Messages in AquaticLife group.

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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11941	From: TankGurl	Date: 6/1/2005
Subject: Re: Starting up a new tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11942	From: Cosmo Knight	Date: 6/1/2005
Subject: Re: A request to the group management
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11943	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/1/2005
Subject: Re: A request to the group management
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11944	From: Amalthea	Date: 6/1/2005
Subject: Re: A request to the group management
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11945	From: Patrick, AAFG	Date: 6/1/2005
Subject: Re: A request to the group management
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11946	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/1/2005
Subject: Re: Digest Number 792: Virus Help !
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11947	From: Amalthea	Date: 6/1/2005
Subject: Re: Digest Number 792: Virus Help !
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11948	From: knelson1701	Date: 6/1/2005
Subject: Re: Starting up a new tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11949	From: Eric Miner	Date: 6/1/2005
Subject: Too much areation?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11950	From: Patrick, AAFG	Date: 6/1/2005
Subject: Re: Digest Number 792: Virus Help !
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11951	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 6/1/2005
Subject: Re: Need help fast confused
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11952	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/1/2005
Subject: TankGurls got a nice tank.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11953	From: Paul N. Chung	Date: 6/1/2005
Subject: Re: Digest Number 792: Virus Help !
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11954	From: TankGurl	Date: 6/1/2005
Subject: Re: Starting up a new tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11955	From: TankGurl	Date: 6/1/2005
Subject: Re: TankGurls got a nice tank.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11956	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/1/2005
Subject: Re: TankGurls got a nice tank.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11957	From: paul helms	Date: 6/1/2005
Subject: Re: Starting up a new tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11958	From: Eric Miner	Date: 6/1/2005
Subject: Re: Starting up a new tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11959	From: Karen	Date: 6/1/2005
Subject: Re: limestone ph buffer
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11960	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 6/1/2005
Subject: Re: Starting up a new tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11961	From: paul helms	Date: 6/1/2005
Subject: Re: Starting up a new tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11962	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 6/1/2005
Subject: Re: Digest Number 792: Virus Help !
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11963	From: Charlene	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Filters I need to see if i brought the right Filers for my tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11964	From: TankGurl	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: TankGurls got a nice tank.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11965	From: TankGurl	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Starting up a new tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11966	From: wendie	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Starting up a new tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11967	From: Robert Hickey	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Starting up a new tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11968	From: TankGurl	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Starting up a new tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11969	From: wendie	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Starting up a new tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11970	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Starting up a new tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11971	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Bio Spira
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11972	From: Sheila	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11973	From: natalieranae	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Hi, need some advice
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11974	From: paul helms	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Filters I need to see if i brought the right Filers for my tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11975	From: paul helms	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Starting up a new tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11976	From: Trevor Holyoak	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Filters I need to see if i brought the right Filers for my tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11977	From: TankGurl	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Bio Spira
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11978	From: TankGurl	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Starting up a new tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11979	From: Trevor	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: TankGurls got a nice tank.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11980	From: Paul N. Chung	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Filters I need to see if i brought the right Filers for my tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11981	From: Trevor Holyoak	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Filters I need to see if i brought the right Filers for my tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11982	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Bio Spira
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11983	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Starting up a new tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11984	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Filters I need to see if i brought the right Filers for my tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11985	From: Trevor Holyoak	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Filters I need to see if i brought the right Filers for my tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11986	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11987	From: TankGurl	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: TankGurls got a nice tank.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11988	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Tank Gurl
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11989	From: Patrick, AAFG	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Starting up a new tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11990	From: paul helms	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Starting up a new tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11991	From: paul helms	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Starting up a new tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11992	From: paul helms	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11993	From: paul helms	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Bio Spira
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11994	From: John Gonzalez	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Bio Spira
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11995	From: Rachel	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: to all replys for goldfish aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11996	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Filters I need to see if i brought the right Filers for my ...
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11997	From: Charlene	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Filters Wet and dry
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11998	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Re: Starting up a new tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11999	From: TankGurl	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Re: Tank Gurl
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12000	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Re: Bio Spira
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12001	From: TankGurl	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Re: Bio Spira
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12002	From: Patrick, AAFG	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Re: Bio Spira
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12003	From: Patrick, AAFG	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Re: Hi, need some advice
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12004	From: Patrick, AAFG	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Re: Bio Spira
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12005	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Re: Hi, need some advice
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12006	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Re: Bio Spira
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12007	From: Trevor Holyoak	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Re: Bio Spira
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12008	From: Patrick	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: [spam] Re: [AquaticLife] Bio Spira
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12009	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Bleach Solution for Cleaning Tanks
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12010	From: T	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Solved the Green water issue
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12011	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Lake Havasu
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12012	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: critters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12013	From: Eric Miner	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Re: Lake Havasu
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12014	From: Eric Miner	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Too much areation?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12015	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12016	From: paul helms	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Re: Bio Spira
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12017	From: paul helms	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Re: Starting up a new tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12018	From: ionut2703	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: New filter
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12019	From: paul helms	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Re: critters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12020	From: paul helms	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Re: Lake Havasu
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12021	From: paul helms	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Re: Bleach Solution for Cleaning Tanks
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12022	From: paul helms	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Re: Bio Spira
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12023	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Re: critters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12024	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Re: critters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12025	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Re: critters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12026	From: Patrick	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: [spam] Re: [AquaticLife] Starting up a new tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12027	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12028	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: Digest Number 792: Virus Help !
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12029	From: paul helms	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: last post on biospira
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12030	From: thant zin	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: how can control the water temperature?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12031	From: Paula Ruter	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: pleco question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12032	From: Sheila	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help! BETTER NOW
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12033	From: Patrick	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: last post on biospira
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12034	From: Patrick	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: how can control the water temperature?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12035	From: harry perry	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Instant cycle ? / I don't understand./some observations.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12036	From: Dan	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: critters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12037	From: paul helms	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help! BETTER NOW
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12038	From: paul helms	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: pleco question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12039	From: paul helms	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: Digest Number 792: Virus Help !
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12040	From: paul helms	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: how can control the water temperature?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12041	From: paul helms	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12042	From: aclaar877	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Diatom Filter not Working
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12043	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: Diatom Filter not Working
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12044	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: Instant cycle ? / I don't understand./some observations.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12045	From: wizzbaf	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Aquarium Salt
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12046	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: pleco question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12047	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: Aquarium Salt
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12048	From: Bruce Hansen	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: Instant cycle ? / I don't understand./some observations.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12049	From: Eric Miner	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: last post on biospira
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12050	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Betta babies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12051	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12052	From: Paul N. Chung	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: critters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12053	From: Paul N. Chung	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: Bleach Solution for Cleaning Tanks
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12054	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: critters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12055	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12056	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: pleco question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12057	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help! BETTER NOW
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12058	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12059	From: Patrick	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: decorations debate
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12060	From: Karen	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Thanks for the honor of front page
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12061	From: Karen	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: Aquarium Salt
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12062	From: Patrick	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: [spam] Re: [AquaticLife] One clownfish dead - have 2 others - pleas
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12063	From: Karen	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: Bleach Solution for Cleaning Tanks
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12064	From: Patrick	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12065	From: Aaron	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: Thanks for the honor of front page
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12066	From: Aaron	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: OT - [spam] Re: [AquaticLife] ...
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12067	From: Patrick	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: OT - [spam]
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12068	From: harry perry	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: decorations debate/To Patrick
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12069	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12070	From: Patrick	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: decorations debate/To Patrick
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12071	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: largest circular fish tank.. very cool
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12072	From: Dragon Hunter	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: critters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12073	From: Dragon Hunter	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: Lake Havasu
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12074	From: paul helms	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: critters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12075	From: paul helms	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: decorations debate/To Patrick
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12076	From: paul helms	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12077	From: paul helms	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: [spam] Re: [AquaticLife] One clownfish dead - have 2 others - p
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12078	From: paul helms	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12079	From: paul helms	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: last post on biospira
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12080	From: paul helms	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: Instant cycle ? / I don't understand./some observations.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12081	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: largest circular fish tank.. very cool
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12082	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: Lake Havasu
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12083	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: [spam] Re: [AquaticLife] One clownfish dead - have 2 others - p
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12084	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12085	From: Patrick	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12086	From: paul helms	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12087	From: paul helms	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12088	From: paul helms	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12089	From: paul helms	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12090	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: largest circular fish tank.. very cool
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12091	From: Patrick	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12092	From: kritter714@aol.com	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: Thanks for the honor of front page/wet dry sump
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12093	From: Evita	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: decorations debate/To Patrick
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12094	From: Nan	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12095	From: paul helms	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12096	From: paul helms	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: largest circular fish tank.. very cool
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12097	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12098	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12099	From: Patrick	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: [spam] Re: [AquaticLife] One clownfish dead - have 2 others - pleas
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12100	From: Dan	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12101	From: Ken McDougall	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12102	From: paul helms	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: [spam] Re: [AquaticLife] One clownfish dead - have 2 others - p
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12103	From: paul helms	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12104	From: paul helms	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12105	From: paul helms	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12106	From: Dragon Hunter	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: Bio Spira
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12107	From: Dragon Hunter	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: last post on biospira
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12108	From: paul helms	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: last post on biospira
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12109	From: paul helms	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: Bio Spira
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12110	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12111	From: thant zin	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: thanks Pastrick
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12112	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: Too much areation?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12113	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12114	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12115	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12116	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: Bio Spira
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12117	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12118	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: [spam] Re: [AquaticLife] One clownfish dead - have 2 others - p
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12119	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12120	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12121	From: Amalthea	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12122	From: Tim Fairchild	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12123	From: paul helms	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12124	From: paul helms	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12125	From: paul helms	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12126	From: paul helms	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12127	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12128	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12129	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - Water Boiling point...
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12130	From: Patrick	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: [spam] Re: [AquaticLife] One clownfish dead - have 2 others - pleas
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12131	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: [spam] Re: [AquaticLife] One clownfish dead - have 2 others - p
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12132	From: Patrick	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12133	From: Amalthea	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: [spam] Re: [AquaticLife] One clownfish dead - have 2 others - p
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12134	From: kb1dva	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: macs and fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12135	From: Trevor Holyoak	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: macs and fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12136	From: Patrick	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: [spam] Re: [AquaticLife] macs and fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12137	From: Dan	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12138	From: minnesotagal866	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: New to group
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12139	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Bleach Solution for Cleaning Tanks
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12140	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: New to group
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12141	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12142	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: how can control the water temperature?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12143	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12144	From: Karen	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Bleach Solution for Cleaning Tanks
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12145	From: Karen	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Help on stocking a set-up
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12146	From: paul helms	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Bleach Solution for Cleaning Tanks
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12147	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Bleach Solution for Cleaning Tanks
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12148	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: It Looks Like Common Plecos to Me . . .
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12149	From: paul helms	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: It Looks Like Common Plecos to Me . . .
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12150	From: paul helms	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Bleach Solution for Cleaning Tanks
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12151	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: macs and fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12152	From: wantvws	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Amiracle filter parts
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12153	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: It Looks Like Common Plecos to Me . . .
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12154	From: Patrick	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: [spam] RE: [AquaticLife] It Looks Like Common Plecos to Me . . .
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12155	From: paul helms	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Amiracle filter parts
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12156	From: wantvws	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Amiracle filter parts
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12157	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Its war in there!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12158	From: Deirdre Marr	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Ich After Water Change? Help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12159	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: It Looks Like Common Plecos to Me . . .
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12160	From: Amalthea	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: macs and fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12161	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Its war in there!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12162	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Its war in there!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12163	From: harry perry	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: It Looks Like Common Plecos to Me . . .
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12164	From: harry perry	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Its war in there!/A solution
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12165	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Its war in there!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12166	From: harry perry	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: [spam] RE: [AquaticLife] It Looks Like Common Plecos to Me /Be
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12167	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Its war in there!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12168	From: paul helms	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Its war in there!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12169	From: paul helms	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Its war in there!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12170	From: paul helms	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Amiracle filter parts
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12171	From: paul helms	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Ich After Water Change? Help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12172	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Its war in there!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12173	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Its war in there!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12174	From: minnesotagal866	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: mystery fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12175	From: hnorton1cogeco.ca	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Common Plecos /Heather Norton
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12176	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: critters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12177	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: critters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12178	From: kb1dva	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Oscar bites
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12179	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: filter debate
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12180	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: Its war in there!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12181	From: Trevor Holyoak	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: filter debate
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12182	From: paul helms	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: filter debate
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12183	From: paul helms	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: Oscar bites
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12184	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: Its war in there!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12185	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: Its war in there! valeen
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12186	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: Its war in there!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12187	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: Oscar bites
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12188	From: kb1dva	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Oscar bites
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12189	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: Oscar bites
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12190	From: kb1dva	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: Oscar bites
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12191	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: Its war in there! valeen
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12192	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: Oscar bites
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12193	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: Oscar bites
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12194	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: Bleach Solution for Cleaning Tanks
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12195	From: Trevor Holyoak	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: Bleach Solution for Cleaning Tanks
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12196	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: Its war in there!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12197	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: filter debate
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12198	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: Its war in there!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12199	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: mystery fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12200	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: Bleach Solution for Cleaning Tanks
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12201	From: Tim Fairchild	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: filter debate
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12202	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: filter debate
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12203	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: Ich After Water Change? Help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12204	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: filter debate
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12205	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: Common Plecos /Heather Norton
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12206	From: Deirdre Marr	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Ich & Water Changes: More Info.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12207	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: filter debate
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12208	From: Eric Miner	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Succesful fishless cycle using....
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12209	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: Ich & Water Changes: More Info.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12210	From: paul helms	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: Bleach Solution for Cleaning Tanks
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12211	From: paul helms	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: Its war in there!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12212	From: hnorton1cogeco.ca	Date: 6/8/2005
Subject: filter debate/Cant find the groups/Heather Norton
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12213	From: hnorton1cogeco.ca	Date: 6/8/2005
Subject: Common Plecos /Heather Norton
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12214	From: Karen	Date: 6/8/2005
Subject: Re: filter debate
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12215	From: Trevor Holyoak	Date: 6/8/2005
Subject: Re: filter debate
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12216	From: angelasjenkins@comcast.net	Date: 6/8/2005
Subject: Tank Cleaning
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12217	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/8/2005
Subject: Re: Succesful fishless cycle using....
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12218	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/8/2005
Subject: Re: Tank Cleaning
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12219	From: Karen	Date: 6/8/2005
Subject: Re: filter debate
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12220	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/8/2005
Subject: Re: Common Plecos /Heather Norton
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12221	From: paul helms	Date: 6/8/2005
Subject: Re: Tank Cleaning
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12222	From: Tim Fairchild	Date: 6/8/2005
Subject: Re: Tank Cleaning
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12223	From: TankGurl	Date: 6/8/2005
Subject: Re: filter debate
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12224	From: angelasjenkins@comcast.net	Date: 6/9/2005
Subject: Re: Tank Cleaning
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12225	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 6/9/2005
Subject: Re: Tank Cleaning
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12226	From: TankGurl	Date: 6/9/2005
Subject: Re: Tank Cleaning
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12227	From: minnesotagal866	Date: 6/9/2005
Subject: keeping tropicals outdoors in summer
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12228	From: Eric Miner	Date: 6/9/2005
Subject: Re: Succesful fishless cycle using....
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12229	From: Eric Miner	Date: 6/9/2005
Subject: First media change after cycling?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12230	From: Patrick	Date: 6/9/2005
Subject: Re: First media change after cycling?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12231	From: Karen	Date: 6/9/2005
Subject: Re: Tank Cleaning
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12232	From: Karen	Date: 6/9/2005
Subject: Re: First media change after cycling?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12233	From: Nan	Date: 6/9/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12234	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 6/9/2005
Subject: The San Diego Tropical Fish Society , 6/12/2005, 7:00 pm
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12235	From: Amanda	Date: 6/9/2005
Subject: Re: Tank Cleaning...My Situation...& A ?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12236	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/9/2005
Subject: Re: First media change after cycling?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12237	From: paul helms	Date: 6/9/2005
Subject: Re: Tank Cleaning
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12238	From: paul helms	Date: 6/9/2005
Subject: Re: Tank Cleaning
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12239	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 6/9/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12240	From: Rei - Raymond Tremor	Date: 6/10/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12241	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 6/10/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12242	From: Paul N. Chung	Date: 6/10/2005
Subject: filter debate
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12243	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/10/2005
Subject: OT: (Sort of) Something to do at the beach
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12244	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 6/10/2005
Subject: Re: Tank Cleaning
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12245	From: Sandra	Date: 6/10/2005
Subject: crabs on live rock. .compatible with cleaner shrimp?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12246	From: paul helms	Date: 6/11/2005
Subject: Re: crabs on live rock. .compatible with cleaner shrimp?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12247	From: Nan	Date: 6/11/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12248	From: Nigel Chetcuti	Date: 6/11/2005
Subject: worm like things
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12249	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/11/2005
Subject: Blood Parrots eat Black Skirts?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12250	From: Eric Miner	Date: 6/11/2005
Subject: Re: First media change after cycling?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12251	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/11/2005
Subject: Re: worm like things
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12252	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 6/11/2005
Subject: filter media
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12253	From: mike mather	Date: 6/11/2005
Subject: Re: worm like things
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12254	From: mike mather	Date: 6/11/2005
Subject: Re: keeping tropicals outdoors in summer
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12255	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/12/2005
Subject: Paludariums
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12256	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/12/2005
Subject: Re: keeping tropicals outdoors in summer
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12257	From: hnorton1cogeco.ca	Date: 6/12/2005
Subject: keeping tropicals outdoors in summer/Heather Norton
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12258	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 6/12/2005
Subject: Planting a tank from the glass up
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12259	From: Karen	Date: 6/12/2005
Subject: Re: filter media
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12260	From: minnesotagal866	Date: 6/12/2005
Subject: Re: keeping tropicals outdoors in summer
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12261	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 6/12/2005
Subject: Re: keeping tropicals outdoors in summer
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12262	From: minnesotagal866	Date: 6/12/2005
Subject: Re: Paludariums
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12263	From: Eric Miner	Date: 6/12/2005
Subject: Hatchets - calm water or a current?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12264	From: paul helms	Date: 6/12/2005
Subject: Re: Hatchets - calm water or a current?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12265	From: paul helms	Date: 6/12/2005
Subject: Re: keeping tropicals outdoors in summer
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12266	From: Patrick	Date: 6/12/2005
Subject: Re: keeping tropicals outdoors in summer
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12267	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 6/12/2005
Subject: aquarium heaters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12268	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/12/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium heaters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12269	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 6/12/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium heaters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12270	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/12/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium heaters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12271	From: Sandra	Date: 6/12/2005
Subject: Re: crabs on live rock. .compatible with cleaner shrimp?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12272	From: dragon6435@aol.com	Date: 6/12/2005
Subject: Nanacara Anomala Cichlids
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12273	From: dragon6435@aol.com	Date: 6/12/2005
Subject: Apistogramma Cacautoides Orange Flash
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12274	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 6/12/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium heaters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12275	From: Tim Fairchild	Date: 6/12/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium heaters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12276	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium heaters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12277	From: kb1dva	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: new tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12278	From: TankGurl	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: new tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12279	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium heaters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12280	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: new tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12281	From: paul helms	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: keeping tropicals outdoors in summer
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12282	From: Cher	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Moss balls & Rosy Red Minnows
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12283	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium heaters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12284	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12285	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium heaters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12286	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium heaters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12287	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium heaters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12288	From: rlmec	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Water Treatment for Ponds
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12289	From: Theresa and Elliott	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: starting a new tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12290	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium heaters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12291	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: starting a new tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12292	From: Rei - Raymond Tremor	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12293	From: Amanda	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Crayfish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12294	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium heaters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12295	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: Crayfish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12296	From: mommy2acdhsurvivor	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: HELP!! Fish with a fat lip! Looks bloody inside
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12297	From: Amanda	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: Crayfish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12298	From: Amanda	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: HELP!! Fish with a fat lip! Looks bloody inside
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12299	From: mommy2acdhsurvivor	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: HELP!! Fish with a fat lip! Looks bloody inside
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12300	From: Amanda	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: HELP!! Fish with a fat lip! Looks bloody inside
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12301	From: mommy2acdhsurvivor	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: HELP!! Fish with a fat lip! Looks bloody inside
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12302	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium heaters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12303	From: Trevor Holyoak	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium heaters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12304	From: eggybumstu	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Help needed
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12305	From: Chris	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Power filter burned out
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12306	From: paul helms	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: Power filter burned out
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12307	From: Tim Fairchild	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: Power filter burned out
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12308	From: paul helms	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: Water Treatment for Ponds
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12309	From: paul helms	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: Moss balls & Rosy Red Minnows
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12310	From: paul helms	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: starting a new tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12311	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12312	From: Tim Fairchild	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: Moss balls & Rosy Red Minnows
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12313	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: Water Treatment for Ponds
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12314	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: Water Treatment for Ponds
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12315	From: Rei - Raymond Tremor	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: HELP!! Fish with a fat lip! Looks bloody inside
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12316	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Power filter burned out
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12317	From: kb1dva	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: turtles
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12318	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: turtles
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12319	From: kb1dva	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: turtles
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12320	From: kb1dva	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: HELP!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12321	From: Patrick	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: [spam] Re: [AquaticLife] aquarium heaters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12322	From: mommy2acdhsurvivor	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: HELP!! Fish with a fat lip! Looks bloody inside
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12323	From: Patrick	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Power filter burned out
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12324	From: Patrick	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Water Treatment for Ponds
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12325	From: Karen	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: HELP!! Fish with a fat lip! Looks bloody inside
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12326	From: Chris	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Power filter burned out
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12327	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium heaters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12328	From: paul helms	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Water Treatment for Ponds
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12329	From: paul helms	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: turtles
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12330	From: helen572	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Crayfish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12331	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: HELP!! Fish with a fat lip! Looks bloody inside
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12332	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Power filter burned out
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12333	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Betta and Dannios
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12334	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12335	From: mommy2acdhsurvivor	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: HELP!! Fish with a fat lip! Looks bloody inside
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12336	From: mommy2acdhsurvivor	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: HELP!! Fish with a fat lip! Looks bloody inside
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12337	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Power filter burned out
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12338	From: mommy2acdhsurvivor	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: HELP!! Fish with a fat lip! Looks bloody inside
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12339	From: Tim Fairchild	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Power filter burned out
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12340	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium heaters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12341	From: Amanda	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: HELP!! Fish with a fat lip! Looks bloody inside
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12342	From: Amanda	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: HELP!! Fish with a fat lip! Looks bloody inside
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12343	From: red eye	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Subject line ---> was > turtles
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12344	From: rlmec	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Water Treatment for Ponds
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12345	From: rlmec	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Water Treatment for Ponds
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12346	From: Lief Brittan Youngs	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Moss Balls
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12347	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Colored Blood Parrots IKES!!! * Pic attached
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12348	From: Rei - Raymond Tremor	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12349	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: BP Pic in folder
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12350	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium heaters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12351	From: paul helms	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Water Treatment for Ponds
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12352	From: paul helms	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Water Treatment for Ponds
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12353	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Water Treatment for Ponds
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12354	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12355	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Power filter burned out
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12356	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Power filter burned out
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12357	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12358	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12359	From: paul helms	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Water Treatment for Ponds
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12360	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: HELP!! Fish with a fat lip! Looks bloody inside
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12361	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Subject line ---> was > turtles
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12362	From: kb1dva	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Subject line ---> was > turtles
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12363	From: kb1dva	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Subject line ---> was > turtles
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12364	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium heaters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12365	From: kb1dva	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: tiger Oscars
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12366	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Subject line ---> was > turtles
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12367	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: tiger Oscars
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12368	From: kb1dva	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Subject line ---> was > turtles
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12369	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Subject line ---> was > turtles
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12370	From: Amanda	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Pop up 15 gallon plastic aquarium/fountain
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12371	From: kb1dva	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Oscars
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12372	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up 15 gallon plastic aquarium/fountain
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12373	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up aquarium/fountain HEATER?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12374	From: Trevor Holyoak	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up aquarium/fountain HEATER?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12375	From: hnorton1cogeco.ca	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Pop up 15 gallon plastic aquarium/Heather Norton
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12376	From: Trevor Holyoak	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up aquarium/fountain HEATER?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12377	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Oscars
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12378	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up 15 gallon plastic aquarium/fountain
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12379	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up aquarium/fountain HEATER?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12380	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up 15 gallon plastic aquarium/fountain
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12381	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up aquarium/fountain HEATER?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12382	From: Eric Miner	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Ammonia and fish behavior
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12383	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Outdoor fish-was pop up aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12384	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up 15 gallon plastic aquarium/fountain
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12385	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up aquarium/fountain HEATER?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12386	From: Trevor Holyoak	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Outdoor fish-was pop up aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12387	From: Trevor Holyoak	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up aquarium/fountain HEATER?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12388	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Pop up aquarium/fountain-Shipping
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12389	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Outdoor fish-was pop up aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12390	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up aquarium/fountain HEATER?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12391	From: Amanda	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up aquarium/fountain-Shipping
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12392	From: helen572	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: cichlid dying of old age?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12393	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up 15 gallon plastic aquarium/fountain
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12394	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up aquarium/fountain HEATER?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12395	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up 15 gallon plastic aquarium/fountain
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12396	From: Trevor Holyoak	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up aquarium/fountain HEATER?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12397	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: New file uploaded to AquaticLife
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12398	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: cichlid dying of old age?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12399	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up 15 gallon plastic aquarium/fountain
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12400	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up 15 gallon plastic aquarium/fountain
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12401	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up 15 gallon plastic aquarium/fountain
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12402	From: Amanda	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up aquarium/fountain-Shipping
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12403	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up aquarium/fountain-Shipping
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12404	From: anubias	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: NEPAS Meeting Thursday night
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12405	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up aquarium/fountain HEATER?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12406	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up aquarium/fountain-Shipping
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12407	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: New file uploaded to AquaticLife
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12408	From: mommy2acdhsurvivor	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: HELP!! Fish with a fat lip! Looks bloody inside
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12409	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12410	From: paul helms	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Ammonia and fish behavior
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12411	From: Eric Miner	Date: 6/16/2005
Subject: Re: Ammonia and fish behavior
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12412	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 6/16/2005
Subject: Re: HELP!! Fish with a fat lip! Looks bloody inside
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12413	From: hnorton1cogeco.ca	Date: 6/16/2005
Subject: other usefull containers/Heather Norton
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12414	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/16/2005
Subject: Female betta turning colors
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12415	From: Patrick	Date: 6/16/2005
Subject: Re: Ammonia and fish behavior
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12416	From: Patrick	Date: 6/16/2005
Subject: Re: Female betta turning colors
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12417	From: Trevor Holyoak	Date: 6/16/2005
Subject: Re: New file uploaded to AquaticLife
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12418	From: Trevor Holyoak	Date: 6/16/2005
Subject: Re: New file uploaded to AquaticLife
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12419	From: paul helms	Date: 6/16/2005
Subject: Re: Ammonia and fish behavior
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12420	From: Patrick	Date: 6/16/2005
Subject: Re: New file uploaded to AquaticLife
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12421	From: Trevor Holyoak	Date: 6/16/2005
Subject: Re: New file uploaded to AquaticLife
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12422	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/16/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up 15 gallon plastic aquarium/fountain
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12423	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/16/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up 15 gallon plastic aquarium/fountain
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12424	From: helen572	Date: 6/16/2005
Subject: Re: cichlid dying of old age?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12425	From: knelson1701	Date: 6/16/2005
Subject: swordtail question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12426	From: Amanda	Date: 6/16/2005
Subject: Malaysian Trumpet Sanils
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12427	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/16/2005
Subject: plant choice and feeding
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12428	From: Amanda	Date: 6/16/2005
Subject: Re: plant choice and feeding
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12429	From: paul helms	Date: 6/16/2005
Subject: Re: Malaysian Trumpet Sanils
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12430	From: paul helms	Date: 6/16/2005
Subject: Re: swordtail question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12431	From: paul helms	Date: 6/16/2005
Subject: Re: New file uploaded to AquaticLife
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12432	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/16/2005
Subject: Re: plant choice and feeding
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12433	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 6/17/2005
Subject: Re: plant choice and feeding
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12434	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 6/17/2005
Subject: Re: swordtail question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12435	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 6/17/2005
Subject: Re: Malaysian Trumpet Sanils
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12436	From: Amanda	Date: 6/17/2005
Subject: Re: Malaysian Trumpet Sanils
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12437	From: Jo Baker	Date: 6/17/2005
Subject: Re: Malaysian Trumpet Sanils
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12438	From: Eric Miner	Date: 6/17/2005
Subject: Was -> Re: Ammonia and fish behavior
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12439	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 6/17/2005
Subject: Re: Was -> Re: Ammonia and fish behavior
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12440	From: paul helms	Date: 6/17/2005
Subject: Re: Was -> Re: Ammonia and fish behavior
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12441	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 6/17/2005
Subject: Re: plant choice and feeding
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12442	From: TankGurl	Date: 6/17/2005
Subject: Re: Was -> Re: Ammonia and fish behavior
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12443	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 6/17/2005
Subject: Re: plant choice and feeding
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12444	From: Sandra	Date: 6/17/2005
Subject: own ick experience/advise i wanted to share
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12445	From: paul helms	Date: 6/17/2005
Subject: Re: Was -> Re: Ammonia and fish behavior
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12446	From: paul helms	Date: 6/17/2005
Subject: Re: Malaysian Trumpet Sanils
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12447	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 6/17/2005
Subject: gravel
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12448	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 6/17/2005
Subject: Re: Was -> Re: Ammonia and fish behavior
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12449	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/17/2005
Subject: Re: New file uploaded to AquaticLife
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12450	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 6/17/2005
Subject: first water testd
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12451	From: Tim Fairchild	Date: 6/17/2005
Subject: Re: first water testd
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12452	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/17/2005
Subject: my new sun coral
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12453	From: Amanda	Date: 6/17/2005
Subject: Re: Malaysian Trumpet Sanils
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12454	From: Rei - Raymond Tremor	Date: 6/18/2005
Subject: Re: Female betta turning colors
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12455	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/18/2005
Subject: Animal Legal & Historical Web Center
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12456	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/18/2005
Subject: Re: Female betta turning colors
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12457	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/18/2005
Subject: Steve & those who replied on "starving fish"
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12458	From: Eric Miner	Date: 6/18/2005
Subject: Was -> Re: Ammonia and fish behavior
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12459	From: Eric Miner	Date: 6/18/2005
Subject: Was -> Re: Ammonia and fish behavior
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12460	From: Patrick	Date: 6/18/2005
Subject: Re: Female betta turning colors
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12461	From: deborahgd14	Date: 6/18/2005
Subject: Re: own ick experience/advise i wanted to share
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12462	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/18/2005
Subject: Re: gravel
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12463	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/18/2005
Subject: Re: first water testd
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12464	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 6/18/2005
Subject: Silicon Valley Aquarium Society (SVAS) Monthly Meeting, 7/2/2005, 6
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12465	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 6/18/2005
Subject: San Francisco Aquarium Society (SFAS), 7/1/2005, 7:15 pm
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12466	From: Rei - Raymond Tremor	Date: 6/18/2005
Subject: Re: Female betta turning colors
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12467	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 6/18/2005
Subject: Re: gravel
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12468	From: mommy2acdhsurvivor	Date: 6/18/2005
Subject: Re: HELP!! Fish with a fat lip! Looks bloody inside
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12469	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/19/2005
Subject: Re: gravel
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12470	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 6/19/2005
Subject: Re: gravel
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12471	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/19/2005
Subject: Re: Female betta turning colors
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12472	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/19/2005
Subject: Re: plant choice and feeding
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12473	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/19/2005
Subject: Re: plant choice and feeding
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12474	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/19/2005
Subject: Re: plant choice and feeding
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12475	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/19/2005
Subject: Re: own ick experience/advise i wanted to share
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12476	From: shutternow	Date: 6/19/2005
Subject: Re: Submersible Heater.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12477	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/19/2005
Subject: Re: worm like things
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12478	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/19/2005
Subject: Converting to and from mg/L and ppm
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12479	From: Eric Miner	Date: 6/19/2005
Subject: Anyone know about "Proto Bac"?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12480	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 6/19/2005
Subject: Re: plant choice and feeding
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12481	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/20/2005
Subject: Re: plant choice and feeding
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12482	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 6/20/2005
Subject: Re: plant choice and feeding
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12483	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 6/20/2005
Subject: Minnows are dying, pls. help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12484	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/20/2005
Subject: Re: Female betta turning colors
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12485	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/20/2005
Subject: Re: Female betta turning colors
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12486	From: Karen	Date: 6/20/2005
Subject: Re: Converting to and from mg/L and ppm
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12487	From: Sandra	Date: 6/20/2005
Subject: Re: own ick experience/advise i wanted to share
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12488	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/20/2005
Subject: Re: plant choice and feeding
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12489	From: Sandra	Date: 6/20/2005
Subject: Re: own ick experience/advise i wanted to share
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12490	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/20/2005
Subject: Re: Female betta turning colors
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12491	From: francisco fagundez	Date: 6/20/2005
Subject: goldfish bowl
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12492	From: akquarium	Date: 6/20/2005
Subject: I have tiny bubbles....??
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12493	From: SCOTT	Date: 6/20/2005
Subject: Re: snails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12494	From: kathygothreau	Date: 6/20/2005
Subject: cloudiness in tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12495	From: Ed Williamson	Date: 6/20/2005
Subject: Re: Was -> Re: Ammonia and fish behavior
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12496	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/20/2005
Subject: Re: I have tiny bubbles....??
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12497	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/20/2005
Subject: Re: I have tiny bubbles....??
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12498	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/20/2005
Subject: Re: I have tiny bubbles....??
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12499	From: paul helms	Date: 6/20/2005
Subject: Re: goldfish bowl
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12500	From: paul helms	Date: 6/20/2005
Subject: Re: I have tiny bubbles....??
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12501	From: Rei - Raymond Tremor	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Re: Female betta turning colors
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12502	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Re: goldfish bowl
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12503	From: Patrick	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Re: goldfish bowl
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12504	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Re: goldfish bowl
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12505	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Aww!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12506	From: Chris	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Re: goldfish bowl
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12507	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: BioSpira rocks!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12508	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Re: Aww!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12509	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Re: Aww!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12510	From: Tricia	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Mystery snail egg clutches
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12511	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Re: Mystery snail egg clutches
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12512	From: mommy2acdhsurvivor	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Re: Mystery snail egg clutches
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12513	From: knelson1701	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Swordtail not looking so good. Help Please
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12514	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Re: Mystery snail egg clutches
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12515	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Re: Mystery snail egg clutches
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12516	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Re: goldfish bowl
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12517	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Substrate Heaters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12518	From: Amanda	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Mississippi Map baby(cute) & My Crayfish(?)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12519	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Re: Mystery snail egg clutches
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12520	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Re: Mystery snail egg clutches
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12521	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Re: Mystery snail egg clutches
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12522	From: Nan	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Re: Female betta turning colors
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12523	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Re: Female betta turning colors
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12524	From: mommy2acdhsurvivor	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Re: Aww!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12525	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Re: Mystery snail egg clutches
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12526	From: paul helms	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Re: goldfish bowl
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12527	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 6/22/2005
Subject: Re: Aww!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12528	From: pam phetteplace	Date: 6/22/2005
Subject: Need advice with angel fish....she has worms (?)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12529	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 6/22/2005
Subject: Re: Need advice with angel fish....she has worms (?)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12530	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/22/2005
Subject: Re: Need advice with angel fish....? About the white globs...
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12531	From: Karen	Date: 6/22/2005
Subject: Re: BioSpira rocks!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12532	From: kathygothreau	Date: 6/22/2005
Subject: Cloudy Water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12533	From: Karen	Date: 6/22/2005
Subject: Re: gravel
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12535	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 6/22/2005
Subject: We have BABIES! :-D
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12536	From: paul helms	Date: 6/22/2005
Subject: Re: Cloudy Water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12537	From: wendie	Date: 6/22/2005
Subject: Re: BioSpira rocks!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12538	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/22/2005
Subject: Re: Substrate Heaters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12539	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 6/22/2005
Subject: Re: gravel
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12540	From: Nan	Date: 6/22/2005
Subject: Sand
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12541	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 6/22/2005
Subject: Re: We have BABIES! :-D
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12542	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 6/22/2005
Subject: Re: Mystery snail egg clutches
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12543	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 6/22/2005
Subject: Re: We have BABIES! :-D
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12544	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 6/23/2005
Subject: Re: We have BABIES! :-D
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12545	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 6/23/2005
Subject: Re: Sand
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12546	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 6/23/2005
Subject: Re: Sand (how to vaccum)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12547	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 6/23/2005
Subject: Re: Sand (how to vaccum)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12548	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 6/23/2005
Subject: Re: Sand (how to vaccum)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12549	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 6/23/2005
Subject: Re: Sand (how to vaccum)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12550	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 6/23/2005
Subject: Re: Sand (how to vaccum)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12551	From: knelson1701	Date: 6/23/2005
Subject: Re: Swordtail not looking so good. Help Please
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12552	From: pam phetteplace	Date: 6/23/2005
Subject: Thank you Stan
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12553	From: pamphetteplace	Date: 6/23/2005
Subject: Purple Bettas
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12554	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/23/2005
Subject: Re: Swordtail not looking so good. Help Please
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12555	From: knelson1701	Date: 6/23/2005
Subject: Re: Swordtail not looking so good. Help Please
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12556	From: kathygothreau	Date: 6/23/2005
Subject: cloudy water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12557	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 6/23/2005
Subject: intro
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12558	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 6/23/2005
Subject: Re: Thank you Stan
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12559	From: paul helms	Date: 6/23/2005
Subject: Re: cloudy water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12560	From: yarncrazymom	Date: 6/23/2005
Subject: Is my snail Dead?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12561	From: Rei - Raymond Tremor	Date: 6/23/2005
Subject: Re: Female betta turning colors
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12563	From: Anne	Date: 6/23/2005
Subject: Re: Sand (how to vaccum)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12564	From: Anne	Date: 6/23/2005
Subject: Re: other usefull containers/Heather Norton
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12565	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/23/2005
Subject: Re: Cloudy Water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12566	From: Rei - Raymond Tremor	Date: 6/23/2005
Subject: Re: Purple Bettas
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12567	From: hnorton1cogeco.ca	Date: 6/24/2005
Subject: other usefull containers/Heather Norton
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12568	From: hnorton1cogeco.ca	Date: 6/24/2005
Subject: Re: other usefull containers/Heather Norton
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12569	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/24/2005
Subject: Bibliography of Lake Malawi Biology
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12570	From: bettamuse	Date: 6/24/2005
Subject: Re: Purple Bettas
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12571	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 6/24/2005
Subject: Two o'clock feedings
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12572	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 6/24/2005
Subject: Re: Two o'clock feedings
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12573	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 6/24/2005
Subject: Re: Two o'clock feedings
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12574	From: wendie	Date: 6/25/2005
Subject: Re: Two o'clock feedings
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12575	From: Jade Evita	Date: 6/25/2005
Subject: New and fry already...sorry so long.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12576	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/25/2005
Subject: Re: New and fry already...sorry so long.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12577	From: Evita	Date: 6/25/2005
Subject: Re: New and fry already...sorry so long.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12578	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/25/2005
Subject: Re: New and fry already...sorry so long.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12579	From: Evita	Date: 6/25/2005
Subject: Re: New and fry already...sorry so long.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12580	From: yarncrazymom	Date: 6/25/2005
Subject: Re: Is my snail Dead?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12581	From: Evita	Date: 6/25/2005
Subject: Re: Is my snail Dead?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12582	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 6/25/2005
Subject: Pacific Coast Cichlid Association (PCCA), 7/9/2005, 6:45 pm
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12583	From: kathygothreau	Date: 6/26/2005
Subject: cloudy water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12584	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/26/2005
Subject: Re: cloudy water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12585	From: sobi966	Date: 6/26/2005
Subject: the first message
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12586	From: Evita	Date: 6/26/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12587	From: Evita	Date: 6/26/2005
Subject: Re: the first message
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12588	From: Evita	Date: 6/26/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12589	From: TankGurl	Date: 6/26/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12590	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/26/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12591	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/26/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12592	From: knelson1701	Date: 6/26/2005
Subject: Re: the first message
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12593	From: panaque321	Date: 6/26/2005
Subject: Move guppy?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12594	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 6/26/2005
Subject: The San Diego Tropical Fish Society , 7/10/2005, 7:00 pm
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12595	From: Kittie Kat	Date: 6/26/2005
Subject: Can Water Change Kill My Fish?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12596	From: Evita	Date: 6/26/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12597	From: Evita	Date: 6/26/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12598	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/26/2005
Subject: Re: Move guppy?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12599	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/26/2005
Subject: Re: Can Water Change Kill My Fish?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12600	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/26/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12601	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/26/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12602	From: Evita	Date: 6/26/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12603	From: sobi966	Date: 6/26/2005
Subject: Re: the first message
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12604	From: panaque321	Date: 6/27/2005
Subject: Re: Move guppy?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12605	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 6/27/2005
Subject: Re: Can Water Change Kill My Fish?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12606	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/27/2005
Subject: muskie grabbing a pike
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12607	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/27/2005
Subject: Re: Can Water Change Kill My Fish?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12608	From: harry perry	Date: 6/27/2005
Subject: Re: muskie grabbing a pike
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12609	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/27/2005
Subject: Re: muskie grabbing a pike
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12610	From: harry perry	Date: 6/27/2005
Subject: Re: muskie grabbing a pike/ A muskie
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12611	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 6/27/2005
Subject: Re: muskie grabbing a pike/ A muskie
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12612	From: bunnycareshi	Date: 6/27/2005
Subject: Newbie-Getting 1st aquarium, secondhand
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12613	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 6/27/2005
Subject: Re: muskie grabbing a pike/ A muskie
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12614	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 6/27/2005
Subject: Re: Newbie-Getting 1st aquarium, secondhand
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12615	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/27/2005
Subject: Re: Move guppy?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12616	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: Is my snail Dead?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12617	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Homepage picture
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12618	From: yarncrazymom	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12619	From: yarncrazymom	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12620	From: Tim Fairchild	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12621	From: TankGurl	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12622	From: yarncrazymom	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12623	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12624	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12625	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: muskie grabbing a pike
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12626	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: muskie grabbing a pike/ A muskie
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12627	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: muskie grabbing a pike/ A muskie
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12628	From: LobsterPond.com	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Muskie Tales
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12629	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: Muskie Tales
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12630	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: Muskie Tales
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12631	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: muskie grabbing a pike/ A muskie
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12632	From: Eric Miner	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Big problem with hair algae
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12633	From: John Gonzalez	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: muskie grabbing a pike/ A muskie
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12634	From: Evita	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12635	From: Evita	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12636	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: muskie grabbing a pike/ A muskie - Noodling?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12637	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12638	From: Evita	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12639	From: Evita	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12640	From: Evita	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: muskie grabbing a pike/ A muskie
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12641	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: Muskie Tales
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12642	From: yarncrazymom	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12643	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: OT Noodling?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12644	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: muskie grabbing a pike/ A muskie - Noodling?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12645	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: Newbie-Getting 1st aquarium, secondhand
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12646	From: Evita	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12647	From: yarncrazymom	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: freshwater Nerite snails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12648	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: recommendation
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12649	From: lance vohs	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: Big problem with hair algae
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12650	From: kritter714@aol.com	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: freshwater Nerite snails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12651	From: Tim Fairchild	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12652	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: San Francisco Aquarium Society (SFAS), 7/1/2005, 7:15 pm
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12653	From: paul helms	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12654	From: Evita	Date: 6/29/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12655	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 6/29/2005
Subject: Re: freshwater Nerite snails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12656	From: Jade Evita	Date: 6/29/2005
Subject: New Numbers
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12657	From: Eric Miner	Date: 6/29/2005
Subject: Re: Big problem with hair algae
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12658	From: panaque321	Date: 6/29/2005
Subject: Re: Move guppy?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12659	From: kb1dva	Date: 6/29/2005
Subject: Re: Move guppy?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12660	From: yarncrazymom	Date: 6/29/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12661	From: LobsterPond.com	Date: 6/29/2005
Subject: Re: Muskie Tales
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12662	From: lance vohs	Date: 6/29/2005
Subject: Re: Big problem with hair algae
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12663	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 6/29/2005
Subject: Re: Muskie Tales
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12664	From: yarncrazymom	Date: 6/29/2005
Subject: Re: Big problem with hair algae
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12665	From: stuff4paws	Date: 6/29/2005
Subject: New to group and saltwater fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12666	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 6/29/2005
Subject: Silicon Valley Aquarium Society (SVAS) Monthly Meeting, 7/2/2005, 6
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12667	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/29/2005
Subject: Re: New Numbers
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12668	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 6/30/2005
Subject: Re: Muskie Tales
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12669	From: Loie	Date: 6/30/2005
Subject: Fwd: FW:
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12670	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/30/2005
Subject: Re: Move guppy?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12671	From: Evita	Date: 6/30/2005
Subject: Re: New Numbers
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12672	From: Evita	Date: 6/30/2005
Subject: Re: Muskie Tales
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12673	From: Patrick	Date: 6/30/2005
Subject: Re: Fwd: FW:
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12674	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/30/2005
Subject: Re: Muskie Tales
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12675	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 6/30/2005
Subject: tank set up!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12676	From: kb1dva	Date: 6/30/2005
Subject: some little questions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12677	From: Evita	Date: 6/30/2005
Subject: Re: tank set up!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12678	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 6/30/2005
Subject: Re: Muskie Tales
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12679	From: panaque321	Date: 6/30/2005
Subject: Re: Move guppy?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12680	From: hhusvar	Date: 6/30/2005
Subject: Introduction and new tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12681	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 6/30/2005
Subject: Re: Introduction and new tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12682	From: Evita	Date: 6/30/2005
Subject: Re: Introduction and new tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12683	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/30/2005
Subject: Re: New Numbers
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12684	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 6/30/2005
Subject: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12685	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/30/2005
Subject: Fwd: Giant catfish caught in Thailand
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12686	From: Evita	Date: 6/30/2005
Subject: Re: New Numbers
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12687	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/30/2005
Subject: Re: Big problem with hair algae
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12688	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/30/2005
Subject: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12689	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/30/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12690	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12691	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12692	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12693	From: Evita	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: New Numbers
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12694	From: Paul N. Chung	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12695	From: Evita	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12696	From: Evita	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12697	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12698	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12699	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12700	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12701	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12702	From: Evita	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12703	From: Evita	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12704	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12705	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12706	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12707	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12708	From: Evita	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12709	From: Evita	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12710	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12711	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12712	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: some little questions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12713	From: LobsterPond.com	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: Muskie Tales
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12714	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12715	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: Introduction and new tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12716	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: New Numbers
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12717	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: New Numbers
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12718	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12719	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12720	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12721	From: Sandra	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12722	From: kritter714@aol.com	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12723	From: Heather Husvar	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: Introduction and new tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12724	From: Heather Husvar	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: some little questions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12725	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12726	From: Evita	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: New Numbers
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12727	From: Evita	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: New Numbers
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12728	From: Evita	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: Introduction and new tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12729	From: Evita	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12730	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: some little questions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12731	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12732	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: New Numbers
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12733	From: paul helms	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12734	From: paul helms	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12735	From: paul helms	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12736	From: paul helms	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12737	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12738	From: Evita	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12739	From: kb1dva	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: some little questions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12740	From: Sandra	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12741	From: paul helms	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12742	From: paul helms	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12743	From: paul helms	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12744	From: Sandra	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12745	From: luke / lemanja Davidson	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: how do I get off the mailing list (anybody)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12746	From: Julie	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: how do I get off the mailing list (anybody)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12747	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: new tank cycling
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12748	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12749	From: Evita	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: how do I get off the mailing list (anybody)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12750	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12751	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12752	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: how do I get off the mailing list (anybody)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12753	From: tomd27m	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Easiest way to share photos
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12754	From: Heather Husvar	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: some little questions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12755	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: New to the forum
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12756	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: new tank cycling
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12757	From: Sandra	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12758	From: Sandra	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12759	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: New to the forum
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12760	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: How long in hobby?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12761	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: How long in hobby?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12762	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: How long in hobby?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12763	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: How long in hobby?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12764	From: Paul N. Chung	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: How long in hobby?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12765	From: Evita	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: some little questions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12766	From: Evita	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: New to the forum
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12767	From: Evita	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: New to the forum
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12768	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: New to the forum
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12769	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: How long in hobby?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12770	From: paul helms	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12771	From: paul helms	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: How long in hobby?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12772	From: wendie	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: How long in hobby?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12773	From: Heather Husvar	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: How long in hobby?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12774	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12775	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12776	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: New to the forum
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12777	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Vintage Aquariums -- Ornaments and more
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12778	From: dreammaker2623	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: How long in hobby?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12779	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: New to the forum
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12780	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: Vintage Aquariums -- Ornaments and more
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12781	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: New to the forum
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12782	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: New to the forum
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12783	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: New to the forum
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12784	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: New to the forum
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12785	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: New to the forum
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12786	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: Vintage Aquariums -- Ornaments and more
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12787	From: paul helms	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12788	From: paul helms	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12789	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: Vintage Aquariums -- Ornaments and more
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12790	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: Vintage Aquariums -- Ornaments and more
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12791	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12792	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: New to the forum
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12793	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: Vintage Aquariums -- Ornaments and more
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12794	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: Vintage Aquariums -- Ornaments and more
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12795	From: Bruce Hansen	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: How long in hobby?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12796	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12797	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: Vintage Aquariums -- Ornaments and more
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12798	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: How long in hobby?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12799	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12800	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12801	From: paul helms	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12802	From: Sandra	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12803	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: Vintage Aquariums -- Ornaments and more
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12804	From: paul helms	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12805	From: ahorseofcourse66	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Need help with spots on inside of tank?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12806	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Brine shrimp
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12807	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: Brine shrimp
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12808	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: Brine shrimp
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12809	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: Brine shrimp
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12810	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: How long in hobby?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12811	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12812	From: Patrick	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12813	From: Sandra	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12814	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: Brine shrimp
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12815	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: Need help with spots on inside of tank?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12816	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12818	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12819	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: New poll for AquaticLife
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12820	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12821	From: dreammaker2623	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: New to the forum
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12822	From: Aaron M.	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: Polls
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12823	From: Nan	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: Vintage Aquariums -- Ornaments and more
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12824	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: Vintage Aquariums -- Ornaments and more
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12825	From: Nan	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: Vintage Aquariums -- Ornaments and more
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12826	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: Vintage Aquariums -- Ornaments and more
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12827	From: Nan	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: Vintage Aquariums -- Ornaments and more
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12828	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12829	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: Brine shrimp
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12830	From: paul helms	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: Brine shrimp
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12831	From: paul helms	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12832	From: paul helms	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12833	From: paul helms	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12834	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12835	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12836	From: Evita	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12837	From: Kathy	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: New poll for AquaticLife
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12838	From: wjcoldman	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: How long in hobby?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12839	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12840	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12841	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: Brine shrimp
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12842	From: paul helms	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12843	From: Sandra	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12844	From: paul helms	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12845	From: paul helms	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12846	From: TankGurl	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12847	From: Bruce Hansen	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12848	From: Pam	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Purple Betta Papa
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12849	From: pamphetteplace	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: AUSTRAILIA. (pls excuse >>> off topic)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12850	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: Purple Betta Papa
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12851	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12852	From: Bruce Hansen	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12853	From: Bruce Hansen	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: AUSTRAILIA. (pls excuse >>> off topic)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12854	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12855	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: AUSTRAILIA. (pls excuse >>> off topic)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12856	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12857	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12858	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12859	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12860	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12861	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: New to the forum
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12862	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12863	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: Purple Betta Papa
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12864	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12865	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: New to the forum
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12866	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: New to the forum
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12867	From: Patrick	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12868	From: countrymom2one	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Newbie
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12869	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12870	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12871	From: Evita	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: Purple Betta Papa
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12872	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: New to the forum
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12873	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12874	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: New to the forum
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12875	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: Purple Betta Papa
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12876	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: New to the forum
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12877	From: Evita	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: New to the forum
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12878	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12879	From: pamphetteplace	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: Purple Betta Papa
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12880	From: paul helms	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: New to the forum
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12881	From: paul helms	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12882	From: paul helms	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12883	From: paul helms	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12884	From: paul helms	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12885	From: Bruce Hansen	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12886	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: FW: [AquaticLife] Need help with spots on inside of tank?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12887	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: Muskie Tales
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12888	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: muskie grabbing a pike
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12889	From: TankGurl	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: FW: [AquaticLife] Need help with spots on inside of tank?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12890	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: FW: [AquaticLife] Need help with spots on inside of tank?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12891	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: No, it's a northern pike grabbing a pike was muskie grabbing a pike
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12892	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: spotted muskie
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12893	From: Heather Husvar	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: Muskie Tales
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12894	From: Sandra	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12895	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: Muskie Tales
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12896	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: FW: [AquaticLife] Need help with spots on inside of tank?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12897	From: paul helms	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: spotted muskie
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12898	From: clarkmariposo25@aol.com	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: How long in hobby?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12899	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: I'm back
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12900	From: joequality1980	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: weird colors
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12901	From: Sandra	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: I'm back
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12902	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: AquaticLife - Re: Newbie
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12903	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: I'm back
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12904	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium (off topic again, but i'm
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12905	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: I'm back
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12906	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: spotted muskie
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12907	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: catfish was Re: Muskie Tales
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12908	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium (off topic again, but i'm
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12909	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Tiger muskies was... Muskie Tales
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12910	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: FW: [AquaticLife] Need help with spots on inside of tank?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12911	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: fishy night light
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12912	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: fishy night light
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12913	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: fishy night light
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12914	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: fishy night light
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12915	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: weird colors
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12916	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: fishy night light
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12917	From: ahorseofcourse66	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Ok, your going to think I'm crazy!?!?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12918	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: muskie grabbing a pike
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12919	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: GORGEOUS FISH!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12920	From: Aaron	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: drown a fish? (was - Re: muskie grabbing a pike)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12921	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: drown a fish?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12922	From: Aaron	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: OT East to West (was - Re: setting ...aquarium (off topic again, bu
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12923	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: Purple Betta Papa
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12924	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12925	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12926	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12927	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: weird colors
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12928	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: not to Egg Yolk ( plants )
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12929	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: I'm back
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12930	From: Patrick	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium (ot: where the sun sets)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12931	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: Newbie
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12932	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: OT East to West (was - Re: setting ...aquarium (off topic again, bu
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12933	From: Aaron	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: New poll for AquaticLife
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12934	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Emily (was catfish, was Re: Muskie Tales)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12935	From: Aaron	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: weird colors
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12936	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: fishy night light
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12937	From: dreammaker2623	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: OT East to West (was - Re: setting ...aquarium (off topic again, bu
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12938	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: GORGEOUS FISH!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12939	From: Aaron	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: OT East to West
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12940	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: OT East to West
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12941	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: I'm back
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12942	From: paul helms	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: GORGEOUS FISH!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12943	From: paul helms	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: OT East to West (was - Re: setting ...aquarium (off topic again
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12944	From: paul helms	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12945	From: paul helms	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: muskie grabbing a pike
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12946	From: yarncrazymom	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: Ok, your going to think I'm crazy!?!?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12947	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: GORGEOUS FISH!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12948	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: GORGEOUS FISH!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12949	From: Heather Husvar	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: I'm back
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12950	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: I'm back
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12951	From: Evita	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: I'm back
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12952	From: Evita	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: I'm back
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12953	From: mocoa_man	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: fishy night light
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12954	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: I'm back
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12955	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: feeding plecos
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12956	From: dreammaker2623	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: OT East to West (was - Re: setting ...aquarium (off topic again, bu
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12957	From: Evita	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: I'm back
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12958	From: dreammaker2623	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: feeding plecos
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12959	From: hnorton1cogeco.ca	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: how do I get off the mailing list (anybody)/Heather Norton
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12960	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: Emily (was catfish, was Re: Muskie Tales)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12961	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: OT East to West (was - Re: setting ...aquarium (off topic again
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12962	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: GORGEOUS FISH!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12963	From: joequality1980	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: weird colors
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12964	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: feeding plecos
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12965	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: how do I get off the mailing list (anybody)/Heather Norton
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12966	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Fighting blood parrots...another question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12967	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: feeding plecos
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12968	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: feeding plecos
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12969	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: I'm back
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12970	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: feeding plecos
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12971	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: feeding plecos
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12972	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: I'm back
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12973	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: feeding plecos
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12974	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: feeding pleco's
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12975	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: I'm back
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12976	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: feeding plecos
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12977	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: feeding plecos
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12978	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: feeding plecos
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12979	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: I'm back
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12980	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: I'm back
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12981	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Testing the email
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12982	From: mocoa_man	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: fishy night light
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12983	From: paul helms	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: OT East to West (was - Re: setting ...aquarium (off topic again
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12984	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Retry: THANK YOU & pics of 75 gal.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12985	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Compatible?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12986	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: 75 Gal Tank Pics & THANK YOU!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12987	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Pacific Coast Cichlid Association (PCCA), 7/9/2005, 6:45 pm
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12988	From: Evita	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: feeding pleco's
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12989	From: Evita	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: I'm back
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12990	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: 75 Gal Tank Pics & THANK YOU!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12991	From: Aaron	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: feeding plecos
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12992	From: Aaron M.	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: OT East to West
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12993	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: feeding pleco's
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12994	From: paul helms	Date: 7/7/2005
Subject: Re: Compatible?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12995	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/7/2005
Subject: Re: I'm back
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12996	From: hnorton1cogeco.ca	Date: 7/7/2005
Subject: feeding plecos/Heather Norton
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12997	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/7/2005
Subject: Re: OT East to West
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12998	From: hnorton1cogeco.ca	Date: 7/7/2005
Subject: fresh food for two inch Angels other then lettuce /Heather Norton
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12999	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 7/7/2005
Subject: Re: feeding pleco's
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13000	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/7/2005
Subject: Re: feeding plecos
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13001	From: Heather Husvar	Date: 7/7/2005
Subject: Re: Retry: THANK YOU & pics of 75 gal.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13002	From: Heather Husvar	Date: 7/7/2005
Subject: Re: OT East to West
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13003	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 7/7/2005
Subject: Re: feeding pleco's
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13004	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/7/2005
Subject: Re: feeding pleco's
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13005	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/7/2005
Subject: Re: feeding plecos
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13006	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/7/2005
Subject: Re: 75 Gal Tank Pics & THANK YOU!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13007	From: joequality1980	Date: 7/7/2005
Subject: Re: 75 Gal Tank Pics & THANK YOU!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13008	From: Nan	Date: 7/7/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13009	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/7/2005
Subject: Re: Ok, your going to think I'm crazy!?!?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13010	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 7/7/2005
Subject: The San Diego Tropical Fish Society , 7/10/2005, 7:00 pm
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13011	From: paul helms	Date: 7/7/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13012	From: Sandra	Date: 7/7/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13013	From: paul helms	Date: 7/7/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13014	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 7/7/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13015	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: set up questions and help with pH, please
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13016	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: pH is 8
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13017	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: set up questions and help with pH, please
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13018	From: Evita	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13019	From: Evita	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: set up questions and help with pH, please
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13020	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: set up questions and help with pH, please
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13021	From: kb1dva	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13022	From: Evita	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: set up questions and help with pH, please
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13023	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium/mud slinging group?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13024	From: Evita	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13025	From: paul helms	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13026	From: paul helms	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13027	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: set up questions and help with pH, please
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13028	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: set up questions and help with pH, please
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13029	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: set up questions and help with pH, please
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13030	From: Evita	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13031	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: set up questions and help with pH, please
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13032	From: Evita	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: set up questions and help with pH, please
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13033	From: Sandra	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Lazy cleaner shrimp??
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13034	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: Lazy cleaner shrimp??
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13035	From: Sandra	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: Lazy cleaner shrimp??
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13036	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: Lazy cleaner shrimp??
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13037	From: Sandra	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: Lazy cleaner shrimp??
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13038	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: Lazy cleaner shrimp??
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13039	From: Nan	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: feeding plecos
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13040	From: Nan	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13041	From: vincer12001	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: New site
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13042	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/9/2005
Subject: cycling question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13043	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/9/2005
Subject: Re: cycling question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13044	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/9/2005
Subject: Re: cycling question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13045	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/9/2005
Subject: Re: cycling question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13046	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/9/2005
Subject: Re: cycling question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13047	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/9/2005
Subject: can I do water changes with Maracyn 2? (nasty case of fin rot)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13048	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/9/2005
Subject: Re: can I do water changes with Maracyn 2? (nasty case of fin rot)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13049	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/9/2005
Subject: Re: (nasty case of fin rot).
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13050	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/9/2005
Subject: questions on hardness
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13051	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/9/2005
Subject: Re: feeding plecos
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13052	From: Nan	Date: 7/9/2005
Subject: Re: (nasty case of fin rot).
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13053	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/9/2005
Subject: Re: can I do water changes with Maracyn 2? (nasty case of fin rot)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13054	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/9/2005
Subject: Re: (nasty case of fin rot).
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13055	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/9/2005
Subject: Re: (nasty case of fin rot).
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13056	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 7/9/2005
Subject: Re: can I do water changes with Maracyn 2? (nasty case of fin r...
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13057	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/9/2005
Subject: Re: questions on hardness
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13058	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/9/2005
Subject: hardness
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13059	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/9/2005
Subject: cotton mouth
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13060	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Crawdaddies, Crawdads, Crawfish, Crayfish, Yabbies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13061	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Aquarium Photography
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13062	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Re: hardness
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13063	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Re: cotton mouth
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13064	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Nitrate (Long post)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13065	From: Nan	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Re: (nasty case of fin rot).
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13066	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Re: Crawdaddies, etc.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13067	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Re: Cotton mouth
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13068	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Re: Cotton mouth
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13069	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Re: Crawdaddies, etc.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13070	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Re: hardness
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13071	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate (Long post)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13072	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Algae/ Water Color?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13073	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Water Color * Picture
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13074	From: paul helms	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Re: Algae/ Water Color?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13075	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Re: Algae/ Water Color?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13076	From: paul helms	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Re: Lazy cleaner shrimp??
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13077	From: paul helms	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13078	From: Evita	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13079	From: Patrick	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium/mud slinging group?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13080	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Re: hardness
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13081	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Re: hardness
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13082	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Re: Algae/ Water Color?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13083	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Re: hardness
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13084	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Re: hardness
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13085	From: paul helms	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium/mud slinging group?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13086	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium/mud slinging group?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13087	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Lascerated eye or something? in black moor >:(
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13088	From: Evita	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Re: hardness
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13089	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Re: hardness
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13090	From: Daniel Brown	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Cats & Fish Keeping
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13091	From: kb1dva	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Re: Cats & Fish Keeping
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13092	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Re: Cats & Fish Keeping
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13093	From: helen572	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Re: Cats & Fish Keeping
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13094	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Re: Cats & Fish Keeping
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13095	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Re: Cats & Fish Keeping
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13096	From: paul helms	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Re: Cats & Fish Keeping
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13097	From: Iksnip@aol.com	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Re: Cats & Fish Keeping
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13098	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Re: Cats & Fish Keeping
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13099	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Re: Cats & Fish Keeping
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13100	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Algae or Bacterial bloom due to DIY CO2 YEAST setup?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13101	From: Evita	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Re: Cats & Fish Keeping
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13102	From: Evita	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Re: Cats & Fish Keeping
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13103	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Re: Cats & Fish Keeping
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13104	From: Evita	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Re: Cats & Fish Keeping
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13105	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Re: hardness
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13106	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Re: hardness
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13107	From: Nan	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Re: Algae/ Water Color?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13108	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: catfish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13109	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Hi, new member. Long time fish owner.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13110	From: Rob	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: My Introduction
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13111	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Re: catfish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13112	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Re: Hi, new member. Long time fish owner.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13113	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Re: My Introduction
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13114	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Re: Hi, new member. Long time fish owner.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13115	From: Heather Husvar	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: Cats & Fish Keeping
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13116	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: Cats & Fish Keeping
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13117	From: deborahgd14	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Fin rot on angel?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13118	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: Fin rot on angel?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13119	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: catfish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13120	From: Evita	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: Hi, new member. Long time fish owner.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13121	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: how do I cool the water in my tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13122	From: arvie!	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: Fin rot on angel?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13123	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Indoor fish pond in Minneapolis.....available ASAP, CHEAP!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13124	From: TankGurl	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13125	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13126	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13127	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13128	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: dying java fern
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13129	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13130	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13131	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13132	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13133	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13134	From: paul helms	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13135	From: paul helms	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13136	From: paul helms	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: Fin rot on angel?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13137	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: dying java fern
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13138	From: paul helms	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: catfish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13139	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13140	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: dying java fern
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13141	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13142	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13143	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: dying java fern
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13144	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis Paul =)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13145	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13146	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13147	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: Fin rot on angel?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13148	From: Evita	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis Paul =)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13149	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis Paul =)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13150	From: paul helms	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis Paul =)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13151	From: paul helms	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13152	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis Paul =)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13153	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13154	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis Paul =)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13155	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: RE_ (pacu minni) Petsmart
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13156	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: was FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis( peoples responsibility)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13157	From: Bruce Hansen	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13158	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Angelfishes.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13159	From: Rob	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Ameca Splendens/ Other fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13160	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13161	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13162	From: kb1dva	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: pacus
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13163	From: paul helms	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: pacus
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13164	From: paul helms	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: was FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis( peoples responsibility)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13165	From: paul helms	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13166	From: paul helms	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis Paul =)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13167	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13168	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13169	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13170	From: Evita	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis Paul =)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13171	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: Angelfishes.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13172	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: was:FREE Pacu! IN( Cheap aquatic books)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13173	From: Evita	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: RE_ (pacu minni) Petsmart
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13174	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13175	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13176	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis Paul =)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13177	From: Evita	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: was FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis( peoples responsibility)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13178	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis Paul =)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13179	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: Angelfishes.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13180	From: Evita	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: was:FREE Pacu! IN( Cheap aquatic books)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13181	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: RE_ (pacu minni) Petsmart
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13182	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis Paul =)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13183	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13184	From: Sandra willber	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: bata question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13185	From: Ambisense	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: hello new member
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13186	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: catfish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13187	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: Angelfishes.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13188	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: Hi, new member. Long time fish owner.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13189	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: catfish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13190	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: water test and dead guppy-long
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13191	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: catfish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13192	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13193	From: rojeriko	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: keeping the rainbows
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13194	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: feeding plecos
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13195	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: feeding plecos
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13196	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Mollies go to surface to breath?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13197	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: dying java fern
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13198	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13199	From: kritter714@aol.com	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: catfish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13200	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Angelfishes.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13201	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: What types of fish would you recommend for 55 gall tank?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13202	From: Bruce Hansen	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: keeping the rainbows
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13203	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: What types of fish would you recommend for 55 gall tank?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13204	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: keeping the rainbows
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13205	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: RE_ (pacu minni) Petsmart
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13206	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: catfish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13207	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: feeding plecos
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13208	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: hello new member
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13209	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Mollies go to surface to breath?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13210	From: paul helms	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: RE_ (pacu minni) Petsmart
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13211	From: paul helms	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Mollies go to surface to breath?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13212	From: daniel_roachus	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis Paul =)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13213	From: Evita	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: RE_ (pacu minni) Petsmart
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13214	From: Evita	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Hi, new member. Long time fish owner.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13215	From: Evita	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: RE_ (pacu minni) Petsmart
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13216	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: catfish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13217	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: RE_ (pacu minni) Petsmart
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13218	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Mollies go to surface to breath?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13219	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13220	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13221	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13222	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: walmart and goldfish was...FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis( peoples respo
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13223	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13224	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: dying java fern
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13225	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13226	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: algae was Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13227	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: What types of fish would you recommend for 55 gall tank?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13228	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: algae was Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13229	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: RE_ (pacu minni) Petsmart
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13230	From: Patrick	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: 40 year old books
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13231	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13232	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: algae was Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13233	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13234	From: paul helms	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13235	From: Evita	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: RE_ (pacu minni) Petsmart
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13236	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: algae was Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13237	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: algae was Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13238	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: algae was Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13239	From: Evita	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: RE_ (pacu minni) Petsmart
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13240	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: algae was Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13241	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: algae was Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13242	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: algae was Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13243	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: algae was Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13244	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: 40 year old books
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13245	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13246	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13247	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: RE_ (pacu minni) Petsmart
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13248	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Argh...So mad w/ LFS
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13249	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: algae was Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13250	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13251	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: algae was Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13252	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Argh...So mad w/ LFS
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13253	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: feeding plecos
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13254	From: Evita	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Argh...So mad w/ LFS
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13255	From: harry perry	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Argh...So mad w/ LFS/animal abuse.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13256	From: Patrick	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Argh...So mad w/ LFS/animal abuse.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13257	From: harry perry	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Argh...So mad w/ LFS/animal abuse./To Patrick
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13258	From: harry perry	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Argh...So mad w/ LFS/animal abuse./To Patrick again
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13259	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13260	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Argh...So mad w/ LFS/animal abuse./To Patrick again
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13261	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13262	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13263	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13264	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13265	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13266	From: clarkmariposo25@aol.com	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: What types of fish would you recommend for 55 gall tank?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13267	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: angel fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13268	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Mollies go to surface to breath?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13269	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Mollies go to surface to breath?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13270	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Mollies go to surface to breath?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13271	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Mollies go to surface to breath?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13272	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: RE_ (pacu minni) Petsmart
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13273	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: catfish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13274	From: Hrvoje Maric	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: angel fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13275	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13276	From: Hrvoje Maric	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Mollies go to surface to breath?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13277	From: paul helms	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Mollies go to surface to breath?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13278	From: paul helms	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: angel fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13279	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13280	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13281	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13282	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13283	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Mollies go to surface to breath?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13284	From: Evita	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Mollies go to surface to breath?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13285	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: catfish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13286	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13287	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13288	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: angel fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13289	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13290	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: angel fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13291	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: angel fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13292	From: joequality1980	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: do pacus play dead?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13293	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13294	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13295	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: angel fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13296	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: algae was Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13297	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: walmart and goldfish was...FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis( peoples r
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13298	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: angel fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13299	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13300	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13301	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13302	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13303	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13304	From: Evita	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13305	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13306	From: Eric Miner	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Clean filters or change them?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13307	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13308	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13309	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13310	From: kb1dva	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: do pacus play dead?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13311	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13312	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13313	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13314	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13315	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Clean filters or change them?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13316	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13317	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13318	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13319	From: Evita	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13320	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: fish stress
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13321	From: Evita	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13322	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13323	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s/ Steve
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13324	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13325	From: harry perry	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: fish stress/To Linda
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13326	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Clean filters or change them?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13327	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13328	From: harry perry	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Clean filters or change them?/What filter?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13329	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s/ Steve
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13330	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: fish stress
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13331	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Job Opening, DC Metro Area
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13332	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s/ Steve
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13333	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Clean filters or change them?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13334	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: fish stress
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13335	From: Patrick	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Clean filters or change them?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13336	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13337	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Clean filters or change them?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13338	From: paul helms	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Clean filters or change them?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13339	From: paul helms	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13340	From: paul helms	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13341	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Clean filters or change them?/What filter?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13342	From: paul helms	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Clean filters or change them?/What filter?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13343	From: paul helms	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13344	From: paul helms	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13345	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13346	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Clean filters or change them?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13347	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: fish stress
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13348	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13349	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13350	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13351	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13352	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: cories darting to sufrace
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13353	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: fish stress
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13354	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: Clean filters or change them?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13355	From: daniel_roachus	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: Clean filters or change them?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13356	From: Jo Baker	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13357	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: fish stress
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13358	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13359	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: styrofoam box cooling disaster!!!!!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13360	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: walmart and goldfish was...FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis( peoples r
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13361	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: Argh...So mad w/ LFS/animal abuse./To Patrick again
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13362	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: algae was Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13363	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: algae was Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13364	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: styrofoam box cooling disaster!!!!!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13365	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: nails was algae was Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13366	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: algae was Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13367	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: styrofoam box cooling disaster!!!!!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13368	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: algae was Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13369	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: nails was algae was Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13370	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13371	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13372	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13373	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: OOPS I mean "snails"...nails was algae was Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13374	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: algae was Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13375	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13376	From: paul helms	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: styrofoam box cooling disaster!!!!!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13377	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: algae was Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13378	From: paul helms	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13379	From: paul helms	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13380	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13381	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13382	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfish)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13383	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13384	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13385	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13386	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13387	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13388	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13389	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13390	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13391	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Please Edit or Snip the junk off of reply messages. Thanks.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13392	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: Snails was algae was Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13393	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13394	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13395	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: LOW, LOW priced tanks at GlassCages.com
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13396	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: styrofoam box cooling disaster!!!!!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13397	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13398	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: New tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13399	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: LOW, LOW priced tanks at GlassCages.com
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13400	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: fish stress
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13401	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: DIY Water chiller plans
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13402	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: algae was Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13403	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: New tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13404	From: Sandra willber	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Betta question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13405	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: hit send to quick.( corycatfish)( breath right )
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13406	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: LOW, LOW priced tanks at GlassCages.com
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13407	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: algae was Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13408	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: algae was Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13409	From: wendie	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: Betta question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13410	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: algae was Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13411	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: Betta question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13412	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: feeding cucumber
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13413	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: cloudy water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13414	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: use of laterite
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13415	From: wendie	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: Betta question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13416	From: wendie	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: Betta question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13417	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: use of laterite
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13418	From: Evita	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13419	From: Evita	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: Betta question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13420	From: Nan	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: Betta question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13421	From: wendie	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: Betta question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13422	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: New tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13423	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: Betta question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13424	From: wendie	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: Betta question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13425	From: ahorseofcourse66	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: OLD CORAL ????
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13426	From: Nan	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: New tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13427	From: Nan	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Driftwood
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13428	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: What types of rocks should I use in my tank?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13429	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: What types of rocks should I use in my tank?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13430	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13431	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: OLD CORAL ????
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13432	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: What types of rocks should I use in my tank?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13433	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: OLD CORAL ????
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13434	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13435	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: feeding cucumber
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13436	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Betta Babies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13437	From: Dan	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: Betta Babies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13438	From: Dan	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: OLD CORAL ????
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13439	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: LOW, LOW priced tanks at GlassCages.com
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13440	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: New tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13441	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: feeding cucumber
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13442	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: OLD CORAL ????
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13443	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: Driftwood
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13444	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: What types of rocks should I use in my tank?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13445	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: What types of rocks should I use in my tank?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13446	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: What types of rocks should I use in my tank?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13447	From: paul helms	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: OLD CORAL ????
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13448	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: New tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13449	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: What types of rocks should I use in my tank?.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13450	From: Dan	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: What types of rocks should I use in my tank?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13451	From: Evita	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: feeding cucumber
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13452	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Photos of my Angelfishes.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13453	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: feeding cucumber
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13454	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: Photos of my Angelfishes.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13455	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: Photos of my Angelfishes.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13456	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: Photos of my Angelfishes.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13457	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Silly question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13458	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: Silly question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13459	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: Silly question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13460	From: Eric Miner	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: There's a baby Panda in my tank!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13461	From: yarncrazymom	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: feeding cucumber
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13462	From: harry perry	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: What types of rocks should I use in my tank?/Rocks
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13463	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Poll: How Long Have You Been In The Hobby?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13464	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Please, Please edit replies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13465	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: Driftwood
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13466	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: Poll: How Long Have You Been In The Hobby?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13467	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: Silly question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13468	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: Silly question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13469	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: Poll: How Long Have You Been In The Hobby?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13470	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: FW: AHHS: Dr. Joanne Norton
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13471	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: Poll: How Long Have You Been In The Hobby?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13472	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: Poll: How Long Have You Been In The Hobby?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13473	From: Nan	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: Driftwood
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13474	From: Nan	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: Driftwood
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13475	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: Mollies go to surface to breath?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13476	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Phosphates
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13477	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: styrofoam box cooling disaster!!!!!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13478	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: Mollies go to surface to breath?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13479	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Pacu in minneapolis still needs home: will deliver
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13480	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: styrofoam box cooling disaster!!!!!!! and more
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13481	From: paul helms	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: styrofoam box cooling disaster!!!!!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13482	From: paul helms	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Phosphates
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13483	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: What types of rocks should I use in my tank? >Link to safe rocks<
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13484	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: What types of rocks should I use in my tank? >Link to safe roc
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13485	From: Nicolas J. Munro	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: webring url broken?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13486	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Driftwood
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13487	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Driftwood
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13488	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Silly question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13489	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: styrofoam box cooling disaster!!!!!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13490	From: Nicolas J. Munro	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Mollie going to the top to breath like a betta?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13491	From: Nicolas J. Munro	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Tiger barb died? really fat tummy
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13492	From: Nicolas J. Munro	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Tiger barb died
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13493	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Mollie going to the top to breath like a betta?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13494	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Tiger barb died
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13495	From: Evita	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Pacu in minneapolis still needs home: will deliver
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13496	From: Evita	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Pacu in minneapolis still needs home: will deliver
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13497	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: What types of rocks should I use in my tank? >Link to safe roc
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13498	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: What types of rocks should I use in my tank? >Link to safe roc
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13499	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Care and feeding of the common Python
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13500	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Mollie going to the top to breath like a betta?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13501	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Poll: How Long Have You Been In The Hobby?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13502	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Poll: How Long Have You Been In The Hobby?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13503	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Pacu in minneapolis still needs home: will deliver
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13504	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Mollie going to the top to breath like a betta?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13505	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: styrofoam box cooling disaster!!!!!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13506	From: Evita	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Pacu in minneapolis still needs home: will deliver
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13507	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Care and feeding of the common Python
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13508	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Pacu in minneapolis still needs home: will deliver
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13509	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: What types of rocks should I use in my tank? >Link to safe...
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13510	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: styrofoam box cooling disaster!!!!!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13511	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Mollie going to the top to breath like a betta?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13512	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: angelfish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13513	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Care and feeding of the common Python
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13514	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Pacu in minneapolis still needs home: will deliver
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13515	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Care and feeding of the common Python
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13516	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Care and feeding of the common Python
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13517	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: maroon w/ 6-line wrasse
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13518	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Mollies go to surface to breath?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13519	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Phosphates
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13520	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: 150 tank pic
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13521	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Mollies go to surface to breath?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13522	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: 150 tank pic
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13523	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: 150 tank pic
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13524	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: zeolite
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13525	From: Marty Mendez	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: zeolite
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13526	From: Justin M.	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: new member
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13527	From: Jade Evita	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: ONE PICTURE
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13528	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Mollie going to the top to breath like a betta?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13529	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Care and feeding of the common Python
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13530	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Care and feeding of the common Python
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13531	From: paul helms	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: zeolite
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13532	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: zeolite
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13533	From: paul helms	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Phosphates
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13534	From: paul helms	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: maroon w/ 6-line wrasse
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13535	From: paul helms	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Tiger barb died? really fat tummy
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13536	From: daniel_roachus	Date: 7/19/2005
Subject: Re: Care and feeding of the common Python
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13537	From: Jo Baker	Date: 7/19/2005
Subject: Re: Care and feeding of the common Python
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13538	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/19/2005
Subject: Angel eggs!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13539	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/19/2005
Subject: Re: maroon w/ 6-line wrasse
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13540	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/19/2005
Subject: Re: new member
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13541	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/19/2005
Subject: Re: Angel eggs!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13542	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/19/2005
Subject: GlassCages.com - 65 Gallon Acrylic -
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13543	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/19/2005
Subject: Re: Angel eggs!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13544	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/19/2005
Subject: Re: Angel eggs!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13545	From: Marty	Date: 7/19/2005
Subject: What kind of pleco is on homepage?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13547	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/19/2005
Subject: Re: What kind of pleco is on homepage?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13548	From: Marty Mendez	Date: 7/19/2005
Subject: Re: What kind of pleco is on homepage?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13549	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/19/2005
Subject: Re: Angel eggs!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13550	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 7/19/2005
Subject: Re: zeolite
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13551	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/19/2005
Subject: Joke (snipped from Kim Komando Computer Newsletter 7/2/2005)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13552	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: Angel eggs!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13553	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: zeolite
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13554	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: What kind of pleco is on homepage?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13555	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: zeolite
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13556	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: angelfish queston
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13557	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: angelfish color/type
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13558	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: zeolite
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13559	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: angelfish queston
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13560	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: eBay
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13561	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: angelfish color/type
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13562	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: eBay
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13563	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: eBay
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13564	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: eBay
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13565	From: yarncrazymom	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: eBay
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13566	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: eBay
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13567	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: zeolite
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13568	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: rooting tropical plants in back of tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13569	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: zeolite
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13570	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Firemouths fin shrinking?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13571	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: angelfish color/type
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13572	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: angelfish queston
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13573	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: angelfish color/type
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13574	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: angelfish color/type
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13575	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: rooting tropical plants in back of tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13576	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: eBay
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13577	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: eBay
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13578	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: rooting tropical plants in back of tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13579	From: yarncrazymom	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: eBay
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13580	From: yarncrazymom	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: eBay
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13581	From: snailcrazymom	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Emily's snail
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13582	From: Norman Ali	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: The Koran Angelfish (Pomacanthus semicirculatus, Cuvier, 1831)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13583	From: Robert	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Warm water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13584	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Re: zeolite
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13585	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Re: zeolite
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13586	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Re: eBay
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13587	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Re: Emily's snail
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13588	From: Evita	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Re: eBay
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13589	From: Evita	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Re: eBay
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13590	From: Evita	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Re: eBay
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13591	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Re: eBay
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13592	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Re: eBay
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13593	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Re: zeolite
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13594	From: Karen	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Re: eBay
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13595	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Re: rooting tropical plants in back of tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13596	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Re: eBay
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13597	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: I have a few substrate questions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13598	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Re: I have a few substrate questions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13599	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Re: I have a few substrate questions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13600	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Re: I have a few substrate questions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13601	From: Dan	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Re: eBay
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13602	From: Tom Ray	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Re: I have a few substrate questions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13603	From: Tom Ray	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Fish for more acidic water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13604	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Re: I have a few substrate questions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13605	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Re: I have a few substrate questions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13606	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Re: rooting tropical plants in back of tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13607	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Re: Warm water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13608	From: Larry Nave	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Clearwater Aquarium Filter System
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13609	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/22/2005
Subject: Re: Fish for more acidic water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13610	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/22/2005
Subject: Re: Clearwater Aquarium Filter System
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13611	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/22/2005
Subject: Re: Pacu in minneapolis still needs home: will deliver
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13612	From: clarkmariposo25@aol.com	Date: 7/22/2005
Subject: Re: Emily's snail
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13613	From: clarkmariposo25@aol.com	Date: 7/22/2005
Subject: Re: Tricia-ot
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13614	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 7/22/2005
Subject: Great customer service from That Pet Place!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13615	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/22/2005
Subject: Re: I have a few substrate questions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13616	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/22/2005
Subject: Re: Fish for more acidic water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13617	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/22/2005
Subject: Re: Fish for more acidic water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13618	From: A.K.	Date: 7/22/2005
Subject: Re: Fish for more acidic water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13619	From: A.K.	Date: 7/22/2005
Subject: Re: Fish for more acidic water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13620	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/22/2005
Subject: Mouth turning black
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13621	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/22/2005
Subject: Re: Mouth turning black
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13622	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/22/2005
Subject: Re: Fish for more acidic water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13623	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 7/22/2005
Subject: Re: zeolite
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13624	From: paul helms	Date: 7/22/2005
Subject: Re: Mouth turning black
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13625	From: paul helms	Date: 7/22/2005
Subject: Re: Warm water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13626	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/22/2005
Subject: Can you identify this "Rock"?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13627	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/22/2005
Subject: GlassCages.com - 65 G Acrylic Tank UPDATE - Building the stand, etc.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13628	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: 1st Annual Coral Conference and Frag Swap, Rhinelander, WI USA, 8/6
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13629	From: Evita	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: Pacu in minneapolis still needs home: will deliver
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13630	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Foamy water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13631	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: Can you identify this "Rock"?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13632	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: Mouth turning black
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13633	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13634	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: Can you identify this "Rock"?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13635	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: GlassCages.com - 65 G Acrylic Tank UPDATE - Building the stand,
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13636	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13637	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13638	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13639	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13640	From: kraftygurl1963	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Set my tanks up
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13641	From: kb1dva	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: dead oscar
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13642	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: GlassCages.com - 65 G Acrylic Tank UPDATE - Building the stand,
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13643	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: dead oscar
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13644	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: dead oscar
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13645	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Silicon Valley Aquarium Society (SVAS) Monthly Meeting, 8/6/2005, 6
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13646	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: zeolite
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13647	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: San Francisco Aquarium Society (SFAS), 8/5/2005, 7:15 pm
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13648	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Added fish, bad move?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13649	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: aquarium lighting
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13650	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: Added fish, bad move?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13651	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: Mouth turning black
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13652	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: Set my tanks up
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13653	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: dead oscar
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13654	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Also added plants, need some info.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13655	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: dead oscar
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13656	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13657	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium lighting
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13658	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: Added fish, bad move?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13659	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: Also added plants, need some info.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13660	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: 1st Annual Coral Conference and Frag Swap, Rhinelander, WI USA, 8/7
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13661	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Power outages?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13662	From: paul helms	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Power outages?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13663	From: paul helms	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Set my tanks up
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13664	From: paul helms	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13665	From: paul helms	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13666	From: paul helms	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13667	From: paul helms	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: dead oscar
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13668	From: paul helms	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: angelfish queston
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13669	From: KraftyGurl1963	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Set my tanks up
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13670	From: KraftyGurl1963	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Set my tanks up/ Steve
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13671	From: KraftyGurl1963	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Question on feeding
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13672	From: wendie	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: angelfish queston
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13673	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Power outages?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13674	From: harry perry	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Set my tanks up/To Lori, Steve and Paul
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13675	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Set my tanks up/ Steve
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13676	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13677	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: GlassCages.com - 65 G Acrylic Tank UPDATE - Building the stand,
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13678	From: kb1dva	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: dead Oscar
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13679	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: GlassCages.com - 65 G Acrylic Tank UPDATE - Building the stand,
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13680	From: Nan	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Set my tanks up/ Steve
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13681	From: Nan	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Set my tanks up/ Steve
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13682	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: dead Oscar
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13683	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: 65 G Acrylic Tank UPDATE
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13684	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Power outages?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13685	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: dead oscar
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13686	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Also added plants, need some info.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13687	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Power outages?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13688	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Added fish, bad move?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13689	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: dead Oscar
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13690	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Power outages?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13691	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: aquarium lighting
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13692	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Also added plants, need some info.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13693	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13694	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: angelfish queston
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13695	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Set my tanks up
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13696	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Also added plants, need some info.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13697	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: GlassCages.com - 65 G Acrylic Tank UPDATE - Building the stand,
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13698	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Set my tanks up/ Steve
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13699	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: 65 G Acrylic Tank UPDATE
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13700	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Power outages?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13701	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Added fish, bad move?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13702	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium lighting
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13703	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: white spots
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13704	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium lighting
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13705	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: PimaFix/MelaFix
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13706	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Set my tanks up
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13707	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: quarentine/hospital tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13708	From: paul helms	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: PimaFix/MelaFix
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13709	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: quarentine/hospital tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13710	From: paul helms	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: dead Oscar
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13711	From: paul helms	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Set my tanks up/To Lori, Steve and Paul
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13712	From: paul helms	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Question on feeding
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13713	From: paul helms	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Set my tanks up
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13714	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: WAS (Power outages) Chicago Aquarium Clubs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13715	From: bunnycareshi	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Seaweed as food & correct temp/freshwater
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13716	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: white spots
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13717	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium lighting
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13718	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Seaweed as food & correct temp/freshwater
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13719	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: PimaFix/MelaFix
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13720	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: WAS (Power outages) Chicago Aquarium Clubs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13721	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: quarentine/hospital tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13722	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium lighting
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13723	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Chicago Aquarium Clubs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13724	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: PimaFix/MelaFix
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13725	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: disposable filter cartridges
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13726	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: glowlight danios
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13727	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: more on glofish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13728	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium lighting
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13729	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium lighting
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13730	From: KraftyGurl1963	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Question on feeding
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13731	From: KraftyGurl1963	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Set my tanks up
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13732	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Power outages?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13733	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: GlassCages.com - 65 G Acrylic Tank UPDATE - Building the stand,
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13734	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: 65 G Acrylic Tank UPDATE (reply to Rob)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13735	From: bunnycareshi	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Seaweed as food & correct temp/freshwater
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13736	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: PimaFix/MelaFix
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13737	From: KraftyGurl1963	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Set my tanks up/Nan
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13738	From: KraftyGurl1963	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Set my tanks up/ Steve
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13739	From: Jo Baker	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Power outages?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13740	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: PimaFix/MelaFix
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13741	From: komal trehan	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Me and My Cuties....
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13742	From: Seasons444@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Canister Filter Media
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13743	From: krazeez22	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Filter Media / Marine Tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13744	From: Robert	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Snails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13745	From: camdogkingsfan	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: question about fish disapearing
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13746	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: 65 G Acrylic Tank UPDATE (reply to Rob)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13747	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Seaweed as food & correct temp/freshwater
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13748	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: quarentine/hospital tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13749	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: quarentine/hospital tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13750	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: more on glofish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13751	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Fin and tail rot keeps getting worse with Maracyn and M2/ hospital
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13752	From: Patrick	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: glowlight danios
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13753	From: AQUARIUMFISH	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Betta nest/eggs - I think
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13754	From: bennedh76	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: New Guy
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13755	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: 65 G Acrylic Tank UPDATE (reply to Rob)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13756	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: question about fish disapearing
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13757	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Snails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13758	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: more on glofish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13759	From: wendie	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Betta nest/eggs - I think
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13760	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Fin and tail rot keeps getting worse with Maracyn and M2/ hospi
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13761	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: New Guy
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13762	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Filter Media / Marine Tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13763	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: PimaFix/MelaFix
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13764	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: PimaFix/MelaFix
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13765	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium lighting
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13766	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: question about fish disapearing
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13767	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Me and My Cuties....
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13768	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: PimaFix/MelaFix
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13769	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: WAS (Power outages) Chicago Aquarium Clubs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13770	From: kb1dva	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: tank stands
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13771	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: more on glofish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13772	From: Robert Hickey	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Cascade 1000 filter
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13773	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Betta nest/eggs - I think
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13774	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: zeolite
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13775	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: PimaFix/MelaFix
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13776	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium lighting
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13777	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: WAS (Power outages) Chicago Aquarium Clubs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13778	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Fin and tail rot keeps getting worse with Maracyn and M2/ hospi
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13779	From: bunnycareshi	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Seaweed as food & correct temp for clowns
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13780	From: japanesegorilla05	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Safe to use a heater?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13781	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: glowlight danios
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13782	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: tank stands
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13783	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: tank stands
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13784	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13785	From: Evita	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13786	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Seaweed as food & correct temp for clowns
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13787	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13788	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: New Guy
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13789	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: New Guy
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13790	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13791	From: Tom Ray	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: UPDATE...re: Fish for more acidic water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13792	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13793	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13794	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: tank stands
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13795	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13796	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Fin and tail rot keeps getting worse with Maracyn and M2/ hospi
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13797	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium lighting
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13798	From: Patrick	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13799	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13800	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13801	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13802	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13803	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium lighting
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13804	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium lighting
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13805	From: discusfishies	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13806	From: discusfishies	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: question about fish disapearing
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13807	From: Sandy Kay	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: snails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13808	From: Phil	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: hot water!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13809	From: Phil	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13810	From: camdogkingsfan	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: question about fish disapearing
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13811	From: Patrick	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: hot water!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13812	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: New Guy
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13813	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: UPDATE...re: Fish for more acidic water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13814	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13815	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Fin and tail rot keeps getting worse with Maracyn and M2/ hospi
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13816	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13817	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13818	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: PimaFix/MelaFix
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13819	From: Aaron M.	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: webring url broken?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13820	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Catfish with BLOATED stomach
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13821	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: tank stands
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13822	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13823	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: tank stands
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13824	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13825	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: signing posts
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13826	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: more on glofish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13827	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: hot water!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13828	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: tank stands/Level
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13829	From: bennedh76	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: New Guy
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13830	From: bennedh76	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: New Guy
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13832	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: New Guy
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13833	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: PimaFix and MelaFix
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13834	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13835	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Aeration questions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13836	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: tank stands/Level
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13837	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water (now debate about Melafix and Pimafix)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13838	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy Water (now the debate on MelaFix and PimaFix)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13839	From: kritter714@aol.com	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13840	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13841	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy Water (now the debate on MelaFix and PimaFix)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13842	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water (now debate about Melafix and Pimafix)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13843	From: sandy	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: NEW FISH??
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13844	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: PimaFix and MelaFix
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13845	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: New Guy
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13846	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: NEW FISH??
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13847	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13848	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13849	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: PimaFix/MelaFix
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13850	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13851	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13852	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13853	From: snailcrazymom	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: eBay
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13854	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: question about fish disapearing
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13855	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: snails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13856	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy Water (now the debate on MelaFix and PimaFix)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13857	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: snails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13858	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water (now debate about Melafix and Pimafix)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13859	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13860	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13861	From: Robert Hickey	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Ph
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13862	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Ph
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13863	From: Robert Hickey	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Ph
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13864	From: Evita	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: hot water!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13865	From: Evita	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13866	From: daniel_roachus	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13867	From: paul helms	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13868	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13869	From: Evita	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: hot water!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13870	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: New Guy
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13871	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy Water (now the debate on MelaFix and PimaFix)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13872	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy Water (now the debate on MelaFix and PimaFix)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13873	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13874	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13875	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water (now debate about Melafix and Pimafix)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13876	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13877	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13878	From: AQUARIUMFISH	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: I have fry!!!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13879	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy Water (now the debate on MelaFix and PimaFix)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13880	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: New Guy
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13881	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: New Guy
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13882	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: New Guy
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13883	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: New Guy
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13884	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy Water (now the debate on MelaFix and PimaFix)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13885	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: I have fry!!!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13886	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: snails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13887	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: hot water!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13888	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy Water (now the debate on MelaFix and PimaFix)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13889	From: Patrick	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13890	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water (now debate about Melafix and Pimafix)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13891	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: I have fry!!!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13892	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: To Paul & Ray Re: MelaFix & PimaFix
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13893	From: Patrick	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: hot water!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13894	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: snails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13895	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: hot water!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13896	From: Tom Ray	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Aeration questions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13897	From: paul helms	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: To Paul & Ray Re: MelaFix & PimaFix
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13898	From: paul helms	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water (now debate about Melafix and Pimafix)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13899	From: paul helms	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: New Guy
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13900	From: paul helms	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13901	From: paul helms	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13902	From: paul helms	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13903	From: paul helms	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13904	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Aeration questions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13905	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water (now debate about Melafix and Pimafix)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13906	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: tank stands/Level
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13907	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: making your own willow water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13908	From: Sandy Kay	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Digest Number 896
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13909	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: hot water!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13910	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: hot water!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13911	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Digest Number 896
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13912	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: pimafix and melafix
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13913	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: aquarium medicine cabinet
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13914	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Clear water!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13915	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: mondo grass
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13916	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Ph
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13917	From: ahorseofcourse66	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Question on Gouramis ?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13918	From: camdogkingsfan	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Update on my Black ghost
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13919	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution (Paul Helms going off the d
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13920	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Ph - Bogwood
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13921	From: Robert Hickey	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: Ph
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13922	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy Water (now the debate on MelaFix and PimaFix)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13923	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy Water (now the debate on MelaFix and PimaFix)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13924	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: PimaFix and MelaFix
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13925	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium medicine cabinet
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13926	From: paul helms	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: PimaFix and MelaFix
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13927	From: paul helms	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution (Paul Helms going off the d
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13928	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13929	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: mondo grass
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13930	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium medicine cabinet
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13931	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Electrocution
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13932	From: Evita	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13933	From: wendie	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: Electrocution
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13934	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: To Paul & Ray Re: MelaFix & PimaFix
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13935	From: Patrick	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: PimaFix and MelaFix
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13936	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Diatom Filters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13937	From: Cire	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: any philly fishfreaks in this group
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13938	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13939	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: hot water!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13940	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium medicine cabinet
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13941	From: joequality1980	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: hot water!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13942	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: hot water!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13943	From: T	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: ATTN FortWayneFish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13944	From: T	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium medicine cabinet
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13945	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Brown Knife Fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13946	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium medicine cabinet
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13947	From: Aaron	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: lighting ? for fw w/ plants
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13948	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy Water (now the debate on MelaFix and PimaFix)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13949	From: Tom Ray	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: Question on Gouramis ?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13950	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: Electrocution
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13951	From: Tom Ray	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: Digest Number 896
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13952	From: Patrick	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: hot water! - cold brains
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13953	From: Patrick	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: ATTN FortWayneFish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13954	From: Patrick	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium medicine cabinet
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13955	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: hot water! - cold brains
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13956	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: Electrocution
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13957	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: any philly fishfreaks in this group
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13958	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: hot water! - cold brains
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13959	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: MEdicine cabinet
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13960	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: lighting ? for fw w/ plants
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13961	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: black lace angelfish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13962	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: Electrocution
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13963	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium medicine cabinet
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13964	From: Tom Ray	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium medicine cabinet
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13965	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: black lace angelfish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13966	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: To Paul & Ray Re: MelaFix & PimaFix
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13967	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: Electrocution
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13968	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium medicine cabinet
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13969	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium medicine cabinet
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13970	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: was ATTN Ftwayne ( ATTN PATRICK ! )
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13971	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: Diatom Filters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13972	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: Diatom Filters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13973	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: New guys in the tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13974	From: Sandra	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution (Paul Helms going off the d
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13975	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium medicine cabinet SALT!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13976	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: New guys in the tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13977	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: New guys in the tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13978	From: Aaron	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Practical Fishkeeping Dyed Fish Campaign
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13979	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy Water (now the debate on MelaFix and PimaFix)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13980	From: Tom Ray	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: New guys in the tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13981	From: Aaron	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: lighting ? for fw w/ plants
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13982	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: guppies and swordtails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13983	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy Water (now the debate on MelaFix and PimaFix)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13984	From: Patrick	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution (Paul Helms going off the d
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13985	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium medicine cabinet
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13986	From: Patrick	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium medicine cabinet SALT!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13987	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: To Paul & Ray Re: MelaFix & PimaFix
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13988	From: Aaron	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: lighting ? for fw w/ plants
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13989	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: New guys in the tank (now Acronym... DH.. lol)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13990	From: Sandra	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: lighting ? for fw w/ plants
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13991	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy Water (now the debate on MelaFix and PimaFix)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13992	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: To Paul & Ray Re: MelaFix & PimaFix
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13993	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium medicine cabinet
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13994	From: nanikjava	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: New Discus Website
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13995	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium medicine cabinet
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13996	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium medicine cabinet
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13997	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: Question on Gouramis ?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13998	From: paul helms	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution (Paul Helms going off the d
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13999	From: paul helms	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: Electrocution
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14000	From: paul helms	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: To Paul & Ray Re: MelaFix & PimaFix
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14001	From: paul helms	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14002	From: paul helms	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy Water (now the debate on MelaFix and PimaFix)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14003	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium medicine cabinet
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14004	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium medicine cabinet
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14005	From: Evita	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution (Paul Helms going off the d
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14006	From: Evita	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14007	From: Patrick	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: To Paul & Ray Re: MelaFix & PimaFix
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14008	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14009	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: New guys in the tank (now Acronym... DH.. lol)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14010	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: New guys in the tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14011	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: New guys in the tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14012	From: harry perry	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: The electrocution thread ends now!!!!!!! To All
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14013	From: harry perry	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: An Important message to all.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14014	From: Patrick	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: An Important message to all.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14015	From: harry perry	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: An Important message to all.To Patrick
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14016	From: Daniel	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Cherry shrimp
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14017	From: Daniel	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Central Filtration idea?/Automation?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14018	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: An Important message to all.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14019	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: Cherry shrimp
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14020	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: Cherry shrimp
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14021	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: name calling and pointless agruements
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14022	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium medicine cabinet
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14023	From: John Gonzalez	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: An Important message to all.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14024	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: name calling and pointless agruements
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14025	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium medicine cabinet
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14026	From: Sandy Kay	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: ammonia reading
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14027	From: Evita	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: Cherry shrimp
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14028	From: Evita	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: An Important message to all.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14029	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14030	From: Tom Ray	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: New guys in the tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14031	From: Ken McDougall	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: Central Filtration idea?/Automation?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14032	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: New guys in the tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14033	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14034	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: blue rams
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14035	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: ammonia reading (about zeolite)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14036	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: Ph - Bogwood
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14037	From: Daniel	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: Cherry shrimp
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14038	From: Daniel	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: Cherry shrimp
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14039	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: Ph
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14040	From: Sandy Kay	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Subject: Re: An Important message to all.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14041	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: hot water!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14042	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: To Paul & Ray Re: MelaFix & PimaFix
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14043	From: Tim Fairchild	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: An Important message to all.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14044	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: hot water!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14045	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: To Paul & Ray Re: MelaFix & PimaFix
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14046	From: Jeff Schultz	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: A great way to ask questions and share experinces
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14047	From: dorothy wheeler	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: An Important message to all.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14048	From: harry perry	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Let's put it to rest. Time to move on. An excerpt from a message s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14049	From: Rei - Raymond Tremor	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: Re: Seaweed as food & correct temp/freshwater
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14050	From: Robert Hickey	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: Re: Ph
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14051	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: Re: New guys in the tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14052	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: Re: New guys in the tank/Betta Fry
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14053	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: Re: New guys in the tank/Betta Fry
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14054	From: TankGurl	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: Re: A great way to ask questions and share experinces
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14055	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: What causes a nitrite spike
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14056	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: Re: Ph - Bogwood (now Crawfish Boiler's)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14057	From: joequality1980	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: swordtail maturity
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14058	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: Re: swordtail maturity
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14059	From: rosette55@webtv.net	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: please trim your posts
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14060	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: Re: swordtail maturity
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14061	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: Re: hot water!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14062	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: Re: hot water!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14063	From: joequality1980	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: Re: hot water!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14064	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: Re: hot water!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14065	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: Re: guppies and swordtails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14066	From: camdogkingsfan	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: question about posting a message
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14067	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: Re: question about posting a message
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14068	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: dead sword and cory
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14069	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: Re: What causes a nitrite spike
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14070	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: Re: please trim your posts
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14071	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: identifying a pleco
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14072	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: Re: Central Filtration idea?/Automation?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14073	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: yet another light question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14074	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: ammonia reading
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14075	From: richard thompson	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: yet another light question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14076	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: yet another light question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14077	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: blue rams
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14078	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: blue rams
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14079	From: ahorseofcourse66	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: Question on Gouramis ?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14080	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: please trim your posts
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14081	From: Daniel	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: Central Filtration idea?/Automation?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14082	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: filter media
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14083	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: question about posting a message
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14084	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: identifying a pleco
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14085	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: Question on Gouramis ?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14086	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: Central Filtration idea?/Automation?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14087	From: aclaar877	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Water parameters - Planted discus
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14088	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: flea and spider bombs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14089	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: flea and spider bombs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14090	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: please trim your posts
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14091	From: Rei - Raymond Tremor	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water (now debate about Melafix and Pimafix)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14092	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: flea and spider bombs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14093	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water (now debate about Melafix and Pimafix)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14094	From: harry perry	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: (now debate about Melafix and Pimafix)/another deadly combinati
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14095	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: Water parameters - Planted discus
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14096	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: Question on Gouramis ?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14097	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Pacific Coast Cichlid Association (PCCA), 8/13/2005, 6:45 pm
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14098	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: Water parameters - Planted discus
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14099	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: flea and spider bombs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14100	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: flea and spider bombs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14101	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: flea and spider bombs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14102	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water (now debate about Melafix and Pimafix)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14103	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: flea and spider bombs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14104	From: Trevor	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: 150 Gallon Tank Disaster
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14105	From: J G	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: couple quick Qs....
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14106	From: snailcrazymom	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: Cherry shrimp
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14107	From: snailcrazymom	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: couple quick Qs....
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14108	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: please trim your replies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14109	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: flea and spider bombs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14110	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: couple quick Qs....
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14111	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: 150 Gallon Tank Disaster
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14112	From: richard thompson	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: flea and spider bombs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14113	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: flea and spider bombs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14114	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: please trim your posts
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14115	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: flea and spider bombs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14116	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: flea and spider bombs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14117	From: DB1RDMAN@WMCONNECT.COM	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: Digest Number 907
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14118	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: Cherry shrimp
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14119	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: Question on Gouramis ?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14120	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: please trim your replies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14121	From: camdogkingsfan	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Pleco with Knife
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14122	From: camdogkingsfan	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Golden Pleco
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14123	From: camdogkingsfan	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Yo Yo Loach
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14124	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: Yo Yo Loach
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14125	From: harry perry	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: please trim your replies/To Lenny
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14126	From: harry perry	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: please trim your replies/To Lenny
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14127	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: Pleco with Knife
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14128	From: camdogkingsfan	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: Yo Yo Loach
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14129	From: Evita	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: flea and spider bombs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14130	From: CATHERINE FLOWERS	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: couple quick Qs....
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14132	From: Aaron	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Green Hair Algae?s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14133	From: Aaron	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: yet another light question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14134	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: Pleco with Knife
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14135	From: harry perry	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: Question on Gouramis ?/ To Linda, I disagree.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14136	From: Aaron	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Aquarium Lighting
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14137	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: 150 Gallon Tank Disaster
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14138	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: Golden Pleco
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14139	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: Yo Yo Loach
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14140	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: flea and spider bombs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14141	From: richard thompson	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: flea and spider bombs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14142	From: richard thompson	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: flea and spider bombs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14143	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: flea and spider bombs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14144	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: flea and spider bombs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14145	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: couple quick Qs....
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14146	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: flea and spider bombs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14147	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: Yo Yo Loach
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14148	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: now weevils
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14149	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: flea and spider bombs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14150	From: CATHERINE FLOWERS	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: flea and spider bombs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14151	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: The San Diego Tropical Fish Society , 8/14/2005, 7:00 pm
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14152	From: CATHERINE FLOWERS	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: couple quick Qs....
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14153	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: Pleco with Knife
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14154	From: Evita	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: flea and spider bombs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14155	From: camdogkingsfan	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Bunocephalus coracoideus or Banjo catfish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14156	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: An Important message to all.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14157	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: Betta nest/eggs - I think
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14158	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: Cascade 1000 filter
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14159	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: Cascade 1000 filter
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14160	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: Electrocution
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14161	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: Fin and tail rot keeps getting worse with Maracyn and M2/ hospi
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14162	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: Fin and tail rot keeps getting worse with Maracyn and M2/ hospi
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14163	From: CATHERINE FLOWERS	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: Betta nest/eggs - I think
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14164	From: camdogkingsfan	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: What is this fish name
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14165	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: EntomologicLife@yahoogroups.com :-D
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14166	From: AQUARIUMFISH	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: What is this fish name
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14167	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: EntomologicLife@yahoogroups.com :-D
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14168	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: What is this fish name
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14169	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: What is this fish name
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14170	From: richard thompson	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: flea and spider bombs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14171	From: camdogkingsfan	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: Bunocephalus coracoideus or Banjo catfish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14172	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: Bunocephalus coracoideus or Banjo catfish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14173	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: Green Hair Algae?s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14174	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: yet another light question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14175	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: Electrocution
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14176	From: richard thompson	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: Bunocephalus coracoideus or Banjo catfish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14177	From: richard thompson	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: Bunocephalus coracoideus or Banjo catfish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14178	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: What is this fish name
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14179	From: Hrvoje Maric	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: Green Hair Algae?s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14180	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: What is this fish name
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14181	From: hnorton1cogeco.ca	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: please trim your posts/Heres a tip/Heather Norton
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14182	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: Betta nest/eggs - I think
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14183	From: camdogkingsfan	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: Bunocephalus coracoideus or Banjo catfish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14184	From: rosette55@webtv.net	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: trim your posts
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14185	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: EntomologicLife@yahoogroups.com :-D
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14186	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14187	From: Aaron	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Rosy Barbs and Neon Tetras (was Re: Green Hair Algae?s)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14188	From: Aaron	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: question about posting a message
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14189	From: Rei - Raymond Tremor	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: (now debate about Melafix and Pimafix)/another deadly combinati
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14190	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14191	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: EntomologicLife@yahoogroups.com :-D
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14192	From: richard thompson	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: Bunocephalus coracoideus or Banjo catfish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14193	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: aquarium salt/dead swordtails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14194	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: water conditioners
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14195	From: Justin M.	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium salt/dead swordtails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14196	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium salt/dead swordtails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14197	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium salt/dead swordtails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14198	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: water conditioners
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14199	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: water conditioners
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14200	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium salt/dead swordtails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14201	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: Poll results for AquaticLife
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14202	From: Hrvoje Maric	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: Rosy Barbs and Neon Tetras (was Re: Green Hair Algae?s)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14203	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium salt/dead swordtails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14204	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium salt/dead swordtails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14205	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium salt/dead swordtails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14206	From: Martin VanderWal	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: Filter Change
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14207	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium salt/dead swordtails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14208	From: Phil	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: More babies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14209	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: Re: More babies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14210	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: Re: More babies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14211	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium salt/dead swordtails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14212	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium salt/dead swordtails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14213	From: Sandy Kay	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: Subject: Re: water conditioners
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14214	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: dechlorinators
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14215	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: San Francisco Aquarium Society (SFAS), 8/5/2005, 7:15 pm
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14216	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: Re: Subject: Re: water conditioners
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14217	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: Subject: Re: water conditioners
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14218	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: Re: dechlorinators
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14219	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium salt/dead swordtails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14220	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium salt/dead swordtails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14221	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium salt/dead swordtails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14222	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: amazon sword for large tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14223	From: KttmfC	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: Hey shtuff for sales
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14224	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium salt/dead swordtails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14225	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium salt/dead swordtails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14226	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: Re: amazon sword for large tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14227	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: 1st Annual Coral Conference and Frag Swap, Rhinelander, WI USA, 8/6
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14228	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: Re: amazon sword for large tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14229	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium salt/dead swordtails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14230	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: Re: amazon sword for large tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14231	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: Re: amazon sword for large tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14232	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium salt/dead swordtails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14233	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium salt/dead swordtails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14234	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: Re: amazon sword for large tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14235	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: Koi question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14236	From: richard thompson	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: Re: Koi question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14237	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: plant question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14238	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: water sprite
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14239	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: hair algae on crinium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14240	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: Re: Koi question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14241	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: Re: water sprite
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14242	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: Re: water sprite
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14243	From: Sandra	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: Re: Hey shtuff for sales
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14244	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: Re: water sprite
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14245	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: Re: water sprite
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14246	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: Silicon Valley Aquarium Society (SVAS) Monthly Meeting, 8/6/2005, 6
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14247	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: Re: Filter Change
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14248	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium salt/dead swordtails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14249	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: Re: Hey shtuff for sales
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14250	From: snailcrazymom	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: How do I get these FISH out
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14251	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: Kordon Breather Bags
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14252	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: 1st Annual Coral Conference and Frag Swap, Rhinelander, WI USA, 8/7
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14253	From: richard thompson	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: Re: How do I get these FISH out
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14254	From: Sandy Kay	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: Re: Subject: Re: water conditioners
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14255	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium salt/dead swordtails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14256	From: ben_noreau	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: looking for guppies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14257	From: ranchugirl	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: Goldfish Calendar 2006
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14258	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: Subject: Re: water conditioners
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14259	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: Re: water sprite
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14260	From: Martin VanderWal	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: Re: Filter Change
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14261	From: joequality1980	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: Re: hair algae on crinium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14262	From: joequality1980	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: Re: looking for guppies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14263	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: Re: Kordon Breather Bags
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14264	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: SAE
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14265	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: Re: Goldfish Calendar 2006
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14266	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14267	From: Tom Ray	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: Re: water sprite
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14268	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14269	From: Ben Noreau	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: Re: looking for guppies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14270	From: steve@landoctor.com	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: (no subject)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14271	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: Re: (unknown)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14272	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: Re: Filter Change
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14273	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: Re: Subject: Re: water conditioners
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14274	From: Andrea	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: New to the Group
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14275	From: seamonkeystew	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: Fish Only Saltwater tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14276	From: Justin M.	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: Re: New to the Group
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14277	From: Robert Hickey	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Feeding Tropical fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14278	From: Daniel	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Re: How do I get these FISH out
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14279	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Guest Speakers ?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14280	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Re: Guest Speakers ?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14281	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Re: Guest Speakers ?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14282	From: Chris	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Re: Feeding Tropical fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14283	From: Daniel	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Tank Pics
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14284	From: joequality1980	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Re: Tank Pics
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14285	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Re: Fish Only Saltwater tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14286	From: Daniel	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Re: Tank Pics
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14287	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Re: Tank Pics
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14288	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Many questions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14289	From: seamonkeystew	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Re: Fish Only Saltwater tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14290	From: joequality1980	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Re: Many questions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14291	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Re: Fish Only Saltwater tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14292	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Re: Many questions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14293	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Re: Fish Only Saltwater tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14294	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Problems
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14295	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Re: Many questions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14296	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution~ PAUL
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14297	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14298	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Re: Problems
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14299	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution~ PAUL
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14300	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Re: Koi question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14301	From: harry perry	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution~ PAUL
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14302	From: Chris	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Re: How do I get these FISH out
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14303	From: Chris	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Re: Tank Pics
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14304	From: Chris	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Re: Many questions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14305	From: Chris	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Re: Many questions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14306	From: Daniel	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Re: Tank Pics
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14307	From: Chris	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Re: Tank Pics
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14308	From: CATHERINE FLOWERS	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Re: New to the Group
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14309	From: Daniel	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: new to group
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14310	From: Sandra	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: disaster continues...
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14311	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Re: Problems
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14312	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Re: disaster continues...
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14313	From: Andrea	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Re: New to the Group
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14314	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Fixing tanks was Re: [AquaticLife] disaster continues...
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14315	From: harry perry	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Re: Fixing tanks was Re: [AquaticLife] disaster continues...
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14316	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Re: disaster continues...
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14317	From: CATHERINE FLOWERS	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Re: new to group
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14318	From: harry perry	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Re: new to group/To Catherine
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14319	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Re: Guest Speakers ?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14320	From: Sandra	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Fixing tanks was Re: [AquaticLife] disaster continues...
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14321	From: Sandra	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Re: disaster continues...
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14322	From: Sandra	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Re: disaster continues...
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14323	From: harry perry	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Re: Fixing tanks was Re: [AquaticLife] disaster continues.../To San
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14324	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Re: disaster continues...
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14325	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Fish and Color
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14326	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: The Jersey Shore Aquarium Society (JSAS), 8/8/2005, 8:00 pm
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14327	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Driftwood gone bad?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14328	From: Sandra	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: geez do i feel stupid now....!!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14329	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: Re: geez do i feel stupid now....!!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14330	From: harry perry	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: Re: geez do i feel stupid now....!!!!/To Sandra
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14331	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: Re: Problems
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14332	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: Re: Driftwood gone bad?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14333	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: Re: geez do i feel stupid now....!!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14334	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: Re: Problems
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14335	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: Re: Driftwood gone bad?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14336	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: Re: Driftwood gone bad?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14337	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: Re: Driftwood gone bad?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14338	From: Sandra	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: Re: geez do i feel stupid now....!!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14339	From: Sandra	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: Re: geez do i feel stupid now....!!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14340	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: Re: geez do i feel stupid now....!!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14341	From: Angela	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: Green Water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14342	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: Re: Green Water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14343	From: CATHERINE FLOWERS	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: Re: new to group/To Catherine
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14344	From: harry perry	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: Re: new to group/To Catherine/again
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14345	From: Angela	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: Re: Green Water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14346	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: hello, intro, and a ? about african knifefish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14347	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: Re: Green Water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14348	From: Leslie	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: White growth
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14349	From: CATHERINE FLOWERS	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: Re: new to group/To Catherine/again
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14350	From: Chris	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: Re: Green Water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14351	From: Chris	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: cracked tanks (inspired by leaky tank thread)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14352	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/8/2005
Subject: Re: White growth
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14353	From: Leslie	Date: 8/8/2005
Subject: Re: White growth
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14354	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 8/8/2005
Subject: arowana
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14355	From: joequality1980	Date: 8/8/2005
Subject: heater question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14356	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/8/2005
Subject: Re: heater question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14357	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/8/2005
Subject: Re: White growth
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14358	From: Leslie	Date: 8/8/2005
Subject: Re: White growth
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14359	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 8/8/2005
Subject: Re: new to group
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14360	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/8/2005
Subject: Re: White growth
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14361	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/8/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14362	From: Leslie	Date: 8/8/2005
Subject: Re: White growth
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14363	From: joequality1980	Date: 8/8/2005
Subject: Re: new to group
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14364	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/8/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14365	From: Leslie	Date: 8/8/2005
Subject: Catfish Bloated Stomach
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14366	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/8/2005
Subject: Re: White growth
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14367	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/8/2005
Subject: Re: heater question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14368	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/8/2005
Subject: Re: Catfish Bloated Stomach
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14369	From: Chris	Date: 8/8/2005
Subject: Re: arowana
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14370	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/8/2005
Subject: Re: Catfish Bloated Stomach
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14371	From: Chris	Date: 8/8/2005
Subject: Re: hello, intro, and a ? about african knifefish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14372	From: richard thompson	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Re: Fish Only Saltwater tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14373	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Re: White growth
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14374	From: Leslie	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Re: Catfish Bloated Stomach
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14375	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Re: Koi question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14376	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Re: Koi question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14377	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Re: hello, intro, and a ? about african knifefish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14378	From: Amalthea	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Re: Koi question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14379	From: Daniel	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Re: new to group
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14380	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Re: Koi question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14381	From: Leslie	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Firemouth died
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14382	From: Chris	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Re: hello, intro, and a ? about african knifefish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14383	From: richard thompson	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Re: hello, intro, and a ? about african knifefish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14384	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Re: Firemouth died
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14385	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Re: hello, intro, and a ? about african knifefish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14386	From: Leslie	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Re: Firemouth died
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14387	From: Leslie	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Re: Firemouth died
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14388	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Re: hello, intro, and a ? about african knifefish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14389	From: Chris	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Re: hello, intro, and a ? about african knifefish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14390	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Re: Catfish Bloated Stomach
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14391	From: Chris	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Re: Firemouth died
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14392	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Re: Koi question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14393	From: Amalthea	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Re: Koi question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14394	From: Chris	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Re: heater question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14395	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: High level of Phosphate in my water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14396	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: High level of Phosphate in my water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14397	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: Koi question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14398	From: deborahgd14	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Angie the Angel fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14399	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: Firemouth died
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14400	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: Angie the Angel fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14401	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: heater question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14402	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: Angie the Angel fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14403	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: Angie the Angel fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14404	From: T	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Need Help Fast...Sick Betta...think it is VELVET
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14405	From: DB1RDMAN@WMCONNECT.COM	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Digest Number 923 - ICE ON THE POND
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14406	From: tws812003	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Discus for sale
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14407	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: Discus for sale
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14408	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: Discus for sale
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14409	From: Andrea	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: Need Help Fast...Sick Betta...think it is VELVET
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14410	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: High level of Phosphate in my water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14411	From: T	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: Need Help Fast...Sick Betta...think it is VELVET
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14412	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: ? about african knifefish/Chris
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14413	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Another stocking question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14414	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: Another stocking question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14415	From: Aaron M.	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: SAE's (was - Re: [AquaticLife] Tank Pics)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14416	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: Another stocking question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14417	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: growing anarchis
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14418	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: bacteria
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14419	From: Daniel	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: SAE's (was - Re: [AquaticLife] Tank Pics)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14420	From: richard thompson	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: growing anarchis
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14421	From: Daniel	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: growing anarchis
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14422	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: SAE's (was - Re: [AquaticLife] Tank Pics)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14423	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: SAE's (was - Re: [AquaticLife] Tank Pics)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14424	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: growing anarchis
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14425	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: got my angelfish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14426	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: High level of Phosphate in my water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14427	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: High level of Phosphate in my water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14428	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: Another stocking question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14429	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: Koi question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14430	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: Koi question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14431	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: bacteria
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14432	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: Koi question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14433	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Pacific Coast Cichlid Association (PCCA), 8/13/2005, 6:45 pm
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14434	From: Chris	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: bacteria
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14435	From: Chris	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: heater question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14436	From: Sandy Kay	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: salt question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14437	From: deborahgd14	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: Angie the Angel fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14438	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: salt question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14439	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: Angie the Angel fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14440	From: Andrea	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: Need Help Fast...Sick Betta...think it is VELVET
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14441	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: got my angelfish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14442	From: T	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: Need Help Fast...Sick Betta...think it is VELVET
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14443	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: Koi question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14444	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: Koi question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14445	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: Need Help Fast...Sick Betta...think it is VELVET
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14446	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: Koi question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14447	From: Daniel	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: Another stocking question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14448	From: Andrea	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: Need Help Fast...Sick Betta...think it is VELVET
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14449	From: pam phetteplace	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Betta with columnaris (sp?)...need advice pls.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14450	From: pamphetteplace	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: Need Help Fast...Sick Betta...think it is VELVET
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14451	From: rojeriko	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: Another stocking question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14452	From: T	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: Need Help Fast...Sick Betta...think it is VELVET
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14453	From: T	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: Need Help Fast...Sick Betta...think it is VELVET
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14454	From: deborahgd14	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: Angie the Angel fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14455	From: T	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: Need Help Fast...Sick Betta...think it is VELVET
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14456	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: Angie the Angel fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14457	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: Betta with columnaris (sp?)...need advice pls.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14458	From: pamphetteplace	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: Betta with columnaris (sp?)...need advice pls.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14459	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: Koi question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14460	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: Betta with columnaris (sp?)...need advice pls.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14461	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: hello, intro, and a ? about african knifefish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14462	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: was african knifefish/now dragonfish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14463	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: link for dragon gobies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14464	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: High level of Phosphate in my water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14465	From: T	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: link for dragon gobies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14466	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: link for dragon gobies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14467	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: But...but...what happened?!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14468	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: salt question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14469	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: hello, intro, and a ? about african knifefish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14470	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: hello, intro, and a ? about african knifefish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14471	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: hello, intro, and a ? about african knifefish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14472	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: violet gobi and do you name your fish?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14473	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14474	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: my catfish ate my snails!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14475	From: Robert	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: violet gobi and do you name your fish?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14476	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: violet gobi and do you name your fish?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14477	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: link for dragon gobies/Terry
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14478	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: violet gobi and do you name your fish?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14479	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: violet gobi and do you name your fish?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14480	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: salt question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14481	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: my catfish ate my snails!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14482	From: Tom Ray	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: salt question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14483	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14484	From: Leslie	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: AquaTank Filtration Question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14485	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: AquaTank Filtration Question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14486	From: Leslie	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: AquaTank Filtration Question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14487	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: The San Diego Tropical Fish Society , 8/14/2005, 7:00 pm
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14488	From: Chris	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: AquaTank Filtration Question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14489	From: Chris	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: AquaTank Filtration Question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14490	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: AquaTank Filtration Question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14491	From: Chris	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: african cichlids in a planted tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14492	From: Leslie	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: AquaTank Filtration Question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14493	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: african cichlids in a planted tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14494	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: salt question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14495	From: Chris	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: humane killing of Gambusia
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14496	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: humane killing of Gambusia
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14497	From: fuzzybpebble	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: ADDED NEW FISH
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14498	From: bucks_boogie@webtv.net	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: Phosphates
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14499	From: bucks_boogie@webtv.net	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: catfish and funky fuzz
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14500	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: ADDED NEW FISH
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14501	From: Chris	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: ADDED NEW FISH
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14502	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 8/12/2005
Subject: Re: violet gobi and do you name your fish? (now - Do you name your
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14503	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 8/12/2005
Subject: Re: my catfish ate my snails!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14504	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/12/2005
Subject: Re: humane killing of Gambusia
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14505	From: Aaron M.	Date: 8/12/2005
Subject: Re: SAE's
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14506	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/12/2005
Subject: Re: salt question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14507	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/12/2005
Subject: Re: ADDED NEW FISH
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14508	From: Andrea	Date: 8/12/2005
Subject: Re: violet gobi and do you name your fish?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14509	From: Chris	Date: 8/12/2005
Subject: Re: humane killing of Gambusia
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14510	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/12/2005
Subject: Re: ADDED NEW FISH
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14511	From: Leslie	Date: 8/12/2005
Subject: Used Eclipse Tank w/ small cracks
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14512	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/12/2005
Subject: Re: ADDED NEW FISH
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14513	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 8/12/2005
Subject: Re: Used Eclipse Tank w/ small cracks
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14514	From: Leslie	Date: 8/12/2005
Subject: Re: Used Eclipse Tank w/ small cracks
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14515	From: fuzzybpebble	Date: 8/12/2005
Subject: Algae question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14516	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/13/2005
Subject: Re: Algae question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14517	From: Da lardboy	Date: 8/13/2005
Subject: Re: Used Eclipse Tank w/ small cracks
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14518	From: Da lardboy	Date: 8/13/2005
Subject: Re: Algae question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14519	From: Da lardboy	Date: 8/13/2005
Subject: Hello Group!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14520	From: Sandy Kay	Date: 8/13/2005
Subject: salt
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14521	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 8/13/2005
Subject: Re: Hello Group!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14522	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 8/13/2005
Subject: Re: Used Eclipse Tank w/ small cracks
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14523	From: Leslie	Date: 8/13/2005
Subject: Re: Used Eclipse Tank w/ small cracks
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14524	From: Tom Ray	Date: 8/13/2005
Subject: PraxiPro+other meds: I've got questions. Hope you've got answer to
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14525	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 8/13/2005
Subject: Steve's Nitrate Post (long)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14526	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 8/13/2005
Subject: Re: But...but...what happened?!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14527	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/13/2005
Subject: Re: But...but...what happened?!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14528	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 8/13/2005
Subject: Re: But...but...what happened?!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14529	From: harry perry	Date: 8/13/2005
Subject: Re: But...but...what happened?!/Where is his girlfriend????
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14530	From: Peter McKane	Date: 8/13/2005
Subject: Re: Hello Group!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14531	From: Peter McKane	Date: 8/13/2005
Subject: Re: Steve's Nitrate Post (long)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14532	From: Peter McKane	Date: 8/13/2005
Subject: Re: PraxiPro+other meds: I've got questions. Hope you've got answe
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14533	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/13/2005
Subject: Re: But...but...what happened?!/Where is his girlfriend????
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14534	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/13/2005
Subject: Lionel Dimitri's $4,900 aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14535	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/13/2005
Subject: Re: But...but...what happened?!/Where is his girlfriend????
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14536	From: Nan	Date: 8/13/2005
Subject: Re: Lionel Dimitri's $4,900 aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14537	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 8/14/2005
Subject: Re: Used Eclipse Tank w/ small cracks
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14538	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/14/2005
Subject: Re: Lionel Dimitri's $4,900 aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14539	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/14/2005
Subject: Re: Lionel Dimitri's $4,900 aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14540	From: Leslie	Date: 8/14/2005
Subject: fuzz spots in tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14541	From: Nan	Date: 8/14/2005
Subject: Re: fuzz spots in tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14542	From: Peter McKane	Date: 8/14/2005
Subject: Re: fuzz spots in tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14543	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/14/2005
Subject: California Betta Society (CBS), 8/27/2005, 2:00 pm
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14544	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 8/14/2005
Subject: Re: Lionel Dimitri's $4,900 aquarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14545	From: deborahgd14	Date: 8/14/2005
Subject: Angie the Angel fish - to Ray
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14546	From: Leslie	Date: 8/14/2005
Subject: Adding a filter
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14547	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 8/14/2005
Subject: Re: Phosphates
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14548	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 8/14/2005
Subject: Good water quality or lack there off??
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14549	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: Re: Angie the Angel fish - to Ray
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14550	From: deborahgd14	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: Re: Angie the Angel fish - to Ray
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14551	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: Re: Adding a filter
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14552	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: Re: Good water quality or lack there off??
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14553	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: Re: Angie the Angel fish - to Ray
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14554	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: Re: Angie the Angel fish - to Deborah
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14555	From: kb1dva	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: Help!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14556	From: mlvdw@aol.com	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: Re: Help!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14557	From: bucks_boogie@webtv.net	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: Re: Phosphate sponge
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14558	From: mlvdw@aol.com	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: Re: Help!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14559	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: Re: Help!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14560	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: fish eating algae
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14561	From: Leslie	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: Adding some cichlids
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14562	From: mike mather	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: Re: fish eating algae
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14563	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14564	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: Re: Adding some cichlids
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14565	From: Leslie	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: Re: Adding some cichlids
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14566	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: giant danio with pop eyed
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14567	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: FISH EATING ALGAE
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14568	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14569	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: Re: Adding some cichlids
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14570	From: Leslie	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: Re: giant danio with pop eyed
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14571	From: Leslie	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: Re: Adding some cichlids
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14572	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: New Angelfish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14573	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: Adding some cichlids
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14574	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: Adding some cichlids
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14575	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: New Angelfish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14576	From: Robert Hickey	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: New Angelfish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14577	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: giant danio with pop eyed
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14578	From: kb1dva	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: help
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14579	From: Robert Hickey	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14580	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: New Angelfish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14581	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14582	From: Robert Hickey	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14583	From: Leslie	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: Adding some cichlids
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14584	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14585	From: Robert Hickey	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14586	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: Adding some cichlids
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14587	From: Robert Hickey	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: Adding some cichlids
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14588	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14589	From: Robert Hickey	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14590	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: adding more tanks
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14591	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14592	From: Robert Hickey	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14593	From: Eric Miner	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: The war on hair algae
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14594	From: rojeriko	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: The war on hair algae
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14595	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14596	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: The war on hair algae
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14597	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14598	From: Leslie	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Putting a fish down
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14599	From: John Gonzalez	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: Putting a fish down
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14600	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: Putting a fish down
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14601	From: Leslie	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: Putting a fish down
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14602	From: Leslie	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: Putting a fish down
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14603	From: richard thompson	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: Putting a fish down
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14604	From: richard thompson	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: Good water quality or lack there off??
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14605	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14606	From: richard thompson	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: AquaTank Filtration Question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14607	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14608	From: KttmfC	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: DISCUS HELP!!!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14609	From: Robert	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: Putting a fish down
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14610	From: Leslie	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: Putting a fish down
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14611	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: Putting a fish down
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14612	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: Putting a fish down
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14613	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: Putting a fish down
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14614	From: wendie	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: Putting a fish down
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14615	From: Leslie	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Electrocution of fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14616	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: sponge filters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14617	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: sponge filters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14618	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: sponge filters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14619	From: Chris	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14620	From: Chris	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: Putting a fish down
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14621	From: Chris	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: sponge filters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14622	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: sponge filters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14623	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: do you name your fish?/Horace
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14624	From: Chris	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: sponge filters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14625	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: sponge filters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14626	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: sponge filters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14627	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus (now Bathroom aquariums)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14628	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: sponge filters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14629	From: Robert Hickey	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14630	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: sponge filters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14631	From: Robert Hickey	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14632	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus (now Bathroom aquariums)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14633	From: Robert Hickey	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus (now Bathroom aquariums)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14634	From: Leslie	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus (now Bathroom aquariums)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14635	From: Chris	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus (now Bathroom aquariums)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14636	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus (now Bathroom aquariums)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14637	From: Karen	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: SEEK: Rena XP1-2 or 3 Canister Filter for Parts
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14638	From: Leslie	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Internal parasites
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14639	From: Rob	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus (now Bathroom aquariums)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14640	From: Tom Ray	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: AH Supply Lighting Questions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14641	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: do you name your fish?/Horace
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14642	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus >question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14643	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus >question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14644	From: joequality1980	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: do you name your fish?/Horace
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14645	From: joequality1980	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: AH Supply Lighting Questions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14646	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Bacteria question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14647	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: Putting a fish down
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14648	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: Internal parasites
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14649	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: salt question/cory cats
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14650	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: my catfish ate my snails!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14651	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: Angie the Angel fish - to Ray
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14652	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: salt question/cory cats
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14653	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus (now Bathroom aquariums)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14654	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: do you name your fish?/Horace
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14655	From: TankGurl	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: Electrocution of fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14656	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: Electrocution of fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14657	From: Erin Cunningham	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Newbie w/question(s). TIA
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14658	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: Newbie w/question(s). TIA
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14659	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: Newbie w/question(s). TIA
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14660	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: New Angelfish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14661	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: Bacteria question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14662	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: SEEK: Rena XP1-2 or 3 Canister Filter for Parts
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14663	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: Bacteria question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14664	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus >question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14665	From: Chris	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: Electrocution of fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14666	From: Chris	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: Newbie w/question(s). TIA
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14667	From: Chris	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: Newbie w/question(s). TIA
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14668	From: Rick Clark	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: neon tetra
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14669	From: Rachel	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: neon tetra
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14670	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: neon tetra
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14671	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus >question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14672	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: neon tetra
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14673	From: deborahgd14	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: Angie the Angel fish - to Ray
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14674	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: New Angelfish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14675	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: Bacteria question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14676	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: Angie the Angel fish - to Ray
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14677	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: Electrocution of fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14678	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: Electrocution of fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14679	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: Electrocution of fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14680	From: Erin Cunningham	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: Newbie w/question(s)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14681	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: Newbie w/question(s). TIA
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14682	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus >question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14683	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus >question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14684	From: Rick Clark	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: neon tetra
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14685	From: dreammaker2623	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: Electrocution of fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14686	From: Trevor	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: SEEK: Rena XP1-2 or 3 Canister Filter for Parts
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14687	From: Tom Ray	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: AH Supply Lighting Questions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14688	From: joequality1980	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: do you name your fish?/Horace
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14689	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: New file uploaded to AquaticLife
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14690	From: Phil	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Oscar eggs!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14691	From: deborahgd14	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Update on Angie
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14692	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14693	From: Leslie	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: Electrocution of fish/Nim
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14694	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: Update on Angie
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14695	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: Oscar eggs!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14696	From: Karen	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: SEEK: Rena XP1-2 or 3 Canister Filter for Parts
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14697	From: aclaar877	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Discus, ich, and high temps
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14698	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: Electrocution of fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14699	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: Newbie w/question(s) - ANSWERS for ERIN
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14700	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14701	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: Discus, ich, and high temps
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14702	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: von rio tetra
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14703	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: von rio tetra
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14704	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: von rio tetra
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14705	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: von rio tetra
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14706	From: Erin Cunningham	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: What have I done !?????????
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14707	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: What have I done !?????????
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14708	From: Erin Cunningham	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: What have I done !?????????
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14709	From: Chris	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Newbie w/question(s). TIA
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14710	From: Chris	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Gambusia day
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14711	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: von rio tetra
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14712	From: Chris	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Gambusia day
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14713	From: Chris	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: What have I done !?????????
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14714	From: minnesotagal866	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Stress Coat
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14715	From: wendie	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Stress Coat
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14716	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Gambusia day
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14717	From: aclaar877	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Discus, ich, and high temps
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14718	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Clown Loaches
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14719	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Stress Coat
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14720	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: What have I done !?????????
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14721	From: wendie	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Stress Coat
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14722	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: What have I done !????????
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14723	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Gambusia day
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14724	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Gambusia day
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14725	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: von rio tetra
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14726	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Discus, ich, and high temps
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14727	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Clown Loaches
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14728	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Stress Coat
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14729	From: Leslie	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Maracyn cloudy water?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14730	From: wendie	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Stress Coat
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14731	From: Leslie	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Maracyn cloudy water?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14732	From: Phil	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Oscar eggs!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14733	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Stress Coat
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14734	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Stress Coat
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14735	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Gambusia day
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14736	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Stress Coat
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14737	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: What have I done !?????????
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14738	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Discus, ich, and high temps/ to AC
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14739	From: Chris	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Gambusia day
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14740	From: Chris	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Gambusia day
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14741	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Gambusia day
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14742	From: Bruce Hansen	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Gambusia day
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14743	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Clown Loaches
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14744	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Re: Gambusia day (now Fishnet.com link)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14745	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Re: Discus, ich, and high temps/ to AC
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14746	From: minnesotagal866	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Re: Stress Coat
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14747	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Re: Stress Coat
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14748	From: wendie	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Re: Stress Coat
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14749	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Re: Stress Coat
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14750	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Re: Discus, ich, and high temps/ to AC
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14751	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: alagebra drop out question- lighting
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14752	From: wendie	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Re: Stress Coat
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14753	From: deborahgd14	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Re: Update on Angie
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14754	From: richard thompson	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Re: Stress Coat
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14755	From: richard thompson	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Re: Stress Coat
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14756	From: wendie	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Re: Stress Coat
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14757	From: richard thompson	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Re: Newbie w/question(s)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14758	From: ahorseofcourse66	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Sick anglefish HELP?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14759	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Re: Sick anglefish HELP?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14760	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Quarantine
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14761	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Re: Quarantine
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14762	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Re: Quarantine
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14763	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Re: Stress Coat
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14764	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Silicon Valley Aquarium Society (SVAS) Monthly Meeting, 9/3/2005, 6
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14765	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Re: Quarantine
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14766	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: San Francisco Aquarium Society (SFAS), 9/2/2005, 7:15 pm
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14767	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Re: What have I done !?????????
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14768	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Re: What have I done !?????????
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14769	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: Stress Coat
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14770	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: Discus, ich, and high temps/ to AC
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14771	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: What have I done !?????????
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14772	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: What have I done !?????????
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14773	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: What have I done !?????????
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14774	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14775	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: changing water parameters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14776	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: Discus, ich, and high temps/ to AC
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14777	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: What have I done !?????????
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14778	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: What have I done !?????????
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14779	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: What have I done !?????????
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14780	From: bristolia	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Questions About Fauna of Lake Titicaca
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14781	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: changing water parameters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14782	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: Discus, ich, and high temps/ to AC
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14783	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: How many angelfishes in a tank?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14784	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: Quarantine
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14785	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: How many angelfishes in a tank?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14786	From: jim	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14787	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14788	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: Newbie w/question(s). TIA
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14789	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: changing water parameters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14790	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: Questions About Fauna of Lake Titicaca
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14791	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: Discus, ich, and high temps/ to AC - Correction
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14792	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: What have I done !?????????
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14793	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: Clown Loaches
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14794	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: Gambusia day
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14795	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: Discus, ich, and high temps/ to AC
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14796	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: Discus, ich, and high temps/ to AC
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14797	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: Discus, ich, and high temps/ to AC
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14798	From: Chris	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: What have I done !?????????
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14799	From: Chris	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: What have I done !?????????
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14800	From: Chris	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: Gambusia day
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14801	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Nitrite/nitrate in tap water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14802	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: my catfish ate my snails!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14803	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: do you name your fish?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14804	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: do you name your fish?/measurements?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14805	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: salt question/cory cats
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14806	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: favorite fish died unexpectedly
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14807	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: do you name your fish?/measurements?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14808	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: favorite fish died unexpectedly
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14809	From: Andrea	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: do you name your fish?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14810	From: Andrea	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Sick Cherry Barb
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14811	From: Erin Cunningham	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: What have I done????? - update from me!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14812	From: Erin Cunningham	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: What have I done????? - update from me!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14813	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: favorite fish died unexpectedly
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14814	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: do you name your fish?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14815	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: What fish is...
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14816	From: Jonathan Hartsoe	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: Digest Number 946
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14817	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: Discus, ich, and high temps/ to AC - Correction
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14818	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: What fish is...
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14819	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: Discus, ich, and high temps/ to AC
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14820	From: raleighaquariumsociety	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Raleigh Aquarium Society
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14821	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: What have I done????? - update from me!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14822	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: favorite fish died unexpectedly
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14823	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: my catfish ate my snails!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14824	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: What fish is...
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14825	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: favorite fish died unexpectedly
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14826	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: favorite fish died unexpectedly
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14827	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14828	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: What fish is...
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14829	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: What fish is...
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14830	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: What fish is...
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14831	From: camdogkingsfan	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Albino catfish babies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14832	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: What fish is...
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14833	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: What fish is...
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14834	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: favorite fish died unexpectedly
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14835	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: favorite fish died unexpectedly
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14836	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: favorite fish died unexpectedly
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14837	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: favorite fish died unexpectedly
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14838	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: favorite fish died unexpectedly
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14839	From: Aaron	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: Bathroom aquariums -> Aquariass - Aquarium toilet
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14840	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: my catfish ate my snails!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14841	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14842	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: my catfish ate my snails!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14843	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: favorite fish died unexpectedly
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14844	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: What have I done !?????????
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14845	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: Gambusia day
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14846	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrite/nitrate in tap water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14847	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrite/nitrate in tap water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14848	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: do you name your fish?/measurements?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14849	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: comets harrassing oranda? Help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14850	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: do you name your fish?/measurements?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14851	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: comets harrassing oranda? Help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14852	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: favorite fish died unexpectedly
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14853	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: do you name your fish?/measurements?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14854	From: Chris	Date: 8/23/2005
Subject: Re: What have I done????? - update from me!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14855	From: muskie4817	Date: 8/23/2005
Subject: At a loss
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14856	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/23/2005
Subject: Re: At a loss
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14857	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/23/2005
Subject: Re: Bathroom aquariums -> Aquariass - Aquarium toilet
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14858	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 8/23/2005
Subject: Re: At a loss
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14859	From: Chris	Date: 8/23/2005
Subject: very little fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14860	From: Amalthea	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Interesting video
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14861	From: muskie4817	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: At a loss
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14862	From: Nicolas J. Munro	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Bettas got babies!!! woppie!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14863	From: T	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: Bettas got babies!!! woppie!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14864	From: Nicolas J. Munro	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: Bettas got babies!!! woppie!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14865	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: At a loss
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14866	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: At a loss
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14867	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: At a loss
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14868	From: deborahgd14	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Update on Angie - Ray
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14869	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: At a loss
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14870	From: Rob	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Fish Farms -Orlando area
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14871	From: EDITHAN1@AOL.COM	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Fwd: help w/ dimensions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14872	From: EDITHAN1@AOL.COM	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: help w/ dimensions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14873	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: very little fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14874	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: Interesting video
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14875	From: Robert	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: Interesting video
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14876	From: muskie4817	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: At a loss
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14877	From: John	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: Interesting video ( Very Cruel!!!!)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14878	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: help w/dimensions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14879	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: Interesting Video (Now - STUPID FRIGGING IDIOTIC WEBSITE RECOMM
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14880	From: EDITHAN1@AOL.COM	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: Interesting video
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14881	From: Justin M.	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: Interesting video
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14882	From: EDITHAN1@AOL.COM	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: Interesting video
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14883	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: help w/dimensions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14884	From: Amalthea	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: Interesting video
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14885	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: Interesting video
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14886	From: clarkmariposo25@aol.com	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: Fish Farms -Orlando area
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14887	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: At a loss
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14888	From: Chris	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: African cichlids (was Re: help w/ dimensions)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14889	From: jerry young	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Filter Media
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14890	From: EDITHAN1@AOL.COM	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: African cichlids (was Re: help w/ dimensions)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14891	From: Chris	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: African cichlids (was Re: help w/ dimensions)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14892	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: African cichlids (was Re: help w/ dimensions)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14893	From: Chris	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: African cichlids (was Re: help w/ dimensions)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14894	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: Interesting video
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14895	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: African cichlids (was Re: help w/ dimensions)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14896	From: Evita	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: Interesting video
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14897	From: KttmfC	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Fresh water purple algea??
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14898	From: Chris	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: Fresh water purple algea??
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14899	From: harry perry	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: Filter Media/Peat
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14900	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: Discus, ich, and high temps/ to AC
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14901	From: EDITHAN1@AOL.COM	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: Interesting video
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14902	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Mississippi Cory cat keepers?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14903	From: EDITHAN1@AOL.COM	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: African cichlids (was Re: help w/ dimensions)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14904	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: Fresh water purple algea??
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14905	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Eco complete
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14906	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: Eco complete
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14907	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14908	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: California Betta Society (CBS), 8/27/2005, 2:00 pm
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14909	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: Eco complete
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14910	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: Interesting video
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14911	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: Eco complete
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14912	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14913	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: They love the net 0_o
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14914	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: Mississippi Cory cat keepers?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14915	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: Eco complete
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14916	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: Discus, ich, and high temps/ to AC
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14917	From: Evita	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: Interesting video
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14918	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: Fish Farms -Orlando area
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14919	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: Filter Media
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14920	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: Fish Farms -Orlando area
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14921	From: Salmarcus@aol.com	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Phosphates
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14922	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: Fish Farms -Orlando area
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14923	From: Chris	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: African cichlids (was Re: help w/ dimensions)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14924	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: African cichlids (was Re: help w/ dimensions)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14925	From: Chris	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: Filter Media
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14926	From: Leslie	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Danios/septisemia
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14927	From: Amalthea	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: Interesting video
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14928	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: Mississippi Cory cat keepers?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14929	From: richard thompson	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: Phosphates
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14930	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: Filter Media
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14931	From: Evita	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: Interesting video
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14932	From: Andrea	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: They love the net 0_o
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14933	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: interesting video - NOT!!!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14934	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: Danios/septisemia
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14935	From: Patrick, the AmericanFishGuy	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: Interesting video
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14936	From: Patrick	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: Interesting video
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14937	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: interesting video - NOT!!!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14938	From: harry perry	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Video thread/ A shot accross the bow.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14939	From: Amalthea	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: Interesting video
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14940	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: OFF TOPIC-was interesting video - NOT!!!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14941	From: aclaar877	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: Discus, ich, and high temps/ to AC
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14942	From: paul helms	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: Interesting video
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14943	From: paul helms	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: interesting video - NOT!!!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14944	From: Fonchy	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: interesting video - NOT!!!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14945	From: rca2745@aol.com	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: OFF TOPIC-was interesting video - NOT!!!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14946	From: rca2745@aol.com	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: OFF TOPIC-was interesting video - NOT!!!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14947	From: Patrick	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: video -> how about a fish suggestion?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14948	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: They love the net 0_o
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14949	From: Fonchy	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: video -> how about a fish suggestion?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14950	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: video -> how about a fish suggestion?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14951	From: EDITHAN1@AOL.COM	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: video -> how about a fish suggestion?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14952	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: DragonFish aka Violet Goby
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14953	From: Aaron M.	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: "Off Topic" Posts
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14954	From: Amalthea	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: interesting video - NOT!!!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14955	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Cloudy water in new tank/no fish.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14956	From: Aaron	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14957	From: Patrick	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: "Off Topic" Posts
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14958	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14959	From: mike mather	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: Eco complete
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14960	From: Aaron	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: algae chompers (wa - Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14961	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: Eco complete
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14962	From: Donna Ransome	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: Interesting video
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14963	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: algae chompers (wa - Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14964	From: Fonchy	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: Cloudy water in new tank/no fish.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14965	From: Fonchy	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: algae chompers (wa - Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14966	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: Filter Media
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14967	From: Fonchy	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: video -> how about a fish suggestion?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14968	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: Phosphates
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14969	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14970	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: DragonFish aka Violet Goby
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14971	From: Jerry Young	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14972	From: Tom Ray	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Vaillant (or Samurai) Chocolate Gourami {S. vaillanti} In San Loren
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14973	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14974	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: Re: Filter Media
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14975	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14976	From: paul helms	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: Re: Interesting video
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14977	From: paul helms	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: Re: Cloudy water in new tank/no fish.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14978	From: harry perry	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: To Paul
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14979	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: Re: Cloudy water in new tank/no fish.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14980	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: Re: DragonFish aka Violet Goby
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14981	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14982	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14983	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14984	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14985	From: bucks_boogie@webtv.net	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: Re: Blue and Gold Rams
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14986	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: Re: Blue and Gold Ramsand new additions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14987	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: Re: Vaillant (or Samurai) Chocolate Gourami {S. vaillanti} In San L
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14988	From: paul helms	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14989	From: paul helms	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: Re: To Paul
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14990	From: Tom Ray	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14991	From: Andrea	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: Re: They love the net 0_o
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14992	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: Pacific Coast Cichlid Association (PCCA), 9/10/2005, 6:45 pm
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14993	From: Aaron	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14994	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14995	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14996	From: Tom Ray	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: Re: Vaillant (or Samurai) Chocolate Gourami {S. vaillanti} In San L
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14997	From: paul helms	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14998	From: paul helms	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14999	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15000	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15001	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Discus, ich, and high temps/ to AC
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15002	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Reading
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15003	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Magazine Articles
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15004	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Two filters for a 55 gallon tank?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15005	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: How much light should an Angelfish tank get?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15006	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Two filters for a 55 gallon tank?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15007	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15008	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: How much light should an Angelfish tank get?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15009	From: Patrick	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15010	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Reading
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15011	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Two filters for a 55 gallon tank?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15012	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Two filters for a 55 gallon tank?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15013	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Floating THERMOMETERS
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15014	From: Fonchy	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Two filters for a 55 gallon tank?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15015	From: Fonchy	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Floating THERMOMETERS
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15016	From: Fonchy	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Two filters for a 55 gallon tank?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15017	From: Fonchy	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: any one with saltwater tanks
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15018	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Floating THERMOMETERS
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15019	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: How much light should an Angelfish tank get?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15020	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Two filters for a 55 gallon tank?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15021	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Two filters for a 55 gallon tank?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15022	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: How much light should an Angelfish tank get?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15023	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15024	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: any one with saltwater tanks
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15025	From: muskie4817	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Ebo-Jager Heater
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15026	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Ebo-Jager Heater
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15027	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: The San Diego Tropical Fish Society , 9/11/2005, 7:00 pm
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15028	From: Chris	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: video -> how about a fish suggestion?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15029	From: paul helms	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15030	From: paul helms	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15031	From: paul helms	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: any one with saltwater tanks
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15032	From: paul helms	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15033	From: Chris	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: algae chompers (wa - Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15034	From: Chris	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: algae chompers (wa - Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15035	From: Chris	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Blue and Gold Ramsand new additions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15036	From: Chris	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: Reading
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15037	From: Chris	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: Magazine Articles
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15038	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: Two filters for a 55 gallon tank?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15039	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: Two filters for a 55 gallon tank?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15040	From: paul helms	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: Reading
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15041	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15042	From: wizzbaf	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Filter Question (Cross Post)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15043	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15044	From: Chris	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: Filter Question (Cross Post)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15045	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: Filter Question (Cross Post)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15046	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: algae chompers (wa - Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15047	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15048	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: eggs in my tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15049	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: any one with saltwater tanks
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15050	From: Justin M.	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: tank dividers for betta splendens
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15051	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: eggs in my tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15052	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: tank dividers for betta splendens
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15053	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: tank dividers for betta splendens
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15054	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15055	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: eggs in my tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15056	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: link to eggs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15057	From: Leslie	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Plastic Plants w/ red spots
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15058	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15059	From: Chris	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: algae chompers (wa - Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15060	From: Chris	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: eggs in my tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15061	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: eggs in my tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15062	From: Chris	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: Plastic Plants w/ red spots
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15063	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: aponogeton crispus
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15064	From: Chris	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: eggs in my tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15065	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: eggs in my tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15066	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: algae chompers (wa - Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15067	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: link to eggs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15068	From: Chris	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: freshwater shrimp as cleaners - was: algae chompers
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15069	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: tank dividers for betta splendens
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15070	From: Chris	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: mixed fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15071	From: Dom	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: aponogeton crispus
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15072	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: eggs in my tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15073	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: Plastic Plants w/ red spots
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15074	From: Fonchy	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: macro for trade
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15075	From: paul helms	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: macro for trade
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15076	From: Fonchy	Date: 8/30/2005
Subject: Re: macro for trade
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15077	From: DB1RDMAN@WMCONNECT.COM	Date: 8/30/2005
Subject: Digest Number 960 - TANK DIVIDER
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15078	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 8/30/2005
Subject: Re: Eco complete
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15079	From: Justin M.	Date: 8/30/2005
Subject: Re: Digest Number 960 - TANK DIVIDER
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15080	From: paul helms	Date: 8/30/2005
Subject: Re: macro for trade
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15081	From: mike mather	Date: 8/30/2005
Subject: Re: Eco complete
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15082	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/30/2005
Subject: algae chompers (wa - Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15083	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/30/2005
Subject: Re: aponogeton crispus
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15084	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/30/2005
Subject: San Francisco Aquarium Society (SFAS), 9/2/2005, 7:15 pm
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15085	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 8/30/2005
Subject: Re: San Francisco Aquarium Society (SFAS), 9/2/2005, 7:15 pm
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15086	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/30/2005
Subject: The Jersey Shore Aquarium Society (JSAS), 9/12/2005, 8:00 pm
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15087	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/30/2005
Subject: Re: algae chompers (wa - Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15088	From: Leslie	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: BP ate the shark
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15089	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: EGGS IN MY TANK
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15090	From: Leslie	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Danios back into tank?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15091	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Re: Danios back into tank?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15092	From: T	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Re: EGGS IN MY TANK
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15093	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Re: EGGS IN MY TANK
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15094	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Re: EGGS IN MY TANK
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15095	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Re: EGGS IN MY TANK
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15096	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Re: EGGS IN MY TANK
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15097	From: Chris	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Re: BP ate the shark
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15098	From: Leslie	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Re: BP ate the shark
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15099	From: Chris	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Re: Danios back into tank?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15100	From: Chris	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Re: BP ate the shark
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15101	From: Aaron M.	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15102	From: Aaron M.	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Re: link to eggs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15103	From: Aaron M.	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Candiru of the Amazon (was - [AquaticLife] Reading)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15104	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Silicon Valley Aquarium Society (SVAS) Monthly Meeting, 9/3/2005, 6
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15105	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Re: Candiru of the Amazon (was - [AquaticLife] Reading)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15106	From: Chris	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Re: Candiru of the Amazon (was - [AquaticLife] Reading)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15107	From: wendie	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Re: Candiru of the Amazon (was - [AquaticLife] Reading)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15108	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Re: Candiru of the Amazon (was - [AquaticLife] Reading)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15109	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Re: Candiru of the Amazon (was - [AquaticLife] Reading)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15110	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Re: Candiru of the Amazon (was - [AquaticLife] Reading)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15111	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Re: Candiru of the Amazon (was - [AquaticLife] Reading)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15112	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Re: Candiru of the Amazon (was - [AquaticLife] Reading)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15113	From: Chris	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Re: Candiru of the Amazon (was - [AquaticLife] Reading)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15114	From: Aaron M.	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: "Amazon Abyss" (was - Re: Candiru of the Amazon)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15115	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Re: BP ate the shark
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15116	From: Chris	Date: 9/1/2005
Subject: Re: BP ate the shark
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15117	From: Leslie	Date: 9/1/2005
Subject: Re: BP ate the shark
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15118	From: Leslie	Date: 9/1/2005
Subject: Re: BP ate the shark
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15119	From: kb1dva	Date: 9/1/2005
Subject: fish behaving badly
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15120	From: Fonchy	Date: 9/1/2005
Subject: Blue hippo with cloudy eye
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15121	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 9/1/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15122	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 9/1/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15123	From: Leslie	Date: 9/1/2005
Subject: Expecting a bacterial bloom
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15124	From: Chris	Date: 9/1/2005
Subject: Re: BP ate the shark
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15125	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 9/1/2005
Subject: Re: Expecting a bacterial bloom
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15126	From: Leslie	Date: 9/2/2005
Subject: Cherry barbs & female betta
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15127	From: rojeriko	Date: 9/2/2005
Subject: medicated food??
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15128	From: Amalthea	Date: 9/2/2005
Subject: Re: medicated food??
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15129	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 9/2/2005
Subject: Re: medicated food??
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15130	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 9/2/2005
Subject: Re: Cherry barbs & female betta
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15131	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 9/2/2005
Subject: Re: video -> how about a fish suggestion?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15132	From: Patrick	Date: 9/2/2005
Subject: Re: video -> how about a fish suggestion?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15133	From: Aaron	Date: 9/2/2005
Subject: Fish Tank Backsplash
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15134	From: Aaron	Date: 9/2/2005
Subject: Red-Tail Shark ate the Apple Snail
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15135	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 9/2/2005
Subject: Re: video -> how about a fish suggestion?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15136	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 9/2/2005
Subject: Re: Red-Tail Shark ate the Apple Snail
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15137	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 9/2/2005
Subject: pond plants
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15138	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 9/2/2005
Subject: Re: video -> how about a fish suggestion?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15139	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 9/2/2005
Subject: Re: video -> how about a fish suggestion?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15140	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 9/2/2005
Subject: Re: pond plants
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15141	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 9/2/2005
Subject: Re: video -> how about a fish suggestion?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15142	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 9/2/2005
Subject: Re: pond plants
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15143	From: clarkmariposo25@aol.com	Date: 9/2/2005
Subject: Re: Fish Tank Backsplash
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15144	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 9/3/2005
Subject: looking to buy fish/products on line?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15145	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 9/3/2005
Subject: OT: Katrina--Looking For and Safe Lists
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15146	From: Chris	Date: 9/3/2005
Subject: Re: fish behaving badly
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15147	From: Chris	Date: 9/3/2005
Subject: Re: Cherry barbs & female betta
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15148	From: Chris	Date: 9/3/2005
Subject: Re: video -> how about a fish suggestion?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15149	From: Chris	Date: 9/3/2005
Subject: Re: Red-Tail Shark ate the Apple Snail
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15150	From: Chris	Date: 9/3/2005
Subject: Re: Red-Tail Shark ate the Apple Snail
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15151	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 9/3/2005
Subject: Re: Red-Tail Shark ate the Apple Snail
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15152	From: Chris	Date: 9/3/2005
Subject: Re: eggs in my tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15153	From: Chris	Date: 9/3/2005
Subject: silver sharks
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15154	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 9/3/2005
Subject: Re: Red-Tail Shark ate the Apple Snail
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15155	From: kb1dva	Date: 9/3/2005
Subject: thanks
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15156	From: roughbuckincwgrl	Date: 9/3/2005
Subject: New with a question?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15157	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 9/3/2005
Subject: Re: New with a question?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15158	From: thesydmonster	Date: 9/3/2005
Subject: Hydra
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15159	From: Patrick	Date: 9/3/2005
Subject: Re: video -> how about a fish suggestion?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15160	From: Aaron	Date: 9/3/2005
Subject: Re: Red-Tail Shark ate the Apple Snail
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15161	From: Aaron	Date: 9/3/2005
Subject: Re: Red-Tail Shark ate the Apple Snail
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15162	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 9/3/2005
Subject: Re: eggs in my tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15165	From: dawnmvo	Date: 9/3/2005
Subject: Algae Eater
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15166	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: Algae Eater
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15167	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: Hydra
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15168	From: Fonchy	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Is this group for fresh water tanks???
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15169	From: Justin M.	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: Is this group for fresh water tanks???
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15170	From: Fonchy	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: Is this group for fresh water tanks???
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15171	From: Justin M.	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: Is this group for fresh water tanks???
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15172	From: wendie	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Safe Ick Medicine
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15173	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: Algae Eater
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15174	From: thesydmonster	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: Algae Eater
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15175	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: Algae Eater
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15176	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: Algae Eater
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15177	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: Algae Eater
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15178	From: Patrick	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: Safe Ick Medicine
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15179	From: paul helms	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: New with a question?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15180	From: paul helms	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: Blue hippo with cloudy eye
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15181	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: New with a question?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15182	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: No fish + not much light on = smelly water?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15183	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: swordtail fry
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15184	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: swordtail fry
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15185	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: swordtail fry
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15186	From: roughbuckincwgrl	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Pictus Catfish's Weird Behavior
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15187	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: Pictus Catfish's Weird Behavior
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15188	From: wendie	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: Safe Ick Medicine
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15189	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: Is this group for fresh water tanks???
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15190	From: Thomas Schlemmermeyer	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Guppies (Poecilia reticulata)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15191	From: Chris	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: plecs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15192	From: Chris	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: swordtail fry
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15193	From: Chris	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: Pictus Catfish's Weird Behavior
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15194	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: plecs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15195	From: Chris	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: plecs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15196	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: plecs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15197	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: swordtail fry
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15198	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: plecs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15199	From: Chris	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: Algae Eater
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15200	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: plecs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15201	From: Chris	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: plecs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15202	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: Algae Eater
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15203	From: dawnmvo	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: Algae Eater
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15204	From: muskie4817	Date: 9/5/2005
Subject: Any experience buying fish over the internet
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15205	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 9/5/2005
Subject: Re: Any experience buying fish over the internet
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15206	From: paul helms	Date: 9/5/2005
Subject: Re: Pictus Catfish's Weird Behavior
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15207	From: paul helms	Date: 9/5/2005
Subject: Re: No fish + not much light on = smelly water?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15208	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 9/5/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15209	From: DB1RDMAN@WMCONNECT.COM	Date: 9/5/2005
Subject: Digest Number 969 - BUYING FISH ON THE `NET
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15210	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 9/5/2005
Subject: Re: No fish + not much light on = smelly water?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15211	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 9/5/2005
Subject: Re: Algae Eater
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15212	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 9/5/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15213	From: Jasmine	Date: 9/5/2005
Subject: Live plants?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15214	From: Justin M.	Date: 9/5/2005
Subject: Re: Live plants?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15215	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 9/5/2005
Subject: Re: Live plants?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15216	From: discusfishies	Date: 9/5/2005
Subject: Re: Any experience buying fish over the internet
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15217	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 9/5/2005
Subject: Re: Any experience buying fish over the internet
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15218	From: discusfishies	Date: 9/5/2005
Subject: Re: Any experience buying fish over the internet
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15219	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 9/5/2005
Subject: Re: Live plants?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15220	From: Chris	Date: 9/6/2005
Subject: new photos
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15221	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 9/6/2005
Subject: Re: Any experience buying fish over the internet
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15222	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 9/6/2005
Subject: Re: Any experience buying fish over the internet
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15223	From: J G	Date: 9/6/2005
Subject: mixed community
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15224	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 9/6/2005
Subject: Re: mixed community
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15225	From: thesydmonster	Date: 9/6/2005
Subject: Re: mixed community
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15226	From: thesydmonster	Date: 9/6/2005
Subject: Re: Live plants?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15227	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 9/6/2005
Subject: light advice for deep planted tanks
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15228	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 9/6/2005
Subject: Re: light advice for deep planted tanks
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15229	From: Jasmine	Date: 9/6/2005
Subject: Algae overload...
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15230	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 9/6/2005
Subject: Re: Algae overload...
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15231	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 9/6/2005
Subject: Re: Live plants?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15232	From: KttmfC	Date: 9/6/2005
Subject: Knifefish Tankmates....
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15233	From: KttmfC	Date: 9/6/2005
Subject: Kribensis fry
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15234	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 9/7/2005
Subject: Re: Knifefish Tankmates....
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15235	From: jules27au	Date: 9/7/2005
Subject: Fish Filters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15236	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 9/7/2005
Subject: Re: light advice for deep planted tanks
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15237	From: Justin M.	Date: 9/7/2005
Subject: Re: Fish Filters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15238	From: mike mather	Date: 9/7/2005
Subject: Re: light advice for deep planted tanks
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15239	From: Chris	Date: 9/7/2005
Subject: Re: Fish Filters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15240	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 9/7/2005
Subject: Pacific Coast Cichlid Association (PCCA), 9/10/2005, 6:45 pm
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15241	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 9/7/2005
Subject: A miracle of timing.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15242	From: camdogkingsfan	Date: 9/7/2005
Subject: banjo catfish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15243	From: Chris	Date: 9/7/2005
Subject: Re: A miracle of timing.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15244	From: Chris	Date: 9/7/2005
Subject: Re: banjo catfish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15245	From: Andrea	Date: 9/8/2005
Subject: Re: mixed community
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15246	From: Patrick	Date: 9/8/2005
Subject: Re: Live plants?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15247	From: Leslie	Date: 9/8/2005
Subject: Red Giant Danions, still
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15248	From: Justin M.	Date: 9/8/2005
Subject: Re: Red Giant Danions, still
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15249	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 9/8/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15250	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 9/8/2005
Subject: Re: A miracle of timing.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15251	From: Patrick	Date: 9/8/2005
Subject: Re: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologis
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15252	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 9/8/2005
Subject: Re: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologis
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15253	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 9/8/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15254	From: Patrick	Date: 9/8/2005
Subject: Re: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologis
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15255	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 9/8/2005
Subject: Re: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biol...
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15256	From: Leslie	Date: 9/8/2005
Subject: BAD spots on fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15257	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 9/8/2005
Subject: The San Diego Tropical Fish Society , 9/11/2005, 7:00 pm
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15258	From: T	Date: 9/9/2005
Subject: NEED HELP
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15259	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 9/9/2005
Subject: Re: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologis
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15260	From: Leslie	Date: 9/9/2005
Subject: Permanent Pop-Eye
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15261	From: Chris	Date: 9/9/2005
Subject: Re: NEED HELP
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15262	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 9/9/2005
Subject: Re: NEED HELP
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15263	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 9/9/2005
Subject: Re: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologis
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15264	From: T	Date: 9/9/2005
Subject: Re: NEED HELP
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15265	From: Leslie	Date: 9/9/2005
Subject: Cichlid shop in Dallas
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15266	From: Leslie	Date: 9/9/2005
Subject: Metals in tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15267	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 9/9/2005
Subject: Re: Metals in tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15268	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 9/9/2005
Subject: Re: NEED HELP
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15269	From: Jasmine	Date: 9/9/2005
Subject: cichlid help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15270	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 9/9/2005
Subject: Re: cichlid help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15271	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 9/9/2005
Subject: Re: cichlid help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15272	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 9/9/2005
Subject: Re: NEED HELP
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15273	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 9/9/2005
Subject: Re: cichlid help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15274	From: Deirdre Marr	Date: 9/10/2005
Subject: UV Sterilizer Advice?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15275	From: paul helms	Date: 9/10/2005
Subject: Re: UV Sterilizer Advice?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15276	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 9/11/2005
Subject: Re: Knifefish Tankmates....
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15277	From: Jasmine	Date: 9/11/2005
Subject: Re: cichlid help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15278	From: Jasmine	Date: 9/11/2005
Subject: Re: cichlid help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15279	From: Jerry	Date: 9/11/2005
Subject: My Green Tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15280	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 9/11/2005
Subject: Re: My Green Tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15281	From: pam phetteplace	Date: 9/11/2005
Subject: Surprise.....Bristlenose plecos
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15282	From: pam phetteplace	Date: 9/11/2005
Subject: Surprise.....Bristlenose plecos
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15283	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 9/11/2005
Subject: Re: Surprise.....Bristlenose plecos
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15284	From: pamphetteplace	Date: 9/11/2005
Subject: Re: Surprise.....Bristlenose plecos
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15285	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 9/11/2005
Subject: Re: Surprise.....Bristlenose plecos
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15286	From: Chris	Date: 9/11/2005
Subject: Re: cichlid help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15287	From: Leslie	Date: 9/11/2005
Subject: spotting, diseased face
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15288	From: Chris	Date: 9/11/2005
Subject: Re: My Green Tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15289	From: Chris	Date: 9/11/2005
Subject: Re: spotting, diseased face
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15290	From: Leslie	Date: 9/11/2005
Subject: Re: spotting, diseased face
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15291	From: Chris	Date: 9/11/2005
Subject: Re: spotting, diseased face
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15292	From: Chris	Date: 9/11/2005
Subject: Re: spotting, diseased face
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15293	From: T	Date: 9/12/2005
Subject: "One" eyed CAtfish update
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15294	From: Leslie	Date: 9/12/2005
Subject: Vitamin enriched food
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15295	From: rojeriko	Date: 9/12/2005
Subject: Re: Vitamin enriched food
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15296	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 9/12/2005
Subject: Re: Vitamin enriched food
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15297	From: Jasmine	Date: 9/12/2005
Subject: Cichlid...I may have figured it out
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15298	From: Jasmine	Date: 9/12/2005
Subject: Re: cichlid help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15299	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 9/12/2005
Subject: Re: Cichlid...I may have figured it out
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15300	From: Karen	Date: 9/12/2005
Subject: Katrina: Help with Bettas rescued from N.O.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15301	From: T	Date: 9/12/2005
Subject: Re: Katrina: Help with Bettas rescued from N.O.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15302	From: Justin M.	Date: 9/12/2005
Subject: Re: Katrina: Help with Bettas rescued from N.O.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15303	From: Ben Noreau	Date: 9/12/2005
Subject: Katrina rescue
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15304	From: snailcrazymom	Date: 9/12/2005
Subject: Why do my fish tanks smell?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15305	From: Karen	Date: 9/12/2005
Subject: Re: Katrina: Help with Bettas rescued from N.O.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15306	From: Andreas	Date: 9/12/2005
Subject: Re: Why do my fish tanks smell?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15307	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 9/12/2005
Subject: Re: Surprise.....Bristlenose plecos
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15308	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 9/12/2005
Subject: Re: Katrina: Help with Bettas rescued from N.O.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15309	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 9/12/2005
Subject: Re: Why do my fish tanks smell?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15310	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 9/12/2005
Subject: Re: Katrina: Help with Bettas rescued from N.O.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15311	From: Snow	Date: 9/13/2005
Subject: Re: Katrina: Help with Bettas rescued from N.O.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15312	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 9/13/2005
Subject: Re: Katrina: Help with Bettas rescued from N.O.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15313	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 9/13/2005
Subject: Re: Why do my fish tanks smell?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15314	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 9/13/2005
Subject: Re: Katrina: Help with Bettas rescued from N.O.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15315	From: snailcrazymom	Date: 9/13/2005
Subject: Re: Why do my fish tanks smell?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15316	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 9/13/2005
Subject: Re: Katrina: Help with Bettas rescued from N.O.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15317	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 9/13/2005
Subject: Re: Katrina: Help with Bettas rescued from N.O.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15318	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 9/13/2005
Subject: Re: Katrina: Help with Bettas rescued from N.O.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15319	From: Patrick	Date: 9/13/2005
Subject: Re: Katrina: Help with Bettas rescued from N.O.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15320	From: llrdhsktr	Date: 9/14/2005
Subject: Converting established cold water tank to tropical
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15321	From: Chris	Date: 9/14/2005
Subject: Re: Converting established cold water tank to tropical
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15322	From: joequality1980	Date: 9/14/2005
Subject: African frogs--not for smaller/comunity tanks
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15323	From: Sue Boswell	Date: 9/14/2005
Subject: Re: Converting established cold water tank to tropical
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15324	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 9/14/2005
Subject: Re: African frogs--not for smaller/comunity tanks
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15325	From: llrdhsktr	Date: 9/14/2005
Subject: Re: Converting established cold water tank to tropical
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15326	From: joequality1980	Date: 9/14/2005
Subject: Re: African frogs--not for smaller/comunity tanks
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15327	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 9/14/2005
Subject: Re: African frogs--not for smaller/comunity tanks
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15328	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 9/14/2005
Subject: Re: Converting established cold water tank to tropical
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15329	From: Patrick	Date: 9/14/2005
Subject: Re: Converting established cold water tank to tropical
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15330	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 9/14/2005
Subject: Re: Converting established cold water tank to tropical
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15331	From: joequality1980	Date: 9/15/2005
Subject: Re: African frogs--not for smaller/comunity tanks
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15332	From: Jasmine	Date: 9/15/2005
Subject: Re: Cichlid...I may have figured it out
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15333	From: ahorseofcourse66	Date: 9/15/2005
Subject: HELP with clown knife!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15334	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 9/15/2005
Subject: Re: HELP with clown knife!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15335	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 9/16/2005
Subject: Re: Cichlid...I may have figured it out
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15336	From: T	Date: 9/16/2005
Subject: Really Stupid Question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15337	From: Justin M.	Date: 9/16/2005
Subject: Re: Really Stupid Question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15338	From: harry perry	Date: 9/16/2005
Subject: Re: Really Stupid Question/??????
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15339	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 9/16/2005
Subject: Re: Really Stupid Question/??????
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15340	From: Patrick	Date: 9/16/2005
Subject: Re: Really Stupid Question/??????
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15341	From: harry perry	Date: 9/16/2005
Subject: Re: Really Stupid Question/??????
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15342	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 9/16/2005
Subject: Air Stones to Harry & Paul
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15343	From: Patrick	Date: 9/16/2005
Subject: Re: Air Stones to Harry & Paul
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15344	From: Patrick	Date: 9/16/2005
Subject: Re: Air Stones to Norman
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15345	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 9/16/2005
Subject: Re: Air Stones to Norman
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15346	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 9/17/2005
Subject: Re: Really Stupid Question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15347	From: ranchugirl	Date: 9/17/2005
Subject: your local goldfish clubs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15348	From: paul helms	Date: 9/17/2005
Subject: Re: Air Stones to Harry & Paul
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15349	From: paul helms	Date: 9/17/2005
Subject: Re: Really Stupid Question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15350	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 9/17/2005
Subject: Re: Air Stones to Harry & Paul
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15351	From: Leslie	Date: 9/17/2005
Subject: Blood Parrot is VERY Pale, SICK!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15352	From: paul helms	Date: 9/18/2005
Subject: Re: Air Stones to Harry & Paul
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15353	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 9/18/2005
Subject: Re: Blood Parrot is VERY Pale, SICK!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15354	From: kb1dva	Date: 9/18/2005
Subject: Help- dead pike and questions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15355	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 9/18/2005
Subject: Re: Help- dead pike and questions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15356	From: Thomas Schlemmermeyer	Date: 9/18/2005
Subject: Livebearer question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15357	From: kb1dva	Date: 9/19/2005
Subject: Re: Help- dead pike and questions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15358	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 9/19/2005
Subject: Re: Help- dead pike and questions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15359	From: kb1dva	Date: 9/19/2005
Subject: Re: Help- dead pike and questions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15360	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 9/19/2005
Subject: Re: Help- dead pike and questions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15361	From: T	Date: 9/19/2005
Subject: AIRSTONE
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15362	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 9/19/2005
Subject: Re: Help- dead pike and questions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15363	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 9/19/2005
Subject: Re: AIRSTONE
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15364	From: hadesidhe	Date: 9/19/2005
Subject: Help! New Tank and Fish are Stressed
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15365	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 9/19/2005
Subject: help for fish with kinked spine--fish looks like a zig zag
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15366	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 9/19/2005
Subject: Re: help for fish with kinked spine--fish looks like a zig zag
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15367	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 9/20/2005
Subject: Re: help for fish with kinked spine--fish looks like a zig zag
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15368	From: Chris	Date: 9/20/2005
Subject: Re: Help! New Tank and Fish are Stressed
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15369	From: Chris	Date: 9/20/2005
Subject: Re: Help- dead pike and questions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15370	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 9/20/2005
Subject: Re: Help! New Tank and Fish are Stressed
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15371	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 9/20/2005
Subject: Re: help for fish with kinked spine--fish looks like a zig zag
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15372	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 9/20/2005
Subject: Re: help for fish with kinked spine--fish looks like a zig zag
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15373	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 9/20/2005
Subject: vitamin C/ help for fish with kinked spine--fish looks like a zig
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15374	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 9/20/2005
Subject: Re: Help- dead pike and questions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15375	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 9/20/2005
Subject: Re: help for fish with kinked spine--fish looks like a zig zag
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15376	From: Chris	Date: 9/20/2005
Subject: Re: Help! New Tank and Fish are Stressed
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15377	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 9/20/2005
Subject: cure for ick-fill in the blanks
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15378	From: ii_ming	Date: 9/21/2005
Subject: sick balloon molly
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15379	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 9/21/2005
Subject: Re: help for fish with kinked spine--fish looks like a zig zag
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15380	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 9/21/2005
Subject: Re: cure for ick-fill in the blanks
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15381	From: stuff4paws	Date: 9/21/2005
Subject: What is wrong with my bubble eye?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15382	From: stuff4paws	Date: 9/21/2005
Subject: Re: What is wrong with my bubble eye?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15383	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 9/21/2005
Subject: Re: help for fish with kinked spine--fish looks like a zig zag
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15384	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 9/21/2005
Subject: Re: help for fish with kinked spine--fish looks like a zig zag
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15385	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 9/21/2005
Subject: Re: help for fish with kinked spine--fish looks like a zig zag
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15386	From: snailcrazymom	Date: 9/21/2005
Subject: Worms
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15387	From: Leslie	Date: 9/21/2005
Subject: Re: What is wrong with my bubble eye?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15388	From: stuff4paws	Date: 9/21/2005
Subject: Re: What is wrong with my bubble eye?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15389	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 9/21/2005
Subject: Re: help for fish with kinked spine--fish looks like a zig zag
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15390	From: Leslie	Date: 9/22/2005
Subject: HITH?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15391	From: Barbara	Date: 9/22/2005
Subject: Re: HITH?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15392	From: Barbara	Date: 9/22/2005
Subject: Re: Worms
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15393	From: Leslie	Date: 9/22/2005
Subject: Re: HITH?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15394	From: Leslie	Date: 9/22/2005
Subject: HITH in the BP?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15395	From: Barbara	Date: 9/22/2005
Subject: Re: HITH?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15396	From: Barbara	Date: 9/22/2005
Subject: Re: HITH in the BP?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15397	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 9/23/2005
Subject: Water Changes and Cleaning Substrate - WAS: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: H
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15398	From: KttmfC	Date: 9/23/2005
Subject: Why are my fish dying?? HELP!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15399	From: Chris	Date: 9/23/2005
Subject: Re: Why are my fish dying?? HELP!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15400	From: harry perry	Date: 9/23/2005
Subject: Re: Why are my fish dying?? HELP!!!/To Kris
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15401	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 9/23/2005
Subject: Re: Water Changes and Cleaning Substrate - WAS: RE: [AquaticLife] R
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15402	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 9/23/2005
Subject: Re: Why are my fish dying?? HELP!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15403	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 9/24/2005
Subject: new betta
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15404	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 9/24/2005
Subject: Re: Water Changes and Cleaning Substrate - WAS: RE: [AquaticLife] R
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15405	From: Amanda	Date: 9/24/2005
Subject: What type of fish are these?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15406	From: Amanda	Date: 9/24/2005
Subject: Re: What type of fish are these?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15407	From: Patrick	Date: 9/24/2005
Subject: Re: Why are my fish dying?? HELP!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15408	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 9/24/2005
Subject: Re: Why are my fish dying?? HELP!!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15409	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 9/24/2005
Subject: Re: Water Changes and Cleaning Substrate - WAS: RE: [AquaticLife] R
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15410	From: Patrick	Date: 9/24/2005
Subject: Re: Water Changes and Cleaning Substrate - WAS: RE: [AquaticLife] R
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15411	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 9/24/2005
Subject: Re: Water Changes and Cleaning Substrate - WAS: RE: [AquaticLife] R
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15412	From: mike	Date: 9/25/2005
Subject: what is the best size tank to buy a 30 or 40gal
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15413	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 9/25/2005
Subject: Re: what is the best size tank to buy a 30 or 40gal
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15414	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 9/25/2005
Subject: Quarantine
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15415	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 9/25/2005
Subject: Re: Quarantine
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15416	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 9/25/2005
Subject: Re: Quarantine
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15417	From: Patrick	Date: 9/25/2005
Subject: Re: Quarantine
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15418	From: Chris	Date: 9/25/2005
Subject: new to group / photo trouble
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15419	From: Aaron	Date: 9/26/2005
Subject: Re: photo trouble
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15420	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 9/27/2005
Subject: Needle-Nosed Gar with hurt nose?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15421	From: Teresa	Date: 9/27/2005
Subject: Long post but PLEASE help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15422	From: Justin M.	Date: 9/27/2005
Subject: Re: Long post but PLEASE help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15423	From: Andreas	Date: 9/27/2005
Subject: Re: Needle-Nosed Gar with hurt nose?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15424	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 9/27/2005
Subject: I got a new fish!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15425	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 9/27/2005
Subject: Re: I got a new fish!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15426	From: Thomas Schlemmermeyer	Date: 9/27/2005
Subject: The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, wilderness tank ent
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15427	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 9/27/2005
Subject: Re: The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, wilderness tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15428	From: Patrick	Date: 9/27/2005
Subject: Re: The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, wilderness tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15429	From: Patrick	Date: 9/27/2005
Subject: Re: The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, wilderness tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15430	From: Sue Boswell	Date: 9/27/2005
Subject: Re: I got a new fish!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15431	From: Patrick, the AmericanFishGuy	Date: 9/28/2005
Subject: Re: how about a fish suggestion?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15432	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 9/28/2005
Subject: Re: The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, wilderness tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15433	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 9/28/2005
Subject: Deeper and deeper
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15434	From: wendie	Date: 9/28/2005
Subject: Re: Deeper and deeper
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15435	From: mike mather	Date: 9/28/2005
Subject: Re: The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, wilderness tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15436	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 9/28/2005
Subject: Re: The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, wilderness tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15437	From: Patrick	Date: 9/28/2005
Subject: Re: The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, wilderness tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15438	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 9/28/2005
Subject: Re: The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, wilderness tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15439	From: Patrick	Date: 9/28/2005
Subject: Re: The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, wilderness tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15440	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 9/28/2005
Subject: Re: The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, wilderness tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15441	From: Ted Angelo	Date: 9/29/2005
Subject: geophagus surinamensis
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15442	From: Ted Angelo	Date: 9/29/2005
Subject: geop
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15443	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 9/29/2005
Subject: Re: geophagus surinamensis
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15444	From: Sue Boswell	Date: 9/29/2005
Subject: Re: geophagus surinamensis
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15445	From: Chris	Date: 9/29/2005
Subject: help finding a hood?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15446	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 9/29/2005
Subject: disappearing fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15447	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 9/29/2005
Subject: Re: help finding a hood?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15448	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 9/29/2005
Subject: Re: disappearing fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15449	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 9/29/2005
Subject: Re: disappearing fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15450	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 9/29/2005
Subject: Re: help finding a hood?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15451	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 9/29/2005
Subject: Re: help finding a hood?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15452	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 9/29/2005
Subject: Re: help finding a hood?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15453	From: mike mather	Date: 9/29/2005
Subject: Re: The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, wilderness tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15454	From: Chris	Date: 9/29/2005
Subject: Re: The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, wilderness tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15455	From: Chris	Date: 9/29/2005
Subject: Re: I got a new fish!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15456	From: Chris	Date: 9/29/2005
Subject: Re: geophagus surinamensis
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15457	From: paul helms	Date: 9/29/2005
Subject: Re: I got a new fish!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15458	From: Christopher Mansfield	Date: 9/30/2005
Subject: Re: help finding a hood?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15459	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 9/30/2005
Subject: Re: help finding a hood?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15460	From: Christopher Mansfield	Date: 9/30/2005
Subject: Re: help finding a hood?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15461	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 9/30/2005
Subject: Re: help finding a hood?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15462	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 9/30/2005
Subject: Re: help finding a hood?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15463	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 9/30/2005
Subject: Re: help finding a hood?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15464	From: discusfishies	Date: 9/30/2005
Subject: Bear,DE fish tanks 4 sale
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15465	From: Christopher Mansfield	Date: 9/30/2005
Subject: Re: help finding a hood?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15466	From: Chalyn Thomas	Date: 9/30/2005
Subject: New Member
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15467	From: Deirdre Marr	Date: 9/30/2005
Subject: What To Feed Rope Fish?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15468	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 9/30/2005
Subject: Re: I got a new fish!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15469	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 9/30/2005
Subject: Re: What To Feed Rope Fish?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15470	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 9/30/2005
Subject: Re: What To Feed Rope Fish?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15471	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 9/30/2005
Subject: Re: I got a new fish!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15472	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 9/30/2005
Subject: Re: What To Feed Rope Fish?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15473	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 9/30/2005
Subject: Re: help finding a hood?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15474	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 9/30/2005
Subject: Re: What To Feed Rope Fish?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15475	From: Ann	Date: 10/1/2005
Subject: Re: What To Feed Rope Fish?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15476	From: paul helms	Date: 10/1/2005
Subject: Re: I got a new fish!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15477	From: paul helms	Date: 10/1/2005
Subject: Re: help finding a hood?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15478	From: hadesidhe	Date: 10/1/2005
Subject: Questions about Ich
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15479	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 10/1/2005
Subject: Re: Deeper and deeper
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15480	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 10/1/2005
Subject: Re: Questions about Ich
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15481	From: Patrick	Date: 10/1/2005
Subject: Re: Questions about Ich
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15482	From: KttmfC	Date: 10/1/2005
Subject: Shovelnose catfish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15483	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 10/2/2005
Subject: Re: Deeper and deeper
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15484	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 10/2/2005
Subject: Re: Shovelnose catfish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15485	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 10/2/2005
Subject: gone for a month
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15486	From: cynjul	Date: 10/2/2005
Subject: WAHH, I killed my pregnant Molly
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15487	From: cynjul	Date: 10/2/2005
Subject: there was an actual question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15488	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 10/2/2005
Subject: Re: gone for a month
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15489	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 10/2/2005
Subject: Re: there was an actual question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15490	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 10/2/2005
Subject: Re: Questions about Ich
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15491	From: cynjul	Date: 10/2/2005
Subject: Okay okay, some are moving
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15492	From: Fred and Cynthia	Date: 10/3/2005
Subject: Vicky - response
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15493	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 10/3/2005
Subject: Re: Vicky - response
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15494	From: fcouellet@sympatico.ca	Date: 10/3/2005
Subject: Re: Vicky - response
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15495	From: andrew davis	Date: 10/3/2005
Subject: Cabomba aquarium requirments
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15496	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 10/3/2005
Subject: Clamped fins
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15497	From: Fred and Cynthia	Date: 10/3/2005
Subject: Re: Clamped fins
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15498	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 10/3/2005
Subject: Re: Cabomba aquarium requirments
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15499	From: KttmfC	Date: 10/3/2005
Subject: Live rock and cichlids
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15500	From: bucks_boogie@webtv.net	Date: 10/4/2005
Subject: Re: Breeder contraptions, GGGGGrrrrrrrrrrrr
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15501	From: T	Date: 10/4/2005
Subject: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15502	From: Sue Boswell	Date: 10/4/2005
Subject: Re: Breeder contraptions, GGGGGrrrrrrrrrrrr
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15503	From: Sue Boswell	Date: 10/4/2005
Subject: Re: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15504	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 10/4/2005
Subject: Re: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15505	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 10/4/2005
Subject: Re: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15506	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 10/4/2005
Subject: Re: Breeder contraptions, GGGGGrrrrrrrrrrrr
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15507	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 10/4/2005
Subject: Re: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15508	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 10/4/2005
Subject: Re: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15509	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 10/4/2005
Subject: Re: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15510	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 10/4/2005
Subject: Bettas and PopEye
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15511	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 10/4/2005
Subject: Re: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15512	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 10/4/2005
Subject: Re: I got a new fish!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15513	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 10/4/2005
Subject: Re: I got a new fish!/feeding prong?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15514	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 10/4/2005
Subject: Re: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15515	From: Evita	Date: 10/4/2005
Subject: Re: Breeder contraptions, GGGGGrrrrrrrrrrrr
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15516	From: SuNnY	Date: 10/4/2005
Subject: Re: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15517	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 10/5/2005
Subject: Re: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15518	From: paul helms	Date: 10/5/2005
Subject: Re: Live rock and cichlids
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15519	From: paul helms	Date: 10/5/2005
Subject: Re: The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, wilderness tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15520	From: paul helms	Date: 10/5/2005
Subject: Re: The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, wilderness tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15521	From: Fred and Cynthia	Date: 10/5/2005
Subject: Re: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15522	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 10/5/2005
Subject: Re: The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, wilderness tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15523	From: dkforgey	Date: 10/5/2005
Subject: Phosphate levels
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15524	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 10/5/2005
Subject: Re: The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, wilderness tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15525	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 10/5/2005
Subject: Betta w/ Pop Eye has puss spot. ?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15526	From: Justin M.	Date: 10/5/2005
Subject: Re: The ecological, libertarian, civil disobedient, wilderness tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15527	From: deborahgd14	Date: 10/5/2005
Subject: Ick
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15528	From: KttmfC	Date: 10/5/2005
Subject: Rift parameters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15529	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 10/5/2005
Subject: Re: Phosphate levels
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15530	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 10/5/2005
Subject: Re: Live rock and cichlids PAUL!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15531	From: Fred and Cynthia	Date: 10/5/2005
Subject: Re: Ick
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15532	From: deborahgd14	Date: 10/6/2005
Subject: Re: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15533	From: Thomas Schlemmermeyer	Date: 10/6/2005
Subject: Re: The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, wilderness tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15534	From: Barbara	Date: 10/6/2005
Subject: Re: Ick
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15535	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 10/6/2005
Subject: Popeyed Bettas Parasitic Puss Spot
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15536	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 10/6/2005
Subject: Re: Popeyed Bettas Parasitic Puss Spot
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15537	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 10/6/2005
Subject: Re: Popeyed Bettas Parasitic Puss Spot
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15538	From: A J Myers	Date: 10/6/2005
Subject: Koi keeling over
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15539	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 10/6/2005
Subject: Goldfish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15540	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 10/6/2005
Subject: Re: Popeyed Bettas Parasitic Puss Spot
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15541	From: Barbara	Date: 10/6/2005
Subject: Re: Popeyed Bettas Parasitic Puss Spot
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15542	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 10/6/2005
Subject: Re: Goldfish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15543	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 10/6/2005
Subject: Re: Popeyed Bettas Parasitic Puss Spot
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15544	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 10/6/2005
Subject: Re: Popeyed Bettas Parasitic Puss Spot
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15545	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 10/6/2005
Subject: Re: Ick
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15546	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 10/6/2005
Subject: Re: Rift parameters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15547	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 10/6/2005
Subject: Re: Rift parameters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15548	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 10/6/2005
Subject: Re: Popeyed Bettas Parasitic Puss Spot
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15549	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 10/7/2005
Subject: Questions to ask a potential seller of fish?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15550	From: harry perry	Date: 10/7/2005
Subject: Re: Questions to ask a potential seller of fish?/ To Beth.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15551	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 10/7/2005
Subject: Re: Rift parameters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15552	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 10/7/2005
Subject: this is so cool does anyone have one
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15553	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 10/7/2005
Subject: Re: this is so cool does anyone have one
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15554	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 10/7/2005
Subject: Re: this is so cool does anyone have one
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15555	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 10/7/2005
Subject: Re: this is so cool does anyone have one
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15556	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 10/7/2005
Subject: Re: this is so cool does anyone have one
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15557	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 10/8/2005
Subject: Re: this is so cool does anyone have one
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15558	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 10/8/2005
Subject: Re: this is so cool does anyone have one
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15559	From: Evita	Date: 10/8/2005
Subject: Re: this is so cool does anyone have one
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15560	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 10/8/2005
Subject: Re: this is so cool does anyone have one
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15561	From: paul helms	Date: 10/8/2005
Subject: Re: Live rock and cichlids PAUL!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15562	From: paul helms	Date: 10/8/2005
Subject: Re: I got a new fish!/feeding prong?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15563	From: Donna Ransome	Date: 10/8/2005
Subject: Used Tank Advice
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15564	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 10/8/2005
Subject: Endangered Species Program, USF&W
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15565	From: Amalthea X	Date: 10/8/2005
Subject: Re: this is so cool does anyone have one
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15566	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 10/8/2005
Subject: Re: Used Tank Advice
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15567	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 10/8/2005
Subject: Re: this is so cool does anyone have one
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15568	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 10/8/2005
Subject: Re: Live rock and cichlids PAUL!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15569	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 10/8/2005
Subject: Re: The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, wilderness tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15570	From: wendie	Date: 10/8/2005
Subject: Re: this is so cool does anyone have one
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15571	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 10/8/2005
Subject: Re: this is so cool does anyone have one
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15572	From: sevenspringss@wmconnect.com	Date: 10/9/2005
Subject: Re: this is so cool does anyone have one
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15573	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 10/9/2005
Subject: Water cloudy white.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15574	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 10/9/2005
Subject: Re: Water cloudy white.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15575	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 10/9/2005
Subject: Re: Water cloudy white.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15576	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 10/9/2005
Subject: Re: Water cloudy white.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15577	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 10/9/2005
Subject: Re: this is so cool does anyone have one
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15578	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 10/9/2005
Subject: Re: Water cloudy white.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15579	From: Thomas Schlemmermeyer	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: William Thorton Innes
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15580	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: Re: Water cloudy white.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15581	From: supamii	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: Re: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15582	From: supamii	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: how big does it really get?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15583	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: Re: how big does it really get?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15584	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: Re: William Thorton Innes
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15585	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: Re: Water cloudy white.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15586	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: Re: how big does it really get?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15587	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: Re: William Thorton Innes
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15589	From: Jeremy Carter	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: unsubscribe
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15590	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: Re: unsubscribe
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15591	From: supamii	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: Re: how big does it really get?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15592	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: Re: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15593	From: supamii	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: Re: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15594	From: supamii	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: Re: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15595	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: Re: Water cloudy white.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15596	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: Re: how big does it really get?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15597	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: Re: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15598	From: supamii	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: Re: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15599	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: Re: how big does it really get?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15600	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: Re: Water cloudy white.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15601	From: Cydne McCown	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: Re: how big does it really get?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15602	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: Re: how big does it really get?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15603	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: Re: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15604	From: supamii	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: repost: red algae/ bearded/ hair algae help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15605	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 10/11/2005
Subject: Re: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15607	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 10/11/2005
Subject: Re: WAHH, I killed my pregnant Molly
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15608	From: Esther Souverein	Date: 10/12/2005
Subject: Re: WAHH, I killed my pregnant Molly
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15609	From: aclaar877	Date: 10/12/2005
Subject: Re: repost: red algae/ bearded/ hair algae help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15610	From: aclaar877	Date: 10/12/2005
Subject: Discus Growth Rate
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15611	From: Cydne McCown	Date: 10/12/2005
Subject: Re: Discus Growth Rate
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15612	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 10/12/2005
Subject: Re: Discus Growth Rate
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15613	From: discusfishies	Date: 10/12/2005
Subject: Re: Discus Growth Rate
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15614	From: discusfishies	Date: 10/12/2005
Subject: Fish tank maintenance business
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15615	From: aclaar877	Date: 10/12/2005
Subject: Re: Discus Growth Rate
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15616	From: aclaar877	Date: 10/12/2005
Subject: Re: Cabomba aquarium requirments
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15617	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 10/12/2005
Subject: Re: Discus Growth Rate
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15618	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 10/12/2005
Subject: Re: Discus Growth Rate
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15619	From: djransome@optonline.net	Date: 10/12/2005
Subject: Re: Siamese Algae Eaters and African Cichlids
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15620	From: dragon6435@aol.com	Date: 10/12/2005
Subject: Re: Discus Growth Rate
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15621	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 10/12/2005
Subject: Re: Siamese Algae Eaters and African Cichlids
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15622	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 10/12/2005
Subject: help with snails in cold water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15623	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 10/12/2005
Subject: Re: help with snails in cold water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15624	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 10/12/2005
Subject: Re: Discus Growth Rate
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15625	From: nicolasqueen	Date: 10/12/2005
Subject: Hi, New to Group
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15626	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 10/13/2005
Subject: Re: Discus Growth Rate
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15627	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 10/13/2005
Subject: Re: help with snails in cold water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15628	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 10/13/2005
Subject: Re: Discus Growth Rate
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15629	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 10/13/2005
Subject: Re: Discus Growth Rate
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15630	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 10/13/2005
Subject: Re: help with snails in cold water
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15631	From: aclaar877	Date: 10/13/2005
Subject: Re: Discus Growth Rate
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15632	From: Cydne McCown	Date: 10/13/2005
Subject: Re: Hi, New to Group
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15633	From: dragon6435@aol.com	Date: 10/13/2005
Subject: Re: Discus Growth Rate
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15634	From: pamphetteplace	Date: 10/13/2005
Subject: Info on shipping bettas requested
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15635	From: pamphetteplace	Date: 10/13/2005
Subject: Info on shipping bettas requested
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15636	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 10/13/2005
Subject: Re: Hi, New to Group
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15637	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 10/13/2005
Subject: Re: Discus Growth Rate
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15638	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 10/14/2005
Subject: Re: Discus Growth Rate
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15639	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 10/14/2005
Subject: question about leaches in pond
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15641	From: Aaron	Date: 10/14/2005
Subject: TROPICAL FISH HOBBYIST MAGAZINE - SPECIAL HOLIDAY RATE!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15642	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 10/14/2005
Subject: Need to sell a whisper water filter and plastic plants.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15643	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 10/14/2005
Subject: My Angelfish just laid eggs!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15644	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 10/14/2005
Subject: Re: My Angelfish just laid eggs!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15645	From: pamphetteplace	Date: 10/14/2005
Subject: Re: My Angelfish just laid eggs!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15646	From: pamphetteplace	Date: 10/14/2005
Subject: Re: Hi, New to Group
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15647	From: Cydne McCown	Date: 10/14/2005
Subject: Re: My Angelfish just laid eggs!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15648	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 10/14/2005
Subject: Brooklyn Aquarium Society Presents: 19th ANNUAL GIANT TROPICAL FISH
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15649	From: SuNnY	Date: 10/14/2005
Subject: Re: My Angelfish just laid eggs!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15650	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 10/14/2005
Subject: Bad news. re: My Angelfish just laid eggs!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15651	From: Cydne McCown	Date: 10/14/2005
Subject: Re: Bad news. re: My Angelfish just laid eggs!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15652	From: Cydne	Date: 10/14/2005
Subject: Now my Angels are laying eggs!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15653	From: Donna Ransome	Date: 10/15/2005
Subject: North Jersey Aquarium Society Fall Show
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15654	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 10/15/2005
Subject: Re: North Jersey Aquarium Society Fall Show
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15655	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 10/15/2005
Subject: Re: Bad news. re: My Angelfish just laid eggs!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15656	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 10/15/2005
Subject: NCORE
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15657	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 10/15/2005
Subject: What to do?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15658	From: Donna Ransome	Date: 10/15/2005
Subject: Re: North Jersey Aquarium Society Fall Show
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15659	From: Donna Ransome	Date: 10/15/2005
Subject: Planning a African Rift Tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15660	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 10/15/2005
Subject: Re: Planning a African Rift Tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15661	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 10/16/2005
Subject: Re: Planning a African Rift Tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15662	From: andrew davis	Date: 10/16/2005
Subject: Re: question about leaches in pond
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15663	From: SuNnY	Date: 10/16/2005
Subject: Re: Bad news. re: My Angelfish just laid eggs!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15664	From: SuNnY	Date: 10/16/2005
Subject: Re: Bad news. re: My Angelfish just laid eggs!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15665	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 10/17/2005
Subject: too many gold mystery snails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15666	From: wendie	Date: 10/17/2005
Subject: Re: too many gold mystery snails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15667	From: bigter4	Date: 10/18/2005
Subject: Re: too many gold mystery snails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15668	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 10/18/2005
Subject: Re: too many gold mystery snails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15669	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 10/18/2005
Subject: Re: too many gold mystery snails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15670	From: Gianluca Polgar	Date: 10/18/2005
Subject: new website on mudskippers
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15671	From: Chris	Date: 10/18/2005
Subject: Re: new website on mudskippers
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15672	From: Chris	Date: 10/18/2005
Subject: Re: new website on mudskippers
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15673	From: supamii	Date: 10/18/2005
Subject: plants dying hydrogen peroxide? help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15674	From: Cydne McCown	Date: 10/18/2005
Subject: Re: plants dying hydrogen peroxide? help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15675	From: supamii	Date: 10/18/2005
Subject: Re: plants dying hydrogen peroxide? help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15676	From: antoniq64	Date: 10/19/2005
Subject: cabomba help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15677	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 10/19/2005
Subject: Re: plants dying hydrogen peroxide? help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15678	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 10/19/2005
Subject: Re: cabomba help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15679	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 10/19/2005
Subject: Re: plants dying hydrogen peroxide? help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15680	From: fish8951	Date: 10/19/2005
Subject: Question for cory breeders
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15681	From: supamii	Date: 10/19/2005
Subject: Re: plants dying hydrogen peroxide? help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15682	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 10/19/2005
Subject: Re: plants dying hydrogen peroxide? help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15683	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 10/19/2005
Subject: Re: plants dying hydrogen peroxide? help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15684	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 10/19/2005
Subject: Re: plants dying hydrogen peroxide? help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15685	From: Cydne McCown	Date: 10/19/2005
Subject: Re: cabomba help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15686	From: supamii	Date: 10/19/2005
Subject: Re: plants dying hydrogen peroxide? help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15687	From: Cydne McCown	Date: 10/19/2005
Subject: Re: Question for cory breeders
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15688	From: antoniq64	Date: 10/20/2005
Subject: Save Cabomba and Anacharis
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15689	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 10/20/2005
Subject: Re: Save Cabomba and Anacharis
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15690	From: bigter4	Date: 10/20/2005
Subject: Re: too many gold mystery snails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15691	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 10/20/2005
Subject: Re: plants dying hydrogen peroxide? help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15692	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 10/20/2005
Subject: Re: question about leaches in pond
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15693	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 10/20/2005
Subject: Re: question about leaches in pond
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15694	From: Gianluca Polgar	Date: 10/20/2005
Subject: Re: new website on mudskippers
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15695	From: Kwang Pak	Date: 10/20/2005
Subject: Re: too many gold mystery snails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15696	From: supamii	Date: 10/20/2005
Subject: Re: plants dying hydrogen peroxide? help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15697	From: dreammaker2623	Date: 10/20/2005
Subject: Re: plants dying hydrogen peroxide? help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15698	From: Chris	Date: 10/20/2005
Subject: Re: new website on mudskippers
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15699	From: supamii	Date: 10/20/2005
Subject: Re: plants dying hydrogen peroxide? help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15700	From: Sandy Kay	Date: 10/21/2005
Subject: gourmie (spelling?)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15701	From: Fred and Cynthia	Date: 10/21/2005
Subject: Re: gourmie (spelling?)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15702	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 10/21/2005
Subject: Re: plants dying hydrogen peroxide? help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15703	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 10/21/2005
Subject: Re: gourmie (spelling?)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15704	From: Bruce Hansen	Date: 10/21/2005
Subject: Re: Question for cory breeders
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15705	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 10/21/2005
Subject: Re: plants dying hydrogen peroxide? help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15706	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 10/21/2005
Subject: Re: gourmie (spelling?)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15707	From: Rei - Raymond Tremor	Date: 10/21/2005
Subject: Help! My plant's leaves are turning into skeleton
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15708	From: Cydne McCown	Date: 10/21/2005
Subject: Re: Help! My plant's leaves are turning into skeleton
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15709	From: Cydne	Date: 10/21/2005
Subject: Question........
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15710	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 10/21/2005
Subject: Re: Question........
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15711	From: Cydne McCown	Date: 10/21/2005
Subject: Re: Question........
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15712	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 10/21/2005
Subject: Re: Question........
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15713	From: KttmfC	Date: 10/22/2005
Subject: Tag alongs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15714	From: Chris	Date: 10/22/2005
Subject: Re: Tag alongs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15715	From: Chris	Date: 10/22/2005
Subject: Re: gourmie (spelling?)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15716	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 10/22/2005
Subject: Re: Tag alongs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15717	From: ahorseofcourse66	Date: 10/22/2005
Subject: What is in my tank??
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15718	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 10/23/2005
Subject: My loss is your gain sale.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15719	From: fuzzybpebble	Date: 10/23/2005
Subject: Re: What is in my tank??
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15720	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 10/23/2005
Subject: Re: What is in my tank??
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15721	From: Donna Ransome	Date: 10/23/2005
Subject: Re: 29 gallon mbuna tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15722	From: Donna Ransome	Date: 10/23/2005
Subject: Mbuna Tank Decor: Background
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15723	From: Tom Ray	Date: 10/24/2005
Subject: Re: Tag alongs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15724	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 10/24/2005
Subject: Re: Tag alongs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15725	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 10/24/2005
Subject: Re: Tag alongs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15726	From: Chris	Date: 10/24/2005
Subject: shortest lived vertebrate - coral reef pygmy goby
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15727	From: supamii	Date: 10/24/2005
Subject: bolivian ram AND angelfish??
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15728	From: SuNnY	Date: 10/24/2005
Subject: Re: bolivian ram AND angelfish??
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15729	From: supamii	Date: 10/24/2005
Subject: Re: bolivian ram AND angelfish??
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15730	From: Chris	Date: 10/24/2005
Subject: Re: bolivian ram AND angelfish??
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15731	From: supamii	Date: 10/24/2005
Subject: Re: bolivian ram AND angelfish??
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15732	From: SuNnY	Date: 10/25/2005
Subject: Re: bolivian ram AND angelfish??
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15733	From: Sue Boswell	Date: 10/25/2005
Subject: Re: bolivian ram AND angelfish??
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15734	From: Robert Hickey	Date: 10/25/2005
Subject: Re: bolivian ram AND angelfish??
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15735	From: Ben Noreau	Date: 10/25/2005
Subject: betta problem
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15736	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 10/25/2005
Subject: Re: betta problem
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15737	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 10/25/2005
Subject: Re: betta problem
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15738	From: mommy2acdhsurvivor	Date: 10/25/2005
Subject: Re: Question........
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15739	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 10/26/2005
Subject: Nemotodes coming out of guppy anus - treatment?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15740	From: Daniel Brown	Date: 10/27/2005
Subject: Questions: just got a mature tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15741	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 10/27/2005
Subject: Re: Nemotodes coming out of guppy anus - treatment?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15742	From: Andreas	Date: 10/27/2005
Subject: Re: Questions: just got a mature tank
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15743	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 10/27/2005
Subject: Re: Nemotodes coming out of guppy anus - treatment?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15744	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 10/27/2005
Subject: Re: Nemotodes coming out of guppy anus - treatment?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15745	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 10/27/2005
Subject: Re: betta problem
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15746	From: Andreas	Date: 10/28/2005
Subject: anchor worms heeelp
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15747	From: linsparks22	Date: 10/28/2005
Subject: Pleco
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15748	From: shaenalee_02	Date: 10/28/2005
Subject: Betta?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15749	From: Cydne McCown	Date: 10/28/2005
Subject: Re: Betta?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15750	From: Cydne McCown	Date: 10/28/2005
Subject: Re: Pleco
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15751	From: Linda Sparks	Date: 10/28/2005
Subject: Fw: Re: [AquaticLife] Pleco
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15752	From: Cydne McCown	Date: 10/28/2005
Subject: Re: Fw: Re: [AquaticLife] Pleco
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15753	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 10/28/2005
Subject: Re: Fw: Re: [AquaticLife] Pleco
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15754	From: harry perry	Date: 10/29/2005
Subject: Re: Pleco/To Linda
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15755	From: harry perry	Date: 10/29/2005
Subject: Re: Pleco/To Linda
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15756	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 10/29/2005
Subject: Re: anchor worms heeelp
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15757	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 10/29/2005
Subject: Re: Pleco
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15758	From: Justin M.	Date: 10/29/2005
Subject: Re: Betta?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15759	From: Andreas	Date: 10/29/2005
Subject: Re: anchor worms heeelp
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15760	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 10/29/2005
Subject: Re: anchor worms heeelp
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15761	From: Cydne McCown	Date: 10/29/2005
Subject: Re: anchor worms heeelp
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15762	From: mommy2acdhsurvivor	Date: 10/29/2005
Subject: Re: anchor worms heeelp
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15763	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 10/29/2005
Subject: questiona bout frogs in tanks
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15764	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 10/29/2005
Subject: Re: questiona bout frogs in tanks
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15765	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 10/29/2005
Subject: Re: live foods
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15766	From: Linda Sparks	Date: 10/29/2005
Subject: Fw: Re: [AquaticLife] anchor worms heeelp
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15767	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 10/29/2005
Subject: Re: questiona bout frogs in tanks
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15768	From: Nimish	Date: 10/30/2005
Subject: Re: Nemotodes coming out of guppy anus - treatment?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15769	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 10/30/2005
Subject: praziquantel?/ Nemotodes coming out of guppy anus - treatment?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15770	From: sevenspringss	Date: 10/30/2005
Subject: Re: praziquantel?/ Nemotodes coming out of guppy anus - treatment?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15771	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 10/30/2005
Subject: Re: praziquantel?/ Nemotodes coming out of guppy anus - treatment?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15772	From: Rev. Eric Roberts	Date: 10/31/2005
Subject: Re: Pleco
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15773	From: shaenalee_02	Date: 11/1/2005
Subject: How many fish?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15774	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 11/1/2005
Subject: Re: How many fish?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15775	From: Justin M.	Date: 11/1/2005
Subject: Re: How many fish?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15776	From: Fred and Cynthia	Date: 11/1/2005
Subject: Re: How many fish?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15777	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 11/1/2005
Subject: Re: How many fish?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15778	From: harry perry	Date: 11/1/2005
Subject: Re: How many fish/1" per gal???.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15779	From: supamii	Date: 11/1/2005
Subject: Re: How many fish?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15780	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 11/1/2005
Subject: Re: How many fish?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15781	From: harry perry	Date: 11/1/2005
Subject: Re: How many fish/To Steve
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15782	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 11/1/2005
Subject: Re: How many fish/To Steve
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15783	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 11/1/2005
Subject: Re: How many fish?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15784	From: shaenalee_02	Date: 11/1/2005
Subject: Thank you
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15785	From: dreammaker2623	Date: 11/1/2005
Subject: Re: How many fish?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15786	From: supamii	Date: 11/1/2005
Subject: Re: How many fish?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15787	From: paul helms	Date: 11/2/2005
Subject: Re: How many fish/To Steve
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15788	From: paul helms	Date: 11/2/2005
Subject: Re: Fw: Re: [AquaticLife] anchor worms heeelp
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15789	From: paul helms	Date: 11/2/2005
Subject: Re: questiona bout frogs in tanks
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15790	From: paul helms	Date: 11/2/2005
Subject: Re: anchor worms heeelp
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15791	From: paul helms	Date: 11/2/2005
Subject: Re: anchor worms heeelp
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15792	From: Rev. Eric Roberts	Date: 11/2/2005
Subject: Re: How many fish?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15793	From: Patrick	Date: 11/2/2005
Subject: Re: How many fish/1" per gal???.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15794	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 11/2/2005
Subject: Thought just came to me
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15795	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 11/2/2005
Subject: Re: Thought just came to me
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15796	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 11/2/2005
Subject: Female Betta FAT w/ eggs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15797	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 11/2/2005
Subject: Re: Thought just came to me
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15798	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 11/2/2005
Subject: Re: questiona bout frogs in tanks
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15799	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 11/2/2005
Subject: Re: Thought just came to me
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15800	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 11/2/2005
Subject: Re: Thought just came to me
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15801	From: Andrea	Date: 11/2/2005
Subject: Re: Female Betta FAT w/ eggs
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15802	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 11/2/2005
Subject: Re: Thought just came to me
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15803	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 11/2/2005
Subject: Re: Thought just came to me
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15804	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 11/3/2005
Subject: Brown growth on filters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15805	From: Rev. Eric Roberts	Date: 11/3/2005
Subject: Re: Thought just came to me
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15806	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 11/4/2005
Subject: Re: Brown growth on filters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15807	From: paul helms	Date: 11/5/2005
Subject: Re: Brown growth on filters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15808	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 11/5/2005
Subject: Re: Brown growth on filters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15809	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 11/6/2005
Subject: New poll for AquaticLife
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15810	From: aclaar877	Date: 11/7/2005
Subject: Free Aquarium Plants -- St. Louis
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15811	From: Justin M.	Date: 11/7/2005
Subject: corydoras spawning!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15812	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 11/7/2005
Subject: Received 2 Kissing Gouramis
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15813	From: Justin M.	Date: 11/7/2005
Subject: Re: Received 2 Kissing Gouramis
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15814	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 11/7/2005
Subject: Re: Received 2 Kissing Gouramis
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15815	From: EDITHAN1@AOL.COM	Date: 11/7/2005
Subject: Re: Free Aquarium Plants -- St. Louis
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15816	From: paul helms	Date: 11/7/2005
Subject: Re: corydoras spawning!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15817	From: paul helms	Date: 11/7/2005
Subject: Re: anchor worms heeelp
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15818	From: Andreas	Date: 11/7/2005
Subject: Re: anchor worms heeelp
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15819	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 11/7/2005
Subject: Re: corydoras spawning!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15820	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 11/8/2005
Subject: Re: Received 2 Kissing Gouramis
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15821	From: Justin M.	Date: 11/8/2005
Subject: new albino cory (was: RE: [AquaticLife] Received 2 Kissing Gouramis)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15822	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 11/8/2005
Subject: where to buy Levimisole HCL online?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15823	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 11/8/2005
Subject: multivitamin freshwater supplement?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15824	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 11/8/2005
Subject: Re: Received 2 Kissing Gouramis
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15825	From: supamii	Date: 11/8/2005
Subject: Re: multivitamin freshwater supplement?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15826	From: paul helms	Date: 11/10/2005
Subject: Re: Pleco
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15827	From: Fred and Cynthia	Date: 11/11/2005
Subject: molly who is pregnant
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15828	From: Raymond Wetzel	Date: 11/11/2005
Subject: Re: molly who is pregnant
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15829	From: Fred and Cynthia	Date: 11/11/2005
Subject: Re: molly who is pregnant
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15830	From: wendie	Date: 11/11/2005
Subject: Re: molly who is pregnant
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15831	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 11/11/2005
Subject: Vitamin fish food
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15832	From: Andreas	Date: 11/11/2005
Subject: need to identify snails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15833	From: Pat Jellison	Date: 11/11/2005
Subject: Requiem for a frog
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15834	From: wendie	Date: 11/11/2005
Subject: Re: need to identify snails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15835	From: harry perry	Date: 11/11/2005
Subject: Re: Requiem for a frog/To Pat
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15836	From: Joe	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: Re: How many fish?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15837	From: abs_334	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: Hi
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15838	From: seaurchin119	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: Hi--I'm a new member!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15839	From: tigertydrake	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: Fish Health
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15840	From: Fred and Cynthia	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: Re: need to identify snails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15841	From: wendie	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: Re: need to identify snails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15842	From: Fred and Cynthia	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: Re: need to identify snails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15843	From: Justin M.	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: Re: Fish Health
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15844	From: Fred and Cynthia	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: Re: molly who is pregnant
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15845	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: Re: Fish Health
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15846	From: Raymond Wetzel	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: Re: molly who is pregnant
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15847	From: Fred and Cynthia	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: Ray
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15848	From: sevenspringss@wmconnect.com	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: Re: Ray
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15849	From: KttmfC	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: need help please
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15850	From: Fred and Cynthia	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: Re: need help please
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15851	From: Ty Drake	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: Re: need help please
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15852	From: Ty Drake	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: Re: Fish Health
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15853	From: Ty Drake	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: Re: Fish Health
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15854	From: Ty Drake	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: Re: need help please
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15855	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: Re: Hi--I'm a new member!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15856	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: Re: Fish Health
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15857	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: Re: need help please
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15858	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: Re: need help please
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15859	From: Fred and Cynthia	Date: 11/13/2005
Subject: Ray
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15860	From: Raymond Wetzel	Date: 11/13/2005
Subject: Re: Ray/Mollie who is pregnant
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15861	From: Luke	Date: 11/14/2005
Subject: Guppies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15862	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 11/14/2005
Subject: Re: Guppies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15863	From: Fred and Cynthia	Date: 11/14/2005
Subject: Ray, photos
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15864	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 11/14/2005
Subject: Re: Guppies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15865	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 11/14/2005
Subject: Re: Guppies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15866	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 11/14/2005
Subject: Re: Guppies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15867	From: KttmfC	Date: 11/14/2005
Subject: anyone in san diego??
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15868	From: KttmfC	Date: 11/14/2005
Subject: sweet
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15869	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 11/14/2005
Subject: Re: Guppies
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15870	From: sevenspringss@wmconnect.com	Date: 11/14/2005
Subject: Re: Ray, photos
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15871	From: Fred and Cynthia	Date: 11/15/2005
Subject: Re: Ray, photos
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15872	From: sevenspringss@wmconnect.com	Date: 11/15/2005
Subject: Re: Ray, photos
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15873	From: Phil	Date: 11/15/2005
Subject: 4th generation convicts!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15874	From: Tiger	Date: 11/16/2005
Subject: Oscar
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15875	From: paul helms	Date: 11/17/2005
Subject: Re: need to identify snails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15876	From: paul helms	Date: 11/17/2005
Subject: Re: need to identify snails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15877	From: paul helms	Date: 11/17/2005
Subject: Re: need to identify snails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15878	From: Rev. Eric Roberts	Date: 11/17/2005
Subject: Re: need to identify snails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15879	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 11/17/2005
Subject: got tramisol from foy's pigeon, just double checking dosage...
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15880	From: Raymond Wetzel	Date: 11/17/2005
Subject: Re: got tramisol from foy's pigeon, just double checking dosage...
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15881	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 11/17/2005
Subject: Re: got tramisol from foy's pigeon, just double checking dosage...
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15882	From: aclaar877	Date: 11/17/2005
Subject: Azoo Red Plant Fertilizer
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15883	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 11/17/2005
Subject: Re: Azoo Red Plant Fertilizer
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15884	From: Raymond Wetzel	Date: 11/17/2005
Subject: Re: got tramisol from foy's pigeon, just double checking dosage...
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15885	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 11/18/2005
Subject: Re: got tramisol from foy's pigeon, just double checking dosage...
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15886	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 11/18/2005
Subject: having problems getting snails to control algae
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15887	From: Justin M.	Date: 11/18/2005
Subject: electronic pH meters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15888	From: dreammaker2623	Date: 11/19/2005
Subject: Re: having problems getting snails to control algae
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15889	From: paul helms	Date: 11/19/2005
Subject: Re: electronic pH meters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15890	From: Tim Fairchild	Date: 11/19/2005
Subject: Re: electronic pH meters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15891	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 11/19/2005
Subject: Re: having problems getting snails to control algae
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15892	From: thesydmonster	Date: 11/19/2005
Subject: Re: need to identify snails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15893	From: Rev. Eric Roberts	Date: 11/20/2005
Subject: Re: need to identify snails
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15894	From: scooobycat2000	Date: 11/20/2005
Subject: question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15895	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 11/20/2005
Subject: Tszzzzzt! Electric fish may jam rivals' signals: Science News Onlin
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15896	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 11/20/2005
Subject: Re: question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15897	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 11/20/2005
Subject: Re: question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15898	From: Rev. Eric Roberts	Date: 11/20/2005
Subject: Re: Tszzzzzt! Electric fish may jam rivals' signals: Science News O
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15899	From: Iksnip@aol.com	Date: 11/20/2005
Subject: Bioscape
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15900	From: Chris	Date: 11/20/2005
Subject: Re: Bioscape
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15901	From: Kara	Date: 11/20/2005
Subject: Re: Bioscape
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15902	From: harry perry	Date: 11/20/2005
Subject: Re: Bioscape/Paludarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15903	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 11/20/2005
Subject: Re: Bioscape/Paludarium
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15904	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 11/21/2005
Subject: Male cichlids transform as dominant rivals removed
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15905	From: John	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: Bio-Wheel Filter opinions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15906	From: yellow71camaro	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: help!!! stingray problems
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15907	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: Re: Bio-Wheel Filter opinions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15908	From: Kara	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: Re: Bio-Wheel Filter opinions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15909	From: Kara	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: Re: Bio-Wheel Filter opinions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15910	From: Patrick	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: Re: Bio-Wheel Filter opinions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15911	From: Laura	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: New tank set up
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15912	From: Patrick	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: Re: New tank set up
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15913	From: wendie	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: Re: Bio-Wheel Filter opinions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15914	From: Laura	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: Re: New tank set up
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15915	From: Laura	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: New to the group...
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15916	From: Laura	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: Re: New to the group...
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15917	From: Patrick	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: Re: New to the group...
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15918	From: Patrick	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: Re: New tank set up
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15919	From: Laura	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: Re: New tank set up
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15920	From: Laura	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: Re: New to the group...
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15921	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: Re: New tank set up
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15922	From: Laura	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: Re: New tank set up
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15923	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: Re: Bio-Wheel Filter opinions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15924	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: Re: New tank set up
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15925	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: Re: New tank set up
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15926	From: Rev. Eric Roberts	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: Re: Bio-Wheel Filter opinions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15927	From: Rev. Eric Roberts	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: Re: Bio-Wheel Filter opinions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15928	From: Rev. Eric Roberts	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: Re: Bio-Wheel Filter opinions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15929	From: Rev. Eric Roberts	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: Re: New tank set up
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15930	From: Raymond Wetzel	Date: 11/27/2005
Subject: Re: New tank set up
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15931	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 11/27/2005
Subject: Re: New to the group...
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15932	From: Laura	Date: 11/27/2005
Subject: Re: New tank set up
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15933	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 11/27/2005
Subject: Re: New tank set up
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15934	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 11/27/2005
Subject: Re: New tank set up
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15935	From: wendie	Date: 11/27/2005
Subject: Re: New tank set up
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15936	From: Laura	Date: 11/27/2005
Subject: Re: New tank set up
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15937	From: Patrick	Date: 11/27/2005
Subject: Re: New tank set up
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15938	From: Larry Nave	Date: 11/27/2005
Subject: BioWheel
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15939	From: Patrick	Date: 11/27/2005
Subject: Re: New to the group...
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15940	From: Laura	Date: 11/27/2005
Subject: Re: New tank set up
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15941	From: Patrick	Date: 11/27/2005
Subject: Re: New tank set up
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15942	From: Raymond Wetzel	Date: 11/27/2005
Subject: Re: New tank set up
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15943	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 11/27/2005
Subject: Re: New tank set up
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15944	From: Rev. Eric Roberts	Date: 11/27/2005
Subject: Re: BioWheel
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15945	From: Cydne McCown	Date: 11/27/2005
Subject: Re: New tank set up
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15946	From: minnesotagal866	Date: 11/27/2005
Subject: Re: New tank set up
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15947	From: Kara	Date: 11/27/2005
Subject: Re: New to the group...
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15948	From: scooobycat2000	Date: 11/27/2005
Subject: saltwater
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15949	From: Iksnip@aol.com	Date: 11/28/2005
Subject: Some Questions :)
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15950	From: Iksnip@aol.com	Date: 11/28/2005
Subject: one last question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15951	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 11/28/2005
Subject: Re: one last question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15952	From: A J Myers	Date: 11/28/2005
Subject: Dojo loach stays buried
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15953	From: Rev. Eric Roberts	Date: 11/28/2005
Subject: Re: Dojo loach stays buried
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15954	From: seaurchin119	Date: 11/28/2005
Subject: Hello again--Please help me out
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15955	From: bigter4	Date: 11/29/2005
Subject: Re: Hello again--Please help me out
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15956	From: Laura	Date: 11/29/2005
Subject: Identity crisis....lol
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15957	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 11/29/2005
Subject: Re: Identity crisis....lol
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15958	From: Thomas Schlemmermeyer	Date: 11/30/2005
Subject: Re: Identity crisis....lol
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15959	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 11/30/2005
Subject: Pictus Catfish ?'s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15960	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 11/30/2005
Subject: Re: Pictus Catfish ?'s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15961	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 11/30/2005
Subject: Re: Identity crisis....lol
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15962	From: Thomas Schlemmermeyer	Date: 11/30/2005
Subject: Re: Identity crisis....lol
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15963	From: Thomas Schlemmermeyer	Date: 11/30/2005
Subject: Re: Pictus Catfish ?'s
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15964	From: John	Date: 11/30/2005
Subject: Would be a Clown Loach good choice?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15965	From: Justin M.	Date: 11/30/2005
Subject: Re: Would be a Clown Loach good choice?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15966	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 11/30/2005
Subject: Re: Would be a Clown Loach good choice?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15967	From: Fred and Cynthia	Date: 11/30/2005
Subject: Re: Would be a Clown Loach good choice?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15968	From: Willow Sumner	Date: 11/30/2005
Subject: what are Rams (was - Re: [AquaticLife] Would be a Clown Loach good
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15969	From: John	Date: 11/30/2005
Subject: what are Rams (was - Re: [AquaticLife] Would be a Clown Loach good
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15970	From: Patrick	Date: 11/30/2005
Subject: fish identification
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15971	From: Raymond Wetzel	Date: 11/30/2005
Subject: Re: Identity crisis....lol
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15972	From: Raymond Wetzel	Date: 11/30/2005
Subject: Re: fish identification
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15973	From: Patrick	Date: 12/1/2005
Subject: Re: fish identification
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15974	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 12/1/2005
Subject: Female beta needs her guy!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15975	From: wendie	Date: 12/1/2005
Subject: Re: Female beta needs her guy!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15976	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/2/2005
Subject: Re: what are Rams (was - Re: [AquaticLife] Would be a Clown Loach g
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15977	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 12/2/2005
Subject: Yikes! Betta swims funny! White tetra is getting eaten!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15978	From: Justin M.	Date: 12/2/2005
Subject: Re: ! White tetra is getting eaten!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15979	From: harry perry	Date: 12/2/2005
Subject: Melafix
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15980	From: Justin M.	Date: 12/2/2005
Subject: Re: Melafix
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15981	From: harry perry	Date: 12/2/2005
Subject: Amazing. Another kind of fish.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15982	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 12/2/2005
Subject: Re: Melafix
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15983	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 12/2/2005
Subject: Re: Melafix
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15984	From: Raymond Wetzel	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: Re: Yikes! Betta swims funny! White tetra is getting eaten!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15985	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: Re: Yikes! Betta swims funny! White tetra is getting eaten!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15986	From: Thomas Schlemmermeyer	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15987	From: Cydne McCown	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: Re: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15988	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: Re: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15989	From: Bruce Hansen	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: Re: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15990	From: Patrick	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: Re: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15991	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: Re: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15992	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: Re: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15993	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: Fish ID on group home page
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15994	From: Donna Ransome	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: Ordering Online: Minimum Order
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15995	From: Patrick	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: Re: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15996	From: Patrick	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: Re: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15997	From: harry perry	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: Re: Ordering Online: Minimum Order/An option
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15998	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: Re: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15999	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: Re: Ordering Online: Minimum Order/An option
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16000	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: Re: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16001	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: Re: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16002	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16003	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: Re: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16004	From: Patrick	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: Re: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16005	From: Patrick	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: A/C vs. Aquarium heaters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16006	From: Patrick	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: Re: A/C vs. Aquarium heaters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16007	From: Laura	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: Re: A/C vs. Aquarium heaters
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16008	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: Re: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16009	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/4/2005
Subject: Re: Amazing. Another kind of fish.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16010	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/4/2005
Subject: Re: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16011	From: Raymond Wetzel	Date: 12/4/2005
Subject: Re: Yikes! Betta swims funny! White tetra is getting eaten!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16012	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 12/4/2005
Subject: Re: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16013	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 12/4/2005
Subject: New file uploaded to AquaticLife
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16014	From: bunnycareshi	Date: 12/4/2005
Subject: Need book referral on mixing freshwater fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16015	From: Cydne McCown	Date: 12/4/2005
Subject: Re: Need book referral on mixing freshwater fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16016	From: Cydne McCown	Date: 12/4/2005
Subject: Re: Need book referral on mixing freshwater fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16017	From: bunnycareshi	Date: 12/4/2005
Subject: Re: Need book referral on mixing freshwater fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16018	From: bunnycareshi	Date: 12/4/2005
Subject: Re: Need book referral on mixing freshwater fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16019	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 12/4/2005
Subject: Re: Need book referral on mixing freshwater fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16020	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 12/4/2005
Subject: Re: Need book referral on mixing freshwater fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16021	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/4/2005
Subject: Re: Need book referral on mixing freshwater fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16022	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/4/2005
Subject: Re: Need book referral on mixing freshwater fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16023	From: Patrick	Date: 12/4/2005
Subject: Re: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16024	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/4/2005
Subject: Re: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16025	From: Cydne McCown	Date: 12/4/2005
Subject: Re: Need book referral on mixing freshwater fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16026	From: harry perry	Date: 12/4/2005
Subject: Re: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?/ think abo
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16027	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/4/2005
Subject: Re: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?/ think abo
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16028	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 12/4/2005
Subject: Re: Need book referral on mixing freshwater fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16029	From: hank voss	Date: 12/4/2005
Subject: Re: Need book referral on mixing freshwater fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16030	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 12/5/2005
Subject: Re: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16031	From: Tom Ray	Date: 12/5/2005
Subject: Freshwater Local Clubs and Fish Stores (LFS) for Louisville,KY & Bl
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16032	From: Tom Ray	Date: 12/5/2005
Subject: Hobby Magazines for Holiday Gifts.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16033	From: Aaron R. Martin	Date: 12/5/2005
Subject: Re: Freshwater Local Clubs and Fish Stores (LFS) for Louisville,KY
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16035	From: Aaron R. Martin	Date: 12/5/2005
Subject: Re: Freshwater Local Clubs and Fish Stores (LFS) for Louisville,KY
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16036	From: Aaron R. Martin	Date: 12/5/2005
Subject: Re: Freshwater Local Clubs and Fish Stores (LFS) for Louisville,KY
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16037	From: wendie	Date: 12/5/2005
Subject: Better Than Brine Shrimp Food
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16038	From: Cydne McCown	Date: 12/5/2005
Subject: Re: Hobby Magazines for Holiday Gifts.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16039	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 12/5/2005
Subject: FISH ID PLEASE
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16040	From: Justin M.	Date: 12/5/2005
Subject: Re: FISH ID PLEASE
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16041	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 12/5/2005
Subject: Re: FISH ID PLEASE
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16042	From: Raymond Wetzel	Date: 12/5/2005
Subject: Re: FISH ID PLEASE
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16043	From: princezzuno	Date: 12/5/2005
Subject: Re: Fish Id
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16044	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 12/5/2005
Subject: Re: Freshwater Local Clubs for louisville/bloomington
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16045	From: KttmfC	Date: 12/6/2005
Subject: Re: FISH ID PLEASE
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16046	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 12/6/2005
Subject: Re: Hobby Magazines for Holiday Gifts.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16047	From: Justin M.	Date: 12/6/2005
Subject: Re: FISH ID PLEASE
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16048	From: Raymond Wetzel	Date: 12/6/2005
Subject: Re: Fish Id
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16049	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 12/6/2005
Subject: Re: FISH ID PLEASE
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16050	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 12/6/2005
Subject: Fish ID, New Pics
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16051	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 12/6/2005
Subject: Re: FISH ID PLEASE
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16052	From: Raymond Wetzel	Date: 12/6/2005
Subject: Re: Fish ID, New Pics
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16053	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 12/6/2005
Subject: Re: FISH ID PLEASE
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16054	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/6/2005
Subject: Re: Hobby Magazines for Holiday Gifts.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16055	From: princezzuno	Date: 12/6/2005
Subject: Re: Fish ID, New Pics
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16056	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 12/6/2005
Subject: snail popl control
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16057	From: Ambisense	Date: 12/7/2005
Subject: Ich help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16058	From: Ambisense	Date: 12/7/2005
Subject: Photos of Ich
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16059	From: paul helms	Date: 12/7/2005
Subject: Re: Ich help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16060	From: Fred and Cynthia	Date: 12/7/2005
Subject: Re: Ich help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16061	From: Aaron R. Martin	Date: 12/7/2005
Subject: Re: snail popl control
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16062	From: hank voss	Date: 12/7/2005
Subject: Re: Ich help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16063	From: jigme7777	Date: 12/7/2005
Subject: inquiry
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16064	From: Tom Ray	Date: 12/7/2005
Subject: Re: Freshwater Local Clubs and Fish Stores (LFS) for Louisville,KY
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16065	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 12/7/2005
Subject: Re: inquiry
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16066	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 12/7/2005
Subject: Re: snail popl control
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16067	From: Raymond Wetzel	Date: 12/7/2005
Subject: Re: inquiry
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16068	From: Ambisense	Date: 12/7/2005
Subject: Re: Ich help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16069	From: Ambisense	Date: 12/7/2005
Subject: Re: inquiry
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16070	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 12/7/2005
Subject: Re: snail popl control
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16071	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 12/7/2005
Subject: Re: snail popl control
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16072	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/7/2005
Subject: Re: Ich help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16073	From: jigme7777	Date: 12/8/2005
Subject: Re: inquiry
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16074	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 12/8/2005
Subject: Re: inquiry
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16075	From: hank voss	Date: 12/8/2005
Subject: Re: inquiry
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16076	From: Rob And Joyce	Date: 12/8/2005
Subject: Sebea anenome question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16077	From: chestercanoy	Date: 12/8/2005
Subject: puffers
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16078	From: Fred and Cynthia	Date: 12/8/2005
Subject: Re: puffers
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16079	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 12/8/2005
Subject: Re: Sebea anenome question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16080	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 12/8/2005
Subject: Re: puffers
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16081	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 12/8/2005
Subject: Re: puffers
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16082	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 12/8/2005
Subject: Re: snail popl control
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16083	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 12/9/2005
Subject: Re: snail popl control
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16084	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 12/9/2005
Subject: Re: puffers
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16085	From: Amber	Date: 12/9/2005
Subject: Saltwater chat!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16086	From: Jerry Young	Date: 12/9/2005
Subject: Re: Need book referral on mixing freshwater fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16087	From: Laura	Date: 12/10/2005
Subject: Columbian Tetras in trouble
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16088	From: Justin M.	Date: 12/10/2005
Subject: Re: Columbian Tetras in trouble
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16089	From: Laura	Date: 12/10/2005
Subject: Re: Columbian Tetras in trouble
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16090	From: Justin M.	Date: 12/10/2005
Subject: Re: Columbian Tetras in trouble
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16091	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/10/2005
Subject: Re: Columbian Tetras in trouble
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16092	From: Laura	Date: 12/10/2005
Subject: Re: Columbian Tetras in trouble
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16093	From: Laura	Date: 12/10/2005
Subject: Re: Columbian Tetras in trouble
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16094	From: hank voss	Date: 12/10/2005
Subject: Re: Columbian Tetras in trouble
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16095	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/10/2005
Subject: Re: Columbian Tetras in trouble
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16096	From: Chris	Date: 12/10/2005
Subject: Re: Bioscape
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16097	From: Chris	Date: 12/10/2005
Subject: buying mudskippers in sydney
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16098	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 12/10/2005
Subject: Re: Columbian Tetras in trouble
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16099	From: Raymond Wetzel	Date: 12/10/2005
Subject: Re: Columbian Tetras in trouble
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16100	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/11/2005
Subject: Triops
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16101	From: hank voss	Date: 12/11/2005
Subject: Re: Triops
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16102	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 12/11/2005
Subject: upside down catfish question?
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16103	From: jerry young	Date: 12/11/2005
Subject: companion for my newts
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16104	From: red eye	Date: 12/12/2005
Subject: Re: companion for my newts
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16105	From: Robert Hickey	Date: 12/12/2005
Subject: Re: mbuna new tank Setup
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16106	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 12/12/2005
Subject: Re: mbuna new tank Setup
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16107	From: Robert Hickey	Date: 12/12/2005
Subject: Re: mbuna new tank Setup
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16108	From: Tom Ray	Date: 12/12/2005
Subject: Re: Freshwater Local Clubs and Fish Stores (LFS) for Louisville,KY
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16109	From: amvass2002	Date: 12/12/2005
Subject: Re: Triops
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16110	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/12/2005
Subject: Re: mbuna new tank Setup
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16111	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/12/2005
Subject: Re: Triops
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16112	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 12/12/2005
Subject: Re: mbuna new tank Setup
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16113	From: Robert Hickey	Date: 12/13/2005
Subject: Re: mbuna new tank Setup
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16114	From: Robert Hickey	Date: 12/13/2005
Subject: Re: mbuna new tank Setup
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16115	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/13/2005
Subject: Re: mbuna new tank Setup
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16116	From: Justin M.	Date: 12/13/2005
Subject: plant ID
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16117	From: thedakotawinds	Date: 12/13/2005
Subject: Gold Angel Fish
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16118	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 12/13/2005
Subject: Re: plant ID
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16119	From: Justin M.	Date: 12/14/2005
Subject: Re: plant ID
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16120	From: bucks_boogie@webtv.net	Date: 12/14/2005
Subject: Re: Sebea anenome
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16121	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 12/14/2005
Subject: Re: Sebea anenome
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16122	From: KttmfC	Date: 12/16/2005
Subject: Blue green algea help
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16123	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 12/17/2005
Subject: Re: Blue green algea help
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16124	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 12/17/2005
Subject: Betta breeding questions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16125	From: hank voss	Date: 12/17/2005
Subject: Re: Betta breeding questions
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16126	From: supamii	Date: 12/18/2005
Subject: SAE not eating hair algae
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16127	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/18/2005
Subject: 'TWAS THE NIGHT BEFORE CHRISTMAS
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16128	From: fuzzybpebble	Date: 12/18/2005
Subject: Re: SAE not eating hair algae
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16129	From: bucks_boogie@webtv.net	Date: 12/18/2005
Subject: Re: sebea
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16130	From: harry perry	Date: 12/18/2005
Subject: Re: SAE not eating hair algae/Algae control.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16131	From: Patrick	Date: 12/18/2005
Subject: Re: sebea
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16132	From: supamii	Date: 12/18/2005
Subject: Re: SAE not eating hair algae/Algae control.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16133	From: harry perry	Date: 12/18/2005
Subject: Re: SAE not eating hair algae/Algae control./supamii
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16134	From: Jerry Young	Date: 12/18/2005
Subject: Re: SAE not eating hair algae/Algae control./supamii
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16135	From: harry perry	Date: 12/18/2005
Subject: Re: SAE not eating hair algae/Algae control./supamii/Jerry
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16136	From: Jerry Young	Date: 12/18/2005
Subject: Re: SAE not eating hair algae/Algae control./supamii/Jerry
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16137	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 12/18/2005
Subject: Re: 'TWAS THE NIGHT BEFORE CHRISTMAS
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16138	From: princezzuno	Date: 12/19/2005
Subject: Looking for Livebearers
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16139	From: hank voss	Date: 12/19/2005
Subject: Re: SAE not eating hair algae/Algae control.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16140	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 12/19/2005
Subject: Re: SAE not eating hair algae/Algae control.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16141	From: hank voss	Date: 12/19/2005
Subject: Re: SAE not eating hair algae/Algae control.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16142	From: hank voss	Date: 12/19/2005
Subject: Re: SAE not eating hair algae/Algae control.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16143	From: hank voss	Date: 12/19/2005
Subject: Re: SAE not eating hair algae/Algae control.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16144	From: mike mather	Date: 12/19/2005
Subject: Re: SAE not eating hair algae/Algae control.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16145	From: Ivan White (Aqua-Hobbyist)	Date: 12/19/2005
Subject: Re: SAE not eating hair algae/Algae control.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16146	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 12/19/2005
Subject: Re: SAE not eating hair algae/Algae control.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16147	From: paul helms	Date: 12/21/2005
Subject: Re: companion for my newts
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16148	From: Jerry Young	Date: 12/21/2005
Subject: Re: companion for my newts
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16149	From: paul helms	Date: 12/22/2005
Subject: Re: companion for my newts
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16150	From: dragon6435@aol.com	Date: 12/23/2005
Subject: Nippy not so little fishy
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16151	From: Sai Narendra Vangamudi	Date: 12/24/2005
Subject: Substrate !!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16152	From: Kevin	Date: 12/24/2005
Subject: Re: SAE not eating hair algae/Algae control.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16153	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 12/24/2005
Subject: Re: Substrate !!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16154	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/24/2005
Subject: Re: Substrate !!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16155	From: Patrick	Date: 12/24/2005
Subject: Re: Substrate !!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16156	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/24/2005
Subject: Re: Substrate !!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16157	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/24/2005
Subject: A Holiday Wish to Those on the Lists
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16158	From: Sai Narendra	Date: 12/25/2005
Subject: Re: Substrate !!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16159	From: jazz	Date: 12/25/2005
Subject: happy happy
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16160	From: Patrick	Date: 12/25/2005
Subject: Re: happy happy
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16161	From: Raymond Wetzel	Date: 12/25/2005
Subject: Re: Seasons Greetings!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16162	From: Ivan White (Aqua-Hobbyist)	Date: 12/25/2005
Subject: Re: Substrate !!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16163	From: Kurt Johnston	Date: 12/25/2005
Subject: Happy Holidays
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16164	From: Jerry Young	Date: 12/26/2005
Subject: Re: companion for my newts
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16165	From: paul helms	Date: 12/27/2005
Subject: Re: companion for my newts
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16166	From: paul helms	Date: 12/27/2005
Subject: Re: Substrate !!!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16167	From: paul helms	Date: 12/27/2005
Subject: Re: Saltwater chat!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16168	From: paul helms	Date: 12/27/2005
Subject: Re: Sebea anenome question
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16169	From: paul helms	Date: 12/27/2005
Subject: Re: puffers
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16170	From: paul helms	Date: 12/27/2005
Subject: Re: Ich help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16171	From: paul helms	Date: 12/27/2005
Subject: Re: inquiry
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16172	From: paul helms	Date: 12/27/2005
Subject: Re: Ich help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16173	From: Rev. Eric Roberts	Date: 12/27/2005
Subject: Re: Ich help!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16174	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 12/28/2005
Subject: triops anyone??
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16175	From: Patrick	Date: 12/28/2005
Subject: Re: triops anyone??
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16176	From: amvass2002	Date: 12/28/2005
Subject: Re: triops anyone??
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16177	From: scooobycat2000	Date: 12/28/2005
Subject: filter
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16178	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/28/2005
Subject: Re: triops anyone??
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16179	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 12/28/2005
Subject: Re: filter
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16180	From: Kara	Date: 12/29/2005
Subject: Re: filter
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16181	From: sunnycitrine	Date: 12/29/2005
Subject: Help! I have a fin-nipper!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16182	From: Kevin	Date: 12/29/2005
Subject: Re: triops anyone??
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16183	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/29/2005
Subject: Re: Help! I have a fin-nipper!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16184	From: sunnycitrine	Date: 12/29/2005
Subject: Re: Help! I have a fin-nipper!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16185	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/29/2005
Subject: Re: Help! I have a fin-nipper!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16186	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 12/29/2005
Subject: Re: Help! I have a fin-nipper!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16187	From: Amy	Date: 12/30/2005
Subject: Re: Help! I have a fin-nipper!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16188	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/30/2005
Subject: Re: Help! I have a fin-nipper!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16189	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 12/30/2005
Subject: Re: Help! I have a fin-nipper!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16190	From: Kurt Johnston	Date: 12/31/2005
Subject: ALA Chairman invades PA
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16191	From: Amy	Date: 12/31/2005
Subject: Re: Help! I have a fin-nipper!
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16192	From: harry perry	Date: 12/31/2005
Subject: An important message to all.
Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16193	From: Salmarcus@aol.com	Date: 12/31/2005
Subject: Happy New Year

---

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11941	From: TankGurl	Date: 6/1/2005
Subject: Re: Starting up a new tank

A quick alternative would be the use of Bio Spira. One dose, fish can be introduced safely within 24 hrs. The stuff works like a dream. Kelly On 5/31/05, paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > cycle it first.....use something like stress zyme with > live bacteria and a food source in the bottle. > --- cynthia brennemann <brennewoman@...> > wrote: > > Okay, I know there is a lot of disagreement over > > fishless/vs fish > > cycling of a new tank. I am going to go fishless, > > for the simple fact > > that I want my plants well established before I add > > fish, to prevent > > the uprooting problems. I also want to take my time > > and get exactly > > what I want instead of just impulse buying fish. I > > would like to get > > some shrimp, ghost shrimp and cherry fire shrimp to > > put into the tank > > and let them get acclimated and maybe start > > reproducing before I put > > the fish in. Would it be better to let the tank > > complete the fishless > > cycle before I put them in? Or can they be put in > > as soon after the > > tank is set up as I want without harming them? > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > Discover Yahoo! > Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online and more. Check it out! > http://discover.yahoo.com/ > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > -- 65g Malawi http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 135g Frontosa/Tang http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11942	From: Cosmo Knight	Date: 6/1/2005
Subject: Re: A request to the group management

Just send a link to the picture. Let the other person deceide if they want to look at it or not. As far as me I receive emails through yahoo so I don't receive them anyways. I really don't care either way, but a link would help those that use yahoo to get the pic. My dime worth, Cosmo

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11943	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/1/2005
Subject: Re: A request to the group management

How do you send a link to a picture? Wouldn't you have to have web space to do that? (Or one of those picture hosting sites, but those are annoying.) -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Cosmo Knight Sent: Wednesday, June 01, 2005 9:40 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: A request to the group management Just send a link to the picture. Let the other person deceide if they want to look at it or not. As far as me I receive emails through yahoo so I don't receive them anyways. I really don't care either way, but a link would help those that use yahoo to get the pic. My dime worth, Cosmo Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11944	From: Amalthea	Date: 6/1/2005
Subject: Re: A request to the group management

just open whatever photo you're referencing in a new window if it's online and if it's not, upload it either to the yahoo home page or get an account with something like photobucket.com. why you find them "annoying" i don't know, but it can't possibly be more annoying than the computercentric threads of late. amalthea http://www.amaltheasattic.com Custom Dreadfalls, Creepy Toys, and Much, Much More... On Jun 1, 2005, at 1:02 PM, Dane & Leslie Moore wrote: > How do you send a link to a picture? Wouldn't you have to have web > space to do that? (Or one of those picture hosting sites, but > those are > annoying.) > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Cosmo Knight > Sent: Wednesday, June 01, 2005 9:40 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: A request to the group management > > > Just send a link to the picture. Let the other person deceide if they > want to look at it or not. > As far as me I receive emails through yahoo so I don't receive them > anyways. I really don't care either way, but a link would help those > that use yahoo to get the pic. > > My dime worth, > Cosmo > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not > important > to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify > the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we > Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not > important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original > message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11945	From: Patrick, AAFG	Date: 6/1/2005
Subject: Re: A request to the group management

This group is a picture-hosting site. You have to sign into yahoo with your account like you would normally do to go to the group. Go to the group home page and the photos link on the right or here: http://photos.groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/lst Create an album using your name as the album name, and then upload your pictures into it. For people who have accounts with their own website or something like photobucket.com, you can get a link from the pictures there. Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill -------Original Message------- How do you send a link to a picture? Wouldn't you have to have web space to do that? (Or one of those picture hosting sites, but those are annoying.) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11946	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/1/2005
Subject: Re: Digest Number 792: Virus Help !

lol amalthea! do you by chance work for apple =) --- Amalthea <amalthea23@...> wrote: > just get a mac and be done with it. > http://www.amaltheasattic.com > Your Alternative to the Alternative.... > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my 2 Ocellaris clownfish!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11947	From: Amalthea	Date: 6/1/2005
Subject: Re: Digest Number 792: Virus Help !

not at all, i just get exhausted listening to PC people babble about viruses and spyware all the time. Amalthea Get em' while they're cheap! Lip Service, Serious, Goth, Punk, Rockabilly and More are all in the Basement.... http://stores.ebay.com/Amaltheas-Basement-Bargain-Shop On Jun 1, 2005, at 4:09 PM, Valeen Gonzalez wrote: > lol amalthea! do you by chance work for apple =) > > --- Amalthea <amalthea23@...> wrote: > > > just get a mac and be done with it. > > http://www.amaltheasattic.com > > Your Alternative to the Alternative.... > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > I love my 2 Ocellaris clownfish! > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not > important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original > message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11948	From: knelson1701	Date: 6/1/2005
Subject: Re: Starting up a new tank

Kelly, Do you know of any websites that sell Bio Spira? I am having problems finding it. Thanks. Keith --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, TankGurl <fishgoddess@g...> wrote: > A quick alternative would be the use of Bio Spira. One dose, fish can > be introduced safely within 24 hrs. The stuff works like a dream. > > Kelly > > On 5/31/05, paul helms <wtfmorlok@y...> wrote: > > cycle it first.....use something like stress zyme with > > live bacteria and a food source in the bottle. > > --- cynthia brennemann <brennewoman@h...> > > wrote: > > > Okay, I know there is a lot of disagreement over > > > fishless/vs fish > > > cycling of a new tank. I am going to go fishless, > > > for the simple fact > > > that I want my plants well established before I add > > > fish, to prevent > > > the uprooting problems. I also want to take my time > > > and get exactly > > > what I want instead of just impulse buying fish. I > > > would like to get > > > some shrimp, ghost shrimp and cherry fire shrimp to > > > put into the tank > > > and let them get acclimated and maybe start > > > reproducing before I put > > > the fish in. Would it be better to let the tank > > > complete the fishless > > > cycle before I put them in? Or can they be put in > > > as soon after the > > > tank is set up as I want without harming them? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > > Discover Yahoo! > > Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online and more. Check it out! > > http://discover.yahoo.com/ > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > > . > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > 65g Malawi > http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 > 135g Frontosa/Tang > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11949	From: Eric Miner	Date: 6/1/2005
Subject: Too much areation?

Hello All, I have a 46gl tank with a Marineland Penguin 340 mechanical filter. I don't have a real problem with it, it does a good job. It has two ouutputs that do a good job of agitationg the surface, maybe too good a job. It sends a lot of bubbles into the tank, the smallest of them spread throughout the water maiking is look a bit cloudy. I know that good areation is required, but is there a way to keep the bubbles down a bit? This happens even when the water level is right up to the outputs. Thanks Eric

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11950	From: Patrick, AAFG	Date: 6/1/2005
Subject: Re: Digest Number 792: Virus Help !

When they make a mac that is user friendly, we'll be driving pickup trucks on Mars and no computer virus will exist any more. :) Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill -------Original Message------- not at all, i just get exhausted listening to PC people babble about viruses and spyware all the time. Amalthea [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11951	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 6/1/2005
Subject: Re: Need help fast confused

I'm assuming you have a new tank? The bacteria that converts ammonia into nitrite has to establish; when this happens ammonia will drop and nitrite will rise. Then bacteria establishes that converts nitrite into nitrate. You could try adding some Ammo-Lock to detoxify the ammonia until the tank cycles. I would do a partial water change, but others would probably suggest against it. Emily Cher <sdkeppler@...> wrote: Ok an artical in your files states if the amonia is high in your tank to do a 10-15% water change daily at least once until the amonia and Nitrite are at zero. My nitrite is at zero but my amonia is still at 4.0 even with the water change. Do I do another till it reaches zero or what?? I am not feeding my fish this is there secound day without food. Please post this soon I am new to this. Thank you for any help you can give me....Cher Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11952	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/1/2005
Subject: TankGurls got a nice tank.

Kelly i really like both of your tanks... Your very artistic! > - > 65g Malawi > http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 > 135g Frontosa/Tang > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011 > > =Nick

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11953	From: Paul N. Chung	Date: 6/1/2005
Subject: Re: Digest Number 792: Virus Help !

Hello, Hey, I just wanna share this experienced of mine. I used to use Norton AntiVirus. But sad to say, it couldn't really trace all virus and spyware. For me, the best Anti-Virus is still "Trend Micro Pc-cillin." just goto trend micro online virus check. And check your pc. For anti-spyware, just download and use "Ad Aware" freeware which you can download at http://www.download.com Hope this helps! Paulo --- Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote: > yep, most it people advocate other email programs > than ms outlook due to ms's low security but > high user friendliness programs. at my former > company, the mis/it guy told me eudora is better > than outlook when it comes to security. however, the > best bet is to not open attachments unless > you're expecting them, or verify with the sender > that they knowingly sent them to you. and of > course, don't download anything off the web unless > you know it's secure. always keep your > anti-virus programs current! > > and if you have access to these programs, do a > norton cleaning on your computer now and install > spyware & ad blocker software onto your computer. > these methods are not 100% effective but are > better than not doing anything. > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11954	From: TankGurl	Date: 6/1/2005
Subject: Re: Starting up a new tank

On 6/1/05, knelson1701 <knelson1701@...> wrote: > Kelly, > > Do you know of any websites that sell Bio Spira? I am having > problems finding it. Thanks. > @yahoogroups.com Yup. http://fishstoretn.com/bio_spira.html Good prices, quick delivery. -- 65g Malawi http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 135g Frontosa/Tang http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11955	From: TankGurl	Date: 6/1/2005
Subject: Re: TankGurls got a nice tank.

Thanks :) I like them alot too. They both just got some new additions last night as I ordered some F1's from a dealer in San Jose. (Burundi Frontosa, Inkfin Calvus and Ruby Red Peacocks) It was a long 14 hour trip for them to Ontario but all arrived alive and minimally stressed. Kelly On 6/1/05, Nicolas Munro <nmunro@...> wrote: > Kelly i really like both of your tanks... Your very artistic! > > > > - > > 65g Malawi > > http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl > > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 > > 135g Frontosa/Tang > > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011 > > > > > > > =Nick > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > -- 65g Malawi http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 135g Frontosa/Tang http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11956	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/1/2005
Subject: Re: TankGurls got a nice tank.

what are F1's? ----- Original Message ----- From: "TankGurl" <fishgoddess@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2005 9:58 AM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] TankGurls got a nice tank. > Thanks :) I like them alot too. They both just got some new additions > last night as I ordered some F1's from a dealer in San Jose. (Burundi > Frontosa, Inkfin Calvus and Ruby Red Peacocks) > > It was a long 14 hour trip for them to Ontario but all arrived alive > and minimally stressed. > > Kelly > > > > On 6/1/05, Nicolas Munro <nmunro@...> wrote: >> Kelly i really like both of your tanks... Your very artistic! >> >> >> > - >> > 65g Malawi >> > http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl >> > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 >> > 135g Frontosa/Tang >> > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011 >> > >> > >> >> >> =Nick >> >> >> >> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks >> . >> Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important >> to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the >> subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank >> You in Advance for your help in this matter >> Yahoo! Groups Links >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > -- > 65g Malawi > http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 > 135g Frontosa/Tang > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011 > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11957	From: paul helms	Date: 6/1/2005
Subject: Re: Starting up a new tank

the jury is still out on that one...lol --- TankGurl <fishgoddess@...> wrote: > A quick alternative would be the use of Bio Spira. > One dose, fish can > be introduced safely within 24 hrs. The stuff works > like a dream. > > Kelly > > On 5/31/05, paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > cycle it first.....use something like stress zyme > with > > live bacteria and a food source in the bottle. > > --- cynthia brennemann <brennewoman@...> > > wrote: > > > Okay, I know there is a lot of disagreement over > > > fishless/vs fish > > > cycling of a new tank. I am going to go > fishless, > > > for the simple fact > > > that I want my plants well established before I > add > > > fish, to prevent > > > the uprooting problems. I also want to take my > time > > > and get exactly > > > what I want instead of just impulse buying fish. > I > > > would like to get > > > some shrimp, ghost shrimp and cherry fire shrimp > to > > > put into the tank > > > and let them get acclimated and maybe start > > > reproducing before I put > > > the fish in. Would it be better to let the tank > > > complete the fishless > > > cycle before I put them in? Or can they be put > in > > > as soon after the > > > tank is set up as I want without harming them? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > > Discover Yahoo! > > Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online and > more. Check it out! > > http://discover.yahoo.com/ > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > when replying, thanks > > . > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text > that is not important to the reply and if changing > the topic of the original message modify the subject > line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, > we Thank You in Advance for your help in this > matter > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > 65g Malawi > http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 > 135g Frontosa/Tang > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011 > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11958	From: Eric Miner	Date: 6/1/2005
Subject: Re: Starting up a new tank

I'm about 10 days into a fishless-cycling using Bio-Spira. Right now I'm getting close to the nitrite spike. I was a little skeptical of the 24 hour claim so decided for the fishless cycle. I'll keep youi posted on the cycle's progress. Eric 46 gl tank, used the Bio-Spira packet for 90 gls. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms <wtfmorlok@y...> wrote: > > the jury is still out on that one...lol > --- TankGurl <fishgoddess@g...> wrote: > > > A quick alternative would be the use of Bio Spira. > > One dose, fish can > > be introduced safely within 24 hrs. The stuff works > > like a dream. > > > > Kelly > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11959	From: Karen	Date: 6/1/2005
Subject: Re: limestone ph buffer

I posted a photo of my tank with about 300# of Texas Holey Rock (Honeycomb limestone). It keeps the pH around 8.2. Karen --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "pondat2001" <pondat2001@y...> wrote: > Thanks so much for the prompt reply. I will try that as well. > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, TankGurl <fishgoddess@g...> wrote: > > A chunk of limestone rock will do the trick well too. > > > > Kelly > > > >> -- > > 65g Malawi > > http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl > > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 > > 135g Frontosa/Tang > > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11960	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 6/1/2005
Subject: Re: Starting up a new tank

Well fish aren't going to be in the tank for a while. I'd like to take my time with this one. Can I just use the fish water from my daughters tanks to cycle it? There has never been any disease in either tank, other than the popey in the female betta, and I think that was due to being picked on by the shark.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11961	From: paul helms	Date: 6/1/2005
Subject: Re: Starting up a new tank

the water will have some bacteria in it, but it really won't cycle any faster than using stress zyme or fritz zyme or the like. --- cynthia brennemann <brennewoman@...> wrote: > Well fish aren't going to be in the tank for a > while. I'd like to take > my time with this one. Can I just use the fish > water from my daughters > tanks to cycle it? There has never been any disease > in either tank, > other than the popey in the female betta, and I > think that was due to > being picked on by the shark. > > > > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Stay in touch with email, IM, photo sharing and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/stayintouch.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11962	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 6/1/2005
Subject: Re: Digest Number 792: Virus Help !

Er. Macs are userfriendly. Just that they run on their own hardware. _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Patrick, AAFG Sent: 01 June 2005 23:17 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Digest Number 792: Virus Help ! When they make a mac that is user friendly, we'll be driving pickup trucks on Mars and no computer virus will exist any more. :) Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill -------Original Message------- not at all, i just get exhausted listening to PC people babble about viruses and spyware all the time. Amalthea [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter _____ Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11963	From: Charlene	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Filters I need to see if i brought the right Filers for my tank

Hi Ok Now I have for my salt water tank. A sump, and Wet and Dry, and Fluval 404 Filter Canister, and 2 Overflow Box. Is that all I have to have for my 55 ga tank. Or do I have to buy more filter or did i brought to much. And watch one should I hook them up, if i have to have 1 or 2 filters. Thank you for helping me again. Charlene muffin4494@...

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11964	From: TankGurl	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: TankGurls got a nice tank.

F1's are the offspring of wild caught specimens. Kelly On 6/1/05, Nicolas Munro <nmunro@...> wrote: > what are F1's? > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "TankGurl" <fishgoddess@...> > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2005 9:58 AM > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] TankGurls got a nice tank. > > > > Thanks :) I like them alot too. They both just got some new additions > > last night as I ordered some F1's from a dealer in San Jose. (Burundi > > Frontosa, Inkfin Calvus and Ruby Red Peacocks) > > > > It was a long 14 hour trip for them to Ontario but all arrived alive > > and minimally stressed. > > > > Kelly > > > > > > > > On 6/1/05, Nicolas Munro <nmunro@...> wrote: > >> Kelly i really like both of your tanks... Your very artistic! > >> > >> > >> > - > >> > 65g Malawi > >> > http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl > >> > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 > >> > 135g Frontosa/Tang > >> > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011 > >> > > >> > > >> > >> > >> =Nick > >> > >> > >> > >> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > >> . > >> Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important > >> to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > >> subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank > >> You in Advance for your help in this matter > >> Yahoo! Groups Links > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > > > > > > -- > > 65g Malawi > > http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl > > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 > > 135g Frontosa/Tang > > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011 > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > > . > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > > in Advance for your help in this matter > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > -- 65g Malawi http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 135g Frontosa/Tang http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11965	From: TankGurl	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Starting up a new tank

On 6/1/05, paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > the jury is still out on that one...lol The jury is out on BioSpira or quick delivery? Kelly -- 65g Malawi http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 135g Frontosa/Tang http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11966	From: wendie	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Starting up a new tank

I used BioSpira with excellent results. Fish went in the next day without a loss. No cloudy conditions. No problems. Wendie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of TankGurl Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2005 8:03 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Starting up a new tank On 6/1/05, paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > the jury is still out on that one...lol The jury is out on BioSpira or quick delivery? Kelly -- 65g Malawi http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 135g Frontosa/Tang http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011 Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- Yahoo! Groups Links a.. To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11967	From: Robert Hickey	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Starting up a new tank

I used cycle And put fish in within 2 days ( on a smaller tank) and it Worked fine, a month later and the tank is still fine. :o) Irish Rob Regards Robert Hickey Robert Hickey | Networks Engineer Citywest Business Park | BT | Tel: +353 (0)1 43258749 | Mob: +353 (0)86 8061840 | E: robert.hickey@... | www.btireland.ie ----- Original Message ----- From: wendie To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2005 2:18 PM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Starting up a new tank I used BioSpira with excellent results. Fish went in the next day without a loss. No cloudy conditions. No problems. Wendie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of TankGurl Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2005 8:03 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Starting up a new tank On 6/1/05, paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > the jury is still out on that one...lol The jury is out on BioSpira or quick delivery? Kelly -- 65g Malawi http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 135g Frontosa/Tang http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011 Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- Yahoo! Groups Links a.. To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Links a.. To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11968	From: TankGurl	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Starting up a new tank

On 6/2/05, wendie <wendieo@...> wrote: > I used BioSpira with excellent results. Fish went in the next day without a > loss. No cloudy conditions. No problems. Yes, my experience has been the same. I also help some friends setup both freshwater and saltwater tanks using it and it worked like a charm. No fish loss, no parameter stress, no bloom, no new tank syndrome. Personally, I'll never do a *regular* cycle again. It saves me time, waiting and the loss of fish. Kelly -- 65g Malawi http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 135g Frontosa/Tang http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11969	From: wendie	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Starting up a new tank

It's really good. I had to add a large number of fish... way too many for the tank... and nothing happened. I'll be using it again shortly on two other new tanks. Wendie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of TankGurl Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2005 8:48 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Starting up a new tank On 6/2/05, wendie <wendieo@...> wrote: > I used BioSpira with excellent results. Fish went in the next day without a > loss. No cloudy conditions. No problems. Yes, my experience has been the same. I also help some friends setup both freshwater and saltwater tanks using it and it worked like a charm. No fish loss, no parameter stress, no bloom, no new tank syndrome. Personally, I'll never do a *regular* cycle again. It saves me time, waiting and the loss of fish. Kelly -- 65g Malawi http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 135g Frontosa/Tang http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011 Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- Yahoo! Groups Links a.. To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11970	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Starting up a new tank

Same here. Love BioSpira. Very glad there's a store near where I just moved that keeps it in stock. Have started 4 tanks with it and used it when I moved those tanks and had no loss or "new tank syndrom" Just realized. As of July 12, my 3 blue gouramis will be 6 years. Considering I was told a max of 4 and they've been with me since I first got into keeping tropical fish (means they've been through a lot of mistakes) guess I'm very lucky! lol ----- Original Message ----- From: "TankGurl" <fishgoddess@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2005 6:47 AM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Starting up a new tank > On 6/2/05, wendie <wendieo@...> wrote: > > I used BioSpira with excellent results. Fish went in the next day without a > > loss. No cloudy conditions. No problems. > > Yes, my experience has been the same. I also help some friends setup > both freshwater and saltwater tanks using it and it worked like a > charm. No fish loss, no parameter stress, no bloom, no new tank > syndrome. Personally, I'll never do a *regular* cycle again. It saves > me time, waiting and the loss of fish. > > Kelly > > > > -- > 65g Malawi > http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 > 135g Frontosa/Tang > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011 > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11971	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Bio Spira

My stores don't carry Bio Spira here, or anywhere near that I can tell. But they both have one called Cycle and stress zyme. She said that these only produce anorobic bacteria and the tank needs more than that so it will take up to 2 weeks to cycle. Would the other things she mentioned work the same? I ask because I have only heard of the Bio Spira on the fish groups. And I understand it that you can add the fish much earlier if used but she said no way. I don't want to go buy this other stuff if it isn't the same thing. Thanks Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11972	From: Sheila	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!

We lost our first clownfish this morning and we only got him last Saturday. When we got him, we put him in our established tank with a female Blue Damselfish, a Coral Banded Shrimp, and a green Hermit Crab. From the start, he was rapidly opening and closing his mouth non-stop. I called the pet store and they told me that was normal for clownfish. Over the next few days, he wasn't eating and would stay in one corner of the tank. Then he began hanging out at the water line like he was trying to get air. I did tests on the water - salinity, amonia, nitrite, nitrate - it all tested fine. Now the new Clarkii clowns we got this morning are doing the same mouth thing, like they are breathing very rapidly. They did eat a bit earlier and do not appear to be stressed, but are they supposed to open and close their mouths constantly? The Blue Damselfish doesn't do that. Please - any advice would be appreciated! Is there something else that might be wrong with the water? Do we need an airstone or air pump? We have a BIO Wheel filter, a heater and the temp is around 80. Please help - I don't want to lose these two fish!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11973	From: natalieranae	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Hi, need some advice

HI, I'm new. My name is Natalie. I Have had aquariums off and on for several years. Right now I have 2 bettas in individual tanks, then I also have a 29 gallon that has 2 goldfish, 4 neons 2 hatchet fish, 2 snails, and 2 corydoras and 1 upside down catfish. I also have a 10 gallon tank with 3 dwarf gouramis. I am looking for an aquarium change soon. I have had my current fish for quite a while and want to down size to just the one 29 gallon tank instead of using the 10 gallon. I don't know whether to find homes for the goldfish and go all tropical, or get rid of some/all of the tropicals and keep only goldfish. I know the 10 gallon rule so if I keep the goldfish I think it better to keep only 2 or 3 without tropicals in there. I really like goldfish because of their bubbly personalitys. I have 1 telescope eyed orange goldfish, and 1 red cap oranda. They come to the top be hand fed in the mornings. The problem with them though is when I go on vacation how to have the family member feed them like I would. Their food needs pre-soaked and one only eats out of my hand. So... it makes keeping goldfish more complicated. Tropicals are certainly easier, less mess, etc. So which way should I go? If tropicals, what should I keep in the tank? I have a real nice local fish store that will take fish and that hardly ever have sick fish. They are a small family owned store, so once I figure out what sort of setup I want to have I will talk to them about taking the ones I am not keeping.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11974	From: paul helms	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Filters I need to see if i brought the right Filers for my tank

you need a protein skimmer for that tanhk if it is saltwater --- Charlene wrote: > Hi Ok Now I have for my salt water tank. A sump, > and Wet and Dry, and > Fluval 404 Filter Canister, and 2 Overflow Box. Is > that all I have to > have for my 55 ga tank. Or do I have to buy more > filter or did i > brought to much. And watch one should I hook them > up, if i have to have > 1 or 2 filters. Thank you for helping me again. > Charlene > muffin4494@...

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11975	From: paul helms	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Starting up a new tank

biospira....i have seen a alot of systems crash within 6 months of using it. --- TankGurl <fishgoddess@...> wrote: > On 6/1/05, paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > > the jury is still out on that one...lol > > The jury is out on BioSpira or quick delivery? > > Kelly > > > -- > 65g Malawi > http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 > 135g Frontosa/Tang > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011 > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11976	From: Trevor Holyoak	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Filters I need to see if i brought the right Filers for my tank

Although protein skimmers aren't absolutely required, they are definitely recommended. :) Also, you can actually do without _any_ filters, and just use the natural filtration of live rock (and optionally live sand). Just live rock, some powerheads, and (optionally) a protein skimmer are all you really need for filtration. - Trevor paul helms wrote: > you need a protein skimmer for that tanhk if it is > saltwater > > --- Charlene wrote: > > > Hi Ok Now I have for my salt water tank. A sump, > > and Wet and Dry, and > > Fluval 404 Filter Canister, and 2 Overflow Box. Is > > that all I have to > > have for my 55 ga tank. Or do I have to buy more > > filter or did i > > brought to much. And watch one should I hook them > > up, if i have to have > > 1 or 2 filters. Thank you for helping me again. > > Charlene > > muffin4494@... > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not > important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original > message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > *Yahoo! Groups Links* > > * To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>. > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11977	From: TankGurl	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Bio Spira

It sounds like she isn't familiar with Bio Spira and some folks think it's too good to be true. Cycle takes longer. From what I understand, it starts the cycle, whereas Bio Spira is the cycle in a package. You *must* add fish within 24 hrs of introducing the BioSpira or you will lose the process. I can't get this stuff here in Ontario, so I order from these people: http://fishstoretn.com/bio_spira.html If you do a Google search, you may find other online dealers. My experience with the above store has been very good. If you don't use the entire package, you can keep it in the fridge for up to 6 months, to either cycle another tank or help a tank that develops a bloom from over cleaning or whatever. I keep a package in my fridge, just in case. (i.e. just in case another tank follows me home from the lfs :) Kelly On 6/2/05, Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: > My stores don't carry Bio Spira here, or anywhere near that I can tell. > But they both have one called Cycle and stress zyme. She said that > these only produce anorobic bacteria and the tank needs more than that > so it will take up to 2 weeks to cycle. > > Would the other things she mentioned work the same? I ask because I > have only heard of the Bio Spira on the fish groups. And I understand > it that you can add the fish much earlier if used but she said no way. > I don't want to go buy this other stuff if it isn't the same thing. > > Thanks > Leslie > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > -- 65g Malawi http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 135g Frontosa/Tang http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11978	From: TankGurl	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Starting up a new tank

On 6/2/05, paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > biospira....i have seen a alot of systems crash within > 6 months of using it. I would guess that the crash was the result of keeper interference. By 6 months, the tank is established via its own manufactured bacteria. The BioSpira would be long gone. I really don't want to sound like I have shares in BioSpira stock here....but my experience with this has been wonderful. 6 tanks and counting... Kelly -- 65g Malawi http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 135g Frontosa/Tang http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11979	From: Trevor	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: TankGurls got a nice tank.

What are you going to do with all your frontosa's when they grow up? - Trevor --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, TankGurl <fishgoddess@g...> wrote: > Thanks :) I like them alot too. They both just got some new additions > last night as I ordered some F1's from a dealer in San Jose. (Burundi > Frontosa, Inkfin Calvus and Ruby Red Peacocks) > > It was a long 14 hour trip for them to Ontario but all arrived alive > and minimally stressed. > > Kelly > > > > On 6/1/05, Nicolas Munro <nmunro@q...> wrote: > > Kelly i really like both of your tanks... Your very artistic! > > > > > > > - > > > 65g Malawi > > > http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl > > > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 > > > 135g Frontosa/Tang > > > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011 > > > > > > > > > > > > =Nick > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > > . > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > 65g Malawi > http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 > 135g Frontosa/Tang > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11980	From: Paul N. Chung	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Filters I need to see if i brought the right Filers for my tank

Hey, Aside from protein skimmer, you could also used a chiller so that you can maintain your tank temperature at 26degree celcius. And ... 1. Chiller with digital temp controller- to maintain water temperature at 26 +/- 2 degrees. heat exchanger should be made of titanium. 2. Protein Skimmer and pump with water turn-over rate at once every hour. You don't want your tank to be ultra clean when you have corals. Corals eat the suspended particles in the wate column. 3. Strong lights - preferably metal halides with 10,000K or 20,000K color temp bulbs. Two 250 Watts minimum for a 100 gallon tank. 4. Main circulation pump - atleast 4 times turn-over rate. 5. Wave maker - atleast 6 times turn over rate with random shut-off and turn-on to simulate current going back and forth...just like in the sea. 6. Calcium reactor with CO2 injection system or nielsen calcium hydroxide reactor 7. Sump - to connect main circulation pump and protein skimmer pump 8. grounding probe - to ensure that you don't get electric shock. 9. thermometer (digital or analog) 10. specific gravity meter or refractometer 11. ph test kit or ph meter. plus your water chemistry should be 1. specific gravity - 1.025 2. calcium - 450ppm 3. ph - 8.3 4. nitrate - zero or near zero 5. phosphate - zero or near zero 6. strongtium - ? 7. magnesium - ? 8. iodine - ? --- Trevor Holyoak <trevor@...> wrote: > Although protein skimmers aren't absolutely > required, they are > definitely recommended. :) > > Also, you can actually do without _any_ filters, and > just use the > natural filtration of live rock (and optionally live > sand). Just live > rock, some powerheads, and (optionally) a protein > skimmer are all you > really need for filtration. > > - Trevor > > paul helms wrote: > > > you need a protein skimmer for that tanhk if it is > > saltwater > > > > --- Charlene wrote: > > > > > Hi Ok Now I have for my salt water tank. A > sump, > > > and Wet and Dry, and > > > Fluval 404 Filter Canister, and 2 Overflow Box. > Is > > > that all I have to > > > have for my 55 ga tank. Or do I have to buy more > > > filter or did i > > > brought to much. And watch one should I hook > them > > > up, if i have to have > > > 1 or 2 filters. Thank you for helping me again. > > > Charlene > > > muffin4494@... > > > > > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11981	From: Trevor Holyoak	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Filters I need to see if i brought the right Filers for my tank

Sounds like somebody's either a dealer or they have too much money on their hands. :D - Trevor Paul N. Chung wrote: > Hey, > > Aside from protein skimmer, you could also used a > chiller so that you can maintain your tank temperature > at 26degree celcius. And ... > 1. Chiller with digital temp controller- to maintain > water temperature at 26 +/- 2 degrees. heat exchanger > should be made of titanium. > 2. Protein Skimmer and pump with water turn-over rate > at once every hour. You don't want your tank to be > ultra clean when you have corals. Corals eat the > suspended particles in the wate column. > 3. Strong lights - preferably metal halides with > 10,000K or 20,000K color temp bulbs. Two 250 Watts > minimum for a 100 gallon tank. > 4. Main circulation pump - atleast 4 times turn-over > rate. > 5. Wave maker - atleast 6 times turn over rate with > random shut-off and turn-on to simulate current going > back and forth...just like in the sea. > 6. Calcium reactor with CO2 injection system or > nielsen calcium hydroxide reactor > 7. Sump - to connect main circulation pump and protein > skimmer pump > 8. grounding probe - to ensure that you don't get > electric shock. > 9. thermometer (digital or analog) > 10. specific gravity meter or refractometer > 11. ph test kit or ph meter. > plus your water chemistry should be > 1. specific gravity - 1.025 > 2. calcium - 450ppm > 3. ph - 8.3 > 4. nitrate - zero or near zero > 5. phosphate - zero or near zero > 6. strongtium - ? > 7. magnesium - ? > 8. iodine - ? > > > --- Trevor Holyoak <trevor@...> wrote: > > > Although protein skimmers aren't absolutely > > required, they are > > definitely recommended. :) > > > > Also, you can actually do without _any_ filters, and > > just use the > > natural filtration of live rock (and optionally live > > sand). Just live > > rock, some powerheads, and (optionally) a protein > > skimmer are all you > > really need for filtration. > > > > - Trevor > > > > paul helms wrote: > > > > > you need a protein skimmer for that tanhk if it is > > > saltwater > > > > > > --- Charlene wrote: > > > > > > > Hi Ok Now I have for my salt water tank. A > > sump, > > > > and Wet and Dry, and > > > > Fluval 404 Filter Canister, and 2 Overflow Box. > > Is > > > > that all I have to > > > > have for my 55 ga tank. Or do I have to buy more > > > > filter or did i > > > > brought to much. And watch one should I hook > > them > > > > up, if i have to have > > > > 1 or 2 filters. Thank you for helping me again. > > > > Charlene > > > > muffin4494@... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > Discover Yahoo! > Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online and more. Check it out! > http://discover.yahoo.com/ > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not > important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original > message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > *Yahoo! Groups Links* > > * To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>. > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11982	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Bio Spira

I will admit, I am still surprised at how many fish stores in my area have never even heard of Bio Spira. My favorite has, but he's not a dealer of the stuff. The only LFS that has it near me is for the most part strictly SW and ponds, but thankfully he also gets the FW Bio Spira. Yea. I will admit, I was very leary of it at first, but like you, I try to keep some handy for just in case. ----- Original Message ----- From: "TankGurl" <fishgoddess@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2005 3:07 PM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Bio Spira > It sounds like she isn't familiar with Bio Spira and some folks think > it's too good to be true. Cycle takes longer. From what I understand, > it starts the cycle, whereas Bio Spira is the cycle in a package. You > *must* add fish within 24 hrs of introducing the BioSpira or you will > lose the process. I can't get this stuff here in Ontario, so I order > from these people: > > http://fishstoretn.com/bio_spira.html > > If you do a Google search, you may find other online dealers. My > experience with the above store has been very good. If you don't use > the entire package, you can keep it in the fridge for up to 6 months, > to either cycle another tank or help a tank that develops a bloom from > over cleaning or whatever. I keep a package in my fridge, just in > case. (i.e. just in case another tank follows me home from the lfs :) > > Kelly > > On 6/2/05, Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: > > My stores don't carry Bio Spira here, or anywhere near that I can tell. > > But they both have one called Cycle and stress zyme. She said that > > these only produce anorobic bacteria and the tank needs more than that > > so it will take up to 2 weeks to cycle. > > > > Would the other things she mentioned work the same? I ask because I > > have only heard of the Bio Spira on the fish groups. And I understand > > it that you can add the fish much earlier if used but she said no way. > > I don't want to go buy this other stuff if it isn't the same thing. > > > > Thanks > > Leslie > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > > . > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > 65g Malawi > http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 > 135g Frontosa/Tang > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011 > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11983	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Starting up a new tank

By then the bio spira should be well gone and you should have a well established tank. Sounds like something happened like maybe an over clear or something new introduced. 4 tanks started and helped restarted after a move with Bio Spira and hopefully sooner or later more. ----- Original Message ----- From: "paul helms" <wtfmorlok@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2005 9:44 AM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Starting up a new tank > biospira....i have seen a alot of systems crash within > 6 months of using it. > > --- TankGurl <fishgoddess@...> wrote: > > > On 6/1/05, paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > > > > the jury is still out on that one...lol > > > > The jury is out on BioSpira or quick delivery? > > > > Kelly > > > > > > -- > > 65g Malawi > > http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl > > > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 > > 135g Frontosa/Tang > > > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011 > > > > > > > __________________________________ > Discover Yahoo! > Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online and more. Check it out! > http://discover.yahoo.com/ > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11984	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Filters I need to see if i brought the right Filers for my tank

lol I use the cheap chiller when it starts getting too warm. I move the canister filter into a flat bottom tupperware bowl and add some ice in the bowl like a cooler. :D Between that and my heater, works pretty good. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Trevor Holyoak" <trevor@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2005 3:28 PM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Filters I need to see if i brought the right Filers for my tank > Sounds like somebody's either a dealer or they have too much money on > their hands. :D > > - Trevor > > Paul N. Chung wrote: > > > Hey, > > > > Aside from protein skimmer, you could also used a > > chiller so that you can maintain your tank temperature > > at 26degree celcius. And ... > > 1. Chiller with digital temp controller- to maintain > > water temperature at 26 +/- 2 degrees. heat exchanger > > should be made of titanium. > > 2. Protein Skimmer and pump with water turn-over rate > > at once every hour. You don't want your tank to be > > ultra clean when you have corals. Corals eat the > > suspended particles in the wate column. > > 3. Strong lights - preferably metal halides with > > 10,000K or 20,000K color temp bulbs. Two 250 Watts > > minimum for a 100 gallon tank. > > 4. Main circulation pump - atleast 4 times turn-over > > rate. > > 5. Wave maker - atleast 6 times turn over rate with > > random shut-off and turn-on to simulate current going > > back and forth...just like in the sea. > > 6. Calcium reactor with CO2 injection system or > > nielsen calcium hydroxide reactor > > 7. Sump - to connect main circulation pump and protein > > skimmer pump > > 8. grounding probe - to ensure that you don't get > > electric shock. > > 9. thermometer (digital or analog) > > 10. specific gravity meter or refractometer > > 11. ph test kit or ph meter. > > plus your water chemistry should be > > 1. specific gravity - 1.025 > > 2. calcium - 450ppm > > 3. ph - 8.3 > > 4. nitrate - zero or near zero > > 5. phosphate - zero or near zero > > 6. strongtium - ? > > 7. magnesium - ? > > 8. iodine - ? > > > > > > --- Trevor Holyoak <trevor@...> wrote: > > > > > Although protein skimmers aren't absolutely > > > required, they are > > > definitely recommended. :) > > > > > > Also, you can actually do without _any_ filters, and > > > just use the > > > natural filtration of live rock (and optionally live > > > sand). Just live > > > rock, some powerheads, and (optionally) a protein > > > skimmer are all you > > > really need for filtration. > > > > > > - Trevor > > > > > > paul helms wrote: > > > > > > > you need a protein skimmer for that tanhk if it is > > > > saltwater > > > > > > > > --- Charlene wrote: > > > > > > > > > Hi Ok Now I have for my salt water tank. A > > > sump, > > > > > and Wet and Dry, and > > > > > Fluval 404 Filter Canister, and 2 Overflow Box. > > > Is > > > > > that all I have to > > > > > have for my 55 ga tank. Or do I have to buy more > > > > > filter or did i > > > > > brought to much. And watch one should I hook > > > them > > > > > up, if i have to have > > > > > 1 or 2 filters. Thank you for helping me again. > > > > > Charlene > > > > > muffin4494@... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > > Discover Yahoo! > > Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online and more. Check it out! > > http://discover.yahoo.com/ > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > > . > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not > > important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original > > message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > > subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > *Yahoo! Groups Links* > > > > * To visit your group on the web, go to: > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > > Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>. > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11985	From: Trevor Holyoak	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Filters I need to see if i brought the right Filers for my tank

I have my saltwater tank in my basement, so I never have any overheating problems. :) Of course, I'm only running two fluorescent tubes on it. Since people aren't comfortable over 78 degrees, the air conditioner keeps my other tanks from overheating. :D - Trevor The Dragon Hunter wrote: > lol I use the cheap chiller when it starts getting too warm. I move the > canister filter into a flat bottom tupperware bowl and add some ice in the > bowl like a cooler. :D Between that and my heater, works pretty good. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Trevor Holyoak" <trevor@...> > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2005 3:28 PM > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Filters I need to see if i brought the right > Filers for my tank > > > > Sounds like somebody's either a dealer or they have too much money on > > their hands. :D > > > > - Trevor > > > > Paul N. Chung wrote: > > > > > Hey, > > > > > > Aside from protein skimmer, you could also used a > > > chiller so that you can maintain your tank temperature > > > at 26degree celcius. And ... > > > 1. Chiller with digital temp controller- to maintain > > > water temperature at 26 +/- 2 degrees. heat exchanger > > > should be made of titanium. > > > 2. Protein Skimmer and pump with water turn-over rate > > > at once every hour. You don't want your tank to be > > > ultra clean when you have corals. Corals eat the > > > suspended particles in the wate column. > > > 3. Strong lights - preferably metal halides with > > > 10,000K or 20,000K color temp bulbs. Two 250 Watts > > > minimum for a 100 gallon tank. > > > 4. Main circulation pump - atleast 4 times turn-over > > > rate. > > > 5. Wave maker - atleast 6 times turn over rate with > > > random shut-off and turn-on to simulate current going > > > back and forth...just like in the sea. > > > 6. Calcium reactor with CO2 injection system or > > > nielsen calcium hydroxide reactor > > > 7. Sump - to connect main circulation pump and protein > > > skimmer pump > > > 8. grounding probe - to ensure that you don't get > > > electric shock. > > > 9. thermometer (digital or analog) > > > 10. specific gravity meter or refractometer > > > 11. ph test kit or ph meter. > > > plus your water chemistry should be > > > 1. specific gravity - 1.025 > > > 2. calcium - 450ppm > > > 3. ph - 8.3 > > > 4. nitrate - zero or near zero > > > 5. phosphate - zero or near zero > > > 6. strongtium - ? > > > 7. magnesium - ? > > > 8. iodine - ? > > > > > > > > > --- Trevor Holyoak <trevor@...> wrote: > > > > > > > Although protein skimmers aren't absolutely > > > > required, they are > > > > definitely recommended. :) > > > > > > > > Also, you can actually do without _any_ filters, and > > > > just use the > > > > natural filtration of live rock (and optionally live > > > > sand). Just live > > > > rock, some powerheads, and (optionally) a protein > > > > skimmer are all you > > > > really need for filtration. > > > > > > > > - Trevor > > > > > > > > paul helms wrote: > > > > > > > > > you need a protein skimmer for that tanhk if it is > > > > > saltwater > > > > > > > > > > --- Charlene wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Hi Ok Now I have for my salt water tank. A > > > > sump, > > > > > > and Wet and Dry, and > > > > > > Fluval 404 Filter Canister, and 2 Overflow Box. > > > > Is > > > > > > that all I have to > > > > > > have for my 55 ga tank. Or do I have to buy more > > > > > > filter or did i > > > > > > brought to much. And watch one should I hook > > > > them > > > > > > up, if i have to have > > > > > > 1 or 2 filters. Thank you for helping me again. > > > > > > Charlene > > > > > > muffin4494@... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > > > Discover Yahoo! > > > Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online and more. Check it out! > > > http://discover.yahoo.com/ > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > > > . > > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not > > > important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original > > > message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > > > subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > *Yahoo! Groups Links* > > > > > > * To visit your group on the web, go to: > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > > > Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > > . > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not > important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not > important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original > message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > *Yahoo! Groups Links* > > * To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>. > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11986	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!

I remember the people on here talking about nitrites and toxic locations around drains etc. Someone said if you were to put a fish from a petshop which comes from perfect water conditions into that invironment they would die but because the fish around the toxic place had aclimatised to it they would survive. Im only guessing here but it might be a good idea to check with the petstore where you got them from to find out what there water conditions are... it could be that the fish arnt used to your perfect conditions and hence find it a bit toxic? just an idea not sure if it applys to your case. =Nick ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sheila" <smccamy@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Friday, June 03, 2005 7:22 AM Subject: [AquaticLife] One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help! > We lost our first clownfish this morning and we only got him last > Saturday. When we got him, we put him in our established tank with a > female Blue Damselfish, a Coral Banded Shrimp, and a green Hermit Crab. >>From the start, he was rapidly opening and closing his mouth non-stop. > I called the pet store and they told me that was normal for clownfish. > Over the next few days, he wasn't eating and would stay in one corner > of the tank. Then he began hanging out at the water line like he was > trying to get air. I did tests on the water - salinity, amonia, > nitrite, nitrate - it all tested fine. Now the new Clarkii clowns we > got this morning are doing the same mouth thing, like they are > breathing very rapidly. They did eat a bit earlier and do not appear to > be stressed, but are they supposed to open and close their mouths > constantly? The Blue Damselfish doesn't do that. Please - any advice > would be appreciated! Is there something else that might be wrong with > the water? Do we need an airstone or air pump? We have a BIO Wheel > filter, a heater and the temp is around 80. Please help - I don't want > to lose these two fish! > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11987	From: TankGurl	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: TankGurls got a nice tank.

On 6/2/05, Trevor <trevor@...> wrote: > What are you going to do with all your frontosa's when they grow up? Well, the colony is now in a 135 gallon. I'll be culling them down to 5-6 when I can establish sex. The tank is large enough to accomodate a colony that size nicely. Kelly -- 65g Malawi http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 135g Frontosa/Tang http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11988	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Tank Gurl

Hay, do you have pics of the other tanks? ----- Original Message ----- From: "TankGurl" <fishgoddess@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Friday, June 03, 2005 8:12 AM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Starting up a new tank > On 6/2/05, paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: >> biospira....i have seen a alot of systems crash within >> 6 months of using it. > > I would guess that the crash was the result of keeper interference. By > 6 months, the tank is established via its own manufactured bacteria. > The BioSpira would be long gone. > > I really don't want to sound like I have shares in BioSpira stock > here....but my experience with this has been wonderful. 6 tanks and > counting... > > Kelly > > -- > 65g Malawi > http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 > 135g Frontosa/Tang > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011 > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11989	From: Patrick, AAFG	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Starting up a new tank

I would suspect it was the people using it. They probably were too confident and didn't do proper maintenance. Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill -------Original Message------- biospira....i have seen a alot of systems crash within 6 months of using it. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11990	From: paul helms	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Starting up a new tank

not a matter of cycling, the bioloads are often too high for the bio spira to hang on its own, and often time sthe water gets too polluted from the lack of sufficinet bacteria. i said within six months, not after six months...most have been at about 3 months. things can catch up in the end. there is also a difference between cycled and established. i personally don't consider anything established until it has been stable for a year. --- The Dragon Hunter <dragon.hunter@...> wrote: > By then the bio spira should be well gone and you > should have a well > established tank. Sounds like something happened > like maybe an over clear > or something new introduced. > > 4 tanks started and helped restarted after a move > with Bio Spira and > hopefully sooner or later more. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "paul helms" <wtfmorlok@...> > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2005 9:44 AM > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Starting up a new tank > > > > biospira....i have seen a alot of systems crash > within > > 6 months of using it. > > > > --- TankGurl <fishgoddess@...> wrote: > > > > > On 6/1/05, paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> > wrote: > > > > > > > > the jury is still out on that one...lol > > > > > > The jury is out on BioSpira or quick delivery? > > > > > > Kelly > > > > > > > > > -- > > > 65g Malawi > > > > http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl > > > > > > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 > > > 135g Frontosa/Tang > > > > > > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011 > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > > Discover Yahoo! > > Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online and > more. Check it out! > > http://discover.yahoo.com/ > > > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > when replying, thanks > > . > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text > that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original > message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11991	From: paul helms	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Starting up a new tank

6 monthjs is not an established tank...taht is still pretty immature --- TankGurl <fishgoddess@...> wrote: > On 6/2/05, paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > biospira....i have seen a alot of systems crash > within > > 6 months of using it. > > I would guess that the crash was the result of > keeper interference. By > 6 months, the tank is established via its own > manufactured bacteria. > The BioSpira would be long gone. > > I really don't want to sound like I have shares in > BioSpira stock > here....but my experience with this has been > wonderful. 6 tanks and > counting... > > Kelly > > -- > 65g Malawi > http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 > 135g Frontosa/Tang > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011 > __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour: http://tour.mail.yahoo.com/mailtour.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11992	From: paul helms	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!

first of all, damsels are aggressive and territorial, second if you have no protein skimmer i guarantee your nitrates are not fine. fish breathe hard liek that when they are suffering from nitrate poisoning. third 80 is too hot for a sw tank. --- Sheila <smccamy@...> wrote: > We lost our first clownfish this morning and we only > got him last > Saturday. When we got him, we put him in our > established tank with a > female Blue Damselfish, a Coral Banded Shrimp, and a > green Hermit Crab. > From the start, he was rapidly opening and closing > his mouth non-stop. > I called the pet store and they told me that was > normal for clownfish. > Over the next few days, he wasn't eating and would > stay in one corner > of the tank. Then he began hanging out at the water > line like he was > trying to get air. I did tests on the water - > salinity, amonia, > nitrite, nitrate - it all tested fine. Now the new > Clarkii clowns we > got this morning are doing the same mouth thing, > like they are > breathing very rapidly. They did eat a bit earlier > and do not appear to > be stressed, but are they supposed to open and close > their mouths > constantly? The Blue Damselfish doesn't do that. > Please - any advice > would be appreciated! Is there something else that > might be wrong with > the water? Do we need an airstone or air pump? We > have a BIO Wheel > filter, a heater and the temp is around 80. Please > help - I don't want > to lose these two fish! > > > > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/mobile.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11993	From: paul helms	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Bio Spira

it has a very short shelf life, and if it is not sold rapidly, it is lost money....and for a while they had problems with bad batches, making it expensive for the lfs. that is why many do not carry it. it also must be kept cold and many only have freezers --- The Dragon Hunter <dragon.hunter@...> wrote: > I will admit, I am still surprised at how many fish > stores in my area have > never even heard of Bio Spira. My favorite has, but > he's not a dealer of > the stuff. The only LFS that has it near me is for > the most part strictly > SW and ponds, but thankfully he also gets the FW Bio > Spira. > > Yea. I will admit, I was very leary of it at first, > but like you, I try to > keep some handy for just in case. > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "TankGurl" <fishgoddess@...> > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2005 3:07 PM > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Bio Spira > > > > It sounds like she isn't familiar with Bio Spira > and some folks think > > it's too good to be true. Cycle takes longer. From > what I understand, > > it starts the cycle, whereas Bio Spira is the > cycle in a package. You > > *must* add fish within 24 hrs of introducing the > BioSpira or you will > > lose the process. I can't get this stuff here in > Ontario, so I order > > from these people: > > > > http://fishstoretn.com/bio_spira.html > > > > If you do a Google search, you may find other > online dealers. My > > experience with the above store has been very > good. If you don't use > > the entire package, you can keep it in the fridge > for up to 6 months, > > to either cycle another tank or help a tank that > develops a bloom from > > over cleaning or whatever. I keep a package in my > fridge, just in > > case. (i.e. just in case another tank follows me > home from the lfs :) > > > > Kelly > > > > On 6/2/05, Dane & Leslie Moore > <amjmail@...> wrote: > > > My stores don't carry Bio Spira here, or > anywhere near that I can tell. > > > But they both have one called Cycle and stress > zyme. She said that > > > these only produce anorobic bacteria and the > tank needs more than that > > > so it will take up to 2 weeks to cycle. > > > > > > Would the other things she mentioned work the > same? I ask because I > > > have only heard of the Bio Spira on the fish > groups. And I understand > > > it that you can add the fish much earlier if > used but she said no way. > > > I don't want to go buy this other stuff if it > isn't the same thing. > > > > > > Thanks > > > Leslie > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > when replying, thanks > > > . > > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all > text that is not important > to the reply and if changing the topic of the > original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > 65g Malawi > > http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl > > > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 > > 135g Frontosa/Tang > > > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011 > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > when replying, thanks > > . > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text > that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original > message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11994	From: John Gonzalez	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Bio Spira

I would go with just Bio Spira. I use that on my Marine tank & it works great. Alot of reefers I've encountered use Bio-Spira & they say it helps the cycle of your tank. Here is a link to learn more about it... http://www.marineland.com/science/nspira.asp --- Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: > My stores don't carry Bio Spira here, or anywhere > near that I can tell. > But they both have one called Cycle and stress zyme. > She said that > these only produce anorobic bacteria and the tank > needs more than that > so it will take up to 2 weeks to cycle. > > Would the other things she mentioned work the same? > I ask because I > have only heard of the Bio Spira on the fish groups. > And I understand > it that you can add the fish much earlier if used > but she said no way. > I don't want to go buy this other stuff if it isn't > the same thing. > > Thanks > Leslie > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Stay in touch with email, IM, photo sharing and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/stayintouch.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11995	From: Rachel	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: to all replys for goldfish aquarium

thanks a lot for ur input. took me a long time to get back to check. and patrick i love that idea. my dads a carpenter (so he's got the hookup) and he's already told me he'll cut me a piece for the cover, so i'm going to get one for the bottom and 1 for each of my tanks as a top. i STILL havnt set up the shorter tank yet... been cooking and cleaning every day and goin out every night since i cant clean it after dark anyway. and to whomever it was that said no soap. ive got the full lowdown on how to clean it very well from previous posts i participated in. oh and i remembered 3 weeks late to add plant fertaliser after i moved back home n moved my 5 gal. and i put some in just yesterday or the day before and i see a big difference already. was worried about their color. Rock On. Rae

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11996	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 6/2/2005
Subject: Re: Filters I need to see if i brought the right Filers for my ...

In a message dated 6/2/2005 3:56:46 AM Pacific Daylight Time, muffin4494@... writes: Hi Ok Now I have for my salt water tank. A sump, and Wet and Dry, and Fluval 404 Filter Canister, and 2 Overflow Box. Is that all I have to have for my 55 ga tank. Or do I have to buy more filter or did i brought to much. And watch one should I hook them up, if i have to have 1 or 2 filters. Thank you for helping me again. Charlene muffin4494@... How big is the aquarium? Gallons? Dimensions? Glass or acrylic? I recall you mentioning you were going with saltwater, what do you plan on keeping in this tank? Is your wet dry setup complete? Do you have the hoses from the overflow to the wet/dry filter? filter material and bio balls? A power head or water pump to return water to the tank? Is the fluval 404 new? Mike [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11997	From: Charlene	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Filters Wet and dry

Hi Ok Now I need to know how can I make the wet and dry in to a sump. And what do i have to have for it. Also need to know how to set it up. Thank you for helping me again Charlene muffin4494@...

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11998	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Re: Starting up a new tank

Still, your blaiming a product and not the person. even within 3 months, with or without Bio-Spira a tank would have long completed a cycle. But I'm not going to argue with your experience. You are the only one that I have ever heard complain about it. I have never had a bad experience with it and with the exception of your posts, have never heard anyone complain about it. Just the opposite. Have heard nothing but praise before I first tried it. I swear by it and think its one of the best products I've used for my fish. And in your first sentense you negate bio-spira and any product that speeds up cycling by yourself pointing out that its the bioload. Over stocking would be a problem with any tank, regardless of how you cycle it. Keep in mind that Bio-Spira is so you don't have to cycle a tank. It is the end result of a cycle. If it were a problem with Bio-Spira, logically it would be fairly quickly since you must have fish in the tank with the bio-spira and you would have new tank syndrome shortly after it if it was the product. Clearly that isn't the case since even you state that most of ythe problems you have heard of are three months down the road, long after even a normal cycle would have completed without bio-spira or cycle or any other product. ----- Original Message ----- From: "paul helms" <wtfmorlok@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2005 8:37 PM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Starting up a new tank > not a matter of cycling, the bioloads are often too > high for the bio spira to hang on its own, and often > time sthe water gets too polluted from the lack of > sufficinet bacteria. i said within six months, not > after six months...most have been at about 3 months. > things can catch up in the end. there is also a > difference between cycled and established. i > personally don't consider anything established until > it has been stable for a year. > > --- The Dragon Hunter > <dragon.hunter@...> wrote: > > > By then the bio spira should be well gone and you > > should have a well > > established tank. Sounds like something happened > > like maybe an over clear > > or something new introduced. > > > > 4 tanks started and helped restarted after a move > > with Bio Spira and > > hopefully sooner or later more. > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "paul helms" <wtfmorlok@...> > > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > > Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2005 9:44 AM > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Starting up a new tank > > > > > > > biospira....i have seen a alot of systems crash > > within > > > 6 months of using it. > > > > > > --- TankGurl <fishgoddess@...> wrote: > > > > > > > On 6/1/05, paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > the jury is still out on that one...lol > > > > > > > > The jury is out on BioSpira or quick delivery? > > > > > > > > Kelly > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > 65g Malawi > > > > > > http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl > > > > > > > > > > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 > > > > 135g Frontosa/Tang > > > > > > > > > > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > > > Discover Yahoo! > > > Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online and > > more. Check it out! > > > http://discover.yahoo.com/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > > when replying, thanks > > > . > > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text > > that is not important to > > the reply and if changing the topic of the original > > message modify the > > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > > subject)" <-, we Thank You > > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > Discover Yahoo! > Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online and more. Check it out! > http://discover.yahoo.com/ > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 11999	From: TankGurl	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Re: Tank Gurl

On 6/2/05, Nicolas Munro <nmunro@...> wrote: > Hay, do you have pics of the other tanks? No, I don't. Besides my 3 tanks (65/135/20 hospital), the BioSpira was used on other people's tanks I helped set up. One saltwater, 2 very large freshwater. Kelly -- 65g Malawi http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 135g Frontosa/Tang http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12000	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Re: Bio Spira

Never heard of a fish store that only had a freezer. Every fish store I know of, even Petco and Petsmart, all have normal refridgerators with freezers for some live foods and/or medications. (ok, I'll concede, Walmart has neither, but then I don't shop walmart for anything for the fish anyway other than the occasional Betta. I'm a sucker for attractive bettas) Corse this is california where it does get pretty warm, so this might be a region thing here. But as I pointed out, they have not heard of it, not a matter of they do not choose to carry it. ----- Original Message ----- From: "paul helms" <wtfmorlok@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2005 8:39 PM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Bio Spira > it has a very short shelf life, and if it is not sold > rapidly, it is lost money....and for a while they had > problems with bad batches, making it expensive for the > lfs. that is why many do not carry it. it also must > be kept cold and many only have freezers > > --- The Dragon Hunter > <dragon.hunter@...> wrote: > > > I will admit, I am still surprised at how many fish > > stores in my area have > > never even heard of Bio Spira. My favorite has, but > > he's not a dealer of > > the stuff. The only LFS that has it near me is for > > the most part strictly > > SW and ponds, but thankfully he also gets the FW Bio > > Spira. > > > > Yea. I will admit, I was very leary of it at first, > > but like you, I try to > > keep some handy for just in case. > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "TankGurl" <fishgoddess@...> > > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > > Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2005 3:07 PM > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Bio Spira > > > > > > > It sounds like she isn't familiar with Bio Spira > > and some folks think > > > it's too good to be true. Cycle takes longer. From > > what I understand, > > > it starts the cycle, whereas Bio Spira is the > > cycle in a package. You > > > *must* add fish within 24 hrs of introducing the > > BioSpira or you will > > > lose the process. I can't get this stuff here in > > Ontario, so I order > > > from these people: > > > > > > http://fishstoretn.com/bio_spira.html > > > > > > If you do a Google search, you may find other > > online dealers. My > > > experience with the above store has been very > > good. If you don't use > > > the entire package, you can keep it in the fridge > > for up to 6 months, > > > to either cycle another tank or help a tank that > > develops a bloom from > > > over cleaning or whatever. I keep a package in my > > fridge, just in > > > case. (i.e. just in case another tank follows me > > home from the lfs :) > > > > > > Kelly > > > > > > On 6/2/05, Dane & Leslie Moore > > <amjmail@...> wrote: > > > > My stores don't carry Bio Spira here, or > > anywhere near that I can tell. > > > > But they both have one called Cycle and stress > > zyme. She said that > > > > these only produce anorobic bacteria and the > > tank needs more than that > > > > so it will take up to 2 weeks to cycle. > > > > > > > > Would the other things she mentioned work the > > same? I ask because I > > > > have only heard of the Bio Spira on the fish > > groups. And I understand > > > > it that you can add the fish much earlier if > > used but she said no way. > > > > I don't want to go buy this other stuff if it > > isn't the same thing. > > > > > > > > Thanks > > > > Leslie > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > > when replying, thanks > > > > . > > > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all > > text that is not important > > to the reply and if changing the topic of the > > original message modify the > > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > > subject)" <-, we Thank You > > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > 65g Malawi > > > http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl > > > > > > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 > > > 135g Frontosa/Tang > > > > > > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011 > > > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > > when replying, thanks > > > . > > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text > > that is not important to > > the reply and if changing the topic of the original > > message modify the > > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > > subject)" <-, we Thank You > > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > Discover Yahoo! > Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online and more. Check it out! > http://discover.yahoo.com/ > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12001	From: TankGurl	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Re: Bio Spira

It boils down to minimal cycle issues and/or a lack of cycle issues for me. Anyone's tank can 'tank' whether they do a regular cycle, a fishless cycle or use cycling products. My experience to date with BioSpira has been wonderful. 99% of the feedback I've read or heard has been positive. So, I'll continue to use the product until proven otherwise. Kelly -- 65g Malawi http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 135g Frontosa/Tang http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12002	From: Patrick, AAFG	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Re: Bio Spira

Funny that your are in Ontario and me in TN, you order biospira from a place in TN and I recently ordered some stress coat and excel from Big Al's. :) Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill -------Original Message------- I can't get this stuff here in Ontario, so I order from these people: http://fishstoretn.com/bio_spira.html [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12003	From: Patrick, AAFG	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Re: Hi, need some advice

Get rid of the goldfish. They are pond fish. I know everybody does it, but goldfish are like koi, they belong in ponds. Big ones with plants and everything. So get rid of them and keep the tropicals in the 29 gallon. Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill -------Original Message------- HI, I'm new. My name is Natalie. I Have had aquariums off and on for several years. Right now I have 2 bettas in individual tanks, then I also have a 29 gallon that has 2 goldfish, 4 neons 2 hatchet fish, 2 snails, and 2 corydoras and 1 upside down catfish. I also have a 10 gallon tank with 3 dwarf gouramis. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12004	From: Patrick, AAFG	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Re: Bio Spira

I've never been to a private store with a refrigerator or a freezer... Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill -------Original Message------- Never heard of a fish store that only had a freezer. Every fish store I know of, even Petco and Petsmart, all have normal refridgerators with freezers for some live foods and/or medications. (ok, I'll concede, Walmart has neither, but then I don't shop walmart for anything for the fish anyway other than the occasional Betta. I'm a sucker for attractive bettas) Corse this is california where it does get pretty warm, so this might be a region thing here. But as I pointed out, they have not heard of it, not a matter of they do not choose to carry it. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12005	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Re: Hi, need some advice

kinda funny when you think about it. the cheapest fish in the store requires the most space. lol ----- Original Message ----- From: "Patrick, AAFG" <patrickmn1@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2005 8:43 PM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Hi, need some advice > Get rid of the goldfish. They are pond fish. I know everybody does it, but > goldfish are like koi, they belong in ponds. Big ones with plants and > everything. So get rid of them and keep the tropicals in the 29 gallon. > > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy. > > "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is > perhaps, the end of the beginning." > -Winston Churchill > -------Original Message------- > HI, I'm new. My name is Natalie. I Have had aquariums off and on for > several years. Right now I have 2 bettas in individual tanks, then I > also have a 29 gallon that has 2 goldfish, 4 neons 2 hatchet fish, 2 > snails, and 2 corydoras and 1 upside down catfish. I also have a 10 > gallon tank with 3 dwarf gouramis. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12006	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Re: Bio Spira

all of them out here do. Every store out here sells frozen worms. all of the private stores and even Petco also sells live worms. Couldn't tell you if Petsmart sells them. I usually don't go there unless Petco is out of Science Diet (very rare). I used to actually go to Petco for live blood worms cause they were just down the street till they stopped carrying them. They still carry live black worms, but I can get live black worms cheaper every where else. the live worms are are always in their fridge. I don't grow them myself, but I asked on it and have been told that blood and black worms have to be kept fairly cool. I love watching my fish eat live foods. Also fun with the frozen worm cubes. I know you're supposed to let them melt a little, but I just toss them in right out of the freezer. after the first few worms melt off, the rainbows and gouramis will start pecking at them. After the tiger barbs realize the cubes are there, they'll peck till they get ahold of it and snatch the entire cube and try to run off with it to the middle of the tank where they usually lose their grip. After a bit, my two plecs will work their way up and get their fill. -Steve ----- Original Message ----- From: "Patrick, AAFG" <patrickmn1@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Friday, June 03, 2005 7:31 AM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Bio Spira > I've never been to a private store with a refrigerator or a freezer... > > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy. > > "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is > perhaps, the end of the beginning." > -Winston Churchill > -------Original Message------- > Never heard of a fish store that only had a freezer. Every fish store I know of, even Petco and Petsmart, all have normal refridgerators with freezers for some live foods and/or medications. (ok, I'll concede, Walmart has neither, but then I don't shop walmart for anything for the fish anyway other than the occasional Betta. I'm a sucker for attractive bettas) Corse this is california where it does get pretty warm, so this might be a region thing here. But as I pointed out, they have not heard of it, not a matter of they do not choose to carry it. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12007	From: Trevor Holyoak	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Re: Bio Spira

Most of the independent stores in my area (Utah) just have a freezer. - Trevor Patrick, AAFG wrote: > I've never been to a private store with a refrigerator or a freezer... > > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy. > > "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But > it is > perhaps, the end of the beginning." > -Winston Churchill > -------Original Message------- > Never heard of a fish store that only had a freezer. Every fish store > I know of, even Petco and Petsmart, all have normal refridgerators > with freezers for some live foods and/or medications. (ok, I'll > concede, Walmart has neither, but then I don't shop walmart for > anything for the fish anyway other than the occasional Betta. I'm a > sucker for attractive bettas) Corse this is california where it does > get pretty warm, so this might be a region thing here. But as I > pointed out, they have not heard of it, not a matter of they do not > choose to carry it. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12008	From: Patrick	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: [spam] Re: [AquaticLife] Bio Spira

To be fair, I've only been to three private stores. One was closing the day I went there, one doesn't have room because it is so small, and the third I've been to about twice and don't remember seeing any refrigerators. Pestmart I know has a refrigerator or freezer, don't remember which. Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12009	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Bleach Solution for Cleaning Tanks

hi everyone, can anyone tell me the bleach solution i should use to clean out an acrylic tank? and can i use this same solution to clean aquarium gravel, too? thanks, valeen Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my 2 Ocellaris clownfish!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12010	From: T	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Solved the Green water issue

Hello All, A few weeks ago I was going to post a question about "green Water". I saw that someone else had posted a question like mine and took the boards advice. What happend was tiny algea consumed the water and gave it a green haze. Several water changes and covering the window near the tank ( I just moved and that was the only place for it) with some black construction paper which cant be seen with the blinds down, solved the problem within days. I didnt think it was too close to the window, but it was getting way to much light, causing the water to have a green haze. Thanks to all for the advice, I ws very botherd by what was happening to the tank. Water is crystal clear again. thx - Terry

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12011	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Lake Havasu

Say, does anyone here know what fish are in Lake Havasu in Arizona? Curious more than anything else, but I know there is one species that doesn't care about the boats or anything else as the buggers usually bite me when I'm in the lake near shore. I never see the buggers, and they never bite my legs. just my back. They've biten other people's legs. Just curious as I've bought a snorkle set so I can try to see them. Thanks in advance and have a good weekend!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12012	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: critters

I have a quick question for yall. This hasn't happened before, but twice I've had to take care of spiders in my larger tank. I was just thinking, rather than squiching them and wiping up the remains, would it be a "treat" to feed the next spider to the fish? We're not talking widows, these have just been normal brown spiders. Would the fish even care or could the spider hurt the fish?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12013	From: Eric Miner	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Re: Lake Havasu

I remember fishing there and in Lake Mojhavie (sp?) as a kid. There were great lake trout. I do remember being nibbled by small fish while swiming, but never caught or saw one. But man those lake trout were great eating!! Eric --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "The Dragon Hunter" <dragon.hunter@d...> wrote: > Say, does anyone here know what fish are in Lake Havasu in Arizona? > > Curious more than anything else, but I know there is one species that > doesn't care about the boats or anything else as the buggers usually bite me > when I'm in the lake near shore. I never see the buggers, and they never > bite my legs. just my back. They've biten other people's legs. Just > curious as I've bought a snorkle set so I can try to see them. > > Thanks in advance and have a good weekend!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12014	From: Eric Miner	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Too much areation?

Hello All, I have a 46gl tank with a Marineland Penguin 340 mechanical filter. I don't have a real problem with it, it does a good job. It has two ouutputs that do a good job of agitationg the surface, maybe too good a job. It sends a lot of bubbles into the tank, the smallest of them spread throughout the water maiking is look a bit cloudy. I know that good areation is required, but is there a way to keep the bubbles down a bit? This happens even when the water level is right up to the outputs. Thanks Eric

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12015	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!

Hi Sheila, First of how big is the tank ? and how long has it been set up ?, you say your water tested fine, what do you mean by fine ? can you tell us the actual readings for salinity, PH, ammonia, nitrite and nitrate ?. Heavy breathing is not normal, are you sure they are not being harassed by the blue damsel ? I would suspect that your problem could be excess nitrates as you say you have filtration with a bio wheel, not a suitable form of filtration for salt water, they are 'nitrate factorys'. What water do you use ? regards, unclenorm. --- Sheila <smccamy@...> wrote: > We lost our first clownfish this morning and we only > got him last > Saturday. When we got him, we put him in our > established tank with a > female Blue Damselfish, a Coral Banded Shrimp, and a > green Hermit Crab. > From the start, he was rapidly opening and closing > his mouth non-stop. > I called the pet store and they told me that was > normal for clownfish. > Over the next few days, he wasn't eating and would > stay in one corner > of the tank. Then he began hanging out at the water > line like he was > trying to get air. I did tests on the water - > salinity, amonia, > nitrite, nitrate - it all tested fine. Now the new > Clarkii clowns we > got this morning are doing the same mouth thing, > like they are > breathing very rapidly. They did eat a bit earlier > and do not appear to > be stressed, but are they supposed to open and close > their mouths > constantly? The Blue Damselfish doesn't do that. > Please - any advice > would be appreciated! Is there something else that > might be wrong with > the water? Do we need an airstone or air pump? We > have a BIO Wheel > filter, a heater and the temp is around 80. Please > help - I don't want > to lose these two fish! > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12016	From: paul helms	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Re: Bio Spira

lfs is local fish store...i don't count corporate chains in that...so i'll rephrase. small fish stores, is that better for ya? --- The Dragon Hunter <dragon.hunter@...> wrote: > Never heard of a fish store that only had a freezer. > Every fish store I > know of, even Petco and Petsmart, all have normal > refridgerators with > freezers for some live foods and/or medications. > (ok, I'll concede, Walmart > has neither, but then I don't shop walmart for > anything for the fish anyway > other than the occasional Betta. I'm a sucker for > attractive bettas) Corse > this is california where it does get pretty warm, so > this might be a region > thing here. But as I pointed out, they have not > heard of it, not a matter > of they do not choose to carry it. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "paul helms" <wtfmorlok@...> > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2005 8:39 PM > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Bio Spira > > > > it has a very short shelf life, and if it is not > sold > > rapidly, it is lost money....and for a while they > had > > problems with bad batches, making it expensive for > the > > lfs. that is why many do not carry it. it also > must > > be kept cold and many only have freezers > > > > --- The Dragon Hunter > > <dragon.hunter@...> wrote: > > > > > I will admit, I am still surprised at how many > fish > > > stores in my area have > > > never even heard of Bio Spira. My favorite has, > but > > > he's not a dealer of > > > the stuff. The only LFS that has it near me is > for > > > the most part strictly > > > SW and ponds, but thankfully he also gets the FW > Bio > > > Spira. > > > > > > Yea. I will admit, I was very leary of it at > first, > > > but like you, I try to > > > keep some handy for just in case. > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "TankGurl" <fishgoddess@...> > > > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > > > Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2005 3:07 PM > > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Bio Spira > > > > > > > > > > It sounds like she isn't familiar with Bio > Spira > > > and some folks think > > > > it's too good to be true. Cycle takes longer. > From > > > what I understand, > > > > it starts the cycle, whereas Bio Spira is the > > > cycle in a package. You > > > > *must* add fish within 24 hrs of introducing > the > > > BioSpira or you will > > > > lose the process. I can't get this stuff here > in > > > Ontario, so I order > > > > from these people: > > > > > > > > http://fishstoretn.com/bio_spira.html > > > > > > > > If you do a Google search, you may find other > > > online dealers. My > > > > experience with the above store has been very > > > good. If you don't use > > > > the entire package, you can keep it in the > fridge > > > for up to 6 months, > > > > to either cycle another tank or help a tank > that > > > develops a bloom from > > > > over cleaning or whatever. I keep a package in > my > > > fridge, just in > > > > case. (i.e. just in case another tank follows > me > > > home from the lfs :) > > > > > > > > Kelly > > > > > > > > On 6/2/05, Dane & Leslie Moore > > > <amjmail@...> wrote: > > > > > My stores don't carry Bio Spira here, or > > > anywhere near that I can tell. > > > > > But they both have one called Cycle and > stress > > > zyme. She said that > > > > > these only produce anorobic bacteria and the > > > tank needs more than that > > > > > so it will take up to 2 weeks to cycle. > > > > > > > > > > Would the other things she mentioned work > the > > > same? I ask because I > > > > > have only heard of the Bio Spira on the fish > > > groups. And I understand > > > > > it that you can add the fish much earlier if > > > used but she said no way. > > > > > I don't want to go buy this other stuff if > it > > > isn't the same thing. > > > > > > > > > > Thanks > > > > > Leslie > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below > it > > > when replying, thanks > > > > > . > > > > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all > > > text that is not important > > > to the reply and if changing the topic of the > > > original message modify the > > > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > > > subject)" <-, we Thank You > > > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > 65g Malawi > > > > > http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl > > > > > > > > > > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 > > > > 135g Frontosa/Tang > > > > > > > > > > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below > it > > > when replying, thanks > > > > . > > > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all > text > > > that is not important to > > > the reply and if changing the topic of the > original > > > message modify the > > > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > > > subject)" <-, we Thank You > > > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > > Discover Yahoo! > > Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online and > more. Check it out! > > http://discover.yahoo.com/ > === message truncated === __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Have fun online with music videos, cool games, IM and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/online.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12017	From: paul helms	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Re: Starting up a new tank

well you are talking in circles a bit...but whatever. biospira is live bacteria, it does not instantly colonize your filters and gravels bed etc...that still takes time. as far as what i said about bio load, i stated that it is not able to keep up, not that the tanks were over populated. when you add a full bioload, it is always larger than your bacteria is ready to support. fish are supposed to be added gradually to allow the bacterial colonies to grow and keep up with the tank. as pat has sadi before , "what works for you works for you; what works for me works for me, but i am always right!" lmao --- The Dragon Hunter <dragon.hunter@...> wrote: > Still, your blaiming a product and not the person. > even within 3 months, > with or without Bio-Spira a tank would have long > completed a cycle. But I'm > not going to argue with your experience. You are > the only one that I have > ever heard complain about it. I have never had a > bad experience with it and > with the exception of your posts, have never heard > anyone complain about it. > Just the opposite. Have heard nothing but praise > before I first tried it. > I swear by it and think its one of the best products > I've used for my fish. > > And in your first sentense you negate bio-spira and > any product that speeds > up cycling by yourself pointing out that its the > bioload. Over stocking > would be a problem with any tank, regardless of how > you cycle it. Keep in > mind that Bio-Spira is so you don't have to cycle a > tank. It is the end > result of a cycle. If it were a problem with > Bio-Spira, logically it would > be fairly quickly since you must have fish in the > tank with the bio-spira > and you would have new tank syndrome shortly after > it if it was the product. > Clearly that isn't the case since even you state > that most of ythe problems > you have heard of are three months down the road, > long after even a normal > cycle would have completed without bio-spira or > cycle or any other product. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "paul helms" <wtfmorlok@...> > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2005 8:37 PM > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Starting up a new tank > > > > not a matter of cycling, the bioloads are often > too > > high for the bio spira to hang on its own, and > often > > time sthe water gets too polluted from the lack of > > sufficinet bacteria. i said within six months, > not > > after six months...most have been at about 3 > months. > > things can catch up in the end. there is also a > > difference between cycled and established. i > > personally don't consider anything established > until > > it has been stable for a year. > > > > --- The Dragon Hunter > > <dragon.hunter@...> wrote: > > > > > By then the bio spira should be well gone and > you > > > should have a well > > > established tank. Sounds like something > happened > > > like maybe an over clear > > > or something new introduced. > > > > > > 4 tanks started and helped restarted after a > move > > > with Bio Spira and > > > hopefully sooner or later more. > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "paul helms" <wtfmorlok@...> > > > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > > > Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2005 9:44 AM > > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Starting up a new > tank > > > > > > > > > > biospira....i have seen a alot of systems > crash > > > within > > > > 6 months of using it. > > > > > > > > --- TankGurl <fishgoddess@...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > On 6/1/05, paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > the jury is still out on that one...lol > > > > > > > > > > The jury is out on BioSpira or quick > delivery? > > > > > > > > > > Kelly > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > 65g Malawi > > > > > > > > > http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 > > > > > 135g Frontosa/Tang > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > > > > Discover Yahoo! > > > > Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online > and > > > more. Check it out! > > > > http://discover.yahoo.com/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below > it > > > when replying, thanks > > > > . > > > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all > text > > > that is not important to > > > the reply and if changing the topic of the > original > > > message modify the > > > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > > > subject)" <-, we Thank You > > > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > > Discover Yahoo! > > Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online and > more. Check it out! > > http://discover.yahoo.com/ > > > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > when replying, thanks > > . > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text > that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original > message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail Mobile Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone. http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12018	From: ionut2703	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: New filter

I just bought a SICCE SHARK ADV 400 for my tank....anyone knows this model....it has a very interesting way to detach the filter (u leave the pump in the water and detach the filter from a mganet)

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12019	From: paul helms	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Re: critters

depends on the fish....cichlids love em --- The Dragon Hunter <dragon.hunter@...> wrote: > I have a quick question for yall. This hasn't > happened before, but twice > I've had to take care of spiders in my larger tank. > I was just thinking, > rather than squiching them and wiping up the > remains, would it be a "treat" > to feed the next spider to the fish? We're not > talking widows, these have > just been normal brown spiders. Would the fish even > care or could the > spider hurt the fish? > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Have fun online with music videos, cool games, IM and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/online.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12020	From: paul helms	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Re: Lake Havasu

bony tail chub and razorback suckers are bred there, as well as game fish such as black bass, striped bass, cats, blue gill, croppie, and cat fish. --- The Dragon Hunter <dragon.hunter@...> wrote: > Say, does anyone here know what fish are in Lake > Havasu in Arizona? > > Curious more than anything else, but I know there is > one species that > doesn't care about the boats or anything else as the > buggers usually bite me > when I'm in the lake near shore. I never see the > buggers, and they never > bite my legs. just my back. They've biten other > people's legs. Just > curious as I've bought a snorkle set so I can try to > see them. > > Thanks in advance and have a good weekend! > > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12021	From: paul helms	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Re: Bleach Solution for Cleaning Tanks

100 ppm --- Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote: > hi everyone, > > can anyone tell me the bleach solution i should use > to clean out an acrylic tank? and can i use > this same solution to clean aquarium gravel, too? > > thanks, > valeen > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > I love my 2 Ocellaris clownfish! > > > __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Helps protect you from nasty viruses. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12022	From: paul helms	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Re: Bio Spira

in the bay area very few have fridges, just freezers --- The Dragon Hunter <dragon.hunter@...> wrote: > all of them out here do. Every store out here sells > frozen worms. all of > the private stores and even Petco also sells live > worms. Couldn't tell you > if Petsmart sells them. I usually don't go there > unless Petco is out of > Science Diet (very rare). I used to actually go to > Petco for live blood > worms cause they were just down the street till > they stopped carrying them. > They still carry live black worms, but I can get > live black worms cheaper > every where else. the live worms are are always in > their fridge. I don't > grow them myself, but I asked on it and have been > told that blood and black > worms have to be kept fairly cool. > > I love watching my fish eat live foods. Also fun > with the frozen worm > cubes. I know you're supposed to let them melt a > little, but I just toss > them in right out of the freezer. after the first > few worms melt off, the > rainbows and gouramis will start pecking at them. > After the tiger barbs > realize the cubes are there, they'll peck till they > get ahold of it and > snatch the entire cube and try to run off with it to > the middle of the tank > where they usually lose their grip. After a bit, my > two plecs will work > their way up and get their fill. > > -Steve > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Patrick, AAFG" <patrickmn1@...> > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Friday, June 03, 2005 7:31 AM > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Bio Spira > > > > I've never been to a private store with a > refrigerator or a freezer... > > > > > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy. > > > > "Now this is not the end. It is not even the > beginning of the end. But it > is > > perhaps, the end of the beginning." > > -Winston Churchill > > -------Original Message------- > > Never heard of a fish store that only had a > freezer. Every fish store I > know of, even Petco and Petsmart, all have normal > refridgerators with > freezers for some live foods and/or medications. > (ok, I'll concede, Walmart > has neither, but then I don't shop walmart for > anything for the fish anyway > other than the occasional Betta. I'm a sucker for > attractive bettas) Corse > this is california where it does get pretty warm, so > this might be a region > thing here. But as I pointed out, they have not > heard of it, not a matter > of they do not choose to carry it. > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > when replying, thanks > > . > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text > that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original > message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Make Yahoo! your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12023	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Re: critters

Ewww! Ewwww! Eww! -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of paul helms Sent: Friday, June 03, 2005 4:24 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] critters depends on the fish....cichlids love em --- The Dragon Hunter <dragon.hunter@...> wrote: > I have a quick question for yall. This hasn't > happened before, but twice > I've had to take care of spiders in my larger tank. > I was just thinking, > rather than squiching them and wiping up the > remains, would it be a "treat" > to feed the next spider to the fish? We're not > talking widows, these have > just been normal brown spiders. Would the fish even > care or could the > spider hurt the fish? > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Have fun online with music videos, cool games, IM and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/online.html Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12024	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Re: critters

I don't even squish them...just push them under the water and the fishies eat them. Guppies seem to think they're a treat.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12025	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: Re: critters

I catch grasshoppers,crickets,spiders,flies,bees, what ever is available to feed the bigger fish. little treats are nice sometimes. just becareful if you have fertilized lately, used pesticides,or anything toxic like that lately i'd advise against it..My neighhbor fertilizes her lawn every other month, so it makes it hard sometimes to find yard critters, I'll feed MY fish. hope that helps rob I(ndiana usa [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12026	From: Patrick	Date: 6/3/2005
Subject: [spam] Re: [AquaticLife] Starting up a new tank

Paul: Biospira instantly 100% cycles a tank WHEN USED PROPERLY. I've never used it, but EVERY person other than you will that has experience will agree with that statement. I didn't believe it at first, but you are the only person out of dozens I have read something bad bout this stuff. Surely if it didn't work there would be more people complaining. This stuff must, therefore, work as advertised or better. It is just like putting a fish into a tank that has been running for 2 months, only it was only 1-2 days. It is fully cycled because it is the EXACT bacteria (nitrosospira and nitrospira) used to convert ammonia and nitrite, not the wrong bacteria (nitrobacter), or only enzymes (stress zyme) that stimulate bacteria. I think your problem is that you have people messing up their tanks behind your back and blaming it on an inanimate object instead of their selves. That or they took your advice and never did water changes or proper tank maintenance without the experience needed to pull that off. Patrick [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12027	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!

Hi Paul, 80 Is not to hot for a salt water tank, the normal temp. of a tropical reef is between 80 and 90. All my tanks, mostly reef run at 32/33C this time of year, (they will rise a bit more yet) and 28/29C in the cold season, I live in the tropics. regards, unclenorm. --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > first of all, damsels are aggressive and > territorial, > second if you have no protein skimmer i guarantee > your > nitrates are not fine. fish breathe hard liek that > when they are suffering from nitrate poisoning. > third > 80 is too hot for a sw tank. > > --- Sheila <smccamy@...> wrote: > > > We lost our first clownfish this morning and we > only > > got him last > > Saturday. When we got him, we put him in our > > established tank with a > > female Blue Damselfish, a Coral Banded Shrimp, and > a > > green Hermit Crab. > > From the start, he was rapidly opening and closing > > his mouth non-stop. > > I called the pet store and they told me that was > > normal for clownfish. > > Over the next few days, he wasn't eating and would > > stay in one corner > > of the tank. Then he began hanging out at the > water > > line like he was > > trying to get air. I did tests on the water - > > salinity, amonia, > > nitrite, nitrate - it all tested fine. Now the new > > Clarkii clowns we > > got this morning are doing the same mouth thing, > > like they are > > breathing very rapidly. They did eat a bit earlier > > and do not appear to > > be stressed, but are they supposed to open and > close > > their mouths > > constantly? The Blue Damselfish doesn't do that. > > Please - any advice > > would be appreciated! Is there something else that > > might be wrong with > > the water? Do we need an airstone or air pump? We > > have a BIO Wheel > > filter, a heater and the temp is around 80. Please > > help - I don't want > > to lose these two fish! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > Discover Yahoo! > Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news and > more. Check it out! > http://discover.yahoo.com/mobile.html > > > ___________________________________________________________ How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12028	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: Digest Number 792: Virus Help !

Actually, it does not matter what choice you make concerning the brand of AV software, you should make a practice of visiting one of the online scanners from a different vendor on a regular basis to scan your machine. While many vendors do a good job on detecting various virus and trojans, no one is perfect, and they all will miss something. I learned this several years ago when doing extensive testing of various AV solutions in a controlled environment. Not one of the products caught all the virus that were on the test bed, even though all had the latest engines and definition files. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Paul N. Chung Sent: Wednesday, June 01, 2005 7:06 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Digest Number 792: Virus Help ! Hello, Hey, I just wanna share this experienced of mine. I used to use Norton AntiVirus. But sad to say, it couldn't really trace all virus and spyware. For me, the best Anti-Virus is still "Trend Micro Pc-cillin." just goto trend micro online virus check. And check your pc. For anti-spyware, just download and use "Ad Aware" freeware which you can download at http://www.download.com Hope this helps! Paulo --- Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote: > yep, most it people advocate other email programs > than ms outlook due to ms's low security but > high user friendliness programs. at my former > company, the mis/it guy told me eudora is better > than outlook when it comes to security. however, the > best bet is to not open attachments unless > you're expecting them, or verify with the sender > that they knowingly sent them to you. and of > course, don't download anything off the web unless > you know it's secure. always keep your > anti-virus programs current! > > and if you have access to these programs, do a > norton cleaning on your computer now and install > spyware & ad blocker software onto your computer. > these methods are not 100% effective but are > better than not doing anything. >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12029	From: paul helms	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: last post on biospira

there is no such thing as instant cycle, you can buy into it if you want. adding the correct bacteria to the water does not mean that they have cultured properly and will absolutely work. if you check back you will find that biospira has had several bad batches which were ineffective. i bet you $20.00 i could go fill a tank from the tap, and some stress zyme and amquel plus, throw in fish tomorrow and not lose any, in fact i have doen it many times, just would not recommend it to anyone. just because i have done it successfully many times, does not mean that it is proven, nor reliable. i could probably get you the names of 20 other people who have done the same successsfully. in fact there are problably many older fish keepers here who have done it as well. despite knowing dozens who have done it, there are hundreds who have failed. same with biospira. i know 3 or 4 experienced fish keepers that failed with said bad batches and were refunded their money based on the manufacture date of the product, but still cost them a good chunk of change in fish loss. in any case, believe what you want, say what you want, think what you want. that is why it is good to be an american. just does not mean that i have to agree with you, and definately does not mean that i will not post negative reviews of it when new people are told to use it. __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail Mobile Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone. http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12030	From: thant zin	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: how can control the water temperature?

Hi, I am Thomas from New Zealand and a new menber. I am familiar with the fresh water aquarium fishes and i interest the marine aquarium fishes.So I would like to get some web site name for getting aquarium knowledge. In here, Weather is too cold and sometime temperature rapidly changed. And then I found that some aquarium shop controled water temperature by room heater system.That is why if i use the thermostat, I can control the water temperature or not. Could you please give me some information for controlling water temperature? Thanks, Thomas --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - 1GB free storage! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12031	From: Paula Ruter	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: pleco question

Hi everyone, I have a question regarding my pleco. It seems that in the last few weeks, he's become a poop machine. There's are strings of his waste all over the tank, it's hard to keep up with keeping it clean! What would cause this sudden change? Thanks, Paula [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12032	From: Sheila	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help! BETTER NOW

Things are better - one clown died, one survived. We did a 80% water change and things got better immediately. The clown and the damsel are getting along great! The damsel was harrassing the clowns before because they were acting passively due to the water conditions. As soon as we got the surviving clown and damsel into the new water, Clownie improved drastically. Now they are both fine - eating voraciously and swimming around normally. We have a fake coral aerator and Clownie will race up with the bubbles! It is hilarious! Answers to some of your questions are below. > Hi Sheila, First of how big is the tank ? - 12 gallon with a Clarkii Clown, Blue Damselfish, Coral Banded Shrimp, and a green Hermit Crab How long has it been set up ? 3 weeks you say your water tested fine, > what do you mean by fine ? can you tell us the actual > readings for salinity - 1.024 PH - 8.0 ammonia - 2ppm nitrite 0 nitrate 0-5 ppm What water do you use? Tap water treated with Amonia Clear and Instant Ocean Salt water mix. Pet Co sold us the saltwater aquarium kit complete with the bio wheel filter and said it was great for saltwater aquariums. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- Sheila <smccamy@y...> wrote: > > > We lost our first clownfish this morning and we only > > got him last > > Saturday. When we got him, we put him in our > > established tank with a > > female Blue Damselfish, a Coral Banded Shrimp, and a > > green Hermit Crab. > > From the start, he was rapidly opening and closing > > his mouth non-stop. > > I called the pet store and they told me that was > > normal for clownfish. > > Over the next few days, he wasn't eating and would > > stay in one corner > > of the tank. Then he began hanging out at the water > > line like he was > > trying to get air. I did tests on the water - > > salinity, amonia, > > nitrite, nitrate - it all tested fine. Now the new > > Clarkii clowns we > > got this morning are doing the same mouth thing, > > like they are > > breathing very rapidly. They did eat a bit earlier > > and do not appear to > > be stressed, but are they supposed to open and close > > their mouths > > constantly? The Blue Damselfish doesn't do that. > > Please - any advice > > would be appreciated! Is there something else that > > might be wrong with > > the water? Do we need an airstone or air pump? We > > have a BIO Wheel > > filter, a heater and the temp is around 80. Please > > help - I don't want > > to lose these two fish! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12033	From: Patrick	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: last post on biospira

Instantanious

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12034	From: Patrick	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: how can control the water temperature?

I understand very little of your problem. Aquarium stores sell aquarium heaters, most of which have built in thermostats, but expensive ones have special thermostats that are plugged in. Such heaters, if they work right, will keep the temperature stable at the desired tank temperature as long as the room temperature is stable at the desired room temperature. You may also need a chiller if your lighting gets very hot. If you don't mind the fish room being set to 80-90°F (27-32°C), you can maintain the desired tank temperature in that room. For one tank that would be overkill, but for multiple tanks the individual heaters at 25 to 100 watts each adds up. I just figured out your problem. I understand now! It is the opposite of us up here. It is almost winter down there! Has it snowed yet? :) Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill -------Original Message------- Hi, I am Thomas from New Zealand and a new menber. I am familiar with the fresh water aquarium fishes and i interest the marine aquarium fishes.So I would like to get some web site name for getting aquarium knowledge. In here, Weather is too cold and sometime temperature rapidly changed. And then I found that some aquarium shop controled water temperature by room heater system.That is why if i use the thermostat, I can control the water temperature or not. Could you please give me some information for controlling water temperature? Thanks, Thomas

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12035	From: harry perry	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Instant cycle ? / I don't understand./some observations.

I've encountered the coversation about instant cycling in all the fish groups. My opinion, since most of us are not scientists we are only posting our experiences and hoping it will help. Why does it have to be instant?. The average person thinks about starting a tank, maybe for months, maybe years and decides to do it. Now it has to be instant? Why?. You already waited months or years. These fish have been around for millions of years chances are they will be around for a bit longer. At least a couple of weeks. After keeping fish for years, again my opinion, I've found that what works for me is to start the new tank(I only do planted tanks). Add everything but fish. I use Stress coat and Stress Zyne. Then the most important part...... I research what I'm about to do. So I don't end up with a 30 gal. tank with 3 foot pacus' or what I'm seeing a lot of, is the plecos. Some stay small (4") some don't (1 foot). In the time it takes you to research, water requirements, ph, hardness etc. The tank will be ready to go.(test it first). Enough of this boring B.S. Let's stir things up !!!!. Why after doing all this work and spending all this money would anyone want to add "tank decorations" Bubbling scuba divers, ship wrecks, etc. etc. etc. When was the last time you saw a molly twice the size of a scuba diver?( I am a scuba diver).I respect all points of view but "tank decorations" don't work for me unless they are driftwood, rocks, gravel etc. "My opinion" See if the Smithsonian will buy your "tank decorations". Hey Paul and Pat I especially would like to hear your opinions. Harry , --------------------------------- Discover Yahoo! Find restaurants, movies, travel & more fun for the weekend. Check it out! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12036	From: Dan	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: critters

I personally wouldn't introduce anything into my aquarium that I didn't know about, just to give the fish a treat. There are too many bugs that eat too many nasty things that could eat something that could be harmful to my fish/aquariums. I know, a lot of "could be's", but why risk anything just for the so called treat? Give them store baught, home grown or aquarist cultured foods - much safer in the long run if you really want to keep your fish and aquarium safe from diseases & death in my opinion. Dan (thaSkorpeon) --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "The Dragon Hunter" <dragon.hunter@d...> wrote: > I have a quick question for yall. This hasn't happened before, but twice > I've had to take care of spiders in my larger tank. I was just thinking, > rather than squiching them and wiping up the remains, would it be a "treat" > to feed the next spider to the fish? We're not talking widows, these have > just been normal brown spiders. Would the fish even care or could the > spider hurt the fish?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12037	From: paul helms	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help! BETTER NOW

petco is flat wrong. you should not even have those fish yet. you have ammonia present, meaning that you were just starting your ammonia spike, which is right on time. at 3-31/2 weeeks the ammonia spike occurs, at 4-41/2 nitrite spike, then things calm down. after changing 80% don't be shocked if you have another spike in 1-3 weeks. saltwater fish are very sensitive to water conditions, and the smaller the tank is the more drastic small changes in quality are. is this a nano cube, straight tank ....? --- Sheila <smccamy@...> wrote: > Things are better - one clown died, one survived. We > did a 80% water > change and things got better immediately. The clown > and the damsel > are getting along great! The damsel was harrassing > the clowns before > because they were acting passively due to the water > conditions. As > soon as we got the surviving clown and damsel into > the new water, > Clownie improved drastically. Now they are both fine > - eating > voraciously and swimming around normally. We have a > fake coral > aerator and Clownie will race up with the bubbles! > It is hilarious! > > Answers to some of your questions are below. > > Hi Sheila, > > First of how big is the tank ? - 12 gallon with a > Clarkii Clown, Blue > Damselfish, Coral Banded Shrimp, and a green Hermit > Crab > > How long has it been set up ? 3 weeks > > you say your water tested fine, > > what do you mean by fine ? can you tell us the > actual > > readings for salinity - 1.024 > PH - 8.0 > ammonia - 2ppm > nitrite 0 > nitrate 0-5 ppm > > What water do you use? Tap water treated with Amonia > Clear and > Instant Ocean Salt water mix. > > Pet Co sold us the saltwater aquarium kit complete > with the bio wheel > filter and said it was great for saltwater > aquariums. > > > regards, > > unclenorm. > > > > > > --- Sheila <smccamy@y...> wrote: > > > > > We lost our first clownfish this morning and we > only > > > got him last > > > Saturday. When we got him, we put him in our > > > established tank with a > > > female Blue Damselfish, a Coral Banded Shrimp, > and a > > > green Hermit Crab. > > > From the start, he was rapidly opening and > closing > > > his mouth non-stop. > > > I called the pet store and they told me that was > > > normal for clownfish. > > > Over the next few days, he wasn't eating and > would > > > stay in one corner > > > of the tank. Then he began hanging out at the > water > > > line like he was > > > trying to get air. I did tests on the water - > > > salinity, amonia, > > > nitrite, nitrate - it all tested fine. Now the > new > > > Clarkii clowns we > > > got this morning are doing the same mouth thing, > > > like they are > > > breathing very rapidly. They did eat a bit > earlier > > > and do not appear to > > > be stressed, but are they supposed to open and > close > > > their mouths > > > constantly? The Blue Damselfish doesn't do that. > > > Please - any advice > > > would be appreciated! Is there something else > that > > > might be wrong with > > > the water? Do we need an airstone or air pump? > We > > > have a BIO Wheel > > > filter, a heater and the temp is around 80. > Please > > > help - I don't want > > > to lose these two fish! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC > calling worldwide > with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com > > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12038	From: paul helms	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: pleco question

either he is eating tons of algae or you are over feeding the tank and he is cleaning it upo for you --- Paula Ruter <metallicamommy@...> wrote: > Hi everyone, > > I have a question regarding my pleco. It seems that > in the last few weeks, he's become a poop machine. > There's are strings of his waste all over the tank, > it's hard to keep up with keeping it clean! What > would cause this sudden change? > > Thanks, > > Paula > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12039	From: paul helms	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: Digest Number 792: Virus Help !

if you can afford it, all that you need is zone alarm professional full suite. it blocks absolutely everything. it does not only use definitions, but checks files for suspicious code. it has blocked 99 viruses from my machine in 3 months. anyway, back to fish!! --- Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > Actually, it does not matter what choice you make > concerning the brand of AV > software, you should make a practice of visiting one > of the online scanners > from a different vendor on a regular basis to scan > your machine. While many > vendors do a good job on detecting various virus and > trojans, no one is > perfect, and they all will miss something. > > I learned this several years ago when doing > extensive testing of various AV > solutions in a controlled environment. Not one of > the products caught all > the virus that were on the test bed, even though all > had the latest engines > and definition files. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Paul N. Chung > Sent: Wednesday, June 01, 2005 7:06 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Digest Number 792: Virus > Help ! > > Hello, > > Hey, I just wanna share this experienced of mine. I > used to use Norton AntiVirus. But sad to say, it > couldn't really trace all virus and spyware. > > For me, the best Anti-Virus is still "Trend Micro > Pc-cillin." > just goto trend micro online virus check. And check > your pc. > > For anti-spyware, just download and use "Ad Aware" > freeware which you can download at > http://www.download.com > > Hope this helps! > > Paulo > > --- Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> > wrote: > > > yep, most it people advocate other email programs > > than ms outlook due to ms's low security but > > high user friendliness programs. at my former > > company, the mis/it guy told me eudora is better > > than outlook when it comes to security. however, > the > > best bet is to not open attachments unless > > you're expecting them, or verify with the sender > > that they knowingly sent them to you. and of > > course, don't download anything off the web unless > > you know it's secure. always keep your > > anti-virus programs current! > > > > and if you have access to these programs, do a > > norton cleaning on your computer now and install > > spyware & ad blocker software onto your computer. > > these methods are not 100% effective but are > > better than not doing anything. > > > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Find restaurants, movies, travel and more fun for the weekend. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/weekend.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12040	From: paul helms	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: how can control the water temperature?

if there was no heater in the tank it would tyake on the ambient temperature of the room. so if you keep the room at 75 degrees , teh tanks should be ery close to that. possibly under a couple degrees or over a couple if you have good lights. --- thant zin <thomath999@...> wrote: > Hi, > I am Thomas from New Zealand and a new menber. I am > familiar with the fresh water aquarium fishes and i > interest the marine aquarium fishes.So I would like > to get some web site name for getting aquarium > knowledge. > > In here, Weather is too cold and sometime > temperature rapidly changed. And then I found that > some aquarium shop controled water temperature by > room heater system.That is why if i use the > thermostat, I can control the water temperature or > not. > Could you please give me some information for > controlling water temperature? > > Thanks, > > Thomas > > > > > --------------------------------- > Do you Yahoo!? > New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - 1GB free storage! > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Find restaurants, movies, travel and more fun for the weekend. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/weekend.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12041	From: paul helms	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!

once you hit 83 degrees fish will start to drop, especially gobies, dartfish, blennies and the like. so setting your tank at 80 and having lights running on top of that is not a godd idea. a reef should be kept at the same temp as a tropical tank, unless you are doing a cold water tank, then it should be below 70. but thanks for trying to correct something that is not wrong. keeping a tank higher than needed will cause problems if you have a heat spell! --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> wrote: > Hi Paul, > 80 Is not to hot for a salt water tank, the > normal temp. of a tropical reef is between 80 and > 90. > All my tanks, mostly reef run at 32/33C this time of > year, (they will rise a bit more yet) and 28/29C in > the cold season, I live in the tropics. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > first of all, damsels are aggressive and > > territorial, > > second if you have no protein skimmer i guarantee > > your > > nitrates are not fine. fish breathe hard liek > that > > when they are suffering from nitrate poisoning. > > third > > 80 is too hot for a sw tank. > > > > --- Sheila <smccamy@...> wrote: > > > > > We lost our first clownfish this morning and we > > only > > > got him last > > > Saturday. When we got him, we put him in our > > > established tank with a > > > female Blue Damselfish, a Coral Banded Shrimp, > and > > a > > > green Hermit Crab. > > > From the start, he was rapidly opening and > closing > > > his mouth non-stop. > > > I called the pet store and they told me that was > > > normal for clownfish. > > > Over the next few days, he wasn't eating and > would > > > stay in one corner > > > of the tank. Then he began hanging out at the > > water > > > line like he was > > > trying to get air. I did tests on the water - > > > salinity, amonia, > > > nitrite, nitrate - it all tested fine. Now the > new > > > Clarkii clowns we > > > got this morning are doing the same mouth thing, > > > like they are > > > breathing very rapidly. They did eat a bit > earlier > > > and do not appear to > > > be stressed, but are they supposed to open and > > close > > > their mouths > > > constantly? The Blue Damselfish doesn't do that. > > > Please - any advice > > > would be appreciated! Is there something else > that > > > might be wrong with > > > the water? Do we need an airstone or air pump? > We > > > have a BIO Wheel > > > filter, a heater and the temp is around 80. > Please > > > help - I don't want > > > to lose these two fish! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > > Discover Yahoo! > > Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news > and > > more. Check it out! > > http://discover.yahoo.com/mobile.html > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > How much free photo storage do you get? Store your > holiday > snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos > http://uk.photos.yahoo.com > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12042	From: aclaar877	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Diatom Filter not Working

Anyone ever use a diatom filter on green water and have it NOT work? I've got the System-1 model on my 55g, two hours later mild green water still persists. Got plenty of powder in there too, and used a flocculant three hours prior. Is there a suspended algae form that is small enough to not be trapped in the filter? AC

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12043	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: Diatom Filter not Working

AC, I have not used the system-1 model, just the vortex filters. Have you tried empty out and recharging the filter? Maybe it was a bit overwhelmed and just needs a refill? Mike In a message dated 6/4/2005 10:09:57 AM Pacific Daylight Time, aclaar877@... writes: Anyone ever use a diatom filter on green water and have it NOT work? I've got the System-1 model on my 55g, two hours later mild green water still persists. Got plenty of powder in there too, and used a flocculant three hours prior. Is there a suspended algae form that is small enough to not be trapped in the filter? AC [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12044	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: Instant cycle ? / I don't understand./some observations.

Harry, It just so happens that some people like the novelty tank--the fluorescent pink gravel, the scuba diver, the bubbling treasure chest, and the no fishing sign. They go well with the plastic plants they buy. Hey, it is no scales off the fish's backs <g>. Actually, I've seen some tanks like this that were quite attractive, though not to my tastes either. The real point is that these people are keeping fish, many of them are being very successful at it also, and isn't that what counts? Many shows have a class that is known as the novelty class. Sometimes it has a theme, a particularly good one, I recall, was the Halloween theme at, I believe, the Norwalk (CT) Aquarium Society Show about 10-15 years ago. Not only were there skeletons, and not only in the closet, but there where ghost fish, phantom tetras, clown loaches, etc. as inhabitants of the tank. I also agree that while there are simple ways to do things, there is no real instant way to do things, especially when first setting up a tank. Like many of the experienced people here, I have my shortcuts, and they work for me, but I would hesitate to suggest them for others to use. While they may work for me, they may not work for you. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of harry perry Sent: Saturday, June 04, 2005 12:36 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Instant cycle ? / I don't understand./some observations. I've encountered the coversation about instant cycling in all the fish groups. My opinion, since most of us are not scientists we are only posting our experiences and hoping it will help. Why does it have to be instant?. The average person thinks about starting a tank, maybe for months, maybe years and decides to do it. Now it has to be instant? Why?. You already waited months or years. These fish have been around for millions of years chances are they will be around for a bit longer. At least a couple of weeks. After keeping fish for years, again my opinion, I've found that what works for me is to start the new tank(I only do planted tanks). Add everything but fish. I use Stress coat and Stress Zyne. Then the most important part...... I research what I'm about to do. So I don't end up with a 30 gal. tank with 3 foot pacus' or what I'm seeing a lot of, is the plecos. Some stay small (4") some don't (1 foot). In the time it takes you to research, water requirements, ph, hardness etc. The tank will be ready to go.(test it first). Enough of this boring B.S. Let's stir things up !!!!. Why after doing all this work and spending all this money would anyone want to add "tank decorations" Bubbling scuba divers, ship wrecks, etc. etc. etc. When was the last time you saw a molly twice the size of a scuba diver?( I am a scuba diver).I respect all points of view but "tank decorations" don't work for me unless they are driftwood, rocks, gravel etc. "My opinion" See if the Smithsonian will buy your "tank decorations". Hey Paul and Pat I especially would like to hear your opinions. Harry

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12045	From: wizzbaf	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Aquarium Salt

I apologize for the cross post, but I am trying to find out a answer to a simple question. Without provoking a war of the salts (table vs. kosher vs. aquarium), I would like to find an aquarium salt that does not cloud the water. I use Doc Wellfish's Aquarium Salt, in the correct dosage, and it seems to cloud the tank. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Thank you in advance.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12046	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: pleco question

He's just growing. They all do that. That is the reason I got rid of both of mine. Of course there are other factors that affect their activity, but overall a pleco is a poop machine. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Paula Ruter Sent: Saturday, June 04, 2005 8:50 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] pleco question Hi everyone, I have a question regarding my pleco. It seems that in the last few weeks, he's become a poop machine. There's are strings of his waste all over the tank, it's hard to keep up with keeping it clean! What would cause this sudden change? Thanks, Paula [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12047	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: Aquarium Salt

Try the kosher salt from the grocery store or a marine mix to determine if you still have the problem. The kosher will be less expensive, and you can put it into your salt shaker should it not work out. I'd be interested to find out why the salt you are using is clouding the water. It should not. No salt should. What is your pH, hardness? Do you treat your water with anything else? \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of wizzbaf Sent: Saturday, June 04, 2005 2:00 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Aquarium Salt I apologize for the cross post, but I am trying to find out a answer to a simple question. Without provoking a war of the salts (table vs. kosher vs. aquarium), I would like to find an aquarium salt that does not cloud the water. I use Doc Wellfish's Aquarium Salt, in the correct dosage, and it seems to cloud the tank. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Thank you in advance.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12048	From: Bruce Hansen	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: Instant cycle ? / I don't understand./some observations.

Harry's turn to have a "stir" :-) No matter how "nicely" we think we have set up our tanks, it is really only our personal opinion. Similar to fashions in clothes and home decorations and furnishings - some will love a certain look others will hate it. One of the great things about the aquarium hobby is that it is so multi-facetted. We all share the interest in the hobby but each of us has our own individual special personal involvement with one aspect or perhaps several. Some of us are more interested in planted tanks, others only native fish (from whichever country), others are collectors of fish-related literature, still others like to photograph fish and so on. I am sure all of us are keen to keep learning about what works for others and how to keep our fish well. WE have a duty of care to them. Cheers Bruce (Hansen) ANGFA (Qld) Inc - http://www.angfaqld.org.au/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steve Szabo" <steve@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Sunday, June 05, 2005 3:58 AM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Instant cycle ? / I don't understand./some observations. > Harry, > > It just so happens that some people like the novelty tank--the fluorescent > pink gravel, the scuba diver, the bubbling treasure chest, and the no > fishing sign. They go well with the plastic plants they buy. Hey, it is no > scales off the fish's backs <g>. Actually, I've seen some tanks like this > that were quite attractive, though not to my tastes either. > > The real point is that these people are keeping fish, many of them are > being > very successful at it also, and isn't that what counts? > > Many shows have a class that is known as the novelty class. Sometimes it > has > a theme, a particularly good one, I recall, was the Halloween theme at, I > believe, the Norwalk (CT) Aquarium Society Show about 10-15 years ago. Not > only were there skeletons, and not only in the closet, but there where > ghost > fish, phantom tetras, clown loaches, etc. as inhabitants of the tank. > > I also agree that while there are simple ways to do things, there is no > real > instant way to do things, especially when first setting up a tank. Like > many > of the experienced people here, I have my shortcuts, and they work for me, > but I would hesitate to suggest them for others to use. While they may > work > for me, they may not work for you. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of harry perry > Sent: Saturday, June 04, 2005 12:36 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Instant cycle ? / I don't understand./some > observations. > > I've encountered the coversation about instant cycling in all the fish > groups. My opinion, since most of us are not scientists we are only > posting > our experiences and hoping it will help. > > Why does it have to be instant?. The average person thinks about starting > a > tank, maybe for months, maybe years and decides to do it. Now it has to be > instant? Why?. You already waited months or years. These fish have been > around for millions of years chances are they will be around for a bit > longer. At least a couple of weeks. > > After keeping fish for years, again my opinion, I've found that what works > for me is to start the new tank(I only do planted tanks). Add everything > but fish. I use Stress coat and Stress Zyne. > > Then the most important part...... I research what I'm about to do. So I > don't end up with a 30 gal. tank with 3 foot pacus' or what I'm seeing a > lot > of, is the plecos. Some stay small (4") some don't (1 foot). In the time > it > takes you to research, water requirements, ph, hardness etc. The tank will > be ready to go.(test it first). > > Enough of this boring B.S. Let's stir things up !!!!. Why after doing all > this work and spending all this money would anyone want to add "tank > decorations" Bubbling scuba divers, ship wrecks, etc. etc. etc. When was > the > last time you saw a molly twice the size of a scuba diver?( I am a scuba > diver).I respect all points of view but "tank decorations" don't work for > me > unless they are driftwood, rocks, gravel etc. "My opinion" See if the > Smithsonian will buy your "tank decorations". > > Hey Paul and Pat I especially would like to hear your opinions. > > Harry > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12049	From: Eric Miner	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: last post on biospira

I too fell that it takes some time to establish a stong and viable bacteria colony. On May 23rd I started a fishless cycle using Bio-Spira. Today, June 4th, the nitrite peak is past and leveled out. I'm now ready to do a water change and add my fish. While this is not immediate, it is darn fast. Yeah, I could have done this with starter bateria from another tank, but in my case I don't have anouther tank. Unlike other products on the market Bio-Sipra contains the required bacterial strains. I don't think I'd add it and then fish a day later, but as a 'trigger' for a fishless cycling it's good stuff. Just my $0.02 worth Eric Charlotte,N.C. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms <wtfmorlok@y...> wrote: > there is no such thing as instant cycle, you can buy > into it if you want. adding the correct bacteria to > the water does not mean that they have cultured > properly and will absolutely work. if you check back > you will find that biospira has had several bad > batches which were ineffective. i bet you $20.00 i > could go fill a tank from the tap, and some stress > zyme and amquel plus, throw in fish tomorrow and not > lose any, in fact i have doen it many times, just > would not recommend it to anyone. just because i have > done it successfully many times, does not mean that it > is proven, nor reliable. i could probably get you the > names of 20 other people who have done the same > successsfully. in fact there are problably many older > fish keepers here who have done it as well. despite > knowing dozens who have done it, there are hundreds > who have failed. same with biospira. i know 3 or 4 > experienced fish keepers that failed with said bad > batches and were refunded their money based on the > manufacture date of the product, but still cost them a > good chunk of change in fish loss. in any case, > believe what you want, say what you want, think what > you want. that is why it is good to be an american. > just does not mean that i have to agree with you, and > definately does not mean that i will not post negative > reviews of it when new people are told to use it. > > > > __________________________________ > Yahoo! Mail Mobile > Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone. > http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12050	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Betta babies

Guys, About 3 weeks ago, I had a male betta and 2 females in a tank with loads of hiding space and it was going fine and suddenly next day morning all 3 were found dead :-s. Sad, but I fished them out but did not shut off the tank as I did not really have time to do anything to it or even test why it happened. Yesterday, while watching TV, I noticed some movement in the tank. On close inspection I noticed a fry. I inspected in the morning as well and finally counted 4 fry. They are about 1cm long and seem to be feeding well on .. Hmm. Don't know exactly what. There is a flurry of Trumpet snails and ramshorn in there and I think that is what kept the fry growing by creating infusoria. My questions are: They are big enough to be able to take powdered fry food so when is the best time to start? There seems to be enough microscopic food in the tank. When will be a best time to separate them to prevent them from fighting or cannibalizing on each other? There are loads of plants in the tank and it is a 8 gallon tank. Do I need to change water? Or is there anything special to do? I believe that the time when they need baby brine shrimp has passed as these are a bit bigger then newly born guppy fry. Thanks, Nim [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12051	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies

Nim, Congrats on the fry. There is no need to separate the fry at any stage. If they grow up together, including males, there is not the tendency to aggression toward each other as is commonly associated with male bettas. However, should you wish to separate them, the time to do it is when you can reliably sex them. You can start with the powdered food now, as a supplement to what they are now getting in the way of infusoria and other nifty microscopic critters. Just be sure to feed sparingly and closely observe if the fry are feeding on the powdered food. Water change as normal, being careful to not siphon out the fry you have. If you raise the water temperature to the low 80's, then halve the time between water changes. While they are yet too small to do much damage, every fish releases a hormone that inhibits growth. If you are trying to maximize growth, you need to change the water to minimize its presence. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nimish Mathur Sent: Saturday, June 04, 2005 5:51 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Betta babies Guys, About 3 weeks ago, I had a male betta and 2 females in a tank with loads of hiding space and it was going fine and suddenly next day morning all 3 were found dead :-s. Sad, but I fished them out but did not shut off the tank as I did not really have time to do anything to it or even test why it happened. Yesterday, while watching TV, I noticed some movement in the tank. On close inspection I noticed a fry. I inspected in the morning as well and finally counted 4 fry. They are about 1cm long and seem to be feeding well on .. Hmm. Don't know exactly what. There is a flurry of Trumpet snails and ramshorn in there and I think that is what kept the fry growing by creating infusoria. My questions are: They are big enough to be able to take powdered fry food so when is the best time to start? There seems to be enough microscopic food in the tank. When will be a best time to separate them to prevent them from fighting or cannibalizing on each other? There are loads of plants in the tank and it is a 8 gallon tank. Do I need to change water? Or is there anything special to do? I believe that the time when they need baby brine shrimp has passed as these are a bit bigger then newly born guppy fry. Thanks, Nim

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12052	From: Paul N. Chung	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: critters

Hey, if you arowana, cichlids on your tank... they would love to eat them. Paulo The Dragon Hunter <dragon.hunter@...> wrote: I have a quick question for yall. This hasn't happened before, but twice I've had to take care of spiders in my larger tank. I was just thinking, rather than squiching them and wiping up the remains, would it be a "treat" to feed the next spider to the fish? We're not talking widows, these have just been normal brown spiders. Would the fish even care or could the spider hurt the fish? Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter --------------------------------- Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12053	From: Paul N. Chung	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: Bleach Solution for Cleaning Tanks

Hey Valeen, Try using Lemon. They are quite effective in cleaning acrylic and glass aquarium. Paulo Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote: hi everyone, can anyone tell me the bleach solution i should use to clean out an acrylic tank? and can i use this same solution to clean aquarium gravel, too? thanks, valeen Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my 2 Ocellaris clownfish! Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter --------------------------------- Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12054	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: critters

Well, I always feed household insects to the fish and they love it ;) If the spiders are not too large and your fish are big enough to gulp a spider body completely without struggling, they can be fed. You also get ultra-sonic spider repellents (for archnophobic people like me) that prevent spiders from entering the room in which the repellent is installed. Cheap stuff but works ;) Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Paul N. Chung Sent: 05 June 2005 00:38 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] critters Hey, if you arowana, cichlids on your tank... they would love to eat them. Paulo The Dragon Hunter <dragon.hunter@...> wrote: I have a quick question for yall. This hasn't happened before, but twice I've had to take care of spiders in my larger tank. I was just thinking, rather than squiching them and wiping up the remains, would it be a "treat" to feed the next spider to the fish? We're not talking widows, these have just been normal brown spiders. Would the fish even care or could the spider hurt the fish? Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter --------------------------------- Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter _____ Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12055	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies

Thanks Steve, I will leave the babies together then. They don't seem interested in the dry food at the moment but their bellies do look overfull. I will keep up with water changes :-). Is raising the temperature to increase their growth? Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: 05 June 2005 00:34 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Betta babies Nim, Congrats on the fry. There is no need to separate the fry at any stage. If they grow up together, including males, there is not the tendency to aggression toward each other as is commonly associated with male bettas. However, should you wish to separate them, the time to do it is when you can reliably sex them. You can start with the powdered food now, as a supplement to what they are now getting in the way of infusoria and other nifty microscopic critters. Just be sure to feed sparingly and closely observe if the fry are feeding on the powdered food. Water change as normal, being careful to not siphon out the fry you have. If you raise the water temperature to the low 80's, then halve the time between water changes. While they are yet too small to do much damage, every fish releases a hormone that inhibits growth. If you are trying to maximize growth, you need to change the water to minimize its presence. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nimish Mathur Sent: Saturday, June 04, 2005 5:51 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Betta babies Guys, About 3 weeks ago, I had a male betta and 2 females in a tank with loads of hiding space and it was going fine and suddenly next day morning all 3 were found dead :-s. Sad, but I fished them out but did not shut off the tank as I did not really have time to do anything to it or even test why it happened. Yesterday, while watching TV, I noticed some movement in the tank. On close inspection I noticed a fry. I inspected in the morning as well and finally counted 4 fry. They are about 1cm long and seem to be feeding well on .. Hmm. Don't know exactly what. There is a flurry of Trumpet snails and ramshorn in there and I think that is what kept the fry growing by creating infusoria. My questions are: They are big enough to be able to take powdered fry food so when is the best time to start? There seems to be enough microscopic food in the tank. When will be a best time to separate them to prevent them from fighting or cannibalizing on each other? There are loads of plants in the tank and it is a 8 gallon tank. Do I need to change water? Or is there anything special to do? I believe that the time when they need baby brine shrimp has passed as these are a bit bigger then newly born guppy fry. Thanks, Nim Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter _____ Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12056	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: pleco question

ive got 2 rubber lipped ones and they are about 3 inches.. I think they max out somewhere around that.. but I never seen mine poop but then I have snails and have to clean the tank twice a week to stay on top of the cleaning.. I guess im glad I got the rubber lipped ones they are so cute and good cleaners.. Shannon: He's just growing. They all do that. That is the reason I got rid of both of mine. Of course there are other factors that affect their activity, but overall a pleco is a poop machine. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Paula Ruter Sent: Saturday, June 04, 2005 8:50 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] pleco question Hi everyone, I have a question regarding my pleco. It seems that in the last few weeks, he's become a poop machine. There's are strings of his waste all over the tank, it's hard to keep up with keeping it clean! What would cause this sudden change? Thanks, Paula [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12057	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help! BETTER NOW

Hi Sheila, I'm glad your clown and damsel are ok what happened to the other clowns you said you bought ?. from your reply I will make one or two comments. first from the test results it would seem that your tank had not cycled at the time you took them in fact the results say the cycle was only just starting, there are very many articles on line that explain the nitrogen cycle. Your nitrate reading indicates to me that you are putting nitrate into your tank via your tap water, tap water can cause a lot of problems, I would recommend that you use RO/DI water. 12gallons is a pretty small tank for salt water, not impossible but very difficult to maintain, things happen very quickly in a small tank giving you little or no chance to correct them, it would be advisable to upgrade to a tank around 55gallons this being a good tank size to start with. Filtration, I'm afraid you have one of the worst kinds of filtration for salt water, bio wheels are great for fresh water were nitrates are not to much of an issue but nitrates are detrimental to a salt water tank and bio wheels are nitrate factorys. I would advise that the best form of filtration for salt water is live rock (1 to 2lbs per gallon) and live sand about 4" deep plus a good protein skimmer no other form of filtration is necessary, this form of filtration will also convert the nitrate into harmless nitrogen gas. finally your bio load, the rule of thumb for stocking salt water is 1 fish for every five galls of water so if you try to add more fish to that tank you will probably have more problems. If you want any more info just ask. regards, unclenorm. --- Sheila <smccamy@...> wrote: > Things are better - one clown died, one survived. We > did a 80% water > change and things got better immediately. The clown > and the damsel > are getting along great! The damsel was harrassing > the clowns before > because they were acting passively due to the water > conditions. As > soon as we got the surviving clown and damsel into > the new water, > Clownie improved drastically. Now they are both fine > - eating > voraciously and swimming around normally. We have a > fake coral > aerator and Clownie will race up with the bubbles! > It is hilarious! > > Answers to some of your questions are below. > > Hi Sheila, > > First of how big is the tank ? - 12 gallon with a > Clarkii Clown, Blue > Damselfish, Coral Banded Shrimp, and a green Hermit > Crab > > How long has it been set up ? 3 weeks > > you say your water tested fine, > > what do you mean by fine ? can you tell us the > actual > > readings for salinity - 1.024 > PH - 8.0 > ammonia - 2ppm > nitrite 0 > nitrate 0-5 ppm > > What water do you use? Tap water treated with Amonia > Clear and > Instant Ocean Salt water mix. > > Pet Co sold us the saltwater aquarium kit complete > with the bio wheel > filter and said it was great for saltwater > aquariums. > > > regards, > > unclenorm. > > > > > > --- Sheila <smccamy@y...> wrote: > > > > > We lost our first clownfish this morning and we > only > > > got him last > > > Saturday. When we got him, we put him in our > > > established tank with a > > > female Blue Damselfish, a Coral Banded Shrimp, > and a > > > green Hermit Crab. > > > From the start, he was rapidly opening and > closing > > > his mouth non-stop. > > > I called the pet store and they told me that was > > > normal for clownfish. > > > Over the next few days, he wasn't eating and > would > > > stay in one corner > > > of the tank. Then he began hanging out at the > water > > > line like he was > > > trying to get air. I did tests on the water - > > > salinity, amonia, > > > nitrite, nitrate - it all tested fine. Now the > new > > > Clarkii clowns we > > > got this morning are doing the same mouth thing, > > > like they are > > > breathing very rapidly. They did eat a bit > earlier > > > and do not appear to > > > be stressed, but are they supposed to open and > close > > > their mouths > > > constantly? The Blue Damselfish doesn't do that. > > > Please - any advice > > > would be appreciated! Is there something else > that > > > might be wrong with > > > the water? Do we need an airstone or air pump? > We > > > have a BIO Wheel > > > filter, a heater and the temp is around 80. > Please > > > help - I don't want > > > to lose these two fish! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC > calling worldwide > with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com > > > ___________________________________________________________ How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12058	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!

Hi Paul, My statement is fact, yours is wrong ! do some research, as I said my tanks (and they total close to 1000galls) all run between 28C and 34C ( that's 82F and 94F ) and they have been up and running for more than six years in this location and very many years in other parts of the world. People have far more problems through temperature being to low than to high. If you try to replicate nature you can't go to far wrong. Regards, unclenorm. --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > once you hit 83 degrees fish will start to drop, > especially gobies, dartfish, blennies and the like. > so setting your tank at 80 and having lights running > on top of that is not a godd idea. a reef should be > kept at the same temp as a tropical tank, unless you > are doing a cold water tank, then it should be below > 70. but thanks for trying to correct something that > is not wrong. keeping a tank higher than needed > will > cause problems if you have a heat spell! > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> > wrote: > > > Hi Paul, > > 80 Is not to hot for a salt water tank, > the > > normal temp. of a tropical reef is between 80 and > > 90. > > All my tanks, mostly reef run at 32/33C this time > of > > year, (they will rise a bit more yet) and 28/29C > in > > the cold season, I live in the tropics. > > regards, > > unclenorm. > > > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > > > first of all, damsels are aggressive and > > > territorial, > > > second if you have no protein skimmer i > guarantee > > > your > > > nitrates are not fine. fish breathe hard liek > > that > > > when they are suffering from nitrate poisoning. > > > third > > > 80 is too hot for a sw tank. > > > > > > --- Sheila <smccamy@...> wrote: > > > > > > > We lost our first clownfish this morning and > we > > > only > > > > got him last > > > > Saturday. When we got him, we put him in our > > > > established tank with a > > > > female Blue Damselfish, a Coral Banded Shrimp, > > and > > > a > > > > green Hermit Crab. > > > > From the start, he was rapidly opening and > > closing > > > > his mouth non-stop. > > > > I called the pet store and they told me that > was > > > > normal for clownfish. > > > > Over the next few days, he wasn't eating and > > would > > > > stay in one corner > > > > of the tank. Then he began hanging out at the > > > water > > > > line like he was > > > > trying to get air. I did tests on the water - > > > > salinity, amonia, > > > > nitrite, nitrate - it all tested fine. Now the > > new > > > > Clarkii clowns we > > > > got this morning are doing the same mouth > thing, > > > > like they are > > > > breathing very rapidly. They did eat a bit > > earlier > > > > and do not appear to > > > > be stressed, but are they supposed to open and > > > close > > > > their mouths > > > > constantly? The Blue Damselfish doesn't do > that. > > > > Please - any advice > > > > would be appreciated! Is there something else > > that > > > > might be wrong with > > > > the water? Do we need an airstone or air pump? > > We > > > > have a BIO Wheel > > > > filter, a heater and the temp is around 80. > > Please > > > > help - I don't want > > > > to lose these two fish! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > > > Discover Yahoo! > > > Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news > > and > > > more. Check it out! > > > http://discover.yahoo.com/mobile.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > > How much free photo storage do you get? Store your > > holiday > > snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos > > http://uk.photos.yahoo.com > > > > > > > __________________________________ > Discover Yahoo! > Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online and > more. Check it out! > http://discover.yahoo.com/ > > > ___________________________________________________________ How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12059	From: Patrick	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: decorations debate

Are you crazy? Ever tank HAS to have a ship wreck! Ok, I'm joking. Some can get away with little ceramic frogs or sharks. :) I have a small plastic cave in one of my tank with bubbles, but it isn't for decoration as much as for water movement and a place for the fish to hide. I have a sunken ship in my other tank, but it is mostly for a place for plants to grow on. I can't even see the boat I have so many plants on it. As for divers, I think they look plain stupid. I think such things are mostly for kids to have fun with. The other problem with them is that they all fade and start to look bad. Now I might someday get another ship wreck. I've been thinking of one of the bismarks or a submarine, but only as a historical ornament. Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill -------Original Message------- Enough of this boring B.S. Let's stir things up !!!!. Why after doing all this work and spending all this money would anyone want to add "tank decorations" Bubbling scuba divers, ship wrecks, etc. etc. etc. When was the last time you saw a molly twice the size of a scuba diver?( I am a scuba diver).I respect all points of view but "tank decorations" don't work for me unless they are driftwood, rocks, gravel etc. "My opinion" See if the Smithsonian will buy your "tank decorations". Hey Paul and Pat I especially would like to hear your opinions. Harry [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12060	From: Karen	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Thanks for the honor of front page

Wow, just checked in and saw my Red Zebra on the front page. She(?) is a beauty. I posted a picture of my Lab. Hongi Island in the photos too. I'm very sad to report that he was found belly up this week. No indication as to why. He had been hiding for a couple of days but that was not unusual. Maybe he was injured. "Jaws" will be sadly missed. He was about 7 years old. I just got home with another 75 gal set-up that I picked up in the paper. Will be spending the night cleaning. It came with a nice wet/dry filter and sump. I'vernever used one but may as well since it seemed to working well. Does anyone think I'll need too supplement with mechanical filtration? This tank won't be overstocked. Haven't decided yet whether to more my Vics to the 75 or set it up for Haps/Peacocks.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12061	From: Karen	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: Aquarium Salt

Epsom Salt for the magnesium content and other trace minerals and Kosher salt for NaCl. There is no iodine in the Kosher salt. That is why it is safe. Aquarium salt is just Epsom and a little NaCl with the price jacked up about 1000 X. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@f...> wrote: > Try the kosher salt from the grocery store or a marine mix to determine if > you still have the problem. The kosher will be less expensive, and you can > put it into your salt shaker should it not work out. > > I'd be interested to find out why the salt you are using is clouding the > water. It should not. No salt should. > > What is your pH, hardness? Do you treat your water with anything else? > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of wizzbaf > Sent: Saturday, June 04, 2005 2:00 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Aquarium Salt > > I apologize for the cross post, but I am trying to find out a answer > to a simple question. > > Without provoking a war of the salts (table vs. kosher vs. aquarium), > I would like to find an aquarium salt that does not cloud the water. > I use Doc Wellfish's Aquarium Salt, in the correct dosage, and it > seems to cloud the tank. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. > > Thank you in advance.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12062	From: Patrick	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: [spam] Re: [AquaticLife] One clownfish dead - have 2 others - pleas

That is odd. I just read that a reef stays between 80 and 90°F. Maybe I read the wrong thing? Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill -------Original Message------- once you hit 83 degrees fish will start to drop, especially gobies, dartfish blennies and the like. so setting your tank at 80 and having lights running on top of that is not a godd idea. a reef should be kept at the same temp as a tropical tank, unless you are doing a cold water tank, then it should be below 70. but thanks for trying to correct something that is not wrong. keeping a tank higher than needed will cause problems if you have a heat spell! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12063	From: Karen	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: Bleach Solution for Cleaning Tanks

Bleach is more for sanitizing and algae. Vinegar and lemon juice work much better for cleaning mineral deposits. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Paul N. Chung" <p_n_chung@y...> wrote: > Hey Valeen, > > Try using Lemon. They are quite effective in cleaning acrylic and glass aquarium. > > Paulo > > > Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@y...> wrote: > hi everyone, > > can anyone tell me the bleach solution i should use to clean out an acrylic tank? and can i use > this same solution to clean aquarium gravel, too? > > thanks, > valeen > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > I love my 2 Ocellaris clownfish! > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Groups Links > > To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12064	From: Patrick	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!

Yeah, I read that reefs stay between 80 and 90°F on another site, so I think it is right. Non-reef sw fish might not take the heat so well, especially if they are not from the tropical reefs. Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill -------Original Message------- Hi Paul, My statement is fact, yours is wrong ! do some research, as I said my tanks (and they total close to 1000galls) all run between 28C and 34C ( that's 82F and 94F ) and they have been up and running for more than six years in this location and very many years in other parts of the world. People have far more problems through temperature being to low than to high. If you try to replicate nature you can't go to far wrong. Regards, unclenorm. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12065	From: Aaron	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: Thanks for the honor of front page

Hi Karen, Your Welcome, it is a awesome photo, she seems to pop off the page like 3D as well as be watching me from every angle as if her eyes move when I do (creepy but cool). I will be puuting the photo onto the FishTankPics home page when I change photos the groups photos again. Hopefully you can post there letting us know how you got such a great image, what kinda camera and settings and all. Aaron --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Karen" <oilfield_brat@y...> wrote: > Wow, just checked in and saw my Red Zebra on the front page. She(?) is > a beauty.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12066	From: Aaron	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: OT - [spam] Re: [AquaticLife] ...

how did SPAM get into the group message header? [spam] Re: [AquaticLife] ... thats weird --- In AquaticLife

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12067	From: Patrick	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: OT - [spam]

That was my fault. I got a new email server and their spam filter is not that great. Every message I send with html code in it has [SPAM] at the beginning. It should be gone now. I forgot to send a message about that like I did in other groups. Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12068	From: harry perry	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: decorations debate/To Patrick

There are some folks here that would consider "you" a ship wreck. I don't. In your post you almost seem to apoligize for your use of decorations. You shouldn't. I said it was my opinion and my choice and that I respect all choices. Someday I will find you and Paul and your ceramic critters in the Smithsonian. I can't wait. Harry Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: Are you crazy? Ever tank HAS to have a ship wreck! Ok, I'm joking. Some can get away with little ceramic frogs or sharks. :) I have a small plastic cave in one of my tank with bubbles, but it isn't for decoration as much as for water movement and a place for the fish to hide. I have a sunken ship in my other tank, but it is mostly for a place for plants to grow on. I can't even see the boat I have so many plants on it. As for divers, I think they look plain stupid. I think such things are mostly for kids to have fun with. The other problem with them is that they all fade and start to look bad. Now I might someday get another ship wreck. I've been thinking of one of the bismarks or a submarine, but only as a historical ornament. Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill -------Original Message------- Enough of this boring B.S. Let's stir things up !!!!. Why after doing all this work and spending all this money would anyone want to add "tank decorations" Bubbling scuba divers, ship wrecks, etc. etc. etc. When was the last time you saw a molly twice the size of a scuba diver?( I am a scuba diver).I respect all points of view but "tank decorations" don't work for me unless they are driftwood, rocks, gravel etc. "My opinion" See if the Smithsonian will buy your "tank decorations". Hey Paul and Pat I especially would like to hear your opinions. Harry [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter --------------------------------- Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12069	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies

Nim, Raising the temperature will raise their metabolism, which will increase their food intake, and lead to faster growth. Be careful not to overdo the temperature. High temperatures can also lead to a shortened lifespan, but the lower 80's should be good, and as they grow, you can start to reduce the temperature somewhat. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nimish Mathur Sent: Saturday, June 04, 2005 7:46 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Betta babies Thanks Steve, I will leave the babies together then. They don't seem interested in the dry food at the moment but their bellies do look overfull. I will keep up with water changes :-). Is raising the temperature to increase their growth? Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: 05 June 2005 00:34 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Betta babies Nim, Congrats on the fry. There is no need to separate the fry at any stage. If they grow up together, including males, there is not the tendency to aggression toward each other as is commonly associated with male bettas. However, should you wish to separate them, the time to do it is when you can reliably sex them. You can start with the powdered food now, as a supplement to what they are now getting in the way of infusoria and other nifty microscopic critters. Just be sure to feed sparingly and closely observe if the fry are feeding on the powdered food. Water change as normal, being careful to not siphon out the fry you have. If you raise the water temperature to the low 80's, then halve the time between water changes. While they are yet too small to do much damage, every fish releases a hormone that inhibits growth. If you are trying to maximize growth, you need to change the water to minimize its presence. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nimish Mathur Sent: Saturday, June 04, 2005 5:51 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Betta babies Guys, About 3 weeks ago, I had a male betta and 2 females in a tank with loads of hiding space and it was going fine and suddenly next day morning all 3 were found dead :-s. Sad, but I fished them out but did not shut off the tank as I did not really have time to do anything to it or even test why it happened. Yesterday, while watching TV, I noticed some movement in the tank. On close inspection I noticed a fry. I inspected in the morning as well and finally counted 4 fry. They are about 1cm long and seem to be feeding well on .. Hmm. Don't know exactly what. There is a flurry of Trumpet snails and ramshorn in there and I think that is what kept the fry growing by creating infusoria. My questions are: They are big enough to be able to take powdered fry food so when is the best time to start? There seems to be enough microscopic food in the tank. When will be a best time to separate them to prevent them from fighting or cannibalizing on each other? There are loads of plants in the tank and it is a 8 gallon tank. Do I need to change water? Or is there anything special to do? I believe that the time when they need baby brine shrimp has passed as these are a bit bigger then newly born guppy fry. Thanks, Nim

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12070	From: Patrick	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: decorations debate/To Patrick

I thought we were trying to make an argument. That is why I called you crazy and plastic divers stupid. :) And I wasn't appologizing for my ugly decorations. If anybody should appologize, it is them for not looking any better, or the bad painters that used paint that fades over the years. Just joking. :) Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill -------Original Message------- There are some folks here that would consider "you" a ship wreck. I don't. In your post you almost seem to apoligize for your use of decorations. You shouldn't. I said it was my opinion and my choice and that I respect all choices. Someday I will find you and Paul and your ceramic critters in the Smithsonian. I can't wait. Harry [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12071	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: largest circular fish tank.. very cool

_http://www.icm-corp.com/aquaDom.htm_ (http://www.icm-corp.com/aquaDom.htm) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12072	From: Dragon Hunter	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: critters

Do those ultra-sonic things bother crusty's such as crayfish or shrimp? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Saturday, June 04, 2005 4:44 PM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] critters > Well, I always feed household insects to the fish and they love it ;) > > If the spiders are not too large and your fish are big enough to gulp a > spider body completely without struggling, they can be fed. > > You also get ultra-sonic spider repellents (for archnophobic people like > me) > that prevent spiders from entering the room in which the repellent is > installed. Cheap stuff but works ;) > > > > Nim > > > > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Paul N. Chung > Sent: 05 June 2005 00:38 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] critters > > > > Hey, > if you arowana, cichlids on your tank... they would love to eat them. > > Paulo > > The Dragon Hunter <dragon.hunter@...> wrote: > I have a quick question for yall. This hasn't happened before, but twice > I've had to take care of spiders in my larger tank. I was just thinking, > rather than squiching them and wiping up the remains, would it be a > "treat" > to feed the next spider to the fish? We're not talking widows, these have > just been normal brown spiders. Would the fish even care or could the > spider hurt the fish? > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Groups Links > > To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > _____ > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > * To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> of Service. > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12073	From: Dragon Hunter	Date: 6/4/2005
Subject: Re: Lake Havasu

Thinking about going there a little prepared and trying to catch one of those biting suckers the next time I head out there. I still have my fishing license, so I doubt I'll be hassled. No diff. between eating them or trying to keep them imo. They're removed from the lake regardless. lol Wonder if what ever I get would be safe for my tropical or if I should set up a seperate tank for it. Ah well. Two months away for me to prepare....If I can even get the buggers. ----- Original Message ----- From: "paul helms" <wtfmorlok@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Friday, June 03, 2005 2:26 PM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Lake Havasu > bony tail chub and razorback suckers are bred there, > as well as game fish such as black bass, striped bass, > cats, blue gill, croppie, and cat fish. > > --- The Dragon Hunter > <dragon.hunter@...> wrote: > >> Say, does anyone here know what fish are in Lake >> Havasu in Arizona? >> >> Curious more than anything else, but I know there is >> one species that >> doesn't care about the boats or anything else as the >> buggers usually bite me >> when I'm in the lake near shore. I never see the >> buggers, and they never >> bite my legs. just my back. They've biten other >> people's legs. Just >> curious as I've bought a snorkle set so I can try to >> see them. >> >> Thanks in advance and have a good weekend! >> >> >> > > > > > __________________________________ > Discover Yahoo! > Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online and more. Check it out! > http://discover.yahoo.com/ > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12074	From: paul helms	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: critters

no they do not --- Dragon Hunter <dragon.hunter@...> wrote: > Do those ultra-sonic things bother crusty's such as > crayfish or shrimp? > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@...> > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Saturday, June 04, 2005 4:44 PM > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] critters > > > > Well, I always feed household insects to the fish > and they love it ;) > > > > If the spiders are not too large and your fish are > big enough to gulp a > > spider body completely without struggling, they > can be fed. > > > > You also get ultra-sonic spider repellents (for > archnophobic people like > > me) > > that prevent spiders from entering the room in > which the repellent is > > installed. Cheap stuff but works ;) > > > > > > > > Nim > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Paul N. Chung > > Sent: 05 June 2005 00:38 > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] critters > > > > > > > > Hey, > > if you arowana, cichlids on your tank... they > would love to eat them. > > > > Paulo > > > > The Dragon Hunter > <dragon.hunter@...> wrote: > > I have a quick question for yall. This hasn't > happened before, but twice > > I've had to take care of spiders in my larger > tank. I was just thinking, > > rather than squiching them and wiping up the > remains, would it be a > > "treat" > > to feed the next spider to the fish? We're not > talking widows, these have > > just been normal brown spiders. Would the fish > even care or could the > > spider hurt the fish? > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > when replying, thanks > > . > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text > that is not important to > > the reply and if changing the topic of the > original message modify the > > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <-, we Thank You > > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > To visit your group on the web, go to: > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email > to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > protection around > > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > when replying, thanks > > . > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text > that is not important to > > the reply and if changing the topic of the > original message modify the > > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <-, we Thank You > > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > * To visit your group on the web, go to: > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email > to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> of Service. > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > when replying, thanks > > . > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text > that is not important to > > the reply and if changing the topic of the > original message modify the > > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <-, we Thank You > > in Advance for your help in this matter > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Make Yahoo! your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12075	From: paul helms	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: decorations debate/To Patrick

lmao --- harry perry <harryfisherman@...> wrote: > There are some folks here that would consider "you" > a ship wreck. I don't. In your post you almost seem > to apoligize for your use of decorations. You > shouldn't. I said it was my opinion and my choice > and that I respect all choices. Someday I will find > you and Paul and your ceramic critters in the > Smithsonian. I can't wait. > > Harry > > Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: > Are you crazy? Ever tank HAS to have a ship > wreck! Ok, I'm joking. > Some can get away with little ceramic frogs or > sharks. :) I have a small > plastic cave in one of my tank with bubbles, but it > isn't for decoration as > much as for water movement and a place for the fish > to hide. I have a > sunken ship in my other tank, but it is mostly for a > place for plants to > grow on. I can't even see the boat I have so many > plants on it. As for > divers, I think they look plain stupid. I think > such things are mostly for > kids to have fun with. The other problem with them > is that they all fade > and start to look bad. Now I might someday get > another ship wreck. I've > been thinking of one of the bismarks or a submarine, > but only as a > historical ornament. > > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy. > > "Now this is not the end. It is not even the > beginning of the end. But it is > perhaps, the end of the beginning." > -Winston Churchill > -------Original Message------- > Enough of this boring B.S. Let's stir things up > !!!!. Why after doing all > this work and spending all this money would anyone > want to add "tank > decorations" Bubbling scuba divers, ship wrecks, > etc. etc. etc. When was the > last time you saw a molly twice the size of a scuba > diver?( I am a scuba > diver).I respect all points of view but "tank > decorations" don't work for me > unless they are driftwood, rocks, gravel etc. "My > opinion" See if the > Smithsonian will buy your "tank decorations". > > Hey Paul and Pat I especially would like to hear > your opinions. > > Harry > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when > replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text > that is not important to the reply and if changing > the topic of the original message modify the subject > line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, > we Thank You in Advance for your help in this > matter > > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Groups Links > > To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Stay in touch with email, IM, photo sharing and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/stayintouch.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12076	From: paul helms	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!

check the national coast temps and you will not find much over 83, but hey what do i know...not like i have any experience or anything. and thaose temps are at shore, not a ways out, or even where fish can go deeper to cool off or anything. --- Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: > Yeah, I read that reefs stay between 80 and 90°F on > another site, so I think > it is right. Non-reef sw fish might not take the > heat so well, especially > if they are not from the tropical reefs. > > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy. > > "Now this is not the end. It is not even the > beginning of the end. But it is > perhaps, the end of the beginning." > -Winston Churchill > -------Original Message------- > Hi Paul, > My statement is fact, yours is wrong ! do > some research, as I said > my tanks (and they total close to > 1000galls) all run between 28C and 34C ( that's 82F > and 94F ) and they have > been up and running for more than six years in this > location and very many > years in other parts of the world. People have far > more problems through > temperature being to low than to high. If you try to > replicate nature you > can't go to far wrong. > Regards, > unclenorm. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Find restaurants, movies, travel and more fun for the weekend. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/weekend.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12077	From: paul helms	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: [spam] Re: [AquaticLife] One clownfish dead - have 2 others - p

Kleypas, J. A., J. W. McManus, and L. A. B. Menez. 1999. Environmental Limits to Coral Reef Development: Where Do We Draw The Line. American Zoologist. 39: 146-159. These authors took measurements from over 1000 different reefs, and determined the physical and chemical limits statistically. The temperatures they found (Converted to Degrees Fahrenheit): Averages: Minimum = 69.8º; Maximum 85.1º; Average = 81.(this is the average temperature of all coral reefs). --- Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: > That is odd. I just read that a reef stays between > 80 and 90°F. Maybe I > read the wrong thing? > > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy. > > "Now this is not the end. It is not even the > beginning of the end. But it is > perhaps, the end of the beginning." > -Winston Churchill > -------Original Message------- > once you hit 83 degrees fish will start to drop, > especially gobies, dartfish > blennies and the like. > so setting your tank at 80 and having lights running > on top of that is not a > godd idea. a reef should be > kept at the same temp as a tropical tank, unless you > are doing a cold water > tank, then it should be below > 70. but thanks for trying to correct something that > is not wrong. keeping > a tank higher than needed will > cause problems if you have a heat spell! > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/mobile.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12078	From: paul helms	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!

guess what smart guy, mine is not wrong. it is based on many years of experience, if you really wanna compare, i have 385 gallons in my home and nearly 2,000 at work. and if you will check some recent posts you will see documented and cited averages world wide on reef as 81 degrees. --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> wrote: > Hi Paul, > My statement is fact, yours is wrong ! do > some > research, as I said my tanks (and they total close > to > 1000galls) all run between 28C and 34C ( that's 82F > and 94F ) and they have been up and running for more > than six years in this location and very many years > in > other parts of the world. People have far more > problems through temperature being to low than to > high. If you try to replicate nature you can't go to > far wrong. > Regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > once you hit 83 degrees fish will start to drop, > > especially gobies, dartfish, blennies and the > like. > > so setting your tank at 80 and having lights > running > > on top of that is not a godd idea. a reef should > be > > kept at the same temp as a tropical tank, unless > you > > are doing a cold water tank, then it should be > below > > 70. but thanks for trying to correct something > that > > is not wrong. keeping a tank higher than needed > > will > > cause problems if you have a heat spell! > > > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> > > wrote: > > > > > Hi Paul, > > > 80 Is not to hot for a salt water tank, > > the > > > normal temp. of a tropical reef is between 80 > and > > > 90. > > > All my tanks, mostly reef run at 32/33C this > time > > of > > > year, (they will rise a bit more yet) and 28/29C > > in > > > the cold season, I live in the tropics. > > > regards, > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > > > > > first of all, damsels are aggressive and > > > > territorial, > > > > second if you have no protein skimmer i > > guarantee > > > > your > > > > nitrates are not fine. fish breathe hard liek > > > that > > > > when they are suffering from nitrate > poisoning. > > > > third > > > > 80 is too hot for a sw tank. > > > > > > > > --- Sheila <smccamy@...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > We lost our first clownfish this morning and > > we > > > > only > > > > > got him last > > > > > Saturday. When we got him, we put him in our > > > > > established tank with a > > > > > female Blue Damselfish, a Coral Banded > Shrimp, > > > and > > > > a > > > > > green Hermit Crab. > > > > > From the start, he was rapidly opening and > > > closing > > > > > his mouth non-stop. > > > > > I called the pet store and they told me that > > was > > > > > normal for clownfish. > > > > > Over the next few days, he wasn't eating and > > > would > > > > > stay in one corner > > > > > of the tank. Then he began hanging out at > the > > > > water > > > > > line like he was > > > > > trying to get air. I did tests on the water > - > > > > > salinity, amonia, > > > > > nitrite, nitrate - it all tested fine. Now > the > > > new > > > > > Clarkii clowns we > > > > > got this morning are doing the same mouth > > thing, > > > > > like they are > > > > > breathing very rapidly. They did eat a bit > > > earlier > > > > > and do not appear to > > > > > be stressed, but are they supposed to open > and > > > > close > > > > > their mouths > > > > > constantly? The Blue Damselfish doesn't do > > that. > > > > > Please - any advice > > > > > would be appreciated! Is there something > else > > > that > > > > > might be wrong with > > > > > the water? Do we need an airstone or air > pump? > > > We > > > > > have a BIO Wheel > > > > > filter, a heater and the temp is around 80. > > > Please > > > > > help - I don't want > > > > > to lose these two fish! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > > > > Discover Yahoo! > > > > Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, > news > > > and > > > > more. Check it out! > > > > http://discover.yahoo.com/mobile.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > > > > How much free photo storage do you get? Store > your > > > holiday > > > snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos > > > http://uk.photos.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > > Discover Yahoo! > > Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online and > > more. Check it out! > > http://discover.yahoo.com/ > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > How much free photo storage do you get? Store your > holiday > snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos > http://uk.photos.yahoo.com > __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail Mobile Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone. http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12079	From: paul helms	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: last post on biospira

that i would buy eric! --- Eric Miner <eminer1254@...> wrote: > I too fell that it takes some time to establish a > stong and viable > bacteria colony. On May 23rd I started a fishless > cycle using > Bio-Spira. Today, June 4th, the nitrite peak is past > and leveled out. > I'm now ready to do a water change and add my fish. > > While this is not immediate, it is darn fast. Yeah, > I could have done > this with starter bateria from another tank, but in > my case I don't > have anouther tank. Unlike other products on the > market Bio-Sipra > contains the required bacterial strains. > > I don't think I'd add it and then fish a day later, > but as a 'trigger' > for a fishless cycling it's good stuff. > > Just my $0.02 worth > > Eric > > Charlotte,N.C. > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > <wtfmorlok@y...> wrote: > > there is no such thing as instant cycle, you can > buy > > into it if you want. adding the correct bacteria > to > > the water does not mean that they have cultured > > properly and will absolutely work. if you check > back > > you will find that biospira has had several bad > > batches which were ineffective. i bet you $20.00 > i > > could go fill a tank from the tap, and some stress > > zyme and amquel plus, throw in fish tomorrow and > not > > lose any, in fact i have doen it many times, just > > would not recommend it to anyone. just because i > have > > done it successfully many times, does not mean > that it > > is proven, nor reliable. i could probably get you > the > > names of 20 other people who have done the same > > successsfully. in fact there are problably many > older > > fish keepers here who have done it as well. > despite > > knowing dozens who have done it, there are > hundreds > > who have failed. same with biospira. i know 3 or > 4 > > experienced fish keepers that failed with said bad > > batches and were refunded their money based on the > > manufacture date of the product, but still cost > them a > > good chunk of change in fish loss. in any case, > > believe what you want, say what you want, think > what > > you want. that is why it is good to be an > american. > > just does not mean that i have to agree with you, > and > > definately does not mean that i will not post > negative > > reviews of it when new people are told to use it. > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > > Yahoo! Mail Mobile > > Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your > mobile phone. > > http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail > > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12080	From: paul helms	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: Instant cycle ? / I don't understand./some observations.

in the past 3 years there has been a large decline in the amount of tank decorationts sold and bought in my area. many people are going to the large plastic molds of ships thgat fish can actually swim through and do not lose their colors easily. the problem is that said pieces are generally in excess of 50 dollars. a bit much. i have founf that the majority of people in the bay area with fish tanks are steering towards a more natural tank. not necessarily a planted tank by definition, but a tank with single colors and a few live plants. the hobby in the bay area of california has also greatly shifted to a family/adult hobby. the larger tanks are set up to be centerpieces, and the effect seems to rub off on the children. most of the small decorations that i have sold in the past few years have been either to non native children, or parents trying to live vicariously through 10 gallons tanks for their children. personally i like the natural look. i use untreated gravel, also called pebble beach sand, and bowl rock with assorted plants like elodia, horn wart, java fern, java moss, mondo grass, amazon sword, dwarf lilly, apogea, bannana plant, green hedge, etc. when i was 13 and first starting out i had lime green and blue gravel with a volcano that pured out sand (air driven) with plastic plants. the fish don't care! they hide in ity just the same. lmao. --- harry perry <harryfisherman@...> wrote: > I've encountered the coversation about instant > cycling in all the fish groups. My opinion, since > most of us are not scientists we are only posting > our experiences and hoping it will help. > > Why does it have to be instant?. The average person > thinks about starting a tank, maybe for months, > maybe years and decides to do it. Now it has to be > instant? Why?. You already waited months or years. > These fish have been around for millions of years > chances are they will be around for a bit longer. At > least a couple of weeks. > > After keeping fish for years, again my opinion, I've > found that what works for me is to start the new > tank(I only do planted tanks). Add everything but > fish. I use Stress coat and Stress Zyne. > > Then the most important part...... I research what > I'm about to do. So I don't end up with a 30 gal. > tank with 3 foot pacus' or what I'm seeing a lot of, > is the plecos. Some stay small (4") some don't (1 > foot). In the time it takes you to research, water > requirements, ph, hardness etc. The tank will be > ready to go.(test it first). > > Enough of this boring B.S. Let's stir things up > !!!!. Why after doing all this work and spending all > this money would anyone want to add "tank > decorations" Bubbling scuba divers, ship wrecks, > etc. etc. etc. When was the last time you saw a > molly twice the size of a scuba diver?( I am a scuba > diver).I respect all points of view but "tank > decorations" don't work for me unless they are > driftwood, rocks, gravel etc. "My opinion" See if > the Smithsonian will buy your "tank decorations". > > Hey Paul and Pat I especially would like to hear > your opinions. > > Harry > , > > > --------------------------------- > Discover Yahoo! > Find restaurants, movies, travel & more fun for the > weekend. Check it out! > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12081	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: largest circular fish tank.. very cool

That is amazing. I can't even imagine the construction efforts that went into that! Thanks for sharing! Leslie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of agentscullyeyore@... Sent: Sunday, June 05, 2005 1:17 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] largest circular fish tank.. very cool _http://www.icm-corp.com/aquaDom.htm_ (http://www.icm-corp.com/aquaDom.htm) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12082	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: Lake Havasu

While you do need a fishing license in many states to collect fish, there are regulations and/or laws on the books that restrict what you can collect and keep in an aquarium. It may be wise to check these first before you go ahead and collect those fish that are nibbling at you. You can do that probably by just checking the Fish and Game website of your state (or the state you will be in). F&G often goes by various names in different states, so use what you have in your state. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Dragon Hunter Sent: Sunday, June 05, 2005 2:35 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Lake Havasu Thinking about going there a little prepared and trying to catch one of those biting suckers the next time I head out there. I still have my fishing license, so I doubt I'll be hassled. No diff. between eating them or trying to keep them imo. They're removed from the lake regardless. lol Wonder if what ever I get would be safe for my tropical or if I should set up a seperate tank for it. Ah well. Two months away for me to prepare....If I can even get the buggers. ----- Original Message ----- From: "paul helms" <wtfmorlok@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Friday, June 03, 2005 2:26 PM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Lake Havasu > bony tail chub and razorback suckers are bred there, > as well as game fish such as black bass, striped bass, > cats, blue gill, croppie, and cat fish. > > --- The Dragon Hunter > <dragon.hunter@...> wrote: > >> Say, does anyone here know what fish are in Lake >> Havasu in Arizona? >> >> Curious more than anything else, but I know there is >> one species that >> doesn't care about the boats or anything else as the >> buggers usually bite me >> when I'm in the lake near shore. I never see the >> buggers, and they never >> bite my legs. just my back. They've biten other >> people's legs. Just >> curious as I've bought a snorkle set so I can try to >> see them. >> >> Thanks in advance and have a good weekend! >> >> >> > > > > > __________________________________ > Discover Yahoo! > Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online and more. Check it out! > http://discover.yahoo.com/ > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12083	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: [spam] Re: [AquaticLife] One clownfish dead - have 2 others - p

Hi Paul, An average temp of 1000 reefs isn't worth the paper its written on, most of them must have been sub tropical anyway. As I'm sure you are aware you can make statistics say anything, ask a politician. My figures are for tropical reefs were the vast majority of the fish available in the hobby come from, I would add that my figures are probably now on the low side as I haven't been diving for a number of years and the tropical sea's are slowly getting warmer. Your own oceanographic institute have articles on sea temps on line that will confirm my figures or look up Dr Ron Shimek's article on water temps. around tropical reefs. regards, unclenorm. --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > Kleypas, J. A., J. W. McManus, and L. A. B. Menez. > 1999. Environmental Limits to Coral Reef > Development: > Where Do We Draw The Line. American Zoologist. 39: > 146-159. > > These authors took measurements from over 1000 > different reefs, and determined the physical and > chemical limits statistically. > > The temperatures they found (Converted to Degrees > Fahrenheit): > > Averages: Minimum = 69.8º; Maximum 85.1º; Average = > 81.(this is the average temperature of all coral > reefs). > > > > --- Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: > > > That is odd. I just read that a reef stays > between > > 80 and 90°F. Maybe I > > read the wrong thing? > > > > > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy. > > > > "Now this is not the end. It is not even the > > beginning of the end. But it is > > perhaps, the end of the beginning." > > -Winston Churchill > > -------Original Message------- > > once you hit 83 degrees fish will start to drop, > > especially gobies, dartfish > > blennies and the like. > > so setting your tank at 80 and having lights > running > > on top of that is not a > > godd idea. a reef should be > > kept at the same temp as a tropical tank, unless > you > > are doing a cold water > > tank, then it should be below > > 70. but thanks for trying to correct something > that > > is not wrong. keeping > > a tank higher than needed will > > cause problems if you have a heat spell! > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > Discover Yahoo! > Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news and > more. Check it out! > http://discover.yahoo.com/mobile.html > ___________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12084	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!

Well Paul some one is trying to be smart but it's not me, your quoting average temps again for reefs world wide which may well be true as if you didn't know there are reef in some very cold parts of the word. If you read my post again you will see I was quite specific in stating I was referring to TROPICAL reefs,and my figures are temperatures taken by me not from a book or an average of a thousand reefs (which must have taken a good few years to collect) but from many reefs in south east Asia were the vast majority of the worlds TROPICAL reefs are located. As for comparisons all my tanks are at home I have no commercial interest in the hobby but I do have more than fifty years experience keeping and breeding fish of many species. The only reason I post on these groups is to try to help people if I can or correct wrong information if I know it to be wrong from personal experience. So Paul except that you have a kink in your knowledge and lets drop it. regards, unclenorm. --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > guess what smart guy, mine is not wrong. it is > based > on many years of experience, if you really wanna > compare, i have 385 gallons in my home and nearly > 2,000 at work. and if you will check some recent > posts you will see documented and cited averages > world > wide on reef as 81 degrees. > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> > wrote: > > > Hi Paul, > > My statement is fact, yours is wrong ! do > > some > > research, as I said my tanks (and they total close > > to > > 1000galls) all run between 28C and 34C ( that's > 82F > > and 94F ) and they have been up and running for > more > > than six years in this location and very many > years > > in > > other parts of the world. People have far more > > problems through temperature being to low than to > > high. If you try to replicate nature you can't go > to > > far wrong. > > Regards, > > unclenorm. > > > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > > > once you hit 83 degrees fish will start to drop, > > > especially gobies, dartfish, blennies and the > > like. > > > so setting your tank at 80 and having lights > > running > > > on top of that is not a godd idea. a reef > should > > be > > > kept at the same temp as a tropical tank, unless > > you > > > are doing a cold water tank, then it should be > > below > > > 70. but thanks for trying to correct something > > that > > > is not wrong. keeping a tank higher than needed > > > will > > > cause problems if you have a heat spell! > > > > > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." > <normnam2000@...> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > Hi Paul, > > > > 80 Is not to hot for a salt water > tank, > > > the > > > > normal temp. of a tropical reef is between 80 > > and > > > > 90. > > > > All my tanks, mostly reef run at 32/33C this > > time > > > of > > > > year, (they will rise a bit more yet) and > 28/29C > > > in > > > > the cold season, I live in the tropics. > > > > regards, > > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > first of all, damsels are aggressive and > > > > > territorial, > > > > > second if you have no protein skimmer i > > > guarantee > > > > > your > > > > > nitrates are not fine. fish breathe hard > liek > > > > that > > > > > when they are suffering from nitrate > > poisoning. > > > > > third > > > > > 80 is too hot for a sw tank. > > > > > > > > > > --- Sheila <smccamy@...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > We lost our first clownfish this morning > and > > > we > > > > > only > > > > > > got him last > > > > > > Saturday. When we got him, we put him in > our > > > > > > established tank with a > > > > > > female Blue Damselfish, a Coral Banded > > Shrimp, > > > > and > > > > > a > > > > > > green Hermit Crab. > > > > > > From the start, he was rapidly opening and > > > > closing > > > > > > his mouth non-stop. > > > > > > I called the pet store and they told me > that > > > was > > > > > > normal for clownfish. > > > > > > Over the next few days, he wasn't eating > and > > > > would > > > > > > stay in one corner > > > > > > of the tank. Then he began hanging out at > > the > > > > > water > > > > > > line like he was > > > > > > trying to get air. I did tests on the > water > > - > > > > > > salinity, amonia, > > > > > > nitrite, nitrate - it all tested fine. Now > > the > > > > new > > > > > > Clarkii clowns we > > > > > > got this morning are doing the same mouth > > > thing, > > > > > > like they are > > > > > > breathing very rapidly. They did eat a bit > > > > earlier > > > > > > and do not appear to > > > > > > be stressed, but are they supposed to open > > and > > > > > close > > > > > > their mouths > > > > > > constantly? The Blue Damselfish doesn't do > > > that. > > > > > > Please - any advice > > > > > > would be appreciated! Is there something > > else > > > > that > > > > > > might be wrong with > > > > > > the water? Do we need an airstone or air > > pump? > > > > We > > > > > > have a BIO Wheel > > > > > > filter, a heater and the temp is around > 80. > > > > Please > > > > > > help - I don't want > > > > > > to lose these two fish! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > > > > > Discover Yahoo! > > > > > Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, > > news > > > > and > > > > > more. Check it out! > > > > > http://discover.yahoo.com/mobile.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > > > > > > How much free photo storage do you get? Store > > your > > > > holiday > > > > snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos > > > > http://uk.photos.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > > > Discover Yahoo! > > > Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online > and > > > more. Check it out! > > > http://discover.yahoo.com/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > > How much free photo storage do you get? Store your > > holiday > > snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos > > http://uk.photos.yahoo.com > > > > > > > __________________________________ > Yahoo! Mail Mobile > Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your > mobile phone. > http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail > ___________________________________________________________ How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12085	From: Patrick	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!

Paul, that is called a "spin". You only took the part of the statistics that fit your argument and left out the rest (a proper use of statistics, according to my ed stats teacher. :) I will show a link to where that information probably came from, along with what was left out: http://rshimek.com/reef/tempsal.htm These averages were taken by the posted scientists from 1000 reefs, and this is what they got: "Averages: Minimum = 69.8º; Maximum 85.1º; Average = 81.(this is the average temperature of all coral reefs). Minimums; Lowest = 60.8º; Highest = 82.8º; Average = 76.4º. Maximums: Lowest = 76.2º; Highest = 93.9;º Average = 86.4º." This is what they got at the warmest reefs: "Extreme Reefs (Maximum Weekly Temperature in Deg. F; Salinity in ppt) Southern Red Sea = 89.1ºF - 91.2º F; 38-40ppt. Central Red Sea = 88.7 ºF - 89.1º F ; 40-41 ppt. Northern Red Sea = up to 88º F; 41-42 ppt." It goes on to say the best temp for a reef tank is 82-84°F. I did some research and found that the average temperature of the Great Barier Reef is around 80°, but it gets to 85°. I have no experience at all with marine fish beyond finding Nemo, but I couldn't let half the data get left out. :) Patrick, an American Fish Guy.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12086	From: paul helms	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!

i left in the overall average, which is the pont of the whole thing, not that there a re a few places in the red sea that are higher. it specifically states that the average of all coral reefs is 81. it does not say the average of each individual reef is 81, therefore not "spin". had it stated that no reef was higher than 81 it would have been spin, but as the average of 1000 tested, not spin. --- Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: > Paul, that is called a "spin". You only took the > part of the statistics > that fit your argument and left out the rest (a > proper use of statistics, > according to my ed stats teacher. :) I will show a > link to where that > information probably came from, along with what was > left out: > > http://rshimek.com/reef/tempsal.htm > > These averages were taken by the posted scientists > from 1000 reefs, and this > is what they got: > > "Averages: Minimum = 69.8º; Maximum 85.1º; Average = > 81.(this is the average > temperature of all coral reefs). > Minimums; Lowest = 60.8º; Highest = 82.8º; Average = > 76.4º. > Maximums: Lowest = 76.2º; Highest = 93.9;º Average = > 86.4º." > > This is what they got at the warmest reefs: > > "Extreme Reefs (Maximum Weekly Temperature in Deg. > F; Salinity in ppt) > Southern Red Sea = 89.1ºF - 91.2º F; 38-40ppt. > Central Red Sea = 88.7 ºF - 89.1º F ; 40-41 ppt. > Northern Red Sea = up to 88º F; 41-42 ppt." > > It goes on to say the best temp for a reef tank is > 82-84°F. > > I did some research and found that the average > temperature of the Great > Barier Reef is around 80°, but it gets to 85°. I > have no experience at all > with marine fish beyond finding Nemo, but I couldn't > let half the data get > left out. :) > > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy. > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Have fun online with music videos, cool games, IM and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/online.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12087	From: paul helms	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!

i am not going to drop iot becauyse you once again stick your nose iun to tell someone they are wrong when talking about an aquarium. the fish kept in aquarium are not from a singular location and will not all do ok in higher temps like that. when i told someone that 80 is not a real safe temp because their tank can easily overheat at that temp and lose fish, i was not incorrect, and far more helpful than stating that 90 is ok. you can say whatever you want about it being tropicalor whatever, but the simple fact is that not all fish in the hobby can handle that kind of temperature, and as i stated, many will start to die off in temps exceding 83 degrees. don't tell people they are wrong when they are talking about the hobby and you are talking about tropical reefs, and not tanks. --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> wrote: > Well Paul some one is trying to be smart but it's > not > me, your quoting average temps again for reefs world > wide which may well be true as if you didn't know > there are reef in some very cold parts of the word. > If > you read my post again you will see I was quite > specific in stating I was referring to TROPICAL > reefs,and my figures are temperatures taken by me > not > from a book or an average of a thousand reefs (which > must have taken a good few years to collect) but > from > many reefs in south east Asia were the vast majority > of the worlds TROPICAL reefs are located. As for > comparisons all my tanks are at home I have no > commercial interest in the hobby but I do have more > than fifty years experience keeping and breeding > fish > of many species. The only reason I post on these > groups is to try to help people if I can or correct > wrong information if I know it to be wrong from > personal experience. So Paul except that you have a > kink in your knowledge and lets drop it. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > guess what smart guy, mine is not wrong. it is > > based > > on many years of experience, if you really wanna > > compare, i have 385 gallons in my home and nearly > > 2,000 at work. and if you will check some recent > > posts you will see documented and cited averages > > world > > wide on reef as 81 degrees. > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> > > wrote: > > > > > Hi Paul, > > > My statement is fact, yours is wrong ! > do > > > some > > > research, as I said my tanks (and they total > close > > > to > > > 1000galls) all run between 28C and 34C ( that's > > 82F > > > and 94F ) and they have been up and running for > > more > > > than six years in this location and very many > > years > > > in > > > other parts of the world. People have far more > > > problems through temperature being to low than > to > > > high. If you try to replicate nature you can't > go > > to > > > far wrong. > > > Regards, > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > > > > > once you hit 83 degrees fish will start to > drop, > > > > especially gobies, dartfish, blennies and the > > > like. > > > > so setting your tank at 80 and having lights > > > running > > > > on top of that is not a godd idea. a reef > > should > > > be > > > > kept at the same temp as a tropical tank, > unless > > > you > > > > are doing a cold water tank, then it should be > > > below > > > > 70. but thanks for trying to correct > something > > > that > > > > is not wrong. keeping a tank higher than > needed > > > > will > > > > cause problems if you have a heat spell! > > > > > > > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." > > <normnam2000@...> > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > Hi Paul, > > > > > 80 Is not to hot for a salt water > > tank, > > > > the > > > > > normal temp. of a tropical reef is between > 80 > > > and > > > > > 90. > > > > > All my tanks, mostly reef run at 32/33C this > > > time > > > > of > > > > > year, (they will rise a bit more yet) and > > 28/29C > > > > in > > > > > the cold season, I live in the tropics. > > > > > regards, > > > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > first of all, damsels are aggressive and > > > > > > territorial, > > > > > > second if you have no protein skimmer i > > > > guarantee > > > > > > your > > > > > > nitrates are not fine. fish breathe hard > > liek > > > > > that > > > > > > when they are suffering from nitrate > > > poisoning. > > > > > > third > > > > > > 80 is too hot for a sw tank. > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Sheila <smccamy@...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > We lost our first clownfish this morning > > and > > > > we > > > > > > only > > > > > > > got him last > > > > > > > Saturday. When we got him, we put him in > > our > > > > > > > established tank with a > > > > > > > female Blue Damselfish, a Coral Banded > > > Shrimp, > > > > > and > > > > > > a > > > > > > > green Hermit Crab. > > > > > > > From the start, he was rapidly opening > and > > > > > closing > > > > > > > his mouth non-stop. > > > > > > > I called the pet store and they told me > > that > > > > was > > > > > > > normal for clownfish. > > > > > > > Over the next few days, he wasn't eating > > and > > > > > would > > > > > > > stay in one corner > > > > > > > of the tank. Then he began hanging out > at > > > the > > > > > > water > > > > > > > line like he was > > > > > > > trying to get air. I did tests on the > > water > > > - > > > > > > > salinity, amonia, > > > > > > > nitrite, nitrate - it all tested fine. > Now > > > the > > > > > new > > > > > > > Clarkii clowns we > > > > > > > got this morning are doing the same > mouth > > > > thing, > > > > > > > like they are > > > > > > > breathing very rapidly. They did eat a > bit > > > > > earlier > > > > > > > and do not appear to > > > > > > > be stressed, but are they supposed to > open > > > and > > > > > > close > > > > > > > their mouths > > > > > > > constantly? The Blue Damselfish doesn't > do > > > > that. > > > > > > > Please - any advice > > > > > > > would be appreciated! Is there something > > > else > > > > > that > > > > > > > might be wrong with > > > > > > > the water? Do we need an airstone or air > > > pump? > > > > > We > > > > > > > have a BIO Wheel > > > > > > > filter, a heater and the temp is around > > 80. > > > > > Please > > > > > > > help - I don't want > > > > > > > to lose these two fish! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > === message truncated === __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail Mobile Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone. http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12088	From: paul helms	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!

since you want to use ronald l shimek phd as refernce as well, here is a direct quote from his book "marine invertebrates" "most coral reefs have temperatures that range between 78-86. the average of 1000 reefs is 81." "some corals can survive from temps of 68-90, and they are often found in areas where the temps reach the extremes or are predominately shifted to either the colder or the hotter parts of their range. animals living in such marginal environments are not thriving , they are simply surviving." he goes on to state that he believes in keeping tanks between 80 and 84 and at higher salinity, but i would not doubt that this is to keep parasites and disease at bay, and that he can afford teh equipment to keep it in that exact range, such as chillers and teh like. like i said before you can have problems once you go above 83 degress. i aslo referenced a type of fish first effected as gobies, which is the case. when tanks run from 85-90, and have not been acclimated that way, the gobies and blennies and dart fish will start to drop like flies. --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> wrote: > Well Paul some one is trying to be smart but it's > not > me, your quoting average temps again for reefs world > wide which may well be true as if you didn't know > there are reef in some very cold parts of the word. > If > you read my post again you will see I was quite > specific in stating I was referring to TROPICAL > reefs,and my figures are temperatures taken by me > not > from a book or an average of a thousand reefs (which > must have taken a good few years to collect) but > from > many reefs in south east Asia were the vast majority > of the worlds TROPICAL reefs are located. As for > comparisons all my tanks are at home I have no > commercial interest in the hobby but I do have more > than fifty years experience keeping and breeding > fish > of many species. The only reason I post on these > groups is to try to help people if I can or correct > wrong information if I know it to be wrong from > personal experience. So Paul except that you have a > kink in your knowledge and lets drop it. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > guess what smart guy, mine is not wrong. it is > > based > > on many years of experience, if you really wanna > > compare, i have 385 gallons in my home and nearly > > 2,000 at work. and if you will check some recent > > posts you will see documented and cited averages > > world > > wide on reef as 81 degrees. > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> > > wrote: > > > > > Hi Paul, > > > My statement is fact, yours is wrong ! > do > > > some > > > research, as I said my tanks (and they total > close > > > to > > > 1000galls) all run between 28C and 34C ( that's > > 82F > > > and 94F ) and they have been up and running for > > more > > > than six years in this location and very many > > years > > > in > > > other parts of the world. People have far more > > > problems through temperature being to low than > to > > > high. If you try to replicate nature you can't > go > > to > > > far wrong. > > > Regards, > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > > > > > once you hit 83 degrees fish will start to > drop, > > > > especially gobies, dartfish, blennies and the > > > like. > > > > so setting your tank at 80 and having lights > > > running > > > > on top of that is not a godd idea. a reef > > should > > > be > > > > kept at the same temp as a tropical tank, > unless > > > you > > > > are doing a cold water tank, then it should be > > > below > > > > 70. but thanks for trying to correct > something > > > that > > > > is not wrong. keeping a tank higher than > needed > > > > will > > > > cause problems if you have a heat spell! > > > > > > > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." > > <normnam2000@...> > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > Hi Paul, > > > > > 80 Is not to hot for a salt water > > tank, > > > > the > > > > > normal temp. of a tropical reef is between > 80 > > > and > > > > > 90. > > > > > All my tanks, mostly reef run at 32/33C this > > > time > > > > of > > > > > year, (they will rise a bit more yet) and > > 28/29C > > > > in > > > > > the cold season, I live in the tropics. > > > > > regards, > > > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > first of all, damsels are aggressive and > > > > > > territorial, > > > > > > second if you have no protein skimmer i > > > > guarantee > > > > > > your > > > > > > nitrates are not fine. fish breathe hard > > liek > > > > > that > > > > > > when they are suffering from nitrate > > > poisoning. > > > > > > third > > > > > > 80 is too hot for a sw tank. > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Sheila <smccamy@...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > We lost our first clownfish this morning > > and > > > > we > > > > > > only > > > > > > > got him last > > > > > > > Saturday. When we got him, we put him in > > our > > > > > > > established tank with a > > > > > > > female Blue Damselfish, a Coral Banded > > > Shrimp, > > > > > and > > > > > > a > > > > > > > green Hermit Crab. > > > > > > > From the start, he was rapidly opening > and > > > > > closing > > > > > > > his mouth non-stop. > > > > > > > I called the pet store and they told me > > that > > > > was > > > > > > > normal for clownfish. > > > > > > > Over the next few days, he wasn't eating > > and > > > > > would > > > > > > > stay in one corner > > > > > > > of the tank. Then he began hanging out > at > > > the > > > > > > water > > > > > > > line like he was > > > > > > > trying to get air. I did tests on the > > water > > > - > > > > > > > salinity, amonia, > > > > > > > nitrite, nitrate - it all tested fine. > Now > > > the > > > > > new > > > > > > > Clarkii clowns we > > > > > > > got this morning are doing the same > mouth > > > > thing, > > > > > > > like they are > > > > > > > breathing very rapidly. They did eat a > bit > > > > > earlier > > > > > > > and do not appear to > > > > > > > be stressed, but are they supposed to > open > > > and > > > > > > close > > > > > > > their mouths > > > > > > > constantly? The Blue Damselfish doesn't > do > > > > that. > > > > > > > Please - any advice > > > > > > > would be appreciated! Is there something > > > else > > > > > that > > > > > > > might be wrong with > > > > > > > the water? Do we need an airstone or air > > > pump? > > > > > We > > > > > > > have a BIO Wheel > > > > > > > filter, a heater and the temp is around > > 80. > > > > > Please > > > > > > > help - I don't want > > > > > > > to lose these two fish! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > === message truncated === __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Read only the mail you want - Yahoo! Mail SpamGuard. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12089	From: paul helms	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!

here are some specific eaxamples of said fish that will start to die of in the mid 80's. i have all of tehse in my tanks, so no they are not rare at all. http://liveaquaria.com/product/prod_Display.cfm?pCatId=181 http://liveaquaria.com/product/prod_Display.cfm?pCatId=168 http://liveaquaria.com/product/prod_Display.cfm?pCatId=173 http://liveaquaria.com/product/prod_Display.cfm?pCatId=195 http://liveaquaria.com/product/prod_Display.cfm?pCatId=228 http://liveaquaria.com/product/prod_Display.cfm?pCatId=1114 http://liveaquaria.com/product/prod_Display.cfm?pCatId=375 http://liveaquaria.com/product/prod_Display.cfm?pCatId=755 there are a few for you with their rcommended temps and specific gravities....interesting taht none are listed in the 80's huh? --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> wrote: > Well Paul some one is trying to be smart but it's > not > me, your quoting average temps again for reefs world > wide which may well be true as if you didn't know > there are reef in some very cold parts of the word. > If > you read my post again you will see I was quite > specific in stating I was referring to TROPICAL > reefs,and my figures are temperatures taken by me > not > from a book or an average of a thousand reefs (which > must have taken a good few years to collect) but > from > many reefs in south east Asia were the vast majority > of the worlds TROPICAL reefs are located. As for > comparisons all my tanks are at home I have no > commercial interest in the hobby but I do have more > than fifty years experience keeping and breeding > fish > of many species. The only reason I post on these > groups is to try to help people if I can or correct > wrong information if I know it to be wrong from > personal experience. So Paul except that you have a > kink in your knowledge and lets drop it. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > guess what smart guy, mine is not wrong. it is > > based > > on many years of experience, if you really wanna > > compare, i have 385 gallons in my home and nearly > > 2,000 at work. and if you will check some recent > > posts you will see documented and cited averages > > world > > wide on reef as 81 degrees. > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> > > wrote: > > > > > Hi Paul, > > > My statement is fact, yours is wrong ! > do > > > some > > > research, as I said my tanks (and they total > close > > > to > > > 1000galls) all run between 28C and 34C ( that's > > 82F > > > and 94F ) and they have been up and running for > > more > > > than six years in this location and very many > > years > > > in > > > other parts of the world. People have far more > > > problems through temperature being to low than > to > > > high. If you try to replicate nature you can't > go > > to > > > far wrong. > > > Regards, > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > > > > > once you hit 83 degrees fish will start to > drop, > > > > especially gobies, dartfish, blennies and the > > > like. > > > > so setting your tank at 80 and having lights > > > running > > > > on top of that is not a godd idea. a reef > > should > > > be > > > > kept at the same temp as a tropical tank, > unless > > > you > > > > are doing a cold water tank, then it should be > > > below > > > > 70. but thanks for trying to correct > something > > > that > > > > is not wrong. keeping a tank higher than > needed > > > > will > > > > cause problems if you have a heat spell! > > > > > > > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." > > <normnam2000@...> > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > Hi Paul, > > > > > 80 Is not to hot for a salt water > > tank, > > > > the > > > > > normal temp. of a tropical reef is between > 80 > > > and > > > > > 90. > > > > > All my tanks, mostly reef run at 32/33C this > > > time > > > > of > > > > > year, (they will rise a bit more yet) and > > 28/29C > > > > in > > > > > the cold season, I live in the tropics. > > > > > regards, > > > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > first of all, damsels are aggressive and > > > > > > territorial, > > > > > > second if you have no protein skimmer i > > > > guarantee > > > > > > your > > > > > > nitrates are not fine. fish breathe hard > > liek > > > > > that > > > > > > when they are suffering from nitrate > > > poisoning. > > > > > > third > > > > > > 80 is too hot for a sw tank. > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Sheila <smccamy@...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > We lost our first clownfish this morning > > and > > > > we > > > > > > only > > > > > > > got him last > > > > > > > Saturday. When we got him, we put him in > > our > > > > > > > established tank with a > > > > > > > female Blue Damselfish, a Coral Banded > > > Shrimp, > > > > > and > > > > > > a > > > > > > > green Hermit Crab. > > > > > > > From the start, he was rapidly opening > and > > > > > closing > > > > > > > his mouth non-stop. > > > > > > > I called the pet store and they told me > > that > > > > was > > > > > > > normal for clownfish. > > > > > > > Over the next few days, he wasn't eating > > and > > > > > would > > > > > > > stay in one corner > > > > > > > of the tank. Then he began hanging out > at > > > the > > > > > > water > > > > > > > line like he was > > > > > > > trying to get air. I did tests on the > > water > > > - > > > > > > > salinity, amonia, > > > > > > > nitrite, nitrate - it all tested fine. > Now > > > the > > > > > new > > > > > > > Clarkii clowns we > > > > > > > got this morning are doing the same > mouth > > > > thing, > > > > > > > like they are > > > > > > > breathing very rapidly. They did eat a > bit > > > > > earlier > > > > > > > and do not appear to > > > > > > > be stressed, but are they supposed to > open > > > and > > > > > > close > > > > > > > their mouths > > > > > > > constantly? The Blue Damselfish doesn't > do > > > > that. > > > > > > > Please - any advice > > > > > > > would be appreciated! Is there something > > > else > > > > > that > > > > > > > might be wrong with > > > > > > > the water? Do we need an airstone or air > > > pump? > > > > > We > > > > > > > have a BIO Wheel > > > > > > > filter, a heater and the temp is around > > 80. > > > > > Please > > > > > > > help - I don't want > > > > > > > to lose these two fish! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > === message truncated === __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Have fun online with music videos, cool games, IM and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/online.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12090	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: largest circular fish tank.. very cool

yea if you went and looked around on some of the links on the page it actually showed you.. the building was built around it.. and this company is responsible for building a lot of other aquariums.. Shannon at is amazing. I can't even imagine the construction efforts that went into that! Thanks for sharing! Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12091	From: Patrick	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!

Paul, you were spinning. Any time you use data to support your own position, you have spun that data. I was simply pointing out that it could also be spun the opposite direction. Spinning does not include lies. You were not telling a lie. You were using the data to support your own position, and were therefore spinning. It isn't a bad thing. Everybody spins things when they debate. I just wanted to act as a moderator in the debate. Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill -------Original Message------- i left in the overall average, which is the pont of the whole thing, not that there a re a few places in the red sea that are higher. it specifically states that the average of all coral reefs is 81. it does not say the average of each individual reef is 81, therefore not "spin". had it stated that no reef was higher than 81 it would have been spin, but as the average of 1000 tested, not spin. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12092	From: kritter714@aol.com	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: Thanks for the honor of front page/wet dry sump

In a message dated 6/4/2005 6:47:12 PM Pacific Standard Time, oilfield_brat@... writes: It came with a nice wet/dry filter and sump. I'vernever used one but may as well since it seemed to working well. Does anyone think I'll need too supplement with mechanical filtration? This tank won't be overstocked. Haven't decided yet whether to more my Vics to the 75 or set it up for Haps/Peacocks. wet drys do work better if you can keep the organic matter out of it your overflow should have some kind of prefilter on it and should be all the mechanical filter you need. I have been running a 90 gallon with only this for 14 years Elaine in the emerald city 125 gallon marine, 90 gallon discus 80 gallon south american cichlid 55 gallon african cichlid 50 gallon temperate water tank [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12093	From: Evita	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: decorations debate/To Patrick

I was wondering if anyone ever checked out ebay and the vintage ceramic stuff for tanks. I did a while back and loved them. What about a vintage tank. Just a thought. Evita harry perry <harryfisherman@...> wrote:There are some folks here that would consider "you" a ship wreck. I don't. In your post you almost seem to apoligize for your use of decorations. You shouldn't. I said it was my opinion and my choice and that I respect all choices. Someday I will find you and Paul and your ceramic critters in the Smithsonian. I can't wait. Harry Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: Are you crazy? Ever tank HAS to have a ship wreck! Ok, I'm joking. Some can get away with little ceramic frogs or sharks. :) I have a small plastic cave in one of my tank with bubbles, but it isn't for decoration as much as for water movement and a place for the fish to hide. I have a sunken ship in my other tank, but it is mostly for a place for plants to grow on. I can't even see the boat I have so many plants on it. As for divers, I think they look plain stupid. I think such things are mostly for kids to have fun with. The other problem with them is that they all fade and start to look bad. Now I might someday get another ship wreck. I've been thinking of one of the bismarks or a submarine, but only as a historical ornament. Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill -------Original Message------- Enough of this boring B.S. Let's stir things up !!!!. Why after doing all this work and spending all this money would anyone want to add "tank decorations" Bubbling scuba divers, ship wrecks, etc. etc. etc. When was the last time you saw a molly twice the size of a scuba diver?( I am a scuba diver).I respect all points of view but "tank decorations" don't work for me unless they are driftwood, rocks, gravel etc. "My opinion" See if the Smithsonian will buy your "tank decorations". Hey Paul and Pat I especially would like to hear your opinions. Harry [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter --------------------------------- Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter --------------------------------- Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- Discover Yahoo! Stay in touch with email, IM, photo sharing & more. Check it out! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12094	From: Nan	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies

Hey, Nim! First off, an 8 gallon is far, far to small to house 2 female and a male betta. That is very cool that they spawned, and yes the fry are more than likely living off of the infusoria that is comeing from the snails. Yes, do feed them the powdered fry food for livebearers, also, you might want to give them some decapped BBS eggs, or you can give them frozen Brine Shrimp, a very small amount. If you have any guppy fry you can put a couple in there to help teach your Betta fry to come to the top for the flake food. Makes the transition easier and they will get along. You still have several weeks (when they start fussing then seperate them, otherwise they are fine, really!) before you have to worry about moving them around. Actually, you might get lucky and they might be all female at which point you won't have to move them. A sure indicator of having to move them is when you catch them harrassing others of the same species, and that won't happen until you can see color on them and that is usually (in my expierence) at about 3 to 4 weeks old. And if you have a good filtration system going, no don't worry about doing a full water chance, maybe a partial in a couple of weeks (like 10%, then the next week about 20% after that).m If you don't have a good filtration system on there, then buy a sponge filter. It will work fine, and keep you from haveing to do a big water change. Hope this helps. Nan Nimish Mathur <nimmat4@...> wrote: Guys, About 3 weeks ago, I had a male betta and 2 females in a tank with loads of hiding space and it was going fine and suddenly next day morning all 3 were found dead :-s. Sad, but I fished them out but did not shut off the tank as I did not really have time to do anything to it or even test why it happened. Yesterday, while watching TV, I noticed some movement in the tank. On close inspection I noticed a fry. I inspected in the morning as well and finally counted 4 fry. They are about 1cm long and seem to be feeding well on .. Hmm. Don't know exactly what. There is a flurry of Trumpet snails and ramshorn in there and I think that is what kept the fry growing by creating infusoria. My questions are: They are big enough to be able to take powdered fry food so when is the best time to start? There seems to be enough microscopic food in the tank. When will be a best time to separate them to prevent them from fighting or cannibalizing on each other? There are loads of plants in the tank and it is a 8 gallon tank. Do I need to change water? Or is there anything special to do? I believe that the time when they need baby brine shrimp has passed as these are a bit bigger then newly born guppy fry. Thanks, Nim ~nan and crew~ Rome, GA http://www.geocities.com/ntalb00/index.htm (updated) bettas and soon we add guppys! --------------------------------- Yahoo! Mail Mobile Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12095	From: paul helms	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!

i disagree when i was using the final data, or teh conclusion --- Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: > Paul, you were spinning. Any time you use data > to support your own > position, you have spun that data. I was simply > pointing out that it could > also be spun the opposite direction. Spinning does > not include lies. You > were not telling a lie. You were using the data to > support your own > position, and were therefore spinning. It isn't a > bad thing. Everybody > spins things when they debate. I just wanted to act > as a moderator in the > debate. > > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy. > > "Now this is not the end. It is not even the > beginning of the end. But it is > perhaps, the end of the beginning." > -Winston Churchill > -------Original Message------- > i left in the overall average, which is the pont of > the whole thing, not > that there a re a few places in > the red sea that are higher. it specifically states > that the average of all > coral reefs is 81. it does > not say the average of each individual reef is 81, > therefore not "spin". had > it stated that no reef was > higher than 81 it would have been spin, but as the > average of 1000 tested, not spin. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Stay in touch with email, IM, photo sharing and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/stayintouch.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12096	From: paul helms	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: largest circular fish tank.. very cool

has anyone seen the new oceanic 1/2 circle 144 gallon tank? it is pretty cool itrself --- agentscullyeyore@... wrote: > > yea if you went and looked around on some of the > links on the page it > actually showed you.. the building was built around > it.. and this company is > responsible for building a lot of other aquariums.. > Shannon > > at is amazing. I can't even imagine the > construction efforts that > went into that! Thanks for sharing! > Leslie > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail Mobile Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone. http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12097	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!

Hi Patrick, Thank you for this post, I am actualy very conversant with this information, I was hopeful Paul would admit his error so that 'newbys' don't digest incorrect information. I'm unsure why he was trying to perpetuate false or at best dubious information in the first place. My figures were factual taken by me from tropical reefs in the one specific area, South East Asia were the majority of reef fish in this hobby come from. regards, unclenorm. --- Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: > Paul, that is called a "spin". You only took the > part of the statistics > that fit your argument and left out the rest (a > proper use of statistics, > according to my ed stats teacher. :) I will show a > link to where that > information probably came from, along with what was > left out: > > http://rshimek.com/reef/tempsal.htm > > These averages were taken by the posted scientists > from 1000 reefs, and this > is what they got: > > "Averages: Minimum = 69.8º; Maximum 85.1º; Average = > 81.(this is the average > temperature of all coral reefs). > Minimums; Lowest = 60.8º; Highest = 82.8º; Average = > 76.4º. > Maximums: Lowest = 76.2º; Highest = 93.9;º Average = > 86.4º." > > This is what they got at the warmest reefs: > > "Extreme Reefs (Maximum Weekly Temperature in Deg. > F; Salinity in ppt) > Southern Red Sea = 89.1ºF - 91.2º F; 38-40ppt. > Central Red Sea = 88.7 ºF - 89.1º F ; 40-41 ppt. > Northern Red Sea = up to 88º F; 41-42 ppt." > > It goes on to say the best temp for a reef tank is > 82-84°F. > > I did some research and found that the average > temperature of the Great > Barier Reef is around 80°, but it gets to 85°. I > have no experience at all > with marine fish beyond finding Nemo, but I couldn't > let half the data get > left out. :) > > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy. > > ___________________________________________________________ How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12098	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!

Paul, You can say what you want, the fact is you do not know what you are talking about, end of story. regards, unclenorm. --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > i am not going to drop iot becauyse you once again > stick your nose iun to tell someone they are wrong > when talking about an aquarium. the fish kept in > aquarium are not from a singular location and will > not > all do ok in higher temps like that. when i told > someone that 80 is not a real safe temp because > their > tank can easily overheat at that temp and lose fish, > i > was not incorrect, and far more helpful than stating > that 90 is ok. you can say whatever you want about > it > being tropicalor whatever, but the simple fact is > that > not all fish in the hobby can handle that kind of > temperature, and as i stated, many will start to die > off in temps exceding 83 degrees. don't tell people > they are wrong when they are talking about the hobby > and you are talking about tropical reefs, and not > tanks. > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> > wrote: > > > Well Paul some one is trying to be smart but it's > > not > > me, your quoting average temps again for reefs > world > > wide which may well be true as if you didn't know > > there are reef in some very cold parts of the > word. > > If > > you read my post again you will see I was quite > > specific in stating I was referring to TROPICAL > > reefs,and my figures are temperatures taken by me > > not > > from a book or an average of a thousand reefs > (which > > must have taken a good few years to collect) but > > from > > many reefs in south east Asia were the vast > majority > > of the worlds TROPICAL reefs are located. As for > > comparisons all my tanks are at home I have no > > commercial interest in the hobby but I do have > more > > than fifty years experience keeping and breeding > > fish > > of many species. The only reason I post on these > > groups is to try to help people if I can or > correct > > wrong information if I know it to be wrong from > > personal experience. So Paul except that you have > a > > kink in your knowledge and lets drop it. > > regards, > > unclenorm. > > > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > > > guess what smart guy, mine is not wrong. it is > > > based > > > on many years of experience, if you really > wanna > > > compare, i have 385 gallons in my home and > nearly > > > 2,000 at work. and if you will check some > recent > > > posts you will see documented and cited averages > > > world > > > wide on reef as 81 degrees. > > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." > <normnam2000@...> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > Hi Paul, > > > > My statement is fact, yours is wrong ! > > do > > > > some > > > > research, as I said my tanks (and they total > > close > > > > to > > > > 1000galls) all run between 28C and 34C ( > that's > > > 82F > > > > and 94F ) and they have been up and running > for > > > more > > > > than six years in this location and very many > > > years > > > > in > > > > other parts of the world. People have far more > > > > problems through temperature being to low than > > to > > > > high. If you try to replicate nature you can't > > go > > > to > > > > far wrong. > > > > Regards, > > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > once you hit 83 degrees fish will start to > > drop, > > > > > especially gobies, dartfish, blennies and > the > > > > like. > > > > > so setting your tank at 80 and having lights > > > > running > > > > > on top of that is not a godd idea. a reef > > > should > > > > be > > > > > kept at the same temp as a tropical tank, > > unless > > > > you > > > > > are doing a cold water tank, then it should > be > > > > below > > > > > 70. but thanks for trying to correct > > something > > > > that > > > > > is not wrong. keeping a tank higher than > > needed > > > > > will > > > > > cause problems if you have a heat spell! > > > > > > > > > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." > > > <normnam2000@...> > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Hi Paul, > > > > > > 80 Is not to hot for a salt water > > > tank, > > > > > the > > > > > > normal temp. of a tropical reef is between > > 80 > > > > and > > > > > > 90. > > > > > > All my tanks, mostly reef run at 32/33C > this > > > > time > > > > > of > > > > > > year, (they will rise a bit more yet) and > > > 28/29C > > > > > in > > > > > > the cold season, I live in the tropics. > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > first of all, damsels are aggressive and > > > > > > > territorial, > > > > > > > second if you have no protein skimmer i > > > > > guarantee > > > > > > > your > > > > > > > nitrates are not fine. fish breathe > hard > > > liek > > > > > > that > > > > > > > when they are suffering from nitrate > > > > poisoning. > > > > > > > third > > > > > > > 80 is too hot for a sw tank. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Sheila <smccamy@...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > We lost our first clownfish this > morning > > > and > > > > > we > > > > > > > only > > > > > > > > got him last > > > > > > > > Saturday. When we got him, we put him > in > > > our > > > > > > > > established tank with a > > > > > > > > female Blue Damselfish, a Coral Banded > > > > Shrimp, > > > > > > and > > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > green Hermit Crab. > > > > > > > > From the start, he was rapidly opening > > and > > > > > > closing > > > > > > > > his mouth non-stop. > > > > > > > > I called the pet store and they told > me > > > that > > > > > was > > > > > > > > normal for clownfish. > > > > > > > > Over the next few days, he wasn't > eating > > > and > > > > > > would > > > > > > > > stay in one corner > > > > > > > > of the tank. Then he began hanging out > > at > > > > the > > > > > > > water > > > > > > > > line like he was > > > > > > > > trying to get air. I did tests on the > > > water > > > > - > > > > > > > > salinity, amonia, > > > > > > > > nitrite, nitrate - it all tested fine. > > Now > > > > the > > > > > > new > > > > > > > > Clarkii clowns we > > > > > > > > got this morning are doing the same > > mouth > > > > > thing, > > > > > > > > like they are > > > > > > > > breathing very rapidly. They did eat a > > bit > > > > > > earlier > > > > > > > > and do not appear to > > > > > > > > be stressed, but are they supposed to > > open > > > > and > > > > > > > close > > > > > > > > their mouths > > > > > > > > constantly? The Blue Damselfish > doesn't > > do > > > > > that. > > > > > > > > Please - any advice > > > > > > > > would be appreciated! Is there > something > > > > else > > > > > > that > > > > > > > > might be wrong with > > > > > > > > the water? Do we need an airstone or > air > > > > pump? > > > > > > We > > > > > > > > have a BIO Wheel > > > > > > > > filter, a heater and the temp is > around > > > 80. > > > > > > Please > > > > > > > > help - I don't want > > > > > > > > to lose these two fish! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > === message truncated === > > > > > __________________________________ > Yahoo! Mail Mobile > Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your > mobile phone. > http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail > ___________________________________________________________ How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12099	From: Patrick	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: [spam] Re: [AquaticLife] One clownfish dead - have 2 others - pleas

Paul, you were not using the conclusion, you were using raw data. When a report is a page long, and you take one sentence that agrees with you and is completly true, but there is another sentence that agrees with the other side and is also true, that is spinning. In a spin-free area that is fairly ballanced, both sentences are produced for everybody to see and make up their own minds. I'm just lookin' out for y'all. That's what moderators do .. Is it not possible that SW fish from the area tested by Norman could do well in high temperatures, while the fish you mention are from areas where the water is colder, despite the fact that they are the same species. A species of fish wild-caught in Asian waters might enjoy warm water. That same species farm-raised in another part of the world (and I know for a fact that there are many species of SW fish now raised in captivity to relieve the stress on the ocean) might come from much cooler waters and not do so well in warm water. Norman, you say you took water temperature readings in Asia. As I've mentioned before, and shown an example in this post, not all of those fish are contained in Asia. Some of them come from areas with slightly cooler water. They might be raised in non-coastal Asia, which is not so warm, or in the US, or anywhere else. Farm-raised fish might actually be used to cooler temperatures than wild-caught. Would you not agree with that? Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12100	From: Dan	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies

I 1st want to say that this is not an attack, just a difference of opinion on the tank size, all other info is exact in my opinion. Now all I want to really say is that an 8 gallon tank is NOT too small for three BETTA, especially since two of them were female. The tank is supposedly also filled with numerous plants for the BETTA to hide, so the 8 gallon should be ok, even for the fry to grow into - as long as there will be only one male in it. Best Fishes, Dan (thaSkorpeon) --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Nan <ntalb00@y...> wrote: > Hey, Nim! > > First off, an 8 gallon is far, far to small to house 2 female and a male betta. That is very cool that they spawned, and yes the fry are more than likely living off of the infusoria that is comeing from the snails. > > Yes, do feed them the powdered fry food for livebearers, also, you might want to give them some decapped BBS eggs, or you can give them frozen Brine Shrimp, a very small amount. If you have any guppy fry you can put a couple in there to help teach your Betta fry to come to the top for the flake food. Makes the transition easier and they will get along. > > You still have several weeks (when they start fussing then seperate them, otherwise they are fine, really!) before you have to worry about moving them around. Actually, you might get lucky and they might be all female at which point you won't have to move them. A sure indicator of having to move them is when you catch them harrassing others of the same species, and that won't happen until you can see color on them and that is usually (in my expierence) at about 3 to 4 weeks old. > > And if you have a good filtration system going, no don't worry about doing a full water chance, maybe a partial in a couple of weeks (like 10%, then the next week about 20% after that).m If you don't have a good filtration system on there, then buy a sponge filter. It will work fine, and keep you from haveing to do a big water change. > > Hope this helps. > > Nan > > Nimish Mathur <nimmat4@y...> wrote: > Guys, > > About 3 weeks ago, I had a male betta and 2 females in a tank with loads of > hiding space and it was going fine and suddenly next day morning all 3 were > found dead :-s. > > > > Sad, but I fished them out but did not shut off the tank as I did not really > have time to do anything to it or even test why it happened. Yesterday, > while watching TV, I noticed some movement in the tank. On close inspection > I noticed a fry. I inspected in the morning as well and finally counted 4 > fry. They are about 1cm long and seem to be feeding well on .. Hmm. Don't > know exactly what. There is a flurry of Trumpet snails and ramshorn in there > and I think that is what kept the fry growing by creating infusoria. > > > > My questions are: > > > > They are big enough to be able to take powdered fry food so when is the best > time to start? There seems to be enough microscopic food in the tank. > > When will be a best time to separate them to prevent them from fighting or > cannibalizing on each other? > > There are loads of plants in the tank and it is a 8 gallon tank. Do I need > to change water? Or is there anything special to do? > > > > I believe that the time when they need baby brine shrimp has passed as these > are a bit bigger then newly born guppy fry. > > > > Thanks, > > Nim > > > > ~nan and crew~ > Rome, GA > http://www.geocities.com/ntalb00/index.htm (updated) > bettas and soon we add guppys! > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Mail Mobile > Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12101	From: Ken McDougall	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!

Hi unclenorm, You should not be letting your marine tank get that hot you shouls have a chiller on it if you live in the tropics. Normal temp for a marine tank is 74-82deg F (23-28deg C). Anything over this and the coral begins to die. A good book to read is "Water Chemistry for the Marine Aquarium" by John H Tullock. Since I have been using his water parameters a lot of small problems have disappeared. Regards Ken "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> wrote: Hi Paul, 80 Is not to hot for a salt water tank, the normal temp. of a tropical reef is between 80 and 90. All my tanks, mostly reef run at 32/33C this time of year, (they will rise a bit more yet) and 28/29C in the cold season, I live in the tropics. regards, unclenorm. --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > first of all, damsels are aggressive and > territorial, > second if you have no protein skimmer i guarantee > your > nitrates are not fine. fish breathe hard liek that > when they are suffering from nitrate poisoning. > third > 80 is too hot for a sw tank. > > --- Sheila <smccamy@...> wrote: > > > We lost our first clownfish this morning and we > only > > got him last > > Saturday. When we got him, we put him in our > > established tank with a > > female Blue Damselfish, a Coral Banded Shrimp, and > a > > green Hermit Crab. > > From the start, he was rapidly opening and closing > > his mouth non-stop. > > I called the pet store and they told me that was > > normal for clownfish. > > Over the next few days, he wasn't eating and would > > stay in one corner > > of the tank. Then he began hanging out at the > water > > line like he was > > trying to get air. I did tests on the water - > > salinity, amonia, > > nitrite, nitrate - it all tested fine. Now the new > > Clarkii clowns we > > got this morning are doing the same mouth thing, > > like they are > > breathing very rapidly. They did eat a bit earlier > > and do not appear to > > be stressed, but are they supposed to open and > close > > their mouths > > constantly? The Blue Damselfish doesn't do that. > > Please - any advice > > would be appreciated! Is there something else that > > might be wrong with > > the water? Do we need an airstone or air pump? We > > have a BIO Wheel > > filter, a heater and the temp is around 80. Please > > help - I don't want > > to lose these two fish! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > Discover Yahoo! > Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news and > more. Check it out! > http://discover.yahoo.com/mobile.html > > > ___________________________________________________________ How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter --------------------------------- Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. Send instant messages to your online friends http://au.messenger.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12102	From: paul helms	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: [spam] Re: [AquaticLife] One clownfish dead - have 2 others - p

that is very possible, but those of us in the US raising fish are quite obviously not in tropical reef areas, therefore making my statement accurate. no? --- Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: > Paul, you were not using the conclusion, you > were using raw data. When > a report is a page long, and you take one sentence > that agrees with you and > is completly true, but there is another sentence > that agrees with the other > side and is also true, that is spinning. In a > spin-free area that is fairly > ballanced, both sentences are produced for everybody > to see and make up > their own minds. I'm just lookin' out for y'all. > That's what moderators do > .. > Is it not possible that SW fish from the area > tested by Norman could do > well in high temperatures, while the fish you > mention are from areas where > the water is colder, despite the fact that they are > the same species. A > species of fish wild-caught in Asian waters might > enjoy warm water. That > same species farm-raised in another part of the > world (and I know for a fact > that there are many species of SW fish now raised in > captivity to relieve > the stress on the ocean) might come from much cooler > waters and not do so > well in warm water. > Norman, you say you took water temperature > readings in Asia. As I've > mentioned before, and shown an example in this post, > not all of those fish > are contained in Asia. Some of them come from areas > with slightly cooler > water. They might be raised in non-coastal Asia, > which is not so warm, or > in the US, or anywhere else. Farm-raised fish might > actually be used to > cooler temperatures than wild-caught. Would you not > agree with that? > > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy. > > "Now this is not the end. It is not even the > beginning of the end. But it is > perhaps, the end of the beginning." > -Winston Churchill > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12103	From: paul helms	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!

like i said old man...i do know whati am talking about and provided many links to prove it. guess old dogs really never learn....just go on the same old way. if you are going to talk down to soemone you may as well leave off the pleasantry on the end as it makes you look bad. --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> wrote: > Paul, > You can say what you want, the fact is you do > not > know what you are talking about, end of story. > regards, > unclenorm. > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > i am not going to drop iot becauyse you once again > > stick your nose iun to tell someone they are wrong > > when talking about an aquarium. the fish kept in > > aquarium are not from a singular location and will > > not > > all do ok in higher temps like that. when i told > > someone that 80 is not a real safe temp because > > their > > tank can easily overheat at that temp and lose > fish, > > i > > was not incorrect, and far more helpful than > stating > > that 90 is ok. you can say whatever you want > about > > it > > being tropicalor whatever, but the simple fact is > > that > > not all fish in the hobby can handle that kind of > > temperature, and as i stated, many will start to > die > > off in temps exceding 83 degrees. don't tell > people > > they are wrong when they are talking about the > hobby > > and you are talking about tropical reefs, and not > > tanks. > > > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> > > wrote: > > > > > Well Paul some one is trying to be smart but > it's > > > not > > > me, your quoting average temps again for reefs > > world > > > wide which may well be true as if you didn't > know > > > there are reef in some very cold parts of the > > word. > > > If > > > you read my post again you will see I was quite > > > specific in stating I was referring to TROPICAL > > > reefs,and my figures are temperatures taken by > me > > > not > > > from a book or an average of a thousand reefs > > (which > > > must have taken a good few years to collect) but > > > from > > > many reefs in south east Asia were the vast > > majority > > > of the worlds TROPICAL reefs are located. As for > > > comparisons all my tanks are at home I have no > > > commercial interest in the hobby but I do have > > more > > > than fifty years experience keeping and breeding > > > fish > > > of many species. The only reason I post on these > > > groups is to try to help people if I can or > > correct > > > wrong information if I know it to be wrong from > > > personal experience. So Paul except that you > have > > a > > > kink in your knowledge and lets drop it. > > > regards, > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > > > > > guess what smart guy, mine is not wrong. it > is > > > > based > > > > on many years of experience, if you really > > wanna > > > > compare, i have 385 gallons in my home and > > nearly > > > > 2,000 at work. and if you will check some > > recent > > > > posts you will see documented and cited > averages > > > > world > > > > wide on reef as 81 degrees. > > > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." > > <normnam2000@...> > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > Hi Paul, > > > > > My statement is fact, yours is wrong > ! > > > do > > > > > some > > > > > research, as I said my tanks (and they total > > > close > > > > > to > > > > > 1000galls) all run between 28C and 34C ( > > that's > > > > 82F > > > > > and 94F ) and they have been up and running > > for > > > > more > > > > > than six years in this location and very > many > > > > years > > > > > in > > > > > other parts of the world. People have far > more > > > > > problems through temperature being to low > than > > > to > > > > > high. If you try to replicate nature you > can't > > > go > > > > to > > > > > far wrong. > > > > > Regards, > > > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > once you hit 83 degrees fish will start to > > > drop, > > > > > > especially gobies, dartfish, blennies and > > the > > > > > like. > > > > > > so setting your tank at 80 and having > lights > > > > > running > > > > > > on top of that is not a godd idea. a reef > > > > should > > > > > be > > > > > > kept at the same temp as a tropical tank, > > > unless > > > > > you > > > > > > are doing a cold water tank, then it > should > > be > > > > > below > > > > > > 70. but thanks for trying to correct > > > something > > > > > that > > > > > > is not wrong. keeping a tank higher than > > > needed > > > > > > will > > > > > > cause problems if you have a heat spell! > > > > > > > > > > > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." > > > > <normnam2000@...> > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hi Paul, > > > > > > > 80 Is not to hot for a salt > water > > > > tank, > > > > > > the > > > > > > > normal temp. of a tropical reef is > between > > > 80 > > > > > and > > > > > > > 90. > > > > > > > All my tanks, mostly reef run at 32/33C > > this > > > > > time > > > > > > of > > > > > > > year, (they will rise a bit more yet) > and > > > > 28/29C > > > > > > in > > > > > > > the cold season, I live in the tropics. > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > first of all, damsels are aggressive > and > > > > > > > > territorial, > > > > > > > > second if you have no protein skimmer > i > > > > > > guarantee > > > > > > > > your > > > > > > > > nitrates are not fine. fish breathe > > hard > > > > liek > > > > > > > that > > > > > > > > when they are suffering from nitrate > > > > > poisoning. > === message truncated === __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12104	From: paul helms	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!

actually he provioded absolutely no figures...so how are they factual? --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> wrote: > Hi Patrick, > Thank you for this post, I am actualy very > conversant with this information, I was hopeful Paul > would admit his error so that 'newbys' don't digest > incorrect information. I'm unsure why he was trying > to > perpetuate false or at best dubious information in > the > first place. My figures were factual taken by me > from > tropical reefs in the one specific area, South East > Asia were the majority of reef fish in this hobby > come > from. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: > > > Paul, that is called a "spin". You only took the > > part of the statistics > > that fit your argument and left out the rest (a > > proper use of statistics, > > according to my ed stats teacher. :) I will show > a > > link to where that > > information probably came from, along with what > was > > left out: > > > > http://rshimek.com/reef/tempsal.htm > > > > These averages were taken by the posted scientists > > from 1000 reefs, and this > > is what they got: > > > > "Averages: Minimum = 69.8º; Maximum 85.1º; Average > = > > 81.(this is the average > > temperature of all coral reefs). > > Minimums; Lowest = 60.8º; Highest = 82.8º; Average > = > > 76.4º. > > Maximums: Lowest = 76.2º; Highest = 93.9;º Average > = > > 86.4º." > > > > This is what they got at the warmest reefs: > > > > "Extreme Reefs (Maximum Weekly Temperature in Deg. > > F; Salinity in ppt) > > Southern Red Sea = 89.1ºF - 91.2º F; 38-40ppt. > > Central Red Sea = 88.7 ºF - 89.1º F ; 40-41 ppt. > > Northern Red Sea = up to 88º F; 41-42 ppt." > > > > It goes on to say the best temp for a reef tank is > > 82-84°F. > > > > I did some research and found that the average > > temperature of the Great > > Barier Reef is around 80°, but it gets to 85°. I > > have no experience at all > > with marine fish beyond finding Nemo, but I > couldn't > > let half the data get > > left out. :) > > > > > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy. > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > How much free photo storage do you get? Store your > holiday > snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos > http://uk.photos.yahoo.com > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Stay in touch with email, IM, photo sharing and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/stayintouch.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12105	From: paul helms	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!

hey what do you know...someone else that knows nothing! lmao. this guy just like to be a grumpy old man and act like he is the supreme source of knowledge, when in fact he is stating the opposite of the truth. my comment that started this thing wa sthat many species start to die off above 83 degrees, and i posted several links describing the temp range of the fish i mentioned. don't bother wasting your time. the guy will only tell you that you are wrong and talk down on you, even though he just needs to go sit in a corner soemwhere and grow up. --- Ken McDougall <ken_mcdougall20012001@...> wrote: > Hi unclenorm, > You should not be letting your marine tank get that > hot you shouls have a chiller on it if you live in > the tropics. Normal temp for a marine tank is > 74-82deg F (23-28deg C). Anything over this and the > coral begins to die. A good book to read is "Water > Chemistry for the Marine Aquarium" by John H > Tullock. Since I have been using his water > parameters a lot of small problems have disappeared. > Regards > Ken > > "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> wrote: > Hi Paul, > 80 Is not to hot for a salt water tank, the > normal temp. of a tropical reef is between 80 and > 90. > All my tanks, mostly reef run at 32/33C this time of > year, (they will rise a bit more yet) and 28/29C in > the cold season, I live in the tropics. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > first of all, damsels are aggressive and > > territorial, > > second if you have no protein skimmer i guarantee > > your > > nitrates are not fine. fish breathe hard liek > that > > when they are suffering from nitrate poisoning. > > third > > 80 is too hot for a sw tank. > > > > --- Sheila <smccamy@...> wrote: > > > > > We lost our first clownfish this morning and we > > only > > > got him last > > > Saturday. When we got him, we put him in our > > > established tank with a > > > female Blue Damselfish, a Coral Banded Shrimp, > and > > a > > > green Hermit Crab. > > > From the start, he was rapidly opening and > closing > > > his mouth non-stop. > > > I called the pet store and they told me that was > > > normal for clownfish. > > > Over the next few days, he wasn't eating and > would > > > stay in one corner > > > of the tank. Then he began hanging out at the > > water > > > line like he was > > > trying to get air. I did tests on the water - > > > salinity, amonia, > > > nitrite, nitrate - it all tested fine. Now the > new > > > Clarkii clowns we > > > got this morning are doing the same mouth thing, > > > like they are > > > breathing very rapidly. They did eat a bit > earlier > > > and do not appear to > > > be stressed, but are they supposed to open and > > close > > > their mouths > > > constantly? The Blue Damselfish doesn't do that. > > > Please - any advice > > > would be appreciated! Is there something else > that > > > might be wrong with > > > the water? Do we need an airstone or air pump? > We > > > have a BIO Wheel > > > filter, a heater and the temp is around 80. > Please > > > help - I don't want > > > to lose these two fish! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > > Discover Yahoo! > > Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news > and > > more. Check it out! > > http://discover.yahoo.com/mobile.html > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > How much free photo storage do you get? Store your > holiday > snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos > http://uk.photos.yahoo.com > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when > replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text > that is not important to the reply and if changing > the topic of the original message modify the subject > line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, > we Thank You in Advance for your help in this > matter > > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Groups Links > > To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > Send instant messages to your online friends > http://au.messenger.yahoo.com > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12106	From: Dragon Hunter	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: Bio Spira

I was lumping both in, both small fish stores and the corporate ones. Was just specifying that the two corporate chains out here also had fridges. I was just specifying that that appears to be the norm out here. not arguing that its diff. in other areas. ----- Original Message ----- From: "paul helms" <wtfmorlok@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Friday, June 03, 2005 8:14 AM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Bio Spira > lfs is local fish store...i don't count corporate > chains in that...so i'll rephrase. small fish stores, > is that better for ya? > > --- The Dragon Hunter > <dragon.hunter@...> wrote: > >> Never heard of a fish store that only had a freezer. >> Every fish store I >> know of, even Petco and Petsmart, all have normal >> refridgerators with >> freezers for some live foods and/or medications. >> (ok, I'll concede, Walmart >> has neither, but then I don't shop walmart for >> anything for the fish anyway >> other than the occasional Betta. I'm a sucker for >> attractive bettas) Corse >> this is california where it does get pretty warm, so >> this might be a region >> thing here. But as I pointed out, they have not >> heard of it, not a matter >> of they do not choose to carry it. >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "paul helms" <wtfmorlok@...> >> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> >> Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2005 8:39 PM >> Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Bio Spira >> >> >> > it has a very short shelf life, and if it is not >> sold >> > rapidly, it is lost money....and for a while they >> had >> > problems with bad batches, making it expensive for >> the >> > lfs. that is why many do not carry it. it also >> must >> > be kept cold and many only have freezers >> > >> > --- The Dragon Hunter >> > <dragon.hunter@...> wrote: >> > >> > > I will admit, I am still surprised at how many >> fish >> > > stores in my area have >> > > never even heard of Bio Spira. My favorite has, >> but >> > > he's not a dealer of >> > > the stuff. The only LFS that has it near me is >> for >> > > the most part strictly >> > > SW and ponds, but thankfully he also gets the FW >> Bio >> > > Spira. >> > > >> > > Yea. I will admit, I was very leary of it at >> first, >> > > but like you, I try to >> > > keep some handy for just in case. >> > > >> > > >> > > ----- Original Message ----- >> > > From: "TankGurl" <fishgoddess@...> >> > > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> >> > > Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2005 3:07 PM >> > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Bio Spira >> > > >> > > >> > > > It sounds like she isn't familiar with Bio >> Spira >> > > and some folks think >> > > > it's too good to be true. Cycle takes longer. >> From >> > > what I understand, >> > > > it starts the cycle, whereas Bio Spira is the >> > > cycle in a package. You >> > > > *must* add fish within 24 hrs of introducing >> the >> > > BioSpira or you will >> > > > lose the process. I can't get this stuff here >> in >> > > Ontario, so I order >> > > > from these people: >> > > > >> > > > http://fishstoretn.com/bio_spira.html >> > > > >> > > > If you do a Google search, you may find other >> > > online dealers. My >> > > > experience with the above store has been very >> > > good. If you don't use >> > > > the entire package, you can keep it in the >> fridge >> > > for up to 6 months, >> > > > to either cycle another tank or help a tank >> that >> > > develops a bloom from >> > > > over cleaning or whatever. I keep a package in >> my >> > > fridge, just in >> > > > case. (i.e. just in case another tank follows >> me >> > > home from the lfs :) >> > > > >> > > > Kelly >> > > > >> > > > On 6/2/05, Dane & Leslie Moore >> > > <amjmail@...> wrote: >> > > > > My stores don't carry Bio Spira here, or >> > > anywhere near that I can tell. >> > > > > But they both have one called Cycle and >> stress >> > > zyme. She said that >> > > > > these only produce anorobic bacteria and the >> > > tank needs more than that >> > > > > so it will take up to 2 weeks to cycle. >> > > > > >> > > > > Would the other things she mentioned work >> the >> > > same? I ask because I >> > > > > have only heard of the Bio Spira on the fish >> > > groups. And I understand >> > > > > it that you can add the fish much earlier if >> > > used but she said no way. >> > > > > I don't want to go buy this other stuff if >> it >> > > isn't the same thing. >> > > > > >> > > > > Thanks >> > > > > Leslie >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been >> > > removed] >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below >> it >> > > when replying, thanks >> > > > > . >> > > > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all >> > > text that is not important >> > > to the reply and if changing the topic of the >> > > original message modify the >> > > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old >> > > subject)" <-, we Thank You >> > > in Advance for your help in this matter >> > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > -- >> > > > 65g Malawi >> > > > >> http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl >> > > > >> > > >> > >> > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 >> > > > 135g Frontosa/Tang >> > > > >> > > >> > >> > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011 >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > Please delete this line and everything below >> it >> > > when replying, thanks >> > > > . >> > > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all >> text >> > > that is not important to >> > > the reply and if changing the topic of the >> original >> > > message modify the >> > > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old >> > > subject)" <-, we Thank You >> > > in Advance for your help in this matter >> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > >> > > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > __________________________________ >> > Discover Yahoo! >> > Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online and >> more. Check it out! >> > http://discover.yahoo.com/ >> > === message truncated === > > > > > __________________________________ > Discover Yahoo! > Have fun online with music videos, cool games, IM and more. Check it out! > http://discover.yahoo.com/online.html > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12107	From: Dragon Hunter	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: last post on biospira

Welp, that's what's great about both this group and this country. We both have our opinions and the right to express them. This is one point that we respectfully agree to disagree. Even if you and I have diff. opinions on Bio-Spira, it is still helpful to the group as a whole to see both sides, so I feel our little debate did help. Just like you said, people have successes and others have failures using the same methods. Can't tell you how much contradictory info is out there that I encountered on many aspects of fish keeping before I got in the hobby. Guess the point that we were both making was do the research, ask around, but in the end you have to make up your mind what to try and what not to try and be prepared to accept any consequences and/or rewards. That's life. Hope you had a good weekend and to all, happy fish keeping. ----- Original Message ----- From: "paul helms" <wtfmorlok@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Friday, June 03, 2005 11:57 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] last post on biospira > there is no such thing as instant cycle, you can buy > into it if you want. adding the correct bacteria to > the water does not mean that they have cultured > properly and will absolutely work. if you check back > you will find that biospira has had several bad > batches which were ineffective. i bet you $20.00 i > could go fill a tank from the tap, and some stress > zyme and amquel plus, throw in fish tomorrow and not > lose any, in fact i have doen it many times, just > would not recommend it to anyone. just because i have > done it successfully many times, does not mean that it > is proven, nor reliable. i could probably get you the > names of 20 other people who have done the same > successsfully. in fact there are problably many older > fish keepers here who have done it as well. despite > knowing dozens who have done it, there are hundreds > who have failed. same with biospira. i know 3 or 4 > experienced fish keepers that failed with said bad > batches and were refunded their money based on the > manufacture date of the product, but still cost them a > good chunk of change in fish loss. in any case, > believe what you want, say what you want, think what > you want. that is why it is good to be an american. > just does not mean that i have to agree with you, and > definately does not mean that i will not post negative > reviews of it when new people are told to use it. > > > > __________________________________ > Yahoo! Mail Mobile > Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone. > http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12108	From: paul helms	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: last post on biospira

much respect to you --- Dragon Hunter <dragon.hunter@...> wrote: > Welp, that's what's great about both this group and > this country. We both > have our opinions and the right to express them. > This is one point that we > respectfully agree to disagree. Even if you and I > have diff. opinions on > Bio-Spira, it is still helpful to the group as a > whole to see both sides, so > I feel our little debate did help. > > Just like you said, people have successes and others > have failures using the > same methods. Can't tell you how much contradictory > info is out there that > I encountered on many aspects of fish keeping before > I got in the hobby. > > Guess the point that we were both making was do the > research, ask around, > but in the end you have to make up your mind what to > try and what not to try > and be prepared to accept any consequences and/or > rewards. That's life. > Hope you had a good weekend and to all, happy fish > keeping. > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "paul helms" <wtfmorlok@...> > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Friday, June 03, 2005 11:57 PM > Subject: [AquaticLife] last post on biospira > > > > there is no such thing as instant cycle, you can > buy > > into it if you want. adding the correct bacteria > to > > the water does not mean that they have cultured > > properly and will absolutely work. if you check > back > > you will find that biospira has had several bad > > batches which were ineffective. i bet you $20.00 > i > > could go fill a tank from the tap, and some stress > > zyme and amquel plus, throw in fish tomorrow and > not > > lose any, in fact i have doen it many times, just > > would not recommend it to anyone. just because i > have > > done it successfully many times, does not mean > that it > > is proven, nor reliable. i could probably get you > the > > names of 20 other people who have done the same > > successsfully. in fact there are problably many > older > > fish keepers here who have done it as well. > despite > > knowing dozens who have done it, there are > hundreds > > who have failed. same with biospira. i know 3 or > 4 > > experienced fish keepers that failed with said bad > > batches and were refunded their money based on the > > manufacture date of the product, but still cost > them a > > good chunk of change in fish loss. in any case, > > believe what you want, say what you want, think > what > > you want. that is why it is good to be an > american. > > just does not mean that i have to agree with you, > and > > definately does not mean that i will not post > negative > > reviews of it when new people are told to use it. > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > > Yahoo! Mail Mobile > > Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your > mobile phone. > > http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail > > > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > when replying, thanks > > . > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text > that is not important to > > the reply and if changing the topic of the > original message modify the > > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <-, we Thank You > > in Advance for your help in this matter > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Find what you need with new enhanced search. http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12109	From: paul helms	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: Bio Spira

ok...where are you located? --- Dragon Hunter <dragon.hunter@...> wrote: > I was lumping both in, both small fish stores and > the corporate ones. Was > just specifying that the two corporate chains out > here also had fridges. I > was just specifying that that appears to be the norm > out here. not arguing > that its diff. in other areas. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "paul helms" <wtfmorlok@...> > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Friday, June 03, 2005 8:14 AM > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Bio Spira > > > > lfs is local fish store...i don't count corporate > > chains in that...so i'll rephrase. small fish > stores, > > is that better for ya? > > > > --- The Dragon Hunter > > <dragon.hunter@...> wrote: > > > >> Never heard of a fish store that only had a > freezer. > >> Every fish store I > >> know of, even Petco and Petsmart, all have normal > >> refridgerators with > >> freezers for some live foods and/or medications. > >> (ok, I'll concede, Walmart > >> has neither, but then I don't shop walmart for > >> anything for the fish anyway > >> other than the occasional Betta. I'm a sucker > for > >> attractive bettas) Corse > >> this is california where it does get pretty warm, > so > >> this might be a region > >> thing here. But as I pointed out, they have not > >> heard of it, not a matter > >> of they do not choose to carry it. > >> > >> ----- Original Message ----- > >> From: "paul helms" <wtfmorlok@...> > >> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > >> Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2005 8:39 PM > >> Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Bio Spira > >> > >> > >> > it has a very short shelf life, and if it is > not > >> sold > >> > rapidly, it is lost money....and for a while > they > >> had > >> > problems with bad batches, making it expensive > for > >> the > >> > lfs. that is why many do not carry it. it > also > >> must > >> > be kept cold and many only have freezers > >> > > >> > --- The Dragon Hunter > >> > <dragon.hunter@...> wrote: > >> > > >> > > I will admit, I am still surprised at how > many > >> fish > >> > > stores in my area have > >> > > never even heard of Bio Spira. My favorite > has, > >> but > >> > > he's not a dealer of > >> > > the stuff. The only LFS that has it near me > is > >> for > >> > > the most part strictly > >> > > SW and ponds, but thankfully he also gets the > FW > >> Bio > >> > > Spira. > >> > > > >> > > Yea. I will admit, I was very leary of it at > >> first, > >> > > but like you, I try to > >> > > keep some handy for just in case. > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > ----- Original Message ----- > >> > > From: "TankGurl" <fishgoddess@...> > >> > > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > >> > > Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2005 3:07 PM > >> > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Bio Spira > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > It sounds like she isn't familiar with Bio > >> Spira > >> > > and some folks think > >> > > > it's too good to be true. Cycle takes > longer. > >> From > >> > > what I understand, > >> > > > it starts the cycle, whereas Bio Spira is > the > >> > > cycle in a package. You > >> > > > *must* add fish within 24 hrs of > introducing > >> the > >> > > BioSpira or you will > >> > > > lose the process. I can't get this stuff > here > >> in > >> > > Ontario, so I order > >> > > > from these people: > >> > > > > >> > > > http://fishstoretn.com/bio_spira.html > >> > > > > >> > > > If you do a Google search, you may find > other > >> > > online dealers. My > >> > > > experience with the above store has been > very > >> > > good. If you don't use > >> > > > the entire package, you can keep it in the > >> fridge > >> > > for up to 6 months, > >> > > > to either cycle another tank or help a tank > >> that > >> > > develops a bloom from > >> > > > over cleaning or whatever. I keep a package > in > >> my > >> > > fridge, just in > >> > > > case. (i.e. just in case another tank > follows > >> me > >> > > home from the lfs :) > >> > > > > >> > > > Kelly > >> > > > > >> > > > On 6/2/05, Dane & Leslie Moore > >> > > <amjmail@...> wrote: > >> > > > > My stores don't carry Bio Spira here, or > >> > > anywhere near that I can tell. > >> > > > > But they both have one called Cycle and > >> stress > >> > > zyme. She said that > >> > > > > these only produce anorobic bacteria and > the > >> > > tank needs more than that > >> > > > > so it will take up to 2 weeks to cycle. > >> > > > > > >> > > > > Would the other things she mentioned work > >> the > >> > > same? I ask because I > >> > > > > have only heard of the Bio Spira on the > fish > >> > > groups. And I understand > >> > > > > it that you can add the fish much earlier > if > >> > > used but she said no way. > >> > > > > I don't want to go buy this other stuff > if > >> it > >> > > isn't the same thing. > >> > > > > > >> > > > > Thanks > >> > > > > Leslie > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have > been > >> > > removed] > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > Please delete this line and everything > below > >> it > >> > > when replying, thanks > >> > > > > . > >> > > > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete > all > >> > > text that is not important > >> > > to the reply and if changing the topic of the > >> > > original message modify the > >> > > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: > old > >> > > subject)" <-, we Thank You > >> > > in Advance for your help in this matter > >> > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > === message truncated === __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Stay in touch with email, IM, photo sharing and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/stayintouch.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12110	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!

Paul, Please pause and think what your saying and quoting, read my statement, you will see that you are contradicting your self, you have just quoted Dr Ron Shimek as saying that tanks should be between 80 and 84 OK, the figures I quoted are FACT for one area, the area were I now live. Now your original statement :- '80 is too hot for a sw tank' So please Paul stop trying to justify an incorrect statement if you won't admit it just shut up!. regards, unclenorm. --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > since you want to use ronald l shimek phd as > refernce > as well, here is a direct quote from his book > "marine > invertebrates" "most coral reefs have temperatures > that range between 78-86. the average of 1000 reefs > is > 81." "some corals can survive from temps of 68-90, > and > they are often found in areas where the temps reach > the extremes or are predominately shifted to either > the colder or the hotter parts of their range. > animals living in such marginal environments are not > thriving , they are simply surviving." he goes on to > state that he believes in keeping tanks between 80 > and > 84 and at higher salinity, but i would not doubt > that > this is to keep parasites and disease at bay, and > that > he can afford teh equipment to keep it in that exact > range, such as chillers and teh like. like i said > before you can have problems once you go above 83 > degress. i aslo referenced a type of fish first > effected as gobies, which is the case. when tanks > run > from 85-90, and have not been acclimated that way, > the > gobies and blennies and dart fish will start to drop > like flies. > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> > wrote: > > > Well Paul some one is trying to be smart but it's > > not > > me, your quoting average temps again for reefs > world > > wide which may well be true as if you didn't know > > there are reef in some very cold parts of the > word. > > If > > you read my post again you will see I was quite > > specific in stating I was referring to TROPICAL > > reefs,and my figures are temperatures taken by me > > not > > from a book or an average of a thousand reefs > (which > > must have taken a good few years to collect) but > > from > > many reefs in south east Asia were the vast > majority > > of the worlds TROPICAL reefs are located. As for > > comparisons all my tanks are at home I have no > > commercial interest in the hobby but I do have > more > > than fifty years experience keeping and breeding > > fish > > of many species. The only reason I post on these > > groups is to try to help people if I can or > correct > > wrong information if I know it to be wrong from > > personal experience. So Paul except that you have > a > > kink in your knowledge and lets drop it. > > regards, > > unclenorm. > > > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > > > guess what smart guy, mine is not wrong. it is > > > based > > > on many years of experience, if you really > wanna > > > compare, i have 385 gallons in my home and > nearly > > > 2,000 at work. and if you will check some > recent > > > posts you will see documented and cited averages > > > world > > > wide on reef as 81 degrees. > > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." > <normnam2000@...> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > Hi Paul, > > > > My statement is fact, yours is wrong ! > > do > > > > some > > > > research, as I said my tanks (and they total > > close > > > > to > > > > 1000galls) all run between 28C and 34C ( > that's > > > 82F > > > > and 94F ) and they have been up and running > for > > > more > > > > than six years in this location and very many > > > years > > > > in > > > > other parts of the world. People have far more > > > > problems through temperature being to low than > > to > > > > high. If you try to replicate nature you can't > > go > > > to > > > > far wrong. > > > > Regards, > > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > once you hit 83 degrees fish will start to > > drop, > > > > > especially gobies, dartfish, blennies and > the > > > > like. > > > > > so setting your tank at 80 and having lights > > > > running > > > > > on top of that is not a godd idea. a reef > > > should > > > > be > > > > > kept at the same temp as a tropical tank, > > unless > > > > you > > > > > are doing a cold water tank, then it should > be > > > > below > > > > > 70. but thanks for trying to correct > > something > > > > that > > > > > is not wrong. keeping a tank higher than > > needed > > > > > will > > > > > cause problems if you have a heat spell! > > > > > > > > > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." > > > <normnam2000@...> > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Hi Paul, > > > > > > 80 Is not to hot for a salt water > > > tank, > > > > > the > > > > > > normal temp. of a tropical reef is between > > 80 > > > > and > > > > > > 90. > > > > > > All my tanks, mostly reef run at 32/33C > this > > > > time > > > > > of > > > > > > year, (they will rise a bit more yet) and > > > 28/29C > > > > > in > > > > > > the cold season, I live in the tropics. > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > first of all, damsels are aggressive and > > > > > > > territorial, > > > > > > > second if you have no protein skimmer i > > > > > guarantee > > > > > > > your > > > > > > > nitrates are not fine. fish breathe > hard > > > liek > > > > > > that > > > > > > > when they are suffering from nitrate > > > > poisoning. > > > > > > > third > > > > > > > 80 is too hot for a sw tank. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Sheila <smccamy@...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > We lost our first clownfish this > morning > > > and > > > > > we > > > > > > > only > > > > > > > > got him last > > > > > > > > Saturday. When we got him, we put him > in > > > our > > > > > > > > established tank with a > > > > > > > > female Blue Damselfish, a Coral Banded > > > > Shrimp, > > > > > > and > > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > green Hermit Crab. > > > > > > > > From the start, he was rapidly opening > > and > > > > > > closing > > > > > > > > his mouth non-stop. > > > > > > > > I called the pet store and they told > me > > > that > > > > > was > > > > > > > > normal for clownfish. > > > > > > > > Over the next few days, he wasn't > eating > > > and > > > > > > would > > > > > > > > stay in one corner > > > > > > > > of the tank. Then he began hanging out > > at > > > > the > > > > > > > water > > > > > > > > line like he was > > > > > > > > trying to get air. I did tests on the > > > water > > > > - > > > > > > > > salinity, amonia, > > > > > > > > nitrite, nitrate - it all tested fine. > > Now > > > > the > > > > > > new > > > > > > > > Clarkii clowns we > > > > > > > > got this morning are doing the same > > mouth > > > > > thing, > > > > > > > > like they are > > > > > > > > breathing very rapidly. They did eat a > > bit > > > > > > earlier > > > > > > > > and do not appear to > > > > > > > > be stressed, but are they supposed to > > open > > > > and > > > > > > > close > > > > > > > > their mouths > > > > > > > > constantly? The Blue Damselfish > doesn't > > do > > > > > that. > > > > > > > > Please - any advice > > > > > > > > would be appreciated! Is there > something > > > > else > > > > > > that > > > > > > > > might be wrong with > > > > > > > > the water? Do we need an airstone or > air > > > > pump? > > > > > > We > > > > > > > > have a BIO Wheel > > > > > > > > filter, a heater and the temp is > around > > > 80. > > > > > > Please > > > > > > > > help - I don't want > > > > > > > > to lose these two fish! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > === message truncated === > > > > > __________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Read only the mail you want - Yahoo! Mail SpamGuard. > > http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail > ___________________________________________________________ How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12111	From: thant zin	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: thanks Pastrick

Thanks Patrick. You understand what i mean because in here the weather is winter season and some place has snowed. It is repaidly changed and sometime is very hot. So I found many hobbies have problem for controlling water temperature and they considered how can easily keep the aquarium fishes and expensive glass tank.That is why we are difficult to keep our aquarium fishes.Now i got many web site link for my knowledge from this group. So thanks for everybody. many thanks, Thomas Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: I understand very little of your problem. Aquarium stores sell aquarium heaters, most of which have built in thermostats, but expensive ones have special thermostats that are plugged in. Such heaters, if they work right, will keep the temperature stable at the desired tank temperature as long as the room temperature is stable at the desired room temperature. You may also need a chiller if your lighting gets very hot. If you don't mind the fish room being set to 80-90°F (27-32°C), you can maintain the desired tank temperature in that room. For one tank that would be overkill, but for multiple tanks the individual heaters at 25 to 100 watts each adds up. I just figured out your problem. I understand now! It is the opposite of us up here. It is almost winter down there! Has it snowed yet? :) Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill -------Original Message------- Hi, I am Thomas from New Zealand and a new menber. I am familiar with the fresh water aquarium fishes and i interest the marine aquarium fishes.So I would like to get some web site name for getting aquarium knowledge. In here, Weather is too cold and sometime temperature rapidly changed. And then I found that some aquarium shop controled water temperature by room heater system.That is why if i use the thermostat, I can control the water temperature or not. Could you please give me some information for controlling water temperature? Thanks, Thomas Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter --------------------------------- Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - 1GB free storage! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12112	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: Too much areation?

Not sure if someone else has replied to this one but... On one of my air pumps it has a setting which can increase or decrease the air. Also i have attached to another one a group of five valves. I can slowly open and close the valve to reduce the amount of air going into the tank. Alternatively I open a 'to atmosphere' valve which goes no where and release some of the pressure but this is noisier. So long as you tank is circulating the water around 3 to 4 times an hour you probably don't need an air pump any ways... but i always make sure one is running at night time just in case cause plants absorb oxygen (or so I'm told) during the night. =Nick ----- Original Message ----- From: "Eric Miner" <eminer1254@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Saturday, June 04, 2005 7:29 AM Subject: [AquaticLife] Too much areation? > Hello All, > > I have a 46gl tank with a Marineland Penguin 340 mechanical filter. I > don't have a real problem with it, it does a good job. It has two > ouutputs that do a good job of agitationg the surface, maybe too good > a job. It sends a lot of bubbles into the tank, the smallest of them > spread throughout the water maiking is look a bit cloudy. I know that > good areation is required, but is there a way to keep the bubbles down > a bit? This happens even when the water level is right up to the outputs. > > Thanks > > Eric > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12113	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!

Some of them live for years in my tanks to, have you ever seen that site recommend any other temp. ? regards, unclenorm. --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > here are some specific eaxamples of said fish that > will start to die of in the mid 80's. i have all of > tehse in my tanks, so no they are not rare at all. > > http://liveaquaria.com/product/prod_Display.cfm?pCatId=181 > > http://liveaquaria.com/product/prod_Display.cfm?pCatId=168 > > http://liveaquaria.com/product/prod_Display.cfm?pCatId=173 > > http://liveaquaria.com/product/prod_Display.cfm?pCatId=195 > > http://liveaquaria.com/product/prod_Display.cfm?pCatId=228 > > http://liveaquaria.com/product/prod_Display.cfm?pCatId=1114 > > http://liveaquaria.com/product/prod_Display.cfm?pCatId=375 > > http://liveaquaria.com/product/prod_Display.cfm?pCatId=755 > > there are a few for you with their rcommended temps > and specific gravities....interesting taht none are > listed in the 80's huh? > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> > wrote: > > > Well Paul some one is trying to be smart but it's > > not > > me, your quoting average temps again for reefs > world > > wide which may well be true as if you didn't know > > there are reef in some very cold parts of the > word. > > If > > you read my post again you will see I was quite > > specific in stating I was referring to TROPICAL > > reefs,and my figures are temperatures taken by me > > not > > from a book or an average of a thousand reefs > (which > > must have taken a good few years to collect) but > > from > > many reefs in south east Asia were the vast > majority > > of the worlds TROPICAL reefs are located. As for > > comparisons all my tanks are at home I have no > > commercial interest in the hobby but I do have > more > > than fifty years experience keeping and breeding > > fish > > of many species. The only reason I post on these > > groups is to try to help people if I can or > correct > > wrong information if I know it to be wrong from > > personal experience. So Paul except that you have > a > > kink in your knowledge and lets drop it. > > regards, > > unclenorm. > > > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > > > guess what smart guy, mine is not wrong. it is > > > based > > > on many years of experience, if you really > wanna > > > compare, i have 385 gallons in my home and > nearly > > > 2,000 at work. and if you will check some > recent > > > posts you will see documented and cited averages > > > world > > > wide on reef as 81 degrees. > > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." > <normnam2000@...> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > Hi Paul, > > > > My statement is fact, yours is wrong ! > > do > > > > some > > > > research, as I said my tanks (and they total > > close > > > > to > > > > 1000galls) all run between 28C and 34C ( > that's > > > 82F > > > > and 94F ) and they have been up and running > for > > > more > > > > than six years in this location and very many > > > years > > > > in > > > > other parts of the world. People have far more > > > > problems through temperature being to low than > > to > > > > high. If you try to replicate nature you can't > > go > > > to > > > > far wrong. > > > > Regards, > > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > once you hit 83 degrees fish will start to > > drop, > > > > > especially gobies, dartfish, blennies and > the > > > > like. > > > > > so setting your tank at 80 and having lights > > > > running > > > > > on top of that is not a godd idea. a reef > > > should > > > > be > > > > > kept at the same temp as a tropical tank, > > unless > > > > you > > > > > are doing a cold water tank, then it should > be > > > > below > > > > > 70. but thanks for trying to correct > > something > > > > that > > > > > is not wrong. keeping a tank higher than > > needed > > > > > will > > > > > cause problems if you have a heat spell! > > > > > > > > > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." > > > <normnam2000@...> > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Hi Paul, > > > > > > 80 Is not to hot for a salt water > > > tank, > > > > > the > > > > > > normal temp. of a tropical reef is between > > 80 > > > > and > > > > > > 90. > > > > > > All my tanks, mostly reef run at 32/33C > this > > > > time > > > > > of > > > > > > year, (they will rise a bit more yet) and > > > 28/29C > > > > > in > > > > > > the cold season, I live in the tropics. > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > first of all, damsels are aggressive and > > > > > > > territorial, > > > > > > > second if you have no protein skimmer i > > > > > guarantee > > > > > > > your > > > > > > > nitrates are not fine. fish breathe > hard > > > liek > > > > > > that > > > > > > > when they are suffering from nitrate > > > > poisoning. > > > > > > > third > > > > > > > 80 is too hot for a sw tank. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Sheila <smccamy@...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > We lost our first clownfish this > morning > > > and > > > > > we > > > > > > > only > > > > > > > > got him last > > > > > > > > Saturday. When we got him, we put him > in > > > our > > > > > > > > established tank with a > > > > > > > > female Blue Damselfish, a Coral Banded > > > > Shrimp, > > > > > > and > > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > green Hermit Crab. > > > > > > > > From the start, he was rapidly opening > > and > > > > > > closing > > > > > > > > his mouth non-stop. > > > > > > > > I called the pet store and they told > me > > > that > > > > > was > > > > > > > > normal for clownfish. > > > > > > > > Over the next few days, he wasn't > eating > > > and > > > > > > would > > > > > > > > stay in one corner > > > > > > > > of the tank. Then he began hanging out > > at > > > > the > > > > > > > water > > > > > > > > line like he was > > > > > > > > trying to get air. I did tests on the > > > water > > > > - > > > > > > > > salinity, amonia, > > > > > > > > nitrite, nitrate - it all tested fine. > > Now > > > > the > > > > > > new > > > > > > > > Clarkii clowns we > > > > > > > > got this morning are doing the same > > mouth > > > > > thing, > > > > > > > > like they are > > > > > > > > breathing very rapidly. They did eat a > > bit > > > > > > earlier > > > > > > > > and do not appear to > > > > > > > > be stressed, but are they supposed to > > open > > > > and > > > > > > > close > > > > > > > > their mouths > > > > > > > > constantly? The Blue Damselfish > doesn't > > do > > > > > that. > > > > > > > > Please - any advice > > > > > > > > would be appreciated! Is there > something > > > > else > > > > > > that > > > > > > > > might be wrong with > > > > > > > > the water? Do we need an airstone or > air > > > > pump? > > > > > > We > > > > > > > > have a BIO Wheel > > > > > > > > filter, a heater and the temp is > around > > > 80. > > > > > > Please > > > > > > > > help - I don't want > > > > > > > > to lose these two fish! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > === message truncated === > > > > > __________________________________ > Discover Yahoo! > Have fun online with music videos, cool games, IM > and more. Check it out! > http://discover.yahoo.com/online.html > ___________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12114	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies

Do the parents always die when they give birth to the babys? I kinda remember some one else had some die for some reason. =Nick PS: If any one has any fish they want to get rid of in Brisbane Queensland i'm interested. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Nan" <ntalb00@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Monday, June 06, 2005 6:20 AM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Betta babies > Hey, Nim! > > First off, an 8 gallon is far, far to small to house 2 female and a male > betta. That is very cool that they spawned, and yes the fry are more than > likely living off of the infusoria that is comeing from the snails. > > Yes, do feed them the powdered fry food for livebearers, also, you might > want to give them some decapped BBS eggs, or you can give them frozen > Brine Shrimp, a very small amount. If you have any guppy fry you can put > a couple in there to help teach your Betta fry to come to the top for the > flake food. Makes the transition easier and they will get along. > > You still have several weeks (when they start fussing then seperate them, > otherwise they are fine, really!) before you have to worry about moving > them around. Actually, you might get lucky and they might be all female > at which point you won't have to move them. A sure indicator of having to > move them is when you catch them harrassing others of the same species, > and that won't happen until you can see color on them and that is usually > (in my expierence) at about 3 to 4 weeks old. > > And if you have a good filtration system going, no don't worry about doing > a full water chance, maybe a partial in a couple of weeks (like 10%, then > the next week about 20% after that).m If you don't have a good filtration > system on there, then buy a sponge filter. It will work fine, and keep > you from haveing to do a big water change. > > Hope this helps. > > Nan > > Nimish Mathur <nimmat4@...> wrote: > Guys, > > About 3 weeks ago, I had a male betta and 2 females in a tank with loads > of > hiding space and it was going fine and suddenly next day morning all 3 > were > found dead :-s. > > > > Sad, but I fished them out but did not shut off the tank as I did not > really > have time to do anything to it or even test why it happened. Yesterday, > while watching TV, I noticed some movement in the tank. On close > inspection > I noticed a fry. I inspected in the morning as well and finally counted 4 > fry. They are about 1cm long and seem to be feeding well on .. Hmm. Don't > know exactly what. There is a flurry of Trumpet snails and ramshorn in > there > and I think that is what kept the fry growing by creating infusoria. > > > > My questions are: > > > > They are big enough to be able to take powdered fry food so when is the > best > time to start? There seems to be enough microscopic food in the tank. > > When will be a best time to separate them to prevent them from fighting or > cannibalizing on each other? > > There are loads of plants in the tank and it is a 8 gallon tank. Do I need > to change water? Or is there anything special to do? > > > > I believe that the time when they need baby brine shrimp has passed as > these > are a bit bigger then newly born guppy fry. > > > > Thanks, > > Nim > > > > ~nan and crew~ > Rome, GA > http://www.geocities.com/ntalb00/index.htm (updated) > bettas and soon we add guppys! > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Mail Mobile > Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12115	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!

oh my god! 80-90?!?! are you nuts?!?! that sounds too hot from what i've heard. i've always heard between 77-80 and not any higher, especially heading into summer as we are when the outside temps are only going to get hotter. correct me if i'm wrong on this anyone, but aren't sw tanks not supposed to be kept above 80 degrees? "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> wrote: Hi Paul, 80 Is not to hot for a salt water tank, the normal temp. of a tropical reef is between 80 and 90. All my tanks, mostly reef run at 32/33C this time of year, (they will rise a bit more yet) and 28/29C in the cold season, I live in the tropics. regards, unclenorm. --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > first of all, damsels are aggressive and > territorial, > second if you have no protein skimmer i guarantee > your > nitrates are not fine. fish breathe hard liek that > when they are suffering from nitrate poisoning. > third > 80 is too hot for a sw tank. > > --- Sheila <smccamy@...> wrote: > > > We lost our first clownfish this morning and we > only > > got him last > > Saturday. When we got him, we put him in our > > established tank with a > > female Blue Damselfish, a Coral Banded Shrimp, and > a > > green Hermit Crab. > > From the start, he was rapidly opening and closing > > his mouth non-stop. > > I called the pet store and they told me that was > > normal for clownfish. > > Over the next few days, he wasn't eating and would > > stay in one corner > > of the tank. Then he began hanging out at the > water > > line like he was > > trying to get air. I did tests on the water - > > salinity, amonia, > > nitrite, nitrate - it all tested fine. Now the new > > Clarkii clowns we > > got this morning are doing the same mouth thing, > > like they are > > breathing very rapidly. They did eat a bit earlier > > and do not appear to > > be stressed, but are they supposed to open and > close > > their mouths > > constantly? The Blue Damselfish doesn't do that. > > Please - any advice > > would be appreciated! Is there something else that > > might be wrong with > > the water? Do we need an airstone or air pump? We > > have a BIO Wheel > > filter, a heater and the temp is around 80. Please > > help - I don't want > > to lose these two fish! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > Discover Yahoo! > Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news and > more. Check it out! > http://discover.yahoo.com/mobile.html > > > ___________________________________________________________ How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter --------------------------------- Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my 2 Ocellaris clownfish! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12116	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: Bio Spira

there are only 2 lfs here on the peninsula section of the bay that have fridges and carry biospira. all the others have freezers as paul stated. paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote:in the bay area very few have fridges, just freezers --- The Dragon Hunter <dragon.hunter@...> wrote: > all of them out here do. Every store out here sells > frozen worms. all of > the private stores and even Petco also sells live > worms. Couldn't tell you > if Petsmart sells them. I usually don't go there > unless Petco is out of > Science Diet (very rare). I used to actually go to > Petco for live blood > worms cause they were just down the street till > they stopped carrying them. > They still carry live black worms, but I can get > live black worms cheaper > every where else. the live worms are are always in > their fridge. I don't > grow them myself, but I asked on it and have been > told that blood and black > worms have to be kept fairly cool. > > I love watching my fish eat live foods. Also fun > with the frozen worm > cubes. I know you're supposed to let them melt a > little, but I just toss > them in right out of the freezer. after the first > few worms melt off, the > rainbows and gouramis will start pecking at them. > After the tiger barbs > realize the cubes are there, they'll peck till they > get ahold of it and > snatch the entire cube and try to run off with it to > the middle of the tank > where they usually lose their grip. After a bit, my > two plecs will work > their way up and get their fill. > > -Steve > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Patrick, AAFG" <patrickmn1@...> > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Friday, June 03, 2005 7:31 AM > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Bio Spira > > > > I've never been to a private store with a > refrigerator or a freezer... > > > > > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy. > > > > "Now this is not the end. It is not even the > beginning of the end. But it > is > > perhaps, the end of the beginning." > > -Winston Churchill > > -------Original Message------- > > Never heard of a fish store that only had a > freezer. Every fish store I > know of, even Petco and Petsmart, all have normal > refridgerators with > freezers for some live foods and/or medications. > (ok, I'll concede, Walmart > has neither, but then I don't shop walmart for > anything for the fish anyway > other than the occasional Betta. I'm a sucker for > attractive bettas) Corse > this is california where it does get pretty warm, so > this might be a region > thing here. But as I pointed out, they have not > heard of it, not a matter > of they do not choose to carry it. > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > when replying, thanks > > . > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text > that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original > message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Make Yahoo! your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter --------------------------------- Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my 2 Ocellaris clownfish! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12117	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!

Hi Ken, If you read all the posts in this thread you might understand why I do not agree with 74-82F, by the way I'm not new to this I've been at it for more than 50 years and have many tanks with hundreds of gallons capacity, while at certain times they get a little higher than I consider ideal they follow the natural temps of the reefs were I now live chillers are out of the question the financial outlay would be horrendous. regards, unclenorm. --- Ken McDougall <ken_mcdougall20012001@...> wrote: > Hi unclenorm, > You should not be letting your marine tank get that > hot you shouls have a chiller on it if you live in > the tropics. Normal temp for a marine tank is > 74-82deg F (23-28deg C). Anything over this and the > coral begins to die. A good book to read is "Water > Chemistry for the Marine Aquarium" by John H > Tullock. Since I have been using his water > parameters a lot of small problems have disappeared. > Regards > Ken > > "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> wrote: > Hi Paul, > 80 Is not to hot for a salt water tank, the > normal temp. of a tropical reef is between 80 and > 90. > All my tanks, mostly reef run at 32/33C this time of > year, (they will rise a bit more yet) and 28/29C in > the cold season, I live in the tropics. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > first of all, damsels are aggressive and > > territorial, > > second if you have no protein skimmer i guarantee > > your > > nitrates are not fine. fish breathe hard liek > that > > when they are suffering from nitrate poisoning. > > third > > 80 is too hot for a sw tank. > > > > --- Sheila <smccamy@...> wrote: > > > > > We lost our first clownfish this morning and we > > only > > > got him last > > > Saturday. When we got him, we put him in our > > > established tank with a > > > female Blue Damselfish, a Coral Banded Shrimp, > and > > a > > > green Hermit Crab. > > > From the start, he was rapidly opening and > closing > > > his mouth non-stop. > > > I called the pet store and they told me that was > > > normal for clownfish. > > > Over the next few days, he wasn't eating and > would > > > stay in one corner > > > of the tank. Then he began hanging out at the > > water > > > line like he was > > > trying to get air. I did tests on the water - > > > salinity, amonia, > > > nitrite, nitrate - it all tested fine. Now the > new > > > Clarkii clowns we > > > got this morning are doing the same mouth thing, > > > like they are > > > breathing very rapidly. They did eat a bit > earlier > > > and do not appear to > > > be stressed, but are they supposed to open and > > close > > > their mouths > > > constantly? The Blue Damselfish doesn't do that. > > > Please - any advice > > > would be appreciated! Is there something else > that > > > might be wrong with > > > the water? Do we need an airstone or air pump? > We > > > have a BIO Wheel > > > filter, a heater and the temp is around 80. > Please > > > help - I don't want > > > to lose these two fish! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > > Discover Yahoo! > > Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news > and > > more. Check it out! > > http://discover.yahoo.com/mobile.html > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > How much free photo storage do you get? Store your > holiday > snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos > http://uk.photos.yahoo.com > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when > replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text > that is not important to the reply and if changing > the topic of the original message modify the subject > line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, > we Thank You in Advance for your help in this > matter > > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Groups Links > > To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > Send instant messages to your online friends > http://au.messenger.yahoo.com > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > ___________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12118	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: [spam] Re: [AquaticLife] One clownfish dead - have 2 others - p

Hi Patrick, Yes I would basically agree with that but would point out that the number of species captive bread is still quite small though it is increasing as more companys get in on the act. But all this does not justify Pauls original false statement. regards, unclenorm. --- Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: > Paul, you were not using the conclusion, you > were using raw data. When > a report is a page long, and you take one sentence > that agrees with you and > is completly true, but there is another sentence > that agrees with the other > side and is also true, that is spinning. In a > spin-free area that is fairly > ballanced, both sentences are produced for everybody > to see and make up > their own minds. I'm just lookin' out for y'all. > That's what moderators do > .. > Is it not possible that SW fish from the area > tested by Norman could do > well in high temperatures, while the fish you > mention are from areas where > the water is colder, despite the fact that they are > the same species. A > species of fish wild-caught in Asian waters might > enjoy warm water. That > same species farm-raised in another part of the > world (and I know for a fact > that there are many species of SW fish now raised in > captivity to relieve > the stress on the ocean) might come from much cooler > waters and not do so > well in warm water. > Norman, you say you took water temperature > readings in Asia. As I've > mentioned before, and shown an example in this post, > not all of those fish > are contained in Asia. Some of them come from areas > with slightly cooler > water. They might be raised in non-coastal Asia, > which is not so warm, or > in the US, or anywhere else. Farm-raised fish might > actually be used to > cooler temperatures than wild-caught. Would you not > agree with that? > > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy. > > "Now this is not the end. It is not even the > beginning of the end. But it is > perhaps, the end of the beginning." > -Winston Churchill > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ___________________________________________________________ How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12119	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!

Not worth answering. --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > like i said old man...i do know whati am talking > about > and provided many links to prove it. guess old dogs > really never learn....just go on the same old way. > if > you are going to talk down to soemone you may as > well > leave off the pleasantry on the end as it makes you > look bad. > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> > wrote: > > > Paul, > > You can say what you want, the fact is you do > > not > > know what you are talking about, end of story. > > regards, > > unclenorm. > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > > > i am not going to drop iot becauyse you once > again > > > stick your nose iun to tell someone they are > wrong > > > when talking about an aquarium. the fish kept > in > > > aquarium are not from a singular location and > will > > > not > > > all do ok in higher temps like that. when i > told > > > someone that 80 is not a real safe temp because > > > their > > > tank can easily overheat at that temp and lose > > fish, > > > i > > > was not incorrect, and far more helpful than > > stating > > > that 90 is ok. you can say whatever you want > > about > > > it > > > being tropicalor whatever, but the simple fact > is > > > that > > > not all fish in the hobby can handle that kind > of > > > temperature, and as i stated, many will start to > > die > > > off in temps exceding 83 degrees. don't tell > > people > > > they are wrong when they are talking about the > > hobby > > > and you are talking about tropical reefs, and > not > > > tanks. > > > > > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." > <normnam2000@...> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > Well Paul some one is trying to be smart but > > it's > > > > not > > > > me, your quoting average temps again for reefs > > > world > > > > wide which may well be true as if you didn't > > know > > > > there are reef in some very cold parts of the > > > word. > > > > If > > > > you read my post again you will see I was > quite > > > > specific in stating I was referring to > TROPICAL > > > > reefs,and my figures are temperatures taken by > > me > > > > not > > > > from a book or an average of a thousand reefs > > > (which > > > > must have taken a good few years to collect) > but > > > > from > > > > many reefs in south east Asia were the vast > > > majority > > > > of the worlds TROPICAL reefs are located. As > for > > > > comparisons all my tanks are at home I have no > > > > commercial interest in the hobby but I do have > > > more > > > > than fifty years experience keeping and > breeding > > > > fish > > > > of many species. The only reason I post on > these > > > > groups is to try to help people if I can or > > > correct > > > > wrong information if I know it to be wrong > from > > > > personal experience. So Paul except that you > > have > > > a > > > > kink in your knowledge and lets drop it. > > > > regards, > > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > guess what smart guy, mine is not wrong. it > > is > > > > > based > > > > > on many years of experience, if you really > > > wanna > > > > > compare, i have 385 gallons in my home and > > > nearly > > > > > 2,000 at work. and if you will check some > > > recent > > > > > posts you will see documented and cited > > averages > > > > > world > > > > > wide on reef as 81 degrees. > > > > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." > > > <normnam2000@...> > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Hi Paul, > > > > > > My statement is fact, yours is > wrong > > ! > > > > do > > > > > > some > > > > > > research, as I said my tanks (and they > total > > > > close > > > > > > to > > > > > > 1000galls) all run between 28C and 34C ( > > > that's > > > > > 82F > > > > > > and 94F ) and they have been up and > running > > > for > > > > > more > > > > > > than six years in this location and very > > many > > > > > years > > > > > > in > > > > > > other parts of the world. People have far > > more > > > > > > problems through temperature being to low > > than > > > > to > > > > > > high. If you try to replicate nature you > > can't > > > > go > > > > > to > > > > > > far wrong. > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > once you hit 83 degrees fish will start > to > > > > drop, > > > > > > > especially gobies, dartfish, blennies > and > > > the > > > > > > like. > > > > > > > so setting your tank at 80 and having > > lights > > > > > > running > > > > > > > on top of that is not a godd idea. a > reef > > > > > should > > > > > > be > > > > > > > kept at the same temp as a tropical > tank, > > > > unless > > > > > > you > > > > > > > are doing a cold water tank, then it > > should > > > be > > > > > > below > > > > > > > 70. but thanks for trying to correct > > > > something > > > > > > that > > > > > > > is not wrong. keeping a tank higher > than > > > > needed > > > > > > > will > > > > > > > cause problems if you have a heat spell! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." > > > > > <normnam2000@...> > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hi Paul, > > > > > > > > 80 Is not to hot for a salt > > water > > > > > tank, > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > normal temp. of a tropical reef is > > between > > > > 80 > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > 90. > > > > > > > > All my tanks, mostly reef run at > 32/33C > > > this > > > > > > time > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > year, (they will rise a bit more yet) > > and > > > > > 28/29C > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > the cold season, I live in the > tropics. > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > first of all, damsels are aggressive > > and > > > > > > > > > territorial, > > > > > > > > > second if you have no protein > skimmer > > i > > > > > > > guarantee > > > > > > > > > your > > > > > > > > > nitrates are not fine. fish breathe > > > hard > > > > > liek > > > > > > > > that > > > > > > > > > when they are suffering from nitrate > > > > > > poisoning. > > > === message truncated === > > > > > __________________________________ > Discover Yahoo! > Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online and > more. Check it out! > http://discover.yahoo.com/ > ___________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12120	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!

Paul, you are now resorting to lies to try and justify your self, As I have already said your 'comment' was and I quote '80 is too hot for a sw tank', maybe you should go and sit in a corner and reread what you and I have been writing and cool of. After all my successful years in the hobby I'm afraid you can't help acquiring some knowledge of what you are doing, the supreme source only exists in the minds of young knowitall students!!. regards, (I bear no malice) unclenorm. --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > hey what do you know...someone else that knows > nothing! lmao. this guy just like to be a grumpy > old > man and act like he is the supreme source of > knowledge, when in fact he is stating the opposite > of > the truth. my comment that started this thing wa > sthat many species start to die off above 83 > degrees, > and i posted several links describing the temp range > of the fish i mentioned. don't bother wasting your > time. the guy will only tell you that you are wrong > and talk down on you, even though he just needs to > go > sit in a corner soemwhere and grow up. > > --- Ken McDougall <ken_mcdougall20012001@...> > wrote: > > > Hi unclenorm, > > You should not be letting your marine tank get > that > > hot you shouls have a chiller on it if you live in > > the tropics. Normal temp for a marine tank is > > 74-82deg F (23-28deg C). Anything over this and > the > > coral begins to die. A good book to read is "Water > > Chemistry for the Marine Aquarium" by John H > > Tullock. Since I have been using his water > > parameters a lot of small problems have > disappeared. > > Regards > > Ken > > > > "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> > wrote: > > Hi Paul, > > 80 Is not to hot for a salt water tank, > the > > normal temp. of a tropical reef is between 80 and > > 90. > > All my tanks, mostly reef run at 32/33C this time > of > > year, (they will rise a bit more yet) and 28/29C > in > > the cold season, I live in the tropics. > > regards, > > unclenorm. > > > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > > > first of all, damsels are aggressive and > > > territorial, > > > second if you have no protein skimmer i > guarantee > > > your > > > nitrates are not fine. fish breathe hard liek > > that > > > when they are suffering from nitrate poisoning. > > > third > > > 80 is too hot for a sw tank. > > > > > > --- Sheila <smccamy@...> wrote: > > > > > > > We lost our first clownfish this morning and > we > > > only > > > > got him last > > > > Saturday. When we got him, we put him in our > > > > established tank with a > > > > female Blue Damselfish, a Coral Banded Shrimp, > > and > > > a > > > > green Hermit Crab. > > > > From the start, he was rapidly opening and > > closing > > > > his mouth non-stop. > > > > I called the pet store and they told me that > was > > > > normal for clownfish. > > > > Over the next few days, he wasn't eating and > > would > > > > stay in one corner > > > > of the tank. Then he began hanging out at the > > > water > > > > line like he was > > > > trying to get air. I did tests on the water - > > > > salinity, amonia, > > > > nitrite, nitrate - it all tested fine. Now the > > new > > > > Clarkii clowns we > > > > got this morning are doing the same mouth > thing, > > > > like they are > > > > breathing very rapidly. They did eat a bit > > earlier > > > > and do not appear to > > > > be stressed, but are they supposed to open and > > > close > > > > their mouths > > > > constantly? The Blue Damselfish doesn't do > that. > > > > Please - any advice > > > > would be appreciated! Is there something else > > that > > > > might be wrong with > > > > the water? Do we need an airstone or air pump? > > We > > > > have a BIO Wheel > > > > filter, a heater and the temp is around 80. > > Please > > > > help - I don't want > > > > to lose these two fish! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > > > Discover Yahoo! > > > Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news > > and > > > more. Check it out! > > > http://discover.yahoo.com/mobile.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > > How much free photo storage do you get? Store your > > holiday > > snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos > > http://uk.photos.yahoo.com > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > when > > replying, thanks > > . > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text > > that is not important to the reply and if changing > > the topic of the original message modify the > subject > > line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" > <-, > > we Thank You in Advance for your help in this > > matter > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > To visit your group on the web, go to: > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email > to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > > Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > > > > Send instant messages to your online friends > > http://au.messenger.yahoo.com > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > Discover Yahoo! > Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online and > more. Check it out! > http://discover.yahoo.com/ > ___________________________________________________________ How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12121	From: Amalthea	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!

instead of clogging all of our mailboxes with the ridiculous and never ending arguments, why don't you guys bicker privately offlist, or start a group JUST for bickering! I'm guessing that if you took a little poll in the group, that would get more agreement than anything else. amalthea http://www.amaltheasattic.com Your Alternative to the Alternative.... On Jun 6, 2005, at 1:09 AM, Norman. S. Hampson. wrote: > Paul, you are now resorting to lies to try and justify > your self, As I have already said your 'comment' was > and I quote '80 is too hot for a sw tank', maybe you > should go and sit in a corner and reread what you and > I have been writing and cool of. After all my > successful years in the hobby I'm afraid you can't > help acquiring some knowledge of what you are doing, > the supreme source only exists in the minds of young > knowitall students!!. > regards, (I bear no malice) > unclenorm. > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > hey what do you know...someone else that knows > > nothing! lmao. this guy just like to be a grumpy > > old > > man and act like he is the supreme source of > > knowledge, when in fact he is stating the opposite > > of > > the truth. my comment that started this thing wa > > sthat many species start to die off above 83 > > degrees, > > and i posted several links describing the temp range > > of the fish i mentioned. don't bother wasting your > > time. the guy will only tell you that you are wrong > > and talk down on you, even though he just needs to > > go > > sit in a corner soemwhere and grow up. > > > > --- Ken McDougall <ken_mcdougall20012001@...> > > wrote: > > > > > Hi unclenorm, > > > You should not be letting your marine tank get > > that > > > hot you shouls have a chiller on it if you live in > > > the tropics. Normal temp for a marine tank is > > > 74-82deg F (23-28deg C). Anything over this and > > the > > > coral begins to die. A good book to read is "Water > > > Chemistry for the Marine Aquarium" by John H > > > Tullock. Since I have been using his water > > > parameters a lot of small problems have > > disappeared. > > > Regards > > > Ken > > > > > > "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> > > wrote: > > > Hi Paul, > > > 80 Is not to hot for a salt water tank, > > the > > > normal temp. of a tropical reef is between 80 and > > > 90. > > > All my tanks, mostly reef run at 32/33C this time > > of > > > year, (they will rise a bit more yet) and 28/29C > > in > > > the cold season, I live in the tropics. > > > regards, > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12122	From: Tim Fairchild	Date: 6/5/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!

On Monday 06 Jun 2005 15:09, Norman. S. Hampson. wrote: > Paul, you are now resorting to lies to try and justify > your self, As I have already said your 'comment' was > and I quote '80 is too hot for a sw tank', maybe you Yes, 80 is too hot for a tank. Water boils at 100 When are you guys going to catch up with the world and use metric ;) Just for a change of pace with the bickering :) tim -- --------------------------------------------------------- Tim & Therese Fairchild Atchafalaya Border Collies. Kuttabul, Queensland, Australia. --------------------------------------------------------- Email mailto:tim@... Homepage http://www.bcs4me.com Photos http://www.pbase.com/amosf ---------------------------------------------------------

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12123	From: paul helms	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!

yet you do...hmmmm --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> wrote: > Not worth answering. > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > like i said old man...i do know whati am talking > > about > > and provided many links to prove it. guess old > dogs > > really never learn....just go on the same old way. > > if > > you are going to talk down to soemone you may as > > well > > leave off the pleasantry on the end as it makes > you > > look bad. > > > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> > > wrote: > > > > > Paul, > > > You can say what you want, the fact is you > do > > > not > > > know what you are talking about, end of story. > > > regards, > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > > > > > i am not going to drop iot becauyse you once > > again > > > > stick your nose iun to tell someone they are > > wrong > > > > when talking about an aquarium. the fish kept > > in > > > > aquarium are not from a singular location and > > will > > > > not > > > > all do ok in higher temps like that. when i > > told > > > > someone that 80 is not a real safe temp > because > > > > their > > > > tank can easily overheat at that temp and lose > > > fish, > > > > i > > > > was not incorrect, and far more helpful than > > > stating > > > > that 90 is ok. you can say whatever you want > > > about > > > > it > > > > being tropicalor whatever, but the simple fact > > is > > > > that > > > > not all fish in the hobby can handle that kind > > of > > > > temperature, and as i stated, many will start > to > > > die > > > > off in temps exceding 83 degrees. don't tell > > > people > > > > they are wrong when they are talking about the > > > hobby > > > > and you are talking about tropical reefs, and > > not > > > > tanks. > > > > > > > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." > > <normnam2000@...> > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > Well Paul some one is trying to be smart but > > > it's > > > > > not > > > > > me, your quoting average temps again for > reefs > > > > world > > > > > wide which may well be true as if you didn't > > > know > > > > > there are reef in some very cold parts of > the > > > > word. > > > > > If > > > > > you read my post again you will see I was > > quite > > > > > specific in stating I was referring to > > TROPICAL > > > > > reefs,and my figures are temperatures taken > by > > > me > > > > > not > > > > > from a book or an average of a thousand > reefs > > > > (which > > > > > must have taken a good few years to collect) > > but > > > > > from > > > > > many reefs in south east Asia were the vast > > > > majority > > > > > of the worlds TROPICAL reefs are located. As > > for > > > > > comparisons all my tanks are at home I have > no > > > > > commercial interest in the hobby but I do > have > > > > more > > > > > than fifty years experience keeping and > > breeding > > > > > fish > > > > > of many species. The only reason I post on > > these > > > > > groups is to try to help people if I can or > > > > correct > > > > > wrong information if I know it to be wrong > > from > > > > > personal experience. So Paul except that you > > > have > > > > a > > > > > kink in your knowledge and lets drop it. > > > > > regards, > > > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > guess what smart guy, mine is not wrong. > it > > > is > > > > > > based > > > > > > on many years of experience, if you > really > > > > wanna > > > > > > compare, i have 385 gallons in my home and > > > > nearly > > > > > > 2,000 at work. and if you will check some > > > > recent > > > > > > posts you will see documented and cited > > > averages > > > > > > world > > > > > > wide on reef as 81 degrees. > > > > > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." > > > > <normnam2000@...> > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hi Paul, > > > > > > > My statement is fact, yours is > > wrong > > > ! > > > > > do > > > > > > > some > > > > > > > research, as I said my tanks (and they > > total > > > > > close > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > 1000galls) all run between 28C and 34C ( > > > > that's > > > > > > 82F > > > > > > > and 94F ) and they have been up and > > running > > > > for > > > > > > more > > > > > > > than six years in this location and very > > > many > > > > > > years > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > other parts of the world. People have > far > > > more > > > > > > > problems through temperature being to > low > > > than > > > > > to > > > > > > > high. If you try to replicate nature you > > > can't > > > > > go > > > > > > to > > > > > > > far wrong. > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > once you hit 83 degrees fish will > start > > to > > > > > drop, > > > > > > > > especially gobies, dartfish, blennies > > and > > > > the > > > > > > > like. > > > > > > > > so setting your tank at 80 and having > > > lights > > > > > > > running > > > > > > > > on top of that is not a godd idea. a > > reef > > > > > > should > > > > > > > be > > > > > > > > kept at the same temp as a tropical > === message truncated === __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12124	From: paul helms	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!

thank you very much valeen, yet again a wrong person? --- Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote: > oh my god! 80-90?!?! are you nuts?!?! that sounds > too hot from what i've heard. i've always heard > between 77-80 and not any higher, especially heading > into summer as we are when the outside temps are > only going to get hotter. > > correct me if i'm wrong on this anyone, but aren't > sw tanks not supposed to be kept above 80 degrees? > > "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> wrote: > Hi Paul, > 80 Is not to hot for a salt water tank, the > normal temp. of a tropical reef is between 80 and > 90. > All my tanks, mostly reef run at 32/33C this time of > year, (they will rise a bit more yet) and 28/29C in > the cold season, I live in the tropics. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > first of all, damsels are aggressive and > > territorial, > > second if you have no protein skimmer i guarantee > > your > > nitrates are not fine. fish breathe hard liek > that > > when they are suffering from nitrate poisoning. > > third > > 80 is too hot for a sw tank. > > > > --- Sheila <smccamy@...> wrote: > > > > > We lost our first clownfish this morning and we > > only > > > got him last > > > Saturday. When we got him, we put him in our > > > established tank with a > > > female Blue Damselfish, a Coral Banded Shrimp, > and > > a > > > green Hermit Crab. > > > From the start, he was rapidly opening and > closing > > > his mouth non-stop. > > > I called the pet store and they told me that was > > > normal for clownfish. > > > Over the next few days, he wasn't eating and > would > > > stay in one corner > > > of the tank. Then he began hanging out at the > > water > > > line like he was > > > trying to get air. I did tests on the water - > > > salinity, amonia, > > > nitrite, nitrate - it all tested fine. Now the > new > > > Clarkii clowns we > > > got this morning are doing the same mouth thing, > > > like they are > > > breathing very rapidly. They did eat a bit > earlier > > > and do not appear to > > > be stressed, but are they supposed to open and > > close > > > their mouths > > > constantly? The Blue Damselfish doesn't do that. > > > Please - any advice > > > would be appreciated! Is there something else > that > > > might be wrong with > > > the water? Do we need an airstone or air pump? > We > > > have a BIO Wheel > > > filter, a heater and the temp is around 80. > Please > > > help - I don't want > > > to lose these two fish! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > > Discover Yahoo! > > Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news > and > > more. Check it out! > > http://discover.yahoo.com/mobile.html > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > How much free photo storage do you get? Store your > holiday > snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos > http://uk.photos.yahoo.com > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when > replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text > that is not important to the reply and if changing > the topic of the original message modify the subject > line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, > we Thank You in Advance for your help in this > matter > > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Groups Links > > To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > I love my 2 Ocellaris clownfish! > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Make Yahoo! your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12125	From: paul helms	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!

geee? wonder why that it is??? could it be because that is the correct temp? nah you must be right as usual.... --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> wrote: > Some of them live for years in my tanks to, have you > ever seen that site recommend any other temp. ? > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > here are some specific eaxamples of said fish that > > will start to die of in the mid 80's. i have all > of > > tehse in my tanks, so no they are not rare at all. > > > > > http://liveaquaria.com/product/prod_Display.cfm?pCatId=181 > > > > > http://liveaquaria.com/product/prod_Display.cfm?pCatId=168 > > > > > http://liveaquaria.com/product/prod_Display.cfm?pCatId=173 > > > > > http://liveaquaria.com/product/prod_Display.cfm?pCatId=195 > > > > > http://liveaquaria.com/product/prod_Display.cfm?pCatId=228 > > > > > http://liveaquaria.com/product/prod_Display.cfm?pCatId=1114 > > > > > http://liveaquaria.com/product/prod_Display.cfm?pCatId=375 > > > > > http://liveaquaria.com/product/prod_Display.cfm?pCatId=755 > > > > there are a few for you with their rcommended > temps > > and specific gravities....interesting taht none > are > > listed in the 80's huh? > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> > > wrote: > > > > > Well Paul some one is trying to be smart but > it's > > > not > > > me, your quoting average temps again for reefs > > world > > > wide which may well be true as if you didn't > know > > > there are reef in some very cold parts of the > > word. > > > If > > > you read my post again you will see I was quite > > > specific in stating I was referring to TROPICAL > > > reefs,and my figures are temperatures taken by > me > > > not > > > from a book or an average of a thousand reefs > > (which > > > must have taken a good few years to collect) but > > > from > > > many reefs in south east Asia were the vast > > majority > > > of the worlds TROPICAL reefs are located. As for > > > comparisons all my tanks are at home I have no > > > commercial interest in the hobby but I do have > > more > > > than fifty years experience keeping and breeding > > > fish > > > of many species. The only reason I post on these > > > groups is to try to help people if I can or > > correct > > > wrong information if I know it to be wrong from > > > personal experience. So Paul except that you > have > > a > > > kink in your knowledge and lets drop it. > > > regards, > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > > > > > guess what smart guy, mine is not wrong. it > is > > > > based > > > > on many years of experience, if you really > > wanna > > > > compare, i have 385 gallons in my home and > > nearly > > > > 2,000 at work. and if you will check some > > recent > > > > posts you will see documented and cited > averages > > > > world > > > > wide on reef as 81 degrees. > > > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." > > <normnam2000@...> > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > Hi Paul, > > > > > My statement is fact, yours is wrong > ! > > > do > > > > > some > > > > > research, as I said my tanks (and they total > > > close > > > > > to > > > > > 1000galls) all run between 28C and 34C ( > > that's > > > > 82F > > > > > and 94F ) and they have been up and running > > for > > > > more > > > > > than six years in this location and very > many > > > > years > > > > > in > > > > > other parts of the world. People have far > more > > > > > problems through temperature being to low > than > > > to > > > > > high. If you try to replicate nature you > can't > > > go > > > > to > > > > > far wrong. > > > > > Regards, > > > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > once you hit 83 degrees fish will start to > > > drop, > > > > > > especially gobies, dartfish, blennies and > > the > > > > > like. > > > > > > so setting your tank at 80 and having > lights > > > > > running > > > > > > on top of that is not a godd idea. a reef > > > > should > > > > > be > > > > > > kept at the same temp as a tropical tank, > > > unless > > > > > you > > > > > > are doing a cold water tank, then it > should > > be > > > > > below > > > > > > 70. but thanks for trying to correct > > > something > > > > > that > > > > > > is not wrong. keeping a tank higher than > > > needed > > > > > > will > > > > > > cause problems if you have a heat spell! > > > > > > > > > > > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." > > > > <normnam2000@...> > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hi Paul, > > > > > > > 80 Is not to hot for a salt > water > > > > tank, > > > > > > the > > > > > > > normal temp. of a tropical reef is > between > > > 80 > > > > > and > > > > > > > 90. > > > > > > > All my tanks, mostly reef run at 32/33C > > this > > > > > time > > > > > > of > > > > > > > year, (they will rise a bit more yet) > and > > > > 28/29C > > > > > > in > > > > > > > the cold season, I live in the tropics. > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > first of all, damsels are aggressive > and > > > > > > > > territorial, > > > > > > > > second if you have no protein skimmer > i > > > > > > guarantee > > > > > > > > your > > > > > > > > nitrates are not fine. fish breathe > === message truncated === __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Have fun online with music videos, cool games, IM and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/online.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12126	From: paul helms	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!

nice trimming there....not the full statement. i disagreed with that plaianly, but it is much closer than the 80-90 that you claim to be safe. and by the way, you have no right to tell me to "shut up". if you do not wish to further this, then take your own advice and stop replying. --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> wrote: > Paul, > Please pause and think what your saying and > quoting, read my statement, you will see that you > are > contradicting your self, you have just quoted Dr Ron > Shimek as saying that tanks should be between 80 and > 84 OK, the figures I quoted are FACT for one area, > the > area were I now live. Now your original statement :- > '80 is too hot for a sw tank' > So please Paul stop trying to justify an > incorrect statement if you won't admit it just shut > up!. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > since you want to use ronald l shimek phd as > > refernce > > as well, here is a direct quote from his book > > "marine > > invertebrates" "most coral reefs have > temperatures > > that range between 78-86. the average of 1000 > reefs > > is > > 81." "some corals can survive from temps of 68-90, > > and > > they are often found in areas where the temps > reach > > the extremes or are predominately shifted to > either > > the colder or the hotter parts of their range. > > animals living in such marginal environments are > not > > thriving , they are simply surviving." he goes on > to > > state that he believes in keeping tanks between 80 > > and > > 84 and at higher salinity, but i would not doubt > > that > > this is to keep parasites and disease at bay, and > > that > > he can afford teh equipment to keep it in that > exact > > range, such as chillers and teh like. like i said > > before you can have problems once you go above 83 > > degress. i aslo referenced a type of fish first > > effected as gobies, which is the case. when tanks > > run > > from 85-90, and have not been acclimated that way, > > the > > gobies and blennies and dart fish will start to > drop > > like flies. > > > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> > > wrote: > > > > > Well Paul some one is trying to be smart but > it's > > > not > > > me, your quoting average temps again for reefs > > world > > > wide which may well be true as if you didn't > know > > > there are reef in some very cold parts of the > > word. > > > If > > > you read my post again you will see I was quite > > > specific in stating I was referring to TROPICAL > > > reefs,and my figures are temperatures taken by > me > > > not > > > from a book or an average of a thousand reefs > > (which > > > must have taken a good few years to collect) but > > > from > > > many reefs in south east Asia were the vast > > majority > > > of the worlds TROPICAL reefs are located. As for > > > comparisons all my tanks are at home I have no > > > commercial interest in the hobby but I do have > > more > > > than fifty years experience keeping and breeding > > > fish > > > of many species. The only reason I post on these > > > groups is to try to help people if I can or > > correct > > > wrong information if I know it to be wrong from > > > personal experience. So Paul except that you > have > > a > > > kink in your knowledge and lets drop it. > > > regards, > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > > > > > guess what smart guy, mine is not wrong. it > is > > > > based > > > > on many years of experience, if you really > > wanna > > > > compare, i have 385 gallons in my home and > > nearly > > > > 2,000 at work. and if you will check some > > recent > > > > posts you will see documented and cited > averages > > > > world > > > > wide on reef as 81 degrees. > > > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." > > <normnam2000@...> > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > Hi Paul, > > > > > My statement is fact, yours is wrong > ! > > > do > > > > > some > > > > > research, as I said my tanks (and they total > > > close > > > > > to > > > > > 1000galls) all run between 28C and 34C ( > > that's > > > > 82F > > > > > and 94F ) and they have been up and running > > for > > > > more > > > > > than six years in this location and very > many > > > > years > > > > > in > > > > > other parts of the world. People have far > more > > > > > problems through temperature being to low > than > > > to > > > > > high. If you try to replicate nature you > can't > > > go > > > > to > > > > > far wrong. > > > > > Regards, > > > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > once you hit 83 degrees fish will start to > > > drop, > > > > > > especially gobies, dartfish, blennies and > > the > > > > > like. > > > > > > so setting your tank at 80 and having > lights > > > > > running > > > > > > on top of that is not a godd idea. a reef > > > > should > > > > > be > > > > > > kept at the same temp as a tropical tank, > > > unless > > > > > you > > > > > > are doing a cold water tank, then it > should > > be > > > > > below > > > > > > 70. but thanks for trying to correct > > > something > > > > > that > > > > > > is not wrong. keeping a tank higher than > > > needed > > > > > > will > > > > > > cause problems if you have a heat spell! > > > > > > > > > > > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." > > > > <normnam2000@...> > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hi Paul, > > > > > > > 80 Is not to hot for a salt > water > > > > tank, > > > > > > the > > > > > > > normal temp. of a tropical reef is > between > > > 80 > > > > > and > > > > > > > 90. > > > > > > > All my tanks, mostly reef run at 32/33C > > this > > > > > time > > > > > > of > > > > > > > year, (they will rise a bit more yet) > and > > > > 28/29C > > > > > > in > === message truncated === __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Make Yahoo! your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12127	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies

Hi Nan, Thanks for the comments :-). The tank 8 gallon is actually a 15" cube with loads of plant cover. Infact there are so many plants that you can barely see a couple of inches inside the tank. I assume about 30 cabomba, 15-20 hygrophylla polysperma, some floating crypts, 2 very large anubias, some hydrocotyle and to top all off, plenty of clumps of java moss floating. The plants are right from the bottom to the top. I had no problems with the females hiding from the males and none of them even had a single fin nip. I tried some powdered fry food but the tank itself is so large for 6 fry that they probably never reached it. Uneaten food is not a problem as the amount of snails in that tank is horrendous and there is nothing that will ever go waste. I suppose around 300 Malaysian trumpet snails, similar amount of ramshorn and plenty of pest snails. I will try and see if I can get a daphnia culture or be able to hatch some brine shrimps to help the fry but my assumption is that everything will get lost in that tank and baby brineshrimp may not survive long enough for the fry to be able to find them. I have performed a 10% water change very carefully. The tank already has a running filter. It is in internal small power filter that has always been there and if the fry managed to evade it to this stage, I think they can evade it further. It is however on the lowest possible setting. Good thing is that the tank is fully cycled and with these many plants, there are nominal chances of water quality going bad. Thanks, Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nan Sent: 05 June 2005 21:20 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Betta babies Hey, Nim! First off, an 8 gallon is far, far to small to house 2 female and a male betta. That is very cool that they spawned, and yes the fry are more than likely living off of the infusoria that is comeing from the snails. Yes, do feed them the powdered fry food for livebearers, also, you might want to give them some decapped BBS eggs, or you can give them frozen Brine Shrimp, a very small amount. If you have any guppy fry you can put a couple in there to help teach your Betta fry to come to the top for the flake food. Makes the transition easier and they will get along. You still have several weeks (when they start fussing then seperate them, otherwise they are fine, really!) before you have to worry about moving them around. Actually, you might get lucky and they might be all female at which point you won't have to move them. A sure indicator of having to move them is when you catch them harrassing others of the same species, and that won't happen until you can see color on them and that is usually (in my expierence) at about 3 to 4 weeks old. And if you have a good filtration system going, no don't worry about doing a full water chance, maybe a partial in a couple of weeks (like 10%, then the next week about 20% after that).m If you don't have a good filtration system on there, then buy a sponge filter. It will work fine, and keep you from haveing to do a big water change. Hope this helps. Nan Nimish Mathur <nimmat4@...> wrote: Guys, About 3 weeks ago, I had a male betta and 2 females in a tank with loads of hiding space and it was going fine and suddenly next day morning all 3 were found dead :-s. Sad, but I fished them out but did not shut off the tank as I did not really have time to do anything to it or even test why it happened. Yesterday, while watching TV, I noticed some movement in the tank. On close inspection I noticed a fry. I inspected in the morning as well and finally counted 4 fry. They are about 1cm long and seem to be feeding well on .. Hmm. Don't know exactly what. There is a flurry of Trumpet snails and ramshorn in there and I think that is what kept the fry growing by creating infusoria. My questions are: They are big enough to be able to take powdered fry food so when is the best time to start? There seems to be enough microscopic food in the tank. When will be a best time to separate them to prevent them from fighting or cannibalizing on each other? There are loads of plants in the tank and it is a 8 gallon tank. Do I need to change water? Or is there anything special to do? I believe that the time when they need baby brine shrimp has passed as these are a bit bigger then newly born guppy fry. Thanks, Nim ~nan and crew~ Rome, GA http://www.geocities.com/ntalb00/index.htm (updated) bettas and soon we add guppys! --------------------------------- Yahoo! Mail Mobile Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter _____ Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12128	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies

Yes Dan, There is probably more plant then water in that tank. Lol There always has been. Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Dan Sent: 06 June 2005 02:28 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies I 1st want to say that this is not an attack, just a difference of opinion on the tank size, all other info is exact in my opinion. Now all I want to really say is that an 8 gallon tank is NOT too small for three BETTA, especially since two of them were female. The tank is supposedly also filled with numerous plants for the BETTA to hide, so the 8 gallon should be ok, even for the fry to grow into - as long as there will be only one male in it. Best Fishes, Dan (thaSkorpeon) --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Nan <ntalb00@y...> wrote: > Hey, Nim! > > First off, an 8 gallon is far, far to small to house 2 female and a male betta. That is very cool that they spawned, and yes the fry are more than likely living off of the infusoria that is comeing from the snails. > > Yes, do feed them the powdered fry food for livebearers, also, you might want to give them some decapped BBS eggs, or you can give them frozen Brine Shrimp, a very small amount. If you have any guppy fry you can put a couple in there to help teach your Betta fry to come to the top for the flake food. Makes the transition easier and they will get along. > > You still have several weeks (when they start fussing then seperate them, otherwise they are fine, really!) before you have to worry about moving them around. Actually, you might get lucky and they might be all female at which point you won't have to move them. A sure indicator of having to move them is when you catch them harrassing others of the same species, and that won't happen until you can see color on them and that is usually (in my expierence) at about 3 to 4 weeks old. > > And if you have a good filtration system going, no don't worry about doing a full water chance, maybe a partial in a couple of weeks (like 10%, then the next week about 20% after that).m If you don't have a good filtration system on there, then buy a sponge filter. It will work fine, and keep you from haveing to do a big water change. > > Hope this helps. > > Nan > > Nimish Mathur <nimmat4@y...> wrote: > Guys, > > About 3 weeks ago, I had a male betta and 2 females in a tank with loads of > hiding space and it was going fine and suddenly next day morning all 3 were > found dead :-s. > > > > Sad, but I fished them out but did not shut off the tank as I did not really > have time to do anything to it or even test why it happened. Yesterday, > while watching TV, I noticed some movement in the tank. On close inspection > I noticed a fry. I inspected in the morning as well and finally counted 4 > fry. They are about 1cm long and seem to be feeding well on .. Hmm. Don't > know exactly what. There is a flurry of Trumpet snails and ramshorn in there > and I think that is what kept the fry growing by creating infusoria. > > > > My questions are: > > > > They are big enough to be able to take powdered fry food so when is the best > time to start? There seems to be enough microscopic food in the tank. > > When will be a best time to separate them to prevent them from fighting or > cannibalizing on each other? > > There are loads of plants in the tank and it is a 8 gallon tank. Do I need > to change water? Or is there anything special to do? > > > > I believe that the time when they need baby brine shrimp has passed as these > are a bit bigger then newly born guppy fry. > > > > Thanks, > > Nim > > > > ~nan and crew~ > Rome, GA > http://www.geocities.com/ntalb00/index.htm (updated) > bettas and soon we add guppys! > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Mail Mobile > Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter _____ Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12129	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - Water Boiling point...

Water boils at 100 C maybe but it's around 212 F which is what this topics these temps are currently stated in. If it were 100F, our own bodies would be frightningly close to boiling. =) -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Tim Fairchild Sent: Monday, June 06, 2005 1:14 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help! On Monday 06 Jun 2005 15:09, Norman. S. Hampson. wrote: > Paul, you are now resorting to lies to try and justify > your self, As I have already said your 'comment' was > and I quote '80 is too hot for a sw tank', maybe you Yes, 80 is too hot for a tank. Water boils at 100 When are you guys going to catch up with the world and use metric ;) Just for a change of pace with the bickering :) tim -- --------------------------------------------------------- Tim & Therese Fairchild Atchafalaya Border Collies. Kuttabul, Queensland, Australia. --------------------------------------------------------- Email mailto:tim@... Homepage http://www.bcs4me.com Photos http://www.pbase.com/amosf --------------------------------------------------------- Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12130	From: Patrick	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: [spam] Re: [AquaticLife] One clownfish dead - have 2 others - pleas

Good suggestion. Everyone is invited to join, but only if you want a good debate! Now there will be one place for people to go to argue and there won t be so much trouble here. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/aquariumdebates/ Description: This group is dedicated to debates concerning aquariums. No rules of engagement on this group. You can expect name calling and personal attacks. This group may become the rudest group on Yahoo! Join now to debate salt use general fish care, evolution of fish, and Marine vs. Freshwater, along with many other topics for debate. So join now, but bring your own mud to throw! Patrick -------Original Message------- instead of clogging all of our mailboxes with the ridiculous and never ending arguments, why don't you guys bicker privately offlist, or start a group JUST for bickering! I'm guessing that if you took a little poll in the group, that would get more agreement than anything else. amalthea [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12131	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: [spam] Re: [AquaticLife] One clownfish dead - have 2 others - p

Lol That is too funny. Now as you obviously "own" this debate group, you aren't going to ban those that don't agree with you are you? =) -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Patrick Sent: Monday, June 06, 2005 10:00 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [spam] Re: [AquaticLife] One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help! Good suggestion. Everyone is invited to join, but only if you want a good debate! Now there will be one place for people to go to argue and there won t be so much trouble here. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/aquariumdebates/ Description: This group is dedicated to debates concerning aquariums. No rules of engagement on this group. You can expect name calling and personal attacks. This group may become the rudest group on Yahoo! Join now to debate salt use general fish care, evolution of fish, and Marine vs. Freshwater, along with many other topics for debate. So join now, but bring your own mud to throw! Patrick -------Original Message------- instead of clogging all of our mailboxes with the ridiculous and never ending arguments, why don't you guys bicker privately offlist, or start a group JUST for bickering! I'm guessing that if you took a little poll in the group, that would get more agreement than anything else. amalthea [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12132	From: Patrick	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: One clownfish dead - have 2 others - please help!

That would be cheating. I'll just call them a rude name. :) Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill -------Original Message------- Lol That is too funny. Now as you obviously "own" this debate group, you aren't going to ban those that don't agree with you are you? =)

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12133	From: Amalthea	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: [spam] Re: [AquaticLife] One clownfish dead - have 2 others - p

Patrick, you just won the official "rockinist mod ever" award. I'm hoping everyone follows through! Amalthea Do evil clowns give you a funny feeling? Join us at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/puppetterrors/ All the cool kids are doing it.... On Jun 6, 2005, at 11:00 AM, Patrick wrote: > Good suggestion. Everyone is invited to join, but only if you want > a good > debate! Now there will be one place for people to go to argue and > there won > t be so much trouble here. > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/aquariumdebates/ > Description: > This group is dedicated to debates concerning aquariums. No rules of > engagement on this group. You can expect name calling and personal > attacks. > This group may become the rudest group on Yahoo! Join now to debate > salt use > general fish care, evolution of fish, and Marine vs. Freshwater, > along with > many other topics for debate. So join now, but bring your own mud > to throw! > > Patrick > -------Original Message------- > instead of clogging all of our mailboxes with the ridiculous and > never ending arguments, why don't you guys bicker privately offlist, > or start a group JUST for bickering! I'm guessing that if you took a > little poll in the group, that would get more agreement than anything > else. > amalthea > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not > important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original > message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12134	From: kb1dva	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: macs and fish

I heard that old macs make great fish tanks does anyone have any experience in this? ----- Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12135	From: Trevor Holyoak	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: macs and fish

"MacQuariums" make interesting fishtanks, but I'm not exactly sure they make "great" ones. :) You actually have to put a tank inside the case (after taking all the electronic stuff out), but they appear as if the fish are swimming around inside the Mac. I actually bought an old Mac a few years ago to make one, but never got around to it. You can see some that people have made here: http://www.theapplecollection.com/Collection/MacAquarium/index.shtml (or http://tinyurl.com/65dqe ). - Trevor kb1dva wrote: > I heard that old macs make great fish tanks does anyone have any > experience > in this? ----- Emily > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12136	From: Patrick	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: [spam] Re: [AquaticLife] macs and fish

In my opinion, anything that makes a mac useful is ok with me. :) I have seen pictures of tv's, computers, and other things with screens or windows that had tanks put in them. I don't know how they were made, but I m sure somebody knows where to get the plans for it. Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill -------Original Message------- I heard that old macs make great fish tanks does anyone have any experience in this? ----- Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12137	From: Dan	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies

Parents rarely die after spawning, only if they get too torn up as a result of aggressiveness along with some other infection of some kind. If the parents are immediately quarantined into a seperate tank with heated clean water and medicines, along with a good diet - all should turn out ok. Something else will usually kill them off, not the mating itself. Dan (thaSkorpeon) --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Nicolas Munro" <nmunro@q...> wrote: > Do the parents always die when they give birth to the babys? I kinda > remember some one else had some die for some reason. > > =Nick > PS: If any one has any fish they want to get rid of in Brisbane Queensland > i'm interested. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Nan" <ntalb00@y...> > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Monday, June 06, 2005 6:20 AM > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Betta babies > > > > Hey, Nim! > > > > First off, an 8 gallon is far, far to small to house 2 female and a male > > betta. That is very cool that they spawned, and yes the fry are more than > > likely living off of the infusoria that is comeing from the snails. > > > > Yes, do feed them the powdered fry food for livebearers, also, you might > > want to give them some decapped BBS eggs, or you can give them frozen > > Brine Shrimp, a very small amount. If you have any guppy fry you can put > > a couple in there to help teach your Betta fry to come to the top for the > > flake food. Makes the transition easier and they will get along. > > > > You still have several weeks (when they start fussing then seperate them, > > otherwise they are fine, really!) before you have to worry about moving > > them around. Actually, you might get lucky and they might be all female > > at which point you won't have to move them. A sure indicator of having to > > move them is when you catch them harrassing others of the same species, > > and that won't happen until you can see color on them and that is usually > > (in my expierence) at about 3 to 4 weeks old. > > > > And if you have a good filtration system going, no don't worry about doing > > a full water chance, maybe a partial in a couple of weeks (like 10%, then > > the next week about 20% after that).m If you don't have a good filtration > > system on there, then buy a sponge filter. It will work fine, and keep > > you from haveing to do a big water change. > > > > Hope this helps. > > > > Nan > > > > Nimish Mathur <nimmat4@y...> wrote: > > Guys, > > > > About 3 weeks ago, I had a male betta and 2 females in a tank with loads > > of > > hiding space and it was going fine and suddenly next day morning all 3 > > were > > found dead :-s. > > > > > > > > Sad, but I fished them out but did not shut off the tank as I did not > > really > > have time to do anything to it or even test why it happened. Yesterday, > > while watching TV, I noticed some movement in the tank. On close > > inspection > > I noticed a fry. I inspected in the morning as well and finally counted 4 > > fry. They are about 1cm long and seem to be feeding well on .. Hmm. Don't > > know exactly what. There is a flurry of Trumpet snails and ramshorn in > > there > > and I think that is what kept the fry growing by creating infusoria. > > > > > > > > My questions are: > > > > > > > > They are big enough to be able to take powdered fry food so when is the > > best > > time to start? There seems to be enough microscopic food in the tank. > > > > When will be a best time to separate them to prevent them from fighting or > > cannibalizing on each other? > > > > There are loads of plants in the tank and it is a 8 gallon tank. Do I need > > to change water? Or is there anything special to do? > > > > > > > > I believe that the time when they need baby brine shrimp has passed as > > these > > are a bit bigger then newly born guppy fry. > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > Nim > > > > > > > > ~nan and crew~ > > Rome, GA > > http://www.geocities.com/ntalb00/index.htm (updated) > > bettas and soon we add guppys! > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > Yahoo! Mail Mobile > > Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone. > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > > . > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > > in Advance for your help in this matter > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12138	From: minnesotagal866	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: New to group

Hi all, My name is Jackie and I am a fish addict . . . Currently I have a 55 gallon freshwater set-up. It is a planted tank with mostly red melon swords, a few other swords, java moss, and java fern. I currently use normal aquarium lighting but hope to upgrade. The moss and ferns grow on large pieces of driftwood. The plants do ok, the red melon swords and java moss do the best in the low light. In my tank I currently have 8 tiger barbs, 5 bleeding heart tetras, 5 pristella tetras, 3 (I think, they hide) corys of some sort, 1 blue gourami, 1 pleco, and 1 iridescant shark. I've had the tank for over a year. I am a tiger barb lover and am thinking about trying to breed them in the future, but for now I'm content to watch them and enjoy how they follow me across the room (the beggars)! I also have a 10 gallon that is heavily planted with about 3 gallons of water in it. It contains 1 fire-belly toad, 2 fire-belly newts, and a snail. It has better lighting and the plants grow faster. I used to have white clouds in with them but the newts managed to eat a couple of them so I moved them. I have a betta in a 1 gallon bowl that I plan to upgrade this winter to a larger tank with a mini heater. There's also a red sword in there that does remarkably well in the low light conditions. Finally, I have an outdoor water container garden (above ground) that I keep about 10 white clouds and a few leftover zebra danios. The garden has a water lily, an iris, and some forget-me-nots. I'm hoping the white clouds will spawn and perhaps give the newts some live food. This winter the whole container will come in the foyer. No filtration, just the plants and regular water changes. My goal is to eventually get a 75 or better yet a 125 for the shark when he becomes larger and design the tank around him. The 55 will either house the remaining tropical fish or it may become a large habitat for my newts, the toad, and some fish. I've read a bunch of back posts, lots of advice and interesting reading material. My mantra in life as far as fish keeping goes . . . you can't do too many water changes. I change at least 20 gallons a week in my 55 gallon tank. Frequent regular large school water changes will prevent a lot of headaches. Looking forward to reading everyone's posts .. . Jackie

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12139	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Bleach Solution for Cleaning Tanks

great, thanks. but can you tell me if 1 cup bleach per 5 gallons water is ok? that's the ratio i found on wetwebmedia.com. thanks, valeen --- Karen <oilfield_brat@...> wrote: > Bleach is more for sanitizing and algae. Vinegar and lemon juice > work much better for cleaning mineral deposits. > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Paul N. Chung" <p_n_chung@y...> > wrote: > > Hey Valeen, > > > > Try using Lemon. They are quite effective in cleaning acrylic and > glass aquarium. > > > > Paulo > > > > > > Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@y...> wrote: > > hi everyone, > > > > can anyone tell me the bleach solution i should use to clean out > an acrylic tank? and can i use > > this same solution to clean aquarium gravel, too? > > > > thanks, > > valeen > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > > I love my 2 Ocellaris clownfish! > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks > > . > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not > important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original > message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > To visit your group on the web, go to: > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service. > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of True Percula clownfish!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12140	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: New to group

welcome to the group, jackie. i hope you enjoy yourself here. -valeen --- minnesotagal866 <minnesotagal866@...> wrote: > Hi all, > > My name is Jackie and I am a fish addict . . . > > Currently I have a 55 gallon freshwater set-up. It is a planted tank > with mostly red melon swords, a few other swords, java moss, and > java fern. I currently use normal aquarium lighting but hope to > upgrade. The moss and ferns grow on large pieces of driftwood. The > plants do ok, the red melon swords and java moss do the best in the > low light. In my tank I currently have 8 tiger barbs, 5 bleeding > heart tetras, 5 pristella tetras, 3 (I think, they hide) corys of > some sort, 1 blue gourami, 1 pleco, and 1 iridescant shark. I've had > the tank for over a year. I am a tiger barb lover and am thinking > about trying to breed them in the future, but for now I'm content to > watch them and enjoy how they follow me across the room (the > beggars)! > > I also have a 10 gallon that is heavily planted with about 3 gallons > of water in it. It contains 1 fire-belly toad, 2 fire-belly newts, > and a snail. It has better lighting and the plants grow faster. I > used to have white clouds in with them but the newts managed to eat > a couple of them so I moved them. > > I have a betta in a 1 gallon bowl that I plan to upgrade this winter > to a larger tank with a mini heater. There's also a red sword in > there that does remarkably well in the low light conditions. > > Finally, I have an outdoor water container garden (above ground) > that I keep about 10 white clouds and a few leftover zebra danios. > The garden has a water lily, an iris, and some forget-me-nots. I'm > hoping the white clouds will spawn and perhaps give the newts some > live food. This winter the whole container will come in the foyer. > No filtration, just the plants and regular water changes. > > My goal is to eventually get a 75 or better yet a 125 for the shark > when he becomes larger and design the tank around him. The 55 will > either house the remaining tropical fish or it may become a large > habitat for my newts, the toad, and some fish. > > I've read a bunch of back posts, lots of advice and interesting > reading material. My mantra in life as far as fish keeping > goes . . . you can't do too many water changes. I change at least 20 > gallons a week in my 55 gallon tank. Frequent regular large school > water changes will prevent a lot of headaches. > > Looking forward to reading everyone's posts .. . > > Jackie > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of True Percula clownfish!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12141	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies

cool, thanks. =Nick ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dan" <dcreator2k4@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, June 07, 2005 2:38 AM Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies > Parents rarely die after spawning, only if they get too torn up as a > result of aggressiveness along with some other infection of some > kind. If the parents are immediately quarantined into a seperate > tank with heated clean water and medicines, along with a good diet - > all should turn out ok. Something else will usually kill them off, > not the mating itself. > > Dan (thaSkorpeon) > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Nicolas Munro" <nmunro@q...> > wrote: >> Do the parents always die when they give birth to the babys? I > kinda >> remember some one else had some die for some reason. >> >> =Nick >> PS: If any one has any fish they want to get rid of in Brisbane > Queensland >> i'm interested. >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Nan" <ntalb00@y...> >> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> >> Sent: Monday, June 06, 2005 6:20 AM >> Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Betta babies >> >> >> > Hey, Nim! >> > >> > First off, an 8 gallon is far, far to small to house 2 female > and a male >> > betta. That is very cool that they spawned, and yes the fry are > more than >> > likely living off of the infusoria that is comeing from the > snails. >> > >> > Yes, do feed them the powdered fry food for livebearers, also, > you might >> > want to give them some decapped BBS eggs, or you can give them > frozen >> > Brine Shrimp, a very small amount. If you have any guppy fry > you can put >> > a couple in there to help teach your Betta fry to come to the > top for the >> > flake food. Makes the transition easier and they will get along. >> > >> > You still have several weeks (when they start fussing then > seperate them, >> > otherwise they are fine, really!) before you have to worry about > moving >> > them around. Actually, you might get lucky and they might be > all female >> > at which point you won't have to move them. A sure indicator of > having to >> > move them is when you catch them harrassing others of the same > species, >> > and that won't happen until you can see color on them and that > is usually >> > (in my expierence) at about 3 to 4 weeks old. >> > >> > And if you have a good filtration system going, no don't worry > about doing >> > a full water chance, maybe a partial in a couple of weeks (like > 10%, then >> > the next week about 20% after that).m If you don't have a good > filtration >> > system on there, then buy a sponge filter. It will work fine, > and keep >> > you from haveing to do a big water change. >> > >> > Hope this helps. >> > >> > Nan >> > >> > Nimish Mathur <nimmat4@y...> wrote: >> > Guys, >> > >> > About 3 weeks ago, I had a male betta and 2 females in a tank > with loads >> > of >> > hiding space and it was going fine and suddenly next day morning > all 3 >> > were >> > found dead :-s. >> > >> > >> > >> > Sad, but I fished them out but did not shut off the tank as I > did not >> > really >> > have time to do anything to it or even test why it happened. > Yesterday, >> > while watching TV, I noticed some movement in the tank. On close >> > inspection >> > I noticed a fry. I inspected in the morning as well and finally > counted 4 >> > fry. They are about 1cm long and seem to be feeding well on .. > Hmm. Don't >> > know exactly what. There is a flurry of Trumpet snails and > ramshorn in >> > there >> > and I think that is what kept the fry growing by creating > infusoria. >> > >> > >> > >> > My questions are: >> > >> > >> > >> > They are big enough to be able to take powdered fry food so when > is the >> > best >> > time to start? There seems to be enough microscopic food in the > tank. >> > >> > When will be a best time to separate them to prevent them from > fighting or >> > cannibalizing on each other? >> > >> > There are loads of plants in the tank and it is a 8 gallon tank. > Do I need >> > to change water? Or is there anything special to do? >> > >> > >> > >> > I believe that the time when they need baby brine shrimp has > passed as >> > these >> > are a bit bigger then newly born guppy fry. >> > >> > >> > >> > Thanks, >> > >> > Nim >> > >> > >> > >> > ~nan and crew~ >> > Rome, GA >> > http://www.geocities.com/ntalb00/index.htm (updated) >> > bettas and soon we add guppys! >> > >> > >> > --------------------------------- >> > Yahoo! Mail Mobile >> > Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone. >> > >> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks >> > . >> > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not > important to >> > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message > modify the >> > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we > Thank You >> > in Advance for your help in this matter >> > Yahoo! Groups Links >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12142	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: how can control the water temperature?

I used to live in Invercargill so i understand exactly your problem... Whilst I didn't keep fish when I lived down there I know that if you keep TROPICAL fish and use a standard fish water heater and set it to 25degC you should always have a stable water temperature and when the ambient weather temperature gets above 25degC (AS IF) you can rest assured that my fish survived a couple of days at 35 deg C which I bet your weather doesn't get that hot where you live. In summary if you want to keep TROPICAL's and can afford the power bill they will be easy to keep. On the other hand, Goldfish can survive in frozen ponds so long as you don't break the ice on top of the water when the pond freezes they will survive as well, just remember they live for over 100 years if you treat them right. So either keep your self and house cosy like Patrick and Paul said or get fish which can handle the temperature range. =Nick ----- Original Message ----- From: "thant zin" <thomath999@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Saturday, June 04, 2005 6:05 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] how can control the water temperature? > Hi, > I am Thomas from New Zealand and a new menber. I am familiar with the > fresh water aquarium fishes and i interest the marine aquarium fishes.So I > would like to get some web site name for getting aquarium knowledge. > > In here, Weather is too cold and sometime temperature rapidly changed. > And then I found that some aquarium shop controled water temperature by > room heater system.That is why if i use the thermostat, I can control the > water temperature or not. > Could you please give me some information for controlling water > temperature? > > Thanks, > > Thomas > > > > > --------------------------------- > Do you Yahoo!? > New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - 1GB free storage! > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12143	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies

Nim, Does you tank smell of plants? a while back when i had lots of Elodia my tank smelt bad. =Nick ----- Original Message ----- From: "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Monday, June 06, 2005 11:37 PM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Betta babies > Hi Nan, > > > > Thanks for the comments :-). The tank 8 gallon is actually a 15" cube with > loads of plant cover. Infact there are so many plants that you can barely > see a couple of inches inside the tank. I assume about 30 cabomba, 15-20 > hygrophylla polysperma, some floating crypts, 2 very large anubias, some > hydrocotyle and to top all off, plenty of clumps of java moss floating. > The > plants are right from the bottom to the top. I had no problems with the > females hiding from the males and none of them even had a single fin nip. > > > > I tried some powdered fry food but the tank itself is so large for 6 fry > that they probably never reached it. Uneaten food is not a problem as the > amount of snails in that tank is horrendous and there is nothing that will > ever go waste. I suppose around 300 Malaysian trumpet snails, similar > amount > of ramshorn and plenty of pest snails. I will try and see if I can get a > daphnia culture or be able to hatch some brine shrimps to help the fry but > my assumption is that everything will get lost in that tank and baby > brineshrimp may not survive long enough for the fry to be able to find > them. > > > > I have performed a 10% water change very carefully. The tank already has a > running filter. It is in internal small power filter that has always been > there and if the fry managed to evade it to this stage, I think they can > evade it further. It is however on the lowest possible setting. Good thing > is that the tank is fully cycled and with these many plants, there are > nominal chances of water quality going bad. > > > > Thanks, > > Nim > > > > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Nan > Sent: 05 June 2005 21:20 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Betta babies > > > > Hey, Nim! > > First off, an 8 gallon is far, far to small to house 2 female and a male > betta. That is very cool that they spawned, and yes the fry are more than > likely living off of the infusoria that is comeing from the snails. > > Yes, do feed them the powdered fry food for livebearers, also, you might > want to give them some decapped BBS eggs, or you can give them frozen > Brine > Shrimp, a very small amount. If you have any guppy fry you can put a > couple > in there to help teach your Betta fry to come to the top for the flake > food. > Makes the transition easier and they will get along. > > You still have several weeks (when they start fussing then seperate them, > otherwise they are fine, really!) before you have to worry about moving > them > around. Actually, you might get lucky and they might be all female at > which > point you won't have to move them. A sure indicator of having to move > them > is when you catch them harrassing others of the same species, and that > won't > happen until you can see color on them and that is usually (in my > expierence) at about 3 to 4 weeks old. > > And if you have a good filtration system going, no don't worry about doing > a > full water chance, maybe a partial in a couple of weeks (like 10%, then > the > next week about 20% after that).m If you don't have a good filtration > system on there, then buy a sponge filter. It will work fine, and keep > you > from haveing to do a big water change. > > Hope this helps. > > Nan > > Nimish Mathur <nimmat4@...> wrote: > Guys, > > About 3 weeks ago, I had a male betta and 2 females in a tank with loads > of > hiding space and it was going fine and suddenly next day morning all 3 > were > found dead :-s. > > > > Sad, but I fished them out but did not shut off the tank as I did not > really > have time to do anything to it or even test why it happened. Yesterday, > while watching TV, I noticed some movement in the tank. On close > inspection > I noticed a fry. I inspected in the morning as well and finally counted 4 > fry. They are about 1cm long and seem to be feeding well on .. Hmm. Don't > know exactly what. There is a flurry of Trumpet snails and ramshorn in > there > and I think that is what kept the fry growing by creating infusoria. > > > > My questions are: > > > > They are big enough to be able to take powdered fry food so when is the > best > time to start? There seems to be enough microscopic food in the tank. > > When will be a best time to separate them to prevent them from fighting or > cannibalizing on each other? > > There are loads of plants in the tank and it is a 8 gallon tank. Do I need > to change water? Or is there anything special to do? > > > > I believe that the time when they need baby brine shrimp has passed as > these > are a bit bigger then newly born guppy fry. > > > > Thanks, > > Nim > > > > ~nan and crew~ > Rome, GA > http://www.geocities.com/ntalb00/index.htm (updated) > bettas and soon we add guppys! > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Mail Mobile > Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > _____ > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > * To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12144	From: Karen	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Bleach Solution for Cleaning Tanks

I personally find that is way too much. It doesn't take much bleach to sanitize and I don't think it does much good for cleaning. I used 2 cups for 75 gallons and it came squeeky clean. Remember bleach leaves a film and has to be rinsed thoroughly. If you use that much, it will take forever to rid your tank of it. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@y...> wrote: > great, thanks. but can you tell me if 1 cup bleach per 5 gallons water is ok? that's the ratio i > found on wetwebmedia.com. > > thanks, > valeen > > --- Karen <oilfield_brat@y...> wrote: > > > Bleach is more for sanitizing and algae. Vinegar and lemon juice > > work much better for cleaning mineral deposits. > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Paul N. Chung" <p_n_chung@y...> > > wrote: > > > Hey Valeen, > > > > > > Try using Lemon. They are quite effective in cleaning acrylic and > > glass aquarium. > > > > > > Paulo > > > > > > > > > Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@y...> wrote: > > > hi everyone, > > > > > > can anyone tell me the bleach solution i should use to clean out > > an acrylic tank? and can i use > > > this same solution to clean aquarium gravel, too? > > > > > > thanks, > > > valeen > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > > > I love my 2 Ocellaris clownfish! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > > thanks > > > . > > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not > > important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original > > message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > > subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > To visit your group on the web, go to: > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > > Service. > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > > Do You Yahoo!? > > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > > > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > I love my mated pair of True Percula clownfish!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12145	From: Karen	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Help on stocking a set-up

What's your opinion? Currently have: 100 gal - stocked with Mbuna, 10 adults, 8 juvies (not keeping all the juvies) 55 gal - Vics, 4 Rock Kribs and 2 sp. 44 One N. livingstonii in a 15 gal holding tank till the new tank is set-up. She needs to be moved to a larger tank. New tank is a 75 gal. Possible reconfigurations: A.1) Move the Mbuna to the 75 gal 2) Move the Hap to the 100 gal and add more Haps/Peacocks. 3) Keep the Vics in the 55 gal. B. 1) Move the Vics to the 75 gal. 2) Move the lone Hap to the 55 and don't add more fish. Want to eventually get rid of the tank anyway. 3) Keep the Mbuna in the 100. C. 1) Keep the Mbuna in the 100 gal 2) Make the 75 a Hap/Peacock tank 3) Keep the 55 a Vic tank. Option A makes a lot of sense. The Haps need the larger tank. But it is also a lot of work to catch all those Mbuna to move them. Option C is the least amount of work. Option B allows more Vics to be added. I'm pretty attached to all of them including the livingstonii. But the 55 gal is an ugly tank and stand and the hubby wants it taken down eventually. What would you do and why?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12146	From: paul helms	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Bleach Solution for Cleaning Tanks

1 cap full per 5 gallons is plenty --- Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote: > great, thanks. but can you tell me if 1 cup bleach > per 5 gallons water is ok? that's the ratio i > found on wetwebmedia.com. > > thanks, > valeen > > --- Karen <oilfield_brat@...> wrote: > > > Bleach is more for sanitizing and algae. Vinegar > and lemon juice > > work much better for cleaning mineral deposits. > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Paul N. > Chung" <p_n_chung@y...> > > wrote: > > > Hey Valeen, > > > > > > Try using Lemon. They are quite effective in > cleaning acrylic and > > glass aquarium. > > > > > > Paulo > > > > > > > > > Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@y...> wrote: > > > hi everyone, > > > > > > can anyone tell me the bleach solution i should > use to clean out > > an acrylic tank? and can i use > > > this same solution to clean aquarium gravel, > too? > > > > > > thanks, > > > valeen > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > > > I love my 2 Ocellaris clownfish! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > when replying, > > thanks > > > . > > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all > text that is not > > important to the reply and if changing the topic > of the original > > message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new > subject (was re: old > > subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your > help in this matter > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > To visit your group on the web, go to: > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email > to: > > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > > Do You Yahoo!? > > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > protection around > > > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > I love my mated pair of True Percula clownfish! > > > > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12147	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Bleach Solution for Cleaning Tanks

just so i am clear (am going to clean the tank tonight) you meant 1 CAP, not 1 CUP, right? -v --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > 1 cap full per 5 gallons is plenty > > --- Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote: > > > great, thanks. but can you tell me if 1 cup bleach > > per 5 gallons water is ok? that's the ratio i > > found on wetwebmedia.com. > > > > thanks, > > valeen > > > > --- Karen <oilfield_brat@...> wrote: > > > > > Bleach is more for sanitizing and algae. Vinegar > > and lemon juice > > > work much better for cleaning mineral deposits. > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Paul N. > > Chung" <p_n_chung@y...> > > > wrote: > > > > Hey Valeen, > > > > > > > > Try using Lemon. They are quite effective in > > cleaning acrylic and > > > glass aquarium. > > > > > > > > Paulo > > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@y...> wrote: > > > > hi everyone, > > > > > > > > can anyone tell me the bleach solution i should > > use to clean out > > > an acrylic tank? and can i use > > > > this same solution to clean aquarium gravel, > > too? > > > > > > > > thanks, > > > > valeen > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > > > > I love my 2 Ocellaris clownfish! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > > when replying, > > > thanks > > > > . > > > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all > > text that is not > > > important to the reply and if changing the topic > > of the original > > > message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new > > subject (was re: old > > > subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your > > help in this matter > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > To visit your group on the web, go to: > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > > > > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email > > to: > > > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > > Yahoo! Terms of > > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > > > Do You Yahoo!? > > > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > > protection around > > > > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > > I love my mated pair of True Percula clownfish! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > Discover Yahoo! > Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online and more. Check it out! > http://discover.yahoo.com/ > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of True Percula clownfish!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12148	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: It Looks Like Common Plecos to Me . . .

Here is something from the BBC. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/asia-pacific/4613985.stm \\Steve// Smith & Wesson, The Original Point And Click Interface

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12149	From: paul helms	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: It Looks Like Common Plecos to Me . . .

that is hillarious --- Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > Here is something from the BBC. > > http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/asia-pacific/4613985.stm > > \\Steve// > Smith & Wesson, The Original Point And Click > Interface > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Stay in touch with email, IM, photo sharing and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/stayintouch.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12150	From: paul helms	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Bleach Solution for Cleaning Tanks

yup...that is enough to kill anything in the tank. that is actually more than we are allowed to use in our sanitizing solution in the food industry. we use less thana cap ina 20 gallon sink! beyond that and it is not safe for humans, and will potentially begin to decay plastics and silicones. --- Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote: > just so i am clear (am going to clean the tank > tonight) you meant 1 CAP, not 1 CUP, right? > > -v > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > 1 cap full per 5 gallons is plenty > > > > --- Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> > wrote: > > > > > great, thanks. but can you tell me if 1 cup > bleach > > > per 5 gallons water is ok? that's the ratio i > > > found on wetwebmedia.com. > > > > > > thanks, > > > valeen > > > > > > --- Karen <oilfield_brat@...> wrote: > > > > > > > Bleach is more for sanitizing and algae. > Vinegar > > > and lemon juice > > > > work much better for cleaning mineral > deposits. > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Paul N. > > > Chung" <p_n_chung@y...> > > > > wrote: > > > > > Hey Valeen, > > > > > > > > > > Try using Lemon. They are quite effective in > > > cleaning acrylic and > > > > glass aquarium. > > > > > > > > > > Paulo > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@y...> > wrote: > > > > > hi everyone, > > > > > > > > > > can anyone tell me the bleach solution i > should > > > use to clean out > > > > an acrylic tank? and can i use > > > > > this same solution to clean aquarium gravel, > > > too? > > > > > > > > > > thanks, > > > > > valeen > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > > > > > I love my 2 Ocellaris clownfish! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below > it > > > when replying, > > > > thanks > > > > > . > > > > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all > > > text that is not > > > > important to the reply and if changing the > topic > > > of the original > > > > message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new > > > subject (was re: old > > > > subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for > your > > > help in this matter > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > To visit your group on the web, go to: > > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > > > > > > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an > email > > > to: > > > > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > > > > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to > the > > > Yahoo! Terms of > > > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > > > > Do You Yahoo!? > > > > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best > spam > > > protection around > > > > > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > > > I love my mated pair of True Percula clownfish! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > > Discover Yahoo! > > Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online and > more. Check it out! > > http://discover.yahoo.com/ > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > I love my mated pair of True Percula clownfish! > > > > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Stay in touch with email, IM, photo sharing and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/stayintouch.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12151	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: macs and fish

Sounds like a good use for a Mac <G>. I don't have any experience, but here is a link that may prove useful to you: http://www.theapplecollection.com/Collection/MacAquarium/ \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of kb1dva Sent: Monday, June 06, 2005 2:34 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] macs and fish I heard that old macs make great fish tanks does anyone have any experience in this? ----- Emily

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12152	From: wantvws	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Amiracle filter parts

Hi...I need a source for filter floss for my Amiracle filter set-up. Not sure of the model number, but it's about 8-10 years old and for a 210 gallon aquarium. Any ideas? Thanks! Robbie

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12153	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: It Looks Like Common Plecos to Me . . .

So plecos aren't legal in Australia? -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of paul helms Sent: Monday, June 06, 2005 8:11 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] It Looks Like Common Plecos to Me . . . that is hillarious --- Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > Here is something from the BBC. > > http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/asia-pacific/4613985.stm > > \\Steve// > Smith & Wesson, The Original Point And Click > Interface > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Stay in touch with email, IM, photo sharing and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/stayintouch.html Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12154	From: Patrick	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: [spam] RE: [AquaticLife] It Looks Like Common Plecos to Me . . .

As far as I know, it is illegal to carry fish as carry-on luggage anywhere, especially if they aren't declared to customs. The issue isn't just the possibility of introducing a new species, it is also the moving of any live animal or plant, fruit, or vegetable across international borders that is illegal. There is also the possiblity of bugs or diseases being introduced with them. If the woman had done this in the US, DHS would have showed up to make sure she wasn't a terrorist. Plus, the word smuggle was used. She was trying to smuggle plecos in without paying the proper importation fees. Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill -------Original Message------- So plecos aren't legal in Australia? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12155	From: paul helms	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Amiracle filter parts

walmart....pillow stuffing material about 2 bucks a bag --- wantvws <rml1963@...> wrote: > Hi...I need a source for filter floss for my > Amiracle filter set-up. > Not sure of the model number, but it's about 8-10 > years old and for a > 210 gallon aquarium. > Any ideas? > Thanks! > Robbie > > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12156	From: wantvws	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Amiracle filter parts

Maybe I used the wrong term....this stuff is kind of a plastic woven wire type stuff, and it's wrapped in a big coil....The Amiracle site listed "Bio-Balls"...can I use them as a replacement? If the pillow stuffing will work, then I'm all for it! Thanks! Robbie

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12157	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Its war in there!

Ehhh!!! For some reason all my fish have decided to attack and fight with each other. Tiger Barbs vs Sword Tails vs Pregnant Guppies vs the poor little CoryDory. Can any one help me narrow it down, ive done the following things over the weekend: Removed FinRot treatment chemicals with a 90% water change. In the process of refilling I broke my heater (300w) by pooring cold water onto it when it was hot (unfortunatly i didn't realise it was still pluged in on a different circuit). Replaced the Heater with a 400w heater which is now keeping the tank at 26degC compaired to the other heater keeping it at 23degC. Rearranged the rock layout so there are more caves for the fish to hide in. Brought and using some new fish food to replace what i was using before. Wardly Totally Tropical i think, flakes. Normally i used some supermarket fish flakes and some Wardley Cichlid Floating Crumbles, both of which Ive run out of. ??? Take cover! =Nick [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12158	From: Deirdre Marr	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Ich After Water Change? Help!

Hello, I am new to the list. My husband and I have 3 tanks which I am very good about doing paritial water changes/gravel vacuuming in. My problem is with my Husband's 24 gal freswater Nanocube. Everytime I do a small water change (1/3-1/4 once every week to 10 days) half of the fish get Ick. I am very careful to match water temps. from my tap water to the aquarium and I add a water conditioner to the tap water. When I do water changes in my Ciclid tank I don't have this problem. My Husband as a pair of Pearl Lyretail Molleys, a pair of Red Velvet Swordtails, 2 Long Finned Rosy Barbs, a couple of small bottom feeders (sorry, I don't know what they are!), a very small Bala Shark and a very small Rainbow Shark, a small red striped Gourami and a large Gold snail. The tank is planted w/ real plants that are thriving. Please help, I hate doing water changes now because I hate seeing the fish get sick! Thank you, Deirdre Marr Dallas, TX

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12159	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: It Looks Like Common Plecos to Me . . .

Actually, Australia has some of the strictest import/export regulations in the world regarding plants and livestock. Pretty much nothing comes in and nothing goes out kind of rules. I'm sure that one of our Australian members can fill us in about the exact regulations regarding importation and exportation of fish far better than I can, as I have never had to deal with them. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Patrick Sent: Monday, June 06, 2005 9:55 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [spam] RE: [AquaticLife] It Looks Like Common Plecos to Me . . . As far as I know, it is illegal to carry fish as carry-on luggage anywhere, especially if they aren't declared to customs. The issue isn't just the possibility of introducing a new species, it is also the moving of any live animal or plant, fruit, or vegetable across international borders that is illegal. There is also the possiblity of bugs or diseases being introduced with them. If the woman had done this in the US, DHS would have showed up to make sure she wasn't a terrorist. Plus, the word smuggle was used. She was trying to smuggle plecos in without paying the proper importation fees. Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill -------Original Message------- So plecos aren't legal in Australia?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12160	From: Amalthea	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: macs and fish

There's a website dedicated specifically to selling them. Here's links to instructions for building them though: http://lowendmac.com/compact/macquarium.shtml amalthea Get em' while they're cheap! Lip Service, Serious, Goth, Punk, Rockabilly and More are all in the Basement.... http://stores.ebay.com/Amaltheas-Basement-Bargain-Shop On Jun 6, 2005, at 2:34 PM, kb1dva wrote: > I heard that old macs make great fish tanks does anyone have any > experience > in this? ----- Emily > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not > important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original > message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12161	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Its war in there!

Nick, 400W heater? What size tank do you have? Generally, you want to size the heater so you have 2-5 Watts per gallon, depending on how much you need to raise the water above the ambient temperature. Right now, your tank is a bit on the warm side for the fish you list, Turn down the thermostat a bit. You'll be looking to get a range of 24-25^o C. for your fish. Not much cooler, but enough to slow the fish down a bit. If you do have the need for larger heaters, then it is normally prudent to buy two heaters, each of half the wattage you need for the tank. This will serve to save you from coming home one day to bouillabaisse should one get out of line and stay on continuously. The other will not come on, unless it is needed to bring the tank up to the set temperature, and one alone will not be enough to overheat the tank. You don't mention how many fish you have of each species, but I'd guess you only have one cory. You should have at least 5 tiger barbs to cut down on aggression of the barbs to other fish. Moving the décor of the tank around is probably your biggest contributor to the current aggression you are seeing. Everyone's territory is gone, and they are in the process of establishing new territories. Once this has been done, the aggression will die back to its former level. In the grouping of fish you have, the massive water change probably has done little to add to the aggression, but it may prompt the barbs into spawning behavior, which will make them more active, but not necessarily more aggressive. A change in the diet should not prompt any kind of aggressive behavior with your fish. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nicolas Munro Sent: Monday, June 06, 2005 10:21 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Its war in there! Ehhh!!! For some reason all my fish have decided to attack and fight with each other. Tiger Barbs vs Sword Tails vs Pregnant Guppies vs the poor little CoryDory. Can any one help me narrow it down, ive done the following things over the weekend: Removed FinRot treatment chemicals with a 90% water change. In the process of refilling I broke my heater (300w) by pooring cold water onto it when it was hot (unfortunatly i didn't realise it was still pluged in on a different circuit). Replaced the Heater with a 400w heater which is now keeping the tank at 26degC compaired to the other heater keeping it at 23degC. Rearranged the rock layout so there are more caves for the fish to hide in. Brought and using some new fish food to replace what i was using before. Wardly Totally Tropical i think, flakes. Normally i used some supermarket fish flakes and some Wardley Cichlid Floating Crumbles, both of which Ive run out of. ??? Take cover! =Nick

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12162	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Its war in there!

I'd like to see more opinions on this subject. My two Blood Parrots are still at it but it's now the smaller one that is the instigator. I've separated the large BP with a screen and yet the small one tries to attack him through it. I wake up to find that the small has dug a hole nearly large enough for one of them to slip under. I then scoot the gravel back into place as they each BITE at me like crazy. And for those that think Blood Parrots can't close their mouths...HA! Lol And it HURTS! I too rearranged territory but only after the aggression became horrible. It did nothing either way. (I made more spaces, no difference. I made less spaces, no difference. I took all the spaces out completely, no difference.) Grrr. Any ideas? -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: Monday, June 06, 2005 10:17 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Its war in there! Nick, 400W heater? What size tank do you have? Generally, you want to size the heater so you have 2-5 Watts per gallon, depending on how much you need to raise the water above the ambient temperature. Right now, your tank is a bit on the warm side for the fish you list, Turn down the thermostat a bit. You'll be looking to get a range of 24-25^o C. for your fish. Not much cooler, but enough to slow the fish down a bit. If you do have the need for larger heaters, then it is normally prudent to buy two heaters, each of half the wattage you need for the tank. This will serve to save you from coming home one day to bouillabaisse should one get out of line and stay on continuously. The other will not come on, unless it is needed to bring the tank up to the set temperature, and one alone will not be enough to overheat the tank. You don't mention how many fish you have of each species, but I'd guess you only have one cory. You should have at least 5 tiger barbs to cut down on aggression of the barbs to other fish. Moving the décor of the tank around is probably your biggest contributor to the current aggression you are seeing. Everyone's territory is gone, and they are in the process of establishing new territories. Once this has been done, the aggression will die back to its former level. In the grouping of fish you have, the massive water change probably has done little to add to the aggression, but it may prompt the barbs into spawning behavior, which will make them more active, but not necessarily more aggressive. A change in the diet should not prompt any kind of aggressive behavior with your fish.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12163	From: harry perry	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: It Looks Like Common Plecos to Me . . .

Years ago I exported business forms to Australia. If the shipment contained wood(i.e. skids) the shipment had to be smoke bombed and certified. The container was opened and smoke bombs thrown in and sealed for 24 hours. I was told it was to protect there beef industry. Beef being their largest export. Harry Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: Actually, Australia has some of the strictest import/export regulations in the world regarding plants and livestock. Pretty much nothing comes in and nothing goes out kind of rules. I'm sure that one of our Australian members can fill us in about the exact regulations regarding importation and exportation of fish far better than I can, as I have never had to deal with them. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Patrick Sent: Monday, June 06, 2005 9:55 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [spam] RE: [AquaticLife] It Looks Like Common Plecos to Me . . . As far as I know, it is illegal to carry fish as carry-on luggage anywhere, especially if they aren't declared to customs. The issue isn't just the possibility of introducing a new species, it is also the moving of any live animal or plant, fruit, or vegetable across international borders that is illegal. There is also the possiblity of bugs or diseases being introduced with them. If the woman had done this in the US, DHS would have showed up to make sure she wasn't a terrorist. Plus, the word smuggle was used. She was trying to smuggle plecos in without paying the proper importation fees. Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill -------Original Message------- So plecos aren't legal in Australia? Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter --------------------------------- Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- Discover Yahoo! Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news & more. Check it out! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12164	From: harry perry	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Its war in there!/A solution

Grilled blood parrot. Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote:I'd like to see more opinions on this subject. My two Blood Parrots are still at it but it's now the smaller one that is the instigator. I've separated the large BP with a screen and yet the small one tries to attack him through it. I wake up to find that the small has dug a hole nearly large enough for one of them to slip under. I then scoot the gravel back into place as they each BITE at me like crazy. And for those that think Blood Parrots can't close their mouths...HA! Lol And it HURTS! I too rearranged territory but only after the aggression became horrible. It did nothing either way. (I made more spaces, no difference. I made less spaces, no difference. I took all the spaces out completely, no difference.) Grrr. Any ideas? -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: Monday, June 06, 2005 10:17 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Its war in there! Nick, 400W heater? What size tank do you have? Generally, you want to size the heater so you have 2-5 Watts per gallon, depending on how much you need to raise the water above the ambient temperature. Right now, your tank is a bit on the warm side for the fish you list, Turn down the thermostat a bit. You'll be looking to get a range of 24-25^o C. for your fish. Not much cooler, but enough to slow the fish down a bit. If you do have the need for larger heaters, then it is normally prudent to buy two heaters, each of half the wattage you need for the tank. This will serve to save you from coming home one day to bouillabaisse should one get out of line and stay on continuously. The other will not come on, unless it is needed to bring the tank up to the set temperature, and one alone will not be enough to overheat the tank. You don't mention how many fish you have of each species, but I'd guess you only have one cory. You should have at least 5 tiger barbs to cut down on aggression of the barbs to other fish. Moving the décor of the tank around is probably your biggest contributor to the current aggression you are seeing. Everyone's territory is gone, and they are in the process of establishing new territories. Once this has been done, the aggression will die back to its former level. In the grouping of fish you have, the massive water change probably has done little to add to the aggression, but it may prompt the barbs into spawning behavior, which will make them more active, but not necessarily more aggressive. A change in the diet should not prompt any kind of aggressive behavior with your fish. Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter --------------------------------- Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12165	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Its war in there!

In a message dated 6/6/2005 11:32:08 PM Eastern Standard Time, amjmail@... writes: Any ideas? Sushi? Vicky Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Or write: hgparker@... =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact Dr Breen @ 919-513-1467 _and_ Dr London @ calondon@... 530-754-5711 They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... *Use this sig! Help the scientists help us!* [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12166	From: harry perry	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: [spam] RE: [AquaticLife] It Looks Like Common Plecos to Me /Be

So..... the woman had bugs or a disease and she tried to smuggle in a terrorist pleco. What an imagination you have. Harry Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: As far as I know, it is illegal to carry fish as carry-on luggage anywhere, especially if they aren't declared to customs. The issue isn't just the possibility of introducing a new species, it is also the moving of any live animal or plant, fruit, or vegetable across international borders that is illegal. There is also the possiblity of bugs or diseases being introduced with them. If the woman had done this in the US, DHS would have showed up to make sure she wasn't a terrorist. Plus, the word smuggle was used. She was trying to smuggle plecos in without paying the proper importation fees. Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill -------Original Message------- So plecos aren't legal in Australia? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter --------------------------------- Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- Discover Yahoo! Have fun online with music videos, cool games, IM & more. Check it out! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12167	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Its war in there!

Dane & Leslie, You are looking at a different type of aggression than Nick is. For the most part, cichlids are aggressive fish. The level of aggression differs between species and sexes as well as the phase of life they are in, i.e., breeding, husbandry, etc. Some are mainly aggressive toward conspecifics (others of the same species) while leaving other species alone, others are aggressive to anything that moves, and still others are aggressive only to others of different species. Off the top of my head, I cannot recall what species were claimed to be used to create the parrot cichlid, but you are likely to see the aggressive traits of each of these species expressed to some extent in the hybrid fish. Research on these fish will give you an indication of what you may expect in behavior. While it has been said that these fish cannot breed, they are sterile, I have heard of reports of them breeding. The reason I bring this up is that what you are experiencing with the one digging under the divider is similar to behavior I have read about with certain cichlids in a similar situation, when they were ready to breed. This would also explain why changing the décor did not resolve the issue between the fish. One may be ready to breed, and the other not. Needless to say, you have already learned that you should extent the tank divider as deep into the substrate as you can, ideally to the tank floor. Another possibility is that the tank is simply too small for each fish to establish its own territory. The only solutions to this are to increase the size of the tank (What, never heard of the Tank-O-Matic Tank Expander?), or to remove one of the fish from the environment by moving it to another tank, or else disposing of it by sale or donation to someone else. Also, the smaller fish, in this case, could just simply be too ornery for his own good. Removal of this fish would then be indicated. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Dane & Leslie Moore Sent: Monday, June 06, 2005 11:29 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Its war in there! I'd like to see more opinions on this subject. My two Blood Parrots are still at it but it's now the smaller one that is the instigator. I've separated the large BP with a screen and yet the small one tries to attack him through it. I wake up to find that the small has dug a hole nearly large enough for one of them to slip under. I then scoot the gravel back into place as they each BITE at me like crazy. And for those that think Blood Parrots can't close their mouths...HA! Lol And it HURTS! I too rearranged territory but only after the aggression became horrible. It did nothing either way. (I made more spaces, no difference. I made less spaces, no difference. I took all the spaces out completely, no difference.) Grrr. Any ideas? -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: Monday, June 06, 2005 10:17 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Its war in there! Nick, 400W heater? What size tank do you have? Generally, you want to size the heater so you have 2-5 Watts per gallon, depending on how much you need to raise the water above the ambient temperature. Right now, your tank is a bit on the warm side for the fish you list, Turn down the thermostat a bit. You'll be looking to get a range of 24-25^o C. for your fish. Not much cooler, but enough to slow the fish down a bit. If you do have the need for larger heaters, then it is normally prudent to buy two heaters, each of half the wattage you need for the tank. This will serve to save you from coming home one day to bouillabaisse should one get out of line and stay on continuously. The other will not come on, unless it is needed to bring the tank up to the set temperature, and one alone will not be enough to overheat the tank. You don't mention how many fish you have of each species, but I'd guess you only have one cory. You should have at least 5 tiger barbs to cut down on aggression of the barbs to other fish. Moving the décor of the tank around is probably your biggest contributor to the current aggression you are seeing. Everyone's territory is gone, and they are in the process of establishing new territories. Once this has been done, the aggression will die back to its former level. In the grouping of fish you have, the massive water change probably has done little to add to the aggression, but it may prompt the barbs into spawning behavior, which will make them more active, but not necessarily more aggressive. A change in the diet should not prompt any kind of aggressive behavior with your fish.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12168	From: paul helms	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Its war in there!

throw in something bigger and more aggressive --- Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: > I'd like to see more opinions on this subject. My > two Blood Parrots are > still at it but it's now the smaller one that is the > instigator. I've > separated the large BP with a screen and yet the > small one tries to > attack him through it. I wake up to find that the > small has dug a hole > nearly large enough for one of them to slip under. > I then scoot the > gravel back into place as they each BITE at me like > crazy. > And for those that think Blood Parrots can't close > their mouths...HA! > Lol And it HURTS! > > I too rearranged territory but only after the > aggression became > horrible. It did nothing either way. (I made more > spaces, no > difference. I made less spaces, no difference. I > took all the spaces > out completely, no difference.) Grrr. > > Any ideas? > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Steve Szabo > Sent: Monday, June 06, 2005 10:17 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Its war in there! > > > Nick, > > 400W heater? What size tank do you have? > > Generally, you want to size the heater so you have > 2-5 Watts per gallon, > depending on how much you need to raise the water > above the ambient > temperature. Right now, your tank is a bit on the > warm side for the fish > you list, Turn down the thermostat a bit. You'll be > looking to get a > range of 24-25^o C. for your fish. Not much cooler, > but enough to slow > the fish down a bit. If you do have the need for > larger heaters, then it > is normally prudent to buy two heaters, each of half > the wattage you > need for the tank. This will serve to save you from > coming home one day > to bouillabaisse should one get out of line and stay > on continuously. > The other will not come on, unless it is needed to > bring the tank up to > the set temperature, and one alone will not be > enough to overheat the > tank. > > You don't mention how many fish you have of each > species, but I'd guess > you only have one cory. You should have at least 5 > tiger barbs to cut > down on aggression of the barbs to other fish. > > Moving the décor of the tank around is probably your > biggest contributor > to the current aggression you are seeing. Everyone's > territory is gone, > and they are in the process of establishing new > territories. Once this > has been done, the aggression will die back to its > former level. > > In the grouping of fish you have, the massive water > change probably has > done little to add to the aggression, but it may > prompt the barbs into > spawning behavior, which will make them more active, > but not necessarily > more aggressive. > > A change in the diet should not prompt any kind of > aggressive behavior > with your fish. > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Have fun online with music videos, cool games, IM and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/online.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12169	From: paul helms	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Its war in there!

well tiger barbs don't really belong with long finned fish, and sword tails can get pretty aggressive, and so can guppies when in competition. swords, guppies, platties, mollies, mosquito fish can all interbreed --- Nicolas Munro <nmunro@...> wrote: > Ehhh!!! > > For some reason all my fish have decided to attack > and fight with each other. Tiger Barbs vs Sword > Tails vs Pregnant Guppies vs the poor little > CoryDory. > > > > Can any one help me narrow it down, ive done the > following things over the weekend: > > Removed FinRot treatment chemicals with a 90% water > change. > > In the process of refilling I broke my heater (300w) > by pooring cold water onto it when it was hot > (unfortunatly i didn't realise it was still pluged > in on a different circuit). > > Replaced the Heater with a 400w heater which is now > keeping the tank at 26degC compaired to the other > heater keeping it at 23degC. > > Rearranged the rock layout so there are more caves > for the fish to hide in. > > Brought and using some new fish food to replace what > i was using before. Wardly Totally Tropical i think, > flakes. Normally i used some supermarket fish > flakes and some Wardley Cichlid Floating Crumbles, > both of which Ive run out of. > > > > ??? > Take cover! > =Nick > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Stay in touch with email, IM, photo sharing and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/stayintouch.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12170	From: paul helms	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Amiracle filter parts

the polyester fibers are the same as filter floss basically. many people use it --- wantvws <rml1963@...> wrote: > Maybe I used the wrong term....this stuff is kind of > a plastic woven > wire type stuff, and it's wrapped in a big > coil....The Amiracle site > listed "Bio-Balls"...can I use them as a > replacement? If the pillow > stuffing will work, then I'm all for it! > Thanks! > Robbie > > > > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/mobile.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12171	From: paul helms	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Ich After Water Change? Help!

sounds like teh tank is not stable yet, and should be left to cycle. you do not need to change wter weekly. if you are doing that much weekly, you are desimating your bacterial supply. i know it is not quite equal to 100%, but you are eefectively changing out 75% of your tank monthly. cut back to 5-10% weekly for a while, then ween back slowly to biweekly small changes. --- Deirdre Marr <dastx@...> wrote: > Hello, > > I am new to the list. My husband and I have 3 tanks > which I am very good about doing > paritial water changes/gravel vacuuming in. > > My problem is with my Husband's 24 gal freswater > Nanocube. Everytime I do a small > water change (1/3-1/4 once every week to 10 days) > half of the fish get Ick. I am very > careful to match water temps. from my tap water to > the aquarium and I add a water > conditioner to the tap water. > > When I do water changes in my Ciclid tank I don't > have this problem. > > My Husband as a pair of Pearl Lyretail Molleys, a > pair of Red Velvet Swordtails, 2 Long > Finned Rosy Barbs, a couple of small bottom feeders > (sorry, I don't know what they are!), a > very small Bala Shark and a very small Rainbow > Shark, a small red striped Gourami and a > large Gold snail. The tank is planted w/ real > plants that are thriving. > > Please help, I hate doing water changes now because > I hate seeing the fish get sick! > > Thank you, > > Deirdre Marr > Dallas, TX > > > > > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Stay in touch with email, IM, photo sharing and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/stayintouch.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12172	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Its war in there!

Cool, brought some mollies for the swords to interbread with a couple of weeks back, so heres hopping! =Nick ----- Original Message ----- From: "paul helms" <wtfmorlok@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, June 07, 2005 3:07 PM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Its war in there! > well tiger barbs don't really belong with long finned > fish, and sword tails can get pretty aggressive, and > so can guppies when in competition. swords, guppies, > platties, mollies, mosquito fish can all interbreed > > --- Nicolas Munro <nmunro@...> wrote: > >> Ehhh!!! >> >> For some reason all my fish have decided to attack >> and fight with each other. Tiger Barbs vs Sword >> Tails vs Pregnant Guppies vs the poor little >> CoryDory. >> >> >> >> Can any one help me narrow it down, ive done the >> following things over the weekend: >> >> Removed FinRot treatment chemicals with a 90% water >> change. >> >> In the process of refilling I broke my heater (300w) >> by pooring cold water onto it when it was hot >> (unfortunatly i didn't realise it was still pluged >> in on a different circuit). >> >> Replaced the Heater with a 400w heater which is now >> keeping the tank at 26degC compaired to the other >> heater keeping it at 23degC. >> >> Rearranged the rock layout so there are more caves >> for the fish to hide in. >> >> Brought and using some new fish food to replace what >> i was using before. Wardly Totally Tropical i think, >> flakes. Normally i used some supermarket fish >> flakes and some Wardley Cichlid Floating Crumbles, >> both of which Ive run out of. >> >> >> >> ??? >> Take cover! >> =Nick >> >> >> >> [Non-text portions of this message have been >> removed] >> >> > > > > > __________________________________ > Discover Yahoo! > Stay in touch with email, IM, photo sharing and more. Check it out! > http://discover.yahoo.com/stayintouch.html > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12173	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/6/2005
Subject: Re: Its war in there!

Yea i know but the heater was $4 more than a 150w heater which i was planning to get 2 of. so $70x$70 = $140ish vs $74 I was kinda relucktant but the sales people talked me into it as it uses a mesh instead of wires for the heating and is supposed to be better quality than the ones I was going to buy which where the same brand as the one which broke. My original thoughts were - it could have been the change of food maybe? =Nick Oh, well i'll let the fish sort it out between themselves then aye? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steve Szabo" <steve@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, June 07, 2005 1:16 PM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Its war in there! > Nick, > > 400W heater? What size tank do you have? > > Generally, you want to size the heater so you have 2-5 Watts per gallon, > depending on how much you need to raise the water above the ambient > temperature. Right now, your tank is a bit on the warm side for the fish > you > list, Turn down the thermostat a bit. You'll be looking to get a range of > 24-25^o C. for your fish. Not much cooler, but enough to slow the fish > down > a bit. If you do have the need for larger heaters, then it is normally > prudent to buy two heaters, each of half the wattage you need for the > tank. > This will serve to save you from coming home one day to bouillabaisse > should > one get out of line and stay on continuously. The other will not come on, > unless it is needed to bring the tank up to the set temperature, and one > alone will not be enough to overheat the tank. > > You don't mention how many fish you have of each species, but I'd guess > you > only have one cory. You should have at least 5 tiger barbs to cut down on > aggression of the barbs to other fish. > > Moving the décor of the tank around is probably your biggest contributor > to > the current aggression you are seeing. Everyone's territory is gone, and > they are in the process of establishing new territories. Once this has > been > done, the aggression will die back to its former level. > > In the grouping of fish you have, the massive water change probably has > done > little to add to the aggression, but it may prompt the barbs into spawning > behavior, which will make them more active, but not necessarily more > aggressive. > > A change in the diet should not prompt any kind of aggressive behavior > with > your fish. > > \\Steve// > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Nicolas Munro > Sent: Monday, June 06, 2005 10:21 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Its war in there! > > Ehhh!!! > > For some reason all my fish have decided to attack and fight with each > other. Tiger Barbs vs Sword Tails vs Pregnant Guppies vs the poor little > CoryDory. > > > > Can any one help me narrow it down, ive done the following things over the > weekend: > > Removed FinRot treatment chemicals with a 90% water change. > > In the process of refilling I broke my heater (300w) by pooring cold water > onto it when it was hot (unfortunatly i didn't realise it was still pluged > in on a different circuit). > > Replaced the Heater with a 400w heater which is now keeping the tank at > 26degC compaired to the other heater keeping it at 23degC. > > Rearranged the rock layout so there are more caves for the fish to hide > in. > > Brought and using some new fish food to replace what i was using before. > Wardly Totally Tropical i think, flakes. Normally i used some supermarket > fish flakes and some Wardley Cichlid Floating Crumbles, both of which Ive > run out of. > > > > ??? > Take cover! > =Nick > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12174	From: minnesotagal866	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: mystery fish

I have a container water garden that is about 35 gallons. On Memorial Day I put 3 zebra danios and 4 white cloud minnows in it. That was 9 days ago. Sunday I added 6 more minnows. I now have several little grayish black with light bellied fish swimming around. They are about 1/2 inch long and they came up to eat fish food last night. They are fast swimmers and dart around the container. Does anyone know what they are? Could the danios have spawned and would this be what their fry look like? Or did one of the plants come with eggs or small fry that I didn't see (I didn't check that closely). Or could they be tadpoles that some enterprising frog delivered to my container? I just netted one quickly, it jumped out of my net and back into the container, but I didn't see a neon stripe on it, more of a lightening of the color from top to belly. Any ideas? Jackie

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12175	From: hnorton1cogeco.ca	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Common Plecos /Heather Norton

It is very interesting about this breed shown (Common Plecos) in the news clip .I was told by my dealer that when they are small they are peaceful but they grow very large and they will eat anything they can get into their mouths . Heather Norton Original Message Smith & Wesson, The Original Point And Click Interface Here is something from the BBC. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/asia-pacific/4613985.stm [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12176	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: critters

What do you mean by "take care of spiders"? They were living inside the tank under the lid?? I sometimes find small (semi-aquatic?) spiders in my pond tank. Why not just leave them? Spiders are beneficial anyway, and if they fall in they'll get eaten and the fish would welcome the treat. I can't imagine any reason the spiders would be dangerous to the fish, unless they somehow came in contact with a pesticide. emily The Dragon Hunter <dragon.hunter@...> wrote: I have a quick question for yall. This hasn't happened before, but twice I've had to take care of spiders in my larger tank. I was just thinking, rather than squiching them and wiping up the remains, would it be a "treat" to feed the next spider to the fish? We're not talking widows, these have just been normal brown spiders. Would the fish even care or could the spider hurt the fish? Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12177	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: critters

no, these aren't the semi-aquatic type. These are normal brown spiders. common in the summer time. We'll get the occasional baby spider , but if you don't get them, they can get to around 2 inches across. wouldn't have bothered me too much except that they made their web under the hinged lid forcing you to knock down a web just to feed the fish. But per other resplies, will let them face the wrath of the gouramis and rainbows. muahahahahahaha ----- Original Message ----- From: "Emily Tenczar" <bababanana@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, June 07, 2005 7:42 AM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] critters > What do you mean by "take care of spiders"? > > They were living inside the tank under the lid?? > > I sometimes find small (semi-aquatic?) spiders in my pond tank. Why not just leave them? Spiders are beneficial anyway, and if they fall in they'll get eaten and the fish would welcome the treat. I can't imagine any reason the spiders would be dangerous to the fish, unless they somehow came in contact with a pesticide. > emily > > The Dragon Hunter <dragon.hunter@...> wrote: > I have a quick question for yall. This hasn't happened before, but twice > I've had to take care of spiders in my larger tank. I was just thinking, > rather than squiching them and wiping up the remains, would it be a "treat" > to feed the next spider to the fish? We're not talking widows, these have > just been normal brown spiders. Would the fish even care or could the > spider hurt the fish? > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12178	From: kb1dva	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Oscar bites

My friend was feeding the fish stopped and had her hand above the tank, and one of my Oscars bit her! Is that common Oscar behavior or was it an accident. She said she could feel the mouth close around her hand but no teeth. BTW thanks for the macquarium info, I think their cool maybe ill build one when things get dull around here. Eventually I need a new filter for my 90 gallon tank, what is the biggest bang for your buck, and what type is the easiest to maintain. Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12179	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: filter debate

We are all moved into our new house! I have all my aquarium supplies except the tank, stand and the filters. I was planning on using two emperor 400's, but in doing more research, they are only recommended up to 70 gallons. Two emperors would only get me 140 gallons and my tank is 150. The people at the store highly recommended an Ehiem. I would be going with a 2028 model and adding an emperor 400 on top of the Ehiem. Does anyone have any experience with the Ehiem filters? Are they worth the extra money? I used to have a 350 magnum and I absolutely hated cleaning the damn thing. I had a chance to take apart and assemble one of the Ehiems and it seemed pretty simple. The parts seemed more sturdy than the parts on the magnum. Any input would greatly be appreciated. Thanks, Linda River Falls, WI [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12180	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: Its war in there!

do you have another tank you can move 1 of them into? if not, i think it may be time to sell or exchange 1 of the fish if possible. --- Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: > I'd like to see more opinions on this subject. My two Blood Parrots are > still at it but it's now the smaller one that is the instigator. I've > separated the large BP with a screen and yet the small one tries to > attack him through it. I wake up to find that the small has dug a hole > nearly large enough for one of them to slip under. I then scoot the > gravel back into place as they each BITE at me like crazy. > And for those that think Blood Parrots can't close their mouths...HA! > Lol And it HURTS! > > I too rearranged territory but only after the aggression became > horrible. It did nothing either way. (I made more spaces, no > difference. I made less spaces, no difference. I took all the spaces > out completely, no difference.) Grrr. > > Any ideas? > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Steve Szabo > Sent: Monday, June 06, 2005 10:17 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Its war in there! > > > Nick, > > 400W heater? What size tank do you have? > > Generally, you want to size the heater so you have 2-5 Watts per gallon, > depending on how much you need to raise the water above the ambient > temperature. Right now, your tank is a bit on the warm side for the fish > you list, Turn down the thermostat a bit. You'll be looking to get a > range of 24-25^o C. for your fish. Not much cooler, but enough to slow > the fish down a bit. If you do have the need for larger heaters, then it > is normally prudent to buy two heaters, each of half the wattage you > need for the tank. This will serve to save you from coming home one day > to bouillabaisse should one get out of line and stay on continuously. > The other will not come on, unless it is needed to bring the tank up to > the set temperature, and one alone will not be enough to overheat the > tank. > > You don't mention how many fish you have of each species, but I'd guess > you only have one cory. You should have at least 5 tiger barbs to cut > down on aggression of the barbs to other fish. > > Moving the décor of the tank around is probably your biggest contributor > to the current aggression you are seeing. Everyone's territory is gone, > and they are in the process of establishing new territories. Once this > has been done, the aggression will die back to its former level. > > In the grouping of fish you have, the massive water change probably has > done little to add to the aggression, but it may prompt the barbs into > spawning behavior, which will make them more active, but not necessarily > more aggressive. > > A change in the diet should not prompt any kind of aggressive behavior > with your fish. > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of True Percula clownfish!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12181	From: Trevor Holyoak	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: filter debate

Personally, I use the Rena Filstar XP3 on my 150 gal. tank. It works great (I've had it for several years) and was only about $100. - Trevor Crazy4fids@... wrote: > We are all moved into our new house! I have all my aquarium supplies > except > the tank, stand and the filters. I was planning on using two emperor > 400's, > but in doing more research, they are only recommended up to 70 > gallons. Two > emperors would only get me 140 gallons and my tank is 150. The > people at > the store highly recommended an Ehiem. I would be going with a 2028 > model and > adding an emperor 400 on top of the Ehiem. > > Does anyone have any experience with the Ehiem filters? Are they > worth the > extra money? I used to have a 350 magnum and I absolutely hated > cleaning > the damn thing. I had a chance to take apart and assemble one of the > Ehiems > and it seemed pretty simple. The parts seemed more sturdy than the > parts on > the magnum. > > Any input would greatly be appreciated. > > > Thanks, > > Linda > River Falls, WI > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12182	From: paul helms	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: filter debate

i prefer the fluvals myself --- Crazy4fids@... wrote: > We are all moved into our new house! I have all my > aquarium supplies except > the tank, stand and the filters. I was planning on > using two emperor 400's, > but in doing more research, they are only > recommended up to 70 gallons. Two > emperors would only get me 140 gallons and my tank > is 150. The people at > the store highly recommended an Ehiem. I would be > going with a 2028 model and > adding an emperor 400 on top of the Ehiem. > > Does anyone have any experience with the Ehiem > filters? Are they worth the > extra money? I used to have a 350 magnum and I > absolutely hated cleaning > the damn thing. I had a chance to take apart and > assemble one of the Ehiems > and it seemed pretty simple. The parts seemed more > sturdy than the parts on > the magnum. > > Any input would greatly be appreciated. > > > Thanks, > > Linda > River Falls, WI > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/mobile.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12183	From: paul helms	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: Oscar bites

that is normal --- kb1dva <vze3pd7a@...> wrote: > My friend was feeding the fish stopped and had her > hand above the tank, and > one of my Oscars bit her! Is that common Oscar > behavior or was it an > accident. She said she could feel the mouth close > around her hand but no > teeth. BTW thanks for the macquarium info, I think > their cool maybe ill > build one when things get dull around here. > Eventually I need a new filter > for my 90 gallon tank, what is the biggest bang for > your buck, and what type > is the easiest to maintain. Emily > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Find restaurants, movies, travel and more fun for the weekend. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/weekend.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12184	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: Its war in there!

These are red devil/sevrum crosses. Yeah, I took into consideration the possibility of breeding, but they just fight days on end. Once scales started coming off and skin was hanging from each of the "noses," I seperated them indefinitely. (And for those who talk about eating my fish, I don't think that's humurous for a number of reasons. I’m not mad, just not amused. I didn't work my tail off to save these guys to talk about their death.) I sunk the divider down closer to the bottom but I can't put it all the way as this will allow for the fish to swim over the top. Being as how they are so thin, they have no problem with turning sideways to maneuver around the tank. The smaller fish is definitely to ornery. BUT I would choose to rid of the larger. He will pick on other fish, primarily the catfish, something fierce. The small one leaves everyone else alone. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: Monday, June 06, 2005 11:04 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Its war in there! Dane & Leslie, You are looking at a different type of aggression than Nick is. For the most part, cichlids are aggressive fish. The level of aggression differs between species and sexes as well as the phase of life they are in, i.e., breeding, husbandry, etc. Some are mainly aggressive toward conspecifics (others of the same species) while leaving other species alone, others are aggressive to anything that moves, and still others are aggressive only to others of different species. Off the top of my head, I cannot recall what species were claimed to be used to create the parrot cichlid, but you are likely to see the aggressive traits of each of these species expressed to some extent in the hybrid fish. Research on these fish will give you an indication of what you may expect in behavior. While it has been said that these fish cannot breed, they are sterile, I have heard of reports of them breeding. The reason I bring this up is that what you are experiencing with the one digging under the divider is similar to behavior I have read about with certain cichlids in a similar situation, when they were ready to breed. This would also explain why changing the décor did not resolve the issue between the fish. One may be ready to breed, and the other not. Needless to say, you have already learned that you should extent the tank divider as deep into the substrate as you can, ideally to the tank floor. Another possibility is that the tank is simply too small for each fish to establish its own territory. The only solutions to this are to increase the size of the tank (What, never heard of the Tank-O-Matic Tank Expander?), or to remove one of the fish from the environment by moving it to another tank, or else disposing of it by sale or donation to someone else. Also, the smaller fish, in this case, could just simply be too ornery for his own good. Removal of this fish would then be indicated. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Dane & Leslie Moore Sent: Monday, June 06, 2005 11:29 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Its war in there! I'd like to see more opinions on this subject. My two Blood Parrots are still at it but it's now the smaller one that is the instigator. I've separated the large BP with a screen and yet the small one tries to attack him through it. I wake up to find that the small has dug a hole nearly large enough for one of them to slip under. I then scoot the gravel back into place as they each BITE at me like crazy. And for those that think Blood Parrots can't close their mouths...HA! Lol And it HURTS! I too rearranged territory but only after the aggression became horrible. It did nothing either way. (I made more spaces, no difference. I made less spaces, no difference. I took all the spaces out completely, no difference.) Grrr. Any ideas? -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: Monday, June 06, 2005 10:17 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Its war in there! Nick, 400W heater? What size tank do you have? Generally, you want to size the heater so you have 2-5 Watts per gallon, depending on how much you need to raise the water above the ambient temperature. Right now, your tank is a bit on the warm side for the fish you list, Turn down the thermostat a bit. You'll be looking to get a range of 24-25^o C. for your fish. Not much cooler, but enough to slow the fish down a bit. If you do have the need for larger heaters, then it is normally prudent to buy two heaters, each of half the wattage you need for the tank. This will serve to save you from coming home one day to bouillabaisse should one get out of line and stay on continuously. The other will not come on, unless it is needed to bring the tank up to the set temperature, and one alone will not be enough to overheat the tank. You don't mention how many fish you have of each species, but I'd guess you only have one cory. You should have at least 5 tiger barbs to cut down on aggression of the barbs to other fish. Moving the décor of the tank around is probably your biggest contributor to the current aggression you are seeing. Everyone's territory is gone, and they are in the process of establishing new territories. Once this has been done, the aggression will die back to its former level. In the grouping of fish you have, the massive water change probably has done little to add to the aggression, but it may prompt the barbs into spawning behavior, which will make them more active, but not necessarily more aggressive. A change in the diet should not prompt any kind of aggressive behavior with your fish. Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12185	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: Its war in there! valeen

I only have a working 15 gal which is too small for him. I had him in there alone for a couple of weeks and he eventually started acting very sluggish and not looking so good. So I then moved him into the large tank in the divider. He does great in there but what kind of life is that? Yuck. =) -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez Sent: Tuesday, June 07, 2005 12:35 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Its war in there! do you have another tank you can move 1 of them into? if not, i think it may be time to sell or exchange 1 of the fish if possible. --- Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: > I'd like to see more opinions on this subject. My two Blood Parrots > are still at it but it's now the smaller one that is the instigator. > I've separated the large BP with a screen and yet the small one tries > to attack him through it. I wake up to find that the small has dug a > hole nearly large enough for one of them to slip under. I then scoot > the gravel back into place as they each BITE at me like crazy. And for > those that think Blood Parrots can't close their mouths...HA! Lol And > it HURTS! > > I too rearranged territory but only after the aggression became > horrible. It did nothing either way. (I made more spaces, no > difference. I made less spaces, no difference. I took all the spaces > out completely, no difference.) Grrr. > > Any ideas? > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Steve Szabo > Sent: Monday, June 06, 2005 10:17 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Its war in there! > > > Nick, > > 400W heater? What size tank do you have? > > Generally, you want to size the heater so you have 2-5 Watts per > gallon, depending on how much you need to raise the water above the > ambient temperature. Right now, your tank is a bit on the warm side > for the fish you list, Turn down the thermostat a bit. You'll be > looking to get a range of 24-25^o C. for your fish. Not much cooler, > but enough to slow the fish down a bit. If you do have the need for > larger heaters, then it is normally prudent to buy two heaters, each > of half the wattage you need for the tank. This will serve to save you > from coming home one day to bouillabaisse should one get out of line > and stay on continuously. The other will not come on, unless it is > needed to bring the tank up to the set temperature, and one alone will > not be enough to overheat the tank. > > You don't mention how many fish you have of each species, but I'd > guess you only have one cory. You should have at least 5 tiger barbs > to cut down on aggression of the barbs to other fish. > > Moving the décor of the tank around is probably your biggest > contributor to the current aggression you are seeing. Everyone's > territory is gone, and they are in the process of establishing new > territories. Once this has been done, the aggression will die back to > its former level. > > In the grouping of fish you have, the massive water change probably > has done little to add to the aggression, but it may prompt the barbs > into spawning behavior, which will make them more active, but not > necessarily more aggressive. > > A change in the diet should not prompt any kind of aggressive behavior > with your fish. > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of True Percula clownfish! Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12186	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: Its war in there!

Leslie, As long as these two fish can see each other, there are going to be problems. As Steve mentioned, this is a different type of aggression from what Nick's fish are exhibiting. The two species (Severum and Red Devil or Midas) involved in the make-up of these Blood Parrots is immaterial, although these two Cichlids in themselves can be highly aggressive, especially the Red Devil. Some New World Cichlids are known to be aggressive to varying degrees, depending (very much) upon which species are being addressed. For the most part it is not merely due to them being "nasty" in temperment or personality. This aggressiveness is due to a sense of territoriality, which is due in part to their natural spawning behavior. While Paul had a valid idea, even if not practical -- introducing a larger and more aggressive fish yet would calm down these two Blood Parrots as now the "pecking order" would be pushed down a peg, but you would need a larger tank yet -- perhaps a 200 or 250 gallon tank for this to work out to where everyone would have enough room to feel "comfortable"; as I said -- not practical. As this is part of the spawning behavior -- and I don't mean that these two are necessarily going through a spawning ritual (they may be 2 males) -- you might try lowering the temperature to no more than 72o. This will reduce some of the spawning instinct. Very possible, though, that this step alone may not be enough. In order to keep both fish in the same tank, you may have to use an opaque divider, so the fish can't see each other. Many years ago, the Meta-Frame Company used to put out such dividers. They were solid sheets of 1/16" white plastic with rows of small 1/16" holes drilled throughout the divider. Rubber or plastic channel stock was used on the ends to support it between the tank sides. The fish couldn't see each other, but it allowed free circulation of water through both sides of the tank. With such large fish, you'd probably need 1/8" or heavier sheet plastic, or it would bend if they pushed against it. If your objective is to harmoniously keep both fish in the same tank, with no divider, forget about it now and resign yourself to getting rid of one of them. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > I'd like to see more opinions on this subject. My two Blood Parrots are > still at it but it's now the smaller one that is the instigator. I've > separated the large BP with a screen and yet the small one tries to > attack him through it. I wake up to find that the small has dug a hole > nearly large enough for one of them to slip under. I then scoot the > gravel back into place as they each BITE at me like crazy. > And for those that think Blood Parrots can't close their mouths...HA! > Lol And it HURTS! > > I too rearranged territory but only after the aggression became > horrible. It did nothing either way. (I made more spaces, no > difference. I made less spaces, no difference. I took all the spaces > out completely, no difference.) Grrr. > > Any ideas? > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Steve Szabo > Sent: Monday, June 06, 2005 10:17 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Its war in there! > > > Nick, > > 400W heater? What size tank do you have? > > Generally, you want to size the heater so you have 2-5 Watts per gallon, > depending on how much you need to raise the water above the ambient > temperature. Right now, your tank is a bit on the warm side for the fish > you list, Turn down the thermostat a bit. You'll be looking to get a > range of 24-25^o C. for your fish. Not much cooler, but enough to slow > the fish down a bit. If you do have the need for larger heaters, then it > is normally prudent to buy two heaters, each of half the wattage you > need for the tank. This will serve to save you from coming home one day > to bouillabaisse should one get out of line and stay on continuously. > The other will not come on, unless it is needed to bring the tank up to > the set temperature, and one alone will not be enough to overheat the > tank. > > You don't mention how many fish you have of each species, but I'd guess > you only have one cory. You should have at least 5 tiger barbs to cut > down on aggression of the barbs to other fish. > > Moving the décor of the tank around is probably your biggest contributor > to the current aggression you are seeing. Everyone's territory is gone, > and they are in the process of establishing new territories. Once this > has been done, the aggression will die back to its former level. > > In the grouping of fish you have, the massive water change probably has > done little to add to the aggression, but it may prompt the barbs into > spawning behavior, which will make them more active, but not necessarily > more aggressive. > > A change in the diet should not prompt any kind of aggressive behavior > with your fish.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12187	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: Oscar bites

Emily, I had a pair and they did that to me a couple times. No harm done to me other than surprising the heck out of me as I was not looking at them when it happened. I did feel what felt like ridges or teeth, but again no harm or blood letting. Mikw In a message dated 6/7/2005 10:22:37 AM Pacific Daylight Time, vze3pd7a@... writes: My friend was feeding the fish stopped and had her hand above the tank, and one of my Oscars bit her! Is that common Oscar behavior or was it an accident. She said she could feel the mouth close around her hand but no teeth. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12188	From: kb1dva	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Oscar bites

She said it didn't break the skin scared her though; She didn't expect to get bitten by a fish. And to think I had my arm in the tank all the way up- to vacuum gravel I don't know if I will ever feel as comfortable doing that again! What's the scoop on a good filter system for a 90 gallon tank? I am using an emperor double wheel filter now but its only rated for 70 gallons. Please remember money is tight Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12189	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: Oscar bites

In a message dated 6/7/2005 2:12:52 PM Pacific Daylight Time, vze3pd7a@... writes: What's the scoop on a good filter system for a 90 gallon tank? I am using an emperor double wheel filter now but its only rated for 70 gallons. Please remember money is tight Emily Hmmm? Well if you want to go with another power filter, try an aqua clear. Usually places like Bigalsonline.com and other online aquatic suppliers have good prices on filters, but you do have to figure shipping into the cost. Ebay also has deals occasionally on filters. I use fluval canister filters, I have four of them and I have been happy with them so far. There is a cheaper brand called Jebo or Odysea that are made in china. I have two of them and they work ok, they are inexpensive, but they seem a little on the cheaply built side. Sponge filters are a cheap filter that can be used with just an air pump or a powerhead hooked up to them. Sponge filters will provide good bacteria filtration, but almost no mechanical filtration as in if there is fish poop it will not really remove it, or at least not much. But then you have the emporer double for the fish poop part as well as the biowheels for bacteria. I have been setting up tanks lately and just using sponge filters, but they are not 90 gallon tanks, they are ten to 55 gallon setups, and the 55 gallon tanks get a sponge filter and a canister or power filter and all seems fine so far. Mike [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12190	From: kb1dva	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: Oscar bites

Thanks I will have to look at them. I want to do research before so I get the right thing. I can't complain I got the tank free on line! Emily _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Deenerz@... Sent: Tuesday, June 07, 2005 5:28 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Oscar bites In a message dated 6/7/2005 2:12:52 PM Pacific Daylight Time, vze3pd7a@... writes: What's the scoop on a good filter system for a 90 gallon tank? I am using an emperor double wheel filter now but its only rated for 70 gallons. Please remember money is tight Emily Hmmm? Well if you want to go with another power filter, try an aqua clear. Usually places like Bigalsonline.com and other online aquatic suppliers have good prices on filters, but you do have to figure shipping into the cost. Ebay also has deals occasionally on filters. I use fluval canister filters, I have four of them and I have been happy with them so far. There is a cheaper brand called Jebo or Odysea that are made in china. I have two of them and they work ok, they are inexpensive, but they seem a little on the cheaply built side. Sponge filters are a cheap filter that can be used with just an air pump or a powerhead hooked up to them. Sponge filters will provide good bacteria filtration, but almost no mechanical filtration as in if there is fish poop it will not really remove it, or at least not much. But then you have the emporer double for the fish poop part as well as the biowheels for bacteria. I have been setting up tanks lately and just using sponge filters, but they are not 90 gallon tanks, they are ten to 55 gallon setups, and the 55 gallon tanks get a sponge filter and a canister or power filter and all seems fine so far. Mike [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter _____ Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12191	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: Its war in there! valeen

oh yeah that is definitely too small for the poor thing. do finances/space permit you purchasing another tank for him? or can you put in a divider that won't allow the fish to see each other? if no to both i think you might have to give one of the fish away =( --- Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: > > I only have a working 15 gal which is too small for him. I had him in > there alone for a couple of weeks and he eventually started acting very > sluggish and not looking so good. So I then moved him into the large > tank in the divider. He does great in there but what kind of life is > that? Yuck. =) > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez > Sent: Tuesday, June 07, 2005 12:35 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Its war in there! > > > do you have another tank you can move 1 of them into? if not, i think it > may be time to sell or exchange 1 of the fish if possible. > > --- Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: > > > I'd like to see more opinions on this subject. My two Blood Parrots > > are still at it but it's now the smaller one that is the instigator. > > I've separated the large BP with a screen and yet the small one tries > > to attack him through it. I wake up to find that the small has dug a > > hole nearly large enough for one of them to slip under. I then scoot > > the gravel back into place as they each BITE at me like crazy. And for > > > those that think Blood Parrots can't close their mouths...HA! Lol And > > > it HURTS! > > > > I too rearranged territory but only after the aggression became > > horrible. It did nothing either way. (I made more spaces, no > > difference. I made less spaces, no difference. I took all the spaces > > > out completely, no difference.) Grrr. > > > > Any ideas? > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > > On Behalf Of Steve Szabo > > Sent: Monday, June 06, 2005 10:17 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Its war in there! > > > > > > Nick, > > > > 400W heater? What size tank do you have? > > > > Generally, you want to size the heater so you have 2-5 Watts per > > gallon, depending on how much you need to raise the water above the > > ambient temperature. Right now, your tank is a bit on the warm side > > for the fish you list, Turn down the thermostat a bit. You'll be > > looking to get a range of 24-25^o C. for your fish. Not much cooler, > > but enough to slow the fish down a bit. If you do have the need for > > larger heaters, then it is normally prudent to buy two heaters, each > > of half the wattage you need for the tank. This will serve to save you > > > from coming home one day to bouillabaisse should one get out of line > > and stay on continuously. The other will not come on, unless it is > > needed to bring the tank up to the set temperature, and one alone will > > > not be enough to overheat the tank. > > > > You don't mention how many fish you have of each species, but I'd > > guess you only have one cory. You should have at least 5 tiger barbs > > to cut down on aggression of the barbs to other fish. > > > > Moving the décor of the tank around is probably your biggest > > contributor to the current aggression you are seeing. Everyone's > > territory is gone, and they are in the process of establishing new > > territories. Once this has been done, the aggression will die back to > > its former level. > > > > In the grouping of fish you have, the massive water change probably > > has done little to add to the aggression, but it may prompt the barbs > > into spawning behavior, which will make them more active, but not > > necessarily more aggressive. > > > > A change in the diet should not prompt any kind of aggressive behavior > > > with your fish. > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > I love my mated pair of True Percula clownfish! > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important > to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify > the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we > Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of True Percula clownfish!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12192	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: Oscar bites

Emily, I guess you could say it was both. It was an accident as far as the Oscar biting your friend. Its intent was not to bite her but to obtain food which he thought he was being fed. Its common behavior to some extent in that in many instances, you can get your Oscars (train) to leap out of the water for their food. As your Oscar obviously is used to having food dropped into its tank from your hand, it has now associated your suspended hand with food being imminently dropped onto the surface. As a hand (your friend's hand) was still suspended over the tank, with no food being dropped, the Oscar thought it would "speed up" matters (got impatient) and go up and get it, since it has learned that a hand over its tank contains food. In this case there was no food, but the Oscar did not know that from what it has come to expect. No need to fear putting your hand into the tank. This fish is not blood-thirsty and will not attack you. Years back its been reported that some people can again "train" their Oscars to be petted, but I don't recommend that as you risk removing its protective slime coating. By the way, they don't have teeth in their jaws as you think of teeth, but its like several rows of coarse sandpaper. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "kb1dva" <vze3pd7a@v...> wrote: > My friend was feeding the fish stopped and had her hand above the tank, and > one of my Oscars bit her! Is that common Oscar behavior or was it an > accident. She said she could feel the mouth close around her hand but no > teeth. BTW thanks for the macquarium info, I think their cool maybe ill > build one when things get dull around here. Eventually I need a new filter > for my 90 gallon tank, what is the biggest bang for your buck, and what type > is the easiest to maintain. Emily > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12193	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: Oscar bites

In a message dated 6/7/2005 2:58:33 PM Pacific Daylight Time, sevenspringss@... writes: Emily, I guess you could say it was both. It was an accident as far as the Oscar biting your friend. Its intent was not to bite her but to obtain food which he thought he was being fed. Its common behavior to some extent in that in many instances, you can get your Oscars (train) to leap out of the water for their food. As your Oscar obviously is used to having food dropped into its tank from your hand, it has now associated your suspended hand with food being imminently dropped onto They are pretty cool fish. Mine had me trained well, he knew what corner I would feed him at in the tank and would do the Oscar manipulation dances in front of the glass to get more food out of his pet human. Mike [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12194	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: Bleach Solution for Cleaning Tanks

ay! ok, i'll use maybe more like 1/2 cap full for my 6 gallon. don't want the bleach residue to kill/harm the betta when he goes back into the tank. thanks for all the help, valeen --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > yup...that is enough to kill anything in the tank. > that is actually more than we are allowed to use in > our sanitizing solution in the food industry. we use > less thana cap ina 20 gallon sink! beyond that and > it is not safe for humans, and will potentially begin > to decay plastics and silicones. > > --- Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote: > > > just so i am clear (am going to clean the tank > > tonight) you meant 1 CAP, not 1 CUP, right? > > > > -v > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > > > 1 cap full per 5 gallons is plenty > > > > > > --- Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> > > wrote: > > > > > > > great, thanks. but can you tell me if 1 cup > > bleach > > > > per 5 gallons water is ok? that's the ratio i > > > > found on wetwebmedia.com. > > > > > > > > thanks, > > > > valeen > > > > > > > > --- Karen <oilfield_brat@...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Bleach is more for sanitizing and algae. > > Vinegar > > > > and lemon juice > > > > > work much better for cleaning mineral > > deposits. > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Paul N. > > > > Chung" <p_n_chung@y...> > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > Hey Valeen, > > > > > > > > > > > > Try using Lemon. They are quite effective in > > > > cleaning acrylic and > > > > > glass aquarium. > > > > > > > > > > > > Paulo > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@y...> > > wrote: > > > > > > hi everyone, > > > > > > > > > > > > can anyone tell me the bleach solution i > > should > > > > use to clean out > > > > > an acrylic tank? and can i use > > > > > > this same solution to clean aquarium gravel, > > > > too? > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks, > > > > > > valeen > > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > > > > > > I love my 2 Ocellaris clownfish! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below > > it > > > > when replying, > > > > > thanks > > > > > > . > > > > > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all > > > > text that is not > > > > > important to the reply and if changing the > > topic > > > > of the original > > > > > message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new > > > > subject (was re: old > > > > > subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for > > your > > > > help in this matter > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > To visit your group on the web, go to: > > > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > > > > > > > > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an > > email > > > > to: > > > > > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > > > > > > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to > > the > > > > Yahoo! Terms of > > > > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > > > > > Do You Yahoo!? > > > > > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best > > spam > > > > protection around > > > > > > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > > > > I love my mated pair of True Percula clownfish! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > > > Discover Yahoo! > > > Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online and > > more. Check it out! > > > http://discover.yahoo.com/ > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > > I love my mated pair of True Percula clownfish! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > Discover Yahoo! > Stay in touch with email, IM, photo sharing and more. Check it out! > http://discover.yahoo.com/stayintouch.html > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of True Percula clownfish!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12195	From: Trevor Holyoak	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: Bleach Solution for Cleaning Tanks

Just make sure you rinse it well enough that you can't smell the bleach anymore and you should be fine. - Trevor Valeen Gonzalez wrote: > ay! ok, i'll use maybe more like 1/2 cap full for my 6 gallon. don't > want the bleach residue to > kill/harm the betta when he goes back into the tank. > > thanks for all the help, > valeen > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > yup...that is enough to kill anything in the tank. > > that is actually more than we are allowed to use in > > our sanitizing solution in the food industry. we use > > less thana cap ina 20 gallon sink! beyond that and > > it is not safe for humans, and will potentially begin > > to decay plastics and silicones. > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12196	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: Its war in there!

Nick, Wow! $70 Australian for a 150 watt heater? That is about $54 US. For a good 150 watt heater we would pay between $15 and 20, roughly, or, in Australian, $20-26. No wonder the Australians I have for clients like it here so much--we are so inexpensive to live for them. However, like there, it is much less costly to purchase one larger heater than two of a lesser size. As I mentioned at the end of my message, a change in diet should not prompt any change in aggression that might or might not already exist. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nicolas Munro Sent: Tuesday, June 07, 2005 1:51 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Its war in there! Yea i know but the heater was $4 more than a 150w heater which i was planning to get 2 of. so $70x$70 = $140ish vs $74 I was kinda relucktant but the sales people talked me into it as it uses a mesh instead of wires for the heating and is supposed to be better quality than the ones I was going to buy which where the same brand as the one which broke. My original thoughts were - it could have been the change of food maybe? =Nick Oh, well i'll let the fish sort it out between themselves then aye? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steve Szabo" <steve@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, June 07, 2005 1:16 PM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Its war in there! > Nick, > > 400W heater? What size tank do you have? > > Generally, you want to size the heater so you have 2-5 Watts per gallon, > depending on how much you need to raise the water above the ambient > temperature. Right now, your tank is a bit on the warm side for the fish > you > list, Turn down the thermostat a bit. You'll be looking to get a range of > 24-25^o C. for your fish. Not much cooler, but enough to slow the fish > down > a bit. If you do have the need for larger heaters, then it is normally > prudent to buy two heaters, each of half the wattage you need for the > tank. > This will serve to save you from coming home one day to bouillabaisse > should > one get out of line and stay on continuously. The other will not come on, > unless it is needed to bring the tank up to the set temperature, and one > alone will not be enough to overheat the tank. > > You don't mention how many fish you have of each species, but I'd guess > you > only have one cory. You should have at least 5 tiger barbs to cut down on > aggression of the barbs to other fish. > > Moving the décor of the tank around is probably your biggest contributor > to > the current aggression you are seeing. Everyone's territory is gone, and > they are in the process of establishing new territories. Once this has > been > done, the aggression will die back to its former level. > > In the grouping of fish you have, the massive water change probably has > done > little to add to the aggression, but it may prompt the barbs into spawning > behavior, which will make them more active, but not necessarily more > aggressive. > > A change in the diet should not prompt any kind of aggressive behavior > with > your fish. > > \\Steve// > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Nicolas Munro > Sent: Monday, June 06, 2005 10:21 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Its war in there! > > Ehhh!!! > > For some reason all my fish have decided to attack and fight with each > other. Tiger Barbs vs Sword Tails vs Pregnant Guppies vs the poor little > CoryDory. > > > > Can any one help me narrow it down, ive done the following things over the > weekend: > > Removed FinRot treatment chemicals with a 90% water change. > > In the process of refilling I broke my heater (300w) by pooring cold water > onto it when it was hot (unfortunatly i didn't realise it was still pluged > in on a different circuit). > > Replaced the Heater with a 400w heater which is now keeping the tank at > 26degC compaired to the other heater keeping it at 23degC. > > Rearranged the rock layout so there are more caves for the fish to hide > in. > > Brought and using some new fish food to replace what i was using before. > Wardly Totally Tropical i think, flakes. Normally i used some supermarket > fish flakes and some Wardley Cichlid Floating Crumbles, both of which Ive > run out of. > > > > ??? > Take cover! > =Nick

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12197	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: filter debate

My experience Ehiem being a international brand name costs a lot more for doing the same thing a nonbrand filter can do. ----- Original Message ----- From: <Crazy4fids@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wednesday, June 08, 2005 3:23 AM Subject: [AquaticLife] filter debate > We are all moved into our new house! I have all my aquarium supplies > except > the tank, stand and the filters. I was planning on using two emperor > 400's, > but in doing more research, they are only recommended up to 70 gallons. > Two > emperors would only get me 140 gallons and my tank is 150. The people at > the store highly recommended an Ehiem. I would be going with a 2028 > model and > adding an emperor 400 on top of the Ehiem. > > Does anyone have any experience with the Ehiem filters? Are they worth > the > extra money? I used to have a 350 magnum and I absolutely hated > cleaning > the damn thing. I had a chance to take apart and assemble one of the > Ehiems > and it seemed pretty simple. The parts seemed more sturdy than the parts > on > the magnum. > > Any input would greatly be appreciated. > > > Thanks, > > Linda > River Falls, WI > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12198	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: Its war in there!

Can Tigerbarbs and African/American Cichlids co exists in a mostly pecful maner. I understand theres probably a 10 times difference in ph... =Nick ----- Original Message ----- From: "Valeen Gonzalez" <valeendgonzalez@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wednesday, June 08, 2005 3:35 AM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Its war in there! > do you have another tank you can move 1 of them into? if not, i think it > may be time to sell or > exchange 1 of the fish if possible. > > --- Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: > >> I'd like to see more opinions on this subject. My two Blood Parrots are >> still at it but it's now the smaller one that is the instigator. I've >> separated the large BP with a screen and yet the small one tries to >> attack him through it. I wake up to find that the small has dug a hole >> nearly large enough for one of them to slip under. I then scoot the >> gravel back into place as they each BITE at me like crazy. >> And for those that think Blood Parrots can't close their mouths...HA! >> Lol And it HURTS! >> >> I too rearranged territory but only after the aggression became >> horrible. It did nothing either way. (I made more spaces, no >> difference. I made less spaces, no difference. I took all the spaces >> out completely, no difference.) Grrr. >> >> Any ideas? >> >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] >> On Behalf Of Steve Szabo >> Sent: Monday, June 06, 2005 10:17 PM >> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com >> Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Its war in there! >> >> >> Nick, >> >> 400W heater? What size tank do you have? >> >> Generally, you want to size the heater so you have 2-5 Watts per gallon, >> depending on how much you need to raise the water above the ambient >> temperature. Right now, your tank is a bit on the warm side for the fish >> you list, Turn down the thermostat a bit. You'll be looking to get a >> range of 24-25^o C. for your fish. Not much cooler, but enough to slow >> the fish down a bit. If you do have the need for larger heaters, then it >> is normally prudent to buy two heaters, each of half the wattage you >> need for the tank. This will serve to save you from coming home one day >> to bouillabaisse should one get out of line and stay on continuously. >> The other will not come on, unless it is needed to bring the tank up to >> the set temperature, and one alone will not be enough to overheat the >> tank. >> >> You don't mention how many fish you have of each species, but I'd guess >> you only have one cory. You should have at least 5 tiger barbs to cut >> down on aggression of the barbs to other fish. >> >> Moving the décor of the tank around is probably your biggest contributor >> to the current aggression you are seeing. Everyone's territory is gone, >> and they are in the process of establishing new territories. Once this >> has been done, the aggression will die back to its former level. >> >> In the grouping of fish you have, the massive water change probably has >> done little to add to the aggression, but it may prompt the barbs into >> spawning behavior, which will make them more active, but not necessarily >> more aggressive. >> >> A change in the diet should not prompt any kind of aggressive behavior >> with your fish. >> >> > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > I love my mated pair of True Percula clownfish! > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12199	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: mystery fish

I hope there not tode tadpoles cause i think they eat fish. =Nick ----- Original Message ----- From: "minnesotagal866" <minnesotagal866@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, June 07, 2005 7:50 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] mystery fish >I have a container water garden that is about 35 gallons. On Memorial > Day I put 3 zebra danios and 4 white cloud minnows in it. That was 9 > days ago. Sunday I added 6 more minnows. I now have several little > grayish black with light bellied fish swimming around. They are about > 1/2 inch long and they came up to eat fish food last night. They are > fast swimmers and dart around the container. Does anyone know what > they are? Could the danios have spawned and would this be what their > fry look like? Or did one of the plants come with eggs or small fry > that I didn't see (I didn't check that closely). Or could they be > tadpoles that some enterprising frog delivered to my container? I just > netted one quickly, it jumped out of my net and back into the > container, but I didn't see a neon stripe on it, more of a lightening > of the color from top to belly. Any ideas? > > Jackie > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12200	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: Bleach Solution for Cleaning Tanks

great, will do. hubby's plan is as follows: put the clorox in the water that's in the tank now (it's empty as the betta is in qt tank) and let it run through the pump for a couple hours. then take out that water and replace w/ new ro water and run for about 1/2 hour. rinse out the tank thoroughly. then let it air dry overnight. does this sound like a good plan? Trevor Holyoak <trevor@...> wrote: Just make sure you rinse it well enough that you can't smell the bleach anymore and you should be fine. - Trevor Valeen Gonzalez wrote: > ay! ok, i'll use maybe more like 1/2 cap full for my 6 gallon. don't > want the bleach residue to > kill/harm the betta when he goes back into the tank. > > thanks for all the help, > valeen > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > yup...that is enough to kill anything in the tank. > > that is actually more than we are allowed to use in > > our sanitizing solution in the food industry. we use > > less thana cap ina 20 gallon sink! beyond that and > > it is not safe for humans, and will potentially begin > > to decay plastics and silicones. > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter --------------------------------- Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of True Percula clownfish! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12201	From: Tim Fairchild	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: filter debate

On Wednesday 08 Jun 2005 03:40, Trevor Holyoak wrote: > Personally, I use the Rena Filstar XP3 on my 150 gal. tank. It works > great (I've had it for several years) and was only about $100. I still make all my own filters. I do buy pumps, but making filters is part of the fun of the hobby. And they a cheaper and 'better' IMO :) tim -- --------------------------------------------------------- Tim & Therese Fairchild Atchafalaya Border Collies. Kuttabul, Queensland, Australia. --------------------------------------------------------- Email mailto:tim@... Homepage http://www.bcs4me.com Photos http://www.pbase.com/amosf ---------------------------------------------------------

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12202	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: filter debate

In a message dated 6/7/2005 6:36:59 PM Pacific Daylight Time, tim@... writes: I still make all my own filters. I do buy pumps, but making filters is part of the fun of the hobby. And they a cheaper and 'better' IMO :) tim Tim is right, Making your own aquatic stuff is fun and cheap! There are at least three yahoo groups for bulding your own aquariums and filters etc. Mike [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12203	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: Ich After Water Change? Help!

Though it is not stated, it does sound like Dierdre's tank is cycled, or close to it. That would not cause the ich she is describing anyway. I did see the original question last night, or early this morning, and have had it in the back of my mind since. Now, upon reading the post again, I've got some thoughts that may lead you in the correct direction. First, you say nothing about the water parameters in the tank itself, other than you try to match the temperature. This would be an important fact to have at hand to more accurately gauge what may be happening. I am willing to bet that the mollies and the swordtails are the ones that show signs of ich first. Ich is a temperature sensitive parasite. The two aforementioned fish are better kept at higher temperatures, close to 80^o F. It usually takes 7-14 days to cure ich, so the cure may not be effective yet when you do the water change, or we are dealing with something that is different, and not ich here. Mollies are fairly warm temperature fish, and can be easily adversely affected by cooler temperatures. The fancy swordtails are not quite so sensitive, but are more so that their plain brethren. What may be happening is the water changing is placing enough extra stress on those fish to produce the symptoms of ich. [BTW, ich is always present. I don't know what the mechanism is that seems to introduce it into every tank, but it seems to be always present, just waiting for the opportunity to strike.] If you could do a better job describing exactly what happens, and how the fish look and which fish are affected, along with your water parameters, we can probably get closer to what is really happening here and give you a path to follow to help resolve the problem. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of paul helms Sent: Tuesday, June 07, 2005 1:10 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Ich After Water Change? Help! sounds like teh tank is not stable yet, and should be left to cycle. you do not need to change wter weekly. if you are doing that much weekly, you are desimating your bacterial supply. i know it is not quite equal to 100%, but you are eefectively changing out 75% of your tank monthly. cut back to 5-10% weekly for a while, then ween back slowly to biweekly small changes. --- Deirdre Marr <dastx@...> wrote: > Hello, > > I am new to the list. My husband and I have 3 tanks > which I am very good about doing > paritial water changes/gravel vacuuming in. > > My problem is with my Husband's 24 gal freswater > Nanocube. Everytime I do a small > water change (1/3-1/4 once every week to 10 days) > half of the fish get Ick. I am very > careful to match water temps. from my tap water to > the aquarium and I add a water > conditioner to the tap water. > > When I do water changes in my Ciclid tank I don't > have this problem. > > My Husband as a pair of Pearl Lyretail Molleys, a > pair of Red Velvet Swordtails, 2 Long > Finned Rosy Barbs, a couple of small bottom feeders > (sorry, I don't know what they are!), a > very small Bala Shark and a very small Rainbow > Shark, a small red striped Gourami and a > large Gold snail. The tank is planted w/ real > plants that are thriving. > > Please help, I hate doing water changes now because > I hate seeing the fish get sick! > > Thank you, > > Deirdre Marr > Dallas, TX

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12204	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: filter debate

Linda, I would not hesitate to recommend the Ehiem. Quality all the way. Be sure you get the quick disconnects that will help considerably when cleaning the filter. From what I have seen on this list, Fluval also makes a nice canister filter. They seem to have resolved some problems that were present in the early models I am most familiar with, so they may be a good choice as well, and not as expensive. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Tuesday, June 07, 2005 1:23 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] filter debate We are all moved into our new house! I have all my aquarium supplies except the tank, stand and the filters. I was planning on using two emperor 400's, but in doing more research, they are only recommended up to 70 gallons. Two emperors would only get me 140 gallons and my tank is 150. The people at the store highly recommended an Ehiem. I would be going with a 2028 model and adding an emperor 400 on top of the Ehiem. Does anyone have any experience with the Ehiem filters? Are they worth the extra money? I used to have a 350 magnum and I absolutely hated cleaning the damn thing. I had a chance to take apart and assemble one of the Ehiems and it seemed pretty simple. The parts seemed more sturdy than the parts on the magnum. Any input would greatly be appreciated. Thanks, Linda River Falls, WI

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12205	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: Common Plecos /Heather Norton

Heather, Some plecos can grow quite large, while others will grow no larger than 3-4 inches. It really depends on the species. However, there are so many pleco species that have a similar color pattern, it can be difficult to tell them apart. As for eating anything they can get into their mouths, not true either. Plecos are herbivores for the most part, though they are not adverse to a little meat in the diet. The story of them eating anything that they can get their mouths around may stem from the fact that plecos have been observed attaching themselves to fish. This is mainly to eat the slime that is produced, and not the fish, and is quite possibly a sign that the pleco is not getting enough of the nutrients that are needed. I am not aware of any reports of this happening in the wild. One thing all who have a pleco should be aware is that they seem to need some wood in their diets, so the placement of some driftwood in the aquarium should be considered to be a necessary item to keep them healthy. Another point, having to do with plecos and lists is that many will spell pl*cos as I have just done, or in another manner so the name is not completely spelled out. This goes back a long ways when several people lost pl*cos after spelling out the name on a list. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of hnorton1cogeco.ca Sent: Tuesday, June 07, 2005 7:28 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Common Plecos /Heather Norton It is very interesting about this breed shown (Common Plecos) in the news clip .I was told by my dealer that when they are small they are peaceful but they grow very large and they will eat anything they can get into their mouths . Heather Norton Original Message Smith & Wesson, The Original Point And Click Interface Here is something from the BBC. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/asia-pacific/4613985.stm

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12206	From: Deirdre Marr	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Ich & Water Changes: More Info.

Here is some more info, and I hope it is enough. The tank has been set up for 2+months. I read various aquarium magazines and they stress the importance of frequent small water changes so this is what I have tried to do. The tank has a heater and thermometer, temp. is kept consistent at 80*F. The Red Velvet Swordtails, the one fancy colored Gourami and a silver/black scaleless bottom feeder (sorry I don't know the name) are the ones affected. The Lyretail Silver Mollies seem unaffected. The fish look fine, I will do a small water change and the next day the fish have the typical small white dots on them, otherwise the fish eat well and don't appear to be ill. I myself don't test the water but I have a great fish store that will test for free as often as I take the water in which is often! (every 2 weeks). They never tell me the exact results but they tell me that everything looks great. I have been treating with Quick Cure. My personal tank is a 60 gal. w/ Cichlids and when I do water changes in that tank I don't have any problems. Thanks in advance for any help. Deirdre

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12207	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: filter debate

Thanks steve! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12208	From: Eric Miner	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Succesful fishless cycle using....

Hello All, Thought I'd post about the fishless cycle I just finished up. This is my first tank in many, many years - 46gl bowfront. After doing a lot of research I decided to do a fishless cycle. 1) because I didn't want to stress any fish and 2) my experience in culturing and keep yeast strains for homebrewing gave me a bit of knowledge on how to keep and feed a colony of one celled critters. On May 23 I started the cycle by adding a dose of Bio-Spira (the 90 gal. size) and 16ml of 'clear ammonia'. Of course the ammonia spike was immediate and was around 2-3ppm. This is a bit lower than some folks shoot for but I didn't want to kill the bacteria I had added. The ammonia stayed high for about 72 hours. Once it began to drop I started adding 12 'drop' of ammonia a day. As expected the ammonia level dropped steadily. About a week later it was low and the nitrite spike started. It peak 24hrs later and was done to a comfortable level in about 32 hrs. On Sunday June 6th I added 6 Panda Corys and 3 Amano shrimp. They're all happy with the tank and the Pandas started cleaning the substrate and playing around about 45 mins after I added them. All levels remain steady in a comfortable zone. Thought you'd like know Later, Eric Charlotte, NC

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12209	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: Ich & Water Changes: More Info.

Deirdre, You should invest in your own test kits. Then you will be able to get a good baseline on your water parameters so if anything does go wrong, you have numbers you can look at and be able to give others a listing of those numbers. I like the Kordon Aqua-Tru kits because of the testing vials. How long does it take for the "ich" to appear? How long does it last? I'd be cautious in using Quick Cure with the fish you originally listed, which include catfish and the unidentified scaleless fish you mention again here. Especially if we do not yet know if we are really dealing with an ich outbreak. The malachite green is toxic, and repeated use may not be the best procedure to be following at this point. If it is indeed ich, then it is unusual that only half the fish are infected and not all. Ich is relatively nonspecific in choosing host fish. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Deirdre Marr Sent: Tuesday, June 07, 2005 10:27 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Ich & Water Changes: More Info. Here is some more info, and I hope it is enough. The tank has been set up for 2+months. I read various aquarium magazines and they stress the importance of frequent small water changes so this is what I have tried to do. The tank has a heater and thermometer, temp. is kept consistent at 80*F. The Red Velvet Swordtails, the one fancy colored Gourami and a silver/black scaleless bottom feeder (sorry I don't know the name) are the ones affected. The Lyretail Silver Mollies seem unaffected. The fish look fine, I will do a small water change and the next day the fish have the typical small white dots on them, otherwise the fish eat well and don't appear to be ill. I myself don't test the water but I have a great fish store that will test for free as often as I take the water in which is often! (every 2 weeks). They never tell me the exact results but they tell me that everything looks great. I have been treating with Quick Cure. My personal tank is a 60 gal. w/ Cichlids and when I do water changes in that tank I don't have any problems. Thanks in advance for any help. Deirdre Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12210	From: paul helms	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: Bleach Solution for Cleaning Tanks

sounds evry much unn ecessary but whatever floats your boat --- Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote: > great, will do. hubby's plan is as follows: > > put the clorox in the water that's in the tank now > (it's empty as the betta is in qt tank) and let it > run through the pump for a couple hours. then take > out that water and replace w/ new ro water and run > for about 1/2 hour. rinse out the tank thoroughly. > then let it air dry overnight. does this sound like > a good plan? > > Trevor Holyoak <trevor@...> wrote: > Just make sure you rinse it well enough that you > can't smell the bleach > anymore and you should be fine. > > - Trevor > > Valeen Gonzalez wrote: > > > ay! ok, i'll use maybe more like 1/2 cap full for > my 6 gallon. don't > > want the bleach residue to > > kill/harm the betta when he goes back into the > tank. > > > > thanks for all the help, > > valeen > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > > > yup...that is enough to kill anything in the > tank. > > > that is actually more than we are allowed to use > in > > > our sanitizing solution in the food industry. > we use > > > less thana cap ina 20 gallon sink! beyond > that and > > > it is not safe for humans, and will potentially > begin > > > to decay plastics and silicones. > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when > replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text > that is not important to the reply and if changing > the topic of the original message modify the subject > line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, > we Thank You in Advance for your help in this > matter > > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Groups Links > > To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > I love my mated pair of True Percula clownfish! > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Find restaurants, movies, travel and more fun for the weekend. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/weekend.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12211	From: paul helms	Date: 6/7/2005
Subject: Re: Its war in there!

in general NO. if you are very lucky Yes. --- Nicolas Munro <nmunro@...> wrote: > Can Tigerbarbs and African/American Cichlids co > exists in a mostly pecful > maner. > > I understand theres probably a 10 times difference > in ph... > =Nick > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Valeen Gonzalez" <valeendgonzalez@...> > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Wednesday, June 08, 2005 3:35 AM > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Its war in there! > > > > do you have another tank you can move 1 of them > into? if not, i think it > > may be time to sell or > > exchange 1 of the fish if possible. > > > > --- Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> > wrote: > > > >> I'd like to see more opinions on this subject. > My two Blood Parrots are > >> still at it but it's now the smaller one that is > the instigator. I've > >> separated the large BP with a screen and yet the > small one tries to > >> attack him through it. I wake up to find that > the small has dug a hole > >> nearly large enough for one of them to slip > under. I then scoot the > >> gravel back into place as they each BITE at me > like crazy. > >> And for those that think Blood Parrots can't > close their mouths...HA! > >> Lol And it HURTS! > >> > >> I too rearranged territory but only after the > aggression became > >> horrible. It did nothing either way. (I made > more spaces, no > >> difference. I made less spaces, no difference. > I took all the spaces > >> out completely, no difference.) Grrr. > >> > >> Any ideas? > >> > >> > >> > >> -----Original Message----- > >> From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > >> On Behalf Of Steve Szabo > >> Sent: Monday, June 06, 2005 10:17 PM > >> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > >> Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Its war in there! > >> > >> > >> Nick, > >> > >> 400W heater? What size tank do you have? > >> > >> Generally, you want to size the heater so you > have 2-5 Watts per gallon, > >> depending on how much you need to raise the water > above the ambient > >> temperature. Right now, your tank is a bit on the > warm side for the fish > >> you list, Turn down the thermostat a bit. You'll > be looking to get a > >> range of 24-25^o C. for your fish. Not much > cooler, but enough to slow > >> the fish down a bit. If you do have the need for > larger heaters, then it > >> is normally prudent to buy two heaters, each of > half the wattage you > >> need for the tank. This will serve to save you > from coming home one day > >> to bouillabaisse should one get out of line and > stay on continuously. > >> The other will not come on, unless it is needed > to bring the tank up to > >> the set temperature, and one alone will not be > enough to overheat the > >> tank. > >> > >> You don't mention how many fish you have of each > species, but I'd guess > >> you only have one cory. You should have at least > 5 tiger barbs to cut > >> down on aggression of the barbs to other fish. > >> > >> Moving the décor of the tank around is probably > your biggest contributor > >> to the current aggression you are seeing. > Everyone's territory is gone, > >> and they are in the process of establishing new > territories. Once this > >> has been done, the aggression will die back to > its former level. > >> > >> In the grouping of fish you have, the massive > water change probably has > >> done little to add to the aggression, but it may > prompt the barbs into > >> spawning behavior, which will make them more > active, but not necessarily > >> more aggressive. > >> > >> A change in the diet should not prompt any kind > of aggressive behavior > >> with your fish. > >> > >> > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > > I love my mated pair of True Percula clownfish! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > when replying, thanks > > . > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text > that is not important to > > the reply and if changing the topic of the > original message modify the > > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <-, we Thank You > > in Advance for your help in this matter > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12212	From: hnorton1cogeco.ca	Date: 6/8/2005
Subject: filter debate/Cant find the groups/Heather Norton

Mike How do I find these groups looked but no such groups Heather Norton? I still make all my own filters. I do buy pumps, but making filters is part of the fun of the hobby. And they a cheaper and 'better' IMO :) tim Tim is right, Making your own aquatic stuff is fun and cheap!There are at least three yahoo groups for building your own aquariums and filters etc.Mike [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12213	From: hnorton1cogeco.ca	Date: 6/8/2005
Subject: Common Plecos /Heather Norton

Steve thanks for this info I am going to getting all the info I can on them I hope to get two for my tank ,It is thirty five gals do you recommend several verities or maybe just one to go with my Angels .As for them eating wood I always keep driftwood from the shops for my tanks .I feel they add the by products since as they age they leach into the water am I right .Not to mention the nice affect it gives and my fish seem to play a lot around it Heather Norton Heather, Some plecos can grow quite large, while others will grow no larger than 3-4 inches. It really depends on the species. However, there are so many pleco species that have a similar color pattern, it can be difficult to tell them apart.As for eating anything they can get into their mouths, not true either.Plecos are herbivores for the most part, though they are not adverse to a little meat in the diet. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12214	From: Karen	Date: 6/8/2005
Subject: Re: filter debate

Eheims are extremely expensive especially if you get it at LFS. For a filter that is every bit as good as an Eheim but costs a lot less, try Rena's Filstar XP3. It is a little noisier than an Eheim, hums a little. If you have it in a cabinet, you will never hear it. It is simple to clean and runs flawlessly. They had a few problems several years ago but seem to have fixed everything. The holes on the spray bar need to be drilled out a little to keep from whislting but I've had the same problem with Eheims. I currently run an XP3 alone on my 100 gal (see photo section, Karen's) and an XP2 with an AC300 on my 55 gal. I have African cichlids in both tanks. The best online prices I've found are www.bigalsonline.com and Petsmart.com (google for use a 20% off coupon), occasionaly petsolutions.com and thatfishplace.com. BTW, never buy anything online before checking Petsmart.com prices with the 20% off or free shipping. They run both promotions all the time. I highly recommend a cannister filter for a big tank. I'm setting a trickle wet/dry on my new 75 but that's only because it came with the set-up. They do a poor job at mechanical filtration but an excellent job at biological filtration. I don't know about other Yahoo aquarist groups but cichlid-forum.com as a lot of good info on DIY. Karen --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Nicolas Munro" <nmunro@q...> wrote: > My experience Ehiem being a international brand name costs a lot more for > doing the same thing a nonbrand filter can do. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: <Crazy4fids@a...> > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Wednesday, June 08, 2005 3:23 AM > Subject: [AquaticLife] filter debate > > > > We are all moved into our new house! I have all my aquarium supplies > > except > > the tank, stand and the filters. I was planning on using two emperor > > 400's, > > but in doing more research, they are only recommended up to 70 gallons. > > Two > > emperors would only get me 140 gallons and my tank is 150. The people at > > the store highly recommended an Ehiem. I would be going with a 2028 > > model and > > adding an emperor 400 on top of the Ehiem. > > > > Does anyone have any experience with the Ehiem filters? Are they worth > > the > > extra money? I used to have a 350 magnum and I absolutely hated > > cleaning > > the damn thing. I had a chance to take apart and assemble one of the > > Ehiems > > and it seemed pretty simple. The parts seemed more sturdy than the parts > > on > > the magnum. > > > > Any input would greatly be appreciated. > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > Linda > > River Falls, WI > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > > . > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > > in Advance for your help in this matter > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12215	From: Trevor Holyoak	Date: 6/8/2005
Subject: Re: filter debate

There is also www.drsfostersmith.com . (They used to be Pet Warehouse.) They have similar prices to Big Al's, but they tend to ship faster. I sometimes fill shopping carts at both sites and then go with the one that ends up being cheapest after shipping is added. :D The Petsmart promotions are usually only for first-time customers, as I recall, and they usually still can't compete with the 2 sites mentioned above. - Trevor Karen wrote: > Eheims are extremely expensive especially if you get it at LFS. For > a filter that is every bit as good as an Eheim but costs a lot less, > try Rena's Filstar XP3. It is a little noisier than an Eheim, hums a > little. If you have it in a cabinet, you will never hear it. It is > simple to clean and runs flawlessly. They had a few problems several > years ago but seem to have fixed everything. The holes on the spray > bar need to be drilled out a little to keep from whislting but I've > had the same problem with Eheims. I currently run an XP3 alone on my > 100 gal (see photo section, Karen's) and an XP2 with an AC300 on my > 55 gal. I have African cichlids in both tanks. The best online > prices I've found are www.bigalsonline.com and Petsmart.com (google > for use a 20% off coupon), occasionaly petsolutions.com and > thatfishplace.com. BTW, never buy anything online before checking > Petsmart.com prices with the 20% off or free shipping. They run both > promotions all the time. > I highly recommend a cannister filter for a big tank. I'm setting a > trickle wet/dry on my new 75 but that's only because it came with > the set-up. They do a poor job at mechanical filtration but an > excellent job at biological filtration. > > I don't know about other Yahoo aquarist groups but cichlid-forum.com > as a lot of good info on DIY. > > Karen > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Nicolas Munro" <nmunro@q...> > wrote: > > My experience Ehiem being a international brand name costs a lot > more for > > doing the same thing a nonbrand filter can do. > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: <Crazy4fids@a...> > > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > > Sent: Wednesday, June 08, 2005 3:23 AM > > Subject: [AquaticLife] filter debate > > > > > > > We are all moved into our new house! I have all my aquarium > supplies > > > except > > > the tank, stand and the filters. I was planning on using two > emperor > > > 400's, > > > but in doing more research, they are only recommended up to 70 > gallons. > > > Two > > > emperors would only get me 140 gallons and my tank is 150. The > people at > > > the store highly recommended an Ehiem. I would be going with a > 2028 > > > model and > > > adding an emperor 400 on top of the Ehiem. > > > > > > Does anyone have any experience with the Ehiem filters? Are > they worth > > > the > > > extra money? I used to have a 350 magnum and I absolutely > hated > > > cleaning > > > the damn thing. I had a chance to take apart and assemble one > of the > > > Ehiems > > > and it seemed pretty simple. The parts seemed more sturdy than > the parts > > > on > > > the magnum. > > > > > > Any input would greatly be appreciated. > > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > Linda > > > River Falls, WI > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks > > > . > > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not > important to > > > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message > modify the > > > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we > Thank You > > > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not > important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original > message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > *Yahoo! Groups Links* > > * To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>. > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12216	From: angelasjenkins@comcast.net	Date: 6/8/2005
Subject: Tank Cleaning

I have a friend who has a beautiful fish tank and never, ever cleans it or changes the water. She tops it off and changes the filter pad. I change 10% of water weekly, vacuum the gravel, and maintain the filter. I've had a few fish losses within the past few months, she hasn't. Should I stop messing with it? Thanks, Angela [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12217	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/8/2005
Subject: Re: Succesful fishless cycle using....

I havn't seen any ammonia products in store where I live, where did you buy the 'Clear Ammonia' and how much? =Nick Brisbane, Australia ----- Original Message ----- From: "Eric Miner" <eminer1254@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wednesday, June 08, 2005 1:40 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] Succesful fishless cycle using.... > Hello All, > > Thought I'd post about the fishless cycle I just finished up. > > This is my first tank in many, many years - 46gl bowfront. After doing > a lot of research I decided to do a fishless cycle. 1) because I > didn't want to stress any fish and 2) my experience in culturing and > keep yeast strains for homebrewing gave me a bit of knowledge on how > to keep and feed a colony of one celled critters. > > On May 23 I started the cycle by adding a dose of Bio-Spira (the 90 > gal. size) and 16ml of 'clear ammonia'. Of course the ammonia spike > was immediate and was around 2-3ppm. This is a bit lower than some > folks shoot for but I didn't want to kill the bacteria I had added. > The ammonia stayed high for about 72 hours. Once it began to drop I > started adding 12 'drop' of ammonia a day. As expected the ammonia > level dropped steadily. About a week later it was low and the nitrite > spike started. It peak 24hrs later and was done to a comfortable level > in about 32 hrs. On Sunday June 6th I added 6 Panda Corys and 3 Amano > shrimp. They're all happy with the tank and the Pandas started > cleaning the substrate and playing around about 45 mins after I added > them. > > All levels remain steady in a comfortable zone. > > Thought you'd like know > > Later, > > Eric > Charlotte, NC > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12218	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/8/2005
Subject: Re: Tank Cleaning

Angela, could you supply some more information about her setup and your setup as this would help the group provide better quality comments. Ie: Filter equipment, heater, type of substrates, number of fish and types and more inportantly the size of her tank and your tank. =Nick ----- Original Message ----- From: <angelasjenkins@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Thursday, June 09, 2005 7:59 AM Subject: [AquaticLife] Tank Cleaning > > I have a friend who has a beautiful fish tank and never, ever cleans it or > changes the water. She tops it off and changes the filter pad. I change > 10% of water weekly, vacuum the gravel, and maintain the filter. I've had > a few fish losses within the past few months, she hasn't. Should I stop > messing with it? > > Thanks, > Angela > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12219	From: Karen	Date: 6/8/2005
Subject: Re: filter debate

The Petsmart coupons are usually not for first time customers. I've used it many times. The code changes so you have to do a search everytime for "Petsmart coupon". Some promotions are for 20% when your order is over $80, or free shipping if over $50, etc. Right now all they have is $10 off $60 "JUNESPECIAL", and 10% off $50 "DISCTEN". Drsfostersmith is good too. They were one of the first internet sites over 5 years ago for cat and dog items. Good customer service too. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Trevor Holyoak <trevor@h...> wrote: > There is also www.drsfostersmith.com . (They used to be Pet Warehouse.) > They have similar prices to Big Al's, but they tend to ship faster. I > sometimes fill shopping carts at both sites and then go with the one > that ends up being cheapest after shipping is added. :D > > The Petsmart promotions are usually only for first-time customers, as I > recall, and they usually still can't compete with the 2 sites mentioned > above. > > - Trevor > > Karen wrote: > > > Eheims are extremely expensive especially if you get it at LFS. For > > a filter that is every bit as good as an Eheim but costs a lot less, > > try Rena's Filstar XP3. It is a little noisier than an Eheim, hums a > > little. If you have it in a cabinet, you will never hear it. It is > > simple to clean and runs flawlessly. They had a few problems several > > years ago but seem to have fixed everything. The holes on the spray > > bar need to be drilled out a little to keep from whislting but I've > > had the same problem with Eheims. I currently run an XP3 alone on my > > 100 gal (see photo section, Karen's) and an XP2 with an AC300 on my > > 55 gal. I have African cichlids in both tanks. The best online > > prices I've found are www.bigalsonline.com and Petsmart.com (google > > for use a 20% off coupon), occasionaly petsolutions.com and > > thatfishplace.com. BTW, never buy anything online before checking > > Petsmart.com prices with the 20% off or free shipping. They run both > > promotions all the time. > > I highly recommend a cannister filter for a big tank. I'm setting a > > trickle wet/dry on my new 75 but that's only because it came with > > the set-up. They do a poor job at mechanical filtration but an > > excellent job at biological filtration. > > > > I don't know about other Yahoo aquarist groups but cichlid- forum.com > > as a lot of good info on DIY. > > > > Karen > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Nicolas Munro" <nmunro@q...> > > wrote: > > > My experience Ehiem being a international brand name costs a lot > > more for > > > doing the same thing a nonbrand filter can do. > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: <Crazy4fids@a...> > > > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > > > Sent: Wednesday, June 08, 2005 3:23 AM > > > Subject: [AquaticLife] filter debate > > > > > > > > > > We are all moved into our new house! I have all my aquarium > > supplies > > > > except > > > > the tank, stand and the filters. I was planning on using two > > emperor > > > > 400's, > > > > but in doing more research, they are only recommended up to 70 > > gallons. > > > > Two > > > > emperors would only get me 140 gallons and my tank is 150. The > > people at > > > > the store highly recommended an Ehiem. I would be going with a > > 2028 > > > > model and > > > > adding an emperor 400 on top of the Ehiem. > > > > > > > > Does anyone have any experience with the Ehiem filters? Are > > they worth > > > > the > > > > extra money? I used to have a 350 magnum and I absolutely > > hated > > > > cleaning > > > > the damn thing. I had a chance to take apart and assemble one > > of the > > > > Ehiems > > > > and it seemed pretty simple. The parts seemed more sturdy than > > the parts > > > > on > > > > the magnum. > > > > > > > > Any input would greatly be appreciated. > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > > > Linda > > > > River Falls, WI > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > > thanks > > > > . > > > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not > > important to > > > > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message > > modify the > > > > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- , we > > Thank You > > > > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > > . > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not > > important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original > > message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > > subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------- ------- > > *Yahoo! Groups Links* > > > > * To visit your group on the web, go to: > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > > Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>. > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12220	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/8/2005
Subject: Re: Common Plecos /Heather Norton

Yahoo! Decided to send a malformed RECPT TO: command to my mail server, so no mail got delivered to me today from at least this group, so I am using the lousy web interface to scan messages that I missed. "As for them eating wood I always keep driftwood from the shops for my tanks .I feel they add the by products since as they age they leach into the water am I right" Actually, it seems they need the cellulose or other product found when eating the wood. What leaches into your tank is primarily tannins, which discolor the water and do turn it more acidic (lower pH). This can actually be detrimental to the pleco, as many come from streams that tend to have a higher pH than many of the more common South American fish live in. \\Steve// Give a man a match, and he'll be warm for a minute. But set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12221	From: paul helms	Date: 6/8/2005
Subject: Re: Tank Cleaning

YES! i don't know how may times i have said that on this group to be shot down --- angelasjenkins@... wrote: > > I have a friend who has a beautiful fish tank and > never, ever cleans it or changes the water. She > tops it off and changes the filter pad. I change > 10% of water weekly, vacuum the gravel, and maintain > the filter. I've had a few fish losses within the > past few months, she hasn't. Should I stop messing > with it? > > Thanks, > Angela > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Have fun online with music videos, cool games, IM and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/online.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12222	From: Tim Fairchild	Date: 6/8/2005
Subject: Re: Tank Cleaning

On Thursday 09 Jun 2005 13:04, paul helms wrote: > YES! i don't know how may times i have said that on > this group to be shot down I've had a fair amount of luck with tanks that I don't clean or change the water (up to 3 years) tho after a while doing top-ups I think you need a good water change, which doesn't seem to worry things either once there's plenty of bacteria in the bio-media and the gravel. In this case there is a risk of disturbing the bacteria if you change the filter media and clean the gravel too well. I have course bio-media in my wet dry that I never really clean... And I don't clean the gravel that well either. tim > --- angelasjenkins@... wrote: > > I have a friend who has a beautiful fish tank and > > never, ever cleans it or changes the water. She > > tops it off and changes the filter pad. I change > > 10% of water weekly, vacuum the gravel, and maintain > > the filter. I've had a few fish losses within the > > past few months, she hasn't. Should I stop messing > > with it? > > > > Thanks, > > Angela > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > __________________________________ > Discover Yahoo! > Have fun online with music videos, cool games, IM and more. Check it out! > http://discover.yahoo.com/online.html > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links > > > -- --------------------------------------------------------- Tim & Therese Fairchild Atchafalaya Border Collies. Kuttabul, Queensland, Australia. --------------------------------------------------------- Email mailto:tim@... Homepage http://www.bcs4me.com Photos http://www.pbase.com/amosf ---------------------------------------------------------

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12223	From: TankGurl	Date: 6/8/2005
Subject: Re: filter debate

I use Emperor BioWheel 400's on both my tanks now, after running a Fluval canister system for years. I couldn't be happier. Water is crystal clear, tanks are stable, maintence is virtually hassle free. I'd never go back to a cannister setup again. Too each her own I guess. :) Kelly -- 65g Malawi http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 135g Frontosa/Tang http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12224	From: angelasjenkins@comcast.net	Date: 6/9/2005
Subject: Re: Tank Cleaning

Then how do I keep the nitrates down? The tend to go up in the danger zone (above 60) within a week. I'm not feeding too much and have lots of plants. What do you suggest? Does your opinion change for a small tank - 10 gallons? Thanks, Angela -------------- Original message -------------- YES! i don't know how may times i have said that on this group to be shot down --- angelasjenkins@... wrote: > > I have a friend who has a beautiful fish tank and > never, ever cleans it or changes the water. She > tops it off and changes the filter pad. I change > 10% of water weekly, vacuum the gravel, and maintain > the filter. I've had a few fish losses within the > past few months, she hasn't. Should I stop messing > with it? > > Thanks, > Angela > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Have fun online with music videos, cool games, IM and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/online.html Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12225	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 6/9/2005
Subject: Re: Tank Cleaning

Small tanks are very vulnerable to lack of maintenance. Large tanks can withstand a lot more then we could imagine. If you do not overfeed and do not overstock, then you could have the bacteria that converts Nitrates to Nitrogen gas develop in the tank. Vacuuming the gravel will not promote these bacteria but there is a 1 in a 100 chance that a tank can be self sustaining. It usually happens with people who do not care about the aquariums and keep replacing the fish that die until one fine day the balance is set and they don't lose a fish and the bacteria keep everything under control. If your friend dare clean her tank now, it could cause more problems then a new tank itself. The Idea is: A Large water body can sustain a small amount of livestock but a small body will not be able to sustain even smaller amounts of live stock. Ofcourse a lot depends on live stock as well. I have seen goldfish live in a 1 gallon tank for over 1 year without a filter and without a water change. This does not mean that these are perfect environment for the fish. the individual may survive but it might be going thru a lot of stress. Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of angelasjenkins@... Sent: 09 June 2005 13:48 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Tank Cleaning Then how do I keep the nitrates down? The tend to go up in the danger zone (above 60) within a week. I'm not feeding too much and have lots of plants. What do you suggest? Does your opinion change for a small tank - 10 gallons? Thanks, Angela -------------- Original message -------------- YES! i don't know how may times i have said that on this group to be shot down --- angelasjenkins@... wrote: > > I have a friend who has a beautiful fish tank and > never, ever cleans it or changes the water. She > tops it off and changes the filter pad. I change > 10% of water weekly, vacuum the gravel, and maintain > the filter. I've had a few fish losses within the > past few months, she hasn't. Should I stop messing > with it? > > Thanks, > Angela > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Have fun online with music videos, cool games, IM and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/online.html Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter _____ Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12226	From: TankGurl	Date: 6/9/2005
Subject: Re: Tank Cleaning

On 6/9/05, angelasjenkins@... <angelasjenkins@...> wrote: > Then how do I keep the nitrates down? The tend to go up in the danger zone (above 60) within a week. I'm not feeding too much and have lots of plants. What do you suggest? Does your opinion change for a small tank - 10 gallons? You'll have to stick with a regular water change schedule. A 5 gallon water change should only take you about 5 mins or so. As already stated, larger tanks *can* survive without water changes, but IMO, it's not condusive to healthy fish. (Especially if you want them to grow and breed) Smaller tanks with multiple fish do need fresh water. Kelly -- 65g Malawi http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 135g Frontosa/Tang http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12227	From: minnesotagal866	Date: 6/9/2005
Subject: keeping tropicals outdoors in summer

Does anyone do this? I brought my danios and white clouds outdoors Memorial Day. I asked about mystery fish, and then talked to a friend who has a aquarium cleaning business--he says that my danios spawned and I have babies. I only put three in so didn't even know if I had a pair (obviously I did). Still haven't seen the distinctive markings of the zebra danios though, although I haven't messed with them in a couple of days. My fish are in heaven outdoors. I have a 35 gallon black whiskey barrel liner. I have several bunches of anachris at the bottom, then I put a pot of water lilies, a water iris, a pot of forget me nots, and 2 water hycaniths (sp)? It's 50-60% covered on the surface. I do feed every day but very little and only a few fish come up. I am going to use some for feeders, my newts love fish and somehow are able to catch white clouds, probably while they are sleeping. And hopefully my iridescant shark will leave my other fish alone if I put some danios in--he ate the previous danios and left the others alone. I am hoping to find someone in the area (Boston) who needs some feeders or perhaps trade some in if any stores around here want them. My husband will take some white clouds to school in the fall. BTW, the white clouds are absolutely gorgeous outdoors, I can't tell you how much the colors come out. These are fish that are loving the sun. This winter I'm probably going to have to bring in the container to hold all the fish--or buy a new aquarium . . . hmmmmm . . . not a bad idea. Jackie

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12228	From: Eric Miner	Date: 6/9/2005
Subject: Re: Succesful fishless cycle using....

I got it at Walmart which is a big low-price retailer here. Any large retailer of groceries and cleaning materials ought to have it. I spent about $2Us on it Eric --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Nicolas Munro" <nmunro@q...> wrote: > I havn't seen any ammonia products in store where I live, where did you buy > the 'Clear Ammonia' and how much? > =Nick > Brisbane, Australia > > ----- Original Message -----

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12229	From: Eric Miner	Date: 6/9/2005
Subject: First media change after cycling?

Hello All, It's time to change my filter media for the first time after cycling my tank. I'm concerned that a lot of the bacteria is in the media. Should I gently squeeze it a bit into the tank? Or, just toss it? Thanks Eric

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12230	From: Patrick	Date: 6/9/2005
Subject: Re: First media change after cycling?

Get a half gallon of tank water and wash the filter media out in it and then return it to the filter. You don't have to replace it until it starts to fall apart. The main purpose of the filter floss is not to catch stuff as much as to hold bacteria, so if you wash the stuff out of it ever month or so, it should last for a while. That is also the cheap way to do it. :) Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill -------Original Message------- Hello All, It's time to change my filter media for the first time after cycling my tank. I'm concerned that a lot of the bacteria is in the media. Should I gently squeeze it a bit into the tank? Or, just toss it? Thanks Eric [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12231	From: Karen	Date: 6/9/2005
Subject: Re: Tank Cleaning

Just a note on this subject. A high nitrate level is an indication that your biological filtration is working very well. Nitrate is the end product of the N cycle except for some elemental N conversion by plant uptake. You may think that you are not feeding too much or that your tank is not overstocked. But a small tank cannot tolerate very much waste. Remember the old saying "Dilution is the solution to pollution". We are dealing with a type of water pollution here. Some fish are hardier than others and will tolerate the high levels. But it will stress them and eventually cause permanent damage. I see two options; continue with frequent water changes and risk upsetting your fish and/or water chemistry, or secondly, move up to a larger tank size. I'd say move up to a larger tank, hence the dilution part of the phrase. Good luck. $.02 --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, TankGurl <fishgoddess@g...> wrote: > On 6/9/05, angelasjenkins@c... <angelasjenkins@c...> wrote: > > Then how do I keep the nitrates down? The tend to go up in the danger zone (above 60) within a week. I'm not feeding too much and have lots of plants. What do you suggest? Does your opinion change for a small tank - 10 gallons? > > > You'll have to stick with a regular water change schedule. A 5 gallon > water change should only take you about 5 mins or so. As already > stated, larger tanks *can* survive without water changes, but IMO, > it's not condusive to healthy fish. (Especially if you want them to > grow and breed) Smaller tanks with multiple fish do need fresh water. > > Kelly > > -- > 65g Malawi > http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 > 135g Frontosa/Tang > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12232	From: Karen	Date: 6/9/2005
Subject: Re: First media change after cycling?

Kinda depends on what type media and filter we are talking about. If you have sponges and filter floss, then replace the filter floss and leave the sponges alone or if you have more than one, rotate them ( move the bottom to the top). If you have just sponges then squeeze the excess out in the sink without rinsing and return to the filter. What filter are you running with what media? BTW, I use polyfill from Wal-Mart for filter floss. Works great, cheap, cut to fit your application. Just be sure to get the polyester, not cotton. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Patrick" <patrickmn@c...> wrote: > Get a half gallon of tank water and wash the filter media out in it and then > return it to the filter. You don't have to replace it until it starts to > fall apart. The main purpose of the filter floss is not to catch stuff as > much as to hold bacteria, so if you wash the stuff out of it ever month or > so, it should last for a while. That is also the cheap way to do it. :) > > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy. > > "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is > perhaps, the end of the beginning." > -Winston Churchill > -------Original Message------- > Hello All, > > It's time to change my filter media for the first time after cycling > my tank. I'm concerned that a lot of the bacteria is in the media. > Should I gently squeeze it a bit into the tank? Or, just toss it? > > Thanks > Eric > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12233	From: Nan	Date: 6/9/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies

Hi Dan! This is just for clarification and is being posted with no ill will or malice involved. I can say that yes, 8 gallons is far to small to allow for a mix of male/female or male/male bettas, even planted. You run the risk of the more aggressive of the bunch either harrassing or harming the others, even in a well planted tank because they must rise to the top for air often. And that, unfortunately, is from my own experience. However, if you wish to keep all females in a well planted tank then I agree, there is no problem. Males tend to be somewhat snottish and will either be killed by an aggressive female or kill the females, even with someplace to hide. Males and females unless they are spawning should not be kept together. But as I have heard it stated here time and again "what works for you, works for you...what works for me, works for me..." and if it works for you (which in this case it did not), then by all means I wish only the best for you! Have a great day, all! Oh and Dan, I love that BEST FISHES..*Grin* Nice Touch!!*grin* ~nan~ Dan <dcreator2k4@...> wrote: I 1st want to say that this is not an attack, just a difference of opinion on the tank size, all other info is exact in my opinion. Now all I want to really say is that an 8 gallon tank is NOT too small for three BETTA, especially since two of them were female. The tank is supposedly also filled with numerous plants for the BETTA to hide, so the 8 gallon should be ok, even for the fry to grow into - as long as there will be only one male in it. Best Fishes, Dan (thaSkorpeon) --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Nan <ntalb00@y...> wrote: > Hey, Nim! > > First off, an 8 gallon is far, far to small to house 2 female and a male betta. That is very cool that they spawned, and yes the fry are more than likely living off of the infusoria that is comeing from the snails. > > Yes, do feed them the powdered fry food for livebearers, also, you might want to give them some decapped BBS eggs, or you can give them frozen Brine Shrimp, a very small amount. If you have any guppy fry you can put a couple in there to help teach your Betta fry to come to the top for the flake food. Makes the transition easier and they will get along. > > You still have several weeks (when they start fussing then seperate them, otherwise they are fine, really!) before you have to worry about moving them around. Actually, you might get lucky and they might be all female at which point you won't have to move them. A sure indicator of having to move them is when you catch them harrassing others of the same species, and that won't happen until you can see color on them and that is usually (in my expierence) at about 3 to 4 weeks old. > > And if you have a good filtration system going, no don't worry about doing a full water chance, maybe a partial in a couple of weeks (like 10%, then the next week about 20% after that).m If you don't have a good filtration system on there, then buy a sponge filter. It will work fine, and keep you from haveing to do a big water change. > > Hope this helps. > > Nan > > Nimish Mathur <nimmat4@y...> wrote: > Guys, > About 3 weeks ago, I had a male betta and 2 females in a tank with loads of > hiding space and it was going fine and suddenly next day morning all 3 were > found dead :-s. > Sad, but I fished them out but did not shut off the tank as I did not really > have time to do anything to it or even test why it happened. Yesterday, > while watching TV, I noticed some movement in the tank. On close inspection > I noticed a fry. I inspected in the morning as well and finally counted 4 > fry. They are about 1cm long and seem to be feeding well on .. Hmm. Don't > know exactly what. There is a flurry of Trumpet snails and ramshorn in there > and I think that is what kept the fry growing by creating infusoria. > My questions are: > They are big enough to be able to take powdered fry food so when is the best time to start? There seems to be enough microscopic food in the tank. > When will be a best time to separate them to prevent them from fighting or > cannibalizing on each other? > There are loads of plants in the tank and it is a 8 gallon tank. Do I need > to change water? Or is there anything special to do? > I believe that the time when they need baby brine shrimp has passed as these > are a bit bigger then newly born guppy fry. > Thanks, > > Nim __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12234	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 6/9/2005
Subject: The San Diego Tropical Fish Society , 6/12/2005, 7:00 pm

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife The San Diego Tropical Fish Society Sunday June 12, 2005 7:00 pm - 8:00 pm This event repeats on the second Sunday of every month. Event Location: room 101, Casa Del Prado, Balboa Park at 7:00 PM Street: SAN DIEGO TROPICAL FISH SOCIETY, PO Box 4156, North Park Station City, State, Zip: San Diego, CA 92164 Phone: 619-281-FISH Notes: http://www.geocities.com/sandiegofishfan/ You are cordially invited to attend our next meeting in room 101, Casa Del Prado, Balboa Park at 7:00 PM on the second Sunday of the month. Visitors are always welcome! 619-281-FISH Yahoo! Greetings Send a Yahoo! Greeting. Birthday Reminders Set up birthday reminders! ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12235	From: Amanda	Date: 6/9/2005
Subject: Re: Tank Cleaning...My Situation...& A ?

I have a 55 gallon that I hadn't done water changes in for at least 2 months.(With no fish loss.) I have 130 gallons worth of filtration on it. It is clear and the levels are great. My only problem is the filters have to be rinsed/replaced a lot more. On my 30 gallon filter that is on there.. the filter gets stopped up with slime in a week, or less. (Is there a solution to the slime problem?) I love my tank now that I have all of this filtration. Before I HAD to do water changes once a week. This was with 60 gallons of filtration. When I finally did a water change tonight, it didn't really seem to need it. The gravel was really clean. The only reason that I did do a water change tonight was to see if it would cut down on the slime problem. I would love to stray away from water changes, but if there is no way to cut back on the slime problem, I may have to stick with them... The filters are a lot more expensive than a little hard work. (If the water change fixes the slime problem.) Is this good bacteria, or just plain useless slime? If anyone has any suggestions on the slime problem they would be greatly appreciated!! I also have a brackish tank.. 10 gallons with a green spotted puffer, a couple snails(that have survived him so far,) and a couple clams. I have never done a water change in this tank, and the levels are great, the water is clear, and most importantly my puffer (Meatball,) is happy. I don't have a slime problem on these filters. I suppose that is the salt playing into things though. I only change the filters in this tank once a month, and everything stays nice and clear, and clean, and the levels are always perfect! Also, thanks for the advice on the guppy breeder tank. I have a 30 gallon with the baby turtles in it, and just left the feeder guppies that survived their rath, put in a lot of plants, and I have tons of guppy babies. Also, a crayfish that is in that tank has eggs!!!! (Puffer food!!) I guess it really did turn into a breeder tank!! Thanks to all!! Mandy --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, angelasjenkins@c... wrote: > > I have a friend who has a beautiful fish tank and never, ever cleans it or changes the water. She tops it off and changes the filter pad. I change 10% of water weekly, vacuum the gravel, and maintain the filter. I've had a few fish losses within the past few months, she hasn't. Should I stop messing with it? > > Thanks, > Angela > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12236	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/9/2005
Subject: Re: First media change after cycling?

To simplyfy what they are trying to achive... > Get a half gallon of tank water and wash the filter media out in it and > then > return it to the filter. Dont use tap water to clean the media cause it contains Chlorine or similar which kills the benificial bacteria. Hence the use of tank water . =Nick ----- Original Message ----- From: "Patrick" <patrickmn@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Friday, June 10, 2005 6:09 AM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] First media change after cycling? > Get a half gallon of tank water and wash the filter media out in it and > then > return it to the filter. You don't have to replace it until it starts to > fall apart. The main purpose of the filter floss is not to catch stuff as > much as to hold bacteria, so if you wash the stuff out of it ever month or > so, it should last for a while. That is also the cheap way to do it. :) > > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy. > > "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it > is > perhaps, the end of the beginning." > -Winston Churchill > -------Original Message------- > Hello All, > > It's time to change my filter media for the first time after cycling > my tank. I'm concerned that a lot of the bacteria is in the media. > Should I gently squeeze it a bit into the tank? Or, just toss it? > > Thanks > Eric > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12237	From: paul helms	Date: 6/9/2005
Subject: Re: Tank Cleaning

if your tak gets in the dangerous zone in a week you are either overfeeding or have a lot of decaying plant material --- TankGurl <fishgoddess@...> wrote: > On 6/9/05, angelasjenkins@... > <angelasjenkins@...> wrote: > > Then how do I keep the nitrates down? The tend to > go up in the danger zone (above 60) within a week. > I'm not feeding too much and have lots of plants. > What do you suggest? Does your opinion change for a > small tank - 10 gallons? > > > You'll have to stick with a regular water change > schedule. A 5 gallon > water change should only take you about 5 mins or > so. As already > stated, larger tanks *can* survive without water > changes, but IMO, > it's not condusive to healthy fish. (Especially if > you want them to > grow and breed) Smaller tanks with multiple fish do > need fresh water. > > Kelly > > -- > 65g Malawi > http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 > 135g Frontosa/Tang > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011 > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Stay in touch with email, IM, photo sharing and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/stayintouch.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12238	From: paul helms	Date: 6/9/2005
Subject: Re: Tank Cleaning

no my opinion/experience doe snot change on a small tank, but there is something causing that spike, either you are in fact overffeding, despite your belief, or you have a lot of decaying plant material, or you are overcleaning and wiping out bacteria. i am running a 7 gallon sw tank with 0 loss, no water changes in a year, and no protein skimmer --- angelasjenkins@... wrote: > Then how do I keep the nitrates down? The tend to > go up in the danger zone (above 60) within a week. > I'm not feeding too much and have lots of plants. > What do you suggest? Does your opinion change for a > small tank - 10 gallons? > > Thanks, > Angela > > -------------- Original message -------------- > YES! i don't know how may times i have said that on > this group to be shot down > > --- angelasjenkins@... wrote: > > > > > I have a friend who has a beautiful fish tank and > > never, ever cleans it or changes the water. She > > tops it off and changes the filter pad. I change > > 10% of water weekly, vacuum the gravel, and > maintain > > the filter. I've had a few fish losses within the > > past few months, she hasn't. Should I stop > messing > > with it? > > > > Thanks, > > Angela > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > Discover Yahoo! > Have fun online with music videos, cool games, IM > and more. Check it out! > http://discover.yahoo.com/online.html > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when > replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text > that is not important to the reply and if changing > the topic of the original message modify the subject > line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, > we Thank You in Advance for your help in this > matter > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > Terms of Service. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Make Yahoo! your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12239	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 6/9/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies

I just managed to take a pic of the 2-3 week old fry. http://www.nimmat.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10001/picture00006.jpg this is what they were on 4th June http://www.nimmat.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10001/betta%20Fry.JPG Nim [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12240	From: Rei - Raymond Tremor	Date: 6/10/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies

What kind of betta did you breed? What are you feeding them? I was feeding mine with baby brime shrimp and hard boiled egg yolk and sometimes beef heart and also boiled chicken meat shredded. I don't have bettas now cause it is hard work to clean tanks. I like your plants, what kind are they? I bred a crown tail female with a twin tail male. Some of the babies were twin crown tail. I used a 5 galloon tank with anacharis plants and about 4 to 5 inches of water cause I had been told that the babies will survive more if the water level was low cause they have a shorter swim from the bottom to the top. I had 20 babies and they live up to a year (maybe more cause I gave them away when I decided to keep a goldfish tank). Rei - Raymond Tremor LoveMoAko@... -------Original Message------- From: Nimish Mathur Date: 06/09/05 20:47:16 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies I just managed to take a pic of the 2-3 week old fry. http://www.nimmat.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10001/picture00006.jpg this is what they were on 4th June http://www.nimmat.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10001/betta%20Fry.JPG Nim [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12241	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 6/10/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies

Rei, This was actually by accident. 2 double tail females with a very standard male and I don’t know which one of the 2 had spawned coz all 3 of them died after spawning :-( I have not fed them anything special at the moment infact I have not yet put any food in the tank. My guess was that the snails created infusoria that fed the fry and if they managed to survive a couple of weeks without me noticing them then something must have been right. I have some fine powdered high protein fry food that I will start from today as I think they are big enough to take this food. I have already seen one of the fry pull out a baby snail from their shell, so maybe that is another source of food for them. The plants are Hygroplhilla polysperma, Java moss, Hydrocotyle and a couple of stems of bacopa and ludwigia with a few hanging crypts and anubias. Nothing is really rooted in that tank as the gravel bottom is just ½ “. I did think about feeding them baby brineshrimp but then I thought that there is no point as the most cruitial stage has passed and they are twice the size of a newly born guppy fry and should be able to take normal food. As you can see that their bellies are still full, so I think there is plenty of what ever they are feeding. Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Rei - Raymond Tremor Sent: 10 June 2005 09:35 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies What kind of betta did you breed? What are you feeding them? I was feeding mine with baby brime shrimp and hard boiled egg yolk and sometimes beef heart and also boiled chicken meat shredded. I don't have bettas now cause it is hard work to clean tanks. I like your plants, what kind are they? I bred a crown tail female with a twin tail male. Some of the babies were twin crown tail. I used a 5 galloon tank with anacharis plants and about 4 to 5 inches of water cause I had been told that the babies will survive more if the water level was low cause they have a shorter swim from the bottom to the top. I had 20 babies and they live up to a year (maybe more cause I gave them away when I decided to keep a goldfish tank). Rei - Raymond Tremor LoveMoAko@... -------Original Message------- From: Nimish Mathur Date: 06/09/05 20:47:16 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies I just managed to take a pic of the 2-3 week old fry. http://www.nimmat.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10001/picture00006.jpg this is what they were on 4th June http://www.nimmat.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10001/betta%20Fry.JPG Nim [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter _____ Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12242	From: Paul N. Chung	Date: 6/10/2005
Subject: filter debate

Hey Linda, I totally agree with Steve. In my opinion, Eheim is the Best canister filter in the market. They are considered to be the BMW of canister filter. Where mechanical, biological and chemical filtration are done. --- Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > Linda, > > I would not hesitate to recommend the Ehiem. Quality > all the way. Be sure > you get the quick disconnects that will help > considerably when cleaning the > filter. > > From what I have seen on this list, Fluval also > makes a nice canister > filter. They seem to have resolved some problems > that were present in the > early models I am most familiar with, so they may be > a good choice as well, > and not as expensive. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... > Sent: Tuesday, June 07, 2005 1:23 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] filter debate > > We are all moved into our new house! I have all my > aquarium supplies > except > the tank, stand and the filters. I was planning on > using two emperor > 400's, > but in doing more research, they are only > recommended up to 70 gallons. > Two > emperors would only get me 140 gallons and my tank > is 150. The people at > the store highly recommended an Ehiem. I would be > going with a 2028 model > and > adding an emperor 400 on top of the Ehiem. > > Does anyone have any experience with the Ehiem > filters? Are they worth the > > extra money? I used to have a 350 magnum and I > absolutely hated cleaning > the damn thing. I had a chance to take apart and > assemble one of the > Ehiems > and it seemed pretty simple. The parts seemed more > sturdy than the parts > on > the magnum. > > Any input would greatly be appreciated. > > > Thanks, > > Linda > River Falls, WI > > Respectfully Yours, Paul N. Chung http://www.geocities.com/p_n_chung/mypage.html http://www.geocities.com/filipinofish/My_page.html __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Have fun online with music videos, cool games, IM and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/online.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12243	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/10/2005
Subject: OT: (Sort of) Something to do at the beach

Summer's here for those of us in the northern hemisphere, and I am sure that there will be a number of us headed to the ocean beaches sometime during the summer. Well, here is some fun for the entire family! Imagine going out in search of the tide pools, and spending your time identifying algae! The kids will love you for it! Here is the page to get you started: Algae: The Forgotten Treasure of Tidepools http://www.sonoma.edu/biology/algae/algae.html Hosted by the Department of Biology at Sonoma State University, this informal website explores the fascinating world of algae through a collection of different alga images. The website's three modest galleries feature seaweeds of the Green (Chlorophyta), Red (Rhodophyta), and Brown (Phaeophyta) varieties. Site visitors will find smallish images of such algal species as Ulva taeniata, Nereocystis luetkeana (aka Bullwhip Kelp), Egregia menziesii (aka Feathered Boa), and Pikea robusta. The images are accompanied by brief, and sometimes droll, annotations. >From The NSDL Scout Report for the Life Sciences, Copyright Internet Scout Project 1994-2005. http://scout.wisc.edu/ \\Steve// Give a man a match, and he'll be warm for a minute. But set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12244	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 6/10/2005
Subject: Re: Tank Cleaning

We have never cleaned our tanks, and only once have we had a problem, and that was after we went on vacation and my MIL GROSSLY overfed the fish. We are going on five years now, with no tank cleaning, and the only problem we have had is popeye, which I beleive was caused by an agressive fish picking on the female betta, because when she was moved, the problem went away and there have been no recurrances. Of course, we have a heavily planted tank, and we do trim the plant matter, squish the snails, and skim any gross matter out of the tank, and we let the fish go hungry one day a week. I don't think I'd try it with a tank with plastic plants.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12245	From: Sandra	Date: 6/10/2005
Subject: crabs on live rock. .compatible with cleaner shrimp?

hi everyone, First of all this is a great group, which i just joined, i have been in the hobby for around 3 years and currently owner of a 180 g saltwater tank and a 30g quarantine tank! I was wondering if someone could answer this question. a few weeks ago ago i introduced live rock to my 180 g tank and now i see two crabs that seemed to have grown in this period. One is about one inch long and the other one is a little bigger, have a "sandy" color, but seriously couldnt find what kind of crab that is. I saw one the other day eating a small snail that also came with the live rock. I am pretty concerned if they would kill my cleaner shrimp when getting bigger?? ... waiting for an answer to take em out... lol greetings, sandra

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12246	From: paul helms	Date: 6/11/2005
Subject: Re: crabs on live rock. .compatible with cleaner shrimp?

they were hitchhikers, and like all crabs will eat anything dead. that is why they are great. when snails die they are hell on the tank...huge amount of ammonia involved. can you send a pic? --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@...> wrote: > hi everyone, > > First of all this is a great group, which i just > joined, i have been > in the hobby for around 3 years and currently owner > of a 180 g > saltwater tank and a 30g quarantine tank! > I was wondering if someone could answer this > question. a few weeks ago > ago i introduced live rock to my 180 g tank and now > i see two crabs > that seemed to have grown in this period. One is > about one inch long > and the other one is a little bigger, have a "sandy" > color, but > seriously couldnt find what kind of crab that is. I > saw one the other > day eating a small snail that also came with the > live rock. I am > pretty concerned if they would kill my cleaner > shrimp when getting > bigger?? ... waiting for an answer to take em out... > lol > > greetings, > sandra > > > > > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Stay in touch with email, IM, photo sharing and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/stayintouch.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12247	From: Nan	Date: 6/11/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies

Hey, Nim! Guess what? They are old enough to tell color on them. Turn off all the lights to the aquarium, and any you have around it, just for a couple of minutes. Take a flashlight shine it into the tank where you see them and you will see what color they are going to become. Also, don't be surprised but they come to the light, so if they dart away at first, give them a couple of minutes and they will be drawn back towards you by the light...*chuckle*. Betta fry are drawn to the light normally, so they will come to the flashlight while you try this little trick. And they are pretty cute, little buggers!*LOL* And Nice Pics!!! Nan Nimish Mathur <nimmat4@...> wrote: I just managed to take a pic of the 2-3 week old fry. http://www.nimmat.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10001/picture00006.jpg this is what they were on 4th June http://www.nimmat.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10001/betta%20Fry.JPG Nim --------------------------------- Yahoo! Mail Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12248	From: Nigel Chetcuti	Date: 6/11/2005
Subject: worm like things

I have recently noticed some white dots on the aquarium glass, which at first glance I thought they were only some debris. On a closer examination today, I found out that my aquarium glass is covered with tiny white “creatures” which can be seen sliding around on the glass in a wriggling motion if you look close enough. The size of these things vary from 0.5mm to around 1mm and they are worm-like in shape with the front part thicker and the posterior slimmer, taper in shape. The aquarium water is crystal clear and very well aerated; I have a 1500Litre/hour external filter which is well maintained. I do a 15 - 20% water change every 2 weeks. This is a 260 litres brackish aquarium, with 4 Scats, 4 Monos & 2 Arius. PH is 7.3, SG is 1.01, ammonia and nitrite levels are ok. All the fish seem healthy and happy, very active as usual. The only glitch is that the arius have a very slight fin-rot at the tip of their dorsal fin. Anyone has any idea what these worm-like creatures are, what causes them to flourish so successfully and how I can control them? Thanks for your help NIgel ___________________________________________________________ How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12249	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/11/2005
Subject: Blood Parrots eat Black Skirts?

We went out of town Tuesday morning and returned last night. At 1 AM, one of the first things on my to do list is to check on the tank only to find that one of my black skirt tetras is MIA. OK, so I fed the tank Tuesday morning and not at all Wednesday or Thursday...would my blood parrot be THAT hungry? And if so, HOW can he fit that tall, skinny fish into his perfectly round mouth? I took in the possibility that he died so I moved the tank items around but no tetra. Thought by some odd chance he flopped out of the back opening; but again, no tetra on the floor or anywhere near. Any ideas? Very hungry blood parrot? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12250	From: Eric Miner	Date: 6/11/2005
Subject: Re: First media change after cycling?

I'm using a Penguin 350 Bio-Wheell from Marineland. It has two meadia 'pads' which have the fiber type media and some carbon. i went a head and squeezed one of them into the tank and then replaced it with a new one. I don't think I'll do that very often Thanks Eric --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Karen" <oilfield_brat@y...> wrote: > Kinda depends on what type media and filter we are talking about.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12251	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/11/2005
Subject: Re: worm like things

It sounds as though you may have planaria. Here is a link to a decent article about them: http://tinyurl.com/bhcdf You can follow the instructions there to diminish the population and to prevent further outbreaks. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nigel Chetcuti Sent: Saturday, June 11, 2005 11:15 AM To: Aquatic life Subject: [AquaticLife] worm like things I have recently noticed some white dots on the aquarium glass, which at first glance I thought they were only some debris. On a closer examination today, I found out that my aquarium glass is covered with tiny white "creatures" which can be seen sliding around on the glass in a wriggling motion if you look close enough. The size of these things vary from 0.5mm to around 1mm and they are worm-like in shape with the front part thicker and the posterior slimmer, taper in shape. The aquarium water is crystal clear and very well aerated; I have a 1500Litre/hour external filter which is well maintained. I do a 15 - 20% water change every 2 weeks. This is a 260 litres brackish aquarium, with 4 Scats, 4 Monos & 2 Arius. PH is 7.3, SG is 1.01, ammonia and nitrite levels are ok. All the fish seem healthy and happy, very active as usual. The only glitch is that the arius have a very slight fin-rot at the tip of their dorsal fin. Anyone has any idea what these worm-like creatures are, what causes them to flourish so successfully and how I can control them? Thanks for your help NIgel ___________________________________________________________ How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12252	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 6/11/2005
Subject: filter media

In doing research for my ehiem filter...I have come up with a few questions. I am finding that it is cheaper to buy the filter pads and media online. I understand that I need ehfimech. But after that I get a little confused. Aquariumguys.com sells ehfisubstrat and something called substrat pro. Do I need both of these, or do I pick just one? Also, the information on these filters (I am looking at the 2028 model which filters up to 158 gallons) does not say how much filter media I need to purchase to fill the filter baskets. Any help would be greatly appreciated. thanks, Linda River Falls, WI [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12253	From: mike mather	Date: 6/11/2005
Subject: Re: worm like things

Nigel, I just noticed the same kind of worms in my tank housing a bunch of Paradise Fish fry. I've also noticed these little round white dots that zip around the aquarium. I belive all of these stange creatures were introduced in the growing and feeding of Infusoria to my fry. Thats the only thing that makes sense to me. The fry in the tank are only 3 weeks old and I watched one eat a white worm today. The round,white,zippy things are a little to big for the fry now, but soon they will be free lunch. As long as they don't harm the fry, I consider it good eats for them! Mike > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/mobile.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12254	From: mike mather	Date: 6/11/2005
Subject: Re: keeping tropicals outdoors in summer

Jackie, I've got about a 30 gallon aluminum bucket that my grandpa used to take a bath in when he was little,(early 20's). I decided,after reading an artical in the last Tropical Fish Hobbyist Magazine, to use this bucket as an outdoor fish container. Right now I,ve got some gravel and some Bicopa and Pigmy sword plants started in the bucket and also some Tadpoles from one of our local creeks(I live in the Mojave Desert on the east side of the Sierra Mountains). Soon I'm going to throw in some Paradise Fish fry that I'm raising and let them enjoy the great outdoors! I think I'm also going to get a kiddie pool at Walmart and make a summer pond out of it.I just love anything to do with ponds,aquariums,fish,plants and the sorts. Good luck with yours! Regards, Mike __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/mobile.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12255	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/12/2005
Subject: Paludariums

A while back, someone asked about paludariums here. I just read the June issue of "Aquarium fish Magazine" this morning, and there was an article on paludariums in the issue. The article gave a fair overview of the topic, which would, at least, lead one to ask the proper questions as they investigate the topic further. \\Steve// Give a man a match, and he'll be warm for a minute. But set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12256	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/12/2005
Subject: Re: keeping tropicals outdoors in summer

If you are going to use a kiddie pool for fish, buy the least expensive one you can find. The very inexpensive ones do not contain algaecides and other *cides in the construction, and are safer for the fish. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of mike mather Sent: Sunday, June 12, 2005 2:58 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] keeping tropicals outdoors in summer Jackie, I've got about a 30 gallon aluminum bucket that my grandpa used to take a bath in when he was little,(early 20's). I decided,after reading an artical in the last Tropical Fish Hobbyist Magazine, to use this bucket as an outdoor fish container. Right now I,ve got some gravel and some Bicopa and Pigmy sword plants started in the bucket and also some Tadpoles from one of our local creeks(I live in the Mojave Desert on the east side of the Sierra Mountains). Soon I'm going to throw in some Paradise Fish fry that I'm raising and let them enjoy the great outdoors! I think I'm also going to get a kiddie pool at Walmart and make a summer pond out of it.I just love anything to do with ponds,aquariums,fish,plants and the sorts. Good luck with yours! Regards, Mike

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12257	From: hnorton1cogeco.ca	Date: 6/12/2005
Subject: keeping tropicals outdoors in summer/Heather Norton

Years ago I kept my goldfish in an old tub we took out of the house our pond maker down the rood from us said it would do fine .We used it for over ten years till moved into town. For three years I kept my three common large goldfish in a wadding pool (the rigged kind and had it in a corner of my one bedroom apartment they are now livening at a freinds place but doing fine .I also bought a small corner filter and pump and one of the cheap fountains to give it a nice garden look folks thought I was nuts but once they saw how nice it was they all wanted to make one .Canadian Tires here in Canada had a small pond for out on your patio last year that you could see through but I thought it was a bit costly but everything was included with it but the fish. Heather Norton If you are going to use a kiddie pool for fish, buy the least expensive one you can find. The very inexpensive ones do not contain algaecides and other*cides in the construction, and are safer for the fish. mike mather -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of mike mather Sent: Sunday, June 12, 2005 2:58 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] keeping tropicals outdoors in summer Jackie, I've got about a 30 gallon aluminum bucket that my grandpa used to take a bath in when he was little,(early 20's). I decided,after reading an artical in the last Tropical Fish Hobbyist Magazine, to use this bucket as an outdoor fish container. Right now I,ve got some gravel and some Bicopa and Pigmy sword plants started in the bucket and also some Tadpoles from one of our local creeks(I live in the Mojave Desert on the east side of the Sierra Mountains). Soon I'm going to throw in some Paradise Fish fry that I'm raising and let them enjoy the great outdoors! I think I'm also going to get a kiddie pool at Walmart and make a summer pond out of it.I just love anything to do with ponds,aquariums,fish,plants and the sorts. Good luck with yours! Regards, Mike Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Links a.. To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12258	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 6/12/2005
Subject: Planting a tank from the glass up

I have been wanting to do a truly planted tank for a while and the recent Amano articles have pushed me that last little bit. ;-) I have a 23 flat-backed hex that I want to strip down anyways so now is the time. I have Laterite already, which I've used in a couple of my other aquariums, but was thinking of using Flourite. I haven't seen Eco-complete around here, so that's probably not an option. I've read postings about using regular dirt and also a substrate you can pick up at Lowe's etc (aquatic dirt?) What do you use and what would work best just as regards the substrate? And how deep would you go? I know I have to upgrade the lighting, too. Vicky [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12259	From: Karen	Date: 6/12/2005
Subject: Re: filter media

I use the Efimech and Efisubstrat Pro. Some of the Eheim's have been coming with media so look around at various web-retailers. As far as the sponge material, I bought pond material for a lot less at Home Depot. It comes in much larger pieces and is made for pond filters. For polishing, I bought poly batting from Wally World. Some people get the loose stuff but I get the quilting material. Call your retailer, whoever you chose, and their customer service should be able to tell you the amount of media you will need for your filter. IT may have been mentioned before but some good online retailera are www.bigalsonline.com, www.thatfishplace.com, and www.petsolutions.com. Big Al's takes a little longer since they are in Canada but good prices and service. Petsmart.com is competitive if you use a discount coupon or get free shipping. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > In doing research for my ehiem filter...I have come up with a few questions. > > I am finding that it is cheaper to buy the filter pads and media online. I > understand that I need ehfimech. But after that I get a little confused. > Aquariumguys.com sells ehfisubstrat and something called substrat pro. Do I > need both of these, or do I pick just one? > > Also, the information on these filters (I am looking at the 2028 model which > filters up to 158 gallons) does not say how much filter media I need to > purchase to fill the filter baskets. > > Any help would be greatly appreciated. > > thanks, > > Linda > River Falls, WI > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12260	From: minnesotagal866	Date: 6/12/2005
Subject: Re: keeping tropicals outdoors in summer

I have a bunch of little black fry that I've been told are Zebra Zanio babies (that was quick). They are starting to get the first black stripe. The one thing that makes me wonder is that they have red tails. I'm wondering if the danios and the white clouds can mate with each other. The fish look great, with the 90 degree weather I've been changing 5 gallons or so every couple of days to keep the water from getting too hot. I thought about putting one of those bamboo fountains in but it would bother the water lily. It's a great change from the indoor tank and I'd encourage anyone with a balconey or deck to try it! Jackie --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, mike mather <mtm6583@y...> wrote: > Jackie, I've got about a 30 gallon aluminum bucket > that my grandpa used to take a bath in when he was > little,(early 20's). I decided,after reading an > artical in the last Tropical Fish Hobbyist Magazine, > to use this bucket as an outdoor fish container. Right > now I,ve got some gravel and some Bicopa and Pigmy > sword plants started in the bucket and also some > Tadpoles from one of our local creeks(I live in the > Mojave Desert on the east side of the Sierra > Mountains). Soon I'm going to throw in some Paradise > Fish fry that I'm raising and let them enjoy the great > outdoors! I think I'm also going to get a kiddie pool > at Walmart and make a summer pond out of it.I just > love anything to do with ponds,aquariums,fish,plants > and the sorts. Good luck with yours! Regards, Mike > > > > > > > __________________________________ > Discover Yahoo! > Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news and more. Check it out! > http://discover.yahoo.com/mobile.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12261	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 6/12/2005
Subject: Re: keeping tropicals outdoors in summer

In a message dated 6/12/2005 12:01:57 PM Eastern Standard Time, minnesotagal866@... writes: The one thing that makes me wonder is that they have red tails. I'm wondering if the danios and the white clouds can mate with each other. Are you sure they're not white clouds? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12262	From: minnesotagal866	Date: 6/12/2005
Subject: Re: Paludariums

I read that article and it inspired me to go looking for newts. I ended up with 2 newts and a toad in a 10 gallon tank. What I did was use all rock and I built it up on the sides to create a land area. I also bought 2 great rocks that look sort of like the Grand Canyon. They are on each side toward the back and the rocks are built up behind it. My newts stay in the water most of the time, if they had chosen land I would build up more land area. The toad suns himself with the red light I use a couple of hours a day. I was told the newts were escape artists but they have no interest in the land or climbing out at all. I used to have white clouds in there but the newts ate them, which the pet store said they would not do because they are too slow to catch them (I think they get them while they sleep). This is the tank I put a plant bulb in and am growing several great plants. My eventual plans are to get a 125 or larger for the tropicals especially for the shark, and then turn the 55 into a huge paladarium with a larger swim area for fish and some real dirt to grow bog type plants. Unfortunately that won't be for 2-3 years, or until the shark demands a larger space. What I like about the paladarium is that I can grow plants without CO2 or expensive lighting, and have a few interesting aquatic animals as well. Jackie --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > A while back, someone asked about paludariums here. I just read the June > issue of "Aquarium fish Magazine" this morning, and there was an article on > paludariums in the issue. The article gave a fair overview of the topic, > which would, at least, lead one to ask the proper questions as they > investigate the topic further. > > \\Steve// > > Give a man a match, and he'll be warm for a minute. > But set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12263	From: Eric Miner	Date: 6/12/2005
Subject: Hatchets - calm water or a current?

Hello All, I'm thinking of adding hatchets to my tank that now has Panda Corys and Harlequins. I've read a number of profiles on Hatches, some say have still water others say they like a good current. Does anybody have any experience with Hatchets and whether or not they like a current? Thanks, Eric

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12264	From: paul helms	Date: 6/12/2005
Subject: Re: Hatchets - calm water or a current?

they do --- Eric Miner <eminer1254@...> wrote: > Hello All, > > I'm thinking of adding hatchets to my tank that now > has Panda Corys > and Harlequins. I've read a number of profiles on > Hatches, some say > have still water others say they like a good > current. Does anybody > have any experience with Hatchets and whether or not > they like a current? > > Thanks, > > Eric > > > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12265	From: paul helms	Date: 6/12/2005
Subject: Re: keeping tropicals outdoors in summer

white clouds are danios --- seleya8@... wrote: > > > In a message dated 6/12/2005 12:01:57 PM Eastern > Standard Time, > minnesotagal866@... writes: > > The one thing that makes me wonder is that they > have > red tails. I'm wondering if the danios and the > white clouds can mate > with each other. > > > Are you sure they're not white clouds? > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/mobile.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12266	From: Patrick	Date: 6/12/2005
Subject: Re: keeping tropicals outdoors in summer

You are kidding, right? White clouds are about as close to being danios as a barb, rasbora, or goldfish (all members of the Cyprinidaes family). White clouds are from the Tanichthys genus, zebra danios are from the Brachydanio or Danio genus. Patrick, an American Fish Guy. -------Original Message------- white clouds are danios

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12267	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 6/12/2005
Subject: aquarium heaters

What size heater would you recommend for a 150 gallon tank? Two 200 watt heaters? Two 300 watt heaters? Maybe a 400 watt heater would suffice. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12268	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/12/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium heaters

What is the ambient temperature of the room? What is the difference between the ambient room temperature and the water temperature you wish to keep? With that size tank, I'd go with two heaters, a few degrees above ambient, 2 150 watt heaters should suffice. If you want the tank temperature 10 or more degrees warmer, then you are looking at a couple of 300 watt heaters. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Sunday, June 12, 2005 7:19 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] aquarium heaters What size heater would you recommend for a 150 gallon tank? Two 200 watt heaters? Two 300 watt heaters? Maybe a 400 watt heater would suffice. Linda

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12269	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 6/12/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium heaters

The central air is set to 73 in the summer and during the winter the furnace is set at 72. I would like the water to be around 79-80. That is a difference of 8 degrees. This means I would need two 300 watt heaters? Thanks for your help, Steve Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12270	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/12/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium heaters

Linda, I'd go with 2 250 watt heaters, unless the air conditioner blows toward the tank. The temperature seems to be a bit on the warm side for many of the fish most people keep. Is there a specific reason why you need the temperature to be that high? If the fish really do not need that temperature, you'll be better off with a lower temperature and lesser heaters. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Sunday, June 12, 2005 8:06 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] aquarium heaters The central air is set to 73 in the summer and during the winter the furnace is set at 72. I would like the water to be around 79-80. That is a difference of 8 degrees. This means I would need two 300 watt heaters? Thanks for your help, Steve Linda

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12271	From: Sandra	Date: 6/12/2005
Subject: Re: crabs on live rock. .compatible with cleaner shrimp?

hi paul. yeah i figured that they eat ANYTHING, there were around 15 snails on that rock (keyhole limpets) and they ate them all ... i didnt really mind cause i dont really like snails in the first place, but i am really concerned about my cleaner shrimp, are they gonna harm the shrimp?? As soon as i have a pic i will send it, i always wanted to wait until i just cleaned the tank to take some pics, but always forgot to do so..lol.. sandra --- In AquaticLife...

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12272	From: dragon6435@aol.com	Date: 6/12/2005
Subject: Nanacara Anomala Cichlids

Does anyone on the list have any experience with nanacaras? I picked up a pair at an auction a couple of months ago and I have to convince myself several times a week that I still have them. They stay secrected away 24/7 in spite of everything I do. I have lots of cover, plantings, dithers, etc. I tried them in a tank with apistos and they wouldn't come out, so I have now moved them (about 2 weeks ago) to a tank with a very gentle juvenile severum, a few tetras and some corys. The tanks are 30 gallons and both heavily planted with caves to hide in for comfort. Two days ago, I actually caught the pair of them scurrying from one point of cover to the next. They seem like pretty fish, if I could just get them to come out. My tanks are well established, mature tanks, water is soft for South American species, nitrates run about 20 to 30 in all my tanks, 0 nitrite, 0 ammonia. Everyone seems very well, so any thoughts on anything else I can do to comfort these nervous nannies? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12273	From: dragon6435@aol.com	Date: 6/12/2005
Subject: Apistogramma Cacautoides Orange Flash

I was up at the Cichlid Classic a couple of weekends ago and picked up a mated pair of Orange Flash Cockatoo Apisots. Does anyone else keep this strain? I just wondered because when I got back home from Chicago and was finally ready to release the fishes, I couldn't believe the size of the male. He looks like he works out or takes steroids or something. I have several other strains of apistos and they are nothing like this guy in size. Do I have a rare critter? He looks to be a good 4 to 4 1/2 inches in length and the mouth on him is quite something. The female is about 1/4 his size. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12274	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 6/12/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium heaters

I was under the impression that angels prefer the water temp to be that warm. 73-84. I guess middle of the road would be 78.5 Right? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12275	From: Tim Fairchild	Date: 6/12/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium heaters

On Monday 13 Jun 2005 09:19, Crazy4fids@... wrote: > What size heater would you recommend for a 150 gallon tank? > > Two 200 watt heaters? > Two 300 watt heaters? > Maybe a 400 watt heater would suffice. 2x300 IMO -- --------------------------------------------------------- Tim & Therese Fairchild Atchafalaya Border Collies. Kuttabul, Queensland, Australia. --------------------------------------------------------- Email mailto:tim@... Homepage http://www.bcs4me.com Photos http://www.pbase.com/amosf ---------------------------------------------------------

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12276	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium heaters

Linda, Years and years ago, when I was but a tyke, my dad was breeding and rearing angels. I recall that he kept the breeding tanks at around 75^o F. I'd double check that with him, normally, but he and my mom are busy spending their kids' inheritance trotting around Europe right now <g>. Of course, those fish were a lot closer to the wild fish than are commonly available angels today. It seems the further from the wild fish get, and the fancier they get, the more fragile they get, and the warmer temperatures suit them better. I have the tendency to keep most fish toward the bottoms of their supposed temperature range, unless I have some literature or experience that would dictate otherwise. Will you be keeping anything other than angels in that tank? Even if you do not, you should have a pretty spectacular display, especially if you start with young fish and grow them out. They should have enough room in there to really grow their bodies and fins out. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Sunday, June 12, 2005 11:45 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] aquarium heaters I was under the impression that angels prefer the water temp to be that warm. 73-84. I guess middle of the road would be 78.5 Right? Linda

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12277	From: kb1dva	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: new tank

I was just given a 55 gallon tank it's kind of an odd shape its 48 inches long 21 inches deep and 12 inches wide. I am broke right now so I am going to concentrate on cleaning the tank and getting stuff for it as money is available. The filter in my 90 gallon is only rated for 70 gallons -it's an emperor 400? - So ill get a filter for the new tank? I still can't decide between types, there so expensive. Am I limited in what kind of fish go in there because it's so narrow? In my other tank I had to use what I had so the decisions are overwhelming. I was given 3 Oscars that I call Groucho, Harpo, and Zeppo. I was thinking they could live there?as always I am looking for ease of maintenance with an eye on cost Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12278	From: TankGurl	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: new tank

On 6/13/05, kb1dva <vze3pd7a@...> wrote: > I was just given a 55 gallon tank it's kind of an odd shape its 48 inches > long 21 inches deep and 12 inches wide. I am broke right now so I am going > to concentrate on cleaning the tank and getting stuff for it as money is > available. The filter in my 90 gallon is only rated for 70 gallons -it's an > emperor 400? - So ill get a filter for the new tank? I still can't decide > between types, there so expensive. I think Emporer 400's are rated for 80 gallons. Depending on your bioload, one of those should be fine. I have a heavily stocked 65 gallon and run both a 400 and 200 now to keep up. If money is tight, you could look to adding a couple sponge filters as a cheap and good alternative. A number of the forums have great DIY's for sponge filters. Good luck. Kelly Am I limited in what kind of fish go in > there because it's so narrow? In my other tank I had to use what I had so > the decisions are overwhelming. I was given 3 Oscars that I call Groucho, > Harpo, and Zeppo. I was thinking they could live there?as always I am > looking for ease of maintenance with an eye on cost Emily > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > -- 65g Malawi http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 135g Frontosa/Tang http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12279	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium heaters

In a message dated 6/13/2005 6:16:26 A.M. Central Standard Time, steve@... writes: Will you be keeping anything other than angels in that tank? Steve, and others, Thanks for all the advice. I plan on starting out with angels, keyhole cichlids, honey gouramis, a shoal of corys and a school of black phantom tetras. I am planning on ordering my angels from mellow aquatics.com. I was originally planning on 12 angels, but have decided to go with 8 or 10. In the future, I would hope I end up with at least one breeding pair. If I am successful with rearing them, I would eventually like to end up with a shoal of altum angels. I have only seen pictures of them online. They are hard to find up here. They are so upright and stately. I may have to join the MN aquarium club to get some local connections. We have been in our new house for a week now and I have already purchased and set up a 10 gallon hospital/quarantine tank. My husband has a "workshop" in the downstairs portion of our split level. It is right off the garage and next to the laundry room and it is heated like the rest of the house. He doesn't know it yet, but it is my future fish room! I have been obsessed with angelfish since I was young. My grandmother kept about 3 of them (along with a few guppies, swordtails and corys) in a 20 gallon aquarium. Whenever we would go and visit (which wasn't very often) that's where I would spend my time. Sitting in front of the fish tank. My father used to take a lot of trips there to go fishing (they lived on lake Michigan) and one time he brought back a five gallon tank, a heater, a box filter and a handful of guppies. That was back in the seventies and I am still obsessed with fish! I took a sixty mile drive across the twin cities to a high quality aquarium store. I had them test my tap water. They said it was neutral and had a general hardness of 16, which I think is considered relatively hard. We are looking at adding a water softener to our house. Do you have any idea how much this will lower the hardness, if at all? They said that everyone that I wanted to put into my tank would do well except for the black phantom tetras. He said that I should start of with about 6 of them and see how they do. If they are ok, I could get more. I really have my heart set on the black phantom tetra as my large school of fish. I also know that in order for my fish to breed and multiply in my tank, the water will need to be softer and more acidic. I am not ready to start messing with my water quality, not yet. Sometime in the future when I have my tank well established I may tackle lowering the pH and the hardness. We close on our old house on June 30th. I should have everything I need to set up my tank shortly after that! Thanks again, Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12280	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: new tank

In a message dated 6/13/2005 9:58:59 A.M. Central Standard Time, fishgoddess@... writes: I think Emporer 400's are rated for 80 gallons. Depending on your bioload, one of those should be fine. I have a heavily stocked 65 gallon and run both a 400 and 200 now to keep up. If money is tight, you could look to adding a couple sponge filters as a cheap and good alternative. A number of the forums have great DIY's for sponge filters. Petsolutions.com has a great web page that compares all the filters side by side._http://www.petsolutions.com/Info.aspx?id=401_ (http://www.petsolution s.com/Info.aspx?id=401) Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12281	From: paul helms	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: keeping tropicals outdoors in summer

nope, not kidding lol. i know that you are referring to the mountain minnow, but there is also a strain of danios called white clouds. they are about 1/2 the size of zebra danios and a bit less nippy. reddish tinti to teh skin with white outlines. there is also a golden white cloud available as well --- Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: > You are kidding, right? White clouds are about as > close to being danios as a > barb, rasbora, or goldfish (all members of the > Cyprinidaes family). White > clouds are from the Tanichthys genus, zebra danios > are from the Brachydanio > or Danio genus. > > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy. > > -------Original Message------- > white clouds are danios > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/mobile.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12282	From: Cher	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Moss balls & Rosy Red Minnows

Hello has anyone got any experiance with these two any info would be apreciated. Thank you Cher in Texas

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12283	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium heaters

Whats the average room temperature? I have a 90 gallon tank and a 400w heater, used to have a 300w heater but it would stay on for a while. My average temp here in brisbane Australia is about 18 to 23 deg Celcius. =Nick ----- Original Message ----- From: <Crazy4fids@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Monday, June 13, 2005 9:19 AM Subject: [AquaticLife] aquarium heaters > What size heater would you recommend for a 150 gallon tank? > > Two 200 watt heaters? > Two 300 watt heaters? > Maybe a 400 watt heater would suffice. > > Linda > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12284	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies

How much light do you have for your tank? both the plants and the betta fry look really good. Look similar to guppie fry too. =Nick ----- Original Message ----- From: "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Friday, June 10, 2005 6:53 PM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies > Rei, > > > > This was actually by accident. 2 double tail females with a very standard > male and I don't know which one of the 2 had spawned coz all 3 of them > died > after spawning :-( > > I have not fed them anything special at the moment. infact I have not yet > put any food in the tank. My guess was that the snails created infusoria > that fed the fry and if they managed to survive a couple of weeks without > me > noticing them then something must have been right. > > > > I have some fine powdered high protein fry food that I will start from > today > as I think they are big enough to take this food. I have already seen one > of > the fry pull out a baby snail from their shell, so maybe that is another > source of food for them. > > > > The plants are Hygroplhilla polysperma, Java moss, Hydrocotyle and a > couple > of stems of bacopa and ludwigia with a few hanging crypts and anubias. > Nothing is really rooted in that tank as the gravel bottom is just ½ ". I > did think about feeding them baby brineshrimp but then I thought that > there > is no point as the most cruitial stage has passed and they are twice the > size of a newly born guppy fry and should be able to take normal food. As > you can see that their bellies are still full, so I think there is plenty > of > what ever they are feeding. > > > > Nim > > > > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Rei - Raymond Tremor > Sent: 10 June 2005 09:35 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies > > > > What kind of betta did you breed? What are you feeding them? I was feeding > mine with baby brime shrimp and hard boiled egg yolk and sometimes beef > heart and also boiled chicken meat shredded. I don't have bettas now cause > it is hard work to clean tanks. I like your plants, what kind are they? I > bred a crown tail female with a twin tail male. Some of the babies were > twin > crown tail. I used a 5 galloon tank with anacharis plants and about 4 to 5 > inches of water cause I had been told that the babies will survive more if > the water level was low cause they have a shorter swim from the bottom to > the top. I had 20 babies and they live up to a year (maybe more cause I > gave > them away when I decided to keep a goldfish tank). > > Rei - Raymond Tremor > LoveMoAko@... > > -------Original Message------- > > From: Nimish Mathur > Date: 06/09/05 20:47:16 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies > > I just managed to take a pic of the 2-3 week old fry. > > http://www.nimmat.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10001/picture00006.jpg > > > > this is what they were on 4th June > > http://www.nimmat.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10001/betta%20Fry.JPG > > > > Nim > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in > Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > _____ > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > * To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12285	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium heaters

Linda, MN, huh? I might, then, go for the 2 x 400 W heaters. Definitely join the club. Not only good for fish, but they can advise you better than we can, especially on the heaters. They are the ones with the experience in your area, he says after suffering through another 90^0 day with high humidity. Randy Carey is a member of that club. He might change your mind and get you into characins <g>. Say hi to him for me, if you go. If you don't already have a link to their web site, it is http://www.mn-aquarium.org/. The corys would be a good addition to the angels in your tank. There are some nice looking ones out there, and get a whole bunch of them, they do better in groups. I've never kept keyholes, but they are supposed to be peaceful (operative words coming up) for cichlids. The honey gouramis are nice fish, but you might want to go with something a tad larger, with the fish you already have planned. Take a look at the dwarf gourami, the naturally colored ones. They are a bit larger, and more able to fend for themselves than the honeys. In a well decorated tank--plants, driftwood, rockwork--they may very well become the bosses of the tank, showing the typical gourami spunk. I've not kept the black phantoms either, but, again, they look to be a bit small for the tank you are planning, and may well become someone's lunch. If you do want some characins, this is an area Randy could well help you out in choosing an appropriate candidate for your tank. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Monday, June 13, 2005 11:07 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] aquarium heaters In a message dated 6/13/2005 6:16:26 A.M. Central Standard Time, steve@... writes: Will you be keeping anything other than angels in that tank? Steve, and others, Thanks for all the advice. I plan on starting out with angels, keyhole cichlids, honey gouramis, a shoal of corys and a school of black phantom tetras. I am planning on ordering my angels from mellow aquatics.com. I was originally planning on 12 angels, but have decided to go with 8 or 10. In the future, I would hope I end up with at least one breeding pair. If I am successful with rearing them, I would eventually like to end up with a shoal of altum angels. I have only seen pictures of them online. They are hard to find up here. They are so upright and stately. I may have to join the MN aquarium club to get some local connections. We have been in our new house for a week now and I have already purchased and set up a 10 gallon hospital/quarantine tank. My husband has a "workshop" in the downstairs portion of our split level. It is right off the garage and next to the laundry room and it is heated like the rest of the house. He doesn't know it yet, but it is my future fish room! I have been obsessed with angelfish since I was young. My grandmother kept about 3 of them (along with a few guppies, swordtails and corys) in a 20 gallon aquarium. Whenever we would go and visit (which wasn't very often) that's where I would spend my time. Sitting in front of the fish tank. My father used to take a lot of trips there to go fishing (they lived on lake Michigan) and one time he brought back a five gallon tank, a heater, a box filter and a handful of guppies. That was back in the seventies and I am still obsessed with fish! I took a sixty mile drive across the twin cities to a high quality aquarium store. I had them test my tap water. They said it was neutral and had a general hardness of 16, which I think is considered relatively hard. We are looking at adding a water softener to our house. Do you have any idea how much this will lower the hardness, if at all? They said that everyone that I wanted to put into my tank would do well except for the black phantom tetras. He said that I should start of with about 6 of them and see how they do. If they are ok, I could get more. I really have my heart set on the black phantom tetra as my large school of fish. I also know that in order for my fish to breed and multiply in my tank, the water will need to be softer and more acidic. I am not ready to start messing with my water quality, not yet. Sometime in the future when I have my tank well established I may tackle lowering the pH and the hardness. We close on our old house on June 30th. I should have everything I need to set up my tank shortly after that! Thanks again, Linda

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12286	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium heaters

In a message dated 6/13/2005 5:34:54 P.M. Central Standard Time, nmunro@... writes: Whats the average room temperature? I have a 90 gallon tank and a 400w heater, used to have a 300w heater but it would stay on for a while. My average temp here in brisbane Australia is about 18 to 23 deg Celcius. The average room temperature is between 70-75 degrees Fahrenheit. I can get a 400 watt heater, but I think I am going to go with two 300 watt heaters. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12287	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium heaters

Thanks again steve. I have had keyhole cichlids before and I absolutely LOVE them! They are quiet and docile and I love their bland yet decorative colors. They have done quite well in with my angelfish in the past. What is your thought on blue rams? I thought the honey gourami WAS a dwarf gourami. What kind of tetra would you recommend? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12288	From: rlmec	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Water Treatment for Ponds

Hi all, Hopefully this is not considered spamming, however I am a distributor for a new product line of water treatment equipment (at least new for the USA), and I would like to see how well it works with ponds. We are currently conducting some pool trials, and I have something lined up with a local botanical garden for testing, however it is for a fountain and has no fish or aquatic life (that they want). The manufacturer says his distributor in Japan has done quite a bit in the area of ponds with great success, however we have not received any translated case study materials. The product is an electronic non- chemical unit that eliminates algea and bacteria, and is most often used for commercial pools and cooling towers. I would be interested in conducting some trials in regard to ponds with aquatic life to determine effectiveness and compatibility with pond life. Indications are that goldfish or other sensory adapted fish species may react initally, but adapt shortly after. Coy seem to love it, and grow faster and larger. If any of you would be willing to conduct a unbiased case study for us, I would be interested in putting it together. We would expect some detailed records, documentation, and photos out of it. I would prefer to conduct the trial with a commercial entity. Thanks, Ron Moon - RLM-EC

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12289	From: Theresa and Elliott	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: starting a new tank

I have not had a tank in several years, but just got a new tank that I resealed, and put water in last week. I got out my old filters, and put in gravel and started an UG filter while waiting for a part for my bio- wheel. the water is filtered well water. the temp is 78*. I just tested the water, wanting to go get a fish or two to start cycling. I got the following results: pH 7.3; Ammonia 0; Nitrite 0; nitrate 50. 1-Can I put a couple of fish in here to start cycling this tank? 2- why do I already have Nitrates in the tank when there is nothing living in the tank? Thanks!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12290	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium heaters

Linda, As I said, I've not kept keyholes before, so I really don't know their actual disposition. I have heard they are peaceful, but I've also heard that dwarf gouramis are timid, and my experience with them indicates much the opposite. The common name dwarf gourami refers to the fish known as _Colisa lalia_, while the honey gourami refers to _Trichogaster chuna_ found in most hobbyist reference books as _Colisa chuna_ or _Colisa sota_. The dwarf is slightly larger than the honey, and a tougher fish. As I alluded to above, given the proper setting, the dwarf is tough as nails, and not afraid to show it. The natural coloration is alternating red and blue jagged vertical stripes, which can be electric, given the right conditions. The females are a silvery base color, with some bluish in the pale striping they have. They are spectacular fish, when in good condition, and breath taking when in excellent condition. I'd probably go with something like a bleeding heart tetra. They are large enough where the angels will not think of them as a snack food. They have a fin structure that is reminiscent of angels and a heavier body like your keyholes. But again, if you go to the Minnesota club meeting, try to find randy Carey as he is the real expert here, and can probably put you on to a nice characin or two to go with your angels and keyholes. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Monday, June 13, 2005 8:38 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] aquarium heaters Thanks again steve. I have had keyhole cichlids before and I absolutely LOVE them! They are quiet and docile and I love their bland yet decorative colors. They have done quite well in with my angelfish in the past. What is your thought on blue rams? I thought the honey gourami WAS a dwarf gourami. What kind of tetra would you recommend? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12291	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: starting a new tank

I prefer to do fishless cycling of a tank, where ammonia is added to the tank to establish a cycle. There are a number of good articles on the Internet about this method, as well as posts that can be found in the archives of this list. Have you tested your water from the tap? That is where your nitrates are to be found. There are many sources for nitrates, as well as other compounds, in well water. If 50 ppm is your baseline, you should be able to live with it, so long as you do not wish to keep fish that may be susceptible to nitrate poisoning or other ill effects that may be caused by nitrates. This will also require good maintenance habits on your part, so the nitrates do not reach much higher levels, such as regular water changes and scrupulous cleaning of your tank. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Theresa and Elliott Sent: Monday, June 13, 2005 1:37 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] starting a new tank I have not had a tank in several years, but just got a new tank that I resealed, and put water in last week. I got out my old filters, and put in gravel and started an UG filter while waiting for a part for my bio- wheel. the water is filtered well water. the temp is 78*. I just tested the water, wanting to go get a fish or two to start cycling. I got the following results: pH 7.3; Ammonia 0; Nitrite 0; nitrate 50. 1-Can I put a couple of fish in here to start cycling this tank? 2- why do I already have Nitrates in the tank when there is nothing living in the tank? Thanks!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12292	From: Rei - Raymond Tremor	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies

Nim, thanks for the info. I was looking online for aquatic plants and they are cheap but the shipping is 11.99 and there is no shipping to Hawaii. I can't seem to find those plants that I want here in Hawaii. I wanted the Banana plant, Hornwort, and Spadderdock. They look good in the picture and I tried to look at the info and they are sturdy plants. My goldfishes keeps on breaking my anacharis plants into small pieces and my filter keeps getting jammed up. Rei - Raymond Tremor LoveMoAko@... -------Original Message------- From: Nimish Mathur Date: 06/09/05 22:53:47 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies Rei, This was actually by accident. 2 double tail females with a very standard male and I don’t know which one of the 2 had spawned coz all 3 of them died after spawning :-( I have not fed them anything special at the moment infact I have not yet put any food in the tank. My guess was that the snails created infusoria that fed the fry and if they managed to survive a couple of weeks without me noticing them then something must have been right. I have some fine powdered high protein fry food that I will start from today as I think they are big enough to take this food. I have already seen one of the fry pull out a baby snail from their shell, so maybe that is another source of food for them. The plants are Hygroplhilla polysperma, Java moss, Hydrocotyle and a couple of stems of bacopa and ludwigia with a few hanging crypts and anubias. Nothing is really rooted in that tank as the gravel bottom is just ½ “. I did think about feeding them baby brineshrimp but then I thought that there is no point as the most cruitial stage has passed and they are twice the size of a newly born guppy fry and should be able to take normal food. As you can see that their bellies are still full, so I think there is plenty of what ever they are feeding. Nim

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12293	From: Amanda	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Crayfish

Does anyone know much about crayfish breeding. I have had crayfish for a long time for puffer food, but now one of them has eggs, so I am going to try to raise the babies for food later on to cut down on cost. I was just wondering if it is ok to move the crayfish to a smaller tank on her own. I didn't worry about it much at first, because I know the babies stay attached to their mother and all that, but the male crayfish in the tank with her has started to chase her around the tank. Is this usual? Is he trying to eat the eggs? Also, with the research that I have done on the internet researching breeding, everyone says the length of time for hatching depends on tank temp. Does anyone know a good temp to make them hatch quicker? I have moved her to a 1 gallon hex tank with some plants in it, and an air stone for now. Until I can find out if she is safe with the other crayfish in the tank. This 30 gallon tank is heavily planted, and has some pvc pipe, but she just can't seem to hide from him. Also, he is a lot larger than her. Also, what is the usual number of babies that hatch? It looks like she has at least 100 eggs on her. Thanks in advance for all of your help. Oh, someone said that I should add some salt to the water to help aid with the development of the babies/eggs. Is this true?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12294	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium heaters

Searching for '75 degrees Fahrenheit to celsius', Google says its about the same as mine. 75 degrees Fahrenheit = 23.8888889 degrees Celsius 70 degrees Fahrenheit = 21.1111111 degrees Celsius Im now running a 400w heater which I have found is better than my tank running a 300w heater. So to play with maths: Your thinking of running two heaters and your tanks almost twice the size of mine. 90 gallons x 2 = 180 gallons, 2x400w =800w work out the ratio between a tank with two heaters twice my size and your tank. 150/180=0.83 Multply the heaters by the ratio 0.83*800w = 666.666w Hay presto! getting two 300w heaters (600w total) is a pretty close match... Check with a Reference: I think Steve Szabo sent me an email once with a rule of thumb figure which I was exceeding with my 400w heater. My Conclusion: I think in your temperature range the Worst Case is the heaters will stay on longer and possibly (i'm assuming) use more power. Sounds good to me Linda ----- Original Message ----- From: <Crazy4fids@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2005 10:33 AM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] aquarium heaters > > In a message dated 6/13/2005 5:34:54 P.M. Central Standard Time, > nmunro@... writes: > > Whats the average room temperature? > > I have a 90 gallon tank and a 400w heater, used to have a 300w heater but > it > would stay on for a while. > > My average temp here in brisbane Australia is about 18 to 23 deg Celcius. > > > The average room temperature is between 70-75 degrees Fahrenheit. I can > get > a 400 watt heater, but I think I am going to go with two 300 watt > heaters. > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12295	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: Crayfish

Slightly off topic Amanda but how much light wattage are you using for your plants? I'm trying to decide if its worth spending a weeks worth of income to improve the lighting in my tank. Also one of my friends used to breed crayfish pretty much for the same reason as you are so i'll ask him, altho his tank was larger i think. =Nick ----- Original Message ----- From: "Amanda" <acharris23@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2005 12:15 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] Crayfish > Does anyone know much about crayfish breeding. I have had crayfish > for a long time for puffer food, but now one of them has eggs, so I > am going to try to raise the babies for food later on to cut down on > cost. I was just wondering if it is ok to move the crayfish to a > smaller tank on her own. I didn't worry about it much at first, > because I know the babies stay attached to their mother and all > that, but the male crayfish in the tank with her has started to > chase her around the tank. Is this usual? Is he trying to eat the > eggs? Also, with the research that I have done on the internet > researching breeding, everyone says the length of time for hatching > depends on tank temp. Does anyone know a good temp to make them > hatch quicker? I have moved her to a 1 gallon hex tank with some > plants in it, and an air stone for now. Until I can find out if she > is safe with the other crayfish in the tank. This 30 gallon tank is > heavily planted, and has some pvc pipe, but she just can't seem to > hide from him. Also, he is a lot larger than her. Also, what is the > usual number of babies that hatch? It looks like she has at least > 100 eggs on her. Thanks in advance for all of your help. > > Oh, someone said that I should add some salt to the water to help > aid with the development of the babies/eggs. Is this true? > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12296	From: mommy2acdhsurvivor	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: HELP!! Fish with a fat lip! Looks bloody inside

Hello, I have a fish bought as a feeder goldfish definatly not a goldfish. I've had him over a year. He is in a 1 1/2 gallon tank alone (since he ate some of my favorite guppies). Well I thought he needed more room so I put him in my 10 gallon with my two baby quarter sized red eared slider turtles he hid behind a dish in there all day and the next morning he had this big fat lip stuck out and red looks like it's bloody underneath. I think the turtles pooped to much. I put him back in the 1 1/2 gallon and I've been changing the water at different times today trying to keep it clean to hopefully clear up his lip. Anyone have any ideas on what it is. I tried to look up fish diseases but can't find much under fat lip! Hehehe Please help I love him, he's been with me over a year.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12297	From: Amanda	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: Crayfish

I usually use 17-20 watt bulbs. There is a 17 watt on there now, and my plants grow like weeds. I have to trim, and replant once a week. I am sure you can go with higher wattage, and it may depend on your plant, but I have a variety that are doing well in there. Especially my banana plants. Hope this helps There are only 2 crayfish in my 30 gallon tank. I hold them there until it is time to feed my puffer, but one happened to have eggs within a couple weeks of getting them. After the male(I suppose,)or bigger one started harrassing her, that is when I put her in one of my holding tanks. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Nicolas Munro" <nmunro@q...> wrote: > Slightly off topic Amanda but how much light wattage are you using for your > plants? I'm trying to decide if its worth spending a weeks worth of income > to improve the lighting in my tank. > > Also one of my friends used to breed crayfish pretty much for the same > reason as you are so i'll ask him, altho his tank was larger i think. > > =Nick > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Amanda" <acharris23@y...> > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2005 12:15 PM > Subject: [AquaticLife] Crayfish > > > > Does anyone know much about crayfish breeding. I have had crayfish > > for a long time for puffer food, but now one of them has eggs, so I > > am going to try to raise the babies for food later on to cut down on > > cost. I was just wondering if it is ok to move the crayfish to a > > smaller tank on her own. I didn't worry about it much at first, > > because I know the babies stay attached to their mother and all > > that, but the male crayfish in the tank with her has started to > > chase her around the tank. Is this usual? Is he trying to eat the > > eggs? Also, with the research that I have done on the internet > > researching breeding, everyone says the length of time for hatching > > depends on tank temp. Does anyone know a good temp to make them > > hatch quicker? I have moved her to a 1 gallon hex tank with some > > plants in it, and an air stone for now. Until I can find out if she > > is safe with the other crayfish in the tank. This 30 gallon tank is > > heavily planted, and has some pvc pipe, but she just can't seem to > > hide from him. Also, he is a lot larger than her. Also, what is the > > usual number of babies that hatch? It looks like she has at least > > 100 eggs on her. Thanks in advance for all of your help. > > > > Oh, someone said that I should add some salt to the water to help > > aid with the development of the babies/eggs. Is this true? > > > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > > . > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > > in Advance for your help in this matter > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12298	From: Amanda	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: HELP!! Fish with a fat lip! Looks bloody inside

Is it possible one of your turtles bit him. My baby turtles, and bigger turtles love fish, and if it is bigger it will not stop them from thrying. I have 2 baby mississippi map turtles, that always eat fish bigger than them, and a 1 year old yellow bellied slider that will tear apart anything. This may be the problem. If not, good luck on figuring it out! --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "mommy2acdhsurvivor" <CK147@H...> wrote: > Hello, > I have a fish bought as a feeder goldfish definatly not a goldfish. > I've had him over a year. He is in a 1 1/2 gallon tank alone (since he > ate some of my favorite guppies). Well I thought he needed more room > so I put him in my 10 gallon with my two baby quarter sized red eared > slider turtles he hid behind a dish in there all day and the next > morning he had this big fat lip stuck out and red looks like it's > bloody underneath. I think the turtles pooped to much. I put him back > in the 1 1/2 gallon and I've been changing the water at different > times today trying to keep it clean to hopefully clear up his lip. > Anyone have any ideas on what it is. I tried to look up fish diseases > but can't find much under fat lip! Hehehe Please help I love him, he's > been with me over a year.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12299	From: mommy2acdhsurvivor	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: HELP!! Fish with a fat lip! Looks bloody inside

Definatly possible, but his lip is still there. I guess I will just keep his water clean and hope it heals itself. No more fishes in with the turtles! There was some feeder guppies in there forever and they never ate them I finally took them out. But maybe they where to small to catch. This fish is like the size of a large feeder goldfish. > Is it possible one of your turtles bit him. My baby turtles, and bigger > turtles love fish, and if it is bigger it will not stop them from > thrying. I have 2 baby mississippi map turtles, that always eat fish > bigger than them, and a 1 year old yellow bellied slider that will tear > apart anything. This may be the problem. If not, good luck on figuring > it out! > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "mommy2acdhsurvivor" <CK147@H...> > wrote: > > Hello, > > I have a fish bought as a feeder goldfish definatly not a goldfish. > > I've had him over a year. He is in a 1 1/2 gallon tank alone (since he > > ate some of my favorite guppies). Well I thought he needed more room > > so I put him in my 10 gallon with my two baby quarter sized red eared > > slider turtles he hid behind a dish in there all day and the next > > morning he had this big fat lip stuck out and red looks like it's > > bloody underneath. I think the turtles pooped to much. I put him back > > in the 1 1/2 gallon and I've been changing the water at different > > times today trying to keep it clean to hopefully clear up his lip. > > Anyone have any ideas on what it is. I tried to look up fish diseases > > but can't find much under fat lip! Hehehe Please help I love him, he's > > been with me over a year.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12300	From: Amanda	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: HELP!! Fish with a fat lip! Looks bloody inside

They probably just nipped him and left a bloody spot that will heal. It has happened with some of my bigger fish that I feed them that they don't get all the way down on the first try! I wouldn't stress it too much if the fish is still eating and all. He may be in shock also from being attacked and moved so much! Good luck!! (My baby map turts are only a little bigger than a quarter, and they eat, and take out eyeballs on feeder fish that they can't quite get down on the first try! I would deffintely keep any fish you want to keep away from the turts!) --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "mommy2acdhsurvivor" <CK147@H...> wrote: > Definatly possible, but his lip is still there. I guess I will just > keep his water clean and hope it heals itself. No more fishes in with > the turtles! There was some feeder guppies in there forever and they > never ate them I finally took them out. But maybe they where to small > to catch. This fish is like the size of a large feeder goldfish. > > > > Is it possible one of your turtles bit him. My baby turtles, and bigger > > turtles love fish, and if it is bigger it will not stop them from > > thrying. I have 2 baby mississippi map turtles, that always eat fish > > bigger than them, and a 1 year old yellow bellied slider that will tear > > apart anything. This may be the problem. If not, good luck on figuring > > it out! > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "mommy2acdhsurvivor" <CK147@H...> > > wrote: > > > Hello, > > > I have a fish bought as a feeder goldfish definatly not a goldfish. > > > I've had him over a year. He is in a 1 1/2 gallon tank alone (since he > > > ate some of my favorite guppies). Well I thought he needed more room > > > so I put him in my 10 gallon with my two baby quarter sized red eared > > > slider turtles he hid behind a dish in there all day and the next > > > morning he had this big fat lip stuck out and red looks like it's > > > bloody underneath. I think the turtles pooped to much. I put him back > > > in the 1 1/2 gallon and I've been changing the water at different > > > times today trying to keep it clean to hopefully clear up his lip. > > > Anyone have any ideas on what it is. I tried to look up fish diseases > > > but can't find much under fat lip! Hehehe Please help I love him, he's > > > been with me over a year.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12301	From: mommy2acdhsurvivor	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: HELP!! Fish with a fat lip! Looks bloody inside

I hope that's all and it heals. Do you think I should not do the water changes? I don't want to stress him more. I just didn't want bad water to make it worse. Since it's just a little tank it's not cycled or anything I usually do a 50 percent water change weekly and suck out poop with a turkey baster as I see it. I will definatly keep fish out of there tank. Baby maps, Hmm I wonder if that's what my mom was talking about, she said they had turtles when they where kids that stayed quarter size. But all I found where red eared sliders. I bought them off aquabid for a present for her, but than after being with us a few weeks waiting to go to her my husband got attached and told me to buy her some more he was keeping these ones. I never did get her anymore. They where never that cheap again. I only paid $4.00 a piece and $3.85 to ship both. I lost the guys info. > They probably just nipped him and left a bloody spot that will heal. > It has happened with some of my bigger fish that I feed them that > they don't get all the way down on the first try! I wouldn't stress > it too much if the fish is still eating and all. He may be in shock > also from being attacked and moved so much! Good luck!! > > (My baby map turts are only a little bigger than a quarter, and they > eat, and take out eyeballs on feeder fish that they can't quite get > down on the first try! I would deffintely keep any fish you want to > keep away from the turts!) > > Definatly possible, but his lip is still there. I guess I will just > > keep his water clean and hope it heals itself. No more fishes in > with > > the turtles! There was some feeder guppies in there forever and > they > > never ate them I finally took them out. But maybe they where to > small > > to catch. This fish is like the size of a large feeder goldfish. > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12302	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium heaters

In a message dated 6/13/2005 10:06:37 P.M. Central Standard Time, nmunro@... writes: I think Steve Szabo sent me an email once with a rule of thumb figure which I was exceeding with my 400w heater. My Conclusion: I think in your temperature range the Worst Case is the heaters will stay on longer and possibly (i'm assuming) use more power. The problem that I have is that I suck with math and equations. I can add, subtract, multiply and divide like the wind, but throw me a story problem and I immediately get flustered and want to cry! Would it be advisable to go with two 400 watt heaters? Big Als online states that the Hydor Theo submersible 400 watt heater is recommended for tanks between 80 and 105 gallons. Maybe a 300 and a 400? Lin-duh [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12303	From: Trevor Holyoak	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium heaters

Keep in mind that the bigger the tank, the more stable the temperature is going to be (and the less a heater is actually needed). I currently have a 250 W heater in my 150 gallon tank, and it rarely comes on. - Trevor Crazy4fids@... wrote: > > In a message dated 6/13/2005 10:06:37 P.M. Central Standard Time, > nmunro@... writes: > > I think Steve Szabo sent me an email once with a rule of thumb figure > which > I was exceeding with my 400w heater. > > My Conclusion: > I think in your temperature range the Worst Case is the heaters will > stay on > longer and possibly (i'm assuming) use more power. > > > > > The problem that I have is that I suck with math and equations. I > can add, > subtract, multiply and divide like the wind, but throw me a story > problem and > I immediately get flustered and want to cry! > > Would it be advisable to go with two 400 watt heaters? Big Als online > states that the Hydor Theo submersible 400 watt heater is recommended > for tanks > between 80 and 105 gallons. Maybe a 300 and a 400? > > Lin-duh > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12304	From: eggybumstu	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Help needed

Hello one and all, its been a while since I've posted and its mainly down to being totally suckered in by my X-box and also being too lazy to log on. But here I am now and have a question for you- I was cleaning out my tank last weekend and when doing a bit of plant pruning something caught my eye on the glass. On closer inspection it was a baby bristlenose plec and on further inspection I counted 7. Seems the male I got for my female 2 weeks ago has performed most well, no flowers or fancy gifts either!!! Should I feed them anything or is any special husbandry required?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12305	From: Chris	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Power filter burned out

My power filter burned out today. This is the third power filter in the three years of keeping fish, that has burned out. I am thinking of replacing it with an under gravel filter. Can anyone recomend a good non expensive filtration systom?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12306	From: paul helms	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: Power filter burned out

a ugf with 2 power heads is about 60 bucks total. you may want to check out your electrical sockets if 3 have burned out. they usually last years --- Chris <cjreporter98@...> wrote: > My power filter burned out today. This is the third > power filter in the > three years of keeping fish, that has burned out. I > am thinking of > replacing it with an under gravel filter. Can anyone > recomend a good > non expensive filtration systom? > > > __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - You care about security. So do we. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12307	From: Tim Fairchild	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: Power filter burned out

On Tuesday 14 Jun 2005 15:56, Chris wrote: > My power filter burned out today. This is the third power filter in the > three years of keeping fish, that has burned out. I am thinking of > replacing it with an under gravel filter. Can anyone recomend a good > non expensive filtration systom? Home made above tank trickle is the best cheap filter. Just need a pump, some hose, a plastic container and some media (eg floss+coarse biological)... Small pond pumps and powerheads are cheap... tim -- --------------------------------------------------------- Tim & Therese Fairchild Atchafalaya Border Collies. Kuttabul, Queensland, Australia. --------------------------------------------------------- Email mailto:tim@... Homepage http://www.bcs4me.com Photos http://www.pbase.com/amosf ---------------------------------------------------------

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12308	From: paul helms	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: Water Treatment for Ponds

bacteria is necessary to keep the water healthy for the fish living in it. biologic filtration is the key to keeping them alive, and since your product will not do anything to take ammonia out of the body of water and will kill off the only 2 things that perform this function (bacteria and plant life) a pond keeper would be absolutely stupid to participate if they wish to have anything left alive. --- rlmec <ronm@...> wrote: > Hi all, > Hopefully this is not considered spamming, however I > am a distributor > for a new product line of water treatment equipment > (at least new for > the USA), and I would like to see how well it works > with ponds. We > are currently conducting some pool trials, and I > have something lined > up with a local botanical garden for testing, > however it is for a > fountain and has no fish or aquatic life (that they > want). > > The manufacturer says his distributor in Japan has > done quite a bit > in the area of ponds with great success, however we > have not received > any translated case study materials. The product is > an electronic non- > chemical unit that eliminates algea and bacteria, > and is most often > used for commercial pools and cooling towers. I > would be interested > in conducting some trials in regard to ponds with > aquatic life to > determine effectiveness and compatibility with pond > life. > > Indications are that goldfish or other sensory > adapted fish species > may react initally, but adapt shortly after. Coy > seem to love it, and > grow faster and larger. > > If any of you would be willing to conduct a unbiased > case study for > us, I would be interested in putting it together. > We would expect > some detailed records, documentation, and photos out > of it. I would > prefer to conduct the trial with a commercial > entity. > > Thanks, > Ron Moon - RLM-EC > > > > > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Find restaurants, movies, travel and more fun for the weekend. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/weekend.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12309	From: paul helms	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: Moss balls & Rosy Red Minnows

these two what? --- Cher <sdkeppler@...> wrote: > Hello has anyone got any experiance with these two > any info would be > apreciated. Thank you Cher in Texas > > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/mobile.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12310	From: paul helms	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: starting a new tank

it is in your well water from fertilizers --- Theresa and Elliott <Simon@...> wrote: > I have not had a tank in several years, but just got > a new tank that I > resealed, and put water in last week. I got out my > old filters, and put > in gravel and started an UG filter while waiting for > a part for my bio- > wheel. the water is filtered well water. the temp is > 78*. I just tested > the water, wanting to go get a fish or two to start > cycling. I got the > following results: pH 7.3; Ammonia 0; Nitrite 0; > nitrate 50. > 1-Can I put a couple of fish in here to start > cycling this tank? > 2- why do I already have Nitrates in the tank when > there is nothing > living in the tank? > > Thanks! > > > > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/mobile.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12311	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies

Hi Nick, Light is a shocker ;). I have only 11W PLL bulb over the tank that’s is half daylight and half bluemoon. They are no where near to even a standard aquarium light but still the plants are doing great. One of the fry seems to have started to show a bit of colour as well ;) Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nicolas Munro Sent: 13 June 2005 23:45 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies How much light do you have for your tank? both the plants and the betta fry look really good. Look similar to guppie fry too. =Nick ----- Original Message ----- From: "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Friday, June 10, 2005 6:53 PM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies > Rei, > > > > This was actually by accident. 2 double tail females with a very standard > male and I don't know which one of the 2 had spawned coz all 3 of them > died > after spawning :-( > > I have not fed them anything special at the moment. infact I have not yet > put any food in the tank. My guess was that the snails created infusoria > that fed the fry and if they managed to survive a couple of weeks without > me > noticing them then something must have been right. > > > > I have some fine powdered high protein fry food that I will start from > today > as I think they are big enough to take this food. I have already seen one > of > the fry pull out a baby snail from their shell, so maybe that is another > source of food for them. > > > > The plants are Hygroplhilla polysperma, Java moss, Hydrocotyle and a > couple > of stems of bacopa and ludwigia with a few hanging crypts and anubias. > Nothing is really rooted in that tank as the gravel bottom is just ½ ". I > did think about feeding them baby brineshrimp but then I thought that > there > is no point as the most cruitial stage has passed and they are twice the > size of a newly born guppy fry and should be able to take normal food. As > you can see that their bellies are still full, so I think there is plenty > of > what ever they are feeding. > > > > Nim > > > > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Rei - Raymond Tremor > Sent: 10 June 2005 09:35 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies > > > > What kind of betta did you breed? What are you feeding them? I was feeding > mine with baby brime shrimp and hard boiled egg yolk and sometimes beef > heart and also boiled chicken meat shredded. I don't have bettas now cause > it is hard work to clean tanks. I like your plants, what kind are they? I > bred a crown tail female with a twin tail male. Some of the babies were > twin > crown tail. I used a 5 galloon tank with anacharis plants and about 4 to 5 > inches of water cause I had been told that the babies will survive more if > the water level was low cause they have a shorter swim from the bottom to > the top. I had 20 babies and they live up to a year (maybe more cause I > gave > them away when I decided to keep a goldfish tank). > > Rei - Raymond Tremor > LoveMoAko@... > > -------Original Message------- > > From: Nimish Mathur > Date: 06/09/05 20:47:16 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies > > I just managed to take a pic of the 2-3 week old fry. > > http://www.nimmat.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10001/picture00006.jpg > > > > this is what they were on 4th June > > http://www.nimmat.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10001/betta%20Fry.JPG > > > > Nim > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in > Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > _____ > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > * To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter _____ Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12312	From: Tim Fairchild	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: Moss balls & Rosy Red Minnows

On Tuesday 14 Jun 2005 16:28, paul helms wrote: > these two what? > subject line. > --- Cher <sdkeppler@...> wrote: > > Hello has anyone got any experiance with these two > > any info would be > > apreciated. Thank you Cher in Texas > > __________________________________ > Discover Yahoo! > Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news and more. Check it out! > http://discover.yahoo.com/mobile.html > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > .. > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links > > > -- --------------------------------------------------------- Tim & Therese Fairchild Atchafalaya Border Collies. Kuttabul, Queensland, Australia. --------------------------------------------------------- Email mailto:tim@... Homepage http://www.bcs4me.com Photos http://www.pbase.com/amosf ---------------------------------------------------------

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12313	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: Water Treatment for Ponds

In a message dated 6/13/2005 11:29:50 PM Pacific Daylight Time, wtfmorlok@... writes: > Indications are that goldfish or other sensory > adapted fish species > may react initally, but adapt shortly after. Coy > seem to love it, and > grow faster and larger. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12314	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 6/13/2005
Subject: Re: Water Treatment for Ponds

Woops, what I meant to write but hit seend too fast was the original poster at least need to spell Koi right if he wants to post in aqautic groups. Mike In a message dated 6/13/2005 11:47:40 PM Pacific Daylight Time, Deenerz@... writes: > Indications are that goldfish or other sensory > adapted fish species > may react initally, but adapt shortly after. Coy > seem to love it, and > grow faster and larger. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12315	From: Rei - Raymond Tremor	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: HELP!! Fish with a fat lip! Looks bloody inside

I would think that the turtles bit him and wanted him for dinner. Just a thought. Doesn't turtle eat fishes? It would help if you had a picture of him and also the pics of the turtles. Rei - Raymond Tremor LoveMoAko@... -------Original Message------- From: mommy2acdhsurvivor Date: 06/13/05 17:14:05 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] HELP!! Fish with a fat lip! Looks bloody inside Hello, I have a fish bought as a feeder goldfish definatly not a goldfish. I've had him over a year. He is in a 1 1/2 gallon tank alone (since he ate some of my favorite guppies). Well I thought he needed more room so I put him in my 10 gallon with my two baby quarter sized red eared slider turtles he hid behind a dish in there all day and the next morning he had this big fat lip stuck out and red looks like it's bloody underneath. I think the turtles pooped to much. I put him back in the 1 1/2 gallon and I've been changing the water at different times today trying to keep it clean to hopefully clear up his lip. Anyone have any ideas on what it is. I tried to look up fish diseases but can't find much under fat lip! Hehehe Please help I love him, he's been with me over a year. Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks .. Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12316	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Power filter burned out

3 power filters in 3 years. I have had a couple of my power filters going on 10 years run time. All I have ever had to do was clean them once a month and replace an impellar once. Why are they burning out? are they getting plugged with sand? salt? algae? fish? other debri that is stopping them from turning? Thats the only reason I can think of a power filter burning out. I have a small CHEAP whisper filters for the beginning well over 10 years and its still running. I have had a few Aquaclear filters running over 5 years on the bigger tanks and the only problems with them was they move so much water it was displacing the sand substrate and sucking it up into the Impellar. After replacing the impellar I fashioned a home made prefilter that has worked grate at keeping the sand out. depending on size of tank but a UGF can cost $50-$60 to install, plus you will have to remove everything from the tank, and more or less start over. including cycling the tank, it might be a short cycle if you use the current substrate and Aid it with a seasoned sponge filter or power filter for a few weeks/months. If your tank is small a cheap filter could possibly be a sponge filter or a corner filter, and an airstone. there are so many possibilities in the hobby which makes it nice. rob Indiana *back from vacation* In a message dated 6/14/2005 1:19:56 AM US Eastern Standard Time, wtfmorlok@... writes: > > My power filter burned out today. This is the third > > power filter in the > > three years of keeping fish, that has burned out. I > > am thinking of > > replacing it with an under gravel filter. Can anyone > > recomend a good > > non expensive filtration systom? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12317	From: kb1dva	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: turtles

I have cichlids and I want to get a turtle for my aquariums I know about land turtles but that's it. What kind is compatible with my fish? And are they a lot more work. Nobody answered my sort of dumb question about my 55 gallon tank being so narrow does it limit the kind of fish I can use it for. I want to set this tank up right, the 90 gallon has an emperor 400 filter not quite up to 90 gallons so ill use that on the 55 and get a new filter for the 90, or should I leave it where it is. Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12318	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: turtles

In a message dated 6/14/2005 9:05:59 AM Eastern Standard Time, vze3pd7a@... writes: I have cichlids and I want to get a turtle for my aquariums I know about land turtles but that's it. What kind is compatible with my fish? And are they a lot more work. Nobody answered my sort of dumb question about my 55 gallon tank being so narrow does it limit the kind of fish I can use it for. I don't know of any turtle which is compatible with fish. Turtles typically eat fish -- even the allegedly herbiverous ones. I have had terrapin which were supposedly more herbiverous as they grew older and my old guy still loved his earthworms, slugs and fishies. ;-) Also, most turtles will outgrow your tanks and need some land or dock. If you choose to investigate this further, you need to make sure you understand the differences between tortoises, terrapin and turtles and ~not~ go by their common names which can be very misleading. Your 55 is the stock size. =) I would swap the filters like you suggested and get a new one for the 90. You can put plenty of varieties of fish into a 55 -- what were you thinking you'd like to try? Vicky Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Or write: hgparker@... =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact Dr Breen @ 919-513-1467 _and_ Dr London @ calondon@... 530-754-5711 They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... *Use this sig! Help the scientists help us!* [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12319	From: kb1dva	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: turtles

I think my 90 is overstocked I have 3 Oscars (tigers) I Pacu- 3 blood parrots (small ones) - and 1 pike I was thinking of spreading them out and maybe adding something colorful? I see small acts of fishie aggression but nothing major. The Pacu is a grump he hates everyone! .I know I am eventually going to have to get rid of the pacu he will get to big, but ill cross that bridge when I get to it. One of the Oscars is brightly colored and the other 2 are duller do you know why. Emily _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of seleya8@... Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2005 9:13 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] turtles In a message dated 6/14/2005 9:05:59 AM Eastern Standard Time, vze3pd7a@... writes: I have cichlids and I want to get a turtle for my aquariums I know about land turtles but that's it. What kind is compatible with my fish? And are they a lot more work. Nobody answered my sort of dumb question about my 55 gallon tank being so narrow does it limit the kind of fish I can use it for. I don't know of any turtle which is compatible with fish. Turtles typically eat fish -- even the allegedly herbiverous ones. I have had terrapin which were supposedly more herbiverous as they grew older and my old guy still loved his earthworms, slugs and fishies. ;-) Also, most turtles will outgrow your tanks and need some land or dock. If you choose to investigate this further, you need to make sure you understand the differences between tortoises, terrapin and turtles and ~not~ go by their common names which can be very misleading. Your 55 is the stock size. =) I would swap the filters like you suggested and get a new one for the 90. You can put plenty of varieties of fish into a 55 -- what were you thinking you'd like to try? Vicky Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Or write: hgparker@... =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact Dr Breen @ 919-513-1467 _and_ Dr London @ calondon@... 530-754-5711 They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... *Use this sig! Help the scientists help us!* [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter _____ Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12320	From: kb1dva	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: HELP!

I just noticed one of my tiger Oscars seems to be loosing color is that normal and if it isn't what can I do for him Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12321	From: Patrick	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: [spam] Re: [AquaticLife] aquarium heaters

I would just go with 2 300 watt heaters. According to the heater charts for most heaters, 300 watts is good for about 100 gallons, so one on each end should easily be enough. Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill -------Original Message------- The problem that I have is that I suck with math and equations. I can add, subtract, multiply and divide like the wind, but throw me a story problem and I immediately get flustered and want to cry! Would it be advisable to go with two 400 watt heaters? Big Als online states that the Hydor Theo submersible 400 watt heater is recommended for tanks between 80 and 105 gallons. Maybe a 300 and a 400? Lin-duh [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12322	From: mommy2acdhsurvivor	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: HELP!! Fish with a fat lip! Looks bloody inside

I'll try and take some t > I would think that the turtles bit him and wanted him for dinner. Just a > thought. Doesn't turtle eat fishes? It would help if you had a picture of > him and also the pics of the turtles. > > Rei - Raymond Tremor > LoveMoAko@H... > > -------Original Message------- > > From: mommy2acdhsurvivor > Date: 06/13/05 17:14:05 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] HELP!! Fish with a fat lip! Looks bloody inside > > Hello, > I have a fish bought as a feeder goldfish definatly not a goldfish. > I've had him over a year. He is in a 1 1/2 gallon tank alone (since he > ate some of my favorite guppies). Well I thought he needed more room > so I put him in my 10 gallon with my two baby quarter sized red eared > slider turtles he hid behind a dish in there all day and the next > morning he had this big fat lip stuck out and red looks like it's > bloody underneath. I think the turtles pooped to much. I put him back > in the 1 1/2 gallon and I've been changing the water at different > times today trying to keep it clean to hopefully clear up his lip. > Anyone have any ideas on what it is. I tried to look up fish diseases > but can't find much under fat lip! Hehehe Please help I love him, he's > been with me over a year. > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > .. > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12323	From: Patrick	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Power filter burned out

UGFs are great for tanks 10 gallons and under, but the bigger the tank the less efficient they are. Paul will soon reply in disagreement. :) I suggest two things. First, get a marineland filter (penguin, emperor, aquatech regent). Second, call an electrician and have them make sure that outlet and the breaker/fuse is working right. If you have sand in your tank get some filter floss wraped around the filter intake and tied on with zip ties. Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill -------Original Message------- My power filter burned out today. This is the third power filter in the three years of keeping fish, that has burned out. I am thinking of replacing it with an under gravel filter. Can anyone recomend a good non expensive filtration systom? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12324	From: Patrick	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Water Treatment for Ponds

This is a great product to have in any pond with an algae problem. Hook it up, plug it in, and boom. All the free-floating bacteria and algae are gone! Of course, it is probably just a UV sterilizer! :) Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill -------Original Message------- bacteria is necessary to keep the water healthy for the fish living in it. biologic filtration is the key to keeping them alive, and since your product will not do anything to take ammonia out of the body of water and will kill off the only 2 things that perform this function (bacteria and plant life) a pond keeper would be absolutely stupid to participate if they wish to have anything left alive. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12325	From: Karen	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: HELP!! Fish with a fat lip! Looks bloody inside

I haven't seen this mentioned yet. Melafix and Pimafix will speed the healing dramatically. You can get it at any good LFS or online. It's good to keep around for any kind of injuries, pop-eye, etc. You will need to quarantine your fish in a small tank and remove any carbon from your filter. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "mommy2acdhsurvivor" <CK147@H...> wrote: > I'll try and take some t > > > > I would think that the turtles bit him and wanted him for dinner. Just a > > thought. Doesn't turtle eat fishes? It would help if you had a > picture of > > him and also the pics of the turtles. > > > > Rei - Raymond Tremor > > LoveMoAko@H... > > > > -------Original Message------- > > > > From: mommy2acdhsurvivor > > Date: 06/13/05 17:14:05 > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] HELP!! Fish with a fat lip! Looks bloody inside > > > > Hello, > > I have a fish bought as a feeder goldfish definatly not a goldfish. > > I've had him over a year. He is in a 1 1/2 gallon tank alone (since he > > ate some of my favorite guppies). Well I thought he needed more room > > so I put him in my 10 gallon with my two baby quarter sized red eared > > slider turtles he hid behind a dish in there all day and the next > > morning he had this big fat lip stuck out and red looks like it's > > bloody underneath. I think the turtles pooped to much. I put him back > > in the 1 1/2 gallon and I've been changing the water at different > > times today trying to keep it clean to hopefully clear up his lip. > > Anyone have any ideas on what it is. I tried to look up fish diseases > > but can't find much under fat lip! Hehehe Please help I love him, he's > > been with me over a year. > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > > .. > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not > important to > > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we > Thank You > > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > To visit your group on the web, go to: > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12326	From: Chris	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Power filter burned out

Well, after thougholy checking it out, it wasn't burned out, JUST UNPLUGGED. After filling it with water, and plugging it back in, it appears to be working fine. I didn't notice it unplugged before. But, I am glad that it wasn't burned out after all. I apreciate teh advice. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Patrick" <patrickmn@c...> wrote: > UGFs are great for tanks 10 gallons and under, but the bigger the tank > the less efficient they are. Paul will soon reply in disagreement. :) I > suggest two things. First, get a marineland filter (penguin, emperor, > aquatech regent). Second, call an electrician and have them make sure that > outlet and the breaker/fuse is working right. If you have sand in your tank > get some filter floss wraped around the filter intake and tied on with zip > ties. > > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy. > > "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is > perhaps, the end of the beginning." > -Winston Churchill > -------Original Message------- > My power filter burned out today. This is the third power filter in the > three years of keeping fish, that has burned out. I am thinking of > replacing it with an under gravel filter. Can anyone recomend a good > non expensive filtration systom? > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12327	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium heaters

Hi Linda, After reading the numerous replies, I thought I would add a bit of info to help you decide. First of all. contrary to what you may have heard or read, Angels do not need the higher temperatures you are thinking of keeping them at, unless you are actually breeding them (and then they will breed at lower temperatures anyway if they decide to breed). To ensure Angels will breed, the best temperature to keep them at, at that time, is around 80o. Now, unless you plan on breeding your Angels right in the community tank when you get them up to size and paired off, you don't need that tank to get much more than the 78o you seem to finally have decided on; 76o -- 77o would be fine, especially as Tetras don't want it that warm. \ The old formula for figuring out heater requirements is 2 Watts per gallon for every 5 degrees you want to raise the water temperature. I would recommend two 200 Watt heaters. This will give you 400 Watts which will give you nearly 3 Watts per gallon; actually 2.67 (2 2/3) watts per gallon, which will raise your tank water nearly 7 degrees (actually 6.675 degrees to be specific). This added to your 72o room temperature would be enough to bring the tank up to over 78o, not that you need to set it that high. \ Incidentally, although its been a long time since I've become aware of this, but I believe the odds of obtaining at least one pair out of 6 fish is about 97% if memory serves me correctly. With 10 Angels, you should certainly get multiple pairs. Always good to start off with a few more if you have the room -- you may lose one or two along the way. Regards, Ray \ -- - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > What size heater would you recommend for a 150 gallon tank? > > Two 200 watt heaters? > Two 300 watt heaters? > Maybe a 400 watt heater would suffice. > > Linda > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12328	From: paul helms	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Water Treatment for Ponds

he said it was just electrical current --- Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: > This is a great product to have in any pond with an > algae problem. Hook it > up, plug it in, and boom. All the free-floating > bacteria and algae are > gone! Of course, it is probably just a UV > sterilizer! :) > > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy. > > "Now this is not the end. It is not even the > beginning of the end. But it is > perhaps, the end of the beginning." > -Winston Churchill > -------Original Message------- > bacteria is necessary to keep the water healthy for > the fish living in it. biologic filtration is the > key > to keeping them alive, and since your product will > not > do anything to take ammonia out of the body of water > and will kill off the only 2 things that perform > this > function (bacteria and plant life) a pond keeper > would > be absolutely stupid to participate if they wish to > have anything left alive. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Find restaurants, movies, travel and more fun for the weekend. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/weekend.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12329	From: paul helms	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: turtles

florida soft shels do great with south american cichlids...outside of that i would not put a turtle with fish under normal circumstances. although one of my clients does have 2 adult sliders with 2 dozen prastilla tetras and a pleco --- seleya8@... wrote: > > > In a message dated 6/14/2005 9:05:59 AM Eastern > Standard Time, > vze3pd7a@... writes: > > I have cichlids and I want to get a turtle for my > aquariums I know about > land turtles but that's it. What kind is compatible > with my fish? > > And are they a lot more work. Nobody answered my > sort of dumb question about > my 55 gallon tank being so narrow does it limit the > kind of fish I can use > it for. > > I don't know of any turtle which is compatible with > fish. Turtles typically > eat fish -- even the allegedly herbiverous ones. I > have had terrapin which > were supposedly more herbiverous as they grew older > and my old guy still loved > his earthworms, slugs and fishies. ;-) Also, most > turtles will outgrow your > tanks and need some land or dock. If you choose to > investigate this further, > you need to make sure you understand the differences > between tortoises, > terrapin and turtles and ~not~ go by their common > names which can be very > misleading. > > Your 55 is the stock size. =) I would swap the > filters like you suggested > and get a new one for the 90. You can put plenty of > varieties of fish into a 55 > -- what were you thinking you'd like to try? > > > Vicky > > Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! > ASK ME how to help Dr > Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older > dogs! Or write: > hgparker@... =) > > Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact Dr Breen @ > 919-513-1467 _and_ Dr > London @ calondon@... 530-754-5711 They NEED > your specimens! > > Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write > cathryn.mellersh@... > > *Use this sig! Help the scientists help us!* > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Stay in touch with email, IM, photo sharing and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/stayintouch.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12330	From: helen572	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Crayfish

I have a blue crayfish and she had eggs once, but I think she ate them. I never saw any craybabies -- I don't want any either, so I don't know much about breeding, but you should check out this site: http://bluecrayfish.com/ The site is devoted to the care of all types of crayfish, and they have a message board too. Good luck --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Amanda" <acharris23@y...> wrote: > Does anyone know much about crayfish breeding. I have had crayfish > for a long time for puffer food, but now one of them has eggs, so I > am going to try to raise the babies for food later on to cut down on > cost. I was just wondering if it is ok to move the crayfish to a > smaller tank on her own. I didn't worry about it much at first, > because I know the babies stay attached to their mother and all > that, but the male crayfish in the tank with her has started to > chase her around the tank. Is this usual? Is he trying to eat the > eggs? Also, with the research that I have done on the internet > researching breeding, everyone says the length of time for hatching > depends on tank temp. Does anyone know a good temp to make them > hatch quicker? I have moved her to a 1 gallon hex tank with some > plants in it, and an air stone for now. Until I can find out if she > is safe with the other crayfish in the tank. This 30 gallon tank is > heavily planted, and has some pvc pipe, but she just can't seem to > hide from him. Also, he is a lot larger than her. Also, what is the > usual number of babies that hatch? It looks like she has at least > 100 eggs on her. Thanks in advance for all of your help. > > Oh, someone said that I should add some salt to the water to help > aid with the development of the babies/eggs. Is this true?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12331	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: HELP!! Fish with a fat lip! Looks bloody inside

Worth a try and might do some good. Just do not mix these two medications -- use one or the other. While I'll probably get a reply saying its perfectly safe to do so, I've read of accounts where mixing these two meds had a bad reaction -- like wiping out all the fish in the tank. In all fairness, while there may have been some other unknown factor(s) in these tanks that contributed to this end (or maybe not), I don't feel its worth taking that chance. Just a precautionary suggestion. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Karen" <oilfield_brat@y...> wrote: > I haven't seen this mentioned yet. Melafix and Pimafix will speed > the healing dramatically. You can get it at any good LFS or online. > It's good to keep around for any kind of injuries, pop-eye, etc. You > will need to quarantine your fish in a small tank and remove any > carbon from your filter. > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "mommy2acdhsurvivor" > <CK147@H...> wrote: > > I'll try and take some t > > > > > > > I would think that the turtles bit him and wanted him for > dinner. Just a > > > thought. Doesn't turtle eat fishes? It would help if you had a > > picture of > > > him and also the pics of the turtles. > > > > > > Rei - Raymond Tremor > > > LoveMoAko@H... > > > > > > -------Original Message------- > > > > > > From: mommy2acdhsurvivor > > > Date: 06/13/05 17:14:05 > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: [AquaticLife] HELP!! Fish with a fat lip! Looks bloody > inside > > > > > > Hello, > > > I have a fish bought as a feeder goldfish definatly not a > goldfish. > > > I've had him over a year. He is in a 1 1/2 gallon tank alone > (since he > > > ate some of my favorite guppies). Well I thought he needed more > room > > > so I put him in my 10 gallon with my two baby quarter sized red > eared > > > slider turtles he hid behind a dish in there all day and the next > > > morning he had this big fat lip stuck out and red looks like it's > > > bloody underneath. I think the turtles pooped to much. I put him > back > > > in the 1 1/2 gallon and I've been changing the water at different > > > times today trying to keep it clean to hopefully clear up his > lip. > > > Anyone have any ideas on what it is. I tried to look up fish > diseases > > > but can't find much under fat lip! Hehehe Please help I love > him, he's > > > been with me over a year. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks > > > .. > > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not > > important to > > > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message > modify the > > > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we > > Thank You > > > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > To visit your group on the web, go to: > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12332	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Power filter burned out

LMAO :-) I'm not laughing at you but with you.. I think we all have been there. rob Indiana In a message dated 6/14/2005 11:58:40 AM US Eastern Standard Time, cjreporter98@... writes: > Well, after thougholy checking it out, it wasn't burned out, JUST > UNPLUGGED. After filling it with water, and plugging it back in, it > appears to be working fine. I didn't notice it unplugged before. But, > I am glad that it wasn't burned out after all. I apreciate teh advice. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12333	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Betta and Dannios

I'm cycling a tank and put my sons betta in there. Now I don't have the heart to take him out. Will he be OK with the three giant danios for cycling? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12334	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies

Do you feed the plants anything special? Im hoping to buy some more plants over the weekend so eventually I won't need to seperate my Guppie fry from the parents, hoping they can use the plants to hide in. =Nick ----- Original Message ----- From: "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2005 4:37 PM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies > Hi Nick, > > > > Light is a shocker ;). I have only 11W PLL bulb over the tank that's is > half > daylight and half bluemoon. They are no where near to even a standard > aquarium light but still the plants are doing great. > > One of the fry seems to have started to show a bit of colour as well ;) > > > > Nim > > > > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Nicolas Munro > Sent: 13 June 2005 23:45 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies > > > > How much light do you have for your tank? both the plants and the betta > fry > > look really good. > > Look similar to guppie fry too. > > =Nick > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@...> > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Friday, June 10, 2005 6:53 PM > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies > > >> Rei, >> >> >> >> This was actually by accident. 2 double tail females with a very standard >> male and I don't know which one of the 2 had spawned coz all 3 of them >> died >> after spawning :-( >> >> I have not fed them anything special at the moment. infact I have not yet >> put any food in the tank. My guess was that the snails created infusoria >> that fed the fry and if they managed to survive a couple of weeks without >> me >> noticing them then something must have been right. >> >> >> >> I have some fine powdered high protein fry food that I will start from >> today >> as I think they are big enough to take this food. I have already seen one >> of >> the fry pull out a baby snail from their shell, so maybe that is another >> source of food for them. >> >> >> >> The plants are Hygroplhilla polysperma, Java moss, Hydrocotyle and a >> couple >> of stems of bacopa and ludwigia with a few hanging crypts and anubias. >> Nothing is really rooted in that tank as the gravel bottom is just ½ ". I >> did think about feeding them baby brineshrimp but then I thought that >> there >> is no point as the most cruitial stage has passed and they are twice the >> size of a newly born guppy fry and should be able to take normal food. As >> you can see that their bellies are still full, so I think there is plenty >> of >> what ever they are feeding. >> >> >> >> Nim >> >> >> >> >> >> _____ >> >> From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On >> Behalf Of Rei - Raymond Tremor >> Sent: 10 June 2005 09:35 >> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com >> Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies >> >> >> >> What kind of betta did you breed? What are you feeding them? I was >> feeding >> mine with baby brime shrimp and hard boiled egg yolk and sometimes beef >> heart and also boiled chicken meat shredded. I don't have bettas now >> cause >> it is hard work to clean tanks. I like your plants, what kind are they? I >> bred a crown tail female with a twin tail male. Some of the babies were >> twin >> crown tail. I used a 5 galloon tank with anacharis plants and about 4 to >> 5 >> inches of water cause I had been told that the babies will survive more >> if >> the water level was low cause they have a shorter swim from the bottom to >> the top. I had 20 babies and they live up to a year (maybe more cause I >> gave >> them away when I decided to keep a goldfish tank). >> >> Rei - Raymond Tremor >> LoveMoAko@... >> >> -------Original Message------- >> >> From: Nimish Mathur >> Date: 06/09/05 20:47:16 >> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com >> Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies >> >> I just managed to take a pic of the 2-3 week old fry. >> >> http://www.nimmat.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10001/picture00006.jpg >> >> >> >> this is what they were on 4th June >> >> http://www.nimmat.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10001/betta%20Fry.JPG >> >> >> >> Nim >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >> >> >> >> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks >> . >> Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important >> to >> the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the >> subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You >> in >> Advance for your help in this matter >> >> >> >> >> Yahoo! Groups Links >> >> To visit your group on the web, go to: >> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ >> >> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: >> AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com >> >> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. >> >> >> >> >> >> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks >> . >> Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important >> to >> the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the >> subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank >> You >> in Advance for your help in this matter >> >> >> >> >> _____ >> >> Yahoo! Groups Links >> >> * To visit your group on the web, go to: >> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ >> >> * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: >> AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com >> <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> >> >> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! >> <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. >> >> >> >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >> >> >> >> >> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks >> . >> Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important >> to > >> the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the >> subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank >> You > >> in Advance for your help in this matter >> Yahoo! Groups Links >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > _____ > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > * To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12335	From: mommy2acdhsurvivor	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: HELP!! Fish with a fat lip! Looks bloody inside

Thanks I'm going to town tonight I will try and find some. Today his lip isn't as swollen but you can definatly see the blood I will try and upload some pics under Melanie's pics. But it was hard and I don't think they turned out good. > I haven't seen this mentioned yet. Melafix and Pimafix will speed > the healing dramatically. You can get it at any good LFS or online. > It's good to keep around for any kind of injuries, pop-eye, etc. You > will need to quarantine your fish in a small tank and remove any > carbon from your filter. > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "mommy2acdhsurvivor" > <CK147@H...> wrote: > > I'll try and take some t > > > > > > > I would think that the turtles bit him and wanted him for > dinner. Just a > > > thought. Doesn't turtle eat fishes? It would help if you had a > > picture of > > > him and also the pics of the turtles. > > > > > > Rei - Raymond Tremor > > > LoveMoAko@H... > > > > > > -------Original Message------- > > > > > > From: mommy2acdhsurvivor > > > Date: 06/13/05 17:14:05 > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: [AquaticLife] HELP!! Fish with a fat lip! Looks bloody > inside > > > > > > Hello, > > > I have a fish bought as a feeder goldfish definatly not a > goldfish. > > > I've had him over a year. He is in a 1 1/2 gallon tank alone > (since he > > > ate some of my favorite guppies). Well I thought he needed more > room > > > so I put him in my 10 gallon with my two baby quarter sized red > eared > > > slider turtles he hid behind a dish in there all day and the next > > > morning he had this big fat lip stuck out and red looks like it's > > > bloody underneath. I think the turtles pooped to much. I put him > back > > > in the 1 1/2 gallon and I've been changing the water at different > > > times today trying to keep it clean to hopefully clear up his > lip. > > > Anyone have any ideas on what it is. I tried to look up fish > diseases > > > but can't find much under fat lip! Hehehe Please help I love > him, he's > > > been with me over a year. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks > > > .. > > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not > > important to > > > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message > modify the > > > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we > > Thank You > > > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > To visit your group on the web, go to: > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12336	From: mommy2acdhsurvivor	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: HELP!! Fish with a fat lip! Looks bloody inside

Thanks I will only use one. I already feel horrible about him hurt I would feel worse if he dies. > Worth a try and might do some good. Just do not mix these two > medications -- use one or the other. While I'll probably get a reply > saying its perfectly safe to do so, I've read of accounts where > mixing these two meds had a bad reaction -- like wiping out all the > fish in the tank. In all fairness, while there may have been some > other unknown factor(s) in these tanks that contributed to this end > (or maybe not), I don't feel its worth taking that chance. Just a > precautionary suggestion. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Karen" <oilfield_brat@y...> > wrote: > > I haven't seen this mentioned yet. Melafix and Pimafix will speed > > the healing dramatically. You can get it at any good LFS or online. > > It's good to keep around for any kind of injuries, pop-eye, etc. > You > > will need to quarantine your fish in a small tank and remove any > > carbon from your filter. > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "mommy2acdhsurvivor" > > <CK147@H...> wrote: > > > I'll try and take some t > > > > > > > > > > I would think that the turtles bit him and wanted him for > > dinner. Just a > > > > thought. Doesn't turtle eat fishes? It would help if you had a > > > picture of > > > > him and also the pics of the turtles. > > > > > > > > Rei - Raymond Tremor > > > > LoveMoAko@H... > > > > > > > > -------Original Message------- > > > > > > > > From: mommy2acdhsurvivor > > > > Date: 06/13/05 17:14:05 > > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > > Subject: [AquaticLife] HELP!! Fish with a fat lip! Looks bloody > > inside > > > > > > > > Hello, > > > > I have a fish bought as a feeder goldfish definatly not a > > goldfish. > > > > I've had him over a year. He is in a 1 1/2 gallon tank alone > > (since he > > > > ate some of my favorite guppies). Well I thought he needed more > > room > > > > so I put him in my 10 gallon with my two baby quarter sized red > > eared > > > > slider turtles he hid behind a dish in there all day and the > next > > > > morning he had this big fat lip stuck out and red looks like > it's > > > > bloody underneath. I think the turtles pooped to much. I put > him > > back > > > > in the 1 1/2 gallon and I've been changing the water at > different > > > > times today trying to keep it clean to hopefully clear up his > > lip. > > > > Anyone have any ideas on what it is. I tried to look up fish > > diseases > > > > but can't find much under fat lip! Hehehe Please help I love > > him, he's > > > > been with me over a year. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > > thanks > > > > .. > > > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not > > > important to > > > > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message > > modify the > > > > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we > > > Thank You > > > > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > To visit your group on the web, go to: > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > > > > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12337	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Power filter burned out

>plus you will have to remove everything from the tank, and more or less >start over. > including cycling the tank, it might be a short cycle if you use the > current > substrate and Aid it with a seasoned sponge filter or power filter for a > few > weeks/months. I did just that not long ago. I caught all my fish and put them into a large bucket. Sucked all the water out of the tank, cleaned my substrate with household (city) tap water, cleaned the rockes the same way... When I returned every thing and filled the tank up with fresh water, the amonia spike lasted maybe 24 or 48 hours. So wouldn't really affect ya too bad. =Nick 90 gallon tropical freshwater tank. ----- Original Message ----- From: <FortWayneFish@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2005 9:10 PM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Power filter burned out >3 power filters in 3 years. I have had a couple of my power filters going >on > 10 years run time. All I have ever had to do was clean them once a month > and > replace an impellar once. > > Why are they burning out? are they getting plugged with sand? salt? > algae? > fish? other debri that is stopping them from turning? Thats the only > reason I > can think of a power filter burning out. I have a small CHEAP whisper > filters > for > the beginning well over 10 years and its still running. > > I have had a few Aquaclear filters running over 5 years on the bigger > tanks > and the only problems with them was they move so much water it was > displacing > the sand substrate and sucking it up into the Impellar. After replacing > the > impellar I fashioned a home made prefilter that has worked grate at > keeping the > sand out. > > depending on size of tank but a UGF can cost $50-$60 to install, plus you > will have to remove everything from the tank, and more or less start over. > including cycling the tank, it might be a short cycle if you use the > current > substrate and Aid it with a seasoned sponge filter or power filter for a > few > weeks/months. > > If your tank is small a cheap filter could possibly be a sponge filter or > a > corner filter, and an airstone. there are so many possibilities in the > hobby > which makes it nice. > > > rob > Indiana > *back from vacation* > > > In a message dated 6/14/2005 1:19:56 AM US Eastern Standard Time, > wtfmorlok@... writes: > > >> > My power filter burned out today. This is the third >> > power filter in the >> > three years of keeping fish, that has burned out. I >> > am thinking of >> > replacing it with an under gravel filter. Can anyone >> > recomend a good >> > non expensive filtration systom? > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12338	From: mommy2acdhsurvivor	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: HELP!! Fish with a fat lip! Looks bloody inside

It's the last 3 photos in the folder MELANIE'S PICS He wouldn't look at me so the last pic is horrible. Anyone have any idea as to what kind of fish he is? He has orange eyes. Thanks

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12339	From: Tim Fairchild	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Power filter burned out

On Wednesday 15 Jun 2005 09:08, Nicolas Munro wrote: > >plus you will have to remove everything from the tank, and more or less > >start over. > > including cycling the tank, it might be a short cycle if you use the > > current > > substrate and Aid it with a seasoned sponge filter or power filter for a > > few > > weeks/months. > > I did just that not long ago. I caught all my fish and put them into a > large bucket. Sucked all the water out of the tank, cleaned my substrate > with household (city) tap water, cleaned the rockes the same way... > > When I returned every thing and filled the tank up with fresh water, the > amonia spike lasted maybe 24 or 48 hours. So wouldn't really affect ya too > bad. How long were the nitrite levels up? tim -- --------------------------------------------------------- Tim & Therese Fairchild Atchafalaya Border Collies. Kuttabul, Queensland, Australia. --------------------------------------------------------- Email mailto:tim@... Homepage http://www.bcs4me.com Photos http://www.pbase.com/amosf ---------------------------------------------------------

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12340	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium heaters

Thanks Ray! It is nice to have input from so many knowledgeable people! Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12341	From: Amanda	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: HELP!! Fish with a fat lip! Looks bloody inside

He looks like a croppy. There might be a more technical, or pet store name for him, but he looks just like the fish that my boyfriend caught in a cast net, and insisted on putting in my 55 gallon tank. My boyfriend calls it a croppy. All I know is he loves feeder fish, won't really eat anything else. He does look exactly like my fish though, with the exception that mine has gotten a lot bigger. I could be wrong, but since he came with feeder fish, he may be. Mandy --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "mommy2acdhsurvivor" <CK147@H...> wrote: > It's the last 3 photos in the folder MELANIE'S PICS He wouldn't look > at me so the last pic is horrible. Anyone have any idea as to what > kind of fish he is? He has orange eyes. Thanks

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12342	From: Amanda	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: HELP!! Fish with a fat lip! Looks bloody inside

Sorry, it is spelled crappie, and pronounce croppy. I will add some pics of my tanks and fish a little later when my batteries charge. I will post them in a folder called Mandy's Pics. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Amanda" <acharris23@y...> wrote: > He looks like a croppy. There might be a more technical, or pet store > name for him, but he looks just like the fish that my boyfriend caught > in a cast net, and insisted on putting in my 55 gallon tank. My > boyfriend calls it a croppy. All I know is he loves feeder fish, won't > really eat anything else. He does look exactly like my fish though, > with the exception that mine has gotten a lot bigger. I could be wrong, > but since he came with feeder fish, he may be. > > Mandy > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "mommy2acdhsurvivor" <CK147@H...> > wrote: > > It's the last 3 photos in the folder MELANIE'S PICS He wouldn't look > > at me so the last pic is horrible. Anyone have any idea as to what > > kind of fish he is? He has orange eyes. Thanks

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12343	From: red eye	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Subject line ---> was > turtles

kb1dva <vze3pd7a@...> wrote:I think my 90 is overstocked I have 3 Oscars (tigers) I Pacu- 3 blood parrots (small ones) - and 1 pike I was thinking of spreading them out and maybe adding something colorful? I see small acts of fishie aggression but nothing major. The Pacu is a grump he hates everyone! .I know I am eventually going to have to get rid of the pacu he will get to big, but ill cross that bridge when I get to it. One of the Oscars is brightly colored and the other 2 are duller do you know why. Emily _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of seleya8@... Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2005 9:13 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] turtles In a message dated 6/14/2005 9:05:59 AM Eastern Standard Time, vze3pd7a@... writes: I have cichlids and I want to get a turtle for my aquariums I know about land turtles but that's it. What kind is compatible with my fish? And are they a lot more work. Nobody answered my sort of dumb question about my 55 gallon tank being so narrow does it limit the kind of fish I can use it for. I don't know of any turtle which is compatible with fish. Turtles typically eat fish -- even the allegedly herbiverous ones. I have had terrapin which were supposedly more herbiverous as they grew older and my old guy still loved his earthworms, slugs and fishies. ;-) Also, most turtles will outgrow your tanks and need some land or dock. If you choose to investigate this further, you need to make sure you understand the differences between tortoises, terrapin and turtles and ~not~ go by their common names which can be very misleading. Your 55 is the stock size. =) I would swap the filters like you suggested and get a new one for the 90. You can put plenty of varieties of fish into a 55 -- what were you thinking you'd like to try? Vicky Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Or write: hgparker@... =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact Dr Breen @ 919-513-1467 _and_ Dr London @ calondon@... 530-754-5711 They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... *Use this sig! Help the scientists help us!* [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter _____ Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter --------------------------------- Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12344	From: rlmec	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Water Treatment for Ponds

Paul, So far, studies have shown it in fact works quite well, unless you feel that a pond requires algae blooms, e. coli and other various forms of harmful water-borne bacteria to maintain a "healthy" ecosystem. Also, the protective coating on the fish is not affected. This in no way is a "new" study. As I said, it is being used very successfully in Japan and elsewhere. Only the algae and bacteria that passes the unit, mounted on the filtration system, are affected. A healthy balance of algae (and bacteria) still is able to propagate on the rocks and sub-surfaces of the pond thus maintaining a balanced system. This is done primarily by specifying a correct amount of "turn-over" of the filtration system. If your filtration system turns over the entire volume of the pond much faster than the algae or bacteria can propagate, then it is true that you would end up with a sterile pond. Typical species of algae propagate well within 30 minutes. Does your filtration system turn the entire volume of the pond faster than this? I think most likely not. I understand your concerns and remarks, but wanted to point out that there is much more to the picture than meets the eye. The system is also already being used on several large aquifers in the UK where fish are part of the ecosystem with great success as well. The most apparent end result is the clarity of the pond. If you don't want to see what is on the bottom of the pond, you won't like this product! One client in the UK complained (jokingly) that they had to clean up all the beer cans on the bottom of their pond because they could see every pebble now. hahaha! True story! -Ron --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms <wtfmorlok@y...> wrote: > bacteria is necessary to keep the water healthy for > the fish living in it. biologic filtration is the key > to keeping them alive, and since your product will not > do anything to take ammonia out of the body of water > and will kill off the only 2 things that perform this > function (bacteria and plant life) a pond keeper would > be absolutely stupid to participate if they wish to > have anything left alive. > > --- rlmec <ronm@r...> wrote: > > > Hi all, > > Hopefully this is not considered spamming, however I > > am a distributor > > for a new product line of water treatment equipment > > (at least new for > > the USA), and I would like to see how well it works > > with ponds. We > > are currently conducting some pool trials, and I > > have something lined > > up with a local botanical garden for testing, > > however it is for a > > fountain and has no fish or aquatic life (that they > > want). > > > > The manufacturer says his distributor in Japan has > > done quite a bit > > in the area of ponds with great success, however we > > have not received > > any translated case study materials. The product is > > an electronic non- > > chemical unit that eliminates algea and bacteria, > > and is most often > > used for commercial pools and cooling towers. I > > would be interested > > in conducting some trials in regard to ponds with > > aquatic life to > > determine effectiveness and compatibility with pond > > life. > > > > Indications are that goldfish or other sensory > > adapted fish species > > may react initally, but adapt shortly after. Coy > > seem to love it, and > > grow faster and larger. > > > > If any of you would be willing to conduct a unbiased > > case study for > > us, I would be interested in putting it together. > > We would expect > > some detailed records, documentation, and photos out > > of it. I would > > prefer to conduct the trial with a commercial > > entity. > > > > Thanks, > > Ron Moon - RLM-EC > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > Discover Yahoo! > Find restaurants, movies, travel and more fun for the weekend. Check it out! > http://discover.yahoo.com/weekend.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12345	From: rlmec	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Water Treatment for Ponds

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Deenerz@a... wrote: > > Woops, what I meant to write but hit seend too fast was the original poster > at least need to spell Koi right if he wants to post in aqautic groups. > Mike > > In a message dated 6/13/2005 11:47:40 PM Pacific Daylight Time, > Deenerz@a... writes: > > > > Indications are that goldfish or other sensory > > adapted fish species > > may react initally, but adapt shortly after. Coy > > seem to love it, and > > grow faster and larger. > > Thanks Mike, and sorry about the typo. BTW: woops is spelled "whoops", I assume you meant "send" not seend, and "aquatic" instead of "aqautic"? Can I assume sentence structure is not so important in "aquatic groups" as well, as long as the names of the fish are spelled correctly? Or, were you just being funny? LOL!!! -Ron

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12346	From: Lief Brittan Youngs	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Moss Balls

Hey, Moss balls are way cool. They are like green sponge balls and are an algrea that grows very slowly. I have one because I think they look really cool. Lief Message: 1 Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2005 18:38:11 -0000 From: "Cher" Subject: Moss balls & Rosy Red Minnows Hello has anyone got any experiance with these two any info would be apreciated. Thank you Cher in Texas ++++++++++++++++++++Lief Youngs++++++++++++++++++++ http://geocities.com/SouthBeach/Mansion/4739 Colorado State University Graduate May 2004 B.S. Bioagricultural Sciences major B.S. Agricultural Business major +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ To give anything less than your best is to sacrifice the gift. -- Steve Prefontaine --------------------------------- Discover Yahoo! Have fun online with music videos, cool games, IM & more. Check it out! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12347	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Colored Blood Parrots IKES!!! * Pic attached

Is this a fake picture or do people actually do this? Half these poor guys have black spot parasites in their eyes and it is already spread to many fins... I hope this is fake. (If the picture doesn't through then attachments aren't allowed and I can post it to a folder tomorrow.) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12348	From: Rei - Raymond Tremor	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies

Nick, I feed them the liquid Flourite by Seachem and now I am trying to use Plant Gro by Nutrafin. I don't have a substrate and only have a plant box with plant plugs and stones. I have to cover the plant plugs with stones cause the goldfishes are notorious in removing the plant plugs. I have anubis nana and anubis barteri in the plant box but they managed to nibble on some of the leaves till it turned yellowish and then brownish. I don't know if I have snails but couldn't see anything. I washed the plants before. I had added the anacharis but washed them in a cool running water. What is a good plant food? Rei - Raymond Tremor LoveMoAko@... http://www.geocities.com/raymondtremor/my-bettas.html -------Original Message------- From: Nicolas Munro Date: 06/14/05 12:55:14 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies Do you feed the plants anything special? Im hoping to buy some more plants over the weekend so eventually I won't need to seperate my Guppie fry from the parents, hoping they can use the plants to hide in. =Nick ----- Original Message ----- From: "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2005 4:37 PM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies > Hi Nick, > > > > Light is a shocker ;). I have only 11W PLL bulb over the tank that's is > half > daylight and half bluemoon. They are no where near to even a standard > aquarium light but still the plants are doing great. > > One of the fry seems to have started to show a bit of colour as well ;) > > > > Nim > > > > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Nicolas Munro > Sent: 13 June 2005 23:45 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies > > > > How much light do you have for your tank? both the plants and the betta > fry > > look really good. > > Look similar to guppie fry too. > > =Nick > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@...> > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Friday, June 10, 2005 6:53 PM > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies > > >> Rei, >> >> >> >> This was actually by accident. 2 double tail females with a very standard >> male and I don't know which one of the 2 had spawned coz all 3 of them >> died >> after spawning :-( >> >> I have not fed them anything special at the moment. infact I have not yet >> put any food in the tank. My guess was that the snails created infusoria >> that fed the fry and if they managed to survive a couple of weeks without >> me >> noticing them then something must have been right. >> >> >> >> I have some fine powdered high protein fry food that I will start from >> today >> as I think they are big enough to take this food. I have already seen one >> of >> the fry pull out a baby snail from their shell, so maybe that is another >> source of food for them. >> >> >> >> The plants are Hygroplhilla polysperma, Java moss, Hydrocotyle and a >> couple >> of stems of bacopa and ludwigia with a few hanging crypts and anubias. >> Nothing is really rooted in that tank as the gravel bottom is just ½ ". I >> did think about feeding them baby brineshrimp but then I thought that >> there >> is no point as the most cruitial stage has passed and they are twice the >> size of a newly born guppy fry and should be able to take normal food. As >> you can see that their bellies are still full, so I think there is plenty >> of >> what ever they are feeding. >> >> >> >> Nim >> >> >> >> >> >> _____ >> >> From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On >> Behalf Of Rei - Raymond Tremor >> Sent: 10 June 2005 09:35 >> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com >> Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies >> >> >> >> What kind of betta did you breed? What are you feeding them? I was >> feeding >> mine with baby brime shrimp and hard boiled egg yolk and sometimes beef >> heart and also boiled chicken meat shredded. I don't have bettas now >> cause >> it is hard work to clean tanks. I like your plants, what kind are they? I >> bred a crown tail female with a twin tail male. Some of the babies were >> twin >> crown tail. I used a 5 galloon tank with anacharis plants and about 4 to >> 5 >> inches of water cause I had been told that the babies will survive more >> if >> the water level was low cause they have a shorter swim from the bottom to >> the top. I had 20 babies and they live up to a year (maybe more cause I >> gave >> them away when I decided to keep a goldfish tank). >> >> Rei - Raymond Tremor >> LoveMoAko@... >> >> -------Original Message------- >> >> From: Nimish Mathur >> Date: 06/09/05 20:47:16 >> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com >> Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies >> >> I just managed to take a pic of the 2-3 week old fry. >> >> http://www.nimmat.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10001/picture00006.jpg >> >> >> >> this is what they were on 4th June >> >> http://www.nimmat.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10001/betta%20Fry.JPG >> >> >> >> Nim >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >> >> >> >> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks >> . >> Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important >> to >> the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the >> subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You >> in >> Advance for your help in this matter >> >> >> >> >> Yahoo! Groups Links >> >> To visit your group on the web, go to: >> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ >> >> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: >> AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com >> >> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. >> >> >> >> >> >> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks >> . >> Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important >> to >> the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the >> subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank >> You >> in Advance for your help in this matter >> >> >> >> >> _____ >> >> Yahoo! Groups Links >> >> * To visit your group on the web, go to: >> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ >> >> * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: >> AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com >> <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> >> >> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! >> <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. >> >> >> >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >> >> >> >> >> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks >> . >> Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important >> to > >> the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the >> subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank >> You > >> in Advance for your help in this matter >> Yahoo! Groups Links >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > _____ > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > * To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12349	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: BP Pic in folder

OK it didn't go through to either group. Go to photos and it's the "Blood Parrots" folder. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12350	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium heaters

I do hope that his formatting holds somewhat, so it is not too hard to decipher. I knew I had seen tables indicating heater sizing, so I took a look around for one tonight, and here is what I found. It is widely distributed through the internet, but I do have some problems with it, as I will outline below. Gallons/Liters 5ºC/9ºF 10ºC/18ºF 15ºC/27ºF 5 gal/25 L 25 watt 50 watt 75 watt 10 gal/50 L 50 watt 75 watt 75 watt 20 gal/75 L 50 watt 75 watt 150 watt 25 gal/100 L 75 watt 100 watt 200 watt 40 gal/150 L 100 watt 150 watt 300 watt 50 gal/200 L 150 watt 200 watt two 200 watt 65 gal/250 L 200 watt 250 watt two 250 watt 75 gal/300 L 250 watt 300 watt two 300 watt Now, Linda, this does not cover that 150 you have been talking about, but we can extrapolate from this table. The first column shows tank size in gallons and liters. The other columns show the amount you wish to raise the water temperature above room temperature. Now, looking at the first temperature column, you note that the 75 would require 250 watts of heater to raise and maintain the temperature 9^o F above room temperature. This would be in the range that you are talking about, as I recall. So, the first thing that pops into your head is that, "Bingo! I need two 250 watt heaters to meet my needs." Wrong! Note that the 50 requires 150 watts, and the 25 requires 75 watts. Add them together and you get 225 watts. Why does the 75 gallon then call for 250 watts. Well, in part it is due to the size that heaters are available. Both the 25 and the 50 gallon recommendations are actually a bit oversized. You see, water has a thermal quality where the heat transfer is slow, either to heat it or to cool it. Once you have the temperature you wish, it does not take much to maintain it. So, if we take this chart at face value, more or less, for the 75 gallon tank, we are actually looking at 225 watts. Double that for your 150 gallon, and we have a total of 450 watts. So, if we are looking at a room temperature of 72^o F, and a water temperature of 80^o F, then 400 to 500 watts of heater should be sufficient for the tank. Now, let us through in a little twist here. You mentioned that this is a new house. You have yet to spend a winter there. Being a New Englander for many years, I know that it can get a bit chilly during the winter. You also have yet to discover where the drafts are, and during a winter storm, they can become painfully evident. Also, you may decide that it really is too expensive to keep the room temperature at 72^o F or so, and lower the old thermostat (and tell the kids they will get used to it) as you snuggle in your down comforter to watch the fish (dad, well he is tough, what with the down vest under his bathrobe <g>). Well, you just jumped yourself into a larger wattage need for your heaters. As you can see from the chart, you will probably need to at least double the wattage to maintain your chosen temperature. It is the choices like this that can drive you batty. According to the charts, you could actually have too much heater in the summer, and barely enough in the winter to maintain the temperature you wish. And we haven't even started to talk about run time, as our friend from down under mentioned. If a 200 watt heater runs 10 hours a day, and a 300 watt heater runs only 6.5 hours, do you really save any money? (Since you hate word problems, the answer is no, it is more expensive.) What is a person to do? Well, the best thing it to talk with others in your area to find out how they do it. Maybe the ideal for your area is less than we are talking about. Maybe it is more. Why not ask at a LFS? Well, that can be a tough one. Some are pretty honest and care more about the fish then selling you the high margin item, while others will care more about the margin. If you have an decent fellow, give him your business and rely on his advice. He'll want to see you keep coming into his shop, and make his money that way. Getting your advice from them that's doin' is the best avenue, and they will seldom lead you astray, especially if they hem and haw about the advice they are giving. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2005 1:28 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] aquarium heaters In a message dated 6/13/2005 10:06:37 P.M. Central Standard Time, nmunro@... writes: I think Steve Szabo sent me an email once with a rule of thumb figure which I was exceeding with my 400w heater. My Conclusion: I think in your temperature range the Worst Case is the heaters will stay on longer and possibly (i'm assuming) use more power. The problem that I have is that I suck with math and equations. I can add, subtract, multiply and divide like the wind, but throw me a story problem and I immediately get flustered and want to cry! Would it be advisable to go with two 400 watt heaters? Big Als online states that the Hydor Theo submersible 400 watt heater is recommended for tanks between 80 and 105 gallons. Maybe a 300 and a 400? Lin-duh

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12351	From: paul helms	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Water Treatment for Ponds

or you could simply use a uv sterilizer which does the exact same thing for about 200.00.... --- rlmec <ronm@...> wrote: > Paul, > So far, studies have shown it in fact works quite > well, unless you > feel that a pond requires algae blooms, e. coli and > other various > forms of harmful water-borne bacteria to maintain a > "healthy" > ecosystem. Also, the protective coating on the fish > is not affected. > > This in no way is a "new" study. As I said, it is > being used very > successfully in Japan and elsewhere. Only the algae > and bacteria > that passes the unit, mounted on the filtration > system, are > affected. A healthy balance of algae (and bacteria) > still is able to > propagate on the rocks and sub-surfaces of the pond > thus maintaining > a balanced system. > > This is done primarily by specifying a correct > amount of "turn-over" > of the filtration system. If your filtration system > turns over the > entire volume of the pond much faster than the algae > or bacteria can > propagate, then it is true that you would end up > with a sterile pond. > Typical species of algae propagate well within 30 > minutes. Does your > filtration system turn the entire volume of the pond > faster than this? > I think most likely not. > > I understand your concerns and remarks, but wanted > to point out that > there is much more to the picture than meets the > eye. The system is > also already being used on several large aquifers in > the UK where > fish are part of the ecosystem with great success as > well. > > The most apparent end result is the clarity of the > pond. If you > don't want to see what is on the bottom of the pond, > you won't like > this product! One client in the UK complained > (jokingly) that they > had to clean up all the beer cans on the bottom of > their pond because > they could see every pebble now. hahaha! True story! > > -Ron > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > <wtfmorlok@y...> wrote: > > bacteria is necessary to keep the water healthy > for > > the fish living in it. biologic filtration is the > key > > to keeping them alive, and since your product will > not > > do anything to take ammonia out of the body of > water > > and will kill off the only 2 things that perform > this > > function (bacteria and plant life) a pond keeper > would > > be absolutely stupid to participate if they wish > to > > have anything left alive. > > > > --- rlmec <ronm@r...> wrote: > > > > > Hi all, > > > Hopefully this is not considered spamming, > however I > > > am a distributor > > > for a new product line of water treatment > equipment > > > (at least new for > > > the USA), and I would like to see how well it > works > > > with ponds. We > > > are currently conducting some pool trials, and I > > > have something lined > > > up with a local botanical garden for testing, > > > however it is for a > > > fountain and has no fish or aquatic life (that > they > > > want). > > > > > > The manufacturer says his distributor in Japan > has > > > done quite a bit > > > in the area of ponds with great success, however > we > > > have not received > > > any translated case study materials. The product > is > > > an electronic non- > > > chemical unit that eliminates algea and > bacteria, > > > and is most often > > > used for commercial pools and cooling towers. I > > > would be interested > > > in conducting some trials in regard to ponds > with > > > aquatic life to > > > determine effectiveness and compatibility with > pond > > > life. > > > > > > Indications are that goldfish or other sensory > > > adapted fish species > > > may react initally, but adapt shortly after. Coy > > > seem to love it, and > > > grow faster and larger. > > > > > > If any of you would be willing to conduct a > unbiased > > > case study for > > > us, I would be interested in putting it > together. > > > We would expect > > > some detailed records, documentation, and photos > out > > > of it. I would > > > prefer to conduct the trial with a commercial > > > entity. > > > > > > Thanks, > > > Ron Moon - RLM-EC > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > > Discover Yahoo! > > Find restaurants, movies, travel and more fun for > the weekend. > Check it out! > > http://discover.yahoo.com/weekend.html > > > > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12352	From: paul helms	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Water Treatment for Ponds

goes to your validity --- rlmec <ronm@...> wrote: > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Deenerz@a... > wrote: > > > > Woops, what I meant to write but hit seend too > fast was the > original poster > > at least need to spell Koi right if he wants to > post in aqautic > groups. > > Mike > > > > In a message dated 6/13/2005 11:47:40 PM Pacific > Daylight Time, > > Deenerz@a... writes: > > > > > > > Indications are that goldfish or other sensory > > > adapted fish species > > > may react initally, but adapt shortly after. > Coy > > > seem to love it, and > > > grow faster and larger. > > > > > > > Thanks Mike, and sorry about the typo. > > BTW: woops is spelled "whoops", I assume you meant > "send" not seend, > and "aquatic" instead of "aqautic"? > > Can I assume sentence structure is not so important > in "aquatic > groups" as well, as long as the names of the fish > are spelled > correctly? Or, were you just being funny? LOL!!! > > -Ron > > > > > > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Stay in touch with email, IM, photo sharing and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/stayintouch.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12353	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Water Treatment for Ponds

Ok Mr. Sensistive, I am not the one trying to test a product that will be marketed to Coy keepers. It would be in your best interest to get that one right. Me making a typo only gets you upset, so smile : ) Now let's hear some real information before you kill off someones Coy or phish in their pawnds or wahter gahrdenz. How about explaining how your product is different than the UV sterilizer I bought for 50 bucks? Or is that still waiting for the tranlation from Japanese? Refresh my memory I forgot your posting while skimming threw the dickshawnary to lern how 2 spehl niw woords. Can't wait to tell everyone how I met the retailer or seller of this new fabulous product when it hits the U.S. Market. : ) Mike <ronm@...> wrote: > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Deenerz@a... > wrote: > > > > Woops, what I meant to write but hit seend too > fast was the > original poster > > at least need to spell Koi right if he wants to > post in aqautic > groups. > > Mike > > > > In a message dated 6/13/2005 11:47:40 PM Pacific > Daylight Time, > > Deenerz@a... writes: > > > > > > > Indications are that goldfish or other sensory > > > adapted fish species > > > may react initally, but adapt shortly after. > Coy > > > seem to love it, and > > > grow faster and larger. > > > > > > > Thanks Mike, and sorry about the typo. > > BTW: woops is spelled "whoops", I assume you meant > "send" not seend, > and "aquatic" instead of "aqautic"? > > Can I assume sentence structure is not so important > in "aquatic > groups" as well, as long as the names of the fish > are spelled > correctly? Or, were you just being funny? LOL!!! > > -Ron > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12354	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies

not sure, i'm using Seachems Flourish but havn't noticed a big change since i started. The plants which are growing on a clay soil which has been heated to 1200 degrees Celcius (think its flourite) seem to be doing better than the ones not on it. =Nick ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rei - Raymond Tremor" <rei_tremor@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2005 1:11 PM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies > Nick, I feed them the liquid Flourite by Seachem and now I am trying to > use > Plant Gro by Nutrafin. I don't have a substrate and only have a plant box > with plant plugs and stones. I have to cover the plant plugs with stones > cause the goldfishes are notorious in removing the plant plugs. I have > anubis nana and anubis barteri in the plant box but they managed to nibble > on some of the leaves till it turned yellowish and then brownish. I don't > know if I have snails but couldn't see anything. I washed the plants > before. > I had added the anacharis but washed them in a cool running water. What is > a > good plant food? > > Rei - Raymond Tremor > LoveMoAko@... > http://www.geocities.com/raymondtremor/my-bettas.html > > -------Original Message------- > > From: Nicolas Munro > Date: 06/14/05 12:55:14 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies > > Do you feed the plants anything special? > > Im hoping to buy some more plants over the weekend so eventually I won't > need to seperate my Guppie fry from the parents, hoping they can use the > plants to hide in. > > =Nick > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@...> > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2005 4:37 PM > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies > > >> Hi Nick, >> >> >> >> Light is a shocker ;). I have only 11W PLL bulb over the tank that's is >> half >> daylight and half bluemoon. They are no where near to even a standard >> aquarium light but still the plants are doing great. >> >> One of the fry seems to have started to show a bit of colour as well ;) >> >> >> >> Nim >> >> >> >> >> >> _____ >> >> From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On >> Behalf Of Nicolas Munro >> Sent: 13 June 2005 23:45 >> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com >> Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies >> >> >> >> How much light do you have for your tank? both the plants and the betta >> fry >> >> look really good. >> >> Look similar to guppie fry too. >> >> =Nick >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@...> >> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> >> Sent: Friday, June 10, 2005 6:53 PM >> Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies >> >> >>> Rei, >>> >>> >>> >>> This was actually by accident. 2 double tail females with a very >>> standard >>> male and I don't know which one of the 2 had spawned coz all 3 of them >>> died >>> after spawning :-( >>> >>> I have not fed them anything special at the moment. infact I have not >>> yet >>> put any food in the tank. My guess was that the snails created infusoria >>> that fed the fry and if they managed to survive a couple of weeks >>> without >>> me >>> noticing them then something must have been right. >>> >>> >>> >>> I have some fine powdered high protein fry food that I will start from >>> today >>> as I think they are big enough to take this food. I have already seen >>> one >>> of >>> the fry pull out a baby snail from their shell, so maybe that is another >>> source of food for them. >>> >>> >>> >>> The plants are Hygroplhilla polysperma, Java moss, Hydrocotyle and a >>> couple >>> of stems of bacopa and ludwigia with a few hanging crypts and anubias. >>> Nothing is really rooted in that tank as the gravel bottom is just ½ ". >>> I >>> did think about feeding them baby brineshrimp but then I thought that >>> there >>> is no point as the most cruitial stage has passed and they are twice the >>> size of a newly born guppy fry and should be able to take normal food. >>> As >>> you can see that their bellies are still full, so I think there is >>> plenty >>> of >>> what ever they are feeding. >>> >>> >>> >>> Nim >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> _____ >>> >>> From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] >>> On >>> Behalf Of Rei - Raymond Tremor >>> Sent: 10 June 2005 09:35 >>> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com >>> Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies >>> >>> >>> >>> What kind of betta did you breed? What are you feeding them? I was >>> feeding >>> mine with baby brime shrimp and hard boiled egg yolk and sometimes beef >>> heart and also boiled chicken meat shredded. I don't have bettas now >>> cause >>> it is hard work to clean tanks. I like your plants, what kind are they? >>> I >>> bred a crown tail female with a twin tail male. Some of the babies were >>> twin >>> crown tail. I used a 5 galloon tank with anacharis plants and about 4 to >>> 5 >>> inches of water cause I had been told that the babies will survive more >>> if >>> the water level was low cause they have a shorter swim from the bottom >>> to >>> the top. I had 20 babies and they live up to a year (maybe more cause I >>> gave >>> them away when I decided to keep a goldfish tank). >>> >>> Rei - Raymond Tremor >>> LoveMoAko@... >>> >>> -------Original Message------- >>> >>> From: Nimish Mathur >>> Date: 06/09/05 20:47:16 >>> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com >>> Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies >>> >>> I just managed to take a pic of the 2-3 week old fry. >>> >>> http://www.nimmat.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10001/picture00006.jpg >>> >>> >>> >>> this is what they were on 4th June >>> >>> http://www.nimmat.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10001/betta%20Fry.JPG >>> >>> >>> >>> Nim >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >>> >>> >>> >>> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks >>> . >>> Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important >>> to >>> the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the >>> subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank >>> You >>> in >>> Advance for your help in this matter >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Yahoo! Groups Links >>> >>> To visit your group on the web, go to: >>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ >>> >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: >>> AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com >>> >>> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks >>> . >>> Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important >>> to >>> the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the >>> subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank >>> You >>> in Advance for your help in this matter >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> _____ >>> >>> Yahoo! Groups Links >>> >>> * To visit your group on the web, go to: >>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ >>> >>> * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: >>> AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com >>> <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> >>> >>> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! >>> <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. >>> >>> >>> >>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks >>> . >>> Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important >>> to >> >>> the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the >>> subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank >>> You >> >>> in Advance for your help in this matter >>> Yahoo! Groups Links >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> >> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks >> . >> Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important >> to >> the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the >> subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank >> You >> in Advance for your help in this matter >> >> >> >> >> _____ >> >> Yahoo! Groups Links >> >> * To visit your group on the web, go to: >> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ >> >> * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: >> AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com >> <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> >> >> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! >> <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. >> >> >> >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >> >> >> >> >> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks >> . >> Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important >> to > >> the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the >> subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank >> You > >> in Advance for your help in this matter >> Yahoo! Groups Links >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12355	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Power filter burned out

Normally i do water tests and changes every saturday morning. By the time the following saturday came, my levels were all back to normal. Which kinda leads me to believe that the benificial bateria lives in the stone substrate just as much as it lives in the foam filter so the cycles are much quicker on an establised tank. =Nick ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tim Fairchild" <tim@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2005 9:26 AM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Power filter burned out > On Wednesday 15 Jun 2005 09:08, Nicolas Munro wrote: >> >plus you will have to remove everything from the tank, and more or less >> >start over. >> > including cycling the tank, it might be a short cycle if you use the >> > current >> > substrate and Aid it with a seasoned sponge filter or power filter for >> > a >> > few >> > weeks/months. >> >> I did just that not long ago. I caught all my fish and put them into a >> large bucket. Sucked all the water out of the tank, cleaned my substrate >> with household (city) tap water, cleaned the rockes the same way... >> >> When I returned every thing and filled the tank up with fresh water, the >> amonia spike lasted maybe 24 or 48 hours. So wouldn't really affect ya >> too >> bad. > > How long were the nitrite levels up? > > tim > > -- > --------------------------------------------------------- > Tim & Therese Fairchild > Atchafalaya Border Collies. > Kuttabul, Queensland, Australia. > --------------------------------------------------------- > Email mailto:tim@... > Homepage http://www.bcs4me.com > Photos http://www.pbase.com/amosf > --------------------------------------------------------- > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12356	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Power filter burned out

Comming to think about it, when my tank was first getting established for the first time, the fish got overly red gills when the nitrates / amonia was too strong. All i did was replace some of the water each night and all my fish survived. =Nick Tropical Fresh Water Tank. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tim Fairchild" <tim@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2005 9:26 AM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Power filter burned out > On Wednesday 15 Jun 2005 09:08, Nicolas Munro wrote: >> >plus you will have to remove everything from the tank, and more or less >> >start over. >> > including cycling the tank, it might be a short cycle if you use the >> > current >> > substrate and Aid it with a seasoned sponge filter or power filter for >> > a >> > few >> > weeks/months. >> >> I did just that not long ago. I caught all my fish and put them into a >> large bucket. Sucked all the water out of the tank, cleaned my substrate >> with household (city) tap water, cleaned the rockes the same way... >> >> When I returned every thing and filled the tank up with fresh water, the >> amonia spike lasted maybe 24 or 48 hours. So wouldn't really affect ya >> too >> bad. > > How long were the nitrite levels up? > > tim > > -- > --------------------------------------------------------- > Tim & Therese Fairchild > Atchafalaya Border Collies. > Kuttabul, Queensland, Australia. > --------------------------------------------------------- > Email mailto:tim@... > Homepage http://www.bcs4me.com > Photos http://www.pbase.com/amosf > --------------------------------------------------------- > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12357	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies

Nick, I do feed then a 1/10 recommended dose of Seachem Flourish. The substrate is inert gravel so they cannot get anything more from them but I am hoping to put some Flourite/Latarite in that tank once the babies are big enough to be moved to another tank. Also, the choice of plants in that tank is very restricted as it is a very low light setup and I have only Java moss, Anubias, Hygrophilla polysperma and Hudrocotyle in there and these are the only plants that have lived. Even the likes of cabomba and amazon swords could not survive. Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nicolas Munro Sent: 14 June 2005 23:57 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies Do you feed the plants anything special? Im hoping to buy some more plants over the weekend so eventually I won't need to seperate my Guppie fry from the parents, hoping they can use the plants to hide in. =Nick ----- Original Message ----- From: "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2005 4:37 PM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies > Hi Nick, > > > > Light is a shocker ;). I have only 11W PLL bulb over the tank that's is > half > daylight and half bluemoon. They are no where near to even a standard > aquarium light but still the plants are doing great. > > One of the fry seems to have started to show a bit of colour as well ;) > > > > Nim > > > > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Nicolas Munro > Sent: 13 June 2005 23:45 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies > > > > How much light do you have for your tank? both the plants and the betta > fry > > look really good. > > Look similar to guppie fry too. > > =Nick > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@...> > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Friday, June 10, 2005 6:53 PM > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies > > >> Rei, >> >> >> >> This was actually by accident. 2 double tail females with a very standard >> male and I don't know which one of the 2 had spawned coz all 3 of them >> died >> after spawning :-( >> >> I have not fed them anything special at the moment. infact I have not yet >> put any food in the tank. My guess was that the snails created infusoria >> that fed the fry and if they managed to survive a couple of weeks without >> me >> noticing them then something must have been right. >> >> >> >> I have some fine powdered high protein fry food that I will start from >> today >> as I think they are big enough to take this food. I have already seen one >> of >> the fry pull out a baby snail from their shell, so maybe that is another >> source of food for them. >> >> >> >> The plants are Hygroplhilla polysperma, Java moss, Hydrocotyle and a >> couple >> of stems of bacopa and ludwigia with a few hanging crypts and anubias. >> Nothing is really rooted in that tank as the gravel bottom is just ½ ". I >> did think about feeding them baby brineshrimp but then I thought that >> there >> is no point as the most cruitial stage has passed and they are twice the >> size of a newly born guppy fry and should be able to take normal food. As >> you can see that their bellies are still full, so I think there is plenty >> of >> what ever they are feeding. >> >> >> >> Nim >> >> >> >> >> >> _____ >> >> From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On >> Behalf Of Rei - Raymond Tremor >> Sent: 10 June 2005 09:35 >> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com >> Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies >> >> >> >> What kind of betta did you breed? What are you feeding them? I was >> feeding >> mine with baby brime shrimp and hard boiled egg yolk and sometimes beef >> heart and also boiled chicken meat shredded. I don't have bettas now >> cause >> it is hard work to clean tanks. I like your plants, what kind are they? I >> bred a crown tail female with a twin tail male. Some of the babies were >> twin >> crown tail. I used a 5 galloon tank with anacharis plants and about 4 to >> 5 >> inches of water cause I had been told that the babies will survive more >> if >> the water level was low cause they have a shorter swim from the bottom to >> the top. I had 20 babies and they live up to a year (maybe more cause I >> gave >> them away when I decided to keep a goldfish tank). >> >> Rei - Raymond Tremor >> LoveMoAko@... >> >> -------Original Message------- >> >> From: Nimish Mathur >> Date: 06/09/05 20:47:16 >> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com >> Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies >> >> I just managed to take a pic of the 2-3 week old fry. >> >> http://www.nimmat.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10001/picture00006.jpg >> >> >> >> this is what they were on 4th June >> >> http://www.nimmat.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10001/betta%20Fry.JPG >> >> >> >> Nim >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >> >> >> >> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks >> . >> Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important >> to >> the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the >> subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You >> in >> Advance for your help in this matter >> >> >> >> >> Yahoo! Groups Links >> >> To visit your group on the web, go to: >> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ >> >> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: >> AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com >> >> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. >> >> >> >> >> >> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks >> . >> Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important >> to >> the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the >> subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank >> You >> in Advance for your help in this matter >> >> >> >> >> _____ >> >> Yahoo! Groups Links >> >> * To visit your group on the web, go to: >> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ >> >> * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: >> AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com >> <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> >> >> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! >> <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. >> >> >> >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >> >> >> >> >> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks >> . >> Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important >> to > >> the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the >> subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank >> You > >> in Advance for your help in this matter >> Yahoo! Groups Links >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > _____ > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > * To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter _____ Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12358	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 6/14/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies

Nick, Flourish will only show a difference if you have a deficiency of any nutrients that it replenishes. If you are doing regular water changes and the tank is not a high tech setup, then flourish may not even be needed. Flourite on the other hand is a wonderful gravel for the plants that has a bit of CEC and so adsorbs the nutrients from the water to make them available to the plants. What plants do you have? Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nicolas Munro Sent: 15 June 2005 07:29 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies not sure, i'm using Seachems Flourish but havn't noticed a big change since i started. The plants which are growing on a clay soil which has been heated to 1200 degrees Celcius (think its flourite) seem to be doing better than the ones not on it. =Nick ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rei - Raymond Tremor" <rei_tremor@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2005 1:11 PM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies > Nick, I feed them the liquid Flourite by Seachem and now I am trying to > use > Plant Gro by Nutrafin. I don't have a substrate and only have a plant box > with plant plugs and stones. I have to cover the plant plugs with stones > cause the goldfishes are notorious in removing the plant plugs. I have > anubis nana and anubis barteri in the plant box but they managed to nibble > on some of the leaves till it turned yellowish and then brownish. I don't > know if I have snails but couldn't see anything. I washed the plants > before. > I had added the anacharis but washed them in a cool running water. What is > a > good plant food? > > Rei - Raymond Tremor > LoveMoAko@... > http://www.geocities.com/raymondtremor/my-bettas.html > > -------Original Message------- > > From: Nicolas Munro > Date: 06/14/05 12:55:14 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies > > Do you feed the plants anything special? > > Im hoping to buy some more plants over the weekend so eventually I won't > need to seperate my Guppie fry from the parents, hoping they can use the > plants to hide in. > > =Nick > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@...> > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2005 4:37 PM > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies > > >> Hi Nick, >> >> >> >> Light is a shocker ;). I have only 11W PLL bulb over the tank that's is >> half >> daylight and half bluemoon. They are no where near to even a standard >> aquarium light but still the plants are doing great. >> >> One of the fry seems to have started to show a bit of colour as well ;) >> >> >> >> Nim >> >> >> >> >> >> _____ >> >> From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On >> Behalf Of Nicolas Munro >> Sent: 13 June 2005 23:45 >> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com >> Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies >> >> >> >> How much light do you have for your tank? both the plants and the betta >> fry >> >> look really good. >> >> Look similar to guppie fry too. >> >> =Nick >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@...> >> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> >> Sent: Friday, June 10, 2005 6:53 PM >> Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies >> >> >>> Rei, >>> >>> >>> >>> This was actually by accident. 2 double tail females with a very >>> standard >>> male and I don't know which one of the 2 had spawned coz all 3 of them >>> died >>> after spawning :-( >>> >>> I have not fed them anything special at the moment. infact I have not >>> yet >>> put any food in the tank. My guess was that the snails created infusoria >>> that fed the fry and if they managed to survive a couple of weeks >>> without >>> me >>> noticing them then something must have been right. >>> >>> >>> >>> I have some fine powdered high protein fry food that I will start from >>> today >>> as I think they are big enough to take this food. I have already seen >>> one >>> of >>> the fry pull out a baby snail from their shell, so maybe that is another >>> source of food for them. >>> >>> >>> >>> The plants are Hygroplhilla polysperma, Java moss, Hydrocotyle and a >>> couple >>> of stems of bacopa and ludwigia with a few hanging crypts and anubias. >>> Nothing is really rooted in that tank as the gravel bottom is just ½ ". >>> I >>> did think about feeding them baby brineshrimp but then I thought that >>> there >>> is no point as the most cruitial stage has passed and they are twice the >>> size of a newly born guppy fry and should be able to take normal food. >>> As >>> you can see that their bellies are still full, so I think there is >>> plenty >>> of >>> what ever they are feeding. >>> >>> >>> >>> Nim >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> _____ >>> >>> From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] >>> On >>> Behalf Of Rei - Raymond Tremor >>> Sent: 10 June 2005 09:35 >>> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com >>> Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies >>> >>> >>> >>> What kind of betta did you breed? What are you feeding them? I was >>> feeding >>> mine with baby brime shrimp and hard boiled egg yolk and sometimes beef >>> heart and also boiled chicken meat shredded. I don't have bettas now >>> cause >>> it is hard work to clean tanks. I like your plants, what kind are they? >>> I >>> bred a crown tail female with a twin tail male. Some of the babies were >>> twin >>> crown tail. I used a 5 galloon tank with anacharis plants and about 4 to >>> 5 >>> inches of water cause I had been told that the babies will survive more >>> if >>> the water level was low cause they have a shorter swim from the bottom >>> to >>> the top. I had 20 babies and they live up to a year (maybe more cause I >>> gave >>> them away when I decided to keep a goldfish tank). >>> >>> Rei - Raymond Tremor >>> LoveMoAko@... >>> >>> -------Original Message------- >>> >>> From: Nimish Mathur >>> Date: 06/09/05 20:47:16 >>> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com >>> Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies >>> >>> I just managed to take a pic of the 2-3 week old fry. >>> >>> http://www.nimmat.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10001/picture00006.jpg >>> >>> >>> >>> this is what they were on 4th June >>> >>> http://www.nimmat.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10001/betta%20Fry.JPG >>> >>> >>> >>> Nim >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >>> >>> >>> >>> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks >>> . >>> Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important >>> to >>> the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the >>> subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank >>> You >>> in >>> Advance for your help in this matter >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Yahoo! Groups Links >>> >>> To visit your group on the web, go to: >>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ >>> >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: >>> AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com >>> >>> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks >>> . >>> Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important >>> to >>> the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the >>> subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank >>> You >>> in Advance for your help in this matter >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> _____ >>> >>> Yahoo! Groups Links >>> >>> * To visit your group on the web, go to: >>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ >>> >>> * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: >>> AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com >>> <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> >>> >>> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! >>> <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. >>> >>> >>> >>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks >>> . >>> Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important >>> to >> >>> the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the >>> subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank >>> You >> >>> in Advance for your help in this matter >>> Yahoo! Groups Links >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> >> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks >> . >> Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important >> to >> the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the >> subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank >> You >> in Advance for your help in this matter >> >> >> >> >> _____ >> >> Yahoo! Groups Links >> >> * To visit your group on the web, go to: >> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ >> >> * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: >> AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com >> <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> >> >> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! >> <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. >> >> >> >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >> >> >> >> >> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks >> . >> Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important >> to > >> the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the >> subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank >> You > >> in Advance for your help in this matter >> Yahoo! Groups Links >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter _____ Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12359	From: paul helms	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Water Treatment for Ponds

and flops because the "reseller" does not know the difference between the bacteria in the nitrogen cycle and E. coli which will not be found in your average filtered pond unless it is filled with reptile excrement. --- Deenerz@... wrote: > > Ok Mr. Sensistive, > > I am not the one trying to test a product that will > be marketed to Coy > keepers. It would be in your best interest to get > that one right. Me making a > typo only gets you upset, so smile : ) > Now let's hear some real information before you kill > off someones Coy or > phish in their pawnds or wahter gahrdenz. > > How about explaining how your product is different > than the UV sterilizer I > bought for 50 bucks? Or is that still waiting for > the tranlation from > Japanese? Refresh my memory I forgot your posting > while skimming threw the > dickshawnary to lern how 2 spehl niw woords. > > Can't wait to tell everyone how I met the retailer > or seller of this new > fabulous product when it hits the U.S. Market. : ) > > Mike > > > <ronm@...> wrote: > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Deenerz@a... > > wrote: > > > > > > Woops, what I meant to write but hit seend too > > fast was the > > original poster > > > at least need to spell Koi right if he wants to > > post in aqautic > > groups. > > > Mike > > > > > > In a message dated 6/13/2005 11:47:40 PM > Pacific > > Daylight Time, > > > Deenerz@a... writes: > > > > > > > > > > Indications are that goldfish or other > sensory > > > > adapted fish species > > > > may react initally, but adapt shortly after. > > Coy > > > > seem to love it, and > > > > grow faster and larger. > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks Mike, and sorry about the typo. > > > > BTW: woops is spelled "whoops", I assume you > meant > > "send" not seend, > > and "aquatic" instead of "aqautic"? > > > > Can I assume sentence structure is not so > important > > in "aquatic > > groups" as well, as long as the names of the fish > > are spelled > > correctly? Or, were you just being funny? LOL!!! > > > > -Ron > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Stay in touch with email, IM, photo sharing and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/stayintouch.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12360	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: HELP!! Fish with a fat lip! Looks bloody inside

Definitely one of the North American Sunfish Family. At this size, its still quite young to tell exactly which species. You may have to wait for a more positive I.D., until it puts on more size. While its remotely possible it may be one of the dwarf Sunfish (Elassoma or Enneacanthus), I tend to dismiss this as by now it should have more adult coloration unless its an immature female. While its still possible that it could be one of the Crappies (White or Black), members of the Sunfish Family which will easily reach an average length of 10" - 12" (world's record - 21"), it lacks the markings in these young Pomoxis species I recall seeing in my collections when seining for them. While the body shape is identical, as are many other young Sunfish, the finnage is not. I tend to believe at this size that its a juvenile of one of the medium size Sunfish of the Lepomis group, more probably a Pumpkinseed Sunfish (Lepomis gibbosus), its telltale "earflap" marking not yet developing at this size. These fish get to about 8". Still not a definite I.D., but best I can come up with at this size. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "mommy2acdhsurvivor" <CK147@H...> wrote: > It's the last 3 photos in the folder MELANIE'S PICS He wouldn't look > at me so the last pic is horrible. Anyone have any idea as to what > kind of fish he is? He has orange eyes. Thanks

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12361	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Subject line ---> was > turtles

Emily, You don't say what color strain you have. With so many varieties of Oscars now in the aquarium hobby, its not easy to say why two of your Oscars are duller than the third one. Many years ago when there was just one (original) variety, often the females were duller (did not have as much color, in red markings, etc.) than the males, but even then many were colored and patterned very similarly. While this is something to consider, you also may have one of the "newer" Red Tiger Oscars and two of the regular original strain, which would may possibly answer the question. If you have the solid Red Oscars, there have been many breeders of this strain since they became available, with varying intensities of color over the years from red to orange-red to a yellow-orange. You may have a mix of them. Many years ago I saw the very first "pair" of Red Oscars to be imported into this country from the Far East, by Aquarium Imports (of Ammityville, NY), when they were first developed. They were intensely red in color. Incidentally, they were about 7" long and priced at $400 (wholesale), but not necessarily male and female. While many breeders of this strain have subsequently held that coloration, others have let the quality deteriorate only to call it something else "new" as the coloration gets less intense. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, red eye <red-eye@p...> wrote: > > > kb1dva <vze3pd7a@v...> wrote:I think my 90 is overstocked I have 3 Oscars (tigers) I Pacu- 3 blood > parrots (small ones) - and 1 pike I was thinking of spreading them out and > maybe adding something colorful? I see small acts of fishie aggression but > nothing major. The Pacu is a grump he hates everyone! .I know I am > eventually going to have to get rid of the pacu he will get to big, but ill > cross that bridge when I get to it. One of the Oscars is brightly colored > and the other 2 are duller do you know why. Emily > > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of seleya8@a... > Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2005 9:13 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] turtles > > > > > > In a message dated 6/14/2005 9:05:59 AM Eastern Standard Time, > vze3pd7a@v... writes: > > I have cichlids and I want to get a turtle for my aquariums I know about > land turtles but that's it. What kind is compatible with my fish? > > And are they a lot more work. Nobody answered my sort of dumb question > about > my 55 gallon tank being so narrow does it limit the kind of fish I can use > it for. > > I don't know of any turtle which is compatible with fish. Turtles typically > > eat fish -- even the allegedly herbiverous ones. I have had terrapin which > were supposedly more herbiverous as they grew older and my old guy still > loved > his earthworms, slugs and fishies. ;-) Also, most turtles will outgrow your > > tanks and need some land or dock. If you choose to investigate this > further, > you need to make sure you understand the differences between tortoises, > terrapin and turtles and ~not~ go by their common names which can be very > misleading. > > Your 55 is the stock size. =) I would swap the filters like you suggested > and get a new one for the 90. You can put plenty of varieties of fish into a > 55 > -- what were you thinking you'd like to try? > > > Vicky > > Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr > Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Or write: > hgparker@n... =) > > Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact Dr Breen @ 919-513-1467 _and_ Dr > London @ calondon@u... 530-754-5711 They NEED your specimens! > > Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@a... > > *Use this sig! Help the scientists help us!* > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > _____ > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > * To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Groups Links > > To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12362	From: kb1dva	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Subject line ---> was > turtles

They are tiger Oscars it's the biggest one - it looks like it's traveling up the body. Someone said it was stress, is this true and how do I help. Is the tank overstocked? Emily _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2005 8:24 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Subject line ---> was > turtles Emily, You don't say what color strain you have. With so many varieties of Oscars now in the aquarium hobby, its not easy to say why two of your Oscars are duller than the third one. Many years ago when there was just one (original) variety, often the females were duller (did not have as much color, in red markings, etc.) than the males, but even then many were colored and patterned very similarly. While this is something to consider, you also may have one of the "newer" Red Tiger Oscars and two of the regular original strain, which would may possibly answer the question. If you have the solid Red Oscars, there have been many breeders of this strain since they became available, with varying intensities of color over the years from red to orange-red to a yellow-orange. You may have a mix of them. Many years ago I saw the very first "pair" of Red Oscars to be imported into this country from the Far East, by Aquarium Imports (of Ammityville, NY), when they were first developed. They were intensely red in color. Incidentally, they were about 7" long and priced at $400 (wholesale), but not necessarily male and female. While many breeders of this strain have subsequently held that coloration, others have let the quality deteriorate only to call it something else "new" as the coloration gets less intense. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, red eye <red-eye@p...> wrote: > > > kb1dva <vze3pd7a@v...> wrote:I think my 90 is overstocked I have 3 Oscars (tigers) I Pacu- 3 blood > parrots (small ones) - and 1 pike I was thinking of spreading them out and > maybe adding something colorful? I see small acts of fishie aggression but > nothing major. The Pacu is a grump he hates everyone! .I know I am > eventually going to have to get rid of the pacu he will get to big, but ill > cross that bridge when I get to it. One of the Oscars is brightly colored > and the other 2 are duller do you know why. Emily > > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of seleya8@a... > Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2005 9:13 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] turtles > > > > > > In a message dated 6/14/2005 9:05:59 AM Eastern Standard Time, > vze3pd7a@v... writes: > > I have cichlids and I want to get a turtle for my aquariums I know about > land turtles but that's it. What kind is compatible with my fish? > > And are they a lot more work. Nobody answered my sort of dumb question > about > my 55 gallon tank being so narrow does it limit the kind of fish I can use > it for. > > I don't know of any turtle which is compatible with fish. Turtles typically > > eat fish -- even the allegedly herbiverous ones. I have had terrapin which > were supposedly more herbiverous as they grew older and my old guy still > loved > his earthworms, slugs and fishies. ;-) Also, most turtles will outgrow your > > tanks and need some land or dock. If you choose to investigate this > further, > you need to make sure you understand the differences between tortoises, > terrapin and turtles and ~not~ go by their common names which can be very > misleading. > > Your 55 is the stock size. =) I would swap the filters like you suggested > and get a new one for the 90. You can put plenty of varieties of fish into a > 55 > -- what were you thinking you'd like to try? > > > Vicky > > Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr > Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Or write: > hgparker@n... =) > > Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact Dr Breen @ 919-513-1467 _and_ Dr > London @ calondon@u... 530-754-5711 They NEED your specimens! > > Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@a... > > *Use this sig! Help the scientists help us!* > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > _____ > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > * To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Groups Links > > To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter _____ Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12363	From: kb1dva	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Subject line ---> was > turtles

Ill post a photo Emily _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2005 8:24 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Subject line ---> was > turtles Emily, You don't say what color strain you have. With so many varieties of Oscars now in the aquarium hobby, its not easy to say why two of your Oscars are duller than the third one. Many years ago when there was just one (original) variety, often the females were duller (did not have as much color, in red markings, etc.) than the males, but even then many were colored and patterned very similarly. While this is something to consider, you also may have one of the "newer" Red Tiger Oscars and two of the regular original strain, which would may possibly answer the question. If you have the solid Red Oscars, there have been many breeders of this strain since they became available, with varying intensities of color over the years from red to orange-red to a yellow-orange. You may have a mix of them. Many years ago I saw the very first "pair" of Red Oscars to be imported into this country from the Far East, by Aquarium Imports (of Ammityville, NY), when they were first developed. They were intensely red in color. Incidentally, they were about 7" long and priced at $400 (wholesale), but not necessarily male and female. While many breeders of this strain have subsequently held that coloration, others have let the quality deteriorate only to call it something else "new" as the coloration gets less intense. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, red eye <red-eye@p...> wrote: > > > kb1dva <vze3pd7a@v...> wrote:I think my 90 is overstocked I have 3 Oscars (tigers) I Pacu- 3 blood > parrots (small ones) - and 1 pike I was thinking of spreading them out and > maybe adding something colorful? I see small acts of fishie aggression but > nothing major. The Pacu is a grump he hates everyone! .I know I am > eventually going to have to get rid of the pacu he will get to big, but ill > cross that bridge when I get to it. One of the Oscars is brightly colored > and the other 2 are duller do you know why. Emily > > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of seleya8@a... > Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2005 9:13 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] turtles > > > > > > In a message dated 6/14/2005 9:05:59 AM Eastern Standard Time, > vze3pd7a@v... writes: > > I have cichlids and I want to get a turtle for my aquariums I know about > land turtles but that's it. What kind is compatible with my fish? > > And are they a lot more work. Nobody answered my sort of dumb question > about > my 55 gallon tank being so narrow does it limit the kind of fish I can use > it for. > > I don't know of any turtle which is compatible with fish. Turtles typically > > eat fish -- even the allegedly herbiverous ones. I have had terrapin which > were supposedly more herbiverous as they grew older and my old guy still > loved > his earthworms, slugs and fishies. ;-) Also, most turtles will outgrow your > > tanks and need some land or dock. If you choose to investigate this > further, > you need to make sure you understand the differences between tortoises, > terrapin and turtles and ~not~ go by their common names which can be very > misleading. > > Your 55 is the stock size. =) I would swap the filters like you suggested > and get a new one for the 90. You can put plenty of varieties of fish into a > 55 > -- what were you thinking you'd like to try? > > > Vicky > > Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr > Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Or write: > hgparker@n... =) > > Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact Dr Breen @ 919-513-1467 _and_ Dr > London @ calondon@u... 530-754-5711 They NEED your specimens! > > Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@a... > > *Use this sig! Help the scientists help us!* > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > _____ > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > * To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Groups Links > > To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter _____ Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12364	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium heaters

Thanks Steve...I just joined the mnaquarium group and will pose the same question to them! Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12365	From: kb1dva	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: tiger Oscars

I have no idea what's going on, but when I looked at him this morning he seemed ok- although I did notice a light colored spot on him that I never noticed before. There's a picture under Tiger Oscars. I have to move the tank about 7 feet over is there an easy way to do this, or do you just take out as much water as you can. Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12366	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Subject line ---> was > turtles

Yes, Posting a photo, as you said may help. Otherwise, I find this "traveling up the body" kind of puzzling. Besides, I thought you indicated there were two of them which were duller than one other. I'll wait for the photo. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "kb1dva" <vze3pd7a@v...> wrote: > They are tiger Oscars it's the biggest one - it looks like it's traveling up > the body. Someone said it was stress, is this true and how do I help. Is the > tank overstocked? Emily > > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2005 8:24 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Subject line ---> was > turtles > > > > Emily, You don't say what color strain you have. With so many > varieties of Oscars now in the aquarium hobby, its not easy to say > why two of your Oscars are duller than the third one. Many years ago > when there was just one (original) variety, often the females were > duller (did not have as much color, in red markings, etc.) than the > males, but even then many were colored and patterned very similarly. > While this is something to consider, you also may have one of > the "newer" Red Tiger Oscars and two of the regular original strain, > which would may possibly answer the question. If you have the solid > Red Oscars, there have been many breeders of this strain since they > became available, with varying intensities of color over the years > from red to orange-red to a yellow-orange. You may have a mix of > them. Many years ago I saw the very first "pair" of Red Oscars to be > imported into this country from the Far East, by Aquarium Imports (of > Ammityville, NY), when they were first developed. They were > intensely red in color. Incidentally, they were about 7" long and > priced at $400 (wholesale), but not necessarily male and female. > While many breeders of this strain have subsequently held that > coloration, others have let the quality deteriorate only to call it > something else "new" as the coloration gets less intense. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, red eye <red-eye@p...> wrote: > > > > > > kb1dva <vze3pd7a@v...> wrote:I think my 90 is overstocked I have 3 > Oscars (tigers) I Pacu- 3 blood > > parrots (small ones) - and 1 pike I was thinking of spreading them > out and > > maybe adding something colorful? I see small acts of fishie > aggression but > > nothing major. The Pacu is a grump he hates everyone! .I know I am > > eventually going to have to get rid of the pacu he will get to big, > but ill > > cross that bridge when I get to it. One of the Oscars is brightly > colored > > and the other 2 are duller do you know why. Emily > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of seleya8@a... > > Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2005 9:13 AM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] turtles > > > > > > > > > > > > In a message dated 6/14/2005 9:05:59 AM Eastern Standard Time, > > vze3pd7a@v... writes: > > > > I have cichlids and I want to get a turtle for my aquariums I know > about > > land turtles but that's it. What kind is compatible with my fish? > > > > And are they a lot more work. Nobody answered my sort of dumb > question > > about > > my 55 gallon tank being so narrow does it limit the kind of fish I > can use > > it for. > > > > I don't know of any turtle which is compatible with fish. Turtles > typically > > > > eat fish -- even the allegedly herbiverous ones. I have had > terrapin which > > were supposedly more herbiverous as they grew older and my old guy > still > > loved > > his earthworms, slugs and fishies. ;-) Also, most turtles will > outgrow your > > > > tanks and need some land or dock. If you choose to investigate this > > further, > > you need to make sure you understand the differences between > tortoises, > > terrapin and turtles and ~not~ go by their common names which can > be very > > misleading. > > > > Your 55 is the stock size. =) I would swap the filters like you > suggested > > and get a new one for the 90. You can put plenty of varieties of > fish into a > > 55 > > -- what were you thinking you'd like to try? > > > > > > Vicky > > > > Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to > help Dr > > Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Or write: > > hgparker@n... =) > > > > Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact Dr Breen @ 919-513-1467 _and_ > Dr > > London @ calondon@u... 530-754-5711 They NEED your specimens! > > > > Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write > cathryn.mellersh@a... > > > > *Use this sig! Help the scientists help us!* > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks > > . > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not > important to > > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify > the > > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we > Thank You > > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > * To visit your group on the web, go to: > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks > > . > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not > important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original > message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > To visit your group on the web, go to: > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service. > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > _____ > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > * To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12367	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: tiger Oscars

Just got done checking out the photo. I'm not quite sure exactly what "light spot" you are referring to. I do notice a light yellowish patch in the vent area, between the two bold black markings. That looks perfectly normal to me. I also see a white keyhole shaped patch below and to the rear of the pectoral fin, as well as another white marking more to the rear. Again. I see nothing abnormal about them -- sometimes as these fish grow, their pattern changes ever so slightly. Now, if this fish was starting to darken up and become more withdrawn and going into a corner, perhaps even going off his feed, then I would say you have something to worry about. Unless there's something I can't discern, I don't see any cause for alarm. At the moment they should not be crowded in the 90, with the Blood Parrots as small as they are. I don't recall seeing the Pacu in the photo so I don't know his size, but as you've already realized you'll have to get rid of him eventually. As the Blood Parrots get up to full size, you should consider moving them out, possibly keeping the Pike Cichlid in there if all (Oscars and Pike) get along. Ray \ -- - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "kb1dva" <vze3pd7a@v...> wrote: > I have no idea what's going on, but when I looked at him this morning he > seemed ok- although I did notice a light colored spot on him that I never > noticed before. There's a picture under Tiger Oscars. I have to move the > tank about 7 feet over is there an easy way to do this, or do you just take > out as much water as you can. Emily > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12368	From: kb1dva	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Subject line ---> was > turtles

It's there are 3 of them 2 duller although they look bright in the photo. _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2005 10:30 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Subject line ---> was > turtles Yes, Posting a photo, as you said may help. Otherwise, I find this "traveling up the body" kind of puzzling. Besides, I thought you indicated there were two of them which were duller than one other. I'll wait for the photo. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "kb1dva" <vze3pd7a@v...> wrote: > They are tiger Oscars it's the biggest one - it looks like it's traveling up > the body. Someone said it was stress, is this true and how do I help. Is the > tank overstocked? Emily > > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2005 8:24 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Subject line ---> was > turtles > > > > Emily, You don't say what color strain you have. With so many > varieties of Oscars now in the aquarium hobby, its not easy to say > why two of your Oscars are duller than the third one. Many years ago > when there was just one (original) variety, often the females were > duller (did not have as much color, in red markings, etc.) than the > males, but even then many were colored and patterned very similarly. > While this is something to consider, you also may have one of > the "newer" Red Tiger Oscars and two of the regular original strain, > which would may possibly answer the question. If you have the solid > Red Oscars, there have been many breeders of this strain since they > became available, with varying intensities of color over the years > from red to orange-red to a yellow-orange. You may have a mix of > them. Many years ago I saw the very first "pair" of Red Oscars to be > imported into this country from the Far East, by Aquarium Imports (of > Ammityville, NY), when they were first developed. They were > intensely red in color. Incidentally, they were about 7" long and > priced at $400 (wholesale), but not necessarily male and female. > While many breeders of this strain have subsequently held that > coloration, others have let the quality deteriorate only to call it > something else "new" as the coloration gets less intense. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, red eye <red-eye@p...> wrote: > > > > > > kb1dva <vze3pd7a@v...> wrote:I think my 90 is overstocked I have 3 > Oscars (tigers) I Pacu- 3 blood > > parrots (small ones) - and 1 pike I was thinking of spreading them > out and > > maybe adding something colorful? I see small acts of fishie > aggression but > > nothing major. The Pacu is a grump he hates everyone! .I know I am > > eventually going to have to get rid of the pacu he will get to big, > but ill > > cross that bridge when I get to it. One of the Oscars is brightly > colored > > and the other 2 are duller do you know why. Emily > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of seleya8@a... > > Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2005 9:13 AM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] turtles > > > > > > > > > > > > In a message dated 6/14/2005 9:05:59 AM Eastern Standard Time, > > vze3pd7a@v... writes: > > > > I have cichlids and I want to get a turtle for my aquariums I know > about > > land turtles but that's it. What kind is compatible with my fish? > > > > And are they a lot more work. Nobody answered my sort of dumb > question > > about > > my 55 gallon tank being so narrow does it limit the kind of fish I > can use > > it for. > > > > I don't know of any turtle which is compatible with fish. Turtles > typically > > > > eat fish -- even the allegedly herbiverous ones. I have had > terrapin which > > were supposedly more herbiverous as they grew older and my old guy > still > > loved > > his earthworms, slugs and fishies. ;-) Also, most turtles will > outgrow your > > > > tanks and need some land or dock. If you choose to investigate this > > further, > > you need to make sure you understand the differences between > tortoises, > > terrapin and turtles and ~not~ go by their common names which can > be very > > misleading. > > > > Your 55 is the stock size. =) I would swap the filters like you > suggested > > and get a new one for the 90. You can put plenty of varieties of > fish into a > > 55 > > -- what were you thinking you'd like to try? > > > > > > Vicky > > > > Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to > help Dr > > Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Or write: > > hgparker@n... =) > > > > Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact Dr Breen @ 919-513-1467 _and_ > Dr > > London @ calondon@u... 530-754-5711 They NEED your specimens! > > > > Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write > cathryn.mellersh@a... > > > > *Use this sig! Help the scientists help us!* > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks > > . > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not > important to > > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify > the > > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we > Thank You > > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > * To visit your group on the web, go to: > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks > > . > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not > important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original > message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > To visit your group on the web, go to: > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service. > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > _____ > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > * To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter _____ Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12369	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Subject line ---> was > turtles

I see one Oscar, presumably the larger one, broadside to the camera with the Pike beside him. I only find one photo in this file. I do see two other Oscars (appear to be smaller from what I can tell) face- on so can't really see their coloration although they look darker -- can't see their sides though. You did mention there is "some aggression" in the tank, but you didn't go into any detail. If its normal mild aggression where everybody is still happy, then its possible (only possible) that the two smaller ones might be females. If the aggression is elevated, these two smaller Oscars just may be stressed and as such will darken up as a result. If its just that they don't (and never did) have as much red markings then there is more of a possibility that they could be females. By the way, the large Oscar to the left (with the Pike) is not a Tiger Oscar, but a normal (original) type Oscar. If you're sure it came from Tiger Oscar parents, then its not a good representative of that strain, although still a nice looking fish. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "kb1dva" <vze3pd7a@v...> wrote: > It's there are 3 of them 2 duller although they look bright in the photo. > > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2005 10:30 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Subject line ---> was > turtles > > > > Yes, Posting a photo, as you said may help. Otherwise, I find > this "traveling up the body" kind of puzzling. Besides, I thought > you indicated there were two of them which were duller than one > other. I'll wait for the photo. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "kb1dva" <vze3pd7a@v...> wrote: > > They are tiger Oscars it's the biggest one - it looks like it's > traveling up > > the body. Someone said it was stress, is this true and how do I > help. Is the > > tank overstocked? Emily > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > > Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2005 8:24 AM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Subject line ---> was > turtles > > > > > > > > Emily, You don't say what color strain you have. With so many > > varieties of Oscars now in the aquarium hobby, its not easy to say > > why two of your Oscars are duller than the third one. Many years > ago > > when there was just one (original) variety, often the females were > > duller (did not have as much color, in red markings, etc.) than the > > males, but even then many were colored and patterned very > similarly. > > While this is something to consider, you also may have one of > > the "newer" Red Tiger Oscars and two of the regular original > strain, > > which would may possibly answer the question. If you have the > solid > > Red Oscars, there have been many breeders of this strain since they > > became available, with varying intensities of color over the years > > from red to orange-red to a yellow-orange. You may have a mix of > > them. Many years ago I saw the very first "pair" of Red Oscars to > be > > imported into this country from the Far East, by Aquarium Imports > (of > > Ammityville, NY), when they were first developed. They were > > intensely red in color. Incidentally, they were about 7" long and > > priced at $400 (wholesale), but not necessarily male and female. > > While many breeders of this strain have subsequently held that > > coloration, others have let the quality deteriorate only to call it > > something else "new" as the coloration gets less intense. Ray > > > \ > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, red eye <red-eye@p...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > kb1dva <vze3pd7a@v...> wrote:I think my 90 is overstocked I have > 3 > > Oscars (tigers) I Pacu- 3 blood > > > parrots (small ones) - and 1 pike I was thinking of spreading > them > > out and > > > maybe adding something colorful? I see small acts of fishie > > aggression but > > > nothing major. The Pacu is a grump he hates everyone! .I know I am > > > eventually going to have to get rid of the pacu he will get to > big, > > but ill > > > cross that bridge when I get to it. One of the Oscars is brightly > > colored > > > and the other 2 are duller do you know why. Emily > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > Behalf Of seleya8@a... > > > Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2005 9:13 AM > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] turtles > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In a message dated 6/14/2005 9:05:59 AM Eastern Standard Time, > > > vze3pd7a@v... writes: > > > > > > I have cichlids and I want to get a turtle for my aquariums I > know > > about > > > land turtles but that's it. What kind is compatible with my fish? > > > > > > And are they a lot more work. Nobody answered my sort of dumb > > question > > > about > > > my 55 gallon tank being so narrow does it limit the kind of fish > I > > can use > > > it for. > > > > > > I don't know of any turtle which is compatible with fish. Turtles > > typically > > > > > > eat fish -- even the allegedly herbiverous ones. I have had > > terrapin which > > > were supposedly more herbiverous as they grew older and my old > guy > > still > > > loved > > > his earthworms, slugs and fishies. ;-) Also, most turtles will > > outgrow your > > > > > > tanks and need some land or dock. If you choose to investigate > this > > > further, > > > you need to make sure you understand the differences between > > tortoises, > > > terrapin and turtles and ~not~ go by their common names which can > > be very > > > misleading. > > > > > > Your 55 is the stock size. =) I would swap the filters like you > > suggested > > > and get a new one for the 90. You can put plenty of varieties of > > fish into a > > > 55 > > > -- what were you thinking you'd like to try? > > > > > > > > > Vicky > > > > > > Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to > > help Dr > > > Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Or write: > > > hgparker@n... =) > > > > > > Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact Dr Breen @ 919-513-1467 > _and_ > > Dr > > > London @ calondon@u... 530-754-5711 They NEED your specimens! > > > > > > Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write > > cathryn.mellersh@a... > > > > > > *Use this sig! Help the scientists help us!* > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > > thanks > > > . > > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not > > important to > > > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message > modify > > the > > > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we > > Thank You > > > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > * To visit your group on the web, go to: > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > > thanks > > > . > > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not > > important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original > > message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > > subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > To visit your group on the web, go to: > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks > > . > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not > important to > > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify > the > > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we > Thank You > > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > * To visit your group on the web, go to: > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > _____ > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > * To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12370	From: Amanda	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Pop up 15 gallon plastic aquarium/fountain

I saw this, and had to post it. It is a good price for something like this, and of course would make a great addition to any patio, or even inside for fish lovers like us. http://www.abcdistributing.com/store/0405F2/36c.cfm?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12371	From: kb1dva	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Oscars

I downloaded 2 more you can see the whole tank - forgive my angle. One of the blood parrots seems to be hiding, doesn't want his picture taken. Moving this thing over -about 8 feet is going to be a real pain. I really appreciate all the good advice, I have learned so much in the four months I've been keeping fish, and so much more to learn Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12372	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up 15 gallon plastic aquarium/fountain

what an interesting idea! --- Amanda <acharris23@...> wrote: > I saw this, and had to post it. It is a good price for something like > this, and of course would make a great addition to any patio, or even > inside for fish lovers like us. > > http://www.abcdistributing.com/store/0405F2/36c.cfm? > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12373	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up aquarium/fountain HEATER?

How do you add a heater to a pop up? Wouldn't that run a risk of melting and where would you put it? -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Amanda Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2005 11:02 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Pop up 15 gallon plastic aquarium/fountain I saw this, and had to post it. It is a good price for something like this, and of course would make a great addition to any patio, or even inside for fish lovers like us. http://www.abcdistributing.com/store/0405F2/36c.cfm? Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12374	From: Trevor Holyoak	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up aquarium/fountain HEATER?

Since this is meant for outdoor use, you probably wouldn't want to add a heater. There are many kinds of fish (more if you live in a warm climate) that would do great outside without a heater. I currently have goldfish and white clouds outside, for instance. When it gets really hot here, in July/August, I've put out endlers as well. - Trevor Dane & Leslie Moore wrote: > How do you add a heater to a pop up? Wouldn't that run a risk of > melting and where would you put it? > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Amanda > Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2005 11:02 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Pop up 15 gallon plastic aquarium/fountain > > > I saw this, and had to post it. It is a good price for something like > this, and of course would make a great addition to any patio, or even > inside for fish lovers like us. > > http://www.abcdistributing.com/store/0405F2/36c.cfm? > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12375	From: hnorton1cogeco.ca	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Pop up 15 gallon plastic aquarium/Heather Norton

Canadian tires had something like this at their store here in Canada last year Heather Norton [AquaticLife] Pop up 15 gallon plastic aquarium/fountain Amanda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12376	From: Trevor Holyoak	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up aquarium/fountain HEATER?

By the way, there are lots of other things you can put fish in outside besides the clear plastic thing that was mentioned. I have my white clouds in a 3 gal. ceramic pot on the front porch. The goldfish are in a large rectangular plastic planter (about 13 gallons) on my back patio. It's big enough that I've been able to add some pond plants to it. I've also kept fish and plants in plastic washtubs and Rubbermaid/Sterilite totes. - Trevor Trevor Holyoak wrote: > Since this is meant for outdoor use, you probably wouldn't want to add a > heater. There are many kinds of fish (more if you live in a warm > climate) that would do great outside without a heater. > > I currently have goldfish and white clouds outside, for instance. When > it gets really hot here, in July/August, I've put out endlers as well. > > - Trevor > > Dane & Leslie Moore wrote: > > > How do you add a heater to a pop up? Wouldn't that run a risk of > > melting and where would you put it? > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > > On Behalf Of Amanda > > Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2005 11:02 AM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Pop up 15 gallon plastic aquarium/fountain > > > > > > I saw this, and had to post it. It is a good price for something like > > this, and of course would make a great addition to any patio, or even > > inside for fish lovers like us. > > > > http://www.abcdistributing.com/store/0405F2/36c.cfm? > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12377	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Oscars

I checked out the two additional photos. From this distance it appears that the two smaller Oscars are indeed darker, although closer pics may be able to show more. If they are as they appear (dark) it could well be due to stress. As far as moving the tank, see if you can save a good amount (at least 50% would be nice) of the water in buckets or such. You may not have to remove the fish if you can drain it down to where you can leave about 12 to 15 gallons, or enough to cover the fishes' backs (they may jump a little if too much water is removed). Even so, 15 gallons of water weighs more than 120 pounds -- it would require a couple of strong guys to move it (gently). This tank will take the strain of 15 gallons of slightly moving water, no problem. If practical and not too heavy, keep the top on the tank (or A top, even if its a piece of plywood) to prevent the fish from jumping out. Ray \ -- - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "kb1dva" <vze3pd7a@v...> wrote: > I downloaded 2 more you can see the whole tank - forgive my angle. One of > the blood parrots seems to be hiding, doesn't want his picture taken. Moving > this thing over -about 8 feet is going to be a real pain. I really > appreciate all the good advice, I have learned so much in the four months > I've been keeping fish, and so much more to learn Emily > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12378	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up 15 gallon plastic aquarium/fountain

Ya, that is pretty cool. I have seen them in the black(non see thru) on ebay in 20 and 45 gallon sizes but I like the clear ones. I wonder if my cat could take it out of commision? Mike -----Original Message----- From: Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wed, 15 Jun 2005 12:10:41 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Pop up 15 gallon plastic aquarium/fountain what an interesting idea! --- Amanda <acharris23@...> wrote: > I saw this, and had to post it. It is a good price for something like > this, and of course would make a great addition to any patio, or even > inside for fish lovers like us. > > http://www.abcdistributing.com/store/0405F2/36c.cfm? > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs! Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12379	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up aquarium/fountain HEATER?

Right on Trevor, I had four sterilite tubs with a centralized filter on my old patio, it worked great. I also had a 30+ gallon plastic pot like for garden plants that I kept goldfish in. Last weekend I drove by a garage sale and they were selling a round stock tank, 2 feet high and 5 feet across. I need to clean it and will make it my summer cichlid pond. Mike -----Original Message----- From: Trevor Holyoak <trevor@...> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wed, 15 Jun 2005 14:11:22 -0600 Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] RE: Pop up aquarium/fountain HEATER? By the way, there are lots of other things you can put fish in outside besides the clear plastic thing that was mentioned. I have my white clouds in a 3 gal. ceramic pot on the front porch. The goldfish are in a large rectangular plastic planter (about 13 gallons) on my back patio. It's big enough that I've been able to add some pond plants to it. I've also kept fish and plants in plastic washtubs and Rubbermaid/Sterilite totes. - Trevor Trevor Holyoak wrote: > Since this is meant for outdoor use, you probably wouldn't want to add a > heater. There are many kinds of fish (more if you live in a warm > climate) that would do great outside without a heater. > > I currently have goldfish and white clouds outside, for instance. When > it gets really hot here, in July/August, I've put out endlers as well. > > - Trevor > > Dane & Leslie Moore wrote: > > > How do you add a heater to a pop up? Wouldn't that run a risk of > > melting and where would you put it? > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > > On Behalf Of Amanda > > Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2005 11:02 AM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Pop up 15 gallon plastic aquarium/fountain > > > > > > I saw this, and had to post it. It is a good price for something like > > this, and of course would make a great addition to any patio, or even > > inside for fish lovers like us. > > > > http://www.abcdistributing.com/store/0405F2/36c.cfm? > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12380	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up 15 gallon plastic aquarium/fountain

Dunno about the clear ones, but I have one of the black ones and I know a cat can't puncture it. Sides are somewhat rigid. Cat might bend a wall in if it had the weight and get a very wet surprise though. lol But with my popup (just a 28 gallon one), the upgraded fountain seems to keep the stray cats away from a potential snack. ----- Original Message ----- From: <Deenerz@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2005 2:12 PM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Pop up 15 gallon plastic aquarium/fountain > Ya, that is pretty cool. > I have seen them in the black(non see thru) on ebay in 20 and 45 gallon sizes but I like the clear ones. > I wonder if my cat could take it out of commision? > > Mike > > -----Original Message----- > From: Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Wed, 15 Jun 2005 12:10:41 -0700 (PDT) > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Pop up 15 gallon plastic aquarium/fountain > > > what an interesting idea! > > --- Amanda <acharris23@...> wrote: > > > I saw this, and had to post it. It is a good price for something like > > this, and of course would make a great addition to any patio, or even > > inside for fish lovers like us. > > > > http://www.abcdistributing.com/store/0405F2/36c.cfm? > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the > reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line > -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for > your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12381	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up aquarium/fountain HEATER?

You shouldn't need to add a heater if you're adding pond fish. The only way I can imagine putting a heater in a popup would be to build an overhang and suspend the heater from the overhang into the popup. But yea. I have a popup with some comets. (Can't spell the word, the white and orange kind) lol They'll stay in there till I finish prepping the pond in the back. I did have to upgrade the pump for my popup as the one that came with it was pathetically weak, barly sending water half an inch out of the pipe. Fortunatly stronger fountains were pretty cheap. (paid 40 bucks and now I have the water going a foot and a half up.) Probably more than nessesary, but at least now I know the thing is getting proper aeration and decent water movement. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dane & Leslie Moore" <amjmail@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2005 12:20 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] RE: Pop up aquarium/fountain HEATER? > How do you add a heater to a pop up? Wouldn't that run a risk of > melting and where would you put it? > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Amanda > Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2005 11:02 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Pop up 15 gallon plastic aquarium/fountain > > > I saw this, and had to post it. It is a good price for something like > this, and of course would make a great addition to any patio, or even > inside for fish lovers like us. > > http://www.abcdistributing.com/store/0405F2/36c.cfm? > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important > to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify > the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we > Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12382	From: Eric Miner	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Ammonia and fish behavior

Hello All, My first tank has been going for two weeks with fish. I did a successful fishless cycle before that. I've been monitoring ammonia, nitrites and nitrates every other day. My ammonia has been steady between 0.2 and 0.25. I did a 25% water change two days ago ammonia fell to 0 and nitrite and nitrates were the same. Today I did another set to tests, ammonia is back up to .2 and NO2 & NO3 are unchanged. The fish, 6 Panda Corys, 8 Harlequins and 8 Amono shrimp all seem very happy and normal. The tank is planted. Are these levels too high? I'm found confliting info on this. Should I do a larger water change? any suggestions? Thanks, Eric

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12383	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Outdoor fish-was pop up aquarium

OK so no heater. That makes sense as it's in the 90's here already, and easily gets over 100 starting in July. Is that TOO hot for outdoor fish? -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Trevor Holyoak Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2005 2:44 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] RE: Pop up aquarium/fountain HEATER? Since this is meant for outdoor use, you probably wouldn't want to add a heater. There are many kinds of fish (more if you live in a warm climate) that would do great outside without a heater. I currently have goldfish and white clouds outside, for instance. When it gets really hot here, in July/August, I've put out endlers as well. - Trevor

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12384	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up 15 gallon plastic aquarium/fountain

Thanks for the information. Since I saw the clear one on the posting I have been trying to scheme a way to put it in my living room on the unused hearth of the fireplace. But I think the black ones will be fine outside and hey I might even be able to grow some aquatic plants that way. Mike -----Original Message----- From: The Dragon Hunter <dragon.hunter@...> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wed, 15 Jun 2005 14:32:50 -0700 Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Pop up 15 gallon plastic aquarium/fountain Dunno about the clear ones, but I have one of the black ones and I know a cat can't puncture it. Sides are somewhat rigid. Cat might bend a wall in if it had the weight and get a very wet surprise though. lol But with my popup (just a 28 gallon one), the upgraded fountain seems to keep the stray cats away from a potential snack. ----- Original Message ----- From: <Deenerz@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2005 2:12 PM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Pop up 15 gallon plastic aquarium/fountain > Ya, that is pretty cool. > I have seen them in the black(non see thru) on ebay in 20 and 45 gallon sizes but I like the clear ones. > I wonder if my cat could take it out of commision? > > Mike > > -----Original Message----- > From: Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Wed, 15 Jun 2005 12:10:41 -0700 (PDT) > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Pop up 15 gallon plastic aquarium/fountain > > > what an interesting idea! > > --- Amanda <acharris23@...> wrote: > > > I saw this, and had to post it. It is a good price for something like > > this, and of course would make a great addition to any patio, or even > > inside for fish lovers like us. > > > > http://www.abcdistributing.com/store/0405F2/36c.cfm? > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the > reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line > -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for > your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12385	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up aquarium/fountain HEATER?

hehehe I moved my plecos in a rubbermaid storage bin. The other fish were moved in deep salad bowls with aluminum foil over the top to keep the water from spilling out. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Trevor Holyoak" <trevor@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2005 1:11 PM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] RE: Pop up aquarium/fountain HEATER? > By the way, there are lots of other things you can put fish in outside > besides the clear plastic thing that was mentioned. I have my white > clouds in a 3 gal. ceramic pot on the front porch. The goldfish are in a > large rectangular plastic planter (about 13 gallons) on my back patio. > It's big enough that I've been able to add some pond plants to it. I've > also kept fish and plants in plastic washtubs and Rubbermaid/Sterilite > totes. > > - Trevor > > Trevor Holyoak wrote: > > > Since this is meant for outdoor use, you probably wouldn't want to add a > > heater. There are many kinds of fish (more if you live in a warm > > climate) that would do great outside without a heater. > > > > I currently have goldfish and white clouds outside, for instance. When > > it gets really hot here, in July/August, I've put out endlers as well. > > > > - Trevor > > > > Dane & Leslie Moore wrote: > > > > > How do you add a heater to a pop up? Wouldn't that run a risk of > > > melting and where would you put it? > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > > > On Behalf Of Amanda > > > Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2005 11:02 AM > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Pop up 15 gallon plastic aquarium/fountain > > > > > > > > > I saw this, and had to post it. It is a good price for something like > > > this, and of course would make a great addition to any patio, or even > > > inside for fish lovers like us. > > > > > > http://www.abcdistributing.com/store/0405F2/36c.cfm? > > > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12386	From: Trevor Holyoak	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Outdoor fish-was pop up aquarium

The fish I've kept outside have done great even in the low 100s. You can put them in the shade or put some floating plants in to provide shade for them. I imagine in their natural tropical habitats the temperatures probably get that high as well. - Trevor Dane & Leslie Moore wrote: > OK so no heater. That makes sense as it's in the 90's here already, and > easily gets over 100 starting in July. Is that TOO hot for outdoor > fish? > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Trevor Holyoak > Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2005 2:44 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] RE: Pop up aquarium/fountain HEATER? > > > Since this is meant for outdoor use, you probably wouldn't want to add a > > heater. There are many kinds of fish (more if you live in a warm > climate) that would do great outside without a heater. > > I currently have goldfish and white clouds outside, for instance. When > it gets really hot here, in July/August, I've put out endlers as well. > > - Trevor > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12387	From: Trevor Holyoak	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up aquarium/fountain HEATER?

I took a fish back to the store I bought it from (it wasn't getting along with the other fish in the tank) in a Tupperware container once. I just didn't tell my wife. :D - Trevor The Dragon Hunter wrote: > hehehe I moved my plecos in a rubbermaid storage bin. The other fish > were > moved in deep salad bowls with aluminum foil over the top to keep the > water > from spilling out. > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12388	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Pop up aquarium/fountain-Shipping

Just an FYI. That company, while they have totally cool stuff and I order from them a LOT, they sometimes really rip you off in shipping. (And they bill you so you don't know it until you already have your stuff.) Just a thought. =) Leslie

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12389	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Outdoor fish-was pop up aquarium

Naw. Same temps in my area (California) Water in my 28 popup outside is about 73. From what I've been told when asking about the pond I'm building, water movement aeration should keep it cool enough to go through the summer. (Good thing since it does hit 110 on occasion in MoVal) -Steve ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dane & Leslie Moore" <amjmail@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2005 2:42 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] Outdoor fish-was pop up aquarium > OK so no heater. That makes sense as it's in the 90's here already, and > easily gets over 100 starting in July. Is that TOO hot for outdoor > fish? > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12390	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up aquarium/fountain HEATER?

What she doesn't know won't hurt, unless you didn't get all of the fish poo out before it was used to prepare the hamburger meat. lol Those Rubermaid bins work good for keeping crayfish in also. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Trevor Holyoak" <trevor@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2005 2:49 PM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] RE: Pop up aquarium/fountain HEATER? > I took a fish back to the store I bought it from (it wasn't getting > along with the other fish in the tank) in a Tupperware container once. I > just didn't tell my wife. :D > > - Trevor > > The Dragon Hunter wrote: > > > hehehe I moved my plecos in a rubbermaid storage bin. The other fish > > were > > moved in deep salad bowls with aluminum foil over the top to keep the > > water > > from spilling out. > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12391	From: Amanda	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up aquarium/fountain-Shipping

Yes that is true about the shipping. If you order a lot of stuff, they sometimes ship every piece seperately, which adds up quickly on the shipping. Their prices are close to wholesale though. The one good thing is that you can order if you do not have a credit card, or don't want to use a c.c., and you also have a couple of days once the item gets there to send off payment for it. Just thought it would be something some people would enjoy. I am thinking of getting one or 2 for my patio. I have an apartment, so patio space is limited, but I think it would be nice to set it up with a basking dock for my turtles to have some time out in the "real" sun. As long as it doesn't get too hot, which it shouldn't since it is in the shade until about 2 in the afternoon, the water temps. should be fine. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > Just an FYI. That company, while they have totally cool stuff and I > order from them a LOT, they sometimes really rip you off in shipping. > (And they bill you so you don't know it until you already have your > stuff.) > Just a thought. =) > Leslie

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12392	From: helen572	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: cichlid dying of old age?

We have a 40-gallon with five S.A. cichlids. The "boss" cichlid, Moe, rules the others, and claimed the large, ceramic tree trunk for his own. He's very dark and has the hump on his head. One of the other guys (Numbnuts) has occasionally challenged him (the head-on, back-and-forth motions). For the past few days, Moe has not come out of his hidey-hole (as far as I know), even to eat. Numbnuts is hanging around the hidey-hole all the time. It's my impression that Numbnuts is waiting for Moe to die so he can take over. Has anyone experienced this kind of behavior? Am I wrong about what's going on here? Anything I can do to coax Moe out to eat? All advice welcome.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12393	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up 15 gallon plastic aquarium/fountain

ABC distributing is my school major provider of classroom materials... that is prolly why a lot of us haven't heard of it... however i think they are very overpriced in general... but it does look like fun... might be an idea for my classroom but then i would want a lid cause kids would be putting their hands in there but saran would work.. hrm.. shannon what an interesting idea! --- Amanda <acharris23@...> wrote: > I saw this, and had to post it. It is a good price for something like > this, and of course would make a great addition to any patio, or even > inside for fish lovers like us. > > http://www.abcdistributing.com/store/0405F2/36c.cfm? > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12394	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up aquarium/fountain HEATER?

what kind of fish other than goldfish would be ok in oregon summers... which are average 75 ° but then can drop to 50° at night... Shannon Since this is meant for outdoor use, you probably wouldn't want to add a heater. There are many kinds of fish (more if you live in a warm climate) that would do great outside without a heater. I currently have goldfish and white clouds outside, for instance. When it gets really hot here, in July/August, I've put out endlers as well. - Trevor [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12395	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up 15 gallon plastic aquarium/fountain

my cats don't care for nothing about fish... i had a jumper on the floor for over a day and the cat just slept on the bed lol... she even drinks out of one of my betta bowls.. doesn't bother the fish at all.. shannon Ya, that is pretty cool. I have seen them in the black(non see thru) on ebay in 20 and 45 gallon sizes but I like the clear ones. I wonder if my cat could take it out of commision? Mike [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12396	From: Trevor Holyoak	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up aquarium/fountain HEATER?

The low temp probably isn't much different than it is here in Utah. The fish I've mentioned have done fine here (although my endlers died last year because I didn't bring them back in on time), and there are others as well. - Trevor agentscullyeyore@... wrote: > > what kind of fish other than goldfish would be ok in oregon > summers... which > are average 75 ° but then can drop to 50° at night... Shannon > > Since this is meant for outdoor use, you probably wouldn't want to add a > heater. There are many kinds of fish (more if you live in a warm > climate) that would do great outside without a heater. > > I currently have goldfish and white clouds outside, for instance. When > it gets really hot here, in July/August, I've put out endlers as well. > > - Trevor > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12397	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: New file uploaded to AquaticLife

Hello, This email message is a notification to let you know that a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the AquaticLife group. File : /eary_stages_aquarium.pdf Uploaded by : tholyoak <trevor@...> Description : An interesting review of the early development of the hobby You can access this file at the URL: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/files/eary_stages_aquarium.pdf To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit: http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files Regards, tholyoak <trevor@...>

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12398	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: cichlid dying of old age?

couple possibilities.. certainly not all the possibilities.. Moe got his butt kicked and is hiding Moe got sick and needs medication, and TLC ( tender loving care ) Moe might be guarding babies. and your NumbNuts could be the mommy. the behavior you witnessed early might not have been aggression rather a mating ritual.. its hard to say really... remove the tree trunk and fish to a seperate tank and have a look inside, or dump Moe into a seperate tank to see what he looks like. If he is diseased it should be pretty obvious when you look at him. i say seperate tank because a quarantine tank is a MUSt have item in any hobbyists house. rob indiana In a message dated 6/15/2005 6:21:56 PM US Eastern Standard Time, shirleycat@... writes: > We have a 40-gallon with five S.A. cichlids. The "boss" cichlid, Moe, > rules the others, and claimed the large, ceramic tree trunk for his > own. He's very dark and has the hump on his head. One of the other > guys (Numbnuts) has occasionally challenged him (the head-on, > back-and-forth motions). For the past few days, Moe has not come out > of his hidey-hole (as far as I know), even to eat. Numbnuts is hanging > around the hidey-hole all the time. It's my impression that Numbnuts > is waiting for Moe to die so he can take over. Has anyone experienced > this kind of behavior? Am I wrong about what's going on here? > Anything I can do to coax Moe out to eat? All advice welcome. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12399	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up 15 gallon plastic aquarium/fountain

My cat likes to sit and watch them and always drinks out of the tanks, she even fell in one ass first, that was hilarious. But most of the fish are smart enough to go to the bottom of the tank when she is drinking water, except the guppies, they think she is going to feed them. Mike -----Original Message----- From: agentscullyeyore@... To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wed, 15 Jun 2005 19:31:59 EDT Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Pop up 15 gallon plastic aquarium/fountain my cats don't care for nothing about fish... i had a jumper on the floor for over a day and the cat just slept on the bed lol... she even drinks out of one of my betta bowls.. doesn't bother the fish at all.. shannon Ya, that is pretty cool. I have seen them in the black(non see thru) on ebay in 20 and 45 gallon sizes but I like the clear ones. I wonder if my cat could take it out of commision? Mike [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12400	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up 15 gallon plastic aquarium/fountain

oh wow i would have loved to see that pic.. how fast was she out of the tank... Shannon My cat likes to sit and watch them and always drinks out of the tanks, she even fell in one ass first, that was hilarious. But most of the fish are smart enough to go to the bottom of the tank when she is drinking water, except the guppies, they think she is going to feed them. Mike [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12401	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up 15 gallon plastic aquarium/fountain

FAST! And of course being a cat she had that "I meant to do that" attitude and look. I laughed and she shunned me all day. Mike -----Original Message----- From: agentscullyeyore@... To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wed, 15 Jun 2005 20:24:05 EDT Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Pop up 15 gallon plastic aquarium/fountain oh wow i would have loved to see that pic.. how fast was she out of the tank... Shannon My cat likes to sit and watch them and always drinks out of the tanks, she even fell in one ass first, that was hilarious. But most of the fish are smart enough to go to the bottom of the tank when she is drinking water, except the guppies, they think she is going to feed them. Mike [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12402	From: Amanda	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up aquarium/fountain-Shipping

Ok, so ABC can get kinda crazy on shipping. Well, I just checked out ebay, and people are charging 15+ dollars to ship this. I know ABC won't charge that much! Also, they ship Fed Ex, with tracking information if you order online. Mandy --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > Just an FYI. That company, while they have totally cool stuff and I > order from them a LOT, they sometimes really rip you off in shipping. > (And they bill you so you don't know it until you already have your > stuff.) > Just a thought. =) > Leslie

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12403	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up aquarium/fountain-Shipping

ppl on ebay have gone crazy with shipping totally makes me mad i nearly wont buy from ppl on there anymore.. Shannon Ok, so ABC can get kinda crazy on shipping. Well, I just checked out ebay, and people are charging 15+ dollars to ship this. I know ABC won't charge that much! Also, they ship Fed Ex, with tracking information if you order online. Mandy [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12404	From: anubias	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: NEPAS Meeting Thursday night

For anyone in the Greater Philadelphia area with an interest in native fish, come check out the Northeast Philadelphia Aquarium Society meeting at the Pennypack Environmental Center at 7:00 tomorrow night. I'll be speaking on the Fishes of Pennypack Creek. More information is available on the NEPAS website, phillyfishclub.com. I hope to see some of you there! Mark

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12405	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up aquarium/fountain HEATER?

In a message dated 6/15/2005 3:44:49 PM Eastern Standard Time, trevor@... writes: Since this is meant for outdoor use, you probably wouldn't want to add a heater. There are many kinds of fish (more if you live in a warm climate) that would do great outside without a heater. I currently have goldfish and white clouds outside, for instance. When it gets really hot here, in July/August, I've put out endlers as well. I have a "pop-up pond" which is similar but larger (45 gal) and brown sided. I overwintered some of my pond fish in it in the family room (warmest room in the house) and it's now on the deck with white clouds in it. I don't use any sort of heater in it and only use a sponge filter and bubble wand in the winter, in the summer the plants do the job. =) Vicky Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Or write: hgparker@... =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact Dr Breen @ 919-513-1467 _and_ Dr London @ calondon@... 530-754-5711 They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... *Use this sig! Help the scientists help us!* [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12406	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up aquarium/fountain-Shipping

That's a great idea Amanda. I'd love to find a way to use it outside. I was going to install a fountain outside but I would rather do this...more fun to look at and much cheaper. =) Have kids stuff? Check out Zainy Zebra Consignment! Based in Cabot, AR www.ZainyZebra.com Live in or near Cabot? Join the Cabot Garage Sale! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/CabotgarageSale/ Live in Little Rock? Little Rock Garage Sale!http://groups.yahoo.com/group/LRgarageSale/ -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Amanda Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2005 5:58 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Pop up aquarium/fountain-Shipping Yes that is true about the shipping. If you order a lot of stuff, they sometimes ship every piece seperately, which adds up quickly on the shipping. Their prices are close to wholesale though. The one good thing is that you can order if you do not have a credit card, or don't want to use a c.c., and you also have a couple of days once the item gets there to send off payment for it. Just thought it would be something some people would enjoy. I am thinking of getting one or 2 for my patio. I have an apartment, so patio space is limited, but I think it would be nice to set it up with a basking dock for my turtles to have some time out in the "real" sun. As long as it doesn't get too hot, which it shouldn't since it is in the shade until about 2 in the afternoon, the water temps. should be fine. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > Just an FYI. That company, while they have totally cool stuff and I > order from them a LOT, they sometimes really rip you off in shipping. > (And they bill you so you don't know it until you already have your > stuff.) > Just a thought. =) > Leslie Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12407	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: New file uploaded to AquaticLife

Trevor, Did Albert give you permission to upload that work here? \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2005 7:47 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] New file uploaded to AquaticLife Hello, This email message is a notification to let you know that a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the AquaticLife group. File : /eary_stages_aquarium.pdf Uploaded by : tholyoak <trevor@...> Description : An interesting review of the early development of the hobby You can access this file at the URL: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/files/eary_stages_aquarium.pdf To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit: http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files Regards, tholyoak <trevor@...> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12408	From: mommy2acdhsurvivor	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: HELP!! Fish with a fat lip! Looks bloody inside

Thanks for all the info. I've had him maybe a year and haven't seen him grow at all. I can't tell if he's getting better or not. His lip is no longer fat but you can definatley see alot of blood still. Some one asked for pictures of the turtles and I forgot to upload them so I will do that for anyone who would like to see them they will be in the folder MELANIE'S PICS. Thanks again for the info, he's a really cool fish. I've enjoyed having him, except of course when he ate my guppies one by one. > Definitely one of the North American Sunfish Family. At this size, its > still quite young to tell exactly which species. You may have to wait > for a more positive I.D., until it puts on more size. While its > remotely possible it may be one of the dwarf Sunfish (Elassoma or > Enneacanthus), I tend to dismiss this as by now it should have more > adult coloration unless its an immature female. While its still > possible that it could be one of the Crappies (White or Black), members > of the Sunfish Family which will easily reach an average length of 10" - > 12" (world's record - 21"), it lacks the markings in these young > Pomoxis species I recall seeing in my collections when seining for > them. While the body shape is identical, as are many other young > Sunfish, the finnage is not. I tend to believe at this size that its a > juvenile of one of the medium size Sunfish of the Lepomis group, more > probably a Pumpkinseed Sunfish (Lepomis gibbosus), its > telltale "earflap" marking not yet developing at this size. These fish > get to about 8". Still not a definite I.D., but best I can come up > with at this size. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "mommy2acdhsurvivor" <CK147@H...> > wrote: > > It's the last 3 photos in the folder MELANIE'S PICS He wouldn't look > > at me so the last pic is horrible. Anyone have any idea as to what > > kind of fish he is? He has orange eyes. Thanks

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12409	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Betta babies

Currently only have Crypts and Elodia. But the elodia is a light light green color which is why i'm really interested in what other people are doing to get there plants looking good. All the aquarium store ive visited, their elodia is a dark green color. Ive added a picture of my plants today, check the photo album " Nick (nedarg@...) " =Nick ----- Original Message ----- From: "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2005 4:59 PM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies > Nick, > > > > Flourish will only show a difference if you have a deficiency of any > nutrients that it replenishes. If you are doing regular water changes and > the tank is not a high tech setup, then flourish may not even be needed. > > > > Flourite on the other hand is a wonderful gravel for the plants that has a > bit of CEC and so adsorbs the nutrients from the water to make them > available to the plants. > > > > What plants do you have? > > > > Nim > > > > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Nicolas Munro > Sent: 15 June 2005 07:29 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies > > > > not sure, i'm using Seachems Flourish but havn't noticed a big change > since > i started. > > The plants which are growing on a clay soil which has been heated to 1200 > degrees Celcius (think its flourite) seem to be doing better than the ones > not on it. > > =Nick > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Rei - Raymond Tremor" <rei_tremor@...> > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2005 1:11 PM > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies > > >> Nick, I feed them the liquid Flourite by Seachem and now I am trying to >> use >> Plant Gro by Nutrafin. I don't have a substrate and only have a plant box >> with plant plugs and stones. I have to cover the plant plugs with stones >> cause the goldfishes are notorious in removing the plant plugs. I have >> anubis nana and anubis barteri in the plant box but they managed to >> nibble >> on some of the leaves till it turned yellowish and then brownish. I don't >> know if I have snails but couldn't see anything. I washed the plants >> before. >> I had added the anacharis but washed them in a cool running water. What >> is > >> a >> good plant food? >> >> Rei - Raymond Tremor >> LoveMoAko@... >> http://www.geocities.com/raymondtremor/my-bettas.html >> >> -------Original Message------- >> >> From: Nicolas Munro >> Date: 06/14/05 12:55:14 >> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com >> Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies >> >> Do you feed the plants anything special? >> >> Im hoping to buy some more plants over the weekend so eventually I won't >> need to seperate my Guppie fry from the parents, hoping they can use the >> plants to hide in. >> >> =Nick >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@...> >> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> >> Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2005 4:37 PM >> Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies >> >> >>> Hi Nick, >>> >>> >>> >>> Light is a shocker ;). I have only 11W PLL bulb over the tank that's is >>> half >>> daylight and half bluemoon. They are no where near to even a standard >>> aquarium light but still the plants are doing great. >>> >>> One of the fry seems to have started to show a bit of colour as well ;) >>> >>> >>> >>> Nim >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> _____ >>> >>> From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] >>> On >>> Behalf Of Nicolas Munro >>> Sent: 13 June 2005 23:45 >>> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com >>> Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies >>> >>> >>> >>> How much light do you have for your tank? both the plants and the betta >>> fry >>> >>> look really good. >>> >>> Look similar to guppie fry too. >>> >>> =Nick >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@...> >>> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> >>> Sent: Friday, June 10, 2005 6:53 PM >>> Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies >>> >>> >>>> Rei, >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> This was actually by accident. 2 double tail females with a very >>>> standard >>>> male and I don't know which one of the 2 had spawned coz all 3 of them >>>> died >>>> after spawning :-( >>>> >>>> I have not fed them anything special at the moment. infact I have not >>>> yet >>>> put any food in the tank. My guess was that the snails created >>>> infusoria >>>> that fed the fry and if they managed to survive a couple of weeks >>>> without >>>> me >>>> noticing them then something must have been right. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> I have some fine powdered high protein fry food that I will start from >>>> today >>>> as I think they are big enough to take this food. I have already seen >>>> one >>>> of >>>> the fry pull out a baby snail from their shell, so maybe that is >>>> another >>>> source of food for them. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> The plants are Hygroplhilla polysperma, Java moss, Hydrocotyle and a >>>> couple >>>> of stems of bacopa and ludwigia with a few hanging crypts and anubias. >>>> Nothing is really rooted in that tank as the gravel bottom is just ½ ". >>>> I >>>> did think about feeding them baby brineshrimp but then I thought that >>>> there >>>> is no point as the most cruitial stage has passed and they are twice >>>> the >>>> size of a newly born guppy fry and should be able to take normal food. >>>> As >>>> you can see that their bellies are still full, so I think there is >>>> plenty >>>> of >>>> what ever they are feeding. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Nim >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _____ >>>> >>>> From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] >>>> On >>>> Behalf Of Rei - Raymond Tremor >>>> Sent: 10 June 2005 09:35 >>>> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com >>>> Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> What kind of betta did you breed? What are you feeding them? I was >>>> feeding >>>> mine with baby brime shrimp and hard boiled egg yolk and sometimes beef >>>> heart and also boiled chicken meat shredded. I don't have bettas now >>>> cause >>>> it is hard work to clean tanks. I like your plants, what kind are they? >>>> I >>>> bred a crown tail female with a twin tail male. Some of the babies were >>>> twin >>>> crown tail. I used a 5 galloon tank with anacharis plants and about 4 >>>> to >>>> 5 >>>> inches of water cause I had been told that the babies will survive more >>>> if >>>> the water level was low cause they have a shorter swim from the bottom >>>> to >>>> the top. I had 20 babies and they live up to a year (maybe more cause I >>>> gave >>>> them away when I decided to keep a goldfish tank). >>>> >>>> Rei - Raymond Tremor >>>> LoveMoAko@... >>>> >>>> -------Original Message------- >>>> >>>> From: Nimish Mathur >>>> Date: 06/09/05 20:47:16 >>>> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com >>>> Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta babies >>>> >>>> I just managed to take a pic of the 2-3 week old fry. >>>> >>>> http://www.nimmat.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10001/picture00006.jpg >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> this is what they were on 4th June >>>> >>>> http://www.nimmat.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10001/betta%20Fry.JPG >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Nim >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks >>>> . >>>> Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important >>>> to >>>> the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the >>>> subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank >>>> You >>>> in >>>> Advance for your help in this matter >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Yahoo! Groups Links >>>> >>>> To visit your group on the web, go to: >>>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ >>>> >>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: >>>> AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com >>>> >>>> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks >>>> . >>>> Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important >>>> to >>>> the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the >>>> subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank >>>> You >>>> in Advance for your help in this matter >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _____ >>>> >>>> Yahoo! Groups Links >>>> >>>> * To visit your group on the web, go to: >>>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ >>>> >>>> * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: >>>> AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com >>>> <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> >>>> >>>> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! >>>> <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks >>>> . >>>> Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important >>>> to >>> >>>> the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the >>>> subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank >>>> You >>> >>>> in Advance for your help in this matter >>>> Yahoo! Groups Links >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks >>> . >>> Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important >>> to >>> the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the >>> subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank >>> You >>> in Advance for your help in this matter >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> _____ >>> >>> Yahoo! Groups Links >>> >>> * To visit your group on the web, go to: >>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ >>> >>> * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: >>> AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com >>> <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> >>> >>> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! >>> <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. >>> >>> >>> >>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks >>> . >>> Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important >>> to >> >>> the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the >>> subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank >>> You >> >>> in Advance for your help in this matter >>> Yahoo! Groups Links >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> >> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks >> . >> Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important >> to >> the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the >> subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank >> You >> in Advance for your help in this matter >> >> >> >> >> Yahoo! Groups Links >> >> To visit your group on the web, go to: >> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ >> >> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: >> AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com >> >> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. >> >> >> >> >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >> >> >> >> >> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks >> . >> Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important >> to > >> the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the >> subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank >> You > >> in Advance for your help in this matter >> Yahoo! Groups Links >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > _____ > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > * To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12410	From: paul helms	Date: 6/15/2005
Subject: Re: Ammonia and fish behavior

you are either overfeeding or cycling...a cycle takes 4-6 weeks --- Eric Miner <eminer1254@...> wrote: > Hello All, > > My first tank has been going for two weeks with > fish. I did a successful > fishless cycle before that. I've been monitoring > ammonia, nitrites and > nitrates every other day. My ammonia has been steady > between 0.2 and > 0.25. I did a 25% water change two days ago ammonia > fell to 0 and > nitrite and nitrates were the same. Today I did > another set to tests, > ammonia is back up to .2 and NO2 & NO3 are > unchanged. > > The fish, 6 Panda Corys, 8 Harlequins and 8 Amono > shrimp all seem very > happy and normal. The tank is planted. > > Are these levels too high? I'm found confliting info > on this. Should I > do a larger water change? any suggestions? > > Thanks, > > Eric > > > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Find restaurants, movies, travel and more fun for the weekend. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/weekend.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12411	From: Eric Miner	Date: 6/16/2005
Subject: Re: Ammonia and fish behavior

I must be overfeeding. The cycle was finished when I added the fish. Thanks Eric --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms <wtfmorlok@y...> wrote: > you are either overfeeding or cycling...a cycle takes > 4-6 weeks >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12412	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 6/16/2005
Subject: Re: HELP!! Fish with a fat lip! Looks bloody inside

If she hasn't grown any in a year, and we can rule out the possibility of her being a stunted Pumpkinseed Sunfish (species she looks closest to in the pics), then in all probability, I'd have to say she's (and it is a female) an Enneacanthus gloriosus (Banded Sunfish); the males getting to a size of about 3 1/4". Note, this is not to be confused with the better known Black-Banded Sunfish (Mesogonistius chaetodon). Many juveniles of this Family look similar to each other and to some of the Dwarf species of the Family. I've taken yet another close look at the pics and can just make out several indistinct transverse bars and a dark area in the corner of the gill plate, although I do not observe the dark bar beneath the eye -- could just be the photos themselves. All these characteristics are traits of the Banded Sunfish and are more prevalent in the males. This species is very similar to the Blue- Spotted Sunfish (E. obesus), which gets to about 4", with the males having a trace of the iridescent blue spotting the Obesus has. Ray Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "mommy2acdhsurvivor" <CK147@H...> wrote: > Thanks for all the info. I've had him maybe a year and haven't seen > him grow at all. I can't tell if he's getting better or not. His lip > is no longer fat but you can definatley see alot of blood still. Some > one asked for pictures of the turtles and I forgot to upload them so I > will do that for anyone who would like to see them they will be in the > folder MELANIE'S PICS. Thanks again for the info, he's a really cool > fish. I've enjoyed having him, except of course when he ate my guppies > one by one. > > > > > Definitely one of the North American Sunfish Family. At this size, its > > still quite young to tell exactly which species. You may have to wait > > for a more positive I.D., until it puts on more size. While its > > remotely possible it may be one of the dwarf Sunfish (Elassoma or > > Enneacanthus), I tend to dismiss this as by now it should have more > > adult coloration unless its an immature female. While its still > > possible that it could be one of the Crappies (White or Black), members > > of the Sunfish Family which will easily reach an average length of 10" - > > 12" (world's record - 21"), it lacks the markings in these young > > Pomoxis species I recall seeing in my collections when seining for > > them. While the body shape is identical, as are many other young > > Sunfish, the finnage is not. I tend to believe at this size that its a > > juvenile of one of the medium size Sunfish of the Lepomis group, more > > probably a Pumpkinseed Sunfish (Lepomis gibbosus), its > > telltale "earflap" marking not yet developing at this size. These fish > > get to about 8". Still not a definite I.D., but best I can come up > > with at this size. Ray > > \ > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "mommy2acdhsurvivor" <CK147@H...> > > wrote: > > > It's the last 3 photos in the folder MELANIE'S PICS He wouldn't look > > > at me so the last pic is horrible. Anyone have any idea as to what > > > kind of fish he is? He has orange eyes. Thanks

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12413	From: hnorton1cogeco.ca	Date: 6/16/2005
Subject: other usefull containers/Heather Norton

This spring having so many guppies I found it cheaper to use the see through Tupperware tubs for sorting them they are cheap and easy to set up and when your finished use them for storage.I use them when I am moving from place to place because the lids help to keep the water from splashing out and dont have them in them very long. I test them with feeders before putting in my good ones.Haven't lost one yet Heather Norton Trevor Holyoak wrote: By the way, there are lots of other things you can put fish in outside besides the clear plastic thing that was mentioned. I have my white clouds in a 3 gal. ceramic pot on the front porch. The goldfish are in a large rectangular plastic planter (about 13 gallons) on my back patio. It's big enough that I've been able to add some pond plants to it. I've also kept fish and plants in plastic washtubs and Rubbermaid/Sterilite totes. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12414	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/16/2005
Subject: Female betta turning colors

We put our female in with the male last night and within an hour she was VERY dark in color with silver stripes. She was very light almost tan before. WHAT?! is this? Shock of some sort? Water conditions were the same, temp a bit different but that has leveled off and she is still very dark. Is she OK or should I remove her? Thanks for any info. Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12415	From: Patrick	Date: 6/16/2005
Subject: Re: Ammonia and fish behavior

Despite the "misinformation" perpetuated by supporters of fishless cycling, once you add fish the tank has to go through the entire cycle again to compensate for the exact amount of ammonia produced by the fish and the food you give them. The tank will also go through the cycle every time you add new fish to the tank. The only difference is that it will only take a few hours or days when you add the new fish. Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill -------Original Message------- I must be overfeeding. The cycle was finished when I added the fish. Thanks Eric [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12416	From: Patrick	Date: 6/16/2005
Subject: Re: Female betta turning colors

That means either she is ready for a fight, or ready for another kind of "fight". :) Those stripes appear at breeding time, so watch for the male to make a nest and for eggs to appear in it. When that happens, take the female out quickly. Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill -------Original Message------- We put our female in with the male last night and within an hour she was VERY dark in color with silver stripes. She was very light almost tan before. WHAT?! is this? Shock of some sort? Water conditions were the same, temp a bit different but that has leveled off and she is still very dark. Is she OK or should I remove her? Thanks for any info. Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12417	From: Trevor Holyoak	Date: 6/16/2005
Subject: Re: New file uploaded to AquaticLife

No, I didn't. I found it among my files yesterday and I don't remember where I got it from. It doesn't have any kind of restrictive notice on it, so I assumed it would be OK to share it with the group. If I made a mistake, I'd be happy to remove the file. - Trevor Steve Szabo wrote: > Trevor, > > Did Albert give you permission to upload that work here? > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2005 7:47 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] New file uploaded to AquaticLife > > > Hello, > > This email message is a notification to let you know that > a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the AquaticLife > group. > > File : /eary_stages_aquarium.pdf > Uploaded by : tholyoak <trevor@...> > Description : An interesting review of the early development of the > hobby > > You can access this file at the URL: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/files/eary_stages_aquarium.pdf > > To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit: > http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files > > Regards, > > tholyoak <trevor@...> >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12418	From: Trevor Holyoak	Date: 6/16/2005
Subject: Re: New file uploaded to AquaticLife

Oops, that first sentence should have either said "No, he didn't" or "No, I didn't get permission." - Trevor Trevor Holyoak wrote: > No, I didn't. I found it among my files yesterday and I don't remember > where I got it from. It doesn't have any kind of restrictive notice on > it, so I assumed it would be OK to share it with the group. If I made a > mistake, I'd be happy to remove the file. > > - Trevor > > Steve Szabo wrote: > > > Trevor, > > > > Did Albert give you permission to upload that work here? > > > > \\Steve// > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > > Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2005 7:47 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] New file uploaded to AquaticLife > > > > > > Hello, > > > > This email message is a notification to let you know that > > a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the AquaticLife > > group. > > > > File : /eary_stages_aquarium.pdf > > Uploaded by : tholyoak <trevor@...> > > Description : An interesting review of the early development of the > > hobby > > > > You can access this file at the URL: > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/files/eary_stages_aquarium.pdf > > > > To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit: > > http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files > > > > Regards, > > > > tholyoak <trevor@...> > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12419	From: paul helms	Date: 6/16/2005
Subject: Re: Ammonia and fish behavior

if you added a lot of fisha t once you could be experienceing a minicycle. when adding fish, it is recommended to adda few a week until you reach your desired amount of fsih. this is to allow said mini cycles to remain short. the tanks biological support must expand to meet the needs of the waste of the new fish. if you add too many too fast there will not be sufficient bacteria to keep up with all the waste. adding 2-3 small fish or 1 medium is not usually a problem, because the bacteria can handle a small increase without much of an ammonia spike or mini cycle. --- Eric Miner <eminer1254@...> wrote: > I must be overfeeding. The cycle was finished when I > added the fish. > > Thanks > > Eric > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > <wtfmorlok@y...> wrote: > > you are either overfeeding or cycling...a cycle > takes > > 4-6 weeks > > > > > > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Stay in touch with email, IM, photo sharing and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/stayintouch.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12420	From: Patrick	Date: 6/16/2005
Subject: Re: New file uploaded to AquaticLife

Once something is written, it is automatically the property of the person who wrote it. For example, it is illegal for you to reprint this post exactly as I have written it. It doesn't have to have a notice to be copyrighted. It doesn't even have to be registered. I won't tell anybody that you uploaded that file if you don't, but we have one member that probably knows the guy personally and will probably tell him to have his lawyer call you up. At that point you will be given a notice to stop what you have done (erase that file from the group) or it will be a court trial. You will be forced into bankruptsy and be forced to sell everything you have just to pay the court costs. The best case is you will be able to sell yourself to the copyright holder and work as their slave. Worst case is you will be executed by being thrown off the top of the Tower of Commerce on Feringinar. Opps, I think Feringinar is copyrighted and held by the Grand Negas. Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill -------Original Message------- Oops, that first sentence should have either said "No, he didn't" or "No, I didn't get permission." - Trevor Trevor Holyoak wrote: > No, I didn't. I found it among my files yesterday and I don't remember > where I got it from. It doesn't have any kind of restrictive notice on > it, so I assumed it would be OK to share it with the group. If I made a > mistake, I'd be happy to remove the file. > > - Trevor [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12421	From: Trevor Holyoak	Date: 6/16/2005
Subject: Re: New file uploaded to AquaticLife

Yes, I realize that everything is automatically copyrighted when it is written. Just how far that applies to e-mail is another topic. ;) Anyway, I didn't realize this group was full of copyright nazis. It was not my intention to distribute an article that the author doesn't want distributed (assuming that such is even the case). I'll just delete the darn thing and you guys can go back to watching your fishies... - Trevor Patrick wrote: > Once something is written, it is automatically the property of the > person who wrote it. For example, it is illegal for you to reprint this > post exactly as I have written it. It doesn't have to have a notice to be > copyrighted. It doesn't even have to be registered. > I won't tell anybody that you uploaded that file if you don't, but we > have one member that probably knows the guy personally and will probably > tell him to have his lawyer call you up. At that point you will be > given a > notice to stop what you have done (erase that file from the group) or it > will be a court trial. You will be forced into bankruptsy and be > forced to > sell everything you have just to pay the court costs. The best case > is you > will be able to sell yourself to the copyright holder and work as their > slave. Worst case is you will be executed by being thrown off the top of > the Tower of Commerce on Feringinar. Opps, I think Feringinar is > copyrighted and held by the Grand Negas. > > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy. > > "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But > it is > perhaps, the end of the beginning." > -Winston Churchill > -------Original Message------- > Oops, that first sentence should have either said "No, he didn't" or > "No, I didn't get permission." > > - Trevor > > Trevor Holyoak wrote: > > > No, I didn't. I found it among my files yesterday and I don't remember > > where I got it from. It doesn't have any kind of restrictive notice on > > it, so I assumed it would be OK to share it with the group. If I made a > > mistake, I'd be happy to remove the file. > > > > - Trevor > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12422	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/16/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up 15 gallon plastic aquarium/fountain

my new kitten loves to stare at all my tanks but can't get to any of them as all have lids shut tightly. he especially loves to sit on the chair in front of the 10g and paw at the front of the tank. he'd do it all day if i didn't shut him out of that room lol --- Deenerz@... wrote: > My cat likes to sit and watch them and always drinks out of the tanks, she even fell in one ass > first, that was hilarious. But most of the fish are smart enough to go to the bottom of the > tank when she is drinking water, except the guppies, they think she is going to feed them. > Mike > > -----Original Message----- > From: agentscullyeyore@... > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Wed, 15 Jun 2005 19:31:59 EDT > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Pop up 15 gallon plastic aquarium/fountain > > > > my cats don't care for nothing about fish... i had a jumper on the floor for > over a day and the cat just slept on the bed lol... she even drinks out of > one of my betta bowls.. doesn't bother the fish at all.. shannon > > Ya, that is pretty cool. > I have seen them in the black(non see thru) on ebay in 20 and 45 gallon > sizes but I like the clear ones. > I wonder if my cat could take it out of commision? > > Mike > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the > reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line > -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for > your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12423	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/16/2005
Subject: Re: Pop up 15 gallon plastic aquarium/fountain

poor cat =) --- Deenerz@... wrote: > FAST! > And of course being a cat she had that "I meant to do that" attitude and look. I laughed and > she shunned me all day. > Mike > > -----Original Message----- > From: agentscullyeyore@... > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Wed, 15 Jun 2005 20:24:05 EDT > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Pop up 15 gallon plastic aquarium/fountain > > > > oh wow i would have loved to see that pic.. how fast was she out of the > tank... Shannon > > My cat likes to sit and watch them and always drinks out of the tanks, she > even fell in one ass first, that was hilarious. But most of the fish are > smart enough to go to the bottom of the tank when she is drinking water, except > > the guppies, they think she is going to feed them. > Mike > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12424	From: helen572	Date: 6/16/2005
Subject: Re: cichlid dying of old age?

Since they're all males, that let's out the babies idea. I've seen the other large cichlids (Larry and Curly) behaving in a similar manner, and I figured it was challenging behavior. Also, Moe and Numbnuts exhibited the same behavior once, actually locking mouths and tugging to the point Moe appeared to have a bruised lip. So, Moe may be simply hiding. But I'll try to get at him to see if there are any signs of illness. I can barely see him now, but enough to know he's alive and moving around a bit. Thanks for the suggestions. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, FortWayneFish@a... wrote: > couple possibilities.. certainly not all the possibilities.. > > Moe got his butt kicked and is hiding > Moe got sick and needs medication, and TLC ( tender loving care ) > Moe might be guarding babies. and your NumbNuts could be the mommy. the > behavior you witnessed early might not have been aggression rather a mating > ritual.. > > its hard to say really... > remove the tree trunk and fish to a seperate tank and have a look inside, or > dump Moe into a seperate tank to see what he looks like. If he is diseased it > should be pretty obvious when you look at him. i say seperate tank because a > quarantine tank is a MUSt have item in any hobbyists house. > > rob > indiana > > In a message dated 6/15/2005 6:21:56 PM US Eastern Standard Time, > shirleycat@b... writes: > > > > We have a 40-gallon with five S.A. cichlids. The "boss" cichlid, Moe, > > rules the others, and claimed the large, ceramic tree trunk for his > > own. He's very dark and has the hump on his head. One of the other > > guys (Numbnuts) has occasionally challenged him (the head-on, > > back-and-forth motions). For the past few days, Moe has not come out > > of his hidey-hole (as far as I know), even to eat. Numbnuts is hanging > > around the hidey-hole all the time. It's my impression that Numbnuts > > is waiting for Moe to die so he can take over. Has anyone experienced > > this kind of behavior? Am I wrong about what's going on here? > > Anything I can do to coax Moe out to eat? All advice welcome. > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12425	From: knelson1701	Date: 6/16/2005
Subject: swordtail question

I have 3 swordtails in a 40 gal tank with some other fish. I have one male and 2 females. I want to add 2 more swordtails. Should I get 2 more females or can I get another male and a female? WIll the males fight? Any suggestions would be great. Keith

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12426	From: Amanda	Date: 6/16/2005
Subject: Malaysian Trumpet Sanils

Does anyone have any of these? I am considering getting some, so I have a constant supply of food for my puffer. I would keep them in a separate tank until feeding time. I know that they are a-sexual, and breed quickly, but I am just wondering how quickly, and how many I should start with. If I get 50 would I end up with way too many? I may eventually get to where I give my puffer one every day, but now I am just looking for maybe 2 a week. Any advice would be greatly appreciated. I just pretty much want to know how many, and how often they have babies. Thanks, Mandy

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12427	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/16/2005
Subject: plant choice and feeding

What type of plants do you have Amanda?, Nim was saying he chooses low light plants and he feed them Seachem flourish and Raymond feeds his Plant Gro by Nutrafin and liquid Flourite by Seachem. I'm starting to think maybe i have enough lighting in my tank after all, ive got 192w but usually only run that much one or two days a week normally i run about 2x 4ft (80w ish) fluros 10hrs/day. my plants don't seem to do that well (yet), posted a couple of pics to my photoalbum 'Nick (nedarg@...)' =Nick ----- Original Message ----- From: "Amanda" <acharris23@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2005 1:49 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Crayfish >I usually use 17-20 watt bulbs. There is a 17 watt on there now, and > my plants grow like weeds. I have to trim, and replant once a week. > I am sure you can go with higher wattage, and it may depend on your > plant, but I have a variety that are doing well in there. Especially > my banana plants. Hope this helps > > There are only 2 crayfish in my 30 gallon tank. I hold them there > until it is time to feed my puffer, but one happened to have eggs > within a couple weeks of getting them. After the male(I suppose,)or > bigger one started harrassing her, that is when I put her in one of > my holding tanks. > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Nicolas Munro" <nmunro@q...> > wrote: >> Slightly off topic Amanda but how much light wattage are you using > for your >> plants? I'm trying to decide if its worth spending a weeks worth > of income >> to improve the lighting in my tank. >> >> Also one of my friends used to breed crayfish pretty much for the > same >> reason as you are so i'll ask him, altho his tank was larger i > think. >> >> =Nick >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Amanda" <acharris23@y...> >> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> >> Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2005 12:15 PM >> Subject: [AquaticLife] Crayfish >> >> >> > Does anyone know much about crayfish breeding. I have had > crayfish >> > for a long time for puffer food, but now one of them has eggs, > so I >> > am going to try to raise the babies for food later on to cut > down on >> > cost. I was just wondering if it is ok to move the crayfish to a >> > smaller tank on her own. I didn't worry about it much at first, >> > because I know the babies stay attached to their mother and all >> > that, but the male crayfish in the tank with her has started to >> > chase her around the tank. Is this usual? Is he trying to eat the >> > eggs? Also, with the research that I have done on the internet >> > researching breeding, everyone says the length of time for > hatching >> > depends on tank temp. Does anyone know a good temp to make them >> > hatch quicker? I have moved her to a 1 gallon hex tank with some >> > plants in it, and an air stone for now. Until I can find out if > she >> > is safe with the other crayfish in the tank. This 30 gallon tank > is >> > heavily planted, and has some pvc pipe, but she just can't seem > to >> > hide from him. Also, he is a lot larger than her. Also, what is > the >> > usual number of babies that hatch? It looks like she has at least >> > 100 eggs on her. Thanks in advance for all of your help. >> > >> > Oh, someone said that I should add some salt to the water to help >> > aid with the development of the babies/eggs. Is this true? >> > >> >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12428	From: Amanda	Date: 6/16/2005
Subject: Re: plant choice and feeding

A lot of the plants I have are sold as "assorted bunch plants" in my pet store. All of my plants grow well, and I do not add any kind of fertilizer. (Maybe it is the turtle poo.) I have some bacopa, lillies, hornwort, pennywort, 1 huge red tiger lotus, some banana plants, a couple java ferns, some java moss, and moss balls(I am trying to cover the whole bottom of the aquarium with moss.) There are a couple assorted plants in there that I don't know the name to. This aquarium I have had much luck with, because it is not a heated aquarium, and a lot of plants do much better in cool water. The max this aquarium gets to is 72. Which is room temp. I have planted a heated tank, and didn't have much luck.(My banana plants came from my heated tank, but they didn't grow in there... actually lost leaves.) The tank gets at least 12 hours of light each day. (Only longer when I am not home to cut the lights out... need to buy a timer!!) My plants grow really well... almost too fast. I actually look at it some days, and say "I don't wanna stick my hands in there again." to trim, and so on. It is beautiful though! I will try to take some pics soon. I am not having luck with the cheap re- chargeable batteries I bought for my digital camera, so when I go out and buy some new ones, I will take some pics! Much luck with plants! It can be beautiful, but time consuming sometimes! --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Nicolas Munro" <nmunro@q...> wrote: > What type of plants do you have Amanda?, > > Nim was saying he chooses low light plants and he feed them Seachem flourish > and Raymond feeds his Plant Gro by Nutrafin and liquid Flourite by Seachem. > > I'm starting to think maybe i have enough lighting in my tank after all, ive > got 192w but usually only run that much one or two days a week normally i > run about 2x 4ft (80w ish) fluros 10hrs/day. > > my plants don't seem to do that well (yet), posted a couple of pics to my > photoalbum 'Nick (nedarg@)' > =Nick > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Amanda" <acharris23@y...> > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2005 1:49 PM > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Crayfish > > > >I usually use 17-20 watt bulbs. There is a 17 watt on there now, and > > my plants grow like weeds. I have to trim, and replant once a week. > > I am sure you can go with higher wattage, and it may depend on your > > plant, but I have a variety that are doing well in there. Especially > > my banana plants. Hope this helps

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12429	From: paul helms	Date: 6/16/2005
Subject: Re: Malaysian Trumpet Sanils

the trumpet snails are hard shelled, the puffer should not be able to eat them. they are a nocturnal snail for teh most part. they come out in the hundreds at night from the gravel. mine do not visually reproduce very often, as i mainly see them when the lights have been out in the whole house and i turn one on, but occasionally i will have to clean my back filter when i hear their shells bouncing around in the impeller --- Amanda <acharris23@...> wrote: > Does anyone have any of these? I am considering > getting some, so I have > a constant supply of food for my puffer. I would > keep them in a > separate tank until feeding time. I know that they > are a-sexual, and > breed quickly, but I am just wondering how quickly, > and how many I > should start with. If I get 50 would I end up with > way too many? I may > eventually get to where I give my puffer one every > day, but now I am > just looking for maybe 2 a week. Any advice would be > greatly > appreciated. I just pretty much want to know how > many, and how often > they have babies. > > Thanks, > > Mandy > > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12430	From: paul helms	Date: 6/16/2005
Subject: Re: swordtail question

get females --- knelson1701 <knelson1701@...> wrote: > I have 3 swordtails in a 40 gal tank with some other > fish. I have one > male and 2 females. I want to add 2 more > swordtails. Should I get 2 > more females or can I get another male and a female? > WIll the males > fight? Any suggestions would be great. > > Keith > > > __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour: http://tour.mail.yahoo.com/mailtour.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12431	From: paul helms	Date: 6/16/2005
Subject: Re: New file uploaded to AquaticLife

it is only protected against republication as your own work. there is no money due for distributing it as a work not of your own unless it is with teh copyright office...at least in ca --- Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: > Once something is written, it is automatically > the property of the > person who wrote it. For example, it is illegal for > you to reprint this > post exactly as I have written it. It doesn't have > to have a notice to be > copyrighted. It doesn't even have to be registered. > I won't tell anybody that you uploaded that file > if you don't, but we > have one member that probably knows the guy > personally and will probably > tell him to have his lawyer call you up. At that > point you will be given a > notice to stop what you have done (erase that file > from the group) or it > will be a court trial. You will be forced into > bankruptsy and be forced to > sell everything you have just to pay the court > costs. The best case is you > will be able to sell yourself to the copyright > holder and work as their > slave. Worst case is you will be executed by being > thrown off the top of > the Tower of Commerce on Feringinar. Opps, I think > Feringinar is > copyrighted and held by the Grand Negas. > > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy. > > "Now this is not the end. It is not even the > beginning of the end. But it is > perhaps, the end of the beginning." > -Winston Churchill > -------Original Message------- > Oops, that first sentence should have either said > "No, he didn't" or > "No, I didn't get permission." > > - Trevor > > Trevor Holyoak wrote: > > > No, I didn't. I found it among my files yesterday > and I don't remember > > where I got it from. It doesn't have any kind of > restrictive notice on > > it, so I assumed it would be OK to share it with > the group. If I made a > > mistake, I'd be happy to remove the file. > > > > - Trevor > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12432	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/16/2005
Subject: Re: plant choice and feeding

thanks ----- Original Message ----- From: "Amanda" <acharris23@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Friday, June 17, 2005 1:45 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: plant choice and feeding >A lot of the plants I have are sold as "assorted bunch plants" in my > pet store. All of my plants grow well, and I do not add any kind of > fertilizer. (Maybe it is the turtle poo.) > > I have some bacopa, lillies, hornwort, pennywort, 1 huge red tiger > lotus, some banana plants, a couple java ferns, some java moss, and > moss balls(I am trying to cover the whole bottom of the aquarium > with moss.) There are a couple assorted plants in there that I don't > know the name to. This aquarium I have had much luck with, because > it is not a heated aquarium, and a lot of plants do much better in > cool water. The max this aquarium gets to is 72. Which is room temp. > I have planted a heated tank, and didn't have much luck.(My banana > plants came from my heated tank, but they didn't grow in there... > actually lost leaves.) The tank gets at least 12 hours of light each > day. (Only longer when I am not home to cut the lights out... need > to buy a timer!!) My plants grow really well... almost too fast. I > actually look at it some days, and say "I don't wanna stick my hands > in there again." to trim, and so on. It is beautiful though! I will > try to take some pics soon. I am not having luck with the cheap re- > chargeable batteries I bought for my digital camera, so when I go > out and buy some new ones, I will take some pics! Much luck with > plants! It can be beautiful, but time consuming sometimes! > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Nicolas Munro" <nmunro@q...> > wrote: >> What type of plants do you have Amanda?, >> >> Nim was saying he chooses low light plants and he feed them > Seachem flourish >> and Raymond feeds his Plant Gro by Nutrafin and liquid Flourite by > Seachem. >> >> I'm starting to think maybe i have enough lighting in my tank > after all, ive >> got 192w but usually only run that much one or two days a week > normally i >> run about 2x 4ft (80w ish) fluros 10hrs/day. >> >> my plants don't seem to do that well (yet), posted a couple of > pics to my >> photoalbum 'Nick (nedarg@)' >> =Nick >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Amanda" <acharris23@y...> >> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> >> Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2005 1:49 PM >> Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Crayfish >> >> >> >I usually use 17-20 watt bulbs. There is a 17 watt on there now, > and >> > my plants grow like weeds. I have to trim, and replant once a > week. >> > I am sure you can go with higher wattage, and it may depend on > your >> > plant, but I have a variety that are doing well in there. > Especially >> > my banana plants. Hope this helps > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12433	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 6/17/2005
Subject: Re: plant choice and feeding

Nick, 192W of light is more then enough for 80% of the plants IMO. I suggest you start keeping that much light on more frequently. One of the latest things about Amano I had read was that he starts his tank in a bit low light and then switches on Metal halides after about 1 hr for 2-3 hours. That is when the plants really pick up, and then go back to fluorescent lighting again. Sounds very logical as in Nature, plants really get peak very bright light for not more then 2-3 hours in a day until the sun changes its angle. You could try that too with fluorescents. My other planted tank is having 150W metal halides and 160W Fluorescents (65 gallon 4ft tank). I start with 80W fluorescents early in the morning. Switch on halides for about 1.5hrs when I wake up as I have to remove the tank lid for them. Just when I am leaving for work, I switch off the halides and get all 160W fluorescents (T8) in and running for a good 9 hr period. When I return from work, I switch off 2 of those fluorescents. And at night, all lights off. Total lighting period of a maddening 16 hours. Not much algae problems and I use tap water for the aquarium and not RO. So I really don't have much controls on the nutrients either. Substrate for this tank is a blend of Flourite and Volcanit (60% fluorite and 40% volcanit). 4" of substrate. Mostly low and medium light plants along with a couple of high light ones like Myriophyllum, Mayaca fluvitallis (sorry for the spelling). And a couple more that I cannot recall. Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nicolas Munro Sent: 17 June 2005 03:57 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] plant choice and feeding What type of plants do you have Amanda?, Nim was saying he chooses low light plants and he feed them Seachem flourish and Raymond feeds his Plant Gro by Nutrafin and liquid Flourite by Seachem. I'm starting to think maybe i have enough lighting in my tank after all, ive got 192w but usually only run that much one or two days a week normally i run about 2x 4ft (80w ish) fluros 10hrs/day. my plants don't seem to do that well (yet), posted a couple of pics to my photoalbum 'Nick (nedarg@...)' =Nick ----- Original Message ----- From: "Amanda" <acharris23@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2005 1:49 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Crayfish >I usually use 17-20 watt bulbs. There is a 17 watt on there now, and > my plants grow like weeds. I have to trim, and replant once a week. > I am sure you can go with higher wattage, and it may depend on your > plant, but I have a variety that are doing well in there. Especially > my banana plants. Hope this helps > > There are only 2 crayfish in my 30 gallon tank. I hold them there > until it is time to feed my puffer, but one happened to have eggs > within a couple weeks of getting them. After the male(I suppose,)or > bigger one started harrassing her, that is when I put her in one of > my holding tanks. > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Nicolas Munro" <nmunro@q...> > wrote: >> Slightly off topic Amanda but how much light wattage are you using > for your >> plants? I'm trying to decide if its worth spending a weeks worth > of income >> to improve the lighting in my tank. >> >> Also one of my friends used to breed crayfish pretty much for the > same >> reason as you are so i'll ask him, altho his tank was larger i > think. >> >> =Nick >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Amanda" <acharris23@y...> >> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> >> Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2005 12:15 PM >> Subject: [AquaticLife] Crayfish >> >> >> > Does anyone know much about crayfish breeding. I have had > crayfish >> > for a long time for puffer food, but now one of them has eggs, > so I >> > am going to try to raise the babies for food later on to cut > down on >> > cost. I was just wondering if it is ok to move the crayfish to a >> > smaller tank on her own. I didn't worry about it much at first, >> > because I know the babies stay attached to their mother and all >> > that, but the male crayfish in the tank with her has started to >> > chase her around the tank. Is this usual? Is he trying to eat the >> > eggs? Also, with the research that I have done on the internet >> > researching breeding, everyone says the length of time for > hatching >> > depends on tank temp. Does anyone know a good temp to make them >> > hatch quicker? I have moved her to a 1 gallon hex tank with some >> > plants in it, and an air stone for now. Until I can find out if > she >> > is safe with the other crayfish in the tank. This 30 gallon tank > is >> > heavily planted, and has some pvc pipe, but she just can't seem > to >> > hide from him. Also, he is a lot larger than her. Also, what is > the >> > usual number of babies that hatch? It looks like she has at least >> > 100 eggs on her. Thanks in advance for all of your help. >> > >> > Oh, someone said that I should add some salt to the water to help >> > aid with the development of the babies/eggs. Is this true? >> > >> > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter _____ Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12434	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 6/17/2005
Subject: Re: swordtail question

Keith, I try and go with 3 or 4 females per male. If it was me I'd choose 2 more females. The males as you have noticed are always trying to spawn and the females just are not as willing. The more females the less harassment 1 particular fish will get. Also some swordtail males can get a little aggressive with other swordtail males. Hope that helps rob indiana In a message dated 6/16/2005 6:02:31 PM US Eastern Standard Time, knelson1701@... writes: > > I have 3 swordtails in a 40 gal tank with some other fish. I have one > male and 2 females. I want to add 2 more swordtails. Should I get 2 > more females or can I get another male and a female? WIll the males > fight? Any suggestions would be great. > > Keith > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12435	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 6/17/2005
Subject: Re: Malaysian Trumpet Sanils

Yep. Very true. They are very hard shelled and it takes a lot of effort to crack them. You could actually think about getting pest snails instead of MTS as they grow much faster and are as prolific as MTS. Just that they are not very good to look at and will eat up anything that is edible including plants. Not a problem if you want to keep them in a separate tank. Just put in a boiled lettuce leaf and some fish food in there every day and you will keep getting a good quantity of snails. Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of paul helms Sent: 17 June 2005 05:51 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Malaysian Trumpet Sanils the trumpet snails are hard shelled, the puffer should not be able to eat them. they are a nocturnal snail for teh most part. they come out in the hundreds at night from the gravel. mine do not visually reproduce very often, as i mainly see them when the lights have been out in the whole house and i turn one on, but occasionally i will have to clean my back filter when i hear their shells bouncing around in the impeller --- Amanda <acharris23@...> wrote: > Does anyone have any of these? I am considering > getting some, so I have > a constant supply of food for my puffer. I would > keep them in a > separate tank until feeding time. I know that they > are a-sexual, and > breed quickly, but I am just wondering how quickly, > and how many I > should start with. If I get 50 would I end up with > way too many? I may > eventually get to where I give my puffer one every > day, but now I am > just looking for maybe 2 a week. Any advice would be > greatly > appreciated. I just pretty much want to know how > many, and how often > they have babies. > > Thanks, > > Mandy > > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter _____ Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12436	From: Amanda	Date: 6/17/2005
Subject: Re: Malaysian Trumpet Sanils

Where can I get these snails? Thanks --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@y...> wrote: > Yep. Very true. They are very hard shelled and it takes a lot of effort to > crack them. > > > > You could actually think about getting pest snails instead of MTS as they > grow much faster and are as prolific as MTS. Just that they are not very > good to look at and will eat up anything that is edible including plants. > Not a problem if you want to keep them in a separate tank. Just put in a > boiled lettuce leaf and some fish food in there every day and you will keep > getting a good quantity of snails. > > > > Nim > > > > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of paul helms > Sent: 17 June 2005 05:51 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Malaysian Trumpet Sanils > > > > the trumpet snails are hard shelled, the puffer should > not be able to eat them. they are a nocturnal snail > for teh most part. they come out in the hundreds at > night from the gravel. mine do not visually reproduce > very often, as i mainly see them when the lights have > been out in the whole house and i turn one on, but > occasionally i will have to clean my back filter when > i hear their shells bouncing around in the impeller > > --- Amanda <acharris23@y...> wrote: > > > Does anyone have any of these? I am considering > > getting some, so I have > > a constant supply of food for my puffer. I would > > keep them in a > > separate tank until feeding time. I know that they > > are a-sexual, and > > breed quickly, but I am just wondering how quickly, > > and how many I > > should start with. If I get 50 would I end up with > > way too many? I may > > eventually get to where I give my puffer one every > > day, but now I am > > just looking for maybe 2 a week. Any advice would be > > greatly > > appreciated. I just pretty much want to know how > > many, and how often > > they have babies. > > > > Thanks, > > > > Mandy > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > _____ > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > * To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12437	From: Jo Baker	Date: 6/17/2005
Subject: Re: Malaysian Trumpet Sanils

I have some. I started with about 20 about 3 years ago and have since then given away or destroyed thousands. They do a good job of stirring up the substrate, but do become a nuisance when they proliferate. The numbers are kept down with the addition of clown loaches. Mostly they get into the filter and impeller. Basically, they are beneficial in a tank if you can keep their numbers down. BTW they are livebearers so you will not see eggs. ----- Original Message ----- From: paul helms To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, June 17, 2005 12:51 AM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Malaysian Trumpet Sanils the trumpet snails are hard shelled, the puffer should not be able to eat them. they are a nocturnal snail for teh most part. they come out in the hundreds at night from the gravel. mine do not visually reproduce very often, as i mainly see them when the lights have been out in the whole house and i turn one on, but occasionally i will have to clean my back filter when i hear their shells bouncing around in the impeller --- Amanda <acharris23@...> wrote: > Does anyone have any of these? I am considering > getting some, so I have > a constant supply of food for my puffer. I would > keep them in a > separate tank until feeding time. I know that they > are a-sexual, and > breed quickly, but I am just wondering how quickly, > and how many I > should start with. If I get 50 would I end up with > way too many? I may > eventually get to where I give my puffer one every > day, but now I am > just looking for maybe 2 a week. Any advice would be > greatly > appreciated. I just pretty much want to know how > many, and how often > they have babies. > > Thanks, > > Mandy > > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Links a.. To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.323 / Virus Database: 267.7.3/15 - Release Date: 6/14/2005 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12438	From: Eric Miner	Date: 6/17/2005
Subject: Was -> Re: Ammonia and fish behavior

Hi Partick, It sounds like you've never done a fishless cycle. Keep in mind that one 'feeds' the bacteria an ammount of ammonia that is much higher than the fish, etc. will give off. Thus the bacterial colony is very large when the proces is completed. Fish are then added to the tank with this large colony that is well prepared to deal with the ammonia given off by the fish. In fact there is a likelyhood that some of the colony will die off due to lack of food (ammonia). In my research of fishless cycling I never saw anything that comes close to the 'misinformation' you mention. On the other hand I am skeptical of Marineland's claim that one can add fish 24 hrs after adding Bio-Spira. I did use Bio-spira to start my fishless cycle, but I'd never add fish right after using it. Thanks for all your help Eric --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Patrick" <patrickmn@c...> wrote: > Despite the "misinformation" perpetuated by supporters of fishless > cycling, once you add fish the tank has to go through the entire cycle again > to compensate for the exact amount of ammonia produced by the fish and the > food you give them. The tank will also go through the cycle every time you > add new fish to the tank. The only difference is that it will only take a > few hours or days when you add the new fish. > > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy. > > "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is > perhaps, the end of the beginning." > -Winston Churchill

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12439	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 6/17/2005
Subject: Re: Was -> Re: Ammonia and fish behavior

Eric, Let me explain a couple of things too. In ammonia based fish less cycle, you are developing the bacteria that convert ammonia to nitrites and nitrites to nitrates. You are however killing the bacteria that convert proteins and other rotting food and waste into ammonia by directly adding ammonia. Now when you stop adding ammonia and add fish, the bacteria will re-adjust themselves onto the direct waste that fish produce as Ammonia but not to the solid poo and extra food and rotting matter that is also a part of waste. Once the bacteria/critters that consume this nitrogenous waste (that is proteins and not pure ammonia), there will be a sudden need for the bacteria to rise in numbers due to the sudden increase in ammonia levels.. Hence creating the mini cycle. This is a fact if you introduce a large number of fish at once after a fish less cycle with pure ammonia as their non ammonical waste just sits there to be properly decomposed. Once its decomposition starts, by that time the bacterial colony has already been reduced to adjust to the low ammonia levels that fish produce. I have experienced this and I resorted to feeding the tank with fish food instead of pure ammonia as this will develop a 100% naturally proper environment for all that is needed and not just Nitrogen bacteria. However, I am also not comfortable with the marineland claims but the Biospira stuff is better then subjecting the fish to a fresh tank without biospira. Unfortunatly, it is not available in the UK, so I cannot comment anything more about it. Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Miner Sent: 17 June 2005 15:05 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Was -> Re: Ammonia and fish behavior Hi Partick, It sounds like you've never done a fishless cycle. Keep in mind that one 'feeds' the bacteria an ammount of ammonia that is much higher than the fish, etc. will give off. Thus the bacterial colony is very large when the proces is completed. Fish are then added to the tank with this large colony that is well prepared to deal with the ammonia given off by the fish. In fact there is a likelyhood that some of the colony will die off due to lack of food (ammonia). In my research of fishless cycling I never saw anything that comes close to the 'misinformation' you mention. On the other hand I am skeptical of Marineland's claim that one can add fish 24 hrs after adding Bio-Spira. I did use Bio-spira to start my fishless cycle, but I'd never add fish right after using it. Thanks for all your help Eric --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Patrick" <patrickmn@c...> wrote: > Despite the "misinformation" perpetuated by supporters of fishless > cycling, once you add fish the tank has to go through the entire cycle again > to compensate for the exact amount of ammonia produced by the fish and the > food you give them. The tank will also go through the cycle every time you > add new fish to the tank. The only difference is that it will only take a > few hours or days when you add the new fish. > > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy. > > "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is > perhaps, the end of the beginning." > -Winston Churchill Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter _____ Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12440	From: paul helms	Date: 6/17/2005
Subject: Re: Was -> Re: Ammonia and fish behavior

unfortunately eric you are the misguided and misinformed one here. what patrick stated is exactly true. as far as bio spira, if you do not add the fish very quickly the bacteria wil die of and leave you with the problem you have now. --- Eric Miner <eminer1254@...> wrote: > Hi Partick, > > It sounds like you've never done a fishless cycle. > Keep in mind that > one 'feeds' the bacteria an ammount of ammonia that > is much higher > than the fish, etc. will give off. Thus the > bacterial colony is very > large when the proces is completed. Fish are then > added to the tank > with this large colony that is well prepared to deal > with the ammonia > given off by the fish. In fact there is a likelyhood > that some of the > colony will die off due to lack of food (ammonia). > > In my research of fishless cycling I never saw > anything that comes > close to the 'misinformation' you mention. On the > other hand I am > skeptical of Marineland's claim that one can add > fish 24 hrs after > adding Bio-Spira. I did use Bio-spira to start my > fishless cycle, but > I'd never add fish right after using it. > > Thanks for all your help > > Eric > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Patrick" > <patrickmn@c...> wrote: > > Despite the "misinformation" perpetuated by > supporters of fishless > > cycling, once you add fish the tank has to go > through the entire > cycle again > > to compensate for the exact amount of ammonia > produced by the fish > and the > > food you give them. The tank will also go through > the cycle every > time you > > add new fish to the tank. The only difference is > that it will only > take a > > few hours or days when you add the new fish. > > > > > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy. > > > > "Now this is not the end. It is not even the > beginning of the end. > But it is > > perhaps, the end of the beginning." > > -Winston Churchill > > > > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12441	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 6/17/2005
Subject: Re: plant choice and feeding

You know, guys, sometimes whether a plant thrives or not isn't because of lighting, it's because of the condition it was in when you bought it. Just as perennials bought at k-mart are usually stressed and sick when you get them and often die, in spite of otherwise excellent conditions in the garden. Most pet stores have NO idea about how to care for the plants in their tanks. try getting them from a reputable dealer. I would suggest you go to www.freshwateraquariumplants.com and take a look at what's available, and the conditions they like. Some REQUIRE low light, some require certain temps, some require certain ph, just like fish. you can have an AWESOME planted tank, if you just do a little research.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12442	From: TankGurl	Date: 6/17/2005
Subject: Re: Was -> Re: Ammonia and fish behavior

On 6/17/05, Eric Miner <eminer1254@...> wrote: > In my research of fishless cycling I never saw anything that comes > close to the 'misinformation' you mention. On the other hand I am > skeptical of Marineland's claim that one can add fish 24 hrs after > adding Bio-Spira. I did use Bio-spira to start my fishless cycle, but > I'd never add fish right after using it. That's too bad. You could have saved all that time waiting for the cycle by adding the fish 24 hrs later. As already said, you *must* add the fish within 24 hrs when introducing BioSpira or else it's just a waste of your $$. And as I've already mentioned before, I've now cycled a number of large tanks using BioSpira. No wacky parameters, no cloudiness, no dead fish. Perfect in every way. I love the stuff. In all my years of fishkeeping, cycling has never been this easy or painless. (to the fish) And some of those tanks are 2-3+ yrs old and have never experienced any parameter crisis, as previously suggested as a result of using BioSpira. Kelly Kelly

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12443	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 6/17/2005
Subject: Re: plant choice and feeding

It is partially true. Plants also do suffer from stress and chemical shock. I have experienced that plants that I buy from my local fish store tend to do much better then those which I buy from online shops that grow them in water very different from mine. A lot of delicate plants on arrival almost melt away but this has yet to happen with plants from my local stores. I am in the UK so things might be a bit different then in the US. Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of cynthia brennemann Sent: 17 June 2005 20:47 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: plant choice and feeding You know, guys, sometimes whether a plant thrives or not isn't because of lighting, it's because of the condition it was in when you bought it. Just as perennials bought at k-mart are usually stressed and sick when you get them and often die, in spite of otherwise excellent conditions in the garden. Most pet stores have NO idea about how to care for the plants in their tanks. try getting them from a reputable dealer. I would suggest you go to www.freshwateraquariumplants.com and take a look at what's available, and the conditions they like. Some REQUIRE low light, some require certain temps, some require certain ph, just like fish. you can have an AWESOME planted tank, if you just do a little research. Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter _____ Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12444	From: Sandra	Date: 6/17/2005
Subject: own ick experience/advise i wanted to share

hi there, I just wanted to share some experience i had with newly arrived stock that had ick, what eliminated the problem and what not ... If you ever wondered what medicine does what and how long does it take for it to work, here i have some new interesting facts. I recieved live stock which i placed into my quarantine tank first (one false falcula butterfly and one yellow tang) which started cratching themselfes already at night, so oviously had a parasite. I waited two days to see what they were going to develope and saw the little white spots already on the butterflies fin. I am a little skeptical with using copper, as you have to be measuring it all the time and practically destroys all kind of bacteria ect. you have in the system, so i tried another medicine first and thought that if this one wouldnt work right i can still use the copper as the last option. I used CLOUT tablets and the results were magnificent - you can have a fish totally covered with white spots and after adding this medicine just a few hours later you see the results. I kept treating them with it for several days (up to ten days i remember or so) but the only negative thing was that they kept flashing and scratching from time to time, which didnt make me too happy cause that would mean that they still have some parasites on them. When after this period i made a 50% water change (thats what the indication says after obvious approvement in the fish) but to my horror they had a reinfection the next day and had the white spots even worse. Thats when i decided to use the copper as they never stopped scratching and i didnt want to treat them with CLOUT for so long. I added Copper-safe to the tank and hoped to see some improvement. The next day the fishes were in total miserable shape, eyes were covered with white spots, could hardly breathe, total color loss... they were a mess and wouldnt have survived another day for sure. So i call an expert and ask him how long it takes for copper to cause a significant improvement in fish´s health and i was told that it could take up to 4 days to see first results, but oviously my fish werent able to wait that long, so i did something that was totally against my will and was some kind of emergency action, i gave them both a fresh water dip for some relieve and besides the copper had to add the CLOUT again (i know mixing medicine sounds horrible and i was ready to find the fish dead the next morning, but that was the last attempt for them to live cause i know that without action they would have died the next day) and if i am telling you that almost swimming belly upside down, isnt exagerating at all... well, to my huge surprise - next day - it looked like nothing has ever happened to them. Further observation made me see the following: CLOUT - seems to eliminate parasites on the fish after just a few hours, giving them immediate relieve, but DOESNT eliminate free floating parasites in the water COPPER-SAFE - is good for prevention and a sure medication to completely eliminate the parasite from the water, BUT is way too slow in action and can´t be used for fishes with an advanced ich case (no improvement after 24 hours) emergency mix of CLOUT AND COPPER-SAFE ...seems to do the job! I still dont recommend mixing medications, but i just wanted to let you guys know what happens if you find yourselfe in a "horror case" of ich and your fishes are literally dying already. Fishes are healthy and free of parasites, no scratching, flashing nor visible spots for around a month now. Placed them into the main tank, and everything has been ok since. greetings, sandra

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12445	From: paul helms	Date: 6/17/2005
Subject: Re: Was -> Re: Ammonia and fish behavior

while i do not stand by biospira, you must follow directions if you want it to work. --- TankGurl <fishgoddess@...> wrote: > On 6/17/05, Eric Miner <eminer1254@...> wrote: > > > In my research of fishless cycling I never saw > anything that comes > > close to the 'misinformation' you mention. On the > other hand I am > > skeptical of Marineland's claim that one can add > fish 24 hrs after > > adding Bio-Spira. I did use Bio-spira to start my > fishless cycle, but > > I'd never add fish right after using it. > > That's too bad. You could have saved all that time > waiting for the > cycle by adding the fish 24 hrs later. As already > said, you *must* add > the fish within 24 hrs when introducing BioSpira or > else it's just a > waste of your $$. > > And as I've already mentioned before, I've now > cycled a number of > large tanks using BioSpira. No wacky parameters, no > cloudiness, no > dead fish. Perfect in every way. I love the stuff. > In all my years of > fishkeeping, cycling has never been this easy or > painless. (to the > fish) And some of those tanks are 2-3+ yrs old and > have never > experienced any parameter crisis, as previously > suggested as a result > of using BioSpira. > > Kelly > > Kelly > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/mobile.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12446	From: paul helms	Date: 6/17/2005
Subject: Re: Malaysian Trumpet Sanils

where are you located? --- Amanda <acharris23@...> wrote: > Where can I get these snails? > > Thanks > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Nimish Mathur" > <nimmat4@y...> > wrote: > > Yep. Very true. They are very hard shelled and it > takes a lot of > effort to > > crack them. > > > > > > > > You could actually think about getting pest snails > instead of MTS > as they > > grow much faster and are as prolific as MTS. Just > that they are > not very > > good to look at and will eat up anything that is > edible including > plants. > > Not a problem if you want to keep them in a > separate tank. Just > put in a > > boiled lettuce leaf and some fish food in there > every day and you > will keep > > getting a good quantity of snails. > > > > > > > > Nim > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of paul helms > > Sent: 17 June 2005 05:51 > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Malaysian Trumpet > Sanils > > > > > > > > the trumpet snails are hard shelled, the puffer > should > > not be able to eat them. they are a nocturnal > snail > > for teh most part. they come out in the hundreds > at > > night from the gravel. mine do not visually > reproduce > > very often, as i mainly see them when the lights > have > > been out in the whole house and i turn one on, but > > occasionally i will have to clean my back filter > when > > i hear their shells bouncing around in the > impeller > > > > --- Amanda <acharris23@y...> wrote: > > > > > Does anyone have any of these? I am considering > > > getting some, so I have > > > a constant supply of food for my puffer. I would > > > keep them in a > > > separate tank until feeding time. I know that > they > > > are a-sexual, and > > > breed quickly, but I am just wondering how > quickly, > > > and how many I > > > should start with. If I get 50 would I end up > with > > > way too many? I may > > > eventually get to where I give my puffer one > every > > > day, but now I am > > > just looking for maybe 2 a week. Any advice > would be > > > greatly > > > appreciated. I just pretty much want to know how > > > many, and how often > > > they have babies. > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > Mandy > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > protection around > > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > when replying, > thanks > > . > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text > that is not > important to > > the reply and if changing the topic of the > original message modify > the > > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <-, we > Thank You > > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > * To visit your group on the web, go to: > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email > to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of > Service. > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > ____________________________________________________ Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12447	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 6/17/2005
Subject: gravel

I am about 2 weeks away from setting up my new aquarium. (I feel like a kid waiting to go on a trip to Disney World) YEAH! I have been collecting my supplies and equipment for the past two months now, while we are waiting to close on our old house. I have everything that I can purchase for under $100, including a 10 gallon hospital tank that is close to being cycled in. My hospital tank has gravel and a large piece of wood in it as well as six glowlight tetras.. I have collected approximately 175 pounds of gravel (pea gravel from Home Depot, two different colors of aquarium gravel, and some small red flint gravel) for my tank. I washed it already, as the pea gravel that I got from Home Depot was very dirty. I am storing it in five gallon pails in my garage with covers ajar on them so they can breath and dry out. I "turn" the gravel a couple times a week so it is not getting moldy or fungussy (how do you like that word!) My question is this: Because a lot of the gravel is still wet, do you think that I will need to rinse the gravel again before putting it in my aquarium or do you think that it safe to just add it to the tank? Also, when I get my new tank set up, should I use the gravel and the piece of wood from my hospital tank? Won't that help the new 150 gallon tank cycle in faster? Linda River Falls, WI [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12448	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 6/17/2005
Subject: Re: Was -> Re: Ammonia and fish behavior

I think then at the situation Eric is at the moment, it could be worth trying out biospira and see if it completes his mini cycle ;) Perfect time to test it out Eric ;) Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of TankGurl Sent: 17 June 2005 20:52 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Was -> Re: Ammonia and fish behavior On 6/17/05, Eric Miner <eminer1254@...> wrote: > In my research of fishless cycling I never saw anything that comes > close to the 'misinformation' you mention. On the other hand I am > skeptical of Marineland's claim that one can add fish 24 hrs after > adding Bio-Spira. I did use Bio-spira to start my fishless cycle, but > I'd never add fish right after using it. That's too bad. You could have saved all that time waiting for the cycle by adding the fish 24 hrs later. As already said, you *must* add the fish within 24 hrs when introducing BioSpira or else it's just a waste of your $$. And as I've already mentioned before, I've now cycled a number of large tanks using BioSpira. No wacky parameters, no cloudiness, no dead fish. Perfect in every way. I love the stuff. In all my years of fishkeeping, cycling has never been this easy or painless. (to the fish) And some of those tanks are 2-3+ yrs old and have never experienced any parameter crisis, as previously suggested as a result of using BioSpira. Kelly Kelly Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter _____ Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12449	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/17/2005
Subject: Re: New file uploaded to AquaticLife

Trevor, Been a tough week here, so far as getting e-mail done. The file is no longer available from its original download site. Is it OK, well, I cannot be the arbiter of that, you will need to speak with Albert Klee. In all works published, there is an implied copyright. For instance, this message has an implied copyright, even though I do not go through the formal process of copyrighting it. Just because it is on the Internet does not mean a work is free for you to distribute, unless there is a statement to that effect, either in the work or as an ancillary document. Albert is a writer, and is chronicling the history of the aquarium hobby. These files, one of which you posted, are placed in the area from which it was originally obtained, so that others can look at it, and critique it. They are removed after a period of time, and either rewritten, or added to a book Albert is working on. If you were to write Albert about posting the file elsewhere, he may or may not grant permission, or he may send a replacement to be distributed. I can't say for sure, since I do not speak for Albert. When we get right down to it, that file is a rough draft of a work that may contain errors and omissions that will be corrected in later revisions of it. If you need the address of Albert, I can send it to you off list, or I can act as an intermediary for you to determine if the posting of the document is valid. If you recall, some months ago there was a thread where I posted his messages on a topic that was being discussed here. It was done with his permission, and I did send those postings to him with summaries of the other posts in the thread. However, had he not given me permission to do so, his words would have been summarized by me with reference that he was the originator of those ideas. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Trevor Holyoak Sent: Thursday, June 16, 2005 11:03 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] New file uploaded to AquaticLife No, I didn't. I found it among my files yesterday and I don't remember where I got it from. It doesn't have any kind of restrictive notice on it, so I assumed it would be OK to share it with the group. If I made a mistake, I'd be happy to remove the file. - Trevor Steve Szabo wrote: > Trevor, > > Did Albert give you permission to upload that work here? > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2005 7:47 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] New file uploaded to AquaticLife > > > Hello, > > This email message is a notification to let you know that > a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the AquaticLife > group. > > File : /eary_stages_aquarium.pdf > Uploaded by : tholyoak <trevor@...> > Description : An interesting review of the early development of the > hobby > > You can access this file at the URL: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/files/eary_stages_aquarium.pdf > > To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit: > http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files > > Regards, > > tholyoak <trevor@...> > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12450	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 6/17/2005
Subject: first water testd

Hello group! I just did my first water test on my hospital tank. Like I mentioned in my last post, it is a ten gallon tank, with gravel, plastic plants, two bulb plants, and a large piece of wood. It has been set up for a week now. It also has six glow light tetras in it. The fish look happy and healthy, are eating fine and are active. The test values are as follows: pH 8 GH 10 KH 7 ammonia 1.5 nitrite 0 I am guess the ammonia is spiking and I did a 1/3 water change. Should I fast the fish for a day or two? Maybe 6 glow light tetras was too many to start of with. I had the guys at the local fish store do a base test on my tap water and they said it was neutral (pH of 7?) and had a hardness of 16 (is that GH or KH?). What would make my water pH go up? I am using the Tetra starter test kit. With the wood in the tank shouldn't it go down? Or is it because the tank is still cycling in? Linda River Falls, WI [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12451	From: Tim Fairchild	Date: 6/17/2005
Subject: Re: first water testd

On Saturday 18 Jun 2005 09:48, Crazy4fids@... wrote: > Hello group! > > I just did my first water test on my hospital tank. Like I mentioned in > my last post, it is a ten gallon tank, with gravel, plastic plants, two > bulb plants, and a large piece of wood. It has been set up for a week > now. It also has six glow light tetras in it. The fish look happy and > healthy, are eating fine and are active. > > The test values are as follows: > > pH 8 > GH 10 > KH 7 I don't much worry about these. I have tetra living in pH 9 with hardness approaching liquid rock at times (and part of the year is softer rainwater). They do fine, but occasionally I do try and mix the hard water with rainwater to keep the hardness down a bit. The pH is still always 8-9 tho. > ammonia 1.5 > nitrite 0 Never like to see ammonia tho. Tetra do no survive well in any amount of ammonia. Now gudgeons are another matter. I have them in tanks while they cycle. They survive just about anything... > I am guess the ammonia is spiking and I did a 1/3 water change. > > Should I fast the fish for a day or two? Maybe 6 glow light tetras was > too many to start of with. > > I had the guys at the local fish store do a base test on my tap water and > they said it was neutral (pH of 7?) and had a hardness of 16 (is that GH or > KH?). > > What would make my water pH go up? I am using the Tetra starter test > kit. With the wood in the tank shouldn't it go down? Or is it because the > tank is still cycling in? Still cycling I'd guess, tho I haven't hept up with the history here... tim -- --------------------------------------------------------- Tim & Therese Fairchild Atchafalaya Border Collies. Kuttabul, Queensland, Australia. --------------------------------------------------------- Email mailto:tim@... Homepage http://www.bcs4me.com Photos http://www.pbase.com/amosf ---------------------------------------------------------

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12452	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/17/2005
Subject: my new sun coral

this was after it had been in the tank for a few hours. what do you guys think? does it look ok? i've never really seen sun corals much so not sure if it looks normal or not. Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12453	From: Amanda	Date: 6/17/2005
Subject: Re: Malaysian Trumpet Sanils

Virginia Beach --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms <wtfmorlok@y...> wrote: > where are you located? > > > --- Amanda <acharris23@y...> wrote: > > > Where can I get these snails? > > > > Thanks > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Nimish Mathur" > > <nimmat4@y...> > > wrote: > > > Yep. Very true. They are very hard shelled and it > > takes a lot of > > effort to > > > crack them. > > > > > > > > > > > > You could actually think about getting pest snails > > instead of MTS > > as they > > > grow much faster and are as prolific as MTS. Just > > that they are > > not very > > > good to look at and will eat up anything that is > > edible including > > plants. > > > Not a problem if you want to keep them in a > > separate tank. Just > > put in a > > > boiled lettuce leaf and some fish food in there > > every day and you > > will keep > > > getting a good quantity of snails. > > > > > > > > > > > > Nim > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > Behalf Of paul helms > > > Sent: 17 June 2005 05:51 > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Malaysian Trumpet > > Sanils > > > > > > > > > > > > the trumpet snails are hard shelled, the puffer > > should > > > not be able to eat them. they are a nocturnal > > snail > > > for teh most part. they come out in the hundreds > > at > > > night from the gravel. mine do not visually > > reproduce > > > very often, as i mainly see them when the lights > > have > > > been out in the whole house and i turn one on, but > > > occasionally i will have to clean my back filter > > when > > > i hear their shells bouncing around in the > > impeller > > > > > > --- Amanda <acharris23@y...> wrote: > > > > > > > Does anyone have any of these? I am considering > > > > getting some, so I have > > > > a constant supply of food for my puffer. I would > > > > keep them in a > > > > separate tank until feeding time. I know that > > they > > > > are a-sexual, and > > > > breed quickly, but I am just wondering how > > quickly, > > > > and how many I > > > > should start with. If I get 50 would I end up > > with > > > > way too many? I may > > > > eventually get to where I give my puffer one > > every > > > > day, but now I am > > > > just looking for maybe 2 a week. Any advice > > would be > > > > greatly > > > > appreciated. I just pretty much want to know how > > > > many, and how often > > > > they have babies. > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > > > Mandy > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > > Do You Yahoo!? > > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > > protection around > > > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > > when replying, > > thanks > > > . > > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text > > that is not > > important to > > > the reply and if changing the topic of the > > original message modify > > the > > > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > > subject)" <-, we > > Thank You > > > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > * To visit your group on the web, go to: > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email > > to: > > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > > Yahoo! > > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > Yahoo! Sports > Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football > http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12454	From: Rei - Raymond Tremor	Date: 6/18/2005
Subject: Re: Female betta turning colors

You just put them together without a container of some sort where the male can see the female but can't attack her? If you just put them in without a glass container and if the space is small, and without any cover, your female will be dead or maybe injured, sometimes the male gets injured and dies also. The silver stripes is fear stripes if going horizontal and breeding stripes if vertical (ready to be mated). It is recommended by breeders that you put the female in a glass container, probably a glass that is used with a kerosene lamp, that way you just lift up the glass when she is ready to mate. Signs of her being ready is, if he goes near her, she will bow her head down, and she will have the vertical stripes (visible if her color is light). Are you trying to breed by any chance? If so, then you have to know what to do before doing it or you might end up killing one or both of them. A single female and a single male CAN sometimes stay together if the aquarium is large and there are hiding places for the female (planted aquarium or lots of hiding places). You can put 3 females and a male since the male will be distracted by the other female if he is chasing one of the females. You can have 4 to 5 females in an aquarium (no male), and they will be fine, except for a bit of fighting to establish dominance. There will be an alpha female and she be tested from time to time by the lower ones. If the alpha female is removed, then there will be fighting again to establish the next alpha female, and so on. They can stay in a community aquarium but be sure the other fish are not fin nippers. Bettas are weird and hard to understand. I had bettas, and had breeded successfully and had raised them to adulthood. But I got tired cleaning containers so I gave them away. Also don't breed 2 twin tails or you will end up with defective babies. That was what I was told, mine was a twin tail male and a crown tail female. They had produced a twin crown tail. When you breed, be sure to take out the female when the male starts chasing her away after he had squeezed her eggs out. Also you can take out the male or leave him in to take care of the eggs and fry and take him out in about 3 days or when he starts eating the fry. The male will pick up the eggs and put them in the bubble nest, he will also pick up the fry when they hatch in 24 to 36 hours after being laid. Rei - Raymond Tremor LoveMoAko@... -------Original Message------- From: Dane & Leslie Moore Date: 06/16/05 04:27:09 To: naturalaquariumenthusiast@yahoogroups.com; AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Female betta turning colors We put our female in with the male last night and within an hour she was VERY dark in color with silver stripes. She was very light almost tan before. WHAT?! is this? Shock of some sort? Water conditions were the same, temp a bit different but that has leveled off and she is still very dark. Is she OK or should I remove her? Thanks for any info. Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks .. Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12455	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/18/2005
Subject: Animal Legal & Historical Web Center

I'm sending this out to a whole bunch of people and various lists, so I apologize if you see more than one copy of this e-mail. This site looks to be great for looking up animal law, and they also have some cases where the law has been adjudicated. It is a bit weak on laws from other countries, but it is a work in progress, as they say, so one would hope this area would improve. For the states, laws from each state are listed along with a summarization and a link to the actual law. Hope you find it useful. Animal Legal & Historical Web Center [pdf] http://www.animallaw.info/ With his colleague Rebecca Wisch, Professor David Favre at the Michigan State University College of Law has created this very helpful online resource designed to give the public and the legal community access to comprehensive explanations on the issues surrounding animal law and associated topics. From the homepage, visitors can peruse new material (such as an overview of French animal law), or move to the left-hand side of the homepage to select information about animal law in different states or by topic. One of the other recently added features is the full text of dog laws for all 50 states, along with a basic overview of state dog leash laws. Overall, the site is well-designed and will be of interest to those with a specific interest in this very broad topic. >From The Scout Report, Copyright Internet Scout Project 1994-2005. http://scout.wisc.edu/ \\Steve// Give a man a match, and he'll be warm for a minute. But set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12456	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/18/2005
Subject: Re: Female betta turning colors

I'm not trying to breed them. I'm setting up a 75 gal and we put my sons male betta in there for fun (alone.) I left and came back to the female also in there, put in by my husband to see what would happen. They had tons of room and lots of places to hide so I just left them together for a few days but then noticed both their tails were ripped. I took the male out (he was easier to catch) but the female is still in there. I'll take her out tonight as this tank is going to spike and I don't want any fish in there for that. Thanks for the info. And her stripes were vertical and appeared when she was very dark in color. Once I removed the male, she returned to her brownish color and her horizontal stripes appeared again. Again, I am NOT going to breed them. No thanks. =) Thanks again, Leslie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Rei - Raymond Tremor Sent: Saturday, June 18, 2005 4:11 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Female betta turning colors You just put them together without a container of some sort where the male can see the female but can't attack her? If you just put them in without a glass container and if the space is small, and without any cover, your female will be dead or maybe injured, sometimes the male gets injured and dies also. The silver stripes is fear stripes if going horizontal and breeding stripes if vertical (ready to be mated). It is recommended by breeders that you put the female in a glass container, probably a glass that is used with a kerosene lamp, that way you just lift up the glass when she is ready to mate. Signs of her being ready is, if he goes near her, she will bow her head down, and she will have the vertical stripes (visible if her color is light). Are you trying to breed by any chance? If so, then you have to know what to do before doing it or you might end up killing one or both of them. A single female and a single male CAN sometimes stay together if the aquarium is large and there are hiding places for the female (planted aquarium or lots of hiding places). You can put 3 females and a male since the male will be distracted by the other female if he is chasing one of the females. You can have 4 to 5 females in an aquarium (no male), and they will be fine, except for a bit of fighting to establish dominance. There will be an alpha female and she be tested from time to time by the lower ones. If the alpha female is removed, then there will be fighting again to establish the next alpha female, and so on. They can stay in a community aquarium but be sure the other fish are not fin nippers. Bettas are weird and hard to understand. I had bettas, and had breeded successfully and had raised them to adulthood. But I got tired cleaning containers so I gave them away. Also don't breed 2 twin tails or you will end up with defective babies. That was what I was told, mine was a twin tail male and a crown tail female. They had produced a twin crown tail. When you breed, be sure to take out the female when the male starts chasing her away after he had squeezed her eggs out. Also you can take out the male or leave him in to take care of the eggs and fry and take him out in about 3 days or when he starts eating the fry. The male will pick up the eggs and put them in the bubble nest, he will also pick up the fry when they hatch in 24 to 36 hours after being laid. Rei - Raymond Tremor LoveMoAko@... -------Original Message------- From: Dane & Leslie Moore Date: 06/16/05 04:27:09 To: naturalaquariumenthusiast@yahoogroups.com; AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Female betta turning colors We put our female in with the male last night and within an hour she was VERY dark in color with silver stripes. She was very light almost tan before. WHAT?! is this? Shock of some sort? Water conditions were the same, temp a bit different but that has leveled off and she is still very dark. Is she OK or should I remove her? Thanks for any info. Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks .. Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12457	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/18/2005
Subject: Steve & those who replied on "starving fish"

I'm sorry I'm just getting to this, but I wanted to send out a HUGE thank you to those that replied with such GRACE on my starving fish question/concern. I fully expected to get some smart remarks but there was not even one. Instead, everyone was SO great and very understanding of my concern. I learned a LOT about the makeup of the food we feed them and now I don't feel bad at all when they act as though they are starved. =) Some of you really went out of your way to help me with that, and I appreciate it more than you know. Thank you so much! Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12458	From: Eric Miner	Date: 6/18/2005
Subject: Was -> Re: Ammonia and fish behavior

Thanks Nim, I wasn't aware of the additional bacteria neede to break down solid waste. Your method of adding fishfood sounds good. Thanks much for the info. Eric --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@y...> wrote: > Eric, > > > > Let me explain a couple of things too. > > In ammonia based fish less cycle, you are developing the bacteria that > convert ammonia to nitrites and nitrites to nitrates. You are however > killing the bacteria that convert proteins and other rotting food and waste > into ammonia by directly adding ammonia. > > > > Now when you stop adding ammonia and add fish, the bacteria will re-adjust > themselves onto the direct waste that fish produce as Ammonia but not to the > solid poo and extra food and rotting matter that is also a part of waste. > Once the bacteria/critters that consume this nitrogenous waste (that is > proteins and not pure ammonia), there will be a sudden need for the bacteria > to rise in numbers due to the sudden increase in ammonia levels.. Hence > creating the mini cycle. This is a fact if you introduce a large number of > fish at once after a fish less cycle with pure ammonia as their non > ammonical waste just sits there to be properly decomposed. Once its > decomposition starts, by that time the bacterial colony has already been > reduced to adjust to the low ammonia levels that fish produce. > > > > I have experienced this and I resorted to feeding the tank with fish food > instead of pure ammonia as this will develop a 100% naturally proper > environment for all that is needed and not just Nitrogen bacteria. > > > > However, I am also not comfortable with the marineland claims but the > Biospira stuff is better then subjecting the fish to a fresh tank without > biospira. Unfortunatly, it is not available in the UK, so I cannot comment > anything more about it. > > > > Nim > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Eric Miner > Sent: 17 June 2005 15:05 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Was -> Re: Ammonia and fish behavior > > > > Hi Partick, > > It sounds like you've never done a fishless cycle. Keep in mind that > one 'feeds' the bacteria an ammount of ammonia that is much higher > than the fish, etc. will give off. Thus the bacterial colony is very > large when the proces is completed. Fish are then added to the tank > with this large colony that is well prepared to deal with the ammonia > given off by the fish. In fact there is a likelyhood that some of the > colony will die off due to lack of food (ammonia). > > In my research of fishless cycling I never saw anything that comes > close to the 'misinformation' you mention. On the other hand I am > skeptical of Marineland's claim that one can add fish 24 hrs after > adding Bio-Spira. I did use Bio-spira to start my fishless cycle, but > I'd never add fish right after using it. > > Thanks for all your help > > Eric > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Patrick" <patrickmn@c...> wrote: > > Despite the "misinformation" perpetuated by supporters of fishless > > cycling, once you add fish the tank has to go through the entire > cycle again > > to compensate for the exact amount of ammonia produced by the fish > and the > > food you give them. The tank will also go through the cycle every > time you > > add new fish to the tank. The only difference is that it will only > take a > > few hours or days when you add the new fish. > > > > > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy. > > > > "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. > But it is > > perhaps, the end of the beginning." > > -Winston Churchill > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > _____ > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > * To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12459	From: Eric Miner	Date: 6/18/2005
Subject: Was -> Re: Ammonia and fish behavior

Thanks Eveyone, Now that I step back and think about it using Bio-Spira for a fishless cycle might not have been the best idea. With my experience in culturing and using various strains of yeast I was working with only one spieces at a time. However, with Bio-Spira there are least two...one takes care of the ammonia (which it did) and the other the nitrites (which it seems to have done, but may not have). I did a 50 % water change yesterday and will take readings today. If things are still out of wack I'll add some fresh Bio-Spira to the tankc, which I hope with bring things back into balance. Moral of the story? Don't assume that bacteria used for one thing will necessarily act like bacteria used for another. Thanks again, Eric --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@y...> wrote: > I think then at the situation Eric is at the moment, it could be worth > trying out biospira and see if it completes his mini cycle ;) > > Perfect time to test it out Eric ;) > > > > Nim

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12460	From: Patrick	Date: 6/18/2005
Subject: Re: Female betta turning colors

Oh, come one. They are so easy to breed. Why not? :) Patrick, an American Fish Guy. -------Original Message------- Again, I am NOT going to breed them. No thanks. =) Thanks again, Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12461	From: deborahgd14	Date: 6/18/2005
Subject: Re: own ick experience/advise i wanted to share

Hi: Thank you for sharing your information in ick. Would this action be good for scaleless fish? I had a bad experience a few months ago and coppersafe did not help them. They ended up with secondary infections and most of my fish died. Next time I will put them in a quarantine tank. DDD --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Sandra" <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > hi there, > > I just wanted to share some experience i had with newly arrived > stock that had ick, what eliminated the problem and what not ... > > If you ever wondered what medicine does what and how long does it > take for it to work, here i have some new interesting facts. I > recieved live stock which i placed into my quarantine tank first > (one false falcula butterfly and one yellow tang) which started > cratching themselfes already at night, so oviously had a parasite. I > waited two days to see what they were going to develope and saw the > little white spots already on the butterflies fin. I am a little > skeptical with using copper, as you have to be measuring it all the > time and practically destroys all kind of bacteria ect. you have in > the system, so i tried another medicine first and thought that if > this one wouldnt work right i can still use the copper as the last > option. > I used CLOUT tablets and the results were magnificent - you can have > a fish totally covered with white spots and after adding this > medicine just a few hours later you see the results. I kept treating > them with it for several days (up to ten days i remember or so) but > the only negative thing was that they kept flashing and scratching > from time to time, which didnt make me too happy cause that would > mean that they still have some parasites on them. When after this > period i made a 50% water change (thats what the indication says > after obvious approvement in the fish) but to my horror they had a > reinfection the next day and had the white spots even worse. Thats > when i decided to use the copper as they never stopped scratching > and i didnt want to treat them with CLOUT for so long. I added > Copper-safe to the tank and hoped to see some improvement. The next > day the fishes were in total miserable shape, eyes were covered with > white spots, could hardly breathe, total color loss... they were a > mess and wouldnt have survived another day for sure. So i call an > expert and ask him how long it takes for copper to cause a > significant improvement in fish´s health and i was told that it > could take up to 4 days to see first results, but oviously my fish > werent able to wait that long, so i did something that was totally > against my will and was some kind of emergency action, i gave them > both a fresh water dip for some relieve and besides the copper had > to add the CLOUT again (i know mixing medicine sounds horrible and i > was ready to find the fish dead the next morning, but that was the > last attempt for them to live cause i know that without action they > would have died the next day) and if i am telling you that almost > swimming belly upside down, isnt exagerating at all... > > well, to my huge surprise - next day - it looked like nothing has > ever happened to them. Further observation made me see the following: > > CLOUT - seems to eliminate parasites on the fish after just a few > hours, giving them immediate relieve, but DOESNT eliminate free > floating parasites in the water > COPPER-SAFE - is good for prevention and a sure medication to > completely eliminate the parasite from the water, BUT is way too > slow in action and can´t be used for fishes with an advanced ich > case (no improvement after 24 hours) > > emergency mix of CLOUT AND COPPER-SAFE ...seems to do the job! > > I still dont recommend mixing medications, but i just wanted to let > you guys know what happens if you find yourselfe in a "horror case" > of ich and your fishes are literally dying already. > > Fishes are healthy and free of parasites, no scratching, flashing > nor visible spots for around a month now. Placed them into the main > tank, and everything has been ok since. > > greetings, > > sandra

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12462	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/18/2005
Subject: Re: gravel

Linda, (If you put off that trip to Disney World, you'll have a lot more money to spend on your new tank! <g>) It would not hurt to use the gravel and the wood in your new tank. I don't know that it would add much to the bacteria populations, if water has not been flowing through the gravel, though. Saving it as a quarantine tank is a good idea, but with some of the fish you are planning on having, a 20 tall would probably be a better bet In the long run. Find a spot in your new tank to keep a sponge filter going so that if and when you need to use the tank, you have some instant biological filtering for the quarantine. Wet gravel is nothing new in a tank <g>. It will be ok to use the wet gravel. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Friday, June 17, 2005 6:03 PM To: mnaquarium@yahoogroups.com; AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] gravel I am about 2 weeks away from setting up my new aquarium. (I feel like a kid waiting to go on a trip to Disney World) YEAH! I have been collecting my supplies and equipment for the past two months now, while we are waiting to close on our old house. I have everything that I can purchase for under $100, including a 10 gallon hospital tank that is close to being cycled in. My hospital tank has gravel and a large piece of wood in it as well as six glowlight tetras.. I have collected approximately 175 pounds of gravel (pea gravel from Home Depot, two different colors of aquarium gravel, and some small red flint gravel) for my tank. I washed it already, as the pea gravel that I got from Home Depot was very dirty. I am storing it in five gallon pails in my garage with covers ajar on them so they can breath and dry out. I "turn" the gravel a couple times a week so it is not getting moldy or fungussy (how do you like that word!) My question is this: Because a lot of the gravel is still wet, do you think that I will need to rinse the gravel again before putting it in my aquarium or do you think that it safe to just add it to the tank? Also, when I get my new tank set up, should I use the gravel and the piece of wood from my hospital tank? Won't that help the new 150 gallon tank cycle in faster? Linda River Falls, WI

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12463	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/18/2005
Subject: Re: first water testd

Linda, You'd be best off to get your own test kits. I like the Aqua-Tru kits from Kordon. That way you can test right from the tank, and there will not be anything to cause inaccurate readings, as you may get when transporting water to another site for testing. The question about the pH is a good one, and one you may be able to resolve yourself with your own test kits (use some of that money for the Disney World trip <g>). When your water comes out of the tap, it may have one reading, but letting it set over night will cause it to gas out, and may give you another, higher reading, which is the true pH of the water. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Friday, June 17, 2005 7:49 PM To: mnaquarium@yahoogroups.com; AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] first water testd Hello group! I just did my first water test on my hospital tank. Like I mentioned in my last post, it is a ten gallon tank, with gravel, plastic plants, two bulb plants, and a large piece of wood. It has been set up for a week now. It also has six glow light tetras in it. The fish look happy and healthy, are eating fine and are active. The test values are as follows: pH 8 GH 10 KH 7 ammonia 1.5 nitrite 0 I am guess the ammonia is spiking and I did a 1/3 water change. Should I fast the fish for a day or two? Maybe 6 glow light tetras was too many to start of with. I had the guys at the local fish store do a base test on my tap water and they said it was neutral (pH of 7?) and had a hardness of 16 (is that GH or KH?). What would make my water pH go up? I am using the Tetra starter test kit. With the wood in the tank shouldn't it go down? Or is it because the tank is still cycling in? Linda River Falls, WI [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12464	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 6/18/2005
Subject: Silicon Valley Aquarium Society (SVAS) Monthly Meeting, 7/2/2005, 6

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife Silicon Valley Aquarium Society (SVAS) Monthly Meeting Saturday July 2, 2005 6:30 pm - 9:30 pm This event repeats on the first Saturday of every month. The next reminder for this event will be sent in 11 days, 4 minutes. Event Location: Round Table Pizza, 4302 Moorpark Ave., San Jose CA Street: 4302 Moorpark Ave. City, State, Zip: San Jose CA 95129-2030 Notes: Silicon Valley Aquarium Society (SVAS) Monthly Meeting http://www.svas.info/ http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SiliconValleyAquariumSociety/ 6:30 pm - 9:30 pm This event repeats on the first Saturday of every month. Event Location: Round Table Pizza, 4302 Moorpark Ave., San Jose Yahoo! Greetings Send a Yahoo! Greeting. Birthday Reminders Set up birthday reminders! ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12465	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 6/18/2005
Subject: San Francisco Aquarium Society (SFAS), 7/1/2005, 7:15 pm

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife San Francisco Aquarium Society (SFAS) Friday July 1, 2005 7:15 pm - 9:15 pm This event repeats on the first Friday of every month. The next reminder for this event will be sent in 10 days, 4 minutes. Event Location: first Friday of each month at first Friday of each month at San Francisco State University Notes: http://www.sfaquarium.org/about.html Meetings are free and open to everyone. If you've enjoyed them, we urge you to become a member. You'll become a welcome part of our community, and your dues help defray the costs of speakers and other special things that show up at every meeting. We meet the first Friday of each month at The San Francisco State University. (We used to meet the first Friday of each month at The Academy of Sciences in San Francisco's Golden Gate Park.) Founded in 1923, the San Francisco Aquarium Society is regarded as one of the nation's esteemed aquarium hobbyi Yahoo! Greetings Send a Yahoo! Greeting. Birthday Reminders Set up birthday reminders! ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12466	From: Rei - Raymond Tremor	Date: 6/18/2005
Subject: Re: Female betta turning colors

if the male had a bubble nest they had probably had mated and you will get babies in about 24 to 36 hours. it only takes a minute to 3 hours for them to mate. Rei - Raymond Tremor LoveMoAko@... -------Original Message------- From: Dane & Leslie Moore Date: 06/18/05 07:37:47 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Female betta turning colors I'm not trying to breed them. I'm setting up a 75 gal and we put my sons male betta in there for fun (alone.) I left and came back to the female also in there, put in by my husband to see what would happen. They had tons of room and lots of places to hide so I just left them together for a few days but then noticed both their tails were ripped. I took the male out (he was easier to catch) but the female is still in there. I'll take her out tonight as this tank is going to spike and I don't want any fish in there for that. Thanks for the info. And her stripes were vertical and appeared when she was very dark in color. Once I removed the male, she returned to her brownish color and her horizontal stripes appeared again. Again, I am NOT going to breed them. No thanks. =) Thanks again, Leslie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Rei - Raymond Tremor Sent: Saturday, June 18, 2005 4:11 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Female betta turning colors You just put them together without a container of some sort where the male can see the female but can't attack her? If you just put them in without a glass container and if the space is small, and without any cover, your female will be dead or maybe injured, sometimes the male gets injured and dies also. The silver stripes is fear stripes if going horizontal and breeding stripes if vertical (ready to be mated). It is recommended by breeders that you put the female in a glass container, probably a glass that is used with a kerosene lamp, that way you just lift up the glass when she is ready to mate. Signs of her being ready is, if he goes near her, she will bow her head down, and she will have the vertical stripes (visible if her color is light). Are you trying to breed by any chance? If so, then you have to know what to do before doing it or you might end up killing one or both of them. A single female and a single male CAN sometimes stay together if the aquarium is large and there are hiding places for the female (planted aquarium or lots of hiding places). You can put 3 females and a male since the male will be distracted by the other female if he is chasing one of the females. You can have 4 to 5 females in an aquarium (no male), and they will be fine, except for a bit of fighting to establish dominance. There will be an alpha female and she be tested from time to time by the lower ones. If the alpha female is removed, then there will be fighting again to establish the next alpha female, and so on. They can stay in a community aquarium but be sure the other fish are not fin nippers. Bettas are weird and hard to understand. I had bettas, and had breeded successfully and had raised them to adulthood. But I got tired cleaning containers so I gave them away. Also don't breed 2 twin tails or you will end up with defective babies. That was what I was told, mine was a twin tail male and a crown tail female. They had produced a twin crown tail. When you breed, be sure to take out the female when the male starts chasing her away after he had squeezed her eggs out. Also you can take out the male or leave him in to take care of the eggs and fry and take him out in about 3 days or when he starts eating the fry. The male will pick up the eggs and put them in the bubble nest, he will also pick up the fry when they hatch in 24 to 36 hours after being laid. Rei - Raymond Tremor LoveMoAko@... -------Original Message------- From: Dane & Leslie Moore Date: 06/16/05 04:27:09 To: naturalaquariumenthusiast@yahoogroups.com; AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Female betta turning colors We put our female in with the male last night and within an hour she was VERY dark in color with silver stripes. She was very light almost tan before. WHAT?! is this? Shock of some sort? Water conditions were the same, temp a bit different but that has leveled off and she is still very dark. Is she OK or should I remove her? Thanks for any info. Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks .. Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks .. Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12467	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 6/18/2005
Subject: Re: gravel

In a message dated 6/18/2005 4:12:37 P.M. Central Standard Time, steve@... writes: >Saving it as a quarantine tank is a good idea, but with some of the fish you are planning on having, a 20 tall would probably be a better bet In the long run.< Yes, I am aware of that. It gives me a reason to get another tank going <he, he he> >Find a spot in your new tank to keep a sponge filter going < Does this run off an air pump? >Wet gravel is nothing new in a tank <g>. It will be ok to use the wet gravel.< I was just wondering with it sitting for so long (over a month now) that it may contain some bad bacteria? Thanks again, Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12468	From: mommy2acdhsurvivor	Date: 6/18/2005
Subject: Re: HELP!! Fish with a fat lip! Looks bloody inside

Thanks for all the info. She is doing much better. She has alot less blood but you can see one side of her mouth is kinda mangled. She is still eating though. I plan on finding a bigger tank to move her too. She is a tough ol gal!!! Hehehe Thanks again for the help. > If she hasn't grown any in a year, and we can rule out the > possibility of her being a stunted Pumpkinseed Sunfish (species she > looks closest to in the pics), then in all probability, I'd have to > say she's (and it is a female) an Enneacanthus gloriosus (Banded > Sunfish); the males getting to a size of about 3 1/4". Note, this is > not to be confused with the better known Black-Banded Sunfish > (Mesogonistius chaetodon). Many juveniles of this Family look > similar to each other and to some of the Dwarf species of the > Family. I've taken yet another close look at the pics and can just > make out several indistinct transverse bars and a dark area in the > corner of the gill plate, although I do not observe the dark bar > beneath the eye -- could just be the photos themselves. All these > characteristics are traits of the Banded Sunfish and are more > prevalent in the males. This species is very similar to the Blue- > Spotted Sunfish (E. obesus), which gets to about 4", with the males > having a trace of the iridescent blue spotting the Obesus has. Ray > Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "mommy2acdhsurvivor" <CK147@H...> > wrote: > > Thanks for all the info. I've had him maybe a year and haven't seen > > him grow at all. I can't tell if he's getting better or not. His lip > > is no longer fat but you can definatley see alot of blood still. > Some > > one asked for pictures of the turtles and I forgot to upload them > so I > > will do that for anyone who would like to see them they will be in > the > > folder MELANIE'S PICS. Thanks again for the info, he's a really cool > > fish. I've enjoyed having him, except of course when he ate my > guppies > > one by one. > > > > > > > > > Definitely one of the North American Sunfish Family. At this > size, its > > > still quite young to tell exactly which species. You may have to > wait > > > for a more positive I.D., until it puts on more size. While its > > > remotely possible it may be one of the dwarf Sunfish (Elassoma or > > > Enneacanthus), I tend to dismiss this as by now it should have > more > > > adult coloration unless its an immature female. While its still > > > possible that it could be one of the Crappies (White or Black), > members > > > of the Sunfish Family which will easily reach an average length > of 10" - > > > 12" (world's record - 21"), it lacks the markings in these young > > > Pomoxis species I recall seeing in my collections when seining > for > > > them. While the body shape is identical, as are many other young > > > Sunfish, the finnage is not. I tend to believe at this size that > its a > > > juvenile of one of the medium size Sunfish of the Lepomis group, > more > > > probably a Pumpkinseed Sunfish (Lepomis gibbosus), its > > > telltale "earflap" marking not yet developing at this size. > These fish > > > get to about 8". Still not a definite I.D., but best I can come > up > > > with at this size. > Ray > > > > \ > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "mommy2acdhsurvivor" > <CK147@H...> > > > wrote: > > > > It's the last 3 photos in the folder MELANIE'S PICS He wouldn't > look > > > > at me so the last pic is horrible. Anyone have any idea as to > what > > > > kind of fish he is? He has orange eyes. Thanks

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12469	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/19/2005
Subject: Re: gravel

Linda, Yes, a sponge filter is generally run with an air pump. Keeping one running in a stocked tank can provide you with "instant" biological filtering in a quarantine tank, or can be used to help cycle a new tank being set up for stocking. As for your gravel, since you had stated that you were regularly stirring it while it was sitting, it is unlikely that any anaerobic bacteria got a start, and it is also not likely that there are any bacteria present that would not be present in setting up a new tank. \\Steve// Smith & Wesson, The Original Point And Click Interface -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Saturday, June 18, 2005 11:49 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] gravel In a message dated 6/18/2005 4:12:37 P.M. Central Standard Time, steve@... writes: >Saving it as a quarantine tank is a good idea, but with some of the fish you are planning on having, a 20 tall would probably be a better bet In the long run.< Yes, I am aware of that. It gives me a reason to get another tank going <he, he he> >Find a spot in your new tank to keep a sponge filter going < Does this run off an air pump? >Wet gravel is nothing new in a tank <g>. It will be ok to use the wet gravel.< I was just wondering with it sitting for so long (over a month now) that it may contain some bad bacteria? Thanks again, Linda

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12470	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 6/19/2005
Subject: Re: gravel

Thanks Steve!! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12471	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/19/2005
Subject: Re: Female betta turning colors

A bubble nest? Like a big clump of floating bubbles on the top of the water? Have kids stuff? Check out Zainy Zebra Consignment! Based in Cabot, AR www.ZainyZebra.com Live in or near Cabot? Join the Cabot Garage Sale! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/CabotgarageSale/ Live in Little Rock? Little Rock Garage Sale!http://groups.yahoo.com/group/LRgarageSale/ -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Rei - Raymond Tremor Sent: Saturday, June 18, 2005 10:23 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Female betta turning colors if the male had a bubble nest they had probably had mated and you will get babies in about 24 to 36 hours. it only takes a minute to 3 hours for them to mate. Rei - Raymond Tremor LoveMoAko@... -------Original Message------- From: Dane & Leslie Moore Date: 06/18/05 07:37:47 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Female betta turning colors I'm not trying to breed them. I'm setting up a 75 gal and we put my sons male betta in there for fun (alone.) I left and came back to the female also in there, put in by my husband to see what would happen. They had tons of room and lots of places to hide so I just left them together for a few days but then noticed both their tails were ripped. I took the male out (he was easier to catch) but the female is still in there. I'll take her out tonight as this tank is going to spike and I don't want any fish in there for that. Thanks for the info. And her stripes were vertical and appeared when she was very dark in color. Once I removed the male, she returned to her brownish color and her horizontal stripes appeared again. Again, I am NOT going to breed them. No thanks. =) Thanks again, Leslie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Rei - Raymond Tremor Sent: Saturday, June 18, 2005 4:11 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Female betta turning colors You just put them together without a container of some sort where the male can see the female but can't attack her? If you just put them in without a glass container and if the space is small, and without any cover, your female will be dead or maybe injured, sometimes the male gets injured and dies also. The silver stripes is fear stripes if going horizontal and breeding stripes if vertical (ready to be mated). It is recommended by breeders that you put the female in a glass container, probably a glass that is used with a kerosene lamp, that way you just lift up the glass when she is ready to mate. Signs of her being ready is, if he goes near her, she will bow her head down, and she will have the vertical stripes (visible if her color is light). Are you trying to breed by any chance? If so, then you have to know what to do before doing it or you might end up killing one or both of them. A single female and a single male CAN sometimes stay together if the aquarium is large and there are hiding places for the female (planted aquarium or lots of hiding places). You can put 3 females and a male since the male will be distracted by the other female if he is chasing one of the females. You can have 4 to 5 females in an aquarium (no male), and they will be fine, except for a bit of fighting to establish dominance. There will be an alpha female and she be tested from time to time by the lower ones. If the alpha female is removed, then there will be fighting again to establish the next alpha female, and so on. They can stay in a community aquarium but be sure the other fish are not fin nippers. Bettas are weird and hard to understand. I had bettas, and had breeded successfully and had raised them to adulthood. But I got tired cleaning containers so I gave them away. Also don't breed 2 twin tails or you will end up with defective babies. That was what I was told, mine was a twin tail male and a crown tail female. They had produced a twin crown tail. When you breed, be sure to take out the female when the male starts chasing her away after he had squeezed her eggs out. Also you can take out the male or leave him in to take care of the eggs and fry and take him out in about 3 days or when he starts eating the fry. The male will pick up the eggs and put them in the bubble nest, he will also pick up the fry when they hatch in 24 to 36 hours after being laid. Rei - Raymond Tremor LoveMoAko@... -------Original Message------- From: Dane & Leslie Moore Date: 06/16/05 04:27:09 To: naturalaquariumenthusiast@yahoogroups.com; AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Female betta turning colors We put our female in with the male last night and within an hour she was VERY dark in color with silver stripes. She was very light almost tan before. WHAT?! is this? Shock of some sort? Water conditions were the same, temp a bit different but that has leveled off and she is still very dark. Is she OK or should I remove her? Thanks for any info. Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks .. Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks .. Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12472	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/19/2005
Subject: Re: plant choice and feeding

I've been surfing the net over the week-end and noticed a lot of comments to turn off or at least use as little bubbles as possible also trying not to disturb the surface. I've probbably been dooing the complete opposite, all night i leave two lots of air stones on, from about 8pm evening till 7am morning, then during the day i have my filter running so it makes waves on the surface of the tank. I'm not running any CO2 at the moment but think this is what i'm lacking in my tank. Next weekend i might buy some testers for Iron, Phosphate and CO2. Probably cost a couple of hours work for me. Do you/anyone think this is worth it? Alternativly i could just take samples of my water down to a LFS for testing which is free. Also over the weekend i brought some Flourish Iron from Seachem and put one cap full in the tank just incase there was a iron deficency. =Nick ----- Original Message ----- From: "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Friday, June 17, 2005 6:59 PM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] plant choice and feeding > Nick, > > > > 192W of light is more then enough for 80% of the plants IMO. I suggest you > start keeping that much light on more frequently. > > > > One of the latest things about Amano I had read was that he starts his > tank > in a bit low light and then switches on Metal halides after about 1 hr for > 2-3 hours. That is when the plants really pick up, and then go back to > fluorescent lighting again. Sounds very logical as in Nature, plants > really > get peak very bright light for not more then 2-3 hours in a day until the > sun changes its angle. You could try that too with fluorescents. > > > > My other planted tank is having 150W metal halides and 160W Fluorescents > (65 > gallon 4ft tank). I start with 80W fluorescents early in the morning. > Switch > on halides for about 1.5hrs when I wake up as I have to remove the tank > lid > for them. Just when I am leaving for work, I switch off the halides and > get > all 160W fluorescents (T8) in and running for a good 9 hr period. When I > return from work, I switch off 2 of those fluorescents. And at night, all > lights off. > > > > Total lighting period of a maddening 16 hours. Not much algae problems and > I > use tap water for the aquarium and not RO. So I really don't have much > controls on the nutrients either. > > > > Substrate for this tank is a blend of Flourite and Volcanit (60% fluorite > and 40% volcanit). 4" of substrate. Mostly low and medium light plants > along > with a couple of high light ones like Myriophyllum, Mayaca fluvitallis > (sorry for the spelling). And a couple more that I cannot recall. > > > > Nim > > > > > > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Nicolas Munro > Sent: 17 June 2005 03:57 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] plant choice and feeding > > > > What type of plants do you have Amanda?, > > Nim was saying he chooses low light plants and he feed them Seachem > flourish > > and Raymond feeds his Plant Gro by Nutrafin and liquid Flourite by > Seachem. > > I'm starting to think maybe i have enough lighting in my tank after all, > ive > > got 192w but usually only run that much one or two days a week normally i > run about 2x 4ft (80w ish) fluros 10hrs/day. > > my plants don't seem to do that well (yet), posted a couple of pics to my > photoalbum 'Nick (nedarg@...)' > =Nick > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Amanda" <acharris23@...> > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2005 1:49 PM > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Crayfish > > >>I usually use 17-20 watt bulbs. There is a 17 watt on there now, and >> my plants grow like weeds. I have to trim, and replant once a week. >> I am sure you can go with higher wattage, and it may depend on your >> plant, but I have a variety that are doing well in there. Especially >> my banana plants. Hope this helps >> >> There are only 2 crayfish in my 30 gallon tank. I hold them there >> until it is time to feed my puffer, but one happened to have eggs >> within a couple weeks of getting them. After the male(I suppose,)or >> bigger one started harrassing her, that is when I put her in one of >> my holding tanks. >> >> >> >> >> --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Nicolas Munro" <nmunro@q...> >> wrote: >>> Slightly off topic Amanda but how much light wattage are you using >> for your >>> plants? I'm trying to decide if its worth spending a weeks worth >> of income >>> to improve the lighting in my tank. >>> >>> Also one of my friends used to breed crayfish pretty much for the >> same >>> reason as you are so i'll ask him, altho his tank was larger i >> think. >>> >>> =Nick >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Amanda" <acharris23@y...> >>> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> >>> Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2005 12:15 PM >>> Subject: [AquaticLife] Crayfish >>> >>> >>> > Does anyone know much about crayfish breeding. I have had >> crayfish >>> > for a long time for puffer food, but now one of them has eggs, >> so I >>> > am going to try to raise the babies for food later on to cut >> down on >>> > cost. I was just wondering if it is ok to move the crayfish to a >>> > smaller tank on her own. I didn't worry about it much at first, >>> > because I know the babies stay attached to their mother and all >>> > that, but the male crayfish in the tank with her has started to >>> > chase her around the tank. Is this usual? Is he trying to eat the >>> > eggs? Also, with the research that I have done on the internet >>> > researching breeding, everyone says the length of time for >> hatching >>> > depends on tank temp. Does anyone know a good temp to make them >>> > hatch quicker? I have moved her to a 1 gallon hex tank with some >>> > plants in it, and an air stone for now. Until I can find out if >> she >>> > is safe with the other crayfish in the tank. This 30 gallon tank >> is >>> > heavily planted, and has some pvc pipe, but she just can't seem >> to >>> > hide from him. Also, he is a lot larger than her. Also, what is >> the >>> > usual number of babies that hatch? It looks like she has at least >>> > 100 eggs on her. Thanks in advance for all of your help. >>> > >>> > Oh, someone said that I should add some salt to the water to help >>> > aid with the development of the babies/eggs. Is this true? >>> > >>> > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > _____ > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > * To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12473	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/19/2005
Subject: Re: plant choice and feeding

thanks Cynthia, =Nick ----- Original Message ----- From: "cynthia brennemann" <brennewoman@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Saturday, June 18, 2005 5:47 AM Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: plant choice and feeding > You know, guys, sometimes whether a plant thrives or not isn't because > of lighting, it's because of the condition it was in when you bought > it. Just as perennials bought at k-mart are usually stressed and sick > when you get them and often die, in spite of otherwise excellent > conditions in the garden. Most pet stores have NO idea about how to > care for the plants in their tanks. try getting them from a reputable > dealer. > > I would suggest you go to www.freshwateraquariumplants.com and take a > look at what's available, and the conditions they like. Some REQUIRE > low light, some require certain temps, some require certain ph, just > like fish. you can have an AWESOME planted tank, if you just do a > little research. > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12474	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/19/2005
Subject: Re: plant choice and feeding

I always find it funny how people say plants 'melt' away... :-) kinda think of ice melting in the sunlight but then get confused cause plants are solid. LOL =Nick ----- Original Message ----- From: "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Saturday, June 18, 2005 6:00 AM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: plant choice and feeding > It is partially true. Plants also do suffer from stress and chemical > shock. > > I have experienced that plants that I buy from my local fish store tend to > do much better then those which I buy from online shops that grow them in > water very different from mine. A lot of delicate plants on arrival almost > melt away but this has yet to happen with plants from my local stores. > > > > I am in the UK so things might be a bit different then in the US. > > > > Nim > > > > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of cynthia brennemann > Sent: 17 June 2005 20:47 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: plant choice and feeding > > > > You know, guys, sometimes whether a plant thrives or not isn't because > of lighting, it's because of the condition it was in when you bought > it. Just as perennials bought at k-mart are usually stressed and sick > when you get them and often die, in spite of otherwise excellent > conditions in the garden. Most pet stores have NO idea about how to > care for the plants in their tanks. try getting them from a reputable > dealer. > > I would suggest you go to www.freshwateraquariumplants.com and take a > look at what's available, and the conditions they like. Some REQUIRE > low light, some require certain temps, some require certain ph, just > like fish. you can have an AWESOME planted tank, if you just do a > little research. > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > _____ > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > * To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12475	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/19/2005
Subject: Re: own ick experience/advise i wanted to share

Its been a couple of days since you sent the post, are the fish still going ok? (fingers crossed) =Nick ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sandra" <sandra_friedwagner@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Saturday, June 18, 2005 3:41 AM Subject: [AquaticLife] own ick experience/advise i wanted to share > hi there, > > I just wanted to share some experience i had with newly arrived > stock that had ick, what eliminated the problem and what not ... > > If you ever wondered what medicine does what and how long does it > take for it to work, here i have some new interesting facts. I > recieved live stock which i placed into my quarantine tank first > (one false falcula butterfly and one yellow tang) which started > cratching themselfes already at night, so oviously had a parasite. I > waited two days to see what they were going to develope and saw the > little white spots already on the butterflies fin. I am a little > skeptical with using copper, as you have to be measuring it all the > time and practically destroys all kind of bacteria ect. you have in > the system, so i tried another medicine first and thought that if > this one wouldnt work right i can still use the copper as the last > option. > I used CLOUT tablets and the results were magnificent - you can have > a fish totally covered with white spots and after adding this > medicine just a few hours later you see the results. I kept treating > them with it for several days (up to ten days i remember or so) but > the only negative thing was that they kept flashing and scratching > from time to time, which didnt make me too happy cause that would > mean that they still have some parasites on them. When after this > period i made a 50% water change (thats what the indication says > after obvious approvement in the fish) but to my horror they had a > reinfection the next day and had the white spots even worse. Thats > when i decided to use the copper as they never stopped scratching > and i didnt want to treat them with CLOUT for so long. I added > Copper-safe to the tank and hoped to see some improvement. The next > day the fishes were in total miserable shape, eyes were covered with > white spots, could hardly breathe, total color loss... they were a > mess and wouldnt have survived another day for sure. So i call an > expert and ask him how long it takes for copper to cause a > significant improvement in fish´s health and i was told that it > could take up to 4 days to see first results, but oviously my fish > werent able to wait that long, so i did something that was totally > against my will and was some kind of emergency action, i gave them > both a fresh water dip for some relieve and besides the copper had > to add the CLOUT again (i know mixing medicine sounds horrible and i > was ready to find the fish dead the next morning, but that was the > last attempt for them to live cause i know that without action they > would have died the next day) and if i am telling you that almost > swimming belly upside down, isnt exagerating at all... > > well, to my huge surprise - next day - it looked like nothing has > ever happened to them. Further observation made me see the following: > > CLOUT - seems to eliminate parasites on the fish after just a few > hours, giving them immediate relieve, but DOESNT eliminate free > floating parasites in the water > COPPER-SAFE - is good for prevention and a sure medication to > completely eliminate the parasite from the water, BUT is way too > slow in action and can´t be used for fishes with an advanced ich > case (no improvement after 24 hours) > > emergency mix of CLOUT AND COPPER-SAFE ...seems to do the job! > > I still dont recommend mixing medications, but i just wanted to let > you guys know what happens if you find yourselfe in a "horror case" > of ich and your fishes are literally dying already. > > Fishes are healthy and free of parasites, no scratching, flashing > nor visible spots for around a month now. Placed them into the main > tank, and everything has been ok since. > > greetings, > > sandra > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12476	From: shutternow	Date: 6/19/2005
Subject: Re: Submersible Heater.

Hi! I recently set up a 10 gallon tank with an older submersible 50 watt heater and I noticed today that the black coating was coming off. Is this normal or should I get a new heater? It seems to be keeping the water at a constant temp.so far.Greatly appreciate any help or advice. Earl.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12477	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/19/2005
Subject: Re: worm like things

How are the fry going now Mike? =Nick ----- Original Message ----- From: "mike mather" <mtm6583@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Sunday, June 12, 2005 4:01 PM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] worm like things > > Nigel, I just noticed the same kind of worms in my > tank housing a bunch of Paradise Fish fry. I've also > noticed these little round white dots that zip around > the aquarium. I belive all of these stange creatures > were introduced in the growing and feeding of > Infusoria to my fry. Thats the only thing that makes > sense to me. The fry in the tank are only 3 weeks old > and I watched one eat a white worm today. The > round,white,zippy things are a little to big for the > fry now, but soon they will be free lunch. As long as > they don't harm the fry, I consider it good eats for > them! Mike > >> > > > > __________________________________ > Discover Yahoo! > Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news and more. Check it out! > http://discover.yahoo.com/mobile.html > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12478	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/19/2005
Subject: Converting to and from mg/L and ppm

How do i convert to and from ppm? my test kits are from Hagen and are measured in mg/L. http://www.hach.com/hc/view.knowledge.base.detail.invoker/PackagingCode=GENERAL-TEST_17/NewLinkLabel=Conversion+from+mg&frasl%3BL+to+ppm > 1 mg/L = 1 ppm for dilute aqueous solutions. > For example, a chlorine concentration of 1.8 mg/L chlorine is equivalent to 1.8 ppm chlorine. =Nick [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12479	From: Eric Miner	Date: 6/19/2005
Subject: Anyone know about "Proto Bac"?

Hello All, I've run across a product from Red Sea called Proto Bac. It's advertised to contain heterotrophic bacteris that will decompose protiens and cellulose (something I'm having a problem with). Any advice on this stuff would be helpful Thanks Eric

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12480	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 6/19/2005
Subject: Re: plant choice and feeding

Nick, I actually assumed that you must be having CO2 with 192w of lighting. CO2 will certainly benefit but if you are pushing CO2 then you need to stop all surface agitation during the day. You can have your airpumps on timer to come on at night. Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nicolas Munro Sent: 19 June 2005 23:30 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] plant choice and feeding I've been surfing the net over the week-end and noticed a lot of comments to turn off or at least use as little bubbles as possible also trying not to disturb the surface. I've probbably been dooing the complete opposite, all night i leave two lots of air stones on, from about 8pm evening till 7am morning, then during the day i have my filter running so it makes waves on the surface of the tank. I'm not running any CO2 at the moment but think this is what i'm lacking in my tank. Next weekend i might buy some testers for Iron, Phosphate and CO2. Probably cost a couple of hours work for me. Do you/anyone think this is worth it? Alternativly i could just take samples of my water down to a LFS for testing which is free. Also over the weekend i brought some Flourish Iron from Seachem and put one cap full in the tank just incase there was a iron deficency. =Nick ----- Original Message ----- From: "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Friday, June 17, 2005 6:59 PM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] plant choice and feeding > Nick, > > > > 192W of light is more then enough for 80% of the plants IMO. I suggest you > start keeping that much light on more frequently. > > > > One of the latest things about Amano I had read was that he starts his > tank > in a bit low light and then switches on Metal halides after about 1 hr for > 2-3 hours. That is when the plants really pick up, and then go back to > fluorescent lighting again. Sounds very logical as in Nature, plants > really > get peak very bright light for not more then 2-3 hours in a day until the > sun changes its angle. You could try that too with fluorescents. > > > > My other planted tank is having 150W metal halides and 160W Fluorescents > (65 > gallon 4ft tank). I start with 80W fluorescents early in the morning. > Switch > on halides for about 1.5hrs when I wake up as I have to remove the tank > lid > for them. Just when I am leaving for work, I switch off the halides and > get > all 160W fluorescents (T8) in and running for a good 9 hr period. When I > return from work, I switch off 2 of those fluorescents. And at night, all > lights off. > > > > Total lighting period of a maddening 16 hours. Not much algae problems and > I > use tap water for the aquarium and not RO. So I really don't have much > controls on the nutrients either. > > > > Substrate for this tank is a blend of Flourite and Volcanit (60% fluorite > and 40% volcanit). 4" of substrate. Mostly low and medium light plants > along > with a couple of high light ones like Myriophyllum, Mayaca fluvitallis > (sorry for the spelling). And a couple more that I cannot recall. > > > > Nim > > > > > > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Nicolas Munro > Sent: 17 June 2005 03:57 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] plant choice and feeding > > > > What type of plants do you have Amanda?, > > Nim was saying he chooses low light plants and he feed them Seachem > flourish > > and Raymond feeds his Plant Gro by Nutrafin and liquid Flourite by > Seachem. > > I'm starting to think maybe i have enough lighting in my tank after all, > ive > > got 192w but usually only run that much one or two days a week normally i > run about 2x 4ft (80w ish) fluros 10hrs/day. > > my plants don't seem to do that well (yet), posted a couple of pics to my > photoalbum 'Nick (nedarg@...)' > =Nick > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Amanda" <acharris23@...> > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2005 1:49 PM > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Crayfish > > >>I usually use 17-20 watt bulbs. There is a 17 watt on there now, and >> my plants grow like weeds. I have to trim, and replant once a week. >> I am sure you can go with higher wattage, and it may depend on your >> plant, but I have a variety that are doing well in there. Especially >> my banana plants. Hope this helps >> >> There are only 2 crayfish in my 30 gallon tank. I hold them there >> until it is time to feed my puffer, but one happened to have eggs >> within a couple weeks of getting them. After the male(I suppose,)or >> bigger one started harrassing her, that is when I put her in one of >> my holding tanks. >> >> >> >> >> --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Nicolas Munro" <nmunro@q...> >> wrote: >>> Slightly off topic Amanda but how much light wattage are you using >> for your >>> plants? I'm trying to decide if its worth spending a weeks worth >> of income >>> to improve the lighting in my tank. >>> >>> Also one of my friends used to breed crayfish pretty much for the >> same >>> reason as you are so i'll ask him, altho his tank was larger i >> think. >>> >>> =Nick >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Amanda" <acharris23@y...> >>> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> >>> Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2005 12:15 PM >>> Subject: [AquaticLife] Crayfish >>> >>> >>> > Does anyone know much about crayfish breeding. I have had >> crayfish >>> > for a long time for puffer food, but now one of them has eggs, >> so I >>> > am going to try to raise the babies for food later on to cut >> down on >>> > cost. I was just wondering if it is ok to move the crayfish to a >>> > smaller tank on her own. I didn't worry about it much at first, >>> > because I know the babies stay attached to their mother and all >>> > that, but the male crayfish in the tank with her has started to >>> > chase her around the tank. Is this usual? Is he trying to eat the >>> > eggs? Also, with the research that I have done on the internet >>> > researching breeding, everyone says the length of time for >> hatching >>> > depends on tank temp. Does anyone know a good temp to make them >>> > hatch quicker? I have moved her to a 1 gallon hex tank with some >>> > plants in it, and an air stone for now. Until I can find out if >> she >>> > is safe with the other crayfish in the tank. This 30 gallon tank >> is >>> > heavily planted, and has some pvc pipe, but she just can't seem >> to >>> > hide from him. Also, he is a lot larger than her. Also, what is >> the >>> > usual number of babies that hatch? It looks like she has at least >>> > 100 eggs on her. Thanks in advance for all of your help. >>> > >>> > Oh, someone said that I should add some salt to the water to help >>> > aid with the development of the babies/eggs. Is this true? >>> > >>> > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > _____ > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > * To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter _____ Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12481	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/20/2005
Subject: Re: plant choice and feeding

I was looking into getting a CO2 kit but its almost 3/4 weeks wages to buy. I've had a little play with bakers yeast but not sure if it will produce enough for the tank? what do you think. The 2L coke container actually pops out if you squeeze it prior to putting the lid on. Seems enough pressure is built up. but i havn't connected it to the tank just yet cause i need to buy some more hoses. =Nick ----- Original Message ----- From: "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Monday, June 20, 2005 4:29 PM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] plant choice and feeding > Nick, > > > > I actually assumed that you must be having CO2 with 192w of lighting. > > CO2 will certainly benefit but if you are pushing CO2 then you need to > stop > all surface agitation during the day. You can have your airpumps on timer > to > come on at night. > > > > Nim > > > > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Nicolas Munro > Sent: 19 June 2005 23:30 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] plant choice and feeding > > > > I've been surfing the net over the week-end and noticed a lot of comments > to > > turn off or at least use as little bubbles as possible also trying not to > disturb the surface. > > I've probbably been dooing the complete opposite, all night i leave two > lots > > of air stones on, from about 8pm evening till 7am morning, then during the > day i have my filter running so it makes waves on the surface of the tank. > > > I'm not running any CO2 at the moment but think this is what i'm lacking > in > my tank. Next weekend i might buy some testers for Iron, Phosphate and > CO2. > > Probably cost a couple of hours work for me. Do you/anyone think this is > worth it? > > Alternativly i could just take samples of my water down to a LFS for > testing > > which is free. > > > Also over the weekend i brought some Flourish Iron from Seachem and put > one > cap full in the tank just incase there was a iron deficency. > =Nick > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@...> > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Friday, June 17, 2005 6:59 PM > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] plant choice and feeding > > >> Nick, >> >> >> >> 192W of light is more then enough for 80% of the plants IMO. I suggest >> you >> start keeping that much light on more frequently. >> >> >> >> One of the latest things about Amano I had read was that he starts his >> tank >> in a bit low light and then switches on Metal halides after about 1 hr >> for >> 2-3 hours. That is when the plants really pick up, and then go back to >> fluorescent lighting again. Sounds very logical as in Nature, plants >> really >> get peak very bright light for not more then 2-3 hours in a day until the >> sun changes its angle. You could try that too with fluorescents. >> >> >> >> My other planted tank is having 150W metal halides and 160W Fluorescents >> (65 >> gallon 4ft tank). I start with 80W fluorescents early in the morning. >> Switch >> on halides for about 1.5hrs when I wake up as I have to remove the tank >> lid >> for them. Just when I am leaving for work, I switch off the halides and >> get >> all 160W fluorescents (T8) in and running for a good 9 hr period. When I >> return from work, I switch off 2 of those fluorescents. And at night, all >> lights off. >> >> >> >> Total lighting period of a maddening 16 hours. Not much algae problems >> and > >> I >> use tap water for the aquarium and not RO. So I really don't have much >> controls on the nutrients either. >> >> >> >> Substrate for this tank is a blend of Flourite and Volcanit (60% fluorite >> and 40% volcanit). 4" of substrate. Mostly low and medium light plants >> along >> with a couple of high light ones like Myriophyllum, Mayaca fluvitallis >> (sorry for the spelling). And a couple more that I cannot recall. >> >> >> >> Nim >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> _____ >> >> From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On >> Behalf Of Nicolas Munro >> Sent: 17 June 2005 03:57 >> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com >> Subject: [AquaticLife] plant choice and feeding >> >> >> >> What type of plants do you have Amanda?, >> >> Nim was saying he chooses low light plants and he feed them Seachem >> flourish >> >> and Raymond feeds his Plant Gro by Nutrafin and liquid Flourite by >> Seachem. >> >> I'm starting to think maybe i have enough lighting in my tank after all, >> ive >> >> got 192w but usually only run that much one or two days a week normally i >> run about 2x 4ft (80w ish) fluros 10hrs/day. >> >> my plants don't seem to do that well (yet), posted a couple of pics to my >> photoalbum 'Nick (nedarg@...)' >> =Nick >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Amanda" <acharris23@...> >> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> >> Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2005 1:49 PM >> Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Crayfish >> >> >>>I usually use 17-20 watt bulbs. There is a 17 watt on there now, and >>> my plants grow like weeds. I have to trim, and replant once a week. >>> I am sure you can go with higher wattage, and it may depend on your >>> plant, but I have a variety that are doing well in there. Especially >>> my banana plants. Hope this helps >>> >>> There are only 2 crayfish in my 30 gallon tank. I hold them there >>> until it is time to feed my puffer, but one happened to have eggs >>> within a couple weeks of getting them. After the male(I suppose,)or >>> bigger one started harrassing her, that is when I put her in one of >>> my holding tanks. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Nicolas Munro" <nmunro@q...> >>> wrote: >>>> Slightly off topic Amanda but how much light wattage are you using >>> for your >>>> plants? I'm trying to decide if its worth spending a weeks worth >>> of income >>>> to improve the lighting in my tank. >>>> >>>> Also one of my friends used to breed crayfish pretty much for the >>> same >>>> reason as you are so i'll ask him, altho his tank was larger i >>> think. >>>> >>>> =Nick >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> From: "Amanda" <acharris23@y...> >>>> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> >>>> Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2005 12:15 PM >>>> Subject: [AquaticLife] Crayfish >>>> >>>> >>>> > Does anyone know much about crayfish breeding. I have had >>> crayfish >>>> > for a long time for puffer food, but now one of them has eggs, >>> so I >>>> > am going to try to raise the babies for food later on to cut >>> down on >>>> > cost. I was just wondering if it is ok to move the crayfish to a >>>> > smaller tank on her own. I didn't worry about it much at first, >>>> > because I know the babies stay attached to their mother and all >>>> > that, but the male crayfish in the tank with her has started to >>>> > chase her around the tank. Is this usual? Is he trying to eat the >>>> > eggs? Also, with the research that I have done on the internet >>>> > researching breeding, everyone says the length of time for >>> hatching >>>> > depends on tank temp. Does anyone know a good temp to make them >>>> > hatch quicker? I have moved her to a 1 gallon hex tank with some >>>> > plants in it, and an air stone for now. Until I can find out if >>> she >>>> > is safe with the other crayfish in the tank. This 30 gallon tank >>> is >>>> > heavily planted, and has some pvc pipe, but she just can't seem >>> to >>>> > hide from him. Also, he is a lot larger than her. Also, what is >>> the >>>> > usual number of babies that hatch? It looks like she has at least >>>> > 100 eggs on her. Thanks in advance for all of your help. >>>> > >>>> > Oh, someone said that I should add some salt to the water to help >>>> > aid with the development of the babies/eggs. Is this true? >>>> > >>>> > >> >> >> >> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks >> . >> Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important >> to >> the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the >> subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank >> You >> in Advance for your help in this matter >> >> >> >> >> _____ >> >> Yahoo! Groups Links >> >> * To visit your group on the web, go to: >> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ >> >> * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: >> AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com >> <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> >> >> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! >> <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. >> >> >> >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >> >> >> >> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks >> . >> Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important >> to > >> the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the >> subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank >> You > >> in Advance for your help in this matter >> Yahoo! Groups Links >> >> >> >> >> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > _____ > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > * To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12482	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 6/20/2005
Subject: Re: plant choice and feeding

Nick, I think you need to use brewers yeast instead of backer's yeast as that will last much longer. Wine yeast will last even longer but I think is too vigorous and fast for aquarium use. Still, nothing really beats the pressurized system but there is another option. If you check out an old thread that I have: A Different CO2 theory. What I experimented was to create more then normal surface agitation in the tank with very high lights to allow equilibrium between the Atmospheric CO2 and dissolved CO2 to be in perfect balance. This however does work but you will need more agitation then just an airstone or a very simple spray bar. You may have to use a powerful pump and spray bars (atleast 2) positioned 1/2 " above the water surface at a 45 degree angle creating a water fall like effect. I was lucky to have a 1500LPH canister and a 2000LPH powerhead that I was using on the pressurized CO2 and the results were fantastic with my pressurized system turned off. The plant growth though very slightly slower then when pressurized system was on, was still a lot faster then normal situations. If you want to try this out, it could be worth it. Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nicolas Munro Sent: 20 June 2005 08:00 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] plant choice and feeding I was looking into getting a CO2 kit but its almost 3/4 weeks wages to buy. I've had a little play with bakers yeast but not sure if it will produce enough for the tank? what do you think. The 2L coke container actually pops out if you squeeze it prior to putting the lid on. Seems enough pressure is built up. but i havn't connected it to the tank just yet cause i need to buy some more hoses. =Nick ----- Original Message ----- From: "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Monday, June 20, 2005 4:29 PM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] plant choice and feeding > Nick, > > > > I actually assumed that you must be having CO2 with 192w of lighting. > > CO2 will certainly benefit but if you are pushing CO2 then you need to > stop > all surface agitation during the day. You can have your airpumps on timer > to > come on at night. > > > > Nim > > > > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Nicolas Munro > Sent: 19 June 2005 23:30 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] plant choice and feeding > > > > I've been surfing the net over the week-end and noticed a lot of comments > to > > turn off or at least use as little bubbles as possible also trying not to > disturb the surface. > > I've probbably been dooing the complete opposite, all night i leave two > lots > > of air stones on, from about 8pm evening till 7am morning, then during the > day i have my filter running so it makes waves on the surface of the tank. > > > I'm not running any CO2 at the moment but think this is what i'm lacking > in > my tank. Next weekend i might buy some testers for Iron, Phosphate and > CO2. > > Probably cost a couple of hours work for me. Do you/anyone think this is > worth it? > > Alternativly i could just take samples of my water down to a LFS for > testing > > which is free. > > > Also over the weekend i brought some Flourish Iron from Seachem and put > one > cap full in the tank just incase there was a iron deficency. > =Nick > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@...> > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Friday, June 17, 2005 6:59 PM > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] plant choice and feeding > > >> Nick, >> >> >> >> 192W of light is more then enough for 80% of the plants IMO. I suggest >> you >> start keeping that much light on more frequently. >> >> >> >> One of the latest things about Amano I had read was that he starts his >> tank >> in a bit low light and then switches on Metal halides after about 1 hr >> for >> 2-3 hours. That is when the plants really pick up, and then go back to >> fluorescent lighting again. Sounds very logical as in Nature, plants >> really >> get peak very bright light for not more then 2-3 hours in a day until the >> sun changes its angle. You could try that too with fluorescents. >> >> >> >> My other planted tank is having 150W metal halides and 160W Fluorescents >> (65 >> gallon 4ft tank). I start with 80W fluorescents early in the morning. >> Switch >> on halides for about 1.5hrs when I wake up as I have to remove the tank >> lid >> for them. Just when I am leaving for work, I switch off the halides and >> get >> all 160W fluorescents (T8) in and running for a good 9 hr period. When I >> return from work, I switch off 2 of those fluorescents. And at night, all >> lights off. >> >> >> >> Total lighting period of a maddening 16 hours. Not much algae problems >> and > >> I >> use tap water for the aquarium and not RO. So I really don't have much >> controls on the nutrients either. >> >> >> >> Substrate for this tank is a blend of Flourite and Volcanit (60% fluorite >> and 40% volcanit). 4" of substrate. Mostly low and medium light plants >> along >> with a couple of high light ones like Myriophyllum, Mayaca fluvitallis >> (sorry for the spelling). And a couple more that I cannot recall. >> >> >> >> Nim >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> _____ >> >> From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On >> Behalf Of Nicolas Munro >> Sent: 17 June 2005 03:57 >> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com >> Subject: [AquaticLife] plant choice and feeding >> >> >> >> What type of plants do you have Amanda?, >> >> Nim was saying he chooses low light plants and he feed them Seachem >> flourish >> >> and Raymond feeds his Plant Gro by Nutrafin and liquid Flourite by >> Seachem. >> >> I'm starting to think maybe i have enough lighting in my tank after all, >> ive >> >> got 192w but usually only run that much one or two days a week normally i >> run about 2x 4ft (80w ish) fluros 10hrs/day. >> >> my plants don't seem to do that well (yet), posted a couple of pics to my >> photoalbum 'Nick (nedarg@...)' >> =Nick >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Amanda" <acharris23@...> >> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> >> Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2005 1:49 PM >> Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Crayfish >> >> >>>I usually use 17-20 watt bulbs. There is a 17 watt on there now, and >>> my plants grow like weeds. I have to trim, and replant once a week. >>> I am sure you can go with higher wattage, and it may depend on your >>> plant, but I have a variety that are doing well in there. Especially >>> my banana plants. Hope this helps >>> >>> There are only 2 crayfish in my 30 gallon tank. I hold them there >>> until it is time to feed my puffer, but one happened to have eggs >>> within a couple weeks of getting them. After the male(I suppose,)or >>> bigger one started harrassing her, that is when I put her in one of >>> my holding tanks. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Nicolas Munro" <nmunro@q...> >>> wrote: >>>> Slightly off topic Amanda but how much light wattage are you using >>> for your >>>> plants? I'm trying to decide if its worth spending a weeks worth >>> of income >>>> to improve the lighting in my tank. >>>> >>>> Also one of my friends used to breed crayfish pretty much for the >>> same >>>> reason as you are so i'll ask him, altho his tank was larger i >>> think. >>>> >>>> =Nick >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> From: "Amanda" <acharris23@y...> >>>> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> >>>> Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2005 12:15 PM >>>> Subject: [AquaticLife] Crayfish >>>> >>>> >>>> > Does anyone know much about crayfish breeding. I have had >>> crayfish >>>> > for a long time for puffer food, but now one of them has eggs, >>> so I >>>> > am going to try to raise the babies for food later on to cut >>> down on >>>> > cost. I was just wondering if it is ok to move the crayfish to a >>>> > smaller tank on her own. I didn't worry about it much at first, >>>> > because I know the babies stay attached to their mother and all >>>> > that, but the male crayfish in the tank with her has started to >>>> > chase her around the tank. Is this usual? Is he trying to eat the >>>> > eggs? Also, with the research that I have done on the internet >>>> > researching breeding, everyone says the length of time for >>> hatching >>>> > depends on tank temp. Does anyone know a good temp to make them >>>> > hatch quicker? I have moved her to a 1 gallon hex tank with some >>>> > plants in it, and an air stone for now. Until I can find out if >>> she >>>> > is safe with the other crayfish in the tank. This 30 gallon tank >>> is >>>> > heavily planted, and has some pvc pipe, but she just can't seem >>> to >>>> > hide from him. Also, he is a lot larger than her. Also, what is >>> the >>>> > usual number of babies that hatch? It looks like she has at least >>>> > 100 eggs on her. Thanks in advance for all of your help. >>>> > >>>> > Oh, someone said that I should add some salt to the water to help >>>> > aid with the development of the babies/eggs. Is this true? >>>> > >>>> > >> >> >> >> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks >> . >> Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important >> to >> the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the >> subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank >> You >> in Advance for your help in this matter >> >> >> >> >> _____ >> >> Yahoo! Groups Links >> >> * To visit your group on the web, go to: >> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ >> >> * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: >> AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com >> <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> >> >> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! >> <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. >> >> >> >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >> >> >> >> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks >> . >> Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important >> to > >> the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the >> subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank >> You > >> in Advance for your help in this matter >> Yahoo! Groups Links >> >> >> >> >> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > _____ > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > * To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter _____ Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12483	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 6/20/2005
Subject: Minnows are dying, pls. help!

A while ago I got some fathead minnows from a local baitstore to add to my goldfish aquarium. They have black spots which we determined to be trematodes and that I shouldn't worry about it. Lately, they have been dying off. I don't think there is anything wrong with the aquarium conditions. They look really skinny. Could they be starving if the goldfish are hogging to food? Or do minnows from bait stores usually just not live long? Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12484	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/20/2005
Subject: Re: Female betta turning colors

yep, that's it! --- Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: > A bubble nest? Like a big clump of floating bubbles on the top of the > water? > > Have kids stuff? Check out Zainy Zebra Consignment! Based in Cabot, AR > www.ZainyZebra.com > > Live in or near Cabot? Join the Cabot Garage Sale! > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/CabotgarageSale/ > > Live in Little Rock? Little Rock Garage > Sale!http://groups.yahoo.com/group/LRgarageSale/ > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Rei - Raymond Tremor > Sent: Saturday, June 18, 2005 10:23 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Female betta turning colors > > > if the male had a bubble nest they had probably had mated and you will > get babies in about 24 to 36 hours. it only takes a minute to 3 hours > for them to mate. > > Rei - Raymond Tremor > LoveMoAko@... > > -------Original Message------- > > From: Dane & Leslie Moore > Date: 06/18/05 07:37:47 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Female betta turning colors > > I'm not trying to breed them. I'm setting up a 75 gal and we put my > sons male betta in there for fun (alone.) I left and came back to the > female also in there, put in by my husband to see what would happen. > They had tons of room and lots of places to hide so I just left them > together for a few days but then noticed both their tails were ripped. I > took the male out (he was easier to catch) but the female is still in > there. I'll take her out tonight as this tank is going to spike and I > don't want any fish in there for that. Thanks for the info. And her > stripes were vertical and appeared when she was very dark in color. > Once I removed the male, she returned to her brownish color and her > horizontal stripes appeared again. Again, I am NOT going to breed them. > No thanks. =) > > Thanks again, > Leslie > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Rei - Raymond Tremor > Sent: Saturday, June 18, 2005 4:11 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Female betta turning colors > > > You just put them together without a container of some sort where the > male can see the female but can't attack her? If you just put them in > without a glass container and if the space is small, and without any > cover, your female will be dead or maybe injured, sometimes the male > gets injured and dies also. The silver stripes is fear stripes if going > horizontal and breeding stripes if vertical (ready to be mated). It is > recommended by breeders that you put the female in a glass container, > probably a glass that is used with a kerosene lamp, that way you just > lift up the glass when she is ready to mate. Signs of her being ready > is, if he goes near her, she will bow her head down, and she will have > the vertical stripes (visible if her color is light). Are you trying to > breed by any chance? If so, then you have to know what to do before > doing it or you might end up killing one or both of them. A single > female and a single male CAN sometimes stay together if the aquarium is > large and there are hiding places for the female (planted aquarium or > lots of hiding places). You can put 3 females and a male since the male > will be distracted by the other female if he is chasing one of the > females. You can have 4 to 5 females in an aquarium (no male), and they > will be fine, except for a bit of fighting to establish dominance. There > will be an alpha female and she be tested from time to time by the lower > ones. If the alpha female is removed, then there will be fighting again > to establish the next alpha female, and so on. They can stay in a > community aquarium but be sure the other fish are not fin nippers. > Bettas are weird and hard to understand. I had bettas, and had breeded > successfully and had raised them to adulthood. But I got tired cleaning > containers so I gave them away. Also don't breed 2 twin tails or you > will end up with defective babies. That was what I was told, mine was a > twin tail male and a crown tail female. They had produced a twin crown > tail. > > When you breed, be sure to take out the female when the male starts > chasing her away after he had squeezed her eggs out. Also you can take > out the male or leave him in to take care of the eggs and fry and take > him out in about 3 days or when he starts eating the fry. The male will > pick up the eggs and put them in the bubble nest, he will also pick up > the fry when they hatch in 24 to 36 hours after being laid. > > Rei - Raymond Tremor > LoveMoAko@... > > -------Original Message------- > > From: Dane & Leslie Moore > Date: 06/16/05 04:27:09 > To: naturalaquariumenthusiast@yahoogroups.com; > AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Female betta turning colors > > We put our female in with the male last night and within an hour she was > VERY dark in color with silver stripes. She was very light almost tan > before. WHAT?! is this? Shock of some sort? Water conditions were the > same, temp a bit different but that has leveled off and she is still > very dark. Is she OK or should I remove her? Thanks for any info. > Leslie > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks .. > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important > to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify > the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we > Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important > to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify > the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we > Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks .. > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important > to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify > the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we > Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important > to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify > the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we > Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12485	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/20/2005
Subject: Re: Female betta turning colors

Whoops. He had one going but I messed it up when I moved him out of the tank. He still does that though even in his smaller habitat. I have put the two next to eachother so that they can see each other. When she does the stripes again, I will do as suggested and see if we can get some baby bettas. My kids would love that. So I'm looking for vertical stripes to tell when she is ready? She is staying that darker color and only turns pale when I remove him from her sight. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez Sent: Monday, June 20, 2005 2:15 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Female betta turning colors yep, that's it! --- Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: > A bubble nest? Like a big clump of floating bubbles on the top of the > water? > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12486	From: Karen	Date: 6/20/2005
Subject: Re: Converting to and from mg/L and ppm

Hagen has a handy conversion table on their website. Here's the link http://www.hagen.com/usa/aquatic/gh_kh_conv_cal.cfm --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Nicolas Munro" <nmunro@q...> wrote: > How do i convert to and from ppm? my test kits are from Hagen and are measured in mg/L. > > > > > http://www.hach.com/hc/view.knowledge.base.detail.invoker/PackagingCo de=GENERAL-TEST_17/NewLinkLabel=Conversion+from+mg&frasl%3BL+to+ppm > > > 1 mg/L = 1 ppm for dilute aqueous solutions. > > For example, a chlorine concentration of 1.8 mg/L chlorine is equivalent to 1.8 ppm chlorine. > > =Nick > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12487	From: Sandra	Date: 6/20/2005
Subject: Re: own ick experience/advise i wanted to share

Hi Nick, Thanks for asking, yes the fish are doing good, no more scratching and no more ich *whew* :) sandra --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Nicolas Munro" <nmunro@q...> wrote: > Its been a couple of days since you sent the post, > > are the fish still going ok? (fingers crossed) > > > =Nick > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12488	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/20/2005
Subject: Re: plant choice and feeding

I think thats what prompted me to turn up the air stones and make the filter closer to the surface of the water. But obviously i'm not doing it 'hard enough' The CO2 unit pressureised, how does it compair to adding carbon in a liquid form like Seachems ones? Cause theres a lot cheeper initially. To buy the liquid CO2 stuff about AU$20 To fill up my CO2 if i get one will probably cost AU$12 from the LFS. To buy the CO2 unit about $549.95 or about a weeks income. =Nick Australian Dollars ----- Original Message ----- From: "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Monday, June 20, 2005 6:26 PM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] plant choice and feeding > Nick, > > I think you need to use brewers yeast instead of backer's yeast as that > will > last much longer. Wine yeast will last even longer but I think is too > vigorous and fast for aquarium use. > > Still, nothing really beats the pressurized system but there is another > option. > > > > If you check out an old thread that I have: A Different CO2 theory. > > What I experimented was to create more then normal surface agitation in > the > tank with very high lights to allow equilibrium between the Atmospheric > CO2 > and dissolved CO2 to be in perfect balance. This however does work but you > will need more agitation then just an airstone or a very simple spray bar. > You may have to use a powerful pump and spray bars (atleast 2) positioned > 1/2 " above the water surface at a 45 degree angle creating a water fall > like effect. I was lucky to have a 1500LPH canister and a 2000LPH > powerhead > that I was using on the pressurized CO2 and the results were fantastic > with > my pressurized system turned off. The plant growth though very slightly > slower then when pressurized system was on, was still a lot faster then > normal situations. If you want to try this out, it could be worth it. > > > > Nim > > > > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Nicolas Munro > Sent: 20 June 2005 08:00 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] plant choice and feeding > > > > I was looking into getting a CO2 kit but its almost 3/4 weeks wages to > buy. > > I've had a little play with bakers yeast but not sure if it will produce > enough for the tank? what do you think. > > The 2L coke container actually pops out if you squeeze it prior to putting > the lid on. Seems enough pressure is built up. but i havn't connected it > to > the tank just yet cause i need to buy some more hoses. > > =Nick > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@...> > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Monday, June 20, 2005 4:29 PM > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] plant choice and feeding > > >> Nick, >> >> >> >> I actually assumed that you must be having CO2 with 192w of lighting. >> >> CO2 will certainly benefit but if you are pushing CO2 then you need to >> stop >> all surface agitation during the day. You can have your airpumps on timer >> to >> come on at night. >> >> >> >> Nim >> >> >> >> >> >> _____ >> >> From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On >> Behalf Of Nicolas Munro >> Sent: 19 June 2005 23:30 >> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com >> Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] plant choice and feeding >> >> >> >> I've been surfing the net over the week-end and noticed a lot of comments >> to >> >> turn off or at least use as little bubbles as possible also trying not to >> disturb the surface. >> >> I've probbably been dooing the complete opposite, all night i leave two >> lots >> >> of air stones on, from about 8pm evening till 7am morning, then during >> the >> day i have my filter running so it makes waves on the surface of the >> tank. >> >> >> I'm not running any CO2 at the moment but think this is what i'm lacking >> in >> my tank. Next weekend i might buy some testers for Iron, Phosphate and >> CO2. >> >> Probably cost a couple of hours work for me. Do you/anyone think this is >> worth it? >> >> Alternativly i could just take samples of my water down to a LFS for >> testing >> >> which is free. >> >> >> Also over the weekend i brought some Flourish Iron from Seachem and put >> one >> cap full in the tank just incase there was a iron deficency. >> =Nick >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@...> >> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> >> Sent: Friday, June 17, 2005 6:59 PM >> Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] plant choice and feeding >> >> >>> Nick, >>> >>> >>> >>> 192W of light is more then enough for 80% of the plants IMO. I suggest >>> you >>> start keeping that much light on more frequently. >>> >>> >>> >>> One of the latest things about Amano I had read was that he starts his >>> tank >>> in a bit low light and then switches on Metal halides after about 1 hr >>> for >>> 2-3 hours. That is when the plants really pick up, and then go back to >>> fluorescent lighting again. Sounds very logical as in Nature, plants >>> really >>> get peak very bright light for not more then 2-3 hours in a day until >>> the >>> sun changes its angle. You could try that too with fluorescents. >>> >>> >>> >>> My other planted tank is having 150W metal halides and 160W Fluorescents >>> (65 >>> gallon 4ft tank). I start with 80W fluorescents early in the morning. >>> Switch >>> on halides for about 1.5hrs when I wake up as I have to remove the tank >>> lid >>> for them. Just when I am leaving for work, I switch off the halides and >>> get >>> all 160W fluorescents (T8) in and running for a good 9 hr period. When I >>> return from work, I switch off 2 of those fluorescents. And at night, >>> all >>> lights off. >>> >>> >>> >>> Total lighting period of a maddening 16 hours. Not much algae problems >>> and >> >>> I >>> use tap water for the aquarium and not RO. So I really don't have much >>> controls on the nutrients either. >>> >>> >>> >>> Substrate for this tank is a blend of Flourite and Volcanit (60% >>> fluorite >>> and 40% volcanit). 4" of substrate. Mostly low and medium light plants >>> along >>> with a couple of high light ones like Myriophyllum, Mayaca fluvitallis >>> (sorry for the spelling). And a couple more that I cannot recall. >>> >>> >>> >>> Nim >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> _____ >>> >>> From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] >>> On >>> Behalf Of Nicolas Munro >>> Sent: 17 June 2005 03:57 >>> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com >>> Subject: [AquaticLife] plant choice and feeding >>> >>> >>> >>> What type of plants do you have Amanda?, >>> >>> Nim was saying he chooses low light plants and he feed them Seachem >>> flourish >>> >>> and Raymond feeds his Plant Gro by Nutrafin and liquid Flourite by >>> Seachem. >>> >>> I'm starting to think maybe i have enough lighting in my tank after all, >>> ive >>> >>> got 192w but usually only run that much one or two days a week normally >>> i >>> run about 2x 4ft (80w ish) fluros 10hrs/day. >>> >>> my plants don't seem to do that well (yet), posted a couple of pics to >>> my >>> photoalbum 'Nick (nedarg@...)' >>> =Nick >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Amanda" <acharris23@...> >>> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> >>> Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2005 1:49 PM >>> Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Crayfish >>> >>> >>>>I usually use 17-20 watt bulbs. There is a 17 watt on there now, and >>>> my plants grow like weeds. I have to trim, and replant once a week. >>>> I am sure you can go with higher wattage, and it may depend on your >>>> plant, but I have a variety that are doing well in there. Especially >>>> my banana plants. Hope this helps >>>> >>>> There are only 2 crayfish in my 30 gallon tank. I hold them there >>>> until it is time to feed my puffer, but one happened to have eggs >>>> within a couple weeks of getting them. After the male(I suppose,)or >>>> bigger one started harrassing her, that is when I put her in one of >>>> my holding tanks. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Nicolas Munro" <nmunro@q...> >>>> wrote: >>>>> Slightly off topic Amanda but how much light wattage are you using >>>> for your >>>>> plants? I'm trying to decide if its worth spending a weeks worth >>>> of income >>>>> to improve the lighting in my tank. >>>>> >>>>> Also one of my friends used to breed crayfish pretty much for the >>>> same >>>>> reason as you are so i'll ask him, altho his tank was larger i >>>> think. >>>>> >>>>> =Nick >>>>> >>>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>>> From: "Amanda" <acharris23@y...> >>>>> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> >>>>> Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2005 12:15 PM >>>>> Subject: [AquaticLife] Crayfish >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> > Does anyone know much about crayfish breeding. I have had >>>> crayfish >>>>> > for a long time for puffer food, but now one of them has eggs, >>>> so I >>>>> > am going to try to raise the babies for food later on to cut >>>> down on >>>>> > cost. I was just wondering if it is ok to move the crayfish to a >>>>> > smaller tank on her own. I didn't worry about it much at first, >>>>> > because I know the babies stay attached to their mother and all >>>>> > that, but the male crayfish in the tank with her has started to >>>>> > chase her around the tank. Is this usual? Is he trying to eat the >>>>> > eggs? Also, with the research that I have done on the internet >>>>> > researching breeding, everyone says the length of time for >>>> hatching >>>>> > depends on tank temp. Does anyone know a good temp to make them >>>>> > hatch quicker? I have moved her to a 1 gallon hex tank with some >>>>> > plants in it, and an air stone for now. Until I can find out if >>>> she >>>>> > is safe with the other crayfish in the tank. This 30 gallon tank >>>> is >>>>> > heavily planted, and has some pvc pipe, but she just can't seem >>>> to >>>>> > hide from him. Also, he is a lot larger than her. Also, what is >>>> the >>>>> > usual number of babies that hatch? It looks like she has at least >>>>> > 100 eggs on her. Thanks in advance for all of your help. >>>>> > >>>>> > Oh, someone said that I should add some salt to the water to help >>>>> > aid with the development of the babies/eggs. Is this true? >>>>> > >>>>> > >>> >>> >>> >>> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks >>> . >>> Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important >>> to >>> the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the >>> subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank >>> You >>> in Advance for your help in this matter >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> _____ >>> >>> Yahoo! Groups Links >>> >>> * To visit your group on the web, go to: >>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ >>> >>> * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: >>> AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com >>> <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> >>> >>> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! >>> <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. >>> >>> >>> >>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >>> >>> >>> >>> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks >>> . >>> Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important >>> to >> >>> the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the >>> subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank >>> You >> >>> in Advance for your help in this matter >>> Yahoo! Groups Links >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> >> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks >> . >> Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important >> to >> the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the >> subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank >> You >> in Advance for your help in this matter >> >> >> >> >> _____ >> >> Yahoo! Groups Links >> >> * To visit your group on the web, go to: >> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ >> >> * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: >> AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com >> <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> >> >> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! >> <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. >> >> >> >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >> >> >> >> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks >> . >> Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important >> to > >> the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the >> subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank >> You > >> in Advance for your help in this matter >> Yahoo! Groups Links >> >> >> >> >> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > _____ > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > * To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12489	From: Sandra	Date: 6/20/2005
Subject: Re: own ick experience/advise i wanted to share

hi deborah, i just checked again on the medicines and it says the following: CLOUT: Not suitable for use in aquariums containing live rock or invertabrates. Use cautiously with marine sharks and lionfish. COPPER-SAFE: Before use, remove invertebrates from tank. CopperSafe may be harmful to plants and some snails. Remove invertebrates without exoskeletons such as jellyfish, anemone etc. BUT, i did some research on the internet and it says that CLOUT cannot be used on scaleless fish, that it will most probably kill them. Couldnt find nothing that said not to use CopperSafe with them, but as you know its very slow in action. I hope you dont have another outbreak of ich and that your fish stay healthy !!! sandra --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "deborahgd14" <deborahgd14@y...> wrote: > Hi: Thank you for sharing your information in ick. Would this > action be good for scaleless fish? I had a bad experience a few > months ago and coppersafe did not help them. They ended up with > secondary infections and most of my fish died. Next time I will put > them in a quarantine tank. DDD >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12490	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/20/2005
Subject: Re: Female betta turning colors

i've never bred bettas, but i do remember hearing that the female's submissive stripes are vertical and stress lines are horizontal. or i could have that backwards or even completely wrong. from what i've heard, breeding bettas isn't necessarily hard but you need to monitor them to make sure to separate the 2 if necessary. but i'm sure there are people on this group who are far more knowledgeable than i am about betta breeding. or you can try the fish forums in the betta section. people there are extremely knowledgeable. fishforums.net. good luck! --- Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: > Whoops. He had one going but I messed it up when I moved him out of the > tank. He still does that though even in his smaller habitat. I have > put the two next to eachother so that they can see each other. When she > does the stripes again, I will do as suggested and see if we can get > some baby bettas. My kids would love that. > So I'm looking for vertical stripes to tell when she is ready? She is > staying that darker color and only turns pale when I remove him from her > sight. > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez > Sent: Monday, June 20, 2005 2:15 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Female betta turning colors > > > yep, that's it! > > --- Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: > > > A bubble nest? Like a big clump of floating bubbles on the top of the > > > water? > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12491	From: francisco fagundez	Date: 6/20/2005
Subject: goldfish bowl

Hi. I´m a new member and first timer aquarist. I would like to make a question. I found a offer on 10gal. bowls at a local department store, now i want to buy a couple of goldfish. What would i need, besides gravel. I´ve been told that there is no need for an air pump and water treatment, just fill up with water and introduce the fish.Right? Also, i could feed them with a mix of shredred carrots, wheat germ with any other veggie? thanks, Francisco. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12492	From: akquarium	Date: 6/20/2005
Subject: I have tiny bubbles....??

Hi everyone, My new tank is about 3 weeks new, water cleared up, the smell went away, now I have millions of tiny bubbles floating on top of the water, why? thanks!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12493	From: SCOTT	Date: 6/20/2005
Subject: Re: snails

If you are going to feed the snails to your fish, you may consider cracking their shells so the fish and get past the shell problem. Scott the trumpet snails are hard shelled, the puffer should not be able to eat them. they are a nocturnal snail for teh most part. they come out in the hundreds at night from the gravel. mine do not visually reproduce very often, as i mainly see them when the lights have been out in the whole house and i turn one on, but occasionally i will have to clean my back filter when i hear their shells bouncing around in the impeller -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.323 / Virus Database: 267.7.4/16 - Release Date: 6/15/2005

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12494	From: kathygothreau	Date: 6/20/2005
Subject: cloudiness in tank

I am new to the group and I have been reading the posts avidly. I am not experienced (as I am sure you will soon learn from my posts!). About 5 months ago I setup a 10 gallon aquarium and purchased 2 very small shebunkins. Chester and Charlie are now about 3-4 inches long and are very active and colorful. I have glass marbles (the kind that you would use in a vase of flowers) on the bottom of the tank and a large rectangular-looking bubble stone. After trying two other filters, I purchased a Penguin 100 Bio-Wheel filter this weekend. I have one decoration in the tank that looks like a rock formation with plastic plants coming out of it. I feed the fish Tetra Fin staple goldfish flakes, Tetra Fin goldfish crisps, Wardley Total Spectra Max and Hikari brine shrimp (I don't feed them all at once, but I rotate them for variety). I have a couple of questions: 1.) my tank always looks cloudy...once a week I siphon the bottom of the tank and I was changing the filter cartridge on the power filter I had once a week...I haven't changed this bio-wheel cartridge yet...I also clean the inside of the glass with one of those rough-surfaced, long-handled implements...I am not experienced at how much food to give the fish; I have two goldfish books that say to feed them what they can consume in 5 minutes. 2.) the second question is how much should I feed Chester and Charlie? They always seem hungry. Thank you very much for any help that you can offer this novice. I promise to make my posts much shorter in the future! Kathy G. Woodstock, CT

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12495	From: Ed Williamson	Date: 6/20/2005
Subject: Re: Was -> Re: Ammonia and fish behavior

Just for info on Bio-spira I used it to set up a 100gal cichlid tank. Put 1 large container of it in tank and added 40 2 to 3 inch fish. One week later added one more container of Bio-spira just to be safe . My ammonia an nitrite reading never got high enough to be a concern. Tank now has 0 ammonia and 0 nitrite in it. Is bee 10 weeks since i started this tank . Ed At 10:05 AM 6/17/2005, you wrote: >Hi Partick, > >It sounds like you've never done a fishless cycle. Keep in mind that >one 'feeds' the bacteria an ammount of ammonia that is much higher >than the fish, etc. will give off. Thus the bacterial colony is very >large when the proces is completed. Fish are then added to the tank >with this large colony that is well prepared to deal with the ammonia >given off by the fish. In fact there is a likelyhood that some of the >colony will die off due to lack of food (ammonia). > >In my research of fishless cycling I never saw anything that comes >close to the 'misinformation' you mention. On the other hand I am >skeptical of Marineland's claim that one can add fish 24 hrs after >adding Bio-Spira. I did use Bio-spira to start my fishless cycle, but >I'd never add fish right after using it. > >Thanks for all your help > >Eric > >--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Patrick" <patrickmn@c...> wrote: > > Despite the "misinformation" perpetuated by supporters of fishless > > cycling, once you add fish the tank has to go through the entire >cycle again > > to compensate for the exact amount of ammonia produced by the fish >and the > > food you give them. The tank will also go through the cycle every >time you > > add new fish to the tank. The only difference is that it will only >take a > > few hours or days when you add the new fish. > > > > > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy. > > > > "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. >But it is > > perhaps, the end of the beginning." > > -Winston Churchill > > > > > > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks >. >Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to >the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the >subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You >in Advance for your help in this matter >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12496	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/20/2005
Subject: Re: I have tiny bubbles....??

do you have real plants? they create bubbles. =Nick ----- Original Message ----- From: "akquarium" <akquarium@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Sunday, June 19, 2005 2:48 AM Subject: [AquaticLife] I have tiny bubbles....?? > Hi everyone, > > My new tank is about 3 weeks new, > water cleared up, > the smell went away, > > now I have millions of tiny bubbles floating > on top of the water, > > why? > > thanks! > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12497	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/20/2005
Subject: Re: I have tiny bubbles....??

Male Siamise fighters produce bubble nests. Pic would be good or some of your own thoughts as to how they could exist. =Nick ----- Original Message ----- From: "akquarium" <akquarium@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Sunday, June 19, 2005 2:48 AM Subject: [AquaticLife] I have tiny bubbles....?? > Hi everyone, > > My new tank is about 3 weeks new, > water cleared up, > the smell went away, > > now I have millions of tiny bubbles floating > on top of the water, > > why? > > thanks! > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12498	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/20/2005
Subject: Re: I have tiny bubbles....??

I know water with high ammonia produces bubbles, almost like a foam of bubbles and usually around the edges. It'd be worth a test to rule it out. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of akquarium Sent: Saturday, June 18, 2005 11:48 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] I have tiny bubbles....?? Hi everyone, My new tank is about 3 weeks new, water cleared up, the smell went away, now I have millions of tiny bubbles floating on top of the water, why? thanks! Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12499	From: paul helms	Date: 6/20/2005
Subject: Re: goldfish bowl

no that is not right...it should be cycled and there are ugf;s available for bowls --- francisco fagundez <franciscofagundez@...> wrote: > Hi. I´m a new member and first timer aquarist. I > would > like to make a question. > > I found a offer on 10gal. bowls at a local > department > store, now i want to buy a couple of goldfish. What > would i need, besides gravel. > I´ve been told that there is no need for an air pump > and water treatment, just fill up with water and > introduce the fish.Right? > > Also, i could feed them with a mix of shredred > carrots, wheat germ with any other veggie? > > thanks, > Francisco. > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12500	From: paul helms	Date: 6/20/2005
Subject: Re: I have tiny bubbles....??

if it is a betta tank it is a bubble nest made by the male --- akquarium <akquarium@...> wrote: > Hi everyone, > > My new tank is about 3 weeks new, > water cleared up, > the smell went away, > > now I have millions of tiny bubbles floating > on top of the water, > > why? > > thanks! > > > > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12501	From: Rei - Raymond Tremor	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Re: Female betta turning colors

Yes that is a bubble nest. the male mostly makes the bubble nest but some females do it too. sometimes the female helps the male put the eggs into the bubble nest after the (squeeze - the male wraps his body around the females body) mating process. The squeezing will take from an hour to about 5 depending on whether the male had done it before. Rei - Raymond Tremor LoveMoAko@... -------Original Message------- From: Dane & Leslie Moore Date: 06/19/05 12:24:01 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Female betta turning colors A bubble nest? Like a big clump of floating bubbles on the top of the water? Have kids stuff? Check out Zainy Zebra Consignment! Based in Cabot, AR www.ZainyZebra.com Live in or near Cabot? Join the Cabot Garage Sale! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/CabotgarageSale/ Live in Little Rock? Little Rock Garage Sale!http://groups.yahoo.com/group/LRgarageSale/ -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Rei - Raymond Tremor Sent: Saturday, June 18, 2005 10:23 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Female betta turning colors if the male had a bubble nest they had probably had mated and you will get babies in about 24 to 36 hours. it only takes a minute to 3 hours for them to mate. Rei - Raymond Tremor LoveMoAko@... -------Original Message------- From: Dane & Leslie Moore Date: 06/18/05 07:37:47 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Female betta turning colors I'm not trying to breed them. I'm setting up a 75 gal and we put my sons male betta in there for fun (alone.) I left and came back to the female also in there, put in by my husband to see what would happen. They had tons of room and lots of places to hide so I just left them together for a few days but then noticed both their tails were ripped. I took the male out (he was easier to catch) but the female is still in there. I'll take her out tonight as this tank is going to spike and I don't want any fish in there for that. Thanks for the info. And her stripes were vertical and appeared when she was very dark in color. Once I removed the male, she returned to her brownish color and her horizontal stripes appeared again. Again, I am NOT going to breed them. No thanks. =) Thanks again, Leslie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Rei - Raymond Tremor Sent: Saturday, June 18, 2005 4:11 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Female betta turning colors You just put them together without a container of some sort where the male can see the female but can't attack her? If you just put them in without a glass container and if the space is small, and without any cover, your female will be dead or maybe injured, sometimes the male gets injured and dies also. The silver stripes is fear stripes if going horizontal and breeding stripes if vertical (ready to be mated). It is recommended by breeders that you put the female in a glass container, probably a glass that is used with a kerosene lamp, that way you just lift up the glass when she is ready to mate. Signs of her being ready is, if he goes near her, she will bow her head down, and she will have the vertical stripes (visible if her color is light). Are you trying to breed by any chance? If so, then you have to know what to do before doing it or you might end up killing one or both of them. A single female and a single male CAN sometimes stay together if the aquarium is large and there are hiding places for the female (planted aquarium or lots of hiding places). You can put 3 females and a male since the male will be distracted by the other female if he is chasing one of the females. You can have 4 to 5 females in an aquarium (no male), and they will be fine, except for a bit of fighting to establish dominance. There will be an alpha female and she be tested from time to time by the lower ones. If the alpha female is removed, then there will be fighting again to establish the next alpha female, and so on. They can stay in a community aquarium but be sure the other fish are not fin nippers. Bettas are weird and hard to understand. I had bettas, and had breeded successfully and had raised them to adulthood. But I got tired cleaning containers so I gave them away. Also don't breed 2 twin tails or you will end up with defective babies. That was what I was told, mine was a twin tail male and a crown tail female. They had produced a twin crown tail. When you breed, be sure to take out the female when the male starts chasing her away after he had squeezed her eggs out. Also you can take out the male or leave him in to take care of the eggs and fry and take him out in about 3 days or when he starts eating the fry. The male will pick up the eggs and put them in the bubble nest, he will also pick up the fry when they hatch in 24 to 36 hours after being laid. Rei - Raymond Tremor LoveMoAko@... -------Original Message------- From: Dane & Leslie Moore Date: 06/16/05 04:27:09 To: naturalaquariumenthusiast@yahoogroups.com; AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Female betta turning colors We put our female in with the male last night and within an hour she was VERY dark in color with silver stripes. She was very light almost tan before. WHAT?! is this? Shock of some sort? Water conditions were the same, temp a bit different but that has leveled off and she is still very dark. Is she OK or should I remove her? Thanks for any info. Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks .. Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks .. Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks .. Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12502	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Re: goldfish bowl

Nonononono!!!! you will kill the fish. You NEED to treat for chlorine. And a filter and pump is always a good idea for goldfish. I would think the veggies would be good for them. But get some flakes or goldfish pellets too. Emily francisco fagundez <franciscofagundez@...> wrote: Hi. I´m a new member and first timer aquarist. I would like to make a question. I found a offer on 10gal. bowls at a local department store, now i want to buy a couple of goldfish. What would i need, besides gravel. I´ve been told that there is no need for an air pump and water treatment, just fill up with water and introduce the fish.Right? Also, i could feed them with a mix of shredred carrots, wheat germ with any other veggie? thanks, Francisco. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12503	From: Patrick	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Re: goldfish bowl

I suggest adding a 0 behind 10 (100 gallons) and make it a pond instead of a bowl. There are lots of pond and container options, even a $8 plastic pool. It will need a small filter, especially if it gets over 85°F. Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill -------Original Message------- Hi. I´m a new member and first timer aquarist. I would like to make a question. I found a offer on 10gal. bowls at a local department store, now i want to buy a couple of goldfish. What would i need, besides gravel. I´ve been told that there is no need for an air pump and water treatment, just fill up with water and introduce the fish.Right? Also, i could feed them with a mix of shredred carrots, wheat germ with any other veggie? thanks, Francisco. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12504	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Re: goldfish bowl

Yea, Goldfish do get a bit on the large size. Comets can top a foot long and Black Moors do get to be about 8 inches long by 3.5 inches wide. (those are the two I have kept and like among gold fishes.) Don't know of any species of Goldfish that doesn't get at least 8 inches long. My Black Moor when he passed away was about 3 pounds. Very cool guy. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Patrick" <patrickmn@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, June 21, 2005 7:26 AM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] goldfish bowl I suggest adding a 0 behind 10 (100 gallons) and make it a pond instead of a bowl. There are lots of pond and container options, even a $8 plastic pool. It will need a small filter, especially if it gets over 85°F. Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill -------Original Message------- Hi. I´m a new member and first timer aquarist. I would like to make a question. I found a offer on 10gal. bowls at a local department store, now i want to buy a couple of goldfish. What would i need, besides gravel. I´ve been told that there is no need for an air pump and water treatment, just fill up with water and introduce the fish.Right? Also, i could feed them with a mix of shredred carrots, wheat germ with any other veggie? thanks, Francisco. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12505	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Aww!

I love the little turtle on the front page. I'd love to have a little turtle or two in my tank, and a blue lobster or crayfish, too. But I really don't want them eating my cherry shrimp, ghost shrimp, or fish, and I know they would. Sigh. Maybe when my girls tire of their tanks (IF they tire of their tanks) I'll get a tank with some of those critters. :D My bettas have mated again. We put them in my big tank by themselves (actually my daughters did it while I was taking Gramma to the doctor), and there is a nice bubble nest there. IT's the first time the bubble nest has survived over night. Oddly, though, I was watching them mate, and the female seems to be tending to the babies and making bubbles, too. She and the male nudge each other almost affectionately while tending the nest. And one goes and eats bloodworms, while the other hovers around the nest. I didn't think they'd get along after the mating. Hmmm. The poor things looked exhausted while they were mating. They kept floating limply down almost to the ground before recovering. The tank is a sixty gallon tank, and they are the sole inhabitants. So the babies should be pretty safe when they hatch.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12506	From: Chris	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Re: goldfish bowl

Just keep in mind the rule of one inch per fish per gal. For a ten gal. I would recomend only one or two max. Also, you would need an air pump. Goldfish need oxigen in their water. And finaly, a small filter is also needed. With goldfish, the water gets prtty dirty with one. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, francisco fagundez <franciscofagundez@y...> wrote: > Hi. I´m a new member and first timer aquarist. I would > like to make a question. > > I found a offer on 10gal. bowls at a local department > store, now i want to buy a couple of goldfish. What > would i need, besides gravel. > I´ve been told that there is no need for an air pump > and water treatment, just fill up with water and > introduce the fish.Right? > > Also, i could feed them with a mix of shredred > carrots, wheat germ with any other veggie? > > thanks, > Francisco. > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12507	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: BioSpira rocks!

I used this on the 75 gal. (since we kept procrastinating on getting it cycled). I added it and 24 hr. later ran all the tests. They each came out great so I added the fish and they are all doing wonderfully. I wish more people knew about this stuff. I think it would help prevent fish death to those who think you can just put water in a tank then add the fish that day. This way they don't have to wait too long (they get their "near instant gratification") and the fish are OK. Yay! Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12508	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Re: Aww!

About the Bettas, not the turtles: Glad to read you have such compatable Bettas -- what you describe is not the most common behavior. Usually, the female will get chased off after spawning, mainly because she has the tendancy to eat the eggs and/or fry if given half a chance. While the family (male, female & fry) are the sole inhabitants of the 60 gallon tank, this is no assurance that all will remain safe. As the fry start free-swimming, the male usually loses interest in guarding them ( his instinct wanes) and may well start eating them. Watch for this and pull him out if necessary at that time, but not before, and the female also if you haven't done so by this time. I assume you have a green water/infusoria culture started as first food for the fry(?). If not try feeding them liquifry and ultra-fine powdered food. Most of the fry should be able to handle newly hatched brine shrimp at an early age, especially if you use the smaller San Franciso eggs rather than then larger Utah (Salt Lake) eggs. One word of caution -- You need to keep the air space above the water humid, if you're not doing this already (for ease of bubble nest maintenance), and at the same temperature as the tank water (I presume you're keeping it around 80o(?) for the next 5 to 6 weeks for proper development of the labyrinth organ of the fry, by keeping the top tightly sealed (except at feeding times). Lastly, you may find, in such a large tank, the fry having difficulty finding their food and you don't want to overfeed and foul the water. After rinsing the baby brine shrimp, you can draw them up in a baster (with some tank water) and gently direct the shrimp towards the fry for easy pickin's. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "cynthia brennemann" <brennewoman@h...> wrote: > I love the little turtle on the front page. I'd love to have a little > turtle or two in my tank, and a blue lobster or crayfish, too. But I > really don't want them eating my cherry shrimp, ghost shrimp, or fish, > and I know they would. Sigh. Maybe when my girls tire of their tanks > (IF they tire of their tanks) I'll get a tank with some of those > critters. :D > > My bettas have mated again. We put them in my big tank by themselves > (actually my daughters did it while I was taking Gramma to the doctor), > and there is a nice bubble nest there. IT's the first time the bubble > nest has survived over night. Oddly, though, I was watching them mate, > and the female seems to be tending to the babies and making bubbles, > too. She and the male nudge each other almost affectionately while > tending the nest. And one goes and eats bloodworms, while the other > hovers around the nest. I didn't think they'd get along after the > mating. Hmmm. The poor things looked exhausted while they were > mating. They kept floating limply down almost to the ground before > recovering. The tank is a sixty gallon tank, and they are the sole > inhabitants. So the babies should be pretty safe when they hatch.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12509	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Re: Aww!

Thanks, Ray. :D I'll definatley follow your advice. I've got some greeny water going, and some floating plants, and I've just boiled some eggs for the yolk mix. We've got Some daphnia, brine shrimp and flake food that I pounded in a mortar with a pestle till it resembles icky flour, and I just called seaworks about some brine shrimp, newly hatched. :D I'll go ahead and put the female back in the smaller tank tomorrow afternoon, since that's when they should hatch, and then when the male looses interest, I'll put him back in the other tank, too. We've had a couple of betta 'couples' And we've also had some that couldn't tolerate each other. I'm glad these two are getting along. I just happen to have a handy turkey baster, so I'll use your idea. Should I turn off the filter when they hatch, to keep them from being sucked up in the filter? > About the Bettas, not the turtles:

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12510	From: Tricia	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Mystery snail egg clutches

Hi all, Just had a quick question. I was wondering if there was a way to remove some of the clutches safely and pass them on to family members? Seems our tank is a bit on the extremely fertile side... :-)~ Less than 2 hours after releasing the new mollies (2F, 1M) they began breeding... the first should be popping out the fry the middle of next week, and the 2nd before the end of next week. The guppy & platty fries are almost mature enough to begin their breeding..... hehehe may be able to convince hubby we need the 150gal tank soon, cause that 29 gal tank will fill up very quickly.... Thanks Tricia

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12511	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Re: Mystery snail egg clutches

yep take them off put them in a moist very moist container like a Ziploc container so that they cant get squished i recommend wrapping them in a moist paper towel.. do you know what to do with them once you move them.. or how to get them to hatch from there.. Shannon Hi all, Just had a quick question. I was wondering if there was a way to remove some of the clutches safely and pass them on to family members? Seems our tank is a bit on the extremely fertile side... :-)~ Less than 2 hours after releasing the new mollies (2F, 1M) they began breeding... the first should be popping out the fry the middle of next week, and the 2nd before the end of next week. The guppy & platty fries are almost mature enough to begin their breeding..... hehehe may be able to convince hubby we need the 150gal tank soon, cause that 29 gal tank will fill up very quickly.... Thanks Tricia [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12512	From: mommy2acdhsurvivor	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Re: Mystery snail egg clutches

Some people use a credit card or something like that to remove them from where ever they are stuck. I hatched out some clutches recently and have about 200 snails from m & m size to pin tip size. I love them they are so cute but seem to grow so slow. What color are your snails? > yep take them off put them in a moist very moist container like a Ziploc > container so that they cant get squished i recommend wrapping them in a moist > paper towel.. do you know what to do with them once you move them.. or how to > get them to hatch from there.. Shannon > > Hi all, > Just had a quick question. I was wondering if there was a way to > remove some of the clutches safely and pass them on to family members? > Seems our tank is a bit on the extremely fertile side... :-)~ > Less than 2 hours after releasing the new mollies (2F, 1M) they began > breeding... the first should be popping out the fry the middle of next > week, and the 2nd before the end of next week. The guppy & platty > fries are almost mature enough to begin their breeding..... hehehe may > be able to convince hubby we need the 150gal tank soon, cause that 29 > gal tank will fill up very quickly.... > Thanks > Tricia > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12513	From: knelson1701	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Swordtail not looking so good. Help Please

After i did my water change and tank cleaning today in my 40 gal tank. I noticed my male swordtail acting wierd. He is swimming at the top of the water slowly, tail kinda drooping down. I went to feed the fish, he did eat, but not like he normally does. All the other fish appear healthy. I have 2 female swordtails, 4 emerald cories and 4 angelfish in the tank. There is no fighting in the tank, and everyone looked healthy till today. Any ideas? A Disease, bad food, bad luck? I've had the swordtails for about a month. All of my water tests came back great. No ammonia or nitrite. Nitrate in good levels. Any help would be great. Keith

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12514	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Re: Mystery snail egg clutches

if your asking me I have a purple white/bluish and 2 canas one yellow one gold... and i have about 10 hatches right now but seems like the opposite snail always tries to knock off the others ones eggs.. anyone ever heard of that.. Shannon Some people use a credit card or something like that to remove them from where ever they are stuck. I hatched out some clutches recently and have about 200 snails from m & m size to pin tip size. I love them they are so cute but seem to grow so slow. What color are your snails? > yep take them off put them in a moist very moist container like a Ziploc > container so that they cant get squished i recommend wrapping them in a moist > paper towel.. do you know what to do with them once you move them.. or how to > get them to hatch from there.. Shannon > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12515	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Re: Mystery snail egg clutches

If possible, i am interested in pics of your mollys and plattys when pregnant. I have two at home but not sure if they are preg or just fat or worse... =Nick ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tricia" <trycya@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wednesday, June 22, 2005 9:09 AM Subject: [AquaticLife] Mystery snail egg clutches > Hi all, > Just had a quick question. I was wondering if there was a way to > remove some of the clutches safely and pass them on to family members? > Seems our tank is a bit on the extremely fertile side... :-)~ > Less than 2 hours after releasing the new mollies (2F, 1M) they began > breeding... the first should be popping out the fry the middle of next > week, and the 2nd before the end of next week. The guppy & platty > fries are almost mature enough to begin their breeding..... hehehe may > be able to convince hubby we need the 150gal tank soon, cause that 29 > gal tank will fill up very quickly.... > Thanks > Tricia > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12516	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Re: goldfish bowl

Any one had luck mixing a goldfish/comet/black moor with tropical fish? I'm keeping ph7, 24 deg C. =Nick ----- Original Message ----- From: "The Dragon Hunter" <dragon.hunter@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wednesday, June 22, 2005 3:21 AM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] goldfish bowl > Yea, Goldfish do get a bit on the large size. Comets can top a foot long > and Black Moors do get to be about 8 inches long by 3.5 inches wide. > (those > are the two I have kept and like among gold fishes.) Don't know of any > species of Goldfish that doesn't get at least 8 inches long. My Black > Moor > when he passed away was about 3 pounds. Very cool guy. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Patrick" <patrickmn@...> > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Tuesday, June 21, 2005 7:26 AM > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] goldfish bowl > > > I suggest adding a 0 behind 10 (100 gallons) and make it a pond instead of > a > bowl. There are lots of pond and container options, even a $8 plastic > pool. > It will need a small filter, especially if it gets over 85°F. > > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy. > > "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it > is > perhaps, the end of the beginning." > -Winston Churchill > -------Original Message------- > Hi. I´m a new member and first timer aquarist. I would > like to make a question. > > I found a offer on 10gal. bowls at a local department > store, now i want to buy a couple of goldfish. What > would i need, besides gravel. > I´ve been told that there is no need for an air pump > and water treatment, just fill up with water and > introduce the fish.Right? > > Also, i could feed them with a mix of shredred > carrots, wheat germ with any other veggie? > > thanks, > Francisco. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12517	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Substrate Heaters

http://aquaticconcepts.thekrib.com/Setups/index.htm It seams that a few people these days are using Substrate Heaters. Has any one from the list experienced any benifit by using this? Another website said it was supposed to stop some kind of bacteria from eating away at the plant base. =Nick [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12518	From: Amanda	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Mississippi Map baby(cute) & My Crayfish(?)

Is that a Mississippi Map baby on the home page. I have 2 baby Mississippi maps, but neither of them have such light coloring on the belly. They do have very different markings though. Guess it is just b/c they are from different parents. Just wanted to make sure that is what it was. They make such a great pet. I also have a Yellow Bellied Slider. I will try to get some better pics of them soon, but if you would like to see them, there are some pics under Mandy's Pics. P.S. My crayfish's eggs have started to hatch, but they aren't staying attached to her when they do hatch. I though they where supposed to. Either way, the tiny things are running around the tank, and I have at least 70+ more to wait for. (I am only counting 15 in the tank, and she is still COVERED in eggs.) I guess puff will be eating good once they get some size on them. Does anyone know why they aren't staying attached to her?? Will they survive? They are in a tank with nothing but a few small(baby) feeder guppies, and 2 ghost shrimp. Thanks!! Mandy

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12519	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Re: Mystery snail egg clutches

I have the golden ones... slow growers? The 3 original ones I started with less than 3 mos ago have more than tripled in size! I have already had 4 clutches hatch in the last mo. and the smallest (less than a week old) is about pin-head size, but the others are 1/2 M & M size and up! Seems no sooner does the clutches start hatching and the mating starts again, by the time 1/2 the clutch is hatched there is a new one.... sheeeesh. gotta work harder on the hubby for the larger tank. ----- Original Message ----- From: mommy2acdhsurvivor To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, June 21, 2005 4:35 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Mystery snail egg clutches Some people use a credit card or something like that to remove them from where ever they are stuck. I hatched out some clutches recently and have about 200 snails from m & m size to pin tip size. I love them they are so cute but seem to grow so slow. What color are your snails? > yep take them off put them in a moist very moist container like a Ziploc > container so that they cant get squished i recommend wrapping them in a moist > paper towel.. do you know what to do with them once you move them.. or how to > get them to hatch from there.. Shannon > > Hi all, > Just had a quick question. I was wondering if there was a way to > remove some of the clutches safely and pass them on to family members? > Seems our tank is a bit on the extremely fertile side... :-)~ > Less than 2 hours after releasing the new mollies (2F, 1M) they began > breeding... the first should be popping out the fry the middle of next > week, and the 2nd before the end of next week. The guppy & platty > fries are almost mature enough to begin their breeding..... hehehe may > be able to convince hubby we need the 150gal tank soon, cause that 29 > gal tank will fill up very quickly.... > Thanks > Tricia > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12520	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Re: Mystery snail egg clutches

That I do not, but now that I know it is possible to do I will be doing some research on how to do it safely. ----- Original Message ----- From: agentscullyeyore@... To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, June 21, 2005 4:30 PM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Mystery snail egg clutches yep take them off put them in a moist very moist container like a Ziploc container so that they cant get squished i recommend wrapping them in a moist paper towel.. do you know what to do with them once you move them.. or how to get them to hatch from there.. Shannon Hi all, Just had a quick question. I was wondering if there was a way to remove some of the clutches safely and pass them on to family members? Seems our tank is a bit on the extremely fertile side... :-)~ Less than 2 hours after releasing the new mollies (2F, 1M) they began breeding... the first should be popping out the fry the middle of next week, and the 2nd before the end of next week. The guppy & platty fries are almost mature enough to begin their breeding..... hehehe may be able to convince hubby we need the 150gal tank soon, cause that 29 gal tank will fill up very quickly.... Thanks Tricia [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12521	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Re: Mystery snail egg clutches

Wish I could send pics, but I still haven't learned how to get the pics to come out w/o the blur.... right now the Mollies are the only preggies, at least for a few more days. ----- Original Message ----- From: Nicolas Munro To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, June 21, 2005 6:57 PM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Mystery snail egg clutches If possible, i am interested in pics of your mollys and plattys when pregnant. I have two at home but not sure if they are preg or just fat or worse... =Nick ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tricia" <trycya@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wednesday, June 22, 2005 9:09 AM Subject: [AquaticLife] Mystery snail egg clutches > Hi all, > Just had a quick question. I was wondering if there was a way to > remove some of the clutches safely and pass them on to family members? > Seems our tank is a bit on the extremely fertile side... :-)~ > Less than 2 hours after releasing the new mollies (2F, 1M) they began > breeding... the first should be popping out the fry the middle of next > week, and the 2nd before the end of next week. The guppy & platty > fries are almost mature enough to begin their breeding..... hehehe may > be able to convince hubby we need the 150gal tank soon, cause that 29 > gal tank will fill up very quickly.... > Thanks > Tricia > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12522	From: Nan	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Re: Female betta turning colors

I would strongly urge you to do some research before attempting to breed your bettas. Certain requirements need to be met so that they are healthy. And another question: you successfully breed your bettas and you end up with 50-500 fry, what are you going to do with them? Good Luck! Nan Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote: i've never bred bettas, but i do remember hearing that the female's submissive stripes are vertical and stress lines are horizontal. or i could have that backwards or even completely wrong. from what i've heard, breeding bettas isn't necessarily hard but you need to monitor them to make sure to separate the 2 if necessary. but i'm sure there are people on this group who are far more knowledgeable than i am about betta breeding. or you can try the fish forums in the betta section. people there are extremely knowledgeable. fishforums.net. good luck! --- Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: > Whoops. He had one going but I messed it up when I moved him out of the > tank. He still does that though even in his smaller habitat. I have > put the two next to eachother so that they can see each other. When she > does the stripes again, I will do as suggested and see if we can get > some baby bettas. My kids would love that. > So I'm looking for vertical stripes to tell when she is ready? She is > staying that darker color and only turns pale when I remove him from her > sight. > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez > Sent: Monday, June 20, 2005 2:15 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Female betta turning colors > > > yep, that's it! > > --- Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: > > > A bubble nest? Like a big clump of floating bubbles on the top of the > > > water? > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs! Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter --------------------------------- Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12523	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Re: Female betta turning colors

50-500 huh? I've not heard of numbers anywhere near that high. Fortunately I have lots of friends and extra fish tanks that the little guys could go to. I don't do anything without researching it first. I know what is required. And if I did make the educated decision to breed my betas, I would know exactly what to and not to do. =) That's why I'm a member of groups such as this. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nan Sent: Tuesday, June 21, 2005 9:55 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Female betta turning colors I would strongly urge you to do some research before attempting to breed your bettas. Certain requirements need to be met so that they are healthy. And another question: you successfully breed your bettas and you end up with 50-500 fry, what are you going to do with them? Good Luck! Nan Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote: i've never bred bettas, but i do remember hearing that the female's submissive stripes are vertical and stress lines are horizontal. or i could have that backwards or even completely wrong. from what i've heard, breeding bettas isn't necessarily hard but you need to monitor them to make sure to separate the 2 if necessary. but i'm sure there are people on this group who are far more knowledgeable than i am about betta breeding. or you can try the fish forums in the betta section. people there are extremely knowledgeable. fishforums.net. good luck! --- Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: > Whoops. He had one going but I messed it up when I moved him out of > the tank. He still does that though even in his smaller habitat. I > have put the two next to eachother so that they can see each other. > When she does the stripes again, I will do as suggested and see if we > can get some baby bettas. My kids would love that. So I'm looking for > vertical stripes to tell when she is ready? She is staying that > darker color and only turns pale when I remove him from her sight. > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez > Sent: Monday, June 20, 2005 2:15 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Female betta turning colors > > > yep, that's it! > > --- Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: > > > A bubble nest? Like a big clump of floating bubbles on the top of > > the > > > water? > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs! Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter --------------------------------- Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12524	From: mommy2acdhsurvivor	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Re: Aww!

Thanks his name is instein (I'm sure I spelt that wrong) and our other turtle is albert. My husband named them! I bought them for my mom as a birthday present but had to keep them at my house until she came to visit. Well my hubby got attached and said she couldn't have them and he's had them ever since. I've never found baby that cheap again. They are very neat pets but yup definatly eat fish. One of the turtles bit my fishes lip so I had to take him out lucky his is all better but now has a crooked mouth. They love crickets so I assume they would love to eat shrimp. > I love the little turtle on the front page. I'd love to have a little > turtle or two in my tank, and a blue lobster or crayfish, too. But I > really don't want them eating my cherry shrimp, ghost shrimp, or fish, > and I know they would. Sigh. Maybe when my girls tire of their tanks > (IF they tire of their tanks) I'll get a tank with some of those > critters. :D

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12525	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Re: Mystery snail egg clutches

well if you want me to help you i do it all the time i would be glad to help.. Shannon at I do not, but now that I know it is possible to do I will be doing some research on how to do it safely. ----- Original Message ----- From: agentscullyeyore@... To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, June 21, 2005 4:30 PM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Mystery snail egg clutches yep take them off put them in a moist very moist container like a Ziploc container so that they cant get squished i recommend wrapping them in a moist paper towel.. do you know what to do with them once you move them.. or how to get them to hatch from there.. Shannon [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12526	From: paul helms	Date: 6/21/2005
Subject: Re: goldfish bowl

yes, black mohrs all the time --- Nicolas Munro <nmunro@...> wrote: > Any one had luck mixing a goldfish/comet/black moor > with tropical fish? > > I'm keeping ph7, 24 deg C. > > =Nick > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "The Dragon Hunter" > <dragon.hunter@...> > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Wednesday, June 22, 2005 3:21 AM > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] goldfish bowl > > > > Yea, Goldfish do get a bit on the large size. > Comets can top a foot long > > and Black Moors do get to be about 8 inches long > by 3.5 inches wide. > > (those > > are the two I have kept and like among gold > fishes.) Don't know of any > > species of Goldfish that doesn't get at least 8 > inches long. My Black > > Moor > > when he passed away was about 3 pounds. Very cool > guy. > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Patrick" <patrickmn@...> > > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > > Sent: Tuesday, June 21, 2005 7:26 AM > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] goldfish bowl > > > > > > I suggest adding a 0 behind 10 (100 gallons) and > make it a pond instead of > > a > > bowl. There are lots of pond and container > options, even a $8 plastic > > pool. > > It will need a small filter, especially if it gets > over 85°F. > > > > > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy. > > > > "Now this is not the end. It is not even the > beginning of the end. But it > > is > > perhaps, the end of the beginning." > > -Winston Churchill > > -------Original Message------- > > Hi. I´m a new member and first timer aquarist. I > would > > like to make a question. > > > > I found a offer on 10gal. bowls at a local > department > > store, now i want to buy a couple of goldfish. > What > > would i need, besides gravel. > > I´ve been told that there is no need for an air > pump > > and water treatment, just fill up with water and > > introduce the fish.Right? > > > > Also, i could feed them with a mix of shredred > > carrots, wheat germ with any other veggie? > > > > thanks, > > Francisco. > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > when replying, thanks > > . > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text > that is not important to > > the reply and if changing the topic of the > original message modify the > > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <-, we Thank You > > in Advance for your help in this matter > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > when replying, thanks > > . > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text > that is not important to > > the reply and if changing the topic of the > original message modify the > > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <-, we Thank You > > in Advance for your help in this matter > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12527	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 6/22/2005
Subject: Re: Aww!

Cynthia, I see you're somwhat prepared already with the green water and hard boiled egg yolk. The egg yolk is a great first food -- you just "strain" it (push it) through a handkerchief for real fine particles. Be careful with it as it can foul the water very easily. While some folks like snails and others do not, here is one time they'll more than earn their keep. Try adding some apple snails to the tank to help clean up the excess food. Daphnia (even "sifted" Daphnia) will be too large for the fry until they get a few weeks old. I'm not familiar with seaworks, but you will need to hatch brine shrimp daily as soon as the fry are able to handle it. I don't know what kind of filter you have, but in general I'd have to say yes, definitely turn off the filter if there's any danger that the fry will get sucked up into it, which is probable in most cases. If you have an outside power filter that's adjustable, you can try turning it to as low a setting as you can, and rubber band a piece of old nylon stocking to the inlet tube opening(s). If you have an inside box filter, wrap it in a piece of nylon stocking. Best bet by far in this case however, is to use an inside sponge filter -- it does a great job in the fry tank, it can't suck them up and the fry will be seen picking at it in short time to get small food particles. Reasons why you need to hatch brine shrimp daily is (1) they'll only live about two days unless they're fed (yeast and/or green water) and given room, (2) if they're fed they'll be too large for the fry after 3 days, (3) most nutrition is available from them as soon as they hatch as they use up most of their stored reserves by the next day. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "cynthia brennemann" <brennewoman@h...> wrote: > Thanks, Ray. :D I'll definatley follow your advice. I've got some > greeny water going, and some floating plants, and I've just boiled some > eggs for the yolk mix. We've got Some daphnia, brine shrimp and flake > food that I pounded in a mortar with a pestle till it resembles icky > flour, and I just called seaworks about some brine shrimp, newly > hatched. :D I'll go ahead and put the female back in the smaller tank > tomorrow afternoon, since that's when they should hatch, and then when > the male looses interest, I'll put him back in the other tank, too. > We've had a couple of betta 'couples' And we've also had some that > couldn't tolerate each other. I'm glad these two are getting along. I > just happen to have a handy turkey baster, so I'll use your idea. > Should I turn off the filter when they hatch, to keep them from being > sucked up in the filter? > > > About the Bettas, not the turtles:

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12528	From: pam phetteplace	Date: 6/22/2005
Subject: Need advice with angel fish....she has worms (?)

Hi One of my angelfish hasnt eaten for over a week now. After much research I have come to the conclusion that she has some sort of internal parasite (perhaps from feeding black worms?). The 4 other angels in the 55 gal. are eating fine and spawning twice a week. She is passing large clumps of white stuff. It isnt shaped like normal feces, it is sort of like globs. I have looked at it under my microscope, but that hasnt helped me much. I put her in a treatment tank 2 days ago and treated her with jungles "parasite clear". After about 16 hours she looked very distressed and her breathing lef me to believe she was going to die so I took her out and put her in a tank with no medicine. She is now passing more white globs. She still wont eat, even though I soaked in garlic oil. Does anyone have experience with this or perhaps know a link that talks about what I have described? Thanks Pam --------------------------------- Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12529	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 6/22/2005
Subject: Re: Need advice with angel fish....she has worms (?)

Hi Pam. You are correct in assuming your Angel has an internal parasite. Normally, I would recommend Kanamycin or Metronidazole, but I see this is going on for over a week. So, as not to use any more time now than is necessary, I would recommend Clout which should clear this up shortly if the stomach has not been damaged too much. Its more probable of this disease coming from Tubifex worms, although uncleaned Blackworms may cause this occasionally. You're much safer feeding them frozen Bloodworms. Insufficient water changes will bring this on as well. Ideally, while most hobbyists don't go this far (they should), Angels do best with water changes every other day. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, pam phetteplace <pamphetteplace@y...> wrote: > > Hi > > One of my angelfish hasnt eaten for over a week now. After much research I have come to the conclusion that she has some sort of internal parasite (perhaps from feeding black worms?). The 4 other angels in the 55 gal. are eating fine and spawning twice a week. > > She is passing large clumps of white stuff. It isnt shaped like normal feces, it is sort of like globs. I have looked at it under my microscope, but that hasnt helped me much. > > I put her in a treatment tank 2 days ago and treated her with jungles "parasite clear". After about 16 hours she looked very distressed and her breathing lef me to believe she was going to die so I took her out and put her in a tank with no medicine. She is now passing more white globs. She still wont eat, even though I soaked in garlic oil. > > Does anyone have experience with this or perhaps know a link that talks about what I have described? > > Thanks > > Pam > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Sports > Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12530	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/22/2005
Subject: Re: Need advice with angel fish....? About the white globs...

Speaking of white globs...I frequently see white mucusy looking strands floating around the tank. The are almost like the white of a raw egg but also have a glob in the midst of the strand? What is this and should I be worried? Everyone is eating well, moving fine, etc... -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Wednesday, June 22, 2005 11:37 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Need advice with angel fish....she has worms (?) Hi Pam. You are correct in assuming your Angel has an internal parasite. Normally, I would recommend Kanamycin or Metronidazole, but I see this is going on for over a week. So, as not to use any more time now than is necessary, I would recommend Clout which should clear this up shortly if the stomach has not been damaged too much. Its more probable of this disease coming from Tubifex worms, although uncleaned Blackworms may cause this occasionally. You're much safer feeding them frozen Bloodworms. Insufficient water changes will bring this on as well. Ideally, while most hobbyists don't go this far (they should), Angels do best with water changes every other day. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, pam phetteplace <pamphetteplace@y...> wrote: > > Hi > > One of my angelfish hasnt eaten for over a week now. After much research I have come to the conclusion that she has some sort of internal parasite (perhaps from feeding black worms?). The 4 other angels in the 55 gal. are eating fine and spawning twice a week. > > She is passing large clumps of white stuff. It isnt shaped like normal feces, it is sort of like globs. I have looked at it under my microscope, but that hasnt helped me much. > > I put her in a treatment tank 2 days ago and treated her with jungles "parasite clear". After about 16 hours she looked very distressed and her breathing lef me to believe she was going to die so I took her out and put her in a tank with no medicine. She is now passing more white globs. She still wont eat, even though I soaked in garlic oil. > > Does anyone have experience with this or perhaps know a link that talks about what I have described? > > Thanks > > Pam > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Sports > Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12531	From: Karen	Date: 6/22/2005
Subject: Re: BioSpira rocks!

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" <amjmail@c...> wrote: Bio Spira is good stuff. It's been off the market for about a year I guess. The manufacturer had to take all the old stuff off the shelves and make new. It now requires special refridgeration while shipping and the retailer must have special refridgeration to keep it as well. It has a very short shelf life. Glad you found it and it worked well for you. > I used this on the 75 gal. (since we kept procrastinating on getting it > cycled). I added it and 24 hr. later ran all the tests. They each came > out great so I added the fish and they are all doing wonderfully. > I wish more people knew about this stuff. I think it would help prevent > fish death to those who think you can just put water in a tank then add > the fish that day. This way they don't have to wait too long (they get > their "near instant gratification") and the fish are OK. > > Yay! > > Leslie > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12532	From: kathygothreau	Date: 6/22/2005
Subject: Cloudy Water

Hello... I am new to the group and a new goldfish owner. I have two shebunkins that I purchased 4-5 months ago when they were very tiny...they are now 5-6 inches long and very active, very colorful and always seem hungry. I have them in a 10 gallon tank with a Penguin 100 filter with a bio- wheel and I have a medium-size rectangular bubble stone in the tank as well. I have glass marbles (the kind that are used in vases) on the bottom of the tank instead of gravel (don't know if this is not good). My question is even though I siphon the bottom of the tank once a week, squeegie the inside of the glass at least once a week and replace evaporated water at least 3 times a week and remove I would say 30% of the water and replace it with clean water once a week, the tank always looks cloudy. My Ph level is 6.5 to 7.0 and I test at least once per week. I am going strictly by a couple of books that I bought at the pet store when I bought the goldies. I am very unsure how much food to feed the Chester and Charlie. I might be overfeeding them? I feed Tetra Fin flakes, Tetra Fin goldfish crisps, Hikari freeze-dried brine shrimp and Wardley Total SpectraMax (rotate them for variety). Any light anyone can shed on my cloudy water problem will certainly be appreciated!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12533	From: Karen	Date: 6/22/2005
Subject: Re: gravel

Just curious, what kind of fish will you be keeping? Gravel is such a hassle to clean and keep clean. I know you've already done the work, but did you consider sand for a substrate? I didn't think you would be keeping just tetras in a 150 gl tank. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > I am about 2 weeks away from setting up my new aquarium. (I feel like a kid > waiting to go on a trip to Disney World) YEAH! > > I have been collecting my supplies and equipment for the past two months > now, while we are waiting to close on our old house. I have everything that I > can purchase for under $100, including a 10 gallon hospital tank that is close > to being cycled in. My hospital tank has gravel and a large piece of wood > in it as well as six glowlight tetras.. > > I have collected approximately 175 pounds of gravel (pea gravel from Home > Depot, two different colors of aquarium gravel, and some small red flint > gravel) for my tank. I washed it already, as the pea gravel that I got from Home > Depot was very dirty. I am storing it in five gallon pails in my garage with > covers ajar on them so they can breath and dry out. I "turn" the gravel a > couple times a week so it is not getting moldy or fungussy (how do you like > that word!) > > My question is this: Because a lot of the gravel is still wet, do you think > that I will need to rinse the gravel again before putting it in my aquarium > or do you think that it safe to just add it to the tank? > > Also, when I get my new tank set up, should I use the gravel and the piece > of wood from my hospital tank? Won't that help the new 150 gallon tank cycle > in faster? > > Linda > River Falls, WI > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12535	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 6/22/2005
Subject: We have BABIES! :-D

They are SO cute and teeny tiny! I feel so sorry for the male betta, I just know he hasn't slept since the eggs were laid, and now the babies keep wiggling out of their bubbles and he keeps taking them back up. Poor daddy. I put some bloodworms and daphia near the bubble nest so he could eat if he wanted to, and I put a few drops of the egg yolk- green water mixture in around the area...how soon will the babies begin feeding? Should I leave the aquarium light on all night so he can see to rescue the babies?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12536	From: paul helms	Date: 6/22/2005
Subject: Re: Cloudy Water

it looks cloudy becaus eyou are overcleaning the tank and the bacteria is trying to reproduce to keep up. the cloud is bacterial blooms. --- kathygothreau <kkhome@...> wrote: > Hello... > > I am new to the group and a new goldfish owner. I > have two > shebunkins that I purchased 4-5 months ago when they > were very > tiny...they are now 5-6 inches long and very active, > very colorful > and always seem hungry. > > I have them in a 10 gallon tank with a Penguin 100 > filter with a bio- > wheel and I have a medium-size rectangular bubble > stone in the tank > as well. I have glass marbles (the kind that are > used in vases) on > the bottom of the tank instead of gravel (don't know > if this is not > good). > > My question is even though I siphon the bottom of > the tank once a > week, squeegie the inside of the glass at least once > a week and > replace evaporated water at least 3 times a week and > remove I would > say 30% of the water and replace it with clean water > once a week, > the tank always looks cloudy. My Ph level is 6.5 to > 7.0 and I test > at least once per week. I am going strictly by a > couple of books > that I bought at the pet store when I bought the > goldies. > > I am very unsure how much food to feed the Chester > and Charlie. I > might be overfeeding them? I feed Tetra Fin flakes, > Tetra Fin > goldfish crisps, Hikari freeze-dried brine shrimp > and Wardley Total > SpectraMax (rotate them for variety). > > Any light anyone can shed on my cloudy water problem > will certainly > be appreciated! > > > > ____________________________________________________ Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12537	From: wendie	Date: 6/22/2005
Subject: Re: BioSpira rocks!

I used it back in March with excellent results. Wendie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Karen Sent: Wednesday, June 22, 2005 4:18 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: BioSpira rocks! --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" <amjmail@c...> wrote: Bio Spira is good stuff. It's been off the market for about a year I guess. The manufacturer had to take all the old stuff off the shelves and make new. It now requires special refridgeration while shipping and the retailer must have special refridgeration to keep it as well. It has a very short shelf life. Glad you found it and it worked well for you. > I used this on the 75 gal. (since we kept procrastinating on getting it > cycled). I added it and 24 hr. later ran all the tests. They each came > out great so I added the fish and they are all doing wonderfully. > I wish more people knew about this stuff. I think it would help prevent > fish death to those who think you can just put water in a tank then add > the fish that day. This way they don't have to wait too long (they get > their "near instant gratification") and the fish are OK. > > Yay! > > Leslie > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- Yahoo! Groups Links a.. To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12538	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/22/2005
Subject: Re: Substrate Heaters

Nick, Substrate heaters are, or were, very much in vogue with the aquatic plant people. The claim was that the plants would grow better if there was an even distribution of heat through the substrate. Since I have not been following the latest, greatest from that segment of the hobby for some time, I really don't know what, if any, other claims are being made. I do think there may be some benefit to substrate heating in that some water movement will occur within the substrate, which will then discourage the growth of anaerobic bacteria, and this may be what the website you saw was alluding to, but looking for a good spin to sell the substrate heaters, which, as I recall, are a good deal more expensive than the heaters we normally use in tanks. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nicolas Munro Sent: Tuesday, June 21, 2005 10:36 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Substrate Heaters http://aquaticconcepts.thekrib.com/Setups/index.htm It seams that a few people these days are using Substrate Heaters. Has any one from the list experienced any benifit by using this? Another website said it was supposed to stop some kind of bacteria from eating away at the plant base. =Nick [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12539	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 6/22/2005
Subject: Re: gravel

In a message dated 6/22/2005 4:46:02 P.M. Central Standard Time, oilfield_brat@... writes: Just curious, what kind of fish will you be keeping? Gravel is such a hassle to clean and keep clean. I know you've already done the work, but did you consider sand for a substrate? I didn't think you would be keeping just tetras in a 150 gl tank. I will be keeping angels, keyholes, dwarf gouramis, corys and a large school of tetras. I found some very fine gravel that I like very much at a local fish store. I have washed 75 pounds of that stuff and 120 pounds of the Home Depot pea gravel. I think that the gravel has a nice look and texture. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12540	From: Nan	Date: 6/22/2005
Subject: Sand

I have a quickish question: I want to add sand to my tanks, I have looked in my LFS/LPS and they don't have it. Where else can I get it, or can I use local sand like from the river? And how the heck do you "vaccumn" the substrate to keep your tank up? Thanks Nan

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12541	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 6/22/2005
Subject: Re: We have BABIES! :-D

The fry will not eat at this stage -- they have a yolk sack right now from which they absorb their nutrients. They'll start eating when they are free-swimming, which will be from two to three days after they hatched, depending upon the water temperature. While you don't need to leave the aquarium light on all night, some light would help - - like a table lamp near the tank, just so he can get any straglers that happen to fall out of the nest. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "cynthia brennemann" <brennewoman@h...> wrote: > They are SO cute and teeny tiny! I feel so sorry for the male betta, > I just know he hasn't slept since the eggs were laid, and now the > babies keep wiggling out of their bubbles and he keeps taking them back > up. Poor daddy. I put some bloodworms and daphia near the bubble nest > so he could eat if he wanted to, and I put a few drops of the egg yolk- > green water mixture in around the area...how soon will the babies begin > feeding? Should I leave the aquarium light on all night so he can see > to rescue the babies?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12542	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 6/22/2005
Subject: Re: Mystery snail egg clutches

Thanks, I will keep ya in mind once the family members' tanks are ready, although if all goes well I may get the bigger tank sooner.... MM & MP, '73 Tricia, KG6PNC If you want to make friends world wide click the link below!! One catch it is not a program that is supported buy windows 98 yet http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12543	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 6/22/2005
Subject: Re: We have BABIES! :-D

The water and air are at 80 degrees, the lid is down so there is plenty of humidity. So in two days start giving them their infusoria and egg yolk? Is that about the time the male betta will just give up and stop taking care of them, too? > The fry will not eat at this stage -- they have a yolk sack right now > from which they absorb their nutrients. They'll start eating when > they are free-swimming, which will be from two to three days after > they hatched, depending upon the water temperature. While you don't > need to leave the aquarium light on all night, some light would help - > - like a table lamp near the tank, just so he can get any straglers > that happen to fall out of the nest. Ray

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12544	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 6/23/2005
Subject: Re: We have BABIES! :-D

If they are free-swimming at that time then yes, start feeding them then. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "cynthia brennemann" <brennewoman@h...> wrote: So in two days start giving them their infusoria and egg > yolk? Is that about the time the male betta will just give up and stop > taking care of them, too? ---- Yup, his job will be done, his protective instinct may start disappearing and he may decide its now snack time. Ray

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12545	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 6/23/2005
Subject: Re: Sand

Nan, Don't use local river sand as you might bring in unwanted creatures. It would be best to visit a swimming pool outlet and ask them for sand that goes in the filters. Its a little more costly but I find it looks better and is a little bigger then Playsand you can get at your local hardware store. You could also go the Playsand route, Kmart,Lowes,Home Depot, Most Ace hardware stores carry Playsand for sandboxes, etc. This is a nice white sand but does need rinsed well.. The LFS and hardware store have a lot of things in common especially if you start going the DIY ( do it yourself ) route. hope this helps rob Indiana In a message dated 6/22/2005 9:27:46 PM US Eastern Standard Time, ntalb00@... writes: > I have a quickish question: I want to add sand to my tanks, I have > looked in my LFS/LPS and they don't have it. Where else can I get it, > or can I use local sand like from the river? And how the heck do > you "vaccumn" the substrate to keep your tank up? > > Thanks > > Nan > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12546	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 6/23/2005
Subject: Re: Sand (how to vaccum)

ooops forgot to mention how to vaccum :-) take your substrate vaccum lightly over the top fo the sand it will suck all the gunk off, as sand compacts there is no room for the mulm and other debri to work itself down into it and get stuck. You will suck up a little sand but thats common. Don't worry about it.. You will have to stir, or sift your sand once in awhile to make sure you don't get dead spot or pockets of gasses. I keep a few corry cats ( 5 or 6 tanks ) and I use just a small hand full in a 10 gallon tank, they are always sifting through it down to the glass, and moving it around looking for food, but if you have any depth at all to your sand it will need to be stirred every now and then.. rob Indiana In a message dated 6/23/2005 5:55:04 AM US Eastern Standard Time, FortWayneFish@... writes: > Nan, > > Don't use local river sand as you might bring in unwanted creatures. > It would be best to visit a swimming pool outlet and ask them for sand that > goes in the filters. Its a little more costly but I find it looks better and > is > a little bigger then Playsand you can get at your local hardware store. > You could also go the Playsand route, Kmart,Lowes,Home Depot, Most Ace > hardware stores carry Playsand for sandboxes, etc. This is a nice white > sand but > does need rinsed well.. > The LFS and hardware store have a lot of things in common especially if you > start going the DIY ( do it yourself ) route. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12547	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 6/23/2005
Subject: Re: Sand (how to vaccum)

Is it everyone's experience that goldfish (Moors to be exact) don't do well in aquariums with a sand substrate? I had my heart set on using a thin sand layer in a new 75 with just some driftwood and rocks with plants attached -- going for a rock garden type effect. =) Should I just resign myself to "turtle rocks" gravel? Any other ideas for some good 'fish shui?' Vicky [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12548	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 6/23/2005
Subject: Re: Sand (how to vaccum)

Since goldfish are so messy and secrete such large volumes of ammonia in there waste , I'd say go with a small pea gravel, it would make vaccuming your 75 gallon tank 2x a week a lot easier. The waste and excess food will stay more or less ontop of the gravel and should be easily vaccumed off. If you use large turtle rocks, the debri and waste will get stuck down in between them and make cleaning the tank harder. Just my opinion rob In a message dated 6/23/2005 6:13:46 AM US Eastern Standard Time, seleya8@... writes: > Is it everyone's experience that goldfish (Moors to be exact) don't do well > > in aquariums with a sand substrate? I had my heart set on using a thin sand > > layer in a new 75 with just some driftwood and rocks with plants attached -- > > going for a rock garden type effect. =) > > Should I just resign myself to "turtle rocks" gravel? Any other ideas for > some good 'fish shui?' > > Vicky > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12549	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 6/23/2005
Subject: Re: Sand (how to vaccum)

In a message dated 6/23/2005 7:21:08 AM Eastern Standard Time, FortWayneFish@... writes: The waste and excess food will stay more or less ontop of the gravel and should be easily vaccumed off. If you use large turtle rocks, the debri and waste will get stuck down in between them and make cleaning the tank harder. The turtle rocks I referenced are bagged with that name. =) They are actually small, very rounded, natural gravel. The various goldfish I've had have all been pretty busy rummagers on the bottom so I can see how they would really kick up the sand. With my luck, after a few water changes there'd be bare spots from siphoning too much sand. =/ I think the 'turtle rocks' are a good size for them, I was just hoping for a different effect. Thanks! Vicky [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12550	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 6/23/2005
Subject: Re: Sand (how to vaccum)

Can't say about sand as none of my aquariums have sand, but my black moor did great with wonder rock and volcanit. ----- Original Message ----- From: <seleya8@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2005 4:13 AM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Sand (how to vaccum) > Is it everyone's experience that goldfish (Moors to be exact) don't do well > in aquariums with a sand substrate? I had my heart set on using a thin sand > layer in a new 75 with just some driftwood and rocks with plants attached -- > going for a rock garden type effect. =) > > Should I just resign myself to "turtle rocks" gravel? Any other ideas for > some good 'fish shui?' > > Vicky > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12551	From: knelson1701	Date: 6/23/2005
Subject: Re: Swordtail not looking so good. Help Please

well, no one responded. He's dead now --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "knelson1701" <knelson1701@y...> wrote: > After i did my water change and tank cleaning today in my 40 gal tank. > I noticed my male swordtail acting wierd. He is swimming at the top of > the water slowly, tail kinda drooping down. I went to feed the fish, > he did eat, but not like he normally does. All the other fish appear > healthy. I have 2 female swordtails, 4 emerald cories and 4 angelfish > in the tank. There is no fighting in the tank, and everyone looked > healthy till today. Any ideas? A Disease, bad food, bad luck? I've > had the swordtails for about a month. All of my water tests came back > great. No ammonia or nitrite. Nitrate in good levels. Any help would > be great. > > Keith

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12552	From: pam phetteplace	Date: 6/23/2005
Subject: Thank you Stan

Thank you Stan for the reply re: my angel. She is currently being treated in a hospital tank. I wanted to ask you if you knew what is the white stuff she is passing? Is it a good sign if I see worms and white stuff ? I wish she would eat something. I did not see much information on this subject online. Do you have a favorite indepth online site for info re: angels. Do freeze dried tubifex worms carry parasites? I have always washed my black worms off before feeding them, but am seriously thinking about stopping all live food, which is something I hate to do. Would you recommend treating her tankmates (another 4 angels) and a pleco. PP --------------------------------- Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12553	From: pamphetteplace	Date: 6/23/2005
Subject: Purple Bettas

I posted pics of my one of my pairs of purple bettas, under the folder titled "Pam's Purple Bettas". Will try to get pics of the other 2 in there soon. Pam

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12554	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/23/2005
Subject: Re: Swordtail not looking so good. Help Please

I'm so sorry he died. Usually if someone doesn't respond, it's because they don't have anything to offer that certain situation. They also usually respond to something with more details regarding the fish (ie spots, thinning, any abnormal physical traits.) That helps to give some ideas. I'm sorry the group wasn't able to help aid with your fish. Don't give up on us though. The people are really great and have seen me through some really awful times with my fish. I'm really very sorry about your swordtail. Leslie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of knelson1701 Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2005 12:21 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Swordtail not looking so good. Help Please well, no one responded. He's dead now --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "knelson1701" <knelson1701@y...> wrote: > After i did my water change and tank cleaning today in my 40 gal tank. > I noticed my male swordtail acting wierd. He is swimming at the top of > the water slowly, tail kinda drooping down. I went to feed the fish, > he did eat, but not like he normally does. All the other fish appear > healthy. I have 2 female swordtails, 4 emerald cories and 4 angelfish > in the tank. There is no fighting in the tank, and everyone looked > healthy till today. Any ideas? A Disease, bad food, bad luck? I've > had the swordtails for about a month. All of my water tests came back > great. No ammonia or nitrite. Nitrate in good levels. Any help would > be great. > > Keith Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12555	From: knelson1701	Date: 6/23/2005
Subject: Re: Swordtail not looking so good. Help Please

Thank you Leslie. :) --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > I'm so sorry he died. Usually if someone doesn't respond, it's because > they don't have anything to offer that certain situation. They also > usually respond to something with more details regarding the fish (ie > spots, thinning, any abnormal physical traits.) That helps to give some > ideas. > > I'm sorry the group wasn't able to help aid with your fish. Don't give > up on us though. The people are really great and have seen me through > some really awful times with my fish. I'm really very sorry about your > swordtail. > > Leslie > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of knelson1701 > Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2005 12:21 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Swordtail not looking so good. Help Please > > > well, no one responded. He's dead now > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "knelson1701" <knelson1701@y...> > wrote: > > After i did my water change and tank cleaning today in my 40 gal > tank. > > I noticed my male swordtail acting wierd. He is swimming at the > top of > > the water slowly, tail kinda drooping down. I went to feed the > fish, > > he did eat, but not like he normally does. All the other fish > appear > > healthy. I have 2 female swordtails, 4 emerald cories and 4 > angelfish > > in the tank. There is no fighting in the tank, and everyone > looked > > healthy till today. Any ideas? A Disease, bad food, bad luck? > I've > > had the swordtails for about a month. All of my water tests came > back > > great. No ammonia or nitrite. Nitrate in good levels. Any help > would > > be great. > > > > Keith > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important > to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify > the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we > Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12556	From: kathygothreau	Date: 6/23/2005
Subject: cloudy water

I just wanted to thank Paul Helms for responding to my post. I am going to wait for about a month before I clean the tank again.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12557	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 6/23/2005
Subject: intro

New guy on the list here...I just recently joined this a few other aquaria lists last night so I thought I would jump in an introduce myself. I am relatively new to keeping an aquarium. I live in Naperville, IL (western suburbs of Chicago). I currently have a 55 gal freshwater tank. We just upgraded from a 20 gallon that I had. My girlfriend got the 55 gallon and her fish as part of her divorce settlement ;-) I currently have an Eclipse II hood (modified to fit the tank on one side) and a standard hood with a Penguin 100 and a Tetratec 60 (soon to be replace by either another eclipse 2 hood or a Emperor 440 filter...haven't decided which I want to go with just yet). I don't heat as the room temp and lights keep the water temp nice an cozy. I had a heater in there but when the higher summer temps rolled in, it ended up overheating the tank (luckily I caught it in time and no harm was done). I have a UGF which does a great job in keeping the water clear. I also decided to plant live plants as I really don;t like the looks of the plastic plants...plus the live plants also are a boon to water quality. In some of the holes up top, I also put some golden pothos as they do great rooting in water and I'm told the plant really sucks up some of the nitrates in the water. I will take pics of the setup when I can and post them. Here's the inhabitants of my tank: 2 Pleco's...one I already had...the other came with the 55 gal tank. 2 Marbled Angels 6 Danios 2 Red-tailed Sharks 2 Bull fin Sharks 3 Spiny Eels 3 Violet Gobies 2 Scissortail Rasboras 2 Rosy Barbs 2 Dojo or weather loaches 1 tiger loach 1 albino cory cat 1 common cory cat All of them do quite well an seem to get along ok. I usually feed them TetraMin flakes twice a day as well as some freeze-dried tubifex and blood worms. As soon as the eels get bigger, I will be getting some small live earthworms as well. I will also occasionally go out and catch some ants. The angels love them as do some of the other carnivorous fish. I am also trying to get some live bloodworms, but for some reason I have not been able to get any to hatch (could be do to local mosquito control programs). Blessing, Eric [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12558	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 6/23/2005
Subject: Re: Thank you Stan

According to the brand of freeze dried worms I get (Wardley), they are sterilized before freeze drying. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of pam phetteplace Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2005 1:40 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Thank you Stan Thank you Stan for the reply re: my angel. She is currently being treated in a hospital tank. I wanted to ask you if you knew what is the white stuff she is passing? Is it a good sign if I see worms and white stuff ? I wish she would eat something. I did not see much information on this subject online. Do you have a favorite indepth online site for info re: angels. Do freeze dried tubifex worms carry parasites? I have always washed my black worms off before feeding them, but am seriously thinking about stopping all live food, which is something I hate to do. Would you recommend treating her tankmates (another 4 angels) and a pleco. PP

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12559	From: paul helms	Date: 6/23/2005
Subject: Re: cloudy water

no problem --- kathygothreau <kkhome@...> wrote: > I just wanted to thank Paul Helms for responding to > my post. I am > going to wait for about a month before I clean the > tank again. > > > __________________________________ Discover Yahoo! Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12560	From: yarncrazymom	Date: 6/23/2005
Subject: Is my snail Dead?

Oh please help me figure it out :O) I have two trap door snails and they were both very active and eating fine. the one went into hi shell yesturday morning and hasnt moved at all...I even took him out of the tank today and felt the trap door and it seemed to go further into the shell, I put it back in the water and it has been several hours and still nothing...I hate to discard him if he is alive but I hate to leave him dead in my tank...Help.... Thanks Rhonda

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12561	From: Rei - Raymond Tremor	Date: 6/23/2005
Subject: Re: Female betta turning colors

Yeah, you get huge fry count but not about 500. It also depends on your aquarium and the nest the male had made and also the female or male could be an egg eater and you will have less fry. Also not all eggs are hatch. Some will have fungus on them. And if the male isn't taken off after about 3 days the fry will look like food for him and will start eating them (whatever he can catch). That is why it is important to have lots of plants and places to hide for the fry to go. Also the plants helps feed the fry with infusuria (sp) for the first few days. Rei - Raymond Tremor LoveMoAko@... -------Original Message------- From: Dane & Leslie Moore Date: 06/21/05 17:14:08 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Female betta turning colors 50-500 huh? I've not heard of numbers anywhere near that high. Fortunately I have lots of friends and extra fish tanks that the little guys could go to. I don't do anything without researching it first. I know what is required. And if I did make the educated decision to breed my betas, I would know exactly what to and not to do. =) That's why I'm a member of groups such as this. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nan Sent: Tuesday, June 21, 2005 9:55 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Female betta turning colors I would strongly urge you to do some research before attempting to breed your bettas. Certain requirements need to be met so that they are healthy. And another question: you successfully breed your bettas and you end up with 50-500 fry, what are you going to do with them? Good Luck! Nan Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote: i've never bred bettas, but i do remember hearing that the female's submissive stripes are vertical and stress lines are horizontal. or i could have that backwards or even completely wrong. from what i've heard, breeding bettas isn't necessarily hard but you need to monitor them to make sure to separate the 2 if necessary. but i'm sure there are people on this group who are far more knowledgeable than i am about betta breeding. or you can try the fish forums in the betta section. people there are extremely knowledgeable. fishforums.net. good luck! --- Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: > Whoops. He had one going but I messed it up when I moved him out of > the tank. He still does that though even in his smaller habitat. I > have put the two next to eachother so that they can see each other. > When she does the stripes again, I will do as suggested and see if we > can get some baby bettas. My kids would love that. So I'm looking for > vertical stripes to tell when she is ready? She is staying that > darker color and only turns pale when I remove him from her sight. > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez > Sent: Monday, June 20, 2005 2:15 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Female betta turning colors > > > yep, that's it! > > --- Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: > > > A bubble nest? Like a big clump of floating bubbles on the top of > > the > > > water? > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs! Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter --------------------------------- Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12563	From: Anne	Date: 6/23/2005
Subject: Re: Sand (how to vaccum)

Hi, I really like the look of sand in my tanks. I keep cories (2 tanks - one tank is shared with a betta) and they stir it up all the time. It's alot easier to keep clean IMO, but I don't have goldfish. I'm hoping to eventually move my clowns into a larger tank with sand - they rearrange their "furniture" constantly. Anne __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12564	From: Anne	Date: 6/23/2005
Subject: Re: other usefull containers/Heather Norton

"The goldfish are in a large rectangular plastic planter (about 13 gallons) on my back patio. It's big enough that I've been able to add some pond plants to it. I've also kept fish and plants in plastic washtubs and Rubbermaid/Sterilite totes." I'm really curious about this topic. I bought a fountain that you put in a large pot and had thought of adding a goldfish or two after I find the size tub I'm looking for but I'm been thinking that, since I live in Md. and the winters get chilly, would I just bring the goldfish inside for the winter? Since I wouldn't run the fountain inside, maybe I could add a sponge filter to the tub from Oct. to May? Or would they need better digs for overwintering? Thanks Anne ____________________________________________________ Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12565	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/23/2005
Subject: Re: Cloudy Water

Kathy, Sorry I cannot be the bearer of better news, and this is likely to get lengthy, so please bear with me. BTW, which type of shebunkins do you have Bristol, American, or Japanese? There are a few problems here. First, you have to much fish for the amount of water you have. Adult goldfish, and yours have a bit to go before they reach full size, require about 30 gallons of water per fish. You can fudge the 30 gallons a bit--your two would probably do fine in a 55 gallon tank. Not stated is the temperature of your tank. Goldfish are temperate water fish. Room temperature should be fine, so long as it is not above 72^o F. Cooler would be better for your fish. At warmer temperatures they are more active and will eat more and grow faster, producing more waste. The waste is your problem here. The amount that the fish will produce, versus the amount you are able to remove with your current practices. The marble substrate you are using is problematic. Solid waste will filter through the marbles and reach the bottom of the tank where it will stay and decay. It is doubtful that your siphon produces a strong enough current to remove more than a minimal amount, unless you are moving the marbles while you are cleaning. Goldfish are, as I alluded to above, tremendous waste producers. They put a heavy load of ammonia into the tank. They are mainly herbivores, and their digestive tract is designed for digesting plant matter. As a result they produce a large amount of solid waste to add to the load in an aquarium. They are large fish, and need the room, particularly because the type you have are active swimmers. Some of the more fancy varieties are not quite as avid swimmers, but still do need the room mentioned above. To handle the load, you need a large bacterial population to convert the ammonia to a less toxic substance. Unfortunately, if you follow Paul's advice, you will not work your way out of your problem. You will still have too much fish for the size of your equipment. So, what can you do. Well, you do have a couple of options. You may be able to trade the fish in for smaller fish. This is probably not a viable option for you, because you wish to keep the fish you have. That leaves the option of enlarging their quarters. Unfortunately, unlike a house, you cannot just add another room onto your current tank. You'll need to get another, larger tank. You'll probably want to go with a 55 or 60 gallon tank for your lovelies, larger if you would wish to add more to your brood. You should use a substrate of a larger sized gravel, possibly a number 3 or larger. The fish will like to scrounge through the gravel on a regular basis, so you'll need to see that it is small enough to fit in their mouths, but not large enough to choke them if they decide to swallow. When you do your water changes, you'll be able to run the siphon through the gravel to help keep it clean. A larger tank will mean a new filter and, perhaps, a larger air pump if you would like to keep the bubbler going. Your current pump may not be large enough for a larger tank as we are talking about. To jump start the cycling of the new tank, you'll probably want to run the old filter, as well as the new, on the new tank to help develop the needed bacterial colonies. A product called Biospira may also help. It has gotten some good reviews in previous messaging on this list. Some clouding of a tank may occur as it is "breaking in". There are two types. You did not mention which type you have. A white or grey cloudiness is caused by a bacterial bloom. A greenish cloudiness is caused by an algal bloom of suspended algae. The underlying causes for these blooms is similar, alga will thrive in an environment where there is plenty of food and light. The bacteria just need the food, light is inconsequential. Both blooms with thrive where there is plenty of nitrogen, such as in a new setup where the biological cycle has not yet become established. As Paul had mentioned, water changes can increase the amount of time it takes to remove the blooms. While this seems to be counter-intuitive, minimizing the water changes will help in the cure. The fresh water will act as a stimulant to the bloom, and, if you have a high level of nitrate in your tap water, it will encourage the growth of the algae or bacteria. However, in your state right now, you are not in the throes of "new tank syndrome" as it is called, but facing a different problem. You need to reduce the bioload in your tank. Again, the best way here is to get a larger tank. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of kathygothreau Sent: Wednesday, June 22, 2005 5:33 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Cloudy Water Hello... I am new to the group and a new goldfish owner. I have two shebunkins that I purchased 4-5 months ago when they were very tiny...they are now 5-6 inches long and very active, very colorful and always seem hungry. I have them in a 10 gallon tank with a Penguin 100 filter with a bio- wheel and I have a medium-size rectangular bubble stone in the tank as well. I have glass marbles (the kind that are used in vases) on the bottom of the tank instead of gravel (don't know if this is not good). My question is even though I siphon the bottom of the tank once a week, squeegie the inside of the glass at least once a week and replace evaporated water at least 3 times a week and remove I would say 30% of the water and replace it with clean water once a week, the tank always looks cloudy. My Ph level is 6.5 to 7.0 and I test at least once per week. I am going strictly by a couple of books that I bought at the pet store when I bought the goldies. I am very unsure how much food to feed the Chester and Charlie. I might be overfeeding them? I feed Tetra Fin flakes, Tetra Fin goldfish crisps, Hikari freeze-dried brine shrimp and Wardley Total SpectraMax (rotate them for variety). Any light anyone can shed on my cloudy water problem will certainly be appreciated!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12566	From: Rei - Raymond Tremor	Date: 6/23/2005
Subject: Re: Purple Bettas

Nice. The male is a plakat (plakad), fighter, or short tailed one. It looks like a delta tail cause the tail is kinda curved or rounded. Full moon would be 180 degrees from the tip of the top tail to the tip of the bottom tail. Delta's are short of 180. Rei - Raymond Tremor LoveMoAko@... -------Original Message------- From: pamphetteplace Date: 06/23/05 08:53:38 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Purple Bettas I posted pics of my one of my pairs of purple bettas, under the folder titled "Pam's Purple Bettas". Will try to get pics of the other 2 in there soon. Pam Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12567	From: hnorton1cogeco.ca	Date: 6/24/2005
Subject: other usefull containers/Heather Norton

Anne I kept my goldfish year round because of wildlife bothering them on my patio ,inside my apartment in a Childs wadding pool . with my fountain inside a two tier garden planter made for the balcony ,I drilled holes into the bottom of the two of the small pots and then inserted a plastic clear tube from the hardware store and is the kind you can get at the pet store .Then I use the silicon glue for tanks around the bottom making sure you have the right size plastic hard tubing to put your hose from the pump after you join them together you allow the tube to come out at the top but you must adjust it yourself to how high you want it the power of you pump will give you different amounts of lift to the water .My pump was a small one so it just came up to about two inches above the lip of the top pot .Then I added a tube that I got that you see at the hardware store for your toilet it is either white or grey and I have used them for years without any health issues with the fish the tube helps to keep the tubing upright .Before I connect all my pump items inside of the plastic pots I make little indents into the lip of the lower pot to allow the water to drip down the sides to give the water a more real look to it is an outdoor fountain .I used large potted plants that look tropical around the back and sides of the tub to also hide the artificial look .I also used a old floor lamp at the back of the pool to give just the right lighting to it and as a little better affect I had butterflies hanging just above the pool and above them I had some nice real looking small birds .they are over four years old now growing very big about 12'' but are thriving at my freinds apartment in a large Tupper ware container with a homemade large ground filter that looks very nice it giving the feeling you were in a solarium.The tub is large enough for the three to move around without bothering each other put on some nice music and close you eyes and you think your outside .Great on those very hot days ,or those cold winter days Heather Norton "The goldfish are in a large rectangular plastic planter (about 13 gallons) on my back patio. It's big enough that I've been able to add some pond plants to it. I've also kept fish and plants in plastic washtubs and Rubbermaid/Sterilize totes." I'm really curious about this topic. I bought a fountain that you put in a large pot and had thought of adding a goldfish or two after I find the size tub I'm looking for but I'm been thinking that, since I live in Md. and the winters get chilly, would I just bring the goldfish inside for the winter? Since I wouldn't run the fountain inside, maybe I could add a sponge filter to the tub from Oct. to May? Or would they need better digs for over wintering? Thanks Anne [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12568	From: hnorton1cogeco.ca	Date: 6/24/2005
Subject: Re: other usefull containers/Heather Norton

I forgot to mention that you can use regular fish gravel in your container and plants but you should clean your bottom on a regular bases and change the water partially each month .I had a large Tupper ware container all set with the proper conditioners to add to the water . Heather Norton [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12569	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/24/2005
Subject: Bibliography of Lake Malawi Biology

A little tidbit for those of you who like Malawi cichlids. Bibliography of Lake Malawi Biology http://malawicichlids.com/mw14001.htm This extensive, online Bibliography of Lake Malawi Biology is part of a larger scientific website titled The Cichlid Fishes of Lake Malawi, Africa (reported on in the March 4, 1998 Scout Report for Science & Engineering) which is maintained by Michael K. Oliver. The regularly updated Bibliography has an emphasis on "the taxonomy of the lake's fishes and their ecology, evolution, and genetics, but also includes literature on all other organisms." The Bibliography "provides links to hundreds of literature abstracts and dozens of full text downloads." The well-organized Bibliography contains an alphabetized list of references with hyperlinks to different alphabetic sections. Preceding the alphabetical list is a selection of highlighted publications from a range of years, as well as annual lists of research publications from 2001 to 2005. Oliver has certainly compiled a very useful resource for ichthyologists and other biologists interested in the African Great Rift Lakes. >From The NSDL Scout Report for the Life Sciences, Copyright Internet Scout Project 1994-2005. http://scout.wisc.edu/ \\Steve// Give a man a match, and he'll be warm for a minute. But set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12570	From: bettamuse	Date: 6/24/2005
Subject: Re: Purple Bettas

Nice fish Pam, It looks from your photo that their colour is copper, that colour often appears purple under certain lights. One of my favourite colours bettas come in. How old are they? If they are still young they could fill out more. They look like they would fit into the Pakat halfmoon criteria. They don't fit into the Traditional pakat shape. The males spread is only a nats whisker off the full 180, a little bit of flaring practice and he may just go all the way. He may already be 180, that pic just might not show it. BM

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12571	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 6/24/2005
Subject: Two o'clock feedings

Okay Mr.Mom is out of the fishtank, leaving behind the teeny baby bettas. So how often do I need to be feeding them? I've got the pump on again, with a nylon over the filter pipe and it takes diligent searching to see the babies. They are so cute, zipping around there.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12572	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 6/24/2005
Subject: Re: Two o'clock feedings

The fry should be fed at least three times a day. If you don't have the time, twice a day will do, but the growth rate won't be as great. Once a day won't cut it. For BEST growth rate, feeding five times a day is optimal, even though not necessary. Beyond five times a day there is no further benefit. So choose the program which best fits your time schedule and desired growth rate. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "cynthia brennemann" <brennewoman@h...> wrote: > Okay Mr.Mom is out of the fishtank, leaving behind the teeny baby > bettas. So how often do I need to be feeding them? I've got the pump > on again, with a nylon over the filter pipe and it takes diligent > searching to see the babies. They are so cute, zipping around there.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12573	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 6/24/2005
Subject: Re: Two o'clock feedings

One further point to consider -- keep an eye on the filter tube. If you can't turn the flow down enough and the flow rate is still too strong, the fry may be drawn against the nylon and may not be able to pull away. If this should happen and this is your only filter, you can install one or two more tubes (W/nylon) so that now with three tubes, each tube has just 1/3 the flow rate of the original one tube. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "cynthia brennemann" <brennewoman@h...> wrote: > Okay Mr.Mom is out of the fishtank, leaving behind the teeny baby > bettas. So how often do I need to be feeding them? I've got the pump > on again, with a nylon over the filter pipe and it takes diligent > searching to see the babies. They are so cute, zipping around there.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12574	From: wendie	Date: 6/25/2005
Subject: Re: Two o'clock feedings

I fed mine about 4 times a day at first. Then tapered down to three until they were about two months old. I did have an awful lot of them thou - 317. Wendie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of cynthia brennemann Sent: Friday, June 24, 2005 11:55 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Two o'clock feedings Okay Mr.Mom is out of the fishtank, leaving behind the teeny baby bettas. So how often do I need to be feeding them? I've got the pump on again, with a nylon over the filter pipe and it takes diligent searching to see the babies. They are so cute, zipping around there. Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- Yahoo! Groups Links a.. To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12575	From: Jade Evita	Date: 6/25/2005
Subject: New and fry already...sorry so long.

I have kept fish off and on as a kid during the era when you filled a tank with water, added and then just fed them never worrying about the ph numbers and what not. Then about five years ago we got my oldest a 20 gal tank for Christmas. The local P. Shop suggested feeder gold fish to cycle the tank but we never really knew what the heck he was talking about. We decided to keep them instead of giving them back. Long story short of course they grew and grew and I know now became too much for the tank. They were over crouded and we ended up with no fish after about three years. My husband said basically it was me and I killed them. He also says I kill plants too. It kinda made us gun shy and the tank was basically empty for over a year. Then I bought a 30 gal from from a friend at work. I kill more fish". So I cleaned up both tanks and read all I could on keeping fish and filled them with water. Then I decided to join some groups and read all I could. As I read I got more and more gun shy and the tanks although up and running I was too nervous to add fish. Now don't laugh but they were up three months and I was testing and doing water changes and watching but to scared to add fish. Then 5 days ago I finally decided I have to go for it. Other wise we would be just keeping to tanks of water. Anyway we added 4 platys. I wanted to start slow and gradually add more. I read platys were hardy and a good beginner fish. Here's the rub of the story. Three days later we wake up to ....you guessed it ...."FRY". The kids went crasy and I got my net. I managed to catch the ones I guess that were left in the tank, around 26. We moved them to the 20 gal. tank, which I did set up as a nursery in the first place. Now 48 hrs. later the Fry are doing well and after over a week the adults are doing well still also. My adult tank temp is at about 76 and my nursery tank is at 80. My question is when is the best time to add more fish to my 30 gal adult tank? It has been over a week sense I got them. Also any suggestions to types of fish that are good with platys? I was also wondering if fry will attempt to eat zuckinni(SP).? I have read that usually you will lose some but the hardy ones will grow. So far I haven't lost any. I also wonder can anyone tell me how long it takes for fry to reach adulthood size. I read alot about mating and can find nothing on growth. Sorry so long but this is my first post in a long time. Evita

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12576	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/25/2005
Subject: Re: New and fry already...sorry so long.

Nice story. I'd add more fish every 10 days to 2 weeks or so, until I reached the limit of my tank, or less. This will give the ongoing bacterial cultures time to adjust to the new load placed on them. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Jade Evita Sent: Saturday, June 25, 2005 10:06 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] New and fry already...sorry so long. I have kept fish off and on as a kid during the era when you filled a tank with water, added and then just fed them never worrying about the ph numbers and what not. Then about five years ago we got my oldest a 20 gal tank for Christmas. The local P. Shop suggested feeder gold fish to cycle the tank but we never really knew what the heck he was talking about. We decided to keep them instead of giving them back. Long story short of course they grew and grew and I know now became too much for the tank. They were over crouded and we ended up with no fish after about three years. My husband said basically it was me and I killed them. He also says I kill plants too. It kinda made us gun shy and the tank was basically empty for over a year. Then I bought a 30 gal from from a friend at work. I kill more fish". So I cleaned up both tanks and read all I could on keeping fish and filled them with water. Then I decided to join some groups and read all I could. As I read I got more and more gun shy and the tanks although up and running I was too nervous to add fish. Now don't laugh but they were up three months and I was testing and doing water changes and watching but to scared to add fish. Then 5 days ago I finally decided I have to go for it. Other wise we would be just keeping to tanks of water. Anyway we added 4 platys. I wanted to start slow and gradually add more. I read platys were hardy and a good beginner fish. Here's the rub of the story. Three days later we wake up to ....you guessed it ...."FRY". The kids went crasy and I got my net. I managed to catch the ones I guess that were left in the tank, around 26. We moved them to the 20 gal. tank, which I did set up as a nursery in the first place. Now 48 hrs. later the Fry are doing well and after over a week the adults are doing well still also. My adult tank temp is at about 76 and my nursery tank is at 80. My question is when is the best time to add more fish to my 30 gal adult tank? It has been over a week sense I got them. Also any suggestions to types of fish that are good with platys? I was also wondering if fry will attempt to eat zuckinni(SP).? I have read that usually you will lose some but the hardy ones will grow. So far I haven't lost any. I also wonder can anyone tell me how long it takes for fry to reach adulthood size. I read alot about mating and can find nothing on growth. Sorry so long but this is my first post in a long time. Evita Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12577	From: Evita	Date: 6/25/2005
Subject: Re: New and fry already...sorry so long.

Thanks Steve, Babies are still doing fine. I have been reading up on cycling and I am watching my water closely testing the water and it is pretty stable but it has been a week. The water looks clear. I was wondering during this time are any water changes needed? I read it can slow down the process but then I also read a 25% water change every two weeks. Right now I just have 4 platys and an really excited about adding more color and variety but I am also cautious and patient. I want to do what is best for the fish. I love them already. Evita Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: Nice story. I'd add more fish every 10 days to 2 weeks or so, until I reached the limit of my tank, or less. This will give the ongoing bacterial cultures time to adjust to the new load placed on them. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Jade Evita Sent: Saturday, June 25, 2005 10:06 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] New and fry already...sorry so long. I have kept fish off and on as a kid during the era when you filled a tank with water, added and then just fed them never worrying about the ph numbers and what not. Then about five years ago we got my oldest a 20 gal tank for Christmas. The local P. Shop suggested feeder gold fish to cycle the tank but we never really knew what the heck he was talking about. We decided to keep them instead of giving them back. Long story short of course they grew and grew and I know now became too much for the tank. They were over crouded and we ended up with no fish after about three years. My husband said basically it was me and I killed them. He also says I kill plants too. It kinda made us gun shy and the tank was basically empty for over a year. Then I bought a 30 gal from from a friend at work. I kill more fish". So I cleaned up both tanks and read all I could on keeping fish and filled them with water. Then I decided to join some groups and read all I could. As I read I got more and more gun shy and the tanks although up and running I was too nervous to add fish. Now don't laugh but they were up three months and I was testing and doing water changes and watching but to scared to add fish. Then 5 days ago I finally decided I have to go for it. Other wise we would be just keeping to tanks of water. Anyway we added 4 platys. I wanted to start slow and gradually add more. I read platys were hardy and a good beginner fish. Here's the rub of the story. Three days later we wake up to ....you guessed it ...."FRY". The kids went crasy and I got my net. I managed to catch the ones I guess that were left in the tank, around 26. We moved them to the 20 gal. tank, which I did set up as a nursery in the first place. Now 48 hrs. later the Fry are doing well and after over a week the adults are doing well still also. My adult tank temp is at about 76 and my nursery tank is at 80. My question is when is the best time to add more fish to my 30 gal adult tank? It has been over a week sense I got them. Also any suggestions to types of fish that are good with platys? I was also wondering if fry will attempt to eat zuckinni(SP).? I have read that usually you will lose some but the hardy ones will grow. So far I haven't lost any. I also wonder can anyone tell me how long it takes for fry to reach adulthood size. I read alot about mating and can find nothing on growth. Sorry so long but this is my first post in a long time. Evita Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Find what you need with new enhanced search. Learn more. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12578	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/25/2005
Subject: Re: New and fry already...sorry so long.

Evita, I usually go with a 10-20% change a week. When I had a large number of tanks running, I'd just go down the line, and siphon the water off, cleaning a portion of the substrate in those tanks that had a substrate, and then went back up the line topping them off, adding a water conditioner first. A lot of my measurements are by gosh and by golly <g>. There has been talk here of a mini cycle occurring each time the water was changed, but I have never experienced it myself, and there was a time I tested water rigorously. Back then, I had a lot of fish that were relatively rare and expensive (some of them are somewhat commonplace today) and I did not want to lose them, or my investment in them. (What's the difference between a novice and an expert? [Pause] The price of the fish they kill.) When you add fish to a tank, as I mentioned in my previous post, you will have a mini-cycle while the colonies of bacteria adjust to the new load in the tank. If you monitor the tank, you will see a slight rise in ammonia, then nitrite and then it will go back to 0 ppm. There is really no way to avoid this, but generally, by two weeks, it has played itself out, unless you add some "dirty" fish--those that produce a lot of ammonia and other waste. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evita Sent: Saturday, June 25, 2005 3:15 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] New and fry already...sorry so long. Thanks Steve, Babies are still doing fine. I have been reading up on cycling and I am watching my water closely testing the water and it is pretty stable but it has been a week. The water looks clear. I was wondering during this time are any water changes needed? I read it can slow down the process but then I also read a 25% water change every two weeks. Right now I just have 4 platys and an really excited about adding more color and variety but I am also cautious and patient. I want to do what is best for the fish. I love them already. Evita Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: Nice story. I'd add more fish every 10 days to 2 weeks or so, until I reached the limit of my tank, or less. This will give the ongoing bacterial cultures time to adjust to the new load placed on them. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Jade Evita Sent: Saturday, June 25, 2005 10:06 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] New and fry already...sorry so long. I have kept fish off and on as a kid during the era when you filled a tank with water, added and then just fed them never worrying about the ph numbers and what not. Then about five years ago we got my oldest a 20 gal tank for Christmas. The local P. Shop suggested feeder gold fish to cycle the tank but we never really knew what the heck he was talking about. We decided to keep them instead of giving them back. Long story short of course they grew and grew and I know now became too much for the tank. They were over crouded and we ended up with no fish after about three years. My husband said basically it was me and I killed them. He also says I kill plants too. It kinda made us gun shy and the tank was basically empty for over a year. Then I bought a 30 gal from from a friend at work. I kill more fish". So I cleaned up both tanks and read all I could on keeping fish and filled them with water. Then I decided to join some groups and read all I could. As I read I got more and more gun shy and the tanks although up and running I was too nervous to add fish. Now don't laugh but they were up three months and I was testing and doing water changes and watching but to scared to add fish. Then 5 days ago I finally decided I have to go for it. Other wise we would be just keeping to tanks of water. Anyway we added 4 platys. I wanted to start slow and gradually add more. I read platys were hardy and a good beginner fish. Here's the rub of the story. Three days later we wake up to ....you guessed it ...."FRY". The kids went crasy and I got my net. I managed to catch the ones I guess that were left in the tank, around 26. We moved them to the 20 gal. tank, which I did set up as a nursery in the first place. Now 48 hrs. later the Fry are doing well and after over a week the adults are doing well still also. My adult tank temp is at about 76 and my nursery tank is at 80. My question is when is the best time to add more fish to my 30 gal adult tank? It has been over a week sense I got them. Also any suggestions to types of fish that are good with platys? I was also wondering if fry will attempt to eat zuckinni(SP).? I have read that usually you will lose some but the hardy ones will grow. So far I haven't lost any. I also wonder can anyone tell me how long it takes for fry to reach adulthood size. I read alot about mating and can find nothing on growth. Sorry so long but this is my first post in a long time. Evita

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12579	From: Evita	Date: 6/25/2005
Subject: Re: New and fry already...sorry so long.

Thanks Steve for your informative post. I will keep it filed. It has been really slow today in groups. I guess I will do a water change sometime on Monday. Evita Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote:Evita, I usually go with a 10-20% change a week. When I had a large number of tanks running, I'd just go down the line, and siphon the water off, cleaning a portion of the substrate in those tanks that had a substrate, and then went back up the line topping them off, adding a water conditioner first. A lot of my measurements are by gosh and by golly <g>. There has been talk here of a mini cycle occurring each time the water was changed, but I have never experienced it myself, and there was a time I tested water rigorously. Back then, I had a lot of fish that were relatively rare and expensive (some of them are somewhat commonplace today) and I did not want to lose them, or my investment in them. (What's the difference between a novice and an expert? [Pause] The price of the fish they kill.) When you add fish to a tank, as I mentioned in my previous post, you will have a mini-cycle while the colonies of bacteria adjust to the new load in the tank. If you monitor the tank, you will see a slight rise in ammonia, then nitrite and then it will go back to 0 ppm. There is really no way to avoid this, but generally, by two weeks, it has played itself out, unless you add some "dirty" fish--those that produce a lot of ammonia and other waste. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evita Sent: Saturday, June 25, 2005 3:15 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] New and fry already...sorry so long. Thanks Steve, Babies are still doing fine. I have been reading up on cycling and I am watching my water closely testing the water and it is pretty stable but it has been a week. The water looks clear. I was wondering during this time are any water changes needed? I read it can slow down the process but then I also read a 25% water change every two weeks. Right now I just have 4 platys and an really excited about adding more color and variety but I am also cautious and patient. I want to do what is best for the fish. I love them already. Evita Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: Nice story. I'd add more fish every 10 days to 2 weeks or so, until I reached the limit of my tank, or less. This will give the ongoing bacterial cultures time to adjust to the new load placed on them. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Jade Evita Sent: Saturday, June 25, 2005 10:06 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] New and fry already...sorry so long. I have kept fish off and on as a kid during the era when you filled a tank with water, added and then just fed them never worrying about the ph numbers and what not. Then about five years ago we got my oldest a 20 gal tank for Christmas. The local P. Shop suggested feeder gold fish to cycle the tank but we never really knew what the heck he was talking about. We decided to keep them instead of giving them back. Long story short of course they grew and grew and I know now became too much for the tank. They were over crouded and we ended up with no fish after about three years. My husband said basically it was me and I killed them. He also says I kill plants too. It kinda made us gun shy and the tank was basically empty for over a year. Then I bought a 30 gal from from a friend at work. I kill more fish". So I cleaned up both tanks and read all I could on keeping fish and filled them with water. Then I decided to join some groups and read all I could. As I read I got more and more gun shy and the tanks although up and running I was too nervous to add fish. Now don't laugh but they were up three months and I was testing and doing water changes and watching but to scared to add fish. Then 5 days ago I finally decided I have to go for it. Other wise we would be just keeping to tanks of water. Anyway we added 4 platys. I wanted to start slow and gradually add more. I read platys were hardy and a good beginner fish. Here's the rub of the story. Three days later we wake up to ....you guessed it ...."FRY". The kids went crasy and I got my net. I managed to catch the ones I guess that were left in the tank, around 26. We moved them to the 20 gal. tank, which I did set up as a nursery in the first place. Now 48 hrs. later the Fry are doing well and after over a week the adults are doing well still also. My adult tank temp is at about 76 and my nursery tank is at 80. My question is when is the best time to add more fish to my 30 gal adult tank? It has been over a week sense I got them. Also any suggestions to types of fish that are good with platys? I was also wondering if fry will attempt to eat zuckinni(SP).? I have read that usually you will lose some but the hardy ones will grow. So far I haven't lost any. I also wonder can anyone tell me how long it takes for fry to reach adulthood size. I read alot about mating and can find nothing on growth. Sorry so long but this is my first post in a long time. Evita Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12580	From: yarncrazymom	Date: 6/25/2005
Subject: Re: Is my snail Dead?

Thanks for all the replys to my question...this is such a helpful group...LOL.. See ya Rho > Oh please help me figure it out :O) I have two trap door snails and > they were both very active and eating fine. the one went into hi > shell yesturday morning and hasnt moved at all...I even took him out > of the tank today and felt the trap door and it seemed to go further > into the shell, I put it back in the water and it has been several > hours and still nothing...I hate to discard him if he is alive but I > hate to leave him dead in my tank...Help.... > > Thanks > Rhonda

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12581	From: Evita	Date: 6/25/2005
Subject: Re: Is my snail Dead?

Sorry you didn't get an answer. I have never had snails and I have little if no experience with Aquariums. I hope your snail is OK. It has been really slow in here all day. Usually if you don't get an answer no one knows the answer or no one that knows the answer is on line. It can be frustrating at times. Evita yarncrazymom <yarncrazymom@...> wrote: Thanks for all the replys to my question...this is such a helpful group...LOL.. See ya Rho > Oh please help me figure it out :O) I have two trap door snails and > they were both very active and eating fine. the one went into hi > shell yesturday morning and hasnt moved at all...I even took him out > of the tank today and felt the trap door and it seemed to go further > into the shell, I put it back in the water and it has been several > hours and still nothing...I hate to discard him if he is alive but I > hate to leave him dead in my tank...Help.... > > Thanks > Rhonda Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter --------------------------------- Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12582	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 6/25/2005
Subject: Pacific Coast Cichlid Association (PCCA), 7/9/2005, 6:45 pm

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife Pacific Coast Cichlid Association (PCCA) Saturday July 9, 2005 6:45 pm - 9:45 pm This event repeats on the second Saturday of every month. The next reminder for this event will be sent in 11 days, 4 minutes. Event Location: Round Table Pizza, 4302 Moorpark Avenue in San Jose, California Notes: The PCCA meets every second Saturday of the month. Meetings are held a the Round Table Pizza parlor located at 4302 Moorpark Avenue in San Jose, California http://www.cichlidworld.com/ Yahoo! Greetings Send a Yahoo! Greeting. Birthday Reminders Set up birthday reminders! ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12583	From: kathygothreau	Date: 6/26/2005
Subject: cloudy water

I haven't had a chance to pickup my e-mails in a few days so my apologies for responding a little late. I want to thank Steve Szabo for his response to my e-mail about my cloudy water in my shebunkins tank. It is a little mind-boggling for a beginner to take all in, but I am trying. My shebunkins are not Bristols, I know that. They have long, luxurious tails that are deeply forked. I am going to an aquarium today to get a larger tank and an additional filter. I am also going to get some different gravel. This gravel part scares me because after reading Steve's e-mail I am afraid that my fish could choke on the gravel. This is one of the reasons I am going to an aquarium...in the hopes that the people will be knowledgeable enough to advise me on the correct gravel. Again, thank you so much, Steve, for going to the trouble of writing such a detailed response to my question. I really appreciate it!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12584	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/26/2005
Subject: Re: cloudy water

Kathy, Sounds like you have the American or Japanese variety of shebunkin (shubunkin). The care and feeding are no different. Given the room and proper care, they will exceed 12" in length in an aquarium, perhaps as much as 18" when kept in a pond environment. Sort of gives you something to shoot for, eh? Good for you to hie yourself off to buy a larger tank. You can search the archive here, or the Internet itself, for information on fishless cycling of the tank. You'll want to get the cycle going before moving the fish over. If you can find some of that biospira that has been mentioned on the list, it may speed the cycle up a bit, so you can get the fish moved over more quickly than doing a cycle without it, at least that is what is claimed--I don't have any personal experience with it, but will probably try it the next time I set up a tank. If you need to move the fish right away (I can understand the space need, especially in my current residence <g>), get yourself some Amquel or Amquel Plus to use as a water conditioner. The Amquel products will make the nitrogenous products in the tank harmless to the fish while still allowing the cycle to occur. It will also remove the chlorine or chloramines in your tap water, should they be present. Be sure to wash the gravel before you place it in the tank. Just put it in a bucket or other container and run water into the container allowing it to spill over the edge while stirring the gravel, until the water runs clear. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of kathygothreau Sent: Sunday, June 26, 2005 11:38 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] cloudy water I haven't had a chance to pickup my e-mails in a few days so my apologies for responding a little late. I want to thank Steve Szabo for his response to my e-mail about my cloudy water in my shebunkins tank. It is a little mind-boggling for a beginner to take all in, but I am trying. My shebunkins are not Bristols, I know that. They have long, luxurious tails that are deeply forked. I am going to an aquarium today to get a larger tank and an additional filter. I am also going to get some different gravel. This gravel part scares me because after reading Steve's e-mail I am afraid that my fish could choke on the gravel. This is one of the reasons I am going to an aquarium...in the hopes that the people will be knowledgeable enough to advise me on the correct gravel. Again, thank you so much, Steve, for going to the trouble of writing such a detailed response to my question. I really appreciate it!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12585	From: sobi966	Date: 6/26/2005
Subject: the first message

I'm a beginner of keeping fish. Please tell me what fish you recommend for a beginner. Fish which is easy to breed would be better.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12586	From: Evita	Date: 6/26/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!

Steve, I am addressing this post to you mainly because you always seem to respond quickly and in simple terms easy enough that even I understand it. I truly enjoy and respect your knowledge on various topics. Now the Help me part of my post. I guess you know I just added my first fish a tad bit over a week ago. I set up my tank over 3 months ago and studied and studied before finally deciding on Platys to start with. I checked them out about three different times in this particular store before even buying them. A little over a week ago I bought 4 platys, making sure they looked good and healthy. Four days later I had babies and all look well. I was in the process of deciding what kind of fish to get next. My fish were doing fine then this morning it looks like ICK!!!! I am dumb founded to why they got it. I have been so careful at every step. Now I am worried for the babies as well even though I transferred them to another tank at birth. I need to treat the adults But I have no hospital tank. They are in a 30 gal tank and it looks as if all 4 are effected. It is small white dots and some white patches on the side. What be my course of treatment. I can't lose them. I realize adding fish right now is a no no too. I think I should just treat the whole tank. I have read about salt and over the counter treatments but I could use some expert advice. Step by step. I do have a 2 gal or so table tank put up that I could get out if needed. Should I have added salt to my tank before I added my fish. Could this have been started by the stress of bring them home and having babies so soon as well. The tank numbers look good and the water is clear looking but still I have ick on my fish. Also how long after I concur this problem can I focus on adding more fish. One of the reasons I waited so long for my fish was I was afraid something like this would happen. My husband is a cynic and he always says stuff like "See.....you can't keep fish...., I told you so, and You killed them". I am really upset. Also are my baby fry in danger even if they are in another tank? Any and all help would be a blessing at this point. I have to go to work now and pray for fast advice. I have several books on the subject but every book says go to the local pet shop or different advice. I would like advice that makes since and from people that had it before and cured it. Give me some hope. Thanks in advance. I live in a small town and we have only a Walmart in the area. Evita __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12587	From: Evita	Date: 6/26/2005
Subject: Re: the first message

Great question. Me too! Evita sobi966 <sobi966@...> wrote:I'm a beginner of keeping fish. Please tell me what fish you recommend for a beginner. Fish which is easy to breed would be better. Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12588	From: Evita	Date: 6/26/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!

I forgot to ask how this set back is going to effect my cycling of my new tank? Evita Evita <evitabug@...> wrote:Steve, I am addressing this post to you mainly because you always seem to respond quickly and in simple terms easy enough that even I understand it. I truly enjoy and respect your knowledge on various topics. Now the Help me part of my post. I guess you know I just added my first fish a tad bit over a week ago. I set up my tank over 3 months ago and studied and studied before finally deciding on Platys to start with. I checked them out about three different times in this particular store before even buying them. A little over a week ago I bought 4 platys, making sure they looked good and healthy. Four days later I had babies and all look well. I was in the process of deciding what kind of fish to get next. My fish were doing fine then this morning it looks like ICK!!!! I am dumb founded to why they got it. I have been so careful at every step. Now I am worried for the babies as well even though I transferred them to another tank at birth. I need to treat the adults But I have no hospital tank. They are in a 30 gal tank and it looks as if all 4 are effected. It is small white dots and some white patches on the side. What be my course of treatment. I can't lose them. I realize adding fish right now is a no no too. I think I should just treat the whole tank. I have read about salt and over the counter treatments but I could use some expert advice. Step by step. I do have a 2 gal or so table tank put up that I could get out if needed. Should I have added salt to my tank before I added my fish. Could this have been started by the stress of bring them home and having babies so soon as well. The tank numbers look good and the water is clear looking but still I have ick on my fish. Also how long after I concur this problem can I focus on adding more fish. One of the reasons I waited so long for my fish was I was afraid something like this would happen. My husband is a cynic and he always says stuff like "See.....you can't keep fish...., I told you so, and You killed them". I am really upset. Also are my baby fry in danger even if they are in another tank? Any and all help would be a blessing at this point. I have to go to work now and pray for fast advice. I have several books on the subject but every book says go to the local pet shop or different advice. I would like advice that makes since and from people that had it before and cured it. Give me some hope. Thanks in advance. I live in a small town and we have only a Walmart in the area. Evita __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter --------------------------------- Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12589	From: TankGurl	Date: 6/26/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!

The best way to treat ick, (in addition to using a commercial remedy) is to add 1 tablespoon of kosher salt or aquarium salt per 5 gallons and turn up the heat on your tank to 84F. I'd do a 20-30% water change before adding the salt. In fact, it's better if you add the salt to your replacement water, let it dissolve, then add to tank. I would also follow this up by the same 20% water change *daily* with added salt until it's all gone. Quite often, this is enough to get rid of the ick. It should not effect your cycle process, but do not get anymore new fish until it's all gone. With the above suggestions, you will notice a decrease in the white dots by tomorrow. Good luck. Kelly -- 65g Malawi http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 135g Frontosa/Tang http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12590	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/26/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!

Evita, Don't know about being so quick, sometimes several days will go by during the week before I even get around to reading a post (work stuff comes first, and I am on call also, having to help over the telephone). First, one need to be sure of the diagnosis before treating the fish for anything, other than doing a water change. Your post first states ich, then you go on to mention white patches. Ich will look like salt on your fish's body. It is actually a cyst that is raised from the body surface. White patches are something else. We would need a fuller description to try to make a determination of what it might be. Let's go on the assumption you have ich. Ich is a parasite with a life cycle of about 7 days. The lifecycle will vary some with the temperature of the water. Ich is always present in the aquarium, but is generally not seen until something in the environment opens the fish to infection. Generally this is a quick drop in the temperature, but other factors can play a part. The ich critters are only susceptible to treatment when they are free swimming, that is, when the cyst hatches and the next generation drops from it. There are medications out there that are designed specifically for ich, but the old tried and true methods also work. The first thing you should do is to raise the temperature of your aquarium. You will want to get it up to about 84-86^o F. This alone can eventually rid your fish of the ich. To hurry things along, though, you should also add salt to the water at the rate of a teaspoon for every gallon, and gradually increase the amount until you have 3 teaspoons per gallon. This treatment should continue for at least 10 days, or for several days after you notice the ich has disappeared from your fish to avoid a re-infection. We have had numerous debates here on they kind of salt to use. Table salt is perfectly acceptable for immediate treatment. However, you should probably use a kosher salt to which an anti-caking agent has not been added (contrary to popular belief, anti-caking agents can be added to salt and still have it certified as kosher). Marine salt is probably the best, but also the most expensive. I'd add the salt to the filter, provided it is easily accessible, because I've seen fish go after the salt as it were food, and I'd rather not see them chowing down on it. Adding it to the filter will allow the salt to find its way into solution at its own pace. The platies you know have should be able to handle this regimen handily. There are other fish out there, however, that would not be too happy with all the salt being added. As you read up on this fish stuff, you'll get to know more about this. Remember, this treatment would be for ich only. If your fish do not exhibit the symptoms of being sprinkled with salt, you have something else, and a fuller description would be needed. For example, there is a disease know as oodium that is related to ich, but it looks like the fish are becoming covered in velvet. While raising the temperature will help in a resolution to this parasite, the methods do vary for the rest of the treatment, and it does seem to be a bit more difficult to be rid of than ich. If the fish are not velvety looking, nor sprinkled with salt, you have something else that needs a fuller description of the symptoms. Also, including your water parameters: pH, ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, temperature, and anything else you might test for, will also help in the diagnosis of your problem or what has caused it. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evita Sent: Sunday, June 26, 2005 2:10 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE! Steve, I am addressing this post to you mainly because you always seem to respond quickly and in simple terms easy enough that even I understand it. I truly enjoy and respect your knowledge on various topics. Now the Help me part of my post. I guess you know I just added my first fish a tad bit over a week ago. I set up my tank over 3 months ago and studied and studied before finally deciding on Platys to start with. I checked them out about three different times in this particular store before even buying them. A little over a week ago I bought 4 platys, making sure they looked good and healthy. Four days later I had babies and all look well. I was in the process of deciding what kind of fish to get next. My fish were doing fine then this morning it looks like ICK!!!! I am dumb founded to why they got it. I have been so careful at every step. Now I am worried for the babies as well even though I transferred them to another tank at birth. I need to treat the adults But I have no hospital tank. They are in a 30 gal tank and it looks as if all 4 are effected. It is small white dots and some white patches on the side. What be my course of treatment. I can't lose them. I realize adding fish right now is a no no too. I think I should just treat the whole tank. I have read about salt and over the counter treatments but I could use some expert advice. Step by step. I do have a 2 gal or so table tank put up that I could get out if needed. Should I have added salt to my tank before I added my fish. Could this have been started by the stress of bring them home and having babies so soon as well. The tank numbers look good and the water is clear looking but still I have ick on my fish. Also how long after I concur this problem can I focus on adding more fish. One of the reasons I waited so long for my fish was I was afraid something like this would happen. My husband is a cynic and he always says stuff like "See.....you can't keep fish...., I told you so, and You killed them". I am really upset. Also are my baby fry in danger even if they are in another tank? Any and all help would be a blessing at this point. I have to go to work now and pray for fast advice. I have several books on the subject but every book says go to the local pet shop or different advice. I would like advice that makes since and from people that had it before and cured it. Give me some hope. Thanks in advance. I live in a small town and we have only a Walmart in the area. Evita

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12591	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/26/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!

That would depend on what needs to be done for the cure. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evita Sent: Sunday, June 26, 2005 2:13 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE! I forgot to ask how this set back is going to effect my cycling of my new tank? Evita Evita <evitabug@...> wrote:Steve, I am addressing this post to you mainly because you always seem to respond quickly and in simple terms easy enough that even I understand it. I truly enjoy and respect your knowledge on various topics. Now the Help me part of my post. I guess you know I just added my first fish a tad bit over a week ago. I set up my tank over 3 months ago and studied and studied before finally deciding on Platys to start with. I checked them out about three different times in this particular store before even buying them. A little over a week ago I bought 4 platys, making sure they looked good and healthy. Four days later I had babies and all look well. I was in the process of deciding what kind of fish to get next. My fish were doing fine then this morning it looks like ICK!!!! I am dumb founded to why they got it. I have been so careful at every step. Now I am worried for the babies as well even though I transferred them to another tank at birth. I need to treat the adults But I have no hospital tank. They are in a 30 gal tank and it looks as if all 4 are effected. It is small white dots and some white patches on the side. What be my course of treatment. I can't lose them. I realize adding fish right now is a no no too. I think I should just treat the whole tank. I have read about salt and over the counter treatments but I could use some expert advice. Step by step. I do have a 2 gal or so table tank put up that I could get out if needed. Should I have added salt to my tank before I added my fish. Could this have been started by the stress of bring them home and having babies so soon as well. The tank numbers look good and the water is clear looking but still I have ick on my fish. Also how long after I concur this problem can I focus on adding more fish. One of the reasons I waited so long for my fish was I was afraid something like this would happen. My husband is a cynic and he always says stuff like "See.....you can't keep fish...., I told you so, and You killed them". I am really upset. Also are my baby fry in danger even if they are in another tank? Any and all help would be a blessing at this point. I have to go to work now and pray for fast advice. I have several books on the subject but every book says go to the local pet shop or different advice. I would like advice that makes since and from people that had it before and cured it. Give me some hope. Thanks in advance. I live in a small town and we have only a Walmart in the area. Evita

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12592	From: knelson1701	Date: 6/26/2005
Subject: Re: the first message

There are quite a few fish that would be suitable for beginners. If you are looking for fish easy to breed, some of the livebearers are the easiest. For a beginner I would recommend the guppy, swordtail, and platy. how big a tank are you planning on using? Also realize that many fish will eat their own fry, so if you want a lot to survive you will need a seperate tank to raise them in. I'd recommend getting a good book and reading it before you buy a thing and see what your getting yourself into. I know several good ones if you want to know. Keith --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "sobi966" <sobi966@y...> wrote: > I'm a beginner of keeping fish. Please tell me what fish you recommend > for a beginner. Fish which is easy to breed would be better.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12593	From: panaque321	Date: 6/26/2005
Subject: Move guppy?

Hi, I'm new to this group and I have a question that some of you might be aboe to help with. At least, give me your opinion of this. I have a guppy in a nice planted bowl where he seems fine. I am wondering if I should move him to a larger tank which I have that has mostly catfish in it. The new tank would be bigger, and have other fish in it. Right now he is alone. Any thoughts? ..... Mackie

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12594	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 6/26/2005
Subject: The San Diego Tropical Fish Society , 7/10/2005, 7:00 pm

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife The San Diego Tropical Fish Society Sunday July 10, 2005 7:00 pm - 8:00 pm This event repeats on the second Sunday of every month. The next reminder for this event will be sent in 11 days, 4 minutes. Event Location: room 101, Casa Del Prado, Balboa Park at 7:00 PM Street: SAN DIEGO TROPICAL FISH SOCIETY, PO Box 4156, North Park Station City, State, Zip: San Diego, CA 92164 Phone: 619-281-FISH Notes: http://www.geocities.com/sandiegofishfan/ You are cordially invited to attend our next meeting in room 101, Casa Del Prado, Balboa Park at 7:00 PM on the second Sunday of the month. Visitors are always welcome! 619-281-FISH Yahoo! Greetings Send a Yahoo! Greeting. Birthday Reminders Set up birthday reminders! ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12595	From: Kittie Kat	Date: 6/26/2005
Subject: Can Water Change Kill My Fish?

The water change was about 10 percent of a 20 gal tank. the water was changed about 24 hours ago. now, two dead fish.... used some dechlorinator with the water change. still have 5 neons, 2 cat fish, 2 koolie loaches, some guppies, and.... all five of one week old babies are doing fine.... maybe we have had just bad luck with elderly fish that were ready for their fish heaven? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12596	From: Evita	Date: 6/26/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!

I just got home and read both Steve and your posts. I only have table salt in the house. Can I use that to get started? Also are you saying with a 30 gal tank I will need to add 6 tablespoons of salt daily till along with water changes. Should I use warmed water or cold from the tap. I know this is a silly question but if I am trying to get the temperature up and do my water changes with cold water won't that take even longer to raise the temp. of aquarium water. Also causing temp fluctuations. Is about 7-9 gal. good for the part. water change. What do ya mean till all gone? What if they sill have a spot or two and I can't see it and miss them. Couldn't it come back. About how many days should it take? Evita TankGurl <fishgoddess@...> wrote: The best way to treat ick, (in addition to using a commercial remedy) is to add 1 tablespoon of kosher salt or aquarium salt per 5 gallons and turn up the heat on your tank to 84F. I'd do a 20-30% water change before adding the salt. In fact, it's better if you add the salt to your replacement water, let it dissolve, then add to tank. I would also follow this up by the same 20% water change *daily* with added salt until it's all gone. Quite often, this is enough to get rid of the ick. It should not effect your cycle process, but do not get anymore new fish until it's all gone. With the above suggestions, you will notice a decrease in the white dots by tomorrow. Good luck. Kelly -- 65g Malawi http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 135g Frontosa/Tang http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011 Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12597	From: Evita	Date: 6/26/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!

Steve, I am 99.99999 percent sure it is ick. Thanks for the help. I feel so stupid at times. The dots do look like salt dots. mainly down the tail and fin. They are acting less active so I hope I won't loose them. -------------------------------------------- I turned up the temp. on my heater to raise the tanks temp. Are you saying 30 teaspoons of salt for my 30 gal tank? I got two responses to my question and 30 teaspoons vs.6 tablespoons seems pretty close in measurements. But do you agree with the water changes as well? I am thinking a 20% Change at least because it is time for a water change anyway. I could also dissolve the salt in the replacement water. If I keep adding salt every day without water changes wouldn't that make my water too salty? ________________________________________________________________ The first thing you should do is to raise the temperature of your aquarium. You will want to get it up to about 84-86^o F. This alone can eventually rid your fish of the ich. To hurry things along, though, you should also add salt to the water at the rate of a teaspoon for every gallon, and gradually increase the amount until you have 3 teaspoons per gallon. This treatment should continue for at least 10 days, or for several days after you notice the ich has disappeared from your fish to avoid a re-infection. _______________________ My numbers are up a tad. Nitrate is about 40 Nitrite .5 in the caution area I am low in Alkalinity about 40 Ph is about 7. ________________ Thanks for your help and sorry for being so dense. Evita __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12598	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/26/2005
Subject: Re: Move guppy?

That would depend on exactly what you have in the other tank. Just saying that you have catfish really does not tell us anything, other than it may be a good bet that most of the fish are bottom dwellers, but that does not apply to all catfish. A hoplo cat may see the guppy and say "Snack Time!" and there goes your guppy. When you do ask a question like this, we would need to know specifics of your other tank. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of panaque321 Sent: Sunday, June 26, 2005 9:20 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Move guppy? Hi, I'm new to this group and I have a question that some of you might be aboe to help with. At least, give me your opinion of this. I have a guppy in a nice planted bowl where he seems fine. I am wondering if I should move him to a larger tank which I have that has mostly catfish in it. The new tank would be bigger, and have other fish in it. Right now he is alone. Any thoughts? ..... Mackie Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12599	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/26/2005
Subject: Re: Can Water Change Kill My Fish?

Short answer, yes. You say you used dechlorinator when doing you water change, however, if you water contains chloramines rather than chlorine, the dechlorinator would be ineffective, and thus your fish could be harmed. If you have not done a water change for a long period of time, and I am talking months, there could be a sudden change in your pH that would cause your fish, at least, distress, at worst, the results that you have seen. If your water is, for some reason, very high in nitrates, this could cause a problem, but the problems with nitrates are not normally seen in a quick demise of your fish. Their could be other reasons as well, but I just got home from a concert and I am trying to whip through the e-mail I have so as to leave me with a clean slate going into tomorrow. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Kittie Kat Sent: Sunday, June 26, 2005 9:57 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Can Water Change Kill My Fish? The water change was about 10 percent of a 20 gal tank. the water was changed about 24 hours ago. now, two dead fish.... used some dechlorinator with the water change. still have 5 neons, 2 cat fish, 2 koolie loaches, some guppies, and.... all five of one week old babies are doing fine.... maybe we have had just bad luck with elderly fish that were ready for their fish heaven? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12600	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/26/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!

Evita, You should add water that is approximately the same as the tank water. Bringing up the temperature will take a bit of time as you just don't want to twist the rheostat knob more than enough to bring the indicator light on, so it will probably take several adjustments until you get it close. As I mentioned in one of my posts, table salt is fine, especially in a pinch. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evita Sent: Sunday, June 26, 2005 10:36 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE! I just got home and read both Steve and your posts. I only have table salt in the house. Can I use that to get started? Also are you saying with a 30 gal tank I will need to add 6 tablespoons of salt daily till along with water changes. Should I use warmed water or cold from the tap. I know this is a silly question but if I am trying to get the temperature up and do my water changes with cold water won't that take even longer to raise the temp. of aquarium water. Also causing temp fluctuations. Is about 7-9 gal. good for the part. water change. What do ya mean till all gone? What if they sill have a spot or two and I can't see it and miss them. Couldn't it come back. About how many days should it take? Evita TankGurl <fishgoddess@...> wrote: The best way to treat ick, (in addition to using a commercial remedy) is to add 1 tablespoon of kosher salt or aquarium salt per 5 gallons and turn up the heat on your tank to 84F. I'd do a 20-30% water change before adding the salt. In fact, it's better if you add the salt to your replacement water, let it dissolve, then add to tank. I would also follow this up by the same 20% water change *daily* with added salt until it's all gone. Quite often, this is enough to get rid of the ick. It should not effect your cycle process, but do not get anymore new fish until it's all gone. With the above suggestions, you will notice a decrease in the white dots by tomorrow. Good luck. Kelly -- 65g Malawi http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 135g Frontosa/Tang http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011 Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12601	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/26/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!

I thought I did mention a water change as a first course of action. I meant to anyway. 30 teaspoons would be 10 tablespoons, but you probably have less than 30 gallons in your tank, maybe as little as 25 gallons. Everything you have in the tank will displace some water. To get a better rough estimate, measure the tank (subtract for the thickness of the glass), then subtract from the height the thickness of your gravel bed, and the amount of space from the water surface to the top of the tank. Use inches. Then multiply what you have left for height, width and length and divide by 231 and the answer is the amount of water in gallons. This is a rough estimate, but should be close enough in this case. You'll probably end up in the 27-28 gallon range. Use salt for this amount of water. With the nitrite, it looks like your cycle had not quite finished yet. pH is good, and will be increased by the salt. Hey, At least you are asking questions. In a few years, you'll be able to answer a lot of questions off the top of your head, if you keep at it, to people who are at the stage you are now. I have years and years of experience behind me. I've picked the brains of some of the best in the hobby, I'm always willing to listen and learn (though, I think, there are e a few here who would rapidly state otherwise). I read, and I read a lot. (Unfortunately, not so much in the fish area lately. However, I've purchased about 8 books in the past year, and all will eventually be read.) Just keep in mind the difference between a novice and the expert is in the price of the fish they kill <G>. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evita Sent: Sunday, June 26, 2005 11:03 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE! Steve, I am 99.99999 percent sure it is ick. Thanks for the help. I feel so stupid at times. The dots do look like salt dots. mainly down the tail and fin. They are acting less active so I hope I won't loose them. -------------------------------------------- I turned up the temp. on my heater to raise the tanks temp. Are you saying 30 teaspoons of salt for my 30 gal tank? I got two responses to my question and 30 teaspoons vs.6 tablespoons seems pretty close in measurements. But do you agree with the water changes as well? I am thinking a 20% Change at least because it is time for a water change anyway. I could also dissolve the salt in the replacement water. If I keep adding salt every day without water changes wouldn't that make my water too salty? ________________________________________________________________ The first thing you should do is to raise the temperature of your aquarium. You will want to get it up to about 84-86^o F. This alone can eventually rid your fish of the ich. To hurry things along, though, you should also add salt to the water at the rate of a teaspoon for every gallon, and gradually increase the amount until you have 3 teaspoons per gallon. This treatment should continue for at least 10 days, or for several days after you notice the ich has disappeared from your fish to avoid a re-infection. _______________________ My numbers are up a tad. Nitrate is about 40 Nitrite .5 in the caution area I am low in Alkalinity about 40 Ph is about 7. ________________ Thanks for your help and sorry for being so dense. Evita

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12602	From: Evita	Date: 6/26/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!

Steve, One thing I have found out right on the bat is that "Fish People" are a special breed. It means alot to me that you or anyone would care about helping someone starting out, with only 4 little platys. It means a lot to me and I thank you. My hubby thinks I am a nut at this point. When I am into something it becomes a passion to me. He just see some cheap little fish. I see a beautiful world in itself. Oh heck, maybe I am a nut. Evita Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote:I thought I did mention a water change as a first course of action. I meant to anyway. 30 teaspoons would be 10 tablespoons, but you probably have less than 30 gallons in your tank, maybe as little as 25 gallons. Everything you have in the tank will displace some water. To get a better rough estimate, measure the tank (subtract for the thickness of the glass), then subtract from the height the thickness of your gravel bed, and the amount of space from the water surface to the top of the tank. Use inches. Then multiply what you have left for height, width and length and divide by 231 and the answer is the amount of water in gallons. This is a rough estimate, but should be close enough in this case. You'll probably end up in the 27-28 gallon range. Use salt for this amount of water. With the nitrite, it looks like your cycle had not quite finished yet. pH is good, and will be increased by the salt. Hey, At least you are asking questions. In a few years, you'll be able to answer a lot of questions off the top of your head, if you keep at it, to people who are at the stage you are now. I have years and years of experience behind me. I've picked the brains of some of the best in the hobby, I'm always willing to listen and learn (though, I think, there are e a few here who would rapidly state otherwise). I read, and I read a lot. (Unfortunately, not so much in the fish area lately. However, I've purchased about 8 books in the past year, and all will eventually be read.) Just keep in mind the difference between a novice and the expert is in the price of the fish they kill <G>. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evita Sent: Sunday, June 26, 2005 11:03 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE! Steve, I am 99.99999 percent sure it is ick. Thanks for the help. I feel so stupid at times. The dots do look like salt dots. mainly down the tail and fin. They are acting less active so I hope I won't loose them. -------------------------------------------- I turned up the temp. on my heater to raise the tanks temp. Are you saying 30 teaspoons of salt for my 30 gal tank? I got two responses to my question and 30 teaspoons vs.6 tablespoons seems pretty close in measurements. But do you agree with the water changes as well? I am thinking a 20% Change at least because it is time for a water change anyway. I could also dissolve the salt in the replacement water. If I keep adding salt every day without water changes wouldn't that make my water too salty? ________________________________________________________________ The first thing you should do is to raise the temperature of your aquarium. You will want to get it up to about 84-86^o F. This alone can eventually rid your fish of the ich. To hurry things along, though, you should also add salt to the water at the rate of a teaspoon for every gallon, and gradually increase the amount until you have 3 teaspoons per gallon. This treatment should continue for at least 10 days, or for several days after you notice the ich has disappeared from your fish to avoid a re-infection. _______________________ My numbers are up a tad. Nitrate is about 40 Nitrite .5 in the caution area I am low in Alkalinity about 40 Ph is about 7. ________________ Thanks for your help and sorry for being so dense. Evita Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Discover Yahoo! Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online & more. Check it out! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12603	From: sobi966	Date: 6/26/2005
Subject: Re: the first message

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "knelson1701" <knelson1701@y...> wrote: > There are quite a few fish that would be suitable for beginners. If > you are looking for fish easy to breed, some of the livebearers are > the easiest. For a beginner I would recommend the guppy, swordtail, > and platy. > > how big a tank are you planning on using? Also realize that many fish > will eat their own fry, so if you want a lot to survive you will need > a seperate tank to raise them in. I'd recommend getting a good book > and reading it before you buy a thing and see what your getting > yourself into. I know several good ones if you want to know. > > Keith > >Thank you for your kind advice. I haven't decided the size of a tank yet. So I'm going to get a good book as you advised. I'll study how I keep fish by that book and try my best.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12604	From: panaque321	Date: 6/27/2005
Subject: Re: Move guppy?

Sorry. No, the catfish aren't a problem at all, no predators. Let's see, there's about 10 Corys and a few small Loricariids, so that should be okay. This guppy has been around the house a while, lived in three different tanks. This is the first time he's been alone. He seems okay, but now I have a chance to move him and wondered if it's better for him to be in with more fish. you know, for stimulation and company. .... Mackie --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > That would depend on exactly what you have in the other tank. Just saying > that you have catfish really does not tell us anything, other than it may be > a good bet that most of the fish are bottom dwellers, but that does not > apply to all catfish. A hoplo cat may see the guppy and say "Snack Time!" > and there goes your guppy. When you do ask a question like this, we would > need to know specifics of your other tank. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of panaque321 > Sent: Sunday, June 26, 2005 9:20 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Move guppy? > > Hi, I'm new to this group and I have a question that some of you might > be aboe to help with. At least, give me your opinion of this. > I have a guppy in a nice planted bowl where he seems fine. > I am wondering if I should move him to a larger tank which I have that > has mostly catfish in it. The new tank would be bigger, and have > other fish in it. Right now he is alone. > Any thoughts? ..... Mackie > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12605	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 6/27/2005
Subject: Re: Can Water Change Kill My Fish?

It's always a good idea to let the water set for a while to make sure it's the same temp as your tank. Did you do this? Emily Kittie Kat <akquarium@...> wrote: The water change was about 10 percent of a 20 gal tank. the water was changed about 24 hours ago. now, two dead fish.... used some dechlorinator with the water change. still have 5 neons, 2 cat fish, 2 koolie loaches, some guppies, and.... all five of one week old babies are doing fine.... maybe we have had just bad luck with elderly fish that were ready for their fish heaven? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12606	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/27/2005
Subject: muskie grabbing a pike

this is a photo of a muskie (sp?) grabbing onto a pike that my husband's coworker was reeling in. he said the pike was about 12"-15" long so you can tell the muskie was humongous! my husband's coworker lives in minnesota so i'm assuming this was somewhere in minnesota too. i think i'm going to have weird dreams tonight after viewing this photo =) http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v681/valeen/muskie.jpg Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12607	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/27/2005
Subject: Re: Can Water Change Kill My Fish?

I don't think that a 10% change with a diff temp of water would kill off two fish. The variable wouldn't be great enough with the other 90%. It is good to keep the water near the same temp but I just don't see that minimal of an amount having a death affect. Just a thought. Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Can Water Change Kill My Fish? It's always a good idea to let the water set for a while to make sure it's the same temp as your tank. Did you do this? Emily

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12608	From: harry perry	Date: 6/27/2005
Subject: Re: muskie grabbing a pike

Muskie will also eat baby ducks, baby geese and small dogs. Don't dangle your feet over the side of the boat. Harry Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote: this is a photo of a muskie (sp?) grabbing onto a pike that my husband's coworker was reeling in. he said the pike was about 12"-15" long so you can tell the muskie was humongous! my husband's coworker lives in minnesota so i'm assuming this was somewhere in minnesota too. i think i'm going to have weird dreams tonight after viewing this photo =) http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v681/valeen/muskie.jpg Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs! Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12609	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/27/2005
Subject: Re: muskie grabbing a pike

What the HECK is a muskie? This is the craziest pic I've seen a long time. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez Sent: Monday, June 27, 2005 6:15 PM To: Aquatik City; Aquarium Club; Aquatic Life Subject: [AquaticLife] muskie grabbing a pike this is a photo of a muskie (sp?) grabbing onto a pike that my husband's coworker was reeling in. he said the pike was about 12"-15" long so you can tell the muskie was humongous! my husband's coworker lives in minnesota so i'm assuming this was somewhere in minnesota too. i think i'm going to have weird dreams tonight after viewing this photo =) http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v681/valeen/muskie.jpg Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs! Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12610	From: harry perry	Date: 6/27/2005
Subject: Re: muskie grabbing a pike/ A muskie

A native fish of North America. Found in the northern parts of the country. A predator easily reaching 4 foot. 'Harry Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: What the HECK is a muskie? This is the craziest pic I've seen a long time. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez Sent: Monday, June 27, 2005 6:15 PM To: Aquatik City; Aquarium Club; Aquatic Life Subject: [AquaticLife] muskie grabbing a pike this is a photo of a muskie (sp?) grabbing onto a pike that my husband's coworker was reeling in. he said the pike was about 12"-15" long so you can tell the muskie was humongous! my husband's coworker lives in minnesota so i'm assuming this was somewhere in minnesota too. i think i'm going to have weird dreams tonight after viewing this photo =) http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v681/valeen/muskie.jpg Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs! Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12611	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 6/27/2005
Subject: Re: muskie grabbing a pike/ A muskie

most incidents like that don't get recorded. Camera in the right spot at the right time.... I've had sea lions take 30-40 pound salmon off the line at the boat a couple times. I've also had pike take small pan fish off my line. Just natural the Muskie taking the pike... We had an incident back in Oregon ( USA ) about 10 years ago or so where the city of Salem or Albany drained one of the city parks ( Lakes) because people where reporting baby ducks and geese being taken off the water, a small dog was pulled under also but was able to get away. Once they drained the lake they found a couple Large Channel Catfish( 30-40 pound range ). Since channel cats are not native to that area they assume a fisherman transplanted into the lake. rob Indiana USA In a message dated 6/27/2005 6:49:42 PM US Eastern Standard Time, harryfisherman@... writes: > This is the craziest pic I've seen a long > time. > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12612	From: bunnycareshi	Date: 6/27/2005
Subject: Newbie-Getting 1st aquarium, secondhand

Aloha I am new to this group, and to aquariums, though I've been planning on getting one for months. I haven't had fish since I was a kid, so know very little, but I have been doing my homework. But to be clear, I have *never* owned an aquarium. Long story short, I found a 30 gal freshwater yesterday, complete w/undergravel filter, heater, lid and light, plus 2 clown loaches, a catfish and a type of angelfish at the price I wanted to spend, so decided to go that route. And I now have a million questions! First, I don't want an underground filter and want a power filter. Is that ok, and any recommendations? I live in Honolulu, so we do not have the selection (of anything!) you have on the mainland, but I know we have Penguin, Whisper and a few others. Next, I have yet to move the tank. The seller will drain it at his place and give me a bucket to move the fish. He says I don't have to isolate them for any period after re-filling the tank, that they are hardy enough to take the change. He said to use some of the old water for the nutrients etc and some of my faucet water, but what ratio? Also, he said to rinse the gravel, some of which I'll keep, again for the nutrients, but I want my own new gravel as I want different colors. Are those gravel "vacuums" good to use, or just use a sieve? Any advice appreciated. Everything seems complicated right now, but I'm really into reading and learning, and I find the yahoo groups an excellent source. Also, if anyone on this group is in Honolulu, do let me know. It's nice to have local contact. Cinde in Honolulu, Hawaii __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12613	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 6/27/2005
Subject: Re: muskie grabbing a pike/ A muskie

I can remember some of the cats they pulled out of Lake Sabine on the Texas/Louisiana border. They get some big ones that get stuck in the intakes on the dam. I can remember one was 12 ft long...talk about some fillets! One time I was snorkeling in a lake in SW MI. I was cruising the bottom in about 12 ft of water, right where it drops off to about 30-40 ft. All of a sudden, out of the darkness comes this huge alligator gar. All I saw was mouth and teeth before I hightailed it to the surface hehehe. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of FortWayneFish@... Sent: Monday, June 27, 2005 7:00 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] muskie grabbing a pike/ A muskie most incidents like that don't get recorded. Camera in the right spot at the right time.... I've had sea lions take 30-40 pound salmon off the line at the boat a couple times. I've also had pike take small pan fish off my line. Just natural the Muskie taking the pike... We had an incident back in Oregon ( USA ) about 10 years ago or so where the city of Salem or Albany drained one of the city parks ( Lakes) because people where reporting baby ducks and geese being taken off the water, a small dog was pulled under also but was able to get away. Once they drained the lake they found a couple Large Channel Catfish( 30-40 pound range ). Since channel cats are not native to that area they assume a fisherman transplanted into the lake. rob Indiana USA In a message dated 6/27/2005 6:49:42 PM US Eastern Standard Time, harryfisherman@... writes: > This is the craziest pic I've seen a long > time. > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12614	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 6/27/2005
Subject: Re: Newbie-Getting 1st aquarium, secondhand

I run both power filters and a UGF. My UGF is air driven with 4 uplift tubes and 2 air pumps. My water usually stays crystal clear. I have a 55 gallon tank. I currently have an Eclipse 2 hood which has a power filter (250 gph) with bio wheel built in as well as as an old penguin 100 and Tetratec (whisper) 40 (app 100gph each) that I had from previous tanks. The smaller pumps are going to get replaced by an Emperor 440 or another eclipse hood. You may want to look into the Eclipse 3 hood, which is for the 30 gallon tanks. go to marineland.com to see them. The do a great job of filtering, plus they look a Hel of a lot nicer than the standard hood and hang on back filters. As far as undergravel filters, you will probably find as many people who love them as you will find people that hate them. I think they do a great job, so I guess it is rally a matter of personal choice. They are a bit high maintenance as you have to regularly clean your gravel. I use a gravel vacuum and it works great. You also have the added benefit of doing a water change while you vacuum. Power filters. I like the biowheel models as they help with biological filtration. The Penguin and the Emperor models from Marineland have the Biowheel, while the Tetratec have a sponge that supposedly serves the same purpose. The Emperor models are higher quality from what I hear and do not have the same problems some have had with the penguin models. If you can't access these items locally, you may have to look online. Marine land does direct sales and there is also a plethora of aquarium supply sites...to include the major pet stores (Petco, Petsmart, Petland). Blessings, Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of bunnycareshi Sent: Monday, June 27, 2005 2:24 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Newbie-Getting 1st aquarium, secondhand Aloha I am new to this group, and to aquariums, though I've been planning on getting one for months. I haven't had fish since I was a kid, so know very little, but I have been doing my homework. But to be clear, I have *never* owned an aquarium. Long story short, I found a 30 gal freshwater yesterday, complete w/undergravel filter, heater, lid and light, plus 2 clown loaches, a catfish and a type of angelfish at the price I wanted to spend, so decided to go that route. And I now have a million questions! First, I don't want an underground filter and want a power filter. Is that ok, and any recommendations? I live in Honolulu, so we do not have the selection (of anything!) you have on the mainland, but I know we have Penguin, Whisper and a few others. Next, I have yet to move the tank. The seller will drain it at his place and give me a bucket to move the fish. He says I don't have to isolate them for any period after re-filling the tank, that they are hardy enough to take the change. He said to use some of the old water for the nutrients etc and some of my faucet water, but what ratio? Also, he said to rinse the gravel, some of which I'll keep, again for the nutrients, but I want my own new gravel as I want different colors. Are those gravel "vacuums" good to use, or just use a sieve? Any advice appreciated. Everything seems complicated right now, but I'm really into reading and learning, and I find the yahoo groups an excellent source. Also, if anyone on this group is in Honolulu, do let me know. It's nice to have local contact. Cinde in Honolulu, Hawaii __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12615	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/27/2005
Subject: Re: Move guppy?

In that case, it should be OK to move him in. However, he really does not need companionship. This would be a case of anthromorphism--putting human characteristics to an animal--and it is not warranted. He'll do fine by himself. If you wish to consolidate tanks, that would be a good reason. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of panaque321 Sent: Monday, June 27, 2005 11:55 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Move guppy? Sorry. No, the catfish aren't a problem at all, no predators. Let's see, there's about 10 Corys and a few small Loricariids, so that should be okay. This guppy has been around the house a while, lived in three different tanks. This is the first time he's been alone. He seems okay, but now I have a chance to move him and wondered if it's better for him to be in with more fish. you know, for stimulation and company. .... Mackie --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > That would depend on exactly what you have in the other tank. Just saying > that you have catfish really does not tell us anything, other than it may be > a good bet that most of the fish are bottom dwellers, but that does not > apply to all catfish. A hoplo cat may see the guppy and say "Snack Time!" > and there goes your guppy. When you do ask a question like this, we would > need to know specifics of your other tank. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of panaque321 > Sent: Sunday, June 26, 2005 9:20 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Move guppy? > > Hi, I'm new to this group and I have a question that some of you might > be aboe to help with. At least, give me your opinion of this. > I have a guppy in a nice planted bowl where he seems fine. > I am wondering if I should move him to a larger tank which I have that > has mostly catfish in it. The new tank would be bigger, and have > other fish in it. Right now he is alone. > Any thoughts? ..... Mackie > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12616	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: Is my snail Dead?

i didn't get a email that any one responded but the emailer said that she got tons of responses where they like personally to you... cause im thinking lots of ppl in the group learn from what others say and we can learn if we don't get the emails too.. if you need help with your snails still let me know i have a good knowledge of them.. Shannon you didn't get an answer. I have never had snails and I have little if no experience with Aquariums. I hope your snail is OK. It has been really slow in here all day. Usually if you don't get an answer no one knows the answer or no one that knows the answer is on line. It can be frustrating at times. Evita yarncrazymom <yarncrazymom@...> wrote: Thanks for all the replys to my question...this is such a helpful group...LOL.. See ya Rho > Oh please help me figure it out :O) I have two trap door snails and > they were both very active and eating fine. the one went into hi > shell yesturday morning and hasnt moved at all...I even took him out > of the tank today and felt the trap door and it seemed to go further > into the shell, I put it back in the water and it has been several > hours and still nothing...I hate to discard him if he is alive but I > hate to leave him dead in my tank...Help.... > > Thanks > Rhonda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12617	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Homepage picture

The picture on the homepage is saddening. Isn't that a cruelty that several were talking about...dying the blood parrots? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12618	From: yarncrazymom	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!

Im new here...but I dont think I would use KOSHER Salt to my fishtank...No... it has additives in there that you do not need to add to an already stressed tank.....Just MHO before more damage was done... Rho > The best way to treat ick, (in addition to using a commercial remedy) > is to add 1 tablespoon of kosher salt or aquarium salt per 5 gallons > and turn up the heat on your tank to 84F. I'd do a 20-30% water change > before adding the salt. In fact, it's better if you add the salt to > your replacement water, let it dissolve, then add to tank. > > I would also follow this up by the same 20% water change *daily* with > added salt until it's all gone. > > Quite often, this is enough to get rid of the ick. It should not > effect your cycle process, but do not get anymore new fish until it's > all gone. With the above suggestions, you will notice a decrease in > the white dots by tomorrow. > > Good luck. > > Kelly > > -- > 65g Malawi > http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 > 135g Frontosa/Tang > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12619	From: yarncrazymom	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!

My hubby thinks I am a nut at this point. When I am into something it becomes a passion to me. He just see some cheap little fish. I see a beautiful world in itself. Oh heck, maybe I am a nut. Evita > Your DH and mine sound a lot alike...He thinks I am totally nuts...I sit and watch my fish every night for an hour or longer just sitting there till I turn out the light and tell them good night :O)...Yes I think we are alittle Nutty..but what the heck....at least we aren't alone :O) Good luck on your tank...Ive only had my tank for 6 months and have learned so much through trial and error and help from others who are willing to share the knowledge they have... Ive lost a 3 platties and a snail and 2 molly's since I put my tank up...never lost a fancy guppie...thank goodness and I feel that my tank is healthy and happy now...at least I hope so....I lost a snail recently but it may have been the stress as he was new to the tank... Good luck Rho

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12620	From: Tim Fairchild	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!

On Wednesday 29 Jun 2005 01:09, yarncrazymom wrote: > Im new here...but I dont think I would use KOSHER Salt to my > fishtank...No... it has additives in there that you do not need to > add to an already stressed tank.....Just MHO before more damage was > done... Kosher salt is okay. The going max rate is 2grams/litre. I don't use teaspoons as it's hard to be accurate. I weigh it out :) tim -- --------------------------------------------------------- Tim & Therese Fairchild Atchafalaya Border Collies. Kuttabul, Queensland, Australia. --------------------------------------------------------- Email mailto:tim@... Homepage http://www.bcs4me.com Photos http://www.pbase.com/amosf ---------------------------------------------------------

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12621	From: TankGurl	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!

On 6/28/05, yarncrazymom <yarncrazymom@...> wrote: > Im new here...but I dont think I would use KOSHER Salt to my > fishtank...No... it has additives in there that you do not need to > add to an already stressed tank.....Just MHO before more damage was > done... Kosher salt generally does NOT have additives.Which is why it's used in kosher cooking. It's the same as table salt but does not contain iodine. It is also available in flake form which dissolves easily for water prep. I've used kosher, but more often than not use Doc's Aquarium Salt. Kosher salt is fine for buffering use. Kelly

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12622	From: yarncrazymom	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!

Unfortunately, Morton's Kosher Salt (as well as others) contains Yellow Prussiate of Soda Yellow prussate of soda is the archaic name for sodium ferrocyanide (Na4Fe[CN]6.3H2O). I believe that ferrocyanide salts are a lot less toxic than cyanides. Its a soda form to prevent the salt from sticking together in clumps.As with other sodas,it can raise your PH level sharply and have been known to creat enough suspended insolubles that they clogged gills and/or other problems. Will it hurt your tank or fish..probably not...but to someone who is new to this it is complicated enough and I would advise to stay away from things that could pose troublesome to the novice. Salt issues are a topic that can go on and on and I enjoy knowing what others have found out and have learned through trial... Anything that adds more to an otherwise stressed tank is not advised in my oppinion. Since we obviously have to add things to the water to keep it as stress free as we can..we do want to make sure that we limit the extras that have no reason or cause to be in the water. Keep it as natural as you can and keep the Junk and additives out! Use a good Aquarium Salt. Just my oppinion Rho > > Im new here...but I dont think I would use KOSHER Salt to my > > fishtank...No... it has additives in there that you do not need to > > add to an already stressed tank.....Just MHO before more damage was > > done... > > Kosher salt generally does NOT have additives.Which is why it's used > in kosher cooking. It's the same as table salt but does not contain > iodine. It is also available in flake form which dissolves easily for > water prep. > > I've used kosher, but more often than not use Doc's Aquarium Salt. > Kosher salt is fine for buffering use. > > Kelly

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12623	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!

Exactly what additives does your kosher salt contain? Kosher salt is either just plain salt (sodium chloride) or, and some here do disagree, but not the rabbi I spoke to, may contain an anti-caking agent, just like the one your table salt contains. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of yarncrazymom Sent: Tuesday, June 28, 2005 11:10 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE! Im new here...but I dont think I would use KOSHER Salt to my fishtank...No... it has additives in there that you do not need to add to an already stressed tank.....Just MHO before more damage was done... Rho > The best way to treat ick, (in addition to using a commercial remedy) > is to add 1 tablespoon of kosher salt or aquarium salt per 5 gallons > and turn up the heat on your tank to 84F. I'd do a 20-30% water change > before adding the salt. In fact, it's better if you add the salt to > your replacement water, let it dissolve, then add to tank. > > I would also follow this up by the same 20% water change *daily* with > added salt until it's all gone. > > Quite often, this is enough to get rid of the ick. It should not > effect your cycle process, but do not get anymore new fish until it's > all gone. With the above suggestions, you will notice a decrease in > the white dots by tomorrow. > > Good luck. > > Kelly > > -- > 65g Malawi > http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 > 135g Frontosa/Tang > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011 Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12624	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!

You would need to use a lot of yellow prussiate of sada to get the symptoms of which you speak. The amount used in any salt is not very much, in the whole scheme of things. Also, not all kosher salt contains the anti-caking agent. However, table salt does, and it is also safe to use in an aquarium (again some would disagree because of the iodine that has been added). Heck, if we take the chemical name of salt and look at it, we should not be using it either. After all, it does contain a form of chlorine, a chemical fatal to fish. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of yarncrazymom Sent: Tuesday, June 28, 2005 3:25 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE! Unfortunately, Morton's Kosher Salt (as well as others) contains Yellow Prussiate of Soda Yellow prussate of soda is the archaic name for sodium ferrocyanide (Na4Fe[CN]6.3H2O). I believe that ferrocyanide salts are a lot less toxic than cyanides. Its a soda form to prevent the salt from sticking together in clumps.As with other sodas,it can raise your PH level sharply and have been known to creat enough suspended insolubles that they clogged gills and/or other problems. Will it hurt your tank or fish..probably not...but to someone who is new to this it is complicated enough and I would advise to stay away from things that could pose troublesome to the novice. Salt issues are a topic that can go on and on and I enjoy knowing what others have found out and have learned through trial... Anything that adds more to an otherwise stressed tank is not advised in my oppinion. Since we obviously have to add things to the water to keep it as stress free as we can..we do want to make sure that we limit the extras that have no reason or cause to be in the water. Keep it as natural as you can and keep the Junk and additives out! Use a good Aquarium Salt. Just my oppinion Rho > > Im new here...but I dont think I would use KOSHER Salt to my > > fishtank...No... it has additives in there that you do not need to > > add to an already stressed tank.....Just MHO before more damage was > > done... > > Kosher salt generally does NOT have additives.Which is why it's used > in kosher cooking. It's the same as table salt but does not contain > iodine. It is also available in flake form which dissolves easily for > water prep. > > I've used kosher, but more often than not use Doc's Aquarium Salt. > Kosher salt is fine for buffering use. > > Kelly Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12625	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: muskie grabbing a pike

that is truly horrifying! glad i don't live in muskie country =) --- harry perry <harryfisherman@...> wrote: > Muskie will also eat baby ducks, baby geese and small dogs. Don't dangle your feet over the side > of the boat. > > Harry > > Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote: > this is a photo of a muskie (sp?) grabbing onto a pike that my husband's coworker was reeling > in. > he said the pike was about 12"-15" long so you can tell the muskie was humongous! my husband's > coworker lives in minnesota so i'm assuming this was somewhere in minnesota too. > > i think i'm going to have weird dreams tonight after viewing this photo =) > > http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v681/valeen/muskie.jpg > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if > changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: > old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Sports > Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12626	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: muskie grabbing a pike/ A muskie

yeah, he said he was lucky his wife was in the boat with him and had her camera ready to take pictures of his catch. my parents live in oregon (outside of eugene) i should ask them if they heard that incident of the big catfish! i thought it was bad enough waking up to about a foot long ugly-a$$ catfish in my face (courtesy of my obnoxious older brother's idea of fun) if i ever saw a 4 ft one i would definitely have had nightmares that night. --- FortWayneFish@... wrote: > most incidents like that don't get recorded. Camera in the right spot at the > right time.... > I've had sea lions take 30-40 pound salmon off the line at the boat a couple > times. I've also had pike take small pan fish off my line. Just natural the > Muskie taking the pike... > > We had an incident back in Oregon ( USA ) about 10 years ago or so where the > city of Salem or Albany drained one of the city parks ( Lakes) because people > where reporting baby ducks and geese being taken off the water, a small dog > was pulled under also but was able to get away. Once they drained the lake they > found a couple Large Channel Catfish( 30-40 pound range ). Since channel cats > are not native to that area they assume a fisherman transplanted into the > lake. > > rob > Indiana > USA > > > > In a message dated 6/27/2005 6:49:42 PM US Eastern Standard Time, > harryfisherman@... writes: > > > > This is the craziest pic I've seen a long > > time. > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12627	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: muskie grabbing a pike/ A muskie

did you say 12 ft?!?!?! they must look like monsters at that length!! --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > I can remember some of the cats they pulled out of Lake Sabine on the > Texas/Louisiana border. They get some big ones that get stuck in the > intakes on the dam. I can remember one was 12 ft long...talk about some > fillets! > > One time I was snorkeling in a lake in SW MI. I was cruising the bottom in > about 12 ft of water, right where it drops off to about 30-40 ft. All of a > sudden, out of the darkness comes this huge alligator gar. All I saw was > mouth and teeth before I hightailed it to the surface hehehe. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of FortWayneFish@... > Sent: Monday, June 27, 2005 7:00 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] muskie grabbing a pike/ A muskie > > > most incidents like that don't get recorded. Camera in the right spot at the > > right time.... > I've had sea lions take 30-40 pound salmon off the line at the boat a couple > > times. I've also had pike take small pan fish off my line. Just natural > the > Muskie taking the pike... > > We had an incident back in Oregon ( USA ) about 10 years ago or so where the > > city of Salem or Albany drained one of the city parks ( Lakes) because > people > where reporting baby ducks and geese being taken off the water, a small dog > was pulled under also but was able to get away. Once they drained the lake > they > found a couple Large Channel Catfish( 30-40 pound range ). Since channel > cats > are not native to that area they assume a fisherman transplanted into the > lake. > > rob > Indiana > USA > > > > In a message dated 6/27/2005 6:49:42 PM US Eastern Standard Time, > harryfisherman@... writes: > > > > This is the craziest pic I've seen a long > > time. > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12628	From: LobsterPond.com	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Muskie Tales

Hey, you didn't know about muskies? Yes, muskie are big and the tales about them are endless. You will always remember the one about the fisherman who got one on his line - him and his boat were pulled around Leach Lake all day and then night. He was never heard from again. Muskies are the reason most boaters carry billy club or baseball bat in the boat. You HAVE TO KNOCK the fish out if you get it in the boat. Northerns (by the way) are a cross of muskie and some trout type fish. From a muskie fisher-woman

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12629	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: Muskie Tales

No I never had heard of them. I told my husband of this and showed him the picture. He was impressed and he fishes all the time (about twice a week.) He said muskies and that fish he was eating are related. Yuck. I then read that people actually go on angling trips to catch these things. No thanks. I'll stick with skydiving for my rush. I think it's safer. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of LobsterPond.com Sent: Tuesday, June 28, 2005 3:29 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Muskie Tales Hey, you didn't know about muskies? Yes, muskie are big and the tales about them are endless. You will always remember the one about the fisherman who got one on his line - him and his boat were pulled around Leach Lake all day and then night. He was never heard from again. Muskies are the reason most boaters carry billy club or baseball bat in the boat. You HAVE TO KNOCK the fish out if you get it in the boat. Northerns (by the way) are a cross of muskie and some trout type fish. From a muskie fisher-woman Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12630	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: Muskie Tales

yuck is right! i still get the creeps when i think about that picture. --- Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: > No I never had heard of them. I told my husband of this and showed him > the picture. He was impressed and he fishes all the time (about twice a > week.) He said muskies and that fish he was eating are related. Yuck. > I then read that people actually go on angling trips to catch these > things. No thanks. I'll stick with skydiving for my rush. I think > it's safer. > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of LobsterPond.com > Sent: Tuesday, June 28, 2005 3:29 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Muskie Tales > > > > Hey, you didn't know about muskies? > > Yes, muskie are big and the tales about them are endless. You will > always remember the one about the fisherman who got one on his line - > him and his boat were pulled around Leach Lake all day and then night. > He was never heard from again. > > Muskies are the reason most boaters carry billy club or baseball bat in > the boat. You HAVE TO KNOCK the fish out if you get it in the boat. > > Northerns (by the way) are a cross of muskie and some trout type fish. > > From a muskie fisher-woman > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important > to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify > the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we > Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12631	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: muskie grabbing a pike/ A muskie

yep...they have caught 14-16 footers in the past. Cats can get huge... Most of these are river cats that also go out into the Gulf. The largest I ever caught while fishing on the jetties in Cameron, LA was about 3 feet long. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez Sent: Tuesday, June 28, 2005 3:27 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] muskie grabbing a pike/ A muskie did you say 12 ft?!?!?! they must look like monsters at that length!! --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > I can remember some of the cats they pulled out of Lake Sabine on the > Texas/Louisiana border. They get some big ones that get stuck in the > intakes on the dam. I can remember one was 12 ft long...talk about some > fillets! > > One time I was snorkeling in a lake in SW MI. I was cruising the bottom in > about 12 ft of water, right where it drops off to about 30-40 ft. All of a > sudden, out of the darkness comes this huge alligator gar. All I saw was > mouth and teeth before I hightailed it to the surface hehehe. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of FortWayneFish@... > Sent: Monday, June 27, 2005 7:00 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] muskie grabbing a pike/ A muskie > > > most incidents like that don't get recorded. Camera in the right spot at the > > right time.... > I've had sea lions take 30-40 pound salmon off the line at the boat a couple > > times. I've also had pike take small pan fish off my line. Just natural > the > Muskie taking the pike... > > We had an incident back in Oregon ( USA ) about 10 years ago or so where the > > city of Salem or Albany drained one of the city parks ( Lakes) because > people > where reporting baby ducks and geese being taken off the water, a small dog > was pulled under also but was able to get away. Once they drained the lake > they > found a couple Large Channel Catfish( 30-40 pound range ). Since channel > cats > are not native to that area they assume a fisherman transplanted into the > lake. > > rob > Indiana > USA > > > > In a message dated 6/27/2005 6:49:42 PM US Eastern Standard Time, > harryfisherman@... writes: > > > > This is the craziest pic I've seen a long > > time. > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs! Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12632	From: Eric Miner	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Big problem with hair algae

Hello everybody, I've got a real hair algae problem. It started a few weeks ago and has only gotten worse. I've tried to manually remove it no good. I tried water changes no good. Now it's gotten into the substrate. I've tried the method of creating a lighting cycle by having the lights on for 6 hrs. then 3 hrs. off then 6 hrs. on. This seems to have slowed it down a bit, but hasn't stopped it. One issue I think could be part of the problem is that I don't have enough lighting to allow the plants to grow fast enough to out-compete the algae. I have 46 gl tank with a 96 watt compact fluorescent bulb. That's just over 2 watts/gallon. I'm thinking of doubling that in the future. Do you think that would help the plants enough to beat back the hair algae? My ammonia, nitrites and nitrates number stay the same no matter if I do a water change or not. Nitrates are at about 12.5 ppm. If I do a water change the number go right back up 24 hrs. later. I strongly believe that the regular tests available and the LFS are simply not accurate enough to track changes. I've ordered supposedly not accurate tests from Kordon. I have number of shrimp (Japanese) that don't seem interested in the hair algae. I don't want to add more fish to this tank. Here's what I'm thinking of for solutions – 1.more wattage per gallon to allow the existing plants to grow more strongly 2.continue to manually remove the hair algae 3.add nitrite/nitrate and phosphate absorbing chemicals/biologicals to lower the nitrate numbers. Please, any other suggestions are very welcome. Thanks in advance, Eric

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12633	From: John Gonzalez	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: muskie grabbing a pike/ A muskie

Imagine if you were noodling for one & that sucker get's a hold of your hand... you will be dragged wherever that cat wants to go!!! --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > yep...they have caught 14-16 footers in the past. > Cats can get huge... > Most of these are river cats that also go out into > the Gulf. The largest I > ever caught while fishing on the jetties in Cameron, > LA was about 3 feet > long. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez > Sent: Tuesday, June 28, 2005 3:27 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] muskie grabbing a pike/ A > muskie > > > did you say 12 ft?!?!?! they must look like monsters > at that length!! > > --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > > > I can remember some of the cats they pulled out of > Lake Sabine on the > > Texas/Louisiana border. They get some big ones > that get stuck in the > > intakes on the dam. I can remember one was 12 ft > long...talk about some > > fillets! > > > > One time I was snorkeling in a lake in SW MI. I > was cruising the bottom > in > > about 12 ft of water, right where it drops off to > about 30-40 ft. All of > a > > sudden, out of the darkness comes this huge > alligator gar. All I saw was > > mouth and teeth before I hightailed it to the > surface hehehe. > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of FortWayneFish@... > > Sent: Monday, June 27, 2005 7:00 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] muskie grabbing a pike/ > A muskie > > > > > > most incidents like that don't get recorded. > Camera in the right spot at > the > > > > right time.... > > I've had sea lions take 30-40 pound salmon off the > line at the boat a > couple > > > > times. I've also had pike take small pan fish > off my line. Just natural > > the > > Muskie taking the pike... > > > > We had an incident back in Oregon ( USA ) about 10 > years ago or so where > the > > > > city of Salem or Albany drained one of the city > parks ( Lakes) because > > people > > where reporting baby ducks and geese being taken > off the water, a small > dog > > was pulled under also but was able to get away. > Once they drained the lake > > they > > found a couple Large Channel Catfish( 30-40 pound > range ). Since channel > > cats > > are not native to that area they assume a > fisherman transplanted into the > > > lake. > > > > rob > > Indiana > > USA > > > > > > > > In a message dated 6/27/2005 6:49:42 PM US Eastern > Standard Time, > > harryfisherman@... writes: > > > > > > > This is the craziest pic I've seen a long > > > time. > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > when replying, thanks > > . > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text > that is not important to > > the reply and if changing the topic of the > original message modify the > > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <-, we Thank You > > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on > the web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an > email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of Service > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when > replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text > that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original > message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the > web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > === message truncated === __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour: http://tour.mail.yahoo.com/mailtour.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12634	From: Evita	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!

Rho, You make me feel much better. I just got on line from the other night so I hadn't had time to write back or answer any-ones posts. I was really excited to see so many on my question. I saw yours first so I will post my update on the last two days. First of all I will digress a bit. Looking back now I am thinking three things on when I first brought them home from the pet store. Point one....... I live in a small town and we don't really have any options on where to buy our fish. We have a mom and pop place in town and a Walmart. The pet shop I use to go to went out of business. The mom and pop place is nasty and dirty. When they bought it they said they were going to clean it up. It was even nastier. I mean really bad. They how ever never cleaned the tanks up. They are all so heavy with algae you can't see the fish. So I would never buy there. Then Walmart always has sick and dying fish. I was checking out their fish for the past few months and looking really close. I have seen fish in their tanks with ick and they still sell them. I mean heavy ick. So I was going to drive to Winston Salem miles away to get my fish. Well then I saw the platys. They look great. I went back time and time again to see that they still looked good. They did so I decided to get them. They only give 3 day rebates on dead fish. And about 5 days after I bought them they started to show spots. Right before they openly looked sick I went back to look at some more fish that really caught my eye. When I got there they were (only 2 days later) SICK AND DYING. I told the guy working there that all the fish were sick and dying just two days later. He goes, ( She treats them everyday.....blaw blaw) Red flag! I have learned my lesson. No more Walmart. I really think they need to take down their tanks and start over instead of putting more fish in them. What is happening is they get healthy fish and they go in their tanks and get affected. They don't look sick when you buy them and a few days after you bring them home (I might add after the bring them back refund time) they get sick. Now I have to wait to add anymore fish to my tank. Point Two........ Now looking back when I brought them home I noticed the fish although they looked health they didn't swim around the tank they just sort of went into hiding. I had to keep looking for them. They grouped up at the corners in the back of the tank. I thought they were nervous from the transfer. Now I am thinking stress and being ill. Point three.....Oh well I forget already what that was ...I have 3 kids interrupting me every 2 minutes and my train of thought jumped the track. Now to the present. I treated them the other night ......Sun. really late. I stayed up till about 3:30 am trying to gradually raise the temp of the tank. I had to work the next day. I was whipped the next day. Talk about being a nut. I got 3 hours of sleep for 4 platys I bought for $1.87. Sadly when I got up that morning I had one dead fish in the tank. It was one of the hardier looking ones but also the one that had different signs of illness. I pulled him out and looked at his lower tail above the fin and the white patch looked like he rubbed off the scales. It wasn't slimy but washed out looking. The others show no sign of this. But one fish is more ill than the others. She is from time to time spending more time at the top of the tank and less active. At the same time all three are practically free of the white dots and unlike when I brought them home are now seemingly more happy and now swimming and chasing each other all over the tank. They all are eating. I still think I may loose the small one that keeps resting at the top of the tank tough. I did another water change and added more salt. I used reg. table salt. But I plan to get some sea salt in the morning. Oh I might add on the good side. My baby fry are doing wonderful. None dead and none sick from what I see. Eating well and a tad larger. Oh also my girls said they saw two more babies in the adult tank that I must have missed when I caught the others. I am going to leave them as not to transfer any problems from the parents to my baby nursery tank. If they survive they were meant to. If the adults eat them, oh well I guess. Thanks for making me feel better and welcome. Sorry for your loses as well. I also apologize for such a long post. I figured to put most all my post in one post. Anyone that makes it through my whole post ....."HATS OFF TO THEM!"I guess you can see I am fired up. Great Group. Evita --------------------------------- Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12635	From: Evita	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!

Tim, I don't have a scale. I used my cooking spoons. Evita Tim Fairchild <tim@...> wrote:On Wednesday 29 Jun 2005 01:09, yarncrazymom wrote: > Im new here...but I dont think I would use KOSHER Salt to my > fishtank...No... it has additives in there that you do not need to > add to an already stressed tank.....Just MHO before more damage was > done... Kosher salt is okay. The going max rate is 2grams/litre. I don't use teaspoons as it's hard to be accurate. I weigh it out :) tim -- --------------------------------------------------------- Tim & Therese Fairchild Atchafalaya Border Collies. Kuttabul, Queensland, Australia. --------------------------------------------------------- Email mailto:tim@... Homepage http://www.bcs4me.com Photos http://www.pbase.com/amosf --------------------------------------------------------- Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Mail Mobile Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12636	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: muskie grabbing a pike/ A muskie - Noodling?

Noodling? Is that where they stick their hands down in the muck and feel around under rocks and ledges until one grabs hold of your hand? Hmmmm. Someone smart came up with that idea eh? ;) -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of John Gonzalez Sent: Tuesday, June 28, 2005 5:00 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] muskie grabbing a pike/ A muskie Imagine if you were noodling for one & that sucker get's a hold of your hand... you will be dragged wherever that cat wants to go!!! --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > yep...they have caught 14-16 footers in the past. > Cats can get huge... > Most of these are river cats that also go out into > the Gulf. The largest I > ever caught while fishing on the jetties in Cameron, > LA was about 3 feet > long. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez > Sent: Tuesday, June 28, 2005 3:27 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] muskie grabbing a pike/ A > muskie > > > did you say 12 ft?!?!?! they must look like monsters > at that length!! > > --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > > > I can remember some of the cats they pulled out of > Lake Sabine on the > > Texas/Louisiana border. They get some big ones > that get stuck in the > > intakes on the dam. I can remember one was 12 ft > long...talk about some > > fillets! > > > > One time I was snorkeling in a lake in SW MI. I > was cruising the bottom > in > > about 12 ft of water, right where it drops off to > about 30-40 ft. All of > a > > sudden, out of the darkness comes this huge > alligator gar. All I saw was > > mouth and teeth before I hightailed it to the > surface hehehe. > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of FortWayneFish@... > > Sent: Monday, June 27, 2005 7:00 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] muskie grabbing a pike/ > A muskie > > > > > > most incidents like that don't get recorded. > Camera in the right spot at > the > > > > right time.... > > I've had sea lions take 30-40 pound salmon off the > line at the boat a > couple > > > > times. I've also had pike take small pan fish > off my line. Just natural > > the > > Muskie taking the pike... > > > > We had an incident back in Oregon ( USA ) about 10 > years ago or so where > the > > > > city of Salem or Albany drained one of the city > parks ( Lakes) because > > people > > where reporting baby ducks and geese being taken > off the water, a small > dog > > was pulled under also but was able to get away. > Once they drained the lake > > they > > found a couple Large Channel Catfish( 30-40 pound > range ). Since channel > > cats > > are not native to that area they assume a > fisherman transplanted into the > > > lake. > > > > rob > > Indiana > > USA > > > > > > > > In a message dated 6/27/2005 6:49:42 PM US Eastern > Standard Time, > > harryfisherman@... writes: > > > > > > > This is the craziest pic I've seen a long > > > time. > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > when replying, thanks > > . > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text > that is not important to > > the reply and if changing the topic of the > original message modify the > > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <-, we Thank You > > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on > the web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an > email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of Service > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text > that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original > message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the > web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > === message truncated === __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour: http://tour.mail.yahoo.com/mailtour.html Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12637	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!

Hi Rho, If you are still hesitant about using Kosher salt (primarily Morton's), because of the Yellow Prussiate of Soda additive in spite of the many replies on this substance, do not use Morton's or any other brand that may contain this stuff but instead use Diamond Crystal brand. This brand of Kosher salt contains NO additives whatsoever and is pure Sodium Chloride (NaCl), i.e. -- Salt, and as safe as you can get and what most people use. Regards, ANYONE \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "yarncrazymom" <yarncrazymom@y...> wrote: > Unfortunately, Morton's Kosher Salt (as well as others) contains > Yellow Prussiate of Soda > Yellow prussate of soda is the archaic name for sodium ferrocyanide > (Na4Fe[CN]6.3H2O). I believe that ferrocyanide salts are a lot less > toxic than cyanides. > Its a soda form to prevent the salt from sticking together in > clumps.As with other sodas,it can raise your PH level sharply and have > been known to creat enough suspended insolubles that they > clogged gills and/or other problems. > Will it hurt your tank or fish..probably not...but to someone who is > new to this it is complicated enough and I would advise to stay away > from things that could pose troublesome to the novice. > Salt issues are a topic that can go on and on and I enjoy knowing what > others have found out and have learned through trial... > Anything that adds more to an otherwise stressed tank is not advised > in my oppinion. Since we obviously have to add things to the water to > keep it as stress free as we can..we do want to make sure that we > limit the extras that have no reason or cause to be in the water. Keep > it as natural as you can and keep the Junk and additives out! Use a > good Aquarium Salt. > > Just my oppinion > Rho > > > > > > > Im new here...but I dont think I would use KOSHER Salt to my > > > fishtank...No... it has additives in there that you do not need to > > > add to an already stressed tank.....Just MHO before more damage was > > > done... > > > > Kosher salt generally does NOT have additives.Which is why it's used > > in kosher cooking. It's the same as table salt but does not contain > > iodine. It is also available in flake form which dissolves easily for > > water prep. > > > > I've used kosher, but more often than not use Doc's Aquarium Salt. > > Kosher salt is fine for buffering use. > > > > Kelly

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12638	From: Evita	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!

Thanks! Rho. for the info. Evita --------------------------------- Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12639	From: Evita	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!

Steve, Very interesting. I posted an update on my post. I hope you read it. It is very long though. For that I am truely sorry. Evita Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote:You would need to use a lot of yellow prussiate of sada to get the symptoms of which you speak. The amount used in any salt is not very much, in the whole scheme of things. Also, not all kosher salt contains the anti-caking agent. However, table salt does, and it is also safe to use in an aquarium (again some would disagree because of the iodine that has been added). Heck, if we take the chemical name of salt and look at it, we should not be using it either. After all, it does contain a form of chlorine, a chemical fatal to fish. \\Steve// --------------------------------- Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12640	From: Evita	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: muskie grabbing a pike/ A muskie

My dad used to tell us stories when we were growing up about catfish a big as cars deep in the murkie waters of the Tennesse river. The monsters of the deep as it were. Evita Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote:yeah, he said he was lucky his wife was in the boat with him and had her camera ready to take pictures of his catch. my parents live in oregon (outside of eugene) i should ask them if they heard that incident of the big catfish! i thought it was bad enough waking up to about a foot long ugly-a$$ catfish in my face (courtesy of my obnoxious older brother's idea of fun) if i ever saw a 4 ft one i would definitely have had nightmares that night. --- FortWayneFish@... wrote: > most incidents like that don't get recorded. Camera in the right spot at the > right time.... > I've had sea lions take 30-40 pound salmon off the line at the boat a couple > times. I've also had pike take small pan fish off my line. Just natural the > Muskie taking the pike... > > We had an incident back in Oregon ( USA ) about 10 years ago or so where the > city of Salem or Albany drained one of the city parks ( Lakes) because people > where reporting baby ducks and geese being taken off the water, a small dog > was pulled under also but was able to get away. Once they drained the lake they > found a couple Large Channel Catfish( 30-40 pound range ). Since channel cats > are not native to that area they assume a fisherman transplanted into the > lake. > > rob > Indiana > USA > > > > In a message dated 6/27/2005 6:49:42 PM US Eastern Standard Time, > harryfisherman@... writes: > > > > This is the craziest pic I've seen a long > > time. > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs! Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12641	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: Muskie Tales

Blue Marina: While you're sort of on the right track with a cross being present in this fish Family, it appears you are quite mistaken in the substance of your statement resulting in misleading conclusions. First of all, there are about 5 species in this fish Family (Esox); the Muskellunge (largest member, having subspecies), the Northern Pike, the Chain Pickerel, the Grass Pickerel and the Red Fin Pickerel. The Northern Pike is not a cross, but a pure species of this Family. Secondly, members of this Family will not (can not) be interbred, either naturally or artificially as they are not even closely related - - the eggs would never develop nor become fertilized. There is a cross, however, between a Muskie and a Northern. This artificial cross is called a "Tiger Muskie", so called because of its pattern and developed as a better fighting gamefish. Muskies, by the way, can reach well over 5 feet in length. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "LobsterPond.com" <BlueMarinaPonds@j...> wrote: > > Hey, you didn't know about muskies? > > Yes, muskie are big and the tales about them are endless. You will always remember the one about the fisherman who got one on his line - him and his boat were pulled around Leach Lake all day and then night. He was never heard from again. > > Muskies are the reason most boaters carry billy club or baseball bat in the boat. You HAVE TO KNOCK the fish out if you get it in the boat. > > Northerns (by the way) are a cross of muskie and some trout type fish. > > From a muskie fisher-woman

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12642	From: yarncrazymom	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Evita <evitabug@y...> wrote: > Rho, You make me feel much better. > Sadly when I got up that morning I had one dead fish in the tank. It was one of the hardier looking ones but also the one that had different signs of illness. I pulled him out and looked at his lower tail above the fin and the white patch looked like he rubbed off the scales. It wasn't slimy but washed out looking. The others show no sign of this. But one fish is more ill than the others. Evita I am glad that your fish are showing some signs of feeling better...and the fry look good..thats somthing to look forward to, at least you know you can start off with healthy fry when you are ready to add them to the larger tank. One thing to think about getting is Mela Fix...I dont know if I will get feedback on this product here but I will tell you that I swear by it... it is for Bacterial and fungal infections in aquarium fish and is all natural and very safe to use in the tank. It is a great healing and calming agent in your tank. If you fish have ulcers or sore spots or torn or freyed fins, Mela fix will work wonders. MelaFix is safe for all aquariums and is a safe and effective anti- bacterial medication for all freshwater fish and has not bothered my apple snails, it is safe for even the most delicate fish species including tetras, discus fry, and scaleless fish. Treating with MelaFix will not harm the biological filter and has no effect on pH. I hope that the fish you have now continue to do better....you may have to look online next time for a good breeder to buy your fish from... Rho

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12643	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: OT Noodling?

I do believe that the American Indians used to catch fish this way, well before line and sinker where invented. But it does take a special type of person to catch fish that way. Imagine sticking your hand down there and coming up with a water maccosin. LOL Rob Indiana In a message dated 6/28/2005 5:55:57 PM US Eastern Standard Time, amjmail@... writes: > Noodling? Is that where they stick their hands down in the muck and > feel around under rocks and ledges until one grabs hold of your hand? > Hmmmm. Someone smart came up with that idea eh? ;) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12644	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: muskie grabbing a pike/ A muskie - Noodling?

someone had too much time on their hands and not enough brain power when they invented that fishing method =) --- Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: > Noodling? Is that where they stick their hands down in the muck and > feel around under rocks and ledges until one grabs hold of your hand? > Hmmmm. Someone smart came up with that idea eh? ;) > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of John Gonzalez > Sent: Tuesday, June 28, 2005 5:00 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] muskie grabbing a pike/ A muskie > > > Imagine if you were noodling for one & that sucker > get's a hold of your hand... you will be dragged > wherever that cat wants to go!!! > > --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > > > yep...they have caught 14-16 footers in the past. > > Cats can get huge... > > Most of these are river cats that also go out into > > the Gulf. The largest I > > ever caught while fishing on the jetties in Cameron, > > LA was about 3 feet > > long. > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > > > On Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez > > Sent: Tuesday, June 28, 2005 3:27 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] muskie grabbing a pike/ A > > muskie > > > > > > did you say 12 ft?!?!?! they must look like monsters > > at that length!! > > > > --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > > > > > I can remember some of the cats they pulled out of > > Lake Sabine on the > > > Texas/Louisiana border. They get some big ones > > that get stuck in the > > > intakes on the dam. I can remember one was 12 ft > > long...talk about some > > > fillets! > > > > > > One time I was snorkeling in a lake in SW MI. I > > was cruising the bottom > > in > > > about 12 ft of water, right where it drops off to > > about 30-40 ft. All of > > a > > > sudden, out of the darkness comes this huge > > alligator gar. All I saw was > > > mouth and teeth before I hightailed it to the > > surface hehehe. > > > > > > Eric > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > Behalf Of FortWayneFish@... > > > Sent: Monday, June 27, 2005 7:00 PM > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] muskie grabbing a pike/ > > A muskie > > > > > > > > > most incidents like that don't get recorded. > > Camera in the right spot at > > the > > > > > > right time.... > > > I've had sea lions take 30-40 pound salmon off the > > line at the boat a > > couple > > > > > > times. I've also had pike take small pan fish > > off my line. Just natural > > > the > > > Muskie taking the pike... > > > > > > We had an incident back in Oregon ( USA ) about 10 > > years ago or so where > > the > > > > > > city of Salem or Albany drained one of the city > > parks ( Lakes) because > > > people > > > where reporting baby ducks and geese being taken > > off the water, a small > > dog > > > was pulled under also but was able to get away. > > Once they drained the lake > > > they > > > found a couple Large Channel Catfish( 30-40 pound > > range ). Since channel > > > cats > > > are not native to that area they assume a > > fisherman transplanted into the > > > > > lake. > > > > > > rob > > > Indiana > > > USA > > > > > > > > > > > > In a message dated 6/27/2005 6:49:42 PM US Eastern > > Standard Time, > > > harryfisherman@... writes: > > > > > > > > > > This is the craziest pic I've seen a long > > > > time. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > > when replying, thanks > > > . > > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text > > that is not important to > > > the reply and if changing the topic of the > > original message modify the > > > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > > subject)" <-, we Thank You > > > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on > > the web. > > > > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an > > email to: > > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > > Yahoo! Terms of Service > > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > > I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > > . > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text > > that is not important to > > the reply and if changing the topic of the original > > message modify the > > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > > subject)" <-, we Thank You > > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the > > web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > === message truncated === > > > > > __________________________________ > Yahoo! Mail > Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour: > http://tour.mail.yahoo.com/mailtour.html > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important > to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify > the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we > Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12645	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: Newbie-Getting 1st aquarium, secondhand

Cinde, Check out the Honolulu Aquarium Society. Their web site says that they meet on the first Friday of the month at 7:00 PM, at the Kuhio Elementary School Cafeteria. The website does seem to be a bit outdated, but you have about a week and a half to check around <g>. Follow this link to them: http://tinyurl.com/7alnn. I also find under gravel filters (UGF) to be perfectly acceptable. However, if you are dead set against them, the time to make the change is when you move the tank. Just remove the gravel and yank out the plates. However, be forewarned that you will then be faced with at least a mini cycle, while new bacteria colonies grow on your bio-wheel filter and in the filter itself. I have not a clue as to what Hawaii water is like. You will probably need to treat the water, at least as it goes into the tank. Ask the person who you are buying the tank from what he does to treat the water, and follow suit, to start. Since you are likely to be making at least an 85% water change for the tank when you move it, this will help minimize the stress on the fish. Pick up some test kits, so you can test your water. I recommend at least a pH kit, an ammonia kit, and a nitrite kit, along with a nitrate kit. You can find master kits with all these rolled in as well as one or two other kits. I like the Aqua-Tru kits by Kordon, mainly for their test vials. You can call the water people to find out if they use chlorine or chloramines to disinfect the water. They can also let you know what the pH is along with a ton of other measurements, and they can send you a full report gratis. Not only should you be reading the lists, like this one, you should also get a start on building a library ("What! More books!", she says as he comes home from an auction or seminar, or workshop. "What are you going to do with all of them?" "Read them, eventually" he says. [Of course, if it were dog books, there would be no question <g>.]). A good book to start is the Baensch _Aquarium Atlas_, Volume 1. It has a good section on setting up and maintaining a tank. It also has a good starting section on live plants, and, of course, the fish. Lots and lots of fish. You might want to subscribe to on of the national magazines as well. And, be sure to check out that aquarium society in Honolulu. Those people will be your best aids in getting started again. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of bunnycareshi Sent: Monday, June 27, 2005 3:24 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Newbie-Getting 1st aquarium, secondhand Aloha I am new to this group, and to aquariums, though I've been planning on getting one for months. I haven't had fish since I was a kid, so know very little, but I have been doing my homework. But to be clear, I have *never* owned an aquarium. Long story short, I found a 30 gal freshwater yesterday, complete w/undergravel filter, heater, lid and light, plus 2 clown loaches, a catfish and a type of angelfish at the price I wanted to spend, so decided to go that route. And I now have a million questions! First, I don't want an underground filter and want a power filter. Is that ok, and any recommendations? I live in Honolulu, so we do not have the selection (of anything!) you have on the mainland, but I know we have Penguin, Whisper and a few others. Next, I have yet to move the tank. The seller will drain it at his place and give me a bucket to move the fish. He says I don't have to isolate them for any period after re-filling the tank, that they are hardy enough to take the change. He said to use some of the old water for the nutrients etc and some of my faucet water, but what ratio? Also, he said to rinse the gravel, some of which I'll keep, again for the nutrients, but I want my own new gravel as I want different colors. Are those gravel "vacuums" good to use, or just use a sieve? Any advice appreciated. Everything seems complicated right now, but I'm really into reading and learning, and I find the yahoo groups an excellent source. Also, if anyone on this group is in Honolulu, do let me know. It's nice to have local contact. Cinde in Honolulu, Hawaii

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12646	From: Evita	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!

Rho, Thanks for the advice. I will go out tomorrow and see if I can find some. Being a small town I may not be able to. Is it a common product? Also I was wondering how long to wait after this problem to try adding some more fish. Should I wait at least a month. I don't want to add any fish to the tank till I know it is problem free. Evita yarncrazymom <yarncrazymom@...> wrote: --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Evita <evitabug@y...> wrote: > Rho, You make me feel much better. > Sadly when I got up that morning I had one dead fish in the tank. It was one of the hardier looking ones but also the one that had different signs of illness. I pulled him out and looked at his lower tail above the fin and the white patch looked like he rubbed off the scales. It wasn't slimy but washed out looking. The others show no sign of this. But one fish is more ill than the others. Evita I am glad that your fish are showing some signs of feeling better...and the fry look good..thats somthing to look forward to, at least you know you can start off with healthy fry when you are ready to add them to the larger tank. One thing to think about getting is Mela Fix...I dont know if I will get feedback on this product here but I will tell you that I swear by it... it is for Bacterial and fungal infections in aquarium fish and is all natural and very safe to use in the tank. It is a great healing and calming agent in your tank. If you fish have ulcers or sore spots or torn or freyed fins, Mela fix will work wonders. MelaFix is safe for all aquariums and is a safe and effective anti- bacterial medication for all freshwater fish and has not bothered my apple snails, it is safe for even the most delicate fish species including tetras, discus fry, and scaleless fish. Treating with MelaFix will not harm the biological filter and has no effect on pH. I hope that the fish you have now continue to do better....you may have to look online next time for a good breeder to buy your fish from... Rho Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12647	From: yarncrazymom	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: freshwater Nerite snails

Does anyone know where I can buy these online? TIA Rho

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12648	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: recommendation

I thought I would give ya'll some feedback on the company from which I ordered plants for my aquarium. I ordered from freshwateraquariumplants.com about a month ago, when I first got my tank. I liked the detailed info they gave on the plants they offer. I ordered several that were out of stock so instead of splitting the order, they waited till they had grown on to send them to me. They did notify me, though, by phone and email, and asked if I would rather them split the order. The order arrived today in excellent condition, despite the heat, and the fact that they sent them with regular mail (at my behest). For the money, I got over twice as much as I would have spend on similar plants at the local petstores, and no snails or dead, spindly plants in the bunch. I'll let you know how they grow on, but I would so far HIGHLY recommend this company :D

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12649	From: lance vohs	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: Big problem with hair algae

how old and what spectrum bulb do you have?? Eric Miner <eminer1254@...> wrote:Hello everybody, I've got a real hair algae problem. It started a few weeks ago and has only gotten worse. I've tried to manually remove it no good. I tried water changes no good. Now it's gotten into the substrate. I've tried the method of creating a lighting cycle by having the lights on for 6 hrs. then 3 hrs. off then 6 hrs. on. This seems to have slowed it down a bit, but hasn't stopped it. One issue I think could be part of the problem is that I don't have enough lighting to allow the plants to grow fast enough to out-compete the algae. I have 46 gl tank with a 96 watt compact fluorescent bulb. That's just over 2 watts/gallon. I'm thinking of doubling that in the future. Do you think that would help the plants enough to beat back the hair algae? My ammonia, nitrites and nitrates number stay the same no matter if I do a water change or not. Nitrates are at about 12.5 ppm. If I do a water change the number go right back up 24 hrs. later. I strongly believe that the regular tests available and the LFS are simply not accurate enough to track changes. I've ordered supposedly not accurate tests from Kordon. I have number of shrimp (Japanese) that don't seem interested in the hair algae. I don't want to add more fish to this tank. Here's what I'm thinking of for solutions – 1.more wattage per gallon to allow the existing plants to grow more strongly 2.continue to manually remove the hair algae 3.add nitrite/nitrate and phosphate absorbing chemicals/biologicals to lower the nitrate numbers. Please, any other suggestions are very welcome. Thanks in advance, Eric --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12650	From: kritter714@aol.com	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: freshwater Nerite snails

In a message dated 6/28/2005 5:42:50 PM Pacific Standard Time, yarncrazymom@... writes: Does anyone know where I can buy these online? TIA Rho I would try aquabid.com an aquarium auction site I have seen them there Elaine in the emerald city 125 gallon marine, 90 gallon discus 80 gallon south american cichlid 55 gallon african cichlid 50 gallon temperate water tank [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12651	From: Tim Fairchild	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!

On Wednesday 29 Jun 2005 08:45, Evita wrote: > Tim, I don't have a scale. I used my cooking spoons. Evita That's fine, but I lose count :) I started weighing it, especially on big tanks :) Cooking spoons are good enough. -- --------------------------------------------------------- Tim & Therese Fairchild Atchafalaya Border Collies. Kuttabul, Queensland, Australia. --------------------------------------------------------- Email mailto:tim@... Homepage http://www.bcs4me.com Photos http://www.pbase.com/amosf ---------------------------------------------------------

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12652	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: San Francisco Aquarium Society (SFAS), 7/1/2005, 7:15 pm

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife San Francisco Aquarium Society (SFAS) Friday July 1, 2005 7:15 pm - 9:15 pm This event repeats on the first Friday of every month. Event Location: first Friday of each month at first Friday of each month at San Francisco State University Notes: http://www.sfaquarium.org/about.html Meetings are free and open to everyone. If you've enjoyed them, we urge you to become a member. You'll become a welcome part of our community, and your dues help defray the costs of speakers and other special things that show up at every meeting. We meet the first Friday of each month at The San Francisco State University. (We used to meet the first Friday of each month at The Academy of Sciences in San Francisco's Golden Gate Park.) Founded in 1923, the San Francisco Aquarium Society is regarded as one of the nation's esteemed aquarium hobbyi Yahoo! Greetings Send a Yahoo! Greeting. Birthday Reminders Set up birthday reminders! ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12653	From: paul helms	Date: 6/28/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!

again back to this....by definition kosher salt is plain sodium chloride....it has been bastradized by salt companies who want to sell a larger grain salt under the same name, it now refers to a style or type of salt as opposed to the real thing. --- Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > Exactly what additives does your kosher salt > contain? Kosher salt is > either just plain salt (sodium chloride) or, and > some here do disagree, > but not the rabbi I spoke to, may contain an > anti-caking agent, just > like the one your table salt contains. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of yarncrazymom > Sent: Tuesday, June 28, 2005 11:10 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR > ANYONE! > > Im new here...but I dont think I would use KOSHER > Salt to my > fishtank...No... it has additives in there that you > do not need to add > to an already stressed tank.....Just MHO before more > damage was done... > > Rho > > > > The best way to treat ick, (in addition to using a > commercial > remedy) > > is to add 1 tablespoon of kosher salt or aquarium > salt per 5 > gallons > > and turn up the heat on your tank to 84F. I'd do a > 20-30% water > change > > before adding the salt. In fact, it's better if > you add the salt to > > your replacement water, let it dissolve, then add > to tank. > > > > I would also follow this up by the same 20% water > change *daily* > with > > added salt until it's all gone. > > > > Quite often, this is enough to get rid of the ick. > It should not > > effect your cycle process, but do not get anymore > new fish until > it's > > all gone. With the above suggestions, you will > notice a decrease in > > the white dots by tomorrow. > > > > Good luck. > > > > Kelly > > > > -- > > 65g Malawi > > http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl > > > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 > > 135g Frontosa/Tang > > > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011 > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when > replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text > that is not important > to the reply and if changing the topic of the > original message modify > the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <-, we > Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12654	From: Evita	Date: 6/29/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!

Good News! I got up this morning fully thinking that my smallest weakest platy would be dead. The other two looked great yeaterday and the small one was at the top alot. Well this morning she is looking much better and swimming around more. I hope this means she has made the turn for the better. Evita --------------------------------- Discover Yahoo! Find restaurants, movies, travel & more fun for the weekend. Check it out! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12655	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 6/29/2005
Subject: Re: freshwater Nerite snails

Rho, Good luck and when you do find them expect to pay in the neighborhood of $10 each. I do believe I have seen freshwater Nerite's on AquaBid.com a time or two. Might try there.... Most Nerite's you find are saltwater snails, and can be found at most reef shops.... Rob Indiana USA In a message dated 6/28/2005 7:42:45 PM US Eastern Standard Time, yarncrazymom@... writes: > Does anyone know where I can buy these online? > TIA > Rho > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12656	From: Jade Evita	Date: 6/29/2005
Subject: New Numbers

My numbers are slightly down on my Nitrate and Nitrite. My Nitrate is down to around 20 from the 40 and the Nitrite appears to be almost at 0. It has been two weeks sense I added the fish. One died from what appears to be ick related. One is still acting effected but holding her own and two appear to be hopefully on the mend. Only three days of treating with water changes, salt and raised water temp at between 84- 86. Should I add an over the counter remedy in addition to the salt? Continue with the salt? Keep doing the water changes? Also how long should I keep the water temps up and when I lower them what would be the best temp. I had the tank at around 76 before they got sick. Thanks in advance. Evita

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12657	From: Eric Miner	Date: 6/29/2005
Subject: Re: Big problem with hair algae

The bulb is a 6700K Coralife, it's only about two months old. The spectrum is designed for freshwater plants, not too much in the blue end that algae like. Eric --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, lance vohs <lancevohs@y...> wrote: > how old and what spectrum bulb do you have?? > Eric Miner <eminer1254@y...> wrote:Hello everybody, >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12658	From: panaque321	Date: 6/29/2005
Subject: Re: Move guppy?

Thanks for the info ... I think you mean "anthropomorphism". I never do that, except with dogs ..... Mackie --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > In that case, it should be OK to move him in. However, he really does not > need companionship. This would be a case of anthromorphism--putting human > characteristics to an animal--and it is not warranted. He'll do fine by > himself. If you wish to consolidate tanks, that would be a good reason. > > \\Steve// > > -----

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12659	From: kb1dva	Date: 6/29/2005
Subject: Re: Move guppy?

Except dogs do have human characteristics, anyone who's lived with one knows that Emily _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of panaque321 Sent: Wednesday, June 29, 2005 12:17 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Move guppy? Thanks for the info ... I think you mean "anthropomorphism". I never do that, except with dogs ..... Mackie --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > In that case, it should be OK to move him in. However, he really does not > need companionship. This would be a case of anthromorphism--putting human > characteristics to an animal--and it is not warranted. He'll do fine by > himself. If you wish to consolidate tanks, that would be a good reason. > > \\Steve// > > ----- Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12660	From: yarncrazymom	Date: 6/29/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Evita <evitabug@y...> wrote: > > Good News! I got up this morning fully thinking that my smallest weakest platy would be dead. The other two looked great yeaterday and the small one was at the top alot. Well this morning she is looking much better and swimming around more. I hope this means she has made the turn for the better. Evita > > Thats great...I am glad they are doing better...Hang in there, we all learn through trial and error...I learn so much everyday about my snails and fish, I hope there is never a time that I think I know it all, because then what fun would it be. Good Luck Rho http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Snailcrazy/

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12661	From: LobsterPond.com	Date: 6/29/2005
Subject: Re: Muskie Tales

Thanks for the correction Ray. The DNR stocks our lake here and near here is a hatchery that did the research on some cross breeding fish. I must have been not listening when the guy told me about it. Regards- Sherry ============earlier message ==== From: "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@...> Subject: Blue Marina: While you're sort of on the right track with a cross being present in this fish Family, it appears you are quite mistaken in the substance of your statement resulting in misleading conclusions. First of all, there are about 5 species in this fish Family (Esox); the Muskellunge (largest member, having subspecies), the Northern Pike, the Chain Pickerel, the Grass Pickerel and the Red Fin Pickerel. The Northern Pike is not a cross, but a pure species of this Family. Secondly, members of this Family will not (can not) be interbred, either naturally or artificially as they are not even closely related - - the eggs would never develop nor become fertilized. There is a cross, however, between a Muskie and a Northern. This artificial cross is called a "Tiger Muskie", so called because of its pattern and developed as a better fighting gamefish. Muskies, by the way, can reach well over 5 feet in length. Ray ___________________________________________________________________ Get Juno Platinum for as low as $6.95/month! Unlimited Internet Access with 250MB of Email Storage. Visit http://www.juno.com/bestoffer to sign up today!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12662	From: lance vohs	Date: 6/29/2005
Subject: Re: Big problem with hair algae

you might want to try to leave the lights off for 18hrs on for 6hrs for a few days to see what happens Eric Miner <eminer1254@...> wrote:The bulb is a 6700K Coralife, it's only about two months old. The spectrum is designed for freshwater plants, not too much in the blue end that algae like. Eric --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, lance vohs <lancevohs@y...> wrote: > how old and what spectrum bulb do you have?? > Eric Miner <eminer1254@y...> wrote:Hello everybody, > --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12663	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 6/29/2005
Subject: Re: Muskie Tales

Hi Sherry, From the looks of it, it seems you enjoy fishing. Any particular type of fish? Noticed a hatchery near you -- now that's fish breeding on a large scale! -- those tours are always fascinating. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "LobsterPond.com" <BlueMarinaPonds@j...> wrote: > > Thanks for the correction Ray. > > The DNR stocks our lake here and near here is a hatchery that did the research on some cross breeding fish. I must have been not listening when the guy told me about it. > Regards- Sherry > > ============earlier message ==== > From: "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> > Subject: > > Blue Marina: While you're sort of on the right track with a cross > being present in this fish Family, it appears you are quite mistaken in > the substance of your statement resulting in misleading conclusions. > First of all, there are about 5 species in this fish Family (Esox); the > Muskellunge (largest member, having subspecies), the Northern Pike, the > Chain Pickerel, the Grass Pickerel and the Red Fin Pickerel. The > Northern Pike is not a cross, but a pure species of this Family. > Secondly, members of this Family will not (can not) be interbred, > either naturally or artificially as they are not even closely related - > - the eggs would never develop nor become fertilized. There is a > cross, however, between a Muskie and a Northern. This artificial cross > is called a "Tiger Muskie", so called because of its pattern and > developed as a better fighting gamefish. Muskies, by the way, can > reach well over 5 feet in length. Ray > > ___________________________________________________________________ > Get Juno Platinum for as low as $6.95/month! > Unlimited Internet Access with 250MB of Email Storage. > Visit http://www.juno.com/bestoffer to sign up today!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12664	From: yarncrazymom	Date: 6/29/2005
Subject: Re: Big problem with hair algae

The Amano shrimp (Caridina Japonica) from Japan is one to eat algae but I wouldn't expect my tank cleaned by it alone. This will not go away over night you have to work at it and be patient..IMO I think you are on the right track... Reduction of your light during this time will help Remove by hand what you can Water changes are very important as I know you know Starving it out as you are trying to do..Check your phospates they should be Zero if Im not mistaken. Tap water contains phosphates as well as nitrates which are both required for algae to thrive, if you are doing water changes from the tap this could be a source of the nutrients it is growing on. A phosphate sponge will remove most of the phosphate from your tank as well as regular water changes. I think I would work on your water conditions not so much getting ride of the algea. They sorta go hand in hand... Im not a fan of chemi-clean Im not even sure it lists the ingredients on it. But it might be somthing to consider. I dunno bout that one... Good luck and keep at it :O) Rho http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Snailcrazy/ > > I've got a real hair algae problem. It started a few weeks ago and has > only gotten worse. I've tried to manually remove it no good. I tried > water changes no good. Now it's gotten into the substrate. > > > I have number of shrimp (Japanese) that don't seem interested in the > hair algae. I don't want to add more fish to this tank. > > Here's what I'm thinking of for solutions – > > 1.more wattage per gallon to allow the existing plants to grow more > strongly > 2.continue to manually remove the hair algae > 3.add nitrite/nitrate and phosphate absorbing chemicals/biologicals to > lower the nitrate numbers. > > Please, any other suggestions are very welcome. > > Thanks in advance, > > Eric

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12665	From: stuff4paws	Date: 6/29/2005
Subject: New to group and saltwater fish

Hi, I am interested in raising some clownfish. Can anyone give me some hints/suggestions on how to start and what I need. I have been doing some research online but I would like to know more on what it takes to start and maintain a salt-water tank. Stefani & Fishies Dusty(bubble-eye),Pip-squeak(moor), and Little Yellow Jacket(bubble-eye)

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12666	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 6/29/2005
Subject: Silicon Valley Aquarium Society (SVAS) Monthly Meeting, 7/2/2005, 6

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife Silicon Valley Aquarium Society (SVAS) Monthly Meeting Saturday July 2, 2005 6:30 pm - 9:30 pm This event repeats on the first Saturday of every month. Event Location: Round Table Pizza, 4302 Moorpark Ave., San Jose CA Street: 4302 Moorpark Ave. City, State, Zip: San Jose CA 95129-2030 Notes: Silicon Valley Aquarium Society (SVAS) Monthly Meeting http://www.svas.info/ http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SiliconValleyAquariumSociety/ 6:30 pm - 9:30 pm This event repeats on the first Saturday of every month. Event Location: Round Table Pizza, 4302 Moorpark Ave., San Jose Yahoo! Greetings Send a Yahoo! Greeting. Birthday Reminders Set up birthday reminders! ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12667	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/29/2005
Subject: Re: New Numbers

Evita, You'll need to continue the treatment for 10-14 days or at least three days after all the symptoms have gone. You can stop changing the water. The idea was to do an immediate water change to help the fish with some freshwater, then to maintain your normal schedule, unless there is an indication that the water should be changed sooner. Once the treatment period has ended, bring the water temperature down gradually, to where it was before. When the indicator light comes on in the heater, simply turn the heater down until the light goes off, then do the same the next day, and the next, until the temperature is normal for your tank. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Jade Evita Sent: Wednesday, June 29, 2005 8:18 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] New Numbers My numbers are slightly down on my Nitrate and Nitrite. My Nitrate is down to around 20 from the 40 and the Nitrite appears to be almost at 0. It has been two weeks sense I added the fish. One died from what appears to be ick related. One is still acting effected but holding her own and two appear to be hopefully on the mend. Only three days of treating with water changes, salt and raised water temp at between 84- 86. Should I add an over the counter remedy in addition to the salt? Continue with the salt? Keep doing the water changes? Also how long should I keep the water temps up and when I lower them what would be the best temp. I had the tank at around 76 before they got sick. Thanks in advance. Evita Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12668	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 6/30/2005
Subject: Re: Muskie Tales

Did someone mention big catfish recently? 644 lb catfish caught. http://www.news.com.au/story/0,10117,15777471-13762,00.html [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12669	From: Loie	Date: 6/30/2005
Subject: Fwd: FW:

Note: forwarded message attached. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12670	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/30/2005
Subject: Re: Move guppy?

Yep, that's the word. I knew I had it wrong, and hoped the spell checker would pick it up, but no joy, once again, with the spell checker. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of panaque321 Sent: Wednesday, June 29, 2005 12:17 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Move guppy? Thanks for the info ... I think you mean "anthropomorphism". I never do that, except with dogs ..... Mackie --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > In that case, it should be OK to move him in. However, he really does not > need companionship. This would be a case of anthromorphism--putting human > characteristics to an animal--and it is not warranted. He'll do fine by > himself. If you wish to consolidate tanks, that would be a good reason. > > \\Steve// > > ----- Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12671	From: Evita	Date: 6/30/2005
Subject: Re: New Numbers

Steve, First of all thanks for all your help and patience with all my dumb questions. I got up this morning fully expecting for my fish to be dead. (See when we got them my three girls and I all picked one fish. Like usual I pick the smallest one). Anyway from the start this fish seems to be the weakest one. She does well at times swimming all over the place then I will look in the tank for her and she is gone. The other two who came through this much better are swimming together all over the place. Then I find her in the left top corner at the top of the water so still I think she is dead. I tap the glass a few times and then she swims. This morning I get up and she is at the bottom of the tank with the others looking like there is nothing wrong with her. Oh also I have to add. Right after we got them home we noticed that she is deformed. It doesn't effect her except she looks odd. I know I should according to the fish books kill her but I just don't have the heart to do it. It is an oddity in the shape of her head....their is a dip the head to the body. You would have to see it. It makes her head look smaller around the neck. Anyway I am thinking this deformity has also made her weaker. That is also why I thought she might die. I thought if she lives then she was meant to. So far so good. Please don't tell me I am wrong in this. After all she has been though I just can't kill her now. Not my thing. Steve about the adding of salt treatment. If I do no water changes when I add the salt won't my water get too salty? After the treatment is over and all is well then I would think it would be safe as well a cycled to add more fish? Or should I wait a few water changes to bring down the salt content of the water first? Oh, I saw two more babies in the adult tank. They seem to be growing and tolerating the treatments of salt. I was really surprised they were alive due to the ick and or being eaten. Also my nursery tank the baby fry are thriving. No signs of loosing any or illness there. On a side note. I get my pet food, mainly bird and cat food, at Walmart. That is where I got my platys by the way. We went last night. All their tanks show various signs of illness. They keep putting more fish in the tanks every Tue. So the ones they sell could be infected and the ones they don't usually die. I think they should stop selling fish. Just my opinion. No one really care for them besides scooping up the dead fish every now and then. One fish even had an eye that was totally blinded and sticking out. It was sad. I used their tanks to show my kids signs of illness fish can get, what to look for and what happens to them. Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: Evita, You'll need to continue the treatment for 10-14 days or at least three days after all the symptoms have gone. You can stop changing the water. The idea was to do an immediate water change to help the fish with some freshwater, then to maintain your normal schedule, unless there is an indication that the water should be changed sooner. Once the treatment period has ended, bring the water temperature down gradually, to where it was before. When the indicator light comes on in the heater, simply turn the heater down until the light goes off, then do the same the next day, and the next, until the temperature is normal for your tank. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Jade Evita Sent: Wednesday, June 29, 2005 8:18 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] New Numbers My numbers are slightly down on my Nitrate and Nitrite. My Nitrate is down to around 20 from the 40 and the Nitrite appears to be almost at 0. It has been two weeks sense I added the fish. One died from what appears to be ick related. One is still acting effected but holding her own and two appear to be hopefully on the mend. Only three days of treating with water changes, salt and raised water temp at between 84- 86. Should I add an over the counter remedy in addition to the salt? Continue with the salt? Keep doing the water changes? Also how long should I keep the water temps up and when I lower them what would be the best temp. I had the tank at around 76 before they got sick. Thanks in advance. Evita Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12672	From: Evita	Date: 6/30/2005
Subject: Re: Muskie Tales

Biggest ever caught but biggest in the river????I bet it fed alot of people too. They would need the worlds biggest frying pan too. They tried to get them to throw it back. I could see why but I can also see that these people probably could only think how many hungry people would be eating that night. Evita Deenerz@... wrote:Did someone mention big catfish recently? 644 lb catfish caught. http://www.news.com.au/story/0,10117,15777471-13762,00.html [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter SPONSORED LINKS Saltwater aquarium Marine biologist Reef tank --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12673	From: Patrick	Date: 6/30/2005
Subject: Re: Fwd: FW:

Note that this was probably a virus infected message that was completely harmless because the attachment was blocked! :) Patrick -------Original Message------- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Date: 06/30/05 03:18:41 To: andreia; aquaticlife@yahoogroups.com; mike carnes; cheryl; gary decker; juan trevino; melissa; mitch; robin scott; melissa rockey; royjaramillo@...; amanda schumaker; tonyhawke88352@...; jennifer torrey Subject: [AquaticLife] Fwd: FW: Note: forwarded message attached. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12674	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 6/30/2005
Subject: Re: Muskie Tales

my hubby said he'd love to have a catfish fry with it! lol --- Deenerz@... wrote: > Did someone mention big catfish recently? > 644 lb catfish caught. > http://www.news.com.au/story/0,10117,15777471-13762,00.html > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12675	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 6/30/2005
Subject: tank set up!

Hello all, I finally got my 150 tank set up! It is so cool! Now that I have it all set up, I have a few questions. The tank is 30" deep. For lighting, I have a single strip fluorescent light and a twin tube light. The live plants that I have are one aponogeton, three amazon swords, and a crinium. I did add laterite to my substrate. Should I add the liquid fertilizer to my water now, or wait until the tank has cycled in? How long should I leave my lights on? The tank is really bright with all three lights on an I am concerned about algae. Could I use the single light for about 16 hours and time the twin tube to come on for about eight? Are guppies good for cycling in a tank? How many should I put in? My daughters and I are going to try breeding some guppies so they will be useful after the tank is cycled in. The ten gallon hospital tank that I set up earlier this month has cycled in. Ammonia and nitrates are at zero:) Can I move the gravel over to the new tank to help it cycle in? How about moving the filter cartridge to the big tank? How much time will this take off the cycling time? And because the new tank is significantly bigger, can I expect the tank to take longer to cycle in? Thanks in advance, Linda River Falls, WI [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12676	From: kb1dva	Date: 6/30/2005
Subject: some little questions

Umm I know that aquariums with live plants need light, but do fish need light and how much, and is to much bad for them How do you tell if something ceramic is ok for an aquarium, no it wasn't made for one- just cute Cold I put it in with a goldfish and see how it does? -or is that mean Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12677	From: Evita	Date: 6/30/2005
Subject: Re: tank set up!

I have to say just one thing. Boy am I jealous! I am starting a 30 gal. myself but one can dream. Evita Crazy4fids@... wrote:Hello all, I finally got my 150 tank set up! It is so cool! --------------------------------- Yahoo! Mail Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12678	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 6/30/2005
Subject: Re: Muskie Tales

Valeen, Was that in one BIG frying pan, or 100 smaller pans? BTW I saw someone in our area on craigslist looking for aquariums. Maybe they should check out Aquatraders in San Bruno, sometimes they have new Jebo/Odyssea tanks really cheap ;) Mike -----Original Message----- From: Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thu, 30 Jun 2005 11:41:03 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: Muskie Tales my hubby said he'd love to have a catfish fry with it! lol --- Deenerz@... wrote: > Did someone mention big catfish recently? > 644 lb catfish caught. > http://www.news.com.au/story/0,10117,15777471-13762,00.html > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs! Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12679	From: panaque321	Date: 6/30/2005
Subject: Re: Move guppy?

Spellcheck's a PITA. Anyway, alot of fuss over a guppy, you may think, but he's the only one, and when you have an only, they get named, and develop importance ... I really thought guppies might have a preference for company. Since it doesn't matter I might just leave him where he is. It's nice. ..... Mackie --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > Yep, that's the word. I knew I had it wrong, and hoped the spell checker > would pick it up, but no joy, once again, with the spell checker. > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of panaque321 > Sent: Wednesday, June 29, 2005 12:17 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Move guppy? > > Thanks for the info ... I think you mean "anthropomorphism". > I never do that, except with dogs ..... Mackie >>

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12680	From: hhusvar	Date: 6/30/2005
Subject: Introduction and new tank

Hello everyone! My name is Heather and I've been a long time freshwater fish enthusiast. After relocating, getting married and having a child we decided it was time to begin our foray into rebuilding aquariums. My husband, not being half as crazy as I am said he wasn't interested in the things I've worked with before (breeding aggressives like chiclids and bettas) and he wanted some fun, active and attractive creatures for our new tank to introduce our child into the family hobby. I said ok and we got started.. I've been told to back off, this is his and her choice. I'm trying! So, first fish, the two of them pick out four fancy fantailed male guppies. I was not sure what to think because I have never had them before. They also got three angel fish. Somewhere along the lines we used a store credit and picked up a blue crayfish. None of us had crayfish experience before, but we had done research and thought "ok, it should be ok as long as we feed it." :D The first day, all we had were the guppies and I was coming around to the idea that they were kind of fun and silly as they were playing in the bubble wall. Day 2, one guppy disappears and I can't find it *anywhere*. My only guess is that it died and the guppies ate it or it jumped out and the cat ate it. Day 3, Angelfish introduced, all is hunky dorey, no sign of the missing guppie. Guppie pronounced MIA and presumed dead. Day 4: crayfish introduced - he digs around and eats some pellets and later I'm looking in the tank and he's carrying around the missing guppy who is definitely dead and is now half eaten. I wonder if I should try to wrestle it away to take it back for the dead fish guarantee. My husband says to let the crayfish have it. This morning I see him at the top of a plant, catching an angelfish (We read and were told, they weren't really wild hunters and would prefer tablets and bottom feeders) and by the time I was leaving he had devoured most of it and was chewing (is chewing the proper term?) the head. Of course, the guppies are fast and they like to tease him by diving down towards him, making a circle and zipping back off to the top of the tank. I'm hoping we still have fish when I get home and he hasn't gone on some gigantic eating spree. In the mean time, I'm going to set up his own tank and provide him with some feeders and maybe get a tank mate. In the mean time, it's all quite interesting and I suppose I'd better buy another angel fish. (I had named them Darryl, Darryl & Darryl. Hee hee. It's not the same with only two.) Of course, now we have another little tank problem, but nothing that's a big deal. Apparently, in addition to being a prolific hunter, the crayfish does NOT like the tablets we purchased so he tore one up and tossed it all over the place, between that and the fish he's killed and an accidental overfeed by our daughter we now have a very slightly cloudy water. Eh, any hobby's worth a little extra work I suppose! If there's additional advice, I'd love to hear it. Heather H.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12681	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 6/30/2005
Subject: Re: Introduction and new tank

Welcome Heather. Setting up a seperate tank for the crayfish is a great idea. Otherwise it will catch every fish in the tank, especially at night when the fish are not moving. I believe that is when the crayfish do a lot of hunting. Glad you joined and look forward to hearing more. Mike -----Original Message----- From: hhusvar <hhusvar@...> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thu, 30 Jun 2005 16:59:27 -0000 Subject: [AquaticLife] Introduction and new tank Of course, the guppies are fast and they like to tease him by diving down towards him, making a circle and zipping back off to the top of the tank. I'm hoping we still have fish when I get home and he hasn't gone on some gigantic eating spree. In the mean time, I'm going to set up his own tank and provide him with some feeders and maybe get a tank mate. In the mean time, it's all quite interesting and I suppose I'd better buy another angel fish. (I had named them Darryl, Darryl & Darryl. Hee hee. It's not the same with only two.) Of course, now we have another little tank problem, but nothing that's a big deal. Apparently, in addition to being a prolific hunter, the crayfish does NOT like the tablets we purchased so he tore one up and tossed it all over the place, between that and the fish he's killed and an accidental overfeed by our daughter we now have a very slightly cloudy water. Eh, any hobby's worth a little extra work I suppose! If there's additional advice, I'd love to hear it. Heather H. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12682	From: Evita	Date: 6/30/2005
Subject: Re: Introduction and new tank

Hi, Heather, I am a new-bie to the fish thing so I really can't be to much help. I just wanted to welcome you and tell you I really enjoyed your story. You sound like you are really getting into it. I was wondering if you cycled your tank before you started. I forgot if you said how big this tank is. How many tanks do ya have? I think you are right about the cloudy water and the food thing. I would also say if you want to keep your fish alive this guy does need his own place. You know the old saying once they have tasted blood......Oh I got the Daryle thing....very funny. I look forward to reading more of your posts. It seems I have found someone else that can talk. Evita --------------------------------- Yahoo! Mail Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12683	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 6/30/2005
Subject: Re: New Numbers

Evita, So long as your darling is not a part of a breeding program, assuming the defect is genetic, there is no harm in keeping her around. I think we have all done a similar deed at least once. Once your treatment is done, Wait at least two weeks to ensure your fish have, indeed, been cured. Then you can get a few more fish, and, of course, quarantine them for at least two weeks to ensure that they are healthy. If they are not, you'll need to treat them in the quarantine tank, and then go another two weeks prior to adding them to your main tank. Once the fish seem to be cured, the salt will be removed by your normal water changes. So long as you are not considering any salt intolerant fish, and I don't think you are, the salt in the main tank would be fine. Most salt intolerant fish are from areas of very soft, acid water. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evita Sent: Thursday, June 30, 2005 9:05 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] New Numbers Steve, First of all thanks for all your help and patience with all my dumb questions. I got up this morning fully expecting for my fish to be dead. (See when we got them my three girls and I all picked one fish. Like usual I pick the smallest one). Anyway from the start this fish seems to be the weakest one. She does well at times swimming all over the place then I will look in the tank for her and she is gone. The other two who came through this much better are swimming together all over the place. Then I find her in the left top corner at the top of the water so still I think she is dead. I tap the glass a few times and then she swims. This morning I get up and she is at the bottom of the tank with the others looking like there is nothing wrong with her. Oh also I have to add. Right after we got them home we noticed that she is deformed. It doesn't effect her except she looks odd. I know I should according to the fish books kill her but I just don't have the heart to do it. It is an oddity in the shape of her head....their is a dip the head to the body. You would have to see it. It makes her head look smaller around the neck. Anyway I am thinking this deformity has also made her weaker. That is also why I thought she might die. I thought if she lives then she was meant to. So far so good. Please don't tell me I am wrong in this. After all she has been though I just can't kill her now. Not my thing. Steve about the adding of salt treatment. If I do no water changes when I add the salt won't my water get too salty? After the treatment is over and all is well then I would think it would be safe as well a cycled to add more fish? Or should I wait a few water changes to bring down the salt content of the water first? Oh, I saw two more babies in the adult tank. They seem to be growing and tolerating the treatments of salt. I was really surprised they were alive due to the ick and or being eaten. Also my nursery tank the baby fry are thriving. No signs of loosing any or illness there. On a side note. I get my pet food, mainly bird and cat food, at Walmart. That is where I got my platys by the way. We went last night. All their tanks show various signs of illness. They keep putting more fish in the tanks every Tue. So the ones they sell could be infected and the ones they don't usually die. I think they should stop selling fish. Just my opinion. No one really care for them besides scooping up the dead fish every now and then. One fish even had an eye that was totally blinded and sticking out. It was sad. I used their tanks to show my kids signs of illness fish can get, what to look for and what happens to them. Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: Evita, You'll need to continue the treatment for 10-14 days or at least three days after all the symptoms have gone. You can stop changing the water. The idea was to do an immediate water change to help the fish with some freshwater, then to maintain your normal schedule, unless there is an indication that the water should be changed sooner. Once the treatment period has ended, bring the water temperature down gradually, to where it was before. When the indicator light comes on in the heater, simply turn the heater down until the light goes off, then do the same the next day, and the next, until the temperature is normal for your tank. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Jade Evita Sent: Wednesday, June 29, 2005 8:18 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] New Numbers My numbers are slightly down on my Nitrate and Nitrite. My Nitrate is down to around 20 from the 40 and the Nitrite appears to be almost at 0. It has been two weeks sense I added the fish. One died from what appears to be ick related. One is still acting effected but holding her own and two appear to be hopefully on the mend. Only three days of treating with water changes, salt and raised water temp at between 84- 86. Should I add an over the counter remedy in addition to the salt? Continue with the salt? Keep doing the water changes? Also how long should I keep the water temps up and when I lower them what would be the best temp. I had the tank at around 76 before they got sick. Thanks in advance. Evita

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12684	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 6/30/2005
Subject: setting up a new salt water aquarium

question my friend is setting up a hex 35 gallon saltwater aquarium... she would like to know what kind of fish would be a good hardy choice for that size and her being new to saltwater.. thanks Shannon [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12685	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/30/2005
Subject: Fwd: Giant catfish caught in Thailand

This is from another group, sorry if you receive the email twice. =Nick See Below -------------------------------- http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2005/06/0629_050629_giantcatfish.html check out the related story links on the right-hand side. also: http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2004/12/1214_041214_huge_fish.html and check out the size of this stingray in the photo gallery: http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2003/11/photogalleries/giantcatfish/photo6.html _______________

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12686	From: Evita	Date: 6/30/2005
Subject: Re: New Numbers

Steve, Thanks for the info. I don't have a quarantine tank because I have just started out and I am trying to get my tank up. I do have a really small 2 gallon tank under the sink I could try and clean up but it wouldn't be cycled either. I think if I tried to keep fish in in for two weeks they might not make it anyway in that tank. My other tank has my fry in it. What is one to do when trying to get one tank up. Plus if I have to wait two weeks why couldn't I do the quarantine and the waiting at the same time. Other wise I would be looking at over 1 month just to add to fish to a tank that has only three fish in it. At this rate it could take 6 months to get my tank up. I don't want to be impatient. What size tank would make a good hospital or quarantine tank? How does one keep it cycled if you only use it when you buy fish or when a fish is sick? I hate to sound dumb but heck if the shoe fits.... when it comes to this I am. All that I have read in my books recommends quarantine when add new fish to a thriving established tank. I am just starting out. As far as what I want next I want some guppies I think. I know they like a little salt anyway. Thanks again for all your help. Evita Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: Evita, So long as your darling is not a part of a breeding program, assuming the defect is genetic, there is no harm in keeping her around. I think we have all done a similar deed at least once. Once your treatment is done, Wait at least two weeks to ensure your fish have, indeed, been cured. Then you can get a few more fish, and, of course, quarantine them for at least two weeks to ensure that they are healthy. If they are not, you'll need to treat them in the quarantine tank, and then go another two weeks prior to adding them to your main tank. Once the fish seem to be cured, the salt will be removed by your normal water changes. So long as you are not considering any salt intolerant fish, and I don't think you are, the salt in the main tank would be fine. Most salt intolerant fish are from areas of very soft, acid water. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evita Sent: Thursday, June 30, 2005 9:05 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] New Numbers Steve, First of all thanks for all your help and patience with all my dumb questions. I got up this morning fully expecting for my fish to be dead. (See when we got them my three girls and I all picked one fish. Like usual I pick the smallest one). Anyway from the start this fish seems to be the weakest one. She does well at times swimming all over the place then I will look in the tank for her and she is gone. The other two who came through this much better are swimming together all over the place. Then I find her in the left top corner at the top of the water so still I think she is dead. I tap the glass a few times and then she swims. This morning I get up and she is at the bottom of the tank with the others looking like there is nothing wrong with her. Oh also I have to add. Right after we got them home we noticed that she is deformed. It doesn't effect her except she looks odd. I know I should according to the fish books kill her but I just don't have the heart to do it. It is an oddity in the shape of her head....their is a dip the head to the body. You would have to see it. It makes her head look smaller around the neck. Anyway I am thinking this deformity has also made her weaker. That is also why I thought she might die. I thought if she lives then she was meant to. So far so good. Please don't tell me I am wrong in this. After all she has been though I just can't kill her now. Not my thing. Steve about the adding of salt treatment. If I do no water changes when I add the salt won't my water get too salty? After the treatment is over and all is well then I would think it would be safe as well a cycled to add more fish? Or should I wait a few water changes to bring down the salt content of the water first? Oh, I saw two more babies in the adult tank. They seem to be growing and tolerating the treatments of salt. I was really surprised they were alive due to the ick and or being eaten. Also my nursery tank the baby fry are thriving. No signs of loosing any or illness there. On a side note. I get my pet food, mainly bird and cat food, at Walmart. That is where I got my platys by the way. We went last night. All their tanks show various signs of illness. They keep putting more fish in the tanks every Tue. So the ones they sell could be infected and the ones they don't usually die. I think they should stop selling fish. Just my opinion. No one really care for them besides scooping up the dead fish every now and then. One fish even had an eye that was totally blinded and sticking out. It was sad. I used their tanks to show my kids signs of illness fish can get, what to look for and what happens to them. Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: Evita, You'll need to continue the treatment for 10-14 days or at least three days after all the symptoms have gone. You can stop changing the water. The idea was to do an immediate water change to help the fish with some freshwater, then to maintain your normal schedule, unless there is an indication that the water should be changed sooner. Once the treatment period has ended, bring the water temperature down gradually, to where it was before. When the indicator light comes on in the heater, simply turn the heater down until the light goes off, then do the same the next day, and the next, until the temperature is normal for your tank. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Jade Evita Sent: Wednesday, June 29, 2005 8:18 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] New Numbers My numbers are slightly down on my Nitrate and Nitrite. My Nitrate is down to around 20 from the 40 and the Nitrite appears to be almost at 0. It has been two weeks sense I added the fish. One died from what appears to be ick related. One is still acting effected but holding her own and two appear to be hopefully on the mend. Only three days of treating with water changes, salt and raised water temp at between 84- 86. Should I add an over the counter remedy in addition to the salt? Continue with the salt? Keep doing the water changes? Also how long should I keep the water temps up and when I lower them what would be the best temp. I had the tank at around 76 before they got sick. Thanks in advance. Evita Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12687	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/30/2005
Subject: Re: Big problem with hair algae

If you've had your tank for a while, its either weather related or its something that has changed recently. Try testing for Phosphates? I had a problem recently when i stated using another brand of pH Down which has a different chemical compound. Every thing seamed work for the first month but latter i got lots of algae all over my tank. Ive stopped using the pH down and alls better. I would suggest getting a master test kit which tests for every possible test. that way you can accurately mmonitor whats going wrong. =Nick lance vohs wrote: >how old and what spectrum bulb do you have?? >Eric Miner <eminer1254@...> wrote:Hello everybody, > >I've got a real hair algae problem. It started a few weeks ago and has >only gotten worse. I've tried to manually remove it…no good. I tried >water changes…no good. Now it's gotten into the substrate. > >I've tried the method of creating a lighting cycle by having the >lights on for 6 hrs. then 3 hrs. off then 6 hrs. on. This seems to >have slowed it down a bit, but hasn't stopped it. One issue I think >could be part of the problem is that I don't have enough lighting to >allow the plants to grow fast enough to out-compete the algae. I have >46 gl tank with a 96 watt compact fluorescent bulb. That's just over 2 >watts/gallon. I'm thinking of doubling that in the future. Do you >think that would help the plants enough to beat back the hair algae? > >My ammonia, nitrites and nitrates number stay the same no matter if I >do a water change or not. Nitrates are at about 12.5 ppm. If I do a >water change the number go right back up 24 hrs. later. I strongly >believe that the regular tests available and the LFS are simply not >accurate enough to track changes. I've ordered supposedly not accurate >tests from Kordon. > >I have number of shrimp (Japanese) that don't seem interested in the >hair algae. I don't want to add more fish to this tank. > >Here's what I'm thinking of for solutions – > >1.more wattage per gallon to allow the existing plants to grow more >strongly >2.continue to manually remove the hair algae >3.add nitrite/nitrate and phosphate absorbing chemicals/biologicals to >lower the nitrate numbers. > >Please, any other suggestions are very welcome. > >Thanks in advance, > >Eric > > > > > > >--------------------------------- >YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > >--------------------------------- > > > > > >--------------------------------- >Yahoo! Sports > Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football > >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks >. >Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12688	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/30/2005
Subject: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk

Do the egg yolks really work??? Isn't that the same as feeding them a high protein fish food? ie 43% or more. =Nick Cynthia brennemann wrote: >The water and air are at 80 degrees, the lid is down so there is plenty >of humidity. So in two days start giving them their infusoria and egg >yolk? Is that about the time the male betta will just give up and stop >taking care of them, too? > > > >>The fry will not eat at this stage -- they have a yolk sack right now >>from which they absorb their nutrients. They'll start eating when >>they are free-swimming, which will be from two to three days after >>they hatched, depending upon the water temperature. While you don't >>need to leave the aquarium light on all night, some light would help - >>- like a table lamp near the tank, just so he can get any straglers >>that happen to fall out of the nest. Ray >> >> > > > > > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks >. >Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12689	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 6/30/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!

Evita, Not sure if you have gotten over the whole Ick thing but i thought Sandra's research was pretty cool. Can't vouch if it works but last i heard it worked for her. 21/June/05, Sandra wrote: hi Deborah, i just checked again on the medicines and it says the following: CLOUT: Not suitable for use in aquariums containing live rock or invertebrates. Use cautiously with marine sharks and lion fish. COPPER-SAFE: Before use, remove invertebrates from tank. CopperSafe may be harmful to plants and some snails. Remove invertebrates without exoskeletons such as jellyfish, anemone etc. BUT, i did some research on the Internet and it says that CLOUT cannot be used on scaleless fish, that it will most probably kill them. Couldn't find nothing that said not to use CopperSafe with them, but as you know its very slow in action. I hope you dont have another outbreak of ich and that your fish stay healthy !!! sandra Evita wrote: >Steve, One thing I have found out right on the bat is that "Fish People" are a special breed. It means alot to me that you or anyone would care about helping someone starting out, with only 4 little platys. It means a lot to me and I thank you. My hubby thinks I am a nut at this point. When I am into something it becomes a passion to me. He just see some cheap little fish. I see a beautiful world in itself. Oh heck, maybe I am a nut. Evita > >Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote:I thought I did mention a water change as a first course of action. I meant >to anyway. > >30 teaspoons would be 10 tablespoons, but you probably have less than 30 >gallons in your tank, maybe as little as 25 gallons. Everything you have in >the tank will displace some water. To get a better rough estimate, measure >the tank (subtract for the thickness of the glass), then subtract from the >height the thickness of your gravel bed, and the amount of space from the >water surface to the top of the tank. Use inches. Then multiply what you >have left for height, width and length and divide by 231 and the answer is >the amount of water in gallons. This is a rough estimate, but should be >close enough in this case. > >You'll probably end up in the 27-28 gallon range. Use salt for this amount >of water. > >With the nitrite, it looks like your cycle had not quite finished yet. pH is >good, and will be increased by the salt. > >Hey, At least you are asking questions. In a few years, you'll be able to >answer a lot of questions off the top of your head, if you keep at it, to >people who are at the stage you are now. I have years and years of >experience behind me. I've picked the brains of some of the best in the >hobby, I'm always willing to listen and learn (though, I think, there are e >a few here who would rapidly state otherwise). I read, and I read a lot. >(Unfortunately, not so much in the fish area lately. However, I've purchased >about 8 books in the past year, and all will eventually be read.) Just keep >in mind the difference between a novice and the expert is in the price of >the fish they kill <G>. > >\\Steve// > >-----Original Message----- >From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On >Behalf Of Evita >Sent: Sunday, June 26, 2005 11:03 PM >To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com >Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE! > >Steve, I am 99.99999 percent sure it is ick. Thanks for the help. I feel so >stupid at times. The dots do look like salt dots. mainly down the tail and >fin. They are acting less active so I hope I won't loose them. >-------------------------------------------- > >I turned up the temp. on my heater to raise the tanks temp. Are you saying >30 teaspoons of salt for my 30 gal tank? I got two responses to my question >and 30 teaspoons vs.6 tablespoons seems pretty close in measurements. But >do you agree with the water changes as well? I am thinking a 20% Change at >least because it is time for a water change anyway. I could also dissolve >the salt in the replacement water. If I keep adding salt every day without >water changes wouldn't that make my water too salty? >________________________________________________________________ >The first thing you should do is to raise the temperature of your aquarium. >You will want to get it up to about 84-86^o F. This alone can eventually rid >your fish of the ich. To hurry things along, though, you should also add >salt to the water at the rate of a teaspoon for every gallon, and gradually >increase the amount until you have 3 teaspoons per gallon. This treatment >should continue for at least 10 days, or for several days after you notice >the ich has disappeared from your fish to avoid a re-infection. > >_______________________ > >My numbers are up a tad. Nitrate is about 40 Nitrite .5 in the caution >area I am low in Alkalinity about 40 Ph is about 7. > >________________ > >Thanks for your help and sorry for being so dense. Evita > > > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks >. >Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > > > >--------------------------------- >YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > >--------------------------------- > > > > > >--------------------------------- >Discover Yahoo! > Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online & more. Check it out! > >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks >. >Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12690	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk

A high protein fish food is great but the fry are so small you need itty bitty particles for them to eat. Egg yolks do work... a little egg yolk added to a little water makes a nice mushy fry food, thats small enough for most small fry to eat.The yellow is something to see in the bellies of tiny fish. Like all foods it will foul the water if over fed. You could also use Paramecia, liquid fry foods, or even your own recipe of finely ground flake food/water stirred into a soupy content and fed lightly to the fry. At this time it would be best to start a microworm culture or think about starting a Brineshrimp culture for your fish They will big enough to eat bigger foods, before you think they will be.. ( 1-2 weeks ) make sure to do extra water changes at this time also. every day or every other day is not to much.. robert Indiana USA In a message dated 6/30/2005 11:14:13 PM US Eastern Standard Time, nmunro@... writes: > Do the egg yolks really work??? > > Isn't that the same as feeding them a high protein fish food? ie 43% or > more. > > > =Nick > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12691	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk

If you mean, do fry eat strained hard-boiled egg yolk and that it puts growth on them, then the answer is yes it "works"! You might consider it the same only in as much as it is a "high protein fish food". If you're looking for a comparison to some of the powdered fry foods which have a high protein content these are good but depending upon fry species, egg yolk is generally eaten more readily. It is also digested and assimilated more easily and has a much higher protein content (57%) not to mention the whole host of readily available fresh vitamins (A, B6, B12, C, D, E, etc.) and minerals (calcium, iron, magnesium, etc.), promoting much faster growth. In general, vitamins in flake and/or powdered fish food is generally lost with two months of its manufacture. Additionally, egg yolk enables infusoria growth in the aquarium. The commercially available product "Liquifry" is about as close as you can get as far as an over-the-counter food. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Nicolas Munro <nmunro@q...> wrote: > Do the egg yolks really work??? > > Isn't that the same as feeding them a high protein fish food? ie 43% or > more. > > > =Nick > > > Cynthia brennemann wrote: > > >The water and air are at 80 degrees, the lid is down so there is plenty > >of humidity. So in two days start giving them their infusoria and egg > >yolk? Is that about the time the male betta will just give up and stop > >taking care of them, too? > > > > > > > >>The fry will not eat at this stage -- they have a yolk sack right now > >>from which they absorb their nutrients. They'll start eating when > >>they are free-swimming, which will be from two to three days after > >>they hatched, depending upon the water temperature. While you don't > >>need to leave the aquarium light on all night, some light would help - > >>- like a table lamp near the tank, just so he can get any straglers > >>that happen to fall out of the nest. Ray > >> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > >. > >Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12692	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

Sharron, My opinion :-) a 35 Hex is a lot smaller then you think. Try 4 or 5 of these.. They are great little guys very entertaining and very hardy for a Salt water fish. (4) Amphiprion ocellaris approx price ( $15 each ) 2males and 2females if you can (2)Elacatinus oceanops approx price ( $12 each ) mated pair preferably and choose a nice piece of rock not live rock to go into the tank. Use live sand not live rock because you NEVER know what is going to hitch hike in on live rock... Stay away from Damsels, as they stay small but are very aggressive,territorial, and well they are not very nice.. They are cheap though.. In a message dated 6/30/2005 9:22:57 PM US Eastern Standard Time, agentscullyeyore@... writes: > question my friend is setting up a hex 35 gallon saltwater aquarium... she > > would like to know what kind of fish would be a good hardy choice for that > size > and her being new to saltwater.. thanks Shannon > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12693	From: Evita	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: New Numbers

Steve, I am still not really sure about her and her chances. this morning the other two which appear to be totally bonded are sleeping on the bottom happily together. But she is once again in the very top left corner again. I have never seen a fish hang on like this one. Could this just be because of the defect more than the illness? I wonder because the dip is right at the jaw or gill on one side. Oh, I still have one fry growing well in the adult tank. Mush me a really smart one because I couldn't catch him and neither could the adults. He is one of the dark ones in color. Looking at the other fry it looks like some are light almost white and some are starting to go orange. Hope I am not bugging you to death Steve. Evita Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: Evita, So long as your darling is not a part of a breeding program, assuming the defect is genetic, there is no harm in keeping her around. I think we have all done a similar deed at least once. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12694	From: Paul N. Chung	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk

Hey, Instead of choosing egg yolks, which can make your water cloudy. Why don't you try hatching Brine Shrimp? To make it hatch faster, buy from your local fish store, a liter or 4 liters of marine water, and have those brine shrimps "hatched." Brine shrimp is a good food for your fries ( baby fish ). Well, at least, smells better than having infusoria or microworms. Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote: If you mean, do fry eat strained hard-boiled egg yolk and that it puts growth on them, then the answer is yes it "works"! You might consider it the same only in as much as it is a "high protein fish food". If you're looking for a comparison to some of the powdered fry foods which have a high protein content these are good but depending upon fry species, egg yolk is generally eaten more readily. It is also digested and assimilated more easily and has a much higher protein content (57%) not to mention the whole host of readily available fresh vitamins (A, B6, B12, C, D, E, etc.) and minerals (calcium, iron, magnesium, etc.), promoting much faster growth. In general, vitamins in flake and/or powdered fish food is generally lost with two months of its manufacture. Additionally, egg yolk enables infusoria growth in the aquarium. The commercially available product "Liquifry" is about as close as you can get as far as an over-the-counter food. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Nicolas Munro <nmunro@q...> wrote: > Do the egg yolks really work??? > > Isn't that the same as feeding them a high protein fish food? ie 43% or > more. > > > =Nick > > > Cynthia brennemann wrote: > > >The water and air are at 80 degrees, the lid is down so there is plenty > >of humidity. So in two days start giving them their infusoria and egg > >yolk? Is that about the time the male betta will just give up and stop > >taking care of them, too? > > > > > > Respectfully Yours, Paul N. Chung http://www.geocities.com/p_n_chung/index.html http://www.geocities.com/filipinofish/index.html http://filipinofish.tripod.com/ __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12695	From: Evita	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!

Thanks Nicolas. Is Clout a brand? I would rather use something fast acting if it is safe. Evita They are better but the girls say they see a dot or two on one. I really want to knock this out for good. I have platy's by the way. Evita Nicolas Munro <nmunro@...> wrote:Evita, Not sure if you have gotten over the whole Ick thing but i thought Sandra's research was pretty cool. Can't vouch if it works but last i heard it worked for her. 21/June/05, Sandra wrote: hi Deborah, i just checked again on the medicines and it says the following: CLOUT: Not suitable for use in aquariums containing live rock or invertebrates. Use cautiously with marine sharks and lion fish. COPPER-SAFE: Before use, remove invertebrates from tank. CopperSafe may be harmful to plants and some snails. Remove invertebrates without exoskeletons such as jellyfish, anemone etc. BUT, i did some research on the Internet and it says that CLOUT cannot be used on scaleless fish, that it will most probably kill them. Couldn't find nothing that said not to use CopperSafe with them, but as you know its very slow in action. I hope you dont have another outbreak of ich and that your fish stay healthy !!! sandra --------------------------------- Discover Yahoo! Stay in touch with email, IM, photo sharing & more. Check it out! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12696	From: Evita	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk

I am totally new at the fish thing but my fry are thriving after a week and growing like weeds on the same flake food as the parents. I just crush it rolling it in my fingers to small little dots for them. I have been feeding them 4-5 times a day very small amounts. I am planning a water change today. My water is fine. Evita FortWayneFish@... wrote:A high protein fish food is great but the fry are so small you need itty bitty particles for them to eat. --------------------------------- Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12697	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk

Paul, Depending upon the size of the fry, sometimes they are just too small when they are first free-swimming, to be able to handle newly hatched brine shrimp so something smaller has to be offered (such as strained egg yolk) for the first few days or up until the first week. Yes, if overfed egg yolk can make the water cloudy; I've cautioned about this in a previous recent post. There are also times when infusoria (or some similarly sized substitute) must be used as a first fry food, again as they may not be able to handle anything larger. As soon as bbs (baby brine shrimp) can be fed to the fry, it's an excellent food but needs to be hatched daily for best nutritional results. Therefore, its probably more convenient (and cheaper) to buy a box of Diamond Crystal Kosher salt to mix into solution at home for hatching bbs rather than buying marine water from a store. In that way you can mix a fresh new solution of salt water daily, as needed. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Paul N. Chung" <p_n_chung@y...> wrote: > Hey, > > Instead of choosing egg yolks, which can make your water cloudy. Why don't you try hatching Brine Shrimp? > > To make it hatch faster, buy from your local fish store, a liter or 4 liters of marine water, and have those brine shrimps "hatched." > > Brine shrimp is a good food for your fries ( baby fish ). Well, at least, smells better than having infusoria or microworms. > > > > > Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > If you mean, do fry eat strained hard-boiled egg yolk and that it > puts growth on them, then the answer is yes it "works"! You might > consider it the same only in as much as it is a "high protein fish > food". If you're looking for a comparison to some of the powdered > fry foods which have a high protein content these are good but > depending upon fry species, egg yolk is generally eaten more > readily. It is also digested and assimilated more easily and has a > much higher protein content (57%) not to mention the whole host of > readily available fresh vitamins (A, B6, B12, C, D, E, etc.) and > minerals (calcium, iron, magnesium, etc.), promoting much faster > growth. In general, vitamins in flake and/or powdered fish food is > generally lost with two months of its manufacture. Additionally, egg > yolk enables infusoria growth in the aquarium. The commercially > available product "Liquifry" is about as close as you can get as far > as an over-the-counter food. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Nicolas Munro <nmunro@q...> wrote: > > Do the egg yolks really work??? > > > > Isn't that the same as feeding them a high protein fish food? ie > 43% or > > more. > > > > > > =Nick > > > > > > Cynthia brennemann wrote: > > > > >The water and air are at 80 degrees, the lid is down so there is > plenty > > >of humidity. So in two days start giving them their infusoria and > egg > > >yolk? Is that about the time the male betta will just give up and > stop > > >taking care of them, too? > > > > > > > > > > > > Respectfully Yours, > > Paul N. Chung > http://www.geocities.com/p_n_chung/index.html > > http://www.geocities.com/filipinofish/index.html > > http://filipinofish.tripod.com/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12698	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!

Evita, Yes Clout is a brand, but I would not recommend it for something as simple as getting rid of a few dots of Ich. By far, the safest way to get rid of Ich is to raise the temperature up to 86o for about 10 days (or for 3 days after no more Ich is seen), with the addition of Kosher salt -- from 1 tbs per 5 gallons up to one tsp per gallon; Platies, as with most liveberarers, can take salt. If you're in a hurry and prefer to use a medication, one of the safest meds is "Rid-Ich" brand (by Korden). Use with the addition of 1/8 tsp of Epson salts -- this will soften the cysts enabling the medication to work faster. Regards, ANYONE \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Evita <evitabug@y...> wrote: > Thanks Nicolas. Is Clout a brand? I would rather use something fast acting if it is safe. Evita They are better but the girls say they see a dot or two on one. I really want to knock this out for good. I have platy's by the way. Evita > > Nicolas Munro <nmunro@q...> wrote:Evita, > > Not sure if you have gotten over the whole Ick thing but i thought > Sandra's research was pretty cool. > Can't vouch if it works but last i heard it worked for her. > > > 21/June/05, Sandra wrote: > > hi Deborah, > > i just checked again on the medicines and it says the following: > > CLOUT: Not suitable for use in aquariums containing live rock or > invertebrates. Use cautiously with marine sharks and lion fish. > > COPPER-SAFE: Before use, remove invertebrates from tank. CopperSafe > may be harmful to plants and some snails. Remove invertebrates > without exoskeletons such as jellyfish, anemone etc. > > BUT, i did some research on the Internet and it says that CLOUT > cannot be used on scaleless fish, that it will most probably kill > them. Couldn't find nothing that said not to use CopperSafe with > them, but as you know its very slow in action. > > I hope you dont have another outbreak of ich and that your fish stay > healthy !!! > > sandra > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > Discover Yahoo! > Stay in touch with email, IM, photo sharing & more. Check it out! > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12699	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk

Apparantly they do. I mushed them up really fine with some infusoria and added it to the aquarium, and they have THRIVED on it. They are about the size of newborn guppy fry now, so cute! > Do the egg yolks really work??? > > Isn't that the same as feeding them a high protein fish food? ie 43% or > more. > > > =Nick

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12700	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk

> Hey, > > Instead of choosing egg yolks, which can make your water cloudy. Why don't you try hatching Brine Shrimp? > > To make it hatch faster, buy from your local fish store, a liter or 4 liters of marine water, and have those brine shrimps "hatched." > > Brine shrimp is a good food for your fries ( baby fish ). Well, at least, smells better than having infusoria or microworms. Well, I'd have to agree with that last statement. The egg yolk and infusoria was kinda whiffy. They are now on brine shrimp and powdered betta food and doing great.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12701	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk

Evita, Glad to hear your fry are thriving. Yeah, with the right amount of finger pressure flake food can be pulverized almost to a powder (at least very fine) and as you've found out is a good first food for small fry if they take it. although maybe not quite as nutritious as other options. With your feeding them 4-5 times a day, it sounds like they're doing just fine. You might want to consider hatching baby brine shrimp, at least for one or two of those daily feedings as they may grow faster yet, even though powdered food is more convenient -- and they will get better color. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Evita <evitabug@y...> wrote: > I am totally new at the fish thing but my fry are thriving after a week and growing like weeds on the same flake food as the parents. I just crush it rolling it in my fingers to small little dots for them. I have been feeding them 4-5 times a day very small amounts. I am planning a water change today. My water is fine. Evita > > FortWayneFish@a... wrote:A high protein fish food is great but the fry are so small you need itty > bitty particles for them to eat. > > > > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Sports > Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12702	From: Evita	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!

Thanks a bunch I am going out in a minute or two do do some this or that shopping. I will see if my local store may carry it. I am assuming do one or the other and not both. Sorry if a dumb question. What do you see in the difference between Kosher salt, table salt or sea salt? I find that confusing a bit. I have been treating just with table salt and the raised temperate at 86. It has been about 4 full days. Thanks again. This has been the most helpful group of people. Evita Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote: Evita, Yes Clout is a brand, but I would not recommend it for something as simple as getting rid of a few dots of Ich. By far, the safest way to get rid of Ich is to raise the temperature up to 86o for about 10 days (or for 3 days after no more Ich is seen), with the addition of Kosher salt -- from 1 tbs per 5 gallons up to one tsp per gallon; Platies, as with most liveberarers, can take salt. If you're in a hurry and prefer to use a medication, one of the safest meds is "Rid-Ich" brand (by Korden). Use with the addition of 1/8 tsp of Epson salts -- this will soften the cysts enabling the medication to work faster. Regards, ANYONE \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Evita <evitabug@y...> wrote: > Thanks Nicolas. Is Clout a brand? I would rather use something fast acting if it is safe. Evita They are better but the girls say they see a dot or two on one. I really want to knock this out for good. I have platy's by the way. Evita > > Nicolas Munro <nmunro@q...> wrote:Evita, > > Not sure if you have gotten over the whole Ick thing but i thought > Sandra's research was pretty cool. > Can't vouch if it works but last i heard it worked for her. > > > 21/June/05, Sandra wrote: > > hi Deborah, > > i just checked again on the medicines and it says the following: > > CLOUT: Not suitable for use in aquariums containing live rock or > invertebrates. Use cautiously with marine sharks and lion fish. > > COPPER-SAFE: Before use, remove invertebrates from tank. CopperSafe > may be harmful to plants and some snails. Remove invertebrates > without exoskeletons such as jellyfish, anemone etc. > > BUT, i did some research on the Internet and it says that CLOUT > cannot be used on scaleless fish, that it will most probably kill > them. Couldn't find nothing that said not to use CopperSafe with > them, but as you know its very slow in action. > > I hope you dont have another outbreak of ich and that your fish stay > healthy !!! > > sandra > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > Discover Yahoo! > Stay in touch with email, IM, photo sharing & more. Check it out! > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12703	From: Evita	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk

Thanks Ray I will check it out. Heh, remember Sea Monkeys or are you too young. I had to get some when I was a kid. They didn't turn out to look anything like the pictures. HA! Evita Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote: Evita, Glad to hear your fry are thriving. Yeah, with the right amount of finger pressure flake food can be pulverized almost to a powder (at least very fine) and as you've found out is a good first food for small fry if they take it. although maybe not quite as nutritious as other options. With your feeding them 4-5 times a day, it sounds like they're doing just fine. You might want to consider hatching baby brine shrimp, at least for one or two of those daily feedings as they may grow faster yet, even though powdered food is more convenient -- and they will get better color. Ray \ --------------------------------- Discover Yahoo! Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news & more. Check it out! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12704	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk

Cynthia, Glad to see your Betta fry are doing great, as you're mentioning. Looks like they've graduated to larger foods. Just keep on keeping the water clean with partial water changes (of same temperature, of course). Actually, while green water in itself may smell a little "green" (whiffy), infusoria cultures that are started on decaying matter (like crushed lettuce leaves) can smell real whiffy, as often that will produce more bacteria (not a fry food) than infusoria and will smell like the decaying matter that it is. Likewise with microworm cultures, the foul smell is the culture medium going bad at which time a new culture should have been started before it even reached this point. Too, egg yolk will foul quickly, as you've discovered but is one of the better foods for small fry if you're careful with it. No doubt its probably a lot easier feeding them now. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "cynthia brennemann" <brennewoman@h...> wrote: > Well, I'd have to agree with that last statement. The egg yolk and > infusoria was kinda whiffy. They are now on brine shrimp and powdered > betta food and doing great. ---In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Paul N. Chung" <p_n_chung@y...> wrote: Brine shrimp is a good food for your fries ( baby fish ). Well, at least, smells better than having infusoria or microworms.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12705	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!

Much has been posted on this forum even up until recently about the pros and cons of different salts. Basically, the differences between the three types of salt you mentioned are: (1) sea salt consists mostly of sodium chloride (NaCl) as do the others, but also has all the trace elements found in sea water (an un-needed expense for fresh water medicinal applications), (2) table salt, again mostly sodium chloride, but with anti-caking agents and usually with iodine as well (some people use this without any apparent downfalls, despite the additives), (3) true Kosher salt (like Diamond Crystal brand) consists of nothing but pure sodium chloride (in my opinon, the best/safest and at the same time the cheapest for practical fresh water use). If you're only in the fourth day of the heat/salt Ich treatment, why don't you wait it out for another six days? With just a couple of spots left on the fish, it sounds like you're doing a good job of beating it already. ANYONE \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Evita <evitabug@y...> wrote: > Thanks a bunch I am going out in a minute or two do do some this or that shopping. I will see if my local store may carry it. I am assuming do one or the other and not both. Sorry if a dumb question. What do you see in the difference between Kosher salt, table salt or sea salt? I find that confusing a bit. I have been treating just with table salt and the raised temperate at 86. It has been about 4 full days. Thanks again. This has been the most helpful group of people. Evita > > Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: Evita, Yes Clout is a brand, but I would not recommend it for > something as simple as getting rid of a few dots of Ich. By far, the > safest way to get rid of Ich is to raise the temperature up to 86o > for about 10 days (or for 3 days after no more Ich is seen), with the > addition of Kosher salt -- from 1 tbs per 5 gallons up to one tsp per > gallon; Platies, as with most liveberarers, can take salt. If you're > in a hurry and prefer to use a medication, one of the safest meds > is "Rid-Ich" brand (by Korden). Use with the addition of 1/8 tsp of > Epson salts -- this will soften the cysts enabling the medication to > work faster. Regards, ANYONE > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Evita <evitabug@y...> wrote: > > Thanks Nicolas. Is Clout a brand? I would rather use something fast > acting if it is safe. Evita They are better but the girls say they > see a dot or two on one. I really want to knock this out for good. I > have platy's by the way. Evita > > > > Nicolas Munro <nmunro@q...> wrote:Evita, > > > > Not sure if you have gotten over the whole Ick thing but i thought > > Sandra's research was pretty cool. > > Can't vouch if it works but last i heard it worked for her. > > > > > > 21/June/05, Sandra wrote: > > > > hi Deborah, > > > > i just checked again on the medicines and it says the following: > > > > CLOUT: Not suitable for use in aquariums containing live rock or > > invertebrates. Use cautiously with marine sharks and lion fish. > > > > COPPER-SAFE: Before use, remove invertebrates from tank. CopperSafe > > may be harmful to plants and some snails. Remove invertebrates > > without exoskeletons such as jellyfish, anemone etc. > > > > BUT, i did some research on the Internet and it says that CLOUT > > cannot be used on scaleless fish, that it will most probably kill > > them. Couldn't find nothing that said not to use CopperSafe with > > them, but as you know its very slow in action. > > > > I hope you dont have another outbreak of ich and that your fish > stay > > healthy !!! > > > > sandra > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > Discover Yahoo! > > Stay in touch with email, IM, photo sharing & more. Check it out! > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12706	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

thanks robbie.. i told her that it was small but unlike others she really isn't listening to me... and what i the general name for those fish do you know... Shannon: Sharron, My opinion :-) a 35 Hex is a lot smaller then you think. Try 4 or 5 of these.. They are great little guys very entertaining and very hardy for a Salt water fish. (4) Amphiprion ocellaris approx price ( $15 each ) 2males and 2females if you can (2)Elacatinus oceanops approx price ( $12 each ) mated pair preferably and choose a nice piece of rock not live rock to go into the tank. Use live sand not live rock because you NEVER know what is going to hitch hike in on live rock... Stay away from Damsels, as they stay small but are very aggressive,territorial, and well they are not very nice.. They are cheap though.. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12707	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk

Yeah, I do remember "Sea Monkeys" -- what a gimmick. For those who were not already familiar with brine shrimp, not being in the tropical fish hobby, I'm sure they expected something entirely different especially going by the pictures they used to advertise with. Actually, hatching them isn't really that hard, if you want to try it. You can buy hatching cones made of thin plastic or you can use old gallon jars (preferably tilted off center) with an air stone at the bottom. Different sources of brine shrimp eggs require slightly different salt solutions, but in general you use about 6 tbp of Kosher salt per gallon and if you're tilting the jar as you should be doing, you'll be using about 3/4 gallon of water -- so you'll use 4 1/2 tbp of salt. Depending upon the temperature (should be about 80o), they'll hatch in about 24 - 30 hours, at which time you remove the airstone, let it sit a few minutes, and drain (with small plastic hose) the shrimp through a linen handkerchief using an empty gallon jar and returning that water when you're done. About 1/4 tsp of brine shrimp eggs should be enough for several feedings for your fry. I use 5 gallon carboys (twice a day) with about 3 tsps (or more) of eggs depending upon what I have going at the time. You should consider using at least two jars to rotate them every day so you constantly have a new batch. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Evita <evitabug@y...> wrote: > Thanks Ray I will check it out. Heh, remember Sea Monkeys or are you too young. I had to get some when I was a kid. They didn't turn out to look anything like the pictures. HA! Evita > > Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: Evita, Glad to hear your fry are thriving. Yeah, with the right > amount of finger pressure flake food can be pulverized almost to a > powder (at least very fine) and as you've found out is a good first > food for small fry if they take it. although maybe not quite as > nutritious as other options. With your feeding them 4-5 times a day, > it sounds like they're doing just fine. You might want to consider > hatching baby brine shrimp, at least for one or two of those daily > feedings as they may grow faster yet, even though powdered food is more > convenient -- and they will get better color. Ray > \ > > > > > --------------------------------- > Discover Yahoo! > Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news & more. Check it out! > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12708	From: Evita	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!

Ray, Thanks you make me feel much better about the treatment. Is the loss of only one fish out of four pretty good? I really hope I don't loose anymore. Also thanks for explaining the salt thing so simply for me as well. I will see if our store carries the Kosher but so far no bad effects from the table salt. Evita --------------------------------- Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12709	From: Evita	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk

Thanks Ray .....your great! Evita Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote:Yeah, I do remember "Sea Monkeys" -- what a gimmick. For those who were not already familiar with brine shrimp, not being in the tropical fish hobby, I'm sure they expected something entirely different especially going by the pictures they used to advertise with. Actually, hatching them isn't really that hard, if you want to try it. You can buy hatching cones made of thin plastic or you can use old gallon jars (preferably tilted off center) with an air stone at the bottom. Different sources of brine shrimp eggs require slightly different salt solutions, but in general you use about 6 tbp of Kosher salt per gallon and if you're tilting the jar as you should be doing, you'll be using about 3/4 gallon of water -- so you'll use 4 1/2 tbp of salt. Depending upon the temperature (should be about 80o), they'll hatch in about 24 - 30 hours, at which time you remove the airstone, let it sit a few minutes, and drain (with small plastic hose) the shrimp through a linen handkerchief using an empty gallon jar and returning that water when you're done. About 1/4 tsp of brine shrimp eggs should be enough for several feedings for your fry. I use 5 gallon carboys (twice a day) with about 3 tsps (or more) of eggs depending upon what I have going at the time. You should consider using at least two jars to rotate them every day so you constantly have a new batch. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Evita <evitabug@y...> wrote: > Thanks Ray I will check it out. Heh, remember Sea Monkeys or are you too young. I had to get some when I was a kid. They didn't turn out to look anything like the pictures. HA! Evita > > Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: Evita, Glad to hear your fry are thriving. Yeah, with the right > amount of finger pressure flake food can be pulverized almost to a > powder (at least very fine) and as you've found out is a good first > food for small fry if they take it. although maybe not quite as > nutritious as other options. With your feeding them 4-5 times a day, > it sounds like they're doing just fine. You might want to consider > hatching baby brine shrimp, at least for one or two of those daily > feedings as they may grow faster yet, even though powdered food is more > convenient -- and they will get better color. Ray > \ > > > > > --------------------------------- > Discover Yahoo! > Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news & more. Check it out! > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12710	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!

While at times all fish so affected may come through it unscathed, quite often you're bound to lose a fish or two. That one was probably the weakest one at the onset and/or had received or got the worst of the initial stress which caused this disease to manifest itself. Don't be too hard on yourself for this one loss which was probably out of your control after the group contracted the Ich. Main thing now is it looks like its getting under control. Ray (ANYONE); Looks like I've been discovered! \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Evita <evitabug@y...> wrote: > Ray, Thanks you make me feel much better about the treatment. Is the loss of only one fish out of four pretty good? I really hope I don't loose anymore. Also thanks for explaining the salt thing so simply for me as well. I will see if our store carries the Kosher but so far no bad effects from the table salt. Evita > > > > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Sports > Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12711	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

i would say false percula clowns (amphiprion ocellaris), firefish, some of the gobies. tell her to check out this link: http://www.liveaquaria.com/product/scateg.cfm?pCatId=2124 this might give her a good idea. -valeen --- agentscullyeyore@... wrote: > question my friend is setting up a hex 35 gallon saltwater aquarium... she > would like to know what kind of fish would be a good hardy choice for that size > and her being new to saltwater.. thanks Shannon > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12712	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: some little questions

Emily, Yes, fish do need light. They are used to the same diurnal sequence that we are. Many will also need light to forage for food. Ambient light, light that is no specific to the aquarium, will suffice. However, to view your fish in the best manner, you need to have light right into the aquarium. It need not be on for longer than you are home, and prone to viewing the fish, provided there is sufficient ambient light in the room (a windowless room is not the place to depend on ambient light <g>). If you are also keeping live plants, then, as you indicated, you do need light specifically for the aquarium. If an object is not made specifically for the aquarium, I'd be hesitant to test in in an aquarium. You really have no way of knowing if an object like the one you allude to is going to be OK in an aquarium environment. If you have a spare container that you can fill with aquarium water, you can place the object in that to test, and then use your test kits to see if anything goes amiss, but this will not cover the full range of problems that may develop. For instance, the object could leach copper, and you would not know unless you have a kit to specifically test for copper. Copper is toxic to many aquatic species, and is often used in treating certain diseases and infestations, but in known quantities, with removal after the treatment. There are other things that could also leach from such an object. Play it safe and do not place objects in the aquarium that are made to be placed in the aquarium, even if you need to go for the bubbling treasure chest and the no fishing sign <g>. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of kb1dva Sent: Thursday, June 30, 2005 3:43 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] some little questions Umm I know that aquariums with live plants need light, but do fish need light and how much, and is to much bad for them How do you tell if something ceramic is ok for an aquarium, no it wasn't made for one- just cute Cold I put it in with a goldfish and see how it does? -or is that mean Emily

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12713	From: LobsterPond.com	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: Muskie Tales

Hi Ray- Fishing? Just came in from the lake dock (will be out there again this weekend). I caught 2 smaller bass this am (not a lunchable size yet). Yes- Waterville MN has a State run hatchery. . . at least I think the DNR manages it. I also have a hatchery lic for my crayfishies. . . which I had to get since they are breeding so often. . . . even though they are non-invasive to MN. Can't use them for bait either (unless they are cooked) since unknown pathogens can be present. I haven't had a problem though with taking lake water and running into my tanks (not allowed to do the reverse and it's not a good practice). Have a great 4th weekend- Sherry "A dog's paradise is no less a paradise" . . . unknown author ============================================ From: "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@...> Subject: Re: Hi Sherry, From the looks of it, it seems you enjoy fishing. Any particular type of fish? Noticed a hatchery near you -- now that's fish breeding on a large scale! -- those tours are always fascinating. Ray ___________________________________________________________________ Get Juno Platinum for as low as $6.95/month! Unlimited Internet Access with 250MB of Email Storage. Visit http://www.juno.com/bestoffer to sign up today!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12714	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

thanks a bunch.. will send it to her.. Shannon: i would say false percula clowns (amphiprion ocellaris), firefish, some of the gobies. tell her to check out this link: http://www.liveaquaria.com/product/scateg.cfm?pCatId=2124 this might give her a good idea. -valeen [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12715	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: Introduction and new tank

welcome heather! hope you enjoy yourself here. you'll definitely get some great advice as there are some very knowledgable people in this group. -valeen --- hhusvar <hhusvar@...> wrote: > Hello everyone! > > My name is Heather and I've been a long time freshwater fish > enthusiast. After relocating, getting married and having a child we > decided it was time to begin our foray into rebuilding aquariums. My > husband, not being half as crazy as I am said he wasn't interested in > the things I've worked with before (breeding aggressives like chiclids > and bettas) and he wanted some fun, active and attractive creatures > for our new tank to introduce our child into the family hobby. I said > ok and we got started.. I've been told to back off, this is his > and her choice. I'm trying! So, first fish, the two of them pick out > four fancy fantailed male guppies. I was not sure what to think > because I have never had them before. They also got three angel > fish. Somewhere along the lines we used a store credit and picked up > a blue crayfish. None of us had crayfish experience before, but we > had done research and thought "ok, it should be ok as long as we feed > it." :D The first day, all we had were the guppies and I was coming > around to the idea that they were kind of fun and silly as they were > playing in the bubble wall. Day 2, one guppy disappears and I can't > find it *anywhere*. My only guess is that it died and the guppies ate > it or it jumped out and the cat ate it. Day 3, Angelfish introduced, > all is hunky dorey, no sign of the missing guppie. Guppie pronounced > MIA and presumed dead. Day 4: crayfish introduced - he digs around > and eats some pellets and later I'm looking in the tank and he's > carrying around the missing guppy who is definitely dead and is now > half eaten. I wonder if I should try to wrestle it away to take it > back for the dead fish guarantee. My husband says to let the crayfish > have it. This morning I see him at the top of a plant, catching an > angelfish (We read and were told, they weren't really wild hunters > and would prefer tablets and bottom feeders) and by the time I was > leaving he had devoured most of it and was chewing (is chewing the > proper term?) the head. Of course, the guppies are fast and they like > to tease him by diving down towards him, making a circle and zipping > back off to the top of the tank. I'm hoping we still have fish when I > get home and he hasn't gone on some gigantic eating spree. In the > mean time, I'm going to set up his own tank and provide him with some > feeders and maybe get a tank mate. In the mean time, it's all quite > interesting and I suppose I'd better buy another angel fish. (I had > named them Darryl, Darryl & Darryl. Hee hee. It's not the same with > only two.) Of course, now we have another little tank problem, but > nothing that's a big deal. Apparently, in addition to being a > prolific hunter, the crayfish does NOT like the tablets we purchased > so he tore one up and tossed it all over the place, between that and > the fish he's killed and an accidental overfeed by our daughter we > now have a very slightly cloudy water. Eh, any hobby's worth a > little extra work I suppose! If there's additional advice, I'd love > to hear it. > > Heather H. > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12716	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: New Numbers

Evita, Once you get over the ich hump here, you will have an established tank, hence the quarantine tank. You'll probably want a 5 gallon tank for a quarantine for your 30, but a 10 gallon tank is probably more cost efficient--you don't need to fill it all the way up. I guess I am just used to having tanks available, or being able to get one quickly, so I really don't think about it. Another thing is that I keep mostly single species tanks, so I actually don't do much in the way of quarantine anyhow, new fish go into an empty tank and stay there. If you get the tank and get it set up, you can get the new fish soon, and then they should be ready when the main tank is ready. (Actually, I am surprised we haven't heard from the dump 'em all in at once contingent, but that is probably just as well). I know you are impatient to get this thing going so you have something nice to look at with a bunch of fish and activity, but, one of the reasons many people keep fish is for relaxation, so relax <G>. Getting started on the right foot is most of the battle, and you'll be glad you did in the long run. To jump start a cycle in a quarantine tank, if you keep a sponge filter going in another tank, you'll have the bacteria you need to add to a quarantine tank at a moment's notice. Just move the sponge filter to the quarantine tank and add fish. A mini cycle may ensue, but that would be a lot easier on the fish than a full blown cycle. Right now, you could add the sponge filter to the fry tank to start it "ripening" and be ready when you need it. It will probably be a couple of weeks before it is truly ready, but you can probably give it a shot after a week, if need be. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evita Sent: Thursday, June 30, 2005 11:36 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] New Numbers Steve, Thanks for the info. I don't have a quarantine tank because I have just started out and I am trying to get my tank up. I do have a really small 2 gallon tank under the sink I could try and clean up but it wouldn't be cycled either. I think if I tried to keep fish in in for two weeks they might not make it anyway in that tank. My other tank has my fry in it. What is one to do when trying to get one tank up. Plus if I have to wait two weeks why couldn't I do the quarantine and the waiting at the same time. Other wise I would be looking at over 1 month just to add to fish to a tank that has only three fish in it. At this rate it could take 6 months to get my tank up. I don't want to be impatient. What size tank would make a good hospital or quarantine tank? How does one keep it cycled if you only use it when you buy fish or when a fish is sick? I hate to sound dumb but heck if the shoe fits.... when it comes to this I am. All that I have read in my books recommends quarantine when add new fish to a thriving established tank. I am just starting out. As far as what I want next I want some guppies I think. I know they like a little salt anyway. Thanks again for all your help. Evita Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: Evita, So long as your darling is not a part of a breeding program, assuming the defect is genetic, there is no harm in keeping her around. I think we have all done a similar deed at least once. Once your treatment is done, Wait at least two weeks to ensure your fish have, indeed, been cured. Then you can get a few more fish, and, of course, quarantine them for at least two weeks to ensure that they are healthy. If they are not, you'll need to treat them in the quarantine tank, and then go another two weeks prior to adding them to your main tank. Once the fish seem to be cured, the salt will be removed by your normal water changes. So long as you are not considering any salt intolerant fish, and I don't think you are, the salt in the main tank would be fine. Most salt intolerant fish are from areas of very soft, acid water. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evita Sent: Thursday, June 30, 2005 9:05 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] New Numbers Steve, First of all thanks for all your help and patience with all my dumb questions. I got up this morning fully expecting for my fish to be dead. (See when we got them my three girls and I all picked one fish. Like usual I pick the smallest one). Anyway from the start this fish seems to be the weakest one. She does well at times swimming all over the place then I will look in the tank for her and she is gone. The other two who came through this much better are swimming together all over the place. Then I find her in the left top corner at the top of the water so still I think she is dead. I tap the glass a few times and then she swims. This morning I get up and she is at the bottom of the tank with the others looking like there is nothing wrong with her. Oh also I have to add. Right after we got them home we noticed that she is deformed. It doesn't effect her except she looks odd. I know I should according to the fish books kill her but I just don't have the heart to do it. It is an oddity in the shape of her head....their is a dip the head to the body. You would have to see it. It makes her head look smaller around the neck. Anyway I am thinking this deformity has also made her weaker. That is also why I thought she might die. I thought if she lives then she was meant to. So far so good. Please don't tell me I am wrong in this. After all she has been though I just can't kill her now. Not my thing. Steve about the adding of salt treatment. If I do no water changes when I add the salt won't my water get too salty? After the treatment is over and all is well then I would think it would be safe as well a cycled to add more fish? Or should I wait a few water changes to bring down the salt content of the water first? Oh, I saw two more babies in the adult tank. They seem to be growing and tolerating the treatments of salt. I was really surprised they were alive due to the ick and or being eaten. Also my nursery tank the baby fry are thriving. No signs of loosing any or illness there. On a side note. I get my pet food, mainly bird and cat food, at Walmart. That is where I got my platys by the way. We went last night. All their tanks show various signs of illness. They keep putting more fish in the tanks every Tue. So the ones they sell could be infected and the ones they don't usually die. I think they should stop selling fish. Just my opinion. No one really care for them besides scooping up the dead fish every now and then. One fish even had an eye that was totally blinded and sticking out. It was sad. I used their tanks to show my kids signs of illness fish can get, what to look for and what happens to them. Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: Evita, You'll need to continue the treatment for 10-14 days or at least three days after all the symptoms have gone. You can stop changing the water. The idea was to do an immediate water change to help the fish with some freshwater, then to maintain your normal schedule, unless there is an indication that the water should be changed sooner. Once the treatment period has ended, bring the water temperature down gradually, to where it was before. When the indicator light comes on in the heater, simply turn the heater down until the light goes off, then do the same the next day, and the next, until the temperature is normal for your tank. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Jade Evita Sent: Wednesday, June 29, 2005 8:18 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] New Numbers My numbers are slightly down on my Nitrate and Nitrite. My Nitrate is down to around 20 from the 40 and the Nitrite appears to be almost at 0. It has been two weeks sense I added the fish. One died from what appears to be ick related. One is still acting effected but holding her own and two appear to be hopefully on the mend. Only three days of treating with water changes, salt and raised water temp at between 84- 86. Should I add an over the counter remedy in addition to the salt? Continue with the salt? Keep doing the water changes? Also how long should I keep the water temps up and when I lower them what would be the best temp. I had the tank at around 76 before they got sick. Thanks in advance. Evita

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12717	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: New Numbers

Well, if you don't mind putting up with my schedule of answering, its no problem really. As for your precious one, it is hard to say without seeing the fish. It could be a sign of distress or it could be normal behavior. Just keep an eye on her, and cross your fingers. Sorry, that's about the best I can do. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evita Sent: Friday, July 01, 2005 8:01 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] New Numbers Steve, I am still not really sure about her and her chances. this morning the other two which appear to be totally bonded are sleeping on the bottom happily together. But she is once again in the very top left corner again. I have never seen a fish hang on like this one. Could this just be because of the defect more than the illness? I wonder because the dip is right at the jaw or gill on one side. Oh, I still have one fry growing well in the adult tank. Mush me a really smart one because I couldn't catch him and neither could the adults. He is one of the dark ones in color. Looking at the other fry it looks like some are light almost white and some are starting to go orange. Hope I am not bugging you to death Steve. Evita Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: Evita, So long as your darling is not a part of a breeding program, assuming the defect is genetic, there is no harm in keeping her around. I think we have all done a similar deed at least once. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12718	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

general names ===== false percula clowns - looks like nemo and neon gobies. rob In a message dated 7/1/2005 10:29:55 AM US Eastern Standard Time, agentscullyeyore@... writes: > > thanks robbie.. i told her that it was small but unlike others she really > isn't listening to me... and what i the general name for those fish do you > know... Shannon: > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12719	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

thanks i went to google and found them are all gobies non aggressive or just that kind.. Shannon general names ===== false percula clowns - looks like nemo and neon gobies. rob In a message dated 7/1/2005 10:29:55 AM US Eastern Standard Time, agentscullyeyore@... writes: > > thanks robbie.. i told her that it was small but unlike others she really > isn't listening to me... and what i the general name for those fish do you > know... Shannon: [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12720	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

i think a lot of gobies aren't that aggressive towards other species of fish, but may be aggressive towards others of their own species. so if your friend gets 1 goby it should be fine. that is, unless she happens to get another species of fish that is aggressive and/or predatorial towards other species like some triggers are (maybe most triggers lol). if she sticks with gobies like a watchman or a neon as rob suggested, and got only other non-aggressive fish like false percs or firefish, she should be ok. --- agentscullyeyore@... wrote: > > thanks i went to google and found them are all gobies non aggressive or just > that kind.. Shannon > > general names ===== false percula clowns - looks like nemo > and neon gobies. > > rob > > In a message dated 7/1/2005 10:29:55 AM US Eastern Standard Time, > agentscullyeyore@... writes: > > > > > > thanks robbie.. i told her that it was small but unlike others she really > > > isn't listening to me... and what i the general name for those fish do you > > > know... Shannon: > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12721	From: Sandra	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

Sorry, just my opinion: I wouldnt recommend buying a firefish for such a small system. Those fishes can grow very large and may not even be able to "turn around" in a 30 something gallon aquarium. Besides that will eat anything that fits in their mouth, have a huge amount of bioload (will contamine the water very fast unless she does water changes VERY often and has a very potent skimmer) and other than that, getting this fish to eat can be more difficult than raising a child.. oh yeah, and are venemous... great fish and very hardy but i wouldnt say it´s for beginners with a small tank. sandra --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@y...> wrote: > i think a lot of gobies aren't that aggressive towards other species of fish, but may be > aggressive towards others of their own species. so if your friend gets 1 goby it should be fine. > that is, unless she happens to get another species of fish that is aggressive and/or predatorial > towards other species like some triggers are (maybe most triggers lol). > > if she sticks with gobies like a watchman or a neon as rob suggested, and got only other > non-aggressive fish like false percs or firefish, she should be ok. > > --- agentscullyeyore@a... wrote: > > > > > thanks i went to google and found them are all gobies non aggressive or just > > that kind.. Shannon > > > > general names ===== false percula clowns - looks like nemo > > and neon gobies. > > > > rob > > > > In a message dated 7/1/2005 10:29:55 AM US Eastern Standard Time, > > agentscullyeyore@a... writes: > > > > > > > > > > thanks robbie.. i told her that it was small but unlike others she really > > > > > isn't listening to me... and what i the general name for those fish do you > > > > > know... Shannon: > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12722	From: kritter714@aol.com	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

Whoever posted about getting the clowns for this tank just an FYI 4 clowns purchased as juveniles which is what I usually would give you a dominant female, a less dominant male and 2 "neuter" individuals they are hermaphrodites and would change sex to meet the situation. I would say a 35 gallon tank would be a good tank for 2 clowns another 2 in that small of a tank would likely be harassed Elaine in the emerald city 125 gallon marine, 90 gallon discus 80 gallon south american cichlid 55 gallon african cichlid 50 gallon temperate water tank [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12723	From: Heather Husvar	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: Introduction and new tank

Thanks! Yes, I set up the tank for four days and then put in some feeders. They took care of business. I vacuumed the gravel and did a partial change and the tank is looking a lot better. Also, even though I didn't think I should, for the price I couldn't help myself. We just added 3 dwarf flame gouramis. As it turns out, they seem to be good for the tank. Everyone looks pretty happy now. Even the crayfish (no, I have not set up his own tank yet!) has decided that it's tired of being teased so much and the tablets are a much easier choice. Now if one is dropped in he runs for it, grabs it and tucks it away in his hidey hole. They're gone by the next morning. As for number of tanks, right now we just have the one. It's only a 29. In the past we've had up to 8 or 9 tanks plus some breeder tanks, but for a while I was moving a lot and I had to put the hobby aside. Now we have stability and plan to hang around for a while. We're ready to get going again. We are starting with this one and in a couple weeks we'll put another just like it on the other side. We have room for a 75 gallon and then a large one in the dining room. We haven't decided whether we're going to expand into the office or not. We'll see. :) Heather On 6/30/05, Evita <evitabug@...> wrote: > Hi, Heather, I am a new-bie to the fish thing so I really can't be to much help. I just wanted to welcome you and tell you I really enjoyed your story. You sound like you are really getting into it. I was wondering if you cycled your tank before you started. I forgot if you said how big this tank is. How many tanks do ya have? I think you are right about the cloudy water and the food thing. I would also say if you want to keep your fish alive this guy does need his own place. You know the old saying once they have tasted blood......Oh I got the Daryle thing....very funny. I look forward to reading more of your posts. It seems I have found someone else that can talk. Evita > > > > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Mail > Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > -- The rules of parents should be but three...Love, Limit, and Let them be. - Elaine M. Ward

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12724	From: Heather Husvar	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: some little questions

> Play it > safe and do not place objects in the aquarium that are made to be placed in > the aquarium, even if you need to go for the bubbling treasure chest and the > no fishing sign <g>. > Awww.. Steve, you make that sounds like a bad thing. My daughter picked the "fresh fish" sign. Heather

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12725	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

I have not had a marine tank in a while. But I know that 99% of False percula's are now Tank bred, and raised, and a lot of the gobies are also tank bred and raised. A 35 hex has a small foot print ( bottom dimensions) As some one suggested 4 Perculas might be to much even for a 35 gallon tank. Most Gobies are very peaceful to tankmates but aggressive towards others of there kind. Plus they sift the sand pretty well if I remember right. And if she ever does get her Perculas to breed, she should be able to get rid of the fry pretty easy. Now you should ask what she could use as a "Clean up crew" because I have no idea. rob Indiana In a message dated 7/1/2005 6:10:28 PM US Eastern Standard Time, valeendgonzalez@... writes: > i think a lot of gobies aren't that aggressive towards other species of > fish, but may be > aggressive towards others of their own species. so if your friend gets 1 > goby it should be fine. > that is, unless she happens to get another species of fish that is > aggressive and/or predatorial > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12726	From: Evita	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: New Numbers

Steve and all, Sad news she died this afternoon. I figured when I looked at her this morning she would. I removed her from the tank to see her defect closer and to see how she looked. I have to say she looked like she died differently from the other fish all together. I still wonder if it wasn't somewhat to do with the defect. She had a deformed looking indention at the jaw or neck on the right side. Basically at right side of the gill. Then from the gill under the skin across the neck it appeared that there was some kind of rupture and you could see blood. The other two are swimming and eating showing no signs of distress or illness. I am trying to be patient about the whole thing. I really know that there was nothing I could have done for her. I really want to wait at least 2 weeks to see how these fish will turn out. I only have 2 now but over 20 babies still doing well. In the adult tank there is still one fry with them. I really don't have the money right now to buy another tank set up. I will keep my eyes open for a possible used one. Oh, I did get my Kosher salt today. I don't mean to sound impatient. I have had the tanks up three months and I have two fish in a 30 gal. tank. Evita Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: Well, if you don't mind putting up with my schedule of answering, its no problem really. As for your precious one, it is hard to say without seeing the fish. It could be a sign of distress or it could be normal behavior. Just keep an eye on her, and cross your fingers. Sorry, that's about the best I can do. \\Steve// --------------------------------- Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12727	From: Evita	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: New Numbers

Steve, I didn't know I could have an established tank with only two fish in it. I thought I had to have more fish to consider it so. Evita Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote:Evita, Once you get over the ich hump here, you will have an established tank, hence the quarantine tank. You'll probably want a 5 gallon tank for a quarantine for your 30, but a 10 gallon tank is probably more cost efficient--you don't need to fill it all the way up. I guess I am just used to having tanks available, or being able to get one quickly, so I really don't think about it. Another thing is that I keep mostly single species tanks, so I actually don't do much in the way of quarantine anyhow, new fish go into an empty tank and stay there. If you get the tank and get it set up, you can get the new fish soon, and then they should be ready when the main tank is ready. (Actually, I am surprised we haven't heard from the dump 'em all in at once contingent, but that is probably just as well). I know you are impatient to get this thing going so you have something nice to look at with a bunch of fish and activity, but, one of the reasons many people keep fish is for relaxation, so relax <G>. Getting started on the right foot is most of the battle, and you'll be glad you did in the long run. To jump start a cycle in a quarantine tank, if you keep a sponge filter going in another tank, you'll have the bacteria you need to add to a quarantine tank at a moment's notice. Just move the sponge filter to the quarantine tank and add fish. A mini cycle may ensue, but that would be a lot easier on the fish than a full blown cycle. Right now, you could add the sponge filter to the fry tank to start it "ripening" and be ready when you need it. It will probably be a couple of weeks before it is truly ready, but you can probably give it a shot after a week, if need be. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evita Sent: Thursday, June 30, 2005 11:36 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] New Numbers Steve, Thanks for the info. I don't have a quarantine tank because I have just started out and I am trying to get my tank up. I do have a really small 2 gallon tank under the sink I could try and clean up but it wouldn't be cycled either. I think if I tried to keep fish in in for two weeks they might not make it anyway in that tank. My other tank has my fry in it. What is one to do when trying to get one tank up. Plus if I have to wait two weeks why couldn't I do the quarantine and the waiting at the same time. Other wise I would be looking at over 1 month just to add to fish to a tank that has only three fish in it. At this rate it could take 6 months to get my tank up. I don't want to be impatient. What size tank would make a good hospital or quarantine tank? How does one keep it cycled if you only use it when you buy fish or when a fish is sick? I hate to sound dumb but heck if the shoe fits.... when it comes to this I am. All that I have read in my books recommends quarantine when add new fish to a thriving established tank. I am just starting out. As far as what I want next I want some guppies I think. I know they like a little salt anyway. Thanks again for all your help. Evita Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: Evita, So long as your darling is not a part of a breeding program, assuming the defect is genetic, there is no harm in keeping her around. I think we have all done a similar deed at least once. Once your treatment is done, Wait at least two weeks to ensure your fish have, indeed, been cured. Then you can get a few more fish, and, of course, quarantine them for at least two weeks to ensure that they are healthy. If they are not, you'll need to treat them in the quarantine tank, and then go another two weeks prior to adding them to your main tank. Once the fish seem to be cured, the salt will be removed by your normal water changes. So long as you are not considering any salt intolerant fish, and I don't think you are, the salt in the main tank would be fine. Most salt intolerant fish are from areas of very soft, acid water. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evita Sent: Thursday, June 30, 2005 9:05 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] New Numbers Steve, First of all thanks for all your help and patience with all my dumb questions. I got up this morning fully expecting for my fish to be dead. (See when we got them my three girls and I all picked one fish. Like usual I pick the smallest one). Anyway from the start this fish seems to be the weakest one. She does well at times swimming all over the place then I will look in the tank for her and she is gone. The other two who came through this much better are swimming together all over the place. Then I find her in the left top corner at the top of the water so still I think she is dead. I tap the glass a few times and then she swims. This morning I get up and she is at the bottom of the tank with the others looking like there is nothing wrong with her. Oh also I have to add. Right after we got them home we noticed that she is deformed. It doesn't effect her except she looks odd. I know I should according to the fish books kill her but I just don't have the heart to do it. It is an oddity in the shape of her head....their is a dip the head to the body. You would have to see it. It makes her head look smaller around the neck. Anyway I am thinking this deformity has also made her weaker. That is also why I thought she might die. I thought if she lives then she was meant to. So far so good. Please don't tell me I am wrong in this. After all she has been though I just can't kill her now. Not my thing. Steve about the adding of salt treatment. If I do no water changes when I add the salt won't my water get too salty? After the treatment is over and all is well then I would think it would be safe as well a cycled to add more fish? Or should I wait a few water changes to bring down the salt content of the water first? Oh, I saw two more babies in the adult tank. They seem to be growing and tolerating the treatments of salt. I was really surprised they were alive due to the ick and or being eaten. Also my nursery tank the baby fry are thriving. No signs of loosing any or illness there. On a side note. I get my pet food, mainly bird and cat food, at Walmart. That is where I got my platys by the way. We went last night. All their tanks show various signs of illness. They keep putting more fish in the tanks every Tue. So the ones they sell could be infected and the ones they don't usually die. I think they should stop selling fish. Just my opinion. No one really care for them besides scooping up the dead fish every now and then. One fish even had an eye that was totally blinded and sticking out. It was sad. I used their tanks to show my kids signs of illness fish can get, what to look for and what happens to them. Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: Evita, You'll need to continue the treatment for 10-14 days or at least three days after all the symptoms have gone. You can stop changing the water. The idea was to do an immediate water change to help the fish with some freshwater, then to maintain your normal schedule, unless there is an indication that the water should be changed sooner. Once the treatment period has ended, bring the water temperature down gradually, to where it was before. When the indicator light comes on in the heater, simply turn the heater down until the light goes off, then do the same the next day, and the next, until the temperature is normal for your tank. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Jade Evita Sent: Wednesday, June 29, 2005 8:18 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] New Numbers My numbers are slightly down on my Nitrate and Nitrite. My Nitrate is down to around 20 from the 40 and the Nitrite appears to be almost at 0. It has been two weeks sense I added the fish. One died from what appears to be ick related. One is still acting effected but holding her own and two appear to be hopefully on the mend. Only three days of treating with water changes, salt and raised water temp at between 84- 86. Should I add an over the counter remedy in addition to the salt? Continue with the salt? Keep doing the water changes? Also how long should I keep the water temps up and when I lower them what would be the best temp. I had the tank at around 76 before they got sick. Thanks in advance. Evita Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12728	From: Evita	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: Introduction and new tank

Heather it all sounds exciting. I have a 29 gal as well and a 20 gal I set up for babies. Good thing too because the third day I got my platys we had babies. My babies are doing great. My adults in the 29 gal. didn't do as well. Two of the four died. I had ick and I accidentally bought a deformed fish. I have a deep red and black male left and the mom fish. I am still treating them with the salt till all the ick is gone. They look like they are going to make it. Funny thing it looks like they are already trying to make more babies. I am thinking at this rate I could go with a species tank instead of a community tank. I have plenty of babies now anyway. But my girls want variety and more colors. I am going to have to find friends that might want to start a tank to give some to at this rate. I wish my hubby was into the hobby so we could both share in this. He is only into his guitars. He isn't into animals and fish like I am. He thought I was wasting my money buying the 30 gal. I bought it used from a friend with all the stuff and extra pumps for only 30 bucks. I thought it was a steal. I couldn't pass it up. Now I am hooked. Can't wait to hear more about your set-up. I really enjoy reading your posts.Evita Heather Husvar <hhusvar@...> wrote: Thanks! Yes, I set up the tank for four days and then put in some feeders. They took care of business. I vacuumed the gravel and did a partial change and the tank is looking a lot better. Also, even though I didn't think I should, for the price I couldn't help myself. We just added 3 dwarf flame gouramis. As it turns out, they seem to be good for the tank. Everyone looks pretty happy now. Even the crayfish (no, I have not set up his own tank yet!) has decided that it's tired of being teased so much and the tablets are a much easier choice. Now if one is dropped in he runs for it, grabs it and tucks it away in his hidey hole. They're gone by the next morning. As for number of tanks, right now we just have the one. It's only a 29. In the past we've had up to 8 or 9 tanks plus some breeder tanks, but for a while I was moving a lot and I had to put the hobby aside. Now we have stability and plan to hang around for a while. We're ready to get going again. We are starting with this one and in a couple weeks we'll put another just like it on the other side. We have room for a 75 gallon and then a large one in the dining room. We haven't decided whether we're going to expand into the office or not. We'll see. :) Heather On 6/30/05, Evita <evitabug@...> wrote: > Hi, Heather, I am a new-bie to the fish thing so I really can't be to much help. I just wanted to welcome you and tell you I really enjoyed your story. You sound like you are really getting into it. I was wondering if you cycled your tank before you started. I forgot if you said how big this tank is. How many tanks do ya have? I think you are right about the cloudy water and the food thing. I would also say if you want to keep your fish alive this guy does need his own place. You know the old saying once they have tasted blood......Oh I got the Daryle thing....very funny. I look forward to reading more of your posts. It seems I have found someone else that can talk. Evita > > > > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Mail > Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > -- The rules of parents should be but three...Love, Limit, and Let them be. - Elaine M. Ward Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12729	From: Evita	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!

Thanks for the info Ray. I got my Kosher salt today. I guess you read in my other post I lost the deformed on. I guess it was for the best. The two I have left funny thing are the two prettiest ones. One is a male and one is the mom of the fry. They seemed to have paired up too. I kinda wonder if the male might be the daddy of the fry too. Wouldn't that be a fishy love story. Evita Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote: Evita, Yes Clout is a brand, but I would not recommend it for something as simple as getting rid of a few dots of Ich. By far, the safest way to get rid of Ich is to raise the temperature up to 86o for about 10 days (or for 3 days after no more Ich is seen), with the addition of Kosher salt -- from 1 tbs per 5 gallons up to one tsp per gallon; Platies, as with most liveberarers, can take salt. If you're in a hurry and prefer to use a medication, one of the safest meds is "Rid-Ich" brand (by Korden). Use with the addition of 1/8 tsp of Epson salts -- this will soften the cysts enabling the medication to work faster. Regards, ANYONE \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Evita <evitabug@y...> wrote: > Thanks Nicolas. Is Clout a brand? I would rather use something fast acting if it is safe. Evita They are better but the girls say they see a dot or two on one. I really want to knock this out for good. I have platy's by the way. Evita > > Nicolas Munro <nmunro@q...> wrote:Evita, > > Not sure if you have gotten over the whole Ick thing but i thought > Sandra's research was pretty cool. > Can't vouch if it works but last i heard it worked for her. > > > 21/June/05, Sandra wrote: > > hi Deborah, > > i just checked again on the medicines and it says the following: > > CLOUT: Not suitable for use in aquariums containing live rock or > invertebrates. Use cautiously with marine sharks and lion fish. > > COPPER-SAFE: Before use, remove invertebrates from tank. CopperSafe > may be harmful to plants and some snails. Remove invertebrates > without exoskeletons such as jellyfish, anemone etc. > > BUT, i did some research on the Internet and it says that CLOUT > cannot be used on scaleless fish, that it will most probably kill > them. Couldn't find nothing that said not to use CopperSafe with > them, but as you know its very slow in action. > > I hope you dont have another outbreak of ich and that your fish stay > healthy !!! > > sandra > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > Discover Yahoo! > Stay in touch with email, IM, photo sharing & more. Check it out! > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12730	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: some little questions

Heather, "Fresh Fish"? I haven't seen that one. I'm a semi-purist, but I do realize that some people have a certain affinity for things like the bubbling treasure chest, the diver, the skull, etc., especially the younger ones, and usually manage not to deride those who use such decoration in an aquarium. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Heather Husvar Sent: Friday, July 01, 2005 4:02 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] some little questions > Play it > safe and do not place objects in the aquarium that are made to be placed in > the aquarium, even if you need to go for the bubbling treasure chest and the > no fishing sign <g>. > Awww.. Steve, you make that sounds like a bad thing. My daughter picked the "fresh fish" sign. Heather Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12731	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk

San Francisco Shrimp Company sells a nifty brine hatchery that includes a black box for the saltwater and eggs. It has a hole on the top where you put another container, that has a small hole in the cap, in. You fill this container with fresh water. The fresh water stays on top, since the saltwater is heavier (according to the instructions). The brine shrimp will swim up through the hole in the cap and into the fresh water as they are attracted to the light. IT works great. SSC provides packets that contain the right amount of salt and eggs for each batch for this set up. You can also buy the packets separately. I also found a cool solution for a more sustained production of brine shrimp. Take a small aquarium (I used a 10 gal) and cover 1/2 of it with a dark, opaque material (I painted a box black and cut the cardboard to the size I needed to cover the the tank sides.)...or paint the glass black. Also make a solid divider (obviously this has to be made of plastic as it will be submerged) and partition off the tank in 2. This partition will also need a small hole to let the shrimp swim out (similar to the concept above). What this does is it keeps the eggs and the shrimp separate. What they also suggested is to take a bit of uplift tubing and run an airline (without an airistone) in it to create some surface turbulence and water flow. The reason they say not to use an airstone is that the shrimp have pockets that the tiny air bubbles can get trapped in, causing the shrimp to be stuck on the surface and starve. I haven't started this setup as I am letting the silicon caulking dry before I fill it up with water. I'll let you know how this works. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Friday, July 01, 2005 10:43 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk Yeah, I do remember "Sea Monkeys" -- what a gimmick. For those who were not already familiar with brine shrimp, not being in the tropical fish hobby, I'm sure they expected something entirely different especially going by the pictures they used to advertise with. Actually, hatching them isn't really that hard, if you want to try it. You can buy hatching cones made of thin plastic or you can use old gallon jars (preferably tilted off center) with an air stone at the bottom. Different sources of brine shrimp eggs require slightly different salt solutions, but in general you use about 6 tbp of Kosher salt per gallon and if you're tilting the jar as you should be doing, you'll be using about 3/4 gallon of water -- so you'll use 4 1/2 tbp of salt. Depending upon the temperature (should be about 80o), they'll hatch in about 24 - 30 hours, at which time you remove the airstone, let it sit a few minutes, and drain (with small plastic hose) the shrimp through a linen handkerchief using an empty gallon jar and returning that water when you're done. About 1/4 tsp of brine shrimp eggs should be enough for several feedings for your fry. I use 5 gallon carboys (twice a day) with about 3 tsps (or more) of eggs depending upon what I have going at the time. You should consider using at least two jars to rotate them every day so you constantly have a new batch. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Evita <evitabug@y...> wrote: > Thanks Ray I will check it out. Heh, remember Sea Monkeys or are you too young. I had to get some when I was a kid. They didn't turn out to look anything like the pictures. HA! Evita > > Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: Evita, Glad to hear your fry are thriving. Yeah, with the right > amount of finger pressure flake food can be pulverized almost to a > powder (at least very fine) and as you've found out is a good first > food for small fry if they take it. although maybe not quite as > nutritious as other options. With your feeding them 4-5 times a day, > it sounds like they're doing just fine. You might want to consider > hatching baby brine shrimp, at least for one or two of those daily > feedings as they may grow faster yet, even though powdered food is more > convenient -- and they will get better color. Ray > \ > > > > > --------------------------------- > Discover Yahoo! > Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news & more. Check it out! > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12732	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/1/2005
Subject: Re: New Numbers

Evita, Once your initial cycle has completed, you have an established tank. In practice, people refer to a tank as being established when they have fish in it after it has completed the initial cycle and has been running without problems for a time. Just to emphasize the importance of quarantine again, say you go out and by another four fish. You get them from the same store you purchased your initial stock from. Once they are in the tank, they are in a weakened state from the handling and transport through the system (farm to wholesaler to distributor to LFS, to your tank), though various water temperatures, and chemistries, perhaps having to deal with high levels of ammonia and a lack of proper nutrition (lack of food mainly). You place them in your tank, which you now believe to be stabilized, and wham, they get hit with some disease of parasite that has been carried along with them, or may actually exist in your tank. You are now stuck with having to identify the cause of their distress, and treating the whole tank again. However, if you have placed them in a smaller tank and they come down with something, you only need to treat the new fish, and not also the older fish, who now may still be weakened from the last treatment. Unfortunately, this places many on the road out of the hobby, as the fish are always sick and in need of treatment. When you follow a quarantine regimen, you will have a much better chance of success. Besides, how are you going to build up your stock of tanks without converting quarantine tanks into full time tanks <G>? \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evita Sent: Friday, July 01, 2005 9:33 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] New Numbers Steve, I didn't know I could have an established tank with only two fish in it. I thought I had to have more fish to consider it so. Evita Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote:Evita, Once you get over the ich hump here, you will have an established tank, hence the quarantine tank. You'll probably want a 5 gallon tank for a quarantine for your 30, but a 10 gallon tank is probably more cost efficient--you don't need to fill it all the way up. I guess I am just used to having tanks available, or being able to get one quickly, so I really don't think about it. Another thing is that I keep mostly single species tanks, so I actually don't do much in the way of quarantine anyhow, new fish go into an empty tank and stay there. If you get the tank and get it set up, you can get the new fish soon, and then they should be ready when the main tank is ready. (Actually, I am surprised we haven't heard from the dump 'em all in at once contingent, but that is probably just as well). I know you are impatient to get this thing going so you have something nice to look at with a bunch of fish and activity, but, one of the reasons many people keep fish is for relaxation, so relax <G>. Getting started on the right foot is most of the battle, and you'll be glad you did in the long run. To jump start a cycle in a quarantine tank, if you keep a sponge filter going in another tank, you'll have the bacteria you need to add to a quarantine tank at a moment's notice. Just move the sponge filter to the quarantine tank and add fish. A mini cycle may ensue, but that would be a lot easier on the fish than a full blown cycle. Right now, you could add the sponge filter to the fry tank to start it "ripening" and be ready when you need it. It will probably be a couple of weeks before it is truly ready, but you can probably give it a shot after a week, if need be. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evita Sent: Thursday, June 30, 2005 11:36 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] New Numbers Steve, Thanks for the info. I don't have a quarantine tank because I have just started out and I am trying to get my tank up. I do have a really small 2 gallon tank under the sink I could try and clean up but it wouldn't be cycled either. I think if I tried to keep fish in in for two weeks they might not make it anyway in that tank. My other tank has my fry in it. What is one to do when trying to get one tank up. Plus if I have to wait two weeks why couldn't I do the quarantine and the waiting at the same time. Other wise I would be looking at over 1 month just to add to fish to a tank that has only three fish in it. At this rate it could take 6 months to get my tank up. I don't want to be impatient. What size tank would make a good hospital or quarantine tank? How does one keep it cycled if you only use it when you buy fish or when a fish is sick? I hate to sound dumb but heck if the shoe fits.... when it comes to this I am. All that I have read in my books recommends quarantine when add new fish to a thriving established tank. I am just starting out. As far as what I want next I want some guppies I think. I know they like a little salt anyway. Thanks again for all your help. Evita Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: Evita, So long as your darling is not a part of a breeding program, assuming the defect is genetic, there is no harm in keeping her around. I think we have all done a similar deed at least once. Once your treatment is done, Wait at least two weeks to ensure your fish have, indeed, been cured. Then you can get a few more fish, and, of course, quarantine them for at least two weeks to ensure that they are healthy. If they are not, you'll need to treat them in the quarantine tank, and then go another two weeks prior to adding them to your main tank. Once the fish seem to be cured, the salt will be removed by your normal water changes. So long as you are not considering any salt intolerant fish, and I don't think you are, the salt in the main tank would be fine. Most salt intolerant fish are from areas of very soft, acid water. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evita Sent: Thursday, June 30, 2005 9:05 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] New Numbers Steve, First of all thanks for all your help and patience with all my dumb questions. I got up this morning fully expecting for my fish to be dead. (See when we got them my three girls and I all picked one fish. Like usual I pick the smallest one). Anyway from the start this fish seems to be the weakest one. She does well at times swimming all over the place then I will look in the tank for her and she is gone. The other two who came through this much better are swimming together all over the place. Then I find her in the left top corner at the top of the water so still I think she is dead. I tap the glass a few times and then she swims. This morning I get up and she is at the bottom of the tank with the others looking like there is nothing wrong with her. Oh also I have to add. Right after we got them home we noticed that she is deformed. It doesn't effect her except she looks odd. I know I should according to the fish books kill her but I just don't have the heart to do it. It is an oddity in the shape of her head....their is a dip the head to the body. You would have to see it. It makes her head look smaller around the neck. Anyway I am thinking this deformity has also made her weaker. That is also why I thought she might die. I thought if she lives then she was meant to. So far so good. Please don't tell me I am wrong in this. After all she has been though I just can't kill her now. Not my thing. Steve about the adding of salt treatment. If I do no water changes when I add the salt won't my water get too salty? After the treatment is over and all is well then I would think it would be safe as well a cycled to add more fish? Or should I wait a few water changes to bring down the salt content of the water first? Oh, I saw two more babies in the adult tank. They seem to be growing and tolerating the treatments of salt. I was really surprised they were alive due to the ick and or being eaten. Also my nursery tank the baby fry are thriving. No signs of loosing any or illness there. On a side note. I get my pet food, mainly bird and cat food, at Walmart. That is where I got my platys by the way. We went last night. All their tanks show various signs of illness. They keep putting more fish in the tanks every Tue. So the ones they sell could be infected and the ones they don't usually die. I think they should stop selling fish. Just my opinion. No one really care for them besides scooping up the dead fish every now and then. One fish even had an eye that was totally blinded and sticking out. It was sad. I used their tanks to show my kids signs of illness fish can get, what to look for and what happens to them. Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: Evita, You'll need to continue the treatment for 10-14 days or at least three days after all the symptoms have gone. You can stop changing the water. The idea was to do an immediate water change to help the fish with some freshwater, then to maintain your normal schedule, unless there is an indication that the water should be changed sooner. Once the treatment period has ended, bring the water temperature down gradually, to where it was before. When the indicator light comes on in the heater, simply turn the heater down until the light goes off, then do the same the next day, and the next, until the temperature is normal for your tank. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Jade Evita Sent: Wednesday, June 29, 2005 8:18 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] New Numbers My numbers are slightly down on my Nitrate and Nitrite. My Nitrate is down to around 20 from the 40 and the Nitrite appears to be almost at 0. It has been two weeks sense I added the fish. One died from what appears to be ick related. One is still acting effected but holding her own and two appear to be hopefully on the mend. Only three days of treating with water changes, salt and raised water temp at between 84- 86. Should I add an over the counter remedy in addition to the salt? Continue with the salt? Keep doing the water changes? Also how long should I keep the water temps up and when I lower them what would be the best temp. I had the tank at around 76 before they got sick. Thanks in advance. Evita

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12733	From: paul helms	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk

they also sell a kit for 20 dollars taht hangs off the back of the tank, using your tank water and teh shrimpo swim into the tank as they hatch. the eggs are sold in glass jars also by sf brine shrimp. they hatch in 24-48 hours and swim in as a steady source of food --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > San Francisco Shrimp Company sells a nifty brine > hatchery that includes a > black box for the saltwater and eggs. It has a hole > on the top where you > put another container, that has a small hole in the > cap, in. You fill this > container with fresh water. The fresh water stays > on top, since the > saltwater is heavier (according to the > instructions). The brine shrimp will > swim up through the hole in the cap and into the > fresh water as they are > attracted to the light. IT works great. SSC > provides packets that contain > the right amount of salt and eggs for each batch for > this set up. You can > also buy the packets separately. > > I also found a cool solution for a more sustained > production of brine > shrimp. Take a small aquarium (I used a 10 gal) and > cover 1/2 of it with a > dark, opaque material (I painted a box black and cut > the cardboard to the > size I needed to cover the the tank sides.)...or > paint the glass black. > Also make a solid divider (obviously this has to be > made of plastic as it > will be submerged) and partition off the tank in 2. > This partition will > also need a small hole to let the shrimp swim out > (similar to the concept > above). What this does is it keeps the eggs and the > shrimp separate. What > they also suggested is to take a bit of uplift > tubing and run an airline > (without an airistone) in it to create some surface > turbulence and water > flow. The reason they say not to use an airstone is > that the shrimp have > pockets that the tiny air bubbles can get trapped > in, causing the shrimp to > be stuck on the surface and starve. I haven't > started this setup as I am > letting the silicon caulking dry before I fill it up > with water. I'll let > you know how this works. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Friday, July 01, 2005 10:43 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg > Yolk > > > Yeah, I do remember "Sea Monkeys" -- what a gimmick. > For those who > were not already familiar with brine shrimp, not > being in the > tropical fish hobby, I'm sure they expected > something entirely > different especially going by the pictures they used > to advertise > with. Actually, hatching them isn't really that > hard, if you want to > try it. You can buy hatching cones made of thin > plastic or you can > use old gallon jars (preferably tilted off center) > with an air stone > at the bottom. Different sources of brine shrimp > eggs require > slightly different salt solutions, but in general > you use about 6 tbp > of Kosher salt per gallon and if you're tilting the > jar as you should > be doing, you'll be using about 3/4 gallon of water > -- so you'll use > 4 1/2 tbp of salt. Depending upon the temperature > (should be about > 80o), they'll hatch in about 24 - 30 hours, at which > time you remove > the airstone, let it sit a few minutes, and drain > (with small plastic > hose) the shrimp through a linen handkerchief using > an empty gallon > jar and returning that water when you're done. > About 1/4 tsp of > brine shrimp eggs should be enough for several > feedings for your > fry. I use 5 gallon carboys (twice a day) with > about 3 tsps (or > more) of eggs depending upon what I have going at > the time. You > should consider using at least two jars to rotate > them every day so > you constantly have a new batch. Ray > > \ > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Evita > <evitabug@y...> wrote: > > Thanks Ray I will check it out. Heh, remember Sea > Monkeys or are > you too young. I had to get some when I was a kid. > They didn't turn > out to look anything like the pictures. HA! Evita > > > > Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: Evita, > Glad to hear your > fry are thriving. Yeah, with the right > > amount of finger pressure flake food can be > pulverized almost to a > > powder (at least very fine) and as you've found > out is a good first > > food for small fry if they take it. although maybe > not quite as > > nutritious as other options. With your feeding > them 4-5 times a > day, > > it sounds like they're doing just fine. You might > want to consider > > hatching baby brine shrimp, at least for one or > two of those daily > > feedings as they may grow faster yet, even though > powdered food is > more > > convenient -- and they will get better color. > Ray > > > \ > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > Discover Yahoo! > > Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news & > more. Check it > out! > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when > replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text > that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original > message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the > web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12734	From: paul helms	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

they are not actually hermaphrodites as they do not posses both male and female genitalia at the same time and are not sterile. they are all born male and one will grow larger and become the female. just a note. percs also get along quite well in groups as long as the numbers are even so that they can pair off if they feel like it. oscelarous are the same as far as behavior btw. --- kritter714@... wrote: > Whoever posted about getting the clowns for this > tank just an FYI 4 clowns > purchased as juveniles which is what I usually would > give you a dominant > female, a less dominant male and 2 "neuter" > individuals they are hermaphrodites and > would change sex to meet the situation. I would say > a 35 gallon tank would > be a good tank for 2 clowns another 2 in that small > of a tank would likely be > harassed > > Elaine in the emerald city > 125 gallon marine, > 90 gallon discus > 80 gallon south american cichlid > 55 gallon african cichlid > 50 gallon temperate water tank > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12735	From: paul helms	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

you need to get your facts straight before posting something like that. 1. fire fish are NOt poisonous. 2. they only grow to about 3 inches and are very skinny. 3. are not difficult to feed. 4. have a mouth so small that they could not eat another fish! they are big around as a sharpie at the most. know what you are talking about before you post!!!!!! --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@...> wrote: > > Sorry, just my opinion: > I wouldnt recommend buying a firefish for such a > small system. Those > fishes can grow very large and may not even be able > to "turn around" > in a 30 something gallon aquarium. Besides that will > eat anything > that fits in their mouth, have a huge amount of > bioload (will > contamine the water very fast unless she does water > changes VERY > often and has a very potent skimmer) and other than > that, getting > this fish to eat can be more difficult than raising > a child.. oh > yeah, and are venemous... great fish and very hardy > but i wouldnt > say it´s for beginners with a small tank. > > sandra > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Valeen Gonzalez > <valeendgonzalez@y...> wrote: > > i think a lot of gobies aren't that aggressive > towards other > species of fish, but may be > > aggressive towards others of their own species. so > if your friend > gets 1 goby it should be fine. > > that is, unless she happens to get another species > of fish that is > aggressive and/or predatorial > > towards other species like some triggers are > (maybe most triggers > lol). > > > > if she sticks with gobies like a watchman or a > neon as rob > suggested, and got only other > > non-aggressive fish like false percs or firefish, > she should be ok. > > > > --- agentscullyeyore@a... wrote: > > > > > > > > thanks i went to google and found them are all > gobies non > aggressive or just > > > that kind.. Shannon > > > > > > general names ===== false percula clowns - > looks like nemo > > > and neon gobies. > > > > > > rob > > > > > > In a message dated 7/1/2005 10:29:55 AM US > Eastern Standard > Time, > > > agentscullyeyore@a... writes: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks robbie.. i told her that it was small > but unlike > others she really > > > > > > > isn't listening to me... and what i the > general name for > those fish do you > > > > > > > know... Shannon: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > > I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > ____________________________________________________ Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12736	From: paul helms	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

if you need recomendations let me know....i am currently running a 7 gallon bowfront saltwater tank tank and a 140 gallon reef witha 40 gallon sump and a 40 gallon refugium. (i have fresh too) paul --- Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote: > i would say false percula clowns (amphiprion > ocellaris), firefish, some of the gobies. tell her > to > check out this link: > http://www.liveaquaria.com/product/scateg.cfm?pCatId=2124 > this might give her > a good idea. > > -valeen > > --- agentscullyeyore@... wrote: > > > question my friend is setting up a hex 35 gallon > saltwater aquarium... she > > would like to know what kind of fish would be a > good hardy choice for that size > > and her being new to saltwater.. thanks Shannon > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12737	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!

Yes, I read that the precious one did not make it and would have to say the same thing -- perhaps it was for the best. Sorry to hear this. Seems, unfortunately, that it was a struggle for her to keep alive up to this point, as it was. Looks like she held out as long as she could but just couldn't function properly with her conditions against her. The male being black and red sounds nicely colorful. Unless I missed it somewhere, I don't recall your saying what color the mom is (same color?). I guess there's always the possibility of the male being the daddy of the fry, but part of those odds would at least depend on how many males were in the tank at the store. By the way, if you'd like to increase the color intensity of red in the fry, you might want to consider adding paprika to their food. You would need to pulverize, say, a week's supply of the flake food you're now feeding them (instead of feeding to feeding) and add up to 10% of that amount of food, of paprika. This is only one way of intensifying fish's color, but as long as you're feeding them powdered food right now . . . Regards, Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Evita <evitabug@y...> wrote: > Thanks for the info Ray. I got my Kosher salt today. I guess you read in my other post I lost the deformed on. I guess it was for the best. The two I have left funny thing are the two prettiest ones. One is a male and one is the mom of the fry. They seemed to have paired up too. I kinda wonder if the male might be the daddy of the fry too. Wouldn't that be a fishy love story. Evita > > Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: Evita, Yes Clout is a brand, but I would not recommend it for > something as simple as getting rid of a few dots of Ich. By far, the > safest way to get rid of Ich is to raise the temperature up to 86o > for about 10 days (or for 3 days after no more Ich is seen), with the > addition of Kosher salt -- from 1 tbs per 5 gallons up to one tsp per > gallon; Platies, as with most liveberarers, can take salt. If you're > in a hurry and prefer to use a medication, one of the safest meds > is "Rid-Ich" brand (by Korden). Use with the addition of 1/8 tsp of > Epson salts -- this will soften the cysts enabling the medication to > work faster. Regards, ANYONE > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Evita <evitabug@y...> wrote: > > Thanks Nicolas. Is Clout a brand? I would rather use something fast > acting if it is safe. Evita They are better but the girls say they > see a dot or two on one. I really want to knock this out for good. I > have platy's by the way. Evita > > > > Nicolas Munro <nmunro@q...> wrote:Evita, > > > > Not sure if you have gotten over the whole Ick thing but i thought > > Sandra's research was pretty cool. > > Can't vouch if it works but last i heard it worked for her. > > > > > > 21/June/05, Sandra wrote: > > > > hi Deborah, > > > > i just checked again on the medicines and it says the following: > > > > CLOUT: Not suitable for use in aquariums containing live rock or > > invertebrates. Use cautiously with marine sharks and lion fish. > > > > COPPER-SAFE: Before use, remove invertebrates from tank. CopperSafe > > may be harmful to plants and some snails. Remove invertebrates > > without exoskeletons such as jellyfish, anemone etc. > > > > BUT, i did some research on the Internet and it says that CLOUT > > cannot be used on scaleless fish, that it will most probably kill > > them. Couldn't find nothing that said not to use CopperSafe with > > them, but as you know its very slow in action. > > > > I hope you dont have another outbreak of ich and that your fish > stay > > healthy !!! > > > > sandra > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > Discover Yahoo! > > Stay in touch with email, IM, photo sharing & more. Check it out! > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12738	From: Evita	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: Steve Help!!!!! OR ANYONE!

Ray, My mom fish is deep rich gold fish orange yellow and my male is almost a red color with black tail fin and what looks like he put on black lip-stick. My fry at this point some are more white in color and others are starting to darken and take on a bit of orangy color. I wonder if the light ones will be more like mom and the darker ones more like the male. In that particular batch of fish were all these two color types. So this may be the fact even if my male isn't the father the father may have been colored like him. On the other hand the fry might end up a plainer color and an orange like the mom. I have not raised fry before so it will be like Christmas waiting to see what colors they will take on as adults. I have seen platys on the plainer no color side and there might be some of those colors back in the parents gene pool. I have never heard of the adding paprika. I might try that. Evita Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote: Yes, I read that the precious one did not make it and would have to say the same thing -- perhaps it was for the best. Sorry to hear this. Seems, unfortunately, that it was a struggle for her to keep alive up to this point, as it was. Looks like she held out as long as she could but just couldn't function properly with her conditions against her. The male being black and red sounds nicely colorful. Unless I missed it somewhere, I don't recall your saying what color the mom is (same color?). I guess there's always the possibility of the male being the daddy of the fry, but part of those odds would at least depend on how many males were in the tank at the store. By the way, if you'd like to increase the color intensity of red in the fry, you might want to consider adding paprika to their food. You would need to pulverize, say, a week's supply of the flake food you're now feeding them (instead of feeding to feeding) and add up to 10% of that amount of food, of paprika. This is only one way of intensifying fish's color, but as long as you're feeding them powdered food right now . . . Regards, Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Evita <evitabug@y...> wrote: > Thanks for the info Ray. I got my Kosher salt today. I guess you read in my other post I lost the deformed on. I guess it was for the best. The two I have left funny thing are the two prettiest ones. One is a male and one is the mom of the fry. They seemed to have paired up too. I kinda wonder if the male might be the daddy of the fry too. Wouldn't that be a fishy love story. Evita > > Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: Evita, Yes Clout is a brand, but I would not recommend it for > something as simple as getting rid of a few dots of Ich. By far, the > safest way to get rid of Ich is to raise the temperature up to 86o > for about 10 days (or for 3 days after no more Ich is seen), with the > addition of Kosher salt -- from 1 tbs per 5 gallons up to one tsp per > gallon; Platies, as with most liveberarers, can take salt. If you're > in a hurry and prefer to use a medication, one of the safest meds > is "Rid-Ich" brand (by Korden). Use with the addition of 1/8 tsp of > Epson salts -- this will soften the cysts enabling the medication to > work faster. Regards, ANYONE > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Evita <evitabug@y...> wrote: > > Thanks Nicolas. Is Clout a brand? I would rather use something fast > acting if it is safe. Evita They are better but the girls say they > see a dot or two on one. I really want to knock this out for good. I > have platy's by the way. Evita > > > > Nicolas Munro <nmunro@q...> wrote:Evita, > > > > Not sure if you have gotten over the whole Ick thing but i thought > > Sandra's research was pretty cool. > > Can't vouch if it works but last i heard it worked for her. > > > > > > 21/June/05, Sandra wrote: > > > > hi Deborah, > > > > i just checked again on the medicines and it says the following: > > > > CLOUT: Not suitable for use in aquariums containing live rock or > > invertebrates. Use cautiously with marine sharks and lion fish. > > > > COPPER-SAFE: Before use, remove invertebrates from tank. CopperSafe > > may be harmful to plants and some snails. Remove invertebrates > > without exoskeletons such as jellyfish, anemone etc. > > > > BUT, i did some research on the Internet and it says that CLOUT > > cannot be used on scaleless fish, that it will most probably kill > > them. Couldn't find nothing that said not to use CopperSafe with > > them, but as you know its very slow in action. > > > > I hope you dont have another outbreak of ich and that your fish > stay > > healthy !!! > > > > sandra > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > Discover Yahoo! > > Stay in touch with email, IM, photo sharing & more. Check it out! > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter SPONSORED LINKS Saltwater aquarium Marine biologist Reef tank --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12739	From: kb1dva	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: some little questions

I'm not that bad, I just have a little ceramic turtle I thought would be cute since a real one isn't a good idea Emily _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: Friday, July 01, 2005 11:08 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] some little questions Heather, "Fresh Fish"? I haven't seen that one. I'm a semi-purist, but I do realize that some people have a certain affinity for things like the bubbling treasure chest, the diver, the skull, etc., especially the younger ones, and usually manage not to deride those who use such decoration in an aquarium. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Heather Husvar Sent: Friday, July 01, 2005 4:02 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] some little questions > Play it > safe and do not place objects in the aquarium that are made to be placed in > the aquarium, even if you need to go for the bubbling treasure chest and the > no fishing sign <g>. > Awww.. Steve, you make that sounds like a bad thing. My daughter picked the "fresh fish" sign. Heather Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12740	From: Sandra	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

Firefish - aka Lionfish or Scorpionfish, if by firefish she meant another kind of fish then it was a misunderstanding - and i very much do know what i am talking about before posting - maybe you should get your facts straight and practise on how to talk to another person. sandra --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms <wtfmorlok@y...> wrote: > you need to get your facts straight before posting > something like that. > 1. fire fish are NOt poisonous. > 2. they only grow to about 3 inches and are very > skinny. > 3. are not difficult to feed. > 4. have a mouth so small that they could not eat > another fish! they are big around as a sharpie at the > most. > know what you are talking about before you post!!!!!! > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > Sorry, just my opinion: > > I wouldnt recommend buying a firefish for such a > > small system. Those > > fishes can grow very large and may not even be able > > to "turn around" > > in a 30 something gallon aquarium. Besides that will > > eat anything > > that fits in their mouth, have a huge amount of > > bioload (will > > contamine the water very fast unless she does water > > changes VERY > > often and has a very potent skimmer) and other than > > that, getting > > this fish to eat can be more difficult than raising > > a child.. oh > > yeah, and are venemous... great fish and very hardy > > but i wouldnt > > say it´s for beginners with a small tank. > > > > sandra > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Valeen Gonzalez > > <valeendgonzalez@y...> wrote: > > > i think a lot of gobies aren't that aggressive > > towards other > > species of fish, but may be > > > aggressive towards others of their own species. so > > if your friend > > gets 1 goby it should be fine. > > > that is, unless she happens to get another species > > of fish that is > > aggressive and/or predatorial > > > towards other species like some triggers are > > (maybe most triggers > > lol). > > > > > > if she sticks with gobies like a watchman or a > > neon as rob > > suggested, and got only other > > > non-aggressive fish like false percs or firefish, > > she should be ok. > > > > > > --- agentscullyeyore@a... wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > thanks i went to google and found them are all > > gobies non > > aggressive or just > > > > that kind.. Shannon > > > > > > > > general names ===== false percula clowns - > > looks like nemo > > > > and neon gobies. > > > > > > > > rob > > > > > > > > In a message dated 7/1/2005 10:29:55 AM US > > Eastern Standard > > Time, > > > > agentscullyeyore@a... writes: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks robbie.. i told her that it was small > > but unlike > > others she really > > > > > > > > > isn't listening to me... and what i the > > general name for > > those fish do you > > > > > > > > > know... Shannon: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > > > I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > Yahoo! Sports > Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football > http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12741	From: paul helms	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

firefish are not aka lionfish or scorpionfish. a lionfish is a lionfish ....try looking it up! The Firefish, a.k.a. Dartfish, is a magnificent little fish that's perfect for reef tanks. These fish have a white forebody and a "fiery" rearbody that is colored in a mix of red colors. The Firefish also has an elongated first dorsal spine that "jumps" up and down. These little fish have lots of personality and should be kept in a tank with lots of rockwork. The Firefish likes lots of crevices, caves, and overhangs where they can "hang" in place. These fish prefer to be kept in pairs and do well in the home aquarium. They are great for reef tanks and will accept most fish foods.These fish are also jumpers, so precautions should be taken to secure openings at the top of the aquarium The family of Lionfish is a group of fish that are world renowned for their beauty and ability to inflict pain. These fish have large flowing dorsal and pectoral fins that are occassionly webbed at the base. The poison these fish can inflict is shot out through their venomous spines from the glands in the long grooves of their fins. Lionfish like an area where they can hang out like a crevice or cave. These fish are nocturnal and prefer to hunt during nightime. Venomous: By purchasing this item you are aware that it is poisonous and deadly very very different. --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@...> wrote: > Firefish - aka Lionfish or Scorpionfish, if by > firefish she meant > another kind of fish then it was a misunderstanding > - and i very > much do know what i am talking about before posting > - maybe you > should get your facts straight and practise on how > to talk to > another person. > > sandra > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > <wtfmorlok@y...> > wrote: > > you need to get your facts straight before posting > > something like that. > > 1. fire fish are NOt poisonous. > > 2. they only grow to about 3 inches and are very > > skinny. > > 3. are not difficult to feed. > > 4. have a mouth so small that they could not eat > > another fish! they are big around as a sharpie at > the > > most. > > know what you are talking about before you > post!!!!!! > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > Sorry, just my opinion: > > > I wouldnt recommend buying a firefish for such a > > > small system. Those > > > fishes can grow very large and may not even be > able > > > to "turn around" > > > in a 30 something gallon aquarium. Besides that > will > > > eat anything > > > that fits in their mouth, have a huge amount of > > > bioload (will > > > contamine the water very fast unless she does > water > > > changes VERY > > > often and has a very potent skimmer) and other > than > > > that, getting > > > this fish to eat can be more difficult than > raising > > > a child.. oh > > > yeah, and are venemous... great fish and very > hardy > > > but i wouldnt > > > say it´s for beginners with a small tank. > > > > > > sandra > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Valeen > Gonzalez > > > <valeendgonzalez@y...> wrote: > > > > i think a lot of gobies aren't that aggressive > > > towards other > > > species of fish, but may be > > > > aggressive towards others of their own > species. so > > > if your friend > > > gets 1 goby it should be fine. > > > > that is, unless she happens to get another > species > > > of fish that is > > > aggressive and/or predatorial > > > > towards other species like some triggers are > > > (maybe most triggers > > > lol). > > > > > > > > if she sticks with gobies like a watchman or a > > > neon as rob > > > suggested, and got only other > > > > non-aggressive fish like false percs or > firefish, > > > she should be ok. > > > > > > > > --- agentscullyeyore@a... wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks i went to google and found them are > all > > > gobies non > > > aggressive or just > > > > > that kind.. Shannon > > > > > > > > > > general names ===== false percula clowns - > > > looks like nemo > > > > > and neon gobies. > > > > > > > > > > rob > > > > > > > > > > In a message dated 7/1/2005 10:29:55 AM US > > > Eastern Standard > > > Time, > > > > > agentscullyeyore@a... writes: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks robbie.. i told her that it was > small > > > but unlike > > > others she really > > > > > > > > > > > isn't listening to me... and what i the > > > general name for > > > those fish do you > > > > > > > > > > > know... Shannon: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > > > > I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > > > Yahoo! Sports > > Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy > Football > > http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com > > > __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour: http://tour.mail.yahoo.com/mailtour.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12742	From: paul helms	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk

i didn't say anything about buying water...i was just metioning that there is another setup available cheap. the one with the air pump and soda bottle works great. the salt and eggs are in the pouch, so all you need is distilled water and your airpump. the base screws onto an inverted 2 liter soda bottle. --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote: > Paul, Depending upon the size of the fry, sometimes > they are just > too small when they are first free-swimming, to be > able to handle > newly hatched brine shrimp so something smaller has > to be offered > (such as strained egg yolk) for the first few days > or up until the > first week. Yes, if overfed egg yolk can make the > water cloudy; I've > cautioned about this in a previous recent post. > There are also times > when infusoria (or some similarly sized substitute) > must be used as a > first fry food, again as they may not be able to > handle anything > larger. As soon as bbs (baby brine shrimp) can be > fed to the fry, > it's an excellent food but needs to be hatched daily > for best > nutritional results. Therefore, its probably more > convenient (and > cheaper) to buy a box of Diamond Crystal Kosher salt > to mix into > solution at home for hatching bbs rather than buying > marine water > from a store. In that way you can mix a fresh new > solution of salt > water daily, as needed. Ray > > \ > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Paul N. Chung" > <p_n_chung@y...> > wrote: > > Hey, > > > > Instead of choosing egg yolks, which can make your > water cloudy. > Why don't you try hatching Brine Shrimp? > > > > To make it hatch faster, buy from your local fish > store, a liter or > 4 liters of marine water, and have those brine > shrimps "hatched." > > > > Brine shrimp is a good food for your fries ( baby > fish ). Well, at > least, smells better than having infusoria or > microworms. > > > > > > > > > > Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > If you mean, do fry eat strained hard-boiled egg > yolk and that it > > puts growth on them, then the answer is yes it > "works"! You might > > consider it the same only in as much as it is a > "high protein fish > > food". If you're looking for a comparison to some > of the powdered > > fry foods which have a high protein content these > are good but > > depending upon fry species, egg yolk is generally > eaten more > > readily. It is also digested and assimilated more > easily and has a > > much higher protein content (57%) not to mention > the whole host of > > readily available fresh vitamins (A, B6, B12, C, > D, E, etc.) and > > minerals (calcium, iron, magnesium, etc.), > promoting much faster > > growth. In general, vitamins in flake and/or > powdered fish food is > > generally lost with two months of its manufacture. > Additionally, > egg > > yolk enables infusoria growth in the aquarium. > The commercially > > available product "Liquifry" is about as close as > you can get as > far > > as an over-the-counter food. > Ray > > > \ > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Nicolas Munro > <nmunro@q...> > wrote: > > > Do the egg yolks really work??? > > > > > > Isn't that the same as feeding them a high > protein fish food? ie > > 43% or > > > more. > > > > > > > > > =Nick > > > > > > > > > Cynthia brennemann wrote: > > > > > > >The water and air are at 80 degrees, the lid is > down so there is > > plenty > > > >of humidity. So in two days start giving them > their infusoria > and > > egg > > > >yolk? Is that about the time the male betta > will just give up > and > > stop > > > >taking care of them, too? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respectfully Yours, > > > > Paul N. Chung > > http://www.geocities.com/p_n_chung/index.html > > > > http://www.geocities.com/filipinofish/index.html > > > > http://filipinofish.tripod.com/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > protection around > > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > ____________________________________________________ Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12743	From: paul helms	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

live rock is always a healthier way to go as most rock sold in stores such as lava and bowl is not from the ocean and can have insectcides, pesticdes, mercury, etc on them. not to mention the mineral composition may not be compatible. if you buy cured rock there is loittle to no worry about hitchhikers, if you buy straight out of the box there is. paul --- FortWayneFish@... wrote: > Sharron, > > My opinion :-) > > a 35 Hex is a lot smaller then you think. Try 4 or 5 > of these.. They are > great little guys very entertaining and very hardy > for a Salt water fish. > > (4) Amphiprion ocellaris approx price ( $15 each > ) 2males and 2females if > you can > (2)Elacatinus oceanops approx price ( $12 each ) > mated pair preferably > > and choose a nice piece of rock not live rock to go > into the tank. Use live > sand not live rock because you NEVER know what is > going to hitch hike in on > live rock... > > Stay away from Damsels, as they stay small but are > very > aggressive,territorial, and well they are not very > nice.. They are cheap though.. > > > In a message dated 6/30/2005 9:22:57 PM US Eastern > Standard Time, > agentscullyeyore@... writes: > > > > question my friend is setting up a hex 35 gallon > saltwater aquarium... she > > > > would like to know what kind of fish would be a > good hardy choice for that > > size > > and her being new to saltwater.. thanks Shannon > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ____________________________________________________ Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12744	From: Sandra	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

you can also look it up, anywhere you look for a firefish there will show up two species - the dartfish, and the lionfish which some people call firefishes. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms <wtfmorlok@y...> wrote: > firefish are not aka lionfish or scorpionfish. a > lionfish is a lionfish ....try looking it up! > > The Firefish, a.k.a. Dartfish, is a magnificent little > fish that's perfect for reef tanks. These fish have a > white forebody and a "fiery" rearbody that is colored > in a mix of red colors. The Firefish also has an > elongated first dorsal spine that "jumps" up and down. > These little fish have lots of personality and should > be kept in a tank with lots of rockwork. The Firefish > likes lots of crevices, caves, and overhangs where > they can "hang" in place. These fish prefer to be kept > in pairs and do well in the home aquarium. They are > great for reef tanks and will accept most fish > foods.These fish are also jumpers, so precautions > should be taken to secure openings at the top of the > aquarium > > The family of Lionfish is a group of fish that are > world renowned for their beauty and ability to inflict > pain. These fish have large flowing dorsal and > pectoral fins that are occassionly webbed at the base. > The poison these fish can inflict is shot out through > their venomous spines from the glands in the long > grooves of their fins. Lionfish like an area where > they can hang out like a crevice or cave. These fish > are nocturnal and prefer to hunt during nightime. > > Venomous: By purchasing this item you are aware that > it is poisonous and deadly > > very very different. > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > Firefish - aka Lionfish or Scorpionfish, if by > > firefish she meant > > another kind of fish then it was a misunderstanding > > - and i very > > much do know what i am talking about before posting > > - maybe you > > should get your facts straight and practise on how > > to talk to > > another person. > > > > sandra > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > wrote: > > > you need to get your facts straight before posting > > > something like that. > > > 1. fire fish are NOt poisonous. > > > 2. they only grow to about 3 inches and are very > > > skinny. > > > 3. are not difficult to feed. > > > 4. have a mouth so small that they could not eat > > > another fish! they are big around as a sharpie at > > the > > > most. > > > know what you are talking about before you > > post!!!!!! > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Sorry, just my opinion: > > > > I wouldnt recommend buying a firefish for such a > > > > small system. Those > > > > fishes can grow very large and may not even be > > able > > > > to "turn around" > > > > in a 30 something gallon aquarium. Besides that > > will > > > > eat anything > > > > that fits in their mouth, have a huge amount of > > > > bioload (will > > > > contamine the water very fast unless she does > > water > > > > changes VERY > > > > often and has a very potent skimmer) and other > > than > > > > that, getting > > > > this fish to eat can be more difficult than > > raising > > > > a child.. oh > > > > yeah, and are venemous... great fish and very > > hardy > > > > but i wouldnt > > > > say it´s for beginners with a small tank. > > > > > > > > sandra > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Valeen > > Gonzalez > > > > <valeendgonzalez@y...> wrote: > > > > > i think a lot of gobies aren't that aggressive > > > > towards other > > > > species of fish, but may be > > > > > aggressive towards others of their own > > species. so > > > > if your friend > > > > gets 1 goby it should be fine. > > > > > that is, unless she happens to get another > > species > > > > of fish that is > > > > aggressive and/or predatorial > > > > > towards other species like some triggers are > > > > (maybe most triggers > > > > lol). > > > > > > > > > > if she sticks with gobies like a watchman or a > > > > neon as rob > > > > suggested, and got only other > > > > > non-aggressive fish like false percs or > > firefish, > > > > she should be ok. > > > > > > > > > > --- agentscullyeyore@a... wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks i went to google and found them are > > all > > > > gobies non > > > > aggressive or just > > > > > > that kind.. Shannon > > > > > > > > > > > > general names ===== false percula clowns - > > > > looks like nemo > > > > > > and neon gobies. > > > > > > > > > > > > rob > > > > > > > > > > > > In a message dated 7/1/2005 10:29:55 AM US > > > > Eastern Standard > > > > Time, > > > > > > agentscullyeyore@a... writes: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks robbie.. i told her that it was > > small > > > > but unlike > > > > others she really > > > > > > > > > > > > > isn't listening to me... and what i the > > > > general name for > > > > those fish do you > > > > > > > > > > > > > know... Shannon: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > > > > > I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > > > > > Yahoo! Sports > > > Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy > > Football > > > http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > Yahoo! Mail > Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour: > http://tour.mail.yahoo.com/mailtour.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12745	From: luke / lemanja Davidson	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: how do I get off the mailing list (anybody)

I need somebody to tell me how to get off the mailing list? thanks luke --------------------------------- Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12746	From: Julie	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: how do I get off the mailing list (anybody)

copied directly from the bottom of the email a.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com a.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- julie Cheyenne, Wyoming I am not a complete idiot. Some parts are missing. ----- Original Message ----- From: luke / lemanja Davidson To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, July 02, 2005 5:30 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] how do I get off the mailing list (anybody) I need somebody to tell me how to get off the mailing list? thanks luke --------------------------------- Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12747	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: new tank cycling

With a 150 gallon tank, 6 glow light tetras and two cory cats, how long will it take to see an ammonia spike? When I started the tank on Wednesday, I added two cups of gravel from my 10 gallon tank and I also pulled the filter pad out of the whisper power filter in the 10 gallon. As of today, the ammonia is still at zero as is the nitrites. Do I need to add more fish? Or just be patient and wait. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12748	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

Hi Sandra, The name Firefish refers to Nemateleotris magnifica also known as Fire Dartfish a small Gobie type fish, the other fish you are calling a firefish is a Pterois Volitans (a large venomous fish up to 38cm) normally called a Lionfish or Scorpionfish or Dragon fish occasionally Turkey fish or Red Firefish. If you have followed this thread from the beginning you would know the tank in question is a small tank that could not acomodate a Pterois Volitans so I fail to see the point of your argument which is not strictly correct anyway as I have pointed out. regards, unclenorm. --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@...> wrote: > you can also look it up, anywhere you look for a > firefish there will > show up two species - the dartfish, and the lionfish > which some > people call firefishes. > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > <wtfmorlok@y...> > wrote: > > firefish are not aka lionfish or scorpionfish. a > > lionfish is a lionfish ....try looking it up! > > > > The Firefish, a.k.a. Dartfish, is a magnificent > little > > fish that's perfect for reef tanks. These fish > have a > > white forebody and a "fiery" rearbody that is > colored > > in a mix of red colors. The Firefish also has an > > elongated first dorsal spine that "jumps" up and > down. > > These little fish have lots of personality and > should > > be kept in a tank with lots of rockwork. The > Firefish > > likes lots of crevices, caves, and overhangs where > > they can "hang" in place. These fish prefer to be > kept > > in pairs and do well in the home aquarium. They > are > > great for reef tanks and will accept most fish > > foods.These fish are also jumpers, so precautions > > should be taken to secure openings at the top of > the > > aquarium > > > > The family of Lionfish is a group of fish that are > > world renowned for their beauty and ability to > inflict > > pain. These fish have large flowing dorsal and > > pectoral fins that are occassionly webbed at the > base. > > The poison these fish can inflict is shot out > through > > their venomous spines from the glands in the long > > grooves of their fins. Lionfish like an area where > > they can hang out like a crevice or cave. These > fish > > are nocturnal and prefer to hunt during nightime. > > > > Venomous: By purchasing this item you are aware > that > > it is poisonous and deadly > > > > very very different. > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > Firefish - aka Lionfish or Scorpionfish, if by > > > firefish she meant > > > another kind of fish then it was a > misunderstanding > > > - and i very > > > much do know what i am talking about before > posting > > > - maybe you > > > should get your facts straight and practise on > how > > > to talk to > > > another person. > > > > > > sandra > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > wrote: > > > > you need to get your facts straight before > posting > > > > something like that. > > > > 1. fire fish are NOt poisonous. > > > > 2. they only grow to about 3 inches and are > very > > > > skinny. > > > > 3. are not difficult to feed. > > > > 4. have a mouth so small that they could not > eat > > > > another fish! they are big around as a sharpie > at > > > the > > > > most. > > > > know what you are talking about before you > > > post!!!!!! > > > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sorry, just my opinion: > > > > > I wouldnt recommend buying a firefish for > such a > > > > > small system. Those > > > > > fishes can grow very large and may not even > be > > > able > > > > > to "turn around" > > > > > in a 30 something gallon aquarium. Besides > that > > > will > > > > > eat anything > > > > > that fits in their mouth, have a huge amount > of > > > > > bioload (will > > > > > contamine the water very fast unless she > does > > > water > > > > > changes VERY > > > > > often and has a very potent skimmer) and > other > > > than > > > > > that, getting > > > > > this fish to eat can be more difficult than > > > raising > > > > > a child.. oh > > > > > yeah, and are venemous... great fish and > very > > > hardy > > > > > but i wouldnt > > > > > say it´s for beginners with a small tank. > > > > > > > > > > sandra > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Valeen > > > Gonzalez > > > > > <valeendgonzalez@y...> wrote: > > > > > > i think a lot of gobies aren't that > aggressive > > > > > towards other > > > > > species of fish, but may be > > > > > > aggressive towards others of their own > > > species. so > > > > > if your friend > > > > > gets 1 goby it should be fine. > > > > > > that is, unless she happens to get another > > > species > > > > > of fish that is > > > > > aggressive and/or predatorial > > > > > > towards other species like some triggers > are > > > > > (maybe most triggers > > > > > lol). > > > > > > > > > > > > if she sticks with gobies like a watchman > or a > > > > > neon as rob > > > > > suggested, and got only other > > > > > > non-aggressive fish like false percs or > > > firefish, > > > > > she should be ok. > > > > > > > > > > > > --- agentscullyeyore@a... wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks i went to google and found them > are > > > all > > > > > gobies non > > > > > aggressive or just > > > > > > > that kind.. Shannon > > > > > > > > > > > > > > general names ===== false percula > clowns - > > > > > looks like nemo > > > > > > > and neon gobies. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > rob > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In a message dated 7/1/2005 10:29:55 AM > US > > > > > Eastern Standard > > > > > Time, > > > > > > > agentscullyeyore@a... writes: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks robbie.. i told her that it > was > > > small > > > > > but unlike > > > > > others she really > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > isn't listening to me... and what i > the > > > > > general name for > > > > > those fish do you > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > know... Shannon: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have > been > > > > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > > > > > > I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > > > > > > > Yahoo! Sports > > > > Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy > > > Football > > > > http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > > Yahoo! Mail > > Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the > tour: > > http://tour.mail.yahoo.com/mailtour.html > > > ___________________________________________________________ How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12749	From: Evita	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: how do I get off the mailing list (anybody)

Luke if you just want to change your status to not get mail yet stay a member you need to go to the group and and click on edit membership. Then go down to message delivery and click No-email, then save changes. Evita luke / lemanja Davidson <lemysluke@...> wrote:I need somebody to tell me how to get off the mailing list? thanks luke --------------------------------- Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12750	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

Looking up the common name firefish gives me [scientific name] [Common Name(s)]: Ebosia bleekeri Bleeker's lionfish, Cockscomb firefish, E-bo-shi-gam-p'eng, Eboshikasago, Kui suo yóu Dendrochirus bellus Bricked firefish, Depu, Hime-yamanokami, Kko-ma-huk-mu-gul-ch'I, Mei lì duan qí suo yóu Dendrochirus brachypterus Chavarali, Dværgdragefisk, Dwarf lionfish, Fang-hamas, Featherfish, Kortvin- kalkoenvis, Shortfin firefish, Shortfin lionfish, Shortfin turkeyfish, Shortspined butterfly-cod, Zebra firefish, Zwerg-Feuerfisch Dendrochirus zebra Cá Mao Tiên, Cá Mao tiên cánh qu?t, Depu, Dwarf lionfish, Galinha zebra, Gedempu, Kirinmino, Lain, Lalong, Lepu, Minokasago, Poisson armée, Scorpion kembang, Sebra-kalkoenvis, Zebra firefish, Zebra lionfish, Zebra turkeyfish, Zebra-dragefisk, Zebradrakfisk, Nemateleotris decora Akebonohaze, Decorated dartfish, Elegant firefish, Eleotris décoré, Exocet, Iga daro geregere, Mano'o-sugale, Violet ildhalekutling Parapterois heterura Blackfoot firefish, Diabo-voador, Gurnard lionfish, Jié wei suo yóu, Laaligere, Ni suo yóu, Seto-minokasago, Swartvoet-vuurvis, Threadtail firefish, To-ja-gam-p'eng Pterois antennata Banded lionfish, Breëbalk-vuurvis, Broadbarred firefish, Deek al bahar, Fanhaa mas, Laagigere, Laffe volant, Nettai-minokasago. Nufu pabo, Peixe-fogo tentaculado, Pletfinnet dragefisk, Poisson armée, Poisson-scorpion à antennes, Ragged-finned firefish, Rough-scaled firefish, Sausau-lele, Scorpion miles, Skrzydlica rogata, Spotfin lionfish, Tarataraiau, Tataraihau Pterois miles African lionfish, Deepwater firefish, Diepwater-vuurvis, Dragón de Mombasa, Frillfin turkeyfish, Laffe mombaise Pterois mombasae (and so on and so forth) Pterois radiata Pterois russelii Pterois volitans The only species listed here that is NOT a lionfish is the Nemateleotris decora. This exercise really only serves to point out that there is some need to standardize the common names of fish, so that we have a better idea of the fish that is being referred to when we do not have a specimen right in front of our eyes. Fishbase, where I grabbed the above listings from, suggests a specific common name for each species. We could use this as a stop gap measure when using common names. However, a generally safer way to achieve uniformity is to use the scientific names \\Steve// Sorry to have sent this in HTML but I thought I needed to to make the text a bit clearer to the reader. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Sandra Sent: Saturday, July 02, 2005 6:07 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium you can also look it up, anywhere you look for a firefish there will show up two species - the dartfish, and the lionfish which some people call firefishes. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms <wtfmorlok@y...> wrote: > firefish are not aka lionfish or scorpionfish. a > lionfish is a lionfish ....try looking it up! > > The Firefish, a.k.a. Dartfish, is a magnificent little > fish that's perfect for reef tanks. These fish have a > white forebody and a "fiery" rearbody that is colored > in a mix of red colors. The Firefish also has an > elongated first dorsal spine that "jumps" up and down. > These little fish have lots of personality and should > be kept in a tank with lots of rockwork. The Firefish > likes lots of crevices, caves, and overhangs where > they can "hang" in place. These fish prefer to be kept > in pairs and do well in the home aquarium. They are > great for reef tanks and will accept most fish > foods.These fish are also jumpers, so precautions > should be taken to secure openings at the top of the > aquarium > > The family of Lionfish is a group of fish that are > world renowned for their beauty and ability to inflict > pain. These fish have large flowing dorsal and > pectoral fins that are occassionly webbed at the base. > The poison these fish can inflict is shot out through > their venomous spines from the glands in the long > grooves of their fins. Lionfish like an area where > they can hang out like a crevice or cave. These fish > are nocturnal and prefer to hunt during nightime. > > Venomous: By purchasing this item you are aware that > it is poisonous and deadly > > very very different. > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > Firefish - aka Lionfish or Scorpionfish, if by > > firefish she meant > > another kind of fish then it was a misunderstanding > > - and i very > > much do know what i am talking about before posting > > - maybe you > > should get your facts straight and practise on how > > to talk to > > another person. > > > > sandra > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > wrote: > > > you need to get your facts straight before posting > > > something like that. > > > 1. fire fish are NOt poisonous. > > > 2. they only grow to about 3 inches and are very > > > skinny. > > > 3. are not difficult to feed. > > > 4. have a mouth so small that they could not eat > > > another fish! they are big around as a sharpie at > > the > > > most. > > > know what you are talking about before you > > post!!!!!! > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Sorry, just my opinion: > > > > I wouldnt recommend buying a firefish for such a > > > > small system. Those > > > > fishes can grow very large and may not even be > > able > > > > to "turn around" > > > > in a 30 something gallon aquarium. Besides that > > will > > > > eat anything > > > > that fits in their mouth, have a huge amount of > > > > bioload (will > > > > contamine the water very fast unless she does > > water > > > > changes VERY > > > > often and has a very potent skimmer) and other > > than > > > > that, getting > > > > this fish to eat can be more difficult than > > raising > > > > a child.. oh > > > > yeah, and are venemous... great fish and very > > hardy > > > > but i wouldnt > > > > say it´s for beginners with a small tank. > > > > > > > > sandra > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Valeen > > Gonzalez > > > > <valeendgonzalez@y...> wrote: > > > > > i think a lot of gobies aren't that aggressive > > > > towards other > > > > species of fish, but may be > > > > > aggressive towards others of their own > > species. so > > > > if your friend > > > > gets 1 goby it should be fine. > > > > > that is, unless she happens to get another > > species > > > > of fish that is > > > > aggressive and/or predatorial > > > > > towards other species like some triggers are > > > > (maybe most triggers > > > > lol). > > > > > > > > > > if she sticks with gobies like a watchman or a > > > > neon as rob > > > > suggested, and got only other > > > > > non-aggressive fish like false percs or > > firefish, > > > > she should be ok. > > > > > > > > > > --- agentscullyeyore@a... wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks i went to google and found them are > > all > > > > gobies non > > > > aggressive or just > > > > > > that kind.. Shannon > > > > > > > > > > > > general names ===== false percula clowns - > > > > looks like nemo > > > > > > and neon gobies. > > > > > > > > > > > > rob > > > > > > > > > > > > In a message dated 7/1/2005 10:29:55 AM US > > > > Eastern Standard > > > > Time, > > > > > > agentscullyeyore@a... writes: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks robbie.. i told her that it was > > small > > > > but unlike > > > > others she really > > > > > > > > > > > > > isn't listening to me... and what i the > > > > general name for > > > > those fish do you > > > > > > > > > > > > > know... Shannon: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > > > > > I love my mated pair of true percs! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12751	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

Thats one thing wrong with common names in a hobby that has Hundred of thousand species. What one person calls a Firefish is not what another person calls a firefish. One reason when recommending a species I tried also adding the Scientific name.. makes it easier for all in the long run... A Fire Fish to me is Nemateleotris magnifica not Pterois volitans Rob Indiana In a message dated 7/2/2005 12:46:38 PM US Eastern Standard Time, sandra_friedwagner@... writes: > Firefish - aka Lionfish or Scorpionfish, if by firefish she meant > another kind of fish then it was a misunderstanding - and i very > much do know what i am talking about before posting - maybe you > should get your facts straight and practise on how to talk to > another person. > > sandra [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12752	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: how do I get off the mailing list (anybody)

Scan all the way to the bottom of this message it READS as follows: To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ have a nice day rob In a message dated 7/2/2005 6:31:07 PM US Eastern Standard Time, lemysluke@... writes: > I need somebody to tell me how to get off the mailing list? > > thanks luke > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12753	From: tomd27m	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Easiest way to share photos

I'd like to recommend a website here: http://www.bonpoo.com/picszip.htm It's probably the easiest way to share photo albums online and it's totally free. You should be able to share a photo album with no more than 5 clicks. Tom

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12754	From: Heather Husvar	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: some little questions

Yes, I was very particular about things about 8 years ago. Now, well, a 3 year old and a husband changed all of that! Eventually, I'll find our camera and take some pictures. I've never had such a tank, but I'm finding that I kind of like it. It's great fun to see my little girl stand there and talk about the fish and the rock she chose and the fish she picked out, etc. Heather On 7/1/05, Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > Heather, > > "Fresh Fish"? I haven't seen that one. > > I'm a semi-purist, but I do realize that some people have a certain affinity > for things like the bubbling treasure chest, the diver, the skull, etc., > especially the younger ones, and usually manage not to deride those who use > such decoration in an aquarium. > > \\Steve//

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12755	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: New to the forum

Hello there! I am relatively new to this hobby as I just started in February :) I have a 10 gallon tank with 1 male betta, 2 rasboras, 3 zebra danios, 1 oto, and 1 corydoras habrosus (searching for more with no luck). I also have a 37 gallon with 1 albino bristlenose pleco, 2 botia striata, now 1 oto (the other died last night), 4 adult guppies, and 20 fry. I need help with my 37 gallon tank. I saw a fuzzy white spot on one of my female guppies and the two males were flashing. Since loaches are sensitive to salt, I decided to use rid-ich to treat the tank. The directions say to do a 25% water change daily and dose daily for 7 days. Yesterday was day 3. I did the water change, added the meds, everything was fine. Then my oto died a few hours later and one of my loaches was having a hard time swimming and kept drifting over onto his side. So, we did an immediate water change to dilute the medicine. I don't have any AC right now. This morning everyone seems fine. Active, eating, swimming normally, etc. I took water readings this morning: ammonia 0, nitrite .25 and nitrate 5-10. Do you think the meds may have affected the biological filter? What do I do now? Put AC in my filter to draw out the meds? Continue treatment for the remaining time? Or I read to just treat the tank on days 1,4,7,10 with the rid-ich and do water changes before I dose? How do I get my nitrites down? Any help is much appreciated, sorry to start out with so many questions! Rebecca

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12756	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: new tank cycling

wow such a small bio-load in such a big tank. I have no idea if you will ever see a ammonia spike. I will leave this question to be answered by those with a little more knowledge with big tanks. rob Indian wish I had a 150 gallon tank :-( * * * * In a message dated 7/2/2005 8:27:39 PM US Eastern Standard Time, Crazy4fids@... writes: > With a 150 gallon tank, 6 glow light tetras and two cory cats, how long > will > it take to see an ammonia spike? > > When I started the tank on Wednesday, I added two cups of gravel from my 10 > > gallon tank and I also pulled the filter pad out of the whisper power filter > > in the 10 gallon. As of today, the ammonia is still at zero as is the > nitrites. > > Do I need to add more fish? Or just be patient and wait. > > Linda > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12757	From: Sandra	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

As you already said, the "Lionfish" has several names that people call it and when looking it up on the internet there will appear dartfish, gobie AND Lionfish. And i already said that if she meant a fish other than the lionfish then it was a simple misunderstanding, but i have seen and heard of people keeping a lionfish in such a small system and many other fishes that arent suitable for those conditions, but a beginner might not know that and my intention was simply informing her about the "Lionfish" if that is what she meant and a person that has the intention to give information and good advice shouldnt be answered rudely - thats all! --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > Hi Sandra, > The name Firefish refers to Nemateleotris > magnifica also known as Fire Dartfish a small Gobie > type fish, the other fish you are calling a firefish > is a Pterois Volitans (a large venomous fish up to > 38cm) normally called a Lionfish or Scorpionfish or > Dragon fish occasionally Turkey fish or Red Firefish. > If you have followed this thread from the beginning > you would know the tank in question is a small tank > that could not acomodate a Pterois Volitans so I fail > to see the point of your argument which is not > strictly correct anyway as I have pointed out. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > you can also look it up, anywhere you look for a > > firefish there will > > show up two species - the dartfish, and the lionfish > > which some > > people call firefishes. > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > wrote: > > > firefish are not aka lionfish or scorpionfish. a > > > lionfish is a lionfish ....try looking it up! > > > > > > The Firefish, a.k.a. Dartfish, is a magnificent > > little > > > fish that's perfect for reef tanks. These fish > > have a > > > white forebody and a "fiery" rearbody that is > > colored > > > in a mix of red colors. The Firefish also has an > > > elongated first dorsal spine that "jumps" up and > > down. > > > These little fish have lots of personality and > > should > > > be kept in a tank with lots of rockwork. The > > Firefish > > > likes lots of crevices, caves, and overhangs where > > > they can "hang" in place. These fish prefer to be > > kept > > > in pairs and do well in the home aquarium. They > > are > > > great for reef tanks and will accept most fish > > > foods.These fish are also jumpers, so precautions > > > should be taken to secure openings at the top of > > the > > > aquarium > > > > > > The family of Lionfish is a group of fish that are > > > world renowned for their beauty and ability to > > inflict > > > pain. These fish have large flowing dorsal and > > > pectoral fins that are occassionly webbed at the > > base. > > > The poison these fish can inflict is shot out > > through > > > their venomous spines from the glands in the long > > > grooves of their fins. Lionfish like an area where > > > they can hang out like a crevice or cave. These > > fish > > > are nocturnal and prefer to hunt during nightime. > > > > > > Venomous: By purchasing this item you are aware > > that > > > it is poisonous and deadly > > > > > > very very different. > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > Firefish - aka Lionfish or Scorpionfish, if by > > > > firefish she meant > > > > another kind of fish then it was a > > misunderstanding > > > > - and i very > > > > much do know what i am talking about before > > posting > > > > - maybe you > > > > should get your facts straight and practise on > > how > > > > to talk to > > > > another person. > > > > > > > > sandra > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > > wrote: > > > > > you need to get your facts straight before > > posting > > > > > something like that. > > > > > 1. fire fish are NOt poisonous. > > > > > 2. they only grow to about 3 inches and are > > very > > > > > skinny. > > > > > 3. are not difficult to feed. > > > > > 4. have a mouth so small that they could not > > eat > > > > > another fish! they are big around as a sharpie > > at > > > > the > > > > > most. > > > > > know what you are talking about before you > > > > post!!!!!! > > > > > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sorry, just my opinion: > > > > > > I wouldnt recommend buying a firefish for > > such a > > > > > > small system. Those > > > > > > fishes can grow very large and may not even > > be > > > > able > > > > > > to "turn around" > > > > > > in a 30 something gallon aquarium. Besides > > that > > > > will > > > > > > eat anything > > > > > > that fits in their mouth, have a huge amount > > of > > > > > > bioload (will > > > > > > contamine the water very fast unless she > > does > > > > water > > > > > > changes VERY > > > > > > often and has a very potent skimmer) and > > other > > > > than > > > > > > that, getting > > > > > > this fish to eat can be more difficult than > > > > raising > > > > > > a child.. oh > > > > > > yeah, and are venemous... great fish and > > very > > > > hardy > > > > > > but i wouldnt > > > > > > say it´s for beginners with a small tank. > > > > > > > > > > > > sandra > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Valeen > > > > Gonzalez > > > > > > <valeendgonzalez@y...> wrote: > > > > > > > i think a lot of gobies aren't that > > aggressive > > > > > > towards other > > > > > > species of fish, but may be > > > > > > > aggressive towards others of their own > > > > species. so > > > > > > if your friend > > > > > > gets 1 goby it should be fine. > > > > > > > that is, unless she happens to get another > > > > species > > > > > > of fish that is > > > > > > aggressive and/or predatorial > > > > > > > towards other species like some triggers > > are > > > > > > (maybe most triggers > > > > > > lol). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if she sticks with gobies like a watchman > > or a > > > > > > neon as rob > > > > > > suggested, and got only other > > > > > > > non-aggressive fish like false percs or > > > > firefish, > > > > > > she should be ok. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- agentscullyeyore@a... wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks i went to google and found them > > are > > > > all > > > > > > gobies non > > > > > > aggressive or just > > > > > > > > that kind.. Shannon > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > general names ===== false percula > > clowns - > > > > > > looks like nemo > > > > > > > > and neon gobies. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > rob > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In a message dated 7/1/2005 10:29:55 AM > > US > > > > > > Eastern Standard > > > > > > Time, > > > > > > > > agentscullyeyore@a... writes: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks robbie.. i told her that it > > was > > > > small > > > > > > but unlike > > > > > > others she really > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > isn't listening to me... and what i > > the > > > > > > general name for > > > > > > those fish do you > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > know... Shannon: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have > > been > > > > > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > > > > > > > I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > > > > > > > > > Yahoo! Sports > > > > > Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy > > > > Football > > > > > http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > > > Yahoo! Mail > > > Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the > > tour: > > > http://tour.mail.yahoo.com/mailtour.html > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday > snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12758	From: Sandra	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

good point, thank you! --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > Looking up the common name firefish gives me [scientific name] > [Common Name(s)]: > > Ebosia bleekeri Bleeker's lionfish, Cockscomb firefish, > E-bo-shi-gam-p'eng, Eboshikasago, Kui suo yóu > Dendrochirus bellus Bricked firefish, Depu, Hime-yamanokami, > Kko-ma-huk-mu-gul-ch'I, Mei lì duan qí suo yóu > Dendrochirus brachypterus Chavarali, Dværgdragefisk, Dwarf lionfish, > Fang-hamas, Featherfish, Kortvin- kalkoenvis, Shortfin firefish, Shortfin > lionfish, Shortfin turkeyfish, Shortspined butterfly-cod, Zebra > firefish, Zwerg-Feuerfisch > Dendrochirus zebra Cá Mao Tiên, Cá Mao tiên cánh qu?t, Depu, Dwarf > lionfish, Galinha zebra, Gedempu, Kirinmino, Lain, Lalong, Lepu, > Minokasago, Poisson armée, Scorpion kembang, Sebra-kalkoenvis, Zebra > firefish, Zebra lionfish, Zebra turkeyfish, Zebra-dragefisk, Zebradrakfisk, > Nemateleotris decora Akebonohaze, Decorated dartfish, Elegant firefish, > Eleotris décoré, Exocet, Iga daro geregere, Mano'o-sugale, Violet > ildhalekutling > Parapterois heterura Blackfoot firefish, Diabo-voador, Gurnard lionfish, > Jié wei suo yóu, Laaligere, Ni suo yóu, Seto-minokasago, Swartvoet-vuurvis, > Threadtail firefish, To-ja-gam-p'eng > Pterois antennata Banded lionfish, Breëbalk-vuurvis, Broadbarred > firefish, Deek al bahar, Fanhaa mas, Laagigere, > Laffe volant, Nettai-minokasago. Nufu pabo, Peixe-fogo tentaculado, > Pletfinnet dragefisk, Poisson armée, Poisson-scorpion à antennes, > Ragged-finned firefish, Rough-scaled firefish, Sausau-lele, Scorpion miles, > Skrzydlica rogata, > Spotfin lionfish, Tarataraiau, Tataraihau > Pterois miles African lionfish, Deepwater firefish, Diepwater- vuurvis, > Dragón de Mombasa, Frillfin turkeyfish, > Laffe mombaise > Pterois mombasae (and so on and so forth) > Pterois radiata > Pterois russelii > Pterois volitans > > > The only species listed here that is NOT a lionfish is the Nemateleotris > decora. This exercise really only serves to point out that there is some > need to standardize the common names of fish, so that we have a better idea > of the fish that is being referred to when we do not have a specimen right > in front of our eyes. > > > > Fishbase, where I grabbed the above listings from, suggests a specific > common name for each species. We could use this as a stop gap measure when > using common names. However, a generally safer way to achieve uniformity is > to use the scientific names > > \\Steve// > > Sorry to have sent this in HTML but I thought I needed to to make the text a > bit clearer to the reader. > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Sandra > Sent: Saturday, July 02, 2005 6:07 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium > > you can also look it up, anywhere you look for a firefish there will > show up two species - the dartfish, and the lionfish which some > people call firefishes. > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms <wtfmorlok@y...> > wrote: > > firefish are not aka lionfish or scorpionfish. a > > lionfish is a lionfish ....try looking it up! > > > > The Firefish, a.k.a. Dartfish, is a magnificent little > > fish that's perfect for reef tanks. These fish have a > > white forebody and a "fiery" rearbody that is colored > > in a mix of red colors. The Firefish also has an > > elongated first dorsal spine that "jumps" up and down. > > These little fish have lots of personality and should > > be kept in a tank with lots of rockwork. The Firefish > > likes lots of crevices, caves, and overhangs where > > they can "hang" in place. These fish prefer to be kept > > in pairs and do well in the home aquarium. They are > > great for reef tanks and will accept most fish > > foods.These fish are also jumpers, so precautions > > should be taken to secure openings at the top of the > > aquarium > > > > The family of Lionfish is a group of fish that are > > world renowned for their beauty and ability to inflict > > pain. These fish have large flowing dorsal and > > pectoral fins that are occassionly webbed at the base. > > The poison these fish can inflict is shot out through > > their venomous spines from the glands in the long > > grooves of their fins. Lionfish like an area where > > they can hang out like a crevice or cave. These fish > > are nocturnal and prefer to hunt during nightime. > > > > Venomous: By purchasing this item you are aware that > > it is poisonous and deadly > > > > very very different. > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > Firefish - aka Lionfish or Scorpionfish, if by > > > firefish she meant > > > another kind of fish then it was a misunderstanding > > > - and i very > > > much do know what i am talking about before posting > > > - maybe you > > > should get your facts straight and practise on how > > > to talk to > > > another person. > > > > > > sandra > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > wrote: > > > > you need to get your facts straight before posting > > > > something like that. > > > > 1. fire fish are NOt poisonous. > > > > 2. they only grow to about 3 inches and are very > > > > skinny. > > > > 3. are not difficult to feed. > > > > 4. have a mouth so small that they could not eat > > > > another fish! they are big around as a sharpie at > > > the > > > > most. > > > > know what you are talking about before you > > > post!!!!!! > > > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sorry, just my opinion: > > > > > I wouldnt recommend buying a firefish for such a > > > > > small system. Those > > > > > fishes can grow very large and may not even be > > > able > > > > > to "turn around" > > > > > in a 30 something gallon aquarium. Besides that > > > will > > > > > eat anything > > > > > that fits in their mouth, have a huge amount of > > > > > bioload (will > > > > > contamine the water very fast unless she does > > > water > > > > > changes VERY > > > > > often and has a very potent skimmer) and other > > > than > > > > > that, getting > > > > > this fish to eat can be more difficult than > > > raising > > > > > a child.. oh > > > > > yeah, and are venemous... great fish and very > > > hardy > > > > > but i wouldnt > > > > > say it´s for beginners with a small tank. > > > > > > > > > > sandra > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Valeen > > > Gonzalez > > > > > <valeendgonzalez@y...> wrote: > > > > > > i think a lot of gobies aren't that aggressive > > > > > towards other > > > > > species of fish, but may be > > > > > > aggressive towards others of their own > > > species. so > > > > > if your friend > > > > > gets 1 goby it should be fine. > > > > > > that is, unless she happens to get another > > > species > > > > > of fish that is > > > > > aggressive and/or predatorial > > > > > > towards other species like some triggers are > > > > > (maybe most triggers > > > > > lol). > > > > > > > > > > > > if she sticks with gobies like a watchman or a > > > > > neon as rob > > > > > suggested, and got only other > > > > > > non-aggressive fish like false percs or > > > firefish, > > > > > she should be ok. > > > > > > > > > > > > --- agentscullyeyore@a... wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks i went to google and found them are > > > all > > > > > gobies non > > > > > aggressive or just > > > > > > > that kind.. Shannon > > > > > > > > > > > > > > general names ===== false percula clowns - > > > > > looks like nemo > > > > > > > and neon gobies. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > rob > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In a message dated 7/1/2005 10:29:55 AM US > > > > > Eastern Standard > > > > > Time, > > > > > > > agentscullyeyore@a... writes: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks robbie.. i told her that it was > > > small > > > > > but unlike > > > > > others she really > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > isn't listening to me... and what i the > > > > > general name for > > > > > those fish do you > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > know... Shannon: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > > > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > > > > > > I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12759	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: New to the forum

Hi Rebecca :-) your name looks familiar for some reason. rob Indiana USA AKA cichlid46816/corydorasworld.com In a message dated 7/2/2005 10:08:24 PM US Eastern Standard Time, TheSydMonster@... writes: > Hello there! I am relatively new to this hobby as I just started in > February :) I have a 10 gallon tank with 1 male betta, 2 rasboras, 3 > zebra danios, 1 oto, and 1 corydoras habrosus (searching for more > with no luck). [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12760	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: How long in hobby?

I am celebrating my 15th year in the hobby this year and was wondering if this group has more "Old timers" or more of a new attitude. Curious... I'd post a poll but it says poll option not available And in a few peoples cases you can reply with decades in hobby LOL rob 15yrs Indiana [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12761	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: How long in hobby?

I have been in the hobby since I was about eight years old. That would be about 30 years. I have been out of the hobby for the past ten years because our little starter house did not have room for my 125 gallon aquarium. Linda River Falls, WI [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12762	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/2/2005
Subject: Re: How long in hobby?

I'm a newbie at just under a year... Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of FortWayneFish@... Sent: Saturday, July 02, 2005 11:14 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] How long in hobby? I am celebrating my 15th year in the hobby this year and was wondering if this group has more "Old timers" or more of a new attitude. Curious... I'd post a poll but it says poll option not available And in a few peoples cases you can reply with decades in hobby LOL rob 15yrs Indiana [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12763	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: How long in hobby?

i guess i am a newbie too about 2 years now but in the two years i have done a major research project in the use of aquaria education in elementary schools.. hopefully it will be off to the publisher no later than sept... shannon I'm a newbie at just under a year... Eric [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12764	From: Paul N. Chung	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: How long in hobby?

Hey, I 've been into Fish Keeping for more than 15 years. Crazy4fids@... wrote: I have been in the hobby since I was about eight years old. That would be about 30 years. I have been out of the hobby for the past ten years because our little starter house did not have room for my 125 gallon aquarium. Linda River Falls, WI Respectfully Yours, Paul N. Chung http://www.geocities.com/p_n_chung/index.html http://www.geocities.com/filipinofish/index.html http://filipinofish.tripod.com/ __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12765	From: Evita	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: some little questions

I miss that age and stage. When all is new and facinating. All mine are grwoing up to the stage where they think they know it all. I guess that is why I keep my church nursery. Evita Heather Husvar <hhusvar@...> wrote:Yes, I was very particular about things about 8 years ago. Now, well, a 3 year old and a husband changed all of that! Eventually, I'll find our camera and take some pictures. I've never had such a tank, but I'm finding that I kind of like it. It's great fun to see my little girl stand there and talk about the fish and the rock she chose and the fish she picked out, etc. Heather On 7/1/05, Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > Heather, > > "Fresh Fish"? I haven't seen that one. > > I'm a semi-purist, but I do realize that some people have a certain affinity > for things like the bubbling treasure chest, the diver, the skull, etc., > especially the younger ones, and usually manage not to deride those who use > such decoration in an aquarium. > > \\Steve// Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12766	From: Evita	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: New to the forum

Rebecca, Sorry about your loss of fish. I don't know if you had been reading or not but I have been having a problem with ICK as well. I wish you luck. I was wondering what your tank temp. is? I was told to bring up the temp to about 86 and it seemed to help. Your post said fuzzy white spot on fish. Are you sure it was ick? One of mine had what appeared to be a spot like that and he was the first one I had that died. The others were covered with more of what looked like salt spots. I am never than you to keeping fish. Hang in there. Do any more of your fish have any white spots? I am still treating with salt but as far as I can tell mine appear to be better. Even so I lost 2 platys. PS My oldest daughter's name is Rebecca. Evita thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@...> wrote: Hello there! I am relatively new to this hobby as I just started in February :) I have a 10 gallon tank with 1 male betta, 2 rasboras, 3 zebra danios, 1 oto, and 1 corydoras habrosus (searching for more with no luck). I also have a 37 gallon with 1 albino bristlenose pleco, 2 botia striata, now 1 oto (the other died last night), 4 adult guppies, and 20 fry. I need help with my 37 gallon tank. I saw a fuzzy white spot on one of my female guppies and the two males were flashing. Since loaches are sensitive to salt, I decided to use rid-ich to treat the tank. The directions say to do a 25% water change daily and dose daily for 7 days. Yesterday was day 3. I did the water change, added the meds, everything was fine. Then my oto died a few hours later and one of my loaches was having a hard time swimming and kept drifting over onto his side. So, we did an immediate water change to dilute the medicine. I don't have any AC right now. This morning everyone seems fine. Active, eating, swimming normally, etc. I took water readings this morning: ammonia 0, nitrite .25 and nitrate 5-10. Do you think the meds may have affected the biological filter? What do I do now? Put AC in my filter to draw out the meds? Continue treatment for the remaining time? Or I read to just treat the tank on days 1,4,7,10 with the rid-ich and do water changes before I dose? How do I get my nitrites down? Any help is much appreciated, sorry to start out with so many questions! Rebecca Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12767	From: Evita	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: New to the forum

Sorry type-O mistake.....I meant newer to keeping fish not Never to keeping fish. It makes a big difference in the meaning. Evita Evita <evitabug@...> wrote: Rebecca, Sorry about your loss of fish. I don't know if you had been reading or not but I have been having a problem with ICK as well. I wish you luck. I was wondering what your tank temp. is? I was told to bring up the temp to about 86 and it seemed to help. Your post said fuzzy white spot on fish. Are you sure it was ick? One of mine had what appeared to be a spot like that and he was the first one I had that died. The others were covered with more of what looked like salt spots. I am never than you to keeping fish. Hang in there. --------------------------------- Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12768	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: New to the forum

The fuzzy white is not an indication of ich. It probably indicates a form of fungus. The flashing of the male guppies could be an indication of many things, or nothing at all. Closer observation would be needed to determine if this is indicative of a parasite or disease. Normally, I would advise to continue the course of treatment recommended by the medication you are using. In this case, however, I would stop it immediately, and add the activated carbon to your filter to remove the remaining medication from the water, as well as doing a water change to help lessen the concentration. If you cannot identify the problem from your books, asking here, as well as your LFS can help you ID the problem, and then a proper course of action can be recommended. When going outside for help, try to indicate the status of the fish as clearly as you can (after all, we cannot see the fish) as well as giving your water parameters--temperature, pH, ammonia, nitrate, nitrite, etc. Give numbers, not that the tests were OK. In some instances you will need to treat the entire tank, while in others you can remove the affected fish to a quarantine or hospital tank, and treat them there. Since the course of treatment would be unknown upon the reporting of the problem, it is also wise to state what the other inhabitants of the tank are, as well as the size of the tank--which you did in this case. As you indicated, some fish are sensitive to some medications, knowing the fish that you have will help in providing you with a course of treatment that is only harmful to the offending organisms, and not the fish. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of thesydmonster Sent: Saturday, July 02, 2005 11:24 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] New to the forum Hello there! I am relatively new to this hobby as I just started in February :) I have a 10 gallon tank with 1 male betta, 2 rasboras, 3 zebra danios, 1 oto, and 1 corydoras habrosus (searching for more with no luck). I also have a 37 gallon with 1 albino bristlenose pleco, 2 botia striata, now 1 oto (the other died last night), 4 adult guppies, and 20 fry. I need help with my 37 gallon tank. I saw a fuzzy white spot on one of my female guppies and the two males were flashing. Since loaches are sensitive to salt, I decided to use rid-ich to treat the tank. The directions say to do a 25% water change daily and dose daily for 7 days. Yesterday was day 3. I did the water change, added the meds, everything was fine. Then my oto died a few hours later and one of my loaches was having a hard time swimming and kept drifting over onto his side. So, we did an immediate water change to dilute the medicine. I don't have any AC right now. This morning everyone seems fine. Active, eating, swimming normally, etc. I took water readings this morning: ammonia 0, nitrite .25 and nitrate 5-10. Do you think the meds may have affected the biological filter? What do I do now? Put AC in my filter to draw out the meds? Continue treatment for the remaining time? Or I read to just treat the tank on days 1,4,7,10 with the rid-ich and do water changes before I dose? How do I get my nitrites down? Any help is much appreciated, sorry to start out with so many questions! Rebecca

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12769	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: How long in hobby?

I've been in, around, about the hobby for more than 50 years. This does include some periods, like my time away at a private high school, where I was not keeping fish, but still reading about them, and of course, my father still had tanks at home. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of FortWayneFish@... Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2005 12:14 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] How long in hobby? I am celebrating my 15th year in the hobby this year and was wondering if this group has more "Old timers" or more of a new attitude. Curious... I'd post a poll but it says poll option not available And in a few peoples cases you can reply with decades in hobby LOL rob 15yrs Indiana [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12770	From: paul helms	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

i did look it up and when you type in firefish in the web browser nothing comes up about lionfish. i also went to several site to purchase fish...all had a section called firefish, and what do you know ....there was no lionfish there. only red and purple firefish along with their 200 dollar counterpart helfrich. i have also been in the industry for 5 years and have never heard ANYONE call a lionfish a firefish. i have been in the hobby as an adult for 14 years, and also had fish as a child...again never heard anyone call a firefish a lionfish or vice versa. all of the sites taht i have seen have not mentioned anything to confuse the issue., but someone posted something that looks like translations from an asian dialect which does...but as far as i know the asian dialect is not good for anything when it comes to the hoibby --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@...> wrote: > you can also look it up, anywhere you look for a > firefish there will > show up two species - the dartfish, and the lionfish > which some > people call firefishes. > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > <wtfmorlok@y...> > wrote: > > firefish are not aka lionfish or scorpionfish. a > > lionfish is a lionfish ....try looking it up! > > > > The Firefish, a.k.a. Dartfish, is a magnificent > little > > fish that's perfect for reef tanks. These fish > have a > > white forebody and a "fiery" rearbody that is > colored > > in a mix of red colors. The Firefish also has an > > elongated first dorsal spine that "jumps" up and > down. > > These little fish have lots of personality and > should > > be kept in a tank with lots of rockwork. The > Firefish > > likes lots of crevices, caves, and overhangs where > > they can "hang" in place. These fish prefer to be > kept > > in pairs and do well in the home aquarium. They > are > > great for reef tanks and will accept most fish > > foods.These fish are also jumpers, so precautions > > should be taken to secure openings at the top of > the > > aquarium > > > > The family of Lionfish is a group of fish that are > > world renowned for their beauty and ability to > inflict > > pain. These fish have large flowing dorsal and > > pectoral fins that are occassionly webbed at the > base. > > The poison these fish can inflict is shot out > through > > their venomous spines from the glands in the long > > grooves of their fins. Lionfish like an area where > > they can hang out like a crevice or cave. These > fish > > are nocturnal and prefer to hunt during nightime. > > > > Venomous: By purchasing this item you are aware > that > > it is poisonous and deadly > > > > very very different. > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > Firefish - aka Lionfish or Scorpionfish, if by > > > firefish she meant > > > another kind of fish then it was a > misunderstanding > > > - and i very > > > much do know what i am talking about before > posting > > > - maybe you > > > should get your facts straight and practise on > how > > > to talk to > > > another person. > > > > > > sandra > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > wrote: > > > > you need to get your facts straight before > posting > > > > something like that. > > > > 1. fire fish are NOt poisonous. > > > > 2. they only grow to about 3 inches and are > very > > > > skinny. > > > > 3. are not difficult to feed. > > > > 4. have a mouth so small that they could not > eat > > > > another fish! they are big around as a sharpie > at > > > the > > > > most. > > > > know what you are talking about before you > > > post!!!!!! > > > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sorry, just my opinion: > > > > > I wouldnt recommend buying a firefish for > such a > > > > > small system. Those > > > > > fishes can grow very large and may not even > be > > > able > > > > > to "turn around" > > > > > in a 30 something gallon aquarium. Besides > that > > > will > > > > > eat anything > > > > > that fits in their mouth, have a huge amount > of > > > > > bioload (will > > > > > contamine the water very fast unless she > does > > > water > > > > > changes VERY > > > > > often and has a very potent skimmer) and > other > > > than > > > > > that, getting > > > > > this fish to eat can be more difficult than > > > raising > > > > > a child.. oh > > > > > yeah, and are venemous... great fish and > very > > > hardy > > > > > but i wouldnt > > > > > say it´s for beginners with a small tank. > > > > > > > > > > sandra > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Valeen > > > Gonzalez > > > > > <valeendgonzalez@y...> wrote: > > > > > > i think a lot of gobies aren't that > aggressive > > > > > towards other > > > > > species of fish, but may be > > > > > > aggressive towards others of their own > > > species. so > > > > > if your friend > > > > > gets 1 goby it should be fine. > > > > > > that is, unless she happens to get another > > > species > > > > > of fish that is > > > > > aggressive and/or predatorial > > > > > > towards other species like some triggers > are > > > > > (maybe most triggers > > > > > lol). > > > > > > > > > > > > if she sticks with gobies like a watchman > or a > > > > > neon as rob > > > > > suggested, and got only other > > > > > > non-aggressive fish like false percs or > > > firefish, > > > > > she should be ok. > > > > > > > > > > > > --- agentscullyeyore@a... wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks i went to google and found them > are > > > all > > > > > gobies non > > > > > aggressive or just > > > > > > > that kind.. Shannon > > > > > > > > > > > > > > general names ===== false percula > clowns - > > > > > looks like nemo > > > > > > > and neon gobies. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > rob > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In a message dated 7/1/2005 10:29:55 AM > US > > > > > Eastern Standard > > > > > Time, > > > > > > > agentscullyeyore@a... writes: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks robbie.. i told her that it > was > > > small > > > > > but unlike > > > > > others she really > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > isn't listening to me... and what i > the > > > > > general name for > > > > > those fish do you > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > know... Shannon: > > > > > > > > === message truncated === __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12771	From: paul helms	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: How long in hobby?

14 years being solely responsible for teh aquariums plus childhood goldfish etc --- FortWayneFish@... wrote: > I am celebrating my 15th year in the hobby this year > and was wondering if > this group has more "Old timers" or more of a new > attitude. > > Curious... I'd post a poll but it says poll option > not available > > And in a few peoples cases you can reply with > decades in hobby LOL > > rob > 15yrs > Indiana > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail Mobile Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone. http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12772	From: wendie	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: How long in hobby?

The same here. Ages me but I started in grade school more than 50 years ago. Even had a job offer by Dr Axelrod who was well respected at that time. Started with goldfish, went on to livebearers and then on to breeding angels, cories, gourami, etc. Wendie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2005 6:11 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] How long in hobby? I've been in, around, about the hobby for more than 50 years. This does include some periods, like my time away at a private high school, where I was not keeping fish, but still reading about them, and of course, my father still had tanks at home. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of FortWayneFish@... Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2005 12:14 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] How long in hobby? I am celebrating my 15th year in the hobby this year and was wondering if this group has more "Old timers" or more of a new attitude. Curious... I'd post a poll but it says poll option not available And in a few peoples cases you can reply with decades in hobby LOL rob 15yrs Indiana [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter SPONSORED LINKS Saltwater aquarium Marine biologist Reef tank ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12773	From: Heather Husvar	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: How long in hobby?

Well, I don't know how many years. As a child, we always had aquaria. My dad taught me, we read up on things, etc. I kept up a light hobby through college and after that I went in "whole hog" for a while living in VT. about 4 years ago I relocated to Ohio and did not have any sea creatures. Now, we're starting up again. We have one established 20 gallon, one 10 gallon in process and one 15 gallon in process. We have established a spot for our 125 gallon and are working on redesigning the office to accommodate a couple 55's and couple more 20's. So.. we'll call that "whole hog" again. :D Heather H. On 7/3/05, FortWayneFish@... <FortWayneFish@...> wrote: > I am celebrating my 15th year in the hobby this year and was wondering if > this group has more "Old timers" or more of a new attitude. > > Curious... I'd post a poll but it says poll option not available > > And in a few peoples cases you can reply with decades in hobby LOL > > rob > 15yrs > Indiana > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > -- The rules of parents should be but three...Love, Limit, and Let them be. - Elaine M. Ward

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12774	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

I googled firefish, and 6th entry shows firefish as _Pterois volitans_. The site listed is an Australian site. Out of the first 10 hits, One reference to lionfish, and 3 to _Nemateleotris_ spp. I left out the Chinese, Japanese, and Korean scripts given as common names, as well as those written in what I think was Sanskrit or an Arabic character set. The others were given as names in the local dialects around the world. Of the ones that I know enough of the language to translate, I did not see a reference to firefish, but other names. Others here may be able to translate some of the other names, and may feel free to report what they mean in English. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of paul helms Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2005 7:19 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium i did look it up and when you type in firefish in the web browser nothing comes up about lionfish. i also went to several site to purchase fish...all had a section called firefish, and what do you know ....there was no lionfish there. only red and purple firefish along with their 200 dollar counterpart helfrich. i have also been in the industry for 5 years and have never heard ANYONE call a lionfish a firefish. i have been in the hobby as an adult for 14 years, and also had fish as a child...again never heard anyone call a firefish a lionfish or vice versa. all of the sites taht i have seen have not mentioned anything to confuse the issue., but someone posted something that looks like translations from an asian dialect which does...but as far as i know the asian dialect is not good for anything when it comes to the hoibby --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@...> wrote: > you can also look it up, anywhere you look for a > firefish there will > show up two species - the dartfish, and the lionfish > which some > people call firefishes. > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > <wtfmorlok@y...> > wrote: > > firefish are not aka lionfish or scorpionfish. a > > lionfish is a lionfish ....try looking it up! > > > > The Firefish, a.k.a. Dartfish, is a magnificent > little > > fish that's perfect for reef tanks. These fish > have a > > white forebody and a "fiery" rearbody that is > colored > > in a mix of red colors. The Firefish also has an > > elongated first dorsal spine that "jumps" up and > down. > > These little fish have lots of personality and > should > > be kept in a tank with lots of rockwork. The > Firefish > > likes lots of crevices, caves, and overhangs where > > they can "hang" in place. These fish prefer to be > kept > > in pairs and do well in the home aquarium. They > are > > great for reef tanks and will accept most fish > > foods.These fish are also jumpers, so precautions > > should be taken to secure openings at the top of > the > > aquarium > > > > The family of Lionfish is a group of fish that are > > world renowned for their beauty and ability to > inflict > > pain. These fish have large flowing dorsal and > > pectoral fins that are occassionly webbed at the > base. > > The poison these fish can inflict is shot out > through > > their venomous spines from the glands in the long > > grooves of their fins. Lionfish like an area where > > they can hang out like a crevice or cave. These > fish > > are nocturnal and prefer to hunt during nightime. > > > > Venomous: By purchasing this item you are aware > that > > it is poisonous and deadly > > > > very very different. > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > Firefish - aka Lionfish or Scorpionfish, if by > > > firefish she meant > > > another kind of fish then it was a > misunderstanding > > > - and i very > > > much do know what i am talking about before > posting > > > - maybe you > > > should get your facts straight and practise on > how > > > to talk to > > > another person. > > > > > > sandra > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > wrote: > > > > you need to get your facts straight before > posting > > > > something like that. > > > > 1. fire fish are NOt poisonous. > > > > 2. they only grow to about 3 inches and are > very > > > > skinny. > > > > 3. are not difficult to feed. > > > > 4. have a mouth so small that they could not > eat > > > > another fish! they are big around as a sharpie > at > > > the > > > > most. > > > > know what you are talking about before you > > > post!!!!!! > > > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sorry, just my opinion: > > > > > I wouldnt recommend buying a firefish for > such a > > > > > small system. Those > > > > > fishes can grow very large and may not even > be > > > able > > > > > to "turn around" > > > > > in a 30 something gallon aquarium. Besides > that > > > will > > > > > eat anything > > > > > that fits in their mouth, have a huge amount > of > > > > > bioload (will > > > > > contamine the water very fast unless she > does > > > water > > > > > changes VERY > > > > > often and has a very potent skimmer) and > other > > > than > > > > > that, getting > > > > > this fish to eat can be more difficult than > > > raising > > > > > a child.. oh > > > > > yeah, and are venemous... great fish and > very > > > hardy > > > > > but i wouldnt > > > > > say it´s for beginners with a small tank. > > > > > > > > > > sandra > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Valeen > > > Gonzalez > > > > > <valeendgonzalez@y...> wrote: > > > > > > i think a lot of gobies aren't that > aggressive > > > > > towards other > > > > > species of fish, but may be > > > > > > aggressive towards others of their own > > > species. so > > > > > if your friend > > > > > gets 1 goby it should be fine. > > > > > > that is, unless she happens to get another > > > species > > > > > of fish that is > > > > > aggressive and/or predatorial > > > > > > towards other species like some triggers > are > > > > > (maybe most triggers > > > > > lol). > > > > > > > > > > > > if she sticks with gobies like a watchman > or a > > > > > neon as rob > > > > > suggested, and got only other > > > > > > non-aggressive fish like false percs or > > > firefish, > > > > > she should be ok. > > > > > > > > > > > > --- agentscullyeyore@a... wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks i went to google and found them > are > > > all > > > > > gobies non > > > > > aggressive or just > > > > > > > that kind.. Shannon > > > > > > > > > > > > > > general names ===== false percula > clowns - > > > > > looks like nemo > > > > > > > and neon gobies. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > rob > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In a message dated 7/1/2005 10:29:55 AM > US > > > > > Eastern Standard > > > > > Time, > > > > > > > agentscullyeyore@a... writes: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks robbie.. i told her that it > was > > > small > > > > > but unlike > > > > > others she really > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > isn't listening to me... and what i > the > > > > > general name for > > > > > those fish do you > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > know... Shannon: > > > > > > > > === message truncated === __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12775	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk

Hi Paul (Helms), No, I realize you did not mention anything about buying water, but Paul N. Chung's reply (see below), who I was responding to, indicated buying a liter or four liters of marine water from your local fish store, to hatch brine shrimp "faster"(?). Yes, the set up you mentioned is very popular. Many hobbyists I know use an inverted 2 liter soda bottle, with the bottom cut out, and an airstone at the bottom (now the cap). This method works as well as a tilted gallon jar -- you just can't hatch as much eggs unless you use most of the bbs at the first feeding from this hatch (if you want to maintain hatching water quality). But for a normal hatch of one tsp of eggs in the 2 liter, this works fine. Depends how many fry you need to feed. If you're raising a lot of fry or several different batches of fry, its probably a lot less expensive in the long run to buy a small can of BS eggs and a box of Kosher Salt. Most hobbyists who consistently raise quantities of fry buy the shrimp eggs in 1 pound cans, but they can be purchased in a smaller 3.5 oz.can (or even smaller plastic vial). Caution here: Quite often these smaller quantities of shrimp eggs do not sell fast and may hang around the lfs for a time. Brine shrimp eggs tend to lose their viability over time, so these smaller quantities may not yield a good hatch rate if kept on the store shelf too long. Unless you know your lfs well, it may be best to have him special-order in a 3.5 oz. can rather than buying the vial size. After opening -- keep refrigerated. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms <wtfmorlok@y...> wrote: > i didn't say anything about buying water...i was just > metioning that there is another setup available cheap. > the one with the air pump and soda bottle works > great. the salt and eggs are in the pouch, so all you > need is distilled water and your airpump. the base > screws onto an inverted 2 liter soda bottle. > > --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > Paul, Depending upon the size of the fry, sometimes > > they are just > > too small when they are first free-swimming, to be > > able to handle > > newly hatched brine shrimp so something smaller has > > to be offered > > (such as strained egg yolk) for the first few days > > or up until the > > first week. Yes, if overfed egg yolk can make the > > water cloudy; I've > > cautioned about this in a previous recent post. > > There are also times > > when infusoria (or some similarly sized substitute) > > must be used as a > > first fry food, again as they may not be able to > > handle anything > > larger. As soon as bbs (baby brine shrimp) can be > > fed to the fry, > > it's an excellent food but needs to be hatched daily > > for best > > nutritional results. Therefore, its probably more > > convenient (and > > cheaper) to buy a box of Diamond Crystal Kosher salt > > to mix into > > solution at home for hatching bbs rather than buying > > marine water > > from a store. In that way you can mix a fresh new > > solution of salt > > water daily, as needed. Ray > > > > \ > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Paul N. Chung" > > <p_n_chung@y...> > > wrote: > > > Hey, > > > > > > Instead of choosing egg yolks, which can make your > > water cloudy. > > Why don't you try hatching Brine Shrimp? > > > > > > To make it hatch faster, buy from your local fish > > store, a liter or > > 4 liters of marine water, and have those brine > > shrimps "hatched." > > > > > > Brine shrimp is a good food for your fries ( baby > > fish ). Well, at > > least, smells better than having infusoria or > > microworms. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > If you mean, do fry eat strained hard-boiled egg > > yolk and that it > > > puts growth on them, then the answer is yes it > > "works"! You might > > > consider it the same only in as much as it is a > > "high protein fish > > > food". If you're looking for a comparison to some > > of the powdered > > > fry foods which have a high protein content these > > are good but > > > depending upon fry species, egg yolk is generally > > eaten more > > > readily. It is also digested and assimilated more > > easily and has a > > > much higher protein content (57%) not to mention > > the whole host of > > > readily available fresh vitamins (A, B6, B12, C, > > D, E, etc.) and > > > minerals (calcium, iron, magnesium, etc.), > > promoting much faster > > > growth. In general, vitamins in flake and/or > > powdered fish food is > > > generally lost with two months of its manufacture. > > Additionally, > > egg > > > yolk enables infusoria growth in the aquarium. > > The commercially > > > available product "Liquifry" is about as close as > > you can get as > > far > > > as an over-the-counter food. > > Ray > > > > > \ > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Nicolas Munro > > <nmunro@q...> > > wrote: > > > > Do the egg yolks really work??? > > > > > > > > Isn't that the same as feeding them a high > > protein fish food? ie > > > 43% or > > > > more. > > > > > > > > > > > > =Nick > > > > > > > > > > > > Cynthia brennemann wrote: > > > > > > > > >The water and air are at 80 degrees, the lid is > > down so there is > > > plenty > > > > >of humidity. So in two days start giving them > > their infusoria > > and > > > egg > > > > >yolk? Is that about the time the male betta > > will just give up > > and > > > stop > > > > >taking care of them, too? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respectfully Yours, > > > > > > Paul N. Chung > > > http://www.geocities.com/p_n_chung/index.html > > > > > > http://www.geocities.com/filipinofish/index.html > > > > > > http://filipinofish.tripod.com/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > > Do You Yahoo!? > > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > > protection around > > > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > Yahoo! Sports > Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football > http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12776	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: New to the forum

Rebecca, Your description (if accurate) of one of your female Guppies having a FUZZY white spot on it certainly indicates the presence of fungus on this fish, unless this white spot looks more like a grain of salt (in which case it would be Ich). If you're sure of this white spot being "fuzzy" (cotton-like), there is no need to treat the whole tank as fungus is not contagious, but usually specific to that fish which may have in some way received a wound of some sort. Such fish can be isolated to a quarantine tank and treated there. Fungus (still not contagious) can also affect the general population of the tank under poor environmental conditions). In that case you would have to correct the conditions of course and treat the whole tank. The flashing by your male Guppies could be caused by a variety of things. An excess bacteria population (usually seen as a cloudy haze) in the aquarium water is one cause. Water parameters outside of their proper living conditions (excess nitrites, etc.) can also cause them to flash as well as the onslaught of Ich even before the white spots appear, in which case the whole tank does need to be treated here as well. \ Fungus is often a secondary infection -- it feeds off of the dead cells of a wound already attacked by bacteria. With treating for fungus, the progressive salt treatment with the fish in the isolation tank usually affects a cure. The first day you sould add 2 tsps of Kosher salt per gallon, the next day another 2 tsps per gallon and the third day yet another 2 tsps per gallon (for a total of 6 tsps per gallon). Guppies can take up to 8 tsps Salt per gallon. A number of safe medicines will also cure the fungus, such as Furan II (by Aquarium Pharmaceuticals) and is a gram-negative/gram-positive acting bacticide as well getting to the root of the problem. Such a medication should be used if needed to treat the whole tank for this. \ Glad to hear your Loaches are doing better. Please note, for the future -- do not use ANY medications with your Loaches which may include any type of dye. Loaches are scale-less and as such, the dye penetrates their skin, slowly poisoning them. Rid-Ich is a medication which contains dye (ingredients are formaldahyde and malachite green - dye). I'd recommend doing another 25% (minumum) or more water change and adding fresh AC to your filter to eliminate this medication; do not continue to use the Rid-Ich. Yes, the formaldahyde in this medication will reek havoc with your nitrifying bacteria. You will probably have to endure going through at least a "mini-cycle" to re-establish your bacteria colonies, to get your nitrites back down. As plants can only use the nitrates (not nitrites) as food, added to them at this time will not help. \ Incidentally, if it turns out that the tank is also at the onset of Ich (manifested by the appearance of salt-like looking white spots), this disease can be treated with heat alone (86o) and does not need the addition of salt, even though it is most helpful and usually recommended -- but not in your case. \ By the way, you will find in time, that lying on their sides is a perfectly normal behavior for you Loaches (but doesn't sound like it at this time), so don't be alarmed if you see them do this at some future date provided that all is healthy. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > Hello there! I am relatively new to this hobby as I just started in > February :) I have a 10 gallon tank with 1 male betta, 2 rasboras, 3 > zebra danios, 1 oto, and 1 corydoras habrosus (searching for more > with no luck). > > I also have a 37 gallon with 1 albino bristlenose pleco, 2 botia > striata, now 1 oto (the other died last night), 4 adult guppies, and > 20 fry. > > I need help with my 37 gallon tank. I saw a fuzzy white spot on one > of my female guppies and the two males were flashing. Since loaches > are sensitive to salt, I decided to use rid-ich to treat the tank. > The directions say to do a 25% water change daily and dose daily for > 7 days. Yesterday was day 3. I did the water change, added the > meds, everything was fine. Then my oto died a few hours later and > one of my loaches was having a hard time swimming and kept drifting > over onto his side. So, we did an immediate water change to dilute > the medicine. I don't have any AC right now. > > This morning everyone seems fine. Active, eating, swimming > normally, etc. I took water readings this morning: ammonia 0, > nitrite .25 and nitrate 5-10. Do you think the meds may have > affected the biological filter? > > What do I do now? Put AC in my filter to draw out the meds? > Continue treatment for the remaining time? Or I read to just treat > the tank on days 1,4,7,10 with the rid-ich and do water changes > before I dose? How do I get my nitrites down? > > Any help is much appreciated, sorry to start out with so many > questions! > > Rebecca

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12777	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Vintage Aquariums -- Ornaments and more

As a follow-up to the thread on ceramic and other ornaments use in an aquarium, here is a site that was just mentioned to me by a friend that sells replicas of such ornaments used in aquaria years ago. From the home page of the site, " Our Ornaments sections contain wonderful handmade bronze decorative items, and bisque aquarium & fish bowl ornaments... mermaids, bathing beauties, divers, and more... ". Also has some videos of older air pumps that were used in aquaria way back when. One of the models is the Supreme Air-master, which I used to own, and I still own, and you can too, the Supreme Dynamaster, which is a two piston model based on the same design. Those suckers are rugged! http://www.vintageaquariums.com/ \\Steve// "The nice thing about standards is that there are so many of them to choose from." Andrew S. Tanenbaum, IT teacher, Vrije University, Netherlands

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12778	From: dreammaker2623	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: How long in hobby?

I have been in the hobby for over 50 years myself and have just moved into a new house. I have many hobies and hope to have time to answer questions in the future on this forum. If you go into a hundred aquarium stores and ask the same question you might get one hundred answers and they might all be right but if you mix parts of answers with other answers you might get a totally wrong answer.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12779	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: New to the forum

I have a question on one of you comments Ray... "Incidentally, if it turns out that the tank is also at the onset of Ich (manifested by the appearance of salt-like looking white spots), this disease can be treated with heat alone (86o) and does not need the addition of salt, even though it is most helpful and usually recommended -- but not in your case. " Increasing the temp quickens the lifecycle of ich and causes them to mature quicker. Don;t you also want to do something to destroy the adult ich so they do not infect other fish? Adding salt would accomplish this, right? "By the way, you will find in time, that lying on their sides is a perfectly normal behavior for you Loaches (but doesn't sound like it at this time), so don't be alarmed if you see them do this at some future date provided that all is healthy." I had a clown loach that I hope was dead. He died about a month after we got him and he was one of our first fish. One day I found him lying on his side in the tank, so I scooped him up and flushed him. I don;t remember seeing any gill activity, so I hope he was really dead and not just playing dead as they have a habit of doing hehehe... Eric [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12780	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: Vintage Aquariums -- Ornaments and more

That was pretty cool...thanks! Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2005 10:07 AM To: Aquatic Life Subject: [AquaticLife] Vintage Aquariums -- Ornaments and more As a follow-up to the thread on ceramic and other ornaments use in an aquarium, here is a site that was just mentioned to me by a friend that sells replicas of such ornaments used in aquaria years ago. From the home page of the site, " Our Ornaments sections contain wonderful handmade bronze decorative items, and bisque aquarium & fish bowl ornaments... mermaids, bathing beauties, divers, and more... ". Also has some videos of older air pumps that were used in aquaria way back when. One of the models is the Supreme Air-master, which I used to own, and I still own, and you can too, the Supreme Dynamaster, which is a two piston model based on the same design. Those suckers are rugged! http://www.vintageaquariums.com/ \\Steve// "The nice thing about standards is that there are so many of them to choose from." Andrew S. Tanenbaum, IT teacher, Vrije University, Netherlands Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12781	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: New to the forum

Eric, Normally, as I noted, you would want to add salt to help erradicate the Ich. There are times, with salt-sensitive fish, that salt cannot be used. In these circumstances, you rely on the heat alone. Yes indeed, the higher temperature causes the Ich to mature faster. As this high temperature increases the Ich's metabolism,it also has the effect of weakening the Ich. Lastly, at a temperature of 86o and over, Ich LOSES ITS ABILITY TO REPRODUCE, so as the old Ich cysts mature they die off and there are no new Ich cysts to re- infect the fish. This is why I've always emphasized raising the temperature to at least 86o -- not 84o or 85o (which will speed up the cycle), but 86o. \ Yeah, the antics of these Loaches can sure catch you off-guard! If you're not familiar with this behavior, for all intents and purposed you would think they're dead when they pull a stunt like this. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > I have a question on one of you comments Ray... > > "Incidentally, if it turns out that the tank is also at the onset of > Ich (manifested by the appearance of salt-like looking white spots), > this disease can be treated with heat alone (86o) and does not need > the addition of salt, even though it is most helpful and usually > recommended -- but not in your case. " > > Increasing the temp quickens the lifecycle of ich and causes them to mature > quicker. Don;t you also want to do something to destroy the adult ich so > they do not infect other fish? Adding salt would accomplish this, right? > > "By the way, you will find in time, that lying on their sides is a > perfectly normal behavior for you Loaches (but doesn't sound like it > at this time), so don't be alarmed if you see them do this at some > future date provided that all is healthy." > > I had a clown loach that I hope was dead. He died about a month after we > got him and he was one of our first fish. One day I found him lying on his > side in the tank, so I scooped him up and flushed him. I don;t remember > seeing any gill activity, so I hope he was really dead and not just playing > dead as they have a habit of doing hehehe... > > Eric > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12782	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: New to the forum

Cool..Thanks Ray! Eric [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12783	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: New to the forum

Eric, Your loach was dead. If he had just been playing dead as soon as you touched him with the net or any other object he would have darted back alive. I used to have( might still ) have a pic of a clown loach sleeping nose down over an ornament. I thaught for sure he was dead also. Once i touched the net to him he swam off like shot out of a cannon. rob In a message dated 7/3/2005 11:06:01 AM US Eastern Standard Time, sevenspringss@... writes: > I had a clown loach that I hope was dead. He died about a month > after we > > got him and he was one of our first fish. One day I found him > lying on his > > side in the tank, so I scooped him up and flushed him. I don;t > remember > > seeing any gill activity, so I hope he was really dead and not just > playing > > dead as they have a habit of doing hehehe... > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12784	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: New to the forum

Hey Rob! Fancy meeting you here :) I do have an easy to recognize name, don't I? Glad to see I chose a good forum if you are here! Thanks for all the replies, everyone! I chose rid-ich because I could not tell if it was ich or fungus and it treats both, as well as external parasites. It is also supposed to be safe for scale-less fish. The dot was more fuzzy than smooth, not salt like. No one else had spots, nor were there any other spots on the one female. I was afraid it was ich because of the males flashing. They have always flashed off and on, it just seemed more pronounced. Hmmm. I did not raise the temperature because I read it could cause more stress for fish that prefer lower temps (my tank is constant at 76F). It is hard not knowing what to do! I knew I could not add a large quantity of salt because of the types of fish in the tank. Since no one else has any spots and the spot on the female is gone, should I not treat the tank anymore, even for fungus? Just let things get back to normal? Put the AC in and do another WC? Or should I up the temp to 86, if so for how long? Everyone is swimming normally, eating, and as of last night we have 11 new guppy fry (total of 31 swimming around now). Thanks for all the help! Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, FortWayneFish@a... wrote: > Hi Rebecca :-) > your name looks familiar for some reason. > > rob > Indiana > USA > > AKA cichlid46816/corydorasworld.com > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12785	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: New to the forum

I agree. I know clown loaches like to rest on their sides but if he was alive, he definitely would have reacted to being touched! My loach was more like drunk swimming... swimming slowly and kind of out of control and when he stopped he would drift onto his side like he couldn't stay upright. Glad to say all seems normal now!! I even heard them click for the first time yesterday while eating :) --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, FortWayneFish@a... wrote: > Eric, > > Your loach was dead. > > If he had just been playing dead as soon as you touched him with the net or > any other object he would have darted back alive. > I used to have( might still ) have a pic of a clown loach sleeping nose down > over an ornament. I thaught for sure he was dead also. > Once i touched the net to him he swam off like shot out of a cannon. > > rob > > > > In a message dated 7/3/2005 11:06:01 AM US Eastern Standard Time, > sevenspringss@w... writes: > > > > I had a clown loach that I hope was dead. He died about a month > > after we > > > got him and he was one of our first fish. One day I found him > > lying on his > > > side in the tank, so I scooped him up and flushed him. I don;t > > remember > > > seeing any gill activity, so I hope he was really dead and not just > > playing > > > dead as they have a habit of doing hehehe... > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12786	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: Vintage Aquariums -- Ornaments and more

amazing how the hobby has progressed in the last 50 years isn't it... In a message dated 7/3/2005 10:08:48 AM US Eastern Standard Time, steve@... writes: > One of the models is the > Supreme Air-master, which I used to own, and I still own, and you can too, > the Supreme Dynamaster, which is a two piston model based on the same > design. Those suckers are rugged! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12787	From: paul helms	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

and? --- Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > I googled firefish, and 6th entry shows firefish as > _Pterois volitans_. The > site listed is an Australian site. Out of the first > 10 hits, One reference > to lionfish, and 3 to _Nemateleotris_ spp. I left > out the Chinese, Japanese, > and Korean scripts given as common names, as well as > those written in what I > think was Sanskrit or an Arabic character set. The > others were given as > names in the local dialects around the world. Of the > ones that I know enough > of the language to translate, I did not see a > reference to firefish, but > other names. Others here may be able to translate > some of the other names, > and may feel free to report what they mean in > English. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of paul helms > Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2005 7:19 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: setting up a new salt > water aquarium > > i did look it up and when you type in firefish in > the > web browser nothing comes up about lionfish. i also > went to several site to purchase fish...all had a > section called firefish, and what do you know > ....there was no lionfish there. only red and > purple > firefish along with their 200 dollar counterpart > helfrich. i have also been in the industry for 5 > years and have never heard ANYONE call a lionfish a > firefish. i have been in the hobby as an adult for > 14 > years, and also had fish as a child...again never > heard anyone call a firefish a lionfish or vice > versa. > all of the sites taht i have seen have not mentioned > anything to confuse the issue., but someone posted > something that looks like translations from an asian > dialect which does...but as far as i know the asian > dialect is not good for anything when it comes to > the > hoibby > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@...> wrote: > > > you can also look it up, anywhere you look for a > > firefish there will > > show up two species - the dartfish, and the > lionfish > > which some > > people call firefishes. > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > wrote: > > > firefish are not aka lionfish or scorpionfish. > a > > > lionfish is a lionfish ....try looking it up! > > > > > > The Firefish, a.k.a. Dartfish, is a magnificent > > little > > > fish that's perfect for reef tanks. These fish > > have a > > > white forebody and a "fiery" rearbody that is > > colored > > > in a mix of red colors. The Firefish also has an > > > elongated first dorsal spine that "jumps" up and > > down. > > > These little fish have lots of personality and > > should > > > be kept in a tank with lots of rockwork. The > > Firefish > > > likes lots of crevices, caves, and overhangs > where > > > they can "hang" in place. These fish prefer to > be > > kept > > > in pairs and do well in the home aquarium. They > > are > > > great for reef tanks and will accept most fish > > > foods.These fish are also jumpers, so > precautions > > > should be taken to secure openings at the top of > > the > > > aquarium > > > > > > The family of Lionfish is a group of fish that > are > > > world renowned for their beauty and ability to > > inflict > > > pain. These fish have large flowing dorsal and > > > pectoral fins that are occassionly webbed at the > > base. > > > The poison these fish can inflict is shot out > > through > > > their venomous spines from the glands in the > long > > > grooves of their fins. Lionfish like an area > where > > > they can hang out like a crevice or cave. These > > fish > > > are nocturnal and prefer to hunt during > nightime. > > > > > > Venomous: By purchasing this item you are aware > > that > > > it is poisonous and deadly > > > > > > very very different. > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > Firefish - aka Lionfish or Scorpionfish, if by > > > > firefish she meant > > > > another kind of fish then it was a > > misunderstanding > > > > - and i very > > > > much do know what i am talking about before > > posting > > > > - maybe you > > > > should get your facts straight and practise on > > how > > > > to talk to > > > > another person. > > > > > > > > sandra > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > > wrote: > > > > > you need to get your facts straight before > > posting > > > > > something like that. > > > > > 1. fire fish are NOt poisonous. > > > > > 2. they only grow to about 3 inches and are > > very > > > > > skinny. > > > > > 3. are not difficult to feed. > > > > > 4. have a mouth so small that they could > not > > eat > > > > > another fish! they are big around as a > sharpie > > at > > > > the > > > > > most. > > > > > know what you are talking about before you > > > > post!!!!!! > > > > > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sorry, just my opinion: > > > > > > I wouldnt recommend buying a firefish for > > such a > > > > > > small system. Those > > > > > > fishes can grow very large and may not > even > > be > > > > able > > > > > > to "turn around" > > > > > > in a 30 something gallon aquarium. Besides > > that > > > > will > > > > > > eat anything > > > > > > that fits in their mouth, have a huge > amount > > of > > > > > > bioload (will > > > > > > contamine the water very fast unless she > > does > > > > water > > > > > > changes VERY > > > > > > often and has a very potent skimmer) and > > other > > > > than > > > > > > that, getting > > > > > > this fish to eat can be more difficult > than > > > > raising > > > > > > a child.. oh > > > > > > yeah, and are venemous... great fish and > > very > > > > hardy > > > > > > but i wouldnt > > > > > > say it´s for beginners with a small tank. > > > > > > > > > > > > sandra > > > > > > > === message truncated === ____________________________________________________ Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12788	From: paul helms	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk

lol too many paul's --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote: > Hi Paul (Helms), No, I realize you did not mention > anything about > buying water, but Paul N. Chung's reply (see below), > who I was > responding to, indicated buying a liter or four > liters of marine > water from your local fish store, to hatch brine > shrimp "faster"(?). > Yes, the set up you mentioned is very popular. Many > hobbyists I know > use an inverted 2 liter soda bottle, with the bottom > cut out, and an > airstone at the bottom (now the cap). This method > works as well as > a tilted gallon jar -- you just can't hatch as much > eggs unless you > use most of the bbs at the first feeding from this > hatch (if you want > to maintain hatching water quality). But for a > normal hatch of one > tsp of eggs in the 2 liter, this works fine. > Depends how many fry > you need to feed. If you're raising a lot of fry or > several > different batches of fry, its probably a lot less > expensive in the > long run to buy a small can of BS eggs and a box of > Kosher Salt. > Most hobbyists who consistently raise quantities of > fry buy the > shrimp eggs in 1 pound cans, but they can be > purchased in a smaller > 3.5 oz.can (or even smaller plastic vial). Caution > here: Quite > often these smaller quantities of shrimp eggs do not > sell fast and > may hang around the lfs for a time. Brine shrimp > eggs tend to lose > their viability over time, so these smaller > quantities may not yield > a good hatch rate if kept on the store shelf too > long. Unless you > know your lfs well, it may be best to have him > special-order in a 3.5 > oz. can rather than buying the vial size. After > opening -- keep > refrigerated. Ray > \ > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > <wtfmorlok@y...> wrote: > > i didn't say anything about buying water...i was > just > > metioning that there is another setup available > cheap. > > the one with the air pump and soda bottle works > > great. the salt and eggs are in the pouch, so all > you > > need is distilled water and your airpump. the > base > > screws onto an inverted 2 liter soda bottle. > > > > --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > > > Paul, Depending upon the size of the fry, > sometimes > > > they are just > > > too small when they are first free-swimming, to > be > > > able to handle > > > newly hatched brine shrimp so something smaller > has > > > to be offered > > > (such as strained egg yolk) for the first few > days > > > or up until the > > > first week. Yes, if overfed egg yolk can make > the > > > water cloudy; I've > > > cautioned about this in a previous recent post. > > > There are also times > > > when infusoria (or some similarly sized > substitute) > > > must be used as a > > > first fry food, again as they may not be able to > > > handle anything > > > larger. As soon as bbs (baby brine shrimp) can > be > > > fed to the fry, > > > it's an excellent food but needs to be hatched > daily > > > for best > > > nutritional results. Therefore, its probably > more > > > convenient (and > > > cheaper) to buy a box of Diamond Crystal Kosher > salt > > > to mix into > > > solution at home for hatching bbs rather than > buying > > > marine water > > > from a store. In that way you can mix a fresh > new > > > solution of salt > > > water daily, as needed. Ray > > > > > > > \ > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Paul N. > Chung" > > > <p_n_chung@y...> > > > wrote: > > > > Hey, > > > > > > > > Instead of choosing egg yolks, which can make > your > > > water cloudy. > > > Why don't you try hatching Brine Shrimp? > > > > > > > > To make it hatch faster, buy from your local > fish > > > store, a liter or > > > 4 liters of marine water, and have those brine > > > shrimps "hatched." > > > > > > > > Brine shrimp is a good food for your fries ( > baby > > > fish ). Well, at > > > least, smells better than having infusoria or > > > microworms. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > > If you mean, do fry eat strained hard-boiled > egg > > > yolk and that it > > > > puts growth on them, then the answer is yes it > > > "works"! You might > > > > consider it the same only in as much as it is > a > > > "high protein fish > > > > food". If you're looking for a comparison to > some > > > of the powdered > > > > fry foods which have a high protein content > these > > > are good but > > > > depending upon fry species, egg yolk is > generally > > > eaten more > > > > readily. It is also digested and assimilated > more > > > easily and has a > > > > much higher protein content (57%) not to > mention > > > the whole host of > > > > readily available fresh vitamins (A, B6, B12, > C, > > > D, E, etc.) and > > > > minerals (calcium, iron, magnesium, etc.), > > > promoting much faster > > > > growth. In general, vitamins in flake and/or > > > powdered fish food is > > > > generally lost with two months of its > manufacture. > > > Additionally, > > > egg > > > > yolk enables infusoria growth in the aquarium. > > > > The commercially > > > > available product "Liquifry" is about as close > as > > > you can get as > > > far > > > > as an over-the-counter food. > > > Ray > > > > > > > \ > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Nicolas > Munro > > > <nmunro@q...> > > > wrote: > > > > > Do the egg yolks really work??? > > > > > > > > > > Isn't that the same as feeding them a high > > > protein fish food? ie > > > > 43% or > > > > > more. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > =Nick > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Cynthia brennemann wrote: > > > > > > === message truncated === ____________________________________________________ Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12789	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: Vintage Aquariums -- Ornaments and more

If you would like to look even further back, try http://parlouraquariums.org.uk A site that talks not only of the state of the hobby way back in the mid 1800's but also of the people behind the scenes. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of FortWayneFish@... Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2005 1:54 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Vintage Aquariums -- Ornaments and more amazing how the hobby has progressed in the last 50 years isn't it... In a message dated 7/3/2005 10:08:48 AM US Eastern Standard Time, steve@... writes: > One of the models is the > Supreme Air-master, which I used to own, and I still own, and you can too, > the Supreme Dynamaster, which is a two piston model based on the same > design. Those suckers are rugged! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12790	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: Vintage Aquariums -- Ornaments and more

In my search for knowledge i have aquired a few aquarium books ( magazines ) back from the 50's60's and 70's its amazing at some of the products, and atitudes back then compared to now. I will cruise http://parlouraquariums.org.uk thanks for the sight look forward to some intresting views on fish keeping. In a message dated 7/3/2005 1:16:32 PM US Eastern Standard Time, steve@... writes: > If you would like to look even further back, try > http://parlouraquariums.org.uk A site that talks not only of the state of > the hobby way back in the mid 1800's but also of the people behind the > scenes. > > \\Steve// > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12791	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk

maybe we should use email addresses ( scientific names ) when refering from person to person ( common name ), Might be less confusing :-) Wow I think I have seen that recommendation sompleace before in a slightly diffrent content.. LOL Rob Indiana USA In a message dated 7/3/2005 1:13:54 PM US Eastern Standard Time, wtfmorlok@... writes: > lol too many paul's [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12792	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: New to the forum

What was funny is I did not know about his behavior until afterwards...so you could just imagine the look on mine and my gf's face when we read about it heheheh. I am almost positive that he was dead too...but you still have that nagging worry that he wasn't hehehe. My queen loach will bury itself head first in the gravel with the back half sticking out like he crashed (presumably digging for the tiny ramshorn snail I have in my gravel). They are odd fish for sure *grin* The other one that have similarly disturbing behavior are my spiny eels. They like to hang limply from mount for my heater (when my heater is not in). They look like a dead plant just hanging there. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of FortWayneFish@... Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2005 11:51 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: New to the forum Eric, Your loach was dead. If he had just been playing dead as soon as you touched him with the net or any other object he would have darted back alive. I used to have( might still ) have a pic of a clown loach sleeping nose down over an ornament. I thaught for sure he was dead also. Once i touched the net to him he swam off like shot out of a cannon. rob In a message dated 7/3/2005 11:06:01 AM US Eastern Standard Time, sevenspringss@... writes: > I had a clown loach that I hope was dead. He died about a month > after we > > got him and he was one of our first fish. One day I found him > lying on his > > side in the tank, so I scooped him up and flushed him. I don;t > remember > > seeing any gill activity, so I hope he was really dead and not just > playing > > dead as they have a habit of doing hehehe... > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12793	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: Vintage Aquariums -- Ornaments and more

says you have to have a sn and password to view it.. shannon: If you would like to look even further back, try http://parlouraquariums.org.uk A site that talks not only of the state of the hobby way back in the mid 1800's but also of the people behind the scenes. \\Steve// [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12794	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: Vintage Aquariums -- Ornaments and more

Hi Shannon, Can't figure why you're having problems, while getting this message about sn and password. Maybe you should try it again. I just tried it after seeing your message and went right up to the site, no problems. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, agentscullyeyore@a... wrote: > > says you have to have a sn and password to view it.. shannon: > > If you would like to look even further back, try > http://parlouraquariums.org.uk A site that talks not only of the state of > the hobby way back in the mid 1800's but also of the people behind the > scenes. > > \\Steve// > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12795	From: Bruce Hansen	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: How long in hobby?

You must be about the same vintage as me Steve - only in my case it was my Mum that kept the fish, my Dad was a "birdman". Cheers Bruce (Hansen) ANGFA (Qld) Inc - http://www.angfaqld.org.au/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steve Szabo" <steve@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2005 9:10 PM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] How long in hobby? > I've been in, around, about the hobby for more than 50 years. This does > include some periods, like my time away at a private high school, where I > was not keeping fish, but still reading about them, and of course, my > father > still had tanks at home. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of FortWayneFish@... > Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2005 12:14 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] How long in hobby? > > I am celebrating my 15th year in the hobby this year and was wondering if > this group has more "Old timers" or more of a new attitude. > > Curious... I'd post a poll but it says poll option not available > > And in a few peoples cases you can reply with decades in hobby LOL > > rob > 15yrs > Indiana > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12796	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

You had said, "i did look it up and when you type in firefish in the web browser nothing comes up about lionfish." apparently in reply to Sandra's, "you can also look it up, anywhere you look for a firefish there will show up two species - the dartfish, and the lionfish which some people call firefishes.". I took that to mean you did a search and did not find any references to lionfish in your results. So, I googled firefish, i.e. a web search, and easily found a reference to lionfish in the first ten responses. I also felt I would be remiss if I did not report the results of the returned first ten results. I don't know what you used to search the web, but, it appears, that it is not difficult to find references to lionfish. Just for ha-has, I just did another search using the search engine Scirus (http://www.scirus.com) and the first 10 results have three direct references to lion fish (one _Pterois miles_ and two _P. volitans_) and one _Nemateleotris decora_ which is not a lionfish but, I believe, a goby. Two entries did not distinguish the species in the description, but one was not a lionfish, the other was. The other five entries were of something else entirely, not fish. In another part of my reply, about languages, was in reply to what Sandra had said. However, using foreign languages in my original post on the topic was merely to reinforce the point I was making, since I was able to translate some of the languages, and others here may be able to translate others. The point there was that using common names to describe fish is hopelessly confusing, for the most part, and probably not the means that should be used to describe fish, unless there is a single source used for the common names. For a handy reference on the Internet that everyone could freely access, I'd suggest looking at http://www.fishbase.org, because they list an accepted common name for each species they cover. While it may not be the fastest site on the web, it certainly covers the information we are discussing here. \\Steve// P.S. While experience does count, a certain minimal effort put forth in researching a topic beyond personal experience is normally warranted in a discussion such as this. I can claim a lot of experience here also. I can also say that I do not recall a time when I have heard anyone refer to a lionfish as a firefish, and certainly could have said so prior to this. However, a few quick searches have shown me how far off base I would have been having said so. Helfrichs' dartfish, which you seem to refer to in your post, is not found on any of my searches on firefish, and while you could claim you did not mention it as a firefish, it certainly seems to be inferred in your post. scs -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of paul helms Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2005 2:12 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium and? --- Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > I googled firefish, and 6th entry shows firefish as > _Pterois volitans_. The > site listed is an Australian site. Out of the first > 10 hits, One reference > to lionfish, and 3 to _Nemateleotris_ spp. I left > out the Chinese, Japanese, > and Korean scripts given as common names, as well as > those written in what I > think was Sanskrit or an Arabic character set. The > others were given as > names in the local dialects around the world. Of the > ones that I know enough > of the language to translate, I did not see a > reference to firefish, but > other names. Others here may be able to translate > some of the other names, > and may feel free to report what they mean in > English. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of paul helms > Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2005 7:19 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: setting up a new salt > water aquarium > > i did look it up and when you type in firefish in > the > web browser nothing comes up about lionfish. i also > went to several site to purchase fish...all had a > section called firefish, and what do you know > ....there was no lionfish there. only red and > purple > firefish along with their 200 dollar counterpart > helfrich. i have also been in the industry for 5 > years and have never heard ANYONE call a lionfish a > firefish. i have been in the hobby as an adult for > 14 > years, and also had fish as a child...again never > heard anyone call a firefish a lionfish or vice > versa. > all of the sites taht i have seen have not mentioned > anything to confuse the issue., but someone posted > something that looks like translations from an asian > dialect which does...but as far as i know the asian > dialect is not good for anything when it comes to > the > hoibby > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@...> wrote: > > > you can also look it up, anywhere you look for a > > firefish there will > > show up two species - the dartfish, and the > lionfish > > which some > > people call firefishes. > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > wrote: > > > firefish are not aka lionfish or scorpionfish. > a > > > lionfish is a lionfish ....try looking it up! > > > > > > The Firefish, a.k.a. Dartfish, is a magnificent > > little > > > fish that's perfect for reef tanks. These fish > > have a > > > white forebody and a "fiery" rearbody that is > > colored > > > in a mix of red colors. The Firefish also has an > > > elongated first dorsal spine that "jumps" up and > > down. > > > These little fish have lots of personality and > > should > > > be kept in a tank with lots of rockwork. The > > Firefish > > > likes lots of crevices, caves, and overhangs > where > > > they can "hang" in place. These fish prefer to > be > > kept > > > in pairs and do well in the home aquarium. They > > are > > > great for reef tanks and will accept most fish > > > foods.These fish are also jumpers, so > precautions > > > should be taken to secure openings at the top of > > the > > > aquarium > > > > > > The family of Lionfish is a group of fish that > are > > > world renowned for their beauty and ability to > > inflict > > > pain. These fish have large flowing dorsal and > > > pectoral fins that are occassionly webbed at the > > base. > > > The poison these fish can inflict is shot out > > through > > > their venomous spines from the glands in the > long > > > grooves of their fins. Lionfish like an area > where > > > they can hang out like a crevice or cave. These > > fish > > > are nocturnal and prefer to hunt during > nightime. > > > > > > Venomous: By purchasing this item you are aware > > that > > > it is poisonous and deadly > > > > > > very very different. > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > Firefish - aka Lionfish or Scorpionfish, if by > > > > firefish she meant > > > > another kind of fish then it was a > > misunderstanding > > > > - and i very > > > > much do know what i am talking about before > > posting > > > > - maybe you > > > > should get your facts straight and practise on > > how > > > > to talk to > > > > another person. > > > > > > > > sandra > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > > wrote: > > > > > you need to get your facts straight before > > posting > > > > > something like that. > > > > > 1. fire fish are NOt poisonous. > > > > > 2. they only grow to about 3 inches and are > > very > > > > > skinny. > > > > > 3. are not difficult to feed. > > > > > 4. have a mouth so small that they could > not > > eat > > > > > another fish! they are big around as a > sharpie > > at > > > > the > > > > > most. > > > > > know what you are talking about before you > > > > post!!!!!! > > > > > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sorry, just my opinion: > > > > > > I wouldnt recommend buying a firefish for > > such a > > > > > > small system. Those > > > > > > fishes can grow very large and may not > even > > be > > > > able > > > > > > to "turn around" > > > > > > in a 30 something gallon aquarium. Besides > > that > > > > will > > > > > > eat anything > > > > > > that fits in their mouth, have a huge > amount > > of > > > > > > bioload (will > > > > > > contamine the water very fast unless she > > does > > > > water > > > > > > changes VERY > > > > > > often and has a very potent skimmer) and > > other > > > > than > > > > > > that, getting > > > > > > this fish to eat can be more difficult > than > > > > raising > > > > > > a child.. oh > > > > > > yeah, and are venemous... great fish and > > very > > > > hardy > > > > > > but i wouldnt > > > > > > say it´s for beginners with a small tank. > > > > > > > > > > > > sandra > > > > > > > === message truncated === ____________________________________________________ Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12797	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: Vintage Aquariums -- Ornaments and more

No password that I recall. Just clicked on the link below and it took me right in. You might wish to edit the link and add www to it, which it looks like I neglected to put in. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of agentscullyeyore@... Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2005 5:06 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Vintage Aquariums -- Ornaments and more says you have to have a sn and password to view it.. shannon: If you would like to look even further back, try http://parlouraquariums.org.uk A site that talks not only of the state of the hobby way back in the mid 1800's but also of the people behind the scenes. \\Steve// [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12798	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: How long in hobby?

Bruce, My mother was more the encourager than the keeper of anything (other than trying to keep us kids more or less in line <g>). She encouraged us to follow where ever our minds led us, though she did draw the line at illegal <G>. Now both parents are busy spending our inheritance on running around the globe visiting the great sites and museums of the world, as well as taking various courses in various parts of this country to learn new things. Go get 'em Mom and Dad! \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Bruce Hansen Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2005 5:59 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] How long in hobby? You must be about the same vintage as me Steve - only in my case it was my Mum that kept the fish, my Dad was a "birdman". Cheers Bruce (Hansen) ANGFA (Qld) Inc - http://www.angfaqld.org.au/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steve Szabo" <steve@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2005 9:10 PM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] How long in hobby? > I've been in, around, about the hobby for more than 50 years. This does > include some periods, like my time away at a private high school, where I > was not keeping fish, but still reading about them, and of course, my > father > still had tanks at home. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of FortWayneFish@... > Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2005 12:14 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] How long in hobby? > > I am celebrating my 15th year in the hobby this year and was wondering if > this group has more "Old timers" or more of a new attitude. > > Curious... I'd post a poll but it says poll option not available > > And in a few peoples cases you can reply with decades in hobby LOL > > rob > 15yrs > Indiana > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12799	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

i agree with paul. i think you may be thinking of something other than a firefish, sandra. firefish are not venemous, don't get large, certainly are not picky eaters and don't contribute more of a bioload than say maybe a clown. so you can see if you're thinking of a different fish than we are, here's a link to an orange firefish: http://www.saltwaterfish.com/site_11_03/product_info.php?products_id=243&parent_category=4&category_search=61&root_parent_id=4&PHPSESSID=fb48e7378bcc5dbd5910cf4105c39c3f paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: you need to get your facts straight before posting something like that. 1. fire fish are NOt poisonous. 2. they only grow to about 3 inches and are very skinny. 3. are not difficult to feed. 4. have a mouth so small that they could not eat another fish! they are big around as a sharpie at the most. know what you are talking about before you post!!!!!! --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@...> wrote: > > Sorry, just my opinion: > I wouldnt recommend buying a firefish for such a > small system. Those > fishes can grow very large and may not even be able > to "turn around" > in a 30 something gallon aquarium. Besides that will > eat anything > that fits in their mouth, have a huge amount of > bioload (will > contamine the water very fast unless she does water > changes VERY > often and has a very potent skimmer) and other than > that, getting > this fish to eat can be more difficult than raising > a child.. oh > yeah, and are venemous... great fish and very hardy > but i wouldnt > say it´s for beginners with a small tank. > > sandra > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Valeen Gonzalez > <valeendgonzalez@y...> wrote: > > i think a lot of gobies aren't that aggressive > towards other > species of fish, but may be > > aggressive towards others of their own species. so > if your friend > gets 1 goby it should be fine. > > that is, unless she happens to get another species > of fish that is > aggressive and/or predatorial > > towards other species like some triggers are > (maybe most triggers > lol). > > > > if she sticks with gobies like a watchman or a > neon as rob > suggested, and got only other > > non-aggressive fish like false percs or firefish, > she should be ok. > > > > --- agentscullyeyore@a... wrote: > > > > > > > > thanks i went to google and found them are all > gobies non > aggressive or just > > > that kind.. Shannon > > > > > > general names ===== false percula clowns - > looks like nemo > > > and neon gobies. > > > > > > rob > > > > > > In a message dated 7/1/2005 10:29:55 AM US > Eastern Standard > Time, > > > agentscullyeyore@a... writes: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks robbie.. i told her that it was small > but unlike > others she really > > > > > > > isn't listening to me... and what i the > general name for > those fish do you > > > > > > > know... Shannon: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > > I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > ____________________________________________________ Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12800	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

i mean a firefish goby, definitely not a lionfish!!!!!!!!! Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@...> wrote:Firefish - aka Lionfish or Scorpionfish, if by firefish she meant another kind of fish then it was a misunderstanding - and i very much do know what i am talking about before posting - maybe you should get your facts straight and practise on how to talk to another person. sandra --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms <wtfmorlok@y...> wrote: > you need to get your facts straight before posting > something like that. > 1. fire fish are NOt poisonous. > 2. they only grow to about 3 inches and are very > skinny. > 3. are not difficult to feed. > 4. have a mouth so small that they could not eat > another fish! they are big around as a sharpie at the > most. > know what you are talking about before you post!!!!!! > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > Sorry, just my opinion: > > I wouldnt recommend buying a firefish for such a > > small system. Those > > fishes can grow very large and may not even be able > > to "turn around" > > in a 30 something gallon aquarium. Besides that will > > eat anything > > that fits in their mouth, have a huge amount of > > bioload (will > > contamine the water very fast unless she does water > > changes VERY > > often and has a very potent skimmer) and other than > > that, getting > > this fish to eat can be more difficult than raising > > a child.. oh > > yeah, and are venemous... great fish and very hardy > > but i wouldnt > > say it´s for beginners with a small tank. > > > > sandra > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Valeen Gonzalez > > <valeendgonzalez@y...> wrote: > > > i think a lot of gobies aren't that aggressive > > towards other > > species of fish, but may be > > > aggressive towards others of their own species. so > > if your friend > > gets 1 goby it should be fine. > > > that is, unless she happens to get another species > > of fish that is > > aggressive and/or predatorial > > > towards other species like some triggers are > > (maybe most triggers > > lol). > > > > > > if she sticks with gobies like a watchman or a > > neon as rob > > suggested, and got only other > > > non-aggressive fish like false percs or firefish, > > she should be ok. > > > > > > --- agentscullyeyore@a... wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > thanks i went to google and found them are all > > gobies non > > aggressive or just > > > > that kind.. Shannon > > > > > > > > general names ===== false percula clowns - > > looks like nemo > > > > and neon gobies. > > > > > > > > rob > > > > > > > > In a message dated 7/1/2005 10:29:55 AM US > > Eastern Standard > > Time, > > > > agentscullyeyore@a... writes: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks robbie.. i told her that it was small > > but unlike > > others she really > > > > > > > > > isn't listening to me... and what i the > > general name for > > those fish do you > > > > > > > > > know... Shannon: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > > > I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > Yahoo! Sports > Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football > http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12801	From: paul helms	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

yes helfrich is a firefish...and that is what i was implying. simply that those were the only three things to be purchased as firefish where i looked --- Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > You had said, "i did look it up and when you type > in firefish in the web > browser nothing comes up about lionfish." apparently > in reply to Sandra's, > "you can also look it up, anywhere you look for a > firefish there will show > up two species - the dartfish, and the lionfish > which some people call > firefishes.". I took that to mean you did a search > and did not find any > references to lionfish in your results. So, I > googled firefish, i.e. a web > search, and easily found a reference to lionfish in > the first ten responses. > I also felt I would be remiss if I did not report > the results of the > returned first ten results. > > I don't know what you used to search the web, but, > it appears, that it is > not difficult to find references to lionfish. Just > for ha-has, I just did > another search using the search engine Scirus > (http://www.scirus.com) and > the first 10 results have three direct references to > lion fish (one _Pterois > miles_ and two _P. volitans_) and one _Nemateleotris > decora_ which is not a > lionfish but, I believe, a goby. Two entries did not > distinguish the species > in the description, but one was not a lionfish, the > other was. The other > five entries were of something else entirely, not > fish. > > In another part of my reply, about languages, was in > reply to what Sandra > had said. However, using foreign languages in my > original post on the topic > was merely to reinforce the point I was making, > since I was able to > translate some of the languages, and others here may > be able to translate > others. The point there was that using common names > to describe fish is > hopelessly confusing, for the most part, and > probably not the means that > should be used to describe fish, unless there is a > single source used for > the common names. For a handy reference on the > Internet that everyone could > freely access, I'd suggest looking at > http://www.fishbase.org, because they > list an accepted common name for each species they > cover. While it may not > be the fastest site on the web, it certainly covers > the information we are > discussing here. > > \\Steve// > > P.S. While experience does count, a certain minimal > effort put forth in > researching a topic beyond personal experience is > normally warranted in a > discussion such as this. I can claim a lot of > experience here also. I can > also say that I do not recall a time when I have > heard anyone refer to a > lionfish as a firefish, and certainly could have > said so prior to this. > However, a few quick searches have shown me how far > off base I would have > been having said so. Helfrichs' dartfish, which you > seem to refer to in your > post, is not found on any of my searches on > firefish, and while you could > claim you did not mention it as a firefish, it > certainly seems to be > inferred in your post. scs > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of paul helms > Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2005 2:12 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: setting up a new salt > water aquarium > > and? > > --- Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > > > I googled firefish, and 6th entry shows firefish > as > > _Pterois volitans_. The > > site listed is an Australian site. Out of the > first > > 10 hits, One reference > > to lionfish, and 3 to _Nemateleotris_ spp. I left > > out the Chinese, Japanese, > > and Korean scripts given as common names, as well > as > > those written in what I > > think was Sanskrit or an Arabic character set. The > > others were given as > > names in the local dialects around the world. Of > the > > ones that I know enough > > of the language to translate, I did not see a > > reference to firefish, but > > other names. Others here may be able to translate > > some of the other names, > > and may feel free to report what they mean in > > English. > > > > \\Steve// > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of paul helms > > Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2005 7:19 AM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: setting up a new > salt > > water aquarium > > > > i did look it up and when you type in firefish in > > the > > web browser nothing comes up about lionfish. i > also > > went to several site to purchase fish...all had a > > section called firefish, and what do you know > > ....there was no lionfish there. only red and > > purple > > firefish along with their 200 dollar counterpart > > helfrich. i have also been in the industry for 5 > > years and have never heard ANYONE call a lionfish > a > > firefish. i have been in the hobby as an adult > for > > 14 > > years, and also had fish as a child...again never > > heard anyone call a firefish a lionfish or vice > > versa. > > all of the sites taht i have seen have not > mentioned > > anything to confuse the issue., but someone posted > > something that looks like translations from an > asian > > dialect which does...but as far as i know the > asian > > dialect is not good for anything when it comes to > > the > > hoibby > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@...> wrote: > > > > > you can also look it up, anywhere you look for a > > > firefish there will > > > show up two species - the dartfish, and the > > lionfish > > > which some > > > people call firefishes. > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > wrote: > > > > firefish are not aka lionfish or scorpionfish. > > > a > > > > lionfish is a lionfish ....try looking it up! > > > > > > > > The Firefish, a.k.a. Dartfish, is a > magnificent > > > little > > > > fish that's perfect for reef tanks. These fish > > > have a > > > > white forebody and a "fiery" rearbody that is > > > colored > > > > in a mix of red colors. The Firefish also has > an > > > > elongated first dorsal spine that "jumps" up > and > > > down. > > > > These little fish have lots of personality and > > > should > > > > be kept in a tank with lots of rockwork. The > > > Firefish > > > > likes lots of crevices, caves, and overhangs > > where > > > > they can "hang" in place. These fish prefer to > > be > > > kept > > > > in pairs and do well in the home aquarium. > They > > > are > > > > great for reef tanks and will accept most fish > === message truncated === ____________________________________________________ Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12802	From: Sandra	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

*applauds* --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > You had said, "i did look it up and when you type in firefish in the web > browser nothing comes up about lionfish." apparently in reply to Sandra's, > "you can also look it up, anywhere you look for a firefish there will show > up two species - the dartfish, and the lionfish which some people call > firefishes.". I took that to mean you did a search and did not find any > references to lionfish in your results. So, I googled firefish, i.e. a web > search, and easily found a reference to lionfish in the first ten responses. > I also felt I would be remiss if I did not report the results of the > returned first ten results. > > I don't know what you used to search the web, but, it appears, that it is > not difficult to find references to lionfish. Just for ha-has, I just did > another search using the search engine Scirus (http://www.scirus.com) and > the first 10 results have three direct references to lion fish (one _Pterois > miles_ and two _P. volitans_) and one _Nemateleotris decora_ which is not a > lionfish but, I believe, a goby. Two entries did not distinguish the species > in the description, but one was not a lionfish, the other was. The other > five entries were of something else entirely, not fish. > > In another part of my reply, about languages, was in reply to what Sandra > had said. However, using foreign languages in my original post on the topic > was merely to reinforce the point I was making, since I was able to > translate some of the languages, and others here may be able to translate > others. The point there was that using common names to describe fish is > hopelessly confusing, for the most part, and probably not the means that > should be used to describe fish, unless there is a single source used for > the common names. For a handy reference on the Internet that everyone could > freely access, I'd suggest looking at http://www.fishbase.org, because they > list an accepted common name for each species they cover. While it may not > be the fastest site on the web, it certainly covers the information we are > discussing here. > > \\Steve// > > P.S. While experience does count, a certain minimal effort put forth in > researching a topic beyond personal experience is normally warranted in a > discussion such as this. I can claim a lot of experience here also. I can > also say that I do not recall a time when I have heard anyone refer to a > lionfish as a firefish, and certainly could have said so prior to this. > However, a few quick searches have shown me how far off base I would have > been having said so. Helfrichs' dartfish, which you seem to refer to in your > post, is not found on any of my searches on firefish, and while you could > claim you did not mention it as a firefish, it certainly seems to be > inferred in your post. scs > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of paul helms > Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2005 2:12 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium > > and? > > --- Steve Szabo <steve@l...> wrote: > > > I googled firefish, and 6th entry shows firefish as > > _Pterois volitans_. The > > site listed is an Australian site. Out of the first > > 10 hits, One reference > > to lionfish, and 3 to _Nemateleotris_ spp. I left > > out the Chinese, Japanese, > > and Korean scripts given as common names, as well as > > those written in what I > > think was Sanskrit or an Arabic character set. The > > others were given as > > names in the local dialects around the world. Of the > > ones that I know enough > > of the language to translate, I did not see a > > reference to firefish, but > > other names. Others here may be able to translate > > some of the other names, > > and may feel free to report what they mean in > > English. > > > > \\Steve// > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of paul helms > > Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2005 7:19 AM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: setting up a new salt > > water aquarium > > > > i did look it up and when you type in firefish in > > the > > web browser nothing comes up about lionfish. i also > > went to several site to purchase fish...all had a > > section called firefish, and what do you know > > ....there was no lionfish there. only red and > > purple > > firefish along with their 200 dollar counterpart > > helfrich. i have also been in the industry for 5 > > years and have never heard ANYONE call a lionfish a > > firefish. i have been in the hobby as an adult for > > 14 > > years, and also had fish as a child...again never > > heard anyone call a firefish a lionfish or vice > > versa. > > all of the sites taht i have seen have not mentioned > > anything to confuse the issue., but someone posted > > something that looks like translations from an asian > > dialect which does...but as far as i know the asian > > dialect is not good for anything when it comes to > > the > > hoibby > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > you can also look it up, anywhere you look for a > > > firefish there will > > > show up two species - the dartfish, and the > > lionfish > > > which some > > > people call firefishes. > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > wrote: > > > > firefish are not aka lionfish or scorpionfish. > > a > > > > lionfish is a lionfish ....try looking it up! > > > > > > > > The Firefish, a.k.a. Dartfish, is a magnificent > > > little > > > > fish that's perfect for reef tanks. These fish > > > have a > > > > white forebody and a "fiery" rearbody that is > > > colored > > > > in a mix of red colors. The Firefish also has an > > > > elongated first dorsal spine that "jumps" up and > > > down. > > > > These little fish have lots of personality and > > > should > > > > be kept in a tank with lots of rockwork. The > > > Firefish > > > > likes lots of crevices, caves, and overhangs > > where > > > > they can "hang" in place. These fish prefer to > > be > > > kept > > > > in pairs and do well in the home aquarium. They > > > are > > > > great for reef tanks and will accept most fish > > > > foods.These fish are also jumpers, so > > precautions > > > > should be taken to secure openings at the top of > > > the > > > > aquarium > > > > > > > > The family of Lionfish is a group of fish that > > are > > > > world renowned for their beauty and ability to > > > inflict > > > > pain. These fish have large flowing dorsal and > > > > pectoral fins that are occassionly webbed at the > > > base. > > > > The poison these fish can inflict is shot out > > > through > > > > their venomous spines from the glands in the > > long > > > > grooves of their fins. Lionfish like an area > > where > > > > they can hang out like a crevice or cave. These > > > fish > > > > are nocturnal and prefer to hunt during > > nightime. > > > > > > > > Venomous: By purchasing this item you are aware > > > that > > > > it is poisonous and deadly > > > > > > > > very very different. > > > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Firefish - aka Lionfish or Scorpionfish, if by > > > > > firefish she meant > > > > > another kind of fish then it was a > > > misunderstanding > > > > > - and i very > > > > > much do know what i am talking about before > > > posting > > > > > - maybe you > > > > > should get your facts straight and practise on > > > how > > > > > to talk to > > > > > another person. > > > > > > > > > > sandra > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > you need to get your facts straight before > > > posting > > > > > > something like that. > > > > > > 1. fire fish are NOt poisonous. > > > > > > 2. they only grow to about 3 inches and are > > > very > > > > > > skinny. > > > > > > 3. are not difficult to feed. > > > > > > 4. have a mouth so small that they could > > not > > > eat > > > > > > another fish! they are big around as a > > sharpie > > > at > > > > > the > > > > > > most. > > > > > > know what you are talking about before you > > > > > post!!!!!! > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sorry, just my opinion: > > > > > > > I wouldnt recommend buying a firefish for > > > such a > > > > > > > small system. Those > > > > > > > fishes can grow very large and may not > > even > > > be > > > > > able > > > > > > > to "turn around" > > > > > > > in a 30 something gallon aquarium. Besides > > > that > > > > > will > > > > > > > eat anything > > > > > > > that fits in their mouth, have a huge > > amount > > > of > > > > > > > bioload (will > > > > > > > contamine the water very fast unless she > > > does > > > > > water > > > > > > > changes VERY > > > > > > > often and has a very potent skimmer) and > > > other > > > > > than > > > > > > > that, getting > > > > > > > this fish to eat can be more difficult > > than > > > > > raising > > > > > > > a child.. oh > > > > > > > yeah, and are venemous... great fish and > > > very > > > > > hardy > > > > > > > but i wouldnt > > > > > > > say it´s for beginners with a small tank. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sandra > > > > > > > > > > === message truncated === > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > Yahoo! Sports > Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football > http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12803	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: Vintage Aquariums -- Ornaments and more

hey thanks ray i did it again and it worked... Shannon Hi Shannon, Can't figure why you're having problems, while getting this message about sn and password. Maybe you should try it again. I just tried it after seeing your message and went right up to the site, no problems. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, agentscullyeyore@a... wrote: > > says you have to have a sn and password to view it.. shannon: > > If you would like to look even further back, try > http://parlouraquariums.org.uk A site that talks not only of the state of > the hobby way back in the mid 1800's but also of the people behind the [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12804	From: paul helms	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

applauds what? you are still wrong. even the guy with 50 years in the hobby says he never heard of it called a lionfish. just because he has the time to go to 20 web searches to find others calling them the wrong thing does not mean a damn thing. i did not google or go to anything of teh wall. go to saltwaterfish.com and there will be a section of firefish.. lions and scorpions will not be there. flat out, make sure you are talking about the same thing as everyone else when you decide to tell a beginner that one of the few fish that will actually work in the tank they have is venemous and deadly, especially when several others are recommending it. --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@...> wrote: > *applauds* > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" > <steve@l...> wrote: > > You had said, "i did look it up and when you type > in firefish in > the web > > browser nothing comes up about lionfish." > apparently in reply to > Sandra's, > > "you can also look it up, anywhere you look for a > firefish there > will show > > up two species - the dartfish, and the lionfish > which some people > call > > firefishes.". I took that to mean you did a search > and did not > find any > > references to lionfish in your results. So, I > googled firefish, > i.e. a web > > search, and easily found a reference to lionfish > in the first ten > responses. > > I also felt I would be remiss if I did not report > the results of > the > > returned first ten results. > > > > I don't know what you used to search the web, but, > it appears, > that it is > > not difficult to find references to lionfish. Just > for ha-has, I > just did > > another search using the search engine Scirus > (http://www.scirus.com) and > > the first 10 results have three direct references > to lion fish > (one _Pterois > > miles_ and two _P. volitans_) and one > _Nemateleotris decora_ which > is not a > > lionfish but, I believe, a goby. Two entries did > not distinguish > the species > > in the description, but one was not a lionfish, > the other was. The > other > > five entries were of something else entirely, not > fish. > > > > In another part of my reply, about languages, was > in reply to what > Sandra > > had said. However, using foreign languages in my > original post on > the topic > > was merely to reinforce the point I was making, > since I was able to > > translate some of the languages, and others here > may be able to > translate > > others. The point there was that using common > names to describe > fish is > > hopelessly confusing, for the most part, and > probably not the > means that > > should be used to describe fish, unless there is a > single source > used for > > the common names. For a handy reference on the > Internet that > everyone could > > freely access, I'd suggest looking at > http://www.fishbase.org, > because they > > list an accepted common name for each species they > cover. While it > may not > > be the fastest site on the web, it certainly > covers the > information we are > > discussing here. > > > > \\Steve// > > > > P.S. While experience does count, a certain > minimal effort put > forth in > > researching a topic beyond personal experience is > normally > warranted in a > > discussion such as this. I can claim a lot of > experience here > also. I can > > also say that I do not recall a time when I have > heard anyone > refer to a > > lionfish as a firefish, and certainly could have > said so prior to > this. > > However, a few quick searches have shown me how > far off base I > would have > > been having said so. Helfrichs' dartfish, which > you seem to refer > to in your > > post, is not found on any of my searches on > firefish, and while > you could > > claim you did not mention it as a firefish, it > certainly seems to > be > > inferred in your post. scs > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of paul helms > > Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2005 2:12 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: setting up a new > salt water aquarium > > > > and? > > > > --- Steve Szabo <steve@l...> wrote: > > > > > I googled firefish, and 6th entry shows firefish > as > > > _Pterois volitans_. The > > > site listed is an Australian site. Out of the > first > > > 10 hits, One reference > > > to lionfish, and 3 to _Nemateleotris_ spp. I > left > > > out the Chinese, Japanese, > > > and Korean scripts given as common names, as > well as > > > those written in what I > > > think was Sanskrit or an Arabic character set. > The > > > others were given as > > > names in the local dialects around the world. Of > the > > > ones that I know enough > > > of the language to translate, I did not see a > > > reference to firefish, but > > > other names. Others here may be able to > translate > > > some of the other names, > > > and may feel free to report what they mean in > > > English. > > > > > > \\Steve// > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > Behalf Of paul helms > > > Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2005 7:19 AM > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: setting up a new > salt > > > water aquarium > > > > > > i did look it up and when you type in firefish > in > > > the > > > web browser nothing comes up about lionfish. i > also > > > went to several site to purchase fish...all had > a > > > section called firefish, and what do you know > > > ....there was no lionfish there. only red and > > > purple > > > firefish along with their 200 dollar counterpart > > > helfrich. i have also been in the industry for > 5 > > > years and have never heard ANYONE call a > lionfish a > > > firefish. i have been in the hobby as an adult > for > > > 14 > > > years, and also had fish as a child...again > never > > > heard anyone call a firefish a lionfish or vice > > > versa. > > > all of the sites taht i have seen have not > mentioned > > > anything to confuse the issue., but someone > posted > > > something that looks like translations from an > asian > > > dialect which does...but as far as i know the > asian > > > dialect is not good for anything when it comes > to > === message truncated === __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12805	From: ahorseofcourse66	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Need help with spots on inside of tank?

Hi, I bought a 20 gallon setup from my dad. The tank has been stored for about a year. We cleaned it good and the tank looked great. We set it up and put tap water, the water treatment and aqui. salt in the tank and the filter and let it run for acouple of days. On the secound day we noticed it looked like it had water spots on the inside. The spots got worse over the next few days. So we emptied the tank and cleaned it with CLR and then The WORKS. Rinsed and rinsed to make sure the tank was clean and then wipped it out so there would be no water spots on the inside. Same thing happened the second time, tank looked great 2 days later hard water looking spots on the inside that you can only scratch off with your finger nail... What can I use to get read of the spots. I don't even know whats causing them, muchless how to get read of them. I don't want to trash the tank but the spots are really really bad, on all 4 sides.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12806	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Brine shrimp

Hi all. I am considering raising brine shrimp and was just wondering if there were any suggestions on where to get info. on care. Just seems that it would be less expensive and more nutritious for the fry and fish to have the "real thing" then the brine shrimp pellets I have been feeding them. MM & MP, '73 Tricia, KG6PNC If you want to make friends world wide click the link below!! One catch it is not a program that is supported buy windows 98 yet http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12807	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: Brine shrimp

Tricia, Try << www.brineshrimpdirect.com >> and go to FAQ's. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Tricia Wilkerson" <trycya@g...> wrote: > Hi all. > I am considering raising brine shrimp and was just wondering if there were any suggestions on where to get info. on care. Just seems that it would be less expensive and more nutritious for the fry and fish to have the "real thing" then the brine shrimp pellets I have been feeding them. > MM & MP, '73 > Tricia, KG6PNC > > If you want to make friends world wide click the link below!! One catch it is not a program that is supported buy windows 98 yet > > http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12808	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: Brine shrimp

San Francisco Bay Shrimp Company offers a few cool solutions. They have one that is a black box with a hole on the top where you insert a container with a hole in the lid. As the shrimp hatch (they provide packets of eggs that also have enough salt to make the water at the right salinity) they swim through the hole in the cap into the freshwater in the container. The freshwater(in he container) and the saltwater(in the box) do not mix as the saltwater is heavier. They make a similar setup that also uses a 2 liter bottle. They have a 3rd setup that you put on the side of your tank. As the shrimp hatch, they will swim into your tank. I also saw a setup online that I am currently experimenting with. I took a 10 gallon tank and partitioned it off with a opaque black divider. I put black cardboard on the sides on 1/2 of the tank and theft the other 1\2 open. I also put a piece of black opaque plastic over the darkened 1/2 of the tank. The partition has a small hole in the center to allow the shrimp to swim out. You put the eggs in the dark 1/2 and the theory is that the shrimp will swim towards the light and go into the open side of the tank. The idea is that you will have shrimp on one side and eggs in the other so you are not scooping up eggs when you are harvesting shrimp. I will let you know how it goes as well as post some pics. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Tricia Wilkerson Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2005 8:09 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Brine shrimp Hi all. I am considering raising brine shrimp and was just wondering if there were any suggestions on where to get info. on care. Just seems that it would be less expensive and more nutritious for the fry and fish to have the "real thing" then the brine shrimp pellets I have been feeding them. MM & MP, '73 Tricia, KG6PNC If you want to make friends world wide click the link below!! One catch it is not a program that is supported buy windows 98 yet http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12809	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: Brine shrimp

from what I have read they (brine shrimp) eat algae? so would I feed them the algae wafers crumbled up? MM & MP, '73 Tricia, KG6PNC If you want to make friends world wide click the link below!! One catch it is not a program that is supported buy windows 98 yet http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12810	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: How long in hobby?

Sorry, I'm only a newbie 7 months old but have been pretty serious about it now running CO2 [bakers yeast] and aquatic plants. =Nick FortWayneFish@... wrote: >I am celebrating my 15th year in the hobby this year and was wondering if >this group has more "Old timers" or more of a new attitude. > >Curious... I'd post a poll but it says poll option not available > >And in a few peoples cases you can reply with decades in hobby LOL > >rob >15yrs >Indiana > > >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks >. >Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12811	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

Paul, TWO web searches, not twenty. One at the most popular search site, and the other at a scientific search engine. If you really want to be particular, three searches, since my original search on the name was done at fishbase.org. Yep, 50 years and never been more than at the fringe of the marine hobby, having read some the articles about the fish and most of the articles about the hardware since many of the marine people published are at the bleeding edge of the hardware stuff, much of which has filtered down to the freshwater area. I have never claimed to be anything but a novice or worse when it comes to marine. The searches I have done show that there are a lot of people out there that call lionfish of various species some sort of firefish. The also call a certain type of goby that is also called a firefish. This is simply the crux of the issue, there is no standard for common names. This is what had led a certain individual to post warning about "firefish" meaning the lion or scorpionfish (another name for lionfish), which would have been perfectly acceptable if everyone was speaking about the same fish. That individual fell into the quagmire of common names. There is really no need to get upset about the whole thing. If I had the time, I may have actually gone to several sites that list fish for sale to see what they are calling what, but fish dealers will go with the name of the moment, or the name they feel has more commercial potential, rather than trying to keep order in the scheme of common names. Being in the business, as you claim, you should have learned that fact early on. I've had dealers try to explain away misnaming fish saying that is what they got them in as and other such excuses in the past, but, if that name sells the fish better, they'll explain it away for someone who knows better, and keep on selling the fish under that name. I've been trying to recall it all day, and have not had success, but there is a listing of common names used by scientists (yes, scientists use common names also) which should be a good resource. If I can come up with it before this thread dies, I'll post it, otherwise I'll bookmark it, as I am sure it is online somewhere, should this type of discussion occur again. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of paul helms Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2005 8:53 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium applauds what? you are still wrong. even the guy with 50 years in the hobby says he never heard of it called a lionfish. just because he has the time to go to 20 web searches to find others calling them the wrong thing does not mean a damn thing. i did not google or go to anything of teh wall. go to saltwaterfish.com and there will be a section of firefish.. lions and scorpions will not be there. flat out, make sure you are talking about the same thing as everyone else when you decide to tell a beginner that one of the few fish that will actually work in the tank they have is venemous and deadly, especially when several others are recommending it. --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@...> wrote: > *applauds* > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" > <steve@l...> wrote: > > You had said, "i did look it up and when you type > in firefish in > the web > > browser nothing comes up about lionfish." > apparently in reply to > Sandra's, > > "you can also look it up, anywhere you look for a > firefish there > will show > > up two species - the dartfish, and the lionfish > which some people > call > > firefishes.". I took that to mean you did a search > and did not > find any > > references to lionfish in your results. So, I > googled firefish, > i.e. a web > > search, and easily found a reference to lionfish > in the first ten > responses. > > I also felt I would be remiss if I did not report > the results of > the > > returned first ten results. > > > > I don't know what you used to search the web, but, > it appears, > that it is > > not difficult to find references to lionfish. Just > for ha-has, I > just did > > another search using the search engine Scirus > (http://www.scirus.com) and > > the first 10 results have three direct references > to lion fish > (one _Pterois > > miles_ and two _P. volitans_) and one > _Nemateleotris decora_ which > is not a > > lionfish but, I believe, a goby. Two entries did > not distinguish > the species > > in the description, but one was not a lionfish, > the other was. The > other > > five entries were of something else entirely, not > fish. > > > > In another part of my reply, about languages, was > in reply to what > Sandra > > had said. However, using foreign languages in my > original post on > the topic > > was merely to reinforce the point I was making, > since I was able to > > translate some of the languages, and others here > may be able to > translate > > others. The point there was that using common > names to describe > fish is > > hopelessly confusing, for the most part, and > probably not the > means that > > should be used to describe fish, unless there is a > single source > used for > > the common names. For a handy reference on the > Internet that > everyone could > > freely access, I'd suggest looking at > http://www.fishbase.org, > because they > > list an accepted common name for each species they > cover. While it > may not > > be the fastest site on the web, it certainly > covers the > information we are > > discussing here. > > > > \\Steve// > > > > P.S. While experience does count, a certain > minimal effort put > forth in > > researching a topic beyond personal experience is > normally > warranted in a > > discussion such as this. I can claim a lot of > experience here > also. I can > > also say that I do not recall a time when I have > heard anyone > refer to a > > lionfish as a firefish, and certainly could have > said so prior to > this. > > However, a few quick searches have shown me how > far off base I > would have > > been having said so. Helfrichs' dartfish, which > you seem to refer > to in your > > post, is not found on any of my searches on > firefish, and while > you could > > claim you did not mention it as a firefish, it > certainly seems to > be > > inferred in your post. scs > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of paul helms > > Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2005 2:12 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: setting up a new > salt water aquarium > > > > and? > > > > --- Steve Szabo <steve@l...> wrote: > > > > > I googled firefish, and 6th entry shows firefish > as > > > _Pterois volitans_. The > > > site listed is an Australian site. Out of the > first > > > 10 hits, One reference > > > to lionfish, and 3 to _Nemateleotris_ spp. I > left > > > out the Chinese, Japanese, > > > and Korean scripts given as common names, as > well as > > > those written in what I > > > think was Sanskrit or an Arabic character set. > The > > > others were given as > > > names in the local dialects around the world. Of > the > > > ones that I know enough > > > of the language to translate, I did not see a > > > reference to firefish, but > > > other names. Others here may be able to > translate > > > some of the other names, > > > and may feel free to report what they mean in > > > English. > > > > > > \\Steve// > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > Behalf Of paul helms > > > Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2005 7:19 AM > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: setting up a new > salt > > > water aquarium > > > > > > i did look it up and when you type in firefish > in > > > the > > > web browser nothing comes up about lionfish. i > also > > > went to several site to purchase fish...all had > a > > > section called firefish, and what do you know > > > ....there was no lionfish there. only red and > > > purple > > > firefish along with their 200 dollar counterpart > > > helfrich. i have also been in the industry for > 5 > > > years and have never heard ANYONE call a > lionfish a > > > firefish. i have been in the hobby as an adult > for > > > 14 > > > years, and also had fish as a child...again > never > > > heard anyone call a firefish a lionfish or vice > > > versa. > > > all of the sites taht i have seen have not > mentioned > > > anything to confuse the issue., but someone > posted > > > something that looks like translations from an > asian > > > dialect which does...but as far as i know the > asian > > > dialect is not good for anything when it comes > to > === message truncated ===

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12812	From: Patrick	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

I googled firefish and the first 10 links had one with about "firefish aka lionfish". It is amazing how many wrong people there are out there! One person sees one person's wrong information and copies it over and over. It was clear from the search (and my very limited knowledge of sw fish) that a lionfish is Captain Picard's pet while a firefish is a small goby. I can't even see why a lionfish would be called a fire fish, it looks nothing like a fire. The firefish goby does look like a flame. :) Patrick [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12813	From: Sandra	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

ilmao... whatever floats your boat ... --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms <wtfmorlok@y...> wrote: > applauds what? you are still wrong. even the guy with > 50 years in the hobby says he never heard of it called > a lionfish. just because he has the time to go to 20 > web searches to find others calling them the wrong > thing does not mean a damn thing. i did not google or > go to anything of teh wall. go to saltwaterfish.com > and there will be a section of firefish.. lions and > scorpions will not be there. flat out, make sure you > are talking about the same thing as everyone else when > you decide to tell a beginner that one of the few fish > that will actually work in the tank they have is > venemous and deadly, especially when several others > are recommending it. > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > *applauds* > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" > > <steve@l...> wrote: > > > You had said, "i did look it up and when you type > > in firefish in > > the web > > > browser nothing comes up about lionfish." > > apparently in reply to > > Sandra's, > > > "you can also look it up, anywhere you look for a > > firefish there > > will show > > > up two species - the dartfish, and the lionfish > > which some people > > call > > > firefishes.". I took that to mean you did a search > > and did not > > find any > > > references to lionfish in your results. So, I > > googled firefish, > > i.e. a web > > > search, and easily found a reference to lionfish > > in the first ten > > responses. > > > I also felt I would be remiss if I did not report > > the results of > > the > > > returned first ten results. > > > > > > I don't know what you used to search the web, but, > > it appears, > > that it is > > > not difficult to find references to lionfish. Just > > for ha-has, I > > just did > > > another search using the search engine Scirus > > (http://www.scirus.com) and > > > the first 10 results have three direct references > > to lion fish > > (one _Pterois > > > miles_ and two _P. volitans_) and one > > _Nemateleotris decora_ which > > is not a > > > lionfish but, I believe, a goby. Two entries did > > not distinguish > > the species > > > in the description, but one was not a lionfish, > > the other was. The > > other > > > five entries were of something else entirely, not > > fish. > > > > > > In another part of my reply, about languages, was > > in reply to what > > Sandra > > > had said. However, using foreign languages in my > > original post on > > the topic > > > was merely to reinforce the point I was making, > > since I was able to > > > translate some of the languages, and others here > > may be able to > > translate > > > others. The point there was that using common > > names to describe > > fish is > > > hopelessly confusing, for the most part, and > > probably not the > > means that > > > should be used to describe fish, unless there is a > > single source > > used for > > > the common names. For a handy reference on the > > Internet that > > everyone could > > > freely access, I'd suggest looking at > > http://www.fishbase.org, > > because they > > > list an accepted common name for each species they > > cover. While it > > may not > > > be the fastest site on the web, it certainly > > covers the > > information we are > > > discussing here. > > > > > > \\Steve// > > > > > > P.S. While experience does count, a certain > > minimal effort put > > forth in > > > researching a topic beyond personal experience is > > normally > > warranted in a > > > discussion such as this. I can claim a lot of > > experience here > > also. I can > > > also say that I do not recall a time when I have > > heard anyone > > refer to a > > > lionfish as a firefish, and certainly could have > > said so prior to > > this. > > > However, a few quick searches have shown me how > > far off base I > > would have > > > been having said so. Helfrichs' dartfish, which > > you seem to refer > > to in your > > > post, is not found on any of my searches on > > firefish, and while > > you could > > > claim you did not mention it as a firefish, it > > certainly seems to > > be > > > inferred in your post. scs > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > Behalf Of paul helms > > > Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2005 2:12 PM > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: setting up a new > > salt water aquarium > > > > > > and? > > > > > > --- Steve Szabo <steve@l...> wrote: > > > > > > > I googled firefish, and 6th entry shows firefish > > as > > > > _Pterois volitans_. The > > > > site listed is an Australian site. Out of the > > first > > > > 10 hits, One reference > > > > to lionfish, and 3 to _Nemateleotris_ spp. I > > left > > > > out the Chinese, Japanese, > > > > and Korean scripts given as common names, as > > well as > > > > those written in what I > > > > think was Sanskrit or an Arabic character set. > > The > > > > others were given as > > > > names in the local dialects around the world. Of > > the > > > > ones that I know enough > > > > of the language to translate, I did not see a > > > > reference to firefish, but > > > > other names. Others here may be able to > > translate > > > > some of the other names, > > > > and may feel free to report what they mean in > > > > English. > > > > > > > > \\Steve// > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > > Behalf Of paul helms > > > > Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2005 7:19 AM > > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: setting up a new > > salt > > > > water aquarium > > > > > > > > i did look it up and when you type in firefish > > in > > > > the > > > > web browser nothing comes up about lionfish. i > > also > > > > went to several site to purchase fish...all had > > a > > > > section called firefish, and what do you know > > > > ....there was no lionfish there. only red and > > > > purple > > > > firefish along with their 200 dollar counterpart > > > > helfrich. i have also been in the industry for > > 5 > > > > years and have never heard ANYONE call a > > lionfish a > > > > firefish. i have been in the hobby as an adult > > for > > > > 14 > > > > years, and also had fish as a child...again > > never > > > > heard anyone call a firefish a lionfish or vice > > > > versa. > > > > all of the sites taht i have seen have not > > mentioned > > > > anything to confuse the issue., but someone > > posted > > > > something that looks like translations from an > > asian > > > > dialect which does...but as far as i know the > > asian > > > > dialect is not good for anything when it comes > > to > > > === message truncated === > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12814	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: Brine shrimp

supposedly ;-) another suggestion is to take some of the water and put it into a sunny spot to create "green water" and put that in your brine shrimp tank. You can also put a pinch of bakers yeast in the water for them. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Tricia Wilkerson Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2005 9:22 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: Brine shrimp from what I have read they (brine shrimp) eat algae? so would I feed them the algae wafers crumbled up? MM & MP, '73 Tricia, KG6PNC If you want to make friends world wide click the link below!! One catch it is not a program that is supported buy windows 98 yet http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12815	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: Need help with spots on inside of tank?

My first thought is diatoms, but they usually manifest in green or brown spots on the glass or other objects in the aquarium. However, you day they look like hard water spots, which I generally visualize as being whitish. Diatoms need a source of silicone, usually in the form of a silicate, to be viable in an aquarium. If you are using silica sand, then they may be the culprit. If they are diatoms, they can usually be wiped off the glass without much effort. Once an aquarium is established, they do not pose much of a problem, unless there is a steady source of silicate for them to utilize. A bit more information would be helpful. How have you cleaned the tank? Have you placed any substrate into it yet? The test results of your tap water. Things like that. A more descriptive section of exactly what the spots look like and how long it is before they start to appear. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of ahorseofcourse66 Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2005 1:51 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Need help with spots on inside of tank? Hi, I bought a 20 gallon setup from my dad. The tank has been stored for about a year. We cleaned it good and the tank looked great. We set it up and put tap water, the water treatment and aqui. salt in the tank and the filter and let it run for acouple of days. On the secound day we noticed it looked like it had water spots on the inside. The spots got worse over the next few days. So we emptied the tank and cleaned it with CLR and then The WORKS. Rinsed and rinsed to make sure the tank was clean and then wipped it out so there would be no water spots on the inside. Same thing happened the second time, tank looked great 2 days later hard water looking spots on the inside that you can only scratch off with your finger nail... What can I use to get read of the spots. I don't even know whats causing them, muchless how to get read of them. I don't want to trash the tank but the spots are really really bad, on all 4 sides. Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12816	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk

I tried a Google search for San Francisco Shrimp Company but didn't notice anything that stood out. I like this idea of the shrimp free swimming into the aquarium. Sounds like less hassle and i think my tiger barbs would love it to. Can tiger barbs and guppies eat bbs shrimp? =Nick paul helms wrote: >they also sell a kit for 20 dollars taht hangs off the >back of the tank, using your tank water and teh >shrimpo swim into the tank as they hatch. the eggs >are sold in glass jars also by sf brine shrimp. they >hatch in 24-48 hours and swim in as a steady source of >food > > >--- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > > > >>San Francisco Shrimp Company sells a nifty brine >>hatchery that includes a >>black box for the saltwater and eggs. It has a hole >>on the top where you >>put another container, that has a small hole in the >>cap, in. You fill this >>container with fresh water. The fresh water stays >>on top, since the >>saltwater is heavier (according to the >>instructions). The brine shrimp will >>swim up through the hole in the cap and into the >>fresh water as they are >>attracted to the light. IT works great. SSC >>provides packets that contain >>the right amount of salt and eggs for each batch for >>this set up. You can >>also buy the packets separately. >> >>I also found a cool solution for a more sustained >>production of brine >>shrimp. Take a small aquarium (I used a 10 gal) and >>cover 1/2 of it with a >>dark, opaque material (I painted a box black and cut >>the cardboard to the >>size I needed to cover the the tank sides.)...or >>paint the glass black. >>Also make a solid divider (obviously this has to be >>made of plastic as it >>will be submerged) and partition off the tank in 2. >>This partition will >>also need a small hole to let the shrimp swim out >>(similar to the concept >>above). What this does is it keeps the eggs and the >>shrimp separate. What >>they also suggested is to take a bit of uplift >>tubing and run an airline >>(without an airistone) in it to create some surface >>turbulence and water >>flow. The reason they say not to use an airstone is >>that the shrimp have >>pockets that the tiny air bubbles can get trapped >>in, causing the shrimp to >>be stuck on the surface and starve. I haven't >>started this setup as I am >>letting the silicon caulking dry before I fill it up >>with water. I'll let >>you know how this works. >> >>Eric >> >> >> _____ >> >>From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com >>[mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On >>Behalf Of Ray Wetzel >>Sent: Friday, July 01, 2005 10:43 AM >>To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com >>Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg >>Yolk >> >> >>Yeah, I do remember "Sea Monkeys" -- what a gimmick. >> For those who >>were not already familiar with brine shrimp, not >>being in the >>tropical fish hobby, I'm sure they expected >>something entirely >>different especially going by the pictures they used >>to advertise >>with. Actually, hatching them isn't really that >>hard, if you want to >>try it. You can buy hatching cones made of thin >>plastic or you can >>use old gallon jars (preferably tilted off center) >>with an air stone >>at the bottom. Different sources of brine shrimp >>eggs require >>slightly different salt solutions, but in general >>you use about 6 tbp >>of Kosher salt per gallon and if you're tilting the >>jar as you should >>be doing, you'll be using about 3/4 gallon of water >>-- so you'll use >>4 1/2 tbp of salt. Depending upon the temperature >>(should be about >>80o), they'll hatch in about 24 - 30 hours, at which >>time you remove >>the airstone, let it sit a few minutes, and drain >>(with small plastic >>hose) the shrimp through a linen handkerchief using >>an empty gallon >>jar and returning that water when you're done. >>About 1/4 tsp of >>brine shrimp eggs should be enough for several >>feedings for your >>fry. I use 5 gallon carboys (twice a day) with >>about 3 tsps (or >>more) of eggs depending upon what I have going at >>the time. You >>should consider using at least two jars to rotate >>them every day so >>you constantly have a new batch. Ray >> >>\ >> >>--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Evita >><evitabug@y...> wrote: >> >> >>>Thanks Ray I will check it out. Heh, remember Sea >>> >>> >>Monkeys or are >>you too young. I had to get some when I was a kid. >>They didn't turn >>out to look anything like the pictures. HA! Evita >> >> >>>Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: Evita, >>> >>> >>Glad to hear your >>fry are thriving. Yeah, with the right >> >> >>>amount of finger pressure flake food can be >>> >>> >>pulverized almost to a >> >> >>>powder (at least very fine) and as you've found >>> >>> >>out is a good first >> >> >>>food for small fry if they take it. although maybe >>> >>> >>not quite as >> >> >>>nutritious as other options. With your feeding >>> >>> >>them 4-5 times a >>day, >> >> >>>it sounds like they're doing just fine. You might >>> >>> >>want to consider >> >> >>>hatching baby brine shrimp, at least for one or >>> >>> >>two of those daily >> >> >>>feedings as they may grow faster yet, even though >>> >>> >>powdered food is >>more >> >> >>>convenient -- and they will get better color. >>> >>> >>Ray >> >> >>\ >> >> >> >> >>> >>> >>>--------------------------------- >>>Discover Yahoo! >>> Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news & >>> >>> >>more. Check it >>out! >> >> >>>[Non-text portions of this message have been >>> >>> >>removed] >> >> >> >> >>Please delete this line and everything below it when >>replying, thanks >>. >>Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text >>that is not important to >>the reply and if changing the topic of the original >>message modify the >>subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old >>subject)" <-, we Thank You >>in Advance for your help in this matter >> >> >> >> _____ >> >>YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS >> >> >> >>* Visit your group "AquaticLife >><http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the >>web. >> >> >>* To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: >> AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com >> >> >> ><mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > >> >> >>* Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the >>Yahoo! Terms of Service >><http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . >> >> >> _____ >> >> >> >> >>[Non-text portions of this message have been >>removed] >> >> >> >> > > >__________________________________________________ >Do You Yahoo!? >Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around >http://mail.yahoo.com > > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks >. >Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12818	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk

I'm sad now :-( The reason i started this post was cause I've had 12 baby guppies for about a month now and decided they looked big enough to put into the community aquarium. So i put one in the community aquarium to try. It swam and avoided two guppies then wham! tiger barb action, no more guppy :-( So I figured I had better not put any more in. Latter that evening i was experimenting with a pH solution in a small container inside a jam jar so there was only a air gap between the concentrated pH solution and the water. Apparently the pH solution was supposed to change color with a change in CO2 concentration in the water, which it did - but thats another post. Any ways whilst all this was going on I put the jam jar which contained the smaller jar into the Guppy breeder being careful not to squish the guppie babys, and left it over night. The metal must have bent under pressure over time and the next morning TO MY HORROR i found only one baby guppy remained, the rest had swam out over the edge of the guppy breeder tank which was now under water. and before I realized I needed to act, wham! a sword tail eats the one remaining baby guppy. poor me. not happy, all my baby guppies are gone. So, my question to you is how long does it take for a guppy to get big enough to survive on its own without being eaten whilst eating this super special high protein egg yolk diet? =Nick

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12819	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: New poll for AquaticLife

Enter your vote today! A new poll has been created for the AquaticLife group: How long have you been in the Hobby? o Newbie ( less then 1 year ) o 1-3 years o 3-5 years o 5-10 years o 10-15 years o 15-20 years o 20-50 years o 50+ Years To vote, please visit the following web page: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/surveys?id=1722965 Note: Please do not reply to this message. Poll votes are not collected via email. To vote, you must go to the Yahoo! Groups web site listed above. Thanks!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12820	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk

Nick, Luckily Guppies breed like guppies. You will have more babies soon as long as you have at least one adult male and female. I think most of us have done more or less the same thing. I lost a whole batch ( 100+ ) bristlenose babies the other day. I seperated the tank with a divider, knowing the BN babies could swim through it but figuered That they would stay on there side at least over night. make a long story short my divider wasn't propt up or fastened. The cichlids easily knocked it over and got to the babies. I wasn't thinking....I usually prop a couple Tall decorations on either side of the egg crate for support. but I had a dumb @## attack and spaced it. As far as how long..depends. Fish rule: If it fits in the mouth it is food. Rule initiated by Mother Nature 1000's of years ago. I know I know I was No help Rob Indiana In a message dated 7/3/2005 10:38:36 PM US Eastern Standard Time, nmunro@... writes: > > The metal must have bent under pressure over time and the next morning > TO MY HORROR i found only one baby guppy remained, the rest had swam out > over the edge of the guppy breeder tank which was now under water. > > and before I realized I needed to act, wham! a sword tail eats the one > remaining baby guppy. > > poor me. not happy, all my baby guppies are gone. > > > So, my question to you is how long does it take for a guppy to get big > enough to survive on its own without being eaten whilst eating this > super special high protein egg yolk diet? > > =Nick > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12821	From: dreammaker2623	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: New to the forum

I would tend to think that you might have a heavy hand in the feeding department. I would cut back on feedings and do more water changes to get the water quality better. If you keep the water quality up then the fish will be less likely to get stressed and have higher disease resistance. Just make sure to not do massive water changes but about 10 to 20 percent once or twice a week to get the water quality back up to where it should be and make sure to mot feed more than the fish can eat in one to two minutes a day. It does not hurt them to go for a day or two with out eating (if they are in good condition) because noone feeds them every day in the wild. Some fish may go weeks or longer with out eating.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12822	From: Aaron M.	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: Polls

Thank you, my previuos email lost it meaning going from html to text via yahoo, Hi All, I've double checked and as far as I can tell, all members can creat polls at will. Just a note, it seems better to use the following options; Select additional optionsNumber of choices: [input] Vote for one or more choices Poll results: [input] Display results during polling Voter identity: [input] Do not display voter identity Close poll: [input] Manually Poll Results: [input] Send results to the entire group via email Group Settings Web Tools Polls: Members (create/modify/vote in polls) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/polls PollsPolls HelpCreate Poll http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/editsurvey Hope that Helps, Aaron FortWayneFish@... wrote: I swear I tried making a poll the other day and it said Polls where not available. maybe it was a Yahoo thing ? Thanks for looking into it. I have created a poll and it is now open and active. once again Thanks rob Indiana got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife stop by and see ~ membership is free! <º((((><¸..·´¯`·., . .·´¯`·.. <º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((>< ¸.·´¯`·.¸. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12823	From: Nan	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: Vintage Aquariums -- Ornaments and more

It asks for SN and PW for me as well. Nan Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: No password that I recall. Just clicked on the link below and it took me right in. You might wish to edit the link and add www to it, which it looks like I neglected to put in. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of agentscullyeyore@... Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2005 5:06 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Vintage Aquariums -- Ornaments and more says you have to have a sn and password to view it.. shannon: If you would like to look even further back, try http://parlouraquariums.org.uk A site that talks not only of the state of the hobby way back in the mid 1800's but also of the people behind the scenes. \\Steve// [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12824	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: Vintage Aquariums -- Ornaments and more

http://www.parlouraquariums.org.uk In a message dated 7/3/2005 11:55:06 PM US Eastern Standard Time, ntalb00@... writes: > http://parlouraquariums.org.uk [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12825	From: Nan	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: Vintage Aquariums -- Ornaments and more

Thank you. I had tried that, but me and the computer are haveing technical difficulties...and I am on the loseing end...*LOL* Nan FortWayneFish@... wrote: http://www.parlouraquariums.org.uk In a message dated 7/3/2005 11:55:06 PM US Eastern Standard Time, ntalb00@... writes: > http://parlouraquariums.org.uk [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! SPONSORED LINKS Saltwater aquarium Marine biologist Reef tank --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- ~nan and crew~ Rome, GA http://www.geocities.com/ntalb00/index.htm (updated) bettas and soon we add guppys! --------------------------------- Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12826	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: Vintage Aquariums -- Ornaments and more

I Really Really know that feeling. Somedays i'd like to throw this computer out the window rob In a message dated 7/4/2005 12:12:30 AM US Eastern Standard Time, ntalb00@... writes: > Thank you. I had tried that, but me and the computer are haveing technical > difficulties...and I am on the loseing end...*LOL* > > Nan > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12827	From: Nan	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: Vintage Aquariums -- Ornaments and more

I have threatened to gut mine and turn it into a aquarium......*LOL* Nan FortWayneFish@... wrote: I Really Really know that feeling. Somedays i'd like to throw this computer out the window rob In a message dated 7/4/2005 12:12:30 AM US Eastern Standard Time, ntalb00@... writes: > Thank you. I had tried that, but me and the computer are haveing technical > difficulties...and I am on the loseing end...*LOL* > > Nan > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12828	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk

Actually it is San Francisco Bay Brand...sorry. Their web addy is http://www.sfbb.com Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nicolas Munro Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2005 10:04 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk I tried a Google search for San Francisco Shrimp Company but didn't notice anything that stood out. I like this idea of the shrimp free swimming into the aquarium. Sounds like less hassle and i think my tiger barbs would love it to. Can tiger barbs and guppies eat bbs shrimp? =Nick paul helms wrote: >they also sell a kit for 20 dollars taht hangs off the >back of the tank, using your tank water and teh >shrimpo swim into the tank as they hatch. the eggs >are sold in glass jars also by sf brine shrimp. they >hatch in 24-48 hours and swim in as a steady source of >food > > >--- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > > > >>San Francisco Shrimp Company sells a nifty brine >>hatchery that includes a >>black box for the saltwater and eggs. It has a hole >>on the top where you >>put another container, that has a small hole in the >>cap, in. You fill this >>container with fresh water. The fresh water stays >>on top, since the >>saltwater is heavier (according to the >>instructions). The brine shrimp will >>swim up through the hole in the cap and into the >>fresh water as they are >>attracted to the light. IT works great. SSC >>provides packets that contain >>the right amount of salt and eggs for each batch for >>this set up. You can >>also buy the packets separately. >> >>I also found a cool solution for a more sustained >>production of brine >>shrimp. Take a small aquarium (I used a 10 gal) and >>cover 1/2 of it with a >>dark, opaque material (I painted a box black and cut >>the cardboard to the >>size I needed to cover the the tank sides.)...or >>paint the glass black. >>Also make a solid divider (obviously this has to be >>made of plastic as it >>will be submerged) and partition off the tank in 2. >>This partition will >>also need a small hole to let the shrimp swim out >>(similar to the concept >>above). What this does is it keeps the eggs and the >>shrimp separate. What >>they also suggested is to take a bit of uplift >>tubing and run an airline >>(without an airistone) in it to create some surface >>turbulence and water >>flow. The reason they say not to use an airstone is >>that the shrimp have >>pockets that the tiny air bubbles can get trapped >>in, causing the shrimp to >>be stuck on the surface and starve. I haven't >>started this setup as I am >>letting the silicon caulking dry before I fill it up >>with water. I'll let >>you know how this works. >> >>Eric >> >> >> _____ >> >>From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com >>[mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On >>Behalf Of Ray Wetzel >>Sent: Friday, July 01, 2005 10:43 AM >>To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com >>Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg >>Yolk >> >> >>Yeah, I do remember "Sea Monkeys" -- what a gimmick. >> For those who >>were not already familiar with brine shrimp, not >>being in the >>tropical fish hobby, I'm sure they expected >>something entirely >>different especially going by the pictures they used >>to advertise >>with. Actually, hatching them isn't really that >>hard, if you want to >>try it. You can buy hatching cones made of thin >>plastic or you can >>use old gallon jars (preferably tilted off center) >>with an air stone >>at the bottom. Different sources of brine shrimp >>eggs require >>slightly different salt solutions, but in general >>you use about 6 tbp >>of Kosher salt per gallon and if you're tilting the >>jar as you should >>be doing, you'll be using about 3/4 gallon of water >>-- so you'll use >>4 1/2 tbp of salt. Depending upon the temperature >>(should be about >>80o), they'll hatch in about 24 - 30 hours, at which >>time you remove >>the airstone, let it sit a few minutes, and drain >>(with small plastic >>hose) the shrimp through a linen handkerchief using >>an empty gallon >>jar and returning that water when you're done. >>About 1/4 tsp of >>brine shrimp eggs should be enough for several >>feedings for your >>fry. I use 5 gallon carboys (twice a day) with >>about 3 tsps (or >>more) of eggs depending upon what I have going at >>the time. You >>should consider using at least two jars to rotate >>them every day so >>you constantly have a new batch. Ray >> >>\ >> >>--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Evita >><evitabug@y...> wrote: >> >> >>>Thanks Ray I will check it out. Heh, remember Sea >>> >>> >>Monkeys or are >>you too young. I had to get some when I was a kid. >>They didn't turn >>out to look anything like the pictures. HA! Evita >> >> >>>Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: Evita, >>> >>> >>Glad to hear your >>fry are thriving. Yeah, with the right >> >> >>>amount of finger pressure flake food can be >>> >>> >>pulverized almost to a >> >> >>>powder (at least very fine) and as you've found >>> >>> >>out is a good first >> >> >>>food for small fry if they take it. although maybe >>> >>> >>not quite as >> >> >>>nutritious as other options. With your feeding >>> >>> >>them 4-5 times a >>day, >> >> >>>it sounds like they're doing just fine. You might >>> >>> >>want to consider >> >> >>>hatching baby brine shrimp, at least for one or >>> >>> >>two of those daily >> >> >>>feedings as they may grow faster yet, even though >>> >>> >>powdered food is >>more >> >> >>>convenient -- and they will get better color. >>> >>> >>Ray >> >> >>\ >> >> >> >> >>> >>> >>>--------------------------------- >>>Discover Yahoo! >>> Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news & >>> >>> >>more. Check it >>out! >> >> >>>[Non-text portions of this message have been >>> >>> >>removed] >> >> >> >> >>Please delete this line and everything below it when >>replying, thanks >>. >>Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text >>that is not important to >>the reply and if changing the topic of the original >>message modify the >>subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old >>subject)" <-, we Thank You >>in Advance for your help in this matter >> >> >> >> _____ >> >>YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS >> >> >> >>* Visit your group "AquaticLife >><http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the >>web. >> >> >>* To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: >> AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com >> >> >> ><mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > >> >> >>* Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the >>Yahoo! Terms of Service >><http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . >> >> >> _____ >> >> >> >> >>[Non-text portions of this message have been >>removed] >> >> >> >> > > >__________________________________________________ >Do You Yahoo!? >Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around >http://mail.yahoo.com > > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks >. >Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12829	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: Brine shrimp

next question how easy is it to breed them? MM & MP, '73 Tricia, KG6PNC If you want to make friends world wide click the link below!! One catch it is not a program that is supported buy windows 98 yet http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12830	From: paul helms	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: Brine shrimp

very easy --- Tricia Wilkerson <trycya@...> wrote: > next question how easy is it to breed them? > MM & MP, '73 > Tricia, KG6PNC > > If you want to make friends world wide click the > link below!! One catch it is not a program that is > supported buy windows 98 yet > > http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12831	From: paul helms	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk

tiger barbs do not really belong with guppies of any size. they are fin eaters...meaning they typically go after anything with long or colorful fins --- Nicolas Munro <nmunro@...> wrote: > I'm sad now :-( > > > The reason i started this post was cause I've had 12 > baby guppies for > about a month now and decided they looked big enough > to put into the > community aquarium. > > So i put one in the community aquarium to try. It > swam and avoided two > guppies then wham! tiger barb action, no more guppy > :-( > > > So I figured I had better not put any more in. > Latter that evening i > was experimenting with a pH solution in a small > container inside a jam > jar so there was only a air gap between the > concentrated pH solution and > the water. Apparently the pH solution was supposed > to change color with > a change in CO2 concentration in the water, which it > did - but thats > another post. > > Any ways whilst all this was going on I put the jam > jar which contained > the smaller jar into the Guppy breeder being careful > not to squish the > guppie babys, and left it over night. > > The metal must have bent under pressure over time > and the next morning > TO MY HORROR i found only one baby guppy remained, > the rest had swam out > over the edge of the guppy breeder tank which was > now under water. > > and before I realized I needed to act, wham! a sword > tail eats the one > remaining baby guppy. > > poor me. not happy, all my baby guppies are gone. > > > So, my question to you is how long does it take for > a guppy to get big > enough to survive on its own without being eaten > whilst eating this > super special high protein egg yolk diet? > > =Nick > > > ____________________________________________________ Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12832	From: paul helms	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

it is mistaklenly called taht becaus eof peoples poor ability to translate from one language to another. the sting of a lionfish is very painful....like your hand is on fire. since many cultures do not hava single word translation like ours, a description may be used. plain and simply fire is not in the latin name or the color description of the fish and it should not be called that. i am sure there will be a gripe fest about this post from some but i really don't care. --- Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: > I googled firefish and the first 10 links had one > with about "firefish aka > lionfish". It is amazing how many wrong people > there are out there! One > person sees one person's wrong information and > copies it over and over. It > was clear from the search (and my very limited > knowledge of sw fish) that a > lionfish is Captain Picard's pet while a firefish is > a small goby. I can't > even see why a lionfish would be called a fire fish, > it looks nothing like a > fire. The firefish goby does look like a flame. :) > > > Patrick > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ____________________________________________________ Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12833	From: paul helms	Date: 7/3/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

my boat is not the one half sunk...it is the one with a good compass, map and plenty of gas. --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@...> wrote: > ilmao... whatever floats your boat ... > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > <wtfmorlok@y...> > wrote: > > applauds what? you are still wrong. even the guy > with > > 50 years in the hobby says he never heard of it > called > > a lionfish. just because he has the time to go to > 20 > > web searches to find others calling them the wrong > > thing does not mean a damn thing. i did not > google or > > go to anything of teh wall. go to > saltwaterfish.com > > and there will be a section of firefish.. lions > and > > scorpions will not be there. flat out, make sure > you > > are talking about the same thing as everyone else > when > > you decide to tell a beginner that one of the few > fish > > that will actually work in the tank they have is > > venemous and deadly, especially when several > others > > are recommending it. > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > *applauds* > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve > Szabo" > > > <steve@l...> wrote: > > > > You had said, "i did look it up and when you > type > > > in firefish in > > > the web > > > > browser nothing comes up about lionfish." > > > apparently in reply to > > > Sandra's, > > > > "you can also look it up, anywhere you look > for a > > > firefish there > > > will show > > > > up two species - the dartfish, and the > lionfish > > > which some people > > > call > > > > firefishes.". I took that to mean you did a > search > > > and did not > > > find any > > > > references to lionfish in your results. So, I > > > googled firefish, > > > i.e. a web > > > > search, and easily found a reference to > lionfish > > > in the first ten > > > responses. > > > > I also felt I would be remiss if I did not > report > > > the results of > > > the > > > > returned first ten results. > > > > > > > > I don't know what you used to search the web, > but, > > > it appears, > > > that it is > > > > not difficult to find references to lionfish. > Just > > > for ha-has, I > > > just did > > > > another search using the search engine Scirus > > > (http://www.scirus.com) and > > > > the first 10 results have three direct > references > > > to lion fish > > > (one _Pterois > > > > miles_ and two _P. volitans_) and one > > > _Nemateleotris decora_ which > > > is not a > > > > lionfish but, I believe, a goby. Two entries > did > > > not distinguish > > > the species > > > > in the description, but one was not a > lionfish, > > > the other was. The > > > other > > > > five entries were of something else entirely, > not > > > fish. > > > > > > > > In another part of my reply, about languages, > was > > > in reply to what > > > Sandra > > > > had said. However, using foreign languages in > my > > > original post on > > > the topic > > > > was merely to reinforce the point I was > making, > > > since I was able to > > > > translate some of the languages, and others > here > > > may be able to > > > translate > > > > others. The point there was that using common > > > names to describe > > > fish is > > > > hopelessly confusing, for the most part, and > > > probably not the > > > means that > > > > should be used to describe fish, unless there > is a > > > single source > > > used for > > > > the common names. For a handy reference on the > > > Internet that > > > everyone could > > > > freely access, I'd suggest looking at > > > http://www.fishbase.org, > > > because they > > > > list an accepted common name for each species > they > > > cover. While it > > > may not > > > > be the fastest site on the web, it certainly > > > covers the > > > information we are > > > > discussing here. > > > > > > > > \\Steve// > > > > > > > > P.S. While experience does count, a certain > > > minimal effort put > > > forth in > > > > researching a topic beyond personal experience > is > > > normally > > > warranted in a > > > > discussion such as this. I can claim a lot of > > > experience here > > > also. I can > > > > also say that I do not recall a time when I > have > > > heard anyone > > > refer to a > > > > lionfish as a firefish, and certainly could > have > > > said so prior to > > > this. > > > > However, a few quick searches have shown me > how > > > far off base I > > > would have > > > > been having said so. Helfrichs' dartfish, > which > > > you seem to refer > > > to in your > > > > post, is not found on any of my searches on > > > firefish, and while > > > you could > > > > claim you did not mention it as a firefish, it > > > certainly seems to > > > be > > > > inferred in your post. scs > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > > Behalf Of paul helms > > > > Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2005 2:12 PM > > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: setting up a > new > > > salt water aquarium > > > > > > > > and? > > > > > > > > --- Steve Szabo <steve@l...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > I googled firefish, and 6th entry shows > firefish > > > as > > > > > _Pterois volitans_. The > > > > > site listed is an Australian site. Out of > the > > > first > > > > > 10 hits, One reference > > > > > to lionfish, and 3 to _Nemateleotris_ spp. I > > > left > > > > > out the Chinese, Japanese, > > > > > and Korean scripts given as common names, as > === message truncated === ____________________________________________________ Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12834	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk

> > So, my question to you is how long does it take for > > a guppy to get big > > enough to survive on its own without being eaten > > whilst eating this > > super special high protein egg yolk diet? > > > > =Nick guppy fry grow pretty quickly, but even newborns can survive larger fish like angelfish and tigerbarbs if you have a moderately to heavily planted tank with lots of places to hide.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12835	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

Hi Paul, The common name in dispute given to Pterois Volitans is actualy 'Red Firefish', as far as I know it is only used in Australia and has no origin in translation. As has already been stated if you google 'firefish' on the first page you will find that name applied to Nemateleotris Magnifica and to Pterois Volitans. So Paul as your original post in this thread is not realy being contested you have nothing to defend this time, so how about dropping it!!. regards, unclenorm. --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > it is mistaklenly called taht becaus eof peoples > poor > ability to translate from one language to another. > the sting of a lionfish is very painful....like your > hand is on fire. since many cultures do not hava > single word translation like ours, a description may > be used. plain and simply fire is not in the latin > name or the color description of the fish and it > should not be called that. i am sure there will be > a > gripe fest about this post from some but i really > don't care. > > --- Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: > > > I googled firefish and the first 10 links had one > > with about "firefish aka > > lionfish". It is amazing how many wrong people > > there are out there! One > > person sees one person's wrong information and > > copies it over and over. It > > was clear from the search (and my very limited > > knowledge of sw fish) that a > > lionfish is Captain Picard's pet while a firefish > is > > a small goby. I can't > > even see why a lionfish would be called a fire > fish, > > it looks nothing like a > > fire. The firefish goby does look like a flame. > :) > > > > > > Patrick > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > > Yahoo! Sports > Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football > > http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com > ___________________________________________________________ How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12836	From: Evita	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk

I am one of those new-bies. When I got my 29 gal a few months ago we already had a 20 gal tank from before. We had Goldfish about two years ago in the smaller tank. We decided if we were to set up the tanks the smaller tank would be great for a nursery. Only three days after we set up the 30 gal. with 4 platys to cycle we had babies. The second we noticed them I got my net. I managed to catch a little over 20 fry. I thought I got them all. The fry are now about a week old and growing pretty fast. I haven't noticed any losses. Then my adults about three days later appeared to have ick. I lost 2 sadly. While I was struggling with the two sicker adult fish I noticed one fry in the tank I missed. He or she must be a really smart fast fish because not only couldn't I catch him but neither could the adult fish. He seems to be growing a tad bit faster than the other fry and seems to be a dark one in color. I decided to leave him where he was since I was treating the tank for ick and all. So he survived not only the parents but the ick as well. But I still even though a new-bie think if you want to really raise baby fry it might be a good idea to have a tank just for babies. It gives then a better chance to grow without the worry of being eaten at least. Of course for me at this point if I don't want to end up with 100 tanks to transfer all the babies to as adults .....I guess natural selection may be the best at some point. The way they multiply I could end up with tons of fish with no tanks to go to. I need to find adoptive homes at some point or my hobby must grow. Just a thought. In any event it has been really fun as heck watching those babies grow. Platy babies are a tad bit larger than guppies but I think I will see how big they are at a month before deciding about transferring some to the larger tank. Years ago a friend of mine's mother had a black molly tank and this was during those times that many people seemed to just put the fish in and let them go as it were with no problems it seemed. He mom had a really relatively small tank I would say about a 20 gal. Her mollys would just breed and breed. They had the tank full of live plants as well. The tank was way over stocked and crowded but they never seemed to have a problem. Today that would be a big no no. Evita cynthia brennemann <brennewoman@...> wrote: > > So, my question to you is how long does it take for > > a guppy to get big > > enough to survive on its own without being eaten > > whilst eating this > > super special high protein egg yolk diet? > > > > =Nick guppy fry grow pretty quickly, but even newborns can survive larger fish like angelfish and tigerbarbs if you have a moderately to heavily planted tank with lots of places to hide. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Mail Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12837	From: Kathy	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: New poll for AquaticLife

I am a newbie...I have two shebunkins and have had them for about 6 months. This group is so very, very helpful! Kathy G. Woodstock, CT ----- Original Message ----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, July 04, 2005 12:04 AM Subject: [AquaticLife] New poll for AquaticLife Enter your vote today! A new poll has been created for the AquaticLife group: How long have you been in the Hobby? o Newbie ( less then 1 year ) o 1-3 years o 3-5 years o 5-10 years o 10-15 years o 15-20 years o 20-50 years o 50+ Years To vote, please visit the following web page: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/surveys?id=1722965 Note: Please do not reply to this message. Poll votes are not collected via email. To vote, you must go to the Yahoo! Groups web site listed above. Thanks! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.323 / Virus Database: 267.8.8/37 - Release Date: 7/1/2005 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12838	From: wjcoldman	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: How long in hobby?

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Nicolas Munro <nmunro@q...> wrote: > Sorry, I'm only a newbie 7 months old but have been pretty serious about > it now running CO2 [bakers yeast] and aquatic plants. > > =Nick > > FortWayneFish@a... wrote: > > >I am celebrating my 15th year in the hobby this year and was wondering if > >this group has more "Old timers" or more of a new attitude. > > > >Curious... I'd post a poll but it says poll option not available > > > >And in a few peoples cases you can reply with decades in hobby LOL > > > >rob > >15yrs > >Indiana > > > > > >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed] I have been in the hobby for 18 yrs now. oldman Ohio

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12839	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk

I wonder if cherry barbs do that as well. When I had 3 of them in my tank with guppies and platties I kept finding fish whose fins were missing, guess I will nix the thought of getting anymore cherry barbs if that is the case. MM & MP, '73 Tricia, KG6PNC If you want to make friends world wide click the link below!! One catch it is not a program that is supported buy windows 98 yet http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12840	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk

To minimize fin nipping by barbs, you'll wan to have an odd number of the species in the tank with a minimum of five. So, you might want to consider getting 2 or 4 more cherry barbs. Now, this might not mitigate all fin nipping, but it should minimize it. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Tricia Wilkerson Sent: Monday, July 04, 2005 12:19 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk I wonder if cherry barbs do that as well. When I had 3 of them in my tank with guppies and platties I kept finding fish whose fins were missing, guess I will nix the thought of getting anymore cherry barbs if that is the case. MM & MP, '73 Tricia, KG6PNC If you want to make friends world wide click the link below!! One catch it is not a program that is supported buy windows 98 yet http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12841	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: Brine shrimp

haven't tried that yet ;-) It's just as cheap to keep buying more eggs. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Tricia Wilkerson Sent: Monday, July 04, 2005 1:34 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: Brine shrimp next question how easy is it to breed them? MM & MP, '73 Tricia, KG6PNC If you want to make friends world wide click the link below!! One catch it is not a program that is supported buy windows 98 yet http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12842	From: paul helms	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

i don't use google, but when i use my web browser, you are correct i have finally found it as a firefish when using that scientific name, and it is listed with the gret barrier reef in australia. so it does appear that down under they are a bit backwards, just like their toilets...lol. it is number 7 of 10. the first 6 call it a red lionfish, a red zebrafish, and a scorpion fish. --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> wrote: > Hi Paul, > The common name in dispute given to Pterois > Volitans is actualy 'Red Firefish', as far as I know > it is only used in Australia and has no origin in > translation. As has already been stated if you > google > 'firefish' on the first page you will find that name > applied to Nemateleotris Magnifica and to Pterois > Volitans. So Paul as your original post in this > thread > is not realy being contested you have nothing to > defend this time, so how about dropping it!!. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > it is mistaklenly called taht becaus eof peoples > > poor > > ability to translate from one language to another. > > > the sting of a lionfish is very painful....like > your > > hand is on fire. since many cultures do not hava > > single word translation like ours, a description > may > > be used. plain and simply fire is not in the > latin > > name or the color description of the fish and it > > should not be called that. i am sure there will > be > > a > > gripe fest about this post from some but i really > > don't care. > > > > --- Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: > > > > > I googled firefish and the first 10 links had > one > > > with about "firefish aka > > > lionfish". It is amazing how many wrong people > > > there are out there! One > > > person sees one person's wrong information and > > > copies it over and over. It > > > was clear from the search (and my very limited > > > knowledge of sw fish) that a > > > lionfish is Captain Picard's pet while a > firefish > > is > > > a small goby. I can't > > > even see why a lionfish would be called a fire > > fish, > > > it looks nothing like a > > > fire. The firefish goby does look like a flame. > > :) > > > > > > > > > Patrick > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > > > > Yahoo! Sports > > Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy > Football > > > > http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > How much free photo storage do you get? Store your > holiday > snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos > http://uk.photos.yahoo.com > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12843	From: Sandra	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

yup, just like titanic... Other than you, most people on here seem to have a LIFE and don´t have time to post bs all day long, so maybe you should write the president if he let´s everyone know not to call the lionfish firefish for whatever reason the voices in your head say so! --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms <wtfmorlok@y...> wrote: > my boat is not the one half sunk...it is the one with > a good compass, map and plenty of gas. > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > ilmao... whatever floats your boat ... > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > wrote: > > > applauds what? you are still wrong. even the guy > > with > > > 50 years in the hobby says he never heard of it > > called > > > a lionfish. just because he has the time to go to > > 20 > > > web searches to find others calling them the wrong > > > thing does not mean a damn thing. i did not > > google or > > > go to anything of teh wall. go to > > saltwaterfish.com > > > and there will be a section of firefish.. lions > > and > > > scorpions will not be there. flat out, make sure > > you > > > are talking about the same thing as everyone else > > when > > > you decide to tell a beginner that one of the few > > fish > > > that will actually work in the tank they have is > > > venemous and deadly, especially when several > > others > > > are recommending it. > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > *applauds* > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve > > Szabo" > > > > <steve@l...> wrote: > > > > > You had said, "i did look it up and when you > > type > > > > in firefish in > > > > the web > > > > > browser nothing comes up about lionfish." > > > > apparently in reply to > > > > Sandra's, > > > > > "you can also look it up, anywhere you look > > for a > > > > firefish there > > > > will show > > > > > up two species - the dartfish, and the > > lionfish > > > > which some people > > > > call > > > > > firefishes.". I took that to mean you did a > > search > > > > and did not > > > > find any > > > > > references to lionfish in your results. So, I > > > > googled firefish, > > > > i.e. a web > > > > > search, and easily found a reference to > > lionfish > > > > in the first ten > > > > responses. > > > > > I also felt I would be remiss if I did not > > report > > > > the results of > > > > the > > > > > returned first ten results. > > > > > > > > > > I don't know what you used to search the web, > > but, > > > > it appears, > > > > that it is > > > > > not difficult to find references to lionfish. > > Just > > > > for ha-has, I > > > > just did > > > > > another search using the search engine Scirus > > > > (http://www.scirus.com) and > > > > > the first 10 results have three direct > > references > > > > to lion fish > > > > (one _Pterois > > > > > miles_ and two _P. volitans_) and one > > > > _Nemateleotris decora_ which > > > > is not a > > > > > lionfish but, I believe, a goby. Two entries > > did > > > > not distinguish > > > > the species > > > > > in the description, but one was not a > > lionfish, > > > > the other was. The > > > > other > > > > > five entries were of something else entirely, > > not > > > > fish. > > > > > > > > > > In another part of my reply, about languages, > > was > > > > in reply to what > > > > Sandra > > > > > had said. However, using foreign languages in > > my > > > > original post on > > > > the topic > > > > > was merely to reinforce the point I was > > making, > > > > since I was able to > > > > > translate some of the languages, and others > > here > > > > may be able to > > > > translate > > > > > others. The point there was that using common > > > > names to describe > > > > fish is > > > > > hopelessly confusing, for the most part, and > > > > probably not the > > > > means that > > > > > should be used to describe fish, unless there > > is a > > > > single source > > > > used for > > > > > the common names. For a handy reference on the > > > > Internet that > > > > everyone could > > > > > freely access, I'd suggest looking at > > > > http://www.fishbase.org, > > > > because they > > > > > list an accepted common name for each species > > they > > > > cover. While it > > > > may not > > > > > be the fastest site on the web, it certainly > > > > covers the > > > > information we are > > > > > discussing here. > > > > > > > > > > \\Steve// > > > > > > > > > > P.S. While experience does count, a certain > > > > minimal effort put > > > > forth in > > > > > researching a topic beyond personal experience > > is > > > > normally > > > > warranted in a > > > > > discussion such as this. I can claim a lot of > > > > experience here > > > > also. I can > > > > > also say that I do not recall a time when I > > have > > > > heard anyone > > > > refer to a > > > > > lionfish as a firefish, and certainly could > > have > > > > said so prior to > > > > this. > > > > > However, a few quick searches have shown me > > how > > > > far off base I > > > > would have > > > > > been having said so. Helfrichs' dartfish, > > which > > > > you seem to refer > > > > to in your > > > > > post, is not found on any of my searches on > > > > firefish, and while > > > > you could > > > > > claim you did not mention it as a firefish, it > > > > certainly seems to > > > > be > > > > > inferred in your post. scs > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > > > Behalf Of paul helms > > > > > Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2005 2:12 PM > > > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: setting up a > > new > > > > salt water aquarium > > > > > > > > > > and? > > > > > > > > > > --- Steve Szabo <steve@l...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > I googled firefish, and 6th entry shows > > firefish > > > > as > > > > > > _Pterois volitans_. The > > > > > > site listed is an Australian site. Out of > > the > > > > first > > > > > > 10 hits, One reference > > > > > > to lionfish, and 3 to _Nemateleotris_ spp. I > > > > left > > > > > > out the Chinese, Japanese, > > > > > > and Korean scripts given as common names, as > > > === message truncated === > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > Yahoo! Sports > Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football > http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12844	From: paul helms	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk

depends on what is in the tank. fish are predatory animals that tend to eat anything that fits in their mouths. i personally do not separate the babies from the rtest of the fish and usually end up with 5-6 new fish per breeding that survive. having some floating plants greatly increases their chances of survival. i just use a crushed brine shrimp flake myself, and it works great. --- cynthia brennemann <brennewoman@...> wrote: > > > So, my question to you is how long does it take > for > > > a guppy to get big > > > enough to survive on its own without being eaten > > > whilst eating this > > > super special high protein egg yolk diet? > > > > > > =Nick > > guppy fry grow pretty quickly, but even newborns can > survive larger > fish like angelfish and tigerbarbs if you have a > moderately to heavily > planted tank with lots of places to hide. > > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12845	From: paul helms	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

maybe you should just grow up! admit that you gave poor advice based on your loss with reality. i don't post bs all day...in fact it was you that posted bs...incorrect information. and if you will note, my posts are very short in comparison to several other posters on here. just because i check my email daily does not mean that i have no life.......does it mean that you don't? --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@...> wrote: > yup, just like titanic... > > Other than you, most people on here seem to have a > LIFE and don´t > have time to post bs all day long, so maybe you > should write the > president if he let´s everyone know not to call the > lionfish > firefish for whatever reason the voices in your head > say so! > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > <wtfmorlok@y...> > wrote: > > my boat is not the one half sunk...it is the one > with > > a good compass, map and plenty of gas. > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > ilmao... whatever floats your boat ... > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > wrote: > > > > applauds what? you are still wrong. even the > guy > > > with > > > > 50 years in the hobby says he never heard of > it > > > called > > > > a lionfish. just because he has the time to > go to > > > 20 > > > > web searches to find others calling them the > wrong > > > > thing does not mean a damn thing. i did not > > > google or > > > > go to anything of teh wall. go to > > > saltwaterfish.com > > > > and there will be a section of firefish.. > lions > > > and > > > > scorpions will not be there. flat out, make > sure > > > you > > > > are talking about the same thing as everyone > else > > > when > > > > you decide to tell a beginner that one of the > few > > > fish > > > > that will actually work in the tank they have > is > > > > venemous and deadly, especially when several > > > others > > > > are recommending it. > > > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > *applauds* > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve > > > Szabo" > > > > > <steve@l...> wrote: > > > > > > You had said, "i did look it up and when > you > > > type > > > > > in firefish in > > > > > the web > > > > > > browser nothing comes up about lionfish." > > > > > apparently in reply to > > > > > Sandra's, > > > > > > "you can also look it up, anywhere you > look > > > for a > > > > > firefish there > > > > > will show > > > > > > up two species - the dartfish, and the > > > lionfish > > > > > which some people > > > > > call > > > > > > firefishes.". I took that to mean you did > a > > > search > > > > > and did not > > > > > find any > > > > > > references to lionfish in your results. > So, I > > > > > googled firefish, > > > > > i.e. a web > > > > > > search, and easily found a reference to > > > lionfish > > > > > in the first ten > > > > > responses. > > > > > > I also felt I would be remiss if I did not > > > report > > > > > the results of > > > > > the > > > > > > returned first ten results. > > > > > > > > > > > > I don't know what you used to search the > web, > > > but, > > > > > it appears, > > > > > that it is > > > > > > not difficult to find references to > lionfish. > > > Just > > > > > for ha-has, I > > > > > just did > > > > > > another search using the search engine > Scirus > > > > > (http://www.scirus.com) and > > > > > > the first 10 results have three direct > > > references > > > > > to lion fish > > > > > (one _Pterois > > > > > > miles_ and two _P. volitans_) and one > > > > > _Nemateleotris decora_ which > > > > > is not a > > > > > > lionfish but, I believe, a goby. Two > entries > > > did > > > > > not distinguish > > > > > the species > > > > > > in the description, but one was not a > > > lionfish, > > > > > the other was. The > > > > > other > > > > > > five entries were of something else > entirely, > > > not > > > > > fish. > > > > > > > > > > > > In another part of my reply, about > languages, > > > was > > > > > in reply to what > > > > > Sandra > > > > > > had said. However, using foreign languages > in > > > my > > > > > original post on > > > > > the topic > > > > > > was merely to reinforce the point I was > > > making, > > > > > since I was able to > > > > > > translate some of the languages, and > others > > > here > > > > > may be able to > > > > > translate > > > > > > others. The point there was that using > common > > > > > names to describe > > > > > fish is > > > > > > hopelessly confusing, for the most part, > and > > > > > probably not the > > > > > means that > > > > > > should be used to describe fish, unless > there > > > is a > > > > > single source > > > > > used for > > > > > > the common names. For a handy reference on > the > > > > > Internet that > > > > > everyone could > > > > > > freely access, I'd suggest looking at > > > > > http://www.fishbase.org, > > > > > because they > > > > > > list an accepted common name for each > species > > > they > > > > > cover. While it > > > > > may not > > > > > > be the fastest site on the web, it > certainly > > > > > covers the > > > > > information we are > > > > > > discussing here. > > > > > > > > > > > > \\Steve// > > > > > > > > > > > > P.S. While experience does count, a > certain > > > > > minimal effort put > > > > > forth in > > > > > > researching a topic beyond personal > experience > > > is > > > > > normally > > > > > warranted in a > > > > > > discussion such as this. I can claim a lot > of > > > > > experience here > === message truncated === __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12846	From: TankGurl	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

Wow...people....chill out!!! I know the heat can make some folks a little pissy, but really...this is rather childish don't you think? Anyone who has spent time researching any species will soon discover there is a mass amount of misinformation, citing of incorrect attributes and yes, incorrect scientific and common names. The trick is to sift through the bs and come up with your own sound conclusion. Also, experience and advice always differs. What works for one person, isn't always going to work for another. You say "potato' , I say 'patato'. :) And for the record, I've seen many "Lionfish" for sale and reputable lfs. Kelly On 7/4/05, paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > maybe you should just grow up! admit that you gave > poor advice based on your loss with reality. i don't > post bs all day...in fact it was you that posted > bs...incorrect information. and if you will note, my > posts are very short in comparison to several other > posters on here. just because i check my email daily > does not mean that i have no life.......does it mean > that you don't? > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@...> wrote: > > > yup, just like titanic... > > > > Other than you, most people on here seem to have a > > LIFE and don´t > > have time to post bs all day long, so maybe you > > should write the > > president if he let´s everyone know not to call the > > lionfish > > firefish for whatever reason the voices in your head > > say so! > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > wrote: > > > my boat is not the one half sunk...it is the one > > with > > > a good compass, map and plenty of gas. > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > ilmao... whatever floats your boat ... > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > > wrote: > > > > > applauds what? you are still wrong. even the > > guy > > > > with > > > > > 50 years in the hobby says he never heard of > > it > > > > called > > > > > a lionfish. just because he has the time to > > go to > > > > 20 > > > > > web searches to find others calling them the > > wrong > > > > > thing does not mean a damn thing. i did not > > > > google or > > > > > go to anything of teh wall. go to > > > > saltwaterfish.com > > > > > and there will be a section of firefish.. > > lions > > > > and > > > > > scorpions will not be there. flat out, make > > sure > > > > you > > > > > are talking about the same thing as everyone > > else > > > > when > > > > > you decide to tell a beginner that one of the > > few > > > > fish > > > > > that will actually work in the tank they have > > is > > > > > venemous and deadly, especially when several > > > > others > > > > > are recommending it. > > > > > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > *applauds* > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve > > > > Szabo" > > > > > > <steve@l...> wrote: > > > > > > > You had said, "i did look it up and when > > you > > > > type > > > > > > in firefish in > > > > > > the web > > > > > > > browser nothing comes up about lionfish." > > > > > > apparently in reply to > > > > > > Sandra's, > > > > > > > "you can also look it up, anywhere you > > look > > > > for a > > > > > > firefish there > > > > > > will show > > > > > > > up two species - the dartfish, and the > > > > lionfish > > > > > > which some people > > > > > > call > > > > > > > firefishes.". I took that to mean you did > > a > > > > search > > > > > > and did not > > > > > > find any > > > > > > > references to lionfish in your results. > > So, I > > > > > > googled firefish, > > > > > > i.e. a web > > > > > > > search, and easily found a reference to > > > > lionfish > > > > > > in the first ten > > > > > > responses. > > > > > > > I also felt I would be remiss if I did not > > > > report > > > > > > the results of > > > > > > the > > > > > > > returned first ten results. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I don't know what you used to search the > > web, > > > > but, > > > > > > it appears, > > > > > > that it is > > > > > > > not difficult to find references to > > lionfish. > > > > Just > > > > > > for ha-has, I > > > > > > just did > > > > > > > another search using the search engine > > Scirus > > > > > > (http://www.scirus.com) and > > > > > > > the first 10 results have three direct > > > > references > > > > > > to lion fish > > > > > > (one _Pterois > > > > > > > miles_ and two _P. volitans_) and one > > > > > > _Nemateleotris decora_ which > > > > > > is not a > > > > > > > lionfish but, I believe, a goby. Two > > entries > > > > did > > > > > > not distinguish > > > > > > the species > > > > > > > in the description, but one was not a > > > > lionfish, > > > > > > the other was. The > > > > > > other > > > > > > > five entries were of something else > > entirely, > > > > not > > > > > > fish. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In another part of my reply, about > > languages, > > > > was > > > > > > in reply to what > > > > > > Sandra > > > > > > > had said. However, using foreign languages > > in > > > > my > > > > > > original post on > > > > > > the topic > > > > > > > was merely to reinforce the point I was > > > > making, > > > > > > since I was able to > > > > > > > translate some of the languages, and > > others > > > > here > > > > > > may be able to > > > > > > translate > > > > > > > others. The point there was that using > > common > > > > > > names to describe > > > > > > fish is > > > > > > > hopelessly confusing, for the most part, > > and > > > > > > probably not the > > > > > > means that > > > > > > > should be used to describe fish, unless > > there > > > > is a > > > > > > single source > > > > > > used for > > > > > > > the common names. For a handy reference on > > the > > > > > > Internet that > > > > > > everyone could > > > > > > > freely access, I'd suggest looking at > > > > > > http://www.fishbase.org, > > > > > > because they > > > > > > > list an accepted common name for each > > species > > > > they > > > > > > cover. While it > > > > > > may not > > > > > > > be the fastest site on the web, it > > certainly > > > > > > covers the > > > > > > information we are > > > > > > > discussing here. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > \\Steve// > > > > > > > > > > > > > > P.S. While experience does count, a > > certain > > > > > > minimal effort put > > > > > > forth in > > > > > > > researching a topic beyond personal > > experience > > > > is > > > > > > normally > > > > > > warranted in a > > > > > > > discussion such as this. I can claim a lot > > of > > > > > > experience here > > > === message truncated === > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > -- 65g Malawi http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 135g Frontosa/Tang http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12847	From: Bruce Hansen	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

I wonder if Paul would like to explain his remark about toilets in Australia? I admit we don't seem to have the same obsessions as many Americans with anal functions, vaginal dryness etc. In fact we are so backward that our pharmacies don't even have entire lanes for devotees of these "religions" :-) Cheers Bruce (Hansen) ANGFA (Qld) Inc - http://www.angfaqld.org.au/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "paul helms" <wtfmorlok@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, July 05, 2005 4:25 AM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium . so it does appear > that down under they are a bit backwards, just like > their toilets...

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12848	From: Pam	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Purple Betta Papa

Purple Betta Papa I have my first betta spawn and this is the hero that has done all the hard work!! http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/pamphetteplace/album?.dir=/c849&.src=ph&.tok=ph0yEQDBpZOGrPGu [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12849	From: pamphetteplace	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: AUSTRAILIA. (pls excuse >>> off topic)

Just to add my comment here. I have always heard that your country is incredible and I would love to visit someday. I understand it is beautiful and the people are down to earth, sounds like paradise!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12850	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: Purple Betta Papa

Ooooh, how pretty he is! Our bettas were not among the prettiest, since my daughters picked them out of pity...LOL. I hope their offspring are pretty, though. They're already about four or five times the size they were when they were born, and some are slightly darker than others. So cute. I felt so sorry for their papa, even all alone in that great big tank. I can't imagine how they ever manage to keep them alive in the wild! > Purple Betta Papa > I have my first betta spawn and this is the hero that has done all the hard work!!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12851	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

when you flush, the water rotates the opposite direction of northern hemisphere toilets. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Bruce Hansen Sent: Monday, July 04, 2005 4:09 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium I wonder if Paul would like to explain his remark about toilets in Australia? I admit we don't seem to have the same obsessions as many Americans with anal functions, vaginal dryness etc. In fact we are so backward that our pharmacies don't even have entire lanes for devotees of these "religions" :-) Cheers Bruce (Hansen) ANGFA (Qld) Inc - http://www.angfaqld.org.au/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "paul helms" <wtfmorlok@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, July 05, 2005 4:25 AM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium . so it does appear > that down under they are a bit backwards, just like > their toilets... ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12852	From: Bruce Hansen	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

Eric I can assure you that the water and the contents go down the pipe - is it the opposite over there ? Cheers Bruce (Hansen) ANGFA (Qld) Inc - http://www.angfaqld.org.au/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Eric Roberts" <woad@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, July 05, 2005 7:27 AM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium when you flush, the water rotates the opposite direction of northern hemisphere toilets. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Bruce Hansen Sent: Monday, July 04, 2005 4:09 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium I wonder if Paul would like to explain his remark about toilets in Australia? I admit we don't seem to have the same obsessions as many Americans with anal functions, vaginal dryness etc. In fact we are so backward that our pharmacies don't even have entire lanes for devotees of these "religions" :-) Cheers Bruce (Hansen) ANGFA (Qld) Inc - http://www.angfaqld.org.au/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "paul helms" <wtfmorlok@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, July 05, 2005 4:25 AM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium . so it does appear > that down under they are a bit backwards, just like > their toilets... ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12853	From: Bruce Hansen	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: AUSTRAILIA. (pls excuse >>> off topic)

When I visited your country I found it to be beautiful and the people to be mainly polite and able to take a joke about themselves. Everyone (including Australians) should see Australia at least once. However remember it is a BIG country (about the same area as the USA) and it takes time and money to have a good look around. Our "outback" has lots of wide open spaces and of course the "top end" has some spectacular areas. If you want to get a taste of it enquire when the new display will be open at the National Aquarium in Baltimore. This will be incredible - a recreation of a tropical Northern Australian gorge system complete with full-sized trees, birds at liberty in the exhibit, several different aquatic habitats etc etc Cheers Bruce (Hansen) ANGFA (Qld) Inc - http://www.angfaqld.org.au/ ----- Original Message ----- nFrom: "pamphetteplace" <pamphetteplace@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, July 05, 2005 7:17 AM Subject: [AquaticLife] AUSTRAILIA. (pls excuse >>> off topic) Just to add my comment here. I have always heard that your country is incredible and I would love to visit someday. I understand it is beautiful and the people are down to earth, sounds like paradise! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12854	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

the water rotates differently as it goes down...one goes clockwise, while the other goes counterclockwise...I forget which is which. The same holds true for drains and any other time water forms a funnel when draining. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Bruce Hansen Sent: Monday, July 04, 2005 4:40 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium Eric I can assure you that the water and the contents go down the pipe - is it the opposite over there ? Cheers Bruce (Hansen) ANGFA (Qld) Inc - http://www.angfaqld.org.au/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Eric Roberts" <woad@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, July 05, 2005 7:27 AM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium when you flush, the water rotates the opposite direction of northern hemisphere toilets. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Bruce Hansen Sent: Monday, July 04, 2005 4:09 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium I wonder if Paul would like to explain his remark about toilets in Australia? I admit we don't seem to have the same obsessions as many Americans with anal functions, vaginal dryness etc. In fact we are so backward that our pharmacies don't even have entire lanes for devotees of these "religions" :-) Cheers Bruce (Hansen) ANGFA (Qld) Inc - http://www.angfaqld.org.au/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "paul helms" <wtfmorlok@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, July 05, 2005 4:25 AM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium . so it does appear > that down under they are a bit backwards, just like > their toilets... ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12855	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: AUSTRAILIA. (pls excuse >>> off topic)

It's one of my dreams to come visit. hopefully by then I will also have some diving experience under my belt as I would love to dive the Great Barrier Reef. Here in Chicago, the Brookfield Zoo, which is one of the top zoos in he US if not the world, has a Aussie area that is done up to reflect the actual environment in which the animals live. They have done the same with African exhibits as well as Tropical exhibits from various parts of the world. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Bruce Hansen Sent: Monday, July 04, 2005 4:51 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] AUSTRAILIA. (pls excuse >>> off topic) When I visited your country I found it to be beautiful and the people to be mainly polite and able to take a joke about themselves. Everyone (including Australians) should see Australia at least once. However remember it is a BIG country (about the same area as the USA) and it takes time and money to have a good look around. Our "outback" has lots of wide open spaces and of course the "top end" has some spectacular areas. If you want to get a taste of it enquire when the new display will be open at the National Aquarium in Baltimore. This will be incredible - a recreation of a tropical Northern Australian gorge system complete with full-sized trees, birds at liberty in the exhibit, several different aquatic habitats etc etc Cheers Bruce (Hansen) ANGFA (Qld) Inc - http://www.angfaqld.org.au/ ----- Original Message ----- nFrom: "pamphetteplace" <pamphetteplace@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, July 05, 2005 7:17 AM Subject: [AquaticLife] AUSTRAILIA. (pls excuse >>> off topic) Just to add my comment here. I have always heard that your country is incredible and I would love to visit someday. I understand it is beautiful and the people are down to earth, sounds like paradise! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12856	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk

Paul, can you remember what species the floating plant is you have? I'm working on planting out my tank, have it probably 10% planted by surface area, Its greatly reduced my algae problem too. Still there is no plants which are bushy enough for the fry to hang in so might have to keep my eyes open for something suitable in the aquatic plant shops. =Nick Paul helms wrote: >depends on what is in the tank. fish are predatory >animals that tend to eat anything that fits in their >mouths. i personally do not separate the babies from >the rtest of the fish and usually end up with 5-6 new >fish per breeding that survive. having some floating >plants greatly increases their chances of survival. i >just use a crushed brine shrimp flake myself, and it >works great. > >--- cynthia brennemann <brennewoman@...> >wrote: > > > >>>>So, my question to you is how long does it take >>>> >>>> >>for >> >> >>>>a guppy to get big >>>>enough to survive on its own without being eaten >>>>whilst eating this >>>>super special high protein egg yolk diet? >>>> >>>>=Nick >>>> >>>> >>guppy fry grow pretty quickly, but even newborns can >>survive larger >>fish like angelfish and tigerbarbs if you have a >>moderately to heavily >>planted tank with lots of places to hide. >> >> >> >> >> > > >__________________________________________________ >Do You Yahoo!? >Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around >http://mail.yahoo.com > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >AquaticLife Management. > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12857	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk

Cool, i could do with some bristle nose babies, my Bristle nose is being picked on by the guppies. Do you (anybody) think that having a couple of buddies for the bristle nose will reduce the likely hood of it being picked on? =Nick FortWayneFish@... wrote: >Nick, >Luckily Guppies breed like guppies. You will have more babies soon as long as >you have at least one adult male and female. >I think most of us have done more or less the same thing. > >I lost a whole batch ( 100+ ) bristlenose babies the other day. I seperated >the tank with a divider, knowing the BN babies could swim through it but >figuered That they would stay on there side at least over night. make a long story >short my divider wasn't propt up or fastened. The cichlids easily knocked it >over and got to the babies. >I wasn't thinking....I usually prop a couple Tall decorations on either side >of the egg crate for support. but I had a dumb @## attack and spaced it. > >As far as how long..depends. > >Fish rule: If it fits in the mouth it is food. Rule initiated by Mother >Nature 1000's of years ago. > >I know I know >I was No help >Rob >Indiana > > > > > > >In a message dated 7/3/2005 10:38:36 PM US Eastern Standard Time, >nmunro@... writes: > > > > >>The metal must have bent under pressure over time and the next morning >>TO MY HORROR i found only one baby guppy remained, the rest had swam out >>over the edge of the guppy breeder tank which was now under water. >> >>and before I realized I needed to act, wham! a sword tail eats the one >>remaining baby guppy. >> >>poor me. not happy, all my baby guppies are gone. >> >> >>So, my question to you is how long does it take for a guppy to get big >>enough to survive on its own without being eaten whilst eating this >>super special high protein egg yolk diet? >> >>=Nick >> >> >> > > > >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >AquaticLife Management. > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12858	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk

If you feed them plenty of Algae discs, which I'm using the Wardly brand btw, this greatly reduces any problem of fin nipping in my experience. The guy in my LFS said they are after the slime coating ie lacking the minerals hence Algae discs. =Nick paul helms wrote: >tiger barbs do not really belong with guppies of any >size. they are fin eaters...meaning they typically go >after anything with long or colorful fins > >--- Nicolas Munro <nmunro@...> wrote: > > > >>I'm sad now :-( >> >> >>The reason i started this post was cause I've had 12 >>baby guppies for >>about a month now and decided they looked big enough >>to put into the >>community aquarium. >> >>So i put one in the community aquarium to try. It >>swam and avoided two >>guppies then wham! tiger barb action, no more guppy >> :-( >> >> >>So I figured I had better not put any more in. >>Latter that evening i >>was experimenting with a pH solution in a small >>container inside a jam >>jar so there was only a air gap between the >>concentrated pH solution and >>the water. Apparently the pH solution was supposed >>to change color with >>a change in CO2 concentration in the water, which it >>did - but thats >>another post. >> >>Any ways whilst all this was going on I put the jam >>jar which contained >>the smaller jar into the Guppy breeder being careful >>not to squish the >>guppie babys, and left it over night. >> >>The metal must have bent under pressure over time >>and the next morning >>TO MY HORROR i found only one baby guppy remained, >>the rest had swam out >>over the edge of the guppy breeder tank which was >>now under water. >> >>and before I realized I needed to act, wham! a sword >>tail eats the one >>remaining baby guppy. >> >>poor me. not happy, all my baby guppies are gone. >> >> >>So, my question to you is how long does it take for >>a guppy to get big >>enough to survive on its own without being eaten >>whilst eating this >>super special high protein egg yolk diet? >> >>=Nick >> >> >> >> >> > > > > >____________________________________________________ >Yahoo! Sports >Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football >http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >AquaticLife Management. > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12859	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk

I had five, they were happy in a 90gallon tank, i increased it to 8 they were happy and now I've increased it to 12 and they are starting to school properly and think one may have a belly full of eggs. Any ways, yep, i think some one from the group suggest to get at least five the first time and since then i have had no serious problems, except for a Cory Dory which EVERY thing picks on. =Nick Steve Szabo wrote: >To minimize fin nipping by barbs, you'll wan to have an odd number of the >species in the tank with a minimum of five. So, you might want to consider >getting 2 or 4 more cherry barbs. > >Now, this might not mitigate all fin nipping, but it should minimize it. > >\\Steve// > >-----Original Message----- >From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On >Behalf Of Tricia Wilkerson >Sent: Monday, July 04, 2005 12:19 PM >To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com >Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk > >I wonder if cherry barbs do that as well. When I had 3 of them in my tank >with guppies and platties I kept finding fish whose fins were missing, guess >I will nix the thought of getting anymore cherry barbs if that is the case. >MM & MP, '73 >Tricia, KG6PNC > >If you want to make friends world wide click the link below!! One catch it >is not a program that is supported buy windows 98 yet > >http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >AquaticLife Management. > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12860	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

Bruce, Yes, water rotates in the opposite direction in the Northern Hemisphere, when going down a drain. But what's really unnerving if you're not use to it -- Naturally the sun rises in the east (Northern and Southern Hemisphere, regardless), but in the Northern Hemisphere it makes an arc to the south as it heads to the west in the sky to set (in the west). It the Southern Hemisphere (like Australia, for instance), the sun makes an arc to the north as it heads west in the sky to set in the west. This of course is much more exaggerated in the Winter when the sun is much lower at noon. Just something I'll bet not everybody realizes unless they've traveled across the Equator. So as not to confuse anyone, this has absolutely nothing to do with the 24 hours of sunlight you would get at this time of year in Prudhoe Bay, Alaska on the North Slope above the Brooks Range ("Land of the Midnight Sun"). Australia is having a "normally long" day of sunshine today, just like us in the Northern Hemisphere, only a bit shorter as their seasons are reversed. In Sydney today sunrise was 7:02AM and sunset is scheduled for 5:00PM only the sun skirts towards the north during the day. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Bruce Hansen" <toxotes@a...> wrote: > Eric > > I can assure you that the water and the contents go down the pipe - is it > the opposite over there ? > > Cheers > > Bruce (Hansen) > > ANGFA (Qld) Inc - http://www.angfaqld.org.au/ > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Tuesday, July 05, 2005 7:27 AM > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium > > > when you flush, the water rotates the opposite direction of northern > hemisphere toilets. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Bruce Hansen > Sent: Monday, July 04, 2005 4:09 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium > > > I wonder if Paul would like to explain his remark about toilets in > Australia? > > I admit we don't seem to have the same obsessions as many Americans with > anal functions, vaginal dryness etc. In fact we are so backward that our > pharmacies don't even have entire lanes for devotees of these "religions" > :-) > > Cheers > > Bruce (Hansen) > > ANGFA (Qld) Inc - http://www.angfaqld.org.au/ > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "paul helms" <wtfmorlok@y...> > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Tuesday, July 05, 2005 4:25 AM > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium > > > . so it does appear > > that down under they are a bit backwards, just like > > their toilets... > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12861	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: New to the forum

So Ray, you think it was most likely a fungus because it was fuzzy? It definitely did not look like a grain of salt and there was only one spot. No one else had any markings. The tank is great now. Everyone is acting normal, eating, swimming, mating, and there are now 10 - 15 new guppy fry! Since I only treated the tank for 3 days, if it was ich, will it come back and how soon? If it was a fungus, do you think it was treated long enough (the spot disappeared after the first dose of rid-ich)? I guess I am wondering if I should just leave the tank alone or still treat it in some way in case it was ich. Thanks for all the advice! Rebecca

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12862	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk

I also have guppies in my community tank (with 2 zebra loaches, an albino bristlenose, and an oto) and do not separate them. There were 3 fry that made it the first time, 18 the second, and 10-15 new ones out and about yesterday. I have a heavily planted tank with java ferns, java moss, amazon sword, dwarf saggitaria, cabomba, anubias coffefolia (sp?), and my floating plant is water sprite. It grows really well and the long roots hang down and hide the babies. I feed the babies crushed flake food. Just my two cents :) Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Nicolas Munro <nmunro@q...> wrote: > Paul, can you remember what species the floating plant is you have? > > I'm working on planting out my tank, have it probably 10% planted by > surface area, Its greatly reduced my algae problem too. > > Still there is no plants which are bushy enough for the fry to hang in > so might have to keep my eyes open for something suitable in the aquatic > plant shops. > > =Nick > > Paul helms wrote: > > >depends on what is in the tank. fish are predatory > >animals that tend to eat anything that fits in their > >mouths. i personally do not separate the babies from > >the rtest of the fish and usually end up with 5-6 new > >fish per breeding that survive. having some floating > >plants greatly increases their chances of survival. i > >just use a crushed brine shrimp flake myself, and it > >works great. > > > >--- cynthia brennemann <brennewoman@h...> > >wrote: > > > > > > > >>>>So, my question to you is how long does it take > >>>> > >>>> > >>for > >> > >> > >>>>a guppy to get big > >>>>enough to survive on its own without being eaten > >>>>whilst eating this > >>>>super special high protein egg yolk diet? > >>>> > >>>>=Nick > >>>> > >>>> > >>guppy fry grow pretty quickly, but even newborns can > >>survive larger > >>fish like angelfish and tigerbarbs if you have a > >>moderately to heavily > >>planted tank with lots of places to hide. > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > > > > > >__________________________________________________ > >Do You Yahoo!? > >Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > >http://mail.yahoo.com > > > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > >AquaticLife Management. > > > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12863	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: Purple Betta Papa

Wow, he is beautiful!!!!! Congrats on the spawning, I hope everything goes well for you :) --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Pam <pamphetteplace@y...> wrote: > Purple Betta Papa > I have my first betta spawn and this is the hero that has done all the hard work!! > http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/pamphetteplace/album?.dir=/c849&.src=ph&. tok=ph0yEQDBpZOGrPGu > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12864	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk

Sorry to hear about your BN babies!! That's a shame :( I have read that they breed rather well, too, so hopefully you'll have more in no time! And I agree, guppies just keep going and going! And boy, do those females get BIG :) --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, FortWayneFish@a... wrote: > Nick, > Luckily Guppies breed like guppies. You will have more babies soon as long as > you have at least one adult male and female. > I think most of us have done more or less the same thing. > > I lost a whole batch ( 100+ ) bristlenose babies the other day. I seperated > the tank with a divider, knowing the BN babies could swim through it but > figuered That they would stay on there side at least over night. make a long story > short my divider wasn't propt up or fastened. The cichlids easily knocked it > over and got to the babies. > I wasn't thinking....I usually prop a couple Tall decorations on either side > of the egg crate for support. but I had a dumb @## attack and spaced it. > > As far as how long..depends. > > Fish rule: If it fits in the mouth it is food. Rule initiated by Mother > Nature 1000's of years ago. > > I know I know > I was No help > Rob > Indiana > > > > > > > In a message dated 7/3/2005 10:38:36 PM US Eastern Standard Time, > nmunro@q... writes: > > > > > > The metal must have bent under pressure over time and the next morning > > TO MY HORROR i found only one baby guppy remained, the rest had swam out > > over the edge of the guppy breeder tank which was now under water. > > > > and before I realized I needed to act, wham! a sword tail eats the one > > remaining baby guppy. > > > > poor me. not happy, all my baby guppies are gone. > > > > > > So, my question to you is how long does it take for a guppy to get big > > enough to survive on its own without being eaten whilst eating this > > super special high protein egg yolk diet? > > > > =Nick > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12865	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: New to the forum

I think you are right that I feed too much. They seem to eat it all in just a few minutes but I am sure some gets by them. I am going to start doing water changes twice per week now instead of once per week since the guppies just keep multiplying but the lfs won't take them until they are colored! So now I have about 35 guppies, 2 2" zebra loaches, 1 3" bristlenose and an oto. May I was what dechlorinator everyone suggests (am I allowed to ask about brands on here?)? Also, what liquid plant fertilizer? --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "dreammaker2623" <dreammaker2623@y...> wrote: > I would tend to think that you might have a heavy hand in the feeding > department. I would cut back on feedings and do more water changes to > get the water quality better. If you keep the water quality up then > the fish will be less likely to get stressed and have higher disease > resistance. Just make sure to not do massive water changes but about > 10 to 20 percent once or twice a week to get the water quality back up > to where it should be and make sure to mot feed more than the fish can > eat in one to two minutes a day. It does not hurt them to go for a day > or two with out eating (if they are in good condition) because noone > feeds them every day in the wild. Some fish may go weeks or longer > with out eating.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12866	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: New to the forum

Rebecca, Yes, from this description I would have to say it was fungus which apparently was taken care of by the Rid-Ich medication. Obviously it was just a mild touch of fungus which was caught right away -- no it should not come back if water parameters are fine and no one procures any damage (nipped fin, wound, etc.). This was not Ich -- you would know it by now -- like the potatoe chip ad said, "bet you can't eat just one", Ich is just about never seen as one and the exceedingly rare times it is, it is just for one day as there will no doubt be at least several more spots the following day as it progresses. You did not do a thorough treatment for Ich and by now you would certainly see more if that's what it was. Unless you see Ich spots, there's no need to treat for a disease that doesn't exist in your tank. If you feel like you want to take a precaution, you can raise the temperature up to 80o for a few days, which will boost the metabolism of the fish slightly, strengthening them and their immune system, without the drawback that they will become even slightly weakened from the excessive heat they would experience at 86o. Otherwise, yes just leave the tank alone (unless you feel it could use a partial water change because of those slightly elevated nitrite readings). Glad to hear you got a nice batch of guppy fry. Ray \ -- - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > So Ray, you think it was most likely a fungus because it was fuzzy? > It definitely did not look like a grain of salt and there was only one > spot. No one else had any markings. > > The tank is great now. Everyone is acting normal, eating, swimming, > mating, and there are now 10 - 15 new guppy fry! > > Since I only treated the tank for 3 days, if it was ich, will it come > back and how soon? If it was a fungus, do you think it was treated > long enough (the spot disappeared after the first dose of rid-ich)? > > I guess I am wondering if I should just leave the tank alone or still > treat it in some way in case it was ich. > > Thanks for all the advice! > Rebecca

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12867	From: Patrick	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

Remember the time Bart Simpson called Australia collect to see if their toilets really flushed backwards? They ended up having to go down under to pay the phone bill and they were staying at the American embassy, which had a special device to make the toilets flush correctly. When they left, the entire country was covered with frogs. :) Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill -------Original Message------- the water rotates differently as it goes down...one goes clockwise, while the other goes counterclockwise...I forget which is which. The same holds true for drains and any other time water forms a funnel when draining. Eric [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12868	From: countrymom2one	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Newbie

Hi everyone. I am Kelly. We have had our goldfish for about 5 yers now. My daughter got it as a gift from her half sister. I think the goldfish is on it's last leg though :(. What happened was my daughter's goldfish jumped out of its tank about a week ago. No one knows how long it was on the floor. My step daughter found the fish and poked it a few times and it didn't move at all so we thought it was dead. The thing is way to big to flush so we decided to put it back in the tank until we decided what to do with it. My step daughter literally peeled the fish from the carpet it was so stuck. When she put him back into the tank it sunk to the bottom like a rock then a few hours later started swimming again - but stupidly. it has been swimming into the tank, not realizing there are walls there. It also will not eat anything. It hasn't eaten anything since the whole thing happened. A fish that is always hungry seems to not know what do do with the food. Also, the fish is looking really bad. It looks like his fins are rotting and the side that was peeled from the carpet is looking pretty bad now too. It also has an open wound behind a gill where a fin should be. I hope this fish makes it. My daughter would be heartbroken if it didn't. I have no idea how to make this poor fish better. Kelly

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12869	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk

Cool thanks Rebecca, out of these plants which one do the fry like the most / live the longest in? =Nick thesydmonster wrote: >I also have guppies in my community tank (with 2 zebra loaches, an >albino bristlenose, and an oto) and do not separate them. There >were 3 fry that made it the first time, 18 the second, and 10-15 new >ones out and about yesterday. I have a heavily planted tank with >java ferns, java moss, amazon sword, dwarf saggitaria, cabomba, >anubias coffefolia (sp?), and my floating plant is water sprite. It >grows really well and the long roots hang down and hide the babies. >I feed the babies crushed flake food. Just my two cents :) > >Rebecca >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12870	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk

You bet! I would say the water sprite for sure. I have it tied to the cross bar that goes across the top of my tank so it stays in the back of the tank and doesn't block the light from the other plants. It's against the back glass and the new batch of fry just born have been hanging out in the roots. I did not have it in there for the last batch and they stayed in the java moss a lot. I believe java moss also stores nutrients for the new fry. Good luck! --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Nicolas Munro <nmunro@q...> wrote: > Cool thanks Rebecca, > > out of these plants which one do the fry like the most / live the > longest in? > > =Nick > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12871	From: Evita	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: Purple Betta Papa

Pam Beautiful photo even more beautiful fish. Do ya got any tips on taking a good photo like that. I tried yesterday and I got glare. Evita Pam <pamphetteplace@...> wrote:Purple Betta Papa I have my first betta spawn and this is the hero that has done all the hard work!! http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/pamphetteplace/album?.dir=/c849&.src=ph&.tok=ph0yEQDBpZOGrPGu [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12872	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: New to the forum

Thanks Ray! I stare at my fish every day so try to notice any changes immediately. I am sorry she got a fungus in the first place, though! Maybe a male nipped her? I will do another water change tomorrow to make sure water conditions are good for them. Thanks soooo much for the help, you have no idea how it's put my mind at ease. I love my fish obsessively (I am a huge believer in in taking responsibility for the life and well being of anything in my care) and just want them to be healthy and happy. Cheers to all :) Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > Rebecca, Yes, from this description I would have to say it was fungus > which apparently was taken care of by the Rid-Ich medication. > Obviously it was just a mild touch of fungus which was caught right > away -- no it should not come back if water parameters are fine and no > one procures any damage (nipped fin, wound, etc.). This was not Ich -- > you would know it by now -- like the potatoe chip ad said, "bet you > can't eat just one", Ich is just about never seen as one and the > exceedingly rare times it is, it is just for one day as there will no > doubt be at least several more spots the following day as it > progresses. You did not do a thorough treatment for Ich and by now you > would certainly see more if that's what it was. Unless you see Ich > spots, there's no need to treat for a disease that doesn't exist in > your tank. If you feel like you want to take a precaution, you can > raise the temperature up to 80o for a few days, which will boost the > metabolism of the fish slightly, strengthening them and their immune > system, without the drawback that they will become even slightly > weakened from the excessive heat they would experience at 86o. > Otherwise, yes just leave the tank alone (unless you feel it could use > a partial water change because of those slightly elevated nitrite > readings). Glad to hear you got a nice batch of guppy fry. Ray > \ -- > - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" <TheSydMonster@c...> > wrote: > > So Ray, you think it was most likely a fungus because it was fuzzy? > > It definitely did not look like a grain of salt and there was only > one > > spot. No one else had any markings. > > > > The tank is great now. Everyone is acting normal, eating, swimming, > > mating, and there are now 10 - 15 new guppy fry! > > > > Since I only treated the tank for 3 days, if it was ich, will it come > > back and how soon? If it was a fungus, do you think it was treated > > long enough (the spot disappeared after the first dose of rid- ich)? > > > > I guess I am wondering if I should just leave the tank alone or still > > treat it in some way in case it was ich. > > > > Thanks for all the advice! > > Rebecca

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12873	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

we americans are an interesting bunch are we not? Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote:when you flush, the water rotates the opposite direction of northern hemisphere toilets. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Bruce Hansen Sent: Monday, July 04, 2005 4:09 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium I wonder if Paul would like to explain his remark about toilets in Australia? I admit we don't seem to have the same obsessions as many Americans with anal functions, vaginal dryness etc. In fact we are so backward that our pharmacies don't even have entire lanes for devotees of these "religions" :-) Cheers Bruce (Hansen) ANGFA (Qld) Inc - http://www.angfaqld.org.au/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "paul helms" <wtfmorlok@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, July 05, 2005 4:25 AM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium . so it does appear > that down under they are a bit backwards, just like > their toilets... ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12874	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: New to the forum

Evita -- how are all your fish doing now?? I know it's tough, I hope it's going well. Sorry for your losses :( Rebecca

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12875	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: Purple Betta Papa

i agree, he's a pretty daddy! thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@...> wrote:Wow, he is beautiful!!!!! Congrats on the spawning, I hope everything goes well for you :) --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Pam <pamphetteplace@y...> wrote: > Purple Betta Papa > I have my first betta spawn and this is the hero that has done all the hard work!! > http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/pamphetteplace/album?.dir=/c849&.src=ph&. tok=ph0yEQDBpZOGrPGu > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12876	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: New to the forum

As for a dechlorinator, if your water had just chlorine in it, and not many do today, then use Kordon's Novaqua. If, like may systems today, the water is treated with what is commonly referred to as chloramines, then Kordon's Amquel. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of thesydmonster Sent: Monday, July 04, 2005 6:58 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: New to the forum I think you are right that I feed too much. They seem to eat it all in just a few minutes but I am sure some gets by them. I am going to start doing water changes twice per week now instead of once per week since the guppies just keep multiplying but the lfs won't take them until they are colored! So now I have about 35 guppies, 2 2" zebra loaches, 1 3" bristlenose and an oto. May I was what dechlorinator everyone suggests (am I allowed to ask about brands on here?)? Also, what liquid plant fertilizer? --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "dreammaker2623" <dreammaker2623@y...> wrote: > I would tend to think that you might have a heavy hand in the feeding > department. I would cut back on feedings and do more water changes to > get the water quality better. If you keep the water quality up then > the fish will be less likely to get stressed and have higher disease > resistance. Just make sure to not do massive water changes but about > 10 to 20 percent once or twice a week to get the water quality back up > to where it should be and make sure to mot feed more than the fish can > eat in one to two minutes a day. It does not hurt them to go for a day > or two with out eating (if they are in good condition) because noone > feeds them every day in the wild. Some fish may go weeks or longer > with out eating.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12877	From: Evita	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: New to the forum

Rebecca, Thanks for asking. They seem to be much better. I lost two but one I think was deformed when I bought it. My babies are growing like weeds. It also looks like my darker adult fish with the black tail and fins was a male. How do I know this you may ask? Because the orange one was the mom of the fry and they have been really pairing up. She already is looking fat again. If things keep going this way I will need more tanks for sure. I was wondering does anyone know how long a platy is preg. before they have babies? Evita thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@...> wrote: Evita -- how are all your fish doing now?? I know it's tough, I hope it's going well. Sorry for your losses :( Rebecca ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12878	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

*grin* Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez Sent: Monday, July 04, 2005 10:41 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium we americans are an interesting bunch are we not? Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote:when you flush, the water rotates the opposite direction of northern hemisphere toilets. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Bruce Hansen Sent: Monday, July 04, 2005 4:09 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium I wonder if Paul would like to explain his remark about toilets in Australia? I admit we don't seem to have the same obsessions as many Americans with anal functions, vaginal dryness etc. In fact we are so backward that our pharmacies don't even have entire lanes for devotees of these "religions" :-) Cheers Bruce (Hansen) ANGFA (Qld) Inc - http://www.angfaqld.org.au/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "paul helms" <wtfmorlok@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, July 05, 2005 4:25 AM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium . so it does appear > that down under they are a bit backwards, just like > their toilets... ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Saltwater <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Saltwater+aquarium&w1=Saltwater+aquariu m&w2=Marine+biologist&w3=Reef+tank&c=3&s=61&.sig=UY1316z62uVmxBaTXrRFwg> aquarium Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biologist&w1=Saltwater+aquarium& w2=Marine+biologist&w3=Reef+tank&c=3&s=61&.sig=cIu6LkaigzIAXitzbMJI2g> biologist Reef <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Reef+tank&w1=Saltwater+aquarium&w2=Mari ne+biologist&w3=Reef+tank&c=3&s=61&.sig=nOJjj1Le7P4CO7AebgBZiQ> tank _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12879	From: pamphetteplace	Date: 7/4/2005
Subject: Re: Purple Betta Papa

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Evita <evitabug@y...> wrote: > Do ya got any tips on taking a good photo like that. I tried yesterday and I got glare. Evita Thank you Evita, and I know what you are talking about, I usually have glare also. I was just lucky with this one. I understand if you turn off your flash you can get a better photo, but mine doesnt turn off. I am sure there are ppl here that could give us some good tips (hehehe cus I havent a clue....sry) > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Sports > Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12880	From: paul helms	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: New to the forum

also if you have a high nitrates level you may want to use the amquel + it takes care of 15ppm of nitrate --- Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > As for a dechlorinator, if your water had just > chlorine in it, and not many > do today, then use Kordon's Novaqua. If, like may > systems today, the water > is treated with what is commonly referred to as > chloramines, then Kordon's > Amquel. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of thesydmonster > Sent: Monday, July 04, 2005 6:58 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: New to the forum > > I think you are right that I feed too much. They > seem to eat it all > in just a few minutes but I am sure some gets by > them. I am going to > start doing water changes twice per week now instead > of once per week > since the guppies just keep multiplying but the lfs > won't take them > until they are colored! So now I have about 35 > guppies, 2 2" zebra > loaches, 1 3" bristlenose and an oto. > > May I was what dechlorinator everyone suggests (am I > allowed to ask > about brands on here?)? > > Also, what liquid plant fertilizer? > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "dreammaker2623" > > <dreammaker2623@y...> wrote: > > I would tend to think that you might have a heavy > hand in the > feeding > > department. I would cut back on feedings and do > more water changes > to > > get the water quality better. If you keep the > water quality up then > > the fish will be less likely to get stressed and > have higher disease > > resistance. Just make sure to not do massive water > changes but about > > 10 to 20 percent once or twice a week to get the > water quality back > up > > to where it should be and make sure to mot feed > more than the fish > can > > eat in one to two minutes a day. It does not hurt > them to go for a > day > > or two with out eating (if they are in good > condition) because noone > > feeds them every day in the wild. Some fish may go > weeks or longer > > with out eating. > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12881	From: paul helms	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk

i would personally disagree with that ...they are just aggressive. they do not exhibit the same behavior in groups. when they are alone they are just bullies. --- Nicolas Munro <nmunro@...> wrote: > If you feed them plenty of Algae discs, which I'm > using the Wardly brand > btw, this greatly reduces any problem of fin nipping > in my experience. > > The guy in my LFS said they are after the slime > coating ie lacking the > minerals hence Algae discs. > > > =Nick > > paul helms wrote: > > >tiger barbs do not really belong with guppies of > any > >size. they are fin eaters...meaning they typically > go > >after anything with long or colorful fins > > > >--- Nicolas Munro <nmunro@...> > wrote: > > > > > > > >>I'm sad now :-( > >> > >> > >>The reason i started this post was cause I've had > 12 > >>baby guppies for > >>about a month now and decided they looked big > enough > >>to put into the > >>community aquarium. > >> > >>So i put one in the community aquarium to try. It > >>swam and avoided two > >>guppies then wham! tiger barb action, no more > guppy > >> :-( > >> > >> > >>So I figured I had better not put any more in. > >>Latter that evening i > >>was experimenting with a pH solution in a small > >>container inside a jam > >>jar so there was only a air gap between the > >>concentrated pH solution and > >>the water. Apparently the pH solution was supposed > >>to change color with > >>a change in CO2 concentration in the water, which > it > >>did - but thats > >>another post. > >> > >>Any ways whilst all this was going on I put the > jam > >>jar which contained > >>the smaller jar into the Guppy breeder being > careful > >>not to squish the > >>guppie babys, and left it over night. > >> > >>The metal must have bent under pressure over time > >>and the next morning > >>TO MY HORROR i found only one baby guppy remained, > >>the rest had swam out > >>over the edge of the guppy breeder tank which was > >>now under water. > >> > >>and before I realized I needed to act, wham! a > sword > >>tail eats the one > >>remaining baby guppy. > >> > >>poor me. not happy, all my baby guppies are gone. > >> > >> > >>So, my question to you is how long does it take > for > >>a guppy to get big > >>enough to survive on its own without being eaten > >>whilst eating this > >>super special high protein egg yolk diet? > >> > >>=Nick > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > > > > > > > > > >____________________________________________________ > > >Yahoo! Sports > >Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy > Football > >http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com > > > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > >Please delete this line and everything below it > when replying, thanks. > > > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING > the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter, > >AquaticLife Management. > > > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > you! > > > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Make Yahoo! your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12882	From: paul helms	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk

java fern works exceptionally well. it grows and recovers well, and it parts are fine and bushy. fine enough for the babies to manuver, yet bushy enough to hide from adults. it grows much like anacharis in taht anywhere it is broken it will grow. --- Nicolas Munro <nmunro@...> wrote: > Paul, can you remember what species the floating > plant is you have? > > I'm working on planting out my tank, have it > probably 10% planted by > surface area, Its greatly reduced my algae problem > too. > > Still there is no plants which are bushy enough for > the fry to hang in > so might have to keep my eyes open for something > suitable in the aquatic > plant shops. > > =Nick > > Paul helms wrote: > > >depends on what is in the tank. fish are predatory > >animals that tend to eat anything that fits in > their > >mouths. i personally do not separate the babies > from > >the rtest of the fish and usually end up with 5-6 > new > >fish per breeding that survive. having some > floating > >plants greatly increases their chances of survival. > i > >just use a crushed brine shrimp flake myself, and > it > >works great. > > > >--- cynthia brennemann <brennewoman@...> > >wrote: > > > > > > > >>>>So, my question to you is how long does it take > >>>> > >>>> > >>for > >> > >> > >>>>a guppy to get big > >>>>enough to survive on its own without being eaten > >>>>whilst eating this > >>>>super special high protein egg yolk diet? > >>>> > >>>>=Nick > >>>> > >>>> > >>guppy fry grow pretty quickly, but even newborns > can > >>survive larger > >>fish like angelfish and tigerbarbs if you have a > >>moderately to heavily > >>planted tank with lots of places to hide. > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > > > > > >__________________________________________________ > >Do You Yahoo!? > >Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > protection around > >http://mail.yahoo.com > > > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > >Please delete this line and everything below it > when replying, thanks. > > > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING > the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter, > >AquaticLife Management. > > > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > you! > > > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12883	From: paul helms	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

its been covered by others before i got the message...just directional rotation. it was not meant as a slander and hopefully not taken taht way. i have 2 cousins and an uncle who are australian, and did not mean anything by it. --- Bruce Hansen <toxotes@...> wrote: > I wonder if Paul would like to explain his remark > about toilets in > Australia? > > I admit we don't seem to have the same obsessions > as many Americans with > anal functions, vaginal dryness etc. In fact we are > so backward that our > pharmacies don't even have entire lanes for devotees > of these "religions" > :-) > > Cheers > > Bruce (Hansen) > > ANGFA (Qld) Inc - http://www.angfaqld.org.au/ > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "paul helms" <wtfmorlok@...> > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Tuesday, July 05, 2005 4:25 AM > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: setting up a new salt > water aquarium > > > . so it does appear > > that down under they are a bit backwards, just > like > > their toilets... > > ____________________________________________________ Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12884	From: paul helms	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

lionfish are for sale everywhere. that was not the issue. the issue was that i believe people should make sure they know what they are posting before they give that kind of advice to a newbie. the issue is taht several people suggested a firefish for a small tank and sandra took it upon herself to spout out that it is venemous, large, and aggressive; none of which is true for teh fish everyone else was talking about. that is the kind of crap that scares people away, and when at work i have to do a lot of hand holding because of it. --- TankGurl <fishgoddess@...> wrote: > Wow...people....chill out!!! I know the heat can > make some folks a > little pissy, but really...this is rather childish > don't you think? > > Anyone who has spent time researching any species > will soon discover > there is a mass amount of misinformation, citing of > incorrect > attributes and yes, incorrect scientific and common > names. The trick > is to sift through the bs and come up with your own > sound conclusion. > Also, experience and advice always differs. What > works for one person, > isn't always going to work for another. You say > "potato' , I say > 'patato'. :) > > And for the record, I've seen many "Lionfish" for > sale and reputable lfs. > > > Kelly > > On 7/4/05, paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > maybe you should just grow up! admit that you gave > > poor advice based on your loss with reality. i > don't > > post bs all day...in fact it was you that posted > > bs...incorrect information. and if you will note, > my > > posts are very short in comparison to several > other > > posters on here. just because i check my email > daily > > does not mean that i have no life.......does it > mean > > that you don't? > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@...> wrote: > > > > > yup, just like titanic... > > > > > > Other than you, most people on here seem to have > a > > > LIFE and don´t > > > have time to post bs all day long, so maybe you > > > should write the > > > president if he let´s everyone know not to call > the > > > lionfish > > > firefish for whatever reason the voices in your > head > > > say so! > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > wrote: > > > > my boat is not the one half sunk...it is the > one > > > with > > > > a good compass, map and plenty of gas. > > > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > ilmao... whatever floats your boat ... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul > helms > > > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > applauds what? you are still wrong. even > the > > > guy > > > > > with > > > > > > 50 years in the hobby says he never heard > of > > > it > > > > > called > > > > > > a lionfish. just because he has the time > to > > > go to > > > > > 20 > > > > > > web searches to find others calling them > the > > > wrong > > > > > > thing does not mean a damn thing. i did > not > > > > > google or > > > > > > go to anything of teh wall. go to > > > > > saltwaterfish.com > > > > > > and there will be a section of firefish.. > > > lions > > > > > and > > > > > > scorpions will not be there. flat out, > make > > > sure > > > > > you > > > > > > are talking about the same thing as > everyone > > > else > > > > > when > > > > > > you decide to tell a beginner that one of > the > > > few > > > > > fish > > > > > > that will actually work in the tank they > have > > > is > > > > > > venemous and deadly, especially when > several > > > > > others > > > > > > are recommending it. > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > *applauds* > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, > "Steve > > > > > Szabo" > > > > > > > <steve@l...> wrote: > > > > > > > > You had said, "i did look it up and > when > > > you > > > > > type > > > > > > > in firefish in > > > > > > > the web > > > > > > > > browser nothing comes up about > lionfish." > > > > > > > apparently in reply to > > > > > > > Sandra's, > > > > > > > > "you can also look it up, anywhere you > > > look > > > > > for a > > > > > > > firefish there > > > > > > > will show > > > > > > > > up two species - the dartfish, and the > > > > > lionfish > > > > > > > which some people > > > > > > > call > > > > > > > > firefishes.". I took that to mean you > did > > > a > > > > > search > > > > > > > and did not > > > > > > > find any > > > > > > > > references to lionfish in your > results. > > > So, I > > > > > > > googled firefish, > > > > > > > i.e. a web > > > > > > > > search, and easily found a reference > to > > > > > lionfish > > > > > > > in the first ten > > > > > > > responses. > > > > > > > > I also felt I would be remiss if I did > not > > > > > report > > > > > > > the results of > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > returned first ten results. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I don't know what you used to search > the > > > web, > > > > > but, > > > > > > > it appears, > > > > > > > that it is > > > > > > > > not difficult to find references to > > > lionfish. > > > > > Just > > > > > > > for ha-has, I > > > > > > > just did > > > > > > > > another search using the search engine > > > Scirus > > > > > > > (http://www.scirus.com) and > > > > > > > > the first 10 results have three direct > > > > > references > > > > > > > to lion fish > > > > > > > (one _Pterois > > > > > > > > miles_ and two _P. volitans_) and one > > > > > > > _Nemateleotris decora_ which > > > > > > > is not a > > > > > > > > lionfish but, I believe, a goby. Two > > > entries > > > > > did > > > > > > > not distinguish > > > > > > > the species > > > > > > > > in the description, but one was not a > > > > > lionfish, > > > > > > > the other was. The > > > > > > > other > > > > > > > > five entries were of something else > > > entirely, > === message truncated === ____________________________________________________ Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12885	From: Bruce Hansen	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

No problems Paul - I had a good laugh about it. Cheers Bruce (Hansen) ANGFA (Qld) Inc - http://www.angfaqld.org.au/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "paul helms" <wtfmorlok@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, July 05, 2005 5:30 PM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium > its been covered by others before i got the > message...just directional rotation. it was not meant > as a slander and hopefully not taken taht way. i have > 2 cousins and an uncle who are australian, and did not > mean anything by it.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12886	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: FW: [AquaticLife] Need help with spots on inside of tank?

_____ From: Eric Roberts [mailto:woad@...] Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2005 8:53 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Need help with spots on inside of tank? It could be permanent. Minerals and salts in water can etch the glass. I have the same problem in my tank and haven't found a way to get rid of it. I even tried using some steel wool and it had no effect. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of ahorseofcourse66 Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2005 12:51 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Need help with spots on inside of tank? Hi, I bought a 20 gallon setup from my dad. The tank has been stored for about a year. We cleaned it good and the tank looked great. We set it up and put tap water, the water treatment and aqui. salt in the tank and the filter and let it run for acouple of days. On the secound day we noticed it looked like it had water spots on the inside. The spots got worse over the next few days. So we emptied the tank and cleaned it with CLR and then The WORKS. Rinsed and rinsed to make sure the tank was clean and then wipped it out so there would be no water spots on the inside. Same thing happened the second time, tank looked great 2 days later hard water looking spots on the inside that you can only scratch off with your finger nail... What can I use to get read of the spots. I don't even know whats causing them, muchless how to get read of them. I don't want to trash the tank but the spots are really really bad, on all 4 sides. Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12887	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: Muskie Tales

You guys do know that all of these are "tales" that aren't true, right??? I seriously hope no one is going to knock the fish over the head. emily "LobsterPond.com" <BlueMarinaPonds@...> wrote: Hey, you didn't know about muskies? Yes, muskie are big and the tales about them are endless. You will always remember the one about the fisherman who got one on his line - him and his boat were pulled around Leach Lake all day and then night. He was never heard from again. Muskies are the reason most boaters carry billy club or baseball bat in the boat. You HAVE TO KNOCK the fish out if you get it in the boat. Northerns (by the way) are a cross of muskie and some trout type fish. From a muskie fisher-woman Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12888	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: muskie grabbing a pike

Come on, the fish has to eat somehow! It's true through. My dad has seen them take down birds, and he also go bit and had to get stitches :o Emily Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote: that is truly horrifying! glad i don't live in muskie country =) --- harry perry wrote: > Muskie will also eat baby ducks, baby geese and small dogs. Don't dangle your feet over the side > of the boat. > > Harry > > Valeen Gonzalez wrote: > this is a photo of a muskie (sp?) grabbing onto a pike that my husband's coworker was reeling > in. > he said the pike was about 12"-15" long so you can tell the muskie was humongous! my husband's > coworker lives in minnesota so i'm assuming this was somewhere in minnesota too. > > i think i'm going to have weird dreams tonight after viewing this photo =) > > http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v681/valeen/muskie.jpg > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if > changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: > old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Sports > Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs! Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12889	From: TankGurl	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: FW: [AquaticLife] Need help with spots on inside of tank?

I wonder if a straight razor blade might do the trick? I use one on the salt deposits in my tanks and it works very well. Kelly On 7/5/05, Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > > > > _____ > > From: Eric Roberts [mailto:woad@...] > Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2005 8:53 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Need help with spots on inside of tank? > > > It could be permanent. Minerals and salts in water can etch the glass. I > have the same problem in my tank and haven't found a way to get rid of it. > I even tried using some steel wool and it had no effect. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of ahorseofcourse66 > Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2005 12:51 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Need help with spots on inside of tank? > > > Hi, I bought a 20 gallon setup from my dad. The tank has been stored > for about a year. We cleaned it good and the tank looked great. We > set it up and put tap water, the water treatment and aqui. salt in the > tank and the filter and let it run for acouple of days. On the secound > day we noticed it looked like it had water spots on the inside. The > spots got worse over the next few days. So we emptied the tank and > cleaned it with CLR and then The WORKS. Rinsed and rinsed to make sure > the tank was clean and then wipped it out so there would be no water > spots on the inside. Same thing happened the second time, tank looked > great 2 days later hard water looking spots on the inside that you can > only scratch off with your finger nail... What can I use to get read > of the spots. I don't even know whats causing them, muchless how to > get read of them. I don't want to trash the tank but the spots are > really really bad, on all 4 sides. > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > -- 65g Malawi http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 135g Frontosa/Tang http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12890	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: FW: [AquaticLife] Need help with spots on inside of tank?

I tried scrubbing with steel wool and it didn't touch the spots on my glass...not sure that a blade would help. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of TankGurl Sent: Tuesday, July 05, 2005 10:16 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: FW: [AquaticLife] Need help with spots on inside of tank? I wonder if a straight razor blade might do the trick? I use one on the salt deposits in my tanks and it works very well. Kelly On 7/5/05, Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > > > > _____ > > From: Eric Roberts [mailto:woad@...] > Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2005 8:53 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Need help with spots on inside of tank? > > > It could be permanent. Minerals and salts in water can etch the glass. I > have the same problem in my tank and haven't found a way to get rid of it. > I even tried using some steel wool and it had no effect. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of ahorseofcourse66 > Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2005 12:51 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Need help with spots on inside of tank? > > > Hi, I bought a 20 gallon setup from my dad. The tank has been stored > for about a year. We cleaned it good and the tank looked great. We > set it up and put tap water, the water treatment and aqui. salt in the > tank and the filter and let it run for acouple of days. On the secound > day we noticed it looked like it had water spots on the inside. The > spots got worse over the next few days. So we emptied the tank and > cleaned it with CLR and then The WORKS. Rinsed and rinsed to make sure > the tank was clean and then wipped it out so there would be no water > spots on the inside. Same thing happened the second time, tank looked > great 2 days later hard water looking spots on the inside that you can > only scratch off with your finger nail... What can I use to get read > of the spots. I don't even know whats causing them, muchless how to > get read of them. I don't want to trash the tank but the spots are > really really bad, on all 4 sides. > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > -- 65g Malawi http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 135g Frontosa/Tang http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011 ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12891	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: No, it's a northern pike grabbing a pike was muskie grabbing a pike

No, look at the markings on the larger fish. It has white spots on a dark background. It's a large northern pike eating a smaller one. Northerns can get huge too: http://www.hearnelakelodge.com/images/Dsc00038.jpg http://www.allkayakfishing.com/float_tubing/photo/snorth.jpg But muskies get huger. http://www.trentu.ca/muskie/biggies/bfst45.html I found a picture showing the typical muskie pattern (barred): http://www.muskiecentral.com/images/fish_muskieJ.jpg There are also spotted muskies: http://savetheriver.org/research/muskie_release/released%20muskie%20in%20arms_greg%20reynolds.jpg and clear muskies: http://www.trentu.ca/muskie/images/gal-rommel.jpg Dark markings (spots or vertical bands) over a light background. Clear muskie that lacks the dark markings. You can see how the fish in the picture eating the smaller fish has light spots over a dark background typical of a northern pike. There is also a hybrid between the two species known as a "tiger muskie" These are the most beautiful of all: http://www.wildlife.utah.gov/fishing/tiger_muskie_tips.html http://www.muskiesupnorth.com/images/Paul%20Ortuskza48.5Tiger.jpg..jpg I just think the patterns are amazing! I release ALL muskies and large northern pikes. Emily Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote: this is a photo of a muskie (sp?) grabbing onto a pike that my husband's coworker was reeling in. he said the pike was about 12"-15" long so you can tell the muskie was humongous! my husband's coworker lives in minnesota so i'm assuming this was somewhere in minnesota too. i think i'm going to have weird dreams tonight after viewing this photo =) http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v681/valeen/muskie.jpg Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs! Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12892	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: spotted muskie

I found another photo: http://www.lindenhurstil.org/lakescom/Images/Fishing/wSpotted.jpg The muskie in the photo should not be held that way. Especially for very large northerns and muskies you never want to hold them vertically because their bodies are too heavy. Gill lock and hold the base of the tail, or even better, skip the photo for a water release. Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12893	From: Heather Husvar	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: Muskie Tales

Emily: I would presume that if someone took a club to a fish like that it was probably going to be eaten. Cruel sounding, yes. May be necessary?? I don't know, but I would imagine it could be and if a giant fish were landed on my boat and started eating me.. heh.. (okay okay! Highly improbable!). Heather H. On 7/5/05, Emily Tenczar <bababanana@...> wrote: > You guys do know that all of these are "tales" that aren't true, right??? I seriously hope no one is going to knock the fish over the head. > emily > > "LobsterPond.com" <BlueMarinaPonds@...> wrote: > > Hey, you didn't know about muskies? > > Yes, muskie are big and the tales about them are endless. You will always remember the one about the fisherman who got one on his line - him and his boat were pulled around Leach Lake all day and then night. He was never heard from again. > > Muskies are the reason most boaters carry billy club or baseball bat in the boat. You HAVE TO KNOCK the fish out if you get it in the boat. > > Northerns (by the way) are a cross of muskie and some trout type fish. > > From a muskie fisher-woman > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > -- The rules of parents should be but three...Love, Limit, and Let them be. - Elaine M. Ward

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12894	From: Sandra	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

i perfectly described a lionfish´s behavior - dare to say otherwise. Its not my fault that i confused firefish with lionfish as many people tend to call it that way - i did never talk about the other firefish she meant cause i have never had one, so no experience there and wouldnt post about something i "just read". Go on and do some more handholding, and save the world from evil... --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms <wtfmorlok@y...> wrote: > lionfish are for sale everywhere. that was not the > issue. the issue was that i believe people should > make sure they know what they are posting before they > give that kind of advice to a newbie. the issue is > taht several people suggested a firefish for a small > tank and sandra took it upon herself to spout out that > it is venemous, large, and aggressive; none of which > is true for teh fish everyone else was talking about. > that is the kind of crap that scares people away, and > when at work i have to do a lot of hand holding > because of it. > > --- TankGurl <fishgoddess@g...> wrote: > > > Wow...people....chill out!!! I know the heat can > > make some folks a > > little pissy, but really...this is rather childish > > don't you think? > > > > Anyone who has spent time researching any species > > will soon discover > > there is a mass amount of misinformation, citing of > > incorrect > > attributes and yes, incorrect scientific and common > > names. The trick > > is to sift through the bs and come up with your own > > sound conclusion. > > Also, experience and advice always differs. What > > works for one person, > > isn't always going to work for another. You say > > "potato' , I say > > 'patato'. :) > > > > And for the record, I've seen many "Lionfish" for > > sale and reputable lfs. > > > > > > Kelly > > > > On 7/4/05, paul helms <wtfmorlok@y...> wrote: > > > maybe you should just grow up! admit that you gave > > > poor advice based on your loss with reality. i > > don't > > > post bs all day...in fact it was you that posted > > > bs...incorrect information. and if you will note, > > my > > > posts are very short in comparison to several > > other > > > posters on here. just because i check my email > > daily > > > does not mean that i have no life.......does it > > mean > > > that you don't? > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > yup, just like titanic... > > > > > > > > Other than you, most people on here seem to have > > a > > > > LIFE and don´t > > > > have time to post bs all day long, so maybe you > > > > should write the > > > > president if he let´s everyone know not to call > > the > > > > lionfish > > > > firefish for whatever reason the voices in your > > head > > > > say so! > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > > wrote: > > > > > my boat is not the one half sunk...it is the > > one > > > > with > > > > > a good compass, map and plenty of gas. > > > > > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > ilmao... whatever floats your boat ... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul > > helms > > > > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > applauds what? you are still wrong. even > > the > > > > guy > > > > > > with > > > > > > > 50 years in the hobby says he never heard > > of > > > > it > > > > > > called > > > > > > > a lionfish. just because he has the time > > to > > > > go to > > > > > > 20 > > > > > > > web searches to find others calling them > > the > > > > wrong > > > > > > > thing does not mean a damn thing. i did > > not > > > > > > google or > > > > > > > go to anything of teh wall. go to > > > > > > saltwaterfish.com > > > > > > > and there will be a section of firefish.. > > > > lions > > > > > > and > > > > > > > scorpions will not be there. flat out, > > make > > > > sure > > > > > > you > > > > > > > are talking about the same thing as > > everyone > > > > else > > > > > > when > > > > > > > you decide to tell a beginner that one of > > the > > > > few > > > > > > fish > > > > > > > that will actually work in the tank they > > have > > > > is > > > > > > > venemous and deadly, especially when > > several > > > > > > others > > > > > > > are recommending it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > *applauds* > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, > > "Steve > > > > > > Szabo" > > > > > > > > <steve@l...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > You had said, "i did look it up and > > when > > > > you > > > > > > type > > > > > > > > in firefish in > > > > > > > > the web > > > > > > > > > browser nothing comes up about > > lionfish." > > > > > > > > apparently in reply to > > > > > > > > Sandra's, > > > > > > > > > "you can also look it up, anywhere you > > > > look > > > > > > for a > > > > > > > > firefish there > > > > > > > > will show > > > > > > > > > up two species - the dartfish, and the > > > > > > lionfish > > > > > > > > which some people > > > > > > > > call > > > > > > > > > firefishes.". I took that to mean you > > did > > > > a > > > > > > search > > > > > > > > and did not > > > > > > > > find any > > > > > > > > > references to lionfish in your > > results. > > > > So, I > > > > > > > > googled firefish, > > > > > > > > i.e. a web > > > > > > > > > search, and easily found a reference > > to > > > > > > lionfish > > > > > > > > in the first ten > > > > > > > > responses. > > > > > > > > > I also felt I would be remiss if I did > > not > > > > > > report > > > > > > > > the results of > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > returned first ten results. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I don't know what you used to search > > the > > > > web, > > > > > > but, > > > > > > > > it appears, > > > > > > > > that it is > > > > > > > > > not difficult to find references to > > > > lionfish. > > > > > > Just > > > > > > > > for ha-has, I > > > > > > > > just did > > > > > > > > > another search using the search engine > > > > Scirus > > > > > > > > (http://www.scirus.com) and > > > > > > > > > the first 10 results have three direct > > > > > > references > > > > > > > > to lion fish > > > > > > > > (one _Pterois > > > > > > > > > miles_ and two _P. volitans_) and one > > > > > > > > _Nemateleotris decora_ which > > > > > > > > is not a > > > > > > > > > lionfish but, I believe, a goby. Two > > > > entries > > > > > > did > > > > > > > > not distinguish > > > > > > > > the species > > > > > > > > > in the description, but one was not a > > > > > > lionfish, > > > > > > > > the other was. The > > > > > > > > other > > > > > > > > > five entries were of something else > > > > entirely, > > > === message truncated === > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > Yahoo! Sports > Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football > http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12895	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: Muskie Tales

I don't believe in eating huge fish (size is relative to the species, obviously) because the big ones 1) are fattier and don't taste as well as smaller ones and 2) they are the main contributors to the gene pool. Also, we release all muskies. It's kind of almost a religious thing in my family, lol. In fact I just got back from lake of the woods (canada side) where they have raised the minimum keeping size for muskies to 54" And these days, a lot of people are chosing to release trophy fish and get a graphite replica made instead. They last longer than real mounted fish and the colors don't fade :) Emily Heather Husvar <hhusvar@...> wrote: Emily: I would presume that if someone took a club to a fish like that it was probably going to be eaten. Cruel sounding, yes. May be necessary?? I don't know, but I would imagine it could be and if a giant fish were landed on my boat and started eating me.. heh.. (okay okay! Highly improbable!). Heather H. On 7/5/05, Emily Tenczar wrote: > You guys do know that all of these are "tales" that aren't true, right??? I seriously hope no one is going to knock the fish over the head. > emily > > "LobsterPond.com" wrote: > > Hey, you didn't know about muskies? > > Yes, muskie are big and the tales about them are endless. You will always remember the one about the fisherman who got one on his line - him and his boat were pulled around Leach Lake all day and then night. He was never heard from again. > > Muskies are the reason most boaters carry billy club or baseball bat in the boat. You HAVE TO KNOCK the fish out if you get it in the boat. > > Northerns (by the way) are a cross of muskie and some trout type fish. > > From a muskie fisher-woman > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > . > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > -- The rules of parents should be but three...Love, Limit, and Let them be. - Elaine M. Ward ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12896	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: FW: [AquaticLife] Need help with spots on inside of tank?

don't know if anyone has suggested this-haven't been reading the whole thread-but have you tried using a credit card? i use one on my coraline spots in my reef tank and it works great! --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > I tried scrubbing with steel wool and it didn't touch the spots on my > glass...not sure that a blade would help. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of TankGurl > Sent: Tuesday, July 05, 2005 10:16 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: FW: [AquaticLife] Need help with spots on inside of tank? > > > I wonder if a straight razor blade might do the trick? I use one on > the salt deposits in my tanks and it works very well. > > > Kelly > > On 7/5/05, Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: Eric Roberts [mailto:woad@...] > > Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2005 8:53 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Need help with spots on inside of tank? > > > > > > It could be permanent. Minerals and salts in water can etch the glass. I > > have the same problem in my tank and haven't found a way to get rid of it. > > I even tried using some steel wool and it had no effect. > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of ahorseofcourse66 > > Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2005 12:51 AM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Need help with spots on inside of tank? > > > > > > Hi, I bought a 20 gallon setup from my dad. The tank has been stored > > for about a year. We cleaned it good and the tank looked great. We > > set it up and put tap water, the water treatment and aqui. salt in the > > tank and the filter and let it run for acouple of days. On the secound > > day we noticed it looked like it had water spots on the inside. The > > spots got worse over the next few days. So we emptied the tank and > > cleaned it with CLR and then The WORKS. Rinsed and rinsed to make sure > > the tank was clean and then wipped it out so there would be no water > > spots on the inside. Same thing happened the second time, tank looked > > great 2 days later hard water looking spots on the inside that you can > > only scratch off with your finger nail... What can I use to get read > > of the spots. I don't even know whats causing them, muchless how to > > get read of them. I don't want to trash the tank but the spots are > > really really bad, on all 4 sides. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > > . > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > 65g Malawi > http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 > 135g Frontosa/Tang > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011 > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12897	From: paul helms	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: spotted muskie

that fish is probably already dead...lol\ --- Emily Tenczar <bababanana@...> wrote: > I found another photo: > http://www.lindenhurstil.org/lakescom/Images/Fishing/wSpotted.jpg > > The muskie in the photo should not be held that way. > Especially for very large northerns and muskies you > never want to hold them vertically because their > bodies are too heavy. Gill lock and hold the base of > the tail, or even better, skip the photo for a water > release. > Emily > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ____________________________________________________ Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12898	From: clarkmariposo25@aol.com	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: How long in hobby?

That is very impressive Wendy! Robyn [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12899	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: I'm back

Okay, the female guppy that had a fuzzy spot on her side now has one on the top of her head. Just one single spot, does not look as fuzzy as the other one. She also has not been as active, hanging out under the water sprite. No one else has spots or is flashing. Since I don't have a QT tank, I am off to the store to buy a little container I can hang in the tank and try to treat her and not the whole tank. I will have them test my water while I am there. What should I do for her? Thanks, Rebecca

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12900	From: joequality1980	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: weird colors

is it just my computer, or did the group color theme become more prone to causing seizures?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12901	From: Sandra	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: I'm back

Hi Rebecca, I had the same problem with some new arrived stock after treating them for ich (saltwater fishes here). It´s hard to say if it is a parasite or an infection/fungus if there is only one or two spots, but something that worked with my fish was when i catched the one with the spot and carefully removed it with my hand (his was on top of the fin and looked fuzzy as well) it was a little hard to remove it cause it seemed to be really stuck there, but once i removed it, nothing else appeared, i also gave him a freshwater dip just in case it was a parasite, but you already have freshwater fish ;). Try removing it with your hands and check if something else occurs! Good luck, sandra --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > Okay, the female guppy that had a fuzzy spot on her side now has one > on the top of her head. Just one single spot, does not look as fuzzy > as the other one. She also has not been as active, hanging out under > the water sprite. No one else has spots or is flashing. > > Since I don't have a QT tank, I am off to the store to buy a little > container I can hang in the tank and try to treat her and not the > whole tank. I will have them test my water while I am there. > > What should I do for her? > > Thanks, > Rebecca

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12902	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: AquaticLife - Re: Newbie

There is a Gold-Fish only group that would be good for you to join if you are not a member already. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Gold-Fish or you can send an email to Gold-Fish-subscribe@yahoogroups.com What are you treating the fish/tank with? I am not a health expert (I've been fortunate) but you should be using Melafix at a minimum which is a general anti-bacterial and helps with curing fin rot and other skin injuries. You should probably move the fish to a hospital tank if you have one... but if not, just treat your entire tank per the directions. Also do a search at http://www.DrsFosterSmith.com for the symptoms on your Goldfish. On the page that comes up with the recommended medicines, there are also links to several articles that will be helpful and informative. http://www.koivet.com is another good site for health issues. If your guy gets too sick, here is a link on the proper humane way to euthanize him. http://www.wisegeek.com/what-is-the-most-humane-way-to-euthanize-a-fish.htm Good luck! Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: 24 Date: Mon, 04 Jul 2005 16:18:23 -0000 From: "countrymom2one" <countrymom2one@...> Subject: Newbie Hi everyone. I am Kelly. We have had our goldfish for about 5 years now. My daughter got it as a gift from her half sister. I think the goldfish is on it's last leg though :(. What happened was my daughter's goldfish jumped out of its tank about a week ago. No one knows how long it was on the floor. My step daughter found the fish and poked it a few times and it didn't move at all so we thought it was dead. The thing is way to big to flush so we decided to put it back in the tank until we decided what to do with it. My step daughter literally peeled the fish from the carpet it was so stuck. When she put him back into the tank it sunk to the bottom like a rock then a few hours later started swimming again - but stupidly. it has been swimming into the tank, not realizing there are walls there. It also will not eat anything. It hasn't eaten anything since the whole thing happened. A fish that is always hungry seems to not know what do do with the food. Also, the fish is looking really bad. It looks like his fins are rotting and the side that was peeled from the carpet is looking pretty bad now too. It also has an open wound behind a gill where a fin should be. I hope this fish makes it. My daughter would be heartbroken if it didn't. I have no idea how to make this poor fish better. Kelly [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12903	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: I'm back

Wish I could see a photo of her. What's "fuzzy" to one person may not be as fuzzy to someone else. Lacking such a photo, a diagnosis has to be made by the relaying of the description by the viewer to the one attempting to give a diagnosis -- not always an accurate result. Offhand, without actually being there to see the fish, this new spot on the head sounds more like an Ich spot and in retrospect the spot on the side, although described as fuzzy, may have been the same. You can try treating her seperately with the Rid-Ich provided you are just adding this to the small container. For her to get it though, the Ich spores would have to be in the aquarium water (which it usually is anyway). It would seem as if the rest of the fish are in good shape and have not been stressed by anything, or they would have contracted a spot or two of Ich also (if this is what it is). As I mentioned in my previous post, raise the temperature to 80o and keep an eye on all the fish. Keep the female guppy in the treated container for an additional three to four days after you see the spot(s) disappear. Ray \ -- - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > Okay, the female guppy that had a fuzzy spot on her side now has one > on the top of her head. Just one single spot, does not look as fuzzy > as the other one. She also has not been as active, hanging out under > the water sprite. No one else has spots or is flashing. > > Since I don't have a QT tank, I am off to the store to buy a little > container I can hang in the tank and try to treat her and not the > whole tank. I will have them test my water while I am there. > > What should I do for her? > > Thanks, > Rebecca

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12904	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium (off topic again, but i'm

I think (being Australian of course) that this is the proof I've been looking for... America really is upside down. My reasoning is as follows: Every day the sun rises and falls - right. Well in America/Northern Hemisphere the sun would have to go 'down' or south to to rise and 'up' or north to fall. - yes? So since south is down on the compus and north is up on the compus then I feel that according to nature Australia is the right way up and the northern hemisphere is actually the one which is upside down cause the sun has to go down to go up. =Nick Ray Wetzel wrote: >Bruce, Yes, water rotates in the opposite direction in the Northern >Hemisphere, when going down a drain. But what's really unnerving if >you're not use to it -- Naturally the sun rises in the east >(Northern and Southern Hemisphere, regardless), but in the Northern >Hemisphere it makes an arc to the south as it heads to the west in >the sky to set (in the west). It the Southern Hemisphere (like >Australia, for instance), the sun makes an arc to the north as it >heads west in the sky to set in the west. This of course is much >more exaggerated in the Winter when the sun is much lower at noon. >Just something I'll bet not everybody realizes unless they've >traveled across the Equator. So as not to confuse anyone, this has >absolutely nothing to do with the 24 hours of sunlight you would get >at this time of year in Prudhoe Bay, Alaska on the North Slope above >the Brooks Range ("Land of the Midnight Sun"). Australia is having >a "normally long" day of sunshine today, just like us in the Northern >Hemisphere, only a bit shorter as their seasons are reversed. In >Sydney today sunrise was 7:02AM and sunset is scheduled for 5:00PM >only the sun skirts towards the north during the day. Ray >\ >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12905	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: I'm back

I posted a picture of her head in my photo album under sick guppy. Is that the right place to post a picture? Once again the spot does not look like salt but is not nearly as fuzzy as last time. Last time it stuck out from her side, this time it seems smooth and I only noticed it because it was white on her gray head. No one is going near her. None of the other fish are acting odd or have spots still. Just her. I bought a little breeder thing to hang in the tank but was told it might be better to put her in a separate container with an airstone and that she'd be okay at room temperature for a few days. Was also told if it's bacterial I should treat the whole tank, not just her. Meds I have are pimafix, melafix, furan-2, and rid-ich. Which would be the best to treat her with? Thanks again. Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > Wish I could see a photo of her. What's "fuzzy" to one person may not > be as fuzzy to someone else. Lacking such a photo, a diagnosis has to > be made by the relaying of the description by the viewer to the one > attempting to give a diagnosis -- not always an accurate result. > Offhand, without actually being there to see the fish, this new spot on > the head sounds more like an Ich spot and in retrospect the spot on the > side, although described as fuzzy, may have been the same. You can try > treating her seperately with the Rid-Ich provided you are just adding > this to the small container. For her to get it though, the Ich spores > would have to be in the aquarium water (which it usually is anyway). > It would seem as if the rest of the fish are in good shape and have not > been stressed by anything, or they would have contracted a spot or two > of Ich also (if this is what it is). As I mentioned in my previous > post, raise the temperature to 80o and keep an eye on all the fish. > Keep the female guppy in the treated container for an additional three > to four days after you see the spot(s) disappear. Ray > \ -- > - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" <TheSydMonster@c...> > wrote: > > Okay, the female guppy that had a fuzzy spot on her side now has one > > on the top of her head. Just one single spot, does not look as fuzzy > > as the other one. She also has not been as active, hanging out under > > the water sprite. No one else has spots or is flashing. > > > > Since I don't have a QT tank, I am off to the store to buy a little > > container I can hang in the tank and try to treat her and not the > > whole tank. I will have them test my water while I am there. > > > > What should I do for her? > > > > Thanks, > > Rebecca

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12906	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: spotted muskie

Not lol, COL (cry out load...I just made that up) I was at lake of the woods over the weekend and we saw a huge muskie dead and floating near the shore. It nearly broke my heart because I know it probably died at the hands of an inexperienced angler. Emily paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: that fish is probably already dead...lol\ --- Emily Tenczar wrote: > I found another photo: > http://www.lindenhurstil.org/lakescom/Images/Fishing/wSpotted.jpg > > The muskie in the photo should not be held that way. > Especially for very large northerns and muskies you > never want to hold them vertically because their > bodies are too heavy. Gill lock and hold the base of > the tail, or even better, skip the photo for a water > release. > Emily > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ____________________________________________________ Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12907	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: catfish was Re: Muskie Tales

Holy f***ing S**T that thing is friggin HUGE!!!!!!!!!!!! Emily Deenerz@... wrote: Did someone mention big catfish recently? 644 lb catfish caught. http://www.news.com.au/story/0,10117,15777471-13762,00.html [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12908	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium (off topic again, but i'm

I think (being Australian of course) that this is the proof I've been looking for... America really is upside down. My reasoning is as follows: Every day the sun rises and falls - right. Well in America/Northern Hemisphere the sun would have to go 'down' or south to to rise and 'up' or north to fall. - yes? So since south is down on the compus and north is up on the compus then I feel that according to nature Australia is the right way up and the northern hemisphere is actually the one which is upside down cause the sun has to go down to go up. =Nick Ray Wetzel wrote: >Bruce, Yes, water rotates in the opposite direction in the Northern >Hemisphere, when going down a drain. But what's really unnerving if >you're not use to it -- Naturally the sun rises in the east >(Northern and Southern Hemisphere, regardless), but in the Northern >Hemisphere it makes an arc to the south as it heads to the west in >the sky to set (in the west). It the Southern Hemisphere (like >Australia, for instance), the sun makes an arc to the north as it >heads west in the sky to set in the west. This of course is much >more exaggerated in the Winter when the sun is much lower at noon. >Just something I'll bet not everybody realizes unless they've >traveled across the Equator. So as not to confuse anyone, this has >absolutely nothing to do with the 24 hours of sunlight you would get >at this time of year in Prudhoe Bay, Alaska on the North Slope above >the Brooks Range ("Land of the Midnight Sun"). Australia is having >a "normally long" day of sunshine today, just like us in the Northern >Hemisphere, only a bit shorter as their seasons are reversed. In >Sydney today sunrise was 7:02AM and sunset is scheduled for 5:00PM >only the sun skirts towards the north during the day. Ray >\ >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12909	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Tiger muskies was... Muskie Tales

Actually muskies and northerns WILL and DO hybridize naturally. I know people who have caught tiger muskies at lake of the woods, and they do not stock them in that lake. That being said, natural tigers are very rare. One of the other advantages of stocking tigers in lakes (they do that here in minneapolis) is that the fish can't reproduce so they will have less effect on the natural fish fauna of lakes where muskies don't naturally occur. I have yet to catch a tiger but someday... Emily "LobsterPond.com" <BlueMarinaPonds@...> wrote: Thanks for the correction Ray. The DNR stocks our lake here and near here is a hatchery that did the research on some cross breeding fish. I must have been not listening when the guy told me about it. Regards- Sherry ============earlier message ==== From: "Ray Wetzel" Subject: Blue Marina: While you're sort of on the right track with a cross being present in this fish Family, it appears you are quite mistaken in the substance of your statement resulting in misleading conclusions. First of all, there are about 5 species in this fish Family (Esox); the Muskellunge (largest member, having subspecies), the Northern Pike, the Chain Pickerel, the Grass Pickerel and the Red Fin Pickerel. The Northern Pike is not a cross, but a pure species of this Family. Secondly, members of this Family will not (can not) be interbred, either naturally or artificially as they are not even closely related - - the eggs would never develop nor become fertilized. There is a cross, however, between a Muskie and a Northern. This artificial cross is called a "Tiger Muskie", so called because of its pattern and developed as a better fighting gamefish. Muskies, by the way, can reach well over 5 feet in length. Ray ___________________________________________________________________ Get Juno Platinum for as low as $6.95/month! Unlimited Internet Access with 250MB of Email Storage. Visit http://www.juno.com/bestoffer to sign up today! Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks . Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You in Advance for your help in this matter Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12910	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: FW: [AquaticLife] Need help with spots on inside of tank?

I will try both and let you know on my tank... Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez Sent: Tuesday, July 05, 2005 3:10 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: FW: [AquaticLife] Need help with spots on inside of tank? don't know if anyone has suggested this-haven't been reading the whole thread-but have you tried using a credit card? i use one on my coraline spots in my reef tank and it works great! --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > I tried scrubbing with steel wool and it didn't touch the spots on my > glass...not sure that a blade would help. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of TankGurl > Sent: Tuesday, July 05, 2005 10:16 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: FW: [AquaticLife] Need help with spots on inside of tank? > > > I wonder if a straight razor blade might do the trick? I use one on > the salt deposits in my tanks and it works very well. > > > Kelly > > On 7/5/05, Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: Eric Roberts [mailto:woad@...] > > Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2005 8:53 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Need help with spots on inside of tank? > > > > > > It could be permanent. Minerals and salts in water can etch the glass. I > > have the same problem in my tank and haven't found a way to get rid of it. > > I even tried using some steel wool and it had no effect. > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of ahorseofcourse66 > > Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2005 12:51 AM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Need help with spots on inside of tank? > > > > > > Hi, I bought a 20 gallon setup from my dad. The tank has been stored > > for about a year. We cleaned it good and the tank looked great. We > > set it up and put tap water, the water treatment and aqui. salt in the > > tank and the filter and let it run for acouple of days. On the secound > > day we noticed it looked like it had water spots on the inside. The > > spots got worse over the next few days. So we emptied the tank and > > cleaned it with CLR and then The WORKS. Rinsed and rinsed to make sure > > the tank was clean and then wipped it out so there would be no water > > spots on the inside. Same thing happened the second time, tank looked > > great 2 days later hard water looking spots on the inside that you can > > only scratch off with your finger nail... What can I use to get read > > of the spots. I don't even know whats causing them, muchless how to > > get read of them. I don't want to trash the tank but the spots are > > really really bad, on all 4 sides. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks > > . > > Please, when you reply to a post, delete all text that is not important to > > the reply and if changing the topic of the original message modify the > > subject line -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <-, we Thank You > > in Advance for your help in this matter > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > 65g Malawi > http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?fish_gurl > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 > 135g Frontosa/Tang > http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011 > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12911	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: fishy night light

I know this may sound strange, but does anyone else have a night light for their aquarium? Will this disrupt the fish? I sometimes suffer from insomnia and I know that turning the light on to watch the fish would not be good for them. I put a small night light over the top corner of the tank. It looks really cool and it gives the tank a real peaceful aura. Not too many fish active at night and you can't really see a whole lot. But at 3am in the morning, it is better than nothing. Linda 150 freshwater [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12912	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: fishy night light

What I have seen is moonlights...is this what you mean? Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Tuesday, July 05, 2005 7:07 PM To: mnaquarium@yahoogroups.com; AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] fishy night light I know this may sound strange, but does anyone else have a night light for their aquarium? Will this disrupt the fish? I sometimes suffer from insomnia and I know that turning the light on to watch the fish would not be good for them. I put a small night light over the top corner of the tank. It looks really cool and it gives the tank a real peaceful aura. Not too many fish active at night and you can't really see a whole lot. But at 3am in the morning, it is better than nothing. Linda 150 freshwater [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12913	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: fishy night light

try a moonlight. i have some over my reef tank and they're cool. moonlights supposedly mimic the moon's light at night and are supposed to be good for the whole tank. i would assume they're also good for freshwater. --- Crazy4fids@... wrote: > I know this may sound strange, but does anyone else have a night light for > their aquarium? Will this disrupt the fish? > > I sometimes suffer from insomnia and I know that turning the light on to > watch the fish would not be good for them. I put a small night light over the > top corner of the tank. It looks really cool and it gives the tank a real > peaceful aura. Not too many fish active at night and you can't really see a > whole lot. But at 3am in the morning, it is better than nothing. > > Linda > 150 freshwater > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12914	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: fishy night light

I saw a really cool design that uses the blue LEDs that they sell at the auto parts stores. Apparently the fish don't see blue, so it doesn't bother them. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez Sent: Tuesday, July 05, 2005 7:29 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] fishy night light try a moonlight. i have some over my reef tank and they're cool. moonlights supposedly mimic the moon's light at night and are supposed to be good for the whole tank. i would assume they're also good for freshwater. --- Crazy4fids@... wrote: > I know this may sound strange, but does anyone else have a night light for > their aquarium? Will this disrupt the fish? > > I sometimes suffer from insomnia and I know that turning the light on to > watch the fish would not be good for them. I put a small night light over the > top corner of the tank. It looks really cool and it gives the tank a real > peaceful aura. Not too many fish active at night and you can't really see a > whole lot. But at 3am in the morning, it is better than nothing. > > Linda > 150 freshwater > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12915	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: weird colors

I think its the group...those color combos hurt... Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of joequality1980 Sent: Tuesday, July 05, 2005 4:20 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] weird colors is it just my computer, or did the group color theme become more prone to causing seizures? ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12916	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: fishy night light

In a message dated 7/5/2005 7:22:43 P.M. Central Standard Time, woad@... writes: What I have seen is moonlights...is this what you mean? Moonlights/night lights- anything that will illuminate the tank slightly at night. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12917	From: ahorseofcourse66	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Ok, your going to think I'm crazy!?!?

We have a female molly, she was orange. Over the last 3weeks she has started to loss her color. Also her and 3 other fish in the tank have developed black spots. Not like big spots, spots about the size of ich spots. They look like spots of dirt granulates. We took the effected fish out and put them in a tank of their own. We have medicated for parisites and fungas with no results. A local fish store owner suggested copper coat. We tried it and at first thought it might be working. Now here is the part you wont believe. Go in look at molly she has spots on her 10min. later the spots are gone, go back in hour later spots are back. One swordtail looks cleared up but molly and guarami look like the stuff leaves and comes back. Anyone have any idea what we may be dealing with and what to do for it? Tested water and amonia is fine ph is a little high. There is no gravel plants or other wise in the tank with sick fish. Thanks

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12918	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: muskie grabbing a pike

No reply on clubbing fish.. But when fishing in the Ocean we carry a couple axe handles. They come in handy for a lot of things especially pushing the boat away from the dock. Did you know you can drown a fish? rob Indiana Born and raised near the Oregon Coast In a message dated 7/5/2005 10:16:31 AM US Eastern Standard Time, bababanana@... writes: > Come on, the fish has to eat somehow! It's true through. My dad has seen > them take down birds, and he also go bit and had to get stitches :o > Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12919	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: GORGEOUS FISH!

Check out the fish I just posted....it's under blood parrots and are the last two pics. I would LOVE to get one of these, but you need at least a 120 gal and I only have a 75. Anyone have any experience with these? The only one I have found so far is $125. Yikes. Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12920	From: Aaron	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: drown a fish? (was - Re: muskie grabbing a pike)

"...Did you know you can drown a fish?" Not that I'd want to, but how? --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, FortWayneFish@a... wrote: > No reply on clubbing fish.. But when fishing in the Ocean we carry a couple > axe handles. They come in handy for a lot of things especially pushing the boat > away from the dock. Did you know you can drown a fish? > > > rob > Indiana > > Born and raised near the Oregon Coast > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12921	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: drown a fish?

pull it tail first into a strong current.ie ( alongside a boat ) The water rushing backwards into the gills will drown it. rob Indiana In a message dated 7/5/2005 8:59:32 PM US Eastern Standard Time, anonymous122899@... writes: > "...Did you know you can drown a fish?" > > Not that I'd want to, but how? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12922	From: Aaron	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: OT East to West (was - Re: setting ...aquarium (off topic again, bu

"Well in America/Northern Hemisphere the sun would have to go 'down' or south to to rise and 'up' or north to fall. - yes?" NO - around here the Sun stays still and the Earth Rotates as it Travels around the Sun. This causes the illusion that the Sun is 'Rising' in the EAST (right side of the compass) and 'Setting" in the WEST (left side of the compass). --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Nicolas Munro <nmunro@q...> wrote: > I think (being Australian of course) that this is the proof I've been > looking for... America really is upside down. > > My reasoning is as follows: Every day the sun rises and falls - right. > > Well in America/Northern Hemisphere the sun would have to go 'down' or > south to to rise and 'up' or north to fall. - yes? > > So since south is down on the compus and north is up on the compus then > I feel that according to nature Australia is the right way up and the > northern hemisphere is actually the one which is upside down cause the > sun has to go down to go up. > > =Nick

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12923	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: Purple Betta Papa

Evita, ii recently got some more lights for my tank and since then I get natural looking pictures without using the flash. Just aim at a place somewhere on the gravel which is approximately the same distance away as the fish then half press the button on my camera to lock in the focal setting then aim the camera back at the fish and push in the button all the way... With a bit of practice and a heap of photos I can normally get a good pic or two. Also standing further back from the tank and turning the resolution up on my camera works well to. then ii crop the pic around the fish using the computer. =Nick Evita wrote: >Pam Beautiful photo even more beautiful fish. Do ya got any tips on taking a good photo like that. I tried yesterday and I got glare. Evita > >Pam <pamphetteplace@...> wrote:Purple Betta Papa >I have my first betta spawn and this is the hero that has done all the hard work!! >http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/pamphetteplace/album?.dir=/c849&.src=ph&.tok=ph0yEQDBpZOGrPGu > > >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >AquaticLife Management. > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > >--------------------------------- >YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > >--------------------------------- > > > > > >--------------------------------- >Yahoo! Sports > Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football > >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >AquaticLife Management. > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12924	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk

Thanks Rebecca, I might buy some Java Moss and Water Sprite this weekend maybe. =Nick thesydmonster wrote: >You bet! I would say the water sprite for sure. I have it tied to >the cross bar that goes across the top of my tank so it stays in the >back of the tank and doesn't block the light from the other plants. >It's against the back glass and the new batch of fry just born have >been hanging out in the roots. I did not have it in there for the >last batch and they stayed in the java moss a lot. I believe java >moss also stores nutrients for the new fry. Good luck! > >--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Nicolas Munro <nmunro@q...> wrote: > > >>Cool thanks Rebecca, >> >>out of these plants which one do the fry like the most / live the >>longest in? >> >>=Nick >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >AquaticLife Management. > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12925	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk

will get some of that too. Java Fern, Java Moss seam the most common plants in peoples fish tanks. =Nick paul helms wrote: >java fern works exceptionally well. it grows and >recovers well, and it parts are fine and bushy. fine >enough for the babies to manuver, yet bushy enough to >hide from adults. it grows much like anacharis in >taht anywhere it is broken it will grow. > >--- Nicolas Munro <nmunro@...> wrote: > > > >>Paul, can you remember what species the floating >>plant is you have? >> >>I'm working on planting out my tank, have it >>probably 10% planted by >>surface area, Its greatly reduced my algae problem >>too. >> >>Still there is no plants which are bushy enough for >>the fry to hang in >>so might have to keep my eyes open for something >>suitable in the aquatic >>plant shops. >> >>=Nick >> >>Paul helms wrote: >> >> >> >>>depends on what is in the tank. fish are predatory >>>animals that tend to eat anything that fits in >>> >>> >>their >> >> >>>mouths. i personally do not separate the babies >>> >>> >>from >> >> >>>the rtest of the fish and usually end up with 5-6 >>> >>> >>new >> >> >>>fish per breeding that survive. having some >>> >>> >>floating >> >> >>>plants greatly increases their chances of survival. >>> >>> >> i >> >> >>>just use a crushed brine shrimp flake myself, and >>> >>> >>it >> >> >>>works great. >>> >>>--- cynthia brennemann <brennewoman@...> >>>wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>>>>So, my question to you is how long does it take >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>for >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>>>a guppy to get big >>>>>>enough to survive on its own without being eaten >>>>>>whilst eating this >>>>>>super special high protein egg yolk diet? >>>>>> >>>>>>=Nick >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>guppy fry grow pretty quickly, but even newborns >>>> >>>> >>can >> >> >>>>survive larger >>>>fish like angelfish and tigerbarbs if you have a >>>>moderately to heavily >>>>planted tank with lots of places to hide. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>__________________________________________________ >>>Do You Yahoo!? >>>Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam >>> >>> >>protection around >> >> >>>http://mail.yahoo.com >>> >>> >>>·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> >>> >>> >>¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> >> >> >>>Please delete this line and everything below it >>> >>> >>when replying, thanks. >> >> >>>PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT >>> >>> >>that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING >>the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT >>LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- >> >> >>>We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this >>> >>> >>matter, >> >> >>>AquaticLife Management. >>> >>><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , >>> >>> >>.·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. >> >> >>> got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for >>> >>> >>you! >> >> >>>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join >>> >>> stop by and see ~ membership is free! >>> >>>·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> >>> >>> >>¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> >> >> >>>Yahoo! Groups Links >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> > > > > >____________________________________________________ >Yahoo! Sports >Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football >http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >AquaticLife Management. > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12926	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk

Actually ii haven't ever had a single tiger barb so cant defend/comment on if the Algae discs will pasify a single Barb. Your probably right tho. =Nick paul helms wrote: >i would personally disagree with that ...they are just >aggressive. they do not exhibit the same behavior in >groups. when they are alone they are just bullies. > >--- Nicolas Munro <nmunro@...> wrote: > > > >>If you feed them plenty of Algae discs, which I'm >>using the Wardly brand >>btw, this greatly reduces any problem of fin nipping >>in my experience. >> >>The guy in my LFS said they are after the slime >>coating ie lacking the >>minerals hence Algae discs. >> >> >>=Nick >> >>paul helms wrote: >> >> >> >>>tiger barbs do not really belong with guppies of >>> >>> >>any >> >> >>>size. they are fin eaters...meaning they typically >>> >>> >>go >> >> >>>after anything with long or colorful fins >>> >>>--- Nicolas Munro <nmunro@...> >>> >>> >>wrote: >> >> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>>I'm sad now :-( >>>> >>>> >>>>The reason i started this post was cause I've had >>>> >>>> >>12 >> >> >>>>baby guppies for >>>>about a month now and decided they looked big >>>> >>>> >>enough >> >> >>>>to put into the >>>>community aquarium. >>>> >>>>So i put one in the community aquarium to try. It >>>>swam and avoided two >>>>guppies then wham! tiger barb action, no more >>>> >>>> >>guppy >> >> >>>>:-( >>>> >>>> >>>>So I figured I had better not put any more in. >>>>Latter that evening i >>>>was experimenting with a pH solution in a small >>>>container inside a jam >>>>jar so there was only a air gap between the >>>>concentrated pH solution and >>>>the water. Apparently the pH solution was supposed >>>>to change color with >>>>a change in CO2 concentration in the water, which >>>> >>>> >>it >> >> >>>>did - but thats >>>>another post. >>>> >>>>Any ways whilst all this was going on I put the >>>> >>>> >>jam >> >> >>>>jar which contained >>>>the smaller jar into the Guppy breeder being >>>> >>>> >>careful >> >> >>>>not to squish the >>>>guppie babys, and left it over night. >>>> >>>>The metal must have bent under pressure over time >>>>and the next morning >>>>TO MY HORROR i found only one baby guppy remained, >>>>the rest had swam out >>>>over the edge of the guppy breeder tank which was >>>>now under water. >>>> >>>>and before I realized I needed to act, wham! a >>>> >>>> >>sword >> >> >>>>tail eats the one >>>>remaining baby guppy. >>>> >>>>poor me. not happy, all my baby guppies are gone. >>>> >>>> >>>>So, my question to you is how long does it take >>>> >>>> >>for >> >> >>>>a guppy to get big >>>>enough to survive on its own without being eaten >>>>whilst eating this >>>>super special high protein egg yolk diet? >>>> >>>>=Nick >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>____________________________________________________ >> >> >> >>>Yahoo! Sports >>>Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy >>> >>> >>Football >> >> >>>http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com >>> >>> >>>·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> >>> >>> >>¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> >> >> >>>Please delete this line and everything below it >>> >>> >>when replying, thanks. >> >> >>>PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT >>> >>> >>that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING >>the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT >>LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- >> >> >>>We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this >>> >>> >>matter, >> >> >>>AquaticLife Management. >>> >>><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , >>> >>> >>.·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. >> >> >>> got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for >>> >>> >>you! >> >> >>>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join >>> >>> stop by and see ~ membership is free! >>> >>>·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> >>> >>> >>¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> >> >> >>>Yahoo! Groups Links >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> > > > > >__________________________________ >Do you Yahoo!? >Make Yahoo! your home page >http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >AquaticLife Management. > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12927	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: weird colors

I'm not a fan of them either. =Nick Eric Roberts wrote: >I think its the group...those color combos hurt... > >Eric > > > _____ > >From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On >Behalf Of joequality1980 >Sent: Tuesday, July 05, 2005 4:20 PM >To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com >Subject: [AquaticLife] weird colors > > >is it just my computer, or did the group color theme become more prone >to causing seizures? > > > > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to >the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the >SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >AquaticLife Management. > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > _____ > >YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > >* Visit your group "AquaticLife ><http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > >* To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com ><mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > >* Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service ><http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >AquaticLife Management. > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12928	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: not to Egg Yolk ( plants )

I can't keep Java fern alive.. don't ask me why I have no idea, never have been able to. I do like Najas, Hornwort, Elodea or anacharis and Java Moss though rob Indiana In a message dated 7/5/2005 9:14:38 PM US Eastern Standard Time, nmunro@... writes: > will get some of that too. > > Java Fern, Java Moss seam the most common plants in peoples fish tanks. > > =Nick [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12929	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: I'm back

While the foreground (back to her eyes) is in focus, the back of the head starts to get slighly out of focus, but seems good enough to get some idea of the white spot. It looks a little fuzzy, but that may be due to the photo -- it still doesn't look cottony-fuzzy, like fungus. Looks more like Ich rather than fungus. From what you just wrote, it looks like you just now bought a breeding net to "contain" the fish, but not a solid container, so you can't just treat her alone without the medication spreading throughout the tank. Then again, she can't be left at room temperature for a few days if the room temperature is in the low 70's -- This temperature will not boost her immune system. Looks like you have no other place to put her regardless of what she has, so it appears you'll have to keep her in the large tank. You could either try Copper-Safe (brand) or just raise the temperature (to 86o, if the loaches don't mind), increasing the aeration and adding no more than 3 tbs of salt per 5 gallons; loaches don't like much more than this. If it, as appears, is Ich (still hard to definitely tell) it should go away in several days. Maybe someone else here can get an idea from the photo. Off-chance, it could just be a bacterial infection, but I'd treat for the Ich first. If bacterial, and its a mystery how and why she got it, the salt should help but the addition of the Melafix should clear it up. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > I posted a picture of her head in my photo album under sick guppy. > Is that the right place to post a picture? Once again the spot does > not look like salt but is not nearly as fuzzy as last time. Last > time it stuck out from her side, this time it seems smooth and I > only noticed it because it was white on her gray head. No one is > going near her. > > None of the other fish are acting odd or have spots still. Just > her. I bought a little breeder thing to hang in the tank but was > told it might be better to put her in a separate container with an > airstone and that she'd be okay at room temperature for a few days. > > Was also told if it's bacterial I should treat the whole tank, not > just her. > > Meds I have are pimafix, melafix, furan-2, and rid-ich. Which would > be the best to treat her with? > > Thanks again. > Rebecca > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" > <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > Wish I could see a photo of her. What's "fuzzy" to one person may > not > > be as fuzzy to someone else. Lacking such a photo, a diagnosis > has to > > be made by the relaying of the description by the viewer to the > one > > attempting to give a diagnosis -- not always an accurate result. > > Offhand, without actually being there to see the fish, this new > spot on > > the head sounds more like an Ich spot and in retrospect the spot > on the > > side, although described as fuzzy, may have been the same. You > can try > > treating her seperately with the Rid-Ich provided you are just > adding > > this to the small container. For her to get it though, the Ich > spores > > would have to be in the aquarium water (which it usually is > anyway). > > It would seem as if the rest of the fish are in good shape and > have not > > been stressed by anything, or they would have contracted a spot or > two > > of Ich also (if this is what it is). As I mentioned in my > previous > > post, raise the temperature to 80o and keep an eye on all the > fish. > > Keep the female guppy in the treated container for an additional > three > > to four days after you see the spot(s) disappear. > Ray > > > \ > -- > > - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" > <TheSydMonster@c...> > > wrote: > > > Okay, the female guppy that had a fuzzy spot on her side now has > one > > > on the top of her head. Just one single spot, does not look as > fuzzy > > > as the other one. She also has not been as active, hanging out > under > > > the water sprite. No one else has spots or is flashing. > > > > > > Since I don't have a QT tank, I am off to the store to buy a > little > > > container I can hang in the tank and try to treat her and not > the > > > whole tank. I will have them test my water while I am there. > > > > > > What should I do for her? > > > > > > Thanks, > > > Rebecca

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12930	From: Patrick	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium (ot: where the sun sets)

Well, being a Southerner of course, the way I see it, the sun rises over the South, and we all hope one day it will fall on the Northerners. No offence to Yankees. :) Patrick -------Original Message------- I think (being Australian of course) that this is the proof I've been looking for... America really is upside down. My reasoning is as follows: Every day the sun rises and falls - right. Well in America/Northern Hemisphere the sun would have to go 'down' or south to to rise and 'up' or north to fall. - yes? So since south is down on the compus and north is up on the compus then I feel that according to nature Australia is the right way up and the northern hemisphere is actually the one which is upside down cause the sun has to go down to go up. =Nick [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12931	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: Newbie

Kelly, hows your goldfish going today? btw how big is the gold fish bowl cause maybe it was feeling cramped and decided to jump out. =Nick countrymom2one wrote: >Hi everyone. > >I am Kelly. We have had our goldfish for about 5 yers now. My >daughter got it as a gift from her half sister. I think the goldfish >is on it's last leg though :(. > >What happened was my daughter's goldfish jumped out of its tank about >a week ago. No one knows how long it was on the floor. My step >daughter found the fish and poked it a few times and it didn't move >at all so we thought it was dead. > >The thing is way to big to flush so we decided to put it back in the >tank until we decided what to do with it. > >My step daughter literally peeled the fish from the carpet it was so >stuck. When she put him back into the tank it sunk to the bottom like >a rock then a few hours later started swimming again - but stupidly. >it has been swimming into the tank, not realizing there are walls >there. It also will not eat anything. It hasn't eaten anything since >the whole thing happened. A fish that is always hungry seems to not >know what do do with the food. > >Also, the fish is looking really bad. It looks like his fins are >rotting and the side that was peeled from the carpet is looking >pretty bad now too. It also has an open wound behind a gill where a >fin should be. > >I hope this fish makes it. My daughter would be heartbroken if it >didn't. I have no idea how to make this poor fish better. > >Kelly > > > > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >AquaticLife Management. > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12932	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: OT East to West (was - Re: setting ...aquarium (off topic again, bu

I believe this "illusion" you are referring to is exactly what all of us are already talking about. I don't think your brilliant revelation of the Sun staying still is exactly news, but then too maybe there are those who still think the world is flat. I trust you've already joined the rest of us in dismissing this notion. \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Aaron" <anonymous122899@y...> wrote: > "Well in America/Northern Hemisphere the sun would have to go 'down' > or south to to rise and 'up' or north to fall. - yes?" > > NO - around here the Sun stays still and the Earth Rotates as it > Travels around the Sun. This causes the illusion that the Sun > is 'Rising' in the EAST (right side of the compass) and 'Setting" in > the WEST (left side of the compass). > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Nicolas Munro <nmunro@q...> > wrote: > > I think (being Australian of course) that this is the proof I've > been > > looking for... America really is upside down. > > > > My reasoning is as follows: Every day the sun rises and falls - > right. > > > > Well in America/Northern Hemisphere the sun would have to > go 'down' or > > south to to rise and 'up' or north to fall. - yes? > > > > So since south is down on the compus and north is up on the compus > then > > I feel that according to nature Australia is the right way up and > the > > northern hemisphere is actually the one which is upside down cause > the > > sun has to go down to go up. > > > > =Nick

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12933	From: Aaron	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: New poll for AquaticLife

To vote, please visit the following web page: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/surveys?id=1722965 > > Note: Please do not reply to this message. Poll votes are > not collected via email. To vote, you must go to the Yahoo! Groups > web site listed above. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com wrote: > > Enter your vote today! A new poll has been created for the > AquaticLife group: > > How long have you been in the Hobby? > > > o Newbie ( less then 1 year ) > o 1-3 years > o 3-5 years > o 5-10 years > o 10-15 years > o 15-20 years > o 20-50 years > o 50+ Years > > > To vote, please visit the following web page: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/surveys?id=1722965 > > Note: Please do not reply to this message. Poll votes are > not collected via email. To vote, you must go to the Yahoo! Groups > web site listed above. > > Thanks!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12934	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Emily (was catfish, was Re: Muskie Tales)

Hey Emily, LMAO! What branch of the service are/were you in? You type like a sailor! :-D Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: 22 Date: Tue, 5 Jul 2005 16:06:30 -0700 (PDT) From: Emily Tenczar <bababanana@...> Subject: catfish was Re: Muskie Tales Holy f***ing S**T that thing is friggin HUGE!!!!!!!!!!!! Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12935	From: Aaron	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: weird colors

In the USA yesterday We celebrated our Nations birthday and the groups colors honored that with the Red, White and Blue theme, we now return you to the normal color scheme which is open to suggestions. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "joequality1980" <crazy.joe.walcek@g...> wrote: > is it just my computer, or did the group color theme become more prone > to causing seizures?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12936	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: fishy night light

Linda, Strange? -- Not at all! I know of many aquarists who use night lights. I've learned many years ago that the fish are less apt to be spooked (as sometimes happens) and attempt to jump, succeeding if there is no cover. Small dim lights will not at all disrupt the fish. I use a small night light on the ceiling in each of the four corners of my hatchery. In total darkness, I can only assume that occasionally fish may drift (bump) into each other, startling themselves and the bumpee. Ray \ - -- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > I know this may sound strange, but does anyone else have a night light for > their aquarium? Will this disrupt the fish? > > I sometimes suffer from insomnia and I know that turning the light on to > watch the fish would not be good for them. I put a small night light over the > top corner of the tank. It looks really cool and it gives the tank a real > peaceful aura. Not too many fish active at night and you can't really see a > whole lot. But at 3am in the morning, it is better than nothing. > > Linda > 150 freshwater > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12937	From: dreammaker2623	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: OT East to West (was - Re: setting ...aquarium (off topic again, bu

Since water spins in one direction in the Northern Hemisphere and the other way in the Southern Hemisphere, which direction does it spin in at the equator? --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Aaron" <anonymous122899@y...> wrote: > "Well in America/Northern Hemisphere the sun would have to go 'down' > or south to to rise and 'up' or north to fall. - yes?" > > NO - around here the Sun stays still and the Earth Rotates as it > Travels around the Sun. This causes the illusion that the Sun > is 'Rising' in the EAST (right side of the compass) and 'Setting" in > the WEST (left side of the compass).

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12938	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: GORGEOUS FISH!

Leslie, While these Flowerhorn Cichlids are truly colorful, they get quite large, as I presume you're already aware. They are also very aggressive, being derived from a cross between two Central American Cichlids -- a Trimaculatum and several other species (there are a few different types/color variations of Flowerhorns). One such cross is a Trimac and a Red Devil, while another such cross is the result of a Trimac and a Bifasciatus. I believe the Texas Cichlid is used with the Trimac to create yet another Flowerhorn variation. Obviously, you can't keep more than one in a tank unless you're lucky enough to have a mated pair and then they better be near equal size. Not sure if they have viable eggs if they breed, but like the Blood Parrots a percentage of them probably do. Ray \ -- - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > Check out the fish I just posted....it's under blood parrots and are the > last two pics. > I would LOVE to get one of these, but you need at least a 120 gal and I > only have a 75. > Anyone have any experience with these? The only one I have found so far > is $125. Yikes. > Leslie > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12939	From: Aaron	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: OT East to West

If you were paying attention to my first post you may have read that the point I was pointing out was eluded to via the subject line, that is the East West reality of the Sunrise and sunset as opposed to the previously mentioned mistaken mention of the sun rising in the South and setting in the North which may be the illusion the rest of you were refering to too. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > I believe this "illusion" you are referring to is exactly what all of > us are already talking about. I don't think your brilliant > revelation of the Sun staying still is exactly news, but then too > maybe there are those who still think the world is flat. I trust > you've already joined the rest of us in dismissing this notion. > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Aaron" <anonymous122899@y...> > wrote: > > "Well in America/Northern Hemisphere the sun would have to > go 'down' > > or south to to rise and 'up' or north to fall. - yes?" > > > > NO - around here the Sun stays still and the Earth Rotates as it > > Travels around the Sun. This causes the illusion that the Sun > > is 'Rising' in the EAST (right side of the compass) and 'Setting" > in > > the WEST (left side of the compass). > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Nicolas Munro <nmunro@q...> > > wrote: > > > I think (being Australian of course) that this is the proof I've > > been > > > looking for... America really is upside down. > > > > > > My reasoning is as follows: Every day the sun rises and falls - > > right. > > > > > > Well in America/Northern Hemisphere the sun would have to > > go 'down' or > > > south to to rise and 'up' or north to fall. - yes? > > > > > > So since south is down on the compus and north is up on the > compus > > then > > > I feel that according to nature Australia is the right way up and > > the > > > northern hemisphere is actually the one which is upside down > cause > > the > > > sun has to go down to go up. > > > > > > =Nick

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12940	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: OT East to West

Aaron, I, for one, was following your first post to the letter. At first glance it appeared as if you were alluding to the fact that none of us realized that its the earth rotating on its axis, with the sun remaining stationary, that causes the sun to rise and travel across the sky 'till it sets, in a seemingly condesceding manner. Your reply did not seem to connect with Nick's slightly confusing message, but then in all fairness, his message had to be re-read more than once to fully appreciate it. As I understand Nick, he was not refuting that the sun rises in the east and sets in the west -- his point, as I gather it, was that as it rises (in the east) it rises (arcs) towards the south and (after reaching apogee) then arcs towards the north as it swings to set in the west, although he did not say this in so many words. After re-reading his somewhat unclear post at least several times, this is finally what I got -- at least I would hope this is what he meant. \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Aaron" <anonymous122899@y...> wrote: > If you were paying attention to my first post you may have read that > the point I was pointing out was eluded to via the subject line, > that is the East West reality of the Sunrise and sunset as opposed > to the previously mentioned mistaken mention of the sun rising in > the South and setting in the North which may be the illusion the > rest of you were refering to too. > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" > <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > I believe this "illusion" you are referring to is exactly what all > of > > us are already talking about. I don't think your brilliant > > revelation of the Sun staying still is exactly news, but then too > > maybe there are those who still think the world is flat. I trust > > you've already joined the rest of us in dismissing this > notion. > > > \ > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Aaron" <anonymous122899@y...> > > wrote: > > > "Well in America/Northern Hemisphere the sun would have to > > go 'down' > > > or south to to rise and 'up' or north to fall. - yes?" > > > > > > NO - around here the Sun stays still and the Earth Rotates as it > > > Travels around the Sun. This causes the illusion that the Sun > > > is 'Rising' in the EAST (right side of the compass) > and 'Setting" > > in > > > the WEST (left side of the compass). > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Nicolas Munro <nmunro@q...> > > > wrote: > > > > I think (being Australian of course) that this is the proof > I've > > > been > > > > looking for... America really is upside down. > > > > > > > > My reasoning is as follows: Every day the sun rises and falls - > > > > right. > > > > > > > > Well in America/Northern Hemisphere the sun would have to > > > go 'down' or > > > > south to to rise and 'up' or north to fall. - yes? > > > > > > > > So since south is down on the compus and north is up on the > > compus > > > then > > > > I feel that according to nature Australia is the right way up > and > > > the > > > > northern hemisphere is actually the one which is upside down > > cause > > > the > > > > sun has to go down to go up. > > > > > > > > =Nick

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12941	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: I'm back

Sorry about the quality of the photo, the guppies seem to never stop moving :) It is kind of fuzzy but not like the one on her side the other day, which was much fuzzier and larger. I can get a different container for her tomorrow for the tank -- I didn't think about the little slats that let the water through in the breeder container. If it is ich, wouldn't there be more spots on her? What about the fact that she isn't flashing or gasping at the surface or anything? Would all the fish show signs? I believe you said the others may not because they may not be as stressed or susceptible to it, is that correct? Thanks sooo much for letting me pester you like this! Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > While the foreground (back to her eyes) is in focus, the back of the > head starts to get slighly out of focus, but seems good enough to get > some idea of the white spot. It looks a little fuzzy, but that may > be due to the photo -- it still doesn't look cottony-fuzzy, like > fungus. Looks more like Ich rather than fungus. From what you just > wrote, it looks like you just now bought a breeding net to "contain" > the fish, but not a solid container, so you can't just treat her > alone without the medication spreading throughout the tank. Then > again, she can't be left at room temperature for a few days if the > room temperature is in the low 70's -- This temperature will not > boost her immune system. Looks like you have no other place to put > her regardless of what she has, so it appears you'll have to keep her > in the large tank. You could either try Copper-Safe (brand) or just > raise the temperature (to 86o, if the loaches don't mind), increasing > the aeration and adding no more than 3 tbs of salt per 5 gallons; > loaches don't like much more than this. If it, as appears, is Ich > (still hard to definitely tell) it should go away in several days. > Maybe someone else here can get an idea from the photo. Off- chance, > it could just be a bacterial infection, but I'd treat for the Ich > first. If bacterial, and its a mystery how and why she got it, the > salt should help but the addition of the Melafix should clear it up. > Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" > <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > I posted a picture of her head in my photo album under sick guppy. > > Is that the right place to post a picture? Once again the spot > does > > not look like salt but is not nearly as fuzzy as last time. Last > > time it stuck out from her side, this time it seems smooth and I > > only noticed it because it was white on her gray head. No one is > > going near her. > > > > None of the other fish are acting odd or have spots still. Just > > her. I bought a little breeder thing to hang in the tank but was > > told it might be better to put her in a separate container with an > > airstone and that she'd be okay at room temperature for a few days. > > > > Was also told if it's bacterial I should treat the whole tank, not > > just her. > > > > Meds I have are pimafix, melafix, furan-2, and rid-ich. Which > would > > be the best to treat her with? > > > > Thanks again. > > Rebecca > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" > > <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > Wish I could see a photo of her. What's "fuzzy" to one person > may > > not > > > be as fuzzy to someone else. Lacking such a photo, a diagnosis > > has to > > > be made by the relaying of the description by the viewer to the > > one > > > attempting to give a diagnosis -- not always an accurate result. > > > Offhand, without actually being there to see the fish, this new > > spot on > > > the head sounds more like an Ich spot and in retrospect the spot > > on the > > > side, although described as fuzzy, may have been the same. You > > can try > > > treating her seperately with the Rid-Ich provided you are just > > adding > > > this to the small container. For her to get it though, the Ich > > spores > > > would have to be in the aquarium water (which it usually is > > anyway). > > > It would seem as if the rest of the fish are in good shape and > > have not > > > been stressed by anything, or they would have contracted a spot > or > > two > > > of Ich also (if this is what it is). As I mentioned in my > > previous > > > post, raise the temperature to 80o and keep an eye on all the > > fish. > > > Keep the female guppy in the treated container for an additional > > three > > > to four days after you see the spot(s) disappear. > > Ray > > > > > > \ > > -- > > > - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" > > <TheSydMonster@c...> > > > wrote: > > > > Okay, the female guppy that had a fuzzy spot on her side now > has > > one > > > > on the top of her head. Just one single spot, does not look as > > fuzzy > > > > as the other one. She also has not been as active, hanging out > > under > > > > the water sprite. No one else has spots or is flashing. > > > > > > > > Since I don't have a QT tank, I am off to the store to buy a > > little > > > > container I can hang in the tank and try to treat her and not > > the > > > > whole tank. I will have them test my water while I am there. > > > > > > > > What should I do for her? > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > Rebecca

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12942	From: paul helms	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: GORGEOUS FISH!

most can breed still in my experience. one of my clients is breeding flowerhorns with managuenses! --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote: > Leslie, While these Flowerhorn Cichlids are truly > colorful, they get > quite large, as I presume you're already aware. > They are also very > aggressive, being derived from a cross between two > Central American > Cichlids -- a Trimaculatum and several other species > (there are a few > different types/color variations of Flowerhorns). > One such cross is a > Trimac and a Red Devil, while another such cross is > the result of a > Trimac and a Bifasciatus. I believe the Texas > Cichlid is used with the > Trimac to create yet another Flowerhorn variation. > Obviously, you > can't keep more than one in a tank unless you're > lucky enough to have a > mated pair and then they better be near equal size. > Not sure if they > have viable eggs if they breed, but like the Blood > Parrots a percentage > of them probably do. Ray > > \ > -- > - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie > Moore" <amjmail@c...> > wrote: > > Check out the fish I just posted....it's under > blood parrots and are > the > > last two pics. > > I would LOVE to get one of these, but you need at > least a 120 gal and > I > > only have a 75. > > Anyone have any experience with these? The only > one I have found so > far > > is $125. Yikes. > > Leslie > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > ____________________________________________________ Sell on Yahoo! Auctions – no fees. Bid on great items. http://auctions.yahoo.com/

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12943	From: paul helms	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: OT East to West (was - Re: setting ...aquarium (off topic again

it doesn't.....it goes straight up. --- dreammaker2623 <dreammaker2623@...> wrote: > Since water spins in one direction in the Northern > Hemisphere and the > other way in the Southern Hemisphere, which > direction does it spin in > at the > equator? > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Aaron" > <anonymous122899@y...> wrote: > > "Well in America/Northern Hemisphere the sun would > have to go 'down' > > or south to to rise and 'up' or north to fall. - > yes?" > > > > NO - around here the Sun stays still and the Earth > Rotates as it > > Travels around the Sun. This causes the illusion > that the Sun > > is 'Rising' in the EAST (right side of the > compass) and 'Setting" in > > the WEST (left side of the compass). > > > > ____________________________________________________ Sell on Yahoo! Auctions – no fees. Bid on great items. http://auctions.yahoo.com/

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12944	From: paul helms	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: To Egg Yolk or not to Egg Yolk

you know what?! I MEANT TO INSERT HORNWART THERE...LMAO NOT JAVA FERN. java fern is a great plant but it does not float. it spreads great over wood and stone though and is a great hiding place too. sorry! --- Nicolas Munro <nmunro@...> wrote: > will get some of that too. > > Java Fern, Java Moss seam the most common plants in > peoples fish tanks. > > =Nick > > paul helms wrote: > > >java fern works exceptionally well. it grows and > >recovers well, and it parts are fine and bushy. > fine > >enough for the babies to manuver, yet bushy enough > to > >hide from adults. it grows much like anacharis in > >taht anywhere it is broken it will grow. > > > >--- Nicolas Munro <nmunro@...> > wrote: > > > > > > > >>Paul, can you remember what species the floating > >>plant is you have? > >> > >>I'm working on planting out my tank, have it > >>probably 10% planted by > >>surface area, Its greatly reduced my algae problem > >>too. > >> > >>Still there is no plants which are bushy enough > for > >>the fry to hang in > >>so might have to keep my eyes open for something > >>suitable in the aquatic > >>plant shops. > >> > >>=Nick > >> > >>Paul helms wrote: > >> > >> > >> > >>>depends on what is in the tank. fish are > predatory > >>>animals that tend to eat anything that fits in > >>> > >>> > >>their > >> > >> > >>>mouths. i personally do not separate the babies > >>> > >>> > >>from > >> > >> > >>>the rtest of the fish and usually end up with 5-6 > >>> > >>> > >>new > >> > >> > >>>fish per breeding that survive. having some > >>> > >>> > >>floating > >> > >> > >>>plants greatly increases their chances of > survival. > >>> > >>> > >> i > >> > >> > >>>just use a crushed brine shrimp flake myself, and > >>> > >>> > >>it > >> > >> > >>>works great. > >>> > >>>--- cynthia brennemann <brennewoman@...> > >>>wrote: > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>>>>>So, my question to you is how long does it > take > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>for > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>>>a guppy to get big > >>>>>>enough to survive on its own without being > eaten > >>>>>>whilst eating this > >>>>>>super special high protein egg yolk diet? > >>>>>> > >>>>>>=Nick > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>guppy fry grow pretty quickly, but even newborns > >>>> > >>>> > >>can > >> > >> > >>>>survive larger > >>>>fish like angelfish and tigerbarbs if you have a > >>>>moderately to heavily > >>>>planted tank with lots of places to hide. > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>__________________________________________________ > >>>Do You Yahoo!? > >>>Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > >>> > >>> > >>protection around > >> > >> > >>>http://mail.yahoo.com > >>> > >>> > >>>·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > >>> > >>> > >>¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > >> > >> > >>>Please delete this line and everything below it > >>> > >>> > >>when replying, thanks. > >> > >> > >>>PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > >>> > >>> > >>that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING > >>the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT > >>LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" > <- > >> > >> > >>>We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > >>> > >>> > >>matter, > >> > >> > >>>AquaticLife Management. > >>> > >>><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > >>> > >>> > >>.·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > >> > >> > >>> got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > >>> > >>> > >>you! > >> > >> > >>>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > >>> > >>> stop by and see ~ membership is free! > >>> > >>>·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > >>> > >>> > >>¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > >> > >> > >>>Yahoo! Groups Links > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > === message truncated === __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail for Mobile Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone. http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12945	From: paul helms	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: muskie grabbing a pike

i use a fish knocker that i made froma thin black walnut branch. hard as hell, does not even dent. --- FortWayneFish@... wrote: > No reply on clubbing fish.. But when fishing in the > Ocean we carry a couple > axe handles. They come in handy for a lot of things > especially pushing the boat > away from the dock. Did you know you can drown a > fish? > > > rob > Indiana > > Born and raised near the Oregon Coast > > In a message dated 7/5/2005 10:16:31 AM US Eastern > Standard Time, > bababanana@... writes: > > > > Come on, the fish has to eat somehow! It's true > through. My dad has seen > > them take down birds, and he also go bit and had > to get stitches :o > > Emily > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12946	From: yarncrazymom	Date: 7/5/2005
Subject: Re: Ok, your going to think I'm crazy!?!?

I just lost a female mickey mouse platty just like this...she lost some of her color went to a dull yellow, she had a black spot just on her head about right in front of her fin. Hers never went anywhere though, once it appeared, it stayed there and a few days later she died. My water is fine I test it every day because my tank is overcrowded right now. I used Melafix just to see if it would help but I lost her anyway, she laid on the bottom of the tank all night and died in the morning... but she lost her color several days before I lost her :O( I have no clue what it was...I assummed it was old age...the black spots are on nothing else in my tank. Let me know if you find any information on it.. If it leaves and comes back I wonder then if you dont have an unwanted critter/fish bug of some sort in your tank...could be hopping on for a ride and a meal and hopping off again??? I dunno.....I hope that you dont lose yours thought... Rho http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Snailtrails/ > We have a female molly, she was orange. Over the last 3weeks she has > started to loss her color. Also her and 3 other fish in the tank have > developed black spots. Not like big spots, spots about the size of ich > spots. They look like spots of dirt granulates. We took the effected > fish out and put them in a tank of their own. We have medicated for > parisites and fungas with no results. A local fish store owner > suggested copper coat. We tried it and at first thought it might be > working. Now here is the part you wont believe. Go in look at molly > she has spots on her 10min. later the spots are gone, go back in hour > later spots are back. One swordtail looks cleared up but molly and > guarami look like the stuff leaves and comes back. Anyone have any > idea what we may be dealing with and what to do for it? Tested water > and amonia is fine ph is a little high. There is no gravel plants or > other wise in the tank with sick fish. > Thanks

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12947	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: GORGEOUS FISH!

When the flowerhorn plague, er I meant when the flowerhorn craze hit the U.S. people paid stupid prices for them which is silly as you can make them out of fish that are already in the aquarium trade. If you look around for them you can get fry for a buck, sometimes a lot less as they produce a huge amount of babies per spawn. The owners think they will get what they paid for them and are lucky to get anything for them. I have been to retail shops that sell these and they usually stuff them into 20 or 30 gallon tanks going under the assumption that they will make big money off them. Kind of like a Ponzi scheme or Pyamid scheme. The people that get in on the craze early made some money mean time these fish take up valuable tank space and unfortunately turned a lot of discus breeders into flowerhorn breeder speculators. If you really want one don't rush out to get one, there will be plenty of them out there if you are patient and look around a bit. The problem with these hybrids and all the new fish they are crossbreeding is that the offspring look very similar to a non hybrid and we will get polluted bloodlines and end up not buying what we think we are buying. The cichlid club I belong to will not allow them at the monthly auction, and I have to agree with them. There are just too many interesting non polluted bloodlines of fish to keep in our tanks. I just got the newest book on West African cichlids and skimmed it for a few minutes tonight and saw about 50 cichlids I have never seen or heard of. I recently discovered African Riverine cichlids and have two different pairs and they are each fascinating to watch and wish I could also get into South American pike cichlids after attending a recent talk on them as there are some beautiful ones that I learned are not the terrors I thought they were. Mike only have a 75. > > Anyone have any experience with these? The only > one I have found so > far > > is $125. Yikes. > > Leslie > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12948	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: GORGEOUS FISH!

Leslie, The smaller the fish when bought the cheaper. One the LPS( local pet store ) is selling a Flowerhorn (Trimac/something) for $5.99 @ 1.5" fish. These fish can get BIG ... I have seen a few that have been Given up to only LFS that will take them. A couple of these fish are in the 10" range and I am sure they are not done growing. If you are intrested in a TankBuster fish Might I suggest you look through Tangled Up in Cichlids ( http://tangledupincichlids.com/photo.html) before you purchase a Flowerhorn. I am sure Jeff Rapps will have something that you would be intrested in. There are A LOT of non hybrid fish that are very very colorful. rob Indiana In a message dated 7/6/2005 4:32:21 AM US Eastern Standard Time, Deenerz@... writes: > The only > > one I have found so > > far > > > is $125. Yikes. > > > Leslie > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12949	From: Heather Husvar	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: I'm back

I don't know if this helps or not. I have guppies for the first time and I ran across the following link for troubleshooting guppy issues: http://guppyplace.tripod.com/Problems.html Thanks, Heather On 7/6/05, thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@...> wrote: > Sorry about the quality of the photo, the guppies seem to never stop > moving :) It is kind of fuzzy but not like the one on her side the > other day, which was much fuzzier and larger. I can get a different > container for her tomorrow for the tank -- I didn't think about the > little slats that let the water through in the breeder container. > If it is ich, wouldn't there be more spots on her? What about the > fact that she isn't flashing or gasping at the surface or anything? > Would all the fish show signs? I believe you said the others may > not because they may not be as stressed or susceptible to it, is > that correct? > > Thanks sooo much for letting me pester you like this! > Rebecca > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" > <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > While the foreground (back to her eyes) is in focus, the back of > the > > head starts to get slighly out of focus, but seems good enough to > get > > some idea of the white spot. It looks a little fuzzy, but that > may > > be due to the photo -- it still doesn't look cottony-fuzzy, like > > fungus. Looks more like Ich rather than fungus. From what you > just > > wrote, it looks like you just now bought a breeding net > to "contain" > > the fish, but not a solid container, so you can't just treat her > > alone without the medication spreading throughout the tank. Then > > again, she can't be left at room temperature for a few days if the > > room temperature is in the low 70's -- This temperature will not > > boost her immune system. Looks like you have no other place to > put > > her regardless of what she has, so it appears you'll have to keep > her > > in the large tank. You could either try Copper-Safe (brand) or > just > > raise the temperature (to 86o, if the loaches don't mind), > increasing > > the aeration and adding no more than 3 tbs of salt per 5 gallons; > > loaches don't like much more than this. If it, as appears, is Ich > > (still hard to definitely tell) it should go away in several > days. > > Maybe someone else here can get an idea from the photo. Off- > chance, > > it could just be a bacterial infection, but I'd treat for the Ich > > first. If bacterial, and its a mystery how and why she got it, > the > > salt should help but the addition of the Melafix should clear it > up. > > > Ray > > > \ > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" > > <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > > I posted a picture of her head in my photo album under sick > guppy. > > > Is that the right place to post a picture? Once again the spot > > does > > > not look like salt but is not nearly as fuzzy as last time. > Last > > > time it stuck out from her side, this time it seems smooth and I > > > only noticed it because it was white on her gray head. No one > is > > > going near her. > > > > > > None of the other fish are acting odd or have spots still. Just > > > her. I bought a little breeder thing to hang in the tank but > was > > > told it might be better to put her in a separate container with > an > > > airstone and that she'd be okay at room temperature for a few > days. > > > > > > Was also told if it's bacterial I should treat the whole tank, > not > > > just her. > > > > > > Meds I have are pimafix, melafix, furan-2, and rid-ich. Which > > would > > > be the best to treat her with? > > > > > > Thanks again. > > > Rebecca > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" > > > <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > > Wish I could see a photo of her. What's "fuzzy" to one person > > may > > > not > > > > be as fuzzy to someone else. Lacking such a photo, a > diagnosis > > > has to > > > > be made by the relaying of the description by the viewer to > the > > > one > > > > attempting to give a diagnosis -- not always an accurate > result. > > > > Offhand, without actually being there to see the fish, this > new > > > spot on > > > > the head sounds more like an Ich spot and in retrospect the > spot > > > on the > > > > side, although described as fuzzy, may have been the same. > You > > > can try > > > > treating her seperately with the Rid-Ich provided you are just > > > adding > > > > this to the small container. For her to get it though, the > Ich > > > spores > > > > would have to be in the aquarium water (which it usually is > > > anyway). > > > > It would seem as if the rest of the fish are in good shape and > > > have not > > > > been stressed by anything, or they would have contracted a > spot > > or > > > two > > > > of Ich also (if this is what it is). As I mentioned in my > > > previous > > > > post, raise the temperature to 80o and keep an eye on all the > > > fish. > > > > Keep the female guppy in the treated container for an > additional > > > three > > > > to four days after you see the spot(s) disappear. > > > Ray > > > > > > > > > > \ > > > -- > > > > - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" > > > <TheSydMonster@c...> > > > > wrote: > > > > > Okay, the female guppy that had a fuzzy spot on her side now > > has > > > one > > > > > on the top of her head. Just one single spot, does not look > as > > > fuzzy > > > > > as the other one. She also has not been as active, hanging > out > > > under > > > > > the water sprite. No one else has spots or is flashing. > > > > > > > > > > Since I don't have a QT tank, I am off to the store to buy a > > > little > > > > > container I can hang in the tank and try to treat her and > not > > > the > > > > > whole tank. I will have them test my water while I am there. > > > > > > > > > > What should I do for her? > > > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > Rebecca > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > -- The rules of parents should be but three...Love, Limit, and Let them be. - Elaine M. Ward

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12950	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: I'm back

Fish photography is not easy as you've found out...Sometimes its more luck than anything else. I think I get the idea from your photo. I believe you said you were going to have your water tested last night. What were the results? As I stated in a previous post, occasionally (although rare), you may find just one Ich spot on a fish. This in itself is a good sign as well as the fact that she isn't flashing or gasping at the surface although some affected fish may never be seen at the surface. As to your last question, you've already answered it. Keep us posted. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > Sorry about the quality of the photo, the guppies seem to never stop > moving :) It is kind of fuzzy but not like the one on her side the > other day, which was much fuzzier and larger. I can get a different > container for her tomorrow for the tank -- I didn't think about the > little slats that let the water through in the breeder container. > If it is ich, wouldn't there be more spots on her? What about the > fact that she isn't flashing or gasping at the surface or anything? > Would all the fish show signs? I believe you said the others may > not because they may not be as stressed or susceptible to it, is > that correct? > > Thanks sooo much for letting me pester you like this! > Rebecca > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" > <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > While the foreground (back to her eyes) is in focus, the back of > the > > head starts to get slighly out of focus, but seems good enough to > get > > some idea of the white spot. It looks a little fuzzy, but that > may > > be due to the photo -- it still doesn't look cottony-fuzzy, like > > fungus. Looks more like Ich rather than fungus. From what you > just > > wrote, it looks like you just now bought a breeding net > to "contain" > > the fish, but not a solid container, so you can't just treat her > > alone without the medication spreading throughout the tank. Then > > again, she can't be left at room temperature for a few days if the > > room temperature is in the low 70's -- This temperature will not > > boost her immune system. Looks like you have no other place to > put > > her regardless of what she has, so it appears you'll have to keep > her > > in the large tank. You could either try Copper-Safe (brand) or > just > > raise the temperature (to 86o, if the loaches don't mind), > increasing > > the aeration and adding no more than 3 tbs of salt per 5 gallons; > > loaches don't like much more than this. If it, as appears, is Ich > > (still hard to definitely tell) it should go away in several > days. > > Maybe someone else here can get an idea from the photo. Off- > chance, > > it could just be a bacterial infection, but I'd treat for the Ich > > first. If bacterial, and its a mystery how and why she got it, > the > > salt should help but the addition of the Melafix should clear it > up. > > > Ray > > > \ > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" > > <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > > I posted a picture of her head in my photo album under sick > guppy. > > > Is that the right place to post a picture? Once again the spot > > does > > > not look like salt but is not nearly as fuzzy as last time. > Last > > > time it stuck out from her side, this time it seems smooth and I > > > only noticed it because it was white on her gray head. No one > is > > > going near her. > > > > > > None of the other fish are acting odd or have spots still. Just > > > her. I bought a little breeder thing to hang in the tank but > was > > > told it might be better to put her in a separate container with > an > > > airstone and that she'd be okay at room temperature for a few > days. > > > > > > Was also told if it's bacterial I should treat the whole tank, > not > > > just her. > > > > > > Meds I have are pimafix, melafix, furan-2, and rid-ich. Which > > would > > > be the best to treat her with? > > > > > > Thanks again. > > > Rebecca > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" > > > <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > > Wish I could see a photo of her. What's "fuzzy" to one person > > may > > > not > > > > be as fuzzy to someone else. Lacking such a photo, a > diagnosis > > > has to > > > > be made by the relaying of the description by the viewer to > the > > > one > > > > attempting to give a diagnosis -- not always an accurate > result. > > > > Offhand, without actually being there to see the fish, this > new > > > spot on > > > > the head sounds more like an Ich spot and in retrospect the > spot > > > on the > > > > side, although described as fuzzy, may have been the same. > You > > > can try > > > > treating her seperately with the Rid-Ich provided you are just > > > adding > > > > this to the small container. For her to get it though, the > Ich > > > spores > > > > would have to be in the aquarium water (which it usually is > > > anyway). > > > > It would seem as if the rest of the fish are in good shape and > > > have not > > > > been stressed by anything, or they would have contracted a > spot > > or > > > two > > > > of Ich also (if this is what it is). As I mentioned in my > > > previous > > > > post, raise the temperature to 80o and keep an eye on all the > > > fish. > > > > Keep the female guppy in the treated container for an > additional > > > three > > > > to four days after you see the spot(s) disappear. > > > Ray > > > > > > > > > > \ > > > -- > > > > - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" > > > <TheSydMonster@c...> > > > > wrote: > > > > > Okay, the female guppy that had a fuzzy spot on her side now > > has > > > one > > > > > on the top of her head. Just one single spot, does not look > as > > > fuzzy > > > > > as the other one. She also has not been as active, hanging > out > > > under > > > > > the water sprite. No one else has spots or is flashing. > > > > > > > > > > Since I don't have a QT tank, I am off to the store to buy a > > > little > > > > > container I can hang in the tank and try to treat her and > not > > > the > > > > > whole tank. I will have them test my water while I am there. > > > > > > > > > > What should I do for her? > > > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > Rebecca

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12951	From: Evita	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: I'm back

Heather, Great site. I think many of the suggestions would apply to the keeping of all fish. I especially enjoyed reading about the hospital tank....I really liked the way they went into detail. Also the section on bring a new fish home. They actually recommended insulation of the new fish for a month before adding to the tank. They also said ask the pet shop to isolate your pick for a week before buying it. Now I doubt any shop around here would do that or have the room to do that. Thanks again. Very helpful info. Evita Heather Husvar <hhusvar@...> wrote: I don't know if this helps or not. I have guppies for the first time and I ran across the following link for troubleshooting guppy issues: http://guppyplace.tripod.com/Problems.html Thanks, Heather On 7/6/05, thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@...> wrote: > Sorry about the quality of the photo, the guppies seem to never stop > moving :) It is kind of fuzzy but not like the one on her side the > other day, which was much fuzzier and larger. I can get a different > container for her tomorrow for the tank -- I didn't think about the > little slats that let the water through in the breeder container. > If it is ich, wouldn't there be more spots on her? What about the > fact that she isn't flashing or gasping at the surface or anything? > Would all the fish show signs? I believe you said the others may > not because they may not be as stressed or susceptible to it, is > that correct? > > Thanks sooo much for letting me pester you like this! > Rebecca > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" > <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > While the foreground (back to her eyes) is in focus, the back of > the > > head starts to get slighly out of focus, but seems good enough to > get > > some idea of the white spot. It looks a little fuzzy, but that > may > > be due to the photo -- it still doesn't look cottony-fuzzy, like > > fungus. Looks more like Ich rather than fungus. From what you > just > > wrote, it looks like you just now bought a breeding net > to "contain" > > the fish, but not a solid container, so you can't just treat her > > alone without the medication spreading throughout the tank. Then > > again, she can't be left at room temperature for a few days if the > > room temperature is in the low 70's -- This temperature will not > > boost her immune system. Looks like you have no other place to > put > > her regardless of what she has, so it appears you'll have to keep > her > > in the large tank. You could either try Copper-Safe (brand) or > just > > raise the temperature (to 86o, if the loaches don't mind), > increasing > > the aeration and adding no more than 3 tbs of salt per 5 gallons; > > loaches don't like much more than this. If it, as appears, is Ich > > (still hard to definitely tell) it should go away in several > days. > > Maybe someone else here can get an idea from the photo. Off- > chance, > > it could just be a bacterial infection, but I'd treat for the Ich > > first. If bacterial, and its a mystery how and why she got it, > the > > salt should help but the addition of the Melafix should clear it > up. > > > Ray > > > \ > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" > > <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > > I posted a picture of her head in my photo album under sick > guppy. > > > Is that the right place to post a picture? Once again the spot > > does > > > not look like salt but is not nearly as fuzzy as last time. > Last > > > time it stuck out from her side, this time it seems smooth and I > > > only noticed it because it was white on her gray head. No one > is > > > going near her. > > > > > > None of the other fish are acting odd or have spots still. Just > > > her. I bought a little breeder thing to hang in the tank but > was > > > told it might be better to put her in a separate container with > an > > > airstone and that she'd be okay at room temperature for a few > days. > > > > > > Was also told if it's bacterial I should treat the whole tank, > not > > > just her. > > > > > > Meds I have are pimafix, melafix, furan-2, and rid-ich. Which > > would > > > be the best to treat her with? > > > > > > Thanks again. > > > Rebecca > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" > > > <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > > Wish I could see a photo of her. What's "fuzzy" to one person > > may > > > not > > > > be as fuzzy to someone else. Lacking such a photo, a > diagnosis > > > has to > > > > be made by the relaying of the description by the viewer to > the > > > one > > > > attempting to give a diagnosis -- not always an accurate > result. > > > > Offhand, without actually being there to see the fish, this > new > > > spot on > > > > the head sounds more like an Ich spot and in retrospect the > spot > > > on the > > > > side, although described as fuzzy, may have been the same. > You > > > can try > > > > treating her seperately with the Rid-Ich provided you are just > > > adding > > > > this to the small container. For her to get it though, the > Ich > > > spores > > > > would have to be in the aquarium water (which it usually is > > > anyway). > > > > It would seem as if the rest of the fish are in good shape and > > > have not > > > > been stressed by anything, or they would have contracted a > spot > > or > > > two > > > > of Ich also (if this is what it is). As I mentioned in my > > > previous > > > > post, raise the temperature to 80o and keep an eye on all the > > > fish. > > > > Keep the female guppy in the treated container for an > additional > > > three > > > > to four days after you see the spot(s) disappear. > > > Ray > > > > > > > > > > \ > > > -- > > > > - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" > > > <TheSydMonster@c...> > > > > wrote: > > > > > Okay, the female guppy that had a fuzzy spot on her side now > > has > > > one > > > > > on the top of her head. Just one single spot, does not look > as > > > fuzzy > > > > > as the other one. She also has not been as active, hanging > out > > > under > > > > > the water sprite. No one else has spots or is flashing. > > > > > > > > > > Since I don't have a QT tank, I am off to the store to buy a > > > little > > > > > container I can hang in the tank and try to treat her and > not > > > the > > > > > whole tank. I will have them test my water while I am there. > > > > > > > > > > What should I do for her? > > > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > Rebecca > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > -- The rules of parents should be but three...Love, Limit, and Let them be. - Elaine M. Ward ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Mail for Mobile Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12952	From: Evita	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: I'm back

Not to sound dumb or anything I meant "iso-lation" not "inso-lation" of the new fish. I hope I was not misunderstood. Evita Evita <evitabug@...> wrote: Heather, Great site. I think many of the suggestions would apply to the keeping of all fish. I especially enjoyed reading about the hospital tank....I really liked the way they went into detail. Also the section on bring a new fish home. They actually recommended insulation of the new fish for a month before adding to the tank. They also said ask the pet shop to isolate your pick for a week before buying it. Now I doubt any shop around here would do that or have the room to do that. Thanks again. Very helpful info. Evita Heather Husvar <hhusvar@...> wrote: I don't know if this helps or not. I have guppies for the first time and I ran across the following link for troubleshooting guppy issues: http://guppyplace.tripod.com/Problems.html Thanks, Heather On 7/6/05, thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@...> wrote: > Sorry about the quality of the photo, the guppies seem to never stop > moving :) It is kind of fuzzy but not like the one on her side the > other day, which was much fuzzier and larger. I can get a different > container for her tomorrow for the tank -- I didn't think about the > little slats that let the water through in the breeder container. > If it is ich, wouldn't there be more spots on her? What about the > fact that she isn't flashing or gasping at the surface or anything? > Would all the fish show signs? I believe you said the others may > not because they may not be as stressed or susceptible to it, is > that correct? > > Thanks sooo much for letting me pester you like this! > Rebecca > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" > <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > While the foreground (back to her eyes) is in focus, the back of > the > > head starts to get slighly out of focus, but seems good enough to > get > > some idea of the white spot. It looks a little fuzzy, but that > may > > be due to the photo -- it still doesn't look cottony-fuzzy, like > > fungus. Looks more like Ich rather than fungus. From what you > just > > wrote, it looks like you just now bought a breeding net > to "contain" > > the fish, but not a solid container, so you can't just treat her > > alone without the medication spreading throughout the tank. Then > > again, she can't be left at room temperature for a few days if the > > room temperature is in the low 70's -- This temperature will not > > boost her immune system. Looks like you have no other place to > put > > her regardless of what she has, so it appears you'll have to keep > her > > in the large tank. You could either try Copper-Safe (brand) or > just > > raise the temperature (to 86o, if the loaches don't mind), > increasing > > the aeration and adding no more than 3 tbs of salt per 5 gallons; > > loaches don't like much more than this. If it, as appears, is Ich > > (still hard to definitely tell) it should go away in several > days. > > Maybe someone else here can get an idea from the photo. Off- > chance, > > it could just be a bacterial infection, but I'd treat for the Ich > > first. If bacterial, and its a mystery how and why she got it, > the > > salt should help but the addition of the Melafix should clear it > up. > > > Ray > > > \ > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" > > <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > > I posted a picture of her head in my photo album under sick > guppy. > > > Is that the right place to post a picture? Once again the spot > > does > > > not look like salt but is not nearly as fuzzy as last time. > Last > > > time it stuck out from her side, this time it seems smooth and I > > > only noticed it because it was white on her gray head. No one > is > > > going near her. > > > > > > None of the other fish are acting odd or have spots still. Just > > > her. I bought a little breeder thing to hang in the tank but > was > > > told it might be better to put her in a separate container with > an > > > airstone and that she'd be okay at room temperature for a few > days. > > > > > > Was also told if it's bacterial I should treat the whole tank, > not > > > just her. > > > > > > Meds I have are pimafix, melafix, furan-2, and rid-ich. Which > > would > > > be the best to treat her with? > > > > > > Thanks again. > > > Rebecca > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" > > > <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > > Wish I could see a photo of her. What's "fuzzy" to one person > > may > > > not > > > > be as fuzzy to someone else. Lacking such a photo, a > diagnosis > > > has to > > > > be made by the relaying of the description by the viewer to > the > > > one > > > > attempting to give a diagnosis -- not always an accurate > result. > > > > Offhand, without actually being there to see the fish, this > new > > > spot on > > > > the head sounds more like an Ich spot and in retrospect the > spot > > > on the > > > > side, although described as fuzzy, may have been the same. > You > > > can try > > > > treating her seperately with the Rid-Ich provided you are just > > > adding > > > > this to the small container. For her to get it though, the > Ich > > > spores > > > > would have to be in the aquarium water (which it usually is > > > anyway). > > > > It would seem as if the rest of the fish are in good shape and > > > have not > > > > been stressed by anything, or they would have contracted a > spot > > or > > > two > > > > of Ich also (if this is what it is). As I mentioned in my > > > previous > > > > post, raise the temperature to 80o and keep an eye on all the > > > fish. > > > > Keep the female guppy in the treated container for an > additional > > > three > > > > to four days after you see the spot(s) disappear. > > > Ray > > > > > > > > > > \ > > > -- > > > > - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" > > > <TheSydMonster@c...> > > > > wrote: > > > > > Okay, the female guppy that had a fuzzy spot on her side now > > has > > > one > > > > > on the top of her head. Just one single spot, does not look > as > > > fuzzy > > > > > as the other one. She also has not been as active, hanging > out > > > under > > > > > the water sprite. No one else has spots or is flashing. > > > > > > > > > > Since I don't have a QT tank, I am off to the store to buy a > > > little > > > > > container I can hang in the tank and try to treat her and > not > > > the > > > > > whole tank. I will have them test my water while I am there. > > > > > > > > > > What should I do for her? > > > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > Rebecca > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > -- The rules of parents should be but three...Love, Limit, and Let them be. - Elaine M. Ward ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Mail for Mobile Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12953	From: mocoa_man	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: fishy night light

Linda, I am new to the group, but I thought I might be able to help you with your question. They actually have lights that you can put in your light hood that looks and acts like moon light. The light flickers like the moon. I am not actually sure but I think they are in a light spectrum that the fish cannot see. They are relatively inexpensive. I hope this helps. Myren --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > I know this may sound strange, but does anyone else have a night light for > their aquarium? Will this disrupt the fish? > > I sometimes suffer from insomnia and I know that turning the light on to > watch the fish would not be good for them. I put a small night light over the > top corner of the tank. It looks really cool and it gives the tank a real > peaceful aura. Not too many fish active at night and you can't really see a > whole lot. But at 3am in the morning, it is better than nothing. > > Linda > 150 freshwater > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12954	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: I'm back

Evita, Typo's are nothing new on this forum -- I'm sure everyone knew what you meant. So, no need to worry about sounding dumb. Realizing that typo errors are prevalant in these posts, when we read them and a red flag comes up in trying to understand what has been said, most of us I believe go back and re-read that sentence (even if it takes a time or two) and put that strange (previously unintelligible) "out-of-place" word in context with the remainder of the sentence to better understand the intended meaning. Happens often enough! Just something we automatically dismiss in our more important purpose of trying to get to know the other members of this Forum. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Evita <evitabug@y...> wrote: > Not to sound dumb or anything I meant "iso-lation" not "inso- lation" of the new fish. I hope I was not misunderstood. Evita > > Evita <evitabug@y...> wrote: Heather, Great site. I think many of the suggestions would apply to the keeping of all fish. I especially enjoyed reading about the hospital tank....I really liked the way they went into detail. Also the section on bring a new fish home. They actually recommended insulation of the new fish for a month before adding to the tank. They also said ask the pet shop to isolate your pick for a week before buying it. Now I doubt any shop around here would do that or have the room to do that. Thanks again. Very helpful info. Evita > > Heather Husvar <hhusvar@g...> wrote: I don't know if this helps or not. I have guppies for the first time > and I ran across the following link for troubleshooting guppy issues: > http://guppyplace.tripod.com/Problems.html > > Thanks, > Heather > > On 7/6/05, thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > Sorry about the quality of the photo, the guppies seem to never stop > > moving :) It is kind of fuzzy but not like the one on her side the > > other day, which was much fuzzier and larger. I can get a different > > container for her tomorrow for the tank -- I didn't think about the > > little slats that let the water through in the breeder container. > > If it is ich, wouldn't there be more spots on her? What about the > > fact that she isn't flashing or gasping at the surface or anything? > > Would all the fish show signs? I believe you said the others may > > not because they may not be as stressed or susceptible to it, is > > that correct? > > > > Thanks sooo much for letting me pester you like this! > > Rebecca > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" > > <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > While the foreground (back to her eyes) is in focus, the back of > > the > > > head starts to get slighly out of focus, but seems good enough to > > get > > > some idea of the white spot. It looks a little fuzzy, but that > > may > > > be due to the photo -- it still doesn't look cottony-fuzzy, like > > > fungus. Looks more like Ich rather than fungus. From what you > > just > > > wrote, it looks like you just now bought a breeding net > > to "contain" > > > the fish, but not a solid container, so you can't just treat her > > > alone without the medication spreading throughout the tank. Then > > > again, she can't be left at room temperature for a few days if the > > > room temperature is in the low 70's -- This temperature will not > > > boost her immune system. Looks like you have no other place to > > put > > > her regardless of what she has, so it appears you'll have to keep > > her > > > in the large tank. You could either try Copper-Safe (brand) or > > just > > > raise the temperature (to 86o, if the loaches don't mind), > > increasing > > > the aeration and adding no more than 3 tbs of salt per 5 gallons; > > > loaches don't like much more than this. If it, as appears, is Ich > > > (still hard to definitely tell) it should go away in several > > days. > > > Maybe someone else here can get an idea from the photo. Off- > > chance, > > > it could just be a bacterial infection, but I'd treat for the Ich > > > first. If bacterial, and its a mystery how and why she got it, > > the > > > salt should help but the addition of the Melafix should clear it > > up. > > > > > Ray > > > > > \ > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" > > > <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > > > I posted a picture of her head in my photo album under sick > > guppy. > > > > Is that the right place to post a picture? Once again the spot > > > does > > > > not look like salt but is not nearly as fuzzy as last time. > > Last > > > > time it stuck out from her side, this time it seems smooth and I > > > > only noticed it because it was white on her gray head. No one > > is > > > > going near her. > > > > > > > > None of the other fish are acting odd or have spots still. Just > > > > her. I bought a little breeder thing to hang in the tank but > > was > > > > told it might be better to put her in a separate container with > > an > > > > airstone and that she'd be okay at room temperature for a few > > days. > > > > > > > > Was also told if it's bacterial I should treat the whole tank, > > not > > > > just her. > > > > > > > > Meds I have are pimafix, melafix, furan-2, and rid-ich. Which > > > would > > > > be the best to treat her with? > > > > > > > > Thanks again. > > > > Rebecca > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" > > > > <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > > > Wish I could see a photo of her. What's "fuzzy" to one person > > > may > > > > not > > > > > be as fuzzy to someone else. Lacking such a photo, a > > diagnosis > > > > has to > > > > > be made by the relaying of the description by the viewer to > > the > > > > one > > > > > attempting to give a diagnosis -- not always an accurate > > result. > > > > > Offhand, without actually being there to see the fish, this > > new > > > > spot on > > > > > the head sounds more like an Ich spot and in retrospect the > > spot > > > > on the > > > > > side, although described as fuzzy, may have been the same. > > You > > > > can try > > > > > treating her seperately with the Rid-Ich provided you are just > > > > adding > > > > > this to the small container. For her to get it though, the > > Ich > > > > spores > > > > > would have to be in the aquarium water (which it usually is > > > > anyway). > > > > > It would seem as if the rest of the fish are in good shape and > > > > have not > > > > > been stressed by anything, or they would have contracted a > > spot > > > or > > > > two > > > > > of Ich also (if this is what it is). As I mentioned in my > > > > previous > > > > > post, raise the temperature to 80o and keep an eye on all the > > > > fish. > > > > > Keep the female guppy in the treated container for an > > additional > > > > three > > > > > to four days after you see the spot(s) disappear. > > > > Ray > > > > > > > > > > > > > > \ > > > > -- > > > > > - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" > > > > <TheSydMonster@c...> > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > Okay, the female guppy that had a fuzzy spot on her side now > > > has > > > > one > > > > > > on the top of her head. Just one single spot, does not look > > as > > > > fuzzy > > > > > > as the other one. She also has not been as active, hanging > > out > > > > under > > > > > > the water sprite. No one else has spots or is flashing. > > > > > > > > > > > > Since I don't have a QT tank, I am off to the store to buy a > > > > little > > > > > > container I can hang in the tank and try to treat her and > > not > > > > the > > > > > > whole tank. I will have them test my water while I am there. > > > > > > > > > > > > What should I do for her? > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > Rebecca > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > The rules of parents should be but three...Love, Limit, and Let them be. > - Elaine M. Ward > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Mail for Mobile > Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12955	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: feeding plecos

I was wondering what is the best way to see that your pleco is getting enough to eat. How would one small pleco find an algae wafer in my 150 tank? Do you consistently drop the wafer in the same spot so the fish know were to find his food? Or do I rely on his fishy instincts an know that he will find his algae wafer on his own? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12956	From: dreammaker2623	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: OT East to West (was - Re: setting ...aquarium (off topic again, bu

Are you saying it does not go down the drain but rather just goes up into the sky? --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms <wtfmorlok@y...> wrote: > it doesn't.....it goes straight up. > > --- dreammaker2623 <dreammaker2623@y...> wrote: > > > Since water spins in one direction in the Northern > > Hemisphere and the > > other way in the Southern Hemisphere, which > > direction does it spin in > > at the > > equator?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12957	From: Evita	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: I'm back

Thanks Ray.......I sometimes type faster than my brain can tell my fingers. Evita Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote:Evita, Typo's are nothing new on this forum -- I'm sure everyone knew what you meant. So, no need to worry about sounding dumb. --------------------------------- Sell on Yahoo! Auctions - No fees. Bid on great items. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12958	From: dreammaker2623	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: feeding plecos

I would put the wafer in just before or after you turn out the light in the same place. The pleco like most catfish come out at night. They will not only eat algae but will find left over fish food. Aothe good thing for them is to have a piece of drift wood in the tank for each pleco because some pleco seem to need drift wood or maybe wood fibers)in their diets. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > I was wondering what is the best way to see that your pleco is getting > enough to eat. How would one small pleco find an algae wafer in my 150 tank? > > Do you consistently drop the wafer in the same spot so the fish know were to > find his food? Or do I rely on his fishy instincts an know that he will > find his algae wafer on his own? > > Linda

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12959	From: hnorton1cogeco.ca	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: how do I get off the mailing list (anybody)/Heather Norton

Luck To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Heather Norton [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12960	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: Emily (was catfish, was Re: Muskie Tales)

Huh? I'm just an average grad student in entomology. Emily Lenny Vasbinder <lnvtm1@...> wrote: Hey Emily, LMAO! What branch of the service are/were you in? You type like a sailor! :-D Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: 22 Date: Tue, 5 Jul 2005 16:06:30 -0700 (PDT) From: Emily Tenczar Subject: catfish was Re: Muskie Tales Holy f***ing S**T that thing is friggin HUGE!!!!!!!!!!!! Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12961	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: OT East to West (was - Re: setting ...aquarium (off topic again

You guys are a hoot. Lol Thanks for the entertainment. It's not every day that I can read an email and laugh so loud my husbands interest is peaked. =) -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Tuesday, July 05, 2005 9:46 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] OT East to West (was - Re: setting ...aquarium (off topic again, but i'm right)) I believe this "illusion" you are referring to is exactly what all of us are already talking about. I don't think your brilliant revelation of the Sun staying still is exactly news, but then too maybe there are those who still think the world is flat. I trust you've already joined the rest of us in dismissing this notion. \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Aaron" <anonymous122899@y...> wrote: > "Well in America/Northern Hemisphere the sun would have to go 'down' > or south to to rise and 'up' or north to fall. - yes?" > > NO - around here the Sun stays still and the Earth Rotates as it > Travels around the Sun. This causes the illusion that the Sun > is 'Rising' in the EAST (right side of the compass) and 'Setting" in > the WEST (left side of the compass). > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Nicolas Munro <nmunro@q...> > wrote: > > I think (being Australian of course) that this is the proof I've > been > > looking for... America really is upside down. > > > > My reasoning is as follows: Every day the sun rises and falls - > right. > > > > Well in America/Northern Hemisphere the sun would have to > go 'down' or > > south to to rise and 'up' or north to fall. - yes? > > > > So since south is down on the compus and north is up on the compus > then > > I feel that according to nature Australia is the right way up and > the > > northern hemisphere is actually the one which is upside down cause > the > > sun has to go down to go up. > > > > =Nick ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12962	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: GORGEOUS FISH!

I'll take a look and take the advise of not buying into the crossbreeds. Now that I have this 75 established, I have the itch to add something with a bang. I have one blood parrot in the 75 with his use-to-be buddy in another tank. Everyone just loves the blood parrot and he adds so much pow to the look of the tank. I have seen that the flowerhorns grow to 12" and I am in no way up for that. Thanks for all the info and links. I will be researching this week! Leslie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of FortWayneFish@... Sent: Wednesday, July 06, 2005 5:00 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: GORGEOUS FISH! Leslie, The smaller the fish when bought the cheaper. One the LPS( local pet store ) is selling a Flowerhorn (Trimac/something) for $5.99 @ 1.5" fish. These fish can get BIG ... I have seen a few that have been Given up to only LFS that will take them. A couple of these fish are in the 10" range and I am sure they are not done growing. If you are intrested in a TankBuster fish Might I suggest you look through Tangled Up in Cichlids ( http://tangledupincichlids.com/photo.html) before you purchase a Flowerhorn. I am sure Jeff Rapps will have something that you would be intrested in. There are A LOT of non hybrid fish that are very very colorful. rob Indiana In a message dated 7/6/2005 4:32:21 AM US Eastern Standard Time, Deenerz@... writes: > The only > > one I have found so > > far > > > is $125. Yikes. > > > Leslie > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12963	From: joequality1980	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: weird colors

ahhh... that just popped into my head the moment I clicked the Send button. makes sense, but it was a bit loud. This scheme is fine I think --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Aaron" <anonymous122899@y...> wrote: > In the USA yesterday We celebrated our Nations birthday and the groups > colors honored that with the Red, White and Blue theme, we now return > you to the normal color scheme which is open to suggestions. >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12964	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: feeding plecos

As I have several fish that eat algae, I drop a few of them across the tank and hope for the best. From what I was reading, if they are feeding during the day, they are not getting enough. I am not sure if that is true or not since I don;t think I have ever seen a pleco not eat ;-) Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Wednesday, July 06, 2005 10:19 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] feeding plecos I was wondering what is the best way to see that your pleco is getting enough to eat. How would one small pleco find an algae wafer in my 150 tank? Do you consistently drop the wafer in the same spot so the fish know were to find his food? Or do I rely on his fishy instincts an know that he will find his algae wafer on his own? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12965	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: how do I get off the mailing list (anybody)/Heather Norton

read the bottom of your emails... Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of hnorton1cogeco.ca Sent: Wednesday, July 06, 2005 10:53 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] how do I get off the mailing list (anybody)/Heather Norton Luck To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Heather Norton [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> SPONSORED LINKS Saltwater <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Saltwater+aquarium&w1=Saltwater+aquariu m&w2=Marine+biologist&w3=Reef+tank&c=3&s=61&.sig=UY1316z62uVmxBaTXrRFwg> aquarium Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biologist&w1=Saltwater+aquarium& w2=Marine+biologist&w3=Reef+tank&c=3&s=61&.sig=cIu6LkaigzIAXitzbMJI2g> biologist Reef <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Reef+tank&w1=Saltwater+aquarium&w2=Mari ne+biologist&w3=Reef+tank&c=3&s=61&.sig=nOJjj1Le7P4CO7AebgBZiQ> tank _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12966	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Fighting blood parrots...another question

I just let the larger of the two back into the 75 gal. That's plenty of room for them to have their own space, but of course they are immediately fighting again. I've tried to let them hash it out but I always cave when see I scales off and upper lips with loose skin. My question, is there such thing as just letting them hash it out or would one eventually kill the other? If I leave them in there, would the lesser of the two find a hiding spot and just try to avoid the larger? Or would this be cruel and I should just again remove the larger to the smaller tank? In which case I would end up getting rid of him as it's just too small in there for him. I have no intentions of getting another tank so unless I find one at some incredible steal, then I have to find a home for him. To fight it out or not to fight it out? Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12967	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: feeding plecos

I have two comon plecs and a "rainbow" shark (dunno why they call it a rainbow when its velvet black with red tips, but then what do I know :p) that are all big eaters. I usually toss in about 6-7 of them into my tank daily as part of the normal feeding with everyone else, skipping usually sunday. I also have a veggie clip that I will put in either lettuce or cabbage (the plecs love both as do the tiger barbs and my rainbow fish [odly enough the shark leaves those alone]). I also found on eBay from a place in Brittain a thing called a screwcumber which work great for giving the plecs a cucumber quarter. But then my two plecs are full grown. -Steve ----- Original Message ----- From: "Eric Roberts" <woad@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wednesday, July 06, 2005 10:00 AM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] feeding plecos As I have several fish that eat algae, I drop a few of them across the tank and hope for the best. From what I was reading, if they are feeding during the day, they are not getting enough. I am not sure if that is true or not since I don;t think I have ever seen a pleco not eat ;-) Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Wednesday, July 06, 2005 10:19 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] feeding plecos I was wondering what is the best way to see that your pleco is getting enough to eat. How would one small pleco find an algae wafer in my 150 tank? Do you consistently drop the wafer in the same spot so the fish know were to find his food? Or do I rely on his fishy instincts an know that he will find his algae wafer on his own? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12968	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: feeding plecos

I only have 1 albino BN pleco in my 37 gallon tank and I actually feed him in the morning. I do feed him in the same place, in front of his little cave entrance. If the wafer drifts he'll find it and pull it back in there. I have to say, though, that he LOVES zucchini. I have to put two pieces in because he will not share with the otos! I only feed him every other day. What kind of lettuce is recommended for them? Any other veggies they seem to love?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12969	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: I'm back

I have to say, Evita, that I didn't even notice the typo so I must have just read it as how you meant it, now how you spelled it :) And thanks for the link, Heather! I was told that the female guppy is probably stressed from all the attention of the males (she is also the dominant female) and that this type of thing is common. How do I add salt to her little container? Should I dissolve a tiny bit in some tank water and add it? How much? It's a pretty small container. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Evita <evitabug@y...> wrote: > Thanks Ray.......I sometimes type faster than my brain can tell my fingers. Evita > > Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote:Evita, Typo's are nothing new on this forum -- I'm sure everyone > knew what you meant. So, no need to worry about sounding dumb. > > > > --------------------------------- > Sell on Yahoo! Auctions - No fees. Bid on great items. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12970	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: feeding plecos

Try Broccoli for the plecos...let it sit in the water a few days and they will go nuts over it. Make sure you use fresh broccoli as frozen broccoli will break down quickly and get ALL over the aquarium and make a really bad mess. A friend of mine who has been an aquarist for years and owns a Petland turned me on to that. I didn't think it was working as it took a few day. Once it sinks to the bottom they are all over it like sharks in a feeding frenzy. Some of the other veggie eaters will nibble on it as well. While the broccoli is still floating, my spiny eels like to hang from the branches hehehe. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of The Dragon Hunter Sent: Wednesday, July 06, 2005 12:55 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] feeding plecos I have two comon plecs and a "rainbow" shark (dunno why they call it a rainbow when its velvet black with red tips, but then what do I know :p) that are all big eaters. I usually toss in about 6-7 of them into my tank daily as part of the normal feeding with everyone else, skipping usually sunday. I also have a veggie clip that I will put in either lettuce or cabbage (the plecs love both as do the tiger barbs and my rainbow fish [odly enough the shark leaves those alone]). I also found on eBay from a place in Brittain a thing called a screwcumber which work great for giving the plecs a cucumber quarter. But then my two plecs are full grown. -Steve ----- Original Message ----- From: "Eric Roberts" <woad@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wednesday, July 06, 2005 10:00 AM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] feeding plecos As I have several fish that eat algae, I drop a few of them across the tank and hope for the best. From what I was reading, if they are feeding during the day, they are not getting enough. I am not sure if that is true or not since I don;t think I have ever seen a pleco not eat ;-) Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Wednesday, July 06, 2005 10:19 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] feeding plecos I was wondering what is the best way to see that your pleco is getting enough to eat. How would one small pleco find an algae wafer in my 150 tank? Do you consistently drop the wafer in the same spot so the fish know were to find his food? Or do I rely on his fishy instincts an know that he will find his algae wafer on his own? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12971	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: feeding plecos

Hee hee, I bet that is a sight Eric!!!!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12972	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: I'm back

I was wondering how they was going to stuff the poor little fish with insolation.... ( just kidding ) rob In a message dated 7/6/2005 6:57:54 AM US Eastern Standard Time, evitabug@... writes: > Not to sound dumb or anything I meant "iso-lation" not "inso-lation" of the > new fish. I hope I was not misunderstood. Evita [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12973	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: feeding plecos

any lettuce but Romaine.. I do believe I feed a lot of yellow "summer" squash cucumbers, fresh boiled green beans, peas, the list could be endless.. but i stick to cucumber, and squash myself.. easier on me... rob In a message dated 7/6/2005 1:15:22 PM US Eastern Standard Time, TheSydMonster@... writes: > > I only have 1 albino BN pleco in my 37 gallon tank and I actually feed > him in the morning. I do feed him in the same place, in front of his > little cave entrance. If the wafer drifts he'll find it and pull it > back in there. I have to say, though, that he LOVES zucchini. I have > to put two pieces in because he will not share with the otos! I only > feed him every other day. > > What kind of lettuce is recommended for them? Any other veggies they > seem to love? > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12974	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: feeding pleco's

I just got my first Pleco, a 5" juvi Common Pleco that I adopted/saved from a 10G tropical tank. I try to drop the algae thins or other sinking foods in the same spot... on the opposite side of the tank from my Goldfish. Most of the times, he smells the algae thins and beats the Goldfish to it. Sometimes they get there first but as soon as the Pleco shows up, he takes what is his! The Goldfish are only 2 1/2" right now so I think the Pleco will always be able to get his fair share of food. I just tried a slice of zucchini last night for the first time about an hour after lights out. I bought a frozen bag of sliced zucchini and nuked one slice for one minute. After it cooled down, I dropped it in the Pleco's normal feeding spot. I checked on it every hour with a flashlight but I never did see him go for the zucchini. After a while, the current moved the slice across the tank and I saw the Goldfish nibbling on it but it was my two Golden Mystery Snails who had the biggest feast. There was one on each side of the slice so the slice was standing up like a wheel. This morning, all that was left was the "O" of the rind. Even the seeds were gone as far as I can tell. I don't know if the Pleco even got a bite. I also bought some frozen 1/2 ears of corn and I hear the Pleco's and Snails like that too. Just par-boil it, take a sharp knife or single-edge razor and slice through the skin of the kernels and drop it in. I'll be trying this in a couple of days. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: Date: Wed, 6 Jul 2005 11:19:24 EDT From: Crazy4fids@... Subject: feeding plecos I was wondering what is the best way to see that your pleco is getting enough to eat. How would one small pleco find an algae wafer in my 150 tank? Do you consistently drop the wafer in the same spot so the fish know were to find his food? Or do I rely on his fishy instincts an know that he will find his algae wafer on his own? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12975	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: I'm back

My readings were 0 ammonia, 0 nitrite, and 10 nitrate. I was wondering if ammonia is going to build up in her little container since there is no filter or water flow? When I first put her in there she went potty A LOT so I siphoned it out and put fresh tank water in there. She seems much calmer now (probably relaxed being away from the males!). Other than gasping or flashing what should I be looking for to be sure she is comfy? Have I said thank you yet to everyone :) Thanks! --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > Fish photography is not easy as you've found out...Sometimes its more > luck than anything else. I think I get the idea from your photo. I > believe you said you were going to have your water tested last > night. What were the results?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12976	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: feeding plecos

So it is still healthy for them to eat just a few things? I rotate algae wafers, spirulina (sp?) flakes, zucchini, cucumber and peas for him and the oto. The peas were not a big hit, though. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, FortWayneFish@a... wrote: > any lettuce but Romaine.. I do believe > I feed a lot of yellow "summer" squash > cucumbers, fresh boiled green beans, peas, > the list could be endless.. > > but i stick to cucumber, and squash myself.. > easier on me... > > rob > > > In a message dated 7/6/2005 1:15:22 PM US Eastern Standard Time, > TheSydMonster@c... writes: > > > > > > I only have 1 albino BN pleco in my 37 gallon tank and I actually feed > > him in the morning. I do feed him in the same place, in front of his > > little cave entrance. If the wafer drifts he'll find it and pull it > > back in there. I have to say, though, that he LOVES zucchini. I have > > to put two pieces in because he will not share with the otos! I only > > feed him every other day. > > > > What kind of lettuce is recommended for them? Any other veggies they > > seem to love? > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12977	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: feeding plecos

blanched zucchini works for my plec. i haven't tried it in awhile because the plec creates so much waste after eating it. but i guess he's fine w/o it because it's healthy looking. i tried the algae disks and my plec never liked em at all. they work great for my sw hermits though. --- FortWayneFish@... wrote: > any lettuce but Romaine.. I do believe > I feed a lot of yellow "summer" squash > cucumbers, fresh boiled green beans, peas, > the list could be endless.. > > but i stick to cucumber, and squash myself.. > easier on me... > > rob > > > In a message dated 7/6/2005 1:15:22 PM US Eastern Standard Time, > TheSydMonster@... writes: > > > > > > I only have 1 albino BN pleco in my 37 gallon tank and I actually feed > > him in the morning. I do feed him in the same place, in front of his > > little cave entrance. If the wafer drifts he'll find it and pull it > > back in there. I have to say, though, that he LOVES zucchini. I have > > to put two pieces in because he will not share with the otos! I only > > feed him every other day. > > > > What kind of lettuce is recommended for them? Any other veggies they > > seem to love? > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12978	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: feeding plecos

The reason to feed a varied diet is to help the fish get all there vitamans. Yes vitamans are needed by our fish. Of course if you are feeding a decent flake food, supplimented by algae waffers, or vegetables your fish are probally recieving enough of the right vitamans. My Bristlenose have been breeding like clock work every 3 weeks giving me between 100-200 babies since September last year. truthfully I don't think the Parent BN have gotten any vegies in the last 6 months ( shame on me ) Just Flake food and sinking shrimp pellets. A piece of real wood, is a plus in a pleco tank as it helps the plecos digestive system, and is also afood supply. My Babies grow 2x faster in a tank with driftwwod in it then in a tank w/o driftwood. My LFS gives me $.25 each for 1"+ juveniles. Not a lot but it helps pay for the food. rob Indiana rob Indiana In a message dated 7/6/2005 5:37:30 PM US Eastern Standard Time, TheSydMonster@... writes: > So it is still healthy for them to eat just a few things? I rotate > algae wafers, spirulina (sp?) flakes, zucchini, cucumber and peas > for him and the oto. The peas were not a big hit, though. > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, FortWayneFish@a... wrote: > > any lettuce but Romaine.. I do believe > > I feed a lot of yellow "summer" squash > > cucumbers, fresh boiled green beans, peas, > > the list could be endless.. > > > > but i stick to cucumber, and squash myself.. > > easier on me... > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12979	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: I'm back

rebecca, Imagine how much light your little girl is getting. Some plants for shade and to hide in might be helpful. By adding freshwater ( tank water ) to the container every couple of hours will help keep the water circulated and the ammonia in check. Just dump some of the container water out and add new tank water. rob Indiana In a message dated 7/6/2005 5:37:32 PM US Eastern Standard Time, TheSydMonster@... writes: > > My readings were 0 ammonia, 0 nitrite, and 10 nitrate. > > I was wondering if ammonia is going to build up in her little > container since there is no filter or water flow? When I first put > her in there she went potty A LOT so I siphoned it out and put fresh > tank water in there. She seems much calmer now (probably relaxed > being away from the males!). Other than gasping or flashing what > should I be looking for to be sure she is comfy? > > Have I said thank you yet to everyone :) Thanks! > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12980	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: I'm back

She has water sprite in there. I will change a little of her water every few hours, thanks. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, FortWayneFish@a... wrote: > > rebecca, > > > Imagine how much light your little girl is getting. Some plants for shade and > to hide in might be helpful. > > By adding freshwater ( tank water ) to the container every couple of hours > will help keep the water circulated and the ammonia in check. Just dump some of > the container water out and add new tank water. > > rob > Indiana > > > > In a message dated 7/6/2005 5:37:32 PM US Eastern Standard Time, > TheSydMonster@c... writes: > > > > > > My readings were 0 ammonia, 0 nitrite, and 10 nitrate. > > > > I was wondering if ammonia is going to build up in her little > > container since there is no filter or water flow? When I first put > > her in there she went potty A LOT so I siphoned it out and put fresh > > tank water in there. She seems much calmer now (probably relaxed > > being away from the males!). Other than gasping or flashing what > > should I be looking for to be sure she is comfy? > > > > Have I said thank you yet to everyone :) Thanks! > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12981	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Testing the email

Just seeing when this goes through. Posted something and never saw it. 7:15 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12982	From: mocoa_man	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: fishy night light

I am new to the group but I thought I might be able to help with this topic. I have actually see the lights for aquariums that act as moon light. It is really dim and flickers like the moon. I am not actually sure, but I think it is in a light spectrum that the fish cannot see. I hope this helps Linda.--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > Linda, Strange? -- Not at all! I know of many aquarists who use night > lights. I've learned many years ago that the fish are less apt to be > spooked (as sometimes happens) and attempt to jump, succeeding if there > is no cover. Small dim lights will not at all disrupt the fish. I use > a small night light on the ceiling in each of the four corners of my > hatchery. In total darkness, I can only assume that occasionally fish > may drift (bump) into each other, startling themselves and the bumpee. > Ray > \ - > -- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > > I know this may sound strange, but does anyone else have a night > light for > > their aquarium? Will this disrupt the fish? > > > > I sometimes suffer from insomnia and I know that turning the light on > to > > watch the fish would not be good for them. I put a small night > light over the > > top corner of the tank. It looks really cool and it gives the tank > a real > > peaceful aura. Not too many fish active at night and you can't > really see a > > whole lot. But at 3am in the morning, it is better than nothing. > > > > Linda > > 150 freshwater > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12983	From: paul helms	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: OT East to West (was - Re: setting ...aquarium (off topic again

sure why not...since the equator is an imaginary line why not have a pretend answer. which ever magnetic pull you are closer to controlls which way it goes. there is no such thing a sthe equater, and there is no dead zone for flushing it will have more pull one direction or the other. --- dreammaker2623 <dreammaker2623@...> wrote: > Are you saying it does not go down the drain but > rather just goes up > into the > sky? > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > <wtfmorlok@y...> wrote: > > it doesn't.....it goes straight up. > > > > --- dreammaker2623 <dreammaker2623@y...> wrote: > > > > > Since water spins in one direction in the > Northern > > > Hemisphere and the > > > other way in the Southern Hemisphere, which > > > direction does it spin in > > > at the > > > equator? > > > > > ____________________________________________________ Sell on Yahoo! Auctions – no fees. Bid on great items. http://auctions.yahoo.com/

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12984	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Retry: THANK YOU & pics of 75 gal.

I am trying to send out an email but it's not coming through. The part that gets me is that THIS one and the other test went through? Am I losing it? Lost it maybe? Huh? And I've tried to send it TWICE now. Grrrr. Maybe if I cut and paste it into this one. It's below, if it goes through: The pictures are posted under Blood Parrots album. This is the tank I received for FREE, or confiscated rather, for all the rescue fish. Everything was "gifted" to me, (including Eheim pro canister filter, tons of food, medications, auto feeders, nets, gravel, heaters, gravel filters/cleaners, giant buckets, spare powerheads-all new, test kits of all kinds, ph powders, massive chemical pump and some pump that you hang on the side with powder that clears up the tank & more that I can't think of right now). I just purchased the plants on my own. This is also the tank you all have helped me so much with. NONE of these fish would be alive if it weren't for those of you who are so faithful to helping out. And you know who you are! THANK YOU!!!!!! From myself and these fish! ;) (Please take a look at them and see who you saved.) Leslie PS Out of 16 fish, 14 made it. One was left in the abandoned house (a firemouth) and I didn't get to him in time. The other was a catfish that died due to my not doing a water change that day. =( But they would ALL be dead if it weren't for this ONE group helping me out with every detail every day for about 14 days straight. You all got a gal with NO fish experience to execute a completely workable tank virtually overnight, and with great success! I literally added 55 gallons of water (to an old dirty tank) and a ton of fish in the same day with only 1 resulting death. Again, THANK YOU!!!!!! You people are wonderful and these survival numbers prove it! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12985	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Compatible?

My DH really likes the powder blue dwarf gourami's the flame dwarf gourami's and the yellow and blue discus. Are these compatible? We can do the water quality, but how about personality?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12986	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: 75 Gal Tank Pics & THANK YOU!

The pictures are posted under Blood Parrots album. This is the tank I received for FREE, or confiscated rather, for all the rescue fish. Everything was "gifted" to me, (including Eheim pro canister filter, tons of food, medications, auto feeders, nets, gravel, heaters, gravel filters/cleaners, giant buckets, spare powerheads-all new, test kits of all kinds, ph powders, massive chemical pump and some pump that you hang on the side with powder that clears up the tank & more that I can't think of right now). I just purchased the plants on my own. This is also the tank you all have helped me so much with. NONE of these fish would be alive if it weren't for those of you who are so faithful to helping out. And you know who you are! THANK YOU!!!!!! From myself and these fish! ;) (Please take a look at them and see who you saved.) Leslie PS Out of 16 fish, 14 made it. One was left in the abandoned house (a firemouth) and I didn't get to him in time. The other was a catfish that died due to my not doing a water change that day. =( But they would ALL be dead if it weren't for this ONE group helping me out with every detail every day for about 14 days straight. You all got a gal with NO fish experience to execute a completely workable tank virtually overnight, and with great success! I literally added 55 gallons of water (to an old dirty tank) and a ton of fish in the same day with only 1 resulting death. Again, THANK YOU!!!!!! You people are wonderful and these survival numbers prove it! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12987	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Pacific Coast Cichlid Association (PCCA), 7/9/2005, 6:45 pm

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife Pacific Coast Cichlid Association (PCCA) Saturday July 9, 2005 6:45 pm - 9:45 pm This event repeats on the second Saturday of every month. Event Location: Round Table Pizza, 4302 Moorpark Avenue in San Jose, California Notes: The PCCA meets every second Saturday of the month. Meetings are held a the Round Table Pizza parlor located at 4302 Moorpark Avenue in San Jose, California http://www.cichlidworld.com/ Yahoo! Greetings Send a Yahoo! Greeting. Birthday Reminders Set up birthday reminders! ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12988	From: Evita	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: feeding pleco's

Lenny You could try fresh Zucchini. You can keep in it the frig and slice it as you want. Like slices of cucumber. No need to cook it. My fish loved it. You just need to sink in in the tank. They will eat it right down to the green skin and then you can throw it out. Evita Lenny Vasbinder <lnvtm1@...> wrote: I just got my first Pleco, a 5" juvi Common Pleco that I adopted/saved from a 10G tropical tank. I try to drop the algae thins or other sinking foods in the same spot... on the opposite side of the tank from my Goldfish. Most of the times, he smells the algae thins and beats the Goldfish to it. Sometimes they get there first but as soon as the Pleco shows up, he takes what is his! The Goldfish are only 2 1/2" right now so I think the Pleco will always be able to get his fair share of food. I just tried a slice of zucchini last night for the first time about an hour after lights out. I bought a frozen bag of sliced zucchini and nuked one slice for one minute. After it cooled down, I dropped it in the Pleco's normal feeding spot. I checked on it every hour with a flashlight but I never did see him go for the zucchini. After a while, the current moved the slice across the tank and I saw the Goldfish nibbling on it but it was my two Golden Mystery Snails who had the biggest feast. There was one on each side of the slice so the slice was standing up like a wheel. This morning, all that was left was the "O" of the rind. Even the seeds were gone as far as I can tell. I don't know if the Pleco even got a bite. I also bought some frozen 1/2 ears of corn and I hear the Pleco's and Snails like that too. Just par-boil it, take a sharp knife or single-edge razor and slice through the skin of the kernels and drop it in. I'll be trying this in a couple of days. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: Date: Wed, 6 Jul 2005 11:19:24 EDT From: Crazy4fids@... Subject: feeding plecos I was wondering what is the best way to see that your pleco is getting enough to eat. How would one small pleco find an algae wafer in my 150 tank? Do you consistently drop the wafer in the same spot so the fish know were to find his food? Or do I rely on his fishy instincts an know that he will find his algae wafer on his own? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12989	From: Evita	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: I'm back

Ha Ha Rob! FortWayneFish@... wrote:I was wondering how they was going to stuff the poor little fish with insolation.... ( just kidding ) rob In a message dated 7/6/2005 6:57:54 AM US Eastern Standard Time, evitabug@... writes: > Not to sound dumb or anything I meant "iso-lation" not "inso-lation" of the > new fish. I hope I was not misunderstood. Evita [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12990	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: 75 Gal Tank Pics & THANK YOU!

Posted under Blood Parrots album. This is the tank I received for FREE, or confiscated rather, for all the rescue fish. Everything was "gifted" to me, (including Eheim pro canister filter, tons of food, medications, auto feeders, nets, gravel, heaters, gravel filters/cleaners, giant buckets, spare powerheads-all new, test kits of all kinds, ph powders, massive chemical pump and some pump that you hang on the side with powder that clears up the tank & more that I can't think of right now). I just purchased the plants on my own. This is also the tank you all have helped me so much with. NONE of these fish would be alive if it weren't for those of you who are so faithful to helping out. And you know who you are! THANK YOU!!!!!! From myself and these fish! ;) (Please take a look at them and see who you saved.) Leslie PS Out of 16 fish, 14 made it. One was left in the abandoned house (a firemouth) and I didn't get to him in time. The other was a catfish that died due to my not doing a water change that day. =( But they would ALL be dead if it weren't for this ONE group helping me out with every detail every day for about 14 days straight. I literally added 55 gallons of water and a ton of fish in the same day with only 1 resulting death. Again, THANK YOU!!!!!! You people are wonderful and these numbers prove it! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12991	From: Aaron	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: feeding plecos

fruits & veggies: Zucchini Broccoli Kale Spinach Lettuce Potatoe Peas(out of shell) Tomatoes Squash Cucumber other foods: Cooked Rice Boiled Egg Yolk edible live plants: echinodorus rose anubias nana Riccia Hornwort duckweed cabomba Limnophylla from: Fish Vegtables nice treats http://f3.grp.yahoofs.com/v1/0LbMQkoDGZCEUCorpp3QxVTOy3Zs16sUrGYWBjdm CaDSzRFOJawrmy1AnHAGSnccQidvn9bFAPtmAzw1LN22/Fish%20Vegtables --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, FortWayneFish@a... wrote: > any lettuce but Romaine.. I do believe > I feed a lot of yellow "summer" squash > cucumbers, fresh boiled green beans, peas, > the list could be endless.. > > but i stick to cucumber, and squash myself.. > easier on me... > > rob > > > In a message dated 7/6/2005 1:15:22 PM US Eastern Standard Time, > TheSydMonster@c... writes: > > > > > > I only have 1 albino BN pleco in my 37 gallon tank and I actually feed > > him in the morning. I do feed him in the same place, in front of his > > little cave entrance. If the wafer drifts he'll find it and pull it > > back in there. I have to say, though, that he LOVES zucchini. I have > > to put two pieces in because he will not share with the otos! I only > > feed him every other day. > > > > What kind of lettuce is recommended for them? Any other veggies they > > seem to love? > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12992	From: Aaron M.	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: OT East to West

Hi Ray, I was being sarcastic as is my typical sense of humor and could only assume that what you explained is exactly what happend and that the aussie was not meaning the sun sets in the north so 2 speak, thats what happens when I'm online past my bedtime - i lose proper sense of judgement and restraint. No harm intended, just senseless fun on my part, I apologize for the confusion. Aaron Ray Wetzel <> wrote: Aaron, I, for one, was following your first post to the letter. At first glance it appeared as if you were alluding to the fact that none of us realized that its the earth rotating on its axis, with the sun remaining stationary, that causes the sun to rise and travel across the sky 'till it sets, in a seemingly condesceding manner. Your reply did not seem to connect with Nick's slightly confusing message, but then in all fairness, his message had to be re-read more than once to fully appreciate it. As I understand Nick, he was not refuting that the sun rises in the east and sets in the west -- his point, as I gather it, was that as it rises (in the east) it rises (arcs) towards the south and (after reaching apogee) then arcs towards the north as it swings to set in the west, although he did not say this in so many words. After re-reading his somewhat unclear post at least several times, this is finally what I got -- at least I would hope this is what he meant. \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Aaron" <anonymous122899@y...> wrote: > If you were paying attention to my first post you may have read that > the point I was pointing out was eluded to via the subject line, > that is the East West reality of the Sunrise and sunset as opposed > to the previously mentioned mistaken mention of the sun rising in > the South and setting in the North which may be the illusion the > rest of you were refering to too. > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" > <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > I believe this "illusion" you are referring to is exactly what all > of > > us are already talking about. I don't think your brilliant > > revelation of the Sun staying still is exactly news, but then too > > maybe there are those who still think the world is flat. I trust > > you've already joined the rest of us in dismissing this > notion. > > > \ > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Aaron" <anonymous122899@y...> > > wrote: > > > "Well in America/Northern Hemisphere the sun would have to > > go 'down' > > > or south to to rise and 'up' or north to fall. - yes?" > > > > > > NO - around here the Sun stays still and the Earth Rotates as it > > > Travels around the Sun. This causes the illusion that the Sun > > > is 'Rising' in the EAST (right side of the compass) > and 'Setting" > > in > > > the WEST (left side of the compass). > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Nicolas Munro <nmunro@q...> > > > wrote: > > > > I think (being Australian of course) that this is the proof > I've > > > been > > > > looking for... America really is upside down. > > > > > > > > My reasoning is as follows: Every day the sun rises and falls - > > > > right. > > > > > > > > Well in America/Northern Hemisphere the sun would have to > > > go 'down' or > > > > south to to rise and 'up' or north to fall. - yes? > > > > > > > > So since south is down on the compus and north is up on the > > compus > > > then > > > > I feel that according to nature Australia is the right way up > and > > > the > > > > northern hemisphere is actually the one which is upside down > > cause > > > the > > > > sun has to go down to go up. > > > > > > > > =Nick ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife stop by and see ~ membership is free! <º((((><¸..·´¯`·., . .·´¯`·.. <º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((>< ¸.·´¯`·.¸. --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Helps protect you from nasty viruses. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12993	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 7/6/2005
Subject: Re: feeding pleco's

My plecos seem to adore my moss balls...They are so funny, the kind of roll them round and round the tank.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12994	From: paul helms	Date: 7/7/2005
Subject: Re: Compatible?

maybe.....the dwarf gourami can be a bit bitchy and nippy, and discus do not handle stress well. --- cynthia brennemann <brennewoman@...> wrote: > My DH really likes the powder blue dwarf gourami's > the flame dwarf > gourami's and the yellow and blue discus. Are these > compatible? We can > do the water quality, but how about personality? > > > ____________________________________________________ Sell on Yahoo! Auctions – no fees. Bid on great items. http://auctions.yahoo.com/

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12995	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/7/2005
Subject: Re: I'm back

Your tank water parameters loohk great -- nothing to worry about there. Ideally, you will need to do partial water changes to the container to keep water parameters up to par. As for how much salt to add, you would have to figure out how much water that container holds. If it holds a quart, then by adding 1/4 tsp to it would be the same as 1 tsp per gallon. If it only holds a pint, then addibg 1/8 tsp of salt to it would be like adding 1 tsp per gallon. with Guppies, you can add the equivilent of 2 tsp salt per gallon with no problems. They'll take up to 6 tsp per gallon comfortably, by adding 2 tsp per gallon per day, but is should not be needed in this case. The easiest way to add the right amount of salt if you don't know how much the container holds is by mixing one (or two, if you prefer) tsp of salt to a gallon jar of your aquarium water, hoping you have a gallon jar laying around (a convenient aquarium item) and fill the container with that water, saving the extra water for water changes. Salt should always be pre-disolved anyway. I presume you're using the Rid-Ich(?), so the salt shouldn't be needed, but should help if you want to use it. If you're just raising the temperature (no Rid_Ich), then you could go up to 2 tsp per gallon on the salt; don't forget, after treatment decrease the salt content gradually before putting her back in the main tank. Things to look for -- watch for additional spots or the disappearance of the present spot. When it disappears, wait at least 3 more days before putting her back. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > My readings were 0 ammonia, 0 nitrite, and 10 nitrate. > > I was wondering if ammonia is going to build up in her little > container since there is no filter or water flow? When I first put > her in there she went potty A LOT so I siphoned it out and put fresh > tank water in there. She seems much calmer now (probably relaxed > being away from the males!). Other than gasping or flashing what > should I be looking for to be sure she is comfy? > > Have I said thank you yet to everyone :) Thanks! > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> > wrote: > > Fish photography is not easy as you've found out...Sometimes its > more > > luck than anything else. I think I get the idea from your photo. I > > believe you said you were going to have your water tested last > > night. What were the results?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12996	From: hnorton1cogeco.ca	Date: 7/7/2005
Subject: feeding plecos/Heather Norton

I know some folks will say Im asking for trouble will other issues but I always have a large jar of lettuce that is well degraded so that is almost like a fine pulp I have been giving all my tanks this soup every week one or twice depending on the breeds of fish .but I have not had much of a drop in the tank checks so it works for me but others who had tried it have to much bacteria count to contend with. Heather Norton [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12997	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/7/2005
Subject: Re: OT East to West

Hi Aaron, Thank you, but I did not expect an apology from you, nor was there one needed by you. After reading Leslie's reply late yesterday morning, I again re-read your original post on this and realized just how you meant it -- in a sarcastically funny vein, which by the way I appreciated and got a chuckle out of. As such, I sent an apology as a reply to her post, but my 'putor shot me down and cut me off-line before my post went through. Anyway, I would like to take this opportunity to expess apologies to you for not understanding your intentions at the time, and misunderstanding your sense of humor. Sorry about the shot I gave you. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Aaron M." <anonymous122899@y...> wrote: > Hi Ray, > > I was being sarcastic as is my typical sense of humor and could only assume that what you explained is exactly what happend and that the aussie was not meaning the sun sets in the north so 2 speak, thats what happens when I'm online past my bedtime - i lose proper sense of judgement and restraint. > No harm intended, just senseless fun on my part, I apologize for the confusion. > Aaron > > Ray Wetzel <> wrote: > Aaron, I, for one, was following your first post to the letter. At > first glance it appeared as if you were alluding to the fact that > none of us realized that its the earth rotating on its axis, with the > sun remaining stationary, that causes the sun to rise and travel > across the sky 'till it sets, in a seemingly condesceding manner. > Your reply did not seem to connect with Nick's slightly confusing > message, but then in all fairness, his message had to be re-read more > than once to fully appreciate it. As I understand Nick, he was not > refuting that the sun rises in the east and sets in the west -- his > point, as I gather it, was that as it rises (in the east) it rises > (arcs) towards the south and (after reaching apogee) then arcs > towards the north as it swings to set in the west, although he did > not say this in so many words. After re-reading his somewhat unclear > post at least several times, this is finally what I got -- at least I > would hope this is what he meant. > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Aaron" <anonymous122899@y...> > wrote: > > If you were paying attention to my first post you may have read > that > > the point I was pointing out was eluded to via the subject line, > > that is the East West reality of the Sunrise and sunset as opposed > > to the previously mentioned mistaken mention of the sun rising in > > the South and setting in the North which may be the illusion the > > rest of you were refering to too. > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" > > <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > I believe this "illusion" you are referring to is exactly what > all > > of > > > us are already talking about. I don't think your brilliant > > > revelation of the Sun staying still is exactly news, but then too > > > maybe there are those who still think the world is flat. I trust > > > you've already joined the rest of us in dismissing this > > notion. > > > > > > \ > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Aaron" > <anonymous122899@y...> > > > wrote: > > > > "Well in America/Northern Hemisphere the sun would have to > > > go 'down' > > > > or south to to rise and 'up' or north to fall. - yes?" > > > > > > > > NO - around here the Sun stays still and the Earth Rotates as > it > > > > Travels around the Sun. This causes the illusion that the Sun > > > > is 'Rising' in the EAST (right side of the compass) > > and 'Setting" > > > in > > > > the WEST (left side of the compass). > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Nicolas Munro <nmunro@q...> > > > > wrote: > > > > > I think (being Australian of course) that this is the proof > > I've > > > > been > > > > > looking for... America really is upside down. > > > > > > > > > > My reasoning is as follows: Every day the sun rises and > falls - > > > > > > right. > > > > > > > > > > Well in America/Northern Hemisphere the sun would have to > > > > go 'down' or > > > > > south to to rise and 'up' or north to fall. - yes? > > > > > > > > > > So since south is down on the compus and north is up on the > > > compus > > > > then > > > > > I feel that according to nature Australia is the right way up > > and > > > > the > > > > > northern hemisphere is actually the one which is upside down > > > cause > > > > the > > > > > sun has to go down to go up. > > > > > > > > > > =Nick > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > > > > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > <º((((><¸..·´¯`·., . .·´¯`·.. <º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((>< ¸.·´¯`·.¸. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Mail - Helps protect you from nasty viruses. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12998	From: hnorton1cogeco.ca	Date: 7/7/2005
Subject: fresh food for two inch Angels other then lettuce /Heather Norton

I have given my Angels (2") just some fresh lettuce but they prefer it decomposed is there anything other then lettuce that I can try.I also have some feeder guppies in with them and one pair of black Tetras Heather Norton [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 12999	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 7/7/2005
Subject: Re: feeding pleco's

Do they eat the moss balls or just play with them? ----- Original Message ----- From: "cynthia brennemann" <brennewoman@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wednesday, July 06, 2005 11:35 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: feeding pleco's My plecos seem to adore my moss balls...They are so funny, the kind of roll them round and round the tank. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13000	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/7/2005
Subject: Re: feeding plecos

Do you blanch or freeze the broccoli or potato first? --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Aaron" <anonymous122899@y...> wrote: > fruits & veggies: > Zucchini > Broccoli > Kale > Spinach > Lettuce > Potatoe > Peas(out of shell) > Tomatoes > Squash > Cucumber > > > > > other foods: > Cooked Rice > Boiled Egg Yolk > > edible live plants: > echinodorus rose > anubias nana > Riccia > Hornwort > duckweed > cabomba > Limnophylla > > from: > Fish Vegtables > nice treats > http://f3.grp.yahoofs.com/v1/0LbMQkoDGZCEUCorpp3QxVTOy3Zs16sUrGYWBjdm > CaDSzRFOJawrmy1AnHAGSnccQidvn9bFAPtmAzw1LN22/Fish%20Vegtables > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, FortWayneFish@a... wrote: > > any lettuce but Romaine.. I do believe > > I feed a lot of yellow "summer" squash > > cucumbers, fresh boiled green beans, peas, > > the list could be endless.. > > > > but i stick to cucumber, and squash myself.. > > easier on me... > > > > rob > > > > > > In a message dated 7/6/2005 1:15:22 PM US Eastern Standard Time, > > TheSydMonster@c... writes: > > > > > > > > > > I only have 1 albino BN pleco in my 37 gallon tank and I > actually feed > > > him in the morning. I do feed him in the same place, in front > of his > > > little cave entrance. If the wafer drifts he'll find it and > pull it > > > back in there. I have to say, though, that he LOVES zucchini. > I have > > > to put two pieces in because he will not share with the otos! I > only > > > feed him every other day. > > > > > > What kind of lettuce is recommended for them? Any other veggies > they > > > seem to love? > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13001	From: Heather Husvar	Date: 7/7/2005
Subject: Re: Retry: THANK YOU & pics of 75 gal.

Absolutely lovely! I have no idea if your other posts made it or not. I have moved my office three times this week and right now I'm in a temporary area. I catch what I can and keep going! You have really done a spectacular job! Thanks, Heather H. On 7/6/05, Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: > I am trying to send out an email but it's not coming through. The part > that gets me is that THIS one and the other test went through? Am I > losing it? Lost it maybe? Huh? And I've tried to send it TWICE now. > Grrrr. Maybe if I cut and paste it into this one. It's below, if it > goes through: > > The pictures are posted under Blood Parrots album. > > This is the tank I received for FREE, or confiscated rather, for all the > rescue fish. Everything was "gifted" to me, (including Eheim pro > canister filter, tons of food, medications, auto feeders, nets, gravel, > heaters, gravel filters/cleaners, giant buckets, spare powerheads-all > new, test kits of all kinds, ph powders, massive chemical pump and some > pump that you hang on the side with powder that clears up the tank & > more that I can't think of right now). I just purchased the plants on > my own. > This is also the tank you all have helped me so much with. NONE of > these fish would be alive if it weren't for those of you who are so > faithful to helping out. And you know who you are! > THANK YOU!!!!!! From myself and these fish! ;) (Please take a look at > them and see who you saved.) > Leslie > > PS > Out of 16 fish, 14 made it. One was left in the abandoned house (a > firemouth) and I didn't get to him in time. The other was a catfish > that died due to my not doing a water change that day. =( But they > would ALL be dead if it weren't for this ONE group helping me out with > every detail every day for about 14 days straight. You all got a gal > with NO fish experience to execute a completely workable tank virtually > overnight, and with great success! I literally added 55 gallons of > water (to an old dirty tank) and a ton of fish in the same day with > only 1 resulting death. Again, THANK YOU!!!!!! You people are > wonderful and these survival numbers prove it! > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > -- The rules of parents should be but three...Love, Limit, and Let them be. - Elaine M. Ward

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13002	From: Heather Husvar	Date: 7/7/2005
Subject: Re: OT East to West

I am not Ray, but allow me! *fist shake* Senseless fun! How dare you!! Out in public and everything! ;) Heather H. On 7/7/05, Aaron M. <anonymous122899@...> wrote: > Hi Ray, > > I was being sarcastic as is my typical sense of humor and could only assume that what you explained is exactly what happend and that the aussie was not meaning the sun sets in the north so 2 speak, thats what happens when I'm online past my bedtime - i lose proper sense of judgement and restraint. > No harm intended, just senseless fun on my part, I apologize for the confusion. > Aaron >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13003	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 7/7/2005
Subject: Re: feeding pleco's

They eat them AND play with them...they are actually a type of algae ball. I would suggest you get three of them for a good sized pleco, so they have time to regrow between nibbles > Do they eat the moss balls or just play with them? >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13004	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/7/2005
Subject: Re: feeding pleco's

I have one one the way in the mail...they look pretty cool. I bought one and if it works well, I will prolly get a few more. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of cynthia brennemann Sent: Thursday, July 07, 2005 1:35 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: feeding pleco's My plecos seem to adore my moss balls...They are so funny, the kind of roll them round and round the tank. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13005	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/7/2005
Subject: Re: feeding plecos

I put the broccoli in raw. After a few days it should start to sink. If it doesn't, I put the stems under a rock to get them to start munching. Once they are completely submerged they will stay there when all of the air gets out of the flowers. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of thesydmonster Sent: Thursday, July 07, 2005 9:05 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: feeding plecos Do you blanch or freeze the broccoli or potato first? --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Aaron" <anonymous122899@y...> wrote: > fruits & veggies: > Zucchini > Broccoli > Kale > Spinach > Lettuce > Potatoe > Peas(out of shell) > Tomatoes > Squash > Cucumber > > > > > other foods: > Cooked Rice > Boiled Egg Yolk > > edible live plants: > echinodorus rose > anubias nana > Riccia > Hornwort > duckweed > cabomba > Limnophylla > > from: > Fish Vegtables > nice treats > http://f3.grp.yahoofs.com/v1/0LbMQkoDGZCEUCorpp3QxVTOy3Zs16sUrGYWBjdm > CaDSzRFOJawrmy1AnHAGSnccQidvn9bFAPtmAzw1LN22/Fish%20Vegtables > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, FortWayneFish@a... wrote: > > any lettuce but Romaine.. I do believe > > I feed a lot of yellow "summer" squash > > cucumbers, fresh boiled green beans, peas, > > the list could be endless.. > > > > but i stick to cucumber, and squash myself.. > > easier on me... > > > > rob > > > > > > In a message dated 7/6/2005 1:15:22 PM US Eastern Standard Time, > > TheSydMonster@c... writes: > > > > > > > > > > I only have 1 albino BN pleco in my 37 gallon tank and I > actually feed > > > him in the morning. I do feed him in the same place, in front > of his > > > little cave entrance. If the wafer drifts he'll find it and > pull it > > > back in there. I have to say, though, that he LOVES zucchini. > I have > > > to put two pieces in because he will not share with the otos! I > only > > > feed him every other day. > > > > > > What kind of lettuce is recommended for them? Any other veggies > they > > > seem to love? > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13006	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/7/2005
Subject: Re: 75 Gal Tank Pics & THANK YOU!

everything looks great leslie! glad to know they're all doing so well in your care. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > Posted under Blood Parrots album. > > This is the tank I received for FREE, or confiscated rather, for all the > rescue fish. Everything was "gifted" to me, (including Eheim pro > canister filter, tons of food, medications, auto feeders, nets, gravel, > heaters, gravel filters/cleaners, giant buckets, spare powerheads-all > new, test kits of all kinds, ph powders, massive chemical pump and some > pump that you hang on the side with powder that clears up the tank & > more that I can't think of right now). I just purchased the plants on > my own. > This is also the tank you all have helped me so much with. NONE of > these fish would be alive if it weren't for those of you who are so > faithful to helping out. And you know who you are! > THANK YOU!!!!!! From myself and these fish! ;) (Please take a look at > them and see who you saved.) > Leslie > > PS > Out of 16 fish, 14 made it. One was left in the abandoned house (a > firemouth) and I didn't get to him in time. The other was a catfish > that died due to my not doing a water change that day. =( But they > would ALL be dead if it weren't for this ONE group helping me out with > every detail every day for about 14 days straight. I literally added 55 > gallons of water and a ton of fish in the same day with only 1 resulting > death. Again, THANK YOU!!!!!! You people are wonderful and these > numbers prove it! > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13007	From: joequality1980	Date: 7/7/2005
Subject: Re: 75 Gal Tank Pics & THANK YOU!

thats a wonderful looking tank and an incredible deal, congratulations! it's something I should strive for --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > Posted under Blood Parrots album. > > This is the tank I received for FREE, or confiscated rather, for all the > rescue fish. Everything was "gifted" to me, (including Eheim pro > canister filter, tons of food, medications, auto feeders, nets, gravel, > heaters, gravel filters/cleaners, giant buckets, spare powerheads-all

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13008	From: Nan	Date: 7/7/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

Catfight??? Everyone makes mistakes, let it go and move on....:) Nan Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@...> wrote: yup, just like titanic... Other than you, most people on here seem to have a LIFE and don´t have time to post bs all day long, so maybe you should write the president if he let´s everyone know not to call the lionfish firefish for whatever reason the voices in your head say so! --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms <wtfmorlok@y...> wrote: > my boat is not the one half sunk...it is the one with > a good compass, map and plenty of gas. > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > ilmao... whatever floats your boat ... > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > wrote: > > > applauds what? you are still wrong. even the guy > > with > > > 50 years in the hobby says he never heard of it > > called > > > a lionfish. just because he has the time to go to > > 20 > > > web searches to find others calling them the wrong > > > thing does not mean a damn thing. i did not > > google or > > > go to anything of teh wall. go to > > saltwaterfish.com > > > and there will be a section of firefish.. lions > > and > > > scorpions will not be there. flat out, make sure > > you > > > are talking about the same thing as everyone else > > when > > > you decide to tell a beginner that one of the few > > fish > > > that will actually work in the tank they have is > > > venemous and deadly, especially when several > > others > > > are recommending it. > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > *applauds* > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve > > Szabo" > > > > <steve@l...> wrote: > > > > > You had said, "i did look it up and when you > > type > > > > in firefish in > > > > the web > > > > > browser nothing comes up about lionfish." > > > > apparently in reply to > > > > Sandra's, > > > > > "you can also look it up, anywhere you look > > for a > > > > firefish there > > > > will show > > > > > up two species - the dartfish, and the > > lionfish > > > > which some people > > > > call > > > > > firefishes.". I took that to mean you did a > > search > > > > and did not > > > > find any > > > > > references to lionfish in your results. So, I > > > > googled firefish, > > > > i.e. a web > > > > > search, and easily found a reference to > > lionfish > > > > in the first ten > > > > responses. > > > > > I also felt I would be remiss if I did not > > report > > > > the results of > > > > the > > > > > returned first ten results. > > > > > > > > > > I don't know what you used to search the web, > > but, > > > > it appears, > > > > that it is > > > > > not difficult to find references to lionfish. > > Just > > > > for ha-has, I > > > > just did > > > > > another search using the search engine Scirus > > > > (http://www.scirus.com) and > > > > > the first 10 results have three direct > > references > > > > to lion fish > > > > (one _Pterois > > > > > miles_ and two _P. volitans_) and one > > > > _Nemateleotris decora_ which > > > > is not a > > > > > lionfish but, I believe, a goby. Two entries > > did > > > > not distinguish > > > > the species > > > > > in the description, but one was not a > > lionfish, > > > > the other was. The > > > > other > > > > > five entries were of something else entirely, > > not > > > > fish. > > > > > > > > > > In another part of my reply, about languages, > > was > > > > in reply to what > > > > Sandra > > > > > had said. However, using foreign languages in > > my > > > > original post on > > > > the topic > > > > > was merely to reinforce the point I was > > making, > > > > since I was able to > > > > > translate some of the languages, and others > > here > > > > may be able to > > > > translate > > > > > others. The point there was that using common > > > > names to describe > > > > fish is > > > > > hopelessly confusing, for the most part, and > > > > probably not the > > > > means that > > > > > should be used to describe fish, unless there > > is a > > > > single source > > > > used for > > > > > the common names. For a handy reference on the > > > > Internet that > > > > everyone could > > > > > freely access, I'd suggest looking at > > > > http://www.fishbase.org, > > > > because they > > > > > list an accepted common name for each species > > they > > > > cover. While it > > > > may not > > > > > be the fastest site on the web, it certainly > > > > covers the > > > > information we are > > > > > discussing here. > > > > > > > > > > \\Steve// > > > > > > > > > > P.S. While experience does count, a certain > > > > minimal effort put > > > > forth in > > > > > researching a topic beyond personal experience > > is > > > > normally > > > > warranted in a > > > > > discussion such as this. I can claim a lot of > > > > experience here > > > > also. I can > > > > > also say that I do not recall a time when I > > have > > > > heard anyone > > > > refer to a > > > > > lionfish as a firefish, and certainly could > > have > > > > said so prior to > > > > this. > > > > > However, a few quick searches have shown me > > how > > > > far off base I > > > > would have > > > > > been having said so. Helfrichs' dartfish, > > which > > > > you seem to refer > > > > to in your > > > > > post, is not found on any of my searches on > > > > firefish, and while > > > > you could > > > > > claim you did not mention it as a firefish, it > > > > certainly seems to > > > > be > > > > > inferred in your post. scs > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > > > Behalf Of paul helms > > > > > Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2005 2:12 PM > > > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: setting up a > > new > > > > salt water aquarium > > > > > > > > > > and? > > > > > > > > > > --- Steve Szabo <steve@l...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > I googled firefish, and 6th entry shows > > firefish > > > > as > > > > > > _Pterois volitans_. The > > > > > > site listed is an Australian site. Out of > > the > > > > first > > > > > > 10 hits, One reference > > > > > > to lionfish, and 3 to _Nemateleotris_ spp. I > > > > left > > > > > > out the Chinese, Japanese, > > > > > > and Korean scripts given as common names, as > > > === message truncated === > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > Yahoo! Sports > Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football > http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Mail Stay connected, organized, and protected. 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13009	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/7/2005
Subject: Re: Ok, your going to think I'm crazy!?!?

I had a fancy guppy once, it played around in my tank for about 2 weeks before one of the other guppies got pregnant, any ways the pregnant guppy turned on the fancy guppy and as a result a couple of shreds of tail fin went missing from the fancy guppy. Any ways it survived and was just demoralised, a couple of days latter it started hiding lots, then wouldn't go to the surface to feed and eventually stopped breathing. Other than the one missing piece of tail fin, the guppy was in good but demoralised condition. My thoughts, which could apply to your fish, is they can die of a broken heart or even bullying. If your spot wasn't contagious and there was no other visible problems then maybe the fish was sick or sad and just died like my fancy guppy. =Nick yarncrazymom wrote: >I just lost a female mickey mouse platty just like this...she lost >some of her color went to a dull yellow, she had a black spot just >on her head about right in front of her fin. Hers never went >anywhere though, once it appeared, it stayed there and a few days >later she died. My water is fine I test it every day because my tank >is overcrowded right now. I used Melafix just to see if it would >help but I lost her anyway, she laid on the bottom of the tank all >night and died in the morning... but she lost her color several days >before I lost her :O( I have no clue what it was...I assummed it >was old age...the black spots are on nothing else in my tank. > >Let me know if you find any information on it.. If it leaves and >comes back I wonder then if you dont have an unwanted critter/fish >bug of some sort in your tank...could be hopping on for a ride and a >meal and hopping off again??? I dunno.....I hope that you dont lose >yours thought... > >Rho >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Snailtrails/ > > > > > >>We have a female molly, she was orange. Over the last 3weeks she >> >> >has > > >>started to loss her color. Also her and 3 other fish in the tank >> >> >have > > >>developed black spots. Not like big spots, spots about the size >> >> >of ich > > >>spots. They look like spots of dirt granulates. We took the >> >> >effected > > >>fish out and put them in a tank of their own. We have medicated >> >> >for > > >>parisites and fungas with no results. A local fish store owner >>suggested copper coat. We tried it and at first thought it might >> >> >be > > >>working. Now here is the part you wont believe. Go in look at >> >> >molly > > >>she has spots on her 10min. later the spots are gone, go back in >> >> >hour > > >>later spots are back. One swordtail looks cleared up but molly >> >> >and > > >>guarami look like the stuff leaves and comes back. Anyone have >> >> >any > > >>idea what we may be dealing with and what to do for it? Tested >> >> >water > > >>and amonia is fine ph is a little high. There is no gravel plants >> >> >or > > >>other wise in the tank with sick fish. >>Thanks >> >> > > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >AquaticLife Management. > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13010	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 7/7/2005
Subject: The San Diego Tropical Fish Society , 7/10/2005, 7:00 pm

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife The San Diego Tropical Fish Society Sunday July 10, 2005 7:00 pm - 8:00 pm This event repeats on the second Sunday of every month. Event Location: room 101, Casa Del Prado, Balboa Park at 7:00 PM Street: SAN DIEGO TROPICAL FISH SOCIETY, PO Box 4156, North Park Station City, State, Zip: San Diego, CA 92164 Phone: 619-281-FISH Notes: http://www.geocities.com/sandiegofishfan/ You are cordially invited to attend our next meeting in room 101, Casa Del Prado, Balboa Park at 7:00 PM on the second Sunday of the month. Visitors are always welcome! 619-281-FISH Yahoo! Greetings Send a Yahoo! Greeting. Birthday Reminders Set up birthday reminders! ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13011	From: paul helms	Date: 7/7/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

interesting how someppl show up act like an ass and leave huh? --- Nan <ntalb00@...> wrote: > Catfight??? > > Everyone makes mistakes, let it go and move on....:) > > Nan > > Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@...> wrote: > yup, just like titanic... > > Other than you, most people on here seem to have a > LIFE and don´t > have time to post bs all day long, so maybe you > should write the > president if he let´s everyone know not to call the > lionfish > firefish for whatever reason the voices in your head > say so! > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > <wtfmorlok@y...> > wrote: > > my boat is not the one half sunk...it is the one > with > > a good compass, map and plenty of gas. > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > ilmao... whatever floats your boat ... > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > wrote: > > > > applauds what? you are still wrong. even the > guy > > > with > > > > 50 years in the hobby says he never heard of > it > > > called > > > > a lionfish. just because he has the time to > go to > > > 20 > > > > web searches to find others calling them the > wrong > > > > thing does not mean a damn thing. i did not > > > google or > > > > go to anything of teh wall. go to > > > saltwaterfish.com > > > > and there will be a section of firefish.. > lions > > > and > > > > scorpions will not be there. flat out, make > sure > > > you > > > > are talking about the same thing as everyone > else > > > when > > > > you decide to tell a beginner that one of the > few > > > fish > > > > that will actually work in the tank they have > is > > > > venemous and deadly, especially when several > > > others > > > > are recommending it. > > > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > *applauds* > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve > > > Szabo" > > > > > <steve@l...> wrote: > > > > > > You had said, "i did look it up and when > you > > > type > > > > > in firefish in > > > > > the web > > > > > > browser nothing comes up about lionfish." > > > > > apparently in reply to > > > > > Sandra's, > > > > > > "you can also look it up, anywhere you > look > > > for a > > > > > firefish there > > > > > will show > > > > > > up two species - the dartfish, and the > > > lionfish > > > > > which some people > > > > > call > > > > > > firefishes.". I took that to mean you did > a > > > search > > > > > and did not > > > > > find any > > > > > > references to lionfish in your results. > So, I > > > > > googled firefish, > > > > > i.e. a web > > > > > > search, and easily found a reference to > > > lionfish > > > > > in the first ten > > > > > responses. > > > > > > I also felt I would be remiss if I did not > > > report > > > > > the results of > > > > > the > > > > > > returned first ten results. > > > > > > > > > > > > I don't know what you used to search the > web, > > > but, > > > > > it appears, > > > > > that it is > > > > > > not difficult to find references to > lionfish. > > > Just > > > > > for ha-has, I > > > > > just did > > > > > > another search using the search engine > Scirus > > > > > (http://www.scirus.com) and > > > > > > the first 10 results have three direct > > > references > > > > > to lion fish > > > > > (one _Pterois > > > > > > miles_ and two _P. volitans_) and one > > > > > _Nemateleotris decora_ which > > > > > is not a > > > > > > lionfish but, I believe, a goby. Two > entries > > > did > > > > > not distinguish > > > > > the species > > > > > > in the description, but one was not a > > > lionfish, > > > > > the other was. The > > > > > other > > > > > > five entries were of something else > entirely, > > > not > > > > > fish. > > > > > > > > > > > > In another part of my reply, about > languages, > > > was > > > > > in reply to what > > > > > Sandra > > > > > > had said. However, using foreign languages > in > > > my > > > > > original post on > > > > > the topic > > > > > > was merely to reinforce the point I was > > > making, > > > > > since I was able to > > > > > > translate some of the languages, and > others > > > here > > > > > may be able to > > > > > translate > > > > > > others. The point there was that using > common > > > > > names to describe > > > > > fish is > > > > > > hopelessly confusing, for the most part, > and > > > > > probably not the > > > > > means that > > > > > > should be used to describe fish, unless > there > > > is a > > > > > single source > > > > > used for > > > > > > the common names. For a handy reference on > the > > > > > Internet that > > > > > everyone could > > > > > > freely access, I'd suggest looking at > > > > > http://www.fishbase.org, > > > > > because they > > > > > > list an accepted common name for each > species > > > they > > > > > cover. While it > > > > > may not > > > > > > be the fastest site on the web, it > certainly > > > > > covers the > > > > > information we are > > > > > > discussing here. > > > > > > > > > > > > \\Steve// > > > > > > > > > > > > P.S. While experience does count, a > certain > > > > > minimal effort put > > > > > forth in > > > > > > researching a topic beyond personal > experience > === message truncated === __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13012	From: Sandra	Date: 7/7/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

Very interesting! You say it but dont know it... Several people told me that you have been acting like one for quiet some time already :) --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms <wtfmorlok@y...> wrote: > interesting how someppl show up act like an ass and > leave huh? > > > --- Nan <ntalb00@y...> wrote: > > > Catfight??? > > > > Everyone makes mistakes, let it go and move on....:) > > > > Nan > > > > Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > yup, just like titanic... > > > > Other than you, most people on here seem to have a > > LIFE and don´t > > have time to post bs all day long, so maybe you > > should write the > > president if he let´s everyone know not to call the > > lionfish > > firefish for whatever reason the voices in your head > > say so! > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > wrote: > > > my boat is not the one half sunk...it is the one > > with > > > a good compass, map and plenty of gas. > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > ilmao... whatever floats your boat ... > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > > wrote: > > > > > applauds what? you are still wrong. even the > > guy > > > > with > > > > > 50 years in the hobby says he never heard of > > it > > > > called > > > > > a lionfish. just because he has the time to > > go to > > > > 20 > > > > > web searches to find others calling them the > > wrong > > > > > thing does not mean a damn thing. i did not > > > > google or > > > > > go to anything of teh wall. go to > > > > saltwaterfish.com > > > > > and there will be a section of firefish.. > > lions > > > > and > > > > > scorpions will not be there. flat out, make > > sure > > > > you > > > > > are talking about the same thing as everyone > > else > > > > when > > > > > you decide to tell a beginner that one of the > > few > > > > fish > > > > > that will actually work in the tank they have > > is > > > > > venemous and deadly, especially when several > > > > others > > > > > are recommending it. > > > > > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > *applauds* > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve > > > > Szabo" > > > > > > <steve@l...> wrote: > > > > > > > You had said, "i did look it up and when > > you > > > > type > > > > > > in firefish in > > > > > > the web > > > > > > > browser nothing comes up about lionfish." > > > > > > apparently in reply to > > > > > > Sandra's, > > > > > > > "you can also look it up, anywhere you > > look > > > > for a > > > > > > firefish there > > > > > > will show > > > > > > > up two species - the dartfish, and the > > > > lionfish > > > > > > which some people > > > > > > call > > > > > > > firefishes.". I took that to mean you did > > a > > > > search > > > > > > and did not > > > > > > find any > > > > > > > references to lionfish in your results. > > So, I > > > > > > googled firefish, > > > > > > i.e. a web > > > > > > > search, and easily found a reference to > > > > lionfish > > > > > > in the first ten > > > > > > responses. > > > > > > > I also felt I would be remiss if I did not > > > > report > > > > > > the results of > > > > > > the > > > > > > > returned first ten results. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I don't know what you used to search the > > web, > > > > but, > > > > > > it appears, > > > > > > that it is > > > > > > > not difficult to find references to > > lionfish. > > > > Just > > > > > > for ha-has, I > > > > > > just did > > > > > > > another search using the search engine > > Scirus > > > > > > (http://www.scirus.com) and > > > > > > > the first 10 results have three direct > > > > references > > > > > > to lion fish > > > > > > (one _Pterois > > > > > > > miles_ and two _P. volitans_) and one > > > > > > _Nemateleotris decora_ which > > > > > > is not a > > > > > > > lionfish but, I believe, a goby. Two > > entries > > > > did > > > > > > not distinguish > > > > > > the species > > > > > > > in the description, but one was not a > > > > lionfish, > > > > > > the other was. The > > > > > > other > > > > > > > five entries were of something else > > entirely, > > > > not > > > > > > fish. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In another part of my reply, about > > languages, > > > > was > > > > > > in reply to what > > > > > > Sandra > > > > > > > had said. However, using foreign languages > > in > > > > my > > > > > > original post on > > > > > > the topic > > > > > > > was merely to reinforce the point I was > > > > making, > > > > > > since I was able to > > > > > > > translate some of the languages, and > > others > > > > here > > > > > > may be able to > > > > > > translate > > > > > > > others. The point there was that using > > common > > > > > > names to describe > > > > > > fish is > > > > > > > hopelessly confusing, for the most part, > > and > > > > > > probably not the > > > > > > means that > > > > > > > should be used to describe fish, unless > > there > > > > is a > > > > > > single source > > > > > > used for > > > > > > > the common names. For a handy reference on > > the > > > > > > Internet that > > > > > > everyone could > > > > > > > freely access, I'd suggest looking at > > > > > > http://www.fishbase.org, > > > > > > because they > > > > > > > list an accepted common name for each > > species > > > > they > > > > > > cover. While it > > > > > > may not > > > > > > > be the fastest site on the web, it > > certainly > > > > > > covers the > > > > > > information we are > > > > > > > discussing here. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > \\Steve// > > > > > > > > > > > > > > P.S. While experience does count, a > > certain > > > > > > minimal effort put > > > > > > forth in > > > > > > > researching a topic beyond personal > > experience > > > === message truncated === > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13013	From: paul helms	Date: 7/7/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

no one was talking to you .....and if i am such an ass why have i had so many thank yous?...anyway that is rhetorical. don't care what you have to say anyway. peace out --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@...> wrote: > Very interesting! You say it but dont know it... > > Several people told me that you have been acting > like one for quiet > some time already :) > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > <wtfmorlok@y...> > wrote: > > interesting how someppl show up act like an ass > and > > leave huh? > > > > > > --- Nan <ntalb00@y...> wrote: > > > > > Catfight??? > > > > > > Everyone makes mistakes, let it go and move > on....:) > > > > > > Nan > > > > > > Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > yup, just like titanic... > > > > > > Other than you, most people on here seem to have > a > > > LIFE and don´t > > > have time to post bs all day long, so maybe you > > > should write the > > > president if he let´s everyone know not to call > the > > > lionfish > > > firefish for whatever reason the voices in your > head > > > say so! > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > wrote: > > > > my boat is not the one half sunk...it is the > one > > > with > > > > a good compass, map and plenty of gas. > > > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > ilmao... whatever floats your boat ... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul > helms > > > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > applauds what? you are still wrong. even > the > > > guy > > > > > with > > > > > > 50 years in the hobby says he never heard > of > > > it > > > > > called > > > > > > a lionfish. just because he has the time > to > > > go to > > > > > 20 > > > > > > web searches to find others calling them > the > > > wrong > > > > > > thing does not mean a damn thing. i did > not > > > > > google or > > > > > > go to anything of teh wall. go to > > > > > saltwaterfish.com > > > > > > and there will be a section of firefish.. > > > lions > > > > > and > > > > > > scorpions will not be there. flat out, > make > > > sure > > > > > you > > > > > > are talking about the same thing as > everyone > > > else > > > > > when > > > > > > you decide to tell a beginner that one of > the > > > few > > > > > fish > > > > > > that will actually work in the tank they > have > > > is > > > > > > venemous and deadly, especially when > several > > > > > others > > > > > > are recommending it. > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > *applauds* > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, > "Steve > > > > > Szabo" > > > > > > > <steve@l...> wrote: > > > > > > > > You had said, "i did look it up and > when > > > you > > > > > type > > > > > > > in firefish in > > > > > > > the web > > > > > > > > browser nothing comes up about > lionfish." > > > > > > > apparently in reply to > > > > > > > Sandra's, > > > > > > > > "you can also look it up, anywhere you > > > look > > > > > for a > > > > > > > firefish there > > > > > > > will show > > > > > > > > up two species - the dartfish, and the > > > > > lionfish > > > > > > > which some people > > > > > > > call > > > > > > > > firefishes.". I took that to mean you > did > > > a > > > > > search > > > > > > > and did not > > > > > > > find any > > > > > > > > references to lionfish in your > results. > > > So, I > > > > > > > googled firefish, > > > > > > > i.e. a web > > > > > > > > search, and easily found a reference > to > > > > > lionfish > > > > > > > in the first ten > > > > > > > responses. > > > > > > > > I also felt I would be remiss if I did > not > > > > > report > > > > > > > the results of > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > returned first ten results. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I don't know what you used to search > the > > > web, > > > > > but, > > > > > > > it appears, > > > > > > > that it is > > > > > > > > not difficult to find references to > > > lionfish. > > > > > Just > > > > > > > for ha-has, I > > > > > > > just did > > > > > > > > another search using the search engine > > > Scirus > > > > > > > (http://www.scirus.com) and > > > > > > > > the first 10 results have three direct > > > > > references > > > > > > > to lion fish > > > > > > > (one _Pterois > > > > > > > > miles_ and two _P. volitans_) and one > > > > > > > _Nemateleotris decora_ which > > > > > > > is not a > > > > > > > > lionfish but, I believe, a goby. Two > > > entries > > > > > did > > > > > > > not distinguish > > > > > > > the species > > > > > > > > in the description, but one was not a > > > > > lionfish, > > > > > > > the other was. The > > > > > > > other > > > > > > > > five entries were of something else > > > entirely, > > > > > not > > > > > > > fish. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In another part of my reply, about > > > languages, > > > > > was > > > > > > > in reply to what > > > > > > > Sandra > > > > > > > > had said. However, using foreign > languages > > > in > > > > > my > > > > > > > original post on > > > > > > > the topic > > > > > > > > was merely to reinforce the point I > was > > > > > making, > === message truncated === __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Helps protect you from nasty viruses. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13014	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 7/7/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

Paul, If you keep this up you will end up being put on moderated posts or banned altogether!! regards, unclenorm. --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > no one was talking to you > .....and if i am such an ass why have i had so many > thank yous?...anyway that is rhetorical. don't care > what you have to say anyway. peace out > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@...> wrote: > > > Very interesting! You say it but dont know it... > > > > Several people told me that you have been acting > > like one for quiet > > some time already :) > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > wrote: > > > interesting how someppl show up act like an ass > > and > > > leave huh? > > > > > > > > > --- Nan <ntalb00@y...> wrote: > > > > > > > Catfight??? > > > > > > > > Everyone makes mistakes, let it go and move > > on....:) > > > > > > > > Nan > > > > > > > > Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > yup, just like titanic... > > > > > > > > Other than you, most people on here seem to > have > > a > > > > LIFE and don´t > > > > have time to post bs all day long, so maybe > you > > > > should write the > > > > president if he let´s everyone know not to > call > > the > > > > lionfish > > > > firefish for whatever reason the voices in > your > > head > > > > say so! > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > > wrote: > > > > > my boat is not the one half sunk...it is the > > one > > > > with > > > > > a good compass, map and plenty of gas. > > > > > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > ilmao... whatever floats your boat ... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul > > helms > > > > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > applauds what? you are still wrong. > even > > the > > > > guy > > > > > > with > > > > > > > 50 years in the hobby says he never > heard > > of > > > > it > > > > > > called > > > > > > > a lionfish. just because he has the > time > > to > > > > go to > > > > > > 20 > > > > > > > web searches to find others calling them > > the > > > > wrong > > > > > > > thing does not mean a damn thing. i did > > not > > > > > > google or > > > > > > > go to anything of teh wall. go to > > > > > > saltwaterfish.com > > > > > > > and there will be a section of > firefish.. > > > > lions > > > > > > and > > > > > > > scorpions will not be there. flat out, > > make > > > > sure > > > > > > you > > > > > > > are talking about the same thing as > > everyone > > > > else > > > > > > when > > > > > > > you decide to tell a beginner that one > of > > the > > > > few > > > > > > fish > > > > > > > that will actually work in the tank they > > have > > > > is > > > > > > > venemous and deadly, especially when > > several > > > > > > others > > > > > > > are recommending it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > *applauds* > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, > > "Steve > > > > > > Szabo" > > > > > > > > <steve@l...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > You had said, "i did look it up and > > when > > > > you > > > > > > type > > > > > > > > in firefish in > > > > > > > > the web > > > > > > > > > browser nothing comes up about > > lionfish." > > > > > > > > apparently in reply to > > > > > > > > Sandra's, > > > > > > > > > "you can also look it up, anywhere > you > > > > look > > > > > > for a > > > > > > > > firefish there > > > > > > > > will show > > > > > > > > > up two species - the dartfish, and > the > > > > > > lionfish > > > > > > > > which some people > > > > > > > > call > > > > > > > > > firefishes.". I took that to mean > you > > did > > > > a > > > > > > search > > > > > > > > and did not > > > > > > > > find any > > > > > > > > > references to lionfish in your > > results. > > > > So, I > > > > > > > > googled firefish, > > > > > > > > i.e. a web > > > > > > > > > search, and easily found a reference > > to > > > > > > lionfish > > > > > > > > in the first ten > > > > > > > > responses. > > > > > > > > > I also felt I would be remiss if I > did > > not > > > > > > report > > > > > > > > the results of > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > returned first ten results. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I don't know what you used to search > > the > > > > web, > > > > > > but, > > > > > > > > it appears, > > > > > > > > that it is > > > > > > > > > not difficult to find references to > > > > lionfish. > > > > > > Just > > > > > > > > for ha-has, I > > > > > > > > just did > > > > > > > > > another search using the search > engine > > > > Scirus > > > > > > > > (http://www.scirus.com) and > > > > > > > > > the first 10 results have three > direct > > > > > > references > > > > > > > > to lion fish > > > > > > > > (one _Pterois > > > > > > > > > miles_ and two _P. volitans_) and > one > > > > > > > > _Nemateleotris decora_ which > > > > > > > > is not a > > > > > > > > > lionfish but, I believe, a goby. Two > > > > entries > > > > > > did > > > > > > > > not distinguish > > > > > > > > the species > > > > > > > > > in the description, but one was not > a > > > > > > lionfish, > > > > > > > > the other was. The > > > > > > > > other > > > > > > > > > five entries were of something else > > > > entirely, > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > fish. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In another part of my reply, about > > > > languages, > > > > > > was > > > > > > > > in reply to what > > > > > > > > Sandra > > > > > > > > > had said. However, using foreign > > languages > > > > in > > > > > > my > > > > > > > > original post on > > > > > > > > the topic > > > > > > > > > was merely to reinforce the point I > > was > > > > > > making, > > > === message truncated === > > > > > __________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Mail - Helps protect you from nasty viruses. > http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail > ___________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13015	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: set up questions and help with pH, please

My Eheim 2028 canister filter and heaters finally came Thursday. I ordered them online from BigAlsonline last Wednesday night. The 150 tank has not had a heater in it since I set it up last week. The temperature has been constant at @75 degrees. As I said in an earlier post, our room temperature is set at 73 degrees. Do you think it is necessary to use both 300 watt heaters? Maybe I could save some money and send one back? Our house temperature may drop down to 71-72 degrees this winter, depending on how warm our house is and how our heating bills look. The Eheim 2028 is so kool!! It was so easy to set up and install and it runs so quiet. I spent the majority of yesterday evening taking everything out of my tank and putting it back in. When I was buying my gravel (a few months ago) I saw this little 5 pound bag of "pond pebbles" at PetsMart. I thought they would add a natural look to my substrate. I could swear that the bag said they were granite. NOT. I finally figured it out that these 150+ pebbles were buffering my water. While I was reading and assembling my new filter yesterday, my 14 year old daughter was testing both my tanks. The 10 gallon has a pH of 7.5, the ammonia is zero as well as the nitrites. The 150 tank had a pH of 8.5, ammonia zero and the nitrites are just starting to spike. So we took all the plants and wood out. Then we pulled all the big ornamental rocks out. Most of the bigger rocks we went rock picking for and my new house that we moved into has an AWESOME rock garden in the back yard. I know a bit about rocks and thought I had picked safe rocks for displaying in the tank. We spent a good 45 minutes sifting through the gravel weeding out all these little pond pebbles. Since I put laterite in my substrate, the water got so cloudy! I was so pissed off I coulda spit.!! After that we went over to my daughters science teachers house. She took us over to school and helped us test a bunch of rocks in her lab using a nail and some hydrochloric acid. Anything with calcium carbonate, limestone or gypsum (?) in it bubbles when tested with the acid. All the rocks that I picked out of my yard were fine. It was the majority of the little pond pebbles that I got from PetsMart that was buffering my water. I didn't get everything back in the tank and settled down until close to midnigt. MY QUESTION: How much of a water change do I need to do to slowly bring my pH back down to what the original tap water is (7.3). Will a 1/4 be too much? We siphoned off a 3 gallon buck last night to hold the live plants while we were sifting for pond pebbles. I ended up adding fresh water back in cause I later used that water to clean the filter cartridges in my Emperor 400 filter. I have not had chance to retest the water. I just wanted to get a quick opinion before I have to go off to work this morning (I work at the Home Depot from 6am to3pm) I will check back with y'all later today. thanks in advance, Linda River Falls, WI 150 freshwater tank [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13016	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: pH is 8

I had time to do a pH test and it is down to 8. Should I do another water change after work or would that be too soon? I can only lower the pH by a value of .2 at a time right? How often can I do that? I gotta run off to work or I am gonna be late! Linda River Falls, WI 150 gallon freshwater [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13017	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: set up questions and help with pH, please

Linda, Keep both heaters. The cost of the electricity will not be noticeably different, and the two heaters will provide better temperature control throughout the tank. Now that you have removed the offensive material from the tank, let the regular water changes and the biological processes take care of the pH. It will settle back down soon enough, and the fish and plants will have time to acclimate to the lower levels without much stress. (I think you said earlier you had some fish in the tank.) \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Friday, July 08, 2005 6:10 AM To: mnaquarium@yahoogroups.com; AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] set up questions and help with pH, please My Eheim 2028 canister filter and heaters finally came Thursday. I ordered them online from BigAlsonline last Wednesday night. The 150 tank has not had a heater in it since I set it up last week. The temperature has been constant at @75 degrees. As I said in an earlier post, our room temperature is set at 73 degrees. Do you think it is necessary to use both 300 watt heaters? Maybe I could save some money and send one back? Our house temperature may drop down to 71-72 degrees this winter, depending on how warm our house is and how our heating bills look. The Eheim 2028 is so kool!! It was so easy to set up and install and it runs so quiet. I spent the majority of yesterday evening taking everything out of my tank and putting it back in. When I was buying my gravel (a few months ago) I saw this little 5 pound bag of "pond pebbles" at PetsMart. I thought they would add a natural look to my substrate. I could swear that the bag said they were granite. NOT. I finally figured it out that these 150+ pebbles were buffering my water. While I was reading and assembling my new filter yesterday, my 14 year old daughter was testing both my tanks. The 10 gallon has a pH of 7.5, the ammonia is zero as well as the nitrites. The 150 tank had a pH of 8.5, ammonia zero and the nitrites are just starting to spike. So we took all the plants and wood out. Then we pulled all the big ornamental rocks out. Most of the bigger rocks we went rock picking for and my new house that we moved into has an AWESOME rock garden in the back yard. I know a bit about rocks and thought I had picked safe rocks for displaying in the tank. We spent a good 45 minutes sifting through the gravel weeding out all these little pond pebbles. Since I put laterite in my substrate, the water got so cloudy! I was so pissed off I coulda spit.!! After that we went over to my daughters science teachers house. She took us over to school and helped us test a bunch of rocks in her lab using a nail and some hydrochloric acid. Anything with calcium carbonate, limestone or gypsum (?) in it bubbles when tested with the acid. All the rocks that I picked out of my yard were fine. It was the majority of the little pond pebbles that I got from PetsMart that was buffering my water. I didn't get everything back in the tank and settled down until close to midnigt. MY QUESTION: How much of a water change do I need to do to slowly bring my pH back down to what the original tap water is (7.3). Will a 1/4 be too much? We siphoned off a 3 gallon buck last night to hold the live plants while we were sifting for pond pebbles. I ended up adding fresh water back in cause I later used that water to clean the filter cartridges in my Emperor 400 filter. I have not had chance to retest the water. I just wanted to get a quick opinion before I have to go off to work this morning (I work at the Home Depot from 6am to3pm) I will check back with y'all later today. thanks in advance, Linda River Falls, WI 150 freshwater tank

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13018	From: Evita	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

I haven't been in this line of posts but it kinda reminds me of my kids.....they all have to get in the last word. We wonder how and why awful things happen in the world and how people can get so mad ..... then people fight over stuff like this. Go figure? This is getting more back and forth hits than someone asking for help about a sick and dying fish. The adult thing would to everyone to say sorry and forgive and stop the name calling and get back on the topic of helping each other and our love for the hobby. I thought having aquariums was calming. Let's just take a minute and go look at ours. Now I will say sorry if I offended anyone. But ....Evita paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: no one was talking to you .....and if i am such an ass why have i had so many thank yous?...anyway that is rhetorical. don't care what you have to say anyway. peace out --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@...> wrote: > Very interesting! You say it but dont know it... > > Several people told me that you have been acting > like one for quiet > some time already :) > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > <wtfmorlok@y...> > wrote: > > interesting how someppl show up act like an ass > and > > leave huh? > > > > > > --- Nan <ntalb00@y...> wrote: > > > > > Catfight??? > > > > > > Everyone makes mistakes, let it go and move > on....:) > > > > > > Nan > > > > > > Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > yup, just like titanic... > > > > > > Other than you, most people on here seem to have > a > > > LIFE and don´t > > > have time to post bs all day long, so maybe you > > > should write the > > > president if he let´s everyone know not to call > the > > > lionfish > > > firefish for whatever reason the voices in your > head > > > say so! > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > wrote: > > > > my boat is not the one half sunk...it is the > one > > > with > > > > a good compass, map and plenty of gas. > > > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > ilmao... whatever floats your boat ... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul > helms > > > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > applauds what? you are still wrong. even > the > > > guy > > > > > with > > > > > > 50 years in the hobby says he never heard > of > > > it > > > > > called > > > > > > a lionfish. just because he has the time > to > > > go to > > > > > 20 > > > > > > web searches to find others calling them > the > > > wrong > > > > > > thing does not mean a damn thing. i did > not > > > > > google or > > > > > > go to anything of teh wall. go to > > > > > saltwaterfish.com > > > > > > and there will be a section of firefish.. > > > lions > > > > > and > > > > > > scorpions will not be there. flat out, > make > > > sure > > > > > you > > > > > > are talking about the same thing as > everyone > > > else > > > > > when > > > > > > you decide to tell a beginner that one of > the > > > few > > > > > fish > > > > > > that will actually work in the tank they > have > > > is > > > > > > venemous and deadly, especially when > several > > > > > others > > > > > > are recommending it. > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > *applauds* > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, > "Steve > > > > > Szabo" > > > > > > > <steve@l...> wrote: > > > > > > > > You had said, "i did look it up and > when > > > you > > > > > type > > > > > > > in firefish in > > > > > > > the web > > > > > > > > browser nothing comes up about > lionfish." > > > > > > > apparently in reply to > > > > > > > Sandra's, > > > > > > > > "you can also look it up, anywhere you > > > look > > > > > for a > > > > > > > firefish there > > > > > > > will show > > > > > > > > up two species - the dartfish, and the > > > > > lionfish > > > > > > > which some people > > > > > > > call > > > > > > > > firefishes.". I took that to mean you > did > > > a > > > > > search > > > > > > > and did not > > > > > > > find any > > > > > > > > references to lionfish in your > results. > > > So, I > > > > > > > googled firefish, > > > > > > > i.e. a web > > > > > > > > search, and easily found a reference > to > > > > > lionfish > > > > > > > in the first ten > > > > > > > responses. > > > > > > > > I also felt I would be remiss if I did > not > > > > > report > > > > > > > the results of > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > returned first ten results. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I don't know what you used to search > the > > > web, > > > > > but, > > > > > > > it appears, > > > > > > > that it is > > > > > > > > not difficult to find references to > > > lionfish. > > > > > Just > > > > > > > for ha-has, I > > > > > > > just did > > > > > > > > another search using the search engine > > > Scirus > > > > > > > (http://www.scirus.com) and > > > > > > > > the first 10 results have three direct > > > > > references > > > > > > > to lion fish > > > > > > > (one _Pterois > > > > > > > > miles_ and two _P. volitans_) and one > > > > > > > _Nemateleotris decora_ which > > > > > > > is not a > > > > > > > > lionfish but, I believe, a goby. Two > > > entries > > > > > did > > > > > > > not distinguish > > > > > > > the species > > > > > > > > in the description, but one was not a > > > > > lionfish, > > > > > > > the other was. The > > > > > > > other > > > > > > > > five entries were of something else > > > entirely, > > > > > not > > > > > > > fish. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In another part of my reply, about > > > languages, > > > > > was > > > > > > > in reply to what > > > > > > > Sandra > > > > > > > > had said. However, using foreign > languages > > > in > > > > > my > > > > > > > original post on > > > > > > > the topic > > > > > > > > was merely to reinforce the point I > was > > > > > making, > === message truncated === __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Helps protect you from nasty viruses. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Saltwater aquarium Marine biologist Reef tank --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Sell on Yahoo! Auctions - No fees. Bid on great items. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13019	From: Evita	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: set up questions and help with pH, please

Great post Steve. I am learning so much from reading all your posts. I really enjoy them all. I wanted to tell you my two remaining platys adults are doing well. I am now trying to slowly raise the temp. back up. Is 76 about right. I am nervous though that when I do the ick might come back. Also......Heh, funny thing. My one baby fry platy that managed to run from my net when I caught the others and moved them to the nursery tank......Well he managed to servive and he is growing faster and bigger than all the others. I wonder if it has to do with the salt treatment for ick in my adult tank. I raised the temp. in both tanks, so the only thing different is the adding of the salt. His color is also deeper. He now is so big he comes out and swims next to the adult fish. It is like he knows he isn't as small and has no fear of being eaten by them. Should I add a little salt to my nursery tank as well? Just wondering. Thanks in advance. You're great!Evita Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote:Linda, Keep both heaters. The cost of the electricity will not be noticeably different, and the two heaters will provide better temperature control throughout the tank. Now that you have removed the offensive material from the tank, let the regular water changes and the biological processes take care of the pH. It will settle back down soon enough, and the fish and plants will have time to acclimate to the lower levels without much stress. (I think you said earlier you had some fish in the tank.) \\Steve// --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Find what you need with new enhanced search. Learn more. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13020	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: set up questions and help with pH, please

When I will be keeping a number of diferent species ina tank, I try to hit a happy medium with the temperature that should please all. Platies should do fine at 74-76^oF, though some may tell you to go warmer. I don't think it is necessary. The reasons why the one fry is doing better in the tank with the adults include, more available food, more room in the tank, lack of competition (other than from the adults) for available resources, and a lack of a hormone that is produced by all fish that wil inhibit growth. To get the others to catch up with the singleton, do more water changes, and feed more often. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evita Sent: Friday, July 08, 2005 8:26 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] set up questions and help with pH, please Great post Steve. I am learning so much from reading all your posts. I really enjoy them all. I wanted to tell you my two remaining platys adults are doing well. I am now trying to slowly raise the temp. back up. Is 76 about right. I am nervous though that when I do the ick might come back. Also......Heh, funny thing. My one baby fry platy that managed to run from my net when I caught the others and moved them to the nursery tank......Well he managed to servive and he is growing faster and bigger than all the others. I wonder if it has to do with the salt treatment for ick in my adult tank. I raised the temp. in both tanks, so the only thing different is the adding of the salt. His color is also deeper. He now is so big he comes out and swims next to the adult fish. It is like he knows he isn't as small and has no fear of being eaten by them. Should I add a little salt to my nursery tank as well? Just wondering. Thanks in advance. You're great!Evita Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote:Linda, Keep both heaters. The cost of the electricity will not be noticeably different, and the two heaters will provide better temperature control throughout the tank. Now that you have removed the offensive material from the tank, let the regular water changes and the biological processes take care of the pH. It will settle back down soon enough, and the fish and plants will have time to acclimate to the lower levels without much stress. (I think you said earlier you had some fish in the tank.) \\Steve// --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Find what you need with new enhanced search. Learn more. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13021	From: kb1dva	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

Evita I have wanted to say something of a sort for a long time, you can even disagree with courtesy, and manners. I have seen way too many of these arguments going back and forth and real questions getting ignored. Please stop the name calling and lets get back to fish E _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evita Sent: Friday, July 08, 2005 8:20 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium I haven't been in this line of posts but it kinda reminds me of my kids.....they all have to get in the last word. We wonder how and why awful things happen in the world and how people can get so mad ..... then people fight over stuff like this. Go figure? This is getting more back and forth hits than someone asking for help about a sick and dying fish. The adult thing would to everyone to say sorry and forgive and stop the name calling and get back on the topic of helping each other and our love for the hobby. I thought having aquariums was calming. Let's just take a minute and go look at ours. Now I will say sorry if I offended anyone. But ....Evita paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: no one was talking to you .....and if i am such an ass why have i had so many thank yous?...anyway that is rhetorical. don't care what you have to say anyway. peace out --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@...> wrote: > Very interesting! You say it but dont know it... > > Several people told me that you have been acting > like one for quiet > some time already :) > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > <wtfmorlok@y...> > wrote: > > interesting how someppl show up act like an ass > and > > leave huh? > > > > > > --- Nan <ntalb00@y...> wrote: > > > > > Catfight??? > > > > > > Everyone makes mistakes, let it go and move > on....:) > > > > > > Nan > > > > > > Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > yup, just like titanic... > > > > > > Other than you, most people on here seem to have > a > > > LIFE and don´t > > > have time to post bs all day long, so maybe you > > > should write the > > > president if he let´s everyone know not to call > the > > > lionfish > > > firefish for whatever reason the voices in your > head > > > say so! > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > wrote: > > > > my boat is not the one half sunk...it is the > one > > > with > > > > a good compass, map and plenty of gas. > > > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > ilmao... whatever floats your boat ... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul > helms > > > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > applauds what? you are still wrong. even > the > > > guy > > > > > with > > > > > > 50 years in the hobby says he never heard > of > > > it > > > > > called > > > > > > a lionfish. just because he has the time > to > > > go to > > > > > 20 > > > > > > web searches to find others calling them > the > > > wrong > > > > > > thing does not mean a damn thing. i did > not > > > > > google or > > > > > > go to anything of teh wall. go to > > > > > saltwaterfish.com > > > > > > and there will be a section of firefish.. > > > lions > > > > > and > > > > > > scorpions will not be there. flat out, > make > > > sure > > > > > you > > > > > > are talking about the same thing as > everyone > > > else > > > > > when > > > > > > you decide to tell a beginner that one of > the > > > few > > > > > fish > > > > > > that will actually work in the tank they > have > > > is > > > > > > venemous and deadly, especially when > several > > > > > others > > > > > > are recommending it. > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > *applauds* > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, > "Steve > > > > > Szabo" > > > > > > > <steve@l...> wrote: > > > > > > > > You had said, "i did look it up and > when > > > you > > > > > type > > > > > > > in firefish in > > > > > > > the web > > > > > > > > browser nothing comes up about > lionfish." > > > > > > > apparently in reply to > > > > > > > Sandra's, > > > > > > > > "you can also look it up, anywhere you > > > look > > > > > for a > > > > > > > firefish there > > > > > > > will show > > > > > > > > up two species - the dartfish, and the > > > > > lionfish > > > > > > > which some people > > > > > > > call > > > > > > > > firefishes.". I took that to mean you > did > > > a > > > > > search > > > > > > > and did not > > > > > > > find any > > > > > > > > references to lionfish in your > results. > > > So, I > > > > > > > googled firefish, > > > > > > > i.e. a web > > > > > > > > search, and easily found a reference > to > > > > > lionfish > > > > > > > in the first ten > > > > > > > responses. > > > > > > > > I also felt I would be remiss if I did > not > > > > > report > > > > > > > the results of > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > returned first ten results. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I don't know what you used to search > the > > > web, > > > > > but, > > > > > > > it appears, > > > > > > > that it is > > > > > > > > not difficult to find references to > > > lionfish. > > > > > Just > > > > > > > for ha-has, I > > > > > > > just did > > > > > > > > another search using the search engine > > > Scirus > > > > > > > (http://www.scirus.com) and > > > > > > > > the first 10 results have three direct > > > > > references > > > > > > > to lion fish > > > > > > > (one _Pterois > > > > > > > > miles_ and two _P. volitans_) and one > > > > > > > _Nemateleotris decora_ which > > > > > > > is not a > > > > > > > > lionfish but, I believe, a goby. Two > > > entries > > > > > did > > > > > > > not distinguish > > > > > > > the species > > > > > > > > in the description, but one was not a > > > > > lionfish, > > > > > > > the other was. The > > > > > > > other > > > > > > > > five entries were of something else > > > entirely, > > > > > not > > > > > > > fish. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In another part of my reply, about > > > languages, > > > > > was > > > > > > > in reply to what > > > > > > > Sandra > > > > > > > > had said. However, using foreign > languages > > > in > > > > > my > > > > > > > original post on > > > > > > > the topic > > > > > > > > was merely to reinforce the point I > was > > > > > making, > === message truncated === __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Helps protect you from nasty viruses. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Saltwater aquarium Marine biologist Reef tank --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Sell on Yahoo! Auctions - No fees. Bid on great items. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13022	From: Evita	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: set up questions and help with pH, please

Steve, In the fry tank I feed 5 small meals compaired to only three small ones in the large tank. I change both tanks water 20 percent once a week. Oh, one further note on the fry. Seemingly over night the fry's color has begun brighten in color. Now almost all of them are going more to the orange coloring. Evita Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote:When I will be keeping a number of diferent species ina tank, I try to hit a happy medium with the temperature that should please all. Platies should do fine at 74-76^oF, though some may tell you to go warmer. I don't think it is necessary. The reasons why the one fry is doing better in the tank with the adults include, more available food, more room in the tank, lack of competition (other than from the adults) for available resources, and a lack of a hormone that is produced by all fish that wil inhibit growth. To get the others to catch up with the singleton, do more water changes, and feed more often. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evita Sent: Friday, July 08, 2005 8:26 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] set up questions and help with pH, please Great post Steve. I am learning so much from reading all your posts. I really enjoy them all. I wanted to tell you my two remaining platys adults are doing well. I am now trying to slowly raise the temp. back up. Is 76 about right. I am nervous though that when I do the ick might come back. Also......Heh, funny thing. My one baby fry platy that managed to run from my net when I caught the others and moved them to the nursery tank......Well he managed to servive and he is growing faster and bigger than all the others. I wonder if it has to do with the salt treatment for ick in my adult tank. I raised the temp. in both tanks, so the only thing different is the adding of the salt. His color is also deeper. He now is so big he comes out and swims next to the adult fish. It is like he knows he isn't as small and has no fear of being eaten by them. Should I add a little salt to my nursery tank as well? Just wondering. Thanks in advance. You're great!Evita Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote:Linda, Keep both heaters. The cost of the electricity will not be noticeably different, and the two heaters will provide better temperature control throughout the tank. Now that you have removed the offensive material from the tank, let the regular water changes and the biological processes take care of the pH. It will settle back down soon enough, and the fish and plants will have time to acclimate to the lower levels without much stress. (I think you said earlier you had some fish in the tank.) \\Steve// --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Find what you need with new enhanced search. Learn more. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Saltwater aquarium Marine biologist Reef tank --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Sell on Yahoo! Auctions - No fees. Bid on great items. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13023	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium/mud slinging group?

Isn't there a group just for people that can't agree on stuff? I could have sworn someone in the group started a "fight" group for mud slinging. If anyone knows what it is, post is so they can GO THERE! -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evita Sent: Friday, July 08, 2005 7:20 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium I haven't been in this line of posts but it kinda reminds me of my kids.....they all have to get in the last word. We wonder how and why awful things happen in the world and how people can get so mad ..... then people fight over stuff like this. Go figure? This is getting more back and forth hits than someone asking for help about a sick and dying fish. The adult thing would to everyone to say sorry and forgive and stop the name calling and get back on the topic of helping each other and our love for the hobby. I thought having aquariums was calming. Let's just take a minute and go look at ours. Now I will say sorry if I offended anyone. But ....Evita paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: no one was talking to you .....and if i am such an ass why have i had so many thank yous?...anyway that is rhetorical. don't care what you have to say anyway. peace out --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@...> wrote: > Very interesting! You say it but dont know it... > > Several people told me that you have been acting > like one for quiet > some time already :) > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms <wtfmorlok@y...> > wrote: > > interesting how someppl show up act like an ass > and > > leave huh? > > > > > > --- Nan <ntalb00@y...> wrote: > > > > > Catfight??? > > > > > > Everyone makes mistakes, let it go and move > on....:) > > > > > > Nan > > > > > > Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > yup, just like titanic... > > > > > > Other than you, most people on here seem to have > a > > > LIFE and don´t > > > have time to post bs all day long, so maybe you > > > should write the > > > president if he let´s everyone know not to call > the > > > lionfish > > > firefish for whatever reason the voices in your > head > > > say so! > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > wrote: > > > > my boat is not the one half sunk...it is the > one > > > with > > > > a good compass, map and plenty of gas. > > > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > ilmao... whatever floats your boat ... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul > helms > > > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > applauds what? you are still wrong. even > the > > > guy > > > > > with > > > > > > 50 years in the hobby says he never heard > of > > > it > > > > > called > > > > > > a lionfish. just because he has the time > to > > > go to > > > > > 20 > > > > > > web searches to find others calling them > the > > > wrong > > > > > > thing does not mean a damn thing. i did > not > > > > > google or > > > > > > go to anything of teh wall. go to > > > > > saltwaterfish.com > > > > > > and there will be a section of firefish.. > > > lions > > > > > and > > > > > > scorpions will not be there. flat out, > make > > > sure > > > > > you > > > > > > are talking about the same thing as > everyone > > > else > > > > > when > > > > > > you decide to tell a beginner that one of > the > > > few > > > > > fish > > > > > > that will actually work in the tank they > have > > > is > > > > > > venemous and deadly, especially when > several > > > > > others > > > > > > are recommending it. > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > *applauds* > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, > "Steve > > > > > Szabo" > > > > > > > <steve@l...> wrote: > > > > > > > > You had said, "i did look it up and > when > > > you > > > > > type > > > > > > > in firefish in > > > > > > > the web > > > > > > > > browser nothing comes up about > lionfish." > > > > > > > apparently in reply to > > > > > > > Sandra's, > > > > > > > > "you can also look it up, anywhere you > > > look > > > > > for a > > > > > > > firefish there > > > > > > > will show > > > > > > > > up two species - the dartfish, and the > > > > > lionfish > > > > > > > which some people > > > > > > > call > > > > > > > > firefishes.". I took that to mean you > did > > > a > > > > > search > > > > > > > and did not > > > > > > > find any > > > > > > > > references to lionfish in your > results. > > > So, I > > > > > > > googled firefish, > > > > > > > i.e. a web > > > > > > > > search, and easily found a reference > to > > > > > lionfish > > > > > > > in the first ten > > > > > > > responses. > > > > > > > > I also felt I would be remiss if I did > not > > > > > report > > > > > > > the results of > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > returned first ten results. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I don't know what you used to search > the > > > web, > > > > > but, > > > > > > > it appears, > > > > > > > that it is > > > > > > > > not difficult to find references to > > > lionfish. > > > > > Just > > > > > > > for ha-has, I > > > > > > > just did > > > > > > > > another search using the search engine > > > Scirus > > > > > > > (http://www.scirus.com) and > > > > > > > > the first 10 results have three direct > > > > > references > > > > > > > to lion fish > > > > > > > (one _Pterois > > > > > > > > miles_ and two _P. volitans_) and one > > > > > > > _Nemateleotris decora_ which > > > > > > > is not a > > > > > > > > lionfish but, I believe, a goby. Two > > > entries > > > > > did > > > > > > > not distinguish > > > > > > > the species > > > > > > > > in the description, but one was not a > > > > > lionfish, > > > > > > > the other was. The > > > > > > > other > > > > > > > > five entries were of something else > > > entirely, > > > > > not > > > > > > > fish. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In another part of my reply, about > > > languages, > > > > > was > > > > > > > in reply to what > > > > > > > Sandra > > > > > > > > had said. However, using foreign > languages > > > in > > > > > my > > > > > > > original post on > > > > > > > the topic > > > > > > > > was merely to reinforce the point I > was > > > > > making, > === message truncated === __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Helps protect you from nasty viruses. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13024	From: Evita	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

I wanted to add being a ne-bie to the hobby and all I really look forward to going to my mail and learning so much from people that know so much more than I do. Sometimes the posts May have different suggestions but you can still take the advice and with other resources decide what to do. Not everyone has to agree all the time. Nor could we. But that is no reason to get angry. Evita kb1dva <vze3pd7a@...> wrote: Evita I have wanted to say something of a sort for a long time, you can even disagree with courtesy, and manners. I have seen way too many of these arguments going back and forth and real questions getting ignored. Please stop the name calling and lets get back to fish E _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evita Sent: Friday, July 08, 2005 8:20 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium I haven't been in this line of posts but it kinda reminds me of my kids.....they all have to get in the last word. We wonder how and why awful things happen in the world and how people can get so mad ..... then people fight over stuff like this. Go figure? This is getting more back and forth hits than someone asking for help about a sick and dying fish. The adult thing would to everyone to say sorry and forgive and stop the name calling and get back on the topic of helping each other and our love for the hobby. I thought having aquariums was calming. Let's just take a minute and go look at ours. Now I will say sorry if I offended anyone. But ....Evita paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: no one was talking to you .....and if i am such an ass why have i had so many thank yous?...anyway that is rhetorical. don't care what you have to say anyway. peace out --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@...> wrote: > Very interesting! You say it but dont know it... > > Several people told me that you have been acting > like one for quiet > some time already :) > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > <wtfmorlok@y...> > wrote: > > interesting how someppl show up act like an ass > and > > leave huh? > > > > > > --- Nan <ntalb00@y...> wrote: > > > > > Catfight??? > > > > > > Everyone makes mistakes, let it go and move > on....:) > > > > > > Nan > > > > > > Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > yup, just like titanic... > > > > > > Other than you, most people on here seem to have > a > > > LIFE and don´t > > > have time to post bs all day long, so maybe you > > > should write the > > > president if he let´s everyone know not to call > the > > > lionfish > > > firefish for whatever reason the voices in your > head > > > say so! > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > wrote: > > > > my boat is not the one half sunk...it is the > one > > > with > > > > a good compass, map and plenty of gas. > > > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > ilmao... whatever floats your boat ... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul > helms > > > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > applauds what? you are still wrong. even > the > > > guy > > > > > with > > > > > > 50 years in the hobby says he never heard > of > > > it > > > > > called > > > > > > a lionfish. just because he has the time > to > > > go to > > > > > 20 > > > > > > web searches to find others calling them > the > > > wrong > > > > > > thing does not mean a damn thing. i did > not > > > > > google or > > > > > > go to anything of teh wall. go to > > > > > saltwaterfish.com > > > > > > and there will be a section of firefish.. > > > lions > > > > > and > > > > > > scorpions will not be there. flat out, > make > > > sure > > > > > you > > > > > > are talking about the same thing as > everyone > > > else > > > > > when > > > > > > you decide to tell a beginner that one of > the > > > few > > > > > fish > > > > > > that will actually work in the tank they > have > > > is > > > > > > venemous and deadly, especially when > several > > > > > others > > > > > > are recommending it. > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > *applauds* > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, > "Steve > > > > > Szabo" > > > > > > > <steve@l...> wrote: > > > > > > > > You had said, "i did look it up and > when > > > you > > > > > type > > > > > > > in firefish in > > > > > > > the web > > > > > > > > browser nothing comes up about > lionfish." > > > > > > > apparently in reply to > > > > > > > Sandra's, > > > > > > > > "you can also look it up, anywhere you > > > look > > > > > for a > > > > > > > firefish there > > > > > > > will show > > > > > > > > up two species - the dartfish, and the > > > > > lionfish > > > > > > > which some people > > > > > > > call > > > > > > > > firefishes.". I took that to mean you > did > > > a > > > > > search > > > > > > > and did not > > > > > > > find any > > > > > > > > references to lionfish in your > results. > > > So, I > > > > > > > googled firefish, > > > > > > > i.e. a web > > > > > > > > search, and easily found a reference > to > > > > > lionfish > > > > > > > in the first ten > > > > > > > responses. > > > > > > > > I also felt I would be remiss if I did > not > > > > > report > > > > > > > the results of > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > returned first ten results. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I don't know what you used to search > the > > > web, > > > > > but, > > > > > > > it appears, > > > > > > > that it is > > > > > > > > not difficult to find references to > > > lionfish. > > > > > Just > > > > > > > for ha-has, I > > > > > > > just did > > > > > > > > another search using the search engine > > > Scirus > > > > > > > (http://www.scirus.com) and > > > > > > > > the first 10 results have three direct > > > > > references > > > > > > > to lion fish > > > > > > > (one _Pterois > > > > > > > > miles_ and two _P. volitans_) and one > > > > > > > _Nemateleotris decora_ which > > > > > > > is not a > > > > > > > > lionfish but, I believe, a goby. Two > > > entries > > > > > did > > > > > > > not distinguish > > > > > > > the species > > > > > > > > in the description, but one was not a > > > > > lionfish, > > > > > > > the other was. The > > > > > > > other > > > > > > > > five entries were of something else > > > entirely, > > > > > not > > > > > > > fish. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In another part of my reply, about > > > languages, > > > > > was > > > > > > > in reply to what > > > > > > > Sandra > > > > > > > > had said. However, using foreign > languages > > > in > > > > > my > > > > > > > original post on > > > > > > > the topic > > > > > > > > was merely to reinforce the point I > was > > > > > making, > === message truncated === __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Helps protect you from nasty viruses. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Saltwater aquarium Marine biologist Reef tank --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Sell on Yahoo! Auctions - No fees. 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PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13025	From: paul helms	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

ya know, it is pathetic that people just post whatever they want to, without regards to thought and it leads to this. plain and simple all i wanted was for people to know what they are talking abut before they post something drastic to a newbie telling them that a fish everyone else is recommending is a fish eater and toxic and gets huge. it is that simple. --- Evita <evitabug@...> wrote: > I haven't been in this line of posts but it kinda > reminds me of my kids.....they all have to get in > the last word. We wonder how and why awful things > happen in the world and how people can get so mad > ..... then people fight over stuff like this. Go > figure? This is getting more back and forth hits > than someone asking for help about a sick and dying > fish. The adult thing would to everyone to say > sorry and forgive and stop the name calling and get > back on the topic of helping each other and our love > for the hobby. I thought having aquariums was > calming. Let's just take a minute and go look at > ours. Now I will say sorry if I offended anyone. > But ....Evita > > paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: no one was > talking to you > .....and if i am such an ass why have i had so many > thank yous?...anyway that is rhetorical. don't care > what you have to say anyway. peace out > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@...> wrote: > > > Very interesting! You say it but dont know it... > > > > Several people told me that you have been acting > > like one for quiet > > some time already :) > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > wrote: > > > interesting how someppl show up act like an ass > > and > > > leave huh? > > > > > > > > > --- Nan <ntalb00@y...> wrote: > > > > > > > Catfight??? > > > > > > > > Everyone makes mistakes, let it go and move > > on....:) > > > > > > > > Nan > > > > > > > > Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > yup, just like titanic... > > > > > > > > Other than you, most people on here seem to > have > > a > > > > LIFE and don´t > > > > have time to post bs all day long, so maybe > you > > > > should write the > > > > president if he let´s everyone know not to > call > > the > > > > lionfish > > > > firefish for whatever reason the voices in > your > > head > > > > say so! > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > > wrote: > > > > > my boat is not the one half sunk...it is the > > one > > > > with > > > > > a good compass, map and plenty of gas. > > > > > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > ilmao... whatever floats your boat ... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul > > helms > > > > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > applauds what? you are still wrong. > even > > the > > > > guy > > > > > > with > > > > > > > 50 years in the hobby says he never > heard > > of > > > > it > > > > > > called > > > > > > > a lionfish. just because he has the > time > > to > > > > go to > > > > > > 20 > > > > > > > web searches to find others calling them > > the > > > > wrong > > > > > > > thing does not mean a damn thing. i did > > not > > > > > > google or > > > > > > > go to anything of teh wall. go to > > > > > > saltwaterfish.com > > > > > > > and there will be a section of > firefish.. > > > > lions > > > > > > and > > > > > > > scorpions will not be there. flat out, > > make > > > > sure > > > > > > you > > > > > > > are talking about the same thing as > > everyone > > > > else > > > > > > when > > > > > > > you decide to tell a beginner that one > of > > the > > > > few > > > > > > fish > > > > > > > that will actually work in the tank they > > have > > > > is > > > > > > > venemous and deadly, especially when > > several > > > > > > others > > > > > > > are recommending it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > *applauds* > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, > > "Steve > > > > > > Szabo" > > > > > > > > <steve@l...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > You had said, "i did look it up and > > when > > > > you > > > > > > type > > > > > > > > in firefish in > > > > > > > > the web > > > > > > > > > browser nothing comes up about > > lionfish." > > > > > > > > apparently in reply to > > > > > > > > Sandra's, > > > > > > > > > "you can also look it up, anywhere > you > > > > look > > > > > > for a > > > > > > > > firefish there > > > > > > > > will show > > > > > > > > > up two species - the dartfish, and > the > > > > > > lionfish > > > > > > > > which some people > > > > > > > > call > > > > > > > > > firefishes.". I took that to mean > you > > did > > > > a > > > > > > search > > > > > > > > and did not > > > > > > > > find any > > > > > > > > > references to lionfish in your > > results. > > > > So, I > > > > > > > > googled firefish, > > > > > > > > i.e. a web > > > > > > > > > search, and easily found a reference > > to > > > > > > lionfish > > > > > > > > in the first ten > > > > > > > > responses. > > > > > > > > > I also felt I would be remiss if I > did > > not > > > > > > report > > > > > > > > the results of > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > returned first ten results. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I don't know what you used to search > > the > > > > web, > > > > > > but, > > > > > > > > it appears, > > > > > > > > that it is > > > > > > > > > not difficult to find references to > > > > lionfish. > > > > > > Just > > > > > > > > for ha-has, I > > > > > > > > just did > > > > > > > > > another search using the search > engine > === message truncated === __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13026	From: paul helms	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

another country heard from! --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> wrote: > Paul, > If you keep this up you will end up being put > on > moderated posts or banned altogether!! > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > no one was talking to you > > .....and if i am such an ass why have i had so > many > > thank yous?...anyway that is rhetorical. don't > care > > what you have to say anyway. peace out > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@...> wrote: > > > > > Very interesting! You say it but dont know it... > > > > > > Several people told me that you have been acting > > > like one for quiet > > > some time already :) > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > wrote: > > > > interesting how someppl show up act like an > ass > > > and > > > > leave huh? > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Nan <ntalb00@y...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Catfight??? > > > > > > > > > > Everyone makes mistakes, let it go and move > > > on....:) > > > > > > > > > > Nan > > > > > > > > > > Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > yup, just like titanic... > > > > > > > > > > Other than you, most people on here seem to > > have > > > a > > > > > LIFE and don´t > > > > > have time to post bs all day long, so maybe > > you > > > > > should write the > > > > > president if he let´s everyone know not to > > call > > > the > > > > > lionfish > > > > > firefish for whatever reason the voices in > > your > > > head > > > > > say so! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul > helms > > > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > my boat is not the one half sunk...it is > the > > > one > > > > > with > > > > > > a good compass, map and plenty of gas. > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > ilmao... whatever floats your boat ... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul > > > helms > > > > > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > applauds what? you are still wrong. > > even > > > the > > > > > guy > > > > > > > with > > > > > > > > 50 years in the hobby says he never > > heard > > > of > > > > > it > > > > > > > called > > > > > > > > a lionfish. just because he has the > > time > > > to > > > > > go to > > > > > > > 20 > > > > > > > > web searches to find others calling > them > > > the > > > > > wrong > > > > > > > > thing does not mean a damn thing. i > did > > > not > > > > > > > google or > > > > > > > > go to anything of teh wall. go to > > > > > > > saltwaterfish.com > > > > > > > > and there will be a section of > > firefish.. > > > > > lions > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > scorpions will not be there. flat > out, > > > make > > > > > sure > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > are talking about the same thing as > > > everyone > > > > > else > > > > > > > when > > > > > > > > you decide to tell a beginner that one > > of > > > the > > > > > few > > > > > > > fish > > > > > > > > that will actually work in the tank > they > > > have > > > > > is > > > > > > > > venemous and deadly, especially when > > > several > > > > > > > others > > > > > > > > are recommending it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > *applauds* > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, > > > "Steve > > > > > > > Szabo" > > > > > > > > > <steve@l...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > You had said, "i did look it up > and > > > when > > > > > you > > > > > > > type > > > > > > > > > in firefish in > > > > > > > > > the web > > > > > > > > > > browser nothing comes up about > > > lionfish." > > > > > > > > > apparently in reply to > > > > > > > > > Sandra's, > > > > > > > > > > "you can also look it up, anywhere > > you > > > > > look > > > > > > > for a > > > > > > > > > firefish there > > > > > > > > > will show > > > > > > > > > > up two species - the dartfish, and > > the > > > > > > > lionfish > > > > > > > > > which some people > > > > > > > > > call > > > > > > > > > > firefishes.". I took that to mean > > you > > > did > > > > > a > > > > > > > search > > > > > > > > > and did not > > > > > > > > > find any > > > > > > > > > > references to lionfish in your > > > results. > > > > > So, I > > > > > > > > > googled firefish, > > > > > > > > > i.e. a web > > > > > > > > > > search, and easily found a > reference > > > to > > > > > > > lionfish > > > > > > > > > in the first ten > > > > > > > > > responses. > > > > > > > > > > I also felt I would be remiss if I > > did > > > not > > > > > > > report > > > > > > > > > the results of > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > returned first ten results. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I don't know what you used to > search > > > the > > > > > web, > > > > > > > but, > > > > > > > > > it appears, > > > > > > > > > that it is > === message truncated === __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13027	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: set up questions and help with pH, please

I usually add a little baking soda to even things out. In my 55 gal, my pH was a little acidic (I don't have the scale in front of me right now) and I added a teaspoon of baking soda and the pH went back to neutral. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Friday, July 08, 2005 5:10 AM To: mnaquarium@yahoogroups.com; AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] set up questions and help with pH, please My Eheim 2028 canister filter and heaters finally came Thursday. I ordered them online from BigAlsonline last Wednesday night. The 150 tank has not had a heater in it since I set it up last week. The temperature has been constant at @75 degrees. As I said in an earlier post, our room temperature is set at 73 degrees. Do you think it is necessary to use both 300 watt heaters? Maybe I could save some money and send one back? Our house temperature may drop down to 71-72 degrees this winter, depending on how warm our house is and how our heating bills look. The Eheim 2028 is so kool!! It was so easy to set up and install and it runs so quiet. I spent the majority of yesterday evening taking everything out of my tank and putting it back in. When I was buying my gravel (a few months ago) I saw this little 5 pound bag of "pond pebbles" at PetsMart. I thought they would add a natural look to my substrate. I could swear that the bag said they were granite. NOT. I finally figured it out that these 150+ pebbles were buffering my water. While I was reading and assembling my new filter yesterday, my 14 year old daughter was testing both my tanks. The 10 gallon has a pH of 7.5, the ammonia is zero as well as the nitrites. The 150 tank had a pH of 8.5, ammonia zero and the nitrites are just starting to spike. So we took all the plants and wood out. Then we pulled all the big ornamental rocks out. Most of the bigger rocks we went rock picking for and my new house that we moved into has an AWESOME rock garden in the back yard. I know a bit about rocks and thought I had picked safe rocks for displaying in the tank. We spent a good 45 minutes sifting through the gravel weeding out all these little pond pebbles. Since I put laterite in my substrate, the water got so cloudy! I was so pissed off I coulda spit.!! After that we went over to my daughters science teachers house. She took us over to school and helped us test a bunch of rocks in her lab using a nail and some hydrochloric acid. Anything with calcium carbonate, limestone or gypsum (?) in it bubbles when tested with the acid. All the rocks that I picked out of my yard were fine. It was the majority of the little pond pebbles that I got from PetsMart that was buffering my water. I didn't get everything back in the tank and settled down until close to midnigt. MY QUESTION: How much of a water change do I need to do to slowly bring my pH back down to what the original tap water is (7.3). Will a 1/4 be too much? We siphoned off a 3 gallon buck last night to hold the live plants while we were sifting for pond pebbles. I ended up adding fresh water back in cause I later used that water to clean the filter cartridges in my Emperor 400 filter. I have not had chance to retest the water. I just wanted to get a quick opinion before I have to go off to work this morning (I work at the Home Depot from 6am to3pm) I will check back with y'all later today. thanks in advance, Linda River Falls, WI 150 freshwater tank [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13028	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: set up questions and help with pH, please

To see the increase in ggrowth to match the one fry in the adult's tank, you would probably want to do a 10% water change daily o the fry tank. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evita Sent: Friday, July 08, 2005 10:25 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] set up questions and help with pH, please Steve, In the fry tank I feed 5 small meals compaired to only three small ones in the large tank. I change both tanks water 20 percent once a week. Oh, one further note on the fry. Seemingly over night the fry's color has begun brighten in color. Now almost all of them are going more to the orange coloring. Evita Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote:When I will be keeping a number of diferent species ina tank, I try to hit a happy medium with the temperature that should please all. Platies should do fine at 74-76^oF, though some may tell you to go warmer. I don't think it is necessary. The reasons why the one fry is doing better in the tank with the adults include, more available food, more room in the tank, lack of competition (other than from the adults) for available resources, and a lack of a hormone that is produced by all fish that wil inhibit growth. To get the others to catch up with the singleton, do more water changes, and feed more often. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evita Sent: Friday, July 08, 2005 8:26 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] set up questions and help with pH, please Great post Steve. I am learning so much from reading all your posts. I really enjoy them all. I wanted to tell you my two remaining platys adults are doing well. I am now trying to slowly raise the temp. back up. Is 76 about right. I am nervous though that when I do the ick might come back. Also......Heh, funny thing. My one baby fry platy that managed to run from my net when I caught the others and moved them to the nursery tank......Well he managed to servive and he is growing faster and bigger than all the others. I wonder if it has to do with the salt treatment for ick in my adult tank. I raised the temp. in both tanks, so the only thing different is the adding of the salt. His color is also deeper. He now is so big he comes out and swims next to the adult fish. It is like he knows he isn't as small and has no fear of being eaten by them. Should I add a little salt to my nursery tank as well? Just wondering. Thanks in advance. You're great!Evita Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote:Linda, Keep both heaters. The cost of the electricity will not be noticeably different, and the two heaters will provide better temperature control throughout the tank. Now that you have removed the offensive material from the tank, let the regular water changes and the biological processes take care of the pH. It will settle back down soon enough, and the fish and plants will have time to acclimate to the lower levels without much stress. (I think you said earlier you had some fish in the tank.) \\Steve// --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Find what you need with new enhanced search. Learn more. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Saltwater aquarium Marine biologist Reef tank --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Sell on Yahoo! Auctions - No fees. 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13029	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: set up questions and help with pH, please

Generally, you do not want to mess with the water chemistry, especially with pH. Water has a buffer that helps to maintain the pH where it is. Inorder to raise or lower the pH, particularly lower, you need to break the buffer. Once the buffer has been broken, it is anybody's guess where the pH will go. Best to take it slow and easy through water changes for her to get back her natural pH. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Roberts Sent: Friday, July 08, 2005 1:10 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] set up questions and help with pH, please I usually add a little baking soda to even things out. In my 55 gal, my pH was a little acidic (I don't have the scale in front of me right now) and I added a teaspoon of baking soda and the pH went back to neutral. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Friday, July 08, 2005 5:10 AM To: mnaquarium@yahoogroups.com; AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] set up questions and help with pH, please My Eheim 2028 canister filter and heaters finally came Thursday. I ordered them online from BigAlsonline last Wednesday night. The 150 tank has not had a heater in it since I set it up last week. The temperature has been constant at @75 degrees. As I said in an earlier post, our room temperature is set at 73 degrees. Do you think it is necessary to use both 300 watt heaters? Maybe I could save some money and send one back? Our house temperature may drop down to 71-72 degrees this winter, depending on how warm our house is and how our heating bills look. The Eheim 2028 is so kool!! It was so easy to set up and install and it runs so quiet. I spent the majority of yesterday evening taking everything out of my tank and putting it back in. When I was buying my gravel (a few months ago) I saw this little 5 pound bag of "pond pebbles" at PetsMart. I thought they would add a natural look to my substrate. I could swear that the bag said they were granite. NOT. I finally figured it out that these 150+ pebbles were buffering my water. While I was reading and assembling my new filter yesterday, my 14 year old daughter was testing both my tanks. The 10 gallon has a pH of 7.5, the ammonia is zero as well as the nitrites. The 150 tank had a pH of 8.5, ammonia zero and the nitrites are just starting to spike. So we took all the plants and wood out. Then we pulled all the big ornamental rocks out. Most of the bigger rocks we went rock picking for and my new house that we moved into has an AWESOME rock garden in the back yard. I know a bit about rocks and thought I had picked safe rocks for displaying in the tank. We spent a good 45 minutes sifting through the gravel weeding out all these little pond pebbles. Since I put laterite in my substrate, the water got so cloudy! I was so pissed off I coulda spit.!! After that we went over to my daughters science teachers house. She took us over to school and helped us test a bunch of rocks in her lab using a nail and some hydrochloric acid. Anything with calcium carbonate, limestone or gypsum (?) in it bubbles when tested with the acid. All the rocks that I picked out of my yard were fine. It was the majority of the little pond pebbles that I got from PetsMart that was buffering my water. I didn't get everything back in the tank and settled down until close to midnigt. MY QUESTION: How much of a water change do I need to do to slowly bring my pH back down to what the original tap water is (7.3). Will a 1/4 be too much? We siphoned off a 3 gallon buck last night to hold the live plants while we were sifting for pond pebbles. I ended up adding fresh water back in cause I later used that water to clean the filter cartridges in my Emperor 400 filter. I have not had chance to retest the water. I just wanted to get a quick opinion before I have to go off to work this morning (I work at the Home Depot from 6am to3pm) I will check back with y'all later today. thanks in advance, Linda River Falls, WI 150 freshwater tank [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13030	From: Evita	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

I know intentions were good but it got out of hand...name calling and what not not needed. One calm friendly post and be done with it. Arguing doesn't help. Usually I take in all posts along with other net sources and my books to get the full picture. New-bies are new but not stupid. It is more of a turn off to new members to see loads of angry type posts than differences of opinons. Some new people, might be to the group but not to the hobby. They could become afraid to post for fear of saying the wrong thing. Then some groups can die from lack of participation. Although I am new to this group I belong to several different types of groups as well as the owner of one art-painting group and I always try to make people feel welcome and safe when posting. That to me is the purpose of groups. To exchange ideas. My pet groups and art groups are my favorite ones due to the shared interests and passions. Also I must add I have a great love for people not just animals. Evita paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote:ya know, it is pathetic that people just post whatever they want to, without regards to thought and it leads to this. plain and simple all i wanted was for people to know what they are talking abut before they post something drastic to a newbie telling them that a fish everyone else is recommending is a fish eater and toxic and gets huge. it is that simple. --- Evita <evitabug@...> wrote: > I haven't been in this line of posts but it kinda > reminds me of my kids.....they all have to get in > the last word. We wonder how and why awful things > happen in the world and how people can get so mad > ..... then people fight over stuff like this. Go > figure? This is getting more back and forth hits > than someone asking for help about a sick and dying > fish. The adult thing would to everyone to say > sorry and forgive and stop the name calling and get > back on the topic of helping each other and our love > for the hobby. I thought having aquariums was > calming. Let's just take a minute and go look at > ours. Now I will say sorry if I offended anyone. > But ....Evita > > paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: no one was > talking to you > .....and if i am such an ass why have i had so many > thank yous?...anyway that is rhetorical. don't care > what you have to say anyway. peace out > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@...> wrote: > > > Very interesting! You say it but dont know it... > > > > Several people told me that you have been acting > > like one for quiet > > some time already :) > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > wrote: > > > interesting how someppl show up act like an ass > > and > > > leave huh? > > > > > > > > > --- Nan <ntalb00@y...> wrote: > > > > > > > Catfight??? > > > > > > > > Everyone makes mistakes, let it go and move > > on....:) > > > > > > > > Nan > > > > > > > > Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > yup, just like titanic... > > > > > > > > Other than you, most people on here seem to > have > > a > > > > LIFE and don´t > > > > have time to post bs all day long, so maybe > you > > > > should write the > > > > president if he let´s everyone know not to > call > > the > > > > lionfish > > > > firefish for whatever reason the voices in > your > > head > > > > say so! > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > > wrote: > > > > > my boat is not the one half sunk...it is the > > one > > > > with > > > > > a good compass, map and plenty of gas. > > > > > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > ilmao... whatever floats your boat ... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul > > helms > > > > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > applauds what? you are still wrong. > even > > the > > > > guy > > > > > > with > > > > > > > 50 years in the hobby says he never > heard > > of > > > > it > > > > > > called > > > > > > > a lionfish. just because he has the > time > > to > > > > go to > > > > > > 20 > > > > > > > web searches to find others calling them > > the > > > > wrong > > > > > > > thing does not mean a damn thing. i did > > not > > > > > > google or > > > > > > > go to anything of teh wall. go to > > > > > > saltwaterfish.com > > > > > > > and there will be a section of > firefish.. > > > > lions > > > > > > and > > > > > > > scorpions will not be there. flat out, > > make > > > > sure > > > > > > you > > > > > > > are talking about the same thing as > > everyone > > > > else > > > > > > when > > > > > > > you decide to tell a beginner that one > of > > the > > > > few > > > > > > fish > > > > > > > that will actually work in the tank they > > have > > > > is > > > > > > > venemous and deadly, especially when > > several > > > > > > others > > > > > > > are recommending it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > *applauds* > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, > > "Steve > > > > > > Szabo" > > > > > > > > <steve@l...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > You had said, "i did look it up and > > when > > > > you > > > > > > type > > > > > > > > in firefish in > > > > > > > > the web > > > > > > > > > browser nothing comes up about > > lionfish." > > > > > > > > apparently in reply to > > > > > > > > Sandra's, > > > > > > > > > "you can also look it up, anywhere > you > > > > look > > > > > > for a > > > > > > > > firefish there > > > > > > > > will show > > > > > > > > > up two species - the dartfish, and > the > > > > > > lionfish > > > > > > > > which some people > > > > > > > > call > > > > > > > > > firefishes.". I took that to mean > you > > did > > > > a > > > > > > search > > > > > > > > and did not > > > > > > > > find any > > > > > > > > > references to lionfish in your > > results. > > > > So, I > > > > > > > > googled firefish, > > > > > > > > i.e. a web > > > > > > > > > search, and easily found a reference > > to > > > > > > lionfish > > > > > > > > in the first ten > > > > > > > > responses. > > > > > > > > > I also felt I would be remiss if I > did > > not > > > > > > report > > > > > > > > the results of > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > returned first ten results. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I don't know what you used to search > > the > > > > web, > > > > > > but, > > > > > > > > it appears, > > > > > > > > that it is > > > > > > > > > not difficult to find references to > > > > lionfish. > > > > > > Just > > > > > > > > for ha-has, I > > > > > > > > just did > > > > > > > > > another search using the search > engine > === message truncated === __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13031	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: set up questions and help with pH, please

That generally works for me. I threw mine off a bit when I added some sphagnum moss for decoration. It made the water slightly acidic (not by much...it was still in the neutral range, just on the acidic end of it). The baking powder corrected it. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: Friday, July 08, 2005 12:23 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] set up questions and help with pH, please Generally, you do not want to mess with the water chemistry, especially with pH. Water has a buffer that helps to maintain the pH where it is. Inorder to raise or lower the pH, particularly lower, you need to break the buffer. Once the buffer has been broken, it is anybody's guess where the pH will go. Best to take it slow and easy through water changes for her to get back her natural pH. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Roberts Sent: Friday, July 08, 2005 1:10 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] set up questions and help with pH, please I usually add a little baking soda to even things out. In my 55 gal, my pH was a little acidic (I don't have the scale in front of me right now) and I added a teaspoon of baking soda and the pH went back to neutral. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Friday, July 08, 2005 5:10 AM To: mnaquarium@yahoogroups.com; AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] set up questions and help with pH, please My Eheim 2028 canister filter and heaters finally came Thursday. I ordered them online from BigAlsonline last Wednesday night. The 150 tank has not had a heater in it since I set it up last week. The temperature has been constant at @75 degrees. As I said in an earlier post, our room temperature is set at 73 degrees. Do you think it is necessary to use both 300 watt heaters? Maybe I could save some money and send one back? Our house temperature may drop down to 71-72 degrees this winter, depending on how warm our house is and how our heating bills look. The Eheim 2028 is so kool!! It was so easy to set up and install and it runs so quiet. I spent the majority of yesterday evening taking everything out of my tank and putting it back in. When I was buying my gravel (a few months ago) I saw this little 5 pound bag of "pond pebbles" at PetsMart. I thought they would add a natural look to my substrate. I could swear that the bag said they were granite. NOT. I finally figured it out that these 150+ pebbles were buffering my water. While I was reading and assembling my new filter yesterday, my 14 year old daughter was testing both my tanks. The 10 gallon has a pH of 7.5, the ammonia is zero as well as the nitrites. The 150 tank had a pH of 8.5, ammonia zero and the nitrites are just starting to spike. So we took all the plants and wood out. Then we pulled all the big ornamental rocks out. Most of the bigger rocks we went rock picking for and my new house that we moved into has an AWESOME rock garden in the back yard. I know a bit about rocks and thought I had picked safe rocks for displaying in the tank. We spent a good 45 minutes sifting through the gravel weeding out all these little pond pebbles. Since I put laterite in my substrate, the water got so cloudy! I was so pissed off I coulda spit.!! After that we went over to my daughters science teachers house. She took us over to school and helped us test a bunch of rocks in her lab using a nail and some hydrochloric acid. Anything with calcium carbonate, limestone or gypsum (?) in it bubbles when tested with the acid. All the rocks that I picked out of my yard were fine. It was the majority of the little pond pebbles that I got from PetsMart that was buffering my water. I didn't get everything back in the tank and settled down until close to midnigt. MY QUESTION: How much of a water change do I need to do to slowly bring my pH back down to what the original tap water is (7.3). Will a 1/4 be too much? We siphoned off a 3 gallon buck last night to hold the live plants while we were sifting for pond pebbles. I ended up adding fresh water back in cause I later used that water to clean the filter cartridges in my Emperor 400 filter. I have not had chance to retest the water. I just wanted to get a quick opinion before I have to go off to work this morning (I work at the Home Depot from 6am to3pm) I will check back with y'all later today. thanks in advance, Linda River Falls, WI 150 freshwater tank [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! 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PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13032	From: Evita	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: set up questions and help with pH, please

Big thanks Steve!!!! Evita Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote:To see the increase in ggrowth to match the one fry in the adult's tank, you would probably want to do a 10% water change daily o the fry tank. --------------------------------- Discover Yahoo! Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news & more. Check it out! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13033	From: Sandra	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Lazy cleaner shrimp??

I was wondering if anyone heard of something as a lazy cleaner shrimp? I am asking cause mine (blood red fire shrimp - 2 and a half years in the tank) doesnt seem to like fish bothering him too much about cleaning them...lol.. he even gets poked from time to time and then he makes an "effort" for some seconds to clean the fish. Does anyone know why is this kind of behaviour? I thought they were really intusiastic cleaners... sandra

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13034	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: Lazy cleaner shrimp??

i had a fire shrimp that was so reclusive i rarely saw it. when i did see it it certainly didn't clean any fish that i noticed. my cleaner shrimp definitely cleans fish, it even cleans my hand when i am in there target feeding. --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@...> wrote: > I was wondering if anyone heard of something as a lazy cleaner shrimp? > I am asking cause mine (blood red fire shrimp - 2 and a half years in > the tank) doesnt seem to like fish bothering him too much about > cleaning them...lol.. he even gets poked from time to time and then he > makes an "effort" for some seconds to clean the fish. Does anyone know > why is this kind of behaviour? I thought they were really intusiastic > cleaners... > > sandra > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13035	From: Sandra	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: Lazy cleaner shrimp??

What kind of cleaner shrimp do you have now? --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@y...> wrote: > i had a fire shrimp that was so reclusive i rarely saw it. when i did see it it certainly didn't > clean any fish that i noticed. my cleaner shrimp definitely cleans fish, it even cleans my hand > when i am in there target feeding. > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > I was wondering if anyone heard of something as a lazy cleaner shrimp? > > I am asking cause mine (blood red fire shrimp - 2 and a half years in > > the tank) doesnt seem to like fish bothering him too much about > > cleaning them...lol.. he even gets poked from time to time and then he > > makes an "effort" for some seconds to clean the fish. Does anyone know > > why is this kind of behaviour? I thought they were really intusiastic > > cleaners... > > > > sandra > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13036	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: Lazy cleaner shrimp??

i've always seen it just called a cleaner shrimp. it has a yellowish transparent body & a red back with a white stripe down the middle. here's a link to it: http://marinedepotlive.com/cleaner-shrimp---lysmata-amboinensis-inverts--shrimp.html --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@...> wrote: > What kind of cleaner shrimp do you have now? > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Valeen Gonzalez > <valeendgonzalez@y...> wrote: > > i had a fire shrimp that was so reclusive i rarely saw it. when i > did see it it certainly didn't > > clean any fish that i noticed. my cleaner shrimp definitely cleans > fish, it even cleans my hand > > when i am in there target feeding. > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > I was wondering if anyone heard of something as a lazy cleaner > shrimp? > > > I am asking cause mine (blood red fire shrimp - 2 and a half > years in > > > the tank) doesnt seem to like fish bothering him too much about > > > cleaning them...lol.. he even gets poked from time to time and > then he > > > makes an "effort" for some seconds to clean the fish. Does > anyone know > > > why is this kind of behaviour? I thought they were really > intusiastic > > > cleaners... > > > > > > sandra > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > > I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13037	From: Sandra	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: Lazy cleaner shrimp??

Thx Valeen, i am gonna purchase one of those! I just hope they both get along :) --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@y...> wrote: > i've always seen it just called a cleaner shrimp. it has a yellowish transparent body & a red back > with a white stripe down the middle. > > here's a link to it: > http://marinedepotlive.com/cleaner-shrimp---lysmata-amboinensis- inverts--shrimp.html > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > What kind of cleaner shrimp do you have now? > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Valeen Gonzalez > > <valeendgonzalez@y...> wrote: > > > i had a fire shrimp that was so reclusive i rarely saw it. when i > > did see it it certainly didn't > > > clean any fish that i noticed. my cleaner shrimp definitely cleans > > fish, it even cleans my hand > > > when i am in there target feeding. > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > I was wondering if anyone heard of something as a lazy cleaner > > shrimp? > > > > I am asking cause mine (blood red fire shrimp - 2 and a half > > years in > > > > the tank) doesnt seem to like fish bothering him too much about > > > > cleaning them...lol.. he even gets poked from time to time and > > then he > > > > makes an "effort" for some seconds to clean the fish. Does > > anyone know > > > > why is this kind of behaviour? I thought they were really > > intusiastic > > > > cleaners... > > > > > > > > sandra > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > > > I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13038	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: Lazy cleaner shrimp??

they should, in my tank they got along fine. the few times i saw the fire shrimp the cleaner could be seen near it and they weren't fighting or showing any signs of aggression toward each other. they're nice looking and should make a good addition to your tank. let us know how it goes =) --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@...> wrote: > Thx Valeen, i am gonna purchase one of those! I just hope they both > get along :) > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Valeen Gonzalez > <valeendgonzalez@y...> wrote: > > i've always seen it just called a cleaner shrimp. it has a > yellowish transparent body & a red back > > with a white stripe down the middle. > > > > here's a link to it: > > http://marinedepotlive.com/cleaner-shrimp---lysmata-amboinensis- > inverts--shrimp.html > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > What kind of cleaner shrimp do you have now? > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Valeen Gonzalez > > > <valeendgonzalez@y...> wrote: > > > > i had a fire shrimp that was so reclusive i rarely saw it. > when i > > > did see it it certainly didn't > > > > clean any fish that i noticed. my cleaner shrimp definitely > cleans > > > fish, it even cleans my hand > > > > when i am in there target feeding. > > > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > I was wondering if anyone heard of something as a lazy > cleaner > > > shrimp? > > > > > I am asking cause mine (blood red fire shrimp - 2 and a half > > > years in > > > > > the tank) doesnt seem to like fish bothering him too much > about > > > > > cleaning them...lol.. he even gets poked from time to time > and > > > then he > > > > > makes an "effort" for some seconds to clean the fish. Does > > > anyone know > > > > > why is this kind of behaviour? I thought they were really > > > intusiastic > > > > > cleaners... > > > > > > > > > > sandra > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > > > > I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > > I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13039	From: Nan	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: feeding plecos

Since my plecos keep my tanks very clean, I tend to take a cucumber and slice it in half, then cut the half lengthways in half, stick some plant weights thru the bottom to hold it down and after rinseing it in aquarium water, I drop it in. I do this 2 or 3 times per week and they love it. Just a thought. Nan Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: As I have several fish that eat algae, I drop a few of them across the tank and hope for the best. From what I was reading, if they are feeding during the day, they are not getting enough. I am not sure if that is true or not since I don;t think I have ever seen a pleco not eat ;-) Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Wednesday, July 06, 2005 10:19 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] feeding plecos I was wondering what is the best way to see that your pleco is getting enough to eat. How would one small pleco find an algae wafer in my 150 tank? Do you consistently drop the wafer in the same spot so the fish know were to find his food? Or do I rely on his fishy instincts an know that he will find his algae wafer on his own? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Mail for Mobile Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13040	From: Nan	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

I agree totally!! BTW, I did go look at my Aquariums, fed my fish, chuckled at about the kid thing and came back to read my emails....and I just have to agree totally! :) Nan kb1dva <vze3pd7a@...> wrote: Evita I have wanted to say something of a sort for a long time, you can even disagree with courtesy, and manners. I have seen way too many of these arguments going back and forth and real questions getting ignored. Please stop the name calling and lets get back to fish E _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evita Sent: Friday, July 08, 2005 8:20 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium I haven't been in this line of posts but it kinda reminds me of my kids.....they all have to get in the last word. We wonder how and why awful things happen in the world and how people can get so mad ..... then people fight over stuff like this. Go figure? This is getting more back and forth hits than someone asking for help about a sick and dying fish. The adult thing would to everyone to say sorry and forgive and stop the name calling and get back on the topic of helping each other and our love for the hobby. I thought having aquariums was calming. Let's just take a minute and go look at ours. Now I will say sorry if I offended anyone. But ....Evita paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: no one was talking to you .....and if i am such an ass why have i had so many thank yous?...anyway that is rhetorical. don't care what you have to say anyway. peace out --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@...> wrote: > Very interesting! You say it but dont know it... > > Several people told me that you have been acting > like one for quiet > some time already :) > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > <wtfmorlok@y...> > wrote: > > interesting how someppl show up act like an ass > and > > leave huh? > > > > > > --- Nan <ntalb00@y...> wrote: > > > > > Catfight??? > > > > > > Everyone makes mistakes, let it go and move > on....:) > > > > > > Nan > > > > > > Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > yup, just like titanic... > > > > > > Other than you, most people on here seem to have > a > > > LIFE and don´t > > > have time to post bs all day long, so maybe you > > > should write the > > > president if he let´s everyone know not to call > the > > > lionfish > > > firefish for whatever reason the voices in your > head > > > say so! > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > wrote: > > > > my boat is not the one half sunk...it is the > one > > > with > > > > a good compass, map and plenty of gas. > > > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > ilmao... whatever floats your boat ... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul > helms > > > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > applauds what? you are still wrong. even > the > > > guy > > > > > with > > > > > > 50 years in the hobby says he never heard > of > > > it > > > > > called > > > > > > a lionfish. just because he has the time > to > > > go to > > > > > 20 > > > > > > web searches to find others calling them > the > > > wrong > > > > > > thing does not mean a damn thing. i did > not > > > > > google or > > > > > > go to anything of teh wall. go to > > > > > saltwaterfish.com > > > > > > and there will be a section of firefish.. > > > lions > > > > > and > > > > > > scorpions will not be there. flat out, > make > > > sure > > > > > you > > > > > > are talking about the same thing as > everyone > > > else > > > > > when > > > > > > you decide to tell a beginner that one of > the > > > few > > > > > fish > > > > > > that will actually work in the tank they > have > > > is > > > > > > venemous and deadly, especially when > several > > > > > others > > > > > > are recommending it. > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > *applauds* > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, > "Steve > > > > > Szabo" > > > > > > > <steve@l...> wrote: > > > > > > > > You had said, "i did look it up and > when > > > you > > > > > type > > > > > > > in firefish in > > > > > > > the web > > > > > > > > browser nothing comes up about > lionfish." > > > > > > > apparently in reply to > > > > > > > Sandra's, > > > > > > > > "you can also look it up, anywhere you > > > look > > > > > for a > > > > > > > firefish there > > > > > > > will show > > > > > > > > up two species - the dartfish, and the > > > > > lionfish > > > > > > > which some people > > > > > > > call > > > > > > > > firefishes.". I took that to mean you > did > > > a > > > > > search > > > > > > > and did not > > > > > > > find any > > > > > > > > references to lionfish in your > results. > > > So, I > > > > > > > googled firefish, > > > > > > > i.e. a web > > > > > > > > search, and easily found a reference > to > > > > > lionfish > > > > > > > in the first ten > > > > > > > responses. > > > > > > > > I also felt I would be remiss if I did > not > > > > > report > > > > > > > the results of > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > returned first ten results. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I don't know what you used to search > the > > > web, > > > > > but, > > > > > > > it appears, > > > > > > > that it is > > > > > > > > not difficult to find references to > > > lionfish. > > > > > Just > > > > > > > for ha-has, I > > > > > > > just did > > > > > > > > another search using the search engine > > > Scirus > > > > > > > (http://www.scirus.com) and > > > > > > > > the first 10 results have three direct > > > > > references > > > > > > > to lion fish > > > > > > > (one _Pterois > > > > > > > > miles_ and two _P. volitans_) and one > > > > > > > _Nemateleotris decora_ which > > > > > > > is not a > > > > > > > > lionfish but, I believe, a goby. Two > > > entries > > > > > did > > > > > > > not distinguish > > > > > > > the species > > > > > > > > in the description, but one was not a > > > > > lionfish, > > > > > > > the other was. The > > > > > > > other > > > > > > > > five entries were of something else > > > entirely, > > > > > not > > > > > > > fish. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In another part of my reply, about > > > languages, > > > > > was > > > > > > > in reply to what > > > > > > > Sandra > > > > > > > > had said. However, using foreign > languages > > > in > > > > > my > > > > > > > original post on > > > > > > > the topic > > > > > > > > was merely to reinforce the point I > was > > > > > making, > === message truncated === __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Helps protect you from nasty viruses. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. 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PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Sell on Yahoo! Auctions - No fees. Bid on great items. 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13041	From: vincer12001	Date: 7/8/2005
Subject: New site

Hey everyoen come check oout our new site!! It is chalked full of monitor and bearded dragon info, pictures breeding etc. We also have exotic fish forums etc. Please register and post away http://s12.invisionfree.com/Dragons_Down_Under/index.php?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13042	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/9/2005
Subject: cycling question

I just started a tank and put in filter media from an established tank to speed up the cycling process. I woke up this morning and the tank was so cloudy I could barely see my little danios I put in there. The cloudiness is not even...you can "waves" in it from the current. I ammonia levels are at 0 but the nitrite levels are at .25. I have never had this happen. Is this just an algae bloom and just let it go with some water changes, or should I be doing anything else? Eric [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13043	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/9/2005
Subject: Re: cycling question

If it is green, then it is an algal bloom. If it is grey or whitish, then it is a bacterial bloom. These are frequent occurrences with new tanks, that they, interestingly enough, call "new tank syndrome". This is just something you need to ride out. Continue with your normal tank maintenance, and as they cycle continues, it will eventually go away. The worst thing you can do is to try to fix it, as doing so, generally makes it worse. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Roberts Sent: Saturday, July 09, 2005 1:01 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] cycling question I just started a tank and put in filter media from an established tank to speed up the cycling process. I woke up this morning and the tank was so cloudy I could barely see my little danios I put in there. The cloudiness is not even...you can "waves" in it from the current. I ammonia levels are at 0 but the nitrite levels are at .25. I have never had this happen. Is this just an algae bloom and just let it go with some water changes, or should I be doing anything else? Eric [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13044	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/9/2005
Subject: Re: cycling question

Every tank has to cycle, even with established filters, gravel from old tanks.It should go away in a week maybe less. Its probally a bacterial bloom, ( whitish color ) Just don't add anymore fish to the tank for awhile. Rob Indiana <*)))))))><( [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13045	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/9/2005
Subject: Re: cycling question

That's what I thought...just anteed to be sure...thanks. It's kinda pretty with the shimmering though...unfortunately it clouds the view of the fish *grin* _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: Saturday, July 09, 2005 12:36 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] cycling question If it is green, then it is an algal bloom. If it is grey or whitish, then it is a bacterial bloom. These are frequent occurrences with new tanks, that they, interestingly enough, call "new tank syndrome". This is just something you need to ride out. Continue with your normal tank maintenance, and as they cycle continues, it will eventually go away. The worst thing you can do is to try to fix it, as doing so, generally makes it worse. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Roberts Sent: Saturday, July 09, 2005 1:01 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] cycling question I just started a tank and put in filter media from an established tank to speed up the cycling process. I woke up this morning and the tank was so cloudy I could barely see my little danios I put in there. The cloudiness is not even...you can "waves" in it from the current. I ammonia levels are at 0 but the nitrite levels are at .25. I have never had this happen. Is this just an algae bloom and just let it go with some water changes, or should I be doing anything else? Eric [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Yahoo! Groups Links 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13046	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/9/2005
Subject: Re: cycling question

Unfortunately I don't have a choice...I set this up to house some ghost shrimp for my carnivorous little buddies in my main tank. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of FortWayneFish@... Sent: Saturday, July 09, 2005 1:00 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] cycling question Every tank has to cycle, even with established filters, gravel from old tanks.It should go away in a week maybe less. Its probally a bacterial bloom, ( whitish color ) Just don't add anymore fish to the tank for awhile. Rob Indiana <*)))))))><( [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13047	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/9/2005
Subject: can I do water changes with Maracyn 2? (nasty case of fin rot)

So yesterday I was at my boyfriend's house (where I keep my 55 gal in which live 4 goldfish, 1 bullhead and snails) and noticed that my blue oranda goldfish has a nasty case of fin and tail rot. I mean she looks really awful. I was quite alarmed because it happened suddenly; the last time I was there she looked fine. I promptly did a 30% water change, added some salt to help with the disease, a bit of stress zyme, some stress coat to protect the fins, and started a treatment of Maracyn 2. I've been doing water changes every couple weeks (last one before this was June 30) and I thought my nitrate levels were only at 20 ppm according to one test kit I have, but when I used a different test strip they read about 60 which is no good. Other levels are okay. I picked up some stuff that reduces nitrate levels in the aquarium and decided to try that, but I know that the best way to deal with nitrates is to do water changes. I am wondering if it's okay to conduct water changes during the use of Maracyn 2? The directions say that water changes are not necessary if readings are in ideal range, but would this affect the efficacy of treatment if I were to conduct water changes every day or two till the problem clears? Oh, if this makes any difference, I use a gravel vacuum every time I do the water change. BTW has anyone ever used this stuff called "melafix"? It contains melaluca (i think that's a plant??) and is supposed to help with diseases. Thanks! Emily

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13048	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/9/2005
Subject: Re: can I do water changes with Maracyn 2? (nasty case of fin rot)

I use Melafix with every addition of fish or if I am having problems. Besides helping the fish out, it makes the water smell great. I have seen a lot of folks recommend it over antibiotic treatment as it doesn't nuke you bio filters. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Emily Tenczar Sent: Saturday, July 09, 2005 6:57 PM To: Freshwater Aquariums; UniQuaria; AquaticLife Subject: [AquaticLife] can I do water changes with Maracyn 2? (nasty case of fin rot) So yesterday I was at my boyfriend's house (where I keep my 55 gal in which live 4 goldfish, 1 bullhead and snails) and noticed that my blue oranda goldfish has a nasty case of fin and tail rot. I mean she looks really awful. I was quite alarmed because it happened suddenly; the last time I was there she looked fine. I promptly did a 30% water change, added some salt to help with the disease, a bit of stress zyme, some stress coat to protect the fins, and started a treatment of Maracyn 2. I've been doing water changes every couple weeks (last one before this was June 30) and I thought my nitrate levels were only at 20 ppm according to one test kit I have, but when I used a different test strip they read about 60 which is no good. Other levels are okay. I picked up some stuff that reduces nitrate levels in the aquarium and decided to try that, but I know that the best way to deal with nitrates is to do water changes. I am wondering if it's okay to conduct water changes during the use of Maracyn 2? The directions say that water changes are not necessary if readings are in ideal range, but would this affect the efficacy of treatment if I were to conduct water changes every day or two till the problem clears? Oh, if this makes any difference, I use a gravel vacuum every time I do the water change. BTW has anyone ever used this stuff called "melafix"? It contains melaluca (i think that's a plant??) and is supposed to help with diseases. Thanks! Emily ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13049	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/9/2005
Subject: Re: (nasty case of fin rot).

60ppm is not ideal.. Do a few more water changes on your tank. I'd get the nitrates under control before starting a treatment plan. Your 60ppm needs to be taken care of through water changes. The stress of high nitrates plus medication will do more harm then good my opinion If you can remove your fish to another tank for treatment , it would be advisable. Why medicate all the fish for something only one fish has? It would be like giving everyone in your house asprin because you have a headache.... :-) Melafix: Treats ulcers and open wounds. Rapidly repairs damaged fins. Treats fin rot and tail rot. Use when introducing new fish. Safe for aquatic plants. Will not affect the biological filter - do remove the activated carbon in filters A lot of people use Melafix rob Indiana USA In a message dated 7/9/2005 6:57:38 PM US Eastern Standard Time, bababanana@... writes: > > I am wondering if it's okay to conduct water changes > during the use of Maracyn 2? The directions say that > water changes are not necessary if readings are in > ideal range, but would this affect the efficacy of > treatment if I were to conduct water changes every day > or two till the problem clears? > > Oh, if this makes any difference, I use a gravel > vacuum every time I do the water change. > > BTW has anyone ever used this stuff called "melafix"? > It contains melaluca (i think that's a plant??) and is > supposed to help with diseases. > > Thanks! > Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13050	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/9/2005
Subject: questions on hardness

Is it normal for your GH and KH reading to be the same? I believe that they are both measuring the hardness, but my values have been the same for the past two days. Friday the GH was 11 and the KH was 11. Today the GH is 10 and the KH is 10. Is it normal for the hardness to go down that much in a 24 hour period? I do have four pieces of wood in my tank. How will this affect the way I do water changes? Linda 150 water freshwater [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13051	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/9/2005
Subject: Re: feeding plecos

i just put some lettuce in the tank that the plec devoured! Nan <ntalb00@...> wrote:Since my plecos keep my tanks very clean, I tend to take a cucumber and slice it in half, then cut the half lengthways in half, stick some plant weights thru the bottom to hold it down and after rinseing it in aquarium water, I drop it in. I do this 2 or 3 times per week and they love it. Just a thought. Nan Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: As I have several fish that eat algae, I drop a few of them across the tank and hope for the best. From what I was reading, if they are feeding during the day, they are not getting enough. I am not sure if that is true or not since I don;t think I have ever seen a pleco not eat ;-) Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Wednesday, July 06, 2005 10:19 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] feeding plecos I was wondering what is the best way to see that your pleco is getting enough to eat. How would one small pleco find an algae wafer in my 150 tank? Do you consistently drop the wafer in the same spot so the fish know were to find his food? Or do I rely on his fishy instincts an know that he will find his algae wafer on his own? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Mail for Mobile Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13052	From: Nan	Date: 7/9/2005
Subject: Re: (nasty case of fin rot).

Isn't Fin/Tail rot easily spread from one fish to another? Why not do a preventative on the whole tank while cleaning up the one that has it? Just curious. Nan FortWayneFish@... wrote: 60ppm is not ideal.. Do a few more water changes on your tank. I'd get the nitrates under control before starting a treatment plan. Your 60ppm needs to be taken care of through water changes. The stress of high nitrates plus medication will do more harm then good my opinion If you can remove your fish to another tank for treatment , it would be advisable. Why medicate all the fish for something only one fish has? It would be like giving everyone in your house asprin because you have a headache.... :-) Melafix: Treats ulcers and open wounds. Rapidly repairs damaged fins. Treats fin rot and tail rot. Use when introducing new fish. Safe for aquatic plants. Will not affect the biological filter - do remove the activated carbon in filters A lot of people use Melafix rob Indiana USA In a message dated 7/9/2005 6:57:38 PM US Eastern Standard Time, bababanana@... writes: > > I am wondering if it's okay to conduct water changes > during the use of Maracyn 2? The directions say that > water changes are not necessary if readings are in > ideal range, but would this affect the efficacy of > treatment if I were to conduct water changes every day > or two till the problem clears? > > Oh, if this makes any difference, I use a gravel > vacuum every time I do the water change. > > BTW has anyone ever used this stuff called "melafix"? > It contains melaluca (i think that's a plant??) and is > supposed to help with diseases. > > Thanks! > Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Find what you need with new enhanced search. Learn more. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13053	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/9/2005
Subject: Re: can I do water changes with Maracyn 2? (nasty case of fin rot)

i used melafix, along with salt dips, for the torn fins of 2 of my bettas that got into a nasty fight after one jumped the divider and it seemed to work well. it does smell a bit though and i didn't use as much as the instructions indicated, because i had been instructed by others that it's too strong for bettas in the regular doseage. Emily Tenczar <bababanana@...> wrote:So yesterday I was at my boyfriend's house (where I keep my 55 gal in which live 4 goldfish, 1 bullhead and snails) and noticed that my blue oranda goldfish has a nasty case of fin and tail rot. I mean she looks really awful. I was quite alarmed because it happened suddenly; the last time I was there she looked fine. I promptly did a 30% water change, added some salt to help with the disease, a bit of stress zyme, some stress coat to protect the fins, and started a treatment of Maracyn 2. I've been doing water changes every couple weeks (last one before this was June 30) and I thought my nitrate levels were only at 20 ppm according to one test kit I have, but when I used a different test strip they read about 60 which is no good. Other levels are okay. I picked up some stuff that reduces nitrate levels in the aquarium and decided to try that, but I know that the best way to deal with nitrates is to do water changes. I am wondering if it's okay to conduct water changes during the use of Maracyn 2? The directions say that water changes are not necessary if readings are in ideal range, but would this affect the efficacy of treatment if I were to conduct water changes every day or two till the problem clears? Oh, if this makes any difference, I use a gravel vacuum every time I do the water change. BTW has anyone ever used this stuff called "melafix"? It contains melaluca (i think that's a plant??) and is supposed to help with diseases. Thanks! Emily ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13054	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/9/2005
Subject: Re: (nasty case of fin rot).

Fin Rot is a very common disease. It is almost always caused by poor water conditions. The stress induced by poor water quality, or other factors like aggression, weakens the fish's immune system to the point where it can no longer fend off attacking bacteria. The fins will begin to shrink, appearing ragged or "bitten." Fin rot can sometimes clear itself up if water conditions improve. Nearly all antibiotics will work, namely melafix, maracide, or any other anti-biotic that says it's good for fin rot. It is contagious, but most fish are robust enough to resist it given good water conditions. Problem with treating the whole tank or all the fish is that over time the fungus/bacteria/diseases can build upa drug resistance. Then what you once used will no longer be good enough to deal with a new outbreak. Drug resistant diseases... scary........... rob Indiana [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13055	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/9/2005
Subject: Re: (nasty case of fin rot).

Yeah you're right, but I started seeing some symptoms just a bit on the other fish, so I thought I should treat them all.. Emily FortWayneFish@... wrote: Fin Rot is a very common disease. It is almost always caused by poor water conditions. The stress induced by poor water quality, or other factors like aggression, weakens the fish's immune system to the point where it can no longer fend off attacking bacteria. The fins will begin to shrink, appearing ragged or "bitten." Fin rot can sometimes clear itself up if water conditions improve. Nearly all antibiotics will work, namely melafix, maracide, or any other anti-biotic that says it's good for fin rot. It is contagious, but most fish are robust enough to resist it given good water conditions. Problem with treating the whole tank or all the fish is that over time the fungus/bacteria/diseases can build upa drug resistance. Then what you once used will no longer be good enough to deal with a new outbreak. Drug resistant diseases... scary........... rob Indiana [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13056	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 7/9/2005
Subject: Re: can I do water changes with Maracyn 2? (nasty case of fin r...

In a message dated 7/9/2005 7:57:39 PM Eastern Standard Time, bababanana@... writes: <<<I've been doing water changes every couple weeks (last one before this was June 30) and I thought my nitrate levels were only at 20 ppm according to one test kit I have, but when I used a different test strip they read about 60 which is no good. Other levels are okay. I picked up some stuff that reduces nitrate levels in the aquarium and decided to try that, but I know that the best way to deal with nitrates is to do water changes.>>> Yes, imo also the way to go with nitrates is water changes. =) With that said, I don't put much stock in tests strips. I had a lfs guy tell me tonight my parameters were all off despite the fact that I tested *everything* when I found one of my new hillstream loaches dead today. According to him my ammonia and nitrites were "climbing" -- I had them both at 0. Even his pH reading was way off (7.8 - 8.5 when I read 7.2 - 7.4 with a reagent test) I've had strips tell me 60 when my 'drop test' said under 20, so don't panic about *numbers* (especially if you're using strips) so much as concern yourself with good, clean water quality and appropriate treatment to get those fins back in shape. Vicky [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13057	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/9/2005
Subject: Re: questions on hardness

Linda, You do raise an interesting question here. I have to say that I have not seen that behavior, but I would not say that it is impossible. GH is what is known as general hardness. It measures calcium and magnesium ions dissolved in the water. When one says I have hard water, it is the GH that they should be referring to. KH is the measure of carbonate hardness or carbonate ions. This measurement is important in relation to pH. When people speak of breaking the buffer and causing pH to crash, this is the buffer. To make things even more confusing, this measurement is a measurement of alkalinity, which is different from the term when used in describing a water of high pH to be alkaline. A high pH does not mean that you have high alkalinity, or KH. Actually, if you are using carbon dioxide to make an environment more to your plants liking, you are liable to be lowering your pH with the addition of carbonate ions from the carbon dioxide. Fun stuff, isn't it? Now, on to your question. Without a track record, this is something that is hard to judge. I variation of 1 degree may be within the margin of error of your test kit. You may well find a measurement that is similar to your earlier measurements, by showing a higher reading. It may not. Is this something you need to worry about. Well, the really definitive answer is: maybe. Just maintain your normal schedule of maintenance for now, while tracking your testing. If it does look like you are having a continuous drop there are two things you need to do. First would be a water change, which would hopefully put your tank back on track to normal, according to the history of the tank, and, second, you need to determine what is causing the problem. You noted that you have four pieces of wood in your tank. Is one or more of those pieces a new addition? This may be the source, and you may need to remove it and let it soak, with water changes, until it finishes leaching what ever it is leaching to cause the change in your water chemistry. If these pieces of wood have been there, like forever, then we would need to locate another possible cause. I don't know if you are keeping a log of your tank, things like water temperature, pH, whatever other tests you run, when you make changes or additions to the tank, etc. If you are not, this may be a good time to start, so you don't need to rely on your memory. While it is good to be religious about such a log, I'll be the first to admit that I am not very religious about it, but I do try to record at least major changes, rather than depend on my memory. Such a log can be helpful when trying to track down a problem as it can point you rapidly to possible causes, and when the problem may have actually started, which is often prior to your realizing that you have a problem. So, stay cool, but keep an eye on things. There may be a time when you need to panic, if you really feel the need, but let's save all that energy for other things right now <g>. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Saturday, July 09, 2005 9:44 PM To: mnaquarium@yahoogroups.com; AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] questions on hardness Is it normal for your GH and KH reading to be the same? I believe that they are both measuring the hardness, but my values have been the same for the past two days. Friday the GH was 11 and the KH was 11. Today the GH is 10 and the KH is 10. Is it normal for the hardness to go down that much in a 24 hour period? I do have four pieces of wood in my tank. How will this affect the way I do water changes? Linda 150 water freshwater [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13058	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/9/2005
Subject: hardness

Thanks Steve! The tank has only been set up for a week and a half. I have two different types of wood, the one big piece is malaysian (the kind that sinks) and the others are the gnarly african wood that sinks. Is there a number I should be watching out for (hardness below 8, 7, 6? Yes, I started a log yesterday. I wish I would have started it sooner. I have been keeping fish on and off for the past 30 years, but I have never had a tank this big before, and I have never kept live plants. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13059	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/9/2005
Subject: cotton mouth

OK, now I am having another problem. A couple of the rummy nose tetras that my husband brought home have white lips. It is not fluffy. It looks like they dipped their lips in powdered sugar. The three fish books that I have don't even mention cotton mouth in the index. Is it possible, that being in a new tank that they ran into something? Poop. I really don't want to loose these fish. I have never had rummy nose tetras and I really like them a lot. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13060	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Crawdaddies, Crawdads, Crawfish, Crayfish, Yabbies

What ever you wish to call those crustaceans that look like little lobsters. There has been some discussion here about keeping such critters in the aquarium. I would like to point those who have an interest in keeping said critters to the July 2005 issue of Aquarium Fish Magazine where an article is presented on their care and feeding and breeding. The author, however, minimizes the danger of crawfish to fish that may be kept in the same aquarium. While I have kept crawfish in an aquarium with fish before, the fish were large enough for the crawfish to ignore, and, in fact, the fish were more of a danger to the crawfish than the other way around. Despite this minimizing of danger, and the lack of any good steaming and dip recipes, which our Louisiana friends may miss, it is a very good article. \\Steve// "Puritanism: The haunting fear that someone, somewhere may be happy." -- H. L. Mencken

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13061	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Aquarium Photography

There have been a few posts concerning the photographing of your fish and aquariums in the last week or so. This is a very interesting topic, and large enough where it cannot be contained in just one post. However, I will attempt to give those who have an interest a few tips. Lighting is crucial to getting a good photograph of your tank and/or fish. The problem most people see in their attempts is the glare of the flash off the glass of the tank. You can minimize this effect by taking the photo from an angle, so that when your camera flash hits the tank, the glare does not bounce back to the camera, but goes off in another direction. In many cases, however, this is till not satisfactory. What you really need to do is to light the tank from another source, and turn off your camera flash. If you have some flood lights available to you, you can set those up to light the tank from above and off to the side. If you can place the lights on stands, or they have stands, place the stands at a 45 degree or great angle from each side of the front of the tank, and raise them so that they point down into the tank. Photo strobes also work very well in this case, and they are synchronized with the shutter. If you have these, you probably don't need to read this at all <g>.This poorly drawn ASCII diagram below should give you a visual idea of the way to light the tank. ____________ | | | tank | |___________| / \ / \ / \ O camera O light light You will probably want the camera even with the lights, or in front of the lights, toward the aquarium, to get your full tank shot. If you still see a reflection in the glass, adjust the lights until the reflection of the lights disappears. Getting a good photograph of an individual fish raises the stakes. It is more difficult to do this than to get the full or partial tank shot. You can use the same basic light setup as shown above, or, light the tank from the top by removing part of the cover (or all of it, depending on your setup) and suspending a light from over the tank. Again, you do not wish to use a built-in flash for this photo. Placement of the camera will depend on the lens you have, and the size of the fish you wish to photograph. You are going to want the fish to fill the frame of the camera, and not disappear in the frame or have the head or tail missing from the frame. It takes practice--lots of practice. In the days before digital cameras, a lot of film was wasted in getting the shot you wanted. Once you have the camera in place, and focused on a specific area of the tank, you need to have patience. Lots of patience is needed waiting for the desired fish to move into range of the camera. Then, you need fast reflexes to trip the shutter at the proper time. Trying to move the camera to follow the fish is a self defeating action, since you need to constantly refocus to get a picture that is worthy. This is why many tricks have been developed to get the shot. There are tanks known as photo tanks that are small tanks, and without much width. Then there is the use of glass to bring the desired fish into the foreground and minimize its movements to make it easier to get the shot. Other props have been developed as well. Other items that are useful in getting the shot are a tripod for the camera, or another stable object to set the camera on, a shutter wire--a contraption that plugs into the camera and is used in place of the shutter button on the camera--and a macro lens. The tripod is probably the most important. It keeps the camera in a fixed position, and steady. Try holding your camera in the same position without moving for a minute. Pretty difficult, isn't it? Now imagine holding it in position for five minutes or more waiting for that stupid fish to swim into view. I think you are getting the idea now. A table or other such object to set the camera on will do as an OK substitution, but without the trip wire, you risk moving the camera as you rush to get the shot by pressing the shutter button on the camera. A macro lens allows one to get very close to the tank, and fish, and still be able to focus on the fish. Today's digital cameras can focus down to a relatively short distance, and may be sufficient for many people. However, with a 35 mm film camera, you do need a special lens that has this capability. I know that several zoom lenses for 35 mm cameras have this capability, and it too should be sufficient. However, if you get really good at the taking of fish photos, you may wish to invest in better equipment. Strobe flashes are a nice adjunct, also. I've got a neat one that goes with my digital camera that does not need to be attached to the camera, but gets the signal from the camera wirelessly to fire. For my 35 mm camera, it needs to be attached via a wire. You really don't need a lot of fancy equipment to get decent photos of your fish. Just remember light comes from an angle and/or the top, keep the camera in a stationary position, and wait for the fish. Oh yes, doing a quick read of this post before sending, I see I've neglected to mention background. Black seems to show most fish off to best advantage. There are many ways to achieve this, the simplest is to place a black background behind the tank, but it can also be achieved with careful use of lighting, f-stop, and focusing, which reduces the depth of field of what the camera sees. Then there are plants, a great deal easier to photograph, since you only need to focus on the plant, and don't need to wait for it to move into camera range <g>. All of the other stuff does apply, though. When you start setting things up to take photos of your tank and fish, also bring along a notebook, so you can take notes about how you set things up, and the settings you use. You will need to do a bit of experimenting, and once you hit the right combination, be sure to mark it down so you can repeat it, but continue to take notes on what works and what does not. If it works for your tank, it may work for a friend's tank, but may need a bit of tweaking to account for differences between things like the tank itself, what is in the tank, the background of the tank and the room, etc. Have fun with it, and remember, for each good shot, you may have 30 or more shots that are not good. \\Steve// "Puritanism: The haunting fear that someone, somewhere may be happy." -- H. L. Mencken

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13062	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Re: hardness

What is the hardness of your water coming out of the tap? Measure it right out of the tap, then again after it has been sitting for 24 hours, as the carbonate hardness number may change as CO2 is gassed off. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Sunday, July 10, 2005 12:45 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] hardness Thanks Steve! The tank has only been set up for a week and a half. I have two different types of wood, the one big piece is malaysian (the kind that sinks) and the others are the gnarly african wood that sinks. Is there a number I should be watching out for (hardness below 8, 7, 6? Yes, I started a log yesterday. I wish I would have started it sooner. I have been keeping fish on and off for the past 30 years, but I have never had a tank this big before, and I have never kept live plants. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13063	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Re: cotton mouth

It could be the start of mouth fungus. Look up mouth fungus. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Sunday, July 10, 2005 12:48 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] cotton mouth OK, now I am having another problem. A couple of the rummy nose tetras that my husband brought home have white lips. It is not fluffy. It looks like they dipped their lips in powdered sugar. The three fish books that I have don't even mention cotton mouth in the index. Is it possible, that being in a new tank that they ran into something? Poop. I really don't want to loose these fish. I have never had rummy nose tetras and I really like them a lot. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13064	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Nitrate (Long post)

There does seem to be a lot of unnecessary concern of nitrate levels expressed by people on this list for relatively low levels of nitrate. Nitrate is the end product of the ammonia cycle that occurs in every tank. There is no easy way to naturally remove nitrate without the use of a setup that uses anaerobic bacteria to reduce nitrate to its components. The usual method of deal with nitrate is water changes and the addition of live plants (which includes algal growth). At what level should one really become concerned about the level of nitrates in the aquarium. A level of 1000 ppm is definitely a concern, since everything dies. So we need to go lower than that. 500 ppm is still of definite concern. Many animals and plants will die at this level also, but some will live, though not well, as they will be subject to long-term effects of nitrate, such as hole-in-head disease and the erosion of the lateral line. Some plants also will not survive this level of nitrates. At 200 ppm, the effects of nitrate will be more long term than immediate. Again, we would be looking at such things as later line disease and hole-in-head as a result. Going lower will help reduce the effects. At 150 ppm, again, the effects are long term. Going even lower, long term effects are still present. Ideally, one would wish to reduce nitrate levels to less than 20 ppm, but immediate action is not called for until you reach a number of more than 150 ppm. (please do note that figures for a marine aquarium are very much different, and action is called for when nitrate is measured in the single digits of ppm. In a marine environment, it is possible to reduce nitrates to immeasurable levels through the use of foam fractioners, which do not work well in fresh water.) So, you notice that your nitrates are rising, or at a high level. One can simply panic and do immediate large water changes to reduce the level of nitrates. However, doing this fails to discover and remedy the core cause of the high level of nitrates. Unless you are getting reading over 150 ppm of nitrate, you do have some time to do investigative work to discover and remedy the cause of the nitrates, while your regular water changes should help you reduce the level. Where does nitrate come from? Nitrate is the end product of the ammonia cycle as we follow it in the aquarium. Ammonia is produced as a waste product by the animals you have living in your tank. It can also be produced by dead and decaying animals and plants as well as food added to the aquarium. If you are using fertilizer for your plants, this may also be a source of ammonia. You need to reduce the sources of ammonia. Feeding less will help reduce the level. Most of us feed our fish too well. A day of fasting may help the health of your fish, as well as reducing the amount fed each day. (Raising fry is a whole other ball of wax, which I will not be covering here, but to get quick growth you do want to ensure they are well fed.) If there is left over food when you are feeding, you will need to reduce the amount of food you give to your fish, until there is no left-overs in the tank. Until this is remedied, you will want to wait a while after feeding the fish, then siphon off the left-overs. If you are fertilizing your live plants, you will want to reduce or stop the fertilization of the plants or start adding only the trace elements your plants may need for good growth and avoid a fertilizer that contain nitrogenous products. Also look for and remove any dead materials from your aquarium. Likely, if this is a fish, you'll do it rather rapidly. If it is plant material, then you will need to, perhaps, do this on a daily basis. Algae poses a particular problem. Removal of algae will reduce the capacity of your aquarium to remove nitrates, but then, it is also difficult to know when to remove it because it may be dead or simply another form of algae. It may be best to follow your aesthetic sense and remove what does not appeal to you, and remove any that is not green. Those of you that have snails in your aquarium are faced with a sometimes difficult decision--is the snail dead or is it alive? Tough to tell sometimes. However, if you have a nitrate problem, it may be well to take the conservative course of action and remove any snails you have doubts about, either to dispose of or to place in another environment. Throughout this entire process, you will need to keep an eye on the progress you are making. Go back to daily testing of your ammonia, nitrite and nitrate levels. Also test your tap water, which could be another source of nitrates in your aquarium. The EPA has a regulation that states that drinking water should not contain more than 10 ppm of nitrate. However, from reports of aquarists around the country, not all water companies are meeting this requirement. Also, if you are using well water, your nitrates may be high, especially when the aquifer is in agricultural parts of the country. (Our well fertilized lawns and gardens can also have an effect on the nitrate level of aquifers, but most research has pointed to agriculture as a large culprit.) If your water is starting with unacceptable levels of nitrate, you will need to look into means to reduce the nitrate before the water reaches the aquarium. This is usually done with chemical adsorption products. If your nitrate level still does not lower after doing all this, you will need to look at some other aspects of your aquarium. I have mentioned live plants in this discussion, but I am aware that not all people utilize live plants in their aquariums. There may be practical reasons for this, like the vegetarian habits of your fish prevent the growth of plant s to any great extent, and may reduce the number of plants you have, your fish may be diggers that uproot plants, etc. Your tank may simply be overcrowded with fish, and be overloading the biological processes that would normally handle such situations. In the former situation, you may want to utilize the marine idea of a refugarium, where there is a separate tank that water flows through that has plants to pull out the "bad stuff" from the water, with water from the main tank run through the filtration system into the refugarium and back into the main tank. You may also wish to investigate plants that may be immune to the predation of your fish. As for overcrowding, well, you simply need to reduce the numbers of fish that are present in the tank. You may set up more aquariums to house them or give them to friends who would like them. You may even be able to bring them back to you LFS for credit. Another source may be a decoration that has recently been added to your tank that is leaching substances into your water as it 'cures' in your tank. Removal of this object will show a quick and drastic reduction with your next water change. Should this be the case, you'll need to either cure the item outside the tank, or do without inside the tank. Also, not usual, but, perhaps not as unusual as we may like to think, there may be an outside force acting upon the tank, like something some one has added to the tank without your knowledge. One of the kids could have put something in the tank without your knowledge (and you may never know if the youngin' expects they'll get a punishment for admitting it) or an adult at a party may have added something just o see what the fish will do. This kind of thing can be the devil to track down, and the influence will abate with time. What ever you need to do, don't panic. Take things slowly and try to identify the cause of the problem. Your fish will allow you time to fix things. Should you be keeping marine fish, well, as I mentioned earlier, we are in a whole other ballpark there, and you may need to take more rapid action to avoid losing animals. Marine animals have less a tolerance for nitrate than freshwater do, and I would advise you to find a guru near you that can be of assistance (I'm not a marine person, nor do I play one on TV, and do not claim to have any special knowledge of marine topics.) Don't buy into any 'magic' cures for what ails your tank. They may do more harm than good. Thank you for your patience reading this long, and somewhat involved post. \\Steve// "Puritanism: The haunting fear that someone, somewhere may be happy." -- H. L. Mencken

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13065	From: Nan	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Re: (nasty case of fin rot).

Thanks, Rob. I see what you mean now. Nan FortWayneFish@... wrote: Fin Rot is a very common disease. It is almost always caused by poor water conditions. The stress induced by poor water quality, or other factors like aggression, weakens the fish's immune system to the point where it can no longer fend off attacking bacteria. The fins will begin to shrink, appearing ragged or "bitten." Fin rot can sometimes clear itself up if water conditions improve. Nearly all antibiotics will work, namely melafix, maracide, or any other anti-biotic that says it's good for fin rot. It is contagious, but most fish are robust enough to resist it given good water conditions. Problem with treating the whole tank or all the fish is that over time the fungus/bacteria/diseases can build upa drug resistance. Then what you once used will no longer be good enough to deal with a new outbreak. Drug resistant diseases... scary........... rob Indiana [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Sell on Yahoo! Auctions - No fees. Bid on great items. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13066	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Re: Crawdaddies, etc.

I don't know about steaming and dipping.. that sounds like something you would do with Lobsters. We just boil 'em by the sack full in giant pots of spicy hot crawfish boil along with some small potatoes, corn-on-the-cob, sausage, mushrooms, onions, etc., added in for extras. Yep.. AFM sure failed to mention how you're supposed to pinch the tails and suck the heads! At least, that's what we do with them critters down here in New Orleans. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: 19 Date: Sun, 10 Jul 2005 06:48:17 -0400 From: "Steve Szabo" <steve@...> Subject: Crawdaddies, Crawdads, Crawfish, Crayfish, Yabbies Despite this minimizing of danger, and the lack of any good steaming and dip recipes, which our Louisiana friends may miss, it is a very good article. \\Steve// [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13067	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Re: Cotton mouth

That ain't powdered sugar! Those must be Columbian rummy nose tetras... them darn coke heads! :-D Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: 18 Date: Sun, 10 Jul 2005 00:48:03 EDT From: Crazy4fids@... Subject: cotton mouth OK, now I am having another problem. A couple of the rummy nose tetras that my husband brought home have white lips. It is not fluffy. It looks like they dipped their lips in powdered sugar. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13068	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Re: Cotton mouth

LOL :-) In a message dated 7/10/2005 1:33:42 PM US Eastern Standard Time, lnvtm1@... writes: > That ain't powdered sugar! > > Those must be Columbian rummy nose tetras... them darn coke heads! > > :-D [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13069	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Re: Crawdaddies, etc.

Stop it...you are making me hungry hehehehe I rarely get to enjoy a good crawfish boil up here in Chicago. I lived in Lake Charles, LA for 8 years and got hooked :-D I do have to say that I have thought about filling a tank with crawfish for later boiling *weg* Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Lenny Vasbinder Sent: Sunday, July 10, 2005 1:10 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Crawdaddies, etc. I don't know about steaming and dipping.. that sounds like something you would do with Lobsters. We just boil 'em by the sack full in giant pots of spicy hot crawfish boil along with some small potatoes, corn-on-the-cob, sausage, mushrooms, onions, etc., added in for extras. Yep.. AFM sure failed to mention how you're supposed to pinch the tails and suck the heads! At least, that's what we do with them critters down here in New Orleans. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: 19 Date: Sun, 10 Jul 2005 06:48:17 -0400 From: "Steve Szabo" <steve@...> Subject: Crawdaddies, Crawdads, Crawfish, Crayfish, Yabbies Despite this minimizing of danger, and the lack of any good steaming and dip recipes, which our Louisiana friends may miss, it is a very good article. \\Steve// [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13070	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Re: hardness

I know that the hardness directly out of the tap is 16. I will have to take a sample and let it sit. I leave the cover off, right? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13071	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate (Long post)

Wow! that was wealth of information Steve! Thanks for the knowledge. I think I will save that one to my filing cabinet. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13072	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Algae/ Water Color?

Our tank is about 3 yards away from our back doors in the living room. They are sliding glass doors and not covered so there is constant light. I rarely turn on the aquarium light for fear of too much and algae growth. Because of the location, I keep a close eye on the water color and I swear it's beginning to get a tint of green, like a teal almost. It's very light but it's there. Two questions: Is this too close to the doors or is OK with minimal aquarium lighting? And what color is aquarium water usually? I know it isn't going to be perfectly clear, but with what tint? Thanks, Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13073	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Water Color * Picture

You can see the color under the Blood Parrots album. It's the last photo. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13074	From: paul helms	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Re: Algae/ Water Color?

usually a healthy tank is perfectly clear. if you do use your lights a bit it may clear up the tank....i know it sounds odd, but i have seen it work many times. you can also put on backing to block light from the sliders. i would not be too concerned about the light being that close to the doors, but temp shifts could be a problem. if you do not have dual payne windows i would refcomend another location. --- Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: > Our tank is about 3 yards away from our back doors > in the living room. > They are sliding glass doors and not covered so > there is constant light. > I rarely turn on the aquarium light for fear of too > much and algae > growth. Because of the location, I keep a close eye > on the water color > and I swear it's beginning to get a tint of green, > like a teal almost. > It's very light but it's there. > Two questions: Is this too close to the doors or is > OK with minimal > aquarium lighting? > And what color is aquarium water usually? I know it > isn't going to be > perfectly clear, but with what tint? > > Thanks, > Leslie > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13075	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Re: Algae/ Water Color?

Any natural light is going to effect your fish tank in one way or another. Your green water sounds like a minor algae bloom, try getting some floating plants or possibly blocking part of the sun one way or another. Algae needs 2 things to thrive. Light and nutrients. limiting indirect light and being careful to not over feed your fish should help keep the tank looking clear. just keep ontop of your water changes like you should be doing anyway and if the algae starts growing onm the walls where it gets sunlight invest in a couple bristlenose catfish LOL * NONE of my tanks are clear excpet the African Mbuna tank and it recieves 4 times the regular filtration and indirect flourescent lighting. rob Indiana In a message dated 7/10/2005 6:54:18 PM US Eastern Standard Time, wtfmorlok@... writes: usually a healthy tank is perfectly clear. if you do use your lights a bit it may clear up the tank....i know it sounds odd, but i have seen it work many times. you can also put on backing to block light from the sliders. i would not be too concerned about the light being that close to the doors, but temp shifts could be a problem. if you do not have dual payne windows i would refcomend another location. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13076	From: paul helms	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Re: Lazy cleaner shrimp??

the fire shrimp are not really much of cleaners. while many saltwater shrimp will clean, mostonly do it as a last resort for food sources. your typical cleaner shrimp is the most enthusiastic. it is red with a white stripe, and sometimes has a gold/yellow side as well. fire shrimp tend to be a bit reclusive and come out at feeding and in the dark. peppermint shrimp will also clean fish when there is no aiptasia for them to eat. the fires are great ornamental shrimp buit pretty much useless as far as cleaners. so all in all it is normal behavior for the shrimp that you have --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@...> wrote: > I was wondering if anyone heard of something as a > lazy cleaner shrimp? > I am asking cause mine (blood red fire shrimp - 2 > and a half years in > the tank) doesnt seem to like fish bothering him too > much about > cleaning them...lol.. he even gets poked from time > to time and then he > makes an "effort" for some seconds to clean the > fish. Does anyone know > why is this kind of behaviour? I thought they were > really intusiastic > cleaners... > > sandra > > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13077	From: paul helms	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

i see your point and take it as well. i apologize if i have offended you or any others caught in the crossfire, but i must say that by newbie i mean a person new to sw aquaria, not posting; and also that this was not an opinion issue, but someone who was not on target and could have caused problems for the one seeking help. --- Evita <evitabug@...> wrote: > I know intentions were good but it got out of > hand...name calling and what not not needed. One > calm friendly post and be done with it. Arguing > doesn't help. Usually I take in all posts along > with other net sources and my books to get the full > picture. New-bies are new but not stupid. It is > more of a turn off to new members to see loads of > angry type posts than differences of opinons. Some > new people, might be to the group but not to the > hobby. They could become afraid to post for fear of > saying the wrong thing. Then some groups can die > from lack of participation. Although I am new to > this group I belong to several different types of > groups as well as the owner of one art-painting > group and I always try to make people feel welcome > and safe when posting. That to me is the purpose of > groups. To exchange ideas. My pet groups and art > groups are my favorite ones due to the shared > interests and passions. Also I must add I have a > great love for people not just animals. Evita > > paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote:ya know, it > is pathetic that people just post whatever > they want to, without regards to thought and it > leads > to this. plain and simple all i wanted was for > people > to know what they are talking abut before they post > something drastic to a newbie telling them that a > fish > everyone else is recommending is a fish eater and > toxic and gets huge. it is that simple. > --- Evita <evitabug@...> wrote: > > > I haven't been in this line of posts but it kinda > > reminds me of my kids.....they all have to get in > > the last word. We wonder how and why awful > things > > happen in the world and how people can get so mad > > ..... then people fight over stuff like this. Go > > figure? This is getting more back and forth hits > > than someone asking for help about a sick and > dying > > fish. The adult thing would to everyone to say > > sorry and forgive and stop the name calling and > get > > back on the topic of helping each other and our > love > > for the hobby. I thought having aquariums was > > calming. Let's just take a minute and go look at > > ours. Now I will say sorry if I offended anyone. > > But ....Evita > > > > paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: no one was > > talking to you > > .....and if i am such an ass why have i had so > many > > thank yous?...anyway that is rhetorical. don't > care > > what you have to say anyway. peace out > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@...> wrote: > > > > > Very interesting! You say it but dont know it... > > > > > > Several people told me that you have been acting > > > like one for quiet > > > some time already :) > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > wrote: > > > > interesting how someppl show up act like an > ass > > > and > > > > leave huh? > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Nan <ntalb00@y...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Catfight??? > > > > > > > > > > Everyone makes mistakes, let it go and move > > > on....:) > > > > > > > > > > Nan > > > > > > > > > > Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > > > > yup, just like titanic... > > > > > > > > > > Other than you, most people on here seem to > > have > > > a > > > > > LIFE and don´t > > > > > have time to post bs all day long, so maybe > > you > > > > > should write the > > > > > president if he let´s everyone know not to > > call > > > the > > > > > lionfish > > > > > firefish for whatever reason the voices in > > your > > > head > > > > > say so! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul > helms > > > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > my boat is not the one half sunk...it is > the > > > one > > > > > with > > > > > > a good compass, map and plenty of gas. > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > ilmao... whatever floats your boat ... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul > > > helms > > > > > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > applauds what? you are still wrong. > > even > > > the > > > > > guy > > > > > > > with > > > > > > > > 50 years in the hobby says he never > > heard > > > of > > > > > it > > > > > > > called > > > > > > > > a lionfish. just because he has the > > time > > > to > > > > > go to > > > > > > > 20 > > > > > > > > web searches to find others calling > them > > > the > > > > > wrong > > > > > > > > thing does not mean a damn thing. i > did > > > not > > > > > > > google or > > > > > > > > go to anything of teh wall. go to > > > > > > > saltwaterfish.com > > > > > > > > and there will be a section of > > firefish.. > > > > > lions > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > scorpions will not be there. flat > out, > > > make > > > > > sure > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > are talking about the same thing as > > > everyone > > > > > else > > > > > > > when > > > > > > > > you decide to tell a beginner that one > > of > > > the > > > > > few > > > > > > > fish > > > > > > > > that will actually work in the tank > they > > > have > > > > > is > > > > > > > > venemous and deadly, especially when > > > several > > > > > > > others > > > > > > > > are recommending it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@h...> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > *applauds* > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, > > > "Steve > > > > > > > Szabo" > > > > > > > > > <steve@l...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > You had said, "i did look it up > and > > > when > > > > > you > > > > > > > type > > > > > > > > > in firefish in > > > > > > > > > the web > > > > > > > > > > browser nothing comes up about > > > lionfish." > > > > > > > > > apparently in reply to > > > > > > > > > Sandra's, > === message truncated === ____________________________________________________ Sell on Yahoo! Auctions – no fees. Bid on great items. http://auctions.yahoo.com/

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13078	From: Evita	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium

No problem Paul. I wasn't offended/ It just got a little to back and forth. Evita paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote:i see your point and take it as well. i apologize if i have offended you or any others caught in the crossfire, but i must say that by newbie i mean a person new to sw aquaria, not posting; and also that this was not an opinion issue, but someone who was not on target and could have caused problems for the one seeking help. --------------------------------- Yahoo! Mail Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13079	From: Patrick	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium/mud slinging group?

Everyone is always welcome to join this group, and there will never be any moderation or banning for anything at all. :) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/aquariumdebates As for the proposal to moderate or remove Paul, that is silly. After all, you don't kill the messenger in a civilized society. Patrick [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13080	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Re: hardness

Linda, Yes, leave it open to the air, as your tank is. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Sunday, July 10, 2005 6:21 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] hardness I know that the hardness directly out of the tap is 16. I will have to take a sample and let it sit. I leave the cover off, right? Linda

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13081	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Re: hardness

Hi Steve, With all due respect, I don't follow why the hardness reading would change over a period of 24 hours, although the pH certainly will change (rise) as the CO2 is gassed off. The carbonates are locked up as a compound with the calcium, which will give a constant reading in ppm (or "degrees"), unless or until another outside factor influences a change to break that bond. The hardness will not just change overnight, nor will it change in any number of nights as far as I can determine. What is your rationale, good buddy? Regards, Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > What is the hardness of your water coming out of the tap? Measure it right > out of the tap, then again after it has been sitting for 24 hours, as the > carbonate hardness number may change as CO2 is gassed off. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Crazy4fids@a... > Sent: Sunday, July 10, 2005 12:45 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] hardness > > Thanks Steve! > > The tank has only been set up for a week and a half. I have two different > types of wood, the one big piece is malaysian (the kind that sinks) and the > > others are the gnarly african wood that sinks. > > Is there a number I should be watching out for (hardness below 8, 7, 6? > > Yes, I started a log yesterday. I wish I would have started it sooner. I > > have been keeping fish on and off for the past 30 years, but I have never > had > a tank this big before, and I have never kept live plants. > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..>< ((((:> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<: ((((><74/`7.88. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..>< ((((:> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13082	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Re: Algae/ Water Color?

Leslie, If the light is indirect light, you are probably OK, using, as you say, minimal lighting from the tank light(s). To get a good bead on the water color in your tank, take two glasses. Fill one with tap or bottled water and the other with tank water. Place them in front of a white background next to each other, and with a good light compare the two to see what the water looks like. Any clear glass will do, just so long s the glass is pretty much the same--two test tubes, two shot glasses from the same set, two juice glasses from the same set, etc. Most people will see a yellowish or brownish tint in their water. If you do have a greenish tint, you may have suspended algae, which is OK, if it doesn't get out of hand. If the tint is greenish, and it does start to get darker, you may want to start checking for nitrates in the tank, and attempt to lower them, as the algae is using that for food. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Dane & Leslie Moore Sent: Sunday, July 10, 2005 7:06 PM To: uniquaria@yahoogroups.com; AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com; naturalaquariumenthusiast@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Algae/ Water Color? Our tank is about 3 yards away from our back doors in the living room. They are sliding glass doors and not covered so there is constant light. I rarely turn on the aquarium light for fear of too much and algae growth. Because of the location, I keep a close eye on the water color and I swear it's beginning to get a tint of green, like a teal almost. It's very light but it's there. Two questions: Is this too close to the doors or is OK with minimal aquarium lighting? And what color is aquarium water usually? I know it isn't going to be perfectly clear, but with what tint? Thanks, Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13083	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Re: hardness

[I received this message privately today (see below my reply), and wrote this reply to it. It concerns my reply on the hardness issue. The reason why I am posting it publicly here is that the return address on it is invalid: (notify@yahoogroups.com [mailto:notify@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of erieberk [erieberk@...]). I also think it contains some valuable information for members of this list.] Ray, KH measures carbonate (CO3^-). Carbonate in water takes three forms, CO3^-, HCO3^- and H2CO3. There is no calcium involved. Calcium and magnesium hardness is measured by DH kits and is a different kind of hardness--the one were one might say my water is hard as a rock. Allowing the water to sit for 24 hours will allow some of this to gas off, thereby changing at least the initial pH, if not the KH measurement of the water. Linda is experiencing a drop in her KH (as well as her DH, which is probably another situation all together), so, the measurement initially is important as well as the measurement after a period of time, where the water Is not subject to changes that occur in the aquarium. She recently reported that her initial KH reading is 16 out of the tap. Her initial report said it was 11 in the tank and had dropped to 10 overnight. Based on the little we know right now, I would project that her pH and KH will drop measurably in a 24 hour time span. This water chemistry stuff is not the easiest thing to get a handle on, and, as a whole, not enough of us knows enough about it to really make a difference. If you would like a really good book on water chemistry, I can recommend Stephen Spotte's book, " Fish and Invertebrate Culture, Second Edition". However, let me warn you that you will need at least high school chemistry to start to understand what he is talking about. I've had to bring the book with me to ask my brother-in-law, the chemist (PhD) to help me understand some of the finer points (much to the chagrin of my sister--but she thinks I am a lost cause anyway). I've also had help from a water chemist, with whom I correspond infrequently, to try to understand this stuff. And I still have trouble putting together all the pieces. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: notify@yahoogroups.com [mailto:notify@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of erieberk Sent: Sunday, July 10, 2005 6:57 PM To: Steve Szabo Subject: Re: hardness Steve, With all due respect, I don't see how the hardness will change after the water sits for 24 hours. While the pH should definitely change (rise) as the CO2 is gassed off, any carbonates would be locked up as a compound with the calcium, causing whatever hardness there may be depending on how many parts per million will be found in a unit of that water. I don't believe that value will change overnight (unless another factor is introduced, breaking that bond). Regards, Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > What is the hardness of your water coming out of the tap? Measure it right > out of the tap, then again after it has been sitting for 24 hours, as the > carbonate hardness number may change as CO2 is gassed off. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Crazy4fids@a... > Sent: Sunday, July 10, 2005 12:45 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] hardness > > Thanks Steve! > > The tank has only been set up for a week and a half. I have two different > types of wood, the one big piece is malaysian (the kind that sinks) and the > > others are the gnarly african wood that sinks. > > Is there a number I should be watching out for (hardness below 8, 7, 6? > > Yes, I started a log yesterday. I wish I would have started it sooner. I > > have been keeping fish on and off for the past 30 years, but I have never > had > a tank this big before, and I have never kept live plants. > > Linda

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13084	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Re: hardness

Ray, See the reply I wrote back to another (?) Ray (erieberk@...) that I ended up posting publicly. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Sunday, July 10, 2005 9:31 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: hardness Hi Steve, With all due respect, I don't follow why the hardness reading would change over a period of 24 hours, although the pH certainly will change (rise) as the CO2 is gassed off. The carbonates are locked up as a compound with the calcium, which will give a constant reading in ppm (or "degrees"), unless or until another outside factor influences a change to break that bond. The hardness will not just change overnight, nor will it change in any number of nights as far as I can determine. What is your rationale, good buddy? Regards, Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > What is the hardness of your water coming out of the tap? Measure it right > out of the tap, then again after it has been sitting for 24 hours, as the > carbonate hardness number may change as CO2 is gassed off. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Crazy4fids@a... > Sent: Sunday, July 10, 2005 12:45 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] hardness > > Thanks Steve! > > The tank has only been set up for a week and a half. I have two different > types of wood, the one big piece is malaysian (the kind that sinks) and the > > others are the gnarly african wood that sinks. > > Is there a number I should be watching out for (hardness below 8, 7, 6? > > Yes, I started a log yesterday. I wish I would have started it sooner. I > > have been keeping fish on and off for the past 30 years, but I have never > had > a tank this big before, and I have never kept live plants. > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..>< ((((:> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<: ((((><74/`7.88. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..>< ((((:> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13085	From: paul helms	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium/mud slinging group?

was someone actually saying to remove me pat? if so i did not catch that, and i would love for that person to e mail personally as i would have a few choice words for them. how are things btw pat? i have not heard from you since it was suggested that you and i be in a museum in the future! lol --- Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: > Everyone is always welcome to join this group, and > there will never be any > moderation or banning for anything at all. :) > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/aquariumdebates > > As for the proposal to moderate or remove Paul, that > is silly. After all, > you don't kill the messenger in a civilized society. > > > > Patrick > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ____________________________________________________ Sell on Yahoo! Auctions – no fees. Bid on great items. http://auctions.yahoo.com/

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13086	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 7/10/2005
Subject: Re: setting up a new salt water aquarium/mud slinging group?

Hi Patrick, The moderation or banning was originally your suggestion!! regards, unclenorm. --- Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: > Everyone is always welcome to join this group, and > there will never be any > moderation or banning for anything at all. :) > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/aquariumdebates > > As for the proposal to moderate or remove Paul, that > is silly. After all, > you don't kill the messenger in a civilized society. > > > > Patrick > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ___________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13087	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Lascerated eye or something? in black moor >:(

In the middle of trying to fix my nitrate and fin rot problem, my black moor decided to go and injure her eye during the night (saturday night). A bit of skin was scraped off. Well as of tonight, the eye looks worse and it almost looks as if the whole layer of skin has slid out of place and bunched up, leaving her with something like an imploded looking eye. Are you following me still? I can't explain but it looks BAD. I'm already treating the tank with M2 so hopefully that prevents infection, but I'm not sure that there's anything else I can really do since any kind of handling would only make things worse (this is what sucks about fish...if your dog or cat or rat gets a cut you can just stitch and bandage them up!) There isn't anything in the tank that she could have gotten stuck in. For the record, this fish has a history of eye problems and is not very smart. The last injury was when she got a long strand of algae wrapped around her eye. It healed fine but should I be worried that she's going to lose the eye now and this will kill her???? Thanks Emily

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13088	From: Evita	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Re: hardness

Thanks for posting it Steve .....I think I'll keep it reading it several times when I get the time. The problem for me right now is I just don't understand a heck of a lot it was trying to say. This water thing is complicated to say the least. The one thing I have learned though is know your fish and their behavior. I think the one biggest mistake new-bies make is setting up a beautiful tank and thinking that's it....walking away thinking this is a easy way to decorate a room. From the various posts I have read I have learned a lot. One thing I do know is this is a "SCIENCE" in itself. My husband just doesn't understand this at all. He thinks I am nuts wanting to learn all I can to help make the environment the best I can for several tiny little nothing fish as he calls them. I may not know the whats and whys right now but I know when my fish are not acting normal. I can tell if they seem unhappy with their environment. I do know now why water changes are necessary. As well as keeping an eye out for little minor changes in the look of my fish. For that I can thank my fish groups and people like you. The other day my daughters friend called her and told her she got a fish...."a Gourami" the other day and by morning it was dead. I found myself asking all sorts of questions you would have asked me in the beginning....what size tank did she have, where did she get the fish, what kind of filter...etc...I wonder if she had just got the fish as an impulse and dropped it in an un-cycled tank and shocked it's system with the wrong temp. as well. My daughter told her we had babies and we could give her some. I told my daughter I would have to know more about her set up before considering her tank for any of my baby fry and I also wanted them to grow a tad bit more before moving them to another environments. The point being? They are thriving now, growing and blooming in color. I don't want to give them to just anyone and then they end up dead over night. Bottom line even I seem to know more in a month than some people do. So Knowledge is a good thing. These groups and people like you with more experience as not only passing on your experiences but actually helping others not only enjoy the experience of fish keeping more but saving the lives of many fish is the process. Thanks again! Oh I added some zucchini to my tanks yesterday and the fry went nutty over it. In a matter of a minute they all crowded around it. I was amazed. It was like a kid hearing the music of the ice-cream truck coming down the street as a kid. They seemed to know it was something good to eat. Evita Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: [I received this message privately today (see below my reply), and wrote this reply to it. It concerns my reply on the hardness issue. The reason why I am posting it publicly here is that the return address on it is invalid: (notify@yahoogroups.com [mailto:notify@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of erieberk [erieberk@...]). I also think it contains some valuable information for members of this list.] Ray, KH measures carbonate (CO3^-). Carbonate in water takes three forms, CO3^-, HCO3^- and H2CO3. There is no calcium involved. Calcium and magnesium hardness is measured by DH kits and is a different kind of hardness--the one were one might say my water is hard as a rock. Allowing the water to sit for 24 hours will allow some of this to gas off, thereby changing at least the initial pH, if not the KH measurement of the water. Linda is experiencing a drop in her KH (as well as her DH, which is probably another situation all together), so, the measurement initially is important as well as the measurement after a period of time, where the water Is not subject to changes that occur in the aquarium. She recently reported that her initial KH reading is 16 out of the tap. Her initial report said it was 11 in the tank and had dropped to 10 overnight. Based on the little we know right now, I would project that her pH and KH will drop measurably in a 24 hour time span. This water chemistry stuff is not the easiest thing to get a handle on, and, as a whole, not enough of us knows enough about it to really make a difference. If you would like a really good book on water chemistry, I can recommend Stephen Spotte's book, " Fish and Invertebrate Culture, Second Edition". However, let me warn you that you will need at least high school chemistry to start to understand what he is talking about. I've had to bring the book with me to ask my brother-in-law, the chemist (PhD) to help me understand some of the finer points (much to the chagrin of my sister--but she thinks I am a lost cause anyway). I've also had help from a water chemist, with whom I correspond infrequently, to try to understand this stuff. And I still have trouble putting together all the pieces. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: notify@yahoogroups.com [mailto:notify@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of erieberk Sent: Sunday, July 10, 2005 6:57 PM To: Steve Szabo Subject: Re: hardness Steve, With all due respect, I don't see how the hardness will change after the water sits for 24 hours. While the pH should definitely change (rise) as the CO2 is gassed off, any carbonates would be locked up as a compound with the calcium, causing whatever hardness there may be depending on how many parts per million will be found in a unit of that water. I don't believe that value will change overnight (unless another factor is introduced, breaking that bond). Regards, Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > What is the hardness of your water coming out of the tap? Measure it right > out of the tap, then again after it has been sitting for 24 hours, as the > carbonate hardness number may change as CO2 is gassed off. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Crazy4fids@a... > Sent: Sunday, July 10, 2005 12:45 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] hardness > > Thanks Steve! > > The tank has only been set up for a week and a half. I have two different > types of wood, the one big piece is malaysian (the kind that sinks) and the > > others are the gnarly african wood that sinks. > > Is there a number I should be watching out for (hardness below 8, 7, 6? > > Yes, I started a log yesterday. I wish I would have started it sooner. I > > have been keeping fish on and off for the past 30 years, but I have never > had > a tank this big before, and I have never kept live plants. > > Linda ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Sell on Yahoo! Auctions - No fees. Bid on great items. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13089	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Re: hardness

Hi Steve, That "other" Ray was me; I was unknowingly using a different User Name (Yahoo I.D.) and password when I posted the message -- I use several sn's to break up the email load, all having a different Yahoo group listing. Somehow, this different sn displayed our Group (which it shouldn't have), so I thought I was using my usual Main/Master email address. I am amazed that it went through to the Group. Naturally, when you tried replying to me on my other email address it came up as invalid as I don't belong to this group with that email address/I.D. I was wondering why I didn't get a reply so posted again, with my proper address, which went through. Sorry about that! \ Now, to the subject at hand -- KH (temporary hardness) has little to do with the general hardness (except when combining these two values to get total hardness), but is a measure of alkalinity, or buffering capacity. This carbonate hardness is a measure of the carbonates and/or bicarbonates, whereas what we are used to recognizing as "hardness" is a measure of mostly the elements calcium and magnesium which actually harden the water, increasing the conductivity. I guess this is what initially through me off. Looking back to your previous post (to <erieberk@y...>), I would have to guess we're on the same wavelength here(?). Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > Ray, > > See the reply I wrote back to another (?) Ray (erieberk@y...) that I > ended up posting publicly. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Sunday, July 10, 2005 9:31 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: hardness > > Hi Steve, With all due respect, I don't follow why the hardness > reading would change over a period of 24 hours, although the pH > certainly will change (rise) as the CO2 is gassed off. The > carbonates are locked up as a compound with the calcium, which will > give a constant reading in ppm (or "degrees"), unless or until > another outside factor influences a change to break that bond. The > hardness will not just change overnight, nor will it change in any > number of nights as far as I can determine. What is your rationale, > good buddy? Regards, Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > > What is the hardness of your water coming out of the tap? Measure > it right > > out of the tap, then again after it has been sitting for 24 hours, > as the > > carbonate hardness number may change as CO2 is gassed off. > > > > \\Steve// > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Crazy4fids@a... > > Sent: Sunday, July 10, 2005 12:45 AM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] hardness > > > > Thanks Steve! > > > > The tank has only been set up for a week and a half. I have two > different > > types of wood, the one big piece is malaysian (the kind that > sinks) and the > > > > others are the gnarly african wood that sinks. > > > > Is there a number I should be watching out for (hardness below 8, > 7, 6? > > > > Yes, I started a log yesterday. I wish I would have started it > sooner. I > > > > have been keeping fish on and off for the past 30 years, but I > have never > > had > > a tank this big before, and I have never kept live plants. > > > > Linda > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..>< > ((((:> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<: > ((((><74/`7.88. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..>< > ((((:> > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13090	From: Daniel Brown	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Cats & Fish Keeping

I've been interested in keeping fish for about a year now, I've not actually got round to starting up the tank I got given by a friend due to being very busy getting married. But now I'm married I've been thinking about setting up the tank but I have two cats. One is ancient and not interested in hunting at all but the other one is young and a hunter (although we do have a bell on her), is this likely to cause problems with having fish as well? I'm aware that I'll need to cat proof the tank and stand so it cannot be opened or tipped over by cats but is there any other considerations I need to make? I thought I'd ask first and not find out the hard way! Cheers, Daniel Scotland ______________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email ______________________________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13091	From: kb1dva	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Re: Cats & Fish Keeping

No not really a stand and the kind of lights that cover the width of the tank. They might surprise you after initial interest my cats ignore the fish; the dogs love to watch them! - and one of the cats is a bug catcher. Emily _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Daniel Brown Sent: Monday, July 11, 2005 12:04 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Cats & Fish Keeping I've been interested in keeping fish for about a year now, I've not actually got round to starting up the tank I got given by a friend due to being very busy getting married. But now I'm married I've been thinking about setting up the tank but I have two cats. One is ancient and not interested in hunting at all but the other one is young and a hunter (although we do have a bell on her), is this likely to cause problems with having fish as well? I'm aware that I'll need to cat proof the tank and stand so it cannot be opened or tipped over by cats but is there any other considerations I need to make? I thought I'd ask first and not find out the hard way! Cheers, Daniel Scotland ______________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email ______________________________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13092	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Re: Cats & Fish Keeping

I have 4 cats and the 2 younger ones try to get the fish through the glass. They also like to sit in the Eclipse 2 hood because it is warm from the lights and it vibrates a bit from the pump. They haven't tried to get into the tank itself as of yet. I think the cat and fish connection is a bit overrated as housecats do not have the layer of fat beneath their skin to keep them warm if their fur gets wet...which is why most avoid water. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Daniel Brown Sent: Monday, July 11, 2005 11:04 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Cats & Fish Keeping I've been interested in keeping fish for about a year now, I've not actually got round to starting up the tank I got given by a friend due to being very busy getting married. But now I'm married I've been thinking about setting up the tank but I have two cats. One is ancient and not interested in hunting at all but the other one is young and a hunter (although we do have a bell on her), is this likely to cause problems with having fish as well? I'm aware that I'll need to cat proof the tank and stand so it cannot be opened or tipped over by cats but is there any other considerations I need to make? I thought I'd ask first and not find out the hard way! Cheers, Daniel Scotland ______________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email ______________________________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13093	From: helen572	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Re: Cats & Fish Keeping

As long as they can't get into it or knock it over, you should be okay, but never underestimate the ability of a cat to get at anything if he wants it bad enough. I have four cats -- two older ones who don't pay any attention to the fish, and two 5-month-old kittens; only one of the kittens seemed captivated by the fish and watched them for a few minutes every now and then, but after a few days, seems to have forgotten all about them. I say go for it, but after setting up the tank, plan to be around for awhile to watch how the cats react and to make sure they can't disturb it. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Daniel Brown" <daniel.brown@v...> wrote: > I've been interested in keeping fish for about a year now, I've not > actually got round to starting up the tank I got given by a friend due > to being very busy getting married. But now I'm married I've been > thinking about setting up the tank but I have two cats. One is ancient > and not interested in hunting at all but the other one is young and a > hunter (although we do have a bell on her), is this likely to cause > problems with having fish as well? I'm aware that I'll need to cat > proof the tank and stand so it cannot be opened or tipped over by cats > but is there any other considerations I need to make? > > I thought I'd ask first and not find out the hard way! > > Cheers, > > Daniel > Scotland > > ______________________________________________________________________ > This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. > For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email > ______________________________________________________________________ > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13094	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Re: Cats & Fish Keeping

In a message dated 7/11/2005 2:23:35 PM Eastern Standard Time, shirleycat@... writes: but the other one is young and a > hunter (although we do have a bell on her), is this likely to cause > problems with having fish as well? From my experience, the bell shouldn't bother the fish. Vicky, hey, what do I know, I just have retrievers who all think the aquaria are big wading pools! Only one of my dogs seems to have noticed the fish -- he's the one who watches tv too. Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Or write: hgparker@... =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact Dr Breen @ 919-513-1467, Dr London @ calondon@... 530-754-5711 _AND_ Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13095	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Re: Cats & Fish Keeping

my 7-mo old kitten is fascinated by all of my fish tanks (3 betta tanks, 2 reef tanks) but seems especially interested in my fw community tank. he will paw at the tank esp. during feeding time when the fish are most active and the tanks lights are on. he even jumps on top of the tank to get to the window sill. the fish so far don't seem to mind him pawing at the tank or even jumping onto the tank. i would definitely keep a tightly-fitted lid on the tank, though, on the off-chance any of the cats might decide it wants a fish snack. --- helen572 <shirleycat@...> wrote: > As long as they can't get into it or knock it over, you should be > okay, but never underestimate the ability of a cat to get at anything > if he wants it bad enough. I have four cats -- two older ones who > don't pay any attention to the fish, and two 5-month-old kittens; only > one of the kittens seemed captivated by the fish and watched them for > a few minutes every now and then, but after a few days, seems to have > forgotten all about them. I say go for it, but after setting up the > tank, plan to be around for awhile to watch how the cats react and to > make sure they can't disturb it. > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Daniel Brown" <daniel.brown@v...> > wrote: > > I've been interested in keeping fish for about a year now, I've not > > actually got round to starting up the tank I got given by a friend due > > to being very busy getting married. But now I'm married I've been > > thinking about setting up the tank but I have two cats. One is ancient > > and not interested in hunting at all but the other one is young and a > > hunter (although we do have a bell on her), is this likely to cause > > problems with having fish as well? I'm aware that I'll need to cat > > proof the tank and stand so it cannot be opened or tipped over by cats > > but is there any other considerations I need to make? > > > > I thought I'd ask first and not find out the hard way! > > > > Cheers, > > > > Daniel > > Scotland > > > > ______________________________________________________________________ > > This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. > > For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email > > ______________________________________________________________________ > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13096	From: paul helms	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Re: Cats & Fish Keeping

just make sure that you do not have anything that will be posionous to the cats just in case. 1 out of my 4 liked to go fishing. she ate about 50 bucks worth of fish before i figured out she was putting her paw in and using it like a bear trap to catch neons and small tetras. after dunking her head in the tank she no longer fishes, but does use the back filter as a drinking fountain.lol --- Daniel Brown <daniel.brown@...> wrote: > I've been interested in keeping fish for about a > year now, I've not > actually got round to starting up the tank I got > given by a friend due > to being very busy getting married. But now I'm > married I've been > thinking about setting up the tank but I have two > cats. One is ancient > and not interested in hunting at all but the other > one is young and a > hunter (although we do have a bell on her), is this > likely to cause > problems with having fish as well? I'm aware that > I'll need to cat > proof the tank and stand so it cannot be opened or > tipped over by cats > but is there any other considerations I need to > make? > > I thought I'd ask first and not find out the hard > way! > > Cheers, > > Daniel > Scotland > > ______________________________________________________________________ > This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email > Security System. > For more information please visit > http://www.messagelabs.com/email > ______________________________________________________________________ > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ____________________________________________________ Sell on Yahoo! Auctions – no fees. Bid on great items. http://auctions.yahoo.com/

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13097	From: Iksnip@aol.com	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Re: Cats & Fish Keeping

i have two cats around 3 years old. One of them will get on her hind paws and paw at the outside of the tank to "play" with the fish. Doesnt seem to be a problem. The other one annoyingly will hop on top of the 75 gallon tank and try to get it. Hasnt caused any casulties but it is something to consider. Personally, go for it! Ken -----Original Message----- From: helen572 <shirleycat@...> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Mon, 11 Jul 2005 18:23:16 -0000 Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Cats & Fish Keeping As long as they can't get into it or knock it over, you should be okay, but never underestimate the ability of a cat to get at anything if he wants it bad enough. I have four cats -- two older ones who don't pay any attention to the fish, and two 5-month-old kittens; only one of the kittens seemed captivated by the fish and watched them for a few minutes every now and then, but after a few days, seems to have forgotten all about them. I say go for it, but after setting up the tank, plan to be around for awhile to watch how the cats react and to make sure they can't disturb it. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Daniel Brown" <daniel.brown@v...> wrote: > I've been interested in keeping fish for about a year now, I've not > actually got round to starting up the tank I got given by a friend due > to being very busy getting married. But now I'm married I've been > thinking about setting up the tank but I have two cats. One is ancient > and not interested in hunting at all but the other one is young and a > hunter (although we do have a bell on her), is this likely to cause > problems with having fish as well? I'm aware that I'll need to cat > proof the tank and stand so it cannot be opened or tipped over by cats > but is there any other considerations I need to make? > > I thought I'd ask first and not find out the hard way! > > Cheers, > > Daniel > Scotland > > ______________________________________________________________________ > This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. > For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email > ______________________________________________________________________ > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13098	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Re: Cats & Fish Keeping

Daniel, It really depends on the cat. I think a lot of us have cat stories to tell. I had a 55 gallon, without a real cover on it, along with the rest o fthe tanks in the basement. My cat used to come down and perch on the rim of the 55 and eatch the fish, never making an effort to catch them. Then, one day, she fell in. BAM! She was out of there in a flash ind up the stairs, and blamed my then wife for her mishap--even though I was the one in the basement and she was upstairs in the kitchen. Since then, she has shown nothing but a passing interest in any tank, and generally gives them a bit of room should she need to walk by one. This happened about 15 years ago. None of the other cats I've had have really shown more than a passing interest in the tanks, once the newness wore off for them, and none have attempted to catch any fish--at least not when I have been around. So, go ahead and do it. I f you need additional cat proofing, so be it. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Daniel Brown Sent: Monday, July 11, 2005 12:04 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Cats & Fish Keeping I've been interested in keeping fish for about a year now, I've not actually got round to starting up the tank I got given by a friend due to being very busy getting married. But now I'm married I've been thinking about setting up the tank but I have two cats. One is ancient and not interested in hunting at all but the other one is young and a hunter (although we do have a bell on her), is this likely to cause problems with having fish as well? I'm aware that I'll need to cat proof the tank and stand so it cannot be opened or tipped over by cats but is there any other considerations I need to make? I thought I'd ask first and not find out the hard way! Cheers, Daniel Scotland ______________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email ______________________________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13099	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Re: Cats & Fish Keeping

It's nothing a few simple precautions won't solve. We have six cats and four aquariums now. We have to put screen and plexiglass around the openings for the filters and heaters and such, or the cats will stick their paws in the spaces left by the hoods and scoop out the occasional unwary fish. I suggest you buy a nice sturdy hood, as if you have a fat cat you WILL otherwise end up with a kitty in the drink at least once. Amusing, but messy, and it scares the fish. Other than that, the cats seem to love the aquariums. We call them kitty t.v. :D

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13100	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Algae or Bacterial bloom due to DIY CO2 YEAST setup?

Hi, Normally my tank is crystal clear. I've recently gotten into the whole CO2 plant thing and decided to test out a 1litre DIY yeast and coke bottle method. If I look long ways through my tank (1.4m) it appears a cloudy white colour with about 25% reduction in transparency and besides the adding some more plants from a friend and addition of a DIY YEAST generator running Bakers Yeast and 1 cup of sugar in 500ml of water, I haven't changed anything else in my set-up. To combat this problem since its been two weeks since the bloom first appeared and also generally upgrade I've decided to grab a spare canister filter 1500 L/h and use that instead of my normal internal filter power head and sponge filter which has an filter mass of 1/5 of the canister filter. My question is this: Is this a common thing with DIY CO2 and Yeast? =Nick

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13101	From: Evita	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Re: Cats & Fish Keeping

Daniel, I have 9 cats, two tanks. A 20 gal and a 30 gal. Both have hood covers and a far as the cats, my cats don't really mess with the tanks except to jump on top of the to try and get my birds. HA! Now that is a whole pther ball game. I would say you need a good hood cover even if you didn't have cats. But I would have my tank set up on a sturdy stand too. Evita Daniel Brown <daniel.brown@...> wrote:I've been interested in keeping fish for about a year now, I've not actually got round to starting up the tank I got given by a friend due to being very busy getting married. But now I'm married I've been thinking about setting up the tank but I have two cats. One is ancient and not interested in hunting at all but the other one is young and a hunter (although we do have a bell on her), is this likely to cause problems with having fish as well? I'm aware that I'll need to cat proof the tank and stand so it cannot be opened or tipped over by cats but is there any other considerations I need to make? I thought I'd ask first and not find out the hard way! Cheers, Daniel Scotland ______________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email ______________________________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Sell on Yahoo! Auctions - No fees. Bid on great items. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13102	From: Evita	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Re: Cats & Fish Keeping

Eric, I have one cat that has been known to jump into the bath with ya. And the day we put up our large pool one of our cats heard the girls playing in it and jump 5 feet in the air landing in the pool. The time in the water 4.5 seconds......Evita I have 4 cats and the 2 younger ones try to get the fish through the glass. They also like to sit in the Eclipse 2 hood because it is warm from the lights and it vibrates a bit from the pump. They haven't tried to get into the tank itself as of yet. I think the cat and fish connection is a bit overrated as housecats do not have the layer of fat beneath their skin to keep them warm if their fur gets wet...which is why most avoid water. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Daniel Brown Sent: Monday, July 11, 2005 11:04 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Cats & Fish Keeping I've been interested in keeping fish for about a year now, I've not actually got round to starting up the tank I got given by a friend due to being very busy getting married. But now I'm married I've been thinking about setting up the tank but I have two cats. One is ancient and not interested in hunting at all but the other one is young and a hunter (although we do have a bell on her), is this likely to cause problems with having fish as well? I'm aware that I'll need to cat proof the tank and stand so it cannot be opened or tipped over by cats but is there any other considerations I need to make? I thought I'd ask first and not find out the hard way! Cheers, Daniel Scotland ______________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email ______________________________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Sell on Yahoo! Auctions - No fees. Bid on great items. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13103	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Re: Cats & Fish Keeping

Some cats like it. Most house cats do not. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evita Sent: Monday, July 11, 2005 7:59 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Cats & Fish Keeping Eric, I have one cat that has been known to jump into the bath with ya. And the day we put up our large pool one of our cats heard the girls playing in it and jump 5 feet in the air landing in the pool. The time in the water 4.5 seconds......Evita I have 4 cats and the 2 younger ones try to get the fish through the glass. They also like to sit in the Eclipse 2 hood because it is warm from the lights and it vibrates a bit from the pump. They haven't tried to get into the tank itself as of yet. I think the cat and fish connection is a bit overrated as housecats do not have the layer of fat beneath their skin to keep them warm if their fur gets wet...which is why most avoid water. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Daniel Brown Sent: Monday, July 11, 2005 11:04 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Cats & Fish Keeping I've been interested in keeping fish for about a year now, I've not actually got round to starting up the tank I got given by a friend due to being very busy getting married. But now I'm married I've been thinking about setting up the tank but I have two cats. One is ancient and not interested in hunting at all but the other one is young and a hunter (although we do have a bell on her), is this likely to cause problems with having fish as well? I'm aware that I'll need to cat proof the tank and stand so it cannot be opened or tipped over by cats but is there any other considerations I need to make? I thought I'd ask first and not find out the hard way! Cheers, Daniel Scotland ______________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email ______________________________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Sell on Yahoo! Auctions - No fees. Bid on great items. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13104	From: Evita	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Re: Cats & Fish Keeping

Paul, You just made me remember..... years ago I had a cat that jumped on our tank that had frogs and salamanders in it. She grabbed out the salamander and not to sound gross we found him later with part of his intestines out. We were horrified to say the least. We put him back in the tank thinking he would surely die. He was really large. We didn't think a vet could sew him up or operate on him. Funny thing is the wound closed and the intestine dropped off and he was fine. I think he regenerated it. True story. Evita paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: just make sure that you do not have anything that will be posionous to the cats just in case. 1 out of my 4 liked to go fishing. she ate about 50 bucks worth of fish before i figured out she was putting her paw in and using it like a bear trap to catch neons and small tetras. after dunking her head in the tank she no longer fishes, but does use the back filter as a drinking fountain.lol --- Daniel Brown <daniel.brown@...> wrote: > I've been interested in keeping fish for about a > year now, I've not > actually got round to starting up the tank I got > given by a friend due > to being very busy getting married. But now I'm > married I've been > thinking about setting up the tank but I have two > cats. One is ancient > and not interested in hunting at all but the other > one is young and a > hunter (although we do have a bell on her), is this > likely to cause > problems with having fish as well? I'm aware that > I'll need to cat > proof the tank and stand so it cannot be opened or > tipped over by cats > but is there any other considerations I need to > make? > > I thought I'd ask first and not find out the hard > way! > > Cheers, > > Daniel > Scotland > > ______________________________________________________________________ > This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email > Security System. > For more information please visit > http://www.messagelabs.com/email > ______________________________________________________________________ > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ____________________________________________________ Sell on Yahoo! Auctions – no fees. Bid on great items. http://auctions.yahoo.com/ ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Sell on Yahoo! Auctions - No fees. Bid on great items. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13105	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Re: hardness

Evita, There is some ART involved as well, and don't forget the black magic <g>. One of the worst things, and it is very common too, is that some one will give you their exact recipe for doing a certain thing, and it will not work for you, yet they can do it time and time again. What happens is that there is some detail left out. It is not really the person's fault, because they may not be aware of it themselves. It could be something in the water chemistry that we do not measure or check for. It could also be something they do, and since they do it, they know that everyone else also does it, so it's not really worth mentioning. But it certainly can drive you up the wall trying to figure out what you have done "wrong". \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evita Sent: Monday, July 11, 2005 7:05 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] RE: hardness Thanks for posting it Steve .....I think I'll keep it reading it several times when I get the time. The problem for me right now is I just don't understand a heck of a lot it was trying to say. This water thing is complicated to say the least. The one thing I have learned though is know your fish and their behavior. I think the one biggest mistake new-bies make is setting up a beautiful tank and thinking that's it....walking away thinking this is a easy way to decorate a room. From the various posts I have read I have learned a lot. One thing I do know is this is a "SCIENCE" in itself. My husband just doesn't understand this at all. He thinks I am nuts wanting to learn all I can to help make the environment the best I can for several tiny little nothing fish as he calls them. I may not know the whats and whys right now but I know when my fish are not acting normal. I can tell if they seem unhappy with their environment. I do know now why water changes are necessary. As well as keeping an eye out for little minor changes in the look of my fish. For that I can thank my fish groups and people like you. The other day my daughters friend called her and told her she got a fish...."a Gourami" the other day and by morning it was dead. I found myself asking all sorts of questions you would have asked me in the beginning....what size tank did she have, where did she get the fish, what kind of filter...etc...I wonder if she had just got the fish as an impulse and dropped it in an un-cycled tank and shocked it's system with the wrong temp. as well. My daughter told her we had babies and we could give her some. I told my daughter I would have to know more about her set up before considering her tank for any of my baby fry and I also wanted them to grow a tad bit more before moving them to another environments. The point being? They are thriving now, growing and blooming in color. I don't want to give them to just anyone and then they end up dead over night. Bottom line even I seem to know more in a month than some people do. So Knowledge is a good thing. These groups and people like you with more experience as not only passing on your experiences but actually helping others not only enjoy the experience of fish keeping more but saving the lives of many fish is the process. Thanks again! Oh I added some zucchini to my tanks yesterday and the fry went nutty over it. In a matter of a minute they all crowded around it. I was amazed. It was like a kid hearing the music of the ice-cream truck coming down the street as a kid. They seemed to know it was something good to eat. Evita

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13106	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Re: hardness

Ray, Yep, looks like you are getting a handle on it now. As I mentioned, not the easiest thing in the world. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Monday, July 11, 2005 7:45 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: hardness Hi Steve, That "other" Ray was me; I was unknowingly using a different User Name (Yahoo I.D.) and password when I posted the message -- I use several sn's to break up the email load, all having a different Yahoo group listing. Somehow, this different sn displayed our Group (which it shouldn't have), so I thought I was using my usual Main/Master email address. I am amazed that it went through to the Group. Naturally, when you tried replying to me on my other email address it came up as invalid as I don't belong to this group with that email address/I.D. I was wondering why I didn't get a reply so posted again, with my proper address, which went through. Sorry about that! \ Now, to the subject at hand -- KH (temporary hardness) has little to do with the general hardness (except when combining these two values to get total hardness), but is a measure of alkalinity, or buffering capacity. This carbonate hardness is a measure of the carbonates and/or bicarbonates, whereas what we are used to recognizing as "hardness" is a measure of mostly the elements calcium and magnesium which actually harden the water, increasing the conductivity. I guess this is what initially through me off. Looking back to your previous post (to <erieberk@y...>), I would have to guess we're on the same wavelength here(?). Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > Ray, > > See the reply I wrote back to another (?) Ray (erieberk@y...) that I > ended up posting publicly. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Sunday, July 10, 2005 9:31 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: hardness > > Hi Steve, With all due respect, I don't follow why the hardness > reading would change over a period of 24 hours, although the pH > certainly will change (rise) as the CO2 is gassed off. The > carbonates are locked up as a compound with the calcium, which will > give a constant reading in ppm (or "degrees"), unless or until > another outside factor influences a change to break that bond. The > hardness will not just change overnight, nor will it change in any > number of nights as far as I can determine. What is your rationale, > good buddy? Regards, Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > > What is the hardness of your water coming out of the tap? Measure > it right > > out of the tap, then again after it has been sitting for 24 hours, > as the > > carbonate hardness number may change as CO2 is gassed off. > > > > \\Steve// > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Crazy4fids@a... > > Sent: Sunday, July 10, 2005 12:45 AM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] hardness > > > > Thanks Steve! > > > > The tank has only been set up for a week and a half. I have two > different > > types of wood, the one big piece is malaysian (the kind that > sinks) and the > > > > others are the gnarly african wood that sinks. > > > > Is there a number I should be watching out for (hardness below 8, > 7, 6? > > > > Yes, I started a log yesterday. I wish I would have started it > sooner. I > > > > have been keeping fish on and off for the past 30 years, but I > have never > > had > > a tank this big before, and I have never kept live plants. > > > > Linda > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..>< > ((((:> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<: > ((((><74/`7.88. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..>< > ((((:> > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13107	From: Nan	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Re: Algae/ Water Color?

I don't know if this would help as well, but I have found Filter Aid, I don't know who makes it, I am sure your LPS/LFS will have it on shelf, comes in a black bottle, anyway you add it behind the filter and it has helped clear mine up during a bacteria bloom, or some sort of cloudiness problem I had. Anyway, it didn't bother my pleco or my loaches, or any of my other fish when I used it in my community tank. You might want to give it a try as well, with the other preventative measures that have been suggested. Nan FortWayneFish@... wrote: Any natural light is going to effect your fish tank in one way or another. Your green water sounds like a minor algae bloom, try getting some floating plants or possibly blocking part of the sun one way or another. Algae needs 2 things to thrive. Light and nutrients. limiting indirect light and being careful to not over feed your fish should help keep the tank looking clear. just keep ontop of your water changes like you should be doing anyway and if the algae starts growing onm the walls where it gets sunlight invest in a couple bristlenose catfish LOL * NONE of my tanks are clear excpet the African Mbuna tank and it recieves 4 times the regular filtration and indirect flourescent lighting. rob Indiana In a message dated 7/10/2005 6:54:18 PM US Eastern Standard Time, wtfmorlok@... writes: usually a healthy tank is perfectly clear. if you do use your lights a bit it may clear up the tank....i know it sounds odd, but i have seen it work many times. you can also put on backing to block light from the sliders. i would not be too concerned about the light being that close to the doors, but temp shifts could be a problem. if you do not have dual payne windows i would refcomend another location. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13108	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: catfish

Not that I'm looking for one now, but can anyone recommend a catfish to add to my 150 gallon freshwater tank? I am trying to keep all the occupants in the tank from South America. I don't want anything that is going to get more than about 4-5 inches. I saw a striped raphael catfish at the lfs and I have done some research on it. I guess it is mostly nocturnal and I wouldn't see it much. Any input? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13109	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Hi, new member. Long time fish owner.

My name is Beth and I have a 30 gallon tropical tank. I had just bought my second tank a 55 gallon tank. I'm working on getting it filled with different types of tropical fish. I have a polly - an alge eater which my family calls polly, which I will be transfering over to the new tank. I know I will be needing two more pollies for my smaller tank till they get bigger. Does anyone have advice on how to transport new fish an hour and a half from the store you bought them from to your home? The nearest fish store in my area, I happen to live in South Central Missouri, is only an hour and half drive to get there. I will be bringing a bucket so they can put the fish in but I'm not sure how to really transport them home without losing one or more of my fish. Any advice will help me greatly. Thanks, Beth Brownell spencer_creek_studios@...

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13110	From: Rob	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: My Introduction

My name is Rob and I am in Herndon, VA. I have (1) 120 Gallon tank that has a High Backed Headstander(8 inches), Black Banded Leporinus(13 inches), two Boehsman Rainbow fish (6-7 inches), three Green Severums (4 inches each), one Scat(4 inches), one common goldfish(5 inches), one rosy barb(feeder survivor), three plecos(2 12 inches, 1 8 inches). (1) 65 Gallon tank: Primarily aquatic garden although slowly transferring my Ameca Splendens to this tank. (2) 55 gallon tanks 1. Guppies, mosquitofish, mollies, cories 2. 5 Serpae Tetras, 3 otocinclus, 2 plecos, 2 bristlenose plecos, 2 rahaels, 9 cories, 5 Buenos Aires tetras, 10 other varying tetras, 3 Chinese Algae Eaters, 5 ghost shrimp, 10 cardinal tetras, 1 clown loach, several platies of varying color, type. Overloaded I know and am working on relocating many of the fish as I have three tanks maturing right now. (1) 40 gallon tank maturing to hold clown loach, ghost shrimp, and several tetra varieties. (2) 30 gallon tanks 1. Snails of 5 different types 2. guppies and one pleco. (2) 20 gallon tanks 1. One contains rest of Ameca Splendens population 2. Guppies, mollies, platies, cories (2) 15 gallon tanks 1. Tall tank with male and female betta, guppies 2. Currently maturing with plants to house the cardinals, bristlenose plecos, and platies from above 55. (3) 10 gallon tanks 1 and 2 are guppy grow out tanks 3. No fish Use it to grow mangroves. Hope to have an open air mangrove tank much later as these develop. Also currently have three ten gallons, 5 gallon and a couple one gallons that I am not using Keep them for grow out tanks and recovery tanks. Thats me to begin with. I will try to get photos of as much as possible to submit to the group in the future. Rob

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13111	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Re: catfish

A school of _Corydoras aneus_ would probably be nice--don't go for the albinos, but the ones that gave them their common name--bronze catfish. There are other _Corydoras_ spp. And _Brochis_ spp. ( a close relative to corys) that have all sorts of patterns and interesting features, but do not get as large as the _C. aneus_. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Monday, July 11, 2005 9:46 PM To: mnaquarium@yahoogroups.com; AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] catfish Not that I'm looking for one now, but can anyone recommend a catfish to add to my 150 gallon freshwater tank? I am trying to keep all the occupants in the tank from South America. I don't want anything that is going to get more than about 4-5 inches. I saw a striped raphael catfish at the lfs and I have done some research on it. I guess it is mostly nocturnal and I wouldn't see it much. Any input? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13112	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Re: Hi, new member. Long time fish owner.

Beth, Welcome. I give up. What is a polly? Just have the store double bag them and add at least air to the bag so it is taut to the feel. Don't put too may fish in the bag and only fill with enough water to cover the fish when the bag is laid length wise, probably less than a quarter to a third of a bag of water will be more than sufficient. Bring along a cooler, and place the fish in the cooler and shut the lid tight. Most fish will be less active in the dark. Then drive straight home. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Beth Brownell Sent: Monday, July 11, 2005 6:33 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Hi, new member. Long time fish owner. My name is Beth and I have a 30 gallon tropical tank. I had just bought my second tank a 55 gallon tank. I'm working on getting it filled with different types of tropical fish. I have a polly - an alge eater which my family calls polly, which I will be transfering over to the new tank. I know I will be needing two more pollies for my smaller tank till they get bigger. Does anyone have advice on how to transport new fish an hour and a half from the store you bought them from to your home? The nearest fish store in my area, I happen to live in South Central Missouri, is only an hour and half drive to get there. I will be bringing a bucket so they can put the fish in but I'm not sure how to really transport them home without losing one or more of my fish. Any advice will help me greatly. Thanks, Beth Brownell spencer_creek_studios@...

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13113	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Re: My Introduction

Rob, Welcome. Check out the Potomac Valley Aquarium Society, http://www.pvas.com for an active bunch of fish nuts fairly local to you. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Rob Sent: Monday, July 11, 2005 1:49 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] My Introduction My name is Rob and I am in Herndon, VA. I have (1) 120 Gallon tank that has a High Backed Headstander(8 inches), Black Banded Leporinus(13 inches), two Boehsman Rainbow fish (6-7 inches), three Green Severums (4 inches each), one Scat(4 inches), one common goldfish(5 inches), one rosy barb(feeder survivor), three plecos(2 12 inches, 1 8 inches). (1) 65 Gallon tank: Primarily aquatic garden although slowly transferring my Ameca Splendens to this tank. (2) 55 gallon tanks 1. Guppies, mosquitofish, mollies, cories 2. 5 Serpae Tetras, 3 otocinclus, 2 plecos, 2 bristlenose plecos, 2 rahaels, 9 cories, 5 Buenos Aires tetras, 10 other varying tetras, 3 Chinese Algae Eaters, 5 ghost shrimp, 10 cardinal tetras, 1 clown loach, several platies of varying color, type. Overloaded I know and am working on relocating many of the fish as I have three tanks maturing right now. (1) 40 gallon tank maturing to hold clown loach, ghost shrimp, and several tetra varieties. (2) 30 gallon tanks 1. Snails of 5 different types 2. guppies and one pleco. (2) 20 gallon tanks 1. One contains rest of Ameca Splendens population 2. Guppies, mollies, platies, cories (2) 15 gallon tanks 1. Tall tank with male and female betta, guppies 2. Currently maturing with plants to house the cardinals, bristlenose plecos, and platies from above 55. (3) 10 gallon tanks 1 and 2 are guppy grow out tanks 3. No fish Use it to grow mangroves. Hope to have an open air mangrove tank much later as these develop. Also currently have three ten gallons, 5 gallon and a couple one gallons that I am not using Keep them for grow out tanks and recovery tanks. Thats me to begin with. I will try to get photos of as much as possible to submit to the group in the future. Rob

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13114	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 7/11/2005
Subject: Re: Hi, new member. Long time fish owner.

Hi Steve, A polly is what I call my Plecostomus. I do not speak really good so I shorten their names to something that I can say easier. My family knows who I'm talking about when they hear the name polly. Beth --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > Beth, > > Welcome. > > I give up. What is a polly? > > \\Steve//

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13115	From: Heather Husvar	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: Cats & Fish Keeping

Our cat doesn't care about the fish so long as she is fed *first* in the morning. She watched the fish for a few days when it was new, but once we had a couple tanks set up, she just ignores them. We're lucky that way I guess! Heather H.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13116	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: Cats & Fish Keeping

This is a timely topic for me. We have a 12 week old kitten and an adult cat. Several months ago the adult cat, Baby Momma, was using my 29 gallon severum tank as her personal water fountain. I laughed at something on TV and it spooked her and she fell ass end into the tank. I have never seen her move soooo fast! The 12 week old boy kitten has free reign in the garage fishroom and never gets too interested in the fish, but today I finally moved my Frontosa (7 fish) from my parent's house to my house into a 115 gallon tank in the living room. Now he is all INTERESTED in them. Baby Momma I think is the culprit on my missing Guppies. I had a good group of guppies going and then I realized there were none. They are the only fish that swim up to the surface for feeding and I guess she chose to feed herself instead. Mike [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13117	From: deborahgd14	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Fin rot on angel?

Hi guys: here we go again. My angel fish had a little bit of her fin gone (in the back - not sure of the term) and I thought it was some fish nipping at her. Now more is gone and it has a little red near her body. She is acting normal and eating. Could this be fin rot? What would you guys recommend for this? Thank you in advance. Deborah D

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13118	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: Fin rot on angel?

Deborah, As for your Angelfish missing some of her fin ("in the back" -- caudal/tail fin?), it could be fin rot or it could well be due to fin-nipping. What other fish do you have in there? I'm somewhat concerned about the "red near her body", especially if it appears as red streaking in her fins -- Have you tested your water recently? Do you have a regular water changing regimen? Need to have more info on this. If its determined that this is due to fin- rot, there are a number of effective medications out there, not the least of which is "Furan II" (excellent), which will act on this. By the way, please disregard previous message with same answer from a different address (mistake). Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "deborahgd14" <deborahgd14@y...> wrote: > Hi guys: here we go again. My angel fish had a little bit of her fin > gone (in the back - not sure of the term) and I thought it was some > fish nipping at her. Now more is gone and it has a little red near > her body. She is acting normal and eating. Could this be fin rot? > What would you guys recommend for this? Thank you in advance. > Deborah D

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13119	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: catfish

Linda, No reason why you couldn't have Striped Raphael Catfish, especially in the 150, depending upon what other fish you have in there. At least they're a bit different, and quite long-lived. They do get a bit larger than the 4-5 inches you were thinking about. As with many other catfish, these are somewhat nocturnal, however, unless you have tons of rockwork, you should be able to view these guys during the day even if they aren't quite as active. I've had a pair of them in one of my 100's for over 12 years now which are still going strong. The male is about 8", with the female being somewhat smaller. I'd recommend them if the slightly larger size fits in with your plans, By the way, as with my previous post this morning, please disregard my similar message posted from a different address. I had not changed over from posting late last night on unrelated forums, but at least caught it after these two posts. Ray \ -- - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > Not that I'm looking for one now, but can anyone recommend a catfish to add > to my 150 gallon freshwater tank? > I am trying to keep all the occupants in the tank from South America. I > don't want anything that is going to get more than about 4-5 inches. > I saw a striped raphael catfish at the lfs and I have done some research on > it. I guess it is mostly nocturnal and I wouldn't see it much. > > Any input? > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13120	From: Evita	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: Hi, new member. Long time fish owner.

Steve, Question. If a fish dies the next day lets say after bring it home with no sign of illness could that indeed be more than likely stress related? I have had that happen. Evita Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote:Beth, Welcome. I give up. What is a polly? Just have the store double bag them and add at least air to the bag so it is taut to the feel. Don't put too may fish in the bag and only fill with enough water to cover the fish when the bag is laid length wise, probably less than a quarter to a third of a bag of water will be more than sufficient. Bring along a cooler, and place the fish in the cooler and shut the lid tight. Most fish will be less active in the dark. Then drive straight home. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Beth Brownell Sent: Monday, July 11, 2005 6:33 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Hi, new member. Long time fish owner. My name is Beth and I have a 30 gallon tropical tank. I had just bought my second tank a 55 gallon tank. I'm working on getting it filled with different types of tropical fish. I have a polly - an alge eater which my family calls polly, which I will be transfering over to the new tank. I know I will be needing two more pollies for my smaller tank till they get bigger. Does anyone have advice on how to transport new fish an hour and a half from the store you bought them from to your home? The nearest fish store in my area, I happen to live in South Central Missouri, is only an hour and half drive to get there. I will be bringing a bucket so they can put the fish in but I'm not sure how to really transport them home without losing one or more of my fish. Any advice will help me greatly. Thanks, Beth Brownell spencer_creek_studios@... ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13121	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: how do I cool the water in my tank

Does anyone have any ideas on how to cool a tank short of adding ice? I've turned off the lights and opened the lid on my goldfish tank, which is in the low 80's right now. The AC isn't working. Thanks Emily

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13122	From: arvie!	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: Fin rot on angel?

that's happen also with my bi color angel couple weeks ago, but i just increase giving it food , not for long, its fin come good again. i guess it just got tear off because the rock. On 7/12/05, deborahgd14 <deborahgd14@...> wrote: > Hi guys: here we go again. My angel fish had a little bit of her fin > gone (in the back - not sure of the term) and I thought it was some > fish nipping at her. Now more is gone and it has a little red near > her body. She is acting normal and eating. Could this be fin rot? > What would you guys recommend for this? Thank you in advance. > Deborah D > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > -- arvie!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13123	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Indoor fish pond in Minneapolis.....available ASAP, CHEAP!!!

I was wondering if there is anyone here in the minneapolis area that would like a fish pond. It's a converted horse trough, comes with everything and about 7 goldfish. My friend is moving across the country and needs to get rid of it ASAP. He's asking $30 but it's negotiable. I've seen it and it's really neat, but I don't have space. Email me if you'd like to contact him. He needs it out immediately. Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13124	From: TankGurl	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank

You could aim some fans that point to the top of the tank and increase your water circulation via a power head. Also, if the tank gets too hot, you could do a 30-40% water change with cooler water. Not icy cold, but just enough to bring down the temp. a couple of degrees while not stressing the fish. Kelly On 7/12/05, Emily Tenczar <bababanana@...> wrote: > Does anyone have any ideas on how to cool a tank short > of adding ice? > I've turned off the lights and opened the lid on my > goldfish tank, which is in the low 80's right now. The > AC isn't working. > > Thanks > Emily > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > -- 65G Lake Malawi http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 135G Lake Tanganyika http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011 36G Brackish http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8498 Tank/s Gallery http://www.picturetrail.com/fish_gurl

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13125	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank

Emily, Other than adding ice, the only other ways I can think of to cool off your tank water is (1) by evaporation, i.e. positioning a fan to blow at the surface (which has already been pointed out). In ideal circumstances, this may drop the temperature a degree or two, but that's nothing on a day in the mid-80's. (2) by use of a Thermoelectric Chiller which can be found in most of the better lfs's. Something to consider if you live in any part of the country which reaches these temperatures for any length of time if you're not going to replace the A/C. Average low price is about $300 although Drs. Foster & Smith (Pet Warehouse) has one for smaller tanks for $109.99. \ Ice is a lot cheaper, but you have to monitor it. Best (and safest) way is to first put the ice in a zip-lock bag, starting out with a small amount (you don't want to drop the temp to fast). Then run an airstone directly under it to thoroughly circulate the water. After reaching the desired temperature, you will have to determine just about how much ice it takes to maintain the water at that temperature -- you don't want to drop the temp any further than the desired goal. The posible drawback is that if that determined amount of ice completely melts overnight without your replacing it, the temp is going to bounce back up again. Best results are had if you fasten sheet styrofoam to at least the back and sides of the tank (you may also consider the front as well, with cutting just a small window). A sheet of styro over the top will help as well. Except for the styro sheet over the top, this would also help with the fan/evaporation method as it will prevent a lot of heat gain into the aquarium from the room. (3) Putting your air pump in as large a styrofoam box (fish box from lfs) as possible filled with ice, with cover just loosely fit with definitely help in bring the temp down a couple of degrees, especially if its helped with the styro insulation on the tank sides. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Emily Tenczar <bababanana@y...> wrote: > Does anyone have any ideas on how to cool a tank short > of adding ice? > I've turned off the lights and opened the lid on my > goldfish tank, which is in the low 80's right now. The > AC isn't working. > > Thanks > Emily

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13126	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank

I live in minnesota :\ What is lfs?? Emily Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote: Emily, Other than adding ice, the only other ways I can think of to cool off your tank water is (1) by evaporation, i.e. positioning a fan to blow at the surface (which has already been pointed out). In ideal circumstances, this may drop the temperature a degree or two, but that's nothing on a day in the mid-80's. (2) by use of a Thermoelectric Chiller which can be found in most of the better lfs's. Something to consider if you live in any part of the country which reaches these temperatures for any length of time if you're not going to replace the A/C. Average low price is about $300 although Drs. Foster & Smith (Pet Warehouse) has one for smaller tanks for $109.99. \ Ice is a lot cheaper, but you have to monitor it. Best (and safest) way is to first put the ice in a zip-lock bag, starting out with a small amount (you don't want to drop the temp to fast). Then run an airstone directly under it to thoroughly circulate the water. After reaching the desired temperature, you will have to determine just about how much ice it takes to maintain the water at that temperature -- you don't want to drop the temp any further than the desired goal. The posible drawback is that if that determined amount of ice completely melts overnight without your replacing it, the temp is going to bounce back up again. Best results are had if you fasten sheet styrofoam to at least the back and sides of the tank (you may also consider the front as well, with cutting just a small window). A sheet of styro over the top will help as well. Except for the styro sheet over the top, this would also help with the fan/evaporation method as it will prevent a lot of heat gain into the aquarium from the room. (3) Putting your air pump in as large a styrofoam box (fish box from lfs) as possible filled with ice, with cover just loosely fit with definitely help in bring the temp down a couple of degrees, especially if its helped with the styro insulation on the tank sides. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Emily Tenczar wrote: > Does anyone have any ideas on how to cool a tank short > of adding ice? > I've turned off the lights and opened the lid on my > goldfish tank, which is in the low 80's right now. The > AC isn't working. > > Thanks > Emily ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13127	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis

Over the weekend I met a guy who has a foot long pacu that he's looking to get rid of since it outgrew the tank. I felt bad for the poor fish and thought I'd see if anyone in the area is interested :( Because I don't have room for it right now. I wish pet stores wouldn't sell fish that people buy and then don't want. It makes me so angry. If you are in the area and interested, please email me and I'll see about getting you in touch with this guy. Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13128	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: dying java fern

About a week and a half ago I did a partial water change in my 2 gal betta tank. Since then the java fern in the tank is looking awful. The leaves are turning chlorotic and dying, and I don't think it's from the snails because it's happening so fast. I added a couple drops of an iron + phosphorus fertilizer. Any ideas? Thanks! Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13129	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank

Hi Emily, "lfs" is a fairly common abbreviation on this forum for "local fish store". You should be able to get a large styrofoam fish shipping box from them, usually for no charge, as they get them with each fish order they buy and usually wind up throwing them in the garbage, as otherwise they just tend to pile up. Pre-cooling the air that you're pumping into the tank helps a lot, as has been inadvertantly found out the hard way by many multi-tank hobbyists who do not want to contend with the noise their blowers might make. All too often, they'll install the blower in their garage and pipe the air into their basement fish tank set-up and find, come Winter, that their tanks are being cooled down. While the idea of putting your air pump in an ice filled styro box might not be as efficient, it will have some effect especially if the box is large enough so that the air gets cooled before it gets used up (pumped out of the box, into the tank) where fresh warmer air is being drawn into the box. Noticing you're in Minnesota, I doubt if you really get very long hot spells, just a stretch here and there. A chiller probably wouldn't be a practical idea -- got to fix that A/C. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Emily Tenczar <bababanana@y...> wrote: > I live in minnesota :\ > What is lfs?? > Emily > > Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > Emily, Other than adding ice, the only other ways I can think of to > cool off your tank water is (1) by evaporation, i.e. positioning a fan > to blow at the surface (which has already been pointed out). In ideal > circumstances, this may drop the temperature a degree or two, but > that's nothing on a day in the mid-80's. (2) by use of a > Thermoelectric Chiller which can be found in most of the better lfs's. > Something to consider if you live in any part of the country which > reaches these temperatures for any length of time if you're not going > to replace the A/C. Average low price is about $300 although Drs. > Foster & Smith (Pet Warehouse) has one for smaller tanks for > $109.99. > \ > Ice is a lot cheaper, but you have to monitor it. Best (and safest) > way is to first put the ice in a zip-lock bag, starting out with a > small amount (you don't want to drop the temp to fast). Then run an > airstone directly under it to thoroughly circulate the water. After > reaching the desired temperature, you will have to determine just about > how much ice it takes to maintain the water at that temperature -- you > don't want to drop the temp any further than the desired goal. The > posible drawback is that if that determined amount of ice completely > melts overnight without your replacing it, the temp is going to bounce > back up again. Best results are had if you fasten sheet styrofoam to > at least the back and sides of the tank (you may also consider the > front as well, with cutting just a small window). A sheet of styro > over the top will help as well. Except for the styro sheet over the > top, this would also help with the fan/evaporation method as it will > prevent a lot of heat gain into the aquarium from the room. (3) > Putting your air pump in as large a styrofoam box (fish box from lfs) > as possible filled with ice, with cover just loosely fit with > definitely help in bring the temp down a couple of degrees, especially > if its helped with the styro insulation on the tank sides. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Emily Tenczar > wrote: > > Does anyone have any ideas on how to cool a tank short > > of adding ice? > > I've turned off the lights and opened the lid on my > > goldfish tank, which is in the low 80's right now. The > > AC isn't working. > > > > Thanks > > Emily > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13130	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank

do you have a fan you can blow onto it? we have a fan in our sw hood & it keeps the tank a nice range between 76-78 all the time, even w/no a/c & the temps heating up here lately. --- Emily Tenczar <bababanana@...> wrote: > Does anyone have any ideas on how to cool a tank short > of adding ice? > I've turned off the lights and opened the lid on my > goldfish tank, which is in the low 80's right now. The > AC isn't working. > > Thanks > Emily > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13131	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank

local fish store --- Emily Tenczar <bababanana@...> wrote: > I live in minnesota :\ > What is lfs?? > Emily > > Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote: > Emily, Other than adding ice, the only other ways I can think of to > cool off your tank water is (1) by evaporation, i.e. positioning a fan > to blow at the surface (which has already been pointed out). In ideal > circumstances, this may drop the temperature a degree or two, but > that's nothing on a day in the mid-80's. (2) by use of a > Thermoelectric Chiller which can be found in most of the better lfs's. > Something to consider if you live in any part of the country which > reaches these temperatures for any length of time if you're not going > to replace the A/C. Average low price is about $300 although Drs. > Foster & Smith (Pet Warehouse) has one for smaller tanks for > $109.99. > \ > Ice is a lot cheaper, but you have to monitor it. Best (and safest) > way is to first put the ice in a zip-lock bag, starting out with a > small amount (you don't want to drop the temp to fast). Then run an > airstone directly under it to thoroughly circulate the water. After > reaching the desired temperature, you will have to determine just about > how much ice it takes to maintain the water at that temperature -- you > don't want to drop the temp any further than the desired goal. The > posible drawback is that if that determined amount of ice completely > melts overnight without your replacing it, the temp is going to bounce > back up again. Best results are had if you fasten sheet styrofoam to > at least the back and sides of the tank (you may also consider the > front as well, with cutting just a small window). A sheet of styro > over the top will help as well. Except for the styro sheet over the > top, this would also help with the fan/evaporation method as it will > prevent a lot of heat gain into the aquarium from the room. (3) > Putting your air pump in as large a styrofoam box (fish box from lfs) > as possible filled with ice, with cover just loosely fit with > definitely help in bring the temp down a couple of degrees, especially > if its helped with the styro insulation on the tank sides. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Emily Tenczar > wrote: > > Does anyone have any ideas on how to cool a tank short > > of adding ice? > > I've turned off the lights and opened the lid on my > > goldfish tank, which is in the low 80's right now. The > > AC isn't working. > > > > Thanks > > Emily > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if > CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: > old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13132	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank

oh! Well duh :) Emily Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote: local fish store --- Emily Tenczar wrote: > I live in minnesota :\ > What is lfs?? > Emily > > Ray Wetzel wrote: > Emily, Other than adding ice, the only other ways I can think of to > cool off your tank water is (1) by evaporation, i.e. positioning a fan > to blow at the surface (which has already been pointed out). In ideal > circumstances, this may drop the temperature a degree or two, but > that's nothing on a day in the mid-80's. (2) by use of a > Thermoelectric Chiller which can be found in most of the better lfs's. > Something to consider if you live in any part of the country which > reaches these temperatures for any length of time if you're not going > to replace the A/C. Average low price is about $300 although Drs. > Foster & Smith (Pet Warehouse) has one for smaller tanks for > $109.99. > \ > Ice is a lot cheaper, but you have to monitor it. Best (and safest) > way is to first put the ice in a zip-lock bag, starting out with a > small amount (you don't want to drop the temp to fast). Then run an > airstone directly under it to thoroughly circulate the water. After > reaching the desired temperature, you will have to determine just about > how much ice it takes to maintain the water at that temperature -- you > don't want to drop the temp any further than the desired goal. The > posible drawback is that if that determined amount of ice completely > melts overnight without your replacing it, the temp is going to bounce > back up again. Best results are had if you fasten sheet styrofoam to > at least the back and sides of the tank (you may also consider the > front as well, with cutting just a small window). A sheet of styro > over the top will help as well. Except for the styro sheet over the > top, this would also help with the fan/evaporation method as it will > prevent a lot of heat gain into the aquarium from the room. (3) > Putting your air pump in as large a styrofoam box (fish box from lfs) > as possible filled with ice, with cover just loosely fit with > definitely help in bring the temp down a couple of degrees, especially > if its helped with the styro insulation on the tank sides. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Emily Tenczar > wrote: > > Does anyone have any ideas on how to cool a tank short > > of adding ice? > > I've turned off the lights and opened the lid on my > > goldfish tank, which is in the low 80's right now. The > > AC isn't working. > > > > Thanks > > Emily > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if > CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: > old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13133	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank

you mean you actually have a small fan UNDER the lid? What...how did you install it? Emily Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote: do you have a fan you can blow onto it? we have a fan in our sw hood & it keeps the tank a nice range between 76-78 all the time, even w/no a/c & the temps heating up here lately. --- Emily Tenczar wrote: > Does anyone have any ideas on how to cool a tank short > of adding ice? > I've turned off the lights and opened the lid on my > goldfish tank, which is in the low 80's right now. The > AC isn't working. > > Thanks > Emily > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13134	From: paul helms	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis

don't yo think people have a responisibility to care for a pet that they choose? --- Emily Tenczar <bababanana@...> wrote: > Over the weekend I met a guy who has a foot long > pacu that he's looking to get rid of since it > outgrew the tank. I felt bad for the poor fish and > thought I'd see if anyone in the area is interested > :( Because I don't have room for it right now. > > I wish pet stores wouldn't sell fish that people buy > and then don't want. It makes me so angry. > > If you are in the area and interested, please email > me and I'll see about getting you in touch with this > guy. > > Emily > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13135	From: paul helms	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank

a chiller, a fan aimed at glass, a fan over head drawing air away, --- Emily Tenczar <bababanana@...> wrote: > Does anyone have any ideas on how to cool a tank > short > of adding ice? > I've turned off the lights and opened the lid on my > goldfish tank, which is in the low 80's right now. > The > AC isn't working. > > Thanks > Emily > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13136	From: paul helms	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: Fin rot on angel?

melafix --- deborahgd14 <deborahgd14@...> wrote: > Hi guys: here we go again. My angel fish had a > little bit of her fin > gone (in the back - not sure of the term) and I > thought it was some > fish nipping at her. Now more is gone and it has a > little red near > her body. She is acting normal and eating. Could > this be fin rot? > What would you guys recommend for this? Thank you > in advance. > Deborah D > > > ____________________________________________________ Sell on Yahoo! Auctions – no fees. Bid on great items. http://auctions.yahoo.com/

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13137	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: dying java fern

Tell me about your tank. What is the substrate made of? What does your java fern have to feed on? > About a week and a half ago I did a partial water change in my 2 gal betta tank. Since then the java fern in the tank is looking awful. The leaves are turning chlorotic and dying, and I don't think it's from the snails because it's happening so fast. I added a couple drops of an iron + phosphorus fertilizer. Any ideas? > Thanks! > Emily

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13138	From: paul helms	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: catfish

rafael, barking, syndontis, etc --- Crazy4fids@... wrote: > Not that I'm looking for one now, but can anyone > recommend a catfish to add > to my 150 gallon freshwater tank? > I am trying to keep all the occupants in the tank > from South America. I > don't want anything that is going to get more than > about 4-5 inches. > I saw a striped raphael catfish at the lfs and I > have done some research on > it. I guess it is mostly nocturnal and I wouldn't > see it much. > > Any input? > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13139	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank

Problem is people keep opening the windows (I'm guilty of it too) because the air gets so stuffy in the apartment. It's at my bf's house and his roommates smoke and the place is basically pretty messy. So just to get this straight, you are saying to actually take a small box with ice packs, cut a hole for the cord and air tube and put the whole pump in there? And that will somehow cool the air? Now I'm wondering if I might be inadvertently heating the air because I have some towels and stuff in front of the pump so I don't have to hear the darn thing! But I work in entomology so we have tons of boxes and ice packs. I always save them for mailing critters. Emily Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote: Hi Emily, "lfs" is a fairly common abbreviation on this forum for "local fish store". You should be able to get a large styrofoam fish shipping box from them, usually for no charge, as they get them with each fish order they buy and usually wind up throwing them in the garbage, as otherwise they just tend to pile up. Pre-cooling the air that you're pumping into the tank helps a lot, as has been inadvertantly found out the hard way by many multi-tank hobbyists who do not want to contend with the noise their blowers might make. All too often, they'll install the blower in their garage and pipe the air into their basement fish tank set-up and find, come Winter, that their tanks are being cooled down. While the idea of putting your air pump in an ice filled styro box might not be as efficient, it will have some effect especially if the box is large enough so that the air gets cooled before it gets used up (pumped out of the box, into the tank) where fresh warmer air is being drawn into the box. Noticing you're in Minnesota, I doubt if you really get very long hot spells, just a stretch here and there. A chiller probably wouldn't be a practical idea -- got to fix that A/C. Ray [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13140	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: dying java fern

It's plain aquarium gravel, in one of those 2 gal. hex tanks. Only one betta and several snails. I just thought of something: the plant started looking bad after I did a water change. Water change removes nitrates. Maybe I should just take the plant out, trim it back and replace the living part of the plant which is very small and wouldn't need as much nitrogen to feed on. Or I could move it to my invert tank to suck up some nitrates in there, and add a new healthier plant?? Emily cynthia brennemann <brennewoman@...> wrote: Tell me about your tank. What is the substrate made of? What does your java fern have to feed on? > About a week and a half ago I did a partial water change in my 2 gal betta tank. Since then the java fern in the tank is looking awful. The leaves are turning chlorotic and dying, and I don't think it's from the snails because it's happening so fast. I added a couple drops of an iron + phosphorus fertilizer. Any ideas? > Thanks! > Emily ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13141	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis

In a message dated 7/12/2005 12:01:46 PM Pacific Daylight Time, wtfmorlok@... writes: don't yo think people have a responisibility to care for a pet that they choose? Yes and that responsibility includes finding a better home for them for whatever reason. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13142	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis

Yes, I do. I know my goldfish are going to get big, and if that means I need to set up a bigger tank someday, that's what I need to do. I'm working on some arachnid breeding projects and I have too many of them already, but I know all I have to do is post a message to a forum and I can have good homes lined up for any extra babies that I might get, no problem. If you know the right people, it's easy to find good homes for baby spiders or scorpions or a large tarantula going out to breed, but no one wants to adopt huge fish. And it's unfortunate that the pet stores are so money-focused that they don't even care about informing people who buy the animals in the first place. Emily paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: don't yo think people have a responisibility to care for a pet that they choose? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13143	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: dying java fern

Your plant needs a better substrate than plain aquarium gravel. It shouldn't be affected by a water change unless its ONLY nutrition comes from nitrates in the water. At the very least you need to get some of those fertilizer tabs to stick down in the gravel next to the roots of your plant. It would be better if you could wrap the fertilizer tab in peat moss and sand, maybe wrapped in paper to keep it from clouding the water. Then work that down into the gravel next to the roots, for the plant to work its roots into the fertilze substrate. Trimming the dead parts back is a good idea, but as long as teh roots are alive, it should recover if you give it something to feed on. > It's plain aquarium gravel, in one of those 2 gal. hex tanks. Only one betta and several snails. > > I just thought of something: the plant started looking bad after I did a water change. Water change removes nitrates. Maybe I should just take the plant out, trim it back and replace the living part of the plant which is very small and wouldn't need as much nitrogen to feed on. Or I could move it to my invert tank to suck up some nitrates in there, and add a new healthier plant?? > Emily

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13144	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis Paul =)

Paul, I think what the general idea here is that yes, people do have a responsibility to care for the animal they choose. The problem is that the fish stores don't bother telling the customer that this particular fish has needs that are going to need to be met in the future. Most people that purchase fish see these cute LITTLE things and never think about them growing out of their tank space. You'd think if they aren't going to bother educating the customer that they could at least put an expected growth size on the tank? Maybe that's too diffiult or would bring down fish sales. I don't know. ;) Ciao' Leslie paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: don't yo think people have a responisibility to care for a pet that they choose? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13145	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank

=) no problem, it took me awhile to figure it out in the beginning too! --- Emily Tenczar <bababanana@...> wrote: > oh! Well duh :) > Emily > > Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote: > local fish store > > --- Emily Tenczar wrote: > > > I live in minnesota :\ > > What is lfs?? > > Emily > > > > Ray Wetzel wrote: > > Emily, Other than adding ice, the only other ways I can think of to > > cool off your tank water is (1) by evaporation, i.e. positioning a fan > > to blow at the surface (which has already been pointed out). In ideal > > circumstances, this may drop the temperature a degree or two, but > > that's nothing on a day in the mid-80's. (2) by use of a > > Thermoelectric Chiller which can be found in most of the better lfs's. > > Something to consider if you live in any part of the country which > > reaches these temperatures for any length of time if you're not going > > to replace the A/C. Average low price is about $300 although Drs. > > Foster & Smith (Pet Warehouse) has one for smaller tanks for > > $109.99. > > \ > > Ice is a lot cheaper, but you have to monitor it. Best (and safest) > > way is to first put the ice in a zip-lock bag, starting out with a > > small amount (you don't want to drop the temp to fast). Then run an > > airstone directly under it to thoroughly circulate the water. After > > reaching the desired temperature, you will have to determine just about > > how much ice it takes to maintain the water at that temperature -- you > > don't want to drop the temp any further than the desired goal. The > > posible drawback is that if that determined amount of ice completely > > melts overnight without your replacing it, the temp is going to bounce > > back up again. Best results are had if you fasten sheet styrofoam to > > at least the back and sides of the tank (you may also consider the > > front as well, with cutting just a small window). A sheet of styro > > over the top will help as well. Except for the styro sheet over the > > top, this would also help with the fan/evaporation method as it will > > prevent a lot of heat gain into the aquarium from the room. (3) > > Putting your air pump in as large a styrofoam box (fish box from lfs) > > as possible filled with ice, with cover just loosely fit with > > definitely help in bring the temp down a couple of degrees, especially > > if its helped with the styro insulation on the tank sides. Ray > > \ > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Emily Tenczar > > wrote: > > > Does anyone have any ideas on how to cool a tank short > > > of adding ice? > > > I've turned off the lights and opened the lid on my > > > goldfish tank, which is in the low 80's right now. The > > > AC isn't working. > > > > > > Thanks > > > Emily > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if > > CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was > re: > > old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if > CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: > old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13146	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank

it's actually in the back of the lid on the right hand side. i have an eclipse 12 that doesn't have a flat lid, rather it's like a rectangle with the bottom half cut out. my hubby had to retro the lid for the power compact bulbs so while he was at it he just cut out a hole big enough to fit a computer fan and stuck it in there. it works amazingly well! the fan is always on, even when the lights go off so it's able to keep the tank at the recommended, stable temp. if you have access to broken down computers with the fans still intact, i would highly recommend using them. here's a link to my tank model so you can see what i'm referring to: http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/prod_display.cfm?pcatid=3865&N=2004+62760 --- Emily Tenczar <bababanana@...> wrote: > you mean you actually have a small fan UNDER the lid? What...how did you install it? > Emily > > Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote: > do you have a fan you can blow onto it? we have a fan in our sw hood & it keeps the tank a nice > range between 76-78 all the time, even w/no a/c & the temps heating up here lately. > --- Emily Tenczar wrote: > > > Does anyone have any ideas on how to cool a tank short > > of adding ice? > > I've turned off the lights and opened the lid on my > > goldfish tank, which is in the low 80's right now. The > > AC isn't working. > > > > Thanks > > Emily > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if > CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: > old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13147	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: Fin rot on angel?

melafix is great stuff! --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > melafix > > --- deborahgd14 <deborahgd14@...> wrote: > > > Hi guys: here we go again. My angel fish had a > > little bit of her fin > > gone (in the back - not sure of the term) and I > > thought it was some > > fish nipping at her. Now more is gone and it has a > > little red near > > her body. She is acting normal and eating. Could > > this be fin rot? > > What would you guys recommend for this? Thank you > > in advance. > > Deborah D > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > Sell on Yahoo! Auctions – no fees. Bid on great items. > http://auctions.yahoo.com/ > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13148	From: Evita	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis Paul =)

I might add that when starting out setting up a tank I would think the person wanting the tank should study up first. I have several books here on fish. Before I would add any fish I would study up on the fish knowing as much as I could along with the growth of the fish. Yes a fish store should tell you if this fish will grow large but people shouldn't just impulse buy either. You can go to the library or go on line too. I am sure store would ask the size of your tank and what type of fish you have already before recommending adding any fish. Evita Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: Paul, I think what the general idea here is that yes, people do have a responsibility to care for the animal they choose. The problem is that the fish stores don't bother telling the customer that this particular fish has needs that are going to need to be met in the future. Most people that purchase fish see these cute LITTLE things and never think about them growing out of their tank space. You'd think if they aren't going to bother educating the customer that they could at least put an expected growth size on the tank? Maybe that's too diffiult or would bring down fish sales. I don't know. ;) Ciao' Leslie paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: don't yo think people have a responisibility to care for a pet that they choose? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13149	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis Paul =)

At petsmart (who's fish look awful by the way) they do have a full size written on the labels. Emily Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: Paul, I think what the general idea here is that yes, people do have a responsibility to care for the animal they choose. The problem is that the fish stores don't bother telling the customer that this particular fish has needs that are going to need to be met in the future. Most people that purchase fish see these cute LITTLE things and never think about them growing out of their tank space. You'd think if they aren't going to bother educating the customer that they could at least put an expected growth size on the tank? Maybe that's too diffiult or would bring down fish sales. I don't know. ;) Ciao' Leslie paul helms wrote: don't yo think people have a responisibility to care for a pet that they choose? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13150	From: paul helms	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis Paul =)

as a matter of personal opinion, i think that if you are unintelligent enough to buy something without asking about its needs that it is the buyers own fault. if they were given mis information or something yeah i can see not wanting it, but being in the industry 4 years, when you tell people a fish will get large they typically like the idea and say they will upgrade. if you have no idea what you are buying, you shoudl not be buying it. a pacu is not even a cute fish, so i personally do not agree that people just buy cute little fishies. about half of the customers want aggressive fish, but no matter how much it is stressed that they will eventually kill the other fish, people do not listen. i am not saying that it is wrong to give a way a fish or to find another hoem for one....exactly the opposite. it is very admirable to put out the effort instead of euthenising the fish. i just do not like it when an lfs is blamed for selling a fish to someone when they decide they do not like or want it. a ish store sells fish. they have a responsibility to answer any and all questions a customer may have, but any seasoned lfs employee also knows that a lot of people get offended when you try to tell them that a fish is not comaptible or imply that they do not have all relevant information. --- Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: > Paul, > I think what the general idea here is that yes, > people do have a > responsibility to care for the animal they choose. > The problem is that > the fish stores don't bother telling the customer > that this particular > fish has needs that are going to need to be met in > the future. Most > people that purchase fish see these cute LITTLE > things and never think > about them growing out of their tank space. > > You'd think if they aren't going to bother educating > the customer that > they could at least put an expected growth size on > the tank? Maybe > that's too diffiult or would bring down fish sales. > I don't know. ;) > > Ciao' > Leslie > > > > > > paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > don't yo think people have a responisibility to care > for a pet that they choose? > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13151	From: paul helms	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis

i agree....and respect that they are finding another home instead of killing.....just don't like lfs's bening blamed for selling the fish and it getting big. --- Deenerz@... wrote: > In a message dated 7/12/2005 12:01:46 PM Pacific > Daylight Time, > wtfmorlok@... writes: > don't yo think people have a responisibility to care > for a pet that they choose? > Yes and that responsibility includes finding a > better home for them for > whatever reason. > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour: http://tour.mail.yahoo.com/mailtour.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13152	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis Paul =)

So far one person from one of the lists and one person from school has shown interest. So hopefully they will be able to get in contact with this guy. I don't even know him well but I felt a responsibility to help the fish even though it isn't my fish. So far no one has contacted me about the fish pond (from another guy who's a good friend of mine). At least he has a place for goldfish if no one wants the whole pond. Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13153	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis

Yes blanket statements can include innocent parties depending on the issue. I have seen the wrong information on tanks in stores, and some employees do not know much about the fish. A little over a month ago I was incorrectly told the name of a trio of fish I bought. Since it is not a very common fish I had not seen a picture of the fish and only knew it by name, location, and behavior. That evening I ran into a very knowledgable cichlid guy at my local club and he told me what they actually are. I lucked out and got fish that were even harder to get. It worked out in my favor this time, but I can easily see it going the otherway more often than not. Five plus years ago I also had a pacu, and I happen to like their looks, and was told a 55 gallon tank would be just fine for it. Well several broken heaters, and missing sections of fins on my oscars I learned they were not quite what I was lead to believe. This sold to me by an LFS that I trusted, the one that sold me my first tank as well as first dozen fish, and up til then had given good information. I was lucky to find a guy in San Jose that had a very large tank that already had two pacu and he was happy to get this one from me and he knew how big they got. My two cents or more. Mike In a message dated 7/12/2005 1:38:14 PM Pacific Daylight Time, wtfmorlok@... writes: i agree....and respect that they are finding another home instead of killing.....just don't like lfs's bening blamed for selling the fish and it getting big. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13154	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis Paul =)

Evita, I agree, however..... My local library having the most up to date aquatic information from 1960 through 1965 was not a good source of information. And information online is often opinion and not accurate unless you look around and find a reputable online resource and that can take some time wading through other sites. Mike In a message dated 7/12/2005 1:41:18 PM Pacific Daylight Time, evitabug@... writes: You can go to the library or go on line too. I am sure store would ask the size of your tank and what type of fish you have already before recommending adding any fish. Evita [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13155	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: RE_ (pacu minni) Petsmart

But I have seen fish mislabeled at Petsmart also. I even got in a mild discussion with the manager. Who told me I was full of BS . I went home got 3 diffrent books saying the same thing and went back to discuss it a little more. I saw her walking out the back door as I entered. The Mis Labeled fish was in a seperate tank without a label.. So I might have actually got through to her , or she might have figuered if i was so sure i was right she'd better investigate. That manager is no longer there :-( Its now run by a snot nosed kid who thinks any south/central american cichlid can be housed for sale in the same tank.... and as long as its a Mbuna it can be housed together. rob Indiana so she might have In a message dated 7/12/2005 3:34:58 PM US Eastern Standard Time, bababanana@... writes: At petsmart (who's fish look awful by the way) they do have a full size written on the labels. Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13156	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: was FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis( peoples responsibility)

you can tell people until your blue in the face that this fish gets 12 inches long and they don't care. 2 of my LFS have quit selling Oscars, Dovii, jaguars, midas and a few other larger central american/ south american fish. One Fish store has a 250 gallon tank with approx 20 10" + Oscars that they have recued from people. MOSt of these larger fish have tell tell signs of hole in the head or other diseases, in its past.. Most people will not listen when you tell them an Oscar can not be housed for long in a 20 gallon tank. rob Indiana In a message dated 7/12/2005 2:20:44 PM US Eastern Standard Time, bababanana@... writes: I'm working on some arachnid breeding projects and I have too many of them already, but I know all I have to do is post a message to a forum and I can have good homes lined up for any extra babies that I might get, no problem. If you know the right people, it's easy to find good homes for baby spiders or scorpions or a large tarantula going out to breed, but no one wants to adopt huge fish. And it's unfortunate that the pet stores are so money-focused that they don't even care about informing people who buy the animals in the first place. Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13157	From: Bruce Hansen	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank

Another strategy a friend of mine uses during "heat waves" is freezing small plastic bottles of water in the family freezer and putting them whole in the tank to gradually thaw, then replacing them to be refrozen and used again. A little extra work but minimal cost . Cheers Bruce (Hansen) ANGFA (Qld) Inc - http://www.angfaqld.org.au/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "TankGurl" <fishgoddess@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 12:57 AM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] how do I cool the water in my tank You could aim some fans that point to the top of the tank and increase your water circulation via a power head. Also, if the tank gets too hot, you could do a 30-40% water change with cooler water. Not icy cold, but just enough to bring down the temp. a couple of degrees while not stressing the fish. Kelly On 7/12/05, Emily Tenczar <bababanana@...> wrote: > Does anyone have any ideas on how to cool a tank short > of adding ice? > I've turned off the lights and opened the lid on my > goldfish tank, which is in the low 80's right now. The > AC isn't working. > > Thanks > Emily > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > -- 65G Lake Malawi http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 135G Lake Tanganyika http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011 36G Brackish http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8498 Tank/s Gallery http://www.picturetrail.com/fish_gurl ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13158	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Angelfishes.

I have five Angelfishes in my 30 gallon tank with eight other smaller fish. I know I need to move at least two of them to the new 55 gallon tank when it matures at the end of the week. But how do you tell the genders from females and males? I have three black and whites, one yellow/black and one silver/black Angelfishes. Thanks, Beth

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13159	From: Rob	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Ameca Splendens/ Other fish

I was wondering if anyone has Ameca Splendens and if they do what other fish work out well with these extinct in the wild fish? I know they come out of the streams in Mexico and were basically eaten up by the larger fish that were brought in to feed the local population. I have them in two species tanks right now but would like to be able to include them with some other fish as they are kind of bland other than the sexually developed males that have a gorgeous yellow band on the end of their tales. I am wondering if they would work out well with some of the non aggressive fish(ie cardinals, rasboras, dwarf rainbows) Dont want to see the fry killed off although they come out almost half an inch long....but also would like to have a little variety in the 65 gallon I am setting them up in. Thanks Rob

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13160	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank

Almost, but a LARGE (not small) box instead, made of styrofoam which is self-insulating. Ice packs would be good as they wouldn't create a puddle as they melt -- you don't want to get the pump wet. And yes, you cut a hole, or just notch the upper edge where the cover fits on; remember you can't put the cover on tight as the pump has to get fresh air to be able to work, but you don't want the lid too loose either. Now, the idea is to keep the air inside as cool as possible, even while fresh air is constantly being drawn in -- that's why you need as big a box as possible (and an insulated box). Best if your lfs has what's called a double (or triple) box. \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Emily Tenczar <bababanana@y...> wrote: > > So just to get this straight, you are saying to actually take a small box with ice packs, cut a hole for the cord and air tube and put the whole pump in there? And that will somehow cool the air? > If you have towels stuffed around the pump now, you are preventing any heat that its generating from disipating, and causing the pump to push air slightly higher in temperature than the room air. Ray \ > Now I'm wondering if I might be inadvertently heating the air because I have some towels and stuff in front of the pump so I don't have to hear the darn thing! But I work in entomology so we have tons of boxes and ice packs. I always save them for mailing critters. > > Emily > > Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > Hi Emily, "lfs" is a fairly common abbreviation on this forum > for "local fish store". You should be able to get a large styrofoam > fish shipping box from them, usually for no charge, as they get them > with each fish order they buy and usually wind up throwing them in > the garbage, as otherwise they just tend to pile up. Pre-cooling the > air that you're pumping into the tank helps a lot, as has been > inadvertantly found out the hard way by many multi-tank hobbyists who > do not want to contend with the noise their blowers might make. All > too often, they'll install the blower in their garage and pipe the > air into their basement fish tank set-up and find, come Winter, that > their tanks are being cooled down. While the idea of putting your > air pump in an ice filled styro box might not be as efficient, it > will have some effect especially if the box is large enough so that > the air gets cooled before it gets used up (pumped out of the box, > into the tank) where fresh warmer air is being drawn into the box. > Noticing you're in Minnesota, I doubt if you really get very long hot > spells, just a stretch here and there. A chiller probably wouldn't > be a practical idea -- got to fix that A/C. Ray > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13161	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank

Great idea Bruce. I think I just about 30 plastic bottles in my recycle bin. I think I am going to go fill some up for my fish room as the top tanks tend to get a bit too hot. Mike In a message dated 7/12/2005 2:48:24 PM Pacific Daylight Time, toxotes@... writes: Another strategy a friend of mine uses during "heat waves" is freezing small plastic bottles of water in the family freezer and putting them whole in the tank to gradually thaw, then replacing them to be refrozen and used again. A little extra work but minimal cost . Cheers Bruce (Hansen) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13162	From: kb1dva	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: pacus

Got my first tank from a guy who posted it on a bulletin board for free , he claimed to not have time for them but it didn't take me long to figure out that the poor pacu was out of room. The tank was a 20 long with 1 pike cichlid, 1 pacu. And 3 blood parrots. He told me they where all blood parrots. Since then ( the beginning of march) I have made a point of learning about my fish and their needs and now have a 90 gallon tank- yes ( sighs ) I know he will eventually get to big for that tank and I will have to find him a new home. I can't imagine finding a spot for a bigger tank. But I feel I have tried to do the best I can for him Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13163	From: paul helms	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: pacus

that is all that you can do. --- kb1dva <vze3pd7a@...> wrote: > Got my first tank from a guy who posted it on a > bulletin board for free , he > claimed to not have time for them but it didn't take > me long to figure out > that the poor pacu was out of room. The tank was a > 20 long with 1 pike > cichlid, 1 pacu. And 3 blood parrots. He told me > they where all blood > parrots. Since then ( the beginning of march) I > have made a point of > learning about my fish and their needs and now have > a 90 gallon tank- yes ( > sighs ) I know he will eventually get to big for > that tank and I will have > to find him a new home. I can't imagine finding a > spot for a bigger tank. > But I feel I have tried to do the best I can for him > Emily > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13164	From: paul helms	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: was FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis( peoples responsibility)

exactly!!!!! --- FortWayneFish@... wrote: > you can tell people until your blue in the face that > this fish gets 12 inches > long and they don't care. 2 of my LFS have quit > selling Oscars, Dovii, > jaguars, midas and a few other larger central > american/ south american fish. > > One Fish store has a 250 gallon tank with approx 20 > 10" + Oscars that they > have recued from people. MOSt of these larger fish > have tell tell signs of hole > in the head or other diseases, in its past.. Most > people will not listen when > you tell them an Oscar can not be housed for long in > a 20 gallon tank. > > rob > Indiana > > > In a message dated 7/12/2005 2:20:44 PM US Eastern > Standard Time, > bababanana@... writes: > > I'm working on some arachnid breeding projects and I > have too many of them > already, but I know all I have to do is post a > message to a forum and I can have > good homes lined up for any extra babies that I > might get, no problem. If you > know the right people, it's easy to find good homes > for baby spiders or > scorpions or a large tarantula going out to breed, > but no one wants to adopt huge > fish. And it's unfortunate that the pet stores are > so money-focused that they > don't even care about informing people who buy the > animals in the first place. > > Emily > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13165	From: paul helms	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis

this is something we talked about last year too. i had a customer that bought a pacu at walmart. they had the name correct, but sold it as "a peaceful community fish that grows to six inches. diet: aquarium flakes." i have to laugh about the 55 gallon thing.....only way that would work is alone and fed only pellets! --- Deenerz@... wrote: > Yes blanket statements can include innocent parties > depending on the issue. > > I have seen the wrong information on tanks in > stores, and some employees do > not know much about the fish. A little over a month > ago I was incorrectly told > the name of a trio of fish I bought. Since it is > not a very common fish I > had not seen a picture of the fish and only knew it > by name, location, and > behavior. That evening I ran into a very > knowledgable cichlid guy at my local club > and he told me what they actually are. I lucked out > and got fish that were > even harder to get. It worked out in my favor this > time, but I can easily see > it going the otherway more often than not. > > Five plus years ago I also had a pacu, and I happen > to like their looks, and > was told a 55 gallon tank would be just fine for it. > Well several broken > heaters, and missing sections of fins on my oscars I > learned they were not quite > what I was lead to believe. This sold to me by an > LFS that I trusted, the one > that sold me my first tank as well as first dozen > fish, and up til then had > given good information. > > I was lucky to find a guy in San Jose that had a > very large tank that already > had two pacu and he was happy to get this one from > me and he knew how big > they got. > > My two cents or more. > Mike > > In a message dated 7/12/2005 1:38:14 PM Pacific > Daylight Time, > wtfmorlok@... writes: > i agree....and respect that they are finding another > home instead of killing.....just don't like lfs's > bening blamed for selling the fish and it getting > big. > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - You care about security. So do we. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13166	From: paul helms	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis Paul =)

hopefully he gets a home --- Emily Tenczar <bababanana@...> wrote: > So far one person from one of the lists and one > person from school has shown interest. So hopefully > they will be able to get in contact with this guy. I > don't even know him well but I felt a responsibility > to help the fish even though it isn't my fish. > > So far no one has contacted me about the fish pond > (from another guy who's a good friend of mine). At > least he has a place for goldfish if no one wants > the whole pond. > Emily > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13167	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis

Ya, I seemed to recall this topic coming up over and over :) My local Wallyworld lists them as growing to 12 inches long, LOL. Ok, that's within the first year, then what? Mike In a message dated 7/12/2005 4:30:31 PM Pacific Daylight Time, wtfmorlok@... writes: this is something we talked about last year too. i had a customer that bought a pacu at walmart. they had the name correct, but sold it as "a peaceful community fish that grows to six inches. diet: aquarium flakes." i have to laugh about the 55 gallon thing.....only way that would work is alone and fed only pellets! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13168	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank

I put a few chunks of ice in my filter to slowly cool it down. I had the same problem when my gf turned off the air conditioning when it was in the 90's out and it got real hat in here...temps were getting up to about 87 degrees. I had to cool my little guys off before I has 55 galls of seafood gumbo ;-) Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Emily Tenczar Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2005 8:33 AM To: UniQuaria; AquaticLife; Freshwater Aquariums Subject: [AquaticLife] how do I cool the water in my tank Does anyone have any ideas on how to cool a tank short of adding ice? I've turned off the lights and opened the lid on my goldfish tank, which is in the low 80's right now. The AC isn't working. Thanks Emily ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13169	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank

Yuck! Sorry Eric you got me laughing pretty good on that one. I better go make sure I am not having a Cichlid Gumbo going on right now. In a message dated 7/12/2005 4:36:50 PM Pacific Daylight Time, woad@... writes: had to cool my little guys off before I has 55 galls of seafood gumbo ;-) Eric [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13170	From: Evita	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis Paul =)

Point well taken but still one should do the best to research before buying. I wonder if your Library is like mine. My Library will take requests when it comes to the buying of new books. Our local library also has some of those same 60's books I might add. I think I have some better books here that I got second hand from a guy that no longer needed the new-bie books. I also have one that is just a fish handbook which I really enjoy reading. Evita Deenerz@... wrote:Evita, I agree, however..... My local library having the most up to date aquatic information from 1960 through 1965 was not a good source of information. And information online is often opinion and not accurate unless you look around and find a reputable online resource and that can take some time wading through other sites. Mike In a message dated 7/12/2005 1:41:18 PM Pacific Daylight Time, evitabug@... writes: You can go to the library or go on line too. I am sure store would ask the size of your tank and what type of fish you have already before recommending adding any fish. Evita [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Sell on Yahoo! Auctions - No fees. Bid on great items. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13171	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: Angelfishes.

Hi Beth, There are several characteristics to look for in Angelfish which will help to determine their sex about 80% of the time, or better, depending upon who's doing the determination. These points are generalities, as only the Angelfish know males and females from each other 100% of the time. As I don't know how old your fish are, I can't say if you would be able to use this point -- and that is, in older fish, males tend to be larger than females and develop a slight nuccal hump on the head as per many Cichlids, although I have seen some LARGE females occasionally (I did say GENERALITIES). Other than that, look for these points: (1) head on, females are almost always fatter (wider) in the belly region. (2) still looking head on, the female's ventral fins are spread wider, whereas the males ventral fins tend to droop straight down. (3) side profile, the angle of the body between the ventral fins and the anal fin is of a steeper angle in the males and almost horizontal in the females. (4) Additionally, the distance of this body area is shorter in the males and up to twice the distance in the females. (5) Even in younger fish (of at least 9 months old), the female's head profile is slightly more pointed. (6) the ventral fins tend to be a bit longer in males. As I said, these are generalities, which sometimes takes an experienced breeder to distinguish, but are things to look for. You may not necessarily see all these points in one fish, but you will see a combination of most of them. The most "ify" point is the tendancy of the males to have longer ventral fins, especially in domesticated stock. Using the above points to look for, Angelfish's sex can be determined, with a fair amount of accuracy at at an age as early as 6 weeks, if you know what your look for. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Beth Brownell" <spencer_creek_studios@y...> wrote: > I have five Angelfishes in my 30 gallon tank with eight other smaller > fish. I know I need to move at least two of them to the new 55 gallon > tank when it matures at the end of the week. > But how do you tell the genders from females and males? > I have three black and whites, one yellow/black and one silver/black > Angelfishes. > > Thanks, > Beth

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13172	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: was:FREE Pacu! IN( Cheap aquatic books)

I found 5 years worth of "Freshwater and Marine Aquarium" Magazine on Ebay for $5.00 plus shipping. when i contacted the person and asked if they would send media mail they asked what that was :-) so for less then $10.00 I got close to 60 magazines. They range in years from 1997-2002 Some of them where well read, and a few had torn pages. I have found these to be a World of information. I also have found 1 yrs worth of TFH for $5, and c a couple other magazines on ebay SEAHORSES.com an Aquatic bookstore has a lot of $1 books and magazines. Plus tons of other info rob Indiana In a message dated 7/12/2005 6:42:32 PM US Eastern Standard Time, evitabug@... writes: I think I have some better books here that I got second hand from a guy that no longer needed the new-bie books. I also have one that is just a fish handbook which I really enjoy reading. Evita [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13173	From: Evita	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: RE_ (pacu minni) Petsmart

Our local Petsmart used to have really friendly people working there along with crystle clear water. They actually had people with knowledge of fish working there willing to help new-bies. I went there the other day and was shocked to see how down hill their tanks had gone. The were actually worse than Walmart with sick and dying fish through out. Plus cloudy water. I am planning a field trip my next day off to yet another local town till I find a Local Pet Shop that cares for it's customers and fish as well. I pointed out to the guy the condition of his tanks and all the dead fish and he didn't seem to care. He tried to sell me frogs and when he took me over to look at them they were all motionless, dead floating or struggling. He tried to make light of it and just said "OH...I guess you better not buy them after all. Anyone could see something was wrong with all the tanks. I heard from someone although I don't know it's true that their all the water is filtered through all the tanks as one. Also in nature I heard that frogs are the first sign that something isn't right in nature. When problems accure in nature the frog number are the first to show it. Thus those frogs doing the worst. I was disappointed at the cloudiness of the water. I will not be going back. I am beginning to wonder if I will ever find a place locally that I can drive to. If someone wants to set up a small community tank with relatively cheaper fish and you have to drive an hour to get them, you don't want to drive back if they die. Yes they might have a great return policy but gas is too much. I would rather have hardy healthy fish to start with. I live 30-45 minutes from Winston Salem, NC and was wondering if anyone might know a good place to check out? Possibly in High Point or Salsbury....Greensboro but only if the place is the best ever. I hate large towns I haven't drove before. I am a bit phobic with the driving thing. Evita FortWayneFish@... wrote: But I have seen fish mislabeled at Petsmart also. I even got in a mild discussion with the manager. Who told me I was full of BS . I went home got 3 diffrent books saying the same thing and went back to discuss it a little more. I saw her walking out the back door as I entered. The Mis Labeled fish was in a seperate tank without a label.. So I might have actually got through to her , or she might have figuered if i was so sure i was right she'd better investigate. That manager is no longer there :-( Its now run by a snot nosed kid who thinks any south/central american cichlid can be housed for sale in the same tank.... and as long as its a Mbuna it can be housed together. rob Indiana so she might have In a message dated 7/12/2005 3:34:58 PM US Eastern Standard Time, bababanana@... writes: At petsmart (who's fish look awful by the way) they do have a full size written on the labels. Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13174	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis

That's good that they do that. They don't do that here or in my home town though. Nor does Petco or the LFS. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Emily Tenczar Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2005 3:23 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis Paul =) At petsmart (who's fish look awful by the way) they do have a full size written on the labels. Emily Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: Paul, I think what the general idea here is that yes, people do have a responsibility to care for the animal they choose. The problem is that the fish stores don't bother telling the customer that this particular fish has needs that are going to need to be met in the future. Most people that purchase fish see these cute LITTLE things and never think about them growing out of their tank space. You'd think if they aren't going to bother educating the customer that they could at least put an expected growth size on the tank? Maybe that's too diffiult or would bring down fish sales. I don't know. ;) Ciao' Leslie paul helms wrote: don't yo think people have a responisibility to care for a pet that they choose? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13175	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis

"I might add that when starting out setting up a tank I would think the person wanting the tank should study up first. " You would think so, yes. But unfortunately not all are created equal in the common sense department. =) paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: don't yo think people have a responisibility to care for a pet that they choose? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13176	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis Paul =)

Paul, Point taken, and agreed. =) Leslie

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13177	From: Evita	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: was FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis( peoples responsibility)

Rob, Your local pet shop sounds like a great one. Not many would even care what happens to those Oscars. Our local Walmart sells them I might add. I was there the other day and started a converation with a man and his small son that were checking them out. I am a new-bie but this man was a no-bie. He knew nothing but was just picking what he thought looked good. He had a 10 gal tank he said he was just setting up for his son. I told him basically stuff about all the different types of fish they had that I had learned in my groups, books and what not, along with pointing out why not to buy this or that fish and how it was sick and why. He left without buying anything and during that time no sales person walked up till the end. I pointed the sick fish out to hi as well he didn't care either. Min. wage job why care or bother thing. When the man and his son walked off I almost laughed when he said, "Boy you know a ton about fish". I told him I knew only a tad bit but more than that sales person. I advised him to study up and get a good book or two before starting. Oh he also was talking Gold fish. Having made mistakes myself on that I told him all I had learned since about them. Evita FortWayneFish@... wrote:you can tell people until your blue in the face that this fish gets 12 inches long and they don't care. 2 of my LFS have quit selling Oscars, Dovii, jaguars, midas and a few other larger central american/ south american fish. One Fish store has a 250 gallon tank with approx 20 10" + Oscars that they have recued from people. MOSt of these larger fish have tell tell signs of hole in the head or other diseases, in its past.. Most people will not listen when you tell them an Oscar can not be housed for long in a 20 gallon tank. rob Indiana In a message dated 7/12/2005 2:20:44 PM US Eastern Standard Time, bababanana@... writes: I'm working on some arachnid breeding projects and I have too many of them already, but I know all I have to do is post a message to a forum and I can have good homes lined up for any extra babies that I might get, no problem. If you know the right people, it's easy to find good homes for baby spiders or scorpions or a large tarantula going out to breed, but no one wants to adopt huge fish. And it's unfortunate that the pet stores are so money-focused that they don't even care about informing people who buy the animals in the first place. Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13178	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis Paul =)

Don't dismiss all of those books from the '60's thinking they are all out-dated -- depending upon who the author and/or publisher was, those books (and even earlier ones from the '50's, etc.) are often the most accurate and informative, Dr. William T. Innes being one of them. His information is never out of date and is usually well detailed, as are many others of that period, only not to include the more later introductions, i.e., Rift Lake Cichlids, etc. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Evita <evitabug@y...> wrote: > Point well taken but still one should do the best to research before buying. I wonder if your Library is like mine. My Library will take requests when it comes to the buying of new books. Our local library also has some of those same 60's books I might add. I think I have some better books here that I got second hand from a guy that no longer needed the new-bie books. I also have one that is just a fish handbook which I really enjoy reading. Evita > > Deenerz@a... wrote:Evita, > I agree, however..... > My local library having the most up to date aquatic information from 1960 > through 1965 was not a good source of information. And information online is > often opinion and not accurate unless you look around and find a reputable online > resource and that can take some time wading through other sites. > > Mike > > In a message dated 7/12/2005 1:41:18 PM Pacific Daylight Time, > evitabug@y... writes: > You can go to the library or go on line too. I am sure store would ask the > size of your tank and what type of fish you have already before recommending > adding any fish. Evita > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > --------------------------------- > Sell on Yahoo! Auctions - No fees. Bid on great items. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13179	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: Angelfishes.

From what I was reading, the males have more of the golden yellow color than the females...though my pair is the exact opposite... Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Beth Brownell Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2005 10:00 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Angelfishes. I have five Angelfishes in my 30 gallon tank with eight other smaller fish. I know I need to move at least two of them to the new 55 gallon tank when it matures at the end of the week. But how do you tell the genders from females and males? I have three black and whites, one yellow/black and one silver/black Angelfishes. Thanks, Beth ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13180	From: Evita	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: was:FREE Pacu! IN( Cheap aquatic books)

I love the mag. on birds too. I get some locally for 1.00 a piece. You got a deal and a half. Hours of reading and re-reading I am sure. I like having my own stuff here because I can go back and re-read stuff. I am one for second hand mag. and books. Why pay full new prices. They are timeless. Evita FortWayneFish@... wrote:I found 5 years worth of "Freshwater and Marine Aquarium" Magazine on Ebay for $5.00 plus shipping. when i contacted the person and asked if they would send media mail they asked what that was :-) so for less then $10.00 I got close to 60 magazines. They range in years from 1997-2002 Some of them where well read, and a few had torn pages. I have found these to be a World of information. I also have found 1 yrs worth of TFH for $5, and c a couple other magazines on ebay SEAHORSES.com an Aquatic bookstore has a lot of $1 books and magazines. Plus tons of other info rob Indiana In a message dated 7/12/2005 6:42:32 PM US Eastern Standard Time, evitabug@... writes: I think I have some better books here that I got second hand from a guy that no longer needed the new-bie books. I also have one that is just a fish handbook which I really enjoy reading. Evita [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Sell on Yahoo! Auctions - No fees. Bid on great items. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13181	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: RE_ (pacu minni) Petsmart

Try doing internet searches...that is how I found the few remaining local mom and pop stores that have survived the corporate rape. I found some pretty cool shops in the area that I try to support as much as possible. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evita Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2005 7:01 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] RE_ (pacu minni) Petsmart Our local Petsmart used to have really friendly people working there along with crystle clear water. They actually had people with knowledge of fish working there willing to help new-bies. I went there the other day and was shocked to see how down hill their tanks had gone. The were actually worse than Walmart with sick and dying fish through out. Plus cloudy water. I am planning a field trip my next day off to yet another local town till I find a Local Pet Shop that cares for it's customers and fish as well. I pointed out to the guy the condition of his tanks and all the dead fish and he didn't seem to care. He tried to sell me frogs and when he took me over to look at them they were all motionless, dead floating or struggling. He tried to make light of it and just said "OH...I guess you better not buy them after all. Anyone could see something was wrong with all the tanks. I heard from someone although I don't know it's true that their all the water is filtered through all the tanks as one. Also in nature I heard that frogs are the first sign that something isn't right in nature. When problems accure in nature the frog number are the first to show it. Thus those frogs doing the worst. I was disappointed at the cloudiness of the water. I will not be going back. I am beginning to wonder if I will ever find a place locally that I can drive to. If someone wants to set up a small community tank with relatively cheaper fish and you have to drive an hour to get them, you don't want to drive back if they die. Yes they might have a great return policy but gas is too much. I would rather have hardy healthy fish to start with. I live 30-45 minutes from Winston Salem, NC and was wondering if anyone might know a good place to check out? Possibly in High Point or Salsbury....Greensboro but only if the place is the best ever. I hate large towns I haven't drove before. I am a bit phobic with the driving thing. Evita FortWayneFish@... wrote: But I have seen fish mislabeled at Petsmart also. I even got in a mild discussion with the manager. Who told me I was full of BS . I went home got 3 diffrent books saying the same thing and went back to discuss it a little more. I saw her walking out the back door as I entered. The Mis Labeled fish was in a seperate tank without a label.. So I might have actually got through to her , or she might have figuered if i was so sure i was right she'd better investigate. That manager is no longer there :-( Its now run by a snot nosed kid who thinks any south/central american cichlid can be housed for sale in the same tank.... and as long as its a Mbuna it can be housed together. rob Indiana so she might have In a message dated 7/12/2005 3:34:58 PM US Eastern Standard Time, bababanana@... writes: At petsmart (who's fish look awful by the way) they do have a full size written on the labels. Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13182	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis Paul =)

PetCo also does that on MOST fish...not all the tanks have the labels though. None of the local stores have their fish labeled with this info however. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Emily Tenczar Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2005 3:23 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis Paul =) At petsmart (who's fish look awful by the way) they do have a full size written on the labels. Emily Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: Paul, I think what the general idea here is that yes, people do have a responsibility to care for the animal they choose. The problem is that the fish stores don't bother telling the customer that this particular fish has needs that are going to need to be met in the future. Most people that purchase fish see these cute LITTLE things and never think about them growing out of their tank space. You'd think if they aren't going to bother educating the customer that they could at least put an expected growth size on the tank? Maybe that's too diffiult or would bring down fish sales. I don't know. ;) Ciao' Leslie paul helms wrote: don't yo think people have a responisibility to care for a pet that they choose? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13183	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank

*grin* Glad to be of service milady...*bowing with a flourish...* Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Deenerz@... Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2005 6:39 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] how do I cool the water in my tank Yuck! Sorry Eric you got me laughing pretty good on that one. I better go make sure I am not having a Cichlid Gumbo going on right now. In a message dated 7/12/2005 4:36:50 PM Pacific Daylight Time, woad@... writes: had to cool my little guys off before I has 55 galls of seafood gumbo ;-) Eric [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13184	From: Sandra willber	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: bata question

I have a 10 gallon warm water fish tank for my batas. I have 1 male and 3 females in the tank, but the male seems uninterested in the females. He doesn't make any bubble nest either. I have the temputure in the tank about 75 degrees. Should the tempature be higher for batas to breed? or do I need a bigger tank for that to happen? Sandra These are new groups that have started up since January 2005; http://groups.yahoo.com/group/nandaychatter http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Wisconsin-photography-club http://groups.yahoo.com/group/The-photography-club http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Wisconsin-walkers-club http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Talking-across-america __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13185	From: Ambisense	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: hello new member

Hi everyone, Just wanted to drop a quick hello because I'm new here :) I own neon tetras, several gold fishes, and bettas. Their photos can be found on my personal webpage: http://www.littlefeatheredbuddies.com/tran-spired Although the bettas are living in separate 1/2 gal tanks, they will be moving into a 10 gal in a couple of weeks (I bought plexiglass type dividers for the tank so they'll each get a cozy ~3 gal to themselves. I just have a quick question right now, is there a reputable heater brand that someone can recommend for a 10 gal? I don't want to get a super strong heater that will make fish soup. Thanks -Amy

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13186	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: catfish

In a message dated 7/12/2005 2:06:52 P.M. Central Standard Time, wtfmorlok@... writes: rafael, barking, syndontis, etc syndontis-I thought they were from Africa? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13187	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: Angelfishes.

Don't believe all you read!--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > From what I was reading, the males have more of the golden yellow color than > the females...though my pair is the exact opposite... > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Beth Brownell > Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2005 10:00 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Angelfishes. > > > I have five Angelfishes in my 30 gallon tank with eight other smaller > fish. I know I need to move at least two of them to the new 55 gallon > tank when it matures at the end of the week. > But how do you tell the genders from females and males? > I have three black and whites, one yellow/black and one silver/black > Angelfishes. > > Thanks, > Beth > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13188	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: Hi, new member. Long time fish owner.

Evita, That could be a tough call to make. If you need an easy out--yes. But, there could be other causes as well. That would be something only an fish autopsy could determine, and I would dare say that most of us do not have the experience or the equipment available to do it, if we had the time. Stress is usually a mitigating factor in fish health. Normally, like in a human, it can lead to a weakened immune system, which is just an invite for pathogens to invade. I would not say that it cannot kill, being the only factor, but, I would generally be looking for another cause or shrug my shoulders with an "Oh, well." Most animals are quite adept at hiding an illness or disease. Those of us with dogs and cats know that for a fact, and only pick up on a problem because of a slight change in demeanor or behavior of the dog or cat. With a new dog or cat, it would be the same as with a new fish. You do not know the animal well enough to pick up on the slight cues that may be given that something is wrong. You see the fish at the shop, and they all look OK, so you tell the clerk to give you a bunch of those fish. He does, and everything looks good until the next day when one has kicked the bucket. If you were not looking carefully when the fish was captured and bagged, you may not have noticed the fish being squeezed between the net and the glass, or some other such mishap, and there are no marks to indicate that this had happened. While you were elsewhere, the new guys on the block were being harassed by the neighborhood gang, and an injury was inflicted that causes the demise of one of the fish. Maybe he was not a particularly strong specimen to begin, and the change in pH did him in. Or any of a million other reasons. So, if you need to, say it was stress. Otherwise, just shrug your shoulders and say "Oh well." (Kind of hard to do with a $50 fish, though.) \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evita Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2005 9:16 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Hi, new member. Long time fish owner. Steve, Question. If a fish dies the next day lets say after bring it home with no sign of illness could that indeed be more than likely stress related? I have had that happen. Evita Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote:Beth, Welcome. I give up. What is a polly? Just have the store double bag them and add at least air to the bag so it is taut to the feel. Don't put too may fish in the bag and only fill with enough water to cover the fish when the bag is laid length wise, probably less than a quarter to a third of a bag of water will be more than sufficient. Bring along a cooler, and place the fish in the cooler and shut the lid tight. Most fish will be less active in the dark. Then drive straight home. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Beth Brownell Sent: Monday, July 11, 2005 6:33 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Hi, new member. Long time fish owner. My name is Beth and I have a 30 gallon tropical tank. I had just bought my second tank a 55 gallon tank. I'm working on getting it filled with different types of tropical fish. I have a polly - an alge eater which my family calls polly, which I will be transfering over to the new tank. I know I will be needing two more pollies for my smaller tank till they get bigger. Does anyone have advice on how to transport new fish an hour and a half from the store you bought them from to your home? The nearest fish store in my area, I happen to live in South Central Missouri, is only an hour and half drive to get there. I will be bringing a bucket so they can put the fish in but I'm not sure how to really transport them home without losing one or more of my fish. Any advice will help me greatly. Thanks, Beth Brownell spencer_creek_studios@...

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13189	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: catfish

In a message dated 7/12/2005 6:30:50 PM Pacific Daylight Time, Crazy4fids@... writes: syndontis-I thought they were from Africa? Linda Yes most Synodontis are from Africa. I would not put a larger one with smaller fish. I missed the beginning of this thread. So I am not much help. Mike [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13190	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: water test and dead guppy-long

A few more days have gone past and I have a few more questions. It looks like the water in my 150 freshwater tank is all cycled in. I don't recall ever having an ammonia reading above zero and the nitrates went from a little over .3 three days ago to zero today. The pH has been between 7.5 and maybe 7.8. I have been using Tetra test kits and the pH result card goes from 7.5 then to 8.0. My result is neither of these colors, but somewhat in between. The GH reading in the past few days has been 11, 10, 13 (I tested it twice), 12 and today it is also 12. The KH readings are as follows: 11, 10, 10, 10, and today it looked like it was somewhere between 9 and 10. For the past three days I have been treating the tank with PimaFix for cotton mouth or some other kind of mouth bacteria. The rummy nose tetras were looking like they had eaten salt or powdered sugar. It was only on their mouth. They look much better as each day goes by. I also had three female guppies in this tank. one of them had 35-40 fry the day after I put them in the tank. One of them is fine. One of them died between last night and tonight with no visible symptoms. The third one is not looking very well. Her silhouette is not smooth, but rather rough or fuzzy. She is also swimming funny. She kind of shimmies, or wags back and forth. The first day I noticed her behavior was a couple of day ago when she was not eating. Today she is eating, but the other fish will go up and poke at her. I didn't take her out of the tank because I was treating everyone along with the rummy nose tetras. I have three fry left that didn't get eaten and they are fine. I am guessing that the rummy nose got sick because of the trouble with the pH and having to pull everything out of the tank to pick out those stupid pond pebbles. Too much stress for them. Any suggestions as to what happened to the one that died and the one that is sick? Also is it normal for my GH and KH to change like it has from day to day? Maybe it is because of the PimaFix? Oh yeah, the water has been noticeably cloudy for the past two days, and I have removed the carbon from the filters. Need input, Thanks a bunch in advance, Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13191	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: catfish

Mike- I am looking for a native catfish to add to my 150 gallon aquarium. I already have 8 cory cats on my list but was looking for something different similar to a syndontis. I think I may be getting a striped raphael catfish, but was wondering whether I would ever see it. I love the look of syndontis. BTW, I have rummy nose tetras, neon tetras, glow light tetras, two guppies, and three peppered cory cats. I will be adding 4 more cories, 8 angelfish and 4 keyhole cichlids. So the catfish need to be a peaceful one. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13192	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank

How hots your ambient temperature? I'm thinking of what I can do with my tank when the ambient temp gets to 35degC. =Nick Valeen Gonzalez wrote: >do you have a fan you can blow onto it? we have a fan in our sw hood & it keeps the tank a nice >range between 76-78 all the time, even w/no a/c & the temps heating up here lately. >--- Emily Tenczar <bababanana@...> wrote: > > > >>Does anyone have any ideas on how to cool a tank short >>of adding ice? >>I've turned off the lights and opened the lid on my >>goldfish tank, which is in the low 80's right now. The >>AC isn't working. >> >>Thanks >>Emily >> >> >> > > >Valeen Robertson Gonzalez >I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > > > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >AquaticLife Management. > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13193	From: rojeriko	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: keeping the rainbows

Hi, I've just added a few rainbows to my 38g platy setup. 3 dwarf rainbow (1M/2F Melanotaenia maccullochi) and 2 dwarf neon rainbow (1M/1F Melantaenia praecox). I'm wondering about the proper male/female ratio. I seached the web and I found different recommendations as 1M/1F, 1M/2F and 3M/2F. What's your experience ? I'm planning to 1-2 neon rainbows. Btw, I'm not planning to breed them so cross-breeding will not happen Thanks, Murat

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13194	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: feeding plecos

I tired green peas with my Tiger barbs, Silver Sharks, Guppies, Cory Dory, Bristle Nose, Mollies, but none of them took any notice? Is it something you have to get them used to over time? I know it took a couple of days before they would all eat the pallets instead of the flakes. =Nick FortWayneFish@... wrote: >any lettuce but Romaine.. I do believe >I feed a lot of yellow "summer" squash >cucumbers, fresh boiled green beans, peas, >the list could be endless.. > >but i stick to cucumber, and squash myself.. >easier on me... > >rob > > >In a message dated 7/6/2005 1:15:22 PM US Eastern Standard Time, >TheSydMonster@... writes: > > > > >>I only have 1 albino BN pleco in my 37 gallon tank and I actually feed >>him in the morning. I do feed him in the same place, in front of his >>little cave entrance. If the wafer drifts he'll find it and pull it >>back in there. I have to say, though, that he LOVES zucchini. I have >>to put two pieces in because he will not share with the otos! I only >>feed him every other day. >> >>What kind of lettuce is recommended for them? Any other veggies they >>seem to love? >> >> >> > > > >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >AquaticLife Management. > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13195	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: feeding plecos

What kind of wood would you suggest? Does a softwood or hardwood any difference? =Nick FortWayneFish@... wrote: >The reason to feed a varied diet is to help the fish get all there vitamans. >Yes vitamans are needed by our fish. Of course if you are feeding a decent >flake food, supplimented by algae waffers, or vegetables your fish are probally >recieving enough of the right vitamans. > >My Bristlenose have been breeding like clock work every 3 weeks giving me >between 100-200 babies since September last year. truthfully I don't think the >Parent BN have gotten any vegies in the last 6 months ( shame on me ) >Just Flake food and sinking shrimp pellets. > >A piece of real wood, is a plus in a pleco tank as it helps the plecos >digestive system, and is also afood supply. My Babies grow 2x faster in a tank with >driftwwod in it then in a tank w/o driftwood. > >My LFS gives me $.25 each for 1"+ juveniles. Not a lot but it helps pay for >the food. > >rob >Indiana > > >rob >Indiana > > >In a message dated 7/6/2005 5:37:30 PM US Eastern Standard Time, >TheSydMonster@... writes: > > > > >>So it is still healthy for them to eat just a few things? I rotate >>algae wafers, spirulina (sp?) flakes, zucchini, cucumber and peas >>for him and the oto. The peas were not a big hit, though. >> >>--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, FortWayneFish@a... wrote: >> >> >>>any lettuce but Romaine.. I do believe >>>I feed a lot of yellow "summer" squash >>>cucumbers, fresh boiled green beans, peas, >>>the list could be endless.. >>> >>>but i stick to cucumber, and squash myself.. >>>easier on me... >>> >>> > > > >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >AquaticLife Management. > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13196	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Mollies go to surface to breath?

Hi, I've got two mollies which always go to the surface and look like they are eating food but there is no food. alternatively are they trying to breath the air kinda like Betas? Non of my other fish in the tank do it, pH, Ammonia, Nitrite are perfect. =Nick

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13197	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: dying java fern

Cynthia, You seem to be missing an important point here. The plant is in a betta bowl. Also we are talking about Java Fern. A 100% water change may well affect the health of the plant, though it is rather tough to kill a Java Fern--one really needs to try. Secondly, a Java Fern does not need to be rooted, per se, but is more often tied to a rock or a piece of driftwood, where it eventually takes hold. I'd be rather leery about adding fertilizer, in any form, to encourage the growth of this plant. Too easy to overdose in the small container she has. Java Fern gets its nutrients from the water, through its roots. I would think that the main problem she may be having here is too much light. Java Fern is really a low light plant, and too much light can cause the appearance of transparent spots on the leaves, and the snails she has in the tank could very well be making them into holes as the leaves die off. A lack of nutrition could also have adverse effects on this plant, but they would need to occur over time to be noticeable. I think her plan of moving the plant to another tank for the time being, and stripping away all the old growth is probably the way to go to nurse this plant back to health. When she does move it back to the betta bowl, the occasional addition of some trace elements may help it retain its health, along with the lowering of the amount of light the plant receives. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of cynthia brennemann Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2005 3:27 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: dying java fern Your plant needs a better substrate than plain aquarium gravel. It shouldn't be affected by a water change unless its ONLY nutrition comes from nitrates in the water. At the very least you need to get some of those fertilizer tabs to stick down in the gravel next to the roots of your plant. It would be better if you could wrap the fertilizer tab in peat moss and sand, maybe wrapped in paper to keep it from clouding the water. Then work that down into the gravel next to the roots, for the plant to work its roots into the fertilze substrate. Trimming the dead parts back is a good idea, but as long as teh roots are alive, it should recover if you give it something to feed on. > It's plain aquarium gravel, in one of those 2 gal. hex tanks. Only one betta and several snails. > > I just thought of something: the plant started looking bad after I did a water change. Water change removes nitrates. Maybe I should just take the plant out, trim it back and replace the living part of the plant which is very small and wouldn't need as much nitrogen to feed on. Or I could move it to my invert tank to suck up some nitrates in there, and add a new healthier plant?? > Emily

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13198	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank

I've been following this thread today, some at work and some at home, and though some have beaten around the bush, so to speak, no one has really nailed it. If your tank is prone to warm up in the summer due to the ambient temperatures rising, and you do need to keep it somewhat cooler, the next best thing to getting a chiller, which can be expensive to purchase and expensive to run, you need to get what we call a "dorm" refrigerator. These are those small refrigerators that students often place in their rooms so that a cold one of their favorite beverage is not far away. They are small, and inexpensive when new, and can often be picked up for next to nothing when used. They are not real expensive to run. Once you have picked up one of these marvels of modern technology, you need to drill two holes in it for the plastic tubing you will be putting through it. The tubing will be the size that will fit onto a powerhead so you can pump water through it. Attach one end to the powerhead (don't turn it on quite yet) and then tread it through one of the holes in the refrigerator. Col it up in the refrigerator, leaving enough room for air to circulate around the tubing, the feed the end through the other hole and back to you tank. Seal the holes with silicone to prevent air leakage and close the refrigerator, and start it up. Then start your power head to pump the water through the tubing and back to the tank. You'll need a power head that will not pump the water through at a furious rate, but one that will cause a slow flow of water back into the tank to give the water enough time to cool off in the fridge before being returned. If you leave some room in the fridge, you can even keep a few cold ones in there for yourself while you are working on or enjoying your tank. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nicolas Munro Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2005 10:54 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] how do I cool the water in my tank How hots your ambient temperature? I'm thinking of what I can do with my tank when the ambient temp gets to 35degC. =Nick Valeen Gonzalez wrote: >do you have a fan you can blow onto it? we have a fan in our sw hood & it keeps the tank a nice >range between 76-78 all the time, even w/no a/c & the temps heating up here lately. >--- Emily Tenczar <bababanana@...> wrote: > > > >>Does anyone have any ideas on how to cool a tank short >>of adding ice? >>I've turned off the lights and opened the lid on my >>goldfish tank, which is in the low 80's right now. The >>AC isn't working. >> >>Thanks >>Emily >> >> >> > > >Valeen Robertson Gonzalez >I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13199	From: kritter714@aol.com	Date: 7/12/2005
Subject: Re: catfish

In my experience rapheals are nocturnal predators one night 8 neons gone any catfish with long barbels tend to be predators so no channels cats or pictus. you might look for Brochis look like giant corys or some of the cool corys like Robinea. Elaine in the emerald city 125 gallon marine, 90 gallon discus 80 gallon south american cichlid 55 gallon african cichlid 50 gallon temperate water tank [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13200	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Angelfishes.

Thanks Ray, I'll check my Angels in the morning when I wake up more to tell which is a girl and who's a boy. Beth

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13201	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: What types of fish would you recommend for 55 gall tank?

For tropical freshwater tank. I already got two Angelfishes for the tank, they are about two inches big. I am not going to do a marine tank, my older brother did that once and he regrets doing it as he was a beginner at it, even if he did good at it. It stressed him because he was worried about the fish he had. And the plycomous will be moved over to the bigger tank so my smaller 30 gallon will need a new alge eater. Thanks, Beth

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13202	From: Bruce Hansen	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: keeping the rainbows

Murat Your rainbows will tend to school together anyway. But to get the best displays you need at least 2 males of each species to spar against each other. The number of females isn't as important if they are only for display - just have a couple of each. You will find fry in your community tank anyway and of course there may well be hybrids produced. If you try to direct a current along the front glass via a small powerhead your school will usually be right there in full view. Cheers Bruce (Hansen) ANGFA (Qld) Inc - http://www.angfaqld.org.au/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "rojeriko" <rojeriko@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 12:57 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] keeping the rainbows Hi, I've just added a few rainbows to my 38g platy setup. 3 dwarf rainbow (1M/2F Melanotaenia maccullochi) and 2 dwarf neon rainbow (1M/1F Melantaenia praecox). I'm wondering about the proper male/female ratio. I seached the web and I found different recommendations as 1M/1F, 1M/2F and 3M/2F. What's your experience ? I'm planning to 1-2 neon rainbows. Btw, I'm not planning to breed them so cross-breeding will not happen Thanks, Murat ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13203	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: What types of fish would you recommend for 55 gall tank?

Beth, You have plenty of options for a 55 gallon tank. Practically, most things will fit in except the likes of large cichlids, very large predators and the previously discusses Pacu. It all depends on as to what type of look and feel you want for the tank as 80% of the fish can be considered. (ofcourse also considering their compatibility) . Planted tank? High light high tech planted tanks? Large fish? Rocky? Brackish with roots etc.? or just a plain simple gravel and fish? Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Beth Brownell Sent: 13 July 2005 10:00 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] What types of fish would you recommend for 55 gall tank? For tropical freshwater tank. I already got two Angelfishes for the tank, they are about two inches big. I am not going to do a marine tank, my older brother did that once and he regrets doing it as he was a beginner at it, even if he did good at it. It stressed him because he was worried about the fish he had. And the plycomous will be moved over to the bigger tank so my smaller 30 gallon will need a new alge eater. Thanks, Beth ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13204	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: keeping the rainbows

In a way, either have all males or have more females then males as Dwarf rainbows do spawn very frequently in right conditions and this can very severly stress the females out. But yes, for display, nothing better then all males ;) Nim # _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Bruce Hansen Sent: 13 July 2005 10:24 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] keeping the rainbows Murat Your rainbows will tend to school together anyway. But to get the best displays you need at least 2 males of each species to spar against each other. The number of females isn't as important if they are only for display - just have a couple of each. You will find fry in your community tank anyway and of course there may well be hybrids produced. If you try to direct a current along the front glass via a small powerhead your school will usually be right there in full view. Cheers Bruce (Hansen) ANGFA (Qld) Inc - http://www.angfaqld.org.au/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "rojeriko" <rojeriko@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 12:57 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] keeping the rainbows Hi, I've just added a few rainbows to my 38g platy setup. 3 dwarf rainbow (1M/2F Melanotaenia maccullochi) and 2 dwarf neon rainbow (1M/1F Melantaenia praecox). I'm wondering about the proper male/female ratio. I seached the web and I found different recommendations as 1M/1F, 1M/2F and 3M/2F. What's your experience ? I'm planning to 1-2 neon rainbows. Btw, I'm not planning to breed them so cross-breeding will not happen Thanks, Murat ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13205	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: RE_ (pacu minni) Petsmart

90%- 95% of chain stores will have a centralized filteration system. and most do not run a UV. So if you see Ich in one tank more then likely there is ich in all the tanks. One reason most mom and pop stores or strictly fish stores usually have better fish. rob Indiana In a message dated 7/12/2005 7:02:16 PM US Eastern Standard Time, evitabug@... writes: OH...I guess you better not buy them after all. Anyone could see something was wrong with all the tanks. I heard from someone although I don't know it's true that their all the water is filtered through all the tanks as one. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13206	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: catfish

Couple of Bristlenose my opinion... n a message dated 7/12/2005 9:34:21 PM US Eastern Standard Time, Crazy4fids@... writes: Mike- I am looking for a native catfish to add to my 150 gallon aquarium. I already have 8 cory cats on my list but was looking for something different similar to a syndontis. I think I may be getting a striped raphael catfish, but was wondering whether I would ever see it. I love the look of syndontis. BTW, I have rummy nose tetras, neon tetras, glow light tetras, two guppies, and three peppered cory cats. I will be adding 4 more cories, 8 angelfish and 4 keyhole cichlids. So the catfish need to be a peaceful one. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13207	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: feeding plecos

aquarium safe wood or driftwood would be the only way I'd go. if you go driftwood try to find hardwood driftwood as the softwoods will eech tanins for ever and a day rob indiana In a message dated 7/12/2005 10:06:49 PM US Eastern Standard Time, nmunro@... writes: What kind of wood would you suggest? Does a softwood or hardwood any difference? =Nick [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13208	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: hello new member

Get a Supreme Heetmaster, 25 or 50 watt depending on how much above the ambient temperature you want the water to be. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ambisense Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2005 7:06 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] hello new member Hi everyone, Just wanted to drop a quick hello because I'm new here :) I own neon tetras, several gold fishes, and bettas. Their photos can be found on my personal webpage: http://www.littlefeatheredbuddies.com/tran-spired Although the bettas are living in separate 1/2 gal tanks, they will be moving into a 10 gal in a couple of weeks (I bought plexiglass type dividers for the tank so they'll each get a cozy ~3 gal to themselves. I just have a quick question right now, is there a reputable heater brand that someone can recommend for a 10 gal? I don't want to get a super strong heater that will make fish soup. Thanks -Amy ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13209	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Mollies go to surface to breath?

Nick, This is not normal behavior for mollies. What do you consider to be perfect for your pH, ammonia, nitrite readings? What size is your tank? What other fish do you have in the tank, and what size are they? What is the water temperature? Any other information you might think pertinent would be helpful. You simply are not giving enough information to go on here to offer even a tentative diagnosis. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nicolas Munro Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2005 11:12 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Mollies go to surface to breath? Hi, I've got two mollies which always go to the surface and look like they are eating food but there is no food. alternatively are they trying to breath the air kinda like Betas? Non of my other fish in the tank do it, pH, Ammonia, Nitrite are perfect. =Nick ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13210	From: paul helms	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: RE_ (pacu minni) Petsmart

just a quick add on...ick is living in all tanks regardless of whether or nto you have a uv sterilizer. the sterilizer just keeps it weak for 6 months. if the bulb is older than sixx months replace it! --- FortWayneFish@... wrote: > 90%- 95% of chain stores will have a centralized > filteration system. and > most do not run a UV. So if you see Ich in one tank > more then likely there is ich > in all the tanks. One reason most mom and pop stores > or strictly fish stores > usually have better fish. > > rob > Indiana > > > > > In a message dated 7/12/2005 7:02:16 PM US Eastern > Standard Time, > evitabug@... writes: > OH...I guess you better not buy them after all. > Anyone could see something > was wrong with all the tanks. I heard from someone > although I don't know it's > true that their all the water is filtered through > all > the tanks as one. > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13211	From: paul helms	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Mollies go to surface to breath?

what about the most important test of all? NITRATE!!!! --- Nicolas Munro <nmunro@...> wrote: > Hi, > > I've got two mollies which always go to the surface > and look like they > are eating food but there is no food. alternatively > are they trying to > breath the air kinda like Betas? > > > Non of my other fish in the tank do it, pH, Ammonia, > Nitrite are perfect. > > > =Nick > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13212	From: daniel_roachus	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis Paul =)

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Emily Tenczar <bababanana@y...> wrote: > At petsmart (who's fish look awful by the way) they do have a full size written on the labels. > Emily > Although they can be inaccurate - I know someome on one of the fish groups has said they've seen pacus with tannk oabels saying "peaceful community fish, grows to 6 inches..."

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13213	From: Evita	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: RE_ (pacu minni) Petsmart

Eric, The one I used to go to in town closed due to mis-management....rumor the owner used it to hit on women that came in....he even tried it once with me and I had kids with me. Then the other one was pretty bad. They never cleaned anything. The smell was criminal. They changed owners but still not up to par. Now the two I know of in Winston Salem are out as well. For my search what would be good? Local Pet Shop.....Piedmont ....NC.......? I will give it a shot. I wish I could get involved with regular locals that are breeding. My fry are healthier than any pet shop right now. They are growing like weeds too. I have even had one person wanting some. But I want to wait till they grow a bit as well as learning more about the person's tank. I thought I might even pass on some tips I learned in here as well first. I want to make sure my babies are happy and well taken care of. Even if they are just platys. Evita Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: Try doing internet searches...that is how I found the few remaining local mom and pop stores that have survived the corporate rape. I found some pretty cool shops in the area that I try to support as much as possible. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evita Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2005 7:01 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] RE_ (pacu minni) Petsmart Our local Petsmart used to have really friendly people working there along with crystle clear water. They actually had people with knowledge of fish working there willing to help new-bies. I went there the other day and was shocked to see how down hill their tanks had gone. The were actually worse than Walmart with sick and dying fish through out. Plus cloudy water. I am planning a field trip my next day off to yet another local town till I find a Local Pet Shop that cares for it's customers and fish as well. I pointed out to the guy the condition of his tanks and all the dead fish and he didn't seem to care. He tried to sell me frogs and when he took me over to look at them they were all motionless, dead floating or struggling. He tried to make light of it and just said "OH...I guess you better not buy them after all. Anyone could see something was wrong with all the tanks. I heard from someone although I don't know it's true that their all the water is filtered through all the tanks as one. Also in nature I heard that frogs are the first sign that something isn't right in nature. When problems accure in nature the frog number are the first to show it. Thus those frogs doing the worst. I was disappointed at the cloudiness of the water. I will not be going back. I am beginning to wonder if I will ever find a place locally that I can drive to. If someone wants to set up a small community tank with relatively cheaper fish and you have to drive an hour to get them, you don't want to drive back if they die. Yes they might have a great return policy but gas is too much. I would rather have hardy healthy fish to start with. I live 30-45 minutes from Winston Salem, NC and was wondering if anyone might know a good place to check out? Possibly in High Point or Salsbury....Greensboro but only if the place is the best ever. I hate large towns I haven't drove before. I am a bit phobic with the driving thing. Evita FortWayneFish@... wrote: But I have seen fish mislabeled at Petsmart also. I even got in a mild discussion with the manager. Who told me I was full of BS . I went home got 3 diffrent books saying the same thing and went back to discuss it a little more. I saw her walking out the back door as I entered. The Mis Labeled fish was in a seperate tank without a label.. So I might have actually got through to her , or she might have figuered if i was so sure i was right she'd better investigate. That manager is no longer there :-( Its now run by a snot nosed kid who thinks any south/central american cichlid can be housed for sale in the same tank.... and as long as its a Mbuna it can be housed together. rob Indiana so she might have In a message dated 7/12/2005 3:34:58 PM US Eastern Standard Time, bababanana@... writes: At petsmart (who's fish look awful by the way) they do have a full size written on the labels. Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. 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PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13214	From: Evita	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Hi, new member. Long time fish owner.

Thanks for your post it really got me to thinking. By the way it was a 3.00 fish but still very beautiful. Evita Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote:Evita, That could be a tough call to make. If you need an easy out--yes. But, there could be other causes as well. That would be something only an fish autopsy could determine, and I would dare say that most of us do not have the experience or the equipment available to do it, if we had the time. Stress is usually a mitigating factor in fish health. Normally, like in a human, it can lead to a weakened immune system, which is just an invite for pathogens to invade. I would not say that it cannot kill, being the only factor, but, I would generally be looking for another cause or shrug my shoulders with an "Oh, well." Most animals are quite adept at hiding an illness or disease. Those of us with dogs and cats know that for a fact, and only pick up on a problem because of a slight change in demeanor or behavior of the dog or cat. With a new dog or cat, it would be the same as with a new fish. You do not know the animal well enough to pick up on the slight cues that may be given that something is wrong. You see the fish at the shop, and they all look OK, so you tell the clerk to give you a bunch of those fish. He does, and everything looks good until the next day when one has kicked the bucket. If you were not looking carefully when the fish was captured and bagged, you may not have noticed the fish being squeezed between the net and the glass, or some other such mishap, and there are no marks to indicate that this had happened. While you were elsewhere, the new guys on the block were being harassed by the neighborhood gang, and an injury was inflicted that causes the demise of one of the fish. Maybe he was not a particularly strong specimen to begin, and the change in pH did him in. Or any of a million other reasons. So, if you need to, say it was stress. Otherwise, just shrug your shoulders and say "Oh well." (Kind of hard to do with a $50 fish, though.) \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evita Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2005 9:16 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Hi, new member. Long time fish owner. Steve, Question. If a fish dies the next day lets say after bring it home with no sign of illness could that indeed be more than likely stress related? I have had that happen. Evita Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote:Beth, Welcome. I give up. What is a polly? Just have the store double bag them and add at least air to the bag so it is taut to the feel. Don't put too may fish in the bag and only fill with enough water to cover the fish when the bag is laid length wise, probably less than a quarter to a third of a bag of water will be more than sufficient. Bring along a cooler, and place the fish in the cooler and shut the lid tight. Most fish will be less active in the dark. Then drive straight home. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Beth Brownell Sent: Monday, July 11, 2005 6:33 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Hi, new member. Long time fish owner. My name is Beth and I have a 30 gallon tropical tank. I had just bought my second tank a 55 gallon tank. I'm working on getting it filled with different types of tropical fish. I have a polly - an alge eater which my family calls polly, which I will be transfering over to the new tank. I know I will be needing two more pollies for my smaller tank till they get bigger. Does anyone have advice on how to transport new fish an hour and a half from the store you bought them from to your home? The nearest fish store in my area, I happen to live in South Central Missouri, is only an hour and half drive to get there. I will be bringing a bucket so they can put the fish in but I'm not sure how to really transport them home without losing one or more of my fish. Any advice will help me greatly. Thanks, Beth Brownell spencer_creek_studios@... ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13215	From: Evita	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: RE_ (pacu minni) Petsmart

I thought so.....I wonder if they would admit that fact if asked though. Evita FortWayneFish@... wrote:90%- 95% of chain stores will have a centralized filteration system. and most do not run a UV. So if you see Ich in one tank more then likely there is ich in all the tanks. One reason most mom and pop stores or strictly fish stores usually have better fish. rob Indiana In a message dated 7/12/2005 7:02:16 PM US Eastern Standard Time, evitabug@... writes: OH...I guess you better not buy them after all. Anyone could see something was wrong with all the tanks. I heard from someone although I don't know it's true that their all the water is filtered through all the tanks as one. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13216	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: catfish

Linda, As I mentioned in my previous reply to your "Catfish" post, there is no reason why you couldn't have Striped Raphael Catfish, depending upon what other fish you have in there. However, as your post late last night indicated you have Neon and Glo-Light Tetras, the answer to the original subject (Raphael Cats) is out of the question -- no, you should not consider adding these catfish to your 150. There are a number of other catfish you could include such as Otocinclus Catfish (Otto's), some of the smaller Pimelodella, Farlowella and Loricaria, Callichthys Cats, and Banjo Cats as well as bushynose albino Ancistrus (as presently pictured on the Group site) -- all peaceful and all from South America. There is also a longfin variety of albino ancistrus. Most of these are within the size you're looking for -- a few slightly larger, although still peaceful, not bothering smaller tankmates. If you don't need to limit yourself to South Amaerican catfish, the Asian Bumblebee Catfish is nice as are any of the smaller African Synodontis Cats. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > Not that I'm looking for one now, but can anyone recommend a catfish to add > to my 150 gallon freshwater tank? > I am trying to keep all the occupants in the tank from South America. I > don't want anything that is going to get more than about 4-5 inches. > I saw a striped raphael catfish at the lfs and I have done some research on > it. I guess it is mostly nocturnal and I wouldn't see it much. > > Any input? > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13217	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: RE_ (pacu minni) Petsmart

Evita, Noticed by your post that you "wish that you could get involved with regular locals that are breeding". While it might be about 90 miles or so from Winston Salem, have you ever considered looking into the Raleigh Aquarium Society group? They meet the 1st Thursday of every month and may just be the type of hobbyists you are looking for as I'm sure they buy, talk and trade fish at these meetings. The Charlotte Area Aquarists Society might also be of interest, but I'm not sure if they actually hold meetings; they may be just a local internet club, but still might be good for local info (lfs's, etc.) Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Evita <evitabug@y...> wrote: > Eric, The one I used to go to in town closed due to mis- management....rumor the owner used it to hit on women that came in....he even tried it once with me and I had kids with me. Then the other one was pretty bad. They never cleaned anything. The smell was criminal. They changed owners but still not up to par. Now the two I know of in Winston Salem are out as well. For my search what would be good? Local Pet Shop.....Piedmont ....NC.......? I will give it a shot. I wish I could get involved with regular locals that are breeding. My fry are healthier than any pet shop right now. They are growing like weeds too. I have even had one person wanting some. But I want to wait till they grow a bit as well as learning more about the person's tank. I thought I might even pass on some tips I learned in here as well first. I want to make sure my babies are happy and well taken care of. Even if they are just platys. Evita > > Eric Roberts <woad@w...> wrote: Try doing internet searches...that is how I found the few remaining local > mom and pop stores that have survived the corporate rape. I found some > pretty cool shops in the area that I try to support as much as possible. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Evita > Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2005 7:01 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] RE_ (pacu minni) Petsmart > > > Our local Petsmart used to have really friendly people working there along > with crystle clear water. They actually had people with knowledge of fish > working there willing to help new-bies. I went there the other day and was > shocked to see how down hill their tanks had gone. The were actually worse > than Walmart with sick and dying fish through out. Plus cloudy water. I am > planning a field trip my next day off to yet another local town till I find > a Local Pet Shop that cares for it's customers and fish as well. I pointed > out to the guy the condition of his tanks and all the dead fish and he > didn't seem to care. He tried to sell me frogs and when he took me over to > look at them they were all motionless, dead floating or struggling. He > tried to make light of it and just said "OH...I guess you better not buy > them after all. Anyone could see something was wrong with all the tanks. I > heard from someone although I don't know it's true that their all the water > is filtered through all > the tanks as one. Also in nature I heard that frogs are the first sign that > something isn't right in nature. When problems accure in nature the frog > number are the first to show it. Thus those frogs doing the worst. I was > disappointed at the cloudiness of the water. I will not be going back. I > am beginning to wonder if I will ever find a place locally that I can drive > to. If someone wants to set up a small community tank with relatively > cheaper fish and you have to drive an hour to get them, you don't want to > drive back if they die. Yes they might have a great return policy but gas > is too much. I would rather have hardy healthy fish to start with. I live > 30-45 minutes from Winston Salem, NC and was wondering if anyone might know > a good place to check out? Possibly in High Point or Salsbury....Greensboro > but only if the place is the best ever. I hate large towns I haven't drove > before. I am a bit phobic with the driving thing. Evita > > FortWayneFish@a... wrote: > But I have seen fish mislabeled at Petsmart also. I even got in a mild > discussion with the manager. Who told me I was full of BS . I went home got > 3 > diffrent books saying the same thing and went back to discuss it a little > more. > I saw her walking out the back door as I entered. The Mis Labeled fish > was in a seperate tank without a label.. So I might have actually got > through > to her , or she might have figuered if i was so sure i was right she'd > better > investigate. > > That manager is no longer there :-( Its now run by a snot nosed kid who > thinks any south/central american cichlid can be housed for sale in the same > > tank.... > and as long as its a Mbuna it can be housed together. > > rob > Indiana > > > so she might have In a message dated 7/12/2005 3:34:58 PM US Eastern > Standard > Time, bababanana@y... writes: > At petsmart (who's fish look awful by the way) they do have a full size > written on the labels. > Emily > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine biology Biology > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13218	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Mollies go to surface to breath?

Although the other fish are not doing this, I would still guess that it's a lack of sufficent oxygen. Get a powerhead going and I bet they resume their normal behavior. (Of course this is if you don't already have one, at this point it doesn't sound as you do.) ? =) L Subject: [AquaticLife] Mollies go to surface to breath?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13219	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank

What size box would be sufficient? Because I have styrofoam boxes already of various sizes. Emily Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote: Almost, but a LARGE (not small) box instead, made of styrofoam which is self-insulating. Ice packs would be good as they wouldn't create a puddle as they melt -- you don't want to get the pump wet. And yes, you cut a hole, or just notch the upper edge where the cover fits on; remember you can't put the cover on tight as the pump has to get fresh air to be able to work, but you don't want the lid too loose either. Now, the idea is to keep the air inside as cool as possible, even while fresh air is constantly being drawn in -- that's why you need as big a box as possible (and an insulated box). Best if your lfs has what's called a double (or triple) box. \ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13220	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Nitrate #s

What is a "safe" number regarding nitrates? Everything is testing 0 but of course I am getting a reading on nitrates, seems to be at 20 ppm. The reason I ask is due to this seemingly minor algae bloom. I've seen others have this and then a full out mess within days. I don't want that. Anyhow, safe nitrate number? Thanks [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13221	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis

thats not to say that the fish at petsmart don't look unhealthy, as you'd expect. Emily Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: That's good that they do that. They don't do that here or in my home town though. Nor does Petco or the LFS. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Emily Tenczar Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2005 3:23 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis Paul =) At petsmart (who's fish look awful by the way) they do have a full size written on the labels. Emily Dane & Leslie Moore wrote: Paul, I think what the general idea here is that yes, people do have a responsibility to care for the animal they choose. The problem is that the fish stores don't bother telling the customer that this particular fish has needs that are going to need to be met in the future. Most people that purchase fish see these cute LITTLE things and never think about them growing out of their tank space. You'd think if they aren't going to bother educating the customer that they could at least put an expected growth size on the tank? Maybe that's too diffiult or would bring down fish sales. I don't know. ;) Ciao' Leslie paul helms wrote: don't yo think people have a responisibility to care for a pet that they choose? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13222	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: walmart and goldfish was...FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis( peoples respo

My first fish as a child were a couple of feeder goldfish. They lived in a fish bowl of course. Now I was a little kid and I'm wondering why my parents didn't check into this, but I'm assuming that they thought the pet store would know something about goldfish and they never told us not to house them in fish bowls. When I got my first goldfish since then (the black moor) at least someone had sense enough to tell me not to get two goldfish at once straight up. I had her in a large critter keeper with a filter until I picked up a larger tank. By the way, her eye is healing up nicely and a small fan seems to be making her and her buddies happier :) Still, it's a lot of trial and error. One time I went into walmart and was so frustrated with seeing sick fish and talking to morons that work there that I decided to leave a note on the whiteboard. Imagine how shocked I was the next time I went there and saw a note saying not to sell any fish in a particular tank because they were being treated. A small step in the right direction. Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13223	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank

As large a box as possible. In fact, if you have two large boxes the same size, invert one on top of the other instead of using the lid. Cut two small notches in the top lip of one of the boxes for the cord and airline and maybe a few (3 or 4) small 1/4" holes for air intake. The idea is you want to contain as much cold air as possible so that incoming air being drawn in by the pump won't cool off this trapped air very fast, keeping this air as cold as possible. Temporarily seal up the joint between the two boxes with tape (duct or masking, etc.), but don't do too good a job -- you'll need to periodically check on the cold packs. Ray \ -- - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Emily Tenczar <bababanana@y...> wrote: > What size box would be sufficient? Because I have styrofoam boxes already of various sizes. > Emily > > Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > Almost, but a LARGE (not small) box instead, made of styrofoam which > is self-insulating. Ice packs would be good as they wouldn't create > a puddle as they melt -- you don't want to get the pump wet. And > yes, you cut a hole, or just notch the upper edge where the cover > fits on; remember you can't put the cover on tight as the pump has to > get fresh air to be able to work, but you don't want the lid too > loose either. Now, the idea is to keep the air inside as cool as > possible, even while fresh air is constantly being drawn in -- that's > why you need as big a box as possible (and an insulated box). Best > if your lfs has what's called a double (or triple) box. > \ > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13224	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: dying java fern

Hey Steve, good call. Maybe the light is part of the problem. I think I'll replace the java fern with something that likes a little more light. I have the tank on a 12-12 cycle with a 15 W bulb. Emily Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: Cynthia, You seem to be missing an important point here. The plant is in a betta bowl. Also we are talking about Java Fern. A 100% water change may well affect the health of the plant, though it is rather tough to kill a Java Fern--one really needs to try. Secondly, a Java Fern does not need to be rooted, per se, but is more often tied to a rock or a piece of driftwood, where it eventually takes hold. I'd be rather leery about adding fertilizer, in any form, to encourage the growth of this plant. Too easy to overdose in the small container she has. Java Fern gets its nutrients from the water, through its roots. I would think that the main problem she may be having here is too much light. Java Fern is really a low light plant, and too much light can cause the appearance of transparent spots on the leaves, and the snails she has in the tank could very well be making them into holes as the leaves die off. A lack of nutrition could also have adverse effects on this plant, but they would need to occur over time to be noticeable. I think her plan of moving the plant to another tank for the time being, and stripping away all the old growth is probably the way to go to nurse this plant back to health. When she does move it back to the betta bowl, the occasional addition of some trace elements may help it retain its health, along with the lowering of the amount of light the plant receives. \\Steve// [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13225	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. This should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in there to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should not get a chance to multiply. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > What is a "safe" number regarding nitrates? Everything is testing 0 but > of course I am getting a reading on nitrates, seems to be at 20 ppm. > The reason I ask is due to this seemingly minor algae bloom. I've seen > others have this and then a full out mess within days. I don't want > that. > Anyhow, safe nitrate number? > Thanks > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13226	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: algae was Nitrate #s

what is the problem with algae anyway? Isn't it good for the tank since it eats up nitrates? Emily Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote: A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. This should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in there to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should not get a chance to multiply. Ray [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13227	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: What types of fish would you recommend for 55 gall tank?

I had tried to grow plants in my tank that was aqua safe but only one managed to grow and then die off about three months later. Had plenty of food for it. Might have been in the wrong gravel as we use gravel with no dirt or anything else. So I use mainly fake plants in my tank. I have hidding places for my 'polly' to hide out during the daytime as he likes to sleep during the day. But mainly my tank is made out of part fake plants/gravel/hidding places and my fish. Beth --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@y...> wrote: > Beth, > > You have plenty of options for a 55 gallon tank. Practically, most > things will fit in except the likes of large cichlids, very large > predators and the previously discusses Pacu. > > It all depends on as to what type of look and feel you want for the > tank as 80% of the fish can be considered. (ofcourse also > considering their compatibility) . > > Planted tank? High light high tech planted tanks? Large fish? Rocky? > Brackish with roots etc.? or just a plain simple gravel and fish? > > Nim > From: Beth Brownell > Subject: [AquaticLife] What types of fish would you recommend for > 55 gall tank? > > For tropical freshwater tank. > > I already got two Angelfishes for the tank, they are about two > inches big. > > I am not going to do a marine tank, my older brother did that once > and he regrets doing it as he was a beginner at it, even if he did > good at it. It stressed him because he was worried about the fish > he had. > > And the plycomous will be moved over to the bigger tank so my > smaller 30 gallon will need a new alge eater. > > Thanks, > Beth

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13228	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: algae was Nitrate #s

It's ugly? ;) Subject: [AquaticLife] algae was Nitrate #s what is the problem with algae anyway? Isn't it good for the tank since it eats up nitrates? Emily

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13229	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: RE_ (pacu minni) Petsmart

I searched under aquarium stores, pet shops, fish stores (though this gets a lot of seafood stores) and a mix of the above. I managed to find 3 mom and pops in the area through this. Once I get some better pics of my tank and fish, I am going to put a web page that will also list local stores to help them drum up some business. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evita Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 6:59 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] RE_ (pacu minni) Petsmart Eric, The one I used to go to in town closed due to mis-management....rumor the owner used it to hit on women that came in....he even tried it once with me and I had kids with me. Then the other one was pretty bad. They never cleaned anything. The smell was criminal. They changed owners but still not up to par. Now the two I know of in Winston Salem are out as well. For my search what would be good? Local Pet Shop.....Piedmont ....NC.......? I will give it a shot. I wish I could get involved with regular locals that are breeding. My fry are healthier than any pet shop right now. They are growing like weeds too. I have even had one person wanting some. But I want to wait till they grow a bit as well as learning more about the person's tank. I thought I might even pass on some tips I learned in here as well first. I want to make sure my babies are happy and well taken care of. Even if they are just platys. Evita Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: Try doing internet searches...that is how I found the few remaining local mom and pop stores that have survived the corporate rape. I found some pretty cool shops in the area that I try to support as much as possible. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evita Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2005 7:01 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] RE_ (pacu minni) Petsmart Our local Petsmart used to have really friendly people working there along with crystle clear water. They actually had people with knowledge of fish working there willing to help new-bies. I went there the other day and was shocked to see how down hill their tanks had gone. The were actually worse than Walmart with sick and dying fish through out. Plus cloudy water. I am planning a field trip my next day off to yet another local town till I find a Local Pet Shop that cares for it's customers and fish as well. I pointed out to the guy the condition of his tanks and all the dead fish and he didn't seem to care. He tried to sell me frogs and when he took me over to look at them they were all motionless, dead floating or struggling. He tried to make light of it and just said "OH...I guess you better not buy them after all. Anyone could see something was wrong with all the tanks. I heard from someone although I don't know it's true that their all the water is filtered through all the tanks as one. Also in nature I heard that frogs are the first sign that something isn't right in nature. When problems accure in nature the frog number are the first to show it. Thus those frogs doing the worst. I was disappointed at the cloudiness of the water. I will not be going back. I am beginning to wonder if I will ever find a place locally that I can drive to. If someone wants to set up a small community tank with relatively cheaper fish and you have to drive an hour to get them, you don't want to drive back if they die. Yes they might have a great return policy but gas is too much. I would rather have hardy healthy fish to start with. I live 30-45 minutes from Winston Salem, NC and was wondering if anyone might know a good place to check out? Possibly in High Point or Salsbury....Greensboro but only if the place is the best ever. I hate large towns I haven't drove before. I am a bit phobic with the driving thing. Evita FortWayneFish@... wrote: But I have seen fish mislabeled at Petsmart also. I even got in a mild discussion with the manager. Who told me I was full of BS . I went home got 3 diffrent books saying the same thing and went back to discuss it a little more. I saw her walking out the back door as I entered. The Mis Labeled fish was in a seperate tank without a label.. So I might have actually got through to her , or she might have figuered if i was so sure i was right she'd better investigate. That manager is no longer there :-( Its now run by a snot nosed kid who thinks any south/central american cichlid can be housed for sale in the same tank.... and as long as its a Mbuna it can be housed together. rob Indiana so she might have In a message dated 7/12/2005 3:34:58 PM US Eastern Standard Time, bababanana@... writes: At petsmart (who's fish look awful by the way) they do have a full size written on the labels. Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13230	From: Patrick	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: 40 year old books

I like reading the old 60's books, especially the ones from Europe. They are generally a lot easier to understand than the newer ones that are filled with so much scientific talk that I just don't know or care what they are saying. I checked out a newer book that was full of chemical equations and scientific formulas. The older books had less of that and more simple explanations of the same things. The only thing that the older books don't have is an understanding of what the nitrogen cycle is in an aquarium. Apparently back then they thought bacteria only converted ammonia to nitrite and didn't realize there are other bacteria to convert that to nitrate, so they said tanks should be as clean and well-planted as possible. It is a fun way to learn the modern history of fishkeeping. Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill -------Original Message------- Point well taken but still one should do the best to research before buying. I wonder if your Library is like mine. My Library will take requests when it comes to the buying of new books. Our local library also has some of those same 60's books I might add. I think I have some better books here that I got second hand from a guy that no longer needed the new-bie books. I also have one that is just a fish handbook which I really enjoy reading. Evita [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13231	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

I just had a major issue with nitrates...they shot up through the roof (and I have some plants). I got some of the nitrate sponges to soak some of them up before they kill my fish. I have been doing 20 % water changes every day and after about a week, they got down to 40 ppm...they were as high as 160 at one point. One of my tasks is to get more plants and more light. I am designing a hood for my 55 gal tank, so once I get that all in place, I should be fine...or at least I hope. I am also getting rid of my gravel eventually and replacing it with sand. This of course means no more UGF, but it looks a lot nicer. I set up my 20 gal to house some of my smaller fish and some ghost shrimp that I got for food for my larger fish and I used the Tahitian moonlight black sand. It looks awesome with that. I will be switching over to that in the next month or so in the big tank. The only thing I don;t like about the sand is it is a real PIA to get clean. When I was setting up the 20 gal, I thought I had it clean, but ended up having to empty out the tank and refilling it after cleaning the gravel once again...ugg. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 10:37 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. This should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in there to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should not get a chance to multiply. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > What is a "safe" number regarding nitrates? Everything is testing 0 but > of course I am getting a reading on nitrates, seems to be at 20 ppm. > The reason I ask is due to this seemingly minor algae bloom. I've seen > others have this and then a full out mess within days. I don't want > that. > Anyhow, safe nitrate number? > Thanks > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13232	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: algae was Nitrate #s

as long as it doesn't get out of hand. an bad algae bloom can cut off the light and kill plants as well as just look really bad. The water will turn green (hence the name green water) Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Emily Tenczar Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 11:51 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] algae was Nitrate #s what is the problem with algae anyway? Isn't it good for the tank since it eats up nitrates? Emily Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote: A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. This should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in there to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should not get a chance to multiply. Ray [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13233	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: how do I cool the water in my tank

well, our apt is always fairly toasty when we get home, even with the fan running in the living room non-stop. i don't know the exact temp because we don't have a/c or a thermometer inside. i'd say just from what it feels like that it's probably at least 80-825 inside our apt until evening when the temps cool down and the cool air is allowed inside. lately the outside temp has been varying the between 85-90. --- Nicolas Munro <nmunro@...> wrote: > How hots your ambient temperature? I'm thinking of what I can do with my > tank when the ambient temp gets to 35degC. > > =Nick > > Valeen Gonzalez wrote: > > >do you have a fan you can blow onto it? we have a fan in our sw hood & it keeps the tank a nice > >range between 76-78 all the time, even w/no a/c & the temps heating up here lately. > >--- Emily Tenczar <bababanana@...> wrote: > > > > > > > >>Does anyone have any ideas on how to cool a tank short > >>of adding ice? > >>I've turned off the lights and opened the lid on my > >>goldfish tank, which is in the low 80's right now. The > >>AC isn't working. > >> > >>Thanks > >>Emily > >> > >> > >> > > > > > >Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > >I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if > CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: > old subject)" <- > > > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > >AquaticLife Management. > > > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13234	From: paul helms	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

under 40 --- Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: > What is a "safe" number regarding nitrates? > Everything is testing 0 but > of course I am getting a reading on nitrates, seems > to be at 20 ppm. > The reason I ask is due to this seemingly minor > algae bloom. I've seen > others have this and then a full out mess within > days. I don't want > that. > Anyhow, safe nitrate number? > Thanks > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13235	From: Evita	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: RE_ (pacu minni) Petsmart

Thanks Ray. I went to High School in Raleigh and still have a friend there. A little long of a drive for me though. I was thinking one could try and start a local thing. Maybe posting in the local various vet offices. Evita Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote:Evita, Noticed by your post that you "wish that you could get involved with regular locals that are breeding". While it might be about 90 miles or so from Winston Salem, have you ever considered looking into the Raleigh Aquarium Society group? They meet the 1st Thursday of every month and may just be the type of hobbyists you are looking for as I'm sure they buy, talk and trade fish at these meetings. The Charlotte Area Aquarists Society might also be of interest, but I'm not sure if they actually hold meetings; they may be just a local internet club, but still might be good for local info (lfs's, etc.) Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Evita <evitabug@y...> wrote: > Eric, The one I used to go to in town closed due to mis- management....rumor the owner used it to hit on women that came in....he even tried it once with me and I had kids with me. Then the other one was pretty bad. They never cleaned anything. The smell was criminal. They changed owners but still not up to par. Now the two I know of in Winston Salem are out as well. For my search what would be good? Local Pet Shop.....Piedmont ....NC.......? I will give it a shot. I wish I could get involved with regular locals that are breeding. My fry are healthier than any pet shop right now. They are growing like weeds too. I have even had one person wanting some. But I want to wait till they grow a bit as well as learning more about the person's tank. I thought I might even pass on some tips I learned in here as well first. I want to make sure my babies are happy and well taken care of. Even if they are just platys. Evita > > Eric Roberts <woad@w...> wrote: Try doing internet searches...that is how I found the few remaining local > mom and pop stores that have survived the corporate rape. I found some > pretty cool shops in the area that I try to support as much as possible. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Evita > Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2005 7:01 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] RE_ (pacu minni) Petsmart > > > Our local Petsmart used to have really friendly people working there along > with crystle clear water. They actually had people with knowledge of fish > working there willing to help new-bies. I went there the other day and was > shocked to see how down hill their tanks had gone. The were actually worse > than Walmart with sick and dying fish through out. Plus cloudy water. I am > planning a field trip my next day off to yet another local town till I find > a Local Pet Shop that cares for it's customers and fish as well. I pointed > out to the guy the condition of his tanks and all the dead fish and he > didn't seem to care. He tried to sell me frogs and when he took me over to > look at them they were all motionless, dead floating or struggling. He > tried to make light of it and just said "OH...I guess you better not buy > them after all. Anyone could see something was wrong with all the tanks. I > heard from someone although I don't know it's true that their all the water > is filtered through all > the tanks as one. Also in nature I heard that frogs are the first sign that > something isn't right in nature. When problems accure in nature the frog > number are the first to show it. Thus those frogs doing the worst. I was > disappointed at the cloudiness of the water. I will not be going back. I > am beginning to wonder if I will ever find a place locally that I can drive > to. If someone wants to set up a small community tank with relatively > cheaper fish and you have to drive an hour to get them, you don't want to > drive back if they die. Yes they might have a great return policy but gas > is too much. I would rather have hardy healthy fish to start with. I live > 30-45 minutes from Winston Salem, NC and was wondering if anyone might know > a good place to check out? Possibly in High Point or Salsbury....Greensboro > but only if the place is the best ever. I hate large towns I haven't drove > before. I am a bit phobic with the driving thing. Evita > > FortWayneFish@a... wrote: > But I have seen fish mislabeled at Petsmart also. I even got in a mild > discussion with the manager. Who told me I was full of BS . I went home got > 3 > diffrent books saying the same thing and went back to discuss it a little > more. > I saw her walking out the back door as I entered. The Mis Labeled fish > was in a seperate tank without a label.. So I might have actually got > through > to her , or she might have figuered if i was so sure i was right she'd > better > investigate. > > That manager is no longer there :-( Its now run by a snot nosed kid who > thinks any south/central american cichlid can be housed for sale in the same > > tank.... > and as long as its a Mbuna it can be housed together. > > rob > Indiana > > > so she might have In a message dated 7/12/2005 3:34:58 PM US Eastern > Standard > Time, bababanana@y... writes: > At petsmart (who's fish look awful by the way) they do have a full size > written on the labels. > Emily > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine biology Biology > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13236	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: algae was Nitrate #s

LOL =) and it obscures your view of the tank! --- Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: > It's ugly? ;) > > Subject: [AquaticLife] algae was Nitrate #s > > > what is the problem with algae anyway? Isn't it good for the tank since > it eats up nitrates? Emily > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13237	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: algae was Nitrate #s

I don't think so. I think the dark green algae makes a lovely background. It took over one of my betta tanks. I only scraped it off the front side of the tank, and I added some snails who decided to go crazy and populate amongst the greenery :) Emily Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote: LOL =) and it obscures your view of the tank! --- Dane & Leslie Moore wrote: > It's ugly? ;) > > Subject: [AquaticLife] algae was Nitrate #s > > > what is the problem with algae anyway? Isn't it good for the tank since > it eats up nitrates? Emily > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13238	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: algae was Nitrate #s

true. snails snails snails!! emily Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: as long as it doesn't get out of hand. an bad algae bloom can cut off the light and kill plants as well as just look really bad. The water will turn green (hence the name green water) Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Emily Tenczar Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 11:51 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] algae was Nitrate #s what is the problem with algae anyway? Isn't it good for the tank since it eats up nitrates? Emily Ray Wetzel wrote: A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. This should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in there to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should not get a chance to multiply. Ray [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13239	From: Evita	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: RE_ (pacu minni) Petsmart

Thanks Eric. Evita Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote:I searched under aquarium stores, pet shops, fish stores (though this gets a lot of seafood stores) and a mix of the above. I managed to find 3 mom and pops in the area through this. Once I get some better pics of my tank and fish, I am going to put a web page that will also list local stores to help them drum up some business. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evita Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 6:59 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] RE_ (pacu minni) Petsmart Eric, The one I used to go to in town closed due to mis-management....rumor the owner used it to hit on women that came in....he even tried it once with me and I had kids with me. Then the other one was pretty bad. They never cleaned anything. The smell was criminal. They changed owners but still not up to par. Now the two I know of in Winston Salem are out as well. For my search what would be good? Local Pet Shop.....Piedmont ....NC.......? I will give it a shot. I wish I could get involved with regular locals that are breeding. My fry are healthier than any pet shop right now. They are growing like weeds too. I have even had one person wanting some. But I want to wait till they grow a bit as well as learning more about the person's tank. I thought I might even pass on some tips I learned in here as well first. I want to make sure my babies are happy and well taken care of. Even if they are just platys. Evita Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: Try doing internet searches...that is how I found the few remaining local mom and pop stores that have survived the corporate rape. I found some pretty cool shops in the area that I try to support as much as possible. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evita Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2005 7:01 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] RE_ (pacu minni) Petsmart Our local Petsmart used to have really friendly people working there along with crystle clear water. They actually had people with knowledge of fish working there willing to help new-bies. I went there the other day and was shocked to see how down hill their tanks had gone. The were actually worse than Walmart with sick and dying fish through out. Plus cloudy water. I am planning a field trip my next day off to yet another local town till I find a Local Pet Shop that cares for it's customers and fish as well. I pointed out to the guy the condition of his tanks and all the dead fish and he didn't seem to care. He tried to sell me frogs and when he took me over to look at them they were all motionless, dead floating or struggling. He tried to make light of it and just said "OH...I guess you better not buy them after all. Anyone could see something was wrong with all the tanks. I heard from someone although I don't know it's true that their all the water is filtered through all the tanks as one. Also in nature I heard that frogs are the first sign that something isn't right in nature. When problems accure in nature the frog number are the first to show it. Thus those frogs doing the worst. I was disappointed at the cloudiness of the water. I will not be going back. I am beginning to wonder if I will ever find a place locally that I can drive to. If someone wants to set up a small community tank with relatively cheaper fish and you have to drive an hour to get them, you don't want to drive back if they die. Yes they might have a great return policy but gas is too much. I would rather have hardy healthy fish to start with. I live 30-45 minutes from Winston Salem, NC and was wondering if anyone might know a good place to check out? Possibly in High Point or Salsbury....Greensboro but only if the place is the best ever. I hate large towns I haven't drove before. I am a bit phobic with the driving thing. Evita FortWayneFish@... wrote: But I have seen fish mislabeled at Petsmart also. I even got in a mild discussion with the manager. Who told me I was full of BS . I went home got 3 diffrent books saying the same thing and went back to discuss it a little more. I saw her walking out the back door as I entered. The Mis Labeled fish was in a seperate tank without a label.. So I might have actually got through to her , or she might have figuered if i was so sure i was right she'd better investigate. That manager is no longer there :-( Its now run by a snot nosed kid who thinks any south/central american cichlid can be housed for sale in the same tank.... and as long as its a Mbuna it can be housed together. rob Indiana so she might have In a message dated 7/12/2005 3:34:58 PM US Eastern Standard Time, bababanana@... writes: At petsmart (who's fish look awful by the way) they do have a full size written on the labels. Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13240	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: algae was Nitrate #s

Emily, As has already been pointed out, most types of algae are unsightly (and can get invasive once it gets a foothold). But beyond that it can get dowright dangerous; something nobody ever considers. Usually (and fortunately), once the hobbyist realizes there is the start of a problem with algae taking over, they will either try to remedy the situation or seek help in doing so. The greater the algae culture in a tank, the more oxygen it is using up at night leaving all the less for the fish. Now consider for instance there is a bloom of suspended algae (green water) in a tank; it can reach a point where the disolved oxygen can no longer support it, resulting in a "crash", which results in even less available oxygen for the fish. The algae will use up more oxygen (at night) than it needs and as it crashes, a bacteria bloom (feeding on the dead algae) will take care of the rest of the oxygen, effectively killing off the fish. \ There are some types of algae which are preferred in certain situations, if kept under control, such as Spirogyra (filamentous algae) which looks similar to fine growing plants such as Nitella and Java Moss and has a limited use in fry rearing tanks. Some Rift Lake Cichlid hobbyists who keep algae-grazers (certain Mbunas, Tropheus species, etc.) encourage the growth of a healthy blanket type algae on the rockwork, but this specialty stuff is the exception. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Emily Tenczar <bababanana@y...> wrote: > what is the problem with algae anyway? Isn't it good for the tank since it eats up nitrates? > Emily > > Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. This > should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in there > to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not > overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should not > get a chance to multiply. Ray > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13241	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: algae was Nitrate #s

When it is a hair algae it looks nice, when it's the phytoplankton type algae, it looks bad... Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Emily Tenczar Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 1:30 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] algae was Nitrate #s I don't think so. I think the dark green algae makes a lovely background. It took over one of my betta tanks. I only scraped it off the front side of the tank, and I added some snails who decided to go crazy and populate amongst the greenery :) Emily Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote: LOL =) and it obscures your view of the tank! --- Dane & Leslie Moore wrote: > It's ugly? ;) > > Subject: [AquaticLife] algae was Nitrate #s > > > what is the problem with algae anyway? Isn't it good for the tank since > it eats up nitrates? Emily > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13242	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: algae was Nitrate #s

We just picked up an apple snail. I also have a ton of little ramshorns in my gravel. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Emily Tenczar Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 1:32 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] algae was Nitrate #s true. snails snails snails!! emily Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: as long as it doesn't get out of hand. an bad algae bloom can cut off the light and kill plants as well as just look really bad. The water will turn green (hence the name green water) Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Emily Tenczar Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 11:51 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] algae was Nitrate #s what is the problem with algae anyway? Isn't it good for the tank since it eats up nitrates? Emily Ray Wetzel wrote: A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. This should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in there to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should not get a chance to multiply. Ray [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13243	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: algae was Nitrate #s

ewwwwwww -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Emily Tenczar Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 1:30 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] algae was Nitrate #s I don't think so. I think the dark green algae makes a lovely background. It took over one of my betta tanks. I only scraped it off the front side of the tank, and I added some snails who decided to go crazy and populate amongst the greenery :) Emily Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote: LOL =) and it obscures your view of the tank! --- Dane & Leslie Moore wrote: > It's ugly? ;) > > Subject: [AquaticLife] algae was Nitrate #s > > > what is the problem with algae anyway? Isn't it good for the tank > since it eats up nitrates? Emily > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13244	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: 40 year old books

Hi Patrick, Got to go along with you 100% on that. While the older books said much the same thing, they where much more easily understood. I guess today's writers/publishers are running out of ways to get there point across, plus they want to sound impressive to give you the impression that their book(s) are so much more informative, so that they will sell. Trouble is, I don't think they even know what they're talking about, so how can they expect us to. As to the nitrogen cycle, while I can discuss much on the European books on this subject, I don't believe much at all was written in American published books on even a portion (ammonia - nitrite) of the nitrogen cycle as hobbyists back then were not even aware of it for the most part. Nobody "cycled" their tanks as it was not known to do so. Curiously by the same token, somehow hardly anyone ever had a problem related to this back then. I guess the fish were just as much in the dark (lol). Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Patrick" <patrickmn@c...> wrote: > I like reading the old 60's books, especially the ones from Europe. They > are generally a lot easier to understand than the newer ones that are filled > with so much scientific talk that I just don't know or care what they are > saying. I checked out a newer book that was full of chemical equations and > scientific formulas. The older books had less of that and more simple > explanations of the same things. The only thing that the older books don't > have is an understanding of what the nitrogen cycle is in an aquarium. > Apparently back then they thought bacteria only converted ammonia to nitrite > and didn't realize there are other bacteria to convert that to nitrate, so > they said tanks should be as clean and well-planted as possible. It is a > fun way to learn the modern history of fishkeeping. > > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy. > > "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is > perhaps, the end of the beginning." > -Winston Churchill > -------Original Message------- > Point well taken but still one should do the best to research before buying. I wonder if your Library is like mine. My Library will take requests when it comes to the buying of new books. Our local library also has some of those same 60's books I might add. I think I have some better books here that I got second hand from a guy that no longer needed the new-bie books. I also have one that is just a fish handbook which I really enjoy reading. Evita > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13245	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

20ppm is safe. All tanks will have some algae. You can just scrape/scrub it off of the glass or depending on the size of your tank and stocking limits, you could try anything from an Apple Snail or Shrimps to Pleco's to eat the algae. Live Hornwort which you can just leave floating in the tank releases an allopathic by-product which inhibits algae growth but won't stop it completely... unless you have a tank full of Hornwort. Many fish will snack on the Hornwort to keep it from growing too much. It's an easy to grow plant but when the needle type leaves fall off, they do make a little mess. Anacharis is another floater or it can be rooted and it's fast growing so it will suck up any excess nutrients in your water which will inhibit algae growth as well. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: 20 Date: Wed, 13 Jul 2005 10:05:56 -0500 From: "Dane & Leslie Moore" <amjmail@...> Subject: Nitrate #s What is a "safe" number regarding nitrates? Everything is testing 0 but of course I am getting a reading on nitrates, seems to be at 20 ppm. The reason I ask is due to this seemingly minor algae bloom. I've seen others have this and then a full out mess within days. I don't want that. Anyhow, safe nitrate number? Thanks [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13246	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

Glad to see you got the nitrates under control. I see you plan to add more plants which should help towards this end. Also notice that you are planning to switch over to sand. While this may look awesome, you may have trouble trying to grow some of those plants you're thinking of getting as the finer sand has the tendancy of preventing proper root growth; its more compacted. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > I just had a major issue with nitrates...they shot up through the roof (and > I have some plants). I got some of the nitrate sponges to soak some of them > up before they kill my fish. I have been doing 20 % water changes every day > and after about a week, they got down to 40 ppm...they were as high as 160 > at one point. One of my tasks is to get more plants and more light. I am > designing a hood for my 55 gal tank, so once I get that all in place, I > should be fine...or at least I hope. I am also getting rid of my gravel > eventually and replacing it with sand. This of course means no more UGF, > but it looks a lot nicer. I set up my 20 gal to house some of my smaller > fish and some ghost shrimp that I got for food for my larger fish and I used > the Tahitian moonlight black sand. It looks awesome with that. I will be > switching over to that in the next month or so in the big tank. The only > thing I don;t like about the sand is it is a real PIA to get clean. When I > was setting up the 20 gal, I thought I had it clean, but ended up having to > empty out the tank and refilling it after cleaning the gravel once > again...ugg. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 10:37 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. This > should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in there > to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not > overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should not > get a chance to multiply. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > What is a "safe" number regarding nitrates? Everything is testing 0 > but > > of course I am getting a reading on nitrates, seems to be at 20 ppm. > > The reason I ask is due to this seemingly minor algae bloom. I've > seen > > others have this and then a full out mess within days. I don't want > > that. > > Anyhow, safe nitrate number? > > Thanks > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13247	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: RE_ (pacu minni) Petsmart

If you're thinking about starting a local fish club, that's surely a good idea, as is posting in vet offices (and supermarket and library bulletin boards, etc.). You must be ambitious to which I wish you lots of luck. Hope things go okay -- sometimes with just a few core people, these things start to snowball. You don't know until you try. You may have to meet at various members' homes in the beginning, but if you inquire there's a good chance some organization (VFW Hall, etc.) may volunteer space for your group to meet once a month. GOOD LUCK! Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Evita <evitabug@y...> wrote: > Thanks Ray. I went to High School in Raleigh and still have a friend there. A little long of a drive for me though. I was thinking one could try and start a local thing. Maybe posting in the local various vet offices. Evita > > Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote:Evita, Noticed by your post that you "wish that you could get > involved with regular locals that are breeding". While it might be > about 90 miles or so from Winston Salem, have you ever considered > looking into the Raleigh Aquarium Society group? They meet the 1st > Thursday of every month and may just be the type of hobbyists you are > looking for as I'm sure they buy, talk and trade fish at these > meetings. The Charlotte Area Aquarists Society might also be of > interest, but I'm not sure if they actually hold meetings; they may > be just a local internet club, but still might be good for local info > (lfs's, etc.) Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Evita <evitabug@y...> wrote: > > Eric, The one I used to go to in town closed due to mis- > management....rumor the owner used it to hit on women that came > in....he even tried it once with me and I had kids with me. Then the > other one was pretty bad. They never cleaned anything. The smell > was criminal. They changed owners but still not up to par. Now the > two I know of in Winston Salem are out as well. For my search what > would be good? Local Pet Shop.....Piedmont ....NC.......? I will > give it a shot. I wish I could get involved with regular locals that > are breeding. My fry are healthier than any pet shop right now. > They are growing like weeds too. I have even had one person wanting > some. But I want to wait till they grow a bit as well as learning > more about the person's tank. I thought I might even pass on some > tips I learned in here as well first. I want to make sure my babies > are happy and well taken care of. Even if they are just platys. Evita > > > > Eric Roberts <woad@w...> wrote: Try doing internet searches...that > is how I found the few remaining local > > mom and pop stores that have survived the corporate rape. I found > some > > pretty cool shops in the area that I try to support as much as > possible. > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Evita > > Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2005 7:01 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] RE_ (pacu minni) Petsmart > > > > > > Our local Petsmart used to have really friendly people working > there along > > with crystle clear water. They actually had people with knowledge > of fish > > working there willing to help new-bies. I went there the other day > and was > > shocked to see how down hill their tanks had gone. The were > actually worse > > than Walmart with sick and dying fish through out. Plus cloudy > water. I am > > planning a field trip my next day off to yet another local town > till I find > > a Local Pet Shop that cares for it's customers and fish as well. I > pointed > > out to the guy the condition of his tanks and all the dead fish and > he > > didn't seem to care. He tried to sell me frogs and when he took me > over to > > look at them they were all motionless, dead floating or > struggling. He > > tried to make light of it and just said "OH...I guess you better > not buy > > them after all. Anyone could see something was wrong with all the > tanks. I > > heard from someone although I don't know it's true that their all > the water > > is filtered through all > > the tanks as one. Also in nature I heard that frogs are the first > sign that > > something isn't right in nature. When problems accure in nature the > frog > > number are the first to show it. Thus those frogs doing the > worst. I was > > disappointed at the cloudiness of the water. I will not be going > back. I > > am beginning to wonder if I will ever find a place locally that I > can drive > > to. If someone wants to set up a small community tank with > relatively > > cheaper fish and you have to drive an hour to get them, you don't > want to > > drive back if they die. Yes they might have a great return policy > but gas > > is too much. I would rather have hardy healthy fish to start > with. I live > > 30-45 minutes from Winston Salem, NC and was wondering if anyone > might know > > a good place to check out? Possibly in High Point or > Salsbury....Greensboro > > but only if the place is the best ever. I hate large towns I > haven't drove > > before. I am a bit phobic with the driving thing. Evita > > > > FortWayneFish@a... wrote: > > But I have seen fish mislabeled at Petsmart also. I even got in a > mild > > discussion with the manager. Who told me I was full of BS . I went > home got > > 3 > > diffrent books saying the same thing and went back to discuss it a > little > > more. > > I saw her walking out the back door as I entered. The Mis Labeled > fish > > was in a seperate tank without a label.. So I might have actually > got > > through > > to her , or she might have figuered if i was so sure i was right > she'd > > better > > investigate. > > > > That manager is no longer there :-( Its now run by a snot nosed > kid who > > thinks any south/central american cichlid can be housed for sale in > the same > > > > tank.... > > and as long as its a Mbuna it can be housed together. > > > > rob > > Indiana > > > > > > so she might have In a message dated 7/12/2005 3:34:58 PM US Eastern > > Standard > > Time, bababanana@y... writes: > > At petsmart (who's fish look awful by the way) they do have a full > size > > written on the labels. > > Emily > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > Marine biology Biology > > > > --------------------------------- > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service. > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service. > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13248	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Argh...So mad w/ LFS

Our lfs isn't all that hot to begin with. About a month ago I noticed Blood Parrots with black spot disease, a parasite. I tell the guy; he's never heard of it and says he'll treat it. Today they are riddled with the stuff even more so and they have a new pink blood parrot tank mate. The little pink one is covered in ick and black spots. The other BPs are floating upside down near the filter, alive but floating at the top. Pacus have horrible tail rot and are CRAMMED into a 20 gal. tank with 8 other pacus and oscars, all huge (at least 8".) Then this young kid boasts at an albino gourami that is LASERED with pink diamond patterns on both sides. I wish there was something I could do. I did take some medication that I used on black spot and told him to tell the owner to treat the tank with it. I doubt he will. Is there anything someone can do or are these fish just doomed? I almost want to buy the pink one just so I know he will be well taken care of. Then again I don't want to "support" the store either. Maybe since he's sick he'll just give him to me. Ha ha. Right. Very frustrating. Just venting I guess. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13249	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: algae was Nitrate #s

one other thing...since you used the plural, snails, I am assuming you have multiple snails that will multiply rapidly...hope you like snails ;-) Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Dane & Leslie Moore Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 2:25 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] algae was Nitrate #s ewwwwwww -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Emily Tenczar Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 1:30 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] algae was Nitrate #s I don't think so. I think the dark green algae makes a lovely background. It took over one of my betta tanks. I only scraped it off the front side of the tank, and I added some snails who decided to go crazy and populate amongst the greenery :) Emily Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote: LOL =) and it obscures your view of the tank! --- Dane & Leslie Moore wrote: > It's ugly? ;) > > Subject: [AquaticLife] algae was Nitrate #s > > > what is the problem with algae anyway? Isn't it good for the tank > since it eats up nitrates? Emily > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13250	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

I am going to leave a layer of gravel underneatth for plants to grow in... Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 2:38 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s Glad to see you got the nitrates under control. I see you plan to add more plants which should help towards this end. Also notice that you are planning to switch over to sand. While this may look awesome, you may have trouble trying to grow some of those plants you're thinking of getting as the finer sand has the tendancy of preventing proper root growth; its more compacted. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > I just had a major issue with nitrates...they shot up through the roof (and > I have some plants). I got some of the nitrate sponges to soak some of them > up before they kill my fish. I have been doing 20 % water changes every day > and after about a week, they got down to 40 ppm...they were as high as 160 > at one point. One of my tasks is to get more plants and more light. I am > designing a hood for my 55 gal tank, so once I get that all in place, I > should be fine...or at least I hope. I am also getting rid of my gravel > eventually and replacing it with sand. This of course means no more UGF, > but it looks a lot nicer. I set up my 20 gal to house some of my smaller > fish and some ghost shrimp that I got for food for my larger fish and I used > the Tahitian moonlight black sand. It looks awesome with that. I will be > switching over to that in the next month or so in the big tank. The only > thing I don;t like about the sand is it is a real PIA to get clean. When I > was setting up the 20 gal, I thought I had it clean, but ended up having to > empty out the tank and refilling it after cleaning the gravel once > again...ugg. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 10:37 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. This > should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in there > to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not > overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should not > get a chance to multiply. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > What is a "safe" number regarding nitrates? Everything is testing 0 > but > > of course I am getting a reading on nitrates, seems to be at 20 ppm. > > The reason I ask is due to this seemingly minor algae bloom. I've > seen > > others have this and then a full out mess within days. I don't want > > that. > > Anyhow, safe nitrate number? > > Thanks > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13251	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: algae was Nitrate #s

i meant when it covers the front of the tank. i usually don't mind it in the back. but when it's on the front it doesn't look so great. --- Emily Tenczar <bababanana@...> wrote: > I don't think so. I think the dark green algae makes a lovely background. It took over one of my > betta tanks. I only scraped it off the front side of the tank, and I added some snails who > decided to go crazy and populate amongst the greenery :) > Emily > > Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote: > LOL =) and it obscures your view of the tank! > > --- Dane & Leslie Moore wrote: > > > It's ugly? ;) > > > > Subject: [AquaticLife] algae was Nitrate #s > > > > > > what is the problem with algae anyway? Isn't it good for the tank since > > it eats up nitrates? Emily > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if > CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: > old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13252	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Argh...So mad w/ LFS

i don't know about where you live, but some animal control organizations will investigate fish store complaints as they would a cat/dog/other mammal complaint and may take action against the owner if the conditions are not improved. perhaps you could try this. it seems a little drastic but it might work. --- Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: > Our lfs isn't all that hot to begin with. About a month ago I noticed > Blood Parrots with black spot disease, a parasite. I tell the guy; he's > never heard of it and says he'll treat it. Today they are riddled with > the stuff even more so and they have a new pink blood parrot tank mate. > The little pink one is covered in ick and black spots. The other BPs > are floating upside down near the filter, alive but floating at the top. > Pacus have horrible tail rot and are CRAMMED into a 20 gal. tank with 8 > other pacus and oscars, all huge (at least 8".) Then this young kid > boasts at an albino gourami that is LASERED with pink diamond patterns > on both sides. > I wish there was something I could do. I did take some medication that > I used on black spot and told him to tell the owner to treat the tank > with it. I doubt he will. Is there anything someone can do or are > these fish just doomed? I almost want to buy the pink one just so I > know he will be well taken care of. Then again I don't want to > "support" the store either. Maybe since he's sick he'll just give him > to me. Ha ha. Right. > Very frustrating. Just venting I guess. > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13253	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: feeding plecos

Nick, It might just be they are not recognizing it as a food source. Try using a small bowl or glass, place it on the bottom of the tank, then place the Shelled green peas iside the container. Wait 24 hrs and see if they have been bothered. You might have to boil the pea out of them :-) for a few minutes, before deshelling them and placing them in the aquarium. I know i had a new bristlenose that had to have the cucumber I was trying to feed him,placed in front of the cave entrance before he Found it... Its all trial and error truthfully. What your fish won't eat mine might gobble up in a few minutes. Keep trying and good luck Rob Indiana USA In a message dated 7/12/2005 9:59:47 PM US Eastern Standard Time, nmunro@... writes: I tired green peas with my Tiger barbs, Silver Sharks, Guppies, Cory Dory, Bristle Nose, Mollies, but none of them took any notice? Is it something you have to get them used to over time? I know it took a couple of days before they would all eat the pallets instead of the flakes. =Nick [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13254	From: Evita	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Argh...So mad w/ LFS

Sadly there is no laws really pretecting tropical fish from being neglected. The least one can do is complain to the Better Business. Places like this are very common. If it were dogs or cats the law would be on them flat. As far a treating the fish they probably sell that too. Sad for sure. Evita Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote:Our lfs isn't all that hot to begin with. About a month ago I noticed Blood Parrots with black spot disease, a parasite. I tell the guy; he's never heard of it and says he'll treat it. Today they are riddled with the stuff even more so and they have a new pink blood parrot tank mate. The little pink one is covered in ick and black spots. The other BPs are floating upside down near the filter, alive but floating at the top. Pacus have horrible tail rot and are CRAMMED into a 20 gal. tank with 8 other pacus and oscars, all huge (at least 8".) Then this young kid boasts at an albino gourami that is LASERED with pink diamond patterns on both sides. I wish there was something I could do. I did take some medication that I used on black spot and told him to tell the owner to treat the tank with it. I doubt he will. Is there anything someone can do or are these fish just doomed? I almost want to buy the pink one just so I know he will be well taken care of. Then again I don't want to "support" the store either. Maybe since he's sick he'll just give him to me. Ha ha. Right. Very frustrating. Just venting I guess. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13255	From: harry perry	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Argh...So mad w/ LFS/animal abuse.

Animal abuse is a crime in most areas. Call your local government or township building. Shut him/her down. Write your local newspaper, they love stories like this. There is a lot you can do. Harry Evita <evitabug@...> wrote: Sadly there is no laws really pretecting tropical fish from being neglected. The least one can do is complain to the Better Business. Places like this are very common. If it were dogs or cats the law would be on them flat. As far a treating the fish they probably sell that too. Sad for sure. Evita Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote:Our lfs isn't all that hot to begin with. About a month ago I noticed Blood Parrots with black spot disease, a parasite. I tell the guy; he's never heard of it and says he'll treat it. Today they are riddled with the stuff even more so and they have a new pink blood parrot tank mate. The little pink one is covered in ick and black spots. The other BPs are floating upside down near the filter, alive but floating at the top. Pacus have horrible tail rot and are CRAMMED into a 20 gal. tank with 8 other pacus and oscars, all huge (at least 8".) Then this young kid boasts at an albino gourami that is LASERED with pink diamond patterns on both sides. I wish there was something I could do. I did take some medication that I used on black spot and told him to tell the owner to treat the tank with it. I doubt he will. Is there anything someone can do or are these fish just doomed? I almost want to buy the pink one just so I know he will be well taken care of. Then again I don't want to "support" the store either. Maybe since he's sick he'll just give him to me. Ha ha. Right. Very frustrating. Just venting I guess. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13256	From: Patrick	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Argh...So mad w/ LFS/animal abuse.

I can just see a 6 foot man going to jail for abusing a 2 inch fish. Here in the real world fish are about as high up on the "protected" list as a roach or mosquito. Face it, only animal rights wackos and fish lovers even think about this, and the animal rights wackos want all pet ownership ended anyway so they are worse than the fish stores that are bad. Maybe this could be discussed somewhere else? Patrick -------Original Message------- Animal abuse is a crime in most areas. Call your local government or township building. Shut him/her down. Write your local newspaper, they love stories like this. There is a lot you can do. Harry [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13257	From: harry perry	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Argh...So mad w/ LFS/animal abuse./To Patrick

I am a fish lover but not an animal rights wacko. I was speaking of hitting the store where it hurts. Money is the name of this game also. Harry Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: I can just see a 6 foot man going to jail for abusing a 2 inch fish. Here in the real world fish are about as high up on the "protected" list as a roach or mosquito. Face it, only animal rights wackos and fish lovers even think about this, and the animal rights wackos want all pet ownership ended anyway so they are worse than the fish stores that are bad. Maybe this could be discussed somewhere else? Patrick -------Original Message------- Animal abuse is a crime in most areas. Call your local government or township building. Shut him/her down. Write your local newspaper, they love stories like this. There is a lot you can do. Harry [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13258	From: harry perry	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Argh...So mad w/ LFS/animal abuse./To Patrick again

Or how about folks in the midwest losing their homes to fire because an enendangered species lives in the undergrowth that can't be cut by law. I live in the real world Patrick and anything is possible. Harry Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: I can just see a 6 foot man going to jail for abusing a 2 inch fish. Here in the real world fish are about as high up on the "protected" list as a roach or mosquito. Face it, only animal rights wackos and fish lovers even think about this, and the animal rights wackos want all pet ownership ended anyway so they are worse than the fish stores that are bad. Maybe this could be discussed somewhere else? Patrick -------Original Message------- Animal abuse is a crime in most areas. Call your local government or township building. Shut him/her down. Write your local newspaper, they love stories like this. There is a lot you can do. Harry [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13259	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

Probably less than 100. However, that may not be your concern here, really. Yes algae uses nitrates, but they also use other compounds and elements found in water that we do not normally measure. An example would be phosphates. Also needed is light. A lack of competition from other plants also contributes to algal growth. If this is a new tank, it is quite common for an algal or bacterial bloom to occur. Usually the blooms are rather short lived, relatively speaking, and will run their course, unless, of course, you try to "cure" the bloom. A reduction in light would be a good first step, unless you have live plants that need a well lit environment. If this is the case, then it is just a matter of time before the algae is out competed for food. One thing to remember is that there is really no such thing as an algae free tank. There will always be algae is some form, in some amount, in your tank. The idea is to control it and minimize it. Is some tanks, with certain fish, it is a welcome plant. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Dane & Leslie Moore Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 11:06 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com; naturalaquariumenthusiast@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Nitrate #s What is a "safe" number regarding nitrates? Everything is testing 0 but of course I am getting a reading on nitrates, seems to be at 20 ppm. The reason I ask is due to this seemingly minor algae bloom. I've seen others have this and then a full out mess within days. I don't want that. Anyhow, safe nitrate number? Thanks [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13260	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Argh...So mad w/ LFS/animal abuse./To Patrick again

Sucks to live there I guess...Maybe if we practiced more environmentally sound building practices, things like this woul;dn't be an issue. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of harry perry Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 9:15 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Argh...So mad w/ LFS/animal abuse./To Patrick again Or how about folks in the midwest losing their homes to fire because an enendangered species lives in the undergrowth that can't be cut by law. I live in the real world Patrick and anything is possible. Harry Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: I can just see a 6 foot man going to jail for abusing a 2 inch fish. Here in the real world fish are about as high up on the "protected" list as a roach or mosquito. Face it, only animal rights wackos and fish lovers even think about this, and the animal rights wackos want all pet ownership ended anyway so they are worse than the fish stores that are bad. Maybe this could be discussed somewhere else? Patrick -------Original Message------- Animal abuse is a crime in most areas. Call your local government or township building. Shut him/her down. Write your local newspaper, they love stories like this. There is a lot you can do. Harry [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13261	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

160 ppm is a ways away from killing your fish. Over a long term it may cause problems in your fish, bit is nothing to panic over as you do have plenty of time to determine the problem and reduce the presence of the nitrate without taking any drastic actions. Now, if we were talking a reef tank here, that would be a whole other ballgame, and your tank would be essentially dead. But, we are not, and your tank would have been OK without rushing about to "do something" about the nitrates. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Roberts Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 1:39 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s I just had a major issue with nitrates...they shot up through the roof (and I have some plants). I got some of the nitrate sponges to soak some of them up before they kill my fish. I have been doing 20 % water changes every day and after about a week, they got down to 40 ppm...they were as high as 160 at one point. One of my tasks is to get more plants and more light. I am designing a hood for my 55 gal tank, so once I get that all in place, I should be fine...or at least I hope. I am also getting rid of my gravel eventually and replacing it with sand. This of course means no more UGF, but it looks a lot nicer. I set up my 20 gal to house some of my smaller fish and some ghost shrimp that I got for food for my larger fish and I used the Tahitian moonlight black sand. It looks awesome with that. I will be switching over to that in the next month or so in the big tank. The only thing I don;t like about the sand is it is a real PIA to get clean. When I was setting up the 20 gal, I thought I had it clean, but ended up having to empty out the tank and refilling it after cleaning the gravel once again...ugg. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 10:37 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. This should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in there to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should not get a chance to multiply. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > What is a "safe" number regarding nitrates? Everything is testing 0 but > of course I am getting a reading on nitrates, seems to be at 20 ppm. > The reason I ask is due to this seemingly minor algae bloom. I've seen > others have this and then a full out mess within days. I don't want > that. > Anyhow, safe nitrate number? > Thanks > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13262	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

Eric, That will not work either. The sand will find its way down through the gravel, and you'd be facing the same problem if you had used all sand. What you may consider doing is using a finer gravel than you normally would find in a store. You should look at some #2 gravel, which is finer than the #3 gravel usually found in stores, and fairly good for plants as it does compact some, but not enough to disrupt root growth. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Roberts Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 4:51 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s I am going to leave a layer of gravel underneatth for plants to grow in... Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 2:38 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s Glad to see you got the nitrates under control. I see you plan to add more plants which should help towards this end. Also notice that you are planning to switch over to sand. While this may look awesome, you may have trouble trying to grow some of those plants you're thinking of getting as the finer sand has the tendancy of preventing proper root growth; its more compacted. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > I just had a major issue with nitrates...they shot up through the roof (and > I have some plants). I got some of the nitrate sponges to soak some of them > up before they kill my fish. I have been doing 20 % water changes every day > and after about a week, they got down to 40 ppm...they were as high as 160 > at one point. One of my tasks is to get more plants and more light. I am > designing a hood for my 55 gal tank, so once I get that all in place, I > should be fine...or at least I hope. I am also getting rid of my gravel > eventually and replacing it with sand. This of course means no more UGF, > but it looks a lot nicer. I set up my 20 gal to house some of my smaller > fish and some ghost shrimp that I got for food for my larger fish and I used > the Tahitian moonlight black sand. It looks awesome with that. I will be > switching over to that in the next month or so in the big tank. The only > thing I don;t like about the sand is it is a real PIA to get clean. When I > was setting up the 20 gal, I thought I had it clean, but ended up having to > empty out the tank and refilling it after cleaning the gravel once > again...ugg. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 10:37 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. This > should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in there > to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not > overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should not > get a chance to multiply. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > What is a "safe" number regarding nitrates? Everything is testing 0 > but > > of course I am getting a reading on nitrates, seems to be at 20 ppm. > > The reason I ask is due to this seemingly minor algae bloom. I've > seen > > others have this and then a full out mess within days. I don't want > > that. > > Anyhow, safe nitrate number? > > Thanks > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13263	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

I just did daily water changes as well a a good deep cleaning of the gravel. I put the bags of nitrate/nitrite/phosphate absorber in my filters just to help get rid of what was already in the water. I think this is what has helped as water changes prior to this did not effect the nitrate levels. I don;t think it was from over feeding. We did have that problem, but I reduced the amount of food, plus got some critters that will mop up the uneaten food. I haven't added any fertilizers for my plants as of yet, so that is not the source. I am not sure where all the excess nitrates are coming from. I normally do a 20% water change every 2 weeks. So I haven't figured out the source. My only thought is that it may have had something to do with my UGF. I turned it off as I am slowly adding plants and that is when the nitrate levels went down to 40 (same day as I added the absorbing material). This was something that has happened over the past few weeks, so it was the extended exposure to high nitrate levels that I was concerned about. I lost 2 of my spiny eels in the past week, so I think that may have been the cause. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 9:39 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s 160 ppm is a ways away from killing your fish. Over a long term it may cause problems in your fish, bit is nothing to panic over as you do have plenty of time to determine the problem and reduce the presence of the nitrate without taking any drastic actions. Now, if we were talking a reef tank here, that would be a whole other ballgame, and your tank would be essentially dead. But, we are not, and your tank would have been OK without rushing about to "do something" about the nitrates. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Roberts Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 1:39 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s I just had a major issue with nitrates...they shot up through the roof (and I have some plants). I got some of the nitrate sponges to soak some of them up before they kill my fish. I have been doing 20 % water changes every day and after about a week, they got down to 40 ppm...they were as high as 160 at one point. One of my tasks is to get more plants and more light. I am designing a hood for my 55 gal tank, so once I get that all in place, I should be fine...or at least I hope. I am also getting rid of my gravel eventually and replacing it with sand. This of course means no more UGF, but it looks a lot nicer. I set up my 20 gal to house some of my smaller fish and some ghost shrimp that I got for food for my larger fish and I used the Tahitian moonlight black sand. It looks awesome with that. I will be switching over to that in the next month or so in the big tank. The only thing I don;t like about the sand is it is a real PIA to get clean. When I was setting up the 20 gal, I thought I had it clean, but ended up having to empty out the tank and refilling it after cleaning the gravel once again...ugg. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 10:37 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. This should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in there to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should not get a chance to multiply. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > What is a "safe" number regarding nitrates? Everything is testing 0 but > of course I am getting a reading on nitrates, seems to be at 20 ppm. > The reason I ask is due to this seemingly minor algae bloom. I've seen > others have this and then a full out mess within days. I don't want > that. > Anyhow, safe nitrate number? > Thanks > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! 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PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13264	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

this is the sand I used and am planning on using in the 55 gal: http://shop.petsmart.com/product/2534374302023693/2534374302030109/845524441 781393.htm I could not find a "mm", but it said extra fine. Now as far as #2 gravel goes, what should I be looking for? I looked online and found this: http://www.cayugalandscape.com/gardencenter/bulk_materials/bulkmaterials.htm l That looks pretty big to me... Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 9:44 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s Eric, That will not work either. The sand will find its way down through the gravel, and you'd be facing the same problem if you had used all sand. What you may consider doing is using a finer gravel than you normally would find in a store. You should look at some #2 gravel, which is finer than the #3 gravel usually found in stores, and fairly good for plants as it does compact some, but not enough to disrupt root growth. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Roberts Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 4:51 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s I am going to leave a layer of gravel underneatth for plants to grow in... Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 2:38 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s Glad to see you got the nitrates under control. I see you plan to add more plants which should help towards this end. Also notice that you are planning to switch over to sand. While this may look awesome, you may have trouble trying to grow some of those plants you're thinking of getting as the finer sand has the tendancy of preventing proper root growth; its more compacted. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > I just had a major issue with nitrates...they shot up through the roof (and > I have some plants). I got some of the nitrate sponges to soak some of them > up before they kill my fish. I have been doing 20 % water changes every day > and after about a week, they got down to 40 ppm...they were as high as 160 > at one point. One of my tasks is to get more plants and more light. I am > designing a hood for my 55 gal tank, so once I get that all in place, I > should be fine...or at least I hope. I am also getting rid of my gravel > eventually and replacing it with sand. This of course means no more UGF, > but it looks a lot nicer. I set up my 20 gal to house some of my smaller > fish and some ghost shrimp that I got for food for my larger fish and I used > the Tahitian moonlight black sand. It looks awesome with that. I will be > switching over to that in the next month or so in the big tank. The only > thing I don;t like about the sand is it is a real PIA to get clean. When I > was setting up the 20 gal, I thought I had it clean, but ended up having to > empty out the tank and refilling it after cleaning the gravel once > again...ugg. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 10:37 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. This > should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in there > to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not > overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should not > get a chance to multiply. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > What is a "safe" number regarding nitrates? Everything is testing 0 > but > > of course I am getting a reading on nitrates, seems to be at 20 ppm. > > The reason I ask is due to this seemingly minor algae bloom. I've > seen > > others have this and then a full out mess within days. I don't want > > that. > > Anyhow, safe nitrate number? > > Thanks > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13265	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

is this what you are referring to? http://www.aquatic-store.com/en-us/dept_461.html Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Roberts Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 10:27 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s this is the sand I used and am planning on using in the 55 gal: http://shop.petsmart.com/product/2534374302023693/2534374302030109/845524441 781393.htm I could not find a "mm", but it said extra fine. Now as far as #2 gravel goes, what should I be looking for? I looked online and found this: http://www.cayugalandscape.com/gardencenter/bulk_materials/bulkmaterials.htm l That looks pretty big to me... Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 9:44 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s Eric, That will not work either. The sand will find its way down through the gravel, and you'd be facing the same problem if you had used all sand. What you may consider doing is using a finer gravel than you normally would find in a store. You should look at some #2 gravel, which is finer than the #3 gravel usually found in stores, and fairly good for plants as it does compact some, but not enough to disrupt root growth. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Roberts Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 4:51 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s I am going to leave a layer of gravel underneatth for plants to grow in... Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 2:38 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s Glad to see you got the nitrates under control. I see you plan to add more plants which should help towards this end. Also notice that you are planning to switch over to sand. While this may look awesome, you may have trouble trying to grow some of those plants you're thinking of getting as the finer sand has the tendancy of preventing proper root growth; its more compacted. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > I just had a major issue with nitrates...they shot up through the roof (and > I have some plants). I got some of the nitrate sponges to soak some of them > up before they kill my fish. I have been doing 20 % water changes every day > and after about a week, they got down to 40 ppm...they were as high as 160 > at one point. One of my tasks is to get more plants and more light. I am > designing a hood for my 55 gal tank, so once I get that all in place, I > should be fine...or at least I hope. I am also getting rid of my gravel > eventually and replacing it with sand. This of course means no more UGF, > but it looks a lot nicer. I set up my 20 gal to house some of my smaller > fish and some ghost shrimp that I got for food for my larger fish and I used > the Tahitian moonlight black sand. It looks awesome with that. I will be > switching over to that in the next month or so in the big tank. The only > thing I don;t like about the sand is it is a real PIA to get clean. When I > was setting up the 20 gal, I thought I had it clean, but ended up having to > empty out the tank and refilling it after cleaning the gravel once > again...ugg. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 10:37 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. This > should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in there > to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not > overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should not > get a chance to multiply. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > What is a "safe" number regarding nitrates? Everything is testing 0 > but > > of course I am getting a reading on nitrates, seems to be at 20 ppm. > > The reason I ask is due to this seemingly minor algae bloom. I've > seen > > others have this and then a full out mess within days. I don't want > > that. > > Anyhow, safe nitrate number? > > Thanks > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13266	From: clarkmariposo25@aol.com	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: What types of fish would you recommend for 55 gall tank?

You could do rainbow fish. They look really pretty when schooling together [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13267	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: angel fish

How do angel fish and tiger barbs get along? sword tails? female aggressive guppies? =Nick Crazy4fids@... wrote: >Mike- >I am looking for a native catfish to add to my 150 gallon aquarium. I >already have 8 cory cats on my list but was looking for something different >similar to a syndontis. I think I may be getting a striped raphael catfish, but >was wondering whether I would ever see it. I love the look of syndontis. > >BTW, I have rummy nose tetras, neon tetras, glow light tetras, two guppies, >and three peppered cory cats. I will be adding 4 more cories, 8 angelfish >and 4 keyhole cichlids. So the catfish need to be a peaceful one. > >Linda > > >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >AquaticLife Management. > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13268	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Mollies go to surface to breath?

300 litres ish or 90 gallons ish pH 7, 0 ammonia and nitrite or as close to zero as I can identify with my Hagen test kit. basically ok. Lately every thing is getting aggressive, but the mollies are bigger than all the other fish so they don't get picked on. 23.5 deg C. I'm wondering if they normally have big bellies? maybe a tummy infection? originally I thought the stomuck was growing and they were going to have babies but its been a month and no sign of any thing. I have two of them and they are both doing it. The only other fish that does it in the tank is a Betta (and as if I have to tell you its like normal :-) ) Live plants, maybe a recent whitening quality of the water due to possibly a bacteria but that has all gone away as of start of last week. =Nick Steve Szabo wrote: >Nick, > >This is not normal behavior for mollies. What do you consider to be perfect >for your pH, ammonia, nitrite readings? > >What size is your tank? > >What other fish do you have in the tank, and what size are they? > >What is the water temperature? > >Any other information you might think pertinent would be helpful. You simply >are not giving enough information to go on here to offer even a tentative >diagnosis. > >-----Original Message----- >From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On >Behalf Of Nicolas Munro >Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2005 11:12 PM >To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com >Subject: [AquaticLife] Mollies go to surface to breath? > >Hi, > >I've got two mollies which always go to the surface and look like they >are eating food but there is no food. alternatively are they trying to >breath the air kinda like Betas? > > >Non of my other fish in the tank do it, pH, Ammonia, Nitrite are perfect. > > >=Nick > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to >the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the >SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >AquaticLife Management. > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >AquaticLife Management. > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13269	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Mollies go to surface to breath?

I don't have a nitrAte test kit, my tanks almost 6 months old so could be. Live plants are supposed to help with that of which I've got a good amount maybe a 1/4 if planted side by side. =Nick paul helms wrote: >what about the most important test of all? NITRATE!!!! > >--- Nicolas Munro <nmunro@...> wrote: > > > >>Hi, >> >>I've got two mollies which always go to the surface >>and look like they >>are eating food but there is no food. alternatively >>are they trying to >>breath the air kinda like Betas? >> >> >>Non of my other fish in the tank do it, pH, Ammonia, >>Nitrite are perfect. >> >> >>=Nick >> >> >> > > > > >____________________________________________________ >Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page >http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >AquaticLife Management. > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13270	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Mollies go to surface to breath?

My original power head was definetly putting heaps of oxygen into the water cause it moved the water probably too quickly, now I have the water flowing slower... and if that wasn't enough i had an air curtain going 24/7 and at night have a couple of air stones going too. don't think its an oxeygen thing =Nick Dane & Leslie Moore wrote: >Although the other fish are not doing this, I would still guess that >it's a lack of sufficent oxygen. Get a powerhead going and I bet they >resume their normal behavior. (Of course this is if you don't already >have one, at this point it doesn't sound as you do.) ? =) >L > >Subject: [AquaticLife] Mollies go to surface to breath? > > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >AquaticLife Management. > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13271	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 7/13/2005
Subject: Re: Mollies go to surface to breath?

Too hot? Is the fish new? In a message dated 7/13/2005 11:39:16 PM Pacific Daylight Time, nmunro@... writes: My original power head was definetly putting heaps of oxygen into the water cause it moved the water probably too quickly, now I have the water flowing slower... and if that wasn't enough i had an air curtain going 24/7 and at night have a couple of air stones going too. don't think its an oxeygen thing =Nick [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13272	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: RE_ (pacu minni) Petsmart

All excellent ideas Ray. Two of the clubs I regularly attend meet at a Round Table Pizza. They get customers and we get two large rooms to hold meetings. A third club can use a meeting room at the local university. An avian society I used to be more active in uses the county water district Board meeting room, free, as well as a conference room at the local library. Mike In a message dated 7/13/2005 12:52:47 PM Pacific Daylight Time, sevenspringss@... writes: If you're thinking about starting a local fish club, that's surely a good idea, as is posting in vet offices (and supermarket and library bulletin boards, etc.). You must be ambitious to which I wish you lots of luck. Hope things go okay -- sometimes with just a few core people, these things start to snowball. You don't know until you try. You may have to meet at various members' homes in the beginning, but if you inquire there's a good chance some organization (VFW Hall, etc.) may volunteer space for your group to meet once a month. GOOD LUCK! Ray \ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13273	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: catfish

Hi Linda. When you say "Native Catfish" do you mean a North American Catfish? I am not sure of a Catfish in North America that would not outgrow and consume most all other tankmates. "FortWayneFish" mentioned bushynose plecos, and I have to agree, they stay relatively small and get along well with other fish. You can also look into other Cories as there are a lot of them to choose from. If I remember correctl As far as the striped rafael catfish. I had two striped and two spotted, and I occasionally saw the tails of the striped but for well over a year and a half the spotted ones might as well have been dead as I NEVER saw them. I found them when I moved and I could not remove them from their rocks, I had to submerse their rocks for transport. You could also look into botias / loaches. Just make sure they do not grow too large. They can be quite comical little guys. I had some and they would fall asleep in plants, laying sideways on the leaves, or laying in a big dogpile sleeping then wake up and scoot all over the tank. In a message dated 7/12/2005 7:34:21 PM Pacific Daylight Time, Crazy4fids@... writes: Mike- I am looking for a native catfish to add to my 150 gallon aquarium. I already have 8 cory cats on my list but was looking for something different similar to a syndontis. I think I may be getting a striped raphael catfish, but was wondering whether I would ever see it. I love the look of syndontis. BTW, I have rummy nose tetras, neon tetras, glow light tetras, two guppies, and three peppered cory cats. I will be adding 4 more cories, 8 angelfish and 4 keyhole cichlids. So the catfish need to be a peaceful one. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13274	From: Hrvoje Maric	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: angel fish

You can have three situations. If introduced together when young they will probably do just fine providing that tank is big enough. If you have adult angelfish and introduce young tiger barbs, angelfish (who tend to be quite territorial) will defend their space and tigers will learn to avoid them. If you have adult tiger barbs and try to introduce young angelfish, well, this is bad idea, because all accomodated fish will attack intruders. From my experience (roughly 25 years and allways quite large and well planted tanks - 200 L minimum)there should be no problem if you don't keep more than two angelfish / 200 L. Otherwise they can become very agressive and harras all other fish, not to mention killing others of their own species. Anyway, in recent years I do prefer setups which contain fish from same area. In that sense angelfish (South America), and tiger barbs (and / or common livebearers - Asia) simply do not fit well together. I appologise for my English, I'm from Croatia, and sometimes can't find right words. Kind regards Hrvoje

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13275	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.

Hi Linda, Mike again. I hit send with the help of my orange 12 week old kitten ;) I was adding more comment about Cories. I think there are about three kinds of small cories, Hastatus, Pygmaeus, and the third escapes me right now. Add some Brochis that someone else mentioned and you could have three very distinct sized catfish, as well as different colored ones. Try this site. http://www.planetcatfish.com/ Lots and lots of catfish to be found here. Mike In a message dated 7/12/2005 7:34:21 PM Pacific Daylight Time, Crazy4fids@... writes: Mike- I am looking for a native catfish to add to my 150 gallon aquarium. I already have 8 cory cats on my list but was looking for something different similar to a syndontis. I think I may be getting a striped raphael catfish, but was wondering whether I would ever see it. I love the look of syndontis. BTW, I have rummy nose tetras, neon tetras, glow light tetras, two guppies, and three peppered cory cats. I will be adding 4 more cories, 8 angelfish and 4 keyhole cichlids. So the catfish need to be a peaceful one. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13276	From: Hrvoje Maric	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Mollies go to surface to breath?

As all information you gave look fine, I'd concentrate on "big bellies". Do they look abnormal (swollen, blunted), scales not attached firmly to the body? In that case it could be desease which is common (but not exclusive) to neon tetras, I cant remember English name but translated form Croatian it is something like "water belly". If so it is quite contagious and deadly, so you should remove your fish form tank. It can come simply from water and it can't be simply cured, but you should consider options for taking precautions for other fish. Other reason that comes to my mind is that they may have caught some gill parasites (again from water), which prevent them to breath properly. Again, quarrantine the fish to avoid spreading to other inhabitants. Do you use tap water, and how do you treat it before pouring into the tank. I allways treat tap water with some commercially available agents, and let it rest for couple of days (requires space and spare vessels). Water taken from nature allways carries some risks in terms of deseases and parasites. Hrvoje

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13277	From: paul helms	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Mollies go to surface to breath?

it very well could be nitrate poisoning. get a test kit that does nitrate..teh most important test --- Nicolas Munro <nmunro@...> wrote: > I don't have a nitrAte test kit, my tanks almost 6 > months old so could be. > > Live plants are supposed to help with that of which > I've got a good > amount maybe a 1/4 if planted side by side. > > =Nick > > paul helms wrote: > > >what about the most important test of all? > NITRATE!!!! > > > >--- Nicolas Munro <nmunro@...> > wrote: > > > > > > > >>Hi, > >> > >>I've got two mollies which always go to the > surface > >>and look like they > >>are eating food but there is no food. > alternatively > >>are they trying to > >>breath the air kinda like Betas? > >> > >> > >>Non of my other fish in the tank do it, pH, > Ammonia, > >>Nitrite are perfect. > >> > >> > >>=Nick > >> > >> > >> > > > > > > > > > >____________________________________________________ > >Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > >http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs > > > > > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > >Please delete this line and everything below it > when replying, thanks. > > > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING > the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter, > >AquaticLife Management. > > > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > you! > > > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13278	From: paul helms	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: angel fish

they don't --- Nicolas Munro <nmunro@...> wrote: > How do angel fish and tiger barbs get along? > > sword tails? > > female aggressive guppies? > > =Nick > > Crazy4fids@... wrote: > > >Mike- > >I am looking for a native catfish to add to my 150 > gallon aquarium. I > >already have 8 cory cats on my list but was looking > for something different > >similar to a syndontis. I think I may be getting a > striped raphael catfish, but > >was wondering whether I would ever see it. I love > the look of syndontis. > > > >BTW, I have rummy nose tetras, neon tetras, glow > light tetras, two guppies, > >and three peppered cory cats. I will be adding 4 > more cories, 8 angelfish > >and 4 keyhole cichlids. So the catfish need to be > a peaceful one. > > > >Linda > > > > > >[Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > >Please delete this line and everything below it > when replying, thanks. > > > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING > the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter, > >AquaticLife Management. > > > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > you! > > > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13279	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)

I really don't think the size of the cory catfish would be to much of a concern in a 150 gallon tank. There are some 200+ species of corycatfish and more being found/described every year. I'd try and stick with one or two species of cories though as it will help them bond together. All cories will school but inter species seem to bond better then those out of species. Just remember all fish poop in the water. And when they do it Goes down. So your bottom dwellers are usually the first to start showing signs, if you tank conditions are not kept up. There are some Hardy cories and not so hardy cories. The hardiest of them all and the cheapest would be C. Aeneus ( bronze cory or green cory ), C palateaus ( salt and peppercory) You see panda cories all the time but be cautious as they can be very sensative to nitrates and more often then not if your tank hasn't aged a few months after the cycle you will loose a few. 150 gallon tank..... escaping to dream land what could I do :-) rob Indiana In a message dated 7/14/2005 4:29:04 AM US Eastern Standard Time, Deenerz@... writes: I was adding more comment about Cories. I think there are about three kinds of small cories, Hastatus, Pygmaeus, and the third escapes me right now. Add some Brochis that someone else mentioned and you could have three very distinct sized catfish, as well as different colored ones. Try this site. http://www.planetcatfish.com/ Lots and lots of catfish to be found here. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13280	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)

I didn't either, I was trying to say that if she stayed in the cory family, she could get different sizes and colors for variety. Now Linda has got me thinking about starting up a planted community tank and getting some different cories to go in it. Mike In a message dated 7/14/2005 3:31:43 AM Pacific Daylight Time, FortWayneFish@... writes: I really don't think the size of the cory catfish would be to much of a concern in a 150 gallon tank. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13281	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

What is the measurement of nitrates coming from your tap water, prior to adding git to the tank? This is often an overlooked source of nitrates, especially if you are using well water. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Roberts Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 11:19 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s I just did daily water changes as well a a good deep cleaning of the gravel. I put the bags of nitrate/nitrite/phosphate absorber in my filters just to help get rid of what was already in the water. I think this is what has helped as water changes prior to this did not effect the nitrate levels. I don;t think it was from over feeding. We did have that problem, but I reduced the amount of food, plus got some critters that will mop up the uneaten food. I haven't added any fertilizers for my plants as of yet, so that is not the source. I am not sure where all the excess nitrates are coming from. I normally do a 20% water change every 2 weeks. So I haven't figured out the source. My only thought is that it may have had something to do with my UGF. I turned it off as I am slowly adding plants and that is when the nitrate levels went down to 40 (same day as I added the absorbing material). This was something that has happened over the past few weeks, so it was the extended exposure to high nitrate levels that I was concerned about. I lost 2 of my spiny eels in the past week, so I think that may have been the cause. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 9:39 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s 160 ppm is a ways away from killing your fish. Over a long term it may cause problems in your fish, bit is nothing to panic over as you do have plenty of time to determine the problem and reduce the presence of the nitrate without taking any drastic actions. Now, if we were talking a reef tank here, that would be a whole other ballgame, and your tank would be essentially dead. But, we are not, and your tank would have been OK without rushing about to "do something" about the nitrates. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Roberts Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 1:39 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s I just had a major issue with nitrates...they shot up through the roof (and I have some plants). I got some of the nitrate sponges to soak some of them up before they kill my fish. I have been doing 20 % water changes every day and after about a week, they got down to 40 ppm...they were as high as 160 at one point. One of my tasks is to get more plants and more light. I am designing a hood for my 55 gal tank, so once I get that all in place, I should be fine...or at least I hope. I am also getting rid of my gravel eventually and replacing it with sand. This of course means no more UGF, but it looks a lot nicer. I set up my 20 gal to house some of my smaller fish and some ghost shrimp that I got for food for my larger fish and I used the Tahitian moonlight black sand. It looks awesome with that. I will be switching over to that in the next month or so in the big tank. The only thing I don;t like about the sand is it is a real PIA to get clean. When I was setting up the 20 gal, I thought I had it clean, but ended up having to empty out the tank and refilling it after cleaning the gravel once again...ugg. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 10:37 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. This should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in there to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should not get a chance to multiply. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > What is a "safe" number regarding nitrates? Everything is testing 0 but > of course I am getting a reading on nitrates, seems to be at 20 ppm. > The reason I ask is due to this seemingly minor algae bloom. I've seen > others have this and then a full out mess within days. I don't want > that. > Anyhow, safe nitrate number? > Thanks > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13282	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

I'll see if I can get a photo for you tonight. That Carib Sea product looks OK, but I'd like to see it in person first. It does not look like sand in the form that most people here are thinking of sand (beach sand). -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Roberts Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 11:27 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s this is the sand I used and am planning on using in the 55 gal: http://shop.petsmart.com/product/2534374302023693/2534374302030109/845524441 781393.htm I could not find a "mm", but it said extra fine. Now as far as #2 gravel goes, what should I be looking for? I looked online and found this: http://www.cayugalandscape.com/gardencenter/bulk_materials/bulkmaterials.htm l That looks pretty big to me... Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 9:44 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s Eric, That will not work either. The sand will find its way down through the gravel, and you'd be facing the same problem if you had used all sand. What you may consider doing is using a finer gravel than you normally would find in a store. You should look at some #2 gravel, which is finer than the #3 gravel usually found in stores, and fairly good for plants as it does compact some, but not enough to disrupt root growth. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Roberts Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 4:51 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s I am going to leave a layer of gravel underneatth for plants to grow in... Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 2:38 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s Glad to see you got the nitrates under control. I see you plan to add more plants which should help towards this end. Also notice that you are planning to switch over to sand. While this may look awesome, you may have trouble trying to grow some of those plants you're thinking of getting as the finer sand has the tendancy of preventing proper root growth; its more compacted. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > I just had a major issue with nitrates...they shot up through the roof (and > I have some plants). I got some of the nitrate sponges to soak some of them > up before they kill my fish. I have been doing 20 % water changes every day > and after about a week, they got down to 40 ppm...they were as high as 160 > at one point. One of my tasks is to get more plants and more light. I am > designing a hood for my 55 gal tank, so once I get that all in place, I > should be fine...or at least I hope. I am also getting rid of my gravel > eventually and replacing it with sand. This of course means no more UGF, > but it looks a lot nicer. I set up my 20 gal to house some of my smaller > fish and some ghost shrimp that I got for food for my larger fish and I used > the Tahitian moonlight black sand. It looks awesome with that. I will be > switching over to that in the next month or so in the big tank. The only > thing I don;t like about the sand is it is a real PIA to get clean. When I > was setting up the 20 gal, I thought I had it clean, but ended up having to > empty out the tank and refilling it after cleaning the gravel once > again...ugg. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 10:37 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. This > should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in there > to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not > overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should not > get a chance to multiply. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > What is a "safe" number regarding nitrates? Everything is testing 0 > but > > of course I am getting a reading on nitrates, seems to be at 20 ppm. > > The reason I ask is due to this seemingly minor algae bloom. I've > seen > > others have this and then a full out mess within days. I don't want > > that. > > Anyhow, safe nitrate number? > > Thanks > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! 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PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13283	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Mollies go to surface to breath?

Then I'd probably look at the oxygen levels in your tank, as someone else has already suggested. You mention the big bellies--just on females, or on both male and female fish? Which kind of mollie do you have? \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nicolas Munro Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 2:38 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Mollies go to surface to breath? 300 litres ish or 90 gallons ish pH 7, 0 ammonia and nitrite or as close to zero as I can identify with my Hagen test kit. basically ok. Lately every thing is getting aggressive, but the mollies are bigger than all the other fish so they don't get picked on. 23.5 deg C. I'm wondering if they normally have big bellies? maybe a tummy infection? originally I thought the stomuck was growing and they were going to have babies but its been a month and no sign of any thing. I have two of them and they are both doing it. The only other fish that does it in the tank is a Betta (and as if I have to tell you its like normal :-) ) Live plants, maybe a recent whitening quality of the water due to possibly a bacteria but that has all gone away as of start of last week. =Nick Steve Szabo wrote: >Nick, > >This is not normal behavior for mollies. What do you consider to be perfect >for your pH, ammonia, nitrite readings? > >What size is your tank? > >What other fish do you have in the tank, and what size are they? > >What is the water temperature? > >Any other information you might think pertinent would be helpful. You simply >are not giving enough information to go on here to offer even a tentative >diagnosis. > >-----Original Message----- >From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On >Behalf Of Nicolas Munro >Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2005 11:12 PM >To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com >Subject: [AquaticLife] Mollies go to surface to breath? > >Hi, > >I've got two mollies which always go to the surface and look like they >are eating food but there is no food. alternatively are they trying to >breath the air kinda like Betas? > > >Non of my other fish in the tank do it, pH, Ammonia, Nitrite are perfect. > > >=Nick > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to >the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the >SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >AquaticLife Management. > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >AquaticLife Management. > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13284	From: Evita	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Mollies go to surface to breath?

The Balloon Mollies have big bellies to begin with. They are really neat. Evita Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote:Then I'd probably look at the oxygen levels in your tank, as someone else has already suggested. You mention the big bellies--just on females, or on both male and female fish? Which kind of mollie do you have? \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nicolas Munro Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 2:38 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Mollies go to surface to breath? 300 litres ish or 90 gallons ish pH 7, 0 ammonia and nitrite or as close to zero as I can identify with my Hagen test kit. basically ok. Lately every thing is getting aggressive, but the mollies are bigger than all the other fish so they don't get picked on. 23.5 deg C. I'm wondering if they normally have big bellies? maybe a tummy infection? originally I thought the stomuck was growing and they were going to have babies but its been a month and no sign of any thing. I have two of them and they are both doing it. The only other fish that does it in the tank is a Betta (and as if I have to tell you its like normal :-) ) Live plants, maybe a recent whitening quality of the water due to possibly a bacteria but that has all gone away as of start of last week. =Nick Steve Szabo wrote: >Nick, > >This is not normal behavior for mollies. What do you consider to be perfect >for your pH, ammonia, nitrite readings? > >What size is your tank? > >What other fish do you have in the tank, and what size are they? > >What is the water temperature? > >Any other information you might think pertinent would be helpful. You simply >are not giving enough information to go on here to offer even a tentative >diagnosis. > >-----Original Message----- >From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On >Behalf Of Nicolas Munro >Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2005 11:12 PM >To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com >Subject: [AquaticLife] Mollies go to surface to breath? > >Hi, > >I've got two mollies which always go to the surface and look like they >are eating food but there is no food. alternatively are they trying to >breath the air kinda like Betas? > > >Non of my other fish in the tank do it, pH, Ammonia, Nitrite are perfect. > > >=Nick > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to >the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the >SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >AquaticLife Management. > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >AquaticLife Management. > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13285	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: catfish

When I said "native" catfish, I meant that they were native to the south american region where the rest of my fish are from. As for adding one to my community tank, I have decided against it. I like my neon tetras too much. Although I have been told that my angelfish will eventually have my neons for lunch:( Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13286	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.

in my own tank, I have Pepper, Albino, and Emerald Cories. Sorry, don't know the scientific names. But 2 LFS's somewhat near me had those and several other varieties. ----- Original Message ----- From: <Deenerz@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 2:25 AM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] catfish whoops hit send to quick. Hi Linda, Mike again. I hit send with the help of my orange 12 week old kitten ;) I was adding more comment about Cories. I think there are about three kinds of small cories, Hastatus, Pygmaeus, and the third escapes me right now. Add some Brochis that someone else mentioned and you could have three very distinct sized catfish, as well as different colored ones. Try this site. http://www.planetcatfish.com/ Lots and lots of catfish to be found here. Mike In a message dated 7/12/2005 7:34:21 PM Pacific Daylight Time, Crazy4fids@... writes: Mike- I am looking for a native catfish to add to my 150 gallon aquarium. I already have 8 cory cats on my list but was looking for something different similar to a syndontis. I think I may be getting a striped raphael catfish, but was wondering whether I would ever see it. I love the look of syndontis. BTW, I have rummy nose tetras, neon tetras, glow light tetras, two guppies, and three peppered cory cats. I will be adding 4 more cories, 8 angelfish and 4 keyhole cichlids. So the catfish need to be a peaceful one. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13287	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)

That and cories have such a great personality. There are times mine won't do anything for hours, then suddenly will start doing highspeed laps around the tank. They've knocked Ataru and Goemon (my two common plecs both just over a foot long) right off of the glass and kept going. Also love it when they just suddenly dart to the top of the tank and then dart back down. They usually avoid my gouramis and rainbows when they do that, but not always. lol They also love playing follow the leader when my dwarf frogs get moving. ----- Original Message ----- From: <Deenerz@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 3:50 AM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih) I didn't either, I was trying to say that if she stayed in the cory family, she could get different sizes and colors for variety. Now Linda has got me thinking about starting up a planted community tank and getting some different cories to go in it. Mike In a message dated 7/14/2005 3:31:43 AM Pacific Daylight Time, FortWayneFish@... writes: I really don't think the size of the cory catfish would be to much of a concern in a 150 gallon tank. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13288	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: angel fish

aren't tiger barbs fin nippers? if so, then i would think they'd harass the angels and nip @ their flowing finnage. --- Nicolas Munro <nmunro@...> wrote: > How do angel fish and tiger barbs get along? > > sword tails? > > female aggressive guppies? > > =Nick > > Crazy4fids@... wrote: > > >Mike- > >I am looking for a native catfish to add to my 150 gallon aquarium. I > >already have 8 cory cats on my list but was looking for something different > >similar to a syndontis. I think I may be getting a striped raphael catfish, but > >was wondering whether I would ever see it. I love the look of syndontis. > > > >BTW, I have rummy nose tetras, neon tetras, glow light tetras, two guppies, > >and three peppered cory cats. I will be adding 4 more cories, 8 angelfish > >and 4 keyhole cichlids. So the catfish need to be a peaceful one. > > > >Linda > > > > > >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if > CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: > old subject)" <- > > > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > >AquaticLife Management. > > > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13289	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

Nitrates: 0 ppm Nitrites: 0 ppm hardness: 150 ppm (GH) alkalinity: 180 ppm (KH) pH: between 7.8 & 8.4 (the color of the test strip was in between the 2 colors) My water comes from Lake Michigan via the Greater Chicagoland Water Reclamation district. They supply most of the Chicago area with water from offshore pump houses. Not too many people...even in the outer reaches of the Chicago area use wells anymore. I checked the nitrates in the tank and they have stayed at 40 ppm for the past 2 days (yeah!!!!!) Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 5:55 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s What is the measurement of nitrates coming from your tap water, prior to adding git to the tank? This is often an overlooked source of nitrates, especially if you are using well water. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Roberts Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 11:19 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s I just did daily water changes as well a a good deep cleaning of the gravel. I put the bags of nitrate/nitrite/phosphate absorber in my filters just to help get rid of what was already in the water. I think this is what has helped as water changes prior to this did not effect the nitrate levels. I don;t think it was from over feeding. We did have that problem, but I reduced the amount of food, plus got some critters that will mop up the uneaten food. I haven't added any fertilizers for my plants as of yet, so that is not the source. I am not sure where all the excess nitrates are coming from. I normally do a 20% water change every 2 weeks. So I haven't figured out the source. My only thought is that it may have had something to do with my UGF. I turned it off as I am slowly adding plants and that is when the nitrate levels went down to 40 (same day as I added the absorbing material). This was something that has happened over the past few weeks, so it was the extended exposure to high nitrate levels that I was concerned about. I lost 2 of my spiny eels in the past week, so I think that may have been the cause. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 9:39 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s 160 ppm is a ways away from killing your fish. Over a long term it may cause problems in your fish, bit is nothing to panic over as you do have plenty of time to determine the problem and reduce the presence of the nitrate without taking any drastic actions. Now, if we were talking a reef tank here, that would be a whole other ballgame, and your tank would be essentially dead. But, we are not, and your tank would have been OK without rushing about to "do something" about the nitrates. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Roberts Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 1:39 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s I just had a major issue with nitrates...they shot up through the roof (and I have some plants). I got some of the nitrate sponges to soak some of them up before they kill my fish. I have been doing 20 % water changes every day and after about a week, they got down to 40 ppm...they were as high as 160 at one point. One of my tasks is to get more plants and more light. I am designing a hood for my 55 gal tank, so once I get that all in place, I should be fine...or at least I hope. I am also getting rid of my gravel eventually and replacing it with sand. This of course means no more UGF, but it looks a lot nicer. I set up my 20 gal to house some of my smaller fish and some ghost shrimp that I got for food for my larger fish and I used the Tahitian moonlight black sand. It looks awesome with that. I will be switching over to that in the next month or so in the big tank. The only thing I don;t like about the sand is it is a real PIA to get clean. When I was setting up the 20 gal, I thought I had it clean, but ended up having to empty out the tank and refilling it after cleaning the gravel once again...ugg. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 10:37 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. This should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in there to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should not get a chance to multiply. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > What is a "safe" number regarding nitrates? Everything is testing 0 but > of course I am getting a reading on nitrates, seems to be at 20 ppm. > The reason I ask is due to this seemingly minor algae bloom. I've seen > others have this and then a full out mess within days. I don't want > that. > Anyhow, safe nitrate number? > Thanks > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. 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PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13290	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: angel fish

I have 2 angels and 2 rosy barbs and they get along fine... Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nicolas Munro Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 1:30 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] angel fish How do angel fish and tiger barbs get along? sword tails? female aggressive guppies? =Nick Crazy4fids@... wrote: >Mike- >I am looking for a native catfish to add to my 150 gallon aquarium. I >already have 8 cory cats on my list but was looking for something different >similar to a syndontis. I think I may be getting a striped raphael catfish, but >was wondering whether I would ever see it. I love the look of syndontis. > >BTW, I have rummy nose tetras, neon tetras, glow light tetras, two guppies, >and three peppered cory cats. I will be adding 4 more cories, 8 angelfish >and 4 keyhole cichlids. So the catfish need to be a peaceful one. > >Linda > > >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >AquaticLife Management. > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13291	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: angel fish

They can be, but then again, they leave my bettas alone though. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Valeen Gonzalez" <valeendgonzalez@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 10:19 AM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] angel fish > aren't tiger barbs fin nippers? if so, then i would think they'd harass the angels and nip @ their > flowing finnage. > > --- Nicolas Munro <nmunro@...> wrote: > > > How do angel fish and tiger barbs get along? > > > > sword tails? > > > > female aggressive guppies? > > > > =Nick > > > > Crazy4fids@... wrote: > > > > >Mike- > > >I am looking for a native catfish to add to my 150 gallon aquarium. I > > >already have 8 cory cats on my list but was looking for something different > > >similar to a syndontis. I think I may be getting a striped raphael catfish, but > > >was wondering whether I would ever see it. I love the look of syndontis. > > > > > >BTW, I have rummy nose tetras, neon tetras, glow light tetras, two guppies, > > >and three peppered cory cats. I will be adding 4 more cories, 8 angelfish > > >and 4 keyhole cichlids. So the catfish need to be a peaceful one. > > > > > >Linda > > > > > > > > >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > > > > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if > > CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: > > old subject)" <- > > > > > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > >AquaticLife Management. > > > > > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13292	From: joequality1980	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: do pacus play dead?

I read somewhere that piranhas play dead sometimes when they get frightened and was wondering if the same holds true for pacus (since they are closely related). Sometimes when mine get scared, they race around the tank and then end up on the bottom on their side. The first time, I reached in and nudged him and he raced around and got normal. An hour later, he was swimming around as if nothing had happened. Are they just messing with me or should I get them a therapist?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13293	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)

We have an albino cory and a leopard cory. The albino exhibits the same behavior. It usually minds it's own business in the corner of the tank, then every so often it just darts to the surface and back down...back to minding it's own business. I wonder what is behind that behavior? Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of The Dragon Hunter Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 10:13 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih) That and cories have such a great personality. There are times mine won't do anything for hours, then suddenly will start doing highspeed laps around the tank. They've knocked Ataru and Goemon (my two common plecs both just over a foot long) right off of the glass and kept going. Also love it when they just suddenly dart to the top of the tank and then dart back down. They usually avoid my gouramis and rainbows when they do that, but not always. lol They also love playing follow the leader when my dwarf frogs get moving. ----- Original Message ----- From: <Deenerz@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 3:50 AM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih) I didn't either, I was trying to say that if she stayed in the cory family, she could get different sizes and colors for variety. Now Linda has got me thinking about starting up a planted community tank and getting some different cories to go in it. Mike In a message dated 7/14/2005 3:31:43 AM Pacific Daylight Time, FortWayneFish@... writes: I really don't think the size of the cory catfish would be to much of a concern in a 150 gallon tank. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13294	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

Unfortunately they don;t list the actual size of the product :-( I looked for a few hours online to find info and couldn't. It looks much courser than beach sand is...I would guestimate at least twice as big if not a bit more. The CaribSea product is available at many pet stores. I bought mine from a mom and pop LFS but I do think I have seen it at Petco as well. I was also looking at a similar product from a local supplier called Aquarium Rock Emporium. One of the other mom and pop LFS' carried their product. I called Carib Sea up and all I got was a voice mail, so I am waiting for a return call from them. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 5:59 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s I'll see if I can get a photo for you tonight. That Carib Sea product looks OK, but I'd like to see it in person first. It does not look like sand in the form that most people here are thinking of sand (beach sand). -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Roberts Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 11:27 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s this is the sand I used and am planning on using in the 55 gal: http://shop.petsmart.com/product/2534374302023693/2534374302030109/845524441 781393.htm I could not find a "mm", but it said extra fine. Now as far as #2 gravel goes, what should I be looking for? I looked online and found this: http://www.cayugalandscape.com/gardencenter/bulk_materials/bulkmaterials.htm l That looks pretty big to me... Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 9:44 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s Eric, That will not work either. The sand will find its way down through the gravel, and you'd be facing the same problem if you had used all sand. What you may consider doing is using a finer gravel than you normally would find in a store. You should look at some #2 gravel, which is finer than the #3 gravel usually found in stores, and fairly good for plants as it does compact some, but not enough to disrupt root growth. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Roberts Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 4:51 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s I am going to leave a layer of gravel underneatth for plants to grow in... Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 2:38 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s Glad to see you got the nitrates under control. I see you plan to add more plants which should help towards this end. Also notice that you are planning to switch over to sand. While this may look awesome, you may have trouble trying to grow some of those plants you're thinking of getting as the finer sand has the tendancy of preventing proper root growth; its more compacted. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > I just had a major issue with nitrates...they shot up through the roof (and > I have some plants). I got some of the nitrate sponges to soak some of them > up before they kill my fish. I have been doing 20 % water changes every day > and after about a week, they got down to 40 ppm...they were as high as 160 > at one point. One of my tasks is to get more plants and more light. I am > designing a hood for my 55 gal tank, so once I get that all in place, I > should be fine...or at least I hope. I am also getting rid of my gravel > eventually and replacing it with sand. This of course means no more UGF, > but it looks a lot nicer. I set up my 20 gal to house some of my smaller > fish and some ghost shrimp that I got for food for my larger fish and I used > the Tahitian moonlight black sand. It looks awesome with that. I will be > switching over to that in the next month or so in the big tank. The only > thing I don;t like about the sand is it is a real PIA to get clean. When I > was setting up the 20 gal, I thought I had it clean, but ended up having to > empty out the tank and refilling it after cleaning the gravel once > again...ugg. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 10:37 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. This > should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in there > to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not > overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should not > get a chance to multiply. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > What is a "safe" number regarding nitrates? Everything is testing 0 > but > > of course I am getting a reading on nitrates, seems to be at 20 ppm. > > The reason I ask is due to this seemingly minor algae bloom. I've > seen > > others have this and then a full out mess within days. I don't want > > that. > > Anyhow, safe nitrate number? > > Thanks > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13295	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: angel fish

It would seem as if you are very lucky in having peaceful Tiger Barbs. I would assume you may have them in an odd-numbered group. In general, Tiger Barbs are notorious fin-nippers -- they didn't get this reputation for nothing. I would not trust them in any situation with such slow moving fish as Angels, of any size (or Bettas). Just what I've seen of them. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "The Dragon Hunter" <dragon.hunter@d...> wrote: > They can be, but then again, they leave my bettas alone though. > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Valeen Gonzalez" <valeendgonzalez@y...> > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 10:19 AM > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] angel fish > > > > aren't tiger barbs fin nippers? if so, then i would think they'd harass > the angels and nip @ their > > flowing finnage. > > > > --- Nicolas Munro <nmunro@q...> wrote: > > > > > How do angel fish and tiger barbs get along? > > > > > > sword tails? > > > > > > female aggressive guppies? > > > > > > =Nick > > > > > > Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > > > > > > >Mike- > > > >I am looking for a native catfish to add to my 150 gallon aquarium. I > > > >already have 8 cory cats on my list but was looking for something > different > > > >similar to a syndontis. I think I may be getting a striped raphael > catfish, but > > > >was wondering whether I would ever see it. I love the look of > syndontis. > > > > > > > >BTW, I have rummy nose tetras, neon tetras, glow light tetras, two > guppies, > > > >and three peppered cory cats. I will be adding 4 more cories, 8 > angelfish > > > >and 4 keyhole cichlids. So the catfish need to be a peaceful one. > > > > > > > >Linda > > > > > > > > > > > >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > > > > > > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important > to the reply and if > > > CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> > i.e. "new subject (was re: > > > old subject)" <- > > > > > > > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > > >AquaticLife Management. > > > > > > > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > > > > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > > I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13296	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: algae was Nitrate #s

why ewwwww? Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote:ewwwwwww -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Emily Tenczar Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 1:30 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] algae was Nitrate #s I don't think so. I think the dark green algae makes a lovely background. It took over one of my betta tanks. I only scraped it off the front side of the tank, and I added some snails who decided to go crazy and populate amongst the greenery :) Emily Valeen Gonzalez wrote: LOL =) and it obscures your view of the tank! --- Dane & Leslie Moore wrote: > It's ugly? ;) > > Subject: [AquaticLife] algae was Nitrate #s > > > what is the problem with algae anyway? Isn't it good for the tank > since it eats up nitrates? Emily > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13297	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: walmart and goldfish was...FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis( peoples r

Emily, So glad to hear the Black Moor's eye is healing up. Here is a typical example of why a small night light may be something to consider in the future. There is the distinct possibility that this accident may never have happened if the tank wasn't in total darkness. Fortunately, this accident doesn't have a tragic end, like the loss of an eye. Good thing it wasn't more serious. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Emily Tenczar <bababanana@y...> wrote: > My first fish as a child were a couple of feeder goldfish. They lived in a fish bowl of course. Now I was a little kid and I'm wondering why my parents didn't check into this, but I'm assuming that they thought the pet store would know something about goldfish and they never told us not to house them in fish bowls. When I got my first goldfish since then (the black moor) at least someone had sense enough to tell me not to get two goldfish at once straight up. I had her in a large critter keeper with a filter until I picked up a larger tank. By the way, her eye is healing up nicely and a small fan seems to be making her and her buddies happier :) > > Still, it's a lot of trial and error. > > One time I went into walmart and was so frustrated with seeing sick fish and talking to morons that work there that I decided to leave a note on the whiteboard. Imagine how shocked I was the next time I went there and saw a note saying not to sell any fish in a particular tank because they were being treated. A small step in the right direction. > Emily > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13298	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: angel fish

then i guess it would depend upon the individual fish. i've seen tiger barbs in lfs tanks, sometimes in with angels unfortunately, and they can sometimes be seen chasing after the angels, as the angels don't seem to be the fastest fish around. --- The Dragon Hunter <dragon.hunter@...> wrote: > They can be, but then again, they leave my bettas alone though. > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Valeen Gonzalez" <valeendgonzalez@...> > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 10:19 AM > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] angel fish > > > > aren't tiger barbs fin nippers? if so, then i would think they'd harass > the angels and nip @ their > > flowing finnage. > > > > --- Nicolas Munro <nmunro@...> wrote: > > > > > How do angel fish and tiger barbs get along? > > > > > > sword tails? > > > > > > female aggressive guppies? > > > > > > =Nick > > > > > > Crazy4fids@... wrote: > > > > > > >Mike- > > > >I am looking for a native catfish to add to my 150 gallon aquarium. I > > > >already have 8 cory cats on my list but was looking for something > different > > > >similar to a syndontis. I think I may be getting a striped raphael > catfish, but > > > >was wondering whether I would ever see it. I love the look of > syndontis. > > > > > > > >BTW, I have rummy nose tetras, neon tetras, glow light tetras, two > guppies, > > > >and three peppered cory cats. I will be adding 4 more cories, 8 > angelfish > > > >and 4 keyhole cichlids. So the catfish need to be a peaceful one. > > > > > > > >Linda > > > > > > > > > > > >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > > > > > > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important > to the reply and if > > > CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> > i.e. "new subject (was re: > > > old subject)" <- > > > > > > > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > > >AquaticLife Management. > > > > > > > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > > > > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > > I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13299	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

I just heard back from them and they said the sand size is between .2 and .5 mm. She also said that it is commonly used in planted aquariums both as the sole substrate and as a bottom substrate. She is also sending me a sample of their eco-lite (I think that is the name) gravel which is a multigrade mix that is designed specifically for planted aquariums. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Roberts Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 1:31 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s Unfortunately they don;t list the actual size of the product :-( I looked for a few hours online to find info and couldn't. It looks much courser than beach sand is...I would guestimate at least twice as big if not a bit more. The CaribSea product is available at many pet stores. I bought mine from a mom and pop LFS but I do think I have seen it at Petco as well. I was also looking at a similar product from a local supplier called Aquarium Rock Emporium. One of the other mom and pop LFS' carried their product. I called Carib Sea up and all I got was a voice mail, so I am waiting for a return call from them. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 5:59 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s I'll see if I can get a photo for you tonight. That Carib Sea product looks OK, but I'd like to see it in person first. It does not look like sand in the form that most people here are thinking of sand (beach sand). -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Roberts Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 11:27 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s this is the sand I used and am planning on using in the 55 gal: http://shop.petsmart.com/product/2534374302023693/2534374302030109/845524441 781393.htm I could not find a "mm", but it said extra fine. Now as far as #2 gravel goes, what should I be looking for? I looked online and found this: http://www.cayugalandscape.com/gardencenter/bulk_materials/bulkmaterials.htm l That looks pretty big to me... Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 9:44 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s Eric, That will not work either. The sand will find its way down through the gravel, and you'd be facing the same problem if you had used all sand. What you may consider doing is using a finer gravel than you normally would find in a store. You should look at some #2 gravel, which is finer than the #3 gravel usually found in stores, and fairly good for plants as it does compact some, but not enough to disrupt root growth. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Roberts Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 4:51 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s I am going to leave a layer of gravel underneatth for plants to grow in... Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 2:38 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s Glad to see you got the nitrates under control. I see you plan to add more plants which should help towards this end. Also notice that you are planning to switch over to sand. While this may look awesome, you may have trouble trying to grow some of those plants you're thinking of getting as the finer sand has the tendancy of preventing proper root growth; its more compacted. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > I just had a major issue with nitrates...they shot up through the roof (and > I have some plants). I got some of the nitrate sponges to soak some of them > up before they kill my fish. I have been doing 20 % water changes every day > and after about a week, they got down to 40 ppm...they were as high as 160 > at one point. One of my tasks is to get more plants and more light. I am > designing a hood for my 55 gal tank, so once I get that all in place, I > should be fine...or at least I hope. I am also getting rid of my gravel > eventually and replacing it with sand. This of course means no more UGF, > but it looks a lot nicer. I set up my 20 gal to house some of my smaller > fish and some ghost shrimp that I got for food for my larger fish and I used > the Tahitian moonlight black sand. It looks awesome with that. I will be > switching over to that in the next month or so in the big tank. The only > thing I don;t like about the sand is it is a real PIA to get clean. When I > was setting up the 20 gal, I thought I had it clean, but ended up having to > empty out the tank and refilling it after cleaning the gravel once > again...ugg. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 10:37 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. This > should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in there > to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not > overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should not > get a chance to multiply. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > What is a "safe" number regarding nitrates? Everything is testing 0 > but > > of course I am getting a reading on nitrates, seems to be at 20 ppm. > > The reason I ask is due to this seemingly minor algae bloom. I've > seen > > others have this and then a full out mess within days. I don't want > > that. > > Anyhow, safe nitrate number? > > Thanks > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13300	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

For easier maintenance in the future: While I don't know the fish- load you are dealing with (unless I missed that part), you might try 33% water changes every week (as many hobbyists normally do) instead of 20% every two weeks. The necessity of this naturally depends on your fish load, but if your nitrates were up to 160, I'd have to say you may possibly have a somewhat heavy fish-load. A 20% change is practically nothing anyway -- that much of a water change would bring your nitrates down to 128, and that's with refilling with fresh water that has absolutely no nitrates in it. After a two week period, enough time has gone by that the amount of nitrate you took out has been replaced (and then some) from the break-down of fish waste. It just keeps escalating -- its a case of too little - too late! You shouldn't need to put nitrate absorber in your filter. Just change more water more frequently, or lessen your fish-load. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > I just did daily water changes as well a a good deep cleaning of the gravel. > I put the bags of nitrate/nitrite/phosphate absorber in my filters just to > help get rid of what was already in the water. I think this is what has > helped as water changes prior to this did not effect the nitrate levels. I > don;t think it was from over feeding. We did have that problem, but I > reduced the amount of food, plus got some critters that will mop up the > uneaten food. I haven't added any fertilizers for my plants as of yet, so > that is not the source. I am not sure where all the excess nitrates are > coming from. I normally do a 20% water change every 2 weeks. So I haven't > figured out the source. My only thought is that it may have had something > to do with my UGF. I turned it off as I am slowly adding plants and that is > when the nitrate levels went down to 40 (same day as I added the absorbing > material). This was something that has happened over the past few weeks, so > it was the extended exposure to high nitrate levels that I was concerned > about. I lost 2 of my spiny eels in the past week, so I think that may have > been the cause. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Steve Szabo > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 9:39 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > 160 ppm is a ways away from killing your fish. Over a long term it may cause > problems in your fish, bit is nothing to panic over as you do have plenty of > time to determine the problem and reduce the presence of the nitrate without > taking any drastic actions. > > Now, if we were talking a reef tank here, that would be a whole other > ballgame, and your tank would be essentially dead. But, we are not, and your > tank would have been OK without rushing about to "do something" about the > nitrates. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Eric Roberts > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 1:39 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > I just had a major issue with nitrates...they shot up through the roof (and > I have some plants). I got some of the nitrate sponges to soak some of them > up before they kill my fish. I have been doing 20 % water changes every day > and after about a week, they got down to 40 ppm...they were as high as 160 > at one point. One of my tasks is to get more plants and more light. I am > designing a hood for my 55 gal tank, so once I get that all in place, I > should be fine...or at least I hope. I am also getting rid of my gravel > eventually and replacing it with sand. This of course means no more UGF, > but it looks a lot nicer. I set up my 20 gal to house some of my smaller > fish and some ghost shrimp that I got for food for my larger fish and I used > the Tahitian moonlight black sand. It looks awesome with that. I will be > switching over to that in the next month or so in the big tank. The only > thing I don;t like about the sand is it is a real PIA to get clean. When I > was setting up the 20 gal, I thought I had it clean, but ended up having to > empty out the tank and refilling it after cleaning the gravel once > again...ugg. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 10:37 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. This > should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in there > to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not > overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should not > get a chance to multiply. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > What is a "safe" number regarding nitrates? Everything is testing 0 > but > > of course I am getting a reading on nitrates, seems to be at 20 ppm. > > The reason I ask is due to this seemingly minor algae bloom. I've > seen > > others have this and then a full out mess within days. I don't want > > that. > > Anyhow, safe nitrate number? > > Thanks > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13301	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

While I'm not familiar with each and every one of these new aquarium products, I have to say I'm a little leery about this. Maybe its just me, but with it having calcium, magnesium, potassium (& 25 more chemicals) its certainly going to at least raise the general hardness and who knows what other effects. Looks like it comes packed in something similar to a black water tonic, if I'm reading right, so you may have to thoroughly rinse it if you don't want tea-stained looking water. This no doubt would keep the pH from rising with the presence of the other chemicals. If you were to rinse it clear you'd then be washing away this plant fertilizer. Might be good for plants used as is but what about fish? I might be wrong on this (I said I'm not familiar with it) but just going with what I've read on it. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > is this what you are referring to? > > http://www.aquatic-store.com/en-us/dept_461.html > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Eric Roberts > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 10:27 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > this is the sand I used and am planning on using in the 55 gal: > http://shop.petsmart.com/product/2534374302023693/2534374302030109/845 524441 > 781393.htm > > I could not find a "mm", but it said extra fine. Now as far as #2 gravel > goes, what should I be looking for? I looked online and found this: > http://www.cayugalandscape.com/gardencenter/bulk_materials/bulkmateria ls.htm > l That looks pretty big to me... > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Steve Szabo > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 9:44 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > Eric, > > That will not work either. The sand will find its way down through the > gravel, and you'd be facing the same problem if you had used all sand. > > What you may consider doing is using a finer gravel than you normally would > find in a store. You should look at some #2 gravel, which is finer than the > #3 gravel usually found in stores, and fairly good for plants as it does > compact some, but not enough to disrupt root growth. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Eric Roberts > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 4:51 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > I am going to leave a layer of gravel underneatth for plants to grow in... > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 2:38 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > Glad to see you got the nitrates under control. I see you plan to > add more plants which should help towards this end. Also notice that > you are planning to switch over to sand. While this may look > awesome, you may have trouble trying to grow some of those plants > you're thinking of getting as the finer sand has the tendancy of > preventing proper root growth; its more compacted. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > > I just had a major issue with nitrates...they shot up through the > roof (and > > I have some plants). I got some of the nitrate sponges to soak > some of them > > up before they kill my fish. I have been doing 20 % water changes > every day > > and after about a week, they got down to 40 ppm...they were as high > as 160 > > at one point. One of my tasks is to get more plants and more > light. I am > > designing a hood for my 55 gal tank, so once I get that all in > place, I > > should be fine...or at least I hope. I am also getting rid of my > gravel > > eventually and replacing it with sand. This of course means no > more UGF, > > but it looks a lot nicer. I set up my 20 gal to house some of my > smaller > > fish and some ghost shrimp that I got for food for my larger fish > and I used > > the Tahitian moonlight black sand. It looks awesome with that. I > will be > > switching over to that in the next month or so in the big tank. > The only > > thing I don;t like about the sand is it is a real PIA to get > clean. When I > > was setting up the 20 gal, I thought I had it clean, but ended up > having to > > empty out the tank and refilling it after cleaning the gravel once > > again...ugg. > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 10:37 AM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. This > > should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in > there > > to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not > > overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should > not > > get a chance to multiply. > Ray > > > \ > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" > > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > > What is a "safe" number regarding nitrates? Everything is > testing 0 > > but > > > of course I am getting a reading on nitrates, seems to be at 20 > ppm. > > > The reason I ask is due to this seemingly minor algae bloom. > I've > > seen > > > others have this and then a full out mess within days. I don't > want > > > that. > > > Anyhow, safe nitrate number? > > > Thanks > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > Marine > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? > t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? > t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13302	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

you can see what I have...I have started a page on my site, but haven't completed it. It does have a good listing of my fish... http://ww.witchnet.org/aquarium.cfm Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 3:07 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s For easier maintenance in the future: While I don't know the fish- load you are dealing with (unless I missed that part), you might try 33% water changes every week (as many hobbyists normally do) instead of 20% every two weeks. The necessity of this naturally depends on your fish load, but if your nitrates were up to 160, I'd have to say you may possibly have a somewhat heavy fish-load. A 20% change is practically nothing anyway -- that much of a water change would bring your nitrates down to 128, and that's with refilling with fresh water that has absolutely no nitrates in it. After a two week period, enough time has gone by that the amount of nitrate you took out has been replaced (and then some) from the break-down of fish waste. It just keeps escalating -- its a case of too little - too late! You shouldn't need to put nitrate absorber in your filter. Just change more water more frequently, or lessen your fish-load. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > I just did daily water changes as well a a good deep cleaning of the gravel. > I put the bags of nitrate/nitrite/phosphate absorber in my filters just to > help get rid of what was already in the water. I think this is what has > helped as water changes prior to this did not effect the nitrate levels. I > don;t think it was from over feeding. We did have that problem, but I > reduced the amount of food, plus got some critters that will mop up the > uneaten food. I haven't added any fertilizers for my plants as of yet, so > that is not the source. I am not sure where all the excess nitrates are > coming from. I normally do a 20% water change every 2 weeks. So I haven't > figured out the source. My only thought is that it may have had something > to do with my UGF. I turned it off as I am slowly adding plants and that is > when the nitrate levels went down to 40 (same day as I added the absorbing > material). This was something that has happened over the past few weeks, so > it was the extended exposure to high nitrate levels that I was concerned > about. I lost 2 of my spiny eels in the past week, so I think that may have > been the cause. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Steve Szabo > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 9:39 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > 160 ppm is a ways away from killing your fish. Over a long term it may cause > problems in your fish, bit is nothing to panic over as you do have plenty of > time to determine the problem and reduce the presence of the nitrate without > taking any drastic actions. > > Now, if we were talking a reef tank here, that would be a whole other > ballgame, and your tank would be essentially dead. But, we are not, and your > tank would have been OK without rushing about to "do something" about the > nitrates. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Eric Roberts > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 1:39 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > I just had a major issue with nitrates...they shot up through the roof (and > I have some plants). I got some of the nitrate sponges to soak some of them > up before they kill my fish. I have been doing 20 % water changes every day > and after about a week, they got down to 40 ppm...they were as high as 160 > at one point. One of my tasks is to get more plants and more light. I am > designing a hood for my 55 gal tank, so once I get that all in place, I > should be fine...or at least I hope. I am also getting rid of my gravel > eventually and replacing it with sand. This of course means no more UGF, > but it looks a lot nicer. I set up my 20 gal to house some of my smaller > fish and some ghost shrimp that I got for food for my larger fish and I used > the Tahitian moonlight black sand. It looks awesome with that. I will be > switching over to that in the next month or so in the big tank. The only > thing I don;t like about the sand is it is a real PIA to get clean. When I > was setting up the 20 gal, I thought I had it clean, but ended up having to > empty out the tank and refilling it after cleaning the gravel once > again...ugg. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 10:37 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. This > should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in there > to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not > overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should not > get a chance to multiply. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > What is a "safe" number regarding nitrates? Everything is testing 0 > but > > of course I am getting a reading on nitrates, seems to be at 20 ppm. > > The reason I ask is due to this seemingly minor algae bloom. I've > seen > > others have this and then a full out mess within days. I don't want > > that. > > Anyhow, safe nitrate number? > > Thanks > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13303	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

It's been fine for the past few months. The main reason I do the amount of water change is it is 2 bucket loads (10 gallons) I will try going to 3 bucket loads from now on and see if that helps. What bothered me was that even after the water change, there was no change in the amount of nitrates. In any case...the levels have been down to 40 ppm for the past 2 days. I am also in the process of getting more plants, so that should help the nitrate levels as well. Unfortunately I lost a couple of my spiny eels in the process :-( Once I get more plants in, I will remove the nitrate sponge and see if the ntrate level stabilizes or spikes again. BTW...I also did move my 7 Danios out of the main tank and put them into the tank with the ghost shrimp as the dannies are too small to try and eat the shrimp. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 3:07 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s For easier maintenance in the future: While I don't know the fish- load you are dealing with (unless I missed that part), you might try 33% water changes every week (as many hobbyists normally do) instead of 20% every two weeks. The necessity of this naturally depends on your fish load, but if your nitrates were up to 160, I'd have to say you may possibly have a somewhat heavy fish-load. A 20% change is practically nothing anyway -- that much of a water change would bring your nitrates down to 128, and that's with refilling with fresh water that has absolutely no nitrates in it. After a two week period, enough time has gone by that the amount of nitrate you took out has been replaced (and then some) from the break-down of fish waste. It just keeps escalating -- its a case of too little - too late! You shouldn't need to put nitrate absorber in your filter. Just change more water more frequently, or lessen your fish-load. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > I just did daily water changes as well a a good deep cleaning of the gravel. > I put the bags of nitrate/nitrite/phosphate absorber in my filters just to > help get rid of what was already in the water. I think this is what has > helped as water changes prior to this did not effect the nitrate levels. I > don;t think it was from over feeding. We did have that problem, but I > reduced the amount of food, plus got some critters that will mop up the > uneaten food. I haven't added any fertilizers for my plants as of yet, so > that is not the source. I am not sure where all the excess nitrates are > coming from. I normally do a 20% water change every 2 weeks. So I haven't > figured out the source. My only thought is that it may have had something > to do with my UGF. I turned it off as I am slowly adding plants and that is > when the nitrate levels went down to 40 (same day as I added the absorbing > material). This was something that has happened over the past few weeks, so > it was the extended exposure to high nitrate levels that I was concerned > about. I lost 2 of my spiny eels in the past week, so I think that may have > been the cause. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Steve Szabo > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 9:39 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > 160 ppm is a ways away from killing your fish. Over a long term it may cause > problems in your fish, bit is nothing to panic over as you do have plenty of > time to determine the problem and reduce the presence of the nitrate without > taking any drastic actions. > > Now, if we were talking a reef tank here, that would be a whole other > ballgame, and your tank would be essentially dead. But, we are not, and your > tank would have been OK without rushing about to "do something" about the > nitrates. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Eric Roberts > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 1:39 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > I just had a major issue with nitrates...they shot up through the roof (and > I have some plants). I got some of the nitrate sponges to soak some of them > up before they kill my fish. I have been doing 20 % water changes every day > and after about a week, they got down to 40 ppm...they were as high as 160 > at one point. One of my tasks is to get more plants and more light. I am > designing a hood for my 55 gal tank, so once I get that all in place, I > should be fine...or at least I hope. I am also getting rid of my gravel > eventually and replacing it with sand. This of course means no more UGF, > but it looks a lot nicer. I set up my 20 gal to house some of my smaller > fish and some ghost shrimp that I got for food for my larger fish and I used > the Tahitian moonlight black sand. It looks awesome with that. I will be > switching over to that in the next month or so in the big tank. The only > thing I don;t like about the sand is it is a real PIA to get clean. When I > was setting up the 20 gal, I thought I had it clean, but ended up having to > empty out the tank and refilling it after cleaning the gravel once > again...ugg. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 10:37 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. This > should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in there > to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not > overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should not > get a chance to multiply. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > What is a "safe" number regarding nitrates? Everything is testing 0 > but > > of course I am getting a reading on nitrates, seems to be at 20 ppm. > > The reason I ask is due to this seemingly minor algae bloom. I've > seen > > others have this and then a full out mess within days. I don't want > > that. > > Anyhow, safe nitrate number? > > Thanks > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13304	From: Evita	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

Sorry Eric Nothing there. Evita Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote:you can see what I have...I have started a page on my site, but haven't completed it. It does have a good listing of my fish... http://ww.witchnet.org/aquarium.cfm Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 3:07 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s For easier maintenance in the future: While I don't know the fish- load you are dealing with (unless I missed that part), you might try 33% water changes every week (as many hobbyists normally do) instead of 20% every two weeks. The necessity of this naturally depends on your fish load, but if your nitrates were up to 160, I'd have to say you may possibly have a somewhat heavy fish-load. A 20% change is practically nothing anyway -- that much of a water change would bring your nitrates down to 128, and that's with refilling with fresh water that has absolutely no nitrates in it. After a two week period, enough time has gone by that the amount of nitrate you took out has been replaced (and then some) from the break-down of fish waste. It just keeps escalating -- its a case of too little - too late! You shouldn't need to put nitrate absorber in your filter. Just change more water more frequently, or lessen your fish-load. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > I just did daily water changes as well a a good deep cleaning of the gravel. > I put the bags of nitrate/nitrite/phosphate absorber in my filters just to > help get rid of what was already in the water. I think this is what has > helped as water changes prior to this did not effect the nitrate levels. I > don;t think it was from over feeding. We did have that problem, but I > reduced the amount of food, plus got some critters that will mop up the > uneaten food. I haven't added any fertilizers for my plants as of yet, so > that is not the source. I am not sure where all the excess nitrates are > coming from. I normally do a 20% water change every 2 weeks. So I haven't > figured out the source. My only thought is that it may have had something > to do with my UGF. I turned it off as I am slowly adding plants and that is > when the nitrate levels went down to 40 (same day as I added the absorbing > material). This was something that has happened over the past few weeks, so > it was the extended exposure to high nitrate levels that I was concerned > about. I lost 2 of my spiny eels in the past week, so I think that may have > been the cause. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Steve Szabo > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 9:39 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > 160 ppm is a ways away from killing your fish. Over a long term it may cause > problems in your fish, bit is nothing to panic over as you do have plenty of > time to determine the problem and reduce the presence of the nitrate without > taking any drastic actions. > > Now, if we were talking a reef tank here, that would be a whole other > ballgame, and your tank would be essentially dead. But, we are not, and your > tank would have been OK without rushing about to "do something" about the > nitrates. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Eric Roberts > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 1:39 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > I just had a major issue with nitrates...they shot up through the roof (and > I have some plants). I got some of the nitrate sponges to soak some of them > up before they kill my fish. I have been doing 20 % water changes every day > and after about a week, they got down to 40 ppm...they were as high as 160 > at one point. One of my tasks is to get more plants and more light. I am > designing a hood for my 55 gal tank, so once I get that all in place, I > should be fine...or at least I hope. I am also getting rid of my gravel > eventually and replacing it with sand. This of course means no more UGF, > but it looks a lot nicer. I set up my 20 gal to house some of my smaller > fish and some ghost shrimp that I got for food for my larger fish and I used > the Tahitian moonlight black sand. It looks awesome with that. I will be > switching over to that in the next month or so in the big tank. The only > thing I don;t like about the sand is it is a real PIA to get clean. When I > was setting up the 20 gal, I thought I had it clean, but ended up having to > empty out the tank and refilling it after cleaning the gravel once > again...ugg. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 10:37 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. This > should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in there > to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not > overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should not > get a chance to multiply. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > What is a "safe" number regarding nitrates? Everything is testing 0 > but > > of course I am getting a reading on nitrates, seems to be at 20 ppm. > > The reason I ask is due to this seemingly minor algae bloom. I've > seen > > others have this and then a full out mess within days. I don't want > > that. > > Anyhow, safe nitrate number? > > Thanks > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13305	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

i see you have violet gobies, aka dragonfish. i saw one of those @ petsmart awhile back and was interested in them. but then heard that they're rather hard to keep. have you found this to be true? --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > It's been fine for the past few months. The main reason I do the amount of > water change is it is 2 bucket loads (10 gallons) I will try going to 3 > bucket loads from now on and see if that helps. What bothered me was that > even after the water change, there was no change in the amount of nitrates. > In any case...the levels have been down to 40 ppm for the past 2 days. I am > also in the process of getting more plants, so that should help the nitrate > levels as well. Unfortunately I lost a couple of my spiny eels in the > process :-( Once I get more plants in, I will remove the nitrate sponge and > see if the ntrate level stabilizes or spikes again. BTW...I also did move > my 7 Danios out of the main tank and put them into the tank with the ghost > shrimp as the dannies are too small to try and eat the shrimp. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 3:07 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > For easier maintenance in the future: While I don't know the fish- > load you are dealing with (unless I missed that part), you might try > 33% water changes every week (as many hobbyists normally do) instead > of 20% every two weeks. The necessity of this naturally depends on > your fish load, but if your nitrates were up to 160, I'd have to say > you may possibly have a somewhat heavy fish-load. A 20% change is > practically nothing anyway -- that much of a water change would bring > your nitrates down to 128, and that's with refilling with fresh water > that has absolutely no nitrates in it. After a two week period, > enough time has gone by that the amount of nitrate you took out has > been replaced (and then some) from the break-down of fish waste. It > just keeps escalating -- its a case of too little - too late! You > shouldn't need to put nitrate absorber in your filter. Just change > more water more frequently, or lessen your fish-load. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > > I just did daily water changes as well a a good deep cleaning of > the gravel. > > I put the bags of nitrate/nitrite/phosphate absorber in my filters > just to > > help get rid of what was already in the water. I think this is > what has > > helped as water changes prior to this did not effect the nitrate > levels. I > > don;t think it was from over feeding. We did have that problem, > but I > > reduced the amount of food, plus got some critters that will mop up > the > > uneaten food. I haven't added any fertilizers for my plants as of > yet, so > > that is not the source. I am not sure where all the excess > nitrates are > > coming from. I normally do a 20% water change every 2 weeks. So I > haven't > > figured out the source. My only thought is that it may have had > something > > to do with my UGF. I turned it off as I am slowly adding plants > and that is > > when the nitrate levels went down to 40 (same day as I added the > absorbing > > material). This was something that has happened over the past few > weeks, so > > it was the extended exposure to high nitrate levels that I was > concerned > > about. I lost 2 of my spiny eels in the past week, so I think that > may have > > been the cause. > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Steve Szabo > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 9:39 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > 160 ppm is a ways away from killing your fish. Over a long term it > may cause > > problems in your fish, bit is nothing to panic over as you do have > plenty of > > time to determine the problem and reduce the presence of the > nitrate without > > taking any drastic actions. > > > > Now, if we were talking a reef tank here, that would be a whole > other > > ballgame, and your tank would be essentially dead. But, we are not, > and your > > tank would have been OK without rushing about to "do something" > about the > > nitrates. > > > > \\Steve// > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Eric Roberts > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 1:39 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > I just had a major issue with nitrates...they shot up through the > roof (and > > I have some plants). I got some of the nitrate sponges to soak > some of them > > up before they kill my fish. I have been doing 20 % water changes > every day > > and after about a week, they got down to 40 ppm...they were as high > as 160 > > at one point. One of my tasks is to get more plants and more > light. I am > > designing a hood for my 55 gal tank, so once I get that all in > place, I > > should be fine...or at least I hope. I am also getting rid of my > gravel > > eventually and replacing it with sand. This of course means no > more UGF, > > but it looks a lot nicer. I set up my 20 gal to house some of my > smaller > > fish and some ghost shrimp that I got for food for my larger fish > and I used > > the Tahitian moonlight black sand. It looks awesome with that. I > will be > > switching over to that in the next month or so in the big tank. > The only > > thing I don;t like about the sand is it is a real PIA to get > clean. When I > > was setting up the 20 gal, I thought I had it clean, but ended up > having to > > empty out the tank and refilling it after cleaning the gravel once > > again...ugg. > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 10:37 AM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. This > > should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in > there > > to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not > > overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should > not > > get a chance to multiply. > Ray > > > \ > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" > > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > > What is a "safe" number regarding nitrates? Everything is > testing 0 > > but > > > of course I am getting a reading on nitrates, seems to be at 20 > ppm. > > > The reason I ask is due to this seemingly minor algae bloom. > I've > > seen > > > others have this and then a full out mess within days. I don't > want > > > that. > > > Anyhow, safe nitrate number? > > > Thanks > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > Marine > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? > t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? > t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13306	From: Eric Miner	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Clean filters or change them?

Hello, I've read differing opinons on this. Should one carefully clean out a filter and reuse it or should it be replaced. I have a Marineland Penquin 350B Bio-wheel power filter. The concern is if I replace the filters how much, if any, effect will this have on the bio filter? The Bio-wheels are designed to increase the surface area for the bacterial Thanks, Eric M.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13307	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

Don't know if this is the same as Evita's getting, but I'm getting the message "Can't Find Website", although that could just be my browser acting up. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > you can see what I have...I have started a page on my site, but haven't > completed it. It does have a good listing of my fish... > > http://ww.witchnet.org/aquarium.cfm > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 3:07 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > For easier maintenance in the future: While I don't know the fish- > load you are dealing with (unless I missed that part), you might try > 33% water changes every week (as many hobbyists normally do) instead > of 20% every two weeks. The necessity of this naturally depends on > your fish load, but if your nitrates were up to 160, I'd have to say > you may possibly have a somewhat heavy fish-load. A 20% change is > practically nothing anyway -- that much of a water change would bring > your nitrates down to 128, and that's with refilling with fresh water > that has absolutely no nitrates in it. After a two week period, > enough time has gone by that the amount of nitrate you took out has > been replaced (and then some) from the break-down of fish waste. It > just keeps escalating -- its a case of too little - too late! You > shouldn't need to put nitrate absorber in your filter. Just change > more water more frequently, or lessen your fish-load. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > > I just did daily water changes as well a a good deep cleaning of > the gravel. > > I put the bags of nitrate/nitrite/phosphate absorber in my filters > just to > > help get rid of what was already in the water. I think this is > what has > > helped as water changes prior to this did not effect the nitrate > levels. I > > don;t think it was from over feeding. We did have that problem, > but I > > reduced the amount of food, plus got some critters that will mop up > the > > uneaten food. I haven't added any fertilizers for my plants as of > yet, so > > that is not the source. I am not sure where all the excess > nitrates are > > coming from. I normally do a 20% water change every 2 weeks. So I > haven't > > figured out the source. My only thought is that it may have had > something > > to do with my UGF. I turned it off as I am slowly adding plants > and that is > > when the nitrate levels went down to 40 (same day as I added the > absorbing > > material). This was something that has happened over the past few > weeks, so > > it was the extended exposure to high nitrate levels that I was > concerned > > about. I lost 2 of my spiny eels in the past week, so I think that > may have > > been the cause. > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Steve Szabo > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 9:39 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > 160 ppm is a ways away from killing your fish. Over a long term it > may cause > > problems in your fish, bit is nothing to panic over as you do have > plenty of > > time to determine the problem and reduce the presence of the > nitrate without > > taking any drastic actions. > > > > Now, if we were talking a reef tank here, that would be a whole > other > > ballgame, and your tank would be essentially dead. But, we are not, > and your > > tank would have been OK without rushing about to "do something" > about the > > nitrates. > > > > \\Steve// > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Eric Roberts > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 1:39 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > I just had a major issue with nitrates...they shot up through the > roof (and > > I have some plants). I got some of the nitrate sponges to soak > some of them > > up before they kill my fish. I have been doing 20 % water changes > every day > > and after about a week, they got down to 40 ppm...they were as high > as 160 > > at one point. One of my tasks is to get more plants and more > light. I am > > designing a hood for my 55 gal tank, so once I get that all in > place, I > > should be fine...or at least I hope. I am also getting rid of my > gravel > > eventually and replacing it with sand. This of course means no > more UGF, > > but it looks a lot nicer. I set up my 20 gal to house some of my > smaller > > fish and some ghost shrimp that I got for food for my larger fish > and I used > > the Tahitian moonlight black sand. It looks awesome with that. I > will be > > switching over to that in the next month or so in the big tank. > The only > > thing I don;t like about the sand is it is a real PIA to get > clean. When I > > was setting up the 20 gal, I thought I had it clean, but ended up > having to > > empty out the tank and refilling it after cleaning the gravel once > > again...ugg. > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 10:37 AM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. This > > should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in > there > > to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not > > overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should > not > > get a chance to multiply. > Ray > > > \ > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" > > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > > What is a "safe" number regarding nitrates? Everything is > testing 0 > > but > > > of course I am getting a reading on nitrates, seems to be at 20 > ppm. > > > The reason I ask is due to this seemingly minor algae bloom. > I've > > seen > > > others have this and then a full out mess within days. I don't > want > > > that. > > > Anyhow, safe nitrate number? > > > Thanks > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > Marine > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? > t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? > t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13308	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

Three buckets instead of two every 2 weeks should help, but maybe try 2 buckets every week if you start to see the nitrates rising. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > It's been fine for the past few months. The main reason I do the amount of > water change is it is 2 bucket loads (10 gallons) I will try going to 3 > bucket loads from now on and see if that helps. What bothered me was that > even after the water change, there was no change in the amount of nitrates. > In any case...the levels have been down to 40 ppm for the past 2 days. I am > also in the process of getting more plants, so that should help the nitrate > levels as well. Unfortunately I lost a couple of my spiny eels in the > process :-( Once I get more plants in, I will remove the nitrate sponge and > see if the ntrate level stabilizes or spikes again. BTW...I also did move > my 7 Danios out of the main tank and put them into the tank with the ghost > shrimp as the dannies are too small to try and eat the shrimp. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 3:07 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > For easier maintenance in the future: While I don't know the fish- > load you are dealing with (unless I missed that part), you might try > 33% water changes every week (as many hobbyists normally do) instead > of 20% every two weeks. The necessity of this naturally depends on > your fish load, but if your nitrates were up to 160, I'd have to say > you may possibly have a somewhat heavy fish-load. A 20% change is > practically nothing anyway -- that much of a water change would bring > your nitrates down to 128, and that's with refilling with fresh water > that has absolutely no nitrates in it. After a two week period, > enough time has gone by that the amount of nitrate you took out has > been replaced (and then some) from the break-down of fish waste. It > just keeps escalating -- its a case of too little - too late! You > shouldn't need to put nitrate absorber in your filter. Just change > more water more frequently, or lessen your fish-load. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > > I just did daily water changes as well a a good deep cleaning of > the gravel. > > I put the bags of nitrate/nitrite/phosphate absorber in my filters > just to > > help get rid of what was already in the water. I think this is > what has > > helped as water changes prior to this did not effect the nitrate > levels. I > > don;t think it was from over feeding. We did have that problem, > but I > > reduced the amount of food, plus got some critters that will mop up > the > > uneaten food. I haven't added any fertilizers for my plants as of > yet, so > > that is not the source. I am not sure where all the excess > nitrates are > > coming from. I normally do a 20% water change every 2 weeks. So I > haven't > > figured out the source. My only thought is that it may have had > something > > to do with my UGF. I turned it off as I am slowly adding plants > and that is > > when the nitrate levels went down to 40 (same day as I added the > absorbing > > material). This was something that has happened over the past few > weeks, so > > it was the extended exposure to high nitrate levels that I was > concerned > > about. I lost 2 of my spiny eels in the past week, so I think that > may have > > been the cause. > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Steve Szabo > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 9:39 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > 160 ppm is a ways away from killing your fish. Over a long term it > may cause > > problems in your fish, bit is nothing to panic over as you do have > plenty of > > time to determine the problem and reduce the presence of the > nitrate without > > taking any drastic actions. > > > > Now, if we were talking a reef tank here, that would be a whole > other > > ballgame, and your tank would be essentially dead. But, we are not, > and your > > tank would have been OK without rushing about to "do something" > about the > > nitrates. > > > > \\Steve// > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Eric Roberts > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 1:39 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > I just had a major issue with nitrates...they shot up through the > roof (and > > I have some plants). I got some of the nitrate sponges to soak > some of them > > up before they kill my fish. I have been doing 20 % water changes > every day > > and after about a week, they got down to 40 ppm...they were as high > as 160 > > at one point. One of my tasks is to get more plants and more > light. I am > > designing a hood for my 55 gal tank, so once I get that all in > place, I > > should be fine...or at least I hope. I am also getting rid of my > gravel > > eventually and replacing it with sand. This of course means no > more UGF, > > but it looks a lot nicer. I set up my 20 gal to house some of my > smaller > > fish and some ghost shrimp that I got for food for my larger fish > and I used > > the Tahitian moonlight black sand. It looks awesome with that. I > will be > > switching over to that in the next month or so in the big tank. > The only > > thing I don;t like about the sand is it is a real PIA to get > clean. When I > > was setting up the 20 gal, I thought I had it clean, but ended up > having to > > empty out the tank and refilling it after cleaning the gravel once > > again...ugg. > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 10:37 AM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. This > > should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in > there > > to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not > > overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should > not > > get a chance to multiply. > Ray > > > \ > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" > > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > > What is a "safe" number regarding nitrates? Everything is > testing 0 > > but > > > of course I am getting a reading on nitrates, seems to be at 20 > ppm. > > > The reason I ask is due to this seemingly minor algae bloom. > I've > > seen > > > others have this and then a full out mess within days. I don't > want > > > that. > > > Anyhow, safe nitrate number? > > > Thanks > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > Marine > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? > t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? > t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13309	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

try it w/o the first two w's or add another w to the first 2 w's. --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote: > Don't know if this is the same as Evita's getting, but I'm getting > the message "Can't Find Website", although that could just be my > browser acting up. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > > you can see what I have...I have started a page on my site, but > haven't > > completed it. It does have a good listing of my fish... > > > > http://ww.witchnet.org/aquarium.cfm > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > > Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 3:07 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > For easier maintenance in the future: While I don't know the fish- > > load you are dealing with (unless I missed that part), you might > try > > 33% water changes every week (as many hobbyists normally do) > instead > > of 20% every two weeks. The necessity of this naturally depends on > > your fish load, but if your nitrates were up to 160, I'd have to > say > > you may possibly have a somewhat heavy fish-load. A 20% change is > > practically nothing anyway -- that much of a water change would > bring > > your nitrates down to 128, and that's with refilling with fresh > water > > that has absolutely no nitrates in it. After a two week period, > > enough time has gone by that the amount of nitrate you took out has > > been replaced (and then some) from the break-down of fish waste. > It > > just keeps escalating -- its a case of too little - too late! You > > shouldn't need to put nitrate absorber in your filter. Just change > > more water more frequently, or lessen your fish-load. > Ray > > > \ > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> > wrote: > > > I just did daily water changes as well a a good deep cleaning of > > the gravel. > > > I put the bags of nitrate/nitrite/phosphate absorber in my > filters > > just to > > > help get rid of what was already in the water. I think this is > > what has > > > helped as water changes prior to this did not effect the nitrate > > levels. I > > > don;t think it was from over feeding. We did have that problem, > > but I > > > reduced the amount of food, plus got some critters that will mop > up > > the > > > uneaten food. I haven't added any fertilizers for my plants as > of > > yet, so > > > that is not the source. I am not sure where all the excess > > nitrates are > > > coming from. I normally do a 20% water change every 2 weeks. So > I > > haven't > > > figured out the source. My only thought is that it may have had > > something > > > to do with my UGF. I turned it off as I am slowly adding plants > > and that is > > > when the nitrate levels went down to 40 (same day as I added the > > absorbing > > > material). This was something that has happened over the past > few > > weeks, so > > > it was the extended exposure to high nitrate levels that I was > > concerned > > > about. I lost 2 of my spiny eels in the past week, so I think > that > > may have > > > been the cause. > > > > > > Eric > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > Behalf Of Steve Szabo > > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 9:39 PM > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > > > > 160 ppm is a ways away from killing your fish. Over a long term > it > > may cause > > > problems in your fish, bit is nothing to panic over as you do > have > > plenty of > > > time to determine the problem and reduce the presence of the > > nitrate without > > > taking any drastic actions. > > > > > > Now, if we were talking a reef tank here, that would be a whole > > other > > > ballgame, and your tank would be essentially dead. But, we are > not, > > and your > > > tank would have been OK without rushing about to "do something" > > about the > > > nitrates. > > > > > > \\Steve// > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > Behalf Of Eric Roberts > > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 1:39 PM > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > I just had a major issue with nitrates...they shot up through the > > roof (and > > > I have some plants). I got some of the nitrate sponges to soak > > some of them > > > up before they kill my fish. I have been doing 20 % water > changes > > every day > > > and after about a week, they got down to 40 ppm...they were as > high > > as 160 > > > at one point. One of my tasks is to get more plants and more > > light. I am > > > designing a hood for my 55 gal tank, so once I get that all in > > place, I > > > should be fine...or at least I hope. I am also getting rid of my > > gravel > > > eventually and replacing it with sand. This of course means no > > more UGF, > > > but it looks a lot nicer. I set up my 20 gal to house some of my > > smaller > > > fish and some ghost shrimp that I got for food for my larger fish > > and I used > > > the Tahitian moonlight black sand. It looks awesome with that. > I > > will be > > > switching over to that in the next month or so in the big tank. > > The only > > > thing I don;t like about the sand is it is a real PIA to get > > clean. When I > > > was setting up the 20 gal, I thought I had it clean, but ended up > > having to > > > empty out the tank and refilling it after cleaning the gravel once > > > again...ugg. > > > > > > Eric > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 10:37 AM > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > > > > A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. > This > > > should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in > > there > > > to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not > > > overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should > > not > > > get a chance to multiply. > > Ray > > > > > > \ > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" > > > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > > > What is a "safe" number regarding nitrates? Everything is > > testing 0 > > > but > > > > of course I am getting a reading on nitrates, seems to be at 20 > > ppm. > > > > The reason I ask is due to this seemingly minor algae bloom. > > I've > > > seen > > > > others have this and then a full out mess within days. I don't > > want > > > > that. > > > > Anyhow, safe nitrate number? > > > > Thanks > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > ((((º> > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > > thanks. > > > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > > important to > > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message > MODIFY > > the > > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > > Marine > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? > > t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > > > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? > > t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > > > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms > of > > Service > > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > ((((º> > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > > thanks. > > > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > > important to > > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message > MODIFY > > the > > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > ((((º> > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > > thanks. > > > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > > important to > > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message > MODIFY > > the > > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms > of > > Service > > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > Marine > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? > t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? > t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13310	From: kb1dva	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: do pacus play dead?

My pacu races around like a crazy thing when frightened but I have also seen him –dead in the water so to speak .They really are odd fish Emily _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of joequality1980 Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 2:45 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] do pacus play dead? I read somewhere that piranhas play dead sometimes when they get frightened and was wondering if the same holds true for pacus (since they are closely related). Sometimes when mine get scared, they race around the tank and then end up on the bottom on their side. The first time, I reached in and nudged him and he raced around and got normal. An hour later, he was swimming around as if nothing had happened. Are they just messing with me or should I get them a therapist? ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13311	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.

In a message dated 7/14/2005 4:29:06 A.M. Central Standard Time, Deenerz@... writes: Try this site. http://www.planetcatfish.com/ Lots and lots of catfish to be found here. Yes! I found that site earlier this week. What a wonderful wealth of information! Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13312	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)

My kids (and husband) have been bugging me to get a dwarf aquatic frog. How would they be with angelfish, keyholes, tetras, and cories? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13313	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)

In a message dated 7/14/2005 1:48:11 P.M. Central Standard Time, woad@... writes: I wonder what is behind that behavior? Aren't cories able to breath regular air like the gouramis? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13314	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

not really. The challenge with them is making sure they eat. I just make sure I get some shrimp pellets in their caves and they get food. They have really poor eyesight and can get beaten to a meal. We lost one early on, but I think he was sick when we got him. Every fish we got from that store has died. The other 2 I got at Petsmart and they are getting big and healthy. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 4:33 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s i see you have violet gobies, aka dragonfish. i saw one of those @ petsmart awhile back and was interested in them. but then heard that they're rather hard to keep. have you found this to be true? --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > It's been fine for the past few months. The main reason I do the amount of > water change is it is 2 bucket loads (10 gallons) I will try going to 3 > bucket loads from now on and see if that helps. What bothered me was that > even after the water change, there was no change in the amount of nitrates. > In any case...the levels have been down to 40 ppm for the past 2 days. I am > also in the process of getting more plants, so that should help the nitrate > levels as well. Unfortunately I lost a couple of my spiny eels in the > process :-( Once I get more plants in, I will remove the nitrate sponge and > see if the ntrate level stabilizes or spikes again. BTW...I also did move > my 7 Danios out of the main tank and put them into the tank with the ghost > shrimp as the dannies are too small to try and eat the shrimp. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 3:07 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > For easier maintenance in the future: While I don't know the fish- > load you are dealing with (unless I missed that part), you might try > 33% water changes every week (as many hobbyists normally do) instead > of 20% every two weeks. The necessity of this naturally depends on > your fish load, but if your nitrates were up to 160, I'd have to say > you may possibly have a somewhat heavy fish-load. A 20% change is > practically nothing anyway -- that much of a water change would bring > your nitrates down to 128, and that's with refilling with fresh water > that has absolutely no nitrates in it. After a two week period, > enough time has gone by that the amount of nitrate you took out has > been replaced (and then some) from the break-down of fish waste. It > just keeps escalating -- its a case of too little - too late! You > shouldn't need to put nitrate absorber in your filter. Just change > more water more frequently, or lessen your fish-load. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > > I just did daily water changes as well a a good deep cleaning of > the gravel. > > I put the bags of nitrate/nitrite/phosphate absorber in my filters > just to > > help get rid of what was already in the water. I think this is > what has > > helped as water changes prior to this did not effect the nitrate > levels. I > > don;t think it was from over feeding. We did have that problem, > but I > > reduced the amount of food, plus got some critters that will mop up > the > > uneaten food. I haven't added any fertilizers for my plants as of > yet, so > > that is not the source. I am not sure where all the excess > nitrates are > > coming from. I normally do a 20% water change every 2 weeks. So I > haven't > > figured out the source. My only thought is that it may have had > something > > to do with my UGF. I turned it off as I am slowly adding plants > and that is > > when the nitrate levels went down to 40 (same day as I added the > absorbing > > material). This was something that has happened over the past few > weeks, so > > it was the extended exposure to high nitrate levels that I was > concerned > > about. I lost 2 of my spiny eels in the past week, so I think that > may have > > been the cause. > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Steve Szabo > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 9:39 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > 160 ppm is a ways away from killing your fish. Over a long term it > may cause > > problems in your fish, bit is nothing to panic over as you do have > plenty of > > time to determine the problem and reduce the presence of the > nitrate without > > taking any drastic actions. > > > > Now, if we were talking a reef tank here, that would be a whole > other > > ballgame, and your tank would be essentially dead. But, we are not, > and your > > tank would have been OK without rushing about to "do something" > about the > > nitrates. > > > > \\Steve// > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Eric Roberts > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 1:39 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > I just had a major issue with nitrates...they shot up through the > roof (and > > I have some plants). I got some of the nitrate sponges to soak > some of them > > up before they kill my fish. I have been doing 20 % water changes > every day > > and after about a week, they got down to 40 ppm...they were as high > as 160 > > at one point. One of my tasks is to get more plants and more > light. I am > > designing a hood for my 55 gal tank, so once I get that all in > place, I > > should be fine...or at least I hope. I am also getting rid of my > gravel > > eventually and replacing it with sand. This of course means no > more UGF, > > but it looks a lot nicer. I set up my 20 gal to house some of my > smaller > > fish and some ghost shrimp that I got for food for my larger fish > and I used > > the Tahitian moonlight black sand. It looks awesome with that. I > will be > > switching over to that in the next month or so in the big tank. > The only > > thing I don;t like about the sand is it is a real PIA to get > clean. When I > > was setting up the 20 gal, I thought I had it clean, but ended up > having to > > empty out the tank and refilling it after cleaning the gravel once > > again...ugg. > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 10:37 AM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. This > > should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in > there > > to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not > > overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should > not > > get a chance to multiply. > Ray > > > \ > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" > > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > > What is a "safe" number regarding nitrates? Everything is > testing 0 > > but > > > of course I am getting a reading on nitrates, seems to be at 20 > ppm. > > > The reason I ask is due to this seemingly minor algae bloom. > I've > > seen > > > others have this and then a full out mess within days. I don't > want > > > that. > > > Anyhow, safe nitrate number? > > > Thanks > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > Marine > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? > t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? > t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13315	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Clean filters or change them?

It shouldn't have any effect. That is the wonder of having the physical and chemical filter separate from the bio-wheel. Yes, you are removing some of the biological filter when you replace the mechanical filter, but the most important part of the biological aspect of Marineland filters is the biowheel. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Miner Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 4:33 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Clean filters or change them? Hello, I've read differing opinons on this. Should one carefully clean out a filter and reuse it or should it be replaced. I have a Marineland Penquin 350B Bio-wheel power filter. The concern is if I replace the filters how much, if any, effect will this have on the bio filter? The Bio-wheels are designed to increase the surface area for the bacterial Thanks, Eric M. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13316	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

no...it was a typo on my part...try http://www.witchnet.org/aquarium.cfm Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 4:41 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s Don't know if this is the same as Evita's getting, but I'm getting the message "Can't Find Website", although that could just be my browser acting up. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > you can see what I have...I have started a page on my site, but haven't > completed it. It does have a good listing of my fish... > > http://ww.witchnet.org/aquarium.cfm > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 3:07 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > For easier maintenance in the future: While I don't know the fish- > load you are dealing with (unless I missed that part), you might try > 33% water changes every week (as many hobbyists normally do) instead > of 20% every two weeks. The necessity of this naturally depends on > your fish load, but if your nitrates were up to 160, I'd have to say > you may possibly have a somewhat heavy fish-load. A 20% change is > practically nothing anyway -- that much of a water change would bring > your nitrates down to 128, and that's with refilling with fresh water > that has absolutely no nitrates in it. After a two week period, > enough time has gone by that the amount of nitrate you took out has > been replaced (and then some) from the break-down of fish waste. It > just keeps escalating -- its a case of too little - too late! You > shouldn't need to put nitrate absorber in your filter. Just change > more water more frequently, or lessen your fish-load. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > > I just did daily water changes as well a a good deep cleaning of > the gravel. > > I put the bags of nitrate/nitrite/phosphate absorber in my filters > just to > > help get rid of what was already in the water. I think this is > what has > > helped as water changes prior to this did not effect the nitrate > levels. I > > don;t think it was from over feeding. We did have that problem, > but I > > reduced the amount of food, plus got some critters that will mop up > the > > uneaten food. I haven't added any fertilizers for my plants as of > yet, so > > that is not the source. I am not sure where all the excess > nitrates are > > coming from. I normally do a 20% water change every 2 weeks. So I > haven't > > figured out the source. My only thought is that it may have had > something > > to do with my UGF. I turned it off as I am slowly adding plants > and that is > > when the nitrate levels went down to 40 (same day as I added the > absorbing > > material). This was something that has happened over the past few > weeks, so > > it was the extended exposure to high nitrate levels that I was > concerned > > about. I lost 2 of my spiny eels in the past week, so I think that > may have > > been the cause. > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Steve Szabo > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 9:39 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > 160 ppm is a ways away from killing your fish. Over a long term it > may cause > > problems in your fish, bit is nothing to panic over as you do have > plenty of > > time to determine the problem and reduce the presence of the > nitrate without > > taking any drastic actions. > > > > Now, if we were talking a reef tank here, that would be a whole > other > > ballgame, and your tank would be essentially dead. But, we are not, > and your > > tank would have been OK without rushing about to "do something" > about the > > nitrates. > > > > \\Steve// > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Eric Roberts > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 1:39 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > I just had a major issue with nitrates...they shot up through the > roof (and > > I have some plants). I got some of the nitrate sponges to soak > some of them > > up before they kill my fish. I have been doing 20 % water changes > every day > > and after about a week, they got down to 40 ppm...they were as high > as 160 > > at one point. One of my tasks is to get more plants and more > light. I am > > designing a hood for my 55 gal tank, so once I get that all in > place, I > > should be fine...or at least I hope. I am also getting rid of my > gravel > > eventually and replacing it with sand. This of course means no > more UGF, > > but it looks a lot nicer. I set up my 20 gal to house some of my > smaller > > fish and some ghost shrimp that I got for food for my larger fish > and I used > > the Tahitian moonlight black sand. It looks awesome with that. I > will be > > switching over to that in the next month or so in the big tank. > The only > > thing I don;t like about the sand is it is a real PIA to get > clean. When I > > was setting up the 20 gal, I thought I had it clean, but ended up > having to > > empty out the tank and refilling it after cleaning the gravel once > > again...ugg. > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 10:37 AM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. This > > should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in > there > > to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not > > overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should > not > > get a chance to multiply. > Ray > > > \ > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" > > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > > What is a "safe" number regarding nitrates? Everything is > testing 0 > > but > > > of course I am getting a reading on nitrates, seems to be at 20 > ppm. > > > The reason I ask is due to this seemingly minor algae bloom. > I've > > seen > > > others have this and then a full out mess within days. I don't > want > > > that. > > > Anyhow, safe nitrate number? > > > Thanks > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > Marine > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? > t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? > t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13317	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

yep...typo's suck hehehe Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 4:47 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s try it w/o the first two w's or add another w to the first 2 w's. --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote: > Don't know if this is the same as Evita's getting, but I'm getting > the message "Can't Find Website", although that could just be my > browser acting up. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > > you can see what I have...I have started a page on my site, but > haven't > > completed it. It does have a good listing of my fish... > > > > http://ww.witchnet.org/aquarium.cfm > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > > Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 3:07 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > For easier maintenance in the future: While I don't know the fish- > > load you are dealing with (unless I missed that part), you might > try > > 33% water changes every week (as many hobbyists normally do) > instead > > of 20% every two weeks. The necessity of this naturally depends on > > your fish load, but if your nitrates were up to 160, I'd have to > say > > you may possibly have a somewhat heavy fish-load. A 20% change is > > practically nothing anyway -- that much of a water change would > bring > > your nitrates down to 128, and that's with refilling with fresh > water > > that has absolutely no nitrates in it. After a two week period, > > enough time has gone by that the amount of nitrate you took out has > > been replaced (and then some) from the break-down of fish waste. > It > > just keeps escalating -- its a case of too little - too late! You > > shouldn't need to put nitrate absorber in your filter. Just change > > more water more frequently, or lessen your fish-load. > Ray > > > \ > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> > wrote: > > > I just did daily water changes as well a a good deep cleaning of > > the gravel. > > > I put the bags of nitrate/nitrite/phosphate absorber in my > filters > > just to > > > help get rid of what was already in the water. I think this is > > what has > > > helped as water changes prior to this did not effect the nitrate > > levels. I > > > don;t think it was from over feeding. We did have that problem, > > but I > > > reduced the amount of food, plus got some critters that will mop > up > > the > > > uneaten food. I haven't added any fertilizers for my plants as > of > > yet, so > > > that is not the source. I am not sure where all the excess > > nitrates are > > > coming from. I normally do a 20% water change every 2 weeks. So > I > > haven't > > > figured out the source. My only thought is that it may have had > > something > > > to do with my UGF. I turned it off as I am slowly adding plants > > and that is > > > when the nitrate levels went down to 40 (same day as I added the > > absorbing > > > material). This was something that has happened over the past > few > > weeks, so > > > it was the extended exposure to high nitrate levels that I was > > concerned > > > about. I lost 2 of my spiny eels in the past week, so I think > that > > may have > > > been the cause. > > > > > > Eric > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > Behalf Of Steve Szabo > > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 9:39 PM > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > > > > 160 ppm is a ways away from killing your fish. Over a long term > it > > may cause > > > problems in your fish, bit is nothing to panic over as you do > have > > plenty of > > > time to determine the problem and reduce the presence of the > > nitrate without > > > taking any drastic actions. > > > > > > Now, if we were talking a reef tank here, that would be a whole > > other > > > ballgame, and your tank would be essentially dead. But, we are > not, > > and your > > > tank would have been OK without rushing about to "do something" > > about the > > > nitrates. > > > > > > \\Steve// > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > Behalf Of Eric Roberts > > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 1:39 PM > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > I just had a major issue with nitrates...they shot up through the > > roof (and > > > I have some plants). I got some of the nitrate sponges to soak > > some of them > > > up before they kill my fish. I have been doing 20 % water > changes > > every day > > > and after about a week, they got down to 40 ppm...they were as > high > > as 160 > > > at one point. One of my tasks is to get more plants and more > > light. I am > > > designing a hood for my 55 gal tank, so once I get that all in > > place, I > > > should be fine...or at least I hope. I am also getting rid of my > > gravel > > > eventually and replacing it with sand. This of course means no > > more UGF, > > > but it looks a lot nicer. I set up my 20 gal to house some of my > > smaller > > > fish and some ghost shrimp that I got for food for my larger fish > > and I used > > > the Tahitian moonlight black sand. It looks awesome with that. > I > > will be > > > switching over to that in the next month or so in the big tank. > > The only > > > thing I don;t like about the sand is it is a real PIA to get > > clean. When I > > > was setting up the 20 gal, I thought I had it clean, but ended up > > having to > > > empty out the tank and refilling it after cleaning the gravel once > > > again...ugg. > > > > > > Eric > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 10:37 AM > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > > > > A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. > This > > > should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in > > there > > > to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not > > > overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should > > not > > > get a chance to multiply. > > Ray > > > > > > \ > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" > > > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > > > What is a "safe" number regarding nitrates? Everything is > > testing 0 > > > but > > > > of course I am getting a reading on nitrates, seems to be at 20 > > ppm. > > > > The reason I ask is due to this seemingly minor algae bloom. > > I've > > > seen > > > > others have this and then a full out mess within days. I don't > > want > > > > that. > > > > Anyhow, safe nitrate number? > > > > Thanks > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > ((((º> > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > > thanks. > > > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > > important to > > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message > MODIFY > > the > > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > > Marine > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? > > t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > > > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? > > t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > > > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms > of > > Service > > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > ((((º> > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > > thanks. > > > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > > important to > > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message > MODIFY > > the > > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > ((((º> > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > > thanks. > > > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > > important to > > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message > MODIFY > > the > > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms > of > > Service > > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > Marine > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? > t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? > t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13318	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

oops...lets try http://www.witchnet.org/aquarium.cfm (amazing what leaving off a "w" will do hehehe) Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evita Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 4:29 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s Sorry Eric Nothing there. Evita Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote:you can see what I have...I have started a page on my site, but haven't completed it. It does have a good listing of my fish... http://ww.witchnet.org/aquarium.cfm Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 3:07 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s For easier maintenance in the future: While I don't know the fish- load you are dealing with (unless I missed that part), you might try 33% water changes every week (as many hobbyists normally do) instead of 20% every two weeks. The necessity of this naturally depends on your fish load, but if your nitrates were up to 160, I'd have to say you may possibly have a somewhat heavy fish-load. A 20% change is practically nothing anyway -- that much of a water change would bring your nitrates down to 128, and that's with refilling with fresh water that has absolutely no nitrates in it. After a two week period, enough time has gone by that the amount of nitrate you took out has been replaced (and then some) from the break-down of fish waste. It just keeps escalating -- its a case of too little - too late! You shouldn't need to put nitrate absorber in your filter. Just change more water more frequently, or lessen your fish-load. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > I just did daily water changes as well a a good deep cleaning of the gravel. > I put the bags of nitrate/nitrite/phosphate absorber in my filters just to > help get rid of what was already in the water. I think this is what has > helped as water changes prior to this did not effect the nitrate levels. I > don;t think it was from over feeding. We did have that problem, but I > reduced the amount of food, plus got some critters that will mop up the > uneaten food. I haven't added any fertilizers for my plants as of yet, so > that is not the source. I am not sure where all the excess nitrates are > coming from. I normally do a 20% water change every 2 weeks. So I haven't > figured out the source. My only thought is that it may have had something > to do with my UGF. I turned it off as I am slowly adding plants and that is > when the nitrate levels went down to 40 (same day as I added the absorbing > material). This was something that has happened over the past few weeks, so > it was the extended exposure to high nitrate levels that I was concerned > about. I lost 2 of my spiny eels in the past week, so I think that may have > been the cause. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Steve Szabo > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 9:39 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > 160 ppm is a ways away from killing your fish. Over a long term it may cause > problems in your fish, bit is nothing to panic over as you do have plenty of > time to determine the problem and reduce the presence of the nitrate without > taking any drastic actions. > > Now, if we were talking a reef tank here, that would be a whole other > ballgame, and your tank would be essentially dead. But, we are not, and your > tank would have been OK without rushing about to "do something" about the > nitrates. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Eric Roberts > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 1:39 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > I just had a major issue with nitrates...they shot up through the roof (and > I have some plants). I got some of the nitrate sponges to soak some of them > up before they kill my fish. I have been doing 20 % water changes every day > and after about a week, they got down to 40 ppm...they were as high as 160 > at one point. One of my tasks is to get more plants and more light. I am > designing a hood for my 55 gal tank, so once I get that all in place, I > should be fine...or at least I hope. I am also getting rid of my gravel > eventually and replacing it with sand. This of course means no more UGF, > but it looks a lot nicer. I set up my 20 gal to house some of my smaller > fish and some ghost shrimp that I got for food for my larger fish and I used > the Tahitian moonlight black sand. It looks awesome with that. I will be > switching over to that in the next month or so in the big tank. The only > thing I don;t like about the sand is it is a real PIA to get clean. When I > was setting up the 20 gal, I thought I had it clean, but ended up having to > empty out the tank and refilling it after cleaning the gravel once > again...ugg. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 10:37 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. This > should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in there > to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not > overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should not > get a chance to multiply. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > What is a "safe" number regarding nitrates? Everything is testing 0 > but > > of course I am getting a reading on nitrates, seems to be at 20 ppm. > > The reason I ask is due to this seemingly minor algae bloom. I've > seen > > others have this and then a full out mess within days. I don't want > > that. > > Anyhow, safe nitrate number? > > Thanks > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13319	From: Evita	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

I am getting....Page cannot be displayed and at the botton....Cannot find server Evita Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote:Don't know if this is the same as Evita's getting, but I'm getting the message "Can't Find Website", although that could just be my browser acting up. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > you can see what I have...I have started a page on my site, but haven't > completed it. It does have a good listing of my fish... > > http://ww.witchnet.org/aquarium.cfm > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 3:07 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > For easier maintenance in the future: While I don't know the fish- > load you are dealing with (unless I missed that part), you might try > 33% water changes every week (as many hobbyists normally do) instead > of 20% every two weeks. The necessity of this naturally depends on > your fish load, but if your nitrates were up to 160, I'd have to say > you may possibly have a somewhat heavy fish-load. A 20% change is > practically nothing anyway -- that much of a water change would bring > your nitrates down to 128, and that's with refilling with fresh water > that has absolutely no nitrates in it. After a two week period, > enough time has gone by that the amount of nitrate you took out has > been replaced (and then some) from the break-down of fish waste. It > just keeps escalating -- its a case of too little - too late! You > shouldn't need to put nitrate absorber in your filter. Just change > more water more frequently, or lessen your fish-load. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > > I just did daily water changes as well a a good deep cleaning of > the gravel. > > I put the bags of nitrate/nitrite/phosphate absorber in my filters > just to > > help get rid of what was already in the water. I think this is > what has > > helped as water changes prior to this did not effect the nitrate > levels. I > > don;t think it was from over feeding. We did have that problem, > but I > > reduced the amount of food, plus got some critters that will mop up > the > > uneaten food. I haven't added any fertilizers for my plants as of > yet, so > > that is not the source. I am not sure where all the excess > nitrates are > > coming from. I normally do a 20% water change every 2 weeks. So I > haven't > > figured out the source. My only thought is that it may have had > something > > to do with my UGF. I turned it off as I am slowly adding plants > and that is > > when the nitrate levels went down to 40 (same day as I added the > absorbing > > material). This was something that has happened over the past few > weeks, so > > it was the extended exposure to high nitrate levels that I was > concerned > > about. I lost 2 of my spiny eels in the past week, so I think that > may have > > been the cause. > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Steve Szabo > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 9:39 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > 160 ppm is a ways away from killing your fish. Over a long term it > may cause > > problems in your fish, bit is nothing to panic over as you do have > plenty of > > time to determine the problem and reduce the presence of the > nitrate without > > taking any drastic actions. > > > > Now, if we were talking a reef tank here, that would be a whole > other > > ballgame, and your tank would be essentially dead. But, we are not, > and your > > tank would have been OK without rushing about to "do something" > about the > > nitrates. > > > > \\Steve// > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Eric Roberts > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 1:39 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > I just had a major issue with nitrates...they shot up through the > roof (and > > I have some plants). I got some of the nitrate sponges to soak > some of them > > up before they kill my fish. I have been doing 20 % water changes > every day > > and after about a week, they got down to 40 ppm...they were as high > as 160 > > at one point. One of my tasks is to get more plants and more > light. I am > > designing a hood for my 55 gal tank, so once I get that all in > place, I > > should be fine...or at least I hope. I am also getting rid of my > gravel > > eventually and replacing it with sand. This of course means no > more UGF, > > but it looks a lot nicer. I set up my 20 gal to house some of my > smaller > > fish and some ghost shrimp that I got for food for my larger fish > and I used > > the Tahitian moonlight black sand. It looks awesome with that. I > will be > > switching over to that in the next month or so in the big tank. > The only > > thing I don;t like about the sand is it is a real PIA to get > clean. When I > > was setting up the 20 gal, I thought I had it clean, but ended up > having to > > empty out the tank and refilling it after cleaning the gravel once > > again...ugg. > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 10:37 AM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. This > > should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in > there > > to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not > > overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should > not > > get a chance to multiply. > Ray > > > \ > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" > > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > > What is a "safe" number regarding nitrates? Everything is > testing 0 > > but > > > of course I am getting a reading on nitrates, seems to be at 20 > ppm. > > > The reason I ask is due to this seemingly minor algae bloom. > I've > > seen > > > others have this and then a full out mess within days. I don't > want > > > that. > > > Anyhow, safe nitrate number? > > > Thanks > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > Marine > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? > t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? > t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13320	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: fish stress

For future reference: Which would cause your fish more stress- chasing them around a 150 gallon tank, netting them and putting them in a holding tank then moving them back, or removing the plants, rocks and wood and rearranging their tank with them in it? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13321	From: Evita	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

That worked Eric. Let us know when you get some photos up. Evita Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote:oops...lets try http://www.witchnet.org/aquarium.cfm (amazing what leaving off a "w" will do hehehe) Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evita Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 4:29 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s Sorry Eric Nothing there. Evita Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote:you can see what I have...I have started a page on my site, but haven't completed it. It does have a good listing of my fish... http://ww.witchnet.org/aquarium.cfm Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 3:07 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s For easier maintenance in the future: While I don't know the fish- load you are dealing with (unless I missed that part), you might try 33% water changes every week (as many hobbyists normally do) instead of 20% every two weeks. The necessity of this naturally depends on your fish load, but if your nitrates were up to 160, I'd have to say you may possibly have a somewhat heavy fish-load. A 20% change is practically nothing anyway -- that much of a water change would bring your nitrates down to 128, and that's with refilling with fresh water that has absolutely no nitrates in it. After a two week period, enough time has gone by that the amount of nitrate you took out has been replaced (and then some) from the break-down of fish waste. It just keeps escalating -- its a case of too little - too late! You shouldn't need to put nitrate absorber in your filter. Just change more water more frequently, or lessen your fish-load. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > I just did daily water changes as well a a good deep cleaning of the gravel. > I put the bags of nitrate/nitrite/phosphate absorber in my filters just to > help get rid of what was already in the water. I think this is what has > helped as water changes prior to this did not effect the nitrate levels. I > don;t think it was from over feeding. We did have that problem, but I > reduced the amount of food, plus got some critters that will mop up the > uneaten food. I haven't added any fertilizers for my plants as of yet, so > that is not the source. I am not sure where all the excess nitrates are > coming from. I normally do a 20% water change every 2 weeks. So I haven't > figured out the source. My only thought is that it may have had something > to do with my UGF. I turned it off as I am slowly adding plants and that is > when the nitrate levels went down to 40 (same day as I added the absorbing > material). This was something that has happened over the past few weeks, so > it was the extended exposure to high nitrate levels that I was concerned > about. I lost 2 of my spiny eels in the past week, so I think that may have > been the cause. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Steve Szabo > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 9:39 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > 160 ppm is a ways away from killing your fish. Over a long term it may cause > problems in your fish, bit is nothing to panic over as you do have plenty of > time to determine the problem and reduce the presence of the nitrate without > taking any drastic actions. > > Now, if we were talking a reef tank here, that would be a whole other > ballgame, and your tank would be essentially dead. But, we are not, and your > tank would have been OK without rushing about to "do something" about the > nitrates. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Eric Roberts > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 1:39 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > I just had a major issue with nitrates...they shot up through the roof (and > I have some plants). I got some of the nitrate sponges to soak some of them > up before they kill my fish. I have been doing 20 % water changes every day > and after about a week, they got down to 40 ppm...they were as high as 160 > at one point. One of my tasks is to get more plants and more light. I am > designing a hood for my 55 gal tank, so once I get that all in place, I > should be fine...or at least I hope. I am also getting rid of my gravel > eventually and replacing it with sand. This of course means no more UGF, > but it looks a lot nicer. I set up my 20 gal to house some of my smaller > fish and some ghost shrimp that I got for food for my larger fish and I used > the Tahitian moonlight black sand. It looks awesome with that. I will be > switching over to that in the next month or so in the big tank. The only > thing I don;t like about the sand is it is a real PIA to get clean. When I > was setting up the 20 gal, I thought I had it clean, but ended up having to > empty out the tank and refilling it after cleaning the gravel once > again...ugg. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 10:37 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. This > should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in there > to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not > overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should not > get a chance to multiply. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > What is a "safe" number regarding nitrates? Everything is testing 0 > but > > of course I am getting a reading on nitrates, seems to be at 20 ppm. > > The reason I ask is due to this seemingly minor algae bloom. I've > seen > > others have this and then a full out mess within days. I don't want > > that. > > Anyhow, safe nitrate number? > > Thanks > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > _____ > > YAHOO! 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13322	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

Eric, Sorry, no time for photos tonight. I go home less than a half hour ago, and just don't have the time to do it. The gravel normally sold for aquarium use is #3 gravel, whether it be a fluorescent color, black or "natural". The sandy, gritty stuff you put on the bottom of a birdcage can be considered to be #1 gravel. The size of the grains of #2 gravel fall in between these two. Some of the stuff I found on the Caribsea site (http://www.carib-sea.com) look to be pretty close to #2 gravel, but it is pretty hard to tell, with no real way to really compare the size of the gravel. The stuff you were looking at in the links from one of the chain pet stores looks like it might be that size. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 6:59 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s I'll see if I can get a photo for you tonight. That Carib Sea product looks OK, but I'd like to see it in person first. It does not look like sand in the form that most people here are thinking of sand (beach sand). -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Roberts Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 11:27 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s this is the sand I used and am planning on using in the 55 gal: http://shop.petsmart.com/product/2534374302023693/2534374302030109/845524441 781393.htm I could not find a "mm", but it said extra fine. Now as far as #2 gravel goes, what should I be looking for? I looked online and found this: http://www.cayugalandscape.com/gardencenter/bulk_materials/bulkmaterials.htm l That looks pretty big to me... Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 9:44 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s Eric, That will not work either. The sand will find its way down through the gravel, and you'd be facing the same problem if you had used all sand. What you may consider doing is using a finer gravel than you normally would find in a store. You should look at some #2 gravel, which is finer than the #3 gravel usually found in stores, and fairly good for plants as it does compact some, but not enough to disrupt root growth. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Roberts Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 4:51 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s I am going to leave a layer of gravel underneatth for plants to grow in... Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 2:38 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s Glad to see you got the nitrates under control. I see you plan to add more plants which should help towards this end. Also notice that you are planning to switch over to sand. While this may look awesome, you may have trouble trying to grow some of those plants you're thinking of getting as the finer sand has the tendancy of preventing proper root growth; its more compacted. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > I just had a major issue with nitrates...they shot up through the roof (and > I have some plants). I got some of the nitrate sponges to soak some of them > up before they kill my fish. I have been doing 20 % water changes every day > and after about a week, they got down to 40 ppm...they were as high as 160 > at one point. One of my tasks is to get more plants and more light. I am > designing a hood for my 55 gal tank, so once I get that all in place, I > should be fine...or at least I hope. I am also getting rid of my gravel > eventually and replacing it with sand. This of course means no more UGF, > but it looks a lot nicer. I set up my 20 gal to house some of my smaller > fish and some ghost shrimp that I got for food for my larger fish and I used > the Tahitian moonlight black sand. It looks awesome with that. I will be > switching over to that in the next month or so in the big tank. The only > thing I don;t like about the sand is it is a real PIA to get clean. When I > was setting up the 20 gal, I thought I had it clean, but ended up having to > empty out the tank and refilling it after cleaning the gravel once > again...ugg. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 10:37 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. This > should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in there > to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not > overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should not > get a chance to multiply. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > What is a "safe" number regarding nitrates? Everything is testing 0 > but > > of course I am getting a reading on nitrates, seems to be at 20 ppm. > > The reason I ask is due to this seemingly minor algae bloom. I've > seen > > others have this and then a full out mess within days. I don't want > > that. > > Anyhow, safe nitrate number? > > Thanks > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! 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PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13323	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s/ Steve

That's good to hear, that it will likely go away. I haven't tried to treat it with anything other than blocking than side from the light source. I do keep the lights to a minimum as it's naturally bright in that room anyway. They don't seem to care. When I do turn on the light, they all go nuts as they know it's feeding time. =) This tank is new, used BioSpira for a quicky, so that is likely what this is. There is algae growth on the drift wood, is that OK? It's not much, but it is ugly. Leslie ---------------------------- Probably less than 100. However, that may not be your concern here, really. Yes algae uses nitrates, but they also use other compounds and elements found in water that we do not normally measure. An example would be phosphates. Also needed is light. A lack of competition from other plants also contributes to algal growth. If this is a new tank, it is quite common for an algal or bacterial bloom to occur. Usually the blooms are rather short lived, relatively speaking, and will run their course, unless, of course, you try to "cure" the bloom. A reduction in light would be a good first step, unless you have live plants that need a well lit environment. If this is the case, then it is just a matter of time before the algae is out competed for food. One thing to remember is that there is really no such thing as an algae free tank. There will always be algae is some form, in some amount, in your tank. The idea is to control it and minimize it. Is some tanks, with certain fish, it is a welcome plant. \\Steve// --

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13324	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

I've heard about that Chicago water. Those rift lake people really like it up there. OK, so that rules out your water as being the source of nitrates, so it was something in your tank that caused the spike. The loss of those fish may not be due to the nitrate spike, directly, but the spike and the resultant change back down may have adversely affected them. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Roberts Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 1:36 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s Nitrates: 0 ppm Nitrites: 0 ppm hardness: 150 ppm (GH) alkalinity: 180 ppm (KH) pH: between 7.8 & 8.4 (the color of the test strip was in between the 2 colors) My water comes from Lake Michigan via the Greater Chicagoland Water Reclamation district. They supply most of the Chicago area with water from offshore pump houses. Not too many people...even in the outer reaches of the Chicago area use wells anymore. I checked the nitrates in the tank and they have stayed at 40 ppm for the past 2 days (yeah!!!!!) Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 5:55 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s What is the measurement of nitrates coming from your tap water, prior to adding git to the tank? This is often an overlooked source of nitrates, especially if you are using well water. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Roberts Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 11:19 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s I just did daily water changes as well a a good deep cleaning of the gravel. I put the bags of nitrate/nitrite/phosphate absorber in my filters just to help get rid of what was already in the water. I think this is what has helped as water changes prior to this did not effect the nitrate levels. I don;t think it was from over feeding. We did have that problem, but I reduced the amount of food, plus got some critters that will mop up the uneaten food. I haven't added any fertilizers for my plants as of yet, so that is not the source. I am not sure where all the excess nitrates are coming from. I normally do a 20% water change every 2 weeks. So I haven't figured out the source. My only thought is that it may have had something to do with my UGF. I turned it off as I am slowly adding plants and that is when the nitrate levels went down to 40 (same day as I added the absorbing material). This was something that has happened over the past few weeks, so it was the extended exposure to high nitrate levels that I was concerned about. I lost 2 of my spiny eels in the past week, so I think that may have been the cause. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 9:39 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s 160 ppm is a ways away from killing your fish. Over a long term it may cause problems in your fish, bit is nothing to panic over as you do have plenty of time to determine the problem and reduce the presence of the nitrate without taking any drastic actions. Now, if we were talking a reef tank here, that would be a whole other ballgame, and your tank would be essentially dead. But, we are not, and your tank would have been OK without rushing about to "do something" about the nitrates. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Roberts Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 1:39 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s I just had a major issue with nitrates...they shot up through the roof (and I have some plants). I got some of the nitrate sponges to soak some of them up before they kill my fish. I have been doing 20 % water changes every day and after about a week, they got down to 40 ppm...they were as high as 160 at one point. One of my tasks is to get more plants and more light. I am designing a hood for my 55 gal tank, so once I get that all in place, I should be fine...or at least I hope. I am also getting rid of my gravel eventually and replacing it with sand. This of course means no more UGF, but it looks a lot nicer. I set up my 20 gal to house some of my smaller fish and some ghost shrimp that I got for food for my larger fish and I used the Tahitian moonlight black sand. It looks awesome with that. I will be switching over to that in the next month or so in the big tank. The only thing I don;t like about the sand is it is a real PIA to get clean. When I was setting up the 20 gal, I thought I had it clean, but ended up having to empty out the tank and refilling it after cleaning the gravel once again...ugg. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 10:37 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. This should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in there to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should not get a chance to multiply. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > What is a "safe" number regarding nitrates? Everything is testing 0 but > of course I am getting a reading on nitrates, seems to be at 20 ppm. > The reason I ask is due to this seemingly minor algae bloom. I've seen > others have this and then a full out mess within days. I don't want > that. > Anyhow, safe nitrate number? > Thanks > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13325	From: harry perry	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: fish stress/To Linda

Linda, I've done both over the years. The last time was with the fish in the tank. I stirred things up a lot and I was concerned until I saw the fish regard this as a feeding opportunity. That was full grown rainbows. In a dario-dario tank, a small fish from India, the disruption of a water change could kill the fish. I would think keeping the fish in their "home water" would cause the least amount of stress. If you move the fish to another tank the water chemistry would have to be exactly the same to prevent stress. My opinion and experience. Harry Crazy4fids@... wrote: For future reference: Which would cause your fish more stress- chasing them around a 150 gallon tank, netting them and putting them in a holding tank then moving them back, or removing the plants, rocks and wood and rearranging their tank with them in it? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13326	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Clean filters or change them?

Hi Eric, I change my filters each week, as the fish poo builds up quite fast in my 30 gallon tank. And I do a monthly tank cleaning and remove about 90% of the water leaving enough water for my fish to remain in the tank. Only once did I remove my fish from my tank and did a complete cleaning of it and all I had was my algea eater 'Polly'. He later died about five months later. He also ate tubifex worms which was hilarious to watch him do so. Beth > Message: 19 > Date: Thu, 14 Jul 2005 21:32:43 -0000 > From: "Eric Miner" <eminer1254@...> > Subject: Clean filters or change them? > > Hello, > > I've read differing opinons on this. Should one carefully clean out a filter and reuse it or should it be replaced. I have a Marineland Penquin 350B Bio-wheel power filter. The concern is if I replace the filters how much, if any, effect will this have on the bio filter? The Bio-wheels are designed to increase the surface area for the bacterial > > Thanks, > > Eric M. http://fa.f-realm.com/ Fanfiction Axis. http://e.webring.com/hub?ring=siriusblack Sirius Black webring. http://e.webring.com/hub?ring=remuslupin Remus Lupin webring http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sailorsenshiocs/ for all original and series characters of Sailor Moon. http://www.livejournal.com/userinfo.bml?user=tropical_fishes Tropical fish tank livejournal community. ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13327	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

Eric, For a 55, you are definitely on the high side of fish load in there, especially if those fish are getting near full growth. I'd probably cut the population of that tank in half, if not more. Mean time, you should probably be doing 25-30% water changes each week to try to maintain a fairly stable water chemistry, and not rely on products to do the work for you. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Roberts Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 4:58 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s you can see what I have...I have started a page on my site, but haven't completed it. It does have a good listing of my fish... http://ww.witchnet.org/aquarium.cfm Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 3:07 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s For easier maintenance in the future: While I don't know the fish- load you are dealing with (unless I missed that part), you might try 33% water changes every week (as many hobbyists normally do) instead of 20% every two weeks. The necessity of this naturally depends on your fish load, but if your nitrates were up to 160, I'd have to say you may possibly have a somewhat heavy fish-load. A 20% change is practically nothing anyway -- that much of a water change would bring your nitrates down to 128, and that's with refilling with fresh water that has absolutely no nitrates in it. After a two week period, enough time has gone by that the amount of nitrate you took out has been replaced (and then some) from the break-down of fish waste. It just keeps escalating -- its a case of too little - too late! You shouldn't need to put nitrate absorber in your filter. Just change more water more frequently, or lessen your fish-load. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > I just did daily water changes as well a a good deep cleaning of the gravel. > I put the bags of nitrate/nitrite/phosphate absorber in my filters just to > help get rid of what was already in the water. I think this is what has > helped as water changes prior to this did not effect the nitrate levels. I > don;t think it was from over feeding. We did have that problem, but I > reduced the amount of food, plus got some critters that will mop up the > uneaten food. I haven't added any fertilizers for my plants as of yet, so > that is not the source. I am not sure where all the excess nitrates are > coming from. I normally do a 20% water change every 2 weeks. So I haven't > figured out the source. My only thought is that it may have had something > to do with my UGF. I turned it off as I am slowly adding plants and that is > when the nitrate levels went down to 40 (same day as I added the absorbing > material). This was something that has happened over the past few weeks, so > it was the extended exposure to high nitrate levels that I was concerned > about. I lost 2 of my spiny eels in the past week, so I think that may have > been the cause. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Steve Szabo > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 9:39 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > 160 ppm is a ways away from killing your fish. Over a long term it may cause > problems in your fish, bit is nothing to panic over as you do have plenty of > time to determine the problem and reduce the presence of the nitrate without > taking any drastic actions. > > Now, if we were talking a reef tank here, that would be a whole other > ballgame, and your tank would be essentially dead. But, we are not, and your > tank would have been OK without rushing about to "do something" about the > nitrates. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Eric Roberts > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 1:39 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > I just had a major issue with nitrates...they shot up through the roof (and > I have some plants). I got some of the nitrate sponges to soak some of them > up before they kill my fish. I have been doing 20 % water changes every day > and after about a week, they got down to 40 ppm...they were as high as 160 > at one point. One of my tasks is to get more plants and more light. I am > designing a hood for my 55 gal tank, so once I get that all in place, I > should be fine...or at least I hope. I am also getting rid of my gravel > eventually and replacing it with sand. This of course means no more UGF, > but it looks a lot nicer. I set up my 20 gal to house some of my smaller > fish and some ghost shrimp that I got for food for my larger fish and I used > the Tahitian moonlight black sand. It looks awesome with that. I will be > switching over to that in the next month or so in the big tank. The only > thing I don;t like about the sand is it is a real PIA to get clean. When I > was setting up the 20 gal, I thought I had it clean, but ended up having to > empty out the tank and refilling it after cleaning the gravel once > again...ugg. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 10:37 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. This > should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in there > to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not > overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should not > get a chance to multiply. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > What is a "safe" number regarding nitrates? Everything is testing 0 > but > > of course I am getting a reading on nitrates, seems to be at 20 ppm. > > The reason I ask is due to this seemingly minor algae bloom. I've > seen > > others have this and then a full out mess within days. I don't want > > that. > > Anyhow, safe nitrate number? > > Thanks > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13328	From: harry perry	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Clean filters or change them?/What filter?

I run Whispers on all my tanks. I only clean the filter once a month. At some point in time the carbon will become saturated and reverses itself. It will no longer filter the tank. I can go as long as 6 months this way with crystal clear water. Harry Beth Brownell <spencer_creek_studios@...> wrote: Hi Eric, I change my filters each week, as the fish poo builds up quite fast in my 30 gallon tank. And I do a monthly tank cleaning and remove about 90% of the water leaving enough water for my fish to remain in the tank. Only once did I remove my fish from my tank and did a complete cleaning of it and all I had was my algea eater 'Polly'. He later died about five months later. He also ate tubifex worms which was hilarious to watch him do so. Beth > Message: 19 > Date: Thu, 14 Jul 2005 21:32:43 -0000 > From: "Eric Miner" <eminer1254@...> > Subject: Clean filters or change them? > > Hello, > > I've read differing opinons on this. Should one carefully clean out a filter and reuse it or should it be replaced. I have a Marineland Penquin 350B Bio-wheel power filter. The concern is if I replace the filters how much, if any, effect will this have on the bio filter? The Bio-wheels are designed to increase the surface area for the bacterial > > Thanks, > > Eric M. http://fa.f-realm.com/ Fanfiction Axis. http://e.webring.com/hub?ring=siriusblack Sirius Black webring. http://e.webring.com/hub?ring=remuslupin Remus Lupin webring http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sailorsenshiocs/ for all original and series characters of Sailor Moon. http://www.livejournal.com/userinfo.bml?user=tropical_fishes Tropical fish tank livejournal community. ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13329	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s/ Steve

Leslie, You are asking a question I cannot answer for you about the algae on the driftwood. It really depends on your sense of aesthetics and the kind of algae it is. If you are trying to get live plants growing, you may need to get them going pretty quick, before this algae gets a good foothold. What you might want to do is to suspend a philodendron over the rear of the tank with the roots trailing in the water. Pretty much guaranteed that your philodendron will take off, and the nitrogenous product levels in your tank will go down, fairly quickly. This will help fight off the algal growth as well. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Dane & Leslie Moore Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 3:00 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Nitrate #s/ Steve That's good to hear, that it will likely go away. I haven't tried to treat it with anything other than blocking than side from the light source. I do keep the lights to a minimum as it's naturally bright in that room anyway. They don't seem to care. When I do turn on the light, they all go nuts as they know it's feeding time. =) This tank is new, used BioSpira for a quicky, so that is likely what this is. There is algae growth on the drift wood, is that OK? It's not much, but it is ugly. Leslie ---------------------------- Probably less than 100. However, that may not be your concern here, really. Yes algae uses nitrates, but they also use other compounds and elements found in water that we do not normally measure. An example would be phosphates. Also needed is light. A lack of competition from other plants also contributes to algal growth. If this is a new tank, it is quite common for an algal or bacterial bloom to occur. Usually the blooms are rather short lived, relatively speaking, and will run their course, unless, of course, you try to "cure" the bloom. A reduction in light would be a good first step, unless you have live plants that need a well lit environment. If this is the case, then it is just a matter of time before the algae is out competed for food. One thing to remember is that there is really no such thing as an algae free tank. There will always be algae is some form, in some amount, in your tank. The idea is to control it and minimize it. Is some tanks, with certain fish, it is a welcome plant. \\Steve// -- 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13330	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: fish stress

The former--hands down. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 9:34 PM To: mnaquarium@yahoogroups.com; AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] fish stress For future reference: Which would cause your fish more stress- chasing them around a 150 gallon tank, netting them and putting them in a holding tank then moving them back, or removing the plants, rocks and wood and rearranging their tank with them in it? Linda

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13331	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Job Opening, DC Metro Area

Posted from another list. If you are in the DC metro area (Washington, DC, Northern VA, Maryland) and want to work with fish, this may be your chance to do so: If anyone is interested in a job working with fish, check this out. Aquatic Specialist III Bethesda, MD Charles River Laboratories is seeking an Aquatic Specialist III in Bethesda, MD at NIH-NICHD. Responsibilities include aquatics husbandry with zebra fish, sea urchins, frogs, and other aquatic and semi aquatic species; blood draws and other technical duties to assist the team of research scientists. Responsibilities also include the design and maintenance of aquatic housing systems, water quality testing, performance of health checks on animals, reporting of any abnormalities to attending veterinarian, and stock and maintenance of all NICHD aquatic facilities on the NIH campus. Some weekend and holiday work will be required. The Aquatic Specialist III will have a Bachelor's Degree in an Aquatic Science or a closely related field, with at least 1 yr of exp in aquatics. Del Sowell 945 Russell Ave Suite B Gaithersburg, MD 20879 240-631-8891 phone 240-631-8895 fax dsowell@... Charles River Laboratories is an affirmative action, equal opportunity employer. Charles River Laboratories You may Email your resume directly to the Human Resources Department at _jobs@..._ (mailto:jobs@...) .Please do not forward your resumes to our comments@... e-mail address. \\Steve// "Puritanism: The haunting fear that someone, somewhere may be happy." -- H. L. Mencken

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13332	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s/ Steve

Will do. Much obliged. =) -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 9:09 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Nitrate #s/ Steve Leslie, You are asking a question I cannot answer for you about the algae on the driftwood. It really depends on your sense of aesthetics and the kind of algae it is. If you are trying to get live plants growing, you may need to get them going pretty quick, before this algae gets a good foothold. What you might want to do is to suspend a philodendron over the rear of the tank with the roots trailing in the water. Pretty much guaranteed that your philodendron will take off, and the nitrogenous product levels in your tank will go down, fairly quickly. This will help fight off the algal growth as well. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Dane & Leslie Moore Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 3:00 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Nitrate #s/ Steve That's good to hear, that it will likely go away. I haven't tried to treat it with anything other than blocking than side from the light source. I do keep the lights to a minimum as it's naturally bright in that room anyway. They don't seem to care. When I do turn on the light, they all go nuts as they know it's feeding time. =) This tank is new, used BioSpira for a quicky, so that is likely what this is. There is algae growth on the drift wood, is that OK? It's not much, but it is ugly. Leslie ---------------------------- Probably less than 100. However, that may not be your concern here, really. Yes algae uses nitrates, but they also use other compounds and elements found in water that we do not normally measure. An example would be phosphates. Also needed is light. A lack of competition from other plants also contributes to algal growth. If this is a new tank, it is quite common for an algal or bacterial bloom to occur. Usually the blooms are rather short lived, relatively speaking, and will run their course, unless, of course, you try to "cure" the bloom. A reduction in light would be a good first step, unless you have live plants that need a well lit environment. If this is the case, then it is just a matter of time before the algae is out competed for food. One thing to remember is that there is really no such thing as an algae free tank. There will always be algae is some form, in some amount, in your tank. The idea is to control it and minimize it. Is some tanks, with certain fish, it is a welcome plant. \\Steve// -- 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Yahoo! Groups Links ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13333	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Clean filters or change them?

I replaced the filter that came with both my marineland filters and now just use sponge material, no carbon. I do not replace this sponge material at all, I just rinse it in tank water every other week to once a month. Much more economical and works great! I clean the entire filter about once a month. I think the effect of changing your filter material will depend on how long your tank has been running. When we switched the material, we put the sponge on top of the filter that came with the tank so the new material could get a little colony built up before the change over. Just a thought :) --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Miner" <eminer1254@y...> wrote: > Hello, > > I've read differing opinons on this. Should one carefully clean out a > filter and reuse it or should it be replaced. I have a Marineland > Penquin 350B Bio-wheel power filter. The concern is if I replace the > filters how much, if any, effect will this have on the bio filter? The > Bio-wheels are designed to increase the surface area for the bacterial > > Thanks, > > Eric M.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13334	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: fish stress

I only have a 37 gallon tank but when we switched it around, we left the fish in there and they did just fine... were quite inquisive, in fact. I am not sure this helps any since it's a MUCH smaller tank than yours!! I am only slighly jealous :) --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > For future reference: > > Which would cause your fish more stress- > chasing them around a 150 gallon tank, netting them and putting them in a > holding tank then moving them back, or removing the plants, rocks and wood and > rearranging their tank with them in it? > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13335	From: Patrick	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Clean filters or change them?

It is wasteful to ever change a filter cartridge before it starts to break apart. These things can be cleaned with a water hose to the point that they look new. Last month I cleaned one that had been in use for 6 months. I will clean it again in the fall, and it should be good until next spring. Patrick [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13336	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)

I remember reading somewhere that they absorb some oxygen through their stomache. In a message dated 7/14/2005 6:04:52 PM Pacific Daylight Time, Crazy4fids@... writes: I wonder what is behind that behavior? Aren't cories able to breath regular air like the gouramis? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13337	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Clean filters or change them?

That is what I do until they just get so internally clogged that water flow is restricted and it is overflowing near the intake tube (I have a penguin 100, a Whisper 20-40, and an Eclipse 2 hood) Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Patrick Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 10:38 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Clean filters or change them? It is wasteful to ever change a filter cartridge before it starts to break apart. These things can be cleaned with a water hose to the point that they look new. Last month I cleaned one that had been in use for 6 months. I will clean it again in the fall, and it should be good until next spring. Patrick [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13338	From: paul helms	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Clean filters or change them?

depends on what you are using the pads for. if you want the carbon to do anything, replace it every 3-5 weeks. if it is just being used to catch debris...they clean it out. --- Eric Miner <eminer1254@...> wrote: > Hello, > > I've read differing opinons on this. Should one > carefully clean out a > filter and reuse it or should it be replaced. I have > a Marineland > Penquin 350B Bio-wheel power filter. The concern is > if I replace the > filters how much, if any, effect will this have on > the bio filter? The > Bio-wheels are designed to increase the surface area > for the bacterial > > Thanks, > > Eric M. > > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13339	From: paul helms	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)

they would be fine as long as you don't get the clawed frog --- Crazy4fids@... wrote: > My kids (and husband) have been bugging me to get a > dwarf aquatic frog. > > How would they be with angelfish, keyholes, tetras, > and cories? > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13340	From: paul helms	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

if you are talking about the salt water dragonfish or dragon goby that has a starburst pattern around its eyes, they are not difficult to keep but love to eat hermits and snails! --- Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote: > i see you have violet gobies, aka dragonfish. i saw > one of those @ petsmart awhile back and was > interested in them. but then heard that they're > rather hard to keep. have you found this to be > true? > > --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > > > It's been fine for the past few months. The main > reason I do the amount of > > water change is it is 2 bucket loads (10 gallons) > I will try going to 3 > > bucket loads from now on and see if that helps. > What bothered me was that > > even after the water change, there was no change > in the amount of nitrates. > > In any case...the levels have been down to 40 ppm > for the past 2 days. I am > > also in the process of getting more plants, so > that should help the nitrate > > levels as well. Unfortunately I lost a couple of > my spiny eels in the > > process :-( Once I get more plants in, I will > remove the nitrate sponge and > > see if the ntrate level stabilizes or spikes > again. BTW...I also did move > > my 7 Danios out of the main tank and put them into > the tank with the ghost > > shrimp as the dannies are too small to try and eat > the shrimp. > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > > Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 3:07 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > For easier maintenance in the future: While I > don't know the fish- > > load you are dealing with (unless I missed that > part), you might try > > 33% water changes every week (as many hobbyists > normally do) instead > > of 20% every two weeks. The necessity of this > naturally depends on > > your fish load, but if your nitrates were up to > 160, I'd have to say > > you may possibly have a somewhat heavy fish-load. > A 20% change is > > practically nothing anyway -- that much of a water > change would bring > > your nitrates down to 128, and that's with > refilling with fresh water > > that has absolutely no nitrates in it. After a > two week period, > > enough time has gone by that the amount of nitrate > you took out has > > been replaced (and then some) from the break-down > of fish waste. It > > just keeps escalating -- its a case of too little > - too late! You > > shouldn't need to put nitrate absorber in your > filter. Just change > > more water more frequently, or lessen your > fish-load. Ray > > \ > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" > <woad@w...> wrote: > > > I just did daily water changes as well a a good > deep cleaning of > > the gravel. > > > I put the bags of nitrate/nitrite/phosphate > absorber in my filters > > just to > > > help get rid of what was already in the water. > I think this is > > what has > > > helped as water changes prior to this did not > effect the nitrate > > levels. I > > > don;t think it was from over feeding. We did > have that problem, > > but I > > > reduced the amount of food, plus got some > critters that will mop up > > the > > > uneaten food. I haven't added any fertilizers > for my plants as of > > yet, so > > > that is not the source. I am not sure where all > the excess > > nitrates are > > > coming from. I normally do a 20% water change > every 2 weeks. So I > > haven't > > > figured out the source. My only thought is that > it may have had > > something > > > to do with my UGF. I turned it off as I am > slowly adding plants > > and that is > > > when the nitrate levels went down to 40 (same > day as I added the > > absorbing > > > material). This was something that has happened > over the past few > > weeks, so > > > it was the extended exposure to high nitrate > levels that I was > > concerned > > > about. I lost 2 of my spiny eels in the past > week, so I think that > > may have > > > been the cause. > > > > > > Eric > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > Behalf Of Steve Szabo > > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 9:39 PM > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > > > > 160 ppm is a ways away from killing your fish. > Over a long term it > > may cause > > > problems in your fish, bit is nothing to panic > over as you do have > > plenty of > > > time to determine the problem and reduce the > presence of the > > nitrate without > > > taking any drastic actions. > > > > > > Now, if we were talking a reef tank here, that > would be a whole > > other > > > ballgame, and your tank would be essentially > dead. But, we are not, > > and your > > > tank would have been OK without rushing about to > "do something" > > about the > > > nitrates. > > > > > > \\Steve// > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > Behalf Of Eric Roberts > > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 1:39 PM > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > I just had a major issue with nitrates...they > shot up through the > > roof (and > > > I have some plants). I got some of the nitrate > sponges to soak > > some of them > > > up before they kill my fish. I have been doing > 20 % water changes > > every day > > > and after about a week, they got down to 40 > ppm...they were as high > > as 160 > > > at one point. One of my tasks is to get more > plants and more > > light. I am > > > designing a hood for my 55 gal tank, so once I > get that all in > > place, I > > > should be fine...or at least I hope. I am also > getting rid of my > > gravel > > > eventually and replacing it with sand. This of > course means no > > more UGF, > > > but it looks a lot nicer. I set up my 20 gal to > house some of my > > smaller > > > fish and some ghost shrimp that I got for food > for my larger fish > > and I used > > > the Tahitian moonlight black sand. It looks > awesome with that. I > > will be > === message truncated === ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13341	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Clean filters or change them?/What filter?

I have Whispers in my tanks. The filter gets to the point where it comes out the other opening than going through the filter itself. I would lift it out and one side is covered in fish poo and I just pitch it and put in a fresh one. And that is done every week. Beth --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, harry perry <harryfisherman@y...> wrote: > I run Whispers on all my tanks. I only clean the filter once a month. At some point in time the carbon will become saturated and reverses itself. It will no longer filter the tank. I can go as long as 6 months this way with crystal clear water. > > Harry > > Beth Brownell <spencer_creek_studios@y...> wrote: > Hi Eric, > > I change my filters each week, as the fish poo builds > up quite fast in my 30 gallon tank. > And I do a monthly tank cleaning and remove about 90% > of the water leaving enough water for my fish to > remain in the tank. > Only once did I remove my fish from my tank and did a > complete cleaning of it and all I had was my algea > eater 'Polly'. He later died about five months later. > He also ate tubifex worms which was hilarious to watch > him do so. > > Beth > > http://fa.f-realm.com/ Fanfiction Axis. > http://e.webring.com/hub?ring=siriusblack Sirius Black webring. > http://e.webring.com/hub?ring=remuslupin Remus Lupin webring > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sailorsenshiocs/ for all original and series characters of Sailor Moon. > http://www.livejournal.com/userinfo.bml?user=tropical_fishes Tropical fish tank livejournal community.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13342	From: paul helms	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Clean filters or change them?/What filter?

you must really be overfeeding to clog it in 1 week? --- Beth Brownell <spencer_creek_studios@...> wrote: > I have Whispers in my tanks. The filter gets to the > point where it > comes out the other opening than going through the > filter itself. > I would lift it out and one side is covered in fish > poo and I just > pitch it and put in a fresh one. And that is done > every week. > > Beth > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, harry perry > <harryfisherman@y...> > wrote: > > I run Whispers on all my tanks. I only clean the > filter once a > month. At some point in time the carbon will become > saturated and > reverses itself. It will no longer filter the tank. > I can go as long > as 6 months this way with crystal clear water. > > > > Harry > > > > Beth Brownell <spencer_creek_studios@y...> wrote: > > Hi Eric, > > > > I change my filters each week, as the fish poo > builds > > up quite fast in my 30 gallon tank. > > And I do a monthly tank cleaning and remove about > 90% > > of the water leaving enough water for my fish to > > remain in the tank. > > Only once did I remove my fish from my tank and > did a > > complete cleaning of it and all I had was my algea > > eater 'Polly'. He later died about five months > later. > > He also ate tubifex worms which was hilarious to > watch > > him do so. > > > > Beth > > > > http://fa.f-realm.com/ Fanfiction Axis. > > http://e.webring.com/hub?ring=siriusblack Sirius > Black webring. > > http://e.webring.com/hub?ring=remuslupin Remus > Lupin webring > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sailorsenshiocs/ for > all original and > series characters of Sailor Moon. > > > http://www.livejournal.com/userinfo.bml?user=tropical_fishes > > Tropical fish tank livejournal community. > > > > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13343	From: paul helms	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)

getting a breathe of fresh air! they often smack their heads into the glass support in the middle of large tanks. they dart up so fast. one of the only fish to have a true bone skull instead of cartlidge. --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > We have an albino cory and a leopard cory. The > albino exhibits the same > behavior. It usually minds it's own business in the > corner of the tank, > then every so often it just darts to the surface and > back down...back to > minding it's own business. I wonder what is behind > that behavior? > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of The Dragon Hunter > Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 10:13 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] catfish whoops hit send > to quick.( corycatfsih) > > > That and cories have such a great personality. > There are times mine won't > do anything for hours, then suddenly will start > doing highspeed laps around > the tank. They've knocked Ataru and Goemon (my two > common plecs both just > over a foot long) right off of the glass and kept > going. Also love it when > they just suddenly dart to the top of the tank and > then dart back down. > They usually avoid my gouramis and rainbows when > they do that, but not > always. lol They also love playing follow the > leader when my dwarf frogs > get moving. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: <Deenerz@...> > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 3:50 AM > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] catfish whoops hit send > to quick.( corycatfsih) > > > I didn't either, I was trying to say that if she > stayed in the cory family, > she could get different sizes and colors for > variety. > Now Linda has got me thinking about starting up a > planted community tank and > getting some different cories to go in it. > > Mike > > In a message dated 7/14/2005 3:31:43 AM Pacific > Daylight Time, > FortWayneFish@... writes: > I really don't think the size of the cory catfish > would be to much of a > concern in a 150 gallon tank. > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when > replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when > replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the > web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13344	From: paul helms	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

it is pretty good stuff...i sell a lot of it. --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > Unfortunately they don;t list the actual size of the > product :-( I looked > for a few hours online to find info and couldn't. > It looks much courser > than beach sand is...I would guestimate at least > twice as big if not a bit > more. The CaribSea product is available at many pet > stores. I bought mine > from a mom and pop LFS but I do think I have seen it > at Petco as well. I > was also looking at a similar product from a local > supplier called Aquarium > Rock Emporium. One of the other mom and pop LFS' > carried their product. > > I called Carib Sea up and all I got was a voice > mail, so I am waiting for a > return call from them. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Steve Szabo > Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 5:59 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > I'll see if I can get a photo for you tonight. That > Carib Sea product looks > OK, but I'd like to see it in person first. It does > not look like sand in > the form that most people here are thinking of sand > (beach sand). > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Eric Roberts > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 11:27 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > this is the sand I used and am planning on using in > the 55 gal: > http://shop.petsmart.com/product/2534374302023693/2534374302030109/845524441 > 781393.htm > > I could not find a "mm", but it said extra fine. > Now as far as #2 gravel > goes, what should I be looking for? I looked online > and found this: > http://www.cayugalandscape.com/gardencenter/bulk_materials/bulkmaterials.htm > l That looks pretty big to me... > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Steve Szabo > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 9:44 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > Eric, > > That will not work either. The sand will find its > way down through the > gravel, and you'd be facing the same problem if you > had used all sand. > > What you may consider doing is using a finer gravel > than you normally would > find in a store. You should look at some #2 gravel, > which is finer than the > #3 gravel usually found in stores, and fairly good > for plants as it does > compact some, but not enough to disrupt root growth. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Eric Roberts > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 4:51 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > I am going to leave a layer of gravel underneatth > for plants to grow in... > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 2:38 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > Glad to see you got the nitrates under control. I > see you plan to > add more plants which should help towards this end. > Also notice that > you are planning to switch over to sand. While this > may look > awesome, you may have trouble trying to grow some of > those plants > you're thinking of getting as the finer sand has the > tendancy of > preventing proper root growth; its more compacted. > Ray > \ > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" > <woad@w...> wrote: > > I just had a major issue with nitrates...they shot > up through the > roof (and > > I have some plants). I got some of the nitrate > sponges to soak > some of them > > up before they kill my fish. I have been doing 20 > % water changes > every day > > and after about a week, they got down to 40 > ppm...they were as high > as 160 > > at one point. One of my tasks is to get more > plants and more > light. I am > > designing a hood for my 55 gal tank, so once I get > that all in > place, I > > should be fine...or at least I hope. I am also > getting rid of my > gravel > > eventually and replacing it with sand. This of > course means no > more UGF, > > but it looks a lot nicer. I set up my 20 gal to > house some of my > smaller > > fish and some ghost shrimp that I got for food for > my larger fish > and I used > > the Tahitian moonlight black sand. It looks > awesome with that. I > will be > > switching over to that in the next month or so in > the big tank. > The only > > thing I don;t like about the sand is it is a real > PIA to get > clean. When I > > was setting up the 20 gal, I thought I had it > clean, but ended up > having to > > empty out the tank and refilling it after cleaning > the gravel once > > again...ugg. > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 10:37 AM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end > of average. This > > should not be of any concern provided you have > enough plants in > there > > to constantly use this up as its being produced > (and you're not > > overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, > any algae should > not > > get a chance to multiply. > Ray > > > === message truncated === __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13345	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

This is the brackish to freshwater version...aka violet goby (Gobioides broussonetti). Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of paul helms Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 12:18 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s if you are talking about the salt water dragonfish or dragon goby that has a starburst pattern around its eyes, they are not difficult to keep but love to eat hermits and snails! --- Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote: > i see you have violet gobies, aka dragonfish. i saw > one of those @ petsmart awhile back and was > interested in them. but then heard that they're > rather hard to keep. have you found this to be > true? > > --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > > > It's been fine for the past few months. The main > reason I do the amount of > > water change is it is 2 bucket loads (10 gallons) > I will try going to 3 > > bucket loads from now on and see if that helps. > What bothered me was that > > even after the water change, there was no change > in the amount of nitrates. > > In any case...the levels have been down to 40 ppm > for the past 2 days. I am > > also in the process of getting more plants, so > that should help the nitrate > > levels as well. Unfortunately I lost a couple of > my spiny eels in the > > process :-( Once I get more plants in, I will > remove the nitrate sponge and > > see if the ntrate level stabilizes or spikes > again. BTW...I also did move > > my 7 Danios out of the main tank and put them into > the tank with the ghost > > shrimp as the dannies are too small to try and eat > the shrimp. > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > > Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 3:07 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > For easier maintenance in the future: While I > don't know the fish- > > load you are dealing with (unless I missed that > part), you might try > > 33% water changes every week (as many hobbyists > normally do) instead > > of 20% every two weeks. The necessity of this > naturally depends on > > your fish load, but if your nitrates were up to > 160, I'd have to say > > you may possibly have a somewhat heavy fish-load. > A 20% change is > > practically nothing anyway -- that much of a water > change would bring > > your nitrates down to 128, and that's with > refilling with fresh water > > that has absolutely no nitrates in it. After a > two week period, > > enough time has gone by that the amount of nitrate > you took out has > > been replaced (and then some) from the break-down > of fish waste. It > > just keeps escalating -- its a case of too little > - too late! You > > shouldn't need to put nitrate absorber in your > filter. Just change > > more water more frequently, or lessen your > fish-load. Ray > > \ > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" > <woad@w...> wrote: > > > I just did daily water changes as well a a good > deep cleaning of > > the gravel. > > > I put the bags of nitrate/nitrite/phosphate > absorber in my filters > > just to > > > help get rid of what was already in the water. > I think this is > > what has > > > helped as water changes prior to this did not > effect the nitrate > > levels. I > > > don;t think it was from over feeding. We did > have that problem, > > but I > > > reduced the amount of food, plus got some > critters that will mop up > > the > > > uneaten food. I haven't added any fertilizers > for my plants as of > > yet, so > > > that is not the source. I am not sure where all > the excess > > nitrates are > > > coming from. I normally do a 20% water change > every 2 weeks. So I > > haven't > > > figured out the source. My only thought is that > it may have had > > something > > > to do with my UGF. I turned it off as I am > slowly adding plants > > and that is > > > when the nitrate levels went down to 40 (same > day as I added the > > absorbing > > > material). This was something that has happened > over the past few > > weeks, so > > > it was the extended exposure to high nitrate > levels that I was > > concerned > > > about. I lost 2 of my spiny eels in the past > week, so I think that > > may have > > > been the cause. > > > > > > Eric > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > Behalf Of Steve Szabo > > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 9:39 PM > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > > > > 160 ppm is a ways away from killing your fish. > Over a long term it > > may cause > > > problems in your fish, bit is nothing to panic > over as you do have > > plenty of > > > time to determine the problem and reduce the > presence of the > > nitrate without > > > taking any drastic actions. > > > > > > Now, if we were talking a reef tank here, that > would be a whole > > other > > > ballgame, and your tank would be essentially > dead. But, we are not, > > and your > > > tank would have been OK without rushing about to > "do something" > > about the > > > nitrates. > > > > > > \\Steve// > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > Behalf Of Eric Roberts > > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 1:39 PM > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > I just had a major issue with nitrates...they > shot up through the > > roof (and > > > I have some plants). I got some of the nitrate > sponges to soak > > some of them > > > up before they kill my fish. I have been doing > 20 % water changes > > every day > > > and after about a week, they got down to 40 > ppm...they were as high > > as 160 > > > at one point. One of my tasks is to get more > plants and more > > light. I am > > > designing a hood for my 55 gal tank, so once I > get that all in > > place, I > > > should be fine...or at least I hope. I am also > getting rid of my > > gravel > > > eventually and replacing it with sand. This of > course means no > > more UGF, > > > but it looks a lot nicer. I set up my 20 gal to > house some of my > > smaller > > > fish and some ghost shrimp that I got for food > for my larger fish > > and I used > > > the Tahitian moonlight black sand. It looks > awesome with that. I > > will be > === message truncated === ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13346	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/14/2005
Subject: Re: Clean filters or change them?

All I do during a weekly 25% PWC, is take the filter cartridge out of the HOB unit and swoosh the filter cartridge/pad/sponge around in the removed tank water to get all of the big stuff off of the filter. Then put the cartridge back in the HOB unit. The filter pad/sponge has more surface area per square inch than any other part of your tank and therefore has more nitrifying bacteria growing on it than anywhere else. Also, ALL of the water in the tank passes through the filter material so the bacteria colony really grows well on the filter pads/sponges. I know the filter companies recommend changing the filters monthly but that is because they are trying to sell filters. Do not change the filter pads/sponges until they are about to fall apart. In the few weeks prior to trashing one, put a new filter pad in the HOB unit/cartridge so it can start growing the proper nitrifying bacteria on it. Then when you trash the old filter, you do not risk putting your tank into a mini-cycle. Now, if you have two filter systems on your tank, you could probably get away with cleaning the filter pads/sponges good every other month, alternating them, so you would still have a fully cycled filter running at all times while the new one is re-building the nitrifying bacteria colony. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: Date: Thu, 14 Jul 2005 21:32:43 -0000 From: "Eric Miner" <eminer1254@...> Subject: Clean filters or change them? Hello, I've read differing opinions on this. Should one carefully clean out a filter and reuse it or should it be replaced. I have a Marineland Penguin 350B Bio-wheel power filter. The concern is if I replace the filters how much, if any, effect will this have on the bio filter? The Bio-wheels are designed to increase the surface area for the bacterial Thanks, Eric M. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13347	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: fish stress

When I do my vacuuming, I use the Python siphon and I also have one of the claw type things that I use to move ornaments around to vacuum under them (just a cheap plastic thing that was around $5.00 online). The fish move away from the Python and the ornaments when I am moving them around but it does not seem to stress the Goldfish out very much but the Pleco does get a little jittery. As soon as I stop, they go right back to normal. Now... on the rare occurrence when I do have to net a fish, I usually put an algae thin in the net and put the net in the tank and wait. Usually the fish you want will eventually swim into the net and then you lift it out. Other fish will also swim into the net to nibble on the algae thin but just jiggle the net and they leave. Their memory span is not very long and they will come back so you may have to jiggle the net a few times to get the right one. This even worked when I had to net a female Zebra Danio that the males got too rough with and nipped up her fins. I think in the long run, all of the fish become less afraid of the net and associate it with food... kind of pavlovian. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: Date: Thu, 14 Jul 2005 21:33:40 EDT From: Crazy4fids@... Subject: fish stress For future reference: Which would cause your fish more stress- chasing them around a 150 gallon tank, netting them and putting them in a holding tank then moving them back, or removing the plants, rocks and wood and rearranging their tank with them in it? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13348	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)

Linda, The dwarf frog will get along with all the those you mentioned. One problem though with frogs are that they are blind, or can't see well. Feeding them is a problem with food more or less having to be put in front of there mouths. The angelfish,keyholes and tetras might not let the frog get anything to eat. and I can not remember which frog is which. clawed and non clawed.. But one will stay small less then a quarter in size where the other will get bigger almost a half dollar size. The bigger frogs have been known to eat fish. ** Cory catfish have the ability to gulp air* somewhere some place i read an article about it. in there wild natural habitat during the dry season they sometimes end up in stagnent pools, so to help them survive they can come to surface to get some oxygen. rob Indiana In a message dated 7/14/2005 8:03:40 PM US Eastern Standard Time, Crazy4fids@... writes: My kids (and husband) have been bugging me to get a dwarf aquatic frog. How would they be with angelfish, keyholes, tetras, and cories? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13349	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

Black sand referd to as Moon sand is a nice substrate and usually #2. I don't know why but a lot of people say there plants actually grow better in it also. I think they are HIGH and the plants just look better against the black substrate myself. It will need to be rinsed pretty well, as the sand will have a fine powder in the bag from the sand particles rubbing each other and wearing them down. some of the sand also will float with air trapped inside.. use a 5 gallon bucket and rinse, rinse, rinse... rob Indiana USA In a message dated 7/14/2005 8:37:43 PM US Eastern Standard Time, steve@... writes: The gravel normally sold for aquarium use is #3 gravel, whether it be a fluorescent color, black or "natural". The sandy, gritty stuff you put on the bottom of a birdcage can be considered to be #1 gravel. The size of the grains of #2 gravel fall in between these two. Some of the stuff I found on the Caribsea site (http://www.carib-sea.com) look to be pretty close to #2 gravel, but it is pretty hard to tell, with no real way to really compare the size of the gravel. The stuff you were looking at in the links from one of the chain pet stores looks like it might be that size. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13350	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)

Noticed a few miscellaneous posts on this subject. While a few posters, like Harry and to some extent Linda, seem to know the reason behind this behavior, from what I read most do not fully understand why Cories behave in the way they do by making a mad dash to the surface. So it appears a brief explanation of this might be in order. Cories can and do "breathe" regular air, but not quite in the same manner as gourami's. These catfish do not have auxillary labyrinth respiratory organs as do gourami's, but instead take in a gulp of air at the surface and swallow it. The oxygen is then absorbed through the stomach. Why the sudden "mad dash"; could be something like we experience with apnea, when we "forget" to take a breath (lol). Ray \ -- - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > > In a message dated 7/14/2005 1:48:11 P.M. Central Standard Time, > woad@w... writes: > > I wonder what is behind that behavior? > > > Aren't cories able to breath regular air like the gouramis? > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13351	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)

Mike, didn't mean to slight you -- you too seem to have a complete understanding as to why Cories pull this crazy stunt, as indicated in your last post. Still a puzzle as to the sudden urgency. Could be they are running low on oxygen at that moment, with just using their gills. Best explanation I can come up with. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > Noticed a few miscellaneous posts on this subject. While a few > posters, like Harry and to some extent Linda, seem to know the reason > behind this behavior, from what I read most do not fully understand why > Cories behave in the way they do by making a mad dash to the surface. > So it appears a brief explanation of this might be in order. Cories > can and do "breathe" regular air, but not quite in the same manner as > gourami's. These catfish do not have auxillary labyrinth respiratory > organs as do gourami's, but instead take in a gulp of air at the > surface and swallow it. The oxygen is then absorbed through the > stomach. Why the sudden "mad dash"; could be something like we > experience with apnea, when we "forget" to take a breath (lol). Ray > \ -- > - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > > > > In a message dated 7/14/2005 1:48:11 P.M. Central Standard Time, > > woad@w... writes: > > > > I wonder what is behind that behavior? > > > > > > Aren't cories able to breath regular air like the gouramis? > > > > Linda > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13352	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: cories darting to sufrace

I thought I read somewhere that the air in their tummies helps the digestion process? I will have to look into that so I know. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13353	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: fish stress

This is all very interesting. Big split decisions among the group. This is how all my problems started. Remember I had to turn over all the gravel to get those little pond pebbles out? We did it as gently as possible and tried to do it a small section of the time. We left the large piece of wood in the tank so the fish would have something to hide around/under. Maybe it was a combination of only being in the tank a few days and then me up setting the whole tank? Once I am done medicating them, how much of a water change should I do? 50%? Is there anything I can run through the filters (other than carbon) to help clear up the water? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13354	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: Clean filters or change them?

With my Emperor 400, it can hold 4 of the store bought filter pads. I just alternate the one that I am changing every month. I replace one, clean two of them with the kitchen sprayer and the other the last one I rinse out in a bucket of tank water. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13355	From: daniel_roachus	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: Clean filters or change them?

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Miner" <eminer1254@y...> wrote: > Hello, > > I've read differing opinons on this. Should one carefully clean out a > filter and reuse it or should it be replaced. I have a Marineland > Penquin 350B Bio-wheel power filter. The concern is if I replace the > filters how much, if any, effect will this have on the bio filter? The > Bio-wheels are designed to increase the surface area for the bacterial > > Thanks, > > Eric M. My Juwel rekord tank has the filter box in the corner of the tank, it gives easy access to all the media, and is powered byu a single powerhead. I like the arrangement because it makes maintenance easy, and enables you to do it without killing too much bacteria. You can upgrade/swap the powerhead and it is only the powerhead that is changed. Every week or so - I change the mechanical filter. Every month I change the carbon Every six weeks I rinse one of the 3 filter sponges. Seems to work quite nicely...

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13356	From: Jo Baker	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)

It could be that they are bottom dwellers and the swim to the surface makes them vulnerable to predation. Better to be quick than a quick snack. ----- Original Message ----- From: Ray Wetzel To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 7:30 AM Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih) Mike, didn't mean to slight you -- you too seem to have a complete understanding as to why Cories pull this crazy stunt, as indicated in your last post. Still a puzzle as to the sudden urgency. Could be they are running low on oxygen at that moment, with just using their gills. Best explanation I can come up with. Ray \ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13357	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: fish stress

Split decision? I wasn't aware of that. While your working around in the tank moving rocks, etc. may temporarily upset the fish, actually physically removing them from their environment is certainly much more stressful to them. I would think most people would have to agree. No fish likes to be netted (physically restrained) and then lifted out of its element no matter how brief. I'm not even considering the chasing that can go on especially if you use only one net. By the way, as we all need to net fish sooner or later (unless we guide them into an open submersed bag, as should be done with larger fish), less stress and much less chasing is done when two nets are used -- one still one, to finally capture the fish and one moving one to guide it in. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > This is all very interesting. Big split decisions among the group. > > This is how all my problems started. Remember I had to turn over all the > gravel to get those little pond pebbles out? We did it as gently as possible > and tried to do it a small section of the time. We left the large piece of > wood in the tank so the fish would have something to hide around/under. Maybe > it was a combination of only being in the tank a few days and then me up > setting the whole tank? > > Once I am done medicating them, how much of a water change should I do? 50%? > Is there anything I can run through the filters (other than carbon) to help > clear up the water? > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13358	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)

Very Possible -- You make a very good point; I never thought of that. \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Jo Baker" <audralee@c...> wrote: > It could be that they are bottom dwellers and the swim to the surface makes them vulnerable to predation. Better to be quick than a quick snack. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Ray Wetzel > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 7:30 AM > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih) > > > Mike, didn't mean to slight you -- you too seem to have a complete > understanding as to why Cories pull this crazy stunt, as indicated in > your last post. Still a puzzle as to the sudden urgency. Could be > they are running low on oxygen at that moment, with just using their > gills. Best explanation I can come up with. Ray > \ > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13359	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: styrofoam box cooling disaster!!!!!!!

I must have done something seriously wrong, so I wanted to warn everyone here before anyone else makes the same mistake. I decided to try the styrofoam box method first on my 10 gallon minnow tank, so I filled up some ziplock freezer bags with ice (mistake #1) and I rigged up the system with a larger pump to put more air through. I got two cute little fans to blow over the water surface. All was well Wednesday night. Well, I spent the night at my boyfriend's house and didn't get home till late thursday night/friday morning around 2am (mistake #2). I came in to a horrible noise from the filter on the side of the tank which was no longer submerged, and found that the water level had gone down to only a couple inches at the bottom of the tank! OMG!!! There was water all over the rug under the two aquarium stands, and then I checked the styrofoam box. OMG somehow the water had escaped from the bags, leaked everywhere, and the air pump was submerged and overheated. I put the box in the bathtub to contain the water while I cleaned up. After I got things partially under control, I examined the damage. The water had heated up and melted and distorted the pump, and an all-too-familiar autoclave smell surrounded the box and its contents. It could have been really bad. As of last night the fish were fine so I hope they will be okay. I hooked up another air pump without a box this time, and ran one small fan over the top of the water. Maybe when the air pump fried it sucked the water back out of the tank. Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13360	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: walmart and goldfish was...FREE Pacu! In Minneapolis( peoples r

Great idea ray, thank you! I'll look into that and see about leaving a lamp on at night just in case until then. I sleep there almost every night so I can check on things. Eyeball (as we call her) has been cause for so much worry over the years; I think we've had her for about 2.5 years now because we got her before we got the rats. Emily Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote: Emily, So glad to hear the Black Moor's eye is healing up. Here is a typical example of why a small night light may be something to consider in the future. There is the distinct possibility that this accident may never have happened if the tank wasn't in total darkness. Fortunately, this accident doesn't have a tragic end, like the loss of an eye. Good thing it wasn't more serious. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Emily Tenczar wrote: > My first fish as a child were a couple of feeder goldfish. They lived in a fish bowl of course. Now I was a little kid and I'm wondering why my parents didn't check into this, but I'm assuming that they thought the pet store would know something about goldfish and they never told us not to house them in fish bowls. When I got my first goldfish since then (the black moor) at least someone had sense enough to tell me not to get two goldfish at once straight up. I had her in a large critter keeper with a filter until I picked up a larger tank. By the way, her eye is healing up nicely and a small fan seems to be making her and her buddies happier :) > > Still, it's a lot of trial and error. > > One time I went into walmart and was so frustrated with seeing sick fish and talking to morons that work there that I decided to leave a note on the whiteboard. Imagine how shocked I was the next time I went there and saw a note saying not to sell any fish in a particular tank because they were being treated. A small step in the right direction. > Emily > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13361	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: Argh...So mad w/ LFS/animal abuse./To Patrick again

which animal are you talking about? Emily harry perry <harryfisherman@...> wrote: Or how about folks in the midwest losing their homes to fire because an enendangered species lives in the undergrowth that can't be cut by law. I live in the real world Patrick and anything is possible. Harry Patrick wrote: I can just see a 6 foot man going to jail for abusing a 2 inch fish. Here in the real world fish are about as high up on the "protected" list as a roach or mosquito. Face it, only animal rights wackos and fish lovers even think about this, and the animal rights wackos want all pet ownership ended anyway so they are worse than the fish stores that are bad. Maybe this could be discussed somewhere else? Patrick -------Original Message------- Animal abuse is a crime in most areas. Call your local government or township building. Shut him/her down. Write your local newspaper, they love stories like this. There is a lot you can do. Harry [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13362	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: algae was Nitrate #s

i just scrape it off if it gets too thick on the front. Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote:i meant when it covers the front of the tank. i usually don't mind it in the back. but when it's on the front it doesn't look so great. --- Emily Tenczar wrote: > I don't think so. I think the dark green algae makes a lovely background. It took over one of my > betta tanks. I only scraped it off the front side of the tank, and I added some snails who > decided to go crazy and populate amongst the greenery :) > Emily > > Valeen Gonzalez wrote: > LOL =) and it obscures your view of the tank! > > --- Dane & Leslie Moore wrote: > > > It's ugly? ;) > > > > Subject: [AquaticLife] algae was Nitrate #s > > > > > > what is the problem with algae anyway? Isn't it good for the tank since > > it eats up nitrates? Emily > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if > CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: > old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13363	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: algae was Nitrate #s

I have several kinds of snails, but the ones that really go nuts are those small spiral cone-shaped snails. I have snails of all sizes and they have babies all the time. I guess if I get too many of them....I will worry about it when it happens. But I really like them a lot. And the cone snails are so hardy compared to other snails ;) Emily Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: one other thing...since you used the plural, snails, I am assuming you have multiple snails that will multiply rapidly...hope you like snails ;-) Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Dane & Leslie Moore Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 2:25 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] algae was Nitrate #s ewwwwwww -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Emily Tenczar Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 1:30 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] algae was Nitrate #s I don't think so. I think the dark green algae makes a lovely background. It took over one of my betta tanks. I only scraped it off the front side of the tank, and I added some snails who decided to go crazy and populate amongst the greenery :) Emily Valeen Gonzalez wrote: LOL =) and it obscures your view of the tank! --- Dane & Leslie Moore wrote: > It's ugly? ;) > > Subject: [AquaticLife] algae was Nitrate #s > > > what is the problem with algae anyway? Isn't it good for the tank > since it eats up nitrates? Emily > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13364	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: styrofoam box cooling disaster!!!!!!!

You're probably right on the money. Most of the air pumps and air stones I buy include what I think they refer to as a valve check? (I know I'm probably wrong on the name) but what it is is a small plastic tube that you plug your air line into between the pump and the water, and its to prevent water from coming back up when the pump fails. Sometimes when a pump fails, it will actually do the opposite and create a brief suction on the air line, and what this little plastic valve does is to prevent a syphon from starting by closing when a suction starts. I've seen them sold seperatly for about a buck at a couple of LFS's. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Emily Tenczar" <bababanana@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 10:03 AM Subject: [AquaticLife] styrofoam box cooling disaster!!!!!!! I must have done something seriously wrong, so I wanted to warn everyone here before anyone else makes the same mistake. I decided to try the styrofoam box method first on my 10 gallon minnow tank, so I filled up some ziplock freezer bags with ice (mistake #1) and I rigged up the system with a larger pump to put more air through. I got two cute little fans to blow over the water surface. All was well Wednesday night. Well, I spent the night at my boyfriend's house and didn't get home till late thursday night/friday morning around 2am (mistake #2). I came in to a horrible noise from the filter on the side of the tank which was no longer submerged, and found that the water level had gone down to only a couple inches at the bottom of the tank! OMG!!! There was water all over the rug under the two aquarium stands, and then I checked the styrofoam box. OMG somehow the water had escaped from the bags, leaked everywhere, and the air pump was submerged and overheated. I put the box in the bathtub to contain the water while I cleaned up. After I got things partially under control, I examined the damage. The water had heated up and melted and distorted the pump, and an all-too-familiar autoclave smell surrounded the box and its contents. It could have been really bad. As of last night the fish were fine so I hope they will be okay. I hooked up another air pump without a box this time, and ran one small fan over the top of the water. Maybe when the air pump fried it sucked the water back out of the tank. Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13365	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: nails was algae was Nitrate #s

My black mystery just died :( I thought melafix and M2 wasn't supposed to hurt them, or maybe it just got old? Emily Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: We just picked up an apple snail. I also have a ton of little ramshorns in my gravel. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Emily Tenczar Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 1:32 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] algae was Nitrate #s true. snails snails snails!! emily Eric Roberts wrote: as long as it doesn't get out of hand. an bad algae bloom can cut off the light and kill plants as well as just look really bad. The water will turn green (hence the name green water) Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Emily Tenczar Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 11:51 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] algae was Nitrate #s what is the problem with algae anyway? Isn't it good for the tank since it eats up nitrates? Emily Ray Wetzel wrote: A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. This should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in there to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should not get a chance to multiply. Ray [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13366	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: algae was Nitrate #s

Thanks for the info!! This is good. I'm not too worried yet but it's something to keep in mind. Emily Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote: Emily, As has already been pointed out, most types of algae are unsightly (and can get invasive once it gets a foothold). But beyond that it can get dowright dangerous; something nobody ever considers. Usually (and fortunately), once the hobbyist realizes there is the start of a problem with algae taking over, they will either try to remedy the situation or seek help in doing so. The greater the algae culture in a tank, the more oxygen it is using up at night leaving all the less for the fish. Now consider for instance there is a bloom of suspended algae (green water) in a tank; it can reach a point where the disolved oxygen can no longer support it, resulting in a "crash", which results in even less available oxygen for the fish. The algae will use up more oxygen (at night) than it needs and as it crashes, a bacteria bloom (feeding on the dead algae) will take care of the rest of the oxygen, effectively killing off the fish. \ There are some types of algae which are preferred in certain situations, if kept under control, such as Spirogyra (filamentous algae) which looks similar to fine growing plants such as Nitella and Java Moss and has a limited use in fry rearing tanks. Some Rift Lake Cichlid hobbyists who keep algae-grazers (certain Mbunas, Tropheus species, etc.) encourage the growth of a healthy blanket type algae on the rockwork, but this specialty stuff is the exception. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Emily Tenczar wrote: > what is the problem with algae anyway? Isn't it good for the tank since it eats up nitrates? > Emily > > Ray Wetzel wrote: > A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. This > should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in there > to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not > overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should not > get a chance to multiply. Ray > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13367	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: styrofoam box cooling disaster!!!!!!!

interesting, i'll check into that. Emily The Dragon Hunter <dragon.hunter@...> wrote: You're probably right on the money. Most of the air pumps and air stones I buy include what I think they refer to as a valve check? (I know I'm probably wrong on the name) but what it is is a small plastic tube that you plug your air line into between the pump and the water, and its to prevent water from coming back up when the pump fails. Sometimes when a pump fails, it will actually do the opposite and create a brief suction on the air line, and what this little plastic valve does is to prevent a syphon from starting by closing when a suction starts. I've seen them sold seperatly for about a buck at a couple of LFS's. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Emily Tenczar" To: Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 10:03 AM Subject: [AquaticLife] styrofoam box cooling disaster!!!!!!! I must have done something seriously wrong, so I wanted to warn everyone here before anyone else makes the same mistake. I decided to try the styrofoam box method first on my 10 gallon minnow tank, so I filled up some ziplock freezer bags with ice (mistake #1) and I rigged up the system with a larger pump to put more air through. I got two cute little fans to blow over the water surface. All was well Wednesday night. Well, I spent the night at my boyfriend's house and didn't get home till late thursday night/friday morning around 2am (mistake #2). I came in to a horrible noise from the filter on the side of the tank which was no longer submerged, and found that the water level had gone down to only a couple inches at the bottom of the tank! OMG!!! There was water all over the rug under the two aquarium stands, and then I checked the styrofoam box. OMG somehow the water had escaped from the bags, leaked everywhere, and the air pump was submerged and overheated. I put the box in the bathtub to contain the water while I cleaned up. After I got things partially under control, I examined the damage. The water had heated up and melted and distorted the pump, and an all-too-familiar autoclave smell surrounded the box and its contents. It could have been really bad. As of last night the fish were fine so I hope they will be okay. I hooked up another air pump without a box this time, and ran one small fan over the top of the water. Maybe when the air pump fried it sucked the water back out of the tank. Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13368	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: algae was Nitrate #s

They can very easily get out of hand. I don;t even want to think about he numbers of the ramshorns (if you look very closely to their tiny shells, the curl looks like the curl of a ram's horn)...probably in the thousands...throughout the gravel. I can see them when I clean the gravel...I end up with several hundred tiny snails in the bottom of my water change bucket. I usually rinse it with tank water to free them from the bottom and dump them back in the tank. This is a definite benefit as it helps to oxygenate the gravel much like earthworms help to oxygenate the soil. Other species of snails can be harmful as they propagate in large numbers and can be hard to get rid of. It is because of that we have a single apple snail in the tank ;-) Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Emily Tenczar Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 12:50 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] algae was Nitrate #s I have several kinds of snails, but the ones that really go nuts are those small spiral cone-shaped snails. I have snails of all sizes and they have babies all the time. I guess if I get too many of them....I will worry about it when it happens. But I really like them a lot. And the cone snails are so hardy compared to other snails ;) Emily Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: one other thing...since you used the plural, snails, I am assuming you have multiple snails that will multiply rapidly...hope you like snails ;-) Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Dane & Leslie Moore Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 2:25 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] algae was Nitrate #s ewwwwwww -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Emily Tenczar Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 1:30 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] algae was Nitrate #s I don't think so. I think the dark green algae makes a lovely background. It took over one of my betta tanks. I only scraped it off the front side of the tank, and I added some snails who decided to go crazy and populate amongst the greenery :) Emily Valeen Gonzalez wrote: LOL =) and it obscures your view of the tank! --- Dane & Leslie Moore wrote: > It's ugly? ;) > > Subject: [AquaticLife] algae was Nitrate #s > > > what is the problem with algae anyway? Isn't it good for the tank > since it eats up nitrates? Emily > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! 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Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13369	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: nails was algae was Nitrate #s

It's supposed to be safe...not sure about the M2 though. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Emily Tenczar Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 12:51 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] nails was algae was Nitrate #s My black mystery just died :( I thought melafix and M2 wasn't supposed to hurt them, or maybe it just got old? Emily Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: We just picked up an apple snail. I also have a ton of little ramshorns in my gravel. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Emily Tenczar Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 1:32 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] algae was Nitrate #s true. snails snails snails!! emily Eric Roberts wrote: as long as it doesn't get out of hand. an bad algae bloom can cut off the light and kill plants as well as just look really bad. The water will turn green (hence the name green water) Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Emily Tenczar Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 11:51 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] algae was Nitrate #s what is the problem with algae anyway? Isn't it good for the tank since it eats up nitrates? Emily Ray Wetzel wrote: A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. This should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in there to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should not get a chance to multiply. Ray [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! 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Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13370	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)

i've had them with bettas and tetras in various tanks and they always worked out well. i'm not sure they'd work in tall tanks (what size tank do you have?) since they need to be able to get to the top for air. --- Crazy4fids@... wrote: > My kids (and husband) have been bugging me to get a dwarf aquatic frog. > > How would they be with angelfish, keyholes, tetras, and cories? > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13371	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

oh cool, it's good to hear a success story about them. how big are yours? --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > not really. The challenge with them is making sure they eat. I just make > sure I get some shrimp pellets in their caves and they get food. They have > really poor eyesight and can get beaten to a meal. We lost one early on, > but I think he was sick when we got him. Every fish we got from that store > has died. The other 2 I got at Petsmart and they are getting big and > healthy. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez > Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 4:33 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > i see you have violet gobies, aka dragonfish. i saw one of those @ petsmart > awhile back and was > interested in them. but then heard that they're rather hard to keep. have > you found this to be > true? > > --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > > > It's been fine for the past few months. The main reason I do the amount > of > > water change is it is 2 bucket loads (10 gallons) I will try going to 3 > > bucket loads from now on and see if that helps. What bothered me was that > > even after the water change, there was no change in the amount of > nitrates. > > In any case...the levels have been down to 40 ppm for the past 2 days. I > am > > also in the process of getting more plants, so that should help the > nitrate > > levels as well. Unfortunately I lost a couple of my spiny eels in the > > process :-( Once I get more plants in, I will remove the nitrate sponge > and > > see if the ntrate level stabilizes or spikes again. BTW...I also did move > > my 7 Danios out of the main tank and put them into the tank with the ghost > > shrimp as the dannies are too small to try and eat the shrimp. > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > > Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 3:07 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > For easier maintenance in the future: While I don't know the fish- > > load you are dealing with (unless I missed that part), you might try > > 33% water changes every week (as many hobbyists normally do) instead > > of 20% every two weeks. The necessity of this naturally depends on > > your fish load, but if your nitrates were up to 160, I'd have to say > > you may possibly have a somewhat heavy fish-load. A 20% change is > > practically nothing anyway -- that much of a water change would bring > > your nitrates down to 128, and that's with refilling with fresh water > > that has absolutely no nitrates in it. After a two week period, > > enough time has gone by that the amount of nitrate you took out has > > been replaced (and then some) from the break-down of fish waste. It > > just keeps escalating -- its a case of too little - too late! You > > shouldn't need to put nitrate absorber in your filter. Just change > > more water more frequently, or lessen your fish-load. Ray > > \ > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > > > I just did daily water changes as well a a good deep cleaning of > > the gravel. > > > I put the bags of nitrate/nitrite/phosphate absorber in my filters > > just to > > > help get rid of what was already in the water. I think this is > > what has > > > helped as water changes prior to this did not effect the nitrate > > levels. I > > > don;t think it was from over feeding. We did have that problem, > > but I > > > reduced the amount of food, plus got some critters that will mop up > > the > > > uneaten food. I haven't added any fertilizers for my plants as of > > yet, so > > > that is not the source. I am not sure where all the excess > > nitrates are > > > coming from. I normally do a 20% water change every 2 weeks. So I > > haven't > > > figured out the source. My only thought is that it may have had > > something > > > to do with my UGF. I turned it off as I am slowly adding plants > > and that is > > > when the nitrate levels went down to 40 (same day as I added the > > absorbing > > > material). This was something that has happened over the past few > > weeks, so > > > it was the extended exposure to high nitrate levels that I was > > concerned > > > about. I lost 2 of my spiny eels in the past week, so I think that > > may have > > > been the cause. > > > > > > Eric > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > Behalf Of Steve Szabo > > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 9:39 PM > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > > > > 160 ppm is a ways away from killing your fish. Over a long term it > > may cause > > > problems in your fish, bit is nothing to panic over as you do have > > plenty of > > > time to determine the problem and reduce the presence of the > > nitrate without > > > taking any drastic actions. > > > > > > Now, if we were talking a reef tank here, that would be a whole > > other > > > ballgame, and your tank would be essentially dead. But, we are not, > > and your > > > tank would have been OK without rushing about to "do something" > > about the > > > nitrates. > > > > > > \\Steve// > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > Behalf Of Eric Roberts > > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 1:39 PM > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > I just had a major issue with nitrates...they shot up through the > > roof (and > > > I have some plants). I got some of the nitrate sponges to soak > > some of them > > > up before they kill my fish. I have been doing 20 % water changes > > every day > > > and after about a week, they got down to 40 ppm...they were as high > > as 160 > > > at one point. One of my tasks is to get more plants and more > > light. I am > > > designing a hood for my 55 gal tank, so once I get that all in > > place, I > > > should be fine...or at least I hope. I am also getting rid of my > > gravel > > > eventually and replacing it with sand. This of course means no > > more UGF, > > > but it looks a lot nicer. I set up my 20 gal to house some of my > > smaller > > > fish and some ghost shrimp that I got for food for my larger fish > > and I used > > > the Tahitian moonlight black sand. It looks awesome with that. I > > will be > > > switching over to that in the next month or so in the big tank. > > The only > > > thing I don;t like about the sand is it is a real PIA to get > > clean. When I > > > was setting up the 20 gal, I thought I had it clean, but ended up > > having to > > > empty out the tank and refilling it after cleaning the gravel once > > > again...ugg. > > > > > > Eric > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 10:37 AM > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > > > > A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. This > > > should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in > > there > > > to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not > > > overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should > > not > > > get a chance to multiply. > > Ray > > > > > \ > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" > > > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > > > What is a "safe" number regarding nitrates? Everything is > > testing 0 > > > but > > > > of course I am getting a reading on nitrates, seems to be at 20 > > ppm. > > > > The reason I ask is due to this seemingly minor algae bloom. > > I've > > > seen > > > > others have this and then a full out mess within days. I don't > > want > > > > that. > > > > Anyhow, safe nitrate number? > > > > Thanks > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > ((((º> > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > > thanks. > > > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > > important to > > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > > the > > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > > Marine > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? > > t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > > > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? > > t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > > > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > > Service > > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > ((((º> > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > > thanks. > > > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > > important to > > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > > the > > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > ((((º> > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > > thanks. > > > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > > important to > > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > > the > > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > > Service > > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > Marine > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13372	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)

Won't the angel's try to eat him? Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 2:37 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih) i've had them with bettas and tetras in various tanks and they always worked out well. i'm not sure they'd work in tall tanks (what size tank do you have?) since they need to be able to get to the top for air. --- Crazy4fids@... wrote: > My kids (and husband) have been bugging me to get a dwarf aquatic frog. > > How would they be with angelfish, keyholes, tetras, and cories? > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13373	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: OOPS I mean "snails"...nails was algae was Nitrate #s

oops! Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote:It's supposed to be safe...not sure about the M2 though. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Emily Tenczar Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 12:51 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] nails was algae was Nitrate #s My black mystery just died :( I thought melafix and M2 wasn't supposed to hurt them, or maybe it just got old? Emily Eric Roberts wrote: We just picked up an apple snail. I also have a ton of little ramshorns in my gravel. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Emily Tenczar Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 1:32 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] algae was Nitrate #s true. snails snails snails!! emily Eric Roberts wrote: as long as it doesn't get out of hand. an bad algae bloom can cut off the light and kill plants as well as just look really bad. The water will turn green (hence the name green water) Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Emily Tenczar Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 11:51 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] algae was Nitrate #s what is the problem with algae anyway? Isn't it good for the tank since it eats up nitrates? Emily Ray Wetzel wrote: A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. This should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in there to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should not get a chance to multiply. Ray [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13374	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: algae was Nitrate #s

I want more ramshorns. how do I get them to reproduce? emily Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: They can very easily get out of hand. I don;t even want to think about he numbers of the ramshorns (if you look very closely to their tiny shells, the curl looks like the curl of a ram's horn)...probably in the thousands...throughout the gravel. I can see them when I clean the gravel...I end up with several hundred tiny snails in the bottom of my water change bucket. I usually rinse it with tank water to free them from the bottom and dump them back in the tank. This is a definite benefit as it helps to oxygenate the gravel much like earthworms help to oxygenate the soil. Other species of snails can be harmful as they propagate in large numbers and can be hard to get rid of. It is because of that we have a single apple snail in the tank ;-) Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Emily Tenczar Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 12:50 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] algae was Nitrate #s I have several kinds of snails, but the ones that really go nuts are those small spiral cone-shaped snails. I have snails of all sizes and they have babies all the time. I guess if I get too many of them....I will worry about it when it happens. But I really like them a lot. And the cone snails are so hardy compared to other snails ;) Emily Eric Roberts wrote: one other thing...since you used the plural, snails, I am assuming you have multiple snails that will multiply rapidly...hope you like snails ;-) Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Dane & Leslie Moore Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 2:25 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] algae was Nitrate #s ewwwwwww -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Emily Tenczar Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 1:30 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] algae was Nitrate #s I don't think so. I think the dark green algae makes a lovely background. It took over one of my betta tanks. I only scraped it off the front side of the tank, and I added some snails who decided to go crazy and populate amongst the greenery :) Emily Valeen Gonzalez wrote: LOL =) and it obscures your view of the tank! --- Dane & Leslie Moore wrote: > It's ugly? ;) > > Subject: [AquaticLife] algae was Nitrate #s > > > what is the problem with algae anyway? Isn't it good for the tank > since it eats up nitrates? Emily > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13375	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

i don't think they're saltwater. at petsmart they were in freshwater, but of course this doesn't necessarily mean anything =) the ones i saw at petsmart look kinda like eels. --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > if you are talking about the salt water dragonfish or > dragon goby that has a starburst pattern around its > eyes, they are not difficult to keep but love to eat > hermits and snails! > > --- Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote: > > > i see you have violet gobies, aka dragonfish. i saw > > one of those @ petsmart awhile back and was > > interested in them. but then heard that they're > > rather hard to keep. have you found this to be > > true? > > > > --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > > > > > It's been fine for the past few months. The main > > reason I do the amount of > > > water change is it is 2 bucket loads (10 gallons) > > I will try going to 3 > > > bucket loads from now on and see if that helps. > > What bothered me was that > > > even after the water change, there was no change > > in the amount of nitrates. > > > In any case...the levels have been down to 40 ppm > > for the past 2 days. I am > > > also in the process of getting more plants, so > > that should help the nitrate > > > levels as well. Unfortunately I lost a couple of > > my spiny eels in the > > > process :-( Once I get more plants in, I will > > remove the nitrate sponge and > > > see if the ntrate level stabilizes or spikes > > again. BTW...I also did move > > > my 7 Danios out of the main tank and put them into > > the tank with the ghost > > > shrimp as the dannies are too small to try and eat > > the shrimp. > > > > > > Eric > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > > > Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 3:07 PM > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > > > > For easier maintenance in the future: While I > > don't know the fish- > > > load you are dealing with (unless I missed that > > part), you might try > > > 33% water changes every week (as many hobbyists > > normally do) instead > > > of 20% every two weeks. The necessity of this > > naturally depends on > > > your fish load, but if your nitrates were up to > > 160, I'd have to say > > > you may possibly have a somewhat heavy fish-load. > > A 20% change is > > > practically nothing anyway -- that much of a water > > change would bring > > > your nitrates down to 128, and that's with > > refilling with fresh water > > > that has absolutely no nitrates in it. After a > > two week period, > > > enough time has gone by that the amount of nitrate > > you took out has > > > been replaced (and then some) from the break-down > > of fish waste. It > > > just keeps escalating -- its a case of too little > > - too late! You > > > shouldn't need to put nitrate absorber in your > > filter. Just change > > > more water more frequently, or lessen your > > fish-load. Ray > > > \ > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" > > <woad@w...> wrote: > > > > I just did daily water changes as well a a good > > deep cleaning of > > > the gravel. > > > > I put the bags of nitrate/nitrite/phosphate > > absorber in my filters > > > just to > > > > help get rid of what was already in the water. > > I think this is > > > what has > > > > helped as water changes prior to this did not > > effect the nitrate > > > levels. I > > > > don;t think it was from over feeding. We did > > have that problem, > > > but I > > > > reduced the amount of food, plus got some > > critters that will mop up > > > the > > > > uneaten food. I haven't added any fertilizers > > for my plants as of > > > yet, so > > > > that is not the source. I am not sure where all > > the excess > > > nitrates are > > > > coming from. I normally do a 20% water change > > every 2 weeks. So I > > > haven't > > > > figured out the source. My only thought is that > > it may have had > > > something > > > > to do with my UGF. I turned it off as I am > > slowly adding plants > > > and that is > > > > when the nitrate levels went down to 40 (same > > day as I added the > > > absorbing > > > > material). This was something that has happened > > over the past few > > > weeks, so > > > > it was the extended exposure to high nitrate > > levels that I was > > > concerned > > > > about. I lost 2 of my spiny eels in the past > > week, so I think that > > > may have > > > > been the cause. > > > > > > > > Eric > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > > Behalf Of Steve Szabo > > > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 9:39 PM > > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > > > > > > > 160 ppm is a ways away from killing your fish. > > Over a long term it > > > may cause > > > > problems in your fish, bit is nothing to panic > > over as you do have > > > plenty of > > > > time to determine the problem and reduce the > > presence of the > > > nitrate without > > > > taking any drastic actions. > > > > > > > > Now, if we were talking a reef tank here, that > > would be a whole > > > other > > > > ballgame, and your tank would be essentially > > dead. But, we are not, > > > and your > > > > tank would have been OK without rushing about to > > "do something" > > > about the > > > > nitrates. > > > > > > > > \\Steve// > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > > Behalf Of Eric Roberts > > > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 1:39 PM > > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > > > I just had a major issue with nitrates...they > > shot up through the > > > roof (and > > > > I have some plants). I got some of the nitrate > > sponges to soak > > > some of them > > > > up before they kill my fish. I have been doing > > 20 % water changes > > > every day > > > > and after about a week, they got down to 40 > > ppm...they were as high > > > as 160 > > > > at one point. One of my tasks is to get more > > plants and more > > > light. I am > > > > designing a hood for my 55 gal tank, so once I > > get that all in > > > place, I > > > > should be fine...or at least I hope. I am also > > getting rid of my > > > gravel > > > > eventually and replacing it with sand. This of > > course means no > > > more UGF, > > > > but it looks a lot nicer. I set up my 20 gal to > > house some of my > > > smaller > > > > fish and some ghost shrimp that I got for food > > for my larger fish > > > and I used > > > > the Tahitian moonlight black sand. It looks > > awesome with that. I > > > will be > > > === message truncated === > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13376	From: paul helms	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: styrofoam box cooling disaster!!!!!!!

a 1 dollar check valve would have stopped that from happening --- Emily Tenczar <bababanana@...> wrote: > I must have done something seriously wrong, so I > wanted to warn everyone here before anyone else > makes the same mistake. > > I decided to try the styrofoam box method first on > my 10 gallon minnow tank, so I filled up some > ziplock freezer bags with ice (mistake #1) and I > rigged up the system with a larger pump to put more > air through. I got two cute little fans to blow over > the water surface. All was well Wednesday night. > > Well, I spent the night at my boyfriend's house and > didn't get home till late thursday night/friday > morning around 2am (mistake #2). > > I came in to a horrible noise from the filter on the > side of the tank which was no longer submerged, and > found that the water level had gone down to only a > couple inches at the bottom of the tank! OMG!!! > There was water all over the rug under the two > aquarium stands, and then I checked the styrofoam > box. OMG somehow the water had escaped from the > bags, leaked everywhere, and the air pump was > submerged and overheated. I put the box in the > bathtub to contain the water while I cleaned up. > After I got things partially under control, I > examined the damage. The water had heated up and > melted and distorted the pump, and an > all-too-familiar autoclave smell surrounded the box > and its contents. > > It could have been really bad. As of last night the > fish were fine so I hope they will be okay. I hooked > up another air pump without a box this time, and ran > one small fan over the top of the water. > > Maybe when the air pump fried it sucked the water > back out of the tank. > Emily > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13377	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: algae was Nitrate #s

they just do. I prolly got mine from plants. If you look in your gravel, you will prolly find lots of them. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Emily Tenczar Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 2:53 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] algae was Nitrate #s I want more ramshorns. how do I get them to reproduce? emily Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: They can very easily get out of hand. I don;t even want to think about he numbers of the ramshorns (if you look very closely to their tiny shells, the curl looks like the curl of a ram's horn)...probably in the thousands...throughout the gravel. I can see them when I clean the gravel...I end up with several hundred tiny snails in the bottom of my water change bucket. I usually rinse it with tank water to free them from the bottom and dump them back in the tank. This is a definite benefit as it helps to oxygenate the gravel much like earthworms help to oxygenate the soil. Other species of snails can be harmful as they propagate in large numbers and can be hard to get rid of. It is because of that we have a single apple snail in the tank ;-) Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Emily Tenczar Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 12:50 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] algae was Nitrate #s I have several kinds of snails, but the ones that really go nuts are those small spiral cone-shaped snails. I have snails of all sizes and they have babies all the time. I guess if I get too many of them....I will worry about it when it happens. But I really like them a lot. And the cone snails are so hardy compared to other snails ;) Emily Eric Roberts wrote: one other thing...since you used the plural, snails, I am assuming you have multiple snails that will multiply rapidly...hope you like snails ;-) Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Dane & Leslie Moore Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 2:25 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] algae was Nitrate #s ewwwwwww -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Emily Tenczar Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 1:30 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] algae was Nitrate #s I don't think so. I think the dark green algae makes a lovely background. It took over one of my betta tanks. I only scraped it off the front side of the tank, and I added some snails who decided to go crazy and populate amongst the greenery :) Emily Valeen Gonzalez wrote: LOL =) and it obscures your view of the tank! --- Dane & Leslie Moore wrote: > It's ugly? ;) > > Subject: [AquaticLife] algae was Nitrate #s > > > what is the problem with algae anyway? Isn't it good for the tank > since it eats up nitrates? Emily > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13378	From: paul helms	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)

i am not sure that they are actually blind as mine see every bit of movement and swim all around my large rock structures never running in to them. the albinos may have a vision problem, but my dwarf africans have no problems seeing, swimming, moving or eating --- FortWayneFish@... wrote: > Linda, > The dwarf frog will get along with all the those you > mentioned. > One problem though with frogs are that they are > blind, or can't see well. > Feeding them is a problem with food more or less > having to be put in front of > there mouths. > > The angelfish,keyholes and tetras might not let the > frog get anything to eat. > > and I can not remember which frog is which. clawed > and non clawed.. But one > will stay small less then a quarter in size where > the other will get bigger > almost a half dollar size. The bigger frogs have > been known to eat fish. > > > ** Cory catfish have the ability to gulp air* > somewhere some place i read an > article about it. > > in there wild natural habitat during the dry season > they sometimes end up in > stagnent pools, so to help them survive they can > come to surface to get some > oxygen. > > rob > Indiana > > In a message dated 7/14/2005 8:03:40 PM US Eastern > Standard Time, > Crazy4fids@... writes: > My kids (and husband) have been bugging me to get a > dwarf aquatic frog. > > How would they be with angelfish, keyholes, tetras, > and cories? > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13379	From: paul helms	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

the fresh water dragojn goby gets kinda big, like around a foot i believe, and they are said to eat anything that fuits in their mouths, but i have not seen them go after anything when i had them in store. they seem to get along with the larger tetras, gouramis, etc but i would not put hem with guppies or neons or the like personally --- Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote: > i don't think they're saltwater. at petsmart they > were in freshwater, but of course this doesn't > necessarily mean anything =) > > the ones i saw at petsmart look kinda like eels. > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > if you are talking about the salt water dragonfish > or > > dragon goby that has a starburst pattern around > its > > eyes, they are not difficult to keep but love to > eat > > hermits and snails! > > > > --- Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> > wrote: > > > > > i see you have violet gobies, aka dragonfish. i > saw > > > one of those @ petsmart awhile back and was > > > interested in them. but then heard that they're > > > rather hard to keep. have you found this to be > > > true? > > > > > > --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > > > > > > > It's been fine for the past few months. The > main > > > reason I do the amount of > > > > water change is it is 2 bucket loads (10 > gallons) > > > I will try going to 3 > > > > bucket loads from now on and see if that > helps. > > > What bothered me was that > > > > even after the water change, there was no > change > > > in the amount of nitrates. > > > > In any case...the levels have been down to 40 > ppm > > > for the past 2 days. I am > > > > also in the process of getting more plants, so > > > that should help the nitrate > > > > levels as well. Unfortunately I lost a couple > of > > > my spiny eels in the > > > > process :-( Once I get more plants in, I will > > > remove the nitrate sponge and > > > > see if the ntrate level stabilizes or spikes > > > again. BTW...I also did move > > > > my 7 Danios out of the main tank and put them > into > > > the tank with the ghost > > > > shrimp as the dannies are too small to try and > eat > > > the shrimp. > > > > > > > > Eric > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > > > > Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 3:07 PM > > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > > > > > > > For easier maintenance in the future: While I > > > don't know the fish- > > > > load you are dealing with (unless I missed > that > > > part), you might try > > > > 33% water changes every week (as many > hobbyists > > > normally do) instead > > > > of 20% every two weeks. The necessity of this > > > naturally depends on > > > > your fish load, but if your nitrates were up > to > > > 160, I'd have to say > > > > you may possibly have a somewhat heavy > fish-load. > > > A 20% change is > > > > practically nothing anyway -- that much of a > water > > > change would bring > > > > your nitrates down to 128, and that's with > > > refilling with fresh water > > > > that has absolutely no nitrates in it. After > a > > > two week period, > > > > enough time has gone by that the amount of > nitrate > > > you took out has > > > > been replaced (and then some) from the > break-down > > > of fish waste. It > > > > just keeps escalating -- its a case of too > little > > > - too late! You > > > > shouldn't need to put nitrate absorber in your > > > filter. Just change > > > > more water more frequently, or lessen your > > > fish-load. Ray > > > > \ > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric > Roberts" > > > <woad@w...> wrote: > > > > > I just did daily water changes as well a a > good > > > deep cleaning of > > > > the gravel. > > > > > I put the bags of nitrate/nitrite/phosphate > > > absorber in my filters > > > > just to > > > > > help get rid of what was already in the > water. > > > I think this is > > > > what has > > > > > helped as water changes prior to this did > not > > > effect the nitrate > > > > levels. I > > > > > don;t think it was from over feeding. We > did > > > have that problem, > > > > but I > > > > > reduced the amount of food, plus got some > > > critters that will mop up > > > > the > > > > > uneaten food. I haven't added any > fertilizers > > > for my plants as of > > > > yet, so > > > > > that is not the source. I am not sure where > all > > > the excess > > > > nitrates are > > > > > coming from. I normally do a 20% water > change > > > every 2 weeks. So I > > > > haven't > > > > > figured out the source. My only thought is > that > > > it may have had > > > > something > > > > > to do with my UGF. I turned it off as I am > > > slowly adding plants > > > > and that is > > > > > when the nitrate levels went down to 40 > (same > > > day as I added the > > > > absorbing > > > > > material). This was something that has > happened > > > over the past few > > > > weeks, so > > > > > it was the extended exposure to high nitrate > > > levels that I was > > > > concerned > > > > > about. I lost 2 of my spiny eels in the > past > > > week, so I think that > > > > may have > > > > > been the cause. > > > > > > > > > > Eric > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > > > Behalf Of Steve Szabo > > > > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 9:39 PM > > > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 160 ppm is a ways away from killing your > fish. > > > Over a long term it > > > > may cause > > > > > problems in your fish, bit is nothing to > panic > > > over as you do have > > > > plenty of > > > > > time to determine the problem and reduce the > > > presence of the > > > > nitrate without > > > > > taking any drastic actions. > > > > > > > > > > Now, if we were talking a reef tank here, > that > === message truncated === __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour: http://tour.mail.yahoo.com/mailtour.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13380	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

They are technically brackish water fish, but do well in a well kept freshwater. If they are sick, however, they will not last long in freshwater. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 2:56 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s i don't think they're saltwater. at petsmart they were in freshwater, but of course this doesn't necessarily mean anything =) the ones i saw at petsmart look kinda like eels. --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > if you are talking about the salt water dragonfish or > dragon goby that has a starburst pattern around its > eyes, they are not difficult to keep but love to eat > hermits and snails! > > --- Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote: > > > i see you have violet gobies, aka dragonfish. i saw > > one of those @ petsmart awhile back and was > > interested in them. but then heard that they're > > rather hard to keep. have you found this to be > > true? > > > > --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > > > > > It's been fine for the past few months. The main > > reason I do the amount of > > > water change is it is 2 bucket loads (10 gallons) > > I will try going to 3 > > > bucket loads from now on and see if that helps. > > What bothered me was that > > > even after the water change, there was no change > > in the amount of nitrates. > > > In any case...the levels have been down to 40 ppm > > for the past 2 days. I am > > > also in the process of getting more plants, so > > that should help the nitrate > > > levels as well. Unfortunately I lost a couple of > > my spiny eels in the > > > process :-( Once I get more plants in, I will > > remove the nitrate sponge and > > > see if the ntrate level stabilizes or spikes > > again. BTW...I also did move > > > my 7 Danios out of the main tank and put them into > > the tank with the ghost > > > shrimp as the dannies are too small to try and eat > > the shrimp. > > > > > > Eric > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > > > Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 3:07 PM > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > > > > For easier maintenance in the future: While I > > don't know the fish- > > > load you are dealing with (unless I missed that > > part), you might try > > > 33% water changes every week (as many hobbyists > > normally do) instead > > > of 20% every two weeks. The necessity of this > > naturally depends on > > > your fish load, but if your nitrates were up to > > 160, I'd have to say > > > you may possibly have a somewhat heavy fish-load. > > A 20% change is > > > practically nothing anyway -- that much of a water > > change would bring > > > your nitrates down to 128, and that's with > > refilling with fresh water > > > that has absolutely no nitrates in it. After a > > two week period, > > > enough time has gone by that the amount of nitrate > > you took out has > > > been replaced (and then some) from the break-down > > of fish waste. It > > > just keeps escalating -- its a case of too little > > - too late! You > > > shouldn't need to put nitrate absorber in your > > filter. Just change > > > more water more frequently, or lessen your > > fish-load. Ray > > > \ > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" > > <woad@w...> wrote: > > > > I just did daily water changes as well a a good > > deep cleaning of > > > the gravel. > > > > I put the bags of nitrate/nitrite/phosphate > > absorber in my filters > > > just to > > > > help get rid of what was already in the water. > > I think this is > > > what has > > > > helped as water changes prior to this did not > > effect the nitrate > > > levels. I > > > > don;t think it was from over feeding. We did > > have that problem, > > > but I > > > > reduced the amount of food, plus got some > > critters that will mop up > > > the > > > > uneaten food. I haven't added any fertilizers > > for my plants as of > > > yet, so > > > > that is not the source. I am not sure where all > > the excess > > > nitrates are > > > > coming from. I normally do a 20% water change > > every 2 weeks. So I > > > haven't > > > > figured out the source. My only thought is that > > it may have had > > > something > > > > to do with my UGF. I turned it off as I am > > slowly adding plants > > > and that is > > > > when the nitrate levels went down to 40 (same > > day as I added the > > > absorbing > > > > material). This was something that has happened > > over the past few > > > weeks, so > > > > it was the extended exposure to high nitrate > > levels that I was > > > concerned > > > > about. I lost 2 of my spiny eels in the past > > week, so I think that > > > may have > > > > been the cause. > > > > > > > > Eric > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > > Behalf Of Steve Szabo > > > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 9:39 PM > > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > > > > > > > 160 ppm is a ways away from killing your fish. > > Over a long term it > > > may cause > > > > problems in your fish, bit is nothing to panic > > over as you do have > > > plenty of > > > > time to determine the problem and reduce the > > presence of the > > > nitrate without > > > > taking any drastic actions. > > > > > > > > Now, if we were talking a reef tank here, that > > would be a whole > > > other > > > > ballgame, and your tank would be essentially > > dead. But, we are not, > > > and your > > > > tank would have been OK without rushing about to > > "do something" > > > about the > > > > nitrates. > > > > > > > > \\Steve// > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > > Behalf Of Eric Roberts > > > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 1:39 PM > > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > > > I just had a major issue with nitrates...they > > shot up through the > > > roof (and > > > > I have some plants). I got some of the nitrate > > sponges to soak > > > some of them > > > > up before they kill my fish. I have been doing > > 20 % water changes > > > every day > > > > and after about a week, they got down to 40 > > ppm...they were as high > > > as 160 > > > > at one point. One of my tasks is to get more > > plants and more > > > light. I am > > > > designing a hood for my 55 gal tank, so once I > > get that all in > > > place, I > > > > should be fine...or at least I hope. I am also > > getting rid of my > > > gravel > > > > eventually and replacing it with sand. This of > > course means no > > > more UGF, > > > > but it looks a lot nicer. I set up my 20 gal to > > house some of my > > > smaller > > > > fish and some ghost shrimp that I got for food > > for my larger fish > > > and I used > > > > the Tahitian moonlight black sand. It looks > > awesome with that. I > > > will be > > > === message truncated === > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13381	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)

hm, i'm not sure but probably not, they're a little big to fit into an angel's mouth. --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > Won't the angel's try to eat him? > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez > Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 2:37 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih) > > > i've had them with bettas and tetras in various tanks and they always worked > out well. i'm not > sure they'd work in tall tanks (what size tank do you have?) since they need > to be able to get to > the top for air. > > --- Crazy4fids@... wrote: > > > My kids (and husband) have been bugging me to get a dwarf aquatic frog. > > > > How would they be with angelfish, keyholes, tetras, and cories? > > > > Linda > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13382	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfish)

Mine won't hold still long enough to put one of them "Breathe Right Strips" on it. And when I finally do get one on it, it gets mad because it wants the "Finding Nemo" themed strips. :-D Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: 13 Date: Fri, 15 Jul 2005 11:20:25 -0000 From: "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@...> Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih) ....Why the sudden "mad dash"; could be something like we experience with apnea, when we "forget" to take a breath (lol). Ray [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13383	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)

yeah my adf's weren't blind but i had to feed them in their own corner while the fish were eating at the surface. mine weren't the fastest things in the world but were peaceful and cute! --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > i am not sure that they are actually blind as mine see > every bit of movement and swim all around my large > rock structures never running in to them. the albinos > may have a vision problem, but my dwarf africans have > no problems seeing, swimming, moving or eating > > --- FortWayneFish@... wrote: > > > Linda, > > The dwarf frog will get along with all the those you > > mentioned. > > One problem though with frogs are that they are > > blind, or can't see well. > > Feeding them is a problem with food more or less > > having to be put in front of > > there mouths. > > > > The angelfish,keyholes and tetras might not let the > > frog get anything to eat. > > > > and I can not remember which frog is which. clawed > > and non clawed.. But one > > will stay small less then a quarter in size where > > the other will get bigger > > almost a half dollar size. The bigger frogs have > > been known to eat fish. > > > > > > ** Cory catfish have the ability to gulp air* > > somewhere some place i read an > > article about it. > > > > in there wild natural habitat during the dry season > > they sometimes end up in > > stagnent pools, so to help them survive they can > > come to surface to get some > > oxygen. > > > > rob > > Indiana > > > > In a message dated 7/14/2005 8:03:40 PM US Eastern > > Standard Time, > > Crazy4fids@... writes: > > My kids (and husband) have been bugging me to get a > > dwarf aquatic frog. > > > > How would they be with angelfish, keyholes, tetras, > > and cories? > > > > Linda > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13384	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

they're interesting looking fish. if i had a freshwater tank large enough i'd get one. --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > the fresh water dragojn goby gets kinda big, like > around a foot i believe, and they are said to eat > anything that fuits in their mouths, but i have not > seen them go after anything when i had them in store. > they seem to get along with the larger tetras, > gouramis, etc but i would not put hem with guppies or > neons or the like personally > > --- Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote: > > > i don't think they're saltwater. at petsmart they > > were in freshwater, but of course this doesn't > > necessarily mean anything =) > > > > the ones i saw at petsmart look kinda like eels. > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > > > if you are talking about the salt water dragonfish > > or > > > dragon goby that has a starburst pattern around > > its > > > eyes, they are not difficult to keep but love to > > eat > > > hermits and snails! > > > > > > --- Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> > > wrote: > > > > > > > i see you have violet gobies, aka dragonfish. i > > saw > > > > one of those @ petsmart awhile back and was > > > > interested in them. but then heard that they're > > > > rather hard to keep. have you found this to be > > > > true? > > > > > > > > --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > It's been fine for the past few months. The > > main > > > > reason I do the amount of > > > > > water change is it is 2 bucket loads (10 > > gallons) > > > > I will try going to 3 > > > > > bucket loads from now on and see if that > > helps. > > > > What bothered me was that > > > > > even after the water change, there was no > > change > > > > in the amount of nitrates. > > > > > In any case...the levels have been down to 40 > > ppm > > > > for the past 2 days. I am > > > > > also in the process of getting more plants, so > > > > that should help the nitrate > > > > > levels as well. Unfortunately I lost a couple > > of > > > > my spiny eels in the > > > > > process :-( Once I get more plants in, I will > > > > remove the nitrate sponge and > > > > > see if the ntrate level stabilizes or spikes > > > > again. BTW...I also did move > > > > > my 7 Danios out of the main tank and put them > > into > > > > the tank with the ghost > > > > > shrimp as the dannies are too small to try and > > eat > > > > the shrimp. > > > > > > > > > > Eric > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > > > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > > > > > Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 3:07 PM > > > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > For easier maintenance in the future: While I > > > > don't know the fish- > > > > > load you are dealing with (unless I missed > > that > > > > part), you might try > > > > > 33% water changes every week (as many > > hobbyists > > > > normally do) instead > > > > > of 20% every two weeks. The necessity of this > > > > naturally depends on > > > > > your fish load, but if your nitrates were up > > to > > > > 160, I'd have to say > > > > > you may possibly have a somewhat heavy > > fish-load. > > > > A 20% change is > > > > > practically nothing anyway -- that much of a > > water > > > > change would bring > > > > > your nitrates down to 128, and that's with > > > > refilling with fresh water > > > > > that has absolutely no nitrates in it. After > > a > > > > two week period, > > > > > enough time has gone by that the amount of > > nitrate > > > > you took out has > > > > > been replaced (and then some) from the > > break-down > > > > of fish waste. It > > > > > just keeps escalating -- its a case of too > > little > > > > - too late! You > > > > > shouldn't need to put nitrate absorber in your > > > > filter. Just change > > > > > more water more frequently, or lessen your > > > > fish-load. Ray > > > > > \ > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric > > Roberts" > > > > <woad@w...> wrote: > > > > > > I just did daily water changes as well a a > > good > > > > deep cleaning of > > > > > the gravel. > > > > > > I put the bags of nitrate/nitrite/phosphate > > > > absorber in my filters > > > > > just to > > > > > > help get rid of what was already in the > > water. > > > > I think this is > > > > > what has > > > > > > helped as water changes prior to this did > > not > > > > effect the nitrate > > > > > levels. I > > > > > > don;t think it was from over feeding. We > > did > > > > have that problem, > > > > > but I > > > > > > reduced the amount of food, plus got some > > > > critters that will mop up > > > > > the > > > > > > uneaten food. I haven't added any > > fertilizers > > > > for my plants as of > > > > > yet, so > > > > > > that is not the source. I am not sure where > > all > > > > the excess > > > > > nitrates are > > > > > > coming from. I normally do a 20% water > > change > > > > every 2 weeks. So I > > > > > haven't > > > > > > figured out the source. My only thought is > > that > > > > it may have had > > > > > something > > > > > > to do with my UGF. I turned it off as I am > > > > slowly adding plants > > > > > and that is > > > > > > when the nitrate levels went down to 40 > > (same > > > > day as I added the > > > > > absorbing > > > > > > material). This was something that has > > happened > > > > over the past few > > > > > weeks, so > > > > > > it was the extended exposure to high nitrate > > > > levels that I was > > > > > concerned > > > > > > about. I lost 2 of my spiny eels in the > > past > > > > week, so I think that > > > > > may have > > > > > > been the cause. > > > > > > > > > > > > Eric > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > > > > Behalf Of Steve Szabo > > > > > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 9:39 PM > > > > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > > > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 160 ppm is a ways away from killing your > > fish. > > > > Over a long term it > > > > > may cause > > > > > > problems in your fish, bit is nothing to > > panic > > > > over as you do have > > > > > plenty of > > > > > > time to determine the problem and reduce the > > > > presence of the > > > > > nitrate without > > > > > > taking any drastic actions. > > > > > > > > > > > > Now, if we were talking a reef tank here, > > that > > > === message truncated === > > > > > __________________________________ > Yahoo! Mail > Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour: > http://tour.mail.yahoo.com/mailtour.html > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13385	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)

The reason I am concerned about that is my angels will attempt to eat anything that is wiggling on the surface. If I throw an ant in there...they go nuts. Same with ghost shrimp. Even if they can't eat it, they may be able to wound it. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 3:27 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih) hm, i'm not sure but probably not, they're a little big to fit into an angel's mouth. --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > Won't the angel's try to eat him? > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez > Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 2:37 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih) > > > i've had them with bettas and tetras in various tanks and they always worked > out well. i'm not > sure they'd work in tall tanks (what size tank do you have?) since they need > to be able to get to > the top for air. > > --- Crazy4fids@... wrote: > > > My kids (and husband) have been bugging me to get a dwarf aquatic frog. > > > > How would they be with angelfish, keyholes, tetras, and cories? > > > > Linda > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13386	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)

i guess you have hungry angels =) well, if you're worried perhaps you shouldn't get the adf's. --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > The reason I am concerned about that is my angels will attempt to eat > anything that is wiggling on the surface. If I throw an ant in there...they > go nuts. Same with ghost shrimp. Even if they can't eat it, they may be > able to wound it. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez > Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 3:27 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih) > > > hm, i'm not sure but probably not, they're a little big to fit into an > angel's mouth. > > --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > > > Won't the angel's try to eat him? > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez > > Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 2:37 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih) > > > > > > i've had them with bettas and tetras in various tanks and they always > worked > > out well. i'm not > > sure they'd work in tall tanks (what size tank do you have?) since they > need > > to be able to get to > > the top for air. > > > > --- Crazy4fids@... wrote: > > > > > My kids (and husband) have been bugging me to get a dwarf aquatic frog. > > > > > > > How would they be with angelfish, keyholes, tetras, and cories? > > > > > > Linda > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > > I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13387	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

--- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > the fresh water dragojn goby gets kinda big, like > around a foot i believe, and they are said to eat > anything that fuits in their mouths, but i have not > seen them go after anything when i had them in store. > they seem to get along with the larger tetras, > gouramis, etc but i would not put hem with guppies or > neons or the like personally Mine is in a brackish tank with mollies and I'm amazed he gets anything to eat. I try to target feed, but the Mollies are pretty smart and see through my distraction attempts. I keep ghost shrimp in the tank and feed him shrimp pellets, a variety of frozen foods and my last Molly spawn (which was pretty large) didn't last a night (except for ~ 7 survivors) With that said, the young mollies swim right up to him and don't think twice about him. What concerns me is that his shape makes it hard for me to know if he is well-fed or not and I don't really *see* him eat all that much. They seem to eat more at dawn/dusk and probably at night. Vicky [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13388	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)

I am not getting them...someone else was asking and they also have angels.. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 3:43 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih) i guess you have hungry angels =) well, if you're worried perhaps you shouldn't get the adf's. --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > The reason I am concerned about that is my angels will attempt to eat > anything that is wiggling on the surface. If I throw an ant in there...they > go nuts. Same with ghost shrimp. Even if they can't eat it, they may be > able to wound it. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez > Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 3:27 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih) > > > hm, i'm not sure but probably not, they're a little big to fit into an > angel's mouth. > > --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > > > Won't the angel's try to eat him? > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez > > Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 2:37 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih) > > > > > > i've had them with bettas and tetras in various tanks and they always > worked > > out well. i'm not > > sure they'd work in tall tanks (what size tank do you have?) since they > need > > to be able to get to > > the top for air. > > > > --- Crazy4fids@... wrote: > > > > > My kids (and husband) have been bugging me to get a dwarf aquatic frog. > > > > > > > How would they be with angelfish, keyholes, tetras, and cories? > > > > > > Linda > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > > I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13389	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

About 7-8" long Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 2:38 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s oh cool, it's good to hear a success story about them. how big are yours? --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > not really. The challenge with them is making sure they eat. I just make > sure I get some shrimp pellets in their caves and they get food. They have > really poor eyesight and can get beaten to a meal. We lost one early on, > but I think he was sick when we got him. Every fish we got from that store > has died. The other 2 I got at Petsmart and they are getting big and > healthy. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez > Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 4:33 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > i see you have violet gobies, aka dragonfish. i saw one of those @ petsmart > awhile back and was > interested in them. but then heard that they're rather hard to keep. have > you found this to be > true? > > --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > > > It's been fine for the past few months. The main reason I do the amount > of > > water change is it is 2 bucket loads (10 gallons) I will try going to 3 > > bucket loads from now on and see if that helps. What bothered me was that > > even after the water change, there was no change in the amount of > nitrates. > > In any case...the levels have been down to 40 ppm for the past 2 days. I > am > > also in the process of getting more plants, so that should help the > nitrate > > levels as well. Unfortunately I lost a couple of my spiny eels in the > > process :-( Once I get more plants in, I will remove the nitrate sponge > and > > see if the ntrate level stabilizes or spikes again. BTW...I also did move > > my 7 Danios out of the main tank and put them into the tank with the ghost > > shrimp as the dannies are too small to try and eat the shrimp. > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > > Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 3:07 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > For easier maintenance in the future: While I don't know the fish- > > load you are dealing with (unless I missed that part), you might try > > 33% water changes every week (as many hobbyists normally do) instead > > of 20% every two weeks. The necessity of this naturally depends on > > your fish load, but if your nitrates were up to 160, I'd have to say > > you may possibly have a somewhat heavy fish-load. A 20% change is > > practically nothing anyway -- that much of a water change would bring > > your nitrates down to 128, and that's with refilling with fresh water > > that has absolutely no nitrates in it. After a two week period, > > enough time has gone by that the amount of nitrate you took out has > > been replaced (and then some) from the break-down of fish waste. It > > just keeps escalating -- its a case of too little - too late! You > > shouldn't need to put nitrate absorber in your filter. Just change > > more water more frequently, or lessen your fish-load. Ray > > \ > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > > > I just did daily water changes as well a a good deep cleaning of > > the gravel. > > > I put the bags of nitrate/nitrite/phosphate absorber in my filters > > just to > > > help get rid of what was already in the water. I think this is > > what has > > > helped as water changes prior to this did not effect the nitrate > > levels. I > > > don;t think it was from over feeding. We did have that problem, > > but I > > > reduced the amount of food, plus got some critters that will mop up > > the > > > uneaten food. I haven't added any fertilizers for my plants as of > > yet, so > > > that is not the source. I am not sure where all the excess > > nitrates are > > > coming from. I normally do a 20% water change every 2 weeks. So I > > haven't > > > figured out the source. My only thought is that it may have had > > something > > > to do with my UGF. I turned it off as I am slowly adding plants > > and that is > > > when the nitrate levels went down to 40 (same day as I added the > > absorbing > > > material). This was something that has happened over the past few > > weeks, so > > > it was the extended exposure to high nitrate levels that I was > > concerned > > > about. I lost 2 of my spiny eels in the past week, so I think that > > may have > > > been the cause. > > > > > > Eric > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > Behalf Of Steve Szabo > > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 9:39 PM > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > > > > 160 ppm is a ways away from killing your fish. Over a long term it > > may cause > > > problems in your fish, bit is nothing to panic over as you do have > > plenty of > > > time to determine the problem and reduce the presence of the > > nitrate without > > > taking any drastic actions. > > > > > > Now, if we were talking a reef tank here, that would be a whole > > other > > > ballgame, and your tank would be essentially dead. But, we are not, > > and your > > > tank would have been OK without rushing about to "do something" > > about the > > > nitrates. > > > > > > \\Steve// > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > Behalf Of Eric Roberts > > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 1:39 PM > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > I just had a major issue with nitrates...they shot up through the > > roof (and > > > I have some plants). I got some of the nitrate sponges to soak > > some of them > > > up before they kill my fish. I have been doing 20 % water changes > > every day > > > and after about a week, they got down to 40 ppm...they were as high > > as 160 > > > at one point. One of my tasks is to get more plants and more > > light. I am > > > designing a hood for my 55 gal tank, so once I get that all in > > place, I > > > should be fine...or at least I hope. I am also getting rid of my > > gravel > > > eventually and replacing it with sand. This of course means no > > more UGF, > > > but it looks a lot nicer. I set up my 20 gal to house some of my > > smaller > > > fish and some ghost shrimp that I got for food for my larger fish > > and I used > > > the Tahitian moonlight black sand. It looks awesome with that. I > > will be > > > switching over to that in the next month or so in the big tank. > > The only > > > thing I don;t like about the sand is it is a real PIA to get > > clean. When I > > > was setting up the 20 gal, I thought I had it clean, but ended up > > having to > > > empty out the tank and refilling it after cleaning the gravel once > > > again...ugg. > > > > > > Eric > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 10:37 AM > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > > > > A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. This > > > should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in > > there > > > to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not > > > overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should > > not > > > get a chance to multiply. > > Ray > > > > > \ > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" > > > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > > > What is a "safe" number regarding nitrates? Everything is > > testing 0 > > > but > > > > of course I am getting a reading on nitrates, seems to be at 20 > > ppm. > > > > The reason I ask is due to this seemingly minor algae bloom. > > I've > > > seen > > > > others have this and then a full out mess within days. I don't > > want > > > > that. > > > > Anyhow, safe nitrate number? > > > > Thanks > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > ((((º> > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > > thanks. > > > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > > important to > > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > > the > > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > > Marine > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? > > t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > > > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? > > t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > > > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > > Service > > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > ((((º> > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > > thanks. > > > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > > important to > > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > > the > > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > ((((º> > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > > thanks. > > > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > > important to > > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > > the > > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > > Service > > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > Marine > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13390	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

They are not hunters. They are more carrion eaters. Carnivorous hunters use eyesight to help them get their prey. If you look at the tiny eyes of the violet goby, they are obviously not hunters. In fact, one of the problems with keeping them is that they tend to lose out on food because the other fish get it before they even see it. In my research on them, I have found that their ferocity and reputation is more of a myth than fact. One of the sites I was at had one it the same tank with guppy fry and none of them got eaten. They apparently have no taste for fish flesh...shrimp on the other hand is another story. They also are gill feeders in that they will open their rather large mouths, sucking in water to suck in algae, phytoplankton and other food morsels into their mouths. They usually stay in their cave and chow on morsels that flow into their caves. The exception being that when I put in tubifex worm cubes...they will come out and hang from the cubes...chowing away... Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of paul helms Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 3:20 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s the fresh water dragojn goby gets kinda big, like around a foot i believe, and they are said to eat anything that fuits in their mouths, but i have not seen them go after anything when i had them in store. they seem to get along with the larger tetras, gouramis, etc but i would not put hem with guppies or neons or the like personally --- Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote: > i don't think they're saltwater. at petsmart they > were in freshwater, but of course this doesn't > necessarily mean anything =) > > the ones i saw at petsmart look kinda like eels. > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > if you are talking about the salt water dragonfish > or > > dragon goby that has a starburst pattern around > its > > eyes, they are not difficult to keep but love to > eat > > hermits and snails! > > > > --- Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> > wrote: > > > > > i see you have violet gobies, aka dragonfish. i > saw > > > one of those @ petsmart awhile back and was > > > interested in them. but then heard that they're > > > rather hard to keep. have you found this to be > > > true? > > > > > > --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > > > > > > > It's been fine for the past few months. The > main > > > reason I do the amount of > > > > water change is it is 2 bucket loads (10 > gallons) > > > I will try going to 3 > > > > bucket loads from now on and see if that > helps. > > > What bothered me was that > > > > even after the water change, there was no > change > > > in the amount of nitrates. > > > > In any case...the levels have been down to 40 > ppm > > > for the past 2 days. I am > > > > also in the process of getting more plants, so > > > that should help the nitrate > > > > levels as well. Unfortunately I lost a couple > of > > > my spiny eels in the > > > > process :-( Once I get more plants in, I will > > > remove the nitrate sponge and > > > > see if the ntrate level stabilizes or spikes > > > again. BTW...I also did move > > > > my 7 Danios out of the main tank and put them > into > > > the tank with the ghost > > > > shrimp as the dannies are too small to try and > eat > > > the shrimp. > > > > > > > > Eric > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > > > > Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 3:07 PM > > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > > > > > > > For easier maintenance in the future: While I > > > don't know the fish- > > > > load you are dealing with (unless I missed > that > > > part), you might try > > > > 33% water changes every week (as many > hobbyists > > > normally do) instead > > > > of 20% every two weeks. The necessity of this > > > naturally depends on > > > > your fish load, but if your nitrates were up > to > > > 160, I'd have to say > > > > you may possibly have a somewhat heavy > fish-load. > > > A 20% change is > > > > practically nothing anyway -- that much of a > water > > > change would bring > > > > your nitrates down to 128, and that's with > > > refilling with fresh water > > > > that has absolutely no nitrates in it. After > a > > > two week period, > > > > enough time has gone by that the amount of > nitrate > > > you took out has > > > > been replaced (and then some) from the > break-down > > > of fish waste. It > > > > just keeps escalating -- its a case of too > little > > > - too late! You > > > > shouldn't need to put nitrate absorber in your > > > filter. Just change > > > > more water more frequently, or lessen your > > > fish-load. Ray > > > > \ > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric > Roberts" > > > <woad@w...> wrote: > > > > > I just did daily water changes as well a a > good > > > deep cleaning of > > > > the gravel. > > > > > I put the bags of nitrate/nitrite/phosphate > > > absorber in my filters > > > > just to > > > > > help get rid of what was already in the > water. > > > I think this is > > > > what has > > > > > helped as water changes prior to this did > not > > > effect the nitrate > > > > levels. I > > > > > don;t think it was from over feeding. We > did > > > have that problem, > > > > but I > > > > > reduced the amount of food, plus got some > > > critters that will mop up > > > > the > > > > > uneaten food. I haven't added any > fertilizers > > > for my plants as of > > > > yet, so > > > > > that is not the source. I am not sure where > all > > > the excess > > > > nitrates are > > > > > coming from. I normally do a 20% water > change > > > every 2 weeks. So I > > > > haven't > > > > > figured out the source. My only thought is > that > > > it may have had > > > > something > > > > > to do with my UGF. I turned it off as I am > > > slowly adding plants > > > > and that is > > > > > when the nitrate levels went down to 40 > (same > > > day as I added the > > > > absorbing > > > > > material). This was something that has > happened > > > over the past few > > > > weeks, so > > > > > it was the extended exposure to high nitrate > > > levels that I was > > > > concerned > > > > > about. I lost 2 of my spiny eels in the > past > > > week, so I think that > > > > may have > > > > > been the cause. > > > > > > > > > > Eric > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > > > Behalf Of Steve Szabo > > > > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 9:39 PM > > > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 160 ppm is a ways away from killing your > fish. > > > Over a long term it > > > > may cause > > > > > problems in your fish, bit is nothing to > panic > > > over as you do have > > > > plenty of > > > > > time to determine the problem and reduce the > > > presence of the > > > > nitrate without > > > > > taking any drastic actions. > > > > > > > > > > Now, if we were talking a reef tank here, > that > === message truncated === __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour: http://tour.mail.yahoo.com/mailtour.html ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13391	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Please Edit or Snip the junk off of reply messages. Thanks.

Please try to remember to SNIP the junk off the bottom of your replies for those of us on the Digest Format or on Dial-Up. Below is the JUNK that was below a single word reply. When you get the Digest Format, you have to scroll through 25 messages with that much JUNK and sometimes much MORE just to read the short replies or long messages. It's even worse when someone on the Digest Mode does not snip all 25 messages when they reply to a single message. Thanks. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13392	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: Snails was algae was Nitrate #s

I have Golden Mystery Snails and I've used Melafix with no problems. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: 6 Date: Fri, 15 Jul 2005 10:50:42 -0700 (PDT) From: Emily Tenczar <bababanana@...> Subject: nails was algae was Nitrate #s My black mystery just died :( I thought melafix and M2 wasn't supposed to hurt them, or maybe it just got old? Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13393	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

i'll check your website often for photos of them. --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > About 7-8" long > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez > Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 2:38 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > oh cool, it's good to hear a success story about them. how big are yours? > > --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > > > not really. The challenge with them is making sure they eat. I just make > > sure I get some shrimp pellets in their caves and they get food. They > have > > really poor eyesight and can get beaten to a meal. We lost one early on, > > but I think he was sick when we got him. Every fish we got from that > store > > has died. The other 2 I got at Petsmart and they are getting big and > > healthy. > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez > > Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 4:33 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > i see you have violet gobies, aka dragonfish. i saw one of those @ > petsmart > > awhile back and was > > interested in them. but then heard that they're rather hard to keep. have > > you found this to be > > true? > > > > --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > > > > > It's been fine for the past few months. The main reason I do the amount > > of > > > water change is it is 2 bucket loads (10 gallons) I will try going to 3 > > > bucket loads from now on and see if that helps. What bothered me was > that > > > even after the water change, there was no change in the amount of > > nitrates. > > > In any case...the levels have been down to 40 ppm for the past 2 days. > I > > am > > > also in the process of getting more plants, so that should help the > > nitrate > > > levels as well. Unfortunately I lost a couple of my spiny eels in the > > > process :-( Once I get more plants in, I will remove the nitrate sponge > > and > > > see if the ntrate level stabilizes or spikes again. BTW...I also did > move > > > my 7 Danios out of the main tank and put them into the tank with the > ghost > > > shrimp as the dannies are too small to try and eat the shrimp. > > > > > > Eric > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On > > > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > > > Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 3:07 PM > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > > > > For easier maintenance in the future: While I don't know the fish- > > > load you are dealing with (unless I missed that part), you might try > > > 33% water changes every week (as many hobbyists normally do) instead > > > of 20% every two weeks. The necessity of this naturally depends on > > > your fish load, but if your nitrates were up to 160, I'd have to say > > > you may possibly have a somewhat heavy fish-load. A 20% change is > > > practically nothing anyway -- that much of a water change would bring > > > your nitrates down to 128, and that's with refilling with fresh water > > > that has absolutely no nitrates in it. After a two week period, > > > enough time has gone by that the amount of nitrate you took out has > > > been replaced (and then some) from the break-down of fish waste. It > > > just keeps escalating -- its a case of too little - too late! You > > > shouldn't need to put nitrate absorber in your filter. Just change > > > more water more frequently, or lessen your fish-load. Ray > > > \ > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > > > > I just did daily water changes as well a a good deep cleaning of > > > the gravel. > > > > I put the bags of nitrate/nitrite/phosphate absorber in my filters > > > just to > > > > help get rid of what was already in the water. I think this is > > > what has > > > > helped as water changes prior to this did not effect the nitrate > > > levels. I > > > > don;t think it was from over feeding. We did have that problem, > > > but I > > > > reduced the amount of food, plus got some critters that will mop up > > > the > > > > uneaten food. I haven't added any fertilizers for my plants as of > > > yet, so > > > > that is not the source. I am not sure where all the excess > > > nitrates are > > > > coming from. I normally do a 20% water change every 2 weeks. So I > > > haven't > > > > figured out the source. My only thought is that it may have had > > > something > > > > to do with my UGF. I turned it off as I am slowly adding plants > > > and that is > > > > when the nitrate levels went down to 40 (same day as I added the > > > absorbing > > > > material). This was something that has happened over the past few > > > weeks, so > > > > it was the extended exposure to high nitrate levels that I was > > > concerned > > > > about. I lost 2 of my spiny eels in the past week, so I think that > > > may have > > > > been the cause. > > > > > > > > Eric > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > > Behalf Of Steve Szabo > > > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 9:39 PM > > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > > > > > > > 160 ppm is a ways away from killing your fish. Over a long term it > > > may cause > > > > problems in your fish, bit is nothing to panic over as you do have > > > plenty of > > > > time to determine the problem and reduce the presence of the > > > nitrate without > > > > taking any drastic actions. > > > > > > > > Now, if we were talking a reef tank here, that would be a whole > > > other > > > > ballgame, and your tank would be essentially dead. But, we are not, > > > and your > > > > tank would have been OK without rushing about to "do something" > > > about the > > > > nitrates. > > > > > > > > \\Steve// > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > > Behalf Of Eric Roberts > > > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 1:39 PM > > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > > > I just had a major issue with nitrates...they shot up through the > > > roof (and > > > > I have some plants). I got some of the nitrate sponges to soak > > > some of them > > > > up before they kill my fish. I have been doing 20 % water changes > > > every day > > > > and after about a week, they got down to 40 ppm...they were as high > > > as 160 > > > > at one point. One of my tasks is to get more plants and more > > > light. I am > > > > designing a hood for my 55 gal tank, so once I get that all in > > > place, I > > > > should be fine...or at least I hope. I am also getting rid of my > > > gravel > > > > eventually and replacing it with sand. This of course means no > > > more UGF, > > > > but it looks a lot nicer. I set up my 20 gal to house some of my > > > smaller > > > > fish and some ghost shrimp that I got for food for my larger fish > > > and I used > > > > the Tahitian moonlight black sand. It looks awesome with that. I > > > will be > > > > switching over to that in the next month or so in the big tank. > > > The only > > > > thing I don;t like about the sand is it is a real PIA to get > > > clean. When I > > > > was setting up the 20 gal, I thought I had it clean, but ended up > > > having to > > > > empty out the tank and refilling it after cleaning the gravel once > > > > again...ugg. > > > > > > > > Eric > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > > > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 10:37 AM > > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > > > > > > > A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. This > > > > should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in > > > there > > > > to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not > > > > overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should > > > not > > > > get a chance to multiply. > > > Ray > > > > > > > \ > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" > > > > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > > > > What is a "safe" number regarding nitrates? Everything is > > > testing 0 > > > > but > > > > > of course I am getting a reading on nitrates, seems to be at 20 > > > ppm. > > > > > The reason I ask is due to this seemingly minor algae bloom. > > > I've > > > > seen > > > > > others have this and then a full out mess within days. I don't > > > want > > > > > that. > > > > > Anyhow, safe nitrate number? > > > > > Thanks > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > > ((((º> > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > > > thanks. > > > > > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > > > important to > > > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > > > the > > > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > > > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > > > Marine > > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? > > > t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > > > > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > > > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology > > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? > > > t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > > > > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > > > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > > > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > > > Service > > > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > > ((((º> > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > > > thanks. > > > > > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > > > important to > > > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > > > the > > > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > > > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > > ((((º> > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > > > thanks. > > > > > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > > > important to > > > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > > > the > > > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > > > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > > > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > > > Service > > > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important > to > > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > > Marine > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service > > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > > I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13394	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih)

oh, sorry! --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > I am not getting them...someone else was asking and they also have angels.. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez > Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 3:43 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih) > > > i guess you have hungry angels =) well, if you're worried perhaps you > shouldn't get the adf's. > > --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > > > The reason I am concerned about that is my angels will attempt to eat > > anything that is wiggling on the surface. If I throw an ant in > there...they > > go nuts. Same with ghost shrimp. Even if they can't eat it, they may be > > able to wound it. > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez > > Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 3:27 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] catfish whoops hit send to quick.( corycatfsih) > > > > > > hm, i'm not sure but probably not, they're a little big to fit into an > > angel's mouth. > > > > --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > > > > > Won't the angel's try to eat him? > > > > > > Eric > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On > > > Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez > > > Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 2:37 PM > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] catfish whoops hit send to quick.( > corycatfsih) > > > > > > > > > i've had them with bettas and tetras in various tanks and they always > > worked > > > out well. i'm not > > > sure they'd work in tall tanks (what size tank do you have?) since they > > need > > > to be able to get to > > > the top for air. > > > > > > --- Crazy4fids@... wrote: > > > > > > > My kids (and husband) have been bugging me to get a dwarf aquatic > frog. > > > > > > > > > > How would they be with angelfish, keyholes, tetras, and cories? > > > > > > > > Linda > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > > > I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important > to > > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service > > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > > I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13395	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: LOW, LOW priced tanks at GlassCages.com

If anybody is in the market for a new tank, here is a post I made on the AquariumFish forums: As many of you know, I've been shopping around for a new or used tank and after much Googling and eBaying, I found a company selling new tanks CHEAPER than any other place that I could find. They had a 55G Glass tank for $69.00, a 65G Acrylic tank for $110.00 and dozens of other tanks for very low prices. They also make custom sized tanks. Their web site is: http://www.GlassCages.com and their eBay site is: http://stores.ebay.com/Custom-Aquariums_W0QQssPageNameZviQ3asibQ3astoreviewQQtZkm I then did a Google search on "GlassCages.com reviews" and found many sites/forums with satisfied customers and of course, a few dissatisfied customers. Most of the few complaints were about the man's pre-sale customer service complaints. Apparently, the owner is a very proud man so when people question the quality of his tanks, he gets very defensive and sometimes would tell people that if they don't trust him, they should buy somewhere else. I guess people question his quality because of the LOW, LOW prices and he gets tired of hearing people question his work. He had 207 good reviews on eBay and only 2 bad ones, both having to do with pre-sale complaints. Well, I ordered the 65G Acrylic tank (48"L x 18"W x 17"H) on eBay and emailed the company to find out the shipping charges. They replied within a few minutes (GOOD!) and the shipping charges would be $35.00 for FEDEX Ground. Fair shipping price! I then had trouble getting to the secure https: part of eBay to PAY so I emailed them again and they called me and I spoke to the wife, husband and son (computer wiz) and all of them were nice to me. The son was pretty good with computers... I am too and we talked tech talk trying to figure out the problem. I finally figured out what was wrong, went to the secure https: payment page and paid using PayPal. After getting the confirmation from PayPal, I sent them another email to GlassCages.com asking about the approximate shipping date, etc., and once again, they replied within minutes and said it would ship tomorrow (Friday) and I should have the tank by Wednesday. Woohoo! The company is located in Tennessee so if you live nearby, you could pick it up and save the shipping charges. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13396	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: styrofoam box cooling disaster!!!!!!!

Emily, Terribly sorry to hear of your watery accident. Hard to figure why those ziplock freezer bags leaked when we all know they're not supposed do. Could be they just weren't quite closed all the way and you wouldn't have noticed as everything was still solid at that point. It appears you may have laid the pump directly in the bottom of the box instead of elevating it. I do recall mentioning to guard against getting the pump wet. But in any case, you would have been much better off had you used the cold packs as you last indicated; I thought that was a good idea, as I told you -- they don't leak, but accidents will happen. In any case, a check valve should always be used in the airline after the air pump, especially if the pump is located below tank level. If your electric power goes out during a storm, the check valve will prevent water from syphoning back out as can otherwise happen. You really didn't need to rig up the larger pump. A smaller one would have sufficed and not given off as much heat, but then to, you're probably right about getting home late. Perhaps you should have waited to hook up this "cooler" until it would be more convenient to keep tabs on it. Sounds like it was a mess to clean up, but glad to hear all the fish are alright. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Emily Tenczar <bababanana@y...> wrote: > I must have done something seriously wrong, so I wanted to warn everyone here before anyone else makes the same mistake. > > I decided to try the styrofoam box method first on my 10 gallon minnow tank, so I filled up some ziplock freezer bags with ice (mistake #1) and I rigged up the system with a larger pump to put more air through. I got two cute little fans to blow over the water surface. All was well Wednesday night. > > Well, I spent the night at my boyfriend's house and didn't get home till late thursday night/friday morning around 2am (mistake #2). > > I came in to a horrible noise from the filter on the side of the tank which was no longer submerged, and found that the water level had gone down to only a couple inches at the bottom of the tank! OMG!!! There was water all over the rug under the two aquarium stands, and then I checked the styrofoam box. OMG somehow the water had escaped from the bags, leaked everywhere, and the air pump was submerged and overheated. I put the box in the bathtub to contain the water while I cleaned up. After I got things partially under control, I examined the damage. The water had heated up and melted and distorted the pump, and an all-too-familiar autoclave smell surrounded the box and its contents. > > It could have been really bad. As of last night the fish were fine so I hope they will be okay. I hooked up another air pump without a box this time, and ran one small fan over the top of the water. > > Maybe when the air pump fried it sucked the water back out of the tank. > Emily > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13397	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

I am waiting on my ex wife so I can borrow her digital camera. As soon as she get a new battery for it, she is going to loan it to me to take some pics. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 4:14 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s i'll check your website often for photos of them. --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > About 7-8" long > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez > Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 2:38 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > oh cool, it's good to hear a success story about them. how big are yours? > > --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > > > not really. The challenge with them is making sure they eat. I just make > > sure I get some shrimp pellets in their caves and they get food. They > have > > really poor eyesight and can get beaten to a meal. We lost one early on, > > but I think he was sick when we got him. Every fish we got from that > store > > has died. The other 2 I got at Petsmart and they are getting big and > > healthy. > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez > > Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 4:33 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > i see you have violet gobies, aka dragonfish. i saw one of those @ > petsmart > > awhile back and was > > interested in them. but then heard that they're rather hard to keep. have > > you found this to be > > true? > > > > --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > > > > > It's been fine for the past few months. The main reason I do the amount > > of > > > water change is it is 2 bucket loads (10 gallons) I will try going to 3 > > > bucket loads from now on and see if that helps. What bothered me was > that > > > even after the water change, there was no change in the amount of > > nitrates. > > > In any case...the levels have been down to 40 ppm for the past 2 days. > I > > am > > > also in the process of getting more plants, so that should help the > > nitrate > > > levels as well. Unfortunately I lost a couple of my spiny eels in the > > > process :-( Once I get more plants in, I will remove the nitrate sponge > > and > > > see if the ntrate level stabilizes or spikes again. BTW...I also did > move > > > my 7 Danios out of the main tank and put them into the tank with the > ghost > > > shrimp as the dannies are too small to try and eat the shrimp. > > > > > > Eric > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On > > > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > > > Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 3:07 PM > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > > > > For easier maintenance in the future: While I don't know the fish- > > > load you are dealing with (unless I missed that part), you might try > > > 33% water changes every week (as many hobbyists normally do) instead > > > of 20% every two weeks. The necessity of this naturally depends on > > > your fish load, but if your nitrates were up to 160, I'd have to say > > > you may possibly have a somewhat heavy fish-load. A 20% change is > > > practically nothing anyway -- that much of a water change would bring > > > your nitrates down to 128, and that's with refilling with fresh water > > > that has absolutely no nitrates in it. After a two week period, > > > enough time has gone by that the amount of nitrate you took out has > > > been replaced (and then some) from the break-down of fish waste. It > > > just keeps escalating -- its a case of too little - too late! You > > > shouldn't need to put nitrate absorber in your filter. Just change > > > more water more frequently, or lessen your fish-load. Ray > > > \ > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > > > > I just did daily water changes as well a a good deep cleaning of > > > the gravel. > > > > I put the bags of nitrate/nitrite/phosphate absorber in my filters > > > just to > > > > help get rid of what was already in the water. I think this is > > > what has > > > > helped as water changes prior to this did not effect the nitrate > > > levels. I > > > > don;t think it was from over feeding. We did have that problem, > > > but I > > > > reduced the amount of food, plus got some critters that will mop up > > > the > > > > uneaten food. I haven't added any fertilizers for my plants as of > > > yet, so > > > > that is not the source. I am not sure where all the excess > > > nitrates are > > > > coming from. I normally do a 20% water change every 2 weeks. So I > > > haven't > > > > figured out the source. My only thought is that it may have had > > > something > > > > to do with my UGF. I turned it off as I am slowly adding plants > > > and that is > > > > when the nitrate levels went down to 40 (same day as I added the > > > absorbing > > > > material). This was something that has happened over the past few > > > weeks, so > > > > it was the extended exposure to high nitrate levels that I was > > > concerned > > > > about. I lost 2 of my spiny eels in the past week, so I think that > > > may have > > > > been the cause. > > > > > > > > Eric > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > > Behalf Of Steve Szabo > > > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 9:39 PM > > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > > > > > > > 160 ppm is a ways away from killing your fish. Over a long term it > > > may cause > > > > problems in your fish, bit is nothing to panic over as you do have > > > plenty of > > > > time to determine the problem and reduce the presence of the > > > nitrate without > > > > taking any drastic actions. > > > > > > > > Now, if we were talking a reef tank here, that would be a whole > > > other > > > > ballgame, and your tank would be essentially dead. But, we are not, > > > and your > > > > tank would have been OK without rushing about to "do something" > > > about the > > > > nitrates. > > > > > > > > \\Steve// > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > > Behalf Of Eric Roberts > > > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 1:39 PM > > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > > > I just had a major issue with nitrates...they shot up through the > > > roof (and > > > > I have some plants). I got some of the nitrate sponges to soak > > > some of them > > > > up before they kill my fish. I have been doing 20 % water changes > > > every day > > > > and after about a week, they got down to 40 ppm...they were as high > > > as 160 > > > > at one point. One of my tasks is to get more plants and more > > > light. I am > > > > designing a hood for my 55 gal tank, so once I get that all in > > > place, I > > > > should be fine...or at least I hope. I am also getting rid of my > > > gravel > > > > eventually and replacing it with sand. This of course means no > > > more UGF, > > > > but it looks a lot nicer. I set up my 20 gal to house some of my > > > smaller > > > > fish and some ghost shrimp that I got for food for my larger fish > > > and I used > > > > the Tahitian moonlight black sand. It looks awesome with that. I > > > will be > > > > switching over to that in the next month or so in the big tank. > > > The only > > > > thing I don;t like about the sand is it is a real PIA to get > > > clean. When I > > > > was setting up the 20 gal, I thought I had it clean, but ended up > > > having to > > > > empty out the tank and refilling it after cleaning the gravel once > > > > again...ugg. > > > > > > > > Eric > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > > > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 10:37 AM > > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > > > > > > > A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. This > > > > should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in > > > there > > > > to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not > > > > overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should > > > not > > > > get a chance to multiply. > > > Ray > > > > > > > \ > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" > > > > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > > > > What is a "safe" number regarding nitrates? Everything is > > > testing 0 > > > > but > > > > > of course I am getting a reading on nitrates, seems to be at 20 > > > ppm. > > > > > The reason I ask is due to this seemingly minor algae bloom. > > > I've > > > > seen > > > > > others have this and then a full out mess within days. I don't > > > want > > > > > that. > > > > > Anyhow, safe nitrate number? > > > > > Thanks > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > > ((((º> > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > > > thanks. > > > > > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > > > important to > > > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > > > the > > > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > > > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > > > Marine > > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? > > > t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > > > > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > > > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology > > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? > > > t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > > > > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > > > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > > > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > > > Service > > > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > > ((((º> > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > > > thanks. > > > > > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > > > important to > > > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > > > the > > > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > > > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > > ((((º> > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > > > thanks. > > > > > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > > > important to > > > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > > > the > > > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > > > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > > > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > > > Service > > > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important > to > > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > > Marine > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service > > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > > I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13398	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: New tank

Hello People :-) Some of you must be missing me I suppose ;) Well, to start with. I got a new tank. A tall 4ft hex acrylic. Below are some pics. http://www.nimmat.com/coppermine/thumbnails.php?album=25 I really wanted this tank to be for a pair of Angels but wife wants goldfish so I am stuffed there :-( But that's fine. I decided on a UGF because I did not really want any unsightly things in the tank and besides with a 6" gravel substrate, I am sure that will be a superb biological media. I plan on having some crypts in there (don't ask me how I am gonna plant in a 4ft deep tank coz I have not thought of it yet) and a couple of onion plants. Goldfish will go in once the plants are established. Views please :-) Thanks, Nim [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13399	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: LOW, LOW priced tanks at GlassCages.com

Lenny, This tank manufacturer has been around for a number of years now (at least 5 or so years, that I know of). His name is Tom Fiala, in Dickson, TN. As far as I'm concerned, he does excellent work -- at great prices. Best thing I feel about his place is that you can have him custom make any size tank you may need -- again, at excellent prices. He has an enclosed trailer truck and tours some of the larger fish shows throughout the East & Mid-West. I bought a few tanks from him myself and am well satisfied. I would mention, in fairness to all, that I know several other aquarists who bought tanks from him which leaked. Easy enough to fix with a tube of silicone (they were minor leaks), but he does have a warrantee policy if you want to ship it back. I mentioned he does shows, so if you contact him, get his show schedule and make arrangements with him to pick up your tanks at that time, you can save shipping costs which can add up especially if you're ordering a few tanks. Incidentally, on the last day of these shows, he generally donates maybe a half dozen good sized tanks towards the show auction, which you can pick up for a song compared to what the tanks are worth. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Lenny Vasbinder" <lnvtm1@g...> wrote: > If anybody is in the market for a new tank, here is a post I made on the AquariumFish forums: > > As many of you know, I've been shopping around for a new or used tank and after much Googling and eBaying, I found a company selling new tanks CHEAPER than any other place that I could find. > > They had a 55G Glass tank for $69.00, a 65G Acrylic tank for $110.00 and dozens of other tanks for very low prices. They also make custom sized tanks. Their web site is: http://www.GlassCages.com and their eBay site is: http://stores.ebay.com/Custom- Aquariums_W0QQssPageNameZviQ3asibQ3astoreviewQQtZkm > > I then did a Google search on "GlassCages.com reviews" and found many sites/forums with satisfied customers and of course, a few dissatisfied customers. Most of the few complaints were about the man's pre-sale customer service complaints. Apparently, the owner is a very proud man so when people question the quality of his tanks, he gets very defensive and sometimes would tell people that if they don't trust him, they should buy somewhere else. I guess people question his quality because of the LOW, LOW prices and he gets tired of hearing people question his work. He had 207 good reviews on eBay and only 2 bad ones, both having to do with pre-sale complaints. > > Well, I ordered the 65G Acrylic tank (48"L x 18"W x 17"H) on eBay and emailed the company to find out the shipping charges. They replied within a few minutes (GOOD!) and the shipping charges would be $35.00 for FEDEX Ground. Fair shipping price! I then had trouble getting to the secure https: part of eBay to PAY so I emailed them again and they called me and I spoke to the wife, husband and son (computer wiz) and all of them were nice to me. The son was pretty good with computers... I am too and we talked tech talk trying to figure out the problem. I finally figured out what was wrong, went to the secure https: payment page and paid using PayPal. > > After getting the confirmation from PayPal, I sent them another email to GlassCages.com asking about the approximate shipping date, etc., and once again, they replied within minutes and said it would ship tomorrow (Friday) and I should have the tank by Wednesday. Woohoo! > > The company is located in Tennessee so if you live nearby, you could pick it up and save the shipping charges. > > Lenny Vasbinder > http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com > 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 > LNVTM1@g... > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13400	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: fish stress

Ray, Thanks for the tips on netting fish. With the large tank that I have, every little bit helps. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13401	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: DIY Water chiller plans

<http://www.floridadriftwood.com/water_changer.htm> http://www.floridadriftwood.com/water_changer.htm Eric [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13402	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: algae was Nitrate #s

In a message dated 7/15/2005 1:21:44 P.M. Central Standard Time, woad@... writes: Other species of snails can be harmful as they propagate in large numbers and can be hard to get rid of. It is because of that we have a single apple snail in the tank ;-) Apple snails don't propagate? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13403	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: New tank

Wow. That would look really great in my kitchen! Are you keeping it on the floor I take it? (I wouldn't imagine you'd move it when full.) Good luck with it. It's really great. =) Leslie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nimish Mathur Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 5:05 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] New tank Hello People :-) Some of you must be missing me I suppose ;) Well, to start with. I got a new tank. A tall 4ft hex acrylic. Below are some pics. http://www.nimmat.com/coppermine/thumbnails.php?album=25 I really wanted this tank to be for a pair of Angels but wife wants goldfish so I am stuffed there :-( But that's fine. I decided on a UGF because I did not really want any unsightly things in the tank and besides with a 6" gravel substrate, I am sure that will be a superb biological media. I plan on having some crypts in there (don't ask me how I am gonna plant in a 4ft deep tank coz I have not thought of it yet) and a couple of onion plants. Goldfish will go in once the plants are established. Views please :-) Thanks, Nim

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13404	From: Sandra willber	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Betta question

Hi there everyone, I had asked a question about bettas, and wondered if anyone knew the anser. I had asked if anyone knew what was the best temperture is best to keep bettas at in order for them to breed. I have 3 females and 1 male in a 10,gallon fish tank, but the male doesn't look interested in the females. The temperture is set at 78. Do I need to have them in a bigger tank, or higher tempertures? Sandra These are new groups that have started up since January 2005; http://groups.yahoo.com/group/nandaychatter http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Wisconsin-photography-club http://groups.yahoo.com/group/The-photography-club http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Wisconsin-walkers-club http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Talking-across-america __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13405	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: hit send to quick.( corycatfish)( breath right )

Now that was cute..... :-) rob indiana In a message dated 7/15/2005 3:28:38 PM US Eastern Standard Time, lnvtm1@... writes: Mine won't hold still long enough to put one of them "Breathe Right Strips" on it. And when I finally do get one on it, it gets mad because it wants the "Finding Nemo" themed strips. :-D [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13406	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: LOW, LOW priced tanks at GlassCages.com

better yet ask them if they have Seconds... I know Perfecto does. as I have 2 of them.. Seconds are tanks with a mild defect, mostly cosmetic defects, that can not be sold at retail prices. Most of the SECONDS I have seen , have either a big scratch in the glass or the corners are not squared.,so there is a Big silicone bead on one side. The manufacterer would rather sell them for cheap, rather then to scrap them. rob Indiana In a message dated 7/15/2005 4:30:23 PM US Eastern Standard Time, lnvtm1@... writes: They had a 55G Glass tank for $69.00, a 65G Acrylic tank for $110.00 and dozens of other tanks for very low prices. They also make custom sized tanks. Their web site is: http://www.GlassCages.com and their eBay site is: http://stores.ebay.com/Custom-Aquariums_W0QQssPageNameZviQ3asibQ3astoreviewQQtZkm [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13407	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: algae was Nitrate #s

not when you only have one :-D Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 5:53 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] algae was Nitrate #s In a message dated 7/15/2005 1:21:44 P.M. Central Standard Time, woad@... writes: Other species of snails can be harmful as they propagate in large numbers and can be hard to get rid of. It is because of that we have a single apple snail in the tank ;-) Apple snails don't propagate? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13408	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: algae was Nitrate #s

I thought all snails could reproduce partenogenically? Emily Crazy4fids@... wrote: Apple snails don't propagate? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13409	From: wendie	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: Betta question

Well where do we start.... Remove the three females, lower the water to about 6 inches... condition the females and the male for a couple of weeks make sure the female is full of eggs divide the tank so that the (1) female and male cannot reach each other but can see each other either tape a Styrofoam cup cut in half on the side or put a lot of floating plants for the nest the male should then be more receptive and the female should start barring up. If there's no reaction you might need to try another female or male The temperature should be about right. I went higher but got mainly males so I'll go lower next time. Be prepared to jar a bunch of betta babies... I ended up with a spawn of 317 Wendie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Sandra willber Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 9:27 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Betta question Hi there everyone, I had asked a question about bettas, and wondered if anyone knew the anser. I had asked if anyone knew what was the best temperture is best to keep bettas at in order for them to breed. I have 3 females and 1 male in a 10,gallon fish tank, but the male doesn't look interested in the females. The temperture is set at 78. Do I need to have them in a bigger tank, or higher tempertures? Sandra These are new groups that have started up since January 2005; http://groups.yahoo.com/group/nandaychatter http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Wisconsin-photography-club http://groups.yahoo.com/group/The-photography-club http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Wisconsin-walkers-club http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Talking-across-america __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13410	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: algae was Nitrate #s

http://www.applesnail.net/content/anatomy/reproduction.php _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Emily Tenczar Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 7:42 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] algae was Nitrate #s I thought all snails could reproduce partenogenically? Emily Crazy4fids@... wrote: Apple snails don't propagate? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13411	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: Betta question

In a message dated 7/15/2005 8:00:27 P.M. Central Standard Time, wendieo@... writes: Be prepared to jar a bunch of betta babies... I ended up with a spawn of 317 Wow Wendy! What did you do with all those bettas? I can just imagine your kitchen counter, dining room table, coffee table, night stand, bathroom counter, and computer desk all covered with little betta bowls, juice cups, measuring cups, jelly jars, canning jars, candle holders...... Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13412	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: feeding cucumber

I heard that I could feed my plecos fresh cucumber. This morning before work, I scrubbed the cuke, sliced it, put it in a tupperware dish for my lunch and stuck a slice in each of my tanks (150 and 10 gallon). This afternoon when I returned home from work the 10 gallon was cloudy (the 150 is already cloudy from the PimaFix). Was I suppose to boil it or nuke the cuke, first? Is it normal for it to cloud your water? I did anchor the cuke slice under a piece of wood and when I got home, there was an oticinclis on it. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13413	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: cloudy water

After I am done treating my 150 gallon take with the PimaFix, how much of a water change should I do? Is 50% enough or should I do more? Will activated carbon and zelite help with the cloudy water? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13414	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: use of laterite

When I decided to use live plants in my 150 freshwater aquarium, I started doing some research. I decided to use laterite in the center part of the tank where the majority of the live plants were going to be planted. I have mixed additional laterite into the substrate where I have planted smaller plants in the front of the tank. When I had the problem with the polished pebbles raising my pH and had to go on a pebble hunt, I stirred up a lot of the laterite. I recently read on ONE web site laterite that is not covered with another type of substrate would make my water cloudy and add large quantities of iron into my water. The instructions on the box said for new tanks to cover the laterite with substrate or could be mixed into the existing substrate for established tanks. The instructions never said anything about cloudy water. Does anyone have any experience with this? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13415	From: wendie	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: Betta question

Oh, so correct.... I am right now rigging up two ten gallon tanks to house a few right now. I have some in a 12 gallon, more in a 10 gallon, more in 2.5 gallon tanks. Had a problem yesterday... lost about 6... they got sucked up in a filter I was loading up with bacteria. I'm running out of room..... One jumped the divider yesterday.... check this out...... www.nashnutphoto.com/poorboy.bmp Wendie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 8:08 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Betta question In a message dated 7/15/2005 8:00:27 P.M. Central Standard Time, wendieo@... writes: Be prepared to jar a bunch of betta babies... I ended up with a spawn of 317 Wow Wendy! What did you do with all those bettas? I can just imagine your kitchen counter, dining room table, coffee table, night stand, bathroom counter, and computer desk all covered with little betta bowls, juice cups, measuring cups, jelly jars, canning jars, candle holders...... Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13416	From: wendie	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: Betta question

Here's the winner.... http://www.nashnutphoto.com/thevictor.bmp loser http://www.nashnutphoto.com/poorboy.bmp Wendie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of wendie Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 8:50 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Betta question Oh, so correct.... I am right now rigging up two ten gallon tanks to house a few right now. I have some in a 12 gallon, more in a 10 gallon, more in 2.5 gallon tanks. Had a problem yesterday... lost about 6... they got sucked up in a filter I was loading up with bacteria. I'm running out of room..... One jumped the divider yesterday.... check this out...... www.nashnutphoto.com/poorboy.bmp Wendie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13417	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: use of laterite

Everything I have read says it is used as a sub layer of the substrate. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 8:30 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] use of laterite When I decided to use live plants in my 150 freshwater aquarium, I started doing some research. I decided to use laterite in the center part of the tank where the majority of the live plants were going to be planted. I have mixed additional laterite into the substrate where I have planted smaller plants in the front of the tank. When I had the problem with the polished pebbles raising my pH and had to go on a pebble hunt, I stirred up a lot of the laterite. I recently read on ONE web site laterite that is not covered with another type of substrate would make my water cloudy and add large quantities of iron into my water. The instructions on the box said for new tanks to cover the laterite with substrate or could be mixed into the existing substrate for established tanks. The instructions never said anything about cloudy water. Does anyone have any experience with this? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13418	From: Evita	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

Eric, I heard that they don't breed well so the have to be caught wild and shipped. They tend to be very stressed by the time they are sold and are hard to keep alive. I was wondering if anyone has ever had them or has them now. They are tooooo cute. I would love to hear more about them from anyone that has them. Evita Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote:They are technically brackish water fish, but do well in a well kept freshwater. If they are sick, however, they will not last long in freshwater. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 2:56 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s i don't think they're saltwater. at petsmart they were in freshwater, but of course this doesn't necessarily mean anything =) the ones i saw at petsmart look kinda like eels. --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > if you are talking about the salt water dragonfish or > dragon goby that has a starburst pattern around its > eyes, they are not difficult to keep but love to eat > hermits and snails! > > --- Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote: > > > i see you have violet gobies, aka dragonfish. i saw > > one of those @ petsmart awhile back and was > > interested in them. but then heard that they're > > rather hard to keep. have you found this to be > > true? > > > > --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > > > > > It's been fine for the past few months. The main > > reason I do the amount of > > > water change is it is 2 bucket loads (10 gallons) > > I will try going to 3 > > > bucket loads from now on and see if that helps. > > What bothered me was that > > > even after the water change, there was no change > > in the amount of nitrates. > > > In any case...the levels have been down to 40 ppm > > for the past 2 days. I am > > > also in the process of getting more plants, so > > that should help the nitrate > > > levels as well. Unfortunately I lost a couple of > > my spiny eels in the > > > process :-( Once I get more plants in, I will > > remove the nitrate sponge and > > > see if the ntrate level stabilizes or spikes > > again. BTW...I also did move > > > my 7 Danios out of the main tank and put them into > > the tank with the ghost > > > shrimp as the dannies are too small to try and eat > > the shrimp. > > > > > > Eric > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > > > Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 3:07 PM > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > > > > For easier maintenance in the future: While I > > don't know the fish- > > > load you are dealing with (unless I missed that > > part), you might try > > > 33% water changes every week (as many hobbyists > > normally do) instead > > > of 20% every two weeks. The necessity of this > > naturally depends on > > > your fish load, but if your nitrates were up to > > 160, I'd have to say > > > you may possibly have a somewhat heavy fish-load. > > A 20% change is > > > practically nothing anyway -- that much of a water > > change would bring > > > your nitrates down to 128, and that's with > > refilling with fresh water > > > that has absolutely no nitrates in it. After a > > two week period, > > > enough time has gone by that the amount of nitrate > > you took out has > > > been replaced (and then some) from the break-down > > of fish waste. It > > > just keeps escalating -- its a case of too little > > - too late! You > > > shouldn't need to put nitrate absorber in your > > filter. Just change > > > more water more frequently, or lessen your > > fish-load. Ray > > > \ > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" > > <woad@w...> wrote: > > > > I just did daily water changes as well a a good > > deep cleaning of > > > the gravel. > > > > I put the bags of nitrate/nitrite/phosphate > > absorber in my filters > > > just to > > > > help get rid of what was already in the water. > > I think this is > > > what has > > > > helped as water changes prior to this did not > > effect the nitrate > > > levels. I > > > > don;t think it was from over feeding. We did > > have that problem, > > > but I > > > > reduced the amount of food, plus got some > > critters that will mop up > > > the > > > > uneaten food. I haven't added any fertilizers > > for my plants as of > > > yet, so > > > > that is not the source. I am not sure where all > > the excess > > > nitrates are > > > > coming from. I normally do a 20% water change > > every 2 weeks. So I > > > haven't > > > > figured out the source. My only thought is that > > it may have had > > > something > > > > to do with my UGF. I turned it off as I am > > slowly adding plants > > > and that is > > > > when the nitrate levels went down to 40 (same > > day as I added the > > > absorbing > > > > material). This was something that has happened > > over the past few > > > weeks, so > > > > it was the extended exposure to high nitrate > > levels that I was > > > concerned > > > > about. I lost 2 of my spiny eels in the past > > week, so I think that > > > may have > > > > been the cause. > > > > > > > > Eric > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > > Behalf Of Steve Szabo > > > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 9:39 PM > > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > > > > > > > 160 ppm is a ways away from killing your fish. > > Over a long term it > > > may cause > > > > problems in your fish, bit is nothing to panic > > over as you do have > > > plenty of > > > > time to determine the problem and reduce the > > presence of the > > > nitrate without > > > > taking any drastic actions. > > > > > > > > Now, if we were talking a reef tank here, that > > would be a whole > > > other > > > > ballgame, and your tank would be essentially > > dead. But, we are not, > > > and your > > > > tank would have been OK without rushing about to > > "do something" > > > about the > > > > nitrates. > > > > > > > > \\Steve// > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > > Behalf Of Eric Roberts > > > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 1:39 PM > > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > > > I just had a major issue with nitrates...they > > shot up through the > > > roof (and > > > > I have some plants). I got some of the nitrate > > sponges to soak > > > some of them > > > > up before they kill my fish. I have been doing > > 20 % water changes > > > every day > > > > and after about a week, they got down to 40 > > ppm...they were as high > > > as 160 > > > > at one point. One of my tasks is to get more > > plants and more > > > light. I am > > > > designing a hood for my 55 gal tank, so once I > > get that all in > > > place, I > > > > should be fine...or at least I hope. I am also > > getting rid of my > > > gravel > > > > eventually and replacing it with sand. This of > > course means no > > > more UGF, > > > > but it looks a lot nicer. I set up my 20 gal to > > house some of my > > > smaller > > > > fish and some ghost shrimp that I got for food > > for my larger fish > > > and I used > > > > the Tahitian moonlight black sand. It looks > > awesome with that. I > > > will be > > > === message truncated === > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13419	From: Evita	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: Betta question

Ouch! To the loser......Will he be alright? Evita wendie <wendieo@...> wrote:Here's the winner.... http://www.nashnutphoto.com/thevictor.bmp loser http://www.nashnutphoto.com/poorboy.bmp Wendie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of wendie Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 8:50 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Betta question Oh, so correct.... I am right now rigging up two ten gallon tanks to house a few right now. I have some in a 12 gallon, more in a 10 gallon, more in 2.5 gallon tanks. Had a problem yesterday... lost about 6... they got sucked up in a filter I was loading up with bacteria. I'm running out of room..... One jumped the divider yesterday.... check this out...... www.nashnutphoto.com/poorboy.bmp Wendie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13420	From: Nan	Date: 7/15/2005
Subject: Re: Betta question

Hi, Sandra. Instead of going into a long explanation and step by step instructions on spawning betta splendens let me give you a few links to follow up on that do give you some helpful hints: http://www.bettacave.com/Spawning.html http://bettazines.freewebpage.org/spawn.htm http://www.bettatalk.com/breeding_bettas.htm (also has great fry care, and basic betta care tips!) Betta Growth in Pictures, for anyone interested: http://www.bettacave.com/Spawning.html And Fry Care: http://bettazines.freewebpage.org/fry.htm I hope this helps somewhat. Good luck. ~nan~ Sandra willber <tracksacrossamerica@...> wrote: Hi there everyone, I had asked a question about bettas, and wondered if anyone knew the anser. I had asked if anyone knew what was the best temperture is best to keep bettas at in order for them to breed. I have 3 females and 1 male in a 10,gallon fish tank, but the male doesn't look interested in the females. The temperture is set at 78. Do I need to have them in a bigger tank, or higher tempertures? Sandra --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13421	From: wendie	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: Betta question

I think so. He's very active... even flaring at the victor today. Eats good and the color is returning around his head. You can just see the regrowth on his fins starting. Considering it's only been a couple of days I think he's doing good. Wendie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Evita Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 10:52 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Betta question Ouch! To the loser......Will he be alright? Evita wendie <wendieo@...> wrote:Here's the winner.... http://www.nashnutphoto.com/thevictor.bmp loser http://www.nashnutphoto.com/poorboy.bmp Wendie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of wendie Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 8:50 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Betta question Oh, so correct.... I am right now rigging up two ten gallon tanks to house a few right now. I have some in a 12 gallon, more in a 10 gallon, more in 2.5 gallon tanks. Had a problem yesterday... lost about 6... they got sucked up in a filter I was loading up with bacteria. I'm running out of room..... One jumped the divider yesterday.... check this out...... www.nashnutphoto.com/poorboy.bmp Wendie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13422	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: New tank

Leslie, Yes, this is on the floor but its not overly heavy. 130L I think but yes, it cannot be moved when filled :-s Thanks, Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Dane & Leslie Moore Sent: 16 July 2005 00:17 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] New tank Wow. That would look really great in my kitchen! Are you keeping it on the floor I take it? (I wouldn't imagine you'd move it when full.) Good luck with it. It's really great. =) Leslie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nimish Mathur Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 5:05 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] New tank Hello People :-) Some of you must be missing me I suppose ;) Well, to start with. I got a new tank. A tall 4ft hex acrylic. Below are some pics. http://www.nimmat.com/coppermine/thumbnails.php?album=25 I really wanted this tank to be for a pair of Angels but wife wants goldfish so I am stuffed there :-( But that's fine. I decided on a UGF because I did not really want any unsightly things in the tank and besides with a 6" gravel substrate, I am sure that will be a superb biological media. I plan on having some crypts in there (don't ask me how I am gonna plant in a 4ft deep tank coz I have not thought of it yet) and a couple of onion plants. Goldfish will go in once the plants are established. Views please :-) Thanks, Nim 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13423	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: Betta question

Do you book bets on your fish (LOL!)? Seriously though, to raise 317 Bettas from one spawn says something about your aquarium knowledge -- Congrats. Have you ever thought about raising Crowntail Bettas or Halfmoon Bettas? While they're a bit more expensive to buy at first (might get a good buy on AquaBid), good ones are always in demand and you should have no trouble getting rid of them. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, wendie <wendieo@o...> wrote: > I think so. He's very active... even flaring at the victor today. Eats > good and the color is returning around his head. You can just see the > regrowth on his fins starting. Considering it's only been a couple of days > I think he's doing good. > Wendie > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On > Behalf Of Evita > Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 10:52 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Betta question > > > Ouch! To the loser......Will he be alright? Evita > > wendie <wendieo@o...> wrote:Here's the winner.... > http://www.nashnutphoto.com/thevictor.bmp > > loser http://www.nashnutphoto.com/poorboy.bmp > > Wendie > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On > Behalf Of wendie > Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 8:50 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Betta question > > > Oh, so correct.... > I am right now rigging up two ten gallon tanks to house a few right now. > I > have some in a 12 gallon, more in a 10 gallon, more in 2.5 gallon tanks. > Had a problem yesterday... lost about 6... they got sucked up in a > filter > I > was loading up with bacteria. I'm running out of room..... > > One jumped the divider yesterday.... check this out...... > www.nashnutphoto.com/poorboy.bmp > Wendie > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- -------- > -- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service. > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- -------- > -- > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13424	From: wendie	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: Betta question

Hi, Yes, the only reason I bred these was because I didn't want to lose the female CT. I also thought I would establish a marble base but there's only a few grizzles. Otherwise I wouldn't have done it. With my luck, there was a high % of males to females so I do need to lower the temperatures a bit in the breeding tank. I would like more females or at least a better balance. Finding homes for the males is a drag though!!! I'm down to about 50 males so I'm sticking them everywhere. Seriously thou, I do have two pairs coming in that I want to work with. One pair is an unusual b/w/r CT and the other is a red marble pair of plakats - both with interesting patterns. Now my quest when I get more room is to find a white female CT and a white female plakat. I also want to try leaving a male in with the spawn longer for culling reasons. I have to admit that I totally enjoyed working with them. I've raised the usual angels, cats, grourami, etc in the past but there's something a bit different with these. Wendie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Saturday, July 16, 2005 9:07 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Betta question Do you book bets on your fish (LOL!)? Seriously though, to raise 317 Bettas from one spawn says something about your aquarium knowledge -- Congrats. Have you ever thought about raising Crowntail Bettas or Halfmoon Bettas? While they're a bit more expensive to buy at first (might get a good buy on AquaBid), good ones are always in demand and you should have no trouble getting rid of them. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, wendie <wendieo@o...> wrote: > I think so. He's very active... even flaring at the victor today. Eats > good and the color is returning around his head. You can just see the > regrowth on his fins starting. Considering it's only been a couple of days > I think he's doing good. > Wendie > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On > Behalf Of Evita > Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 10:52 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Betta question > > > Ouch! To the loser......Will he be alright? Evita > > wendie <wendieo@o...> wrote:Here's the winner.... > http://www.nashnutphoto.com/thevictor.bmp > > loser http://www.nashnutphoto.com/poorboy.bmp > > Wendie > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On > Behalf Of wendie > Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 8:50 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Betta question > > > Oh, so correct.... > I am right now rigging up two ten gallon tanks to house a few right now. > I > have some in a 12 gallon, more in a 10 gallon, more in 2.5 gallon tanks. > Had a problem yesterday... lost about 6... they got sucked up in a > filter > I > was loading up with bacteria. I'm running out of room..... > > One jumped the divider yesterday.... check this out...... > www.nashnutphoto.com/poorboy.bmp > Wendie > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- -------- > -- > YAHOO! 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13425	From: ahorseofcourse66	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: OLD CORAL ????

Hi< I WAS AT AN AUCTION TODAY AND THERE WAS 2 BOXES WITH OLD CORAL IN THEM. BIG PIECES LIKE 12IN BY 10INCHS OR MAYBE EVEN BIGGER. WHATS YOUR OPPINONS ABOUT CLEANING AND USING THEM IN A BIG FRESHWATER TANK? ALSO HAD SOME DRIFT WOOD AND LARGE STONES.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13426	From: Nan	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: New tank

I think if you wrap end of some barbeque tongs (the real long ones) with something like guaze, that will help keep you from squishing the plant, holding the plant with one end of the tongs, and then push it under the substrate to "plant" it, then gently lift the tongs out, you could plant tall plants in there like the swords, or similar plants? Just a thought. But it is a small problem to figure out, isn't it? But I like the look of it. How do you plan to use a gravel vacummn on it? What else other than goldies are thinking of? What type of tank cleaner (such as a pleco) can you put with goldfish to help with algea problems, etc? Nan Nimish Mathur <nimmat4@...> wrote: Leslie, Yes, this is on the floor but its not overly heavy. 130L I think but yes, it cannot be moved when filled :-s Thanks, Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Dane & Leslie Moore Sent: 16 July 2005 00:17 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] New tank Wow. That would look really great in my kitchen! Are you keeping it on the floor I take it? (I wouldn't imagine you'd move it when full.) Good luck with it. It's really great. =) Leslie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nimish Mathur Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 5:05 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] New tank Hello People :-) Some of you must be missing me I suppose ;) Well, to start with. I got a new tank. A tall 4ft hex acrylic. Below are some pics. http://www.nimmat.com/coppermine/thumbnails.php?album=25 I really wanted this tank to be for a pair of Angels but wife wants goldfish so I am stuffed there :-( But that's fine. I decided on a UGF because I did not really want any unsightly things in the tank and besides with a 6" gravel substrate, I am sure that will be a superb biological media. I plan on having some crypts in there (don't ask me how I am gonna plant in a 4ft deep tank coz I have not thought of it yet) and a couple of onion plants. Goldfish will go in once the plants are established. Views please :-) Thanks, Nim --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13427	From: Nan	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Driftwood

I have searched high and low on the WWW for information on prepareing my driftwood for my tank. There are 2 pieces that I have had soaking in a large blue tote, with dechlorinated water with a high dose of Aquarium salt to kill any unwanted pests. I saw on another website that I need to boil them to make them sink, possibly several times. I want to partially hollow out one before attaching it to the plexi plate that I am going to silicon gravel to. I am attatching the log to the plexi plate with either aquarium silicon, or with stainless steel screw so I can change it out. I would prefer to use the screw, so that I can replace the wood as it decays (I think that is the term I am looking for?). I am currently going to go change out the water with the logs, so I can soak at least one more week, before attempting to put it all together and by the middle of the following week I should be able to place it in the tank. I know I will still get some tannis from it, but I have no problem with changeing out my filters a little more often for awhile, and a light brown color to the water (tan color?) for awhile will not bother me, and should be fine with the fish. The question I have is, is there anything more I should do to these 2 pieces before placeing them in the tank, or is that all I need to do? Thanks for the help, y'all!! ~nan~ __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13428	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: What types of rocks should I use in my tank?

I want to make a secluded place for my smaller fish to go when chased or need to be away from the medium size fish in the tank? I have some small rocks that I can make hiding spots with but not sure if they are good for the tank. They're limestone. Thanks, Beth http://fa.f-realm.com/ Fanfiction Axis. http://e.webring.com/hub?ring=siriusblack Sirius Black webring. http://e.webring.com/hub?ring=remuslupin Remus Lupin webring http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sailorsenshiocs/ for all original and series characters of Sailor Moon. http://www.livejournal.com/userinfo.bml?user=tropical_fishes Tropical fish tank livejournal community. ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13429	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: What types of rocks should I use in my tank?

What kind of fish do you have in your tank? The limestone will make your pH go up and harden your water. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13430	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

I have 2 of them that are doing quite well. They usually hide in their caves...sticking their heads out when they smell food. I think they are also the main eaters of the ghost shrimp as I am sure the shrimp try to hide in the same caves where they hide hehehe. I don;t think my angels hunt them all down. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evita Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 10:29 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s Eric, I heard that they don't breed well so the have to be caught wild and shipped. They tend to be very stressed by the time they are sold and are hard to keep alive. I was wondering if anyone has ever had them or has them now. They are tooooo cute. I would love to hear more about them from anyone that has them. Evita Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote:They are technically brackish water fish, but do well in a well kept freshwater. If they are sick, however, they will not last long in freshwater. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 2:56 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s i don't think they're saltwater. at petsmart they were in freshwater, but of course this doesn't necessarily mean anything =) the ones i saw at petsmart look kinda like eels. --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > if you are talking about the salt water dragonfish or > dragon goby that has a starburst pattern around its > eyes, they are not difficult to keep but love to eat > hermits and snails! > > --- Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote: > > > i see you have violet gobies, aka dragonfish. i saw > > one of those @ petsmart awhile back and was > > interested in them. but then heard that they're > > rather hard to keep. have you found this to be > > true? > > > > --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > > > > > It's been fine for the past few months. The main > > reason I do the amount of > > > water change is it is 2 bucket loads (10 gallons) > > I will try going to 3 > > > bucket loads from now on and see if that helps. > > What bothered me was that > > > even after the water change, there was no change > > in the amount of nitrates. > > > In any case...the levels have been down to 40 ppm > > for the past 2 days. I am > > > also in the process of getting more plants, so > > that should help the nitrate > > > levels as well. Unfortunately I lost a couple of > > my spiny eels in the > > > process :-( Once I get more plants in, I will > > remove the nitrate sponge and > > > see if the ntrate level stabilizes or spikes > > again. BTW...I also did move > > > my 7 Danios out of the main tank and put them into > > the tank with the ghost > > > shrimp as the dannies are too small to try and eat > > the shrimp. > > > > > > Eric > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > > > Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 3:07 PM > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > > > > For easier maintenance in the future: While I > > don't know the fish- > > > load you are dealing with (unless I missed that > > part), you might try > > > 33% water changes every week (as many hobbyists > > normally do) instead > > > of 20% every two weeks. The necessity of this > > naturally depends on > > > your fish load, but if your nitrates were up to > > 160, I'd have to say > > > you may possibly have a somewhat heavy fish-load. > > A 20% change is > > > practically nothing anyway -- that much of a water > > change would bring > > > your nitrates down to 128, and that's with > > refilling with fresh water > > > that has absolutely no nitrates in it. After a > > two week period, > > > enough time has gone by that the amount of nitrate > > you took out has > > > been replaced (and then some) from the break-down > > of fish waste. It > > > just keeps escalating -- its a case of too little > > - too late! You > > > shouldn't need to put nitrate absorber in your > > filter. Just change > > > more water more frequently, or lessen your > > fish-load. Ray > > > \ > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" > > <woad@w...> wrote: > > > > I just did daily water changes as well a a good > > deep cleaning of > > > the gravel. > > > > I put the bags of nitrate/nitrite/phosphate > > absorber in my filters > > > just to > > > > help get rid of what was already in the water. > > I think this is > > > what has > > > > helped as water changes prior to this did not > > effect the nitrate > > > levels. I > > > > don;t think it was from over feeding. We did > > have that problem, > > > but I > > > > reduced the amount of food, plus got some > > critters that will mop up > > > the > > > > uneaten food. I haven't added any fertilizers > > for my plants as of > > > yet, so > > > > that is not the source. I am not sure where all > > the excess > > > nitrates are > > > > coming from. I normally do a 20% water change > > every 2 weeks. So I > > > haven't > > > > figured out the source. My only thought is that > > it may have had > > > something > > > > to do with my UGF. I turned it off as I am > > slowly adding plants > > > and that is > > > > when the nitrate levels went down to 40 (same > > day as I added the > > > absorbing > > > > material). This was something that has happened > > over the past few > > > weeks, so > > > > it was the extended exposure to high nitrate > > levels that I was > > > concerned > > > > about. I lost 2 of my spiny eels in the past > > week, so I think that > > > may have > > > > been the cause. > > > > > > > > Eric > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > > Behalf Of Steve Szabo > > > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 9:39 PM > > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > > > > > > > 160 ppm is a ways away from killing your fish. > > Over a long term it > > > may cause > > > > problems in your fish, bit is nothing to panic > > over as you do have > > > plenty of > > > > time to determine the problem and reduce the > > presence of the > > > nitrate without > > > > taking any drastic actions. > > > > > > > > Now, if we were talking a reef tank here, that > > would be a whole > > > other > > > > ballgame, and your tank would be essentially > > dead. But, we are not, > > > and your > > > > tank would have been OK without rushing about to > > "do something" > > > about the > > > > nitrates. > > > > > > > > \\Steve// > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > > Behalf Of Eric Roberts > > > > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 1:39 PM > > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > > > > > > I just had a major issue with nitrates...they > > shot up through the > > > roof (and > > > > I have some plants). I got some of the nitrate > > sponges to soak > > > some of them > > > > up before they kill my fish. I have been doing > > 20 % water changes > > > every day > > > > and after about a week, they got down to 40 > > ppm...they were as high > > > as 160 > > > > at one point. One of my tasks is to get more > > plants and more > > > light. I am > > > > designing a hood for my 55 gal tank, so once I > > get that all in > > > place, I > > > > should be fine...or at least I hope. I am also > > getting rid of my > > > gravel > > > > eventually and replacing it with sand. This of > > course means no > > > more UGF, > > > > but it looks a lot nicer. I set up my 20 gal to > > house some of my > > > smaller > > > > fish and some ghost shrimp that I got for food > > for my larger fish > > > and I used > > > > the Tahitian moonlight black sand. It looks > > awesome with that. I > > > will be > > > === message truncated === > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13431	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: OLD CORAL ????

I'd use them.... need my mailing address? rob Indiana In a message dated 7/16/2005 12:35:14 PM US Eastern Standard Time, ahorseofcourse66@... writes: Hi< I WAS AT AN AUCTION TODAY AND THERE WAS 2 BOXES WITH OLD CORAL IN THEM. BIG PIECES LIKE 12IN BY 10INCHS OR MAYBE EVEN BIGGER. WHATS YOUR OPPINONS ABOUT CLEANING AND USING THEM IN A BIG FRESHWATER TANK? ALSO HAD SOME DRIFT WOOD AND LARGE STONES. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13432	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: What types of rocks should I use in my tank?

I have at the moment Angelfishes. I do plan on getting some neons, swordtails and some other fish for my fifty-five gallon tank and some for my 30 gallon tank. Beth --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > What kind of fish do you have in your tank? The limestone will make your pH go up and harden your water. > > Linda

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13433	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: OLD CORAL ????

If I remember correctly, it will increase the hardness of your water. Coral is made up of calcium carbonate , so it will effect your water chemistry... Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of ahorseofcourse66 Sent: Saturday, July 16, 2005 12:35 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] OLD CORAL ???? Hi< I WAS AT AN AUCTION TODAY AND THERE WAS 2 BOXES WITH OLD CORAL IN THEM. BIG PIECES LIKE 12IN BY 10INCHS OR MAYBE EVEN BIGGER. WHATS YOUR OPPINONS ABOUT CLEANING AND USING THEM IN A BIG FRESHWATER TANK? ALSO HAD SOME DRIFT WOOD AND LARGE STONES. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13434	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrate #s

I just updated the site with pics...unfortunately they are webcam pics, so they are not the best... Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Roberts Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 8:09 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s oops...lets try http://www.witchnet.org/aquarium.cfm (amazing what leaving off a "w" will do hehehe) Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evita Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 4:29 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s Sorry Eric Nothing there. Evita Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote:you can see what I have...I have started a page on my site, but haven't completed it. It does have a good listing of my fish... http://ww.witchnet.org/aquarium.cfm Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 3:07 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s For easier maintenance in the future: While I don't know the fish- load you are dealing with (unless I missed that part), you might try 33% water changes every week (as many hobbyists normally do) instead of 20% every two weeks. The necessity of this naturally depends on your fish load, but if your nitrates were up to 160, I'd have to say you may possibly have a somewhat heavy fish-load. A 20% change is practically nothing anyway -- that much of a water change would bring your nitrates down to 128, and that's with refilling with fresh water that has absolutely no nitrates in it. After a two week period, enough time has gone by that the amount of nitrate you took out has been replaced (and then some) from the break-down of fish waste. It just keeps escalating -- its a case of too little - too late! You shouldn't need to put nitrate absorber in your filter. Just change more water more frequently, or lessen your fish-load. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > I just did daily water changes as well a a good deep cleaning of the gravel. > I put the bags of nitrate/nitrite/phosphate absorber in my filters just to > help get rid of what was already in the water. I think this is what has > helped as water changes prior to this did not effect the nitrate levels. I > don;t think it was from over feeding. We did have that problem, but I > reduced the amount of food, plus got some critters that will mop up the > uneaten food. I haven't added any fertilizers for my plants as of yet, so > that is not the source. I am not sure where all the excess nitrates are > coming from. I normally do a 20% water change every 2 weeks. So I haven't > figured out the source. My only thought is that it may have had something > to do with my UGF. I turned it off as I am slowly adding plants and that is > when the nitrate levels went down to 40 (same day as I added the absorbing > material). This was something that has happened over the past few weeks, so > it was the extended exposure to high nitrate levels that I was concerned > about. I lost 2 of my spiny eels in the past week, so I think that may have > been the cause. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Steve Szabo > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 9:39 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > 160 ppm is a ways away from killing your fish. Over a long term it may cause > problems in your fish, bit is nothing to panic over as you do have plenty of > time to determine the problem and reduce the presence of the nitrate without > taking any drastic actions. > > Now, if we were talking a reef tank here, that would be a whole other > ballgame, and your tank would be essentially dead. But, we are not, and your > tank would have been OK without rushing about to "do something" about the > nitrates. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Eric Roberts > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 1:39 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > I just had a major issue with nitrates...they shot up through the roof (and > I have some plants). I got some of the nitrate sponges to soak some of them > up before they kill my fish. I have been doing 20 % water changes every day > and after about a week, they got down to 40 ppm...they were as high as 160 > at one point. One of my tasks is to get more plants and more light. I am > designing a hood for my 55 gal tank, so once I get that all in place, I > should be fine...or at least I hope. I am also getting rid of my gravel > eventually and replacing it with sand. This of course means no more UGF, > but it looks a lot nicer. I set up my 20 gal to house some of my smaller > fish and some ghost shrimp that I got for food for my larger fish and I used > the Tahitian moonlight black sand. It looks awesome with that. I will be > switching over to that in the next month or so in the big tank. The only > thing I don;t like about the sand is it is a real PIA to get clean. When I > was setting up the 20 gal, I thought I had it clean, but ended up having to > empty out the tank and refilling it after cleaning the gravel once > again...ugg. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2005 10:37 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Nitrate #s > > > A reading of 20 ppm is normal and on the low end of average. This > should not be of any concern provided you have enough plants in there > to constantly use this up as its being produced (and you're not > overfeeding). If you keep your lighting normal, any algae should not > get a chance to multiply. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > What is a "safe" number regarding nitrates? Everything is testing 0 > but > > of course I am getting a reading on nitrates, seems to be at 20 ppm. > > The reason I ask is due to this seemingly minor algae bloom. I've > seen > > others have this and then a full out mess within days. I don't want > > that. > > Anyhow, safe nitrate number? > > Thanks > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13435	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: feeding cucumber

I do not cook my cucumber or zucchini first. I leave it in overnight and it usually causes a little haze in the tank. It goes away on it's own once the food it out (I think it's because the food starts coming apart into the water). Just my experience, glad the oto liked it :) --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > > I heard that I could feed my plecos fresh cucumber. This morning before > work, I scrubbed the cuke, sliced it, put it in a tupperware dish for my lunch > and stuck a slice in each of my tanks (150 and 10 gallon). > > This afternoon when I returned home from work the 10 gallon was cloudy (the > 150 is already cloudy from the PimaFix). > > Was I suppose to boil it or nuke the cuke, first? Is it normal for it to > cloud your water? I did anchor the cuke slice under a piece of wood and when I > got home, there was an oticinclis on it. > > Linda > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13436	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Betta Babies

Well, at one month old they are about 3/4 inch long now, and tinting. they still don't look noticeably different from the guppy fry, unless you look closely at the transparent fins. I think we may have gotten two blues out of this mating between two red bettas. Is this normal? To our delight, our favorite fish store in the area, seaworks aquariums, has said that they would be delighted to have bettas from a local breeder instead of ordering them long distance. The sixty gallon tank is nice and busy with activity from the babies zipping all over the place. I swear they play with the ghost shrimp. They also like to wiggle up on top of my floating plants as if to bask...is this normal?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13437	From: Dan	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: Betta Babies

to answer the questions, it may be normal to get different colors other than the parents colors if they carry that gene. It depends, if they are a LFS stock or breeder you got them from originally, you could ask them. As for the 'basking on plants', this is actually very normal for BETTAs to swim up onto plants & sit there enjoying the lights rays, a lot of mine like to do it if they are in a tank with plants that float - like in the breeding tanks. Hope this helps & Best Fishes! Dan (thaSkorpeon) --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "cynthia brennemann" <brennewoman@h...> wrote: > Well, at one month old they are about 3/4 inch long now, and tinting. > they still don't look noticeably different from the guppy fry, unless > you look closely at the transparent fins. I think we may have gotten > two blues out of this mating between two red bettas. Is this normal? > To our delight, our favorite fish store in the area, seaworks > aquariums, has said that they would be delighted to have bettas from a > local breeder instead of ordering them long distance. The sixty gallon > tank is nice and busy with activity from the babies zipping all over > the place. I swear they play with the ghost shrimp. They also like to > wiggle up on top of my floating plants as if to bask...is this normal?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13438	From: Dan	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: OLD CORAL ????

As far as cleaning coral, put into a bucket with 1:10 (bleach:water) mix and let it soak as this will clean it and kill any living things on/in it. After letting it soak for 1-2 days, rinse repeatedly until you can no longer smell any bleach at all - that is very, very important to not smell any bleach. then let it completely dry. after it dries, put it into your tanks. Coral is good for raising the ph and water hardness as it is calcium/salt based. I have used coral previously for angelfish tanks and african cichlid tanks. Hope this helps & Best Fishes! Dan (thaSkorpeon) --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "ahorseofcourse66" <ahorseofcourse66@y...> wrote: > Hi< I WAS AT AN AUCTION TODAY AND THERE WAS 2 BOXES WITH OLD CORAL IN > THEM. BIG PIECES LIKE 12IN BY 10INCHS OR MAYBE EVEN BIGGER. WHATS > YOUR OPPINONS ABOUT CLEANING AND USING THEM IN A BIG FRESHWATER TANK? > ALSO HAD SOME DRIFT WOOD AND LARGE STONES.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13439	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: LOW, LOW priced tanks at GlassCages.com

The list of shows he will be coming to is listed on the Glass Cages web site. He does both fish and reptile shows. You can order the tank, and have it delivered to you at the show. Very nice tanks, and some unusual dimensions are available as standard order. (Well, they really are standard dimensions, but you never see them offered in stores any more.) \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 6:39 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: LOW, LOW priced tanks at GlassCages.com Lenny, This tank manufacturer has been around for a number of years now (at least 5 or so years, that I know of). His name is Tom Fiala, in Dickson, TN. As far as I'm concerned, he does excellent work -- at great prices. Best thing I feel about his place is that you can have him custom make any size tank you may need -- again, at excellent prices. He has an enclosed trailer truck and tours some of the larger fish shows throughout the East & Mid-West. I bought a few tanks from him myself and am well satisfied. I would mention, in fairness to all, that I know several other aquarists who bought tanks from him which leaked. Easy enough to fix with a tube of silicone (they were minor leaks), but he does have a warrantee policy if you want to ship it back. I mentioned he does shows, so if you contact him, get his show schedule and make arrangements with him to pick up your tanks at that time, you can save shipping costs which can add up especially if you're ordering a few tanks. Incidentally, on the last day of these shows, he generally donates maybe a half dozen good sized tanks towards the show auction, which you can pick up for a song compared to what the tanks are worth. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Lenny Vasbinder" <lnvtm1@g...> wrote: > If anybody is in the market for a new tank, here is a post I made on the AquariumFish forums: > > As many of you know, I've been shopping around for a new or used tank and after much Googling and eBaying, I found a company selling new tanks CHEAPER than any other place that I could find. > > They had a 55G Glass tank for $69.00, a 65G Acrylic tank for $110.00 and dozens of other tanks for very low prices. They also make custom sized tanks. Their web site is: http://www.GlassCages.com and their eBay site is: http://stores.ebay.com/Custom- Aquariums_W0QQssPageNameZviQ3asibQ3astoreviewQQtZkm > > I then did a Google search on "GlassCages.com reviews" and found many sites/forums with satisfied customers and of course, a few dissatisfied customers. Most of the few complaints were about the man's pre-sale customer service complaints. Apparently, the owner is a very proud man so when people question the quality of his tanks, he gets very defensive and sometimes would tell people that if they don't trust him, they should buy somewhere else. I guess people question his quality because of the LOW, LOW prices and he gets tired of hearing people question his work. He had 207 good reviews on eBay and only 2 bad ones, both having to do with pre-sale complaints. > > Well, I ordered the 65G Acrylic tank (48"L x 18"W x 17"H) on eBay and emailed the company to find out the shipping charges. They replied within a few minutes (GOOD!) and the shipping charges would be $35.00 for FEDEX Ground. Fair shipping price! I then had trouble getting to the secure https: part of eBay to PAY so I emailed them again and they called me and I spoke to the wife, husband and son (computer wiz) and all of them were nice to me. The son was pretty good with computers... I am too and we talked tech talk trying to figure out the problem. I finally figured out what was wrong, went to the secure https: payment page and paid using PayPal. > > After getting the confirmation from PayPal, I sent them another email to GlassCages.com asking about the approximate shipping date, etc., and once again, they replied within minutes and said it would ship tomorrow (Friday) and I should have the tank by Wednesday. Woohoo! > > The company is located in Tennessee so if you live nearby, you could pick it up and save the shipping charges. > > Lenny Vasbinder > http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com > 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 > LNVTM1@g... > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13440	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: New tank

Nim, Hate to disappoint your wife, but that is not a very suitable tank for any gold fish. Too much depth and not enough surface area. You mentioned that the tank holds 130 l, which converts to 34.3 gallons. Really not a heck of a lot of water. In a normal, rectangular tank, that is enough for one adult goldfish. I'm not even sure it would be a good tank for angels. I'd suggest you do a bit more research into various fish before populating this tank, so you can make the right choice of the right fish for the tank and its size. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nimish Mathur Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 6:05 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] New tank Hello People :-) Some of you must be missing me I suppose ;) Well, to start with. I got a new tank. A tall 4ft hex acrylic. Below are some pics. http://www.nimmat.com/coppermine/thumbnails.php?album=25 I really wanted this tank to be for a pair of Angels but wife wants goldfish so I am stuffed there :-( But that's fine. I decided on a UGF because I did not really want any unsightly things in the tank and besides with a 6" gravel substrate, I am sure that will be a superb biological media. I plan on having some crypts in there (don't ask me how I am gonna plant in a 4ft deep tank coz I have not thought of it yet) and a couple of onion plants. Goldfish will go in once the plants are established. Views please :-) Thanks, Nim [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13441	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: feeding cucumber

Quite often the veggies such as zucchini and cucumbers are too firm for the fish to really eat well. Parboiling them, or nuking, them helps to soften up the pulp, so it is more readily accessible to the fish. It will also help the piece sink to the bottom of the tank, though this is not a sure fire method to make this occur. I'd doubt that the cuke would have clouded the water by itself, though it may be possible. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 9:17 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] feeding cucumber I heard that I could feed my plecos fresh cucumber. This morning before work, I scrubbed the cuke, sliced it, put it in a tupperware dish for my lunch and stuck a slice in each of my tanks (150 and 10 gallon). This afternoon when I returned home from work the 10 gallon was cloudy (the 150 is already cloudy from the PimaFix). Was I suppose to boil it or nuke the cuke, first? Is it normal for it to cloud your water? I did anchor the cuke slice under a piece of wood and when I got home, there was an oticinclis on it. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13442	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: OLD CORAL ????

Unless there is a reason to increase the hardness and pH of you present tank's water, I'd not use the coral in the tank.. If there was a reason, I'd use it with caution. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of ahorseofcourse66 Sent: Saturday, July 16, 2005 1:35 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] OLD CORAL ???? Hi< I WAS AT AN AUCTION TODAY AND THERE WAS 2 BOXES WITH OLD CORAL IN THEM. BIG PIECES LIKE 12IN BY 10INCHS OR MAYBE EVEN BIGGER. WHATS YOUR OPPINONS ABOUT CLEANING AND USING THEM IN A BIG FRESHWATER TANK? ALSO HAD SOME DRIFT WOOD AND LARGE STONES. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13443	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: Driftwood

If the wood still floats in water, I'd start soaking it in a chlorine solution for at least one week, then switch to dechlorinated water for the rest of the time it takes the wood to acquire the waterlogged state to stay put once it is added to your tank. Change the water once a week while this is occurring to ensure you are removing any residual chlorine that may have penetrated the surface of the wood. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nan Sent: Saturday, July 16, 2005 2:21 PM To: aquaticlife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Driftwood I have searched high and low on the WWW for information on prepareing my driftwood for my tank. There are 2 pieces that I have had soaking in a large blue tote, with dechlorinated water with a high dose of Aquarium salt to kill any unwanted pests. I saw on another website that I need to boil them to make them sink, possibly several times. I want to partially hollow out one before attaching it to the plexi plate that I am going to silicon gravel to. I am attatching the log to the plexi plate with either aquarium silicon, or with stainless steel screw so I can change it out. I would prefer to use the screw, so that I can replace the wood as it decays (I think that is the term I am looking for?). I am currently going to go change out the water with the logs, so I can soak at least one more week, before attempting to put it all together and by the middle of the following week I should be able to place it in the tank. I know I will still get some tannis from it, but I have no problem with changeing out my filters a little more often for awhile, and a light brown color to the water (tan color?) for awhile will not bother me, and should be fine with the fish. The question I have is, is there anything more I should do to these 2 pieces before placeing them in the tank, or is that all I need to do? Thanks for the help, y'all!! ~nan~

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13444	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: What types of rocks should I use in my tank?

With those fish, no limestone. It will adversely affect the fish as the water chemistry changes. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Beth Brownell Sent: Saturday, July 16, 2005 3:22 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: What types of rocks should I use in my tank? I have at the moment Angelfishes. I do plan on getting some neons, swordtails and some other fish for my fifty-five gallon tank and some for my 30 gallon tank. Beth --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > What kind of fish do you have in your tank? The limestone will make your pH go up and harden your water. > > Linda

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13445	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: What types of rocks should I use in my tank?

So limestone is out, what other kinds of rocks would work good in a freshwater tank? I'll be setting my new tank up this coming Tuesday and would like to get the rocks figured out before I get it fully set up. Beth

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13446	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: What types of rocks should I use in my tank?

To give you a few ideas of safe rocks for the aquarium, you might consider, slate, shale (comes basically red or green), quartz, agate and petrified wood (very colorful). I've always preferred red shale, finding that to be the most decorative and natural to aquascape with for my purposes, but you may have different ideas. There are probably a number of other rocks that are safe, but I just can't think of them at the moment. If in doubt about a rock, just ask here. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Beth Brownell" <spencer_creek_studios@y...> wrote: > So limestone is out, what other kinds of rocks would work good in a > freshwater tank? > > I'll be setting my new tank up this coming Tuesday and would like to > get the rocks figured out before I get it fully set up. > > Beth

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13447	From: paul helms	Date: 7/16/2005
Subject: Re: OLD CORAL ????

you can put all kinds of effort into getting it safe and pretty for the tank, but you will have to repeat the process everyfew months when algae and fish feces get all over it and tyurn it brown or green --- ahorseofcourse66 <ahorseofcourse66@...> wrote: > Hi< I WAS AT AN AUCTION TODAY AND THERE WAS 2 BOXES > WITH OLD CORAL IN > THEM. BIG PIECES LIKE 12IN BY 10INCHS OR MAYBE EVEN > BIGGER. WHATS > YOUR OPPINONS ABOUT CLEANING AND USING THEM IN A BIG > FRESHWATER TANK? > ALSO HAD SOME DRIFT WOOD AND LARGE STONES. > > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13448	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: New tank

Hi Steve, Yes, I know this is not suitable for goldfish but I am getting very small ones for now and they probably will be in this tank for a year. There will be plenty of aeration in the tank to provide a oxygen rich environment as I am having a couple of airstones and a bubble wall. Besides, I am not getting more then 4-5 small goldfish for it. They will go to a pond hopefully by next year same time. The tank would be perfect for a pair of angels as it's a nice 15" in diameter but that's another story :( Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: 17 July 2005 03:26 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] New tank Nim, Hate to disappoint your wife, but that is not a very suitable tank for any gold fish. Too much depth and not enough surface area. You mentioned that the tank holds 130 l, which converts to 34.3 gallons. Really not a heck of a lot of water. In a normal, rectangular tank, that is enough for one adult goldfish. I'm not even sure it would be a good tank for angels. I'd suggest you do a bit more research into various fish before populating this tank, so you can make the right choice of the right fish for the tank and its size. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nimish Mathur Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 6:05 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] New tank Hello People :-) Some of you must be missing me I suppose ;) Well, to start with. I got a new tank. A tall 4ft hex acrylic. Below are some pics. http://www.nimmat.com/coppermine/thumbnails.php?album=25 I really wanted this tank to be for a pair of Angels but wife wants goldfish so I am stuffed there :-( But that's fine. I decided on a UGF because I did not really want any unsightly things in the tank and besides with a 6" gravel substrate, I am sure that will be a superb biological media. I plan on having some crypts in there (don't ask me how I am gonna plant in a 4ft deep tank coz I have not thought of it yet) and a couple of onion plants. Goldfish will go in once the plants are established. Views please :-) Thanks, Nim [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Yahoo! Groups Links 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13449	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: What types of rocks should I use in my tank?.

any color of granite is good too [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13450	From: Dan	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: What types of rocks should I use in my tank?

Lava rock could be good, so would slate as someone else stated. I have slate in my tanks. If you have a PetsPlus store near you, they usually have some good misc rocks that work in freshwater tanks also. Dan (thaSkorpeon) --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Beth Brownell" <spencer_creek_studios@y...> wrote: > So limestone is out, what other kinds of rocks would work good in a > freshwater tank? > > I'll be setting my new tank up this coming Tuesday and would like to > get the rocks figured out before I get it fully set up. > > Beth

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13451	From: Evita	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: feeding cucumber

Steve, I know I am a new-bie and you know a ton's more than I do about fish and all, but....I fed my fish zucchini fresh. Funny thing is the adult fish ate it a bit but they didn't seem to really like it as much as the fry. The fry attached it and ate it up. They even though tiny had no problem at all eating it. Also it didn't cloud the water one bit. I would say try different things to see what different fish like. Evita Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote:Quite often the veggies such as zucchini and cucumbers are too firm for the fish to really eat well. Parboiling them, or nuking, them helps to soften up the pulp, so it is more readily accessible to the fish. It will also help the piece sink to the bottom of the tank, though this is not a sure fire method to make this occur. I'd doubt that the cuke would have clouded the water by itself, though it may be possible. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 9:17 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] feeding cucumber I heard that I could feed my plecos fresh cucumber. This morning before work, I scrubbed the cuke, sliced it, put it in a tupperware dish for my lunch and stuck a slice in each of my tanks (150 and 10 gallon). This afternoon when I returned home from work the 10 gallon was cloudy (the 150 is already cloudy from the PimaFix). Was I suppose to boil it or nuke the cuke, first? Is it normal for it to cloud your water? I did anchor the cuke slice under a piece of wood and when I got home, there was an oticinclis on it. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Yahoo! Groups Links ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13452	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Photos of my Angelfishes.

I just took my first photos of my Angelfishes in their tank. The pics are a little blurry but you can see them very clearly. I really love their markings. http://desert.f-realm.com/gal/index.php?category=30 Beth http://fa.f-realm.com/ Fanfiction Axis. http://e.webring.com/hub?ring=siriusblack Sirius Black webring. http://e.webring.com/hub?ring=remuslupin Remus Lupin webring http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sailorsenshiocs/ for all original and series characters of Sailor Moon. http://www.livejournal.com/userinfo.bml?user=tropical_fishes Tropical fish tank livejournal community. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13453	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: feeding cucumber

I put some cucumber in the tank it it was gobbled up. I put it in fresh and held it down with rocks. The pleco's, my snail, and even the angels had a feast. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evita Sent: Sunday, July 17, 2005 7:42 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] feeding cucumber Steve, I know I am a new-bie and you know a ton's more than I do about fish and all, but....I fed my fish zucchini fresh. Funny thing is the adult fish ate it a bit but they didn't seem to really like it as much as the fry. The fry attached it and ate it up. They even though tiny had no problem at all eating it. Also it didn't cloud the water one bit. I would say try different things to see what different fish like. Evita Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote:Quite often the veggies such as zucchini and cucumbers are too firm for the fish to really eat well. Parboiling them, or nuking, them helps to soften up the pulp, so it is more readily accessible to the fish. It will also help the piece sink to the bottom of the tank, though this is not a sure fire method to make this occur. I'd doubt that the cuke would have clouded the water by itself, though it may be possible. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 9:17 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] feeding cucumber I heard that I could feed my plecos fresh cucumber. This morning before work, I scrubbed the cuke, sliced it, put it in a tupperware dish for my lunch and stuck a slice in each of my tanks (150 and 10 gallon). This afternoon when I returned home from work the 10 gallon was cloudy (the 150 is already cloudy from the PimaFix). Was I suppose to boil it or nuke the cuke, first? Is it normal for it to cloud your water? I did anchor the cuke slice under a piece of wood and when I got home, there was an oticinclis on it. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Yahoo! Groups Links ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13454	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: Photos of my Angelfishes.

Beth, Nice looking fish. I see two silver (black & silver) Angels and three gold-crown Marble Angels, one having more gold than the other two. Looks like they're doing well and being well taken care of, I presume. Don't forget to give them frequent water changes. By the way, I guess you've figured out their sex from when you last asked; starting from the upper left photo and going clockwise, the first fish (silver Angel) is a male, the second and third fish (marble Angel -- both same fish) is a female, the fourth fish (a different marble Angel) in lower center foreground is also a female and the fifth fish (marble Angel) is the same fish as in the fourth photo. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Beth Brownell <spencer_creek_studios@y...> wrote: > I just took my first photos of my Angelfishes in their > tank. The pics are a little blurry but you can see > them very clearly. > > I really love their markings. > > http://desert.f-realm.com/gal/index.php?category=30 > > Beth > > http://fa.f-realm.com/ Fanfiction Axis. > http://e.webring.com/hub?ring=siriusblack Sirius Black webring. > http://e.webring.com/hub?ring=remuslupin Remus Lupin webring > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sailorsenshiocs/ for all original and series characters of Sailor Moon. > http://www.livejournal.com/userinfo.bml?user=tropical_fishes Tropical fish tank livejournal community. > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13455	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: Photos of my Angelfishes.

I change their water every three weeks and clean the walls (but for the back walls they are left for the algea eater) and the gravel at the same time. Beth --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > Beth, Nice looking fish. I see two silver (black & silver) Angels > and three gold-crown Marble Angels, one having more gold than the > other two. Looks like they're doing well and being well taken care > of, I presume. Don't forget to give them frequent water changes. By > the way, I guess you've figured out their sex from when you last > asked; starting from the upper left photo and going clockwise, the > first fish (silver Angel) is a male, the second and third fish > (marble Angel -- both same fish) is a female, the fourth fish (a > different marble Angel) in lower center foreground is also a female > and the fifth fish (marble Angel) is the same fish as in the fourth > photo. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Beth Brownell > <spencer_creek_studios@y...> wrote: > > I just took my first photos of my Angelfishes in their > > tank. The pics are a little blurry but you can see > > them very clearly. > > > > I really love their markings. > > > > http://desert.f-realm.com/gal/index.php?category=30 > > > > Beth > > > > http://www.livejournal.com/userinfo.bml?user=tropical_fishes > Tropical fish tank livejournal community.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13456	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: Photos of my Angelfishes.

That's fine, leaving the back wall for the algae eater -- gives it something to nibble on. While you don't say how much water you change when you do that, I would recommend doing some kind of a meaningful (min. 25%, to 33%) water change at least one a week. While I'm not looking to give you more work to do, Angels do best with more frequent water changes -- every other day is not too often for them, if you want to do 15% at those intervals, but once a week would be second best for optimum maintenance, especially as they get older. They seem more prone to contracting internal Hexamita after they mature, noticeably if not given sufficiently fresh water at all times. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Beth Brownell" <spencer_creek_studios@y...> wrote: > I change their water every three weeks and clean the walls (but for > the back walls they are left for the algea eater) and the gravel at > the same time. > > Beth > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> > wrote: > > Beth, Nice looking fish. I see two silver (black & silver) Angels > > and three gold-crown Marble Angels, one having more gold than the > > other two. Looks like they're doing well and being well taken care > > of, I presume. Don't forget to give them frequent water changes. > By > > the way, I guess you've figured out their sex from when you last > > asked; starting from the upper left photo and going clockwise, the > > first fish (silver Angel) is a male, the second and third fish > > (marble Angel -- both same fish) is a female, the fourth fish (a > > different marble Angel) in lower center foreground is also a female > > and the fifth fish (marble Angel) is the same fish as in the fourth > > photo. > Ray > > > \ > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Beth Brownell > > <spencer_creek_studios@y...> wrote: > > > I just took my first photos of my Angelfishes in their > > > tank. The pics are a little blurry but you can see > > > them very clearly. > > > > > > I really love their markings. > > > > > > http://desert.f-realm.com/gal/index.php?category=30 > > > > > > Beth > > > > > > http://www.livejournal.com/userinfo.bml?user=tropical_fishes > > Tropical fish tank livejournal community.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13457	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Silly question

I was wondering if fish have good eyesight? Can they see colors (how would we know that anyway)? Does it depend on the fish? I ask because the baby guppies will be picking along the wood, seemingly tasting things, bouncing along and they'll move right onto my yellow albino bristlenose and it seems to startle them :) The kind of jerk back and swim away. Quite amusing to watch. He nevers seems to mind, doesn't move at all when they do it. Do they not see him as something different than the wood? Just curious, thanks :) Rebecca

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13458	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: Silly question

Rebecca, I'd say that some fish have better eye sight then others. If fish didn't have the ability to see, then why would males and females have diffrent colors? . Why would males change color? I mean I have kenyii and the Juvenile males all stay blue ( female color) but as soon as i take the Dominant male out they turn yellow and start competing for Top dog honors in the tank. I am not sure of the guppies, maybe they have not gotton the ability to recognize the bristlenose as another fish yet? and when they run into him they get startled. who knows but I am sure some fish can see colors, if not most fish. rob Indiana In a message dated 7/17/2005 12:40:35 PM US Eastern Standard Time, TheSydMonster@... writes: I was wondering if fish have good eyesight? Can they see colors (how would we know that anyway)? Does it depend on the fish? I ask because the baby guppies will be picking along the wood, seemingly tasting things, bouncing along and they'll move right onto my yellow albino bristlenose and it seems to startle them :) The kind of jerk back and swim away. Quite amusing to watch. He nevers seems to mind, doesn't move at all when they do it. Do they not see him as something different than the wood? Just curious, thanks :) Rebecca [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13459	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: Silly question

Rebecca, Actually, a very good question. Yes, most vertabrates, including fish, have both rod and cone receptors in the retinas of their eyes and so can see color, although the extent of this color vision varies with the behavior with which they've evolved. Most catfish and other night-feeding fish do not have as many cones (color receptors) and have more rods enabling them to see better in low light. As you may have already guessed, color plays a large part in fish's breeding -- one of the main reasons why the males are usually more colorful and (depending upon species) colors up even more at breeding times. I don't that your guppies can't see the difference in coloration between the driftwood and the Bristlenose, but the catfish is so still it may appear as if its inanimate. Could probably fool a person as well, if they weren't familiar with the catfish's behavior. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > I was wondering if fish have good eyesight? Can they see colors (how > would we know that anyway)? Does it depend on the fish? > > I ask because the baby guppies will be picking along the wood, > seemingly tasting things, bouncing along and they'll move right onto > my yellow albino bristlenose and it seems to startle them :) The kind > of jerk back and swim away. Quite amusing to watch. He nevers seems > to mind, doesn't move at all when they do it. Do they not see him as > something different than the wood? > > Just curious, thanks :) > Rebecca

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13460	From: Eric Miner	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: There's a baby Panda in my tank!

After the sad loss of one of my Pandas last week, I have some goode news. Yesterday while doing my daily algae harvest I saw a baby Panda in my tank. I knew the Pandas were happy with the tank but I had no idea they spawned. The little one is about a quarter of an inch. I've only seen the one, but there may be more. I don't have another tank so I'll leave it in there. Does anyone know what I should do special? I was planning on just letting it be. I first spotted it while it was feeding with the adult Pandas. Any idea how fast they grow and at what stage they'll be safe in the tank? Thanks Eric

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13461	From: yarncrazymom	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: feeding cucumber

I freeze my Cuc and zuc....I do not blanch it or anything I slice it and put it in a ziplock, take out a frozen peice and attach it to a feeding clip and stick it to the side of my tank. My Fancy Gups go right for the frozen treat...they eat a hole right through the center of it...then comes my Bridg's snails and they eat most of the insides...I have left a large chunk over night but not longer then that for fear of a bacteria bloom. I have been lucky that I have never had it cloud my water...and the fish, plecos and snails all enjoy eating it. Freezing it tend to make them very soft. Just my thoughts :O) Rhonda http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Snailtrails/ COME JOIN US WE ARE RUNNING AN AWESOME, FUN CONTEST with PRIZES!! > I put some cucumber in the tank it it was gobbled up. I put it in fresh and > held it down with rocks. The pleco's, my snail, and even the angels had a > feast. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Evita > Sent: Sunday, July 17, 2005 7:42 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] feeding cucumber > > > Steve, I know I am a new-bie and you know a ton's more than I do about fish > and all, but....I fed my fish zucchini fresh. Funny thing is the adult fish > ate it a bit but they didn't seem to really like it as much as the fry. The > fry attached it and ate it up. They even though tiny had no problem at all > eating it. Also it didn't cloud the water one bit. I would say try > different things to see what different fish like. Evita > > Steve Szabo <steve@l...> wrote:Quite often the veggies such as > zucchini and cucumbers are too firm for the > fish to really eat well. Parboiling them, or nuking, them helps to soften up > the pulp, so it is more readily accessible to the fish. It will also help > the piece sink to the bottom of the tank, though this is not a sure fire > method to make this occur. > > I'd doubt that the cuke would have clouded the water by itself, though it > may be possible. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Crazy4fids@a... > Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 9:17 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] feeding cucumber > > > I heard that I could feed my plecos fresh cucumber. This morning before > work, I scrubbed the cuke, sliced it, put it in a tupperware dish for my > lunch > and stuck a slice in each of my tanks (150 and 10 gallon). > > This afternoon when I returned home from work the 10 gallon was cloudy (the > > 150 is already cloudy from the PimaFix). > > Was I suppose to boil it or nuke the cuke, first? Is it normal for it to > cloud your water? I did anchor the cuke slice under a piece of wood and > when I > got home, there was an oticinclis on it. > > Linda > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..>< ((((:> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<: ((((><74/`7.88. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..>< ((((:> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13462	From: harry perry	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: What types of rocks should I use in my tank?/Rocks

Any rock that won't disolve. Limestone doesn't work. I "borrow" my rocks from my local banks landscape on a Sunday afternoon. I hope there aren't any cameras. Beth Brownell <spencer_creek_studios@...> wrote:So limestone is out, what other kinds of rocks would work good in a freshwater tank? I'll be setting my new tank up this coming Tuesday and would like to get the rocks figured out before I get it fully set up. Beth ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13463	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Poll: How Long Have You Been In The Hobby?

Just checked back on this poll. I would guess most of the very active posters have already participated. But, only 27 members have done so to date. While I did not start this poll I, for one, would like to see more participation in this so that we can all get an idea of the final results, to somewhat know the members' needs going by the levels of experience. This Poll closes August 2nd, so there are still a couple of weeks to respond. Please do so if you haven't. \ Just as an afterthought, anyone's knowledge can be gained by reading. As such, I would urge members (especially the newer ones) to pick up at least occasionally a copy of a good aquarium related magazine, in addition to following the posts on this Forum. While any particular month's issue may not necessarily address your questions at the moment, the overall information glommmed from these magazines can only add to what you've picked up so far. Periodic input such as this will tend to keep your interest peaked as well, and will broaden your knowledge of fish in general. This makes the difference between a hobbyist who has been keeping fish for one year, and not doing anything else, and a keanly interested hobbyist keeping fish for the same amount of time but who reads up on the hobby. Much luck with your fishy charges. Ray

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13464	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Please, Please edit replies

Below my sig is what was left on a one line reply in digest 874. That was just one of the 25 posts which each had their own fair shair of JUNK left on the reply. Just a few lines down into the JUNK, the instructions from the Group says to "Please delete this line and everything below it when replying..." so this isn't just me complaining... it's the Group's rules. Please for those of us on Digest and Dial-Up... it will make the Digests 15-20 KB instead of 100-150KB if all of the junk wasn't on each reply. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... SNIP > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13465	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: Driftwood

Here are three other sites that I've found about preparing driftwood: http://www.drsfostersmith.com/pic/article.cfm?acatid=415&aid=857 http://www.cichlid-forum.com/articles/driftwood.php http://www.sydneycichlid.com/content/?page_id=13 Basically, I've had mine in a 5G bucket for a week and every day, I pour fresh BOILING water to refill the bucket. The thinner piece lost it's buoyancy after about 4 days but the thicker piece is still a little buoyant after 4 days. My pieces came from http://www.BigAlsOnline.com and came with a piece of slate screwed to them with a stainless steel screw so the slate is heavy enough to hold them under but the boiling makes sure to kill any possible bacteria and it also helps leach out the tannic acid (tannins) which turn the water the color of tea. Kind of like boiling water to pour over tea versus using cold water.... the HOT water works faster. I'm setting up my new tank next week so the driftwood is going in the tank and if it's still leaching tannin, I understand fresh charcoal every two weeks will clear it up. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: Date: Sat, 16 Jul 2005 11:20:57 -0700 (PDT) From: Nan <ntalb00@...> Subject: Driftwood I have searched high and low on the WWW for information on prepareing my driftwood for my tank. There are 2 pieces that I have had soaking in a large blue tote, with dechlorinated water with a high dose of Aquarium salt to kill any unwanted pests. I saw on another website that I need to boil them to make them sink, possibly several times. I want to partially hollow out one before attaching it to the plexi plate that I am going to silicon gravel to. I am attatching the log to the plexi plate with either aquarium silicon, or with stainless steel screw so I can change it out. I would prefer to use the screw, so that I can replace the wood as it decays (I think that is the term I am looking for?). I am currently going to go change out the water with the logs, so I can soak at least one more week, before attempting to put it all together and by the middle of the following week I should be able to place it in the tank. I know I will still get some tannis from it, but I have no problem with changeing out my filters a little more often for awhile, and a light brown color to the water (tan color?) for awhile will not bother me, and should be fine with the fish. The question I have is, is there anything more I should do to these 2 pieces before placeing them in the tank, or is that all I need to do? Thanks for the help, y'all!! ~nan~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13466	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: Poll: How Long Have You Been In The Hobby?

What would your magazine recommendations be? I am looking to subscribe to one or two. I am looking for freshwater mags. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Sunday, July 17, 2005 9:37 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Poll: How Long Have You Been In The Hobby? Just checked back on this poll. I would guess most of the very active posters have already participated. But, only 27 members have done so to date. While I did not start this poll I, for one, would like to see more participation in this so that we can all get an idea of the final results, to somewhat know the members' needs going by the levels of experience. This Poll closes August 2nd, so there are still a couple of weeks to respond. Please do so if you haven't. \ Just as an afterthought, anyone's knowledge can be gained by reading. As such, I would urge members (especially the newer ones) to pick up at least occasionally a copy of a good aquarium related magazine, in addition to following the posts on this Forum. While any particular month's issue may not necessarily address your questions at the moment, the overall information glommmed from these magazines can only add to what you've picked up so far. Periodic input such as this will tend to keep your interest peaked as well, and will broaden your knowledge of fish in general. This makes the difference between a hobbyist who has been keeping fish for one year, and not doing anything else, and a keanly interested hobbyist keeping fish for the same amount of time but who reads up on the hobby. Much luck with your fishy charges. Ray ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13467	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: Silly question

Thanks for the replies, Ray and Rob. I guess I didn't really think my question through when I was asking about color, duh :) I realize in a lot of animals males are more colored to catch the eyes of females... I guess I just wondered under water what they would see. I suppose that Ray is right in that the pleco seems inanimate to the babies until they touch him and realize he is something other than wood. They never do it when he is moving. Thanks again, I appreciate it :) Rebecca

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13468	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: Silly question

In a message dated 7/17/2005 9:03:31 PM Eastern Standard Time, TheSydMonster@... writes: I suppose that Ray is right in that the pleco seems inanimate to the babies until they touch him and realize he is something other than wood. They never do it when he is moving. That just shows that his comoflauge works! ;-) Vicky Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Or write: hgparker@... =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact Dr Breen @ 919-513-1467, Dr London @ calondon@... 530-754-5711 _AND_ Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13469	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: Poll: How Long Have You Been In The Hobby?

Aquarium Fish Magazine (AFM) is the one I recommend right now. Freshwater and Marine Aquarium (FAMA) is pretty much for an advanced hobbyist, and seems to be slanted more to the marine end of the hobby (it recently was purchased by the people who publish AFM, so it may change in the future). I've not read Tropical Fish Hobbyist (TFH) for a few years, but I do understand it is becoming more relevant lately. If you are not from the United States, you may wish to consider Practical Fishkeeping from Britain, which may also be easily available in Australia (I don't know, just guessing here). \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Roberts Sent: Sunday, July 17, 2005 6:31 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Poll: How Long Have You Been In The Hobby? What would your magazine recommendations be? I am looking to subscribe to one or two. I am looking for freshwater mags. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Sunday, July 17, 2005 9:37 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Poll: How Long Have You Been In The Hobby? Just checked back on this poll. I would guess most of the very active posters have already participated. But, only 27 members have done so to date. While I did not start this poll I, for one, would like to see more participation in this so that we can all get an idea of the final results, to somewhat know the members' needs going by the levels of experience. This Poll closes August 2nd, so there are still a couple of weeks to respond. Please do so if you haven't. \ Just as an afterthought, anyone's knowledge can be gained by reading. As such, I would urge members (especially the newer ones) to pick up at least occasionally a copy of a good aquarium related magazine, in addition to following the posts on this Forum. While any particular month's issue may not necessarily address your questions at the moment, the overall information glommmed from these magazines can only add to what you've picked up so far. Periodic input such as this will tend to keep your interest peaked as well, and will broaden your knowledge of fish in general. This makes the difference between a hobbyist who has been keeping fish for one year, and not doing anything else, and a keanly interested hobbyist keeping fish for the same amount of time but who reads up on the hobby. Much luck with your fishy charges. Ray

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13470	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: FW: AHHS: Dr. Joanne Norton

I picked this up from the Aquarium Hobby Historical Society list, and felt I should pass it along. I am posting it to a number of lists, and a number of individuals. I am trying to be selective with the individuals, not posting to those privately when I know you are on one of the lists, but my knowledge is not infallible, so I do apologize if you get a duplicate posting. We will all miss her, but Dr. Norton's contributions to the hobby will live on. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquariumHobbyHistoricalSociety@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, July 17, 2005 6:24 PM Subject: AHHS: Dr. Joanne Norton Friends, It grieves me to tell you that Joanne died yesterday morning (July 16th). Her husband Don called me and asked me to tell her friends. Her children Carol and Glenn had visited her recently from out-of-state - while Wayne was there with Don at the time of death. Don says there will not be any formal funeral nor memorial service. I suspect that Don would appreciate a note from close friends if you knew her well. Don Norton, 2305 Broadmoor Ave., Ames, Iowa 50010 Jim Langhammer

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13471	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: Poll: How Long Have You Been In The Hobby?

Thanks! Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: Sunday, July 17, 2005 8:23 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Poll: How Long Have You Been In The Hobby? Aquarium Fish Magazine (AFM) is the one I recommend right now. Freshwater and Marine Aquarium (FAMA) is pretty much for an advanced hobbyist, and seems to be slanted more to the marine end of the hobby (it recently was purchased by the people who publish AFM, so it may change in the future). I've not read Tropical Fish Hobbyist (TFH) for a few years, but I do understand it is becoming more relevant lately. If you are not from the United States, you may wish to consider Practical Fishkeeping from Britain, which may also be easily available in Australia (I don't know, just guessing here). \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Roberts Sent: Sunday, July 17, 2005 6:31 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Poll: How Long Have You Been In The Hobby? What would your magazine recommendations be? I am looking to subscribe to one or two. I am looking for freshwater mags. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Sunday, July 17, 2005 9:37 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Poll: How Long Have You Been In The Hobby? Just checked back on this poll. I would guess most of the very active posters have already participated. But, only 27 members have done so to date. While I did not start this poll I, for one, would like to see more participation in this so that we can all get an idea of the final results, to somewhat know the members' needs going by the levels of experience. This Poll closes August 2nd, so there are still a couple of weeks to respond. Please do so if you haven't. \ Just as an afterthought, anyone's knowledge can be gained by reading. As such, I would urge members (especially the newer ones) to pick up at least occasionally a copy of a good aquarium related magazine, in addition to following the posts on this Forum. While any particular month's issue may not necessarily address your questions at the moment, the overall information glommmed from these magazines can only add to what you've picked up so far. Periodic input such as this will tend to keep your interest peaked as well, and will broaden your knowledge of fish in general. This makes the difference between a hobbyist who has been keeping fish for one year, and not doing anything else, and a keanly interested hobbyist keeping fish for the same amount of time but who reads up on the hobby. Much luck with your fishy charges. Ray 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13472	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: Poll: How Long Have You Been In The Hobby?

FAMA has some great articles but it is geared more towards marines. Personally now that AFM and FAMA are owned by the same company I'd like to see strictly a saltwater mag and a freshwater mag but that porbally will never come around. If you cruise ebay you will find a years subscription to AFM for around $10/ yr thats $10 for 12 issues well under the $24/yr subscrition price. I agree TFH got off track a few years ago and lost favor in A LOT of hobbyists me included. price approx $30/yr Practical Fish keeping is a great magazine also but shipping to the States makes it uneconomical in my sistuation. rob Indiana In a message dated 7/17/2005 8:38:40 PM US Eastern Standard Time, woad@... writes: Aquarium Fish Magazine (AFM) is the one I recommend right now. Freshwater and Marine Aquarium (FAMA) is pretty much for an advanced hobbyist, and seems to be slanted more to the marine end of the hobby (it recently was purchased by the people who publish AFM, so it may change in the future). I've not read Tropical Fish Hobbyist (TFH) for a few years, but I do understand it is becoming more relevant lately. If you are not from the United States, you may wish to consider Practical Fishkeeping from Britain, which may also be easily available in Australia (I don't know, just guessing here). \\Steve// [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13473	From: Nan	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: Driftwood

Thanks, Steve, however since I have "boiled" it on the stove in a stainless steel pan for 5-6 hours, they now are on the bottom of the tote. I figured I should let it sit for a few more days in the aquarium salt/dechlorniated water solution so as to let it pull whatever I have missed out, before attatching it to the plexi....I am also going to add some java moss, and maybe a java fern or two onto it after I plexi it...however, my next question is, should I let it dry first, then sand it down a little, smooth it out or should I leave it a little rough like it is, or does it matter? I figure the java moss will be on it so I shouldn't have to worry too much. When I am done, I will post a pic for everyone to see.... Thanks for the help!! ~nan~ Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: If the wood still floats in water, I'd start soaking it in a chlorine solution for at least one week, then switch to dechlorinated water for the rest of the time it takes the wood to acquire the waterlogged state to stay put once it is added to your tank. Change the water once a week while this is occurring to ensure you are removing any residual chlorine that may have penetrated the surface of the wood. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nan Sent: Saturday, July 16, 2005 2:21 PM To: aquaticlife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Driftwood I have searched high and low on the WWW for information on prepareing my driftwood for my tank. There are 2 pieces that I have had soaking in a large blue tote, with dechlorinated water with a high dose of Aquarium salt to kill any unwanted pests. I saw on another website that I need to boil them to make them sink, possibly several times. I want to partially hollow out one before attaching it to the plexi plate that I am going to silicon gravel to. I am attatching the log to the plexi plate with either aquarium silicon, or with stainless steel screw so I can change it out. I would prefer to use the screw, so that I can replace the wood as it decays (I think that is the term I am looking for?). I am currently going to go change out the water with the logs, so I can soak at least one more week, before attempting to put it all together and by the middle of the following week I should be able to place it in the tank. I know I will still get some tannis from it, but I have no problem with changeing out my filters a little more often for awhile, and a light brown color to the water (tan color?) for awhile will not bother me, and should be fine with the fish. The question I have is, is there anything more I should do to these 2 pieces before placeing them in the tank, or is that all I need to do? Thanks for the help, y'all!! ~nan~ --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13474	From: Nan	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: Driftwood

Thank you, Lenny, however, this is not driftwood that was bought in the store. Since there is so much in our waterways in my area, I just harvested from there (my backyard..*LOL*). I see no reason to spend excess money, when I have it readily available with alittle work on my part. Today, I boiled it for 5-6 hours, and it cleaned it and removed alot of the tannins (I hope I am spelling this correctly), it now sinks to the bottom of the large tote I am soaking it in. As I stated before, I am attempting ot take every precaution available to me in order to keep it safe for my fish, yet, make it less expensive for me to create for them a more natural enviroment..:) The sites you found are very helpful, thank you for takeing that time for me. Have a great day!! ~nan~ Lenny Vasbinder <lnvtm1@...> wrote: Here are three other sites that I've found about preparing driftwood: http://www.drsfostersmith.com/pic/article.cfm?acatid=415&aid=857 http://www.cichlid-forum.com/articles/driftwood.php http://www.sydneycichlid.com/content/?page_id=13 Basically, I've had mine in a 5G bucket for a week and every day, I pour fresh BOILING water to refill the bucket. The thinner piece lost it's buoyancy after about 4 days but the thicker piece is still a little buoyant after 4 days. My pieces came from http://www.BigAlsOnline.com and came with a piece of slate screwed to them with a stainless steel screw so the slate is heavy enough to hold them under but the boiling makes sure to kill any possible bacteria and it also helps leach out the tannic acid (tannins) which turn the water the color of tea. Kind of like boiling water to pour over tea versus using cold water.... the HOT water works faster. I'm setting up my new tank next week so the driftwood is going in the tank and if it's still leaching tannin, I understand fresh charcoal every two weeks will clear it up. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: Date: Sat, 16 Jul 2005 11:20:57 -0700 (PDT) From: Nan <ntalb00@...> Subject: Driftwood I have searched high and low on the WWW for information on prepareing my driftwood for my tank. There are 2 pieces that I have had soaking in a large blue tote, with dechlorinated water with a high dose of Aquarium salt to kill any unwanted pests. I saw on another website that I need to boil them to make them sink, possibly several times. I want to partially hollow out one before attaching it to the plexi plate that I am going to silicon gravel to. I am attatching the log to the plexi plate with either aquarium silicon, or with stainless steel screw so I can change it out. I would prefer to use the screw, so that I can replace the wood as it decays (I think that is the term I am looking for?). I am currently going to go change out the water with the logs, so I can soak at least one more week, before attempting to put it all together and by the middle of the following week I should be able to place it in the tank. I know I will still get some tannis from it, but I have no problem with changeing out my filters a little more often for awhile, and a light brown color to the water (tan color?) for awhile will not bother me, and should be fine with the fish. The question I have is, is there anything more I should do to these 2 pieces before placeing them in the tank, or is that all I need to do? Thanks for the help, y'all!! ~nan~ --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13475	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: Mollies go to surface to breath?

I'll take a couple of pics of them tonight, Went spending on the weekend, spent about half a weeks pay on my fish tank! ouch, the wife wasn't impressed. Apparently I have phosphates above 5ppm and its about 4.5ppm straight out of my kitchen tap, so I'm out of luck with water changes here. NitrAtes are about 15ppm from the tap also and my aquarium is about 20ppm. Still getting a bit of white colouring in my water , I did a 95% water change this weekend cause I added some new gravel/plant fertiliser which made water really murky and I also wanted to remove as much of the phosphates as I could cause my pH down I was using was phosphate based, now I'm using straight tap water which this weekend was pH 7.4 as tested 2 hours after filling my tank up. I added iron to raise it to between 0.1 and 0.25, my estimate is 0.175 cause I moved the plants around too and some of the roots were moved. Now my tank looks like a forest. Also got two females Bettas which my male Betta doesn't get along with but so far they just run away from. Any ways I'll post a complete list of my testing results tonight with the pic. =Nick :) Evita wrote: > The Balloon Mollies have big bellies to begin with. They are really neat. Evita > >Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote:Then I'd probably look at the oxygen levels in your tank, as someone else >has already suggested. You mention the big bellies--just on females, or on >both male and female fish? Which kind of mollie do you have? > >\\Steve// > >-----Original Message----- >From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On >Behalf Of Nicolas Munro >Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 2:38 AM >To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com >Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Mollies go to surface to breath? > >300 litres ish or 90 gallons ish > >pH 7, 0 ammonia and nitrite or as close to zero as I can identify with >my Hagen test kit. basically ok. > >Lately every thing is getting aggressive, but the mollies are bigger >than all the other fish so they don't get picked on. > >23.5 deg C. > >I'm wondering if they normally have big bellies? maybe a tummy >infection? originally I thought the stomuck was growing and they were >going to have babies but its been a month and no sign of any thing. > >I have two of them and they are both doing it. > >The only other fish that does it in the tank is a Betta (and as if I >have to tell you its like normal :-) ) > >Live plants, maybe a recent whitening quality of the water due to >possibly a bacteria but that has all gone away as of start of last week. > > >=Nick > > >Steve Szabo wrote: > > > >>Nick, >> >>This is not normal behavior for mollies. What do you consider to be perfect >>for your pH, ammonia, nitrite readings? >> >>What size is your tank? >> >>What other fish do you have in the tank, and what size are they? >> >>What is the water temperature? >> >>Any other information you might think pertinent would be helpful. You >> >> >simply > > >>are not giving enough information to go on here to offer even a tentative >>diagnosis. >> >>-----Original Message----- >>From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On >>Behalf Of Nicolas Munro >>Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2005 11:12 PM >>To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com >>Subject: [AquaticLife] Mollies go to surface to breath? >> >>Hi, >> >>I've got two mollies which always go to the surface and look like they >>are eating food but there is no food. alternatively are they trying to >>breath the air kinda like Betas? >> >> >>Non of my other fish in the tank do it, pH, Ammonia, Nitrite are perfect. >> >> >>=Nick >> >> >>·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> >> >>Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. >> >>PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to >>the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the >>SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- >> >>We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >>AquaticLife Management. >> >><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. >> >> got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! >> >>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join >> >> stop by and see ~ membership is free! >> >>·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> >> >> >>Yahoo! Groups Links >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >>·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> >> >>Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. >> >>PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to >> >> >the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the >SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > >>We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >>AquaticLife Management. >> >><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. >> >> got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! >> >>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join >> >> stop by and see ~ membership is free! >> >>·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> >> >> >>Yahoo! Groups Links >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to >the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the >SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >AquaticLife Management. > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >AquaticLife Management. > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > >--------------------------------- >YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > >--------------------------------- > > > > >__________________________________________________ >Do You Yahoo!? >Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around >http://mail.yahoo.com > >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >AquaticLife Management. > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13476	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Phosphates

What level of phosphates are bad for fish and plants? Mine are greater than 5ppm and from the tap they are about 4.5ppm. I'm running a system with DIY yeast CO2 and lots (forest) of plants =Nick

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13477	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: styrofoam box cooling disaster!!!!!!!

we learn from our mistakes, right? Emily paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: a 1 dollar check valve would have stopped that from happening --- Emily Tenczar wrote: > I must have done something seriously wrong, so I > wanted to warn everyone here before anyone else > makes the same mistake. > > I decided to try the styrofoam box method first on > my 10 gallon minnow tank, so I filled up some > ziplock freezer bags with ice (mistake #1) and I > rigged up the system with a larger pump to put more > air through. I got two cute little fans to blow over > the water surface. All was well Wednesday night. > > Well, I spent the night at my boyfriend's house and > didn't get home till late thursday night/friday > morning around 2am (mistake #2). > > I came in to a horrible noise from the filter on the > side of the tank which was no longer submerged, and > found that the water level had gone down to only a > couple inches at the bottom of the tank! OMG!!! > There was water all over the rug under the two > aquarium stands, and then I checked the styrofoam > box. OMG somehow the water had escaped from the > bags, leaked everywhere, and the air pump was > submerged and overheated. I put the box in the > bathtub to contain the water while I cleaned up. > After I got things partially under control, I > examined the damage. The water had heated up and > melted and distorted the pump, and an > all-too-familiar autoclave smell surrounded the box > and its contents. > > It could have been really bad. As of last night the > fish were fine so I hope they will be okay. I hooked > up another air pump without a box this time, and ran > one small fan over the top of the water. > > Maybe when the air pump fried it sucked the water > back out of the tank. > Emily > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13478	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: Mollies go to surface to breath?

If you go to your local grocery store, they would prolly have one of these machines that has the filtered/deionized water...maybe you might consider using that until it clears up a bit. I used to get that for drinking water and it was pretty cheap...only a few bucks for a couple of gallons If your water has that many extras, you may want to look into a filter that can take that out. I know petco carries one that cleans up tap water for about 70 bucks...I would look into that and see if that will handle all of the extras in your water. Otherwise you are going to need a container(s) to hold enough water for a water change and treat it ahead of time so that you have it ready. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nicolas Munro Sent: Sunday, July 17, 2005 10:33 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Mollies go to surface to breath? I'll take a couple of pics of them tonight, Went spending on the weekend, spent about half a weeks pay on my fish tank! ouch, the wife wasn't impressed. Apparently I have phosphates above 5ppm and its about 4.5ppm straight out of my kitchen tap, so I'm out of luck with water changes here. NitrAtes are about 15ppm from the tap also and my aquarium is about 20ppm. Still getting a bit of white colouring in my water , I did a 95% water change this weekend cause I added some new gravel/plant fertiliser which made water really murky and I also wanted to remove as much of the phosphates as I could cause my pH down I was using was phosphate based, now I'm using straight tap water which this weekend was pH 7.4 as tested 2 hours after filling my tank up. I added iron to raise it to between 0.1 and 0.25, my estimate is 0.175 cause I moved the plants around too and some of the roots were moved. Now my tank looks like a forest. Also got two females Bettas which my male Betta doesn't get along with but so far they just run away from. Any ways I'll post a complete list of my testing results tonight with the pic. =Nick :) Evita wrote: > The Balloon Mollies have big bellies to begin with. They are really neat. Evita > >Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote:Then I'd probably look at the oxygen levels in your tank, as someone else >has already suggested. You mention the big bellies--just on females, or on >both male and female fish? Which kind of mollie do you have? > >\\Steve// > >-----Original Message----- >From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On >Behalf Of Nicolas Munro >Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 2:38 AM >To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com >Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Mollies go to surface to breath? > >300 litres ish or 90 gallons ish > >pH 7, 0 ammonia and nitrite or as close to zero as I can identify with >my Hagen test kit. basically ok. > >Lately every thing is getting aggressive, but the mollies are bigger >than all the other fish so they don't get picked on. > >23.5 deg C. > >I'm wondering if they normally have big bellies? maybe a tummy >infection? originally I thought the stomuck was growing and they were >going to have babies but its been a month and no sign of any thing. > >I have two of them and they are both doing it. > >The only other fish that does it in the tank is a Betta (and as if I >have to tell you its like normal :-) ) > >Live plants, maybe a recent whitening quality of the water due to >possibly a bacteria but that has all gone away as of start of last week. > > >=Nick > > >Steve Szabo wrote: > > > >>Nick, >> >>This is not normal behavior for mollies. What do you consider to be perfect >>for your pH, ammonia, nitrite readings? >> >>What size is your tank? >> >>What other fish do you have in the tank, and what size are they? >> >>What is the water temperature? >> >>Any other information you might think pertinent would be helpful. You >> >> >simply > > >>are not giving enough information to go on here to offer even a tentative >>diagnosis. >> >>-----Original Message----- >>From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On >>Behalf Of Nicolas Munro >>Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2005 11:12 PM >>To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com >>Subject: [AquaticLife] Mollies go to surface to breath? >> >>Hi, >> >>I've got two mollies which always go to the surface and look like they >>are eating food but there is no food. alternatively are they trying to >>breath the air kinda like Betas? >> >> >>Non of my other fish in the tank do it, pH, Ammonia, Nitrite are perfect. >> >> >>=Nick >> >> >>·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> >> >>Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. >> >>PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to >>the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the >>SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- >> >>We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >>AquaticLife Management. >> >><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. >> >> got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! >> >>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join >> >> stop by and see ~ membership is free! >> >>·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> >> >> >>Yahoo! Groups Links >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >>·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> >> >>Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. >> >>PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to >> >> >the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the >SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > >>We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >>AquaticLife Management. >> >><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. >> >> got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! >> >>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join >> >> stop by and see ~ membership is free! >> >>·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> >> >> >>Yahoo! Groups Links >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to >the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the >SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >AquaticLife Management. > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >AquaticLife Management. > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > >--------------------------------- >YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > >--------------------------------- > > > > >__________________________________________________ >Do You Yahoo!? >Tired of spam? Yahoo! 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Groups Links > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13479	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Pacu in minneapolis still needs home: will deliver

This poor fish still has not found a home and I'm afraid it will be put to sleep. This guy is willing to deliver it to anyone who wants to give it a home. I am sorry that I just don't have any place to put it. Please email me asap if you are interested in having the pacu delivered to your house and I will send you the guy's phone number. Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13480	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 7/17/2005
Subject: Re: styrofoam box cooling disaster!!!!!!! and more

Oh yes we do Emily. Last night I was filling a tank on the top shelf in my fishroom and it overflowed while I was not paying attention, AGAIN, and water overflowed and hit a surge protector and suddenly I was in a pitch black room. I reset the breaker and fortunately nothing ignited and I did not get electrocuted. So as soon as I get back from the ACA convention I am going to spend some time moving some power cords and surge protectors to a safer location and working on my concentration skills in the meantime. Mike In a message dated 7/17/2005 8:57:23 PM Pacific Daylight Time, bababanana@... writes: we learn from our mistakes, right? Emily paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: a 1 dollar check valve would have stopped that from happening [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13481	From: paul helms	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: styrofoam box cooling disaster!!!!!!!

hopefully lol! --- Emily Tenczar <bababanana@...> wrote: > we learn from our mistakes, right? > Emily > > paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > a 1 dollar check valve would have stopped that from > happening > > --- Emily Tenczar wrote: > > > I must have done something seriously wrong, so I > > wanted to warn everyone here before anyone else > > makes the same mistake. > > > > I decided to try the styrofoam box method first on > > my 10 gallon minnow tank, so I filled up some > > ziplock freezer bags with ice (mistake #1) and I > > rigged up the system with a larger pump to put > more > > air through. I got two cute little fans to blow > over > > the water surface. All was well Wednesday night. > > > > Well, I spent the night at my boyfriend's house > and > > didn't get home till late thursday night/friday > > morning around 2am (mistake #2). > > > > I came in to a horrible noise from the filter on > the > > side of the tank which was no longer submerged, > and > > found that the water level had gone down to only a > > couple inches at the bottom of the tank! OMG!!! > > There was water all over the rug under the two > > aquarium stands, and then I checked the styrofoam > > box. OMG somehow the water had escaped from the > > bags, leaked everywhere, and the air pump was > > submerged and overheated. I put the box in the > > bathtub to contain the water while I cleaned up. > > After I got things partially under control, I > > examined the damage. The water had heated up and > > melted and distorted the pump, and an > > all-too-familiar autoclave smell surrounded the > box > > and its contents. > > > > It could have been really bad. As of last night > the > > fish were fine so I hope they will be okay. I > hooked > > up another air pump without a box this time, and > ran > > one small fan over the top of the water. > > > > Maybe when the air pump fried it sucked the water > > back out of the tank. > > Emily > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when > replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING > the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13482	From: paul helms	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Phosphates

phosphates have no effect on animals and are a food source for plants and algae. the lower the better. my test kit does not test with the same numbers as yours, but the translation i would assume is that under 5 is where you would like to keep it, butyou will never really see it under 2.5. --- Nicolas Munro <nmunro@...> wrote: > What level of phosphates are bad for fish and > plants? > > Mine are greater than 5ppm and from the tap they are > about 4.5ppm. > > > I'm running a system with DIY yeast CO2 and lots > (forest) of plants > > =Nick > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13483	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: What types of rocks should I use in my tank? >Link to safe rocks<

Here is a link from another yahoo list with a safe list and unsafe list as well as a way to test rocks to see if they are safe. http://www.uniquaria.com/articles/sr.html I used to use some lava rock but it is really a rough surface for a fish to run into or scrape against. I found a rock landscaping place not too far from me that sells slates, granite, bowl rock, large gravel, and big rocks. I want to go back in a couple weeks and buy some slate as they sell most rocks for $0.15 to $0.40 a pund and if you have ever bought bowl rock a sale price is about $1.00 a pound and can regularly sell up to $2.00 per pound in some stores. So look for a place that sell rocks for landscaping and save some money. Mike In a message dated 7/17/2005 4:09:18 AM Pacific Daylight Time, dcreator2k4@... writes: Lava rock could be good, so would slate as someone else stated. I have slate in my tanks. If you have a PetsPlus store near you, they usually have some good misc rocks that work in freshwater tanks also. Dan (thaSkorpeon) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13484	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: What types of rocks should I use in my tank? >Link to safe roc

Mike, At first glance, your recommended Uniquaria link appears quite informative, but in looking it over, I curiously don't see shale listed either as safe or unsafe (its just not listed). So, as not to mislead our Forum members, I would again like to get across the point that shale is perfectly safe (and quite decorative). I don't know about its present popularity in the hobby, but some years ago it was the mainstay rock of choice for aquarium use here in the NE where much of it is found. I used to buy it from my aquarium supply wholesaler by the bushel basket (100 lb) for $5 per bushel. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Deenerz@a... wrote: > Here is a link from another yahoo list with a safe list and unsafe list as > well as a way to test rocks to see if they are safe. > http://www.uniquaria.com/articles/sr.html > > I used to use some lava rock but it is really a rough surface for a fish to > run into or scrape against. > > I found a rock landscaping place not too far from me that sells slates, > granite, bowl rock, large gravel, and big rocks. I want to go back in a couple > weeks and buy some slate as they sell most rocks for $0.15 to $0.40 a pund and > if you have ever bought bowl rock a sale price is about $1.00 a pound and can > regularly sell up to $2.00 per pound in some stores. So look for a place that > sell rocks for landscaping and save some money. > Mike > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13485	From: Nicolas J. Munro	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: webring url broken?

the webring url dosn't seam to work on my pc. http://tinyurl.com/6ge5u/ its the one on the front page of the group. PS. thats a mean monster too, lots of spikes! =Nick

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13486	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Driftwood

Once you are done treating the wood, and it shows no sign of chlorine, or other chemicals you may have used in the treatment, just move it into the tank. However, unless you are using screws to attach it to the plate, and that may not be a wise way to attach it, you would either need to use a marine cement, or let the wood dry so that the silicone will bond with the wood and plexi. To sand and smooth is up to your aesthetic sense, just so long as there are no real jagged parts that could injure a fish. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nan Sent: Sunday, July 17, 2005 10:19 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Driftwood Thanks, Steve, however since I have "boiled" it on the stove in a stainless steel pan for 5-6 hours, they now are on the bottom of the tote. I figured I should let it sit for a few more days in the aquarium salt/dechlorniated water solution so as to let it pull whatever I have missed out, before attatching it to the plexi....I am also going to add some java moss, and maybe a java fern or two onto it after I plexi it...however, my next question is, should I let it dry first, then sand it down a little, smooth it out or should I leave it a little rough like it is, or does it matter? I figure the java moss will be on it so I shouldn't have to worry too much. When I am done, I will post a pic for everyone to see.... Thanks for the help!! ~nan~ Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: If the wood still floats in water, I'd start soaking it in a chlorine solution for at least one week, then switch to dechlorinated water for the rest of the time it takes the wood to acquire the waterlogged state to stay put once it is added to your tank. Change the water once a week while this is occurring to ensure you are removing any residual chlorine that may have penetrated the surface of the wood. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nan Sent: Saturday, July 16, 2005 2:21 PM To: aquaticlife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Driftwood I have searched high and low on the WWW for information on prepareing my driftwood for my tank. There are 2 pieces that I have had soaking in a large blue tote, with dechlorinated water with a high dose of Aquarium salt to kill any unwanted pests. I saw on another website that I need to boil them to make them sink, possibly several times. I want to partially hollow out one before attaching it to the plexi plate that I am going to silicon gravel to. I am attatching the log to the plexi plate with either aquarium silicon, or with stainless steel screw so I can change it out. I would prefer to use the screw, so that I can replace the wood as it decays (I think that is the term I am looking for?). I am currently going to go change out the water with the logs, so I can soak at least one more week, before attempting to put it all together and by the middle of the following week I should be able to place it in the tank. I know I will still get some tannis from it, but I have no problem with changeing out my filters a little more often for awhile, and a light brown color to the water (tan color?) for awhile will not bother me, and should be fine with the fish. The question I have is, is there anything more I should do to these 2 pieces before placeing them in the tank, or is that all I need to do? Thanks for the help, y'all!! ~nan~ --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13487	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Driftwood

Nan, I agree, 90% of my driftwood has come from the WILDS of America :-) with a little precaution everything should work out, I mean you have taken more precaution then I usually do already LOL I usually harvest wood, pressure wash it, soak it in mild bleach solution for 24/48 hrs,rinse , rinse, I then have a 29 gallon tank ( 36 inches long ) with a powerhead in it, I put the wood in the tank and place a few bricks ontop of some egg crate I use to hold the wood down. if the water starts turning colors after a week, I stick the waterhose in the tanka nd overfill it for a few minutes., and soak some more. When i place the wood in my tanks most of the time they still half way float. I let them float, the fish don't mind and it makes it intresting when they finally do settle.. from wilds to fish populated tank about 2.5 weeks.. so far no problems... rob Indiana In a message dated 7/17/2005 9:58:09 PM US Eastern Standard Time, ntalb00@... writes: Since there is so much in our waterways in my area, I just harvested from there (my backyard..*LOL*). I see no reason to spend excess money, when I have it readily available with alittle work on my part. Today, I boiled it for 5-6 hours, and it cleaned it and removed alot of the tannins (I hope I am spelling this correctly), it now sinks to the bottom of the large tote I am soaking it in. As I stated before, I am attempting ot take every precaution available to me in order to keep it safe for my fish, yet, make it less expensive for me to create for them a more natural enviroment..:) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13488	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Silly question

For a moment, I also thought this about this fish's camouflage, but then realized this is an albino lacking the natural protective coloration. I guess it just appears "dead" as in looking like a rock or piece of wood, showing how well that strategy works too. Ray \ -- - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, seleya8@a... wrote: > > That just shows that his comoflauge works! ;-) > > Vicky > > > In a message dated 7/17/2005 9:03:31 PM Eastern Standard Time, > TheSydMonster@c... writes: > > I suppose > that . . . the pleco seems inanimate to the babies > until they touch him and realize he is something other than wood. > They never do it when he is moving. > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13489	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: styrofoam box cooling disaster!!!!!!!

That right, we learn from our mistakes, But i like learning from others mistakes less mess to clean up .So hopefully by your small mistake or inexperience others will avoid the same problem in the future. This hobby is a lot of trial and error. Sometimes we forget the smallest things when giving advice ( check valve ) I have probally 30 of them laying around, so it would have been just natural for me to use one. I don't think anyone thaught of suggesting a check valve. I have my airpump located over a heater vent/Ac vent this way during the winter the pump pushes warm air, and in summer it pumps cooler air. The styrofoam does work, have used it in the past.. don't get disgruntled, try again :-) but this time use cold packs and a check valve.. and hopefully you will have better results. rob Indiana In a message dated 7/17/2005 10:57:23 PM US Eastern Standard Time, bababanana@... writes: we learn from our mistakes, right? Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13490	From: Nicolas J. Munro	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Mollie going to the top to breath like a betta?

Hello This is the movie (300kB ish) here: http://www.geocities.com/nedarg/movie.wmv This mollie keeps going to the surface to breath air, just like a Betta. Don't know why. Fe non-chelated 0 Fe Chelated 0.175 PO4 Phosphate >5 NO3 Nitrate 5 pH between 7.2 and 7.4 GH 130ppm KH 70ppm NO2 Nitrite 0 NH3/NH4 Ammonia 0 my tap water has: NO3 Nitrate 5 PO4 Phosphate 2.5 pH 7.3 I do weekly water changes normally about 30% to 40%.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13491	From: Nicolas J. Munro	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Tiger barb died? really fat tummy

not happy. Think this was caused by my CO2 yeast thingy cause water is still very white looking and its been almost 3 weeks and several very very big water changes. Tonight ive taken away the yeast CO2 DIY bottle and replaced it with a air curtain to see if it makes a difference. see photo album nick (nedarg@...) =Nick

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13492	From: Nicolas J. Munro	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Tiger barb died

http://photos.groups.yahoo.com/group/aquaticlife/lst?.dir=/Nick+ (nedarg@...) don't know why. ==Nick

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13493	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Mollie going to the top to breath like a betta?

With clicking on to this link provided, I'm getting the message "Windows Media Player Error -- Cannot Open". Are you sure the filename is correct? Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Nicolas J. Munro" <nmunro@q...> wrote: > Hello > > > This is the movie (300kB ish) here: > http://www.geocities.com/nedarg/movie.wmv > > This mollie keeps going to the surface to breath air, just like a > Betta. Don't know why. > > > Fe non-chelated 0 > Fe Chelated 0.175 > PO4 Phosphate >5 > NO3 Nitrate 5 > pH between 7.2 and 7.4 > GH 130ppm > KH 70ppm > NO2 Nitrite 0 > NH3/NH4 Ammonia 0 > > my tap water has: > NO3 Nitrate 5 > PO4 Phosphate 2.5 > pH 7.3 > > > I do weekly water changes normally about 30% to 40%.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13494	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Tiger barb died

With clicking onto this link, I'm getting the message that "the photo page I'm trying to open does not exist or has expired" (?), or something to that effect (very strange). Anyway, took a look at your Tiger Barb by going directly to the Photo Albums. Looks to me as if it died of Dropsey. In addition to it being very bloasted, looks as if I can see the scale edges standing out if that's how the photo is accurately portraying this fish. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Nicolas J. Munro" <nmunro@q...> wrote: > http://photos.groups.yahoo.com/group/aquaticlife/lst?.dir=/Nick+ > (nedarg@) > > don't know why. > ==Nick

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13495	From: Evita	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Pacu in minneapolis still needs home: will deliver

Emily, Not to sound like a dummy but has he tried calling various fish related pet shops? Maybe one would take it. Also maybe there are some groups devoted to that particular fish that had members that might want it. Also most VET offices have bulletin boards for pet adoption or sales of animals, mostly cats and dogs but he could try putting an advertisement there. Also the public library might have a message board too. Ours does. Good luck. Let us know how it goes. Evita Emily Tenczar <bababanana@...> wrote: This poor fish still has not found a home and I'm afraid it will be put to sleep. This guy is willing to deliver it to anyone who wants to give it a home. I am sorry that I just don't have any place to put it. Please email me asap if you are interested in having the pacu delivered to your house and I will send you the guy's phone number. Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13496	From: Evita	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Pacu in minneapolis still needs home: will deliver

I forgot sometimes the local paper will put an ad in cheap or free if it is a free ad. Evita Evita <evitabug@...> wrote:Emily, Not to sound like a dummy but has he tried calling various fish related pet shops? Maybe one would take it. Also maybe there are some groups devoted to that particular fish that had members that might want it. Also most VET offices have bulletin boards for pet adoption or sales of animals, mostly cats and dogs but he could try putting an advertisement there. Also the public library might have a message board too. Ours does. Good luck. Let us know how it goes. Evita Emily Tenczar <bababanana@...> wrote: This poor fish still has not found a home and I'm afraid it will be put to sleep. This guy is willing to deliver it to anyone who wants to give it a home. I am sorry that I just don't have any place to put it. Please email me asap if you are interested in having the pacu delivered to your house and I will send you the guy's phone number. Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13497	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: What types of rocks should I use in my tank? >Link to safe roc

Would just like to add, as I meant to include in my post below, that in reading the Uniquaria (and other) links I notice these webpages are lumping dolomite and limestone in with other undesireable stones as unsafe. While you do not want these substances in your community tank for obvious reasons (they'll make the water rock-hard and increase the pH substantially), they are no more "unsafe" than crushed coral -- they are not poisonous and they do have their uses. For reasons just outlined, these rocks and substances are sought after by Rift Lake Cichlid hobbyists for obtaining these very objectives. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > Mike, At first glance, your recommended Uniquaria link appears quite > informative, but in looking it over, I curiously don't see shale > listed either as safe or unsafe (its just not listed). So, as not to > mislead our Forum members, I would again like to get across the point > that shale is perfectly safe (and quite decorative). Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Deenerz@a... wrote: > > Here is a link from another yahoo list with a safe list and unsafe > list as > > well as a way to test rocks to see if they are safe. > > http://www.uniquaria.com/articles/sr.html > > > > Mike > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13498	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: What types of rocks should I use in my tank? >Link to safe roc

Most of the LFS' here carry it in many different sizes...so I guess it is still popular ;-) Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Monday, July 18, 2005 5:46 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: What types of rocks should I use in my tank? >Link to safe rocks< Mike, At first glance, your recommended Uniquaria link appears quite informative, but in looking it over, I curiously don't see shale listed either as safe or unsafe (its just not listed). So, as not to mislead our Forum members, I would again like to get across the point that shale is perfectly safe (and quite decorative). I don't know about its present popularity in the hobby, but some years ago it was the mainstay rock of choice for aquarium use here in the NE where much of it is found. I used to buy it from my aquarium supply wholesaler by the bushel basket (100 lb) for $5 per bushel. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Deenerz@a... wrote: > Here is a link from another yahoo list with a safe list and unsafe list as > well as a way to test rocks to see if they are safe. > http://www.uniquaria.com/articles/sr.html > > I used to use some lava rock but it is really a rough surface for a fish to > run into or scrape against. > > I found a rock landscaping place not too far from me that sells slates, > granite, bowl rock, large gravel, and big rocks. I want to go back in a couple > weeks and buy some slate as they sell most rocks for $0.15 to $0.40 a pund and > if you have ever bought bowl rock a sale price is about $1.00 a pound and can > regularly sell up to $2.00 per pound in some stores. So look for a place that > sell rocks for landscaping and save some money. > Mike > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13499	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Care and feeding of the common Python

Having always been a member of the bucket brigade, with the purchase of my newest 46 bow, I received a Python. =) The guy showed me basically how to use it, but, as it didn't come with directions, I was hoping someone could give me some pointers. I did change the water in one of my other tanks with it this morning, but first blew the python right off the adaptor on the sink. LOL! All the fish are still alive, so I think I at least did it ok, but it seems everyone I know who uses one does it with more ease and less damp fumbling. ;-) Thanks! Vicky [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13500	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Mollie going to the top to breath like a betta?

Works fine here...you might want to make sure your media player is up to date. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Monday, July 18, 2005 7:48 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Mollie going to the top to breath like a betta? With clicking on to this link provided, I'm getting the message "Windows Media Player Error -- Cannot Open". Are you sure the filename is correct? Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Nicolas J. Munro" <nmunro@q...> wrote: > Hello > > > This is the movie (300kB ish) here: > http://www.geocities.com/nedarg/movie.wmv > > This mollie keeps going to the surface to breath air, just like a > Betta. Don't know why. > > > Fe non-chelated 0 > Fe Chelated 0.175 > PO4 Phosphate >5 > NO3 Nitrate 5 > pH between 7.2 and 7.4 > GH 130ppm > KH 70ppm > NO2 Nitrite 0 > NH3/NH4 Ammonia 0 > > my tap water has: > NO3 Nitrate 5 > PO4 Phosphate 2.5 > pH 7.3 > > > I do weekly water changes normally about 30% to 40%. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13501	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Poll: How Long Have You Been In The Hobby?

Eric, As I recommended to the Forum that the members should at least pick up a good aquarium related magazine from their lfs (if not subscribe to one), the least I can do is give you my recommendations. However, it appears that a few members have already beaten me to the punch. My first choice presently would be Aquarium Fish Magazine as covering a wide field of topics. Way back, Tropical Fish Hobbyist used to be excellent reading but had fallen off in quality. It is getting to be much better lately; hopefully, with the recent addition of a couple of new (and very knowledgeable) authors/friends in the hobby, (whom I've known for years) this magazine will regain its former status. Unfortunately for the strictly freshwater hobbyists (or vice-versa), these magazines include both fresh and saltwater topics and there may be some info not of importance to everyone, as compared to years ago when these subjects were published in either freshwater or saltwater magazines. For the devout Cichlid hobbyist in this Group, I can't emphasize enough the benefits gained in keeping up with things by reading the quarterly "Cichlid News" magazine. Whether you're a New World Cichlid nut or an Old World Cichlid nut, there's always a balance of Cichlid material in this one. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > What would your magazine recommendations be? I am looking to subscribe to > one or two. I am looking for freshwater mags. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Sunday, July 17, 2005 9:37 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Poll: How Long Have You Been In The Hobby? > > > Just checked back on this poll. I would guess most of the very > active posters have already participated. But, only 27 members have > done so to date. While I did not start this poll I, for one, would > like to see more participation in this so that we can all get an idea > of the final results, to somewhat know the members' needs going by > the levels of experience. This Poll closes August 2nd, so there are > still a couple of weeks to respond. Please do so if you haven't. > \ > Just as an afterthought, anyone's knowledge can be gained by > reading. As such, I would urge members (especially the newer ones) > to pick up at least occasionally a copy of a good aquarium related > magazine, in addition to following the posts on this Forum. While > any particular month's issue may not necessarily address your > questions at the moment, the overall information glommmed from these > magazines can only add to what you've picked up so far. Periodic > input such as this will tend to keep your interest peaked as well, > and will broaden your knowledge of fish in general. This makes the > difference between a hobbyist who has been keeping fish for one year, > and not doing anything else, and a keanly interested hobbyist keeping > fish for the same amount of time but who reads up on the hobby. Much > luck with your fishy charges. Ray > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13502	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Poll: How Long Have You Been In The Hobby?

Thanks Ray! One other organization I am looking into is the American Angelfish Society since we have angels and hopefully baby angels in the future ;-) I am also lucky to have an Aquatic Gardening group here and if I ever got into into killifish, the Killifish Society has a big presence here too. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Monday, July 18, 2005 9:14 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Poll: How Long Have You Been In The Hobby? Eric, As I recommended to the Forum that the members should at least pick up a good aquarium related magazine from their lfs (if not subscribe to one), the least I can do is give you my recommendations. However, it appears that a few members have already beaten me to the punch. My first choice presently would be Aquarium Fish Magazine as covering a wide field of topics. Way back, Tropical Fish Hobbyist used to be excellent reading but had fallen off in quality. It is getting to be much better lately; hopefully, with the recent addition of a couple of new (and very knowledgeable) authors/friends in the hobby, (whom I've known for years) this magazine will regain its former status. Unfortunately for the strictly freshwater hobbyists (or vice-versa), these magazines include both fresh and saltwater topics and there may be some info not of importance to everyone, as compared to years ago when these subjects were published in either freshwater or saltwater magazines. For the devout Cichlid hobbyist in this Group, I can't emphasize enough the benefits gained in keeping up with things by reading the quarterly "Cichlid News" magazine. Whether you're a New World Cichlid nut or an Old World Cichlid nut, there's always a balance of Cichlid material in this one. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > What would your magazine recommendations be? I am looking to subscribe to > one or two. I am looking for freshwater mags. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Sunday, July 17, 2005 9:37 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Poll: How Long Have You Been In The Hobby? > > > Just checked back on this poll. I would guess most of the very > active posters have already participated. But, only 27 members have > done so to date. While I did not start this poll I, for one, would > like to see more participation in this so that we can all get an idea > of the final results, to somewhat know the members' needs going by > the levels of experience. This Poll closes August 2nd, so there are > still a couple of weeks to respond. Please do so if you haven't. > \ > Just as an afterthought, anyone's knowledge can be gained by > reading. As such, I would urge members (especially the newer ones) > to pick up at least occasionally a copy of a good aquarium related > magazine, in addition to following the posts on this Forum. While > any particular month's issue may not necessarily address your > questions at the moment, the overall information glommmed from these > magazines can only add to what you've picked up so far. Periodic > input such as this will tend to keep your interest peaked as well, > and will broaden your knowledge of fish in general. This makes the > difference between a hobbyist who has been keeping fish for one year, > and not doing anything else, and a keanly interested hobbyist keeping > fish for the same amount of time but who reads up on the hobby. Much > luck with your fishy charges. Ray > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13503	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Pacu in minneapolis still needs home: will deliver

I think he called some pet stores; do you know if a pacu will survive 60 degrees in the winter? I found someone who might be interested but the pond isn't heated in the winter. Emily Evita <evitabug@...> wrote: Emily, Not to sound like a dummy but has he tried calling various fish related pet shops? Maybe one would take it. Also maybe there are some groups devoted to that particular fish that had members that might want it. Also most VET offices have bulletin boards for pet adoption or sales of animals, mostly cats and dogs but he could try putting an advertisement there. Also the public library might have a message board too. Ours does. Good luck. Let us know how it goes. Evita Emily Tenczar wrote: This poor fish still has not found a home and I'm afraid it will be put to sleep. This guy is willing to deliver it to anyone who wants to give it a home. I am sorry that I just don't have any place to put it. Please email me asap if you are interested in having the pacu delivered to your house and I will send you the guy's phone number. Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13504	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Mollie going to the top to breath like a betta?

I saw it fine. Might be something with your comp. ? -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Monday, July 18, 2005 7:48 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Mollie going to the top to breath like a betta? With clicking on to this link provided, I'm getting the message "Windows Media Player Error -- Cannot Open". Are you sure the filename is correct? Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Nicolas J. Munro" <nmunro@q...> wrote: > Hello > > > This is the movie (300kB ish) here: > http://www.geocities.com/nedarg/movie.wmv > > This mollie keeps going to the surface to breath air, just like a > Betta. Don't know why. > > > Fe non-chelated 0 > Fe Chelated 0.175 > PO4 Phosphate >5 > NO3 Nitrate 5 > pH between 7.2 and 7.4 > GH 130ppm > KH 70ppm > NO2 Nitrite 0 > NH3/NH4 Ammonia 0 > > my tap water has: > NO3 Nitrate 5 > PO4 Phosphate 2.5 > pH 7.3 > > > I do weekly water changes normally about 30% to 40%. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13505	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: styrofoam box cooling disaster!!!!!!!

In a message dated 7/17/2005 10:57:24 P.M. Central Standard Time, bababanana@... writes: we learn from our mistakes, right? Yeah, but can really piss a person off! Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13506	From: Evita	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Pacu in minneapolis still needs home: will deliver

I hope he doesn't give up in his search for a good home. If they wanted it heated they could invest in a heating system of some kind. I got my 30 gal tank from a friend with everything but the heater for 30.00. It was a great deal and I bought my own heater. I have been looking at flea markets and what not and saw a 20 gal with less than mine came with and they wanted 40.00. Evita Emily Tenczar <bababanana@...> wrote:I think he called some pet stores; do you know if a pacu will survive 60 degrees in the winter? I found someone who might be interested but the pond isn't heated in the winter. Emily Evita <evitabug@...> wrote: Emily, Not to sound like a dummy but has he tried calling various fish related pet shops? Maybe one would take it. Also maybe there are some groups devoted to that particular fish that had members that might want it. Also most VET offices have bulletin boards for pet adoption or sales of animals, mostly cats and dogs but he could try putting an advertisement there. Also the public library might have a message board too. Ours does. Good luck. Let us know how it goes. Evita Emily Tenczar wrote: This poor fish still has not found a home and I'm afraid it will be put to sleep. This guy is willing to deliver it to anyone who wants to give it a home. I am sorry that I just don't have any place to put it. Please email me asap if you are interested in having the pacu delivered to your house and I will send you the guy's phone number. Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13507	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Care and feeding of the common Python

I could use some pointers also. I use a 50 foot python. I find that when I use the python, I don't get as much suction power as when I use the 8 foot siphon and bucket method. Maybe because the siphon hose is so long? Or could it be because it has all the extra joints and fittings that reduce the flow of water? Also, when filling directly from the tap, do you add your dechlorinator to the tank before hand, or after? I have been adding right before I start the tap water running into the tank. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13508	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Pacu in minneapolis still needs home: will deliver

Have they tried any of the pets stores? Maybe the Mall of America has room for it in one of their tanks (Underwater World)? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13509	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: What types of rocks should I use in my tank? >Link to safe...

In a message dated 7/18/2005 4:37:06 A.M. Central Standard Time, Deenerz@... writes: So look for a place that sell rocks for landscaping and save some money. I agree! There is a new landscape supply store near my home and they let me have a bucket full of cobble sized granite rocks. Last time I upgraded my tank from a 75 gallon to a 125 gallon, I went to a landscape supply store up in St. Paul, MN and they gave me 20 pounds of pea gravel. I must say it took way longer to clean it than the stuff you buy bagged from the lfs. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13510	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: styrofoam box cooling disaster!!!!!!!

In a message dated 7/18/2005 6:47:49 A.M. Central Standard Time, FortWayneFish@... writes: That right, we learn from our mistakes, But i like learning from others mistakes less mess to clean up .So hopefully by your small mistake or inexperience others will avoid the same problem in the future. This hobby is a lot of trial and error. It helps too when people can admit they made a stupid mistake. I know a lot of people who would never admit that they made a mistake. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13511	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Mollie going to the top to breath like a betta?

Thanks Leslie, No surprise there -- always having some kind of PC problems. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > I saw it fine. Might be something with your comp. ? > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Monday, July 18, 2005 7:48 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Mollie going to the top to breath like a > betta? > > > With clicking on to this link provided, I'm getting the > message "Windows Media Player Error -- Cannot Open". Are you sure > the filename is correct? Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Nicolas J. Munro" <nmunro@q...> > wrote: > > Hello > > > > > > This is the movie (300kB ish) here: > > http://www.geocities.com/nedarg/movie.wmv > > > > This mollie keeps going to the surface to breath air, just like a > > Betta. Don't know why. > > > > > > Fe non-chelated 0 > > Fe Chelated 0.175 > > PO4 Phosphate >5 > > NO3 Nitrate 5 > > pH between 7.2 and 7.4 > > GH 130ppm > > KH 70ppm > > NO2 Nitrite 0 > > NH3/NH4 Ammonia 0 > > > > my tap water has: > > NO3 Nitrate 5 > > PO4 Phosphate 2.5 > > pH 7.3 > > > > > > I do weekly water changes normally about 30% to 40%. > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important > to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife > Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13512	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: angelfish

In a message dated 7/18/2005 9:25:10 A.M. Central Standard Time, woad@... writes: One other organization I am looking into is the American Angelfish Society since we have angels and hopefully baby angels in the future ;-) Eric, have you checked out the Finarama web site? Lots of angelfish info there! _Welcome To Finarama_ (http://www.finarama.com/) Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13513	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Care and feeding of the common Python

Welp, I have a 12? footer (don't remember, just long enough to handle the living room and the bedroom tanks.) and I just usually turn the water up higher when I don't get enough suction. As for the dechlorinator, I add that as I'm filling back up, sometimes right after. ----- Original Message ----- From: <Crazy4fids@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Monday, July 18, 2005 9:02 AM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Care and feeding of the common Python I could use some pointers also. I use a 50 foot python. I find that when I use the python, I don't get as much suction power as when I use the 8 foot siphon and bucket method. Maybe because the siphon hose is so long? Or could it be because it has all the extra joints and fittings that reduce the flow of water? Also, when filling directly from the tap, do you add your dechlorinator to the tank before hand, or after? I have been adding right before I start the tap water running into the tank. Linda

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13514	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Pacu in minneapolis still needs home: will deliver

The folks at school are not going to heat the goldfish pond. I think someone is contacting him today, I will let you know what happens. emily Evita <evitabug@...> wrote: I hope he doesn't give up in his search for a good home. If they wanted it heated they could invest in a heating system of some kind. I got my 30 gal tank from a friend with everything but the heater for 30.00. It was a great deal and I bought my own heater. I have been looking at flea markets and what not and saw a 20 gal with less than mine came with and they wanted 40.00. Evita Emily Tenczar wrote:I think he called some pet stores; do you know if a pacu will survive 60 degrees in the winter? I found someone who might be interested but the pond isn't heated in the winter. Emily Evita wrote: Emily, Not to sound like a dummy but has he tried calling various fish related pet shops? Maybe one would take it. Also maybe there are some groups devoted to that particular fish that had members that might want it. Also most VET offices have bulletin boards for pet adoption or sales of animals, mostly cats and dogs but he could try putting an advertisement there. Also the public library might have a message board too. Ours does. Good luck. Let us know how it goes. Evita Emily Tenczar wrote: This poor fish still has not found a home and I'm afraid it will be put to sleep. This guy is willing to deliver it to anyone who wants to give it a home. I am sorry that I just don't have any place to put it. Please email me asap if you are interested in having the pacu delivered to your house and I will send you the guy's phone number. Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13515	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Care and feeding of the common Python

At first I thought you posted to the wrong group and were looking for advice on how to care for and feed a "Python" snake. :-D I got my Python about a month ago and have used it on my 3 tanks to do 25% PWC's each week. One thing I did not do that I wish I would have done is mark off the 25% mark on my tanks. I use to use 5G buckets so I knew how much I removed / added but now I just have to guesstimate. I did measure from the top of the gravel to the water line and then divide that distance by 4 and marked off 1/4 in inches on a back corner so I assume I'm doing 25% PWC's but I'm only guessing as to the exact gallonage since I'm not positive how many gallons are actually in the space between the gravel and the water line. I'm guessing around 80% of the tank capacity. You'll have to do your own math if you did not mark it off using known measurements with your buckets. The biggest question I had in the beginning was how to treat the tap water during the refill process. Most people I spoke to in other forums said to just add 1/2 of your dechlor product to the tank first and add the other 1/2 by dripping it into the water flow of the Python. This has worked for me. Another little trick that I've learned is when you hook up the "empty" python to your spigot, run the water in the suction mode and turn off the valve on the vacuum end so it builds up some vacuum pressure in the hose first. Then insert the vacuum end into your tank, all the way to the bottom and slowly open the valve. This starts the vacuum up quick as opposed to it taking a little while to get started. It also seems to create a more constant vacuum without air pockets in the line that causes spurts in vacuum pressure. One last problem I have is that during the summer months, the water comes out my tap around 80F which is fine for the tropical tank but it's a big change for the Goldfish tanks which I now keep at 74-75F since I have a recently adopted 5" Pleco in with the Goldfish since it's too big for my tropical tank. I just refill the tank at a MUCH slower rate to give the water a chance to dilute and cool off to room temp. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: Date: Mon, 18 Jul 2005 09:58:50 EDT From: seleya8@... Subject: Care and feeding of the common Python Having always been a member of the bucket brigade, with the purchase of my newest 46 bow, I received a Python. =) The guy showed me basically how to use it, but, as it didn't come with directions, I was hoping someone could give me some pointers. I did change the water in one of my other tanks with it this morning, but first blew the python right off the adaptor on the sink. LOL! All the fish are still alive, so I think I at least did it ok, but it seems everyone I know who uses one does it with more ease and less damp fumbling. ;-) Thanks! Vicky [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13516	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Care and feeding of the common Python

In a message dated 7/18/2005 1:20:12 P.M. Central Standard Time, lnvtm1@... writes: Another little trick that I've learned is when you hook up the "empty" python to your spigot, run the water in the suction mode and turn off the valve on the vacuum end so it builds up some vacuum pressure in the hose first. Then insert the vacuum end into your tank, all the way to the bottom and slowly open the valve. This starts the vacuum up quick as opposed to it taking a little while to get started. It also seems to create a more constant vacuum without air pockets in the line that causes spurts in vacuum pressure Lenny, this is a great idea. I hope it works. I have been real close to returning the python for lack of suction. In the past when I have used it, the gravel does not move at all. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13517	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: maroon w/ 6-line wrasse

i saw a beautiful maroon clown that almost looks as if it's glowing @ a lfs and was wondering if it would be a good inhabitant for my 30 gal that is cycling right now. we've tentatively planned on a sixline wrasse and a goby of some sorts as tankmates for it. do you think this planned stocking would work out? Valeen Robertson Gonzalez I love my mated pair of true percs!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13518	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Mollies go to surface to breath?

The state I'm living in at the moment is promoting people to buy rain water tanks for using to water the garden and clean the car with. They are offering an incentive too so it costs about a couple of weeks wages. Would rain water contain less phosphates and ammonia? Cause I could try putting a bucket under the roof down pipe to check. =Nick PS: I live in Brisbane QLD which is a 'big' city with lots of cars and... Eric Roberts wrote: >If you go to your local grocery store, they would prolly have one of these >machines that has the filtered/deionized water...maybe you might consider >using that until it clears up a bit. I used to get that for drinking water >and it was pretty cheap...only a few bucks for a couple of gallons If your >water has that many extras, you may want to look into a filter that can take >that out. I know petco carries one that cleans up tap water for about 70 >bucks...I would look into that and see if that will handle all of the extras >in your water. Otherwise you are going to need a container(s) to hold >enough water for a water change and treat it ahead of time so that you have >it ready. > >Eric > > > _____ > >From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On >Behalf Of Nicolas Munro >Sent: Sunday, July 17, 2005 10:33 PM >To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com >Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Mollies go to surface to breath? > > >I'll take a couple of pics of them tonight, > >Went spending on the weekend, spent about half a weeks pay on my fish >tank! ouch, the wife wasn't impressed. > > >Apparently I have phosphates above 5ppm and its about 4.5ppm straight >out of my kitchen tap, so I'm out of luck with water changes here. > >NitrAtes are about 15ppm from the tap also and my aquarium is about 20ppm. > > >Still getting a bit of white colouring in my water , I did a 95% water >change this weekend cause I added some new gravel/plant fertiliser which >made water really murky and I also wanted to remove as much of the >phosphates as I could cause my pH down I was using was phosphate based, >now I'm using straight tap water which this weekend was pH 7.4 as tested >2 hours after filling my tank up. > >I added iron to raise it to between 0.1 and 0.25, my estimate is 0.175 >cause I moved the plants around too and some of the roots were moved. > >Now my tank looks like a forest. > >Also got two females Bettas which my male Betta doesn't get along with >but so far they just run away from. > > >Any ways I'll post a complete list of my testing results tonight with >the pic. > >=Nick :) > > > >Evita wrote: > > > >>The Balloon Mollies have big bellies to begin with. They are really neat. >> >> >Evita > > >>Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote:Then I'd probably look at the >> >> >oxygen levels in your tank, as someone else > > >>has already suggested. You mention the big bellies--just on females, or on >>both male and female fish? Which kind of mollie do you have? >> >>\\Steve// >> >>-----Original Message----- >>From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On >>Behalf Of Nicolas Munro >>Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2005 2:38 AM >>To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com >>Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Mollies go to surface to breath? >> >>300 litres ish or 90 gallons ish >> >>pH 7, 0 ammonia and nitrite or as close to zero as I can identify with >>my Hagen test kit. basically ok. >> >>Lately every thing is getting aggressive, but the mollies are bigger >>than all the other fish so they don't get picked on. >> >>23.5 deg C. >> >>I'm wondering if they normally have big bellies? maybe a tummy >>infection? originally I thought the stomuck was growing and they were >>going to have babies but its been a month and no sign of any thing. >> >>I have two of them and they are both doing it. >> >>The only other fish that does it in the tank is a Betta (and as if I >>have to tell you its like normal :-) ) >> >>Live plants, maybe a recent whitening quality of the water due to >>possibly a bacteria but that has all gone away as of start of last week. >> >> >>=Nick >> >> >>Steve Szabo wrote: >> >> >> >> >> >>>Nick, >>> >>>This is not normal behavior for mollies. What do you consider to be >>> >>> >perfect > > >>>for your pH, ammonia, nitrite readings? >>> >>>What size is your tank? >>> >>>What other fish do you have in the tank, and what size are they? >>> >>>What is the water temperature? >>> >>>Any other information you might think pertinent would be helpful. You >>> >>> >>> >>> >>simply >> >> >> >> >>>are not giving enough information to go on here to offer even a tentative >>>diagnosis. >>> >>>-----Original Message----- >>>From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On >>>Behalf Of Nicolas Munro >>>Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2005 11:12 PM >>>To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com >>>Subject: [AquaticLife] Mollies go to surface to breath? >>> >>>Hi, >>> >>>I've got two mollies which always go to the surface and look like they >>>are eating food but there is no food. alternatively are they trying to >>>breath the air kinda like Betas? >>> >>> >>>Non of my other fish in the tank do it, pH, Ammonia, Nitrite are perfect. >>> >>> >>>=Nick >>> >>> >>>·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> >>> >>>Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. >>> >>>PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to >>>the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the >>>SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- >>> >>>We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >>>AquaticLife Management. >>> >>><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. >>> >>>got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! >>> >>>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join >>> >>>stop by and see ~ membership is free! >>> >>>·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> >>> >>> >>>Yahoo! Groups Links >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> >>> >>>Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. >>> >>>PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to >>> >>> >>> >>> >>the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the >>SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- >> >> >> >> >>>We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >>>AquaticLife Management. >>> >>><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. >>> >>>got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! >>> >>>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join >>> >>>stop by and see ~ membership is free! >>> >>>·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> >>> >>> >>>Yahoo! Groups Links >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> >> >>Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. >> >>PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to >>the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the >>SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- >> >>We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >>AquaticLife Management. >> >><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. >> >> got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! >> >>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join >> >> stop by and see ~ membership is free! >> >>·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> >> >> >>Yahoo! Groups Links >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >>·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> >> >>Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. >> >>PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to >> >> >the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the >SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > >>We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >>AquaticLife Management. >> >><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. >> >> got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! >> >>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join >> >> stop by and see ~ membership is free! >> >>·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> >> >> >> >> >> >>--------------------------------- >>YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS >> >> >> Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. >> >> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: >>AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com >> >> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. >> >> >>--------------------------------- >> >> >> >> >>__________________________________________________ >>Do You Yahoo!? >>Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around >>http://mail.yahoo.com >> >>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >> >> >> >>·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> >> >>Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. >> >>PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to >> >> >the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the >SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > >>We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >>AquaticLife Management. >> >><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. >> >> got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! >> >>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join >> >> stop by and see ~ membership is free! >> >>·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> >> >> >>Yahoo! Groups Links >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to >the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the >SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >AquaticLife Management. > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > _____ > >YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > >* Visit your group "AquaticLife ><http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > >* To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com ><mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > >* Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service ><http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >AquaticLife Management. > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13519	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Phosphates

mine (Hagen) actually tests with mg/Litre which I think is ppm. what does yours test in? paul helms wrote: >phosphates have no effect on animals and are a food >source for plants and algae. the lower the better. >my test kit does not test with the same numbers as >yours, but the translation i would assume is that >under 5 is where you would like to keep it, butyou >will never really see it under 2.5. > >--- Nicolas Munro <nmunro@...> wrote: > > > >>What level of phosphates are bad for fish and >>plants? >> >>Mine are greater than 5ppm and from the tap they are >>about 4.5ppm. >> >> >>I'm running a system with DIY yeast CO2 and lots >>(forest) of plants >> >>=Nick >> >> >> > > >__________________________________________________ >Do You Yahoo!? >Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around >http://mail.yahoo.com > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >AquaticLife Management. > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13520	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: 150 tank pic

I posted the first pics of my tank under Linda's. Notice that the water is still cloudy after a 50% water change. I am all done with the PimaFix treatment and added the carbon back into the filters. I am just going to let it sit for a while and see what happens. Anyone with an Eheim filter-I have a question- is the Ehfisynth like a microfilter? Will it work like the magnum micron filterf? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13521	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Mollies go to surface to breath?

I haven't seen mollies before so not sure if its swollen hence the movie clip. The scales appear ok to me and the fish have been in there for probably over a month like that now. Not sure if the belly is getting bigger or not, definitely slow if it is. =Nick Hrvoje Maric wrote: >As all information you gave look fine, I'd concentrate on "big >bellies". Do they look abnormal (swollen, blunted), scales not attached >firmly to the body? In that case it could be desease which is common >(but not exclusive) to neon tetras, I cant remember English name but >translated form Croatian it is something like "water belly". If so it >is quite contagious and deadly, so you should remove your fish form >tank. It can come simply from water and it can't be simply cured, but >you should consider options for taking precautions for other fish. >Other reason that comes to my mind is that they may have caught some >gill parasites (again from water), which prevent them to breath >properly. Again, quarrantine the fish to avoid spreading to other >inhabitants. Do you use tap water, and how do you treat it before >pouring into the tank. I allways treat tap water with some commercially >available agents, and let it rest for couple of days (requires space >and spare vessels). Water taken from nature allways carries some risks >in terms of deseases and parasites. > >Hrvoje > > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >AquaticLife Management. > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13522	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: 150 tank pic

I LOVE your tank. I’m so jealous. If you have an Eheim, which I do as well but don't know the answer to your question, where is your water intake coming from? I didn't see the infamous foam ball. Or am I out of date here? One more thing; if you have a spray wand, is yours submerged or do you keep it over the water for movement? Again, LOVE your tank! Thanks, Leslie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Monday, July 18, 2005 5:59 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] 150 tank pic I posted the first pics of my tank under Linda's. Notice that the water is still cloudy after a 50% water change. I am all done with the PimaFix treatment and added the carbon back into the filters. I am just going to let it sit for a while and see what happens. Anyone with an Eheim filter-I have a question- is the Ehfisynth like a microfilter? Will it work like the magnum micron filterf? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13523	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: 150 tank pic

Thanks Leslie- hard to believe that I started out with a 5 gallon guppy tank when I was 10 years old. I went from a 5 to a 29, 55, 75, 125 and now a 150. The 29 gallon lasted me my first 15 years. I love to put my fish into the most natural environment that I can. That is why I have been so obsessed with the water quality. As for the Eheim, I have a 2028 pro series. I have no idea what a foam ball is or where it should go. (maybe you are referring to a pre filter?) I just have a regular intake strainer. I purchased the filter from BigAlsOnline and not only did I get the filter, media, filter pads and hoses, but they sent me the updated inlet and outlet kits (I believe that these kits sell for approx $20 each and the original piping came with the filter!). The spray wand is divided into three sections. It came with an elbow so I could form it to the corner of my tank if I wanted. Right now I have one section pointing down, one pointing at a 45 degree angle to the water surface, and one pointing across the water surface. I was not sure which way was better for water circulation. The Emperor 400 supplies a lot of surface movement, but with the cloudy water, I wanted to make sure everyone has enough oxygen. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13524	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: zeolite

Has anyone heard that zeolite is bad for your bacteria colony in your aquarium? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13525	From: Marty Mendez	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: zeolite

Zeolite is a stone media similiar to carbon in looks to absorb ammonia, never used it never had the need to. Be best to use it with sponge filter of sort so then the bacteria will be fine since have enough in the sponge for when u rinse the zeolite. Marty Crazy4fids@... wrote: Has anyone heard that zeolite is bad for your bacteria colony in your aquarium? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- Current Breeding List: Aulo. Lwanda Ngara Flametails Queen L260 Pleco's Sunshine Maleri's Bristlenose Pleco's Sci. Fryeri "Hap Ahli" --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13526	From: Justin M.	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: new member

Hello all! I guess I'm supposed to introduce myself, so here goes. I'm Justin, from western Canada. My girlfriend and I are new to the hobby, but fairly serious about it. We set up our first aquarium in April of this year, and already we've acquired a second system...Multiple Tank Syndrome is rampant at our house! If anyone's interested, our setups are as follows: Tank #1 33 gallon goldfish tank 2 calico fantails 2 pearlscales Mixture of fake and live plants (java fern) Tank #2 10 gallon tropical tank 1 male betta (soon to be joined by a few corys) Lots of live plants, including hornwort, moneywort, giant hygrophila, and java fern) Anyways, I'm looking forward to participating in the list, and learning from everyone's experiences! JM

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13527	From: Jade Evita	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: ONE PICTURE

I put one photo I took today in Evita's in the photo section. It is of my platy fry. They have really grown. I managed to catch about 5 or so in the shot. I have about 23 in all but they like to hide except at feeding time that is. I think the shot shows well the difference in the shades of the various babies. Boy are they healthy and happy. Hope you can check them out. I wanted to post one of my adult tank but the photo section is full for the most part. Evita

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13528	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Mollie going to the top to breath like a betta?

Tough to say from such a short clip, but I did notice that the fins do seem to be clamped, and she does seem to have a rapid respiration rate. However, the fin thing could be a temporary condition, and are not really clamped. I'd probably isolate her (use another tank) and add some salt to the water, and see what happens. I do not see any other obvious signs of a disease or parasites. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nicolas J. Munro Sent: Monday, July 18, 2005 8:08 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Mollie going to the top to breath like a betta? Hello This is the movie (300kB ish) here: http://www.geocities.com/nedarg/movie.wmv This mollie keeps going to the surface to breath air, just like a Betta. Don't know why. Fe non-chelated 0 Fe Chelated 0.175 PO4 Phosphate >5 NO3 Nitrate 5 pH between 7.2 and 7.4 GH 130ppm KH 70ppm NO2 Nitrite 0 NH3/NH4 Ammonia 0 my tap water has: NO3 Nitrate 5 PO4 Phosphate 2.5 pH 7.3 I do weekly water changes normally about 30% to 40%. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13529	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Care and feeding of the common Python

Linda, What is the height difference between your tank's water level and the end of the Python in the sink? This is the difference in the velocity of the water. I'm going to bet that the sink is a wee bit off the floor, and not much lower than the tank. I never thought much of it, a it gave me sufficient time to vacuum the gravel patch for the week thoroughly. I add the water conditioner prior to adding water to the tank. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Monday, July 18, 2005 12:03 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Care and feeding of the common Python I could use some pointers also. I use a 50 foot python. I find that when I use the python, I don't get as much suction power as when I use the 8 foot siphon and bucket method. Maybe because the siphon hose is so long? Or could it be because it has all the extra joints and fittings that reduce the flow of water? Also, when filling directly from the tap, do you add your dechlorinator to the tank before hand, or after? I have been adding right before I start the tap water running into the tank. Linda

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13530	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Care and feeding of the common Python

There is a window within two feet of the tank. Maybe I could take the screen off the window and hang the python out the window and water my garden at the same time. LOL As this may work during the warm weather, but it's going to be a long winter! Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13531	From: paul helms	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: zeolite

no it has no effect --- Crazy4fids@... wrote: > Has anyone heard that zeolite is bad for your > bacteria colony in your > aquarium? > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13532	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: zeolite

Zeolite absorbs ammonia which means it is taking food away from your nitrifying bacteria colony. At a certain point, the zeolite fills up and then the diminished bacteria colony cannot handle all of the ammonia which can cause a small ammonia / nitrite spike. Also... DO NOT ADD SALT to your tank if you are using zeolite as salt will cause the zeolite to release the ammonia it has absorbed causing a more severe ammonia spike and mini-cycle. If you are going to use zeolite, you should stick to a regular schedule of changing the zeolite so you always have fresh product. You can recycle it if you want by soaking it in a salt water solution. This will cause the zeolite to release the ammonia. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: 21 Date: Mon, 18 Jul 2005 20:54:25 EDT From: Crazy4fids@... Subject: zeolite Has anyone heard that zeolite is bad for your bacteria colony in your aquarium? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13533	From: paul helms	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Phosphates

its scale is 0,.25,.5,1,1.25,1.5 etc it says to keep it under .5 --- Nicolas Munro <nmunro@...> wrote: > mine (Hagen) actually tests with mg/Litre which I > think is ppm. > > what does yours test in? > > paul helms wrote: > > >phosphates have no effect on animals and are a food > >source for plants and algae. the lower the better. > > >my test kit does not test with the same numbers as > >yours, but the translation i would assume is that > >under 5 is where you would like to keep it, butyou > >will never really see it under 2.5. > > > >--- Nicolas Munro <nmunro@...> > wrote: > > > > > > > >>What level of phosphates are bad for fish and > >>plants? > >> > >>Mine are greater than 5ppm and from the tap they > are > >>about 4.5ppm. > >> > >> > >>I'm running a system with DIY yeast CO2 and lots > >>(forest) of plants > >> > >>=Nick > >> > >> > >> > > > > > >__________________________________________________ > >Do You Yahoo!? > >Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > protection around > >http://mail.yahoo.com > > > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > >Please delete this line and everything below it > when replying, thanks. > > > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING > the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter, > >AquaticLife Management. > > > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > you! > > > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13534	From: paul helms	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: maroon w/ 6-line wrasse

no, the marron clowns get fairly large and i would not recommend it for such a small tank. --- Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote: > i saw a beautiful maroon clown that almost looks as > if it's glowing @ a lfs and was wondering if > it would be a good inhabitant for my 30 gal that is > cycling right now. we've tentatively planned > on a sixline wrasse and a goby of some sorts as > tankmates for it. do you think this planned > stocking would work out? > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > > > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13535	From: paul helms	Date: 7/18/2005
Subject: Re: Tiger barb died? really fat tummy

well if you have done big water changes you are probably having a bacterial bloom because you may have wiped out too much in thiose big water changes --- "Nicolas J. Munro" <nmunro@...> wrote: > not happy. > > Think this was caused by my CO2 yeast thingy cause > water is still very > white looking and its been almost 3 weeks and > several very very big > water changes. > > > Tonight ive taken away the yeast CO2 DIY bottle and > replaced it with a > air curtain to see if it makes a difference. > > see photo album nick (nedarg@...) > > =Nick > > > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13536	From: daniel_roachus	Date: 7/19/2005
Subject: Re: Care and feeding of the common Python

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Lenny Vasbinder" <lnvtm1@g...> wrote: > At first I thought you posted to the wrong group and were looking for advice on how to care for and feed a "Python" snake. :-D > I was going to give a ticking off for taking on a creature like that.... :-D

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13537	From: Jo Baker	Date: 7/19/2005
Subject: Re: Care and feeding of the common Python

It works better if you let it run in to the toilet, but it's best if you can get the hose end outside, below floor level. ----- Original Message ----- From: Steve Szabo To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, July 18, 2005 11:10 PM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Care and feeding of the common Python Linda, What is the height difference between your tank's water level and the end of the Python in the sink? This is the difference in the velocity of the water. I'm going to bet that the sink is a wee bit off the floor, and not much lower than the tank. I never thought much of it, a it gave me sufficient time to vacuum the gravel patch for the week thoroughly. I add the water conditioner prior to adding water to the tank. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Monday, July 18, 2005 12:03 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Care and feeding of the common Python I could use some pointers also. I use a 50 foot python. I find that when I use the python, I don't get as much suction power as when I use the 8 foot siphon and bucket method. Maybe because the siphon hose is so long? Or could it be because it has all the extra joints and fittings that reduce the flow of water? Also, when filling directly from the tap, do you add your dechlorinator to the tank before hand, or after? I have been adding right before I start the tap water running into the tank. Linda ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.323 / Virus Database: 267.9.0/50 - Release Date: 7/16/2005 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13538	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/19/2005
Subject: Angel eggs!

My angels are laying eggs as I type. I am going to remove them before the plecos get some caviar. Any recommendations about what to do next. How long should I leave them with mom and dad to make sure they are all fertilized? I have a ten gallon that is all set up (from my plant filter experiment that went bad...but it is filled with the same water that is in the community tank that the angels are in) Should I just put the eggs in there later and hope for the best. I haven't got past the egg laying stage yet as last time my plecos had a feast. Any help here would be great...I would love to see them hatch and have baby angels. Eric [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13539	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/19/2005
Subject: Re: maroon w/ 6-line wrasse

thanks paul. i've decided against it anyway as i've heard reports of it being one of the most aggressive clowns. --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > no, the marron clowns get fairly large and i would not > recommend it for such a small tank. > > --- Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote: > > > i saw a beautiful maroon clown that almost looks as > > if it's glowing @ a lfs and was wondering if > > it would be a good inhabitant for my 30 gal that is > > cycling right now. we've tentatively planned > > on a sixline wrasse and a goby of some sorts as > > tankmates for it. do you think this planned > > stocking would work out? > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > > I love my mated pair of true percs! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13540	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/19/2005
Subject: Re: new member

welcome justin! --- "Justin M." <warbyrd@...> wrote: > Hello all! I guess I'm supposed to introduce myself, so here goes. I'm > Justin, from western Canada. My girlfriend and I are new to the hobby, but > fairly serious about it. We set up our first aquarium in April of this > year, and already we've acquired a second system...Multiple Tank Syndrome > is rampant at our house! If anyone's interested, our setups are as follows: > > Tank #1 33 gallon goldfish tank > > 2 calico fantails > 2 pearlscales > > Mixture of fake and live plants (java fern) > > Tank #2 10 gallon tropical tank > > 1 male betta (soon to be joined by a few corys) > > Lots of live plants, including hornwort, moneywort, giant hygrophila, and > java fern) > > Anyways, I'm looking forward to participating in the list, and learning > from everyone's experiences! > > > JM > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13541	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/19/2005
Subject: Re: Angel eggs!

First off, the Angels may take up to a couple of hours to complete their spawning, but usually it's much sooner. Keep an eye on them for when they finish and keep an eye on the Plecos. If they're big enough they'll be too bold for the Angels to effectively chase away. You may need to somehow keep the Plecos at bay, without upsetting the Angels to the point that they may eat the eggs themselves. You may remove the eggs shortly after they're done spawning as I believe there is just a short window (timewise) as far as how long the eggs are acceptable to being fertilized, although sometimes I wait an additional couple of hours to "make sure" if there's no danger of the eggs being eaten. \ Now, what are the Angels using to deposit the eggs on? Its always best to replace the egg receptacle you remove with a similar one, like trading a new piece of slate for the piece the eggs are on, although you probably aren't using slates. Anyhow, this acts to keep the Angels calm after the eggs are removed. Otherwise, they may blame each other for eating the eggs. This way they'll fan and protect an empty slate (or whatever was used) until it s-l-o-w-l-y dawns on them that there's nothing there at which point they lose the parenting instinct (until next time). Best if you can turn the lights out after removing the eggs, although many times you can't as some pairs have a tendency to spawn early in the morning. This will help prevent parental aggression towards each other. \ While the eggs should hatch in the community tank water that's in your ten gallon tank, especially if they're fertilized, its always best to put them in a smaller container to hatch and transfer them to the larger tank when they're free-swimming (in about 7 days). Some people use 2 1/2 gallon tanks for this purpose (my preference) and others use gallon jars. Main reason for this is you'll need to add a funguscide (Acriflavin) to the water to prevent any unfertilized eggs from fungusing and spreading to the good eggs, so you don't want to treat the rearing tank (10 gallon tank) with funguscide as you'll only have to change out the water after the fry are swimming -- they should not be kept in acriflavin after the hatching stage. So, after they do hatch in the smaller container, you'll preferably want to change out at least half of the water. This is not imperative, but preferable; the acriflavin can remain until you tranfer the fry to the 10 at the free-swimming stage. \ Getting back to the hatching water, while you can use the aquarium water, it is preferred to use fresh-drawn water, naturally of the same temperature (and same pH). However, as with adding fish to the water, you must treat this water for chloramines, which I probably don't need to tell you. But my point here is that if by chance you are one of the lucky ones who still just get chlorine (and not chloramines), you can fill the ten with fresh-drawn tap water and put the eggs directly into the ten with the chlorine acting as a funguscide -- and it will disipate in 24 to 48 hours. In any case, you will need to put an airstone near (not on) the eggs whatever container you're hatching them in, and keep it at 80o. Newly hatched BBS should be started on the 6th day so that it will be ready to feed the fry on day 7 -- free-swimming stage. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > My angels are laying eggs as I type. I am going to remove them before the > plecos get some caviar. Any recommendations about what to do next. How > long should I leave them with mom and dad to make sure they are all > fertilized? I have a ten gallon that is all set up (from my plant filter > experiment that went bad...but it is filled with the same water that is in > the community tank that the angels are in) Should I just put the eggs in > there later and hope for the best. I haven't got past the egg laying stage > yet as last time my plecos had a feast. Any help here would be great...I > would love to see them hatch and have baby angels. > > Eric > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13542	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/19/2005
Subject: GlassCages.com - 65 Gallon Acrylic -

A follow-up post about my 65 G Acrylic tank: I Googled and eBayed for over a month before finding their eBay site. I checked them out very thoroughly on the net, with the BBBonline and in three different very active forums, including this one. Then I ordered the tank on Thursday night, July 14, 2005 and paid my $110.00 plus $35.00 shipping (total = $145.00) via PayPal on eBay and I received my package today. The nice people at GlassCages.com told me it would ship on Friday, July 15, 2005 and I should receive it on Wednesday, July 20, 2005, but it came a day early. I couldn't believe it when I saw the FedEx guy carrying the tank up the stairs WITHOUT a dolly... just in a bear hug. I was thinking... this is one strong FedEx guy. I was going out to help him, or actually, I thought I was going to have to carry it in by myself since it came via FedEx Ground. Other big items that I've ordered in the past were shipped via common freight and I had to get the item off the back of the truck or tip the driver to help me bring it inside. This is my first time receiving something from FedEx Ground. Apparently, they are just like UPS. I weighed it after the "Superman" FedEx guy dropped it off inside and it only weighed 40 pounds still in the packaging. Oh well.. there goes the "Superman" title for the FedEx guy. I was worried that it might be an empty box but after snipping the strapping bands and opening the heavy cardboard box, removing the styrofoam panels and all the plastic wrap holding all packaging together, there was the four foot long monster tank... well, monster tank, compared to the ones I have now. It was wrapped in plastic wrap and had the blue tape type stuff on the acrylic to keep it from getting scratched. After removing everything, there stood a beautiful crystal clear 48"L x 18"W x 17"D acrylic tank. So far, I have nothing but good things to say about http://www.GlassCages.com and their eBay site at http://stores.ebay.com/Custom-Aquariums_W0QQssPageNameZviQ3asibQ3astoreviewQQtZkm. I looked over all of the seams and they all seem well sealed. Since it's acrylic, the bottom and back corner seams are glued with some type of thick clear epoxy type glue rather than opaque silicone that you find on glass tanks. The front two corners are rounded so that's two less seams to worry about and it looks much nicer than the siliconed glass corners on my glass tanks. The back two corners do have seams but they seem well sealed with the clear epoxy type glue and there is the black frame material as well, in the back. The only downside (for me) is the top frame and the 1 1/2"W x 1/2" thick acrylic braces that run along the top of the front and back 48" long sections. They make the frame on the back 1 1/2" wide so my HOB filters will not fit over the framing. I was planning on using a canister and an HOB but I guess I'll have to re-think my filtration. It looks like the pre-fabbed black frame has cut-aways for putting an HOB and accessories but with the 1 1/2" wide bracing that GlassCages puts around the top, it defeats these cut-aways in the black frame. Oh well.. I guess it will look better without an HOB hanging on the back anyhow but I may retrofit the HOB to the side where the plastic top frame isn't reinforced with the 1/2" thick acrylic brace since I've been cycling the HOB filter that I bought for this new tank for the past month in my 20G tank. If you need a new tank, either Glass or Acrylic, I highly recommend these guys and gals at http://www.GlassCages.com Here are some quick webcam pictures that I took while unpacking the tank: http://community.webshots.com/album/399539107iQXyjY I'm still amazed at how light it is compared to the 10 & 20 gallon glass tanks that I have which seem to have weighed much more comparably, from what I remember. My Goldfish and Pleco will have a nice big home and I'll have the 20 gallon tank to give more room to some of the recently adopted/saved overstocked 10G tropical tank. I'll post a follow-up about which tropical fish to move into the 20G tank and which ones I should leave in the 10G tank. I still have to fill up the 65G and check it for proper sealing but it looks GREAT so far. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13543	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/19/2005
Subject: Re: Angel eggs!

Yeah I know about the Plecos...the rat bastards got me last time hehehe. Would the jungle Labs anti fungal tabs work ok? I am not sure what's in them as I don;t have the box any more. I am keeping an eye on thing. My angels seem to be pretty good parents (maybe should put the plecos in the 10 gal for a while heheheh). They started spawning about 2 or 3 this afternoon (CST...its 6pm now). They are just on guard duty now, fanning the eggs every once in a while. I assume this means they have been fertilized? Replacing the receptacle...There is a leaf right under this one...would that fool them enough instead of replacing the actual leaf or do they put something on it so they recognize it? I don;t have any jars or alternative containers. What if I put the leaf and eggs inside a fry basket then pull the basket out once the hatch and do a water change? Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2005 5:36 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Angel eggs! First off, the Angels may take up to a couple of hours to complete their spawning, but usually it's much sooner. Keep an eye on them for when they finish and keep an eye on the Plecos. If they're big enough they'll be too bold for the Angels to effectively chase away. You may need to somehow keep the Plecos at bay, without upsetting the Angels to the point that they may eat the eggs themselves. You may remove the eggs shortly after they're done spawning as I believe there is just a short window (timewise) as far as how long the eggs are acceptable to being fertilized, although sometimes I wait an additional couple of hours to "make sure" if there's no danger of the eggs being eaten. \ Now, what are the Angels using to deposit the eggs on? Its always best to replace the egg receptacle you remove with a similar one, like trading a new piece of slate for the piece the eggs are on, although you probably aren't using slates. Anyhow, this acts to keep the Angels calm after the eggs are removed. Otherwise, they may blame each other for eating the eggs. This way they'll fan and protect an empty slate (or whatever was used) until it s-l-o-w-l-y dawns on them that there's nothing there at which point they lose the parenting instinct (until next time). Best if you can turn the lights out after removing the eggs, although many times you can't as some pairs have a tendency to spawn early in the morning. This will help prevent parental aggression towards each other. \ While the eggs should hatch in the community tank water that's in your ten gallon tank, especially if they're fertilized, its always best to put them in a smaller container to hatch and transfer them to the larger tank when they're free-swimming (in about 7 days). Some people use 2 1/2 gallon tanks for this purpose (my preference) and others use gallon jars. Main reason for this is you'll need to add a funguscide (Acriflavin) to the water to prevent any unfertilized eggs from fungusing and spreading to the good eggs, so you don't want to treat the rearing tank (10 gallon tank) with funguscide as you'll only have to change out the water after the fry are swimming -- they should not be kept in acriflavin after the hatching stage. So, after they do hatch in the smaller container, you'll preferably want to change out at least half of the water. This is not imperative, but preferable; the acriflavin can remain until you tranfer the fry to the 10 at the free-swimming stage. \ Getting back to the hatching water, while you can use the aquarium water, it is preferred to use fresh-drawn water, naturally of the same temperature (and same pH). However, as with adding fish to the water, you must treat this water for chloramines, which I probably don't need to tell you. But my point here is that if by chance you are one of the lucky ones who still just get chlorine (and not chloramines), you can fill the ten with fresh-drawn tap water and put the eggs directly into the ten with the chlorine acting as a funguscide -- and it will disipate in 24 to 48 hours. In any case, you will need to put an airstone near (not on) the eggs whatever container you're hatching them in, and keep it at 80o. Newly hatched BBS should be started on the 6th day so that it will be ready to feed the fry on day 7 -- free-swimming stage. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > My angels are laying eggs as I type. I am going to remove them before the > plecos get some caviar. Any recommendations about what to do next. How > long should I leave them with mom and dad to make sure they are all > fertilized? I have a ten gallon that is all set up (from my plant filter > experiment that went bad...but it is filled with the same water that is in > the community tank that the angels are in) Should I just put the eggs in > there later and hope for the best. I haven't got past the egg laying stage > yet as last time my plecos had a feast. Any help here would be great...I > would love to see them hatch and have baby angels. > > Eric > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13544	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/19/2005
Subject: Re: Angel eggs!

No, don't use the Jungle Labs tabs -- you need a good dye-type anti fungus medication (like Kordon's Acriflavin or Aquarium Pharmaceuticals Fungus Cure -- mostly acriflavin), last resort - a strong solution of methylene blue. I can't see how you can dose the eggs without dosing the whole tank if you put the eggs in a fry basket in the main tank. Yes, they have had ample time to be fertilized; it just remains to be seen whether they actually were. You should be able to remove the leaf (and eggs) -- the leaf right under this one should fool them enough if its close enough. If you don't have (or can't get tonight) the acriflavin, next best thing is to put the leaf and eggs in the 10, weeighing it down , with an airstone near it. Should be okay if they're fertilized and the water is clean. If not, fill it with clean water at a temperature of 80o. To speed hatching up, so there's less chance of fungus invading, slowly increase the temperature to 83o - 84o, but no more. Slowly decrease to 80o after hatching. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > Yeah I know about the Plecos...the rat bastards got me last time hehehe. > Would the jungle Labs anti fungal tabs work ok? I am not sure what's in > them as I don;t have the box any more. I am keeping an eye on thing. My > angels seem to be pretty good parents (maybe should put the plecos in the > 10 gal for a while heheheh). They started spawning about 2 or 3 this > afternoon (CST...its 6pm now). They are just on guard duty now, fanning the > eggs every once in a while. I assume this means they have been fertilized? > > Replacing the receptacle...There is a leaf right under this one...would that > fool them enough instead of replacing the actual leaf or do they put > something on it so they recognize it? > > I don;t have any jars or alternative containers. What if I put the leaf and > eggs inside a fry basket then pull the basket out once the hatch and do a > water change? > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2005 5:36 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Angel eggs! > > > First off, the Angels may take up to a couple of hours to complete > their spawning, but usually it's much sooner. Keep an eye on them > for when they finish and keep an eye on the Plecos. If they're big > enough they'll be too bold for the Angels to effectively chase away. > You may need to somehow keep the Plecos at bay, without upsetting the > Angels to the point that they may eat the eggs themselves. You may > remove the eggs shortly after they're done spawning as I believe > there is just a short window (timewise) as far as how long the eggs > are acceptable to being fertilized, although sometimes I wait an > additional couple of hours to "make sure" if there's no danger of the > eggs being eaten. > \ > Now, what are the Angels using to deposit the eggs on? Its always > best to replace the egg receptacle you remove with a similar one, > like trading a new piece of slate for the piece the eggs are on, > although you probably aren't using slates. Anyhow, this acts to keep > the Angels calm after the eggs are removed. Otherwise, they may > blame each other for eating the eggs. This way they'll fan and > protect an empty slate (or whatever was used) until it s-l-o-w-l-y > dawns on them that there's nothing there at which point they lose the > parenting instinct (until next time). Best if you can turn the > lights out after removing the eggs, although many times you can't as > some pairs have a tendency to spawn early in the morning. This will > help prevent parental aggression towards each other. > \ > While the eggs should hatch in the community tank water that's in > your ten gallon tank, especially if they're fertilized, its always > best to put them in a smaller container to hatch and transfer them to > the larger tank when they're free-swimming (in about 7 days). Some > people use 2 1/2 gallon tanks for this purpose (my preference) and > others use gallon jars. Main reason for this is you'll need to add a > funguscide (Acriflavin) to the water to prevent any unfertilized eggs > from fungusing and spreading to the good eggs, so you don't want to > treat the rearing tank (10 gallon tank) with funguscide as you'll > only have to change out the water after the fry are swimming -- they > should not be kept in acriflavin after the hatching stage. So, after > they do hatch in the smaller container, you'll preferably want to > change out at least half of the water. This is not imperative, but > preferable; the acriflavin can remain until you tranfer the fry to > the 10 at the free-swimming stage. > \ > Getting back to the hatching water, while you can use the aquarium > water, it is preferred to use fresh-drawn water, naturally of the > same temperature (and same pH). However, as with adding fish to the > water, you must treat this water for chloramines, which I probably > don't need to tell you. But my point here is that if by chance you > are one of the lucky ones who still just get chlorine (and not > chloramines), you can fill the ten with fresh-drawn tap water and put > the eggs directly into the ten with the chlorine acting as a > funguscide -- and it will disipate in 24 to 48 hours. In any case, > you will need to put an airstone near (not on) the eggs whatever > container you're hatching them in, and keep it at 80o. Newly hatched > BBS should be started on the 6th day so that it will be ready to feed > the fry on day 7 -- free-swimming stage. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > > My angels are laying eggs as I type. I am going to remove them > before the > > plecos get some caviar. Any recommendations about what to do > next. How > > long should I leave them with mom and dad to make sure they are all > > fertilized? I have a ten gallon that is all set up (from my plant > filter > > experiment that went bad...but it is filled with the same water > that is in > > the community tank that the angels are in) Should I just put the > eggs in > > there later and hope for the best. I haven't got past the egg > laying stage > > yet as last time my plecos had a feast. Any help here would be > great...I > > would love to see them hatch and have baby angels. > > > > Eric > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13545	From: Marty	Date: 7/19/2005
Subject: What kind of pleco is on homepage?

What kind of BN pleco is that? looks cool. Marty

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13547	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/19/2005
Subject: Re: What kind of pleco is on homepage?

That is my male albino BN pleco, Jimmy. Other than knowing he's an ancistrus, I do not know how else to define him. I wanted the yellow color so he would be easy to see in my heavily planted tank and in his dark wood cave. He's about 3 inches right now and is VERY active, never a dull moment in my tank :) --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Marty" <slvrsfr_2001@y...> wrote: > What kind of BN pleco is that? looks cool. > > Marty

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13548	From: Marty Mendez	Date: 7/19/2005
Subject: Re: What kind of pleco is on homepage?

That's neato Rebecca, never seen one with that coloration before on albino species. Marty thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@...> wrote: That is my male albino bristlenose pleco. He is an ancistrus species, there are quite a few of them. They grow to 3 - 5 inches and are good algae eaters. I chose albino because he is much easier to see in my heavily planted tank with dark wood. He is hilarious to watch, very entertaining fish :) Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Marty" <slvrsfr_2001@y...> wrote: > What kind of BN pleco is that? looks cool. > > Marty

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13549	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/19/2005
Subject: Re: Angel eggs!

Would it be real bad if I did use the Jungle labs fungus tabs? My internet access sis real spotty and I wanted to get the eggs out before the plecos got...they were eying them and drooling hehehe. If it is bad I can do a quick water change and just put in some treated tap water. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2005 7:45 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Angel eggs! No, don't use the Jungle Labs tabs -- you need a good dye-type anti fungus medication (like Kordon's Acriflavin or Aquarium Pharmaceuticals Fungus Cure -- mostly acriflavin), last resort - a strong solution of methylene blue. I can't see how you can dose the eggs without dosing the whole tank if you put the eggs in a fry basket in the main tank. Yes, they have had ample time to be fertilized; it just remains to be seen whether they actually were. You should be able to remove the leaf (and eggs) -- the leaf right under this one should fool them enough if its close enough. If you don't have (or can't get tonight) the acriflavin, next best thing is to put the leaf and eggs in the 10, weeighing it down , with an airstone near it. Should be okay if they're fertilized and the water is clean. If not, fill it with clean water at a temperature of 80o. To speed hatching up, so there's less chance of fungus invading, slowly increase the temperature to 83o - 84o, but no more. Slowly decrease to 80o after hatching. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > Yeah I know about the Plecos...the rat bastards got me last time hehehe. > Would the jungle Labs anti fungal tabs work ok? I am not sure what's in > them as I don;t have the box any more. I am keeping an eye on thing. My > angels seem to be pretty good parents (maybe should put the plecos in the > 10 gal for a while heheheh). They started spawning about 2 or 3 this > afternoon (CST...its 6pm now). They are just on guard duty now, fanning the > eggs every once in a while. I assume this means they have been fertilized? > > Replacing the receptacle...There is a leaf right under this one...would that > fool them enough instead of replacing the actual leaf or do they put > something on it so they recognize it? > > I don;t have any jars or alternative containers. What if I put the leaf and > eggs inside a fry basket then pull the basket out once the hatch and do a > water change? > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2005 5:36 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Angel eggs! > > > First off, the Angels may take up to a couple of hours to complete > their spawning, but usually it's much sooner. Keep an eye on them > for when they finish and keep an eye on the Plecos. If they're big > enough they'll be too bold for the Angels to effectively chase away. > You may need to somehow keep the Plecos at bay, without upsetting the > Angels to the point that they may eat the eggs themselves. You may > remove the eggs shortly after they're done spawning as I believe > there is just a short window (timewise) as far as how long the eggs > are acceptable to being fertilized, although sometimes I wait an > additional couple of hours to "make sure" if there's no danger of the > eggs being eaten. > \ > Now, what are the Angels using to deposit the eggs on? Its always > best to replace the egg receptacle you remove with a similar one, > like trading a new piece of slate for the piece the eggs are on, > although you probably aren't using slates. Anyhow, this acts to keep > the Angels calm after the eggs are removed. Otherwise, they may > blame each other for eating the eggs. This way they'll fan and > protect an empty slate (or whatever was used) until it s-l-o-w-l-y > dawns on them that there's nothing there at which point they lose the > parenting instinct (until next time). Best if you can turn the > lights out after removing the eggs, although many times you can't as > some pairs have a tendency to spawn early in the morning. This will > help prevent parental aggression towards each other. > \ > While the eggs should hatch in the community tank water that's in > your ten gallon tank, especially if they're fertilized, its always > best to put them in a smaller container to hatch and transfer them to > the larger tank when they're free-swimming (in about 7 days). Some > people use 2 1/2 gallon tanks for this purpose (my preference) and > others use gallon jars. Main reason for this is you'll need to add a > funguscide (Acriflavin) to the water to prevent any unfertilized eggs > from fungusing and spreading to the good eggs, so you don't want to > treat the rearing tank (10 gallon tank) with funguscide as you'll > only have to change out the water after the fry are swimming -- they > should not be kept in acriflavin after the hatching stage. So, after > they do hatch in the smaller container, you'll preferably want to > change out at least half of the water. This is not imperative, but > preferable; the acriflavin can remain until you tranfer the fry to > the 10 at the free-swimming stage. > \ > Getting back to the hatching water, while you can use the aquarium > water, it is preferred to use fresh-drawn water, naturally of the > same temperature (and same pH). However, as with adding fish to the > water, you must treat this water for chloramines, which I probably > don't need to tell you. But my point here is that if by chance you > are one of the lucky ones who still just get chlorine (and not > chloramines), you can fill the ten with fresh-drawn tap water and put > the eggs directly into the ten with the chlorine acting as a > funguscide -- and it will disipate in 24 to 48 hours. In any case, > you will need to put an airstone near (not on) the eggs whatever > container you're hatching them in, and keep it at 80o. Newly hatched > BBS should be started on the 6th day so that it will be ready to feed > the fry on day 7 -- free-swimming stage. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > > My angels are laying eggs as I type. I am going to remove them > before the > > plecos get some caviar. Any recommendations about what to do > next. How > > long should I leave them with mom and dad to make sure they are all > > fertilized? I have a ten gallon that is all set up (from my plant > filter > > experiment that went bad...but it is filled with the same water > that is in > > the community tank that the angels are in) Should I just put the > eggs in > > there later and hope for the best. I haven't got past the egg > laying stage > > yet as last time my plecos had a feast. Any help here would be > great...I > > would love to see them hatch and have baby angels. > > > > Eric > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13550	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 7/19/2005
Subject: Re: zeolite

Hi Lenny, Your post may or may not be true, it depends on what form of Zeolite is being used and for what purpose. The word Zeolite refers to a large group minerals with many different uses see :- http:/mineral.galleries.com/minerals/silicate/zeolites.htm regards, unclenorm. --- Lenny Vasbinder <lnvtm1@...> wrote: > Zeolite absorbs ammonia which means it is taking > food away from your nitrifying bacteria colony. > > At a certain point, the zeolite fills up and then > the diminished bacteria colony cannot handle all of > the ammonia which can cause a small ammonia / > nitrite spike. > > Also... DO NOT ADD SALT to your tank if you are > using zeolite as salt will cause the zeolite to > release the ammonia it has absorbed causing a more > severe ammonia spike and mini-cycle. > > If you are going to use zeolite, you should stick to > a regular schedule of changing the zeolite so you > always have fresh product. You can recycle it if > you want by soaking it in a salt water solution. > This will cause the zeolite to release the ammonia. > > Lenny Vasbinder > http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com > 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 > LNVTM1@... > > Message: 21 > Date: Mon, 18 Jul 2005 20:54:25 EDT > From: Crazy4fids@... > Subject: zeolite > > Has anyone heard that zeolite is bad for your > bacteria colony in your > aquarium? > > Linda > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ___________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13551	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/19/2005
Subject: Joke (snipped from Kim Komando Computer Newsletter 7/2/2005)

What do you call a fish with no eyes? A fsh. I know... it's lame but at least it's one you can share with your kids. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13552	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: Angel eggs!

As I said, do not use the Jungle Labs Fungus (Clear) Tabs. Yes it would be real bad; one of the ingredients, potassium dichromate is toxix to fish eggs. This product is meant to kill off another entirely different type of fungus (Saprolegnia), as a fish disease. Again, as I said, do a quick water change -- use treated tap water; especially treat if you have chloramines. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > Would it be real bad if I did use the Jungle labs fungus tabs? My internet > access sis real spotty and I wanted to get the eggs out before the plecos > got...they were eying them and drooling hehehe. If it is bad I can do a > quick water change and just put in some treated tap water. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2005 7:45 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Angel eggs! > > > No, don't use the Jungle Labs tabs -- you need a good dye-type anti > fungus medication (like Kordon's Acriflavin or Aquarium > Pharmaceuticals Fungus Cure -- mostly acriflavin), last resort - a > strong solution of methylene blue. I can't see how you can dose the > eggs without dosing the whole tank if you put the eggs in a fry > basket in the main tank. Yes, they have had ample time to be > fertilized; it just remains to be seen whether they actually were. > You should be able to remove the leaf (and eggs) -- the leaf right > under this one should fool them enough if its close enough. If you > don't have (or can't get tonight) the acriflavin, next best thing is > to put the leaf and eggs in the 10, weeighing it down , with an > airstone near it. Should be okay if they're fertilized and the water > is clean. If not, fill it with clean water at a temperature of 80o. > To speed hatching up, so there's less chance of fungus invading, > slowly increase the temperature to 83o - 84o, but no more. Slowly > decrease to 80o after hatching. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > > Yeah I know about the Plecos...the rat bastards got me last time > hehehe. > > Would the jungle Labs anti fungal tabs work ok? I am not sure > what's in > > them as I don;t have the box any more. I am keeping an eye on > thing. My > > angels seem to be pretty good parents (maybe should put the plecos > in the > > 10 gal for a while heheheh). They started spawning about 2 or 3 > this > > afternoon (CST...its 6pm now). They are just on guard duty now, > fanning the > > eggs every once in a while. I assume this means they have been > fertilized? > > > > Replacing the receptacle...There is a leaf right under this > one...would that > > fool them enough instead of replacing the actual leaf or do they put > > something on it so they recognize it? > > > > I don;t have any jars or alternative containers. What if I put the > leaf and > > eggs inside a fry basket then pull the basket out once the hatch > and do a > > water change? > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > > Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2005 5:36 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Angel eggs! > > > > > > First off, the Angels may take up to a couple of hours to complete > > their spawning, but usually it's much sooner. Keep an eye on them > > for when they finish and keep an eye on the Plecos. If they're big > > enough they'll be too bold for the Angels to effectively chase > away. > > You may need to somehow keep the Plecos at bay, without upsetting > the > > Angels to the point that they may eat the eggs themselves. You may > > remove the eggs shortly after they're done spawning as I believe > > there is just a short window (timewise) as far as how long the eggs > > are acceptable to being fertilized, although sometimes I wait an > > additional couple of hours to "make sure" if there's no danger of > the > > eggs being > eaten. > > > \ > > Now, what are the Angels using to deposit the eggs on? Its always > > best to replace the egg receptacle you remove with a similar one, > > like trading a new piece of slate for the piece the eggs are on, > > although you probably aren't using slates. Anyhow, this acts to > keep > > the Angels calm after the eggs are removed. Otherwise, they may > > blame each other for eating the eggs. This way they'll fan and > > protect an empty slate (or whatever was used) until it s-l-o-w-l- y > > dawns on them that there's nothing there at which point they lose > the > > parenting instinct (until next time). Best if you can turn the > > lights out after removing the eggs, although many times you can't > as > > some pairs have a tendency to spawn early in the morning. This > will > > help prevent parental aggression towards each other. > > > \ > > While the eggs should hatch in the community tank water that's in > > your ten gallon tank, especially if they're fertilized, its always > > best to put them in a smaller container to hatch and transfer them > to > > the larger tank when they're free-swimming (in about 7 days). Some > > people use 2 1/2 gallon tanks for this purpose (my preference) and > > others use gallon jars. Main reason for this is you'll need to add > a > > funguscide (Acriflavin) to the water to prevent any unfertilized > eggs > > from fungusing and spreading to the good eggs, so you don't want to > > treat the rearing tank (10 gallon tank) with funguscide as you'll > > only have to change out the water after the fry are swimming -- > they > > should not be kept in acriflavin after the hatching stage. So, > after > > they do hatch in the smaller container, you'll preferably want to > > change out at least half of the water. This is not imperative, but > > preferable; the acriflavin can remain until you tranfer the fry to > > the 10 at the free-swimming > stage. > > > \ > > Getting back to the hatching water, while you can use the aquarium > > water, it is preferred to use fresh-drawn water, naturally of the > > same temperature (and same pH). However, as with adding fish to > the > > water, you must treat this water for chloramines, which I probably > > don't need to tell you. But my point here is that if by chance you > > are one of the lucky ones who still just get chlorine (and not > > chloramines), you can fill the ten with fresh-drawn tap water and > put > > the eggs directly into the ten with the chlorine acting as a > > funguscide -- and it will disipate in 24 to 48 hours. In any case, > > you will need to put an airstone near (not on) the eggs whatever > > container you're hatching them in, and keep it at 80o. Newly > hatched > > BBS should be started on the 6th day so that it will be ready to > feed > > the fry on day 7 -- free-swimming stage. > Ray > > > \ > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> > wrote: > > > My angels are laying eggs as I type. I am going to remove them > > before the > > > plecos get some caviar. Any recommendations about what to do > > next. How > > > long should I leave them with mom and dad to make sure they are > all > > > fertilized? I have a ten gallon that is all set up (from my > plant > > filter > > > experiment that went bad...but it is filled with the same water > > that is in > > > the community tank that the angels are in) Should I just put the > > eggs in > > > there later and hope for the best. I haven't got past the egg > > laying stage > > > yet as last time my plecos had a feast. Any help here would be > > great...I > > > would love to see them hatch and have baby angels. > > > > > > Eric > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13553	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: zeolite

Norman, The type of Zeolite commonly used in the aquarium trade for the purpose of controlling ammonia, such as Aquarium Pharmaceuticals' "Ammo-Chips", "Ammo-Carb", "Ammo-Zorb", etc., acts in exactly this same way. Lenny is right-on, in being 100% accurate in his description of the behavior of Zeolite as referenced in this manner in the aquarium industry. The only other Zeolite product for aquarium use that I'm aware of is the ion-exchange water-softener crystals use for water softening pillows, which "absorb" calcium and magnesium. I note you cite the fact that it depends on what form of Zeolite is being used (and for what purpose), but say nothing further. Would you care to elaborate as to other Zeolite-based products found in the aquarium hobby? Many thanks for any further input you can share in this regard. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > Hi Lenny, > Your post may or may not be true, it depends > on what form of Zeolite is being used and for what > purpose. The word Zeolite refers to a large group > minerals with many different uses see :- > http:/mineral.galleries.com/minerals/silicate/zeolites.htm > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- Lenny Vasbinder <lnvtm1@g...> wrote: > > > Zeolite absorbs ammonia which means it is taking > > food away from your nitrifying bacteria colony. > > > > At a certain point, the zeolite fills up and then > > the diminished bacteria colony cannot handle all of > > the ammonia which can cause a small ammonia / > > nitrite spike. > > > > Also... DO NOT ADD SALT to your tank if you are > > using zeolite as salt will cause the zeolite to > > release the ammonia it has absorbed causing a more > > severe ammonia spike and mini-cycle. > > > > If you are going to use zeolite, you should stick to > > a regular schedule of changing the zeolite so you > > always have fresh product. You can recycle it if > > you want by soaking it in a salt water solution. > > This will cause the zeolite to release the ammonia. > > > > Lenny Vasbinder > > http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com > > 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 > > LNVTM1@g... > > > > Message: 21 > > Date: Mon, 18 Jul 2005 20:54:25 EDT > > From: Crazy4fids@a... > > Subject: zeolite > > > > Has anyone heard that zeolite is bad for your > > bacteria colony in your > > aquarium? > > > > Linda > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13554	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: What kind of pleco is on homepage?

Thanks :) I am told as he matures he will lose his pink spot on his head and get more golden color with some dots. We'll see... I was told when I got him he's between 1 and 1 1/2 years old. I don't know their lifespan but I hope it's a long one! -- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Marty Mendez <slvrsfr_2001@y...> wrote: > That's neato Rebecca, never seen one with that coloration before on albino species. > > Marty > > thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > That is my male albino bristlenose pleco. He is an ancistrus species, > there are quite a few of them. They grow to 3 - 5 inches and are > good algae eaters. I chose albino because he is much easier to see in > my heavily planted tank with dark wood. He is hilarious to watch, > very entertaining fish :) > > Rebecca > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Marty" <slvrsfr_2001@y...> wrote: > > What kind of BN pleco is that? looks cool. > > > > Marty

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13555	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: zeolite

Hi Ray, Did you visit the web site I posted the link for ?? , it lists most of the forms of zeolite available, there are forms for removing most things like nitrite, nitrate, phosphates, silicates and many more. As I said ' Zeolite' is a collective word for a large group of manufactured products, also various natural crystals ( collectors items ). Lenny description was quite correct for one particular form of Zeolite, but he did not say which form hence my 'may or may not be true'. regards, unclenorm. Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote: Norman, The type of Zeolite commonly used in the aquarium trade for the purpose of controlling ammonia, such as Aquarium Pharmaceuticals' "Ammo-Chips", "Ammo-Carb", "Ammo-Zorb", etc., acts in exactly this same way. Lenny is right-on, in being 100% accurate in his description of the behavior of Zeolite as referenced in this manner in the aquarium industry. The only other Zeolite product for aquarium use that I'm aware of is the ion-exchange water-softener crystals use for water softening pillows, which "absorb" calcium and magnesium. I note you cite the fact that it depends on what form of Zeolite is being used (and for what purpose), but say nothing further. Would you care to elaborate as to other Zeolite-based products found in the aquarium hobby? Many thanks for any further input you can share in this regard. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > Hi Lenny, > Your post may or may not be true, it depends > on what form of Zeolite is being used and for what > purpose. The word Zeolite refers to a large group > minerals with many different uses see :- > http:/mineral.galleries.com/minerals/silicate/zeolites.htm > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- Lenny Vasbinder <lnvtm1@g...> wrote: > > > Zeolite absorbs ammonia which means it is taking > > food away from your nitrifying bacteria colony. > > > > At a certain point, the zeolite fills up and then > > the diminished bacteria colony cannot handle all of > > the ammonia which can cause a small ammonia / > > nitrite spike. > > > > Also... DO NOT ADD SALT to your tank if you are > > using zeolite as salt will cause the zeolite to > > release the ammonia it has absorbed causing a more > > severe ammonia spike and mini-cycle. > > > > If you are going to use zeolite, you should stick to > > a regular schedule of changing the zeolite so you > > always have fresh product. You can recycle it if > > you want by soaking it in a salt water solution. > > This will cause the zeolite to release the ammonia. > > > > Lenny Vasbinder > > http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com > > 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 > > LNVTM1@g... > > > > Message: 21 > > Date: Mon, 18 Jul 2005 20:54:25 EDT > > From: Crazy4fids@a... > > Subject: zeolite > > > > Has anyone heard that zeolite is bad for your > > bacteria colony in your > > aquarium? > > > > Linda > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos. Get Yahoo! Photos [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13556	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: angelfish queston

Has anyone had success with their angelfish spawning and rearing angelfish fry in a community aquarium? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13557	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: angelfish color/type

I currently have four angelfish in my tank. I have two silvers (sliver with the brown/black bars, and two gold. I do not like the veil tails and prefer the standard fins. I know I would like to have at least one black, and I think three black lace. The black lace are the ones with the dark bars and grey to black where the silver is. Right? Which are the types that get the red/orange eyes? Does anyone in MN know of a good source for angelfish? I would love to see a breeding set up and ask a gazillion questions. Linda River Falls, WI 150 freshwater tank [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13558	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: zeolite

Uncle Norm, I'm well aware of the existence of various other Zeolite products, as I'm sure many other members are. I did visit the web site you posted only to find it most interesting. However, I don't see any other Zeolites on that web site that are used in the aquarium hobby. Surely your most recent reply for me to visit your posted Zeolite web site is not an answer to my question as these Zeolites have nothing to do with the aquarium hobby. I specifically asked you if you could elaborate on other Zeolite products found in the aquarium hobby. When Lenny was discussing Zeolites, he was clearly doing so as it relates to the aquarium hobby, as was I. While there of course are other Zeolite products in existence, for many other uses, why would you want to post about products that have absolutely nothing to do with this hobby? What do those Zeolites have to do with the discussion at hand? As Zeolite/ammonia-removal in the aquarium was the subject, the opening sentence of your original post seemed to infer there are other Zeolites to be used in the aquarium for other aquarium related purposes. If some members on this group did not know about other completely unrelated Zeolites (nor go to that web site), they may be under the impression from your post that there are indeed other aquarium related Zeolites that can be used for other aquarium related purposes. I understand where you're coming from, but I can't remember the last time I used Ferrierite or Paranatrolite (no, not to control Parana's/Pirana's - lol), in any of my aquariums. Your replie(s) to Lenny (and myself) almost seemed contradictory if the reader didn't realize you were going off-topic. By the way, as for Lenny's description of the Zeolite form he was talking about for ammonia removal in aquariums, I know of only one Zeolite used for this purpose in the aquarium trade (although different brand names). Why should he need to say which form? Incidentally, that Zeolite website really is fascinating as there are so many of them, even if they have "nothing to do with nothing" here. Regards, Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > Hi Ray, > Did you visit the web site I posted the link for ?? , it lists most of the forms of zeolite available, there are forms for removing most things like nitrite, nitrate, phosphates, silicates and many more. As I said ' Zeolite' is a collective word for a large group of manufactured products, also various natural crystals ( collectors items ). Lenny description was quite correct for one particular form of Zeolite, but he did not say which form hence my 'may or may not be true'. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > > Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: Norman, The type of Zeolite commonly used in the aquarium trade for > the purpose of controlling ammonia, such as Aquarium > Pharmaceuticals' "Ammo-Chips", "Ammo-Carb", "Ammo-Zorb", etc., acts > in exactly this same way. Lenny is right-on, in being 100% accurate > in his description of the behavior of Zeolite as referenced in this > manner in the aquarium industry. The only other Zeolite product for > aquarium use that I'm aware of is the ion-exchange water-softener > crystals use for water softening pillows, which "absorb" calcium and > magnesium. I note you cite the fact that it depends on what form of > Zeolite is being used (and for what purpose), but say nothing > further. Would you care to elaborate as to other Zeolite-based > products found in the aquarium hobby? Many thanks for any further > input you can share in this regard. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. Hampson." > <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > Hi Lenny, > > Your post may or may not be true, it depends > > on what form of Zeolite is being used and for what > > purpose. The word Zeolite refers to a large group > > minerals with many different uses see :- > > http:/mineral.galleries.com/minerals/silicate/zeolites.htm > > regards, > > unclenorm. > > > > > > --- Lenny Vasbinder <lnvtm1@g...> wrote: > > > > > Zeolite absorbs ammonia which means it is taking > > > food away from your nitrifying bacteria colony. > > > > > > At a certain point, the zeolite fills up and then > > > the diminished bacteria colony cannot handle all of > > > the ammonia which can cause a small ammonia / > > > nitrite spike. > > > > > > Also... DO NOT ADD SALT to your tank if you are > > > using zeolite as salt will cause the zeolite to > > > release the ammonia it has absorbed causing a more > > > severe ammonia spike and mini-cycle. > > > > > > If you are going to use zeolite, you should stick to > > > a regular schedule of changing the zeolite so you > > > always have fresh product. You can recycle it if > > > you want by soaking it in a salt water solution. > > > This will cause the zeolite to release the ammonia. > > > > > > Lenny Vasbinder > > > http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com > > > 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 > > > LNVTM1@g... > > > > > > Message: 21 > > > Date: Mon, 18 Jul 2005 20:54:25 EDT > > > From: Crazy4fids@a... > > > Subject: zeolite > > > > > > Has anyone heard that zeolite is bad for your > > > bacteria colony in your > > > aquarium? > > > > > > Linda > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide > with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine biology Biology > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos. Get Yahoo! Photos > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13559	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: angelfish queston

Probably no way to really know for sure, unless you either happen to learn about it or read an account on it. I supose its entirely possible -- all depends on a lot of variables like "how big was the tank?", "what other type(s) of fish where in with the Angels?", "How many other (and how large) companion fish were in this tank?", "How much (and what kind of) vegetation/plants and other hiding places (driftwood, etc.) were in this tank?" and other such environmental factors. Odds, however, are against this from happening in the average community tank as there would be too much predation. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > Has anyone had success with their angelfish spawning and rearing angelfish > fry in a community aquarium? > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13560	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: eBay

I was doing a search on angelfish for sale and followed a link that led me to angelfish for sale on eBay. I didn't think you could sell live animals on eBay. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13561	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: angelfish color/type

Linda, The preference between standard and veiltail is of course a personal matter. Then too, there are Veils and there are "SuperVeils", the latter having extremely long finnage. I particularly don't care for those myself although I do like both the standard and the regular veil. Yes, you're basically right in your description of the Black Lace; the fins are also partially filled in (appearing lace-like) with black as well. As you may know, the original wild type has red eyes. As such, the early domesticated silvers also had red eyes, but unfortunately much of that was lost no doubt due to an inattentive or indifferent attitude on the part of those breeders (hobbyists, not fish). The red eye gene can still be found in some good quality silvers, as well as black lace and blacks. This trait can also be seen in some strains of zebra, chocolate and various other strains although I can't recall seeing it in golds or german blues. Being from NJ myself, I couldn't tell you of an Angelfish source in MN, but you can feel free to ask as many questions as you like here; I'd be glad to help if I can. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > I currently have four angelfish in my tank. I have two silvers (sliver with > the brown/black bars, and two gold. I do not like the veil tails and prefer > the standard fins. I know I would like to have at least one black, and I > think three black lace. The black lace are the ones with the dark bars and > grey to black where the silver is. Right? Which are the types that get the > red/orange eyes? > > Does anyone in MN know of a good source for angelfish? I would love to see > a breeding set up and ask a gazillion questions. > > Linda > River Falls, WI > 150 freshwater tank > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13562	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: eBay

Don't know about live animals on eBay, but surely you must know of Aqua- Bid(?). That's a very popular site, but unfortunately, sometimes the combined postage and "handling" fee gets out of sight. Also, at times the fish prices themselves tend to be inflated or get up to that point in the bidding. While sometimes you may not have many other options in obtaining certain fish you're looking for (depending upon your location), its always best to try to find out the reputation of the dealer if you're thinking of bidding. Often enough you may wind up with inferior or smaller than advertised fish (or not really the same color fish as pictured). Ray \ -- - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > I was doing a search on angelfish for sale and followed a link that led me > to angelfish for sale on eBay. I didn't think you could sell live animals on > eBay. > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13563	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: eBay

I didn't think so either but I have since found other live fish on ebay as well. Some very nice ones too. I haven't ventured into buying any yet(too scared to add fish after reading so many stories here.) Everything is going so well I hate to chance it. L -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Wednesday, July 20, 2005 1:58 PM To: mnaquarium@yahoogroups.com; AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com; uniaquaria@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] eBay I was doing a search on angelfish for sale and followed a link that led me to angelfish for sale on eBay. I didn't think you could sell live animals on eBay. Linda

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13564	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: eBay

Just had to check out "Angelfish" on eBay -- I was curious. Came up with three sites having live fish (besides Angelfish Brooches, shower curtains, necklaces and you-name-it). The shipping looks expensive compared to Aqua-Bid. That has to be for someone who doesn't have a lfs within 200 miles. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > I didn't think so either but I have since found other live fish on ebay > as well. Some very nice ones too. I haven't ventured into buying any > yet(too scared to add fish after reading so many stories here.) > Everything is going so well I hate to chance it. L > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@a... > Sent: Wednesday, July 20, 2005 1:58 PM > To: mnaquarium@yahoogroups.com; AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com; > uniaquaria@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] eBay > > > I was doing a search on angelfish for sale and followed a link that led > me > to angelfish for sale on eBay. I didn't think you could sell live > animals on > eBay. > > Linda

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13565	From: yarncrazymom	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: eBay

While Ebay does have a no LIVE animal policy, they do allow the selling of fish, snails and other aquatic's. They have a separate catigory for each of them. I guess these don't seem to count as LIVE animals. But beware of some of the sellers...I wont mention the name but I bought snails off Ebay and got the most unhealthy, sad snails. 40% of them died and the rest are finally coming around after being cared for. Good Luck Rho http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Snailtrails/ > I didn't think so either but I have since found other live fish on ebay > as well. Some very nice ones too. I haven't ventured into buying any > yet(too scared to add fish after reading so many stories here.) > Everything is going so well I hate to chance it. L > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@a... > Sent: Wednesday, July 20, 2005 1:58 PM > To: mnaquarium@yahoogroups.com; AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com; > uniaquaria@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] eBay > > > I was doing a search on angelfish for sale and followed a link that led > me > to angelfish for sale on eBay. I didn't think you could sell live > animals on > eBay. > > Linda

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13566	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: eBay

Ebay does allow fish to be sold asLong as they OFFER next day delivery. For locating fish the one auction houses, that are Aquadic in nature would probally be best.. http://www.AquaBid.com is by far the largest and most successful. But a few other auction sights that I have in my book marks are http://www.aquaauctions.com/ http://www.bid4pets.com rob Indiana n a message dated 7/20/2005 1:58:32 PM US Eastern Standard Time, Crazy4fids@... writes: I was doing a search on angelfish for sale and followed a link that led me to angelfish for sale on eBay. I didn't think you could sell live animals on eBay. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13567	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: zeolite

The reason I was questioning the zeolite was pretty simple. I am trying to clear up my cloudy water. I believe that it is from stirring up the laterite in my substrate. I was wondering if adding zeolite to my filter media may help with this or do more damage to my bacteria establishment. I have come to the conclusion that as long as the water tests are ok and the fish are not gasping for air, I will put up with the cloudy and just continue to do my regular water changes. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13568	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: rooting tropical plants in back of tank

I know I read somewhere that you could grow bare root tropical plants out of the opening in the back of your aquarium. This sounds like something I could do. What is the best method of securing the roots into the tank and keeping the plant from falling off the back? Also what are the best plants for doing this. I think the devils ivy (pothos plant) philodendron vine would do well. You see people rooting these in water all the time. How about the plants that you see sticking out of glass vases with the betta living in them? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13569	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: zeolite

Unclenorm, All I did was answer the original question as written. If your answer is different than mine, please feel free to post your answer to the question. My answer explains why zeolite can be bad for the nitrifying bacteria colony in an aquarium. > > Message: 21 > > Date: Mon, 18 Jul 2005 20:54:25 EDT > > From: Crazy4fids@a... > > Subject: zeolite > > > > Has anyone heard that zeolite is bad for your > > bacteria colony in your > > aquarium? > > > > Linda Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: Date: Wed, 20 Jul 2005 17:27:16 +0100 (BST) From: "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> Subject: Re: Re: zeolite Hi Ray, Did you visit the web site I posted the link for ?? , it lists most of the forms of zeolite available, there are forms for removing most things like nitrite, nitrate, phosphates, silicates and many more. As I said ' Zeolite' is a collective word for a large group of manufactured products, also various natural crystals ( collectors items ). Lenny description was quite correct for one particular form of Zeolite, but he did not say which form hence my 'may or may not be true'. regards, unclenorm. Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote: Norman, The type of Zeolite commonly used in the aquarium trade for the purpose of controlling ammonia, such as Aquarium Pharmaceuticals' "Ammo-Chips", "Ammo-Carb", "Ammo-Zorb", etc., acts in exactly this same way. Lenny is right-on, in being 100% accurate in his description of the behavior of Zeolite as referenced in this manner in the aquarium industry. The only other Zeolite product for aquarium use that I'm aware of is the ion-exchange water-softener crystals use for water softening pillows, which "absorb" calcium and magnesium. I note you cite the fact that it depends on what form of Zeolite is being used (and for what purpose), but say nothing further. Would you care to elaborate as to other Zeolite-based products found in the aquarium hobby? Many thanks for any further input you can share in this regard. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > Hi Lenny, > Your post may or may not be true, it depends > on what form of Zeolite is being used and for what > purpose. The word Zeolite refers to a large group > minerals with many different uses see :- > http:/mineral.galleries.com/minerals/silicate/zeolites.htm > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- Lenny Vasbinder <lnvtm1@g...> wrote: > > > Zeolite absorbs ammonia which means it is taking > > food away from your nitrifying bacteria colony. > > > > At a certain point, the zeolite fills up and then > > the diminished bacteria colony cannot handle all of > > the ammonia which can cause a small ammonia / > > nitrite spike. > > > > Also... DO NOT ADD SALT to your tank if you are > > using zeolite as salt will cause the zeolite to > > release the ammonia it has absorbed causing a more > > severe ammonia spike and mini-cycle. > > > > If you are going to use zeolite, you should stick to > > a regular schedule of changing the zeolite so you > > always have fresh product. You can recycle it if > > you want by soaking it in a salt water solution. > > This will cause the zeolite to release the ammonia. > > > > Lenny Vasbinder > > http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com > > 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 > > LNVTM1@g... > > > > Message: 21 > > Date: Mon, 18 Jul 2005 20:54:25 EDT > > From: Crazy4fids@a... > > Subject: zeolite > > > > Has anyone heard that zeolite is bad for your > > bacteria colony in your > > aquarium? > > > > Linda > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13570	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Firemouths fin shrinking?

Under the album Blood Parrots there is a pic of my firemouth. In this you can see his lower fin is tapered and black at the end. This portion is fairly long. It seems like it is slowly getting more tapered up toward his body, therefore this part is becoming longer. It looks like his fin is shriveling up. Is this normal to have a trailer fin like this? I've yet to see other firemouths with it and I really think his is getting thinner, slowly. Any ideas? Fin rot? Doesn't look rotten, more like it's shrivled up. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13571	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: angelfish color/type

Linda Source: "The House of Angels" is located in Northern Wisconsin would that be close enough ? http://www.thehouseofangels.com/ Questions: I'd suggest the Angelfish Study Group ( TASG ) http://www.finarama.com/ and TASG forum http://www.finarama.com/forum/ rob Indiana In a message dated 7/20/2005 11:48:36 AM US Eastern Standard Time, Crazy4fids@... writes: Does anyone in MN know of a good source for angelfish? I would love to see a breeding set up and ask a gazillion questions. Linda River Falls, WI 150 freshwater [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13572	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: angelfish queston

Nope...my plecos had a feast the evening after the eggs were laid. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Wednesday, July 20, 2005 11:41 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com; uniaquaria@yahoogroups.com; mnaquarium@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] angelfish queston Has anyone had success with their angelfish spawning and rearing angelfish fry in a community aquarium? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13573	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: angelfish color/type

In a message dated 7/20/2005 8:25:11 P.M. Central Standard Time, FortWayneFish@... writes: Source: "The House of Angels" is located in Northern Wisconsin would that be close enough ? http://www.thehouseofangels.com/ Yes, I already found them. Unfortunately, from what I was told, they raise their fry to a certain size, then ship them to a holding facility in CA. Supposedly a relative. They do no official business in WI. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13574	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: angelfish color/type

Linda, Find the other part of their company in California and ask them if you can purchase from them but pick up in WI. Mike Source: "The House of Angels" is located in Northern Wisconsin would that be close enough ? http://www.thehouseofangels.com/ Yes, I already found them. Unfortunately, from what I was told, they raise their fry to a certain size, then ship them to a holding facility in CA. Supposedly a relative. They do no official business in WI. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13575	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: rooting tropical plants in back of tank

Another option I found requires a bit of modification of the tank setup. What you would do is run the outflow of the power filters into a gutter (one like you have on your house). One end is sealed shut, while the far end has a way for the water to spill back into the tank. You fill the gutter with hydroponics media and then plant plants in it. Once the plants start growing, the roots and the media will slow the water flow enough for the plants to soak up the nitrates and ammonia in he water and return cleaner water to your tank. I suppose the hydroponics material and roots will also form a secondary biological filter as well. This solution, obviously, is for larger tanks. I am thinking of incorporating something into my hood design to accomplish this. I am in the process of designing a hood to cover my 55 gal tank. As it is going to be a planted tank, I will require more lighting than I presently have. I am constructing this out of wood and it will hold 3 96 watt fluorescent bulbs as well as a series of blue leds for "moonlight" effects when the other lights are off. To control heat, I will mount a couple of large computer case fans to keep good airflow and keep the bulbs and ballasts cool. Now if I can get a job so I can buy everything I need...all will be well *grin* Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Wednesday, July 20, 2005 6:47 PM To: mnaquarium@yahoogroups.com; AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com; uniaquaria@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] rooting tropical plants in back of tank I know I read somewhere that you could grow bare root tropical plants out of the opening in the back of your aquarium. This sounds like something I could do. What is the best method of securing the roots into the tank and keeping the plant from falling off the back? Also what are the best plants for doing this. I think the devils ivy (pothos plant) philodendron vine would do well. You see people rooting these in water all the time. How about the plants that you see sticking out of glass vases with the betta living in them? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13576	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: eBay

you should mention the name. If this person is selling sick critters, then you would be helping the community by telling who it is. If people know that word of mouth advertising...both good and bad...is going on, it will help to keep people honest. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of yarncrazymom Sent: Wednesday, July 20, 2005 3:09 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: eBay While Ebay does have a no LIVE animal policy, they do allow the selling of fish, snails and other aquatic's. They have a separate catigory for each of them. I guess these don't seem to count as LIVE animals. But beware of some of the sellers...I wont mention the name but I bought snails off Ebay and got the most unhealthy, sad snails. 40% of them died and the rest are finally coming around after being cared for. Good Luck Rho http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Snailtrails/ > I didn't think so either but I have since found other live fish on ebay > as well. Some very nice ones too. I haven't ventured into buying any > yet(too scared to add fish after reading so many stories here.) > Everything is going so well I hate to chance it. L > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@a... > Sent: Wednesday, July 20, 2005 1:58 PM > To: mnaquarium@yahoogroups.com; AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com; > uniaquaria@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] eBay > > > I was doing a search on angelfish for sale and followed a link that led > me > to angelfish for sale on eBay. I didn't think you could sell live > animals on > eBay. > > Linda ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13577	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: eBay

I'm a little eerie of buy stuff off the Internet or even mail order. I like to see what I am getting before I buy it. I was just surfing and was not aware that you could sell livestock on eBay. I used to work for a humane society. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13578	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: rooting tropical plants in back of tank

Good luck Eric. Sounds like a great idea. Let me know when you have a blue print for it and take a picture for us to see=) Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13579	From: yarncrazymom	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: eBay

Oh no I just dont want any trouble with anyone..I dont see anyone else stepping up to put anyones name out as a bad seller....I would hate to be the only one.....There are only a few on Ebay that sell "freshwater" Snails...so chances are its one of them :O) They did send me a refund and was professional about it but the poor snails suffered... Rhonda http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Snailtrails/ Join us for Fun contests and PRIZES > you should mention the name. If this person is selling sick critters, then > you would be helping the community by telling who it is. If people know > that word of mouth advertising...both good and bad...is going on, it will > help to keep people honest.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13580	From: yarncrazymom	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Re: eBay

I have come to trust and know several online Freshwater snail breeders if you are ever in the market email me and I would be glad to forward the information on to anyone. Rhonda http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Snailtrails/ Join us for Fun and Contests with PRIZES > I'm a little eerie of buy stuff off the Internet or even mail order. I like > to see what I am getting before I buy it. I was just surfing and was not > aware that you could sell livestock on eBay. I used to work for a humane > society. > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13581	From: snailcrazymom	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Emily's snail

> > > My black mystery just died :( > I thought melafix and M2 wasn't supposed to hurt them, or maybe it just got > old? > Emily > Emily... Melafix is fine to use on your snails to help treat your fish...did you just have the one snail or are you worried about others in the tank...you are doing the water changes which is GREAT, just make sure that you are replacing it with treated water. I am assumming that it is a fresh water tank I dont recall what you said it was. You can use up to a tablespoon of salt per 10 gallons on snails, cory cats and plecos with no ill effects too. This will help fight off problems. Did you say that your nitrites were high? That could effect the snail as well. Most time the snail will roll over on the back of its shell and die from the poison. Check the additives on the meds you are using..if it contains Copper that is a NO NO for snails..and copper can even break down the Bio of the tank. Hope that your other water BB's are fine Hope this helped some Rhonda http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Snailtrails/ Join us for Fun and Contests with PRIZES

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13582	From: Norman Ali	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: The Koran Angelfish (Pomacanthus semicirculatus, Cuvier, 1831)

The Koran Angelfish (Pomacanthus semicirculatus, Cuvier, 1831)* By: Norman Ali Khalaf-von Jaffa *Note: This article was published in: Gazelle: The Palestinian Biological Bulletin. Number 44. August 2005. The Koran Angelfish is one of the eighty-six described species of the marine angelfish family, Pomacanthidae. With their vibrant colours and deep, laterally compressed bodies, marine angelfish are some of the more conspicuous residents of the reef. They most closely resemble the butterflyfish, a related family of similarly showy reef fish. Marine angelfish are distinguished from butterflyfish by the presence of strong preopercle spines (part of the gill covers) in the former. This feature also explains the family name Pomacanthidae; from the Greek poma meaning "cover" and akantha meaning "thorn". As a juvenile the Koran Angelfish is easily confused with a plethora of other blue, black and white banded young angelfish species. Their other common name, Semicircle Angelfish, only applies to specimens of about one to three inches in total length. Older, larger individuals transform their irregular rear semicircles to sweeping lines. At four to seven inches they show what appears as Arabic Islamic script (hence the name Koran) in blue against black between blue lines on the tail fin. In some specimens we can read on one side of the tail "La Ilaha Illa Allah" (There is no God but Allah) and on the other side "Sha'n Allah" (A Matter of Allah). Korans have four or five wider-distinctive white body band-lines that sweep back dorsally and ventrally. Other species of large angel's young have more striping that is more vertical (or more circular in the case of the imperator) and/or orange colouration which the Koran lacks. Adult colouration patterns are attained in a few years at a size of six-seven inches plus. The white stripes and blue fade to an overall pattern of dark spots on a yellowish-green background. Three inch juvenile, six, eight inch changelings below. Classification: Class: Actinopterygii (ray-finned fishes). Order: Perciformes (perch-like fish). Family: Pomacanthidae (Angelfishes). Subfamily: Pomacanthinae. Scientific Name: Pomacanthus semicirculatus, Cuvier, 1831. Other Scientific Names: Holacanthus semicirculatus, Cuvier in Cuvier and Valenciennes, 1831. (valid as). Holacanthus alternans, Cuvier in Cuvier and Valenciennes, 1831. (synonym). Holacanthus alternans meleagris, Alcock, 1896.(synonym). Holacanthus lepidolepis, Bleeker, 1853.(synonym). Holacanthus ignatius, Playfair, 1868.(synonym). Holacanthus poecilus, Peters, 1868.(synonym). Holacanthus semicircularis, De Vis, 1884.(synonym). Holacanthus reginae, Sauvage, 1891.(synonym). Pomacanthus semicirculatus, Allen, 1980.(valid). Common Name: Koran Angelfish. Other Common Names: English: Semicircle Angelfish, Koran Angel, Half-circled Angelfish, Zebra Angelfish, Blue Angelfish. German: Koran Kaiserfisch, Koranfisch. Arabic: Samak Alqura'n Almalai'ki. Distribution: Indo-West Pacific: Red Sea, East Africa and Arab Sea to Fiji and Samoa, north to southern Japan, south to Western Australia and New South Wales, including Lord Howe Island. Description: Dorsal spines (total): 13-13; Dorsal soft rays (total): 20-23; Anal spines: 3-3; Anal soft rays: 18-22. Juveniles of this species are bluish black with concentric white semi-circles. Adults brownish on anterior and posterior third of the body; middle portion greenish or yellowish; numerous blue spots on the sides; posterior part of dorsal and anal fins prolonged as a filament, the tips bright yellow. Transformation to the adult color pattern occurs over the size range of about 8 - 16 cm. Max. Size: 40.0 cm SL. Similar Species: There is a possible confusion with the Six-banded Angelfish (Pomacanthus sexstriatus), the latter having clear bands along the sides and no blue edges. The juvenile Korans resembles the Emperor Angelfish (Pomacanthus imperator), but the circular lines are never close, like in the latter. Biology: Juveniles inhabit shallow protected areas, while adults prefer coastal reefs with heavy coral growth providing ample hiding places. The species is found foraging and hiding around coral and rocky reefs (external and deep reef), not in open, upper waters or over sandy bottoms. They are often found in proximity of caves and shipwrecks. Generally solitary or in pairs. Feeds on sponges, tunicates, and algae. The young are excellent aquarium fish and suitable for a community tank. Breeding: Egg-scatterer. Environment: Reef-associated; non-migratory; marine; depth range 1 - 30 m. Climate: Tropical; 30°N - 30°S. Global Importance: Aquarium Fish: commercial. Threatened: Not in IUCN Red List. Dangerous: Harmless. Koran Angelfish: The Aquarium Fish: Aquarium Statistics: Min. Tank Size: 70 - 100 gallons. Temperature: 72 - 82 °F. pH: 8.1 - 8.4. sg: 1.018 - 1.025. dKH: 8 - 12. Resilience: Medium, minimum population doubling time 1.4 - 4.4 years (Preliminary K or Fecundity.) Diet: Omnivorous. Meaty foods such as small pieces of shellfish, plus Mysis and brine shrimp; also takes algae. Temperament: This fish will compete strenuously with all others to establish and maintain its territory. Keep this species in a tank that is sufficiently large to offer copious swimming space, and be sure to furnish the aquarium with plenty of shelters, created by using piled rocks. This aggressive fish is not suitable to be kept in an invertebrate aquarium. Selection as Aquarium fish: General to Specific: For most circumstances, Korans, like other large angelfishes, should be purchased as juveniles, but not babies. Very small individuals (less than two inches) should be avoided as they usually adapt poorly. Get at least a three inch specimen; and not one over six inches. Larger specimens often time are problematical in terms of foods/feeding and behavior. Also of note, larger specimens (upwards of 16 inches) require systems of a few to several hundred-gallon capacities. There are a handful of important observational criteria to consider in picking out a good specimen. A prime one is apparent health as gauged by gill movement. A healthy individual displays regular, steady "breathing" of about once per second. Gill flukes, common and species-specific on these wild-caught fish, the effects of "gill- burn" from shipment/handling, poor present water quality, all can speed up the rate of gill movement. Avoid such angels. Instead choose one with full finnage and a full-body appearance, not thin in the head or stomach. Only buy angels that are alert interested in their environment, not skulking in a corner. These pomacanthids have a curious nature that mirrors their intelligence. The fish's colour should be bright and uniform, showing no light spots, blemishes or pitting. Eyes must be clear and shiny. Ask to see the prospective purchase eat what you intend to feed it at home. Though most Korans that eat will live on, it's best to leave the specimen for weeks stay at the dealers holding it on deposit. Environmental Conditions; Chemical, Physical, Biological: Koran angels are more sensitive to poor water quality as marine aquarium species go. Excess organics often show as blotchy white- marked areas, and are directly positively correlated with ease of infectious and parasitic susceptibility. Temperatures in the low to upper seventy degrees Fahrenheit, lower to "normal" specific gravity (1.018-1.025), of natural or synthetic saltwater are fine. Effective protein skimming is a must have. Behaviour Notes: All members of medium and large angelfish species are aggressive toward their own kind, other angels and similar-appearing fishes and are ideally kept one specimen to a tank. Sometimes adding them at the same time, moving around parts of the habitat, disrupting territories, or bringing in ever-larger specimens can successfully mix these angels. This practice is not encouraged unless you have other facilities for separating them, should relations sour. In most cases other non-angel species are generally ignored; occasionally a Koran angel will become a bully, and require "rehabilitation" through removal or temporary isolation. Provide adequate hiding and escape spaces for tank-mates and observe your charges, as you should, daily. Feeding: This is the most critical area in keeping most angels and many other saltwater species. Koran's should be offered live and fresh foods and weaned from natural foodstuffs ASAP to survive and thrive. In the wild, Korans feed on algae and associated fauna primarily as juveniles; adults eat copious amounts of sponges, corals, and algae with the remaining bulk made up mostly of worms of all sorts, crustaceans and mollusks. They supplement this diet well in captivity with crustacean and other fresh and frozen animal foods. Opened, whole shellfish, squid, frozen and fresh crustaceans should be offered occasionally. Plant material/algae materials should be fed daily. Algae (Caulerpa), Ulva (sea lettuce), nori and kombu from an oriental food supplier, and plant matter (spinach, zucchini, chard etc.) should make up a substantial part of their diet. Feed frequently, small amounts. Disease: Infectious, parasitic, nutritional and social diseases are a significant problem with this species. Beyond details already listed, careful handling, quarantine and freshwater dipping with or without admixtures are recommended. If necessary, copper treatments (best chelated types) are suggested for ridding pathogens. Summary: The Koran Angelfish or Semicircle Angelfish (Pomacanthus semicirculatus) makes an excellent first or beginner angel for aquarists with an adequately large system. It's easy to find, reasonably inexpensive; simple to maintain when purchased at the right size and fed properly, intelligent and long-lived. References and Internet Websites: Allen, Gerald R. (1979). Butterfly and Angelfishes of the World. Vol 2. Wiley Interscience, New York. Dor, Menahem (1986). Checklist of the Fishes of the Red Sea. Israel Academy of Sciences and Humanities, Jerusalem. El Acuarista. El Sitio Web Latinoamericano de Acuariofilia y Disciplinas afines. http://images.google.de/imgres? imgurl=http://www.elacuarista.com/secciones/images/semicirc_terver.gi f&imgrefurl=http://www.elacuarista.com/secciones/acuamarino1.htm&h=30 5&w=475&sz=135&tbnid=2_Tf1tVeE5gJ:&tbnh=80&tbnw=126&hl=de&start=21&pr ev=/images%3Fq%3Dpomacanthus%2Bsemicirculatus%26start%3D20%26svnum% 3D10%26hl%3Dde%26lr%3D%26sa%3DN Emmens, C.W. (1972). Pacific angelfish. Marine Aquarist 3(1):72. Emmens, C.W. (1983). Large Pacific angelfishes. TFH 3/83. Fenner, Robert M. (1998). The Conscientious Marine Aquarist. Microcosm, VT. 432pp. Kaiserfische: Koran Kaiserfisch. http://www.seewasserlexikon.de/fische/kaiserfische/pomacanthus_semici rculatus.htm Khalaf, Norman Ali Bassam (1980). Tabi'et Altalawon fi Alhaiwanat. (The Colouration of Animals). Albiology Bulletin, Biological Society, Kuwait University, State of Kuwait. Number 1. January 1980, Safar 1401. pp. 4-5. (in Arabic). Khalaf, Norman Ali Bassam (1981). Fawa'ed Alasmak. (The Benefits of Fishes). Albiology Magazine, Biological Socity, Kuwait University, State of Kuwait. Number 1. Sunday 7.6.1981, 5. Sha'ban 1401. pp. 54- 55. (in Arabic). Khalaf, Norman Ali Bassam (1982). Samak Al-Coelacanth (The Coelacanth Fish). Albiology Magazine. Number 2. February 1982. Biological Society, Kuwait University, State of Kuwait. pp. 14-15. (in Arabic). Khalaf, Norman Ali B.(1986). The Schooling of Fishes. Gazelle: The Palestinian Biological Bulletin. Number 9. Fourth Year. Ramadan 1406. May 1986. Durham, United Kingdom. pp. 1-13. Khalaf, N.A.B. (1986). The Schooling of Sumatra Barbs (Barbus tetrazona tetrazona) and Minnows (Phoxinus phoxinus). Unpublished Dissertation, M.Sc. in Ecology, Departments of Zoology and Botany, University of Durham, England. pps. 59. Khalaf, Norman Ali B. (1987). The Coelacanth (Latimeria chalumnae) in the Science and Natural History Museum, State of Kuwait. Gazelle: The Palestinian Biological Bulletin. Number 15. Fifth Year. July 1987. Rilchingen-Hanweiler, Germany. pp. 1-8. Khalaf-von Jaffa, Norman Ali B.(1995). Alasmak fi Filistin (Die Fische von Palaestina...The Fishes of Palestine). Gazelle: The Palestinian Biological Bulletin. Number 33. Thirteenth Year. December 1995. Bonn, Germany. pp.1-35. (in Arabic). Khalaf-von Jaffa, Norman Ali (2004). Gazelle: Das Palaestinensische Biologische Bulletin. Eine Wissenschaftliche Reise in Palaestina, Arabien und Europa zwischen 1983 – 2004. / Gazelle: The Palestinian Biological Bulletin. A Scientific Journey in Palestine, Arabia and Europe between 1983 – 2004. Erste Auflage, Juli 2004: 452 Seiten. Zweite erweiterte Auflage, August 2004: 460 Seiten. Norman Ali Khalaf, Bonn-Bad Godesberg, Germany. http://www.geocities.com/jaffacity/Gazelle_Bulletin.html Khalaf-von Jaffa, Norman Ali (2005). Aquatica Arabica. Eine Aquatische Wissenschaftliche Reise in Palaestina, Arabien und Europa zwischen 1980 - 2005. / Aquatica Arabica. An Aquatic Scientific Journey in Palestine, Arabia and Europe between 1980 - 2005. (in publication). http://www.geocities.com/jaffacity/Aquatica_Arabica.html Khalaf-von Jaffa, Norman Ali (2005). Der Komoren-Quastenflosser (Latimeria chalumnae) und der Manado-Quastenflosser (Latimeria menadoensis). Gazelle: The Palestinian Biological Bulletin. Number 38. Twenty Third Year. February 2005. Sharjah, United Arab Emirates. pp. 1-8. http://www.geocities.com/jaffacity/quastenflosser.html Khalaf-von Jaffa, Norman Ali (Gruender)(2005). Der Quastenflosser: Coelacanth Latimeria Yahoo Deutschland Group. http://de.groups.yahoo.com/group/Quastenflosser/ Khalaf-von Jaffa, Norman Ali (2005). The Koran Angelfish (Pomacanthus semicirculatus, Cuvier, 1831). Gazelle: The Palestinian Biological Bulletin. Number 44. Twenty-third Year. August 2005. Jamada Alakhira 1426. Sharjah, United Arab Emirates. pp. 1-8. http://www.geocities.com/jaffacity/Koran_Angelfish.html Marine Angelfish. http://www.absoluteastronomy.com/encyclopedia/M/Ma/Marine_angelfish.h tm Marine Angelfishes of the Red Sea. http://www.wetwebmedia.com/marine/fishes/angels/rsangels.htm Miklosz, John C. (1972). When is a Koran, not a Koran? Marine Aquarist 3(4):72. Moenich, David R. (1987). Angel food; the most important single factor in keeping marine angels healthy is a varied diet. TFH 6/87. Moenich, David R. (1988). Breaking the rules (on mixing angel species). TFH 3/88. My Favorite Large Marine Angelfish, the Koran, Pomacanthus semicirculatus. http://www.wetwebmedia.com/marine/fishes/angels/pomacanthus/koran.htm Norman, J.R. (1963). A History of Fishes. Revised by: P.H. Greenwood. Second (Revised) Edition. Ernest Benn Limited, London. pps. 398. Pomacanthus semicirculatus (Cuvier in Cuvier and Valenciennes, 1831). ITIS Report. http://www.itis.usda.gov/servlet/SingleRpt/SingleRpt? search_topic=TSN&search_value=169636 Pomacanthus semicirculatus in Sri Lanka: Semicircle angelfish. http://www.fishbase.org/Country/CountrySpeciesSummary.cfm? Country=Sri%20Lanka&Genus=Pomacanthus&Species=semicirculatus Pomacanthus semicirculatus (Koran Angel). FishIndex. http://species.fishindex.com/species_1356pomacanthus_semicirculatus_k oran_angel.html Pomacanthus semicirculatus Semicircle angelfish. http://www.fishbase.org/Summary/SpeciesSummary.cfm?id=5663 Scientific Names: Pomacanthus. http://www.funet.fi/pub/sci/bio/life/pisces/actinopterygii/perciforme s/pomacanthidae/pomacanthinae/pomacanthus/ Semi circled angel fish, Pomacanthus semicirculatus. http://www.edge- of-reef.com/pomacantidi/POMPomacanthussemicirculatusen.htm The Fish of Bali. http://www.hallofreun.de/fish.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13583	From: Robert	Date: 7/20/2005
Subject: Warm water

Can Koi's live in tropical tanks? Robert

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13584	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Re: zeolite

Ray, Read the 2nd and 3rd lines of my post, are they not aquarium related ??. If you read all of the link you now know that there is a Zeolite product to remove almost anything!, not being from your side of the pond I can't quote you trade names, but remember the aquarium hobby is a very insignificant outlet for this type of product, I'm not to sure but how about Rawfoss (may be spelt wrong) removes phosphates. regards, unclenorm. Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote: Uncle Norm, I'm well aware of the existence of various other Zeolite products, as I'm sure many other members are. I did visit the web site you posted only to find it most interesting. However, I don't see any other Zeolites on that web site that are used in the aquarium hobby. Surely your most recent reply for me to visit your posted Zeolite web site is not an answer to my question as these Zeolites have nothing to do with the aquarium hobby. I specifically asked you if you could elaborate on other Zeolite products found in the aquarium hobby. When Lenny was discussing Zeolites, he was clearly doing so as it relates to the aquarium hobby, as was I. While there of course are other Zeolite products in existence, for many other uses, why would you want to post about products that have absolutely nothing to do with this hobby? What do those Zeolites have to do with the discussion at hand? As Zeolite/ammonia-removal in the aquarium was the subject, the opening sentence of your original post seemed to infer there are other Zeolites to be used in the aquarium for other aquarium related purposes. If some members on this group did not know about other completely unrelated Zeolites (nor go to that web site), they may be under the impression from your post that there are indeed other aquarium related Zeolites that can be used for other aquarium related purposes. I understand where you're coming from, but I can't remember the last time I used Ferrierite or Paranatrolite (no, not to control Parana's/Pirana's - lol), in any of my aquariums. Your replie(s) to Lenny (and myself) almost seemed contradictory if the reader didn't realize you were going off-topic. By the way, as for Lenny's description of the Zeolite form he was talking about for ammonia removal in aquariums, I know of only one Zeolite used for this purpose in the aquarium trade (although different brand names). Why should he need to say which form? Incidentally, that Zeolite website really is fascinating as there are so many of them, even if they have "nothing to do with nothing" here. Regards, Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > Hi Ray, > Did you visit the web site I posted the link for ?? , it lists most of the forms of zeolite available, there are forms for removing most things like nitrite, nitrate, phosphates, silicates and many more. As I said ' Zeolite' is a collective word for a large group of manufactured products, also various natural crystals ( collectors items ). Lenny description was quite correct for one particular form of Zeolite, but he did not say which form hence my 'may or may not be true'. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > > Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: Norman, The type of Zeolite commonly used in the aquarium trade for > the purpose of controlling ammonia, such as Aquarium > Pharmaceuticals' "Ammo-Chips", "Ammo-Carb", "Ammo-Zorb", etc., acts > in exactly this same way. Lenny is right-on, in being 100% accurate > in his description of the behavior of Zeolite as referenced in this > manner in the aquarium industry. The only other Zeolite product for > aquarium use that I'm aware of is the ion-exchange water-softener > crystals use for water softening pillows, which "absorb" calcium and > magnesium. I note you cite the fact that it depends on what form of > Zeolite is being used (and for what purpose), but say nothing > further. Would you care to elaborate as to other Zeolite-based > products found in the aquarium hobby? Many thanks for any further > input you can share in this regard. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. Hampson." > <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > Hi Lenny, > > Your post may or may not be true, it depends > > on what form of Zeolite is being used and for what > > purpose. The word Zeolite refers to a large group > > minerals with many different uses see :- > > http:/mineral.galleries.com/minerals/silicate/zeolites.htm > > regards, > > unclenorm. > > > > > > --- Lenny Vasbinder <lnvtm1@g...> wrote: > > > > > Zeolite absorbs ammonia which means it is taking > > > food away from your nitrifying bacteria colony. > > > > > > At a certain point, the zeolite fills up and then > > > the diminished bacteria colony cannot handle all of > > > the ammonia which can cause a small ammonia / > > > nitrite spike. > > > > > > Also... DO NOT ADD SALT to your tank if you are > > > using zeolite as salt will cause the zeolite to > > > release the ammonia it has absorbed causing a more > > > severe ammonia spike and mini-cycle. > > > > > > If you are going to use zeolite, you should stick to > > > a regular schedule of changing the zeolite so you > > > always have fresh product. You can recycle it if > > > you want by soaking it in a salt water solution. > > > This will cause the zeolite to release the ammonia. > > > > > > Lenny Vasbinder > > > http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com > > > 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 > > > LNVTM1@g... > > > > > > Message: 21 > > > Date: Mon, 18 Jul 2005 20:54:25 EDT > > > From: Crazy4fids@a... > > > Subject: zeolite > > > > > > Has anyone heard that zeolite is bad for your > > > bacteria colony in your > > > aquarium? > > > > > > Linda > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide > with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine biology Biology > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos. Get Yahoo! Photos > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos. Get Yahoo! Photos [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13585	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Re: zeolite

Hi Lenny, My only point was that the word 'Zeolite' does not imply any specific product. While I'm on I will say that if there is an ammonia problem the Zeolite based product in question if it is formulated to remove ammonia cannot do much harm to none existent bacteria (if they were present then there wouldn't be any ammonia.) I would suggest that this is an uncycled tank or the filtration system is inadequate or not functioning for some reason in which case this type of product is not the way to tackle the problem. regards, unclenorm. Lenny Vasbinder <lnvtm1@...> wrote: Unclenorm, All I did was answer the original question as written. If your answer is different than mine, please feel free to post your answer to the question. My answer explains why zeolite can be bad for the nitrifying bacteria colony in an aquarium. > > Message: 21 > > Date: Mon, 18 Jul 2005 20:54:25 EDT > > From: Crazy4fids@a... > > Subject: zeolite > > > > Has anyone heard that zeolite is bad for your > > bacteria colony in your > > aquarium? > > > > Linda Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: Date: Wed, 20 Jul 2005 17:27:16 +0100 (BST) From: "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> Subject: Re: Re: zeolite Hi Ray, Did you visit the web site I posted the link for ?? , it lists most of the forms of zeolite available, there are forms for removing most things like nitrite, nitrate, phosphates, silicates and many more. As I said ' Zeolite' is a collective word for a large group of manufactured products, also various natural crystals ( collectors items ). Lenny description was quite correct for one particular form of Zeolite, but he did not say which form hence my 'may or may not be true'. regards, unclenorm. Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote: Norman, The type of Zeolite commonly used in the aquarium trade for the purpose of controlling ammonia, such as Aquarium Pharmaceuticals' "Ammo-Chips", "Ammo-Carb", "Ammo-Zorb", etc., acts in exactly this same way. Lenny is right-on, in being 100% accurate in his description of the behavior of Zeolite as referenced in this manner in the aquarium industry. The only other Zeolite product for aquarium use that I'm aware of is the ion-exchange water-softener crystals use for water softening pillows, which "absorb" calcium and magnesium. I note you cite the fact that it depends on what form of Zeolite is being used (and for what purpose), but say nothing further. Would you care to elaborate as to other Zeolite-based products found in the aquarium hobby? Many thanks for any further input you can share in this regard. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > Hi Lenny, > Your post may or may not be true, it depends > on what form of Zeolite is being used and for what > purpose. The word Zeolite refers to a large group > minerals with many different uses see :- > http:/mineral.galleries.com/minerals/silicate/zeolites.htm > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- Lenny Vasbinder <lnvtm1@g...> wrote: > > > Zeolite absorbs ammonia which means it is taking > > food away from your nitrifying bacteria colony. > > > > At a certain point, the zeolite fills up and then > > the diminished bacteria colony cannot handle all of > > the ammonia which can cause a small ammonia / > > nitrite spike. > > > > Also... DO NOT ADD SALT to your tank if you are > > using zeolite as salt will cause the zeolite to > > release the ammonia it has absorbed causing a more > > severe ammonia spike and mini-cycle. > > > > If you are going to use zeolite, you should stick to > > a regular schedule of changing the zeolite so you > > always have fresh product. You can recycle it if > > you want by soaking it in a salt water solution. > > This will cause the zeolite to release the ammonia. > > > > Lenny Vasbinder > > http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com > > 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 > > LNVTM1@g... > > > > Message: 21 > > Date: Mon, 18 Jul 2005 20:54:25 EDT > > From: Crazy4fids@a... > > Subject: zeolite > > > > Has anyone heard that zeolite is bad for your > > bacteria colony in your > > aquarium? > > > > Linda > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos. Get Yahoo! Photos [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13586	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Re: eBay

As everyone knows things happen. Maybe the snails where in tip top shape when he sent them,.Things happen. Once they leave a sellers hands its out of there control. He refunded your $ and was professional about how he treated you. That sounds like a Great Ebay seller to me. I have run across some sellers who will not even return an email, little alone money. rob Indiana over 400 + remarks on Ebay and 1- remark In a message dated 7/20/2005 11:10:54 PM US Eastern Standard Time, yarncrazymom@... writes: Oh no I just dont want any trouble with anyone..I dont see anyone else stepping up to put anyones name out as a bad seller....I would hate to be the only one.....There are only a few on Ebay that sell "freshwater" Snails...so chances are its one of them :O) They did send me a refund and was professional about it but the poor snails suffered... Rhonda http://groups [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13587	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Re: Emily's snail

Sorry to hear about your loss :-( rob Indiana In a message dated 7/20/2005 11:49:15 PM US Eastern Standard Time, yarncrazymom@... writes: My black mystery just died :( > I thought melafix and M2 wasn't supposed to hurt them, or maybe it just got > old? > Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13588	From: Evita	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Re: eBay

Linda, I thought the same thing but it seems that fish don't count as live animals. But birds do. Go figure. Evita Crazy4fids@... wrote:I was doing a search on angelfish for sale and followed a link that led me to angelfish for sale on eBay. I didn't think you could sell live animals on eBay. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13589	From: Evita	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Re: eBay

I have bought tons on e-bay. Fairly large ticket items and some small from my movie camera, guitars, a sewing maching, my steam cleaner and some Vintage Santa stuff. But nothing live. One thing is check the feed-back and stats of the seller close, (How many sell they have made, how long they have been under the name, as well as what others say about them. Also some people use a flat shipping rate to jack up the price. Evita Crazy4fids@... wrote:I'm a little eerie of buy stuff off the Internet or even mail order. I like to see what I am getting before I buy it. I was just surfing and was not aware that you could sell livestock on eBay. I used to work for a humane society. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13590	From: Evita	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Re: eBay

Rob, that is so true. You made some really good points. I might also add that sometimes the person might have neg. feed-back but I always look at how that person handles it. If they get angry and try to put the buying down I see a red flag. If they explain calmly and tell how they resolved the situation, many times you can see it wasn't their fault. We have sold as well as bought on e-bay and many times there are just as many or more bad buyers as sellers. Sometimes people are just plain difficult. Evita FortWayneFish@... wrote:As everyone knows things happen. Maybe the snails where in tip top shape when he sent them,.Things happen. Once they leave a sellers hands its out of there control. He refunded your $ and was professional about how he treated you. That sounds like a Great Ebay seller to me. I have run across some sellers who will not even return an email, little alone money. rob Indiana over 400 + remarks on Ebay and 1- remark In a message dated 7/20/2005 11:10:54 PM US Eastern Standard Time, yarncrazymom@... writes: Oh no I just dont want any trouble with anyone..I dont see anyone else stepping up to put anyones name out as a bad seller....I would hate to be the only one.....There are only a few on Ebay that sell "freshwater" Snails...so chances are its one of them :O) They did send me a refund and was professional about it but the poor snails suffered... Rhonda http://groups [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13591	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Re: eBay

This is very true. I have also ordered things like Snails and plants off eBay and the response from the sellers have been great. However, sometimes we do get sellers who are as crap as sending you the wrong stuff then make you send the stuff back to them so they can arrange a replacement and you never hear from them again. Usually stuff below £15 which is not covered by any eBay policy and eBay cannot take the seller to task either :-(. Not that the money mattered, but I was hoping that the so called “Power seller with 3000+ rating” should have acted responsibly and if not, eBay should have done something about it except for me leaving a negative feedback and getting the same from him :-( Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of FortWayneFish@... Sent: 21 July 2005 11:42 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: eBay As everyone knows things happen. Maybe the snails where in tip top shape when he sent them,.Things happen. Once they leave a sellers hands its out of there control. He refunded your $ and was professional about how he treated you. That sounds like a Great Ebay seller to me. I have run across some sellers who will not even return an email, little alone money. rob Indiana over 400 + remarks on Ebay and 1- remark In a message dated 7/20/2005 11:10:54 PM US Eastern Standard Time, yarncrazymom@... writes: Oh no I just dont want any trouble with anyone..I dont see anyone else stepping up to put anyones name out as a bad seller....I would hate to be the only one.....There are only a few on Ebay that sell "freshwater" Snails...so chances are its one of them :O) They did send me a refund and was professional about it but the poor snails suffered... Rhonda http://groups [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13592	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Re: eBay

More important. Do read their negative feedback and especially if a negative feedback has been left by a reputable buyer/seller (with more then 50 rating). Having a high rating on a seller with plenty of negative feedback is also something of a risk IMHO. Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evita Sent: 21 July 2005 13:03 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: eBay I have bought tons on e-bay. Fairly large ticket items and some small from my movie camera, guitars, a sewing maching, my steam cleaner and some Vintage Santa stuff. But nothing live. One thing is check the feed-back and stats of the seller close, (How many sell they have made, how long they have been under the name, as well as what others say about them. Also some people use a flat shipping rate to jack up the price. Evita Crazy4fids@... wrote:I'm a little eerie of buy stuff off the Internet or even mail order. I like to see what I am getting before I buy it. I was just surfing and was not aware that you could sell livestock on eBay. I used to work for a humane society. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13593	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Re: zeolite

Unclenorm, In re-reading the 2nd and 3rd lines of your original post (the main topic of discussion here and now), I would have to say the answer is "NO", they are not aquarium related. That is just my point. While I certainly agree, as you've been so kind as to point out, that there are Zeolite products to remove almost anything, these products are not used in the aquarium hobby -- at least not on this side of the Pond. Okay, just NOW, came back from going up to sites referring to Rowaphos. This product is made in Germany (for removing phosphate) but is not yet found in the States (at least my wholesale suppliers do not handle it yet). We have a freeze-dried bacteria product here for removing phosphates. I'm beginning to see where the discrepancies are coming from. Regards, Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > Ray, > Read the 2nd and 3rd lines of my post, are they not aquarium related ??. If you read all of the link you now know that there is a Zeolite product to remove almost anything!, not being from your side of the pond I can't quote you trade names, but remember the aquarium hobby is a very insignificant outlet for this type of product, I'm not to sure but how about Rawfoss (may be spelt wrong) removes phosphates. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > > Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: Uncle Norm, I'm well aware of the existence of various other Zeolite > products, as I'm sure many other members are. I did visit the web > site you posted only to find it most interesting. However, I don't > see any other Zeolites on that web site that are used in the aquarium > hobby. Surely your most recent reply for me to visit your posted > Zeolite web site is not an answer to my question as these Zeolites > have nothing to do with the aquarium hobby. I specifically asked you > if you could elaborate on other Zeolite products found in the > aquarium hobby. When Lenny was discussing Zeolites, he was clearly > doing so as it relates to the aquarium hobby, as was I. While there > of course are other Zeolite products in existence, for many other > uses, why would you want to post about products that have absolutely > nothing to do with this hobby? What do those Zeolites have to do > with the discussion at hand? As Zeolite/ammonia-removal in the > aquarium was the subject, the opening sentence of your original post > seemed to infer there are other Zeolites to be used in the aquarium > for other aquarium related purposes. If some members on this group > did not know about other completely unrelated Zeolites (nor go to > that web site), they may be under the impression from your post that > there are indeed other aquarium related Zeolites that can be used for > other aquarium related purposes. I understand where you're coming > from, but I can't remember the last time I used Ferrierite or > Paranatrolite (no, not to control Parana's/Pirana's - lol), in any of > my aquariums. Your replie(s) to Lenny (and myself) almost seemed > contradictory if the reader didn't realize you were going off- topic. > By the way, as for Lenny's description of the Zeolite form he was > talking about for ammonia removal in aquariums, I know of only one > Zeolite used for this purpose in the aquarium trade (although > different brand names). Why should he need to say which form? > Incidentally, that Zeolite website really is fascinating as there are > so many of them, even if they have "nothing to do with nothing" > here. Regards, Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. Hampson." > <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > Hi Ray, > > Did you visit the web site I posted the link for ?? , it > lists most of the forms of zeolite available, there are forms for > removing most things like nitrite, nitrate, phosphates, silicates and > many more. As I said ' Zeolite' is a collective word for a large > group of manufactured products, also various natural crystals ( > collectors items ). Lenny description was quite correct for one > particular form of Zeolite, but he did not say which form hence > my 'may or may not be true'. > > regards, > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: Norman, The type of Zeolite > commonly used in the aquarium trade for > > the purpose of controlling ammonia, such as Aquarium > > Pharmaceuticals' "Ammo-Chips", "Ammo-Carb", "Ammo-Zorb", etc., acts > > in exactly this same way. Lenny is right-on, in being 100% > accurate > > in his description of the behavior of Zeolite as referenced in this > > manner in the aquarium industry. The only other Zeolite product > for > > aquarium use that I'm aware of is the ion-exchange water-softener > > crystals use for water softening pillows, which "absorb" calcium > and > > magnesium. I note you cite the fact that it depends on what form > of > > Zeolite is being used (and for what purpose), but say nothing > > further. Would you care to elaborate as to other Zeolite-based > > products found in the aquarium hobby? Many thanks for any further > > input you can share in this regard. > Ray > > > \ > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. Hampson." > > <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > > Hi Lenny, > > > Your post may or may not be true, it depends > > > on what form of Zeolite is being used and for what > > > purpose. The word Zeolite refers to a large group > > > minerals with many different uses see :- > > > http:/mineral.galleries.com/minerals/silicate/zeolites.htm > > > regards, > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > --- Lenny Vasbinder <lnvtm1@g...> wrote: > > > > > > > Zeolite absorbs ammonia which means it is taking > > > > food away from your nitrifying bacteria colony. > > > > > > > > At a certain point, the zeolite fills up and then > > > > the diminished bacteria colony cannot handle all of > > > > the ammonia which can cause a small ammonia / > > > > nitrite spike. > > > > > > > > Also... DO NOT ADD SALT to your tank if you are > > > > using zeolite as salt will cause the zeolite to > > > > release the ammonia it has absorbed causing a more > > > > severe ammonia spike and mini-cycle. > > > > > > > > If you are going to use zeolite, you should stick to > > > > a regular schedule of changing the zeolite so you > > > > always have fresh product. You can recycle it if > > > > you want by soaking it in a salt water solution. > > > > This will cause the zeolite to release the ammonia. > > > > > > > > Lenny Vasbinder > > > > http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com > > > > 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 > > > > LNVTM1@g... > > > > > > > > Message: 21 > > > > Date: Mon, 18 Jul 2005 20:54:25 EDT > > > > From: Crazy4fids@a... > > > > Subject: zeolite > > > > > > > > Has anyone heard that zeolite is bad for your > > > > bacteria colony in your > > > > aquarium? > > > > > > > > Linda > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide > > with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > Marine biology Biology > > > > --------------------------------- > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service. > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps > for FREE with Yahoo! Photos. Get Yahoo! Photos > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine biology Biology > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13594	From: Karen	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Re: eBay

I have bought a lot of stuff on Ebay over the years. I'd say 99% of all of my purchases have been favorable. While I haven't bought fish, I have bought fish from a breeder that also sells on Ebay and Aquabid. I just prefer to go through the dealer directly. I too don't understand the policy of allowing live aquatics as if they aren't animals but what can you do. If you are looking for angelfish, try the trading forum on www.cichlid-forum.com. If I remember corretly angels are cichlids too. There is also a good review section to check on various retailers. While the price to ship can be exorbadant, I believe you get much better quality fish. Of course it's cost prohibitive if you only want one or two fish. But if you want several or want to stock an entire tank, it's much cheaper than going to the LFS. I'm in the process of stocking a 100 gal Hap/Peacock tank. If I were to buy at the LFS, it would cost around $150 -$200 for a dozen fish. But it will be under $100 to buy 15 from a retailer and having them shipped. I've had very good luck with receiving fish FedEx. I bought 6 Lake Victorian cichlids that were shipped from Minnesota to Louisiana. They arrived 12 hours after they were shipped and I paid around $35 for the shipping. These are fish that cannot be found locally either. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@y...> wrote: > More important. Do read their negative feedback and especially if a negative > feedback has been left by a reputable buyer/seller (with more then 50 > rating). Having a high rating on a seller with plenty of negative feedback > is also something of a risk IMHO. > > > > Nim > > > > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Evita > Sent: 21 July 2005 13:03 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: eBay > > > > I have bought tons on e-bay. Fairly large ticket items and some small from > my movie camera, guitars, a sewing maching, my steam cleaner and some > Vintage Santa stuff. But nothing live. One thing is check the feed-back > and stats of the seller close, (How many sell they have made, how long they > have been under the name, as well as what others say about them. Also some > people use a flat shipping rate to jack up the price. Evita > > Crazy4fids@a... wrote:I'm a little eerie of buy stuff off the Internet or > even mail order. I like > to see what I am getting before I buy it. I was just surfing and was not > aware that you could sell livestock on eBay. I used to work for a humane > society. > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology > > Biology > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > _____ > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13595	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Re: rooting tropical plants in back of tank

Will do. I may draw up some plans and scan them in once I figure out exactly how I am going to do it ;-) Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Wednesday, July 20, 2005 11:02 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] rooting tropical plants in back of tank Good luck Eric. Sounds like a great idea. Let me know when you have a blue print for it and take a picture for us to see=) Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13596	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Re: eBay

Then it sounds like they are not bad folk. If they were, you wouldn't have received a refund. I have never bought animals on eBay, but I have bought plants before with good results. With animals, it can be hard to tell if they are sick. It could have been that they just had a bad batch of snails. I have bought fish from my LFS that has a great reputation and from whom I never had any problems with before...and it turned out the fish was sick when I got him. Places that are reputable with guarantee their animals and will replace them if they are sick or dead when you get them...many even give a certain number of days after you receive them. I think that we, as a community, should let others know about the good and bad experiences we have. If you are the only person that has had problems, it may have been a fluke. If 20 other people come up and say...you know we had the same problem...then we know to avoid that seller. It's not causing trouble...it's helping to keep consumers aware and informed. On the other side of the coin, if you have a seller that you love and get great results from, you should let everyone know so that their good ethics can be likewise rewarded. One of the companies that I deal with on EBay is Bettaboys. I love their baby mossballs...they are so cute...like green tribbles *grin* Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of yarncrazymom Sent: Wednesday, July 20, 2005 11:10 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: eBay Oh no I just dont want any trouble with anyone..I dont see anyone else stepping up to put anyones name out as a bad seller....I would hate to be the only one.....There are only a few on Ebay that sell "freshwater" Snails...so chances are its one of them :O) They did send me a refund and was professional about it but the poor snails suffered... Rhonda http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Snailtrails/ Join us for Fun contests and PRIZES > you should mention the name. If this person is selling sick critters, then > you would be helping the community by telling who it is. If people know > that word of mouth advertising...both good and bad...is going on, it will > help to keep people honest. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13597	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: I have a few substrate questions

I have been given a 50 gal. tank. I am planning to make this a planted tank, but not sure about the substrate. I am wanting to use sand, but am thinking that it might be a good idea to mix a bit of potting soil with it. Would this be a good idea or would it be better to just do the sand? There will be a little bit of gravel here and there as decoration, but it will not be covering the whole. MM & MP, '73 Tricia, KG6PNC A couple of great sites for fun http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya Check out my yahoogroup..... clickable [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13598	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Re: I have a few substrate questions

Carib Sea makes a substrate designed for potted tanks called Eco-Complete...you should check it out. You will get mixed feelings on using sand as sand can compact and inhibit root growth...while others say it works fine. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Tricia Wilkerson Sent: Thursday, July 21, 2005 1:12 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] I have a few substrate questions I have been given a 50 gal. tank. I am planning to make this a planted tank, but not sure about the substrate. I am wanting to use sand, but am thinking that it might be a good idea to mix a bit of potting soil with it. Would this be a good idea or would it be better to just do the sand? There will be a little bit of gravel here and there as decoration, but it will not be covering the whole. MM & MP, '73 Tricia, KG6PNC A couple of great sites for fun http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya Check out my yahoogroup..... clickable [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13599	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Re: I have a few substrate questions

In a message dated 7/21/2005 3:22:46 P.M. Central Standard Time, woad@... writes: Carib Sea makes a substrate designed for potted tanks called Eco-Complete...you should check it out. You will get mixed feelings on using sand as sand can compact and inhibit root growth...while others say it works fine I'd be hesitant about adding potting soil also. I would recommend laterite or flourite instead. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13600	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Re: I have a few substrate questions

Thanks for the info... this looks interesting and I will keep it in mind, though it is a bit on the expensive side. MM & MP, '73 Tricia, KG6PNC A couple of great sites for fun http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya Check out my yahoogroup..... clickable [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13601	From: Dan	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Re: eBay

Gr8 angels can be bought from www_angelsplus_com. I have bought many things from equipment to fish from them with no problems or really high s&h fees. Dan (thaSkorpeon) --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Karen" <oilfield_brat@y...> wrote: > I have bought a lot of stuff on Ebay over the years. I'd say 99% of > all of my purchases have been favorable. While I haven't bought > fish, I have bought fish from a breeder that also sells on Ebay and > Aquabid. I just prefer to go through the dealer directly. I too > don't understand the policy of allowing live aquatics as if they > aren't animals but what can you do. > > If you are looking for angelfish, try the trading forum on > www.cichlid-forum.com. If I remember corretly angels are cichlids > too. There is also a good review section to check on various > retailers. While the price to ship can be exorbadant, I believe you > get much better quality fish. Of course it's cost prohibitive if you > only want one or two fish. But if you want several or want to stock > an entire tank, it's much cheaper than going to the LFS. I'm in the > process of stocking a 100 gal Hap/Peacock tank. If I were to buy at > the LFS, it would cost around $150 -$200 for a dozen fish. But it > will be under $100 to buy 15 from a retailer and having them > shipped. I've had very good luck with receiving fish FedEx. I bought > 6 Lake Victorian cichlids that were shipped from Minnesota to > Louisiana. They arrived 12 hours after they were shipped and I paid > around $35 for the shipping. These are fish that cannot be found > locally either. > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@y...> > wrote: > > More important. Do read their negative feedback and especially if > a negative > > feedback has been left by a reputable buyer/seller (with more then > 50 > > rating). Having a high rating on a seller with plenty of negative > feedback > > is also something of a risk IMHO. > > > > > > > > Nim > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Evita > > Sent: 21 July 2005 13:03 > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: eBay > > > > > > > > I have bought tons on e-bay. Fairly large ticket items and some > small from > > my movie camera, guitars, a sewing maching, my steam cleaner and > some > > Vintage Santa stuff. But nothing live. One thing is check the > feed-back > > and stats of the seller close, (How many sell they have made, how > long they > > have been under the name, as well as what others say about them. > Also some > > people use a flat shipping rate to jack up the price. Evita > > > > Crazy4fids@a... wrote:I'm a little eerie of buy stuff off the > Internet or > > even mail order. I like > > to see what I am getting before I buy it. I was just surfing and > was not > > aware that you could sell livestock on eBay. I used to work for > a humane > > society. > > > > Linda > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service. > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > > > > > Marine > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? > t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology > > > > Biology > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? > t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13602	From: Tom Ray	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Re: I have a few substrate questions

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Tricia Wilkerson" <trycya@g...> wrote: > I have been given a 50 gal. tank. I am planning to make this a planted tank, but not sure about the substrate. I am wanting to use sand, but am thinking that it might be a good idea to mix a bit of potting soil with it. Would this be a good idea or would it be better to just do the sand? You may want to visit www.AquaBotanic.com's forum (some name like "EL Naturale") on "natural" or "low-tech" tanks and substrates. The moderator, Diana W. has literally written the book on using plain ol' potting soil. For High-Tech, the others are correct. Laterite and Florabase act as purportedly great ionic adhesives for the minerals your plant roots will need. I've used both. Florabase is cheaper here, BUT not cheap (see below on cheaper alternative). Neither, IMHO, is great should you use an Under Gravel filter. Both are a bit light to be used alone. And, Seachem's Flourite (red or black) and Carib's Eco-Complete are sweet for the initial year. I've used both. Flourite is heavy enough to use "as is." But, I find, it is a bit course in grade for some substrate cleaner fish and delicate plantings in small spaces. Eco-complete is a mix of 2 grades and "bio juice" to get the tank started cycling right. I find it a bit light should you want to put bottom cleaners like loaches or corys in your tank. You may also see Seachem's Onyx. I've heard mixed reviews of it, but if you buy it, most people seem to prefer and recommend the "sand" grade. For High-Tech on a budget, I'd use a layer of boiled peat and one of Schultz APS (aquauatic potting soil = Laterite/Florabase) under my top layer of pea gravel. Personally, I just set up a tank intended to NOT to ever have cory or loaches using boiled peat, APS, and Eco-complete -- a sort of cheaper High-Tech. I am also using/trying 2 small reptile heater pads on the bottom to induce thermals through the substrate. One of my LFS does it to all his plant tanks. And, from what I have read, long-term productive life of the tank substrate really does appear to be improved by heating. > There will be a little bit of gravel here and there as decoration, but it will not be covering the whole. If it looks like goldfish bowl gravel, I'd discard or use it ONLY for contrasting color/texture decoration.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13603	From: Tom Ray	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Fish for more acidic water

In my last post (a reply re. substrates), I said I am putting together a new tank. Layout, hardscape and plants done. Now I am trying stock it. It will include a Wild Betta that like peat filtered water (pH at or around 6+). I'd like to use cheap ol' White Clouds (SN: Tanichthys albonubes) since they shoal (loose schooling some as well as swim alone), and since their coloration would work well with the Bettas and the rest of the tank (browns to ruddy reds, and greens). Anyone ever done this? From what I read, it should be OK, but I know they don't read books and I also know they originally came from mountain (i.e., well-aereated) waters. And, I cannot find anyone writing about their oxygen needs. Also, if you know of other fish that you think particularly go with this color scheme (other than/NOT loaches and NOT cory cats), please let me know.* For sizing, the tank is 24Lx18Wx20H" @37 gal.. TIA, --TommyBoy *NOTE: Cardinals and Neon Tetras, and other fish with "blue reds" would be examples of fish that DO NOT go with this color scheme. This would preclude most/all So. American Tetras. Would African Tetras or Killies work color-wise? Would So. American Killies?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13604	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Re: I have a few substrate questions

It is best to have a layer of more organic matter on the very bottom. Don't mix it in with the sand, as that will tend to cloud the water and/or float. I mix rinsed chunky peat moss, perlite, and laterite in the very bottom of the tank, then top it off with sand and gravel to hold it down. This gives the roots a great place to grab hold. And even the plants that supposedly do not need a substrate, like java fern, seem to flourish much better in my tank now that I do this.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13605	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Re: I have a few substrate questions

thanks, this makes sense to me, wasn't thinking clearly on the water clarity and the floating problem. This looks like it would be fairly easy to care for and make plants happy and in turn all my little fishy friends very happy. I think this just might end up being the direction I will go. Now just gotta get the new tank moved here and get started... hehehe MM & MP, '73 Tricia, KG6PNC A couple of great sites for fun http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya Check out my yahoogroup..... clickable [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13606	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Re: rooting tropical plants in back of tank

Linda, There are probably nearly as many ways to do this as there are people out there. I only recall seeing philodendrons done this way, though I am sure that there are many other plants out there that will fill the bill. Get yourself a pond book and look up bog plants. If you find something that suits your fancy, look around for it. I've seen plants growing up a trellis against the wall. The start is twined onto the trellis for support, with the roots directly in the water. I've seen twine holding up the plants, I've seen heavy plastic film (stiff Mylar 20-30 mil thick) with holes cut into it to hold plants in place. Eric's idea looks like it has some merit, but I thought that hydroponics media was water with nutrients added??!? I'm sure you can find something hanging around the house that would do to hold the plant with a bit of ingenuity. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Wednesday, July 20, 2005 7:47 PM To: mnaquarium@yahoogroups.com; AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com; uniaquaria@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] rooting tropical plants in back of tank I know I read somewhere that you could grow bare root tropical plants out of the opening in the back of your aquarium. This sounds like something I could do. What is the best method of securing the roots into the tank and keeping the plant from falling off the back? Also what are the best plants for doing this. I think the devils ivy (pothos plant) philodendron vine would do well. You see people rooting these in water all the time. How about the plants that you see sticking out of glass vases with the betta living in them? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13607	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Re: Warm water

Short and sweet--NO. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Robert Sent: Wednesday, July 20, 2005 11:44 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Warm water Can Koi's live in tropical tanks? Robert

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13608	From: Larry Nave	Date: 7/21/2005
Subject: Clearwater Aquarium Filter System

Does anyone use this system to filter their aquariums...I am considering it as it seems the next level up from the under gravel filter concept???? The site is www.miraclekoifood.com/aquarium_filters.html I am not affliated with this site.....just want to get opinons or ideas. Thanks in advance. Larry Carmichael/Sacramento

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13609	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/22/2005
Subject: Re: Fish for more acidic water

You may wish to take a look at what rasboras are available in your area. Also, any of the dwarf type gouramis may be of interest, in their wild forms. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Tom Ray Sent: Thursday, July 21, 2005 7:22 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Fish for more acidic water In my last post (a reply re. substrates), I said I am putting together a new tank. Layout, hardscape and plants done. Now I am trying stock it. It will include a Wild Betta that like peat filtered water (pH at or around 6+). I'd like to use cheap ol' White Clouds (SN: Tanichthys albonubes) since they shoal (loose schooling some as well as swim alone), and since their coloration would work well with the Bettas and the rest of the tank (browns to ruddy reds, and greens). Anyone ever done this? From what I read, it should be OK, but I know they don't read books and I also know they originally came from mountain (i.e., well-aereated) waters. And, I cannot find anyone writing about their oxygen needs. Also, if you know of other fish that you think particularly go with this color scheme (other than/NOT loaches and NOT cory cats), please let me know.* For sizing, the tank is 24Lx18Wx20H" @37 gal.. TIA, --TommyBoy *NOTE: Cardinals and Neon Tetras, and other fish with "blue reds" would be examples of fish that DO NOT go with this color scheme. This would preclude most/all So. American Tetras. Would African Tetras or Killies work color-wise? Would So. American Killies? ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13610	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/22/2005
Subject: Re: Clearwater Aquarium Filter System

looks like a Modified UGF to me.... Myself I'd rather go with a Hang on back filter or a canister filter. but thats just my Opinion. I did not watch the Flash Media presentation.. so it might work diffrently then I think.. Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 7/21/2005 11:30:19 PM US Eastern Standard Time, l.nave@... writes: www.miraclekoifood.com/aquarium_filters.html [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13611	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/22/2005
Subject: Re: Pacu in minneapolis still needs home: will deliver

Hi, it ended up that Aquatropics took the fish :) Emily Evita <evitabug@...> wrote: Emily, Not to sound like a dummy but has he tried calling various fish related pet shops? Maybe one would take it. Also maybe there are some groups devoted to that particular fish that had members that might want it. Also most VET offices have bulletin boards for pet adoption or sales of animals, mostly cats and dogs but he could try putting an advertisement there. Also the public library might have a message board too. Ours does. Good luck. Let us know how it goes. Evita Emily Tenczar wrote: This poor fish still has not found a home and I'm afraid it will be put to sleep. This guy is willing to deliver it to anyone who wants to give it a home. I am sorry that I just don't have any place to put it. Please email me asap if you are interested in having the pacu delivered to your house and I will send you the guy's phone number. Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13612	From: clarkmariposo25@aol.com	Date: 7/22/2005
Subject: Re: Emily's snail

Snails, unfortunately do not live very long-about two years if you are lucky. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13613	From: clarkmariposo25@aol.com	Date: 7/22/2005
Subject: Re: Tricia-ot

your on neopets too. can i add you to my buddy list on the site. my screen name is mariposo. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13614	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 7/22/2005
Subject: Great customer service from That Pet Place!

I ordered some decorations from them for my 55 gallon tank which arrived on July 21 and I unwrapped them all so I could wash them down before we put them in the tank. Well, one of my decorations broke during transit to me. I wasn't able to get a hold of the customer service last night because they were all gone for the night. I called them a few minutes ago and told them what happened and I asked do I need to return the broken one back to you. The girl said no, just throw it away. I will have a new one shipped out to you asap. That is really good of her to tell me to pitch it as it was badly broken not even going to try to repair it as I looked at it and found stress cracks everywhere on it. It was only a matter of time before that decoration would have fallen apart. I give That Pet Place a five star in customer service and shipping very fast. Their URL is: http://www.thatpetplace.com/ They got my business. Beth Brownell http://fa.f-realm.com/ Fanfiction Axis. http://e.webring.com/hub?ring=siriusblack Sirius Black webring. http://e.webring.com/hub?ring=remuslupin Remus Lupin webring http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sailorsenshiocs/ for all original and series characters of Sailor Moon. http://www.livejournal.com/userinfo.bml?user=tropical_fishes Tropical fish tank livejournal community. ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13615	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/22/2005
Subject: Re: I have a few substrate questions

I just got the samples in from Carib sea. The Eco complete has multi size grains ranging from the size of the Tahitian Moonlight sand to something roughly 4 times the size of that...about 1mm I guess...no ruler handy. Eric [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13616	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/22/2005
Subject: Re: Fish for more acidic water

I thought it was not a good idea to put bettas and gouramis together as they are related and may fight/pester one another? --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > You may wish to take a look at what rasboras are available in your area. > Also, any of the dwarf type gouramis may be of interest, in their wild > forms. >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13617	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/22/2005
Subject: Re: Fish for more acidic water

they're both labyrinth fishes or anabantoids. i don't know if they'd fight/harrass each other but one could always try it and see. --- thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@...> wrote: > I thought it was not a good idea to put bettas and gouramis together > as they are related and may fight/pester one another? > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > > You may wish to take a look at what rasboras are available in your > area. > > Also, any of the dwarf type gouramis may be of interest, in their > wild > > forms. > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13618	From: A.K.	Date: 7/22/2005
Subject: Re: Fish for more acidic water

When I had a male betta in the aquarium he & my male dwarf gourami didn't interact at all. Mind, I have a 29 gal. tank, with lots of live plants for hiding, so that may have made a difference. HTH; A.K. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > I thought it was not a good idea to put bettas and gouramis together > as they are related and may fight/pester one another? > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > > You may wish to take a look at what rasboras are available in your > area. > > Also, any of the dwarf type gouramis may be of interest, in their > wild > > forms. > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13619	From: A.K.	Date: 7/22/2005
Subject: Re: Fish for more acidic water

My white clouds have done well. I have a Whisper power filter on the tank and an additional airstone & that seems to suit them just fine. A.K. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Tom Ray" <t_a_ray_cissp@y...> wrote: > In my last post (a reply re. substrates), I said I am putting together > a new tank. Layout, hardscape and plants done. Now I am trying > stock it. > > It will include a Wild Betta that like peat filtered water (pH at or > around 6+). I'd like to use cheap ol' White Clouds (SN: Tanichthys > albonubes) since they shoal (loose schooling some as well as swim > alone), and since their coloration would work well with the Bettas and > the rest of the tank (browns to ruddy reds, and greens). Anyone ever > done this? From what I read, it should be OK, but I know they don't > read books and I also know they originally came from mountain (i.e., > well-aereated) waters. And, I cannot find anyone writing about their > oxygen needs. > > Also, if you know of other fish that you think particularly go with > this color scheme (other than/NOT loaches and NOT cory cats), please > let me know.* For sizing, the tank is 24Lx18Wx20H" @37 gal.. > > TIA, > --TommyBoy > > *NOTE: Cardinals and Neon Tetras, and other fish with "blue reds" > would be examples of fish that DO NOT go with this color scheme. This > would preclude most/all So. American Tetras. Would African Tetras or > Killies work color-wise? Would So. American Killies?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13620	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/22/2005
Subject: Mouth turning black

My firemouths mouth is turning black. First his fin shrivled up, which I received no feedback on that post, and now he has black spotting on his lips. The black is more-so each day. What is this? Any ideas? Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13621	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/22/2005
Subject: Re: Mouth turning black

Leslie no idea.. I'm sorry rob Indiana In a message dated 7/22/2005 5:41:58 PM US Eastern Standard Time, amjmail@... writes: y firemouths mouth is turning black. First his fin shrivled up, which I received no feedback on that post, and now he has black spotting on his lips. The black is more-so each day. What is this? Any ideas? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13622	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/22/2005
Subject: Re: Fish for more acidic water

They are distant relations, sort of like the third cousin of my mother's aunt's sister twice removed. The aggression in most betta species is conspecific, i.e. only directed at others of their species, mainly males in this case. Gouramis also have an aggressive streak in them, but it is not really limited. While they are conspecific, absence of another of the same species will mean they will be aggressive to whatever else is in the tank. The aggression will vary from species to species, and even among individuals of the same species, but it is present. It has been my experience that the dwarf type gouramis are the least aggressive, and mainly consists of chasing rather than actual attacks on other fish. This behavior is best shown in a well planted tank with one or two pair of the gouramis, and other fish as well. Even the so called timid dwarf gourami _Colisa lalia_ will show this aggressive trait, if given the right conditions (for a good picture of the wild form, look at http://www.salonhogar.com/ciencias/animales/peces/0024.jpg (in case of line break in the URL given use this one: http://tinyurl.com/c2m8g). But, as mentioned above, the aggression is harmless. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of thesydmonster Sent: Friday, July 22, 2005 2:07 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Fish for more acidic water I thought it was not a good idea to put bettas and gouramis together as they are related and may fight/pester one another? --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > You may wish to take a look at what rasboras are available in your area. > Also, any of the dwarf type gouramis may be of interest, in their wild > forms.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13623	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 7/22/2005
Subject: Re: zeolite

Hi Ray, I'm somewhat puzzled as to why you claim that nitrite, nitrate, phosphates and silicates are not aquarium related 'the answer is "NO" '!! you will be hard pushed to find an established aquarium that does not contain all four to some extent . availability of Rowaphos in the USA there are quite a number of US on line suppliers listing it for sale, the Rowaphos manufacturer 'ROWA' has a USA Co. I would add that I'm not sure that Rowaphos is a Zeolite. Could you tell me the name of the freeze-dried bacteria product that you refer to I would like to know more about that. regards, unclenorm. --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@wmconUnclenorm wrote: > Unclenorm, In re-reading the 2nd and 3rd lines of > your original post > (the main topic of discussion here and now), I would > have to say the > answer is "NO", they are not aquarium related. That > is just my > point. While I certainly agree, as you've been so > kind as to point > out, that there are Zeolite products to remove > almost anything, these > products are not used in the aquarium hobby -- at > least not on this > side of the Pond. Okay, just NOW, came back from > going up to sites > referring to Rowaphos. This product is made in > Germany (for removing > phosphate) but is not yet found in the States (at > least my wholesale > suppliers do not handle it yet). We have a > freeze-dried bacteria > product here for removing phosphates. I'm beginning > to see where the > discrepancies are coming from. Regards, Ray > > \ > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. > Hampson." > <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > Ray, > > Read the 2nd and 3rd lines of my post, are > they not aquarium > related ??. If you read all of the link you now know > that there is a > Zeolite product to remove almost anything!, not > being from your side > of the pond I can't quote you trade names, but > remember the aquarium > hobby is a very insignificant outlet for this type > of product, I'm > not toRawfossut how about Rawfoss (may be spelt > wrong) removes > phosphates. > > regards, > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: Uncle Norm, > I'm well aware > of the existence of various other Zeolite > > products, as I'm sure many other members are. I > did visit the web > > site you posted only to find it most interesting. > However, I don't > > see any other Zeolites on that web site that are > used in the > aquarium > > hobby. Surely your most recent reply for me to > visit your posted > > Zeolite web site is not an answer to my question > as these Zeolites > > have nothing to do with the aquarium hobby. I > specifically asked > you > > if you could elaborate on other Zeolite products > found in the > > aquarium hobby. When Lenny was discussing > Zeolites, he was clearly > > doing so as it relates to the aquarium hobby, as > was I. While > there > > of course are other Zeolite products in existence, > for many other > > uses, why would you want to post about products > that have > absolutely > > nothing to do with this hobby? What do those > Zeolites have to do > > with the discussion at hand? As > Zeolite/ammonia-removal in the > > aquarium was the subject, the opening sentence of > your original > post > > seemed to infer there are other Zeolites to be > used in the aquarium > > for other aquarium related purposes. If some > members on this group > > did not know about other completely unrelated > Zeolites (nor go to > > that web site), they may be under the impression > from your post > that > > there are indeed other aquarium related Zeolites > that can be used > for > > other aquarium related purposes. I understand > where you're coming > > from, but I can't remember theFerrierite I used >ParanatroliteFerrierite or > > ParanatroliteParana'sPirana'sloll > Parana's/Pirana's - lol), in anyreplie(s > of > > my aquariums. Your replie(s) to Lenny (and > myself) almost seemed > > contradictory if the reader didn't realize you > were going off- > topic. > > By the way, as for Lenny's description of the > Zeolite form he was > > talking about for ammonia removal in aquariums, I > know of only one > > Zeolite used for this purpose in the aquarium > trade (although > > different brand names). Why should he need to say > which form? > > Incidentally, that Zeolite website really is > fascinating as there > are > > so many of them, even if they have "nothing to do > with nothing" > > here. Regards, Ray > > > \ > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. > Hampson." > > <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > > Hi Ray, > > > Did you visit the web site I posted > the link for ?? , > it > > lists most of the forms of zeolite available, > there are forms for > > removing most things like nitrite, nitrate, > phosphates, silicates > and > > many more. As I said ' Zeolite' is a collective > word for a large > > group of manufactured products, also various > natural crystals ( > > collectors items ). Lenny description was quite > correct for one > > particular form of Zeolite, but he did not say > which form hence > > my 'may or may not be true'. > > > regards, > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > > > > Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: Norman, > The type of > Zeolite > > commonly used in the aquarium trade for > > > the purpose of controlling ammonia, such as > Aquarium > > CarbarmaceuticaZorb"Ammo-Chips", "Ammo-Carb", > "Ammo-Zorb", etc., > acts > > > in exactly this same way. Lenny is right-on, in > being 100% > > accurate > > > in his description of the behavior of Zeolite as > referenced in > this > > > manner in the aquarium industry. The only other > Zeolite product > > for > > > aquarium use that I'm aware of is the > ion-exchange water-softener > > > crystals use for water softening pillows, which > "absorb" calcium > > and > > > magnesium. I note you cite the fact that it > depends on what form > > of > > > Zeolite is being used (and for what purpose), > but say nothing > > > further. Would you care to elaborate as to > other Zeolite-based > > > products found in the aquarium hobby? Many > thanks for any > further > > > input you can share in this regard. > > Ray > > > > > > \ > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. > Hampson." > > > <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > > > Hi Lenny, > > > > Your post may or may not be true, it > depends > > > > on what form of Zeolite is being used and for > what > > > > purpose. The word Zeolite refers to a large > group > > > > minerals with manymineral.galleries.com- > > > > > http:/mineral.galleries.comzeolites.htmilicate/zeolites.htm > > > > regards, > > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Lenny Vasbinder <lnvtm1@g...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Zeolite absorbs ammonia which means it is nitrifying > > > > > food away from your nitrifying bacteria > colony. > > > > > > > > > > At a certain point, the zeolite fills up and > then > > > > > the diminished bacteria colony cannot handle > all of > > > > > the ammonia which can cause a small ammonia > / > > > > > nitrite spike. > > > > > > > > > > Also... DO NOT ADD SALT to your tank if you > are > > > > > using zeolite as salt will cause the zeolite > to > > > > > release the ammonia it has absorbed causing > a more > > > > > severe ammonia spike and mini-cycle. > > > > > > > > > > If you are going to use zeolite, you should > stick to > > > > > a regular schedule of changing the zeolite > so you > > > > > always have fresh product. You can recycle > it if > > > > > you want by soaking it in a salt water > solution. > > > > > This will cause the zeolite to release the > ammonia. > > > > > > > > > > Lenny Vasbinder > > > > > http://lennyvasbindeFaxlogspot.com > > > > > 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 > > > > > LNVTM1@g... > > > > > > > > > > Message: 21 > > > > > Date: Mon, 18 Jul 2005 20:54:25 EDT > > > > > From: Crazy4fids@a... > > > > > Subject: zeolite > > > > > > > > > > Has anyone heard that zeolite is bad for > your > > > > > bacteria colony in your > > > > > aquarium? > > > > > > > > > > Linda > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > > > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > > > Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clearvoicemail > calling worldwide > > > with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > ((((º> > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > when replying, > > thanks. > > > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all > TEXT that is NOT > > important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC > of the original > > message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new > subject (was re: old > > subject)" <- > > > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter, > > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º > > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group > for you! > > > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > > Marine biology Biology > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an > email to: > > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of > > Service. > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > > How much free photo storage do you get? Store > your holiday snaps > > for FREE with Yahoo! Photos. Get Yahoo! Photos > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > when replying, > thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT > important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of > the original > message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject > (was re: old > subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > Marine biology Biology > > > > --------------------------------- > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email > to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of > Service. > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > How much free photo storage do you get? Store your > holiday snaps > for FREE with Yahoo! Photos. Get Yahoo! Photos > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > ___________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13624	From: paul helms	Date: 7/22/2005
Subject: Re: Mouth turning black

sounds like blackspot, which is not real common, somewhere between a bacterial and algae. treat with melafix. if that does nto work do a 20% water change and try pimafix --- Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: > My firemouths mouth is turning black. First his fin > shrivled up, which > I received no feedback on that post, and now he has > black spotting on > his lips. The black is more-so each day. What is > this? Any ideas? > Leslie > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13625	From: paul helms	Date: 7/22/2005
Subject: Re: Warm water

in really big ones.lol --- Robert <coffeex10@...> wrote: > Can Koi's live in tropical tanks? > Robert > > > > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13626	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/22/2005
Subject: Can you identify this "Rock"?

Here is my webshots photo album for the 65G if you want to see the tank, the retrofit for the HOB, now HOS power filter. http://community.webshots.com/album/399539107iQXyjY Also, while you're in my photo album, go to page two and please look at the "large rock" (10" x 5" x 6" abstract shape) that I got when I adopted that overstocked 10G tropical tank last month. The "rock" was just in a box of extras that came with the adoption. I'm not a geology expert and I've Image Googled and the best I can come up with is some type of Granite with quartz veins... or some type of marble and granite mix. If you are familiar with "rocks", please let me know what this is. The original owner says she bought it at a LFS "so it should be safe". I did boil it for an hour to kill any possible pathogens, so unless someone tells me not to use it, I was planning on using it in the 65G tank, which will be up and running this weekend. I will be using all of my existing fully cycled filter material, gravel and decorations when I move my Goldfish and Pleco, from their current 20G tank, into the 65G tank and I will not be adding any more fish so I should not have a nitrogen cycle problem. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13627	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/22/2005
Subject: GlassCages.com - 65 G Acrylic Tank UPDATE - Building the stand, etc.

OK.. now I've got this huge tank (compared to all of my previous ones)... four feet long, 18 inches wide, 17 inches high... estimated weight when full - over 600 pounds (US). I shopped around for a stand and the "cheapest" stands I could find were at BigAlsOnline.com for around $80.00 plus shipping (probably another $25 - $35). The local LFS and LPS were much more. I didn't want a "cheap" stand but the really nice hard wood stands were a couple hundred dollars and I can't afford one of them right now. I decided to build my own stand. By buying 2 x 4's, and having Home Depot cut the not quite 8' boards to my requested lengths, I have the framing materials for the stand for $20.00 and this stand will be MUCH, MUCH stronger and sturdier than any stand you could buy.... even the expensive ones. I do have power tools but no shop right now so I had HD pre-cut the lengths that I would need for my design. I may still have to do some minor sawing and sanding but at least I won't have to deal with as much sawdust in my living room. :-O I'll scan my plans and upload them to the my photo album once I have them finalized (I may still make some revisions as I assemble this thing on Saturday)... along with a few pictures of the construction process. The parts list (9 - 92-5/8"x2"x4"s cut to size, etc.) is: 4 - 48" top and bottom, front and back frame sections. 5 - 15" top and bottom, left and right frame sections and 1 in the middle on the top. 8 - 30" screwed together to form four 3-1/2" x 5" L's for the four "inside legs" that the outside frame sections will be screwed to. 6 - 23" upright supports for the four corners and the middles of each 48" section. 4 - 44" reinforcing angle braces | X | for the back and | / | on both sides. (these 44" sections were left over from the 48" cuts off of the 92-5/8" originals). 1 - 1 lb. box of 2 1/2" long framing screws (you can use drywall screws or deck screws). I'm sure I went a little overboard with the strength of this stand and I could have probably used glue along with the screws and I could have done away with the 8 - 30" "inside L shaped legs" but I didn't want to glue this behemoth together in case I ever move and need to break it down. I also wanted to err on the side of caution and it's only 3 more 2x4's at $2.34 each so it would have only saved me $7.00 and may have compromised the sturdiness of the stand. I have two thoughts about how I will "finish" the exterior of the stand: 1 - "Panel" the entire exterior with some nice real wood paneling, including adding doors to the front and then staining it..., or, 2 - Use 3/4"x6" boards to cover the 23" high area between the top and bottom 2x4 frame sections on the side. I would also make doors out of this material for the front. Then I'll stain the entire stand. This is why I have the 30" high inside "legs" and also the 23" high supports between the top and bottom 48" long sections. If I go with complete exterior "paneling", I can leave the stand as built but if I go with the boards to fill in between the 2x4 top and bottom frame sections, I'll have to remove two of the 23" supports in the middle front and back and add 2 - 30" middle inside leg supports for the 48" long sections. The best price I could find on a 48" hood was at PetsMart.com for a Perfecto product for around $80.00. I also checked out the 48" long "Shop Lights" at HD and If I decide to build a NICE matching "Hood" for my stand, I could just use a Plexiglas cover on the tank and make it much cheaper than the Perfecto Hood. I didn't price the Plexiglas but I don't think a 48" by 18" section would be very much. I may go back to HD after I get the tank up and running tomorrow. I did retrofit my tank a little bit and used my roto-tool to "carve" a 1/4" crescent out of the 1-1/2" wide top black frame on the left end of the tank so my HOB Power Filter will now be an HOS (Hang On Side). I needed the 1/4" crescent carved out so the suction tube would fit down into the tank since the back and front of the tank is reinforced with 1/2" thick acrylic by 1-1/2" wide, along the tops of the 48" long front and back sections. Here is my webshots photo album for the 65G if you want to see the tank, the retrofit for the HOB, now HOS power filter. http://community.webshots.com/album/399539107iQXyjY Also, while you're in my photo album, please look at the "large rock" that I got when I adopted that overstocked 10G tropical tank last month. The "rock" was just in a box of extras that came with the adoption. I'm not a geology expert and I've Image Googled and the best I can come up with is some type of Granite with quartz veins... or some type of marble and granite mix. If you are familiar with "rocks", please let me know what this is. I did boil it for an hour to kill any possible pathogens, so unless someone tells me not to use it, I was planning on using it in the tank, which will be up and running this weekend. I will be using all of my existing fully cycled filter material, gravel and decorations when I move my Goldfish and Pleco, from their current 20G tank, into the 65G tank and I will not be adding any more fish so I should not have a nitrogen cycle problem. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: Date: Tue, 19 Jul 2005 17:56:42 -0500 From: "Lenny Vasbinder" <lnvtm1@...> Subject: GlassCages.com - 65 Gallon Acrylic - A follow-up post about my 65 G Acrylic tank: I Googled and eBayed for over a month before finding their eBay site. I checked them out very thoroughly on the net, with the BBBonline and in three different very active forums, including this one. Then I ordered the tank on Thursday night, July 14, 2005 and paid my $110.00 plus $35.00 shipping (total = $145.00) via PayPal on eBay and I received my package today. The nice people at GlassCages.com told me it would ship on Friday, July 15, 2005 and I should receive it on Wednesday, July 20, 2005, but it came a day early. I couldn't believe it when I saw the FedEx guy carrying the tank up the stairs WITHOUT a dolly... just in a bear hug. I was thinking... this is one strong FedEx guy. I was going out to help him, or actually, I thought I was going to have to carry it in by myself since it came via FedEx Ground. Other big items that I've ordered in the past were shipped via common freight and I had to get the item off the back of the truck or tip the driver to help me bring it inside. This is my first time receiving something from FedEx Ground. Apparently, they are just like UPS. I weighed it after the "Superman" FedEx guy dropped it off inside and it only weighed 40 pounds still in the packaging. Oh well.. there goes the "Superman" title for the FedEx guy. I was worried that it might be an empty box but after snipping the strapping bands and opening the heavy cardboard box, removing the styrofoam panels and all the plastic wrap holding all packaging together, there was the four foot long monster tank... well, monster tank, compared to the ones I have now. It was wrapped in plastic wrap and had the blue tape type stuff on the acrylic to keep it from getting scratched. After removing everything, there stood a beautiful crystal clear 48"L x 18"W x 17"D acrylic tank. So far, I have nothing but good things to say about http://www.GlassCages.com and their eBay site at http://stores.ebay.com/Custom-Aquariums_W0QQssPageNameZviQ3asibQ3astoreviewQQtZkm. I looked over all of the seams and they all seem well sealed. Since it's acrylic, the bottom and back corner seams are glued with some type of thick clear epoxy type glue rather than opaque silicone that you find on glass tanks. The front two corners are rounded so that's two less seams to worry about and it looks much nicer than the siliconed glass corners on my glass tanks. The back two corners do have seams but they seem well sealed with the clear epoxy type glue and there is the black frame material as well, in the back. The only downside (for me) is the top frame and the 1 1/2"W x 1/2" thick acrylic braces that run along the top of the front and back 48" long sections. They make the frame on the back 1 1/2" wide so my HOB filters will not fit over the framing. I was planning on using a canister and an HOB but I guess I'll have to re-think my filtration. It looks like the pre-fabbed black frame has cut-aways for putting an HOB and accessories but with the 1 1/2" wide bracing that GlassCages puts around the top, it defeats these cut-aways in the black frame. Oh well.. I guess it will look better without an HOB hanging on the back anyhow but I may retrofit the HOB to the side where the plastic top frame isn't reinforced with the 1/2" thick acrylic brace since I've been cycling the HOB filter that I bought for this new tank for the past month in my 20G tank. If you need a new tank, either Glass or Acrylic, I highly recommend these guys and gals at http://www.GlassCages.com Here are some quick webcam pictures that I took while unpacking the tank: http://community.webshots.com/album/399539107iQXyjY I'm still amazed at how light it is compared to the 10 & 20 gallon glass tanks that I have which seem to have weighed much more comparably, from what I remember. My Goldfish and Pleco will have a nice big home and I'll have the 20 gallon tank to give more room to some of the recently adopted/saved overstocked 10G tropical tank. I'll post a follow-up about which tropical fish to move into the 20G tank and which ones I should leave in the 10G tank. I still have to fill up the 65G and check it for proper sealing but it looks GREAT so far. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13628	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: 1st Annual Coral Conference and Frag Swap, Rhinelander, WI USA, 8/6

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife 1st Annual Coral Conference and Frag Swap, Rhinelander, WI USA Saturday August 6, 2005 All Day This event repeats every day, until Sunday August 7, 2005. The next reminder for this event will be sent in 10 days, 23 hours, 59 minutes. Event Location: Drs. Foster & Smith's new Aquacultured Coral Facility in Rhinelander, WI US Street: 3329 N RIVER RD City, State, Zip: RHINELANDER, WI 54501, US Map Phone: 1-800-381-7179 Notes: Coral enthusiasts, reef clubs, frag traders, and beginning hobbyists are invited to attend our 1st Annual Coral Conference and Frag Swap at Drs. Foster & Smith's new Aquacultured Coral Facility in Rhinelander, WI on August 6-7, 2005. http://www.drsfostersmith.com/general.cfm?gid=400&ref=3621&subref=AB Helping protect our coral reefs . . . one frag at a time Come enjoy a weekend in Wisconsin's scenic Northwoods with fellow hobbyists sharing stories, trading coral frags, and listening to expert speakers discuss a variety of topics in a relaxed banquet atmosphere. Browse dozens of exhi ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13629	From: Evita	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: Pacu in minneapolis still needs home: will deliver

Emily, That's great! Thank-you for taking the time to let us know. Evita Emily Tenczar <bababanana@...> wrote:Hi, it ended up that Aquatropics took the fish :) Emily __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13630	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Foamy water

My water has developed a foam type around the edges as well as a few spots of randome floating clumps. The foam is all along the edge of the tank as well as the filter, spray wand, etc... All the tests are fine. No ammonia, nitrites or high nitrates. I read a post a while back where someone else had some "foam" but I can't remember which group or what the outcome was. any ideas? Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13631	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: Can you identify this "Rock"?

Lenny, Tough to say from the pictures you have up there. If the whitish areas are crystalline, it is probably quartz, and the veins are contaminants in the quartz. It is unlikely to be granite or marble as the containments. If you take a nail and can dig into the white areas relatively easily, then it may be a soft marble, and you would not see any definitive crystallization as you would with quartz. Here is a pretty good article on rocks in the aquarium I found on the Internet: http://tinyurl.com/9gaz7. You should check it out as it will help you make the decision on whether to use this rock in the aquarium or in your rock garden. \\Steve// Hmmm, interesting that your phone number is Louisiana and your e-fax is Western Massachusetts. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Lenny Vasbinder Sent: Saturday, July 23, 2005 1:18 AM To: AquaticLife Yahoo! Group Subject: [AquaticLife] Can you identify this "Rock"? Here is my webshots photo album for the 65G if you want to see the tank, the retrofit for the HOB, now HOS power filter. http://community.webshots.com/album/399539107iQXyjY Also, while you're in my photo album, go to page two and please look at the "large rock" (10" x 5" x 6" abstract shape) that I got when I adopted that overstocked 10G tropical tank last month. The "rock" was just in a box of extras that came with the adoption. I'm not a geology expert and I've Image Googled and the best I can come up with is some type of Granite with quartz veins... or some type of marble and granite mix. If you are familiar with "rocks", please let me know what this is. The original owner says she bought it at a LFS "so it should be safe". I did boil it for an hour to kill any possible pathogens, so unless someone tells me not to use it, I was planning on using it in the 65G tank, which will be up and running this weekend. I will be using all of my existing fully cycled filter material, gravel and decorations when I move my Goldfish and Pleco, from their current 20G tank, into the 65G tank and I will not be adding any more fish so I should not have a nitrogen cycle problem. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@...

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13632	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: Mouth turning black

Leslie, Noticing up 'till now you are not receiving any replies on this problem either, I'll try to be of what ever help I can offer. First, on the bottom fin (anal fin); Sometimes, as in the photo, its hard to see the exact problem. To me the fin looks normal (the reason I didn't post a reply), but if the fin is actually getting narrower throughout, there's obviously a problem but couldn't tell you what it is. If the fin is tapering on the end and elongating (as it appears to me from the photo), this would be a normal transformation of the fin(s) as HE matures. Males acquire such elongated finnage top & bottom (dorsal and anal fins) as well as elongations on the tail (caudal fin) extremities. \ Now to the main problem at hand -- There are several reasons why your Firemouth is turning black. A very few New World Cichlids, such as Discus, just turn black as a reaction to stress usually due to disease. In that case, the blackening is not a disease itself, but does indicate the fish is not comfortable due to either negative external stimulation or internal parasites. I have never seen this in Firemouths and cannot say for sure that's what it may be. Posting a picture of him again, showing this problem may help. There are two other causes of this that I know of; both of these are very rare diseases. One being caused by Myxobacteriosis, which can be caused by overfeeding and/or poor water conditions, where the fins and scales start turning black. The only medication that I know of for this is Phenocide (made by Aquatronics), but you could try a good gram positive- gram negative bacticide such as Furan II. The other cause from what you say is black spotting on his lips is caused by Diplopstormiasis, a parasitic skin disease appropriately named Black Spot Disease. Again, unfortunately, the only medication that I know of to treat this is Black Spot Control (made by Aquatronics). I say "unfortunately" as Aquatronics has been out of business for the better part of a year. I've seen good results in treating similar parasitic diseases using Jungle Labs' Fungus Eliminator, which does much more than just treat fungus. Salt baths, up to 4 tsp of salt per gallon (using 2 tsp/gal per day over 2 days) help rid fish of parasites as well, but can't say if that will affect Black Spot or not. The On-Line store -- < superfishstore,com > still lists Aquatronics products, although that may be out-dated. In the hopes that they do still carry Black Spot Control (for $3.98) as still listed, you could try calling them at 800- 230-3648, after 10:00AM Central time, or locally (they're in Austin, TX) 512-989-2293. I know this is not much help, but some of these things might be worth a try in the event no one else comes up with something better. Ray \ -- - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > My firemouths mouth is turning black. First his fin shrivled up, which > I received no feedback on that post, and now he has black spotting on > his lips. The black is more-so each day. What is this? Any ideas? > Leslie > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13633	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water

Have you started treating your tank with anything? I believe certain medications, such as melafix and pimafix -- which can be used together, by the way -- cause foam to appear. Sorry to not be of more help. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > My water has developed a foam type around the edges as well as a few > spots of randome floating clumps. The foam is all along the edge of the > tank as well as the filter, spray wand, etc... > All the tests are fine. No ammonia, nitrites or high nitrates. > > I read a post a while back where someone else had some "foam" but I > can't remember which group or what the outcome was. > > any ideas? > > Leslie > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13634	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: Can you identify this "Rock"?

Lenny, Real nice tank! I like the two rounded corners in the front. Nice size tank too. Probably don't need to remind you to be careful when cleaning it (algae on "glass", etc.); you don't want scratches. Lots of luck with it. As for the rock, the veins could be marble (which you don't want); if so it will really harden the water and raise the pH. If you're not sure, either pour some muriatic acid, found in your hardware store plumbing section (be careful with it), or white vinegar on it and see if it bubbles. If so, its marble or limestone. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Lenny Vasbinder" <lnvtm1@g...> wrote: > Here is my webshots photo album for the 65G if you want to see the tank, the retrofit for the HOB, now HOS power filter. http://community.webshots.com/album/399539107iQXyjY > > Also, while you're in my photo album, go to page two and please look at the "large rock" (10" x 5" x 6" abstract shape) that I got when I adopted that overstocked 10G tropical tank last month. The "rock" was just in a box of extras that came with the adoption. I'm not a geology expert and I've Image Googled and the best I can come up with is some type of Granite with quartz veins... or some type of marble and granite mix. If you are familiar with "rocks", please let me know what this is. The original owner says she bought it at a LFS "so it should be safe". I did boil it for an hour to kill any possible pathogens, so unless someone tells me not to use it, I was planning on using it in the 65G tank, which will be up and running this weekend. I will be using all of my existing fully cycled filter material, gravel and decorations when I move my Goldfish and Pleco, from their current 20G tank, into the 65G tank and I will not be adding any more fish so I should not have a nitrogen cycle problem. > > Lenny Vasbinder > http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com > 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 > LNVTM1@g... > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13635	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: GlassCages.com - 65 G Acrylic Tank UPDATE - Building the stand,

Lenny, Nice project -- this should turn out good from the way you're describing it. Would like to see your plans when you get them finalized. I built a couple of multi-tank wood racks many years ago (still using them), before I had all my steel racks welded up. Just a few suggestions: (1) you might consider 2" x 6" 's for the 2 linear upper rails for best support of the middle of the tank, (2) Instead of screws, drill holes through and use nuts and bolts (and washers), (3) (optional): install "X" bracing, back and sides, for added strength using 1" wide flat steel (or aluminum) stock from the hardware store. Also, you didn't mention a Top, that I noticed. Probably not really necessary, but you might want to have a piece of 3/4" (48" x 18", or larger if you want a small front shelf), to help support the actual center and take up any unevenness. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Lenny Vasbinder" <lnvtm1@g...> wrote: > OK.. now I've got this huge tank (compared to all of my previous ones)... four feet long, 18 inches wide, 17 inches high... estimated weight when full - over 600 pounds (US). > > I shopped around for a stand and the "cheapest" stands I could find were at BigAlsOnline.com for around $80.00 plus shipping (probably another $25 - $35). The local LFS and LPS were much more. I didn't want a "cheap" stand but the really nice hard wood stands were a couple hundred dollars and I can't afford one of them right now. > > I decided to build my own stand. > > By buying 2 x 4's, and having Home Depot cut the not quite 8' boards to my requested lengths, I have the framing materials for the stand for $20.00 and this stand will be MUCH, MUCH stronger and sturdier than any stand you could buy.... even the expensive ones. I do have power tools but no shop right now so I had HD pre-cut the lengths that I would need for my design. I may still have to do some minor sawing and sanding but at least I won't have to deal with as much sawdust in my living room. :-O > > I'll scan my plans and upload them to the my photo album once I have them finalized (I may still make some revisions as I assemble this thing on Saturday)... along with a few pictures of the construction process. > > The parts list (9 - 92-5/8"x2"x4"s cut to size, etc.) is: > > 4 - 48" top and bottom, front and back frame sections. > 5 - 15" top and bottom, left and right frame sections and 1 in the middle on the top. > 8 - 30" screwed together to form four 3-1/2" x 5" L's for the four "inside legs" that the outside frame sections will be screwed to. > 6 - 23" upright supports for the four corners and the middles of each 48" section. > 4 - 44" reinforcing angle braces | X | for the back and | / | on both sides. > (these 44" sections were left over from the 48" cuts off of the 92- 5/8" originals). > 1 - 1 lb. box of 2 1/2" long framing screws (you can use drywall screws or deck screws). > > I'm sure I went a little overboard with the strength of this stand and I could have probably used glue along with the screws and I could have done away with the 8 - 30" "inside L shaped legs" but I didn't want to glue this behemoth together in case I ever move and need to break it down. I also wanted to err on the side of caution and it's only 3 more 2x4's at $2.34 each so it would have only saved me $7.00 and may have compromised the sturdiness of the stand. > > I have two thoughts about how I will "finish" the exterior of the stand: > > 1 - "Panel" the entire exterior with some nice real wood paneling, including adding doors to the front and then staining it..., or, > > 2 - Use 3/4"x6" boards to cover the 23" high area between the top and bottom 2x4 frame sections on the side. I would also make doors out of this material for the front. Then I'll stain the entire stand. > > This is why I have the 30" high inside "legs" and also the 23" high supports between the top and bottom 48" long sections. If I go with complete exterior "paneling", I can leave the stand as built but if I go with the boards to fill in between the 2x4 top and bottom frame sections, I'll have to remove two of the 23" supports in the middle front and back and add 2 - 30" middle inside leg supports for the 48" long sections. > > The best price I could find on a 48" hood was at PetsMart.com for a Perfecto product for around $80.00. I also checked out the 48" long "Shop Lights" at HD and If I decide to build a NICE matching "Hood" for my stand, I could just use a Plexiglas cover on the tank and make it much cheaper than the Perfecto Hood. I didn't price the Plexiglas but I don't think a 48" by 18" section would be very much. I may go back to HD after I get the tank up and running tomorrow. > > I did retrofit my tank a little bit and used my roto-tool to "carve" a 1/4" crescent out of the 1-1/2" wide top black frame on the left end of the tank so my HOB Power Filter will now be an HOS (Hang On Side). I needed the 1/4" crescent carved out so the suction tube would fit down into the tank since the back and front of the tank is reinforced with 1/2" thick acrylic by 1-1/2" wide, along the tops of the 48" long front and back sections. > > Here is my webshots photo album for the 65G if you want to see the tank, the retrofit for the HOB, now HOS power filter. http://community.webshots.com/album/399539107iQXyjY > > Also, while you're in my photo album, please look at the "large rock" that I got when I adopted that overstocked 10G tropical tank last month. The "rock" was just in a box of extras that came with the adoption. I'm not a geology expert and I've Image Googled and the best I can come up with is some type of Granite with quartz veins... or some type of marble and granite mix. If you are familiar with "rocks", please let me know what this is. I did boil it for an hour to kill any possible pathogens, so unless someone tells me not to use it, I was planning on using it in the tank, which will be up and running this weekend. I will be using all of my existing fully cycled filter material, gravel and decorations when I move my Goldfish and Pleco, from their current 20G tank, into the 65G tank and I will not be adding any more fish so I should not have a nitrogen cycle problem. > > Lenny Vasbinder > http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com > 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 > LNVTM1@g... > > Message: > Date: Tue, 19 Jul 2005 17:56:42 -0500 > From: "Lenny Vasbinder" <lnvtm1@g...> > Subject: GlassCages.com - 65 Gallon Acrylic - > > A follow-up post about my 65 G Acrylic tank: > > I Googled and eBayed for over a month before finding their eBay site. I checked them out very thoroughly on the net, with the BBBonline and in three different very active forums, including this one. Then I ordered the tank on Thursday night, July 14, 2005 and paid my $110.00 plus $35.00 shipping (total = $145.00) via PayPal on eBay and I received my package today. The nice people at GlassCages.com told me it would ship on Friday, July 15, 2005 and I should receive it on Wednesday, July 20, 2005, but it came a day early. > > I couldn't believe it when I saw the FedEx guy carrying the tank up the stairs WITHOUT a dolly... just in a bear hug. I was thinking... this is one strong FedEx guy. I was going out to help him, or actually, I thought I was going to have to carry it in by myself since it came via FedEx Ground. Other big items that I've ordered in the past were shipped via common freight and I had to get the item off the back of the truck or tip the driver to help me bring it inside. This is my first time receiving something from FedEx Ground. Apparently, they are just like UPS. > > I weighed it after the "Superman" FedEx guy dropped it off inside and it only weighed 40 pounds still in the packaging. Oh well.. there goes the "Superman" title for the FedEx guy. I was worried that it might be an empty box but after snipping the strapping bands and opening the heavy cardboard box, removing the styrofoam panels and all the plastic wrap holding all packaging together, there was the four foot long monster tank... well, monster tank, compared to the ones I have now. It was wrapped in plastic wrap and had the blue tape type stuff on the acrylic to keep it from getting scratched. After removing everything, there stood a beautiful crystal clear 48"L x 18"W x 17"D acrylic tank. > > So far, I have nothing but good things to say about http://www.GlassCages.com and their eBay site at http://stores.ebay.com/Custom- Aquariums_W0QQssPageNameZviQ3asibQ3astoreviewQQtZkm. > > I looked over all of the seams and they all seem well sealed. Since it's acrylic, the bottom and back corner seams are glued with some type of thick clear epoxy type glue rather than opaque silicone that you find on glass tanks. The front two corners are rounded so that's two less seams to worry about and it looks much nicer than the siliconed glass corners on my glass tanks. The back two corners do have seams but they seem well sealed with the clear epoxy type glue and there is the black frame material as well, in the back. > > The only downside (for me) is the top frame and the 1 1/2"W x 1/2" thick acrylic braces that run along the top of the front and back 48" long sections. They make the frame on the back 1 1/2" wide so my HOB filters will not fit over the framing. I was planning on using a canister and an HOB but I guess I'll have to re-think my filtration. It looks like the pre-fabbed black frame has cut-aways for putting an HOB and accessories but with the 1 1/2" wide bracing that GlassCages puts around the top, it defeats these cut-aways in the black frame. Oh well.. I guess it will look better without an HOB hanging on the back anyhow but I may retrofit the HOB to the side where the plastic top frame isn't reinforced with the 1/2" thick acrylic brace since I've been cycling the HOB filter that I bought for this new tank for the past month in my 20G tank. > > If you need a new tank, either Glass or Acrylic, I highly recommend these guys and gals at http://www.GlassCages.com > > Here are some quick webcam pictures that I took while unpacking the tank: > > http://community.webshots.com/album/399539107iQXyjY > > I'm still amazed at how light it is compared to the 10 & 20 gallon glass tanks that I have which seem to have weighed much more comparably, from what I remember. My Goldfish and Pleco will have a nice big home and I'll have the 20 gallon tank to give more room to some of the recently adopted/saved overstocked 10G tropical tank. I'll post a follow-up about which tropical fish to move into the 20G tank and which ones I should leave in the 10G tank. > > I still have to fill up the 65G and check it for proper sealing but it looks GREAT so far. > > Lenny Vasbinder > http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com > 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 > LNVTM1@g... > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13636	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water

No, I haven't treated it. I did do a pwc a few minutes ago. Nitrates were at 60 and nitrites 25. Not bad but not what it usally is either. Ammonia was and is at 0. When I was cleaning the gravel during the water change, I did notice lots of eensy food particles. None had fungus though. It was the fragments from the flakes when they explode as the fish grab them. I am guessing this may have been the reason. Lol I think I may be too picky on my tank. (I'm thinking several here agree.) ;) I just want it to be perfect all the time so I watch it like a hawk. I try to fix something the moment I notice it as from past experience fast reaction time can make all the difference. I will post again if any of this persists. And thanks Ray for the tips and such. =) Leslie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of thesydmonster Sent: Saturday, July 23, 2005 10:41 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Foamy water Have you started treating your tank with anything? I believe certain medications, such as melafix and pimafix -- which can be used together, by the way -- cause foam to appear. Sorry to not be of more help.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13637	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water

Foam is usually an indication of high DOC's (Dissolved Organic Carbons). Best treatment is regular water changes. You probably would want to start with a minimum of a 30% water change, until the foaming stops and then go to a 10-15% water change per week. If you have been doing regular water changes right along, you'll need to investigate to determine what may be causing this problem. What changes have you made in your tank in the last 60 days? Is there more than the usual amount of waste collecting between water changes? Once you have isolated the change (cause) you will need to determine how to negate its effect. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Dane & Leslie Moore Sent: Saturday, July 23, 2005 10:38 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com; uniquaria@yahoogroups.com; naturalaquariumenthusiast@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Foamy water My water has developed a foam type around the edges as well as a few spots of randome floating clumps. The foam is all along the edge of the tank as well as the filter, spray wand, etc... All the tests are fine. No ammonia, nitrites or high nitrates. I read a post a while back where someone else had some "foam" but I can't remember which group or what the outcome was. any ideas? Leslie

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13638	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water

Leslie, Foaming can come from excess phosphates, the source of which may be your tap water. You would have to test for that. It can also be the result of overfeeding, as you seem to indicate in your following post, and noticing your parameters are a bit less than ideal. Ray \ -- - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > My water has developed a foam type around the edges as well as a few > spots of randome floating clumps. The foam is all along the edge of the > tank as well as the filter, spray wand, etc... > All the tests are fine. No ammonia, nitrites or high nitrates. > > I read a post a while back where someone else had some "foam" but I > can't remember which group or what the outcome was. > > any ideas? > > Leslie > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13639	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water

I have only had this tank set up for about a month and half. So there aren't any changes other than switching their tanks, which is huge in itself. I did a 30% change and noticed food, but no waste to speak of. I did notice more junk in some areas than others so I now know to concentrate on those particular spaces, hard to reach of course. Thanks again. =) Leslie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: Saturday, July 23, 2005 11:26 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Foamy water Foam is usually an indication of high DOC's (Dissolved Organic Carbons). Best treatment is regular water changes. You probably would want to start with a minimum of a 30% water change, until the foaming stops and then go to a 10-15% water change per week. If you have been doing regular water changes right along, you'll need to investigate to determine what may be causing this problem. What changes have you made in your tank in the last 60 days? Is there more than the usual amount of waste collecting between water changes? Once you have isolated the change (cause) you will need to determine how to negate its effect.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13640	From: kraftygurl1963	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Set my tanks up

Hi I just got finished setting my tanks up. I have a 20 gl with a whisper for a 60 gl and my 10 gl with a 10 gl whisper. I plan on getting a bigger filter for my 10. I put the treatment solution needed for starting - conditioning the tank. I used tap water. When do you think I will be able to put fish in? I am so happy ; I got all them up.Have a good night everyone Lori

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13641	From: kb1dva	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: dead oscar

sorry to leave and pop in again but I am really upset my oscar had been acting very agressivly for him and last night I went downstairs to do something and he was dead on the livingroom floor there was no trauma i could see- he must have jumped out of the tank.does this happen often and was his agressiveness a sign that he was sick. please help me understand what happened Emily

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13642	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: GlassCages.com - 65 G Acrylic Tank UPDATE - Building the stand,

depending on your lighting needs, check out ahsupply.com for DIY lighting kits. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Lenny Vasbinder Sent: Saturday, July 23, 2005 12:20 AM To: AquaticLife Yahoo! Group Subject: [AquaticLife] GlassCages.com - 65 G Acrylic Tank UPDATE - Building the stand, etc. OK.. now I've got this huge tank (compared to all of my previous ones)... four feet long, 18 inches wide, 17 inches high... estimated weight when full - over 600 pounds (US). I shopped around for a stand and the "cheapest" stands I could find were at BigAlsOnline.com for around $80.00 plus shipping (probably another $25 - $35). The local LFS and LPS were much more. I didn't want a "cheap" stand but the really nice hard wood stands were a couple hundred dollars and I can't afford one of them right now. I decided to build my own stand. By buying 2 x 4's, and having Home Depot cut the not quite 8' boards to my requested lengths, I have the framing materials for the stand for $20.00 and this stand will be MUCH, MUCH stronger and sturdier than any stand you could buy.... even the expensive ones. I do have power tools but no shop right now so I had HD pre-cut the lengths that I would need for my design. I may still have to do some minor sawing and sanding but at least I won't have to deal with as much sawdust in my living room. :-O I'll scan my plans and upload them to the my photo album once I have them finalized (I may still make some revisions as I assemble this thing on Saturday)... along with a few pictures of the construction process. The parts list (9 - 92-5/8"x2"x4"s cut to size, etc.) is: 4 - 48" top and bottom, front and back frame sections. 5 - 15" top and bottom, left and right frame sections and 1 in the middle on the top. 8 - 30" screwed together to form four 3-1/2" x 5" L's for the four "inside legs" that the outside frame sections will be screwed to. 6 - 23" upright supports for the four corners and the middles of each 48" section. 4 - 44" reinforcing angle braces | X | for the back and | / | on both sides. (these 44" sections were left over from the 48" cuts off of the 92-5/8" originals). 1 - 1 lb. box of 2 1/2" long framing screws (you can use drywall screws or deck screws). I'm sure I went a little overboard with the strength of this stand and I could have probably used glue along with the screws and I could have done away with the 8 - 30" "inside L shaped legs" but I didn't want to glue this behemoth together in case I ever move and need to break it down. I also wanted to err on the side of caution and it's only 3 more 2x4's at $2.34 each so it would have only saved me $7.00 and may have compromised the sturdiness of the stand. I have two thoughts about how I will "finish" the exterior of the stand: 1 - "Panel" the entire exterior with some nice real wood paneling, including adding doors to the front and then staining it..., or, 2 - Use 3/4"x6" boards to cover the 23" high area between the top and bottom 2x4 frame sections on the side. I would also make doors out of this material for the front. Then I'll stain the entire stand. This is why I have the 30" high inside "legs" and also the 23" high supports between the top and bottom 48" long sections. If I go with complete exterior "paneling", I can leave the stand as built but if I go with the boards to fill in between the 2x4 top and bottom frame sections, I'll have to remove two of the 23" supports in the middle front and back and add 2 - 30" middle inside leg supports for the 48" long sections. The best price I could find on a 48" hood was at PetsMart.com for a Perfecto product for around $80.00. I also checked out the 48" long "Shop Lights" at HD and If I decide to build a NICE matching "Hood" for my stand, I could just use a Plexiglas cover on the tank and make it much cheaper than the Perfecto Hood. I didn't price the Plexiglas but I don't think a 48" by 18" section would be very much. I may go back to HD after I get the tank up and running tomorrow. I did retrofit my tank a little bit and used my roto-tool to "carve" a 1/4" crescent out of the 1-1/2" wide top black frame on the left end of the tank so my HOB Power Filter will now be an HOS (Hang On Side). I needed the 1/4" crescent carved out so the suction tube would fit down into the tank since the back and front of the tank is reinforced with 1/2" thick acrylic by 1-1/2" wide, along the tops of the 48" long front and back sections. Here is my webshots photo album for the 65G if you want to see the tank, the retrofit for the HOB, now HOS power filter. http://community.webshots.com/album/399539107iQXyjY Also, while you're in my photo album, please look at the "large rock" that I got when I adopted that overstocked 10G tropical tank last month. The "rock" was just in a box of extras that came with the adoption. I'm not a geology expert and I've Image Googled and the best I can come up with is some type of Granite with quartz veins... or some type of marble and granite mix. If you are familiar with "rocks", please let me know what this is. I did boil it for an hour to kill any possible pathogens, so unless someone tells me not to use it, I was planning on using it in the tank, which will be up and running this weekend. I will be using all of my existing fully cycled filter material, gravel and decorations when I move my Goldfish and Pleco, from their current 20G tank, into the 65G tank and I will not be adding any more fish so I should not have a nitrogen cycle problem. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: Date: Tue, 19 Jul 2005 17:56:42 -0500 From: "Lenny Vasbinder" <lnvtm1@...> Subject: GlassCages.com - 65 Gallon Acrylic - A follow-up post about my 65 G Acrylic tank: I Googled and eBayed for over a month before finding their eBay site. I checked them out very thoroughly on the net, with the BBBonline and in three different very active forums, including this one. Then I ordered the tank on Thursday night, July 14, 2005 and paid my $110.00 plus $35.00 shipping (total = $145.00) via PayPal on eBay and I received my package today. The nice people at GlassCages.com told me it would ship on Friday, July 15, 2005 and I should receive it on Wednesday, July 20, 2005, but it came a day early. I couldn't believe it when I saw the FedEx guy carrying the tank up the stairs WITHOUT a dolly... just in a bear hug. I was thinking... this is one strong FedEx guy. I was going out to help him, or actually, I thought I was going to have to carry it in by myself since it came via FedEx Ground. Other big items that I've ordered in the past were shipped via common freight and I had to get the item off the back of the truck or tip the driver to help me bring it inside. This is my first time receiving something from FedEx Ground. Apparently, they are just like UPS. I weighed it after the "Superman" FedEx guy dropped it off inside and it only weighed 40 pounds still in the packaging. Oh well.. there goes the "Superman" title for the FedEx guy. I was worried that it might be an empty box but after snipping the strapping bands and opening the heavy cardboard box, removing the styrofoam panels and all the plastic wrap holding all packaging together, there was the four foot long monster tank... well, monster tank, compared to the ones I have now. It was wrapped in plastic wrap and had the blue tape type stuff on the acrylic to keep it from getting scratched. After removing everything, there stood a beautiful crystal clear 48"L x 18"W x 17"D acrylic tank. So far, I have nothing but good things to say about http://www.GlassCages.com and their eBay site at http://stores.ebay.com/Custom-Aquariums_W0QQssPageNameZviQ3asibQ3astoreviewQ QtZkm. I looked over all of the seams and they all seem well sealed. Since it's acrylic, the bottom and back corner seams are glued with some type of thick clear epoxy type glue rather than opaque silicone that you find on glass tanks. The front two corners are rounded so that's two less seams to worry about and it looks much nicer than the siliconed glass corners on my glass tanks. The back two corners do have seams but they seem well sealed with the clear epoxy type glue and there is the black frame material as well, in the back. The only downside (for me) is the top frame and the 1 1/2"W x 1/2" thick acrylic braces that run along the top of the front and back 48" long sections. They make the frame on the back 1 1/2" wide so my HOB filters will not fit over the framing. I was planning on using a canister and an HOB but I guess I'll have to re-think my filtration. It looks like the pre-fabbed black frame has cut-aways for putting an HOB and accessories but with the 1 1/2" wide bracing that GlassCages puts around the top, it defeats these cut-aways in the black frame. Oh well.. I guess it will look better without an HOB hanging on the back anyhow but I may retrofit the HOB to the side where the plastic top frame isn't reinforced with the 1/2" thick acrylic brace since I've been cycling the HOB filter that I bought for this new tank for the past month in my 20G tank. If you need a new tank, either Glass or Acrylic, I highly recommend these guys and gals at http://www.GlassCages.com Here are some quick webcam pictures that I took while unpacking the tank: http://community.webshots.com/album/399539107iQXyjY I'm still amazed at how light it is compared to the 10 & 20 gallon glass tanks that I have which seem to have weighed much more comparably, from what I remember. My Goldfish and Pleco will have a nice big home and I'll have the 20 gallon tank to give more room to some of the recently adopted/saved overstocked 10G tropical tank. I'll post a follow-up about which tropical fish to move into the 20G tank and which ones I should leave in the 10G tank. I still have to fill up the 65G and check it for proper sealing but it looks GREAT so far. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13643	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: dead oscar

Sorry to hear of your loss, Oscars are great fish and very hardy fish, they just get so darn big............ 12 inches plus Oscars are very moody fish. One reason a lot of people like them, they have personalities. I don't know why your Oscar was getting aggressive. And I have no idea why he committed suicide. Oscars do sometimes jump, but not very often in my opinion. If you have an open top tank maybe there was a fly, or moth flying over the top of the tank and he wanted a snack? No one will really know. . My daughters got 2 Oscars in a 75 gallon tank and they are closing in on the 12 inch mark now going on year two. They are starting to show some aggression towards each other so hopefully its just prespawning aggression and not territorial aggression. Rob NE Indiana In a message dated 7/23/2005 6:10:19 PM US Eastern Standard Time, vze3pd7a@... writes: sorry to leave and pop in again but I am really upset my oscar had been acting very agressivly for him and last night I went downstairs to do something and he was dead on the livingroom floor there was no trauma i could see- he must have jumped out of the tank.does this happen often and was his agressiveness a sign that he was sick. please help me understand what happened Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13644	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: dead oscar

Emily, Really sorry to hear of the loss of you Oscar. I know how upset you must be as we can't help getting attached to them. As some people recommend; maybe you should go out and get another one as soon as you get a chance. While it won't exactly take the place of this one, perhaps you'll feel just a little better with a new one keeping you occupied. I can't say why he was acting aggressive. Maybe he was just getting to that certain size that he was getting territorial, or maybe he was feeling irritating effects of old water as can happen (unless you changed it recently). Hard to say, but I doubt that behavior would indicate illness. Oscars aren't really prone to jumping any more than most other fish, or you would have found him on the floor much sooner than this. Any fish is capable of jumping sooner or later however, especially if given half a chance -- like having no top on the tank and/or having the water level right up to the tippy-top. Unless one has a hang-on filter that requires the water to be with an inch and a half from the top, the water level should be kept down at least 5" if there is no top on the tank. But ideally, its always safest to keep a top of some sort on the tank at all times. Its bad enough that some fish will seem to find the smallest opening in the tank top to jump out of in spite of all our precautions. Unfortunately, Oscars and many other fish can and will jump sooner or later, for one reason or another (doesn't really matter why they do it after its done) and it only takes one time; the end result often being fatal, having no restraint present. More of a puzzle yet, if a top was on -- you wonder how they found the smallest opening to jump through as so often happens. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "kb1dva" <vze3pd7a@v...> wrote: > sorry to leave and pop in again but I am really upset my oscar had > been acting very agressivly for him and last night I went downstairs > to do something and he was dead on the livingroom floor there was no > trauma i could see- he must have jumped out of the tank.does this > happen often and was his agressiveness a sign that he was sick. please > help me understand what happened Emily

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13645	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Silicon Valley Aquarium Society (SVAS) Monthly Meeting, 8/6/2005, 6

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife Silicon Valley Aquarium Society (SVAS) Monthly Meeting Saturday August 6, 2005 6:30 pm - 9:30 pm This event repeats on the first Saturday of every month. The next reminder for this event will be sent in 11 days, 4 minutes. Event Location: Round Table Pizza, 4302 Moorpark Ave., San Jose CA Street: 4302 Moorpark Ave. City, State, Zip: San Jose CA 95129-2030 Notes: Silicon Valley Aquarium Society (SVAS) Monthly Meeting http://www.svas.info/ http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SiliconValleyAquariumSociety/ 6:30 pm - 9:30 pm This event repeats on the first Saturday of every month. Event Location: Round Table Pizza, 4302 Moorpark Ave., San Jose ADVERTISEMENT ZIP code where you park at night. Do you currently have auto insurance? Yes No Have you had a U.S driver's license for more than 3 years? Yes No Has any driver in your household had 2 or more accidents or moving violations in the last 3 years? Yes No Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13646	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: zeolite

Unclenorm, WWHHOOOOAAA!!! Hold on there -- I never said that nitrite, nitrate, phosphates and silicates are not aquarium related. Such a statement is totally absurd and I don't know how you came to that conclusion. I'm finding that I'm the one who is puzzled, to say the least, and I don't understand where you got that from. You ask me to "read the 2nd and 3rd lines of my (your) post, are they not aquarium related??". The 2nd and 3rd lines of your (original) post direct me to the Zeolite Group of Minerals site (<< mineral.galleries.com/minerals/silicate/zeolites.htm >>). My answer is definitely NO. When was the last time you used Analcime, Chabazite, Ferrierite, Gmelinite, Phillipsite, Paranatrolite or Thomsonite (the zeolites found at your suggested link)in any of your aquariums? I know I've never used any of them, nor have I ever before heard of them -- I certainly wouldn't consider them "aquarium related" by any stretch of the imagination. \ Glad to hear RowaPhos has a USA company; hopefully it will become more popular. As I said, none of my wholesale suppliers handle it, nor do any of my retail (lfs) customers. I don't know how much in demand it will be; hopefully it will catch on. I believe the product may be a zeolite -- it consists of granular Ferric Hydroxide. \ The freeze-dried bacteria product I believe is simply called Phosphate Remover and is manufactured by Acquamarine (Yes, with a "c"). Their website is << www.northcoastmarines.com/bact.htm >>. Regards, Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > Hi Ray, > I'm somewhat puzzled as to why you claim that > nitrite, nitrate, phosphates and silicates are not > aquarium related 'the answer is "NO" '!! you will be > hard pushed to find an established aquarium that does > not contain all four to some extent . availability > of Rowaphos in the USA there are quite a number of US > on line suppliers listing it for sale, the Rowaphos > manufacturer 'ROWA' has a USA Co. I would add that I'm > not sure that Rowaphos is a Zeolite. Could you tell me > the name of the freeze-dried bacteria product that you > refer to I would like to know more about that. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@wmconUnclenorm wrote: > > > Unclenorm, In re-reading the 2nd and 3rd lines of > > your original post > > (the main topic of discussion here and now), I would > > have to say the > > answer is "NO", they are not aquarium related. That > > is just my > > point. While I certainly agree, as you've been so > > kind as to point > > out, that there are Zeolite products to remove > > almost anything, these > > products are not used in the aquarium hobby -- at > > least not on this > > side of the Pond. Okay, just NOW, came back from > > going up to sites > > referring to Rowaphos. This product is made in > > Germany (for removing > > phosphate) but is not yet found in the States (at > > least my wholesale > > suppliers do not handle it yet). We have a > > freeze-dried bacteria > > product here for removing phosphates. I'm beginning > > to see where the > > discrepancies are coming from. Regards, Ray > > > > \ > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. > > Hampson." > > <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > > Ray, > > > Read the 2nd and 3rd lines of my post, are > > they not aquarium > > related ??. If you read all of the link you now know > > that there is a > > Zeolite product to remove almost anything!, not > > being from your side > > of the pond I can't quote you trade names, but > > remember the aquarium > > hobby is a very insignificant outlet for this type > > of product, I'm > > not toRawfossut how about Rawfoss (may be spelt > > wrong) removes > > phosphates. > > > regards, > > > unclenorm. >\ > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. > > Hampson." > > > > <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > > > > Hi Lenny, > > > > > Your post may or may not be true, it > > depends > > > > > on what form of Zeolite is being used and for > > what > > > > > purpose. The word Zeolite refers to a large > > group > > > > > minerals with manymineral.galleries.com- > > > > > > > > http:/mineral.galleries.comzeolites.htmilicate/zeolites.htm > > > > > regards, > > > > > unclenorm. > > ___________________________________________________________________ > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > > ((((º> > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13647	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: San Francisco Aquarium Society (SFAS), 8/5/2005, 7:15 pm

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife San Francisco Aquarium Society (SFAS) Friday August 5, 2005 7:15 pm - 9:15 pm This event repeats on the first Friday of every month. The next reminder for this event will be sent in 10 days, 4 minutes. Event Location: first Friday of each month at first Friday of each month at San Francisco State University Notes: http://www.sfaquarium.org/about.html Meetings are free and open to everyone. If you've enjoyed them, we urge you to become a member. You'll become a welcome part of our community, and your dues help defray the costs of speakers and other special things that show up at every meeting. We meet the first Friday of each month at The San Francisco State University. (We used to meet the first Friday of each month at The Academy of Sciences in San Francisco's Golden Gate Park.) Founded in 1923, the San Francisco Aquarium Society is regarded as one of the nation's esteemed aquarium hobbyi ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13648	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Added fish, bad move?

We added an albino shark to our tropical tank, just one, and a small catfish. The shark is getting picked on by our Danios of all things. Should we have bought two of these so they can swim together? He keeps trying to swim with the danios. The catfish is too small for this tank but the fish in the smaller tank tried to eat out his eyes. He's now hunkered down in the corner of the tank while the others harrass him, even the larger cat is picking on him. Any suggestions as to adding another shark or what to do about the catfish? I feel horrible for both of them and I'm sorry I put them through this. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13649	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: aquarium lighting

I was just browsing eBay and found an Jebo 48" QUAD compact fluoresent fixture, with fans, legs and four LED blue moon lights. Four 65 watt bulbs, 2 daylight 12K and 2 ture 03 actinic bulbs (total of 260 watts). This is a 2005 model and starting bid is .99. Would this be a better light system for my 150 gallon (30" tall) planted tank? The seller is Fishman911. I think that these light regularly sell for around $300. If I wanted, I could drive down to New Berlin, WI and pick it up. Of course It would probably cost me more in gas than in shipping. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13650	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: Added fish, bad move?

Add a lot of hiding places. give them someplace to hide. Out of sight out of mind.. Your shark.. probally would be aggressive towards others of its kind. subdue the light, and add more hiding places hopefully this will help. rob Indiana In a message dated 7/23/2005 9:31:56 PM US Eastern Standard Time, amjmail@... writes: The catfish is too small for this tank but the fish in the smaller tank tried to eat out his eyes. He's now hunkered down in the corner of the tank while the others harrass him, even the larger cat is picking on him. Any suggestions as to adding another shark or what to do about the catfish? I feel horrible for both of them and I'm sorry I put them through this. Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13651	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: Mouth turning black

Leslie, Noticing up 'till now you are not receiving any replies on this problem either, I'll try to be of what ever help I can offer. First, on the bottom fin (anal fin); Sometimes, as in the photo, its hard to see the exact problem. To me the fin looks normal (the reason I didn't post a reply), but if the fin is actually getting narrower throughout, there's obviously a problem but couldn't tell you what it is. If the fin is tapering on the end and elongating (as it appears to me from the photo), this would be a normal transformation of the fin(s) as HE matures. Males acquire such elongated finnage top & bottom (dorsal and anal fins) as well as elongations on the tail (caudal fin) extremities. \ Now to the main problem at hand -- There are several reasons why your Firemouth is turning black. A very few New World Cichlids, such as Discus, just turn black as a reaction to stress usually due to disease. In that case, the blackening is not a disease itself, but does indicate the fish is not comfortable due to either negative external stimulation or internal parasites. I have never seen this in Firemouths and cannot say for sure that's what it may be. Posting a picture of him again, showing this problem may help. There are two other causes of this that I know of; both of these are very rare diseases. One being caused by Myxobacteriosis, which can be caused by overfeeding and/or poor water conditions, where the fins and scales start turning black. The only medication that I know of for this is Phenocide (made by Aquatronics), but you could try a good gram positive- gram negative bacticide such as Furan II. The other cause from what you say is black spotting on his lips is caused by Diplopstormiasis, a parasitic skin disease appropriately named Black Spot Disease. Again, unfortunately, the only medication that I know of to treat this is Black Spot Control (made by Aquatronics). I say "unfortunately" as Aquatronics has been out of business for the better part of a year. I've seen good results in treating similar parasitic diseases using Jungle Labs' Fungus Eliminator, which does much more than just treat fungus. Salt baths, up to 4 tsp of salt per gallon (using 2 tsp/gal per day over 2 days) help rid fish of parasites as well, but can't say if that will affect Black Spot or not. The On-Line store -- < superfishstore,com > still lists Aquatronics products, although that may be out-dated. In the hopes that they do still carry Black Spot Control (for $3.98) as still listed, you could try calling them at 800- 230-3648, after 10:00AM Central time, or locally (they're in Austin, TX) 512-989-2293. I know this is not much help, but some of these things might be worth a try in the event no one else comes up with something better. Ray \ -- - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > My firemouths mouth is turning black. First his fin shrivled up, which > I received no feedback on that post, and now he has black spotting on > his lips. The black is more-so each day. What is this? Any ideas? > Leslie > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13652	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: Set my tanks up

Lori, The tanks need to be cycled. There are two schools of thought on cycling tanks. One is to add some inexpensive fish and let them start the cycle, and do not add any more until the cycle is established. The other school of thought is to do a fishless cycle, using ammonia to kick off the cycle. However you do it, the cycle needs to be established. First you will have the ammonia spike, where ammonia levels will rise, then level off and decline as the nitrites rise, level off and decline as the nitrates rise. Bacteria colonies are established to reduce the ammonia to nitrite, then to reduce the nitrites to nitrates. The time to cycle runs about 6 weeks, sometime a bit faster, some times a bit slower. You do need test kits to test for the levels of these substances in your water. At a minimum, you need kits to test for pH, ammonia, nitrites and nitrates. Yes, there are stores that will do this for you, but there is nothing like doing it yourself. The tests are simple, don't take much time, but very important to establish a track record for your tanks. Nitrates, by the way, are removed by two methods. Water changes, and/or keeping live plants. It does sound as though you need to do some reading. You can read the archive here, search for cycle and cycling, as well as ammonia, nitrites and nitrates. Get yourself a good general book, I suggest the Baensch Aquarium Atlas, and read through that. And, of course, ask questions, lots of questions. You'll find there is no one way to do things with aquariums and fish. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of kraftygurl1963 Sent: Saturday, July 23, 2005 6:00 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Set my tanks up Hi I just got finished setting my tanks up. I have a 20 gl with a whisper for a 60 gl and my 10 gl with a 10 gl whisper. I plan on getting a bigger filter for my 10. I put the treatment solution needed for starting - conditioning the tank. I used tap water. When do you think I will be able to put fish in? I am so happy ; I got all them up.Have a good night everyone Lori

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13653	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: dead oscar

Tough t easy why he was acting aggressive. As Ray had suggested, he may have just been reaching that age and size where he thought he needed to establish a territory for himself. I used to have to keep bricks on my lid to keep the oscars from banging on it and opening it. It was more a game for them as none of them jumped out, but an error in judgment could have easily led to that. This may have been what lead to the untimely demise of your oscar. As mentioned, oscars are very personable fish, and they are intelligent as well, which sometimes gets them into trouble. I ended up keeping mine in a room where we spent a great deal of time, so they could watch us, and go through their antics of begging for food and attention. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of kb1dva Sent: Saturday, July 23, 2005 10:12 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] dead oscar sorry to leave and pop in again but I am really upset my oscar had been acting very agressivly for him and last night I went downstairs to do something and he was dead on the livingroom floor there was no trauma i could see- he must have jumped out of the tank.does this happen often and was his agressiveness a sign that he was sick. please help me understand what happened Emily

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13654	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Also added plants, need some info.

In addition to my albino red fin shark and spotted catfish, I added some floating plants to help out with nitrates. (I finally found some at Petco of all places...AND they had GREAT quality fish. I was HIGHLY impressed!) I added 6 sprigs to the 75 gal and 4 to the 15 gal. I have NO idea on live plants and if these numbers are OK. Do you have to add plants gradually or is it OK to float them all at once? Thanks again, Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13655	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: dead oscar

For some reason, the first line of my post did not turn out right (could it be I am still in Neverland after the Peter Pan performance with Cathy Rigby I saw tonight?). It should read: Though it is not easy to determine why he was acting aggressive, as Ray suggested, . . . Sorry about that. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 12:10 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] dead oscar Tough t easy why he was acting aggressive. As Ray had suggested, he may have just been reaching that age and size where he thought he needed to establish a territory for himself. I used to have to keep bricks on my lid to keep the oscars from banging on it and opening it. It was more a game for them as none of them jumped out, but an error in judgment could have easily led to that. This may have been what lead to the untimely demise of your oscar. As mentioned, oscars are very personable fish, and they are intelligent as well, which sometimes gets them into trouble. I ended up keeping mine in a room where we spent a great deal of time, so they could watch us, and go through their antics of begging for food and attention. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of kb1dva Sent: Saturday, July 23, 2005 10:12 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] dead oscar sorry to leave and pop in again but I am really upset my oscar had been acting very agressivly for him and last night I went downstairs to do something and he was dead on the livingroom floor there was no trauma i could see- he must have jumped out of the tank.does this happen often and was his agressiveness a sign that he was sick. please help me understand what happened Emily

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13656	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water

I know Melafix definitely will...it will clear up in a couple of days if this is the cause. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of thesydmonster Sent: Saturday, July 23, 2005 10:41 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Foamy water Have you started treating your tank with anything? I believe certain medications, such as melafix and pimafix -- which can be used together, by the way -- cause foam to appear. Sorry to not be of more help. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > My water has developed a foam type around the edges as well as a few > spots of randome floating clumps. The foam is all along the edge of the > tank as well as the filter, spray wand, etc... > All the tests are fine. No ammonia, nitrites or high nitrates. > > I read a post a while back where someone else had some "foam" but I > can't remember which group or what the outcome was. > > any ideas? > > Leslie > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13657	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium lighting

According to what I have been reading, you want 3-4 watts per gallon (450-600 watts for your 150 gal tank) for planted aquariums. The lighting would be good for a 55-75 gallon planted aquarium. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Saturday, July 23, 2005 9:45 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] aquarium lighting I was just browsing eBay and found an Jebo 48" QUAD compact fluoresent fixture, with fans, legs and four LED blue moon lights. Four 65 watt bulbs, 2 daylight 12K and 2 ture 03 actinic bulbs (total of 260 watts). This is a 2005 model and starting bid is .99. Would this be a better light system for my 150 gallon (30" tall) planted tank? The seller is Fishman911. I think that these light regularly sell for around $300. If I wanted, I could drive down to New Berlin, WI and pick it up. Of course It would probably cost me more in gas than in shipping. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13658	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: Added fish, bad move?

speaking of Danios...the other day about 4 of my Danios were huddles together in a corner...lined up together nose to tail like they were in a sardine can. Any ideas as to what that was all about...it was pretty weird. I was thinking maybe they were all sardines in a past life? hehehe Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of FortWayneFish@... Sent: Saturday, July 23, 2005 10:25 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Added fish, bad move? Add a lot of hiding places. give them someplace to hide. Out of sight out of mind.. Your shark.. probally would be aggressive towards others of its kind. subdue the light, and add more hiding places hopefully this will help. rob Indiana In a message dated 7/23/2005 9:31:56 PM US Eastern Standard Time, amjmail@... writes: The catfish is too small for this tank but the fish in the smaller tank tried to eat out his eyes. He's now hunkered down in the corner of the tank while the others harrass him, even the larger cat is picking on him. Any suggestions as to adding another shark or what to do about the catfish? I feel horrible for both of them and I'm sorry I put them through this. Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13659	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/23/2005
Subject: Re: Also added plants, need some info.

The important thing with plants is that you have enough light. Some plants are low light, while others need intense light to survive. The recommended formula is 3-4 watts per gallon. The key though is to see what your plants tell you. If they are happy and healthy looking, then you have enough light :-D Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Dane & Leslie Moore Sent: Saturday, July 23, 2005 11:11 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com; naturalaquariumenthusiast@yahoogroups.com; uniquaria@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Also added plants, need some info. In addition to my albino red fin shark and spotted catfish, I added some floating plants to help out with nitrates. (I finally found some at Petco of all places...AND they had GREAT quality fish. I was HIGHLY impressed!) I added 6 sprigs to the 75 gal and 4 to the 15 gal. I have NO idea on live plants and if these numbers are OK. Do you have to add plants gradually or is it OK to float them all at once? Thanks again, Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13660	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: 1st Annual Coral Conference and Frag Swap, Rhinelander, WI USA, 8/7

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife 1st Annual Coral Conference and Frag Swap, Rhinelander, WI USA Sunday August 7, 2005 All Day This event repeats every day, until Sunday August 7, 2005. The next reminder for this event will be sent in 10 days. Event Location: Drs. Foster & Smith's new Aquacultured Coral Facility in Rhinelander, WI US Street: 3329 N RIVER RD City, State, Zip: RHINELANDER, WI 54501, US Map Phone: 1-800-381-7179 Notes: Coral enthusiasts, reef clubs, frag traders, and beginning hobbyists are invited to attend our 1st Annual Coral Conference and Frag Swap at Drs. Foster & Smith's new Aquacultured Coral Facility in Rhinelander, WI on August 6-7, 2005. http://www.drsfostersmith.com/general.cfm?gid=400&ref=3621&subref=AB Helping protect our coral reefs . . . one frag at a time Come enjoy a weekend in Wisconsin's scenic Northwoods with fellow hobbyists sharing stories, trading coral frags, and listening to expert speakers discuss a variety of topics in a relaxed banquet atmosphere. Browse dozens of exhi ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13661	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Power outages?

Our house has had two power outages today. One lasted for four hours and another one for four hours. I had probably about three hours between outages before the next one hit. I have no way to keep my tank filled with oxygen with no power. My fish all swam up to the surface trying to get oxygen. What should I do before the next power outage comes? We had a possible F1/F2 twister hit near our home which knocked the power out for four hours and at ten last night the power went out till just recently it got back on. Beth http://fa.f-realm.com/ Fanfiction Axis. http://e.webring.com/hub?ring=siriusblack Sirius Black webring. http://e.webring.com/hub?ring=remuslupin Remus Lupin webring http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sailorsenshiocs/ for all original and series characters of Sailor Moon. http://www.livejournal.com/userinfo.bml?user=tropical_fishes Tropical fish tank livejournal community. ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13662	From: paul helms	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Power outages?

there are battery powered air pumps on the market for about 25 bucks, or you can use a ups for a computer on your pumps --- Beth Brownell <spencer_creek_studios@...> wrote: > Our house has had two power outages today. One > lasted > for four hours and another one for four hours. > > I had probably about three hours between outages > before the next one hit. > > I have no way to keep my tank filled with oxygen > with > no power. My fish all swam up to the surface trying > to > get oxygen. > > What should I do before the next power outage comes? > > We had a possible F1/F2 twister hit near our home > which knocked the power out for four hours and at > ten > last night the power went out till just recently it > got back on. > > Beth > > http://fa.f-realm.com/ Fanfiction Axis. > http://e.webring.com/hub?ring=siriusblack Sirius > Black webring. > http://e.webring.com/hub?ring=remuslupin Remus Lupin > webring > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sailorsenshiocs/ for > all original and series characters of Sailor Moon. > http://www.livejournal.com/userinfo.bml?user=tropical_fishes > Tropical fish tank livejournal community. > > > > ____________________________________________________ > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13663	From: paul helms	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Set my tanks up

5 weeks --- kraftygurl1963 <kraftygurl1963@...> wrote: > Hi > I just got finished setting my tanks > up. I have a 20 > gl with a whisper for a 60 gl and my 10 gl with a 10 > gl whisper. I > plan on getting a bigger filter for my 10. I put the > treatment > solution needed for starting - conditioning the > tank. I used tap > water. When do you think I will be able to put fish > in? I am so > happy ; I got all them up.Have a good night > everyone > > Lori > > > > > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13664	From: paul helms	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water

1. 6 weeks you should just now be adding fish 2. rotting food is excess waste 3. no food should be anywhere except in the food container or the fishes belly, you are way overfeeding 4., there should be no reason to do a 30% water change on a tank that should just be finishing its cycle, it should be perfect water perameters --- Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: > I have only had this tank set up for about a month > and half. So there > aren't any changes other than switching their tanks, > which is huge in > itself. > I did a 30% change and noticed food, but no waste to > speak of. I did > notice more junk in some areas than others so I now > know to concentrate > on those particular spaces, hard to reach of course. > > Thanks again. =) > Leslie > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Steve Szabo > Sent: Saturday, July 23, 2005 11:26 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Foamy water > > > Foam is usually an indication of high DOC's > (Dissolved Organic Carbons). > Best treatment is regular water changes. You > probably would want to > start with a minimum of a 30% water change, until > the foaming stops and > then go to a 10-15% water change per week. If you > have been doing > regular water changes right along, you'll need to > investigate to > determine what may be causing this problem. What > changes have you made > in your tank in the last 60 days? Is there more than > the usual amount of > waste collecting between water changes? Once you > have isolated the > change (cause) you will need to determine how to > negate its effect. > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13665	From: paul helms	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water

the nitrites should be 0, there was obviosuly a lrage amount of ammonia present in the prior week, the most probable cause is the overfeeding that you have discovered yourself. --- Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: > No, I haven't treated it. I did do a pwc a few > minutes ago. Nitrates > were at 60 and nitrites 25. Not bad but not what it > usally is either. > Ammonia was and is at 0. > When I was cleaning the gravel during the water > change, I did notice > lots of eensy food particles. None had fungus > though. It was the > fragments from the flakes when they explode as the > fish grab them. I am > guessing this may have been the reason. > > Lol > > I think I may be too picky on my tank. (I'm > thinking several here > agree.) ;) I just want it to be perfect all the > time so I watch it > like a hawk. I try to fix something the moment I > notice it as from past > experience fast reaction time can make all the > difference. > > I will post again if any of this persists. And > thanks Ray for the tips > and such. =) > > Leslie > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of thesydmonster > Sent: Saturday, July 23, 2005 10:41 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Foamy water > > > Have you started treating your tank with anything? > I believe certain > medications, such as melafix and pimafix -- which > can be used > together, by the way -- cause foam to appear. Sorry > to not be of more > help. > > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13666	From: paul helms	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water

they should not be used together, and can have fatal results when mixed at the same time. alone they are safe...together not so much --- thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@...> wrote: > Have you started treating your tank with anything? > I believe certain > medications, such as melafix and pimafix -- which > can be used > together, by the way -- cause foam to appear. Sorry > to not be of more > help. > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie > Moore" > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > My water has developed a foam type around the > edges as well as a few > > spots of randome floating clumps. The foam is all > along the edge of > the > > tank as well as the filter, spray wand, etc... > > All the tests are fine. No ammonia, nitrites or > high nitrates. > > > > I read a post a while back where someone else had > some "foam" but I > > can't remember which group or what the outcome > was. > > > > any ideas? > > > > Leslie > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13667	From: paul helms	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: dead oscar

if the lid is open they will jump out...could have gone for a bug ie moth etc, or could have been high nitrates resulting in erratic behavior. --- kb1dva <vze3pd7a@...> wrote: > sorry to leave and pop in again but I am really > upset my oscar had > been acting very agressivly for him and last night I > went downstairs > to do something and he was dead on the livingroom > floor there was no > trauma i could see- he must have jumped out of the > tank.does this > happen often and was his agressiveness a sign that > he was sick. please > help me understand what happened Emily > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13668	From: paul helms	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: angelfish queston

i have bred them in an angel and cory tank --- Crazy4fids@... wrote: > Has anyone had success with their angelfish spawning > and rearing angelfish > fry in a community aquarium? > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13669	From: KraftyGurl1963	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Set my tanks up

5 weeks Why 5 wks? Lori __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13670	From: KraftyGurl1963	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Set my tanks up/ Steve

Hi Steve, Thanks for your response, My head was spinning for a min. with the nitrate stuff lol. I did by a phosphate kit. But I didn't test the water yet. What would you reccommend for a hardy fish? I would like non aggressive . I know I have alot of learning . I appreciate your help. Have a great day Lori __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13671	From: KraftyGurl1963	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Question on feeding

Good morning all How often do you all feed your fish? Once a day , every other day? I don't want to over feed tthem. Also what kind of food do you buy? I plan on non aggressive tank. Thanks for all the help Lori __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13672	From: wendie	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: angelfish queston

Yes, many times. Even had one pair hold off a 6 inch oscar defending their nests. Their spawning had caught me by surprise. Wendie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of paul helms Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 4:00 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] angelfish queston i have bred them in an angel and cory tank --- Crazy4fids@... wrote: > Has anyone had success with their angelfish spawning > and rearing angelfish > fry in a community aquarium? > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13673	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Power outages?

Beth, If your fish are having problems during a short outage as you describe, you may wish to rethink the stocking of your tank(s). Four hours is not a long time, and even if the water is not saturated with oxygen to start, there should have been plenty while the power was out. One caveat here would be the water temperature rising, if you are experiencing the heat that much of the US is right now. The higher the temperature, the less oxygen the water can hold before it is saturated. A loss of electricity would mean a loss of air conditioning as well, and a rise in ambient temperature would have affected the water temperature, though that should have risen more slowly than the air temperature. As someone else has already mentioned, battery powered air pumps are available. If your LFS does not carry them, check out a bait store, as they also sell them along with live bait so that angler can keep their minnows and other aquatic bait alive in small containers whilst fishing. Using a small container to fill with tank water and slowly pouring it back in will also help to agitate the water and help with gaseous exchange while the power is out. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Beth Brownell Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 4:10 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Power outages? Our house has had two power outages today. One lasted for four hours and another one for four hours. I had probably about three hours between outages before the next one hit. I have no way to keep my tank filled with oxygen with no power. My fish all swam up to the surface trying to get oxygen. What should I do before the next power outage comes? We had a possible F1/F2 twister hit near our home which knocked the power out for four hours and at ten last night the power went out till just recently it got back on. Beth http://fa.f-realm.com/ Fanfiction Axis. http://e.webring.com/hub?ring=siriusblack Sirius Black webring. http://e.webring.com/hub?ring=remuslupin Remus Lupin webring http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sailorsenshiocs/ for all original and series characters of Sailor Moon. http://www.livejournal.com/userinfo.bml?user=tropical_fishes Tropical fish tank livejournal community.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13674	From: harry perry	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Set my tanks up/To Lori, Steve and Paul

I have a different opinion. All bodies of water need to cycle. The effects of the cycle on the fish is totally overrated. Years ago I started tanks and didn't know anything about the nitrogen cycle. I set the tank up on a saturday and put fish in on sunday. Guess what happened? NOTHING happened. I didn't lose a single fish. Did the fish feel stressed? I don't know I'm not a fish shrink. Steve and Paul are very knowledgeable folks. They have their opinion and I have mine. I did use Stress coat and Stress zyne to lesson the effects of the cycle on the fish. There are a lot of variables in this equation. Filtration, live plants or not, water movement by air stones or your filter,weekly water changes. I don't use air stones. I run whisper filters on all my tanks and find that the surface agitation from these filters is enough. The cycle is real it will happen. The effects of the cycle on fish is another matter. Harry KraftyGurl1963 <kraftygurl1963@...> wrote: 5 weeks Why 5 wks? Lori __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13675	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Set my tanks up/ Steve

Lori, Water chemistry is a difficult subject to get a handle on, especially if you have never taken a chemistry course. It is one of the more important aspects of fish keeping, actually probably the most important, and yet the least understood by the vast majority of people who keep fish, but everyone should have at least a rudimentary understanding of the ammonia cycle to experience some success with their aquariums. Most general hobby books do cover this topic is some form. There is one book that can be called the bible of water chemistry, so far as fish keeping goes, but you need to have some chemistry in your background to make it worthwhile to acquire this book. As I mentioned, I favor a fishless cycle. However, you are probably eager to get some fish in your tank rather than let it sit empty for the 4 to 6 weeks or so the cycle will take to become established. You could use what are known as feeder fish, guppies in particular, which are usually quite inexpensive and somewhat hardy. The problem with feeder fish is that many are not very healthy to start, either from genetics or the way they are normally handled, and you may experience a high loss ratio with these fish. White Cloud Mountain fish may be available. They show their best colors at a low temperature, upper 60's to low 70's, but do have a wide temperature range in which they can live. Again, depending on availability, various rasbora species may do you well. Probably the best choice here would be the harlequin rasbora. I don't have any others coming to mind right now, to much interesting TV news I think <g>. The phosphate kit may come in handy if you are planning on growing live plants, as they do need a certain amount of phosphorus compounds available for good growth. The ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate kits are what you need now. There are sets of kits that you can buy, which reduces the cost per kit that contain these three along with one or two others (or more, depending on the set you buy). I favor the Aqua-Tru kits, but look for kits that use a dry powdered reagent and have a use by date on the reagents so you know when the reagents are nearing the end of their useful life. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of KraftyGurl1963 Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 8:11 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Set my tanks up/ Steve Hi Steve, Thanks for your response, My head was spinning for a min. with the nitrate stuff lol. I did by a phosphate kit. But I didn't test the water yet. What would you reccommend for a hardy fish? I would like non aggressive . I know I have alot of learning . I appreciate your help. Have a great day Lori

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13676	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water

1. I used Bio Spira and added fish the next day. 2. I know that rotting food is excess waste which I why I cleaned it out. 3. The only food that was in there was remnants of exploded flakes. Not so much a result of "way overfeeding" but a little overfed perhaps. 4. It hadn't just finished it's cycle hence the parameteres were not perfect which is why I did a water change. My "set up" in previous post referred to time with fish and after cycling. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of paul helms Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 3:49 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Foamy water 1. 6 weeks you should just now be adding fish 2. rotting food is excess waste 3. no food should be anywhere except in the food container or the fishes belly, you are way overfeeding 4., there should be no reason to do a 30% water change on a tank that should just be finishing its cycle, it should be perfect water perameters --- Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: > I have only had this tank set up for about a month > and half. So there > aren't any changes other than switching their tanks, > which is huge in > itself. > I did a 30% change and noticed food, but no waste to > speak of. I did > notice more junk in some areas than others so I now > know to concentrate > on those particular spaces, hard to reach of course. > > Thanks again. =) > Leslie > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Steve Szabo > Sent: Saturday, July 23, 2005 11:26 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Foamy water > > > Foam is usually an indication of high DOC's > (Dissolved Organic Carbons). > Best treatment is regular water changes. You > probably would want to > start with a minimum of a 30% water change, until > the foaming stops and > then go to a 10-15% water change per week. If you > have been doing > regular water changes right along, you'll need to > investigate to > determine what may be causing this problem. What > changes have you made > in your tank in the last 60 days? Is there more than > the usual amount of > waste collecting between water changes? Once you > have isolated the > change (cause) you will need to determine how to > negate its effect. > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13677	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: GlassCages.com - 65 G Acrylic Tank UPDATE - Building the stand,

Thanks Eric. I'm checking them out now. I finished the "stand" on Saturday... well, except for the final decorative finish that I will add once I decide what kind of finish I want on it. I probably could have built the stand for $10.00 but I went overboard with the bracing and support sections since I wasn't sure how strong the finished stand would be. I did have to leave a few brace sections off since I overdid my original plans. I have some pictures of the "stand" on my webshots photo album at http://community.webshots.com/album/399539107iQXyjY if anyone wants to build their own STRONG DIY stand. Once you have this stand, you can "finish" it to match your furniture. I'll post more pictures as I start the "finishing" process. Here's a picture of the finished "stand" with the "Rock" in the middle. I get the Digest format for AquaticLIfe so I'm not sure if they send out attachments/pictures but I'll try sending a picture of my unidentified "Rock" that I'm still trying to figure out. It's supposed to be safe since the previous owner bought it at a LFS but I would really like to know what it is. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: 7 Date: Sat, 23 Jul 2005 18:13:54 -0500 From: "Eric Roberts" <woad@...> Subject: RE: GlassCages.com - 65 G Acrylic Tank UPDATE - Building the stand, etc. depending on your lighting needs, check out ahsupply.com for DIY lighting kits. Eric [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13678	From: kb1dva	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: dead Oscar

I want to thank everyone for their support. He was a big fish getting close to 12 inches. Last week we did about a 90% water change and moved the tank about 6-8 feet over could that be what flipped him out. Money is non existent right now, so I will have to try to improvise a cover with materials on hand. He had started to go around trying to bite everyone, but this is bug season and he might have seen a moth or this house is filled with spiders. What would be a nice addition to the tank when possible – 1 pacu, 2 Oscars, 1 pike, 3 blood parots all in a 90 gallon- tall. He must have been quite the jumper Emily _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of paul helms Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 4:54 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] dead oscar if the lid is open they will jump out...could have gone for a bug ie moth etc, or could have been high nitrates resulting in erratic behavior. --- kb1dva <vze3pd7a@...> wrote: > sorry to leave and pop in again but I am really > upset my oscar had > been acting very agressivly for him and last night I > went downstairs > to do something and he was dead on the livingroom > floor there was no > trauma i could see- he must have jumped out of the > tank.does this > happen often and was his agressiveness a sign that > he was sick. please > help me understand what happened Emily > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13679	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: GlassCages.com - 65 G Acrylic Tank UPDATE - Building the stand,

Lenny, You mentioned the plastic casings were too thick for your hob filter. Was this just because it's an acryllic tank or would this likely be so on the glass ones as well? I'm thinking of ordering but we'd have to use HOB filter. Great stand. If you're ever in the Little Rock, AR area, I'd love to have you build me one. =) (We're about to have a top built for ours but I'm worried about matching the base stand.) Leslie H -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Lenny Vasbinder Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 8:21 AM To: AquaticLife Yahoo! Group Subject: [AquaticLife] RE: GlassCages.com - 65 G Acrylic Tank UPDATE - Building the stand, etc. Thanks Eric. I'm checking them out now. I finished the "stand" on Saturday... well, except for the final decorative finish that I will add once I decide what kind of finish I want on it. I probably could have built the stand for $10.00 but I went overboard with the bracing and support sections since I wasn't sure how strong the finished stand would be. I did have to leave a few brace sections off since I overdid my original plans. I have some pictures of the "stand" on my webshots photo album at http://community.webshots.com/album/399539107iQXyjY if anyone wants to build their own STRONG DIY stand. Once you have this stand, you can "finish" it to match your furniture. I'll post more pictures as I start the "finishing" process. Here's a picture of the finished "stand" with the "Rock" in the middle. I get the Digest format for AquaticLIfe so I'm not sure if they send out attachments/pictures but I'll try sending a picture of my unidentified "Rock" that I'm still trying to figure out. It's supposed to be safe since the previous owner bought it at a LFS but I would really like to know what it is. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: 7 Date: Sat, 23 Jul 2005 18:13:54 -0500 From: "Eric Roberts" <woad@...> Subject: RE: GlassCages.com - 65 G Acrylic Tank UPDATE - Building the stand, etc. depending on your lighting needs, check out ahsupply.com for DIY lighting kits. Eric [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13680	From: Nan	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Set my tanks up/ Steve

For a community tank, you could go several different ways. I have dojo weather loaches (they prefer at least 2 to be happy, I have found but I have 3 in a 35 gallon), cory cats are good, and I would reccomend at least a pair, but I am told they are happier with at least a group of 5 but I only have 2 and they seem to be fine and dandy and been that way for nearly a year, I have a clown loach in with the dojos, they do well together as well. For a algea eater I would sugget a couple of bristle nose plecos, but not until you start seeing some algea, since they will need to have food already established, and, another one would be Otocinculus Cats, they are similar to the pleco and tend to get along with everyone as well. For colorful community tank, I would suggest a group of 5 or so neon tetras, they school together and though I am told they have a short life expectancy I have had a pair survive my learning experience and have had them for nearly 2 years now, and I am sure if I hadn't made the mistake of putting a catfish in my tank more would have survived. Guppys work well as a first fish, and they are pretty hardy and reproduce quickly but if you don't want to have that happen I would go with another kind of fish, such as Black Skirt Tetras, get a odd numbered group, such as 5 or so, since I have learned by watching in here an odd numbered group seems to keep alot of them from picking on others. I may be wrong but that is what I think I have read. Danios work well in an odd numbered group as well. All of those fish, I have mentioned are non-aggressive. Since, most people lean toward goldfish, and I believe you said it was a 20 gallon tank (I could be mistaken on that as well) I would strongly urge you NOT to go with goldfish. Goldfish grow pretty big and need a much bigger tank than a 20 gallon. I would also strongly urge you to put a few low to high light plants in your tank to help keep your nitrite, nitrate and amonia readings normal. If you do a little looking around on here, I have found some that several sites have said are hard to kill and good beginner plants, and in the plants that is where I am..*LOL* I used to use just plastic, but I have found by useing some live plants in my tanks, seems to keep everyone happier and healthier. Food wise, depends on what you decide on before you can tackle that issue. Hope my opinion has helped some. ~nan~ KraftyGurl1963 <kraftygurl1963@...> wrote: Hi Steve, Thanks for your response, My head was spinning for a min. with the nitrate stuff lol. I did by a phosphate kit. But I didn't test the water yet. What would you reccommend for a hardy fish? I would like non aggressive . I know I have alot of learning . I appreciate your help. Have a great day Lori __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13681	From: Nan	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Set my tanks up/ Steve

Lori, I forgot to add that since you have some time (at least a couple of weeks, if not a little longer) while your tank cycles, you can do some research and see what looks good to you and what direction you want to go! ~nan~ Nan <ntalb00@...> wrote: For a community tank, you could go several different ways. I have dojo weather loaches (they prefer at least 2 to be happy, I have found but I have 3 in a 35 gallon), cory cats are good, and I would reccomend at least a pair, but I am told they are happier with at least a group of 5 but I only have 2 and they seem to be fine and dandy and been that way for nearly a year, I have a clown loach in with the dojos, they do well together as well. For a algea eater I would sugget a couple of bristle nose plecos, but not until you start seeing some algea, since they will need to have food already established, and, another one would be Otocinculus Cats, they are similar to the pleco and tend to get along with everyone as well. For colorful community tank, I would suggest a group of 5 or so neon tetras, they school together and though I am told they have a short life expectancy I have had a pair survive my learning experience and have had them for nearly 2 years now, and I am sure if I hadn't made the mistake of putting a catfish in my tank more would have survived. Guppys work well as a first fish, and they are pretty hardy and reproduce quickly but if you don't want to have that happen I would go with another kind of fish, such as Black Skirt Tetras, get a odd numbered group, such as 5 or so, since I have learned by watching in here an odd numbered group seems to keep alot of them from picking on others. I may be wrong but that is what I think I have read. Danios work well in an odd numbered group as well. All of those fish, I have mentioned are non-aggressive. Since, most people lean toward goldfish, and I believe you said it was a 20 gallon tank (I could be mistaken on that as well) I would strongly urge you NOT to go with goldfish. Goldfish grow pretty big and need a much bigger tank than a 20 gallon. I would also strongly urge you to put a few low to high light plants in your tank to help keep your nitrite, nitrate and amonia readings normal. If you do a little looking around on here, I have found some that several sites have said are hard to kill and good beginner plants, and in the plants that is where I am..*LOL* I used to use just plastic, but I have found by useing some live plants in my tanks, seems to keep everyone happier and healthier. Food wise, depends on what you decide on before you can tackle that issue. Hope my opinion has helped some. ~nan~ KraftyGurl1963 <kraftygurl1963@...> wrote: Hi Steve, Thanks for your response, My head was spinning for a min. with the nitrate stuff lol. I did by a phosphate kit. But I didn't test the water yet. What would you reccommend for a hardy fish? I would like non aggressive . I know I have alot of learning . I appreciate your help. Have a great day Lori __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13682	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: dead Oscar

Emily , You currently have 1 pacu, 2 oscars, 1 Pike , 3 blood parots in a 90-Tall? or are you asking what you shoud put in the 90T. I am not really sure what you are asking. "He had started to go around trying to bite everyone, but this is bug season and he might have seen a moth or this house is filled with spiders. What would be a nice addition to the tank when possible – 1 pacu, 2 Oscars, 1 pike, 3 blood parots all in a 90 gallon- tall."I'd say your tank was pretty well stocked with fish on hand if the above fish are already in the tank. Lids can be fashioned out of almost anything. If you use wood probally the easist thing make sure to flip it over every other day to let it dry, or it will mold within a week. Your 90% waterchange could have resulted in a mini cycle raising ammonia or nitrate levels in your tank. its hard to say. I'd keep the waterlevel about 4-5 inches from the trim on top giving a dead space in case your other fish decide to start jumping. rob Indiana In a message dated 7/24/2005 8:28:08 AM US Eastern Standard Time, vze3pd7a@... writes: I want to thank everyone for their support. He was a big fish getting close to 12 inches. Last week we did about a 90% water change and moved the tank about 6-8 feet over could that be what flipped him out. Money is non existent right now, so I will have to try to improvise a cover with materials on hand. He had started to go around trying to bite everyone, but this is bug season and he might have seen a moth or this house is filled with spiders. What would be a nice addition to the tank when possible – 1 pacu, 2 Oscars, 1 pike, 3 blood parots all in a 90 gallon- tall. He must have been quite the jumper Emily Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13683	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: 65 G Acrylic Tank UPDATE

The first time I bought a tank biggr then a 55 gallons I was dissapointed that my AquaClear 300's wouldn't fit on it because of the Plastic Casing around the top. I bought a few AC 300's a few years ago on sale for $16.50 and I was hoping to use 2 of them on the 75 but they don't fit. The AC 500's fit no problem but the 300 didn't. I think the filters rated for that size of tank mostly fit the casing. But the lower rated filters don't. maybe its a consipracy between the tank manufacturers and the Filter makers. ? rob Indiana In a message dated 7/24/2005 8:29:18 AM US Eastern Standard Time, amjmail@... writes: Lenny, You mentioned the plastic casings were too thick for your hob filter. Was this just because it's an acryllic tank or would this likely be so on the glass ones as well? I'm thinking of ordering but we'd have to use HOB filter. Great stand. If you're ever in the Little Rock, AR area, I'd love to have you build me one. =) (We're about to have a top built for ours but I'm worried about matching the base stand.) Leslie Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13684	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Power outages?

I made sure that the temp was not too hot for the fish by tossing in some ice for them to play with and to keep the water from getting any hotter with no ac going. I have seen those battery powered pumps and I'll have a look at them. I have to mail order them since my LFS closed down a month ago. :( Beth --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > Beth, > > If your fish are having problems during a short outage as you describe, you may wish to rethink the stocking of your tank(s). Four hours is not a long time, and even if the water is not saturated with oxygen to start, there should have been plenty while the power was out. One caveat here would be the water temperature rising, if you are experiencing the heat that much of the US is right now. The higher the temperature, the less oxygen the water can hold before it is saturated. A loss of electricity would mean a loss of air conditioning as well, and a rise in ambient temperature would have affected the water temperature, though that should have risen more slowly than the air temperature. > As someone else has already mentioned, battery powered air pumps are available. If your LFS does not carry them, check out a bait store, as they also sell them along with live bait so that angler can keep their minnows and other aquatic bait alive in small containers whilst fishing. > > Using a small container to fill with tank water and slowly pouring it back in will also help to agitate the water and help with gaseous exchange while the power is out. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Beth Brownell > Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 4:10 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Power outages? > > Our house has had two power outages today. One lasted > for four hours and another one for four hours. > > I had probably about three hours between outages > before the next one hit. > > I have no way to keep my tank filled with oxygen with > no power. My fish all swam up to the surface trying to > get oxygen. > > What should I do before the next power outage comes? > > We had a possible F1/F2 twister hit near our home > which knocked the power out for four hours and at ten > last night the power went out till just recently it > got back on. > > Beth

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13685	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: dead oscar

In a message dated 7/23/2005 11:09:55 P.M. Central Standard Time, steve@... writes: As mentioned, oscars are very personable fish, and they are intelligent as well, which sometimes gets them into trouble. I ended up keeping mine in a room where we spent a great deal of time, so they could watch us, and go through their antics of begging for food and attention. I never had an oscar, but I did have a chocolate cichlid. They don't get quite a big, but have very similar personalities. He was kept in a 125 gallon tank with a very large angelfish. Funny thing, I can't remember the other fish I had at the time. These two are the only ones I recall. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13686	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Also added plants, need some info.

Leslie, In addition to the floating plants, you should add some with roots that get planted into the substrate. While you do say that you've added these floating plants, you do not say what kind they are; I assume you may not know (it could be helpful if you could find out for us). In addition to any fish books you may have (I hope you have some/one?), you ought to either get an all-around aquarium book which among other things deals with "aquascaping", aquarium plants and their usages. More advanced aquatic plant books such as those authored by Takashi Amano may give you some additional ideas. In the meanwhile you might want to check out these couple of planted aquarium sites: << www.mops.ca/gallery/shirley/index.asp >> and << www.mops.ca/gallery/SteveP/index.asp >> for starters to get some ideas of how well planted tanks look, and possibly give you some ideas. No, while your plants will grow, your 6 "sprigs" for the 75 and 4 "sprigs" for the 15 are far from being enough, although its a start. Most plants do not grow all that fast that those starter "sprigs" will fill out your tank any time in the near future. Use a good balance of plants and don't put in too many floaters as they may start to block out the needed light from the planted ones underneath. If you have any questions about what plants to use feel free to ask -- that's why we're here. One thing I would like to point out is that before you add the plants to the aquarium, its best to disinfect them so as not to introduce anything unwanted. I know of two methods: (1) a 10 to 15 minute bath in a potassium permanganate solution. This comes in a plastic bottle by Aquarium Pharmaceuticals. Its a dye and while not harmful to you, it can stain your hands (like methylene blue or malachite green) purple if you're not careful. You just need a dark pink solution. (2) a 2 minute bath, use bleach -- 1 1/2 teaspoons to the quart. Do not soak the roots for that length of time, but do give them a rinse in the solution towards the end of the bath. After disinfecting with either of these two methods, rinse the plants well. Ray \ -- - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > In addition to my albino red fin shark and spotted catfish, I added some > floating plants to help out with nitrates. (I finally found some at > Petco of all places...AND they had GREAT quality fish. I was HIGHLY > impressed!) > I added 6 sprigs to the 75 gal and 4 to the 15 gal. I have NO idea on > live plants and if these numbers are OK. > Do you have to add plants gradually or is it OK to float them all at > once? > > Thanks again, > Leslie > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13687	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Power outages?

Beth, Do you have a bait store, walmart, kmart or a Sporting goods store something along those lines in town? I know my Walmarts carry battery operated airpumps for "Bait Keeper buckets" so does Kmart. If you do buy a battery operated airpump get some rechargable batteries, this way when the lights go out you have power, and when the lights come on you can recharge if needed. I have an inverter for the car turns 12volt into 120.. Last year when we had a f3 tear through the power grid out here, i was able to run an extension cord from the driveway into the house and run, 6 tanks off one airpump. No airstones just airline, weighed down or stuck in decoration,so there is no back pressure. I have been thinking of writing an article for my LAS ( Local Aquarium Society) just have not really found a subject or time lately. Maybe I'll do a little research and write about Power Outtage. I did post a Long reply last summer in one of the forums on the subject. (scratching head- which forum was it though ) rob Indiana In a message dated 7/24/2005 9:51:44 AM US Eastern Standard Time, spencer_creek_studios@... writes: I made sure that the temp was not too hot for the fish by tossing in some ice for them to play with and to keep the water from getting any hotter with no ac going. I have seen those battery powered pumps and I'll have a look at them. I have to mail order them since my LFS closed down a month ago. :( Beth Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13688	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Added fish, bad move?

Offhand, it sounds like some defense strategy. Perhaps they had been stressed as in being spooked or maybe chased or threatened. I don't know what other fish you have in there, so I really can't say for sure and it may have just been a one time occurrance in response to what had been going on at the moment (or immediately preceding moments). Only you MAY have been aware of what had been going on at or just before that particular moment -- try thinking back. We certainly would have no idea of what possible interaction was going on, if that was the cause, which is still one of the distinct possibilities of this behavior. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > speaking of Danios...the other day about 4 of my Danios were huddles > together in a corner...lined up together nose to tail like they were in a > sardine can. Any ideas as to what that was all about...it was pretty weird. > I was thinking maybe they were all sardines in a past life? hehehe > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of FortWayneFish@a... > Sent: Saturday, July 23, 2005 10:25 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Added fish, bad move? > > > Add a lot of hiding places. give them someplace to hide. Out of sight out > of mind.. > Your shark.. probally would be aggressive towards others of its kind. > subdue the light, and add more hiding places hopefully this will help. > > rob > Indiana > > > In a message dated 7/23/2005 9:31:56 PM US Eastern Standard Time, > amjmail@c... writes: > > The catfish is too small for this tank but the fish in the smaller tank > tried to eat out his eyes. He's now hunkered down in the corner of the > tank while the others harrass him, even the larger cat is picking on > him. > > Any suggestions as to adding another shark or what to do about the > catfish? I feel horrible for both of them and I'm sorry I put them > through this. > > Rob > NE Indiana > USA > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..>< ((((:> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<: ((((><74/`7.88. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..>< ((((:> > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13689	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: dead Oscar

Emily, Your latest post (below) at least sheds some light on his sudden "aggressive" behavior. With the 90% water change (in itself, not at all harmful, of course), the stimulation of such a quantity of fresh water was cause for such behavior of territoriality and initial mate-seeking response in preparation of spawning (even though a mate was not yet present). Such large water changes can and will trigger these responses as that's exactly what happens in the wild, during their main breeding season. Nothing wrong with large water changes if you know what to expect -- I frequently do such changes myself. This does not fully explain his jumping, although coupled with his aggressiveness, he may have been chasing another tank mate and just got too rambunctious. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "kb1dva" <vze3pd7a@v...> wrote: > I want to thank everyone for their support. He was a big fish getting close > to 12 inches. Last week we did about a 90% water change and moved the tank > about 6-8 feet over could that be what flipped him out. Money is non > existent right now, so I will have to try to improvise a cover with > materials on hand. He had started to go around trying to bite everyone, but > this is bug season and he might have seen a moth or this house is filled > with spiders. What would be a nice addition to the tank when possible – 1 > pacu, 2 Oscars, 1 pike, 3 blood parots all in a 90 gallon- tall. He must > have been quite the jumper Emily > > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of paul helms > Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 4:54 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] dead oscar > > > > if the lid is open they will jump out...could have > gone for a bug ie moth etc, or could have been high > nitrates resulting in erratic behavior. > > --- kb1dva <vze3pd7a@v...> wrote: > > > sorry to leave and pop in again but I am really > > upset my oscar had > > been acting very agressivly for him and last night I > > went downstairs > > to do something and he was dead on the livingroom > > floor there was no > > trauma i could see- he must have jumped out of the > > tank.does this > > happen often and was his agressiveness a sign that > > he was sick. please > > help me understand what happened Emily > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > _____ > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13690	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Power outages?

Beth, Next time put the ice in a zip-lock bag and float it, swishing the water around by hand if need be, to circulate the water for and even temperature. Otherwise, depending on how much is used, just tossing in ice in that manner is an invitation for an Ich outbreak. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Beth Brownell" <spencer_creek_studios@y...> wrote: > I made sure that the temp was not too hot for the fish by tossing in > some ice for them to play with and to keep the water from getting any > hotter with no ac going. > I have seen those battery powered pumps and I'll have a look at them. > I have to mail order them since my LFS closed down a month ago. :( > > Beth > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > > Beth, > > > > If your fish are having problems during a short outage as you > describe, you may wish to rethink the stocking of your tank(s). > Four hours is not a long time, and even if the water is not > saturated with oxygen to start, there should have been plenty > while the power was out. One caveat here would be the water > temperature rising, if you are experiencing the heat that much of > the US is right now. The higher the temperature, the less oxygen > the water can hold before it is saturated. A loss of electricity > would mean a loss of air conditioning as well, and a rise in ambient > temperature would have affected the water temperature, though that > should have risen more slowly than the air temperature. > > > As someone else has already mentioned, battery powered air pumps > are available. If your LFS does not carry them, check out a bait > store, as they also sell them along with live bait so that angler > can keep their minnows and other aquatic bait alive in small > containers whilst fishing. > > > > Using a small container to fill with tank water and slowly pouring > it back in will also help to agitate the water and help with gaseous > exchange while the power is out. > > > > \\Steve// > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Beth Brownell > > Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 4:10 AM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Power outages? > > > > Our house has had two power outages today. One lasted > > for four hours and another one for four hours. > > > > I had probably about three hours between outages > > before the next one hit. > > > > I have no way to keep my tank filled with oxygen with > > no power. My fish all swam up to the surface trying to > > get oxygen. > > > > What should I do before the next power outage comes? > > > > We had a possible F1/F2 twister hit near our home > > which knocked the power out for four hours and at ten > > last night the power went out till just recently it > > got back on. > > > > Beth

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13691	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: aquarium lighting

Can I put larger bulbs in this kind of light set up? I know little about light bulbs other than incandescent bulbs. I am going out to do research today. Any other input from others would be greatly appreciated. Linda >>>>>>I was just browsing eBay and found an Jebo 48" QUAD compact fluoresent fixture, with fans, legs and four LED blue moon lights. Four 65 watt bulbs, 2 daylight 12K and 2 ture 03 actinic bulbs (total of 260 watts). This is a 2005 model and starting bid is .99. Would this be a better light system for my 150 gallon (30" tall) planted tank? The seller is Fishman911. I think that these light regularly sell for around $300. If I wanted, I could drive down to New Berlin, WI and pick it up. Of course It would probably cost me more in gas than in shipping.Linda<<<<<< >>>>>>>According to what I have been reading, you want 3-4 watts per gallon (450-600 watts for your 150 gal tank) for planted aquariums. The lighting would be good for a 55-75 gallon planted aquarium. Eric<<<<<<< [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13692	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Also added plants, need some info.

Ray, You mentioned me buying a book...I think you should write one. Write one and I'll buy it. =) I just want first dibs rights. ;) I'll get into planted plants later. I rushed into this whole experience, not by choice, so I think I'll go baby steps from here on out. As long as these fish will let me anyway. =) And, hope you're sitting down, I don't have any books! I am going to do the Ebay thing and buy some lots of magazines though. (You know I have all this spare time and stuff. haha) Seriously, I am going to buy the magazines. =) Thanks for putting up with me here. ;) Leslie

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13693	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water

Hmmm.. it says on their web page and the packaging that melafix and pimafix CAN be used together, that they are complementary. What happens when you put them together that is fatal and why would the manufacturer recommend it, then? --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms <wtfmorlok@y...> wrote: > they should not be used together, and can have fatal > results when mixed at the same time. alone they are > safe...together not so much > > --- thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > > Have you started treating your tank with anything? > > I believe certain > > medications, such as melafix and pimafix -- which > > can be used > > together, by the way -- cause foam to appear. Sorry > > to not be of more > > help. > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie > > Moore" > > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > > My water has developed a foam type around the > > edges as well as a few > > > spots of randome floating clumps. The foam is all > > along the edge of > > the > > > tank as well as the filter, spray wand, etc... > > > All the tests are fine. No ammonia, nitrites or > > high nitrates. > > > > > > I read a post a while back where someone else had > > some "foam" but I > > > can't remember which group or what the outcome > > was. > > > > > > any ideas? > > > > > > Leslie > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13694	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: angelfish queston

Mine surprised me the first time. I am planning on setting up a separate tank for them when I can afford it so I can breed them to help support my aquatic habit *grin* A separate question... I just noticed last night on my 20 gallon tank that there are white spots on the glass. They are too small to really describe the shape. I can tell that they are not actually attached. I have some 9 Danios, a queen loach, 2 octi cats, and ghost shrimp in the tank (and a bunch of ramshorn snails that the loach is feasting on). Is this just algae? It almost looks like there is a film that they are suspended in on the glass. It's think enough to make the water look cloudy, though it is crystal clear when you look through the top...I am assuming that these white things are not spread through the water... Any ideas anyone? Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of wendie Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 7:28 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] angelfish queston Yes, many times. Even had one pair hold off a 6 inch oscar defending their nests. Their spawning had caught me by surprise. Wendie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of paul helms Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 4:00 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] angelfish queston i have bred them in an angel and cory tank --- Crazy4fids@... wrote: > Has anyone had success with their angelfish spawning > and rearing angelfish > fry in a community aquarium? > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13695	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Set my tanks up

you can also speed up the process by getting some biozyme or biospira. I would drop in some fish food...or if you have other fish...some fish waste to get the cycle going. If you are putting any pretty hardy fish...you can put a couple of them in to get the cycle rolling. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of paul helms Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 3:47 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Set my tanks up 5 weeks --- kraftygurl1963 <kraftygurl1963@...> wrote: > Hi > I just got finished setting my tanks > up. I have a 20 > gl with a whisper for a 60 gl and my 10 gl with a 10 > gl whisper. I > plan on getting a bigger filter for my 10. I put the > treatment > solution needed for starting - conditioning the > tank. I used tap > water. When do you think I will be able to put fish > in? I am so > happy ; I got all them up.Have a good night > everyone > > Lori > > > > > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13696	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Also added plants, need some info.

Leslie, Thank you for the kind words, in the manner you meant that I should write a book -- who knows, maybe someday. I used to write articles quite often (at least monthly) for my local aquarium society magazine, of which I was the author, which got distributed to all the major clubs around the country. Also wrote a few things back when, for the ACA's Buntbarsche Bulletin, being a charter member of that group and on their first BOT. I do enjoy writing about fish as you probably realize and should do more but just don't seem to have the time lately. Maybe that's why I try to contribute here. \ Was wondering if you had any books at all -- really, they can be quite helpful. I am glad to see that you intend to at least get some literature, although while magazines can be a good supplement to the knowledge you've already gained from more basic books, they're limited to the subject matter written in those particular articles only. You really should buy a good book (on eBay), they needn't be expensive and I know you won't regret it if you have any inclination of keeping fish as a hobby right now. If you do so decide, I can't recommend enough your getting a used copy of "Exotic Aquarium Fishes" written by Dr. William T. Innes. At this moment (just checked for you, in case), there are no less than 9 copies up on eBay, starting at 99 cents up to $14 for an original autographed copy (in mediochre shape, or I would be bidding on that one myself, even though I have a few). The first one is closing in about 2 hours or less. While this book may be "old" in years, it is the one book (used to be called the aquarium bible) that has all the basics that's needed to know and will never go out of date because of this, even if it doesn't include many of the newer imports. By the way, it has many black & white and color photos of many of todays community fish. Oh Yeah, has a nice number of pages on Oscars. Please consider it. As to your last sentence, its a pleasure helping people such as yourself with fish, if it leads to their success with them. Sometimes the less experienced members don't ask enough questions and go ahead and do something on their own which may lead to disaster. Well, now I really have to go and do some water changes. Talk to you later. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > Ray, > You mentioned me buying a book...I think you should write one. Write > one and I'll buy it. =) I just want first dibs rights. ;) > I'll get into planted plants later. I rushed into this whole > experience, not by choice, so I think I'll go baby steps from here on > out. As long as these fish will let me anyway. =) > And, hope you're sitting down, I don't have any books! I am going to do > the Ebay thing and buy some lots of magazines though. (You know I have > all this spare time and stuff. haha) Seriously, I am going to buy the > magazines. =) Thanks for putting up with me here. ;) > Leslie

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13697	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: GlassCages.com - 65 G Acrylic Tank UPDATE - Building the stand,

heheh...me too...I went and bought all of the material and it cost me about 60...saving 50 on the hood I am designing it after (this is without lights...which the hood I am designing after also did not come with lights). I will putting it together today if I get a chance. Until I can afford the lighting, I will still be using the hood lights that I currently have. I have a stand for a much larger tank that I got from a friend, so I won't be concerning myself with a stand for now, but I do eventually want to put one together eventually that fits the tank better. That stand looks good. Put some panels on the side and doors on the front...as well as some shelving inside and that will be pretty sharp. Once I get my hood assembled, I will post some pics. I still have some future moods that I will be making once I can afford to do so. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Lenny Vasbinder Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 8:21 AM To: AquaticLife Yahoo! Group Subject: [AquaticLife] RE: GlassCages.com - 65 G Acrylic Tank UPDATE - Building the stand, etc. Thanks Eric. I'm checking them out now. I finished the "stand" on Saturday... well, except for the final decorative finish that I will add once I decide what kind of finish I want on it. I probably could have built the stand for $10.00 but I went overboard with the bracing and support sections since I wasn't sure how strong the finished stand would be. I did have to leave a few brace sections off since I overdid my original plans. I have some pictures of the "stand" on my webshots photo album at http://community.webshots.com/album/399539107iQXyjY if anyone wants to build their own STRONG DIY stand. Once you have this stand, you can "finish" it to match your furniture. I'll post more pictures as I start the "finishing" process. Here's a picture of the finished "stand" with the "Rock" in the middle. I get the Digest format for AquaticLIfe so I'm not sure if they send out attachments/pictures but I'll try sending a picture of my unidentified "Rock" that I'm still trying to figure out. It's supposed to be safe since the previous owner bought it at a LFS but I would really like to know what it is. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: 7 Date: Sat, 23 Jul 2005 18:13:54 -0500 From: "Eric Roberts" <woad@...> Subject: RE: GlassCages.com - 65 G Acrylic Tank UPDATE - Building the stand, etc. depending on your lighting needs, check out ahsupply.com for DIY lighting kits. Eric [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13698	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Set my tanks up/ Steve

a note on the plecos...as long as you provide algae wafers or veggies such as cucumbers, broccoli, or spinach, they will be fine without algae. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nan Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 8:29 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Set my tanks up/ Steve For a community tank, you could go several different ways. I have dojo weather loaches (they prefer at least 2 to be happy, I have found but I have 3 in a 35 gallon), cory cats are good, and I would reccomend at least a pair, but I am told they are happier with at least a group of 5 but I only have 2 and they seem to be fine and dandy and been that way for nearly a year, I have a clown loach in with the dojos, they do well together as well. For a algea eater I would sugget a couple of bristle nose plecos, but not until you start seeing some algea, since they will need to have food already established, and, another one would be Otocinculus Cats, they are similar to the pleco and tend to get along with everyone as well. For colorful community tank, I would suggest a group of 5 or so neon tetras, they school together and though I am told they have a short life expectancy I have had a pair survive my learning experience and have had them for nearly 2 years now, and I am sure if I hadn't made the mistake of putting a catfish in my tank more would have survived. Guppys work well as a first fish, and they are pretty hardy and reproduce quickly but if you don't want to have that happen I would go with another kind of fish, such as Black Skirt Tetras, get a odd numbered group, such as 5 or so, since I have learned by watching in here an odd numbered group seems to keep alot of them from picking on others. I may be wrong but that is what I think I have read. Danios work well in an odd numbered group as well. All of those fish, I have mentioned are non-aggressive. Since, most people lean toward goldfish, and I believe you said it was a 20 gallon tank (I could be mistaken on that as well) I would strongly urge you NOT to go with goldfish. Goldfish grow pretty big and need a much bigger tank than a 20 gallon. I would also strongly urge you to put a few low to high light plants in your tank to help keep your nitrite, nitrate and amonia readings normal. If you do a little looking around on here, I have found some that several sites have said are hard to kill and good beginner plants, and in the plants that is where I am..*LOL* I used to use just plastic, but I have found by useing some live plants in my tanks, seems to keep everyone happier and healthier. Food wise, depends on what you decide on before you can tackle that issue. Hope my opinion has helped some. ~nan~ KraftyGurl1963 <kraftygurl1963@...> wrote: Hi Steve, Thanks for your response, My head was spinning for a min. with the nitrate stuff lol. I did by a phosphate kit. But I didn't test the water yet. What would you reccommend for a hardy fish? I would like non aggressive . I know I have alot of learning . I appreciate your help. Have a great day Lori __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13699	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: 65 G Acrylic Tank UPDATE

the rat bastards hehehehhe I was looking at the site that he purchased it from and it looks like he makes a lip around the top of the tank that looked to be an inch or 2 wide. That would be a good reason HOB filters don;t fit. Something that could be dome to remedy this is to make a gutter filer with hydroponic media and plants in it and put your hob filters on this. You may have to modify the intake with some flexible hosing ( I saw the perfect hosing at Lowe's last night...I don;t remember the length, but it was a good about for only $5. Then just fit the opposite end of the gutter with some hosing for outflow back into the tank. This is a bonus because you have a nice decorative planter and the plants will soak up ammonia, nitrites and nitrates. The hydroponic media and roots will also serve as a biological filter. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of FortWayneFish@... Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 9:50 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] 65 G Acrylic Tank UPDATE The first time I bought a tank biggr then a 55 gallons I was dissapointed that my AquaClear 300's wouldn't fit on it because of the Plastic Casing around the top. I bought a few AC 300's a few years ago on sale for $16.50 and I was hoping to use 2 of them on the 75 but they don't fit. The AC 500's fit no problem but the 300 didn't. I think the filters rated for that size of tank mostly fit the casing. But the lower rated filters don't. maybe its a consipracy between the tank manufacturers and the Filter makers. ? rob Indiana In a message dated 7/24/2005 8:29:18 AM US Eastern Standard Time, amjmail@... writes: Lenny, You mentioned the plastic casings were too thick for your hob filter. Was this just because it's an acryllic tank or would this likely be so on the glass ones as well? I'm thinking of ordering but we'd have to use HOB filter. Great stand. If you're ever in the Little Rock, AR area, I'd love to have you build me one. =) (We're about to have a top built for ours but I'm worried about matching the base stand.) Leslie Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13700	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Power outages?

Rob...since you are a relatively a neighbor...do you know of any general LAS' in the Chicago area? I know of specific ones (like Cichlid, killifish, etc... societies), but I would like a more general one. If you do not know of any...is there anyplace online that would have that info? Thanks in advance, Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of FortWayneFish@... Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 10:10 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: Power outages? Beth, Do you have a bait store, walmart, kmart or a Sporting goods store something along those lines in town? I know my Walmarts carry battery operated airpumps for "Bait Keeper buckets" so does Kmart. If you do buy a battery operated airpump get some rechargable batteries, this way when the lights go out you have power, and when the lights come on you can recharge if needed. I have an inverter for the car turns 12volt into 120.. Last year when we had a f3 tear through the power grid out here, i was able to run an extension cord from the driveway into the house and run, 6 tanks off one airpump. No airstones just airline, weighed down or stuck in decoration,so there is no back pressure. I have been thinking of writing an article for my LAS ( Local Aquarium Society) just have not really found a subject or time lately. Maybe I'll do a little research and write about Power Outtage. I did post a Long reply last summer in one of the forums on the subject. (scratching head- which forum was it though ) rob Indiana In a message dated 7/24/2005 9:51:44 AM US Eastern Standard Time, spencer_creek_studios@... writes: I made sure that the temp was not too hot for the fish by tossing in some ice for them to play with and to keep the water from getting any hotter with no ac going. I have seen those battery powered pumps and I'll have a look at them. I have to mail order them since my LFS closed down a month ago. :( Beth Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13701	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Added fish, bad move?

The only other fish in there at the time was a queen loach and a bunch of ghost shrimp. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 10:18 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Added fish, bad move? Offhand, it sounds like some defense strategy. Perhaps they had been stressed as in being spooked or maybe chased or threatened. I don't know what other fish you have in there, so I really can't say for sure and it may have just been a one time occurrance in response to what had been going on at the moment (or immediately preceding moments). Only you MAY have been aware of what had been going on at or just before that particular moment -- try thinking back. We certainly would have no idea of what possible interaction was going on, if that was the cause, which is still one of the distinct possibilities of this behavior. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > speaking of Danios...the other day about 4 of my Danios were huddles > together in a corner...lined up together nose to tail like they were in a > sardine can. Any ideas as to what that was all about...it was pretty weird. > I was thinking maybe they were all sardines in a past life? hehehe > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of FortWayneFish@a... > Sent: Saturday, July 23, 2005 10:25 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Added fish, bad move? > > > Add a lot of hiding places. give them someplace to hide. Out of sight out > of mind.. > Your shark.. probally would be aggressive towards others of its kind. > subdue the light, and add more hiding places hopefully this will help. > > rob > Indiana > > > In a message dated 7/23/2005 9:31:56 PM US Eastern Standard Time, > amjmail@c... writes: > > The catfish is too small for this tank but the fish in the smaller tank > tried to eat out his eyes. He's now hunkered down in the corner of the > tank while the others harrass him, even the larger cat is picking on > him. > > Any suggestions as to adding another shark or what to do about the > catfish? I feel horrible for both of them and I'm sorry I put them > through this. > > Rob > NE Indiana > USA > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..>< ((((:> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<: ((((><74/`7.88. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..>< ((((:> > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13702	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium lighting

It would depend on the upper limit of wattage on the unit. I believe they have a website with specs...or at least you can find one that has specs for it. I was looking at it at one point in time and I remember seeing something, so a lil bit of googling will get you there. You could also email fishman911 and he may still have the manual or at least have info on the specs. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 10:51 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] aquarium lighting Can I put larger bulbs in this kind of light set up? I know little about light bulbs other than incandescent bulbs. I am going out to do research today. Any other input from others would be greatly appreciated. Linda >>>>>>I was just browsing eBay and found an Jebo 48" QUAD compact fluoresent fixture, with fans, legs and four LED blue moon lights. Four 65 watt bulbs, 2 daylight 12K and 2 ture 03 actinic bulbs (total of 260 watts). This is a 2005 model and starting bid is .99. Would this be a better light system for my 150 gallon (30" tall) planted tank? The seller is Fishman911. I think that these light regularly sell for around $300. If I wanted, I could drive down to New Berlin, WI and pick it up. Of course It would probably cost me more in gas than in shipping.Linda<<<<<< >>>>>>>According to what I have been reading, you want 3-4 watts per gallon (450-600 watts for your 150 gal tank) for planted aquariums. The lighting would be good for a 55-75 gallon planted aquarium. Eric<<<<<<< [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13703	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: white spots

In a message dated 7/24/2005 12:02:52 P.M. Central Standard Time, woad@... writes: I just noticed last night on my 20 gallon tank that there are white spots on the glass. They are too small to really describe the shape. I can tell that they are not actually attached. I've had something similar on my tank glass. I would describe it as thin white filaments, like the fuzzy green algae you see except this stuff is straight and white. I have seen them or it in both my 10 gallon and 150. It usually shows up after a large water change. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13704	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium lighting

In a message dated 7/24/2005 1:17:48 P.M. Central Standard Time, woad@... writes: You could also email fishman911 and he may still have the manual or at least have info on the specs. These systems are brand new, still in the box! I am concerned that the larger lights will add more heat. I have seen the Orbit ones for (I think its) 95 watt bulbs. They have more/larger fans. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13705	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: PimaFix/MelaFix

In a message dated 7/24/2005 11:49:40 A.M. Central Standard Time, TheSydMonster@... writes: Hmmm.. it says on their web page and the packaging that melafix and pimafix CAN be used together, that they are complementary. What happens when you put them together that is fatal and why would the manufacturer recommend it, then? It also warns on the bottle that this product has been know to cause cancer in the state of California. I wonder what part of the ingredients they are referring to? I use melaleuca product all the time. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13706	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Set my tanks up

In a message dated 7/24/2005 12:11:13 P.M. Central Standard Time, woad@... writes: you can also speed up the process by getting some biozyme or biospira. I would drop in some fish food...or if you have other fish...some fish waste to get the cycle going. If you are putting any pretty hardy fish...you can put a couple of them in to get the cycle rolling. If you know anyone who had an established tank, you could add some of their aquarium gravel too. This would contain some of the beneficial bacteria you need for your new tank. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13707	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: quarentine/hospital tank

Now that I have my 150 gallon freshwater tank up and running, how do I keep my hospital tank going. I would imagine that in order to keep the beneficial bacteria colony alive, I need to feed it. Can you do that without any fish in it? I have a whisper filter for it. What's the minimum amount of fish to keep my bacteria alive? I'd like to do something with it (plants, breeder tank?), but then it would not be available to use as a hospital tank. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13708	From: paul helms	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: PimaFix/MelaFix

i have several customers and freinds that have used them separtately with great success, and also used them together with absolutely 0 success. everyone that i know that has tried hem together has lost their fish within 24 hours. they really do not mix well. one is antifungal and one is anibacterial. i am sure that you have always heard that you should not mix drugs, and if it is not safe for you, it probably isn't for your fish either. --- Crazy4fids@... wrote: > > In a message dated 7/24/2005 11:49:40 A.M. Central > Standard Time, > TheSydMonster@... writes: > > Hmmm.. it says on their web page and the packaging > that melafix and > pimafix CAN be used together, that they are > complementary. What > happens when you put them together that is fatal > and why would the > manufacturer recommend it, then? > > > > > It also warns on the bottle that this product has > been know to cause cancer > in the state of California. I wonder what part of > the ingredients they are > referring to? I use melaleuca product all the time. > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13709	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: quarentine/hospital tank

Linda, you could drain the Qt tank and sterilize everything. Mild bleach solution. This will kill any parasites or diseases that are stil in the tank. You could then run the "CLEAN" Whisper filter into the 150 to establish a new bacteria colony. Or you could also buy a few cheap expendable fish to use in the 10 gallon QT tank. WhiteClouds or something like that, to keep the QT alive. Everytime i use my QT tank to treat fish i dissemble it and clean it to sterilize it. One reason I recommend a Bare bottom, 1 or 2 decorations and a filterand heater in the tank nothing else. I am currently keeping some Swordtail fry in my QT tank and a handful of Najas grass, but if I needed to use the tank as a hospital tank it would take me 5 minutes to get it ready. rob Indiana In a message dated 7/24/2005 2:03:23 PM US Eastern Standard Time, Crazy4fids@... writes: Now that I have my 150 gallon freshwater tank up and running, how do I keep my hospital tank going. I would imagine that in order to keep the beneficial bacteria colony alive, I need to feed it. Can you do that without any fish in it? I have a whisper filter for it. What's the minimum amount of fish to keep my bacteria alive? I'd like to do something with it (plants, breeder tank?), but then it would not be available to use as a hospital tank. Linda Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13710	From: paul helms	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: dead Oscar

btw, all of the fish that you have are agressive and territorial by nature. the pacu will more than likely clear out your tank also when he is so inclimed. he could have been after the oscar causing him to jump. --- kb1dva <vze3pd7a@...> wrote: > I want to thank everyone for their support. He was a > big fish getting close > to 12 inches. Last week we did about a 90% water > change and moved the tank > about 6-8 feet over could that be what flipped him > out. Money is non > existent right now, so I will have to try to > improvise a cover with > materials on hand. He had started to go around > trying to bite everyone, but > this is bug season and he might have seen a moth or > this house is filled > with spiders. What would be a nice addition to the > tank when possible – 1 > pacu, 2 Oscars, 1 pike, 3 blood parots all in a 90 > gallon- tall. He must > have been quite the jumper Emily > > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of paul helms > Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 4:54 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] dead oscar > > > > if the lid is open they will jump out...could have > gone for a bug ie moth etc, or could have been high > nitrates resulting in erratic behavior. > > --- kb1dva <vze3pd7a@...> wrote: > > > sorry to leave and pop in again but I am really > > upset my oscar had > > been acting very agressivly for him and last night > I > > went downstairs > > to do something and he was dead on the livingroom > > floor there was no > > trauma i could see- he must have jumped out of the > > tank.does this > > happen often and was his agressiveness a sign that > > he was sick. please > > help me understand what happened Emily > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when > replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the > web. > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of > Service. > > > > _____ > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13711	From: paul helms	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Set my tanks up/To Lori, Steve and Paul

i to have done the same harry, and yes it can work. i have doen it many times in fact, and also rely on stress zyme, usually works for me. the difference here is that we both have experience in the hobby and know what to watch for, whie a newbie may jump the gun and over clean, interrupting the cycle, may overfeed leaving large amounts of ammonia, and may overmedicate. there are too many factors for newbies imo to suggest doing a one day start up. in this case, there are nitrites present at week 6, meaning things were not done correctly, obviously. --- harry perry <harryfisherman@...> wrote: > I have a different opinion. All bodies of water need > to cycle. The effects of the cycle on the fish is > totally overrated. Years ago I started tanks and > didn't know anything about the nitrogen cycle. I set > the tank up on a saturday and put fish in on sunday. > Guess what happened? > > NOTHING happened. I didn't lose a single fish. Did > the fish feel stressed? I don't know I'm not a fish > shrink. Steve and Paul are very knowledgeable folks. > They have their opinion and I have mine. I did use > Stress coat and Stress zyne to lesson the effects of > the cycle on the fish. There are a lot of variables > in this equation. Filtration, live plants or not, > water movement by air stones or your filter,weekly > water changes. I don't use air stones. I run whisper > filters on all my tanks and find that the surface > agitation from these filters is enough. > > The cycle is real it will happen. The effects of the > cycle on fish is another matter. > > Harry > > KraftyGurl1963 <kraftygurl1963@...> wrote: > 5 weeks > Why 5 wks? > Lori > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when > replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING > the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email > to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > --------------------------------- > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13712	From: paul helms	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Question on feeding

i feed daily, skipping an occasional day. make sure the food you buy is of good quality. for flake i use ocean nutrition and tertamin --- KraftyGurl1963 <kraftygurl1963@...> wrote: > Good morning all > How often do you all feed your fish? > Once a day , every other day? I don't want to over > feed tthem. Also what kind of food do you buy? I > plan on non aggressive tank. > Thanks for all the help > Lori > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13713	From: paul helms	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Set my tanks up

it akes 4-6 weeks to correctly cycle a tank --- KraftyGurl1963 <kraftygurl1963@...> wrote: > 5 weeks > Why 5 wks? > Lori > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13714	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: WAS (Power outages) Chicago Aquarium Clubs

Eric, what are you looking for/ There are (8) fish/aquarium clubs all over the Chicago area, but as you mentioned alot of them are specific.( cichlids, killies, guppies, etc) The only club I know of that is not specific would be Chicagoland Aquarist Society Contact Name: Carl Morris Contact Phone: (708)371-0045 Contact Email: acmecm(AT)worldnet.att.net Meeting Details: Meets the first Friday of every month in room A141 of Moraine Valley Community College. Alternative Contacts: Scott Davis unclescott(AT)prodigy.net Ben Kalafut bkalafut(AT)bigfoot.com I have no other info about the group, last updated info in 2001. There are also clubs in some of the surrounding cities. Elkhart,In- Champagne, IL- and a few others. Where are you generally located maybe we can find you a nice club close to home. rob NE Indiana CCAC member ( Circle City ) In a message dated 7/24/2005 12:30:17 PM US Eastern Standard Time, woad@... writes: Rob...since you are a relatively a neighbor...do you know of any general LAS' in the Chicago area? I know of specific ones (like Cichlid, killifish, etc... societies), but I would like a more general one. If you do not know of any...is there anyplace online that would have that info? Thanks in advance, Eric Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13715	From: bunnycareshi	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Seaweed as food & correct temp/freshwater

Aloha I'm a newbie and joined this group about a month ago when I got my very first aquarium - a 30gal freshwater (secondhand) w/4 clown loaches, 2 Black Lace Angels and 1 cat, all about 4" length. I have 2 questions: 1) The former owner claimed the temp. he *had* to keep his tank at was 85 w/his heater. I asked around and was told that seemed pretty high, esp. for Hawaii, and I don't have a/c here. Does that sound correct? 2) I saw seaweed treat food at one of the fish stores here and as I recall it was pretty expensive. Can I give my fish "human" seaweed, the kind that is flat and used to roll sushi in? (Hope that's not a dumb question!) As you can imagine, we have a ton of it here and the sushi-kind sells as low as $1. Cinde in Hawaii ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13716	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: white spots

no...it's not filaments. The dots are dots. Imagine if you were to spread a thin gel on the glass that has small white dots in it. I also haven't done a water change in a couple of weeks. It is one of my tasks for the weekend actually. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 1:47 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] white spots In a message dated 7/24/2005 12:02:52 P.M. Central Standard Time, woad@... writes: I just noticed last night on my 20 gallon tank that there are white spots on the glass. They are too small to really describe the shape. I can tell that they are not actually attached. I've had something similar on my tank glass. I would describe it as thin white filaments, like the fuzzy green algae you see except this stuff is straight and white. I have seen them or it in both my 10 gallon and 150. It usually shows up after a large water change. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13717	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium lighting

yep...you can use computer fans if you put them in a hood to keep things cool. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 1:50 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] aquarium lighting In a message dated 7/24/2005 1:17:48 P.M. Central Standard Time, woad@... writes: You could also email fishman911 and he may still have the manual or at least have info on the specs. These systems are brand new, still in the box! I am concerned that the larger lights will add more heat. I have seen the Orbit ones for (I think its) 95 watt bulbs. They have more/larger fans. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13718	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Seaweed as food & correct temp/freshwater

Temp sounds high for me, i think 78*F would be a little more appropriete. The human kind of sea weed will work just fine for your fish. rob Indiana In a message dated 7/24/2005 3:40:55 PM US Eastern Standard Time, bunnycareshi@... writes: 1) The former owner claimed the temp. he *had* to keep his tank at was 85 w/his heater. I asked around and was told that seemed pretty high, esp. for Hawaii, and I don't have a/c here. Does that sound correct? 2) I saw seaweed treat food at one of the fish stores here and as I recall it was pretty expensive. Can I give my fish "human" seaweed, the kind that is flat and used to roll sushi in? (Hope that's not a dumb question!) As you can imagine, we have a ton of it here and the sushi-kind sells as low as $1. Cinde in Hawaii Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13719	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: PimaFix/MelaFix

Pharmacologically speaking, an antibacterial and an antifungal are not contraindicated. Antibacterial ointments are often used with antifungal treatments to prevent secondary infections. If the fish died, it just means that in those instances there was more there than medicines could fix. If you want to look at an example in humans...look at the antibacterial ointments. Most contain 3 different antibacterial drugs and some even contain a analgesic. Mixing drugs is pretty common. HIV/AIDS drugs are cocktails of different drugs as are many cancer medication. Certain drugs should not be mixed...mainly ones that would double the effect of the other, causing a harmful result, like drinking alcohol while on sedatives. Eric...former army combat medical specialist. _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of paul helms Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 2:47 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] PimaFix/MelaFix i have several customers and freinds that have used them separtately with great success, and also used them together with absolutely 0 success. everyone that i know that has tried hem together has lost their fish within 24 hours. they really do not mix well. one is antifungal and one is anibacterial. i am sure that you have always heard that you should not mix drugs, and if it is not safe for you, it probably isn't for your fish either. --- Crazy4fids@... wrote: > > In a message dated 7/24/2005 11:49:40 A.M. Central > Standard Time, > TheSydMonster@... writes: > > Hmmm.. it says on their web page and the packaging > that melafix and > pimafix CAN be used together, that they are > complementary. What > happens when you put them together that is fatal > and why would the > manufacturer recommend it, then? > > > > > It also warns on the bottle that this product has > been know to cause cancer > in the state of California. I wonder what part of > the ingredients they are > referring to? I use melaleuca product all the time. > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13720	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: WAS (Power outages) Chicago Aquarium Clubs

cool thanks!!!! I will have to find out where the first one is at...not sure where Moraine Valley College is at. Elkhart and Champaign are a bit of a haul. I am in Naperville which is abut 40 miles west of the Chicago city limits. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of FortWayneFish@... Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 3:00 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] WAS (Power outages) Chicago Aquarium Clubs Eric, what are you looking for/ There are (8) fish/aquarium clubs all over the Chicago area, but as you mentioned alot of them are specific.( cichlids, killies, guppies, etc) The only club I know of that is not specific would be Chicagoland Aquarist Society Contact Name: Carl Morris Contact Phone: (708)371-0045 Contact Email: acmecm(AT)worldnet.att.net Meeting Details: Meets the first Friday of every month in room A141 of Moraine Valley Community College. Alternative Contacts: Scott Davis unclescott(AT)prodigy.net Ben Kalafut bkalafut(AT)bigfoot.com I have no other info about the group, last updated info in 2001. There are also clubs in some of the surrounding cities. Elkhart,In- Champagne, IL- and a few others. Where are you generally located maybe we can find you a nice club close to home. rob NE Indiana CCAC member ( Circle City ) In a message dated 7/24/2005 12:30:17 PM US Eastern Standard Time, woad@... writes: Rob...since you are a relatively a neighbor...do you know of any general LAS' in the Chicago area? I know of specific ones (like Cichlid, killifish, etc... societies), but I would like a more general one. If you do not know of any...is there anyplace online that would have that info? Thanks in advance, Eric Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13721	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: quarentine/hospital tank

Rob, This sounds like a good idea. Never thought to add the whisper filter to the big tank to establish a bacteria colony. It wouldn't take much to move it to the ten gallon, should I decide to store it till I need it. We thought of using the tank to raise guppy fry in, but I have decided against the guppies. They are not much bigger than a neon, and my angelfish are gonna be huge! We did pick up a few female pineapple swords and a one male today. I think they are going to add a nice color zip to the tank. I left four glowlight tetras an a couple of cories in the ten gallon, for now. There is also a nice (small) piece of malaysian wood in there that I am going to try and plant. I am not sure if I want to use java moss or java fern. I can't seem to find any java moss in any of the lfs around here. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13722	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium lighting

My tank does not have a canopy as of yet. Couldn't find one for my tank size. Anybody know of a good site where you could buy or build one? Would you have to put fans on that as well as the light fixture? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13723	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Chicago Aquarium Clubs

The Midwest Cichlid Association I know that it says Cichlid Association . A few memebrs in your area. Might be able to point you in a more specific direction.. rob NE Indiana 100+miles to Chicago In a message dated 7/24/2005 4:03:11 PM US Eastern Standard Time, woad@... writes: cool thanks!!!! I will have to find out where the first one is at...not sure where Moraine Valley College is at. Elkhart and Champaign are a bit of a haul. I am in Naperville which is abut 40 miles west of the Chicago city limits. Eric Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13724	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: PimaFix/MelaFix

It does seem to me they would compliment one another. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > Pharmacologically speaking, an antibacterial and an antifungal are not > contraindicated. Antibacterial ointments are often used with antifungal > treatments to prevent secondary infections. If the fish died, it just means > that in those instances there was more there than medicines could fix. If > you want to look at an example in humans...look at the antibacterial > ointments. Most contain 3 different antibacterial drugs and some even > contain a analgesic. Mixing drugs is pretty common. HIV/AIDS drugs are > cocktails of different drugs as are many cancer medication. Certain drugs > should not be mixed...mainly ones that would double the effect of the other, > causing a harmful result, like drinking alcohol while on sedatives. > > Eric...former army combat medical specialist. > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of paul helms > Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 2:47 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] PimaFix/MelaFix > > > i have several customers and freinds that have used > them separtately with great success, and also used > them together with absolutely 0 success. everyone > that i know that has tried hem together has lost their > fish within 24 hours. they really do not mix well. > one is antifungal and one is anibacterial. i am sure > that you have always heard that you should not mix > drugs, and if it is not safe for you, it probably > isn't for your fish either. > > --- Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > > > > > In a message dated 7/24/2005 11:49:40 A.M. Central > > Standard Time, > > TheSydMonster@c... writes: > > > > Hmmm.. it says on their web page and the packaging > > that melafix and > > pimafix CAN be used together, that they are > > complementary. What > > happens when you put them together that is fatal > > and why would the > > manufacturer recommend it, then? > > > > > > > > > > It also warns on the bottle that this product has > > been know to cause cancer > > in the state of California. I wonder what part of > > the ingredients they are > > referring to? I use melaleuca product all the time. > > > > Linda > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13725	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: disposable filter cartridges

Who was looking for a recyclable filter cartridge? I picked up a copy of Aquarium USA and in it is an ad for Imagine Bio3 disposable filter cartridges. It looks like it comes in three parts. The first part is a snap together plastic frame. In it, you have two disposable parts. One is a white mechanical bag that contains carbon. The second is a sponge for biological filtration. These cartridges will fit Tetra and Marineland filters. It says "For a free sample, send e-mail request to: _imaginegld@..._ (mailto:imaginegld@...) or fax 888-777-7447. Please indicate power filter model and manufacturer." Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13726	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: glowlight danios

Check these out! _Practical Fishkeeping magazine | The GloFish_ (http://www.practicalfishkeeping.co.uk/pfk/pages/show_article.php?article_id=119) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13727	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: more on glofish

_GloFish (tm) - Welcome_ (http://www.glofish.com/default.asp) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13728	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium lighting

You can get them at any pet store or you can build one yourself. Actually one of my project today is putting one together that I designed...somewhat basing it off of one I saw at Petco...modified greatly pf course ;-) I will post pics and plans when I get a chance. As you get into the higher wattage lighting, you will need to put cooling fans on it. Computer fans work great. One of the things I am working into this is using a cold cathode tube to provide moonlighting and using led fans for computer cases. I am going to grab a power supply off of on of my own systems to power them. The moonlighting is nice as it provides enough light to see your fish, but still give them a night phase. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 4:24 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] aquarium lighting My tank does not have a canopy as of yet. Couldn't find one for my tank size. Anybody know of a good site where you could buy or build one? Would you have to put fans on that as well as the light fixture? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13729	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium lighting

Thanks for all the light help, Eric Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13730	From: KraftyGurl1963	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Question on feeding

i feed daily, skipping an occasional day. make sure the food you buy is of good quality. for flake i use ocean nutrition and tertamin Hi Paul Thanks for all the information you have provided. I really appreciate it. Lori --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Helps protect you from nasty viruses. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13731	From: KraftyGurl1963	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Set my tanks up

Thanks to everyone for the help with my new tanks Lori --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13732	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Power outages?

No Kmart they closed their last store here two years ago, not enough people buying stuff from them. We do have walmart. I'll look through wal mart when I get back from my small vacation out of the country. Usually, our power outages don't last too long maybe an hour at the latest. But the ones we dealt with last night was three to four hours long each. I started to get worried about my babies having no oxygen. I did see those tablets for ponds which puts oxygen into it. I was almost thinking about getting some of them and breaking some of them into smaller bits so I could toss one in my 30 gal tank during the possible long time without power. Beth --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, FortWayneFish@a... wrote: > Beth, > Do you have a bait store, walmart, kmart or a Sporting goods store something along those lines in town? > > I know my Walmarts carry battery operated airpumps for "Bait Keeper buckets"so does Kmart. If you do buy a battery operated airpump get some rechargable batteries, this way when the lights go out you have power, and when the lights come on you can recharge if needed. > > I have an inverter for the car turns 12volt into 120.. Last year when we had a f3 tear through the power grid out here, i was able to run an extension cord from the driveway into the house and run, 6 tanks off one airpump. No airstones just airline, weighed down or stuck in decoration,so there is no back pressure. > > I have been thinking of writing an article for my LAS ( Local Aquarium Society) just have not really found a subject or time lately. Maybe I'll do a little research and write about Power Outtage. I did post a Long reply last summer in one of the forums on the subject. (scratching head- which forum was it though ) > > rob > Indiana

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13733	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: GlassCages.com - 65 G Acrylic Tank UPDATE - Building the stand,

Hi Leslie, Yeah... the reason is because it's an acrylic tank so it's much lighter than a comparably sized Glass tank. The Glass tanks have to use MUCH thicker glass which means they don't have to further brace it at the top of the long front and back panels. This tank only weighed around 37 pounds. I'm not sure what a 65G glass tank would weigh. Another place you may want to check out for Glass tanks is http://www.AquaTraders.com I saw their full page ad in the August 2005 Aquarium Fish Magazine and they have "Glass Aquariums for $0.99 / gallon for a 60G, 100G or 168G, so the 60G should only be $60.00. Of course, shipping on a glass tank may be a lot more than the acrylic because of the weight difference. Check them and http://www.GlassCages.com for the retail and shipping costs. Aquatraders.com also has the 20" long 14 LED Moonlighting strips for only $16.99. That's a GREAT price compared to all of the other Moonlighting kits that I've seen. The cheapest I've seen was around $30.00 for a single LED kit but maybe it was a stronger LED... who knows? They also have a 9W UV Sterilizer for $29.90 which is about half of what I've seen them for. It looks like http://www.BigAlsOnline.com has some new competition. After I build my hood, I'm going to install two of those Moonlighting strips too. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: Date: Sun, 24 Jul 2005 08:28:38 -0500 From: "Dane & Leslie Moore" <amjmail@...> Subject: RE: RE: GlassCages.com - 65 G Acrylic Tank UPDATE - Building the stand, etc. Lenny, You mentioned the plastic casings were too thick for your hob filter. Was this just because it's an acrylic tank or would this likely be so on the glass ones as well? I'm thinking of ordering but we'd have to use HOB filter. Great stand. If you're ever in the Little Rock, AR area, I'd love to have you build me one. =) (We're about to have a top built for ours but I'm worried about matching the base stand.) Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13734	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: 65 G Acrylic Tank UPDATE (reply to Rob)

Hey Rob, The HOB I bought ahead of time was rated for a 70G tank so apparently the company wasn't in the loop with the co-conspirators. I was able to modify the top side frame by carving a 1/4" crescent into the plastic frame so I could at least use the HOB on the end rather than the back. I was going to rename it a HOE (hang on end) but decided to call it a HOS (hang on side) so I didn't sound like a rap song. :-D I got this HOS from the PetsMart.com clearance pages (1/2 priced) for under $15.00 (I think it was $13.40). I have a couple of different types of HOB's but this one has an airline attached to the impeller area and it injects air into the water stream going into the filter pads. It says this added O2 aids the bacteria in doing their job. It sounds like it should. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: Date: Sun, 24 Jul 2005 10:50:16 EDT From: FortWayneFish@... Subject: Re: 65 G Acrylic Tank UPDATE The first time I bought a tank bigger then a 55 gallons I was disappointed that my AquaClear 300's wouldn't fit on it because of the Plastic Casing around the top. I bought a few AC 300's a few years ago on sale for $16.50 and I was hoping to use 2 of them on the 75 but they don't fit. The AC 500's fit no problem but the 300 didn't. I think the filters rated for that size of tank mostly fit the casing. But the lower rated filters don't. maybe its a conspiracy between the tank manufacturers and the Filter makers. ? rob Indiana In a message dated 7/24/2005 8:29:18 AM US Eastern Standard Time, amjmail@... writes: Lenny, You mentioned the plastic casings were too thick for your hob filter. Was this just because it's an acrylic tank or would this likely be so on the glass ones as well? I'm thinking of ordering but we'd have to use HOB filter. Great stand. If you're ever in the Little Rock, AR area, I'd love to have you build me one. =) (We're about to have a top built for ours but I'm worried about matching the base stand.) Leslie Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13735	From: bunnycareshi	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Seaweed as food & correct temp/freshwater

Aloha Thank you, Rob. When I told the guy I thought the temp was too high and that I had taken the heater out, keeping the temp at about 85, he said I was going to lose the Clowns at that temp and that I also might incur ick. He had these fish for 1 yr or more and he seemed to know quite a bit about aquariums. I just don't see why they can't do well in the dead of summer in Hawaii w/out heater. I'm so glad I can use the dried "human" seaweed. How do I feed it? Do I put in chunks or chop it fine like fish flaked food? Cinde in Hawaii --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, FortWayneFish@a... wrote: > Temp sounds high for me, i think 78*F would be a little more appropriete. > The human kind of sea weed will work just fine for your fish. > > rob > Indiana > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13736	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: PimaFix/MelaFix

I agree Linda. Melafix and Pimafix can be used safely together. "It also warns on the bottle that this product has been know to cause cancer in the state of California." As far as California with their obsessive regulation... they would post a cancer warning on the Sun if they could figure out a way to do it... at the taxpayers expense! Or... maybe Melafix figured out a way to ONLY cause cancer to Californians... now if they could get it to only affect tax and spend politicians. Today California, tomorrow Washington, D.C. Melafix for President 2008!!!! :-P Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: Date: Sun, 24 Jul 2005 14:52:09 EDT From: Crazy4fids@... Subject: PimaFix/MelaFix In a message dated 7/24/2005 11:49:40 A.M. Central Standard Time, TheSydMonster@... writes: Hmmm.. it says on their web page and the packaging that melafix and pimafix CAN be used together, that they are complementary. What happens when you put them together that is fatal and why would the manufacturer recommend it, then? It also warns on the bottle that this product has been know to cause cancer in the state of California. I wonder what part of the ingredients they are referring to? I use melaleuca product all the time. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13737	From: KraftyGurl1963	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Set my tanks up/Nan

Lori, I forgot to add that since you have some time (at least a couple of weeks, if not a little longer) while your tank cycles, you can do some research and see what looks good to you and what direction you want to go! ~nan~ Thanks Nan!! I haven't really done any research; but I know I should Lori --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13738	From: KraftyGurl1963	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Set my tanks up/ Steve

Hi Steve Thanks for all the information/ opinion. i appreciate the time. again ty Lori --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13739	From: Jo Baker	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Power outages?

Greenwater Aquarium Society is a general club for all fish. Can't remember the town, but it's South of Chicago. Nice folks ----- Original Message ----- From: Eric Roberts To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 1:30 PM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Power outages? Rob...since you are a relatively a neighbor...do you know of any general LAS' in the Chicago area? I know of specific ones (like Cichlid, killifish, etc... societies), but I would like a more general one. If you do not know of any...is there anyplace online that would have that info? Thanks in advance, Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of FortWayneFish@... Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 10:10 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: Power outages? Beth, Do you have a bait store, walmart, kmart or a Sporting goods store something along those lines in town? I know my Walmarts carry battery operated airpumps for "Bait Keeper buckets" so does Kmart. If you do buy a battery operated airpump get some rechargable batteries, this way when the lights go out you have power, and when the lights come on you can recharge if needed. I have an inverter for the car turns 12volt into 120.. Last year when we had a f3 tear through the power grid out here, i was able to run an extension cord from the driveway into the house and run, 6 tanks off one airpump. No airstones just airline, weighed down or stuck in decoration,so there is no back pressure. I have been thinking of writing an article for my LAS ( Local Aquarium Society) just have not really found a subject or time lately. Maybe I'll do a little research and write about Power Outtage. I did post a Long reply last summer in one of the forums on the subject. (scratching head- which forum was it though ) rob Indiana In a message dated 7/24/2005 9:51:44 AM US Eastern Standard Time, spencer_creek_studios@... writes: I made sure that the temp was not too hot for the fish by tossing in some ice for them to play with and to keep the water from getting any hotter with no ac going. I have seen those battery powered pumps and I'll have a look at them. I have to mail order them since my LFS closed down a month ago. :( Beth Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.9.4/57 - Release Date: 7/22/2005 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13740	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: PimaFix/MelaFix

Maybe they can get on that effects neocons and we could have our democracy back *grin* Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Lenny Vasbinder Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 6:23 PM To: AquaticLife Yahoo! Group Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: PimaFix/MelaFix I agree Linda. Melafix and Pimafix can be used safely together. "It also warns on the bottle that this product has been know to cause cancer in the state of California." As far as California with their obsessive regulation... they would post a cancer warning on the Sun if they could figure out a way to do it... at the taxpayers expense! Or... maybe Melafix figured out a way to ONLY cause cancer to Californians... now if they could get it to only affect tax and spend politicians. Today California, tomorrow Washington, D.C. Melafix for President 2008!!!! :-P Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: Date: Sun, 24 Jul 2005 14:52:09 EDT From: Crazy4fids@... Subject: PimaFix/MelaFix In a message dated 7/24/2005 11:49:40 A.M. Central Standard Time, TheSydMonster@... writes: Hmmm.. it says on their web page and the packaging that melafix and pimafix CAN be used together, that they are complementary. What happens when you put them together that is fatal and why would the manufacturer recommend it, then? It also warns on the bottle that this product has been know to cause cancer in the state of California. I wonder what part of the ingredients they are referring to? I use melaleuca product all the time. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13741	From: komal trehan	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Me and My Cuties....

Hey I m an Indian girl.I have 1 n a half meter,width wise n 1 meter in height wise,long aquarium.I have 2 black n 2 white Sharks,approx 12 inches long fishes n there r some other fishes too like 4 Sucker Fishes n there r 2 more different fishes r there but i don't know there names. When i was 7,my father bought aquarium n many different kind of Fishes along with.At that times i had 6 Sharks, 4 Black n 2 White,each were 3 inches long. Now after 11 years, my Sharks r 12 inches long.In the middle of the years i also have bought 2 baby turtles abt 2 an a half inches n they r at present with me.They r very cute.My fish's seller told me when i bought turtles, that i have to tak them out from the aquarium at least 2 hours a day.That's y i sets them free for,sometimes 1 n a half or 2 or may b 3 hours in my room.Sometimes my one the turtle go crazy n tried to cut me,when i put in finder in front of them,even sometimes i saw that they both were fighting in the aquarium but suddenly when any1 of them c me, they stops fighting n comes on the top of the aquarium n always give a hungry expression.I love them both,they r life.They r so sweet that even i take them out when i goes to my Institute. Well,i have read all ur mails n find out that some of u have grown up algae n stuff like that.Can any1 could tell me that y u all people grow algae in ur water tanks. As i told u that my family is maintaining an aquarium for 11 years n till now i never felt that there is any need of algae n stuff like that, in the same even i also have never heard abt growning algae n stuff like that, in the same. Plz do tell me..... Thanx 4 ur Precious Time God Bless All..... Tak Care............ Bye Bye............ "Eshali" --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13742	From: Seasons444@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Canister Filter Media

I'm setting up my first tank, a 50 gal. marine fish and invert with 65 lbs live rock and 3.5" sand bed. I have a Aqua C protein skimmer, two powerheads and an Eheim 2080 canister filter. My question is, what type of filter media would you suggest I add to the Eheim canister filter? There's three compartments. I'm just testing out my tank for leaks with tap water and checking systems out today (the sand, live rock and fish and inverts not added yet) so filters are running. I had some mechanical and biological media so I put in the Eheim, but I'm wondering if this is incorrect. Should I just go with an activated carbon along with mechanical media, or just carbon? All advice is appreciated, thank you, Kathy [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13743	From: krazeez22	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Filter Media / Marine Tank

I'm setting up my first tank, a 50 gal. marine fish and invert tank with 65 lbs live rock and 3.5" sand bed. I have a Aqua C protein skimmer, two powerheads and an Eheim 2080 canister filter. My question is, what type of filter media would you suggest I add to the Eheim canister filter? There's three compartments. I'm just testing out my tank for leaks with tap water and checking systems out today (the sand, live rock and fish and inverts not added yet) so filters are running. I had some mechanical and biological media so I put in the Eheim, but I'm wondering if this is incorrect. Should I just go with an activated carbon along with mechanical media, or just carbon?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13744	From: Robert	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Snails

Can cold fresh water snails be fed anything? Robert

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13745	From: camdogkingsfan	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: question about fish disapearing

Hello all. Let me try and keep my story and question short. I have had a 25 gallon take for about 3 years. In there I have had a Pasco, black ghost knife, 4 black skirt tetras, 4 albno catfish, 2 clear looking catfish (sorry I can't remember the name of them right now),and 2 upside down catfish. Now before you get on my case about have that many fish I already know. Well I upgraded to bigger aquaruim about a month ago to a 48 gallon. I put all those fish in there along with 3 small fish. I can't remember the name of them right now. I know they are about an inch long and one is yellow, the other two where blue and gray. Very pretty. Well I noticed earlier this week. One of the small fish were gone. I saw the other two about 1:00 pm my time. Then I came home at 4:00 pm and the yellow was the only one left. Then on Friday I saw that one of my tetras fins looked missing or chewed up. I woke up Saturday and he was gone. This morning I saw one of the other tetras fins is kinda mussed up. Does anyone know what is going on? Is the Knife eating the fish? I feed my fish very well. I give them bottom feeding food and two Brine Shrimp cubes. Can anyone help?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13746	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: 65 G Acrylic Tank UPDATE (reply to Rob)

So Lenny, when did you start using HOE's ? Well that shot dow my consiracy theory . Well it was a good conspiracy. Maybe your filter manufacturer couldn't read the English directions at The Place of Origin, where filter was made. ? Can't beat clearance or 1/2 price products usually. I grabbed a handful of AC 300's a few years ago at $16.50 each with free shipping. 300GPH filteration couldn't beat it with a stick especially when the Emperor and Penguin comparision was $30.00 + shipping. I did take and modify my tank surround to accomedate the 300, but it sits to high and no matter how full I fill the tank I get a Cascade sound. Which is great if you ask me, but the wife and kids hate it.. I tell them" if you don't like it stay out of the fish room" Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 7/24/2005 5:51:57 PM US Eastern Standard Time, lnvtm1@... writes: I was going to rename it a HOE (hang on end) but decided to call it a HOS (hang on side) so I didn't sound like a rap song. :-D I got this HOS from the PetsMart.com clearance pages (1/2 priced) for under $15.00 (I think it was $13.40). I have a couple of different types of HOB's but this one has an airline attached to the impeller area and it injects air into the water stream going into the filter pads. It says this added O2 aids the bacteria in doing their job. It sounds like it should. Lenny Vasbinder [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13747	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: Seaweed as food & correct temp/freshwater

Cinde, experiemnt with it.. Yaki Nor or seaweed comes in a few forms. I know of people who attach it in the tank with a seaweed clip/ lettuce clip the clips can be found at most Fish or pet stores for around a dollar each.. I have 5 Clown Loaches over 5 inches in a tank with the water temp of 74*F And they have been fine for over 4 years. rob Indiana In a message dated 7/24/2005 5:57:11 PM US Eastern Standard Time, bunnycareshi@... writes: I'm so glad I can use the dried "human" seaweed. How do I feed it? Do I put in chunks or chop it fine like fish flaked food? Cinde in Hawaii Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13748	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: quarentine/hospital tank

I'd place a sponge filter (simple, air driven) in the main tank, and reserve the 10 gallon tank for when needed. A quick wash out and fill with water, add heater and sponge filter from main tank and fish to be quarantined. Be done with it in a few hours. If the tank is sitting there, you are gonna put something in it, I guarantee it, and it won't be ready for use as a quarantine. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 3:03 PM To: mnaquarium@yahoogroups.com; AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com; uniaquaria@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] quarentine/hospital tank Now that I have my 150 gallon freshwater tank up and running, how do I keep my hospital tank going. I would imagine that in order to keep the beneficial bacteria colony alive, I need to feed it. Can you do that without any fish in it? I have a whisper filter for it. What's the minimum amount of fish to keep my bacteria alive? I'd like to do something with it (plants, breeder tank?), but then it would not be available to use as a hospital tank. Linda

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13749	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: quarentine/hospital tank

Yep, if it's sitting there you will put something in it. I had one all set up. I bought a female firemouth, realized she is too small for the main tank (ohhh I'll let her get a bit bigger before I add her, right.) She's in the q tank...she looked so lonely. I then add another baby firemouth for company. Ooooof! Now I am looking for yet another tank so I can reclaim this one as my hospital tank. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 9:25 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] quarentine/hospital tank I'd place a sponge filter (simple, air driven) in the main tank, and reserve the 10 gallon tank for when needed. A quick wash out and fill with water, add heater and sponge filter from main tank and fish to be quarantined. Be done with it in a few hours. If the tank is sitting there, you are gonna put something in it, I guarantee it, and it won't be ready for use as a quarantine. \\Steve//

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13750	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: more on glofish

This is relatively old news. I don't even see them around any more, though some one probably still sells them. Haven't even heard them mentioned in more than 6 months, probably closer to a year. As I recall, you do need a UV light to make them glow I believe they were developed in a search to find something that would detect certain types of pollutants in the water. Like painted fish or the parrot cichlids, I'd not purchase them. However, these fish were created by adding genes of another critter, I believe, for research, to which I do not have an objection. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 5:45 PM To: uniaquaria@yahoogroups.com; AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com; mnaquarium@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] more on glofish _GloFish (tm) - Welcome_ (http://www.glofish.com/default.asp)

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13751	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Fin and tail rot keeps getting worse with Maracyn and M2/ hospital

Oh my gosh, guys I don't even know what to do anymore. My 20 gal guppy/danio tank is infected with fin and tail rot, which I've already tried treating once with M2 and again with Maracyn, and again with Maracyn a 2nd time. And of course weekly water changes in the meantime, and at one point even more frequently. But it is getting worse instead of better, and one of the fish has lost almost its entire tail. The last water check was okay. I'm ordering some tetracycline tablets online because I haven't used that yet, but I really don't even know what to do now. I've tried the jungle anti-bacterial food even. That's not even the worst of it. The same problem is going on in my 55 gal goldfish tank. Everyone is okay except the oranda, who still isn't any better after an M2 treatment, maracyn, and melafix. I'm considering a hospital tank for that one with tetracycline, but I don't have an empty established tank. I could set up a small 3-gal tank with some gravel from the old tank and a filter than hangs on the side, then leave her in there for a week and don't feed too much? I'm ready to pull my hair out. I can't add anything to the aquariums that will harm the snails either. Please does anyone have advice? Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13752	From: Patrick	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Re: glowlight danios

Opposition to these fish MOSTLY comes from ignorant people who also believe starving Africans is a better thing than feeding them American grain which has also been genetically modified for years. That magazine seems to be run by people who enjoy opposing things. But, many fishkeepers simply prefer natural fish, like me. I have no problem with them, and hope they continue to make their creators money to fund more research to clean up the water. I've never seen them in my area. I wouldn't buy them myself, but only because they are too expensive. Also, to make it clear, these danios are modified genetically when they are still a single cell long before they hatch, so no physical harm is ever done to them once born that isn't done to normal danios. Once bred with normal danios, the glow gene will disapear in a generation or two. Glolight tetras are 100% natural as they are found in the wild, and are not gm'ed. Patrick [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13753	From: AQUARIUMFISH	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: Betta nest/eggs - I think

I think I have a pair of spawning or spawned bettas. It looks like to me in the past few hours that there are now eggs but I really dont know becuase I have never seen it .. Its a regular bubble nest but I noticed tonight that there are what looks like miniture cotton balls up in the nest. is this eggs or not ... and the female is still in there .. could they be finished ??? the male is defending the nest very well but I cant seem to get her out either so I dont know what to do. Inexperienced Egger lol Gen [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13754	From: bennedh76	Date: 7/24/2005
Subject: New Guy

Hello, My name is Heeth I have just recently purchased an aquarium. I am just about to the point of pulling all my hair out and smashing the 55gal fish killing machine. I cannot figure it out, I have tested the; PH=7.5, Nitrites=0, Chloramine=0, Ammonia=0. So far I bought some gold fish to get the bacteria up, got rid of them and got some misc. community fish - Had a algae bloom and most everything died even the Placo the only thing that survived was the frog and the beta. So I cleaned and treated the algae and cleaned it up. Shortly after the beta and frog crossed over. So I waited a couple weeks treated the water for parasites and algae tested all the things that I listed in the beginning and those were the results so I figured that I was safe. Yesterday I went and bought three Chichlids and put them in, so far two have died and the third is barely making it. I did buy a couple little tiny baskets of sea shells from Wal-Mart boiled and cleaned them, put some glassware and marbles in as well. Also this tank had been previously owned but I did clean it. I think that is about all as far as backgrounds go. Can anyone HELP or does anyone have any suggestions? Thank you, and I am looking forward to being part of the group. Heeth

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13755	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: 65 G Acrylic Tank UPDATE (reply to Rob)

I like the gurgling of the water...it's relaxing. If I had a room big enough to have a tank with a crashing surf I would do it. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of FortWayneFish@... Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 8:51 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: 65 G Acrylic Tank UPDATE (reply to Rob) So Lenny, when did you start using HOE's ? Well that shot dow my consiracy theory . Well it was a good conspiracy. Maybe your filter manufacturer couldn't read the English directions at The Place of Origin, where filter was made. ? Can't beat clearance or 1/2 price products usually. I grabbed a handful of AC 300's a few years ago at $16.50 each with free shipping. 300GPH filteration couldn't beat it with a stick especially when the Emperor and Penguin comparision was $30.00 + shipping. I did take and modify my tank surround to accomedate the 300, but it sits to high and no matter how full I fill the tank I get a Cascade sound. Which is great if you ask me, but the wife and kids hate it.. I tell them" if you don't like it stay out of the fish room" Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 7/24/2005 5:51:57 PM US Eastern Standard Time, lnvtm1@... writes: I was going to rename it a HOE (hang on end) but decided to call it a HOS (hang on side) so I didn't sound like a rap song. :-D I got this HOS from the PetsMart.com clearance pages (1/2 priced) for under $15.00 (I think it was $13.40). I have a couple of different types of HOB's but this one has an airline attached to the impeller area and it injects air into the water stream going into the filter pads. It says this added O2 aids the bacteria in doing their job. It sounds like it should. Lenny Vasbinder [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13756	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: question about fish disapearing

If there are any carnivorous or omnivorous fish that are larger than the tetras, they will get eaten. We found that out the hard war with the neons we got when we first set the our tank up. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of camdogkingsfan Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 3:39 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] question about fish disapearing Hello all. Let me try and keep my story and question short. I have had a 25 gallon take for about 3 years. In there I have had a Pasco, black ghost knife, 4 black skirt tetras, 4 albno catfish, 2 clear looking catfish (sorry I can't remember the name of them right now),and 2 upside down catfish. Now before you get on my case about have that many fish I already know. Well I upgraded to bigger aquaruim about a month ago to a 48 gallon. I put all those fish in there along with 3 small fish. I can't remember the name of them right now. I know they are about an inch long and one is yellow, the other two where blue and gray. Very pretty. Well I noticed earlier this week. One of the small fish were gone. I saw the other two about 1:00 pm my time. Then I came home at 4:00 pm and the yellow was the only one left. Then on Friday I saw that one of my tetras fins looked missing or chewed up. I woke up Saturday and he was gone. This morning I saw one of the other tetras fins is kinda mussed up. Does anyone know what is going on? Is the Knife eating the fish? I feed my fish very well. I give them bottom feeding food and two Brine Shrimp cubes. Can anyone help? ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13757	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Snails

cold freshwater snail food? *grin* Sorry...couldn't resist ;-) If you put veggies in there, they will eat it...as well as most other things in the tank that the fish haven't eaten. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Robert Sent: Saturday, July 23, 2005 12:49 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Snails Can cold fresh water snails be fed anything? Robert ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13758	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: more on glofish

I think it's kinda neat though...genetics is a very fascinating subject a is genetic engineering. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 9:42 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] more on glofish This is relatively old news. I don't even see them around any more, though some one probably still sells them. Haven't even heard them mentioned in more than 6 months, probably closer to a year. As I recall, you do need a UV light to make them glow I believe they were developed in a search to find something that would detect certain types of pollutants in the water. Like painted fish or the parrot cichlids, I'd not purchase them. However, these fish were created by adding genes of another critter, I believe, for research, to which I do not have an objection. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 5:45 PM To: uniaquaria@yahoogroups.com; AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com; mnaquarium@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] more on glofish _GloFish (tm) - Welcome_ (http://www.glofish.com/default.asp) 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13759	From: wendie	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Betta nest/eggs - I think

Sounds like eggs especially if he's defending the nest. She should be removed immediately before he kills her. Also you need to get your food supply ready as they'll be ready to eat by Wednesday or Thursday. Wendie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of AQUARIUMFISH Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 10:33 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Betta nest/eggs - I think I think I have a pair of spawning or spawned bettas. It looks like to me in the past few hours that there are now eggs but I really dont know becuase I have never seen it .. Its a regular bubble nest but I noticed tonight that there are what looks like miniture cotton balls up in the nest. is this eggs or not ... and the female is still in there .. could they be finished ??? the male is defending the nest very well but I cant seem to get her out either so I dont know what to do. Inexperienced Egger lol Gen [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13760	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Fin and tail rot keeps getting worse with Maracyn and M2/ hospi

stop medicating...anitibiotics are not always the answer. concentrate on tank water quality. increase th eheat to 83-85 degrees and add strezz zyme everyother day for a week --- Emily Tenczar <bababanana@...> wrote: > Oh my gosh, guys I don't even know what to do > anymore. My 20 gal guppy/danio tank is infected with > fin and tail rot, which I've already tried treating > once with M2 and again with Maracyn, and again with > Maracyn a 2nd time. And of course weekly water > changes in the meantime, and at one point even more > frequently. But it is getting worse instead of > better, and one of the fish has lost almost its > entire tail. The last water check was okay. > > I'm ordering some tetracycline tablets online > because I haven't used that yet, but I really don't > even know what to do now. I've tried the jungle > anti-bacterial food even. > > That's not even the worst of it. The same problem is > going on in my 55 gal goldfish tank. Everyone is > okay except the oranda, who still isn't any better > after an M2 treatment, maracyn, and melafix. I'm > considering a hospital tank for that one with > tetracycline, but I don't have an empty established > tank. I could set up a small 3-gal tank with some > gravel from the old tank and a filter than hangs on > the side, then leave her in there for a week and > don't feed too much? > > I'm ready to pull my hair out. I can't add anything > to the aquariums that will harm the snails either. > Please does anyone have advice? > Emily > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13761	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: New Guy

test your NITRATES --- bennedh76 <bennedh76@...> wrote: > Hello, My name is Heeth I have just recently > purchased an aquarium. I > am just about to the point of pulling all my hair > out and smashing > the 55gal fish killing machine. I cannot figure it > out, I have tested > the; PH=7.5, Nitrites=0, Chloramine=0, Ammonia=0. > > So far I bought some gold fish to get the bacteria > up, got rid of > them and got some misc. community fish - Had a algae > bloom and most > everything died even the Placo the only thing that > survived was the > frog and the beta. So I cleaned and treated the > algae and cleaned it > up. Shortly after the beta and frog crossed over. So > I waited a > couple weeks treated the water for parasites and > algae tested all the > things that I listed in the beginning and those were > the results so I > figured that I was safe. Yesterday I went and bought > three Chichlids > and put them in, so far two have died and the third > is barely making > it. > > I did buy a couple little tiny baskets of sea shells > from Wal-Mart > boiled and cleaned them, put some glassware and > marbles in as well. > Also this tank had been previously owned but I did > clean it. > > I think that is about all as far as backgrounds go. > Can anyone HELP > or does anyone have any suggestions? > Thank you, and I am looking forward to being part of > the group. > Heeth > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13762	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Filter Media / Marine Tank

carbon is not typically used in saltwater as it pulls out the minerals such as calcium which are needed by the live rock and inverts. i use fluval biomax when adding something, but the only thing really needed are circulation pumps and a protein skimmer. the canniseter is nice but not needed --- krazeez22 <Seasons444@...> wrote: > I'm setting up my first tank, a 50 gal. marine fish > and invert tank > with 65 lbs live rock and 3.5" sand bed. I have a > Aqua C protein > skimmer, two powerheads and an Eheim 2080 canister > filter. My > question is, what type of filter media would you > suggest I add to the > Eheim canister filter? There's three compartments. > I'm just testing > out my tank for leaks with tap water and checking > systems out today > (the sand, live rock and fish and inverts not added > yet) so filters > are running. I had some mechanical and biological > media so I put in > the Eheim, but I'm wondering if this is incorrect. > Should I just go > with an activated carbon along with mechanical > media, or just carbon? > > > > > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13763	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: PimaFix/MelaFix

just a warning....observed results are far better than labels used to sell medications. alcohol and sedatives do nothing to me personally, bu may kill the next person. and btw fish do not die from a scrape caused by a rock, it was the combination of pima and mela fix that did them in. the customer was trying to quickly heal a scrape on a fish and heard melafix does that, but some guy told her that she needed pima fix too just in case, and the result was a tank full of dead fish instead of 1 scraped fish. this has been the case many times over. while i respect your medical knowledge, you are not correct in the cases i have observed. --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > Pharmacologically speaking, an antibacterial and an > antifungal are not > contraindicated. Antibacterial ointments are often > used with antifungal > treatments to prevent secondary infections. If the > fish died, it just means > that in those instances there was more there than > medicines could fix. If > you want to look at an example in humans...look at > the antibacterial > ointments. Most contain 3 different antibacterial > drugs and some even > contain a analgesic. Mixing drugs is pretty common. > HIV/AIDS drugs are > cocktails of different drugs as are many cancer > medication. Certain drugs > should not be mixed...mainly ones that would double > the effect of the other, > causing a harmful result, like drinking alcohol > while on sedatives. > > Eric...former army combat medical specialist. > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of paul helms > Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 2:47 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] PimaFix/MelaFix > > > i have several customers and freinds that have used > them separtately with great success, and also used > them together with absolutely 0 success. everyone > that i know that has tried hem together has lost > their > fish within 24 hours. they really do not mix well. > one is antifungal and one is anibacterial. i am > sure > that you have always heard that you should not mix > drugs, and if it is not safe for you, it probably > isn't for your fish either. > > --- Crazy4fids@... wrote: > > > > > In a message dated 7/24/2005 11:49:40 A.M. Central > > Standard Time, > > TheSydMonster@... writes: > > > > Hmmm.. it says on their web page and the > packaging > > that melafix and > > pimafix CAN be used together, that they are > > complementary. What > > happens when you put them together that is fatal > > and why would the > > manufacturer recommend it, then? > > > > > > > > > > It also warns on the bottle that this product has > > been know to cause cancer > > in the state of California. I wonder what part of > > the ingredients they are > > referring to? I use melaleuca product all the > time. > > > > Linda > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when > replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the > web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13764	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: PimaFix/MelaFix

it was just advice based on experience, not law...i said can be fatal not will absolutely kill your fish. --- thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@...> wrote: > It does seem to me they would compliment one > another. > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" > <woad@w...> wrote: > > Pharmacologically speaking, an antibacterial and > an antifungal are > not > > contraindicated. Antibacterial ointments are > often used with > antifungal > > treatments to prevent secondary infections. If > the fish died, it > just means > > that in those instances there was more there than > medicines could > fix. If > > you want to look at an example in humans...look at > the > antibacterial > > ointments. Most contain 3 different antibacterial > drugs and some > even > > contain a analgesic. Mixing drugs is pretty > common. HIV/AIDS > drugs are > > cocktails of different drugs as are many cancer > medication. > Certain drugs > > should not be mixed...mainly ones that would > double the effect of > the other, > > causing a harmful result, like drinking alcohol > while on sedatives. > > > > Eric...former army combat medical specialist. > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of paul helms > > Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 2:47 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] PimaFix/MelaFix > > > > > > i have several customers and freinds that have > used > > them separtately with great success, and also used > > them together with absolutely 0 success. everyone > > that i know that has tried hem together has lost > their > > fish within 24 hours. they really do not mix > well. > > one is antifungal and one is anibacterial. i am > sure > > that you have always heard that you should not mix > > drugs, and if it is not safe for you, it probably > > isn't for your fish either. > > > > --- Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > > > > > > > > In a message dated 7/24/2005 11:49:40 A.M. > Central > > > Standard Time, > > > TheSydMonster@c... writes: > > > > > > Hmmm.. it says on their web page and the > packaging > > > that melafix and > > > pimafix CAN be used together, that they are > > > complementary. What > > > happens when you put them together that is > fatal > > > and why would the > > > manufacturer recommend it, then? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It also warns on the bottle that this product > has > > > been know to cause cancer > > > in the state of California. I wonder what part > of > > > the ingredients they are > > > referring to? I use melaleuca product all the > time. > > > > > > Linda > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > protection around > > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > when replying, > thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT > important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the > original message MODIFY > the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on > the web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email > to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of > Service > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13765	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium lighting

radioshack fans work a bit better as they are designe dto be plugged in to the wall. the computer fans only use 5 volts. --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > yep...you can use computer fans if you put them in a > hood to keep things > cool. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... > Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 1:50 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] aquarium lighting > > > > In a message dated 7/24/2005 1:17:48 P.M. Central > Standard Time, > woad@... writes: > > You could also > email fishman911 and he may still have the manual or > at least have info on > the specs. > > > > These systems are brand new, still in the box! I am > concerned that the > larger lights will add more heat. I have seen the > Orbit ones for (I think > its) > 95 watt bulbs. They have more/larger fans. > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> > 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when > replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , > .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> > 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the > web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13766	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: question about fish disapearing

sounds like you put african cichlids in with tetras and they are doing what they do! --- camdogkingsfan <camdog@...> wrote: > Hello all. Let me try and keep my story and > question short. I have > had a 25 gallon take for about 3 years. In there I > have had a Pasco, > black ghost knife, 4 black skirt tetras, 4 albno > catfish, 2 clear > looking catfish (sorry I can't remember the name of > them right > now),and 2 upside down catfish. Now before you get > on my case about > have that many fish I already know. Well I upgraded > to bigger > aquaruim about a month ago to a 48 gallon. I put > all those fish in > there along with 3 small fish. I can't remember the > name of them > right now. I know they are about an inch long and > one is yellow, the > other two where blue and gray. Very pretty. Well I > noticed earlier > this week. One of the small fish were gone. I saw > the other two > about 1:00 pm my time. Then I came home at 4:00 pm > and the yellow > was > the only one left. Then on Friday I saw that one of > my tetras fins > looked missing or chewed up. I woke up Saturday and > he was gone. > This morning I saw one of the other tetras fins is > kinda mussed up. > Does anyone know what is going on? Is the Knife > eating the fish? I > feed my fish very well. I give them bottom feeding > food and two > Brine > Shrimp cubes. Can anyone help? > > > > > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13767	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Me and My Cuties....

are you talking about fresh or saltwater? if it is salt, macro algae is used as a natural filter dfor the aquarium. if you are talking about fresh water we use plants for the same reason, and avaoid algae --- komal trehan <komal_thegirl@...> wrote: > Hey > > I m an Indian girl.I have 1 n a half meter,width > wise n 1 meter in > height wise,long aquarium.I have 2 black n 2 white > Sharks,approx 12 inches > long fishes n there r some other fishes too like 4 > Sucker Fishes n there > r 2 more different fishes r there but i don't know > there names. > When i was 7,my father bought aquarium n many > different kind of Fishes > along with.At that times i had 6 Sharks, 4 Black n 2 > White,each were 3 > inches long. > > Now after 11 years, my Sharks r 12 inches long.In > the middle of the > years i also have bought 2 baby turtles abt 2 an a > half inches n they r at > present with me.They r very cute.My fish's seller > told me when i bought > turtles, that i have to tak them out from the > aquarium at least 2 hours > a day.That's y i sets them free for,sometimes 1 n a > half or 2 or may b 3 > hours in my room.Sometimes my one the turtle go > crazy n tried to cut > me,when i put in finder in front of them,even > sometimes i saw that they > both were fighting in the aquarium but suddenly when > any1 of them c me, > they stops fighting n comes on the top of the > aquarium n always give a > hungry expression.I love them both,they r life.They > r so sweet that even > i take them out when i goes to my Institute. > > Well,i have read all ur mails n find out that some > of u have grown up > algae n stuff like that.Can any1 could tell me that > y u all people grow > algae in ur water tanks. > As i told u that my family is maintaining an > aquarium for 11 years n > till now i never felt that there is any need of > algae n stuff like that, in > the same even i also have never heard abt growning > algae n stuff like > that, in the same. > Plz do tell me..... > Thanx 4 ur Precious Time > > > God Bless All..... > Tak Care............ > Bye Bye............ > > > > > "Eshali" > > > --------------------------------- > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13768	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: PimaFix/MelaFix

Yeah, might seem they would. Too bad they don't. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > It does seem to me they would compliment one another. > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > > Pharmacologically speaking, an antibacterial and an antifungal are > not > > contraindicated. Antibacterial ointments are often used with > antifungal > > treatments to prevent secondary infections. If the fish died, it > just means > > that in those instances there was more there than medicines could > fix. If > > you want to look at an example in humans...look at the > antibacterial > > ointments. Most contain 3 different antibacterial drugs and some > even > > contain a analgesic. Mixing drugs is pretty common. HIV/AIDS > drugs are > > cocktails of different drugs as are many cancer medication. > Certain drugs > > should not be mixed...mainly ones that would double the effect of > the other, > > causing a harmful result, like drinking alcohol while on sedatives. > > > > Eric...former army combat medical specialist. > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of paul helms > > Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 2:47 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] PimaFix/MelaFix > > > > > > i have several customers and freinds that have used > > them separtately with great success, and also used > > them together with absolutely 0 success. everyone > > that i know that has tried hem together has lost their > > fish within 24 hours. they really do not mix well. > > one is antifungal and one is anibacterial. i am sure > > that you have always heard that you should not mix > > drugs, and if it is not safe for you, it probably > > isn't for your fish either. > > > > --- Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > > > > > > > > In a message dated 7/24/2005 11:49:40 A.M. Central > > > Standard Time, > > > TheSydMonster@c... writes: > > > > > > Hmmm.. it says on their web page and the packaging > > > that melafix and > > > pimafix CAN be used together, that they are > > > complementary. What > > > happens when you put them together that is fatal > > > and why would the > > > manufacturer recommend it, then? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It also warns on the bottle that this product has > > > been know to cause cancer > > > in the state of California. I wonder what part of > > > the ingredients they are > > > referring to? I use melaleuca product all the time. > > > > > > Linda > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13769	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: WAS (Power outages) Chicago Aquarium Clubs

Someone Suggested: Greenwater Aquarist Society of Chicagoland c/o Dick Jarvis 20033 S Rosewood Frankfurt, IL 60423 Email: GWASOC(AT)crosswinds.net Websight: GWASOC if link don't show http://www.gwasoc.crosswinds.net/ They meet First Friday of every month at the Alsip Village Hall in Alsip, IL I do believe thats West of Chicago on the southside. In a message dated 7/24/2005 4:03:11 PM US Eastern Standard Time, woad@... writes: I am in Naperville which is abut 40 miles west of the Chicago city limits. Eric Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13770	From: kb1dva	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: tank stands

I had been thinking that a stand would be good; something like Lenny's building only with wheels and a lip for the tank so it couldn't slide. Lenny are you putting doors on the stand, it would look nice and keep equipment out of sight Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13771	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: more on glofish

I've never seen them offered for sale before. I've been out of the hobby for a decade though.. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13772	From: Robert Hickey	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Cascade 1000 filter

Hi all Just got My new 260 litre and set it up yesterday, I also got a cascade 1000 filter it handle up to 400 litre`s so it may be over kill but heh if Im going to do this tank right I may as well get a good filter, After setting it up and turning it on I realised how powerfull it is And creates a current in the Water thats a bit to Much., As at Some point I plan on discus and I need a much slower current in the Water, I have tryed the drip extension to no avail and the standard output genarated a heavy current, what can I do? Do pennplax have other extensions for the Filter ? Anyone come accross this before? or any experience of this kinda thing? Thanks All Irish Rob Regards Robert Hickey Robert Hickey | Networks Engineer Citywest Business Park | BT | Tel: +353 (0)1 43258749 | Mob: +353 (0)86 8061840 | E: robert.hickey@... | www.btireland.ie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13773	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Betta nest/eggs - I think

Sounds about right. My female didn't come out for some time, the eggs were nearly hatched by the time she lost interest and swam away from the nest.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13774	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: zeolite

Ray, I said or intended to say the second and third lines of my last post I didn't say my first post, sorry for the confusion, anyway I think you should have the gist of my original reason for posting by know?. regards, unclenorm. --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote: > Unclenorm, WWHHOOOOAAA!!! Hold on there -- I never > said that > nitrite, nitrate, phosphates and silicates are not > aquarium related. > Such a statement is totally absurd and I don't know > how you came to > that conclusion. I'm finding that I'm the one who > is puzzled, to say > the least, and I don't understand where you got that > from. You ask > me to "read the 2nd and 3rd lines of my (your) post, > are they not > aquarium related??". The 2nd and 3rd lines of your > (original) post > direct me to the Zeolite Group of Minerals site (<< > mineral.galleries.com/minerals/silicate/zeolites.htm > >>). My answer > is definitely NO. When was the last time you used > Analcime, > Chabazite, Ferrierite, Gmelinite, Phillipsite, > Paranatrolite or > Thomsonite (the zeolites found at your suggested > link)in any of your > aquariums? I know I've never used any of them, nor > have I ever > before heard of them -- I certainly wouldn't > consider them "aquarium > related" by any stretch of the imagination. > > \ > > Glad to hear RowaPhos has a USA company; hopefully > it will become > more popular. As I said, none of my wholesale > suppliers handle it, > nor do any of my retail (lfs) customers. I don't > know how much in > demand it will be; hopefully it will catch on. I > believe the product > may be a zeolite -- it consists of granular Ferric > Hydroxide. > \ > > The freeze-dried bacteria product I believe is > simply called > Phosphate Remover and is manufactured by Acquamarine > (Yes, with > a "c"). Their website is << > www.northcoastmarines.com/bact.htm >>. > Regards, Ray > > \ > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. > Hampson." > <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > Hi Ray, > > I'm somewhat puzzled as to why you claim > that > > nitrite, nitrate, phosphates and silicates are not > > aquarium related 'the answer is "NO" '!! you will > be > > hard pushed to find an established aquarium that > does > > not contain all four to some extent . > availability > > of Rowaphos in the USA there are quite a number > of US > > on line suppliers listing it for sale, the > Rowaphos > > manufacturer 'ROWA' has a USA Co. I would add that > I'm > > not sure that Rowaphos is a Zeolite. Could you > tell me > > the name of the freeze-dried bacteria product that > you > > refer to I would like to know more about that. > > regards, > > unclenorm. > > > > > > --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@wmconUnclenorm > wrote: > > > > > Unclenorm, In re-reading the 2nd and 3rd lines > of > > > your original post > > > (the main topic of discussion here and now), I > would > > > have to say the > > > answer is "NO", they are not aquarium related. > That > > > is just my > > > point. While I certainly agree, as you've been > so > > > kind as to point > > > out, that there are Zeolite products to remove > > > almost anything, these > > > products are not used in the aquarium hobby -- > at > > > least not on this > > > side of the Pond. Okay, just NOW, came back > from > > > going up to sites > > > referring to Rowaphos. This product is made in > > > Germany (for removing > > > phosphate) but is not yet found in the States > (at > > > least my wholesale > > > suppliers do not handle it yet). We have a > > > freeze-dried bacteria > > > product here for removing phosphates. I'm > beginning > > > to see where the > > > discrepancies are coming from. Regards, Ray > > > > > > > \ > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. > > > Hampson." > > > <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > > > Ray, > > > > Read the 2nd and 3rd lines of my post, > are > > > they not aquarium > > > related ??. If you read all of the link you now > know > > > that there is a > > > Zeolite product to remove almost anything!, not > > > being from your side > > > of the pond I can't quote you trade names, but > > > remember the aquarium > > > hobby is a very insignificant outlet for this > type > > > of product, I'm > > > not toRawfossut how about Rawfoss (may be spelt > > > wrong) removes > > > phosphates. > > > > regards, > > > > unclenorm. > >\ > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. > S. > > > Hampson." > > > > > <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > > > > > Hi Lenny, > > > > > > Your post may or may not be true, > it > > > depends > > > > > > on what form of Zeolite is being used and > for > > > what > > > > > > purpose. The word Zeolite refers to a > large > > > group > > > > > > minerals with manymineral.galleries.com- > > > > > > > > > > > > http:/mineral.galleries.comzeolites.htmilicate/zeolites.htm > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > unclenorm. > > > > > ___________________________________________________________________ > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > > > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC > calling worldwide > with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com > > > ___________________________________________________________ How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13775	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: PimaFix/MelaFix

But then here in California, the Air and water can give you cancer. (when I lived in San Bernardino, there was actually an advisory to not let infants and the elderly drink the tap water. Dunno if its still in effect.) Maybe they use our tap water as part of their mixture. lol ----- Original Message ----- From: <Crazy4fids@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 11:52 AM Subject: [AquaticLife] PimaFix/MelaFix In a message dated 7/24/2005 11:49:40 A.M. Central Standard Time, TheSydMonster@... writes: Hmmm.. it says on their web page and the packaging that melafix and pimafix CAN be used together, that they are complementary. What happens when you put them together that is fatal and why would the manufacturer recommend it, then? It also warns on the bottle that this product has been know to cause cancer in the state of California. I wonder what part of the ingredients they are referring to? I use melaleuca product all the time. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13776	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium lighting

I am going to be using a power supply from a computer as I am also going to be using cold cathode tubes (used for lighting effects on computer cases) for moonlighting... Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of paul helms Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 5:47 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] aquarium lighting radioshack fans work a bit better as they are designe dto be plugged in to the wall. the computer fans only use 5 volts. --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > yep...you can use computer fans if you put them in a > hood to keep things > cool. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... > Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 1:50 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] aquarium lighting > > > > In a message dated 7/24/2005 1:17:48 P.M. Central > Standard Time, > woad@... writes: > > You could also > email fishman911 and he may still have the manual or > at least have info on > the specs. > > > > These systems are brand new, still in the box! I am > concerned that the > larger lights will add more heat. I have seen the > Orbit ones for (I think > its) > 95 watt bulbs. They have more/larger fans. > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> > 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when > replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , > .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> > 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the > web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13777	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: WAS (Power outages) Chicago Aquarium Clubs

that's very south...not west...but still close enough...thanks! BTW...the contact you gave for the Chicago Aquarist Society is not valid :-( Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of FortWayneFish@... Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 6:30 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] WAS (Power outages) Chicago Aquarium Clubs Someone Suggested: Greenwater Aquarist Society of Chicagoland c/o Dick Jarvis 20033 S Rosewood Frankfurt, IL 60423 Email: GWASOC(AT)crosswinds.net Websight: GWASOC if link don't show http://www.gwasoc.crosswinds.net/ They meet First Friday of every month at the Alsip Village Hall in Alsip, IL I do believe thats West of Chicago on the southside. In a message dated 7/24/2005 4:03:11 PM US Eastern Standard Time, woad@... writes: I am in Naperville which is abut 40 miles west of the Chicago city limits. Eric Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13778	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Fin and tail rot keeps getting worse with Maracyn and M2/ hospi

what should i do about the goldfish? it cant take the warm water Emily paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: stop medicating...anitibiotics are not always the answer. concentrate on tank water quality. increase th eheat to 83-85 degrees and add strezz zyme everyother day for a week --- Emily Tenczar wrote: > Oh my gosh, guys I don't even know what to do > anymore. My 20 gal guppy/danio tank is infected with > fin and tail rot, which I've already tried treating > once with M2 and again with Maracyn, and again with > Maracyn a 2nd time. And of course weekly water > changes in the meantime, and at one point even more > frequently. But it is getting worse instead of > better, and one of the fish has lost almost its > entire tail. The last water check was okay. > > I'm ordering some tetracycline tablets online > because I haven't used that yet, but I really don't > even know what to do now. I've tried the jungle > anti-bacterial food even. > > That's not even the worst of it. The same problem is > going on in my 55 gal goldfish tank. Everyone is > okay except the oranda, who still isn't any better > after an M2 treatment, maracyn, and melafix. I'm > considering a hospital tank for that one with > tetracycline, but I don't have an empty established > tank. I could set up a small 3-gal tank with some > gravel from the old tank and a filter than hangs on > the side, then leave her in there for a week and > don't feed too much? > > I'm ready to pull my hair out. I can't add anything > to the aquariums that will harm the snails either. > Please does anyone have advice? > Emily > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13779	From: bunnycareshi	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Seaweed as food & correct temp for clowns

Aloha Thanks so much to Rob for your info. This is all new to me and it gets confusing because there are so many opinions on correct care. But when the former owner said I was sure to get ick if I reduced the water temp I got concerned. I'm curious what it is that *would* bring on ick. Also, I notice that, at night it seems, one of the clowns does this thing where he points his head up like a rocket-ship and stays in that position, right near the glass. Is there some reason for that? That's what the other 2 clowns did b/4 they died (this was b/4 I got the bubble stones and power filter) and they did this exclusively right up against the tube from the undergravel filter. When this guy does it, it's just at the seam at the front of the tank, but I keep wondering what it means. Having not owned anything but a goldfish when I was a little kid, I'm just now learning that fish have behaviors w/meaning, just as other pets do. Re your info on clipping the seaweed to tank - I was warned about over-feeding, which is why I wondered about amount of seaweed to feed. I thought it was necessary to cut it in little pieces. If I were to put a small sheet of it in tank, that would not be overfeeding? Considering I just give a large pinch of flakes 2x/day, I still don't know how to gauge what overfeeding is. Newbie Cinde in Hawaii --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, FortWayneFish@a... wrote: > Cinde, > experiemnt with it.. Yaki Nor or seaweed comes in a few forms. > > I know of people who attach it in the tank with a seaweed clip/ lettuce clip > the clips can be found at most Fish or pet stores for around a dollar each.. > > > I have 5 Clown Loaches over 5 inches in a tank with the water temp of 74*F > And they have been fine for over 4 years. > > rob > Indiana >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13780	From: japanesegorilla05	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Safe to use a heater?

Hi all, I just bought an used aquarium with misc. accessories. It was quite a deal; everything works great thus far. The only concern that I have is for the heater. It appears to have water in it, and looks rather discolored and corroded. Is this alright, or should I just toss it? Thanks, Jay

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13781	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: glowlight danios

unfortunately these are illegal in california, not sure about other states, but definitely illegal here. --- Crazy4fids@... wrote: > Check these out! > _Practical Fishkeeping magazine | The GloFish_ > (http://www.practicalfishkeeping.co.uk/pfk/pages/show_article.php?article_id=119) > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13782	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: tank stands

What size tank do you have or are you planning? Be very careful about using wheels since it would de-stabilize the stand and possibly your floor if not on a cement slab. A tank weighs around 10 pounds per gallon. You might be able to find some pre-fabbed rolling bases that would hold the weight but I'm not positive. Check the weight load specifications on anything you decide and then double or triple it for safety. Also, you would be putting a lot more pounds per square inch on the wheels, where my frame spreads the 700 pounds over 211.5" of base framing so it's only 3.3 pounds per square inch. If you only used 4 or 6 wheels, the weight would be over 100 pounds per square inch with 6 wheels... if each wheel had a square inch of surface contact. HUGE DIFFERENCE. I live in a 2nd floor condo but the floors are 3" cement slabs over wood framing. I still put the tank adjacent to a load bearing wall just to be safe and spread the weight over four different 2x8 floor/ceiling joists, all supported by the load bearing wall. I do not have any leaning away from the wall problems so I think I did my homework properly. I will definitely put up doors and sides but I am still deciding on the aesthetics. One option is to use a nice real wood paneling and cover the 2x4's on the sides and make doors for the front. My other option that I am leaning towards is to cut 3/4" or 1/2" thick 5"-6" wide boards to fill in the "gaps" between the 2x4's on the sides and make matching doors for the front. If I go with the paneling option, then I will have to use some corner molding and base molding but that will also match the molding for top of the stand to cover the black aquarium frame. If I go with a 5" board, I'll just use them to cover the top 2x4's on the front and sides and they will also cover the black frame. It really depends on how I design the hood... then things will fall into place as to the rest of the stand. I haven't decided if I will go horizontal or vertical with these boards. If I go vertical, then I will make a 6" top shelf and a lipped bottom shelf on the insides of the doors... to hold the door pieces together and also serve as shelves to do testing, feeding, etc., and to hold the smaller bottles/canisters. I'll still add these if I go horizontal but they would serve two purposes if I go vertical... as the braces to hold the four 6" wide boards and as the shelves themselves. I am also going to add a middle shelf inside the cabinet, on one side and keep the other side big for any bigger items I may want to store in there... like my 10G Q-tank, until needed. The top "lip" or trim which is there to block the black aquarium frame will not do anything to prevent your tank from sliding. A 65G tank weighs around 700 pounds so if it decides to slide, there is no small trim piece that will stop it. LOL Once I decide on the aesthetic finish for my tank and work up the hood design, I'll be adding the "trim" pieces to cover the black aquarium frame. In case any one wants to see the tank and DIY stand, here is my photo album and I'll be uploading some pictures of the 90% stocked/finished tank. I still need to get a few more plants and clip down the 24" bubble wand and air line. I still need to get a full size lighting/hood but I'm still researching them. I'll probably go with a 48" fluorescent "Shop" light from Home Depot or Lowes and incorporate that into my DIY Hood. The 48" "Shop" light fixture and bulbs only cost around $15.00. For the next week or so, they'll have to do with the 24" hood that I took off of my 10G Q-tank that is empty. Time to get back to work to pay for all of this. :-D Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: 11 Date: Mon, 25 Jul 2005 07:29:30 -0400 From: "kb1dva" <vze3pd7a@...> Subject: tank stands I had been thinking that a stand would be good; something like Lenny's building only with wheels and a lip for the tank so it couldn't slide. Lenny are you putting doors on the stand, it would look nice and keep equipment out of sight Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13783	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: tank stands

You mention "leaning away from the wall problems..." My tank leans a bit outward. I moved it away from the carpet strip as suggeted but once I filled it up, the water is not level. Can this eventually cause a problem? Leslie

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13784	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater?

I'd toss it and get a new one. I have a feeling that if you fire it up you are going to shock yourself or your fish... Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of japanesegorilla05 Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 2:37 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? Hi all, I just bought an used aquarium with misc. accessories. It was quite a deal; everything works great thus far. The only concern that I have is for the heater. It appears to have water in it, and looks rather discolored and corroded. Is this alright, or should I just toss it? Thanks, Jay ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13785	From: Evita	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater?

I would say better safe than sorry....I would toss it. Replacing it wouldn't cost as much as electric shock would. No joke. I would just buy a new one with all the money you saved on the great deal. Evita japanesegorilla05 <japanesegorilla05@...> wrote:Hi all, I just bought an used aquarium with misc. accessories. It was quite a deal; everything works great thus far. The only concern that I have is for the heater. It appears to have water in it, and looks rather discolored and corroded. Is this alright, or should I just toss it? Thanks, Jay ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13786	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Seaweed as food & correct temp for clowns

well the key to feeding can be debated for ever on here. But generally feed what your fish can eat in 2 minutes. There stomaches are about the size of there eye ball so its easy to over feed. I usually feed 1x a day and skip at least 1 day a week. Fish can go upwards of a week or two without food. If they are in good health and condition. If you feed the seaweed with a clip don't feed anything else. Remove after 12 hours or if you notice the water conditions deteriating. After a couple times feeding you should be able to Judge how much to feed them. Trial and error in small amounts.. Clown Loaches are intresting fish. You'll notice them falling asleep in many many positions. Sometimes they look dead, and when you go to net them they scamper away. rob indiana In a message dated 7/25/2005 2:35:19 PM US Eastern Standard Time, bunnycareshi@... writes: Thanks so much to Rob for your info. This is all new to me and it gets confusing because there are so many opinions on correct care. But when the former owner said I was sure to get ick if I reduced the water temp I got concerned. I'm curious what it is that *would* bring on ick. Also, I notice that, at night it seems, one of the clowns does this thing where he points his head up like a rocket-ship and stays in that position, right near the glass. Is there some reason for that? That's what the other 2 clowns did b/4 they died (this was b/4 I got the bubble stones and power filter) and they did this exclusively right up against the tube from the undergravel filter. When this guy does it, it's just at the seam at the front of the tank, but I keep wondering what it means. Having not owned anything but a goldfish when I was a little kid, I'm just now learning that fish have behaviors w/meaning, just as other pets do. Re your info on clipping the seaweed to tank - I was warned about over-feeding, which is why I wondered about amount of seaweed to feed. I thought it was necessary to cut it in little pieces. If I were to put a small sheet of it in tank, that would not be overfeeding? Considering I just give a large pinch of flakes 2x/day, I still don't know how to gauge what overfeeding is. Newbie Cinde in Hawaii Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13787	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater?

I agree Toss it and get a new one. A heater costs next to nothing these days... rob Indiana In a message dated 7/25/2005 3:41:39 PM US Eastern Standard Time, woad@... writes: Hi all, I just bought an used aquarium with misc. accessories. It was quite a deal; everything works great thus far. The only concern that I have is for the heater. It appears to have water in it, and looks rather discolored and corroded. Is this alright, or should I just toss it? Thanks, Jay Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13788	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: New Guy

Keeth, Before you beat yourself up anymore, or smash the tank, Let me know if this used tank was previously used for reptiles (or mammals). If you don't know, try to find out. Reptile tanks cannot be used for fish afterwards, The strong undiluted urine from reptiles (and mammals) permeates the silicone sealant (much as malachite green does when using some Ich cures) and comes back out into solution when you fill the tank with water. It will kill the fish everytime. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "bennedh76" <bennedh76@y...> wrote: > Hello, My name is Heeth I have just recently purchased an aquarium. I > am just about to the point of pulling all my hair out and smashing > the 55gal fish killing machine. I cannot figure it out, I have tested > the; PH=7.5, Nitrites=0, Chloramine=0, Ammonia=0. > > So far I bought some gold fish to get the bacteria up, got rid of > them and got some misc. community fish - Had a algae bloom and most > everything died even the Placo the only thing that survived was the > frog and the beta. So I cleaned and treated the algae and cleaned it > up. Shortly after the beta and frog crossed over. So I waited a > couple weeks treated the water for parasites and algae tested all the > things that I listed in the beginning and those were the results so I > figured that I was safe. Yesterday I went and bought three Chichlids > and put them in, so far two have died and the third is barely making > it. > > I did buy a couple little tiny baskets of sea shells from Wal-Mart > boiled and cleaned them, put some glassware and marbles in as well. > Also this tank had been previously owned but I did clean it. > > I think that is about all as far as backgrounds go. Can anyone HELP > or does anyone have any suggestions? > Thank you, and I am looking forward to being part of the group. > Heeth

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13789	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: New Guy

Sorry, meant to write Heeth, but my fingers got crossed (lol). Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > Keeth, Before you beat yourself up anymore, or smash the tank, Let > me know if this used tank was previously used for reptiles (or > mammals). If you don't know, try to find out. Reptile tanks cannot > be used for fish afterwards, The strong undiluted urine from reptiles > (and mammals) permeates the silicone sealant (much as malachite green > does when using some Ich cures) and comes back out into solution when > you fill the tank with water. It will kill the fish everytime. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "bennedh76" <bennedh76@y...> > wrote: > > Hello, My name is Heeth I have just recently purchased an aquarium. > I > > am just about to the point of pulling all my hair out and smashing > > the 55gal fish killing machine. I cannot figure it out, I have > tested > > the; PH=7.5, Nitrites=0, Chloramine=0, Ammonia=0. > > > > So far I bought some gold fish to get the bacteria up, got rid of > > them and got some misc. community fish - Had a algae bloom and most > > everything died even the Placo the only thing that survived was the > > frog and the beta. So I cleaned and treated the algae and cleaned > it > > up. Shortly after the beta and frog crossed over. So I waited a > > couple weeks treated the water for parasites and algae tested all > the > > things that I listed in the beginning and those were the results so > I > > figured that I was safe. Yesterday I went and bought three > Chichlids > > and put them in, so far two have died and the third is barely > making > > it. > > > > I did buy a couple little tiny baskets of sea shells from Wal- Mart > > boiled and cleaned them, put some glassware and marbles in as well. > > Also this tank had been previously owned but I did clean it. > > > > I think that is about all as far as backgrounds go. Can anyone HELP > > or does anyone have any suggestions? > > Thank you, and I am looking forward to being part of the group. > > Heeth

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13790	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater?

Jay, Do not under any circumstances plug this heater in. However, there are some better aquarium heaters on the market such as Supreme Heetmasters (by Eugene Danner Co.) in which all the parts are easily replaced. You should be able to see the two coated (insulated) heating element wires (if the water inside is not too murky) leading from the ceramic heating block at the bottom to the condensor and thermostat. If those connections look like long brass pins, they can be slid out (no tools required) and a new heating element (which it needs) can be installed and as such it would in that case be a Supreme. The Condensor would be encased in a clear plastic cylinder sealed top and bottom. If this is what you have its well worth fixing at a fraction of the cost of a new one and perfectly safe to do. You lfs would probably do this for you if its a mom and pop store. If that's not the design, toss it -- its not worth fooling around with otherwise. Ray \ -- - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "japanesegorilla05" <japanesegorilla05@y...> wrote: > Hi all, I just bought an used aquarium with misc. accessories. It was > quite a deal; everything works great thus far. The only concern that I > have is for the heater. It appears to have water in it, and looks > rather discolored and corroded. Is this alright, or should I just toss > it? > > Thanks, > Jay

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13791	From: Tom Ray	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: UPDATE...re: Fish for more acidic water

Quick Update... 1) I found where one of the Chocolate Gourami species are found in the same waters as these wild-form Betta (B. foerschi). ...So I added my trio. They seem to be getting along wonderfully. I am wondering whether I can add 2-4 more in this size tank at some point in the future. Anyone know? or opine one way of another? 2) I also have a (now) lonely-heart Pygmy Gourami I might add to "the mix." Again, anyone have an opinion one way or another? 3) I added the White Clouds that I had thanks to your^all's advice. Awesome, inexpensive beauty. I'd like to complement them with possibly some kind of killifish. Maybe a larger Rivulus? ...or Aphyosemion? Any ideas? 4) Taking a completely different tack... As a bigger, rounder "dither" fish, I've had thoughts about "placid," "non-digging" So. American cichlids like: - Key Hole (maybe: too big for tank or other species? ...will their "irridescence" be visible in peat water?) (positive: no digging of substrate) - Some kind of Laetracara (maybe: too agressive when spawning? solution: keep only males? Does this work? ...which species will color up nicest in tank?) (positive: no digging of substrate) - One of the Nannacara (maybe: do color-region variations require in person choosing? ...too agressive when spawning? solution: same a Laetracara sp? ...will their "irridescence" be visible in peat water? ...cannot find any mention of whether they dig.) Once again... Anyone know? or opine one way of another? 5) Finally, as for Rasbora/Danio/Barb, thanks for the advice on 'em. A spotted R. (looks like a larger of R. maculata), it appears, is also available in the same waters. BUT I am almost afraid that would be too much red. I saw some yellow-lined (purported) Danio about the size of Neon Tetra / smaller than a Cherry Barb in an LFS, but without a name or price as yet. I wonder what kind and size they get? Again, Thanks so far and... I'm still open to your thoughts and opinions. TIA, --TommyBoy --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Tom Ray" <t_a_ray_cissp@y...> wrote: > ...Now I am trying stock it. > > Also, if you know of other fish that you think particularly go with > this color scheme (other than/NOT loaches and NOT cory cats), please > let me know.* For sizing, the tank is 24Lx18Wx20H" @37 gal.. > > TIA, > --TommyBoy > > *NOTE: Cardinals and Neon Tetras, and other fish with "blue reds" > would be examples of fish that DO NOT go with this color scheme. This > would preclude most/all So. American Tetras. Would African Tetras or > Killies work color-wise? Would So. American Killies?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13792	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water

Do not believe everything that you read! Do you REALLY KNOW for sure whether or not Melafix and Pimafix can be mixed? If not, please do not recommend such a thing to other newer Forum members who may not know better. Paul is 100% correct on this one. I too have seen and learned of many cases of hobbyists I know mixing these two "medications" together and wiping out their tanks. Most of these tanks were well established over many years with one fish having a scrape or slight sore with all the other fish being healthy, as in cases that Paul has seen. By themselves, these remedies are great, so I am not trying to bash them. I am not a chemist, so I cannot tell you what happens when you put them together, only that it kills fish. Can't say why the manufacturer would recommend it -- I would hope it wouldn't just be to increase sales, but it would seem obvious they may not have really tried mixing these two meds as a test in a healthy fish-populated aquarium or I'm sure they would have found it to be detrimental. My gut feeling is that there may be other unseen factors involved when mixing these two, such as maybe the water was below a certain pH (6.6? for instance), or the water was high in magnesium or any number of things in these aquariums which were not ordinarily unsafe nor uncommon as all the aquariums involved must have had similar parameters, but were fatal when these TWO meds were introduced to the tank together. Maybe when mixing them, you can add no more than half strength of each one to get a total treatment -- that I couldn't tell you, but I can tell you mixing them can be fatal, even if not all the time. Although I haven't heard of any successful mixed treatments. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > Hmmm.. it says on their web page and the packaging that melafix and > pimafix CAN be used together, that they are complementary. What > happens when you put them together that is fatal and why would the > manufacturer recommend it, then? > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms <wtfmorlok@y...> > wrote: > > they should not be used together, and can have fatal > > results when mixed at the same time. alone they are > > safe...together not so much > > > > --- thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > > > > Have you started treating your tank with anything? > > > I believe certain > > > medications, such as melafix and pimafix -- which > > > can be used > > > together, by the way -- cause foam to appear. Sorry > > > to not be of more > > > help. > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie > > > Moore" > > > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > > > My water has developed a foam type around the > > > edges as well as a few > > > > spots of randome floating clumps. The foam is all > > > along the edge of > > > the > > > > tank as well as the filter, spray wand, etc... > > > > All the tests are fine. No ammonia, nitrites or > > > high nitrates. > > > > > > > > I read a post a while back where someone else had > > > some "foam" but I > > > > can't remember which group or what the outcome > > > was. > > > > > > > > any ideas? > > > > > > > > Leslie > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > > http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13793	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water

Ray, i looked up the pimafix website, and it does not say that they should be used together at all, it says that they are designed to work "synergistically", which just means to greater effect. this may only be useful as dip, there is no information listed. the use of this language very clearly states to me that it is a write up by a marketing team, not researchers. if one takes the time to read the full statement on the site, it states very clearly that they can be used togther in EXTREME cases, not everyday use. in addition, i know that we have had some "medical" responses, but these are not "medications" but rather tea tree and bay tree extracts, not true antibiotics or anti fungals meaning not engineered to be used in this way. they may function well in the application, but this is hollistic not pharmaceutical. --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote: > Do not believe everything that you read! Do you > REALLY KNOW for sure > whether or not Melafix and Pimafix can be mixed? If > not, please do > not recommend such a thing to other newer Forum > members who may not > know better. Paul is 100% correct on this one. I > too have seen and > learned of many cases of hobbyists I know mixing > these > two "medications" together and wiping out their > tanks. Most of these > tanks were well established over many years with one > fish having a > scrape or slight sore with all the other fish being > healthy, as in > cases that Paul has seen. By themselves, these > remedies are great, > so I am not trying to bash them. I am not a > chemist, so I cannot > tell you what happens when you put them together, > only that it kills > fish. Can't say why the manufacturer would > recommend it -- I would > hope it wouldn't just be to increase sales, but it > would seem obvious > they may not have really tried mixing these two meds > as a test in a > healthy fish-populated aquarium or I'm sure they > would have found it > to be detrimental. My gut feeling is that there may > be other unseen > factors involved when mixing these two, such as > maybe the water was > below a certain pH (6.6? for instance), or the water > was high in > magnesium or any number of things in these aquariums > which were not > ordinarily unsafe nor uncommon as all the aquariums > involved must > have had similar parameters, but were fatal when > these TWO meds were > introduced to the tank together. Maybe when mixing > them, you can add > no more than half strength of each one to get a > total treatment -- > that I couldn't tell you, but I can tell you mixing > them can be > fatal, even if not all the time. Although I haven't > heard of any > successful mixed treatments. Ray > > \ > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" > > <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > Hmmm.. it says on their web page and the packaging > that melafix and > > pimafix CAN be used together, that they are > complementary. What > > happens when you put them together that is fatal > and why would the > > manufacturer recommend it, then? > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > wrote: > > > they should not be used together, and can have > fatal > > > results when mixed at the same time. alone they > are > > > safe...together not so much > > > > > > --- thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > > > > > > Have you started treating your tank with > anything? > > > > I believe certain > > > > medications, such as melafix and pimafix -- > which > > > > can be used > > > > together, by the way -- cause foam to appear. > Sorry > > > > to not be of more > > > > help. > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & > Leslie > > > > Moore" > > > > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > > > > My water has developed a foam type around > the > > > > edges as well as a few > > > > > spots of randome floating clumps. The foam > is all > > > > along the edge of > > > > the > > > > > tank as well as the filter, spray wand, > etc... > > > > > All the tests are fine. No ammonia, > nitrites or > > > > high nitrates. > > > > > > > > > > I read a post a while back where someone > else had > > > > some "foam" but I > > > > > can't remember which group or what the > outcome > > > > was. > > > > > > > > > > any ideas? > > > > > > > > > > Leslie > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > > Do You Yahoo!? > > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > protection around > > > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > > __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail for Mobile Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone. http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13794	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: tank stands

only stability, as long as it is flat it is fine, flat does not mean level by the way. --- Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: > You mention "leaning away from the wall problems..." > My tank leans a > bit outward. I moved it away from the carpet strip > as suggeted but once > I filled it up, the water is not level. Can this > eventually cause a > problem? > Leslie > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13795	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater?

toss the heater, it is no good and will electricute you. ufortunately we have some folks here that do not understand the way electricity works, and have warned you about fish being electricuted. fish are not grounded and will not be electricuted. --- japanesegorilla05 <japanesegorilla05@...> wrote: > Hi all, I just bought an used aquarium with misc. > accessories. It was > quite a deal; everything works great thus far. The > only concern that I > have is for the heater. It appears to have water in > it, and looks > rather discolored and corroded. Is this alright, or > should I just toss > it? > > Thanks, > Jay > > > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13796	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Fin and tail rot keeps getting worse with Maracyn and M2/ hospi

the goldfish will be fine at 83 for a week or two if you bring the temp up a degree per day or so 40-80 is safe for them and a few over will only kill off parasites. --- Emily Tenczar <bababanana@...> wrote: > what should i do about the goldfish? it cant take > the warm water > Emily > > paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > stop medicating...anitibiotics are not always the > answer. concentrate on tank water quality. increase > th eheat to 83-85 degrees and add strezz zyme > everyother day for a week > > --- Emily Tenczar wrote: > > > Oh my gosh, guys I don't even know what to do > > anymore. My 20 gal guppy/danio tank is infected > with > > fin and tail rot, which I've already tried > treating > > once with M2 and again with Maracyn, and again > with > > Maracyn a 2nd time. And of course weekly water > > changes in the meantime, and at one point even > more > > frequently. But it is getting worse instead of > > better, and one of the fish has lost almost its > > entire tail. The last water check was okay. > > > > I'm ordering some tetracycline tablets online > > because I haven't used that yet, but I really > don't > > even know what to do now. I've tried the jungle > > anti-bacterial food even. > > > > That's not even the worst of it. The same problem > is > > going on in my 55 gal goldfish tank. Everyone is > > okay except the oranda, who still isn't any better > > after an M2 treatment, maracyn, and melafix. I'm > > considering a hospital tank for that one with > > tetracycline, but I don't have an empty > established > > tank. I could set up a small 3-gal tank with some > > gravel from the old tank and a filter than hangs > on > > the side, then leave her in there for a week and > > don't feed too much? > > > > I'm ready to pull my hair out. I can't add > anything > > to the aquariums that will harm the snails either. > > Please does anyone have advice? > > Emily > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when > replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING > the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13797	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium lighting

problem solved lol --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > I am going to be using a power supply from a > computer as I am also going to > be using cold cathode tubes (used for lighting > effects on computer cases) > for moonlighting... > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of paul helms > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 5:47 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] aquarium lighting > > > radioshack fans work a bit better as they are > designe > dto be plugged in to the wall. the computer fans > only > use 5 volts. > > --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > > > yep...you can use computer fans if you put them in > a > > hood to keep things > > cool. > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... > > Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 1:50 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] aquarium lighting > > > > > > > > In a message dated 7/24/2005 1:17:48 P.M. Central > > Standard Time, > > woad@... writes: > > > > You could also > > email fishman911 and he may still have the manual > or > > at least have info on > > the specs. > > > > > > > > These systems are brand new, still in the box! I > am > > concerned that the > > larger lights will add more heat. I have seen the > > Orbit ones for (I think > > its) > > 95 watt bulbs. They have more/larger fans. > > > > Linda > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> > > 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > when > > replying, thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > > that is NOT important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the > original > > message MODIFY the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > > subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > > matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , > > .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > > you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> > > 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on > the > > web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an > email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > > Yahoo! Terms of Service > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when > replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology > Biology > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > === message truncated === ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13798	From: Patrick	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater?

Don't tell that to the makers of those electrode rod things! Funny thing is without such a rod or other conductor connecting the water with a grounded source (finger), no current can even exist. Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill -------Original Message------- toss the heater, it is no good and will electricute you. ufortunately we have some folks here that do not understand the way electricity works, and have warned you about fish being electricuted. fish are not grounded and will not be electricuted. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13799	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water

Paul, Good move, strange that The Syd finds the website to say something else. I have a melafix lable and insert sheet around here somewhere; I'll have to check it out. I'm beginning to wonder if they have tested the two together -- I'm sure they must have had many complaints by now or maybe people just chalk it up to experience and move on, not saying anything. Got to (and do) agree, they're not medications in the strick sense of the word -- my reason for putting the word "medications" in quotes, in my last post. If you noticed, I went on to describe them as remedies. I still think there's a third element in this deadly equation, and that testing by the manufacturer should be done covering the many possibilities of normal water parameters as is found in most of our aquarium water, to expose the reason behind this deadly combination. It certainly cannot be said that they've done any testing to any great extent or the results would have been obvious to them. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms <wtfmorlok@y...> wrote: > Ray, > i looked up the pimafix website, and it does not say > that they should be used together at all, it says that > they are designed to work "synergistically", which > just means to greater effect. this may only be useful > as dip, there is no information listed. the use of > this language very clearly states to me that it is a > write up by a marketing team, not researchers. if one > takes the time to read the full statement on the site, > it states very clearly that they can be used togther > in EXTREME cases, not everyday use. in addition, i > know that we have had some "medical" responses, but > these are not "medications" but rather tea tree and > bay tree extracts, not true antibiotics or anti > fungals meaning not engineered to be used in this way. > they may function well in the application, but this > is hollistic not pharmaceutical. > > --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > Do not believe everything that you read! Do you > > REALLY KNOW for sure > > whether or not Melafix and Pimafix can be mixed? If > > not, please do > > not recommend such a thing to other newer Forum > > members who may not > > know better. Paul is 100% correct on this one. I > > too have seen and > > learned of many cases of hobbyists I know mixing > > these > > two "medications" together and wiping out their > > tanks. Most of these > > tanks were well established over many years with one > > fish having a > > scrape or slight sore with all the other fish being > > healthy, as in > > cases that Paul has seen. By themselves, these > > remedies are great, > > so I am not trying to bash them. I am not a > > chemist, so I cannot > > tell you what happens when you put them together, > > only that it kills > > fish. Can't say why the manufacturer would > > recommend it -- I would > > hope it wouldn't just be to increase sales, but it > > would seem obvious > > they may not have really tried mixing these two meds > > as a test in a > > healthy fish-populated aquarium or I'm sure they > > would have found it > > to be detrimental. My gut feeling is that there may > > be other unseen > > factors involved when mixing these two, such as > > maybe the water was > > below a certain pH (6.6? for instance), or the water > > was high in > > magnesium or any number of things in these aquariums > > which were not > > ordinarily unsafe nor uncommon as all the aquariums > > involved must > > have had similar parameters, but were fatal when > > these TWO meds were > > introduced to the tank together. Maybe when mixing > > them, you can add > > no more than half strength of each one to get a > > total treatment -- > > that I couldn't tell you, but I can tell you mixing > > them can be > > fatal, even if not all the time. Although I haven't > > heard of any > > successful mixed treatments. Ray > > > > \ > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" > > > > <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > > Hmmm.. it says on their web page and the packaging > > that melafix and > > > pimafix CAN be used together, that they are > > complementary. What > > > happens when you put them together that is fatal > > and why would the > > > manufacturer recommend it, then? > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > wrote: > > > > they should not be used together, and can have > > fatal > > > > results when mixed at the same time. alone they > > are > > > > safe...together not so much > > > > > > > > --- thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Have you started treating your tank with > > anything? > > > > > I believe certain > > > > > medications, such as melafix and pimafix -- > > which > > > > > can be used > > > > > together, by the way -- cause foam to appear. > > Sorry > > > > > to not be of more > > > > > help. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & > > Leslie > > > > > Moore" > > > > > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > > > > > My water has developed a foam type around > > the > > > > > edges as well as a few > > > > > > spots of randome floating clumps. The foam > > is all > > > > > along the edge of > > > > > the > > > > > > tank as well as the filter, spray wand, > > etc... > > > > > > All the tests are fine. No ammonia, > > nitrites or > > > > > high nitrates. > > > > > > > > > > > > I read a post a while back where someone > > else had > > > > > some "foam" but I > > > > > > can't remember which group or what the > > outcome > > > > > was. > > > > > > > > > > > > any ideas? > > > > > > > > > > > > Leslie > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > > > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > > > Do You Yahoo!? > > > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > > protection around > > > > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > Yahoo! Mail for Mobile > Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone. > http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13800	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water

yup, i think anothe rbig factor may be the fact that you are supposed to treat daily for seven days i believe, followed by a 20% water change, but the pimafix website says to change 20-50% every 3 days when medicating, and they emphasize it as a must! people may not be catching that, and 3 days may be the safe limit to have the mixture in the tank. i would also be willing to make the hypothesis that the labs test with ro water and batches of fish, not in established tanks with nitrate content --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote: > Paul, Good move, strange that The Syd finds the > website to say > something else. I have a melafix lable and insert > sheet around here > somewhere; I'll have to check it out. I'm beginning > to wonder if > they have tested the two together -- I'm sure they > must have had many > complaints by now or maybe people just chalk it up > to experience and > move on, not saying anything. Got to (and do) > agree, they're not > medications in the strick sense of the word -- my > reason for putting > the word "medications" in quotes, in my last post. > If you noticed, I > went on to describe them as remedies. I still think > there's a third > element in this deadly equation, and that testing by > the manufacturer > should be done covering the many possibilities of > normal water > parameters as is found in most of our aquarium > water, to expose the > reason behind this deadly combination. It certainly > cannot be said > that they've done any testing to any great extent or > the results > would have been obvious to them. Ray > \ > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > <wtfmorlok@y...> wrote: > > Ray, > > i looked up the pimafix website, and it does not > say > > that they should be used together at all, it says > that > > they are designed to work "synergistically", which > > just means to greater effect. this may only be > useful > > as dip, there is no information listed. the use > of > > this language very clearly states to me that it is > a > > write up by a marketing team, not researchers. if > one > > takes the time to read the full statement on the > site, > > it states very clearly that they can be used > togther > > in EXTREME cases, not everyday use. in addition, i > > know that we have had some "medical" responses, > but > > these are not "medications" but rather tea tree > and > > bay tree extracts, not true antibiotics or anti > > fungals meaning not engineered to be used in this > way. > > they may function well in the application, but > this > > is hollistic not pharmaceutical. > > > > --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > > > Do not believe everything that you read! Do you > > > REALLY KNOW for sure > > > whether or not Melafix and Pimafix can be mixed? > If > > > not, please do > > > not recommend such a thing to other newer Forum > > > members who may not > > > know better. Paul is 100% correct on this one. > I > > > too have seen and > > > learned of many cases of hobbyists I know mixing > > > these > > > two "medications" together and wiping out their > > > tanks. Most of these > > > tanks were well established over many years with > one > > > fish having a > > > scrape or slight sore with all the other fish > being > > > healthy, as in > > > cases that Paul has seen. By themselves, these > > > remedies are great, > > > so I am not trying to bash them. I am not a > > > chemist, so I cannot > > > tell you what happens when you put them > together, > > > only that it kills > > > fish. Can't say why the manufacturer would > > > recommend it -- I would > > > hope it wouldn't just be to increase sales, but > it > > > would seem obvious > > > they may not have really tried mixing these two > meds > > > as a test in a > > > healthy fish-populated aquarium or I'm sure they > > > would have found it > > > to be detrimental. My gut feeling is that there > may > > > be other unseen > > > factors involved when mixing these two, such as > > > maybe the water was > > > below a certain pH (6.6? for instance), or the > water > > > was high in > > > magnesium or any number of things in these > aquariums > > > which were not > > > ordinarily unsafe nor uncommon as all the > aquariums > > > involved must > > > have had similar parameters, but were fatal when > > > these TWO meds were > > > introduced to the tank together. Maybe when > mixing > > > them, you can add > > > no more than half strength of each one to get a > > > total treatment -- > > > that I couldn't tell you, but I can tell you > mixing > > > them can be > > > fatal, even if not all the time. Although I > haven't > > > heard of any > > > successful mixed treatments. Ray > > > > > > > \ > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, > "thesydmonster" > > > > > > <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > > > Hmmm.. it says on their web page and the > packaging > > > that melafix and > > > > pimafix CAN be used together, that they are > > > complementary. What > > > > happens when you put them together that is > fatal > > > and why would the > > > > manufacturer recommend it, then? > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > > wrote: > > > > > they should not be used together, and can > have > > > fatal > > > > > results when mixed at the same time. alone > they > > > are > > > > > safe...together not so much > > > > > > > > > > --- thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@c...> > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Have you started treating your tank with > > > anything? > > > > > > I believe certain > > > > > > medications, such as melafix and pimafix > -- > > > which > > > > > > can be used > > > > > > together, by the way -- cause foam to > appear. > > > Sorry > > > > > > to not be of more > > > > > > help. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane > & > > > Leslie > > > > > > Moore" > > > > > > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > > > > > > My water has developed a foam type > around > > > the > > > > > > edges as well as a few > > > > > > > spots of randome floating clumps. The > foam > > > is all > > > > > > along the edge of > > > > > > the > > > > > > > tank as well as the filter, spray wand, > > > etc... > > > > > > > All the tests are fine. No ammonia, > > > nitrites or > > > > > > high nitrates. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I read a post a while back where someone > > > else had > > > > > > some "foam" but I > > > > > > > can't remember which group or what the > === message truncated === __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13801	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater?

lmao exactly! --- Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: > Don't tell that to the makers of those electrode rod > things! Funny thing is > without such a rod or other conductor connecting > the water with a grounded > source (finger), no current can even exist. > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy. > > "Now this is not the end. It is not even the > beginning of the end. But it is > perhaps, the end of the beginning." > -Winston Churchill > -------Original Message------- > toss the heater, it is no good and will electricute > you. ufortunately we have some folks here that do > not > understand the way electricity works, and have > warned > you about fish being electricuted. fish are not > grounded and will not be electricuted. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13802	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater?

I did not know that...I figured that since they were in the water, if you electrified the water, you would have fish soup. How does an electric eel fry it's dinner if dinner isn't grounded then? I understand how electricity works BTW. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of paul helms Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 6:45 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? toss the heater, it is no good and will electricute you. ufortunately we have some folks here that do not understand the way electricity works, and have warned you about fish being electricuted. fish are not grounded and will not be electricuted. --- japanesegorilla05 <japanesegorilla05@...> wrote: > Hi all, I just bought an used aquarium with misc. > accessories. It was > quite a deal; everything works great thus far. The > only concern that I > have is for the heater. It appears to have water in > it, and looks > rather discolored and corroded. Is this alright, or > should I just toss > it? > > Thanks, > Jay > > > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13803	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium lighting

Yup :-D I saw the idea on a DIY site. The cathode tubes give off a nice glow. I was trying to figure out how I could just use computer case fans since I have tons of them laying around and I saw the site with the cathode tubes. Killed 2 birds with one stone as I was also looking for a moonlighting solution. You can buy kits that come with 2 cathode tubes for $15. I am taking a PS of an old system (old 486), which should have enough juice for 2 tubes and 2 fans. Now I just have to figure what I am going to do with the PS. I don;t want to put it in the hood as that might be a bit too humid, but I also don;t want this boxy PS on the side of my hood or just laying around. BTW...I got my hood built. Now I just have to get the lighting and put in the fans and it will be finished. I will be posting pics when I get around to taking some. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of paul helms Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 6:48 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] aquarium lighting problem solved lol --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > I am going to be using a power supply from a > computer as I am also going to > be using cold cathode tubes (used for lighting > effects on computer cases) > for moonlighting... > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of paul helms > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 5:47 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] aquarium lighting > > > radioshack fans work a bit better as they are > designe > dto be plugged in to the wall. the computer fans > only > use 5 volts. > > --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > > > yep...you can use computer fans if you put them in > a > > hood to keep things > > cool. > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... > > Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 1:50 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] aquarium lighting > > > > > > > > In a message dated 7/24/2005 1:17:48 P.M. Central > > Standard Time, > > woad@... writes: > > > > You could also > > email fishman911 and he may still have the manual > or > > at least have info on > > the specs. > > > > > > > > These systems are brand new, still in the box! I > am > > concerned that the > > larger lights will add more heat. I have seen the > > Orbit ones for (I think > > its) > > 95 watt bulbs. They have more/larger fans. > > > > Linda > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> > > 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > when > > replying, thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > > that is NOT important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the > original > > message MODIFY the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > > subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > > matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , > > .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > > you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> > > 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on > the > > web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an > email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > > Yahoo! Terms of Service > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when > replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology > Biology > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > === message truncated === ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13804	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium lighting

Here is an encased set you can get... regular price is 13.95, but they are on sale for 8.95. This is a dual set and probably all that you will need for larger tanks. If the light is too bright, you can ass resistors...or just get a variable resistor so you can adjust the voltage. When you lower the voltage, you dim the light. A regular dimmer switch would probably suffice (if it works with dc voltage). <http://www.casecooler.com/ducocalikit1.html> http://www.casecooler.com/ducocalikit1.html Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Roberts Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 7:14 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] aquarium lighting Yup :-D I saw the idea on a DIY site. The cathode tubes give off a nice glow. I was trying to figure out how I could just use computer case fans since I have tons of them laying around and I saw the site with the cathode tubes. Killed 2 birds with one stone as I was also looking for a moonlighting solution. You can buy kits that come with 2 cathode tubes for $15. I am taking a PS of an old system (old 486), which should have enough juice for 2 tubes and 2 fans. Now I just have to figure what I am going to do with the PS. I don;t want to put it in the hood as that might be a bit too humid, but I also don;t want this boxy PS on the side of my hood or just laying around. BTW...I got my hood built. Now I just have to get the lighting and put in the fans and it will be finished. I will be posting pics when I get around to taking some. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of paul helms Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 6:48 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] aquarium lighting problem solved lol --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > I am going to be using a power supply from a > computer as I am also going to > be using cold cathode tubes (used for lighting > effects on computer cases) > for moonlighting... > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of paul helms > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 5:47 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] aquarium lighting > > > radioshack fans work a bit better as they are > designe > dto be plugged in to the wall. the computer fans > only > use 5 volts. > > --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > > > yep...you can use computer fans if you put them in > a > > hood to keep things > > cool. > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... > > Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 1:50 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] aquarium lighting > > > > > > > > In a message dated 7/24/2005 1:17:48 P.M. Central > > Standard Time, > > woad@... writes: > > > > You could also > > email fishman911 and he may still have the manual > or > > at least have info on > > the specs. > > > > > > > > These systems are brand new, still in the box! I > am > > concerned that the > > larger lights will add more heat. I have seen the > > Orbit ones for (I think > > its) > > 95 watt bulbs. They have more/larger fans. > > > > Linda > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> > > 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > when > > replying, thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > > that is NOT important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the > original > > message MODIFY the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > > subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > > matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , > > .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > > you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> > > 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on > the > > web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an > email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > > Yahoo! Terms of Service > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when > replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology > Biology > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > === message truncated === ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13805	From: discusfishies	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater?

Would buy a new one I would consider heater most important besides filter, all fish varieties need stable temperature except goldfish need NO heater Laurie--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "japanesegorilla05" <japanesegorilla05@y...> wrote: > Hi all, I just bought an used aquarium with misc. accessories. It was > quite a deal; everything works great thus far. The only concern that I > have is for the heater. It appears to have water in it, and looks > rather discolored and corroded. Is this alright, or should I just toss > it? > > Thanks, > Jay

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13806	From: discusfishies	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: question about fish disapearing

I agrre sounds like your 3 new fish were african cichlids they sell maternity boxes that float right in your tank but you can separate your new fish from the others ( quarentine ) and you will see the results or take your new fish back to where you bought them if they are african cicchlids they are an agressive breed you can only keep africans with africans they will eat or bother anything else you put with them, they can eat anything that is equal or lesser in size Laurie--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms <wtfmorlok@y...> wrote: > sounds like you put african cichlids in with tetras > and they are doing what they do! > > --- camdogkingsfan <camdog@s...> wrote: > > > Hello all. Let me try and keep my story and > > question short. I have > > had a 25 gallon take for about 3 years. In there I > > have had a Pasco, > > black ghost knife, 4 black skirt tetras, 4 albno > > catfish, 2 clear > > looking catfish (sorry I can't remember the name of > > them right > > now),and 2 upside down catfish. Now before you get > > on my case about > > have that many fish I already know. Well I upgraded > > to bigger > > aquaruim about a month ago to a 48 gallon. I put > > all those fish in > > there along with 3 small fish. I can't remember the > > name of them > > right now. I know they are about an inch long and > > one is yellow, the > > other two where blue and gray. Very pretty. Well I > > noticed earlier > > this week. One of the small fish were gone. I saw > > the other two > > about 1:00 pm my time. Then I came home at 4:00 pm > > and the yellow > > was > > the only one left. Then on Friday I saw that one of > > my tetras fins > > looked missing or chewed up. I woke up Saturday and > > he was gone. > > This morning I saw one of the other tetras fins is > > kinda mussed up. > > Does anyone know what is going on? Is the Knife > > eating the fish? I > > feed my fish very well. I give them bottom feeding > > food and two > > Brine > > Shrimp cubes. Can anyone help? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13807	From: Sandy Kay	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: snails

I have a problem with small snails. I bought some live plants a few weeks ago and was told to wash the plants off good with cold water because the store knew they had a problem with snails at that time. I did and thought I was okay. I am now seeing small snails, about 5 a day, which I pick off and take out of the tank. I do not know anything about snails, other than the store told me they will eat my live plants. Is there anything I can do that is safe for the tank to rid it of them? Thank you, Sandy [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13808	From: Phil	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: hot water!

Howdy! The water temp. has been off the chart in 1 of my tanks. I've been putting ice in a baggie & putting that in the tank, but it doesn't help much. My oscar's skin is coming off & he's not eating. I've also been putting med. in the tank. What else can I do?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13809	From: Phil	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater?

hey! I would toss the heater.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13810	From: camdogkingsfan	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: question about fish disapearing

My What? african cichlids? What is that? --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms <wtfmorlok@y...> wrote: > sounds like you put african cichlids in with tetras > and they are doing what they do! > > --- camdogkingsfan <camdog@s...> wrote: > > > Hello all. Let me try and keep my story and > > question short. I have > > had a 25 gallon take for about 3 years. In there I > > have had a Pasco, > > black ghost knife, 4 black skirt tetras, 4 albno > > catfish, 2 clear > > looking catfish (sorry I can't remember the name of > > them right > > now),and 2 upside down catfish. Now before you get > > on my case about > > have that many fish I already know. Well I upgraded > > to bigger > > aquaruim about a month ago to a 48 gallon. I put > > all those fish in > > there along with 3 small fish. I can't remember the > > name of them > > right now. I know they are about an inch long and > > one is yellow, the > > other two where blue and gray. Very pretty. Well I > > noticed earlier > > this week. One of the small fish were gone. I saw > > the other two > > about 1:00 pm my time. Then I came home at 4:00 pm > > and the yellow > > was > > the only one left. Then on Friday I saw that one of > > my tetras fins > > looked missing or chewed up. I woke up Saturday and > > he was gone. > > This morning I saw one of the other tetras fins is > > kinda mussed up. > > Does anyone know what is going on? Is the Knife > > eating the fish? I > > feed my fish very well. I give them bottom feeding > > food and two > > Brine > > Shrimp cubes. Can anyone help? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13811	From: Patrick	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: hot water!

Turn the a/c up. Seriously, though. For everybody here who doesn't have an air conditioner: Get one. If you can afford a fish tank, you don't have any excuse to not have a good air conditioner to keep the room it is in cool in the summer, and a good safe heater to keep it warm in the winter. Not to mention you are more likely to die of heat stroke in your own house if you don't keep it cool. Also, if you can afford an internet connection, you have no excuse to not have an a/c. They aren't really that expensive. A lot cheaper than restocking your tanks or paying medical bills when you fall over dead. Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill -------Original Message------- Howdy! The water temp. has been off the chart in 1 of my tanks. I've been putting ice in a baggie & putting that in the tank, but it doesn't help much. My oscar's skin is coming off & he's not eating. I've also been putting med. in the tank. What else can I do? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13812	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: New Guy

In a message dated 7/25/2005 4:35:26 P.M. Central Standard Time, sevenspringss@... writes: The strong undiluted urine from reptiles (and mammals) permeates the silicone sealant (much as malachite green does when using some Ich cures) and comes back out into solution when you fill the tank with water. It will kill the fish everytime This is good information to know. Thanks Ray [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13813	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: UPDATE...re: Fish for more acidic water

In a message dated 7/25/2005 5:09:35 P.M. Central Standard Time, t_a_ray_cissp@... writes: - Key Hole (maybe: too big for tank or other species? ...will their "irridescence" be visible in peat water?) (positive: no digging of substrate) I have four keyhole cichlids. I have had a few in the past. They are absolutely my favorite cichlid. I have never noticed their "iridescence", although the do change their color patterns quite frequently. I have seen them pick up a mouthful of gravel now and then, but I have never seen them digging. How about a pair of blue rams? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13814	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water

In a message dated 7/25/2005 6:43:26 P.M. Central Standard Time, wtfmorlok@... writes: in EXTREME cases, not everyday use. in addition, i know that we have had some "medical" responses, but these are not "medications" but rather tea tree and bay tree extracts, not true antibiotics or anti fungals meaning not engineered to be used in this way. they may function well in the application, but this is hollistic not pharmaceutical. It sure would be nice if people would sign their posts so all of us know who the info is coming from. Thanks Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13815	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Fin and tail rot keeps getting worse with Maracyn and M2/ hospi

Goldfish can handle those temperatures. In ponds, the temperatures flucuate between 75 - 85F every day and the fish do fine. NO fish likes a dramatic change but as long as it takes a few hours to go up a few degrees, or 1F per hour, it will acclimate. They can't live in 85F forever without possible adverse side effects, but they can "tolerate" it for a short time. They will "act" different and probably be more sluggish or at the surface more but it should survive. Keep the water aerated better by lowering the water level if you have a HOB so it will "aerate" the water too since warmer water has a lower O2 level. When you get ready to bring the temp back down, do it slowly also. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: 1 Date: Mon, 25 Jul 2005 11:16:18 -0700 (PDT) From: Emily Tenczar <bababanana@...> Subject: Re: Fin and tail rot keeps getting worse with Maracyn and M2/ hospital tank? what should i do about the goldfish? it cant take the warm water Emily paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: stop medicating...anitibiotics are not always the answer. concentrate on tank water quality. increase th eheat to 83-85 degrees and add strezz zyme everyother day for a week --- Emily Tenczar wrote: > Oh my gosh, guys I don't even know what to do > anymore. My 20 gal guppy/danio tank is infected with > fin and tail rot, which I've already tried treating > once with M2 and again with Maracyn, and again with > Maracyn a 2nd time. And of course weekly water > changes in the meantime, and at one point even more > frequently. But it is getting worse instead of > better, and one of the fish has lost almost its > entire tail. The last water check was okay. > > I'm ordering some tetracycline tablets online > because I haven't used that yet, but I really don't > even know what to do now. I've tried the jungle > anti-bacterial food even. > > That's not even the worst of it. The same problem is > going on in my 55 gal goldfish tank. Everyone is > okay except the oranda, who still isn't any better > after an M2 treatment, maracyn, and melafix. I'm > considering a hospital tank for that one with > tetracycline, but I don't have an empty established > tank. I could set up a small 3-gal tank with some > gravel from the old tank and a filter than hangs on > the side, then leave her in there for a week and > don't feed too much? > > I'm ready to pull my hair out. I can't add anything > to the aquariums that will harm the snails either. > Please does anyone have advice? > Emily > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13816	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater?

In a message dated 7/25/2005 6:47:32 P.M. Central Standard Time, wtfmorlok@... writes: toss the heater, it is no good and will electricute you. ufortunately we have some folks here that do not understand the way electricity works, and have warned you about fish being electricuted. fish are not grounded and will not be electricuted Again, your knowledge here is great information. I would have never know that (same principal as bird on a wire) fish can not get electrocuted. But who are you? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13817	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater?

Toss it. Check PetsMart.com and BigAlsOnline.com in their clearance pages. I don't remember which one had them, but they had Rena Heaters for 1/2 price. I think they were between $5.00 - $10.00 depending on the wattage. I bought a 100W for my 20G tank that I recently converted to tropical and a 300W just to have an extra on hand in case I need to regulate the temp in my 65G Goldfish tank since I have a Pleco in there now. So far it's staying a consistent 74F. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: 3 Date: Mon, 25 Jul 2005 19:36:31 -0000 From: "japanesegorilla05" <japanesegorilla05@...> Subject: Safe to use a heater? Hi all, I just bought an used aquarium with misc. accessories. It was quite a deal; everything works great thus far. The only concern that I have is for the heater. It appears to have water in it, and looks rather discolored and corroded. Is this alright, or should I just toss it? Thanks, Jay [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13818	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: PimaFix/MelaFix

In a message dated 7/25/2005 7:35:40 P.M. Central Standard Time, wtfmorlok@... writes: yup, i think anothe rbig factor may be the fact that you are supposed to treat daily for seven days i believe, followed by a 20% water change, but the pimafix website says to change 20-50% every 3 days when medicating, and they emphasize it as a must! I used this (PimaFix) to treat my rummy nose tetras (they looked like they were eating powdered sugar donuts). I don't recall seeing anything on the bottle that says to do a water change after three days. I will have to pick up another bottle and read it more closely. The remedy worked well (saw improvements after 24 hours and was completely gone in four days) but I did have rather cloudy water. I did a 50% water change on day eight, and still had cloudy water. This is the second week after treatment and I did a 25% water change today and the cloudiness is almost gone. Some of the cloudiness may have been due to the exposed laterite in my tank. I also have a bottle of MelaFix in my cabinet just in case. I would rather try an herbal remedy first than to jump into a antibiotic or fungal remedy. I guess it would all depend on who and how many were sick and whether I was treating the whole tank or just a quarantine tank. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13819	From: Aaron M.	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: webring url broken?

Hi Nicolas, I have no idea how to get the whole webring thing to work, it was something I saw on a local groups page and I've had no luck whatsoever. "Nicolas J. Munro" <nmunro@...> wrote: the webring url dosn't seam to work on my pc. http://tinyurl.com/6ge5u/ its the one on the front page of the group. PS. thats a mean monster too, lots of spikes! =Nick ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife stop by and see ~ membership is free! <º((((><¸..·´¯`·., . .·´¯`·.. <º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((>< ¸.·´¯`·.¸. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13820	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Catfish with BLOATED stomach

My new spotted catfish has a HUGE bloated stomach. He swims up at the top and does not come down ever. I chalked this up to the fact that he is new and was being bullied at the bottom, but I'm not certain now. What is this and is it treatable? I'm leaving town first thing in the morning so I'm needing some quick help. Thanks, Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13821	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: tank stands

How big is your tank? It could certainly cause problems. You should definitely work on getting it level. Give me more info on your tank size, what kind of stand you have, how tall is the stand, how tall with the tank on top of it, what kind of floors, etc. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: 6 Date: Mon, 25 Jul 2005 15:06:12 -0500 From: "Dane & Leslie Moore" <amjmail@...> Subject: RE: Re: tank stands You mention "leaning away from the wall problems..." My tank leans a bit outward. I moved it away from the carpet strip as suggeted but once I filled it up, the water is not level. Can this eventually cause a problem? Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13822	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water

I'm certain that this post was signed as I read the conversation between Ray and Paul. I wouldn't have known that had they not signed their names. Or perhaps I saw it in the address as to who it was written by, either way, I knew. LESLIE -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 9:45 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: Foamy water In a message dated 7/25/2005 6:43:26 P.M. Central Standard Time, wtfmorlok@... writes: in EXTREME cases, not everyday use. in addition, i know that we have had some "medical" responses, but these are not "medications" but rather tea tree and bay tree extracts, not true antibiotics or anti fungals meaning not engineered to be used in this way. they may function well in the application, but this is hollistic not pharmaceutical. It sure would be nice if people would sign their posts so all of us know who the info is coming from. Thanks Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13823	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: tank stands

Check to see if the floor is level as it is not in many instances, especially in older buildings. Probably would have been a wise first step. If the lean is not much, less than 1/4" difference between front and back, you probably are OK. More that that, and I would shim the stand to get the tank level. I've always used cedar shingles for that as they cut easily once in place. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Dane & Leslie Moore Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 4:06 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: tank stands You mention "leaning away from the wall problems..." My tank leans a bit outward. I moved it away from the carpet strip as suggeted but once I filled it up, the water is not level. Can this eventually cause a problem? Leslie

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13824	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution

Fish are not grounded so they won't be electrocuted huh? Hmmm. Lol Sorry but that's funny. -----Original Message---- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 9:48 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? In a message dated 7/25/2005 6:47:32 P.M. Central Standard Time, wtfmorlok@... writes: toss the heater, it is no good and will electricute you. ufortunately we have some folks here that do not understand the way electricity works, and have warned you about fish being electricuted. fish are not grounded and will not be electricuted Again, your knowledge here is great information. I would have never know that (same principal as bird on a wire) fish can not get electrocuted. But who are you? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13825	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: signing posts

Thanks Leslie, Being a newbie, I have not figured out everyone's email address. It is just easier to read the post and then know whom it is from by reading their name at the bottom of the post. I may have missed his name on the bottom. Not trying to be snotty here, just like to get to know everyone. I would think that signing your name would be a common courtesy. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13826	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: more on glofish

I own three of these fish and they are great. They are genetically altered with sea anemone genes and have been used to test water for pollutants (their colors fade). They are like normal danios, however, and can breed and will produce red offspring. These were the first fish I bought after my betta about 6 months ago. I went to the lfs to ask about setting up a tank. They told me to a cycle with hardy fish (no mention of fishless cycling). We really liked the red color so chose these guys. I looked up glofish when I got home and then learned about them, why they are red, what they are used for, that they are quite controversial, etc. Once I have an animal in my care, I believe in giving it the best life possible and did not return them. I think they are great, very active, hardy, healthy, social, and fun to watch. I do not have any special lights for them or treat them any differently than my other fish. They are a hoot. I put a picture of my male in my photo album. I realize there is a lot of controversy over them and I hope no one finds this post offensive. Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > I've never seen them offered for sale before. I've been out of the hobby for > a decade though.. > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13827	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: hot water!

Have you unplugged the heater? Sounds silly, but that could be the cause of your problem with the temperature. Also, leave the tank lights off unless they are needed. Your water temperature should not read above the ambient temperature, unless you have a source of heat within the aquarium. So, without heater or lights, if your room is 75^o F, the water should be 75^o F. Another thought would be any pumps overheating, which could cause a rise in temperature, but, by then, the noise form the pump should be the give away, and it should not really raise the temperature by much. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Phil Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 3:47 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] hot water! Howdy! The water temp. has been off the chart in 1 of my tanks. I've been putting ice in a baggie & putting that in the tank, but it doesn't help much. My oscar's skin is coming off & he's not eating. I've also been putting med. in the tank. What else can I do?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13828	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: tank stands/Level

It's a 75 gallon. I can't measure right now. I took a pill and I'm barely able to type this out. It's on carpet, away from the wall by about 4-5", enough to get away from the strip and bump it causes. What types of problems are we looking at? I don't know what I could do to fix it other than move it to the hard floor which is only in the kitchen and the hall, so no room. Ack! Gosh I'm loopy. Lol Pardon me if this doesn't make too much sense. Leslie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Lenny Vasbinder Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:11 PM To: AquaticLife Yahoo! Group Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: tank stands How big is your tank? It could certainly cause problems. You should definitely work on getting it level. Give me more info on your tank size, what kind of stand you have, how tall is the stand, how tall with the tank on top of it, what kind of floors, etc. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: 6 Date: Mon, 25 Jul 2005 15:06:12 -0500 From: "Dane & Leslie Moore" <amjmail@...> Subject: RE: Re: tank stands You mention "leaning away from the wall problems..." My tank leans a bit outward. I moved it away from the carpet strip as suggeted but once I filled it up, the water is not level. Can this eventually cause a problem? Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13829	From: bennedh76	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: New Guy

The previous owner raisd fish and says that it was only used for fish. Thank you for the info, that is good to know for future purchases. Heeth --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > Keeth, Before you beat yourself up anymore, or smash the tank, Let > me know if this used tank was previously used for reptiles (or > mammals). If you don't know, try to find out. Reptile tanks cannot > be used for fish afterwards, The strong undiluted urine from reptiles > (and mammals) permeates the silicone sealant (much as malachite green > does when using some Ich cures) and comes back out into solution when > you fill the tank with water. It will kill the fish everytime. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "bennedh76" <bennedh76@y...> > wrote: > > Hello, My name is Heeth I have just recently purchased an aquarium. > I > > am just about to the point of pulling all my hair out and smashing > > the 55gal fish killing machine. I cannot figure it out, I have > tested > > the; PH=7.5, Nitrites=0, Chloramine=0, Ammonia=0. > > > > So far I bought some gold fish to get the bacteria up, got rid of > > them and got some misc. community fish - Had a algae bloom and most > > everything died even the Placo the only thing that survived was the > > frog and the beta. So I cleaned and treated the algae and cleaned > it > > up. Shortly after the beta and frog crossed over. So I waited a > > couple weeks treated the water for parasites and algae tested all > the > > things that I listed in the beginning and those were the results so > I > > figured that I was safe. Yesterday I went and bought three > Chichlids > > and put them in, so far two have died and the third is barely > making > > it. > > > > I did buy a couple little tiny baskets of sea shells from Wal- Mart > > boiled and cleaned them, put some glassware and marbles in as well. > > Also this tank had been previously owned but I did clean it. > > > > I think that is about all as far as backgrounds go. Can anyone HELP > > or does anyone have any suggestions? > > Thank you, and I am looking forward to being part of the group. > > Heeth

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13830	From: bennedh76	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: New Guy

That is fine I get the K all the time. :o) --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > Sorry, meant to write Heeth, but my fingers got crossed (lol). Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> > wrote: > > Keeth, Before you beat yourself up anymore, or smash the tank, Let > > me know if this used tank was previously used for reptiles (or > > mammals). If you don't know, try to find out. Reptile tanks > cannot > > be used for fish afterwards, The strong undiluted urine from > reptiles > > (and mammals) permeates the silicone sealant (much as malachite > green > > does when using some Ich cures) and comes back out into solution > when > > you fill the tank with water. It will kill the fish everytime. > Ray > > > \ > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "bennedh76" <bennedh76@y...> > > wrote: > > > Hello, My name is Heeth I have just recently purchased an > aquarium. > > I > > > am just about to the point of pulling all my hair out and > smashing > > > the 55gal fish killing machine. I cannot figure it out, I have > > tested > > > the; PH=7.5, Nitrites=0, Chloramine=0, Ammonia=0. > > > > > > So far I bought some gold fish to get the bacteria up, got rid of > > > them and got some misc. community fish - Had a algae bloom and > most > > > everything died even the Placo the only thing that survived was > the > > > frog and the beta. So I cleaned and treated the algae and cleaned > > it > > > up. Shortly after the beta and frog crossed over. So I waited a > > > couple weeks treated the water for parasites and algae tested all > > the > > > things that I listed in the beginning and those were the results > so > > I > > > figured that I was safe. Yesterday I went and bought three > > Chichlids > > > and put them in, so far two have died and the third is barely > > making > > > it. > > > > > > I did buy a couple little tiny baskets of sea shells from Wal- > Mart > > > boiled and cleaned them, put some glassware and marbles in as > well. > > > Also this tank had been previously owned but I did clean it. > > > > > > I think that is about all as far as backgrounds go. Can anyone > HELP > > > or does anyone have any suggestions? > > > Thank you, and I am looking forward to being part of the group. > > > Heeth

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13832	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: New Guy

I have a 20 gallon that I used to have anoles in that is now housing fish...I have had no probs and I hand the lizards in there for about 2 years. Guess there is an exception to everything, huh? Eric Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of bennedh76 Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:46 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: New Guy The previous owner raisd fish and says that it was only used for fish. Thank you for the info, that is good to know for future purchases. Heeth --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > Keeth, Before you beat yourself up anymore, or smash the tank, Let > me know if this used tank was previously used for reptiles (or > mammals). If you don't know, try to find out. Reptile tanks cannot > be used for fish afterwards, The strong undiluted urine from reptiles > (and mammals) permeates the silicone sealant (much as malachite green > does when using some Ich cures) and comes back out into solution when > you fill the tank with water. It will kill the fish everytime. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "bennedh76" <bennedh76@y...> > wrote: > > Hello, My name is Heeth I have just recently purchased an aquarium. > I > > am just about to the point of pulling all my hair out and smashing > > the 55gal fish killing machine. I cannot figure it out, I have > tested > > the; PH=7.5, Nitrites=0, Chloramine=0, Ammonia=0. > > > > So far I bought some gold fish to get the bacteria up, got rid of > > them and got some misc. community fish - Had a algae bloom and most > > everything died even the Placo the only thing that survived was the > > frog and the beta. So I cleaned and treated the algae and cleaned > it > > up. Shortly after the beta and frog crossed over. So I waited a > > couple weeks treated the water for parasites and algae tested all > the > > things that I listed in the beginning and those were the results so > I > > figured that I was safe. Yesterday I went and bought three > Chichlids > > and put them in, so far two have died and the third is barely > making > > it. > > > > I did buy a couple little tiny baskets of sea shells from Wal- Mart > > boiled and cleaned them, put some glassware and marbles in as well. > > Also this tank had been previously owned but I did clean it. > > > > I think that is about all as far as backgrounds go. Can anyone HELP > > or does anyone have any suggestions? > > Thank you, and I am looking forward to being part of the group. > > Heeth ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13833	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: PimaFix and MelaFix

"PimaFix Treats fungal infections and both internal and external bacterial infections. Will not adversely affect the biological filter, alter thepH, or discolor water. Safe for reef aquariums and live plants. For use in fresh or salt water. PimaFix has been formulated to work in combination with MelaFix to enhance effectiveness against fish diseases" "In extreme cases of especially stubborn infections, PimaFix has been designed to work synergistically with MelaFix. Using PimaFix and MelaFix together provides the added benefit of quick tissue regeneration and wound healing." "Whenever treating with any medication, we suggest performing a 25- 50% water change every three days depending on the organic load in water." These quotes are from the aquarium pharmaceuticals webpage. I am certainly not saying that both should be used together based on several posts here that have stated there is a terrible reaction when used simultaneously, I just wanted to show you that I was NOT, in fact, making up that the manufacturer states they are safe to use together. "When used in combination with PimaFix, MelaFix provides a more effective treatment against fish disease and promotes rapid healing" is written on the label of the melafix bottle I have. "PimaFix has been specially formulated to work in combination with MelaFix for a more effective treatment against stubborn fish disease and to promote rapid healing" is written on the label of the pimafix I have. Both labels say to dose daily for 7 days, then do a 25% water change. This is why I have been confused. I am not belittling the experiences told on this forum about fatalities that occured when both medications were used, I am just pointing out how it can be so hard to know if you are doing the right thing if you cannot believe a manufaturer's label or business website! I appreciate everyone's insight into this topic and apologize for the long post :) Rebecca

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13834	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution

Aren't they grounded by the water? Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Dane & Leslie Moore Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:17 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? Electrocution Fish are not grounded so they won't be electrocuted huh? Hmmm. Lol Sorry but that's funny. -----Original Message---- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 9:48 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? In a message dated 7/25/2005 6:47:32 P.M. Central Standard Time, wtfmorlok@... writes: toss the heater, it is no good and will electricute you. ufortunately we have some folks here that do not understand the way electricity works, and have warned you about fish being electricuted. fish are not grounded and will not be electricuted Again, your knowledge here is great information. I would have never know that (same principal as bird on a wire) fish can not get electrocuted. But who are you? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13835	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Aeration questions

After treating my 37 gallon tank with Furan 2 months ago I was told to leave my airstone in all the time to increase the surface agitation in my tank. I was wondering if I am supposed to leave it on all day and all night? I just leave it on all the time, is that okay or should I shut it off at night? I only turn the one on in the 10 gallon when the temperature starts to increase (set at 76 but due to our heat waves it's been getting up to 80 in there) because the betta doesn't like the current much, is that okay? Also, the air pump I was given to put in the 37 gallon tank was for a 10 gallon tank so the bubbles were very gentle (it's a deep tank, not a wide one). I just got a new pump for a tank up to 40 gallons and it causes a lot more aggitation and current on that side of the tank. Is this bad or stressful for the fish or will they get used to it? The only ones that seem affected by it are the otos that are trying to clean the glass next to the bubbles and get swirled around a bit -- but boy, do they keep trying :) Any suggestions are appreciated.. Rebecca

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13836	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: tank stands/Level

Maybe that's why it is leaning hehehe (the pill)... The only problem is if it is leaning too far forward the higher center of gravity could cause it to fall forward. When a long tank is on an uneven surface, it could conceivably crack in half under the pressure of the water weight. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Dane & Leslie Moore Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:34 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: tank stands/Level It's a 75 gallon. I can't measure right now. I took a pill and I'm barely able to type this out. It's on carpet, away from the wall by about 4-5", enough to get away from the strip and bump it causes. What types of problems are we looking at? I don't know what I could do to fix it other than move it to the hard floor which is only in the kitchen and the hall, so no room. Ack! Gosh I'm loopy. Lol Pardon me if this doesn't make too much sense. Leslie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Lenny Vasbinder Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:11 PM To: AquaticLife Yahoo! Group Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: tank stands How big is your tank? It could certainly cause problems. You should definitely work on getting it level. Give me more info on your tank size, what kind of stand you have, how tall is the stand, how tall with the tank on top of it, what kind of floors, etc. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: 6 Date: Mon, 25 Jul 2005 15:06:12 -0500 From: "Dane & Leslie Moore" <amjmail@...> Subject: RE: Re: tank stands You mention "leaning away from the wall problems..." My tank leans a bit outward. I moved it away from the carpet strip as suggeted but once I filled it up, the water is not level. Can this eventually cause a problem? Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13837	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water (now debate about Melafix and Pimafix)

Melafix and Pimafix are made by Aquarium Pharmaceuticals http://www.aquariumpharm.com .. the maker of many, many aquarium related products.. water treatments, Master Test Kits, etc. They are the US distributors for Rena products like the Filstar Canister filter, Rena Air pumps, Rena Heaters, etc. To imply that they don't test their products before putting it on the label and website to "increase sales" is ludicrous since they do not sell fish.. at least not from what I've seen on their web pages. You say that you have only heard of it happening to other people, yet you want to say they cannot be mixed and in the same sentence you implore others to not recommend it if we do not know for ourselves. Well, I do know for myself. You also say "do not believe every thing you read".. so does that mean we should not believe what AP says about Melafix and Pimafix or not believe what you are saying? You SHOULD read the labeling on the two bottles the next time you are in a LFS. These are some of the few products that are 100% natural and will not kill your biofilter, affect your pH, etc. They probably aren't as strong as some of the other "chemicals" out there, but they have been safe when used as directed for my fish. I see people misuse things all the time and maybe that is what has happened to the people who KILLED all of their fish. Maybe they tried bumping the dosage to "make it work faster" and they KILLED their fish when they did not follow the directions. We all know many, many people that kill their fish for not following directions for cycling, compatibility, etc., etc. Just like the 1" rule that so many people throw around.. that is a fish KILLING rule. It only works for about 25% of fish... the ones that stay under 3" as adults. It does not work for Goldfish.. one of the most popular beginner fish... and it does not work for nearly any other fish that gets over 3" as an adult. What all of this is saying is that you are right about not believing every thing you read.. but it does not mean that every thing you read is wrong. If someone asks for advice in this or any other forum and you disagree with the advice, just state your opinion or advice. Don't claim that the other advice or opinion is wrong when you readily admit that you are not a "chemist". I do not work for, or own stock in Aquarium Pharmaceuticals... do you work for the competition? Oh well.. you had your rant and now that's my rant du jour. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: 15 Date: Mon, 25 Jul 2005 22:58:54 -0000 From: "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@...> Subject: Re: Foamy water Do not believe everything that you read! Do you REALLY KNOW for sure whether or not Melafix and Pimafix can be mixed? If not, please do not recommend such a thing to other newer Forum members who may not know better. Paul is 100% correct on this one. I too have seen and learned of many cases of hobbyists I know mixing these two "medications" together and wiping out their tanks. Most of these tanks were well established over many years with one fish having a scrape or slight sore with all the other fish being healthy, as in cases that Paul has seen. By themselves, these remedies are great, so I am not trying to bash them. I am not a chemist, so I cannot tell you what happens when you put them together, only that it kills fish. Can't say why the manufacturer would recommend it -- I would hope it wouldn't just be to increase sales, but it would seem obvious they may not have really tried mixing these two meds as a test in a healthy fish-populated aquarium or I'm sure they would have found it to be detrimental. My gut feeling is that there may be other unseen factors involved when mixing these two, such as maybe the water was below a certain pH (6.6? for instance), or the water was high in magnesium or any number of things in these aquariums which were not ordinarily unsafe nor uncommon as all the aquariums involved must have had similar parameters, but were fatal when these TWO meds were introduced to the tank together. Maybe when mixing them, you can add no more than half strength of each one to get a total treatment -- that I couldn't tell you, but I can tell you mixing them can be fatal, even if not all the time. Although I haven't heard of any successful mixed treatments. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > Hmmm.. it says on their web page and the packaging that melafix and > pimafix CAN be used together, that they are complementary. What > happens when you put them together that is fatal and why would the > manufacturer recommend it, then? > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms <wtfmorlok@y...> > wrote: > > they should not be used together, and can have fatal > > results when mixed at the same time. alone they are > > safe...together not so much > > > > --- thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > > > > Have you started treating your tank with anything? > > > I believe certain > > > medications, such as melafix and pimafix -- which > > > can be used > > > together, by the way -- cause foam to appear. Sorry > > > to not be of more > > > help. > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie > > > Moore" > > > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > > > My water has developed a foam type around the > > > edges as well as a few > > > > spots of randome floating clumps. The foam is all > > > along the edge of > > > the > > > > tank as well as the filter, spray wand, etc... > > > > All the tests are fine. No ammonia, nitrites or > > > high nitrates. > > > > > > > > I read a post a while back where someone else had > > > some "foam" but I > > > > can't remember which group or what the outcome > > > was. > > > > > > > > any ideas? > > > > > > > > Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13838	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy Water (now the debate on MelaFix and PimaFix)

Here are cut and paste product descriptions and FAQ's from Melafix and Pimafix... well, there were no FAQ's on Pimafix but the product description says "PimaFix has been formulated to work in combination with MelaFix to enhance effectiveness against fish diseases"... among other things. These snips are directly from the Aquarium Pharmaceuticals web site. MelaFix® Heals open wounds & abrasions, treats fin and tail rot, eye cloud, mouth fungus and promotes regrowth of damaged fin rays & tissue. Will not adversely affect the biological filter, alter the pH, or discolor water. Safe for reef aquariums and live plants. For use in fresh or salt water. MelaFix FAQ's- Can MelaFix be used with other medications? MelaFix has been tested and found compatible with Aquarium Pharmaceuticals medications. Mixing other brands of medications is not recommended. Is MelaFix harmful to aquatic plants? MelaFix can be used in aquariums and ponds containing live plants. Will MelaFix kill snails? No. Can I use MelaFix in aquariums containing freshwater crabs and shrimp? Yes. Will MelaFix hurt saltwater invertebrates? No. MelaFix is reef-compatible. MelaFix has been shown to promote the healing of damaged coral tissue. I have a protein skimmer. Will MelaFix cause foaming? MelaFix will cause some increased foaming during the treatment. We recommend turning the skimmer down or off during treatment with MelaFix. Do I have to remove the activated carbon from my filter when treating with MelaFix? We suggest removing the carbon while treating with any medication. PimaFix Treats fungal infections and both internal and external bacterial infections. Will not adversely affect the biological filter, alter the pH, or discolor water. Safe for reef aquariums and live plants. For use in fresh or salt water. PimaFix has been formulated to work in combination with MelaFix to enhance effectiveness against fish diseases. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13839	From: kritter714@aol.com	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater?

depends on the heater brand truthfully my ebo-jaegers quite often have water in them as they age and I have never had a problem I think it is condensation disappears when in use and I have never had a problem any other brand toss Elaine in the emerald city 125 gallon marine, 90 gallon discus 80 gallon south american cichlid 55 gallon african cichlid 50 gallon temperate water tank [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13840	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater?

no heater should have water in it --- kritter714@... wrote: > depends on the heater brand truthfully my > ebo-jaegers quite often have water > in them as they age and I have never had a problem I > think it is > condensation disappears when in use and I have > never had a problem any other brand toss > > > Elaine in the emerald city > 125 gallon marine, > 90 gallon discus > 80 gallon south american cichlid > 55 gallon african cichlid > 50 gallon temperate water tank > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13841	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy Water (now the debate on MelaFix and PimaFix)

i was on the pimafix website and that is not the language used there. i understand you got this from ap's website, but that is not the onlything out there. there is really nothing to debate here. expperience shows direct contradiction. take it or leave it, i am not gonna argue about it. i am also looking at aquarium pharm directly on their pimafix.html site, and the wording is not the same as what you have cut and pasted. you can copy and paste the link before for the full article by ap. http://www.aquariumpharm.com/pimafix.html direct snip of full paragraph- In extreme cases of especially stubborn infections, PimaFix has been designed to work synergistically with MelaFix. Using PimaFix and MelaFix together provides the added benefit of quick tissue regeneration and wound healing. --- Lenny Vasbinder <lnvtm1@...> wrote: > Here are cut and paste product descriptions and > FAQ's from Melafix and Pimafix... well, there were > no FAQ's on Pimafix but the product description says > "PimaFix has been formulated to work in combination > with MelaFix to enhance effectiveness against fish > diseases"... among other things. These snips are > directly from the Aquarium Pharmaceuticals web site. > > MelaFix® > > Heals open wounds & abrasions, treats fin and tail > rot, eye cloud, mouth fungus and promotes regrowth > of damaged fin rays & tissue. Will not adversely > affect the biological filter, alter the pH, or > discolor water. Safe for reef aquariums and live > plants. For use in fresh or salt water. > > MelaFix FAQ's- > > Can MelaFix be used with other medications? > > MelaFix has been tested and found compatible with > Aquarium Pharmaceuticals medications. Mixing other > brands of medications is not recommended. > > Is MelaFix harmful to aquatic plants? > > MelaFix can be used in aquariums and ponds > containing live plants. > > Will MelaFix kill snails? > > No. > > Can I use MelaFix in aquariums containing freshwater > crabs and shrimp? > > Yes. > > Will MelaFix hurt saltwater invertebrates? > > No. MelaFix is reef-compatible. MelaFix has been > shown to promote the healing of damaged coral > tissue. > > I have a protein skimmer. Will MelaFix cause > foaming? > > MelaFix will cause some increased foaming during the > treatment. We recommend turning the skimmer down or > off during treatment with MelaFix. > > Do I have to remove the activated carbon from my > filter when treating with MelaFix? > > We suggest removing the carbon while treating with > any medication. > > > > PimaFix > > Treats fungal infections and both internal and > external bacterial infections. Will not adversely > affect the biological filter, alter the pH, or > discolor water. Safe for reef aquariums and live > plants. For use in fresh or salt water. PimaFix has > been formulated to work in combination with MelaFix > to enhance effectiveness against fish diseases. > > > Lenny Vasbinder > http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com > 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 > LNVTM1@... > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13842	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water (now debate about Melafix and Pimafix)

i do sell both products, and support the use of both products, just not combined togther. most of the lfs's in the bay area of california are decent and will warn the same as i have done. we have sold it, and seen it, not just heard about it. i have done it myself on clients tanks and seen the results first hand and with 15 years experience i do know what i am doing and know how to measure. no one ever said do not do it, this whole thing started because i said it can be fatal. it was plain and simple a warning from experience. --- Lenny Vasbinder <lnvtm1@...> wrote: > Melafix and Pimafix are made by Aquarium > Pharmaceuticals http://www.aquariumpharm.com .. the > maker of many, many aquarium related products.. > water treatments, Master Test Kits, etc. They are > the US distributors for Rena products like the > Filstar Canister filter, Rena Air pumps, Rena > Heaters, etc. > > To imply that they don't test their products before > putting it on the label and website to "increase > sales" is ludicrous since they do not sell fish.. at > least not from what I've seen on their web pages. > > You say that you have only heard of it happening to > other people, yet you want to say they cannot be > mixed and in the same sentence you implore others to > not recommend it if we do not know for ourselves. > Well, I do know for myself. > > You also say "do not believe every thing you read".. > so does that mean we should not believe what AP says > about Melafix and Pimafix or not believe what you > are saying? > > You SHOULD read the labeling on the two bottles the > next time you are in a LFS. These are some of the > few products that are 100% natural and will not kill > your biofilter, affect your pH, etc. > > They probably aren't as strong as some of the other > "chemicals" out there, but they have been safe when > used as directed for my fish. > > I see people misuse things all the time and maybe > that is what has happened to the people who KILLED > all of their fish. Maybe they tried bumping the > dosage to "make it work faster" and they KILLED > their fish when they did not follow the directions. > We all know many, many people that kill their fish > for not following directions for cycling, > compatibility, etc., etc. > > Just like the 1" rule that so many people throw > around.. that is a fish KILLING rule. It only > works for about 25% of fish... the ones that stay > under 3" as adults. It does not work for Goldfish.. > one of the most popular beginner fish... and it does > not work for nearly any other fish that gets over 3" > as an adult. > > What all of this is saying is that you are right > about not believing every thing you read.. but it > does not mean that every thing you read is wrong. > If someone asks for advice in this or any other > forum and you disagree with the advice, just state > your opinion or advice. Don't claim that the other > advice or opinion is wrong when you readily admit > that you are not a "chemist". > > I do not work for, or own stock in Aquarium > Pharmaceuticals... do you work for the competition? > > Oh well.. you had your rant and now that's my rant > du jour. > > Lenny Vasbinder > http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com > 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 > LNVTM1@... > > Message: 15 > Date: Mon, 25 Jul 2005 22:58:54 -0000 > From: "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@...> > Subject: Re: Foamy water > > Do not believe everything that you read! Do you > REALLY KNOW for sure > whether or not Melafix and Pimafix can be mixed? If > not, please do > not recommend such a thing to other newer Forum > members who may not > know better. Paul is 100% correct on this one. I > too have seen and > learned of many cases of hobbyists I know mixing > these > two "medications" together and wiping out their > tanks. Most of these > tanks were well established over many years with one > fish having a > scrape or slight sore with all the other fish being > healthy, as in > cases that Paul has seen. By themselves, these > remedies are great, > so I am not trying to bash them. I am not a > chemist, so I cannot > tell you what happens when you put them together, > only that it kills > fish. Can't say why the manufacturer would > recommend it -- I would > hope it wouldn't just be to increase sales, but it > would seem obvious > they may not have really tried mixing these two meds > as a test in a > healthy fish-populated aquarium or I'm sure they > would have found it > to be detrimental. My gut feeling is that there may > be other unseen > factors involved when mixing these two, such as > maybe the water was > below a certain pH (6.6? for instance), or the water > was high in > magnesium or any number of things in these aquariums > which were not > ordinarily unsafe nor uncommon as all the aquariums > involved must > have had similar parameters, but were fatal when > these TWO meds were > introduced to the tank together. Maybe when mixing > them, you can add > no more than half strength of each one to get a > total treatment -- > that I couldn't tell you, but I can tell you mixing > them can be > fatal, even if not all the time. Although I haven't > heard of any > successful mixed treatments. Ray > > \ > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" > > <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > Hmmm.. it says on their web page and the packaging > that melafix and > > pimafix CAN be used together, that they are > complementary. What > > happens when you put them together that is fatal > and why would the > > manufacturer recommend it, then? > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > wrote: > > > they should not be used together, and can have > fatal > > > results when mixed at the same time. alone they > are > > > safe...together not so much > > > > > > --- thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > > > > > > Have you started treating your tank with > anything? > > > > I believe certain > > > > medications, such as melafix and pimafix -- > which > > > > can be used > > > > together, by the way -- cause foam to appear. > Sorry > > > > to not be of more > > > > help. > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & > Leslie > > > > Moore" > > > > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > > > > My water has developed a foam type around > the > > > > edges as well as a few > > > > > spots of randome floating clumps. The foam > is all > > > > along the edge of > > > > the > > > > > tank as well as the filter, spray wand, > etc... > > > > > All the tests are fine. No ammonia, > nitrites or > > > > high nitrates. > > > > > > > > > > I read a post a while back where someone > else had > > > > some "foam" but I > > > > > can't remember which group or what the > outcome > > > > was. > > > > > > > > > > any ideas? > > > > > > > > > > Leslie > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13843	From: sandy	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: NEW FISH??

MY CHILDREN BOUGHT ME A RED BELLY PACU? I DO NOT KNOW A THING ABOUT THIS FISH, EXCEPT THAT IT GETS FAIRLY BIG, CAN ANYONE TELL ME ABOUT IT'S CARE NEEDS?? AND FEEDING NEEDS?? PLEASE

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13844	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: PimaFix and MelaFix

the quotes you have taken from the site contraindicate the bottles directions. the webs ite says 20-50% change every 3 days and the bottle quote you have posted says 25% after 7 days...little odd huh? also the website says IN EXTREME CASES. --- thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@...> wrote: > "PimaFix > > Treats fungal infections and both internal and > external bacterial > infections. Will not adversely affect the biological > filter, alter > thepH, or discolor water. Safe for reef aquariums > and live plants. > For use in fresh or salt water. PimaFix has been > formulated to work > in combination with MelaFix to enhance effectiveness > against fish > diseases" > > "In extreme cases of especially stubborn infections, > PimaFix has been > designed to work synergistically with MelaFix. Using > PimaFix and > MelaFix together provides the added benefit of quick > tissue > regeneration and wound healing." > > "Whenever treating with any medication, we suggest > performing a 25- > 50% water change every three days depending on the > organic load in > water." > > These quotes are from the aquarium pharmaceuticals > webpage. I am > certainly not saying that both should be used > together based on > several posts here that have stated there is a > terrible reaction when > used simultaneously, I just wanted to show you that > I was NOT, in > fact, making up that the manufacturer states they > are safe to use > together. > > "When used in combination with PimaFix, MelaFix > provides a more > effective treatment against fish disease and > promotes rapid healing" > is written on the label of the melafix bottle I > have. > > "PimaFix has been specially formulated to work in > combination with > MelaFix for a more effective treatment against > stubborn fish disease > and to promote rapid healing" is written on the > label of the pimafix > I have. > > Both labels say to dose daily for 7 days, then do a > 25% water change. > > This is why I have been confused. I am not > belittling the experiences > told on this forum about fatalities that occured > when both > medications were used, I am just pointing out how it > can be so hard > to know if you are doing the right thing if you > cannot believe a > manufaturer's label or business website! > > I appreciate everyone's insight into this topic and > apologize for the > long post :) > > Rebecca > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13845	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: New Guy

i used a 50 gallon tank for an iguanna for 2 years, hosed it out and used it for 3 years for fish with no problems at all. --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > I have a 20 gallon that I used to have anoles in > that is now housing > fish...I have had no probs and I hand the lizards in > there for about 2 > years. Guess there is an exception to everything, > huh? > > Eric > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of bennedh76 > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:46 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: New Guy > > > The previous owner raisd fish and says that it was > only used for > fish. Thank you for the info, that is good to know > for future > purchases. > Heeth > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" > <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > Keeth, Before you beat yourself up anymore, or > smash the tank, > Let > > me know if this used tank was previously used for > reptiles (or > > mammals). If you don't know, try to find out. > Reptile tanks > cannot > > be used for fish afterwards, The strong undiluted > urine from > reptiles > > (and mammals) permeates the silicone sealant (much > as malachite > green > > does when using some Ich cures) and comes back out > into solution > when > > you fill the tank with water. It will kill the > fish everytime. > Ray > > > \ > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "bennedh76" > <bennedh76@y...> > > wrote: > > > Hello, My name is Heeth I have just recently > purchased an > aquarium. > > I > > > am just about to the point of pulling all my > hair out and > smashing > > > the 55gal fish killing machine. I cannot figure > it out, I have > > tested > > > the; PH=7.5, Nitrites=0, Chloramine=0, > Ammonia=0. > > > > > > So far I bought some gold fish to get the > bacteria up, got rid > of > > > them and got some misc. community fish - Had a > algae bloom and > most > > > everything died even the Placo the only thing > that survived was > the > > > frog and the beta. So I cleaned and treated the > algae and > cleaned > > it > > > up. Shortly after the beta and frog crossed > over. So I waited a > > > couple weeks treated the water for parasites and > algae tested > all > > the > > > things that I listed in the beginning and those > were the results > so > > I > > > figured that I was safe. Yesterday I went and > bought three > > Chichlids > > > and put them in, so far two have died and the > third is barely > > making > > > it. > > > > > > I did buy a couple little tiny baskets of sea > shells from Wal- > Mart > > > boiled and cleaned them, put some glassware and > marbles in as > well. > > > Also this tank had been previously owned but I > did clean it. > > > > > > I think that is about all as far as backgrounds > go. Can anyone > HELP > > > or does anyone have any suggestions? > > > Thank you, and I am looking forward to being > part of the group. > > > Heeth > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when > replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the > web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13846	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: NEW FISH??

grows to approximately 21 inches in the tank, eats anything it feels like eating including your other fish. will require a 100 gallon tank within 2 years. double in size roughly every 6 to 8 months. not a peaceful community fish as often sold. is a charisen (sp) --- sandy <honeylove_71@...> wrote: > MY CHILDREN BOUGHT ME A RED BELLY PACU? I DO NOT > KNOW A THING ABOUT > THIS FISH, EXCEPT THAT IT GETS FAIRLY BIG, CAN > ANYONE TELL ME ABOUT > IT'S CARE NEEDS?? AND FEEDING NEEDS?? PLEASE > > > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13847	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution

no...while water (especially salt) is an excellent conductor, water is not touching the floor and therefore has no where to convey. grounding needs contact direct contact with the ground. if there is a current in the water and you are wearing rubber soled shoes you will not be shocked because the rubber inhibits the currents path. if you wore leather soles you would get shocked. nothing in the aquarium is contacting the floor directly. glass is an insolator so electricity does not flow through it. the electricity has to have a place to strike like lightning does on the earth. --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > Aren't they grounded by the water? > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Dane & Leslie Moore > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:17 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > Electrocution > > > Fish are not grounded so they won't be electrocuted > huh? Hmmm. Lol > Sorry but that's funny. > > -----Original Message---- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 9:48 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > > > > In a message dated 7/25/2005 6:47:32 P.M. Central > Standard Time, > wtfmorlok@... writes: > > toss the heater, it is no good and will electricute > you. ufortunately we have some folks here that do > not understand the > way electricity works, and have warned you about > fish being > electricuted. fish are not grounded and will not > be electricuted > > > Again, your knowledge here is great information. I > would have never > know > that (same principal as bird on a wire) fish can not > get electrocuted. > But who > are you? > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when > replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important > to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the > original message MODIFY > the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter, AquaticLife > Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when > replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the > web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13848	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution

funny and true --- Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: > Fish are not grounded so they won't be electrocuted > huh? Hmmm. Lol > Sorry but that's funny. > > -----Original Message---- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 9:48 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > > > > In a message dated 7/25/2005 6:47:32 P.M. Central > Standard Time, > wtfmorlok@... writes: > > toss the heater, it is no good and will electricute > you. ufortunately we have some folks here that do > not understand the > way electricity works, and have warned you about > fish being > electricuted. fish are not grounded and will not > be electricuted > > > Again, your knowledge here is great information. I > would have never > know > that (same principal as bird on a wire) fish can not > get electrocuted. > But who > are you? > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when > replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important > to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the > original message MODIFY > the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter, AquaticLife > Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13849	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: PimaFix/MelaFix

again, i am stating that the bottle indicates a 20% ish water change after 7 days of treatment and the website states to do a 20-50% every 3 days during treatment. maybe this is their way of warning without accepting blame. --- Crazy4fids@... wrote: > > In a message dated 7/25/2005 7:35:40 P.M. Central > Standard Time, > wtfmorlok@... writes: > > yup, i think anothe rbig factor may be the fact > that > you are supposed to treat daily for seven days i > believe, followed by a 20% water change, but the > pimafix website says to change 20-50% every 3 days > when medicating, and they emphasize it as a must! > > > > I used this (PimaFix) to treat my rummy nose tetras > (they looked like they > were eating powdered sugar donuts). I don't recall > seeing anything on the > bottle that says to do a water change after three > days. I will have to pick up > another bottle and read it more closely. The remedy > worked well (saw > improvements after 24 hours and was completely gone > in four days) but I did have > rather cloudy water. I did a 50% water change on > day eight, and still had > cloudy water. This is the second week after > treatment and I did a 25% water > change today and the cloudiness is almost gone. > Some of the cloudiness may have > been due to the exposed laterite in my tank. > > I also have a bottle of MelaFix in my cabinet just > in case. I would rather > try an herbal remedy first than to jump into a > antibiotic or fungal remedy. > I guess it would all depend on who and how many were > sick and whether I was > treating the whole tank or just a quarantine tank. > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13850	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater?

i am paul lol. yes it is similar to principal that a bird on A wire is not grounded, but a bird on 2 wires is and will be roasted! that is also why a person can grab A wire and not get electricuted, but the moment they touch the other wire, they are completeing the circuit and grounding the wires with eachother. i say similar because the wires are grounded at some point themselves where the taquarium is a non conductive material to start with , whether acrylic or glass. --- Crazy4fids@... wrote: > > In a message dated 7/25/2005 6:47:32 P.M. Central > Standard Time, > wtfmorlok@... writes: > > toss the heater, it is no good and will electricute > you. ufortunately we have some folks here that do > not > understand the way electricity works, and have > warned > you about fish being electricuted. fish are not > grounded and will not be electricuted > > > Again, your knowledge here is great information. I > would have never know > that (same principal as bird on a wire) fish can not > get electrocuted. But who > are you? > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Read only the mail you want - Yahoo! Mail SpamGuard. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13851	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water

once again was me paul --- Crazy4fids@... wrote: > > In a message dated 7/25/2005 6:43:26 P.M. Central > Standard Time, > wtfmorlok@... writes: > > in EXTREME cases, not everyday use. in addition, i > know that we have had some "medical" responses, but > these are not "medications" but rather tea tree and > bay tree extracts, not true antibiotics or anti > fungals meaning not engineered to be used in this > way. > they may function well in the application, but this > is hollistic not pharmaceutical. > > > > It sure would be nice if people would sign their > posts so all of us know who > the info is coming from. Thanks > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13852	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater?

direct application of current from the eel to its pray. much like a cattle prod. prod only works when applied directly, not when held several feet away --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > I did not know that...I figured that since they were > in the water, if you > electrified the water, you would have fish soup. > How does an electric eel > fry it's dinner if dinner isn't grounded then? I > understand how electricity > works BTW. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of paul helms > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 6:45 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > > > toss the heater, it is no good and will electricute > you. ufortunately we have some folks here that do > not > understand the way electricity works, and have > warned > you about fish being electricuted. fish are not > grounded and will not be electricuted. > > --- japanesegorilla05 <japanesegorilla05@...> > wrote: > > > Hi all, I just bought an used aquarium with misc. > > accessories. It was > > quite a deal; everything works great thus far. The > > only concern that I > > have is for the heater. It appears to have water > in > > it, and looks > > rather discolored and corroded. Is this alright, > or > > should I just toss > > it? > > > > Thanks, > > Jay > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when > replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the > web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13853	From: snailcrazymom	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: eBay

Well I do agree that he was nice enough to give me my money back, well mainly because I filed with paypal...however I dont agree that once it leaves the sellers hands that the responsibilty ends there. The snails I got were not healthy for a long time and you could tell they lived in very over crowded conditions...this did NOT happen in the 2 days while the USPS had them.....and I also dont agree that he was a "good" seller because now I am stuck with these snails...I could send them back to him but why would I do that to the poor snails when I know they are better off with me...of course they will never be show snails :O) They are ugly and beat up....but I love them now just the same.... Rho > As everyone knows things happen. Maybe the snails where in tip top shape when > he sent them,.Things happen. Once they leave a sellers hands its out of > there control. > > > He refunded your $ and was professional about how he treated you. That sounds > like a Great Ebay seller to me. I have run across some sellers who will not > even return an email, little alone money. > > rob > Indiana > > over 400 + remarks on Ebay and 1- remark > > > In a message dated 7/20/2005 11:10:54 PM US Eastern Standard Time, > yarncrazymom@y... writes: > Oh no I just dont want any trouble with anyone..I dont see anyone else > stepping up to put anyones name out as a bad seller....I would hate to > be the only one.....There are only a few on Ebay that > sell "freshwater" Snails...so chances are its one of them :O) They did > send me a refund and was professional about it but the poor snails > suffered... > > Rhonda > http://groups > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13854	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: question about fish disapearing

brightly clored aggressive fresh water fish are from 3 lakes in africa. --- camdogkingsfan <camdog@...> wrote: > My What? african cichlids? What is that? > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > <wtfmorlok@y...> > wrote: > > sounds like you put african cichlids in with > tetras > > and they are doing what they do! > > > > --- camdogkingsfan <camdog@s...> wrote: > > > > > Hello all. Let me try and keep my story and > > > question short. I have > > > had a 25 gallon take for about 3 years. In > there I > > > have had a Pasco, > > > black ghost knife, 4 black skirt tetras, 4 albno > > > catfish, 2 clear > > > looking catfish (sorry I can't remember the name > of > > > them right > > > now),and 2 upside down catfish. Now before you > get > > > on my case about > > > have that many fish I already know. Well I > upgraded > > > to bigger > > > aquaruim about a month ago to a 48 gallon. I > put > > > all those fish in > > > there along with 3 small fish. I can't remember > the > > > name of them > > > right now. I know they are about an inch long > and > > > one is yellow, the > > > other two where blue and gray. Very pretty. > Well I > > > noticed earlier > > > this week. One of the small fish were gone. I > saw > > > the other two > > > about 1:00 pm my time. Then I came home at 4:00 > pm > > > and the yellow > > > was > > > the only one left. Then on Friday I saw that > one of > > > my tetras fins > > > looked missing or chewed up. I woke up Saturday > and > > > he was gone. > > > This morning I saw one of the other tetras fins > is > > > kinda mussed up. > > > Does anyone know what is going on? Is the Knife > > > eating the fish? I > > > feed my fish very well. I give them bottom > feeding > > > food and two > > > Brine > > > Shrimp cubes. Can anyone help? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > protection around > > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13855	From: paul helms	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: snails

add loaches --- Sandy Kay <knightwriter101@...> wrote: > I have a problem with small snails. I bought some > live plants a few weeks > ago and was told to wash the plants off good with > cold water because the > store knew they had a problem with snails at that > time. > > I did and thought I was okay. I am now seeing small > snails, about 5 a day, > which I pick off and take out of the tank. > > I do not know anything about snails, other than the > store told me they will > eat my live plants. Is there anything I can do that > is safe for the tank to > rid it of them? > > Thank you, Sandy > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13856	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy Water (now the debate on MelaFix and PimaFix)

The quick regen is because the antibacterial is keeping the wound clean while the antifungal keeps the fungus at bay. That is why you see antibiotics (both internal and topical) used in human medicine. I would have to agree that there is another factor involved and that this has nothing to do with the combo of the 2. BTW...I don;t remember who made the comment, but just because this is a holistic herbal preparation, it does not mean that it is not medication. Keep in mind (whether you are treating your fish or yourself) that herbs are the basis of most medicines we have today. The only difference is that the meds we have today are synthetically produced where possible. Just because you chewed on some willow bark to cure your headache instead of taking a couple of tablets of Bayer aspirin doesn't mean you avoided taking medicine. It's the same compound in he inner bark of the willow tree as what's in that tablet of aspirin you bought at the store. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of paul helms Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 12:44 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: Foamy Water (now the debate on MelaFix and PimaFix) i was on the pimafix website and that is not the language used there. i understand you got this from ap's website, but that is not the onlything out there. there is really nothing to debate here. expperience shows direct contradiction. take it or leave it, i am not gonna argue about it. i am also looking at aquarium pharm directly on their pimafix.html site, and the wording is not the same as what you have cut and pasted. you can copy and paste the link before for the full article by ap. http://www.aquariumpharm.com/pimafix.html direct snip of full paragraph- In extreme cases of especially stubborn infections, PimaFix has been designed to work synergistically with MelaFix. Using PimaFix and MelaFix together provides the added benefit of quick tissue regeneration and wound healing. --- Lenny Vasbinder <lnvtm1@...> wrote: > Here are cut and paste product descriptions and > FAQ's from Melafix and Pimafix... well, there were > no FAQ's on Pimafix but the product description says > "PimaFix has been formulated to work in combination > with MelaFix to enhance effectiveness against fish > diseases"... among other things. These snips are > directly from the Aquarium Pharmaceuticals web site. > > MelaFix® > > Heals open wounds & abrasions, treats fin and tail > rot, eye cloud, mouth fungus and promotes regrowth > of damaged fin rays & tissue. Will not adversely > affect the biological filter, alter the pH, or > discolor water. Safe for reef aquariums and live > plants. For use in fresh or salt water. > > MelaFix FAQ's- > > Can MelaFix be used with other medications? > > MelaFix has been tested and found compatible with > Aquarium Pharmaceuticals medications. Mixing other > brands of medications is not recommended. > > Is MelaFix harmful to aquatic plants? > > MelaFix can be used in aquariums and ponds > containing live plants. > > Will MelaFix kill snails? > > No. > > Can I use MelaFix in aquariums containing freshwater > crabs and shrimp? > > Yes. > > Will MelaFix hurt saltwater invertebrates? > > No. MelaFix is reef-compatible. MelaFix has been > shown to promote the healing of damaged coral > tissue. > > I have a protein skimmer. Will MelaFix cause > foaming? > > MelaFix will cause some increased foaming during the > treatment. We recommend turning the skimmer down or > off during treatment with MelaFix. > > Do I have to remove the activated carbon from my > filter when treating with MelaFix? > > We suggest removing the carbon while treating with > any medication. > > > > PimaFix > > Treats fungal infections and both internal and > external bacterial infections. Will not adversely > affect the biological filter, alter the pH, or > discolor water. Safe for reef aquariums and live > plants. For use in fresh or salt water. PimaFix has > been formulated to work in combination with MelaFix > to enhance effectiveness against fish diseases. > > > Lenny Vasbinder > http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com > 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 > LNVTM1@... > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13857	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/25/2005
Subject: Re: snails

Queen loaches and clown loaches love them. I have them in both of my tanks and they serve a useful purpose of chowing on the mulm in the gravel and keeping my loaches' bellies full *grin* You might have to knock them off the glass so the loach will find them. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of paul helms Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 1:11 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] snails add loaches --- Sandy Kay <knightwriter101@...> wrote: > I have a problem with small snails. I bought some > live plants a few weeks > ago and was told to wash the plants off good with > cold water because the > store knew they had a problem with snails at that > time. > > I did and thought I was okay. I am now seeing small > snails, about 5 a day, > which I pick off and take out of the tank. > > I do not know anything about snails, other than the > store told me they will > eat my live plants. Is there anything I can do that > is safe for the tank to > rid it of them? > > Thank you, Sandy > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13858	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water (now debate about Melafix and Pimafix)

Have you contacted Aquarium Pharmaceuticals about this. If it is the combo of the product, I am sure they would like to know this so that can either fix the problem or at least stop saying they are safe to use together. Maybe with a water sample, they can figure out what really killed the fish. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of paul helms Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 12:47 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: Foamy water (now debate about Melafix and Pimafix) i do sell both products, and support the use of both products, just not combined togther. most of the lfs's in the bay area of california are decent and will warn the same as i have done. we have sold it, and seen it, not just heard about it. i have done it myself on clients tanks and seen the results first hand and with 15 years experience i do know what i am doing and know how to measure. no one ever said do not do it, this whole thing started because i said it can be fatal. it was plain and simple a warning from experience. --- Lenny Vasbinder <lnvtm1@...> wrote: > Melafix and Pimafix are made by Aquarium > Pharmaceuticals http://www.aquariumpharm.com .. the > maker of many, many aquarium related products.. > water treatments, Master Test Kits, etc. They are > the US distributors for Rena products like the > Filstar Canister filter, Rena Air pumps, Rena > Heaters, etc. > > To imply that they don't test their products before > putting it on the label and website to "increase > sales" is ludicrous since they do not sell fish.. at > least not from what I've seen on their web pages. > > You say that you have only heard of it happening to > other people, yet you want to say they cannot be > mixed and in the same sentence you implore others to > not recommend it if we do not know for ourselves. > Well, I do know for myself. > > You also say "do not believe every thing you read".. > so does that mean we should not believe what AP says > about Melafix and Pimafix or not believe what you > are saying? > > You SHOULD read the labeling on the two bottles the > next time you are in a LFS. These are some of the > few products that are 100% natural and will not kill > your biofilter, affect your pH, etc. > > They probably aren't as strong as some of the other > "chemicals" out there, but they have been safe when > used as directed for my fish. > > I see people misuse things all the time and maybe > that is what has happened to the people who KILLED > all of their fish. Maybe they tried bumping the > dosage to "make it work faster" and they KILLED > their fish when they did not follow the directions. > We all know many, many people that kill their fish > for not following directions for cycling, > compatibility, etc., etc. > > Just like the 1" rule that so many people throw > around.. that is a fish KILLING rule. It only > works for about 25% of fish... the ones that stay > under 3" as adults. It does not work for Goldfish.. > one of the most popular beginner fish... and it does > not work for nearly any other fish that gets over 3" > as an adult. > > What all of this is saying is that you are right > about not believing every thing you read.. but it > does not mean that every thing you read is wrong. > If someone asks for advice in this or any other > forum and you disagree with the advice, just state > your opinion or advice. Don't claim that the other > advice or opinion is wrong when you readily admit > that you are not a "chemist". > > I do not work for, or own stock in Aquarium > Pharmaceuticals... do you work for the competition? > > Oh well.. you had your rant and now that's my rant > du jour. > > Lenny Vasbinder > http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com > 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 > LNVTM1@... > > Message: 15 > Date: Mon, 25 Jul 2005 22:58:54 -0000 > From: "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@...> > Subject: Re: Foamy water > > Do not believe everything that you read! Do you > REALLY KNOW for sure > whether or not Melafix and Pimafix can be mixed? If > not, please do > not recommend such a thing to other newer Forum > members who may not > know better. Paul is 100% correct on this one. I > too have seen and > learned of many cases of hobbyists I know mixing > these > two "medications" together and wiping out their > tanks. Most of these > tanks were well established over many years with one > fish having a > scrape or slight sore with all the other fish being > healthy, as in > cases that Paul has seen. By themselves, these > remedies are great, > so I am not trying to bash them. I am not a > chemist, so I cannot > tell you what happens when you put them together, > only that it kills > fish. Can't say why the manufacturer would > recommend it -- I would > hope it wouldn't just be to increase sales, but it > would seem obvious > they may not have really tried mixing these two meds > as a test in a > healthy fish-populated aquarium or I'm sure they > would have found it > to be detrimental. My gut feeling is that there may > be other unseen > factors involved when mixing these two, such as > maybe the water was > below a certain pH (6.6? for instance), or the water > was high in > magnesium or any number of things in these aquariums > which were not > ordinarily unsafe nor uncommon as all the aquariums > involved must > have had similar parameters, but were fatal when > these TWO meds were > introduced to the tank together. Maybe when mixing > them, you can add > no more than half strength of each one to get a > total treatment -- > that I couldn't tell you, but I can tell you mixing > them can be > fatal, even if not all the time. Although I haven't > heard of any > successful mixed treatments. Ray > > \ > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" > > <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > Hmmm.. it says on their web page and the packaging > that melafix and > > pimafix CAN be used together, that they are > complementary. What > > happens when you put them together that is fatal > and why would the > > manufacturer recommend it, then? > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > wrote: > > > they should not be used together, and can have > fatal > > > results when mixed at the same time. alone they > are > > > safe...together not so much > > > > > > --- thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > > > > > > Have you started treating your tank with > anything? > > > > I believe certain > > > > medications, such as melafix and pimafix -- > which > > > > can be used > > > > together, by the way -- cause foam to appear. > Sorry > > > > to not be of more > > > > help. > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & > Leslie > > > > Moore" > > > > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > > > > My water has developed a foam type around > the > > > > edges as well as a few > > > > > spots of randome floating clumps. The foam > is all > > > > along the edge of > > > > the > > > > > tank as well as the filter, spray wand, > etc... > > > > > All the tests are fine. No ammonia, > nitrites or > > > > high nitrates. > > > > > > > > > > I read a post a while back where someone > else had > > > > some "foam" but I > > > > > can't remember which group or what the > outcome > > > > was. > > > > > > > > > > any ideas? > > > > > > > > > > Leslie > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13859	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution

wouldn't there be a complete circuit from the wiring inside the heater? Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of paul helms Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 12:57 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? Electrocution no...while water (especially salt) is an excellent conductor, water is not touching the floor and therefore has no where to convey. grounding needs contact direct contact with the ground. if there is a current in the water and you are wearing rubber soled shoes you will not be shocked because the rubber inhibits the currents path. if you wore leather soles you would get shocked. nothing in the aquarium is contacting the floor directly. glass is an insolator so electricity does not flow through it. the electricity has to have a place to strike like lightning does on the earth. --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > Aren't they grounded by the water? > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Dane & Leslie Moore > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:17 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > Electrocution > > > Fish are not grounded so they won't be electrocuted > huh? Hmmm. Lol > Sorry but that's funny. > > -----Original Message---- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 9:48 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > > > > In a message dated 7/25/2005 6:47:32 P.M. Central > Standard Time, > wtfmorlok@... writes: > > toss the heater, it is no good and will electricute > you. ufortunately we have some folks here that do > not understand the > way electricity works, and have warned you about > fish being > electricuted. fish are not grounded and will not > be electricuted > > > Again, your knowledge here is great information. I > would have never > know > that (same principal as bird on a wire) fish can not > get electrocuted. > But who > are you? > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when > replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important > to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the > original message MODIFY > the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter, AquaticLife > Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when > replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the > web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13860	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water

I can personally 3rd this comment along with Paul :-) Melafix may not go well with a lot of other medications and I have suffered myself. Never really used pimafix but after the horror I went thru over a year ago, I have stopped using melafix as a water conditioner/air freshener just incase there is something in the tank that could cause it to bounce back. Even water conditioners strangely. I used a new water conditioner with melafix and within an hour all fish were gasping at the surface. Reasons not known as oxygen depletion was really not an issue. I have a couple of powerheads in the tank making it look like a water fall and even next day they still had to put an effort to breath. Luckily, no casualty but if I had gone to sleep without putting the powerhead then probably the entire tank would have gone belly up. Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: 25 July 2005 23:59 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Foamy water Do not believe everything that you read! Do you REALLY KNOW for sure whether or not Melafix and Pimafix can be mixed? If not, please do not recommend such a thing to other newer Forum members who may not know better. Paul is 100% correct on this one. I too have seen and learned of many cases of hobbyists I know mixing these two "medications" together and wiping out their tanks. Most of these tanks were well established over many years with one fish having a scrape or slight sore with all the other fish being healthy, as in cases that Paul has seen. By themselves, these remedies are great, so I am not trying to bash them. I am not a chemist, so I cannot tell you what happens when you put them together, only that it kills fish. Can't say why the manufacturer would recommend it -- I would hope it wouldn't just be to increase sales, but it would seem obvious they may not have really tried mixing these two meds as a test in a healthy fish-populated aquarium or I'm sure they would have found it to be detrimental. My gut feeling is that there may be other unseen factors involved when mixing these two, such as maybe the water was below a certain pH (6.6? for instance), or the water was high in magnesium or any number of things in these aquariums which were not ordinarily unsafe nor uncommon as all the aquariums involved must have had similar parameters, but were fatal when these TWO meds were introduced to the tank together. Maybe when mixing them, you can add no more than half strength of each one to get a total treatment -- that I couldn't tell you, but I can tell you mixing them can be fatal, even if not all the time. Although I haven't heard of any successful mixed treatments. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > Hmmm.. it says on their web page and the packaging that melafix and > pimafix CAN be used together, that they are complementary. What > happens when you put them together that is fatal and why would the > manufacturer recommend it, then? > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms <wtfmorlok@y...> > wrote: > > they should not be used together, and can have fatal > > results when mixed at the same time. alone they are > > safe...together not so much > > > > --- thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > > > > Have you started treating your tank with anything? > > > I believe certain > > > medications, such as melafix and pimafix -- which > > > can be used > > > together, by the way -- cause foam to appear. Sorry > > > to not be of more > > > help. > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie > > > Moore" > > > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > > > My water has developed a foam type around the > > > edges as well as a few > > > > spots of randome floating clumps. The foam is all > > > along the edge of > > > the > > > > tank as well as the filter, spray wand, etc... > > > > All the tests are fine. No ammonia, nitrites or > > > high nitrates. > > > > > > > > I read a post a while back where someone else had > > > some "foam" but I > > > > can't remember which group or what the outcome > > > was. > > > > > > > > any ideas? > > > > > > > > Leslie > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > > http://mail.yahoo.com ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13861	From: Robert Hickey	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Ph

Hi All Hope everyone is fine, :o) Im in an area I would say some Would love To be in Asthe Water we have is soft and the Ph is neutral. The problem Im having is that I have a few big pieces of bog wood in My tank and such release tanins and lower my ph ( which is great) but the problem I am having is that the ph is droping to 6, most of the fish don`t mind this as there all south american but I would prefer to keep it around 6.5 to 6.8. Im not into chemical buffers, so is there a way for me to buffer the ph to Around this , ? by using stone or other natural buffers? Many Thanks All Rob ----- Original Message ----- From: Ray Wetzel To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:38 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: New Guy Sorry, meant to write Heeth, but my fingers got crossed (lol). Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > Keeth, Before you beat yourself up anymore, or smash the tank, Let > me know if this used tank was previously used for reptiles (or > mammals). If you don't know, try to find out. Reptile tanks cannot > be used for fish afterwards, The strong undiluted urine from reptiles > (and mammals) permeates the silicone sealant (much as malachite green > does when using some Ich cures) and comes back out into solution when > you fill the tank with water. It will kill the fish everytime. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "bennedh76" <bennedh76@y...> > wrote: > > Hello, My name is Heeth I have just recently purchased an aquarium. > I > > am just about to the point of pulling all my hair out and smashing > > the 55gal fish killing machine. I cannot figure it out, I have > tested > > the; PH=7.5, Nitrites=0, Chloramine=0, Ammonia=0. > > > > So far I bought some gold fish to get the bacteria up, got rid of > > them and got some misc. community fish - Had a algae bloom and most > > everything died even the Placo the only thing that survived was the > > frog and the beta. So I cleaned and treated the algae and cleaned > it > > up. Shortly after the beta and frog crossed over. So I waited a > > couple weeks treated the water for parasites and algae tested all > the > > things that I listed in the beginning and those were the results so > I > > figured that I was safe. Yesterday I went and bought three > Chichlids > > and put them in, so far two have died and the third is barely > making > > it. > > > > I did buy a couple little tiny baskets of sea shells from Wal- Mart > > boiled and cleaned them, put some glassware and marbles in as well. > > Also this tank had been previously owned but I did clean it. > > > > I think that is about all as far as backgrounds go. Can anyone HELP > > or does anyone have any suggestions? > > Thank you, and I am looking forward to being part of the group. > > Heeth ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13862	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Ph

Rob, You can have a bag of coral gravel/sand or crushed washed sea shells in your filter to help buffer the PH but IMO its not worth it. You have no control over the tannins released by the bog wood and so you will also have no control over the carbonated released by the coral sand. It is possible that your PH may rise to as much as 8 which is not good. Bogwood releases tannins for as long as 6-8 months after which it will stop and you will start to get stability in the water. So just keep patience as PH of 6 will not harm the fish. But a PH of 8, and then dropping to 7 after a water change will. Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Robert Hickey Sent: 26 July 2005 10:21 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Ph Hi All Hope everyone is fine, :o) Im in an area I would say some Would love To be in Asthe Water we have is soft and the Ph is neutral. The problem Im having is that I have a few big pieces of bog wood in My tank and such release tanins and lower my ph ( which is great) but the problem I am having is that the ph is droping to 6, most of the fish don`t mind this as there all south american but I would prefer to keep it around 6.5 to 6.8. Im not into chemical buffers, so is there a way for me to buffer the ph to Around this , ? by using stone or other natural buffers? Many Thanks All Rob ----- Original Message ----- From: Ray Wetzel To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:38 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: New Guy Sorry, meant to write Heeth, but my fingers got crossed (lol). Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > Keeth, Before you beat yourself up anymore, or smash the tank, Let > me know if this used tank was previously used for reptiles (or > mammals). If you don't know, try to find out. Reptile tanks cannot > be used for fish afterwards, The strong undiluted urine from reptiles > (and mammals) permeates the silicone sealant (much as malachite green > does when using some Ich cures) and comes back out into solution when > you fill the tank with water. It will kill the fish everytime. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "bennedh76" <bennedh76@y...> > wrote: > > Hello, My name is Heeth I have just recently purchased an aquarium. > I > > am just about to the point of pulling all my hair out and smashing > > the 55gal fish killing machine. I cannot figure it out, I have > tested > > the; PH=7.5, Nitrites=0, Chloramine=0, Ammonia=0. > > > > So far I bought some gold fish to get the bacteria up, got rid of > > them and got some misc. community fish - Had a algae bloom and most > > everything died even the Placo the only thing that survived was the > > frog and the beta. So I cleaned and treated the algae and cleaned > it > > up. Shortly after the beta and frog crossed over. So I waited a > > couple weeks treated the water for parasites and algae tested all > the > > things that I listed in the beginning and those were the results so > I > > figured that I was safe. Yesterday I went and bought three > Chichlids > > and put them in, so far two have died and the third is barely > making > > it. > > > > I did buy a couple little tiny baskets of sea shells from Wal- Mart > > boiled and cleaned them, put some glassware and marbles in as well. > > Also this tank had been previously owned but I did clean it. > > > > I think that is about all as far as backgrounds go. Can anyone HELP > > or does anyone have any suggestions? > > Thank you, and I am looking forward to being part of the group. > > Heeth ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13863	From: Robert Hickey	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Ph

ok Thanks Nimish Most of the wood there has been a previous tank for 8/9 months so Will stay with it and see how it pans out Thanks (Irish)Rob ----- Original Message ----- From: Nimish Mathur To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 11:03 AM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Ph Rob, You can have a bag of coral gravel/sand or crushed washed sea shells in your filter to help buffer the PH but IMO its not worth it. You have no control over the tannins released by the bog wood and so you will also have no control over the carbonated released by the coral sand. It is possible that your PH may rise to as much as 8 which is not good. Bogwood releases tannins for as long as 6-8 months after which it will stop and you will start to get stability in the water. So just keep patience as PH of 6 will not harm the fish. But a PH of 8, and then dropping to 7 after a water change will. Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Robert Hickey Sent: 26 July 2005 10:21 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Ph Hi All Hope everyone is fine, :o) Im in an area I would say some Would love To be in Asthe Water we have is soft and the Ph is neutral. The problem Im having is that I have a few big pieces of bog wood in My tank and such release tanins and lower my ph ( which is great) but the problem I am having is that the ph is droping to 6, most of the fish don`t mind this as there all south american but I would prefer to keep it around 6.5 to 6.8. Im not into chemical buffers, so is there a way for me to buffer the ph to Around this , ? by using stone or other natural buffers? Many Thanks All Rob ----- Original Message ----- From: Ray Wetzel To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:38 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: New Guy Sorry, meant to write Heeth, but my fingers got crossed (lol). Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > Keeth, Before you beat yourself up anymore, or smash the tank, Let > me know if this used tank was previously used for reptiles (or > mammals). If you don't know, try to find out. Reptile tanks cannot > be used for fish afterwards, The strong undiluted urine from reptiles > (and mammals) permeates the silicone sealant (much as malachite green > does when using some Ich cures) and comes back out into solution when > you fill the tank with water. It will kill the fish everytime. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "bennedh76" <bennedh76@y...> > wrote: > > Hello, My name is Heeth I have just recently purchased an aquarium. > I > > am just about to the point of pulling all my hair out and smashing > > the 55gal fish killing machine. I cannot figure it out, I have > tested > > the; PH=7.5, Nitrites=0, Chloramine=0, Ammonia=0. > > > > So far I bought some gold fish to get the bacteria up, got rid of > > them and got some misc. community fish - Had a algae bloom and most > > everything died even the Placo the only thing that survived was the > > frog and the beta. So I cleaned and treated the algae and cleaned > it > > up. Shortly after the beta and frog crossed over. So I waited a > > couple weeks treated the water for parasites and algae tested all > the > > things that I listed in the beginning and those were the results so > I > > figured that I was safe. Yesterday I went and bought three > Chichlids > > and put them in, so far two have died and the third is barely > making > > it. > > > > I did buy a couple little tiny baskets of sea shells from Wal- Mart > > boiled and cleaned them, put some glassware and marbles in as well. > > Also this tank had been previously owned but I did clean it. > > > > I think that is about all as far as backgrounds go. Can anyone HELP > > or does anyone have any suggestions? > > Thank you, and I am looking forward to being part of the group. > > Heeth ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13864	From: Evita	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: hot water!

Not nessarily true about the cost of cooling your house these days. The air conditioner may be cheap but running it is not. I have to say I am really happy I have central air though as today they are calling for 100 plus here where I am in NC. I lived for many years without air and it was indeed "Killer". I even went through 4 preg. without air. Evita Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote:Turn the a/c up. Seriously, though. For everybody here who doesn't have an air conditioner: Get one. If you can afford a fish tank, you don't have any excuse to not have a good air conditioner to keep the room it is in cool in the summer, and a good safe heater to keep it warm in the winter. Not to mention you are more likely to die of heat stroke in your own house if you don't keep it cool. Also, if you can afford an internet connection, you have no excuse to not have an a/c. They aren't really that expensive. A lot cheaper than restocking your tanks or paying medical bills when you fall over dead. Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill -------Original Message------- Howdy! The water temp. has been off the chart in 1 of my tanks. I've been putting ice in a baggie & putting that in the tank, but it doesn't help much. My oscar's skin is coming off & he's not eating. I've also been putting med. in the tank. What else can I do? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13865	From: Evita	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution

Eric, Now this is one experiment I don't plan to try and test. I will saw no mater what the science of it is the bottom line we can and I would never use a broken heater. Evita Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: Aren't they grounded by the water? Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Dane & Leslie Moore Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:17 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? Electrocution Fish are not grounded so they won't be electrocuted huh? Hmmm. Lol Sorry but that's funny. -----Original Message---- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 9:48 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? In a message dated 7/25/2005 6:47:32 P.M. Central Standard Time, wtfmorlok@... writes: toss the heater, it is no good and will electricute you. ufortunately we have some folks here that do not understand the way electricity works, and have warned you about fish being electricuted. fish are not grounded and will not be electricuted Again, your knowledge here is great information. I would have never know that (same principal as bird on a wire) fish can not get electrocuted. But who are you? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13866	From: daniel_roachus	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater?

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > I'd toss it and get a new one. I have a feeling that if you fire it up you > are going to shock yourself or your fish... > > Eric > > on the plus side - fish soup is delicious!!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13867	From: paul helms	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution

only if you are touching the heater wires. electricity does not flow through glass, and the eloectricity only flows towards grounded objects like you. --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > wouldn't there be a complete circuit from the wiring > inside the heater? > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of paul helms > Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 12:57 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > Electrocution > > > no...while water (especially salt) is an excellent > conductor, water is not touching the floor and > therefore has no where to convey. grounding needs > contact direct contact with the ground. if there is > a > current in the water and you are wearing rubber > soled > shoes you will not be shocked because the rubber > inhibits the currents path. if you wore leather > soles > you would get shocked. nothing in the aquarium is > contacting the floor directly. glass is an > insolator > so electricity does not flow through it. the > electricity has to have a place to strike like > lightning does on the earth. > > --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > > > Aren't they grounded by the water? > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Dane & Leslie Moore > > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:17 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > > Electrocution > > > > > > Fish are not grounded so they won't be > electrocuted > > huh? Hmmm. Lol > > Sorry but that's funny. > > > > -----Original Message---- > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > > On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... > > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 9:48 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > > > > > > > > In a message dated 7/25/2005 6:47:32 P.M. Central > > Standard Time, > > wtfmorlok@... writes: > > > > toss the heater, it is no good and will > electricute > > you. ufortunately we have some folks here that > do > > not understand the > > way electricity works, and have warned you about > > fish being > > electricuted. fish are not grounded and will not > > be electricuted > > > > > > Again, your knowledge here is great information. > I > > would have never > > know > > that (same principal as bird on a wire) fish can > not > > get electrocuted. > > But who > > are you? > > > > Linda > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > when > > replying, thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > > that is NOT important > > to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the > > original message MODIFY > > the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > > subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > > matter, AquaticLife > > Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > > you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > when > > replying, thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > > that is NOT important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the > original > > message MODIFY the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > > subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > > matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > > you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on > the > > web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an > email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > === message truncated === __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13868	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution

Current in the water will not electrocute the fish. It will however electrocute anyone putting their hand in the water. Electricity in the water also has more effects then just electrocution. There have been reports that the fish start to lose their orientation and lateral lines if there is current in the water but this is not something that happens immediately. What can happen immediately are: Heater bursting off and sending out glass splinters. Heater malfunctioning and eventually making a fish soup. Someone getting electrocuted. Blowing up your main household circuit or fuse or RCDs. Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Roberts Sent: 26 July 2005 07:39 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? Electrocution wouldn't there be a complete circuit from the wiring inside the heater? Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of paul helms Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 12:57 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? Electrocution no...while water (especially salt) is an excellent conductor, water is not touching the floor and therefore has no where to convey. grounding needs contact direct contact with the ground. if there is a current in the water and you are wearing rubber soled shoes you will not be shocked because the rubber inhibits the currents path. if you wore leather soles you would get shocked. nothing in the aquarium is contacting the floor directly. glass is an insolator so electricity does not flow through it. the electricity has to have a place to strike like lightning does on the earth. --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > Aren't they grounded by the water? > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Dane & Leslie Moore > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:17 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > Electrocution > > > Fish are not grounded so they won't be electrocuted > huh? Hmmm. Lol > Sorry but that's funny. > > -----Original Message---- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 9:48 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > > > > In a message dated 7/25/2005 6:47:32 P.M. Central > Standard Time, > wtfmorlok@... writes: > > toss the heater, it is no good and will electricute > you. ufortunately we have some folks here that do > not understand the > way electricity works, and have warned you about > fish being > electricuted. fish are not grounded and will not > be electricuted > > > Again, your knowledge here is great information. I > would have never > know > that (same principal as bird on a wire) fish can not > get electrocuted. > But who > are you? > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when > replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important > to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the > original message MODIFY > the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter, AquaticLife > Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when > replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the > web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. 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PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13869	From: Evita	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: hot water!

Phil, Off the subject. Funny as it seems I saw on the news last night that people were calling the ice companies because it has been so hot to add big ice blocks to their swimming pools. We have the largest above ground pool Walmart sells and it is like bath water. I wonder how people with outdoor ponds fish are handling the hot temps. Evita Phil <swordtail72@...> wrote: Howdy! The water temp. has been off the chart in 1 of my tanks. I've been putting ice in a baggie & putting that in the tank, but it doesn't help much. My oscar's skin is coming off & he's not eating. I've also been putting med. in the tank. What else can I do? ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13870	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: New Guy

Eric, By your statement, I trust you are not refuting what I've taken the time to warn people about, although of course you don't need to believe me. Seems there are almost always exceptions to just about everything, except death and taxes, depending on slightly different and/or extenuating circumstances. You long-time Forum members may remember when posting such facts, I used to start such a post with "In general", meaning that it was correct 98% of the time, allowing for "the exception". I guess I got tired of having to include that, hoping that it would be realized that, from experience, these statements are valid. Am glad to see you (Eric) had no problem keeping fish in your 20, after keeping lizards (good for you), but if you did I'll bet you wouldn't have made the connection and probably would have been stumped if your fish died for no "apparent" reason. I don't know about the extenuating circumstances in your case (small lizards -- not Monitors, lots of bedding to soak up waste and frequent changes, etc.); I don't know and am not about to guess. But I've seen all too many of these cases over the years. In this area, any lfs's selling used tanks that were once used for reptiles always give this warning to the buyer. Almost happened to me with a used tank I got from an unknown source, but luckily I pulled the fish out in time and it revived. I don't post these warnings idley (I have better things to do), or without knowledge, but hope I can help the next person by passing this along which you may not have thought of or been aware of. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > I have a 20 gallon that I used to have anoles in that is now housing > fish...I have had no probs and I hand the lizards in there for about 2 > years. Guess there is an exception to everything, huh? > > Eric > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of bennedh76 > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:46 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: New Guy > > > The previous owner raisd fish and says that it was only used for > fish. Thank you for the info, that is good to know for future > purchases. > Heeth > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" > <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > Keeth, Before you beat yourself up anymore, or smash the tank, > Let > > me know if this used tank was previously used for reptiles (or > > mammals). If you don't know, try to find out. Reptile tanks > cannot > > be used for fish afterwards, The strong undiluted urine from > reptiles > > (and mammals) permeates the silicone sealant (much as malachite > green > > does when using some Ich cures) and comes back out into solution > when > > you fill the tank with water. It will kill the fish everytime. > Ray > > > \ > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "bennedh76" <bennedh76@y...> > > wrote: > > > Hello, My name is Heeth I have just recently purchased an > aquarium. > > I > > > am just about to the point of pulling all my hair out and > smashing > > > the 55gal fish killing machine. I cannot figure it out, I have > > tested > > > the; PH=7.5, Nitrites=0, Chloramine=0, Ammonia=0. > > > > > > So far I bought some gold fish to get the bacteria up, got rid > of > > > them and got some misc. community fish - Had a algae bloom and > most > > > everything died even the Placo the only thing that survived was > the > > > frog and the beta. So I cleaned and treated the algae and > cleaned > > it > > > up. Shortly after the beta and frog crossed over. So I waited a > > > couple weeks treated the water for parasites and algae tested > all > > the > > > things that I listed in the beginning and those were the results > so > > I > > > figured that I was safe. Yesterday I went and bought three > > Chichlids > > > and put them in, so far two have died and the third is barely > > making > > > it. > > > > > > I did buy a couple little tiny baskets of sea shells from Wal- > Mart > > > boiled and cleaned them, put some glassware and marbles in as > well. > > > Also this tank had been previously owned but I did clean it. > > > > > > I think that is about all as far as backgrounds go. Can anyone > HELP > > > or does anyone have any suggestions? > > > Thank you, and I am looking forward to being part of the group. > > > Heeth > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13871	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy Water (now the debate on MelaFix and PimaFix)

In a message dated 7/26/2005 12:16:26 A.M. Central Standard Time, lnvtm1@... writes: MelaFix® Heals open wounds & abrasions, treats fin and tail rot, eye cloud, mouth fungus and promotes regrowth of damaged fin rays & tissue. Will not adversely affect the biological filter, alter the pH, or discolor water. Safe for reef aquariums and live plants. For use in fresh or salt water. When I bought these two products, I was quite confused as to which one to get. It both sounds like they treat fungal infections, but the PimaFix looks like it is geared more toward bacterial infections. Sounds like the Melafix is a soothing agent and fungal tonic. I am just glad that it worked for me=) Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13872	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy Water (now the debate on MelaFix and PimaFix)

In a message dated 7/26/2005 1:36:56 A.M. Central Standard Time, woad@... writes: Just because you chewed on some willow bark to cure your headache instead of taking a couple of tablets of Bayer aspirin doesn't mean you avoided taking medicine. It's the same compound in he inner bark of the willow tree as what's in that tablet of aspirin you bought at the store. Chewing on willow bark will get rid of a headache? I've always used it for rooting new plants faster. LOL Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13873	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution

Yes they are. From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Roberts Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:24 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? Electrocution Aren't they grounded by the water? Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Dane & Leslie Moore Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:17 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? Electrocution Fish are not grounded so they won't be electrocuted huh? Hmmm. Lol Sorry but that's funny. -----Original Message---- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 9:48 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? In a message dated 7/25/2005 6:47:32 P.M. Central Standard Time, wtfmorlok@... writes: toss the heater, it is no good and will electricute you. ufortunately we have some folks here that do not understand the way electricity works, and have warned you about fish being electricuted. fish are not grounded and will not be electricuted Again, your knowledge here is great information. I would have never know that (same principal as bird on a wire) fish can not get electrocuted. But who are you? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13874	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution

Then why is that some of my friends fish died when there home was hit with lightening? Have kids stuff? Check out Zainy Zebra Consignment! Based in Cabot, AR www.ZainyZebra.com Live in or near Cabot? Join the Cabot Garage Sale! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/CabotgarageSale/ Live in Little Rock? Little Rock Garage Sale!http://groups.yahoo.com/group/LRgarageSale/ -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of paul helms Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 12:57 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? Electrocution no...while water (especially salt) is an excellent conductor, water is not touching the floor and therefore has no where to convey. grounding needs contact direct contact with the ground. if there is a current in the water and you are wearing rubber soled shoes you will not be shocked because the rubber inhibits the currents path. if you wore leather soles you would get shocked. nothing in the aquarium is contacting the floor directly. glass is an insolator so electricity does not flow through it. the electricity has to have a place to strike like lightning does on the earth. --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > Aren't they grounded by the water? > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Dane & Leslie Moore > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:17 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > Electrocution > > > Fish are not grounded so they won't be electrocuted > huh? Hmmm. Lol > Sorry but that's funny. > > -----Original Message---- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 9:48 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > > > > In a message dated 7/25/2005 6:47:32 P.M. Central > Standard Time, > wtfmorlok@... writes: > > toss the heater, it is no good and will electricute > you. ufortunately we have some folks here that do > not understand the > way electricity works, and have warned you about > fish being > electricuted. fish are not grounded and will not > be electricuted > > > Again, your knowledge here is great information. I > would have never > know > that (same principal as bird on a wire) fish can not > get electrocuted. > But who > are you? > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important > to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the > original message MODIFY > the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter, AquaticLife > Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the > web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13875	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water (now debate about Melafix and Pimafix)

Lenny, I'm well aware of the fine products Aquarium Pharmaceuticals produces; I don't need your reminder. \ If you read my post correctly, I did not say that the company does not test their products (before putting it on the label and website) to increase sales. Further, although they do not sell fish, I fail to see whether their selling fish or not has anything to do with the subject at hand. FYI, I wrote: "I would hope it WOULDN'T just be to increase their sales", as could be construed from a recommendation of mixing those two products, if they were a less than reputable. I was talking about product sales not fish sales in the case of them dying. I do maintain, in the wake of so many fish die-offs from mixing the two meds, that it appears they have not tested the mixture of these two meds (at least not thoroughly or in average established aquarium conditions), or they would have become aware of the toxic effects in at least a good portion of those trials. \ Again, you did not read my post correctly. I did not say that I have only "heard" of it (die-off) happening to other people. I said: "I too have SEEN and LEARNED of cases of many hobbyists I know mixing these two 'medications' together and wiping out their tanks". When I said "I have SEEN and LEARNED" of the die-offs, I meant EXACTLY that -- I did not just hear of it. I personally have seen the results of mixing the two remedies first-hand, over a period of a short time, with several of my friends' aquariums before we all realized what in the end became obvious to us all. I was there visiting on these occasions, as we do frequent each others' hatcheries. \ I figured you might pick up on my statement to "not read everything you read", leaving myself open for your consideration. You don't have to and obviously don't believe me, but I'm not posting this just to see myself type. Without you're trying this, you have no way of knowing, so why are you refuting me? Is it just because a big company like A P can do no wrong? I invite you to mix these two remedies into your tank and for you to try to tell me later that all your fish are fine. I will even pay you for the meds. Would you care to try it? You can wait until you see a "problem" with one of your fish, instead of treating them now unnecessarily. \ I know these products are 100% natural -- I use Melafix myself on ocassion. Agreed, they do not affect the biofilter, change the pH and are safe (if used by themselves). \ \It was asked on the Forum, "What happens when you put them together that is fatal . . . ?" I don't think anyone knows "what happens". The fact that I readily admit that I'm not a chemist does not mean I haven't seen the results of this med mixing -- it kills the fish -- don't believe me -- I prefer you don't -- find out the hard way. Of course everything you read is not wrong, I hope you're not saying that I'm implying the opposite. But some things are open to correction if found not to be right. By the way, what right have you to tell me to just state my opinion or advice. If I see someone posting something that known to be wrong (and I've seen the proof, the other person hasn't), I will post my ADVICE so that others on this Forum are forewarned. Oh yeah, any advice I give is not just an "opinion", but has a basis or I would not post it. \ While it may appear as if I'm saying that A P is wrong on their recommendation to mix the two meds, I'm saying the results I've personally seen says it all -- not to mix them. As I did bring out there may be variables and/or other factors involved, you (or anyone) are taking a BIG chance in mixing them even if not fatal 100% of the time. I will say that anyone who says its okay to mix them is wrong, based on many personal factual experiences I've had in this regard and that is not just an "opinion". Don't know why I'm writing this as I know you still won't believe me (that's OK, you have a right to your "opinion"), but I and Paul have pointed out many results of the mixing of these two meds always with a bad ending. Hopefully, if not yourself, others may heed our advice and prevent a possible disaster before it happens. That is our only purpose. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Lenny Vasbinder" <lnvtm1@g...> wrote: > Melafix and Pimafix are made by Aquarium Pharmaceuticals http://www.aquariumpharm.com .. the maker of many, many aquarium related products.. water treatments, Master Test Kits, etc. They are the US distributors for Rena products like the Filstar Canister filter, Rena Air pumps, Rena Heaters, etc. > > To imply that they don't test their products before putting it on the label and website to "increase sales" is ludicrous since they do not sell fish.. at least not from what I've seen on their web pages. > > You say that you have only heard of it happening to other people, yet you want to say they cannot be mixed and in the same sentence you implore others to not recommend it if we do not know for ourselves. Well, I do know for myself. > > You also say "do not believe every thing you read".. so does that mean we should not believe what AP says about Melafix and Pimafix or not believe what you are saying? > > You SHOULD read the labeling on the two bottles the next time you are in a LFS. These are some of the few products that are 100% natural and will not kill your biofilter, affect your pH, etc. > > They probably aren't as strong as some of the other "chemicals" out there, but they have been safe when used as directed for my fish. > > I see people misuse things all the time and maybe that is what has happened to the people who KILLED all of their fish. Maybe they tried bumping the dosage to "make it work faster" and they KILLED their fish when they did not follow the directions. We all know many, many people that kill their fish for not following directions for cycling, compatibility, etc., etc. > > Just like the 1" rule that so many people throw around.. that is a fish KILLING rule. It only works for about 25% of fish... the ones that stay under 3" as adults. It does not work for Goldfish.. one of the most popular beginner fish... and it does not work for nearly any other fish that gets over 3" as an adult. > > What all of this is saying is that you are right about not believing every thing you read.. but it does not mean that every thing you read is wrong. If someone asks for advice in this or any other forum and you disagree with the advice, just state your opinion or advice. Don't claim that the other advice or opinion is wrong when you readily admit that you are not a "chemist". > > I do not work for, or own stock in Aquarium Pharmaceuticals... do you work for the competition? > > Oh well.. you had your rant and now that's my rant du jour. > > Lenny Vasbinder > http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com > 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 > LNVTM1@g... > > Message: 15 > Date: Mon, 25 Jul 2005 22:58:54 -0000 > From: "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> > Subject: Re: Foamy water > > Do not believe everything that you read! Do you REALLY KNOW for sure > whether or not Melafix and Pimafix can be mixed? If not, please do > not recommend such a thing to other newer Forum members who may not > know better. Paul is 100% correct on this one. I too have seen and > learned of many cases of hobbyists I know mixing these > two "medications" together and wiping out their tanks. Most of these > tanks were well established over many years with one fish having a > scrape or slight sore with all the other fish being healthy, as in > cases that Paul has seen. By themselves, these remedies are great, > so I am not trying to bash them. I am not a chemist, so I cannot > tell you what happens when you put them together, only that it kills > fish. Can't say why the manufacturer would recommend it -- I would > hope it wouldn't just be to increase sales, but it would seem obvious > they may not have really tried mixing these two meds as a test in a > healthy fish-populated aquarium or I'm sure they would have found it > to be detrimental. My gut feeling is that there may be other unseen > factors involved when mixing these two, such as maybe the water was > below a certain pH (6.6? for instance), or the water was high in > magnesium or any number of things in these aquariums which were not > ordinarily unsafe nor uncommon as all the aquariums involved must > have had similar parameters, but were fatal when these TWO meds were > introduced to the tank together. Maybe when mixing them, you can add > no more than half strength of each one to get a total treatment -- > that I couldn't tell you, but I can tell you mixing them can be > fatal, even if not all the time. Although I haven't heard of any > successful mixed treatments. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" > <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > Hmmm.. it says on their web page and the packaging that melafix and > > pimafix CAN be used together, that they are complementary. What > > happens when you put them together that is fatal and why would the > > manufacturer recommend it, then? > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms <wtfmorlok@y...> > > wrote: > > > they should not be used together, and can have fatal > > > results when mixed at the same time. alone they are > > > safe...together not so much > > > > > > --- thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > > > > > > Have you started treating your tank with anything? > > > > I believe certain > > > > medications, such as melafix and pimafix -- which > > > > can be used > > > > together, by the way -- cause foam to appear. Sorry > > > > to not be of more > > > > help. > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie > > > > Moore" > > > > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > > > > My water has developed a foam type around the > > > > edges as well as a few > > > > > spots of randome floating clumps. The foam is all > > > > along the edge of > > > > the > > > > > tank as well as the filter, spray wand, etc... > > > > > All the tests are fine. No ammonia, nitrites or > > > > high nitrates. > > > > > > > > > > I read a post a while back where someone else had > > > > some "foam" but I > > > > > can't remember which group or what the outcome > > > > was. > > > > > > > > > > any ideas? > > > > > > > > > > Leslie > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13876	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater?

throw in some rue and some gumbo file...a few potatoes and okra and you have gumbo... Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of daniel_roachus Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 6:22 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Safe to use a heater? --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > I'd toss it and get a new one. I have a feeling that if you fire it up you > are going to shock yourself or your fish... > > Eric > > on the plus side - fish soup is delicious!! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13877	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution

I that is true...why would you get electrocuted if you drop a hair dryer in a tub...even f you are not touching either the dryer or a grounding source...you are fried still the same. I think you are incorrect on this one..not that I would want to test it to verify ;-) Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of paul helms Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 6:25 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? Electrocution only if you are touching the heater wires. electricity does not flow through glass, and the eloectricity only flows towards grounded objects like you. --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > wouldn't there be a complete circuit from the wiring > inside the heater? > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of paul helms > Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 12:57 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > Electrocution > > > no...while water (especially salt) is an excellent > conductor, water is not touching the floor and > therefore has no where to convey. grounding needs > contact direct contact with the ground. if there is > a > current in the water and you are wearing rubber > soled > shoes you will not be shocked because the rubber > inhibits the currents path. if you wore leather > soles > you would get shocked. nothing in the aquarium is > contacting the floor directly. glass is an > insolator > so electricity does not flow through it. the > electricity has to have a place to strike like > lightning does on the earth. > > --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > > > Aren't they grounded by the water? > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Dane & Leslie Moore > > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:17 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > > Electrocution > > > > > > Fish are not grounded so they won't be > electrocuted > > huh? Hmmm. Lol > > Sorry but that's funny. > > > > -----Original Message---- > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > > On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... > > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 9:48 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > > > > > > > > In a message dated 7/25/2005 6:47:32 P.M. Central > > Standard Time, > > wtfmorlok@... writes: > > > > toss the heater, it is no good and will > electricute > > you. ufortunately we have some folks here that > do > > not understand the > > way electricity works, and have warned you about > > fish being > > electricuted. fish are not grounded and will not > > be electricuted > > > > > > Again, your knowledge here is great information. > I > > would have never > > know > > that (same principal as bird on a wire) fish can > not > > get electrocuted. > > But who > > are you? > > > > Linda > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > when > > replying, thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > > that is NOT important > > to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the > > original message MODIFY > > the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > > subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > > matter, AquaticLife > > Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > > you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > when > > replying, thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > > that is NOT important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the > original > > message MODIFY the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > > subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > > matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > > you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on > the > > web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an > email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > === message truncated === __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13878	From: AQUARIUMFISH	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: I have fry!!!!!

OMG OMG OMG !!!!!!!!!!!!! I GOT FRY I have been walking around on shells trying not to shake the floor and make the eggs fall out of the nest but they must have been in there for more than one night because there are bunches of babies swimming around. OMG im so excited ... cant you tell. the male is scooping them up and putting them back in the nest and b4 he can do that a bunch more fall back down and swim back up lol more guy ... they look like a speck of dust but with a tail like a tadpole or something with the fish bowl as a great magnifier. OMG im sooooo excited this is the first time for me -------Original Message------- From: AQUARIUMFISH Date: 07/24/05 22:33:14 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Betta nest/eggs - I think I think I have a pair of spawning or spawned bettas. It looks like to me in the past few hours that there are now eggs but I really dont know becuase I have never seen it .. Its a regular bubble nest but I noticed tonight that there are what looks like miniture cotton balls up in the nest. is this eggs or not ... and the female is still in there .. could they be finished ??? the male is defending the nest very well but I cant seem to get her out either so I dont know what to do. Inexperienced Egger lol Gen [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13879	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy Water (now the debate on MelaFix and PimaFix)

The recommendation for mixing these two remedies is misguided to say the least. Just my "opinion", based on the many dead fish I've seen as a direct result of this erroneous advice. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Lenny Vasbinder" <lnvtm1@g...> wrote: > Here are cut and paste product descriptions and FAQ's from Melafix and Pimafix... well, there were no FAQ's on Pimafix but the product description says "PimaFix has been formulated to work in combination with MelaFix to enhance effectiveness against fish diseases"... among other things. These snips are directly from the Aquarium Pharmaceuticals web site. > > MelaFix® > > Heals open wounds & abrasions, treats fin and tail rot, eye cloud, mouth fungus and promotes regrowth of damaged fin rays & tissue. Will not adversely affect the biological filter, alter the pH, or discolor water. Safe for reef aquariums and live plants. For use in fresh or salt water. > > MelaFix FAQ's- > > Can MelaFix be used with other medications? > > MelaFix has been tested and found compatible with Aquarium Pharmaceuticals medications. Mixing other brands of medications is not recommended. > > Is MelaFix harmful to aquatic plants? > > MelaFix can be used in aquariums and ponds containing live plants. > > Will MelaFix kill snails? > > No. > > Can I use MelaFix in aquariums containing freshwater crabs and shrimp? > > Yes. > > Will MelaFix hurt saltwater invertebrates? > > No. MelaFix is reef-compatible. MelaFix has been shown to promote the healing of damaged coral tissue. > > I have a protein skimmer. Will MelaFix cause foaming? > > MelaFix will cause some increased foaming during the treatment. We recommend turning the skimmer down or off during treatment with MelaFix. > > Do I have to remove the activated carbon from my filter when treating with MelaFix? > > We suggest removing the carbon while treating with any medication. > > > > PimaFix > > Treats fungal infections and both internal and external bacterial infections. Will not adversely affect the biological filter, alter the pH, or discolor water. Safe for reef aquariums and live plants. For use in fresh or salt water. PimaFix has been formulated to work in combination with MelaFix to enhance effectiveness against fish diseases. > > > Lenny Vasbinder > http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com > 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 > LNVTM1@g... > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13880	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: New Guy

I am not refuting it...jus making the statement. I wonder why I did not have problem? I definitely would not have made the connection. I think it is off though...I have always looked at silicone as a non absorptive substance. I had a gravel substrate with 3 anoles. I rinsed everything out once a month...maybe that just kept things clean. I even kept the crickets in the same cage and they reproduced there. Is there anything that can be done to make the tanks safe if someone does have a problem with hits? Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 6:49 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: New Guy Eric, By your statement, I trust you are not refuting what I've taken the time to warn people about, although of course you don't need to believe me. Seems there are almost always exceptions to just about everything, except death and taxes, depending on slightly different and/or extenuating circumstances. You long-time Forum members may remember when posting such facts, I used to start such a post with "In general", meaning that it was correct 98% of the time, allowing for "the exception". I guess I got tired of having to include that, hoping that it would be realized that, from experience, these statements are valid. Am glad to see you (Eric) had no problem keeping fish in your 20, after keeping lizards (good for you), but if you did I'll bet you wouldn't have made the connection and probably would have been stumped if your fish died for no "apparent" reason. I don't know about the extenuating circumstances in your case (small lizards -- not Monitors, lots of bedding to soak up waste and frequent changes, etc.); I don't know and am not about to guess. But I've seen all too many of these cases over the years. In this area, any lfs's selling used tanks that were once used for reptiles always give this warning to the buyer. Almost happened to me with a used tank I got from an unknown source, but luckily I pulled the fish out in time and it revived. I don't post these warnings idley (I have better things to do), or without knowledge, but hope I can help the next person by passing this along which you may not have thought of or been aware of. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > I have a 20 gallon that I used to have anoles in that is now housing > fish...I have had no probs and I hand the lizards in there for about 2 > years. Guess there is an exception to everything, huh? > > Eric > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of bennedh76 > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:46 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: New Guy > > > The previous owner raisd fish and says that it was only used for > fish. Thank you for the info, that is good to know for future > purchases. > Heeth > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" > <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > Keeth, Before you beat yourself up anymore, or smash the tank, > Let > > me know if this used tank was previously used for reptiles (or > > mammals). If you don't know, try to find out. Reptile tanks > cannot > > be used for fish afterwards, The strong undiluted urine from > reptiles > > (and mammals) permeates the silicone sealant (much as malachite > green > > does when using some Ich cures) and comes back out into solution > when > > you fill the tank with water. It will kill the fish everytime. > Ray > > > \ > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "bennedh76" <bennedh76@y...> > > wrote: > > > Hello, My name is Heeth I have just recently purchased an > aquarium. > > I > > > am just about to the point of pulling all my hair out and > smashing > > > the 55gal fish killing machine. I cannot figure it out, I have > > tested > > > the; PH=7.5, Nitrites=0, Chloramine=0, Ammonia=0. > > > > > > So far I bought some gold fish to get the bacteria up, got rid > of > > > them and got some misc. community fish - Had a algae bloom and > most > > > everything died even the Placo the only thing that survived was > the > > > frog and the beta. So I cleaned and treated the algae and > cleaned > > it > > > up. Shortly after the beta and frog crossed over. So I waited a > > > couple weeks treated the water for parasites and algae tested > all > > the > > > things that I listed in the beginning and those were the results > so > > I > > > figured that I was safe. Yesterday I went and bought three > > Chichlids > > > and put them in, so far two have died and the third is barely > > making > > > it. > > > > > > I did buy a couple little tiny baskets of sea shells from Wal- > Mart > > > boiled and cleaned them, put some glassware and marbles in as > well. > > > Also this tank had been previously owned but I did clean it. > > > > > > I think that is about all as far as backgrounds go. Can anyone > HELP > > > or does anyone have any suggestions? > > > Thank you, and I am looking forward to being part of the group. > > > Heeth > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13881	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: New Guy

Okay Paul, That's good to know (honestly). Does show there are exceptions. But it is something to watch out for. As I mentioned, I've seen tanks pre-used by reptiles deadly for fish. Just a precaution and something to watch for if getting a used tank and having problems. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms <wtfmorlok@y...> wrote: > i used a 50 gallon tank for an iguanna for 2 years, > hosed it out and used it for 3 years for fish with no > problems at all. > > --- Eric Roberts <woad@w...> wrote: > > > I have a 20 gallon that I used to have anoles in > > that is now housing > > fish...I have had no probs and I hand the lizards in > > there for about 2 > > years. Guess there is an exception to everything, > > huh? > > > > Eric > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of bennedh76 > > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:46 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: New Guy > > > > > > The previous owner raisd fish and says that it was > > only used for > > fish. Thank you for the info, that is good to know > > for future > > purchases. > > Heeth > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" > > <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > Keeth, Before you beat yourself up anymore, or > > smash the tank, > > Let > > > me know if this used tank was previously used for > > reptiles (or > > > mammals). If you don't know, try to find out. > > Reptile tanks > > cannot > > > be used for fish afterwards, The strong undiluted > > urine from > > reptiles > > > (and mammals) permeates the silicone sealant (much > > as malachite > > green > > > does when using some Ich cures) and comes back out > > into solution > > when > > > you fill the tank with water. It will kill the > > fish everytime. > > Ray > > > > > \ > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "bennedh76" > > <bennedh76@y...> > > > wrote: > > > > Hello, My name is Heeth I have just recently > > purchased an > > aquarium. > > > I > > > > am just about to the point of pulling all my > > hair out and > > smashing > > > > the 55gal fish killing machine. I cannot figure > > it out, I have > > > tested > > > > the; PH=7.5, Nitrites=0, Chloramine=0, > > Ammonia=0. > > > > > > > > So far I bought some gold fish to get the > > bacteria up, got rid > > of > > > > them and got some misc. community fish - Had a > > algae bloom and > > most > > > > everything died even the Placo the only thing > > that survived was > > the > > > > frog and the beta. So I cleaned and treated the > > algae and > > cleaned > > > it > > > > up. Shortly after the beta and frog crossed > > over. So I waited a > > > > couple weeks treated the water for parasites and > > algae tested > > all > > > the > > > > things that I listed in the beginning and those > > were the results > > so > > > I > > > > figured that I was safe. Yesterday I went and > > bought three > > > Chichlids > > > > and put them in, so far two have died and the > > third is barely > > > making > > > > it. > > > > > > > > I did buy a couple little tiny baskets of sea > > shells from Wal- > > Mart > > > > boiled and cleaned them, put some glassware and > > marbles in as > > well. > > > > Also this tank had been previously owned but I > > did clean it. > > > > > > > > I think that is about all as far as backgrounds > > go. Can anyone > > HELP > > > > or does anyone have any suggestions? > > > > Thank you, and I am looking forward to being > > part of the group. > > > > Heeth > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when > > replying, thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > > that is NOT important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > > message MODIFY the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > > subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > > matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > > you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the > > web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > > Yahoo! Terms of Service > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13882	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: New Guy

Apparently from what you and Paul have said, this fortunately is not always a problem, but as I said, I have seen bad results from it. Also, as I said, it almost happened to me. I was given a used 10 gallon tank which I cleaned out as thoroughly as I could. I brought this tank and several others to one of the areas annual fish shows, and set them up using all my own water, with one fish per tank. After about 20 minutes the fish in the used 10 started going belly up. I quickly netted him into one of the other tanks and he revived. I later realized the guy that gave me the tank used to keep reptiles. \ Anyone would think that silicone sealant is non-absorbant. This is the reason I posted the reminder that after you treat with any dye medication (mainly for Ich or for an egg fungus preventative) such as malachite green, methylene blue or acriflavin, you see that the medication stained all the silicone inside the tank, and it just doesn't scrub off. It will slowly fade in time, though as it slowly leaches out. Don't know what you could do to make it fish-safe except to trim off all excess silicone inside and reseal the tank using a good heavy bead of fresh silicone all the way around. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > I am not refuting it...jus making the statement. I wonder why I did not have > problem? I definitely would not have made the connection. I think it is > off though...I have always looked at silicone as a non absorptive substance. > I had a gravel substrate with 3 anoles. I rinsed everything out once a > month...maybe that just kept things clean. I even kept the crickets in the > same cage and they reproduced there. Is there anything that can be done to > make the tanks safe if someone does have a problem with hits? > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 6:49 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: New Guy > > > Eric, By your statement, I trust you are not refuting what I've > taken the time to warn people about, although of course you don't > need to believe me. Seems there are almost always exceptions to just > about everything, except death and taxes, depending on slightly > different and/or extenuating circumstances. You long-time Forum > members may remember when posting such facts, I used to start such a > post with "In general", meaning that it was correct 98% of the time, > allowing for "the exception". I guess I got tired of having to > include that, hoping that it would be realized that, from experience, > these statements are valid. Am glad to see you (Eric) had no problem > keeping fish in your 20, after keeping lizards (good for you), but if > you did I'll bet you wouldn't have made the connection and probably > would have been stumped if your fish died for no "apparent" reason. > I don't know about the extenuating circumstances in your case (small > lizards -- not Monitors, lots of bedding to soak up waste and > frequent changes, etc.); I don't know and am not about to guess. But > I've seen all too many of these cases over the years. In this area, > any lfs's selling used tanks that were once used for reptiles always > give this warning to the buyer. Almost happened to me with a used > tank I got from an unknown source, but luckily I pulled the fish out > in time and it revived. I don't post these warnings idley (I have > better things to do), or without knowledge, but hope I can help the > next person by passing this along which you may not have thought of > or been aware of. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > > I have a 20 gallon that I used to have anoles in that is now housing > > fish...I have had no probs and I hand the lizards in there for > about 2 > > years. Guess there is an exception to everything, huh? > > > > Eric > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of bennedh76 > > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:46 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: New Guy > > > > > > The previous owner raisd fish and says that it was only used for > > fish. Thank you for the info, that is good to know for future > > purchases. > > Heeth > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" > > <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > Keeth, Before you beat yourself up anymore, or smash the tank, > > Let > > > me know if this used tank was previously used for reptiles (or > > > mammals). If you don't know, try to find out. Reptile tanks > > cannot > > > be used for fish afterwards, The strong undiluted urine from > > reptiles > > > (and mammals) permeates the silicone sealant (much as malachite > > green > > > does when using some Ich cures) and comes back out into solution > > when > > > you fill the tank with water. It will kill the fish everytime. > > Ray > > > > > > \ > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "bennedh76" <bennedh76@y...> > > > wrote: > > > > Hello, My name is Heeth I have just recently purchased an > > aquarium. > > > I > > > > am just about to the point of pulling all my hair out and > > smashing > > > > the 55gal fish killing machine. I cannot figure it out, I have > > > tested > > > > the; PH=7.5, Nitrites=0, Chloramine=0, Ammonia=0. > > > > > > > > So far I bought some gold fish to get the bacteria up, got rid > > of > > > > them and got some misc. community fish - Had a algae bloom and > > most > > > > everything died even the Placo the only thing that survived was > > the > > > > frog and the beta. So I cleaned and treated the algae and > > cleaned > > > it > > > > up. Shortly after the beta and frog crossed over. So I waited a > > > > couple weeks treated the water for parasites and algae tested > > all > > > the > > > > things that I listed in the beginning and those were the > results > > so > > > I > > > > figured that I was safe. Yesterday I went and bought three > > > Chichlids > > > > and put them in, so far two have died and the third is barely > > > making > > > > it. > > > > > > > > I did buy a couple little tiny baskets of sea shells from Wal- > > Mart > > > > boiled and cleaned them, put some glassware and marbles in as > > well. > > > > Also this tank had been previously owned but I did clean it. > > > > > > > > I think that is about all as far as backgrounds go. Can anyone > > HELP > > > > or does anyone have any suggestions? > > > > Thank you, and I am looking forward to being part of the group. > > > > Heeth > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13883	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: New Guy

Apparently from what you and Paul have said, this fortunately is not always a problem, but as I said, I have seen bad results from it. Also, as I said, it almost happened to me. I was given a used 10 gallon tank which I cleaned out as thoroughly as I could. I brought this tank and several others to one of the areas annual fish shows, and set them up using all my own water, with one fish per tank. After about 20 minutes the fish in the used 10 started going belly up. I quickly netted him into one of the other tanks and he revived. I later realized the guy that gave me the tank used to keep reptiles. \ Anyone would think that silicone sealant is non-absorbant. This is the reason I posted the reminder that after you treat with any dye medication (mainly for Ich or for an egg fungus preventative) such as malachite green, methylene blue or acriflavin, you see that the medication stained all the silicone inside the tank, and it just doesn't scrub off. It will slowly fade in time, though as it slowly leaches out. Don't know what you could do to make it fish-safe except to trim off all excess silicone inside and reseal the tank using a good heavy bead of fresh silicone all the way around. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > I am not refuting it...jus making the statement. I wonder why I did not have > problem? I definitely would not have made the connection. I think it is > off though...I have always looked at silicone as a non absorptive substance. > I had a gravel substrate with 3 anoles. I rinsed everything out once a > month...maybe that just kept things clean. I even kept the crickets in the > same cage and they reproduced there. Is there anything that can be done to > make the tanks safe if someone does have a problem with hits? > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 6:49 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: New Guy > > > Eric, By your statement, I trust you are not refuting what I've > taken the time to warn people about, although of course you don't > need to believe me. Seems there are almost always exceptions to just > about everything, except death and taxes, depending on slightly > different and/or extenuating circumstances. You long-time Forum > members may remember when posting such facts, I used to start such a > post with "In general", meaning that it was correct 98% of the time, > allowing for "the exception". I guess I got tired of having to > include that, hoping that it would be realized that, from experience, > these statements are valid. Am glad to see you (Eric) had no problem > keeping fish in your 20, after keeping lizards (good for you), but if > you did I'll bet you wouldn't have made the connection and probably > would have been stumped if your fish died for no "apparent" reason. > I don't know about the extenuating circumstances in your case (small > lizards -- not Monitors, lots of bedding to soak up waste and > frequent changes, etc.); I don't know and am not about to guess. But > I've seen all too many of these cases over the years. In this area, > any lfs's selling used tanks that were once used for reptiles always > give this warning to the buyer. Almost happened to me with a used > tank I got from an unknown source, but luckily I pulled the fish out > in time and it revived. I don't post these warnings idley (I have > better things to do), or without knowledge, but hope I can help the > next person by passing this along which you may not have thought of > or been aware of. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > > I have a 20 gallon that I used to have anoles in that is now housing > > fish...I have had no probs and I hand the lizards in there for > about 2 > > years. Guess there is an exception to everything, huh? > > > > Eric > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of bennedh76 > > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:46 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: New Guy > > > > > > The previous owner raisd fish and says that it was only used for > > fish. Thank you for the info, that is good to know for future > > purchases. > > Heeth > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" > > <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > Keeth, Before you beat yourself up anymore, or smash the tank, > > Let > > > me know if this used tank was previously used for reptiles (or > > > mammals). If you don't know, try to find out. Reptile tanks > > cannot > > > be used for fish afterwards, The strong undiluted urine from > > reptiles > > > (and mammals) permeates the silicone sealant (much as malachite > > green > > > does when using some Ich cures) and comes back out into solution > > when > > > you fill the tank with water. It will kill the fish everytime. > > Ray > > > > > > \ > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "bennedh76" <bennedh76@y...> > > > wrote: > > > > Hello, My name is Heeth I have just recently purchased an > > aquarium. > > > I > > > > am just about to the point of pulling all my hair out and > > smashing > > > > the 55gal fish killing machine. I cannot figure it out, I have > > > tested > > > > the; PH=7.5, Nitrites=0, Chloramine=0, Ammonia=0. > > > > > > > > So far I bought some gold fish to get the bacteria up, got rid > > of > > > > them and got some misc. community fish - Had a algae bloom and > > most > > > > everything died even the Placo the only thing that survived was > > the > > > > frog and the beta. So I cleaned and treated the algae and > > cleaned > > > it > > > > up. Shortly after the beta and frog crossed over. So I waited a > > > > couple weeks treated the water for parasites and algae tested > > all > > > the > > > > things that I listed in the beginning and those were the > results > > so > > > I > > > > figured that I was safe. Yesterday I went and bought three > > > Chichlids > > > > and put them in, so far two have died and the third is barely > > > making > > > > it. > > > > > > > > I did buy a couple little tiny baskets of sea shells from Wal- > > Mart > > > > boiled and cleaned them, put some glassware and marbles in as > > well. > > > > Also this tank had been previously owned but I did clean it. > > > > > > > > I think that is about all as far as backgrounds go. Can anyone > > HELP > > > > or does anyone have any suggestions? > > > > Thank you, and I am looking forward to being part of the group. > > > > Heeth > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13884	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy Water (now the debate on MelaFix and PimaFix)

the inner part of the part contains the same chemical as aspirin. Before it was synthesized, that was the source of aspirin. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 7:55 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: Foamy Water (now the debate on MelaFix and PimaFix) In a message dated 7/26/2005 1:36:56 A.M. Central Standard Time, woad@... writes: Just because you chewed on some willow bark to cure your headache instead of taking a couple of tablets of Bayer aspirin doesn't mean you avoided taking medicine. It's the same compound in he inner bark of the willow tree as what's in that tablet of aspirin you bought at the store. Chewing on willow bark will get rid of a headache? I've always used it for rooting new plants faster. LOL Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13885	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: I have fry!!!!!

Congrats!!!! Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of AQUARIUMFISH Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 8:21 AM To: aquaticlife@yahoogroups.com; Betta_Crazy@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] I have fry!!!!! OMG OMG OMG !!!!!!!!!!!!! I GOT FRY I have been walking around on shells trying not to shake the floor and make the eggs fall out of the nest but they must have been in there for more than one night because there are bunches of babies swimming around. OMG im so excited ... cant you tell. the male is scooping them up and putting them back in the nest and b4 he can do that a bunch more fall back down and swim back up lol more guy ... they look like a speck of dust but with a tail like a tadpole or something with the fish bowl as a great magnifier. OMG im sooooo excited this is the first time for me -------Original Message------- From: AQUARIUMFISH Date: 07/24/05 22:33:14 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Betta nest/eggs - I think I think I have a pair of spawning or spawned bettas. It looks like to me in the past few hours that there are now eggs but I really dont know becuase I have never seen it .. Its a regular bubble nest but I noticed tonight that there are what looks like miniture cotton balls up in the nest. is this eggs or not ... and the female is still in there .. could they be finished ??? the male is defending the nest very well but I cant seem to get her out either so I dont know what to do. Inexperienced Egger lol Gen [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13886	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: snails

I have 3 botia striata (zebra loaches) in my 37 gallon tank and they are great snail eaters :) They are nice, too, because they only get about 3 or so inches. How big do queen loaches get, they seem really neat? Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > Queen loaches and clown loaches love them. I have them in both of my tanks > and they serve a useful purpose of chowing on the mulm in the gravel and > keeping my loaches' bellies full *grin* You might have to knock them off > the glass so the loach will find them. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of paul helms > Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 1:11 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] snails > > > add loaches > > --- Sandy Kay <knightwriter101@y...> wrote: > > > I have a problem with small snails. I bought some > > live plants a few weeks > > ago and was told to wash the plants off good with > > cold water because the > > store knew they had a problem with snails at that > > time. > > > > I did and thought I was okay. I am now seeing small > > snails, about 5 a day, > > which I pick off and take out of the tank. > > > > I do not know anything about snails, other than the > > store told me they will > > eat my live plants. Is there anything I can do that > > is safe for the tank to > > rid it of them? > > > > Thank you, Sandy > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13887	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: hot water!

I disagree with a Patrick that everyone needs an airconditioner and can afford one. Perhaps the kinds you prop in the window, you mean, versus a central a/c? Because the price difference is huge as well as the charge to your electric bill. It's been over 100 here for the last two weeks. We don't have a/c, especially because these temps are unusual for us. The 10 gallon tank in my bedroom upstairs has a fan pointed across the surface and has stayed between 76 and 80 every day. I also do cool water changes twice weekly. I added an airstone. All the fish are fine, no one is gasping, everyone is still active, etc. I think people just need to be prepared on how to handle temp changes in their house so they know what to do for their tanks. Making a blanket statement that everyone that has a fishtank should have a/c does not seem practical. If you have one in your house, nice for you and I am glad you are that concious of your fish care :) And Evita, wow, 4 hot pregnancies in NC :) My sister-in-law had a terrible time with her pregnancy in the summer and it only got into the upper 80s with no humidity! Have a nice day, Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Evita <evitabug@y...> wrote: > Not nessarily true about the cost of cooling your house these days. The air conditioner may be cheap but running it is not. I have to say I am really happy I have central air though as today they are calling for 100 plus here where I am in NC. I lived for many years without air and it was indeed "Killer". I even went through 4 preg. without air. Evita > > Patrick <patrickmn@c...> wrote:Turn the a/c up. > > Seriously, though. For everybody here who doesn't have an air conditioner: > Get one. If you can afford a fish tank, you don't have any excuse to not > have a good air conditioner to keep the room it is in cool in the summer, > and a good safe heater to keep it warm in the winter. Not to mention you > are more likely to die of heat stroke in your own house if you don't keep it > cool. Also, if you can afford an internet connection, you have no excuse to > not have an a/c. They aren't really that expensive. A lot cheaper than > restocking your tanks or paying medical bills when you fall over dead. > > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy. > > "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is > perhaps, the end of the beginning." > -Winston Churchill > -------Original Message------- > Howdy! The water temp. has been off the chart in 1 of my tanks. I've been putting ice in a baggie & putting that in the tank, but it doesn't help much. My oscar's skin is coming off & he's not eating. I've also been putting med. in the tank. What else can I do? > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine biology Biology > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > --------------------------------- > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13888	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy Water (now the debate on MelaFix and PimaFix)

> Chewing on willow bark will get rid of a headache? I've always used it for > rooting new plants faster. LOL > > Linda > > > How does it help root new plants, if I may ask? And where do you find it? Thanks :) Rebecca

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13889	From: Patrick	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution

Because if you are sitting on a tub you are grounded because the tub is grounded and a conductor. Glass does not conduct much electricity, so even if a fish sets on the bottom of the tank it won't be grounded because the glass blocks the current. What you have is an open circuit if one wire is exposed because the electricity simply has no reason to leave the wire because it has nowhere to go. If you have two exposed wires, the current will flow directly from one wire to the other, creating a short in that exact area, but current still has no reason to move to the rest of the tank. Current follows a path of least resistance, which means it jumps from one wire to the other, possibly blowing a fuse, tripping a breakers, or turning off a gfi outlet. Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill -------Original Message------- I that is true...why would you get electrocuted if you drop a hair dryer in a tub...even f you are not touching either the dryer or a grounding source...you are fried still the same. I think you are incorrect on this one..not that I would want to test it to verify ;-) Eric [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13890	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water (now debate about Melafix and Pimafix)

I have to say thank you for everyone's advice and experience. I think we all realize not everyone agrees on things and that we ask questions on these forums to learn from other's experiences and opinions. It is great that so many people take time out to answer questions for us :) I was the one that asked what happens to make the medicine become fatal and was wondering how quickly the fish passed when both medications were used, Ray? Was there any warning signs that something was wrong? I am sorry I turned the foamy water thread into a debate about medicines. I just like to know as much as possible about things before I put them in my tank and since I have only had tanks for 6 months, my experience is very limited. Thank you all for your thoughts on this subject, I really appreciate it. Have a great day! Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > Lenny, I'm well aware of the fine products Aquarium Pharmaceuticals > produces; I don't need your reminder. > \ > If you read my post correctly, I did not say that the company does > not test their products (before putting it on the label and website) > to increase sales. Further, although they do not sell fish, I fail > to see whether their selling fish or not has anything to do with the > subject at hand. FYI, I wrote: "I would hope it WOULDN'T just be to > increase their sales", as could be construed from a recommendation of > mixing those two products, if they were a less than reputable. I was > talking about product sales not fish sales in the case of them > dying. I do maintain, in the wake of so many fish die-offs from > mixing the two meds, that it appears they have not tested the mixture > of these two meds (at least not thoroughly or in average established > aquarium conditions), or they would have become aware of the toxic > effects in at least a good portion of those trials. > \ > Again, you did not read my post correctly. I did not say that I have > only "heard" of it (die-off) happening to other people. I said: "I > too have SEEN and LEARNED of cases of many hobbyists I know mixing > these two 'medications' together and wiping out their tanks". When I > said "I have SEEN and LEARNED" of the die-offs, I meant EXACTLY > that -- I did not just hear of it. I personally have seen the > results of mixing the two remedies first-hand, over a period of a > short time, with several of my friends' aquariums before we all > realized what in the end became obvious to us all. I was there > visiting on these occasions, as we do frequent each others' > hatcheries. > \ > I figured you might pick up on my statement to "not read everything > you read", leaving myself open for your consideration. You don't > have to and obviously don't believe me, but I'm not posting this just > to see myself type. Without you're trying this, you have no way of > knowing, so why are you refuting me? Is it just because a big company > like A P can do no wrong? I invite you to mix these two remedies > into your tank and for you to try to tell me later that all your fish > are fine. I will even pay you for the meds. Would you care to try > it? You can wait until you see a "problem" with one of your fish, > instead of treating them now unnecessarily. > \ > I know these products are 100% natural -- I use Melafix myself on > ocassion. Agreed, they do not affect the biofilter, change the pH > and are safe (if used by themselves). > \ > \It was asked on the Forum, "What happens when you put them together > that is fatal . . . ?" I don't think anyone knows "what happens". > The fact that I readily admit that I'm not a chemist does not mean I > haven't seen the results of this med mixing -- it kills the fish -- > don't believe me -- I prefer you don't -- find out the hard way. Of > course everything you read is not wrong, I hope you're not saying > that I'm implying the opposite. But some things are open to > correction if found not to be right. By the way, what right have you > to tell me to just state my opinion or advice. If I see someone > posting something that known to be wrong (and I've seen the proof, > the other person hasn't), I will post my ADVICE so that others on > this Forum are forewarned. Oh yeah, any advice I give is not just > an "opinion", but has a basis or I would not post it. > \ > While it may appear as if I'm saying that A P is wrong on their > recommendation to mix the two meds, I'm saying the results I've > personally seen says it all -- not to mix them. As I did bring out > there may be variables and/or other factors involved, you (or anyone) > are taking a BIG chance in mixing them even if not fatal 100% of the > time. I will say that anyone who says its okay to mix them is wrong, > based on many personal factual experiences I've had in this regard > and that is not just an "opinion". Don't know why I'm writing this > as I know you still won't believe me (that's OK, you have a right to > your "opinion"), but I and Paul have pointed out many results of the > mixing of these two meds always with a bad ending. Hopefully, if not > yourself, others may heed our advice and prevent a possible disaster > before it happens. That is our only purpose. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Lenny Vasbinder" <lnvtm1@g...> > wrote: > > Melafix and Pimafix are made by Aquarium Pharmaceuticals > http://www.aquariumpharm.com .. the maker of many, many aquarium > related products.. water treatments, Master Test Kits, etc. They are > the US distributors for Rena products like the Filstar Canister > filter, Rena Air pumps, Rena Heaters, etc. > > > > To imply that they don't test their products before putting it on > the label and website to "increase sales" is ludicrous since they do > not sell fish.. at least not from what I've seen on their web pages. > > > > You say that you have only heard of it happening to other people, > yet you want to say they cannot be mixed and in the same sentence you > implore others to not recommend it if we do not know for ourselves. > Well, I do know for myself. > > > > You also say "do not believe every thing you read".. so does that > mean we should not believe what AP says about Melafix and Pimafix or > not believe what you are saying? > > > > You SHOULD read the labeling on the two bottles the next time you > are in a LFS. These are some of the few products that are 100% > natural and will not kill your biofilter, affect your pH, etc. > > > > They probably aren't as strong as some of the other "chemicals" out > there, but they have been safe when used as directed for my fish. > > > > I see people misuse things all the time and maybe that is what has > happened to the people who KILLED all of their fish. Maybe they > tried bumping the dosage to "make it work faster" and they KILLED > their fish when they did not follow the directions. We all know > many, many people that kill their fish for not following directions > for cycling, compatibility, etc., etc. > > > > Just like the 1" rule that so many people throw around.. that is a > fish KILLING rule. It only works for about 25% of fish... the ones > that stay under 3" as adults. It does not work for Goldfish.. one of > the most popular beginner fish... and it does not work for nearly any > other fish that gets over 3" as an adult. > > > > What all of this is saying is that you are right about not > believing every thing you read.. but it does not mean that every > thing you read is wrong. If someone asks for advice in this or any > other forum and you disagree with the advice, just state your opinion > or advice. Don't claim that the other advice or opinion is wrong > when you readily admit that you are not a "chemist". > > > > I do not work for, or own stock in Aquarium Pharmaceuticals... do > you work for the competition? > > > > Oh well.. you had your rant and now that's my rant du jour. > > > > Lenny Vasbinder > > http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com > > 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 > > LNVTM1@g... > > > > Message: 15 > > Date: Mon, 25 Jul 2005 22:58:54 -0000 > > From: "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> > > Subject: Re: Foamy water > > > > Do not believe everything that you read! Do you REALLY KNOW for > sure > > whether or not Melafix and Pimafix can be mixed? If not, please do > > not recommend such a thing to other newer Forum members who may not > > know better. Paul is 100% correct on this one. I too have seen > and > > learned of many cases of hobbyists I know mixing these > > two "medications" together and wiping out their tanks. Most of > these > > tanks were well established over many years with one fish having a > > scrape or slight sore with all the other fish being healthy, as in > > cases that Paul has seen. By themselves, these remedies are great, > > so I am not trying to bash them. I am not a chemist, so I cannot > > tell you what happens when you put them together, only that it > kills > > fish. Can't say why the manufacturer would recommend it -- I would > > hope it wouldn't just be to increase sales, but it would seem > obvious > > they may not have really tried mixing these two meds as a test in a > > healthy fish-populated aquarium or I'm sure they would have found > it > > to be detrimental. My gut feeling is that there may be other > unseen > > factors involved when mixing these two, such as maybe the water was > > below a certain pH (6.6? for instance), or the water was high in > > magnesium or any number of things in these aquariums which were not > > ordinarily unsafe nor uncommon as all the aquariums involved must > > have had similar parameters, but were fatal when these TWO meds > were > > introduced to the tank together. Maybe when mixing them, you can > add > > no more than half strength of each one to get a total treatment - - > > that I couldn't tell you, but I can tell you mixing them can be > > fatal, even if not all the time. Although I haven't heard of any > > successful mixed treatments. Ray > > > \ > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" > > <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > > Hmmm.. it says on their web page and the packaging that melafix > and > > > pimafix CAN be used together, that they are complementary. What > > > happens when you put them together that is fatal and why would > the > > > manufacturer recommend it, then? > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > wrote: > > > > they should not be used together, and can have fatal > > > > results when mixed at the same time. alone they are > > > > safe...together not so much > > > > > > > > --- thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Have you started treating your tank with anything? > > > > > I believe certain > > > > > medications, such as melafix and pimafix -- which > > > > > can be used > > > > > together, by the way -- cause foam to appear. Sorry > > > > > to not be of more > > > > > help. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie > > > > > Moore" > > > > > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > > > > > My water has developed a foam type around the > > > > > edges as well as a few > > > > > > spots of randome floating clumps. The foam is all > > > > > along the edge of > > > > > the > > > > > > tank as well as the filter, spray wand, etc... > > > > > > All the tests are fine. No ammonia, nitrites or > > > > > high nitrates. > > > > > > > > > > > > I read a post a while back where someone else had > > > > > some "foam" but I > > > > > > can't remember which group or what the outcome > > > > > was. > > > > > > > > > > > > any ideas? > > > > > > > > > > > > Leslie > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13891	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: I have fry!!!!!

congratulations and good luck :) Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "AQUARIUMFISH" <aquariumfish@B...> wrote: > OMG OMG OMG !!!!!!!!!!!!! I GOT FRY I have been walking around on shells > trying not to shake the floor and make the eggs fall out of the nest but > they must have been in there for more than one night because there are > bunches of babies swimming around. OMG im so excited ... cant you tell. the > male is scooping them up and putting them back in the nest and b4 he can do > that a bunch more fall back down and swim back up lol more guy ... they look > like a speck of dust but with a tail like a tadpole or something with the > fish bowl as a great magnifier. > > OMG im sooooo excited this is the first time for me > > -------Original Message------- > > From: AQUARIUMFISH > Date: 07/24/05 22:33:14 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Betta nest/eggs - I think > > I think I have a pair of spawning or spawned bettas. It looks like to me in > the past few hours that there are now eggs but I really dont know becuase I > have never seen it .. Its a regular bubble nest but I noticed tonight that > there are what looks like miniture cotton balls up in the nest. is this eggs > or not ... and the female is still in there .. could they be finished ??? > the male is defending the nest very well but I cant seem to get her out > either so I dont know what to do. > > > Inexperienced Egger lol > Gen > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13892	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: To Paul & Ray Re: MelaFix & PimaFix

Hi Paul, As I'm sure you know MelaFix and PImaFix are manufactured by Aquarium Pharmaceuticals a reputable American manufacturer, there web site states and I quote #1 "PimaFix has been formulated to work in combination with MelaFix to enhance effectiveness against fish diseases" quote #2 "University studies and laboratory tests showed that PimaFix is an effective antifungal AND antibacterial remedy for both freshwater and marine fish. This evidence led to the granting of a United States Patent." quote #3 "MelaFix has been tested and found compatible with Aquarium Pharmaceuticals medications. Mixing other brands of medications is not recommended." To verify my above statements visit :- http://www.aquariumpharm.com?pimafix.html I do not know which wed-site you looked at but what you have stated is not on Aquarium Pharmaceuticals website. What proof do you have that mixing MelaFix and PimaFix kills healthy fish ? if you have some then complain to your Patent Office. regards, unclenorm. --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > Ray, > i looked up the pimafix website, and it does not say > that they should be used together at all, it says > that > they are designed to work "synergistically", which > just means to greater effect. this may only be > useful > as dip, there is no information listed. the use of > this language very clearly states to me that it is a > write up by a marketing team, not researchers. if > one > takes the time to read the full statement on the > site, > it states very clearly that they can be used togther > in EXTREME cases, not everyday use. in addition, i > know that we have had some "medical" responses, but > these are not "medications" but rather tea tree and > bay tree extracts, not true antibiotics or anti > fungals meaning not engineered to be used in this > way. > they may function well in the application, but this > is hollistic not pharmaceutical. > > --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote: > > > Do not believe everything that you read! Do you > > REALLY KNOW for sure > > whether or not Melafix and Pimafix can be mixed? > If > > not, please do > > not recommend such a thing to other newer Forum > > members who may not > > know better. Paul is 100% correct on this one. I > > too have seen and > > learned of many cases of hobbyists I know mixing > > these > > two "medications" together and wiping out their > > tanks. Most of these > > tanks were well established over many years with > one > > fish having a > > scrape or slight sore with all the other fish > being > > healthy, as in > > cases that Paul has seen. By themselves, these > > remedies are great, > > so I am not trying to bash them. I am not a > > chemist, so I cannot > > tell you what happens when you put them together, > > only that it kills > > fish. Can't say why the manufacturer would > > recommend it -- I would > > hope it wouldn't just be to increase sales, but it > > would seem obvious > > they may not have really tried mixing these two > meds > > as a test in a > > healthy fish-populated aquarium or I'm sure they > > would have found it > > to be detrimental. My gut feeling is that there > may > > be other unseen > > factors involved when mixing these two, such as > > maybe the water was > > below a certain pH (6.6? for instance), or the > water > > was high in > > magnesium or any number of things in these > aquariums > > which were not > > ordinarily unsafe nor uncommon as all the > aquariums > > involved must > > have had similar parameters, but were fatal when > > these TWO meds were > > introduced to the tank together. Maybe when > mixing > > them, you can add > > no more than half strength of each one to get a > > total treatment -- > > that I couldn't tell you, but I can tell you > mixing > > them can be > > fatal, even if not all the time. Although I > haven't > > heard of any > > successful mixed treatments. Ray > > > > > \ > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, > "thesydmonster" > > > > <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > > Hmmm.. it says on their web page and the > packaging > > that melafix and > > > pimafix CAN be used together, that they are > > complementary. What > > > happens when you put them together that is fatal > > and why would the > > > manufacturer recommend it, then? > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > wrote: > > > > they should not be used together, and can have > > fatal > > > > results when mixed at the same time. alone > they > > are > > > > safe...together not so much > > > > > > > > --- thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Have you started treating your tank with > > anything? > > > > > I believe certain > > > > > medications, such as melafix and pimafix -- > > which > > > > > can be used > > > > > together, by the way -- cause foam to > appear. > > Sorry > > > > > to not be of more > > > > > help. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & > > Leslie > > > > > Moore" > > > > > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > > > > > My water has developed a foam type around > > the > > > > > edges as well as a few > > > > > > spots of randome floating clumps. The > foam > > is all > > > > > along the edge of > > > > > the > > > > > > tank as well as the filter, spray wand, > > etc... > > > > > > All the tests are fine. No ammonia, > > nitrites or > > > > > high nitrates. > > > > > > > > > > > > I read a post a while back where someone > > else had > > > > > some "foam" but I > > > > > > can't remember which group or what the > > outcome > > > > > was. > > > > > > > > > > > > any ideas? > > > > > > > > > > > > Leslie > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have > been > > > > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > > > Do You Yahoo!? > > > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > > protection around > > > > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > Yahoo! Mail for Mobile > Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your > mobile phone. > http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail > ___________________________________________________________ How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13893	From: Patrick	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: hot water!

When you die of heat stroke, you will regret you didn't listen. There is a reason the average life expectancy before air conditioning was under 65, and under 55 before fans. Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill -------Original Message------- I disagree with a Patrick that everyone needs an airconditioner and can afford one. Perhaps the kinds you prop in the window, you mean, versus a central a/c? Because the price difference is huge as well as the charge to your electric bill. It's been over 100 here for the last two weeks. We don't have a/c, especially because these temps are unusual for us. The 10 gallon tank in my bedroom upstairs has a fan pointed across the surface and has stayed between 76 and 80 every day. I also do cool water changes twice weekly. I added an airstone. All the fish are fine, no one is gasping, everyone is still active, etc. I think people just need to be prepared on how to handle temp changes in their house so they know what to do for their tanks. Making a blanket statement that everyone that has a fishtank should have a/c does not seem practical. If you have one in your house, nice for you and I am glad you are that concious of your fish care :) And Evita, wow, 4 hot pregnancies in NC :) My sister-in-law had a terrible time with her pregnancy in the summer and it only got into the upper 80s with no humidity! Have a nice day, Rebecca [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13894	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: snails

Not sure, but we have had ours for about 7 months and he is about 4 inches long. He is the same size he was when we got him. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of thesydmonster Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 10:22 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: snails I have 3 botia striata (zebra loaches) in my 37 gallon tank and they are great snail eaters :) They are nice, too, because they only get about 3 or so inches. How big do queen loaches get, they seem really neat? Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > Queen loaches and clown loaches love them. I have them in both of my tanks > and they serve a useful purpose of chowing on the mulm in the gravel and > keeping my loaches' bellies full *grin* You might have to knock them off > the glass so the loach will find them. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of paul helms > Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 1:11 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] snails > > > add loaches > > --- Sandy Kay <knightwriter101@y...> wrote: > > > I have a problem with small snails. I bought some > > live plants a few weeks > > ago and was told to wash the plants off good with > > cold water because the > > store knew they had a problem with snails at that > > time. > > > > I did and thought I was okay. I am now seeing small > > snails, about 5 a day, > > which I pick off and take out of the tank. > > > > I do not know anything about snails, other than the > > store told me they will > > eat my live plants. Is there anything I can do that > > is safe for the tank to > > rid it of them? > > > > Thank you, Sandy > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13895	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: hot water!

are you kidding? minimal cost for a portable a/c here is $1300. that's why i don't have one. --- Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: > Turn the a/c up. > > Seriously, though. For everybody here who doesn't have an air conditioner: > Get one. If you can afford a fish tank, you don't have any excuse to not > have a good air conditioner to keep the room it is in cool in the summer, > and a good safe heater to keep it warm in the winter. Not to mention you > are more likely to die of heat stroke in your own house if you don't keep it > cool. Also, if you can afford an internet connection, you have no excuse to > not have an a/c. They aren't really that expensive. A lot cheaper than > restocking your tanks or paying medical bills when you fall over dead. > > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy. > > "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is > perhaps, the end of the beginning." > -Winston Churchill > -------Original Message------- > Howdy! The water temp. has been off the chart in 1 of my tanks. I've been putting ice in a > baggie & putting that in the tank, but it doesn't help much. My oscar's skin is coming off & > he's not eating. I've also been putting med. in the tank. What else can I do? > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13896	From: Tom Ray	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Aeration questions

TheSydMonster: I too have a deep and wide 37 gal tank (Ocean "Cube" -- brand & model). I too bubble for aeration. I use a 10 gal pump and just keep its airstone/rod above the pump's rated depth, but below the spray bar (which is pointed back towards the back side {& airstone} to reduce the water turbulance over the rest of the tank which is well-planted and becoming stocked with lower-flow fish). As for overnight, your aeration helps keep constant flow CO2 from poisoning your fish / sudden dips in pH. So I think it may be more important to have it on at night than during the day. I also asked one wise old keeper acquaintance why he uses air stone AND waterfall filter in his tanks. His reply: "Its added insurance. Its also on a separate circuit breaker from the filter and lights." And, it did NOT seem to noticeably, negatively affect any of his "forrested look" planted tanks. As for temperature, does it help / seem to help offset the heat wave's effects? If so, I just might try that. As for Mr. Betta, several of the wild-strain Betta breeders I've chatted with use only an underground (UGF use air pumps), sponge, or solo air stone for filtration/aeration in their tanks. If it really is bothering Mr. Betta too much, what if you tried containing it a bit using some of that clear tank piping the LFS sell. Sort of emulating the riser of an UGF. Finally, as to Oto's, I too have a couple of otocinclus and a parotocinclus in my 37 gal. tank. I've read somewhere online (ScotCat or Planet Catfish or ???) that oto/paroto like well oxygenated water. I also read accounts of how they will deliberately and oddly play as a group, getting tossed around in the air bubble stream. So I think they may will be A-OK. TIA, --TommyBoy --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > After treating my 37 gallon tank with Furan 2 months ago I was told > to leave my airstone in all the time to increase the surface > agitation in my tank. I was wondering if I am supposed to leave it > on all day and all night? I just leave it on all the time, is that > okay or should I shut it off at night? > > I only turn the one on in the 10 gallon when the temperature starts > to increase (set at 76 but due to our heat waves it's been getting > up to 80 in there) because the betta doesn't like the current much, > is that okay? > > Also, the air pump I was given to put in the 37 gallon tank was for > a 10 gallon tank so the bubbles were very gentle (it's a deep tank, > not a wide one). I just got a new pump for a tank up to 40 gallons > and it causes a lot more aggitation and current on that side of the > tank. Is this bad or stressful for the fish or will they get used > to it? The only ones that seem affected by it are the otos that are > trying to clean the glass next to the bubbles and get swirled around > a bit -- but boy, do they keep trying :) > > Any suggestions are appreciated.. > Rebecca

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13897	From: paul helms	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: To Paul & Ray Re: MelaFix & PimaFix

read the posts before directing a statement like that at me. i did use their own website for quotes, and others have quoted the same text. it is the pimafix.html on ap's website. proof is experience, same as ray and nimish! --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> wrote: > Hi Paul, > As I'm sure you know MelaFix and PImaFix are > manufactured by Aquarium Pharmaceuticals a reputable > American manufacturer, there web site states and I > quote #1 "PimaFix has been formulated to work in > combination with MelaFix to enhance effectiveness > against fish diseases" > quote #2 "University studies and laboratory tests > showed that PimaFix is an effective antifungal AND > antibacterial remedy for both freshwater and marine > fish. This evidence led to the granting of a United > States Patent." > quote #3 "MelaFix has been tested and found > compatible > with Aquarium Pharmaceuticals medications. Mixing > other brands of medications is not recommended." > To verify my above statements visit :- > http://www.aquariumpharm.com?pimafix.html > I do not know which wed-site you looked at but what > you have stated is not on Aquarium Pharmaceuticals > website. > What proof do you have that mixing MelaFix and > PimaFix kills healthy fish ? if you have some then > complain to your Patent Office. > regards, > unclenorm. > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > Ray, > > i looked up the pimafix website, and it does not > say > > that they should be used together at all, it says > > that > > they are designed to work "synergistically", which > > just means to greater effect. this may only be > > useful > > as dip, there is no information listed. the use > of > > this language very clearly states to me that it is > a > > write up by a marketing team, not researchers. if > > one > > takes the time to read the full statement on the > > site, > > it states very clearly that they can be used > togther > > in EXTREME cases, not everyday use. in addition, i > > know that we have had some "medical" responses, > but > > these are not "medications" but rather tea tree > and > > bay tree extracts, not true antibiotics or anti > > fungals meaning not engineered to be used in this > > way. > > they may function well in the application, but > this > > is hollistic not pharmaceutical. > > > > --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> > wrote: > > > > > Do not believe everything that you read! Do you > > > REALLY KNOW for sure > > > whether or not Melafix and Pimafix can be mixed? > > > If > > > not, please do > > > not recommend such a thing to other newer Forum > > > members who may not > > > know better. Paul is 100% correct on this one. > I > > > too have seen and > > > learned of many cases of hobbyists I know mixing > > > these > > > two "medications" together and wiping out their > > > tanks. Most of these > > > tanks were well established over many years with > > one > > > fish having a > > > scrape or slight sore with all the other fish > > being > > > healthy, as in > > > cases that Paul has seen. By themselves, these > > > remedies are great, > > > so I am not trying to bash them. I am not a > > > chemist, so I cannot > > > tell you what happens when you put them > together, > > > only that it kills > > > fish. Can't say why the manufacturer would > > > recommend it -- I would > > > hope it wouldn't just be to increase sales, but > it > > > would seem obvious > > > they may not have really tried mixing these two > > meds > > > as a test in a > > > healthy fish-populated aquarium or I'm sure they > > > would have found it > > > to be detrimental. My gut feeling is that there > > may > > > be other unseen > > > factors involved when mixing these two, such as > > > maybe the water was > > > below a certain pH (6.6? for instance), or the > > water > > > was high in > > > magnesium or any number of things in these > > aquariums > > > which were not > > > ordinarily unsafe nor uncommon as all the > > aquariums > > > involved must > > > have had similar parameters, but were fatal when > > > these TWO meds were > > > introduced to the tank together. Maybe when > > mixing > > > them, you can add > > > no more than half strength of each one to get a > > > total treatment -- > > > that I couldn't tell you, but I can tell you > > mixing > > > them can be > > > fatal, even if not all the time. Although I > > haven't > > > heard of any > > > successful mixed treatments. Ray > > > > > > > > > \ > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, > > "thesydmonster" > > > > > > <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > > > Hmmm.. it says on their web page and the > > packaging > > > that melafix and > > > > pimafix CAN be used together, that they are > > > complementary. What > > > > happens when you put them together that is > fatal > > > and why would the > > > > manufacturer recommend it, then? > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > > wrote: > > > > > they should not be used together, and can > have > > > fatal > > > > > results when mixed at the same time. alone > > they > > > are > > > > > safe...together not so much > > > > > > > > > > --- thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@c...> > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Have you started treating your tank with > > > anything? > > > > > > I believe certain > > > > > > medications, such as melafix and pimafix > -- > > > which > > > > > > can be used > > > > > > together, by the way -- cause foam to > > appear. > > > Sorry > > > > > > to not be of more > > > > > > help. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane > & > > > Leslie > > > > > > Moore" > > > > > > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > > > > > > My water has developed a foam type > around > > > the > > > > > > edges as well as a few > > > > > > > spots of randome floating clumps. The > > foam > > > is all > > > > > > along the edge of > > > > > > the > > > > > > > tank as well as the filter, spray wand, > > > etc... > > > > > > > All the tests are fine. No ammonia, > > > nitrites or > > > > > > high nitrates. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I read a post a while back where someone > > > else had > > > > > > some "foam" but I > > > > > > > can't remember which group or what the > === message truncated === ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13898	From: paul helms	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water (now debate about Melafix and Pimafix)

always ask, just because some people can't allow others to express their expriences, don't take it as you did something wrong. i warned about the fatal mix because i have see it first hand several times, and others who have not need to feel special by defending something a product by any means they can....for what reason i do not know. bottom line, ask anything the results of peoples behavior is not your problem =) --- thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@...> wrote: > I have to say thank you for everyone's advice and > experience. I > think we all realize not everyone agrees on things > and that we ask > questions on these forums to learn from other's > experiences and > opinions. It is great that so many people take time > out to answer > questions for us :) > > I was the one that asked what happens to make the > medicine become > fatal and was wondering how quickly the fish passed > when both > medications were used, Ray? Was there any warning > signs that > something was wrong? > > I am sorry I turned the foamy water thread into a > debate about > medicines. I just like to know as much as possible > about things > before I put them in my tank and since I have only > had tanks for 6 > months, my experience is very limited. Thank you > all for your > thoughts on this subject, I really appreciate it. > > Have a great day! > Rebecca > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" > <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > Lenny, I'm well aware of the fine products > Aquarium > Pharmaceuticals > > produces; I don't need your > reminder. > > > \ > > > > If you read my post correctly, I did not say that > the company does > > not test their products (before putting it on the > label and > website) > > to increase sales. Further, although they do not > sell fish, I > fail > > to see whether their selling fish or not has > anything to do with > the > > subject at hand. FYI, I wrote: "I would hope it > WOULDN'T just be > to > > increase their sales", as could be construed from > a recommendation > of > > mixing those two products, if they were a less > than reputable. I > was > > talking about product sales not fish sales in the > case of them > > dying. I do maintain, in the wake of so many fish > die-offs from > > mixing the two meds, that it appears they have not > tested the > mixture > > of these two meds (at least not thoroughly or in > average > established > > aquarium conditions), or they would have become > aware of the toxic > > effects in at least a good portion of those > trials. > > > \ > > > > Again, you did not read my post correctly. I did > not say that I > have > > only "heard" of it (die-off) happening to other > people. I > said: "I > > too have SEEN and LEARNED of cases of many > hobbyists I know mixing > > these two 'medications' together and wiping out > their tanks". > When I > > said "I have SEEN and LEARNED" of the die-offs, I > meant EXACTLY > > that -- I did not just hear of it. I personally > have seen the > > results of mixing the two remedies first-hand, > over a period of a > > short time, with several of my friends' aquariums > before we all > > realized what in the end became obvious to us all. > I was there > > visiting on these occasions, as we do frequent > each others' > > > hatcheries. > > > > \ > > > > I figured you might pick up on my statement to > "not read > everything > > you read", leaving myself open for your > consideration. You don't > > have to and obviously don't believe me, but I'm > not posting this > just > > to see myself type. Without you're trying this, > you have no way > of > > knowing, so why are you refuting me? Is it just > because a big > company > > like A P can do no wrong? I invite you to mix > these two remedies > > into your tank and for you to try to tell me later > that all your > fish > > are fine. I will even pay you for the meds. > Would you care to > try > > it? You can wait until you see a "problem" with > one of your fish, > > instead of treating them now > unnecessarily. > > > \ > > > > I know these products are 100% natural -- I use > Melafix myself on > > ocassion. Agreed, they do not affect the > biofilter, change the > pH > > and are safe (if used by > themselves). > > > \ > > > \It was asked on the Forum, "What happens when you > put them > together > > that is fatal . . . ?" I don't think anyone knows > "what > happens". > > The fact that I readily admit that I'm not a > chemist does not mean > I > > haven't seen the results of this med mixing -- it > kills the fish -- > > > don't believe me -- I prefer you don't -- find out > the hard way. > Of > > course everything you read is not wrong, I hope > you're not saying > > that I'm implying the opposite. But some things > are open to > > correction if found not to be right. By the way, > what right have > you > > to tell me to just state my opinion or advice. If > I see someone > > posting something that known to be wrong (and I've > seen the proof, > > the other person hasn't), I will post my ADVICE so > that others on > > this Forum are forewarned. Oh yeah, any advice I > give is not just > > an "opinion", but has a basis or I would not post > it. > > \ > > > While it may appear as if I'm saying that A P is > wrong on their > > recommendation to mix the two meds, I'm saying the > results I've > > personally seen says it all -- not to mix them. > As I did bring > out > > there may be variables and/or other factors > involved, you (or > anyone) > > are taking a BIG chance in mixing them even if not > fatal 100% of > the > > time. I will say that anyone who says its okay to > mix them is > wrong, > > based on many personal factual experiences I've > had === message truncated === ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13899	From: paul helms	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: New Guy

that is why i did not say you are wrong...unlike others on this group i do realize that things can and do happen other than the way i experience. that is why i try to not use words like, always never etc.. --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote: > Okay Paul, That's good to know (honestly). Does > show there are > exceptions. But it is something to watch out for. > As I mentioned, > I've seen tanks pre-used by reptiles deadly for > fish. Just a > precaution and something to watch for if getting a > used tank and > having problems. Ray > > \ > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > <wtfmorlok@y...> wrote: > > i used a 50 gallon tank for an iguanna for 2 > years, > > hosed it out and used it for 3 years for fish with > no > > problems at all. > > > > --- Eric Roberts <woad@w...> wrote: > > > > > I have a 20 gallon that I used to have anoles in > > > that is now housing > > > fish...I have had no probs and I hand the > lizards in > > > there for about 2 > > > years. Guess there is an exception to > everything, > > > huh? > > > > > > Eric > > > > > > Eric > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > Behalf Of bennedh76 > > > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:46 PM > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: New Guy > > > > > > > > > The previous owner raisd fish and says that it > was > > > only used for > > > fish. Thank you for the info, that is good to > know > > > for future > > > purchases. > > > Heeth > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" > > > > <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > > Keeth, Before you beat yourself up anymore, > or > > > smash the tank, > > > Let > > > > me know if this used tank was previously used > for > > > reptiles (or > > > > mammals). If you don't know, try to find out. > > > > Reptile tanks > > > cannot > > > > be used for fish afterwards, The strong > undiluted > > > urine from > > > reptiles > > > > (and mammals) permeates the silicone sealant > (much > > > as malachite > > > green > > > > does when using some Ich cures) and comes back > out > > > into solution > > > when > > > > you fill the tank with water. It will kill > the > > > fish everytime. > > > Ray > > > > > > > \ > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, > "bennedh76" > > > <bennedh76@y...> > > > > wrote: > > > > > Hello, My name is Heeth I have just recently > > > purchased an > > > aquarium. > > > > I > > > > > am just about to the point of pulling all my > > > hair out and > > > smashing > > > > > the 55gal fish killing machine. I cannot > figure > > > it out, I have > > > > tested > > > > > the; PH=7.5, Nitrites=0, Chloramine=0, > > > Ammonia=0. > > > > > > > > > > So far I bought some gold fish to get the > > > bacteria up, got rid > > > of > > > > > them and got some misc. community fish - Had > a > > > algae bloom and > > > most > > > > > everything died even the Placo the only > thing > > > that survived was > > > the > > > > > frog and the beta. So I cleaned and treated > the > > > algae and > > > cleaned > > > > it > > > > > up. Shortly after the beta and frog crossed > > > over. So I waited a > > > > > couple weeks treated the water for parasites > and > > > algae tested > > > all > > > > the > > > > > things that I listed in the beginning and > those > > > were the results > > > so > > > > I > > > > > figured that I was safe. Yesterday I went > and > > > bought three > > > > Chichlids > > > > > and put them in, so far two have died and > the > > > third is barely > > > > making > > > > > it. > > > > > > > > > > I did buy a couple little tiny baskets of > sea > > > shells from Wal- > > > Mart > > > > > boiled and cleaned them, put some glassware > and > > > marbles in as > > > well. > > > > > Also this tank had been previously owned but > I > > > did clean it. > > > > > > > > > > I think that is about all as far as > backgrounds > > > go. Can anyone > > > HELP > > > > > or does anyone have any suggestions? > > > > > Thank you, and I am looking forward to being > > > part of the group. > > > > > Heeth > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > when > > > replying, thanks. > > > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all > TEXT > > > that is NOT important to > > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the > original > > > message MODIFY the > > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > > > subject)" <- > > > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > > > matter, > > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > > > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group > for > > > you! > > > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > === message truncated === __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13900	From: paul helms	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution

in that situation you are the path of least resisstence. your body is mostly water which is a great conductor and the hairdryer is a much different electrical device than an aquarium heater. its voltage/wattage is different. in most cases, tubs are also metal with a porecelain overlat...meaning you are grouunded. for someone who claims to understand the way electricity works, you are waaaay off. if you think that evryone who is educated inthe area is wrong, maybe you should take a basic electronics class. --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > I that is true...why would you get electrocuted if > you drop a hair dryer in > a tub...even f you are not touching either the dryer > or a grounding > source...you are fried still the same. I think you > are incorrect on this > one..not that I would want to test it to verify ;-) > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of paul helms > Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 6:25 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > Electrocution > > > only if you are touching the heater wires. > electricity does not flow through glass, and the > eloectricity only flows towards grounded objects > like > you. > > --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > > > wouldn't there be a complete circuit from the > wiring > > inside the heater? > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of paul helms > > Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 12:57 AM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > > Electrocution > > > > > > no...while water (especially salt) is an excellent > > conductor, water is not touching the floor and > > therefore has no where to convey. grounding needs > > contact direct contact with the ground. if there > is > > a > > current in the water and you are wearing rubber > > soled > > shoes you will not be shocked because the rubber > > inhibits the currents path. if you wore leather > > soles > > you would get shocked. nothing in the aquarium is > > contacting the floor directly. glass is an > > insolator > > so electricity does not flow through it. the > > electricity has to have a place to strike like > > lightning does on the earth. > > > > --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > > > > > Aren't they grounded by the water? > > > > > > Eric > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > Behalf Of Dane & Leslie Moore > > > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:17 PM > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > > > Electrocution > > > > > > > > > Fish are not grounded so they won't be > > electrocuted > > > huh? Hmmm. Lol > > > Sorry but that's funny. > > > > > > -----Original Message---- > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > > > On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... > > > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 9:48 PM > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > > > > > > > > > > > > In a message dated 7/25/2005 6:47:32 P.M. > Central > > > Standard Time, > > > wtfmorlok@... writes: > > > > > > toss the heater, it is no good and will > > electricute > > > you. ufortunately we have some folks here that > > do > > > not understand the > > > way electricity works, and have warned you > about > > > fish being > > > electricuted. fish are not grounded and will > not > > > be electricuted > > > > > > > > > Again, your knowledge here is great information. > > > I > > > would have never > > > know > > > that (same principal as bird on a wire) fish can > > not > > > get electrocuted. > > > But who > > > are you? > > > > > > Linda > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > > when > > > replying, thanks. > > > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all > TEXT > > > that is NOT important > > > to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the > > > original message MODIFY > > > the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: > old > > > subject)" <- > > > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > > > matter, AquaticLife > > > Management. > > > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > > > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group > for > > > you! > > > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > > when > > > replying, thanks. > > > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all > TEXT > > > that is NOT important to > > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the > > original > > > message MODIFY the > > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > > > subject)" <- > > > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > > > matter, > === message truncated === __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13901	From: paul helms	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution

a few billion volts and a heater are very different. that is like comparing a lighter to a volcanoe and saying a little fire is not gonna kill you in a firemans suit! jesus! --- Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: > Then why is that some of my friends fish died when > there home was hit > with lightening? > > Have kids stuff? Check out Zainy Zebra Consignment! > Based in Cabot, AR > www.ZainyZebra.com > > Live in or near Cabot? Join the Cabot Garage Sale! > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/CabotgarageSale/ > > Live in Little Rock? Little Rock Garage > Sale!http://groups.yahoo.com/group/LRgarageSale/ > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of paul helms > Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 12:57 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > Electrocution > > > no...while water (especially salt) is an excellent > conductor, water is not touching the floor and > therefore has no where to convey. grounding needs > contact direct contact with the ground. if there is > a > current in the water and you are wearing rubber > soled > shoes you will not be shocked because the rubber > inhibits the currents path. if you wore leather > soles > you would get shocked. nothing in the aquarium is > contacting the floor directly. glass is an > insolator > so electricity does not flow through it. the > electricity has to have a place to strike like > lightning does on the earth. > > --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > > > Aren't they grounded by the water? > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > > > On Behalf Of Dane & Leslie Moore > > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:17 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > > Electrocution > > > > > > Fish are not grounded so they won't be > electrocuted > > huh? Hmmm. Lol > > Sorry but that's funny. > > > > -----Original Message---- > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > > On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... > > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 9:48 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > > > > > > > > In a message dated 7/25/2005 6:47:32 P.M. Central > > Standard Time, > > wtfmorlok@... writes: > > > > toss the heater, it is no good and will > electricute > > you. ufortunately we have some folks here that > do > > not understand the > > way electricity works, and have warned you about > > fish being > > electricuted. fish are not grounded and will not > > be electricuted > > > > > > Again, your knowledge here is great information. > I > > would have never > > know > > that (same principal as bird on a wire) fish can > not > > get electrocuted. > > But who > > are you? > > > > Linda > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > when replying, thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > > that is NOT important > > to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the > > original message MODIFY > > the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > > subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > > matter, AquaticLife > > Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > > you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > when replying, thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > > that is NOT important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the > original > > message MODIFY the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > > subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > > matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > > you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on > the > > web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email > to: > === message truncated === __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13902	From: paul helms	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution

no they are not...god damn it read a freaking book, take a class , something!!!! --- Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: > Yes they are. > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Eric Roberts > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:24 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > Electrocution > > > Aren't they grounded by the water? > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Dane & Leslie Moore > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:17 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > Electrocution > > > Fish are not grounded so they won't be electrocuted > huh? Hmmm. Lol > Sorry but that's funny. > > -----Original Message---- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 9:48 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > > > > In a message dated 7/25/2005 6:47:32 P.M. Central > Standard Time, > wtfmorlok@... writes: > > toss the heater, it is no good and will electricute > you. ufortunately we have some folks here that do > not understand the > way electricity works, and have warned you about > fish being > electricuted. fish are not grounded and will not > be electricuted > > > Again, your knowledge here is great information. I > would have never > know > that (same principal as bird on a wire) fish can not > get electrocuted. > But who > are you? > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when > replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important > to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the > original message MODIFY > the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter, AquaticLife > Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when > replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important > to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the > original message MODIFY > the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter, AquaticLife > Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the > web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of > Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when > replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important > to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the > original message MODIFY > the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter, AquaticLife > Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > you! > === message truncated === __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13903	From: paul helms	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution

now here is soeone who is educated in the matter! --- Nimish Mathur <nimmat4@...> wrote: > Current in the water will not electrocute the fish. > It will however > electrocute anyone putting their hand in the water. > > Electricity in the water also has more effects then > just electrocution. > There have been reports that the fish start to lose > their orientation and > lateral lines if there is current in the water but > this is not something > that happens immediately. > > > > What can happen immediately are: Heater bursting off > and sending out glass > splinters. Heater malfunctioning and eventually > making a fish soup. Someone > getting electrocuted. Blowing up your main household > circuit or fuse or > RCDs. > > > > Nim > > > > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Eric Roberts > Sent: 26 July 2005 07:39 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > Electrocution > > > > wouldn't there be a complete circuit from the wiring > inside the heater? > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of paul helms > Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 12:57 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > Electrocution > > > no...while water (especially salt) is an excellent > conductor, water is not touching the floor and > therefore has no where to convey. grounding needs > contact direct contact with the ground. if there is > a > current in the water and you are wearing rubber > soled > shoes you will not be shocked because the rubber > inhibits the currents path. if you wore leather > soles > you would get shocked. nothing in the aquarium is > contacting the floor directly. glass is an > insolator > so electricity does not flow through it. the > electricity has to have a place to strike like > lightning does on the earth. > > --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > > > Aren't they grounded by the water? > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Dane & Leslie Moore > > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:17 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > > Electrocution > > > > > > Fish are not grounded so they won't be > electrocuted > > huh? Hmmm. Lol > > Sorry but that's funny. > > > > -----Original Message---- > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > > On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... > > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 9:48 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > > > > > > > > In a message dated 7/25/2005 6:47:32 P.M. Central > > Standard Time, > > wtfmorlok@... writes: > > > > toss the heater, it is no good and will > electricute > > you. ufortunately we have some folks here that > do > > not understand the > > way electricity works, and have warned you about > > fish being > > electricuted. fish are not grounded and will not > > be electricuted > > > > > > Again, your knowledge here is great information. > I > > would have never > > know > > that (same principal as bird on a wire) fish can > not > > get electrocuted. > > But who > > are you? > > > > Linda > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > when > > replying, thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > > that is NOT important > > to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the > > original message MODIFY > > the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > > subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > > matter, AquaticLife > > Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > > you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > when > > replying, thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > > that is NOT important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the > original > > message MODIFY the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > > subject)" <- > > > === message truncated === __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13904	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Aeration questions

Thanks, Tom! Everyone seems to have adjusted to the more flow/bubbles today in the 37 gallon. The right side of the tank is still somewhat calm so all the bazillion tiny baby guppies just hang out there when they aren't zooming around. I guess I certainly could have just raised the airstone up instead of buying a new pump, duh, what a good idea! The new pump is actually quieter, though, which is a plus. I guess I will leave it on all the time as you suggested for pH and CO2 balance. Besides, I like the bubbles and the otos do seem to play in them :) The aeration does not offset the heatwaves effects, I do it because the warmer water does not hold as much oxygen so the bubbles breaking the surface actually help the fish. Please correct me, someone, if this is not the case! So far the best method to cool down my tank has been to aim a fan at it and open the hood. Thanks again for addressing my questions! Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Tom Ray" <t_a_ray_cissp@y...> wrote: > TheSydMonster: > > I too have a deep and wide 37 gal tank (Ocean "Cube" -- brand & > model). I too bubble for aeration. I use a 10 gal pump and just keep > its airstone/rod above the pump's rated depth, but below the spray bar > (which is pointed back towards the back side {& airstone} to reduce > the water turbulance over the rest of the tank which is well- planted > and becoming stocked with lower-flow fish). > > As for overnight, your aeration helps keep constant flow CO2 from > poisoning your fish / sudden dips in pH. So I think it may be more > important to have it on at night than during the day. > > I also asked one wise old keeper acquaintance why he uses air stone > AND waterfall filter in his tanks. His reply: "Its added insurance. > Its also on a separate circuit breaker from the filter and lights." > And, it did NOT seem to noticeably, negatively affect any of his > "forrested look" planted tanks. > > As for temperature, does it help / seem to help offset the heat wave's > effects? If so, I just might try that. > > As for Mr. Betta, several of the wild-strain Betta breeders I've > chatted with use only an underground (UGF use air pumps), sponge, or > solo air stone for filtration/aeration in their tanks. If it really > is bothering Mr. Betta too much, what if you tried containing it a bit > using some of that clear tank piping the LFS sell. Sort of emulating > the riser of an UGF. > > Finally, as to Oto's, I too have a couple of otocinclus and a > parotocinclus in my 37 gal. tank. I've read somewhere online (ScotCat > or Planet Catfish or ???) that oto/paroto like well oxygenated water. > I also read accounts of how they will deliberately and oddly play as > a group, getting tossed around in the air bubble stream. So I think > they may will be A-OK. > > TIA, > --TommyBoy > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" > <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > After treating my 37 gallon tank with Furan 2 months ago I was told > > to leave my airstone in all the time to increase the surface > > agitation in my tank. I was wondering if I am supposed to leave it > > on all day and all night? I just leave it on all the time, is that > > okay or should I shut it off at night? > > > > I only turn the one on in the 10 gallon when the temperature starts > > to increase (set at 76 but due to our heat waves it's been getting > > up to 80 in there) because the betta doesn't like the current much, > > is that okay? > > > > Also, the air pump I was given to put in the 37 gallon tank was for > > a 10 gallon tank so the bubbles were very gentle (it's a deep tank, > > not a wide one). I just got a new pump for a tank up to 40 gallons > > and it causes a lot more aggitation and current on that side of the > > tank. Is this bad or stressful for the fish or will they get used > > to it? The only ones that seem affected by it are the otos that are > > trying to clean the glass next to the bubbles and get swirled around > > a bit -- but boy, do they keep trying :) > > > > Any suggestions are appreciated.. > > Rebecca

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13905	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water (now debate about Melafix and Pimafix)

Hi Rebecca, Am glad to see you started signing again yesterday after a brief discussion on that topic came up; it does help. I had temporarily forgotten who TheSydMonster was and regret coming down on you as hard as I did at the start of this debate; sorry about that I guess I just feel strongly that the members here, including you, are instructed with the correct information on any topic in question based on concrete evidence that I post (otherwise, I wouldn't post it), in an effort to see you succeed. At least I trust you got something out of these talks, and I thank you for appreciating the time we take out to answer any questions we can for those who haven't "learned the ropes" yet. I can speak for myself in saying that I don't spend time typing out replies for my health as it seems you realize, but I do genuinely enjoy being able to help newer hobbyists succeed in their fish keeping by passing along what I've personally learned along the way (sometimes the hard way). I've come to love the hobby, as I'm sure many other Forum members have, and enjoy directing my efforts towards making others' experiences with fish as great as mine has been up until now, and would prefer they don't stumble and give up if I can help it. There's a lot here to be enjoyed, and I know many of our more experienced posters feel the same way or they wouldn't be here. \ In general (usually), the effects of mixing Melafix and Pimafix are seen to be felt by the fish in about two hours or so. It does not seem to affect them immediately, and so there really was no early warning sign. The tough part is that sometimes these remedies were giving at night shortly before the owners went to bed. Naturally, by the time the owner got up the next morning it was way too late to do anything to reverse the fatal conditions. The fish were already dead. \ Do not feel sorry about your role in the foamy water thread. I'm glad you furthered this topic which enabled those of us who have had more experience with these remedies to inform you and the rest of the members of the adverse findings we've found with them. Whether they want to believe us or not, we've tried to advise them to prevent any disasters they may otherwise experience had they not known. I know where you're coming from as far as wanting to know whats going into your tanks and will be glad to help in any capacity I can as long as I'm here. Happy fish watching, Best Regards, Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > I have to say thank you for everyone's advice and experience. I > think we all realize not everyone agrees on things and that we ask > questions on these forums to learn from other's experiences and > opinions. It is great that so many people take time out to answer > questions for us :) > > I was the one that asked what happens to make the medicine become > fatal and was wondering how quickly the fish passed when both > medications were used, Ray? Was there any warning signs that > something was wrong? > > I am sorry I turned the foamy water thread into a debate about > medicines. I just like to know as much as possible about things > before I put them in my tank and since I have only had tanks for 6 > months, my experience is very limited. Thank you all for your > thoughts on this subject, I really appreciate it. > > Have a great day! > Rebecca > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13906	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: tank stands/Level

You didn't say if you live on the first floor and if your sub-flooring is a cement slab or wood frame? Is your home raised off of the ground? If it's on a cement slab, you are OK as far as the weight goes but you should have "leveled" it or had it leaning towards the wall a little. Also, if your tank is on a short stand, it will be more stable than if it's on a tall stand. I built mine 30" high... the standard height for desks.. so it's not as high as a kitchen counter but not as low as some stands. A 75G tank weighs around 800 pounds so you have a very top heavy system compared to the stand which weighs less than 50 pounds in all likelihood. I can't go into a physics lesson here but if it leans away from the wall, it is more likely to tip over with less force than if it was level or slightly canted towards the wall. You could use "shims" (small wedges of wood) under the base of the frame, to cant (lean) the stand and tank back to a level position. If you do this, do not push on the tank itself, but have someone gently pust on the top of the stand (the edge of the top), while someone else slides or taps the shims under the front of the frame base. You would want to use the shims every couple of inches to spread the weight over more surface area. You can get "shims" at your local home improvement store. Make sure you get HARD wood shims... not soft wood. Now, if you live on a 2nd floor or raised house, all of this changes... so let me know. Do you have any pictures of your stand? From the front and from a side view to show how far it is leaning away from the wall? Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: Date: Mon, 25 Jul 2005 22:34:08 -0500 From: "Dane & Leslie Moore" <amjmail@...> Subject: RE: Re: tank stands/Level It's a 75 gallon. I can't measure right now. I took a pill and I'm barely able to type this out. It's on carpet, away from the wall by about 4-5", enough to get away from the strip and bump it causes. What types of problems are we looking at? I don't know what I could do to fix it other than move it to the hard floor which is only in the kitchen and the hall, so no room. Ack! Gosh I'm loopy. Lol Pardon me if this doesn't make too much sense. Leslie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Lenny Vasbinder Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:11 PM To: AquaticLife Yahoo! Group Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: tank stands How big is your tank? It could certainly cause problems. You should definitely work on getting it level. Give me more info on your tank size, what kind of stand you have, how tall is the stand, how tall with the tank on top of it, what kind of floors, etc. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: Date: Mon, 25 Jul 2005 15:06:12 -0500 From: "Dane & Leslie Moore" <amjmail@...> Subject: RE: Re: tank stands You mention "leaning away from the wall problems..." My tank leans a bit outward. I moved it away from the carpet strip as suggeted but once I filled it up, the water is not level. Can this eventually cause a problem? Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13907	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: making your own willow water

In a message dated 7/26/2005 10:38:16 A.M. Central Standard Time, TheSydMonster@... writes: How does it help root new plants, if I may ask? And where do you find it? Thanks :) Rebecca Willows contain root stimulants which allow branches to root by themselves if set into wet ground in the spring. Poplars and dogwoods have the same property to a lesser extent. That property can help to root other plants as well. Directions: * Collect any surplus willow branches or twigs. They are usually lying on the ground after a storm. * Trim off the leaves to prevent spoileage. * Cut the branches to a height about double of a pail. * Stick them into a pail and fill it with water. * Use that water to pour on any newly set plants: bedding plants, shrubs, or trees. * Refill the pail with water. If the water gets stinky, compost the willow branches and start with ne [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13908	From: Sandy Kay	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Digest Number 896

Hi, Thanks so much for your thoughts. My problem with these kind of fish is I am using a 10 gallon. Have a 55 gallon would love to use but do not have room for it. I don't think a 10 gallon is big enough for a loach, is it? Sandy Subject: Re: snails I have 3 botia striata (zebra loaches) in my 37 gallon tank and they are great snail eaters :) They are nice, too, because they only get about 3 or so inches. How big do queen loaches get, they seem really neat? Rebecca [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13909	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: hot water!

The top of the pond is at ground level. All the water is below grade. With no water movement, the upper layers would be warm, and the lower layers would be cool, giving refuge for the fish. If there is water movement, provided by a pump, filter and waterfall, say, then the water would start to warm, but may not get to the temperatures that the above ground pools are experiencing. First, it is a slow mix, relatively speaking, and, second, that the majority of the water is below grade, the earth will help to keep it cool, as the sun and ambient temperature try to warm it up. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Evita Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 7:43 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] hot water! Phil, Off the subject. Funny as it seems I saw on the news last night that people were calling the ice companies because it has been so hot to add big ice blocks to their swimming pools. We have the largest above ground pool Walmart sells and it is like bath water. I wonder how people with outdoor ponds fish are handling the hot temps. Evita Phil <swordtail72@...> wrote: Howdy! The water temp. has been off the chart in 1 of my tanks. I've been putting ice in a baggie & putting that in the tank, but it doesn't help much. My oscar's skin is coming off & he's not eating. I've also been putting med. in the tank. What else can I do?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13910	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: hot water!

Where are you located that the unit is so expensive? Last year, I replaced my heat pump, both the exterior and interior portions, and it ran me only $6000. And that cools the whole house in the summer and heats it in the winter (sometimes with an electrical heating coil assisting). \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 3:51 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] hot water! are you kidding? minimal cost for a portable a/c here is $1300. that's why i don't have one. --- Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: > Turn the a/c up. > > Seriously, though. For everybody here who doesn't have an air conditioner: > Get one. If you can afford a fish tank, you don't have any excuse to not > have a good air conditioner to keep the room it is in cool in the summer, > and a good safe heater to keep it warm in the winter. Not to mention you > are more likely to die of heat stroke in your own house if you don't keep it > cool. Also, if you can afford an internet connection, you have no excuse to > not have an a/c. They aren't really that expensive. A lot cheaper than > restocking your tanks or paying medical bills when you fall over dead. > > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy. > > "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is > perhaps, the end of the beginning." > -Winston Churchill > -------Original Message------- > Howdy! The water temp. has been off the chart in 1 of my tanks. I've been putting ice in a > baggie & putting that in the tank, but it doesn't help much. My oscar's skin is coming off & > he's not eating. I've also been putting med. in the tank. What else can I do? > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13911	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Digest Number 896

Sorry to say, no, I don't think a 10 gallon would be a happy home for a loach, especially because they like to be in groups of at least 3. When I first set up my 10 gallon, I just squished the snails I saw against the glass and my betta ate them. This may have already been suggested but you could place an algae wafer in there or a piece of lettuce and the next morning, when all the snails are congregated on it, take it out and throw it away. I currently have snails in my 10 gallon (malaysian trumpet snails, sorry if the spelling is wrong) to help turn over the sand and they don't eat my plants. I have been told snails aren't really as bad as people think they are and actually have some benefits. Good luck :) Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Sandy Kay" <knightwriter101@y...> wrote: > Hi, Thanks so much for your thoughts. My problem with these kind of fish is > I am using a 10 gallon. Have a 55 gallon would love to use but do not have > room for it. I don't think a 10 gallon is big enough for a loach, is it? > > Sandy > > > > Subject: Re: snails > > I have 3 botia striata (zebra loaches) in my 37 gallon tank and they > are great snail eaters :) They are nice, too, because they only get > about 3 or so inches. How big do queen loaches get, they seem > really neat? > > Rebecca > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13912	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: pimafix and melafix

Ahhh, yes, the miracle cure all. Anything that claims to treat both bacterial and fungal infections should be immediately suspect. This is even before we consider the differences in gram-negative and gram-positive bacteria, which need different treatments to be effective. Also suspect, in this description is that both marine organisms and freshwater organisms the same. While my experience with marine organisms is strictly through literature, none of it indicates using the same exact cure for the similar diseases they may suffer--similar, but caused by different organisms. While I question the usefulness of aloe in StressCoat, it seems to do no harm to the fish, and I can live with that, but I feel there are better products out there that do not use aloe or other similar compounds that do the job just as well, if not better. However, I would not dissuade you from using it, if it works for you. However, from what I have seen in this thread, and other, previous threads about these products, I'd stay far away from them. I'd try to positively identify what my fish are suffering from, and then treat accordingly with the recommended treatment. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of thesydmonster Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 11:57 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] pimafix and melafix "PimaFix Treats fungal infections and both internal and external bacterial infections. Will not adversely affect the biological filter, alter the pH, or discolor water. Safe for reef aquariums and live plants. For use in fresh or salt water. PimaFix has been formulated to work in combination with MelaFix to enhance effectiveness against fish diseases" "In extreme cases of especially stubborn infections, PimaFix has been designed to work synergistically with MelaFix. Using PimaFix and MelaFix together provides the added benefit of quick tissue regeneration and wound healing." "Whenever treating with any medication, we suggest performing a 25-50% water change every three days depending on the organic load in water." These quotes are from the aquarium pharmaceuticals webpage. I am certainly not saying that both should be used together based on several posts here that have stated there is a terrible reaction when used simultaneously, I just wanted to show you that I was NOT, in fact, making up that the manufacturer states they are safe to use together. "When used in combination with PimaFix, MelaFix provides a more effective treatment against fish disease and promotes rapid healing" is written on the label of the melafix bottle I have. "PimaFix has been specially formulated to work in combination with MelaFix for a more effective treatment against stubborn fish disease and to promote rapid healing" is written on the label of the pimafix I have. Both labels say to dose daily for 7 days, then do a 25% water change. This is why I have been confused. I am not belittling the experiences told on this forum about fatalities that occured when both medications were used, I am just pointing out how it can be so hard to know if you are doing the right thing if you cannot believe a manufatured label or business website! I appreciate everyone's insight into this topic and apologize for the long post :)

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13913	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: aquarium medicine cabinet

Hello list, What products would you recommend to keep in an aquarium medicine cabinet? Obviously, something to treat ick, but what else? Which is more contagious, bacterial infections, or fungal? In what situations do you remove the fish to a hospital tank? Do you remove the infected fish and start treatment on that particular fish; if more than one fish has it, would you pull them out one by one, or just treat the entire community? I know there are a lot of denominations missing here, but this has always been my dilemma. With a bacteria, can you assume that everyone will get sick? I do have a book on fish diseases, but it gets way into scientific stuff, like doing biopsies and skin scrapings. I have seen a few different websites that help to diagnose; just wondering what everyone else does. I do not have a problem now, but I just want to be prepared should someone get sick. Thanks, Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13914	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Clear water!!

I finally have crystal clear water! It is so pretty! Thanks to everyone who reassured me in what I was doing, with all the cloudy water, cycling in and planted aquarium questions. I can finally sit back and really enjoy SEEING my pet fish. I have a couple more plants I need to adjust next time I do a water change and I get to pick up my four black lace angels tomorrow! I am so excited. I posted another picture to share. It is under Linda's-clear water! Note the aponogeton ulvaceous flower floating at the center of the tank! Yeah! Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13915	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: mondo grass

I was out shopping for java moss and java fern yesterday. I went to one of the fish stores in the cities and found a very dark aquarium full of mondo grass. The guy at the store said it did well in low light, so I bought some. Now that I have had time to do research, it is not a true aquatic plant? One site even said it should be planted short term only. What's up with that? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13916	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Ph

First, it is always pH, even if one starts a sentence with it. In another post you say that the wood was in another aquarium for 8-9 months. If it is still leaching tannins at this point, and I mean enough to yellow the water and lower the pH as you describe, I would question whether this wood was meant for an aquarium. If it were, then I'd suggest trying to speed the process along by removing the wood and boiling it until the water no longer darkens. Or, you can just leave the pH where it is, and when the wood finishes leaching, the pH will rise somewhat. For many South American fish, a pH of even 6.5 may be high for them. Rams have been found in water with a pH of less than 5, as have discus. Neon tetras are often found in water below 6. pH is a funny thing. I recommend that you not try to change it, as often that leads to disaster. Just keep an eye on it, and if it maintains itself at the lower level, be happy. Your fish probably are. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Robert Hickey Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 5:21 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Ph Hi All Hope everyone is fine, :o) Im in an area I would say some Would love To be in Asthe Water we have is soft and the Ph is neutral. The problem Im having is that I have a few big pieces of bog wood in My tank and such release tanins and lower my ph ( which is great) but the problem I am having is that the ph is droping to 6, most of the fish don`t mind this as there all south american but I would prefer to keep it around 6.5 to 6.8. Im not into chemical buffers, so is there a way for me to buffer the ph to Around this , ? by using stone or other natural buffers? Many Thanks All Rob

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13917	From: ahorseofcourse66	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Question on Gouramis ?

Big ? We have 4 gouramis, 2 males and 2 female. Non of them will get along. The first male and female we bought fought to the point they drew blood. Now the male fights any fish you put him with and the female gets along fine with any fist but other gouramis. Now we bought another pair and they didn't get along, so we seperated them and after aweek we are trying again. They seemed to be ok for alittle while the female was currling up around the male and he seemed to not care then she started chasing him around the tank, then they started this curling around each other and holding onto each others tail and now their back to her chasing him. Which the first time we had them together he was the one chasing her. Now all he wants to do is hide. Anyone have any experence or might have some input?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13918	From: camdogkingsfan	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Update on my Black ghost

Okay for those of you that don't know what i am talking about look for the posting called fish disapering. But here is an update. I took my knife out of the 48 and put him/her in the 25 gallon take I have and bought a Platydoras costatus or striped rafeal. Cool fish. It is still a little guy but I think big enough to make sure the Black Knife does eat him. In the 48 gallon I bought some for fish for it too. I bought 3 guppy's, a glass fish, and other guppy looking fish that have a split tale. So now all in the 48 is big posco, 2 upside down catfish, 4 albno catfish, 2 black skirt tetras, 2 ghost catfish and the new guys. Hopefully I won't have anymore problems with fish getting eaten.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13919	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution (Paul Helms going off the d

Paul, I think it's about time you take a MelaFix / PimaFix cocktail so we can test your theory. Geeeezzzz.... take a chill pill dude! Besides.. God ALWAYS starts with a capital "G" and you should never use His name in vain! I think you implied that you own a LFS. I hope you don't talk to your customers like that. Maybe you should take a class in how to talk to people. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: 13 Date: Tue, 26 Jul 2005 14:19:31 -0700 (PDT) From: paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> Subject: RE: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution no they are not...god damn it read a freaking book, take a class , something!!!! --- Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: > Yes they are. > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Eric Roberts > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:24 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > Electrocution > > > Aren't they grounded by the water? > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Dane & Leslie Moore > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:17 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > Electrocution > > > Fish are not grounded so they won't be electrocuted > huh? Hmmm. Lol > Sorry but that's funny. > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13920	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 7/26/2005
Subject: Re: Ph - Bogwood

Steve, On a rare occasion, my LFS had got some bogwood from Africa and they had to take back a lot of this wood from people (excluding me) as it almost never seemed to stop leeching tannins even after 6-8 months. I had them in a very large tank (100 gallons) for more then a year and they were still leeching out tannins :-(. Considering the UK's wet weather, I let the woods sit in the garden for another year and all seasons and about 4 months ago I started to reuse them and they are perfectly fine now :-). No leeching color or tannins any more and perfectly stable. I don't know why they were like this but I suspect that they needed more time. Some one I know had also reported that it took almost 18 months for the same shipment of wood to stop leeching tannins but were otherwise perfectly safe. I did want to boil it too but because the pieces were as large as 3.5ft-4ft, I was unable to figure out a proper way to boil a piece lol. But it is a very rare occasion and they have not ordered from the same company after that. Nim Ps: I do agree 100% on the PH issue though _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: 27 July 2005 03:36 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Ph First, it is always pH, even if one starts a sentence with it. In another post you say that the wood was in another aquarium for 8-9 months. If it is still leaching tannins at this point, and I mean enough to yellow the water and lower the pH as you describe, I would question whether this wood was meant for an aquarium. If it were, then I'd suggest trying to speed the process along by removing the wood and boiling it until the water no longer darkens. Or, you can just leave the pH where it is, and when the wood finishes leaching, the pH will rise somewhat. For many South American fish, a pH of even 6.5 may be high for them. Rams have been found in water with a pH of less than 5, as have discus. Neon tetras are often found in water below 6. pH is a funny thing. I recommend that you not try to change it, as often that leads to disaster. Just keep an eye on it, and if it maintains itself at the lower level, be happy. Your fish probably are. \\Steve// _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13921	From: Robert Hickey	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: Ph

Hi steve Yes it is still staining the Water ( its not a problem as I am going for a amazon Biotope) and yes the Wood is for aquariums supplied from my local fish store and is suited for aquariums. Also I have boiled it to dead before I added to the aquarium months back. Wow didnt know that Rams have been found in Such low PH , interesting, I do plan on adding discus at some point but only after a few months when this new tank has cycled,( most of my old fish are still in the old tank While the new one cyclies) I have kept a good eye on the ph and read a bit more and found more information about ph than before , and it directly relates to my setup,. th etank ph in the morning is around 6 to 6.4 while at the end of the Day it Works out around 6.6 to 6.8 and this is to do with plants, as my tank is well planted and at night the plants are not doing there bits and pieces as during the day they are, so the tank seems to have stablised a bit more ove rthe last few days, It worried me that ph was droping so low but with your details on rams And neons found in such low ph I am no longer concerned thanks Steve, But as you advise Im leaving it alone , from all this information if its not broke don`t fix it, Thanks again Irish rob Regards Robert Hickey Robert Hickey | Networks Engineer Citywest Business Park | BT | Tel: +353 (0)1 43258749 | Mob: +353 (0)86 8061840 | E: robert.hickey@... | www.btireland.ie ----- Original Message ----- From: Steve Szabo To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 3:36 AM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Ph First, it is always pH, even if one starts a sentence with it. In another post you say that the wood was in another aquarium for 8-9 months. If it is still leaching tannins at this point, and I mean enough to yellow the water and lower the pH as you describe, I would question whether this wood was meant for an aquarium. If it were, then I'd suggest trying to speed the process along by removing the wood and boiling it until the water no longer darkens. Or, you can just leave the pH where it is, and when the wood finishes leaching, the pH will rise somewhat. For many South American fish, a pH of even 6.5 may be high for them. Rams have been found in water with a pH of less than 5, as have discus. Neon tetras are often found in water below 6. pH is a funny thing. I recommend that you not try to change it, as often that leads to disaster. Just keep an eye on it, and if it maintains itself at the lower level, be happy. Your fish probably are. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Robert Hickey Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 5:21 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Ph Hi All Hope everyone is fine, :o) Im in an area I would say some Would love To be in Asthe Water we have is soft and the Ph is neutral. The problem Im having is that I have a few big pieces of bog wood in My tank and such release tanins and lower my ph ( which is great) but the problem I am having is that the ph is droping to 6, most of the fish don`t mind this as there all south american but I would prefer to keep it around 6.5 to 6.8. Im not into chemical buffers, so is there a way for me to buffer the ph to Around this , ? by using stone or other natural buffers? Many Thanks All Rob ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13922	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy Water (now the debate on MelaFix and PimaFix)

Paul, You are using half truths and hearsay again to try to get the better of an argument. I have quoted the relevant statements from the A/P website in a previous post. If you have any proof at all that mixing MelaFix and PimaFix kills fish lets here it, otherwise retract your statements. Incidentally 'synergistically' means acting together or enhancing the effect of each other !. regards, unclenorm. --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > i was on the pimafix website and that is not the > language used there. i understand you got this from > ap's website, but that is not the onlything out > there. > there is really nothing to debate here. > expperience > shows direct contradiction. take it or leave it, i > am > not gonna argue about it. i am also looking at > aquarium pharm directly on their pimafix.html site, > and the wording is not the same as what you have cut > and pasted. you can copy and paste the link before > for > the full article by ap. > > http://www.aquariumpharm.com/pimafix.html > > direct snip of full paragraph- > > In extreme cases of especially stubborn infections, > PimaFix has been designed to work synergistically > with > MelaFix. Using PimaFix and MelaFix together provides > the added benefit of quick tissue regeneration and > wound healing. > > > --- Lenny Vasbinder <lnvtm1@...> wrote: > > > Here are cut and paste product descriptions and > > FAQ's from Melafix and Pimafix... well, there were > > no FAQ's on Pimafix but the product description > says > > "PimaFix has been formulated to work in > combination > > with MelaFix to enhance effectiveness against fish > > diseases"... among other things. These snips are > > directly from the Aquarium Pharmaceuticals web > site. > > > > MelaFix® > > > > Heals open wounds & abrasions, treats fin and tail > > rot, eye cloud, mouth fungus and promotes regrowth > > of damaged fin rays & tissue. Will not adversely > > affect the biological filter, alter the pH, or > > discolor water. Safe for reef aquariums and live > > plants. For use in fresh or salt water. > > > > MelaFix FAQ's- > > > > Can MelaFix be used with other medications? > > > > MelaFix has been tested and found compatible with > > Aquarium Pharmaceuticals medications. Mixing > other > > brands of medications is not recommended. > > > > Is MelaFix harmful to aquatic plants? > > > > MelaFix can be used in aquariums and ponds > > containing live plants. > > > > Will MelaFix kill snails? > > > > No. > > > > Can I use MelaFix in aquariums containing > freshwater > > crabs and shrimp? > > > > Yes. > > > > Will MelaFix hurt saltwater invertebrates? > > > > No. MelaFix is reef-compatible. MelaFix has been > > shown to promote the healing of damaged coral > > tissue. > > > > I have a protein skimmer. Will MelaFix cause > > foaming? > > > > MelaFix will cause some increased foaming during > the > > treatment. We recommend turning the skimmer down > or > > off during treatment with MelaFix. > > > > Do I have to remove the activated carbon from my > > filter when treating with MelaFix? > > > > We suggest removing the carbon while treating with > > any medication. > > > > > > > > PimaFix > > > > Treats fungal infections and both internal and > > external bacterial infections. Will not adversely > > affect the biological filter, alter the pH, or > > discolor water. Safe for reef aquariums and live > > plants. For use in fresh or salt water. PimaFix > has > > been formulated to work in combination with > MelaFix > > to enhance effectiveness against fish diseases. > > > > > > Lenny Vasbinder > > http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com > > 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 > > LNVTM1@... > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > ___________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13923	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy Water (now the debate on MelaFix and PimaFix)

Whats the argument about? There are too many variables in an aquarium to even think about similarities. I have on a couple of occasions had a bad experience with melafix + other medication. This is one in a 100 times .This does not prove that the mix of medicines can or cannot kill a fish. Its like “Driving can kill you” or “Driving cannot kill you”. Both statements are somewhat true and false. API does state that both medicines can be mixed, but there could be a scenario when the mixed medicines can cause problems rather then benefits we all know that this is very much possible with practically anything even a water change. I was myself just giving my experience that it has had a bad effect a couple of times and just shows that one should be careful with using medications and should be the last resort to anything. Why and where is the argument? Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Norman. S. Hampson. Sent: 27 July 2005 11:40 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: Foamy Water (now the debate on MelaFix and PimaFix) Paul, You are using half truths and hearsay again to try to get the better of an argument. I have quoted the relevant statements from the A/P website in a previous post. If you have any proof at all that mixing MelaFix and PimaFix kills fish lets here it, otherwise retract your statements. Incidentally 'synergistically' means acting together or enhancing the effect of each other !. regards, unclenorm. --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > i was on the pimafix website and that is not the > language used there. i understand you got this from > ap's website, but that is not the onlything out > there. > there is really nothing to debate here. > expperience > shows direct contradiction. take it or leave it, i > am > not gonna argue about it. i am also looking at > aquarium pharm directly on their pimafix.html site, > and the wording is not the same as what you have cut > and pasted. you can copy and paste the link before > for > the full article by ap. > > http://www.aquariumpharm.com/pimafix.html > > direct snip of full paragraph- > > In extreme cases of especially stubborn infections, > PimaFix has been designed to work synergistically > with > MelaFix. Using PimaFix and MelaFix together provides > the added benefit of quick tissue regeneration and > wound healing. > > > --- Lenny Vasbinder <lnvtm1@...> wrote: > > > Here are cut and paste product descriptions and > > FAQ's from Melafix and Pimafix... well, there were > > no FAQ's on Pimafix but the product description > says > > "PimaFix has been formulated to work in > combination > > with MelaFix to enhance effectiveness against fish > > diseases"... among other things. These snips are > > directly from the Aquarium Pharmaceuticals web > site. > > > > MelaFix® > > > > Heals open wounds & abrasions, treats fin and tail > > rot, eye cloud, mouth fungus and promotes regrowth > > of damaged fin rays & tissue. Will not adversely > > affect the biological filter, alter the pH, or > > discolor water. Safe for reef aquariums and live > > plants. For use in fresh or salt water. > > > > MelaFix FAQ's- > > > > Can MelaFix be used with other medications? > > > > MelaFix has been tested and found compatible with > > Aquarium Pharmaceuticals medications. Mixing > other > > brands of medications is not recommended. > > > > Is MelaFix harmful to aquatic plants? > > > > MelaFix can be used in aquariums and ponds > > containing live plants. > > > > Will MelaFix kill snails? > > > > No. > > > > Can I use MelaFix in aquariums containing > freshwater > > crabs and shrimp? > > > > Yes. > > > > Will MelaFix hurt saltwater invertebrates? > > > > No. MelaFix is reef-compatible. MelaFix has been > > shown to promote the healing of damaged coral > > tissue. > > > > I have a protein skimmer. Will MelaFix cause > > foaming? > > > > MelaFix will cause some increased foaming during > the > > treatment. We recommend turning the skimmer down > or > > off during treatment with MelaFix. > > > > Do I have to remove the activated carbon from my > > filter when treating with MelaFix? > > > > We suggest removing the carbon while treating with > > any medication. > > > > > > > > PimaFix > > > > Treats fungal infections and both internal and > > external bacterial infections. Will not adversely > > affect the biological filter, alter the pH, or > > discolor water. Safe for reef aquariums and live > > plants. For use in fresh or salt water. PimaFix > has > > been formulated to work in combination with > MelaFix > > to enhance effectiveness against fish diseases. > > > > > > Lenny Vasbinder > > http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com > > 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 > > LNVTM1@... > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > ___________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13924	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: PimaFix and MelaFix

Paul, You are misquoting again to try and further your argument. The site says and I quote :- "Whenever treating with any medication, we suggest performing a 25-50% water change every three days depending on the organic load in water". regards, unclenorm. --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > the quotes you have taken from the site > contraindicate > the bottles directions. the webs ite says 20-50% > change every 3 days and the bottle quote you have > posted says 25% after 7 days...little odd huh? also > the website says IN EXTREME CASES. > > --- thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@...> wrote: > > > "PimaFix > > > > Treats fungal infections and both internal and > > external bacterial > > infections. Will not adversely affect the > biological > > filter, alter > > thepH, or discolor water. Safe for reef aquariums > > and live plants. > > For use in fresh or salt water. PimaFix has been > > formulated to work > > in combination with MelaFix to enhance > effectiveness > > against fish > > diseases" > > > > "In extreme cases of especially stubborn > infections, > > PimaFix has been > > designed to work synergistically with MelaFix. > Using > > PimaFix and > > MelaFix together provides the added benefit of > quick > > tissue > > regeneration and wound healing." > > > > "Whenever treating with any medication, we suggest > > performing a 25- > > 50% water change every three days depending on the > > organic load in > > water." > > > > These quotes are from the aquarium pharmaceuticals > > webpage. I am > > certainly not saying that both should be used > > together based on > > several posts here that have stated there is a > > terrible reaction when > > used simultaneously, I just wanted to show you > that > > I was NOT, in > > fact, making up that the manufacturer states they > > are safe to use > > together. > > > > "When used in combination with PimaFix, MelaFix > > provides a more > > effective treatment against fish disease and > > promotes rapid healing" > > is written on the label of the melafix bottle I > > have. > > > > "PimaFix has been specially formulated to work in > > combination with > > MelaFix for a more effective treatment against > > stubborn fish disease > > and to promote rapid healing" is written on the > > label of the pimafix > > I have. > > > > Both labels say to dose daily for 7 days, then do > a > > 25% water change. > > > > This is why I have been confused. I am not > > belittling the experiences > > told on this forum about fatalities that occured > > when both > > medications were used, I am just pointing out how > it > > can be so hard > > to know if you are doing the right thing if you > > cannot believe a > > manufaturer's label or business website! > > > > I appreciate everyone's insight into this topic > and > > apologize for the > > long post :) > > > > Rebecca > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > ___________________________________________________________ How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13925	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium medicine cabinet

Oh wow... I see another debate starting.... Preventive Maintenance is key here Weekly waterchanges Cures and prevents Most things My Medicine cabinet: quick cure for ich Methyl blue for fungus mostly on eggs And Salt................ I also have medicated food by Jungle: anti bacterial and anti parasite rob Indiana In a message dated 7/26/2005 9:06:05 PM US Eastern Standard Time, Crazy4fids@... writes: Hello list, What products would you recommend to keep in an aquarium medicine cabinet? Obviously, something to treat ick, but what else? Which is more contagious, bacterial infections, or fungal? In what situations do you remove the fish to a hospital tank? Do you remove the infected fish and start treatment on that particular fish; if more than one fish has it, would you pull them out one by one, or just treat the entire community? I know there are a lot of denominations missing here, but this has always been my dilemma. With a bacteria, can you assume that everyone will get sick? I do have a book on fish diseases, but it gets way into scientific stuff, like doing biopsies and skin scrapings. I have seen a few different websites that help to diagnose; just wondering what everyone else does. I do not have a problem now, but I just want to be prepared should someone get sick. Thanks, Linda Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13926	From: paul helms	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: PimaFix and MelaFix

any medication would include itself. not misquoted. the web site says change 20-50% every 3 days when medicating...the bottle says treat 7 days follow with 20% water change...nothing misquoted. --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> wrote: > Paul, > You are misquoting again to try and further > your > argument. The site says and I quote :- "Whenever > treating with any medication, we suggest performing > a > 25-50% water change every three days depending on > the > organic load in water". > regards, > unclenorm. > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > the quotes you have taken from the site > > contraindicate > > the bottles directions. the webs ite says 20-50% > > change every 3 days and the bottle quote you have > > posted says 25% after 7 days...little odd huh? > also > > the website says IN EXTREME CASES. > > > > --- thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@...> > wrote: > > > > > "PimaFix > > > > > > Treats fungal infections and both internal and > > > external bacterial > > > infections. Will not adversely affect the > > biological > > > filter, alter > > > thepH, or discolor water. Safe for reef > aquariums > > > and live plants. > > > For use in fresh or salt water. PimaFix has been > > > formulated to work > > > in combination with MelaFix to enhance > > effectiveness > > > against fish > > > diseases" > > > > > > "In extreme cases of especially stubborn > > infections, > > > PimaFix has been > > > designed to work synergistically with MelaFix. > > Using > > > PimaFix and > > > MelaFix together provides the added benefit of > > quick > > > tissue > > > regeneration and wound healing." > > > > > > "Whenever treating with any medication, we > suggest > > > performing a 25- > > > 50% water change every three days depending on > the > > > organic load in > > > water." > > > > > > These quotes are from the aquarium > pharmaceuticals > > > webpage. I am > > > certainly not saying that both should be used > > > together based on > > > several posts here that have stated there is a > > > terrible reaction when > > > used simultaneously, I just wanted to show you > > that > > > I was NOT, in > > > fact, making up that the manufacturer states > they > > > are safe to use > > > together. > > > > > > "When used in combination with PimaFix, MelaFix > > > provides a more > > > effective treatment against fish disease and > > > promotes rapid healing" > > > is written on the label of the melafix bottle I > > > have. > > > > > > "PimaFix has been specially formulated to work > in > > > combination with > > > MelaFix for a more effective treatment against > > > stubborn fish disease > > > and to promote rapid healing" is written on the > > > label of the pimafix > > > I have. > > > > > > Both labels say to dose daily for 7 days, then > do > > a > > > 25% water change. > > > > > > This is why I have been confused. I am not > > > belittling the experiences > > > told on this forum about fatalities that occured > > > when both > > > medications were used, I am just pointing out > how > > it > > > can be so hard > > > to know if you are doing the right thing if you > > > cannot believe a > > > manufaturer's label or business website! > > > > > > I appreciate everyone's insight into this topic > > and > > > apologize for the > > > long post :) > > > > > > Rebecca > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > > protection around > > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > How much free photo storage do you get? Store your > holiday > snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos > http://uk.photos.yahoo.com > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13927	From: paul helms	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution (Paul Helms going off the d

i am sick of ignorant ppl arguing fact...elctricities nature is a fact not an opinion. speaking of how you talk to ppl, telling someone to drink something that they know to be fatal to fish is not exactly good ppl skills --- Lenny Vasbinder <lnvtm1@...> wrote: > Paul, > > I think it's about time you take a MelaFix / PimaFix > cocktail so we can test your theory. > > Geeeezzzz.... take a chill pill dude! > > Besides.. God ALWAYS starts with a capital "G" and > you should never use His name in vain! > > I think you implied that you own a LFS. I hope you > don't talk to your customers like that. Maybe you > should take a class in how to talk to people. > > Lenny Vasbinder > http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com > 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 > LNVTM1@... > > Message: 13 > Date: Tue, 26 Jul 2005 14:19:31 -0700 (PDT) > From: paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> > Subject: RE: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution > > no they are not...god damn it read a freaking book, > take a class , something!!!! > > --- Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> > wrote: > > > Yes they are. > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > > On Behalf Of Eric Roberts > > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:24 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > > Electrocution > > > > > > Aren't they grounded by the water? > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > > On Behalf Of Dane & Leslie Moore > > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:17 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > > Electrocution > > > > > > Fish are not grounded so they won't be > electrocuted > > huh? Hmmm. Lol > > Sorry but that's funny. > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13928	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water

Hi Nimish, MelaFix is a Medication not a water conditioner or an air freshener why were you using it as such ? why do you not name the other product you say caused your problem when mixed with MelaFix, you should never mix medications unless advised to do so by someone you can hold to task for the consequences.As you say you haven't used PimaFix your post is not relevant to this thread. This thread is about mixing MelaFix and PimaFix. Fish gasping at the surface if not oxygen starvation is usualy ammonia or nitrite poisoning, inadequate filtration. regards, unclenorm. --- Nimish Mathur <nimmat4@...> wrote: > I can personally 3rd this comment along with Paul > :-) > > > > Melafix may not go well with a lot of other > medications and I have suffered > myself. Never really used pimafix but after the > horror I went thru over a > year ago, I have stopped using melafix as a water > conditioner/air freshener > just incase there is something in the tank that > could cause it to bounce > back. Even water conditioners strangely. > > > > I used a new water conditioner with melafix and > within an hour all fish were > gasping at the surface. Reasons not known as oxygen > depletion was really not > an issue. I have a couple of powerheads in the tank > making it look like a > water fall and even next day they still had to put > an effort to breath. > Luckily, no casualty but if I had gone to sleep > without putting the > powerhead then probably the entire tank would have > gone belly up. > > > > Nim > > > > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: 25 July 2005 23:59 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Foamy water > > > > Do not believe everything that you read! Do you > REALLY KNOW for sure > whether or not Melafix and Pimafix can be mixed? If > not, please do > not recommend such a thing to other newer Forum > members who may not > know better. Paul is 100% correct on this one. I > too have seen and > learned of many cases of hobbyists I know mixing > these > two "medications" together and wiping out their > tanks. Most of these > tanks were well established over many years with one > fish having a > scrape or slight sore with all the other fish being > healthy, as in > cases that Paul has seen. By themselves, these > remedies are great, > so I am not trying to bash them. I am not a > chemist, so I cannot > tell you what happens when you put them together, > only that it kills > fish. Can't say why the manufacturer would > recommend it -- I would > hope it wouldn't just be to increase sales, but it > would seem obvious > they may not have really tried mixing these two meds > as a test in a > healthy fish-populated aquarium or I'm sure they > would have found it > to be detrimental. My gut feeling is that there may > be other unseen > factors involved when mixing these two, such as > maybe the water was > below a certain pH (6.6? for instance), or the water > was high in > magnesium or any number of things in these aquariums > which were not > ordinarily unsafe nor uncommon as all the aquariums > involved must > have had similar parameters, but were fatal when > these TWO meds were > introduced to the tank together. Maybe when mixing > them, you can add > no more than half strength of each one to get a > total treatment -- > that I couldn't tell you, but I can tell you mixing > them can be > fatal, even if not all the time. Although I haven't > heard of any > successful mixed treatments. Ray > > \ > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" > <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > Hmmm.. it says on their web page and the packaging > that melafix and > > pimafix CAN be used together, that they are > complementary. What > > happens when you put them together that is fatal > and why would the > > manufacturer recommend it, then? > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > wrote: > > > they should not be used together, and can have > fatal > > > results when mixed at the same time. alone they > are > > > safe...together not so much > > > > > > --- thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > > > > > > Have you started treating your tank with > anything? > > > > I believe certain > > > > medications, such as melafix and pimafix -- > which > > > > can be used > > > > together, by the way -- cause foam to appear. > Sorry > > > > to not be of more > > > > help. > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & > Leslie > > > > Moore" > > > > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > > > > My water has developed a foam type around > the > > > > edges as well as a few > > > > > spots of randome floating clumps. The foam > is all > > > > along the edge of > > > > the > > > > > tank as well as the filter, spray wand, > etc... > > > > > All the tests are fine. No ammonia, > nitrites or > > > > high nitrates. > > > > > > > > > > I read a post a while back where someone > else had > > > > some "foam" but I > > > > > can't remember which group or what the > outcome > > > > was. > > > > > > > > > > any ideas? > > > > > > > > > > Leslie > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > > Do You Yahoo!? > > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > protection around > > > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when > replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology > > Biology > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the > web. > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of > Service. > > > > _____ > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ___________________________________________________________ How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13929	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: mondo grass

Mondo grass is a land plant that loves wet ground. However, there are a couple of types of aquatic plants that are sold under the name of mondo grass in aquarium stores that look virtually identical, but are not the same thing. Certain types of sagittaria subulata or lilaeopsis are sold as mondo grass in pet stores. They are also fairly hardy and low light and do quite well in aqariums, spreading to make a nice grassy looking low ground cover in your tank, perfect for hiding and protecting small fry and shrimp that like to busy themselves at the bottom of the tank.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13930	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium medicine cabinet

The only things I have "on hand" is aquarium salt and melafix, both of which were bought because I treated a guppy for fungus. I thought I read somewhere to not really have a lot of meds on hand because a) they expire b) you shouldn't treat without really knowing what you are treating for c) good water maintenance is the best preventative. I am just a newbe, too, though. good luck :) Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, FortWayneFish@a... wrote: > Oh wow... I see another debate starting.... > Preventive Maintenance is key here > Weekly waterchanges Cures and prevents Most things > > > My Medicine cabinet: > > quick cure for ich > Methyl blue for fungus mostly on eggs > And Salt................ > I also have medicated food by Jungle: anti bacterial and anti parasite > > rob > Indiana > > > > > > > > In a message dated 7/26/2005 9:06:05 PM US Eastern Standard Time, > Crazy4fids@a... writes: > Hello list, > > What products would you recommend to keep in an aquarium medicine cabinet? > Obviously, something to treat ick, but what else? > > Which is more contagious, bacterial infections, or fungal? In what > situations do you remove the fish to a hospital tank? Do you remove the > infected > fish and start treatment on that particular fish; if more than one fish has > it, > would you pull them out one by one, or just treat the entire community? > > I know there are a lot of denominations missing here, but this has always > been my dilemma. With a bacteria, can you assume that everyone will get > sick? > > I do have a book on fish diseases, but it gets way into scientific stuff, > like doing biopsies and skin scrapings. I have seen a few different > websites > that help to diagnose; just wondering what everyone else does. > > I do not have a problem now, but I just want to be prepared should someone > get sick. > > Thanks, > > Linda > > Rob > NE Indiana > USA > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13931	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Electrocution

Guys, Some facts: 1. Fish in the aquarium are not grounded. Current will not flow thru them unless they come in-between the flow of current. 2. Human body is very large, In things like a bath tub, the human body is not really grounded but infact acts as a ground itself. 3. Dropping a hair dryer in the bath will not burn the person sitting in it. The electricity flowing thru the body will work on the nervous system and eventually kill it. 4. Fish are too small to be considered as grounding in an aquarium. It is similar to a large swimming pool and someone swimming in it and one drops in a hair dryer in the pool. Why does electricity flow thru the human body in water? Electricity flows in the water in form of ions. Once a current is released in the water, it starts to spread in a 3D field rather then linearly as in wires etc. This basically allows the electricity to come in contact with any and every surface in the water including the human body. Now, human body is so big and has a such a large surface area, that it starts to work as almost a zero resistance conductor in the water. What now happens is very absurd, the part of the body closer to the point of electricity will accept in the flowing electricity and any point further away will start to release it just like radiations. Why? To explain this, flow of electricity is controlled by a force: Potential difference or voltage. Current is just a quantity of it but the force that drives the current is the voltage. A ground surface is one that is considered at an infinitely negative potential or something that will always allow any current to pass thru without offering any resistance.. in a bath tub case: the Human body. So at a point where we have high voltage of current, the human body will tend to absorb the current. now this should absorb the current from every point then? Even the furthest? This does not happen because the current we are talking about is Alternating current. Interesting thing about the alternating current is that in 1/100th of a second, it is positive and the next 1/100th of a second it is negative (basically push and pull). This push and pull makes the human body an effective capacitor (do you really want me to explain what this is and what this does? Lol) It's the work of the body as a capacitor that makes the flow of minor current around the body and thru the water many folds and thus start to effect the entire nervous system. Fish are too small to act as a ground or something at infinitely negative potential and they have a too little surface area to allow a strong potential difference be created at 2 distant ends of the fish and also, it is too small to act as a capacitor. This however does not mean that electricity does not have effect on them.. it is just a minute fraction of what humans feel and the long term effect of current in the water has been reported on fish too. Long term is from 10days to 3-4 months depending on the current as well. Ofcourse, none of this would happen if the current was DC instead of AC. Nim Ps: Sorry for all this but I had to shed some light on this from my thoughts. Been 8 years since I studied physics in university so I could be incorrect in some places.. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13932	From: Evita	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution

Paul, We get it but do you have to cuss a member? I don't get why you are so angry. Evita paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote:no they are not...god damn it read a freaking book, take a class , something!!!! --- Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: > Yes they are. > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Eric Roberts > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:24 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > Electrocution > > > Aren't they grounded by the water? > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Dane & Leslie Moore > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:17 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > Electrocution > > > Fish are not grounded so they won't be electrocuted > huh? Hmmm. Lol > Sorry but that's funny. > > -----Original Message---- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 9:48 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > > > > In a message dated 7/25/2005 6:47:32 P.M. Central > Standard Time, > wtfmorlok@... writes: > > toss the heater, it is no good and will electricute > you. ufortunately we have some folks here that do > not understand the > way electricity works, and have warned you about > fish being > electricuted. fish are not grounded and will not > be electricuted > > > Again, your knowledge here is great information. I > would have never > know > that (same principal as bird on a wire) fish can not > get electrocuted. > But who > are you? > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when > replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important > to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the > original message MODIFY > the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter, AquaticLife > Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when > replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important > to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the > original message MODIFY > the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter, AquaticLife > Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the > web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of > Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when > replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important > to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the > original message MODIFY > the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter, AquaticLife > Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > you! > === message truncated === __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13933	From: wendie	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: Electrocution

How well I remember working on my tanks years ago... I had one hand in one tank and one hand in the other.... oops.... boy was that a weird feeling. Had a damaged heater that I didn't know about until then. Wendie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Nimish Mathur Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 8:34 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Electrocution Guys, Some facts: 1. Fish in the aquarium are not grounded. Current will not flow thru them unless they come in-between the flow of current. 2. Human body is very large, In things like a bath tub, the human body is not really grounded but infact acts as a ground itself. 3. Dropping a hair dryer in the bath will not burn the person sitting in it. The electricity flowing thru the body will work on the nervous system and eventually kill it. 4. Fish are too small to be considered as grounding in an aquarium. It is similar to a large swimming pool and someone swimming in it and one drops in a hair dryer in the pool. Why does electricity flow thru the human body in water? Electricity flows in the water in form of ions. Once a current is released in the water, it starts to spread in a 3D field rather then linearly as in wires etc. This basically allows the electricity to come in contact with any and every surface in the water including the human body. Now, human body is so big and has a such a large surface area, that it starts to work as almost a zero resistance conductor in the water. What now happens is very absurd, the part of the body closer to the point of electricity will accept in the flowing electricity and any point further away will start to release it just like radiations. Why? To explain this, flow of electricity is controlled by a force: Potential difference or voltage. Current is just a quantity of it but the force that drives the current is the voltage. A ground surface is one that is considered at an infinitely negative potential or something that will always allow any current to pass thru without offering any resistance.. in a bath tub case: the Human body. So at a point where we have high voltage of current, the human body will tend to absorb the current. now this should absorb the current from every point then? Even the furthest? This does not happen because the current we are talking about is Alternating current. Interesting thing about the alternating current is that in 1/100th of a second, it is positive and the next 1/100th of a second it is negative (basically push and pull). This push and pull makes the human body an effective capacitor (do you really want me to explain what this is and what this does? Lol) It's the work of the body as a capacitor that makes the flow of minor current around the body and thru the water many folds and thus start to effect the entire nervous system. Fish are too small to act as a ground or something at infinitely negative potential and they have a too little surface area to allow a strong potential difference be created at 2 distant ends of the fish and also, it is too small to act as a capacitor. This however does not mean that electricity does not have effect on them.. it is just a minute fraction of what humans feel and the long term effect of current in the water has been reported on fish too. Long term is from 10days to 3-4 months depending on the current as well. Ofcourse, none of this would happen if the current was DC instead of AC. Nim Ps: Sorry for all this but I had to shed some light on this from my thoughts. Been 8 years since I studied physics in university so I could be incorrect in some places.. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13934	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: To Paul & Ray Re: MelaFix & PimaFix

Paul, As I have pointed out in previous posts you only quoted parts of A/P web site to suit your argument and most of what you have said is pure conjecture, you do not know what killed the fish in question it is an assumption on your part, it could have been the MelaFix or the PimaFix combining with some other substance or medication previously administered to the tank, why were all these fish being treated in there display tanks holding other fish ?, you should know that it is not at all advisable to medicate a display tank, there is no valid excuse for not using a quarantine tank, even a bucket will do. You based some of your statements on there site but out of context such as your remarks on water changes, read what you wrote on this again and then read what the site says again. Why are you trying to bring Nimish into this, he say he has never used PimaFix. It is Ray and yourself that are making these rash statements. regards, unclenorm. --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > read the posts before directing a statement like > that > at me. i did use their own website for quotes, and > others have quoted the same text. it is the > pimafix.html on ap's website. proof is experience, > same as ray and nimish! > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> > wrote: > > > Hi Paul, > > As I'm sure you know MelaFix and PImaFix > are > > manufactured by Aquarium Pharmaceuticals a > reputable > > American manufacturer, there web site states and I > > quote #1 "PimaFix has been formulated to work in > > combination with MelaFix to enhance effectiveness > > against fish diseases" > > quote #2 "University studies and laboratory tests > > showed that PimaFix is an effective antifungal AND > > antibacterial remedy for both freshwater and > marine > > fish. This evidence led to the granting of a > United > > States Patent." > > quote #3 "MelaFix has been tested and found > > compatible > > with Aquarium Pharmaceuticals medications. Mixing > > other brands of medications is not recommended." > > To verify my above statements visit :- > > http://www.aquariumpharm.com?pimafix.html > > I do not know which wed-site you looked at but > what > > you have stated is not on Aquarium Pharmaceuticals > > website. > > What proof do you have that mixing MelaFix and > > PimaFix kills healthy fish ? if you have some then > > complain to your Patent Office. > > regards, > > unclenorm. > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > > > Ray, > > > i looked up the pimafix website, and it does not > > say > > > that they should be used together at all, it > says > > > that > > > they are designed to work "synergistically", > which > > > just means to greater effect. this may only be > > > useful > > > as dip, there is no information listed. the use > > of > > > this language very clearly states to me that it > is > > a > > > write up by a marketing team, not researchers. > if > > > one > > > takes the time to read the full statement on the > > > site, > > > it states very clearly that they can be used > > togther > > > in EXTREME cases, not everyday use. in addition, > i > > > know that we have had some "medical" responses, > > but > > > these are not "medications" but rather tea tree > > and > > > bay tree extracts, not true antibiotics or anti > > > fungals meaning not engineered to be used in > this > > > way. > > > they may function well in the application, but > > this > > > is hollistic not pharmaceutical. > > > > > > --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> > > wrote: > > > > > > > Do not believe everything that you read! Do > you > > > > REALLY KNOW for sure > > > > whether or not Melafix and Pimafix can be > mixed? > > > > > If > > > > not, please do > > > > not recommend such a thing to other newer > Forum > > > > members who may not > > > > know better. Paul is 100% correct on this > one. > > I > > > > too have seen and > > > > learned of many cases of hobbyists I know > mixing > > > > these > > > > two "medications" together and wiping out > their > > > > tanks. Most of these > > > > tanks were well established over many years > with > > > one > > > > fish having a > > > > scrape or slight sore with all the other fish > > > being > > > > healthy, as in > > > > cases that Paul has seen. By themselves, > these > > > > remedies are great, > > > > so I am not trying to bash them. I am not a > > > > chemist, so I cannot > > > > tell you what happens when you put them > > together, > > > > only that it kills > > > > fish. Can't say why the manufacturer would > > > > recommend it -- I would > > > > hope it wouldn't just be to increase sales, > but > > it > > > > would seem obvious > > > > they may not have really tried mixing these > two > > > meds > > > > as a test in a > > > > healthy fish-populated aquarium or I'm sure > they > > > > would have found it > > > > to be detrimental. My gut feeling is that > there > > > may > > > > be other unseen > > > > factors involved when mixing these two, such > as > > > > maybe the water was > > > > below a certain pH (6.6? for instance), or the > > > water > > > > was high in > > > > magnesium or any number of things in these > > > aquariums > > > > which were not > > > > ordinarily unsafe nor uncommon as all the > > > aquariums > > > > involved must > > > > have had similar parameters, but were fatal > when > > > > these TWO meds were > > > > introduced to the tank together. Maybe when > > > mixing > > > > them, you can add > > > > no more than half strength of each one to get > a > > > > total treatment -- > > > > that I couldn't tell you, but I can tell you > > > mixing > > > > them can be > > > > fatal, even if not all the time. Although I > > > haven't > > > > heard of any > > > > successful mixed treatments. Ray > > > > > > > > > > > > > > \ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, > > > "thesydmonster" > > > > > > > > <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > > > > Hmmm.. it says on their web page and the > > > packaging > > > > that melafix and > > > > > pimafix CAN be used together, that they are > > > > complementary. What > > > > > happens when you put them together that is > > fatal > > > > and why would the > > > > > manufacturer recommend it, then? > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul > helms > > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > they should not be used together, and can > > have > > > > fatal > > > > > > results when mixed at the same time. > alone > > > they > > > > are > > > > > > safe...together not so much > > > > > > > > > > > > --- thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@c...> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > Have you started treating your tank with > > > > anything? > > > > > > > I believe certain > > > > > > > medications, such as melafix and pimafix > > -- > > > > which > > > > > > > can be used > > > > > > > together, by the way -- cause foam to > > > appear. > > > > Sorry > > > > > > > to not be of more > > > > > > > help. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, > "Dane > > & > > > > Leslie > > > > > > > Moore" > > > > > > > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > > > > > > > My water has developed a foam type > > around > > > > the > > > > > > > edges as well as a few > > > > > > > > spots of randome floating clumps. The > > > foam > > > > is all > > > > > > > along the edge of > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > tank as well as the filter, spray > wand, > > > > etc... > > > > > > > > All the tests are fine. No ammonia, > > > > nitrites or > > > > > > > high nitrates. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I read a post a while back where > someone > > > > else had > > > > > > > some "foam" but I > > > > > > > > can't remember which group or what the > > > === message truncated === > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs > > ___________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13935	From: Patrick	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: PimaFix and MelaFix

I've heard of more than one person who used both meds at the same time according to directions and killed most of their fish. It is surely too much of a risk for me. I would only use melafix and some salt if I just had to. :) Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13936	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Diatom Filters

Have a quick question on Diatom Filters. After you do a "spot" filtration run, do you just open it up and take the top layer of gunk off or do you just leave it till its time to change the power? Thought I'd ask as I'm shopping for one now. Any recomendations as to what one to get without spending an arm and a leg? (largest tank is 65 gallons)

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13937	From: Cire	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: any philly fishfreaks in this group

I have some fish that I can no longer keep and I'm looking for someone that I can give them to. I have 4 loaches. Please let me know. And I thank you in advance for your time.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13938	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water

Welp, to throw my two cents in, I agree, you shouldn't mix meds unless strongly advised to do so. I've only done this once and that was with a black moor that had developed a bad case of cotton mouth, and Melafix and eurythmomyacin (sp?) used under the directions given by my LFS cured it and helped the poor guy recover nicly. But that was under strict measurements of both (had to use a pill cutter and the like). Other than that, (yea, I know, also doesn't pertain accuratly to this thread as I 've never used Pimafix) but the only meds I keep regularly are Melafix and Aquarium salt. Melafix usually for my bettas (have yet to buy one that didn't have torn fins and melafix works great for that). Can't say I've ever had fish gasp for air when using melafix though it does foam the water initially. Personally I don't care for the smell (smells too much like Ben Gay for my tastes). Never heard of anyone till now using it as an air freshener. Just my humble opinion. Fish keeping for seven years and still learn something new every day. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 5:55 AM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Foamy water > Hi Nimish, > MelaFix is a Medication not a water > conditioner or an air freshener why were you using it > as such ? why do you not name the other product you > say caused your problem when mixed with MelaFix, you > should never mix medications unless advised to do so > by someone you can hold to task for the > consequences.As you say you haven't used PimaFix your > post is not relevant to this thread. This thread is > about mixing MelaFix and PimaFix. Fish gasping at the > surface if not oxygen starvation is usualy ammonia or > nitrite poisoning, inadequate filtration. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- Nimish Mathur <nimmat4@...> wrote: > > > I can personally 3rd this comment along with Paul > > :-) > > > > > > > > Melafix may not go well with a lot of other > > medications and I have suffered > > myself. Never really used pimafix but after the > > horror I went thru over a > > year ago, I have stopped using melafix as a water > > conditioner/air freshener > > just incase there is something in the tank that > > could cause it to bounce > > back. Even water conditioners strangely. > > > > > > > > I used a new water conditioner with melafix and > > within an hour all fish were > > gasping at the surface. Reasons not known as oxygen > > depletion was really not > > an issue. I have a couple of powerheads in the tank > > making it look like a > > water fall and even next day they still had to put > > an effort to breath. > > Luckily, no casualty but if I had gone to sleep > > without putting the > > powerhead then probably the entire tank would have > > gone belly up. > > > > > > > > Nim > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > > Sent: 25 July 2005 23:59 > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Foamy water > > > > > > > > Do not believe everything that you read! Do you > > REALLY KNOW for sure > > whether or not Melafix and Pimafix can be mixed? If > > not, please do > > not recommend such a thing to other newer Forum > > members who may not > > know better. Paul is 100% correct on this one. I > > too have seen and > > learned of many cases of hobbyists I know mixing > > these > > two "medications" together and wiping out their > > tanks. Most of these > > tanks were well established over many years with one > > fish having a > > scrape or slight sore with all the other fish being > > healthy, as in > > cases that Paul has seen. By themselves, these > > remedies are great, > > so I am not trying to bash them. I am not a > > chemist, so I cannot > > tell you what happens when you put them together, > > only that it kills > > fish. Can't say why the manufacturer would > > recommend it -- I would > > hope it wouldn't just be to increase sales, but it > > would seem obvious > > they may not have really tried mixing these two meds > > as a test in a > > healthy fish-populated aquarium or I'm sure they > > would have found it > > to be detrimental. My gut feeling is that there may > > be other unseen > > factors involved when mixing these two, such as > > maybe the water was > > below a certain pH (6.6? for instance), or the water > > was high in > > magnesium or any number of things in these aquariums > > which were not > > ordinarily unsafe nor uncommon as all the aquariums > > involved must > > have had similar parameters, but were fatal when > > these TWO meds were > > introduced to the tank together. Maybe when mixing > > them, you can add > > no more than half strength of each one to get a > > total treatment -- > > that I couldn't tell you, but I can tell you mixing > > them can be > > fatal, even if not all the time. Although I haven't > > heard of any > > successful mixed treatments. Ray > > > > \ > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" > > <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > > Hmmm.. it says on their web page and the packaging > > that melafix and > > > pimafix CAN be used together, that they are > > complementary. What > > > happens when you put them together that is fatal > > and why would the > > > manufacturer recommend it, then? > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > wrote: > > > > they should not be used together, and can have > > fatal > > > > results when mixed at the same time. alone they > > are > > > > safe...together not so much > > > > > > > > --- thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Have you started treating your tank with > > anything? > > > > > I believe certain > > > > > medications, such as melafix and pimafix -- > > which > > > > > can be used > > > > > together, by the way -- cause foam to appear. > > Sorry > > > > > to not be of more > > > > > help. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & > > Leslie > > > > > Moore" > > > > > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > > > > > My water has developed a foam type around > > the > > > > > edges as well as a few > > > > > > spots of randome floating clumps. The foam > > is all > > > > > along the edge of > > > > > the > > > > > > tank as well as the filter, spray wand, > > etc... > > > > > > All the tests are fine. No ammonia, > > nitrites or > > > > > high nitrates. > > > > > > > > > > > > I read a post a while back where someone > > else had > > > > > some "foam" but I > > > > > > can't remember which group or what the > > outcome > > > > > was. > > > > > > > > > > > > any ideas? > > > > > > > > > > > > Leslie > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > > > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > > > Do You Yahoo!? > > > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > > protection around > > > > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when > > replying, thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > > that is NOT important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > > message MODIFY the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > > subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > > matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > > you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > > > > > Marine > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology > > > > Biology > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the > > web. > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > > Yahoo! > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of > > Service. > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday > snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13939	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: hot water!

the peninsula area of the san francisco bay area --- Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > Where are you located that the unit is so expensive? Last year, I replaced > my heat pump, both the exterior and interior portions, and it ran me only > $6000. And that cools the whole house in the summer and heats it in the > winter (sometimes with an electrical heating coil assisting). > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez > Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 3:51 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] hot water! > > are you kidding? minimal cost for a portable a/c here is $1300. that's why i > don't have one. > > --- Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: > > > Turn the a/c up. > > > > Seriously, though. For everybody here who doesn't have an air > conditioner: > > Get one. If you can afford a fish tank, you don't have any excuse to not > > have a good air conditioner to keep the room it is in cool in the summer, > > and a good safe heater to keep it warm in the winter. Not to mention you > > are more likely to die of heat stroke in your own house if you don't keep > it > > cool. Also, if you can afford an internet connection, you have no excuse > to > > not have an a/c. They aren't really that expensive. A lot cheaper than > > restocking your tanks or paying medical bills when you fall over dead. > > > > > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy. > > > > "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it > is > > perhaps, the end of the beginning." > > -Winston Churchill > > -------Original Message------- > > Howdy! The water temp. has been off the chart in 1 of my tanks. I've been > putting ice in a > > baggie & putting that in the tank, but it doesn't help much. My oscar's > skin is coming off & > > he's not eating. I've also been putting med. in the tank. What else can I > do? > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!! > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13940	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium medicine cabinet

in mine i have instant ocean salt (for my sw tanks & for fw dips), malachite green, melafix, marcyn & maracyn 2. --- FortWayneFish@... wrote: > Oh wow... I see another debate starting.... > Preventive Maintenance is key here > Weekly waterchanges Cures and prevents Most things > > > My Medicine cabinet: > > quick cure for ich > Methyl blue for fungus mostly on eggs > And Salt................ > I also have medicated food by Jungle: anti bacterial and anti parasite > > rob > Indiana > > > > > > > > In a message dated 7/26/2005 9:06:05 PM US Eastern Standard Time, > Crazy4fids@... writes: > Hello list, > > What products would you recommend to keep in an aquarium medicine cabinet? > Obviously, something to treat ick, but what else? > > Which is more contagious, bacterial infections, or fungal? In what > situations do you remove the fish to a hospital tank? Do you remove the > infected > fish and start treatment on that particular fish; if more than one fish has > it, > would you pull them out one by one, or just treat the entire community? > > I know there are a lot of denominations missing here, but this has always > been my dilemma. With a bacteria, can you assume that everyone will get > sick? > > I do have a book on fish diseases, but it gets way into scientific stuff, > like doing biopsies and skin scrapings. I have seen a few different > websites > that help to diagnose; just wondering what everyone else does. > > I do not have a problem now, but I just want to be prepared should someone > get sick. > > Thanks, > > Linda > > Rob > NE Indiana > USA > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13941	From: joequality1980	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: hot water!

yes, and in Southern California its not cheap either... I heard the state is starting to have temporary, intentional power outtages to save on power/$$$ since its been so hot here recently --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@y...> wrote: > the peninsula area of the san francisco bay area > > --- Steve Szabo <steve@l...> wrote: > > > Where are you located that the unit is so expensive? Last year, I replaced > > my heat pump, both the exterior and interior portions, and it ran me only > > $6000. And that cools the whole house in the summer and heats it in the > > winter (sometimes with an electrical heating coil assisting).

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13942	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: hot water!

ah the joys of living in govenator land =) but i can't imagine living in any other state or another part of this state for that matter. i haven't experienced the brown-outs yet in the bay but they will probably come soon, as the temps continue to stay high here. thankfully my office is fully air-conditioned. boy do i wish i could swing $1300 for an a/c!!! --- joequality1980 <crazy.joe.walcek@...> wrote: > yes, and in Southern California its not cheap either... I heard the > state is starting to have temporary, intentional power outtages to > save on power/$$$ since its been so hot here recently > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Valeen Gonzalez > <valeendgonzalez@y...> wrote: > > the peninsula area of the san francisco bay area > > > > --- Steve Szabo <steve@l...> wrote: > > > > > Where are you located that the unit is so expensive? Last year, I > replaced > > > my heat pump, both the exterior and interior portions, and it ran > me only > > > $6000. And that cools the whole house in the summer and heats it > in the > > > winter (sometimes with an electrical heating coil assisting). > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13943	From: T	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: ATTN FortWayneFish

Hey, I just read your post mention fish medicin cabinet. You are correct on your point. Water changes are the best "Preventive Medicin" Also you make a great point about SALT for curing ICH. Regular NON iodized salt and turn the temp up to about 80 for a day or so. this will kill all the ICH and has not harmed one fish in all my yrs. - Ter

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13944	From: T	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium medicine cabinet

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > Hello list, >Hi Linda... Regular NON iodized Salt from the supermarket is the best cure for Ick. Turn the Temp up to about 80 + and pour in the salt. A tablespoon or so... a day later it will be gone. - Terry > What products would you recommend to keep in an aquarium medicine cabinet? > Obviously, something to treat ick, but what else? > > Which is more contagious, bacterial infections, or fungal? In what > situations do you remove the fish to a hospital tank? Do you remove the infected > fish and start treatment on that particular fish; if more than one fish has it, > would you pull them out one by one, or just treat the entire community? > > I know there are a lot of denominations missing here, but this has always > been my dilemma. With a bacteria, can you assume that everyone will get sick? > > I do have a book on fish diseases, but it gets way into scientific stuff, > like doing biopsies and skin scrapings. I have seen a few different websites > that help to diagnose; just wondering what everyone else does. > > I do not have a problem now, but I just want to be prepared should someone > get sick. > > Thanks, > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13945	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Brown Knife Fish

Has anyone ever heard of a Brown Knife Fish? Not Clown Knife or Black Ghost, but Brown. Color is almost the color of a dark pine. I've been told that they are semi-agressive and can go into a normal community tank, and I gotta admit, this is the first time I can't find ANY info on just a brown knife fish. Tons on Clowns and Black Ghosts but not a word on a Brown? How big do they get? The one I've have has been with me for 6 months with no noticable growth and pretty much ignores all others including the tetras. Very relaxing just watching him swim with that bottom fin. Want to know more about them other than what the store told me, but can't seem to find more. Any help is appreciated. (Still wish I could have kept my Clown knife, but he would have eaten everyone else save for the plecos in my tank whne he got bigger. Loved his face)

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13946	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium medicine cabinet

I have Salt, Nigata Clay, methylene blue and melafix. Nothing else on an occasion I had to get a treatment for dropsy/internal bacteria but apart from that the Methylene blue is only for eggs in a separate tank and does not go in the main tank. Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez Sent: 27 July 2005 18:50 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] aquarium medicine cabinet in mine i have instant ocean salt (for my sw tanks & for fw dips), malachite green, melafix, marcyn & maracyn 2. --- FortWayneFish@... wrote: > Oh wow... I see another debate starting.... > Preventive Maintenance is key here > Weekly waterchanges Cures and prevents Most things > > > My Medicine cabinet: > > quick cure for ich > Methyl blue for fungus mostly on eggs > And Salt................ > I also have medicated food by Jungle: anti bacterial and anti parasite > > rob > Indiana > > > > > > > > In a message dated 7/26/2005 9:06:05 PM US Eastern Standard Time, > Crazy4fids@... writes: > Hello list, > > What products would you recommend to keep in an aquarium medicine cabinet? > Obviously, something to treat ick, but what else? > > Which is more contagious, bacterial infections, or fungal? In what > situations do you remove the fish to a hospital tank? Do you remove the > infected > fish and start treatment on that particular fish; if more than one fish has > it, > would you pull them out one by one, or just treat the entire community? > > I know there are a lot of denominations missing here, but this has always > been my dilemma. With a bacteria, can you assume that everyone will get > sick? > > I do have a book on fish diseases, but it gets way into scientific stuff, > like doing biopsies and skin scrapings. I have seen a few different > websites > that help to diagnose; just wondering what everyone else does. > > I do not have a problem now, but I just want to be prepared should someone > get sick. > > Thanks, > > Linda > > Rob > NE Indiana > USA > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13947	From: Aaron	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: lighting ? for fw w/ plants

Hi, I have a 55gallon (48inch long x 18inches deep) freshwater with mostly Tetras and some Algae eating fish & shrimp. I have the Eco-Complete planted substrate. There are mostly Amazon Sword plants, some Java Fern, Java Moss, Anachris, Hornwort, other misc. plants I forgot the name of and (and the WalMart plants that come in a package as little bulbs that turn into lilly looking plants, mostly red). I do not have (or plan on yet) getting CO2. There are 4- 55W Compact Flourescent bulbs, 2 each 6700K and 5000K. They are about a year old and 1 just broke. The bulbs are going lengthwise 2 across and 2 deep, sorta looks like this == . Using 2- workhorse brand Ballasts. I need to find replacement bulbs, but I am not sure what kind to get. Can I put the 65watt of same size in these? or do they have to be 55watt? What is the best kind for plants? I've heard 6500K but then there is lux, lumens (plants are supposedly more sensitive to red and blue light spectrum), CRI color rendering index, etc... its all confusing to me. Some people are using marine type lights that are 1/2 white and 1/2 blue, others use 10,000k. Also, since they slowly wear out, should I only replace 2 at a time like every 4 to 6 months, sorta rotating them or even just get 1 for now and buy a new bulb every 2 - 3 months or would that cause uneven lighting? I've seen new fixtures that have similar compact flourescent with 2 small Metal Halides in the middle, are these for reef tanks only? any help would be appreciated Thanks, Aaron

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13948	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy Water (now the debate on MelaFix and PimaFix)

I think what the argument is about is that the two are there cause when many feel there is something else that we are not taking into account. While we don't have the water in front of us, maybe we can try and figure out what other factor was there that could have caused this to become toxic. As many people use these remedies, I think looking into exactly what the other factor is would be a good idea. I am sure the manufacture would like to know, plus it could save a lot of little fish if we can figure it out. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nimish Mathur Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 5:56 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Foamy Water (now the debate on MelaFix and PimaFix) Whats the argument about? There are too many variables in an aquarium to even think about similarities. I have on a couple of occasions had a bad experience with melafix + other medication. This is one in a 100 times .This does not prove that the mix of medicines can or cannot kill a fish. Its like “Driving can kill you” or “Driving cannot kill you”. Both statements are somewhat true and false. API does state that both medicines can be mixed, but there could be a scenario when the mixed medicines can cause problems rather then benefits we all know that this is very much possible with practically anything even a water change. I was myself just giving my experience that it has had a bad effect a couple of times and just shows that one should be careful with using medications and should be the last resort to anything. Why and where is the argument? Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Norman. S. Hampson. Sent: 27 July 2005 11:40 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: Foamy Water (now the debate on MelaFix and PimaFix) Paul, You are using half truths and hearsay again to try to get the better of an argument. I have quoted the relevant statements from the A/P website in a previous post. If you have any proof at all that mixing MelaFix and PimaFix kills fish lets here it, otherwise retract your statements. Incidentally 'synergistically' means acting together or enhancing the effect of each other !. regards, unclenorm. --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > i was on the pimafix website and that is not the > language used there. i understand you got this from > ap's website, but that is not the onlything out > there. > there is really nothing to debate here. > expperience > shows direct contradiction. take it or leave it, i > am > not gonna argue about it. i am also looking at > aquarium pharm directly on their pimafix.html site, > and the wording is not the same as what you have cut > and pasted. you can copy and paste the link before > for > the full article by ap. > > http://www.aquariumpharm.com/pimafix.html > > direct snip of full paragraph- > > In extreme cases of especially stubborn infections, > PimaFix has been designed to work synergistically > with > MelaFix. Using PimaFix and MelaFix together provides > the added benefit of quick tissue regeneration and > wound healing. > > > --- Lenny Vasbinder <lnvtm1@...> wrote: > > > Here are cut and paste product descriptions and > > FAQ's from Melafix and Pimafix... well, there were > > no FAQ's on Pimafix but the product description > says > > "PimaFix has been formulated to work in > combination > > with MelaFix to enhance effectiveness against fish > > diseases"... among other things. These snips are > > directly from the Aquarium Pharmaceuticals web > site. > > > > MelaFix® > > > > Heals open wounds & abrasions, treats fin and tail > > rot, eye cloud, mouth fungus and promotes regrowth > > of damaged fin rays & tissue. Will not adversely > > affect the biological filter, alter the pH, or > > discolor water. Safe for reef aquariums and live > > plants. For use in fresh or salt water. > > > > MelaFix FAQ's- > > > > Can MelaFix be used with other medications? > > > > MelaFix has been tested and found compatible with > > Aquarium Pharmaceuticals medications. Mixing > other > > brands of medications is not recommended. > > > > Is MelaFix harmful to aquatic plants? > > > > MelaFix can be used in aquariums and ponds > > containing live plants. > > > > Will MelaFix kill snails? > > > > No. > > > > Can I use MelaFix in aquariums containing > freshwater > > crabs and shrimp? > > > > Yes. > > > > Will MelaFix hurt saltwater invertebrates? > > > > No. MelaFix is reef-compatible. MelaFix has been > > shown to promote the healing of damaged coral > > tissue. > > > > I have a protein skimmer. Will MelaFix cause > > foaming? > > > > MelaFix will cause some increased foaming during > the > > treatment. We recommend turning the skimmer down > or > > off during treatment with MelaFix. > > > > Do I have to remove the activated carbon from my > > filter when treating with MelaFix? > > > > We suggest removing the carbon while treating with > > any medication. > > > > > > > > PimaFix > > > > Treats fungal infections and both internal and > > external bacterial infections. Will not adversely > > affect the biological filter, alter the pH, or > > discolor water. Safe for reef aquariums and live > > plants. For use in fresh or salt water. PimaFix > has > > been formulated to work in combination with > MelaFix > > to enhance effectiveness against fish diseases. > > > > > > Lenny Vasbinder > > http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com > > 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 > > LNVTM1@... > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > ___________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. 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PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13949	From: Tom Ray	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: Question on Gouramis ?

1st: Can you provide us with the names of your types / species? The range of Gourami behavior, IMHE (E= experience), is VERY dependent upon genera and species, so then so also are your options. Also... Based upon what you have already written, I am assuming none of these came from the same brood, as far as you know, eh? 3rd'ly: What size tank(s)? How is it(are they) planted? What kinds and how many territory landmarks do you have in it(them)? Finally... Are any of your males in spawning colors, or mood/dominance colors? Or are your females sporting a "ripe with eggs" shapeliness? --TommyBoy --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "ahorseofcourse66" <ahorseofcourse66@y...> wrote: > Big ? We have 4 gouramis, 2 males and 2 female. Non of them will get > along. The first male and female we bought fought to the point they > drew blood. Now the male fights any fish you put him with and the > female gets along fine with any fist but other gouramis. Now we bought > another pair and they didn't get along, so we seperated them and after > aweek we are trying again. They seemed to be ok for alittle while the > female was currling up around the male and he seemed to not care then > she started chasing him around the tank, then they started this curling > around each other and holding onto each others tail and now their back > to her chasing him. Which the first time we had them together he was > the one chasing her. Now all he wants to do is hide. Anyone have any > experence or might have some input?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13950	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: Electrocution

Thank you for the answer...much better than being an ass about it...right Paul ;-) I do have one question about what you wrote. You said that the current is the measure but the force behind it is the force. Shouldn't that be the voltage is the measure and it the amperage that is the force? Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nimish Mathur Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 8:34 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Electrocution Guys, Some facts: 1. Fish in the aquarium are not grounded. Current will not flow thru them unless they come in-between the flow of current. 2. Human body is very large, In things like a bath tub, the human body is not really grounded but infact acts as a ground itself. 3. Dropping a hair dryer in the bath will not burn the person sitting in it. The electricity flowing thru the body will work on the nervous system and eventually kill it. 4. Fish are too small to be considered as grounding in an aquarium. It is similar to a large swimming pool and someone swimming in it and one drops in a hair dryer in the pool. Why does electricity flow thru the human body in water? Electricity flows in the water in form of ions. Once a current is released in the water, it starts to spread in a 3D field rather then linearly as in wires etc. This basically allows the electricity to come in contact with any and every surface in the water including the human body. Now, human body is so big and has a such a large surface area, that it starts to work as almost a zero resistance conductor in the water. What now happens is very absurd, the part of the body closer to the point of electricity will accept in the flowing electricity and any point further away will start to release it just like radiations. Why? To explain this, flow of electricity is controlled by a force: Potential difference or voltage. Current is just a quantity of it but the force that drives the current is the voltage. A ground surface is one that is considered at an infinitely negative potential or something that will always allow any current to pass thru without offering any resistance.. in a bath tub case: the Human body. So at a point where we have high voltage of current, the human body will tend to absorb the current. now this should absorb the current from every point then? Even the furthest? This does not happen because the current we are talking about is Alternating current. Interesting thing about the alternating current is that in 1/100th of a second, it is positive and the next 1/100th of a second it is negative (basically push and pull). This push and pull makes the human body an effective capacitor (do you really want me to explain what this is and what this does? Lol) It's the work of the body as a capacitor that makes the flow of minor current around the body and thru the water many folds and thus start to effect the entire nervous system. Fish are too small to act as a ground or something at infinitely negative potential and they have a too little surface area to allow a strong potential difference be created at 2 distant ends of the fish and also, it is too small to act as a capacitor. This however does not mean that electricity does not have effect on them.. it is just a minute fraction of what humans feel and the long term effect of current in the water has been reported on fish too. Long term is from 10days to 3-4 months depending on the current as well. Ofcourse, none of this would happen if the current was DC instead of AC. Nim Ps: Sorry for all this but I had to shed some light on this from my thoughts. Been 8 years since I studied physics in university so I could be incorrect in some places.. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13951	From: Tom Ray	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: Digest Number 896

I agree: "no, I don't think a 10 gallon [aka "nano-tank"] would be a happy home for a loach, especially because they like to be in groups of at least 3." And, from what I've read online, many loaches (even the small "sick monkeys"/sidhimonki {sp?}) require lots of room and water flow (e.g., from a power head) to be playfully happy as a gaggle [NOTE: I've even, through my online searches, found a "mountain loach tank design" plans with returns to ensure higher flow rates.]. So I've got lots of nano-tanks and no loaches. As for snails, Diana Walstad has written on them, dispelling "hobby legends" about them and planted tanks. You may want to do a search on her name and on "snails." Hope this helps, --TommyBoy --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > Sorry to say, no, I don't think a 10 gallon would be a happy home > for a loach, especially because they like to be in groups of at > least 3. When I first set up my 10 gallon, I just squished the > snails I saw against the glass and my betta ate them. This may have > already been suggested but you could place an algae wafer in there > or a piece of lettuce and the next morning, when all the snails are > congregated on it, take it out and throw it away. I currently have > snails in my 10 gallon (malaysian trumpet snails, sorry if the > spelling is wrong) to help turn over the sand and they don't eat my > plants. I have been told snails aren't really as bad as people > think they are and actually have some benefits. Good luck :) > Rebecca > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Sandy Kay" > <knightwriter101@y...> wrote: > > Hi, Thanks so much for your thoughts. My problem with these kind > of fish is > > I am using a 10 gallon. Have a 55 gallon would love to use but do > not have > > room for it. I don't think a 10 gallon is big enough for a loach, > is it? > > > > Sandy > > > > > > > > Subject: Re: snails > > > > I have 3 botia striata (zebra loaches) in my 37 gallon tank and > they > > are great snail eaters :) They are nice, too, because they only > get > > about 3 or so inches. How big do queen loaches get, they seem > > really neat? > > > > Rebecca > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13952	From: Patrick	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: hot water! - cold brains

That is what you get for living in one of the few communist nations left on Earth! It is immoral for a state to take away the people's power. They think using energy is automatically bad for the environment out there. Wrong. Putting dead people in the ground is a lot worse! When people start dropping like they did in Las Vegas and some other cities, cemeteries will fill up. Every year we hear about people dropping dead in their own homes. This is the year 2005, there is no excuse for every person in America not having a 300 dollar air conditioner in their window and more than enough nuclear energy to keep them going forever. Ask yourself how much you spent on fish last year. I figure an ac would only use a little more power than a fish tank if you only used it while you were at home and only used it to keep the temp at 80° at that time. Here is one for less than 300 dollars at Target. http://www.target.com/gp/detail html/602-3325056-6928611?asin=B00023XKNY&AFID=Froogle&ref=tgt_adv_XSG10001 Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill -------Original Message------- yes, and in Southern California its not cheap either... I heard the state is starting to have temporary, intentional power outtages to save on power/$$$ since its been so hot here recently [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13953	From: Patrick	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: ATTN FortWayneFish

I'm tired of hearing this non-iodized salt junk. LIES Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill -------Original Message------- Hey, I just read your post mention fish medicin cabinet. You are correct on your point. Water changes are the best "Preventive Medicin" Also you make a great point about SALT for curing ICH. Regular NON iodized salt and turn the temp up to about 80 for a day or so. this will kill all the ICH and has not harmed one fish in all my yrs. - Ter [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13954	From: Patrick	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium medicine cabinet

I don't even know where the post is in this stuff! :) Speaking of :). I forgot to put a :) after the word "LIES" in my previous post. :) Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill -------Original Message------- --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > Hello list, >Hi Linda... Regular NON iodized Salt from the supermarket is the best cure for Ick. Turn the Temp up to about 80 + and pour in the salt. A tablespoon or so... a day later it will be gone. - Terry > What products would you recommend to keep in an aquarium medicine cabinet? > Obviously, something to treat ick, but what else? > > Which is more contagious, bacterial infections, or fungal? In what > situations do you remove the fish to a hospital tank? Do you remove the infected > fish and start treatment on that particular fish; if more than one fish has it, > would you pull them out one by one, or just treat the entire community? > > I know there are a lot of denominations missing here, but this has always > been my dilemma. With a bacteria, can you assume that everyone will get sick? > > I do have a book on fish diseases, but it gets way into scientific stuff, > like doing biopsies and skin scrapings. I have seen a few different websites > that help to diagnose; just wondering what everyone else does. > > I do not have a problem now, but I just want to be prepared should someone > get sick. > > Thanks, > > Linda > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13955	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: hot water! - cold brains

there is an excuse if you live in an apt complex with windows that cannot support window a/c's (the windows are the rotating lever kind that open outwards from the left side of the window sill) as i do. the only kind i could have is a portable one, which i said here is minimum $1,300. i'm not about to pay that for a/c when i can simply take a shower to keep myself cool and install fans in my tanks to keep my fish cool. --- Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: > That is what you get for living in one of the few communist nations left on > Earth! It is immoral for a state to take away the people's power. They > think using energy is automatically bad for the environment out there. > Wrong. Putting dead people in the ground is a lot worse! When people start > dropping like they did in Las Vegas and some other cities, cemeteries will > fill up. Every year we hear about people dropping dead in their own homes. > This is the year 2005, there is no excuse for every person in America not > having a 300 dollar air conditioner in their window and more than enough > nuclear energy to keep them going forever. Ask yourself how much you spent > on fish last year. I figure an ac would only use a little more power than a > fish tank if you only used it while you were at home and only used it to > keep the temp at 80° at that time. Here is one for less than 300 dollars at > Target. > > http://www.target.com/gp/detail > html/602-3325056-6928611?asin=B00023XKNY&AFID=Froogle&ref=tgt_adv_XSG10001 > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy. > > "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is > perhaps, the end of the beginning." > -Winston Churchill > -------Original Message------- > yes, and in Southern California its not cheap either... I heard the state is starting to have > temporary, intentional power outtages to save on power/$$$ since its been so hot here recently > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13956	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: Electrocution

Eric, Amperage is the measure of electrons per second traveling. I think its 6.24 * 10 to the power of 18 electrons per second (coulomb per sec). The force that drives these electrons is called "Potential difference" or voltage. Voltage = Amount of work done(joule)/number of electrons(coulomb). Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Roberts Sent: 27 July 2005 20:12 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Electrocution Thank you for the answer...much better than being an ass about it...right Paul ;-) I do have one question about what you wrote. You said that the current is the measure but the force behind it is the force. Shouldn't that be the voltage is the measure and it the amperage that is the force? Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nimish Mathur Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 8:34 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Electrocution Guys, Some facts: 1. Fish in the aquarium are not grounded. Current will not flow thru them unless they come in-between the flow of current. 2. Human body is very large, In things like a bath tub, the human body is not really grounded but infact acts as a ground itself. 3. Dropping a hair dryer in the bath will not burn the person sitting in it. The electricity flowing thru the body will work on the nervous system and eventually kill it. 4. Fish are too small to be considered as grounding in an aquarium. It is similar to a large swimming pool and someone swimming in it and one drops in a hair dryer in the pool. Why does electricity flow thru the human body in water? Electricity flows in the water in form of ions. Once a current is released in the water, it starts to spread in a 3D field rather then linearly as in wires etc. This basically allows the electricity to come in contact with any and every surface in the water including the human body. Now, human body is so big and has a such a large surface area, that it starts to work as almost a zero resistance conductor in the water. What now happens is very absurd, the part of the body closer to the point of electricity will accept in the flowing electricity and any point further away will start to release it just like radiations. Why? To explain this, flow of electricity is controlled by a force: Potential difference or voltage. Current is just a quantity of it but the force that drives the current is the voltage. A ground surface is one that is considered at an infinitely negative potential or something that will always allow any current to pass thru without offering any resistance.. in a bath tub case: the Human body. So at a point where we have high voltage of current, the human body will tend to absorb the current. now this should absorb the current from every point then? Even the furthest? This does not happen because the current we are talking about is Alternating current. Interesting thing about the alternating current is that in 1/100th of a second, it is positive and the next 1/100th of a second it is negative (basically push and pull). This push and pull makes the human body an effective capacitor (do you really want me to explain what this is and what this does? Lol) It's the work of the body as a capacitor that makes the flow of minor current around the body and thru the water many folds and thus start to effect the entire nervous system. Fish are too small to act as a ground or something at infinitely negative potential and they have a too little surface area to allow a strong potential difference be created at 2 distant ends of the fish and also, it is too small to act as a capacitor. This however does not mean that electricity does not have effect on them.. it is just a minute fraction of what humans feel and the long term effect of current in the water has been reported on fish too. Long term is from 10days to 3-4 months depending on the current as well. Ofcourse, none of this would happen if the current was DC instead of AC. Nim Ps: Sorry for all this but I had to shed some light on this from my thoughts. Been 8 years since I studied physics in university so I could be incorrect in some places.. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13957	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: any philly fishfreaks in this group

I wish I was closer...I would take them off of your hands...loaches are cool little fish.. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Cire Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 11:32 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] any philly fishfreaks in this group I have some fish that I can no longer keep and I'm looking for someone that I can give them to. I have 4 loaches. Please let me know. And I thank you in advance for your time. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13958	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: hot water! - cold brains

hehehe Yea. Unfortunatly, it goes back to Govoner Wilson deregulating California's Power and then Edison, San Diego, Pacific? selling their power plants, never upgrading their power lines, then wondering why the companies they just sold the plants to began charging very high fees and not using the money to upgrade their grids. Ah well. We're stuck with it for now. Funny that I don't hear anyone thanking Gray Davis now that the lawsuits he initiated to get reimbursed for the high fees before getting kicked out of office for raising the vehical registration fee for (as stated in the bill limited to 1 year which would have pulled us out of the debt, that the new Govenorator retracted and was shocked that Californians didn't want to pay higher taxes or pay for bonds and is now name calling rather than working on it.) are now ending with victories (though not as high under da Govonerator's lawyers.) but hey, some is better than none. Corse, all things considering, with as much land as we have here, you'd think we'd build more power plants and upgrade the lines. Corse this is California where we complain about water shortages without building desalination plants or improving our ability to store rain water. OK, now that the rant is over (lets see how many people reply to the above. lol) It was my concerns over blackouts that caused me to get a UPS. Worse comes to worse, the UPS can power my canister filter and I can put the canister filter in a bucket with ice to make a real cheapie chiller. My Fluval 404 is my only filtration on my large tank, but it seems that you could get any cheapy canister filter and a 5 dollar plastic tub and whalla, chiller for $60 or so as opposed to $400 (the cheapest true aquatic chiller). That with a decent heater in the tank and you shouldn't have to worry about the heat. Cant think of a way to do it with a power filter, unless you have room on your tank for a second power filter and us it just for running the water over ice as I doubt the bacteria could servive that close a proximity to the ice, but I could be wrong. (wow, political rambings and still managed to stay kinda on topic. lol) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Patrick" <patrickmn@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 12:25 PM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] hot water! - cold brains That is what you get for living in one of the few communist nations left on Earth! It is immoral for a state to take away the people's power. They think using energy is automatically bad for the environment out there. Wrong. Putting dead people in the ground is a lot worse! When people start dropping like they did in Las Vegas and some other cities, cemeteries will fill up. Every year we hear about people dropping dead in their own homes. This is the year 2005, there is no excuse for every person in America not having a 300 dollar air conditioner in their window and more than enough nuclear energy to keep them going forever. Ask yourself how much you spent on fish last year. I figure an ac would only use a little more power than a fish tank if you only used it while you were at home and only used it to keep the temp at 80° at that time. Here is one for less than 300 dollars at Target. http://www.target.com/gp/detail html/602-3325056-6928611?asin=B00023XKNY&AFID=Froogle&ref=tgt_adv_XSG10001 Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill -------Original Message------- yes, and in Southern California its not cheap either... I heard the state is starting to have temporary, intentional power outtages to save on power/$$$ since its been so hot here recently [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13959	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: MEdicine cabinet

I have aquarium salts, aquarisol, Jungle Labs No More Algae, Melafix, Maroxy liquid, maroxycin tabs, and Jungle fungus clear. Most of the anti-fungal stuff was from when I had a goby that had a real bad fungal problem and ended up dying. I also keep some biozyme on hand incase I have a bloom of some sort to boost the beneficial bacteria. It usually clears things up in a day or 2. Eric [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13960	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: lighting ? for fw w/ plants

As long as the ballasts can handle the 65W bulbs, I don;t see why not. You will be boosting your wattage by 40 watts if you replace them all with 65w bulbs...but I don;t think that would be prob. How is the eco-complete gravel working for you? I am in the process of turning my 55gal into a planted tank and I was thinking of using that gravel. Here's a good article in regards to lighting in planted tanks... http://www.aquarticles.com/articles/plants/Hudson_Lighting.html Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Aaron Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 1:27 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] lighting ? for fw w/ plants Hi, I have a 55gallon (48inch long x 18inches deep) freshwater with mostly Tetras and some Algae eating fish & shrimp. I have the Eco-Complete planted substrate. There are mostly Amazon Sword plants, some Java Fern, Java Moss, Anachris, Hornwort, other misc. plants I forgot the name of and (and the WalMart plants that come in a package as little bulbs that turn into lilly looking plants, mostly red). I do not have (or plan on yet) getting CO2. There are 4- 55W Compact Flourescent bulbs, 2 each 6700K and 5000K. They are about a year old and 1 just broke. The bulbs are going lengthwise 2 across and 2 deep, sorta looks like this == . Using 2- workhorse brand Ballasts. I need to find replacement bulbs, but I am not sure what kind to get. Can I put the 65watt of same size in these? or do they have to be 55watt? What is the best kind for plants? I've heard 6500K but then there is lux, lumens (plants are supposedly more sensitive to red and blue light spectrum), CRI color rendering index, etc... its all confusing to me. Some people are using marine type lights that are 1/2 white and 1/2 blue, others use 10,000k. Also, since they slowly wear out, should I only replace 2 at a time like every 4 to 6 months, sorta rotating them or even just get 1 for now and buy a new bulb every 2 - 3 months or would that cause uneven lighting? I've seen new fixtures that have similar compact flourescent with 2 small Metal Halides in the middle, are these for reef tanks only? any help would be appreciated Thanks, Aaron ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13961	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: black lace angelfish

I am so bummed=( The black lace angelfish that I have been waiting for the past three weeks never came in! The lfs was suppose to get some in today. Anybody know where I can get my hands on four dark black angelfish with standard tails the size of quarters? I am looking for the real dark body color, but light enough that you can still see the bars. I live in River Falls, WI Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13962	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: Electrocution

We might be saying the same thing here..you can have a high amperage, but low voltage charge that would be more hazardous that a high voltage, low amp charge...correct? Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nimish Mathur Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 2:55 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Electrocution Eric, Amperage is the measure of electrons per second traveling. I think its 6.24 * 10 to the power of 18 electrons per second (coulomb per sec). The force that drives these electrons is called "Potential difference" or voltage. Voltage = Amount of work done(joule)/number of electrons(coulomb). Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Roberts Sent: 27 July 2005 20:12 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Electrocution Thank you for the answer...much better than being an ass about it...right Paul ;-) I do have one question about what you wrote. You said that the current is the measure but the force behind it is the force. Shouldn't that be the voltage is the measure and it the amperage that is the force? Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nimish Mathur Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 8:34 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Electrocution Guys, Some facts: 1. Fish in the aquarium are not grounded. Current will not flow thru them unless they come in-between the flow of current. 2. Human body is very large, In things like a bath tub, the human body is not really grounded but infact acts as a ground itself. 3. Dropping a hair dryer in the bath will not burn the person sitting in it. The electricity flowing thru the body will work on the nervous system and eventually kill it. 4. Fish are too small to be considered as grounding in an aquarium. It is similar to a large swimming pool and someone swimming in it and one drops in a hair dryer in the pool. Why does electricity flow thru the human body in water? Electricity flows in the water in form of ions. Once a current is released in the water, it starts to spread in a 3D field rather then linearly as in wires etc. This basically allows the electricity to come in contact with any and every surface in the water including the human body. Now, human body is so big and has a such a large surface area, that it starts to work as almost a zero resistance conductor in the water. What now happens is very absurd, the part of the body closer to the point of electricity will accept in the flowing electricity and any point further away will start to release it just like radiations. Why? To explain this, flow of electricity is controlled by a force: Potential difference or voltage. Current is just a quantity of it but the force that drives the current is the voltage. A ground surface is one that is considered at an infinitely negative potential or something that will always allow any current to pass thru without offering any resistance.. in a bath tub case: the Human body. So at a point where we have high voltage of current, the human body will tend to absorb the current. now this should absorb the current from every point then? Even the furthest? This does not happen because the current we are talking about is Alternating current. Interesting thing about the alternating current is that in 1/100th of a second, it is positive and the next 1/100th of a second it is negative (basically push and pull). This push and pull makes the human body an effective capacitor (do you really want me to explain what this is and what this does? Lol) It's the work of the body as a capacitor that makes the flow of minor current around the body and thru the water many folds and thus start to effect the entire nervous system. Fish are too small to act as a ground or something at infinitely negative potential and they have a too little surface area to allow a strong potential difference be created at 2 distant ends of the fish and also, it is too small to act as a capacitor. This however does not mean that electricity does not have effect on them.. it is just a minute fraction of what humans feel and the long term effect of current in the water has been reported on fish too. Long term is from 10days to 3-4 months depending on the current as well. Ofcourse, none of this would happen if the current was DC instead of AC. Nim Ps: Sorry for all this but I had to shed some light on this from my thoughts. Been 8 years since I studied physics in university so I could be incorrect in some places.. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13963	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium medicine cabinet

One thing I was told is that if you have water that just has chlorine in it (no chloramines) that you can use the water just like that to prevent fungus in eggs. Any comments on this? What is Nigata clay? Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nimish Mathur Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 1:22 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] aquarium medicine cabinet I have Salt, Nigata Clay, methylene blue and melafix. Nothing else on an occasion I had to get a treatment for dropsy/internal bacteria but apart from that the Methylene blue is only for eggs in a separate tank and does not go in the main tank. Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez Sent: 27 July 2005 18:50 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] aquarium medicine cabinet in mine i have instant ocean salt (for my sw tanks & for fw dips), malachite green, melafix, marcyn & maracyn 2. --- FortWayneFish@... wrote: > Oh wow... I see another debate starting.... > Preventive Maintenance is key here > Weekly waterchanges Cures and prevents Most things > > > My Medicine cabinet: > > quick cure for ich > Methyl blue for fungus mostly on eggs > And Salt................ > I also have medicated food by Jungle: anti bacterial and anti parasite > > rob > Indiana > > > > > > > > In a message dated 7/26/2005 9:06:05 PM US Eastern Standard Time, > Crazy4fids@... writes: > Hello list, > > What products would you recommend to keep in an aquarium medicine cabinet? > Obviously, something to treat ick, but what else? > > Which is more contagious, bacterial infections, or fungal? In what > situations do you remove the fish to a hospital tank? Do you remove the > infected > fish and start treatment on that particular fish; if more than one fish has > it, > would you pull them out one by one, or just treat the entire community? > > I know there are a lot of denominations missing here, but this has always > been my dilemma. With a bacteria, can you assume that everyone will get > sick? > > I do have a book on fish diseases, but it gets way into scientific stuff, > like doing biopsies and skin scrapings. I have seen a few different > websites > that help to diagnose; just wondering what everyone else does. > > I do not have a problem now, but I just want to be prepared should someone > get sick. > > Thanks, > > Linda > > Rob > NE Indiana > USA > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. 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PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13964	From: Tom Ray	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium medicine cabinet

Anyone else use dried Eucalyptus leaves? I keep Chocolate Gourami, and these leaves (in addition to their tannic/humic properties not unlike Sweet Almond, Oak {White?} and Plane trees) purportedly have "medicinal qualities." Not sure exactly which. --TommyBoy --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > Hello list, > > What products would you recommend to keep in an aquarium medicine cabinet? > Obviously, something to treat ick, but what else? > > Which is more contagious, bacterial infections, or fungal? In what > situations do you remove the fish to a hospital tank? Do you remove the infected > fish and start treatment on that particular fish; if more than one fish has it, > would you pull them out one by one, or just treat the entire community? > > I know there are a lot of denominations missing here, but this has always > been my dilemma. With a bacteria, can you assume that everyone will get sick? > > I do have a book on fish diseases, but it gets way into scientific stuff, > like doing biopsies and skin scrapings. I have seen a few different websites > that help to diagnose; just wondering what everyone else does. > > I do not have a problem now, but I just want to be prepared should someone > get sick. > > Thanks, > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13965	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: black lace angelfish

http://www.liveaquaria.com/product/scateg.cfm?pCatId=879 They are up in Rhinelander, WI Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 3:37 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com; mnaquarium@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] black lace angelfish I am so bummed=( The black lace angelfish that I have been waiting for the past three weeks never came in! The lfs was suppose to get some in today. Anybody know where I can get my hands on four dark black angelfish with standard tails the size of quarters? I am looking for the real dark body color, but light enough that you can still see the bars. I live in River Falls, WI Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13966	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: To Paul & Ray Re: MelaFix & PimaFix

Norm, Wish you wouldn't drag my name into an argument that you're having with someone else. I've already said my peace on this subject and thought I was done with it. I'm getting a tired trying to convince some of you guys of the dangers of mixing these two remedies for your own benefit. You can either believe it or you don't (obviously you don't), but don't say I'm making rash statements. I know what I saw happen. I do notice your saying that "it could have been the Melafix or the Pimafix combining with some other substance..." At least you're open to the fact that killings can take place using both of these remedies. I myself wouldn't mind getting to the bottom of why this occurs. Hope you have noticed that I never said it was the combination of these two remedies themselves that can cause a toxic result (but the toxic result can happen when using the two remedies in combination). Again, as I hope you read, I feel, similar to what you have stated that there is another factor (substance, etc.; call it what you will) involved and not the direct result of the two meds. Yet, the killings that can happen, happen only when these two meds are present. Seems to be something strange going on chemically under certain circumstances when the both meds are introduced, when something else or some other condition is already present. All toxic cases I've seen occured in acid water. About a third of these cases already had salt in the water. I have no idea whether this had anything to do with the fatal results and AM NOT saying this will happen all of the time. Under conditions where this third mystery factor/substance is absent, the mixture of the two remedies may well be safe; I just don't know of any instances. Would like to add that once, and only once, I had a bad reaction in one of my tanks using just plain Melafix where after about 20 minutes, the fish started coming up to the surface for air. All water parameters were normal (no ammonia, etc., etc.), although that water was at about pH 6.2. Still can't figure why that happened. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > Paul, > As I have pointed out in previous posts you only > quoted parts of A/P web site to suit your argument and > most of what you have said is pure conjecture, you do > not know what killed the fish in question it is an > assumption on your part, it could have been the > MelaFix or the PimaFix combining with some other > substance or medication previously administered to the > tank, why were all these fish being treated in there > display tanks holding other fish ?, you should know > that it is not at all advisable to medicate a display > tank, there is no valid excuse for not using a > quarantine tank, even a bucket will do. You based some > of your statements on there site but out of context > such as your remarks on water changes, read what you > wrote on this again and then read what the site says > again. Why are you trying to bring Nimish into this, > he say he has never used PimaFix. It is Ray and > yourself that are making these rash statements. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@y...> wrote: > > > read the posts before directing a statement like > > that > > at me. i did use their own website for quotes, and > > others have quoted the same text. it is the > > pimafix.html on ap's website. proof is experience, > > same as ray and nimish! > > > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@y...> > > wrote: > > > > > Hi Paul, > > > As I'm sure you know MelaFix and PImaFix > > are > > > manufactured by Aquarium Pharmaceuticals a > > reputable > > > American manufacturer, there web site states and I > > > quote #1 "PimaFix has been formulated to work in > > > combination with MelaFix to enhance effectiveness > > > against fish diseases" > > > quote #2 "University studies and laboratory tests > > > showed that PimaFix is an effective antifungal AND > > > antibacterial remedy for both freshwater and > > marine > > > fish. This evidence led to the granting of a > > United > > > States Patent." > > > quote #3 "MelaFix has been tested and found > > > compatible > > > with Aquarium Pharmaceuticals medications. Mixing > > > other brands of medications is not recommended." > > > To verify my above statements visit :- > > > http://www.aquariumpharm.com?pimafix.html > > > I do not know which wed-site you looked at but > > what > > > you have stated is not on Aquarium Pharmaceuticals > > > website. > > > What proof do you have that mixing MelaFix and > > > PimaFix kills healthy fish ? if you have some then > > > complain to your Patent Office. > > > regards, > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@y...> wrote: > > > > > > > Ray, > > > > i looked up the pimafix website, and it does not > > > say > > > > that they should be used together at all, it > > says > > > > that > > > > they are designed to work "synergistically", > > which > > > > just means to greater effect. this may only be > > > > useful > > > > as dip, there is no information listed. the use > > > of > > > > this language very clearly states to me that it > > is > > > a > > > > write up by a marketing team, not researchers. > > if > > > > one > > > > takes the time to read the full statement on the > > > > site, > > > > it states very clearly that they can be used > > > togther > > > > in EXTREME cases, not everyday use. in addition, > > i > > > > know that we have had some "medical" responses, > > > but > > > > these are not "medications" but rather tea tree > > > and > > > > bay tree extracts, not true antibiotics or anti > > > > fungals meaning not engineered to be used in > > this > > > > way. > > > > they may function well in the application, but > > > this > > > > is hollistic not pharmaceutical. > > > > > > > > --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > Do not believe everything that you read! Do > > you > > > > > REALLY KNOW for sure > > > > > whether or not Melafix and Pimafix can be > > mixed? > > > > > > > If > > > > > not, please do > > > > > not recommend such a thing to other newer > > Forum > > > > > members who may not > > > > > know better. Paul is 100% correct on this > > one. > > > I > > > > > too have seen and > > > > > learned of many cases of hobbyists I know > > mixing > > > > > these > > > > > two "medications" together and wiping out > > their > > > > > tanks. Most of these > > > > > tanks were well established over many years > > with > > > > one > > > > > fish having a > > > > > scrape or slight sore with all the other fish > > > > being > > > > > healthy, as in > > > > > cases that Paul has seen. By themselves, > > these > > > > > remedies are great, > > > > > so I am not trying to bash them. I am not a > > > > > chemist, so I cannot > > > > > tell you what happens when you put them > > > together, > > > > > only that it kills > > > > > fish. Can't say why the manufacturer would > > > > > recommend it -- I would > > > > > hope it wouldn't just be to increase sales, > > but > > > it > > > > > would seem obvious > > > > > they may not have really tried mixing these > > two > > > > meds > > > > > as a test in a > > > > > healthy fish-populated aquarium or I'm sure > > they > > > > > would have found it > > > > > to be detrimental. My gut feeling is that > > there > > > > may > > > > > be other unseen > > > > > factors involved when mixing these two, such > > as > > > > > maybe the water was > > > > > below a certain pH (6.6? for instance), or the > > > > water > > > > > was high in > > > > > magnesium or any number of things in these > > > > aquariums > > > > > which were not > > > > > ordinarily unsafe nor uncommon as all the > > > > aquariums > > > > > involved must > > > > > have had similar parameters, but were fatal > > when > > > > > these TWO meds were > > > > > introduced to the tank together. Maybe when > > > > mixing > > > > > them, you can add > > > > > no more than half strength of each one to get > > a > > > > > total treatment -- > > > > > that I couldn't tell you, but I can tell you > > > > mixing > > > > > them can be > > > > > fatal, even if not all the time. Although I > > > > haven't > > > > > heard of any > > > > > successful mixed treatments. Ray > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > \ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, > > > > "thesydmonster" > > > > > > > > > > <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > > > > > Hmmm.. it says on their web page and the > > > > packaging > > > > > that melafix and > > > > > > pimafix CAN be used together, that they are > > > > > complementary. What > > > > > > happens when you put them together that is > > > fatal > > > > > and why would the > > > > > > manufacturer recommend it, then? > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul > > helms > > > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > they should not be used together, and can > > > have > > > > > fatal > > > > > > > results when mixed at the same time. > > alone > > > > they > > > > > are > > > > > > > safe...together not so much > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@c...> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Have you started treating your tank with > > > > > anything? > > > > > > > > I believe certain > > > > > > > > medications, such as melafix and pimafix > > > -- > > > > > which > > > > > > > > can be used > > > > > > > > together, by the way -- cause foam to > > > > appear. > > > > > Sorry > > > > > > > > to not be of more > > > > > > > > help. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, > > "Dane > > > & > > > > > Leslie > > > > > > > > Moore" > > > > > > > > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > My water has developed a foam type > > > around > > > > > the > > > > > > > > edges as well as a few > > > > > > > > > spots of randome floating clumps. The > > > > foam > > > > > is all > > > > > > > > along the edge of > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > tank as well as the filter, spray > > wand, > > > > > etc... > > > > > > > > > All the tests are fine. No ammonia, > > > > > nitrites or > > > > > > > > high nitrates. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I read a post a while back where > > someone > > > > > else had > > > > > > > > some "foam" but I > > > > > > > > > can't remember which group or what the > > > > > === message truncated === > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13967	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: Electrocution

No Eric, Low voltage will now allow the high amperage to flow thru the conductor as fast as high voltage will. Low current and high voltage will however allow small amperage to travel thru a conductor fast. Power will be the same in both however so I am not really qualified enough to comment on their hazardous nature. Telephone lines are low voltage and so are most laptop adapters and is AC and not hazardous. Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Roberts Sent: 27 July 2005 21:44 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Electrocution We might be saying the same thing here..you can have a high amperage, but low voltage charge that would be more hazardous that a high voltage, low amp charge...correct? Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nimish Mathur Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 2:55 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Electrocution Eric, Amperage is the measure of electrons per second traveling. I think its 6.24 * 10 to the power of 18 electrons per second (coulomb per sec). The force that drives these electrons is called "Potential difference" or voltage. Voltage = Amount of work done(joule)/number of electrons(coulomb). Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Roberts Sent: 27 July 2005 20:12 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Electrocution Thank you for the answer...much better than being an ass about it...right Paul ;-) I do have one question about what you wrote. You said that the current is the measure but the force behind it is the force. Shouldn't that be the voltage is the measure and it the amperage that is the force? Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nimish Mathur Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 8:34 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Electrocution Guys, Some facts: 1. Fish in the aquarium are not grounded. Current will not flow thru them unless they come in-between the flow of current. 2. Human body is very large, In things like a bath tub, the human body is not really grounded but infact acts as a ground itself. 3. Dropping a hair dryer in the bath will not burn the person sitting in it. The electricity flowing thru the body will work on the nervous system and eventually kill it. 4. Fish are too small to be considered as grounding in an aquarium. It is similar to a large swimming pool and someone swimming in it and one drops in a hair dryer in the pool. Why does electricity flow thru the human body in water? Electricity flows in the water in form of ions. Once a current is released in the water, it starts to spread in a 3D field rather then linearly as in wires etc. This basically allows the electricity to come in contact with any and every surface in the water including the human body. Now, human body is so big and has a such a large surface area, that it starts to work as almost a zero resistance conductor in the water. What now happens is very absurd, the part of the body closer to the point of electricity will accept in the flowing electricity and any point further away will start to release it just like radiations. Why? To explain this, flow of electricity is controlled by a force: Potential difference or voltage. Current is just a quantity of it but the force that drives the current is the voltage. A ground surface is one that is considered at an infinitely negative potential or something that will always allow any current to pass thru without offering any resistance.. in a bath tub case: the Human body. So at a point where we have high voltage of current, the human body will tend to absorb the current. now this should absorb the current from every point then? Even the furthest? This does not happen because the current we are talking about is Alternating current. Interesting thing about the alternating current is that in 1/100th of a second, it is positive and the next 1/100th of a second it is negative (basically push and pull). This push and pull makes the human body an effective capacitor (do you really want me to explain what this is and what this does? Lol) It's the work of the body as a capacitor that makes the flow of minor current around the body and thru the water many folds and thus start to effect the entire nervous system. Fish are too small to act as a ground or something at infinitely negative potential and they have a too little surface area to allow a strong potential difference be created at 2 distant ends of the fish and also, it is too small to act as a capacitor. This however does not mean that electricity does not have effect on them.. it is just a minute fraction of what humans feel and the long term effect of current in the water has been reported on fish too. Long term is from 10days to 3-4 months depending on the current as well. Ofcourse, none of this would happen if the current was DC instead of AC. Nim Ps: Sorry for all this but I had to shed some light on this from my thoughts. Been 8 years since I studied physics in university so I could be incorrect in some places.. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! 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PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13968	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium medicine cabinet

Eric, Yes, I used to draw my water straight from the tap, mixing hot & cold to get the right temperature, and set up my Angelfish slates in it -- using the chlorine as a funguscide. Worked great -- never had a problem. But who has just chlorine anymore? Never heard of Nigata clay (I presume you're sure of the spelling?). Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > One thing I was told is that if you have water that just has chlorine in it > (no chloramines) that you can use the water just like that to prevent fungus > in eggs. Any comments on this? What is Nigata clay? > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Nimish Mathur > Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 1:22 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] aquarium medicine cabinet > > > I have Salt, Nigata Clay, methylene blue and melafix. Nothing else on an > occasion I had to get a treatment for dropsy/internal bacteria but apart > from that the Methylene blue is only for eggs in a separate tank and does > not go in the main tank. > > > > Nim > > > > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez > Sent: 27 July 2005 18:50 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] aquarium medicine cabinet > > > > in mine i have instant ocean salt (for my sw tanks & for fw dips), malachite > green, melafix, > marcyn & maracyn 2. > > --- FortWayneFish@a... wrote: > > > Oh wow... I see another debate starting.... > > Preventive Maintenance is key here > > Weekly waterchanges Cures and prevents Most things > > > > > > My Medicine cabinet: > > > > quick cure for ich > > Methyl blue for fungus mostly on eggs > > And Salt................ > > I also have medicated food by Jungle: anti bacterial and anti parasite > > > > rob > > Indiana > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In a message dated 7/26/2005 9:06:05 PM US Eastern Standard Time, > > Crazy4fids@a... writes: > > Hello list, > > > > What products would you recommend to keep in an aquarium medicine > cabinet? > > Obviously, something to treat ick, but what else? > > > > Which is more contagious, bacterial infections, or fungal? In what > > situations do you remove the fish to a hospital tank? Do you remove the > > infected > > fish and start treatment on that particular fish; if more than one fish > has > > it, > > would you pull them out one by one, or just treat the entire community? > > > > I know there are a lot of denominations missing here, but this has always > > > been my dilemma. With a bacteria, can you assume that everyone will get > > sick? > > > > I do have a book on fish diseases, but it gets way into scientific stuff, > > > like doing biopsies and skin scrapings. I have seen a few different > > websites > > that help to diagnose; just wondering what everyone else does. > > > > I do not have a problem now, but I just want to be prepared should someone > > > get sick. > > > > Thanks, > > > > Linda > > > > Rob > > NE Indiana > > USA > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!! > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology > > Biology > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > _____ > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13969	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium medicine cabinet

The problem with keeping many things on hand, just in case, is that they expire. Things that any good aquarist should have on hand are: 1. Test kits. The usual suspects will do--pH, ammonia, nitrite, nitrate. If you do have a need to run some other tests, such as Oxygen, phosphorus, etc. do not hesitate to add them to your collection, but remember the expiration date bugaboo. 2. Water conditioner. Your usual brand, if it is working for you. 3. Salt. Kosher or marine (the aquarium kind, not the fancy cooking stuff) salt is good. This is one thing that does not expire, and can be used in a pinch to treat many things, though not necessarily cure them. 4. Various spare parts for your equipment. Things like filter pads or other filter media, depending on the filter you are using, flapper valves for your vibrating air pump, extra airline tubing, a few air valves. Don't go hog wild and buy enough parts so you could put together your own filter from parts, use a bit of sense. Get those parts that are most likely to be replaced. Having some spare parts on hand (and believe me, if you've been in the hobby for any amount of time, you've got spare parts hanging around from many sources) can save you a bunch of worry when the impeller on your filter quites or Fluffy decides that the airline is tasty, until she takes a bite out of it, or what ever little disaster strikes at [place appropriate hour here--when everything is closed]. Good tank maintenance pretty much precludes having to have a lot of medications and treatments hanging around, simply because your fish will not get sick. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 10:05 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com; mnaquarium@yahoogroups.com; uniaquaria@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] aquarium medicine cabinet Hello list, What products would you recommend to keep in an aquarium medicine cabinet? Obviously, something to treat ick, but what else? Which is more contagious, bacterial infections, or fungal? In what situations do you remove the fish to a hospital tank? Do you remove the infected fish and start treatment on that particular fish; if more than one fish has it, would you pull them out one by one, or just treat the entire community? I know there are a lot of denominations missing here, but this has always been my dilemma. With a bacteria, can you assume that everyone will get sick? I do have a book on fish diseases, but it gets way into scientific stuff, like doing biopsies and skin scrapings. I have seen a few different websites that help to diagnose; just wondering what everyone else does. I do not have a problem now, but I just want to be prepared should someone get sick. Thanks, Linda

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13970	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: was ATTN Ftwayne ( ATTN PATRICK ! )

GEt Over it !! :-)~~ Some people have there own beliefs. I myself Use plain Jane Diamond Kosher Salt. always have, I Do have aquarium salt in a small 16 oz container but have not used that in awhile. Maybe if we run out of reg salt for food i'll grind it up and use it that way. I don't use buffers, tonics , extracts or specialized salts either. Maybe I should..... I believe the manufacterers about as much as i trust a politician. As long as my fish are looking food, eating good, and reproducing I figuere i am doing a decent Job.... Why not use garlic Salt ? garlic is suppose to be good for your fish, and salt is ok... why not use both at the same time? In a message dated 7/27/2005 2:30:16 PM US Eastern Standard Time, patrickmn@... writes: I'm tired of hearing this non-iodized salt junk. LIES Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13971	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: Diatom Filters

Sometimes ebay has the smaller models and at decent prices. Sometimes you can find one used too. If they are missing parts you can usually find replacement parts like the filter bag or regular aquarium tubing for them on the online aquarium supply places. Mike -----Original Message----- From: The Dragon Hunter <dragon.hunter@...> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wed, 27 Jul 2005 09:09:04 -0700 Subject: [AquaticLife] Diatom Filters Have a quick question on Diatom Filters. After you do a "spot" filtration run, do you just open it up and take the top layer of gunk off or do you just leave it till its time to change the power? Thought I'd ask as I'm shopping for one now. Any recomendations as to what one to get without spending an arm and a leg? (largest tank is 65 gallons) ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13972	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: Diatom Filters

Sometimes ebay has the smaller models and at decent prices. Sometimes you can find one used too. If they are missing parts you can usually find replacement parts like the filter bag or regular aquarium tubing for them on the online aquarium supply places. Mike -----Original Message----- From: The Dragon Hunter <dragon.hunter@...> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wed, 27 Jul 2005 09:09:04 -0700 Subject: [AquaticLife] Diatom Filters Have a quick question on Diatom Filters. After you do a "spot" filtration run, do you just open it up and take the top layer of gunk off or do you just leave it till its time to change the power? Thought I'd ask as I'm shopping for one now. Any recomendations as to what one to get without spending an arm and a leg? (largest tank is 65 gallons) ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13973	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: New guys in the tank

We went to the aquarium store today...took back the tiger barb we were given, as he was causing problems in the tank. While we were there we found a pair of flame gouramis that my DH fell in love with and came home with them, as well as a couple of clown loaches (we have a slight snail problem I'm hoping they'll help us with), and put them in the 60 gallon tank with the betta fry, which are now an inch long and starting to get color. It was so cute, every new fish had it's own betta fry escort all over the tank. It was like a group of kids following people around to see what they'd do. I think it kinda freaked the flame gourami's out a bit, and they were reluctant to come out of of hiding...but they seem to be getting comfy now. Dh would like a pair of paradise gourami's now...do they stay small-ish?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13974	From: Sandra	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution (Paul Helms going off the d

You know Paul...There have been wonderful medical break through's now, You can actually have that chip on your shoulder and the stick that is up your ass surgically removed with minimal side affects. sandra --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms <wtfmorlok@y...> wrote: > i am sick of ignorant ppl arguing fact...elctricities > nature is a fact not an opinion. speaking of how you > talk to ppl, telling someone to drink something that > they know to be fatal to fish is not exactly good ppl > skills > > > --- Lenny Vasbinder <lnvtm1@g...> wrote: > > > Paul, > > > > I think it's about time you take a MelaFix / PimaFix > > cocktail so we can test your theory. > > > > Geeeezzzz.... take a chill pill dude! > > > > Besides.. God ALWAYS starts with a capital "G" and > > you should never use His name in vain! > > > > I think you implied that you own a LFS. I hope you > > don't talk to your customers like that. Maybe you > > should take a class in how to talk to people. > > > > Lenny Vasbinder > > http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com > > 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 > > LNVTM1@g... > > > > Message: 13 > > Date: Tue, 26 Jul 2005 14:19:31 -0700 (PDT) > > From: paul helms <wtfmorlok@y...> > > Subject: RE: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution > > > > no they are not...god damn it read a freaking book, > > take a class , something!!!! > > > > --- Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@c...> > > wrote: > > > > > Yes they are. > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > > > On Behalf Of Eric Roberts > > > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:24 PM > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > > > Electrocution > > > > > > > > > Aren't they grounded by the water? > > > > > > Eric > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > > > On Behalf Of Dane & Leslie Moore > > > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:17 PM > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > > > Electrocution > > > > > > > > > Fish are not grounded so they won't be > > electrocuted > > > huh? Hmmm. Lol > > > Sorry but that's funny. > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13975	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium medicine cabinet SALT!

I am also tired of rereading the same salt argument every other month. Perhaps we can have a group of pro and con salt/iodized people put together a web page on it and just refer people to it instead of rehashing the same old arguments? That way everyone can have their say on their reasons, facts, and experiences in one area and let people make a decision rather than battle it out again and again and again. Mike [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13976	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: New guys in the tank

If I remember right, Paradise Gouramis get to be about 3-4 inches tops. Don't think any gouramis get above 5 inches until you go for the true Giant Gourami, which gets to be around 18 inches. Would love to have one of the big guys, but don't have a tank big enough. One of the LFS's in Riverside has one. I go there to drool more than to buy glass shrimp. lol The Clowns, once they get used to things, will live up to their name. Just don't panic if you see them laying on their sides motionless. Just one of the things they do. ----- Original Message ----- From: "cynthia brennemann" <brennewoman@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 3:00 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] New guys in the tank We went to the aquarium store today...took back the tiger barb we were given, as he was causing problems in the tank. While we were there we found a pair of flame gouramis that my DH fell in love with and came home with them, as well as a couple of clown loaches (we have a slight snail problem I'm hoping they'll help us with), and put them in the 60 gallon tank with the betta fry, which are now an inch long and starting to get color. It was so cute, every new fish had it's own betta fry escort all over the tank. It was like a group of kids following people around to see what they'd do. I think it kinda freaked the flame gourami's out a bit, and they were reluctant to come out of of hiding...but they seem to be getting comfy now. Dh would like a pair of paradise gourami's now...do they stay small-ish? ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13977	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: New guys in the tank

hehe Wait till he sees a Honey gourami (sometimes refered to as a marigold gourami). Most common colloration that I've seen is Canary yellow with red fins. Have only seen them locally twice and I bought all they had both times. They only get to be an inch or so. I have tetras that are longer than they are. Cute little buggers. I have 5 total now and will buy more as soon as I see them. ----- Original Message ----- From: "cynthia brennemann" <brennewoman@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 3:00 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] New guys in the tank We went to the aquarium store today...took back the tiger barb we were given, as he was causing problems in the tank. While we were there we found a pair of flame gouramis that my DH fell in love with and came home with them, as well as a couple of clown loaches (we have a slight snail problem I'm hoping they'll help us with), and put them in the 60 gallon tank with the betta fry, which are now an inch long and starting to get color. It was so cute, every new fish had it's own betta fry escort all over the tank. It was like a group of kids following people around to see what they'd do. I think it kinda freaked the flame gourami's out a bit, and they were reluctant to come out of of hiding...but they seem to be getting comfy now. Dh would like a pair of paradise gourami's now...do they stay small-ish? ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13978	From: Aaron	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Practical Fishkeeping Dyed Fish Campaign

Practical Fishkeeping Dyed Fish Campaign http://www.practicalfishkeeping.co.uk/pfk/pages/campaign.php Back in 1996, we ran a successful campaign which asked shops to sign a pledge not to sell dyed fish. This led to a huge decrease in the number of dyed fish sold. Unfortunately, dyed fish seem to be making a comeback, so we've relaunched our campaign, and this time we're going global! Why sign up? Apart from the feelgood-factor of supporting a good cause, all members will get a certificate to display in their shop, as well as a free webpage like this one if they provide the appropriate details. In a poll we ran in February 2003 88% of PFK readers said they would prefer to buy their fish from dealers who pledged not to stock dyed fish. If you sell these fish, you'll be upsetting a significant number of your customers. Who has signed up? We've had hundreds of companies sign up to the campaign already. To find a dealer in your country who's signed our Dyed Fish Pledge check out our list of Campaign Members. How are fish dyed? If you are interested in finding more information on the dyeing processes used and the effect they have on fish, read Drs Peter Burgess and Stan MacMahon's article Why it's cruel to dye. http://www.practicalfishkeeping.co.uk/pfk/pages/show_article.php? article_id=72 How do I sign up? For more details on signing up to the campaign, and information on how PFK readers can help support the campaign, click here http://www.practicalfishkeeping.co.uk/pfk/pages/campaign_join.php

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13979	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy Water (now the debate on MelaFix and PimaFix)

Here is the email address to Aquarium Pharmaceuticals. I sent them an email with some of the comments made out here to get their feedback and I will forward same to the group when I receive it. docwellfish@... Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: Date: Wed, 27 Jul 2005 13:52:42 -0500 From: "Eric Roberts" <woad@...> Subject: RE: Re: Foamy Water (now the debate on MelaFix and PimaFix) I think what the argument is about is that the two are there cause when many feel there is something else that we are not taking into account. While we don't have the water in front of us, maybe we can try and figure out what other factor was there that could have caused this to become toxic. As many people use these remedies, I think looking into exactly what the other factor is would be a good idea. I am sure the manufacture would like to know, plus it could save a lot of little fish if we can figure it out. Eric [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13980	From: Tom Ray	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: New guys in the tank

By "Paradise Goarami," do you mean the Macropodus genera (spechti, concolor, etc.) or the Pseudosphromenus genera (cupanus, dayi) species? FYI: Not sure how friendly the former will be towards your Betta splendid juveniles. The former are agressive outside of its own species. I have not witnessed any aggression by the latter. --TommyBoy --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "cynthia brennemann" <brennewoman@h...> wrote: > ...Dh would like a pair > of paradise gourami's now...do they stay small-ish?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13981	From: Aaron	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: lighting ? for fw w/ plants

here is a reply I got from a retailer that I was asking for replacement bulbs, I got great technical advice but I still do not know where to buy the new lights? --------- From: "MarineBio" <MarineBio@...> To: "'Aaron M.'" <anonymous122899@...> Subject: RE: lighting Date: Wed, 27 Jul 2005 19:27:02 -0400 For your lighting system you can probably use 65 watt bulbs. The important thing to make sure of is that the pins match. Nearly all 55 watt bulbs are straight pin while 65 watts can be square or straight pin. I would stick with 5500-6700K bulbs. Chlorophyll absorbs light most efficiently at 420nm which is the same as true actinic. It is also the spectrum of light that will penetrate water further than any other. In marine tanks most of the corals are found in depths greater than 15' where red, orange, and yellow light is nonexistent. That's why these tanks are often lit with so much blue light. In freshwater the plants are found in much shallower depths of only 10' or less. And many are not underwater at all. Consequently they are adapted to a light spectrum much higher in red, yellow, and orange and why the lower Kelvin rated bulbs are best. They still produce the 420 nm light spectrum but you cannot see it because of the other colors emitted as well. I would replace all your bulbs now and date them. When they reach 9000 hours of use you should replace them with new bulbs whether they still light up or not. Chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists every Thursday night from 8-10 pm EST at www.thatpetplace.com. Thank You Andy

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13982	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: guppies and swordtails

I have two male guppies, three female pineapple swordtails and a male pineapple swordtail. The swordtails were added on Sunday. The male guppies have "discovered" the female and have been dogging them all day. Is there any possibility of them breeding? I have not seen the male sword dogging them. I know platies and swordtails can cross breed, but what about guppies and swordtails? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13983	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy Water (now the debate on MelaFix and PimaFix)

I wrote to them two days ago and am still waiting to hear back. Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Lenny Vasbinder" <lnvtm1@g...> wrote: > Here is the email address to Aquarium Pharmaceuticals. I sent them an email with some of the comments made out here to get their feedback and I will forward same to the group when I receive it. > > docwellfish@a... > > Lenny Vasbinder > http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com > 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 > LNVTM1@g... > > Message: > Date: Wed, 27 Jul 2005 13:52:42 -0500 > From: "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> > Subject: RE: Re: Foamy Water (now the debate on MelaFix and PimaFix) > > I think what the argument is about is that the two are there cause when many > feel there is something else that we are not taking into account. While we > don't have the water in front of us, maybe we can try and figure out what > other factor was there that could have caused this to become toxic. As many > people use these remedies, I think looking into exactly what the other > factor is would be a good idea. I am sure the manufacture would like to > know, plus it could save a lot of little fish if we can figure it out. > > Eric > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13984	From: Patrick	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution (Paul Helms going off the d

Oh, that's nice. More stupid comments. I like it. :) Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill -------Original Message------- You know Paul...There have been wonderful medical break through's now, You can actually have that chip on your shoulder and the stick that is up your ass surgically removed with minimal side affects. sandra [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13985	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium medicine cabinet

I have no clue...it was something Nimish posted... As far as just having chlorine...the entire Chicago area is chloramines free. Most of the Chicago area gets it water form Lake Michigan, so we have the same water quality. Here is the chemical analysis from the DuPage County Water Commission: http://www.dpwc.org/2004.html Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 4:07 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: aquarium medicine cabinet Eric, Yes, I used to draw my water straight from the tap, mixing hot & cold to get the right temperature, and set up my Angelfish slates in it -- using the chlorine as a funguscide. Worked great -- never had a problem. But who has just chlorine anymore? Never heard of Nigata clay (I presume you're sure of the spelling?). Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > One thing I was told is that if you have water that just has chlorine in it > (no chloramines) that you can use the water just like that to prevent fungus > in eggs. Any comments on this? What is Nigata clay? > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Nimish Mathur > Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 1:22 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] aquarium medicine cabinet > > > I have Salt, Nigata Clay, methylene blue and melafix. Nothing else on an > occasion I had to get a treatment for dropsy/internal bacteria but apart > from that the Methylene blue is only for eggs in a separate tank and does > not go in the main tank. > > > > Nim > > > > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez > Sent: 27 July 2005 18:50 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] aquarium medicine cabinet > > > > in mine i have instant ocean salt (for my sw tanks & for fw dips), malachite > green, melafix, > marcyn & maracyn 2. > > --- FortWayneFish@a... wrote: > > > Oh wow... I see another debate starting.... > > Preventive Maintenance is key here > > Weekly waterchanges Cures and prevents Most things > > > > > > My Medicine cabinet: > > > > quick cure for ich > > Methyl blue for fungus mostly on eggs > > And Salt................ > > I also have medicated food by Jungle: anti bacterial and anti parasite > > > > rob > > Indiana > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In a message dated 7/26/2005 9:06:05 PM US Eastern Standard Time, > > Crazy4fids@a... writes: > > Hello list, > > > > What products would you recommend to keep in an aquarium medicine > cabinet? > > Obviously, something to treat ick, but what else? > > > > Which is more contagious, bacterial infections, or fungal? In what > > situations do you remove the fish to a hospital tank? Do you remove the > > infected > > fish and start treatment on that particular fish; if more than one fish > has > > it, > > would you pull them out one by one, or just treat the entire community? > > > > I know there are a lot of denominations missing here, but this has always > > > been my dilemma. With a bacteria, can you assume that everyone will get > > sick? > > > > I do have a book on fish diseases, but it gets way into scientific stuff, > > > like doing biopsies and skin scrapings. I have seen a few different > > websites > > that help to diagnose; just wondering what everyone else does. > > > > I do not have a problem now, but I just want to be prepared should someone > > > get sick. > > > > Thanks, > > > > Linda > > > > Rob > > NE Indiana > > USA > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!! > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology > > Biology > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > _____ > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13986	From: Patrick	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium medicine cabinet SALT!

It can always be debated at groups.yahoo.com/group/aquariumdebates I guess. At least it would take it out of here. :) Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill -------Original Message------- I am also tired of rereading the same salt argument every other month. Perhaps we can have a group of pro and con salt/iodized people put together a web page on it and just refer people to it instead of rehashing the same old arguments? That way everyone can have their say on their reasons, facts, and experiences in one area and let people make a decision rather than battle it out again and again and again. Mike [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13987	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: To Paul & Ray Re: MelaFix & PimaFix

Hi Ray, I included your name because you appeared to be siding with and supporting Paul's statements. I am only trying to bring out the truth. Paul has used these half truths and partial quote tactics on more than one occasion before, then when he is shown to be incorrect he resorts to abusive posts. In this case we have a reputable manufacturer who states that one of the two products in question, PimaFix has been formulated to work in combination with the other, MelaFix. Common sense tells me that that does not form a deadly cocktail, if these two medications have any bearing on the death of the fish in question I suggest it is due to one or more other substances being present in the tank water, probably other medications or water additives. In which case it is pure speculation and most unfair and very likely liable to blame and name MelaFix and PimaFix in public. There must be many thousands of aquarists world wide using or have used these to products in combination, if there was any truth in the accusation that they produce a deadly cocktail there would be thousands of complaints. Have you ever heard of this before this incident ?. Aquarists will have killed very many fish by using two or more medications at the same time without specific recommendation. regards, unclenorm. --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote: > Norm, Wish you wouldn't drag my name into an > argument that you're > having with someone else. I've already said my peace > on this subject > and thought I was done with it. I'm getting a tired > trying to > convince some of you guys of the dangers of mixing > these two remedies > for your own benefit. You can either believe it or > you don't > (obviously you don't), but don't say I'm making rash > statements. I > know what I saw happen. I do notice your saying > that "it could have > been the Melafix or the Pimafix combining with some > other > substance..." At least you're open to the fact that > killings can > take place using both of these remedies. I myself > wouldn't mind > getting to the bottom of why this occurs. Hope you > have noticed that > I never said it was the combination of these two > remedies themselves > that can cause a toxic result (but the toxic result > can happen when > using the two remedies in combination). Again, as I > hope you read, I > feel, similar to what you have stated that there is > another factor > (substance, etc.; call it what you will) involved > and not the direct > result of the two meds. Yet, the killings that can > happen, happen > only when these two meds are present. Seems to be > something strange > going on chemically under certain circumstances when > the both meds > are introduced, when something else or some other > condition is > already present. All toxic cases I've seen occured > in acid water. > About a third of these cases already had salt in the > water. I have > no idea whether this had anything to do with the > fatal results and AM > NOT saying this will happen all of the time. Under > conditions where > this third mystery factor/substance is absent, the > mixture of the two > remedies may well be safe; I just don't know of any > instances. Would > like to add that once, and only once, I had a bad > reaction in one of > my tanks using just plain Melafix where after about > 20 minutes, the > fish started coming up to the surface for air. All > water parameters > were normal (no ammonia, etc., etc.), although that > water was at > about pH 6.2. Still can't figure why that happened. > Ray > \ > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. > Hampson." > <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > Paul, > > As I have pointed out in previous posts you > only > > quoted parts of A/P web site to suit your argument > and > > most of what you have said is pure conjecture, you > do > > not know what killed the fish in question it is an > > assumption on your part, it could have been the > > MelaFix or the PimaFix combining with some other > > substance or medication previously administered to > the > > tank, why were all these fish being treated in > there > > display tanks holding other fish ?, you should > know > > that it is not at all advisable to medicate a > display > > tank, there is no valid excuse for not using a > > quarantine tank, even a bucket will do. You based > some > > of your statements on there site but out of > context > > such as your remarks on water changes, read what > you > > wrote on this again and then read what the site > says > > again. Why are you trying to bring Nimish into > this, > > he say he has never used PimaFix. It is Ray and > > yourself that are making these rash statements. > > regards, > > unclenorm. > > > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@y...> wrote: > > > > > read the posts before directing a statement like > > > that > > > at me. i did use their own website for quotes, > and > > > others have quoted the same text. it is the > > > pimafix.html on ap's website. proof is > experience, > > > same as ray and nimish! > > > > > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@y...> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > Hi Paul, > > > > As I'm sure you know MelaFix and > PImaFix > > > are > > > > manufactured by Aquarium Pharmaceuticals a > > > reputable > > > > American manufacturer, there web site states > and I > > > > quote #1 "PimaFix has been formulated to work > in > > > > combination with MelaFix to enhance > effectiveness > > > > against fish diseases" > > > > quote #2 "University studies and laboratory > tests > > > > showed that PimaFix is an effective antifungal > AND > > > > antibacterial remedy for both freshwater and > > > marine > > > > fish. This evidence led to the granting of a > > > United > > > > States Patent." > > > > quote #3 "MelaFix has been tested and found > > > > compatible > > > > with Aquarium Pharmaceuticals medications. > Mixing > > > > other brands of medications is not > recommended." > > > > To verify my above statements visit :- > > > > http://www.aquariumpharm.com?pimafix.html > > > > I do not know which wed-site you looked at > but > > > what > > > > you have stated is not on Aquarium > Pharmaceuticals > > > > website. > > > > What proof do you have that mixing MelaFix > and > > > > PimaFix kills healthy fish ? if you have some > then > > > > complain to your Patent Office. > > > > regards, > > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@y...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Ray, > > > > > i looked up the pimafix website, and it does > not > > > > say > > > > > that they should be used together at all, it > > > says > > > > > that > > > > > they are designed to work "synergistically", > > > which > > > > > just means to greater effect. this may only > be > > > > > useful > > > > > as dip, there is no information listed. the > use > > > > of > > > > > this language very clearly states to me that > it > > > is > > > > a > > > > > write up by a marketing team, not > researchers. > > > if > > > > > one > > > > > takes the time to read the full statement on > the > > > > > site, > > > > > it states very clearly that they can be used > > > > togther > > > > > in EXTREME cases, not everyday use. in > addition, > > > i > > > > > know that we have had some "medical" > responses, > > > > but > > > > > these are not "medications" but rather tea > tree > > > > and > > > > > bay tree extracts, not true antibiotics or > anti > > > > > fungals meaning not engineered to be used in > > > this > > > > > way. > > > > > they may function well in the application, > but > > > > this > > > > > is hollistic not pharmaceutical. > > > > > > > > > > --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Do not believe everything that you read! > Do > > > you > > > > > > REALLY KNOW for sure > > > > > > whether or not Melafix and Pimafix can be > > > mixed? > > > > > > > > > If > > > > > > not, please do > > > > > > not recommend such a thing to other newer > > > Forum > > > > > > members who may not > > > > > > know better. Paul is 100% correct on this > > > one. > > > > I > > > > > > too have seen and > > > > > > learned of many cases of hobbyists I know > > > mixing > > > > > > these > > > > > > two "medications" together and wiping out > > > their > > > > > > tanks. Most of these > > > > > > tanks were well established over many > years > > > with > > > > > one > > > > > > fish having a > > > > > > scrape or slight sore with all the other > fish > > > > > being > > > > > > healthy, as in > > > > > > cases that Paul has seen. By themselves, > > > these > > > > > > remedies are great, > > > > > > so I am not trying to bash them. I am not > a > > > > > > chemist, so I cannot > > > > > > tell you what happens when you put them > > > > together, > > > > > > only that it kills > > > > > > fish. Can't say why the manufacturer > would > > > > > > recommend it -- I would > > > > > > hope it wouldn't just be to increase > sales, > > > but > > > > it > > > > > > would seem obvious > > > > > > they may not have really tried mixing > these > > > two > > > > > meds > > > > > > as a test in a > > > > > > healthy fish-populated aquarium or I'm > sure > > > they > > > > > > would have found it > > > > > > to be detrimental. My gut feeling is that > > > there > > > > > may > > > > > > be other unseen > > > > > > factors involved when mixing these two, > such > > > as > > > > > > maybe the water was > > > > > > below a certain pH (6.6? for instance), or > the > > > > > water > > > > > > was high in > > > > > > magnesium or any number of things in these > > > > > aquariums > > > > > > which were not > > > > > > ordinarily unsafe nor uncommon as all the > > > > > aquariums > > > > > > involved must > > > > > > have had similar parameters, but were > fatal > > > when > > > > > > these TWO meds were > > > > > > introduced to the tank together. Maybe > when > > > > > mixing > > > > > > them, you can add > > > > > > no more than half strength of each one to > get > > > a > > > > > > total treatment -- > > > > > > that I couldn't tell you, but I can tell > you > > > > > mixing > > > > > > them can be > > > > > > fatal, even if not all the time. Although > I > > > > > haven't > > > > > > heard of any > > > > > > successful mixed treatments. Ray > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > \ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, > > > > > "thesydmonster" > > > > > > > > > > > > <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > > > > > > Hmmm.. it says on their web page and the > > > > > packaging > > > > > > that melafix and > > > > > > > pimafix CAN be used together, that they > are > > > > > > complementary. What > > > > > > > happens when you put them together that > is > > > > fatal > > > > > > and why would the > > > > > > > manufacturer recommend it, then? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul > > > helms > > > > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > they should not be used together, and > can > > > > have > > > > > > fatal > > > > > > > > results when mixed at the same time. > > > alone > > > > > they > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > safe...together not so much > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@c...> > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Have you started treating your tank > with > > > > > > anything? > > > > > > > > > I believe certain > > > > > > > > > medications, such as melafix and > pimafix > > > > -- > > > > > > which > > > > > > > > > can be used > > > > > > > > > together, by the way -- cause foam > to > > > > > appear. > > > > > > Sorry > > > > > > > > > to not be of more > > > > > > > > > help. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, > > > "Dane > > > > & > > > > > > Leslie > > > > > > > > > Moore" > > > > > > > > > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > My water has developed a foam type > > > > around > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > edges as well as a few > > > > > > > > > > spots of randome floating clumps. > The > > > > > foam > > > > > > is all > > > > > > > > > along the edge of > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > tank as well as the filter, spray > > > wand, > > > > > > etc... > > > > > > > > > > All the tests are fine. No > ammonia, > > > > > > nitrites or > > > > > > > > > high nitrates. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I read a post a while back where > > > someone > > > > > > else had > > > > > > > > > some "foam" but I > > > > > > > > > > can't remember which group or what > the > > > > > > > === message truncated === > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > > > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home > page > > > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC > calling worldwide > with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com > > > > ___________________________________________________________ How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13988	From: Aaron	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: lighting ? for fw w/ plants

I have found 2 places online that have what I'm looking for - however niether discloses the brand online - is there a difference in quality of brands? --- 4 - 65 Watt 6500K Daylight Compact Fluorescent $19.99each = Subtotal: $79.96 Sales Tax: $0.00 Shipping: $14.36 TOTAL: $94.32 from http://aquariumplant.com/ - or - 2 - 55 Watt 5500K Compact Fluorescent Bulb $18.99ea $37.98 2 - 55 Watt 6700K Compact Fluorescent Bulb $18.99ea $37.98 Sub Total $75.96 Shipping and Handling $6.00 Total $81.96 from http://ahsupply.com --- Will the 2 - Workhorse5 ballasts power the 65w bulbs all the way or will it only put out 55watts? If the ballasts can handle it then for $12 more I get shipping insurance and 40watts more. is there really a big difference between the 6500K and 6700K? are the plants better with those spectrums? or should I mix the 5000K or 5500K in with them? --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Aaron" <anonymous122899@y...> wrote: > here is a reply I got from a retailer that I was asking for > replacement bulbs, I got great technical advice but I still do not > know where to buy the new lights? >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13989	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: New guys in the tank (now Acronym... DH.. lol)

Cynthia, I've seen you refer to your "DH" on several occasions but I have not been able to figure out what DH stands for.... Dear Hubby, Dumb Husband, Domestic Help, a few expletive deleted's... what is it? Inquiring minds want to know. :-P Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: 13 Date: Wed, 27 Jul 2005 22:00:13 -0000 From: "cynthia brennemann" <brennewoman@...> Subject: New guys in the tank We went to the aquarium store today...took back the tiger barb we were given, as he was causing problems in the tank. While we were there we found a pair of flame gouramis that my DH fell in love with and came home with them, as well as a couple of clown loaches (we have a slight snail problem I'm hoping they'll help us with), and put them in the 60 gallon tank with the betta fry, which are now an inch long and starting to get color. It was so cute, every new fish had it's own betta fry escort all over the tank. It was like a group of kids following people around to see what they'd do. I think it kinda freaked the flame gourami's out a bit, and they were reluctant to come out of of hiding...but they seem to be getting comfy now. Dh would like a pair of paradise gourami's now...do they stay small-ish? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13990	From: Sandra	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: lighting ? for fw w/ plants

HI Aaron, Sorry i can´t answer your questions, but i have been shopping at www.customaquatic.com for quiet some time, they have pretty reasonable prices (a huge variety of lights as well), if you want you can compare and see which prices are more convenient for you! :) sandra --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Aaron" <anonymous122899@y...> wrote: > I have found 2 places online that have what I'm looking for - > however niether discloses the brand online - is there a difference > in quality of brands? > > --- > > 4 - 65 Watt 6500K Daylight Compact Fluorescent $19.99each = > Subtotal: $79.96 > Sales Tax: $0.00 > Shipping: $14.36 > TOTAL: $94.32 > from http://aquariumplant.com/ > - > or > - > 2 - 55 Watt 5500K Compact Fluorescent Bulb $18.99ea $37.98 > 2 - 55 Watt 6700K Compact Fluorescent Bulb $18.99ea $37.98 > Sub Total $75.96 > Shipping and Handling $6.00 > Total $81.96 > from http://ahsupply.com > --- > > Will the 2 - Workhorse5 ballasts power the 65w bulbs all the way or > will it only put out 55watts? If the ballasts can handle it then > for $12 more I get shipping insurance and 40watts more. > > is there really a big difference between the 6500K and 6700K? > are the plants better with those spectrums? or should I mix the > 5000K or 5500K in with them? > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Aaron" <anonymous122899@y...> > wrote: > > here is a reply I got from a retailer that I was asking for > > replacement bulbs, I got great technical advice but I still do not > > know where to buy the new lights? > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13991	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy Water (now the debate on MelaFix and PimaFix)

Do you REALLY think any their comments will be other than pro A/P??? \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Lenny Vasbinder" <lnvtm1@g...> wrote: > Here is the email address to Aquarium Pharmaceuticals. I sent them an email with some of the comments made out here to get their feedback and I will forward same to the group when I receive it. > > docwellfish@a... > > Lenny Vasbinder > http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com > 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 > LNVTM1@g... > > Message: > Date: Wed, 27 Jul 2005 13:52:42 -0500 > From: "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> > Subject: RE: Re: Foamy Water (now the debate on MelaFix and PimaFix) > > I think what the argument is about is that the two are there cause when many > feel there is something else that we are not taking into account. While we > don't have the water in front of us, maybe we can try and figure out what > other factor was there that could have caused this to become toxic. As many > people use these remedies, I think looking into exactly what the other > factor is would be a good idea. I am sure the manufacture would like to > know, plus it could save a lot of little fish if we can figure it out. > > Eric > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13992	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: To Paul & Ray Re: MelaFix & PimaFix

Norm, What gets me is that you won't even concede that there is even the remote possibility that the combination of these two remedies can cause a fatal condition. What makes you so sure? How would you know one way or the other if you have never had any experience with mixing the two? You ask "have I ever heard of this before this incident?". First of all I never "heard" of it -- I've seen it first-hand so it IS NOT SPECULATION, but more importantly, I've seen it many times. Maybe you haven't read all my posts on this starting with Message #13799 (July 25, 8:24PM). AGAIN< in case you haven't understood what I said in my last post, I am not solely blaming the combination of Melafix & Pimafix by themselves as I suspect a third condition being present in these cases, which remains unknown. In each and every case I've witnessed, there was absolutely no other medication involved so that possibility has to be ruled out (at least the incidences I'm talking about). Why, as you say, would there necessarily be thousands of complaints if this were true? I would think that the cases I saw were probably (hopefully) in the minority - - for one thing I never said that this can and will happen each and every time, but I am saying there is a distinct possibility (as I witnessed) that it can happen and for anyone to be cautious of this. Better yet, THEY'RE PERFECTLY FINE TOGETHER -- YOU MAY USE WITH ABANDON. NO NEED TO BE CAREFUL HERE -- THEY"RE ALSO GREAT ON ICE TOGETHER DURING "HAPPY HOUR". In Short, I don't care what you think or do with these two remedies -- I'm sick of hashing something out just because you don't believe what I've personally witnessed. I only passed it along in an effort to save your fish. I do hope though, that someday you'll have the opportunity to try these two together -- lots of luck with them. END OF DISCUSSION. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > Hi Ray, > I included your name because you appeared to be > siding with and supporting Paul's statements. I am > only trying to bring out the truth. Paul has used > these half truths and partial quote tactics on more > than one occasion before, then when he is shown to be > incorrect he resorts to abusive posts. In this case we > have a reputable manufacturer who states that one of > the two products in question, PimaFix has been > formulated to work in combination with the other, > MelaFix. Common sense tells me that that does not form > a deadly cocktail, if these two medications have any > bearing on the death of the fish in question I suggest > it is due to one or more other substances being > present in the tank water, probably other medications > or water additives. In which case it is pure > speculation and most unfair and very likely liable to > blame and name MelaFix and PimaFix in public. There > must be many thousands of aquarists world wide using > or have used these to products in combination, if > there was any truth in the accusation that they > produce a deadly cocktail there would be thousands of > complaints. Have you ever heard of this before this > incident ?. Aquarists will have killed very many fish > by using two or more medications at the same time > without specific recommendation. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > Norm, Wish you wouldn't drag my name into an > > argument that you're > > having with someone else. I've already said my peace > > on this subject > > and thought I was done with it. I'm getting a tired > > trying to > > convince some of you guys of the dangers of mixing > > these two remedies > > for your own benefit. You can either believe it or > > you don't > > (obviously you don't), but don't say I'm making rash > > statements. I > > know what I saw happen. I do notice your saying > > that "it could have > > been the Melafix or the Pimafix combining with some > > other > > substance..." At least you're open to the fact that > > killings can > > take place using both of these remedies. I myself > > wouldn't mind > > getting to the bottom of why this occurs. Hope you > > have noticed that > > I never said it was the combination of these two > > remedies themselves > > that can cause a toxic result (but the toxic result > > can happen when > > using the two remedies in combination). Again, as I > > hope you read, I > > feel, similar to what you have stated that there is > > another factor > > (substance, etc.; call it what you will) involved > > and not the direct > > result of the two meds. Yet, the killings that can > > happen, happen > > only when these two meds are present. Seems to be > > something strange > > going on chemically under certain circumstances when > > the both meds > > are introduced, when something else or some other > > condition is > > already present. All toxic cases I've seen occured > > in acid water. > > About a third of these cases already had salt in the > > water. I have > > no idea whether this had anything to do with the > > fatal results and AM > > NOT saying this will happen all of the time. Under > > conditions where > > this third mystery factor/substance is absent, the > > mixture of the two > > remedies may well be safe; I just don't know of any > > instances. Would > > like to add that once, and only once, I had a bad > > reaction in one of > > my tanks using just plain Melafix where after about > > 20 minutes, the > > fish started coming up to the surface for air. All > > water parameters > > were normal (no ammonia, etc., etc.), although that > > water was at > > about pH 6.2. Still can't figure why that happened. > > Ray > > \ > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. > > Hampson." > > <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > > Paul, > > > As I have pointed out in previous posts you > > only > > > quoted parts of A/P web site to suit your argument > > and > > > most of what you have said is pure conjecture, you > > do > > > not know what killed the fish in question it is an > > > assumption on your part, it could have been the > > > MelaFix or the PimaFix combining with some other > > > substance or medication previously administered to > > the > > > tank, why were all these fish being treated in > > there > > > display tanks holding other fish ?, you should > > know > > > that it is not at all advisable to medicate a > > display > > > tank, there is no valid excuse for not using a > > > quarantine tank, even a bucket will do. You based > > some > > > of your statements on there site but out of > > context > > > such as your remarks on water changes, read what > > you > > > wrote on this again and then read what the site > > says > > > again. Why are you trying to bring Nimish into > > this, > > > he say he has never used PimaFix. It is Ray and > > > yourself that are making these rash statements. > > > regards, > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@y...> wrote: > > > > > > > read the posts before directing a statement like > > > > that > > > > at me. i did use their own website for quotes, > > and > > > > others have quoted the same text. it is the > > > > pimafix.html on ap's website. proof is > > experience, > > > > same as ray and nimish! > > > > > > > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@y...> > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > Hi Paul, > > > > > As I'm sure you know MelaFix and > > PImaFix > > > > are > > > > > manufactured by Aquarium Pharmaceuticals a > > > > reputable > > > > > American manufacturer, there web site states > > and I > > > > > quote #1 "PimaFix has been formulated to work > > in > > > > > combination with MelaFix to enhance > > effectiveness > > > > > against fish diseases" > > > > > quote #2 "University studies and laboratory > > tests > > > > > showed that PimaFix is an effective antifungal > > AND > > > > > antibacterial remedy for both freshwater and > > > > marine > > > > > fish. This evidence led to the granting of a > > > > United > > > > > States Patent." > > > > > quote #3 "MelaFix has been tested and found > > > > > compatible > > > > > with Aquarium Pharmaceuticals medications. > > Mixing > > > > > other brands of medications is not > > recommended." > > > > > To verify my above statements visit :- > > > > > http://www.aquariumpharm.com?pimafix.html > > > > > I do not know which wed-site you looked at > > but > > > > what > > > > > you have stated is not on Aquarium > > Pharmaceuticals > > > > > website. > > > > > What proof do you have that mixing MelaFix > > and > > > > > PimaFix kills healthy fish ? if you have some > > then > > > > > complain to your Patent Office. > > > > > regards, > > > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@y...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Ray, > > > > > > i looked up the pimafix website, and it does > > not > > > > > say > > > > > > that they should be used together at all, it > > > > says > > > > > > that > > > > > > they are designed to work "synergistically", > > > > which > > > > > > just means to greater effect. this may only > > be > > > > > > useful > > > > > > as dip, there is no information listed. the > > use > > > > > of > > > > > > this language very clearly states to me that > > it > > > > is > > > > > a > > > > > > write up by a marketing team, not > > researchers. > > > > if > > > > > > one > > > > > > takes the time to read the full statement on > > the > > > > > > site, > > > > > > it states very clearly that they can be used > > > > > togther > > > > > > in EXTREME cases, not everyday use. in > > addition, > > > > i > > > > > > know that we have had some "medical" > > responses, > > > > > but > > > > > > these are not "medications" but rather tea > > tree > > > > > and > > > > > > bay tree extracts, not true antibiotics or > > anti > > > > > > fungals meaning not engineered to be used in > > > > this > > > > > > way. > > > > > > they may function well in the application, > > but > > > > > this > > > > > > is hollistic not pharmaceutical. > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > Do not believe everything that you read! > > Do > > > > you > > > > > > > REALLY KNOW for sure > > > > > > > whether or not Melafix and Pimafix can be > > > > mixed? > > > > > > > > > > > If > > > > > > > not, please do > > > > > > > not recommend such a thing to other newer > > > > Forum > > > > > > > members who may not > > > > > > > know better. Paul is 100% correct on this > > > > one. > > > > > I > > > > > > > too have seen and > > > > > > > learned of many cases of hobbyists I know > > > > mixing > > > > > > > these > > > > > > > two "medications" together and wiping out > > > > their > > > > > > > tanks. Most of these > > > > > > > tanks were well established over many > > years > > > > with > > > > > > one > > > > > > > fish having a > > > > > > > scrape or slight sore with all the other > > fish > > > > > > being > > > > > > > healthy, as in > > > > > > > cases that Paul has seen. By themselves, > > > > these > > > > > > > remedies are great, > > > > > > > so I am not trying to bash them. I am not > > a > > > > > > > chemist, so I cannot > > > > > > > tell you what happens when you put them > > > > > together, > > > > > > > only that it kills > > > > > > > fish. Can't say why the manufacturer > > would > > > > > > > recommend it -- I would > > > > > > > hope it wouldn't just be to increase > > sales, > > > > but > > > > > it > > > > > > > would seem obvious > > > > > > > they may not have really tried mixing > > these > > > > two > > > > > > meds > > > > > > > as a test in a > > > > > > > healthy fish-populated aquarium or I'm > > sure > > > > they > > > > > > > would have found it > > > > > > > to be detrimental. My gut feeling is that > > > > there > > > > > > may > > > > > > > be other unseen > > > > > > > factors involved when mixing these two, > > such > > > > as > > > > > > > maybe the water was > > > > > > > below a certain pH (6.6? for instance), or > > the > > > > > > water > > > > > > > was high in > > > > > > > magnesium or any number of things in these > > > > > > aquariums > > > > > > > which were not > > > > > > > ordinarily unsafe nor uncommon as all the > > > > > > aquariums > > > > > > > involved must > > > > > > > have had similar parameters, but were > > fatal > > > > when > > > > > > > these TWO meds were > > > > > > > introduced to the tank together. Maybe > > when > > > > > > mixing > > > > > > > them, you can add > > > > > > > no more than half strength of each one to > > get > > > > a > > > > > > > total treatment -- > > > > > > > that I couldn't tell you, but I can tell > > you > > > > > > mixing > > > > > > > them can be > > > > > > > fatal, even if not all the time. Although > > I > > > > > > haven't > > > > > > > heard of any > > > > > > > successful mixed treatments. Ray > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > \ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, > > > > > > "thesydmonster" > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > > > > > > > Hmmm.. it says on their web page and the > > > > > > packaging > > > > > > > that melafix and > > > > > > > > pimafix CAN be used together, that they > > are > > > > > > > complementary. What > > > > > > > > happens when you put them together that > > is > > > > > fatal > > > > > > > and why would the > > > > > > > > manufacturer recommend it, then? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul > > > > helms > > > > > > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > they should not be used together, and > > can > > > > > have > > > > > > > fatal > > > > > > > > > results when mixed at the same time. > > > > alone > > > > > > they > > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > safe...together not so much > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@c...> > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Have you started treating your tank > > with > > > > > > > anything? > > > > > > > > > > I believe certain > > > > > > > > > > medications, such as melafix and > > pimafix > > > > > -- > > > > > > > which > > > > > > > > > > can be used > > > > > > > > > > together, by the way -- cause foam > > to > > > > > > appear. > > > > > > > Sorry > > > > > > > > > > to not be of more > > > > > > > > > > help. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, > > > > "Dane > > > > > & > > > > > > > Leslie > > > > > > > > > > Moore" > > > > > > > > > > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > My water has developed a foam type > > > > > around > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > edges as well as a few > > > > > > > > > > > spots of randome floating clumps. > > The > > > > > > foam > > > > > > > is all > > > > > > > > > > along the edge of > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > tank as well as the filter, spray > > > > wand, > > > > > > > etc... > > > > > > > > > > > All the tests are fine. No > > ammonia, > > > > > > > nitrites or > > > > > > > > > > high nitrates. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I read a post a while back where > > > > someone > > > > > > > else had > > > > > > > > > > some "foam" but I > > > > > > > > > > > can't remember which group or what > > the > > > > > > > > > === message truncated === > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > > > > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home > > page > > > > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > > > Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC > > calling worldwide > > with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday > snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13993	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium medicine cabinet

Sorry. A Spelling error. It’s a product by Nishikoi called niigata clay. _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Roberts Sent: 28 July 2005 02:13 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: aquarium medicine cabinet I have no clue...it was something Nimish posted... As far as just having chlorine...the entire Chicago area is chloramines free. Most of the Chicago area gets it water form Lake Michigan, so we have the same water quality. Here is the chemical analysis from the DuPage County Water Commission: http://www.dpwc.org/2004.html Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 4:07 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: aquarium medicine cabinet Eric, Yes, I used to draw my water straight from the tap, mixing hot & cold to get the right temperature, and set up my Angelfish slates in it -- using the chlorine as a funguscide. Worked great -- never had a problem. But who has just chlorine anymore? Never heard of Nigata clay (I presume you're sure of the spelling?). Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > One thing I was told is that if you have water that just has chlorine in it > (no chloramines) that you can use the water just like that to prevent fungus > in eggs. Any comments on this? What is Nigata clay? > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Nimish Mathur > Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 1:22 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] aquarium medicine cabinet > > > I have Salt, Nigata Clay, methylene blue and melafix. Nothing else on an > occasion I had to get a treatment for dropsy/internal bacteria but apart > from that the Methylene blue is only for eggs in a separate tank and does > not go in the main tank. > > > > Nim > > > > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez > Sent: 27 July 2005 18:50 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] aquarium medicine cabinet > > > > in mine i have instant ocean salt (for my sw tanks & for fw dips), malachite > green, melafix, > marcyn & maracyn 2. > > --- FortWayneFish@a... wrote: > > > Oh wow... I see another debate starting.... > > Preventive Maintenance is key here > > Weekly waterchanges Cures and prevents Most things > > > > > > My Medicine cabinet: > > > > quick cure for ich > > Methyl blue for fungus mostly on eggs > > And Salt................ > > I also have medicated food by Jungle: anti bacterial and anti parasite > > > > rob > > Indiana > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In a message dated 7/26/2005 9:06:05 PM US Eastern Standard Time, > > Crazy4fids@a... writes: > > Hello list, > > > > What products would you recommend to keep in an aquarium medicine > cabinet? > > Obviously, something to treat ick, but what else? > > > > Which is more contagious, bacterial infections, or fungal? In what > > situations do you remove the fish to a hospital tank? Do you remove the > > infected > > fish and start treatment on that particular fish; if more than one fish > has > > it, > > would you pull them out one by one, or just treat the entire community? > > > > I know there are a lot of denominations missing here, but this has always > > > been my dilemma. With a bacteria, can you assume that everyone will get > > sick? > > > > I do have a book on fish diseases, but it gets way into scientific stuff, > > > like doing biopsies and skin scrapings. I have seen a few different > > websites > > that help to diagnose; just wondering what everyone else does. > > > > I do not have a problem now, but I just want to be prepared should someone > > > get sick. > > > > Thanks, > > > > Linda > > > > Rob > > NE Indiana > > USA > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!! > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology > > Biology > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > _____ > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13994	From: nanikjava	Date: 7/27/2005
Subject: New Discus Website

Hi Friends, I've created a website that profiles some of the Discus breeders in Indonesia. In the website your will find plenty of photos and videos of Discus along with interview with the breeders. Hope you enjoy the website, the website address is http://www.discusofindonesia.com Take care Regards

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13995	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium medicine cabinet

What does it do? Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nimish Mathur Sent: Thursday, July 28, 2005 1:43 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: aquarium medicine cabinet Sorry. A Spelling error. It’s a product by Nishikoi called niigata clay. _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Roberts Sent: 28 July 2005 02:13 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: aquarium medicine cabinet I have no clue...it was something Nimish posted... As far as just having chlorine...the entire Chicago area is chloramines free. Most of the Chicago area gets it water form Lake Michigan, so we have the same water quality. Here is the chemical analysis from the DuPage County Water Commission: http://www.dpwc.org/2004.html Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 4:07 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: aquarium medicine cabinet Eric, Yes, I used to draw my water straight from the tap, mixing hot & cold to get the right temperature, and set up my Angelfish slates in it -- using the chlorine as a funguscide. Worked great -- never had a problem. But who has just chlorine anymore? Never heard of Nigata clay (I presume you're sure of the spelling?). Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > One thing I was told is that if you have water that just has chlorine in it > (no chloramines) that you can use the water just like that to prevent fungus > in eggs. Any comments on this? What is Nigata clay? > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Nimish Mathur > Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 1:22 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] aquarium medicine cabinet > > > I have Salt, Nigata Clay, methylene blue and melafix. Nothing else on an > occasion I had to get a treatment for dropsy/internal bacteria but apart > from that the Methylene blue is only for eggs in a separate tank and does > not go in the main tank. > > > > Nim > > > > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez > Sent: 27 July 2005 18:50 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] aquarium medicine cabinet > > > > in mine i have instant ocean salt (for my sw tanks & for fw dips), malachite > green, melafix, > marcyn & maracyn 2. > > --- FortWayneFish@a... wrote: > > > Oh wow... I see another debate starting.... > > Preventive Maintenance is key here > > Weekly waterchanges Cures and prevents Most things > > > > > > My Medicine cabinet: > > > > quick cure for ich > > Methyl blue for fungus mostly on eggs > > And Salt................ > > I also have medicated food by Jungle: anti bacterial and anti parasite > > > > rob > > Indiana > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In a message dated 7/26/2005 9:06:05 PM US Eastern Standard Time, > > Crazy4fids@a... writes: > > Hello list, > > > > What products would you recommend to keep in an aquarium medicine > cabinet? > > Obviously, something to treat ick, but what else? > > > > Which is more contagious, bacterial infections, or fungal? In what > > situations do you remove the fish to a hospital tank? Do you remove the > > infected > > fish and start treatment on that particular fish; if more than one fish > has > > it, > > would you pull them out one by one, or just treat the entire community? > > > > I know there are a lot of denominations missing here, but this has always > > > been my dilemma. With a bacteria, can you assume that everyone will get > > sick? > > > > I do have a book on fish diseases, but it gets way into scientific stuff, > > > like doing biopsies and skin scrapings. I have seen a few different > > websites > > that help to diagnose; just wondering what everyone else does. > > > > I do not have a problem now, but I just want to be prepared should someone > > > get sick. > > > > Thanks, > > > > Linda > > > > Rob > > NE Indiana > > USA > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!! > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology > > Biology > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > _____ > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13996	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium medicine cabinet

Its basically a Japanese clay additive that re-instates the electrolytes in the water and does help acclimatize fish better. Apart from this, I also have it make water absolutely crystal clear in just a few hours. Cheap stuff but does some good things as fish do tend to look better after using it. There is another similar things called Easylife: www.easylife.nl <http://www.easylife.nl/> which sounds like snake oil when you read it but my experience with it has been that it does 80% of the claims. After doing some searching, I figured that Niigata clay is a major component of easylife (excluding the vitamins and water conditioner part that Seachem prime can do itself). Nim Ps: Niigata clay is cheap enough for anyone to try it once. A 200gm box costs £3 in the UK and you need 5gms to treat 100 gallons I think. Its sold as a pond stuff but hey its for fish. _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Roberts Sent: 28 July 2005 08:14 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: aquarium medicine cabinet What does it do? Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nimish Mathur Sent: Thursday, July 28, 2005 1:43 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: aquarium medicine cabinet Sorry. A Spelling error. It’s a product by Nishikoi called niigata clay. _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Roberts Sent: 28 July 2005 02:13 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: aquarium medicine cabinet I have no clue...it was something Nimish posted... As far as just having chlorine...the entire Chicago area is chloramines free. Most of the Chicago area gets it water form Lake Michigan, so we have the same water quality. Here is the chemical analysis from the DuPage County Water Commission: http://www.dpwc.org/2004.html Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 4:07 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: aquarium medicine cabinet Eric, Yes, I used to draw my water straight from the tap, mixing hot & cold to get the right temperature, and set up my Angelfish slates in it -- using the chlorine as a funguscide. Worked great -- never had a problem. But who has just chlorine anymore? Never heard of Nigata clay (I presume you're sure of the spelling?). Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > One thing I was told is that if you have water that just has chlorine in it > (no chloramines) that you can use the water just like that to prevent fungus > in eggs. Any comments on this? What is Nigata clay? > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Nimish Mathur > Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 1:22 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] aquarium medicine cabinet > > > I have Salt, Nigata Clay, methylene blue and melafix. Nothing else on an > occasion I had to get a treatment for dropsy/internal bacteria but apart > from that the Methylene blue is only for eggs in a separate tank and does > not go in the main tank. > > > > Nim > > > > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez > Sent: 27 July 2005 18:50 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] aquarium medicine cabinet > > > > in mine i have instant ocean salt (for my sw tanks & for fw dips), malachite > green, melafix, > marcyn & maracyn 2. > > --- FortWayneFish@a... wrote: > > > Oh wow... I see another debate starting.... > > Preventive Maintenance is key here > > Weekly waterchanges Cures and prevents Most things > > > > > > My Medicine cabinet: > > > > quick cure for ich > > Methyl blue for fungus mostly on eggs > > And Salt................ > > I also have medicated food by Jungle: anti bacterial and anti parasite > > > > rob > > Indiana > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In a message dated 7/26/2005 9:06:05 PM US Eastern Standard Time, > > Crazy4fids@a... writes: > > Hello list, > > > > What products would you recommend to keep in an aquarium medicine > cabinet? > > Obviously, something to treat ick, but what else? > > > > Which is more contagious, bacterial infections, or fungal? In what > > situations do you remove the fish to a hospital tank? Do you remove the > > infected > > fish and start treatment on that particular fish; if more than one fish > has > > it, > > would you pull them out one by one, or just treat the entire community? > > > > I know there are a lot of denominations missing here, but this has always > > > been my dilemma. With a bacteria, can you assume that everyone will get > > sick? > > > > I do have a book on fish diseases, but it gets way into scientific stuff, > > > like doing biopsies and skin scrapings. I have seen a few different > > websites > > that help to diagnose; just wondering what everyone else does. > > > > I do not have a problem now, but I just want to be prepared should someone > > > get sick. > > > > Thanks, > > > > Linda > > > > Rob > > NE Indiana > > USA > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!! > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology > > Biology > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > _____ > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13997	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: Question on Gouramis ?

Which gouramis do you have, specifically? All gouramis are aggressive to a greater or lesser degree. One means to lessen the aggression is to have enough tank space and enough hiding places so that each can establish a territory in the aquarium. Do note that this will only lessen the aggression, not cure it. This would naturally lead to another question, what size is your tank and how is it aquascaped? \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of ahorseofcourse66 Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 11:02 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Question on Gouramis ? Big ? We have 4 gouramis, 2 males and 2 female. Non of them will get along. The first male and female we bought fought to the point they drew blood. Now the male fights any fish you put him with and the female gets along fine with any fist but other gouramis. Now we bought another pair and they didn't get along, so we seperated them and after aweek we are trying again. They seemed to be ok for alittle while the female was currling up around the male and he seemed to not care then she started chasing him around the tank, then they started this curling around each other and holding onto each others tail and now their back to her chasing him. Which the first time we had them together he was the one chasing her. Now all he wants to do is hide. Anyone have any experence or might have some input?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13998	From: paul helms	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution (Paul Helms going off the d

bite me B@#$h --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@...> wrote: > You know Paul...There have been wonderful medical > break through's > now, You can actually have that chip on your > shoulder and the stick > that is up your ass surgically removed with minimal > side affects. > > sandra > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > <wtfmorlok@y...> > wrote: > > i am sick of ignorant ppl arguing > fact...elctricities > > nature is a fact not an opinion. speaking of how > you > > talk to ppl, telling someone to drink something > that > > they know to be fatal to fish is not exactly good > ppl > > skills > > > > > > --- Lenny Vasbinder <lnvtm1@g...> wrote: > > > > > Paul, > > > > > > I think it's about time you take a MelaFix / > PimaFix > > > cocktail so we can test your theory. > > > > > > Geeeezzzz.... take a chill pill dude! > > > > > > Besides.. God ALWAYS starts with a capital "G" > and > > > you should never use His name in vain! > > > > > > I think you implied that you own a LFS. I hope > you > > > don't talk to your customers like that. Maybe > you > > > should take a class in how to talk to people. > > > > > > Lenny Vasbinder > > > http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com > > > 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 > > > LNVTM1@g... > > > > > > Message: 13 > > > Date: Tue, 26 Jul 2005 14:19:31 -0700 (PDT) > > > From: paul helms <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > Subject: RE: Safe to use a heater? > Electrocution > > > > > > no they are not...god damn it read a freaking > book, > > > take a class , something!!!! > > > > > > --- Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@c...> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > Yes they are. > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > > > > On Behalf Of Eric Roberts > > > > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:24 PM > > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a > heater? > > > > Electrocution > > > > > > > > > > > > Aren't they grounded by the water? > > > > > > > > Eric > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > > > > On Behalf Of Dane & Leslie Moore > > > > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:17 PM > > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a > heater? > > > > Electrocution > > > > > > > > > > > > Fish are not grounded so they won't be > > > electrocuted > > > > huh? Hmmm. Lol > > > > Sorry but that's funny. > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home > page > > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs > > > __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail for Mobile Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone. http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 13999	From: paul helms	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: Electrocution

you are not 10 three times being told the same thing and by three people should be enough --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > Thank you for the answer...much better than being an > ass about it...right > Paul ;-) I do have one question about what you > wrote. You said that the > current is the measure but the force behind it is > the force. Shouldn't that > be the voltage is the measure and it the amperage > that is the force? > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Nimish Mathur > Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 8:34 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Electrocution > > > Guys, > > Some facts: > > 1. Fish in the aquarium are not grounded. > Current will not flow thru > them unless they come in-between the flow of > current. > 2. Human body is very large, In things like a > bath tub, the human body > is not really grounded but infact acts as a ground > itself. > 3. Dropping a hair dryer in the bath will not > burn the person sitting > in it. The electricity flowing thru the body will > work on the nervous system > and eventually kill it. > 4. Fish are too small to be considered as > grounding in an aquarium. It > is similar to a large swimming pool and someone > swimming in it and one drops > in a hair dryer in the pool. > > > > Why does electricity flow thru the human body in > water? > > Electricity flows in the water in form of ions. Once > a current is released > in the water, it starts to spread in a 3D field > rather then linearly as in > wires etc. This basically allows the electricity to > come in contact with any > and every surface in the water including the human > body. Now, human body is > so big and has a such a large surface area, that it > starts to work as almost > a zero resistance conductor in the water. What now > happens is very absurd, > the part of the body closer to the point of > electricity will accept in the > flowing electricity and any point further away will > start to release it just > like radiations. Why? To explain this, flow of > electricity is controlled by > a force: Potential difference or voltage. Current is > just a quantity of it > but the force that drives the current is the > voltage. A ground surface is > one that is considered at an infinitely negative > potential or something that > will always allow any current to pass thru without > offering any resistance.. > in a bath tub case: the Human body. So at a point > where we have high voltage > of current, the human body will tend to absorb the > current. now this should > absorb the current from every point then? Even the > furthest? This does not > happen because the current we are talking about is > Alternating current. > Interesting thing about the alternating current is > that in 1/100th of a > second, it is positive and the next 1/100th of a > second it is negative > (basically push and pull). This push and pull makes > the human body an > effective capacitor (do you really want me to > explain what this is and what > this does? Lol) It's the work of the body as a > capacitor that makes the flow > of minor current around the body and thru the water > many folds and thus > start to effect the entire nervous system. > > > > Fish are too small to act as a ground or something > at infinitely negative > potential and they have a too little surface area to > allow a strong > potential difference be created at 2 distant ends of > the fish and also, it > is too small to act as a capacitor. This however > does not mean that > electricity does not have effect on them.. it is > just a minute fraction of > what humans feel and the long term effect of current > in the water has been > reported on fish too. Long term is from 10days to > 3-4 months depending on > the current as well. > > > > Ofcourse, none of this would happen if the current > was DC instead of AC. > > > > Nim > > Ps: Sorry for all this but I had to shed some light > on this from my > thoughts. Been 8 years since I studied physics in > university so I could be > incorrect in some places.. > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> > 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when > replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , > .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> > 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the > web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > === message truncated === __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14000	From: paul helms	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: To Paul & Ray Re: MelaFix & PimaFix

i never said anything about treating a display tank...dunno where you even got that. he only thing that i have ever treated a display tank with was copper for hookworms that came in on fish. any way the water change issue is from two sources,number 1 the bottles which say to change water after 7 days and the pimafix.html document on ap's website which says every 3 days during treatment. very different statements both by ap. the website says 3 days for any meds while their bottles for the specific products say after 7 days. --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> wrote: > Paul, > As I have pointed out in previous posts you > only > quoted parts of A/P web site to suit your argument > and > most of what you have said is pure conjecture, you > do > not know what killed the fish in question it is an > assumption on your part, it could have been the > MelaFix or the PimaFix combining with some other > substance or medication previously administered to > the > tank, why were all these fish being treated in there > display tanks holding other fish ?, you should know > that it is not at all advisable to medicate a > display > tank, there is no valid excuse for not using a > quarantine tank, even a bucket will do. You based > some > of your statements on there site but out of context > such as your remarks on water changes, read what you > wrote on this again and then read what the site says > again. Why are you trying to bring Nimish into this, > he say he has never used PimaFix. It is Ray and > yourself that are making these rash statements. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > read the posts before directing a statement like > > that > > at me. i did use their own website for quotes, > and > > others have quoted the same text. it is the > > pimafix.html on ap's website. proof is > experience, > > same as ray and nimish! > > > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> > > wrote: > > > > > Hi Paul, > > > As I'm sure you know MelaFix and PImaFix > > are > > > manufactured by Aquarium Pharmaceuticals a > > reputable > > > American manufacturer, there web site states and > I > > > quote #1 "PimaFix has been formulated to work in > > > combination with MelaFix to enhance > effectiveness > > > against fish diseases" > > > quote #2 "University studies and laboratory > tests > > > showed that PimaFix is an effective antifungal > AND > > > antibacterial remedy for both freshwater and > > marine > > > fish. This evidence led to the granting of a > > United > > > States Patent." > > > quote #3 "MelaFix has been tested and found > > > compatible > > > with Aquarium Pharmaceuticals medications. > Mixing > > > other brands of medications is not recommended." > > > To verify my above statements visit :- > > > http://www.aquariumpharm.com?pimafix.html > > > I do not know which wed-site you looked at but > > what > > > you have stated is not on Aquarium > Pharmaceuticals > > > website. > > > What proof do you have that mixing MelaFix and > > > PimaFix kills healthy fish ? if you have some > then > > > complain to your Patent Office. > > > regards, > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > > > > > Ray, > > > > i looked up the pimafix website, and it does > not > > > say > > > > that they should be used together at all, it > > says > > > > that > > > > they are designed to work "synergistically", > > which > > > > just means to greater effect. this may only > be > > > > useful > > > > as dip, there is no information listed. the > use > > > of > > > > this language very clearly states to me that > it > > is > > > a > > > > write up by a marketing team, not researchers. > > if > > > > one > > > > takes the time to read the full statement on > the > > > > site, > > > > it states very clearly that they can be used > > > togther > > > > in EXTREME cases, not everyday use. in > addition, > > i > > > > know that we have had some "medical" > responses, > > > but > > > > these are not "medications" but rather tea > tree > > > and > > > > bay tree extracts, not true antibiotics or > anti > > > > fungals meaning not engineered to be used in > > this > > > > way. > > > > they may function well in the application, > but > > > this > > > > is hollistic not pharmaceutical. > > > > > > > > --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > Do not believe everything that you read! Do > > you > > > > > REALLY KNOW for sure > > > > > whether or not Melafix and Pimafix can be > > mixed? > > > > > > > If > > > > > not, please do > > > > > not recommend such a thing to other newer > > Forum > > > > > members who may not > > > > > know better. Paul is 100% correct on this > > one. > > > I > > > > > too have seen and > > > > > learned of many cases of hobbyists I know > > mixing > > > > > these > > > > > two "medications" together and wiping out > > their > > > > > tanks. Most of these > > > > > tanks were well established over many years > > with > > > > one > > > > > fish having a > > > > > scrape or slight sore with all the other > fish > > > > being > > > > > healthy, as in > > > > > cases that Paul has seen. By themselves, > > these > > > > > remedies are great, > > > > > so I am not trying to bash them. I am not a > > > > > chemist, so I cannot > > > > > tell you what happens when you put them > > > together, > > > > > only that it kills > > > > > fish. Can't say why the manufacturer would > > > > > recommend it -- I would > > > > > hope it wouldn't just be to increase sales, > > but > > > it > > > > > would seem obvious > > > > > they may not have really tried mixing these > > two > > > > meds > > > > > as a test in a > > > > > healthy fish-populated aquarium or I'm sure > > they > > > > > would have found it > > > > > to be detrimental. My gut feeling is that > > there > > > > may > > > > > be other unseen > > > > > factors involved when mixing these two, such > > as > > > > > maybe the water was > > > > > below a certain pH (6.6? for instance), or > the > > > > water > > > > > was high in > > > > > magnesium or any number of things in these > > > > aquariums > > > > > which were not > > > > > ordinarily unsafe nor uncommon as all the > > > > aquariums > > > > > involved must > > > > > have had similar parameters, but were fatal > === message truncated === ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14001	From: paul helms	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution

didn't cuss, freaking is not a cuss word. tired of ppl who have no idea what they are talking about posting to correct opthers. one thing when it is based on opinions another when based on fact. --- Evita <evitabug@...> wrote: > Paul, We get it but do you have to cuss a member? I > don't get why you are so angry. Evita > > paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote:no they are > not...god damn it read a freaking book, > take a class , something!!!! > > --- Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> > wrote: > > > Yes they are. > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > > On Behalf Of Eric Roberts > > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:24 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > > Electrocution > > > > > > Aren't they grounded by the water? > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > > On Behalf Of Dane & Leslie Moore > > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:17 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > > Electrocution > > > > > > Fish are not grounded so they won't be > electrocuted > > huh? Hmmm. Lol > > Sorry but that's funny. > > > > -----Original Message---- > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > > On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... > > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 9:48 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > > > > > > > > In a message dated 7/25/2005 6:47:32 P.M. Central > > Standard Time, > > wtfmorlok@... writes: > > > > toss the heater, it is no good and will > electricute > > you. ufortunately we have some folks here that > do > > not understand the > > way electricity works, and have warned you about > > fish being > > electricuted. fish are not grounded and will not > > be electricuted > > > > > > Again, your knowledge here is great information. > I > > would have never > > know > > that (same principal as bird on a wire) fish can > not > > get electrocuted. > > But who > > are you? > > > > Linda > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > when > > replying, thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > > that is NOT important > > to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the > > original message MODIFY > > the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > > subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > > matter, AquaticLife > > Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > > you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > when > > replying, thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > > that is NOT important > > to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the > > original message MODIFY > > the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > > subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > > matter, AquaticLife > > Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > > you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on > the > > web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an > email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > > Yahoo! Terms of > > Service > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > === message truncated === ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14002	From: paul helms	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy Water (now the debate on MelaFix and PimaFix)

i will not retract anything, i know what synergistically means, i have seen it and that is all the proof i need. i really do not need any posts from you directed at me any further. i will not be criticized or ordered around by you for helping people. you only seem to crawl out of your little hole to attack others peoples comments. there were no 1/2 truths or anything decietful here. we are looking at two different documents. first hand experience is not heresay. i am not going to defend myself any further to you and neither should ray or nim or anyone else for that matter. this is a forum to advise people with experience. whether you agree or disagree with what i say i really do not care to hear. if you want to post your experience to questions go ahead, but you are not helping anyone by refuting other peoples experiences or antagonizing others either. --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> wrote: > Paul, > You are using half truths and hearsay again to > try to get the better of an argument. I have quoted > the relevant statements from the A/P website in a > previous post. If you have any proof at all that > mixing MelaFix and PimaFix kills fish lets here it, > otherwise retract your statements. Incidentally > 'synergistically' means acting together or enhancing > the effect of each other !. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > i was on the pimafix website and that is not the > > language used there. i understand you got this > from > > ap's website, but that is not the onlything out > > there. > > there is really nothing to debate here. > > expperience > > shows direct contradiction. take it or leave it, > i > > am > > not gonna argue about it. i am also looking at > > aquarium pharm directly on their pimafix.html > site, > > and the wording is not the same as what you have > cut > > and pasted. you can copy and paste the link before > > for > > the full article by ap. > > > > http://www.aquariumpharm.com/pimafix.html > > > > direct snip of full paragraph- > > > > In extreme cases of especially stubborn > infections, > > PimaFix has been designed to work synergistically > > with > > MelaFix. Using PimaFix and MelaFix together > provides > > the added benefit of quick tissue regeneration and > > wound healing. > > > > > > --- Lenny Vasbinder <lnvtm1@...> wrote: > > > > > Here are cut and paste product descriptions and > > > FAQ's from Melafix and Pimafix... well, there > were > > > no FAQ's on Pimafix but the product description > > says > > > "PimaFix has been formulated to work in > > combination > > > with MelaFix to enhance effectiveness against > fish > > > diseases"... among other things. These snips > are > > > directly from the Aquarium Pharmaceuticals web > > site. > > > > > > MelaFix® > > > > > > Heals open wounds & abrasions, treats fin and > tail > > > rot, eye cloud, mouth fungus and promotes > regrowth > > > of damaged fin rays & tissue. Will not adversely > > > affect the biological filter, alter the pH, or > > > discolor water. Safe for reef aquariums and live > > > plants. For use in fresh or salt water. > > > > > > MelaFix FAQ's- > > > > > > Can MelaFix be used with other medications? > > > > > > MelaFix has been tested and found compatible > with > > > Aquarium Pharmaceuticals medications. Mixing > > other > > > brands of medications is not recommended. > > > > > > Is MelaFix harmful to aquatic plants? > > > > > > MelaFix can be used in aquariums and ponds > > > containing live plants. > > > > > > Will MelaFix kill snails? > > > > > > No. > > > > > > Can I use MelaFix in aquariums containing > > freshwater > > > crabs and shrimp? > > > > > > Yes. > > > > > > Will MelaFix hurt saltwater invertebrates? > > > > > > No. MelaFix is reef-compatible. MelaFix has been > > > shown to promote the healing of damaged coral > > > tissue. > > > > > > I have a protein skimmer. Will MelaFix cause > > > foaming? > > > > > > MelaFix will cause some increased foaming during > > the > > > treatment. We recommend turning the skimmer down > > or > > > off during treatment with MelaFix. > > > > > > Do I have to remove the activated carbon from my > > > filter when treating with MelaFix? > > > > > > We suggest removing the carbon while treating > with > > > any medication. > > > > > > > > > > > > PimaFix > > > > > > Treats fungal infections and both internal and > > > external bacterial infections. Will not > adversely > > > affect the biological filter, alter the pH, or > > > discolor water. Safe for reef aquariums and live > > > plants. For use in fresh or salt water. PimaFix > > has > > > been formulated to work in combination with > > MelaFix > > > to enhance effectiveness against fish diseases. > > > > > > > > > Lenny Vasbinder > > > http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com > > > 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 > > > LNVTM1@... > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > > protection around > > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC > calling worldwide with voicemail > http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14003	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium medicine cabinet

Nim, Nishikoi Niigata Clay is an additive (montmorillonite) in Nishikoi Niigata Professional Koi Pellets food, which has calcium and many trace elements and is supposed to promote the health of Koi. It is primarily used by the company to simulate the benefits of a natural clay bottom pond and is marketed as Nishikoi Niigata Nishi- Clay. A small quantity of the product is disolved in pond water and is then poured around the perimeter of the pond. This will make the water milky looking, but clears up in a couple of hours. It has the effect of adding necessary elements to enhance health and growth directly to the water. Can't say if it works, but Nishikoi is a well known and respected Japanese company mostly dealing with high quality Koi foods. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@y...> wrote: > Sorry. A Spelling error. It's a product by Nishikoi called niigata clay. > > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Eric Roberts > Sent: 28 July 2005 02:13 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: aquarium medicine cabinet > > > > I have no clue...it was something Nimish posted... > > As far as just having chlorine...the entire Chicago area is chloramines > free. Most of the Chicago area gets it water form Lake Michigan, so we have > the same water quality. Here is the chemical analysis from the DuPage > County Water Commission: http://www.dpwc.org/2004.html > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 4:07 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: aquarium medicine cabinet > > > Eric, Yes, I used to draw my water straight from the tap, mixing hot > & cold to get the right temperature, and set up my Angelfish slates > in it -- using the chlorine as a funguscide. Worked great -- never > had a problem. But who has just chlorine anymore? Never heard of > Nigata clay (I presume you're sure of the spelling?). Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > > One thing I was told is that if you have water that just has > chlorine in it > > (no chloramines) that you can use the water just like that to > prevent fungus > > in eggs. Any comments on this? What is Nigata clay? > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Nimish Mathur > > Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 1:22 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] aquarium medicine cabinet > > > > > > I have Salt, Nigata Clay, methylene blue and melafix. Nothing else > on an > > occasion I had to get a treatment for dropsy/internal bacteria but > apart > > from that the Methylene blue is only for eggs in a separate tank > and does > > not go in the main tank. > > > > > > > > Nim > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez > > Sent: 27 July 2005 18:50 > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] aquarium medicine cabinet > > > > > > > > in mine i have instant ocean salt (for my sw tanks & for fw dips), > malachite > > green, melafix, > > marcyn & maracyn 2. > > > > --- FortWayneFish@a... wrote: > > > > > Oh wow... I see another debate starting.... > > > Preventive Maintenance is key here > > > Weekly waterchanges Cures and prevents Most things > > > > > > > > > My Medicine cabinet: > > > > > > quick cure for ich > > > Methyl blue for fungus mostly on eggs > > > And Salt................ > > > I also have medicated food by Jungle: anti bacterial and anti > parasite > > > > > > rob > > > Indiana > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In a message dated 7/26/2005 9:06:05 PM US Eastern Standard Time, > > > Crazy4fids@a... writes: > > > Hello list, > > > > > > What products would you recommend to keep in an aquarium medicine > > cabinet? > > > Obviously, something to treat ick, but what else? > > > > > > Which is more contagious, bacterial infections, or fungal? In > what > > > situations do you remove the fish to a hospital tank? Do you > remove the > > > infected > > > fish and start treatment on that particular fish; if more than > one fish > > has > > > it, > > > would you pull them out one by one, or just treat the entire > community? > > > > > > I know there are a lot of denominations missing here, but this > has always > > > > > been my dilemma. With a bacteria, can you assume that everyone > will get > > > sick? > > > > > > I do have a book on fish diseases, but it gets way into > scientific stuff, > > > > > like doing biopsies and skin scrapings. I have seen a few > different > > > websites > > > that help to diagnose; just wondering what everyone else does. > > > > > > I do not have a problem now, but I just want to be prepared > should someone > > > > > get sick. > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > Linda > > > > > > Rob > > > NE Indiana > > > USA > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > > My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > > > > > Marine > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? > t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology > > > > Biology > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? > t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > _____ > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14004	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium medicine cabinet

Yep, if it works for Koi, whats preventing it to work on other fish? Yes, ok, maybe t does add a bit of calcium but I got another friend who keeps discus to use it and he is also happy with it. Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: 28 July 2005 13:03 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: aquarium medicine cabinet Nim, Nishikoi Niigata Clay is an additive (montmorillonite) in Nishikoi Niigata Professional Koi Pellets food, which has calcium and many trace elements and is supposed to promote the health of Koi. It is primarily used by the company to simulate the benefits of a natural clay bottom pond and is marketed as Nishikoi Niigata Nishi- Clay. A small quantity of the product is disolved in pond water and is then poured around the perimeter of the pond. This will make the water milky looking, but clears up in a couple of hours. It has the effect of adding necessary elements to enhance health and growth directly to the water. Can't say if it works, but Nishikoi is a well known and respected Japanese company mostly dealing with high quality Koi foods. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@y...> wrote: > Sorry. A Spelling error. It's a product by Nishikoi called niigata clay. > > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Eric Roberts > Sent: 28 July 2005 02:13 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: aquarium medicine cabinet > > > > I have no clue...it was something Nimish posted... > > As far as just having chlorine...the entire Chicago area is chloramines > free. Most of the Chicago area gets it water form Lake Michigan, so we have > the same water quality. Here is the chemical analysis from the DuPage > County Water Commission: http://www.dpwc.org/2004.html > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 4:07 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: aquarium medicine cabinet > > > Eric, Yes, I used to draw my water straight from the tap, mixing hot > & cold to get the right temperature, and set up my Angelfish slates > in it -- using the chlorine as a funguscide. Worked great -- never > had a problem. But who has just chlorine anymore? Never heard of > Nigata clay (I presume you're sure of the spelling?). Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > > One thing I was told is that if you have water that just has > chlorine in it > > (no chloramines) that you can use the water just like that to > prevent fungus > > in eggs. Any comments on this? What is Nigata clay? > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Nimish Mathur > > Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 1:22 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] aquarium medicine cabinet > > > > > > I have Salt, Nigata Clay, methylene blue and melafix. Nothing else > on an > > occasion I had to get a treatment for dropsy/internal bacteria but > apart > > from that the Methylene blue is only for eggs in a separate tank > and does > > not go in the main tank. > > > > > > > > Nim > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez > > Sent: 27 July 2005 18:50 > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] aquarium medicine cabinet > > > > > > > > in mine i have instant ocean salt (for my sw tanks & for fw dips), > malachite > > green, melafix, > > marcyn & maracyn 2. > > > > --- FortWayneFish@a... wrote: > > > > > Oh wow... I see another debate starting.... > > > Preventive Maintenance is key here > > > Weekly waterchanges Cures and prevents Most things > > > > > > > > > My Medicine cabinet: > > > > > > quick cure for ich > > > Methyl blue for fungus mostly on eggs > > > And Salt................ > > > I also have medicated food by Jungle: anti bacterial and anti > parasite > > > > > > rob > > > Indiana > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In a message dated 7/26/2005 9:06:05 PM US Eastern Standard Time, > > > Crazy4fids@a... writes: > > > Hello list, > > > > > > What products would you recommend to keep in an aquarium medicine > > cabinet? > > > Obviously, something to treat ick, but what else? > > > > > > Which is more contagious, bacterial infections, or fungal? In > what > > > situations do you remove the fish to a hospital tank? Do you > remove the > > > infected > > > fish and start treatment on that particular fish; if more than > one fish > > has > > > it, > > > would you pull them out one by one, or just treat the entire > community? > > > > > > I know there are a lot of denominations missing here, but this > has always > > > > > been my dilemma. With a bacteria, can you assume that everyone > will get > > > sick? > > > > > > I do have a book on fish diseases, but it gets way into > scientific stuff, > > > > > like doing biopsies and skin scrapings. I have seen a few > different > > > websites > > > that help to diagnose; just wondering what everyone else does. > > > > > > I do not have a problem now, but I just want to be prepared > should someone > > > > > get sick. > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > Linda > > > > > > Rob > > > NE Indiana > > > USA > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > > My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > > > > > Marine > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? > t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology > > > > Biology > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? > t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > _____ > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14005	From: Evita	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution (Paul Helms going off the d

You seem to be showing your true intelligence. Evita paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: bite me B@#$h --- Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@...> wrote: > You know Paul...There have been wonderful medical > break through's > now, You can actually have that chip on your > shoulder and the stick > that is up your ass surgically removed with minimal > side affects. > > sandra > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > <wtfmorlok@y...> > wrote: > > i am sick of ignorant ppl arguing > fact...elctricities > > nature is a fact not an opinion. speaking of how > you > > talk to ppl, telling someone to drink something > that > > they know to be fatal to fish is not exactly good > ppl > > skills > > > > > > --- Lenny Vasbinder <lnvtm1@g...> wrote: > > > > > Paul, > > > > > > I think it's about time you take a MelaFix / > PimaFix > > > cocktail so we can test your theory. > > > > > > Geeeezzzz.... take a chill pill dude! > > > > > > Besides.. God ALWAYS starts with a capital "G" > and > > > you should never use His name in vain! > > > > > > I think you implied that you own a LFS. I hope > you > > > don't talk to your customers like that. Maybe > you > > > should take a class in how to talk to people. > > > > > > Lenny Vasbinder > > > http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com > > > 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 > > > LNVTM1@g... > > > > > > Message: 13 > > > Date: Tue, 26 Jul 2005 14:19:31 -0700 (PDT) > > > From: paul helms <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > Subject: RE: Safe to use a heater? > Electrocution > > > > > > no they are not...god damn it read a freaking > book, > > > take a class , something!!!! > > > > > > --- Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@c...> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > Yes they are. > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > > > > On Behalf Of Eric Roberts > > > > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:24 PM > > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a > heater? > > > > Electrocution > > > > > > > > > > > > Aren't they grounded by the water? > > > > > > > > Eric > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > > > > On Behalf Of Dane & Leslie Moore > > > > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:17 PM > > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a > heater? > > > > Electrocution > > > > > > > > > > > > Fish are not grounded so they won't be > > > electrocuted > > > > huh? Hmmm. Lol > > > > Sorry but that's funny. > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home > page > > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs > > > __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail for Mobile Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone. http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14006	From: Evita	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution

Paul, I see your so smart But I was speaking of the gd word. You have some personal issues. Evita paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote:didn't cuss, freaking is not a cuss word. tired of ppl who have no idea what they are talking about posting to correct opthers. one thing when it is based on opinions another when based on fact. --- Evita <evitabug@...> wrote: > Paul, We get it but do you have to cuss a member? I > don't get why you are so angry. Evita > > paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote:no they are > not...god damn it read a freaking book, > take a class , something!!!! > > --- Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> > wrote: > > > Yes they are. > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > > On Behalf Of Eric Roberts > > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:24 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > > Electrocution > > > > > > Aren't they grounded by the water? > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > > On Behalf Of Dane & Leslie Moore > > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:17 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > > Electrocution > > > > > > Fish are not grounded so they won't be > electrocuted > > huh? Hmmm. Lol > > Sorry but that's funny. > > > > -----Original Message---- > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > > On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... > > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 9:48 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > > > > > > > > In a message dated 7/25/2005 6:47:32 P.M. Central > > Standard Time, > > wtfmorlok@... writes: > > > > toss the heater, it is no good and will > electricute > > you. ufortunately we have some folks here that > do > > not understand the > > way electricity works, and have warned you about > > fish being > > electricuted. fish are not grounded and will not > > be electricuted > > > > > > Again, your knowledge here is great information. > I > > would have never > > know > > that (same principal as bird on a wire) fish can > not > > get electrocuted. > > But who > > are you? > > > > Linda > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > when > > replying, thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > > that is NOT important > > to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the > > original message MODIFY > > the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > > subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > > matter, AquaticLife > > Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > > you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > when > > replying, thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > > that is NOT important > > to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the > > original message MODIFY > > the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > > subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > > matter, AquaticLife > > Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > > you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on > the > > web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an > email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > > Yahoo! Terms of > > Service > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > === message truncated === ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14007	From: Patrick	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: To Paul & Ray Re: MelaFix & PimaFix

Do you have to oppose what Paul says even if what you say makes no sense? I guess you went to an ivy league school to learn the art of debate: make your opponent look bad and you don't have to debate anything. You are guilty of lible and slander yourself for saying things that are clearly unsuported and possibly complete lies. Paul keeps quoting the website and the bottle to show the difference in insturctions between them, while you set back and just say he is telling lies. Patrick -------Original Message------- Hi Ray, I included your name because you appeared to be siding with and supporting Paul's statements. I am only trying to bring out the truth. Paul has used these half truths and partial quote tactics on more than one occasion before, then when he is shown to be incorrect he resorts to abusive posts. In this case we have a reputable manufacturer who states that one of the two products in question, PimaFix has been formulated to work in combination with the other, MelaFix. Common sense tells me that that does not form a deadly cocktail, if these two medications have any bearing on the death of the fish in question I suggest it is due to one or more other substances being present in the tank water, probably other medications or water additives. In which case it is pure speculation and most unfair and very likely liable to blame and name MelaFix and PimaFix in public. There must be many thousands of aquarists world wide using or have used these to products in combination, if there was any truth in the accusation that they produce a deadly cocktail there would be thousands of complaints. Have you ever heard of this before this incident ?. Aquarists will have killed very many fish by using two or more medications at the same time without specific recommendation. regards, unclenorm. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14008	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution

Instead of being an asshole, you could of explained, like Nimish did. Instead, it seems you can only be an ass. So go fuck yourself Paul. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of paul helms Sent: Thursday, July 28, 2005 6:19 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? Electrocution didn't cuss, freaking is not a cuss word. tired of ppl who have no idea what they are talking about posting to correct opthers. one thing when it is based on opinions another when based on fact. --- Evita <evitabug@...> wrote: > Paul, We get it but do you have to cuss a member? I > don't get why you are so angry. Evita > > paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote:no they are > not...god damn it read a freaking book, > take a class , something!!!! > > --- Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> > wrote: > > > Yes they are. > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > > On Behalf Of Eric Roberts > > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:24 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > > Electrocution > > > > > > Aren't they grounded by the water? > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > > On Behalf Of Dane & Leslie Moore > > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 10:17 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > > Electrocution > > > > > > Fish are not grounded so they won't be > electrocuted > > huh? Hmmm. Lol > > Sorry but that's funny. > > > > -----Original Message---- > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > > On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... > > Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 9:48 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? > > > > > > > > In a message dated 7/25/2005 6:47:32 P.M. Central > > Standard Time, > > wtfmorlok@... writes: > > > > toss the heater, it is no good and will > electricute > > you. ufortunately we have some folks here that > do > > not understand the > > way electricity works, and have warned you about > > fish being > > electricuted. fish are not grounded and will not > > be electricuted > > > > > > Again, your knowledge here is great information. > I > > would have never > > know > > that (same principal as bird on a wire) fish can > not > > get electrocuted. > > But who > > are you? > > > > Linda > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > when > > replying, thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > > that is NOT important > > to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the > > original message MODIFY > > the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > > subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > > matter, AquaticLife > > Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > > you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it > when > > replying, thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > > that is NOT important > > to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the > > original message MODIFY > > the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > > subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > > matter, AquaticLife > > Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > > you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on > the > > web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an > email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > > Yahoo! Terms of > > Service > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > === message truncated === ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14009	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: New guys in the tank (now Acronym... DH.. lol)

LOL, Lenny, depending on what he's been up to lately, it's Darlin Hubby, or Darn Hubby. :D > Cynthia, > > I've seen you refer to your "DH" on several occasions but I have not been able to figure out what DH stands for.... Dear Hubby, Dumb Husband, Domestic Help, a few expletive deleted's... what is it? Inquiring minds want to know. :-P

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14010	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: New guys in the tank

Ooh, now he's interested and downstairs on the other computer doing a search. LOL This from the guy who didn't want a fish tank :o > hehe Wait till he sees a Honey gourami (sometimes refered to as a marigold > gourami).

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14011	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: New guys in the tank

Err.....I mean the gourami that looks orange and blue striped with a more flowy blue tail than any other gourami I've seen so far. They didn't have the latin names on the tanks, and the guy had just gotten a shipment of fish in and was a bit busy, so I didn't ask. But tankies for the heads up...if they're aggressive, frankly, I don't want them. > By "Paradise Goarami," do you mean the Macropodus genera (spechti, > concolor, etc.) or the Pseudosphromenus genera (cupanus, dayi) species? > > FYI: Not sure how friendly the former will be towards your Betta > splendid juveniles. The former are agressive outside of its own > species. I have not witnessed any aggression by the latter. > > --TommyBoy

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14012	From: harry perry	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: The electrocution thread ends now!!!!!!! To All

This thread has gone way too far. Only children throw stones and call names. Continion this thread and I will delete everyone involved. Our members are here to talk about fish, not each other. Harry __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14013	From: harry perry	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: An Important message to all.

Paul Helmes and Eric Roberts have been banned from this group. Children use this group (besides the 2 I deleted). Name calling and foul language will not be tolerated. Harry __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14014	From: Patrick	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: An Important message to all.

I'm leaving this group. I will not stay in a group that bans people like Paul. Patrick -------Original Message------- Paul Helmes and Eric Roberts have been banned from this group. Children use this group (besides the 2 I deleted). Name calling and foul language will not be tolerated. Harry [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14015	From: harry perry	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: An Important message to all.To Patrick

It's not about you and Paul it's about our members and their children. Harry Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: I'm leaving this group. I will not stay in a group that bans people like Paul. Patrick -------Original Message------- Paul Helmes and Eric Roberts have been banned from this group. Children use this group (besides the 2 I deleted). Name calling and foul language will not be tolerated. Harry [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14016	From: Daniel	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Cherry shrimp

I bought just one cherry shrimp from the Aquarium store a copy of weeks ago because the shrimp had a bunch of eggs on her.I only bought 1 because they cost alot for a little shrimp like that. Well I put her by herself so that nothing would eat her.I looked in the tank the other day and saw that the baby shrmp had hatched and were moving around ,very small looking shrimp and very neat to watch them.Well I took the mother out because I wasnt sure if she would eat them.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14017	From: Daniel	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Central Filtration idea?/Automation?

In the near future I am plannig on building me a building with 30 or more tanks in it for breeding.The Fish will need the same water quality and I wanted to use central filtration for the tanks and automate all of the water changes and such.I am not sure the chooses I had about drilling or not drilling the tanks and how the plumming would be routed to the tanks and filter. >does anyone have a setup like that and maybe could put up some picture or decribe the setup? >Or does anyone know any good sites that will show you how to setup a central filtration system or any DIY automation for it? >also if anyone has any kind breeding setups and could share some pictures of it that would be great. Thanks Daniel

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14018	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: An Important message to all.

Its sad that Harry had to take this decision but as a moderator I think he had no option :-(. I hope that it can be retracted as both Paul and Eric have been very active members in the group and it will not be the same without them. Harry and other moderators, please do reconsider the decision and rather then banning members, if possible to put the posting on moderation. Patrick, I hope you have also changed your decision to leave the group. This is one of the most active groups I have been a member of and I personally don't want it to suffer for what so ever reasons. Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Patrick Sent: 28 July 2005 17:26 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] An Important message to all. I'm leaving this group. I will not stay in a group that bans people like Paul. Patrick -------Original Message------- Paul Helmes and Eric Roberts have been banned from this group. Children use this group (besides the 2 I deleted). Name calling and foul language will not be tolerated. Harry [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14019	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: Cherry shrimp

Congratulations! I have been looking for the cherry red shrimp but cannot find any in my area. I only want one or two, so aquabid is out. Good luck with your babies! Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Daniel" <daniel@t...> wrote: > I bought just one cherry shrimp from the Aquarium store a copy of > weeks ago because the shrimp had a bunch of eggs on her.I only bought > 1 because they cost alot for a little shrimp like that. > Well I put her by herself so that nothing would eat her.I looked in > the tank the other day and saw that the baby shrmp had hatched and > were moving around ,very small looking shrimp and very neat to watch > them.Well I took the mother out because I wasnt sure if she would eat > them.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14020	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: Cherry shrimp

Although I could be mistaken, I do not think the parents eat the baby shrimp. Perhaps someone with more shrimp experience will come along and tell us more about them :) Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Daniel" <daniel@t...> wrote: > I bought just one cherry shrimp from the Aquarium store a copy of > weeks ago because the shrimp had a bunch of eggs on her.I only bought > 1 because they cost alot for a little shrimp like that. > Well I put her by herself so that nothing would eat her.I looked in > the tank the other day and saw that the baby shrmp had hatched and > were moving around ,very small looking shrimp and very neat to watch > them.Well I took the mother out because I wasnt sure if she would eat > them.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14021	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: name calling and pointless agruements

I have been listening to the name calling and pointless arguments here now for at least two days. I would say enough is enough! Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. Everyone has the free will and sensibility to make their own judgement call on the advice and information posted on this list. Most of us are here to learn all they can about what works and doesn't work in the hobby of tropical fish. It is good to see that there is more than one way to do something. If you want to continue with the name calling and the arguing, maybe you should take it off the list and contact the person whom you are arguing with personally. I would hate to see someone get thrown off the list. Everyone's opinion is quite valuable (to me)! Moderator: maybe you could put an "END OF DISCUSSION" on this one. Just my opinion, Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14022	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium medicine cabinet

Can't say whether Nishikoi Niigata Nishi-Clay would be benefitial for Discus or not, but it sounds like it might be worth a try. As your friend uses it with Discus with good results, why argue with success? The Nishikoi company makes quality products, mainly foods for the Koi hobby and although these foods may not be top of the line, they're very popular with those hobbyists yielding consistantly good results. I've never had a call for Nishikoi's Niigata Professional Koi Pellets, But have sold tons of their Staple, Growth and Wheat-Germ Pellets in buckets up to 22 lbs. A pond full of 36" Koi can go through a bucket fast. Could be the (Niigata) Nishi-Clay and Professional pellets need more advertising. As you say, the water additive should work with most any fish. By the looks of it Nim, from the appearance of your medicine cabinet it looks like you use it although haven't said for what type fish, or if regularly dosed periodically or used as a medication and for what. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@y...> wrote: > Yep, if it works for Koi, whats preventing it to work on other fish? Yes, > ok, maybe t does add a bit of calcium but I got another friend who keeps > discus to use it and he is also happy with it. > > Nim > > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: 28 July 2005 13:03 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: aquarium medicine cabinet > > > > Nim, Nishikoi Niigata Clay is an additive (montmorillonite) in > Nishikoi Niigata Professional Koi Pellets food, which has calcium and > many trace elements and is supposed to promote the health of Koi. It > is primarily used by the company to simulate the benefits of a > natural clay bottom pond and is marketed as Nishikoi Niigata Nishi- > Clay. A small quantity of the product is disolved in pond water and > is then poured around the perimeter of the pond. This will make the > water milky looking, but clears up in a couple of hours. It has the > effect of adding necessary elements to enhance health and growth > directly to the water. Can't say if it works, but Nishikoi is a well > known and respected Japanese company mostly dealing with high quality > Koi foods. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@y...> > wrote: > > Sorry. A Spelling error. It's a product by Nishikoi called niigata > clay. > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Eric Roberts > > Sent: 28 July 2005 02:13 > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: aquarium medicine cabinet > > > > > > > > I have no clue...it was something Nimish posted... > > > > As far as just having chlorine...the entire Chicago area is > chloramines > > free. Most of the Chicago area gets it water form Lake Michigan, > so we have > > the same water quality. Here is the chemical analysis from the > DuPage > > County Water Commission: http://www.dpwc.org/2004.html > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > > Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 4:07 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: aquarium medicine cabinet > > > > > > Eric, Yes, I used to draw my water straight from the tap, mixing > hot > > & cold to get the right temperature, and set up my Angelfish slates > > in it -- using the chlorine as a funguscide. Worked great -- never > > had a problem. But who has just chlorine anymore? Never heard of > > Nigata clay (I presume you're sure of the spelling?). > Ray > > > \ > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> > wrote: > > > One thing I was told is that if you have water that just has > > chlorine in it > > > (no chloramines) that you can use the water just like that to > > prevent fungus > > > in eggs. Any comments on this? What is Nigata clay? > > > > > > Eric > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > Behalf Of Nimish Mathur > > > Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 1:22 PM > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] aquarium medicine cabinet > > > > > > > > > I have Salt, Nigata Clay, methylene blue and melafix. Nothing > else > > on an > > > occasion I had to get a treatment for dropsy/internal bacteria > but > > apart > > > from that the Methylene blue is only for eggs in a separate tank > > and does > > > not go in the main tank. > > > > > > > > > > > > Nim > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez > > > Sent: 27 July 2005 18:50 > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] aquarium medicine cabinet > > > > > > > > > > > > in mine i have instant ocean salt (for my sw tanks & for fw > dips), > > malachite > > > green, melafix, > > > marcyn & maracyn 2. > > > > > > --- FortWayneFish@a... wrote: > > > > > > > Oh wow... I see another debate starting.... > > > > Preventive Maintenance is key here > > > > Weekly waterchanges Cures and prevents Most things > > > > > > > > > > > > My Medicine cabinet: > > > > > > > > quick cure for ich > > > > Methyl blue for fungus mostly on eggs > > > > And Salt................ > > > > I also have medicated food by Jungle: anti bacterial and anti > > parasite > > > > > > > > rob > > > > Indiana > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In a message dated 7/26/2005 9:06:05 PM US Eastern Standard > Time, > > > > Crazy4fids@a... writes: > > > > Hello list, > > > > > > > > What products would you recommend to keep in an aquarium > medicine > > > cabinet? > > > > Obviously, something to treat ick, but what else? > > > > > > > > Which is more contagious, bacterial infections, or fungal? In > > what > > > > situations do you remove the fish to a hospital tank? Do you > > remove the > > > > infected > > > > fish and start treatment on that particular fish; if more than > > one fish > > > has > > > > it, > > > > would you pull them out one by one, or just treat the entire > > community? > > > > > > > > I know there are a lot of denominations missing here, but this > > has always > > > > > > > been my dilemma. With a bacteria, can you assume that everyone > > will get > > > > sick? > > > > > > > > I do have a book on fish diseases, but it gets way into > > scientific stuff, > > > > > > > like doing biopsies and skin scrapings. I have seen a few > > different > > > > websites > > > > that help to diagnose; just wondering what everyone else does. > > > > > > > > I do not have a problem now, but I just want to be prepared > > should someone > > > > > > > get sick. > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > > > Linda > > > > > > > > Rob > > > > NE Indiana > > > > USA > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > > > My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > ((((º> > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > > thanks. > > > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > > important to > > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message > MODIFY > > the > > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > > > > > > > > Marine > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? > > t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > > > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology > > > > > > Biology > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? > > t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > > > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > ((((º> > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > > thanks. > > > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > > important to > > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message > MODIFY > > the > > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms > of > > Service > > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology > > Biology > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > _____ > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14023	From: John Gonzalez	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: An Important message to all.

I'm new to this forum group & i've gathered alot of information just in a short time. There are alot of knowledgeable people who contribute in this forum. On the flip side I've also seen heated debates & just condescending remarks & name calling to some who are just looking for some info, or have another opinion. The main reason I joined is to gather info & help me out in my hobby. So what if the question has been asked a million times. We were all new at this hobby at one point & as we get seasoned into this hobby it's our turn to spread the info around. That's what forums are here for..gather info & discuss old & new technology in our hobby. We just need to re-group & compose ourselves & think for a moment that this is a HOBBY!! If the person you are trying to help out still thinks his or her is a better way then by all means let that person do their thing. If it crashes then they learn from their mistake. Everyone will have their own opinion. We just need to refrain from name calling & bashing each other. Just my 2 cents. --- Nimish Mathur <nimmat4@...> wrote: > Its sad that Harry had to take this decision but as > a moderator I think he > had no option :-(. I hope that it can be retracted > as both Paul and Eric > have been very active members in the group and it > will not be the same > without them. > > > > Harry and other moderators, please do reconsider the > decision and rather > then banning members, if possible to put the posting > on moderation. > > > > Patrick, I hope you have also changed your decision > to leave the group. This > is one of the most active groups I have been a > member of and I personally > don't want it to suffer for what so ever reasons. > > > > Nim > > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Patrick > Sent: 28 July 2005 17:26 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] An Important message to > all. > > > > I'm leaving this group. I will not stay in a group > that bans people like > Paul. > > > Patrick > -------Original Message------- > Paul Helmes and Eric Roberts have been banned from > this group. Children use > this group (besides the 2 I deleted). Name calling > and foul language will > not be tolerated. > > Harry > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> > 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when > replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , > .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for > you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> > 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> > > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the > web. > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of > Service. > > > > _____ > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14024	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: name calling and pointless agruements

Sorry list, I guess I should have read all my emails first. My apologies, Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14025	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium medicine cabinet

Hi Ray, Yes, I should have been more specific about it. I use nishikoi nigata clay (which comes as a powder to be mixed in water thoroughly and then poured over the tank/pond) in my general community tank on a every 2 week basis (after water change) and on the mbuna tank on a weekly basis (regardless of water change). The betta tank and other small tanks are once a month and after a water change. What I noticed with this was that the fish tend to display better colours and with time their colours seem to develop better. This was most evident in the harlequin rasbora and cardinal tetera. Since I started using this stuff, I have stopped having dead cardinals despite the fact that my water is as hard as a rock and very alkaline. Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: 28 July 2005 18:36 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: aquarium medicine cabinet Can't say whether Nishikoi Niigata Nishi-Clay would be benefitial for Discus or not, but it sounds like it might be worth a try. As your friend uses it with Discus with good results, why argue with success? The Nishikoi company makes quality products, mainly foods for the Koi hobby and although these foods may not be top of the line, they're very popular with those hobbyists yielding consistantly good results. I've never had a call for Nishikoi's Niigata Professional Koi Pellets, But have sold tons of their Staple, Growth and Wheat-Germ Pellets in buckets up to 22 lbs. A pond full of 36" Koi can go through a bucket fast. Could be the (Niigata) Nishi-Clay and Professional pellets need more advertising. As you say, the water additive should work with most any fish. By the looks of it Nim, from the appearance of your medicine cabinet it looks like you use it although haven't said for what type fish, or if regularly dosed periodically or used as a medication and for what. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@y...> wrote: > Yep, if it works for Koi, whats preventing it to work on other fish? Yes, > ok, maybe t does add a bit of calcium but I got another friend who keeps > discus to use it and he is also happy with it. > > Nim > > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: 28 July 2005 13:03 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: aquarium medicine cabinet > > > > Nim, Nishikoi Niigata Clay is an additive (montmorillonite) in > Nishikoi Niigata Professional Koi Pellets food, which has calcium and > many trace elements and is supposed to promote the health of Koi. It > is primarily used by the company to simulate the benefits of a > natural clay bottom pond and is marketed as Nishikoi Niigata Nishi- > Clay. A small quantity of the product is disolved in pond water and > is then poured around the perimeter of the pond. This will make the > water milky looking, but clears up in a couple of hours. It has the > effect of adding necessary elements to enhance health and growth > directly to the water. Can't say if it works, but Nishikoi is a well > known and respected Japanese company mostly dealing with high quality > Koi foods. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@y...> > wrote: > > Sorry. A Spelling error. It's a product by Nishikoi called niigata > clay. > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Eric Roberts > > Sent: 28 July 2005 02:13 > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: aquarium medicine cabinet > > > > > > > > I have no clue...it was something Nimish posted... > > > > As far as just having chlorine...the entire Chicago area is > chloramines > > free. Most of the Chicago area gets it water form Lake Michigan, > so we have > > the same water quality. Here is the chemical analysis from the > DuPage > > County Water Commission: http://www.dpwc.org/2004.html > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > > Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 4:07 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: aquarium medicine cabinet > > > > > > Eric, Yes, I used to draw my water straight from the tap, mixing > hot > > & cold to get the right temperature, and set up my Angelfish slates > > in it -- using the chlorine as a funguscide. Worked great -- never > > had a problem. But who has just chlorine anymore? Never heard of > > Nigata clay (I presume you're sure of the spelling?). > Ray > > > \ > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> > wrote: > > > One thing I was told is that if you have water that just has > > chlorine in it > > > (no chloramines) that you can use the water just like that to > > prevent fungus > > > in eggs. Any comments on this? What is Nigata clay? > > > > > > Eric > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > Behalf Of Nimish Mathur > > > Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 1:22 PM > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] aquarium medicine cabinet > > > > > > > > > I have Salt, Nigata Clay, methylene blue and melafix. Nothing > else > > on an > > > occasion I had to get a treatment for dropsy/internal bacteria > but > > apart > > > from that the Methylene blue is only for eggs in a separate tank > > and does > > > not go in the main tank. > > > > > > > > > > > > Nim > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez > > > Sent: 27 July 2005 18:50 > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] aquarium medicine cabinet > > > > > > > > > > > > in mine i have instant ocean salt (for my sw tanks & for fw > dips), > > malachite > > > green, melafix, > > > marcyn & maracyn 2. > > > > > > --- FortWayneFish@a... wrote: > > > > > > > Oh wow... I see another debate starting.... > > > > Preventive Maintenance is key here > > > > Weekly waterchanges Cures and prevents Most things > > > > > > > > > > > > My Medicine cabinet: > > > > > > > > quick cure for ich > > > > Methyl blue for fungus mostly on eggs > > > > And Salt................ > > > > I also have medicated food by Jungle: anti bacterial and anti > > parasite > > > > > > > > rob > > > > Indiana > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In a message dated 7/26/2005 9:06:05 PM US Eastern Standard > Time, > > > > Crazy4fids@a... writes: > > > > Hello list, > > > > > > > > What products would you recommend to keep in an aquarium > medicine > > > cabinet? > > > > Obviously, something to treat ick, but what else? > > > > > > > > Which is more contagious, bacterial infections, or fungal? In > > what > > > > situations do you remove the fish to a hospital tank? Do you > > remove the > > > > infected > > > > fish and start treatment on that particular fish; if more than > > one fish > > > has > > > > it, > > > > would you pull them out one by one, or just treat the entire > > community? > > > > > > > > I know there are a lot of denominations missing here, but this > > has always > > > > > > > been my dilemma. With a bacteria, can you assume that everyone > > will get > > > > sick? > > > > > > > > I do have a book on fish diseases, but it gets way into > > scientific stuff, > > > > > > > like doing biopsies and skin scrapings. I have seen a few > > different > > > > websites > > > > that help to diagnose; just wondering what everyone else does. > > > > > > > > I do not have a problem now, but I just want to be prepared > > should someone > > > > > > > get sick. > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > > > Linda > > > > > > > > Rob > > > > NE Indiana > > > > USA > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > > > My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > ((((º> > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > > thanks. > > > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > > important to > > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message > MODIFY > > the > > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > > > > > > > > Marine > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? > > t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > > > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > > > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology > > > > > > Biology > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? > > t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > > > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > > > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > ((((º> > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > > thanks. > > > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > > important to > > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message > MODIFY > > the > > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms > of > > Service > > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to > > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > the > > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology > > Biology > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > _____ > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14026	From: Sandy Kay	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: ammonia reading

Hi, I have a 10 gallon freshwater tank that is a month running. I have 3 danios, 3 small tetras, 3 guppies, 1 molly, 1 small pleco, 2 small upside down catifsh. My ammonia reading stays at 0.25. I know that isn't bad but wish I could get it to read 0. And I do know it will change with feeding, etc. back and forth. The nitrates are 0 most of the time. I also have several live plants, no plastic and a small piece of driftwood. I do not overfeed and sometimes skip a day. I am running zeolite through my filter along with carbon. Does anyone have input on this? Thank you in advance, Sandy [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14027	From: Evita	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: Cherry shrimp

Daniel, That is really cool. I hope they all make it and grow fast. Please keep us updated. By the way my fry have really grown too. They are all doing well. Evita Daniel <daniel@...> wrote:I bought just one cherry shrimp from the Aquarium store a copy of weeks ago because the shrimp had a bunch of eggs on her.I only bought 1 because they cost alot for a little shrimp like that. Well I put her by herself so that nothing would eat her.I looked in the tank the other day and saw that the baby shrmp had hatched and were moving around ,very small looking shrimp and very neat to watch them.Well I took the mother out because I wasnt sure if she would eat them. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14028	From: Evita	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: An Important message to all.

Sorry if I contribted in anyway. I just didn't think we were learning anything from the cussing. The topic wasn't helpful at a certain point. I just don't understand how it got off that way. Seems that everyone has a love for the hobby and we are here to learn all we can. I didn't want to see anyone banned but I agree with why. Sorry again. Evita harry perry <harryfisherman@...> wrote:Paul Helmes and Eric Roberts have been banned from this group. Children use this group (besides the 2 I deleted). Name calling and foul language will not be tolerated. Harry __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14029	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists every Thursday Thursday July 28, 2005 8:00 pm - 10:00 pm This event repeats every week. The next reminder for this event will be sent in 3 hours, 4 minutes. Event Location: http://chat.thatpetplace.com/chat/chat.aspx Notes: Return to this site every Thursday from 8pm to 10pm and Monday from 8pm to 9pm (Eastern Time) to chat LIVE with one of our on-staff Marine Biologists. Learn about your fish, how to treat common maladies, get recommendations on accessories, food and live animal compatibility, or ask a question that only an expert could answer. MarineBio Chat every Thursday 8pm to 10pm EST, only from That Fish Place, The Original Aquatic Superstore. Attention MarineBio chat participants! The chat server is unavailable until 8pm Eastern Time. If you experience problems while trying to log on to the chat session ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14030	From: Tom Ray	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: New guys in the tank

Yes, they are pretty. HOWEVER: Those are the aggreesive type, namely; Macropodus opercularis. They may be the original "tropical ornamental fish" being imported to Europe back in 1860s, and reported/described nearly 100 years earlier than that. When they attack, they ususally go for the eyes of the object of their aggression. And so should be kept only in a species aquarium IMHO. --TommyBoy --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "cynthia brennemann" <brennewoman@h...> wrote: > Err.....I mean the gourami that looks orange and blue striped with a > more flowy blue tail than any other gourami I've seen so far. They > didn't have the latin names on the tanks, and the guy had just gotten a > shipment of fish in and was a bit busy, so I didn't ask. > > But tankies for the heads up...if they're aggressive, frankly, I don't > want them. > > > By "Paradise Goarami," do you mean the Macropodus genera (spechti, > > concolor, etc.) or the Pseudosphromenus genera (cupanus, dayi) > species? > > > > FYI: Not sure how friendly the former will be towards your Betta > > splendid juveniles. The former are agressive outside of its own > > species. I have not witnessed any aggression by the latter. > > > > --TommyBoy

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14031	From: Ken McDougall	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: Central Filtration idea?/Automation?

Hi Daniel. Have a look at this site it may be some help. http://www.angelsonly.com/hatchery.htm Regards Ken Daniel <daniel@...> wrote: In the near future I am plannig on building me a building with 30 or more tanks in it for breeding.The Fish will need the same water quality and I wanted to use central filtration for the tanks and automate all of the water changes and such.I am not sure the chooses I had about drilling or not drilling the tanks and how the plumming would be routed to the tanks and filter. >does anyone have a setup like that and maybe could put up some picture or decribe the setup? >Or does anyone know any good sites that will show you how to setup a central filtration system or any DIY automation for it? >also if anyone has any kind breeding setups and could share some pictures of it that would be great. Thanks Daniel Send instant messages to your online friends http://au.messenger.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14032	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: New guys in the tank

> HOWEVER: Those are the aggreesive type, namely; Macropodus > opercularis. Ahh, phooey. Oh well, I'll skip those. There are enough pretty fish that aren't bullies that I don't need to import troublemakers. :P The flame gourami's are getting along fine with the betta fry and the honey gourami. I'm hoping for a nice, active yet peaceful tank. Still no signs of aggression amongst the betta fry...they're a teeny bit longer than an inch, if you count the fins right now. Coloring up nicely, too.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14033	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists every Thursday Thursday July 28, 2005 8:00 pm - 10:00 pm This event repeats every week. Event Location: http://chat.thatpetplace.com/chat/chat.aspx Notes: Return to this site every Thursday from 8pm to 10pm and Monday from 8pm to 9pm (Eastern Time) to chat LIVE with one of our on-staff Marine Biologists. Learn about your fish, how to treat common maladies, get recommendations on accessories, food and live animal compatibility, or ask a question that only an expert could answer. MarineBio Chat every Thursday 8pm to 10pm EST, only from That Fish Place, The Original Aquatic Superstore. Attention MarineBio chat participants! The chat server is unavailable until 8pm Eastern Time. If you experience problems while trying to log on to the chat session ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14034	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: blue rams

Would you, should you, could you put blue rams in with keyhole cichlids and angels? Would the keyholes and rams compete for the same bottom territory? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14035	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: ammonia reading (about zeolite)

We recently had this discussion about zeolite. The good thing about zeolite is it absorbs ammonia which keeps your ammonia levels lower during the cycle process. The bad thing about zeolite is it absorbs ammonia which keeps your ammonia levels lower during the cycle process. Yes... I know I just said the same thing, both good and bad, about zeolite. Because it is absorbing the ammonia, it is taking food away from your nitrifying bacteria, which you need in order to grow in order to cycle a tank. That is why you are not getting much of a nitrite or nitrate reading. There are not enough nitrifying bacteria to produce very many nitrites and then nitrates. As soon as you quit using zeolite, or when it "fills" up with ammonia, then you will see your ammonia reading go higher and then your nitrifying bacteria will start to grow and you will get your nitrite and eventual nitrate readings. If you choose to discontinue zeolite, you will need to monitor your ammonia and nitrite readings daily or every other day and check your nitrates every couple of days. Be prepared to do daily PWC's to keep the ammonia levels below .5ppm and the nitrites below 1.0ppm. You have to give the nitrifying bacteria a chance to grow without letting the ammonia readings or nitrite readings get too high. This will build a strong nitrifying bacteria colony while keeping the levels from getting too high to be dangerous to your fish. You should not get as severe of readings or for as long since you already have some nitrifying bacteria growing but you will experience a mini-cycle in all probability. Eventually, after a few weeks, you will have a healthy bacteria colony eating the ammonia, converting it into nitrites, then eating the nitrites, converting them into nitrates and then you keep the nitrates under 40ppm by doing PWC's as needed and usually at least 25% every two weeks just to introduce "fresh" water into the tank. Remember to treat your tap water with your dechlor product of choice. If you use Ammo-Lock, Prime or similar ammonia neutralizing products, it will affect your ammonia readings on most test kits. Read the directions closely on these types of products. If you continue to use zeolite, follow the directions properly so you will not get an ammonia spike that you are not prepared for. Do not add salt to your tank as that will cause zeolite to release all of the absorbed ammonia, causing a severe spike. I, personally, do not like using it unless it was for an emergency ammonia spike but it is a user's choice type product... just like charcoal in the filters. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: Date: Thu, 28 Jul 2005 13:36:48 -0500 (Central Standard Time) From: "Sandy Kay" <knightwriter101@...> Subject: ammonia reading Hi, I have a 10 gallon freshwater tank that is a month running. I have 3 danios, 3 small tetras, 3 guppies, 1 molly, 1 small pleco, 2 small upside down catifsh. My ammonia reading stays at 0.25. I know that isn't bad but wish I could get it to read 0. And I do know it will change with feeding, etc. back and forth. The nitrates are 0 most of the time. I also have several live plants, no plastic and a small piece of driftwood. I do not overfeed and sometimes skip a day. I am running zeolite through my filter along with carbon. Does anyone have input on this? Thank you in advance, Sandy [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14036	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: Ph - Bogwood

Galvanized horse trough over a fire probably would have worked <g>. Kind of reminds me of the time someone won a 22 lb. Lobster at a Fish & Game Club event. We had to find something big enough to hold it for cooking (boiling) and then a way to get the water up to boiling. Finally found a big enough container that would actually hold water and take the heat, then used all four burners on the stove to heat the water prior to placing the lobster in it. Then the debate was how long to boil it (normally 15 minutes). I forgot what we determined, but it got the job done and we all had more than our fill of lobster and beer. The old bird was a bit tough, though. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nimish Mathur Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 2:40 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Ph - Bogwood Steve, On a rare occasion, my LFS had got some bogwood from Africa and they had to take back a lot of this wood from people (excluding me) as it almost never seemed to stop leeching tannins even after 6-8 months. I had them in a very large tank (100 gallons) for more then a year and they were still leeching out tannins :-(. Considering the UK's wet weather, I let the woods sit in the garden for another year and all seasons and about 4 months ago I started to reuse them and they are perfectly fine now :-). No leeching color or tannins any more and perfectly stable. I don't know why they were like this but I suspect that they needed more time. Some one I know had also reported that it took almost 18 months for the same shipment of wood to stop leeching tannins but were otherwise perfectly safe. I did want to boil it too but because the pieces were as large as 3.5ft-4ft, I was unable to figure out a proper way to boil a piece lol. But it is a very rare occasion and they have not ordered from the same company after that. Nim Ps: I do agree 100% on the PH issue though _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: 27 July 2005 03:36 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Ph First, it is always pH, even if one starts a sentence with it. In another post you say that the wood was in another aquarium for 8-9 months. If it is still leaching tannins at this point, and I mean enough to yellow the water and lower the pH as you describe, I would question whether this wood was meant for an aquarium. If it were, then I'd suggest trying to speed the process along by removing the wood and boiling it until the water no longer darkens. Or, you can just leave the pH where it is, and when the wood finishes leaching, the pH will rise somewhat. For many South American fish, a pH of even 6.5 may be high for them. Rams have been found in water with a pH of less than 5, as have discus. Neon tetras are often found in water below 6. pH is a funny thing. I recommend that you not try to change it, as often that leads to disaster. Just keep an eye on it, and if it maintains itself at the lower level, be happy. Your fish probably are. \\Steve// _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14037	From: Daniel	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: Cherry shrimp

Maybe not but I just didnt want to take the chance with my first hatching.Maybe I'll be more bold if I get another female with eggs. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > Although I could be mistaken, I do not think the parents eat the baby > shrimp. Perhaps someone with more shrimp experience will come along > and tell us more about them :) > > Rebecca > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Daniel" <daniel@t...> wrote: > > I bought just one cherry shrimp from the Aquarium store a copy of > > weeks ago because the shrimp had a bunch of eggs on her.I only bought > > 1 because they cost alot for a little shrimp like that. > > Well I put her by herself so that nothing would eat her.I looked in > > the tank the other day and saw that the baby shrmp had hatched and > > were moving around ,very small looking shrimp and very neat to watch > > them.Well I took the mother out because I wasnt sure if she would eat > > them.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14038	From: Daniel	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: Cherry shrimp

Maybe you could ask your local Aquarium store to stock them.My local one puts them in the plant tank ,so they want take up another tank for them and it will help with the alge in the plant tank.They sale them for $5.99 ea at my store but the one I got was on sale for $4.99. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > Congratulations! I have been looking for the cherry red shrimp but > cannot find any in my area. I only want one or two, so aquabid is > out. Good luck with your babies! > > Rebecca > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Daniel" <daniel@t...> wrote: > > I bought just one cherry shrimp from the Aquarium store a copy of > > weeks ago because the shrimp had a bunch of eggs on her.I only bought > > 1 because they cost alot for a little shrimp like that. > > Well I put her by herself so that nothing would eat her.I looked in > > the tank the other day and saw that the baby shrmp had hatched and > > were moving around ,very small looking shrimp and very neat to watch > > them.Well I took the mother out because I wasnt sure if she would eat > > them.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14039	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: Ph

The variation in your pH overnight seems to be a bit on the extreme side 0.4 from day to night. Do you use any aeration in your tank? You might want to try this to lessen the change. pH is also liable to be lower in the tank than it is coming from the tap due to any of a number of reasons. An interesting experiment may be to test the water out of the tap and let it sit for about 24 hours, then retest. This could lead to a drop in the pH and not the wood you have in the tank. Of course, if it does not drop, then it may be partly due to the wood, and partly due to the plants that your pH is where it is in your tank, not to mention the biological processes that are happening in the tank. \\Steve// Network engineer huh? I do some of that stuff over the course of doing my job. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Robert Hickey Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 5:55 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Ph Hi steve Yes it is still staining the Water ( its not a problem as I am going for a amazon Biotope) and yes the Wood is for aquariums supplied from my local fish store and is suited for aquariums. Also I have boiled it to dead before I added to the aquarium months back. Wow didnt know that Rams have been found in Such low PH , interesting, I do plan on adding discus at some point but only after a few months when this new tank has cycled,( most of my old fish are still in the old tank While the new one cyclies) I have kept a good eye on the ph and read a bit more and found more information about ph than before , and it directly relates to my setup,. th etank ph in the morning is around 6 to 6.4 while at the end of the Day it Works out around 6.6 to 6.8 and this is to do with plants, as my tank is well planted and at night the plants are not doing there bits and pieces as during the day they are, so the tank seems to have stablised a bit more ove rthe last few days, It worried me that ph was droping so low but with your details on rams And neons found in such low ph I am no longer concerned thanks Steve, But as you advise Im leaving it alone , from all this information if its not broke don`t fix it, Thanks again Irish rob Regards Robert Hickey Robert Hickey | Networks Engineer Citywest Business Park | BT | Tel: +353 (0)1 43258749 | Mob: +353 (0)86 8061840 | E: robert.hickey@... | www.btireland.ie ----- Original Message ----- From: Steve Szabo To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 3:36 AM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Ph First, it is always pH, even if one starts a sentence with it. In another post you say that the wood was in another aquarium for 8-9 months. If it is still leaching tannins at this point, and I mean enough to yellow the water and lower the pH as you describe, I would question whether this wood was meant for an aquarium. If it were, then I'd suggest trying to speed the process along by removing the wood and boiling it until the water no longer darkens. Or, you can just leave the pH where it is, and when the wood finishes leaching, the pH will rise somewhat. For many South American fish, a pH of even 6.5 may be high for them. Rams have been found in water with a pH of less than 5, as have discus. Neon tetras are often found in water below 6. pH is a funny thing. I recommend that you not try to change it, as often that leads to disaster. Just keep an eye on it, and if it maintains itself at the lower level, be happy. Your fish probably are. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Robert Hickey Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 5:21 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Ph Hi All Hope everyone is fine, :o) Im in an area I would say some Would love To be in Asthe Water we have is soft and the Ph is neutral. The problem Im having is that I have a few big pieces of bog wood in My tank and such release tanins and lower my ph ( which is great) but the problem I am having is that the ph is droping to 6, most of the fish don`t mind this as there all south american but I would prefer to keep it around 6.5 to 6.8. Im not into chemical buffers, so is there a way for me to buffer the ph to Around this , ? by using stone or other natural buffers? Many Thanks All Rob

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14040	From: Sandy Kay	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Subject: Re: An Important message to all.

This is too bad. I have only been here 3 weeks at the most. I thought Eric Roberts had a lot of knowledge to share and learned much from his answers. I didn't see the messages that were not good. Hope everything gets worked out and we just enjoy our hobby. Sandy "Each day is a gift from God, waiting to blossom into a thing of beauty." [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14041	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: hot water!

That certainly seems to be an unreasonable price for a room air conditioner. Around here, you can get one for a couple of hundred dollars, and the same was true when I was in New England. Of course, if you want a king of the road model, that will set you back more. My parents had one that lasted them about 20 years. Fifteen of those years I put it in for them in the summer and took it out in the fall--then I got smart and moved down to the DC area <g>, and it was entirely up to my brother to do it. Maybe that is why it finally broke down <g>. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 1:31 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] hot water! the peninsula area of the san francisco bay area --- Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > Where are you located that the unit is so expensive? Last year, I replaced > my heat pump, both the exterior and interior portions, and it ran me only > $6000. And that cools the whole house in the summer and heats it in the > winter (sometimes with an electrical heating coil assisting). > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez > Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 3:51 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] hot water! > > are you kidding? minimal cost for a portable a/c here is $1300. that's why i > don't have one. > > --- Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: > > > Turn the a/c up. > > > > Seriously, though. For everybody here who doesn't have an air > conditioner: > > Get one. If you can afford a fish tank, you don't have any excuse to not > > have a good air conditioner to keep the room it is in cool in the summer, > > and a good safe heater to keep it warm in the winter. Not to mention you > > are more likely to die of heat stroke in your own house if you don't keep > it > > cool. Also, if you can afford an internet connection, you have no excuse > to > > not have an a/c. They aren't really that expensive. A lot cheaper than > > restocking your tanks or paying medical bills when you fall over dead. > > > > > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy. > > > > "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it > is > > perhaps, the end of the beginning." > > -Winston Churchill > > -------Original Message------- > > Howdy! The water temp. has been off the chart in 1 of my tanks. I've been > putting ice in a > > baggie & putting that in the tank, but it doesn't help much. My oscar's > skin is coming off & > > he's not eating. I've also been putting med. in the tank. What else can I > do? > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14042	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: To Paul & Ray Re: MelaFix & PimaFix

Paul, AS you have just said the 3 day version is a general advice for all AP meds, the bottle label is specific. As for the display tank treatment OK that was an assumption on my part as you implied that it killed all the fish which would imply multiple deaths and you appeared to be referring to other people's fish and tanks rather than your own. regards, unclenorm. --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > i never said anything about treating a display > tank...dunno where you even got that. he only thing > that i have ever treated a display tank with was > copper for hookworms that came in on fish. any way > the water change issue is from two sources,number 1 > the bottles which say to change water after 7 days > and > the pimafix.html document on ap's website which says > every 3 days during treatment. very different > statements both by ap. the website says 3 days for > any meds while their bottles for the specific > products > say after 7 days. > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> > wrote: > > > Paul, > > As I have pointed out in previous posts you > > only > > quoted parts of A/P web site to suit your argument > > and > > most of what you have said is pure conjecture, you > > do > > not know what killed the fish in question it is an > > assumption on your part, it could have been the > > MelaFix or the PimaFix combining with some other > > substance or medication previously administered to > > the > > tank, why were all these fish being treated in > there > > display tanks holding other fish ?, you should > know > > that it is not at all advisable to medicate a > > display > > tank, there is no valid excuse for not using a > > quarantine tank, even a bucket will do. You based > > some > > of your statements on there site but out of > context > > such as your remarks on water changes, read what > you > > wrote on this again and then read what the site > says > > again. Why are you trying to bring Nimish into > this, > > he say he has never used PimaFix. It is Ray and > > yourself that are making these rash statements. > > regards, > > unclenorm. > > > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > > > read the posts before directing a statement like > > > that > > > at me. i did use their own website for quotes, > > and > > > others have quoted the same text. it is the > > > pimafix.html on ap's website. proof is > > experience, > > > same as ray and nimish! > > > > > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." > <normnam2000@...> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > Hi Paul, > > > > As I'm sure you know MelaFix and > PImaFix > > > are > > > > manufactured by Aquarium Pharmaceuticals a > > > reputable > > > > American manufacturer, there web site states > and > > I > > > > quote #1 "PimaFix has been formulated to work > in > > > > combination with MelaFix to enhance > > effectiveness > > > > against fish diseases" > > > > quote #2 "University studies and laboratory > > tests > > > > showed that PimaFix is an effective antifungal > > AND > > > > antibacterial remedy for both freshwater and > > > marine > > > > fish. This evidence led to the granting of a > > > United > > > > States Patent." > > > > quote #3 "MelaFix has been tested and found > > > > compatible > > > > with Aquarium Pharmaceuticals medications. > > Mixing > > > > other brands of medications is not > recommended." > > > > To verify my above statements visit :- > > > > http://www.aquariumpharm.com?pimafix.html > > > > I do not know which wed-site you looked at > but > > > what > > > > you have stated is not on Aquarium > > Pharmaceuticals > > > > website. > > > > What proof do you have that mixing MelaFix > and > > > > PimaFix kills healthy fish ? if you have some > > then > > > > complain to your Patent Office. > > > > regards, > > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Ray, > > > > > i looked up the pimafix website, and it does > > not > > > > say > > > > > that they should be used together at all, it > > > says > > > > > that > > > > > they are designed to work "synergistically", > > > which > > > > > just means to greater effect. this may only > > be > > > > > useful > > > > > as dip, there is no information listed. the > > use > > > > of > > > > > this language very clearly states to me that > > it > > > is > > > > a > > > > > write up by a marketing team, not > researchers. > > > if > > > > > one > > > > > takes the time to read the full statement on > > the > > > > > site, > > > > > it states very clearly that they can be used > > > > togther > > > > > in EXTREME cases, not everyday use. in > > addition, > > > i > > > > > know that we have had some "medical" > > responses, > > > > but > > > > > these are not "medications" but rather tea > > tree > > > > and > > > > > bay tree extracts, not true antibiotics or > > anti > > > > > fungals meaning not engineered to be used in > > > this > > > > > way. > > > > > they may function well in the application, > > but > > > > this > > > > > is hollistic not pharmaceutical. > > > > > > > > > > --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Do not believe everything that you read! > Do > > > you > > > > > > REALLY KNOW for sure > > > > > > whether or not Melafix and Pimafix can be > > > mixed? > > > > > > > > > If > > > > > > not, please do > > > > > > not recommend such a thing to other newer > > > Forum > > > > > > members who may not > > > > > > know better. Paul is 100% correct on this > > > one. > > > > I > > > > > > too have seen and > > > > > > learned of many cases of hobbyists I know > > > mixing > > > > > > these > > > > > > two "medications" together and wiping out > > > their > > > > > > tanks. Most of these > > > > > > tanks were well established over many > years > > > with > > > > > one > > > > > > fish having a > > > > > > scrape or slight sore with all the other > > fish > > > > > being > > > > > > healthy, as in > > > > > > cases that Paul has seen. By themselves, > > > these > > > > > > remedies are great, > > > > > > so I am not trying to bash them. I am not > a > > > > > > chemist, so I cannot > > > > > > tell you what happens when you put them > > > > together, > > > > > > only that it kills > > > > > > fish. Can't say why the manufacturer > would > > > > > > recommend it -- I would > > > > > > hope it wouldn't just be to increase > sales, > > > but > > > > it > > > > > > would seem obvious > > > > > > they may not have really tried mixing > these > > > two > > > > > meds > > > > > > as a test in a > > > > > > healthy fish-populated aquarium or I'm > sure > > > they > > > > > > would have found it > > > > > > to be detrimental. My gut feeling is that > > > there > > > > > may > > > > > > be other unseen > > > > > > factors involved when mixing these two, > such > > > as > > > > > > maybe the water was > > > > > > below a certain pH (6.6? for instance), or > > the > > > > > water > > > > > > was high in > > > > > > magnesium or any number of things in these > > > > > aquariums > > > > > > which were not > > > > > > ordinarily unsafe nor uncommon as all the > > > > > aquariums > > > > > > involved must > > > > > > have had similar parameters, but were > fatal > > > === message truncated === > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs > > ___________________________________________________________ How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14043	From: Tim Fairchild	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: An Important message to all.

On Friday 29 Jul 2005 03:01, Nimish Mathur wrote: > Its sad that Harry had to take this decision but as a moderator I think he > had no option :-(. I hope that it can be retracted as both Paul and Eric > have been very active members in the group and it will not be the same > without them. > > > > Harry and other moderators, please do reconsider the decision and rather > then banning members, if possible to put the posting on moderation. Yes, well I tend to moderate members rather than ban on my lists, but it's more work and it's really up to the moderator how they decide to handle these things. You also have to moderate all new members, as once you ban people they tend to log on with a new name and maybe cause trouble... But that's kids for you :) tim -- --------------------------------------------------------- Tim & Therese Fairchild Atchafalaya Border Collies. Kuttabul, Queensland, Australia. --------------------------------------------------------- Email mailto:tim@... Homepage http://www.bcs4me.com Photos http://www.pbase.com/amosf Blog http://bcs4me.com/blog ---------------------------------------------------------

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14044	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: hot water!

> My parents had one that lasted them about 20 years. Fifteen of those years > I put it in for them in the summer and took it out in the fall--then I got > smart and moved down to the DC area <g>, and it was entirely up to my > brother to do it. Maybe that is why it finally broke down <g>. > > \\Steve// > Hee hee, that was funny :)

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14045	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: To Paul & Ray Re: MelaFix & PimaFix

Patrick, Please quote what I have said that is "liable or slander or unsupported and possibly complete lies", if you can ?. Paul keeps quoting bits of the website out of context and I have never said he was telling lies !!. I only oppose what anybody says if I know it to be incorrect or misleading to new people looking for advice. I await your constructive reply with interest. regards, Unclenorm --- Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: > Do you have to oppose what Paul says even if > what you say makes no > sense? I guess you went to an ivy league school to > learn the art of debate: > make your opponent look bad and you don't have to > debate anything. You are > guilty of lible and slander yourself for saying > things that are clearly > unsuported and possibly complete lies. Paul keeps > quoting the website and > the bottle to show the difference in insturctions > between them, while you > set back and just say he is telling lies. > > > Patrick > -------Original Message------- > Hi Ray, > I included your name because you appeared to > be > siding with and supporting Paul's statements. I am > only trying to bring out the truth. Paul has used > these half truths and partial quote tactics on more > than one occasion before, then when he is shown to > be > incorrect he resorts to abusive posts. In this case > we > have a reputable manufacturer who states that one of > the two products in question, PimaFix has been > formulated to work in combination with the other, > MelaFix. Common sense tells me that that does not > form > a deadly cocktail, if these two medications have any > bearing on the death of the fish in question I > suggest > it is due to one or more other substances being > present in the tank water, probably other > medications > or water additives. In which case it is pure > speculation and most unfair and very likely liable > to > blame and name MelaFix and PimaFix in public. There > must be many thousands of aquarists world wide using > or have used these to products in combination, if > there was any truth in the accusation that they > produce a deadly cocktail there would be thousands > of > complaints. Have you ever heard of this before this > incident ?. Aquarists will have killed very many > fish > by using two or more medications at the same time > without specific recommendation. > regards, > unclenorm. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ___________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14046	From: Jeff Schultz	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: A great way to ask questions and share experinces

I have never been very vocal in this group, but banning someone for there "opinion", "experience", and "knowledge" is totally wrong. A good debate may work for some, not for everyone. Why? I would have loved to debate this, but a member that has a lot of value to this group was banned? This group lost. Because Paul got the kick. Just my two cents and I am entitled to it. Thank you all for all the info I have learned in the past. Good luck to everyone in the future. I hope the group puts the power to the post so everyone has the opportunity to learn. REMEMBER, it is Opinion, Experience, Knowledge, and Personal experiences. Best regards~ Jeff Schultz ccfireems@...

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14047	From: dorothy wheeler	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Re: An Important message to all.

Harry, It is a shame you felt the need to ban them. They contribute a lot to the group. I read all the posts, but, do not feel I am qualified to answer most of the questions that are asked. Dorothy harry perry <harryfisherman@...> wrote: Paul Helmes and Eric Roberts have been banned from this group. Children use this group (besides the 2 I deleted). Name calling and foul language will not be tolerated. Harry __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14048	From: harry perry	Date: 7/28/2005
Subject: Let's put it to rest. Time to move on. An excerpt from a message s

Dear Paul, I consider you to be a very knowledgable person Who honestly tries to help people. The issue isn't what you do it's how you do it. Time and time again I've seen you "go off" when someone disagrees with you. We're working with people who know absolutely nothing about keeping fish. . That's the value of these groups. A place where folks can go and talk about there mistakes and feel comfortable doing so. A place where they are not afraid of being criticised or being called ignorant and certainly not a place where folks lose there temper at the first uninformed post. . They want to feel as if someone cares about there problems. They also want there children to be involved, hence the problem. Eric responded to one of your posts , "f____ you". Your response to a women was "bite me" This doesn't exactly sound like a family oriented fish group. I respond to posts all the time the way you and Eric did, but I do it in Yahoo's adult groups not in a family fish group. It may interest you to know that even your detractors thought my action was extreme. I don't. Consider this: A parent comes home from work looking forward to interaction in the group. An escape from corporate bullshit and the rat race. An opportunity to spend some valuable time with their child, they log in. What do they find? Your an ass, f___ you, your ingnorant, bite me. What does the child get from this? My action was not personal. This group and groups like it exist because they are a sanctuary for the uninformed. That's the only way they can exist. I'm looking forward to working with you in aquarium debates. Harry paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: i did not post a single cuss word on group. if you care tyo take a look the only cuss words came from sandra and eric not me. i have been a member for over a year on this group and i think it is complete bs that you can just ban me from the group. i have been elevated to moderator on 2 other groups. if you feel the need to ban people, it should be those like unclenorm who just jump in to cause arguments. i said nothing about any specific member so could not have called anyone a name. i made no reference to anyone specifically when venting about issues. the only borderline remark that io made was to the woman who told me to take the stick out of my ass, and i used alternate letters, not the real ones. this is what you get for taking the time to care and to warn people about potential hazards i guess. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [input] [input] [input] [input] [input] [input] [input] [input] DeleteReplyForwardMove... Previous | Next | Back to Messages Save Message Text __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14049	From: Rei - Raymond Tremor	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: Re: Seaweed as food & correct temp/freshwater

Cinde, where in Hawaii are you from? I am here in Oahu. If you are in Oahu too, do you go see the aquarium and orchid show at blaisedel center? Rei - Raymond Tremor LoveMoAko@... -------Original Message------- From: bunnycareshi Date: 07/24/05 12:57:11 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Seaweed as food & correct temp/freshwater Aloha Thank you, Rob. When I told the guy I thought the temp was too high and that I had taken the heater out, keeping the temp at about 85, he said I was going to lose the Clowns at that temp and that I also might incur ick. He had these fish for 1 yr or more and he seemed to know quite a bit about aquariums. I just don't see why they can't do well in the dead of summer in Hawaii w/out heater. I'm so glad I can use the dried "human" seaweed. How do I feed it? Do I put in chunks or chop it fine like fish flaked food? Cinde in Hawaii --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, FortWayneFish@a... wrote: > Temp sounds high for me, i think 78*F would be a little more appropriete. > The human kind of sea weed will work just fine for your fish. > > rob > Indiana > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14050	From: Robert Hickey	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: Re: Ph

Hi yeh there is a air pump ( setting up for a 260 litre) Will try the 24 hour test, any time I have tested the Water from the tap is was neutral so, Its seems to have stablised more over the last few day as I removed some bogwood and its now around 6.4 to 6.5 Thanks Steve ----- Original Message ----- From: Steve Szabo To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, July 29, 2005 2:36 AM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Ph The variation in your pH overnight seems to be a bit on the extreme side 0.4 from day to night. Do you use any aeration in your tank? You might want to try this to lessen the change. pH is also liable to be lower in the tank than it is coming from the tap due to any of a number of reasons. An interesting experiment may be to test the water out of the tap and let it sit for about 24 hours, then retest. This could lead to a drop in the pH and not the wood you have in the tank. Of course, if it does not drop, then it may be partly due to the wood, and partly due to the plants that your pH is where it is in your tank, not to mention the biological processes that are happening in the tank. \\Steve// Network engineer huh? I do some of that stuff over the course of doing my job. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Robert Hickey Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 5:55 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Ph Hi steve Yes it is still staining the Water ( its not a problem as I am going for a amazon Biotope) and yes the Wood is for aquariums supplied from my local fish store and is suited for aquariums. Also I have boiled it to dead before I added to the aquarium months back. Wow didnt know that Rams have been found in Such low PH , interesting, I do plan on adding discus at some point but only after a few months when this new tank has cycled,( most of my old fish are still in the old tank While the new one cyclies) I have kept a good eye on the ph and read a bit more and found more information about ph than before , and it directly relates to my setup,. th etank ph in the morning is around 6 to 6.4 while at the end of the Day it Works out around 6.6 to 6.8 and this is to do with plants, as my tank is well planted and at night the plants are not doing there bits and pieces as during the day they are, so the tank seems to have stablised a bit more ove rthe last few days, It worried me that ph was droping so low but with your details on rams And neons found in such low ph I am no longer concerned thanks Steve, But as you advise Im leaving it alone , from all this information if its not broke don`t fix it, Thanks again Irish rob Regards Robert Hickey Robert Hickey | Networks Engineer Citywest Business Park | BT | Tel: +353 (0)1 43258749 | Mob: +353 (0)86 8061840 | E: robert.hickey@... | www.btireland.ie ----- Original Message ----- From: Steve Szabo To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 3:36 AM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Ph First, it is always pH, even if one starts a sentence with it. In another post you say that the wood was in another aquarium for 8-9 months. If it is still leaching tannins at this point, and I mean enough to yellow the water and lower the pH as you describe, I would question whether this wood was meant for an aquarium. If it were, then I'd suggest trying to speed the process along by removing the wood and boiling it until the water no longer darkens. Or, you can just leave the pH where it is, and when the wood finishes leaching, the pH will rise somewhat. For many South American fish, a pH of even 6.5 may be high for them. Rams have been found in water with a pH of less than 5, as have discus. Neon tetras are often found in water below 6. pH is a funny thing. I recommend that you not try to change it, as often that leads to disaster. Just keep an eye on it, and if it maintains itself at the lower level, be happy. Your fish probably are. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Robert Hickey Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 5:21 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Ph Hi All Hope everyone is fine, :o) Im in an area I would say some Would love To be in Asthe Water we have is soft and the Ph is neutral. The problem Im having is that I have a few big pieces of bog wood in My tank and such release tanins and lower my ph ( which is great) but the problem I am having is that the ph is droping to 6, most of the fish don`t mind this as there all south american but I would prefer to keep it around 6.5 to 6.8. Im not into chemical buffers, so is there a way for me to buffer the ph to Around this , ? by using stone or other natural buffers? Many Thanks All Rob ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14051	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: Re: New guys in the tank

Cynthia, The paradise gouramis are really paradise fish, _Macropodus opercularis_, and they are not really community tank fish. I believe that there has been some discussion about gourami aggressiveness on this list. Well, these guys will take out those aggressive gouramis, should they care to. In a tank by themselves, with some dither fish, they would probably be OK, but as residents of a community tank, forget it. They do have a wide temperature range (60-80^o+ F.), and are not real particular about water quality, so in that way they are ideal fish <g>. They were commonly kept in the early days of the hobby because of their hardiness. In good condition, they can really be spectacular fish. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of cynthia brennemann Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 6:00 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] New guys in the tank We went to the aquarium store today...took back the tiger barb we were given, as he was causing problems in the tank. While we were there we found a pair of flame gouramis that my DH fell in love with and came home with them, as well as a couple of clown loaches (we have a slight snail problem I'm hoping they'll help us with), and put them in the 60 gallon tank with the betta fry, which are now an inch long and starting to get color. It was so cute, every new fish had it's own betta fry escort all over the tank. It was like a group of kids following people around to see what they'd do. I think it kinda freaked the flame gourami's out a bit, and they were reluctant to come out of of hiding...but they seem to be getting comfy now. Dh would like a pair of paradise gourami's now...do they stay small-ish?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14052	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: Re: New guys in the tank/Betta Fry

Hi Cynthia, Just as a reminder, as its now been 5 weeks (June 22) since you told us you had fry: This next week or so will be a critical stage for them. At around six weeks of age they will be starting to use their labyrinth organs, which have been developing over these last 5 weeks. Make sure there is no trace of any film on the surface, and keep the top sealed best you can. If there is any "oil" or anything, that can easily be removed by dragging a piece of paper towel over the surface. Looks like you're doing good with them, congratulations. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "cynthia brennemann" <brennewoman@h...> wrote: > The flame gourami's are getting along fine with the betta fry and the honey > gourami. I'm hoping for a nice, active yet peaceful tank. Still no > signs of aggression amongst the betta fry...they're a teeny bit longer > than an inch, if you count the fins right now. Coloring up nicely, too.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14053	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: Re: New guys in the tank/Betta Fry

Hey Ray, thanks for the heads up! I noticed they've all been basking at the top of the tank a lot more often, resting on the clumps of floating plants. Cute little beggers. They're starting to develop some very pretty coloration. Still can't figure out which ones are female and which are male. We have about 1/4 dark/bodied 3/4 light bodied right now. >Hi Cynthia, Just as a reminder, as its now been 5 weeks (June 22) > since you told us you had fry: This next week or so will be a > critical stage for them. At around six weeks of age they will be > starting to use their labyrinth organs, which have been developing > over these last 5 weeks. Make sure there is no trace of any film on > the surface, and keep the top sealed best you can. If there is > any "oil" or anything, that can easily be removed by dragging a piece > of paper towel over the surface. Looks like you're doing good with > them, congratulations. Ray

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14054	From: TankGurl	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: Re: A great way to ask questions and share experinces

On 7/29/05, Jeff Schultz <ccfireems@...> wrote: > I have never been very vocal in this group, but banning someone for > there "opinion", "experience", and "knowledge" is totally wrong. There is a difference between sharing knowledge, and using knowledge as power over others. If one is able to effectively communicate their knowledge without condescension or insult, then they are using and sharing their knowledge in the best possible manner. If they are not, they are simply enjoying their position at the top. Kelly

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14055	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: What causes a nitrite spike

Okay, I guess 0.5 ppm isn't exactly a spike, but what would cause nitrite levels to rise? I know fish waste can cause this, but ammonia is at zero and the tank is established and cycled. Is it because I've done several 15-20% water changes this week with the gravel vaccum? Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14056	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: Re: Ph - Bogwood (now Crawfish Boiler's)

If ya'll lived down here in N'Awlins, all you would have to do is pull out the Crawfish Boiler for both of these projects. My recent Driftwood venture did not include huge pieces of Driftwood so I didn't drag out the Crawfish Boiller but I was tempted to. Here is a NICE system which can also be used for frying turkeys so they are a year round fixture now. http://www.lalagniappe.com/mall/lobby-deep-fry-hot-tub.htm and if a 34 Qt. pot isn't big enough, here are some more.. up to 60 Qt. http://froogle.google.com/froogle?q=Crawfish%20Boiler&hl=en&lr=&sa=N&tab=wf Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: Date: Thu, 28 Jul 2005 21:09:18 -0400 From: "Steve Sabot" <steve@...> Subject: RE: Ph - Bogwood Galvanized horse trough over a fire probably would have worked <g>. Kind of reminds me of the time someone won a 22 lb. Lobster at a Fish & Game Club event. We had to find something big enough to hold it for cooking (boiling) and then a way to get the water up to boiling. Finally found a big enough container that would actually hold water and take the heat, then used all four burners on the stove to heat the water prior to placing the lobster in it. Then the debate was how long to boil it (normally 15 minutes). I forgot what we determined, but it got the job done and we all had more than our fill of lobster and beer. The old bird was a bit tough, though. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nimish Mathur Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 2:40 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Ph - Bogwood Steve, On a rare occasion, my LFS had got some bogwood from Africa and they had to take back a lot of this wood from people (excluding me) as it almost never seemed to stop leeching tannins even after 6-8 months. I had them in a very large tank (100 gallons) for more then a year and they were still leeching out tannins :-(. Considering the UK's wet weather, I let the woods sit in the garden for another year and all seasons and about 4 months ago I started to reuse them and they are perfectly fine now :-). No leeching color or tannins any more and perfectly stable. I don't know why they were like this but I suspect that they needed more time. Some one I know had also reported that it took almost 18 months for the same shipment of wood to stop leeching tannins but were otherwise perfectly safe. I did want to boil it too but because the pieces were as large as 3.5ft-4ft, I was unable to figure out a proper way to boil a piece lol. But it is a very rare occasion and they have not ordered from the same company after that. Nim [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14057	From: joequality1980	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: swordtail maturity

At what age do juvenile swordtails reach sexual maturity? I have some that are 5 months old, and none have the male sword or the pointy male anal fin. Will some eventually grow their tail out and at what age, or do I have all females? Future advice: the best method to respond to an inappropriate posting is to not respond at all.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14058	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: Re: swordtail maturity

Joe, IME they start to develop the gonopodium and the sword at the age of 3-4 months. A lot depends on the temperature you are keeping them at and what food you are feeding. Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of joequality1980 Sent: 29 July 2005 18:46 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] swordtail maturity At what age do juvenile swordtails reach sexual maturity? I have some that are 5 months old, and none have the male sword or the pointy male anal fin. Will some eventually grow their tail out and at what age, or do I have all females? Future advice: the best method to respond to an inappropriate posting is to not respond at all. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14059	From: rosette55@webtv.net	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: please trim your posts

hello all, could you please trim your posts of old posts and yahoo headers? i am on digest form and the list is always truncated from being too long with unnecessary stuff. maybe it is my webtv but i can't read the entire digest. thanks so much. samantha

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14060	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: Re: swordtail maturity

May I jump in and ask if the same is true of guppies? When do they develop their color? I have mine at 76F. Thanks for letting me share your post :) Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@y...> wrote: > Joe, > > IME they start to develop the gonopodium and the sword at the age of 3-4 > months. A lot depends on the temperature you are keeping them at and what > food you are feeding. > > Nim > > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of joequality1980 > Sent: 29 July 2005 18:46 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] swordtail maturity > > > > At what age do juvenile swordtails reach sexual maturity? I have some > that are 5 months old, and none have the male sword or the pointy male > anal fin. Will some eventually grow their tail out and at what age, or > do I have all females? > > Future advice: the best method to respond to an inappropriate posting > is to not respond at all. > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > _____ > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14061	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: Re: hot water!

it is unreasonable but that's the bay area for you. where else could you get away with charging $800k for a 2 br house? that is a very average price for san rafael (north bay), some cities on the peninsula like san carlos, menlo park, atherton (where jerry rice lives), redwood shores (where oracle is located) and even in san mateo where i live. my rent on a decent 2 br 1 ba apt is more than my brother's mortgage payment on his 4 br 2 ba home in chico (north of here by 3 hours). but it's worth it to me to live here because you can't beat the cultural diversity, the higher salaries and the amazing things to see and do. --- Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > That certainly seems to be an unreasonable price for a room air conditioner. > Around here, you can get one for a couple of hundred dollars, and the same > was true when I was in New England. Of course, if you want a king of the > road model, that will set you back more. > > My parents had one that lasted them about 20 years. Fifteen of those years > I put it in for them in the summer and took it out in the fall--then I got > smart and moved down to the DC area <g>, and it was entirely up to my > brother to do it. Maybe that is why it finally broke down <g>. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez > Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 1:31 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] hot water! > > the peninsula area of the san francisco bay area > > --- Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > > > Where are you located that the unit is so expensive? Last year, I replaced > > my heat pump, both the exterior and interior portions, and it ran me only > > $6000. And that cools the whole house in the summer and heats it in the > > winter (sometimes with an electrical heating coil assisting). > > > > \\Steve// > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez > > Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 3:51 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] hot water! > > > > are you kidding? minimal cost for a portable a/c here is $1300. that's why > i > > don't have one. > > > > --- Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: > > > > > Turn the a/c up. > > > > > > Seriously, though. For everybody here who doesn't have an air > > conditioner: > > > Get one. If you can afford a fish tank, you don't have any excuse to > not > > > have a good air conditioner to keep the room it is in cool in the > summer, > > > and a good safe heater to keep it warm in the winter. Not to mention > you > > > are more likely to die of heat stroke in your own house if you don't > keep > > it > > > cool. Also, if you can afford an internet connection, you have no > excuse > > to > > > not have an a/c. They aren't really that expensive. A lot cheaper than > > > restocking your tanks or paying medical bills when you fall over dead. > > > > > > > > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy. > > > > > > "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But > it > > is > > > perhaps, the end of the beginning." > > > -Winston Churchill > > > -------Original Message------- > > > Howdy! The water temp. has been off the chart in 1 of my tanks. I've > been > > putting ice in a > > > baggie & putting that in the tank, but it doesn't help much. My oscar's > > skin is coming off & > > > he's not eating. I've also been putting med. in the tank. What else can > I > > do? > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > > My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!! > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14062	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: Re: hot water!

Washington, DC area. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez Sent: Friday, July 29, 2005 3:21 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] hot water! it is unreasonable but that's the bay area for you. where else could you get away with charging $800k for a 2 br house? that is a very average price for san rafael (north bay), some cities on the peninsula like san carlos, menlo park, atherton (where jerry rice lives), redwood shores (where oracle is located) and even in san mateo where i live. my rent on a decent 2 br 1 ba apt is more than my brother's mortgage payment on his 4 br 2 ba home in chico (north of here by 3 hours). but it's worth it to me to live here because you can't beat the cultural diversity, the higher salaries and the amazing things to see and do. --- Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > That certainly seems to be an unreasonable price for a room air conditioner. > Around here, you can get one for a couple of hundred dollars, and the > same was true when I was in New England. Of course, if you want a king > of the road model, that will set you back more. > > My parents had one that lasted them about 20 years. Fifteen of those > years I put it in for them in the summer and took it out in the > fall--then I got smart and moved down to the DC area <g>, and it was > entirely up to my brother to do it. Maybe that is why it finally broke down <g>. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez > Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 1:31 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] hot water! > > the peninsula area of the san francisco bay area > > --- Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > > > Where are you located that the unit is so expensive? Last year, I > > replaced my heat pump, both the exterior and interior portions, and > > it ran me only $6000. And that cools the whole house in the summer > > and heats it in the winter (sometimes with an electrical heating coil assisting). > > > > \\Steve// > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez > > Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 3:51 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] hot water! > > > > are you kidding? minimal cost for a portable a/c here is $1300. > > that's why > i > > don't have one. > > > > --- Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: > > > > > Turn the a/c up. > > > > > > Seriously, though. For everybody here who doesn't have an air > > conditioner: > > > Get one. If you can afford a fish tank, you don't have any excuse > > > to > not > > > have a good air conditioner to keep the room it is in cool in the > summer, > > > and a good safe heater to keep it warm in the winter. Not to > > > mention > you > > > are more likely to die of heat stroke in your own house if you > > > don't > keep > > it > > > cool. Also, if you can afford an internet connection, you have no > excuse > > to > > > not have an a/c. They aren't really that expensive. A lot > > > cheaper than restocking your tanks or paying medical bills when you fall over dead. > > > > > > > > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy. > > > > > > "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. > > > But > it > > is > > > perhaps, the end of the beginning." > > > -Winston Churchill > > > -------Original Message------- > > > Howdy! The water temp. has been off the chart in 1 of my tanks. > > > I've > been > > putting ice in a > > > baggie & putting that in the tank, but it doesn't help much. My > > > oscar's > > skin is coming off & > > > he's not eating. I've also been putting med. in the tank. What > > > else can > I > > do? > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > > My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!! > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14063	From: joequality1980	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: Re: hot water!

I grew up in San Mateo (on Hillsdale), and the Bay Area is becoming more and more unavailalble for the average person to live in. Los Angeles is more affordable and diverse. But I digress... so it would be worth paying for a cooling system just for the summer months? The highest I've seen my tanks go is 84, but then I got several fans that do help a little --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@y...> wrote: > it is unreasonable but that's the bay area for you. where else could you get away with charging > $800k for a 2 br house? that is a very average price for san rafael (north bay), some cities on > the peninsula like san carlos, menlo park, atherton (where jerry rice lives), redwood shores > (where oracle is located) and even in san mateo where i live. my rent on a decent 2 br 1 ba apt is > more than my brother's mortgage payment on his 4 br 2 ba home in chico (north of here by 3 hours). > > but it's worth it to me to live here because you can't beat the cultural diversity, the higher > salaries and the amazing things to see and do.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14064	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: Re: hot water!

good to find another san matean (sp? right word?) here. yep the bay's housing prices are ridiculous. but as long as i can still pay my rent i don't care. i have no desire to own a home and deal with all the headaches that can bring. i personally would never pay $1,300 for an a/c because the computer fans i have on all my tanks keep the temps below 80 without fail, even a couple weeks ago when temps outside soared to the mid 90s. --- joequality1980 <crazy.joe.walcek@...> wrote: > I grew up in San Mateo (on Hillsdale), and the Bay Area is becoming > more and more unavailalble for the average person to live in. Los > Angeles is more affordable and diverse. > > But I digress... so it would be worth paying for a cooling system just > for the summer months? The highest I've seen my tanks go is 84, but > then I got several fans that do help a little > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14065	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: Re: guppies and swordtails

Linda, A cross between a guppy and a swordtail is highly unlikely, else we would probably be inundated by them already. There are many community tanks where guppies and swords are kept together, and I do not ever recall hearing of a cross between these two fish. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 8:41 PM To: mnaquarium@yahoogroups.com; AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com; uniaquaria@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] guppies and swordtails I have two male guppies, three female pineapple swordtails and a male pineapple swordtail. The swordtails were added on Sunday. The male guppies have "discovered" the female and have been dogging them all day. Is there any possibility of them breeding? I have not seen the male sword dogging them. I know platies and swordtails can cross breed, but what about guppies and swordtails? Linda

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14066	From: camdogkingsfan	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: question about posting a message

There is allot of people that post messages everyday and I want to know how do I knw when someone has posted a responce about my messages? I really don't want to do through all the pages of messages to see if someone responded.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14067	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: Re: question about posting a message

change the subject line a little That way if anyone hits REPLY to your message it will read RE:[AquaticLife] what ever the subject is Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 7/29/2005 8:02:46 PM US Eastern Standard Time, camdog@... writes: There is allot of people that post messages everyday and I want to know how do I knw when someone has posted a responce about my messages? I really don't want to do through all the pages of messages to see if someone responded. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14068	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: dead sword and cory

I need some expert advice. I know it is common to loose a couple fish here and there, but I was wondering what y'all thought. On Sunday I purchased five swordtails (three pineapple females, one pineapple male and my daughter insisted on a red wag male). The pineapples were fine the first 48 hours. The red wag immediately went to the bottom of the tank and came out seldom; only to pick at food. He died on Tuesday. I lost one of the female pineapple swords today. All of them used to spend a lot of time swimming around the tank. The one that died this morning spent a lot of time laying on the bottom of the tank yesterday. Today, there is another one spending a lot of time on the bottom. I really like these swordtails. The two male guppies have spent endless hours with their noses attached to the swordtails bellies. I have even seen them dogging the male swordtail. The the two male guppies are now in my ten gallon tank because I can't stand watching them. The paleatus cories I have had at least four weeks. One of them quit eating and seldom moved about the tank. Two days ago I noticed that he was blacker in color than the rest of his shoal. This morning I found him dead on the bottom with what looked to be a bloodied bruise on his bottom/side. My water parameters are all good. GH 11 (stable between 10-12) KH 9 (stable between 9-10) pH 7.5 - 7.8 stable ammonia 0 nitrite <.3 nitrate 5-10 This tank has never shown any ammonia or nitrites. The swordtails were introduce very slowly to the tank. I put the bag in a dark colored pitcher and added about three TBS of aquarium water to the bag about every 15 minutes. I have live plants in my tank. I do not us CO 2. The last water change was done on Monday and I changed about 1/4 of the water. Other than the fish, the only thing new to the tank is some java fern and some java moss. Everyone in the tank looks healthy and symptom free. What would make the cory turn dark? The only thing I can think of is lack of oxygen. Which leads me to another question. The spray bar to my Eheim filter was originally positioned to move the surface water. But when we had the heat spell last week, the surface temp was two to four degree warmer than the temp. at the bottom of the tank, so I re-directed the spray bar to point down. I still have quite a bit of surface movement from my Emperor 400. Any advice/suggestions would be great! Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14069	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: Re: What causes a nitrite spike

Hi Emily, Yes that could be the cause if your Biofilter is inadequate or malfunctioning for some reason and the nitrifying bacteria have been using your gravel as a media. Why have you been doing so many water changes ?. regards, unclenorm. --- Emily Tenczar <bababanana@...> wrote: > Okay, I guess 0.5 ppm isn't exactly a spike, but > what would cause nitrite levels to rise? I know fish > waste can cause this, but ammonia is at zero and the > tank is established and cycled. Is it because I've > done several 15-20% water changes this week with the > gravel vaccum? > > Emily > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ___________________________________________________________ To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. http://uk.security.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14070	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: Re: please trim your posts

Hi Samantha, If you trim the post you are replying to then there is no continuity to the thread. If you don't want individual emails why not read messages on the site rather than in digest ? regards, unclenorm. --- rosette55@... wrote: > hello all, could you please trim your posts of old > posts and yahoo > headers? i am on digest form and the list is always > truncated from > being too long with unnecessary stuff. maybe it is > my webtv but i can't > read the entire digest. thanks so much. samantha > > ___________________________________________________________ How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14071	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: identifying a pleco

Several weeks ago I purchased a pleco. I bought it because it wasn't suppose to get more than four inches. I wanted something more colorful than your average brown pleco, so the one I got is gold in color. I paid $14.99 for it. I wanted to know it's exact name so I could look it up on Planetcatfish.com. I dug out my receipt and it was rung up as plecostomus-tem. albino lg. Now, if it is an albino, shouldn't it have pink eyes? Mine definitely has black eyes. I am kind of worried because the receipt says-large. I did consult with a sales associate as to what I was looking for and he pointed me in the direction of this particular pleco. You can see a picture of him posted under Linda's.. Thanks Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14072	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: Re: Central Filtration idea?/Automation?

Daniel, Using standpipes is the way to go in the system you are planning. This does away with faulty siphons, and you can also control the water level to a certain extent if you set it up correctly, using threaded bulkhead fittings and pipe, you can cut different lengths of pipe. These pipes will drain into a reservoir either directly, or through a larger pipe. A pump will take the water and feed it through a filter and past a UV light to help kill any bacteria and/or parasites that may be present and back into the tanks by overhanging pipes to each of the tanks. The question here is whether you want to drill the tanks yourself, or have it done for you. Drilling tanks is not the easiest thing in the world, but it can be done. I know people who have done it. It takes time and patience to get it right. You'll need to build yourself a jig to hold the tank in place and one to hold the drill in place. You'll need a diamond tipped, I believe it is a diamond tipped, blade, and water to keep both the drill and glass cool. Using the jigs, you can get the holes in the same place in every tank, which will make the plumbing job easier. I know that there have been some articles written on this, but I'll be doggoned if I could lay my hands on the right away. They probably did appear in FAMA. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Daniel Sent: Thursday, July 28, 2005 10:34 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Central Filtration idea?/Automation? In the near future I am plannig on building me a building with 30 or more tanks in it for breeding.The Fish will need the same water quality and I wanted to use central filtration for the tanks and automate all of the water changes and such.I am not sure the chooses I had about drilling or not drilling the tanks and how the plumming would be routed to the tanks and filter. >does anyone have a setup like that and maybe could put up some picture or decribe the setup? >Or does anyone know any good sites that will show you how to setup a central filtration system or any DIY automation for it? >also if anyone has any kind breeding setups and could share some pictures of it that would be great. Thanks Daniel

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14073	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/29/2005
Subject: yet another light question

I was studying up on lighting and light bulbs. I found an article that went over Kelvin stuff. I work at the Home Depot and on lunch today I went and looked at light bulbs. We sell 40 watt/1600 lumens/2700k bulbs for $9.99. These bulb are specifically markets for planted aquariums. The bulbs I currently have in my tank are Eclipse Natural Daylight F40T10 bulbs. I was just wondering if the bulbs at Home Depot would be better for my plants than what I have while I am saving up my money for a better lighting system. The tubes from HD are 2700k; and full spectrum light is about 5000k. I thought full spectrum light were better for plants? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14074	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: ammonia reading

To establish a cycle generally takes 4-6 weeks. However, by now, you should have readings of 0 ppm for ammonia and be worried about nitrite. I would suggest that you may have too many fish in your tank for one, probably by a factor of two. Also, as was indicated in another thread that occurred in this space recently, the use of zeolites to remove ammonia may be harmful to your successfully establishing a cycle, in that it may not allow sufficient colonies of nitrobacter and nitrosomas bacteria to become established in your tank. Since you are relying on your filter to be your do-all filter, you should probably consider a biowheel type of attachment to the filter to provide area for the necessary bacteria that carry out your biological filtration, else you will be causing a mini cycle each time you change or clean your filter media. Finally, because this seems like a handy place to put it, though it does not relate directly with your situation at present (though it may in the future), I was doing some research the other night, looking for a table showing ammonia toxicity as it relates to pH, and I ran across and interesting few paragraphs in one of my references. It talks about the long term effects of ammonia on fish. This is based on research done in the 1970's and earlier, so there may be a more definitive answer out there at this point, though I have not pursued it yet, but, as we have stated in the past, persistent ammonia presence in the environment leads to the death of fish. It seems to affect the way that the hemoglobin in the fish's blood handles the transfer of oxygen to the cells of fish. The ability of hemoglobin to do this transfer is adversely affected in the presence of even small amounts of ammonia over long periods of time, which leads to the eventual death of the fish. I'll try to follow this up over the next few weeks, but my time is rather limited right now, as I have been slaughtered with work lately (which is only supposed to happen after I return from time off--not before I leave <g>), witness that I am replying to a post from Thursday on a Saturday. The results are definitive, it is just that the cause is (was) open to discussion. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Sandy Kay Sent: Thursday, July 28, 2005 2:37 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] ammonia reading Hi, I have a 10 gallon freshwater tank that is a month running. I have 3 danios, 3 small tetras, 3 guppies, 1 molly, 1 small pleco, 2 small upside down catifsh. My ammonia reading stays at 0.25. I know that isn't bad but wish I could get it to read 0. And I do know it will change with feeding, etc. back and forth. The nitrates are 0 most of the time. I also have several live plants, no plastic and a small piece of driftwood. I do not overfeed and sometimes skip a day. I am running zeolite through my filter along with carbon. Does anyone have input on this? Thank you in advance, Sandy

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14075	From: richard thompson	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: yet another light question

linda, are the 40 watt bulbs the 48 inch size? i think eclipse bulbs max out at 24 inches. Crazy4fids@... wrote:I was studying up on lighting and light bulbs. I found an article that went over Kelvin stuff. I work at the Home Depot and on lunch today I went and looked at light bulbs. We sell 40 watt/1600 lumens/2700k bulbs for $9.99. These bulb are specifically markets for planted aquariums. The bulbs I currently have in my tank are Eclipse Natural Daylight F40T10 bulbs. I was just wondering if the bulbs at Home Depot would be better for my plants than what I have while I am saving up my money for a better lighting system. The tubes from HD are 2700k; and full spectrum light is about 5000k. I thought full spectrum light were better for plants? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14076	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: yet another light question

In a message dated 7/30/2005 8:39:42 A.M. Central Standard Time, rapidostang@... writes: linda, are the 40 watt bulbs the 48 inch size? i think eclipse bulbs max out at 24 inches. Yes. I am sure of it! Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14077	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: blue rams

I gave this some thought. The combination you mention may work, if the water quality is very good. Rams are rather sensitive to nitrates, so this is important. The reason I had to think on this for a bit is that I'd not think of doing it myself. I'd have a tendency to keep the rams in a species tank, or, perhaps, add a few fish that would occupy the upper third of the water column. If you heavily plant a portion of the tank, where you may like the rams to hang out, perhaps on one end of the tank, then there would probably not be much competition for that section of the tank, as long as all your plants were not in that area., and there were other areas suitable for the keyholes. But, I still think the rams would do better by themselves. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Thursday, July 28, 2005 8:16 PM To: mnaquarium@yahoogroups.com; AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] blue rams Would you, should you, could you put blue rams in with keyhole cichlids and angels? Would the keyholes and rams compete for the same bottom territory? Linda

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14078	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: blue rams

Thanks Steve! Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14079	From: ahorseofcourse66	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: Question on Gouramis ?

--Steve, They are blues and gold gouramis and they are in a 20 gallon. We setup our 55 gallon 2 days ago and are just waiting to put them in. We put in 3 dwarfs and 3 gaint danos last night. We will be checking water tonight and if all is fine will proably try the 2 blue gourmis in the tank Sunday. They are not really fighting at this time, but the female stays in one corner and doesn't come out much because the male chases her when she does. I hope the 55 gallon with more space and several plants and 2 caves will help the problem. Will let you know. Thanks for the reply. - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > Which gouramis do you have, specifically? All gouramis are aggressive to a > greater or lesser degree. One means to lessen the aggression is to have > enough tank space and enough hiding places so that each can establish a > territory in the aquarium. Do note that this will only lessen the > aggression, not cure it. This would naturally lead to another question, what > size is your tank and how is it aquascaped? > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of ahorseofcourse66 > Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 11:02 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Question on Gouramis ? > > Big ? We have 4 gouramis, 2 males and 2 female. Non of them will get > along. The first male and female we bought fought to the point they > drew blood. Now the male fights any fish you put him with and the > female gets along fine with any fist but other gouramis. Now we bought > another pair and they didn't get along, so we seperated them and after > aweek we are trying again. They seemed to be ok for alittle while the > female was currling up around the male and he seemed to not care then > she started chasing him around the tank, then they started this curling > around each other and holding onto each others tail and now their back > to her chasing him. Which the first time we had them together he was > the one chasing her. Now all he wants to do is hide. Anyone have any > experence or might have some input?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14080	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: please trim your posts

One does try to remember to trim the posts, but due to time constraints, memory loss, and other distractions, one may not always be successful. One does wonder, from time to time, especially on this list, why people choose to receive messages in a digest mode rather than individually. It does not save space, other than when the digest is truncated by Yahoo! for length (size). And it does make it impossible to sort messages by topic so that one may read all current replies in a thread at the same time. Which actually brings up my pet peeve, that I only see on this list. It is actually two peeves, but the primary one is that someone is using an editor to reply to messages that puts the RE: after the group tag [AquaticLife], which throws off the sort function of my e-mail reader. When someone replies with an editor that places the RE: in the correct position, it starts yet a new thread, according to a subject sort. I suspect that what happens is that the editor actually strips the [AquaticLife] tag and then sends the message without it, and then the group software places a new one on the reply. Makes things very confusing no matter how it happens. When one receives in excess of 200 messages a day, not counting spam, which is filtered off, and a few other specific messages that get filtered off into another folder, knowing whether one should place his two cents worth in is rather important from a stand point of available time. The other peeve is the slight changing of a subject, when the content could very well remain under the original subject header which leads to two very similar threads. I have no problem of a subject changing when the topic veers off course, but all too frequently, the topic is still viable under the same subject and should stay there. Well, there is yet another as long as I am on the subject. I've been doing this e-mail thing since the late '70's. There is a certain etiquette that has built up around communicating with e-mail. When it comes to lists, there are certain forms of etiquette that develop among the community of the list. Most lists look favorably upon the retaining of previous content with the reply. This way one can refresh himself on the content that has gone on prior to his participation in a thread, or be reminded of the content when continuing a thread he has already participated in. This can help, in a certain fashion, to prevent repeating of answers or comments given in the course of a thread. (Of course, for example, if I had just received this message and was replying to it, and someone else was doing the same, we may be giving the same reply. There is absolutely no way to prevent this from happening, and it is quite understandable when it does.) This is my first and last post on these peeves, and I do hope that this is the last post I see on this "Trim your messages, people" topic on this forum (though I know the hope is futile). I also dislike seeing an endless list of "Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks." below a message in a thread, but I can live with it, and, if need be, trim it if I should archive the thread. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of rosette55@... Sent: Friday, July 29, 2005 2:23 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] please trim your posts hello all, could you please trim your posts of old posts and yahoo headers? i am on digest form and the list is always truncated from being too long with unnecessary stuff. maybe it is my webtv but i can't read the entire digest. thanks so much. samantha

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14081	From: Daniel	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: Central Filtration idea?/Automation?

Thank you Steve I think I know how I will do it now. But if for say I had a sump filter of some kind on the floor below the tanks would I just have gravity send the water to it or would I have a pump on the intake side of the filter? of course I would have a pump on the out side to pump water back in the tanks. Daniel --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > Daniel, > > Using standpipes is the way to go in the system you are planning. This does > away with faulty siphons, and you can also control the water level to a > certain extent if you set it up correctly, using threaded bulkhead fittings > and pipe, you can cut different lengths of pipe. These pipes will drain into > a reservoir either directly, or through a larger pipe. A pump will take the > water and feed it through a filter and past a UV light to help kill any > bacteria and/or parasites that may be present and back into the tanks by > overhanging pipes to each of the tanks. > > The question here is whether you want to drill the tanks yourself, or have > it done for you. Drilling tanks is not the easiest thing in the world, but > it can be done. I know people who have done it. It takes time and patience > to get it right. You'll need to build yourself a jig to hold the tank in > place and one to hold the drill in place. You'll need a diamond tipped, I > believe it is a diamond tipped, blade, and water to keep both the drill and > glass cool. Using the jigs, you can get the holes in the same place in every > tank, which will make the plumbing job easier. I know that there have been > some articles written on this, but I'll be doggoned if I could lay my hands > on the right away. They probably did appear in FAMA. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Daniel > Sent: Thursday, July 28, 2005 10:34 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Central Filtration idea?/Automation? > > In the near future I am plannig on building me a building with 30 or > more tanks in it for breeding.The Fish will need the same water > quality and I wanted to use central filtration for the tanks and > automate all of the water changes and such.I am not sure the chooses I > had about drilling or not drilling the tanks and how the plumming > would be routed to the tanks and filter. > >does anyone have a setup like that and maybe could put up some > picture or decribe the setup? > >Or does anyone know any good sites that will show you how to setup a > central filtration system or any DIY automation for it? > >also if anyone has any kind breeding setups and could share some > pictures of it that would be great. > > Thanks > Daniel

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14082	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: filter media

I was wondering if there was a material that would work as a replacement of the store bought carbon filled ones.... I am thinking of getting the refillable carbon cartridge. I have seen a little bit mentioned of this topic but unfortunately I missed most of it. MM & MP, '73 Tricia, KG6PNC A couple of great sites for fun http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya Check out my yahoogroup..... clickable [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14083	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: question about posting a message

Sort your messages by subject and look for your subject line. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of camdogkingsfan Sent: Friday, July 29, 2005 9:02 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] question about posting a message There is allot of people that post messages everyday and I want to know how do I knw when someone has posted a responce about my messages? I really don't want to do through all the pages of messages to see if someone responded. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14084	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: identifying a pleco

Without an ID coming with the fish, and even then, it is hard to identify a pleco with any certainty. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Friday, July 29, 2005 11:18 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] identifying a pleco Several weeks ago I purchased a pleco. I bought it because it wasn't suppose to get more than four inches. I wanted something more colorful than your average brown pleco, so the one I got is gold in color. I paid $14.99 for it. I wanted to know it's exact name so I could look it up on Planetcatfish.com. I dug out my receipt and it was rung up as plecostomus-tem. albino lg. Now, if it is an albino, shouldn't it have pink eyes? Mine definitely has black eyes. I am kind of worried because the receipt says-large. I did consult with a sales associate as to what I was looking for and he pointed me in the direction of this particular pleco. You can see a picture of him posted under Linda's.. Thanks Linda

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14085	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: Question on Gouramis ?

Blue and gold gouramis are color varieties of the same fish, _Trichogaster trichopterus_ . They tend to be more aggressive than most other gouramis, and will grow to about 6". They may have established a pecking order by now, n the female in the corner is the low man on the totem pole, so to speak. You are liable to see an uptick in the aggressive behavior when you move them to the new tank. Especially if you move them separately to the new tank. The two you move first will have some time to establish a territory, and the other two will be seen as invaders by the original fish in the tank. This could be alleviated somewhat by moving the décor around just prior to the introduction of the other gouramis. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of ahorseofcourse66 Sent: Saturday, July 30, 2005 11:01 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Question on Gouramis ? --Steve, They are blues and gold gouramis and they are in a 20 gallon. We setup our 55 gallon 2 days ago and are just waiting to put them in. We put in 3 dwarfs and 3 gaint danos last night. We will be checking water tonight and if all is fine will proably try the 2 blue gourmis in the tank Sunday. They are not really fighting at this time, but the female stays in one corner and doesn't come out much because the male chases her when she does. I hope the 55 gallon with more space and several plants and 2 caves will help the problem. Will let you know. Thanks for the reply. - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > Which gouramis do you have, specifically? All gouramis are aggressive to a > greater or lesser degree. One means to lessen the aggression is to have > enough tank space and enough hiding places so that each can establish a > territory in the aquarium. Do note that this will only lessen the > aggression, not cure it. This would naturally lead to another question, what > size is your tank and how is it aquascaped? > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of ahorseofcourse66 > Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 11:02 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Question on Gouramis ? > > Big ? We have 4 gouramis, 2 males and 2 female. Non of them will get > along. The first male and female we bought fought to the point they > drew blood. Now the male fights any fish you put him with and the > female gets along fine with any fist but other gouramis. Now we bought > another pair and they didn't get along, so we seperated them and after > aweek we are trying again. They seemed to be ok for alittle while the > female was currling up around the male and he seemed to not care then > she started chasing him around the tank, then they started this curling > around each other and holding onto each others tail and now their back > to her chasing him. Which the first time we had them together he was > the one chasing her. Now all he wants to do is hide. Anyone have any > experence or might have some input?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14086	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: Central Filtration idea?/Automation?

This would be a design question you would have to answer for yourself. I'd probably try to set it up so that I had the pump from the sump to the filter and then let gravity handle the flow back to the tank, unless it is a canister type filter, in which case you could create a flow through push. I'd also have a float valve to shut the pump off should the water level get too low to effectively pump, so that I would not burn out the pump. This is a definite consideration in this type of setup. You need an automatic means to shut down the pump(s) you are using should there be a problem with the supply of water to it, no matter where the placement of the pump(s) is. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Daniel Sent: Saturday, July 30, 2005 12:20 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Central Filtration idea?/Automation? Thank you Steve I think I know how I will do it now. But if for say I had a sump filter of some kind on the floor below the tanks would I just have gravity send the water to it or would I have a pump on the intake side of the filter? of course I would have a pump on the out side to pump water back in the tanks. Daniel --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > Daniel, > > Using standpipes is the way to go in the system you are planning. This does > away with faulty siphons, and you can also control the water level to a > certain extent if you set it up correctly, using threaded bulkhead fittings > and pipe, you can cut different lengths of pipe. These pipes will drain into > a reservoir either directly, or through a larger pipe. A pump will take the > water and feed it through a filter and past a UV light to help kill any > bacteria and/or parasites that may be present and back into the tanks by > overhanging pipes to each of the tanks. > > The question here is whether you want to drill the tanks yourself, or have > it done for you. Drilling tanks is not the easiest thing in the world, but > it can be done. I know people who have done it. It takes time and patience > to get it right. You'll need to build yourself a jig to hold the tank in > place and one to hold the drill in place. You'll need a diamond tipped, I > believe it is a diamond tipped, blade, and water to keep both the drill and > glass cool. Using the jigs, you can get the holes in the same place in every > tank, which will make the plumbing job easier. I know that there have been > some articles written on this, but I'll be doggoned if I could lay my hands > on the right away. They probably did appear in FAMA. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Daniel > Sent: Thursday, July 28, 2005 10:34 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Central Filtration idea?/Automation? > > In the near future I am plannig on building me a building with 30 or > more tanks in it for breeding.The Fish will need the same water > quality and I wanted to use central filtration for the tanks and > automate all of the water changes and such.I am not sure the chooses I > had about drilling or not drilling the tanks and how the plumming > would be routed to the tanks and filter. > >does anyone have a setup like that and maybe could put up some > picture or decribe the setup? > >Or does anyone know any good sites that will show you how to setup a > central filtration system or any DIY automation for it? > >also if anyone has any kind breeding setups and could share some > pictures of it that would be great. > > Thanks > Daniel

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14087	From: aclaar877	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Water parameters - Planted discus

I'd like to hear from successful planted discus tank owners--what is your mix of pH, kH, gH, and CO2? How do you keep a lower, stable pH without dangerous levels of CO2? Or is pH around 6.8-7.0 OK for tank- bred discus? I just bought an RO unit, but I think I've stressed my cardinal tetras due to hard water and pH fluctuations due to the Co2. My water is fairly hard, but has a kH around 2.0. Thanks.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14088	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: flea and spider bombs

Ok so I guess we are bombing my house as my roommate has decided so before this all takes place I want to know what i should do with my tank I have told her that none of the bombs will be allowed to go off in my room which is where my tanks are I have heard that i need to shut off the filter but for how long and also that i should cover my tanks but with what... anyone have any advice or knowledge on this area... thanks Shannon [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14089	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: flea and spider bombs

since your tanks are still small( right ? ) 10 gallons and less i'd suggest removing the tanks from the house until the bombing is done. After the house has been bombed Air house out for about an hour and return fish. If this is not possible, turn off all filters, remove airpumps from house, and cover tanks with a Towel or blanket. Once the bombs have been dropped, check for oily film or foreign material ontop of water,do a partial waterchange and watch for fish for signs of stress. Spiders and fleas will escape to the room that is not bombed.... so might as well bomb the whole house. I say remove airpumps from house: i may be paranoid but i'd hate for the checmicals to be on the pump and then plug them in injecting harmful chemicals into my tank. of course you could get rid of housemate and get another tank and live with the fleas. :-)~ rob Indiana n a message dated 7/30/2005 3:26:03 PM US Eastern Standard Time, agentscullyeyore@... writes: Ok so I guess we are bombing my house as my roommate has decided so before this all takes place I want to know what i should do with my tank I have told her that none of the bombs will be allowed to go off in my room which is where my tanks are I have heard that i need to shut off the filter but for how long and also that i should cover my tanks but with what... anyone have any advice or knowledge on this area... thanks Shannon [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14090	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: please trim your posts

Hey Steve, As you can see below my signature, the "Messages" in the digest format do not have the "[AquaticLife]" in the subject line... unless someone hits Reply which would then have "[AquaticLife] Digest Number 905" which is the one your email appeared in. Your email client added the "RE:" in the Subject line, or Yahoo did it, depending on how your original Subject line appeared. Rosette55 had "[AquaticLife] please trim your posts" and your message showed up as "RE: please trim your posts" so I'm not sure what the solution would be for that peeve. Should I copy/paste "RE: please trim your reply" since I am replying to your post or should I include the "[AquaticLife]" before or after the "RE:"? I normally copy/paste the previous message into a new email and then copy/paste the Subject line as I did with this one.... "RE: please trim your posts"... and what Yahoo does to the subject line by the time you get it, I have no control over. I only do a friendly reminder to "Trim your posts please" when it gets out of hand. I've seen single messages, within a Digest, go 30 pages long which I have to scroll through to get to the next message because one-liners going back and forth that were not trimmed even once... maybe not in this group but in others. The average Digest in AquaticLife runs around 50-60KB but I've seen many go over 150KB when people leave all of the junk on their replies. On July 14, 2005, I received two Digests, one was 215KB and the other was 169KB and a big part of that was because of untrimmed posts, so instead of having to download 100KB, I had to download nearly 400KB. For people on dial-up or pay-per-minute (still around in some countries), this costs them lots of extra time and money. Apparently many, many people get the Digest formats of many Yahoo Groups, as I do, because it limits the overall number of emails that I get each day, since a single Digest will contain up to 25 messages. I only have to open one email, read it and delete it if there is nothing worth saving. With the individual emails, it would be opening 25 and deleting 25 so it conserves download time and reading time by getting the Digest. I guess it all boils down to common courtesy and we all need to be reminded of that from time to time. Just like the individual email readers would not like it if I did not edit the Digest, the Digest readers would reciprocally like the individual senders to edit theirs. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: Date: Sat, 30 Jul 2005 11:45:39 -0400 From: "Steve Szabo" <steve@...> Subject: RE: please trim your posts One does try to remember to trim the posts, but due to time constraints, memory loss, and other distractions, one may not always be successful. One does wonder, from time to time, especially on this list, why people choose to receive messages in a digest mode rather than individually. It does not save space, other than when the digest is truncated by Yahoo! for length (size). And it does make it impossible to sort messages by topic so that one may read all current replies in a thread at the same time. Which actually brings up my pet peeve, that I only see on this list. It is actually two peeves, but the primary one is that someone is using an editor to reply to messages that puts the RE: after the group tag [AquaticLife], which throws off the sort function of my e-mail reader. When someone replies with an editor that places the RE: in the correct position, it starts yet a new thread, according to a subject sort. I suspect that what happens is that the editor actually strips the [AquaticLife] tag and then sends the message without it, and then the group software places a new one on the reply. Makes things very confusing no matter how it happens. When one receives in excess of 200 messages a day, not counting spam, which is filtered off, and a few other specific messages that get filtered off into another folder, knowing whether one should place his two cents worth in is rather important from a stand point of available time. The other peeve is the slight changing of a subject, when the content could very well remain under the original subject header which leads to two very similar threads. I have no problem of a subject changing when the topic veers off course, but all too frequently, the topic is still viable under the same subject and should stay there. Well, there is yet another as long as I am on the subject. I've been doing this e-mail thing since the late '70's. There is a certain etiquette that has built up around communicating with e-mail. When it comes to lists, there are certain forms of etiquette that develop among the community of the list. Most lists look favorably upon the retaining of previous content with the reply. This way one can refresh himself on the content that has gone on prior to his participation in a thread, or be reminded of the content when continuing a thread he has already participated in. This can help, in a certain fashion, to prevent repeating of answers or comments given in the course of a thread. (Of course, for example, if I had just received this message and was replying to it, and someone else was doing the same, we may be giving the same reply. There is absolutely no way to prevent this from happening, and it is quite understandable when it does.) This is my first and last post on these peeves, and I do hope that this is the last post I see on this "Trim your messages, people" topic on this forum (though I know the hope is futile). I also dislike seeing an endless list of "Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks." below a message in a thread, but I can live with it, and, if need be, trim it if I should archive the thread. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of rosette55@... Sent: Friday, July 29, 2005 2:23 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] please trim your posts hello all, could you please trim your posts of old posts and yahoo headers? i am on digest form and the list is always truncated from being too long with unnecessary stuff. maybe it is my webtv but i can't read the entire digest. thanks so much. samantha SNIP [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14091	From: Rei - Raymond Tremor	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water (now debate about Melafix and Pimafix)

I had used melafix and pimafix together and the fishes didn't have problems with it. Yeah it does have a foamy effect and it is indicated in the label that it does make your water foamy, but my fishes didn't have problems with it. Actually they were fine after the treatment. This just my experience with the product. Now, I don't use conditioners or anything except fertilizers and my fishes are still fine. I have a ryukin that have a swim bladder problem but he/she is still alive. It lays on the bottom of the tank upside down and comes swimming fine when you touch it or feed them. Rei - Raymond Tremor LoveMoAko@... -------Original Message------- From: Eric Roberts Date: 07/25/05 21:10:10 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Foamy water (now debate about Melafix and Pimafix) Have you contacted Aquarium Pharmaceuticals about this. If it is the combo of the product, I am sure they would like to know this so that can either fix the problem or at least stop saying they are safe to use together. Maybe with a water sample, they can figure out what really killed the fish. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of paul helms Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 12:47 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: Foamy water (now debate about Melafix and Pimafix) i do sell both products, and support the use of both products, just not combined togther. most of the lfs's in the bay area of california are decent and will warn the same as i have done. we have sold it, and seen it, not just heard about it. i have done it myself on clients tanks and seen the results first hand and with 15 years experience i do know what i am doing and know how to measure. no one ever said do not do it, this whole thing started because i said it can be fatal. it was plain and simple a warning from experience. --- Lenny Vasbinder <lnvtm1@...> wrote: > Melafix and Pimafix are made by Aquarium > Pharmaceuticals http://www.aquariumpharm.com .. the > maker of many, many aquarium related products.. > water treatments, Master Test Kits, etc. They are > the US distributors for Rena products like the > Filstar Canister filter, Rena Air pumps, Rena > Heaters, etc. > > To imply that they don't test their products before > putting it on the label and website to "increase > sales" is ludicrous since they do not sell fish.. at > least not from what I've seen on their web pages. > > You say that you have only heard of it happening to > other people, yet you want to say they cannot be > mixed and in the same sentence you implore others to > not recommend it if we do not know for ourselves. > Well, I do know for myself. > > You also say "do not believe every thing you read".. > so does that mean we should not believe what AP says > about Melafix and Pimafix or not believe what you > are saying? > > You SHOULD read the labeling on the two bottles the > next time you are in a LFS. These are some of the > few products that are 100% natural and will not kill > your biofilter, affect your pH, etc. > > They probably aren't as strong as some of the other > "chemicals" out there, but they have been safe when > used as directed for my fish. > > I see people misuse things all the time and maybe > that is what has happened to the people who KILLED > all of their fish. Maybe they tried bumping the > dosage to "make it work faster" and they KILLED > their fish when they did not follow the directions. > We all know many, many people that kill their fish > for not following directions for cycling, > compatibility, etc., etc. > > Just like the 1" rule that so many people throw > around.. that is a fish KILLING rule. It only > works for about 25% of fish... the ones that stay > under 3" as adults. It does not work for Goldfish.. > one of the most popular beginner fish... and it does > not work for nearly any other fish that gets over 3" > as an adult. > > What all of this is saying is that you are right > about not believing every thing you read.. but it > does not mean that every thing you read is wrong. > If someone asks for advice in this or any other > forum and you disagree with the advice, just state > your opinion or advice. Don't claim that the other > advice or opinion is wrong when you readily admit > that you are not a "chemist". > > I do not work for, or own stock in Aquarium > Pharmaceuticals... do you work for the competition? > > Oh well.. you had your rant and now that's my rant > du jour. > > Lenny Vasbinder > http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com > 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 > LNVTM1@... > > Message: 15 > Date: Mon, 25 Jul 2005 22:58:54 -0000 > From: "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@...> > Subject: Re: Foamy water > > Do not believe everything that you read! Do you > REALLY KNOW for sure > whether or not Melafix and Pimafix can be mixed? If > not, please do > not recommend such a thing to other newer Forum > members who may not > know better. Paul is 100% correct on this one. I > too have seen and > learned of many cases of hobbyists I know mixing > these > two "medications" together and wiping out their > tanks. Most of these > tanks were well established over many years with one > fish having a > scrape or slight sore with all the other fish being > healthy, as in > cases that Paul has seen. By themselves, these > remedies are great, > so I am not trying to bash them. I am not a > chemist, so I cannot > tell you what happens when you put them together, > only that it kills > fish. Can't say why the manufacturer would > recommend it -- I would > hope it wouldn't just be to increase sales, but it > would seem obvious > they may not have really tried mixing these two meds > as a test in a > healthy fish-populated aquarium or I'm sure they > would have found it > to be detrimental. My gut feeling is that there may > be other unseen > factors involved when mixing these two, such as > maybe the water was > below a certain pH (6.6? for instance), or the water > was high in > magnesium or any number of things in these aquariums > which were not > ordinarily unsafe nor uncommon as all the aquariums > involved must > have had similar parameters, but were fatal when > these TWO meds were > introduced to the tank together. Maybe when mixing > them, you can add > no more than half strength of each one to get a > total treatment -- > that I couldn't tell you, but I can tell you mixing > them can be > fatal, even if not all the time. Although I haven't > heard of any > successful mixed treatments. Ray > > \ > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" > > <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > Hmmm.. it says on their web page and the packaging > that melafix and > > pimafix CAN be used together, that they are > complementary. What > > happens when you put them together that is fatal > and why would the > > manufacturer recommend it, then? > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > wrote: > > > they should not be used together, and can have > fatal > > > results when mixed at the same time. alone they > are > > > safe...together not so much > > > > > > --- thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > > > > > > Have you started treating your tank with > anything? > > > > I believe certain > > > > medications, such as melafix and pimafix -- > which > > > > can be used > > > > together, by the way -- cause foam to appear. > Sorry > > > > to not be of more > > > > help. > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & > Leslie > > > > Moore" > > > > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > > > > My water has developed a foam type around > the > > > > edges as well as a few > > > > > spots of randome floating clumps. The foam > is all > > > > along the edge of > > > > the > > > > > tank as well as the filter, spray wand, > etc... > > > > > All the tests are fine. No ammonia, > nitrites or > > > > high nitrates. > > > > > > > > > > I read a post a while back where someone > else had > > > > some "foam" but I > > > > > can't remember which group or what the > outcome > > > > was. > > > > > > > > > > any ideas? > > > > > > > > > > Leslie > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14092	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: flea and spider bombs

Shannon, Didn't you say that at least one of your tanks is a 20 gallon? Might not be practical to remove the tanks from the house. Of course if you can with little trouble, then sure by all means get them out of there IF you have a place to put them. Otherwise, its best to cover them with heavy clear plastic sheeting and tie it (or tape it) around the four sides. Stop and/or remove the airpump and enclose the filter with the plastic also, if its a hang on, or remove that too but don't dump the water out. You'll probably lose a good deal of the bacteria anyway as there won't be any oxygenated water flowing past them. Rob has a good point -- I didn't think about the fact the spiders and/or fleas might migrate to your room if it's not bombed too. Seal up those tanks real good (hope they're not too crowded). I don't think blankets would be enough although you could add them after the plastic. Don't unseal the tanks until after the house is thoroughly aired out. Ray \ -- - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, agentscullyeyore@a... wrote: > Ok so I guess we are bombing my house as my roommate has decided so before > this all takes place I want to know what i should do with my tank I have told > her that none of the bombs will be allowed to go off in my room which is where > my tanks are I have heard that i need to shut off the filter but for how > long and also that i should cover my tanks but with what... anyone have any > advice or knowledge on this area... thanks Shannon > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14093	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water (now debate about Melafix and Pimafix)

Raymond, Have read your current post with great interest. I'm glad to see at least one account where mixing Melafix and Pimafix didn't have a disasterous result. I trust the Goldfish's (Ryukin's) swim bladder problem was there prior to the treatment(?). Could you please fill us in on your tank water parameters at the time, if you know them. Is/was your water in the alkaline pH range? Anything else you can add? Many thanks, it would be great to get to the bottom of why this combination can be deadly under certain circumstances and to find just exactly what those circumstances have in common. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Rei - Raymond Tremor" <rei_tremor@y...> wrote: > I had used melafix and pimafix together and the fishes didn't have problems > with it. Yeah it does have a foamy effect and it is indicated in the label > that it does make your water foamy, but my fishes didn't have problems with > it. Actually they were fine after the treatment. This just my experience > with the product. Now, I don't use conditioners or anything except > fertilizers and my fishes are still fine. I have a ryukin that have a swim > bladder problem but he/she is still alive. It lays on the bottom of the tank > upside down and comes swimming fine when you touch it or feed them. > > Rei - Raymond Tremor > LoveMoAko@H... > > -------Original Message------- > > From: Eric Roberts > Date: 07/25/05 21:10:10 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Foamy water (now debate about Melafix and > Pimafix) > > Have you contacted Aquarium Pharmaceuticals about this. If it is the combo > of the product, I am sure they would like to know this so that can either > fix the problem or at least stop saying they are safe to use together. > Maybe with a water sample, they can figure out what really killed the fish. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of paul helms > Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 12:47 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: Foamy water (now debate about Melafix and > Pimafix) > > > i do sell both products, and support the use of both > products, just not combined togther. most of the > lfs's in the bay area of california are decent and > will warn the same as i have done. we have sold it, > and seen it, not just heard about it. i have done it > myself on clients tanks and seen the results first > hand and with 15 years experience i do know what i am > doing and know how to measure. no one ever said do > not do it, this whole thing started because i said it > can be fatal. it was plain and simple a warning from > experience. > > --- Lenny Vasbinder <lnvtm1@g...> wrote: > > > Melafix and Pimafix are made by Aquarium > > Pharmaceuticals http://www.aquariumpharm.com .. the > > maker of many, many aquarium related products.. > > water treatments, Master Test Kits, etc. They are > > the US distributors for Rena products like the > > Filstar Canister filter, Rena Air pumps, Rena > > Heaters, etc. > > > > To imply that they don't test their products before > > putting it on the label and website to "increase > > sales" is ludicrous since they do not sell fish.. at > > least not from what I've seen on their web pages. > > > > You say that you have only heard of it happening to > > other people, yet you want to say they cannot be > > mixed and in the same sentence you implore others to > > not recommend it if we do not know for ourselves. > > Well, I do know for myself. > > > > You also say "do not believe every thing you read".. > > so does that mean we should not believe what AP says > > about Melafix and Pimafix or not believe what you > > are saying? > > > > You SHOULD read the labeling on the two bottles the > > next time you are in a LFS. These are some of the > > few products that are 100% natural and will not kill > > your biofilter, affect your pH, etc. > > > > They probably aren't as strong as some of the other > > "chemicals" out there, but they have been safe when > > used as directed for my fish. > > > > I see people misuse things all the time and maybe > > that is what has happened to the people who KILLED > > all of their fish. Maybe they tried bumping the > > dosage to "make it work faster" and they KILLED > > their fish when they did not follow the directions. > > We all know many, many people that kill their fish > > for not following directions for cycling, > > compatibility, etc., etc. > > > > Just like the 1" rule that so many people throw > > around.. that is a fish KILLING rule. It only > > works for about 25% of fish... the ones that stay > > under 3" as adults. It does not work for Goldfish.. > > one of the most popular beginner fish... and it does > > not work for nearly any other fish that gets over 3" > > as an adult. > > > > What all of this is saying is that you are right > > about not believing every thing you read.. but it > > does not mean that every thing you read is wrong. > > If someone asks for advice in this or any other > > forum and you disagree with the advice, just state > > your opinion or advice. Don't claim that the other > > advice or opinion is wrong when you readily admit > > that you are not a "chemist". > > > > I do not work for, or own stock in Aquarium > > Pharmaceuticals... do you work for the competition? > > > > Oh well.. you had your rant and now that's my rant > > du jour. > > > > Lenny Vasbinder > > http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com > > 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 > > LNVTM1@g... > > > > Message: 15 > > Date: Mon, 25 Jul 2005 22:58:54 -0000 > > From: "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> > > Subject: Re: Foamy water > > > > Do not believe everything that you read! Do you > > REALLY KNOW for sure > > whether or not Melafix and Pimafix can be mixed? If > > not, please do > > not recommend such a thing to other newer Forum > > members who may not > > know better. Paul is 100% correct on this one. I > > too have seen and > > learned of many cases of hobbyists I know mixing > > these > > two "medications" together and wiping out their > > tanks. Most of these > > tanks were well established over many years with one > > fish having a > > scrape or slight sore with all the other fish being > > healthy, as in > > cases that Paul has seen. By themselves, these > > remedies are great, > > so I am not trying to bash them. I am not a > > chemist, so I cannot > > tell you what happens when you put them together, > > only that it kills > > fish. Can't say why the manufacturer would > > recommend it -- I would > > hope it wouldn't just be to increase sales, but it > > would seem obvious > > they may not have really tried mixing these two meds > > as a test in a > > healthy fish-populated aquarium or I'm sure they > > would have found it > > to be detrimental. My gut feeling is that there may > > be other unseen > > factors involved when mixing these two, such as > > maybe the water was > > below a certain pH (6.6? for instance), or the water > > was high in > > magnesium or any number of things in these aquariums > > which were not > > ordinarily unsafe nor uncommon as all the aquariums > > involved must > > have had similar parameters, but were fatal when > > these TWO meds were > > introduced to the tank together. Maybe when mixing > > them, you can add > > no more than half strength of each one to get a > > total treatment -- > > that I couldn't tell you, but I can tell you mixing > > them can be > > fatal, even if not all the time. Although I haven't > > heard of any > > successful mixed treatments. Ray > > > > \ > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" > > > > <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > > Hmmm.. it says on their web page and the packaging > > that melafix and > > > pimafix CAN be used together, that they are > > complementary. What > > > happens when you put them together that is fatal > > and why would the > > > manufacturer recommend it, then? > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > wrote: > > > > they should not be used together, and can have > > fatal > > > > results when mixed at the same time. alone they > > are > > > > safe...together not so much > > > > > > > > --- thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Have you started treating your tank with > > anything? > > > > > I believe certain > > > > > medications, such as melafix and pimafix -- > > which > > > > > can be used > > > > > together, by the way -- cause foam to appear. > > Sorry > > > > > to not be of more > > > > > help. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & > > Leslie > > > > > Moore" > > > > > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > > > > > My water has developed a foam type around > > the > > > > > edges as well as a few > > > > > > spots of randome floating clumps. The foam > > is all > > > > > along the edge of > > > > > the > > > > > > tank as well as the filter, spray wand, > > etc... > > > > > > All the tests are fine. No ammonia, > > nitrites or > > > > > high nitrates. > > > > > > > > > > > > I read a post a while back where someone > > else had > > > > > some "foam" but I > > > > > > can't remember which group or what the > > outcome > > > > > was. > > > > > > > > > > > > any ideas? > > > > > > > > > > > > Leslie > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14094	From: harry perry	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: (now debate about Melafix and Pimafix)/another deadly combinati

I had a wounded fish( a fight) and also a fish with fungus in the same tank. I used melafix and Jungle Lab's fungus fizz tablet at the same time. 4 dead fish later. I realized what had happened. This happened in 1 hour. I removed all the fish from the tank and broke it down. Harry Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote: Raymond, Have read your current post with great interest. I'm glad to see at least one account where mixing Melafix and Pimafix didn't have a disasterous result. I trust the Goldfish's (Ryukin's) swim bladder problem was there prior to the treatment(?). Could you please fill us in on your tank water parameters at the time, if you know them. Is/was your water in the alkaline pH range? Anything else you can add? Many thanks, it would be great to get to the bottom of why this combination can be deadly under certain circumstances and to find just exactly what those circumstances have in common. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Rei - Raymond Tremor" <rei_tremor@y...> wrote: > I had used melafix and pimafix together and the fishes didn't have problems > with it. Yeah it does have a foamy effect and it is indicated in the label > that it does make your water foamy, but my fishes didn't have problems with > it. Actually they were fine after the treatment. This just my experience > with the product. Now, I don't use conditioners or anything except > fertilizers and my fishes are still fine. I have a ryukin that have a swim > bladder problem but he/she is still alive. It lays on the bottom of the tank > upside down and comes swimming fine when you touch it or feed them. > > Rei - Raymond Tremor > LoveMoAko@H... > > -------Original Message------- > > From: Eric Roberts > Date: 07/25/05 21:10:10 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Foamy water (now debate about Melafix and > Pimafix) > > Have you contacted Aquarium Pharmaceuticals about this. If it is the combo > of the product, I am sure they would like to know this so that can either > fix the problem or at least stop saying they are safe to use together. > Maybe with a water sample, they can figure out what really killed the fish. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of paul helms > Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 12:47 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: Foamy water (now debate about Melafix and > Pimafix) > > > i do sell both products, and support the use of both > products, just not combined togther. most of the > lfs's in the bay area of california are decent and > will warn the same as i have done. we have sold it, > and seen it, not just heard about it. i have done it > myself on clients tanks and seen the results first > hand and with 15 years experience i do know what i am > doing and know how to measure. no one ever said do > not do it, this whole thing started because i said it > can be fatal. it was plain and simple a warning from > experience. > > --- Lenny Vasbinder <lnvtm1@g...> wrote: > > > Melafix and Pimafix are made by Aquarium > > Pharmaceuticals http://www.aquariumpharm.com .. the > > maker of many, many aquarium related products.. > > water treatments, Master Test Kits, etc. They are > > the US distributors for Rena products like the > > Filstar Canister filter, Rena Air pumps, Rena > > Heaters, etc. > > > > To imply that they don't test their products before > > putting it on the label and website to "increase > > sales" is ludicrous since they do not sell fish.. at > > least not from what I've seen on their web pages. > > > > You say that you have only heard of it happening to > > other people, yet you want to say they cannot be > > mixed and in the same sentence you implore others to > > not recommend it if we do not know for ourselves. > > Well, I do know for myself. > > > > You also say "do not believe every thing you read".. > > so does that mean we should not believe what AP says > > about Melafix and Pimafix or not believe what you > > are saying? > > > > You SHOULD read the labeling on the two bottles the > > next time you are in a LFS. These are some of the > > few products that are 100% natural and will not kill > > your biofilter, affect your pH, etc. > > > > They probably aren't as strong as some of the other > > "chemicals" out there, but they have been safe when > > used as directed for my fish. > > > > I see people misuse things all the time and maybe > > that is what has happened to the people who KILLED > > all of their fish. Maybe they tried bumping the > > dosage to "make it work faster" and they KILLED > > their fish when they did not follow the directions. > > We all know many, many people that kill their fish > > for not following directions for cycling, > > compatibility, etc., etc. > > > > Just like the 1" rule that so many people throw > > around.. that is a fish KILLING rule. It only > > works for about 25% of fish... the ones that stay > > under 3" as adults. It does not work for Goldfish.. > > one of the most popular beginner fish... and it does > > not work for nearly any other fish that gets over 3" > > as an adult. > > > > What all of this is saying is that you are right > > about not believing every thing you read.. but it > > does not mean that every thing you read is wrong. > > If someone asks for advice in this or any other > > forum and you disagree with the advice, just state > > your opinion or advice. Don't claim that the other > > advice or opinion is wrong when you readily admit > > that you are not a "chemist". > > > > I do not work for, or own stock in Aquarium > > Pharmaceuticals... do you work for the competition? > > > > Oh well.. you had your rant and now that's my rant > > du jour. > > > > Lenny Vasbinder > > http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com > > 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 > > LNVTM1@g... > > > > Message: 15 > > Date: Mon, 25 Jul 2005 22:58:54 -0000 > > From: "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> > > Subject: Re: Foamy water > > > > Do not believe everything that you read! Do you > > REALLY KNOW for sure > > whether or not Melafix and Pimafix can be mixed? If > > not, please do > > not recommend such a thing to other newer Forum > > members who may not > > know better. Paul is 100% correct on this one. I > > too have seen and > > learned of many cases of hobbyists I know mixing > > these > > two "medications" together and wiping out their > > tanks. Most of these > > tanks were well established over many years with one > > fish having a > > scrape or slight sore with all the other fish being > > healthy, as in > > cases that Paul has seen. By themselves, these > > remedies are great, > > so I am not trying to bash them. I am not a > > chemist, so I cannot > > tell you what happens when you put them together, > > only that it kills > > fish. Can't say why the manufacturer would > > recommend it -- I would > > hope it wouldn't just be to increase sales, but it > > would seem obvious > > they may not have really tried mixing these two meds > > as a test in a > > healthy fish-populated aquarium or I'm sure they > > would have found it > > to be detrimental. My gut feeling is that there may > > be other unseen > > factors involved when mixing these two, such as > > maybe the water was > > below a certain pH (6.6? for instance), or the water > > was high in > > magnesium or any number of things in these aquariums > > which were not > > ordinarily unsafe nor uncommon as all the aquariums > > involved must > > have had similar parameters, but were fatal when > > these TWO meds were > > introduced to the tank together. Maybe when mixing > > them, you can add > > no more than half strength of each one to get a > > total treatment -- > > that I couldn't tell you, but I can tell you mixing > > them can be > > fatal, even if not all the time. Although I haven't > > heard of any > > successful mixed treatments. Ray > > > > \ > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" > > > > <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > > Hmmm.. it says on their web page and the packaging > > that melafix and > > > pimafix CAN be used together, that they are > > complementary. What > > > happens when you put them together that is fatal > > and why would the > > > manufacturer recommend it, then? > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > wrote: > > > > they should not be used together, and can have > > fatal > > > > results when mixed at the same time. alone they > > are > > > > safe...together not so much > > > > > > > > --- thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Have you started treating your tank with > > anything? > > > > > I believe certain > > > > > medications, such as melafix and pimafix -- > > which > > > > > can be used > > > > > together, by the way -- cause foam to appear. > > Sorry > > > > > to not be of more > > > > > help. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & > > Leslie > > > > > Moore" > > > > > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > > > > > My water has developed a foam type around > > the > > > > > edges as well as a few > > > > > > spots of randome floating clumps. The foam > > is all > > > > > along the edge of > > > > > the > > > > > > tank as well as the filter, spray wand, > > etc... > > > > > > All the tests are fine. No ammonia, > > nitrites or > > > > > high nitrates. > > > > > > > > > > > > I read a post a while back where someone > > else had > > > > > some "foam" but I > > > > > > can't remember which group or what the > > outcome > > > > > was. > > > > > > > > > > > > any ideas? > > > > > > > > > > > > Leslie > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14095	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: Water parameters - Planted discus

I'm very interested in this topic, too...my DH loves discus fish, and they're just too expensive and pretty to fool around with. We want to get it right, right off the bat.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14096	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: Question on Gouramis ?

In a message dated 7/30/2005 12:17:52 P.M. Central Standard Time, steve@... writes: They may have established a pecking order by now, n the female in the corner is the low man on the totem pole, so to speak. You are liable to see an uptick in the aggressive behavior when you move them to the new tank. Especially if you move them separately to the new tank. The two you move first will have some time to establish a territory, and the other two will be seen as invaders by the original fish in the tank. This could be alleviated somewhat by moving the décor around just prior to the introduction of the other gouramis. Wouldn't it help to move the subordinate female to the tank first? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14097	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Pacific Coast Cichlid Association (PCCA), 8/13/2005, 6:45 pm

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife Pacific Coast Cichlid Association (PCCA) Saturday August 13, 2005 6:45 pm - 9:45 pm This event repeats on the second Saturday of every month. The next reminder for this event will be sent in 11 days, 4 minutes. Event Location: Round Table Pizza, 4302 Moorpark Avenue in San Jose, California Notes: The PCCA meets every second Saturday of the month. Meetings are held a the Round Table Pizza parlor located at 4302 Moorpark Avenue in San Jose, California http://www.cichlidworld.com/ ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14098	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: Water parameters - Planted discus

Hi Cynthia, By these remarks, can it be taken that you're thinking about getting discus? If so how soon? How many are you thinking of getting and what size tank do you have for them? Main thing at the moment -- what would you like to know? Will give you some stuff to work with, but I'm sure you'll have other questions. For starters, I'd have to say a 55 gallon tank (preferably at 75 or so -- naturally, the larger the better (even a 90) and more easily maintained. I keep my pairs in 50's but you'd probably want to have half a dozen or so (?) to grow up; they mature in about 18 months. They're not really a "community" fish in that you can put anything in with them (not that they're terrors), but they can be more timid than many other fish and may not be able to compete, depending of course what you intended to put with them. Often, I've seen Cardinal tetras with them, but you also have to keep in mind Discus require a higher temperature (like 84o -- or 86o for very young juveniles and fry). They like a variety of good foods (frozen bloodworms, mysis shrimp, etc.). As far as water, the tank raised Discus will do just as well in mildly alkaline conditions of moderate hardness. If later on you attempt spawning them, the water should be in the acid range for best results (pH 6.2 - 6.6 or so) with not much more than 3 DH, or if you think you might get a conductivity meter at that time (very handy here), a reading of no more than 90 microseimens; preferably less. Depending upon your water source(s), you may have to invest in an R/O )reverse osmosis) Unit. But this is only for breeding if your water isn't up to their needs. Do not buy any fish if they appear dark and retiring, and thin through the head region. Look for alert thick bodied fish in good color. If you're hesitant, any good lfs owner should be more than glad to give them a small feeding at your request so you can judge their appetites. If you want TOP quality and don't mind the shipping expense, you could inquire of either Mark Weiss or Jack Wattley in Florida or Bing Seto in Califonia. I know all three of these gentlemen and they are world reknown for their fish. Let me (or any of us) know what other questions you may have on your mind. Ray \ -- - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "cynthia brennemann" <brennewoman@h...> wrote: > I'm very interested in this topic, too...my DH loves discus fish, and > they're just too expensive and pretty to fool around with. We want to > get it right, right off the bat.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14099	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: flea and spider bombs

I'd not cover the tank with a towel, but use something like Saran Wrap, of another plastic cling film to cover the tanks after removing the hoods and filters. Use the towels to cover the outside of the tanks to keep the fish in the dark so they use less oxygen and stay in a quiescent state. Stop feeding the fish a couple of days before the bombing occurs. This will reduce the waste load on the tank. When the house is habitable again, air out the room, and carefully remove the wrappings from the tanks so as not to get anything in the water. Fleas are kind of like ich, in a way. Their life cycle needs to be interrupted somehow, and you may be in need of a second bombing in a couple of weeks to rid yourself of the new crop. Always wash your hands prior to doing anything with the tanks, especially right after the bombing, to avoid transferring any of the insecticide into the tank. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of agentscullyeyore@... Sent: Saturday, July 30, 2005 4:25 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] flea and spider bombs Ok so I guess we are bombing my house as my roommate has decided so before this all takes place I want to know what i should do with my tank I have told her that none of the bombs will be allowed to go off in my room which is where my tanks are I have heard that i need to shut off the filter but for how long and also that i should cover my tanks but with what... anyone have any advice or knowledge on this area... thanks Shannon

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14100	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: flea and spider bombs

oh lordy robbie.. we have been friend for how long and talked tons about my tanks.. they are not 10 gallons my main on is a 29 gallon and is not going anywhere... t hanks for the xtra info though that was the question i was going to ask you the other day Shannon since your tanks are still small( right ? ) 10 gallons and less i'd suggest removing the tanks from the house until the bombing is done. After the house has been bombed Air house out for about an hour and return fish. If this is not possible, turn off all filters, remove airpumps from house, and cover tanks with a Towel or blanket. Once the bombs have been dropped, check for oily film or foreign material ontop of water,do a partial waterchange and watch for fish for signs of stress. Spiders and fleas will escape to the room that is not bombed.... so might as well bomb the whole house. I say remove airpumps from house: i may be paranoid but i'd hate for the checmicals to be on the pump and then plug them in injecting harmful chemicals into my tank. of course you could get rid of housemate and get another tank and live with the fleas. :-)~ rob Indiana [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14101	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: flea and spider bombs

well they are not fleas we don't even have freaking spiders they are like small hard shelled something that are tiny and she is paranoid i haven't even seen one she said she saw some in a cereal box and on her bathroom floor when she mopped... Shannon of course you could get rid of housemate and get another tank and live with the fleas. :-)~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14102	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: Foamy water (now debate about Melafix and Pimafix)

gosh when i used melafix it nearly killed my fish they hated it and the smell about killed me.. never again will i have it anywhere near me or my fish.. Shannon I had used melafix and pimafix together and the fishes didn't have problems with it. Yeah it does have a foamy effect and it is indicated in the label that it does make your water foamy, but my fishes didn't have problems with it. Actually they were fine after the treatment. This just my experience with the product. Now, I don't use conditioners or anything except fertilizers and my fishes are still fine. I have a ryukin that have a swim bladder problem but he/she is still alive. It lays on the bottom of the tank upside down and comes swimming fine when you touch it or feed them. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14103	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: flea and spider bombs

gosh i love you Ray you are always so on top of things and remember very well... thanks Shannon Shannon, Didn't you say that at least one of your tanks is a 20 gallon? Might not be practical to remove the tanks from the house. Of course if you can with little trouble, then sure by all means get them out of there IF you have a place to put them. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14104	From: Trevor	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: 150 Gallon Tank Disaster

A while back, someone was asking about the 150 gallon tank that Petsmart has. At that time, I mentioned that I have one, and that I love it. Well, things changed a little bit on Thursday morning. My wife got up to mix a new bottle for out baby at about 4:00 am, and she noticed water all over the floor around the aquarium. She woke me up, and I opened up the stand to find water pouring out from the bottom of the tank. I shut all the equipment off, began draining the water into the kitchen sink (using my Python), and then began the process of catching the fish, while my wife went down to the basement and moved things out of the way of the water dripping down through the ceiling. By the time the fish were all caught, the water was pretty much gone, so I removed the gravel and vacummed the rest of the water out of the tank. I could see no visible sign of leaks. I vacuumed as much water out of the carpet as I could (the tank is on a tile floor, but the adjoining room has carpet and it was drenched) while my wife worked on cleaning up the basement. About this time, I noticed that two of my fish (a frontosa and a silver dollar) were already dead. I'm guessing it was from the stress of being caught, and then put into a bucket. At this point, I realized I wouldn't be able to keep them in buckets for very long, and it was likely to be a while before I had a new permanent home for them. Fortunately, I had dug a small pond in my yard a couple of weeks earlier, so I put all the herbivores into the pond, in the hopes that they would have a better chance there. The remaining silver dollars still weren't looking very happy, and my 7 year old daughter spent the morning with a net trying to "help" them. By this time, I was late for work, so I called my boss, finished cleaning up, and then got ready to go. I got a couple of calls during the day with updates on the fish. The pond turned out to be a good idea, because all the silver dollars had recovered within a few hours. On my way home from work, I stopped at Petsmart to find out about warranties. They at first thought I was a customer who had already called them, who they were waiting to bring his tank in (the same model) for an exchange. It turned out I was definitely not the first to have this problem (although they said it usually only took a couple of days for any problems to show up, rather than the 4 years I have had mine). They said that they only had the one that was already spoken for, and it will take a couple of weeks to get more in. They gave me a free tube of silicone, so I could try fixing it in the interim, as they were worried about my fish. My wife and I decided that we'd rather just use the pond until we get a new tank, rather than running the risk of another disaster if I repair the leaky one, so I caught the fish that were in my pond originally (some goldfish, endlers, and white cloud mountain minnows) so I could put the rest of my tank fish in without worrying about anyone being eaten. I then added a heater, since the water temperature probably drops a bit at night. Today, I realized I'd need to keep my canister filter viable, so I set it up in the pond as well. Plus, I've already started getting an ammonia reading, so hopefully the established filter will help out with that. I also got a bottle of Prime and have been adding a dose a day. Anyway, I thought I'd share my horrible experience with the tank, and I hope that whoever it was that bought one like it doesn't have the same problems! :) - Trevor

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14105	From: J G	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: couple quick Qs....

OK just want to check befor I do the nasty act. Are fleas OK for fish (angel, neon & glow tetras, green tiger barb, pelco & octo cat) to eat or not? I think I saw something about them not being good for cats to eat, but cat & fish are different, so.... The cat has left me a present & the carpeting under my desk is infested with fleas. I'm going to try to nab a few by leaving a bowl of water with a light above it... I read somewhere that they'll be attracted to the heat of the light & then hit the water & drown.... I thought maybe the fish might like a lil snack rather than just dumping them outside or down the toliet or something.... And also, is prolonged exposure to a black light harmful to fish??? My dad has repetedly told me of how a friend of his when he was my age had a tank of neons & had a black light on them. So I figured I'd give it a try, and right now I have it sitting on the side of my tank & its looking qusi-cool. would look better if it was over the entire tank, but.... The angel for example is on the other side of the tank & the black light isnt reaching him over there to make him glow... so I was wanting to make sure it wouldnt hurt them and then start to look for a hood that had 2 light sockets, one for a regular light & a 2nd for a black light.... maybe use the black light for a moon light type thing (too bringht?) since it does make a good night light for me too - just enough light to move around with, not enough to keep me up.... ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14106	From: snailcrazymom	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: Cherry shrimp

Email Susan from Snips and snails she may have cherry reds to sell you masts@ mchsi.com If not email Shannon ijedic@ yahoo.com she may also have them to sell you Both ladies are wonderful and have beautiful water bb's if either of them have red's they would sell you just one or two...what ever you wanted.... Good luck Rho > Congratulations! I have been looking for the cherry red shrimp but > cannot find any in my area. I only want one or two, so aquabid is > out. Good luck with your babies! > > Rebecca > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Daniel" <daniel@t...> wrote: > > I bought just one cherry shrimp from the Aquarium store a copy of > > weeks ago because the shrimp had a bunch of eggs on her.I only bought > > 1 because they cost alot for a little shrimp like that. > > Well I put her by herself so that nothing would eat her.I looked in > > the tank the other day and saw that the baby shrmp had hatched and > > were moving around ,very small looking shrimp and very neat to watch > > them.Well I took the mother out because I wasnt sure if she would eat > > them.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14107	From: snailcrazymom	Date: 7/30/2005
Subject: Re: couple quick Qs....

I dont know for sure..but a thought I had was if you have treated your cat with anything for the fleas then chances are the flea may have the insecticide either on them or inside of them if they bite the cat and thus this could be a bad thing for the fish....I think I would flush the fleas.....and if you bomb or spray please keep in mind your tank.... Good luck Rho > OK just want to check befor I do the nasty act. Are > fleas OK for fish (angel, neon & glow tetras, green > tiger barb, pelco & octo cat) to eat or not? I think > I saw something about them not being good for cats to > eat, but cat & fish are different, so.... The cat has > left me a present & the carpeting under my desk is > infested with fleas. I'm going to try to nab a few by > leaving a bowl of water with a light above it... I > read somewhere that they'll be attracted to the heat > of the light & then hit the water & drown.... I > thought maybe the fish might like a lil snack rather > than just dumping them outside or down the toliet or > something....

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14108	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: please trim your replies

Steve, Just to give you an idea of what happens, all of the below was left on a single message in Digest 906... not counting the other 24 messages. Imagine the carpal tunnel outbreak if people had to scroll through that much junk to get to each message? Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14109	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: flea and spider bombs

Shannon, Thanks much for the sentiment. Always enjoy helping you out whenever I can, especially as I know you put the advice I and other Forum members give you to practical use. You always appreciate it and let us know that. \ I did goof a little here in trying to recall what you said about your tank size, but its been a while. I knew it was larger than a ten and was at least a 20. In the back of my mind I kept telling myself it was a 29 but wasn't sure. Anyway, I can see you're not about to move it, so seal it up good. I'd still use a heavy plastic sheeting that you can get from the hardware store. Cut it at least 1 1/2 to 2 feet wider and longer than the tank and let the excess droop over then like I said tie it by wrapping some heavy string or cord (twine) around the tank (over the plastic), so that its tight against the outside of all four sides of the tank. If you can get some wide plastic tape, that's better yet as it will seal airtight. Might be a slight problem getting it all off later but so what. Use a razor blade and be careful. I would use the heavier plastic sheeting rather than Saran Wra just to play it safe. While we know Saran Wrap won't leak liquids, it just may be permeable to gases. Then the blanket or towels mainly to keep the fish inactive. \ Don't know where you're getting the bug bomb from (unless home depot handles them), but if you get it from anyone having to do with exterminating, you should try to bring some of those critters to them in a jar, if you can capture some, and have them I.D.'d. They may not be anything you need to worry about (hopefully) and so you may not need to bomb the house after all. There are critters that can in time invade cereals and live on grain products, such as spaghetti and stuff. Check some unopened boxes of cereal, spaghetti, rice and things if they've been on the shelf a while. Maybe that's all they are(?). One other alternative, although you should maybe ask someone like an exterminator to make sure. If you're positive you don't have any of the critters in your room, as you said, you might want to consider sealing up your room (doors, etc.) with duct tape so no gases can get in, but it must be done thoroughly so that no critters migrate to your room. You would still seal up the tanks as a precaution. The drawback here is that if there are just two (male & female) critters now already in your room that you've overlooked, you would have to bomb the house all over again soon. Just something to consider, but you have to be thorough. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, agentscullyeyore@a... wrote: > > gosh i love you Ray you are always so on top of things and remember very > well... thanks Shannon > > Shannon, Didn't you say that at least one of your tanks is a 20 > gallon? Might not be practical to remove the tanks from the house. Of > course if you can with little trouble, then sure by all means get them > out of there IF you have a place to put them. > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14110	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: couple quick Qs....

For the small possible potential of additional fish food, I don't feel its worth taking the risk of feeding these fleas to your fish for a number of reasons, not the least of which is their exposure to any flea powder residue. They would most definitely have to be assured as dead before feeding as any fish taking a live flea whole would risk the flea biting internally, rupturing the (fish's) stomach. With the hard shell that fleas possess, I doubt there is that much nutrition to be obtained. Better off feeding live "water Fleas" (Daphnia) which can usually be had from your lfs. \ Black Light is just another name for Ultra-Violet light, that band of radiation between 10 - 40 nanometers to 400 nanometers, which in general can be most harmful to us. That range of Black Light used in aquarium lighting is the less harmful upper part of the spectrum called UV-A (345 to 400 nm.), and certainly gives an unusual and pleasant visual effect.Never the less, too much exposure even to this wavelength can lead to a depressed immune system and eye cataracts (in humans), besides killing bacteria and other small life. While I'm not meaning to be an alarmist, I wonder what effect long exposures might have on our fish. I do understand water absorbs much light radiation, but the effects of Black Light on some of our fish are readily seen. At what point is too much exposure to our fish. My concern is that it may not be as safe as first thought. Ray \ - -- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, J G <sir_grubs47@y...> wrote: > OK just want to check befor I do the nasty act. Are > fleas OK for fish (angel, neon & glow tetras, green > tiger barb, pelco & octo cat) to eat or not? I think > I saw something about them not being good for cats to > eat, but cat & fish are different, so.... The cat has > left me a present & the carpeting under my desk is > infested with fleas. I'm going to try to nab a few by > leaving a bowl of water with a light above it... I > read somewhere that they'll be attracted to the heat > of the light & then hit the water & drown.... I > thought maybe the fish might like a lil snack rather > than just dumping them outside or down the toliet or > something.... > > And also, is prolonged exposure to a black light > harmful to fish??? My dad has repetedly told me of > how a friend of his when he was my age had a tank of > neons & had a black light on them. So I figured I'd > give it a try, and right now I have it sitting on the > side of my tank & its looking qusi-cool. would look > better if it was over the entire tank, but.... The > angel for example is on the other side of the tank & > the black light isnt reaching him over there to make > him glow... so I was wanting to make sure it wouldnt > hurt them and then start to look for a hood that had 2 > light sockets, one for a regular light & a 2nd for a > black light.... maybe use the black light for a moon > light type thing (too bringht?) since it does make a > good night light for me too - just enough light to > move around with, not enough to keep me up.... > > > > ____________________________________________________ > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14111	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: 150 Gallon Tank Disaster

Trevor, Sorry to hear about your disaster -- good thing you at least had a pond to put the fish into. If you don't think that your fish will be in the pond too long, and that they'll soon be back in an aquarium of some type, get a small (10 lb) bag or two of Ammo-Rocks (made by Pond-Care/Tetra). One bag will do for approximately 300 gallons, depending upon fish load. This is if you see the ammonia continue to rise. After you remove the fish to an aquarium, remove the Ammo-Rock slowly otherwise you'll have an ammonia spike in your pond which may be detrimental to your pond fish. \ You will not see any visable signs of where the leak was, ass now without the water there is no outward (or downward) pressure form the weight of the water, so no seams will be spread. It may be for the best that you were not able to obtain the 150 in stock that went to the other guy (who just brought back a leaker). Could have been a bad run and there might be problems with that one as well. While most any tank can develop a leak, for peace of mind you might want to consider getting a different brand (All-Glass, Oceanic, Perfecto, etc.) from what you have right now. Hope you didn't have too much damage. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Trevor" <trevor@h...> wrote: > A while back, someone was asking about the 150 gallon tank that > Petsmart has. At that time, I mentioned that I have one, and that I > love it. Well, things changed a little bit on Thursday morning. > > My wife got up to mix a new bottle for out baby at about 4:00 am, and > she noticed water all over the floor around the aquarium. She woke me > up, and I opened up the stand to find water pouring out from the > bottom of the tank. > > I shut all the equipment off, began draining the water into the > kitchen sink (using my Python), and then began the process of catching > the fish, while my wife went down to the basement and moved things out > of the way of the water dripping down through the ceiling. > > By the time the fish were all caught, the water was pretty much gone, > so I removed the gravel and vacummed the rest of the water out of the > tank. I could see no visible sign of leaks. > > I vacuumed as much water out of the carpet as I could (the tank is on > a tile floor, but the adjoining room has carpet and it was drenched) > while my wife worked on cleaning up the basement. > > About this time, I noticed that two of my fish (a frontosa and a > silver dollar) were already dead. I'm guessing it was from the stress > of being caught, and then put into a bucket. At this point, I realized > I wouldn't be able to keep them in buckets for very long, and it was > likely to be a while before I had a new permanent home for them. > > Fortunately, I had dug a small pond in my yard a couple of weeks > earlier, so I put all the herbivores into the pond, in the hopes that > they would have a better chance there. The remaining silver dollars > still weren't looking very happy, and my 7 year old daughter spent the > morning with a net trying to "help" them. > > By this time, I was late for work, so I called my boss, finished > cleaning up, and then got ready to go. I got a couple of calls during > the day with updates on the fish. The pond turned out to be a good > idea, because all the silver dollars had recovered within a few hours. > > On my way home from work, I stopped at Petsmart to find out about > warranties. They at first thought I was a customer who had already > called them, who they were waiting to bring his tank in (the same > model) for an exchange. It turned out I was definitely not the first > to have this problem (although they said it usually only took a couple > of days for any problems to show up, rather than the 4 years I have > had mine). They said that they only had the one that was already > spoken for, and it will take a couple of weeks to get more in. They > gave me a free tube of silicone, so I could try fixing it in the > interim, as they were worried about my fish. > > My wife and I decided that we'd rather just use the pond until we get > a new tank, rather than running the risk of another disaster if I > repair the leaky one, so I caught the fish that were in my pond > originally (some goldfish, endlers, and white cloud mountain minnows) > so I could put the rest of my tank fish in without worrying about > anyone being eaten. I then added a heater, since the water temperature > probably drops a bit at night. > > Today, I realized I'd need to keep my canister filter viable, so I set > it up in the pond as well. Plus, I've already started getting an > ammonia reading, so hopefully the established filter will help out > with that. I also got a bottle of Prime and have been adding a dose a day. > > Anyway, I thought I'd share my horrible experience with the tank, and > I hope that whoever it was that bought one like it doesn't have the > same problems! :) > > - Trevor

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14112	From: richard thompson	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: flea and spider bombs

that sounds like you have weavels. they are flour eating insects that are usually found in punctured bags of flour, cereal, crakers, pasta, etc. agentscullyeyore@... wrote: well they are not fleas we don't even have freaking spiders they are like small hard shelled something that are tiny and she is paranoid i haven't even seen one she said she saw some in a cereal box and on her bathroom floor when she mopped... Shannon of course you could get rid of housemate and get another tank and live with the fleas. :-)~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14113	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: flea and spider bombs

So THAT'S the name of them critters! \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, richard thompson <rapidostang@y...> wrote: > that sounds like you have weavels. they are flour eating insects that are usually found in punctured bags of flour, cereal, crakers, pasta, etc. > > agentscullyeyore@a... wrote: > well they are not fleas we don't even have freaking spiders they are like > small hard shelled something that are tiny and she is paranoid i haven't even > seen one she said she saw some in a cereal box and on her bathroom floor when > she mopped... Shannon > > of course you could get rid of housemate and get another tank and live with > the fleas. > :-)~ > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > --------------------------------- > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14114	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: please trim your posts

Lenny, That is correct. If you read the list posts via the web interface, they also do not have the [AquaticLife] tag on the subject line. I believe that the Yahoo! Groups software prepends the subject line when the messages are sent out, based on information in the message headers. I am willing to bet that the digest has AquaticLife somewhere in the subject line, though. You will now note that this reply now has two RE: markers, one prior to the tag and one after the tag. Your message had it after the tag. This may be what is screwing things up with regard to sorts, the Yahoo! software. The proper placement of the RE: should be the start of the subject line. You may do it, but others also do it, I recall at least three messages of this type in the last week. I try to remember to take out the crap at the end of a post, but it does not always happen. Sometimes I am just trying to go too fast, and I remember as the message is being sent, there times it simply does not occur to me at all, but, I think that you will find that the majority of my replies do without the "Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks." and everything that follows. I do leave the messages in the thread there as that is good practice for those who have not been following the thread can get caught up with what has occurred before. I have run into several posts where I am obviously reading in the middle of the conversation, but there is no reference to what has gone on before. Unless there is a specific question in those posts I can answer, I skip over them as I do not know what has gone on previously in the thread and do not wish to repeat what has already been said. Even when the top modem speed was 1200 bps, I still got individual e-mails. I don't even think there was a digest mode back then. My e-mail program is set to collect messages on a regular time schedule, so I am not sitting in from of my computer and starting the program and getting the 200+ messages collected in a day all at the same time. It is a heck of a lot easier for me to sort by subject so I can just delete whole threads at once than to delete the individual messages as I come upon them, and those I want to save, I don't need to edit a digest to save the messages elsewhere, they are simply stored in a folder in my mail program. I think that if you figure it out, it takes no more time to download 15 messages than it takes to get the same 15 messages as one. People using a digest mode for this reason are practicing a false economy. The endless junk at the end of messages will occur whether you have digest mode or not. It may be handy if you are archiving all the messages from a list, but even then there are problems in that threads may continue for many days (such as this one) and be covered in several digests as a result. Since I seldom look to the end of messages, I don't know if the same people are guilty, time after time, of not editing the replies of the junk below the "Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks." line or not. I am sure, though, that everyone does it once in a while, probably for the reasons stated above, and the list need not be filled with repeated trim your posts messages. To be seeing several messages of this type each week is probably far more less courteous than those who occasionally forget to edit their messages. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Lenny Vasbinder Sent: Saturday, July 30, 2005 4:45 PM To: AquaticLife Yahoo! Group Subject: [AquaticLife] RE: please trim your posts Hey Steve, As you can see below my signature, the "Messages" in the digest format do not have the "[AquaticLife]" in the subject line... unless someone hits Reply which would then have "[AquaticLife] Digest Number 905" which is the one your email appeared in. Your email client added the "RE:" in the Subject line, or Yahoo did it, depending on how your original Subject line appeared. Rosette55 had "[AquaticLife] please trim your posts" and your message showed up as "RE: please trim your posts" so I'm not sure what the solution would be for that peeve. Should I copy/paste "RE: please trim your reply" since I am replying to your post or should I include the "[AquaticLife]" before or after the "RE:"? I normally copy/paste the previous message into a new email and then copy/paste the Subject line as I did with this one.... "RE: please trim your posts"... and what Yahoo does to the subject line by the time you get it, I have no control over. I only do a friendly reminder to "Trim your posts please" when it gets out of hand. I've seen single messages, within a Digest, go 30 pages long which I have to scroll through to get to the next message because one-liners going back and forth that were not trimmed even once... maybe not in this group but in others. The average Digest in AquaticLife runs around 50-60KB but I've seen many go over 150KB when people leave all of the junk on their replies. On July 14, 2005, I received two Digests, one was 215KB and the other was 169KB and a big part of that was because of untrimmed posts, so instead of having to download 100KB, I had to download nearly 400KB. For people on dial-up or pay-per-minute (still around in some countries), this costs them lots of extra time and money. Apparently many, many people get the Digest formats of many Yahoo Groups, as I do, because it limits the overall number of emails that I get each day, since a single Digest will contain up to 25 messages. I only have to open one email, read it and delete it if there is nothing worth saving. With the individual emails, it would be opening 25 and deleting 25 so it conserves download time and reading time by getting the Digest. I guess it all boils down to common courtesy and we all need to be reminded of that from time to time. Just like the individual email readers would not like it if I did not edit the Digest, the Digest readers would reciprocally like the individual senders to edit theirs. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: Date: Sat, 30 Jul 2005 11:45:39 -0400 From: "Steve Szabo" <steve@...> Subject: RE: please trim your posts One does try to remember to trim the posts, but due to time constraints, memory loss, and other distractions, one may not always be successful. One does wonder, from time to time, especially on this list, why people choose to receive messages in a digest mode rather than individually. It does not save space, other than when the digest is truncated by Yahoo! for length (size). And it does make it impossible to sort messages by topic so that one may read all current replies in a thread at the same time. Which actually brings up my pet peeve, that I only see on this list. It is actually two peeves, but the primary one is that someone is using an editor to reply to messages that puts the RE: after the group tag [AquaticLife], which throws off the sort function of my e-mail reader. When someone replies with an editor that places the RE: in the correct position, it starts yet a new thread, according to a subject sort. I suspect that what happens is that the editor actually strips the [AquaticLife] tag and then sends the message without it, and then the group software places a new one on the reply. Makes things very confusing no matter how it happens. When one receives in excess of 200 messages a day, not counting spam, which is filtered off, and a few other specific messages that get filtered off into another folder, knowing whether one should place his two cents worth in is rather important from a stand point of available time. The other peeve is the slight changing of a subject, when the content could very well remain under the original subject header which leads to two very similar threads. I have no problem of a subject changing when the topic veers off course, but all too frequently, the topic is still viable under the same subject and should stay there. Well, there is yet another as long as I am on the subject. I've been doing this e-mail thing since the late '70's. There is a certain etiquette that has built up around communicating with e-mail. When it comes to lists, there are certain forms of etiquette that develop among the community of the list. Most lists look favorably upon the retaining of previous content with the reply. This way one can refresh himself on the content that has gone on prior to his participation in a thread, or be reminded of the content when continuing a thread he has already participated in. This can help, in a certain fashion, to prevent repeating of answers or comments given in the course of a thread. (Of course, for example, if I had just received this message and was replying to it, and someone else was doing the same, we may be giving the same reply. There is absolutely no way to prevent this from happening, and it is quite understandable when it does.) This is my first and last post on these peeves, and I do hope that this is the last post I see on this "Trim your messages, people" topic on this forum (though I know the hope is futile). I also dislike seeing an endless list of "Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks." below a message in a thread, but I can live with it, and, if need be, trim it if I should archive the thread. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of rosette55@... Sent: Friday, July 29, 2005 2:23 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] please trim your posts hello all, could you please trim your posts of old posts and yahoo headers? i am on digest form and the list is always truncated from being too long with unnecessary stuff. maybe it is my webtv but i can't read the entire digest. thanks so much. samantha SNIP

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14115	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: flea and spider bombs

Your right about checking the bugs and stuff i mean if i knew they were fleas i would address that but they are not and seem harmless as i haven't encountered any loll.. so i am going to do my best to curve from doing a bomb of some sort but if i have to ill seal it all up and be frustrated as it seems like a butt load of work lol Shannon Shannon, Thanks much for the sentiment. Always enjoy helping you out whenever I can, especially as I know you put the advice I and other Forum members give you to practical use. You always appreciate it and let us know that. \ I did goof a little here in trying to recall what you said about your tank size, but its been a while. I knew it was larger than a ten and was at least a 20. In the back of my mind I kept telling myself it was a 29 but wasn't sure. Anyway, I can see you're not about to move it, so seal it up good. I'd still use a heavy plastic sheeting that you can get from the hardware store. Cut it at least 1 1/2 to 2 feet wider and longer than the tank and let the excess droop over then like I said tie it by wrapping some heavy string or cord (twine) around the tank (over the plastic), so that its tight against the outside of all four sides of the tank. If you can get some wide plastic tape, that's better yet as it will seal airtight. Might be a slight problem getting it all off later but so what. Use a razor blade and be careful. I would use the heavier plastic sheeting rather than Saran Wra just to play it safe. While we know Saran Wrap won't leak liquids, it just may be permeable to gases. Then the blanket or towels mainly to keep the fish inactive. \ Don't know where you're getting the bug bomb from (unless home depot handles them), but if you get it from anyone having to do with exterminating, you should try to bring some of those critters to them in a jar, if you can capture some, and have them I.D.'d. They may not be anything you need to worry about (hopefully) and so you may not need to bomb the house after all. There are critters that can in time invade cereals and live on grain products, such as spaghetti and stuff. Check some unopened boxes of cereal, spaghetti, rice and things if they've been on the shelf a while. Maybe that's all they are(?). One other alternative, although you should maybe ask someone like an exterminator to make sure. If you're positive you don't have any of the critters in your room, as you said, you might want to consider sealing up your room (doors, etc.) with duct tape so no gases can get in, but it must be done thoroughly so that no critters migrate to your room. You would still seal up the tanks as a precaution. The drawback here is that if there are just two (male & female) critters now already in your room that you've overlooked, you would have to bomb the house all over again soon. Just something to consider, but you have to be thorough. Ray [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14116	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: flea and spider bombs

we live on a farm an have had outbreaks of weavels in our grain so my mom said that they didn't look like weavels unless they are so me new breed of them which is entirely possible i am sure.. Shannon that sounds like you have weavels. they are flour eating insects that are usually found in punctured bags of flour, cereal, crakers, pasta, etc. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14117	From: DB1RDMAN@WMCONNECT.COM	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: Digest Number 907

In a message dated 7/31/2005 12:33:07 PM Eastern Daylight Time, AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com writes: > From: "Lenny Vasbinder" <lnvtm1@...> > Subject: RE: please trim your replies > Bless you my child. I wish you luck on your request. This seams to be the "I don't know how to cut and paste and I really don't care virus." It's showing up on most of the Yahoo groups. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14118	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: Cherry shrimp

Thanks! Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "snailcrazymom" <yarncrazymom@y...> wrote: > Email Susan from Snips and snails she may have cherry reds to sell > you masts@ mchsi.com > If not email Shannon ijedic@ yahoo.com she may also have them to > sell you > > Both ladies are wonderful and have beautiful water bb's if either of > them have red's they would sell you just one or two...what ever you > wanted.... > > Good luck > Rho > > > > Congratulations! I have been looking for the cherry red shrimp > but > > cannot find any in my area. I only want one or two, so aquabid is > > out. Good luck with your babies! > > > > Rebecca > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Daniel" <daniel@t...> wrote: > > > I bought just one cherry shrimp from the Aquarium store a copy of > > > weeks ago because the shrimp had a bunch of eggs on her.I only > bought > > > 1 because they cost alot for a little shrimp like that. > > > Well I put her by herself so that nothing would eat her.I > looked in > > > the tank the other day and saw that the baby shrmp had hatched > and > > > were moving around ,very small looking shrimp and very neat to > watch > > > them.Well I took the mother out because I wasnt sure if she > would eat > > > them.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14119	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: Question on Gouramis ?

Linda, Not necessarily. The best thing to do would probably be to move all four to the new tank at once and let them establish the pecking order from scratch. It will not necessarily turn out the same as it did in the other tank, and each fish will have the same amount of stress to go through. Moving the two with one being the retiring (purported) female will enable the two to establish something, then moving the other two will disrupt that and a new pecking order would be established. It may happen that in any case the retiring fish will still be the retiring fish no matter what scenario you use to move the fish, but then, again, it may not. I've not done enough reading and studying of behavioral issues to really give a definitive answer in a case such as this, just a guess based on the information given, and knowing what I have observed in various fish in the past. I've seen cases where the top dog becomes the low man on the totem pole, and I've also seen cases where the top dog remains the top dog. Go figure! \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Saturday, July 30, 2005 8:30 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: Question on Gouramis ? In a message dated 7/30/2005 12:17:52 P.M. Central Standard Time, steve@... writes: They may have established a pecking order by now, n the female in the corner is the low man on the totem pole, so to speak. You are liable to see an uptick in the aggressive behavior when you move them to the new tank. Especially if you move them separately to the new tank. The two you move first will have some time to establish a territory, and the other two will be seen as invaders by the original fish in the tank. This could be alleviated somewhat by moving the décor around just prior to the introduction of the other gouramis. Wouldn't it help to move the subordinate female to the tank first? Linda

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14120	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: please trim your replies

Lenny, Hmmm, left click on the down arrow in your message window, and let the machine scroll it down for you, or you can left click and pull the scroll bar down to the next message, one simple easy movement that doesn't even take that much room to accomplish (i.e., I did not need to reposition my mouse in the roughly 6 inch square I have open on my desk for it). Or 11 [Pg Dn] keystrokes to go from the top of your message to the bottom. Did not count the number I needed to use the scroll wheel on the mouse but I suspect it would be about double the [Pg Dn] key, depending on how your scroll is set. Just another reason to get individual e-mails, I guess. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Lenny Vasbinder Sent: Sunday, July 31, 2005 5:56 AM To: AquaticLife Yahoo! Group Subject: [AquaticLife] RE: please trim your replies Steve, Just to give you an idea of what happens, all of the below was left on a single message in Digest 906... not counting the other 24 messages. Imagine the carpal tunnel outbreak if people had to scroll through that much junk to get to each message? Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > ----------------------<snip>----------------------

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14121	From: camdogkingsfan	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Pleco with Knife

I have a 25 gallon tank that has Black ghost and a Rafeal in it and they are kinda boring during the day. Can I put my pleco in with them? He is about 16 inch long. Cam

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14122	From: camdogkingsfan	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Golden Pleco

I went to my local pet store yesterday and I saw the pleco that I have never seen before. It was called a golden pleco. I did a google search for it but I couldn't find any info on it. There were golden stripped and nugget but not complete golden. Has anyone heard of it or have one? I might want to get it but want some more info on it.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14123	From: camdogkingsfan	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Yo Yo Loach

I am think of getting a Yo Yo but not sure how big they get or what kind of fish they are. Can they go with other tropical fish like guppy's, tertas, and catfish or are they more agg? Cam

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14124	From: thesydmonster	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: Yo Yo Loach

Botia lohachata/almorhae (a type of loach). I believe they get to be around 5" in length. I read that they are great escape artists so you have to make sure the top of your tank is covered, including any holes around the filter, etc. They prefer to be in groups of at least 3. I believe they can be a bit nippy with slow moving long finned fish. http://www.petresources.net/fish/cyprinid/bot_alm.html It helps to have them in groups so they can interact with each other and not bother the other fish too much. They do best with a sand substrate and lots of hiding places. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "camdogkingsfan" <camdog@s...> wrote: > I am think of getting a Yo Yo but not sure how big they get or what > kind of fish they are. Can they go with other tropical fish like > guppy's, tertas, and catfish or are they more agg? > > Cam

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14125	From: harry perry	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: please trim your replies/To Lenny

Dear Lenny, I can't even get folks to change something in their subject line. 20 posts, same subject line the topic changed 4 times. What do you suppose your chances are of getting folks to delete everything below the message. You couldn't possible have as many e-mails as I do. 250 in a 8 hour period. I go individual e-mail and simply start at the bottom and work my way back for continuity. I have many interests cooking, scuba diving, fish keeping, sea horses the list goes on and on. I go thru a list of 25 posts in 5 minutes. I simple mark for deletion anything that doesn't interest me or I have created a number of sub files, move to files and I can go back later and read them when I have the time. Supposedly the digest format saves time I don't see how. Harry Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: Lenny, Hmmm, left click on the down arrow in your message window, and let the machine scroll it down for you, or you can left click and pull the scroll bar down to the next message, one simple easy movement that doesn't even take that much room to accomplish (i.e., I did not need to reposition my mouse in the roughly 6 inch square I have open on my desk for it). Or 11 [Pg Dn] keystrokes to go from the top of your message to the bottom. Did not count the number I needed to use the scroll wheel on the mouse but I suspect it would be about double the [Pg Dn] key, depending on how your scroll is set. Just another reason to get individual e-mails, I guess. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Lenny Vasbinder Sent: Sunday, July 31, 2005 5:56 AM To: AquaticLife Yahoo! Group Subject: [AquaticLife] RE: please trim your replies Steve, Just to give you an idea of what happens, all of the below was left on a single message in Digest 906... not counting the other 24 messages. Imagine the carpal tunnel outbreak if people had to scroll through that much junk to get to each message? Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > ----------------------<snip>---------------------- ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14126	From: harry perry	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: please trim your replies/To Lenny

Dear Lenny, I can't even get folks to change something in their subject line. 20 posts, same subject line the topic changed 4 times. What do you suppose your chances are of getting folks to delete everything below the message. You couldn't possible have as many e-mails as I do. 250 in a 8 hour period. I go individual e-mail and simply start at the bottom and work my way back for continuity. I have many interests cooking, scuba diving, fish keeping, sea horses the list goes on and on. I go thru a list of 25 posts in 5 minutes. I simple mark for deletion anything that doesn't interest me or I have created a number of sub files, "move to" files and I can go back later and read them when I have the time. Supposedly the digest format saves time I don't see how. Harry Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: Lenny, Hmmm, left click on the down arrow in your message window, and let the machine scroll it down for you, or you can left click and pull the scroll bar down to the next message, one simple easy movement that doesn't even take that much room to accomplish (i.e., I did not need to reposition my mouse in the roughly 6 inch square I have open on my desk for it). Or 11 [Pg Dn] keystrokes to go from the top of your message to the bottom. Did not count the number I needed to use the scroll wheel on the mouse but I suspect it would be about double the [Pg Dn] key, depending on how your scroll is set. Just another reason to get individual e-mails, I guess. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Lenny Vasbinder Sent: Sunday, July 31, 2005 5:56 AM To: AquaticLife Yahoo! Group Subject: [AquaticLife] RE: please trim your replies Steve, Just to give you an idea of what happens, all of the below was left on a single message in Digest 906... not counting the other 24 messages. Imagine the carpal tunnel outbreak if people had to scroll through that much junk to get to each message? Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > ----------------------<snip>---------------------- ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14127	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: Pleco with Knife

alll three answers as per my experoience... the pleco should be ok because ive never had a problem with that setup you mentouined.... the yoyo should be kept in small groups of at least 3 and that would do fine in a comminuty tank, the golden plecop may have been a mislabeled albino or chocolate pleco, the golden nugget is popular but if i read correctly you dont beleive thats it. Also id ask the store if thats what it isd because sometimes they have iold labels on them. hope for the best. Kris camdogkingsfan <camdog@...> wrote: I have a 25 gallon tank that has Black ghost and a Rafeal in it and they are kinda boring during the day. Can I put my pleco in with them? He is about 16 inch long. Cam ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14128	From: camdogkingsfan	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: Yo Yo Loach

Thanks for the site. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > Botia lohachata/almorhae (a type of loach). I believe they get to be > around 5" in length. I read that they are great escape artists so you > have to make sure the top of your tank is covered, including any holes > around the filter, etc. They prefer to be in groups of at least 3. I > believe they can be a bit nippy with slow moving long finned fish. > http://www.petresources.net/fish/cyprinid/bot_alm.html It helps to > have them in groups so they can interact with each other and not > bother the other fish too much. They do best with a sand substrate > and lots of hiding places. > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "camdogkingsfan" <camdog@s...> > wrote: > > I am think of getting a Yo Yo but not sure how big they get or what > > kind of fish they are. Can they go with other tropical fish like > > guppy's, tertas, and catfish or are they more agg? > > > > Cam

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14129	From: Evita	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: flea and spider bombs

I thought she was talking about what we called Roley-Poleys. Has anyone heard of them? You usually find them in the areas of shade under leaves or rocks. I don't think I would bomb unless it was roaches, fleas or maybe ants. If it is flour type mites I would just throw out the food stuff and get air tight containers for the new stuff. I did have to bomb recently and then do a regular spray and both times I used the heavy duty black trash bags. I cut them at the seams and covered the tanks with them, sealing with duck tape. The tanks have to be shut off of course. I also bagged up all my stuff like my buckets and hoses and food stuff as well. It usually says. wait at least 6 hours before going back in the house for humans. I would say do it in the morning and leave all day. Come home an air out the house then uncover the tanks. Evita Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote: So THAT'S the name of them critters! \ --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14130	From: CATHERINE FLOWERS	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: couple quick Qs....

I have raised cats for sixteen yrs, I know about fleas too, untill I read something in the sf, paper, on killing these bugers, take table salt & put on the floor leave for two days, the fleas will die!! it works gr8!!no harm to the cat or the fish,I had guppies @ that time nothing happen to them either, the salt works wonders also baking soda after wards, to clean the floor its better than the sprays that they have out on the market, With the sprays / fogger you have to put the dishes in the fridge, even the pots& pans, breads too, anything with a plastic, even your tv& computer equipment can get damage , with salt it is safer, plus with the foggers they kill only the flea that is alive,not the eggs that hasn't hatch, . just sprinkile the floor with the salt & in 2 days vaccume it up. also is your cat outdoors or compleatly indoors,

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14132	From: Aaron	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Green Hair Algae?s

What (if anything) eats Green Hair Algae?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14133	From: Aaron	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: yet another light question

here is a reply I got from thatpetplace.com about the 5500-6700K bulbs spectrum --------- From: "MarineBio" <MarineBio@...> To: "'Aaron M.'" <anonymous122899@...> Subject: RE: lighting Date: Wed, 27 Jul 2005 19:27:02 -0400 "For your lighting system you can probably use 65 watt bulbs. The important thing to make sure of is that the pins match. Nearly all 55 watt bulbs are straight pin while 65 watts can be square or straight pin. I would stick with 5500-6700K bulbs. Chlorophyll absorbs light most efficiently at 420nm which is the same as true actinic. It is also the spectrum of light that will penetrate water further than any other. In marine tanks most of the corals are found in depths greater than 15' where red, orange, and yellow light is nonexistent. That's why these tanks are often lit with so much blue light. In freshwater the plants are found in much shallower depths of only 10' or less. And many are not underwater at all. Consequently they are adapted to a light spectrum much higher in red, yellow, and orange and why the lower Kelvin rated bulbs are best. They still produce the 420 nm light spectrum but you cannot see it because of the other colors emitted as well. I would replace all your bulbs now and date them. When they reach 9000 hours of use you should replace them with new bulbs whether they still light up or not. Chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists every Thursday night from 8-10 pm EST at www.thatpetplace.com. Thank You Andy" -end qoute- --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Aaron" <anonymous122899@y...> wrote: > As far as I understand, you want the 5500K and especially the > 6500K for optimal plant GROWTH. the 2700k may just make the plants > LOOK nicer maybe? > > Aaron > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > > I was studying up on lighting and light bulbs. I found an > article that went > > over Kelvin stuff. I work at the Home Depot and on lunch today I > went and > > looked at light bulbs. We sell 40 watt/1600 lumens/2700k bulbs > for $9.99. > > These bulb are specifically markets for planted aquariums. The > bulbs I > > currently have in my tank are Eclipse Natural Daylight F40T10 > bulbs. I was just > > wondering if the bulbs at Home Depot would be better for my > plants than what I > > have while I am saving up my money for a better lighting system. > > > > The tubes from HD are 2700k; and full spectrum light is about > 5000k. I > > thought full spectrum light were better for plants? > > > > Linda > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14134	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: Pleco with Knife

Cam, Should be no problem with the Pleco, even at that size. They may be big and clutzy but they are not aggressive. As you probably know, they are also somewhat nocturnal so don't expect him to break up the boredom. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "camdogkingsfan" <camdog@s...> wrote: > I have a 25 gallon tank that has Black ghost and a Rafeal in it and > they are kinda boring during the day. Can I put my pleco in with > them? He is about 16 inch long. > > Cam

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14135	From: harry perry	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: Question on Gouramis ?/ To Linda, I disagree.

I have breed gouramis for years. What works best for me is to put the females alone in a tank by themselves. They will establish their own turf. 2 weeks later add the males. The male will still beat up on the female but you need to establish caves etc. for the female. The pecking order is always the same. If you want to breed this fish put them in a separate 10 gal tank. Float hornwort, raise the temp to 80 and feed live food. I.E. bbs. Instant babies. Be sure you can deal with the young. They are very small and require infusoria the first 2 weeks of their life. Any more questions, please don't hesitate to ask. The ratio is 1 male to 2 females. Why doesn't the tank imitate life? oh well. Harry Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: Linda, Not necessarily. The best thing to do would probably be to move all four to the new tank at once and let them establish the pecking order from scratch. It will not necessarily turn out the same as it did in the other tank, and each fish will have the same amount of stress to go through. Moving the two with one being the retiring (purported) female will enable the two to establish something, then moving the other two will disrupt that and a new pecking order would be established. It may happen that in any case the retiring fish will still be the retiring fish no matter what scenario you use to move the fish, but then, again, it may not. I've not done enough reading and studying of behavioral issues to really give a definitive answer in a case such as this, just a guess based on the information given, and knowing what I have observed in various fish in the past. I've seen cases where the top dog becomes the low man on the totem pole, and I've also seen cases where the top dog remains the top dog. Go figure! \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Saturday, July 30, 2005 8:30 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: Question on Gouramis ? In a message dated 7/30/2005 12:17:52 P.M. Central Standard Time, steve@... writes: They may have established a pecking order by now, n the female in the corner is the low man on the totem pole, so to speak. You are liable to see an uptick in the aggressive behavior when you move them to the new tank. Especially if you move them separately to the new tank. The two you move first will have some time to establish a territory, and the other two will be seen as invaders by the original fish in the tank. This could be alleviated somewhat by moving the décor around just prior to the introduction of the other gouramis. Wouldn't it help to move the subordinate female to the tank first? Linda ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14136	From: Aaron	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Aquarium Lighting

here is a link Articles about Proper Aquarium Lighting: http://www.liveaquaria.com/general/general.cfm?general_pagesid=308 ARTICLES: Aquarium Lighting: Spectrum and Intensity Part 1, Part 2 Aquarium Lighting: Systems and Bulbs Part 1, Part 2 Improve Your Night Vision Lighting: How it helps your aquarium's inhabitants Overview: Compact Fluorescent Lighting Systems Overview: Standard Fluorescent and VHO Lighting Systems Vitalize your Aquarium with Proper Lighting It is from Doctors Foster & Smith, Information Library

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14137	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: 150 Gallon Tank Disaster

Trevor, That would be me! I have not had any problems with my tank so far. I have all the paperwork and my receipt. I am going to print off your email and file it with my receipt, just in case I have any problems. PetsMart is going to replace your tank after you have had it four years? I don't recall the warranty info off hand. Sorry to hear about your leak. Lucky you have a pond to put your fish in. The only thing I have are five gallon buckets. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14138	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: Golden Pleco

Cam, There are a couple of Pleco's described as "Golden Pleco's". Incidentally, have you checked out the fish on our website? There is a Yellow-Gold Pleco (Loricariidae gen. sp.), also called the Green Phantom Pleco. It really has more of a greenish cast to it than gold. There is also a Gold Titanic Pleco (Pseudoacanthicus sp.), but is not solid gold -- it has large brown blotches with gold in between and red in the fins -- nice fish. But you might be referring to either of these two following fish: (1) the Golden Pleco (Pterogoplichthys sp.), a rather slender gold colored Pleco which gets to about 10", or (2) the Golden Ancistrus Pleco (Scobinancistrus auriatus) which is a beautiful golden colored Pleco having the typical bushy-nose of Ancistrus type Plecos and getting to maybe 6". There are also the Gold Spot Pleco and the Gold Dot Pleco, but you didn't mention any pattern. Maybe a brief description might help, unless you recognize it above. Ray \ -- - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "camdogkingsfan" <camdog@s...> wrote: > I went to my local pet store yesterday and I saw the pleco that I have > never seen before. It was called a golden pleco. I did a google > search for it but I couldn't find any info on it. There were golden > stripped and nugget but not complete golden. Has anyone heard of it > or have one? I might want to get it but want some more info on it.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14139	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: Yo Yo Loach

Cam, Looks like Rebecca ("TheSydMonster") answered your question pretty thoroughly, but I'd just like to add that all loaches prefer to be kept in a group of at least 3 (or more). This goes for the more popular Clown Loach as well. Any of them do a pretty good job of going over the bottom for uneaten food and they make short work of snails. The Weather Loach and the Koolie Loach do not belong to this family (Botia) and are not related -- they'll do nothing for snails. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "camdogkingsfan" <camdog@s...> wrote: > I am think of getting a Yo Yo but not sure how big they get or what > kind of fish they are. Can they go with other tropical fish like > guppy's, tertas, and catfish or are they more agg? > > Cam

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14140	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: flea and spider bombs

oh lordy no they are not rollie pollies or what ppl also call the pill bug.. Shannon I thought she was talking about what we called Roley-Poleys. Has anyone heard of them? You usually find them in the areas of shade under leaves or rocks. I don't think I would bomb unless it was roaches, fleas or maybe ants. If it is flour type mites I would just throw out the food stuff and get air tight containers for the new stuff. I did have to bomb recently and then do a regular spray and both times I used the heavy duty black trash bags. I cut them at the seams and covered the tanks with them, sealing with duck tape. The tanks have to be shut off of course. I also bagged up all my stuff like my buckets and hoses and food stuff as well. It usually says. wait at least 6 hours before going back in the house for humans. I would say do it in the morning and leave all day. Come home an air out the house then uncover the tanks. Evita [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14141	From: richard thompson	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: flea and spider bombs

weavels goin after whole grains would be larger ahn the variety you would pick up in a bag of flour, but it is just a guess....without ever seeing the bugs themselves no one can really tell ya for sure. agentscullyeyore@... wrote: we live on a farm an have had outbreaks of weavels in our grain so my mom said that they didn't look like weavels unless they are so me new breed of them which is entirely possible i am sure.. Shannon that sounds like you have weavels. they are flour eating insects that are usually found in punctured bags of flour, cereal, crakers, pasta, etc. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14142	From: richard thompson	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: flea and spider bombs

i beleieve the real name is bull weavel or somethign close to that Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote:So THAT'S the name of them critters! \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, richard thompson <rapidostang@y...> wrote: > that sounds like you have weavels. they are flour eating insects that are usually found in punctured bags of flour, cereal, crakers, pasta, etc. > > agentscullyeyore@a... wrote: > well they are not fleas we don't even have freaking spiders they are like > small hard shelled something that are tiny and she is paranoid i haven't even > seen one she said she saw some in a cereal box and on her bathroom floor when > she mopped... Shannon > > of course you could get rid of housemate and get another tank and live with > the fleas. > :-)~ > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > --------------------------------- > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14143	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: flea and spider bombs

yep i know that too i did a search in my entomology program and found that there are a lot of different kinds.. mine is a very small speckle cylindrical the others or most have like a bulbous and pinchers.. Shannon weavels goin after whole grains would be larger ahn the variety you would pick up in a bag of flour, but it is just a guess....without ever seeing the bugs themselves no one can really tell ya for sure. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14144	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: flea and spider bombs

yep you are really close it is actually called a boll weevil.. Shannon i beleieve the real name is bull weavel or somethign close to that [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14145	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: couple quick Qs....

hey i'm going to try that salt thing. my kitten recently started scratching (checked, he had fleas from where i don't know since he's an indoors cat) so i gave him a bath with flea shampoo and am going to buy him a flea collar. but the salt idea sounds better. CATHERINE FLOWERS <ceflowers2000@...> wrote:I have raised cats for sixteen yrs, I know about fleas too, untill I read something in the sf, paper, on killing these bugers, take table salt & put on the floor leave for two days, the fleas will die!! it works gr8!!no harm to the cat or the fish,I had guppies @ that time nothing happen to them either, the salt works wonders also baking soda after wards, to clean the floor its better than the sprays that they have out on the market, With the sprays / fogger you have to put the dishes in the fridge, even the pots& pans, breads too, anything with a plastic, even your tv& computer equipment can get damage , with salt it is safer, plus with the foggers they kill only the flea that is alive,not the eggs that hasn't hatch, . just sprinkile the floor with the salt & in 2 days vaccume it up. also is your cat outdoors or compleatly indoors, ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14146	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: flea and spider bombs

rollie pollies were my favorite when i was growing up! my brother & i spent countless hours being entertained by them. aren't they called potato bugs too? agentscullyeyore@... wrote: oh lordy no they are not rollie pollies or what ppl also call the pill bug.. Shannon Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14147	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: Yo Yo Loach

scientific name: Botia almorhae common names: Yo-Yo Loach or Pakistani loach. Get to about 5 inches and are peaceful. should be kept in schools of 3 fish or more. very good fish for snails but will also snack on small fish. your livebearer fry should be ok but if you get tetra or catfish wigglers forget it. Provide plent of hiding places. rocks, driftwood etc for them to hide behind. Sand is an ideal substrate as they will burrow if allowed. very comical fish, and you'll probally fall in love with them if you get them. I'm sure others will reply with more info rob Indiana In a message dated 7/31/2005 12:51:53 PM US Eastern Standard Time, camdog@... writes: I am think of getting a Yo Yo but not sure how big they get or what kind of fish they are. Can they go with other tropical fish like guppy's, tertas, and catfish or are they more agg? Cam Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14148	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: now weevils

boll weevil i think. i think they infect cotton too, or is that the cotton weevil? richard thompson <rapidostang@...> wrote:i beleieve the real name is bull weavel or somethign close to that Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote:So THAT'S the name of them critters! \ Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14149	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: flea and spider bombs

no the potato bugs are different and smell pretty nasty when you squish them but they doo look similar... i have heard a lot of kids played with them but we really didn't have a lot of them around.. Shannon rollie pollies were my favorite when i was growing up! my brother & i spent countless hours being entertained by them. aren't they called potato bugs too? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14150	From: CATHERINE FLOWERS	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: flea and spider bombs

they r called sow bugs the ( rollie polle bugs --- agentscullyeyore@... wrote: --------------------------------- no the potato bugs are different and smell pretty nasty when you squish them but they doo look similar... i have heard a lot of kids played with them but we really didn't have a lot of them around.. Shannon rollie pollies were my favorite when i was growing up! my brother & i spent countless hours being entertained by them. aren't they called potato bugs too? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ---------------------------------

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14151	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: The San Diego Tropical Fish Society , 8/14/2005, 7:00 pm

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife The San Diego Tropical Fish Society Sunday August 14, 2005 7:00 pm - 8:00 pm This event repeats on the second Sunday of every month. The next reminder for this event will be sent in 11 days, 3 minutes. Event Location: room 101, Casa Del Prado, Balboa Park at 7:00 PM Street: SAN DIEGO TROPICAL FISH SOCIETY, PO Box 4156, North Park Station City, State, Zip: San Diego, CA 92164 Phone: 619-281-FISH Notes: http://www.geocities.com/sandiegofishfan/ You are cordially invited to attend our next meeting in room 101, Casa Del Prado, Balboa Park at 7:00 PM on the second Sunday of the month. Visitors are always welcome! 619-281-FISH ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14152	From: CATHERINE FLOWERS	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: couple quick Qs....

this is cathy again , I have a lhasa alspo, got her on the advantage, they dont have the one for the cats but they do for the dogs its called k-9 advantage, but for the cats/kittens, would be advantage, works gr8. also there is another item, which dr foster&smith carrieswhich works better, and cost less, tooits called bio spot and cost is 9.99.depending on the age of your kitten they requir the kitten to be 7 mos.but their items work gr8 too. I have ordered from them before also they have fish & supplies too --- Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote: --------------------------------- hey i'm going to try that salt thing. my kitten recently started scratching (checked, he had fleas from where i don't know since he's an indoors cat) so i gave him a bath with flea shampoo and am going to buy him a flea collar. but the salt idea sounds better. CATHERINE FLOWERS <ceflowers2000@...> wrote:I have raised cats for sixteen yrs, I know about fleas too, untill I read something in the sf, paper, on killing these bugers, take table salt & put on the floor leave for two days, the fleas will die!! it works gr8!!no harm to the cat or the fish,I had guppies @ that time nothing happen to them either, the salt works wonders also baking soda after wards, to clean the floor its better than the sprays that they have out on the market, With the sprays / fogger you have to put the dishes in the fridge, even the pots& pans, breads too, anything with a plastic, even your tv& computer equipment can get damage , with salt it is safer, plus with the foggers they kill only the flea that is alive,not the eggs that hasn't hatch, . just sprinkile the floor with the salt & in 2 days vaccume it up. also is your cat outdoors or compleatly indoors, ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ---------------------------------

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14153	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: Pleco with Knife

Cam, No. The tank is already too small for the fish you have in it. The black ghost can grow to 20", and the raphael cat can get to about 9.5 inches. Now you want to add a fish that is already 16" long to the tank, probably with no idea how big the fish will get. Some plecos will easily exceed the 24" mark. I don't know what size your raphael or black ghost is at present, but it is likely that they will get larger and need a new home. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of camdogkingsfan Sent: Sunday, July 31, 2005 1:43 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Pleco with Knife I have a 25 gallon tank that has Black ghost and a Rafeal in it and they are kinda boring during the day. Can I put my pleco in with them? He is about 16 inch long. Cam

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14154	From: Evita	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: flea and spider bombs

Isn't funny how most people can remember favorite bugs of their childhoods. I think they were the first live things that we interacted with. We also have those bugs were love to hate as well. Rollie Pollies I believe was a name that some kid came up with first. Evita Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote:rollie pollies were my favorite when i was growing up! my brother & i spent countless hours being entertained by them. aren't they called potato bugs too? agentscullyeyore@... wrote: oh lordy no they are not rollie pollies or what ppl also call the pill bug.. Shannon Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14155	From: camdogkingsfan	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Bunocephalus coracoideus or Banjo catfish

I got one of these today. I never seen him before. Looks like a Pleco but is a cat. Pretty cool looking. Can I put him in with Black knife, and Bala Shark? I am thinking he can defend himself but not sure.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14156	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: An Important message to all.

I would prefer if both were moderated instead. Paul has helped me out with a couple of things and provided an alternative which would have been missed otherwise. =Nick harry perry wrote: >Paul Helmes and Eric Roberts have been banned from this group. Children use this group (besides the 2 I deleted). Name calling and foul language will not be tolerated. > >Harry > >__________________________________________________ >Do You Yahoo!? >Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around >http://mail.yahoo.com > >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >AquaticLife Management. > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14157	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: Betta nest/eggs - I think

I brought a couple of new female bettas which I'm hoping will breed with my male betta. The lady in the fish shop thought they may be about 6 months old. My male is at least that also but he is about twice the size of the females. How long till they find each other attractive? and probably more importantly does the fact that I've got other aggressive fish like tiger barbs and sword tails reduce the chance they will mate. All my fish are in a community tank, =Nick 300 litre / 90gallon ish tank, 18inch deep, winter here so I'm running 27.5degC, ph7.4, full of live plants. 11 Tiger barbs, 2 male sword tails 2 mollies heaps of guppies 4 or 5 Bristle nose 1 cory dory (I want more of these so if you live in Brisbane Australia and have any babys let me know!!!) 1 Flying Fox (looks just like a SAE but doesn't seem to eat the algae) wendie wrote: >Sounds like eggs especially if he's defending the nest. She should be >removed immediately before he kills her. Also you need to get your food >supply ready as they'll be ready to eat by Wednesday or Thursday. >Wendie > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On >Behalf Of AQUARIUMFISH > Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 10:33 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Betta nest/eggs - I think > > > I think I have a pair of spawning or spawned bettas. It looks like to me >in > the past few hours that there are now eggs but I really dont know becuase >I > have never seen it .. Its a regular bubble nest but I noticed tonight that > there are what looks like miniture cotton balls up in the nest. is this >eggs > or not ... and the female is still in there .. could they be finished ??? > the male is defending the nest very well but I cant seem to get her out > either so I dont know what to do. > > > Inexperienced Egger lol > Gen >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14158	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: Cascade 1000 filter

I had an internal filter, I went down to my local hardware shop (Bunnings!) and brought some large hose which was tight enough to fit onto the outlet of the filter. I then blocked the other end off and made little holes all along the hose. This meant the water came out of a lot more places and didn't shoot fish into rocks and break there back (a problem I had with a now dead tiger barb). The new hose made a lot slower water current and only cost me about AU $4 I think. Good luck! =Nick Robert Hickey wrote: >Hi all > >Just got My new 260 litre and set it up yesterday, I also got a cascade 1000 filter it handle up to 400 litre`s so it may be over kill but heh if Im going to do this tank right I may as well get a good filter, > >After setting it up and turning it on I realised how powerfull it is And creates a current in the Water thats a bit to Much., As at Some point I plan on discus and I need a much slower current in the Water, > >I have tryed the drip extension to no avail and the standard output genarated a heavy current, what can I do? > >Do pennplax have other extensions for the Filter ? > >Anyone come accross this before? or any experience of this kinda thing? > >Thanks All > >Irish Rob > > >Regards >Robert Hickey > >Robert Hickey | Networks Engineer Citywest Business Park | BT | Tel: +353 (0)1 43258749 >| Mob: +353 (0)86 8061840 | E: robert.hickey@... | www.btireland.ie > > >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >AquaticLife Management. > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14159	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: Cascade 1000 filter

Rob, doesn't the Cascade have a turn knob on the filter intake tube? to adjust water inflow/outflow? I don't own one but was looking at a model on display the other day. If not then maybe a large decoration in the path of the outflow. this way the water is slowed down and deflected into the tank instead of a large current. Most fish can handle a good current, I try and over filter my tanks also. better to much filteration I always say.I usually accomplish this by 2 slightly undersized filters though, rather one large filter. That way if one filter goes down the other hopefully will sltill work. Hope this helps rob Indiana USA In a message dated 7/31/2005 10:00:16 PM US Eastern Standard Time, nmunro@... writes: >Just got My new 260 litre and set it up yesterday, I also got a cascade 1000 filter it handle up to 400 litre`s so it may be over kill but heh if Im going to do this tank right I may as well get a good filter, > >After setting it up and turning it on I realised how powerfull it is And creates a current in the Water thats a bit to Much., As at Some point I plan on discus and I need a much slower current in the Water, > >I have tryed the drip extension to no avail and the standard output genarated a heavy current, what can I do? > >Do pennplax have other extensions for the Filter ? > >Anyone come accross this before? or any experience of this kinda thing? > >Thanks All > >Irish Rob Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14160	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: Electrocution

Ever stuck your toung across a nine volt battery??? I have heard reports of people getting hurt / killed buy statement number 3 which I feel is as such I wrong / incomplete. see Wendies email where she acted as a conductor between both tanks. Unfortunately most bath tubs are filled with fresh water which doesn't have much salt (ie ions) but when compared to a human body which has more (general statement I know). As such if you throw the same hair dryer into the water at the other end of the bath tube as to the drain plug then the water will act as a high resistance and only flow a little bit of current for the same voltage. keeping it simple... If you add a good conductor, which a human is a relatively good conductor in this case then the body of the person will act as a path of lest resistance and the current will flow threw it.! ouch! but the second thing to note here is that you need a earth/ground point, my bath at home has plastic pipes and the tube self is plastic so when/if my wife every trys to kill me she will be wasting her time cause the bath tube will have no ground point and hence the current will have no where to flow too. so hopefully she doesn't try but if I did piss her off enough then I'd probably be ok in my own bath tube. Another thing to add is residual current devices (RCD) they are designed to turn off the power very quickly without killing / damaging stuff and are recommended to get. So if your power supply board doesn't have one then ask at your local hardware shop for a RCD device. =Nick Nimish Mathur wrote: >Guys, > >Some facts: > >1. Fish in the aquarium are not grounded. Current will not flow thru >them unless they come in-between the flow of current. >2. Human body is very large, In things like a bath tub, the human body >is not really grounded but infact acts as a ground itself. >3. Dropping a hair dryer in the bath will not burn the person sitting >in it. The electricity flowing thru the body will work on the nervous system >and eventually kill it. >4. Fish are too small to be considered as grounding in an aquarium. It >is similar to a large swimming pool and someone swimming in it and one drops >in a hair dryer in the pool. > > > >Why does electricity flow thru the human body in water? > >Electricity flows in the water in form of ions. Once a current is released >in the water, it starts to spread in a 3D field rather then linearly as in >wires etc. This basically allows the electricity to come in contact with any >and every surface in the water including the human body. Now, human body is >so big and has a such a large surface area, that it starts to work as almost >a zero resistance conductor in the water. What now happens is very absurd, >the part of the body closer to the point of electricity will accept in the >flowing electricity and any point further away will start to release it just >like radiations. Why? To explain this, flow of electricity is controlled by >a force: Potential difference or voltage. Current is just a quantity of it >but the force that drives the current is the voltage. A ground surface is >one that is considered at an infinitely negative potential or something that >will always allow any current to pass thru without offering any resistance.. >in a bath tub case: the Human body. So at a point where we have high voltage >of current, the human body will tend to absorb the current. now this should >absorb the current from every point then? Even the furthest? This does not >happen because the current we are talking about is Alternating current. >Interesting thing about the alternating current is that in 1/100th of a >second, it is positive and the next 1/100th of a second it is negative >(basically push and pull). This push and pull makes the human body an >effective capacitor (do you really want me to explain what this is and what >this does? Lol) It's the work of the body as a capacitor that makes the flow >of minor current around the body and thru the water many folds and thus >start to effect the entire nervous system. > > > >Fish are too small to act as a ground or something at infinitely negative >potential and they have a too little surface area to allow a strong >potential difference be created at 2 distant ends of the fish and also, it >is too small to act as a capacitor. This however does not mean that >electricity does not have effect on them.. it is just a minute fraction of >what humans feel and the long term effect of current in the water has been >reported on fish too. Long term is from 10days to 3-4 months depending on >the current as well. > > > >Ofcourse, none of this would happen if the current was DC instead of AC. > > > >Nim > >Ps: Sorry for all this but I had to shed some light on this from my >thoughts. Been 8 years since I studied physics in university so I could be >incorrect in some places.. > > > > > > > >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >AquaticLife Management. > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14161	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: Fin and tail rot keeps getting worse with Maracyn and M2/ hospi

I had a lot of problem with fin rot but it seams to have dissapared lately. Things I have added are live plants, liquid fertiliser for the plants (Seachem Flourish) which has lots of neturents including iron and also I have raised the temperature. Id suggest for an experiment adding some of the Seachem flourish to your tank and see if that helps and is resemble cheep but makes a huge difference for plants! and maybe fin-rot My tanks are currently at 27.5 deg Celsius I found 21 deg Celsius too cold and my guppies wouldn't breed at 25 deg Celsius, well not as well at least. =Nick Emily Tenczar wrote: >Oh my gosh, guys I don't even know what to do anymore. My 20 gal guppy/danio tank is infected with fin and tail rot, which I've already tried treating once with M2 and again with Maracyn, and again with Maracyn a 2nd time. And of course weekly water changes in the meantime, and at one point even more frequently. But it is getting worse instead of better, and one of the fish has lost almost its entire tail. The last water check was okay. > >I'm ordering some tetracycline tablets online because I haven't used that yet, but I really don't even know what to do now. I've tried the jungle anti-bacterial food even. > >That's not even the worst of it. The same problem is going on in my 55 gal goldfish tank. Everyone is okay except the oranda, who still isn't any better after an M2 treatment, maracyn, and melafix. I'm considering a hospital tank for that one with tetracycline, but I don't have an empty established tank. I could set up a small 3-gal tank with some gravel from the old tank and a filter than hangs on the side, then leave her in there for a week and don't feed too much? > >I'm ready to pull my hair out. I can't add anything to the aquariums that will harm the snails either. Please does anyone have advice? >Emily > > >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >AquaticLife Management. > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14162	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: Fin and tail rot keeps getting worse with Maracyn and M2/ hospi

Actually my last comment about guppies must be wrong cause they breed in creeks which don't have a heater in them. So temp might not have helped much with the fin-rot. Try either the live plants or the extra neutrents in the water. Some times other fish will pick on fish and cause it to get sick, remove the bullys or give them some veggies as my tiger barbs don't nip tails when they eat their veggies (Wardley Algae Discs). =Nick Emily Tenczar wrote: >Oh my gosh, guys I don't even know what to do anymore. My 20 gal guppy/danio tank is infected with fin and tail rot, which I've already tried treating once with M2 and again with Maracyn, and again with Maracyn a 2nd time. And of course weekly water changes in the meantime, and at > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14163	From: CATHERINE FLOWERS	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: Betta nest/eggs - I think

put the male & the female in a breaders tray. they should do well. get the female out after their done. I am mating a calicio m & a apache f betta. had to put them in a bowl for the others have died & have only the catfish in a 10gal. wish ya luck --- Nicolas Munro <nmunro@...> wrote: --------------------------------- I brought a couple of new female bettas which I'm hoping will breed with my male betta. The lady in the fish shop thought they may be about 6 months old. My male is at least that also but he is about twice the size of the females. How long till they find each other attractive? and probably more importantly does the fact that I've got other aggressive fish like tiger barbs and sword tails reduce the chance they will mate. All my fish are in a community tank, =Nick 300 litre / 90gallon ish tank, 18inch deep, winter here so I'm running 27.5degC, ph7.4, full of live plants. 11 Tiger barbs, 2 male sword tails 2 mollies heaps of guppies 4 or 5 Bristle nose 1 cory dory (I want more of these so if you live in Brisbane Australia and have any babys let me know!!!) 1 Flying Fox (looks just like a SAE but doesn't seem to eat the algae) wendie wrote: >Sounds like eggs especially if he's defending the nest. She should be >removed immediately before he kills her. Also you need to get your food >supply ready as they'll be ready to eat by Wednesday or Thursday. >Wendie > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On >Behalf Of AQUARIUMFISH > Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 10:33 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Betta nest/eggs - I think > > > I think I have a pair of spawning or spawned bettas. It looks like to me >in > the past few hours that there are now eggs but I really dont know becuase >I > have never seen it .. Its a regular bubble nest but I noticed tonight that > there are what looks like miniture cotton balls up in the nest. is this >eggs > or not ... and the female is still in there .. could they be finished ??? > the male is defending the nest very well but I cant seem to get her out > either so I dont know what to do. > > > Inexperienced Egger lol > Gen > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ---------------------------------

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14164	From: camdogkingsfan	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: What is this fish name

http://www.petresources.net/fish/catfish/cor_mel.html I got one of these the other day and I don;t know what it is called. Look at the pic larger and tell what the name of the fish is in the back ground. The tetra looking one. Not the black spotted one the silver one. Thanks, Cam

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14165	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: EntomologicLife@yahoogroups.com :-D

Someone needs to start a new group! :-D Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14166	From: AQUARIUMFISH	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: What is this fish name

well its really hard to tell what that one in the picture looks like fully but to me it looks like from what is displayed it could either be a hatchet fish hatchet fish picture : http://www.liveaquaria.com/product/prod_Display.cfm?pCatId=1015 or one of an assortment of the skirted tetras http://www.petresources.net/fish/characin/gym_ter.html not really sure unless there is a picture of the fish you bought. - Gen [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14167	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: EntomologicLife@yahoogroups.com :-D

Hi Lenny, What for ? if you are referring to fish I would have thought there were to many all ready!. Or is this just a ploy to draw people to your blog site ? regards, unclenorm. --- Lenny Vasbinder <lnvtm1@...> wrote: > Someone needs to start a new group! :-D > > Lenny Vasbinder > http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com > 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 > LNVTM1@... > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ___________________________________________________________ To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. http://uk.security.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14168	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: What is this fish name

That kind of looks like the 2 spotted Cory cats I Have. MM & MP, '73 Tricia, KG6PNC A couple of great sites for fun http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14169	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: What is this fish name

He was asking about the Fish behind the Cory. I do believe that the first answer about the hatchet fish might be correct. Its hard to really tell. Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 8/1/2005 1:12:50 AM US Eastern Standard Time, trycya@... writes: That kind of looks like the 2 spotted Cory cats I Have. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14170	From: richard thompson	Date: 7/31/2005
Subject: Re: flea and spider bombs

good to know, ty agentscullyeyore@... wrote: yep you are really close it is actually called a boll weevil.. Shannon i beleieve the real name is bull weavel or somethign close to that [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14171	From: camdogkingsfan	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: Bunocephalus coracoideus or Banjo catfish

THIS THING IS ALREADY DEAD. I have had him for like 5 hours and he is already dead. UGGG --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "camdogkingsfan" <camdog@s...> wrote: > I got one of these today. I never seen him before. Looks like a > Pleco but is a cat. Pretty cool looking. Can I put him in with Black > knife, and Bala Shark? I am thinking he can defend himself but not > sure.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14172	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: Bunocephalus coracoideus or Banjo catfish

I would suggest doing alittle research before buying any new fish... a little research will save you a lot of $$ down the road rob Indiana n a message dated 8/1/2005 2:04:19 AM US Eastern Standard Time, camdog@... writes: THIS THING IS ALREADY DEAD. I have had him for like 5 hours and he is already dead. UGGG --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "camdogkingsfan" <camdog@s...> wrote: > I got one of these today. I never seen him before. Looks like a > Pleco but is a cat. Pretty cool looking. Can I put him in with Black > knife, and Bala Shark? I am thinking he can defend himself but not > sure. Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14173	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: Green Hair Algae?s

Amano shrimps and siamese algae eaters. Some people have also reported that rosy barbs also devour this algae at a much faster rate then anything else and it could be true. Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Aaron Sent: 31 July 2005 22:29 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Green Hair Algae?s What (if anything) eats Green Hair Algae? ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14174	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: yet another light question

No, not really Aaron. 2700/3000K bulbs depending on the spectrum can be just great for plants. 2 examples are: Arcadia original tropical and the most well known Grolux. They are both bulbs of lower Kelvin temperature but the spectrum has more for plants in them then any other freshwater planted bulb IME. Kelvin rating has been generalized to make people understand things better. Yes, Blue light does have the capability to reach greater depths and is well absorbed by the plants but they also absorb red with the same vigor. In a 18” deep tank, it really does not make much difference but in tanks deeper then 30”, the blue spectrum does help as it can penetrate right upto the bottom and the red end lags behind. 2700K plant growth bulbs are also good for plant growth. I don’t know what spectrum it has but if you lookup the spectrum of the grolux or the original tropical, you can see that it has a lot in it for plants then the 6500K standard daylight CF bulbs. This is apart from them making the fish and tanks look great ;) Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Aaron Sent: 31 July 2005 22:28 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: yet another light question As far as I understand, you want the 5000K, 5500K and especially the 6500K for optimal plant GROWTH. the 2700k may just make the plants LOOK nicer maybe? Aaron --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > I was studying up on lighting and light bulbs. I found an article that went > over Kelvin stuff. I work at the Home Depot and on lunch today I went and > looked at light bulbs. We sell 40 watt/1600 lumens/2700k bulbs for $9.99. > These bulb are specifically markets for planted aquariums. The bulbs I > currently have in my tank are Eclipse Natural Daylight F40T10 bulbs. I was just > wondering if the bulbs at Home Depot would be better for my plants than what I > have while I am saving up my money for a better lighting system. > > The tubes from HD are 2700k; and full spectrum light is about 5000k. I > thought full spectrum light were better for plants? > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14175	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: Electrocution

Hi Nick, Even if your bath is 100% insulated including plastic taps and plastic drains, electricity will still flow through you no matter where the dryer is dropped. That’s what I was trying to explain that even in a 100% insulated scenario the human body is so large and such a good conductor that it will eventually become (theoretically) a part of the dryer that is releasing electricity in the water to allow the current to flow to the furthest point away from the dryer in the tub. There is no way that the entire water and the body will reach a saturation point because the electricity is Alternating. What happened to Wendy was something totally different. It was like touching a live wire and then grounding yourself at the other end. But because of the resistance water provided, she is still here to talk about it. I am sure you don’t want to try to piss off your wife so much that the experiment is actually put into action ;) lol Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nicolas Munro Sent: 01 August 2005 04:24 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Electrocution Ever stuck your toung across a nine volt battery??? I have heard reports of people getting hurt / killed buy statement number 3 which I feel is as such I wrong / incomplete. see Wendies email where she acted as a conductor between both tanks. Unfortunately most bath tubs are filled with fresh water which doesn't have much salt (ie ions) but when compared to a human body which has more (general statement I know). As such if you throw the same hair dryer into the water at the other end of the bath tube as to the drain plug then the water will act as a high resistance and only flow a little bit of current for the same voltage. keeping it simple... If you add a good conductor, which a human is a relatively good conductor in this case then the body of the person will act as a path of lest resistance and the current will flow threw it.! ouch! but the second thing to note here is that you need a earth/ground point, my bath at home has plastic pipes and the tube self is plastic so when/if my wife every trys to kill me she will be wasting her time cause the bath tube will have no ground point and hence the current will have no where to flow too. so hopefully she doesn't try but if I did piss her off enough then I'd probably be ok in my own bath tube. Another thing to add is residual current devices (RCD) they are designed to turn off the power very quickly without killing / damaging stuff and are recommended to get. So if your power supply board doesn't have one then ask at your local hardware shop for a RCD device. =Nick Nimish Mathur wrote: >Guys, > >Some facts: > >1. Fish in the aquarium are not grounded. Current will not flow thru >them unless they come in-between the flow of current. >2. Human body is very large, In things like a bath tub, the human body >is not really grounded but infact acts as a ground itself. >3. Dropping a hair dryer in the bath will not burn the person sitting >in it. The electricity flowing thru the body will work on the nervous system >and eventually kill it. >4. Fish are too small to be considered as grounding in an aquarium. It >is similar to a large swimming pool and someone swimming in it and one drops >in a hair dryer in the pool. > > > >Why does electricity flow thru the human body in water? > >Electricity flows in the water in form of ions. Once a current is released >in the water, it starts to spread in a 3D field rather then linearly as in >wires etc. This basically allows the electricity to come in contact with any >and every surface in the water including the human body. Now, human body is >so big and has a such a large surface area, that it starts to work as almost >a zero resistance conductor in the water. What now happens is very absurd, >the part of the body closer to the point of electricity will accept in the >flowing electricity and any point further away will start to release it just >like radiations. Why? To explain this, flow of electricity is controlled by >a force: Potential difference or voltage. Current is just a quantity of it >but the force that drives the current is the voltage. A ground surface is >one that is considered at an infinitely negative potential or something that >will always allow any current to pass thru without offering any resistance.. >in a bath tub case: the Human body. So at a point where we have high voltage >of current, the human body will tend to absorb the current. now this should >absorb the current from every point then? Even the furthest? This does not >happen because the current we are talking about is Alternating current. >Interesting thing about the alternating current is that in 1/100th of a >second, it is positive and the next 1/100th of a second it is negative >(basically push and pull). This push and pull makes the human body an >effective capacitor (do you really want me to explain what this is and what >this does? Lol) It's the work of the body as a capacitor that makes the flow >of minor current around the body and thru the water many folds and thus >start to effect the entire nervous system. > > > >Fish are too small to act as a ground or something at infinitely negative >potential and they have a too little surface area to allow a strong >potential difference be created at 2 distant ends of the fish and also, it >is too small to act as a capacitor. This however does not mean that >electricity does not have effect on them.. it is just a minute fraction of >what humans feel and the long term effect of current in the water has been >reported on fish too. Long term is from 10days to 3-4 months depending on >the current as well. > > > >Ofcourse, none of this would happen if the current was DC instead of AC. > > > >Nim > >Ps: Sorry for all this but I had to shed some light on this from my >thoughts. Been 8 years since I studied physics in university so I could be >incorrect in some places.. > > > > > > > >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >AquaticLife Management. > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14176	From: richard thompson	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: Bunocephalus coracoideus or Banjo catfish

was that a farlowalla cat ? i do not see a pic or link or anything. camdogkingsfan <camdog@...> wrote:THIS THING IS ALREADY DEAD. I have had him for like 5 hours and he is already dead. UGGG --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "camdogkingsfan" <camdog@s...> wrote: > I got one of these today. I never seen him before. Looks like a > Pleco but is a cat. Pretty cool looking. Can I put him in with Black > knife, and Bala Shark? I am thinking he can defend himself but not > sure. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14177	From: richard thompson	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: Bunocephalus coracoideus or Banjo catfish

was that a farlowalla cat ? i do not see a pic or link or anything. camdogkingsfan <camdog@...> wrote:THIS THING IS ALREADY DEAD. I have had him for like 5 hours and he is already dead. UGGG --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "camdogkingsfan" <camdog@s...> wrote: > I got one of these today. I never seen him before. Looks like a > Pleco but is a cat. Pretty cool looking. Can I put him in with Black > knife, and Bala Shark? I am thinking he can defend himself but not > sure. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14178	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: What is this fish name

It is really tough to say, since one can only see the head and a tiny portion of the body. Look for pictures of silver dollars and hatchet fish to see if you can find a match. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of camdogkingsfan Sent: Monday, August 01, 2005 1:29 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] What is this fish name http://www.petresources.net/fish/catfish/cor_mel.html I got one of these the other day and I don;t know what it is called. Look at the pic larger and tell what the name of the fish is in the back ground. The tetra looking one. Not the black spotted one the silver one. Thanks, Cam ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14179	From: Hrvoje Maric	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: Green Hair Algae?s

Rosy barbs, or "schubert" variety will do it. Tried and tested on my 200 l tank where problem arised after first setup. Shoal of five or six got rid of the stuff in two weeks. Not only green hair, but also any other type of hair algae. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@y...> wrote: > Amano shrimps and siamese algae eaters. > > Some people have also reported that rosy barbs also devour this algae at a > much faster rate then anything else and it could be true. > > Nim > > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Aaron > Sent: 31 July 2005 22:29 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Green Hair Algae?s > > > > What (if anything) eats Green Hair Algae? > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14180	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: What is this fish name

Cam, With only 1/3 of the fish appearing in the photo, it make it difficult for a positive I.D. However, going with the very deep body and superior mouth, I'd have to say its a Silver Hatchetfish. If the pectoral fins slant back and up on an oblique angle and there is a black line from the mid-body to the base of a forked tail, this would further indicate that's what it is. It is broadly speaking in the Tetra family as you brought out. They are jumpers, so make sure to keep the tank covered. Unfortunately, as they can be picky eaters, they sometimes starve out. They are surface feeders and would do best on live wingless fruit flies, although the less experienced hobbyist is usually not prepared to culture these foods as are more experienced (read; neurotic) hobbyists who in time slowly get pursuaded (by their fish's needs) into growing such fish fodder. Ray \ -- - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "camdogkingsfan" <camdog@s...> wrote: > http://www.petresources.net/fish/catfish/cor_mel.html > > I got one of these the other day and I don;t know what it is called. > Look at the pic larger and tell what the name of the fish is in the > back ground. The tetra looking one. Not the black spotted one the > silver one. > Thanks, > Cam

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14181	From: hnorton1cogeco.ca	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: please trim your posts/Heres a tip/Heather Norton

samantha for those on time limits to view your mail, I download my mail when in a hurry or time does not allow me to read all my email into a folder on my desktop to read them at a time when I dont have to rush and then if I want to respond to a certain one I can write back at my own not so hectic pace Heather Norton ----- Original Message ----- From: rosette55@... To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, July 29, 2005 2:22 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] please trim your posts hello all, could you please trim your posts of old posts and yahoo headers? I am on digest form and the list is always truncated from being too long with unnecessary stuff. maybe it is my webtv but i can't read the entire digest. thanks so much. samantha [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14182	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: Betta nest/eggs - I think

I like to introduce the males to the females in a community tank, but you'll have to remove them from the tank and put them in a small tank together to get any fry. They may even mate in the community tank, but the constant activity of the other fish will demolish the nest, and they'll eat the eggs and fry.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14183	From: camdogkingsfan	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: Bunocephalus coracoideus or Banjo catfish

Richard here is a link to him. http://www.petresources.net/fish/catfish/bun_cor.html --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, richard thompson <rapidostang@y...> wrote: > was that a farlowalla cat ? i do not see a pic or link or anything. > > camdogkingsfan <camdog@s...> wrote:THIS THING IS ALREADY DEAD. I have had him for like 5 hours and he is > already dead. UGGG > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "camdogkingsfan" <camdog@s...> > wrote: > > I got one of these today. I never seen him before. Looks like a > > Pleco but is a cat. Pretty cool looking. Can I put him in with > Black > > knife, and Bala Shark? I am thinking he can defend himself but not > > sure. > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine biology Biology > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14184	From: rosette55@webtv.net	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: trim your posts

wow sorry guys i did not mean to bother anyone. just forget about my request! i'm sure it's only me and my webtv limitations. digest does take up less space in my already small email allottment, and it is very awkward to read from the site with webtv. but this is my problem for being computer illiterate. apologies again for the trouble. samantha

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14185	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: EntomologicLife@yahoogroups.com :-D

Uncle Norm, It was a "joke" about all of the bug talk lately... thus the subject "EntomologicLife". :-D Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: 4 Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 07:06:33 +0100 (BST) From: "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> Subject: Re: EntomologicLife@yahoogroups.com :-D Hi Lenny, What for ? if you are referring to fish I would have thought there were to many all ready!. Or is this just a ploy to draw people to your blog site ? regards, unclenorm. --- Lenny Vasbinder <lnvtm1@...> wrote: > Someone needs to start a new group! :-D > > Lenny Vasbinder > http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com > 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 > LNVTM1@... > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14186	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists every Monday! Monday August 1, 2005 8:00 pm - 9:00 pm This event repeats every week. The next reminder for this event will be sent in 3 hours, 3 minutes. Event Location: http://chat.thatpetplace.com/chat/chat.aspx Notes: Return to this site every Thursday from 8pm to 10pm and Monday from 8pm to 9pm (Eastern Time) to chat LIVE with one of our on-staff Marine Biologists. Learn about your fish, how to treat common maladies, get recommendations on accessories, food and live animal compatibility, or ask a question that only an expert could answer. MarineBio Chat every Thursday 8pm to 10pm EST, only from That Fish Place, The Original Aquatic Superstore. Attention MarineBio chat participants! The chat server is unavailable until 8pm Eastern Time. If you experience problems while trying to log on to the chat session ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14187	From: Aaron	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Rosy Barbs and Neon Tetras (was Re: Green Hair Algae?s)

this is a 55gallon tank with mostly Neon Tetras, will the Rosy barbs, or "schubert" variety , be ok w/ tetras? how can I identify and find the schubert variety ? --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Hrvoje Maric" <hrvoje.maric3@z...> wrote: > Rosy barbs, or "schubert" variety will do it. Tried and tested on my > 200 l tank where problem arised after first setup. Shoal of five or > six got rid of the stuff in two weeks. Not only green hair, but also > any other type of hair algae. > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@y...> > wrote: > > Amano shrimps and siamese algae eaters. > > > > Some people have also reported that rosy barbs also devour this > algae at a > > much faster rate then anything else and it could be true. > > > > Nim > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Aaron > > Sent: 31 July 2005 22:29 > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Green Hair Algae?s > > > > > > > > What (if anything) eats Green Hair Algae? > > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14188	From: Aaron	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: question about posting a message

thats almost an ironic qusetion, if not just kinda funny, I mean who's gonna reply if your not gonna find it? sorta like the the tree falling in the forest dilema, anyway, to answer your question in hopes you'll look for my reply here goes- 1) Start by selecting your Email Delivery Preference, setting this to anything other than Daily digest will make it easier to sort thru all the posts. You can do this by clicking on: Edit Membership - centered at the top of the Group Page: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/ Message Delivery Individual emails - Receive individual messages. Daily digest - Receive a daily compilation of many emails in one message. Special notices - Receive only important email notices from the group moderator. No email - I'll read messages on the web site. 2) Using the Individual emails option allows you to sort your inbox by subject and then you can delete all the emails you are not interested in until you find yours or replies to yours. 3) if you select No email or Special notices, then you have to search a lttle bit more and theres several ways to do it- Start here: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/messages at the top you'll see all these options for sorting the posts: Message # Search: View: Simple | Summary | Expanded As: Msg List | Thread First | < Previous | Next > | Last a) if you know your original message #, you can enter it then scroll to the bottom to see if there are any replies or b) if you do not, then in the search box enter the subject or a word from the subject line to search for your post and look at the botom for replies or c) try view list as Thread, it will link all replie under the original post, however these are now sorted by message topic not chronologically Hope that helps, Aaron --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "camdogkingsfan" <camdog@s...> wrote: > There is allot of people that post messages everyday and I want to > know how do I knw when someone has posted a responce about my > messages? I really don't want to do through all the pages of messages > to see if someone responded.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14189	From: Rei - Raymond Tremor	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: (now debate about Melafix and Pimafix)/another deadly combinati

The Ryukin had that problem before, and then it was laying on its belly but on the bottom of the tank and comes up to eat. Then it had that again and stays belly up on the bottom of the tank. I don't check for water. I had used melafix with pimafix combined with aquasafe, easy balance, and maracin plus. I stopped using meds and just use stress zyme now when the water gets cloudy after cleaning the filter. Rei - Raymond Tremor LoveMoAko@... -------Original Message------- From: harry perry Date: 07/30/05 12:27:23 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] (now debate about Melafix and Pimafix)/another deadly combination. I had a wounded fish( a fight) and also a fish with fungus in the same tank. I used melafix and Jungle Lab's fungus fizz tablet at the same time. 4 dead fish later. I realized what had happened. This happened in 1 hour. I removed all the fish from the tank and broke it down. Harry Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote: Raymond, Have read your current post with great interest. I'm glad to see at least one account where mixing Melafix and Pimafix didn't have a disasterous result. I trust the Goldfish's (Ryukin's) swim bladder problem was there prior to the treatment(?). Could you please fill us in on your tank water parameters at the time, if you know them. Is/was your water in the alkaline pH range? Anything else you can add? Many thanks, it would be great to get to the bottom of why this combination can be deadly under certain circumstances and to find just exactly what those circumstances have in common. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Rei - Raymond Tremor" <rei_tremor@y...> wrote: > I had used melafix and pimafix together and the fishes didn't have problems > with it. Yeah it does have a foamy effect and it is indicated in the label > that it does make your water foamy, but my fishes didn't have problems with > it. Actually they were fine after the treatment. This just my experience > with the product. Now, I don't use conditioners or anything except > fertilizers and my fishes are still fine. I have a ryukin that have a swim > bladder problem but he/she is still alive. It lays on the bottom of the tank > upside down and comes swimming fine when you touch it or feed them. > > Rei - Raymond Tremor > LoveMoAko@H... > > -------Original Message------- > > From: Eric Roberts > Date: 07/25/05 21:10:10 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Foamy water (now debate about Melafix and > Pimafix) > > Have you contacted Aquarium Pharmaceuticals about this. If it is the combo > of the product, I am sure they would like to know this so that can either > fix the problem or at least stop saying they are safe to use together. > Maybe with a water sample, they can figure out what really killed the fish. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of paul helms > Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 12:47 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: Foamy water (now debate about Melafix and > Pimafix) > > > i do sell both products, and support the use of both > products, just not combined togther. most of the > lfs's in the bay area of california are decent and > will warn the same as i have done. we have sold it, > and seen it, not just heard about it. i have done it > myself on clients tanks and seen the results first > hand and with 15 years experience i do know what i am > doing and know how to measure. no one ever said do > not do it, this whole thing started because i said it > can be fatal. it was plain and simple a warning from > experience. > > --- Lenny Vasbinder <lnvtm1@g...> wrote: > > > Melafix and Pimafix are made by Aquarium > > Pharmaceuticals http://www.aquariumpharm.com .. the > > maker of many, many aquarium related products.. > > water treatments, Master Test Kits, etc. They are > > the US distributors for Rena products like the > > Filstar Canister filter, Rena Air pumps, Rena > > Heaters, etc. > > > > To imply that they don't test their products before > > putting it on the label and website to "increase > > sales" is ludicrous since they do not sell fish.. at > > least not from what I've seen on their web pages. > > > > You say that you have only heard of it happening to > > other people, yet you want to say they cannot be > > mixed and in the same sentence you implore others to > > not recommend it if we do not know for ourselves. > > Well, I do know for myself. > > > > You also say "do not believe every thing you read".. > > so does that mean we should not believe what AP says > > about Melafix and Pimafix or not believe what you > > are saying? > > > > You SHOULD read the labeling on the two bottles the > > next time you are in a LFS. These are some of the > > few products that are 100% natural and will not kill > > your biofilter, affect your pH, etc. > > > > They probably aren't as strong as some of the other > > "chemicals" out there, but they have been safe when > > used as directed for my fish. > > > > I see people misuse things all the time and maybe > > that is what has happened to the people who KILLED > > all of their fish. Maybe they tried bumping the > > dosage to "make it work faster" and they KILLED > > their fish when they did not follow the directions. > > We all know many, many people that kill their fish > > for not following directions for cycling, > > compatibility, etc., etc. > > > > Just like the 1" rule that so many people throw > > around.. that is a fish KILLING rule. It only > > works for about 25% of fish... the ones that stay > > under 3" as adults. It does not work for Goldfish.. > > one of the most popular beginner fish... and it does > > not work for nearly any other fish that gets over 3" > > as an adult. > > > > What all of this is saying is that you are right > > about not believing every thing you read.. but it > > does not mean that every thing you read is wrong. > > If someone asks for advice in this or any other > > forum and you disagree with the advice, just state > > your opinion or advice. Don't claim that the other > > advice or opinion is wrong when you readily admit > > that you are not a "chemist". > > > > I do not work for, or own stock in Aquarium > > Pharmaceuticals... do you work for the competition? > > > > Oh well.. you had your rant and now that's my rant > > du jour. > > > > Lenny Vasbinder > > http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com > > 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 > > LNVTM1@g... > > > > Message: 15 > > Date: Mon, 25 Jul 2005 22:58:54 -0000 > > From: "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> > > Subject: Re: Foamy water > > > > Do not believe everything that you read! Do you > > REALLY KNOW for sure > > whether or not Melafix and Pimafix can be mixed? If > > not, please do > > not recommend such a thing to other newer Forum > > members who may not > > know better. Paul is 100% correct on this one. I > > too have seen and > > learned of many cases of hobbyists I know mixing > > these > > two "medications" together and wiping out their > > tanks. Most of these > > tanks were well established over many years with one > > fish having a > > scrape or slight sore with all the other fish being > > healthy, as in > > cases that Paul has seen. By themselves, these > > remedies are great, > > so I am not trying to bash them. I am not a > > chemist, so I cannot > > tell you what happens when you put them together, > > only that it kills > > fish. Can't say why the manufacturer would > > recommend it -- I would > > hope it wouldn't just be to increase sales, but it > > would seem obvious > > they may not have really tried mixing these two meds > > as a test in a > > healthy fish-populated aquarium or I'm sure they > > would have found it > > to be detrimental. My gut feeling is that there may > > be other unseen > > factors involved when mixing these two, such as > > maybe the water was > > below a certain pH (6.6? for instance), or the water > > was high in > > magnesium or any number of things in these aquariums > > which were not > > ordinarily unsafe nor uncommon as all the aquariums > > involved must > > have had similar parameters, but were fatal when > > these TWO meds were > > introduced to the tank together. Maybe when mixing > > them, you can add > > no more than half strength of each one to get a > > total treatment -- > > that I couldn't tell you, but I can tell you mixing > > them can be > > fatal, even if not all the time. Although I haven't > > heard of any > > successful mixed treatments. Ray > > > > \ > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" > > > > <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > > Hmmm.. it says on their web page and the packaging > > that melafix and > > > pimafix CAN be used together, that they are > > complementary. What > > > happens when you put them together that is fatal > > and why would the > > > manufacturer recommend it, then? > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms > > <wtfmorlok@y...> > > > wrote: > > > > they should not be used together, and can have > > fatal > > > > results when mixed at the same time. alone they > > are > > > > safe...together not so much > > > > > > > > --- thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Have you started treating your tank with > > anything? > > > > > I believe certain > > > > > medications, such as melafix and pimafix -- > > which > > > > > can be used > > > > > together, by the way -- cause foam to appear. > > Sorry > > > > > to not be of more > > > > > help. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & > > Leslie > > > > > Moore" > > > > > <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > > > > > My water has developed a foam type around > > the > > > > > edges as well as a few > > > > > > spots of randome floating clumps. The foam > > is all > > > > > along the edge of > > > > > the > > > > > > tank as well as the filter, spray wand, > > etc... > > > > > > All the tests are fine. No ammonia, > > nitrites or > > > > > high nitrates. > > > > > > > > > > > > I read a post a while back where someone > > else had > > > > > some "foam" but I > > > > > > can't remember which group or what the > > outcome > > > > > was. > > > > > > > > > > > > any ideas? > > > > > > > > > > > > Leslie > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14190	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists every Monday! Monday August 1, 2005 8:00 pm - 9:00 pm This event repeats every week. Event Location: http://chat.thatpetplace.com/chat/chat.aspx Notes: Return to this site every Thursday from 8pm to 10pm and Monday from 8pm to 9pm (Eastern Time) to chat LIVE with one of our on-staff Marine Biologists. Learn about your fish, how to treat common maladies, get recommendations on accessories, food and live animal compatibility, or ask a question that only an expert could answer. MarineBio Chat every Thursday 8pm to 10pm EST, only from That Fish Place, The Original Aquatic Superstore. Attention MarineBio chat participants! The chat server is unavailable until 8pm Eastern Time. If you experience problems while trying to log on to the chat session ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14191	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: EntomologicLife@yahoogroups.com :-D

Hi Lenny, Sorry about that, I'm afraid I didn't look at the subject line properly!. regards, unclenorm. --- Lenny Vasbinder <lnvtm1@...> wrote: > Uncle Norm, > > It was a "joke" about all of the bug talk lately... > thus the subject "EntomologicLife". :-D > > Lenny Vasbinder > http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com > 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 > LNVTM1@... > > Message: 4 > Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 07:06:33 +0100 (BST) > From: "Norman. S. Hampson." > <normnam2000@...> > Subject: Re: EntomologicLife@yahoogroups.com :-D > > Hi Lenny, > What for ? if you are referring to fish I > would have thought there were to many all ready!. Or > is this just a ploy to draw people to your blog site > ? > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- Lenny Vasbinder <lnvtm1@...> wrote: > > > Someone needs to start a new group! :-D > > > > Lenny Vasbinder > > http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com > > 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 > > LNVTM1@... > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ___________________________________________________________ To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. http://uk.security.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14192	From: richard thompson	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: Bunocephalus coracoideus or Banjo catfish

AHHH a banjo cat, they are not real hearty. kind of like otto cats, where it may take a few before you get one to live. camdogkingsfan <camdog@...> wrote:Richard here is a link to him. http://www.petresources.net/fish/catfish/bun_cor.html --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, richard thompson <rapidostang@y...> wrote: > was that a farlowalla cat ? i do not see a pic or link or anything. > > camdogkingsfan <camdog@s...> wrote:THIS THING IS ALREADY DEAD. I have had him for like 5 hours and he is > already dead. UGGG > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "camdogkingsfan" <camdog@s...> > wrote: > > I got one of these today. I never seen him before. Looks like a > > Pleco but is a cat. Pretty cool looking. Can I put him in with > Black > > knife, and Bala Shark? I am thinking he can defend himself but not > > sure. > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine biology Biology > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Mail Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14193	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: aquarium salt/dead swordtails

I lost another swordtail this morning. I started out with five and am now down to two. The clerk at the PetsMart where I purchased them suggested that I add salt to the tank water. Because my water parameters are all good, this is the only advice she could come up with. As this may benefit the swordtails, how is going to affect the other occupants of my tank, which include:angelfish, keyhole cichlids, rummy nose tetras, neon tetras, cories, oticinclis, and plants. If the salt does not benefit all the fish, can someone recommend a fish that would add some red/orange to my community. I know that the rummy's and the neon add a little, but the swordtails were perfect. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14194	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: water conditioners

If a water conditioner says that it removes chloramines, does it also remove chlorine and vice versa? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14195	From: Justin M.	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium salt/dead swordtails

At 08:58 PM 01/08/2005 -0400, you wrote: >Because my water parameters are all good, this is the only advice she could >come up with. As this may benefit the swordtails, how is going to >affect the >other occupants of my tank, which include:angelfish, keyhole cichlids, rummy >nose tetras, neon tetras, cories, oticinclis, and plants. If the salt does >not benefit all the fish, can someone recommend a fish that would add some >red/orange to my community. I know that the rummy's and the neon add >a little, >but the swordtails were perfect. Your tetras will definitely not like the salt. JM

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14196	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium salt/dead swordtails

In a message dated 8/1/2005 8:03:12 P.M. Central Standard Time, warbyrd@... writes: Your tetras will definitely not like the salt. That's what I figured. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14197	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium salt/dead swordtails

I do not think cory cats do well with long term salt use. Sorry to hear your swordtails aren't doing well... perhaps it is bad stock from where you got them? Do you have a lfs you could go to versus petsmart? I know this sounds odd but one employee told me never to buy fish there on Fridays because they come in on Thursdays and are not quarantined (sp?). sorry to not be of more help. Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > I lost another swordtail this morning. I started out with five and am now > down to two. The clerk at the PetsMart where I purchased them suggested that > I add salt to the tank water. > > Because my water parameters are all good, this is the only advice she could > come up with. As this may benefit the swordtails, how is going to affect the > other occupants of my tank, which include:angelfish, keyhole cichlids, rummy > nose tetras, neon tetras, cories, oticinclis, and plants. If the salt does > not benefit all the fish, can someone recommend a fish that would add some > red/orange to my community. I know that the rummy's and the neon add a little, > but the swordtails were perfect. > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14198	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: water conditioners

Amquel will. I cannot speak for others. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Monday, August 01, 2005 9:00 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] water conditioners If a water conditioner says that it removes chloramines, does it also remove chlorine and vice versa? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14199	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: water conditioners

Linda, All brands of chloramine remover that I'm familiar with will remove chlorine, but as far as vice-versa -- no. For the most part chlorine remover will not remove chloramines. There are some chlorine removers that claim to break the chlorine - ammonia bond (as per their label description). These descriptions do not go on to say in those cases that it continues to remove the chlorine, but I would hope it would. In any case, those particular chlorine removers will not do anything for the ammonia once its freed up from the chlorine bond. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > If a water conditioner says that it removes chloramines, does it also remove > chlorine and vice versa? > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14200	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/1/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium salt/dead swordtails

Hello, My feeling is that your Swordtails were not the healthiest stock in the world, especially (but in fairness, not necessarily) since it is noted they came from PetsMart which seems to have a less than desireable reputation. As you have Cories and Tetras, you may add no more than 1 tbs of salt per 5 gallons to your aquarium. This amount will be tolerated, but may not do too much for the well-being of the livebearers. \ Although similar to Neons, Cardinal Tetras will add even more red to the tank. Additionally for red and/or orange, you might consider Honey Gourami's, certain Rainbowfish (M. boesemani, but not G. incisus), Flame Tetras, Dwarf Gourami's, Cherry Barbs, Glo-Lite Tetras, Bloodfin Tetras, Clown Loaches and Orange Lyretail Killifish for starters. I'd include the Orange Mollies, but they enjoy a measure of salt even more than the Swordtaild. Maybe you could try locating Red Swords from a different source, and get Brick Red Swords rather than Blood Red Swords (which have proven to be not as hardy). The similar Red Platies are another option. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > I lost another swordtail this morning. I started out with five and am now > down to two. The clerk at the PetsMart where I purchased them suggested that > I add salt to the tank water. > > Because my water parameters are all good, this is the only advice she could > come up with. As this may benefit the swordtails, how is going to affect the > other occupants of my tank, which include:angelfish, keyhole cichlids, rummy > nose tetras, neon tetras, cories, oticinclis, and plants. If the salt does > not benefit all the fish, can someone recommend a fish that would add some > red/orange to my community. I know that the rummy's and the neon add a little, > but the swordtails were perfect. > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14201	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: Poll results for AquaticLife

The following AquaticLife poll is now closed. Here are the final results: POLL QUESTION: How long have you been in the Hobby? CHOICES AND RESULTS - Newbie ( less then 1 year ), 9 votes, 25.00% - 1-3 years, 6 votes, 16.67% - 3-5 years, 3 votes, 8.33% - 5-10 years, 3 votes, 8.33% - 10-15 years, 5 votes, 13.89% - 15-20 years, 3 votes, 8.33% - 20-50 years, 3 votes, 8.33% - 50+ Years, 4 votes, 11.11% For more information about this group, please visit http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife For help with Yahoo! Groups, please visit http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14202	From: Hrvoje Maric	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: Rosy Barbs and Neon Tetras (was Re: Green Hair Algae?s)

I can only speek of species available here, but in general rosy barbs are.. erm ... rosy or red-ish, while schubert variety are more pale yellow-ish (young) to orange (when adult) in color. According to literature they were once referred as same species color variety, but during the seventies or early eighties were divided as separate species. Here (Croatia) Schubert variety is readily (and more often) available at pet shops, but I can't tell for other countries. Nevertheless these are peacfull fish who swim in small shoals and I never saw them harras or disturb other fish (like their tiger cousins sometimes do). They grow up to 4 - 5 cm (2 in) and should be OK with smaller fish such as neon tetras. Hope this helps. Hrvoje

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14203	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium salt/dead swordtails

It's odd that the swordtails did not do very well. I watched them for quite a while before I made my purchase. All of them in the tank were active, robust and appareantly healthy. I really like the pineapple swords. I saw a couple of them at my local fish store. They are approx. 8 miles away from my house and am told the water quality is very similar to what I have. Maybe I will pick up a couple from there to add to the two that I have left, if they survive. If they don't, I am going to do some research on rainbow fish. Do they come in red/orange? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14204	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium salt/dead swordtails

In a message dated 8/2/2005 7:06:57 AM Eastern Standard Time, Crazy4fids@... writes: <<<If they don't, I am going to do some research on rainbow fish. Do they come in red/orange?>>> Every color of the 'rainbow'.... ;-) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14205	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium salt/dead swordtails

Linda, Normally, Swordtails usually do quite well, but as I said the Blood Red Swords are not quite as hardy as some of the others. Once they're established though, they too do quite well. Maybe they were a bit stressed from being acclimated too fast (or improperly). After you float the new bag of fish to equalize the temperature, do you open the bag and let a little tank water in, tie it up and let it set for 5 - 10 minutes, open it and discard some water then add more tank water and repeat this process for at least 30 minutes? This gets the new fish used to your pH, etc., more slowly than just dumping them in. Not sure if this is what you do, so thought I'd mention this important point. \ Pineapple Swordtails are just great as are Lemon Swordtails; by "local fish store", I presume you mean an lfs other than PetSmart? Maybe you'd have better luck with them, and maybe by know (hopefully) your 2 Red Swords have settled in. I guess you know they'll interbreed. \ To be specific, as I mentioned in my previous post, Rainbows do come in red and/or orange. I'd highly recommend the peaceful and colorful Boesemani Rainbow (Melanotaenia boesemani) which normally has the back half of its body bright orange including all the fins and tail. An aquarist friend of mine by the name of Rosario LaCorte raises these, however he manages to get the Boesemani's to exhibit a bright red which aren't even found in nature that colorful. Unfortunately, he does not usually ship fish, but if you're ever in central New Jersey you can find his stock in the lfs's. If you get Boesemani's in your area, try feeding them Mysis Shrimp (it comes frozen) from your lfs. While extremely colorful with the males being a solid bright red, Glossolepis incisus is really colorful but I don't recommend it because of its aggressive nature. Sorry about throwing these latin names at you, but some of the fish just do not have common names. Another Rainbow I'd recommend is a variety of Melanotaenia trifasciata from the Goyder River location (the species can be found in several other locations). This fish has bright orange fins (including the tail) and horizontal stripes down the length of its body -- really attractive. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > It's odd that the swordtails did not do very well. I watched them for quite > a while before I made my purchase. All of them in the tank were active, > robust and appareantly healthy. I really like the pineapple swords. I saw a > couple of them at my local fish store. They are approx. 8 miles away from my > house and am told the water quality is very similar to what I have. Maybe I > will pick up a couple from there to add to the two that I have left, if they > survive. If they don't, I am going to do some research on rainbow fish. Do > they come in red/orange? > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14206	From: Martin VanderWal	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: Filter Change

I'm presently switching filters, from a Penguin 170 Bio-wheel to a Fluval 204, in a 30 gal FW. Right now I've got both running. How long before a bacteria colony is well enough established in the Fluval that I can take out the Penguin? Or is a spike inevitable? Or, is the bacteria in the tank, etc. good enough to handle the changeover? I might also add that it is a planted tank. Another question is about carbon in the filter with a planted tank. The manual that came with the filter said that the presence of carbon in a filter might remove some of the nutrients important in a planted aquarium. Is that true? Do I need to worry about it while using Flourish Excel and injecting CO2 (via a DIY system)? Does it work to run the CO2 line into the intake of the Fluval? Maybe a third question, if anybody can answer it. The same manual said the addition of aquarium peat can help keep or make the water acidic. It also said that peat will bring out the colors of the fish more. Is that true? In my struggle to have a decent pH, I've resorted to using R/0 water with R/O Rite (from Kent). Would I be able (gradually of course), to go back to treated tap water and using peat to keep the water neutral or a little acidic? FYI, tap water runs anywhere from 8.0 to 8.4. BTW, I'm thrilled with the canister filter, especially that I'll be able to have some flexibility with the media, and with the aquarium location, not having to worry about the filter hanging off the back. Thanks in advance for the help. This is a great forum! Martin VanderWal

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14207	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium salt/dead swordtails

In a message dated 8/2/2005 8:47:21 A.M. Central Standard Time, sevenspringss@... writes: Maybe they were a bit stressed from being acclimated too fast (or improperly). After I put the bag into a pitcher and add two tablespoons of my tank water ever 10-15 minutes. Then I net the fish out of the bag and place them into the tank. I do that with all my fish. The one particular fish store I shop at has and exceptionally low pH. 6.5 and my water is a whole degree higher than that. I really do like the swordtails and would love to see some babies again. I had another one dead this morning. The remaining one looks like she is doing fine. She is still active and eating. If she is doing well next week, I think I will buy some from my local fish store. As I said in an earlier post, they have very similar water chemistry. Do the platies do better if salt is added? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14208	From: Phil	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: More babies

Hey! My convicts laid eggs 3 days ago & now they have hatched. I have around 75 wigglers. Woo HOO more babies! They are 4th generation cons, I had their great grandpa & grandma. I LOVE convicts!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14209	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: Re: More babies

Congrats! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Phil" <swordtail72@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, August 02, 2005 1:55 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] More babies Hey! My convicts laid eggs 3 days ago & now they have hatched. I have around 75 wigglers. Woo HOO more babies! They are 4th generation cons, I had their great grandpa & grandma. I LOVE convicts! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14210	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: Re: More babies

Yea, congratulations :) Sounds like you (and they) really know what to do right!! --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Phil" <swordtail72@y...> wrote: > Hey! My convicts laid eggs 3 days ago & now they have hatched. I have > around 75 wigglers. Woo HOO more babies! They are 4th generation cons, > I had their great grandpa & grandma. I LOVE convicts!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14211	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium salt/dead swordtails

Linda, Obviously nothing wrong with the way you're acclimating them, in fact I have to say you're taking more pains than most. Maybe they were just weakened or bad stock. Hard to say without knowing all of their background; they even have been stressed somehow somewhere along the way. Good bet they were probably raised in Florida, which generally raises good livebearers especially if the farm belongs to the FTFI group, so I'd rule out their origin as a reason why they didn't hold up. \ I wouldn't give up on trying to keep them if I were you. I gather there was no indication of anything wrong before they died, like them staying in one place, shimmying? I've seen this symptom often with Swordtails if they've been recently stressed. Yes, try you lfs as another source for Swordtails, if there was no signs of any impending disease (again, like shimmying) in those first ones. Hopefully, they'll do better -- they're really not that hard to keep. \ I find most livebearers do better with some salt added, especially Mollies, although most don't really need it if your water suits them. Platies have about the same requirements as Swordtails -- which, coming from streams in Mexico, do best in hard water of high mineral content (thus, the addition of salt) and of a higher pH. If your water is at least moderately hard anyway you really wouldn't need the salt. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > > In a message dated 8/2/2005 8:47:21 A.M. Central Standard Time, > sevenspringss@w... writes: > > Maybe they were > a bit stressed from being acclimated too fast (or improperly). After > > > I put the bag into a pitcher and add two tablespoons of my tank water ever > 10-15 minutes. Then I net the fish out of the bag and place them into the > tank. I do that with all my fish. The one particular fish store I shop at has > and exceptionally low pH. 6.5 and my water is a whole degree higher than > that. > > I really do like the swordtails and would love to see some babies again. I > had another one dead this morning. The remaining one looks like she is doing > fine. She is still active and eating. If she is doing well next week, I > think I will buy some from my local fish store. As I said in an earlier post, > they have very similar water chemistry. > > Do the platies do better if salt is added? > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14212	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium salt/dead swordtails

In a message dated 8/2/2005 6:42:47 P.M. Central Standard Time, sevenspringss@... writes: <<<like them staying in one place, shimmying? >>> The pineapple swords were fine do begin with. Then, one by one, they started spending more time "resting" on the bottom. The red wag swordtail spent a lot of time on the bottom to begin with. I have never seen shimmy, what's it like? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14213	From: Sandy Kay	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: Subject: Re: water conditioners

I am interested in this subject too and hope you don't mind me butting in here. I am starting a small tank and learning too. Is there a brand you prefer or is Amquel as Steve mentioned, the only thing that will break the chlorine - ammonia bond, I am not sure if I am right about this but you don t want to use Amquel all the time, do you? For removing chlorine and what else needs to be conditioned, what do you like to use? It seems I have noticed in the fish store, some brands that say will remove chlorine. ammonia, etc. but I hadn't noticed or understood about looking for chloramine. Is it not really true that there is a product that will break all down? Hope I make sense because I am a newbie and still learning the fish language. Thank you, Sandy Subject: Re: water conditioners Linda, All brands of chloramine remover that I'm familiar with will remove chlorine, but as far as vice-versa -- no. For the most part chlorine remover will not remove chloramines. There are some chlorine removers that claim to break the chlorine - ammonia bond (as per their label description). These descriptions do not go on to say in those cases that it continues to remove the chlorine, but I would hope it would. In any case, those particular chlorine removers will not do anything for the ammonia once its freed up from the chlorine bond "Each day is a gift from God, waiting to blossom into a thing of beauty." [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14214	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: dechlorinators

<<<<<Yes, there are products, some quite popular, that profess to "remove chloramine in "one-step". A vital clue here is their formalin/formaldehyde smell. What a scam! These products "work" by 1) poisoning your livestock such that it produces slime and other materials in response to the formalin and thus precludes chlorine/chloramine from entering their bodies, and 2) as a placebo, albeit toxic one, where no treatment was necessary.>>>>> The above statement was copied off a website. Is this true? Are there imposter dechlorinators out there? Does anyone know which brands effectively remove chlorine and chloramine from tap water? Is Sodium thiosulfate the correct ingredient that removes chlorine/chloramine? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14215	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: San Francisco Aquarium Society (SFAS), 8/5/2005, 7:15 pm

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife San Francisco Aquarium Society (SFAS) Friday August 5, 2005 7:15 pm - 9:15 pm This event repeats on the first Friday of every month. Event Location: first Friday of each month at first Friday of each month at San Francisco State University Notes: http://www.sfaquarium.org/about.html Meetings are free and open to everyone. If you've enjoyed them, we urge you to become a member. You'll become a welcome part of our community, and your dues help defray the costs of speakers and other special things that show up at every meeting. We meet the first Friday of each month at The San Francisco State University. (We used to meet the first Friday of each month at The Academy of Sciences in San Francisco's Golden Gate Park.) Founded in 1923, the San Francisco Aquarium Society is regarded as one of the nation's esteemed aquarium hobbyi ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14216	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: Re: Subject: Re: water conditioners

Sandy, You almost got what I said right. I said that Amquel (and also Amquel plus) is the only product I know that definitely will break down chloramines. "There are other products out there that make the claim, and they may actually work, but I know that Amquel does work. Amquel will also convert ammonia to a non-toxic form so that your fish can survive a cycle better, and does contain some other ingredients for the health of fish. A lot of people use StressCoat, though I've not seen a mention of it in these threads talking about water conditioners, and I believe that it also claims to remove chloramines. What we commonly refer to chloramines is a chemical combination that contains chlorine and ammonia. These water conditioners break the bond between the ammonia and chlorine, and then neutralize the chlorine. Amquel goes a step further and neutralizes, to an extent. (Lost the "s" on the keyboard I was using and had to substitute another one while I was writing this message. This one looks to have a sticky xxxxxxxxxxxx key.) \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Sandy Kay Sent: Tuesday, August 02, 2005 8:26 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Subject: Re: water conditioners I am interested in this subject too and hope you don't mind me butting in here. I am starting a small tank and learning too. Is there a brand you prefer or is Amquel as Steve mentioned, the only thing that will break the chlorine - ammonia bond, I am not sure if I am right about this but you don t want to use Amquel all the time, do you? For removing chlorine and what else needs to be conditioned, what do you like to use? It seems I have noticed in the fish store, some brands that say will remove chlorine. ammonia, etc. but I hadn't noticed or understood about looking for chloramine. Is it not really true that there is a product that will break all down? Hope I make sense because I am a newbie and still learning the fish language. Thank you, Sandy Subject: Re: water conditioners Linda, All brands of chloramine remover that I'm familiar with will remove chlorine, but as far as vice-versa -- no. For the most part chlorine remover will not remove chloramines. There are some chlorine removers that claim to break the chlorine - ammonia bond (as per their label description). These descriptions do not go on to say in those cases that it continues to remove the chlorine, but I would hope it would. In any case, those particular chlorine removers will not do anything for the ammonia once its freed up from the chlorine bond "Each day is a gift from God, waiting to blossom into a thing of beauty." [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14217	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: Subject: Re: water conditioners

Sandy, Don't mind at all -- Amquel is not the only product that will neutralize chloramine, but is one of the best. As far as using it all the time, yes if need be -- if you are adding or changing any fair amount of tap water that contains chloramine. Other products that will remove chloramine are: (1) Prime, by Seachem, (2) Ammonia Detox, by Kent Marine, (3) Insto Chlor, by Jungle Labs, (4) Super Chlor, by Wardley, (5) Ammo-Lock by Pond Care and (6) Aqua Safe, by Tetra. I prefer Amquel myself for the rare times I need it. Most of the time I use my well water (nothing in it) rather than my tap water. For removing just chlorine, you can use any chlorine or chloramine remover. so, by this, any chloramine remover will break all (both) down if that is your question. If you have chloramines in your tap water, which in all probability you do, you need to use chloramine remover. No, there is nothing else that needs to be "conditioned", although if you're netting fish or adding new fish you might want go use Stress Coat as some people do (I don't myself). Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Sandy Kay" <knightwriter101@y...> wrote: > I am interested in this subject too and hope you don't mind me butting in > here. I am starting a small tank and learning too. Is there a brand you > prefer or is Amquel as Steve mentioned, the only thing that will break the > chlorine - ammonia bond, I am not sure if I am right about this but you don > t want to use Amquel all the time, do you? > > For removing chlorine and what else needs to be conditioned, what do you > like to use? It seems I have noticed in the fish store, some brands that say > will remove chlorine. ammonia, etc. but I hadn't noticed or understood about > looking for chloramine. Is it not really true that there is a product that > will break all down? Hope I make sense because I am a newbie and still > learning the fish language. > > Thank you, Sandy > > > > > Subject: Re: water conditioners > > Linda, All brands of chloramine remover that I'm familiar with will > remove chlorine, but as far as vice-versa -- no. For the most part > chlorine remover will not remove chloramines. There are some chlorine > removers that claim to break the chlorine - ammonia bond (as per their > label description). These descriptions do not go on to say in those > cases that it continues to remove the chlorine, but I would hope it > would. In any case, those particular chlorine removers will not do > anything for the ammonia once its freed up from the chlorine bond > "Each day is a gift from God, waiting to blossom into a thing of beauty." > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14218	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: Re: dechlorinators

Can't say I ever heard of formalin based chloramine removers, and would tend to have to say that most of those statements are not true, but then I suppose I haven't seen everything. Formalin has the effect that it removes the protective slime coat. Its used as an external parasite treatment, albeit a bit rough, though necssary on those occasions. Salt will act as a stimulant to increase the slime production. I don't believe formalin is poisonous when treating fish if used properly, unless it is overdosed, or unless it contains paraformaldahyde. Using formalin in combination with any dye medication might also have toxic effects on the fish. Don't know of any "imposter" de-chlorinators, but it always pays to buy a brand name. Check my previous post (to Sandy) for a list of chloramine removers. Sodium thiosulphate will only remove chlorine. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > <<<<<Yes, there are products, some quite popular, that profess to "remove > chloramine in "one-step". A vital clue here is their formalin/formaldehyde > smell. What a scam! These products "work" by 1) poisoning your livestock such > that it produces slime and other materials in response to the formalin and thus > precludes chlorine/chloramine from entering their bodies, and 2) as a > placebo, albeit toxic one, where no treatment was necessary.>>>>> > > The above statement was copied off a website. Is this true? Are there > imposter dechlorinators out there? > > Does anyone know which brands effectively remove chlorine and chloramine > from tap water? Is Sodium thiosulfate the correct ingredient that removes > chlorine/chloramine? > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14219	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium salt/dead swordtails

Linda, Didn't realize you had any Pineapple Swords; last I knew you were going to get them from your lfs about 8 miles away, unless I misunderstood something. Shimmying is a condition that mostly livebearers (mostly Swordtails) get where the fish stays in one place and wags its body in an exaggerated manner, like its in the starting gate ready to take off. Glad to see at least you don't have that problem but they're no less dead. Since you've been inquiring about chloramine removers, are you sure your using the right product. If not, that could be your answer. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > In a message dated 8/2/2005 6:42:47 P.M. Central Standard Time, > sevenspringss@w... writes: > > <<<like them > staying in one place, shimmying? >>> > > The pineapple swords were fine do begin with. Then, one by one, they > started spending more time "resting" on the bottom. The red wag swordtail spent a > lot of time on the bottom to begin with. > > I have never seen shimmy, what's it like? > > Linda > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14220	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium salt/dead swordtails

Hey Ray! I bought 4 pineapples and one red wag sword. All have since died except one female pineapple. She is doing well. Eating and swimming, color is great. I originally purchased Novaqua. Then I picked up a bottle of Amquel (sp) and got a free bottle of Amquel + . They all have similar directions and do a lot of the same things. One says removes chlorine and one says removes chloramines. I have been using the one that says it removes chloramines, although I don't think my city uses chloramine. Only chlorine. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14221	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium salt/dead swordtails

What causes shimmy? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14222	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: amazon sword for large tank

I read that someone was looking to stock their large tank with plants. Check out this mother sword plant. _Aquarium Plants . com -- Amazon Sword "Giant Mother Plant" (Echinodorus bleheri) Pot (20"-24+")_ (http://aquariumplant.com/cgi-bin/cart/XXL675.html) Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14223	From: KttmfC	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: Hey shtuff for sales

Ive got some stuff for a saltwater tank, basically a protien skimmer, jebo and it works good, rated for a 150 gallon tank. I recently went to all fresh because i have more fun with planted tanks... hit ,me up if your interested. Kris

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14224	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium salt/dead swordtails

Linda, Okay, now I understand. I thought all your original Swordtails were red, my mistake. Nothing wrong with Novaqua. On the Amquel and Amquel + (Amquel Plus), I think maybe you're reading the lables wrong or something. Both of these products removes chloramine (& chlorine). We may be getting to the bottom of this. If you have used the Amquel + (Amquel Plus), that may well be your problem. Do not under any circumstances use Amquel +. There are too many reports of this product causing fish deaths. Maybe it has something to do with using just a bit more than needed (overdosing) or maybe the recommended amount is too much to use for your circumstances (like maybe you don't have that much chloramine in the water so there's more added than needed). Obviously, these fish deaths don't happen in all instances or they wouldn't be selling the product, but there have been a lot of problems reported. I hope this doesn't start another argument like MelaFix/PimaFix. If you don't believe this, I'm not arguing; belierve what you want. For those of you who care to give this the benefit of the doubt, especially if you're having problems when using this, just take heed. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > Hey Ray! > > I bought 4 pineapples and one red wag sword. All have since died except one > female pineapple. She is doing well. Eating and swimming, color is great. > > I originally purchased Novaqua. Then I picked up a bottle of Amquel (sp) > and got a free bottle of Amquel + . They all have similar directions and do a > lot of the same things. One says removes chlorine and one says removes > chloramines. I have been using the one that says it removes chloramines, although > I don't think my city uses chloramine. Only chlorine. > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14225	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium salt/dead swordtails

Linda, Shimmy is caused by stress such as poor water conditions, or getting chilled, etc. It can appear as the onset of Ich. A partial change of water and/or the addition of salt frequently cures up this symptom, unless there is an actual Ich outbreak. While Swordtails commonly get this, so can Guppies. Mollies are especially prone to it possibly because of a lack of salt in their case. This livebearer seems to do best with the addition of salt moreso than any other. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > What causes shimmy? > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14226	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: Re: amazon sword for large tank

Linda, Nice find and a very large plant. However, this plant is really a shrimp compared to how big Sword Plants can get. I'll never forget the appearance of an Amazon Sword Plant (E. intermedius as it was called then; now I think that's an invalid name) completely filling a 100 gallon tank at a now defunct super-store called Aquarium Stock Company (New York, not Cal.), from bottom to top with leaves across the surface if you can picture that. Never thought they could get near that size. Truly unforgettable. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > I read that someone was looking to stock their large tank with plants. > Check out this mother sword plant. > _Aquarium Plants . com -- Amazon Sword "Giant Mother Plant" (Echinodorus > bleheri) Pot (20"-24+")_ (http://aquariumplant.com/cgi- bin/cart/XXL675.html) > > Linda > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14227	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/2/2005
Subject: 1st Annual Coral Conference and Frag Swap, Rhinelander, WI USA, 8/6

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife 1st Annual Coral Conference and Frag Swap, Rhinelander, WI USA Saturday August 6, 2005 All Day This event repeats every day, until Sunday August 7, 2005. Event Location: Drs. Foster & Smith's new Aquacultured Coral Facility in Rhinelander, WI US Street: 3329 N RIVER RD City, State, Zip: RHINELANDER, WI 54501, US Map Phone: 1-800-381-7179 Notes: Coral enthusiasts, reef clubs, frag traders, and beginning hobbyists are invited to attend our 1st Annual Coral Conference and Frag Swap at Drs. Foster & Smith's new Aquacultured Coral Facility in Rhinelander, WI on August 6-7, 2005. http://www.drsfostersmith.com/general.cfm?gid=400&ref=3621&subref=AB Helping protect our coral reefs . . . one frag at a time Come enjoy a weekend in Wisconsin's scenic Northwoods with fellow hobbyists sharing stories, trading coral frags, and listening to expert speakers discuss a variety of topics in a relaxed banquet atmosphere. Browse dozens of exhi ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14228	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: Re: amazon sword for large tank

I may be getting one. It all depends on how the two that I currently have do over the next few months. I wouldn't want t get it and have it not do well in my water/light conditons. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14229	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium salt/dead swordtails

I don't think I have opened the bottle of the "Plus" stuff yet. I wanted to use up one bottle at a time. Thanks for the warning. Maybe I can take it back to the store. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14230	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: Re: amazon sword for large tank

We have an amazon sword in our 37 gallon tank and it is doing very well. We only have about 1.5 wpg and the substrate is filter sand. We dose weekly with liquid fertilizer. I have been debating about getting some sort of fetilizing tablet for under the roots but am afraid the loaches might get into it so have just stuck with the liquid so far. I cut off the older outside leaves as they start to deteriorate to make room for the new ones coming up the center. My otos love this plant. good luck with yours! Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > I may be getting one. It all depends on how the two that I currently have > do over the next few months. I wouldn't want t get it and have it not do well > in my water/light conditons. > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14231	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: Re: amazon sword for large tank

You don't mean that you'll be getting one of those giant specimens of an Amazon Sword Plant(?). A plant that size will suffer some kind of a set-back when transplanted and will revive only to the extent of how much your conditions (substrate, etc.) are similar to its existing aquarium. Plants that large are best grown in place as smaller specimens and not moved after reaching that size. This is not to say that large plants are never transplanted, but they're not as resilient. Sword plants do well in slighly alkaline to slightly acid water of soft to medium soft hardness, and with medium lighting. They don't however like a change in pH. They do best in an enriched substrate as they can be heavy eaters when putting on growth. I used to have them pushing out new leaves almost every day or every couple of days during the "growing season". While hobbyists today tend to keep their substrate spotless with frequent gravel vacuumings, this activity really takes away from the plants food source. Agreed, you have to get up any uneaten fish food, but that shouldn't be there in the first place. Gravel that contains a moderate (not loads) amount of mulm (broken down fish waste) is ideal plant food for the Amazons. Additionally, I used to push small pieces of Planttabs (safe for fish) down into the gravel by the roots. By the way, the proper method of planting aquatics is to dig a fair sized hole at least 6" to 8" away from where you want the plant to be and, burying all the roots thoroughly, drag the plant slowly but firmly through the gravel to the location where you want the plant permanently set up. This will give all the roots a chance to spread out throughout the gravel for best feeding and development, instead of having the roots all bunched up in one place. Ray \ > I may be getting one. It all depends on how the two that I currently have > do over the next few months. I wouldn't want t get it and have it not do well > in my water/light conditons. > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14232	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium salt/dead swordtails

Guess that rules out the chloromine remover as far as the Swordtails' deaths. Back to square one. Hard to pinpoint something with so many possible and unknown variables. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > I don't think I have opened the bottle of the "Plus" stuff yet. I wanted to > use up one bottle at a time. Thanks for the warning. Maybe I can take it > back to the store. > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14233	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium salt/dead swordtails

Thanks for trying Ray. Personally, I think it was lack of aquarium salt in the tank. Before I try some more pineapple swords from the local fish store, I will ask them if they add salt to their swordtail tank. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14234	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: Re: amazon sword for large tank

Thanks for the advice. Maybe I will save my money and see if I can get mine to grow that big! Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14235	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: Koi question

My sister in law called today to ask me a fish question but I know nothing about koi! They live outside of Aspen, CO at about 6700 feet. They have a pond that is not year round... it is fed by run off in the spring and summer and dries up in the winter. I would say it's full about 4 or 5 months of the year. There is a square tube about the size of an outdoor trashcan that goes into the ground at least 6 feet that does not dry up. She just bought 20 goldfish and 4 koi and put them in the pond. She wants to know if there is a difference between Japanese Koi and Fancy Japanese Koi. Can they live year round outside in a climate that freezes in the winter? As long as that tube of water doesn't freeze, will the fish be able to survive in such a small environment (deep but not broad at all)? Basically, I have no idea what to tell her or even what to ask you. Any suggestions are appreciated. I did already tell her to research in advance next time. Thanks, Rebecca

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14236	From: richard thompson	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: Re: Koi question

Fancy japanese koi will cost a lot more than regular japanese koi. they will be butterflies etc. koi can handle temp down to about 40 degrees, but will most likely not survive in he winter in colorado. she would need to have a tank set up in the house or garacge with a good heater for the winter. thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@...> wrote:My sister in law called today to ask me a fish question but I know nothing about koi! They live outside of Aspen, CO at about 6700 feet. They have a pond that is not year round... it is fed by run off in the spring and summer and dries up in the winter. I would say it's full about 4 or 5 months of the year. There is a square tube about the size of an outdoor trashcan that goes into the ground at least 6 feet that does not dry up. She just bought 20 goldfish and 4 koi and put them in the pond. She wants to know if there is a difference between Japanese Koi and Fancy Japanese Koi. Can they live year round outside in a climate that freezes in the winter? As long as that tube of water doesn't freeze, will the fish be able to survive in such a small environment (deep but not broad at all)? Basically, I have no idea what to tell her or even what to ask you. Any suggestions are appreciated. I did already tell her to research in advance next time. Thanks, Rebecca ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14237	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: plant question

My aponogeton ulvaceus has two flowers on it. How long do these last? At what point in time (if any) do I remove them? I accidentally broke one of them while doing maintenance today. Also, when and how is the best method for trimming leaves. Snip them down far? Pluck them off the bunch as close to the root ball as possible? When do you remove them? When they start turning brown/yellow? When they get holes in them and tear? Or is it all a matter of what looks acceptable? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14238	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: water sprite

Does anybody have any tips for growing water sprite? Both as a floating plant and as a rooted plant. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14239	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: hair algae on crinium

I seem to have a problem with hair algae on my crinium plant. This algae is dark olive green and hair like. It does not wipe off the leave, and it is very difficult to pull off the leaves. This is the only plant that has algae on it. It has grown all the way down to about 2-3 inches above the bulb. The algae will eventually kill the leaves-right? Why does the algae only grow on this plant? Should I remove it or let it be? If I remove it, will it grow back or will I have eradicated it from my tank? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14240	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: Re: Koi question

The probable difference between the Japanese koi and the fancy Japanese koi is price, and the hope that the fancy are of higher quality. They will not survive year round in what you describe. The koi will need to be moved indoors. If you have a collection of _Aquarium Fish Magazine_ issues, you can look back to find the articles by Steve Meyer about over wintering koi indoors. Basicly, he uses 2 x 4's and 2 x 6's and plastic liners to create ponds in his basement, and moves his koi into them for the winter months. Of course, he does not have the problem of the disappearing pond as your sister-in-law does, so his fish are a bit arder to corral to bring indoors. He provides filtration with a number of canister filters and larger Marineland HOT filters. Koi are also picky about temperatures. She will not be able to putthem out until the water temperature reaches at least 50^o F, 55 is better, and she shoud bringthem in before the water temperature drops below that mark. The reason that koi have these "magic" numbers is that when the temperature reaches that range, their digestion ceases. They may still eat, but they cannot digest the food, and that can lead to problems later on as the food will have a tendency to rot in their bellies while the temperature is low. Koi are a very nice fish for a pond. I would suggest your sister-in-law gets her self off to the library, at lest, and get some books on koi and ponds so she can gain a better understanding of the pond and keeping koi in the pond. It is not something to be undertaken lightly, as it seems she has done. I've not mentioned goldfish. If they are run of the mill type comets, she can try to overwinter them in th e"pond" that remains over th ewinter, but I'd not think that she wil have a high degree of success. Seems like too many fish fo rthe situation she has. She should over winter them just like the koi. I do take it that she is not aware that koi wil grow to over 24" as will comets (presuming that is what she has)? This would also need to be considered in any movement of the fish between quarters and the size of those quarters. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of thesydmonster Sent: Wednesday, August 03, 2005 2:38 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Koi question My sister in law called today to ask me a fish question but I know nothing about koi! They live outside of Aspen, CO at about 6700 feet. They have a pond that is not year round... it is fed by run off in the spring and summer and dries up in the winter. I would say it's full about 4 or 5 months of the year. There is a square tube about the size of an outdoor trashcan that goes into the ground at least 6 feet that does not dry up. She just bought 20 goldfish and 4 koi and put them in the pond. She wants to know if there is a difference between Japanese Koi and Fancy Japanese Koi. Can they live year round outside in a climate that freezes in the winter? As long as that tube of water doesn't freeze, will the fish be able to survive in such a small environment (deep but not broad at all)? Basically, I have no idea what to tell her or even what to ask you. Any suggestions are appreciated. I did already tell her to research in advance next time. Thanks, Rebecca ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14241	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: Re: water sprite

Ironically, I also just got my hands on this plant today so I will be looking at this thread too ;) Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: 03 August 2005 20:37 To: mnaquarium@yahoogroups.com; AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] water sprite Does anybody have any tips for growing water sprite? Both as a floating plant and as a rooted plant. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14242	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: Re: water sprite

In a message dated 8/3/2005 3:38:07 PM Eastern Standard Time, Crazy4fids@... writes: <<<Does anybody have any tips for growing water sprite? Both as a floating plant and as a rooted plant.>>> Put it in water. ;-) Actually, it can float or you can weight it towards the substrate. It doesn't do as well *in* the substrate. You can tie it to a weight and have it hover over the substrate. Vicky Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Call (301) 496-7299 or (301) 402-8625 or write: hgparker@... =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@... 919-513-1467, Dr London @ calondon@... 530-754-5711 _AND_ Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14243	From: Sandra	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: Re: Hey shtuff for sales

hi kris how long have you had the skimmer and for how much do you sell it? --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "KttmfC" <punk3r12@y...> wrote: > Ive got some stuff for a saltwater tank, basically a protien skimmer, > jebo and it works good, rated for a 150 gallon tank. I recently went > to all fresh because i have more fun with planted tanks... hit ,me up > if your interested. > > Kris

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14244	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: Re: water sprite

Well, I have water sprite as a floating plant in both my tanks and it grows like crazy. The leaves spread out and get huge and then roots form -- I just snip off the part with roots and let be free, or they will separate on their own. I use liquid ferts once per week and have less than 2 wpg on each tank (but does it really matter when they are floating on the surface?). The guppy fry love it. Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > Does anybody have any tips for growing water sprite? Both as a floating > plant and as a rooted plant. > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14245	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: Re: water sprite

Do you have any water surface movement? Mine is moved around a lot by the filters. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14246	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: Silicon Valley Aquarium Society (SVAS) Monthly Meeting, 8/6/2005, 6

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife Silicon Valley Aquarium Society (SVAS) Monthly Meeting Saturday August 6, 2005 6:30 pm - 9:30 pm This event repeats on the first Saturday of every month. Event Location: Round Table Pizza, 4302 Moorpark Ave., San Jose CA Street: 4302 Moorpark Ave. City, State, Zip: San Jose CA 95129-2030 Notes: Silicon Valley Aquarium Society (SVAS) Monthly Meeting http://www.svas.info/ http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SiliconValleyAquariumSociety/ 6:30 pm - 9:30 pm This event repeats on the first Saturday of every month. Event Location: Round Table Pizza, 4302 Moorpark Ave., San Jose ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14247	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: Re: Filter Change

A mini cycle is inevitable as long as you keep both filters running, neither will have the capacity to carry the biological load by itself. Activated carbon is generally indicated only when you want to remove something from the water, and there is no better way to achieve the removal. Everyone touts the good that activated carbon can do, but seldom does one hear of the downside. In this case you got a small picture of what that might be in relation to plants, the carbon will remove micronutrients beneficial to the plants. It can also remove elements that are beneficial t the fish. You almost never hear of what happens when you saturate the carbon. It has a tendency to release what it has captured, and not necessarily in the form in which it was taken in. Some chemical combinations thus developed could be harmful to the fish. When can you tell if the carbon has become saturated? You really cannot. I can't even give you a ballpark figure. It depends on the quality of the carbon, and the amount of chemicals in the water it is capable of removing. Just use carbon when it is indicated. One problem in using your canister filter as a biofilter should be mentioned. Whenever you clean it, depending on the thoroughness of your work, you will disrupt the bacterial colonies established. I would recommend that you get a biowheel you can attach to the canister's output to provide a home for your bacterial colonies. I'm not real familiar with the use of CO2, or its injection into the canister output. I would hope that someone else can jump in here with that information for you. I'd stop playing with your pH, if I were you, and start keeping fish that are comfortable with the pH you have. With that pH, I'm thinking African Rift Lake fish (they are not all cichlids, you know--there are a few other species available). Many livebearers would like your pH as well. It does get expensive using RO or distilled water and additives to obtain the right pH and chemical balance. If you are using other means to reduce the pH, you do need to be careful, because once you break the buffer which is holding the pH to a certain level, you can suffer a pH crash, which is no good for your fish, and may leave you with a pH that you cannot even measure with most common pH kits. Peat will work, if you are already tending to the acid side, but it is used more for softening the water than lowering the pH, though that can be a bonus. The tannins that are release will also have a tendency to overwhelm your carbon, if I did not already scare you off using it. Water quality is very important to our hobby, yet it is one of the hardest things to learn about, and really get to know, as it requires a knowledge of chemistry that many of us lack. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin VanderWal Sent: Tuesday, August 02, 2005 1:56 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Filter Change I'm presently switching filters, from a Penguin 170 Bio-wheel to a Fluval 204, in a 30 gal FW. Right now I've got both running. How long before a bacteria colony is well enough established in the Fluval that I can take out the Penguin? Or is a spike inevitable? Or, is the bacteria in the tank, etc. good enough to handle the changeover? I might also add that it is a planted tank. Another question is about carbon in the filter with a planted tank. The manual that came with the filter said that the presence of carbon in a filter might remove some of the nutrients important in a planted aquarium. Is that true? Do I need to worry about it while using Flourish Excel and injecting CO2 (via a DIY system)? Does it work to run the CO2 line into the intake of the Fluval? Maybe a third question, if anybody can answer it. The same manual said the addition of aquarium peat can help keep or make the water acidic. It also said that peat will bring out the colors of the fish more. Is that true? In my struggle to have a decent pH, I've resorted to using R/0 water with R/O Rite (from Kent). Would I be able (gradually of course), to go back to treated tap water and using peat to keep the water neutral or a little acidic? FYI, tap water runs anywhere from 8.0 to 8.4. BTW, I'm thrilled with the canister filter, especially that I'll be able to have some flexibility with the media, and with the aquarium location, not having to worry about the filter hanging off the back. Thanks in advance for the help. This is a great forum! Martin VanderWal

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14248	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium salt/dead swordtails

Ray, I believe that mollies are more prone to shimmying than other livebearers, especially the black mollies. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Tuesday, August 02, 2005 11:29 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: aquarium salt/dead swordtails Linda, Didn't realize you had any Pineapple Swords; last I knew you were going to get them from your lfs about 8 miles away, unless I misunderstood something. Shimmying is a condition that mostly livebearers (mostly Swordtails) get where the fish stays in one place and wags its body in an exaggerated manner, like its in the starting gate ready to take off. Glad to see at least you don't have that problem but they're no less dead. Since you've been inquiring about chloramine removers, are you sure your using the right product. If not, that could be your answer. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > In a message dated 8/2/2005 6:42:47 P.M. Central Standard Time, > sevenspringss@w... writes: > > <<<like them > staying in one place, shimmying? >>> > > The pineapple swords were fine do begin with. Then, one by one, they > started spending more time "resting" on the bottom. The red wag swordtail spent a > lot of time on the bottom to begin with. > > I have never seen shimmy, what's it like? > > Linda > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14249	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: Re: Hey shtuff for sales

had it for about 3 months on my tank then shut it down.... sale for 35 plus shipping unless your in san diego w\then i can meet upn with ya for it, Let me know Kris Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@...> wrote: hi kris how long have you had the skimmer and for how much do you sell it? --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "KttmfC" <punk3r12@y...> wrote: > Ive got some stuff for a saltwater tank, basically a protien skimmer, > jebo and it works good, rated for a 150 gallon tank. I recently went > to all fresh because i have more fun with planted tanks... hit ,me up > if your interested. > > Kris ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14250	From: snailcrazymom	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: How do I get these FISH out

I have feeder guppies that cycled a tank for me...I put 2 in and they of course mated...I got most of them out but 4 or 5 I can not get out for anything without taking everything out of my tank :O( Is there a way to get these fish out of my tank before they breed.......I got the larger ones out and most of the babies but 4 or 5 are too quick :O( Help Rho

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14251	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: Kordon Breather Bags

I saw this on the forum of my Local Aquarium Society, Thaught it might be of intrest: Rob NE Indiana USA ~~~~ I contacted Kordon about the rumor they are discontinuing Breather Bags. The nice receptionist told me they had stopped production because they feel demand has fallen. They have alot of 4x8 & bag liners left, however at this time will not be making additional runs of breather bags. I use these all the time, so I bought bulk from them, however I would like them to be available in the future. The receptionist said we EACH need to send an email to info@... stating we do use the breather bags and would like them to continue production. She said if they received enough requests, they would probably rethink the situation. I just posted this to killietalk (if it went through). Let your friends know. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14252	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/3/2005
Subject: 1st Annual Coral Conference and Frag Swap, Rhinelander, WI USA, 8/7

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife 1st Annual Coral Conference and Frag Swap, Rhinelander, WI USA Sunday August 7, 2005 All Day This event repeats every day, until Sunday August 7, 2005. Event Location: Drs. Foster & Smith's new Aquacultured Coral Facility in Rhinelander, WI US Street: 3329 N RIVER RD City, State, Zip: RHINELANDER, WI 54501, US Map Phone: 1-800-381-7179 Notes: Coral enthusiasts, reef clubs, frag traders, and beginning hobbyists are invited to attend our 1st Annual Coral Conference and Frag Swap at Drs. Foster & Smith's new Aquacultured Coral Facility in Rhinelander, WI on August 6-7, 2005. http://www.drsfostersmith.com/general.cfm?gid=400&ref=3621&subref=AB Helping protect our coral reefs . . . one frag at a time Come enjoy a weekend in Wisconsin's scenic Northwoods with fellow hobbyists sharing stories, trading coral frags, and listening to expert speakers discuss a variety of topics in a relaxed banquet atmosphere. Browse dozens of exhi ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14253	From: richard thompson	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: Re: How do I get these FISH out

put in fish larger than them =) snailcrazymom <yarncrazymom@...> wrote:I have feeder guppies that cycled a tank for me...I put 2 in and they of course mated...I got most of them out but 4 or 5 I can not get out for anything without taking everything out of my tank :O( Is there a way to get these fish out of my tank before they breed.......I got the larger ones out and most of the babies but 4 or 5 are too quick :O( Help Rho ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14254	From: Sandy Kay	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: Re: Subject: Re: water conditioners

Well, I made a mistake. I have Ammo-Lock by Aquarium Pharmaceuticals, Inc. I also have Stress Coat and Stress Zyme.These are what the fish store recommended to use. I do know about Amquel or at least have seen it in the store but had the two mixed up. Can I use Amquel instead only to condition the tap water? To remove chlorine chloramine, and ammonia. Is it safe to use all the time when you do a water change. Does Ammo-Lock do the same thing. I don't know why I got the name confused. I'm still trying to understand what water conditioner to use. Sorry for being such a nuisance about this. I don't want to use all these conditioners, don't think it even safe to use so many. So to repeat myself because I find it hard to write what I am trying to say sometimes, can I just use Amquel only to condition the tap water? Thank you, Sandy -------Original Message------- From: Sandy Kay Date: 08/02/05 19:25:34 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Subject: Re: water conditioners I am interested in this subject too and hope you don't mind me butting in here. I am starting a small tank and learning too. Is there a brand you prefer or is Amquel as Steve mentioned, the only thing that will break the chlorine - ammonia bond, I am not sure if I am right about this but you don t want to use Amquel all the time, do you? For removing chlorine and what else needs to be conditioned, what do you like to use? It seems I have noticed in the fish store, some brands that say will remove chlorine. ammonia, etc. but I hadn't noticed or understood about looking for chloramine. Is it not really true that there is a product that will break all down? Hope I make sense because I am a newbie and don't understand the cycle. Thank you, Sandy Subject: Re: water conditioners Linda, All brands of chloramine remover that I'm familiar with will remove chlorine, but as far as vice-versa -- no. For the most part chlorine remover will not remove chloramines. There are some chlorine removers that claim to break the chlorine - ammonia bond (as per their label description). These descriptions do not go on to say in those cases that it continues to remove the chlorine, but I would hope it would. In any case, those particular chlorine removers will not do anything for the ammonia once its freed up from the chlorine bond. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14255	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: Re: aquarium salt/dead swordtails

Hi Steve, Yes, thank you; I'm aware of that and tried to rectify that previous statement of mine in my next post on the subject (message #14225 8/3/05 1:09PM EDT) found below in which I wrote: While Swordtails commonly get this . . . Mollies are especially prone to it . . . In the writing of my first post, my train of thought was directed to the subject at hand (Swordtails), and I was vividly picturing the many tanks I've seen of shimmying Blood Red Swordtails over the years, appearing at the time as being kept in less than ideal conditions. I later realized I've probably seen more Mollies in that conditon over time. Probably an immaterial point as the fact isn't going to hinder or help any situation that might come up, but does indicate added vigilance is needed for the health of Mollies. Ray > >--- In Aquatic Life@yahoogroups.com, Steve Szabo <steve@l...> wrote: >Ray > >I believe that mollies are more prone to shimmying than other >livebearers, especially the black mollies. > >\\Steve// \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > Linda, Shimmy is caused by stress such as poor water conditions, or > getting chilled, etc. It can appear as the onset of Ich. A partial > change of water and/or the addition of salt frequently cures up this > symptom, unless there is an actual Ich outbreak. While Swordtails > commonly get this, so can Guppies. Mollies are especially prone to it > possibly because of a lack of salt in their case. This livebearer > seems to do best with the addition of salt moreso than any other. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > > What causes shimmy? > > > > Linda > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14256	From: ben_noreau	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: looking for guppies

Hello, I just wanted to put the word out to see what would turn up. I am looking for guppies. At the moment preferably females. Believe it or not I cant find quality fish in the quantities that I want at the local stores. Also I am looking for varieties that are different from what is available up here. I did have a contact at wal-mart that was going to hook me up, but they put him on midnights :( So to make a long story short, if you have any guppies that you are willing to sell/give away(I am willing to pay a fair price, I wont turn away free fish either!)I am looking. Thanks. Ben

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14257	From: ranchugirl	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: Goldfish Calendar 2006

Hi everybody! I realize I am not on here much, but I always enjoy reading through the various posts and problems.... As a very addicted goldfish collector, about a year ago I noticed that there isn't one single calendar out there dedicated to goldfish - NONE! Dogs/cats/horses/whatever, they make calendars out of it, but surprisingly - and sadly - no goldfish calendar! Well, I decided to change that, and after "beginners struggle" through a nonfamiliar calendar program, the result is in! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll? ViewItem&item=7174108011&rd=1&sspagename=STRK%3AMESE%3AIT&rd=1 Its a 12 month calendar, and after contacting Rick Hess, Ken from DandyOrandas, Tommy Hui and Gunn Chusakul (our four major importers of goldfish and supplies), each of them has now one page dedicated to their own goldfish pictures. The rest of them are my own fish, as well as fish from breeders from the Goldfishsociety of America. There are ryukin, oranda, pearlscales, bubble eyes, wakin, jikin, Phoenix, comets, and then some! It also is proof that there is more to a goldfish than a 12 cent feeder fish or a little comet won on a fair, and I am particularly proud of that accomplishment. Interested collectors, please feel free to have a look at ebay, or contact me directly at RAJ-Pecher@.... I ship within the US, as well as worldwide, and the starting price on ebay is $ 9.99, and directly from me its $ 12.99. I hope you enjoy it as much as I do! Thanks! Andrea a.k.a. Ranchugirl

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14258	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: Subject: Re: water conditioners

Sandy, Amquel -- mixed up with what? You should ONLY use Amquel to condition the tap water to remove the chlorine/chloromine. That's what its for. Yes Ammo-Lock does the same thing. Don't worry about being a "nuisance" -- better be safe and ask, than be sorry. The directions/instructions/primary-use should be printed on the box and/or bottle -- you may have overlooked the. Stress Coat, while removing chlorine (only - not chloromine), is primarily used as a temporary liquid "bandage" to replace the body slime that may have been rubbed off and/or to cover minor skin damage incurred when handling or netting fish until more mucous can be secreted. It contains Aloe-Vera, which of course is not at all harmful, but you don't need to keep adding it when your purpose may just be to get rid of chlorine. Stress Zyme is a selected concentration of nitrifying bacteria used primarily when you first set up your tank and need to "cycle" it; it will get your biological filter "kick-started". Its seldom needed thereafter except when you may have to re-establish a bacteria colony that may have been disturbed due to a prolonged power outage, etc. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Sandy Kay" <knightwriter101@y...> wrote: > Well, I made a mistake. I have Ammo-Lock by Aquarium Pharmaceuticals, Inc. > I also have Stress Coat and Stress Zyme.These are what the fish store > recommended to use. I do know about Amquel or at least have seen it in the > store but had the two mixed up. > > Can I use Amquel instead only to condition the tap water? To remove chlorine > chloramine, and ammonia. Is it safe to use all the time when you do a water > change. Does Ammo-Lock do the same thing. I don't know why I got the name > confused. I'm still trying to understand what water conditioner to use. > Sorry for being such a nuisance about this. > > I don't want to use all these conditioners, don't think it even safe to use > so many. So to repeat myself because I find it hard to write what I am > trying to say sometimes, can I just use Amquel only to condition the tap > water? > > Thank you, Sandy > > > -------Original Message------- > > From: Sandy Kay > Date: 08/02/05 19:25:34 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Subject: Re: water conditioners > > > I am interested in this subject too and hope you don't mind me butting in > here. I am starting a small tank and learning too. Is there a brand you > prefer or is Amquel as Steve mentioned, the only thing that will break the > chlorine - ammonia bond, I am not sure if I am right about this but you don > t want to use Amquel all the time, do you? > > For removing chlorine and what else needs to be conditioned, what do you > like to use? It seems I have noticed in the fish store, some brands that say > will remove chlorine. ammonia, etc. but I hadn't noticed or understood about > looking for chloramine. Is it not really true that there is a product that > will break all down? Hope I make sense because I am a newbie and don't > understand the cycle. > > Thank you, Sandy > > > > > Subject: Re: water conditioners > > Linda, All brands of chloramine remover that I'm familiar with will > remove chlorine, but as far as vice-versa -- no. For the most part > chlorine remover will not remove chloramines. There are some chlorine > removers that claim to break the chlorine - ammonia bond (as per their > label description). These descriptions do not go on to say in those > cases that it continues to remove the chlorine, but I would hope it > would. In any case, those particular chlorine removers will not do > anything for the ammonia once its freed up from the chlorine bond. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14259	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: Re: water sprite

In the 37 gallon tank sometimes it slowly spins but when I added the new air pump to increase my aeration, it happens to push the plant into the center front and the filter outflows keep it there, so it doesn't move much anymore. In the 10 gallon tank it just stays on the opposite side of the tank from the outflow and doesn't move around. Sometimes it grows so large it takes over the entire top of the tank, though! Sorry to not me of more help. Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > Do you have any water surface movement? Mine is moved around a lot by the > filters. > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14260	From: Martin VanderWal	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: Re: Filter Change

Dear Steve, Thanks for your help, especially what you say about carbon. Looks like for the present, though, I'll be keeping my tetras and using R/O water. With a thirty gallon, the expense isn't that high. If I go with any larger an aquarium, I'll have to keep your advice in mind. Given those things in mind--giving up carbon and using R/O water, would there be any benefit in using peat? Thanks again, Martin VanderWal --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > A mini cycle is inevitable as long as you keep both filters running, neither > will have the capacity to carry the biological load by itself. > > Activated carbon is generally indicated only when you want to remove > something from the water, and there is no better way to achieve the removal. > Everyone touts the good that activated carbon can do, but seldom does one > hear of the downside. In this case you got a small picture of what that > might be in relation to plants, the carbon will remove micronutrients > beneficial to the plants. It can also remove elements that are beneficial t > the fish. You almost never hear of what happens when you saturate the > carbon. It has a tendency to release what it has captured, and not > necessarily in the form in which it was taken in. Some chemical combinations > thus developed could be harmful to the fish. When can you tell if the carbon > has become saturated? You really cannot. I can't even give you a ballpark > figure. It depends on the quality of the carbon, and the amount of chemicals > in the water it is capable of removing. > > Just use carbon when it is indicated. > > One problem in using your canister filter as a biofilter should be > mentioned. Whenever you clean it, depending on the thoroughness of your > work, you will disrupt the bacterial colonies established. I would recommend > that you get a biowheel you can attach to the canister's output to provide a > home for your bacterial colonies. > > I'm not real familiar with the use of CO2, or its injection into the > canister output. I would hope that someone else can jump in here with that > information for you. > > I'd stop playing with your pH, if I were you, and start keeping fish that > are comfortable with the pH you have. With that pH, I'm thinking African > Rift Lake fish (they are not all cichlids, you know--there are a few other > species available). Many livebearers would like your pH as well. It does get > expensive using RO or distilled water and additives to obtain the right pH > and chemical balance. If you are using other means to reduce the pH, you do > need to be careful, because once you break the buffer which is holding the > pH to a certain level, you can suffer a pH crash, which is no good for your > fish, and may leave you with a pH that you cannot even measure with most > common pH kits. Peat will work, if you are already tending to the acid side, > but it is used more for softening the water than lowering the pH, though > that can be a bonus. The tannins that are release will also have a tendency > to overwhelm your carbon, if I did not already scare you off using it. > > Water quality is very important to our hobby, yet it is one of the hardest > things to learn about, and really get to know, as it requires a knowledge of > chemistry that many of us lack. > > \\Steve// >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14261	From: joequality1980	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: Re: hair algae on crinium

remove it if you think it doesnt look good (I would). It may or may not grow back depending on your tank and environmental conditions --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > I seem to have a problem with hair algae on my crinium plant. This algae is > dark olive green and hair like. It does not wipe off the leave, and it is > very difficult to pull off the leaves. This is the only plant that has algae > on it. It has grown all the way down to about 2-3 inches above the bulb. > The algae will eventually kill the leaves-right? Why does the algae only grow > on this plant? Should I remove it or let it be? If I remove it, will it > grow back or will I have eradicated it from my tank? > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14262	From: joequality1980	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: Re: looking for guppies

where are you located? --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "ben_noreau" <ben_noreau@y...> wrote: > > So to make a long story short, if you have any guppies that you > are willing to sell/give away(I am willing to pay a fair price, I wont > turn away free fish either!)I am looking. Thanks.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14263	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: Re: Kordon Breather Bags

I just wrote to them. I got some sample breather bags at the ACA convention and they worked great. I plan on buying some soon, especially now that they are thinking of discontinuing them. Mike -----Original Message----- From: FortWayneFish@... To: CentralCichlids@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 02:33:26 EDT Subject: [AquaticLife] Kordon Breather Bags I saw this on the forum of my Local Aquarium Society, Thaught it might be of intrest: Rob NE Indiana USA ~~~~ I contacted Kordon about the rumor they are discontinuing Breather Bags. The nice receptionist told me they had stopped production because they feel demand has fallen. They have alot of 4x8 & bag liners left, however at this time will not be making additional runs of breather bags. I use these all the time, so I bought bulk from them, however I would like them to be available in the future. The receptionist said we EACH need to send an email to info@... stating we do use the breather bags and would like them to continue production. She said if they received enough requests, they would probably rethink the situation. I just posted this to killietalk (if it went through). Let your friends know. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14264	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: SAE

I have been considering getting 2 SAEs for my 37 gallon community tank but am not sure they would be a good fit. It is well planted and contains 3 otos, 1 albino BN, 3 botia striata, and guppies. I have BBA on my amazon sword and anubias coffefolia. Do you think the SAEs would get too big for my tank (it's tall, not wide)? Would they be too wild? I read they aren't aggressive but swim like maniacs that can startle other fish. Also, I am going to go have my water tested for phosphates as I read this could be another reason I have this algae. What is a good value to have and if it is high, how do I lower it? Finally, what liquid fertilizer do you recommend? I bought Flourish and Flourish Excel because I was told it would help my plants and get rid of the algae but haven't been using it very long. Is there a shrimp or snail that would be a good addition for algae control that wouldn't get eaten by the loaches? The otos and BN keep the glass, wood, and leaves clean, it's just the edges that have the algae. Thanks :) Rebecca

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14265	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: Re: Goldfish Calendar 2006

Sinc ethat link provided wrapped, use this link to avoid having to edit the message or copy and paste the URL to your browser: http://tinyurl.com/8wzgo -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of ranchugirl Sent: Thursday, August 04, 2005 9:09 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Goldfish Calendar 2006 Hi everybody! I realize I am not on here much, but I always enjoy reading through the various posts and problems.... As a very addicted goldfish collector, about a year ago I noticed that there isn't one single calendar out there dedicated to goldfish - NONE! Dogs/cats/horses/whatever, they make calendars out of it, but surprisingly - and sadly - no goldfish calendar! Well, I decided to change that, and after "beginners struggle" through a nonfamiliar calendar program, the result is in! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7174108011&rd=1&sspagename=STRK%3AMESE%3AIT&rd=1 Its a 12 month calendar, and after contacting Rick Hess, Ken from DandyOrandas, Tommy Hui and Gunn Chusakul (our four major importers of goldfish and supplies), each of them has now one page dedicated to their own goldfish pictures. The rest of them are my own fish, as well as fish from breeders from the Goldfishsociety of America. There are ryukin, oranda, pearlscales, bubble eyes, wakin, jikin, Phoenix, comets, and then some! It also is proof that there is more to a goldfish than a 12 cent feeder fish or a little comet won on a fair, and I am particularly proud of that accomplishment. Interested collectors, please feel free to have a look at ebay, or contact me directly at RAJ-Pecher@.... I ship within the US, as well as worldwide, and the starting price on ebay is $ 9.99, and directly from me its $ 12.99. I hope you enjoy it as much as I do! Thanks! Andrea a.k.a. Ranchugirl ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14266	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists every Thursday Thursday August 4, 2005 8:00 pm - 10:00 pm This event repeats every week. The next reminder for this event will be sent in 3 hours, 3 minutes. Event Location: http://chat.thatpetplace.com/chat/chat.aspx Notes: Return to this site every Thursday from 8pm to 10pm and Monday from 8pm to 9pm (Eastern Time) to chat LIVE with one of our on-staff Marine Biologists. Learn about your fish, how to treat common maladies, get recommendations on accessories, food and live animal compatibility, or ask a question that only an expert could answer. MarineBio Chat every Thursday 8pm to 10pm EST, only from That Fish Place, The Original Aquatic Superstore. Attention MarineBio chat participants! The chat server is unavailable until 8pm Eastern Time. If you experience problems while trying to log on to the chat session ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14267	From: Tom Ray	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: Re: water sprite

I've only grown it with great success (i.e., grows like a weed) in pico-tanks (so far). I did add some into my new 37 gal too. In both cases've always "rooted it" (the best I can). A typical pico-tank set up that has worked for me: 1) Laterite/APS/FloraBase substrate. 2) daily SeaChem Excel liquid dosing of the pico-tank; DIY CO2 of my 37 gal. 3) after a major water change or at least monthly SeaChem liquid fert. 4) let detris accummulate around its roots (NOTE: The roots will constantly be working themselves up out of your substrate. Just stick them back in when you liquid fert.). 5) lighting in pico-tank is typically high (i.e., a CoraLife 18W for 1-2.5 gal.), but they start off partially to fully shaded. Not sure what part of the above has been key. I have found my Pygmy Gourami and Dario Dario love Water Sprite (even more than Riccia, and as much as Java Moss). One Betta s. I had use to swim through it all the time, working his way and rubbing up against it, though he never showed signs of any skin parasites so I guess he just loved its gentile "fingers" along his scales. --TommyBoy --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > Does anybody have any tips for growing water sprite? Both as a floating plant and as a rooted plant. > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14268	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists every Thursday Thursday August 4, 2005 8:00 pm - 10:00 pm This event repeats every week. Event Location: http://chat.thatpetplace.com/chat/chat.aspx Notes: Return to this site every Thursday from 8pm to 10pm and Monday from 8pm to 9pm (Eastern Time) to chat LIVE with one of our on-staff Marine Biologists. Learn about your fish, how to treat common maladies, get recommendations on accessories, food and live animal compatibility, or ask a question that only an expert could answer. MarineBio Chat every Thursday 8pm to 10pm EST, only from That Fish Place, The Original Aquatic Superstore. Attention MarineBio chat participants! The chat server is unavailable until 8pm Eastern Time. If you experience problems while trying to log on to the chat session ADVERTISEMENT ZIP code where you park at night. Do you currently have auto insurance? Yes No Have you had a U.S driver's license for more than 3 years? Yes No Has any driver in your household had 2 or more accidents or moving violations in the last 3 years? Yes No Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14269	From: Ben Noreau	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: Re: looking for guppies

I am located in northern (near the canadian border) NY. Ben Ben ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14270	From: steve@landoctor.com	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: (no subject)

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14271	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: Re: (unknown)

Sorry, I don't know what happened here. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of steve@... Sent: Thursday, August 04, 2005 10:23 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] (unknown) 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14272	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: Re: Filter Change

Martin, I don't know. Depends on what your water is after it has gone through the RO process, and the additives you are using with it. If your pH is 7.0 or higher, you may wish to experiment with it, and be ready to pull it should anything untoward happen. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Martin VanderWal Sent: Thursday, August 04, 2005 11:24 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Filter Change Dear Steve, Thanks for your help, especially what you say about carbon. Looks like for the present, though, I'll be keeping my tetras and using R/O water. With a thirty gallon, the expense isn't that high. If I go with any larger an aquarium, I'll have to keep your advice in mind. Given those things in mind--giving up carbon and using R/O water, would there be any benefit in using peat? Thanks again, Martin VanderWal --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > A mini cycle is inevitable as long as you keep both filters running, neither > will have the capacity to carry the biological load by itself. > > Activated carbon is generally indicated only when you want to remove > something from the water, and there is no better way to achieve the removal. > Everyone touts the good that activated carbon can do, but seldom does one > hear of the downside. In this case you got a small picture of what that > might be in relation to plants, the carbon will remove micronutrients > beneficial to the plants. It can also remove elements that are beneficial t > the fish. You almost never hear of what happens when you saturate the > carbon. It has a tendency to release what it has captured, and not > necessarily in the form in which it was taken in. Some chemical combinations > thus developed could be harmful to the fish. When can you tell if the carbon > has become saturated? You really cannot. I can't even give you a ballpark > figure. It depends on the quality of the carbon, and the amount of chemicals > in the water it is capable of removing. > > Just use carbon when it is indicated. > > One problem in using your canister filter as a biofilter should be > mentioned. Whenever you clean it, depending on the thoroughness of your > work, you will disrupt the bacterial colonies established. I would recommend > that you get a biowheel you can attach to the canister's output to provide a > home for your bacterial colonies. > > I'm not real familiar with the use of CO2, or its injection into the > canister output. I would hope that someone else can jump in here with that > information for you. > > I'd stop playing with your pH, if I were you, and start keeping fish that > are comfortable with the pH you have. With that pH, I'm thinking African > Rift Lake fish (they are not all cichlids, you know--there are a few other > species available). Many livebearers would like your pH as well. It does get > expensive using RO or distilled water and additives to obtain the right pH > and chemical balance. If you are using other means to reduce the pH, you do > need to be careful, because once you break the buffer which is holding the > pH to a certain level, you can suffer a pH crash, which is no good for your > fish, and may leave you with a pH that you cannot even measure with most > common pH kits. Peat will work, if you are already tending to the acid side, > but it is used more for softening the water than lowering the pH, though > that can be a bonus. The tannins that are release will also have a tendency > to overwhelm your carbon, if I did not already scare you off using it. > > Water quality is very important to our hobby, yet it is one of the hardest > things to learn about, and really get to know, as it requires a knowledge of > chemistry that many of us lack. > > \\Steve// >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14273	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: Re: Subject: Re: water conditioners

This did not show the first time I sent it, just that malformed text passing itself as a message. So, here goes once more. ---------------------------------- Profit margins can do wonders for recommendations from store personnel <g>. I normally use Amquel for treatment of water during water changes. This is the end for which the product was designed. What Amquel does is to break the bond between the chlorine and ammonia. Once this has been done, the chlorine is removed. The ammonia is changed to a non-toxic form (per the developer, not the product literature). This will allow, particularly in a cycling tank, the bacteria colonies to develop uninterrupted. When you use Amquel, you cannot test the ammonia level in the water using Nesslar reagents. You need a test kit that use salicylate reagents. You can read more about this and other Kordon products by going to http://www.novalek.com/kordon.htm. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Sandy Kay Sent: Thursday, August 04, 2005 7:09 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Subject: Re: water conditioners Well, I made a mistake. I have Ammo-Lock by Aquarium Pharmaceuticals, Inc. I also have Stress Coat and Stress Zyme.These are what the fish store recommended to use. I do know about Amquel or at least have seen it in the store but had the two mixed up. Can I use Amquel instead only to condition the tap water? To remove chlorine chloramine, and ammonia. Is it safe to use all the time when you do a water change. Does Ammo-Lock do the same thing. I don't know why I got the name confused. I'm still trying to understand what water conditioner to use. Sorry for being such a nuisance about this. I don't want to use all these conditioners, don't think it even safe to use so many. So to repeat myself because I find it hard to write what I am trying to say sometimes, can I just use Amquel only to condition the tap water? Thank you, Sandy -------Original Message------- From: Sandy Kay Date: 08/02/05 19:25:34 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Subject: Re: water conditioners I am interested in this subject too and hope you don't mind me butting in here. I am starting a small tank and learning too. Is there a brand you prefer or is Amquel as Steve mentioned, the only thing that will break the chlorine - ammonia bond, I am not sure if I am right about this but you don t want to use Amquel all the time, do you? For removing chlorine and what else needs to be conditioned, what do you like to use? It seems I have noticed in the fish store, some brands that say will remove chlorine. ammonia, etc. but I hadn't noticed or understood about looking for chloramine. Is it not really true that there is a product that will break all down? Hope I make sense because I am a newbie and don't understand the cycle. Thank you, Sandy Subject: Re: water conditioners Linda, All brands of chloramine remover that I'm familiar with will remove chlorine, but as far as vice-versa -- no. For the most part chlorine remover will not remove chloramines. There are some chlorine removers that claim to break the chlorine - ammonia bond (as per their label description). These descriptions do not go on to say in those cases that it continues to remove the chlorine, but I would hope it would. In any case, those particular chlorine removers will not do anything for the ammonia once its freed up from the chlorine bond.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14274	From: Andrea	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: New to the Group

Hi Everybody I'm new to your group and figured I'd post a Hello. I raise bettas (plakats and cambodians so far) and have started to dabble with white clouds and long finned zebra danios. I've read a few of the recent posts and have found the ones on the plants especially interesting ( I have had terrible luck with live plants - most of my bettas sleep in plastic ones now :) ) Andrea & Approx. 150 bettas, danios and minnows :)

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14275	From: seamonkeystew	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: Fish Only Saltwater tank

Any recomendations for a saltwater fishonly tank. Im not a begginer, i just cant think of anything. Help me!!!!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14276	From: Justin M.	Date: 8/4/2005
Subject: Re: New to the Group

At 12:01 AM 05/08/2005 +0000, you wrote: >Hi Everybody >I'm new to your group and figured I'd post a Hello. I raise bettas >(plakats and cambodians so far) and have started to dabble with white >clouds and long finned zebra danios. I've read a few of the recent >posts and have found the ones on the plants especially interesting ( I >have had terrible luck with live plants - most of my bettas sleep in >plastic ones now :) ) Welcome aboard Andrea! I have a male betta (the first I've ever owned)and I've been pleasantly surprised by how much personality he's shown. His name is Alpha, and he shares a heated 10 gal. tank with two bronze corys. It saddens me to see these lovely fish displayed in cold, cramped plastic cups...especially now that I've watched my little guy enjoy his spacious home. Anyways, welcome again, I hope you find the group as informative as I have! JM

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14277	From: Robert Hickey	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Feeding Tropical fish

Hi all me again Just out of curiosty Im looking into different foods for my tank the reason for this is that all My fish have grown well and are doing well on the normal flake, sinking and pleco standard pellets, I have a 260 litre with 9 neons 10 Serpa tetras 2 5 inch Angels a 6 inch pleco 3 bolivian rams 6 corys As all eat different food types Im wondering What other people do with feeding there fish. I have lately taken to setting up a small devise for dangling food in the tank, the pleco seems to love cucumber and one of the angels like it to. Last night I added a cooked prawn ( let to cool down) which the serpaes loved ( like a school of red belly piranhas) What other foods can I over them in small amounts ever now and again for treats? As most of the bigger fish are chiclids would they be more interested in better foods? Regards Robert Hickey Robert Hickey | Networks Engineer Citywest Business Park | BT | Tel: +353 (0)1 43258749 | Mob: +353 (0)86 8061840 | E: robert.hickey@... | www.btireland.ie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14278	From: Daniel	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Re: How do I get these FISH out

Hi Rho If they are babies you could put larger fish if you dont care for them to be eaten.I find with my guppies that when you feed them they come to the top if its flake food but make sure you have no water movement so the flakes will stay afloat for a while.It also helps if they are really hungry when you feed them.The method I use to catch my Cardina Tetras is to use 2 nets to catch them .I use one in front of them and one behind them and force them into a corner them grab them up in the net. I hope this helps. Daniel --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "snailcrazymom" <yarncrazymom@y...> wrote: > I have feeder guppies that cycled a tank for me...I put 2 in and they > of course mated...I got most of them out but 4 or 5 I can not get out > for anything without taking everything out of my tank :O( Is there a > way to get these fish out of my tank before they breed.......I got the > larger ones out and most of the babies but 4 or 5 are too quick :O( > > Help > > Rho

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14279	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Guest Speakers ?

I am trying to HELP come up with a list of possible speakers for my Local Aquarium Club Outting for 2006. Its a Whole year away but I figuered I'd start now. Is there a list of speakers out there besides the Marineland List? http://marineland.com/science/dr_tim/speakers_index.asp The club has a wide variety of members. From Livebearer keepers to cichlid nuts. Can anyone recomend or give a list of speakers? This is the 1st time I have ever tried being active so i'd like to do my part. Rob USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14280	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Re: Guest Speakers ?

Ther eare a couple of other plces you can look. I'll need to wait until I get home and have a chance to look them up for you. Where is your club and what is it called? You may have some good speakers right in your neighborhood, so to speak, that would be willing to come speak. Can you be a bit more specific about the event. Is it a hwole day event, a weekend event or what? Is there a show as well? If there is, you can perhaps get the speakers to also judge some of the show. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of FortWayneFish@... Sent: Friday, August 05, 2005 1:48 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Guest Speakers ? I am trying to HELP come up with a list of possible speakers for my Local Aquarium Club Outting for 2006. Its a Whole year away but I figuered I'd start now. Is there a list of speakers out there besides the Marineland List? http://marineland.com/science/dr_tim/speakers_index.asp The club has a wide variety of members. From Livebearer keepers to cichlid nuts. Can anyone recomend or give a list of speakers? This is the 1st time I have ever tried being active so i'd like to do my part. Rob USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14281	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Re: Guest Speakers ?

Steve, Thanks for the reply Here is the Info for this years Event. club Is Circle City Aquarium Club Indianapolis, Indiana October 14 thru October 16, 2005 Speaker Lineup: Banquet Speaker - Chuck Rambo: Chuck has been in the hobby for 38 years and specializes in African Cichlids. He has visited both Lake Malawi and Lake Tanganyika within the past 3 years. Eric Keith: Eric has just returned from an adventure from the Amazon. Mike Hellweg: Mike will be talking about Oddball fishes. Steve Edie: Steve’s lecture covers the cichlids of Lake Tanganyika Peter Shepard: Pete is an active member in the Greater Cincinnati Aquarium Society, and a avid breeder. You don't want to miss our FISH, PLANTS, DRY GOODS AUCTION on Sunday! this year CCAC was in competition with a few other Aquarium Societies in getting speakers because of the dates. But still managed to get a pretty impressive list of speakers. Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 8/5/2005 12:53:48 PM US Eastern Standard Time, steve@... writes: Ther eare a couple of other plces you can look. I'll need to wait until I get home and have a chance to look them up for you. Where is your club and what is it called? You may have some good speakers right in your neighborhood, so to speak, that would be willing to come speak. Can you be a bit more specific about the event. Is it a hwole day event, a weekend event or what? Is there a show as well? If there is, you can perhaps get the speakers to also judge some of the show. \\Steve// [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14282	From: Chris	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Re: Feeding Tropical fish

Those fish would feast on live brine shrimp (drain the shrimp into a net over a bucket so you don't put the salt water in your tank). Try frozen foods every so often, too - eg bloodworms would suit tropical fish. You could always hand-feed the fish too, especially if the bottom feeders were missing out. Your plec will love lettuce - use the softest parts of the leaf. Chris. Robert Hickey <rhickey@...> wrote: What other foods can I over them in small amounts ever now and again for treats? As most of the bigger fish are chiclids would they be more interested in better foods? Send instant messages to your online friends http://au.messenger.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14283	From: Daniel	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Tank Pics

I just redesignied my landscape in my 90G discus tank and thought I would share some pictures with you all.This is a tank I put in my wall like a picture frame last year.I get to it from another room which I have made into a small fish room.The Tank in viewable from my dining room.The rock I got from right outside my yard and I just reused the plants I already had.The sand is white play sand. I use an O2 system for the plants that has a ph shutoff monitor on it. The tank has (5) blue diamond discus,about (20) cardnal tetras,(1)true siamese Alge eater( that I over paied for. $20.00 at my nearest aquarium store)found out later I could get them online for $2.99ea.I plan on getting atleast 5 more so they can swim together.I also have 2 grey plecos,and I love this guys trumpet snails. Well just wanted to share a little. P.S. Pics are in my Album under Danielc. Daniel

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14284	From: joequality1980	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Re: Tank Pics

Very cool tank... what type of plants are those? --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Daniel" <daniel@t...> wrote: > I just redesignied my landscape in my 90G discus tank and thought I > would share some pictures with you all.This is a tank I put in my wall > like a picture frame last year.I get to it from another room which

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14285	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Re: Fish Only Saltwater tank

how big is your tank? did you want aggressive or peaceful fish? --- seamonkeystew <seamonkeystew@...> wrote: > Any recomendations for a saltwater fishonly tank. Im not a begginer, > i just cant think of anything. Help me!!!! > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14286	From: Daniel	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Re: Tank Pics

I think the names of the plants I have are java ferns,Drawf sag,lg swords ,emerarl sword,and I have some java moss stick in between the rocks. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "joequality1980" <crazy.joe.walcek@g...> wrote: > Very cool tank... what type of plants are those? >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14287	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Re: Tank Pics

Wow, lovely tank!! You did a nice job with it... how neat for it to be in a frame like that :) Rebecca

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14288	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Many questions

1. Do zebra danios get along with guppies? 2. How deep should sand substrate be in a community tank that does not have fish large enough to dig through it (although I did add some MTS)? 3. In my 10 gallon (4 corydoras habrosus, 4 rasbora espei, 2 otos, 1 male betta) I have been running my airstone all the time lately. The tank is on my dresser and the air pump in under my dresser. Is it okay that the pump is below the dresser or is it supposed to be higher? Also, it seems to make a lot of noise because of vibration, not the pump... do you think this could be because I have a veggie clip on the side of the tank holding the air tube so the stone doesn't stir up my sand? Is there a better way for me to do this? A wand vs. a stone, etc? Is it okay to turn it off once in while (like after a water change to the fish can settle down a bit or does the off and on stress them more)? Thanks :) I cannot help it, the more I seem to do with the fish, the more questions pop into my head! Rebecca

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14289	From: seamonkeystew	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Re: Fish Only Saltwater tank

It's a 36 bow front. I was thinking mostly peaceful fish --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@y...> wrote: > how big is your tank? did you want aggressive or peaceful fish? > > --- seamonkeystew <seamonkeystew@y...> wrote: > > > Any recomendations for a saltwater fishonly tank. Im not a begginer, > > i just cant think of anything. Help me!!!! > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14290	From: joequality1980	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Re: Many questions

1. omg, they will break your tank and loot your house! j/k, they will be fine together 2. 1 - 1.5 inches (what is an MTS?) 3. not sure. To get rid of vibration noise you can put the pump on top of something softer like a washcloth

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14291	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Re: Fish Only Saltwater tank

Welp, I saw a couple of cool setups at a fish store in San Bernardino. One was nothing but Rays and an eel. Another one was a Sea Horse tank with these huge sea horses that must have been 7 inches tall. > --- seamonkeystew <seamonkeystew@...> wrote: > > > Any recomendations for a saltwater fishonly tank. Im not a begginer, > > i just cant think of anything. Help me!!!! > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!! > > > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14292	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Re: Many questions

they ARE looting my house, slowly... one plant, one bottle of conditioner, 1 fish at a time :) MTS = malaysian trumpet snail (also multiple tank syndrome, I have both, actually!!) the pump doesn't seem to be what is loud but actually the vibration of the tank lid and airstone. Thanks Joe! Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "joequality1980" <crazy.joe.walcek@g...> wrote: > 1. omg, they will break your tank and loot your house! j/k, they will > be fine together > > 2. 1 - 1.5 inches (what is an MTS?) > > 3. not sure. To get rid of vibration noise you can put the pump on top > of something softer like a washcloth

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14293	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Re: Fish Only Saltwater tank

hm, if you want peaceful try some of these: firefish (both kinds), percs (not tomatoes or maroons!) or ocellaris, chromis (although I hear they can sometimes get aggressive as they get older), gobies. those are the peaceful ones i can think of that would fit in your tank. but i'm sure others can think of additional kinds. hope this helps, valeen --- seamonkeystew <seamonkeystew@...> wrote: > It's a 36 bow front. I was thinking mostly peaceful fish > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Valeen Gonzalez > <valeendgonzalez@y...> wrote: > > how big is your tank? did you want aggressive or peaceful fish? > > > > --- seamonkeystew <seamonkeystew@y...> wrote: > > > > > Any recomendations for a saltwater fishonly tank. Im not a > begginer, > > > i just cant think of anything. Help me!!!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > > My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!! > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14294	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Problems

I went on vacation for a week. My husband was here "tending" to things. Day 3 of my absence, the Eheim filter apparently stops working. The motor went out or something. I'm informed of this over the phone. Eheim is removed and a chemical filter is put on, it hasn't been used in 6 months. Day 6 Blood Parrots "aren't looking so good." The larger is pale and lethargic. At this point I thought the Eheim had been fixed and was working. BUT it was in fact disconnected and sitting with water in it. He said he did a 50% water change. Day 7 Larger blood parrot dies. Today, day 9, the smaller BP is pale as the other one was. The numbers test at ammonia 0, nitrates 20 (?) and nitrites .50 The Eheim is scheduled to be worked on tomorrow, but the fact that it is not hooked up to anything is obviously a problem. Currently the tank has a chemical filter running (which I can't find anything beneficial about this), and he has put the hospital tank filter, a 15 gallon hob, on it for some reason. So now my hospital tank is crap. He also added river rocks from our garden and two firemouth cichlids that were in our 15 gal. He said he added a bit of salt last night per instructions on the carton. I did a 20% water change tonight and vacuumed the VERY dirty gravel, which had NOTHING in it when I left. It would appear that I am starting over here and if the Eheim can not be repaired, I need some filtration suggestions for a 75 freshwater tropical tank. Frankly, I need a lot of suggestions right now. Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14295	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Re: Many questions

1. Danios are more a mid-water fish than guppies are. They are not normally aggressive in any way, though with their constant swimming, they may put some species off. They should do well with the guppies, and the guppies with them. 2. Most sand is not acceptable for the substrate in the tank as it has a tendency to pack down hard, think concrete. This is especially bad should you wish to try to grow plants as the new roots will not be able to find their way through the packed sand. If you are going to use sand, check out some of the coarser varieties, such as found in the Caribe-Sea line. This will also make it better for other fish, such as the horseface loach, which spends most of its time in the substrate, with only the eyes and part of the head showing. (These are really cool, relatively small, loaches.) 3. Unless you have a check valve in the line, or another way to stop a back siphon should the pump stop, I would keep an air pump above the water line. If the vibration is not from the pump, then you need to determine the source of it, and then you can stop it. You mention a vegetable clip. If that is the source, consider getting some small suction cups to hold the line in place, and stop the vibration. Since most tanks are really over crowded, you need to provide as much surface area as you can to the atmosphere to ensure a decent amount of gaseous exchange. Air moving the water, and providing some turbulence helps. You should run the pump 24/7, only stopping it to make repairs (replace the flapper valve, etc.). If you were to switch to a wand, you would need to ensure that the pump you have will be able to handle the output necessary to utilize the full length of the wand. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of thesydmonster Sent: Friday, August 05, 2005 3:23 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Many questions 1. Do zebra danios get along with guppies? 2. How deep should sand substrate be in a community tank that does not have fish large enough to dig through it (although I did add some MTS)? 3. In my 10 gallon (4 corydoras habrosus, 4 rasbora espei, 2 otos, 1 male betta) I have been running my airstone all the time lately. The tank is on my dresser and the air pump in under my dresser. Is it okay that the pump is below the dresser or is it supposed to be higher? Also, it seems to make a lot of noise because of vibration, not the pump... do you think this could be because I have a veggie clip on the side of the tank holding the air tube so the stone doesn't stir up my sand? Is there a better way for me to do this? A wand vs. a stone, etc? Is it okay to turn it off once in while (like after a water change to the fish can settle down a bit or does the off and on stress them more)? Thanks :) I cannot help it, the more I seem to do with the fish, the more questions pop into my head! Rebecca

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14296	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution~ PAUL

Excuse me? Do me a favor and refrain from replying to any of my posts. I'm hear to seek advice from respectable people and you are a far cry from that. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of paul helms Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 4:20 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? Electrocution no they are not...god damn it read a freaking book, take a class , something!!!! --- Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14297	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution

That was a rude ending to your statement. It was an honest question. No need for insult. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of paul helms Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 4:19 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? Electrocution a few billion volts and a heater are very different. that is like comparing a lighter to a volcanoe and saying a little fire is not gonna kill you in a firemans suit! jesus!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14298	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Re: Problems

If your nitrites are .50, that's cause for alarm and should be the first thing to address. Do at least a 50% (or 60%) water change and either put the small Blood Parrot in the 15 with similar water and treat him in there if possible, or (if not feasible for whatever reason) treat him (with Furan II) in the 75 with the rest of the fish which may need treating by now anyway. Worry about the Eheim tomorrow -- can't do much about it now, unless you want to stay up and tinker with it. Try to fix the Eheim in the morning; at least you have some kind of filtration on there now even if not quite adequate. Have your lfs owner take a look at the Eheim if you can't get it going -- often these ma & pa stores will offer such services. If its beyond repair, consider you may have to spring for a new one. As it appears your bacteria balance has been upset, add some stress zyme to the 75. A small amount (1 tbs per 5 gal.) of salt wouldn't hurt. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > I went on vacation for a week. My husband was here "tending" to things. > > Day 3 of my absence, the Eheim filter apparently stops working. The > motor went out or something. I'm informed of this over the phone. > Eheim is removed and a chemical filter is put on, it hasn't been used in > 6 months. > > Day 6 Blood Parrots "aren't looking so good." The larger is pale and > lethargic. At this point I thought the Eheim had been fixed and was > working. BUT it was in fact disconnected and sitting with water in it. > He said he did a 50% water change. > > Day 7 Larger blood parrot dies. > > Today, day 9, the smaller BP is pale as the other one was. The numbers > test at ammonia 0, nitrates 20 (?) and nitrites .50 > > The Eheim is scheduled to be worked on tomorrow, but the fact that it is > not hooked up to anything is obviously a problem. > Currently the tank has a chemical filter running (which I can't find > anything beneficial about this), and he has put the hospital tank > filter, a 15 gallon hob, on it for some reason. So now my hospital tank > is crap. He also added river rocks from our garden and two firemouth > cichlids that were in our 15 gal. He said he added a bit of salt last > night per instructions on the carton. > > I did a 20% water change tonight and vacuumed the VERY dirty gravel, > which had NOTHING in it when I left. > > It would appear that I am starting over here and if the Eheim can not be > repaired, I need some filtration suggestions for a 75 freshwater > tropical tank. Frankly, I need a lot of suggestions right now. > > Leslie > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14299	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution~ PAUL

Hi Leslie, You may be pleased to know that shortly after you left for vacation, Paul was banned from this group. Hope you had a good vacation. Sorry to hear of your fish problems now. Sometimes its best to instruct the fish watcher to feed them only a couple of times a week, or not at all. They will survive. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > Excuse me? Do me a favor and refrain from replying to any of my posts. > I'm hear to seek advice from respectable people and you are a far cry > from that. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of paul helms > Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 4:20 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? Electrocution > > > no they are not...god damn it read a freaking book, > take a class , something!!!! > > --- Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@c...> > wrote: > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14300	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/5/2005
Subject: Re: Koi question

Hi Rebecca, Aside from the obvious and "profound" (lol) answer that the difference between Japanese Koi and Fancy Japanese Koi is the price, it is not really a difference in quality as we understand the term, but has everything to do with the dozens of established recognized color patterns that have been bred into these Koi which make some more desirable than others. While the actual quality/soundness/health of all fish involved is the same, Pond Quality (Grade) Koi, although nicely colored and marked, are not as expensive as they're not as desirable as higher Show Quality Koi by the more discriminating Koi fanciers. There are many consistant patterns or varieties of these Fancy Japanese Koi: such as Kohaku (white with red markings) which in itself has a good number of different variations like Nidan (2 separate red blochings), Sandan (3 red markings), Yondan (4 red markings), Godan (5 red markings) and others such as Tancho (red sun) which is highly prized as having a single large red marking on top of its head reminiscent of the Japanese flag's "Rising Sun". Other varieties include Showa Sanshowku (3 color - mostly black with red and white), Taisho Sanke (3 color - mostly red with black and white). Highly prized are Hiarimono Ogon (or just plain "Ogon"), which are metalic colored fish. These patterns are all observed looking down at the top of the fish. I could go on and on, but you can see what I mean, and this has nothing to do with Butterfly Koi's which, though more expensive as a Pond Fish, are not as desirable to the show connoisseur. \ They can certainly, and do, live outside in a climate that freezes in the winter, as can the more common pond goldfish. With their metabolism slowing down in the colder water, they settle to the bottom and go into hibernation. They have no problem surviving at these temperatures, especially if allowed to fatten up until just before ice-over. The only requirement is that you need to keep an open hole (8" - 10" diameter) to allow the escape of noxious gases such as methane and hydrogen (from any decaying matter which may have accumulated) as these gases are toxic to the fish if they remain under the ice. Several companies make floating thermostatically controlled heaters just for this purpose. They are not designed to heat the whole pond but just to keep an open whole in the ice. \ Depending upon the size (surface dimensions, not depth) of this "tube" -- and it doesn't sound too large, it may be able to support several goldfish, but unfortunately not Koi, as Koi frequently and quickly (in a matter of a few years) grow to 24" and will get to at least 36". Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > My sister in law called today to ask me a fish question but I know > nothing about koi! They live outside of Aspen, CO at about 6700 > feet. They have a pond that is not year round... it is fed by run > off in the spring and summer and dries up in the winter. I would > say it's full about 4 or 5 months of the year. There is a square > tube about the size of an outdoor trashcan that goes into the ground > at least 6 feet that does not dry up. She just bought 20 goldfish > and 4 koi and put them in the pond. > > She wants to know if there is a difference between Japanese Koi and > Fancy Japanese Koi. > > Can they live year round outside in a climate that freezes in the > winter? > > As long as that tube of water doesn't freeze, will the fish be able > to survive in such a small environment (deep but not broad at all)? > > Basically, I have no idea what to tell her or even what to ask you. > Any suggestions are appreciated. I did already tell her to research > in advance next time. > > Thanks, > Rebecca

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14301	From: harry perry	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Re: Safe to use a heater? Electrocution~ PAUL

Paul is no longer a member here. Harry Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: Excuse me? Do me a favor and refrain from replying to any of my posts. I'm hear to seek advice from respectable people and you are a far cry from that. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of paul helms Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2005 4:20 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Safe to use a heater? Electrocution no they are not...god damn it read a freaking book, take a class , something!!!! --- Dane & Leslie Moore <amjmail@...> wrote: > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14302	From: Chris	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Re: How do I get these FISH out

as well as "grabbing them up" in the net - you can try to get the fish up against the front glass of your tank, position your net behind the fish then quickly put your free hand up in front of the glass - usually the fish will get a fright, flee in the opposite direction, straight into the net. Daniel <daniel@...> wrote: use 2 nets to catch them .I use one in front of them and one behind them and force them into a corner them grab them up in the net. Send instant messages to your online friends http://au.messenger.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14303	From: Chris	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Re: Tank Pics

beautiful tank, and gorgeous fish! Do you have any "before" pics of the old landscape? Chris. Daniel <daniel@...> wrote: I just redesignied my landscape in my 90G discus tank Send instant messages to your online friends http://au.messenger.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14304	From: Chris	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Re: Many questions

looks like I can't send directly from my yahoo mail account. here's a reply I wrote to this earlier today: 1. as already answered, zebra danios and guppies get along fine. Danios are generally faster fish but guppies aren't easily traumatised so that doesn't matter. 2. as per earlier answer 3. Putting your air pump under the tank puts you at risk. If you are out of the house and there is a blackout (power failure) it's possible that water will syphon back out of the tank into the pump. From there the water would escape all through your dresser. Worst case scenario is that the power comes back on and you now have a puddle of water with live electricity (not to mention a tank empty of water). You can prevent this by buying "check valves" which sit inline in your air hose. They allow air to travel one way though the valve, and (hopefully) no water back the other way in a power failure. Check them in the shop though (by blowing through both ways) - because sometimes you get a bad one. Putting the pump above the tank obviously gets around this whole issue. Except when I had a breeding tank with no lid and the pump's vibrations made it fall into the tank. When I came in I didn't notice but was wondering why all the fish were swimming in loopy circles. The temperature was sky high. Then I noticed the pump in there and thought - "oh - have to get that out". Stuck in my hand and yow! ok. let's turn the pump off first..... learn the hard way :)

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14305	From: Chris	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Re: Many questions

1. as already answered, zebra danios and guppies get along fine. Danios are generally faster fish but guppies aren't easily traumatised so that doesn't matter. 2. as per earlier answer 3. Putting your air pump under the tank puts you at risk. If you are out of the house and there is a blackout (power failure) it's possible that water will syphon back out of the tank into the pump. From there the water would escape all through your dresser. Worst case scenario is that the power comes back on and you now have a puddle of water with live electricity (not to mention a tank empty of water). You can prevent this by buying "check valves" which sit inline in your air hose. They allow air to travel one way though the valve, and (hopefully) no water back the other way in a power failure. Check them in the shop though (by blowing through both ways) - because sometimes you get a bad one. Putting the pump above the tank obviously gets around this whole issue. Except when I had a breeding tank with no lid and the pump's vibrations made it fall into the tank. When I came in I didn't notice but was wondering why all the fish were swimming in loopy circles. The temperature was sky high. Then I noticed the pump in there and thought - "oh - have to get that out". Stuck in my hand and yow! ok. let's turn the pump off first..... learn the hard way :) Send instant messages to your online friends http://au.messenger.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14306	From: Daniel	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Re: Tank Pics

Thanks for the compliment chris! Yes I just put 2 up.I thought it look really well before also,and I had alot more plants in there but I was bored with that look and wanted a different one.It want take long for the plants I have now to grow out as much as before. Daniel --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Chris <youcantryreachingme@y...> wrote: > beautiful tank, and gorgeous fish! Do you have any "before" pics of the old landscape? > > Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14307	From: Chris	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Re: Tank Pics

HUGE difference! and i think what's made the most striking impact is the change of gravel. The other great thing is separating the tank into two feature areas with empty space in between. Very Japanese I feel! :) I really like that. It's the kind of thing I wouldn't have thought to try myself, but now that I see it.... Daniel <daniel@...> wrote: I had alot more plants in there but I was bored with that look and wanted a different one. Send instant messages to your online friends http://au.messenger.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14308	From: CATHERINE FLOWERS	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Re: New to the Group

hey 150 where do u keep them ? My name is cathy, I have 4 males & 3 females @ this time, plus a cory. I have two that is in my rm, & have this lite that goes to 3 differant colers, they r so engrossed with the lites they mellow out!!I have a chocolet, a white female, that is very picky which male she wants to be with, I want to breed her whith this one male wont have nothing to do with him, but I put her next to the chocolate one she just lit rite up now shes happy, guess I should let her be now, any way, take care & wecome to the club --- Andrea <whitedragon1018@...> wrote: --------------------------------- Hi Everybody I'm new to your group and figured I'd post a Hello. I raise bettas (plakats and cambodians so far) and have started to dabble with white clouds and long finned zebra danios. I've read a few of the recent posts and have found the ones on the plants especially interesting ( I have had terrible luck with live plants - most of my bettas sleep in plastic ones now :) ) Andrea & Approx. 150 bettas, danios and minnows :) ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ---------------------------------

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14309	From: Daniel	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: new to group

Hi I'm pretty New to the group and wanted to introduce myself. I'm Daniel from Rougemont, North Carolina.I have have a 90Gallon Planted tank with mostly Discus and Cardinal Tetras.I also have a few other tanks that I am trying to breed Guppies in.Since I have bought my Discus I have been amazed with them and hope one day to breed those as my main focus fish.My 90G tank I have was a project that I did last Summer,It is a wall tank in my dining room. I just made a photo Gallery of it on a website and I wanted to share it with you.Thanks Here is the link. http://myaquariums.thecomputerpro.biz/Photosprojectslistpg1.htm

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14310	From: Sandra	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: disaster continues...

after reading a post someone made about that his huge aquarium was leaking i thought "omg, that is horrible, that would be like the worst thing that could happen..." well...now its my turn... Mine is a 180 gallon saltwater tank which i just a few minutes ago discovered is leaking from underneath, where water seems to leak from where the silicon is supposed to be. Its still pretty much dripping, but how long could it take until it gets worse?? I know what is waiting for me tomorrow... emty the tank completely, put the silicone where it´s leaking and fill it up again, but just thinking about this procedure is giving me cold sweats and a stomach ache.. great thing is also that i am over 8 month pregnant and i have to put up with something like this tomorrow...uff! I called the owner of the pet shop where i got the tank three years ago, he is a friend of mine and will help me with everything tomorrow, but its just horrible. I dont know why i wrote this, i guess i just wanted to vent cause i am horrified - the worst thing that i could imagine just happened, i was thankful after that person posted his "disaster story" that this hasnt happened to me and that i can imagine what he has been thru... now its my turn! sandra

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14311	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Re: Problems

You could get an Emperor 400 power filter. I have had these in the past and I have one now. They cost about $45.00 to start and about $9 to replace the filters every 4-6 weeks or so. The combine mechanical and biological filtration. They are easy to maintain. The 400 filters up to a 70 gallon tank. I would put two on mine. Petsolutions.com has an excellent comparison chart for all the power and canister filters. _http://www.petsolutions.com/Info.aspx?id=401_ (http://www.petsolutions.com/Info.aspx?id=401) (power filters) _http://www.petsolutions.com/Info.aspx?id=59_ (http://www.petsolutions.com/Info.aspx?id=59) (canister filters) Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14312	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Re: disaster continues...

How awful! At least you have someone to help you with this major project. Where are you going to keep all your fish while you do this? I hope it all goes smooth and you can fix the leak yourself. Hopefully you won't have to replace the tank. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14313	From: Andrea	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Re: New to the Group

My bettas are spread out in several 10 gallon tanks, 2 5 gallon tanks and 1 30 gallon tank. Some of my more docile males live with groups of 4 or 5 females (as long as nobody's fins get torn) and I have 11 males and 2 females who live separately because they fight with others. Nobody lives in anything under 1 gallon of water and all live in sight of other fish so they stay interested. They show preferences as well as to who they like or don't like and have so much personality. I have fish everywhere :)and keep 3 finches, 2 chinchillas, a crested gecko and a cat as well. Andrea & Approx. 150 bettas,danios and minnows --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, CATHERINE FLOWERS <ceflowers2000@s...> wrote: > hey 150 where do u keep them ?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14314	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Fixing tanks was Re: [AquaticLife] disaster continues...

I just set up a 44 corner tank today, got it all pretty, planted and popped the fish in (the tank is replacing a smaller tank using the same substrate, filter, fish, etc) Just as I was settling back to admire the 'fish shui' and watch my little friends check out their new spacious digs, I saw a little water on the bottom edge of the tank - wiped it - more drops - ut-oh. I've never had a leaky tank before so I'm a little bit horrified. I think at one time after I checked it for leaks, I popped the glass cover into the tank to carry them both inside the house and I dinged the silicone just enough to initiate a slow leak. The tank has been redrained, fish back into their temp home w/ filter, I left just enough water to keep the substrate covered and the planted driftwood is outside in the guppies' container getting guppy poo all over it. ;-) I found the ding and plinked it off but am a bit nervous about cutting the silicone with a razor. According to the directions, I should cut away the silicone - how much? Is there a way to leave the cut edges? Straight cut or angled? Do I really need to remove all the silicone for such a small hole or can I heavily silicone around/over the ding and feather the edges well a few inches from the ding and still reasonably expect the tank to be watertight? This ding is ~3" from the bottom of the tank and doesn't leak unless the tank is totally full (stopped oozing when the water was just 4" from the top). Thanks! Vicky, just glad it's only 44 gallons! =} Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Call (301) 496-7299 or (301) 402-8625 or write: hgparker@... =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@... 919-513-1467, Dr London @ calondon@... 530-754-5711 _AND_ Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14315	From: harry perry	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Re: Fixing tanks was Re: [AquaticLife] disaster continues...

If you follow the instructions you could make things worse. I've patched tanks while they were still full of water. Worked for me. Harry seleya8@... wrote: I just set up a 44 corner tank today, got it all pretty, planted and popped the fish in (the tank is replacing a smaller tank using the same substrate, filter, fish, etc) Just as I was settling back to admire the 'fish shui' and watch my little friends check out their new spacious digs, I saw a little water on the bottom edge of the tank - wiped it - more drops - ut-oh. I've never had a leaky tank before so I'm a little bit horrified. I think at one time after I checked it for leaks, I popped the glass cover into the tank to carry them both inside the house and I dinged the silicone just enough to initiate a slow leak. The tank has been redrained, fish back into their temp home w/ filter, I left just enough water to keep the substrate covered and the planted driftwood is outside in the guppies' container getting guppy poo all over it. ;-) I found the ding and plinked it off but am a bit nervous about cutting the silicone with a razor. According to the directions, I should cut away the silicone - how much? Is there a way to leave the cut edges? Straight cut or angled? Do I really need to remove all the silicone for such a small hole or can I heavily silicone around/over the ding and feather the edges well a few inches from the ding and still reasonably expect the tank to be watertight? This ding is ~3" from the bottom of the tank and doesn't leak unless the tank is totally full (stopped oozing when the water was just 4" from the top). Thanks! Vicky, just glad it's only 44 gallons! =} Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Call (301) 496-7299 or (301) 402-8625 or write: hgparker@... =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@... 919-513-1467, Dr London @ calondon@... 530-754-5711 _AND_ Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14316	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Re: disaster continues...

Just keep in mind that where you see the water on the outside of the tank may not be where the leak is on the inside of the tank. Unless the leak on the inside is obvious, you will need to reseal the entire seam. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Sandra Sent: Saturday, August 06, 2005 7:39 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] disaster continues... after reading a post someone made about that his huge aquarium was leaking i thought "omg, that is horrible, that would be like the worst thing that could happen..." well...now its my turn... Mine is a 180 gallon saltwater tank which i just a few minutes ago discovered is leaking from underneath, where water seems to leak from where the silicon is supposed to be. Its still pretty much dripping, but how long could it take until it gets worse?? I know what is waiting for me tomorrow... emty the tank completely, put the silicone where it´s leaking and fill it up again, but just thinking about this procedure is giving me cold sweats and a stomach ache.. great thing is also that i am over 8 month pregnant and i have to put up with something like this tomorrow...uff! I called the owner of the pet shop where i got the tank three years ago, he is a friend of mine and will help me with everything tomorrow, but its just horrible. I dont know why i wrote this, i guess i just wanted to vent cause i am horrified - the worst thing that i could imagine just happened, i was thankful after that person posted his "disaster story" that this hasnt happened to me and that i can imagine what he has been thru... now its my turn! sandra

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14317	From: CATHERINE FLOWERS	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Re: new to group

nice tank,welcome to the grp. --- Daniel <daniel@...> wrote: --------------------------------- Hi I'm pretty New to the group and wanted to introduce myself. I'm Daniel from Rougemont, North Carolina.I have have a 90Gallon Planted tank with mostly Discus and Cardinal Tetras.I also have a few other tanks that I am trying to breed Guppies in.Since I have bought my Discus I have been amazed with them and hope one day to breed those as my main focus fish.My 90G tank I have was a project that I did last Summer,It is a wall tank in my dining room. I just made a photo Gallery of it on a website and I wanted to share it with you.Thanks Here is the link. http://myaquariums.thecomputerpro.biz/Photosprojectslistpg1.htm ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ---------------------------------

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14318	From: harry perry	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Re: new to group/To Catherine

You wrote me about a problem tank last week. Ar you o.k. now? Harry CATHERINE FLOWERS <ceflowers2000@...> wrote: nice tank,welcome to the grp. --- Daniel <daniel@...> wrote: --------------------------------- Hi I'm pretty New to the group and wanted to introduce myself. I'm Daniel from Rougemont, North Carolina.I have have a 90Gallon Planted tank with mostly Discus and Cardinal Tetras.I also have a few other tanks that I am trying to breed Guppies in.Since I have bought my Discus I have been amazed with them and hope one day to breed those as my main focus fish.My 90G tank I have was a project that I did last Summer,It is a wall tank in my dining room. I just made a photo Gallery of it on a website and I wanted to share it with you.Thanks Here is the link. http://myaquariums.thecomputerpro.biz/Photosprojectslistpg1.htm ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14319	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Re: Guest Speakers ?

Rob, Sorry to take so long to get back to you. As they say, events beyond my control . . .. Circle City. Always wondered where they got that name from. The racetrack? Naw, that is more an oval. Maybe from the interstate that circles the city (Indianapolis)? I see Chuck Rambo listed. He may be from the ACA speakers' program. They have a number of high powered cichlid people available for talks. I was looking for information on the Tetra program, but I don't know if that is available anymore. I don't see any mention of it on their web site. Looking at the Marineland web site, however, it appears that is the program now being offered by Marineland. The listing shows most of the original Tetra speakers, with some additions. The rules are pretty much that same as the Tetra program's. I just noticed that on the ACA listing, there is one John Farrell Kuhns listed. You might want to grab him to speak on water chemistry. That is a topic that should appeal to all your attendees. Here is a way to get several talks for your next weekend. Get Lee Finley from Marineland, and Wayne Leibel from the ACA. Wayne can do a cichlid talk, Lee can do one on catfish, and maybe you can get them together to do their talk on the history of the aquarium hobby as the banquet speakers. Another good idea is to try and get Tony Terceira. He can speak on Killifish. He has a dynamite program on fish photography, and, IMHO, is one of the best fish photographers out there. Also, a little known fact is that he also does bettas, and has a talk on bettas (he is known mostly for his killies). I'd suggest trolling the sites of the national, and international, organizations to see if they have any speaker lists. If not, write a member of their board or committees, to see if they can offer suggestions. It is always a challenge to come up with good speakers and topics for local meetings and for the club's big event of the year. If you don't already have your dates tied down for next year, now is the time to do it so you can get a good venue. Now is also the time to start looking for speakers for next year's event so that you don't run into a problem like this year where you are competing with other groups for the available pool of (affordable) speakers. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of FortWayneFish@... Sent: Friday, August 05, 2005 2:01 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Guest Speakers ? Steve, Thanks for the reply Here is the Info for this years Event. club Is Circle City Aquarium Club Indianapolis, Indiana October 14 thru October 16, 2005 Speaker Lineup: Banquet Speaker - Chuck Rambo: Chuck has been in the hobby for 38 years and specializes in African Cichlids. He has visited both Lake Malawi and Lake Tanganyika within the past 3 years. Eric Keith: Eric has just returned from an adventure from the Amazon. Mike Hellweg: Mike will be talking about Oddball fishes. Steve Edie: Steve's lecture covers the cichlids of Lake Tanganyika Peter Shepard: Pete is an active member in the Greater Cincinnati Aquarium Society, and a avid breeder. You don't want to miss our FISH, PLANTS, DRY GOODS AUCTION on Sunday! this year CCAC was in competition with a few other Aquarium Societies in getting speakers because of the dates. But still managed to get a pretty impressive list of speakers. Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 8/5/2005 12:53:48 PM US Eastern Standard Time, steve@... writes: Ther eare a couple of other plces you can look. I'll need to wait until I get home and have a chance to look them up for you. Where is your club and what is it called? You may have some good speakers right in your neighborhood, so to speak, that would be willing to come speak. Can you be a bit more specific about the event. Is it a hwole day event, a weekend event or what? Is there a show as well? If there is, you can perhaps get the speakers to also judge some of the show. \\Steve//

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14320	From: Sandra	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Fixing tanks was Re: [AquaticLife] disaster continues...

Hi Harry, i have a question - how could i fix my tank without having to take out all water? if i put silicone over the place where the water is dripping it wont help a thing cause the silicone will get wet and won´t do its job.. what do you think?? ( i know that i probably won´t get around the whole procedure tomorrow, i was just wondering how you fixed the tanks with the water still inside...) sandra --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, harry perry <harryfisherman@y...> wrote: > If you follow the instructions you could make things worse. I've patched tanks while they were still full of water. Worked for me. > > Harry > > seleya8@a... wrote: > I just set up a 44 corner tank today, got it all pretty, planted and popped > the fish in (the tank is replacing a smaller tank using the same substrate, > filter, fish, etc) > > Just as I was settling back to admire the 'fish shui' and watch my little > friends check out their new spacious digs, I saw a little water on the bottom > edge of the tank - wiped it - more drops - ut-oh. I've never had a leaky tank > before so I'm a little bit horrified. > > I think at one time after I checked it for leaks, I popped the glass cover > into the tank to carry them both inside the house and I dinged the silicone > just enough to initiate a slow leak. The tank has been redrained, fish back into > their temp home w/ filter, I left just enough water to keep the substrate > covered and the planted driftwood is outside in the guppies' container getting > guppy poo all over it. ;-) > > I found the ding and plinked it off but am a bit nervous about cutting the > silicone with a razor. According to the directions, I should cut away the > silicone - how much? Is there a way to leave the cut edges? Straight cut or > angled? Do I really need to remove all the silicone for such a small hole or can I > heavily silicone around/over the ding and feather the edges well a few inches > from the ding and still reasonably expect the tank to be watertight? This > ding is ~3" from the bottom of the tank and doesn't leak unless the tank is > totally full (stopped oozing when the water was just 4" from the top). > > Thanks! > > Vicky, just glad it's only 44 gallons! =} > > Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr > Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Call (301) 496-7299 or (301) > 402-8625 or write: hgparker@n... =) > > Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: > Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@n... 919-513-1467, > Dr London @ calondon@u... 530-754-5711 _AND_ > Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! > > Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@a... > > ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14321	From: Sandra	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Re: disaster continues...

Hi Linda, I will probably put some of the 180g tank water in the quarantine and put the fish that are in the big tank (1 yellow tang, 1 juv. emperor angel, 2 clownfish and 1 cleaner shrimp) over there, when trying to fix the tank. Hopefully the friend of mine will get the huge container for tomorrow (that was the one we went to get water from the ocean when we installed it three years ago), to put all the water in there and not having to put new water in the tank, thats what would hurt me the most - after three years establishing the tanks water, its bacteria having to begin from 0 again... its just horrible! Thx for understanding... *still sitting here waiting for that guy to call, not knowing what to do* sandra --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > How awful! At least you have someone to help you with this major project. > > Where are you going to keep all your fish while you do this? I hope it all > goes smooth and you can fix the leak yourself. Hopefully you won't have to > replace the tank. > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14322	From: Sandra	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Re: disaster continues...

so if its dripping at one place and i clean it and it keeps on dripping right there doesnt mean that the leak is there? ...that makes it all even worse... :( --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > Just keep in mind that where you see the water on the outside of the tank > may not be where the leak is on the inside of the tank. Unless the leak on > the inside is obvious, you will need to reseal the entire seam. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Sandra > Sent: Saturday, August 06, 2005 7:39 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] disaster continues... > > after reading a post someone made about that his huge aquarium was > leaking i thought "omg, that is horrible, that would be like the > worst thing that could happen..." well...now its my turn... > > Mine is a 180 gallon saltwater tank which i just a few minutes ago > discovered is leaking from underneath, where water seems to leak > from where the silicon is supposed to be. Its still pretty much > dripping, but how long could it take until it gets worse?? I know > what is waiting for me tomorrow... emty the tank completely, put the > silicone where it´s leaking and fill it up again, but just thinking > about this procedure is giving me cold sweats and a stomach ache.. > great thing is also that i am over 8 month pregnant and i have to > put up with something like this tomorrow...uff! I called the owner > of the pet shop where i got the tank three years ago, he is a friend > of mine and will help me with everything tomorrow, but its just > horrible. I dont know why i wrote this, i guess i just wanted to > vent cause i am horrified - the worst thing that i could imagine > just happened, i was thankful after that person posted his "disaster > story" that this hasnt happened to me and that i can imagine what he > has been thru... now its my turn! > > sandra

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14323	From: harry perry	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Re: Fixing tanks was Re: [AquaticLife] disaster continues.../To San

I simply put the silicon on my finger and placed it where I wanted,under water. I use this method all the time to fix my d.i.y. co2 system. Silicon doesn't need to air dry. It will set underwater. I would try it first before I broke down the tank. Don't start cutting away silicon like the instructions say, you will end up rebuilding your tank. Silicon is not affected by water that's why it's used for tanks. Harry Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@...> wrote: Hi Harry, i have a question - how could i fix my tank without having to take out all water? if i put silicone over the place where the water is dripping it wont help a thing cause the silicone will get wet and won´t do its job.. what do you think?? ( i know that i probably won´t get around the whole procedure tomorrow, i was just wondering how you fixed the tanks with the water still inside...) sandra --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, harry perry <harryfisherman@y...> wrote: > If you follow the instructions you could make things worse. I've patched tanks while they were still full of water. Worked for me. > > Harry > > seleya8@a... wrote: > I just set up a 44 corner tank today, got it all pretty, planted and popped > the fish in (the tank is replacing a smaller tank using the same substrate, > filter, fish, etc) > > Just as I was settling back to admire the 'fish shui' and watch my little > friends check out their new spacious digs, I saw a little water on the bottom > edge of the tank - wiped it - more drops - ut-oh. I've never had a leaky tank > before so I'm a little bit horrified. > > I think at one time after I checked it for leaks, I popped the glass cover > into the tank to carry them both inside the house and I dinged the silicone > just enough to initiate a slow leak. The tank has been redrained, fish back into > their temp home w/ filter, I left just enough water to keep the substrate > covered and the planted driftwood is outside in the guppies' container getting > guppy poo all over it. ;-) > > I found the ding and plinked it off but am a bit nervous about cutting the > silicone with a razor. According to the directions, I should cut away the > silicone - how much? Is there a way to leave the cut edges? Straight cut or > angled? Do I really need to remove all the silicone for such a small hole or can I > heavily silicone around/over the ding and feather the edges well a few inches > from the ding and still reasonably expect the tank to be watertight? This > ding is ~3" from the bottom of the tank and doesn't leak unless the tank is > totally full (stopped oozing when the water was just 4" from the top). > > Thanks! > > Vicky, just glad it's only 44 gallons! =} > > Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr > Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Call (301) 496-7299 or (301) > 402-8625 or write: hgparker@n... =) > > Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: > Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@n... 919-513-1467, > Dr London @ calondon@u... 530-754-5711 _AND_ > Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! > > Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@a... > > ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > > > > > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14324	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Re: disaster continues...

The seal may be broken on the inside of the tank in one place. The water seeks to get out, and may flow along the seam until it finds a weak spot to get out and begins to leak from that point to the outside. Mind you, this is not always the case. The leak may well be where it is showing on the outside, but that is not necessarily so. That is why I say that if the leak is obvious on the inside, you can just patch that one spot, but you are better off redoing the whole seam. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Sandra Sent: Saturday, August 06, 2005 9:24 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: disaster continues... so if its dripping at one place and i clean it and it keeps on dripping right there doesnt mean that the leak is there? ...that makes it all even worse... :( --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > Just keep in mind that where you see the water on the outside of the tank > may not be where the leak is on the inside of the tank. Unless the leak on > the inside is obvious, you will need to reseal the entire seam. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Sandra > Sent: Saturday, August 06, 2005 7:39 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] disaster continues... > > after reading a post someone made about that his huge aquarium was > leaking i thought "omg, that is horrible, that would be like the > worst thing that could happen..." well...now its my turn... > > Mine is a 180 gallon saltwater tank which i just a few minutes ago > discovered is leaking from underneath, where water seems to leak > from where the silicon is supposed to be. Its still pretty much > dripping, but how long could it take until it gets worse?? I know > what is waiting for me tomorrow... emty the tank completely, put the > silicone where it´s leaking and fill it up again, but just thinking > about this procedure is giving me cold sweats and a stomach ache.. > great thing is also that i am over 8 month pregnant and i have to > put up with something like this tomorrow...uff! I called the owner > of the pet shop where i got the tank three years ago, he is a friend > of mine and will help me with everything tomorrow, but its just > horrible. I dont know why i wrote this, i guess i just wanted to > vent cause i am horrified - the worst thing that i could imagine > just happened, i was thankful after that person posted his "disaster > story" that this hasnt happened to me and that i can imagine what he > has been thru... now its my turn! > > sandra

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14325	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Fish and Color

Just finished reading an interesting article on fish and color in the May issue of _National Geographic Magazine_. While it talked about reef fish, I am sure that much would translate over into freshwater fish as well, since many of the color patterns are found in both freshwater and marine fish. If you would like to take a look at the online version of the article, hie thyself over to http://tinyurl.com/7nn7m and take a look. \\Steve// "There is still no cure for the common birthday" -- John Glenn

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14326	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: The Jersey Shore Aquarium Society (JSAS), 8/8/2005, 8:00 pm

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife The Jersey Shore Aquarium Society (JSAS) Monday August 8, 2005 8:00 pm - 9:00 pm This event repeats on the second Monday of every month. Event Location: Knights of Columbus Hall on Rt. 537 (70 East Main Street) in Freehold, New Jersey Notes: http://www.jerseyshoreas.org/information.htm The Jersey Shore Aquarium Society meets at 8:00pm on the second Monday of every month (except August) at the Knights of Columbus Hall on Rt. 537 (70 East Main Street) in Freehold, New Jersey. Each meeting typically features an interesting slide, movie or video presentation of tropical fish, and aquarist related topics. Our presenters are often professionals in their respective fields or experienced hobbyists. ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14327	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: Driftwood gone bad?

The driftwood that I have has turned white-ish. It looks like a soft white covering. My two blood parrots have paled this color, one died and one was moved to the hospital tank tonight. The firemouth has also become discolored and lethargic. I was able to catch him, big sign of illness right there, and moved him as well. WHAT is going on with my tank and why has this wood turned white? It has to have something to do with the overall problem. ? The numbers are all decent, ammonia and nitrates 0 and 20. Nitrites were .50 before a morning 50% water change, haven't tested again today. =( Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14328	From: Sandra	Date: 8/6/2005
Subject: geez do i feel stupid now....!!!!

After my little (!) nervous breakdown and hysterical attack i was lying in bed till 2am thinking "omg, the tank is gonna explode any minute", then it started to rain outside and i thought the water was splashing already into the living room.. i ran out of the bedroom ...water still drippin... couldnt wait till the next day to do something (i was planning on getting around 45 empty bottles - the ones you use to drink water from i guess they have around 3,8 gallons capacity each - where from?? dont know, i was gonna borrow them from several supermarkets or something...getting nuts here already, you see? lol) SOOOO, i went to the living room once again and sat down on the floor and watched the water dripping down and asked myselfe why i deserved such a disaster. Then i thought, hmm, let me just in case plug everything out and check the skimmers once again...(hoping for a miracle to happen..) to my discovery (and HUGE relieve) i saw that one skimmer that was enabled for two weeks but still filled with water was now almost half empty .... i just hoped that the water was somehow comming from there so i took it off the tank and once again dried all the water from the place it was dripping down.. and ... IT STOPPED!!!!!!!!! False alarm, tank is not broken, but you can´t imagine how stupid i feel now for freaking out like that ...lol... I hope some of you liked my little short-version-drama-story and laughed as i am now.. and yes i feel like bumping my head against the keyboard! *ashamed* Sandra

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14329	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: Re: geez do i feel stupid now....!!!!

I think we all are relieved that you do not have a leaking tank... And it is a good learning experience for all of us NOT to jump to conclusions. I had a 20L that I thaught had developed a leak a few months ago. Drained it, was going to reseal the whole thing. By chance I transfered the Filter to another tank for additional filteration Plus to keep the filter seeded. The following day my kids told me Another tank was leaking. Come to find out the rubber O ring on the power filter was pinched and allowing water to drip..In my case all it took was for me to remove the motor and screw it back on the filter making sure to get it aligned so the O ring wasn't twisted. rob Indiana In a message dated 8/7/2005 1:04:01 AM US Eastern Standard Time, sandra_friedwagner@... writes: After my little (!) nervous breakdown and hysterical attack i was lying in bed till 2am thinking "omg, the tank is gonna explode any minute", then it started to rain outside and i thought the water was splashing already into the living room.. i ran out of the bedroom ...water still drippin... couldnt wait till the next day to do something (i was planning on getting around 45 empty bottles - the ones you use to drink water from i guess they have around 3,8 gallons capacity each - where from?? dont know, i was gonna borrow them from several supermarkets or something...getting nuts here already, you see? lol) SOOOO, i went to the living room once again and sat down on the floor and watched the water dripping down and asked myselfe why i deserved such a disaster. Then i thought, hmm, let me just in case plug everything out and check the skimmers once again...(hoping for a miracle to happen..) to my discovery (and HUGE relieve) i saw that one skimmer that was enabled for two weeks but still filled with water was now almost half empty .... i just hoped that the water was somehow comming from there so i took it off the tank and once again dried all the water from the place it was dripping down.. and ... IT STOPPED!!!!!!!!! False alarm, tank is not broken, but you can´t imagine how stupid i feel now for freaking out like that ...lol... I hope some of you liked my little short-version-drama-story and laughed as i am now.. and yes i feel like bumping my head against the keyboard! *ashamed* Sandra Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14330	From: harry perry	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: Re: geez do i feel stupid now....!!!!/To Sandra

I'm glad the story had a happy ending. Harry Sandra <sandra_friedwagner@...> wrote: After my little (!) nervous breakdown and hysterical attack i was lying in bed till 2am thinking "omg, the tank is gonna explode any minute", then it started to rain outside and i thought the water was splashing already into the living room.. i ran out of the bedroom ...water still drippin... couldnt wait till the next day to do something (i was planning on getting around 45 empty bottles - the ones you use to drink water from i guess they have around 3,8 gallons capacity each - where from?? dont know, i was gonna borrow them from several supermarkets or something...getting nuts here already, you see? lol) SOOOO, i went to the living room once again and sat down on the floor and watched the water dripping down and asked myselfe why i deserved such a disaster. Then i thought, hmm, let me just in case plug everything out and check the skimmers once again...(hoping for a miracle to happen..) to my discovery (and HUGE relieve) i saw that one skimmer that was enabled for two weeks but still filled with water was now almost half empty .... i just hoped that the water was somehow comming from there so i took it off the tank and once again dried all the water from the place it was dripping down.. and ... IT STOPPED!!!!!!!!! False alarm, tank is not broken, but you can´t imagine how stupid i feel now for freaking out like that ...lol... I hope some of you liked my little short-version-drama-story and laughed as i am now.. and yes i feel like bumping my head against the keyboard! *ashamed* Sandra ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14331	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: Re: Problems

Linda, Do these come with refillable cartridges? At $9 a refill that is about $80 a year. I have a couple refillable cartridges for my penguin 170's. I think they were made by Whisper and once I bought those I never bought a penguin refill as I just put new floss or filter material from a fabric store. Mike In a message dated 8/6/2005 4:44:26 PM Pacific Daylight Time, Crazy4fids@... writes: You could get an Emperor 400 power filter. I have had these in the past and I have one now. They cost about $45.00 to start and about $9 to replace the filters every 4-6 weeks or so. The combine mechanical and biological filtration. They are easy to maintain. The 400 filters up to a 70 gallon tank. I would put two on mine. Petsolutions.com has an excellent comparison chart for all the power and canister filters. _http://www.petsolutions.com/Info.aspx?id=401_ (http://www.petsolutions.com/Info.aspx?id=401) (power filters) _http://www.petsolutions.com/Info.aspx?id=59_ (http://www.petsolutions.com/Info.aspx?id=59) (canister filters) Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14332	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: Re: Driftwood gone bad?

Leslie, I more or less expected one or more of your firemouths (and possible other fish) would exhibit these same symptoms and it was for this reason, as I stated in my last post, that you may want to treat the whole tank rather than just pull the remaining Blood Parrot out and treat him separately in the 15. Any fish that was subjected to those conditions should be suspect for coming down with this illness. I am no expert on microbacteriology, but with the horrible conditions you described in a recent previous post, I'm surprised that anything survived. From your description of conditions, I would say a lot of aerobic and anaerobic bacterial action was going on; in effect, the aquarium was starting to turn into a mini-cesspool (no offense on your part here intended). As a result, one or more of these undesirable types of bacteria are attacking the driftwood, or a type of mold (fungus) causing the start of the degrading (rotting) process, as I see it. While the water conditions now seem healthy, the effects noted on the fish are directly as a delayed result of those poor conditions. I would remove the driftwood and either re-boil it or scrub it down with a salt paste, rinsing it off well before replacing it in the tank. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > The driftwood that I have has turned white-ish. It looks like a soft > white covering. My two blood parrots have paled this color, one died > and one was moved to the hospital tank tonight. The firemouth has also > become discolored and lethargic. I was able to catch him, big sign of > illness right there, and moved him as well. > WHAT is going on with my tank and why has this wood turned white? It > has to have something to do with the overall problem. ? > The numbers are all decent, ammonia and nitrates 0 and 20. Nitrites > were .50 before a morning 50% water change, haven't tested again today. > =( > Leslie > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14333	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: Re: geez do i feel stupid now....!!!!

Sandra, Just now noticed the horrible experience you posted early yesterday evening about your tank "leaking"; I wasn't on line last night. Was just about to send you a reply on that when, after reading the rest of these posts, I happily saw that it was a false alarm. No need to feel stupid or ashamed, that could happen to anybody; just be glad it turned out as it did. I was going to suggest checking what you already discovered. Occasionally, equipment such skimmers, hang-on filter, reflectors/hoods and even air line tubing can be the source for water to slowly and quite unexpectedly drip out of the tank through capillary action with water somehow collecting at a place on the tank rim and finding a way out from there. Sometimes its the appliance (filter, etc.) itself that starts leaking. Watch for capillary action though -- that "problem" is real sneaky. Glad things worked out. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Sandra" <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > After my little (!) nervous breakdown and hysterical attack i was > lying in bed till 2am thinking "omg, the tank is gonna explode any > minute", then it started to rain outside and i thought the water was > splashing already into the living room.. i ran out of the > bedroom ...water still drippin... > > couldnt wait till the next day to do something (i was planning on > getting around 45 empty bottles - the ones you use to drink water > from i guess they have around 3,8 gallons capacity each - where > from?? dont know, i was gonna borrow them from several supermarkets > or something...getting nuts here already, you see? lol) SOOOO, i > went to the living room once again and sat down on the floor and > watched the water dripping down and asked myselfe why i deserved > such a disaster. Then i thought, hmm, let me just in case plug > everything out and check the skimmers once again...(hoping for a > miracle to happen..) > > to my discovery (and HUGE relieve) i saw that one skimmer that was > enabled for two weeks but still filled with water was now almost > half empty .... i just hoped that the water was somehow comming from > there so i took it off the tank and once again dried all the water > from the place it was dripping down.. and ... IT STOPPED!!!!!!!!! > > False alarm, tank is not broken, but you can´t imagine how stupid i > feel now for freaking out like that ...lol... I hope some of you > liked my little short-version-drama-story and laughed as i am now.. > and yes i feel like bumping my head against the keyboard! > > *ashamed* > Sandra

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14334	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: Re: Problems

The emperor 400 comes with two refillable cartridges. I have used activated carbon in them as well as putting filter floss into them. The filter has four slots for cartridges. You can use all four, but I only use the two, because I also have a Eheim 2028 canister filter. I like the Emperor because it has the biowheels. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14335	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: Re: Driftwood gone bad?

I did remove the driftwood right after I posted this. Anything looking like that can't be at all healthy. The Firemouth and the BP are in the hospital tank and doing great. Both have their full color back and are acting normally. The Eheim is being worked on and I am out to buy another filter, a HOB, for a backup that will always run. (It looks as though the Eheim motor is completely dead.) If any other fish start showing these symptoms, I will remove them to the qt tanks. And absolutely NO offense is taken regarding this tank being a cess pool. Unfortunately that's what it is right now. But I don't understand why the numbers don't show it. Leslie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Sunday, August 07, 2005 7:44 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Driftwood gone bad? Leslie, I more or less expected one or more of your firemouths (and possible other fish) would exhibit these same symptoms and it was for this reason, as I stated in my last post, that you may want to treat the whole tank rather than just pull the remaining Blood Parrot out and treat him separately in the 15. Any fish that was subjected to those conditions should be suspect for coming down with this illness. I am no expert on microbacteriology, but with the horrible conditions you described in a recent previous post, I'm surprised that anything survived. From your description of conditions, I would say a lot of aerobic and anaerobic bacterial action was going on; in effect, the aquarium was starting to turn into a mini-cesspool (no offense on your part here intended). As a result, one or more of these undesirable types of bacteria are attacking the driftwood, or a type of mold (fungus) causing the start of the degrading (rotting) process, as I see it. While the water conditions now seem healthy, the effects noted on the fish are directly as a delayed result of those poor conditions. I would remove the driftwood and either re-boil it or scrub it down with a salt paste, rinsing it off well before replacing it in the tank. Ray \ ---

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14336	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: Re: Driftwood gone bad?

Fortunately, it would appear as if you have good cultures of nitrifying bacteria controling things; that along with your water changes (and cleaning up the gravel) is keeping parameters normal. Getting back to the diftwood, there's also the possibility of a fine layer of dry food particles coating it which is putrifying, rather than the actual wood itself having a fungal layer. This would be seen mainly on the top surfaces. Maybe you could tell by how (if) it might rub off. A posted photo would be too hard for us to tell by. I presume you did some deep cleaning of the gravel, as it sounded like it needed(?). By the way, I think you said you have 2 firemouths -- I guess the other one is doing fine in the 75. If so, sounds like you've turned the corner on this disaster. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Dane & Leslie Moore" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > I did remove the driftwood right after I posted this. Anything looking > like that can't be at all healthy. The Firemouth and the BP are in the > hospital tank and doing great. Both have their full color back and are > acting normally. The Eheim is being worked on and I am out to buy > another filter, a HOB, for a backup that will always run. (It looks as > though the Eheim motor is completely dead.) If any other fish start > showing these symptoms, I will remove them to the qt tanks. > > And absolutely NO offense is taken regarding this tank being a cess > pool. Unfortunately that's what it is right now. But I don't > understand why the numbers don't show it. > > > Leslie > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Sunday, August 07, 2005 7:44 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Driftwood gone bad? > > > Leslie, I more or less expected one or more of your firemouths (and > possible other fish) would exhibit these same symptoms and it was for > this reason, as I stated in my last post, that you may want to treat > the whole tank rather than just pull the remaining Blood Parrot out and > treat him separately in the 15. Any fish that was subjected to those > conditions should be suspect for coming down with this illness. I am > no expert on microbacteriology, but with the horrible conditions you > described in a recent previous post, I'm surprised that anything > survived. From your description of conditions, I would say a lot of > aerobic and anaerobic bacterial action was going on; in effect, the > aquarium was starting to turn into a mini-cesspool (no offense on your > part here intended). As a result, one or more of these undesirable > types of bacteria are attacking the driftwood, or a type of mold > (fungus) causing the start of the degrading (rotting) process, as I see > it. While the water conditions now seem healthy, the effects noted on > the fish are directly as a delayed result of those poor conditions. I > would remove the driftwood and either re-boil it or scrub it down with > a salt paste, rinsing it off well before replacing it in the tank. Ray > \ > ---

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14337	From: Dane & Leslie Moore	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: Re: Driftwood gone bad?

I don't think it was food particles (although I don't have experience with that, so it very well could be at my unknowlegable point.) This wood had an algae growth on it before I left. When I returned, the algae was gone and the white was present. The white is flush against the wood, very smooth and continuous. I did do some very deep gravel cleaning. I got most of the gunk out but I still saw a bit more waste when I removed the wood last night. I'll get that sucked up tonight. I do have two firemouths. One is around 4 yrs old and the other a few months. The younger is doing fine in the 75 and the older is in with the BP in a qt tank. But last night he wasn't doing well at all. I hope this is getting to be somewhat controlled. I'm going to Wal Mart or the icky LFS to buy a hob filter. I still don't know which one to get though. And I don't have a lot of faith in the owner of the lfs. I wish the EHEIM were working! ~Leslie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Sunday, August 07, 2005 11:21 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Driftwood gone bad? Fortunately, it would appear as if you have good cultures of nitrifying bacteria controling things; that along with your water changes (and cleaning up the gravel) is keeping parameters normal. Getting back to the diftwood, there's also the possibility of a fine layer of dry food particles coating it which is putrifying, rather than the actual wood itself having a fungal layer. This would be seen mainly on the top surfaces. Maybe you could tell by how (if) it might rub off. A posted photo would be too hard for us to tell by. I presume you did some deep cleaning of the gravel, as it sounded like it needed(?). By the way, I think you said you have 2 firemouths -- I guess the other one is doing fine in the 75. If so, sounds like you've turned the corner on this disaster. Ray \

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14338	From: Sandra	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: Re: geez do i feel stupid now....!!!!

totally agree with you, thank´s :)) sandra --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, FortWayneFish@a... wrote: > I think we all are relieved that you do not have a leaking tank... > > And it is a good learning experience for all of us NOT to jump to > conclusions. > > I had a 20L that I thaught had developed a leak a few months ago. Drained it, > was going to reseal the whole thing. By chance I transfered the Filter to > another tank for additional filteration Plus to keep the filter seeded. > The following day my kids told me Another tank was leaking. > > Come to find out the rubber O ring on the power filter was pinched and > allowing water to drip..In my case all it took was for me to remove the motor and > screw it back on the filter making sure to get it aligned so the O ring wasn't > twisted. > > rob > Indiana > > > In a message dated 8/7/2005 1:04:01 AM US Eastern Standard Time, > sandra_friedwagner@h... writes: > After my little (!) nervous breakdown and hysterical attack i was > lying in bed till 2am thinking "omg, the tank is gonna explode any > minute", then it started to rain outside and i thought the water was > splashing already into the living room.. i ran out of the > bedroom ...water still drippin... > > couldnt wait till the next day to do something (i was planning on > getting around 45 empty bottles - the ones you use to drink water > from i guess they have around 3,8 gallons capacity each - where > from?? dont know, i was gonna borrow them from several supermarkets > or something...getting nuts here already, you see? lol) SOOOO, i > went to the living room once again and sat down on the floor and > watched the water dripping down and asked myselfe why i deserved > such a disaster. Then i thought, hmm, let me just in case plug > everything out and check the skimmers once again...(hoping for a > miracle to happen..) > > to my discovery (and HUGE relieve) i saw that one skimmer that was > enabled for two weeks but still filled with water was now almost > half empty .... i just hoped that the water was somehow comming from > there so i took it off the tank and once again dried all the water > from the place it was dripping down.. and ... IT STOPPED!!!!!!!!! > > False alarm, tank is not broken, but you can´t imagine how stupid i > feel now for freaking out like that ...lol... I hope some of you > liked my little short-version-drama-story and laughed as i am now.. > and yes i feel like bumping my head against the keyboard! > > *ashamed* > Sandra > > Rob > NE Indiana > USA > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14339	From: Sandra	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: Re: geez do i feel stupid now....!!!!

thank you, i definitally learned from this experience, and i want to thank everyone that responded to my post. I didnt know about the silicone that can be used underwater (thx harry) and about the leak that may come from a total different side of the tank! So many experienced people in here with intentions to help and give advise ... :)) --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > Sandra, Just now noticed the horrible experience you posted early > yesterday evening about your tank "leaking"; I wasn't on line last > night. Was just about to send you a reply on that when, after > reading the rest of these posts, I happily saw that it was a false > alarm. No need to feel stupid or ashamed, that could happen to > anybody; just be glad it turned out as it did. I was going to > suggest checking what you already discovered. Occasionally, > equipment such skimmers, hang-on filter, reflectors/hoods and even > air line tubing can be the source for water to slowly and quite > unexpectedly drip out of the tank through capillary action with water > somehow collecting at a place on the tank rim and finding a way out > from there. Sometimes its the appliance (filter, etc.) itself that > starts leaking. Watch for capillary action though -- that "problem" > is real sneaky. Glad things worked out. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Sandra" > <sandra_friedwagner@h...> wrote: > > After my little (!) nervous breakdown and hysterical attack i was > > lying in bed till 2am thinking "omg, the tank is gonna explode any > > minute", then it started to rain outside and i thought the water > was > > splashing already into the living room.. i ran out of the > > bedroom ...water still drippin... > > > > couldnt wait till the next day to do something (i was planning on > > getting around 45 empty bottles - the ones you use to drink water > > from i guess they have around 3,8 gallons capacity each - where > > from?? dont know, i was gonna borrow them from several supermarkets > > or something...getting nuts here already, you see? lol) SOOOO, i > > went to the living room once again and sat down on the floor and > > watched the water dripping down and asked myselfe why i deserved > > such a disaster. Then i thought, hmm, let me just in case plug > > everything out and check the skimmers once again...(hoping for a > > miracle to happen..) > > > > to my discovery (and HUGE relieve) i saw that one skimmer that was > > enabled for two weeks but still filled with water was now almost > > half empty .... i just hoped that the water was somehow comming > from > > there so i took it off the tank and once again dried all the water > > from the place it was dripping down.. and ... IT STOPPED!!!!!!!!! > > > > False alarm, tank is not broken, but you can´t imagine how stupid i > > feel now for freaking out like that ...lol... I hope some of you > > liked my little short-version-drama-story and laughed as i am now.. > > and yes i feel like bumping my head against the keyboard! > > > > *ashamed* > > Sandra

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14340	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: Re: geez do i feel stupid now....!!!!

I think we all are here to learn and if we can to teach a little. rob Indiana If you don't learn something New everyday Your probally already dead. In a message dated 8/7/2005 3:13:34 PM US Eastern Standard Time, sandra_friedwagner@... writes: and i want to thank everyone that responded to my post. I didnt know about the silicone that can be used underwater (thx harry) and about the leak that may come from a total different side of the tank! So many experienced people in here with intentions to help and give advise ... :)) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14341	From: Angela	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: Green Water

I have a 10 gallon tank with live plants, black skirts, a few cories, a frog, a large snail and an algae eater. Suddenly, the water has turned green. I changed out 1/2 and it's still green. We lost a black skirt today. What can I do?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14342	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: Re: Green Water

REDUCE BIOLOAD~~! that s a lot for a ten gallon tank weithout lots of water changes.... all that will lead to algea in the water,,, Angela <angelasjenkins@...> wrote:I have a 10 gallon tank with live plants, black skirts, a few cories, a frog, a large snail and an algae eater. Suddenly, the water has turned green. I changed out 1/2 and it's still green. We lost a black skirt today. What can I do? ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14343	From: CATHERINE FLOWERS	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: Re: new to group/To Catherine

well I guess everythings ok now . I chang the water cleaned everything. saved what fish that i did ( ie the cory cat, and 2 bettas, m&f ) but I did a ammonia test, & nitrites test it was the next step up from the 0.0 for both, ( one was yellow & the other was a lime yellow, in the low status, wasnt high, this one girl said that my temp was off. ( my son was reading , the one that is on the glass, which read, 85f, where the temp gage / them inside the tank was reading 79.5I told her that that was reading the air temp inside the house not the water on the inside> ( I believed that I was rite , ( was I ?) I have been noicing something that is unuasl for fish that you might answer: do fish see colors like we do? for I have this lite that attracts the f* m bettas that blink red yellow, & bluethey get soo interige with it when I turn it off they start going crazy! also I have this other female she doesnt like the fish I put her with... both are bettas too. ( there the ones that I saved, but tried putting them together, she didnt want to have nothing to do with him, so I put her in a reserve bowl, next to a pretty chocolate betta, she went crazy she want to be with him, I let them be that way for a day, the next day , I put her in the bowl, they get alone just fine.. what can cuz this? thx for all your help too.. cathy --- harry perry <harryfisherman@...> wrote: --------------------------------- You wrote me about a problem tank last week. Ar you o.k. now? Harry CATHERINE FLOWERS <ceflowers2000@...> wrote: nice tank,welcome to the grp. --- Daniel <daniel@...> wrote: --------------------------------- Hi I'm pretty New to the group and wanted to introduce myself. I'm Daniel from Rougemont, North Carolina.I have have a 90Gallon Planted tank with mostly Discus and Cardinal Tetras.I also have a few other tanks that I am trying to breed Guppies in.Since I have bought my Discus I have been amazed with them and hope one day to breed those as my main focus fish.My 90G tank I have was a project that I did last Summer,It is a wall tank in my dining room. I just made a photo Gallery of it on a website and I wanted to share it with you.Thanks Here is the link. http://myaquariums.thecomputerpro.biz/Photosprojectslistpg1.htm ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14344	From: harry perry	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: Re: new to group/To Catherine/again

Inreresting about the lights. Different fish can see different colors. I don't know which fish can see what. As a fisherman I can say the colors of the lures make a difference. Your female sounds like she knows what she wants. I have seen this happen before. I don't know why. Glad everything worked out. Harry CATHERINE FLOWERS <ceflowers2000@...> wrote: well I guess everythings ok now . I chang the water cleaned everything. saved what fish that i did ( ie the cory cat, and 2 bettas, m&f ) but I did a ammonia test, & nitrites test it was the next step up from the 0.0 for both, ( one was yellow & the other was a lime yellow, in the low status, wasnt high, this one girl said that my temp was off. ( my son was reading , the one that is on the glass, which read, 85f, where the temp gage / them inside the tank was reading 79.5I told her that that was reading the air temp inside the house not the water on the inside> ( I believed that I was rite , ( was I ?) I have been noicing something that is unuasl for fish that you might answer: do fish see colors like we do? for I have this lite that attracts the f* m bettas that blink red yellow, & bluethey get soo interige with it when I turn it off they start going crazy! also I have this other female she doesnt like the fish I put her with... both are bettas too. ( there the ones that I saved, but tried putting them together, she didnt want to have nothing to do with him, so I put her in a reserve bowl, next to a pretty chocolate betta, she went crazy she want to be with him, I let them be that way for a day, the next day , I put her in the bowl, they get alone just fine.. what can cuz this? thx for all your help too.. cathy --- harry perry <harryfisherman@...> wrote: --------------------------------- You wrote me about a problem tank last week. Ar you o.k. now? Harry CATHERINE FLOWERS <ceflowers2000@...> wrote: nice tank,welcome to the grp. --- Daniel <daniel@...> wrote: --------------------------------- Hi I'm pretty New to the group and wanted to introduce myself. I'm Daniel from Rougemont, North Carolina.I have have a 90Gallon Planted tank with mostly Discus and Cardinal Tetras.I also have a few other tanks that I am trying to breed Guppies in.Since I have bought my Discus I have been amazed with them and hope one day to breed those as my main focus fish.My 90G tank I have was a project that I did last Summer,It is a wall tank in my dining room. I just made a photo Gallery of it on a website and I wanted to share it with you.Thanks Here is the link. http://myaquariums.thecomputerpro.biz/Photosprojectslistpg1.htm ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14345	From: Angela	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: Re: Green Water

We started the tank in April. Does it usually take this long to turn green? --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, kristopher helsing <punk3r12@y...> wrote: > REDUCE BIOLOAD~~! that s a lot for a ten gallon tank weithout lots of water changes.... all that will lead to algea in the water,,, > > Angela <angelasjenkins@c...> wrote:I have a 10 gallon tank with live plants, black skirts, a few cories, > a frog, a large snail and an algae eater. Suddenly, the water has > turned green. I changed out 1/2 and it's still green. We lost a > black skirt today. What can I do? > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14346	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: hello, intro, and a ? about african knifefish

Hello, my name's Sarah :) I'm 25 and I live in Washington state. My husband and I recently set up a 55 gallon tank, then we had problems with a couple fish picking on others so yesterday we set up a 29 gallon. So, in the 55 there's a needlefish, 3 glass cats, 2 cory cats (our daughter's), 1 albino chanel cat, one other catfish I'm not sure what he's black with 2 shiney blue stripes, and a dragonfish. In the 29 we have another, larger needlefish who was tormenting the other one and 2 headstanders who were tormenting my catfish >:( So, that's our tanks :) Anyway, I was just at the local pet store buying some feeders when I spotted an African Knife. Does anyone know anything about these? I didn't have much money on me or I would have got it, lol!!! Do you think I could have one in my 55? I'd love any inmfo on these fish. There were 2, one was about 3 inches and the other was really small. Amd they were the same price!!! Well duh, who would want the little tiny one? LOL!!! Sarah

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14347	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: Re: Green Water

it could take a few... depends....on temp and lots of other things.....the can be unpredictable Angela <angelasjenkins@...> wrote:We started the tank in April. Does it usually take this long to turn green? --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, kristopher helsing <punk3r12@y...> wrote: > REDUCE BIOLOAD~~! that s a lot for a ten gallon tank weithout lots of water changes.... all that will lead to algea in the water,,, > > Angela <angelasjenkins@c...> wrote:I have a 10 gallon tank with live plants, black skirts, a few cories, > a frog, a large snail and an algae eater. Suddenly, the water has > turned green. I changed out 1/2 and it's still green. We lost a > black skirt today. What can I do? > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14348	From: Leslie	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: White growth

There is now white on my heater. I removed the driftwood and treated the tank with fungus fizz drops. The Eheim is FIXED and running better than it did before. It was a dead motor and we found another for free. =) I just it would have been sooner so I would still have my large blood parrot. The white on my heater is growing from bottom to top. It has completely covered the lower half and is getting closer to the top. Is this fungus? Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14349	From: CATHERINE FLOWERS	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: Re: new to group/To Catherine/again

I have bettas 4m & 3females & 1 corycat fish. it is the 2 that is in my bdrm, in a bowl, the f betta is with the white m betta. everytime i turn on the lite, they go to the lite . --- harry perry <harryfisherman@...> wrote: --------------------------------- Inreresting about the lights. Different fish can see different colors. I don't know which fish can see what. As a fisherman I can say the colors of the lures make a difference. Your female sounds like she knows what she wants. I have seen this happen before. I don't know why. Glad everything worked out. Harry CATHERINE FLOWERS <ceflowers2000@...> wrote: well I guess everythings ok now . I chang the water cleaned everything. saved what fish that i did ( ie the cory cat, and 2 bettas, m&f ) but I did a ammonia test, & nitrites test it was the next step up from the 0.0 for both, ( one was yellow & the other was a lime yellow, in the low status, wasnt high, this one girl said that my temp was off. ( my son was reading , the one that is on the glass, which read, 85f, where the temp gage / them inside the tank was reading 79.5I told her that that was reading the air temp inside the house not the water on the inside> ( I believed that I was rite , ( was I ?) I have been noicing something that is unuasl for fish that you might answer: do fish see colors like we do? for I have this lite that attracts the f* m bettas that blink red yellow, & bluethey get soo interige with it when I turn it off they start going crazy! also I have this other female she doesnt like the fish I put her with... both are bettas too. ( there the ones that I saved, but tried putting them together, she didnt want to have nothing to do with him, so I put her in a reserve bowl, next to a pretty chocolate betta, she went crazy she want to be with him, I let them be that way for a day, the next day , I put her in the bowl, they get alone just fine.. what can cuz this? thx for all your help too.. cathy --- harry perry <harryfisherman@...> wrote: --------------------------------- You wrote me about a problem tank last week. Ar you o.k. now? Harry CATHERINE FLOWERS <ceflowers2000@...> wrote: nice tank,welcome to the grp. --- Daniel <daniel@...> wrote: --------------------------------- Hi I'm pretty New to the group and wanted to introduce myself. I'm Daniel from Rougemont, North Carolina.I have have a 90Gallon Planted tank with mostly Discus and Cardinal Tetras.I also have a few other tanks that I am trying to breed Guppies in.Since I have bought my Discus I have been amazed with them and hope one day to breed those as my main focus fish.My 90G tank I have was a project that I did last Summer,It is a wall tank in my dining room. I just made a photo Gallery of it on a website and I wanted to share it with you.Thanks Here is the link. http://myaquariums.thecomputerpro.biz/Photosprojectslistpg1.htm ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14350	From: Chris	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: Re: Green Water

does the tank get *any* direct sunlight whatsoever? I've found even less than 15 minutes a day can cause an algal bloom.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14351	From: Chris	Date: 8/7/2005
Subject: cracked tanks (inspired by leaky tank thread)

I used to work at an aquarium store and one day we had just one customer in the shop (with her little boy) and one of the top-row marine tanks cracked (each bank of tanks was three rows high). The tank was 4' long. At the top there was a glass bridge so there was really two sets of lids on top of the tank - left and right. The crack was in the front panel of the tank, near the left lids, went down, across and back up to the right-hand lids (like a big smile) - and you guessed it, the customer was standing right there. I've never seen my boss move so fast - he called out to the customer to move away, and killed the power for the whole shop. Thankfully, the worst that happened was water streaming down the front and all over the floor, but you can imagine worse: broken glass, saltwater and electricity. Fun mix. Another time I was visiting a different aquarium (that I also used to work at) and I was in one of their back rooms talking to staff and an arowana decided to hit the front panel of his tank. He smashed it right out. This tank was about 30,18,18", and all the water came down the corridor like a wave. The fish managed to get himself underneath the bottom row of tanks and staff had to get their arms in under there to rescue him. I don't know about in the States, but here in Australia, arowanas are very very pricey. This was several years ago, but that fish would have been around the $2000 mark. Anyone else had a tank crack on them? Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14352	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/8/2005
Subject: Re: White growth

You said that the white on your driftwood was smoothish and hard. Now it is on your heater. I wonder if it is a lime deposit or diatoms. The first is usually the result of hard water, or the addition of calcium of some sort, and the second is due to the availability of silica of some sort in the water. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Leslie Sent: Sunday, August 07, 2005 11:01 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com; naturalaquariumenthusiast@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] White growth There is now white on my heater. I removed the driftwood and treated the tank with fungus fizz drops. The Eheim is FIXED and running better than it did before. It was a dead motor and we found another for free. =) I just it would have been sooner so I would still have my large blood parrot. The white on my heater is growing from bottom to top. It has completely covered the lower half and is getting closer to the top. Is this fungus? Leslie

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14353	From: Leslie	Date: 8/8/2005
Subject: Re: White growth

I just messed with the stuff on the heater and it rubs off immediately with just the slightest touch. Is that a fungus? I have fungus fizz tabs in the tank as of last night. I can't do a water change while this stuff is working so that worries me a bit. What could be this stuff be? Leslie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: Monday, August 08, 2005 6:14 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] White growth You said that the white on your driftwood was smoothish and hard. Now it is on your heater. I wonder if it is a lime deposit or diatoms. The first is usually the result of hard water, or the addition of calcium of some sort, and the second is due to the availability of silica of some sort in the water.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14354	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 8/8/2005
Subject: arowana

So did the arowana live? Yes, they are pretty pricey here too, especially for the rarer ones like the black ones. They are my husbands favorite fish and before we met he had one that was 2 ft long! Sarah

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14355	From: joequality1980	Date: 8/8/2005
Subject: heater question

If I were to trade in my smaller tanks (20,29 gal) for a larger one (55 gal), could I just use both heaters in the 55 or would I have to get a new heater with a higher wattage output?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14356	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/8/2005
Subject: Re: heater question

Use the old heaters as long as they are in good condition. The heater for the 29 might be big enough by itself to heat the 55, depending on room temp compared to desired tank temp. But both smaller heaters in my opinion are better then one Large heater. Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 8/8/2005 12:11:13 PM US Eastern Standard Time, crazy.joe.walcek@... writes: If I were to trade in my smaller tanks (20,29 gal) for a larger one (55 gal), could I just use both heaters in the 55 or would I have to get a new heater with a higher wattage output? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14357	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/8/2005
Subject: Re: White growth

Its more probable, as Steve said earlier, that its lime (or calcium) deposits. Excess minerals can adhere to the heat source that is helping to evaporate the medium (water) that its contained in. Just the high heat itself concentrated in that one area -- the heater tube -- will cause the water to release these minerals, especially as the concentration is increases (as the water hardness increases). Would like to make one point I made earlier clearer in case you may be confused. While the fungus fizz tabs would probably work on anything of a fungal material, note that any type of mold (fungus) as had been possibly growing on your driftwood (or even if perhaps on your heater) is not in the least transferable to your fish, as a fish fungus. These are molds (fungi) that would grow only on vegetative matter (wood, fish food, etc.), if you even had it. For example, mushrooms are forms of fungi, but don't affect animals, and we're all familiar with bread mold. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > I just messed with the stuff on the heater and it rubs off immediately > with just the slightest touch. Is that a fungus? I have fungus fizz > tabs in the tank as of last night. I can't do a water change while this > stuff is working so that worries me a bit. > > What could be this stuff be? > > Leslie > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Steve Szabo > Sent: Monday, August 08, 2005 6:14 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] White growth > > You said that the white on your driftwood was smoothish and hard. Now it > is > on your heater. I wonder if it is a lime deposit or diatoms. The first > is > usually the result of hard water, or the addition of calcium of some > sort, > and the second is due to the availability of silica of some sort in the > water.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14358	From: Leslie	Date: 8/8/2005
Subject: Re: White growth

I also just noticed that my baby firemouth has clamped fins. So I need to be testing the ph then and if it's way off then correct it. Otherwise, what should I be doing? -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Monday, August 08, 2005 1:20 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: White growth Its more probable, as Steve said earlier, that its lime (or calcium) deposits. Excess minerals can adhere to the heat source that is helping to evaporate the medium (water) that its contained in. Just the high heat itself concentrated in that one area -- the heater tube -- will cause the water to release these minerals, especially as the concentration is increases (as the water hardness increases). Would like to make one point I made earlier clearer in case you may be confused. While the fungus fizz tabs would probably work on anything of a fungal material, note that any type of mold (fungus) as had been possibly growing on your driftwood (or even if perhaps on your heater) is not in the least transferable to your fish, as a fish fungus. These are molds (fungi) that would grow only on vegetative matter (wood, fish food, etc.), if you even had it. For example, mushrooms are forms of fungi, but don't affect animals, and we're all familiar with bread mold. Ray \

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14359	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 8/8/2005
Subject: Re: new to group

very nice! --- Daniel <daniel@...> wrote: > Hi I'm pretty New to the group and wanted to introduce myself. > I'm Daniel from Rougemont, North Carolina.I have have a 90Gallon > Planted tank with mostly Discus and Cardinal Tetras.I also have a few > other tanks that I am trying to breed Guppies in.Since I have bought > my Discus I have been amazed with them and hope one day to breed those > as my main focus fish.My 90G tank I have was a project that I did last > Summer,It is a wall tank in my dining room. I just made a photo > Gallery of it on a website and I wanted to share it with you.Thanks > Here is the link. > http://myaquariums.thecomputerpro.biz/Photosprojectslistpg1.htm > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14360	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/8/2005
Subject: Re: White growth

Sounds as if the baby Firemouth isn't doing too well in the water of the 75 gallon tank, for whatever reason, and appears as if he should be treated with the other fish. Your pH should not have moved without good cause, but if you were to "adjust" it with the baby Firemouth still in there, you would be subjecting him to even more stress (especially if its "way off"), possibly worsening his present condition. His condition may well be a delayed reaction to the poor tank conditions of several days ago, otherwise there's something weird going on in the 75 for which either all the facts haven't been forthcoming or are not known. In the meantime treat him in the quarantine tank and watch the other fish. It may turn out that you should have treated the 75 as I first suggested, but lets take it one step at a time. A question of concern -- what is this "chemical filter" that was used? Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > I also just noticed that my baby firemouth has clamped fins. > > So I need to be testing the ph then and if it's way off then correct it. > Otherwise, what should I be doing? > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Monday, August 08, 2005 1:20 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: White growth > > Its more probable, as Steve said earlier, that its lime (or calcium) > deposits. Excess minerals can adhere to the heat source that is > helping to evaporate the medium (water) that its contained in. Just > the high heat itself concentrated in that one area -- the heater > tube -- will cause the water to release these minerals, especially as > the concentration is increases (as the water hardness increases). > Would like to make one point I made earlier clearer in case you may > be confused. While the fungus fizz tabs would probably work on > anything of a fungal material, note that any type of mold (fungus) as > had been possibly growing on your driftwood (or even if perhaps on > your heater) is not in the least transferable to your fish, as a fish > fungus. These are molds (fungi) that would grow only on vegetative > matter (wood, fish food, etc.), if you even had it. For example, > mushrooms are forms of fungi, but don't affect animals, and we're all > familiar with bread mold. Ray > \

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14361	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/8/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists every Monday! Monday August 8, 2005 8:00 pm - 9:00 pm This event repeats every week. The next reminder for this event will be sent in 3 hours, 3 minutes. Event Location: http://chat.thatpetplace.com/chat/chat.aspx Notes: Return to this site every Thursday from 8pm to 10pm and Monday from 8pm to 9pm (Eastern Time) to chat LIVE with one of our on-staff Marine Biologists. Learn about your fish, how to treat common maladies, get recommendations on accessories, food and live animal compatibility, or ask a question that only an expert could answer. MarineBio Chat every Thursday 8pm to 10pm EST, only from That Fish Place, The Original Aquatic Superstore. Attention MarineBio chat participants! The chat server is unavailable until 8pm Eastern Time. If you experience problems while trying to log on to the chat session ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14362	From: Leslie	Date: 8/8/2005
Subject: Re: White growth

I treated the 75. That's where the fungus fizz tabs are. I didn't treat the qt tank but with salt and a small water change (and conditioner.) The chemical filter is a fluval (sp?) of some sort. It supposedly removes the metals from the water. It had carbon but that was removed when I added the fungus treatments. Is it possible that if this filter wasn't clean and then just stuck on to my tank, that it could have added to the problem? I hope his condition is a delayed reaction. He looks miserable. His fins are close to his sides with his back "tail" not fully fanned out. He uses his right fin more while his left stays stuck to the side with only an occasional movement. Leslie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Monday, August 08, 2005 3:56 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: White growth Sounds as if the baby Firemouth isn't doing too well in the water of the 75 gallon tank, for whatever reason, and appears as if he should be treated with the other fish. Your pH should not have moved without good cause, but if you were to "adjust" it with the baby Firemouth still in there, you would be subjecting him to even more stress (especially if its "way off"), possibly worsening his present condition. His condition may well be a delayed reaction to the poor tank conditions of several days ago, otherwise there's something weird going on in the 75 for which either all the facts haven't been forthcoming or are not known. In the meantime treat him in the quarantine tank and watch the other fish. It may turn out that you should have treated the 75 as I first suggested, but lets take it one step at a time. A question of concern -- what is this "chemical filter" that was used? Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > I also just noticed that my baby firemouth has clamped fins. > > So I need to be testing the ph then and if it's way off then correct it. > Otherwise, what should I be doing? > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Monday, August 08, 2005 1:20 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: White growth > > Its more probable, as Steve said earlier, that its lime (or calcium) > deposits. Excess minerals can adhere to the heat source that is > helping to evaporate the medium (water) that its contained in. Just > the high heat itself concentrated in that one area -- the heater > tube -- will cause the water to release these minerals, especially as > the concentration is increases (as the water hardness increases). > Would like to make one point I made earlier clearer in case you may > be confused. While the fungus fizz tabs would probably work on > anything of a fungal material, note that any type of mold (fungus) as > had been possibly growing on your driftwood (or even if perhaps on > your heater) is not in the least transferable to your fish, as a fish > fungus. These are molds (fungi) that would grow only on vegetative > matter (wood, fish food, etc.), if you even had it. For example, > mushrooms are forms of fungi, but don't affect animals, and we're all > familiar with bread mold. Ray > \ ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14363	From: joequality1980	Date: 8/8/2005
Subject: Re: new to group

wow, that makes me want to buy a house and ditch my apartment... How long did it take you to set it up? > Here is the link. > http://myaquariums.thecomputerpro.biz/Photosprojectslistpg1.htm

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14364	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/8/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists every Monday! Monday August 8, 2005 8:00 pm - 9:00 pm This event repeats every week. Event Location: http://chat.thatpetplace.com/chat/chat.aspx Notes: Return to this site every Thursday from 8pm to 10pm and Monday from 8pm to 9pm (Eastern Time) to chat LIVE with one of our on-staff Marine Biologists. Learn about your fish, how to treat common maladies, get recommendations on accessories, food and live animal compatibility, or ask a question that only an expert could answer. MarineBio Chat every Thursday 8pm to 10pm EST, only from That Fish Place, The Original Aquatic Superstore. Attention MarineBio chat participants! The chat server is unavailable until 8pm Eastern Time. If you experience problems while trying to log on to the chat session ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14365	From: Leslie	Date: 8/8/2005
Subject: Catfish Bloated Stomach

My catfish has a VERY bloated stomach. He had this once before but it went down while I was gone away. Now today his stomach is bloated and much worse. He looks like he could float, but he's not. I can't find anything on what this could be. I know he's hungry as he swims to the surface to eat and in fact gets most of the food before it begins to sink. Over fed catfish? Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14366	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/8/2005
Subject: Re: White growth

The only fungus I have seen in a tank has been of the fuzzy variety. While I would not rule out fungus, I'd think it is something else. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Leslie Sent: Monday, August 08, 2005 9:27 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] White growth I just messed with the stuff on the heater and it rubs off immediately with just the slightest touch. Is that a fungus? I have fungus fizz tabs in the tank as of last night. I can't do a water change while this stuff is working so that worries me a bit. What could be this stuff be? Leslie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: Monday, August 08, 2005 6:14 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] White growth You said that the white on your driftwood was smoothish and hard. Now it is on your heater. I wonder if it is a lime deposit or diatoms. The first is usually the result of hard water, or the addition of calcium of some sort, and the second is due to the availability of silica of some sort in the water.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14367	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/8/2005
Subject: Re: heater question

What is the wattage of your old heaters? What is the difference between the ambient room temperature and the tank temperature you wish to maintain? The definitive answer will come when those questions are answered. Right now the best that can be said is probably yes, especially since the two heaters you now have were probably oversized for the tanks they were in. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of joequality1980 Sent: Monday, August 08, 2005 1:10 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] heater question If I were to trade in my smaller tanks (20,29 gal) for a larger one (55 gal), could I just use both heaters in the 55 or would I have to get a new heater with a higher wattage output?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14368	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/8/2005
Subject: Re: Catfish Bloated Stomach

What kind of catfish is it? \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Leslie Sent: Monday, August 08, 2005 8:10 PM To: uniquaria@yahoogroups.com; AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com; naturalaquariumenthusiast@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Catfish Bloated Stomach My catfish has a VERY bloated stomach. He had this once before but it went down while I was gone away. Now today his stomach is bloated and much worse. He looks like he could float, but he's not. I can't find anything on what this could be. I know he's hungry as he swims to the surface to eat and in fact gets most of the food before it begins to sink. Over fed catfish? Leslie

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14369	From: Chris	Date: 8/8/2005
Subject: Re: arowana

I'm not sure. This one was about 2' too. I don't imagine a few minutes on the floor would kill it, but then again, it fell onto concrete... Chris. Sarah Fleming Davis <keelis_mom@...> wrote: So did the arowana live? --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Try Yahoo! Photomail Beta: Send up to 300 photos in one email! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14370	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/8/2005
Subject: Re: Catfish Bloated Stomach

what kind of catfish? maybe full of eggs, maybe blocked intestine, maybe to much air in stomache from eating at surface... .. Very very hard to tell ... more details rob indiana In a message dated 8/8/2005 10:25:02 PM US Eastern Standard Time, steve@... writes: My catfish has a VERY bloated stomach. He had this once before but it went down while I was gone away. Now today his stomach is bloated and much worse. He looks like he could float, but he's not. I can't find anything on what this could be. I know he's hungry as he swims to the surface to eat and in fact gets most of the food before it begins to sink. Over fed catfish? Leslie Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14371	From: Chris	Date: 8/8/2005
Subject: Re: hello, intro, and a ? about african knifefish

> spotted an African Knife. Does anyone know anything about these? I'm not sure what you mean by "needlefish" and "dragonfish" although the rest of the fish you describe are fairly gentle community fish - so I imagine these others are also. Here is a good summary page which shows some African Knives with goldfish and axolotyls (of all things!) - you can check that the fish you saw is the same as on the page and not some other knife fish by mistake. You'll see links (at right) to the Clown Knife and Ghost Knife also. It seems the most notable features are that during "bright-light" (day/lights-on) periods, this fish will probably prefer darker corners and/or caves in your tank. When the fish gets larger (up to 1') you might consider putting a weight on top of your lids as it can jump. Make sure too that the gap where your filtration/heater/airhose, etc, enters the tank, is not too big - put cling wrap over it if it is - as this is a compressed (thin) fish which might slip out that gap. Oh, the thing I find most interesting about this fish (and similar) is that it gives off electrical signals. I do believe some water-treatment plants use the electrical signals from knife fish as part of a quality assurnace program. I don't remember the details now, but I read about it in a book named "Fish and their behaviour" by Gunther K.H. Zupanc (1985) which I still have at home. Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14372	From: richard thompson	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Re: Fish Only Saltwater tank

fish only tank means just about anything...what are you intending to do..just remember with clowns...only 1 species, with dottybacks only 1 fish....with firefish don't mix purple and red, etc seamonkeystew <seamonkeystew@...> wrote:Any recomendations for a saltwater fishonly tank. Im not a begginer, i just cant think of anything. Help me!!!! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14373	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Re: White growth

Was wondering why you were adding the fungus fiz tabs to the 75. Since it was never established that your fish had fungus (only paling in color), I assumed that you were trying to get rid of any possible type fungus that may have been growing on your driftwood, as you wouldn't be treating the fish with the fiz tabs for something they didn't have. A more appropriate treatment more relevant to what may be ailing the fish would have been Furan II, as suggested, a gram- positive/gram-negative bacticide. That the ailing fish came around in the qt tank with just salt added does at least show that they were not as sick as first appeared, although they certainly don't like the water (or what's in it) in the 75. You may have to do more than salt for the baby firemouth, though; I presume you've pulled him out of the problem 75 tank. I am very suspect of the Fluval being a large contributor to the problems, especially if it was previously just sitting around with funky water still in it, and wasn't cleaned. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > I treated the 75. That's where the fungus fizz tabs are. I didn't > treat the qt tank but with salt and a small water change (and > conditioner.) > > The chemical filter is a fluval (sp?) of some sort. It supposedly > removes the metals from the water. It had carbon but that was removed > when I added the fungus treatments. Is it possible that if this filter > wasn't clean and then just stuck on to my tank, that it could have added > to the problem? > > I hope his condition is a delayed reaction. He looks miserable. His > fins are close to his sides with his back "tail" not fully fanned out. > He uses his right fin more while his left stays stuck to the side with > only an occasional movement. > > Leslie > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Monday, August 08, 2005 3:56 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: White growth > > Sounds as if the baby Firemouth isn't doing too well in the water of > the 75 gallon tank, for whatever reason, and appears as if he should > be treated with the other fish. Your pH should not have moved > without good cause, but if you were to "adjust" it with the baby > Firemouth still in there, you would be subjecting him to even more > stress (especially if its "way off"), possibly worsening his present > condition. His condition may well be a delayed reaction to the poor > tank conditions of several days ago, otherwise there's something > weird going on in the 75 for which either all the facts haven't been > forthcoming or are not known. In the meantime treat him in the > quarantine tank and watch the other fish. It may turn out that you > should have treated the 75 as I first suggested, but lets take it one > step at a time. A question of concern -- what is this "chemical > filter" that was used? Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > I also just noticed that my baby firemouth has clamped fins. > > > > So I need to be testing the ph then and if it's way off then > correct it. > > Otherwise, what should I be doing? > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > > On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > > Sent: Monday, August 08, 2005 1:20 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: White growth > > > > Its more probable, as Steve said earlier, that its lime (or > calcium) > > deposits. Excess minerals can adhere to the heat source that is > > helping to evaporate the medium (water) that its contained in. > Just > > the high heat itself concentrated in that one area -- the heater > > tube -- will cause the water to release these minerals, especially > as > > the concentration is increases (as the water hardness increases). > > Would like to make one point I made earlier clearer in case you may > > be confused. While the fungus fizz tabs would probably work on > > anything of a fungal material, note that any type of mold (fungus) > as > > had been possibly growing on your driftwood (or even if perhaps on > > your heater) is not in the least transferable to your fish, as a > fish > > fungus. These are molds (fungi) that would grow only on vegetative > > matter (wood, fish food, etc.), if you even had it. For example, > > mushrooms are forms of fungi, but don't affect animals, and we're > all > > familiar with bread mold. Ray > > \ > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important > to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14374	From: Leslie	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Re: Catfish Bloated Stomach

I think it is called something like a pictus catfish? It's shiny silver with long "whiskers" and black spots all over. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of FortWayneFish@... Sent: Monday, August 08, 2005 10:43 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Catfish Bloated Stomach what kind of catfish? maybe full of eggs, maybe blocked intestine, maybe to much air in stomache from eating at surface... .. Very very hard to tell ... more details rob indiana In a message dated 8/8/2005 10:25:02 PM US Eastern Standard Time, steve@... writes: My catfish has a VERY bloated stomach. He had this once before but it went down while I was gone away. Now today his stomach is bloated and much worse. He looks like he could float, but he's not. I can't find anything on what this could be. I know he's hungry as he swims to the surface to eat and in fact gets most of the food before it begins to sink. Over fed catfish? Leslie Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14375	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Re: Koi question

Steve, Have been meaning to get back to you on this so that readers will not get the wrong impression. As such, I'm taking this opportunity before I let it slide again. First of all, Koi are normally kept in their ponds year 'round, even in the dead of Winter in cold climates where ponds freeze over, as there is absolutely no reason to bring them indoors. Some hobbyists such as Steve Meyer may choose to bring their fish inside, just as some goldfish fanciers do with their hardy pool Comets, but its entirely unnecessary, as both will survive the Winter under the ice. I realize successful Koi keepers with established ponds already know this, but am advising the members on this Forum who may be thinking about keeping Koi so as not to have them discouraged by this un-needed chore of netting their fish in the Fall to bring into a basement pond. It is only under circumstances such as Rebecca describes that the Koi would have to be moved, where the fluctuating water requires them to be moved for lack of sufficient water, as I trust you are referring to. \ As Koi can and do Winter-over under the ice, they're obviously not picky about temperatures. The only reason why one might wait for their pond water to get to 55 o F, is if you already had your fish indoors (for whatever reason) and were transferring them to the pond - - you want to avoid any extremes of temperature difference, just as with tropical fish. Otherwise there's no need to be concerned with their water temperature. True enough, as with all fish (and other cold-blooded animals), their metabolism slows as the temperature decreases, resulting in slowed digestion. They will continue to eat (as they have an appetite) down to 43 o, but if fed normal "Summer Formula" foods they will not be able to digest it and yes it can rot in their bellies. Under no circumstances should Koi be fed regular formula pellet/stick foods in water temperatures lower than 60 o. Koi definitely need to continue to be fed as the water temperature drops to keep them healthy over the Winter when they do not eat, albeit, less quantity and less frequently as the temperature drops. This is why Spring and Fall formulas of pellet and stick Koi foods are marketed, containing mostly easily digestible (especially in cold weather) Wheat Germ which they can assimilate with no problems. Below approximately 43 o cease feeding them as they will no longer be interested in eating. As they again begin to stir in the Spring, Wheat Germ foods (only) should be fed until the pond temperature again reaches 60 o. While the fish are under the ice, a small pond heater is required to keep an open hole in the ice, to let any noxious gases (methane and hydrogen) from rotting vegetation, etc., escape which would otherwise accumulate and poison the fish. These floating heaters are not designed to heat the whole pond but just to keep the ice clear immediately surrounding it. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > > They will not survive year round in what you describe. The koi will need to be moved indoors. If you have a collection of _Aquarium Fish Magazine_ issues, you can look back to find the articles by Steve Meyer about over wintering koi indoors. Basicly, he uses 2 x 4's and 2 x 6's and plastic liners to create ponds in his basement, and moves his koi into them for the winter months. Of course, he does not have the problem of the disappearing pond as your sister-in-law does, so his fish are a bit arder to corral to bring indoors. He provides filtration with a number of canister filters and larger Marineland HOT filters. > > Koi are also picky about temperatures. She will not be able to putthem out until the water temperature reaches at least 50^o F, 55 is better, and she shoud bringthem in before the water temperature drops below that mark. The reason that koi have these "magic" numbers is that when the temperature reaches that range, their digestion ceases. They may still eat, but they cannot digest the food, and that can lead to problems later on as the food will have a tendency to rot in their bellies while the temperature is low. > > \\Steve// > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸ > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14376	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Re: Koi question

Thank you for all the koi info. I saw my sister-in-law over the weekend. Although she plans on keeping the fish she already bought, she is planning on having the pond adjusted by digging it deeper. That way it will not dry out and the koi will have a swimming area in the winter. Someone had also told her about breaking the ice or getting the heater and she plans to do that. Hopefully they grow slow enough so that they will make it through this winter in that little well thing in the center of the pond. I will let her know about the feeding schedule and different foods. Thanks again!!!! Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > Steve, Have been meaning to get back to you on this so that readers > will not get the wrong impression. As such, I'm taking this > opportunity before I let it slide again. First of all, Koi are > normally kept in their ponds year 'round, even in the dead of Winter > in cold climates where ponds freeze over, as there is absolutely no > reason to bring them indoors. Some hobbyists such as Steve Meyer may > choose to bring their fish inside, just as some goldfish fanciers do > with their hardy pool Comets, but its entirely unnecessary, as both > will survive the Winter under the ice. I realize successful Koi > keepers with established ponds already know this, but am advising the > members on this Forum who may be thinking about keeping Koi so as not > to have them discouraged by this un-needed chore of netting their > fish in the Fall to bring into a basement pond. It is only under > circumstances such as Rebecca describes that the Koi would have to be > moved, where the fluctuating water requires them to be moved for lack > of sufficient water, as I trust you are referring to. > \ > As Koi can and do Winter-over under the ice, they're obviously not > picky about temperatures. The only reason why one might wait for > their pond water to get to 55 o F, is if you already had your fish > indoors (for whatever reason) and were transferring them to the pond - > - you want to avoid any extremes of temperature difference, just as > with tropical fish. Otherwise there's no need to be concerned with > their water temperature. True enough, as with all fish (and other > cold-blooded animals), their metabolism slows as the temperature > decreases, resulting in slowed digestion. They will continue to eat > (as they have an appetite) down to 43 o, but if fed normal "Summer > Formula" foods they will not be able to digest it and yes it can rot > in their bellies. Under no circumstances should Koi be fed regular > formula pellet/stick foods in water temperatures lower than 60 o. > Koi definitely need to continue to be fed as the water temperature > drops to keep them healthy over the Winter when they do not eat, > albeit, less quantity and less frequently as the temperature drops. > This is why Spring and Fall formulas of pellet and stick Koi foods > are marketed, containing mostly easily digestible (especially in cold > weather) Wheat Germ which they can assimilate with no problems. > Below approximately 43 o cease feeding them as they will no longer be > interested in eating. As they again begin to stir in the Spring, > Wheat Germ foods (only) should be fed until the pond temperature > again reaches 60 o. While the fish are under the ice, a small pond > heater is required to keep an open hole in the ice, to let any > noxious gases (methane and hydrogen) from rotting vegetation, etc., > escape which would otherwise accumulate and poison the fish. These > floating heaters are not designed to heat the whole pond but just to > keep the ice clear immediately surrounding it. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > > > > They will not survive year round in what you describe. The koi will > need to be moved indoors. If you have a collection of _Aquarium Fish > Magazine_ issues, you can look back to find the articles by Steve > Meyer about over wintering koi indoors. Basicly, he uses 2 x 4's and > 2 x 6's and plastic liners to create ponds in his basement, and moves > his koi into them for the winter months. Of course, he does not have > the problem of the disappearing pond as your sister-in-law does, so > his fish are a bit arder to corral to bring indoors. He provides > filtration with a number of canister filters and larger Marineland > HOT filters. > > > > Koi are also picky about temperatures. She will not be able to > putthem out until the water temperature reaches at least 50^o F, 55 > is better, and she shoud bringthem in before the water temperature > drops below that mark. The reason that koi have these "magic" numbers > is that when the temperature reaches that range, their digestion > ceases. They may still eat, but they cannot digest the food, and that > can lead to problems later on as the food will have a tendency to rot > in their bellies while the temperature is low. > > > > \\Steve// > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸ > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14377	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Re: hello, intro, and a ? about african knifefish

Saw that Walmart had "dragonfish" for sale when I went to get more algae tabs. Dunno what kind it is but they all looked badly injured. Very long body, short head with fins and gills all right there. The paper they had on this fish said "great community fish, have singularly or many." It definitly looked very unique, but since I've never seen anything like it and as I said, they all appeared injured (around the gills and immediatly inder the fins was a dull pink. Belly was a pale white, top is brown. Looks kinda like a chinese dragon. I went looking online for it, but found nothing that matched what these looked like. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chris" <youcantryreachingme@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Monday, August 08, 2005 8:54 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: hello, intro, and a ? about african knifefish > spotted an African Knife. Does anyone know anything about these? I'm not sure what you mean by "needlefish" and "dragonfish" although the rest of the fish you describe are fairly gentle community fish - so I imagine these others are also. Here is a good summary page which shows some African Knives with goldfish and axolotyls (of all things!) - you can check that the fish you saw is the same as on the page and not some other knife fish by mistake. You'll see links (at right) to the Clown Knife and Ghost Knife also. It seems the most notable features are that during "bright-light" (day/lights-on) periods, this fish will probably prefer darker corners and/or caves in your tank. When the fish gets larger (up to 1') you might consider putting a weight on top of your lids as it can jump. Make sure too that the gap where your filtration/heater/airhose, etc, enters the tank, is not too big - put cling wrap over it if it is - as this is a compressed (thin) fish which might slip out that gap. Oh, the thing I find most interesting about this fish (and similar) is that it gives off electrical signals. I do believe some water-treatment plants use the electrical signals from knife fish as part of a quality assurnace program. I don't remember the details now, but I read about it in a book named "Fish and their behaviour" by Gunther K.H. Zupanc (1985) which I still have at home. Chris. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14378	From: Amalthea	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Re: Koi question

Be sure she does not manually break the ice by hitting it or banging on it. The vibrations from this can damage or kill the fish! The only way to keep it open is with a floating heater (cheap and well worth the investment) or by pouring hot water on a section of the ice. A bubbler can also keep the ice open except during snow storms, etc. Amalthea http://www.amaltheasattic.com Your Alternative to the Alternative.... On Aug 9, 2005, at 9:59 AM, thesydmonster wrote: > Thank you for all the koi info. I saw my sister-in-law over the > weekend. Although she plans on keeping the fish she already bought, > she is planning on having the pond adjusted by digging it deeper. > That way it will not dry out and the koi will have a swimming area > in the winter. Someone had also told her about breaking the ice or > getting the heater and she plans to do that. Hopefully they grow > slow enough so that they will make it through this winter in that > little well thing in the center of the pond. I will let her know > about the feeding schedule and different foods. > > Thanks again!!!! > Rebecca > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" > <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > Steve, Have been meaning to get back to you on this so that > readers > > will not get the wrong impression. As such, I'm taking this > > opportunity before I let it slide again. First of all, Koi are > > normally kept in their ponds year 'round, even in the dead of > Winter > > in cold climates where ponds freeze over, as there is absolutely > no > > reason to bring them indoors. Some hobbyists such as Steve Meyer > may > > choose to bring their fish inside, just as some goldfish fanciers > do > > with their hardy pool Comets, but its entirely unnecessary, as > both > > will survive the Winter under the ice. I realize successful Koi > > keepers with established ponds already know this, but am advising > the > > members on this Forum who may be thinking about keeping Koi so as > not > > to have them discouraged by this un-needed chore of netting their > > fish in the Fall to bring into a basement pond. It is only under > > circumstances such as Rebecca describes that the Koi would have to > be > > moved, where the fluctuating water requires them to be moved for > lack > > of sufficient water, as I trust you are referring > to. > > > \ > > > As Koi can and do Winter-over under the ice, they're obviously not > > picky about temperatures. The only reason why one might wait for > > their pond water to get to 55 o F, is if you already had your fish > > indoors (for whatever reason) and were transferring them to the > pond - > > - you want to avoid any extremes of temperature difference, just > as > > with tropical fish. Otherwise there's no need to be concerned > with > > their water temperature. True enough, as with all fish (and other > > cold-blooded animals), their metabolism slows as the temperature > > decreases, resulting in slowed digestion. They will continue to > eat > > (as they have an appetite) down to 43 o, but if fed normal "Summer > > Formula" foods they will not be able to digest it and yes it can > rot > > in their bellies. Under no circumstances should Koi be fed > regular > > formula pellet/stick foods in water temperatures lower than 60 o. > > Koi definitely need to continue to be fed as the water temperature > > drops to keep them healthy over the Winter when they do not eat, > > albeit, less quantity and less frequently as the temperature > drops. > > This is why Spring and Fall formulas of pellet and stick Koi foods > > are marketed, containing mostly easily digestible (especially in > cold > > weather) Wheat Germ which they can assimilate with no problems. > > Below approximately 43 o cease feeding them as they will no longer > be > > interested in eating. As they again begin to stir in the Spring, > > Wheat Germ foods (only) should be fed until the pond temperature > > again reaches 60 o. While the fish are under the ice, a small > pond > > heater is required to keep an open hole in the ice, to let any > > noxious gases (methane and hydrogen) from rotting vegetation, > etc., > > escape which would otherwise accumulate and poison the fish. > These > > floating heaters are not designed to heat the whole pond but just > to > > keep the ice clear immediately surrounding it. > Ray > > > \ > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> > wrote: > > > > > > They will not survive year round in what you describe. The koi > will > > need to be moved indoors. If you have a collection of _Aquarium > Fish > > Magazine_ issues, you can look back to find the articles by Steve > > Meyer about over wintering koi indoors. Basicly, he uses 2 x 4's > and > > 2 x 6's and plastic liners to create ponds in his basement, and > moves > > his koi into them for the winter months. Of course, he does not > have > > the problem of the disappearing pond as your sister-in-law does, > so > > his fish are a bit arder to corral to bring indoors. He provides > > filtration with a number of canister filters and larger Marineland > > HOT filters. > > > > > > Koi are also picky about temperatures. She will not be able to > > putthem out until the water temperature reaches at least 50^o F, > 55 > > is better, and she shoud bringthem in before the water temperature > > drops below that mark. The reason that koi have these "magic" > numbers > > is that when the temperature reaches that range, their digestion > > ceases. They may still eat, but they cannot digest the food, and > that > > can lead to problems later on as the food will have a tendency to > rot > > in their bellies while the temperature is low. > > > > > > \\Steve// > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > ((((º> > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸ > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > ((((º> > > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><· > ´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14379	From: Daniel	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Re: new to group

Joe After I had all my supplies it took my only half a day to cut out the wall and complete the tank setup.I used the old filters that I used in my 55 gallon tank so I wouldn't have to cycle and some of the old gravel. They worked fine.After waiting a couple of days I went and purchased my fish to put in there.I have added 3 more Discus from the 2 I first had put in and also added more Cardinals also.The new setup only took an evening that includes searching my land for the rocks. Thanks Daniel --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "joequality1980" <crazy.joe.walcek@g...> wrote: > wow, that makes me want to buy a house and ditch my apartment... How > long did it take you to set it up? > > > Here is the link. > > http://myaquariums.thecomputerpro.biz/Photosprojectslistpg1.htm

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14380	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Re: Koi question

Please tell your Sister-In-Law not to smash the ice to break a hole in it, under any circumstances. The concussion can kill the Koi. Besides that, it will only freeze over again, which would require more breaking. As stated in my last post, there are floating pond heaters available for that purpose, some requiring only 100 Watts (Thermo-Pond brand for around $70). A small (40 to 60 GPH) submersible water pump aimed at the surface and situated about 8" below the surface can be used to create turbulance in a small area at the surface which will prevent freezing in that spot, however this is to be used only in large ponds as otherwise you would be "turning over" the pond too rapidly at that time of year for the fish's well being. Normally, the water at the very bottom of the pond where the fish will be hibernating is actually warmer by a few degrees and you don't want to disturb that. \ Under normal conditions, Koi are not a slow growing fish -- for instance. an 8" Koi can easily grow 6" in a season. Between now and Winter they won't have that opportunity but they will add something, but will not grow during the Winter. As you see though, by the end of next year they will be quite a bit larger. One thing she ought to keep in mind; after the pond is finished the majority of beginner water gardeners often feel that they should have made their pond larger when they first started it. Tell her to make it a little larger now if she has the room rather than be sorry later. A good way to "design" the pond is to lay down repeated outlines with a garden hose until she likes what she sees. At the same time the pond is being dug, ledges (for bog plants and such) and different levels can be allowed for. While you don't want the sides to drop straight down, you want to avoid shallow angles to the sides to discourage predators from finding it easy to get to the fish. \ One further note on the Autumn feeding; as the water temperature drops from 60 o to 43 o, the frequency of feedings should drop off gradually to finally once every 3 days as it gets down near 45 o. They do need these feedings though to help them through the Winter. Summertime, twice a day feedings are normal, with regular food, an amount given similar to what we feed our tropicals -- no more than they'll clean up in 5 minutes or so. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > Thank you for all the koi info. I saw my sister-in-law over the > weekend. Although she plans on keeping the fish she already bought, > she is planning on having the pond adjusted by digging it deeper. > That way it will not dry out and the koi will have a swimming area > in the winter. Someone had also told her about breaking the ice or > getting the heater and she plans to do that. Hopefully they grow > slow enough so that they will make it through this winter in that > little well thing in the center of the pond. I will let her know > about the feeding schedule and different foods. > > Thanks again!!!! > Rebecca > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" > <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > Steve, Have been meaning to get back to you on this so that > readers > > will not get the wrong impression. As such, I'm taking this > > opportunity before I let it slide again. First of all, Koi are > > normally kept in their ponds year 'round, even in the dead of > Winter > > in cold climates where ponds freeze over, as there is absolutely > no > > reason to bring them indoors. Some hobbyists such as Steve Meyer > may > > choose to bring their fish inside, just as some goldfish fanciers > do > > with their hardy pool Comets, but its entirely unnecessary, as > both > > will survive the Winter under the ice. I realize successful Koi > > keepers with established ponds already know this, but am advising > the > > members on this Forum who may be thinking about keeping Koi so as > not > > to have them discouraged by this un-needed chore of netting their > > fish in the Fall to bring into a basement pond. It is only under > > circumstances such as Rebecca describes that the Koi would have to > be > > moved, where the fluctuating water requires them to be moved for > lack > > of sufficient water, as I trust you are referring > to. > > > \ > > > As Koi can and do Winter-over under the ice, they're obviously not > > picky about temperatures. The only reason why one might wait for > > their pond water to get to 55 o F, is if you already had your fish > > indoors (for whatever reason) and were transferring them to the > pond - > > - you want to avoid any extremes of temperature difference, just > as > > with tropical fish. Otherwise there's no need to be concerned > with > > their water temperature. True enough, as with all fish (and other > > cold-blooded animals), their metabolism slows as the temperature > > decreases, resulting in slowed digestion. They will continue to > eat > > (as they have an appetite) down to 43 o, but if fed normal "Summer > > Formula" foods they will not be able to digest it and yes it can > rot > > in their bellies. Under no circumstances should Koi be fed > regular > > formula pellet/stick foods in water temperatures lower than 60 o. > > Koi definitely need to continue to be fed as the water temperature > > drops to keep them healthy over the Winter when they do not eat, > > albeit, less quantity and less frequently as the temperature > drops. > > This is why Spring and Fall formulas of pellet and stick Koi foods > > are marketed, containing mostly easily digestible (especially in > cold > > weather) Wheat Germ which they can assimilate with no problems. > > Below approximately 43 o cease feeding them as they will no longer > be > > interested in eating. As they again begin to stir in the Spring, > > Wheat Germ foods (only) should be fed until the pond temperature > > again reaches 60 o. While the fish are under the ice, a small > pond > > heater is required to keep an open hole in the ice, to let any > > noxious gases (methane and hydrogen) from rotting vegetation, > etc., > > escape which would otherwise accumulate and poison the fish. > These > > floating heaters are not designed to heat the whole pond but just > to > > keep the ice clear immediately surrounding it. > Ray > > > \ > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> > wrote: > > > > > > They will not survive year round in what you describe. The koi > will > > need to be moved indoors. If you have a collection of _Aquarium > Fish > > Magazine_ issues, you can look back to find the articles by Steve > > Meyer about over wintering koi indoors. Basicly, he uses 2 x 4's > and > > 2 x 6's and plastic liners to create ponds in his basement, and > moves > > his koi into them for the winter months. Of course, he does not > have > > the problem of the disappearing pond as your sister-in-law does, > so > > his fish are a bit arder to corral to bring indoors. He provides > > filtration with a number of canister filters and larger Marineland > > HOT filters. > > > > > > Koi are also picky about temperatures. She will not be able to > > putthem out until the water temperature reaches at least 50^o F, > 55 > > is better, and she shoud bringthem in before the water temperature > > drops below that mark. The reason that koi have these "magic" > numbers > > is that when the temperature reaches that range, their digestion > > ceases. They may still eat, but they cannot digest the food, and > that > > can lead to problems later on as the food will have a tendency to > rot > > in their bellies while the temperature is low. > > > > > > \\Steve// > > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > ((((º> > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸ > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > ((((º> > > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14381	From: Leslie	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Firemouth died

The baby firemouth died this afternoon. His eyes had turned completely black which leads me to believe it was a parasite. I am furious with myself for not treating him for parasites. I saw that his eye had a black streak but didn't think much of it. OH!!!!!!!!!! Is this infectious? Do I need to treat the tank, which is already full of jungle fizz tabs but I can add the carbon back in the filter and get it out if needed. I'm starting to think I suck at this. I do need to know if this in infectious or not. Thanks, Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14382	From: Chris	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Re: hello, intro, and a ? about african knifefish

The first fish that came to mind was the butterfly fish: http://www.aquahobby.com/gallery/gpantodon.html Was this it? The Dragon Hunter <dragon.hunter@...> wrote: Dunno what kind it is Send instant messages to your online friends http://au.messenger.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14383	From: richard thompson	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Re: hello, intro, and a ? about african knifefish

it could be a dragon goby, they get up to about 12 inches or so Chris <youcantryreachingme@...> wrote:The first fish that came to mind was the butterfly fish: http://www.aquahobby.com/gallery/gpantodon.html Was this it? The Dragon Hunter <dragon.hunter@...> wrote: Dunno what kind it is Send instant messages to your online friends http://au.messenger.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14384	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Re: Firemouth died

Sorry to hear about the loss of the baby Firemouth. It is strange that his eye would turn completely black, but that doesn't necessarily indicate it was a parasite. Don't go blaming yourself, especially since this recent illness bout is not your fault. Sometimes these things are just beyond us. None of us like to loss a fish, yet we have all lost fish at one time or another. Some of the absolute best aquarists have confided in me that they've regretted letting this strain of Killiefish go, or that strain of Tetras go, when these fish possibly could have been saved but through inattention or lack of time, etc., the strain (variety) was lost. I am not at liberty to say who, but it shows things can happen to any of us, even the most experienced. This is not the first fish you lost and, not that we like to think of it but, it won't be the last. All's we can do is try, and maybe learn so that their death won't be in vain, as I'm sure you would like to continue keeping fish. I know what I would do with the 75, but I would need to know what fish are still in there (and how they look); and I know not everyone would agree with me. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > The baby firemouth died this afternoon. His eyes had turned completely > black which leads me to believe it was a parasite. I am furious with > myself for not treating him for parasites. I saw that his eye had a > black streak but didn't think much of it. OH!!!!!!!!!! > > Is this infectious? Do I need to treat the tank, which is already full > of jungle fizz tabs but I can add the carbon back in the filter and get > it out if needed. > I'm starting to think I suck at this. I do need to know if this in > infectious or not. > > Thanks, > Leslie > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14385	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Re: hello, intro, and a ? about african knifefish

Yes, they are gobi's! When we got ours home my hubby researched them online and was surprised to find that they are brackish. well our's acted like it was dying for about a week but now is doing great and is a porky dude!!! He scoops up the gravel in his mouth and gets food, or he goes to the tops and gobbles the tubifix worms!!! Sarah richard thompson <rapidostang@...> wrote: it could be a dragon goby, they get up to about 12 inches or so Chris <youcantryreachingme@...> wrote:The first fish that came to mind was the butterfly fish: http://www.aquahobby.com/gallery/gpantodon.html Was this it? The Dragon Hunter <dragon.hunter@...> wrote: Dunno what kind it is Send instant messages to your online friends http://au.messenger.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14386	From: Leslie	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Re: Firemouth died

Ray, you have me totally mystified. 1 large blood parrot, two pictus catfish (1 baby 1 adult), 1 adult firemouth, 1 baby albino rainbow shark, 1 black skirt tetra, 3 adult giant danios. My email amjmail@.... I still don't know, are parasites infectious? Leslie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 7:28 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Firemouth died Sorry to hear about the loss of the baby Firemouth. It is strange that his eye would turn completely black, but that doesn't necessarily indicate it was a parasite. Don't go blaming yourself, especially since this recent illness bout is not your fault. Sometimes these things are just beyond us. None of us like to loss a fish, yet we have all lost fish at one time or another. Some of the absolute best aquarists have confided in me that they've regretted letting this strain of Killiefish go, or that strain of Tetras go, when these fish possibly could have been saved but through inattention or lack of time, etc., the strain (variety) was lost. I am not at liberty to say who, but it shows things can happen to any of us, even the most experienced. This is not the first fish you lost and, not that we like to think of it but, it won't be the last. All's we can do is try, and maybe learn so that their death won't be in vain, as I'm sure you would like to continue keeping fish. I know what I would do with the 75, but I would need to know what fish are still in there (and how they look); and I know not everyone would agree with me. Ray

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14387	From: Leslie	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Re: Firemouth died

I forgot to add that all of the fish are doing well at this point. No discoloration, sluggish movements. All are their normal, hyper, hungry selves. And the catfishs' stomach has gone down again. Weird little thing. Leslie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 7:28 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Firemouth died Sorry to hear about the loss of the baby Firemouth. It is strange that his eye would turn completely black, but that doesn't necessarily indicate it was a parasite. Don't go blaming yourself, especially since this recent illness bout is not your fault. Sometimes these things are just beyond us. None of us like to loss a fish, yet we have all lost fish at one time or another. Some of the absolute best aquarists have confided in me that they've regretted letting this strain of Killiefish go, or that strain of Tetras go, when these fish possibly could have been saved but through inattention or lack of time, etc., the strain (variety) was lost. I am not at liberty to say who, but it shows things can happen to any of us, even the most experienced. This is not the first fish you lost and, not that we like to think of it but, it won't be the last. All's we can do is try, and maybe learn so that their death won't be in vain, as I'm sure you would like to continue keeping fish. I know what I would do with the 75, but I would need to know what fish are still in there (and how they look); and I know not everyone would agree with me. Ray \

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14388	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Re: hello, intro, and a ? about african knifefish

Do the dragonfish look anything like the fish here -- http://tinyurl.com/d6n53 ? If so, they are not freshwater fish. They are brackish to marine fish and should not be kept in freshwater. This may be why they are in such poor shape. They also feed minute creatures found in an on the mud of their home waters. They are, at least in some areas, considered to be an endangered species. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of The Dragon Hunter Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 10:15 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: hello, intro, and a ? about african knifefish Saw that Walmart had "dragonfish" for sale when I went to get more algae tabs. Dunno what kind it is but they all looked badly injured. Very long body, short head with fins and gills all right there. The paper they had on this fish said "great community fish, have singularly or many." It definitly looked very unique, but since I've never seen anything like it and as I said, they all appeared injured (around the gills and immediatly inder the fins was a dull pink. Belly was a pale white, top is brown. Looks kinda like a chinese dragon. I went looking online for it, but found nothing that matched what these looked like. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chris" <youcantryreachingme@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Monday, August 08, 2005 8:54 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: hello, intro, and a ? about african knifefish > spotted an African Knife. Does anyone know anything about these? I'm not sure what you mean by "needlefish" and "dragonfish" although the rest of the fish you describe are fairly gentle community fish - so I imagine these others are also. Here is a good summary page which shows some African Knives with goldfish and axolotyls (of all things!) - you can check that the fish you saw is the same as on the page and not some other knife fish by mistake. You'll see links (at right) to the Clown Knife and Ghost Knife also. It seems the most notable features are that during "bright-light" (day/lights-on) periods, this fish will probably prefer darker corners and/or caves in your tank. When the fish gets larger (up to 1') you might consider putting a weight on top of your lids as it can jump. Make sure too that the gap where your filtration/heater/airhose, etc, enters the tank, is not too big - put cling wrap over it if it is - as this is a compressed (thin) fish which might slip out that gap. Oh, the thing I find most interesting about this fish (and similar) is that it gives off electrical signals. I do believe some water-treatment plants use the electrical signals from knife fish as part of a quality assurnace program. I don't remember the details now, but I read about it in a book named "Fish and their behaviour" by Gunther K.H. Zupanc (1985) which I still have at home. Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14389	From: Chris	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Re: hello, intro, and a ? about african knifefish

Yes, gobies are interesting critters. Until this year I had hardly anything to do with them, but earlier in the year I collected some marine/fresh gobies (legally) and have been fascinated ever since. In my case a full grown fish is about 4cm (2"?). I joined a yahoo group named "gobygroup", where I've posted some photos under a directory in my yahoo name - if you're interested. I'd love to see some photos of the fish you've got if you find a link for some online. Chris. Sarah Fleming Davis <keelis_mom@...> wrote: Yes, they are gobi's! When we got ours home my hubby researched them online Send instant messages to your online friends http://au.messenger.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14390	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Re: Catfish Bloated Stomach

If it is a pictus cat, then it should have a relatively flat belly. The bloating you mention would mean that there is something amiss. It could just be air, since you noted earlier that he will feed from the surface, not usual behavior for these guys. The air will work its way through. If it was overeating, then you might notice some distension in the stomach area, but I would be, and I suspect that you would also be, hard pressed to call it bloating. I would suspect that it would be something to do with his diet. I believe, though you should look it up, that these guys are mainly carnivores, and that they will eat anything that can fit into their mouths. If you are tending to a high concentration of vegetable matter, this may be causing the bloating you see. You might want to try feeding something meatier to the pictus cat, and see if the bloating problem and rampant hunger remain. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Leslie Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 9:04 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Catfish Bloated Stomach I think it is called something like a pictus catfish? It's shiny silver with long "whiskers" and black spots all over. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of FortWayneFish@... Sent: Monday, August 08, 2005 10:43 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Catfish Bloated Stomach what kind of catfish? maybe full of eggs, maybe blocked intestine, maybe to much air in stomache from eating at surface... .. Very very hard to tell ... more details rob indiana In a message dated 8/8/2005 10:25:02 PM US Eastern Standard Time, steve@... writes: My catfish has a VERY bloated stomach. He had this once before but it went down while I was gone away. Now today his stomach is bloated and much worse. He looks like he could float, but he's not. I can't find anything on what this could be. I know he's hungry as he swims to the surface to eat and in fact gets most of the food before it begins to sink. Over fed catfish? Leslie Rob NE Indiana USA

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14391	From: Chris	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Re: Firemouth died

Another thing to note is that you shouldn't place too much weight on the appearance of a fish after it has died. It's general appearance (eg the eye colour in this case) can change very rapidly in just a few minutes. This can be for any number of reasons including that a disease-causing organism might now proliferate in the fish's carcass - but the same organism may not have been there at all prior to death, or even if it was, it might not have been a contributing factor. In addition, other fish may start to eat at the dead fish too. On the other question of parasites being infectious - yes, they can infect any number of fish in a tank. However, sometimes only one fish will fall prone to the parasite and it's because that fish was not well for some other reason. All the healthy fish may well avoid being hosts to the parasite because they are well. Chris. Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote: Sorry to hear about the loss of the baby Firemouth. It is strange that his eye would turn completely black, but that doesn't necessarily indicate it was a parasite. Send instant messages to your online friends http://au.messenger.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14392	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Re: Koi question

Ray, We may need to agree to disagree on this one. First, feeding. Koi should not be fed once the water temperature is below 50^oF. Doesn't matter what you are feeding, but if they are to be left outdoors over the winter season, they should stop being feed, because of the slowness of the digestion, whether it be their summer food, or a wheat germ based food. If one is to keep koi out of doors during the winter in areas where water will freeze, you need to have a pond volume and depth that will support the fish, even in a hibernation type mode, without the pond freezing over. As I recall (and I may be mistaken), your digs are in sunny California where you do not see the low temperatures that Rebecca and Steve Meyer will see. Where Steve lives, the desired depth to over winter fish is between 3 and 4 feet. In Steve's case, the geology generally prohibits one from digging a pond that deep without calling in heavy equipment or having to blast ledge. Even for those who have the volume and depth for their fish, the wise course of action my be to bring them in over the winter. A 1500 watt ring may not be enough to keep the ice open across its diameter. When fish are over wintered out of doors, you will always lose fish due to the temperature, due to the chemistry of the water over the course of the winter, etc. If you bring them indoors, sure, you do risk something in the moving of them from pond to basement or garage, but you do not lose fish as you would in the pond. In an area where the water doesn't freeze, it is a whole different story. However, my experiences do mimic Steve Meyer's experiences and I am firmly in the fish indoors over the winter camp. If I lived in Florida, say, I may be singing a different tune. But, even where I am now, in Virginia, I'd not want the fish outdoors in the winter. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 9:36 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Koi question Steve, Have been meaning to get back to you on this so that readers will not get the wrong impression. As such, I'm taking this opportunity before I let it slide again. First of all, Koi are normally kept in their ponds year 'round, even in the dead of Winter in cold climates where ponds freeze over, as there is absolutely no reason to bring them indoors. Some hobbyists such as Steve Meyer may choose to bring their fish inside, just as some goldfish fanciers do with their hardy pool Comets, but its entirely unnecessary, as both will survive the Winter under the ice. I realize successful Koi keepers with established ponds already know this, but am advising the members on this Forum who may be thinking about keeping Koi so as not to have them discouraged by this un-needed chore of netting their fish in the Fall to bring into a basement pond. It is only under circumstances such as Rebecca describes that the Koi would have to be moved, where the fluctuating water requires them to be moved for lack of sufficient water, as I trust you are referring to. \ As Koi can and do Winter-over under the ice, they're obviously not picky about temperatures. The only reason why one might wait for their pond water to get to 55 o F, is if you already had your fish indoors (for whatever reason) and were transferring them to the pond - - you want to avoid any extremes of temperature difference, just as with tropical fish. Otherwise there's no need to be concerned with their water temperature. True enough, as with all fish (and other cold-blooded animals), their metabolism slows as the temperature decreases, resulting in slowed digestion. They will continue to eat (as they have an appetite) down to 43 o, but if fed normal "Summer Formula" foods they will not be able to digest it and yes it can rot in their bellies. Under no circumstances should Koi be fed regular formula pellet/stick foods in water temperatures lower than 60 o. Koi definitely need to continue to be fed as the water temperature drops to keep them healthy over the Winter when they do not eat, albeit, less quantity and less frequently as the temperature drops. This is why Spring and Fall formulas of pellet and stick Koi foods are marketed, containing mostly easily digestible (especially in cold weather) Wheat Germ which they can assimilate with no problems. Below approximately 43 o cease feeding them as they will no longer be interested in eating. As they again begin to stir in the Spring, Wheat Germ foods (only) should be fed until the pond temperature again reaches 60 o. While the fish are under the ice, a small pond heater is required to keep an open hole in the ice, to let any noxious gases (methane and hydrogen) from rotting vegetation, etc., escape which would otherwise accumulate and poison the fish. These floating heaters are not designed to heat the whole pond but just to keep the ice clear immediately surrounding it. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > > They will not survive year round in what you describe. The koi will need to be moved indoors. If you have a collection of _Aquarium Fish Magazine_ issues, you can look back to find the articles by Steve Meyer about over wintering koi indoors. Basicly, he uses 2 x 4's and 2 x 6's and plastic liners to create ponds in his basement, and moves his koi into them for the winter months. Of course, he does not have the problem of the disappearing pond as your sister-in-law does, so his fish are a bit arder to corral to bring indoors. He provides filtration with a number of canister filters and larger Marineland HOT filters. > > Koi are also picky about temperatures. She will not be able to putthem out until the water temperature reaches at least 50^o F, 55 is better, and she shoud bringthem in before the water temperature drops below that mark. The reason that koi have these "magic" numbers is that when the temperature reaches that range, their digestion ceases. They may still eat, but they cannot digest the food, and that can lead to problems later on as the food will have a tendency to rot in their bellies while the temperature is low. > > \\Steve//

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14393	From: Amalthea	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Re: Koi question

I live on Long Island in New York and we get bitterly cold winters. Two years ago when the temperatures hung at around 2 degrees fahrenheit, we had a 2.5' deep pond with a floating pond heater and had no problems at all with the fish. Last year we had a slightly warmer winter (a few weeks of about ten degrees) and a slightly larger pond (800 gallons and about 3.5 feet deep) and again, the fish were fine with just the floating heater. I think both koi and comets are a little more hardy than people give them credit for. Oh, and we don't feed them once the temp gets below 50 degrees in the water, however we make sure they're good and fat before then. Amalthea http://www.amaltheasattic.com Your Alternative to the Alternative.... On Aug 9, 2005, at 10:52 PM, Steve Szabo wrote: > Ray, > > We may need to agree to disagree on this one. First, feeding. Koi > should not > be fed once the water temperature is below 50^oF. Doesn't matter > what you > are feeding, but if they are to be left outdoors over the winter > season, > they should stop being feed, because of the slowness of the digestion, > whether it be their summer food, or a wheat germ based food. > > If one is to keep koi out of doors during the winter in areas where > water > will freeze, you need to have a pond volume and depth that will > support the > fish, even in a hibernation type mode, without the pond freezing > over. As I > recall (and I may be mistaken), your digs are in sunny California > where you > do not see the low temperatures that Rebecca and Steve Meyer will > see. Where > Steve lives, the desired depth to over winter fish is between 3 and > 4 feet. > In Steve's case, the geology generally prohibits one from digging a > pond > that deep without calling in heavy equipment or having to blast > ledge. Even > for those who have the volume and depth for their fish, the wise > course of > action my be to bring them in over the winter. A 1500 watt ring may > not be > enough to keep the ice open across its diameter. > > When fish are over wintered out of doors, you will always lose fish > due to > the temperature, due to the chemistry of the water over the course > of the > winter, etc. If you bring them indoors, sure, you do risk something > in the > moving of them from pond to basement or garage, but you do not lose > fish as > you would in the pond. In an area where the water doesn't freeze, > it is a > whole different story. However, my experiences do mimic Steve Meyer's > experiences and I am firmly in the fish indoors over the winter > camp. If I > lived in Florida, say, I may be singing a different tune. But, even > where I > am now, in Virginia, I'd not want the fish outdoors in the winter. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 9:36 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Koi question > > Steve, Have been meaning to get back to you on this so that readers > will not get the wrong impression. As such, I'm taking this > opportunity before I let it slide again. First of all, Koi are > normally kept in their ponds year 'round, even in the dead of Winter > in cold climates where ponds freeze over, as there is absolutely no > reason to bring them indoors. Some hobbyists such as Steve Meyer may > choose to bring their fish inside, just as some goldfish fanciers do > with their hardy pool Comets, but its entirely unnecessary, as both > will survive the Winter under the ice. I realize successful Koi > keepers with established ponds already know this, but am advising the > members on this Forum who may be thinking about keeping Koi so as not > to have them discouraged by this un-needed chore of netting their > fish in the Fall to bring into a basement pond. It is only under > circumstances such as Rebecca describes that the Koi would have to be > moved, where the fluctuating water requires them to be moved for lack > of sufficient water, as I trust you are referring to. > \ > As Koi can and do Winter-over under the ice, they're obviously not > picky about temperatures. The only reason why one might wait for > their pond water to get to 55 o F, is if you already had your fish > indoors (for whatever reason) and were transferring them to the pond - > - you want to avoid any extremes of temperature difference, just as > with tropical fish. Otherwise there's no need to be concerned with > their water temperature. True enough, as with all fish (and other > cold-blooded animals), their metabolism slows as the temperature > decreases, resulting in slowed digestion. They will continue to eat > (as they have an appetite) down to 43 o, but if fed normal "Summer > Formula" foods they will not be able to digest it and yes it can rot > in their bellies. Under no circumstances should Koi be fed regular > formula pellet/stick foods in water temperatures lower than 60 o. > Koi definitely need to continue to be fed as the water temperature > drops to keep them healthy over the Winter when they do not eat, > albeit, less quantity and less frequently as the temperature drops. > This is why Spring and Fall formulas of pellet and stick Koi foods > are marketed, containing mostly easily digestible (especially in cold > weather) Wheat Germ which they can assimilate with no problems. > Below approximately 43 o cease feeding them as they will no longer be > interested in eating. As they again begin to stir in the Spring, > Wheat Germ foods (only) should be fed until the pond temperature > again reaches 60 o. While the fish are under the ice, a small pond > heater is required to keep an open hole in the ice, to let any > noxious gases (methane and hydrogen) from rotting vegetation, etc., > escape which would otherwise accumulate and poison the fish. These > floating heaters are not designed to heat the whole pond but just to > keep the ice clear immediately surrounding it. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > > > > They will not survive year round in what you describe. The koi will > need to be moved indoors. If you have a collection of _Aquarium Fish > Magazine_ issues, you can look back to find the articles by Steve > Meyer about over wintering koi indoors. Basicly, he uses 2 x 4's and > 2 x 6's and plastic liners to create ponds in his basement, and moves > his koi into them for the winter months. Of course, he does not have > the problem of the disappearing pond as your sister-in-law does, so > his fish are a bit arder to corral to bring indoors. He provides > filtration with a number of canister filters and larger Marineland > HOT filters. > > > > Koi are also picky about temperatures. She will not be able to > putthem out until the water temperature reaches at least 50^o F, 55 > is better, and she shoud bringthem in before the water temperature > drops below that mark. The reason that koi have these "magic" numbers > is that when the temperature reaches that range, their digestion > ceases. They may still eat, but they cannot digest the food, and that > can lead to problems later on as the food will have a tendency to rot > in their bellies while the temperature is low. > > > > \\Steve// > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><· > ´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine biology Biology > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14394	From: Chris	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: Re: heater question

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, FortWayneFish@a... wrote: But both smaller heaters in my opinion are better > then one Large heater. and one reason why two is better than one is because if one fails, your fish have a chance to congregate around the remaining heater while you notice the temperature has dropped. It might not keep the tank up to temperature for a long time, but it at least gives you a chance. Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14395	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 8/9/2005
Subject: High level of Phosphate in my water

Hi, I have a Hagen test kit which says under 1 ppm is ok (as far as I can recall) and the test measurement should be taken after 2 minutes of reaction and it has a high level of 5ppm. I'm getting a high reading of Phosphate in my water. When I test my water I get more than 5ppm in just 30 seconds which to me indicates a problem. My fish tank is suffering from algae which sticks on the glass and also makes the water a slight green / yellow colour. My question is simple but I can't find many alternatives, how do I reduce the phosphate? I've got lots of live plants, I've tried underfeeding my fish for a week, I've tried replacing water very regularly (more than 90% for a couple of weeks/water changes) - my tap water by the way has 0.5ppm Phosphate after a reaction time of 2 minutes. _Are there any alternatives? _ =Nick [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14396	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: High level of Phosphate in my water

Nick, Apart from water changes, Rowaphos is the only solution. In a planted tank, this can create another problem by stripping the phosphates off the plants as well but it does good work in controlling phosphates. Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nicolas Munro Sent: 10 August 2005 04:46 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] High level of Phosphate in my water Hi, I have a Hagen test kit which says under 1 ppm is ok (as far as I can recall) and the test measurement should be taken after 2 minutes of reaction and it has a high level of 5ppm. I'm getting a high reading of Phosphate in my water. When I test my water I get more than 5ppm in just 30 seconds which to me indicates a problem. My fish tank is suffering from algae which sticks on the glass and also makes the water a slight green / yellow colour. My question is simple but I can't find many alternatives, how do I reduce the phosphate? I've got lots of live plants, I've tried underfeeding my fish for a week, I've tried replacing water very regularly (more than 90% for a couple of weeks/water changes) - my tap water by the way has 0.5ppm Phosphate after a reaction time of 2 minutes. _Are there any alternatives? _ =Nick [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14397	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: Koi question

Steve, Regret you feel the need to disagree, but everyboby's entitled to their own opinions. Hope you've had at least some personal experience with Koi. First, on the Autumn feeding and water temperature; it does matter what you feed them in the Fall (a good quality wheat-germ based food only), which as per the generally recommended consensus is until the water reaches a low temperature of 7 o C to 8 o C (43 o F to 46 o F). I, too, have seen many erroneous recommendations stating 50 o F as the lowest temperature for feeding, also noting a few stating 53 o F as the lowest, with feeding Cheerio's (sounding possibly antiquated) and another couple of recommendations saying 40 o F (Wrong-O). With good, proper vegative- based Fall foods (ShoKoi, Hikari, Tetra, etc.), its perfectly safe (& recommended) to feed them down to the temperature I stated, as you want your fish to winter over in prime condition. I did include in my last post that the Koi are only to be fed once every 3 days at these lower temperatures, again because of the slowness of their digestion, which I too mentioned. \ On pond volumn and depth, it is assumed that Rebecca's sister-in law is going to enlarge her pond enough to support her fish as is her latest plan, if that's what you're referring to. Otherwise, that's a prerequisite of course for any Koi pond -- to have it large enough to support the fish (just as with an aquarium)-- that's especially essential which higher temperatures of Summer when there's less oxygen available. I believe I already recommended a minimum depth of 3' to winter fish over in harsher latitudes (and elevations), which also affords the fish some protection from predators year 'round. Incidentally, my digs are in northern New Jersey where the ice can easily get 6" to 8" thick. I'm not in sunny California if that is what your thinking, and while most of my hundreds of pond customers (of Tricker's Water Gardens -- now renamed Waterford Gardens, which I manage) are spread across the country, including California, I'd have to say most of them are here in the cold Northeast, with some of them a lot further north up into New York State, and New England (where the ice might get much thicker). \ I did not get a chance to look for Steve Meyer's article and you did not previously mention that the reason he takes his fish indoors is because he can't excavate a deep enough outdoor pond, not because its too cold to keep Koi outdoors otherwise in his climate. There are ways around that; while I don't recommend a partially above ground pond in that climate, to increase depth, many water gardeners in that situation elevate their property (with added soil) in the vicinity of their planned pond to enable them to have a completely sunken pond of their desired depth. I've seen a few done and it works out nice. \ None of my hundreds of customers bring their fish in for the Winter, as its just not necessary, but you can do what you want. As you're in Virginia, I urge you to check with Mr. Charles Thomas, owner of LiliPons Water Gardens (in Maryland) or his Director of Operations, Rich Koogle. My customers have very few, if any loses, and those that are lost are generally do to malfunctions, such as their power going out during a storm and they have no back-up method of keeping the very important ventilation hole open or, with ill-planned waterfalls, these falls partially freeze over and keeps diverting water to the side -- out of the pond. The 1500 watt (and/or 1250 watt) Farm Innovators (brand name) "Ice-Chaser" Pond De-Icers have been used for many years, with improvements being made, and are about the most reliable heaters you can buy (for around $55). They'll keep an open hole in the ice most anywhere, except maybe in Alaska, but certainly should be fine in Virginia. As for the water chemistry -- you need to do normal maintenance all season long anyway, and as Fall approaches, you need to make sure the pond bottom is clean. Additionally, you need to put leaf netting over the pond during autumn leaf-falling season to prevent the leaves from falling in and decaying over the Winter. Oak leaves are worse yet, as they'll tend to turn the water acid if there's a lot of them. However, normally there is no reason for the chemistry to change. For one thing, the colder the water is, the slower any naturally occurring change in water chemistry will take place. Guess it can't hurt to play it safe, and I understand where you're coming from, but they will survive outdoors. Perhaps the best of both worlds might be with having the outdoor pond near the garage with a sluiceway leading through the garage wall into an indoor pond. No need for any netting of them. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > Ray, > > We may need to agree to disagree on this one. First, feeding. Koi should not > be fed once the water temperature is below 50^oF. Doesn't matter what you > are feeding, but if they are to be left outdoors over the winter season, > they should stop being feed, because of the slowness of the digestion, > whether it be their summer food, or a wheat germ based food. > > If one is to keep koi out of doors during the winter in areas where water > will freeze, you need to have a pond volume and depth that will support the > fish, even in a hibernation type mode, without the pond freezing over. As I > recall (and I may be mistaken), your digs are in sunny California where you > do not see the low temperatures that Rebecca and Steve Meyer will see. Where > Steve lives, the desired depth to over winter fish is between 3 and 4 feet. > In Steve's case, the geology generally prohibits one from digging a pond > that deep without calling in heavy equipment or having to blast ledge. Even > for those who have the volume and depth for their fish, the wise course of > action my be to bring them in over the winter. A 1500 watt ring may not be > enough to keep the ice open across its diameter. > > When fish are over wintered out of doors, you will always lose fish due to > the temperature, due to the chemistry of the water over the course of the > winter, etc. If you bring them indoors, sure, you do risk something in the > moving of them from pond to basement or garage, but you do not lose fish as > you would in the pond. In an area where the water doesn't freeze, it is a > whole different story. However, my experiences do mimic Steve Meyer's > experiences and I am firmly in the fish indoors over the winter camp. If I > lived in Florida, say, I may be singing a different tune. But, even where I > am now, in Virginia, I'd not want the fish outdoors in the winter. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 9:36 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Koi question > > Steve, First of all, Koi are > normally kept in their ponds year 'round, even in the dead of Winter > in cold climates where ponds freeze over, as there is absolutely no > reason to bring them indoors. Some hobbyists such as Steve Meyer may > choose to bring their fish inside, just as some goldfish fanciers do > with their hardy pool Comets, but its entirely unnecessary, as both > will survive the Winter under the ice. I realize successful Koi > keepers with established ponds already know this, but am advising the > members on this Forum who may be thinking about keeping Koi so as not > to have them discouraged by this un-needed chore of netting their > fish in the Fall to bring into a basement pond. It is only under > circumstances such as Rebecca describes that the Koi would have to be > moved, where the fluctuating water requires them to be moved for lack > of sufficient water, as I trust you are referring to. > \ > As Koi can and do Winter-over under the ice, they're obviously not > picky about temperatures. The only reason why one might wait for > their pond water to get to 55 o F, is if you already had your fish > indoors (for whatever reason) and were transferring them to the pond - > - you want to avoid any extremes of temperature difference, just as > with tropical fish. Otherwise there's no need to be concerned with > their water temperature. True enough, as with all fish (and other > cold-blooded animals), their metabolism slows as the temperature > decreases, resulting in slowed digestion. They will continue to eat > (as they have an appetite) down to 43 o, but if fed normal "Summer > Formula" foods they will not be able to digest it and yes it can rot > in their bellies. Under no circumstances should Koi be fed regular > formula pellet/stick foods in water temperatures lower than 60 o. > Koi definitely need to continue to be fed as the water temperature > drops to keep them healthy over the Winter when they do not eat, > albeit, less quantity and less frequently as the temperature drops. > This is why Spring and Fall formulas of pellet and stick Koi foods > are marketed, containing mostly easily digestible (especially in cold > weather) Wheat Germ which they can assimilate with no problems. > Below approximately 43 o cease feeding them as they will no longer be > interested in eating. As they again begin to stir in the Spring, > Wheat Germ foods (only) should be fed until the pond temperature > again reaches 60 o. While the fish are under the ice, a small pond > heater is required to keep an open hole in the ice, to let any > noxious gases (methane and hydrogen) from rotting vegetation, etc., > escape which would otherwise accumulate and poison the fish. These > floating heaters are not designed to heat the whole pond but just to > keep the ice clear immediately surrounding it. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > > > > They will not survive year round in what you describe. > > > > Koi are also picky about temperatures. She will not be able to > putthem out until the water temperature reaches at least 50^o F, 55 > is better, and she shoud bringthem in before the water temperature > drops below that mark. The reason that koi have these "magic" numbers > is that when the temperature reaches that range, their digestion > ceases. They may still eat, but they cannot digest the food, and that > can lead to problems later on as the food will have a tendency to rot > in their bellies while the temperature is low. > > > > \\Steve//

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14398	From: deborahgd14	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Angie the Angel fish

Hello Everyone: My angel is acting really strange. She didn't eat today and either hangs out at the top corner or on the bottom. What do you think I should do? A salt bath? And what would that consist of. I don't want to stress her out any more than she is. She freaks out when the fish net goes in the tank as it is. Thanks. Deborah D

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14399	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: Firemouth died

Thanks for filling me in on the fish that are in there and their appearance. I presume though, that the large B R Parrot and firemouth are still in the 15, not the 75. From what you're saying it looks like things are finally settling down -- no more illnesses and stuff. As to your question whether parasites are contagious; some are and some aren't -- some have several hosts which may or may not be aquatic and only infect a select fish, whereby it is not transferable but has to cycle to the next host (not a fish) to complete it life cycle. On the otherhand, yes some are "contagious", although I do not feel at all that its what the baby Firemouth had. I guess my having you "mystified" is due to my vague reply which depended on knowing more about your fish. Truth is, if more of your fish were starting to have problems, on top of your catfish's "bloated" stomach (fortunately OK now), I would seriously consider transferring all the remaining fish into a slightly crowded 15 and dose the 75 with a cup of Clorox, after first removing the gravel to buckets and doing the same thing, while letting all filters run (with Chlorox solution running though them). This of course would require cycling the tank all, over again, after rinsing everything out thoroughly. This does sound extreme and would be only a last resort, but it was almost beginning to look to me as the only course of action. I still believe the uncleaned chemical filter transferred a bad lot of latent bacteria to the 75 which adversely affected your fish and that it, along with the overall condition of the tank and gravel, was the main culprit. As its now turning out there's no need to go through that, but that would have been my next recommendation if these mysterious illnesses continued, as controversial as it may sound. Any fish you took out of the 75 and put in the 15 perked up almost at once from what I gather you've said, telling me that they in no way liked the water in the 75. Glad to hear things are so much better. I would still suggest doing several smaller water changes in the very near future. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > I forgot to add that all of the fish are doing well at this point. No > discoloration, sluggish movements. All are their normal, hyper, hungry > selves. And the catfishs' stomach has gone down again. Weird little > thing. > Leslie > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 7:28 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Firemouth died > > Sorry to hear about the loss of the baby Firemouth. It is strange that > his eye would turn completely black, but that doesn't necessarily > indicate it was a parasite. Don't go blaming yourself, especially > since this recent illness bout is not your fault. Sometimes these > things are just beyond us. None of us like to loss a fish, yet we have > all lost fish at one time or another. Some of the absolute best > aquarists have confided in me that they've regretted letting this > strain of Killiefish go, or that strain of Tetras go, when these fish > possibly could have been saved but through inattention or lack of time, > etc., the strain (variety) was lost. I am not at liberty to say who, > but it shows things can happen to any of us, even the most > experienced. This is not the first fish you lost and, not that we like > to think of it but, it won't be the last. All's we can do is try, and > maybe learn so that their death won't be in vain, as I'm sure you would > like to continue keeping fish. I know what I would do with the 75, but > I would need to know what fish are still in there (and how they look); > and I know not everyone would agree with me. Ray > \

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14400	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: Angie the Angel fish

Deborah, You haven't mentioned what temperature you keep your fish at, nor did you let us know what the water parameters (pH, ammonia, nitrites. etc.) are. Anyway, this sounds like Hexamita, an internal disease which Angels are quite susceptible to. Isolate the fish if possible for ease of treatment. If you can't you'll have to treat the whole tank. Do a partial (1/3) water change and raise the temperature to 82 o. Treat with Metronidazole, by Seachem (Aquarium Pharmaceuticals used to have it, in capsule form, if you can still find it). Metronidazole is not readily diluted in water, so use a small quantity of hot (not boiling) water. As Metronidazole is not as readily absorbed through the fish's tissue as is Kanamycin, it helps to add this medication as well. Read the directions, you'll need to repeat this every 2 days, and remove carbon from the filter. Sometimes the fish do not respond to treatment -- in which case you can try Clout as a last resort. Seems the less an Angelfish's tank water is changed, the more possible it is that they'll sooner or later get this disease. For absolute best maintenance of Angels, they should receive a partial water change every 2 days, even though that sounds extreme. If not feasible in your circumstances, then at least once a week. Ray \ -- - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "deborahgd14" <deborahgd14@y...> wrote: > Hello Everyone: My angel is acting really strange. She didn't eat > today and either hangs out at the top corner or on the bottom. What > do you think I should do? A salt bath? And > what would that consist of. I don't want to stress her out any more > than she is. She freaks out when the fish net goes in the tank as it > is. Thanks. Deborah D

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14401	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: heater question

While to some extent what you're saying is true (although this is not the main purpose), even though with a filter and/or airstone the circulation will not require the fish to congregate around the remaining heater. At least the temperature will be tolerable and within range, while being somewhat lower. The main purpose of two smaller separate heaters though, is to prevent any single heater from overheating the tank due to a stuck thermostat. With two (smaller) heaters, if a thermostat sticks on, a smaller heater does not have the capacity to overheat the tank, and as the temperature may be somewhat higher than normal, the second heater will never kick in, with the temperature being above its setting. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Chris" <youcantryreachingme@y...> wrote: > > and one reason why two is better than one is because if one fails, your > fish have a chance to congregate around the remaining heater while you > notice the temperature has dropped. It might not keep the tank up to > temperature for a long time, but it at least gives you a chance. > > Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14402	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: Angie the Angel fish

Addition to Post: Sorry, I meant to say Aquatronics (not Aquarium Pharmaceuticals) as a possible second source of Metronidazole if you can find it -- I believe they have gone out out business. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > Deborah, You haven't mentioned what temperature you keep your fish at, > nor did you let us know what the water parameters (pH, ammonia, > nitrites. etc.) are. Anyway, this sounds like Hexamita, an internal > disease which Angels are quite susceptible to. Isolate the fish if > possible for ease of treatment. If you can't you'll have to treat the > whole tank. Do a partial (1/3) water change and raise the temperature > to 82 o. Treat with Metronidazole, by Seachem (Aquarium Pharmaceuticals > used to have it, in capsule form, if you can still find it). > Metronidazole is not readily diluted in water, so use a small quantity > of hot (not boiling) water. As Metronidazole is not as readily > absorbed through the fish's tissue as is Kanamycin, it helps to add > this medication as well. Read the directions, you'll need to repeat > this every 2 days, and remove carbon from the filter. Sometimes the > fish do not respond to treatment -- in which case you can try Clout as > a last resort. Seems the less an Angelfish's tank water is changed, > the more possible it is that they'll sooner or later get this disease. > For absolute best maintenance of Angels, they should receive a partial > water change every 2 days, even though that sounds extreme. If not > feasible in your circumstances, then at least once a week. Ray > \ -- > - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "deborahgd14" <deborahgd14@y...> > wrote: > > Hello Everyone: My angel is acting really strange. She didn't eat > > today and either hangs out at the top corner or on the bottom. What > > do you think I should do? A salt bath? And > > what would that consist of. I don't want to stress her out any more > > than she is. She freaks out when the fish net goes in the tank as it > > is. Thanks. Deborah D

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14403	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: Angie the Angel fish

Addition to Post: Sorry, I meant to say Aquatronics (not Aquarium Pharmaceuticals) as a possible second source of Metronidazole if you can find it -- I believe they have gone out out business. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > Deborah, You haven't mentioned what temperature you keep your fish at, > nor did you let us know what the water parameters (pH, ammonia, > nitrites. etc.) are. Anyway, this sounds like Hexamita, an internal > disease which Angels are quite susceptible to. Isolate the fish if > possible for ease of treatment. If you can't you'll have to treat the > whole tank. Do a partial (1/3) water change and raise the temperature > to 82 o. Treat with Metronidazole, by Seachem (Aquarium Pharmaceuticals > used to have it, in capsule form, if you can still find it). > Metronidazole is not readily diluted in water, so use a small quantity > of hot (not boiling) water. As Metronidazole is not as readily > absorbed through the fish's tissue as is Kanamycin, it helps to add > this medication as well. Read the directions, you'll need to repeat > this every 2 days, and remove carbon from the filter. Sometimes the > fish do not respond to treatment -- in which case you can try Clout as > a last resort. Seems the less an Angelfish's tank water is changed, > the more possible it is that they'll sooner or later get this disease. > For absolute best maintenance of Angels, they should receive a partial > water change every 2 days, even though that sounds extreme. If not > feasible in your circumstances, then at least once a week. Ray > \ -- > - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "deborahgd14" <deborahgd14@y...> > wrote: > > Hello Everyone: My angel is acting really strange. She didn't eat > > today and either hangs out at the top corner or on the bottom. What > > do you think I should do? A salt bath? And > > what would that consist of. I don't want to stress her out any more > > than she is. She freaks out when the fish net goes in the tank as it > > is. Thanks. Deborah D

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14404	From: T	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Need Help Fast...Sick Betta...think it is VELVET

I gave a Male Betta in a 3 gal tank. I have had this Betta for almost 3 years. He is the fish that got me into all this and later inspired my other Tanks. It looks like he has come down with this in the last 48 hrs or so.He has all the signs and I did a little research and will be getting VELVET GAURD from Jumgle products this afternoon. I put salt in the tank as instructed untill I get some cure. Is there anything else I can do?? I cant lose this Fish. - Ter

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14405	From: DB1RDMAN@WMCONNECT.COM	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Digest Number 923 - ICE ON THE POND

In a message dated 8/10/2005 9:43:11 AM Eastern Daylight Time, AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com writes: > Be sure she does not manually break the ice by hitting it or banging > on it. The vibrations from this can damage or kill the fish! The only > way to keep it open is with a floating heater (cheap and well worth > the investment) or by pouring hot water on a section of the ice. A > bubbler can also keep the ice open except during snow storms, etc. > Amalthea > HHHHHMMMMM - I used to keep mine open in winter by floating a tire inner tube on the pond. The black rubber would absorb heat and melt the ice around the tube. I've also used a "bubbler" - aui stone to keep the ice off the pond. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14406	From: tws812003	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Discus for sale

Has anyone wanted to buy discus here??

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14407	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: Discus for sale

yes _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of tws812003 Sent: 10 August 2005 16:20 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Discus for sale Has anyone wanted to buy discus here?? ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14408	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: Discus for sale

I WANT DISCUS!!! whats the prices? and do you have pix tws812003 <tws812003@...> wrote:Has anyone wanted to buy discus here?? ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14409	From: Andrea	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: Need Help Fast...Sick Betta...think it is VELVET

If it's velvet it is very contagious and sometimes related to poor water conditions. Disinfect any nets etc that you have used in that tank or don't use them in any other tanks. Since it is a parasite that requires light, dim the lighting around the tank (or use something like pieces of paper to block light entering the tank) and raise the water temperature to 82'F (the parasite doesn't do well with warmer water). Treatment of choice is copper sulfate and if you have a filter on the tank, remove the carbon portion while treating the tank. Salt is always good - I keep salt in all my betta tanks as a routine thing and have had very little incidence of disease. I also try to keep their tanks fairly clean, removing any old food or waste every couple of days so the water quality remains good. At least a 50% water change is done weekly. I usually aerate my tanks (even the small 2 gallon ones) with an airstone as this seems to maintain the water quality better than a still tank (and the bettas like to play in the bubbles :) ) I have some old timers like yours (3 yrs or older) that I hope to keep for a long while yet - they have such personality! Good luck with your betta guy - hopefully this will help and he will make a good recovery. Andrea & the Senior Guys - Blackie (3.5 yrs old - nearly black) and Remington (3 yrs old - steel blue) --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "T" <bigter4@y...> wrote: > I gave a Male Betta in a 3 gal tank. I have had this Betta for almost 3 > years. He is the fish that got me into all this and later inspired my > other Tanks. It looks like he has come down with this in the last 48 > hrs or so.He has all the signs and I did a little research and will be > getting VELVET GAURD from Jumgle products this afternoon. I put salt in > the tank as instructed untill I get some cure. Is there anything else I > can do?? I cant lose this Fish. - Ter

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14410	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: High level of Phosphate in my water

i use something called phosx or something like that on my sw tank, which works really well. there's also phos ban which i've also heard works well. i don't know how long, if at all, you leave your lights on, but i've found that by leaving my lights off for most of the day lessens the algae. hope this helps. --- Nicolas Munro <nmunro@...> wrote: > Hi, > > I have a Hagen test kit which says under 1 ppm is ok (as far as I can > recall) and the test measurement should be taken after 2 minutes of > reaction and it has a high level of 5ppm. > > I'm getting a high reading of Phosphate in my water. When I test my > water I get more than 5ppm in just 30 seconds which to me indicates a > problem. > > My fish tank is suffering from algae which sticks on the glass and also > makes the water a slight green / yellow colour. > > > > My question is simple but I can't find many alternatives, how do I > reduce the phosphate? > > I've got lots of live plants, I've tried underfeeding my fish for a > week, I've tried replacing water very regularly (more than 90% for a > couple of weeks/water changes) - my tap water by the way has 0.5ppm > Phosphate after a reaction time of 2 minutes. > > _Are there any alternatives? _ > > =Nick > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14411	From: T	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: Need Help Fast...Sick Betta...think it is VELVET

Hello Andrea, Thx for the Tips. I will be getting him in a sick "bowl" as soon as I get home. I have the medication and I will look into the Airstone for him. I never bothered cause the tank is so small but it is a really good idea after what has happened.I hope I catch this in the early stages. I will have to do good cleaning of the grvel for excess food ect.. thx -Ter > If it's velvet it is very contagious and sometimes related to poor > water conditions. Disinfect any nets etc that you have used in that > tank or don't use them in any other tanks. Since it is a parasite > that requires light, dim the lighting around the tank (or use > something like pieces of paper to block light entering the tank) and > raise the water temperature to 82'F (the parasite doesn't do well with > warmer water). Treatment of choice is copper sulfate and if you have > a filter on the tank, remove the carbon portion while treating the > tank. Salt is always good - I keep salt in all my betta tanks as a > routine thing and have had very little incidence of disease. I also > try to keep their tanks fairly clean, removing any old food or waste > every couple of days so the water quality remains good. At least a > 50% water change is done weekly. I usually aerate my tanks (even the > small 2 gallon ones) with an airstone as this seems to maintain the > water quality better than a still tank (and the bettas like to play in > the bubbles :) ) > I have some old timers like yours (3 yrs or older) that I hope to keep > for a long while yet - they have such personality! > Good luck with your betta guy - hopefully this will help and he will > make a good recovery. > > Andrea & the Senior Guys - Blackie (3.5 yrs old - nearly black) and > Remington (3 yrs old - steel blue) > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "T" <bigter4@y...> wrote: > > I gave a Male Betta in a 3 gal tank. I have had this Betta for > almost 3 > > years. He is the fish that got me into all this and later inspired > my > > other Tanks. It looks like he has come down with this in the last 48 > > hrs or so.He has all the signs and I did a little research and will > be > > getting VELVET GAURD from Jumgle products this afternoon. I put salt > in > > the tank as instructed untill I get some cure. Is there anything > else I > > can do?? I cant lose this Fish. - Ter

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14412	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: ? about african knifefish/Chris

Thanks for the info Chris! The needlefish is actually a needle nosed gar, does that sound familiar at all? They are jumpers so we've already made sure the tank is good and sealed up! Unfortunately the african knife has cloudy eye or something so the whole tank is marked "do not sell" until they're better :( Sarah Chris <youcantryreachingme@...> wrote: > spotted an African Knife. Does anyone know anything about these? I'm not sure what you mean by "needlefish" and "dragonfish" although the rest of the fish you describe are fairly gentle community fish - so I imagine these others are also. --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14413	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Another stocking question

Thank you all for your posts to my many questions :) I have yet another one :) In a 37 gallon tall tank with 3 otos, 1 bristlenose, 3 zebra loaches and guppies, do you think I could put in a SAE? I read to have them singly or in a group of 5. I think they are too big for me to have 5 so I was thinking one. Is it too big for my tank? I am not familiar with these fish at all, any info is welcomed. Thanks, again and again and again :) Rebecca

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14414	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: Another stocking question

ONE IS FINE BUT THEY WILL FIGHT WITH EACH OTHER SO KEEP ONLY ONE, THE CHINEASE ALGEA EATERS YOU CAN HAVE MULTIPLE BUT THE SIAMESE WILL FIGHT.... thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@...> wrote:Thank you all for your posts to my many questions :) I have yet another one :) In a 37 gallon tall tank with 3 otos, 1 bristlenose, 3 zebra loaches and guppies, do you think I could put in a SAE? I read to have them singly or in a group of 5. I think they are too big for me to have 5 so I was thinking one. Is it too big for my tank? I am not familiar with these fish at all, any info is welcomed. Thanks, again and again and again :) Rebecca Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14415	From: Aaron M.	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: SAE's (was - Re: [AquaticLife] Tank Pics)

Where online do you get the True SAE's? I need some also, and where do you get the cardnal tetras from as well? I can't get either around here in the San Francisco Bay Area. Thanks, Aaron Daniel <> wrote: ... (20) cardnal tetras,(1)true siamese Alge eater( that I over paied for. $20.00 at my nearest aquarium store)found out later I could get them online for $2.99ea.I plan on getting atleast 5 more so they can swim together....Daniel got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife stop by and see ~ membership is free! <º((((><¸..·´¯`·., . .·´¯`·.. <º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((>< ¸.·´¯`·.¸. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14416	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: Another stocking question

But keep in mind that a Chinese Algae Eater will become very agressive as it gets larger. They are great in a community tank when they are small, but when they start getting bigger, they will attack other fish. My folks had one in their tank and was fine till he reached four inches and started attacking her blue gouramis. She was worried about it possibly killing them, so we put it in my crayfish tank with the idea at the time that we would take it to the LFS the next day. In the cray tank was a single 7 inch blue crayfish. Next morning, the cray was dead. ----- Original Message ----- From: "kristopher helsing" <punk3r12@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wednesday, August 10, 2005 12:02 PM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Another stocking question ONE IS FINE BUT THEY WILL FIGHT WITH EACH OTHER SO KEEP ONLY ONE, THE CHINEASE ALGEA EATERS YOU CAN HAVE MULTIPLE BUT THE SIAMESE WILL FIGHT.... thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@...> wrote:Thank you all for your posts to my many questions :) I have yet another one :) In a 37 gallon tall tank with 3 otos, 1 bristlenose, 3 zebra loaches and guppies, do you think I could put in a SAE? I read to have them singly or in a group of 5. I think they are too big for me to have 5 so I was thinking one. Is it too big for my tank? I am not familiar with these fish at all, any info is welcomed. Thanks, again and again and again :) Rebecca Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14417	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: growing anarchis

I have a bunch of anarchis growing in my tank. I reached the water surface today. I would like to trim it, but am not sure how. Do you cut it about half way down and put the top half into the gravel? I know with trees, shrub and houseplants, if you top off the vertical growth, the plant will sprout from beneath the cut part. Is this true for aquatic plants? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14418	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: bacteria

Can someone explain the difference between gram positive and gram negative bacteria. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14419	From: Daniel	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: SAE's (was - Re: [AquaticLife] Tank Pics)

The True SAE’s you can get from HYPERLINK "http://www.azgardens.com/algae_eating_fish.php"http://www.azgardens.com/alg ae_eating_fish.php they raise there own I think.I have never bought SAE’s from them but I have bought cherry shrimp a long time ago and I was satisfied. I use to buy the Cardinals from my local aquarium shop for $2.89 ea but they would never last long.That was the only fish I have had problems with from my local shop.The last ones I bought from HYPERLINK "http://www.tropfish5.com/fresh.htm"http://www.tropfish5.com/fresh.htm along with 3 of my Discus.They have good prices on fish but the shipping charge is terrible. It was about $80.00 for shipping and you order needs to be atleast 75 or 100.00 I think.The fish were all fine when I received them. I would suggest looking around on the internet for shops in your area and find out that way if they have some Cardinals .Maybe you will find a new shop and a new supplier. I love taking a Saturday and traveling to new shops in my area of NC.Here are some links that might help you out. HYPERLINK "http://www.seabay.org/lnk_bay_stores.htm"http://www.seabay.org/lnk_bay_stor es.htm HYPERLINK "http://www.sfaquarium.org/membership.html"http://www.sfaquarium.org/members hip.html Good Luck! Daniel _____ From: Aaron M. [mailto:anonymous122899@...] Sent: Wednesday, August 10, 2005 3:57 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: SAE's (was - Re: [AquaticLife] Tank Pics) Where online do you get the True SAE's? I need some also, and where do you get the cardnal tetras from as well? I can't get either around here in the San Francisco Bay Area. Thanks, Aaron Daniel <> wrote: ... (20) cardnal tetras,(1)true siamese Alge eater( that I over paied for. $20.00 at my nearest aquarium store)found out later I could get them online for $2.99ea.I plan on getting atleast 5 more so they can swim together....Daniel got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! HYPERLINK "http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife" \nhttp://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife stop by and see ~ membership is free! <º((((><¸..·´¯`·., . .·´¯`·.. <º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((>< ¸.·´¯`·.¸. -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.4/66 - Release Date: 8/9/2005 -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.4/66 - Release Date: 8/9/2005 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14420	From: richard thompson	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: growing anarchis

you can cut it anywhere and t will continue to grow, but floating is fine it does not need to be planted Crazy4fids@... wrote:I have a bunch of anarchis growing in my tank. I reached the water surface today. I would like to trim it, but am not sure how. Do you cut it about half way down and put the top half into the gravel? I know with trees, shrub and houseplants, if you top off the vertical growth, the plant will sprout from beneath the cut part. Is this true for aquatic plants? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14421	From: Daniel	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: growing anarchis

I have some Anarchis in one of my tanks and when I cut them I usually cut right below any roots that have started to grow out from the stem.Then replant it about an inch in the gravel.I have also cut them at any length I wanted to and replanted them.They are very easy plants to grow in my tanks and grow fast they do. But I think it helps to also cut the stem that is left back down to the next leave on the stem if you dont sometimes they will grow a stem out to the side and stop growing on the stem where you cut them. Hope this helps! Daniel --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > I have a bunch of anarchis growing in my tank. I reached the water surface > today. I would like to trim it, but am not sure how. Do you cut it about > half way down and put the top half into the gravel? I know with trees, shrub > and houseplants, if you top off the vertical growth, the plant will sprout > from beneath the cut part. Is this true for aquatic plants? > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14422	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: SAE's (was - Re: [AquaticLife] Tank Pics)

aaron where are you in the bay? if you're near the peninsula i've seen them at ultimate aquarium in san mateo. --- "Aaron M." <anonymous122899@...> wrote: > Where online do you get the True SAE's? > I need some also, and where do you get the cardnal tetras from as well? > I can't get either around here in the San Francisco Bay Area. > > Thanks, > Aaron > > Daniel <> wrote: > ... (20) cardnal tetras,(1)true > siamese Alge eater( that I over paied for. $20.00 at my nearest > aquarium store)found out later I could get them online for $2.99ea.I > plan on getting atleast 5 more so they can swim together....Daniel > > > > > > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > <º((((><¸..·´¯`·., . .·´¯`·.. <º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((>< ¸.·´¯`·.¸. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14423	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: SAE's (was - Re: [AquaticLife] Tank Pics)

aaron, should clarify, i meant i've seen the cardinals @ ultimate, not the sae's. --- Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote: > aaron where are you in the bay? if you're near the peninsula i've seen them at ultimate aquarium > in san mateo. > > --- "Aaron M." <anonymous122899@...> wrote: > > > Where online do you get the True SAE's? > > I need some also, and where do you get the cardnal tetras from as well? > > I can't get either around here in the San Francisco Bay Area. > > > > Thanks, > > Aaron > > > > Daniel <> wrote: > > ... (20) cardnal tetras,(1)true > > siamese Alge eater( that I over paied for. $20.00 at my nearest > > aquarium store)found out later I could get them online for $2.99ea.I > > plan on getting atleast 5 more so they can swim together....Daniel > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! > > > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife > > > > > > stop by and see ~ membership is free! > > > > <º((((><¸..·´¯`·., . .·´¯`·.. <º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((>< ¸.·´¯`·.¸. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!! > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14424	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: growing anarchis

I tend to trim mine like Daniel does. I cut below where the roots have started to come out and replant the top part. Sometimes they come loose from the sand if I haven't put them in deep enough and they float around with my water sprite :) Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > I have a bunch of anarchis growing in my tank. I reached the water surface > today. I would like to trim it, but am not sure how. Do you cut it about > half way down and put the top half into the gravel? I know with trees, shrub > and houseplants, if you top off the vertical growth, the plant will sprout > from beneath the cut part. Is this true for aquatic plants? > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14425	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: got my angelfish

I finally got my black lace angelfish! I ended up buying some from a guy on aquabid. I didn't actually place a bid. I talked with him online, as I didn't want what he was auctioning. But I did end up purchasing two black lace and three blacks hybred from him. Got the fish today. He also included one that I think he is calling blue koi. It is also a pearl scale. Please take a peek at it. I willl post it under Linda on the picture site. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14426	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: High level of Phosphate in my water

Ok thanks, will have a look in my LFS. =Nick Valeen Gonzalez wrote: >i use something called phosx or something like that on my sw tank, which works really well. >there's also phos ban which i've also heard works well. > >i don't know how long, if at all, you leave your lights on, but i've found that by leaving my >lights off for most of the day lessens the algae. > >hope this helps. > >--- Nicolas Munro <nmunro@...> wrote: > > > >>Hi, >> >>I have a Hagen test kit which says under 1 ppm is ok (as far as I can >>recall) and the test measurement should be taken after 2 minutes of >>reaction and it has a high level of 5ppm. >> >>I'm getting a high reading of Phosphate in my water. When I test my >>water I get more than 5ppm in just 30 seconds which to me indicates a >>problem. >> >>My fish tank is suffering from algae which sticks on the glass and also >>makes the water a slight green / yellow colour. >> >> >> >>My question is simple but I can't find many alternatives, how do I >>reduce the phosphate? >> >>I've got lots of live plants, I've tried underfeeding my fish for a >>week, I've tried replacing water very regularly (more than 90% for a >>couple of weeks/water changes) - my tap water by the way has 0.5ppm >>Phosphate after a reaction time of 2 minutes. >> >>_Are there any alternatives? _ >> >>=Nick >> >> >>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >> >> >> >> > > >Valeen Robertson Gonzalez >My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!! > > > > > > > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >AquaticLife Management. >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14427	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: High level of Phosphate in my water

Do the phosphate reducing chemicals adversly affect the fish or pH or bacteria or anything like that? I also have a high level of phosphates in my water but would rather have the algae than hurt anything living in my tank! Thanks, Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@y...> wrote: > i use something called phosx or something like that on my sw tank, which works really well. > there's also phos ban which i've also heard works well. > > i don't know how long, if at all, you leave your lights on, but i've found that by leaving my > lights off for most of the day lessens the algae. > > hope this helps. > > --- Nicolas Munro <nmunro@q...> wrote: > > > Hi, > > > > I have a Hagen test kit which says under 1 ppm is ok (as far as I can > > recall) and the test measurement should be taken after 2 minutes of > > reaction and it has a high level of 5ppm. > > > > I'm getting a high reading of Phosphate in my water. When I test my > > water I get more than 5ppm in just 30 seconds which to me indicates a > > problem. > > > > My fish tank is suffering from algae which sticks on the glass and also > > makes the water a slight green / yellow colour. > > > > > > > > My question is simple but I can't find many alternatives, how do I > > reduce the phosphate? > > > > I've got lots of live plants, I've tried underfeeding my fish for a > > week, I've tried replacing water very regularly (more than 90% for a > > couple of weeks/water changes) - my tap water by the way has 0.5ppm > > Phosphate after a reaction time of 2 minutes. > > > > _Are there any alternatives? _ > > > > =Nick > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14428	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: Another stocking question

Yes, I was just going to get one. I only want a true Siamese algae eater, I am not looking at the chinese algae eaters at all. Do you think one will fit in my community tank? --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, kristopher helsing <punk3r12@y...> wrote: > ONE IS FINE BUT THEY WILL FIGHT WITH EACH OTHER SO KEEP ONLY ONE, THE CHINEASE ALGEA EATERS YOU CAN HAVE MULTIPLE BUT THE SIAMESE WILL FIGHT.... > > thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote:Thank you all for your posts to my many questions :) I have yet > another one :) > > In a 37 gallon tall tank with 3 otos, 1 bristlenose, 3 zebra loaches > and guppies, do you think I could put in a SAE? I read to have them > singly or in a group of 5. I think they are too big for me to have 5 > so I was thinking one. Is it too big for my tank? I am not familiar > with these fish at all, any info is welcomed. > > Thanks, again and again and again :) > Rebecca > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine biology Biology > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > --------------------------------- > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14429	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: Koi question

Thanks for all the information. I will pass it along to my sister-in- law. I know that they will never bring the fish inside and they don't have a garage, so hopefully the fish can make it outside. Unfortunately, they won't be expanding the pond until next year so I don't know what will happen this winter. Again, I appreciate everyone's input. The more info and experiences listed, the better I think! Rebecca

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14430	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: Koi question

I must have you confused with someone else. Well, it would not be the first time. <g>. When I was a kid in NJ, my parents would take me over to Saddle River to Trickers (it is Saddle River, isn't it, that's what I seem to remember). Did not have koi then, but did have various pond goldfish. Further north, when I was in New England, I did have koi, and regularly lost them until I started bringing them in over the winter. It may have been the combination of only being able to go three feet down and living on top of a wind swept hill, or perhaps just the depth. In mid-winter, it was a pain keeping an open spot in the ice with a 1500 watt heater, not to mention all the kilowatt hours it consumed. Therefore I must go with the recommendations of Mr. Meyer. Here in VA, I do not have a pond. Kind of hard to do it right with a yard the dogs can barely turn around in, and I've decided against the half barrel approach because of the summer temperatures and the amount of sun the yard gets. So, until I have a yard, pond keeping is out. We are looking, but for $500,000 I can buy a house and not have much more yard than I do now, and that is ridiculous. Most of what I have read about koi tells me that about 50^oF is the lower limit to feed them, though I have not read much lately. And while I was not specific about when to feed them what, I did mention the wheat germ. I have kept many kind of fish in ponds over the years, and most are much more hardy than one would assume, but they all do have their limits. As I mentioned in my previous post, we may have to agree to disagree on this topic, and that is fine with me. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Wednesday, August 10, 2005 7:53 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Koi question Steve, Regret you feel the need to disagree, but everyboby's entitled to their own opinions. Hope you've had at least some personal experience with Koi. First, on the Autumn feeding and water temperature; it does matter what you feed them in the Fall (a good quality wheat-germ based food only), which as per the generally recommended consensus is until the water reaches a low temperature of 7 o C to 8 o C (43 o F to 46 o F). I, too, have seen many erroneous recommendations stating 50 o F as the lowest temperature for feeding, also noting a few stating 53 o F as the lowest, with feeding Cheerio's (sounding possibly antiquated) and another couple of recommendations saying 40 o F (Wrong-O). With good, proper vegative- based Fall foods (ShoKoi, Hikari, Tetra, etc.), its perfectly safe (& recommended) to feed them down to the temperature I stated, as you want your fish to winter over in prime condition. I did include in my last post that the Koi are only to be fed once every 3 days at these lower temperatures, again because of the slowness of their digestion, which I too mentioned. \ On pond volumn and depth, it is assumed that Rebecca's sister-in law is going to enlarge her pond enough to support her fish as is her latest plan, if that's what you're referring to. Otherwise, that's a prerequisite of course for any Koi pond -- to have it large enough to support the fish (just as with an aquarium)-- that's especially essential which higher temperatures of Summer when there's less oxygen available. I believe I already recommended a minimum depth of 3' to winter fish over in harsher latitudes (and elevations), which also affords the fish some protection from predators year 'round. Incidentally, my digs are in northern New Jersey where the ice can easily get 6" to 8" thick. I'm not in sunny California if that is what your thinking, and while most of my hundreds of pond customers (of Tricker's Water Gardens -- now renamed Waterford Gardens, which I manage) are spread across the country, including California, I'd have to say most of them are here in the cold Northeast, with some of them a lot further north up into New York State, and New England (where the ice might get much thicker). \ I did not get a chance to look for Steve Meyer's article and you did not previously mention that the reason he takes his fish indoors is because he can't excavate a deep enough outdoor pond, not because its too cold to keep Koi outdoors otherwise in his climate. There are ways around that; while I don't recommend a partially above ground pond in that climate, to increase depth, many water gardeners in that situation elevate their property (with added soil) in the vicinity of their planned pond to enable them to have a completely sunken pond of their desired depth. I've seen a few done and it works out nice. \ None of my hundreds of customers bring their fish in for the Winter, as its just not necessary, but you can do what you want. As you're in Virginia, I urge you to check with Mr. Charles Thomas, owner of LiliPons Water Gardens (in Maryland) or his Director of Operations, Rich Koogle. My customers have very few, if any loses, and those that are lost are generally do to malfunctions, such as their power going out during a storm and they have no back-up method of keeping the very important ventilation hole open or, with ill-planned waterfalls, these falls partially freeze over and keeps diverting water to the side -- out of the pond. The 1500 watt (and/or 1250 watt) Farm Innovators (brand name) "Ice-Chaser" Pond De-Icers have been used for many years, with improvements being made, and are about the most reliable heaters you can buy (for around $55). They'll keep an open hole in the ice most anywhere, except maybe in Alaska, but certainly should be fine in Virginia. As for the water chemistry -- you need to do normal maintenance all season long anyway, and as Fall approaches, you need to make sure the pond bottom is clean. Additionally, you need to put leaf netting over the pond during autumn leaf-falling season to prevent the leaves from falling in and decaying over the Winter. Oak leaves are worse yet, as they'll tend to turn the water acid if there's a lot of them. However, normally there is no reason for the chemistry to change. For one thing, the colder the water is, the slower any naturally occurring change in water chemistry will take place. Guess it can't hurt to play it safe, and I understand where you're coming from, but they will survive outdoors. Perhaps the best of both worlds might be with having the outdoor pond near the garage with a sluiceway leading through the garage wall into an indoor pond. No need for any netting of them. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > Ray, > > We may need to agree to disagree on this one. First, feeding. Koi should not > be fed once the water temperature is below 50^oF. Doesn't matter what you > are feeding, but if they are to be left outdoors over the winter season, > they should stop being feed, because of the slowness of the digestion, > whether it be their summer food, or a wheat germ based food. > > If one is to keep koi out of doors during the winter in areas where water > will freeze, you need to have a pond volume and depth that will support the > fish, even in a hibernation type mode, without the pond freezing over. As I > recall (and I may be mistaken), your digs are in sunny California where you > do not see the low temperatures that Rebecca and Steve Meyer will see. Where > Steve lives, the desired depth to over winter fish is between 3 and 4 feet. > In Steve's case, the geology generally prohibits one from digging a pond > that deep without calling in heavy equipment or having to blast ledge. Even > for those who have the volume and depth for their fish, the wise course of > action my be to bring them in over the winter. A 1500 watt ring may not be > enough to keep the ice open across its diameter. > > When fish are over wintered out of doors, you will always lose fish due to > the temperature, due to the chemistry of the water over the course of the > winter, etc. If you bring them indoors, sure, you do risk something in the > moving of them from pond to basement or garage, but you do not lose fish as > you would in the pond. In an area where the water doesn't freeze, it is a > whole different story. However, my experiences do mimic Steve Meyer's > experiences and I am firmly in the fish indoors over the winter camp. If I > lived in Florida, say, I may be singing a different tune. But, even where I > am now, in Virginia, I'd not want the fish outdoors in the winter. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 9:36 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Koi question > > Steve, First of all, Koi are > normally kept in their ponds year 'round, even in the dead of Winter > in cold climates where ponds freeze over, as there is absolutely no > reason to bring them indoors. Some hobbyists such as Steve Meyer may > choose to bring their fish inside, just as some goldfish fanciers do > with their hardy pool Comets, but its entirely unnecessary, as both > will survive the Winter under the ice. I realize successful Koi > keepers with established ponds already know this, but am advising the > members on this Forum who may be thinking about keeping Koi so as not > to have them discouraged by this un-needed chore of netting their > fish in the Fall to bring into a basement pond. It is only under > circumstances such as Rebecca describes that the Koi would have to be > moved, where the fluctuating water requires them to be moved for lack > of sufficient water, as I trust you are referring to. > \ > As Koi can and do Winter-over under the ice, they're obviously not > picky about temperatures. The only reason why one might wait for > their pond water to get to 55 o F, is if you already had your fish > indoors (for whatever reason) and were transferring them to the pond - > - you want to avoid any extremes of temperature difference, just as > with tropical fish. Otherwise there's no need to be concerned with > their water temperature. True enough, as with all fish (and other > cold-blooded animals), their metabolism slows as the temperature > decreases, resulting in slowed digestion. They will continue to eat > (as they have an appetite) down to 43 o, but if fed normal "Summer > Formula" foods they will not be able to digest it and yes it can rot > in their bellies. Under no circumstances should Koi be fed regular > formula pellet/stick foods in water temperatures lower than 60 o. > Koi definitely need to continue to be fed as the water temperature > drops to keep them healthy over the Winter when they do not eat, > albeit, less quantity and less frequently as the temperature drops. > This is why Spring and Fall formulas of pellet and stick Koi foods > are marketed, containing mostly easily digestible (especially in cold > weather) Wheat Germ which they can assimilate with no problems. > Below approximately 43 o cease feeding them as they will no longer be > interested in eating. As they again begin to stir in the Spring, > Wheat Germ foods (only) should be fed until the pond temperature > again reaches 60 o. While the fish are under the ice, a small pond > heater is required to keep an open hole in the ice, to let any > noxious gases (methane and hydrogen) from rotting vegetation, etc., > escape which would otherwise accumulate and poison the fish. These > floating heaters are not designed to heat the whole pond but just to > keep the ice clear immediately surrounding it. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > > > > They will not survive year round in what you describe. > > > > Koi are also picky about temperatures. She will not be able to > putthem out until the water temperature reaches at least 50^o F, 55 > is better, and she shoud bringthem in before the water temperature > drops below that mark. The reason that koi have these "magic" numbers > is that when the temperature reaches that range, their digestion > ceases. They may still eat, but they cannot digest the food, and that > can lead to problems later on as the food will have a tendency to rot > in their bellies while the temperature is low. > > > > \\Steve//

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14431	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: bacteria

Linda, You can find an answer here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gram-negative. You can also Google for further information. To find this, I used "gram negative bacteria" with the quotes. That link was the first hit of about 483,000. Once you have a little better understanding of what you are looking for, you can always go to http://www.scirus.com and search there for more science related information. If I recall correctly, most bacteria that are relevant to fish diseases are gram positive. And now I will shut up before I get myself in too deep on a subject I know little about. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Wednesday, August 10, 2005 4:24 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com; mnaquarium@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] bacteria Can someone explain the difference between gram positive and gram negative bacteria. Linda

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14432	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: Koi question

I have had a pond here in Massachusetts for several years now. The first few winters, we left the comets and koi outside - most if not all made it through the winter each year without even a heater keeping an opening in the ice. The pond was small enough to cover it entirely with plexi roofing panels and a frame. We don't really feed our pond fish much even in the summertime, they thrive with the plants, algea, etc within the pond and the bugs that teem in great swarms from the nearby woods and vernal pool. Last year, we brought the fish in and we feel they did even better than usual. We didn't lose one fish either over the winter or in the big move back outside. (even the big spazzy koi who wanted to swim 'upstream' to the kitchen survived) Over the winter, they lived in our family room in pop-up ponds with only water changes and sponge filters for filtration (bare bottom). It was probably good we brought them in this winter because it was more fierce than we usually have (we're coastal, so it's not usually as severe here as a bit further inland) and I wouldn't be surprised if the pond froze almost totally (*unbelieveable* cold from Oct - March) I would be very worried about so many fish relying on a small refuge from the weather in the MN pond. That seems like a recipe for disaster. Our own fish will be coming in again this year. All my hopes, Vicky Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Call (301) 496-7299 or (301) 402-8625 or write: hgparker@... =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@... 919-513-1467, Dr London @ calondon@... 530-754-5711 _AND_ Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14433	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Pacific Coast Cichlid Association (PCCA), 8/13/2005, 6:45 pm

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife Pacific Coast Cichlid Association (PCCA) Saturday August 13, 2005 6:45 pm - 9:45 pm This event repeats on the second Saturday of every month. Event Location: Round Table Pizza, 4302 Moorpark Avenue in San Jose, California Notes: The PCCA meets every second Saturday of the month. Meetings are held a the Round Table Pizza parlor located at 4302 Moorpark Avenue in San Jose, California http://www.cichlidworld.com/ ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14434	From: Chris	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: bacteria

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > Linda, > > You can find an answer here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gram- negative. should be: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gram-negative (just in case) Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14435	From: Chris	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: heater question

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: The main purpose of two > smaller separate heaters though, is to prevent any single heater from > overheating the tank due to a stuck thermostat. True - I never stopped to think about overheating being prevented too. Co-incidentally, one of my toddlers got to the power point behind my tank yesterday and switched it off. Two heaters would only be good then if they were in different power points! Fortunately the temp hadn't dipped too much before I fixed it. Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14436	From: Sandy Kay	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: salt question

Some have said they keep salt in their water. I have freshwater and know you are supposed to use the non iodine kind. Do you have any more specifics? My tank is a 10 gallon. How much to use and when, etc. Thank you, Sandy [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14437	From: deborahgd14	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: Angie the Angel fish

Hi Ray: The temperature of the tank is 80; nitrate 20 - safe; nitrite 0 - safe; hardness 75 - soft; alkiline - 80 moderate; ph 7.2 neutral. I put her in a five gallon tank and put furazone - green which I purchased and was recommended from my LFS. I keep my tank very clean and usually do water changes every week. I didn't last week, could that be it? I have had her for 1-1/2 years and she has done fine. Thank you for your help. Deborah D --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > Addition to Post: Sorry, I meant to say Aquatronics (not Aquarium > Pharmaceuticals) as a possible second source of Metronidazole if you > can find it -- I believe they have gone out out business. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> > wrote: > > Deborah, You haven't mentioned what temperature you keep your fish > at, > > nor did you let us know what the water parameters (pH, ammonia, > > nitrites. etc.) are. Anyway, this sounds like Hexamita, an > internal > > disease which Angels are quite susceptible to. Isolate the fish if > > possible for ease of treatment. If you can't you'll have to treat > the > > whole tank. Do a partial (1/3) water change and raise the > temperature > > to 82 o. Treat with Metronidazole, by Seachem (Aquarium > Pharmaceuticals > > used to have it, in capsule form, if you can still find it). > > Metronidazole is not readily diluted in water, so use a small > quantity > > of hot (not boiling) water. As Metronidazole is not as readily > > absorbed through the fish's tissue as is Kanamycin, it helps to add > > this medication as well. Read the directions, you'll need to > repeat > > this every 2 days, and remove carbon from the filter. Sometimes > the > > fish do not respond to treatment -- in which case you can try Clout > as > > a last resort. Seems the less an Angelfish's tank water is > changed, > > the more possible it is that they'll sooner or later get this > disease. > > For absolute best maintenance of Angels, they should receive a > partial > > water change every 2 days, even though that sounds extreme. If not > > feasible in your circumstances, then at least once a week. > Ray > > > \ > -- > > - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "deborahgd14" <deborahgd14@y...> > > wrote: > > > Hello Everyone: My angel is acting really strange. She didn't > eat > > > today and either hangs out at the top corner or on the bottom. > What > > > do you think I should do? A salt bath? And > > > what would that consist of. I don't want to stress her out any > more > > > than she is. She freaks out when the fish net goes in the tank > as it > > > is. Thanks. Deborah D

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14438	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/10/2005
Subject: Re: salt question

Unless there is a specific need, one does not need to add salt to a freshwater tank. Salt is often used as an emergency remedy until one can resolve the issue with the proper medication. It is also used as a remedy in and of itself for certain parasites. Having said that, there are certain fish that can benefit from a regular addition of salt to the aquarium. One such genus of fish would be mollies, which are often found in estaturine environments where they are regularly exposed to salt in the environment. Other livebearers may also respond positively to such treatment. In a general community tank, it would not be wise to keep a level of salt in the tank. There are many fish that can be adversely affected by the regular addition of salt. So, in the end, only use salt when its use is indicated for the tank as a whole. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Sandy Kay Sent: Wednesday, August 10, 2005 10:28 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] salt question Some have said they keep salt in their water. I have freshwater and know you are supposed to use the non iodine kind. Do you have any more specifics? My tank is a 10 gallon. How much to use and when, etc. Thank you, Sandy

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14439	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: Angie the Angel fish

Deborah, Sounds like your water's in good shape, although you don't indicate an ammonia reading -- but going by your nitrites and nitrates I can't believe it wouldn't be in a safe normal range. Its good to see you keep up on the maintenance of the tank. One wouldn't think that Angelfish are that "touchy" to keep, but it appears as if the missed weekly water change was just enough stress to allow this disease to come to the foreground and affect the fish; your Angel didn't suddenly contract this disease all at once just because of the lack of fresher water for the two week period. To explain; Hexamita, a disease that infects the digestive system of many Cichlids, but especially Angels and Discus, starts its infection in the ensuing years after maturity (which, in Angels is about 9 months). Fish kept in the clean conditions that they require (as you have been doing up until recently) rarely show symptoms of the disease and tend to live with it, as their immune system keeps tending to ward it off. Sometimes though, there reaches a point when the balance between the amount of infection and the fish's manifestation of it becomes precarious. At that point, all's it may take is the added stress of not having a change of fresh new water to put things over the edge. Many wild Angels have this microorganism in their gut and live with it fine as two co-existing organisms. Then too, wild Angels never have the stress of having old water as they're in a constantly moving water environment. While many domestic Angels carry this microorganism (unknowingly to us), I've never seen it manifest itself in juvenile Angels, nor in Angels that have just matured. \ Furazone - Green is an excellant medication for many ailments, especially external. However, this is not the medication of choice to be used against Heximita, partly because it is not readily absorbed through the fish's tissue where its needed internally. And, oh yes, fish do not "drink" water in the manner we think of it. I would suggest getting one of the proper medications needed and then before using, remove the Furazone-green either by water changes or by fresh carbon in the filter, after which raise the temperature to 82 o F. If not too heavily infected, the fish sometimes come around (not always, so be prepared). If she decides to start eating, feed her with Jungle Laboratories "Pepso" food which contains medications needed to clear intestinal fish parasites. You could also make your own medicated food by making a paste of some flake food and adding the Metronidazole to it, then rolling it out flat (between wax paper) and letting it dry and crumble it. If you need to go to "Clout" as a last resort, you'll need to cut the tablet in half for your 5 gallon tank. The tablet is meant as a dose for 10 gallons and you do not want to overdose with this medication. Let us know how it goes. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "deborahgd14" <deborahgd14@y...> wrote: > Hi Ray: The temperature of the tank is 80; nitrate 20 - safe; > nitrite 0 - safe; hardness 75 - soft; alkiline - 80 moderate; ph 7.2 > neutral. > > I put her in a five gallon tank and put furazone - green which I > purchased and was recommended from my LFS. > > I keep my tank very clean and usually do water changes every week. > I didn't last week, could that be it? I have had her for 1-1/2 > years and she has done fine. Thank you for your help. Deborah D > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" > <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > Addition to Post: Sorry, I meant to say Aquatronics (not Aquarium > > Pharmaceuticals) as a possible second source of Metronidazole if > you > > can find it -- I believe they have gone out out business. > Ray > > > \ > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" > <sevenspringss@w...> > > wrote: > > > Deborah, You haven't mentioned what temperature you keep your > fish > > at, > > > nor did you let us know what the water parameters (pH, ammonia, > > > nitrites. etc.) are. Anyway, this sounds like Hexamita, an > > internal > > > disease which Angels are quite susceptible to. Isolate the fish > if > > > possible for ease of treatment. If you can't you'll have to > treat > > the > > > whole tank. Do a partial (1/3) water change and raise the > > temperature > > > to 82 o. Treat with Metronidazole, by Seachem (Aquarium > > Pharmaceuticals > > > used to have it, in capsule form, if you can still find it). > > > Metronidazole is not readily diluted in water, so use a small > > quantity > > > of hot (not boiling) water. As Metronidazole is not as readily > > > absorbed through the fish's tissue as is Kanamycin, it helps to > add > > > this medication as well. Read the directions, you'll need to > > repeat > > > this every 2 days, and remove carbon from the filter. Sometimes > > the > > > fish do not respond to treatment -- in which case you can try > Clout > > as > > > a last resort. Seems the less an Angelfish's tank water is > > changed, > > > the more possible it is that they'll sooner or later get this > > disease. > > > For absolute best maintenance of Angels, they should receive a > > partial > > > water change every 2 days, even though that sounds extreme. If > not > > > feasible in your circumstances, then at least once a week. > > Ray > > > > > > \ > > > -- > > > - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "deborahgd14" > <deborahgd14@y...> > > > wrote: > > > > Hello Everyone: My angel is acting really strange. She > didn't > > eat > > > > today and either hangs out at the top corner or on the > bottom. > > What > > > > do you think I should do? A salt bath? And > > > > what would that consist of. I don't want to stress her out > any > > more > > > > than she is. She freaks out when the fish net goes in the > tank > > as it > > > > is. Thanks. Deborah D

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14440	From: Andrea	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: Need Help Fast...Sick Betta...think it is VELVET

I've stopped using gravel in my tanks at least for now - it just harbours too much waste and leftover food and is harder to keep clean. I'm using the flat glass stones right now - the bettas like them because they can see themselves reflected in them. It entertains them and the stones are pretty and cheap if you get them at Walmart (pet stores tend to charge more for them). Andrea -- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "T" <bigter4@y...> wrote: > Hello Andrea, Thx for the Tips. I will be getting him in a > sick "bowl" as soon as I get home. I have the medication and I will > look into the Airstone for him. I never bothered cause the tank is so > small but it is a really good idea after what has happened.I hope I > catch this in the early stages. I will have to do good cleaning of > the grvel for excess food ect.. thx -Ter > > > > If it's velvet it is very contagious and sometimes related to poor > > water conditions. Disinfect any nets etc that you have used in that > > tank or don't use them in any other tanks. Since it is a parasite > > that requires light, dim the lighting around the tank (or use > > something like pieces of paper to block light entering the tank) > and > > raise the water temperature to 82'F (the parasite doesn't do well > with > > warmer water). Treatment of choice is copper sulfate and if you > have > > a filter on the tank, remove the carbon portion while treating the > > tank. Salt is always good - I keep salt in all my betta tanks as a > > routine thing and have had very little incidence of disease. I > also > > try to keep their tanks fairly clean, removing any old food or > waste > > every couple of days so the water quality remains good. At least a > > 50% water change is done weekly. I usually aerate my tanks (even > the > > small 2 gallon ones) with an airstone as this seems to maintain the > > water quality better than a still tank (and the bettas like to play > in > > the bubbles :) ) > > I have some old timers like yours (3 yrs or older) that I hope to > keep > > for a long while yet - they have such personality! > > Good luck with your betta guy - hopefully this will help and he > will > > make a good recovery. > > > > Andrea & the Senior Guys - Blackie (3.5 yrs old - nearly black) > and > > Remington (3 yrs old - steel blue) > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "T" <bigter4@y...> wrote: > > > I gave a Male Betta in a 3 gal tank. I have had this Betta for > > almost 3 > > > years. He is the fish that got me into all this and later > inspired > > my > > > other Tanks. It looks like he has come down with this in the last > 48 > > > hrs or so.He has all the signs and I did a little research and > will > > be > > > getting VELVET GAURD from Jumgle products this afternoon. I put > salt > > in > > > the tank as instructed untill I get some cure. Is there anything > > else I > > > can do?? I cant lose this Fish. - Ter

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14441	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: got my angelfish

The two fish in your photo look nice and healthy; if that's how the other fish look you bought some nice fish. I guess you've had the gold Angel (I don't remember what you said previously). The silver Pearlscale looks great -- has some interesting black markings. There is of course no recognized strain as "blue koi" (some people like to come up with names to tack on to different looking, or mixed gene fish they've raised), but this doesn't take away from his attractiveness. Am presently fixing pearlscale onto my german blues, which I've seen before but is not widely bred -- a nice looking fish. Lots of luck with the group and keep us posted on them. Ray \ P.S.: Do the black lace and black Angels have red eyes as you wanted? \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > I finally got my black lace angelfish! I ended up buying some from a guy on > aquabid. I didn't actually place a bid. I talked with him online, as I > didn't want what he was auctioning. But I did end up purchasing two black lace > and three blacks hybred from him. Got the fish today. He also included one > that I think he is calling blue koi. It is also a pearl scale. Please take > a peek at it. I willl post it under Linda on the picture site. > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14442	From: T	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: Need Help Fast...Sick Betta...think it is VELVET

Hi andrea... I lost My Betta last night. I guess I dodnt get to him in time. Well 3 years was a good run. I wil miss him greatly. The Colored stones are a great idea. Thank You for all of your help. I will be looking into another one soon. Thanks again - Terry > I've stopped using gravel in my tanks at least for now - it just > harbours too much waste and leftover food and is harder to keep > clean. I'm using the flat glass stones right now - the bettas like > them because they can see themselves reflected in them. It > entertains them and the stones are pretty and cheap if you get them > at Walmart (pet stores tend to charge more for them). > > Andrea > > -- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "T" <bigter4@y...> wrote: > > Hello Andrea, Thx for the Tips. I will be getting him in a > > sick "bowl" as soon as I get home. I have the medication and I will > > look into the Airstone for him. I never bothered cause the tank is > so > > small but it is a really good idea after what has happened.I hope I > > catch this in the early stages. I will have to do good cleaning of > > the grvel for excess food ect.. thx -Ter > > > > > > > If it's velvet it is very contagious and sometimes related to > poor > > > water conditions. Disinfect any nets etc that you have used in > that > > > tank or don't use them in any other tanks. Since it is a > parasite > > > that requires light, dim the lighting around the tank (or use > > > something like pieces of paper to block light entering the tank) > > and > > > raise the water temperature to 82'F (the parasite doesn't do well > > with > > > warmer water). Treatment of choice is copper sulfate and if you > > have > > > a filter on the tank, remove the carbon portion while treating > the > > > tank. Salt is always good - I keep salt in all my betta tanks as > a > > > routine thing and have had very little incidence of disease. I > > also > > > try to keep their tanks fairly clean, removing any old food or > > waste > > > every couple of days so the water quality remains good. At least > a > > > 50% water change is done weekly. I usually aerate my tanks (even > > the > > > small 2 gallon ones) with an airstone as this seems to maintain > the > > > water quality better than a still tank (and the bettas like to > play > > in > > > the bubbles :) ) > > > I have some old timers like yours (3 yrs or older) that I hope to > > keep > > > for a long while yet - they have such personality! > > > Good luck with your betta guy - hopefully this will help and he > > will > > > make a good recovery. > > > > > > Andrea & the Senior Guys - Blackie (3.5 yrs old - nearly black) > > and > > > Remington (3 yrs old - steel blue) > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "T" <bigter4@y...> wrote: > > > > I gave a Male Betta in a 3 gal tank. I have had this Betta for > > > almost 3 > > > > years. He is the fish that got me into all this and later > > inspired > > > my > > > > other Tanks. It looks like he has come down with this in the > last > > 48 > > > > hrs or so.He has all the signs and I did a little research and > > will > > > be > > > > getting VELVET GAURD from Jumgle products this afternoon. I put > > salt > > > in > > > > the tank as instructed untill I get some cure. Is there > anything > > > else I > > > > can do?? I cant lose this Fish. - Ter

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14443	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: Koi question

Yeah, your memory serves you right, it is in Saddle River. Sounds like you had some harsh conditions in New England, especially being on top of a wind swept hill. Your fish might have done better if you could have only dug one small section at least another foot or so. I've read that for every foot deeper you go under the ice, the temperature increase by one degree. Doesn't sound like much, but sometimes it can make a difference. While I respect your preference for bringing Koi inside, you must (I think) be aware that most people overwinter their Koi in their ponds. This past winter I sold literally hundreds of pond heaters, many across the counter and many more that I shipped out. Obviously, a good number of these heaters were bought by first-time pond owners -- they generally last a good number of years and don't need replacing every year. Yes, those 1500 watt heaters can create a "small" electric bill, but if you weigh that cost against even a few large Koi that may be worth $500 to $1000 each or even a larger number of smaller Koi worth nearly that, its good insurance. 12" to 14" fancy imported Japanese Koi can go for $225 each or so, then after putting a few year's growth on them the pond owner has a fish large enough that he couldn't replace for less than several hundred dollars more. There are pond heaters out today that use only 100 watts -- they're self-insulated, shaped like a large 12" or so donut with a large hole in the center. So, the hole in the ice is created in the middle where its more easily maintained rather than trying to constantly keep the ice from encroaching around the outside as the larger wattage heaters are designed to do. \ Sorry to hear you don't now have room for a pond -- it sounds as if you would like to. Got to go along with you there; the price of houses in many more built-up areas is insane. You may have to move further out from things to find something (with at least some land) at a decent price (I wish you luck there). We may not be as much at odds than you first thought -- I do agree that all fish have their limits. While Koi and goldfish can and do winter-over under the ice and are therefore for the mostpart kept in the pond year 'round, they (as would most cold-water fish) would do better indoors over the winter, not having to put up with the harsh elements. Many years ago, before I bought my first Oscars, I had a 9" largemouth Bass in a 50 gallon tank that was kept in my then small fish room over the winter. He was one happy fish! Even gained a little size. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > I must have you confused with someone else. Well, it would not be the first > time. <g>. > > When I was a kid in NJ, my parents would take me over to Saddle River to > Trickers (it is Saddle River, isn't it, that's what I seem to remember). Did > not have koi then, but did have various pond goldfish. > > Further north, when I was in New England, I did have koi, and regularly lost > them until I started bringing them in over the winter. It may have been the > combination of only being able to go three feet down and living on top of a > wind swept hill, or perhaps just the depth. In mid-winter, it was a pain > keeping an open spot in the ice with a 1500 watt heater, not to mention all > the kilowatt hours it consumed. Therefore I must go with the recommendations > of Mr. Meyer. > > Here in VA, I do not have a pond. Kind of hard to do it right with a yard > the dogs can barely turn around in, and I've decided against the half barrel > approach because of the summer temperatures and the amount of sun the yard > gets. So, until I have a yard, pond keeping is out. We are looking, but for > $500,000 I can buy a house and not have much more yard than I do now, and > that is ridiculous. > > Most of what I have read about koi tells me that about 50^oF is the lower > limit to feed them, though I have not read much lately. And while I was not > specific about when to feed them what, I did mention the wheat germ. > > I have kept many kind of fish in ponds over the years, and most are much > more hardy than one would assume, but they all do have their limits. > > As I mentioned in my previous post, we may have to agree to disagree on this > topic, and that is fine with me. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Wednesday, August 10, 2005 7:53 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Koi question > > Steve, Regret you feel the need to disagree, but everyboby's > entitled to their own opinions. Hope you've had at least some > personal experience with Koi. First, on the Autumn feeding and water > temperature; it does matter what you feed them in the Fall (a good > quality wheat-germ based food only), which as per the generally > recommended consensus is until the water reaches a low temperature of > 7 o C to 8 o C (43 o F to 46 o F). I, too, have seen many erroneous > recommendations stating 50 o F as the lowest temperature for feeding, > also noting a few stating 53 o F as the lowest, with feeding > Cheerio's (sounding possibly antiquated) and another couple of > recommendations saying 40 o F (Wrong-O). With good, proper vegative- > based Fall foods (ShoKoi, Hikari, Tetra, etc.), its perfectly safe (& > recommended) to feed them down to the temperature I stated, as you > want your fish to winter over in prime condition. I did include in > my last post that the Koi are only to be fed once every 3 days at > these lower temperatures, again because of the slowness of their > digestion, which I too mentioned. > \ > On pond volumn and depth, it is assumed that Rebecca's sister-in law > is going to enlarge her pond enough to support her fish as is her > latest plan, if that's what you're referring to. Otherwise, that's a > prerequisite of course for any Koi pond -- to have it large enough to > support the fish (just as with an aquarium)-- that's especially > essential which higher temperatures of Summer when there's less > oxygen available. I believe I already recommended a minimum depth of > 3' to winter fish over in harsher latitudes (and elevations), which > also affords the fish some protection from predators year 'round. > Incidentally, my digs are in northern New Jersey where the ice can > easily get 6" to 8" thick. I'm not in sunny California if that is > what your thinking, and while most of my hundreds of pond customers > (of Tricker's Water Gardens -- now renamed Waterford Gardens, which I > manage) are spread across the country, including California, I'd have > to say most of them are here in the cold Northeast, with some of them > a lot further north up into New York State, and New England (where > the ice might get much thicker). > \ > I did not get a chance to look for Steve Meyer's article and you did > not previously mention that the reason he takes his fish indoors is > because he can't excavate a deep enough outdoor pond, not because its > too cold to keep Koi outdoors otherwise in his climate. There are > ways around that; while I don't recommend a partially above ground > pond in that climate, to increase depth, many water gardeners in that > situation elevate their property (with added soil) in the vicinity of > their planned pond to enable them to have a completely sunken pond of > their desired depth. I've seen a few done and it works out nice. > \ > None of my hundreds of customers bring their fish in for the Winter, > as its just not necessary, but you can do what you want. As you're > in Virginia, I urge you to check with Mr. Charles Thomas, owner of > LiliPons Water Gardens (in Maryland) or his Director of Operations, > Rich Koogle. My customers have very few, if any loses, and those > that are lost are generally do to malfunctions, such as their power > going out during a storm and they have no back-up method of keeping > the very important ventilation hole open or, with ill-planned > waterfalls, these falls partially freeze over and keeps diverting > water to the side -- out of the pond. The 1500 watt (and/or 1250 > watt) Farm Innovators (brand name) "Ice-Chaser" Pond De-Icers have > been used for many years, with improvements being made, and are about > the most reliable heaters you can buy (for around $55). They'll keep > an open hole in the ice most anywhere, except maybe in Alaska, but > certainly should be fine in Virginia. As for the water chemistry -- > you need to do normal maintenance all season long anyway, and as Fall > approaches, you need to make sure the pond bottom is clean. > Additionally, you need to put leaf netting over the pond during > autumn leaf-falling season to prevent the leaves from falling in and > decaying over the Winter. Oak leaves are worse yet, as they'll tend > to turn the water acid if there's a lot of them. However, normally > there is no reason for the chemistry to change. For one thing, the > colder the water is, the slower any naturally occurring change in > water chemistry will take place. Guess it can't hurt to play it > safe, and I understand where you're coming from, but they will > survive outdoors. Perhaps the best of both worlds might be with > having the outdoor pond near the garage with a sluiceway leading > through the garage wall into an indoor pond. No need for any netting > of them. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > > Ray, > > > > We may need to agree to disagree on this one. First, feeding. Koi > should not > > be fed once the water temperature is below 50^oF. Doesn't matter > what you > > are feeding, but if they are to be left outdoors over the winter > season, > > they should stop being feed, because of the slowness of the > digestion, > > whether it be their summer food, or a wheat germ based food. > > > > If one is to keep koi out of doors during the winter in areas where > water > > will freeze, you need to have a pond volume and depth that will > support the > > fish, even in a hibernation type mode, without the pond freezing > over. As I > > recall (and I may be mistaken), your digs are in sunny California > where you > > do not see the low temperatures that Rebecca and Steve Meyer will > see. Where > > Steve lives, the desired depth to over winter fish is between 3 and > 4 feet. > > In Steve's case, the geology generally prohibits one from digging a > pond > > that deep without calling in heavy equipment or having to blast > ledge. Even > > for those who have the volume and depth for their fish, the wise > course of > > action my be to bring them in over the winter. A 1500 watt ring may > not be > > enough to keep the ice open across its diameter. > > > > When fish are over wintered out of doors, you will always lose fish > due to > > the temperature, due to the chemistry of the water over the course > of the > > winter, etc. If you bring them indoors, sure, you do risk something > in the > > moving of them from pond to basement or garage, but you do not lose > fish as > > you would in the pond. In an area where the water doesn't freeze, > it is a > > whole different story. However, my experiences do mimic Steve > Meyer's > > experiences and I am firmly in the fish indoors over the winter > camp. If I > > lived in Florida, say, I may be singing a different tune. But, even > where I > > am now, in Virginia, I'd not want the fish outdoors in the winter. > > > > \\Steve// > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > > Sent: Tuesday, August 09, 2005 9:36 AM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Koi question > > > > Steve, First of all, Koi are > > normally kept in their ponds year 'round, even in the dead of > Winter > > in cold climates where ponds freeze over, as there is absolutely no > > reason to bring them indoors. Some hobbyists such as Steve Meyer > may > > choose to bring their fish inside, just as some goldfish fanciers > do > > with their hardy pool Comets, but its entirely unnecessary, as both > > will survive the Winter under the ice. I realize successful Koi > > keepers with established ponds already know this, but am advising > the > > members on this Forum who may be thinking about keeping Koi so as > not > > to have them discouraged by this un-needed chore of netting their > > fish in the Fall to bring into a basement pond. It is only under > > circumstances such as Rebecca describes that the Koi would have to > be > > moved, where the fluctuating water requires them to be moved for > lack > > of sufficient water, as I trust you are referring to. > > > \ > > As Koi can and do Winter-over under the ice, they're obviously not > > picky about temperatures. The only reason why one might wait for > > their pond water to get to 55 o F, is if you already had your fish > > indoors (for whatever reason) and were transferring them to the > pond - > > - you want to avoid any extremes of temperature difference, just as > > with tropical fish. Otherwise there's no need to be concerned with > > their water temperature. True enough, as with all fish (and other > > cold-blooded animals), their metabolism slows as the temperature > > decreases, resulting in slowed digestion. They will continue to > eat > > (as they have an appetite) down to 43 o, but if fed normal "Summer > > Formula" foods they will not be able to digest it and yes it can > rot > > in their bellies. Under no circumstances should Koi be fed regular > > formula pellet/stick foods in water temperatures lower than 60 o. > > Koi definitely need to continue to be fed as the water temperature > > drops to keep them healthy over the Winter when they do not eat, > > albeit, less quantity and less frequently as the temperature > drops. > > This is why Spring and Fall formulas of pellet and stick Koi foods > > are marketed, containing mostly easily digestible (especially in > cold > > weather) Wheat Germ which they can assimilate with no problems. > > Below approximately 43 o cease feeding them as they will no longer > be > > interested in eating. As they again begin to stir in the Spring, > > Wheat Germ foods (only) should be fed until the pond temperature > > again reaches 60 o. While the fish are under the ice, a small pond > > heater is required to keep an open hole in the ice, to let any > > noxious gases (methane and hydrogen) from rotting vegetation, etc., > > escape which would otherwise accumulate and poison the fish. These > > floating heaters are not designed to heat the whole pond but just > to > > keep the ice clear immediately surrounding it. > Ray > > > \ > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> > wrote: > > > > > > They will not survive year round in what you describe. > > > > > > Koi are also picky about temperatures. She will not be able to > > putthem out until the water temperature reaches at least 50^o F, 55 > > is better, and she shoud bringthem in before the water temperature > > drops below that mark. The reason that koi have these "magic" > numbers > > is that when the temperature reaches that range, their digestion > > ceases. They may still eat, but they cannot digest the food, and > that > > can lead to problems later on as the food will have a tendency to > rot > > in their bellies while the temperature is low. > > > > > > \\Steve//

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14444	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: Koi question

It would probably be best if the Koi were kept in an aquarium until next year, if they're not too large. I doubt if they'll make it in the "trash-container" size remnant of a pool you described. Speaking of which, how large is this "trash-container-sized" water recepticle? Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > Thanks for all the information. I will pass it along to my sister-in- > law. I know that they will never bring the fish inside and they don't > have a garage, so hopefully the fish can make it outside. > Unfortunately, they won't be expanding the pond until next year so I > don't know what will happen this winter. > > Again, I appreciate everyone's input. The more info and experiences > listed, the better I think! > > Rebecca

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14445	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: Need Help Fast...Sick Betta...think it is VELVET

So sorry for your loss Terry!! Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "T" <bigter4@y...> wrote: > Hi andrea... I lost My Betta last night. I guess I dodnt get to him > in time. Well 3 years was a good run. I wil miss him greatly. The > Colored stones are a great idea. Thank You for all of your help. I > will be looking into another one soon. Thanks again - Terry > > > I've stopped using gravel in my tanks at least for now - it just > > harbours too much waste and leftover food and is harder to keep > > clean. I'm using the flat glass stones right now - the bettas like > > them because they can see themselves reflected in them. It > > entertains them and the stones are pretty and cheap if you get them > > at Walmart (pet stores tend to charge more for them). > > > > Andrea > > > > -- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "T" <bigter4@y...> wrote: > > > Hello Andrea, Thx for the Tips. I will be getting him in a > > > sick "bowl" as soon as I get home. I have the medication and I > will > > > look into the Airstone for him. I never bothered cause the tank > is > > so > > > small but it is a really good idea after what has happened.I hope > I > > > catch this in the early stages. I will have to do good cleaning > of > > > the grvel for excess food ect.. thx -Ter > > > > > > > > > > If it's velvet it is very contagious and sometimes related to > > poor > > > > water conditions. Disinfect any nets etc that you have used in > > that > > > > tank or don't use them in any other tanks. Since it is a > > parasite > > > > that requires light, dim the lighting around the tank (or use > > > > something like pieces of paper to block light entering the > tank) > > > and > > > > raise the water temperature to 82'F (the parasite doesn't do > well > > > with > > > > warmer water). Treatment of choice is copper sulfate and if > you > > > have > > > > a filter on the tank, remove the carbon portion while treating > > the > > > > tank. Salt is always good - I keep salt in all my betta tanks > as > > a > > > > routine thing and have had very little incidence of disease. I > > > also > > > > try to keep their tanks fairly clean, removing any old food or > > > waste > > > > every couple of days so the water quality remains good. At > least > > a > > > > 50% water change is done weekly. I usually aerate my tanks > (even > > > the > > > > small 2 gallon ones) with an airstone as this seems to maintain > > the > > > > water quality better than a still tank (and the bettas like to > > play > > > in > > > > the bubbles :) ) > > > > I have some old timers like yours (3 yrs or older) that I hope > to > > > keep > > > > for a long while yet - they have such personality! > > > > Good luck with your betta guy - hopefully this will help and he > > > will > > > > make a good recovery. > > > > > > > > Andrea & the Senior Guys - Blackie (3.5 yrs old - nearly > black) > > > and > > > > Remington (3 yrs old - steel blue) > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "T" <bigter4@y...> wrote: > > > > > I gave a Male Betta in a 3 gal tank. I have had this Betta > for > > > > almost 3 > > > > > years. He is the fish that got me into all this and later > > > inspired > > > > my > > > > > other Tanks. It looks like he has come down with this in the > > last > > > 48 > > > > > hrs or so.He has all the signs and I did a little research > and > > > will > > > > be > > > > > getting VELVET GAURD from Jumgle products this afternoon. I > put > > > salt > > > > in > > > > > the tank as instructed untill I get some cure. Is there > > anything > > > > else I > > > > > can do?? I cant lose this Fish. - Ter

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14446	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: Koi question

I would say it's about 3' on each side, square shaped, and at least 6 feet deep. I know some of the goldfish they bought last year made it through the winter living in there but they are bigger this year. The goldfish and koi she bought this year she just got last week and are all very small. Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > It would probably be best if the Koi were kept in an aquarium until > next year, if they're not too large. I doubt if they'll make it in > the "trash-container" size remnant of a pool you described. Speaking > of which, how large is this "trash-container-sized" water recepticle? > Ray

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14447	From: Daniel	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: Another stocking question

according to what I have read if you get the TRUE SIAMENSIS ALGAE EATER (they are schooling fish)So its better to have more then one.I have also read that the True SAE are not agressive.The ones that they sale mostly in the pet stores are False SAE and they are agressive sometimes.The two fish are hard to tell apart and are very differnt fish in behavor.most of the time if you see a True SAE in a pet store they know what they got and they will be marked (TRUE) and not marked just as a SAE. You will also pay more then the false SAE in the pet stores.My Aquarium shop happend to have some true SAE in stock and I got only one at the time at a $19.99 price.They are rare in pet store and also very prised in the hobby because they are not agressive and eat more varities of Algae then the false SAE do. Here is a link that sales the True SAE online and will tell you more about them http://www.azgardens.com/algae_eating_fish.php . Do a seach Google online for (Crossocheilus siamensis)True SAE's and see what you find,There is alot of infromation about these guys. I hope this helps Daniel --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > Yes, I was just going to get one. I only want a true Siamese algae > eater, I am not looking at the chinese algae eaters at all. Do you > think one will fit in my community tank? > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, kristopher helsing > <punk3r12@y...> wrote: > > ONE IS FINE BUT THEY WILL FIGHT WITH EACH OTHER SO KEEP ONLY ONE, > THE CHINEASE ALGEA EATERS YOU CAN HAVE MULTIPLE BUT THE SIAMESE WILL > FIGHT.... > > > > thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote:Thank you all for your > posts to my many questions :) I have yet > > another one :) > > > > In a 37 gallon tall tank with 3 otos, 1 bristlenose, 3 zebra > loaches > > and guppies, do you think I could put in a SAE? I read to have > them > > singly or in a group of 5. I think they are too big for me to > have 5 > > so I was thinking one. Is it too big for my tank? I am not > familiar > > with these fish at all, any info is welcomed. > > > > Thanks, again and again and again :) > > Rebecca > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > Marine biology Biology > > > > --------------------------------- > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service. > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14448	From: Andrea	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: Need Help Fast...Sick Betta...think it is VELVET

I'm sorry to hear that you lost your little guy. I know what that feels like :( Three years is a long life for a betta though - you must have taken very good care of him. Good luck with your next one - feel free to email me if you have any questions or just post on the group. Andrea & Approx. 150 bettas, danios, silver mollies, white clouds and cherry barbs --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "T" <bigter4@y...> wrote: > Hi andrea... I lost My Betta last night. I guess I dodnt get to him > in time. Well 3 years was a good run. I wil miss him greatly. The > Colored stones are a great idea. Thank You for all of your help. I > will be looking into another one soon. Thanks again - Terry > > > I've stopped using gravel in my tanks at least for now - it just > > harbours too much waste and leftover food and is harder to keep > > clean. I'm using the flat glass stones right now - the bettas like > > them because they can see themselves reflected in them. It > > entertains them and the stones are pretty and cheap if you get them > > at Walmart (pet stores tend to charge more for them). > > > > Andrea > > > > -- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "T" <bigter4@y...> wrote: > > > Hello Andrea, Thx for the Tips. I will be getting him in a > > > sick "bowl" as soon as I get home. I have the medication and I > will > > > look into the Airstone for him. I never bothered cause the tank > is > > so > > > small but it is a really good idea after what has happened.I hope > I > > > catch this in the early stages. I will have to do good cleaning > of > > > the grvel for excess food ect.. thx -Ter > > > > > > > > > > If it's velvet it is very contagious and sometimes related to > > poor > > > > water conditions. Disinfect any nets etc that you have used in > > that > > > > tank or don't use them in any other tanks. Since it is a > > parasite > > > > that requires light, dim the lighting around the tank (or use > > > > something like pieces of paper to block light entering the > tank) > > > and > > > > raise the water temperature to 82'F (the parasite doesn't do > well > > > with > > > > warmer water). Treatment of choice is copper sulfate and if > you > > > have > > > > a filter on the tank, remove the carbon portion while treating > > the > > > > tank. Salt is always good - I keep salt in all my betta tanks > as > > a > > > > routine thing and have had very little incidence of disease. I > > > also > > > > try to keep their tanks fairly clean, removing any old food or > > > waste > > > > every couple of days so the water quality remains good. At > least > > a > > > > 50% water change is done weekly. I usually aerate my tanks > (even > > > the > > > > small 2 gallon ones) with an airstone as this seems to maintain > > the > > > > water quality better than a still tank (and the bettas like to > > play > > > in > > > > the bubbles :) ) > > > > I have some old timers like yours (3 yrs or older) that I hope > to > > > keep > > > > for a long while yet - they have such personality! > > > > Good luck with your betta guy - hopefully this will help and he > > > will > > > > make a good recovery. > > > > > > > > Andrea & the Senior Guys - Blackie (3.5 yrs old - nearly > black) > > > and > > > > Remington (3 yrs old - steel blue) > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "T" <bigter4@y...> wrote: > > > > > I gave a Male Betta in a 3 gal tank. I have had this Betta > for > > > > almost 3 > > > > > years. He is the fish that got me into all this and later > > > inspired > > > > my > > > > > other Tanks. It looks like he has come down with this in the > > last > > > 48 > > > > > hrs or so.He has all the signs and I did a little research > and > > > will > > > > be > > > > > getting VELVET GAURD from Jumgle products this afternoon. I > put > > > salt > > > > in > > > > > the tank as instructed untill I get some cure. Is there > > anything > > > > else I > > > > > can do?? I cant lose this Fish. - Ter

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14449	From: pam phetteplace	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Betta with columnaris (sp?)...need advice pls.

My female has what I think must be flex (aka columnaris) and she is not responding to medication. She has a large enlarging band of white coloring around her body behind her dorsal fin and seems to be getting white coloring on her underside. This stuff started really slow and she had a small whitish area at her dorsal for over 2 months. Then all of a sudden it seemed to bloom and really get large. I have tried kanamycin. maracyn 1 and 2, and now I am using furazone green and antibiotic food by jungle (which lists columnaris as one of the things it treats). She is eating the food but I have seen no improvement in 2 days. I am doing 20 per cent daily water changes, and her tank parameters are all safe. The temp is 76, ph approx 7.8. Anyone have experience with this nasty stuff? Thanks Pam --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14450	From: pamphetteplace	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: Need Help Fast...Sick Betta...think it is VELVET

Swim free little friend.....

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14451	From: rojeriko	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: Another stocking question

Hi, I have a 38g platy aquarium. I initially added a pair of adult (fully grown) real SAE's. When one of them died during a disease outbreak I bought 2 juniors. They all get along well. The SAE's even learnt to eat flakes and frozen worms, brine shrimp. They are very peaceful. I have lots of platy fries in the aquarium and I never saw them attacking any fish. They are great in controling hair and harder brush algae. I also have 5 otto's for softer algae. The main challenge here is to find the true SAE. Good luck Murat --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > Yes, I was just going to get one. I only want a true Siamese algae > eater, I am not looking at the chinese algae eaters at all. Do you > think one will fit in my community tank? >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14452	From: T	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: Need Help Fast...Sick Betta...think it is VELVET

Hey Andrea... I do hjave one more question...How are the glass stones easier to clean then the grvel??... just wondering thx for yourt note..I am really bummed today - Terry @y...> wrote: > I'm sorry to hear that you lost your little guy. I know what that > feels like :( Three years is a long life for a betta though - you > must have taken very good care of him. Good luck with your next one - > feel free to email me if you have any questions or just post on the > group. > > Andrea & Approx. 150 bettas, danios, silver mollies, white clouds and > cherry barbs > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "T" <bigter4@y...> wrote: > > Hi andrea... I lost My Betta last night. I guess I dodnt get to him > > in time. Well 3 years was a good run. I wil miss him greatly. The > > Colored stones are a great idea. Thank You for all of your help. I > > will be looking into another one soon. Thanks again - Terry > > > > > I've stopped using gravel in my tanks at least for now - it just > > > harbours too much waste and leftover food and is harder to keep > > > clean. I'm using the flat glass stones right now - the bettas > like > > > them because they can see themselves reflected in them. It > > > entertains them and the stones are pretty and cheap if you get > them > > > at Walmart (pet stores tend to charge more for them). > > > > > > Andrea > > > > > > -- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "T" <bigter4@y...> wrote: > > > > Hello Andrea, Thx for the Tips. I will be getting him in a > > > > sick "bowl" as soon as I get home. I have the medication and I > > will > > > > look into the Airstone for him. I never bothered cause the tank > > is > > > so > > > > small but it is a really good idea after what has happened.I > hope > > I > > > > catch this in the early stages. I will have to do good > cleaning > > of > > > > the grvel for excess food ect.. thx -Ter > > > > > > > > > > > > > If it's velvet it is very contagious and sometimes related to > > > poor > > > > > water conditions. Disinfect any nets etc that you have used > in > > > that > > > > > tank or don't use them in any other tanks. Since it is a > > > parasite > > > > > that requires light, dim the lighting around the tank (or use > > > > > something like pieces of paper to block light entering the > > tank) > > > > and > > > > > raise the water temperature to 82'F (the parasite doesn't do > > well > > > > with > > > > > warmer water). Treatment of choice is copper sulfate and if > > you > > > > have > > > > > a filter on the tank, remove the carbon portion while > treating > > > the > > > > > tank. Salt is always good - I keep salt in all my betta > tanks > > as > > > a > > > > > routine thing and have had very little incidence of disease. > I > > > > also > > > > > try to keep their tanks fairly clean, removing any old food > or > > > > waste > > > > > every couple of days so the water quality remains good. At > > least > > > a > > > > > 50% water change is done weekly. I usually aerate my tanks > > (even > > > > the > > > > > small 2 gallon ones) with an airstone as this seems to > maintain > > > the > > > > > water quality better than a still tank (and the bettas like > to > > > play > > > > in > > > > > the bubbles :) ) > > > > > I have some old timers like yours (3 yrs or older) that I > hope > > to > > > > keep > > > > > for a long while yet - they have such personality! > > > > > Good luck with your betta guy - hopefully this will help and > he > > > > will > > > > > make a good recovery. > > > > > > > > > > Andrea & the Senior Guys - Blackie (3.5 yrs old - nearly > > black) > > > > and > > > > > Remington (3 yrs old - steel blue) > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "T" <bigter4@y...> wrote: > > > > > > I gave a Male Betta in a 3 gal tank. I have had this Betta > > for > > > > > almost 3 > > > > > > years. He is the fish that got me into all this and later > > > > inspired > > > > > my > > > > > > other Tanks. It looks like he has come down with this in > the > > > last > > > > 48 > > > > > > hrs or so.He has all the signs and I did a little research > > and > > > > will > > > > > be > > > > > > getting VELVET GAURD from Jumgle products this afternoon. I > > put > > > > salt > > > > > in > > > > > > the tank as instructed untill I get some cure. Is there > > > anything > > > > > else I > > > > > > can do?? I cant lose this Fish. - Ter

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14453	From: T	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: Need Help Fast...Sick Betta...think it is VELVET

Thx Rebacca.. Nice to hear people do care. > So sorry for your loss Terry!! > > Rebecca > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "T" <bigter4@y...> wrote: > > Hi andrea... I lost My Betta last night. I guess I dodnt get to > him > > in time. Well 3 years was a good run. I wil miss him greatly. The > > Colored stones are a great idea. Thank You for all of your help. I > > will be looking into another one soon. Thanks again - Terry > > > > > I've stopped using gravel in my tanks at least for now - it just > > > harbours too much waste and leftover food and is harder to keep > > > clean. I'm using the flat glass stones right now - the bettas > like > > > them because they can see themselves reflected in them. It > > > entertains them and the stones are pretty and cheap if you get > them > > > at Walmart (pet stores tend to charge more for them). > > > > > > Andrea > > > > > > -- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "T" <bigter4@y...> wrote: > > > > Hello Andrea, Thx for the Tips. I will be getting him in a > > > > sick "bowl" as soon as I get home. I have the medication and I > > will > > > > look into the Airstone for him. I never bothered cause the > tank > > is > > > so > > > > small but it is a really good idea after what has happened.I > hope > > I > > > > catch this in the early stages. I will have to do good > cleaning > > of > > > > the grvel for excess food ect.. thx -Ter > > > > > > > > > > > > > If it's velvet it is very contagious and sometimes related > to > > > poor > > > > > water conditions. Disinfect any nets etc that you have used > in > > > that > > > > > tank or don't use them in any other tanks. Since it is a > > > parasite > > > > > that requires light, dim the lighting around the tank (or > use > > > > > something like pieces of paper to block light entering the > > tank) > > > > and > > > > > raise the water temperature to 82'F (the parasite doesn't do > > well > > > > with > > > > > warmer water). Treatment of choice is copper sulfate and if > > you > > > > have > > > > > a filter on the tank, remove the carbon portion while > treating > > > the > > > > > tank. Salt is always good - I keep salt in all my betta > tanks > > as > > > a > > > > > routine thing and have had very little incidence of > disease. I > > > > also > > > > > try to keep their tanks fairly clean, removing any old food > or > > > > waste > > > > > every couple of days so the water quality remains good. At > > least > > > a > > > > > 50% water change is done weekly. I usually aerate my tanks > > (even > > > > the > > > > > small 2 gallon ones) with an airstone as this seems to > maintain > > > the > > > > > water quality better than a still tank (and the bettas like > to > > > play > > > > in > > > > > the bubbles :) ) > > > > > I have some old timers like yours (3 yrs or older) that I > hope > > to > > > > keep > > > > > for a long while yet - they have such personality! > > > > > Good luck with your betta guy - hopefully this will help and > he > > > > will > > > > > make a good recovery. > > > > > > > > > > Andrea & the Senior Guys - Blackie (3.5 yrs old - nearly > > black) > > > > and > > > > > Remington (3 yrs old - steel blue) > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "T" <bigter4@y...> wrote: > > > > > > I gave a Male Betta in a 3 gal tank. I have had this Betta > > for > > > > > almost 3 > > > > > > years. He is the fish that got me into all this and later > > > > inspired > > > > > my > > > > > > other Tanks. It looks like he has come down with this in > the > > > last > > > > 48 > > > > > > hrs or so.He has all the signs and I did a little research > > and > > > > will > > > > > be > > > > > > getting VELVET GAURD from Jumgle products this afternoon. > I > > put > > > > salt > > > > > in > > > > > > the tank as instructed untill I get some cure. Is there > > > anything > > > > > else I > > > > > > can do?? I cant lose this Fish. - Ter

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14454	From: deborahgd14	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: Angie the Angel fish

Ray: thank you so much for your advice. I forgot to mention that I had been treating her (I call her a her because she is so pretty) Pimafix and melafix in large aquarium (44 gallon) on July 12 as her tail had fin rot. Since then, it has almost grown back. I will try and get her the right medication. Thanks again. Deborah D --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > Deborah, Sounds like your water's in good shape, although you don't > indicate an ammonia reading -- but going by your nitrites and > nitrates I can't believe it wouldn't be in a safe normal range. Its > good to see you keep up on the maintenance of the tank. One wouldn't > think that Angelfish are that "touchy" to keep, but it appears as if > the missed weekly water change was just enough stress to allow this > disease to come to the foreground and affect the fish; your Angel > didn't suddenly contract this disease all at once just because of the > lack of fresher water for the two week period. To explain; Hexamita, > a disease that infects the digestive system of many Cichlids, but > especially Angels and Discus, starts its infection in the ensuing > years after maturity (which, in Angels is about 9 months). Fish kept > in the clean conditions that they require (as you have been doing up > until recently) rarely show symptoms of the disease and tend to live > with it, as their immune system keeps tending to ward it off. > Sometimes though, there reaches a point when the balance between the > amount of infection and the fish's manifestation of it becomes > precarious. At that point, all's it may take is the added stress of > not having a change of fresh new water to put things over the edge. > Many wild Angels have this microorganism in their gut and live with > it fine as two co-existing organisms. Then too, wild Angels never > have the stress of having old water as they're in a constantly moving > water environment. While many domestic Angels carry this > microorganism (unknowingly to us), I've never seen it manifest > itself in juvenile Angels, nor in Angels that have just matured. > \ > Furazone - Green is an excellant medication for many ailments, > especially external. However, this is not the medication of choice > to be used against Heximita, partly because it is not readily > absorbed through the fish's tissue where its needed internally. And, > oh yes, fish do not "drink" water in the manner we think of it. I > would suggest getting one of the proper medications needed and then > before using, remove the Furazone-green either by water changes or by > fresh carbon in the filter, after which raise the temperature to 82 o > F. If not too heavily infected, the fish sometimes come around (not > always, so be prepared). If she decides to start eating, feed her > with Jungle Laboratories "Pepso" food which contains medications > needed to clear intestinal fish parasites. You could also make your > own medicated food by making a paste of some flake food and adding > the Metronidazole to it, then rolling it out flat (between wax paper) > and letting it dry and crumble it. If you need to go to "Clout" as a > last resort, you'll need to cut the tablet in half for your 5 gallon > tank. The tablet is meant as a dose for 10 gallons and you do not > want to overdose with this medication. Let us know how it goes. > Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "deborahgd14" <deborahgd14@y...> > wrote: > > Hi Ray: The temperature of the tank is 80; nitrate 20 - safe; > > nitrite 0 - safe; hardness 75 - soft; alkiline - 80 moderate; ph > 7.2 > > neutral. > > > > I put her in a five gallon tank and put furazone - green which I > > purchased and was recommended from my LFS. > > > > I keep my tank very clean and usually do water changes every week. > > I didn't last week, could that be it? I have had her for 1-1/2 > > years and she has done fine. Thank you for your help. Deborah D > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" > > <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > Addition to Post: Sorry, I meant to say Aquatronics (not > Aquarium > > > Pharmaceuticals) as a possible second source of Metronidazole if > > you > > > can find it -- I believe they have gone out out business. > > Ray > > > > > > \ > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" > > <sevenspringss@w...> > > > wrote: > > > > Deborah, You haven't mentioned what temperature you keep your > > fish > > > at, > > > > nor did you let us know what the water parameters (pH, ammonia, > > > > nitrites. etc.) are. Anyway, this sounds like Hexamita, an > > > internal > > > > disease which Angels are quite susceptible to. Isolate the > fish > > if > > > > possible for ease of treatment. If you can't you'll have to > > treat > > > the > > > > whole tank. Do a partial (1/3) water change and raise the > > > temperature > > > > to 82 o. Treat with Metronidazole, by Seachem (Aquarium > > > Pharmaceuticals > > > > used to have it, in capsule form, if you can still find it). > > > > Metronidazole is not readily diluted in water, so use a small > > > quantity > > > > of hot (not boiling) water. As Metronidazole is not as readily > > > > absorbed through the fish's tissue as is Kanamycin, it helps to > > add > > > > this medication as well. Read the directions, you'll need to > > > repeat > > > > this every 2 days, and remove carbon from the filter. > Sometimes > > > the > > > > fish do not respond to treatment -- in which case you can try > > Clout > > > as > > > > a last resort. Seems the less an Angelfish's tank water is > > > changed, > > > > the more possible it is that they'll sooner or later get this > > > disease. > > > > For absolute best maintenance of Angels, they should receive a > > > partial > > > > water change every 2 days, even though that sounds extreme. If > > not > > > > feasible in your circumstances, then at least once a week. > > > Ray > > > > > > > > > > \ > > > > > -- > > > > - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "deborahgd14" > > <deborahgd14@y...> > > > > wrote: > > > > > Hello Everyone: My angel is acting really strange. She > > didn't > > > eat > > > > > today and either hangs out at the top corner or on the > > bottom. > > > What > > > > > do you think I should do? A salt bath? And > > > > > what would that consist of. I don't want to stress her out > > any > > > more > > > > > than she is. She freaks out when the fish net goes in the > > tank > > > as it > > > > > is. Thanks. Deborah D

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14455	From: T	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: Need Help Fast...Sick Betta...think it is VELVET

Thank You! I like looking at it that way :) > Swim free little friend.....

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14456	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: Angie the Angel fish

Forgot to mention the Hexamita parasite medication that was put out by Aquatronics is not labeled "Metronidazole" as is Seachem's, but is call "Hex-a-mit". The product "Flagyl" (I forget who makes it) is also metronidazole. I understand that "Paragon II" (again by Aquatronics) is also effective, although I've never tried it. By the way, since you had success using Pimafix with Melafix, I'm curious as to what your pH is (there was a recent didcussion about this). Thanx, Ray--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "deborahgd14" <deborahgd14@y...> wrote: > Ray: thank you so much for your advice. I forgot to mention that I > had been treating her (I call her a her because she is so pretty) > Pimafix and melafix in large aquarium (44 gallon) on July 12 as her > tail had fin rot. Since then, it has almost grown back. I will try > and get her the right medication. Thanks again. Deborah D > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" > <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > Deborah, Sounds like your water's in good shape, although you > don't > > indicate an ammonia reading -- but going by your nitrites and > > nitrates I can't believe it wouldn't be in a safe normal range. > Its > > good to see you keep up on the maintenance of the tank. One > wouldn't > > think that Angelfish are that "touchy" to keep, but it appears as > if > > the missed weekly water change was just enough stress to allow > this > > disease to come to the foreground and affect the fish; your Angel > > didn't suddenly contract this disease all at once just because of > the > > lack of fresher water for the two week period. To explain; > Hexamita, > > a disease that infects the digestive system of many Cichlids, but > > especially Angels and Discus, starts its infection in the ensuing > > years after maturity (which, in Angels is about 9 months). Fish > kept > > in the clean conditions that they require (as you have been doing > up > > until recently) rarely show symptoms of the disease and tend to > live > > with it, as their immune system keeps tending to ward it off. > > Sometimes though, there reaches a point when the balance between > the > > amount of infection and the fish's manifestation of it becomes > > precarious. At that point, all's it may take is the added stress > of > > not having a change of fresh new water to put things over the > edge. > > Many wild Angels have this microorganism in their gut and live > with > > it fine as two co-existing organisms. Then too, wild Angels never > > have the stress of having old water as they're in a constantly > moving > > water environment. While many domestic Angels carry this > > microorganism (unknowingly to us), I've never seen it manifest > > itself in juvenile Angels, nor in Angels that have just > matured. > > > \ > > > Furazone - Green is an excellant medication for many ailments, > > especially external. However, this is not the medication of > choice > > to be used against Heximita, partly because it is not readily > > absorbed through the fish's tissue where its needed internally. > And, > > oh yes, fish do not "drink" water in the manner we think of it. I > > would suggest getting one of the proper medications needed and > then > > before using, remove the Furazone-green either by water changes or > by > > fresh carbon in the filter, after which raise the temperature to > 82 o > > F. If not too heavily infected, the fish sometimes come around > (not > > always, so be prepared). If she decides to start eating, feed her > > with Jungle Laboratories "Pepso" food which contains medications > > needed to clear intestinal fish parasites. You could also make > your > > own medicated food by making a paste of some flake food and adding > > the Metronidazole to it, then rolling it out flat (between wax > paper) > > and letting it dry and crumble it. If you need to go to "Clout" > as a > > last resort, you'll need to cut the tablet in half for your 5 > gallon > > tank. The tablet is meant as a dose for 10 gallons and you do not > > want to overdose with this medication. Let us know how it goes. > > > Ray > > > \ > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "deborahgd14" > <deborahgd14@y...> > > wrote: > > > Hi Ray: The temperature of the tank is 80; nitrate 20 - safe; > > > nitrite 0 - safe; hardness 75 - soft; alkiline - 80 moderate; ph > > 7.2 > > > neutral. > > > > > > I put her in a five gallon tank and put furazone - green which I > > > purchased and was recommended from my LFS. > > > > > > I keep my tank very clean and usually do water changes every > week. > > > I didn't last week, could that be it? I have had her for 1-1/2 > > > years and she has done fine. Thank you for your help. Deborah D > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" > > > <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > > Addition to Post: Sorry, I meant to say Aquatronics (not > > Aquarium > > > > Pharmaceuticals) as a possible second source of Metronidazole > if > > > you > > > > can find it -- I believe they have gone out out business. > > > Ray > > > > > > > > > > \ > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" > > > <sevenspringss@w...> > > > > wrote: > > > > > Deborah, You haven't mentioned what temperature you keep > your > > > fish > > > > at, > > > > > nor did you let us know what the water parameters (pH, > ammonia, > > > > > nitrites. etc.) are. Anyway, this sounds like Hexamita, an > > > > internal > > > > > disease which Angels are quite susceptible to. Isolate the > > fish > > > if > > > > > possible for ease of treatment. If you can't you'll have to > > > treat > > > > the > > > > > whole tank. Do a partial (1/3) water change and raise the > > > > temperature > > > > > to 82 o. Treat with Metronidazole, by Seachem (Aquarium > > > > Pharmaceuticals > > > > > used to have it, in capsule form, if you can still find > it). > > > > > Metronidazole is not readily diluted in water, so use a > small > > > > quantity > > > > > of hot (not boiling) water. As Metronidazole is not as > readily > > > > > absorbed through the fish's tissue as is Kanamycin, it helps > to > > > add > > > > > this medication as well. Read the directions, you'll need > to > > > > repeat > > > > > this every 2 days, and remove carbon from the filter. > > Sometimes > > > > the > > > > > fish do not respond to treatment -- in which case you can > try > > > Clout > > > > as > > > > > a last resort. Seems the less an Angelfish's tank water is > > > > changed, > > > > > the more possible it is that they'll sooner or later get > this > > > > disease. > > > > > For absolute best maintenance of Angels, they should receive > a > > > > partial > > > > > water change every 2 days, even though that sounds extreme. > If > > > not > > > > > feasible in your circumstances, then at least once a week. > > > > Ray > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > \ > > > > > > > -- > > > > > - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "deborahgd14" > > > <deborahgd14@y...> > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > Hello Everyone: My angel is acting really strange. She > > > didn't > > > > eat > > > > > > today and either hangs out at the top corner or on the > > > bottom. > > > > What > > > > > > do you think I should do? A salt bath? And > > > > > > what would that consist of. I don't want to stress her > out > > > any > > > > more > > > > > > than she is. She freaks out when the fish net goes in the > > > tank > > > > as it > > > > > > is. Thanks. Deborah D

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14457	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: Betta with columnaris (sp?)...need advice pls.

Good results can be effected using Furan 2, although any furanace based medication such as what you are using will be just as good. Acriflavin is also effective against Flexibacteria such as columnaris and may be safely used in conjunction with furanace type drugs. Do not use this nor the Furazone green if you have Loaches. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, pam phetteplace <pamphetteplace@y...> wrote: > > My female has what I think must be flex (aka columnaris) and she is not responding to medication. She has a large enlarging band of white coloring around her body behind her dorsal fin and seems to be getting white coloring on her underside. This stuff started really slow and she had a small whitish area at her dorsal for over 2 months. Then all of a sudden it seemed to bloom and really get large. I have tried kanamycin. maracyn 1 and 2, and now I am using furazone green and antibiotic food by jungle (which lists columnaris as one of the things it treats). She is eating the food but I have seen no improvement in 2 days. I am doing 20 per cent daily water changes, and her tank parameters are all safe. The temp is 76, ph approx 7.8. Anyone have experience with this nasty stuff? > > Thanks > > Pam > > > --------------------------------- > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14458	From: pamphetteplace	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: Betta with columnaris (sp?)...need advice pls.

Is it ok to treat with this and also give her the antibiotic food by jungle? She is not getting any better, is there anything else I can do? Thanks-- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > Good results can be effected using Furan 2, although any furanace > based medication such as what you are using will be just as good. > Acriflavin is also effective against Flexibacteria such as columnaris > and may be safely used in conjunction with furanace type drugs. Do > not use this nor the Furazone green if you have Loaches. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, pam phetteplace > <pamphetteplace@y...> wrote: > > > > My female has what I think must be flex (aka columnaris) and she is > not responding to medication. She has a large enlarging band of > white coloring around her body behind her dorsal fin and seems to be > getting white coloring on her underside. This stuff started really > slow and she had a small whitish area at her dorsal for over 2 > months. Then all of a sudden it seemed to bloom and really get > large. I have tried kanamycin. maracyn 1 and 2, and now I am using > furazone green and antibiotic food by jungle (which lists columnaris > as one of the things it treats). She is eating the food but I have > seen no improvement in 2 days. I am doing 20 per cent daily water > changes, and her tank parameters are all safe. The temp is 76, ph > approx 7.8. Anyone have experience with this nasty stuff? > > > > Thanks > > > > Pam > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14459	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: Koi question

I pictured about that size, but really wasn't sure, thanks. While plenty deep, that's really not that much surface area; I seem to recall you saying that she just bought 20 goldfish and 4 koi(?). Good thing they're small otherwise I might have my doubts about them making it to the Winter, let alone through the Winter. She has about 400 gallons, but its mostly verticle. Best thing she can do right now until the water gets much colder is to run a small pond filter (a self-contained Pondmaster #200 pump/filter unit for instance -- good for at least 300 gallons - $90+) and run the return tube up, above the surface and let the return water flow back onto the pond creating a good surface circulation. She'll need a larger filter though, next year after she increases the pond size. If she doesn't want to get a filter right now, she should at least have an air pump for aeration to turn the surface over. Can't put the air stone down six feet though (18" - or less is plenty), it will never pump. This is not for winter; I talking about right now, for more oxygen absorption into the water. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "thesydmonster" <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > I would say it's about 3' on each side, square shaped, and at least 6 > feet deep. I know some of the goldfish they bought last year made it > through the winter living in there but they are bigger this year. The > goldfish and koi she bought this year she just got last week and are > all very small. > > Rebecca > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> > wrote: > > It would probably be best if the Koi were kept in an aquarium until > > next year, if they're not too large. I doubt if they'll make it in > > the "trash-container" size remnant of a pool you described. > Speaking > > of which, how large is this "trash-container-sized" water > recepticle? > > > Ray

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14460	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: Betta with columnaris (sp?)...need advice pls.

Columnaris is not the easiest thing to successfully treat sometimes. Yes, you can certainly also give her antibiotic food along with the tank medication, although this is mainly for an internal infection, of course -- but it may just help boost her immune system, and can't hurt. You might consider adding the Acriflavin; that can be bought in a liquid solution called "Fungus Cure" in a red and yellow bottle, by Aquarium Pharmaceuticals, and while I seldom double-dose any meds, this is one I have no problem in doing that with. I also use it for eggs as an funguscide, using it double strength. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "pamphetteplace" <pamphetteplace@y...> wrote: > Is it ok to treat with this and also give her the antibiotic food by > jungle? She is not getting any better, is there anything else I > can do? > > Thanks-- > > In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> > wrote: > > Good results can be effected using Furan 2, although any furanace > > based medication such as what you are using will be just as good. > > Acriflavin is also effective against Flexibacteria such as > columnaris > > and may be safely used in conjunction with furanace type drugs. > Do > > not use this nor the Furazone green if you have Loaches. Ray > > > \ > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, pam phetteplace > > <pamphetteplace@y...> wrote: > > > > > > My female has what I think must be flex (aka columnaris) and she > is > > not responding to medication. She has a large enlarging band of > > white coloring around her body behind her dorsal fin and seems to > be > > getting white coloring on her underside. This stuff started > really > > slow and she had a small whitish area at her dorsal for over 2 > > months. Then all of a sudden it seemed to bloom and really get > > large. I have tried kanamycin. maracyn 1 and 2, and now I am > using > > furazone green and antibiotic food by jungle (which lists > columnaris > > as one of the things it treats). She is eating the food but I > have > > seen no improvement in 2 days. I am doing 20 per cent daily water > > changes, and her tank parameters are all safe. The temp is 76, > ph > > approx 7.8. Anyone have experience with this nasty stuff? > > > > > > Thanks > > > > > > Pam > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14461	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: hello, intro, and a ? about african knifefish

The dragonfish I have looks nothing like those. Sarah Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: Do the dragonfish look anything like the fish here -- http://tinyurl.com/d6n53 ? If so, they are not freshwater fish. They are brackish to marine fish and should not be kept in freshwater. This may be why they are in such poor shape. They also feed minute creatures found in an on the mud of their home waters. They are, at least in some areas, considered to be an endangered species. \\Steve// __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14462	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: was african knifefish/now dragonfish

I'll definately check out the group,thanks Chris :) I'll look for some pics and info on what I have too, I know it's out there somewhere because my husband found several websites about them. I'm having major computer problems at home so I'm at my mom's right now trying to get caught up on emails, lol! Sarah Chris <youcantryreachingme@...> wrote: Yes, gobies are interesting critters. Until this year I had hardly anything to do with them, but earlier in the year I collected some marine/fresh gobies (legally) and have been fascinated ever since. In my case a full grown fish is about 4cm (2"?). I joined a yahoo group named "gobygroup", where I've posted some photos under a directory in my yahoo name - if you're interested. I'd love to see some photos of the fish you've got if you find a link for some online. Chris. Sarah Fleming Davis <keelis_mom@...> wrote: Yes, they are gobi's! When we got ours home my hubby researched them online Send instant messages to your online friends http://au.messenger.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply and if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14463	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: link for dragon gobies

This is the fish I have... http://www.fishtanksandponds.net/resources/articles/dragon_gobies.htm Sarah

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14464	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: High level of Phosphate in my water

nope, they're designed to work safely within the tank. --- thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@...> wrote: > Do the phosphate reducing chemicals adversly affect the fish or pH > or bacteria or anything like that? I also have a high level of > phosphates in my water but would rather have the algae than hurt > anything living in my tank! > > Thanks, > Rebecca > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Valeen Gonzalez > <valeendgonzalez@y...> wrote: > > i use something called phosx or something like that on my sw tank, > which works really well. > > there's also phos ban which i've also heard works well. > > > > i don't know how long, if at all, you leave your lights on, but > i've found that by leaving my > > lights off for most of the day lessens the algae. > > > > hope this helps. > > > > --- Nicolas Munro <nmunro@q...> wrote: > > > > > Hi, > > > > > > I have a Hagen test kit which says under 1 ppm is ok (as far as > I can > > > recall) and the test measurement should be taken after 2 minutes > of > > > reaction and it has a high level of 5ppm. > > > > > > I'm getting a high reading of Phosphate in my water. When I test > my > > > water I get more than 5ppm in just 30 seconds which to me > indicates a > > > problem. > > > > > > My fish tank is suffering from algae which sticks on the glass > and also > > > makes the water a slight green / yellow colour. > > > > > > > > > > > > My question is simple but I can't find many alternatives, how > do I > > > reduce the phosphate? > > > > > > I've got lots of live plants, I've tried underfeeding my fish > for a > > > week, I've tried replacing water very regularly (more than 90% > for a > > > couple of weeks/water changes) - my tap water by the way has > 0.5ppm > > > Phosphate after a reaction time of 2 minutes. > > > > > > _Are there any alternatives? _ > > > > > > =Nick > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > > My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!! > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14465	From: T	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: link for dragon gobies

Hi Sarah! I have this same fish. When I got him it referred ot as a "DRAGON EEL", but this is him. Moine was very samll whenI got him, and is now close to 9 inches long. He bothers no one in the tank and loveds to eat Veggie rounds and Ghost Shrimp. - Terry > This is the fish I have... > http://www.fishtanksandponds.net/resources/articles/dragon_gobies.htm > > Sarah

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14466	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: link for dragon gobies

I just called the store I buy from the most, Coral Sea in Riverside, and they said inspite of its maximum size and appearance, you have to make sure your fish won't pick on it. I said the info I found said to watch out for small fish, but they said my cories and my neons would be just fine with them. They said they are actually called a Violet goby, and that they are half blind, but other than that, said they are great with a lot of character. Think I might get one myself. I love their look. Kinda like a chinese dragon. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sarah Fleming Davis" <keelis_mom@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2005 11:58 AM Subject: [AquaticLife] link for dragon gobies This is the fish I have... http://www.fishtanksandponds.net/resources/articles/dragon_gobies.htm Sarah Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14467	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: But...but...what happened?!

This morning everything was fine in the tank. Nitrate levels a teensy bit high, but they've been higher with no problems. Did a partial water change, fed the fishies. Then just an hour ago our golden gourami suddenly started spinning over and over and died within a minute. His mouth kept gaping, there were no wounds or lesions or bulges that I could see. Fins were not clamped...It was so sad! He was nearly three years old and so calm and peaceable!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14468	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: salt question

We put salt in our tank because of the gobi and the needlefish and the other fish seem ok with it. Sarah Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: Unless there is a specific need, one does not need to add salt to a freshwater tank. Salt is often used as an emergency remedy until one can resolve the issue with the proper medication. It is also used as a remedy in and of itself for certain parasites. Having said that, there are certain fish that can benefit from a regular addition of salt to the aquarium. One such genus of fish would be mollies, which are often found in estaturine environments where they are regularly exposed to salt in the environment. Other livebearers may also respond positively to such treatment. In a general community tank, it would not be wise to keep a level of salt in the tank. There are many fish that can be adversely affected by the regular addition of salt. So, in the end, only use salt when its use is indicated for the tank as a whole. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Sandy Kay Sent: Wednesday, August 10, 2005 10:28 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] salt question Some have said they keep salt in their water. I have freshwater and know you are supposed to use the non iodine kind. Do you have any more specifics? My tank is a 10 gallon. How much to use and when, etc. Thank you, Sandy Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14469	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: hello, intro, and a ? about african knifefish

perhaps it's a violet goby, pictured here: http://species.fishindex.com/species_910gobioides_broussonnetii_violet_goby.html --- Sarah Fleming Davis <keelis_mom@...> wrote: > The dragonfish I have looks nothing like those. > > Sarah > > > Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > Do the dragonfish look anything like the fish here -- > http://tinyurl.com/d6n53 ? If so, they are not freshwater fish. They are > brackish to marine fish and should not be kept in freshwater. This may be > why they are in such poor shape. They also feed minute creatures found in an > on the mud of their home waters. They are, at least in some areas, > considered to be an endangered species. > > \\Steve// > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14470	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: hello, intro, and a ? about african knifefish

perhaps it's a violet goby, pictured here: http://species.fishindex.com/species_910gobioides_broussonnetii_violet_goby.html --- Sarah Fleming Davis <keelis_mom@...> wrote: > The dragonfish I have looks nothing like those. > > Sarah > > > Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > Do the dragonfish look anything like the fish here -- > http://tinyurl.com/d6n53 ? If so, they are not freshwater fish. They are > brackish to marine fish and should not be kept in freshwater. This may be > why they are in such poor shape. They also feed minute creatures found in an > on the mud of their home waters. They are, at least in some areas, > considered to be an endangered species. > > \\Steve// > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14471	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: hello, intro, and a ? about african knifefish

perhaps it's a violet goby, pictured here: http://species.fishindex.com/species_910gobioides_broussonnetii_violet_goby.html --- Sarah Fleming Davis <keelis_mom@...> wrote: > The dragonfish I have looks nothing like those. > > Sarah > > > Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > Do the dragonfish look anything like the fish here -- > http://tinyurl.com/d6n53 ? If so, they are not freshwater fish. They are > brackish to marine fish and should not be kept in freshwater. This may be > why they are in such poor shape. They also feed minute creatures found in an > on the mud of their home waters. They are, at least in some areas, > considered to be an endangered species. > > \\Steve// > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14472	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: violet gobi and do you name your fish?

Yes that's it :) Thanks for the info, I found what I was trying say earlier...filter feeder!!! I knew there was a name for it, lol! Wow, they get to be 2 ft?!?!?! I really like mine, his name is Fang by the way ;) Does anyone else name their fish? Sarah Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote: perhaps it's a violet goby, pictured here: http://species.fishindex.com/species_910gobioides_broussonnetii_violet_goby.html --- Sarah Fleming Davis <keelis_mom@...> wrote: > The dragonfish I have looks nothing like those. > > Sarah > > > Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > Do the dragonfish look anything like the fish here -- > http://tinyurl.com/d6n53 ? If so, they are not freshwater fish. They are --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14473	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists every Thursday Thursday August 11, 2005 8:00 pm - 10:00 pm This event repeats every week. The next reminder for this event will be sent in 3 hours, 3 minutes. Event Location: http://chat.thatpetplace.com/chat/chat.aspx Notes: Return to this site every Thursday from 8pm to 10pm and Monday from 8pm to 9pm (Eastern Time) to chat LIVE with one of our on-staff Marine Biologists. Learn about your fish, how to treat common maladies, get recommendations on accessories, food and live animal compatibility, or ask a question that only an expert could answer. MarineBio Chat every Thursday 8pm to 10pm EST, only from That Fish Place, The Original Aquatic Superstore. Attention MarineBio chat participants! The chat server is unavailable until 8pm Eastern Time. If you experience problems while trying to log on to the chat session Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14474	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: my catfish ate my snails!!!

Have any of you ever seen a catfish eat a snail??? It was so weird! I had just turned out the light last night(I am finally realizing that the catfish aren't very active until the light's out) and my big albino chanel cat came out and grabbed a snail and shook it right out of it's shell and ate it!!! Then this morning there was another empty shell :( I feel really bad for the snail but I'm also wondering if he did it because he wasn't getting enough food and was hungary? What do you think? Sarah

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14475	From: Robert	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: violet gobi and do you name your fish?

Yes I name my fish, Slippery Pete, Bob and Boris. I have a cat named Fang. Robert ----- Original Message ----- From: Sarah Fleming Davis To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, August 12, 2005 6:40 AM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: violet gobi and do you name your fish? Yes that's it :) Thanks for the info, I found what I was trying say earlier...filter feeder!!! I knew there was a name for it, lol! Wow, they get to be 2 ft?!?!?! I really like mine, his name is Fang by the way ;) Does anyone else name their fish? Sarah Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote: perhaps it's a violet goby, pictured here: http://species.fishindex.com/species_910gobioides_broussonnetii_violet_goby.html --- Sarah Fleming Davis <keelis_mom@...> wrote: > The dragonfish I have looks nothing like those. > > Sarah > > > Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > Do the dragonfish look anything like the fish here -- > http://tinyurl.com/d6n53 ? If so, they are not freshwater fish. They are --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14476	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: violet gobi and do you name your fish?

i name some of mine like my angel whose name is angel lol =) --- Sarah Fleming Davis <keelis_mom@...> wrote: > Yes that's it :) Thanks for the info, I found what I was trying say earlier...filter feeder!!! > I knew there was a name for it, lol! Wow, they get to be 2 ft?!?!?! I really like mine, his > name is Fang by the way ;) > Does anyone else name their fish? > > Sarah > > > Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote: > perhaps it's a violet goby, pictured here: > > http://species.fishindex.com/species_910gobioides_broussonnetii_violet_goby.html > > --- Sarah Fleming Davis <keelis_mom@...> wrote: > > > The dragonfish I have looks nothing like those. > > > > Sarah > > > > > > Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > > Do the dragonfish look anything like the fish here -- > > http://tinyurl.com/d6n53 ? If so, they are not freshwater fish. They are > > > --------------------------------- > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14477	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: link for dragon gobies/Terry

I've been wondering if that's who eating up the ghost shrimp!!! lol!! Mine's only about 5 inches long at this point but we've only had him about a month. I can't wait to see him get bigger and man does he love to eat!!! I agree, he takes no nitice of the other fish at all, lol, and they just try to stay out of his way ;) What are veggie rounds?? Sarah T <bigter4@...> wrote: Hi Sarah! I have this same fish. When I got him it referred ot as a "DRAGON EEL", but this is him. Moine was very samll whenI got him, and is now close to 9 inches long. He bothers no one in the tank and loveds to eat Veggie rounds and Ghost Shrimp. - Terry > This is the fish I have... > http://www.fishtanksandponds.net/resources/articles/dragon_gobies.htm > > Sarah Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14478	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: violet gobi and do you name your fish?

Oh good, lol, I thought I was the only one ;) I also have Bullet, Honey, Beetle Bug, Dino, Dinah, and the Rainbow Sisters(3 glass cats)! :) Sarah Robert <coffeex10@...> wrote: Yes I name my fish, Slippery Pete, Bob and Boris. I have a cat named Fang. Robert ----- Original Message ----- From: Sarah Fleming Davis To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, August 12, 2005 6:40 AM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: violet gobi and do you name your fish? Yes that's it :) Thanks for the info, I found what I was trying say earlier...filter feeder!!! I knew there was a name for it, lol! Wow, they get to be 2 ft?!?!?! I really like mine, his name is Fang by the way ;) Does anyone else name their fish? Sarah Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote: perhaps it's a violet goby, pictured here: http://species.fishindex.com/species_910gobioides_broussonnetii_violet_goby.html --- Sarah Fleming Davis <keelis_mom@...> wrote: > The dragonfish I have looks nothing like those. > > Sarah > > > Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > Do the dragonfish look anything like the fish here -- > http://tinyurl.com/d6n53 ? If so, they are not freshwater fish. They are --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14479	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: violet gobi and do you name your fish?

I name some of them. Horace is the leader of my blue gourami. Ataru is my larger pleco, Goemon is the smaller (er, was, think they are the same now) pleco. My Dojo Loach is Confuse-shus. My three albino cories are the Three Stooges do to their tendancy to go full bore at times around the tank not caring what they might hit. The others have no name...yet. :D -Steve ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sarah Fleming Davis" <keelis_mom@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2005 1:40 PM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: violet gobi and do you name your fish? Yes that's it :) Thanks for the info, I found what I was trying say earlier...filter feeder!!! I knew there was a name for it, lol! Wow, they get to be 2 ft?!?!?! I really like mine, his name is Fang by the way ;) Does anyone else name their fish? Sarah

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14480	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: salt question

Sarah, did you say you have cory cats? I thought they did not do well in tanks with long term salt use? Wouldn't it be better for the true freshwater fish to be in a freshwater tank and the brackish fish be in a brackish tank instead of trying to combine them? Just asking... Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Sarah Fleming Davis <keelis_mom@y...> wrote: > We put salt in our tank because of the gobi and the needlefish and the other fish seem ok with it. > > Sarah > > > Steve Szabo <steve@l...> wrote: > Unless there is a specific need, one does not need to add salt to a > freshwater tank. Salt is often used as an emergency remedy until one can > resolve the issue with the proper medication. It is also used as a remedy in > and of itself for certain parasites. > > Having said that, there are certain fish that can benefit from a regular > addition of salt to the aquarium. One such genus of fish would be mollies, > which are often found in estaturine environments where they are regularly > exposed to salt in the environment. Other livebearers may also respond > positively to such treatment. > > In a general community tank, it would not be wise to keep a level of salt in > the tank. There are many fish that can be adversely affected by the regular > addition of salt. So, in the end, only use salt when its use is indicated > for the tank as a whole. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Sandy Kay > Sent: Wednesday, August 10, 2005 10:28 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] salt question > > Some have said they keep salt in their water. I have freshwater and know you > are supposed to use the non iodine kind. Do you have any more specifics? My > tank is a 10 gallon. How much to use and when, etc. Thank you, Sandy > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine biology Biology > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > --------------------------------- > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14481	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: my catfish ate my snails!!!

Yes, I'd say he might have been hungry, and rightly so. Do you realize that Channel Catfish average at least 15 pounds and grow to about 30" (average) or better. Larger ones can get to at least 35 pounds. Perhaps not albinos, but they can't be too far behind. Better watch that he doesn't eye up his tank mates for a meal. Ray \ -- - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Sarah Fleming Davis" <keelis_mom@y...> wrote: > Have any of you ever seen a catfish eat a snail??? It was so weird! > I had just turned out the light last night(I am finally realizing that > the catfish aren't very active until the light's out) and my big > albino chanel cat came out and grabbed a snail and shook it right out > of it's shell and ate it!!! Then this morning there was another empty > shell :( I feel really bad for the snail but I'm also wondering if he > did it because he wasn't getting enough food and was hungary? What do > you think? > > Sarah

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14482	From: Tom Ray	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: salt question

I think you may benefit from doing a Google search to find a list of species OK and NOT, and to find dosage. From personal experience, various Betta species (including mouthbrooders) have been OK with periodic salt dosings (mouthbrooders seem to also like liquid ferts). So too have Rainbows and Day Paradisefish. Catfish (other than Cories) from what I hear do not like salt [NOTE: not sure about Cories and most Catfish, but my one experience was "does not" and I've heard other stories]. --TommyBoy --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Sandy Kay" <knightwriter101@y...> wrote: > Some have said they keep salt in their water. I have freshwater and know you > are supposed to use the non iodine kind. Do you have any more specifics? My > tank is a 10 gallon. How much to use and when, etc. > > Thank you, Sandy > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14483	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists every Thursday Thursday August 11, 2005 8:00 pm - 10:00 pm This event repeats every week. Event Location: http://chat.thatpetplace.com/chat/chat.aspx Notes: Return to this site every Thursday from 8pm to 10pm and Monday from 8pm to 9pm (Eastern Time) to chat LIVE with one of our on-staff Marine Biologists. Learn about your fish, how to treat common maladies, get recommendations on accessories, food and live animal compatibility, or ask a question that only an expert could answer. MarineBio Chat every Thursday 8pm to 10pm EST, only from That Fish Place, The Original Aquatic Superstore. Attention MarineBio chat participants! The chat server is unavailable until 8pm Eastern Time. If you experience problems while trying to log on to the chat session Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14484	From: Leslie	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: AquaTank Filtration Question

I've acquired an aquatank model 202 for our male betta. It has an under gravel system but I'm miffed as to how it works. There is the plastic insert along with the attached tube. It looks as though I am supposed to insert the bubble disc into the filter tube but I don't see how that makes any sense. Maybe I am completely missing it here but I don't see how this filters anything at all. Included parts are the "under gravel filtration system" which consists of the plastic bottom insert and tube, air pump, air tube attached to a small bubble disc and that's it. How does this filtration work and if I have everything I need how do I set it up other than putting this bubble disc into the tube? Honestly, this looks to me like a joke to make people think they have something that works. I feel stupid. Lol Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14485	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: AquaTank Filtration Question

Leslie, You need to put the air stone in the tube. The action of the bubbles moves the water down through the gravel and up through the tube. When it is set up correctly and maintained correctly, the undergravel filter is a very good filter. You can check the actual water flow if you remove enough water so that the water level is just below the tube's outlet. Water will flow out of the outlet, thus you can prove to yourself that it does, indeed, work. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Leslie Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2005 8:31 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com; naturalaquariumenthusiast@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] AquaTank Filtration Question I've acquired an aquatank model 202 for our male betta. It has an under gravel system but I'm miffed as to how it works. There is the plastic insert along with the attached tube. It looks as though I am supposed to insert the bubble disc into the filter tube but I don't see how that makes any sense. Maybe I am completely missing it here but I don't see how this filters anything at all. Included parts are the "under gravel filtration system" which consists of the plastic bottom insert and tube, air pump, air tube attached to a small bubble disc and that's it. How does this filtration work and if I have everything I need how do I set it up other than putting this bubble disc into the tube? Honestly, this looks to me like a joke to make people think they have something that works. I feel stupid. Lol Leslie

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14486	From: Leslie	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: AquaTank Filtration Question

Now see... I said I felt stupid and you guys just proved me to have good reason to do so. Thanks for the info. I was offered yet another one for free so I will take it since it isn't as useless as I thought. Learn something new everyday, especially in this group. Thanks, Leslie H -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2005 8:45 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] AquaTank Filtration Question Leslie, You need to put the air stone in the tube. The action of the bubbles moves the water down through the gravel and up through the tube. When it is set up correctly and maintained correctly, the undergravel filter is a very good filter. You can check the actual water flow if you remove enough water so that the water level is just below the tube's outlet. Water will flow out of the outlet, thus you can prove to yourself that it does, indeed, work. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Leslie Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2005 8:31 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com; naturalaquariumenthusiast@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] AquaTank Filtration Question I've acquired an aquatank model 202 for our male betta. It has an under gravel system but I'm miffed as to how it works. There is the plastic insert along with the attached tube. It looks as though I am supposed to insert the bubble disc into the filter tube but I don't see how that makes any sense. Maybe I am completely missing it here but I don't see how this filters anything at all. Included parts are the "under gravel filtration system" which consists of the plastic bottom insert and tube, air pump, air tube attached to a small bubble disc and that's it. How does this filtration work and if I have everything I need how do I set it up other than putting this bubble disc into the tube? Honestly, this looks to me like a joke to make people think they have something that works. I feel stupid. Lol Leslie Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14487	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: The San Diego Tropical Fish Society , 8/14/2005, 7:00 pm

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife The San Diego Tropical Fish Society Sunday August 14, 2005 7:00 pm - 8:00 pm This event repeats on the second Sunday of every month. Event Location: room 101, Casa Del Prado, Balboa Park at 7:00 PM Street: SAN DIEGO TROPICAL FISH SOCIETY, PO Box 4156, North Park Station City, State, Zip: San Diego, CA 92164 Phone: 619-281-FISH Notes: http://www.geocities.com/sandiegofishfan/ You are cordially invited to attend our next meeting in room 101, Casa Del Prado, Balboa Park at 7:00 PM on the second Sunday of the month. Visitors are always welcome! 619-281-FISH ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14488	From: Chris	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: AquaTank Filtration Question

Yes, and the way that the filter works is to encourage bacteria to grow on the surface of your gravel. (It encourages this by increasing the waterflow through the gravel). The bacteria break down toxic wastes in the water. Such wastes commonly come from decomposing food (don't overfeed), plant material and fish wastes. I always tell people that an undergravel doesn't keep your tank looking *clean* - it keeps your water *healthy*. You can't really see the effect of the toxic wastes being broken down. If you find that the tank still gets dirty, you may well need additional filtration which removes physical particles from the water (for example, a power filter - either internal or external). However, there is one thing more you can do which works well with an undergravel filter - buy a "gravel cleaner". All it is, is simply plastic tubing with a solid plastic cylinder attached to the end. When it comes time to do your water change, you use the gravel cleaner - syphon the water out as normal, but using the large plastic cylinder, churn up the gravel. Because the undergravel encourages water to move down into the gravel, you find it does a good job of keeping fish wastes and excess food at the bottom of the tank. The gravel cleaner, because of it's larger diameter will syphon out the dirt particles without being such a strong suction as to pose any risk to your fish (should they get in the way). Now your water changes will remove most of the dirt from your tank. I discourage people from removing the gravel and washing it unless they are having real problems with disease in the tank and are going to rebuild it from scratch - this is because you can remove too much of the good bacteria which has been encouraged to grow there. An extended power outage can also damage the bacteria colony in the gravel - but I haven't really ever seen this cause a serious problem. Unless you have particularly "dirty" fish, an undergravel with a gravel cleaner is all you really need for filtration - and it's cheap! Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14489	From: Chris	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: AquaTank Filtration Question

oh - and why should you feel stupid for not knowing something which has never been explained to you before? Even if it has - and you forgot - who cares? we're all human! :) Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14490	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: AquaTank Filtration Question

Leslie, Just a quick once over, since I haven't much time this evening. If the undergravel filter (UGF) is the only filter in your tank, it will also serve as a mechanical filter. This means that you will need to take rigorous care of the filter. As a mechanical filter it will trap all kinds of detritus in the gravel. Detritus is the fish poop, the uneaten food, etc. that will find its way to the gravel bed. I'm not familiar with the aquatank 202, but I am suspecting that it is a small tank. If that is right, then you would probably clean 1/3 to 1/2 the filter bed each time you do a water change. If it is more like 5 gallons and up, reduce that to 1/4. You do this to avoid disturbing too much of the bacterial colonies that will become established in your gravel, and thus avoid mini-cycles of the tank. Where the UGF really shines is biological filtration. Again, if this is a small tank, one inch of a gravel substrate should do the trick for you, more if the tank is larger. All that gravel gives you an incredibly large surface area for bacteria to grow. You'll also need to clean under the filter from time to time. This does get tricky, but you can do that by inserting a small diameter air line hose down the return stem, and under the filter, and use that to siphon the mulm out. Mulm is really inert matter, so far as the aquarium is concerned, but a good build up of mulm can hurt your water flow. In an well maintained filter, you may only need to do this once a year or so. If the mulm builds rapidly, then you would need to do it more often. When I was running multiple tanks with UGF's, I would just about get the hang of it when I was finishing, only to have to develop it again the next time around <g>. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Leslie Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2005 9:50 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] AquaTank Filtration Question Now see... I said I felt stupid and you guys just proved me to have good reason to do so. Thanks for the info. I was offered yet another one for free so I will take it since it isn't as useless as I thought. Learn something new everyday, especially in this group. Thanks, Leslie H -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2005 8:45 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] AquaTank Filtration Question Leslie, You need to put the air stone in the tube. The action of the bubbles moves the water down through the gravel and up through the tube. When it is set up correctly and maintained correctly, the undergravel filter is a very good filter. You can check the actual water flow if you remove enough water so that the water level is just below the tube's outlet. Water will flow out of the outlet, thus you can prove to yourself that it does, indeed, work. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Leslie Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2005 8:31 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com; naturalaquariumenthusiast@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] AquaTank Filtration Question I've acquired an aquatank model 202 for our male betta. It has an under gravel system but I'm miffed as to how it works. There is the plastic insert along with the attached tube. It looks as though I am supposed to insert the bubble disc into the filter tube but I don't see how that makes any sense. Maybe I am completely missing it here but I don't see how this filters anything at all. Included parts are the "under gravel filtration system" which consists of the plastic bottom insert and tube, air pump, air tube attached to a small bubble disc and that's it. How does this filtration work and if I have everything I need how do I set it up other than putting this bubble disc into the tube? Honestly, this looks to me like a joke to make people think they have something that works. I feel stupid. Lol Leslie Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. Yahoo! Groups Links Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14491	From: Chris	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: african cichlids in a planted tank

I noticed in cold_one's gallery that s/he has some beautiful African cichlids in a planted aquarium. Do many people have experience keeping African cichlids in planted tanks? In my experience it's always discouraged; reason given is that the fish will eat/uproot the plants. Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14492	From: Leslie	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: AquaTank Filtration Question

I should have mentioned, it is just a 2 gallon hexi tank. I had "aquatank 202" on the brain as I was doing an internet search before I posted on the group. It's good to know that it does its' job. I appreciate the answers more than you know. =) I have a python for the 75 (PRAISE whoever invented that wonderful python!) so I can use it on this little guy as well when I am cleaning the others. I might instead buy a mini python though and just drain it to a bucket. Thanks again!!! Leslie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2005 9:22 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] AquaTank Filtration Question Leslie, Just a quick once over, since I haven't much time this evening. If the undergravel filter (UGF) is the only filter in your tank, it will also serve as a mechanical filter. This means that you will need to take rigorous care of the filter. As a mechanical filter it will trap all kinds of detritus in the gravel. Detritus is the fish poop, the uneaten food, etc. that will find its way to the gravel bed. I'm not familiar with the aquatank 202, but I am suspecting that it is a small tank. If that is right, then you would probably clean 1/3 to 1/2 the filter bed each time you do a water change. If it is more like 5 gallons and up, reduce that to 1/4. You do this to avoid disturbing too much of the bacterial colonies that will become established in your gravel, and thus avoid mini-cycles of the tank. Where the UGF really shines is biological filtration. Again, if this is a small tank, one inch of a gravel substrate should do the trick for you, more if the tank is larger. All that gravel gives you an incredibly large surface area for bacteria to grow. You'll also need to clean under the filter from time to time. This does get tricky, but you can do that by inserting a small diameter air line hose down the return stem, and under the filter, and use that to siphon the mulm out. Mulm is really inert matter, so far as the aquarium is concerned, but a good build up of mulm can hurt your water flow. In an well maintained filter, you may only need to do this once a year or so. If the mulm builds rapidly, then you would need to do it more often. When I was running multiple tanks with UGF's, I would just about get the hang of it when I was finishing, only to have to develop it again the next time around <g>. \\Steve// -----

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14493	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: african cichlids in a planted tank

Chris, Some cichlids are a little less destructive than others. Also cichlid keepers with plants tend to focus on Anubias as they are tougher than many other plants. Mike -----Original Message----- From: Chris <youcantryreachingme@...> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 02:39:40 -0000 Subject: [AquaticLife] african cichlids in a planted tank I noticed in cold_one's gallery that s/he has some beautiful African cichlids in a planted aquarium. Do many people have experience keeping African cichlids in planted tanks? In my experience it's always discouraged; reason given is that the fish will eat/uproot the plants. Chris. Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14494	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: salt question

where do I buy that kosher salt from the one which was something like KNO3 or something like that? what products is it found in? =Nick Sarah Fleming Davis wrote: >We put salt in our tank because of the gobi and the needlefish and the other fish seem ok with it. > >Sarah > > >Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: >Unless there is a specific need, one does not need to add salt to a >freshwater tank. Salt is often used as an emergency remedy until one can >resolve the issue with the proper medication. It is also used as a remedy in >and of itself for certain parasites. > >Having said that, there are certain fish that can benefit from a regular >addition of salt to the aquarium. One such genus of fish would be mollies, >which are often found in estaturine environments where they are regularly >exposed to salt in the environment. Other livebearers may also respond >positively to such treatment. > >In a general community tank, it would not be wise to keep a level of salt in >the tank. There are many fish that can be adversely affected by the regular >addition of salt. So, in the end, only use salt when its use is indicated >for the tank as a whole. > >\\Steve// > >-----Original Message----- >From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On >Behalf Of Sandy Kay >Sent: Wednesday, August 10, 2005 10:28 PM >To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com >Subject: [AquaticLife] salt question > >Some have said they keep salt in their water. I have freshwater and know you >are supposed to use the non iodine kind. Do you have any more specifics? My >tank is a 10 gallon. How much to use and when, etc. Thank you, Sandy > > > > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >AquaticLife Management. > > > >SPONSORED LINKS >Marine biology Biology > >--------------------------------- >YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > >--------------------------------- > > > > >--------------------------------- > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >AquaticLife Management. >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14495	From: Chris	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: humane killing of Gambusia

Could anyone point me in the direction of finding information about the humane killing of Gambusia? Australia/NSW specific would be fantastic! :) Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14496	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: humane killing of Gambusia

Intresting Read and probally will answer any questions you have. http://homepage.ntlworld.com/faustus/nicoldaquaria/euthanasia.htm Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 8/12/2005 1:00:16 AM US Eastern Standard Time, youcantryreachingme@... writes: Could anyone point me in the direction of finding information about the humane killing of Gambusia? Australia/NSW specific would be fantastic! :) Chris. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14497	From: fuzzybpebble	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: ADDED NEW FISH

I got 3 fancy guppies yesterday and added them to the ten gallon tank. They are all females and all are so pretty. That should help with the diversity of my matings. The fry are doing great. I do not have 34 any more, it is really hard to keep count and to count tails, but it does not look as much as 34. My Aquascene 2 is the new topfin that I was talking about. It is a 2 gallon and came with a undergravel system. So I am learning about those. They seem nice, when I change the water I put it through the 10 gallon after I have removed 2 gallons from the 10 and then I cycle the water in the 10 for a couple of minutes and then put the water that I removed from the ten and put it through my net to filter it and put it back into the 2 gallon. Then I take more out of the ten and replace that. This way I am keeping the good bacteria going. I still use the betta tanks for sick fish, when I have sick fish. So I have 3 of those tanks also. Not running at the moment. Does anyone know how to grow algae for my Algae eaters? They will not eat the pellets and my tanks always look clean so I am wondering if they are getting enough food. They look healthy and happy, but you still wonder. JUST A QUESTION Bethany

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14498	From: bucks_boogie@webtv.net	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: Phosphates

Check the phosphate level of our foods too. Tetra has several styles of food with phosphates above 1%, your aim is below 1%. Their crisps and cichlid foods are the worst! Try Omega One, it's usually at .5% for all formulas, it's a far better product but it's packaging isn't as slick. But that's Tetra for ya, Whisper's are one of the better selling filters but they're as basic as you can get. Kent makes a GREAT phosphate sponge and it's rechargeable. Just be sure to soak it in a pail of water first, it can burn you when it first gets wet. "Damaged and I like it. It made me what I am!"

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14499	From: bucks_boogie@webtv.net	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: catfish and funky fuzz

I got bounced for not checking my mail enough (stupid, overrated adulthood) so I'm just catching up. I have notice a thread about a couple of problems that Leslie is having and I'm prone to agree with Steve and Ray and others. Gunk from a used filter can cause many problems, forgive me if this has already been covered, but I'd be checking ammonia, nitrites and nitrates long before I'd worry about pH. I'd also suspect overfeeding is providing lots of food for bacteria, not just fish, thus the fuzz around what used to be food. What are the water parameters and how long has the tank been set up? I'll check the other digests to see if this info is there already. At my store, we've been using a lot of Amquel Plus+ lately, especially for the feeders and it's been very helpful. Pictus cats have large appetites and can bloat right up with a full belly. Also keep in mind that they are nighttime predators and will eat any other fish that will fit into their mouths while they are sleeping. "Damaged and I like it. It made me what I am!"

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14500	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: ADDED NEW FISH

Hi Bethany, The procedure you are going through to do a water change does not help your bacteria colonies in any way, the bacteria live in your filter media or in the case of your tank with the UGF in the gravel covering the UGF, bacteria do not live in the water column. I hope this information will make your water changes a little easier. regards, unclenorm. --- fuzzybpebble <fuzzybpebble@...> wrote: > I got 3 fancy guppies yesterday and added them to > the ten gallon > tank. They are all females and all are so pretty. > That should help > with the diversity of my matings. The fry are doing > great. I do > not have 34 any more, it is really hard to keep > count and to count > tails, but it does not look as much as 34. My > Aquascene 2 is the > new topfin that I was talking about. It is a 2 > gallon and came with > a undergravel system. So I am learning about those. > They seem > nice, when I change the water I put it through the > 10 gallon after I > have removed 2 gallons from the 10 and then I cycle > the water in the > 10 for a couple of minutes and then put the water > that I removed > from the ten and put it through my net to filter it > and put it back > into the 2 gallon. Then I take more out of the ten > and replace > that. This way I am keeping the good bacteria > going. I still use > the betta tanks for sick fish, when I have sick > fish. So I have 3 > of those tanks also. Not running at the moment. > > Does anyone know how to grow algae for my Algae > eaters? They will > not eat the pellets and my tanks always look clean > so I am wondering > if they are getting enough food. They look healthy > and happy, but > you still wonder. JUST A QUESTION > > Bethany > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14501	From: Chris	Date: 8/11/2005
Subject: Re: ADDED NEW FISH

complete guess here: grab some tank water, put it in a large plastic tub, sit it outdoors in the sunshine with slabs of slate in the water. Algae on a slate? Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14502	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 8/12/2005
Subject: Re: violet gobi and do you name your fish? (now - Do you name your

ORIGINAL Message: Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 13:40:26 -0700 (PDT) From: Sarah Fleming Davis <keelis_mom@...> Subject: RE: Re: violet gobi and do you name your fish? SNIP Does anyone else name their fish? Sarah MY REPLY: Hi Sarah, I named my first four Goldfish and my recently adopted Pleco, but the rest of my recently adopted tropical's are still un-named. I named the Goldfish based on their personalities or distinguished markings. The Pleco, I named "Shitty".... well... because he does so much, especially after eating zucchini. I do refer to my Albino Buenos Aires Tetras as "Grumpy Old Men" or "Beavis and Butthead's" because their mouths look like they have a serious under-bite and I don't remember which (Beavis or Butthead) had the under-bite and which had no chin. LOL Actually, I decided to Google Images on "Beavis Butthead" and it appears that Beavis is the one with the serious under-bite so now I know my Tetras are Beavis'... although I still think they are Buttheads when they splash me when I'm feeding them. They must think they are Tarpon the way the attack the floating flakes. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14503	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 8/12/2005
Subject: Re: my catfish ate my snails!!!

Hi Sarah, What size tank do you have? If your "Channel Cat" is anything like the Channel Cat's we have down here in South Louisiana, they get GIGANTIC... and I imagine they would pretty much eat anything that gets in their way. The Louisiana record is 105 pounds but they regularly get caught in the 30-40 pound range. You better watch the rest of your fish in that tank. I have a 5" juvi Common Pleco that I recently adopted from a 10G tropical tank and he's in my 65G Goldfish tank and I make sure he gets enough food so he doesn't get hungry for my sleeping goldfish as it has been reported that they will go for the slime coat on healthy goldfish. They will also suck on a sick or dead fish since they are omnivores. I know most, if not all catfish are omnivores. What kind of snails do you have? I have a few golden mystery snails and the Pleco will "clean" their shells but I've never seen him actually try to eat one. Of course, the GM Snails close their trap door whenever anything gets close. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 21:01:01 -0000 From: "Sarah Fleming Davis" <keelis_mom@...> Subject: my catfish ate my snails!!! Have any of you ever seen a catfish eat a snail??? It was so weird! I had just turned out the light last night(I am finally realizing that the catfish aren't very active until the light's out) and my big albino channel cat came out and grabbed a snail and shook it right out of it's shell and ate it!!! Then this morning there was another empty shell :( I feel really bad for the snail but I'm also wondering if he did it because he wasn't getting enough food and was hungry? What do you think? Sarah [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14504	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/12/2005
Subject: Re: humane killing of Gambusia

Hi Chris, Why would you want to kill them they are an excellent mmosquito control ?, try this link :- www.gambusia.net regards, unclenorm. --- Chris <youcantryreachingme@...> wrote: > Could anyone point me in the direction of finding > information about the > humane killing of Gambusia? Australia/NSW specific > would be > fantastic! :) > > Chris. > > > > ___________________________________________________________ To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. http://uk.security.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14505	From: Aaron M.	Date: 8/12/2005
Subject: Re: SAE's

I'm in Livermore Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@...> wrote:aaron where are you in the bay? if you're near the peninsula i've seen them at ultimate aquarium in san mateo. --- "Aaron M." <anonymous122899@...> wrote: > Where online do you get the True SAE's? > I need some also, and where do you get the cardnal tetras from as well? > I can't get either around here in the San Francisco Bay Area. > > Thanks, > Aaron got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife stop by and see ~ membership is free! <º((((><¸..·´¯`·., . .·´¯`·.. <º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((>< ¸.·´¯`·.¸. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14506	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/12/2005
Subject: Re: salt question

Nick, Kosher salt (which chemically is common table salt - NaCl) can be found in most any supermarket. I've found Diamond Crystal brand in the 3# red box to be one of the purer ones, without any additives if that's what you prefer. Ray \ -- - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Nicolas Munro <nmunro@q...> wrote: > where do I buy that kosher salt from the one which was something like > KNO3 or something like that? what products is it found in? > > =Nick > > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14507	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/12/2005
Subject: Re: ADDED NEW FISH

Bethany, Usually, people are asking just the opposite --How to get rid of their algae. But this is a good question; try a longer duration with your lights. Depending on how many plants you have, you may have to carefully and slowly add more nutrients to the water in the form of a bit more fish food. The idea is you want to very slightly build up your nitrates, while keeping your ammonia and nitrites in your normally safe minimal zone. The algae will then feed on the extra nitrates, keeping them in a normal range -- a bit of a balancing act, and for best results you may have to cut back on your water changes somewhat. Not something we normally prefer to do. Might be easier and safer if you just add a touch of liquid plant fertilizer. In the meantime, why don't you feed the Algae Eaters spirulina flakes or algae wafers? They may get used to that to the point that you won't need to grow algae. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "fuzzybpebble" <fuzzybpebble@y...> wrote: > > Does anyone know how to grow algae for my Algae eaters? They will > not eat the pellets and my tanks always look clean so I am wondering > if they are getting enough food. They look healthy and happy, but > you still wonder. JUST A QUESTION > > Bethany

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14508	From: Andrea	Date: 8/12/2005
Subject: Re: violet gobi and do you name your fish?

All my adult bettas are named (probably about 50 right now) especially the males (Seamus, Rocky, Fluffy, Rufus, Tyler, Carl,Blackie, Casper, Pink Floyd, Reminton Steele, etc) and my few special girls (Tilly, Ruby, Violet, Emily, Sassy and Kitty). Mostly it's their personality that determines their name or something really obvious like an unusual color. Andrea and the "herds" of fishies --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Sarah Fleming Davis <keelis_mom@y...> wrote: > Oh good, lol, I thought I was the only one ;) I also have Bullet, Honey, Beetle Bug, Dino, Dinah, and the Rainbow Sisters(3 glass cats)! :) > > Sarah > > > Robert <coffeex10@y...> wrote: > Yes I name my fish, Slippery Pete, Bob and Boris. I have a cat named Fang. > Robert > >> Does anyone else name their fish? > > Sarah > > > ]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14509	From: Chris	Date: 8/12/2005
Subject: Re: humane killing of Gambusia

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > Hi Chris, > Why would you want to kill them they are an > excellent mmosquito control ?, try this link :- > www.gambusia.net you know - i'd seen that site some time ago, but not recently. There is a long reference list at the end which should keep me going :) As to the question of "why?" - as the site itself suggests, Gambusia's benefit as a mosquito control is a) doubtful (by some sources) and b) not necessarily any better than native fish species. Additionally, here in Australia many of the more horrible mosquito- borne diseases are not prevalent (ie do we really need mosquito control?) and finally, Gambusia prey on tadpoles. Australian frogs are struggling enough without competition and predation from Gambusia. There is a local wetlands development which was completed about 3 years ago. It consists of a pollutant trap followed by a sediment pond. The sediment pond drains into two wetlands areas - the natural one and a developed one. At the head of the natural wetlands is a waterhole about 1.5 meters across with hundreds of Gambusia in it. The wetlands itself contains Gambusia less densely distributed, but the second wetlands, and the sediment pond upstream of both, do not appear to contain Gambusia. If I can assume a) that the Gambusia were present in the original (natural) wetlands before the development and b) that Gambusia hasn't spread upstream, then I can attempt to push Gambusia further downstream by clearing the waterhole. Whilst we're in our cooler months and under drought conditions, it might be worth a shot. At the very least an experience although probably not useful to clearing other waterways of Gambusia. Thanks again for pointing me back to that website. Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14510	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/12/2005
Subject: Re: ADDED NEW FISH

Do you offer them any fresh foods such as zucchini, cucumber or lettuce? You might find that they really enjoy those. I also give mine spirulina flakes and algae wafers. As for a way to grow algae, I think Chris mentioned slate in water in the sun and that is a good suggestion. I was told to get some jars, put a rock in each with water and put them on a ledge that gets sun. That way you always have an algae covered rock ready to feed them. Rebecca > Does anyone know how to grow algae for my Algae eaters? They will > not eat the pellets and my tanks always look clean so I am wondering > if they are getting enough food. They look healthy and happy, but > you still wonder. JUST A QUESTION > > Bethany

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14511	From: Leslie	Date: 8/12/2005
Subject: Used Eclipse Tank w/ small cracks

I purchased a used Eclipse plexi 12 gallon tank/hood. The plexi has some minor crackeling around the front and sides. There is a larger crackel spot on the bottom but you can't feel it either inside or outside the tank. Is this still usable with these areas? I thought of placing some silicone on the areas just in case but then realized that the crack is not contained so it could spread. Any thoughts? I hope to use it. It's absolutely gorgeous and I only paid $2 for it. hehe =) Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14512	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/12/2005
Subject: Re: ADDED NEW FISH

I have encountered this problem before. i currently have 50 or so Bristlenose fry growing up in 4 tanks. I ended up moving a smaller tank( 15 gallons) in front of the window and let it get all the sunshine it wanted, Nice thick green algae in 2 days. I left the tank bare bottom for easier cleaning. Once I dumped in 10 BN fry at 1" it only took them 4 days to clean the tank where i could see all the way through. I then removed the Fry and let the tank stand a couple days,and repeated the process. temp varies with sunshine, have seen it top at 84*f and as low as 68*F i do have a small water pump in the tank to help with circulation, and a lot of rock caves available for the fry. I only vaccum the bottom when the junk on bottom of the tank gets thicker then the fry are large. I wish I had place for a 29 or larger tank in front of a window i'd use the same process. Once the weather starts getting cold, you'd want to move the tank away from the window. or get a Good heater. hope this helps rob Indiana In a message dated 8/12/2005 5:26:33 AM US Eastern Standard Time, sevenspringss@... writes: > Does anyone know how to grow algae for my Algae eaters? They will > not eat the pellets and my tanks always look clean so I am wondering > if they are getting enough food. They look healthy and happy, but > you still wonder. JUST A QUESTION [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14513	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 8/12/2005
Subject: Re: Used Eclipse Tank w/ small cracks

i wish i had paid $2 for my eclipse 12!! can you post a pic of it? --- Leslie <amjmail@...> wrote: > I purchased a used Eclipse plexi 12 gallon tank/hood. The plexi has > some minor crackeling around the front and sides. There is a larger > crackel spot on the bottom but you can't feel it either inside or > outside the tank. Is this still usable with these areas? I thought of > placing some silicone on the areas just in case but then realized that > the crack is not contained so it could spread. > Any thoughts? > I hope to use it. It's absolutely gorgeous and I only paid $2 for it. > hehe =) > > Leslie > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14514	From: Leslie	Date: 8/12/2005
Subject: Re: Used Eclipse Tank w/ small cracks

No pictures right now. But I will as soon as I get it placed and going. I miss figured the tank as it is a 7 (approx) gallon. Wish it were 12 but I’m still very happy with it. =) L -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez Sent: Friday, August 12, 2005 5:01 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Used Eclipse Tank w/ small cracks i wish i had paid $2 for my eclipse 12!! can you post a pic of it? --- Leslie <amjmail@...> wrote: > I purchased a used Eclipse plexi 12 gallon tank/hood. The plexi has > some minor crackeling around the front and sides. There is a larger > crackel spot on the bottom but you can't feel it either inside or > outside the tank. Is this still usable with these areas? I thought > of placing some silicone on the areas just in case but then realized > that the crack is not contained so it could spread. Any thoughts? > I hope to use it. It's absolutely gorgeous and I only paid $2 for it. > hehe =) > > Leslie > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!! Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14515	From: fuzzybpebble	Date: 8/12/2005
Subject: Algae question

Thanks for the replies I will try some of the suggestions. one of my LFS said that Oto's, which is what I have, like to eat the left overs from the other fish. So I guess they are garbage men in the fish world. Anyways I will try some of the suggestions. Since I have old betta tanks sitting around I will use them for the algae growth. I have the hottest room in the house for the housing of my fish, so I should have no problem getting sun in that room. Bethany

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14516	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/13/2005
Subject: Re: Algae question

Bethany, Otos are not scavengers. They do not eat the leftovers from the other fish. Otos are vegetarians, and specialized ones at thet. They eat algae. They can be picky about the algae they eat, also. You may have a tank full of algae, and the otos will starve to death if it is not to their liking. There are very few fish that can be considered to be scavengerd, living on the leftovers of other fish in the tank. Most have their own dietary needs, and those needs do have to be met to ensure they do well in your aquarium. Many catfish will do OK on the same foods that you feed your other fish, but you need to ensure that they get their share, without overfeeding the tank. Everyone should take the time to find out what the needs are of the fish they widh to add to their tanks prior to purchasing them. Having said that, I must also add that sometimes this is not possible to do. When I first became interested in and started keeping _Ctenopoma_ spp., there was very little literature available on them, and muh of that was not correct or was not helpful. Now, while there is not a wealth of information available, it is certainly available, and much more correct than it was in the early '70's. Doiong research now is certainly much easier now than it was back then. While ther ewas an Internet and various electronic services available back then, there certainly was not the information avaiable that there is now, and e-mail was the main means of use of the Internet, so yu needed to now someone and have an e-mail address for them. However, there is still a lot of misinformation out there, and you need to know how to seperate the wheat from the chaff. The best information can still be found in magazines and books. A good general book will stand most people in good stead. I generally recommend the Baensch Atlas as a good starting point for most people. A good general magazine is Aquarium Fish Magazine. Any one who is starting in this hobby should be willing to lay out the $40, more or less, for the Baensch book to learn about the fish, and the setting up and maintainiong of the aquarium. Lists, like this one, can also be good sources of information, though sometimes you will see some very long threads where even those who have been doing this for a long time do not necessarily agree (for reference, you can see th ediscussion I have had recently with Ray about over wintering koi). In a good list, you will see that misinformation is quickly corrected, and you can be lead in the proper direction. You must also realize that while there is a lot of science behind what we do, there is also a certain amount of art as well--some would say magic. You will sometimes find that what works for someone else does not work for you for some reason or another, and you need to find your own way of doing it. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com on behalf of fuzzybpebble Sent: Fri 8/12/2005 8:31 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Algae question Thanks for the replies I will try some of the suggestions. one of my LFS said that Oto's, which is what I have, like to eat the left overs from the other fish. So I guess they are garbage men in the fish world. Anyways I will try some of the suggestions. Since I have old betta tanks sitting around I will use them for the algae growth. I have the hottest room in the house for the housing of my fish, so I should have no problem getting sun in that room. Bethany [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14517	From: Da lardboy	Date: 8/13/2005
Subject: Re: Used Eclipse Tank w/ small cracks

Hey Leslie Containing a crack in glass is difficult, but its nearly impossible in plexiglass or acrylic / plastic tanks. However, the best thing that you can do is not use silicone (which will stretch but willalso likely become easily detached), but to use a resin based glue. I think that Epoxy Resin will work best, but be careful if you are using glues! Many resins (Im not sure if Expoy is inclued) will severely corrode acrylic plastics due to a chemical reaction. One other alternative would be to use clear Gaffers Tape. Its a bit like duct tape, but it tends to be more water resistant and it also... quite obviously... comes in clear variants. Make sure to only use tape on the outside of the tank, as the glues will probably not be good for your fishies, and only use on "closed cracks" i.e cracks that have no chips in them, so when the edges are together there is a perfect seal. Good luck with it! I hope my suggestions help. -Peter McKane --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > I purchased a used Eclipse plexi 12 gallon tank/hood. The plexi has > some minor crackeling around the front and sides. There is a larger > crackel spot on the bottom but you can't feel it either inside or > outside the tank. Is this still usable with these areas? I thought of > placing some silicone on the areas just in case but then realized that > the crack is not contained so it could spread. > Any thoughts? > I hope to use it. It's absolutely gorgeous and I only paid $2 for it. > hehe =) > > Leslie > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14518	From: Da lardboy	Date: 8/13/2005
Subject: Re: Algae question

Bethany, I think that this article about Ottos (or Oto's, theres no real accepted spelling of that name) will be useful to you: http://www.helpthefish.org/modules.php?name=Content&pa=showpage&pid=10 Some fish that do scavenge for leftovers are Corydoras. They are a type of small catfish and come in a huge variety. Some interesting species include Green Lazers (which are not dyed! I have seen them breed and their young also have the distinctive green stripe) and my personal favorite: Peppered. A good "cleanup crew" usually consisits of a few ottos, maybe a few Corydoras and a Pleco. They must of course all be suited to the size of your tank. Small Plecos include Lime Plecos and Bristle Nose Plecos. These do not grow as large as Common or Royal plecos. Also, as written in the linked article, Ottos need a fairly constant supply of soft algae to survive properly, and it is important not to overstock them. They will eat cucumber or courgette (zuchini) but this is really only a supplement. The common Otto is a far more specialized eater than people realise. -Peter McKane --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "fuzzybpebble" <fuzzybpebble@y...> wrote: > Thanks for the replies I will try some of the suggestions. one of my > LFS said that Oto's, which is what I have, like to eat the left overs > from the other fish. So I guess they are garbage men in the fish > world. Anyways I will try some of the suggestions. Since I have old > betta tanks sitting around I will use them for the algae growth. I > have the hottest room in the house for the housing of my fish, so I > should have no problem getting sun in that room. > > Bethany

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14519	From: Da lardboy	Date: 8/13/2005
Subject: Hello Group!

Hello All! This is my first of hopefully many posts here! I am currently running a project called Help The Fish. Its current goal is to highlight the very best and the very worst fish stores around the world. We also provide a feature where users of the site can actively attempt to re-house needy fish, or help beginner aquarists or aquarists in times of need. I know I am not the only fish keeper who has, after buying new fish and keeping them in quarantine, suddenly needed a hospital tank in an emergency. We aim to help out in situations like this with the lending or donation of spare equipment. Theres a lot of other useful things on the site also. We have a set of tank tools that can help aquarists check their water levels suitability for a particular purpose, and will even recommend the maximum number of fish that can be kept in a certain sized tank. There are also articles published fairly regularly that, I hope, are at least a little witty and entertaining. If you want, you can come visit the site at www.helpthefish.org or .com or .co.uk or .net. I am also not joining this group for the sole purpose of advertising, I have every intention of contributing as much to this group as I possibly can! Hope you like the site! -Peter McKane

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14520	From: Sandy Kay	Date: 8/13/2005
Subject: salt

Thanks for all the replies to my question about salt. Sandy [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14521	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 8/13/2005
Subject: Re: Hello Group!

Hello Peter, Have you read about this? http://petsforum.com/psw/ It has information about some fairly innocent conversation from aquarists about a reatailer they were dissatisfied with and what ensued. Mike In a message dated 8/13/2005 9:43:46 AM Pacific Daylight Time, peter@... writes: If you want, you can come visit the site at www.helpthefish.org or .com or .co.uk or .net. I am also not joining this group for the sole purpose of advertising, I have every intention of contributing as much to this group as I possibly can! Hope you like the site! -Peter McKane [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14522	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 8/13/2005
Subject: Re: Used Eclipse Tank w/ small cracks

I think the Eclipse is acrylic. If so, you can use an acrylic epoxy instead of silicone. Since it's so small, the pressure from water weight would be minimal so I'm not sure where these stress cracks are from. Probably from abuse by the original owner. I would fill it up outside and see if it leaks... it probably won't. Then empty it and put it on a level and secure location so it will not "twist" or "warp" which may be what happened to cause the stress cracks. If it was a big tank, or if it was glass with stress cracks, I would not take the same chance but I don't think water weight from 12G's caused the stress cracks and I don't think it will cause them to spread in an acrylic tank. Maybe you could contact the Eclipse manufacturer for more info. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 12:56:25 -0500 From: "Leslie" <amjmail@...> Subject: Used Eclipse Tank w/ small cracks I purchased a used Eclipse plexi 12 gallon tank/hood. The plexi has some minor crackeling around the front and sides. There is a larger crackel spot on the bottom but you can't feel it either inside or outside the tank. Is this still usable with these areas? I thought of placing some silicone on the areas just in case but then realized that the crack is not contained so it could spread. Any thoughts? I hope to use it. It's absolutely gorgeous and I only paid $2 for it. hehe =) Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14523	From: Leslie	Date: 8/13/2005
Subject: Re: Used Eclipse Tank w/ small cracks

I tend to agree that it will be OK. The tank is only a 6 and not a 12. (duh on my part.) I have had water in it for 24 hours and no leaks so I'm now thinking of what to add. I might take in my friends neons. She's going to salt water. Thanks for the opinions and advice. =) Leslie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Lenny Vasbinder Sent: Saturday, August 13, 2005 1:50 PM To: AquaticLife Yahoo! Group Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Used Eclipse Tank w/ small cracks I think the Eclipse is acrylic. If so, you can use an acrylic epoxy instead of silicone. Since it's so small, the pressure from water weight would be minimal so I'm not sure where these stress cracks are from. Probably from abuse by the original owner. I would fill it up outside and see if it leaks... it probably won't. Then empty it and put it on a level and secure location so it will not "twist" or "warp" which may be what happened to cause the stress cracks. If it was a big tank, or if it was glass with stress cracks, I would not take the same chance but I don't think water weight from 12G's caused the stress cracks and I don't think it will cause them to spread in an acrylic tank. Maybe you could contact the Eclipse manufacturer for more info. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 12:56:25 -0500 From: "Leslie" <amjmail@...> Subject: Used Eclipse Tank w/ small cracks I purchased a used Eclipse plexi 12 gallon tank/hood. The plexi has some minor crackeling around the front and sides. There is a larger crackel spot on the bottom but you can't feel it either inside or outside the tank. Is this still usable with these areas? I thought of placing some silicone on the areas just in case but then realized that the crack is not contained so it could spread. Any thoughts? I hope to use it. It's absolutely gorgeous and I only paid $2 for it. hehe =) Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14524	From: Tom Ray	Date: 8/13/2005
Subject: PraxiPro+other meds: I've got questions. Hope you've got answer to

Questions: Can one safely combine naphthoquinone (Vitamin K) & PraxiPro? Anyone tried it and had success? ...Or should I go ahead and use a salt treatment with PraxiPro? Situation: Dual infestation. 1) Initially evident onset was gill/intestininal parasite (2 curviseps died a day after dispalying heavy breathing and long stringy white feces). SO I began a PraxiPro tank treatment dosing & redosed after 3 days. 2) Around the day of the redose, Ich spots began to appear on select fish. It has spread. 3) BUT I would like to redose (1 more/final time) today or tomorrow with PraxiPro. Additional info: a) I was initially considering a salt treatement for the Ich. My normal treatment. PraxiPro comes with two labels. Both labels state PraxiPro is OK for salt tanks. b) This tank's inhabitants may or may not be OK with salt treatment for Ich. Residents: - Chocolate Gourami -- OK with salt, but salt can cause Nitirite spike which is dangerous for them since it does collateral damage to biofilter. - Pygmy G. -- OK with salt. - Whiteclouds -- OK with salt. - Curviceps -- OK with salt. - OTOCINCLUS -- Conflicting reports about salt negatively affecting them. Same goes for some other medications. - Unknown Rasbora -- ?? with salt. - Microrasbora gatesi (sp?) -- ?? with salt c) Hikari (manufacturer of PraxiPro) has printed 2 different labels: (1) "Do not combine PraxiPro with other medications." (2) "PraxiPro works great with {name of their Ich medication}." Their "Ich-X" brand includes "A Less Harsh Form Of Malachite Green" (MG Chloride) and Formalin. --TommyBoy

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14525	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 8/13/2005
Subject: Steve's Nitrate Post (long)

Steve Szabo, I copy/pasted your long Nitrate post from a few months ago into a document that I keep in my aquarium file on my computer. I recently shared it with another forum after editing out your email address and last name so you would not get any unsolicited emails. I did properly attribute the information to you though. No plagiarizing on this end. LOL Several people gave accolades to you and wanted the post made into a "Sticky". The forum, instead wants to use your Nitrate post as an "Article" on their site and wanted me to contact you... I guess for your permission. Email me off list for details. I am sending this to the group as well as your direct email address so I apologize if you get duplicates but I wanted to make sure you got it. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... For other's who missed the original posting, here it is again... hopefully with Steve's blessings. ORIGINAL Message: Date: Sun, 10 Jul 2005 10:45:48 -0400 From: "Steve S" Subject: Nitrate (Long post) There does seem to be a lot of unnecessary concern of nitrate levels expressed by people on this list for relatively low levels of nitrate. Nitrate is the end product of the ammonia cycle that occurs in every tank. There is no easy way to naturally remove nitrate without the use of a setup that uses anaerobic bacteria to reduce nitrate to its components. The usual method of deal with nitrate is water changes and the addition of live plants (which includes algal growth). At what level should one really become concerned about the level of nitrates in the aquarium. A level of 1000 ppm is definitely a concern, since everything dies. So we need to go lower than that. 500 ppm is still of definite concern. Many animals and plants will die at this level also, but some will live, though not well, as they will be subject to long-term effects of nitrate, such as hole-in-head disease and the erosion of the lateral line. Some plants also will not survive this level of nitrates. At 200 ppm, the effects of nitrate will be more long term than immediate. Again, we would be looking at such things as later line disease and hole-in-head as a result. Going lower will help reduce the effects. At 150 ppm, again, the effects are long term. Going even lower, long term effects are still present. Ideally, one would wish to reduce nitrate levels to less than 20 ppm, but immediate action is not called for until you reach a number of more than 150ppm. (please do note that figures for a marine aquarium are very much different, and action is called for when nitrate is measured in the single digits of ppm. In a marine environment, it is possible to reduce nitrates to immeasurable levels through the use of foam fractioners, which do not work well in fresh water.) So, you notice that your nitrates are rising, or at a high level. One can simply panic and do immediate large water changes to reduce the level of nitrates. However, doing this fails to discover and remedy the core cause of the high level of nitrates. Unless you are getting reading over 150 ppm of nitrate, you do have some time to do investigative work to discover and remedy the cause of the nitrates, while your regular water changes should help you reduce the level. Where does nitrate come from? Nitrate is the end product of the ammonia cycle as we follow it in the aquarium. Ammonia is produced as a waste product by the animals you have living in your tank. It can also be produced by dead and decaying animals and plants as well as food added to the aquarium. If you are using fertilizer for your plants, this may also be a source of ammonia. You need to reduce the sources of ammonia. Feeding less will help reduce the level. Most of us feed our fish too well. A day of fasting may help the health of your fish, as well as reducing the amount fed each day. (Raising fry is a whole other ball of wax, which I will not be covering here, but to get quick growth you do want to ensure they are well fed.) If there is left over food when you are feeding, you will need to reduce the amount of food you give to your fish, until there is no left-overs in the tank. Until this is remedied, you will want to wait a while after feeding the fish, then siphon off the left-overs. If you are fertilizing your live plants, you will want to reduce or stop the fertilization of the plants or start adding only the trace elements your plants may need for good growth and avoid a fertilizer that contain nitrogenous products. Also look for and remove any dead materials from your aquarium. Likely, if this is a fish, you'll do it rather rapidly. If it is plant material, then you will need to, perhaps, do this on a daily basis. Algae poses a particular problem. Removal of algae will reduce the capacity of your aquarium to remove nitrates, but then, it is also difficult to know when to remove it because it may be dead or simply another form of algae. It may be best to follow your aesthetic sense and remove what does not appeal to you, and remove any that is not green. Those of you that have snails in your aquarium are faced with a sometimes difficult decision--is the snail dead or is it alive? Tough to tell sometimes. However, if you have a nitrate problem, it may be well to take the conservative course of action and remove any snails you have doubts about, either to dispose of or to place in another environment. Throughout this entire process, you will need to keep an eye on the progress you are making. Go back to daily testing of your ammonia, nitrite and nitrate levels. Also test your tap water, which could be another source of nitrates in your aquarium. The EPA has a regulation that states that drinking water should not contain more than 10 ppm of nitrate. However, from reports of aquarists around the country, not all water companies are meeting this requirement. Also, if you are using well water, your nitrates may be high, especially when the aquifer is in agricultural parts of the country. (Our well fertilized lawns and gardens can also have an effect on the nitrate level of aquifers, but most research has pointed to agriculture as a large culprit.) If your water is starting with unacceptable levels of nitrate, you will need to look into means to reduce the nitrate before the water reaches the aquarium. This is usually done with chemical adsorption products. If your nitrate level still does not lower after doing all this, you will need to look at some other aspects of your aquarium. I have mentioned live plants in this discussion, but I am aware that not all people utilize live plants in their aquariums. There may be practical reasons for this, like the vegetarian habits of your fish prevent the growth of plant s to any great extent, and may reduce the number of plants you have, your fish may be diggers that uproot plants, etc. Your tank may simply be overcrowded with fish, and be overloading the biological processes that would normally handle such situations. In the former situation, you may want to utilize the marine idea of a refugarium, where there is a separate tank that water flows through that has plants to pull out the "bad stuff" from the water, with water from the main tank run through the filtration system into the refugarium and back into the main tank. You may also wish to investigate plants that may be immune to the predation of your fish. As for overcrowding, well, you simply need to reduce the numbers of fish that are present in the tank. You may set up more aquariums to house them or give them to friends who would like them. You may even be able to bring them back to you LFS for credit. Another source may be a decoration that has recently been added to your tank that is leaching substances into your water as it 'cures' in your tank. Removal of this object will show a quick and drastic reduction with your next water change. Should this be the case, you'll need to either cure the item outside the tank, or do without inside the tank. Also, not usual, but, perhaps not as unusual as we may like to think, there may be an outside force acting upon the tank, like something some one has added to the tank without your knowledge. One of the kids could have put something in the tank without your knowledge (and you may never know if the youngin' expects they'll get a punishment for admitting it) or an adult at a party may have added something just to see what the fish will do. This kind of thing can be the devil to track down, and the influence will abate with time. What ever you need to do, don't panic. Take things slowly and try to identify the cause of the problem. Your fish will allow you time to fix things. Should you be keeping marine fish, well, as I mentioned earlier, we are in a whole other ballpark there, and you may need to take more rapid action to avoid losing animals. Marine animals have less a tolerance for nitrate than freshwater do, and I would advise you to find a guru near you that can be of assistance (I'm not a marine person, nor do I play one on TV, and do not claim to have any special knowledge of marine topics.) Don't buy into any 'magic' cures for what ails your tank. They may do more harm than good. Thank you for your patience reading this long, and somewhat involved post. \\Steve// [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14526	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 8/13/2005
Subject: Re: But...but...what happened?!

Hmmm...our flame gourami, the only gourami in the tank since the honey gourami up and died on us, has made a bubble nest and has gotten very territorial. 0_o I thought it was a he! Sigh.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14527	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/13/2005
Subject: Re: But...but...what happened?!

Males are the ones that make the bubble nests, I believe, just like bettas. Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "cynthia brennemann" <brennewoman@h...> wrote: > Hmmm...our flame gourami, the only gourami in the tank since the honey > gourami up and died on us, has made a bubble nest and has gotten very > territorial. 0_o I thought it was a he! Sigh.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14528	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 8/13/2005
Subject: Re: But...but...what happened?!

In a message dated 8/13/2005 7:24:23 PM Eastern Standard Time, brennewoman@... writes: <<<Hmmm...our flame gourami, the only gourami in the tank since the honey gourami up and died on us, has made a bubble nest and has gotten very territorial. 0_o I thought it was a he! Sigh.>>> It *is* a 'he'. Isn't it the "hes" who make the bubblenests? Vicky ;-) Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Call (301) 496-7299 or (301) 402-8625 or write: hgparker@... =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@... 919-513-1467, Dr London @ calondon@... 530-754-5711 _AND_ Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14529	From: harry perry	Date: 8/13/2005
Subject: Re: But...but...what happened?!/Where is his girlfriend????

It is a he. Only the males build bubble nests but usually only when their is a female in the tank.?????? Harry cynthia brennemann <brennewoman@...> wrote: Hmmm...our flame gourami, the only gourami in the tank since the honey gourami up and died on us, has made a bubble nest and has gotten very territorial. 0_o I thought it was a he! Sigh. Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14530	From: Peter McKane	Date: 8/13/2005
Subject: Re: Hello Group!

Hey Mike Well, it seems that I am in in your debt. I was completely unaware of this, even with a decent amount of research before I opened this project! Recently with some rather serious troubles that I have faced with now former staff members, I have been considering chaning the focus of the project entirely. Instead of highlighting the best and worst, I think it suitable to highlight only the best. After all, who will sue for telling the world what a good job they are doing? Im sincerely thankful for your email. It may very well have saved me a hell of a lot of strife. Even though this Novack character seems to be getting exactly what he deserves (a big fat nothing), there is no way that I could afford to defend myself against such allegations, or for that matter welcome the stress that it would bring. *works on the site a bit* The focus of the Help The Fish project has changed from showing stores both good and bad, to just showing the good stores. The chances of legal comeback on this are minimal because exclusiveness is part of every list, and there is no law against it. If there were laws against membership exclusivity, I could walk into the nearest Yacht Club even though I dont own a Yacht. I owe you one. -Peter McKane Deenerz@... wrote: > Hello Peter, > Have you read about this? http://petsforum.com/psw/ > It has information about some fairly innocent conversation from aquarists > about a reatailer they were dissatisfied with and what ensued. > > Mike > > In a message dated 8/13/2005 9:43:46 AM Pacific Daylight Time, > peter@... writes: > > If you want, you can come visit the site at www.helpthefish.org or > .com or .co.uk or .net. I am also not joining this group for the sole > purpose of advertising, I have every intention of contributing as much > to this group as I possibly can! > > Hope you like the site! > > -Peter McKane

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14531	From: Peter McKane	Date: 8/13/2005
Subject: Re: Steve's Nitrate Post (long)

Talking of Nitrate... http://www.helpthefish.org/modules.php?name=tanktool This is a very handy and completely open source & free set of tools that will, among other things, verify your water levels. There is _absolutely no restriction of useage_ so this code can be downloaded (linked at the bottom) and used in any way you want to with no request for credit or a link to any website. This is done in an effort to spread tools like this over the internet sleflessly to ensure that aquarists can have as many opportunities as possible to learn new techniques and find good information. As soon as someone requests a water level verifier for the many Marine configurations I will happily add one! -Peter McKane

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14532	From: Peter McKane	Date: 8/13/2005
Subject: Re: PraxiPro+other meds: I've got questions. Hope you've got answe

The only fish in your tank that would be adversely affected by a salt treatment will be the Ottos from what I can see. If you can, try to isolate the parasite only infected fish and the dual infected fish into different hospital tanks. This will not only reduce the chance of the spread of disease, but also save you a fair chunk of cash on medication costs. If the Ich is still small and not yet overpowering or deadly, then you could consider treating the while bunch with just the parasitic treatment and waiting to treat with the anti Ich treatment when the parasites are gone, or vica versa. In this case, I dont know whcih is going to be more deadly. Parasites tend to lead to a slow death, but parasites also increase stress which will make the Ich much harder to treat. If you cant seperate and treat fish into hospital tanks then your best bet will indeed be to use a salt treatment and the anti-parasitic treatment at the same time. The label says its Ok, and the manufacturers stand to lose a lot of money by giving bad advice. Also, it _is_ safe to mix two different brands of medication as long as you make sure that the chemicals in the medication are the same (the concentrations may differ, and as such you should follow the useage instructions from each manufacturer. Ten drips of one medicine may contain the same medicine as thirty of another). If you can, seperate the Ottos into a different tank for the time being, they will not react well at all to the salt. Most Rasboras are hardy fish and will tolerate a salt treatment. It would also probably be well advised to do a low level salt treatment in an effort to simply keep the Ich under control until the parasites have been cured, and then use an anti Ich medication to clear up the remaining Ich problem. Good luck with this, it sounds like you have your work cut out over the next few days. -Peter McKane <http://www.spreadfirefox.com/?q=affiliates&id=0&t=83> <http://www.spreadfirefox.com/?q=affiliates&id=0&t=83> Tom Ray wrote: > Questions: Can one safely combine naphthoquinone (Vitamin K) & > PraxiPro? Anyone tried it and had success? ...Or should I go ahead > and use a salt treatment with PraxiPro? > > Situation: Dual infestation. > 1) Initially evident onset was gill/intestininal parasite (2 > curviseps died a day after dispalying heavy breathing and long > stringy white feces). SO I began a PraxiPro tank treatment dosing & > redosed after 3 days. > 2) Around the day of the redose, Ich spots began to appear on select > fish. It has spread. > 3) BUT I would like to redose (1 more/final time) today or tomorrow > with PraxiPro. > > Additional info: > a) I was initially considering a salt treatement for the Ich. My > normal treatment. PraxiPro comes with two labels. Both labels > state PraxiPro is OK for salt tanks. > b) This tank's inhabitants may or may not be OK with salt treatment > for Ich. > Residents: > - Chocolate Gourami -- OK with salt, but salt can cause Nitirite > spike which is dangerous for them since it does collateral damage to > biofilter. > - Pygmy G. -- OK with salt. > - Whiteclouds -- OK with salt. > - Curviceps -- OK with salt. > - OTOCINCLUS -- Conflicting reports about salt negatively affecting > them. Same goes for some other medications. > - Unknown Rasbora -- ?? with salt. > - Microrasbora gatesi (sp?) -- ?? with salt > c) Hikari (manufacturer of PraxiPro) has printed 2 different labels: > (1) "Do not combine PraxiPro with other medications." (2) "PraxiPro > works great with {name of their Ich medication}." Their "Ich-X" > brand includes "A Less Harsh Form Of Malachite Green" (MG Chloride) > and Formalin. > > --TommyBoy > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message > MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife>" on the web. > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>. > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14533	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/13/2005
Subject: Re: But...but...what happened?!/Where is his girlfriend????

I did not realize they needed a female in the tank. I guess I thought they were like bettas... they make bubble nests in preparation to breed even if they are alone. Interesting. Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, harry perry <harryfisherman@y...> wrote: > It is a he. Only the males build bubble nests but usually only when their is a female in the tank.?????? > > Harry >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14534	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/13/2005
Subject: Lionel Dimitri's $4,900 aquarium

What happens when a designer gets hold of an aquarium? Take a look at this article. If you can read French: http://www.cyberpresse.ca/actuel/article/article_complet.php?path=/actuel/article/1,4230,4507,112004,848481.php or (because you know the link is going to wrap): http://tinyurl.com/acejr Translated version: http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=fr&u=http://www.cyberpresse.ca/actuel/article/article_complet.php%3Fpath%3D/actuel/article/1,4230,4507,112004,848481.php&prev=/search%3Fq%3D%2522Lionel%2BDimitri%2522%26hl%3Den%26hs%3DkUR%26lr%3D%26client%3Dfirefox-a%26rls%3Dorg.mozilla:en-US:official_s%26sa%3DG or (because you know that the link will wrap): http://tinyurl.com/8cb2h \\Steve// [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14535	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/13/2005
Subject: Re: But...but...what happened?!/Where is his girlfriend????

Rebecca, You are correct. The male will make a bubblenest when he is ready, whether or not there is a female present. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com on behalf of thesydmonster Sent: Sat 8/13/2005 10:06 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: But...but...what happened?!/Where is his girlfriend???? I did not realize they needed a female in the tank. I guess I thought they were like bettas... they make bubble nests in preparation to breed even if they are alone. Interesting. Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, harry perry <harryfisherman@y...> wrote: > It is a he. Only the males build bubble nests but usually only when their is a female in the tank.?????? > > Harry > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14536	From: Nan	Date: 8/13/2005
Subject: Re: Lionel Dimitri's $4,900 aquarium

OMG! That is a gorgeous aquarium. However, what the heck is holding it up? And did I read right, is the "filters" in the metal "legs" or "tubes" of the aqarium? It certainly be nicer, in my opinion, if it had a sand substrate and plants in it. But Wow!, what a job they did do! ~nan~ Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: What happens when a designer gets hold of an aquarium? Take a look at this article. If you can read French: http://www.cyberpresse.ca/actuel/article/article_complet.php?path=/actuel/article/1,4230,4507,112004,848481.php or (because you know the link is going to wrap): http://tinyurl.com/acejr Translated version: http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=fr&u=http://www.cyberpresse.ca/actuel/article/article_complet.php%3Fpath%3D/actuel/article/1,4230,4507,112004,848481.php&prev=/search%3Fq%3D%2522Lionel%2BDimitri%2522%26hl%3Den%26hs%3DkUR%26lr%3D%26client%3Dfirefox-a%26rls%3Dorg.mozilla:en-US:official_s%26sa%3DG or (because you know that the link will wrap): http://tinyurl.com/8cb2h \\Steve// [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14537	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 8/14/2005
Subject: Re: Used Eclipse Tank w/ small cracks

Leslie, 2 bucks for a six gallon eclipse is still an excellent deal. If you see any more deals like that let me know : ) A month ago I picked up a 3 gallon eclipse for 5 plus tax and I am still very happy with that purchase. Mike In a message dated 8/13/2005 1:32:13 PM Pacific Daylight Time, amjmail@... writes: I tend to agree that it will be OK. The tank is only a 6 and not a 12. (duh on my part.) I have had water in it for 24 hours and no leaks so I'm now thinking of what to add. I might take in my friends neons. She's going to salt water. Thanks for the opinions and advice. =) Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14538	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/14/2005
Subject: Re: Lionel Dimitri's $4,900 aquarium

Designers . . . go figure. Who knows what they figure is easy on the eye. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com on behalf of Nan Sent: Sat 8/13/2005 10:35 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Lionel Dimitri's $4,900 aquarium OMG! That is a gorgeous aquarium. However, what the heck is holding it up? And did I read right, is the "filters" in the metal "legs" or "tubes" of the aqarium? It certainly be nicer, in my opinion, if it had a sand substrate and plants in it. But Wow!, what a job they did do! ~nan~ Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: What happens when a designer gets hold of an aquarium? Take a look at this article. If you can read French: http://www.cyberpresse.ca/actuel/article/article_complet.php?path=/actuel/article/1,4230,4507,112004,848481.php or (because you know the link is going to wrap): http://tinyurl.com/acejr Translated version: http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=fr&u=http://www.cyberpresse.ca/actuel/article/article_complet.php%3Fpath%3D/actuel/article/1,4230,4507,112004,848481.php&prev=/search%3Fq%3D%2522Lionel%2BDimitri%2522%26hl%3Den%26hs%3DkUR%26lr%3D%26client%3Dfirefox-a%26rls%3Dorg.mozilla:en-US:official_s%26sa%3DG or (because you know that the link will wrap): http://tinyurl.com/8cb2h \\Steve// [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14539	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/14/2005
Subject: Re: Lionel Dimitri's $4,900 aquarium

Its certainly different! \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > Designers . . . go figure. Who knows what they figure is easy on the eye. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com on behalf of Nan > Sent: Sat 8/13/2005 10:35 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Lionel Dimitri's $4,900 aquarium > > OMG! That is a gorgeous aquarium. However, what the heck is holding it up? And did I read right, is the "filters" in the metal "legs" or "tubes" of the aqarium? It certainly be nicer, in my opinion, if it had a sand substrate and plants in it. But Wow!, what a job they did do! > > ~nan~ > Steve Szabo <steve@l...> wrote: > What happens when a designer gets hold of an aquarium? Take a look at this article. > > If you can read French: > http://www.cyberpresse.ca/actuel/article/article_complet.php? path=/actuel/article/1,4230,4507,112004,848481.php > > or (because you know the link is going to wrap): > > http://tinyurl.com/acejr > > Translated version: > http://translate.google.com/translate? hl=en&sl=fr&u=http://www.cyberpresse.ca/actuel/article/article_complet .php%3Fpath% 3D/actuel/article/1,4230,4507,112004,848481.php&prev=/search%3Fq%3D% 2522Lionel%2BDimitri%2522%26hl%3Den%26hs%3DkUR%26lr%3D%26client% 3Dfirefox-a%26rls%3Dorg.mozilla:en-US:official_s%26sa%3DG > > or (because you know that the link will wrap): > > http://tinyurl.com/8cb2h > > \\Steve// > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14540	From: Leslie	Date: 8/14/2005
Subject: fuzz spots in tank

This is a posting from another group. It hasn't received any help there and I'm wondering what this groups take would be on the spots. have bought a brand new tank, might have been about a couple months or so, in it i have/had about 10 fancy guppies, 4 platys, and 1 bala shark(stil a baby)... Recently it has began to grow some sort of fuzz with white spots on it, on almost everything in the tank except for the fish. But the fish are slowly dieing, so far 2 platys, and about 5 fancy guppies. I do have some fry in there but i dont think any of them died yet... They are dieing at the rate of maybe 1 or 2 a day and i cant figure out the problem. Yesterday i did a 35% water change and ran my Diatom filter in the tank for 4-5 hours hoping it would clear something up. The tank is in great shape it self, it isnt cloudy or anything, it just has that fuzz with the white spots growing on it, it is on the gravel the plants and my castle and i think even the air stone... If anyone could help me here it would be great. Hopefully there is a cure for this... I have never saw it before, i have 4 fish tanks and not one of them had this problem... Thanks in advance, Mike [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14541	From: Nan	Date: 8/14/2005
Subject: Re: fuzz spots in tank

Personally, it sounds like a fungus of some sort. I would treat the whole tank with Jungle Fungus Clear, and move the fish to a temporary home for a week or so while I was treating the tank. Whatever can be taken out and washed with HOT water I would do so. I would also add a high dose of Aquarium Salt (no I don't want to get into the tablesalt/Kosher Salt/Aquarium Salt debate, either..*LOL*) and like I said, I would run the filter with no insert, no carbon, and let it just run for a week, so if it is a fungus it will be eliminated. I would get a brand new insert cartridge for the filter as well so you don't have to worry about recontaminateing the tank once you get it cleared up. You don't say if you have live plants in there, if so they will be fine with the treatment. Since Jungle Fungus Clear or Eliminator tends to stain light colored objects, if your castle is light colored or your rocks I would remove them and clean them in hot, hot water. I have heard that you can boil the gravel in a large pot on the stove, and I would do that as well. I would probably boil it for about an hour or so just to be safe. The reason I sugget moving the fish, is since they are being killed off by the white stuff a few each day, try to save what you can and move them to a "hospital tank", and I would probably treat them in the "hospital" tank with the jungle fungus clear and a dose of aquarium salt, as well. Since the fish look healthy it may only be precautionary, but why chance it? Yes, when you put it all back together and run it you will need to do a cycle before you can add the original occupants back into the tank if you take the gravel out and boil it, but to save them and make the tank useable for them again, it is well worth it, in my opinion. I know it sounds like over kill, but I would rather be safe than sorry. Good luck and I hope this helps. ~nan~ Leslie <amjmail@...> wrote: This is a posting from another group. It hasn't received any help there and I'm wondering what this groups take would be on the spots. have bought a brand new tank, might have been about a couple months or so, in it i have/had about 10 fancy guppies, 4 platys, and 1 bala shark(stil a baby)... Recently it has began to grow some sort of fuzz with white spots on it, on almost everything in the tank except for the fish. But the fish are slowly dieing, so far 2 platys, and about 5 fancy guppies. I do have some fry in there but i dont think any of them died yet... They are dieing at the rate of maybe 1 or 2 a day and i cant figure out the problem. Yesterday i did a 35% water change and ran my Diatom filter in the tank for 4-5 hours hoping it would clear something up. The tank is in great shape it self, it isnt cloudy or anything, it just has that fuzz with the white spots growing on it, it is on the gravel the plants and my castle and i think even the air stone... If anyone could help me here it would be great. Hopefully there is a cure for this... I have never saw it before, i have 4 fish tanks and not one of them had this problem... Thanks in advance, Mike __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14542	From: Peter McKane	Date: 8/14/2005
Subject: Re: fuzz spots in tank

Fuzz... Well, in one of my setups I once has a piece of wood that grew a slimy white fuzz. I was worried about it so I cleaned it off daily with a syphon hose and then strained the water through a coffee filter and put it back in the tank. It didnt have any adverse affects on any of my fish though.. that is worrying. What are your water levels and do your fish show any sign of disease at all? Strange swimming, heavy or slow breathing, spots, growths, lumps, bumps, patches, blotches, cuts, ulcers... anything at all, or are they seemingly in perfect health when they die? It could be that the growth is Ich... but Ive never heard of it like that before. Also, in my tank, it went away after about two weeks completely. Im not sure if this was becauseof the constant syphoning or because it just... went away. There are many types of fungus that grow on wood under water, most are completely harmless to fish, but any fungus is typically seen as bad fungus as it signifies an imbalance in the contained ecosystem. Post your water levels, or check them yourself here: http://www.helpthefish.org/modules.php?name=tanktool -Peter McKane >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14543	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/14/2005
Subject: California Betta Society (CBS), 8/27/2005, 2:00 pm

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife California Betta Society (CBS) Saturday August 27, 2005 2:00 pm - 3:00 pm This event repeats on the last Saturday of every month. The next reminder for this event will be sent in 11 days, 3 minutes. Event Location: various - http://www.cbsbettas.org/ Notes: CBS Meetings are usually on the 4th Saturday of each month. Our meetings are open to the public--everyone is welcome. While we hope that people will join CBS as official members, it's certainly not required -- we're here simply to share our love of bettas and information for all other fans of these fish. CBS is located in the San Francisco Bay Area. The members of CBS come from all over the Bay Area and meeting locations tend to change from month to month to give people in different parts of the Bay Area a chance to attend. (CBS) is an International Betta Congress chapter ADVERTISEMENT ZIP code where you park at night. Do you currently have auto insurance? Yes No Have you had a U.S driver's license for more than 3 years? Yes No Has any driver in your household had 2 or more accidents or moving violations in the last 3 years? Yes No Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14544	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 8/14/2005
Subject: Re: Lionel Dimitri's $4,900 aquarium

some where in there they said it was 10cm thick? So long as I'm not the one cleaning it, and who ever sets it up is a master of algae control then I think they would be cool! don't think my silver shark could turn in there very easily. =Nick Steve Szabo wrote: >What happens when a designer gets hold of an aquarium? Take a look at this article. > >If you can read French: >http://www.cyberpresse.ca/actuel/article/article_complet.php?path=/actuel/article/1,4230,4507,112004,848481.php > >or (because you know the link is going to wrap): > >http://tinyurl.com/acejr > >Translated version: >http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=fr&u=http://www.cyberpresse.ca/actuel/article/article_complet.php%3Fpath%3D/actuel/article/1,4230,4507,112004,848481.php&prev=/search%3Fq%3D%2522Lionel%2BDimitri%2522%26hl%3Den%26hs%3DkUR%26lr%3D%26client%3Dfirefox-a%26rls%3Dorg.mozilla:en-US:official_s%26sa%3DG > >or (because you know that the link will wrap): > >http://tinyurl.com/8cb2h > >\\Steve// > > >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >AquaticLife Management. >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14545	From: deborahgd14	Date: 8/14/2005
Subject: Angie the Angel fish - to Ray

Hi Ray: I have been giving Angie the metronidazole. She is now in the hospital tank which is a five gallon hex. She most of the time stays at the bottom. Today she did eat one piece of flake food which I was very happy about. Would this be the way she would act with the diseas of hexamita (as you described)? Thanks. Deborah D

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14546	From: Leslie	Date: 8/14/2005
Subject: Adding a filter

I've added a filter to the 75 gal. used to be cess tank so that if the Eheim goes out again, I have something to fall back on. My question: is it OK to just "stick a filter on"? It is a not-so-quiet, basic Whisper 30-60. I know it isn't for a 75 but I also have the Eheim which is for a 90 so I think it should hold the tank until I can get the Eheim up should it fail. Does this sound OK or should I do some prep work for this? Thanks, Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14547	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 8/14/2005
Subject: Re: Phosphates

whats a phosphate sponge? whats it made out of. =Nick bucks_boogie@... wrote: >Check the phosphate level of our foods too. Tetra has several styles of >food with phosphates above 1%, your aim is below 1%. Their crisps and >cichlid foods are the worst! Try Omega One, it's usually at .5% for all >formulas, it's a far better product but it's packaging isn't as slick. >But that's Tetra for ya, Whisper's are one of the better selling filters >but they're as basic as you can get. Kent makes a GREAT phosphate >sponge and it's rechargeable. Just be sure to soak it in a pail of >water first, it can burn you when it first gets wet. > >"Damaged and I like it. It made me what I am!" > > > > > > > >Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. >·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> >PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- ><º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. >We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, >AquaticLife Management. >Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14548	From: Nicolas Munro	Date: 8/14/2005
Subject: Good water quality or lack there off??

What is good water quality? I've lost my third tiger barb in about 3 months, and starting to wonder if I'm missing something from the picture. Nitrate, Nitrite, pH, etc. all ok except phosphate which is drastically high. Besides when they first get sick the fish don't pick on each other. I can't get them to bread yet, there are 10 tiger barbs which I suspect are a mix of male and female but no signs of breeding, same goes for my bettas altho it could be too cold for them 27.5degC. Any suggestions what I should test for? =Nick

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14549	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: Re: Angie the Angel fish - to Ray

Hi Deborah, Yes, more or less; they may not necessarily stay at the bottom, but are noticeably less active than other fish, or than they used to be, Often, they will kind of face one corner of the tank, and as I've mentioned not eat. The fact that she was interested in and took at least something is cause for hope. Try to find "Pepso" (medicated) food if you can and offer that to her instead of the flake. Pepso is a granulated food though rather than flake and may or may not be accepted, but keep trying it. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "deborahgd14" <deborahgd14@y...> wrote: > Hi Ray: I have been giving Angie the metronidazole. She is now in > the hospital tank which is a five gallon hex. She most of the time > stays at the bottom. Today she did eat one piece of flake food which > I was very happy about. Would this be the way she would act with the > diseas of hexamita (as you described)? Thanks. Deborah D

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14550	From: deborahgd14	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: Re: Angie the Angel fish - to Ray

Ray: I haven't found that kind of food yet. She is facing the corner and is doing exactly as you said. Thanks for your input. Will keep you informed of her progress. Today is the third time I have medicated her. Should I do more than five if she isn't better? Thanks Again. Deborah --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > Hi Deborah, Yes, more or less; they may not necessarily stay at the > bottom, but are noticeably less active than other fish, or than they > used to be, Often, they will kind of face one corner of the tank, and > as I've mentioned not eat. The fact that she was interested in and > took at least something is cause for hope. Try to find "Pepso" > (medicated) food if you can and offer that to her instead of the > flake. Pepso is a granulated food though rather than flake and may or > may not be accepted, but keep trying it. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "deborahgd14" <deborahgd14@y...> > wrote: > > Hi Ray: I have been giving Angie the metronidazole. She is now in > > the hospital tank which is a five gallon hex. She most of the time > > stays at the bottom. Today she did eat one piece of flake food which > > I was very happy about. Would this be the way she would act with the > > diseas of hexamita (as you described)? Thanks. Deborah D

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14551	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: Re: Adding a filter

Should work for your purpose, and while it will help right-off with mechanical filtration, it will have to build up a bacteria colony first to be effective as a biological filter. Only drawback is that the cartridges are filled with carbon which lasts only about a month or so and should be replaced shortly thereafter, needing a fresh bacteria colony to be built up again each time. Best results probably would be had by repacing the carbon in the cartridge with an equal amount of mixed #3 gravel and the smallest grade "river gravel" as a medium on which the bacteria will get established. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > I've added a filter to the 75 gal. used to be cess tank so that if the > Eheim goes out again, I have something to fall back on. > My question: is it OK to just "stick a filter on"? > > It is a not-so-quiet, basic Whisper 30-60. I know it isn't for a 75 but > I also have the Eheim which is for a 90 so I think it should hold the > tank until I can get the Eheim up should it fail. > > Does this sound OK or should I do some prep work for this? > > Thanks, > Leslie > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14552	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: Re: Good water quality or lack there off??

Nick, You should be giving us specific numbers from your tests, so that we have a starting point so far as your water parameters are concerned. Secondly, you should describe the looks and behavior of the fish you lost, so we can, perhaps, divine something from that. You should also describe your tank. What size is it? What other fish do you have? What sizes are they? What is your aqua-decor? They question you ask, "What is good water quality?", is a bit broad. Entire books have been written on water quality, and we certainly do not have the space to reproduce that information here. The best we can do is to give you snippets of knowledge as it may apply to your situation. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com on behalf of Nicolas Munro Sent: Sun 8/14/2005 11:47 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Good water quality or lack there off?? What is good water quality? I've lost my third tiger barb in about 3 months, and starting to wonder if I'm missing something from the picture. Nitrate, Nitrite, pH, etc. all ok except phosphate which is drastically high. Besides when they first get sick the fish don't pick on each other. I can't get them to bread yet, there are 10 tiger barbs which I suspect are a mix of male and female but no signs of breeding, same goes for my bettas altho it could be too cold for them 27.5degC. Any suggestions what I should test for? =Nick [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14553	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: Re: Angie the Angel fish - to Ray

Deborah, Yes, you'll have to continue medicating her even if she hasn't responded by the fifth dose. Do a 30% - 50% water change after that time and start the treatment all over again. Sometimes it takes up to 3 such rounds of treatments. Without medication for this ailment there is absolutely no hope of the fish recovering, and this is the medication of choice for this disease. As you may have noticed on the label, there is very little danger of overdosing; as such, I would increase the doses doubly and add kanamycin (Kanycin) as well as its readily absorbed through the tissue to get internally. \ You might try using Garlic Guard (by Seachem) for use as an appetite enhancer, and if you want to try a frozen food and adding some Metronidazole to it yourself (1 measure - or capsule - of Metronidazole to 1 tbs of frozen food paste), use with Focus (again by Seachem) which will act as a polymer so you don't lose the food in the water when feeding. If you can't or don't use frozen food, make a paste of flake food as I've mention and add 1 measure (or 1 capsule) of Metronidazole to 1 tbs of flake food paste after which you make it into a flake food again -- it will dry overnight. If you can get her to eat anything with medication in it, so much the better. Years ago, before they even knew the cause of this, they'd just call it a "hunger strike" and at times, feeding baby guppies would get them to continue eating again. I've found that feeding them frozen (or live if you can find them) bloodworms will sometimes do the same tning, especially if they've been previously fed this food -- they'll recognize it as a food they've relished before becoming ill. This is not an easy disease to successfully treat all the time, but all's you can do is keep trying, and in the meantime try to prepare yourself for the worst. The sad part is that they may continue the hunger strike and slowly starve, lasting up to 3 weeks or so. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "deborahgd14" <deborahgd14@y...> wrote: > Ray: I haven't found that kind of food yet. She is facing the > corner and is doing exactly as you said. Thanks for your input. > Will keep you informed of her progress. Today is the third time I > have medicated her. Should I do more than five if she isn't > better? Thanks Again. Deborah >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14554	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: Re: Angie the Angel fish - to Deborah

Deborah, Meant to write "so you don't lose the medication in the water when feeding". This should make more sense. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > Deborah, \ > You might try using Garlic Guard (by Seachem) for use as an appetite > enhancer, and if you want to try a frozen food and adding some > Metronidazole to it yourself (1 measure - or capsule - of Metronidazole > to 1 tbs of frozen food paste), use with Focus (again by Seachem) which > will act as a polymer so you don't lose the food in the water when > feeding. Ray > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14555	From: kb1dva	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: Help!!!

MY penguin 7oo filter won't let it's self be primed motor running, but I prime it and the wheels stop. - We had a 12 hour power outage last night so this is urgent thanks Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14556	From: mlvdw@aol.com	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: Re: Help!!!

I have the same filter on one of my aquariums. Sometimes I have to keep priming it, until it gets the picture. Just keep dumping the water in either the filter area, or around the intake tube. You might have to keep dumping water in, until it gets as high as possible without going over all the sides. BTW, use the water in your aquarium, scooping it out with a cup. It's already trained to go through the filter :) I take it by "wheels" you mean the bio wheel? If so, don't worry about it; it's stopped anyway when it's not running. Once the filter begins running, the bio wheel should start turning, even very, very slowly is O.K. Hope it works for you! Martin VanderWal -----Original Message----- From: kb1dva <vze3pd7a@...> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Mon, 15 Aug 2005 11:27:51 -0400 Subject: [AquaticLife] Help!!! MY penguin 7oo filter won't let it's self be primed motor running, but I prime it and the wheels stop. - We had a 12 hour power outage last night so this is urgent thanks Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14557	From: bucks_boogie@webtv.net	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: Re: Phosphate sponge

Kent's Phoshpate sponge is a rechargeable resin that's used in a media bag or fine filter basket. Packaging doesn't describe just what the resin is, but it looks like small zeolite chunks. Haven't used it myself, but I've have numerous positive feedbacks from both my freshwater and marine customers, many who've used Phos-Sorb by API with no luck. "Damaged and I like it. It made me what I am!"

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14558	From: mlvdw@aol.com	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: Re: Help!!!

Emily, Sorry about the mix-up. My filter's a 170, not a 700. The advice I gave might still work, though. Martin VanderWal In a message dated 8/15/2005 9:17:08 AM Pacific Standard Time, mlvdw@... writes: I have the same filter on one of my aquariums. Sometimes I have to keep priming it, until it gets the picture. Just keep dumping the water in either the filter area, or around the intake tube. You might have to keep dumping water in, until it gets as high as possible without going over all the sides. BTW, use the water in your aquarium, scooping it out with a cup. It's already trained to go through the filter :) I take it by "wheels" you mean the bio wheel? If so, don't worry about it; it's stopped anyway when it's not running. Once the filter begins running, the bio wheel should start turning, even very, very slowly is O.K. Hope it works for you! Martin VanderWal [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14559	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: Re: Help!!!

I do the same thing as Martin on my penguin 100 w/biowheel. I just take tank water and scoop it into the back of the filter with a cup until it starts churning on its own. Sometimes the wheel spins like mad, sometimes it barely turns. I know it does spin better when the tank is full. Today I did a water change and cleaned my intake tube and rinsed my sponge material (I don't use the filter cartridges) and my biowheel is barely spinning but it was spinning very fast before the change. As long as it spins, it's okay. Good luck! Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "kb1dva" <vze3pd7a@v...> wrote: > MY penguin 7oo filter won't let it's self be primed motor running, but I > prime it and the wheels stop. - We had a 12 hour power outage last night so > this is urgent thanks Emily > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14560	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: fish eating algae

I know we have discussed this before, but are there any community fish that enjoy eating hair algae? The dark green/black stuff? How about snails? Do they eat this kind of algae? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14561	From: Leslie	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: Adding some cichlids

The 75 is up and going well with lots of attention and a dash of Bio Spira. A friend is moving to a marine tank so is giving away her fish. I was thinking of adding her large yellow peacock chichlid to the 75 and her small one to the newly running 6. The larger yellow (3") is the current "boss" in her tank but I think that will change once introduced to my blood parrot. He rules the roost so speak. The 75 currently holds 1 blood parrot (possibly 2 within a couple of months), 1 firemouth (soon to be 2), 3 giant danios, 1 rainbow shark, 2 pictus catfish, 1 black skirt tetra. OK for the yellow cichlid? 6 gal. will hold a female betta (mine), two long finned tetras, two cherry barbs and the baby yellow peacock. All of which are coming from her tank. I have read that this type of peacock cichlid can in fact be a community fish so that is what I'm hoping for here with the small one. Of course if it doesn't work, he will be transferred to another tank. Maybe with this mistake of a meany I aquired being told it was a firemouth. (MEAN thing has a 10 gal all to herself as she eats up everyone else. I'll be getting rid of her eventually.) Anyone want her? Free for the taking, just pay to ship. =) Anyway, do these combinations sound OK or should I be alerted to reconsider? Thanks, Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14562	From: mike mather	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: Re: fish eating algae

Linda, The American Flag Fish is a great consumer of hair Algae, but they will also eat whatever else you feed the other fish in your tank. I sometimes put the entire tank on a 1 or 2 day fast, which kicks the Flag's hair algae consumption into high gear, as they can become a little lazy at times with all the other delicious foods put into the tank. Good luck, Mike --- Crazy4fids@... wrote: > I know we have discussed this before, but are there > any community fish that > enjoy eating hair algae? The dark green/black > stuff? How about snails? Do > they eat this kind of algae? > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14563	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists every Monday! Monday August 15, 2005 8:00 pm - 9:00 pm This event repeats every week. The next reminder for this event will be sent in 3 hours, 3 minutes. Event Location: http://chat.thatpetplace.com/chat/chat.aspx Notes: Return to this site every Thursday from 8pm to 10pm and Monday from 8pm to 9pm (Eastern Time) to chat LIVE with one of our on-staff Marine Biologists. Learn about your fish, how to treat common maladies, get recommendations on accessories, food and live animal compatibility, or ask a question that only an expert could answer. MarineBio Chat every Thursday 8pm to 10pm EST, only from That Fish Place, The Original Aquatic Superstore. Attention MarineBio chat participants! The chat server is unavailable until 8pm Eastern Time. If you experience problems while trying to log on to the chat session ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14564	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: Re: Adding some cichlids

The Malawi Peacocks are generally much milder in disposition than the Malawi Mbunas. However, it is generally advised not to mix these Old World Cichlids with New World Cichlids as they don't recognize each other's signals (of aggression, territoriality, etc.). While the Peacock may learn the hard way, you may be asking for trouble with a head-long confrontation (with the Peacock getting the worst of it), not knowing exactly what message the blood parrot is trying to get across. I would advise against it, although you could try it, being prepared to net the Peacock back out again if need be. As for the six gallon, it just sounds crowded and although that peacock is small now, its going to grow. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > The 75 is up and going well with lots of attention and a dash of Bio > Spira. > > A friend is moving to a marine tank so is giving away her fish. I was > thinking of adding her large yellow peacock chichlid to the 75 and her > small one to the newly running 6. The larger yellow (3") is the current > "boss" in her tank but I think that will change once introduced to my > blood parrot. He rules the roost so speak. > The 75 currently holds 1 blood parrot (possibly 2 within a couple of > months), 1 firemouth (soon to be 2), 3 giant danios, 1 rainbow shark, 2 > pictus catfish, 1 black skirt tetra. OK for the yellow cichlid? > > 6 gal. will hold a female betta (mine), two long finned tetras, two > cherry barbs and the baby yellow peacock. All of which are coming from > her tank. I have read that this type of peacock cichlid can in fact be a > community fish so that is what I'm hoping for here with the small one. > Of course if it doesn't work, he will be transferred to another tank. > Maybe with this mistake of a meany I aquired being told it was a > firemouth. (MEAN thing has a 10 gal all to herself as she eats up > everyone else. I'll be getting rid of her eventually.) Anyone want > her? Free for the taking, just pay to ship. =) > > Anyway, do these combinations sound OK or should I be alerted to > reconsider? > > Thanks, > Leslie > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14565	From: Leslie	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: Re: Adding some cichlids

It does seem crowded. But each fish is so tiny I thought it might be OK. I'll reavulate when I see them again tomorrow. Now for more problems. Giant danios are generally pretty hardy fish, right? One of my three has a red belly and HUGE nasty pop-eye with cloud on one of them. ARGH! And here I thought all was well. No other fish are showing any signs of anything. What is this pop-eye? Could it be delayed from a week ago? Also, what is best to treat it (pop-eye)? I'm using a jungle fungus treatment in a qt tank but I'm worried that isn't enough. Leslie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Monday, August 15, 2005 5:49 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Adding some cichlids The Malawi Peacocks are generally much milder in disposition than the Malawi Mbunas. However, it is generally advised not to mix these Old World Cichlids with New World Cichlids as they don't recognize each other's signals (of aggression, territoriality, etc.). While the Peacock may learn the hard way, you may be asking for trouble with a head-long confrontation (with the Peacock getting the worst of it), not knowing exactly what message the blood parrot is trying to get across. I would advise against it, although you could try it, being prepared to net the Peacock back out again if need be. As for the six gallon, it just sounds crowded and although that peacock is small now, its going to grow. Ray \

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14566	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: giant danio with pop eyed

Leslie, I am not trying to be snooty here, but maybe what you need to do is just let your tank cycle for a while. Let the filters run, do your weekly water changes, feed lightly and see what happens. Make sure you are testing your water to make sure things are going ok before you try and add any more fish to your household. I know that this is often hard to do, but we often try and do too much too fast. Over the past week I have lost nine fish. I am not sure why, it may have something to do with a houseplant that I was trying to root out of the back of the tank. I am guessing that there may have been fertilizer on the plant. The fish were fine one day and dead the next. I have only lost neons, and rummy nose and two of my cory cat fish. All of my angels and keyhole cichlids are still fine. I would like to replace the ones that died, but I am just siting tight and doing 30% water changes every three days. If I can go a week without anyone dying, I may replace the rummy nose tetras. How is that new filter working for you? Did you get your eheim back and running? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14567	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: FISH EATING ALGAE

Yes, I guess that should be algae eating fish =) I couldn't figure out why it was "oh so scary" LOL [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14568	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists every Monday! Monday August 15, 2005 8:00 pm - 9:00 pm This event repeats every week. Event Location: http://chat.thatpetplace.com/chat/chat.aspx Notes: Return to this site every Thursday from 8pm to 10pm and Monday from 8pm to 9pm (Eastern Time) to chat LIVE with one of our on-staff Marine Biologists. Learn about your fish, how to treat common maladies, get recommendations on accessories, food and live animal compatibility, or ask a question that only an expert could answer. MarineBio Chat every Thursday 8pm to 10pm EST, only from That Fish Place, The Original Aquatic Superstore. Attention MarineBio chat participants! The chat server is unavailable until 8pm Eastern Time. If you experience problems while trying to log on to the chat session ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14569	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: Re: Adding some cichlids

when one my sw fish, a perc, had popeye awhile ago the lfs gave me penicilin tabs to use. it said to use with fw & sw. it worked well so perhaps you can give this a try. --- Leslie <amjmail@...> wrote: > It does seem crowded. But each fish is so tiny I thought it might be > OK. I'll reavulate when I see them again tomorrow. > > Now for more problems. Giant danios are generally pretty hardy fish, > right? One of my three has a red belly and HUGE nasty pop-eye with > cloud on one of them. ARGH! And here I thought all was well. No other > fish are showing any signs of anything. What is this pop-eye? Could it > be delayed from a week ago? Also, what is best to treat it (pop-eye)? > I'm using a jungle fungus treatment in a qt tank but I'm worried that > isn't enough. > > Leslie > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Monday, August 15, 2005 5:49 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Adding some cichlids > > > The Malawi Peacocks are generally much milder in disposition than the > Malawi Mbunas. However, it is generally advised not to mix these Old > World Cichlids with New World Cichlids as they don't recognize each > other's signals (of aggression, territoriality, etc.). While the > Peacock may learn the hard way, you may be asking for trouble with a > head-long confrontation (with the Peacock getting the worst of it), > not knowing exactly what message the blood parrot is trying to get > across. I would advise against it, although you could try it, being > prepared to net the Peacock back out again if need be. As for the > six gallon, it just sounds crowded and although that peacock is small > now, its going to grow. Ray > \ > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14570	From: Leslie	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: Re: giant danio with pop eyed

Hi Linda, I did get the Eheim running, thank goodness. I just bought yet another filter, a penguin dual bio wheel. I LOVE it. Why didn't I buy on of these way long ago? Perfect current and perfectly quiet. Well with the giant danio having this ogor look to him, I'm not doing anything to this tank until it is perfect, again. I have the danio with a male betta in a qt tank. Think they are OK together? So far they seem to be. I’m treating with maracyn 2 tabs and will start with medicated food tomorrow. I also purchased some more tests, the liquid drops. I think mine may be out of date so I want to be safe with the results. Dropped $100 at the lfs. Good thing I got this tank and the fish for free. !!! Ack! Lol Leslie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Monday, August 15, 2005 6:47 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] giant danio with pop eyed Leslie, I am not trying to be snooty here, but maybe what you need to do is just let your tank cycle for a while. Let the filters run, do your weekly water changes, feed lightly and see what happens. Make sure you are testing your water to make sure things are going ok before you try and add any more fish to your household. I know that this is often hard to do, but we often try and do too much too fast. Over the past week I have lost nine fish. I am not sure why, it may have something to do with a houseplant that I was trying to root out of the back of the tank. I am guessing that there may have been fertilizer on the plant. The fish were fine one day and dead the next. I have only lost neons, and rummy nose and two of my cory cat fish. All of my angels and keyhole cichlids are still fine. I would like to replace the ones that died, but I am just siting tight and doing 30% water changes every three days. If I can go a week without anyone dying, I may replace the rummy nose tetras. How is that new filter working for you? Did you get your eheim back and running? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14571	From: Leslie	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: Re: Adding some cichlids

Thank you. I'll ask about that. Right now I dropped a maracyn 2 tab in. My lfs isn't the most knowledgeable around. Anything unusual throws him off. Leslie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez Sent: Monday, August 15, 2005 7:11 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Adding some cichlids when one my sw fish, a perc, had popeye awhile ago the lfs gave me penicilin tabs to use. it said to use with fw & sw. it worked well so perhaps you can give this a try. --- Leslie <amjmail@...> wrote: > It does seem crowded. But each fish is so tiny I thought it might be > OK. I'll reavulate when I see them again tomorrow. > > Now for more problems. Giant danios are generally pretty hardy fish, > right? One of my three has a red belly and HUGE nasty pop-eye with > cloud on one of them. ARGH! And here I thought all was well. No > other fish are showing any signs of anything. What is this pop-eye? > Could it be delayed from a week ago? Also, what is best to treat it > (pop-eye)? I'm using a jungle fungus treatment in a qt tank but I'm > worried that isn't enough. > > Leslie > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Monday, August 15, 2005 5:49 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Adding some cichlids > > > The Malawi Peacocks are generally much milder in disposition than the > Malawi Mbunas. However, it is generally advised not to mix these Old > World Cichlids with New World Cichlids as they don't recognize each > other's signals (of aggression, territoriality, etc.). While the > Peacock may learn the hard way, you may be asking for trouble with a > head-long confrontation (with the Peacock getting the worst of it), > not knowing exactly what message the blood parrot is trying to get > across. I would advise against it, although you could try it, being > prepared to net the Peacock back out again if need be. As for the > six gallon, it just sounds crowded and although that peacock is small > now, its going to grow. Ray > \ > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!! Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14572	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 8/15/2005
Subject: New Angelfish

I got a new koi angelfish today and tried to introduce him into my 44 corner tank. I have a slightly smaller gold angel in there (about 2") and there has been some aggression. I added him while feeding to distract the fish in there and there is some driftwood and vallis to duck behind but the plants are not yet established enough to be true refuges. Is there anything else I should do? I had also hoped to eventually add a pair of Bolivian rams, is that likely to be ok, or am I asking for trouble? Otherwise, there are 3 marble hatchets, an ancistrus and a gaggle of cories. This tank is new (I replaced a different tank with this one and used all the existing driftwood/media/substrate), the established angel has only "owned" it for a couple of weeks. Any suggestions/advice? FWIW, I think they may be different sexes from my untrained eye - the gold has a bit of a rounded belly and her vent seems slightly differently placed than the koi. The dorsal fins also seem to be a bit different with the koi having a slightly more spiky 'do' before you get to true fin. ???? Thanks! Vicky Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Call (301) 496-7299 or (301) 402-8625 or write: hgparker@... =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@... 919-513-1467, Dr London @ calondon@... 530-754-5711 _AND_ Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14573	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: Adding some cichlids

Leslie, The red belly on your Giant Danio is hemorrhagic Septicemia, an internal disease resulting from an infection of gram-negative aeromonas or pseudomonas bacteria. Unless your water paranmeters are elevated again, this in all probability is something that had started from your problems of last week. This is usually associated with Dropsey, but as long as you don't see the scales standing out from the body it looks like maybe you've caught it in the early stages. The pop-eye is associated with it as there is a bad internal infection going on. The pop-eye condition itself is a result of fluids being built up behind the eye (and pushing it out) from the internal infection. \ The Jungle Fungus treatment is not enough, but I believe you said in a later post that you've since added Maracyn-Two (Minocycline), a broad-spectrum anti-bacterial med which is one of the best for treatment of this disease. Good you acted fast, as this is a serious fast acting disease. If you can get the fish to eat a medicated food such as "Pepso", all the better. Other medications useful against this disease are Terramycn, Oxytetracycline hydrochloride, Kanamycin and Nitrofurazone (including Furan II). Additionally, you could add Epsom salts to the tune of 1/8 tsp per 5 gallons, which in the case of your 1 qt tank would be 1/20 of that amount . You would need to disolve 1/8 tsp of E-Salts in a measuring cup of water and then just use 1/20 of that amount (near as you could figure) of the measuring cup. This is not essential, but may help. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > Now for more problems. Giant danios are generally pretty hardy fish, > right? One of my three has a red belly and HUGE nasty pop-eye with > cloud on one of them. ARGH! And here I thought all was well. No other > fish are showing any signs of anything. What is this pop-eye? Could it > be delayed from a week ago? Also, what is best to treat it (pop- eye)? > I'm using a jungle fungus treatment in a qt tank but I'm worried that > isn't enough. > > Leslie > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Monday, August 15, 2005 5:49 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Adding some cichlids > > > The Malawi Peacocks are generally much milder in disposition than the > Malawi Mbunas. However, it is generally advised not to mix these Old > World Cichlids with New World Cichlids as they don't recognize each > other's signals (of aggression, territoriality, etc.). While the > Peacock may learn the hard way, you may be asking for trouble with a > head-long confrontation (with the Peacock getting the worst of it), > not knowing exactly what message the blood parrot is trying to get > across. I would advise against it, although you could try it, being > prepared to net the Peacock back out again if need be. As for the > six gallon, it just sounds crowded and although that peacock is small > now, its going to grow. Ray > \

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14574	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: Adding some cichlids

Leslie, Just a quick follow-up on my last post. On your isolation tank, it looked like you were saying (and I took it as) qt -- quart -- tank. Thought this was a bit small except for a Betta, but for one small fish like a Giant Danio I figured "a little crowded" but what the heck; should be okay with good aeration for a short time, like maybe that's all you had. With reading additional threads on this, I realize you were saying qt = quarantine (lol). Makes a big difference, and while I'm not sure of the size, you could probably figure on the amount of Epsom salts accordingly if you decide to use that. Glad to see you've already decided to start feeding medicated food. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > Leslie, . . . Additionally, you could add > Epsom salts to the tune of 1/8 tsp per 5 gallons, which in the case > of your 1 qt tank would be 1/20 of that amount . You would need to > disolve 1/8 tsp of E-Salts in a measuring cup of water and then just > use 1/20 of that amount (near as you could figure) of the measuring > cup. This is not essential, but may help. Ray > \ > > \

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14575	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: New Angelfish

Vicky, Usually, the most ideal time to introduce new fish to the tank is just before lights-out in the evening. In this way, everybody (including the new fish) gets use to any changes (like the new fish) gradually the next morning. With no place to hide, the new guy is now a target as there's no way to control the aggression of the gold Angel. Even though probably not in your original aqua- scaping plans, I would suggest adding some inexpensive leafy grown plants (like Watersprite) as cover for the new guy which you can remove after your more desired plants get established and grown. \ I don't see a problem with adding Bolivian Rams -- they're generally a more peaceful Cichlid. You certainly still have enough room for them. I would definitely not rearrange the tank for the Angels as one might do for confusing Mbunas as for one thing, this is just not as effective with New World Cichlids. The planted Watersprite should help to change things a bit, with adding cover. By the way, at one time the Angelfish's dorsal (along with other characteristics) had some indication of sex, with wild or near-wild fish, but now Angel's dorsal fins tend to vary not only with different strains, but with different aquarists/breeders variations of those strains. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, seleya8@a... wrote: > I got a new koi angelfish today and tried to introduce him into my 44 corner > tank. I have a slightly smaller gold angel in there (about 2") and there has > been some aggression. I added him while feeding to distract the fish in > there and there is some driftwood and vallis to duck behind but the plants are > not yet established enough to be true refuges. Is there anything else I should > do? I had also hoped to eventually add a pair of Bolivian rams, is that likely > to be ok, or am I asking for trouble? Otherwise, there are 3 marble > hatchets, an ancistrus and a gaggle of cories. This tank is new (I replaced a > different tank with this one and used all the existing driftwood/media/substrate), > the established angel has only "owned" it for a couple of weeks. Any > suggestions/advice? > > FWIW, I think they may be different sexes from my untrained eye - the gold > has a bit of a rounded belly and her vent seems slightly differently placed > than the koi. The dorsal fins also seem to be a bit different with the koi > having a slightly more spiky 'do' before you get to true fin. ???? > > Thanks! > > Vicky > > Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr > Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Call (301) 496-7299 or (301) > 402-8625 or write: hgparker@n... =) > > Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: > Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@n... 919-513-1467, > Dr London @ calondon@u... 530-754-5711 _AND_ > Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! > > Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@a... > > ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14576	From: Robert Hickey	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: New Angelfish

Hi vicky I have pretty much the same setup as yourself and adding a new angel to a tank that has a older angel in it, and with bolivan rams I have two angels both aroound the Same size 4 or so inches, I found adding another angel ended in all out War for the First 3 weeks, and now the two swim Around together with no hassle , however I tryed everything I could at first to seperate them and stop the aggression from the outer angel its all about territory and angels dont like anyone getting in there way. As suggested plants are a must and at first used to hide in the large vallis area at the back of the tank And angels seem to love this and its makes them feel secure, As to the rams, I have 2 males and a female and ae fine with angels being chiclids also ther ehold there own at the botton level of the tank and allow the angels if they wish to bottom feed etc, however the angels are a different story they will not allow the rams above mid level in the tank which is fine really As the Rams are bottom dwellers anyway . They will and do push each other around and its naturally no harm done and they all live very happyly together so If you need anymore info drop me a mail :o) Rob (irish rob) Regards Robert Hickey Robert Hickey | Networks Engineer Citywest Business Park | BT | Tel: +353 (0)1 43258749 | Mob: +353 (0)86 8061840 | E: robert.hickey@... | www.btireland.ie ----- Original Message ----- From: Ray Wetzel To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, August 16, 2005 1:45 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: New Angelfish Vicky, Usually, the most ideal time to introduce new fish to the tank is just before lights-out in the evening. In this way, everybody (including the new fish) gets use to any changes (like the new fish) gradually the next morning. With no place to hide, the new guy is now a target as there's no way to control the aggression of the gold Angel. Even though probably not in your original aqua- scaping plans, I would suggest adding some inexpensive leafy grown plants (like Watersprite) as cover for the new guy which you can remove after your more desired plants get established and grown. \ I don't see a problem with adding Bolivian Rams -- they're generally a more peaceful Cichlid. You certainly still have enough room for them. I would definitely not rearrange the tank for the Angels as one might do for confusing Mbunas as for one thing, this is just not as effective with New World Cichlids. The planted Watersprite should help to change things a bit, with adding cover. By the way, at one time the Angelfish's dorsal (along with other characteristics) had some indication of sex, with wild or near-wild fish, but now Angel's dorsal fins tend to vary not only with different strains, but with different aquarists/breeders variations of those strains. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, seleya8@a... wrote: > I got a new koi angelfish today and tried to introduce him into my 44 corner > tank. I have a slightly smaller gold angel in there (about 2") and there has > been some aggression. I added him while feeding to distract the fish in > there and there is some driftwood and vallis to duck behind but the plants are > not yet established enough to be true refuges. Is there anything else I should > do? I had also hoped to eventually add a pair of Bolivian rams, is that likely > to be ok, or am I asking for trouble? Otherwise, there are 3 marble > hatchets, an ancistrus and a gaggle of cories. This tank is new (I replaced a > different tank with this one and used all the existing driftwood/media/substrate), > the established angel has only "owned" it for a couple of weeks. Any > suggestions/advice? > > FWIW, I think they may be different sexes from my untrained eye - the gold > has a bit of a rounded belly and her vent seems slightly differently placed > than the koi. The dorsal fins also seem to be a bit different with the koi > having a slightly more spiky 'do' before you get to true fin. ???? > > Thanks! > > Vicky > > Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr > Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Call (301) 496-7299 or (301) > 402-8625 or write: hgparker@n... =) > > Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: > Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@n... 919-513-1467, > Dr London @ calondon@u... 530-754-5711 _AND_ > Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! > > Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@a... > > ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14577	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: giant danio with pop eyed

I have seen other fish pick at the pop eye. Keep a close eye on them. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14578	From: kb1dva	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: help

I couldn't get the filter going I think it might have been zapped- the storm was pretty bad. I also don't know how old the filter was, it came with the old tank. I bought a tetratech 500 the emperor was only rated at 70 gallons? - and my tank is a 90. It seems to move a lot more water; the fish seem more active so I wonder if the thing was failing. I hated to spend money I don't have but the thing just wouldn't work, no matter what. But thank you for the help. My local LFS said everybody was having tank trouble after that storm! Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14579	From: Robert Hickey	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus

Hi all I have a 60 gallon tank souh american biotope and more and more Im finding myself addicted to discus ( my girlfriend will kill me when I tell her spent 40 euros on a fish) I have two angels in the tank and I love them to bits, has anyone ever had angels in with discus, I know how shy and eveything about the discus as I have been researching them for a long time now, they guy I bought the tank off had a very large angel in with his younger discus, Im just wondering if I could or is it advisable , Its a large high tank so the angels stick to the top under flooting plants and verus tall vallis, its heavly planted with lots of bogwood and hidding places etc Thanks all :o) Irish rob Regards Robert Hickey Robert Hickey | Networks Engineer Citywest Business Park | BT | Tel: +353 (0)1 43258749 | Mob: +353 (0)86 8061840 | E: robert.hickey@... | www.btireland.ie ----- Original Message ----- From: kb1dva To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, August 16, 2005 2:14 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: help I couldn't get the filter going I think it might have been zapped- the storm was pretty bad. I also don't know how old the filter was, it came with the old tank. I bought a tetratech 500 the emperor was only rated at 70 gallons? - and my tank is a 90. It seems to move a lot more water; the fish seem more active so I wonder if the thing was failing. I hated to spend money I don't have but the thing just wouldn't work, no matter what. But thank you for the help. My local LFS said everybody was having tank trouble after that storm! Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14580	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: New Angelfish

When I added my gold angels to my 150 tank, I was quite surprised to see that the original two silvers picked on them profusely for the first 48 hours. After that, they were fine. Last week I introduced five more into the tank and there has not been any fighting or picking on at all. I fed the creatures in the 150 before I released the newbies, and I had the lights out for a couple of hours till the new fish had a chance to become familiar with their new surroundings. Everyone is quite happy and healthy. No fighting=) Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14581	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus

Robert, It is generally not advisable to mix Angels with Discus for a number of reasons. First of all, Discus (even adults) prefer the temperature at least 28 o C (30 o C for fry and juveniles), whereas Angels are more comfortable around 25 o C, unless breeding. It should also be noted that Angels are more aggressive feeders, usually resulting in your Discus not getting their fair share of food. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Robert Hickey" <rhickey@e...> wrote: > Hi all > > I have a 60 gallon tank souh american biotope and more and more Im finding myself addicted to discus ( my girlfriend will kill me when I tell her spent 40 euros on a fish) I have two angels in the tank and I love them to bits, has anyone ever had angels in with discus, I know how shy and eveything about the discus as I have been researching them for a long time now, > > they guy I bought the tank off had a very large angel in with his younger discus, > > Im just wondering if I could or is it advisable , Its a large high tank so the angels stick to the top under flooting plants and verus tall vallis, its heavly planted with lots of bogwood and hidding places etc > > Thanks all > > :o) > > Irish rob > > > > Regards > Robert Hickey > > Robert Hickey | Networks Engineer Citywest Business Park | BT | Tel: +353 > (0)1 43258749 > | Mob: +353 (0)86 8061840 | E: robert.hickey@b... | www.btireland.ie > ----- Original Message ----- > From: kb1dva > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Tuesday, August 16, 2005 2:14 PM > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: help > > > I couldn't get the filter going I think it might have been zapped- the storm > was pretty bad. I also don't know how old the filter was, it came with the > old tank. I bought a tetratech 500 the emperor was only rated at 70 gallons? > - and my tank is a 90. It seems to move a lot more water; the fish seem more > active so I wonder if the thing was failing. I hated to spend money I don't > have but the thing just wouldn't work, no matter what. But thank you for the > help. My local LFS said everybody was having tank trouble after that storm! > Emily > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- ---------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- ---------- > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14582	From: Robert Hickey	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus

Thanks ray The tank is at 28 degrees all the time, since it was Setup ages back with no problems, hmmm don`t know what to do now, Me wants discus, Ah well Irish Rob Regards Robert Hickey Robert Hickey | Networks Engineer Citywest Business Park | BT | Tel: +353 (0)1 43258749 | Mob: +353 (0)86 8061840 | E: robert.hickey@... | www.btireland.ie ----- Original Message ----- From: Ray Wetzel To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, August 16, 2005 2:50 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: angels and discus Robert, It is generally not advisable to mix Angels with Discus for a number of reasons. First of all, Discus (even adults) prefer the temperature at least 28 o C (30 o C for fry and juveniles), whereas Angels are more comfortable around 25 o C, unless breeding. It should also be noted that Angels are more aggressive feeders, usually resulting in your Discus not getting their fair share of food. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Robert Hickey" <rhickey@e...> wrote: > Hi all > > I have a 60 gallon tank souh american biotope and more and more Im finding myself addicted to discus ( my girlfriend will kill me when I tell her spent 40 euros on a fish) I have two angels in the tank and I love them to bits, has anyone ever had angels in with discus, I know how shy and eveything about the discus as I have been researching them for a long time now, > > they guy I bought the tank off had a very large angel in with his younger discus, > > Im just wondering if I could or is it advisable , Its a large high tank so the angels stick to the top under flooting plants and verus tall vallis, its heavly planted with lots of bogwood and hidding places etc > > Thanks all > > :o) > > Irish rob > > > > Regards > Robert Hickey > > Robert Hickey | Networks Engineer Citywest Business Park | BT | Tel: +353 > (0)1 43258749 > | Mob: +353 (0)86 8061840 | E: robert.hickey@b... | www.btireland.ie > ----- Original Message ----- > From: kb1dva > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Tuesday, August 16, 2005 2:14 PM > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: help > > > I couldn't get the filter going I think it might have been zapped- the storm > was pretty bad. I also don't know how old the filter was, it came with the > old tank. I bought a tetratech 500 the emperor was only rated at 70 gallons? > - and my tank is a 90. It seems to move a lot more water; the fish seem more > active so I wonder if the thing was failing. I hated to spend money I don't > have but the thing just wouldn't work, no matter what. But thank you for the > help. My local LFS said everybody was having tank trouble after that storm! > Emily > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- ---------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- ---------- > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14583	From: Leslie	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: Adding some cichlids

I did add the maracyn 2 last night as a tab form. I added half a pill then and will add 1/4 pill for another 5 days. I found a great link on the red streaks that you identified so that is why I ran to the lfs and purchased what I did, minus the medicated food as I forgot. I will get that this afternoon. The other two danios both have red on them as well, but only minor. They have done this before and it went away on it's own so they may not be infected. I'm watching closely anyway. I tested the water with new tests and everything is perfect. Thank GOD! No ammonia or nitrites and 20 at nitrates. I bought the liquid tests instead and I like not having to dissolve the tabs. Much faster. You know I now have 4 tanks? I started with one unexpected and ended up with four. It's addicting. And I love finding tanks at sales and thrift shops. I got a 2 gal with filter and all for $4 at a thrift shop the other day. =) -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Tuesday, August 16, 2005 6:28 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Adding some cichlids Leslie, The red belly on your Giant Danio is hemorrhagic Septicemia, an internal disease resulting from an infection of gram-negative aeromonas or pseudomonas bacteria. Unless your water paranmeters are elevated again, this in all probability is something that had started from your problems of last week. This is usually associated with Dropsey, but as long as you don't see the scales standing out from the body it looks like maybe you've caught it in the early stages. The pop-eye is associated with it as there is a bad internal infection going on. The pop-eye condition itself is a result of fluids being built up behind the eye (and pushing it out) from the internal infection. \ The Jungle Fungus treatment is not enough, but I believe you said in a later post that you've since added Maracyn-Two (Minocycline), a broad-spectrum anti-bacterial med which is one of the best for treatment of this disease. Good you acted fast, as this is a serious fast acting disease. If you can get the fish to eat a medicated food such as "Pepso", all the better. Other medications useful against this disease are Terramycn, Oxytetracycline hydrochloride, Kanamycin and Nitrofurazone (including Furan II). Additionally, you could add Epsom salts to the tune of 1/8 tsp per 5 gallons, which in the case of your 1 qt tank would be 1/20 of that amount . You would need to disolve 1/8 tsp of E-Salts in a measuring cup of water and then just use 1/20 of that amount (near as you could figure) of the measuring cup. This is not essential, but may help. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > Now for more problems. Giant danios are generally pretty hardy fish, > right? One of my three has a red belly and HUGE nasty pop-eye with > cloud on one of them. ARGH! And here I thought all was well. No other > fish are showing any signs of anything. What is this pop-eye? Could it > be delayed from a week ago? Also, what is best to treat it (pop- eye)? > I'm using a jungle fungus treatment in a qt tank but I'm worried that > isn't enough. > > Leslie > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Monday, August 15, 2005 5:49 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Adding some cichlids > > > The Malawi Peacocks are generally much milder in disposition than the > Malawi Mbunas. However, it is generally advised not to mix these Old > World Cichlids with New World Cichlids as they don't recognize each > other's signals (of aggression, territoriality, etc.). While the > Peacock may learn the hard way, you may be asking for trouble with a > head-long confrontation (with the Peacock getting the worst of it), > not knowing exactly what message the blood parrot is trying to get > across. I would advise against it, although you could try it, being > prepared to net the Peacock back out again if need be. As for the > six gallon, it just sounds crowded and although that peacock is small > now, its going to grow. Ray > \ Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14584	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus

Set up another tank(?).--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Robert Hickey" <rhickey@e...> wrote: > Thanks ray > > The tank is at 28 degrees all the time, since it was Setup ages back with no problems, > > hmmm don`t know what to do now, > > Me wants discus, > > Ah well > > Irish Rob > > Regards > Robert Hickey > > Robert Hickey | Networks Engineer Citywest Business Park | BT | Tel: +353 > (0)1 43258749 > | Mob: +353 (0)86 8061840 | E: robert.hickey@b... | www.btireland.ie > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Ray Wetzel > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Tuesday, August 16, 2005 2:50 PM > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: angels and discus > > > Robert, It is generally not advisable to mix Angels with Discus for > a number of reasons. First of all, Discus (even adults) prefer the > temperature at least 28 o C (30 o C for fry and juveniles), whereas > Angels are more comfortable around 25 o C, unless breeding. It > should also be noted that Angels are more aggressive feeders, usually > resulting in your Discus not getting their fair share of food. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Robert Hickey" <rhickey@e...> > wrote: > > Hi all > > > > I have a 60 gallon tank souh american biotope and more and more Im > finding myself addicted to discus ( my girlfriend will kill me when I > tell her spent 40 euros on a fish) I have two angels in the tank and > I love them to bits, has anyone ever had angels in with discus, I > know how shy and eveything about the discus as I have been > researching them for a long time now, > > > > they guy I bought the tank off had a very large angel in with his > younger discus, > > > > Im just wondering if I could or is it advisable , Its a large high > tank so the angels stick to the top under flooting plants and verus > tall vallis, its heavly planted with lots of bogwood and hidding > places etc > > > > Thanks all > > > > :o) > > > > Irish rob > > > > > > > > Regards > > Robert Hickey > > > > Robert Hickey | Networks Engineer Citywest Business Park | BT | > Tel: +353 > > (0)1 43258749 > > | Mob: +353 (0)86 8061840 | E: robert.hickey@b... | www.btireland.ie > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: kb1dva > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Sent: Tuesday, August 16, 2005 2:14 PM > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: help > > > > > > I couldn't get the filter going I think it might have been zapped- > the storm > > was pretty bad. I also don't know how old the filter was, it came > with the > > old tank. I bought a tetratech 500 the emperor was only rated at > 70 gallons? > > - and my tank is a 90. It seems to move a lot more water; the > fish seem more > > active so I wonder if the thing was failing. I hated to spend > money I don't > > have but the thing just wouldn't work, no matter what. But thank > you for the > > help. My local LFS said everybody was having tank trouble after > that storm! > > Emily > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------- ---- > ---------- > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > > > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms > of Service. > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------- ---- > ---------- > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > > > SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- ---------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- ---------- > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14585	From: Robert Hickey	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus

hahahaha thanks ray she would kill me indeed we already have a tank in nearly ever room in the house as it is, and were in a bungalow so, ah Well if I had the space for a juwel rio 400 I would have two hahahaha Either that or buy some scuda gear :o) Rob Regards Robert Hickey Robert Hickey | Networks Engineer Citywest Business Park | BT | Tel: +353 (0)1 43258749 | Mob: +353 (0)86 8061840 | E: robert.hickey@... | www.btireland.ie ----- Original Message ----- From: Ray Wetzel To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, August 16, 2005 3:14 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: angels and discus Set up another tank(?).--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Robert Hickey" <rhickey@e...> wrote: > Thanks ray > > The tank is at 28 degrees all the time, since it was Setup ages back with no problems, > > hmmm don`t know what to do now, > > Me wants discus, > > Ah well > > Irish Rob > > Regards > Robert Hickey > > Robert Hickey | Networks Engineer Citywest Business Park | BT | Tel: +353 > (0)1 43258749 > | Mob: +353 (0)86 8061840 | E: robert.hickey@b... | www.btireland.ie > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Ray Wetzel > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Tuesday, August 16, 2005 2:50 PM > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: angels and discus > > > Robert, It is generally not advisable to mix Angels with Discus for > a number of reasons. First of all, Discus (even adults) prefer the > temperature at least 28 o C (30 o C for fry and juveniles), whereas > Angels are more comfortable around 25 o C, unless breeding. It > should also be noted that Angels are more aggressive feeders, usually > resulting in your Discus not getting their fair share of food. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Robert Hickey" <rhickey@e...> > wrote: > > Hi all > > > > I have a 60 gallon tank souh american biotope and more and more Im > finding myself addicted to discus ( my girlfriend will kill me when I > tell her spent 40 euros on a fish) I have two angels in the tank and > I love them to bits, has anyone ever had angels in with discus, I > know how shy and eveything about the discus as I have been > researching them for a long time now, > > > > they guy I bought the tank off had a very large angel in with his > younger discus, > > > > Im just wondering if I could or is it advisable , Its a large high > tank so the angels stick to the top under flooting plants and verus > tall vallis, its heavly planted with lots of bogwood and hidding > places etc > > > > Thanks all > > > > :o) > > > > Irish rob > > > > > > > > Regards > > Robert Hickey > > > > Robert Hickey | Networks Engineer Citywest Business Park | BT | > Tel: +353 > > (0)1 43258749 > > | Mob: +353 (0)86 8061840 | E: robert.hickey@b... | www.btireland.ie > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: kb1dva > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Sent: Tuesday, August 16, 2005 2:14 PM > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: help > > > > > > I couldn't get the filter going I think it might have been zapped- > the storm > > was pretty bad. I also don't know how old the filter was, it came > with the > > old tank. I bought a tetratech 500 the emperor was only rated at > 70 gallons? > > - and my tank is a 90. It seems to move a lot more water; the > fish seem more > > active so I wonder if the thing was failing. I hated to spend > money I don't > > have but the thing just wouldn't work, no matter what. But thank > you for the > > help. My local LFS said everybody was having tank trouble after > that storm! > > Emily > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------- ---- > ---------- > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > > > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms > of Service. > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------- ---- > ---------- > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > > > SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- ---------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- ---------- > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14586	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: Adding some cichlids

Glad to see you found a link on the red streaks and acted fast on getting the med to them. Might not be a bad idea to put the other two Danios in the quarantine tank as well, since you have the proper med in there to treat them, rather than hoping it clears up by chance. It can't do anything else than help them. Would have got back to you sooner (like last night), but I'm an early riser and lately I'm getting to bed earlier or just watching the big tube, not the monitor. \ Sounds like you've found some good deals on some of your tanks. So, you're just finding out that this hobby can get addicting! (LOL ... lol ... LOL). Most of us (with multiple tanks) start out not really intended to have many (or any) more. The additional ones start out as being unexpected but "needed", as we soon learn a q-tine tank is handy and then there's always fry sooner or later and it takes off from there. You soon discover that you can't do without fewer than what you have and continually find the need to add "just one more", with no end. Ask almost anyone in the hobby who becomes more serious about keeping fish than just being content to have one tank, and they'll always say they never have enough room regardless of how many tanks they have. This is similar to, but not exactly the same as the pondkeeper who starts with a certain sized pond in mind (surely plenty big enough at the time), and by the following year wishes they should have made the pond much larger to begin with -- almost invariably. I must have heard this a hundred times. There is no end to this hobby -- it just keeps growing in proportion to our appetite for keeping and enjoying these animals. Well, got to go change some water. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > I did add the maracyn 2 last night as a tab form. I added half a pill > then and will add 1/4 pill for another 5 days. > I found a great link on the red streaks that you identified so that is > why I ran to the lfs and purchased what I did, minus the medicated food > as I forgot. I will get that this afternoon. > > The other two danios both have red on them as well, but only minor. > They have done this before and it went away on it's own so they may not > be infected. I'm watching closely anyway. I tested the water with new > tests and everything is perfect. Thank GOD! No ammonia or nitrites and > 20 at nitrates. I bought the liquid tests instead and I like not having > to dissolve the tabs. Much faster. > > You know I now have 4 tanks? I started with one unexpected and ended up > with four. It's addicting. And I love finding tanks at sales and > thrift shops. I got a 2 gal with filter and all for $4 at a thrift shop > the other day. > > =) > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Tuesday, August 16, 2005 6:28 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Adding some cichlids > > > Leslie, The red belly on your Giant Danio is hemorrhagic Septicemia, > an internal disease resulting from an infection of gram-negative > aeromonas or pseudomonas bacteria. Unless your water paranmeters are > elevated again, this in all probability is something that had started > from your problems of last week. This is usually associated with > Dropsey, but as long as you don't see the scales standing out from > the body it looks like maybe you've caught it in the early stages. > The pop-eye is associated with it as there is a bad internal > infection going on. The pop-eye condition itself is a result of > fluids being built up behind the eye (and pushing it out) from the > internal infection. > \ > The Jungle Fungus treatment is not enough, but I believe you said in > a later post that you've since added Maracyn-Two (Minocycline), a > broad-spectrum anti-bacterial med which is one of the best for > treatment of this disease. Good you acted fast, as this is a serious > fast acting disease. If you can get the fish to eat a medicated food > such as "Pepso", all the better. Other medications useful against > this disease are Terramycn, Oxytetracycline hydrochloride, Kanamycin > and Nitrofurazone (including Furan II). Additionally, you could add > Epsom salts to the tune of 1/8 tsp per 5 gallons, which in the case > of your 1 qt tank would be 1/20 of that amount . You would need to > disolve 1/8 tsp of E-Salts in a measuring cup of water and then just > use 1/20 of that amount (near as you could figure) of the measuring > cup. This is not essential, but may help. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > > > Now for more problems. Giant danios are generally pretty hardy > fish, > > right? One of my three has a red belly and HUGE nasty pop-eye with > > cloud on one of them. ARGH! And here I thought all was well. No > other > > fish are showing any signs of anything. What is this pop-eye? > Could it > > be delayed from a week ago? Also, what is best to treat it (pop- > eye)? > > I'm using a jungle fungus treatment in a qt tank but I'm worried > that > > isn't enough. > > > > Leslie > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > > On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > > Sent: Monday, August 15, 2005 5:49 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Adding some cichlids > > > > > > The Malawi Peacocks are generally much milder in disposition than > the > > Malawi Mbunas. However, it is generally advised not to mix these > Old > > World Cichlids with New World Cichlids as they don't recognize each > > other's signals (of aggression, territoriality, etc.). While the > > Peacock may learn the hard way, you may be asking for trouble with > a > > head-long confrontation (with the Peacock getting the worst of it), > > not knowing exactly what message the blood parrot is trying to get > > across. I would advise against it, although you could try it, > being > > prepared to net the Peacock back out again if need be. As for the > > six gallon, it just sounds crowded and although that peacock is > small > > now, its going to grow. Ray > > \ > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important > to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife > Management. > Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14587	From: Robert Hickey	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: Adding some cichlids

Hiya ray yeh pretty much , saturday routines of multiple water Changes on different tanks , were so used t it now its just standard for me it all started about 3 years ago when I hadnt ac clue what to get my girlfriend for her birthday ,knowing how much she missed her dog and with us living in a flat I decided to get a 5 gallon plastic tank with a few small goldfish, which she still discribes as the best present she ever got , andit all started from there As it Was down to me to figure out what Was going in with them and cycle and everthing else so I became a bit of an expert on it , so i ended up hooked, and started my own tank a rekord 70 and then a friend started a rekord 60 with afican frogs so we all jumped into the hugh learning curve of looking after as we have called them our babies how sad Are we, :o) anyway I then moved onto a 260 litres and its my pride and joy, its in the sitting room and the TV usually gets turned of And we sit and watch the tank, its a south american biotope angels rams and neons ( angel food at Some point ) and a school of serpae tetras. the bedroom is A asian biotope with bettas etc and the office is my old rekord 70 that has her hugh goldfish moved to Scuba gear is the next buy i think hahaha over the last three years I have learned so much and so love keeing fish its so rewarding and such a pleasure :o) Irish Rob Regards Robert Hickey Robert Hickey | Networks Engineer Citywest Business Park | BT | Tel: +353 (0)1 43258749 | Mob: +353 (0)86 8061840 | E: robert.hickey@... | www.btireland.ie ----- Original Message ----- From: Ray Wetzel To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, August 16, 2005 3:41 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Adding some cichlids Glad to see you found a link on the red streaks and acted fast on getting the med to them. Might not be a bad idea to put the other two Danios in the quarantine tank as well, since you have the proper med in there to treat them, rather than hoping it clears up by chance. It can't do anything else than help them. Would have got back to you sooner (like last night), but I'm an early riser and lately I'm getting to bed earlier or just watching the big tube, not the monitor. \ Sounds like you've found some good deals on some of your tanks. So, you're just finding out that this hobby can get addicting! (LOL ... lol ... LOL). Most of us (with multiple tanks) start out not really intended to have many (or any) more. The additional ones start out as being unexpected but "needed", as we soon learn a q-tine tank is handy and then there's always fry sooner or later and it takes off from there. You soon discover that you can't do without fewer than what you have and continually find the need to add "just one more", with no end. Ask almost anyone in the hobby who becomes more serious about keeping fish than just being content to have one tank, and they'll always say they never have enough room regardless of how many tanks they have. This is similar to, but not exactly the same as the pondkeeper who starts with a certain sized pond in mind (surely plenty big enough at the time), and by the following year wishes they should have made the pond much larger to begin with -- almost invariably. I must have heard this a hundred times. There is no end to this hobby -- it just keeps growing in proportion to our appetite for keeping and enjoying these animals. Well, got to go change some water. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > I did add the maracyn 2 last night as a tab form. I added half a pill > then and will add 1/4 pill for another 5 days. > I found a great link on the red streaks that you identified so that is > why I ran to the lfs and purchased what I did, minus the medicated food > as I forgot. I will get that this afternoon. > > The other two danios both have red on them as well, but only minor. > They have done this before and it went away on it's own so they may not > be infected. I'm watching closely anyway. I tested the water with new > tests and everything is perfect. Thank GOD! No ammonia or nitrites and > 20 at nitrates. I bought the liquid tests instead and I like not having > to dissolve the tabs. Much faster. > > You know I now have 4 tanks? I started with one unexpected and ended up > with four. It's addicting. And I love finding tanks at sales and > thrift shops. I got a 2 gal with filter and all for $4 at a thrift shop > the other day. > > =) > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Tuesday, August 16, 2005 6:28 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Adding some cichlids > > > Leslie, The red belly on your Giant Danio is hemorrhagic Septicemia, > an internal disease resulting from an infection of gram-negative > aeromonas or pseudomonas bacteria. Unless your water paranmeters are > elevated again, this in all probability is something that had started > from your problems of last week. This is usually associated with > Dropsey, but as long as you don't see the scales standing out from > the body it looks like maybe you've caught it in the early stages. > The pop-eye is associated with it as there is a bad internal > infection going on. The pop-eye condition itself is a result of > fluids being built up behind the eye (and pushing it out) from the > internal infection. > \ > The Jungle Fungus treatment is not enough, but I believe you said in > a later post that you've since added Maracyn-Two (Minocycline), a > broad-spectrum anti-bacterial med which is one of the best for > treatment of this disease. Good you acted fast, as this is a serious > fast acting disease. If you can get the fish to eat a medicated food > such as "Pepso", all the better. Other medications useful against > this disease are Terramycn, Oxytetracycline hydrochloride, Kanamycin > and Nitrofurazone (including Furan II). Additionally, you could add > Epsom salts to the tune of 1/8 tsp per 5 gallons, which in the case > of your 1 qt tank would be 1/20 of that amount . You would need to > disolve 1/8 tsp of E-Salts in a measuring cup of water and then just > use 1/20 of that amount (near as you could figure) of the measuring > cup. This is not essential, but may help. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > > > > Now for more problems. Giant danios are generally pretty hardy > fish, > > right? One of my three has a red belly and HUGE nasty pop-eye with > > cloud on one of them. ARGH! And here I thought all was well. No > other > > fish are showing any signs of anything. What is this pop-eye? > Could it > > be delayed from a week ago? Also, what is best to treat it (pop- > eye)? > > I'm using a jungle fungus treatment in a qt tank but I'm worried > that > > isn't enough. > > > > Leslie > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > > On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > > Sent: Monday, August 15, 2005 5:49 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Adding some cichlids > > > > > > The Malawi Peacocks are generally much milder in disposition than > the > > Malawi Mbunas. However, it is generally advised not to mix these > Old > > World Cichlids with New World Cichlids as they don't recognize each > > other's signals (of aggression, territoriality, etc.). While the > > Peacock may learn the hard way, you may be asking for trouble with > a > > head-long confrontation (with the Peacock getting the worst of it), > > not knowing exactly what message the blood parrot is trying to get > > across. I would advise against it, although you could try it, > being > > prepared to net the Peacock back out again if need be. As for the > > six gallon, it just sounds crowded and although that peacock is > small > > now, its going to grow. Ray > > \ > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important > to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife > Management. > Yahoo! Groups Links Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14588	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus

In a message dated 8/16/2005 8:51:21 A.M. Central Standard Time, sevenspringss@... writes: It should also be noted that Angels are more aggressive feeders, usually I'd say! Mine hang out around the top of the tank whenever someone comes near the tank. Feeding time resembles a school of piranhas! I really have to watch them feed to make sure the keyhole cichlids (who are somewhat shy and bottom dwellers) are getting enough to eat. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14589	From: Robert Hickey	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus

thanks linda the tank i have has a wide top area and I feed the angels seperate to the rest of the fish and distract the angels with there own food and feed the rest rams corys tetras and pleco, knowing and seeing how angels and the rest of the tank feed could I add some discus, the angels only stay at the top of the tank and rarely go near the bottom, hmmmm Rob Regards Robert Hickey Robert Hickey | Networks Engineer Citywest Business Park | BT | Tel: +353 (0)1 43258749 | Mob: +353 (0)86 8061840 | E: robert.hickey@... | www.btireland.ie ----- Original Message ----- From: Crazy4fids@... To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, August 16, 2005 4:14 PM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: angels and discus In a message dated 8/16/2005 8:51:21 A.M. Central Standard Time, sevenspringss@... writes: It should also be noted that Angels are more aggressive feeders, usually I'd say! Mine hang out around the top of the tank whenever someone comes near the tank. Feeding time resembles a school of piranhas! I really have to watch them feed to make sure the keyhole cichlids (who are somewhat shy and bottom dwellers) are getting enough to eat. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14590	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: adding more tanks

In a message dated 8/16/2005 9:43:49 A.M. Central Standard Time, sevenspringss@... writes: Most of us (with multiple tanks) start out not really intended to have many (or any) more My hobby comes with a restrictor plate; it's called a husband. I think I may have to get rid of him to add another tank to my household. Wait till my angels are ready to breed. I may have to set up tanks in my laundry room. There is a nice place to stack a few tanks right where the folding table is =) I have a friend that I sold a 55 gallon set up to many years ago when I bought my 75 gallon. I ran into her recently and she wanted to know if I wanted it back. She has gotten sick of the thing and wanted to know if I want it back. This has got to be close to 15 years ago. A 55 gallon tank would be great for growing out angel fry. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14591	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus

I have heard that people keep discus with altum angel. If you really want to keep angels with your discus, maybe you could invest in some altum angels. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14592	From: Robert Hickey	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus

altum angels are so beautiful and rare And expensive As Im in ireland and not the States the prices over here are two or three fold however I have two angels already and a silver and a white gold angel so pretty, think I will try Anyway and see how they get on, As I have Seen it before ( the guy who I bought the tank off had 2 Angels and 4 discus and a large sevrerium(spelling) and 16 rummie nose tetras amoung the catfish he had, think I am lucky enough that the girlfriend is as much into it as I am ( she just dosnt like the idea of how expnsive discus Are) As she has two smaller tanks to my one large one And I had to stop her from buying a biorp for the bathroom , go Figure!!! hahaha Regards Robert Hickey Robert Hickey | Networks Engineer Citywest Business Park | BT | Tel: +353 (0)1 43258749 | Mob: +353 (0)86 8061840 | E: robert.hickey@... | www.btireland.ie ----- Original Message ----- From: Crazy4fids@... To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, August 16, 2005 4:26 PM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: angels and discus I have heard that people keep discus with altum angel. If you really want to keep angels with your discus, maybe you could invest in some altum angels. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14593	From: Eric Miner	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: The war on hair algae

My war on hair algae is still being fought. I've tired the following: Turn off lights for a few hours a day creating a `rest period". Manually remove the hair algae. This is a real pain. Plus, it cover half of my substrate and I lose gravel every time I try to get it out of the substrate Added fast growing plants such as Hornwort. Not sure how well this is working, the Hornwort in some places is covered with the algae. Keep plants well feed, but not adding nitrates or phosphate Regular water changes to keep nitrates down The hair algae is now shorter, no really long strands. But, it's still covers about half of my plants and half of the substrate. It's now fuzzy hair algae. My tank is a 46 gal. bowfront. Lighting is a Coralife power compact fluorescent 96 watts, about 2 watts/gal. While the algae are shorter is there any hope of getting rid of it completely? I have been give two techniques – one I found in a thread on the net the other is from my LFS. On the net I found a thread that discusses the use of Flourish Excel. The technique is to double dose the tank every day for about a week. This apparently kills the algae. The down side is that I have young Panda Corys n the tank and I'm concerned this might affect them. My LFS suggested adding Florida Flag Fish since they will eat the algae. I'm not really attracted to this fish and I'm already at the limit for this tank. Please any advice of words of hope will be greatly appreciated. Thanks, Eric

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14594	From: rojeriko	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: The war on hair algae

Hi Eric, I had a similar problem. It started with soft hair algae and continued with harder brush algae. In fact for a while algae was the only plant life that was growing. I was using only Seachem Iron at that time. This is what I did to get rid of algae. I started using Seachem Potassium and Flourish Excel. Excel doesn't kill algae, it only provides liquid carbon for the plants. When the plants are fed properly, algae would be under control. I also use an UV sterilizer as a disease prevention but it also helps to kill the free floating algae. In my aquarium food is not free :) The fish has to work for it. My platies enjoy the soft hair algae, the otto cats enjoy any soft algae. The main worker is the Siamese Algae Eater ( true SAE). They can eat the hard brush algae. They are always busy cleaning the plants or the gravel. I provide algae tablets maybe once a week and I drop it after lights off. Otto's and SAE's are also active at night, so the platies don't finish the tablets I have a 38g with 96W Coralife light. The light is on for 12 hours a day. I clean the glass from time to time with a magnet and that's all for algae cleaning. Before finding the real SAE's I also consider the flag cichlid but I was worried about my platy fries. In my heavily planted tank some of the fries actually survive. My setup may be too peaceful for the flag cichlid. But I must admit that I don't have any experience with the flag fish so I may be wrong. If you consider the SAE, make sure that you buy the real SAE ,not the flying fox or false SAE ( definitely not the Chinese Algae Eater; can get too big and aggresive) Good luck Murat --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Miner" <eminer1254@y...> wrote: > My war on hair algae is still being fought. I've tired the following: > > Turn off lights for a few hours a day creating a `rest period". > > Manually remove the hair algae. This is a real pain. Plus, it cover > half of my substrate and I lose gravel every time I try to get it out > of the substrate > > Added fast growing plants such as Hornwort. Not sure how well this is > working, the Hornwort in some places is covered with the algae. > > Keep plants well feed, but not adding nitrates or phosphate > > Regular water changes to keep nitrates down > > The hair algae is now shorter, no really long strands. But, it's still > covers about half of my plants and half of the substrate. It's now > fuzzy hair algae. > My tank is a 46 gal. bowfront. Lighting is a Coralife power compact > fluorescent 96 watts, about 2 watts/gal. > > While the algae are shorter is there any hope of getting rid of it > completely? I have been give two techniques – one I found in a thread > on the net the other is from my LFS. > > On the net I found a thread that discusses the use of Flourish Excel. > The technique is to double dose the tank every day for about a week. > This apparently kills the algae. The down side is that I have young > Panda Corys n the tank and I'm concerned this might affect them. > > My LFS suggested adding Florida Flag Fish since they will eat the > algae. I'm not really attracted to this fish and I'm already at the > limit for this tank. > > Please any advice of words of hope will be greatly appreciated. > > Thanks, > > Eric

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14595	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus

I just saw a picture of those this morning, they are quite striking fish! Do angels do okay singly or are they better in pairs or groups? Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > I have heard that people keep discus with altum angel. If you really want > to keep angels with your discus, maybe you could invest in some altum angels. > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14596	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: The war on hair algae

You can take apart the whole kit and kaboodle and bleach everything. Swordtails also eat algae. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14597	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus

angels are best kept by themselves (one per tank) or more than three or four. I have eleven juveniles in a 150 gallon community tank with keyhole cichlids, swordtails, rummy nose tetras, neon tetras, long fin blue danios, three otos and four cory cats and a dwarf pleco. When the angels start to pair off, I will be setting them up in breeder tanks. I don't want any more than 7 angels in the community at one time. Altum angels are quite like discus. They prefer a quieter environment and are very shy. I am not aware that they breed in captivity. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14598	From: Leslie	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Putting a fish down

I need to put my giant danio down. His eye has exploded internally and is beyond repair. I came home with the pepso food and it was like this. He won't eat it. I was told that I could/should put him a bag with just enough water to cover him then place him in the freezer. Does this sound OK, or as OK as humanely possible? I hate this. Poor guy. Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14599	From: John Gonzalez	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: Putting a fish down

Leslie, Sorry to hear about your fish. Here is a link of humane methods. http://www.fishforums.net/index.php?showtopic=8031 --- Leslie <amjmail@...> wrote: > I need to put my giant danio down. His eye has > exploded internally and > is beyond repair. I came home with the pepso food > and it was like this. > He won't eat it. > > I was told that I could/should put him a bag with > just enough water to > cover him then place him in the freezer. Does this > sound OK, or as OK > as humanely possible? > > I hate this. Poor guy. > > Leslie > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Helps protect you from nasty viruses. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14600	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: Putting a fish down

Leslie, Sorry to hear he has gotten worse. Yes, that is one humane way of putting him down. Another way is to drop him in a container of seltzer water/club soda. The carbon dioxide will do him in, in short time. Fish don't feel the cold from freezing them. Their metabolism just slows down until it finally stops. We feel the cold 'cause we can feel the difference between the outside temperature and our body temperature, and we shiver to increase our body temperature if its too cold. Fish, being cold-blooded don't do that. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > I need to put my giant danio down. His eye has exploded internally and > is beyond repair. I came home with the pepso food and it was like this. > He won't eat it. > > I was told that I could/should put him a bag with just enough water to > cover him then place him in the freezer. Does this sound OK, or as OK > as humanely possible? > > I hate this. Poor guy. > > Leslie > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14601	From: Leslie	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: Putting a fish down

What a drag. Well I did take the remaining two danios and put them into the 6 gal eclipse. I had cycled it with bio spira the other day so it's ready for them. They aren't pleased with the smaller quarters but I'm hoping they will kick this. Their fins are more red than this morning. They did eat a few pellets of the med food and I'm hoping that they will eat more if confined. I also added some salt and maracyn 2. My betta with the pop eye ate the food wonderfully so I am hoping he will get over this. His tank is also being treated with maracyn 2. My lfs is so used to me, he gave me a free hamster cage and hamster for a fundraiser he heard I was coordinating. Eeesh. =) lol He also offered my friend a 75 gal. set up, tank, stand and canopy, for $375. I'm spending wa----y too much time in there. Keep your fingers crossed please! I can't handle losing anymore fish! From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Tuesday, August 16, 2005 3:27 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Putting a fish down Leslie, Sorry to hear he has gotten worse. Yes, that is one humane way of putting him down. Another way is to drop him in a container of seltzer water/club soda. The carbon dioxide will do him in, in short time. Fish don't feel the cold from freezing them. Their metabolism just slows down until it finally stops. We feel the cold 'cause we can feel the difference between the outside temperature and our body temperature, and we shiver to increase our body temperature if its too cold. Fish, being cold-blooded don't do that. Ray \ ---

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14602	From: Leslie	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: Putting a fish down

One more thing...is this stuff contagious? I fed the main tank the med food but should I do anything else preventative?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14603	From: richard thompson	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: Putting a fish down

seltzer water works even better, the co2 in the water will numb him before the freezing process, or to be really fast, you can bput him in a bag and bop him against a wall head first, a 1 second smack and it will beover. sounds brutal i k now, but itis the fastest Leslie <amjmail@...> wrote:I need to put my giant danio down. His eye has exploded internally and is beyond repair. I came home with the pepso food and it was like this. He won't eat it. I was told that I could/should put him a bag with just enough water to cover him then place him in the freezer. Does this sound OK, or as OK as humanely possible? I hate this. Poor guy. Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14604	From: richard thompson	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: Good water quality or lack there off??

if phosphate is high, there is way too much fod in the system. Nicolas Munro <nmunro@...> wrote:What is good water quality? I've lost my third tiger barb in about 3 months, and starting to wonder if I'm missing something from the picture. Nitrate, Nitrite, pH, etc. all ok except phosphate which is drastically high. Besides when they first get sick the fish don't pick on each other. I can't get them to bread yet, there are 10 tiger barbs which I suspect are a mix of male and female but no signs of breeding, same goes for my bettas altho it could be too cold for them 27.5degC. Any suggestions what I should test for? =Nick Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14605	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus

I figured you might get a laugh out of that! Which of course was exactly why I sent it. Ah, I see by your post the fish addiction has hit you too (hahaha). A tank in nearly every room of the house. Well I guess you're reaching you limit (with the wife). I do notice that there are still some room(s) without tanks though (hahaha). I'm beginning to see why those old double wrought iron stands were so popular over the wooden cabinet stands that you can put only one tank on. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Robert Hickey" <rhickey@e...> wrote: > hahahaha thanks ray > > she would kill me indeed we already have a tank in nearly ever room in the house as it is, and were in a bungalow so, > > > ah Well if I had the space for a juwel rio 400 I would have two > > hahahaha > > Either that or buy some scuda gear > > :o) > Rob > > Regards > Robert Hickey > > Robert Hickey | Networks Engineer Citywest Business Park | BT | Tel: +353 > (0)1 43258749 > | Mob: +353 (0)86 8061840 | E: robert.hickey@b... | www.btireland.ie > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Ray Wetzel > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Tuesday, August 16, 2005 3:14 PM > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: angels and discus > > > Set up another tank(?).--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Robert > Hickey" <rhickey@e...> wrote: > > Thanks ray > > > > The tank is at 28 degrees all the time, since it was Setup ages > back with no problems, > > > > hmmm don`t know what to do now, > > > > Me wants discus, > > > > Ah well > > > > Irish Rob > > > > Regards > > Robert Hickey > > > > Robert Hickey | Networks Engineer Citywest Business Park | BT | > Tel: +353 > > (0)1 43258749 > > | Mob: +353 (0)86 8061840 | E: robert.hickey@b... | www.btireland.ie > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Ray Wetzel > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Sent: Tuesday, August 16, 2005 2:50 PM > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: angels and discus > > > > > > Robert, It is generally not advisable to mix Angels with Discus > for > > a number of reasons. First of all, Discus (even adults) prefer > the > > temperature at least 28 o C (30 o C for fry and juveniles), > whereas > > Angels are more comfortable around 25 o C, unless breeding. It > > should also be noted that Angels are more aggressive feeders, > usually > > resulting in your Discus not getting their fair share of food. > Ray > > > \ > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Robert Hickey" > <rhickey@e...> > > wrote: > > > Hi all > > > > > > I have a 60 gallon tank souh american biotope and more and more > Im > > finding myself addicted to discus ( my girlfriend will kill me > when I > > tell her spent 40 euros on a fish) I have two angels in the tank > and > > I love them to bits, has anyone ever had angels in with discus, I > > know how shy and eveything about the discus as I have been > > researching them for a long time now, > > > > > > they guy I bought the tank off had a very large angel in with > his > > younger discus, > > > > > > Im just wondering if I could or is it advisable , Its a large > high > > tank so the angels stick to the top under flooting plants and > verus > > tall vallis, its heavly planted with lots of bogwood and hidding > > places etc > > > > > > Thanks all > > > > > > :o) > > > > > > Irish rob > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards > > > Robert Hickey > > > > > > Robert Hickey | Networks Engineer Citywest Business Park | BT | > > Tel: +353 > > > (0)1 43258749 > > > | Mob: +353 (0)86 8061840 | E: robert.hickey@b... | > www.btireland.ie > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: kb1dva > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Sent: Tuesday, August 16, 2005 2:14 PM > > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: help > > > > > > > > > I couldn't get the filter going I think it might have been > zapped- > > the storm > > > was pretty bad. I also don't know how old the filter was, it > came > > with the > > > old tank. I bought a tetratech 500 the emperor was only rated > at > > 70 gallons? > > > - and my tank is a 90. It seems to move a lot more water; the > > fish seem more > > > active so I wonder if the thing was failing. I hated to spend > > money I don't > > > have but the thing just wouldn't work, no matter what. But > thank > > you for the > > > help. My local LFS said everybody was having tank trouble > after > > that storm! > > > Emily > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when > replying, > > thanks. > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > ((((º> > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > > important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > > message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > > subject)" <- > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------ ---- > ---- > > ---------- > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > > > > > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > > > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > Terms > > of Service. > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------ ---- > ---- > > ---------- > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------- ---- > ---------- > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > > > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms > of Service. > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------- ---- > ---------- > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > > > SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- ---------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- ---------- > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14606	From: richard thompson	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: AquaTank Filtration Question

the air from the pump is forced under the plate, and as it rushes to the surface it causes a vacuum to form under the plate. as the air rises, it pulls with it the water from under the plate, causing excess food and fish watse to be pulled through the gravel to a waiting colony of bacteria where it is cleaned up. the efficiency of this filter is great;y increased with the use of powerheads which pull about 150 gph through the plate instead of the 30 or so from teh air pump. Leslie <amjmail@...> wrote:I've acquired an aquatank model 202 for our male betta. It has an under gravel system but I'm miffed as to how it works. There is the plastic insert along with the attached tube. It looks as though I am supposed to insert the bubble disc into the filter tube but I don't see how that makes any sense. Maybe I am completely missing it here but I don't see how this filters anything at all. Included parts are the "under gravel filtration system" which consists of the plastic bottom insert and tube, air pump, air tube attached to a small bubble disc and that's it. How does this filtration work and if I have everything I need how do I set it up other than putting this bubble disc into the tube? Honestly, this looks to me like a joke to make people think they have something that works. I feel stupid. Lol Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14607	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus

Anybody have an aquarium in their bathroom yet? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14608	From: KttmfC	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: DISCUS HELP!!!!!

Anyone with experience or knowledge with discus i need your hjelp.... i have 3 discus that look like they are peeling a thin white film and they are getting worse by the day....... the others in the tank they came out of look fine still but these 3 are looking bad, can anyone offer any info on my problem, suggestions, advice, experience would be helpful, thank you very much, Kris

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14609	From: Robert	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: Putting a fish down

Who told you that? Sounds a little cruel to me. Robert ----- Original Message ----- From: Leslie To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com ; uniquaria@yahoogroups.com ; naturalaquariumenthusiast@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 5:13 AM Subject: [AquaticLife] Putting a fish down I need to put my giant danio down. His eye has exploded internally and is beyond repair. I came home with the pepso food and it was like this. He won't eat it. I was told that I could/should put him a bag with just enough water to cover him then place him in the freezer. Does this sound OK, or as OK as humanely possible? I hate this. Poor guy. Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14610	From: Leslie	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: Putting a fish down

Well fabulous. It says freezing is inhumane. That's what I did. =( -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of John Gonzalez Sent: Tuesday, August 16, 2005 2:38 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Putting a fish down Leslie, Sorry to hear about your fish. Here is a link of humane methods. http://www.fishforums.net/index.php?showtopic=8031 --- Leslie <amjmail@...> wrote: > I need to put my giant danio down. His eye has > exploded internally and > is beyond repair. I came home with the pepso food > and it was like this. > He won't eat it. > > I was told that I could/should put him a bag with > just enough water to > cover him then place him in the freezer. Does this > sound OK, or as OK > as humanely possible? > > I hate this. Poor guy. > > Leslie > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Helps protect you from nasty viruses. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14611	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: Putting a fish down

In a message dated 8/16/2005 5:42:47 P.M. Central Standard Time, amjmail@... writes: Well fabulous. It says freezing is inhumane. That's what I did. =( Don't feel bad Leslie, I did the same thing. We'll know better for next time. My friend said that I could have her 55 gallon tank--for free! Yeah baby! Hmm, what can I put in it? I'd love to do a completely planted tank. Or maybe salt water. I'd like to try an african cichlid tank too. Someone please remind me that it is for growing out angelfish fry. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14612	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: Putting a fish down

Leslie, Skip the opinions and go to a Vet for advice. (see link below) Not sure if this link has been posted before but here goes. A Koi Veterinarian. http://koivet.com/html/articles/articles_results.php?article_id=115&category=9&search_term=death <><><>"My favorite method is the freezer method, with plenty enough water for the fish not to feel alarmed." ~ Doc Johnson favorite method is the freezer method, with plenty enough water for the fish not to feel alarmed." ~ Doc Johnson <><><> Mike -----Original Message----- From: Leslie <amjmail@...> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 17:41:37 -0500 Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Putting a fish down Well fabulous. It says freezing is inhumane. That's what I did. =( [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14613	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: Putting a fish down

Perhaps look at the links offered first next time? It is a learning curve and it's over now, don't beat yourself up. I had to euthanize one of my guppies and I decapitated her. Quick and painless for her, way traumatic for me! Clove oil is supposed to work really well... put the fish in a bag or container in tank water and add some clove oil. Hopefully it is not something you will have to do often!! Take care, Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > Well fabulous. It says freezing is inhumane. That's what I did. =(

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14614	From: wendie	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: Putting a fish down

Get some clove oil and mix it with water. Wendie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Robert Sent: Tuesday, August 16, 2005 5:02 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Putting a fish down Who told you that? Sounds a little cruel to me. Robert ----- Original Message ----- From: Leslie To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com ; uniquaria@yahoogroups.com ; naturalaquariumenthusiast@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 5:13 AM Subject: [AquaticLife] Putting a fish down I need to put my giant danio down. His eye has exploded internally and is beyond repair. I came home with the pepso food and it was like this. He won't eat it. I was told that I could/should put him a bag with just enough water to cover him then place him in the freezer. Does this sound OK, or as OK as humanely possible? I hate this. Poor guy. Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology -------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. -------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14615	From: Leslie	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Electrocution of fish

While searching for a "nice" way to kill my fish, I happened upon this topic of euthanasia. Cut and Paste from the web site...: Electrocution This method is dangerous - it should not be attempted by unqualified individuals! This method involves placing negative and positive electrodes in the aquarium water and producing a charge sufficient to kill the fish. The key to this method is amperage. It is the amperes of a current that kill, not the voltage. Volts is another word for the kick, while amperage is the power in real terms. Death occurs due to cardiac arrest when accomplished properly. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14616	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: sponge filters

I have been doing some reading on sponge filters and have a few questions. First off, I have absolutely no experience with sponge filters. I have never seen them at the local fish store and PetsMart does not carry them either. Do you have to use an air pump, or can you use a power head? Are there different sizes for different size aquariums? Can I get a large air pump and use it to power three aquariums-say a 55 gallon grow out tank, a ten gallon hatch tank and a 20-30 gallon breeder tank? Or would you recommend separate air pumps for each tank? I figure I can divide the 55 gallon tank into two sections. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14617	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: sponge filters

Hi Linda, I use sponge filters in some of my tanks, either alone or in conjunction with other filters. You can use some of them with a powerhead or just buy a powerhead that comes with a foam filter. You can run one larger air pump to run two or more, but you should look into a pump with that many outlets. As in a two outlet pump for two sponge filters or a four outlet pump for four airlines. Use three lines for sponge filters and the fourth for an air stone etc. You can use some inexpensive air valves for each line to control the airflow as what may be good for the 55 gallon may not be good for the smaller tanks. I have not had good luck using a pump with a splitter to power two things. Maybe it was an old air pump. Right now I am running a small linear air pump with about 15 airlines running off of it, but that is larger and more noisy than you need. If you want to buy some sponge filters check out http://www.kensfish.com/ati.html http://www.jehmco.com/PRODUCTS_/FILTRATION/Hydro-Sponge_Filters/hydro-sponge_filters.html www.aquabid.com has them sometimes as well. www.ebay.com I prefer the ATI sponges like Ken's or Jehmco sell, the other ones like Lee's seem too small for me and break too easy. You can make your own, but you have buy foam, wash it, drill it, attach it to a pipe or tube, attach it to a heavy weight, attact the airline to keep it from coming loose. I have made several of these, but that is because I am a cheapskate and try to make things to save money. Mike -----Original Message----- From: Crazy4fids@... To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com; mnaquarium@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 21:44:26 EDT Subject: [AquaticLife] sponge filters I have been doing some reading on sponge filters and have a few questions. First off, I have absolutely no experience with sponge filters. I have never seen them at the local fish store and PetsMart does not carry them either. Do you have to use an air pump, or can you use a power head? Are there different sizes for different size aquariums? Can I get a large air pump and use it to power three aquariums-say a 55 gallon grow out tank, a ten gallon hatch tank and a 20-30 gallon breeder tank? Or would you recommend separate air pumps for each tank? I figure I can divide the 55 gallon tank into two sections. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14618	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: sponge filters

In a message dated 8/16/2005 9:03:28 P.M. Central Standard Time, Deenerz@... writes: I have not had good luck using a pump with a splitter to power two things. Maybe it was an old air pump. Right now I am running a small linear air pump with about 15 airlines running off of it, but that is larger and more noisy than you need. I remember back in the seventies-20 gallon tank with an undergravel filter with two lift tubes, and an air stone for bubbles. Using a medium sized air pump and a three gang valve. You could never get them to split the air up just right and if you bumped the little knob it would mess everything up! Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14619	From: Chris	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus

yep. it's called a bathtub and it intermitently contains two toddlerfish. seriously though, a friend who is into invertebrates frequently uses his bathtub to house his latest collection specimens before transferring them to tanks... i guess his family must bath only every other day! :D chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14620	From: Chris	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: Putting a fish down

Regarding the "whack the fish" method: I once worked in an aquarium store where I had to dispatch of a fish and was advised to use this method. The fish was about 5" long. I can't remember exactly what kind of fish it was, but it looked much like a perch. I went out back of the store, held the fish with head exposed and whacked it on the concrete or something similar. (Yes, I now know that the whole man-handling process causes undue stress which is not in keeping with humane destruction...). The blessed thing cut the pad of my index finger with it's dorsal spines. The cut hurt a fair bit so I covered it with a band aid. By the next day it was still hurting, so I kept it covered up. After a few days I took a good look at the wound and squeezed it.. wouldn't you know it? about a quarter of an inch of dorsal spine was in there. Food for thought if you plan destroying larger fish via the "whack" method. Another site recommending the use of clove oil before decapitation or freezing is the ANGFA code of conduct (Australia New Guinea Fishes Association): http://www.angfa.org.au/angfa-coc.html I suppose for large-scale destruction of Gambusia (in the field - see my earlier thread), this is looking to be the way to go. Chris. Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14621	From: Chris	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: sponge filters

One of those links describes them as excellent biological filters as well as mechanical filters, although I find it hard to imagine how they would be excellent biological filters. Firstly, yes, of course bacteria can grow on the surface of the filter medium and assist biological breakdown, but surely one or two filters would provide only a very small surface area when compared to the effect of an undergravel filter, or purpose-designed biological filter? Secondly, once the sponge is covered in muck, you'd want to wash that off so it can continue to operate effectively as a mechanical filter - which of course puts any bacteria at risk too, reducing it's effectiveness as a biological filter. So at a guess - don't rely on them as biological filters. Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14622	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: sponge filters

Chris, I know several people that run fish breeding facilities or have fishrooms and sponge filters are the only filtration they use on most tanks. As I mentioned before I use them on a few tanks and they work fine. As far as surface medium, all those little tiny holes and passageways in the filter provide a LARGE surface area for beneficial bacteria to accumulate, far more than a BioWheel. I use aquaclear sponge powerfilters in some tanks and it is the same principle of filtering only it is a power filter and not an air driven filter. I have used aquaclear 500 sponge filter foam to make sponge filters and it works great. As far as being covered in muck, yep it happens, just like my aquaclear power filter. I use the same cleaning method, I never wash them off so much as wring them out or squeeze them repeatedly in a bucket of tank water and ONLY in tank water. No tap water right out of the tap ever, as this will kill the bacteria and the tank would need to start the cycle over. As far as relying on them I do all the time as well as many people that have fish rooms. Personally I know gravel filters work and I have run a few tanks with them and I will NEVER use one of them again, but then I have cichlids and they dig and that prevents the UG filter from working. I also use seasoned sponge filters to start new tanks. They already have the bacteria in them, so a tank full of water treated for chlorine and chloramine is up and running as soon as it is at room temperature. As far as the Jehmco and Kensfish websites, both of those shops are basically setup as "fish room" supply stores and they sell what people use in their fish rooms. But hey, use whatever works best for you. If you want I have a few UG filters you can have if you are in my area. Mike -----Original Message----- From: Chris <youcantryreachingme@...> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 02:55:26 -0000 Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: sponge filters One of those links describes them as excellent biological filters as well as mechanical filters, although I find it hard to imagine how they would be excellent biological filters. Firstly, yes, of course bacteria can grow on the surface of the filter medium and assist biological breakdown, but surely one or two filters would provide only a very small surface area when compared to the effect of an undergravel filter, or purpose-designed biological filter? Secondly, once the sponge is covered in muck, you'd want to wash that off so it can continue to operate effectively as a mechanical filter - which of course puts any bacteria at risk too, reducing it's effectiveness as a biological filter. So at a guess - don't rely on them as biological filters. Chris. Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14623	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: do you name your fish?/Horace

We both have a Horace, cool! Although it's looking like I will be giving mine to a woman with a garage pond :( I will miss him but he will be happier there. Sarah The Dragon Hunter <dragon.hunter@...> wrote: I name some of them. Horace is the leader of my blue gourami. Ataru is my larger pleco, Goemon is the smaller (er, was, think they are the same now) pleco. My Dojo Loach is Confuse-shus. My three albino cories are the Three Stooges do to their tendancy to go full bore at times around the tank not caring what they might hit. The others have no name...yet. :D -Steve ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sarah Fleming Davis" <keelis_mom@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2005 1:40 PM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: violet gobi and do you name your fish? Yes that's it :) Thanks for the info, I found what I was trying say earlier...filter feeder!!! I knew there was a name for it, lol! Wow, they get to be 2 ft?!?!?! I really like mine, his name is Fang by the way ;) Does anyone else name their fish? Sarah Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14624	From: Chris	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: sponge filters

Thanks for the info - I'm glad someone who uses them extensively filled in all the details... as I said, I was guessing. Your tip to wash them only in tank water must be the difference between success and failure then. *When* (if) my garage is ever converted into a fishroom (and my wife has other plans) - I'll certainly take a closer look at these filters. Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14625	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/16/2005
Subject: Re: sponge filters

I have the Hydro sponges , in all my tanks. I just throw them in the tanks, no base, no airstone just let them sink to bottom. fish use them as shelters, eat off them, etc etc. When I set up a new tank I always have seeded filters to use. Plus we loose electricity every once in awhile. Its nice to have some kind of filteration in a tank when the lights go out. they make great filters especially in fry tanks or grow out tanks. Food particles get caught in the sponges and the babies can eat for weeks off of them.. In a message dated 8/17/2005 12:46:00 AM US Eastern Standard Time, youcantryreachingme@... writes: Thanks for the info - I'm glad someone who uses them extensively filled in all the details... as I said, I was guessing. Your tip to wash them only in tank water must be the difference between success and failure then. *When* (if) my garage is ever converted into a fishroom (and my wife has other plans) - I'll certainly take a closer look at these filters. Chris. Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14626	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: sponge filters

Hi Chris, Sponge filters are excellent biological filters, the bacteria colonise the sponge all the way through it which give a very large surface area. in my discus and angel breading and rearing tanks that's all I have, nothing else except a breeding cone. no ammonia or nitrite, nitrate kept down by daily vacuum of uneaten food and water changes. I have 2 or 3 in each tank depending on the tank size, to clean them I squeeze them in the tank water I have just removed at water change time, one filter each week. that way I maintain the bio filtration with no interruption. I use RO/DI water at PH 6.5. Also they are the only form of filtration perfectly safe for tiny fry. Under gravel filters are fine for a time until the nitrates build up and they build up large amounts of mulm under the plate, then you need to strip the tank down to clean them, not a pleasant job. regards, unclenorm. --- Chris <youcantryreachingme@...> wrote: > One of those links describes them as excellent > biological filters as > well as mechanical filters, although I find it hard > to imagine how they > would be excellent biological filters. > > Firstly, yes, of course bacteria can grow on the > surface of the filter > medium and assist biological breakdown, but surely > one or two filters > would provide only a very small surface area when > compared to the > effect of an undergravel filter, or purpose-designed > biological filter? > Secondly, once the sponge is covered in muck, you'd > want to wash that > off so it can continue to operate effectively as a > mechanical filter - > which of course puts any bacteria at risk too, > reducing it's > effectiveness as a biological filter. > > So at a guess - don't rely on them as biological > filters. > > Chris. > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14627	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus (now Bathroom aquariums)

Message: Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 17:33:26 EDT From: Crazy4fids@... Subject: Re: Re: angels and discus Anybody have an aquarium in their bathroom yet? Linda I occasionally have a turd-le swimming around in a porcelain bowl. Does that count? :-P Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14628	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: sponge filters

Hi, I also have Hydro sponges and they are excellent, but only used as intended with an air supply, just thrown in the tank with no motive power i.e. air flow, they will not do any filtering at all, to filter the water must flow through them, and with no flow through the sponge you will have little or no bacteria. regards, unclenorm. --- FortWayneFish@... wrote: > I have the Hydro sponges , in all my tanks. I just > throw them in the tanks, > no base, no airstone just let them sink to bottom. > fish use them as shelters, > eat off them, etc etc. When I set up a new tank I > always have seeded filters > to use. Plus we loose electricity every once in > awhile. Its nice to have some > kind of filteration in a tank when the lights go > out. > they make great filters especially in fry tanks or > grow out tanks. Food > particles get caught in the sponges and the babies > can eat for weeks off of them.. > > > > In a message dated 8/17/2005 12:46:00 AM US Eastern > Standard Time, > youcantryreachingme@... writes: > Thanks for the info - I'm glad someone who uses them > extensively filled > in all the details... as I said, I was guessing. > Your tip to wash them > only in tank water must be the difference between > success and failure > then. > > *When* (if) my garage is ever converted into a > fishroom (and my wife > has other plans) - I'll certainly take a closer look > at these filters. > > Chris. > > Rob > NE Indiana > USA > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ___________________________________________________________ To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. http://uk.security.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14629	From: Robert Hickey	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus

usually alone or in groups of three or more unless you have a bonded pair, Irish Rob Regards Robert Hickey Robert Hickey | Networks Engineer Citywest Business Park | BT | Tel: +353 (0)1 43258749 | Mob: +353 (0)86 8061840 | E: robert.hickey@... | www.btireland.ie ----- Original Message ----- From: thesydmonster To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, August 16, 2005 6:38 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: angels and discus I just saw a picture of those this morning, they are quite striking fish! Do angels do okay singly or are they better in pairs or groups? Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > I have heard that people keep discus with altum angel. If you really want > to keep angels with your discus, maybe you could invest in some altum angels. > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14630	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: sponge filters

Chris-sponge filters don't just use surface area. They use every nook and cranny of the sponge to grow bacteria. They are not a reliable source of mechanical for the reason you stated, which is they clog easily. When they do clog or get too dirty, all you have to do is squeeze them out a couple of times in your water change water. Lots of people use them in fry tanks. Less likely to be damaged by strong filter currents or get sucked into a filter. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14631	From: Robert Hickey	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus

hahahaha Ther problem is her dad is an excellent iron worker And can build anything We need, so at one point we had two tanks one above the other on a steel frame With room for more, but I then went a got My 260 litre so thatwent out the Window, Im telling yeh were border line scuba gear and just building a tank Around the house, :o) the Familys keep joking about this all the time, hahaha Thanks again Ray Rob Regards Robert Hickey Robert Hickey | Networks Engineer Citywest Business Park | BT | Tel: +353 (0)1 43258749 | Mob: +353 (0)86 8061840 | E: robert.hickey@... | www.btireland.ie ----- Original Message ----- From: Ray Wetzel To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, August 16, 2005 10:15 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: angels and discus I figured you might get a laugh out of that! Which of course was exactly why I sent it. Ah, I see by your post the fish addiction has hit you too (hahaha). A tank in nearly every room of the house. Well I guess you're reaching you limit (with the wife). I do notice that there are still some room(s) without tanks though (hahaha). I'm beginning to see why those old double wrought iron stands were so popular over the wooden cabinet stands that you can put only one tank on. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Robert Hickey" <rhickey@e...> wrote: > hahahaha thanks ray > > she would kill me indeed we already have a tank in nearly ever room in the house as it is, and were in a bungalow so, > > > ah Well if I had the space for a juwel rio 400 I would have two > > hahahaha > > Either that or buy some scuda gear > > :o) > Rob > > Regards > Robert Hickey > > Robert Hickey | Networks Engineer Citywest Business Park | BT | Tel: +353 > (0)1 43258749 > | Mob: +353 (0)86 8061840 | E: robert.hickey@b... | www.btireland.ie > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Ray Wetzel > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Tuesday, August 16, 2005 3:14 PM > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: angels and discus > > > Set up another tank(?).--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Robert > Hickey" <rhickey@e...> wrote: > > Thanks ray > > > > The tank is at 28 degrees all the time, since it was Setup ages > back with no problems, > > > > hmmm don`t know what to do now, > > > > Me wants discus, > > > > Ah well > > > > Irish Rob > > > > Regards > > Robert Hickey > > > > Robert Hickey | Networks Engineer Citywest Business Park | BT | > Tel: +353 > > (0)1 43258749 > > | Mob: +353 (0)86 8061840 | E: robert.hickey@b... | www.btireland.ie > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Ray Wetzel > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Sent: Tuesday, August 16, 2005 2:50 PM > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: angels and discus > > > > > > Robert, It is generally not advisable to mix Angels with Discus > for > > a number of reasons. First of all, Discus (even adults) prefer > the > > temperature at least 28 o C (30 o C for fry and juveniles), > whereas > > Angels are more comfortable around 25 o C, unless breeding. It > > should also be noted that Angels are more aggressive feeders, > usually > > resulting in your Discus not getting their fair share of food. > Ray > > > \ > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Robert Hickey" > <rhickey@e...> > > wrote: > > > Hi all > > > > > > I have a 60 gallon tank souh american biotope and more and more > Im > > finding myself addicted to discus ( my girlfriend will kill me > when I > > tell her spent 40 euros on a fish) I have two angels in the tank > and > > I love them to bits, has anyone ever had angels in with discus, I > > know how shy and eveything about the discus as I have been > > researching them for a long time now, > > > > > > they guy I bought the tank off had a very large angel in with > his > > younger discus, > > > > > > Im just wondering if I could or is it advisable , Its a large > high > > tank so the angels stick to the top under flooting plants and > verus > > tall vallis, its heavly planted with lots of bogwood and hidding > > places etc > > > > > > Thanks all > > > > > > :o) > > > > > > Irish rob > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards > > > Robert Hickey > > > > > > Robert Hickey | Networks Engineer Citywest Business Park | BT | > > Tel: +353 > > > (0)1 43258749 > > > | Mob: +353 (0)86 8061840 | E: robert.hickey@b... | > www.btireland.ie > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: kb1dva > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Sent: Tuesday, August 16, 2005 2:14 PM > > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: help > > > > > > > > > I couldn't get the filter going I think it might have been > zapped- > > the storm > > > was pretty bad. I also don't know how old the filter was, it > came > > with the > > > old tank. I bought a tetratech 500 the emperor was only rated > at > > 70 gallons? > > > - and my tank is a 90. It seems to move a lot more water; the > > fish seem more > > > active so I wonder if the thing was failing. I hated to spend > > money I don't > > > have but the thing just wouldn't work, no matter what. But > thank > > you for the > > > help. My local LFS said everybody was having tank trouble > after > > that storm! > > > Emily > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when > replying, > > thanks. > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > ((((º> > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > > important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > > message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > > subject)" <- > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------ ---- > ---- > > ---------- > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > > > > > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > > > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > Terms > > of Service. > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------ ---- > ---- > > ---------- > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, > thanks. > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > > AquaticLife Management. > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------- ---- > ---------- > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > > > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms > of Service. > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------- ---- > ---------- > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > > > SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- ---------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- ---------- > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14632	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus (now Bathroom aquariums)

In a message dated 8/17/2005 3:38:33 A.M. Central Standard Time, lnvtm1@... writes: I occasionally have a turd-le swimming around in a porcelain bowl. Does that count? :-P Good one lenny! Never would have thought of that one myself. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14633	From: Robert Hickey	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus (now Bathroom aquariums)

LOL Not saying anything more, biting my tongue LOL Irish Rob Regards Robert Hickey Robert Hickey | Networks Engineer Citywest Business Park | BT | Tel: +353 (0)1 43258749 | Mob: +353 (0)86 8061840 | E: robert.hickey@... | www.btireland.ie ----- Original Message ----- From: Lenny Vasbinder To: AquaticLife Yahoo! Group Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 9:07 AM Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Re: angels and discus (now Bathroom aquariums) Message: Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 17:33:26 EDT From: Crazy4fids@... Subject: Re: Re: angels and discus Anybody have an aquarium in their bathroom yet? Linda I occasionally have a turd-le swimming around in a porcelain bowl. Does that count? :-P Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14634	From: Leslie	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus (now Bathroom aquariums)

That's kind of a good idea. Would the humidity from the shower be bad though? Electrical wise? Ours gets pretty damp when the kids shower. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Lenny Vasbinder Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 3:08 AM To: AquaticLife Yahoo! Group Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Re: angels and discus (now Bathroom aquariums) Message: Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 17:33:26 EDT From: Crazy4fids@... Subject: Re: Re: angels and discus Anybody have an aquarium in their bathroom yet? Linda I occasionally have a turd-le swimming around in a porcelain bowl. Does that count? :-P Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14635	From: Chris	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus (now Bathroom aquariums)

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > That's kind of a good idea. Would the humidity from the shower be bad > though? Electrical wise? Ours gets pretty damp when the kids shower. > I'm thinking a row of betta tanks along the window sill :) narrow, but tall and wide.... but.... algae... is there a prize for the first person to post a pic of a tank in a bathroom? Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14636	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus (now Bathroom aquariums)

link to a picture of a tank in the bathroom. http://midwestcichlid.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=140 the pics are 1/2 way down the thread. rob Indiana usa In a message dated 8/17/2005 9:58:46 AM US Eastern Standard Time, youcantryreachingme@... writes: --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > That's kind of a good idea. Would the humidity from the shower be bad > though? Electrical wise? Ours gets pretty damp when the kids shower. > I'm thinking a row of betta tanks along the window sill :) narrow, but tall and wide.... but.... algae... is there a prize for the first person to post a pic of a tank in a bathroom? Chris. Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14637	From: Karen	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: SEEK: Rena XP1-2 or 3 Canister Filter for Parts

The O-ring in my XP3 split. Any aquarists out there have an old XP for parts laying around? The O-ring from any of the XPs will fit. Thanks

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14638	From: Leslie	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Internal parasites

Seeing as how my danios have this septicemia parasite, should I be worried that it has spread to my other types of fish? It's obviously "spread" amongst the danios. Is it contagious or no? Leslie PS By the way, my danios aren't getting any better. Their fins are more red every day and they will not eat anything. I'm wondering if they aren't eating due to being in a small hospital tank. They were eating well in the 75. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14639	From: Rob	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus (now Bathroom aquariums)

Hey Everyone, I have kept a ten gallon aquarium in the bathroom for over two years without incident. It is a guppy grow out tank no windows but enough algae growth that I only feed the guppies once or twice a week on flakes and once a week on live brine shrimp. I rarely if ever have to perform anything other than basic maintenance and removal of fish that are ready for transfer to the 55 gallon where I keep the majority of my guppies. The shower will steam the glass but it does not seem to have any detrimental effect on the tank. I will work on a picture when I get a chance although its not really impressive enough to warrant pics. Rob

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14640	From: Tom Ray	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: AH Supply Lighting Questions

I've left voicemail and email and yet have gotten no response from AH Supply, so here are my questions to this group in hopes that someone can answer them. I am looking for the following information on their bulbs not found on their Weebsite: 1) How many lumens and/or PAR are available from their 5500K and 6700K 36W and 55W compact fluorescent (CF) bulbs, respectively? 2) What are the lumens and/or PAR available at each of the ends of the CF (plug and H-shaped)? These 2 questions would fill in this chart: Middle/average | Plug end | H-end | Lumens | PARs | Lumens | PARs | Lumens | PARs 36W-5500K | | | | | | 36W-6700K | | | | | | 55W-5500K | | | | | | 55W-6700K | | | | | | Another bulb question is: 3) What "color" CF (for example: 5000K, 5500K or 6700K) works best with peat-filtered water? Finally, 2 questions related to design/layout: 4) What is the angle of the light down off their reflectors and into the aquarium? 5) What is optimal spacing between bulbs/fixtures for a 20 inch tall and 18 inch wide (and 24 inch long) tank? Thanks in advance for your help in answering any/all of these questions. --TommyBoy

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14641	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: do you name your fish?/Horace

Yea. Horace is cool. Named him that as his face looks like a "Horace" He has protected two batches of molly fry and usually will interject with any hostilities in the tank. He's an old guy now. Got him in June 5 years ago. Him and the other two blues (there were 5 to start) and my two plecs are the oldest fish I have. Gonna be hard when he goes. -Steve ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sarah Fleming Davis" <keelis_mom@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, August 16, 2005 8:46 PM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife]do you name your fish?/Horace We both have a Horace, cool! Although it's looking like I will be giving mine to a woman with a garage pond :( I will miss him but he will be happier there. Sarah The Dragon Hunter <dragon.hunter@...> wrote: I name some of them. Horace is the leader of my blue gourami. Ataru is my larger pleco, Goemon is the smaller (er, was, think they are the same now) pleco. My Dojo Loach is Confuse-shus. My three albino cories are the Three Stooges do to their tendancy to go full bore at times around the tank not caring what they might hit. The others have no name...yet. :D -Steve ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sarah Fleming Davis" <keelis_mom@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2005 1:40 PM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: violet gobi and do you name your fish? Yes that's it :) Thanks for the info, I found what I was trying say earlier...filter feeder!!! I knew there was a name for it, lol! Wow, they get to be 2 ft?!?!?! I really like mine, his name is Fang by the way ;) Does anyone else name their fish? Sarah Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14642	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus >question

Okay, every tank I've seen with discus has been unplanted, and most of the ones I've seen have no substrate at all, just a bare tank. What's up with that? Don't they like plants in their habitat?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14643	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus >question

Welp, the discus tank at Coral Sea in Riverside is heavily planted. They also have several smaller species of plecs and a few other fish in there. Think they said it was a 300 gallon tank. Very nice. ----- Original Message ----- From: "cynthia brennemann" <brennewoman@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 12:41 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: angels and discus >question Okay, every tank I've seen with discus has been unplanted, and most of the ones I've seen have no substrate at all, just a bare tank. What's up with that? Don't they like plants in their habitat? Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14644	From: joequality1980	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: do you name your fish?/Horace

I painstakingly take 6 photos of each fish, one for each direction on the compass plus above and below. Then I assign he/she a name selected from the Tibetan Book of the Dead based upon the fish's personality exhibited during the picture process. Once the name is selected I write the name plus the exact measurements of the fish on each photo, and submit it to www.petfishnamesdatabase.com. I email the photos to all my friends and family, and lastly file them away in my own peronsal archive that is updated every Saturday night. The entire process usually take around five hours. > Subject: do you name your fish?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14645	From: joequality1980	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: AH Supply Lighting Questions

although I dont know the specifics, I did order 1 55W retrofit kit for 24" long tanks and it works very well. It took them less than 2 days to email me back about my questions. I recommend them > I've left voicemail and email and yet have gotten no response from AH > Supply, so here are my questions to this group in hopes that someone > can answer them. >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14646	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Bacteria question

In my 37 gallon tank with an Eclipse 3 hood, I replaced the cartridges with that blue sponge material. It's been a while now and the material has flattened out quite a bit and seems not to be filtering as well (water flows right over it instead of through it). We put a new piece in there on top of the old one so that it could start to establish a bacteria colony. How long should I leave both of them in there before I can take the old one out? Thanks! Rebecca

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14647	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: Putting a fish down

Just caught this on my second read-through -- almost missed it I regret to say. Seems the jury is still out on this one as there are two schools of thought, one saying it is contagious and the other saying it isn't. I prefer to err on the side of caution and do consider this to be contagious. Glad to see you fed the main tank med food. Hope those fish lok okay. While I don't like medicating fish unnecessarily, this is one time I would consider treating the main tank as a precaution. Better to be safe here than sorry. If they still remain symptom-free in a few more days, they should be alright. In the meantime I would give them two doses, 2 days apart to help boost their immune system. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > One more thing...is this stuff contagious? I fed the main tank the med > food but should I do anything else preventative?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14648	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: Internal parasites

Leslie, See my previous post; I believe this bacterial disease to be contagious and would play it safe by treating the 75 as well, even though it might cost something in meds. If you decide to go this route, you might think about putting the 2 Danios back in the 75, hoping they may eat, since the other fish have already been exposed to this disease anyhow. If they do not eat, they may not improve. Then you'll have to weigh whether or not you want the rest of the fish exposed to them any further. I would in that case put them back in the quarantine tank, tying a different approach like giving them Furan-2, since if they were too far along, the present med, even though highly recommended for this condition, may not be handling it. Ray \ -- - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > Seeing as how my danios have this septicemia parasite, should I be > worried that it has spread to my other types of fish? It's obviously > "spread" amongst the danios. > Is it contagious or no? > > Leslie > > PS By the way, my danios aren't getting any better. Their fins are > more red every day and they will not eat anything. I'm wondering if > they aren't eating due to being in a small hospital tank. They were > eating well in the 75. > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14649	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: salt question/cory cats

Hi Rebecca, The cory's seem to be fine. Someday when we move into a bigger house we'd like to have another big tank but right now we don' have the space and all the fish seem to be fine :) Sarah Sarah, did you say you have cory cats? I thought they did not do well in tanks with long term salt use? Wouldn't it be better for the true freshwater fish to be in a freshwater tank and the brackish fish be in a brackish tank instead of trying to combine them? Just asking... Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Sarah Fleming Davis <keelis_mom@y...> wrote: > We put salt in our tank because of the gobi and the needlefish and the other fish seem ok with it. > > Sarah > > > Steve Szabo <steve@l...> wrote: > Unless there is a specific need, one does not need to add salt to a > freshwater tank. Salt is often used as an emergency remedy until one can > resolve the issue with the proper medication. It is also used as a remedy in > and of itself for certain parasites. > > Having said that, there are certain fish that can benefit from a regular > addition of salt to the aquarium. One such genus of fish would be mollies, > which are often found in estaturine environments where they are regularly > exposed to salt in the environment. Other livebearers may also respond > positively to such treatment. > > In a general community tank, it would not be wise to keep a level of salt in > the tank. There are many fish that can be adversely affected by the regular > addition of salt. So, in the end, only use salt when its use is indicated > for the tank as a whole. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Sandy Kay > Sent: Wednesday, August 10, 2005 10:28 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] salt question > > Some have said they keep salt in their water. I have freshwater and know you > are supposed to use the non iodine kind. Do you have any more specifics? My > tank is a 10 gallon. How much to use and when, etc. Thank you, Sandy > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine biology Biology > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > --------------------------------- > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14650	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: my catfish ate my snails!!!

Ray, Yes, I realize that now *sigh*. I had a long talk with a guy at Petsmart about him and was told that I will wake up some morning and he will have eaten everything else in the tank. So for now we put him in a 29, the only other fish in there is the larger of my needlefish. There's a woman who also works at Petsmart and she has a garage pond and will take Horace for me. I just can't bring myself to give him away but I know he will be happier in the pond. Sarah Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote: Yes, I'd say he might have been hungry, and rightly so. Do you realize that Channel Catfish average at least 15 pounds and grow to about 30" (average) or better. Larger ones can get to at least 35 pounds. Perhaps not albinos, but they can't be too far behind. Better watch that he doesn't eye up his tank mates for a meal. Ray \ -- - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Sarah Fleming Davis" <keelis_mom@y...> wrote: > Have any of you ever seen a catfish eat a snail??? It was so weird! > I had just turned out the light last night(I am finally realizing that > the catfish aren't very active until the light's out) and my big > albino chanel cat came out and grabbed a snail and shook it right out > of it's shell and ate it!!! Then this morning there was another empty > shell :( I feel really bad for the snail but I'm also wondering if he > did it because he wasn't getting enough food and was hungary? What do > you think? > > Sarah Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14651	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: Angie the Angel fish - to Ray

Hi Deborah, How's Angie doing? Any improvement yet? Please keep us posted if there is any change. If she is still the same, slowly boost the temperature up to 87 o. With good aeration, they should be able to take it up to 95 o, which sometimes needs to be done as a last resort, even though it sounds like you're about to cook them. Let us know if she shows any improvement at 87 o, with continuing the meds. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "deborahgd14" <deborahgd14@y...> wrote: > Ray: I haven't found that kind of food yet. She is facing the > corner and is doing exactly as you said. Thanks for your input. > Will keep you informed of her progress. Today is the third time I > have medicated her. Should I do more than five if she isn't > better? Thanks Again. Deborah >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14652	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: salt question/cory cats

Funny you should say that... I have been looking into another tank (hard to imagine, I know) but am trying to wait until we move next fall when I am done with school. We really don't have room for the one I want right now in this house, darn it :) As for the corys, I just read about long term exposure to salt... shortening of life span, things like that. Not necessarily things that you'll notice immediately. Of course, I believe there is a lot of conflicting thoughts on this. Good luck on the bigger house and bigger tank issue :) Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Sarah Fleming Davis <keelis_mom@y...> wrote: > Hi Rebecca, > The cory's seem to be fine. Someday when we move into a bigger house we'd like to have another big tank but right now we don' have the space and all the fish seem to be fine :) > > Sarah > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14653	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus (now Bathroom aquariums)

In a message dated 8/17/2005 11:48:46 A.M. Central Standard Time, FortWayneFish@... writes: http://midwestcichlid.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=140 Wow! That's a big ass bathroom! I was thinking something mini like no larger than the top of a toilet tank. Not necessarily on the back of the toilet tank, but about that size. You'd have to be careful with chemicals, especially hair spray (does anyone use this stuff anymore?) and perfume etc. You'd have to have a decent night light in there, so you wouldn't be disturbing the fish at night. It would be interesting entertainment while taking care of paperwork on the throne. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14654	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: do you name your fish?/Horace

In a message dated 8/17/2005 2:59:24 P.M. Central Standard Time, crazy.joe.walcek@... writes: Once the name is selected I write the name plus the exact measurements of the fish on each photo, and submit it to www.petfishnamesdatabase.com. I Now how many people do you think went to that website? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14655	From: TankGurl	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: Electrocution of fish

Are these sick or healthy fish you want to kill? Healthy could always be dropped at a local lfs. Sick fish will die within 10 seconds when dropped into a ziplock baggie filled with strong straight alcohol. (not sweet stuff) They do not suffer and with the first intake through their gills, they are unconcious. My spouse is a vet and she uses this method in her practise. This is not recommended for large fish (ie. koi) Kelly On 8/16/05, Leslie <amjmail@...> wrote: > While searching for a "nice" way to kill my fish, I happened upon this > topic of euthanasia. > > Cut and Paste from the web site...: > > > > Electrocution > > This method is dangerous - it should not be attempted by unqualified > individuals! > > This method involves placing negative and positive electrodes in the > aquarium water and producing a charge sufficient to kill the fish. > > The key to this method is amperage. It is the amperes of a current that > kill, not the voltage. Volts is another word for the kick, while > amperage is the power in real terms. > > Death occurs due to cardiac arrest when accomplished properly. > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > 毀畔�虜.><((((�.毀畔�虜.毀畔��<((((� �毀畔�� , .毀畔�.><((((� > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <�(((><.毀畔�虜.毀畔���(((><�毀畔�� , .毀畔�.<�(((><毀畔�虜. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > -- 65G Lake Malawi http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 135G Lake Tanganyika http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011 36G Brackish http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8498 Tank/s Gallery http://www.picturetrail.com/fish_gurl

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14656	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: Electrocution of fish

Kelly, thanks for the advice on putting down a sick fish. One shot for me and one zip lock shot for the fish. Mike -----Original Message----- From: TankGurl <fishgoddess@...> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 19:48:54 -0400 Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Electrocution of fish Are these sick or healthy fish you want to kill? Healthy could always be dropped at a local lfs. Sick fish will die within 10 seconds when dropped into a ziplock baggie filled with strong straight alcohol. (not sweet stuff) They do not suffer and with the first intake through their gills, they are unconcious. My spouse is a vet and she uses this method in her practise. This is not recommended for large fish (ie. koi) Kelly On 8/16/05, Leslie <amjmail@...> wrote: > While searching for a "nice" way to kill my fish, I happened upon this > topic of euthanasia. > > Cut and Paste from the web site...: > > > > Electrocution > > This method is dangerous - it should not be attempted by unqualified > individuals! > > This method involves placing negative and positive electrodes in the > aquarium water and producing a charge sufficient to kill the fish. > > The key to this method is amperage. It is the amperes of a current that > kill, not the voltage. Volts is another word for the kick, while > amperage is the power in real terms. > > Death occurs due to cardiac arrest when accomplished properly. > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > ????.><((((?.????.????<((((? ????? , .???.><((((? > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <?(((><.????.?????(((><????? , .???.<?(((><????. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > -- 65G Lake Malawi http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=7176 135G Lake Tanganyika http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8011 36G Brackish http://www.cichlid-forum.com/tanks/displaytank.php?tank=8498 Tank/s Gallery http://www.picturetrail.com/fish_gurl Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. `..><((((>.`..`.><((((> .`.. , .`..><((((> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <((((><.`..`.<((((><.`.. , .`..<((((><`.. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14657	From: Erin Cunningham	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Newbie w/question(s). TIA

Hiya! Newbie here, please be gentle! Hee!Hee! A few questions... I have a couple of Gold Gouramis that are 'twitching', according to my 9yr old. They swim around the tank (55gal).. go to their favorite corner in the back and then stay facing in one direction, but go forward and back.. Is this normal??? After awhile, they take off around the tank and the cycle starts again! I have a couple of Blue's, but they don't do that. Also, how many times DO you feed fish?? I've read anywhere from once to three times. I fed them 3 times yesterday and now have 3 dead fish to show for this!!! TIA for your help!! Erin Who doesn't want to lose anymore fish if she can help it!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14658	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: Newbie w/question(s). TIA

Hi Erin! Sorry to hear about your fish. Could you tell us more about your tank? How long have you had it? What fish you have in it? What the water parameters are? That sorta thing. ;-) Thanks! Vicky Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Call (301) 496-7299 or (301) 402-8625 or write: hgparker@... =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@... 919-513-1467, Dr London @ calondon@... 530-754-5711 _AND_ Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14659	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: Newbie w/question(s). TIA

Erin Sorry you lost your fish. I would skip advice from whoever told you to feed three times a day. I used to overfeed my fish and had the same end result, dead fish. Now I only feed once a day and skip one day a week, sometimes two days a week. I know a guy that has a fish breeding/selling facility and he only feeds every other day and his fish do just fine. Sometimes we think they are hungry because we eat several times a day and think they need to do the same. Some fish are excellent manipulators, like Oscars. They will beg at the side of the tank and wiggle for food and follow you back and forth and sometimes just sit and stare at you. You may want to do a water change asap as the inadverdant over feeding has probably increased the ammonia level in your tank. That is probably what killed those three off. Maybe start with a 25% change once a day for several days, be sure to treat for the chloramine and chlorine if you have it in your water. Someone else may have better water changing advice, this is what works for me. Mike -----Original Message----- From: Erin Cunningham <erosaaen@...> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wed, 17 Aug 2005 14:29:00 -0000 Subject: [AquaticLife] Newbie w/question(s). TIA Hiya! Newbie here, please be gentle! Hee!Hee! A few questions... I have a couple of Gold Gouramis that are 'twitching', according to my 9yr old. They swim around the tank (55gal).. go to their favorite corner in the back and then stay facing in one direction, but go forward and back.. Is this normal??? After awhile, they take off around the tank and the cycle starts again! I have a couple of Blue's, but they don't do that. Also, how many times DO you feed fish?? I've read anywhere from once to three times. I fed them 3 times yesterday and now have 3 dead fish to show for this!!! TIA for your help!! Erin Who doesn't want to lose anymore fish if she can help it! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14660	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: New Angelfish

In a message dated 8/16/2005 8:46:34 AM Eastern Standard Time, sevenspringss@... writes: <<<Usually, the most ideal time to introduce new fish to the tank is just before lights-out in the evening. In this way, everybody (including the new fish) gets use to any changes (like the new fish) gradually the next morning. With no place to hide, the new guy is now a target as there's no way to control the aggression of the gold Angel. Even though probably not in your original aqua- scaping plans, I would suggest adding some inexpensive leafy grown plants (like Watersprite) as cover for the new guy which you can remove after your more desired plants get established and grown.>>> First of all, thanks for your help! =) I did introduce the fish right before lights out, but it was immediately smack-down time - by morning the koi was well wedged behind some driftwood. I followed your advice and got some more vallis (corkscrew this time!) and some sort of huge plant the lfs had loads of for cheap. LOL I'm not sure what it is (long sword style leaf w/ sort of wavy edges and a rhizome), but was assured it was pretty low maintenance -- all I wanted it for was to break up sight lines anyways. My gold angel (pretty sure she's a she as her belly is quite swollen and I believe it's the ovipositor I see) stewed in her own juices for a couple of days in a breeder net while the koi got settled. I finally got some decent plants today and let her loose. She made a beeline for the koi then just left him alone. They are standing together in all the vegetation as I type. =) On a bad note, I wonder if I may have stressed the gold too much -- she seems to have a couple of small spots - possibly ich. =( The water has tested wonderful 0 - 0 - <10, pH steady at 7. Should I jump on this now, assuming it's ich, or wait it out and keep a close eye on things? All the fish seem fine and she only has two small dots on her but I don't want to let this take over. argh! =b Thanks Vicky Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Call (301) 496-7299 or (301) 402-8625 or write: hgparker@... =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@... 919-513-1467, Dr London @ calondon@... 530-754-5711 _AND_ Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14661	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: Bacteria question

Rebecca, If the water was flowing over the other sponge rather than through it, you might as well toss the old piece right now, as it was doing very little in the way of biological filtation. However, if there was somewater flowing through, then you may wish to wait about a week or so before removing the old one to help establish new colonies in the new sponge. I hope that you actually put the old sponge first in the water flow, followed by the new one. If nothing else, this should allow you to remove th eold sponge without moving the new sponge. It may also help populate the new sponge as bacteria that may be washed off the old can establish themselves in the new. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com on behalf of thesydmonster Sent: Wed 8/17/2005 5:14 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Bacteria question In my 37 gallon tank with an Eclipse 3 hood, I replaced the cartridges with that blue sponge material. It's been a while now and the material has flattened out quite a bit and seems not to be filtering as well (water flows right over it instead of through it). We put a new piece in there on top of the old one so that it could start to establish a bacteria colony. How long should I leave both of them in there before I can take the old one out? Thanks! Rebecca [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14662	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: SEEK: Rena XP1-2 or 3 Canister Filter for Parts

Hi Karen, Go to the following site and ask them to put you one in the post, they are the manufacturers. The second link is all about your filter. http://www.aquariumpharm.com/contactapi.html http://www.aquariumpharm.com/filterfaqs.html regards, unclenorm. --- Karen <oilfield_brat@...> wrote: > The O-ring in my XP3 split. Any aquarists out there > have an old XP for > parts laying around? The O-ring from any of the XPs > will fit. > Thanks > > > > ___________________________________________________________ How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14663	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: Bacteria question

Thanks, Steve :) The water was flowing through and over the sponge, just a lot more over the sponge that it used to. I think my boyfriend was squeezing the water out when he rinsed it in tank water and it just kind of flattened over time. We put the new sponge underneath the old one (water flows over/through it lengthwise in this filter) so we can just take the old one out without moving the new one. It's like a long horizontal tray vs. a vertical one. They have both been in there 7 days. There is also a biowheel but I am not sure how much bacterial that really has on it? We are leaving next week for a trip and don't want anything to happen while we are gone! We leave Weds, so I can feed the fish then and get back the next Tues... so the fish will be 5 days without food, that's okay, right? Thanks, Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > Rebecca, > > If the water was flowing over the other sponge rather than through it, you might as well toss the old piece right now, as it was doing very little in the way of biological filtation. However, if there was somewater flowing through, then you may wish to wait about a week or so before removing the old one to help establish new colonies in the new sponge. I hope that you actually put the old sponge first in the water flow, followed by the new one. If nothing else, this should allow you to remove th eold sponge without moving the new sponge. It may also help populate the new sponge as bacteria that may be washed off the old can establish themselves in the new. > > \\Steve// > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com on behalf of thesydmonster > Sent: Wed 8/17/2005 5:14 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Bacteria question > > In my 37 gallon tank with an Eclipse 3 hood, I replaced the > cartridges with that blue sponge material. It's been a while now and > the material has flattened out quite a bit and seems not to be > filtering as well (water flows right over it instead of through it). > We put a new piece in there on top of the old one so that it could > start to establish a bacteria colony. How long should I leave both of > them in there before I can take the old one out? > > Thanks! > Rebecca > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14664	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus >question

Hi Cynthia, You are describing breeders tanks, Discus are very happy in tanks with substrate and plenty of plants and bog wood. regards, unclenorm. --- cynthia brennemann <brennewoman@...> wrote: > Okay, every tank I've seen with discus has been > unplanted, and most of > the ones I've seen have no substrate at all, just a > bare tank. What's > up with that? Don't they like plants in their > habitat? > > > > ___________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14665	From: Chris	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: Electrocution of fish

Thanks for the tip. I'll be looking to destroy several hundred Gambusia "in the field" sometime soon. I think I'll use a bucket of alcohol - not a ziplock bag! Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14666	From: Chris	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: Newbie w/question(s). TIA

It seems there are two schools of thought on feeding frequency. A lot of factors have to come into consideration, but if you take a standard tropical freshwater fish tank, which is already established and has biological filtration under control, my usual recommendation is feed at least twice a day and really, as often as you like ***BUT*** (and this is the bit that's been missing in this thread so far) - make *sure* that *all* of the food you put in, is consumed within 60 seconds. (I've heard others recommend "within two minutes", but I find that if there's still food floating around after 60 seconds, the fish won't find it all, or won't be able to eat it all and then it'll decompose in the tank, increasing ammonia). What's the logic behind this? Fish are small and so their eating pattern is to eat more frequently than us humans. This happens in the wild where they eat whenever they have the opportunity (unless they're asleep). The thing to be most concerned about is "overfeeding" - and what I mean is putting too much food in during any one feed. As I said - all the food, and I do mean all of it, should be gone within 60 seconds. I've fed fish 6 times a day on this kind of routine without trouble (and certainly without "overfeeding"). Lastly - I've been talking about an established tank. Building up a new tank from scratch would require a more cautious approach with constant monitoring of ammonia levels. The fish stock, too, would be increased slowly over a period of days or weeks. In addition, if your fish are sick (and this might be your situation now), you would probably not feed 3 or 6 times a day because the fish quite likely will not eat as much - leading to overfeeding, high ammonia and more problems for an already troubled tank. Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14667	From: Chris	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: Newbie w/question(s). TIA

I should also add that I've also fed tanks 2 or fewer times a day, skipping some days without problem too - for most fish they'll find things to eat in the tank somewhere (especially if it's a planted tank) - my main point was not to put too much food in the tank no matter how often you feed them. Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14668	From: Rick Clark	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: neon tetra

Hi all, I have a Neon Tetra in my tank that looks to me like it might be pregnant. Should I put it in a seperate tank. Thanks in advance for any suggestions. Rick

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14669	From: Rachel	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: neon tetra

its a good meal. yum eggs. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Rick Clark" <rickcif@y...> wrote: > Hi all, I have a Neon Tetra in my tank that looks to me like it might > be pregnant. Should I put it in a seperate tank. Thanks in advance for > any suggestions. > > Rick

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14670	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 8/17/2005
Subject: Re: neon tetra

good luck i hope your water is hella soft and pristine or those eggs will be useless! Rachel <star9crystal@...> wrote:its a good meal. yum eggs. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Rick Clark" <rickcif@y...> wrote: > Hi all, I have a Neon Tetra in my tank that looks to me like it might > be pregnant. Should I put it in a seperate tank. Thanks in advance for > any suggestions. > > Rick Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14671	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus >question

Cynthia not only do they like plants in the wild Discus breed in the tree tops. :) I am not kidding, in the wild their habitat floods as high or higher than the tree tops every year and they spawn eggs and raise fry among the submerged tree tops. I have some small discus right now and when I put them in their tank they were all pretty scared and hid in one corner for a couple days until I put an amazon sword in the right hand third of the tank. They love it, brought them out of their shell so to speak, they swin in between the tall leaves. I put a large concave rock on the left third of the tank to break up the tank a bit and since have put in some baby tears (sp) and anubias and some floating stem plants floating on top that I have been too lazy to plant. They really seem to like the eir environment now and swim around a lot more. Mike In a message dated 8/17/2005 7:46:57 PM Pacific Daylight Time, normnam2000@... writes: --- cynthia brennemann <brennewoman@...> wrote: > Okay, every tank I've seen with discus has been > unplanted, and most of > the ones I've seen have no substrate at all, just a > bare tank. What's > up with that? Don't they like plants in their > habitat? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14672	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: neon tetra

Rick, Neon Tetras are not livebearing fish which have their eggs fertilized internally. Your Neon cannot get pregnant as her eggs will only be fertilized as they are being released in the presence of a spawning male which will fertilize her eggs only after they are expelled. Its possible that she may be egg-bound or she (or he) may have developed a case of bloat (or Dropsey). You could try putting her in a separate tank and add Epsom salts to the tune of 1/8 tsp per 5 gallons, on the chance it may just be a constipation type of bloat. If the scales start standing out from the body you'll need to treat with a nitrofurazone medication. Unfortunately, there is not too much you can do if she's egg bound, aside from trying the addition of several good sized males and hoping she's not too bound up. You'll need to slowly reduce the pH and hardness, cutting your tank water with distilled water in this case (to about 2 - 3 o). Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Rick Clark" <rickcif@y...> wrote: > Hi all, I have a Neon Tetra in my tank that looks to me like it might > be pregnant. Should I put it in a seperate tank. Thanks in advance for > any suggestions. > > Rick

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14673	From: deborahgd14	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: Angie the Angel fish - to Ray

Hi Ray: She seems about the same. I found the Peso and am going out today to get it. I will look for kanamycin (kanycin) also today. We were away a couple of days, so I wasn't able to observe her. I will keep you posted. Thanks again. Deborah D --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > Hi Deborah, How's Angie doing? Any improvement yet? Please keep us > posted if there is any change. If she is still the same, slowly boost > the temperature up to 87 o. With good aeration, they should be able to > take it up to 95 o, which sometimes needs to be done as a last resort, > even though it sounds like you're about to cook them. Let us know if > she shows any improvement at 87 o, with continuing the meds. Ray > \ >>

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14674	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: New Angelfish

Vicky, Good to see that your two Angels are now getting along Too bad you had to resort to putting the gold one in the breeder trap; that had to cause some stress. The Koi Angel may have introduced Ich to the tank if it wasn't there already (usually most tanks have a latent population). Unless you're keeping your tank in a lower temperature range, I can't believe this alone caused the Gold Angel to get this Ich, although it probably did contribute towards it. Maybe the Koi got chilled on the way home (it may well manifest in him next). If you're sure those two dots are Ich, it seldom goes away by itself and can only get worse. Best to start treating this now by gradually raising the temperature to 86 o F and adding salt (no more than 1 tbs per 5 gallons). Increase aeration and keep the temperature there for 3 additional days after all traces of Ich are gone. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, seleya8@a... wrote: > > First of all, thanks for your help! =) > > I did introduce the fish right before lights out, but it was immediately > smack-down time - by morning the koi was well wedged behind some driftwood. I > followed your advice and got some more vallis (corkscrew this time!) and some > sort of huge plant the lfs had loads of for cheap. LOL I'm not sure what it is > (long sword style leaf w/ sort of wavy edges and a rhizome), but was assured > it was pretty low maintenance -- all I wanted it for was to break up sight > lines anyways. > > My gold angel (pretty sure she's a she as her belly is quite swollen and I > believe it's the ovipositor I see) stewed in her own juices for a couple of > days in a breeder net while the koi got settled. I finally got some decent > plants today and let her loose. She made a beeline for the koi then just left him > alone. They are standing together in all the vegetation as I type. =) > > On a bad note, I wonder if I may have stressed the gold too much -- she > seems to have a couple of small spots - possibly ich. =( The water has tested > wonderful 0 - 0 - <10, pH steady at 7. Should I jump on this now, assuming it's > ich, or wait it out and keep a close eye on things? All the fish seem fine > and she only has two small dots on her but I don't want to let this take over. > argh! =b > > Thanks > > Vicky > > Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr > Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Call (301) 496-7299 or (301) > 402-8625 or write: hgparker@n... =) > > Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: > Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@n... 919-513-1467, > Dr London @ calondon@u... 530-754-5711 _AND_ > Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! > > Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@a... > > ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14675	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: Bacteria question

Rebecca, For healthy, well fed fish 5 days is nothing. They should do well without food being provided by you or anyone else. Ensure that, if you are using an air pump, there is no way the water will back siphon should the power be lost while you are gone. Also be sure that the water level in your tank is at its normal full level, so if the filter stops due to power outage, it can restart OK. If your tank light(s) are not on a timer, leave them off during your absence, though live plants may suffer some, depending on ambient light, they should recover just fine. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com on behalf of thesydmonster Sent: Wed 8/17/2005 9:34 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Bacteria question Thanks, Steve :) The water was flowing through and over the sponge, just a lot more over the sponge that it used to. I think my boyfriend was squeezing the water out when he rinsed it in tank water and it just kind of flattened over time. We put the new sponge underneath the old one (water flows over/through it lengthwise in this filter) so we can just take the old one out without moving the new one. It's like a long horizontal tray vs. a vertical one. They have both been in there 7 days. There is also a biowheel but I am not sure how much bacterial that really has on it? We are leaving next week for a trip and don't want anything to happen while we are gone! We leave Weds, so I can feed the fish then and get back the next Tues... so the fish will be 5 days without food, that's okay, right? Thanks, Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > Rebecca, > > If the water was flowing over the other sponge rather than through it, you might as well toss the old piece right now, as it was doing very little in the way of biological filtation. However, if there was somewater flowing through, then you may wish to wait about a week or so before removing the old one to help establish new colonies in the new sponge. I hope that you actually put the old sponge first in the water flow, followed by the new one. If nothing else, this should allow you to remove th eold sponge without moving the new sponge. It may also help populate the new sponge as bacteria that may be washed off the old can establish themselves in the new. > > \\Steve// > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com on behalf of thesydmonster > Sent: Wed 8/17/2005 5:14 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Bacteria question > > In my 37 gallon tank with an Eclipse 3 hood, I replaced the > cartridges with that blue sponge material. It's been a while now and > the material has flattened out quite a bit and seems not to be > filtering as well (water flows right over it instead of through it). > We put a new piece in there on top of the old one so that it could > start to establish a bacteria colony. How long should I leave both of > them in there before I can take the old one out? > > Thanks! > Rebecca > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14676	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: Angie the Angel fish - to Ray

Okay, sounds like you need to start raising the temperature, first to 87 o, and increase aeration, then see if there's any improvement. Give her a chance at this temperature first, before raising the temperature further. One benefit of higher temperatures is an increase in metabolism, which heightens the immune system. There is one caveat however; if she still isn't eating the higher metabolism will cause her to pass on sooner from lack of food, but then if you can't get her to eat even at these higher temperatures, she may unfortunately be too heavily infected to make a recovery anyway. So, we have to keep trying to treat her with these standardized methods known to be effective, in her best interest hoping she'll turn the corner. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "deborahgd14" <deborahgd14@y...> wrote: > Hi Ray: She seems about the same. I found the Peso and am going > out today to get it. I will look for kanamycin (kanycin) also > today. We were away a couple of days, so I wasn't able to observe > her. I will keep you posted. Thanks again. Deborah D > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" > <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > Hi Deborah, How's Angie doing? Any improvement yet? Please keep > us > > posted if there is any change. If she is still the same, slowly > boost > > the temperature up to 87 o. With good aeration, they should be > able to > > take it up to 95 o, which sometimes needs to be done as a last > resort, > > even though it sounds like you're about to cook them. Let us know > if > > she shows any improvement at 87 o, with continuing the meds. > Ray > > > \ > > >>

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14677	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: Electrocution of fish

Hi Leslie, Can you point to the exact link where you got this from? Amperage is not power in any terms. Its like saying that "Distance is speed in real terms". In a low Voltage, current will not flow thru the water as there is negligible driving force behind it. Voltage is the driving force behind the current flowing. Obviously, if the force trying to push the current is low, then low current will flow thru which does not matter what amperage is applied at the terminals. Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Leslie Sent: 17 August 2005 00:53 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Electrocution of fish While searching for a "nice" way to kill my fish, I happened upon this topic of euthanasia. Cut and Paste from the web site...: Electrocution This method is dangerous - it should not be attempted by unqualified individuals! This method involves placing negative and positive electrodes in the aquarium water and producing a charge sufficient to kill the fish. The key to this method is amperage. It is the amperes of a current that kill, not the voltage. Volts is another word for the kick, while amperage is the power in real terms. Death occurs due to cardiac arrest when accomplished properly. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14678	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: Electrocution of fish

Chris, This will also kill a lot of other organisms on a large scale. Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Chris Sent: 18 August 2005 04:05 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Electrocution of fish Thanks for the tip. I'll be looking to destroy several hundred Gambusia "in the field" sometime soon. I think I'll use a bucket of alcohol - not a ziplock bag! Chris. Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14679	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: Electrocution of fish

Sorry, I got the link in the other group. I must say that a lot of tests done and assumptions are very baseless. not to even mention the Electrocution method. Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nimish Mathur Sent: 18 August 2005 13:43 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Electrocution of fish Hi Leslie, Can you point to the exact link where you got this from? Amperage is not power in any terms. Its like saying that "Distance is speed in real terms". In a low Voltage, current will not flow thru the water as there is negligible driving force behind it. Voltage is the driving force behind the current flowing. Obviously, if the force trying to push the current is low, then low current will flow thru which does not matter what amperage is applied at the terminals. Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Leslie Sent: 17 August 2005 00:53 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Electrocution of fish While searching for a "nice" way to kill my fish, I happened upon this topic of euthanasia. Cut and Paste from the web site...: Electrocution This method is dangerous - it should not be attempted by unqualified individuals! This method involves placing negative and positive electrodes in the aquarium water and producing a charge sufficient to kill the fish. The key to this method is amperage. It is the amperes of a current that kill, not the voltage. Volts is another word for the kick, while amperage is the power in real terms. Death occurs due to cardiac arrest when accomplished properly. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14680	From: Erin Cunningham	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: Newbie w/question(s)

Mike & Vicky, Hello! I have a 55gal tank that had been running w/no fish in it for a day. Boring to look at... I just got the tank from a friend the day before. Then I went to Petco and got what maybe too many fish too soon!! I picked up 6 Head/Taillite Tetras, 6 Bloodfin Tetras, 3 Emerald green Cories, 6 Harlequin rasboras, 4 Sunset Fire Platies. The guy there said these were all excellent starter fish and with a tank that big, shouldn't be a problem... said to leave the bag floating for 30 min. to adjust the fish to tank water... 30 min. proved to be too long for 2 platies - the guy had put all these fish in one bag. He was also the one who said to feed them 3 times a day. Next morning, I got my replacements (2 White Mickey Mouse platies) from Petco and I went elsewhere.. I got my 2 Gold Gouramis, 2 Blue Gouramis, 2 Albino Irridescent Sharks, 4 Panda Cories, 4 Kuhlii Loaches. They put all the fish in separate bags. Said to wait a day before adding anymore new ones. Next day.. throughout the day, I had floaters! I used one of those quick dip check strips after each new one rose... everything was in line! Lost 6 throughout the day... then I noticed my Gouramis acting weird and found this forum. I am sorry to note that upon waking this AM one of my Gouramis had passed, one of my son's sharks was wrapped around the bottom of the filter intake, and one of the bloodfins was floating as well! Then as I sat there watching my fish and trying not to cry, I noticed one of my daughter's MickeyMouse platies had its side fin missing and wasn't going to make it either!! My son and I have changed out about 25% of the water..I put stress coat in and filled her back up...I am NOT gonna feed the fish until tomorrow AM!! Then change 25% of the water again! My new questions are, how long until I know if this is fixed?? How many fish should I have added at a time? And finally, after adding fish, how long should I wait before getting more??? TIA!!! Erin - Who really didn't mean to kill all those fish!! I --------------------------------- Yahoo! Mail for Mobile Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14681	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: Newbie w/question(s). TIA

Chris, If there is no food left over after 60 seconds, you are not feeding enough food to begin with. General rule which seems to work out well is -- feed no more than the fish will clean up in 3 to 4 minutes or so. This is not too much food as it may take that long for some fish to get their proper portion. If you have fish food in the tank that the fish won't find or that they're unable to eat then you're feeding too much to begin with. Fish food will normally be cleaned up with correct feedings, except for what may have fallen to the bottom intended for the catfish. I feed twice a day but only 2/3 at those times of what I would normally feed if I were feeding just once a day. Except for larger predatory fish, fish in the wild do not feed just once a day, but sparingly andsteadily throughout the day. I feel that properly fed twice a day feedings are more beneficial to the fish in the long run. \ As for your feedings of 6 times a day -- it has been well researched and shown that feedings up to 5 times a day are most beneficial when raising fry of any species. However there is no additional benefit in growth with any subsequent feedings. More than 5 feedings a day are not only a waste, they add an unnecessary burden on the biological system. Ray \ In Aquatic Life@yahoogroups.com, "Chris" <youcantryreachingme@y...> wrote: > It seems there are two schools of thought on feeding frequency. A lot > of factors have to come into consideration, but if you take a > standard tropical freshwater fish tank, which is already established > and has biological filtration under control, my usual recommendation > is feed at least twice a day and really, as often as you like > ***BUT*** (and this is the bit that's been missing in this thread so > far) - make *sure* that *all* of the food you put in, is consumed > within 60 seconds. (I've heard others recommend "within two minutes", > but I find that if there's still food floating around after 60 > seconds, the fish won't find it all, or won't be able to eat it all > and then it'll decompose in the tank, increasing ammonia). > > What's the logic behind this? Fish are small and so their eating > pattern is to eat more frequently than us humans. This happens in the > wild where they eat whenever they have the opportunity (unless > they're asleep). > > The thing to be most concerned about is "overfeeding" - and what I > mean is putting too much food in during any one feed. As I said - all > the food, and I do mean all of it, should be gone within 60 seconds. > I've fed fish 6 times a day on this kind of routine without trouble > (and certainly without "overfeeding"). > > Lastly - I've been talking about an established tank. Building up a > new tank from scratch would require a more cautious approach with > constant monitoring of ammonia levels. The fish stock, too, would be > increased slowly over a period of days or weeks. > > In addition, if your fish are sick (and this might be your situation > now), you would probably not feed 3 or 6 times a day because the fish > quite likely will not eat as much - leading to overfeeding, high > ammonia and more problems for an already troubled tank. > > Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14682	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus >question

Oh, good. I hate the empty tanks :( I noticed that every breeder I talked to told me to put my breeding bettas in a barren tank as well, but we had great success with them breeding in a heavily planted tank. We found homes so far for all but about 25 of the babies, and those will go to the store :D Don't know if I want to try breeding discus, but if it happens, I think I'll let it happen naturally in the planted tank. > Hi Cynthia, > You are describing breeders tanks, Discus > are very happy in tanks with substrate and plenty of > plants and bog wood. > regards, > unclenorm.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14683	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus >question

LOL...Okay (stares out window at oak trees) now how to get THOSE in my tank? :-P > Cynthia not only do they like plants in the wild Discus breed in the tree > tops. :)

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14684	From: Rick Clark	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: neon tetra

Thanks alot for the info. Still new to this, just getting a good grasp on biological filtration and maintaining a good water quality when we noticed this. Rick --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > Rick, Neon Tetras are not livebearing fish which have their eggs > fertilized internally. Your Neon cannot get pregnant as her eggs > will only be fertilized as they are being released in the presence of > a spawning male which will fertilize her eggs only after they are > expelled. Its possible that she may be egg-bound or she (or he) may > have developed a case of bloat (or Dropsey). You could try putting > her in a separate tank and add Epsom salts to the tune of 1/8 tsp per > 5 gallons, on the chance it may just be a constipation type of > bloat. If the scales start standing out from the body you'll need to > treat with a nitrofurazone medication. Unfortunately, there is not > too much you can do if she's egg bound, aside from trying the > addition of several good sized males and hoping she's not too bound > up. You'll need to slowly reduce the pH and hardness, cutting your > tank water with distilled water in this case (to about 2 - 3 o). Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Rick Clark" <rickcif@y...> wrote: > > Hi all, I have a Neon Tetra in my tank that looks to me like it > might > > be pregnant. Should I put it in a seperate tank. Thanks in advance > for > > any suggestions. > > > > Rick

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14685	From: dreammaker2623	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: Electrocution of fish

The United States Fish and Game departments have used electocution to kill and also to figure out the populaions of fish n give waters. You miht wish to get in touch with one of those agencies. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Chris" <youcantryreachingme@y...> wrote: > Thanks for the tip. > > I'll be looking to destroy several hundred Gambusia "in the field" > sometime soon. I think I'll use a bucket of alcohol - not a ziplock bag! > > Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14686	From: Trevor	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: SEEK: Rena XP1-2 or 3 Canister Filter for Parts

You can order one at http://www.thomasregister.com/olc/smartcat.aspx?az=73615684&advancedsearch=yes&bgcolor=FFFFFF&border=0&bordercolor=000000&cartlink=yes&columnsort=yes&counters=yes&email=yes&font=Arial,%2BHelvetica&fontsize=2&linktext=Back&listsort=yes(%22derimage=http://www.thomasregister.com/olc/ccc/mm/cec_AddToCart_f01.gif&printpreview=yes&ptnolink=yes&rfqimage=http://www.thomasregister.com/olc/ccc/mm/cec_AddToRFQ_f01.gif&showdiscounts=yes&stripecolor=FFFFEE&tablealign=center&tablewidth=460&textcolor=000000&sort=asc&sortby=PART_NUMBER%BD%03mber=20&type=heading_order&pn=28962009&template=http://www.renapump.com/html/ool/template.htm (If that link doesn't work, go to http://www.aquariumpharm.com/sitemap.html and click on "Buy FilStar Parts Online" under "Equipment.") - Trevor --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > Hi Karen, > Go to the following site and ask them to put > you one in the post, they are the manufacturers. The > second link is all about your filter. > > http://www.aquariumpharm.com/contactapi.html > > http://www.aquariumpharm.com/filterfaqs.html > > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- Karen <oilfield_brat@y...> wrote: > > > The O-ring in my XP3 split. Any aquarists out there > > have an old XP for > > parts laying around? The O-ring from any of the XPs > > will fit. > > Thanks > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday > snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14687	From: Tom Ray	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: AH Supply Lighting Questions

Thanks for the recommendation. AH Supply did get back to me at the end of the day yesterday via email. Their answer in a nutshell: We decline to answer your questions at this time. That is a rather disappointing answer given their reputation and given I'd also given them my phone #. A simple call would have seemed much more polite, and probably would have won them another sale and fan. --TommyBoy --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "joequality1980" <crazy.joe.walcek@g...> wrote: > although I dont know the specifics, I did order 1 55W retrofit kit for > 24" long tanks and it works very well. It took them less than 2 days > to email me back about my questions. I recommend them > > > I've left voicemail and email and yet have gotten no response from AH > > Supply, so here are my questions to this group in hopes that someone > > can answer them. > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14688	From: joequality1980	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: do you name your fish?/Horace

hehe hopefully more than I hoped for! > > Now how many people do you think went to that website? > > Linda

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14689	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: New file uploaded to AquaticLife

Hello, This email message is a notification to let you know that a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the AquaticLife group. File : /Aquarium Photography Uploaded by : tropicalfishman <anonymous122899@...> Description : Original Post from "Steve Szabo You can access this file at the URL: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/files/Aquarium%20Photography%20 To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit: http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files Regards, tropicalfishman <anonymous122899@...>

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14690	From: Phil	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Oscar eggs!

Hey! MY Oscars laid eggs this morning!They laid bout 100-200 eggs. I thought both were males & one turned out to be a female. So I had to change "His" name from roscoe to Roxanne.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14691	From: deborahgd14	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Update on Angie

Angie is still in the corner but did come up for food. I found the pepo by Jungle Lab. She looked at it funny, so I put some flakes with it. Hopefully she swallowed some of the medicine. Here's hoping she pulls through. Deborah D

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14692	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists every Thursday Thursday August 18, 2005 8:00 pm - 10:00 pm This event repeats every week. The next reminder for this event will be sent in 3 hours, 4 minutes. Event Location: http://chat.thatpetplace.com/chat/chat.aspx Notes: Return to this site every Thursday from 8pm to 10pm and Monday from 8pm to 9pm (Eastern Time) to chat LIVE with one of our on-staff Marine Biologists. Learn about your fish, how to treat common maladies, get recommendations on accessories, food and live animal compatibility, or ask a question that only an expert could answer. MarineBio Chat every Thursday 8pm to 10pm EST, only from That Fish Place, The Original Aquatic Superstore. Attention MarineBio chat participants! The chat server is unavailable until 8pm Eastern Time. If you experience problems while trying to log on to the chat session ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14693	From: Leslie	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: Electrocution of fish/Nim

Nim, Here's the link. I'm questioning a lot of what it says. http://homepage.ntlworld.com/faustus/nicoldaquaria/euthanasia.htm -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nimish Mathur Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2005 7:43 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Electrocution of fish Hi Leslie, Can you point to the exact link where you got this from?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14694	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: Update on Angie

That's a bit of good news. Just the fact that she ate something is encouraging. Often, affected fish will come up to the surface and look "funny" at the food (as you described), almost as if they're going to eat, but not quite -- can be very frustrating. You may need to keep mixing foods as you just did until she gets used to the Pepso food. In the meantime it would be a good idea to make your own medicated flake food as I previously described. You can even spread out the medicated paste as a light smear on an old piece of glass. When it dries, it will be the perfect thickness for a flake food, just crumble it slightly. This way you'll be assured she's getting med into her. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "deborahgd14" <deborahgd14@y...> wrote: > Angie is still in the corner but did come up for food. I found the > pepo by Jungle Lab. She looked at it funny, so I put some flakes with > it. Hopefully she swallowed some of the medicine. Here's hoping she > pulls through. Deborah D

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14695	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: Oscar eggs!

Phil, Congratulations and nice going. Now you'll have to decide whether or not to pull the eggs out, if you haven't so decided already. In general, Oscars are pretty good parents; The only thing I notice is that after the fry hatch and they're free swimming, the parent (s) may "forget" to spit them back out (when cleaning them) all time, resulting in gradually diminishing numbers each proceeding day. I've found it best to let the parents hatch the eggs, but I remove (syphon out) about 95% of the fry when they are free swimming. Best to leave them some so they don't blame each other for eating them. Fortunately, Cichlids can't count! (lol). Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Phil" <swordtail72@y...> wrote: > Hey! MY Oscars laid eggs this morning!They laid bout 100-200 eggs. > I thought both were males & one turned out to be a female. So I had to > change "His" name from roscoe to Roxanne.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14696	From: Karen	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: SEEK: Rena XP1-2 or 3 Canister Filter for Parts

I ordered one from BigAlsOnline.com . I need a bulb too so the hsipping cost was spread out. It was only $7 US plus $8 shipping with the Power-Glo bulb ($14). I was just fishing to see if maybe someone had an XP that they weren't using. Thanks. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Trevor" <trevor@h...> wrote: > You can order one at > http://www.thomasregister.com/olc/smartcat.aspx? az=73615684&advancedsearch=yes&bgcolor=FFFFFF&border=0&bordercolor=00 0000&cartlink=yes&columnsort=yes&counters=yes&email=yes&font=Arial,% 2BHelvetica&fontsize=2&linktext=Back&listsort=yes(% 22derimage=http://www.thomasregister.com/olc/ccc/mm/cec_AddToCart_f01 .gif&printpreview=yes&ptnolink=yes&rfqimage=http://www.thomasregister .com/olc/ccc/mm/cec_AddToRFQ_f01.gif&showdiscounts=yes&stripecolor=FF FFEE&tablealign=center&tablewidth=460&textcolor=000000&sort=asc&sortb y=PART_NUMBER%BD% 03mber=20&type=heading_order&pn=28962009&template=http://www.renapump .com/html/ool/template.htm > > (If that link doesn't work, go to > http://www.aquariumpharm.com/sitemap.html and click on "Buy FilStar > Parts Online" under "Equipment.") > > - Trevor > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. Hampson." > <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > Hi Karen, > > Go to the following site and ask them to put > > you one in the post, they are the manufacturers. The > > second link is all about your filter. > > > > http://www.aquariumpharm.com/contactapi.html > > > > http://www.aquariumpharm.com/filterfaqs.html > > > > regards, > > unclenorm. > > > > > > --- Karen <oilfield_brat@y...> wrote: > > > > > The O-ring in my XP3 split. Any aquarists out there > > > have an old XP for > > > parts laying around? The O-ring from any of the XPs > > > will fit. > > > Thanks > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday > > snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14697	From: aclaar877	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Discus, ich, and high temps

Just added four discus to 155g planted tank on Sunday, and three have developed some ich spots. A few cardinals and both clown loaches have them as well. Temperature has never been below 86--I thought ich wouldn't spread at those temps? I now have the temp at about 88-89, and the discus are getting even more spots. They are still eating and not yet scratching against things. Should I keep the temperature high and wait it out, or start the Quick-Cure malachite green medication? Water quality is high, with 0 ammonia and 0 nitrates. I'd like to hear what any other discus owners have done in this situation. I don't want to medicate if I don't have to, but would hate for the ich to rapidly spread and kill the fish quicker than I can react. Thanks.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14698	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: Electrocution of fish

Message: Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 03:05:16 -0000 From: "Chris" <youcantryreachingme@...> Subject: Re: Electrocution of fish Thanks for the tip. I'll be looking to destroy several hundred Gambusia "in the field" sometime soon. I think I'll use a bucket of alcohol - not a ziplock bag! Chris. Ummm.. down here in New Orleans, that would be considered "Alcohol Abuse"... wasting perfectly good booze on some fish... unless it's medicinal alcohol.. then have at it. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14699	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: Newbie w/question(s) - ANSWERS for ERIN

Erin, It is not completely your fault for killing all of those fish. Mistake number one was listening to a LFS employee who you did not know to be knowledgeable. MOST LFS employees don't know their A$$ from a hole in the ground. Your fish are dying because you did not properly cycle your tank before adding fish. Bring back all of the corpses for FULL REFUNDS and complain to the manager of the store for being given such stupid instructions which resulted in killing all those fish. Feel free to show him or her a copy of my reply calling him or her a DUMBA$$! Go to this link and READ ALL of the information and other all of the LINKS. You may be able to save some of your fish but you need to get a Master Test Kit and test your water for ammonia, nitrites, nitrates, etc., and prepare to do daily 25% PWC's (partial water changes) to keep those levels in the safe range until your tank has "Cycled" properly. http://www.myfishtank.net/forum/showthread.php?t=19357 If that is not enough or if you do not believe that information, go to these sites as well. http://faq.thekrib.com/begin.html http://www.aquatic-hobbyist.com/profiles/misc/fishcycling.html http://faq.thekrib.com/begin-chem.html Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: 19 Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2005 07:02:44 -0700 (PDT) From: Erin Cunningham <erosaaen@...> Subject: Re: Newbie w/question(s) Mike & Vicky, Hello! I have a 55gal tank that had been running w/no fish in it for a day. Boring to look at... I just got the tank from a friend the day before. Then I went to Petco and got what maybe too many fish too soon!! I picked up 6 Head/Taillite Tetras, 6 Bloodfin Tetras, 3 Emerald green Cories, 6 Harlequin rasboras, 4 Sunset Fire Platies. The guy there said these were all excellent starter fish and with a tank that big, shouldn't be a problem... said to leave the bag floating for 30 min. to adjust the fish to tank water... 30 min. proved to be too long for 2 platies - the guy had put all these fish in one bag. He was also the one who said to feed them 3 times a day. Next morning, I got my replacements (2 White Mickey Mouse platies) from Petco and I went elsewhere.. I got my 2 Gold Gouramis, 2 Blue Gouramis, 2 Albino Irridescent Sharks, 4 Panda Cories, 4 Kuhlii Loaches. They put all the fish in separate bags. Said to wait a day before adding anymore new ones. Next day.. throughout the day, I had floaters! I used one of those quick dip check strips after each new one rose... everything was in line! Lost 6 throughout the day... then I noticed my Gouramis acting weird and found this forum. I am sorry to note that upon waking this AM one of my Gouramis had passed, one of my son's sharks was wrapped around the bottom of the filter intake, and one of the bloodfins was floating as well! Then as I sat there watching my fish and trying not to cry, I noticed one of my daughter's MickeyMouse platies had its side fin missing and wasn't going to make it either!! My son and I have changed out about 25% of the water..I put stress coat in and filled her back up...I am NOT gonna feed the fish until tomorrow AM!! Then change 25% of the water again! My new questions are, how long until I know if this is fixed?? How many fish should I have added at a time? And finally, after adding fish, how long should I wait before getting more??? TIA!!! Erin - Who really didn't mean to kill all those fish!! I [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14700	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists every Thursday Thursday August 18, 2005 8:00 pm - 10:00 pm This event repeats every week. Event Location: http://chat.thatpetplace.com/chat/chat.aspx Notes: Return to this site every Thursday from 8pm to 10pm and Monday from 8pm to 9pm (Eastern Time) to chat LIVE with one of our on-staff Marine Biologists. Learn about your fish, how to treat common maladies, get recommendations on accessories, food and live animal compatibility, or ask a question that only an expert could answer. MarineBio Chat every Thursday 8pm to 10pm EST, only from That Fish Place, The Original Aquatic Superstore. Attention MarineBio chat participants! The chat server is unavailable until 8pm Eastern Time. If you experience problems while trying to log on to the chat session ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14701	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: Discus, ich, and high temps

To Whom it May Concern (no signature): Generally, Ich find it difficult to reproduce above 86 o. Occassionally, you might run across a particularly virulent and resistant strain which may be able to endure temperatures up to 90 o. Their getting more spots may just be a delayed reaction and once these cysts drop off they should not be able to multiply very freely, if at all (unless its a resistant strain). If the spots are still few, I would go with the heat treatment and add no more than 1 tbs of salt per 5 gallons -- you have Tetras. Give it 2 days if you can (if there's not a heavy infestation) and see what it looks like by then. If you find that you're up against a more virulent strain, you may need to move to a medication, but do not under any circumstances use a malachite green (or any other dye) based medication -- it will kill your scaleless Loaches. So keep the temperature up and keep an eye on things. And, I hope you meant a reading of 0 for your nitrItes. Ray \ - -- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "aclaar877" <aclaar877@y...> wrote: > Just added four discus to 155g planted tank on Sunday, and three have > developed some ich spots. A few cardinals and both clown loaches have > them as well. Temperature has never been below 86--I thought ich > wouldn't spread at those temps? I now have the temp at about 88-89, > and the discus are getting even more spots. They are still eating and > not yet scratching against things. Should I keep the temperature high > and wait it out, or start the Quick-Cure malachite green medication? > > Water quality is high, with 0 ammonia and 0 nitrates. > > I'd like to hear what any other discus owners have done in this > situation. I don't want to medicate if I don't have to, but would > hate for the ich to rapidly spread and kill the fish quicker than I > can react. Thanks.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14702	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: von rio tetra

Although the von rio tetra doesn't get very big, it has a deeper body. Would this be a more suitable tank mate (as opposed to neon tetras) to keep with my angelfish? Or would the angels seem them as food? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14703	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 8/18/2005
Subject: Re: von rio tetra

Ive had REALLY bad luck with von rios anyone have a link for them?? Crazy4fids@... wrote:Although the von rio tetra doesn't get very big, it has a deeper body. Would this be a more suitable tank mate (as opposed to neon tetras) to keep with my angelfish? Or would the angels seem them as food? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14704	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: von rio tetra

Linda, You must not have seen fully mature specimens of these fish. Flame Tetras get to be about 2", or just slightly less than Serpae's or Lemon Tetra's; certainly much longer than Neons, and as you say -- deeper bodied. These fish would be fine as tankmates for your Angels. They're peaceful and colorful and would not be viewed as food. Today's Von Rio's may not be as brilliantly colored as much earlier ones in the hobby, but are still a pleasant shade of red. As with most Tetra's, they are best kept in a group of at least 6 (or more), as you may already know. Ray \ -- - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > Although the von rio tetra doesn't get very big, it has a deeper body. > Would this be a more suitable tank mate (as opposed to neon tetras) to keep with > my angelfish? Or would the angels seem them as food? > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14705	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: von rio tetra

Von Rios are generally as hardy as any other small Tetra. I'm surprised and regret to hear that you've had bad luck with them, although you don't say exactly what went wrong (Ich, or other illness?). You may have just purchased a weaker strain, as there has been too much inbreeding of this species over the years by some breeders. This is the main reason why their coloring today (although nice) is not nearly as it was many years ago when these fish were a brilliant red. Out of curiousity urged by your question, I made a search with "Flame Tetra" and came up with more sites than I could count, some of them links to more specialized web pages. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, kristopher helsing <punk3r12@y...> wrote: > Ive had REALLY bad luck with von rios anyone have a link for them?? > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14706	From: Erin Cunningham	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: What have I done !?????????

I did a 20-25% water change yesterday.. put stress coat in and filled the tank back up... went out got an ammonia quick test thing and came home... Checked it all out.. pH, ammonia,nitrite and nitrate... all fine - safe!!! Watched fish swim about last night... woke up this AM and I couldn't see a bloody thing!!! And this horrible smell! Checked again... TOO much ammonia and TOO much nitrite!!! I changed the water 50% and scooped out all my dead fish... put in ACE.. filled her back up... 30min. later check water: more fish dead (scooped these out), tested water levels: Bit higher than usual, but bordering safe/stress... add safe coat.. still have fish at the top except for 2 Blue Gouramis who seem to be enjoying the atmosphere! WTF!!!!!!!! And the smell is still there.. what is that from??? Erin

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14707	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: What have I done !?????????

I presume you have chloramine in your tap water (?). If so, why did you used Stress Coat? Stress Coat is formulated to remove chlorine (only), with the additional function of putting a temporary coating on the fish (with Aloe) to replace any slime coat that may have been lost when handling or netting the fish; this product's main use. You need to use Ammo-Lock or some similar product to get rid of the chloramines which most tap water has now a days. Sounds like that may have been your problem as a first insight. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Erin Cunningham" <erosaaen@y...> wrote: > I did a 20-25% water change yesterday.. put stress coat in and filled > the tank back up... went out got an ammonia quick test thing and came > home... Checked it all out.. pH, ammonia,nitrite and nitrate... all > fine - safe!!! Watched fish swim about last night... woke up this AM > and I couldn't see a bloody thing!!! And this horrible smell! Checked > again... TOO much ammonia and TOO much nitrite!!! I changed the water > 50% and scooped out all my dead fish... put in ACE.. filled her back > up... 30min. later check water: more fish dead (scooped these out), > tested water levels: Bit higher than usual, but bordering > safe/stress... add safe coat.. still have fish at the top except for 2 > Blue Gouramis who seem to be enjoying the atmosphere! WTF!!!!!!!! And > the smell is still there.. what is that from??? > > Erin

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14708	From: Erin Cunningham	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: What have I done !?????????

Ray, I put stress coat in as it says you can to reduce stress of fish during a water change... they were stressed out to begin with, so I thought I was helping... Erin --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > I presume you have chloramine in your tap water (?). If so, why did > you used Stress Coat? Stress Coat is formulated to remove chlorine > (only), with the additional function of putting a temporary coating on > the fish (with Aloe) to replace any slime coat that may have been lost > when handling or netting the fish; this product's main use. You need > to use Ammo-Lock or some similar product to get rid of the chloramines > which most tap water has now a days. Sounds like that may have been > your problem as a first insight. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Erin Cunningham" <erosaaen@y...> > wrote: > > I did a 20-25% water change yesterday.. put stress coat in and filled > > the tank back up... went out got an ammonia quick test thing and came > > home... Checked it all out.. pH, ammonia,nitrite and nitrate... all > > fine - safe!!! Watched fish swim about last night... woke up this AM > > and I couldn't see a bloody thing!!! And this horrible smell! Checked > > again... TOO much ammonia and TOO much nitrite!!! I changed the water > > 50% and scooped out all my dead fish... put in ACE.. filled her back > > up... 30min. later check water: more fish dead (scooped these out), > > tested water levels: Bit higher than usual, but bordering > > safe/stress... add safe coat.. still have fish at the top except for > 2 > > Blue Gouramis who seem to be enjoying the atmosphere! WTF!!!!!!!! And > > the smell is still there.. what is that from??? > > > > Erin

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14709	From: Chris	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Newbie w/question(s). TIA

I do have one exception in my community tank - I have 6 gobies at the bottom (and no catfish, but a couple of kuhli loaches)... 2 of the gobies are confident enough to come to the top to feed, but the other four only get what makes it to the bottom. Most days that means very little, so I frequently hand-feed them with frozen bloodworms... Again - my earlier description was "in general" and each tank is different. Cheers, Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14710	From: Chris	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Gambusia day

Looks like tomorrow is the Gambusia day for me. Other suggestions submitted to me were rotanone (tomato dust) and bleach (which apparently rapidly reduces oxygen). Anyone have any experience with these? (neither sounds appealing to me. Alcohol is still the likely option). I'll let you know how we go. In a nutshell, the waterway begins as stormwater runoff, enters a pollution trap, goes into a sediment pond then splits into two distinct (not joined) wetlands. Both wetlands drain separately into saltwater mangroves. Gambusia can be found in one of the two wetlands, and no-where else. At the head of those wetlands is a small waterhole with hundreds of them. At present, due to drought conditions, the waterhole is self contained. If we get good rain, those hundreds of Gambusia would likely spread downstream straight into the wetlands (where there are already some). To try and further discourage the possibility of the Gambusia heading upstream into the sediment pond, we plan to clear the waterhole then monitor all parts of the system. Bedtime now here in Sydney, but I'll check for replies in the morning before I head off. Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14711	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: von rio tetra

In a message dated 8/19/2005 5:48:41 A.M. Central Standard Time, sevenspringss@... writes: Flame Tetras get to be about 2", or just slightly less than Serpae's or Lemon Tetra's; certainly much longer than Neons Any info I have found says that they only get 1-1.5 inches. The ones I found have nice color and are currently about the size of a dime. Lindas [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14712	From: Chris	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Gambusia day

Looks like I found my own answer for anyone interested... also talks about electrofishing and hand collection, but in the context of trout. Australian info though: http://202.45.103.18/forums/viewtopic.php? topic=28912&forum=2&view_post_id=258450

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14713	From: Chris	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: What have I done !?????????

Typically three things go into new water before the water goes in the tank: 1) water purifier - find one which removes chlorine, chloramines and heavy metals 2) water conditioner (if your type of fish needs it) - basically salts that set the water hardness and pH (different for different kinds of fish - eg goldfish, tropicals, cichlids, south american, etc) 3) something to "ease the stress" on the fish. If anything is optional, the third one might be - but the first two are most important. In all cases, mix the water up before putting it in the tank, too. try and get the temperature roughly the same as in your tank, too - don't just use the cold water tap. Check the shelf-life of the product you used, too - make sure it's not out of date. Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14714	From: minnesotagal866	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Stress Coat

I just bought some stress coat, on the bottle it says that it takes care of chloramines as well as chlorine. Don't have it in front of me for exact wording (it's at school for the classroom). Anyone have a newish bottle to confirm? Jackie

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14715	From: wendie	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Stress Coat

Yes, I also use stress coat. It neutralizes chloramines. I've used it for months and prefer it over the others. I don't age the water either so it's added and sits perhaps 30 minutes and then the fish are introduced without a problem. Wendie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of minnesotagal866 Sent: Friday, August 19, 2005 9:44 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Stress Coat I just bought some stress coat, on the bottle it says that it takes care of chloramines as well as chlorine. Don't have it in front of me for exact wording (it's at school for the classroom). Anyone have a newish bottle to confirm? Jackie Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14716	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Gambusia day

Hi Chris, I just tried to check out the site you posted the link for, but my computer security blocked access telling me that that site has a non standard web address format and that such sites are known vehicles for viruses and other harmful entities. I thought I better let you know. regards, unclenorm. --- Chris <youcantryreachingme@...> wrote: > Looks like I found my own answer for anyone > interested... also talks > about electrofishing and hand collection, but in the > context of trout. > Australian info though: > > http://202.45.103.18/forums/viewtopic.php? > topic=28912&forum=2&view_post_id=258450 > > > > Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14717	From: aclaar877	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Discus, ich, and high temps

Ray, thanks. I do have 0 nitrites, as well as 0 nitrates. Most plants are doing great, though maybe some nitrates will help the red ammania gracillis I have. I'll keep the heat up, but probably won't do salt because of the plants. Do you know if the white spots are the parasites themselves, or reactions to the parasite? If there is a delay between the parasite attaching itself and the appearance of a spot, I may be ahead of where I thought I was as far as the ich cycle is concerned. AC --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > To Whom it May Concern (no signature): Generally, Ich find it > difficult to reproduce above 86 o. Occassionally, you might run across > a particularly virulent and resistant strain which may be able to > endure temperatures up to 90 o. Their getting more spots may just be a > delayed reaction and once these cysts drop off they should not be able > to multiply very freely, if at all (unless its a resistant strain). If > the spots are still few, I would go with the heat treatment and add no > more than 1 tbs of salt per 5 gallons -- you have Tetras. Give it 2 > days if you can (if there's not a heavy infestation) and see what it > looks like by then. If you find that you're up against a more virulent > strain, you may need to move to a medication, but do not under any > circumstances use a malachite green (or any other dye) based > medication -- it will kill your scaleless Loaches. So keep the > temperature up and keep an eye on things. And, I hope you meant a > reading of 0 for your nitrItes. Ray > \ - > -- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "aclaar877" <aclaar877@y...> wrote: > > Just added four discus to 155g planted tank on Sunday, and three have > > developed some ich spots. A few cardinals and both clown loaches > have > > them as well. Temperature has never been below 86--I thought ich > > wouldn't spread at those temps? I now have the temp at about 88- 89, > > and the discus are getting even more spots. They are still eating > and > > not yet scratching against things. Should I keep the temperature > high > > and wait it out, or start the Quick-Cure malachite green medication? > > > > Water quality is high, with 0 ammonia and 0 nitrates. > > > > I'd like to hear what any other discus owners have done in this > > situation. I don't want to medicate if I don't have to, but would > > hate for the ich to rapidly spread and kill the fish quicker than I > > can react. Thanks.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14718	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Clown Loaches

Apparently a large supplier out here had some problems, as virtually every LFS around me that has Clown loaches recieved them infected with Ich. They are all treating them now - was wondering if it would be safe to actually purchase them after their treatments are done or if I should wait

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14719	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Stress Coat

Unless there's a brandy-new formula out there now, Stress Coat does not remove chloramine as far as I'm aware. Have the box and bottle right in front of me -- it says: "contains Aloe Vera" and "Removes Chlorine and Replaces the Natural Slime Coating of Fish". Removing chlorine is a lot different than removing chloramine. The latter requires entirely different chemicals to break the ammonia - chlorine bond. No where on the box or bottle does it say it removes chloramine, at least not on my bottle which is fairly new. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, wendie <wendieo@o...> wrote: > Yes, I also use stress coat. It neutralizes chloramines. I've used it for > months and prefer it over the others. > I don't age the water either so it's added and sits perhaps 30 minutes and > then the fish are introduced without a problem. > Wendie > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On > Behalf Of minnesotagal866 > Sent: Friday, August 19, 2005 9:44 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Stress Coat > > > I just bought some stress coat, on the bottle it says that it takes > care of chloramines as well as chlorine. Don't have it in front of me > for exact wording (it's at school for the classroom). Anyone have a > newish bottle to confirm? > Jackie > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- -------- > -- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service. > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- -------- > -- > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14720	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: What have I done !?????????

Erin, No harm done in adding Stress Coat to a tank if it is needed to temporarily replace the slime coating on the fish, if somehow some of it got rubbed off due to netting. As I see it, this is really the type of stress referred to in the brand name (Stress Coat) as its use; the last part of the name (Coat) indicating what it does (more or less how it works) -- relieving the stress brought on by removal of the slime coat by replacing (coating) the lost natural slime coat with a stress-reducing artificial (aloe vera) slime coat. I don't believe it is meant to reduce the stress incurred by exposing the fish to a change of water -- there is nothing in the formula that can achieve such a thing, nor do I know of any other product that can accomplish this. Any slight changes in pH, etc., with new water would have to be adjusted to by the fish. \ The only problem here is that you would still need to add another product which would remove chloramines, as Stress Coat is not designed to do that; it states that it removes chlorine (only). Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Erin Cunningham" <erosaaen@y...> wrote: > Ray, > I put stress coat in as it says you can to reduce stress of fish > during a water change... they were stressed out to begin with, so I > thought I was helping... > Erin > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> > wrote: > > I presume you have chloramine in your tap water (?). If so, why did > > you used Stress Coat? Stress Coat is formulated to remove chlorine > > (only), with the additional function of putting a temporary coating on > > the fish (with Aloe) to replace any slime coat that may have been lost > > when handling or netting the fish; this product's main use. You need > > to use Ammo-Lock or some similar product to get rid of the chloramines > > which most tap water has now a days. Sounds like that may have been > > your problem as a first insight. Ray > > \ > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Erin Cunningham" <erosaaen@y...> > > wrote: > > > I did a 20-25% water change yesterday.. put stress coat in and filled > > > the tank back up... went out got an ammonia quick test thing and came > > > home... Checked it all out.. pH, ammonia,nitrite and nitrate... all > > > fine - safe!!! Watched fish swim about last night... woke up this AM > > > and I couldn't see a bloody thing!!! And this horrible smell! Checked > > > again... TOO much ammonia and TOO much nitrite!!! I changed the water > > > 50% and scooped out all my dead fish... put in ACE.. filled her back > > > up... 30min. later check water: more fish dead (scooped these out), > > > tested water levels: Bit higher than usual, but bordering > > > safe/stress... add safe coat.. still have fish at the top except for > > 2 > > > Blue Gouramis who seem to be enjoying the atmosphere! WTF!!!!!!!! And > > > the smell is still there.. what is that from??? > > > > > > Erin

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14721	From: wendie	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Stress Coat

I just happen to be using it now for two Betta tanks. I stuck it up here... http://www.nashnutphoto.com/bettas/stresscoat.jpg Wendie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Friday, August 19, 2005 11:34 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Stress Coat Unless there's a brandy-new formula out there now, Stress Coat does not remove chloramine as far as I'm aware. Have the box and bottle right in front of me -- it says: "contains Aloe Vera" and "Removes Chlorine and Replaces the Natural Slime Coating of Fish". Removing chlorine is a lot different than removing chloramine. The latter requires entirely different chemicals to break the ammonia - chlorine bond. No where on the box or bottle does it say it removes chloramine, at least not on my bottle which is fairly new. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, wendie <wendieo@o...> wrote: > Yes, I also use stress coat. It neutralizes chloramines. I've used it for > months and prefer it over the others. > I don't age the water either so it's added and sits perhaps 30 minutes and > then the fish are introduced without a problem. > Wendie > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On > Behalf Of minnesotagal866 > Sent: Friday, August 19, 2005 9:44 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Stress Coat > > > I just bought some stress coat, on the bottle it says that it takes > care of chloramines as well as chlorine. Don't have it in front of me > for exact wording (it's at school for the classroom). Anyone have a > newish bottle to confirm? > Jackie > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- -------- > -- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service. > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- -------- > -- > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14722	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: What have I done !????????

One of your previously dead fish could be hidden and decomposing which would cause serious ammonia levels, then nitrites, then nitrates. I saw Ray's suggestion about Ammo-lock but the downside is you need to make sure your test kit is compatible as most ammonia locking water treatments will cause false readings with test kits. I'm not sure why your first test showed safe and your second was off the charts except you tested the water after the PWC before the problem had a chance to redevelop. What is "ACE"? You should probably only do 25% PWC's at a time since changing the water chemistry and temperature too much, too fast... even while attempting to lower the ammonia/nitrites, can cause additional stress on the fish. If my levels ever got too high, I would do a series of 25% PWC's, every four hours until the levels were down in the safe range. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: 22 Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2005 11:26:21 -0000 From: "Erin Cunningham" <erosaaen@...> Subject: What have I done !????????? I did a 20-25% water change yesterday.. put stress coat in and filled the tank back up... went out got an ammonia quick test thing and came home... Checked it all out.. pH, ammonia,nitrite and nitrate... all fine - safe!!! Watched fish swim about last night... woke up this AM and I couldn't see a bloody thing!!! And this horrible smell! Checked again... TOO much ammonia and TOO much nitrite!!! I changed the water 50% and scooped out all my dead fish... put in ACE.. filled her back up... 30min. later check water: more fish dead (scooped these out), tested water levels: Bit higher than usual, but bordering safe/stress... add safe coat.. still have fish at the top except for 2 Blue Gouramis who seem to be enjoying the atmosphere! WTF!!!!!!!! And the smell is still there.. what is that from??? Erin [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14723	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Gambusia day

hey Norm try http://www.fishnet/forums/viewtopic.php?%3E%20topic=28912&forum=2&view_post_id =258450 its the same link just with the sight name not domain numbers used. when i try accessing the link Fishnet says the thread no longer exists. Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 8/19/2005 9:53:17 AM US Eastern Standard Time, Looks like I found my own answer for anyone > interested... also talks > about electrofishing and hand collection, but in the > context of trout. > Australian info though: > > http://202.45.103.18/forums/viewtopic.php? > topic=28912&forum=2&view_post_id=258450 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14724	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Gambusia day

While alchohol may be recommended by some and may be the euthaniser of choice by them, I tend to think that alchohol would burn the fish's gills (possibly causing some pain and/or discomfort), no matter how fast it acts. I would go with carbonated water (selter water. etc.) as it renders the fish unconscious before dispatching them. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Chris" <youcantryreachingme@y...> wrote: > Looks like tomorrow is the Gambusia day for me. > > Other suggestions submitted to me were rotanone (tomato dust) and > bleach (which apparently rapidly reduces oxygen). Anyone have any > experience with these? (neither sounds appealing to me. Alcohol is > still the likely option). > > I'll let you know how we go. In a nutshell, the waterway begins as > stormwater runoff, enters a pollution trap, goes into a sediment > pond then splits into two distinct (not joined) wetlands. Both > wetlands drain separately into saltwater mangroves. Gambusia can be > found in one of the two wetlands, and no-where else. At the head of > those wetlands is a small waterhole with hundreds of them. At > present, due to drought conditions, the waterhole is self contained. > If we get good rain, those hundreds of Gambusia would likely spread > downstream straight into the wetlands (where there are already > some). To try and further discourage the possibility of the Gambusia > heading upstream into the sediment pond, we plan to clear the > waterhole then monitor all parts of the system. > > Bedtime now here in Sydney, but I'll check for replies in the > morning before I head off. > > Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14725	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: von rio tetra

Linda, Glad to see you've found some of these Flame Tetras, and with good color. You may be pleased to know that get much bigger than the dime size you have, and larger than the info you've been able to come up with. I use to have these and breed them years ago, and so, know how large they can get. Perhaps your references are merely stating the average size you can expect to find them at. I, too, have seen similar misleading information and can't figure the reasoning. Just went up to Google and briefly looked around -- came up with a number of sites indicating their correct size. Try these following, entering them into Search (not Web Address): \ mongabay.com/characins \ mojo/fishnet/characins/flame tetra \ netpets.org fish identification characins \ aquaticcommunity.com/encyclopedia-189 \ aquariacentral.com/species/characins \ I remember coming across their description, including their size, in books as well, Just can't remember where right now. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > > In a message dated 8/19/2005 5:48:41 A.M. Central Standard Time, > sevenspringss@w... writes: > > Flame Tetras get to be about 2", or just slightly less than Serpae's or > Lemon Tetra's; certainly much longer than Neons > > > Any info I have found says that they only get 1-1.5 inches. The ones I > found have nice color and are currently about the size of a dime. > > Lindas > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14726	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Discus, ich, and high temps

AC, From what I've come to learn about Ich, the white spots you are seeing is a result of the reaction the fish has (like minor "skin boils") to the Ich, rather than the actual Ich cyst itself. The 3 tbs of salt per 5 gallons should be tolerated by your plants, which was another reason I mention not more than that amount. While the salt is not absolutely necessary, it usually helps. You should be able to effect a cure with just the heat, though, as you are doing. Hopefully, you may well be ahead of where you thought you were. One thing I neglected to mention, not knowing if you're using an ugf. If you are using one, they are known to effectively help eradicate the Ich, depending on the power involved (power heads or increase in air supply if that's the type you have). A stronger circulation of water down into the gravel helps prevent the new cysts from getting up into the water column to reinfect the fish. Keep us posted. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "aclaar877" <aclaar877@y...> wrote: > Ray, thanks. > > I do have 0 nitrites, as well as 0 nitrates. Most plants are doing > great, though maybe some nitrates will help the red ammania > gracillis I have. I'll keep the heat up, but probably won't do salt > because of the plants. Do you know if the white spots are the > parasites themselves, or reactions to the parasite? If there is a > delay between the parasite attaching itself and the appearance of a > spot, I may be ahead of where I thought I was as far as the ich > cycle is concerned. > > AC > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" > <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > To Whom it May Concern (no signature): Generally, Ich find it > > difficult to reproduce above 86 o. Occassionally, you might run > across > > a particularly virulent and resistant strain which may be able to > > endure temperatures up to 90 o. Their getting more spots may just > be a > > delayed reaction and once these cysts drop off they should not be > able > > to multiply very freely, if at all (unless its a resistant > strain). If > > the spots are still few, I would go with the heat treatment and > add no > > more than 1 tbs of salt per 5 gallons -- you have Tetras. Give it > 2 > > days if you can (if there's not a heavy infestation) and see what > it > > looks like by then. If you find that you're up against a more > virulent > > strain, you may need to move to a medication, but do not under any > > circumstances use a malachite green (or any other dye) based > > medication -- it will kill your scaleless Loaches. So keep the > > temperature up and keep an eye on things. And, I hope you meant a > > reading of 0 for your nitrItes. > Ray > > > \ > - > > -- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "aclaar877" <aclaar877@y...> > wrote: > > > Just added four discus to 155g planted tank on Sunday, and three > have > > > developed some ich spots. A few cardinals and both clown > loaches > > have > > > them as well. Temperature has never been below 86--I thought > ich > > > wouldn't spread at those temps? I now have the temp at about 88- > 89, > > > and the discus are getting even more spots. They are still > eating > > and > > > not yet scratching against things. Should I keep the > temperature > > high > > > and wait it out, or start the Quick-Cure malachite green > medication? > > > > > > Water quality is high, with 0 ammonia and 0 nitrates. > > > > > > I'd like to hear what any other discus owners have done in this > > > situation. I don't want to medicate if I don't have to, but > would > > > hate for the ich to rapidly spread and kill the fish quicker > than I > > > can react. Thanks.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14727	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Clown Loaches

Clown Loaches seem to be very susceptible to Ich. While they should be safe to purchase if treatment is complete, meaning that they would be Ich-free, I would wait unless you're in a real hurry for some reason. They obviously will be somewhat weakened, and your trip home with them may give them enough stress to set them back and contract Ich all over again, especially if they are at all allowed to be chilled enroute home. Wait it out an extra week or so. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "The Dragon Hunter" <dragon.hunter@d...> wrote: > Apparently a large supplier out here had some problems, as virtually every > LFS around me that has Clown loaches recieved them infected with Ich. They > are all treating them now - was wondering if it would be safe to actually > purchase them after their treatments are done or if I should wait

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14728	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Stress Coat

Thanks for posting the website/pic. This is a newer/different looking bottle from what I have. Glad to see that they now have it removing chloramine; sounds like they may have changed the formula. The now obviously older bottle is not advertised on the bottle to take care of that. I would have to assume that anyone still using an older bottle would have problems with chloramine if they didn't realize the difference. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, wendie <wendieo@o...> wrote: > I just happen to be using it now for two Betta tanks. > I stuck it up here... > > http://www.nashnutphoto.com/bettas/stresscoat.jpg > > Wendie > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Friday, August 19, 2005 11:34 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Stress Coat > > > Unless there's a brandy-new formula out there now, Stress Coat does > not remove chloramine as far as I'm aware. Have the box and bottle > right in front of me -- it says: "contains Aloe Vera" and "Removes > Chlorine and Replaces the Natural Slime Coating of Fish". Removing > chlorine is a lot different than removing chloramine. The latter > requires entirely different chemicals to break the ammonia - chlorine > bond. No where on the box or bottle does it say it removes > chloramine, at least not on my bottle which is fairly new. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, wendie <wendieo@o...> wrote: > > Yes, I also use stress coat. It neutralizes chloramines. I've > used it for > > months and prefer it over the others. > > I don't age the water either so it's added and sits perhaps 30 > minutes and > > then the fish are introduced without a problem. > > Wendie > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On > > Behalf Of minnesotagal866 > > Sent: Friday, August 19, 2005 9:44 AM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Stress Coat > > > > > > I just bought some stress coat, on the bottle it says that it > takes > > care of chloramines as well as chlorine. Don't have it in front > of me > > for exact wording (it's at school for the classroom). Anyone have > a > > newish bottle to confirm? > > Jackie > > > > > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, > thanks. > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to > > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > the SUBJECT > > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------- ---- > -------- > > -- > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > > > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > > Service. > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------- ---- > -------- > > -- > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- -------- > -- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service. > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- -------- > -- > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14729	From: Leslie	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Maracyn cloudy water?

My tank is very cloudy today. I'm using Maracyn 2 tabs is the only thing different in routine. Is this clouding the water or should I be looking for another cause? I've not used this med before so I don't know what to expect. Thanks, Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14730	From: wendie	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Stress Coat

I've been using it for well over a year now but think that the look of the bottle changed a few months back. I vaguely remember thinking there was something different about it then and thought it wasn't the same stuff!! It was thou. I had tried a combination of treatments but didn't like the reaction of the bettas. They seemed to be better when I used the stress coat for the numerous water changes. I tried the other stuff for about a month and then switched back. Wendie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Friday, August 19, 2005 2:45 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Stress Coat Thanks for posting the website/pic. This is a newer/different looking bottle from what I have. Glad to see that they now have it removing chloramine; sounds like they may have changed the formula. The now obviously older bottle is not advertised on the bottle to take care of that. I would have to assume that anyone still using an older bottle would have problems with chloramine if they didn't realize the difference. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, wendie <wendieo@o...> wrote: > I just happen to be using it now for two Betta tanks. > I stuck it up here... > > http://www.nashnutphoto.com/bettas/stresscoat.jpg > > Wendie > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Friday, August 19, 2005 11:34 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Stress Coat > > > Unless there's a brandy-new formula out there now, Stress Coat does > not remove chloramine as far as I'm aware. Have the box and bottle > right in front of me -- it says: "contains Aloe Vera" and "Removes > Chlorine and Replaces the Natural Slime Coating of Fish". Removing > chlorine is a lot different than removing chloramine. The latter > requires entirely different chemicals to break the ammonia - chlorine > bond. No where on the box or bottle does it say it removes > chloramine, at least not on my bottle which is fairly new. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, wendie <wendieo@o...> wrote: > > Yes, I also use stress coat. It neutralizes chloramines. I've > used it for > > months and prefer it over the others. > > I don't age the water either so it's added and sits perhaps 30 > minutes and > > then the fish are introduced without a problem. > > Wendie > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On > > Behalf Of minnesotagal866 > > Sent: Friday, August 19, 2005 9:44 AM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Stress Coat > > > > > > I just bought some stress coat, on the bottle it says that it > takes > > care of chloramines as well as chlorine. Don't have it in front > of me > > for exact wording (it's at school for the classroom). Anyone have > a > > newish bottle to confirm? > > Jackie > > > > > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, > thanks. > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to > > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > the SUBJECT > > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------- ---- > -------- > > -- > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > > > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > > Service. > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------- ---- > -------- > > -- > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- -------- > -- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service. > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- -------- > -- > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14731	From: Leslie	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Maracyn cloudy water?

Well.... I now see that there are tons of eesny white particles floating around everywhere. The glass is covered in it. It's like a loose white fuzz. On the rocks, the glass, everything. When I use the magnetic cleaner along the sides, it does come off and you can see it waving with the water motion. Is this bad? I don't see it how it can't be. =( Leslie Subject: [AquaticLife] Maracyn cloudy water? My tank is very cloudy today. I'm using Maracyn 2 tabs is the only thing different in routine. Is this clouding the water or should I be looking for another cause? I've not used this med before so I don't know what to expect. Thanks, Leslie

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14732	From: Phil	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Oscar eggs!

Hey! I dont think they were fertilized or the parents ate them cause there are only a few eggs left.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14733	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Stress Coat

In a message dated 8/19/2005 2:45:48 P.M. Central Standard Time, sevenspringss@... writes: Glad to see that they now have it removing chloramine; sounds like they may have changed the formula. The now obviously older bottle is not advertised The bottle doesn't say it removes chloramines, it says "neutralizes chloramines" does that mean the same thing? I also went to the website and it says "removes chlorine and chloramines". Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14734	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Stress Coat

Hi Ray, Stress Coat does neutralise chloramine and chlorine it's primary purpose, the aloe vera/slime coat is secondary. You must have some very old stock!. You can confirm this at http://www.aquariumpharm.com as you know the manufacturers. regards, unclenorm. --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote: > Unless there's a brandy-new formula out there now, > Stress Coat does > not remove chloramine as far as I'm aware. Have the > box and bottle > right in front of me -- it says: "contains Aloe > Vera" and "Removes > Chlorine and Replaces the Natural Slime Coating of > Fish". Removing > chlorine is a lot different than removing > chloramine. The latter > requires entirely different chemicals to break the > ammonia - chlorine > bond. No where on the box or bottle does it say it > removes > chloramine, at least not on my bottle which is > fairly new. Ray > \ > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, wendie > <wendieo@o...> wrote: > > Yes, I also use stress coat. It neutralizes > chloramines. I've > used it for > > months and prefer it over the others. > > I don't age the water either so it's added and > sits perhaps 30 > minutes and > > then the fish are introduced without a problem. > > Wendie > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On > > Behalf Of minnesotagal866 > > Sent: Friday, August 19, 2005 9:44 AM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Stress Coat > > > > > > I just bought some stress coat, on the bottle it > says that it > takes > > care of chloramines as well as chlorine. Don't > have it in front > of me > > for exact wording (it's at school for the > classroom). Anyone have > a > > newish bottle to confirm? > > Jackie > > > > > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it > when replying, > thanks. > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all > TEXT that is NOT > important to > > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY > the SUBJECT > > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" > <- > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology > > > > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > -------- > > -- > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the > web. > > > > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an > email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to > the Yahoo! Terms of > > Service. > > > > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > -------- > > -- > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > ___________________________________________________________ How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14735	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Gambusia day

Hi Rob, Apparently it 'no longer exists' has been shut down for the reasons my security protection stated! regards, unclenorm. --- FortWayneFish@... wrote: > hey Norm try > > http://www.fishnet/forums/viewtopic.php?%3E%20topic=28912&forum=2&view_post_id > =258450 > > its the same link just with the sight name not > domain numbers used. > when i try accessing the link Fishnet says the > thread no longer exists. > > Rob > NE Indiana > USA > > > In a message dated 8/19/2005 9:53:17 AM US Eastern > Standard Time, Looks like > I found my own answer for anyone > > interested... also talks > > about electrofishing and hand collection, but in > the > > context of trout. > > Australian info though: > > > > http://202.45.103.18/forums/viewtopic.php? > > topic=28912&forum=2&view_post_id=258450 > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ___________________________________________________________ To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. http://uk.security.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14736	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Stress Coat

Different brand maybe? Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Friday, August 19, 2005 11:34 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Stress Coat Unless there's a brandy-new formula out there now, Stress Coat does not remove chloramine as far as I'm aware. Have the box and bottle right in front of me -- it says: "contains Aloe Vera" and "Removes Chlorine and Replaces the Natural Slime Coating of Fish". Removing chlorine is a lot different than removing chloramine. The latter requires entirely different chemicals to break the ammonia - chlorine bond. No where on the box or bottle does it say it removes chloramine, at least not on my bottle which is fairly new. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, wendie <wendieo@o...> wrote: > Yes, I also use stress coat. It neutralizes chloramines. I've used it for > months and prefer it over the others. > I don't age the water either so it's added and sits perhaps 30 minutes and > then the fish are introduced without a problem. > Wendie > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On > Behalf Of minnesotagal866 > Sent: Friday, August 19, 2005 9:44 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Stress Coat > > > I just bought some stress coat, on the bottle it says that it takes > care of chloramines as well as chlorine. Don't have it in front of me > for exact wording (it's at school for the classroom). Anyone have a > newish bottle to confirm? > Jackie > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- -------- > -- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service. > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- -------- > -- > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14737	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: What have I done !?????????

you might want to add some biozyme or biospira to give the cycle a bit of kick in the behind. The cloudiness is prolly a bacterial or algal bloom do to the high ammonia and nitrite levels. IF no more fish are dying, I would leave it alone (other than adding the above) and let it cycle. The water changes could also slow the cycling down or even cause it to restart if all of the chlorine/chloramines is not removed first. You may also have nitrites/nitrates in your water that just adds to it. Test your tap water as well. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Erin Cunningham Sent: Friday, August 19, 2005 6:26 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] What have I done !????????? I did a 20-25% water change yesterday.. put stress coat in and filled the tank back up... went out got an ammonia quick test thing and came home... Checked it all out.. pH, ammonia,nitrite and nitrate... all fine - safe!!! Watched fish swim about last night... woke up this AM and I couldn't see a bloody thing!!! And this horrible smell! Checked again... TOO much ammonia and TOO much nitrite!!! I changed the water 50% and scooped out all my dead fish... put in ACE.. filled her back up... 30min. later check water: more fish dead (scooped these out), tested water levels: Bit higher than usual, but bordering safe/stress... add safe coat.. still have fish at the top except for 2 Blue Gouramis who seem to be enjoying the atmosphere! WTF!!!!!!!! And the smell is still there.. what is that from??? Erin Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14738	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Discus, ich, and high temps/ to AC

Hi AC, Here are some links about Ich (Ick), you will find all the information you need to overcome your problem, :- http://www.fishdoc.co.uk/disease/whitespot.htm http://fishorbust.net/ich.html http://www.nunnie.com/ick.html http://badmanstropicalfish.com/meds/ick.html regards, unclenorm --- aclaar877 <aclaar877@...> wrote: > Ray, thanks. > > I do have 0 nitrites, as well as 0 nitrates. Most > plants are doing > great, though maybe some nitrates will help the red > ammania > gracillis I have. I'll keep the heat up, but > probably won't do salt > because of the plants. Do you know if the white > spots are the > parasites themselves, or reactions to the parasite? > If there is a > delay between the parasite attaching itself and the > appearance of a > spot, I may be ahead of where I thought I was as far > as the ich > cycle is concerned. > > AC > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" > <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > To Whom it May Concern (no signature): > Generally, Ich find it > > difficult to reproduce above 86 o. Occassionally, > you might run > across > > a particularly virulent and resistant strain which > may be able to > > endure temperatures up to 90 o. Their getting > more spots may just > be a > > delayed reaction and once these cysts drop off > they should not be > able > > to multiply very freely, if at all (unless its a > resistant > strain). If > > the spots are still few, I would go with the heat > treatment and > add no > > more than 1 tbs of salt per 5 gallons -- you have > Tetras. Give it > 2 > > days if you can (if there's not a heavy > infestation) and see what > it > > looks like by then. If you find that you're up > against a more > virulent > > strain, you may need to move to a medication, but > do not under any > > circumstances use a malachite green (or any other > dye) based > > medication -- it will kill your scaleless Loaches. > So keep the > > temperature up and keep an eye on things. And, I > hope you meant a > > reading of 0 for your nitrItes. > Ray > > > \ > > - > > -- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "aclaar877" > <aclaar877@y...> > wrote: > > > Just added four discus to 155g planted tank on > Sunday, and three > have > > > developed some ich spots. A few cardinals and > both clown > loaches > > have > > > them as well. Temperature has never been below > 86--I thought > ich > > > wouldn't spread at those temps? I now have the > temp at about 88- > 89, > > > and the discus are getting even more spots. > They are still > eating > > and > > > not yet scratching against things. Should I > keep the > temperature > > high > > > and wait it out, or start the Quick-Cure > malachite green > medication? > > > > > > Water quality is high, with 0 ammonia and 0 > nitrates. > > > > > > I'd like to hear what any other discus owners > have done in this > > > situation. I don't want to medicate if I don't > have to, but > would > > > hate for the ich to rapidly spread and kill the > fish quicker > than I > > > can react. Thanks. > > > ___________________________________________________________ To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. http://uk.security.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14739	From: Chris	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Gambusia day

hmm, very strange. it might be because the URL begins with an ip address (all the numbers) - also, you probably know this already, but the address wraps to two lines. when i searched with google i couldn't access that page directly, but rather google's cache - then from there i clicked a link (the one i pasted) - but i could see it fine. Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14740	From: Chris	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Gambusia day

hmm.. i can still get the page. anyway, here's the main posting. the rest of the thread consists of people questioning the logic, etc... (some of it intelligent) Quote: On 18-01-2005 13:00, 1tina wrote: can some-one please explain what is going with this and the trout, and why they are trying erradicate them? The current debate appears to have been started when someone in the Australian Trout Foundation read some old action statement from the mid 1990s relating to then planned use of rotenone to remove trout from a number of small streams. These plans were misinterpreted these as being current proposals (the plans had actually been implemented not long after they were published). The relevent action was to protect an endangered native fish, the barred galaxias, and an endangered native frog, the spotted tree frog. Much noise has ensued. However a few facts about rotenone may be pertinent here. Rotenone is a naturally occuring plant extract found in a widely distributed group of plants world wide. Rotenone has been used in agriculture as an insecticide (known as derris dust) for at least 400 years. Rotenone has been used by native people including aboriginal people to kill fish for food for thousands of years. Rotenone degrades rapidly in the environment and in the doses used in Australia, even if not neutralised, has been totally broken down within 24 hours. Rotenone works by preventing the exchange of oxygen and non-target fish can usually be revived by simply placing them in un treated water if using the chemical in an area where species other than trout are present. No one is proposing to use Rotenone to erradicate trout. It is only being suggested that its use be retained as a tool to be used when it is necessary to remove trout from a particular section of a stream, and then only in small streams for the most part inaccessible. Rotenone is ideal for this use because trout are particularly sensistive to it and thus low doses can be used minimising the impact on other species whilst still allowing total removal of trout from the target area. The ATF has made much of a study linking Rotenone to parkinsons disease like symptoms in laboratory animals. However the full experiment showed that the symptoms only occurred in animals given massive doses intraveniously, others given rotenone containing food and water did not exhibit any adverse symptoms. Rotenone is easily neutralised by introducing Potassium permangenate at the bottom of the treated section, this is the normal practice in Australia. No other method is capable of totally removing all individuals of a fish population from a designated section of water. Claims that electro fishing or hand removal are appropriate substitutes (when complete removal is required) are incorrect. At best extensive electro-fishing will remove only about 40% of a population. Hand removal is so ineffective it astonishes me that anyone would seriously suggest it. Nick

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14741	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Gambusia day

Hi Chris, Re the web site in question, I'm now told that it is closed down because it spread viruses, worms etc. I'm very conversant with Rotenone, it was used extensively in the UK and especialy Ireland about thirty years ago to clear trout fisherys of course fish in which I had some involvement, it was very effective. regards, unclenorm. --- Chris <youcantryreachingme@...> wrote: > hmm.. i can still get the page. anyway, here's the > main posting. the > rest of the thread consists of people questioning > the logic, etc... > (some of it intelligent) > > Quote: > > On 18-01-2005 13:00, 1tina wrote: > can some-one please explain what is going with this > and the trout, > and why they are trying erradicate them? > > > > The current debate appears to have been started when > someone in the > Australian Trout Foundation read some old action > statement from the > mid 1990s relating to then planned use of rotenone > to remove trout > from a number of small streams. These plans were > misinterpreted > these as being current proposals (the plans had > actually been > implemented not long after they were published). The > relevent action > was to protect an endangered native fish, the barred > galaxias, and > an endangered native frog, the spotted tree frog. > > Much noise has ensued. However a few facts about > rotenone may be > pertinent here. > > Rotenone is a naturally occuring plant extract found > in a widely > distributed group of plants world wide. > > Rotenone has been used in agriculture as an > insecticide (known as > derris dust) for at least 400 years. > > Rotenone has been used by native people including > aboriginal people > to kill fish for food for thousands of years. > > Rotenone degrades rapidly in the environment and in > the doses used > in Australia, even if not neutralised, has been > totally broken down > within 24 hours. > > Rotenone works by preventing the exchange of oxygen > and non-target > fish can usually be revived by simply placing them > in un treated > water if using the chemical in an area where species > other than > trout are present. > > No one is proposing to use Rotenone to erradicate > trout. It is only > being suggested that its use be retained as a tool > to be used when > it is necessary to remove trout from a particular > section of a > stream, and then only in small streams for the most > part > inaccessible. > > Rotenone is ideal for this use because trout are > particularly > sensistive to it and thus low doses can be used > minimising the > impact on other species whilst still allowing total > removal of trout > from the target area. > > The ATF has made much of a study linking Rotenone to > parkinsons > disease like symptoms in laboratory animals. However > the full > experiment showed that the symptoms only occurred in > animals given > massive doses intraveniously, others given rotenone > containing food > and water did not exhibit any adverse symptoms. > > Rotenone is easily neutralised by introducing > Potassium permangenate > at the bottom of the treated section, this is the > normal practice in > Australia. > > No other method is capable of totally removing all > individuals of a > fish population from a designated section of water. > Claims that > electro fishing or hand removal are appropriate > substitutes (when > complete removal is required) are incorrect. At best > extensive > electro-fishing will remove only about 40% of a > population. Hand > removal is so ineffective it astonishes me that > anyone would > seriously suggest it. > > Nick > > > > ___________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14742	From: Bruce Hansen	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Gambusia day

Chris I suggest you consider a 2 stage process - initial anaesthesia with clove oil (which is cheap) and then into the alcohol for "capital" punishment. Cheers Bruce (Hansen) ANGFA (Qld) Inc - http://www.angfaqld.org.au/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chris" <youcantryreachingme@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Saturday, August 20, 2005 12:03 AM Subject: [AquaticLife] Gambusia day Looks like tomorrow is the Gambusia day for me. Other suggestions submitted to me were rotanone (tomato dust) and bleach (which apparently rapidly reduces oxygen). Anyone have any experience with these? (neither sounds appealing to me. Alcohol is still the likely option). I'll let you know how we go. In a nutshell, the waterway begins as stormwater runoff, enters a pollution trap, goes into a sediment pond then splits into two distinct (not joined) wetlands. Both wetlands drain separately into saltwater mangroves. Gambusia can be found in one of the two wetlands, and no-where else. At the head of those wetlands is a small waterhole with hundreds of them. At present, due to drought conditions, the waterhole is self contained. If we get good rain, those hundreds of Gambusia would likely spread downstream straight into the wetlands (where there are already some). To try and further discourage the possibility of the Gambusia heading upstream into the sediment pond, we plan to clear the waterhole then monitor all parts of the system. Bedtime now here in Sydney, but I'll check for replies in the morning before I head off. Chris. Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14743	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/19/2005
Subject: Re: Clown Loaches

I agree with Ray. If you can wait --wait at least a week. After that time watch the tank for a few minutes, and try and find the healthiest looking fish. if the sides appear to be lightly sunken in, or the eyes are withdrawn skip the fish. I have never really seen that many successful treatments fo ich on clown loaches. Not saying some people havn't been successful but from what I have seen most loaches end up perishing from the treatments or other complications usually associated with the treatments. We have a couple( 3 ) small 5 inch clown loaches and I have successfully given them salt baths, but this takes a lot of time and patience from the hobbyist. At one time i did have over 10 clown loaches... so 3/10 not very good odds.... of course it could just be me. I'm really really not patient. Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 8/19/2005 2:32:47 PM US Eastern Standard Time, sevenspringss@... writes: Clown Loaches seem to be very susceptible to Ich. While they should be safe to purchase if treatment is complete, meaning that they would be Ich-free, I would wait unless you're in a real hurry for some reason. They obviously will be somewhat weakened, and your trip home with them may give them enough stress to set them back and contract Ich all over again, especially if they are at all allowed to be chilled enroute home. Wait it out an extra week or so. Ray \ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14744	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Re: Gambusia day (now Fishnet.com link)

That URL is missing the .com or .net behind fishnet so it would never work but I did add the .com and got it to go to the main site http://www.fishnet.com but never could get the full URL to work. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: 18 Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2005 02:10:36 +0100 (BST) From: "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> Subject: Re: Re: Gambusia day Hi Rob, Apparently it 'no longer exists' has been shut down for the reasons my security protection stated! regards, unclenorm. --- FortWayneFish@... wrote: > hey Norm try > > http://www.fishnet/forums/viewtopic.php?%3E%20topic=28912&forum=2&view_post_id > =258450 > > its the same link just with the sight name not > domain numbers used. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14745	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Re: Discus, ich, and high temps/ to AC

Hi Norman, Just went up to these 4 sites you mentioned, out of curiousity. Looks like there's some good information there that may not have been known to our newcomers. One thing I did notice, there doesn't seem to be anything there that would inform AC of how to proceed with his treatment of Ich as the last two sites recommend treatment by medication (only), which AC prefers not to do. The third site even refers to Quick-Cure and Rid-Ich (both I believe containing malachite green) which should not be used with Clown Loaches, but something AC fortunately already realizes. The first site recommends raising the temperature up to 25 o C (77 o F) which may help Koi, but would be useless in treating tropicals. With the second site, I got the message "Can't Find Web Site". Don't know if that site still exists or maybe its just my server. Just thought I'd pass this along in case you haven't actually read these sites. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > Hi AC, > Here are some links about Ich (Ick), you will > find all the information you need to overcome your > problem, :- > > > http://www.fishdoc.co.uk/disease/whitespot.htm > > http://fishorbust.net/ich.html > > http://www.nunnie.com/ick.html > > http://badmanstropicalfish.com/meds/ick.html > > regards, > unclenorm > > > --- aclaar877 <aclaar877@y...> wrote: > > > Ray, thanks. > > > > I do have 0 nitrites, as well as 0 nitrates. Most > > plants are doing > > great, though maybe some nitrates will help the red > > ammania > > gracillis I have. I'll keep the heat up, but > > probably won't do salt > > because of the plants. Do you know if the white > > spots are the > > parasites themselves, or reactions to the parasite? > > If there is a > > delay between the parasite attaching itself and the > > appearance of a > > spot, I may be ahead of where I thought I was as far > > as the ich > > cycle is concerned. > > > > AC > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" > > <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > To Whom it May Concern (no signature): > > Generally, Ich find it > > > difficult to reproduce above 86 o. Occassionally, > > you might run > > across > > > a particularly virulent and resistant strain which > > may be able to > > > endure temperatures up to 90 o. Their getting > > more spots may just > > be a > > > delayed reaction and once these cysts drop off > > they should not be > > able > > > to multiply very freely, if at all (unless its a > > resistant > > strain). If > > > the spots are still few, I would go with the heat > > treatment and > > add no > > > more than 1 tbs of salt per 5 gallons -- you have > > Tetras. Give it > > 2 > > > days if you can (if there's not a heavy > > infestation) and see what > > it > > > looks like by then. If you find that you're up > > against a more > > virulent > > > strain, you may need to move to a medication, but > > do not under any > > > circumstances use a malachite green (or any other > > dye) based > > > medication -- it will kill your scaleless Loaches. > > So keep the > > > temperature up and keep an eye on things. And, I > > hope you meant a > > > reading of 0 for your nitrItes. > > Ray > > > > > \ > > > > - > > > -- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "aclaar877" > > <aclaar877@y...> > > wrote: > > > > Just added four discus to 155g planted tank on > > Sunday, and three > > have > > > > developed some ich spots. A few cardinals and > > both clown > > loaches > > > have > > > > them as well. Temperature has never been below > > 86--I thought > > ich > > > > wouldn't spread at those temps? I now have the > > temp at about 88- > > 89, > > > > and the discus are getting even more spots. > > They are still > > eating > > > and > > > > not yet scratching against things. Should I > > keep the > > temperature > > > high > > > > and wait it out, or start the Quick-Cure > > malachite green > > medication? > > > > > > > > Water quality is high, with 0 ammonia and 0 > > nitrates. > > > > > > > > I'd like to hear what any other discus owners > > have done in this > > > > situation. I don't want to medicate if I don't > > have to, but > > would > > > > hate for the ich to rapidly spread and kill the > > fish quicker > > than I > > > > can react. Thanks. > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. http://uk.security.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14746	From: minnesotagal866	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Re: Stress Coat

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, wendie <wendieo@o...> wrote: > I just happen to be using it now for two Betta tanks. > I stuck it up here... > > http://www.nashnutphoto.com/bettas/stresscoat.jpg > > Thanks for posting and confirming that. The last 2 bottles I've bought have specifically said "neutralizes chloramines" and I couldn't understand why everyone kept saying it didn't. Thought maybe I was going crazy in my old age . . . <smile>

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14747	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Re: Stress Coat

Hi Norm, Yeah, I gather that from reading Wendie's last couple of posts, that the Stress Coat now takes care of both things. That's a bit of good news. Although my bottle is only a few months old, after going to Wendie's post with the picture link I see they've since come out with this latest formula (and new bottle). As I believe I mentioned, my bottle says nothing about chloramines but just says it removes chlorine (which is not the same thing as removing or neutralizing both). Regards, Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > Hi Ray, > Stress Coat does neutralise chloramine and > chlorine it's primary purpose, the aloe vera/slime > coat is secondary. You must have some very old stock!. > You can confirm this at http://www.aquariumpharm.com > as you know the manufacturers. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > Unless there's a brandy-new formula out there now, > > Stress Coat does > > not remove chloramine as far as I'm aware. Have the > > box and bottle > > right in front of me -- it says: "contains Aloe > > Vera" and "Removes > > Chlorine and Replaces the Natural Slime Coating of > > Fish". Removing > > chlorine is a lot different than removing > > chloramine. The latter > > requires entirely different chemicals to break the > > ammonia - chlorine > > bond. No where on the box or bottle does it say it > > removes > > chloramine, at least not on my bottle which is > > fairly new. Ray > > \ > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, wendie > > <wendieo@o...> wrote: > > > Yes, I also use stress coat. It neutralizes > > chloramines. I've > > used it for > > > months and prefer it over the others. > > > I don't age the water either so it's added and > > sits perhaps 30 > > minutes and > > > then the fish are introduced without a problem. > > > Wendie > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On > > > Behalf Of minnesotagal866 > > > Sent: Friday, August 19, 2005 9:44 AM > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Stress Coat > > > > > > > > > I just bought some stress coat, on the bottle it > > says that it > > takes > > > care of chloramines as well as chlorine. Don't > > have it in front > > of me > > > for exact wording (it's at school for the > > classroom). Anyone have > > a > > > newish bottle to confirm? > > > Jackie > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it > > when replying, > > thanks. > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > ((((º> > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all > > TEXT that is NOT > > important to > > > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > > message MODIFY > > the SUBJECT > > > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" > > <- > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > > .·´¯`·..<º > > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > > matter. > > > > > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology > > > > > > > > > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > > -------- > > > -- > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the > > web. > > > > > > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an > > email to: > > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > > > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to > > the Yahoo! Terms of > > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > > -------- > > > -- > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday > snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14748	From: wendie	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Re: Stress Coat

I use a ton of the stuff. With 10 betta tanks that need changing all the time I found this to be the best. I draw the water, add the stress coat, wait 30 minutes and use it. Use it in the breeding tank and the new water for the fry without a problem. Probably never would have used it if I hadn't seen the kid at the fish store turn on the tap, add water to the bag, pop in a fish and then add a couple of squirts of stress coat. I like to had a heart attack but his words were "no problem, I love this stuff - he'll be fine - works like a charm".... I bought some then. Wendie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of minnesotagal866 Sent: Saturday, August 20, 2005 6:26 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Stress Coat --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, wendie <wendieo@o...> wrote: > I just happen to be using it now for two Betta tanks. > I stuck it up here... > > http://www.nashnutphoto.com/bettas/stresscoat.jpg > > Thanks for posting and confirming that. The last 2 bottles I've bought have specifically said "neutralizes chloramines" and I couldn't understand why everyone kept saying it didn't. Thought maybe I was going crazy in my old age . . . <smile> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14749	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Re: Stress Coat

Wow, if I saw that at a store and the fish was fine, I would be convinced, too!! I tend to do what you do but I use Prime. I fill my buckets with water (same pH and temp as the tank), add the Prime, let it sit for a few minutes, then start cleaning the tank -- trimming plants, cleaning the glass, cleaning the gravel, etc. Then I add in the new water. Seems to work well for my fish. I was kind of startled when I first started using Prime because it requires such a *tiny* amount compared to what I was using before! Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, wendie <wendieo@o...> wrote: > I use a ton of the stuff. With 10 betta tanks that need changing all the > time I found this to be > the best. I draw the water, add the stress coat, wait 30 minutes and use > it. Use it in the > breeding tank and the new water for the fry without a problem. > > Probably never would have used it if I hadn't seen the kid at the fish > store turn on the tap, > add water to the bag, pop in a fish and then add a couple of squirts of > stress coat. I like to > had a heart attack but his words were "no problem, I love this stuff - > he'll be fine - works like > a charm".... I bought some then. > Wendie > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On > Behalf Of minnesotagal866 > Sent: Saturday, August 20, 2005 6:26 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Stress Coat > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, wendie <wendieo@o...> wrote: > > I just happen to be using it now for two Betta tanks. > > I stuck it up here... > > > > http://www.nashnutphoto.com/bettas/stresscoat.jpg > > > > > Thanks for posting and confirming that. The last 2 bottles I've bought > have specifically said "neutralizes chloramines" and I couldn't > understand why everyone kept saying it didn't. Thought maybe I was > going crazy in my old age . . . <smile> > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14750	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Re: Discus, ich, and high temps/ to AC

Hi Ray, I've said many times fish with problems should be treated in quarantein, Any container big enough will do. There are dozens more such sites to be found on the net. regards, unclenorm. --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote: > Hi Norman, Just went up to these 4 sites you > mentioned, out of > curiousity. Looks like there's some good > information there that may > not have been known to our newcomers. One thing I > did notice, there > doesn't seem to be anything there that would inform > AC of how to > proceed with his treatment of Ich as the last two > sites recommend > treatment by medication (only), which AC prefers not > to do. The third > site even refers to Quick-Cure and Rid-Ich (both I > believe containing > malachite green) which should not be used with Clown > Loaches, but > something AC fortunately already realizes. The > first site recommends > raising the temperature up to 25 o C (77 o F) which > may help Koi, but > would be useless in treating tropicals. With the > second site, I got > the message "Can't Find Web Site". Don't know if > that site still > exists or maybe its just my server. Just thought > I'd pass this along > in case you haven't actually read these sites. Ray > > \ > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. > Hampson." > <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > Hi AC, > > Here are some links about Ich (Ick), you > will > > find all the information you need to overcome your > > problem, :- > > > > > > http://www.fishdoc.co.uk/disease/whitespot.htm > > > > http://fishorbust.net/ich.html > > > > http://www.nunnie.com/ick.html > > > > http://badmanstropicalfish.com/meds/ick.html > > > > regards, > > unclenorm > > > > > > --- aclaar877 <aclaar877@y...> wrote: > > > > > Ray, thanks. > > > > > > I do have 0 nitrites, as well as 0 nitrates. > Most > > > plants are doing > > > great, though maybe some nitrates will help the > red > > > ammania > > > gracillis I have. I'll keep the heat up, but > > > probably won't do salt > > > because of the plants. Do you know if the white > > > spots are the > > > parasites themselves, or reactions to the > parasite? > > > If there is a > > > delay between the parasite attaching itself and > the > > > appearance of a > > > spot, I may be ahead of where I thought I was as > far > > > as the ich > > > cycle is concerned. > > > > > > AC > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" > > > > <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > > To Whom it May Concern (no signature): > > > Generally, Ich find it > > > > difficult to reproduce above 86 o. > Occassionally, > > > you might run > > > across > > > > a particularly virulent and resistant strain > which > > > may be able to > > > > endure temperatures up to 90 o. Their getting > > > more spots may just > > > be a > > > > delayed reaction and once these cysts drop off > > > they should not be > > > able > > > > to multiply very freely, if at all (unless its > a > > > resistant > > > strain). If > > > > the spots are still few, I would go with the > heat > > > treatment and > > > add no > > > > more than 1 tbs of salt per 5 gallons -- you > have > > > Tetras. Give it > > > 2 > > > > days if you can (if there's not a heavy > > > infestation) and see what > > > it > > > > looks like by then. If you find that you're > up > > > against a more > > > virulent > > > > strain, you may need to move to a medication, > but > > > do not under any > > > > circumstances use a malachite green (or any > other > > > dye) based > > > > medication -- it will kill your scaleless > Loaches. > > > So keep the > > > > temperature up and keep an eye on things. > And, I > > > hope you meant a > > > > reading of 0 for your nitrItes. > > > Ray > > > > > > > \ > > > > > > > - > > > > -- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "aclaar877" > > > <aclaar877@y...> > > > wrote: > > > > > Just added four discus to 155g planted tank > on > > > Sunday, and three > > > have > > > > > developed some ich spots. A few cardinals > and > > > both clown > > > loaches > > > > have > > > > > them as well. Temperature has never been > below > > > 86--I thought > > > ich > > > > > wouldn't spread at those temps? I now have > the > > > temp at about 88- > > > 89, > > > > > and the discus are getting even more spots. > > > They are still > > > eating > > > > and > > > > > not yet scratching against things. Should I > > > keep the > > > temperature > > > > high > > > > > and wait it out, or start the Quick-Cure > > > malachite green > > > medication? > > > > > > > > > > Water quality is high, with 0 ammonia and 0 > > > nitrates. > > > > > > > > > > I'd like to hear what any other discus > owners > > > have done in this > > > > > situation. I don't want to medicate if I > don't > > > have to, but > > > would > > > > > hate for the ich to rapidly spread and kill > the > > > fish quicker > > > than I > > > > > can react. Thanks. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > To help you stay safe and secure online, we've > developed the all > new Yahoo! Security Centre. > http://uk.security.yahoo.com > > > ___________________________________________________________ To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. http://uk.security.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14751	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: alagebra drop out question- lighting

What was the formula for figuring out watt/gallon again? tank size divided by ? equals ? I was thinking, instead of purchasing a whole new light system for my tank, it may be more economical and work just as good to just add another 40 watt strip light to my tank. Right now I have three 40 T10 lights for my 150 gallon, 30" tall tank. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14752	From: wendie	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Re: Stress Coat

LOL.... I always feel the same way!! Is that enough... is it really doing the job?? I think we're all the same. Wendie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of thesydmonster Sent: Saturday, August 20, 2005 9:28 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Stress Coat Wow, if I saw that at a store and the fish was fine, I would be convinced, too!! I tend to do what you do but I use Prime. I fill my buckets with water (same pH and temp as the tank), add the Prime, let it sit for a few minutes, then start cleaning the tank -- trimming plants, cleaning the glass, cleaning the gravel, etc. Then I add in the new water. Seems to work well for my fish. I was kind of startled when I first started using Prime because it requires such a *tiny* amount compared to what I was using before! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14753	From: deborahgd14	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Re: Update on Angie

Hi Ray: I will make the paste up today. She doesn't seem interested in eating now. I hate to see her starve to death but I feel I have done all I can for her. She is still in the corner. Yesterday I did the water change and added the tablet (for 10 gallon) in her five gallon. Maybe that made her feel worse. I will do the same tomorrow. Tomorrow will be the sixth dose. Poor little girl. Deborah D --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > That's a bit of good news. Just the fact that she ate something is > encouraging. Often, affected fish will come up to the surface and > look "funny" at the food (as you described), almost as if they're going > to eat, but not quite -- can be very frustrating. You may need to keep > mixing foods as you just did until she gets used to the Pepso food. In > the meantime it would be a good idea to make your own medicated flake > food as I previously described. You can even spread out the medicated > paste as a light smear on an old piece of glass. When it dries, it > will be the perfect thickness for a flake food, just crumble it > slightly. This way you'll be assured she's getting med into her. Ray > \

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14754	From: richard thompson	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Re: Stress Coat

are you sure their "tap " was not hooled into a large ro/di filter in the back? many store are wendie <wendieo@...> wrote: I use a ton of the stuff. With 10 betta tanks that need changing all the time I found this to be the best. I draw the water, add the stress coat, wait 30 minutes and use it. Use it in the breeding tank and the new water for the fry without a problem. Probably never would have used it if I hadn't seen the kid at the fish store turn on the tap, add water to the bag, pop in a fish and then add a couple of squirts of stress coat. I like to had a heart attack but his words were "no problem, I love this stuff - he'll be fine - works like a charm".... I bought some then. Wendie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of minnesotagal866 Sent: Saturday, August 20, 2005 6:26 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Stress Coat --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, wendie <wendieo@o...> wrote: > I just happen to be using it now for two Betta tanks. > I stuck it up here... > > http://www.nashnutphoto.com/bettas/stresscoat.jpg > > Thanks for posting and confirming that. The last 2 bottles I've bought have specifically said "neutralizes chloramines" and I couldn't understand why everyone kept saying it didn't. Thought maybe I was going crazy in my old age . . . <smile> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14755	From: richard thompson	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Re: Stress Coat

teh new formula is not yet available everywhere. it has just started coming into circulation at most lfs. prior to this month it neutralized heavy metals such as copper and had the slime coat bennefit as well. Hi Ray, Stress Coat does neutralise chloramine and chlorine it's primary purpose, the aloe vera/slime coat is secondary. You must have some very old stock!. You can confirm this at http://www.aquariumpharm.com as you know the manufacturers. regards, unclenorm. --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote: > Unless there's a brandy-new formula out there now, > Stress Coat does > not remove chloramine as far as I'm aware. Have the > box and bottle > right in front of me -- it says: "contains Aloe > Vera" and "Removes > Chlorine and Replaces the Natural Slime Coating of > Fish". Removing > chlorine is a lot different than removing > chloramine. The latter > requires entirely different chemicals to break the > ammonia - chlorine > bond. No where on the box or bottle does it say it > removes > chloramine, at least not on my bottle which is > fairly new. Ray > \ > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, wendie > <wendieo@o...> wrote: > > Yes, I also use stress coat. It neutralizes > chloramines. I've > used it for > > months and prefer it over the others. > > I don't age the water either so it's added and > sits perhaps 30 > minutes and > > then the fish are introduced without a problem. > > Wendie > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On > > Behalf Of minnesotagal866 > > Sent: Friday, August 19, 2005 9:44 AM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Stress Coat > > > > > > I just bought some stress coat, on the bottle it > says that it > takes > > care of chloramines as well as chlorine. Don't > have it in front > of me > > for exact wording (it's at school for the > classroom). Anyone have > a > > newish bottle to confirm? > > Jackie > > > > > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it > when replying, > thanks. > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all > TEXT that is NOT > important to > > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY > the SUBJECT > > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" > <- > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology > > > > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > -------- > > -- > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the > web. > > > > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an > email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to > the Yahoo! Terms of > > Service. > > > > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > -------- > > -- > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > ___________________________________________________________ How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Find what you need with new enhanced search. Learn more. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14756	From: wendie	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Re: Stress Coat

I asked him about the water. Regular street water. Same as in the house. Wendie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of richard thompson Sent: Saturday, August 20, 2005 1:52 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Stress Coat are you sure their "tap " was not hooled into a large ro/di filter in the back? many store are wendie <wendieo@...> wrote: I use a ton of the stuff. With 10 betta tanks that need changing all the time I found this to be the best. I draw the water, add the stress coat, wait 30 minutes and use it. Use it in the breeding tank and the new water for the fry without a problem. Probably never would have used it if I hadn't seen the kid at the fish store turn on the tap, add water to the bag, pop in a fish and then add a couple of squirts of stress coat. I like to had a heart attack but his words were "no problem, I love this stuff - he'll be fine - works like a charm".... I bought some then. Wendie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of minnesotagal866 Sent: Saturday, August 20, 2005 6:26 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Stress Coat --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, wendie <wendieo@o...> wrote: > I just happen to be using it now for two Betta tanks. > I stuck it up here... > > http://www.nashnutphoto.com/bettas/stresscoat.jpg > > Thanks for posting and confirming that. The last 2 bottles I've bought have specifically said "neutralizes chloramines" and I couldn't understand why everyone kept saying it didn't. Thought maybe I was going crazy in my old age . . . <smile> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14757	From: richard thompson	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Re: Newbie w/question(s)

what do you mean by evrything was inline? what was your ammonia reading? what was your nitrite reading? nitrate reading? ph reading? what is the temperature of the tank? yes it was way too many fish. for a fishless scylce you would be looking at 4-6weeks with no foish. for a cycle with fish you would add about 10% of what you plan on keeping in there after a week or so. then, when fully cycled, adding maybe 5 or 6 small fish or 2-3 gourami sized fish per week until stocked. Erin Cunningham <erosaaen@...> wrote: Mike & Vicky, Hello! I have a 55gal tank that had been running w/no fish in it for a day. Boring to look at... I just got the tank from a friend the day before. Then I went to Petco and got what maybe too many fish too soon!! I picked up 6 Head/Taillite Tetras, 6 Bloodfin Tetras, 3 Emerald green Cories, 6 Harlequin rasboras, 4 Sunset Fire Platies. The guy there said these were all excellent starter fish and with a tank that big, shouldn't be a problem... said to leave the bag floating for 30 min. to adjust the fish to tank water... 30 min. proved to be too long for 2 platies - the guy had put all these fish in one bag. He was also the one who said to feed them 3 times a day. Next morning, I got my replacements (2 White Mickey Mouse platies) from Petco and I went elsewhere.. I got my 2 Gold Gouramis, 2 Blue Gouramis, 2 Albino Irridescent Sharks, 4 Panda Cories, 4 Kuhlii Loaches. They put all the fish in separate bags. Said to wait a day before adding anymore new ones. Next day.. throughout the day, I had floaters! I used one of those quick dip check strips after each new one rose... everything was in line! Lost 6 throughout the day... then I noticed my Gouramis acting weird and found this forum. I am sorry to note that upon waking this AM one of my Gouramis had passed, one of my son's sharks was wrapped around the bottom of the filter intake, and one of the bloodfins was floating as well! Then as I sat there watching my fish and trying not to cry, I noticed one of my daughter's MickeyMouse platies had its side fin missing and wasn't going to make it either!! My son and I have changed out about 25% of the water..I put stress coat in and filled her back up...I am NOT gonna feed the fish until tomorrow AM!! Then change 25% of the water again! My new questions are, how long until I know if this is fixed?? How many fish should I have added at a time? And finally, after adding fish, how long should I wait before getting more??? TIA!!! Erin - Who really didn't mean to kill all those fish!! I --------------------------------- Yahoo! Mail for Mobile Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14758	From: ahorseofcourse66	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Sick anglefish HELP?

I have a 55 gallon tank and all water checks come back fine. It is a tank that has been up for some time. I have 2 angles I have had for several weekd and about aweek ago I bought an angle and put in the same tank now a week later all 3 fish are sick. They started looking like their fins are clamped together (all three are veils) and they are swimming fine but with their head in the air and now today they are not eating. Have treated the tank for parisites and no change. Anyone have any ideas? Also now one has lost his top fin. Thanks

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14759	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Re: Sick anglefish HELP?

There is not enough information here for me to even guess at what your problem is with the fish. However, I did want to use your misfortune as an object lesson to others here. This problem developed because of a failure to quarantine the new fish from the others when it was brought home. Having another tank available as a quarantine/hospital/treatment tank is invaluable. Had ahorseofcourse66 quarantined his new purchase upon arrival home, what ever disease it was carrying would have been made evident while the fish was in quarantine, and he/she would only need to diagnose and treat that one fish, once it had been determined that there was a problem. There would also be the option of contacting the store about that fish to see if the owner/manager would be willing to remedy the problem with an exchange or credit for the fish. When new fish are purchased, they should be quarantined for 14-21 days before placing them in their home tank. This period is long enough to allow most problems to rear their ugly heads before the main tank is affected, and makes it much easier to diagnose and treat the problem. If you are quarantining a fish, or a number of fish, and a problem does develop, them, once the problem is resolved, the quarantine period starts once again, 14-21 days of quarantine before placement in the home tank. Once this period has passed, it is generally safe to add the fish to the tank it will be housed in (home tank). I am sorry that ahorseofcourse66 is having a problem, and don't mean any ill will in using him/her to point this out, but it is an important lesson to learn, and tough to learn it the hard way. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of ahorseofcourse66 Sent: Saturday, August 20, 2005 4:48 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Sick anglefish HELP? I have a 55 gallon tank and all water checks come back fine. It is a tank that has been up for some time. I have 2 angles I have had for several weekd and about aweek ago I bought an angle and put in the same tank now a week later all 3 fish are sick. They started looking like their fins are clamped together (all three are veils) and they are swimming fine but with their head in the air and now today they are not eating. Have treated the tank for parisites and no change. Anyone have any ideas? Also now one has lost his top fin. Thanks

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14760	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Quarantine

Do you keep a QT tank set up all the time? How do you keep the bacteria going? Do you QT everything including plants and inverts such as snails? Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > There is not enough information here for me to even guess at what your > problem is with the fish. However, I did want to use your misfortune as an > object lesson to others here. > > This problem developed because of a failure to quarantine the new fish from > the others when it was brought home. Having another tank available as a > quarantine/hospital/treatment tank is invaluable. Had ahorseofcourse66 > quarantined his new purchase upon arrival home, what ever disease it was > carrying would have been made evident while the fish was in quarantine, and > he/she would only need to diagnose and treat that one fish, once it had been > determined that there was a problem. There would also be the option of > contacting the store about that fish to see if the owner/manager would be > willing to remedy the problem with an exchange or credit for the fish. > > When new fish are purchased, they should be quarantined for 14-21 days > before placing them in their home tank. This period is long enough to allow > most problems to rear their ugly heads before the main tank is affected, and > makes it much easier to diagnose and treat the problem. > > If you are quarantining a fish, or a number of fish, and a problem does > develop, them, once the problem is resolved, the quarantine period starts > once again, 14-21 days of quarantine before placement in the home tank. Once > this period has passed, it is generally safe to add the fish to the tank it > will be housed in (home tank). > > I am sorry that ahorseofcourse66 is having a problem, and don't mean any ill > will in using him/her to point this out, but it is an important lesson to > learn, and tough to learn it the hard way. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of ahorseofcourse66 > Sent: Saturday, August 20, 2005 4:48 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Sick anglefish HELP? > > I have a 55 gallon tank and all water checks come back fine. It is a > tank that has been up for some time. I have 2 angles I have had for > several weekd and about aweek ago I bought an angle and put in the same > tank now a week later all 3 fish are sick. They started looking like > their fins are clamped together (all three are veils) and they are > swimming fine but with their head in the air and now today they are not > eating. Have treated the tank for parisites and no change. Anyone have > any ideas? Also now one has lost his top fin. Thanks

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14761	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Re: Quarantine

In a message dated 8/20/2005 6:28:15 PM Eastern Standard Time, TheSydMonster@... writes: <<<Do you keep a QT tank set up all the time? How do you keep the bacteria going?>>> I usually keep a small filter on one of my other tanks that I can swap over to either a 10 or 2 1/2 gallon QT at a moment's notice. (instant cycle) I use a bare bottom but have a few plants with stand-up bases and an ornament or two in the qt for the fishes' comfort. I used to keep a sponge filter going, but hate the look of the darn things and I always have spare filters sitting unused. The extra filter on one of the tanks only costs pennies to keep running and it sure saves you in the long run to quarantine. I am treating a tank right now for ich (heat + salt), tho no new spots have shown up and everyone seems fine. I added an angelfish after 2 weeks in qt. This is my first break-through illness, but I know the fish in the tank were also under some stress from swapping tanks over briefly before the new angel was added and the one who is showing a couple spots was also unhappily in a breeder net. I'll probably err on the side of 3 weeks from now on and be more careful of adding any fish after stressors. Vicky Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Call (301) 496-7299 or (301) 402-8625 or write: hgparker@... =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@... 919-513-1467, Dr London @ calondon@... 530-754-5711 _AND_ Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14762	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Re: Quarantine

ReBecca, My QT tanks are used when needed. After I use them they are drained, mild bleach solution rinsed and then air dried. The sponge filters get mild bleach solution washed, rinsed in tap water and then let to air dry. After a few days I rinse in tap water again and then add to main tank to re-seed with bacteria. I always have 4 or 5 sponge filters seeding in my tanks. if electricty goes it they are a great back up temporarily. They can also be pulled and placed in a new tank with fish for immediate use. If I leave my QT tank up and running It always ends up being used. Usually for fry, or babies, and sometimes as a breeding tank. Then when i need to use it as a QT tank its not available. just my 2 cents Rob NE Indiana USA Small Fish- Big Tanks n a message dated 8/20/2005 5:28:14 PM US Eastern Standard Time, TheSydMonster@... writes: Do you keep a QT tank set up all the time? How do you keep the bacteria going? Do you QT everything including plants and inverts such as snails? Rebecca [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14763	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Re: Stress Coat

Hi Richard, Do you have any proof that it is a new formula ?, I suspect it is just a new label, I base this assumption on the fact that the currant material safety data certificate for Stress Coat is dated 11/07/96 ! regards, unclenorm. --- richard thompson <rapidostang@...> wrote: > teh new formula is not yet available everywhere. it > has just started coming into circulation at most > lfs. prior to this month it neutralized heavy > metals such as copper and had the slime coat > bennefit as well. > > Hi Ray, > Stress Coat does neutralise chloramine and > chlorine it's primary purpose, the aloe vera/slime > coat is secondary. You must have some very old > stock!. > You can confirm this at > http://www.aquariumpharm.com > as you know the manufacturers. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote: > > > Unless there's a brandy-new formula out there now, > > Stress Coat does > > not remove chloramine as far as I'm aware. Have > the > > box and bottle > > right in front of me -- it says: "contains Aloe > > Vera" and "Removes > > Chlorine and Replaces the Natural Slime Coating of > > Fish". Removing > > chlorine is a lot different than removing > > chloramine. The latter > > requires entirely different chemicals to break the > > ammonia - chlorine > > bond. No where on the box or bottle does it say > it > > removes > > chloramine, at least not on my bottle which is > > fairly new. Ray > > \ > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, wendie > > <wendieo@o...> wrote: > > > Yes, I also use stress coat. It neutralizes > > chloramines. I've > > used it for > > > months and prefer it over the others. > > > I don't age the water either so it's added and > > sits perhaps 30 > > minutes and > > > then the fish are introduced without a problem. > > > Wendie > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On > > > Behalf Of minnesotagal866 > > > Sent: Friday, August 19, 2005 9:44 AM > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Stress Coat > > > > > > > > > I just bought some stress coat, on the bottle > it > > says that it > > takes > > > care of chloramines as well as chlorine. Don't > > have it in front > > of me > > > for exact wording (it's at school for the > > classroom). Anyone have > > a > > > newish bottle to confirm? > > > Jackie > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below > it > > when replying, > > thanks. > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > ((((º> > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all > > TEXT that is NOT > > important to > > > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the > original > > message MODIFY > > the SUBJECT > > > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" > > <- > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > > .·´¯`·..<º > > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > > matter. > > > > > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology > > > > > > > > > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > > -------- > > > -- > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the > > web. > > > > > > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an > > email to: > > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > > > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to > > the Yahoo! Terms of > > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > > -------- > > > -- > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > How much free photo storage do you get? Store your > holiday > snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos > http://uk.photos.yahoo.com > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when > replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the > TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine biology Biology > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email > to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > --------------------------------- > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Mail - Find what you need with new enhanced > search. Learn more. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ___________________________________________________________ How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14764	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Silicon Valley Aquarium Society (SVAS) Monthly Meeting, 9/3/2005, 6

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife Silicon Valley Aquarium Society (SVAS) Monthly Meeting Saturday September 3, 2005 6:30 pm - 9:30 pm This event repeats on the first Saturday of every month. The next reminder for this event will be sent in 11 days, 4 minutes. Event Location: Round Table Pizza, 4302 Moorpark Ave., San Jose CA Street: 4302 Moorpark Ave. City, State, Zip: San Jose CA 95129-2030 Notes: Silicon Valley Aquarium Society (SVAS) Monthly Meeting http://www.svas.info/ http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SiliconValleyAquariumSociety/ 6:30 pm - 9:30 pm This event repeats on the first Saturday of every month. Event Location: Round Table Pizza, 4302 Moorpark Ave., San Jose ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14765	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Re: Quarantine

Rebecca, Others have answered here appropriately. You just need an extra tank that you can rapidly place into service. The biological filtration is normally handled by a sponge filter that is kept alive in another tank, and moved when needed in the quarantine. A spare 50 watt heater should be sufficient to provide any needed heat for a 10 gallon tank, probably the most common size for a quarantine tank. When the tank is needed, a quick rinse should clean it up, and then fill it with water near the temperature of your main tank(s) and then insert the and start. If the water needs treatment for chlorine/chloramines, treat. Place the sponge filter in, place your fish in there, and do what is needed for them. If it is observation for new fish coming in--observe. If it is treatment, treat. Be sure the tank has a cover, so the fish do not jump. No substrate is needed, nor is any desired. A glass or slate (if you are like me and still have older tanks around) bottom is a lot easier to keep clean than is one with a substrate. When the tank has done its duty, and the fish are removed, sterilize the tank with bleach and put away for the next time it is needed. There is one warning. I have lost many a good quarantine tank to a batch of fish I have brought in when I decided that it was easier to keep them in the tank than to move them <g>. Also, some fish may have special needs, such as a hidey hole to feel safe, which you may need to provide, but be sure that you can view the fish while it thinks it is hidden. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of thesydmonster Sent: Saturday, August 20, 2005 6:26 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Quarantine Do you keep a QT tank set up all the time? How do you keep the bacteria going? Do you QT everything including plants and inverts such as snails? Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > There is not enough information here for me to even guess at what your > problem is with the fish. However, I did want to use your misfortune as an > object lesson to others here. > > This problem developed because of a failure to quarantine the new fish from > the others when it was brought home. Having another tank available as a > quarantine/hospital/treatment tank is invaluable. Had ahorseofcourse66 > quarantined his new purchase upon arrival home, what ever disease it was > carrying would have been made evident while the fish was in quarantine, and > he/she would only need to diagnose and treat that one fish, once it had been > determined that there was a problem. There would also be the option of > contacting the store about that fish to see if the owner/manager would be > willing to remedy the problem with an exchange or credit for the fish. > > When new fish are purchased, they should be quarantined for 14-21 days > before placing them in their home tank. This period is long enough to allow > most problems to rear their ugly heads before the main tank is affected, and > makes it much easier to diagnose and treat the problem. > > If you are quarantining a fish, or a number of fish, and a problem does > develop, them, once the problem is resolved, the quarantine period starts > once again, 14-21 days of quarantine before placement in the home tank. Once > this period has passed, it is generally safe to add the fish to the tank it > will be housed in (home tank). > > I am sorry that ahorseofcourse66 is having a problem, and don't mean any ill > will in using him/her to point this out, but it is an important lesson to > learn, and tough to learn it the hard way. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of ahorseofcourse66 > Sent: Saturday, August 20, 2005 4:48 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Sick anglefish HELP? > > I have a 55 gallon tank and all water checks come back fine. It is a > tank that has been up for some time. I have 2 angles I have had for > several weekd and about aweek ago I bought an angle and put in the same > tank now a week later all 3 fish are sick. They started looking like > their fins are clamped together (all three are veils) and they are > swimming fine but with their head in the air and now today they are not > eating. Have treated the tank for parisites and no change. Anyone have > any ideas? Also now one has lost his top fin. Thanks

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14766	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: San Francisco Aquarium Society (SFAS), 9/2/2005, 7:15 pm

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife San Francisco Aquarium Society (SFAS) Friday September 2, 2005 7:15 pm - 9:15 pm This event repeats on the first Friday of every month. The next reminder for this event will be sent in 10 days, 4 minutes. Event Location: first Friday of each month at first Friday of each month at San Francisco State University Notes: http://www.sfaquarium.org/about.html Meetings are free and open to everyone. If you've enjoyed them, we urge you to become a member. You'll become a welcome part of our community, and your dues help defray the costs of speakers and other special things that show up at every meeting. We meet the first Friday of each month at The San Francisco State University. (We used to meet the first Friday of each month at The Academy of Sciences in San Francisco's Golden Gate Park.) Founded in 1923, the San Francisco Aquarium Society is regarded as one of the nation's esteemed aquarium hobbyi ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14767	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Re: What have I done !?????????

Chris, Of your three things, 2 and 3 are not needed. Your second item about changing the water chemistry is downright dangerous. One should be maintain fish with the water chemistry that is available, not trying to change it to suit the fish. If a fish requires hard water, your water should be hard out of the tap. If a fish requires soft acid water, that should be your water out of the tap. The only change that should be made is to add a marine salt should you be keeping brackish fish or marine fish, which changes the water subtly. If you have a high pH and you want to keep rams, well, you will should not be messing with the pH and find a fish that will do well in a high pH environment. When you try to lower the pH of the water, you are fighting against the natural buffering capacity of the water. If you are able to break this buffering capacity, you will then be faced with what is known as a pH crash, in which the pH can get so low that you will not be able to keep fish in the water for any length of time. Raising the pH is less risky to do, but then you will be fighting a constant uphill battle as the water tries to maintain its natural pH. Well, you might say, water companies raise the pH of their water supply all the time to prevent their pipes from becoming corroded. You are right--they do. However, draw a glass of that water and measure the pH. Then let the glass sit there for 24 hours and measure the pH again. Whoa, wait a minute, the pH has gone down! You got that right, it has. It is seeking its own pH level and it may drop dramatically during that 24 hour period. The water company only needs the high pH when the water is flowing through their pipes. This is possible to do. In fact, it is quite easy to do, though not entirely without expense, and perhaps causing some other problems, such as raising the toxicity of nitrogenous compounds in the water. I can go on and on about this subject, as some members of this list can attest. There have been books written about it. Find one. Read it. Your third point is also not necessary, so long as you are providing your fish the environment they need to stay healthy and stress free. If you are messing with the water in your step two, then the fish probably need it to help prolong their lives, though I can't say the quality of their life is made better by it. Actually, the products that claim to help fish by creating a better mucous coat on the fish actually irritate the fish to produce the mucous which protects the fish. So, maybe you really don't need that since the fish are probably already irritated by your messing with the water chemistry. This is not to say that there are instances where such products can be useful, even necessary to use, but using one on a regular basis is probably something you wish to avoid as much as possible. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Chris Sent: Friday, August 19, 2005 10:17 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: What have I done !????????? Typically three things go into new water before the water goes in the tank: 1) water purifier - find one which removes chlorine, chloramines and heavy metals 2) water conditioner (if your type of fish needs it) - basically salts that set the water hardness and pH (different for different kinds of fish - eg goldfish, tropicals, cichlids, south american, etc) 3) something to "ease the stress" on the fish. If anything is optional, the third one might be - but the first two are most important. In all cases, mix the water up before putting it in the tank, too. try and get the temperature roughly the same as in your tank, too - don't just use the cold water tap. Check the shelf-life of the product you used, too - make sure it's not out of date. Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14768	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/20/2005
Subject: Re: What have I done !?????????

Hi Steve, I'm very surprised at this alarmist post, there is nothing at all wrong with changing the water parameters to suit the fish, there are many ways of doing it totally non dangerous!!, it is done all the time by thousands of hobbyists and breeders alike, your statement that people should only buy fish to suit there tap water is rather ridiculous to say the least. If there is anything dangerous it is the use of tap water! especialy in a marine tank, I'm sure you must know what RO/DI is ?. I would suggest that you need to read up on water chemistry as it applies to this hobby, totally different to water company prioritys. regards, unclenorm. --- Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > Chris, > > Of your three things, 2 and 3 are not needed. > > Your second item about changing the water chemistry > is downright dangerous. > One should be maintain fish with the water chemistry > that is available, not > trying to change it to suit the fish. If a fish > requires hard water, your > water should be hard out of the tap. If a fish > requires soft acid water, > that should be your water out of the tap. The only > change that should be > made is to add a marine salt should you be keeping > brackish fish or marine > fish, which changes the water subtly. > > If you have a high pH and you want to keep rams, > well, you will should not > be messing with the pH and find a fish that will do > well in a high pH > environment. When you try to lower the pH of the > water, you are fighting > against the natural buffering capacity of the water. > If you are able to > break this buffering capacity, you will then be > faced with what is known as > a pH crash, in which the pH can get so low that you > will not be able to keep > fish in the water for any length of time. > > Raising the pH is less risky to do, but then you > will be fighting a constant > uphill battle as the water tries to maintain its > natural pH. > > Well, you might say, water companies raise the pH of > their water supply all > the time to prevent their pipes from becoming > corroded. You are right--they > do. However, draw a glass of that water and measure > the pH. Then let the > glass sit there for 24 hours and measure the pH > again. Whoa, wait a minute, > the pH has gone down! You got that right, it has. It > is seeking its own pH > level and it may drop dramatically during that 24 > hour period. The water > company only needs the high pH when the water is > flowing through their > pipes. This is possible to do. In fact, it is quite > easy to do, though not > entirely without expense, and perhaps causing some > other problems, such as > raising the toxicity of nitrogenous compounds in the > water. > > I can go on and on about this subject, as some > members of this list can > attest. There have been books written about it. Find > one. Read it. > > Your third point is also not necessary, so long as > you are providing your > fish the environment they need to stay healthy and > stress free. If you are > messing with the water in your step two, then the > fish probably need it to > help prolong their lives, though I can't say the > quality of their life is > made better by it. Actually, the products that claim > to help fish by > creating a better mucous coat on the fish actually > irritate the fish to > produce the mucous which protects the fish. So, > maybe you really don't need > that since the fish are probably already irritated > by your messing with the > water chemistry. > > This is not to say that there are instances where > such products can be > useful, even necessary to use, but using one on a > regular basis is probably > something you wish to avoid as much as possible. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Chris > Sent: Friday, August 19, 2005 10:17 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: What have I done > !????????? > > Typically three things go into new water before the > water goes in > the tank: > > 1) water purifier - find one which removes chlorine, > chloramines and > heavy metals > > 2) water conditioner (if your type of fish needs it) > - basically > salts that set the water hardness and pH (different > for different > kinds of fish - eg goldfish, tropicals, cichlids, > south american, > etc) > > 3) something to "ease the stress" on the fish. > > If anything is optional, the third one might be - > but the first two > are most important. In all cases, mix the water up > before putting it > in the tank, too. try and get the temperature > roughly the same as in > your tank, too - don't just use the cold water tap. > > Check the shelf-life of the product you used, too - > make sure it's > not out of date. > > Chris. > > ___________________________________________________________ To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. http://uk.security.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14769	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: Stress Coat

while that is entirely possible *grin*, I think it was due to Ray having an older bottle. Previous incarnations of this product only nuked chlorine. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of minnesotagal866 Sent: Saturday, August 20, 2005 6:26 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Stress Coat --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, wendie <wendieo@o...> wrote: > I just happen to be using it now for two Betta tanks. > I stuck it up here... > > http://www.nashnutphoto.com/bettas/stresscoat.jpg > > Thanks for posting and confirming that. The last 2 bottles I've bought have specifically said "neutralizes chloramines" and I couldn't understand why everyone kept saying it didn't. Thought maybe I was going crazy in my old age . . . <smile> Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14770	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: Discus, ich, and high temps/ to AC

Hi Norm, While you may believe that all fish with problems should be treated in quarantine, my belief is that most (but not all) problems should be treated in quarantine. One of my main exceptions to this is when a fish shows symptoms of Ich. As I see it, by the time this is seen on just one fish, Ich has multiplied or is about to multiply in the water column many times over, putting any other fish in that tank at risk of contracting it. In this situation, I believe it is best to treat the entire tank to prevent the Ich from the probability (or even possibility) of spreading to the other inhabitants as can so very easily occur -- its very cheap insurance. In my estimation, it is nothing short of negligence not to treat the main tank in hopes that it won't spread, as once the second round of new free-swimming cysts release their populations (being many times over the original) the odds of any other fish getting this is greatly increased. To not act responsibly is like burying your head in the sand. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > Hi Ray, > I've said many times fish with problems should > be treated in quarantein, Any container big enough > will do. There are dozens more such sites to be found > on the net. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > Hi Norman, Just went up to these 4 sites you > > mentioned, out of > > curiousity. Looks like there's some good > > information there that may > > not have been known to our newcomers. One thing I > > did notice, there > > doesn't seem to be anything there that would inform > > AC of how to > > proceed with his treatment of Ich as the last two > > sites recommend > > treatment by medication (only), which AC prefers not > > to do. The third > > site even refers to Quick-Cure and Rid-Ich (both I > > believe containing > > malachite green) which should not be used with Clown > > Loaches, but > > something AC fortunately already realizes. The > > first site recommends > > raising the temperature up to 25 o C (77 o F) which > > may help Koi, but > > would be useless in treating tropicals. With the > > second site, I got > > the message "Can't Find Web Site". Don't know if > > that site still > > exists or maybe its just my server. Just thought > > I'd pass this along > > in case you haven't actually read these sites. Ray > > > > \ > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. > > Hampson." > > <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > > Hi AC, > > > Here are some links about Ich (Ick), you > > will > > > find all the information you need to overcome your > > > problem, :- > > > > > > > > > http://www.fishdoc.co.uk/disease/whitespot.htm > > > > > > http://fishorbust.net/ich.html > > > > > > http://www.nunnie.com/ick.html > > > > > > http://badmanstropicalfish.com/meds/ick.html > > > > > > regards, > > > unclenorm > > > > > > > > > --- aclaar877 <aclaar877@y...> wrote: > > > > > > > Ray, thanks. > > > > > > > > I do have 0 nitrites, as well as 0 nitrates. > > Most > > > > plants are doing > > > > great, though maybe some nitrates will help the > > red > > > > ammania > > > > gracillis I have. I'll keep the heat up, but > > > > probably won't do salt > > > > because of the plants. Do you know if the white > > > > spots are the > > > > parasites themselves, or reactions to the > > parasite? > > > > If there is a > > > > delay between the parasite attaching itself and > > the > > > > appearance of a > > > > spot, I may be ahead of where I thought I was as > > far > > > > as the ich > > > > cycle is concerned. > > > > > > > > AC > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" > > > > > > <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > > > To Whom it May Concern (no signature): > > > > Generally, Ich find it > > > > > difficult to reproduce above 86 o. > > Occassionally, > > > > you might run > > > > across > > > > > a particularly virulent and resistant strain > > which > > > > may be able to > > > > > endure temperatures up to 90 o. Their getting > > > > more spots may just > > > > be a > > > > > delayed reaction and once these cysts drop off > > > > they should not be > > > > able > > > > > to multiply very freely, if at all (unless its > > a > > > > resistant > > > > strain). If > > > > > the spots are still few, I would go with the > > heat > > > > treatment and > > > > add no > > > > > more than 1 tbs of salt per 5 gallons -- you > > have > > > > Tetras. Give it > > > > 2 > > > > > days if you can (if there's not a heavy > > > > infestation) and see what > > > > it > > > > > looks like by then. If you find that you're > > up > > > > against a more > > > > virulent > > > > > strain, you may need to move to a medication, > > but > > > > do not under any > > > > > circumstances use a malachite green (or any > > other > > > > dye) based > > > > > medication -- it will kill your scaleless > > Loaches. > > > > So keep the > > > > > temperature up and keep an eye on things. > > And, I > > > > hope you meant a > > > > > reading of 0 for your nitrItes. > > > > Ray > > > > > > > > > \ > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > > -- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "aclaar877" > > > > <aclaar877@y...> > > > > wrote: > > > > > > Just added four discus to 155g planted tank > > on > > > > Sunday, and three > > > > have > > > > > > developed some ich spots. A few cardinals > > and > > > > both clown > > > > loaches > > > > > have > > > > > > them as well. Temperature has never been > > below > > > > 86--I thought > > > > ich > > > > > > wouldn't spread at those temps? I now have > > the > > > > temp at about 88- > > > > 89, > > > > > > and the discus are getting even more spots. > > > > They are still > > > > eating > > > > > and > > > > > > not yet scratching against things. Should I > > > > keep the > > > > temperature > > > > > high > > > > > > and wait it out, or start the Quick-Cure > > > > malachite green > > > > medication? > > > > > > > > > > > > Water quality is high, with 0 ammonia and 0 > > > > nitrates. > > > > > > > > > > > > I'd like to hear what any other discus > > owners > > > > have done in this > > > > > > situation. I don't want to medicate if I > > don't > > > > have to, but > > > > would > > > > > > hate for the ich to rapidly spread and kill > > the > > > > fish quicker > > > > than I > > > > > > can react. Thanks. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > > > To help you stay safe and secure online, we've > > developed the all > > new Yahoo! Security Centre. > > http://uk.security.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. http://uk.security.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14771	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: What have I done !?????????

Steve, I could not have said it better -- only to add that this is exactly the same way that unnecessarily maintaining a salt level in a tank helps keep fish "healthy" (which it can up to a point), by irritating the skin which then is caused to produce additional mucous beyond the normal layer of it. This is not to say that salt should never be used, as it can be quite beneficial in treating certain diseases, with some of these benefits derived in this same manner -- inducing a heavier mucous coating (by irritation). ANY additional chemicals (such as Stress Coat) should be avoided if possible, except when actually needed, as for best fish health the water should be as pure as naturally possible, and should not have general additional "tonics" continually added. Many hobbyists probably have gotten use to adding chemicals (and that's just what they are) as a normal way of maintenance as in this society mosts of us thinking nothing of popping pills and stuff in ourselves -- not the least of which is aspirins, but there's got to be dozens of all kinds of pain relievers and cold and alergy "medications" (yes, some needed) for "curing" symptoms of headaches to curing the Gout. \ Agreed, changing the water chemistry can be downright dangerous, even if some breeders do this as a normal routine. Its so much easier, and always recommended, to work with (or keep) fish that do best in water similar to your source. Even if one is successful enough to have changed the water chemistry to match the different preference of the fish of his or her choice, there now remains the challenge of maintaining that chemistry when water changes are needed, with the water source now being so different. The maintenance and water changes are so much easier and less stressful for fish kept in your tap water (or well water, as the case may be), which I realize you're well aware of but possibly not all of our members. Regards, Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > Chris, > > Of your three things, 2 and 3 are not needed. > > Your second item about changing the water chemistry is downright dangerous. > One should be maintain fish with the water chemistry that is available, not > trying to change it to suit the fish. If a fish requires hard water, your > water should be hard out of the tap. If a fish requires soft acid water, > that should be your water out of the tap. The only change that should be > made is to add a marine salt should you be keeping brackish fish or marine > fish, which changes the water subtly. > > If you have a high pH and you want to keep rams, well, you will should not > be messing with the pH and find a fish that will do well in a high pH > environment. When you try to lower the pH of the water, you are fighting > against the natural buffering capacity of the water. If you are able to > break this buffering capacity, you will then be faced with what is known as > a pH crash, in which the pH can get so low that you will not be able to keep > fish in the water for any length of time. > > Raising the pH is less risky to do, but then you will be fighting a constant > uphill battle as the water tries to maintain its natural pH. > > Well, you might say, water companies raise the pH of their water supply all > the time to prevent their pipes from becoming corroded. You are right--they > do. However, draw a glass of that water and measure the pH. Then let the > glass sit there for 24 hours and measure the pH again. Whoa, wait a minute, > the pH has gone down! You got that right, it has. It is seeking its own pH > level and it may drop dramatically during that 24 hour period. The water > company only needs the high pH when the water is flowing through their > pipes. This is possible to do. In fact, it is quite easy to do, though not > entirely without expense, and perhaps causing some other problems, such as > raising the toxicity of nitrogenous compounds in the water. > > I can go on and on about this subject, as some members of this list can > attest. There have been books written about it. Find one. Read it. > > Your third point is also not necessary, so long as you are providing your > fish the environment they need to stay healthy and stress free. If you are > messing with the water in your step two, then the fish probably need it to > help prolong their lives, though I can't say the quality of their life is > made better by it. Actually, the products that claim to help fish by > creating a better mucous coat on the fish actually irritate the fish to > produce the mucous which protects the fish. So, maybe you really don't need > that since the fish are probably already irritated by your messing with the > water chemistry. > > This is not to say that there are instances where such products can be > useful, even necessary to use, but using one on a regular basis is probably > something you wish to avoid as much as possible. > > \\Steve// >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14772	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: What have I done !?????????

I should probably also add that seeing a fish in the LFS does not necessarily mean that it is able to be kept in the local water. The fish's stay in the store is only temporary, and it may not be there long enough to show the signs of stress by being kept in that water. Before one chooses fish in a store, one should familiarize themselves with the fish by reading and learning its needs with regard to diet, water conditions, behavior, etc. If a fish requires hard water, and your water is like a rock, fine. If a fish shows aggression to conspecifics, then you do not want to buy a group of them, but one may be a nice addition. If a fish is aggressive to other species, then you may wish to consider a species tank. And so on. Keeping fish is more than just throwing some water and fish together. One must learn the science and the art of keeping fish. Sure, one will make mistakes. We all do. Also we all also see that fish we just have to have because it is available. The difference between a novice and an expert, it is often said, is in the price of the fish we kill <g>. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Sunday, August 21, 2005 7:57 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: What have I done !????????? Steve, I could not have said it better -- only to add that this is exactly the same way that unnecessarily maintaining a salt level in a tank helps keep fish "healthy" (which it can up to a point), by irritating the skin which then is caused to produce additional mucous beyond the normal layer of it. This is not to say that salt should never be used, as it can be quite beneficial in treating certain diseases, with some of these benefits derived in this same manner -- inducing a heavier mucous coating (by irritation). ANY additional chemicals (such as Stress Coat) should be avoided if possible, except when actually needed, as for best fish health the water should be as pure as naturally possible, and should not have general additional "tonics" continually added. Many hobbyists probably have gotten use to adding chemicals (and that's just what they are) as a normal way of maintenance as in this society mosts of us thinking nothing of popping pills and stuff in ourselves -- not the least of which is aspirins, but there's got to be dozens of all kinds of pain relievers and cold and alergy "medications" (yes, some needed) for "curing" symptoms of headaches to curing the Gout. \ Agreed, changing the water chemistry can be downright dangerous, even if some breeders do this as a normal routine. Its so much easier, and always recommended, to work with (or keep) fish that do best in water similar to your source. Even if one is successful enough to have changed the water chemistry to match the different preference of the fish of his or her choice, there now remains the challenge of maintaining that chemistry when water changes are needed, with the water source now being so different. The maintenance and water changes are so much easier and less stressful for fish kept in your tap water (or well water, as the case may be), which I realize you're well aware of but possibly not all of our members. Regards, Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > Chris, > > Of your three things, 2 and 3 are not needed. > > Your second item about changing the water chemistry is downright dangerous. > One should be maintain fish with the water chemistry that is available, not > trying to change it to suit the fish. If a fish requires hard water, your > water should be hard out of the tap. If a fish requires soft acid water, > that should be your water out of the tap. The only change that should be > made is to add a marine salt should you be keeping brackish fish or marine > fish, which changes the water subtly. > > If you have a high pH and you want to keep rams, well, you will should not > be messing with the pH and find a fish that will do well in a high pH > environment. When you try to lower the pH of the water, you are fighting > against the natural buffering capacity of the water. If you are able to > break this buffering capacity, you will then be faced with what is known as > a pH crash, in which the pH can get so low that you will not be able to keep > fish in the water for any length of time. > > Raising the pH is less risky to do, but then you will be fighting a constant > uphill battle as the water tries to maintain its natural pH. > > Well, you might say, water companies raise the pH of their water supply all > the time to prevent their pipes from becoming corroded. You are right--they > do. However, draw a glass of that water and measure the pH. Then let the > glass sit there for 24 hours and measure the pH again. Whoa, wait a minute, > the pH has gone down! You got that right, it has. It is seeking its own pH > level and it may drop dramatically during that 24 hour period. The water > company only needs the high pH when the water is flowing through their > pipes. This is possible to do. In fact, it is quite easy to do, though not > entirely without expense, and perhaps causing some other problems, such as > raising the toxicity of nitrogenous compounds in the water. > > I can go on and on about this subject, as some members of this list can > attest. There have been books written about it. Find one. Read it. > > Your third point is also not necessary, so long as you are providing your > fish the environment they need to stay healthy and stress free. If you are > messing with the water in your step two, then the fish probably need it to > help prolong their lives, though I can't say the quality of their life is > made better by it. Actually, the products that claim to help fish by > creating a better mucous coat on the fish actually irritate the fish to > produce the mucous which protects the fish. So, maybe you really don't need > that since the fish are probably already irritated by your messing with the > water chemistry. > > This is not to say that there are instances where such products can be > useful, even necessary to use, but using one on a regular basis is probably > something you wish to avoid as much as possible. > > \\Steve// > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14773	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: What have I done !?????????

Unclenorm, If you read my post, I do not state that changing water parameters is impossible to do, but that once it is done, there is a constant battle to maintain the new parameters and there are dangers in changing the parameters. With most of the people on this list in the early stages of the hobby, this is not something they should be considering, but accepting the limitations of their water and the fish they can successfully keep is what they should be concerned with doing. The aquarium hobby has a high drop out rate of people in the early stages of learning how to keep fish. Many of the problems could be resolved by keeping fish that like the water conditions that are present in the local water. (Another problem is that many simply do not prepare themselves before diving into the hobby (pun intended). But that is another topic in and of itself.) Using RO water requires an RO unit, starting at $125+, along with replacement membranes to produce enough water to fill a 10 gallon tank a day. There is also a tremendous ratio of waste water to RO water, a 5:1 figure is often seen, meaning it takes 5 gallons of incoming tap water to produce 1 gallon of RO water. Unless you are on a private system (read your own well), you are paying a price for each gallon of water used. I am paying $30-40 dollars a month for the normal water usage here. For every 10 gallons of water I produce using an RO filter, I will be throwing away 40 gallons of water. True, some of this can be recycled in the garden, but after a while, if I were to use all the water that way, I'd be raising bog plants instead of my bearded iris and daylilies. (The cactus do not require much water at all.) Then, I need to reconstitute the water per the requirements of the fish. This requires the purchase of mixtures to add to the water, or the purchase and measurements of the various chemicals and compounds I would need (and I do have recipes for those stashed away somewhere). This is not something you would want to be doing if you are a newcomer to the hobby. The use of the examples of the water companies is so that people can verify easily what I am saying, and also answers those questions about rapid pH drops that some people have reported here. Since probably 90% of the people here are on some form of municipal water system, it is an apt example. There are a number of books and many articles available that discuss water chemistry relating to aquariums out there. Some are mere generalizations, but many go into depth on various aspects of water chemistry. I have mentioned one book here several times and still do recommend it, though it can be a bit hard to find. Most consider it to be the bible when it comes to water chemistry, though I'll not give it that sobriquet, it is a well written book that goes into all the basic aspects in great depth with, sometimes lengthy, references to other articles and published works. It is "Fish and Invertebrate Culture, Second Edition", by Stephen Spotte. A warming goes along with this recommendation. You need to have had at least a high school chemistry course to be able to understand the book, and even then it may not be easy. An accomplished aquarist may wish to start experimenting with changing water parameters to keep specific fish, however it is not something a novice should be experimenting with. It is difficult enough to learn the nitrogen cycle and to maintain it for many beginners, hence all the quick fixes to be found on the market, many of which are worthless or even dangerous to use (dangerous for the health of your fish). At best, the better products can shave a couple of weeks off the cycle or convert the nitrogenous products to harmless compounds that still allow the cycle to complete. I will continue to maintain that if you do not understand water chemistry, you should not attempt to change it. Period. No argument allowed. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Norman. S. Hampson. Sent: Sunday, August 21, 2005 2:15 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: What have I done !????????? Hi Steve, I'm very surprised at this alarmist post, there is nothing at all wrong with changing the water parameters to suit the fish, there are many ways of doing it totally non dangerous!!, it is done all the time by thousands of hobbyists and breeders alike, your statement that people should only buy fish to suit there tap water is rather ridiculous to say the least. If there is anything dangerous it is the use of tap water! especialy in a marine tank, I'm sure you must know what RO/DI is ?. I would suggest that you need to read up on water chemistry as it applies to this hobby, totally different to water company prioritys. regards, unclenorm. --- Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > Chris, > > Of your three things, 2 and 3 are not needed. > > Your second item about changing the water chemistry > is downright dangerous. > One should be maintain fish with the water chemistry > that is available, not > trying to change it to suit the fish. If a fish > requires hard water, your > water should be hard out of the tap. If a fish > requires soft acid water, > that should be your water out of the tap. The only > change that should be > made is to add a marine salt should you be keeping > brackish fish or marine > fish, which changes the water subtly. > > If you have a high pH and you want to keep rams, > well, you will should not > be messing with the pH and find a fish that will do > well in a high pH > environment. When you try to lower the pH of the > water, you are fighting > against the natural buffering capacity of the water. > If you are able to > break this buffering capacity, you will then be > faced with what is known as > a pH crash, in which the pH can get so low that you > will not be able to keep > fish in the water for any length of time. > > Raising the pH is less risky to do, but then you > will be fighting a constant > uphill battle as the water tries to maintain its > natural pH. > > Well, you might say, water companies raise the pH of > their water supply all > the time to prevent their pipes from becoming > corroded. You are right--they > do. However, draw a glass of that water and measure > the pH. Then let the > glass sit there for 24 hours and measure the pH > again. Whoa, wait a minute, > the pH has gone down! You got that right, it has. It > is seeking its own pH > level and it may drop dramatically during that 24 > hour period. The water > company only needs the high pH when the water is > flowing through their > pipes. This is possible to do. In fact, it is quite > easy to do, though not > entirely without expense, and perhaps causing some > other problems, such as > raising the toxicity of nitrogenous compounds in the > water. > > I can go on and on about this subject, as some > members of this list can > attest. There have been books written about it. Find > one. Read it. > > Your third point is also not necessary, so long as > you are providing your > fish the environment they need to stay healthy and > stress free. If you are > messing with the water in your step two, then the > fish probably need it to > help prolong their lives, though I can't say the > quality of their life is > made better by it. Actually, the products that claim > to help fish by > creating a better mucous coat on the fish actually > irritate the fish to > produce the mucous which protects the fish. So, > maybe you really don't need > that since the fish are probably already irritated > by your messing with the > water chemistry. > > This is not to say that there are instances where > such products can be > useful, even necessary to use, but using one on a > regular basis is probably > something you wish to avoid as much as possible. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Chris > Sent: Friday, August 19, 2005 10:17 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: What have I done > !????????? > > Typically three things go into new water before the > water goes in > the tank: > > 1) water purifier - find one which removes chlorine, > chloramines and > heavy metals > > 2) water conditioner (if your type of fish needs it) > - basically > salts that set the water hardness and pH (different > for different > kinds of fish - eg goldfish, tropicals, cichlids, > south american, > etc) > > 3) something to "ease the stress" on the fish. > > If anything is optional, the third one might be - > but the first two > are most important. In all cases, mix the water up > before putting it > in the tank, too. try and get the temperature > roughly the same as in > your tank, too - don't just use the cold water tap. > > Check the shelf-life of the product you used, too - > make sure it's > not out of date. > > Chris. > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14774	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus

I don't, but I know someone who does have a tank in one of the two bathrooms in their home. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Tuesday, August 16, 2005 5:33 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: angels and discus Anybody have an aquarium in their bathroom yet? Linda

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14775	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: changing water parameters

I was told when I started this hobby a whopping 6 months ago to get fish that would be comfortable in the water that I have from my tap. My pH is a little on the high side at 7.6 to 7.8 and I realize not all fish do well at that pH so I have avoided any fish that would need me to change the water parameters. I realize this could be done (peat, crushed coral, etc) and have read several articles on it but I am new and just want to enjoy healthy fish without doing a lot of changes that, if I messed up, would kill all my fish. Maybe when I am more comfortable and understand it all more completely, I would consider lowering or raising my pH/adjusting GH or KH, etc and getting different fish but I am very happy right now. I am told that as long as I keep things the same, the fish will do fine and so far, so good! Rebecca

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14776	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: Discus, ich, and high temps/ to AC

Ray, It is claimed by many of the experts that ich is always present in a tank just waiting for an under par fish to attach, so I believe that that fish should be removed to quarantine before the dormant rich can rejuvenate and infest the other fish in the tank. I am inclined to believe this dormancy theory as I've seen outbreaks in long established tanks both fresh and salt water were there have been no changes of any kind kind in a long time, except one under par fish through a territorial squabble or some other reason, the quick removal of the effected fish has brought the tank back to normal. Tell me how would you treat a large salt water reef tank 325gall that is normally running at 32/33C. regards, unclenorm. --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote: > Hi Norm, While you may believe that all fish with > problems should be > treated in quarantine, my belief is that most (but > not all) problems > should be treated in quarantine. One of my main > exceptions to this > is when a fish shows symptoms of Ich. As I see it, > by the time this > is seen on just one fish, Ich has multiplied or is > about to multiply > in the water column many times over, putting any > other fish in that > tank at risk of contracting it. In this situation, > I believe it is > best to treat the entire tank to prevent the Ich > from the probability > (or even possibility) of spreading to the other > inhabitants as can so > very easily occur -- its very cheap insurance. In > my estimation, it > is nothing short of negligence not to treat the main > tank in hopes > that it won't spread, as once the second round of > new free-swimming > cysts release their populations (being many times > over the original) > the odds of any other fish getting this is greatly > increased. To not > act responsibly is like burying your head in the > sand. Ray > \ > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. > Hampson." > <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > Hi Ray, > > I've said many times fish with problems > should > > be treated in quarantein, Any container big enough > > will do. There are dozens more such sites to be > found > > on the net. > > regards, > > unclenorm. > > > > > > --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > > > Hi Norman, Just went up to these 4 sites you > > > mentioned, out of > > > curiousity. Looks like there's some good > > > information there that may > > > not have been known to our newcomers. One thing > I > > > did notice, there > > > doesn't seem to be anything there that would > inform > > > AC of how to > > > proceed with his treatment of Ich as the last > two > > > sites recommend > > > treatment by medication (only), which AC prefers > not > > > to do. The third > > > site even refers to Quick-Cure and Rid-Ich (both > I > > > believe containing > > > malachite green) which should not be used with > Clown > > > Loaches, but > > > something AC fortunately already realizes. The > > > first site recommends > > > raising the temperature up to 25 o C (77 o F) > which > > > may help Koi, but > > > would be useless in treating tropicals. With > the > > > second site, I got > > > the message "Can't Find Web Site". Don't know > if > > > that site still > > > exists or maybe its just my server. Just > thought > > > I'd pass this along > > > in case you haven't actually read these sites. > Ray > > > > > > \ > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. > > > Hampson." > > > <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > > > Hi AC, > > > > Here are some links about Ich (Ick), you > > > will > > > > find all the information you need to overcome > your > > > > problem, :- > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.fishdoc.co.uk/disease/whitespot.htm > > > > > > > > http://fishorbust.net/ich.html > > > > > > > > http://www.nunnie.com/ick.html > > > > > > > > http://badmanstropicalfish.com/meds/ick.html > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > unclenorm > > > > > > > > > > > > --- aclaar877 <aclaar877@y...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Ray, thanks. > > > > > > > > > > I do have 0 nitrites, as well as 0 nitrates. > > > > Most > > > > > plants are doing > > > > > great, though maybe some nitrates will help > the > > > red > > > > > ammania > > > > > gracillis I have. I'll keep the heat up, > but > > > > > probably won't do salt > > > > > because of the plants. Do you know if the > white > > > > > spots are the > > > > > parasites themselves, or reactions to the > > > parasite? > > > > > If there is a > > > > > delay between the parasite attaching itself > and > > > the > > > > > appearance of a > > > > > spot, I may be ahead of where I thought I > was as > > > far > > > > > as the ich > > > > > cycle is concerned. > > > > > > > > > > AC > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray > Wetzel" > > > > > > > > <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > > > > To Whom it May Concern (no signature): > > > > > Generally, Ich find it > > > > > > difficult to reproduce above 86 o. > > > Occassionally, > > > > > you might run > > > > > across > > > > > > a particularly virulent and resistant > strain > > > which > > > > > may be able to > > > > > > endure temperatures up to 90 o. Their > getting > > > > > more spots may just > > > > > be a > > > > > > delayed reaction and once these cysts drop > off > > > > > they should not be > > > > > able > > > > > > to multiply very freely, if at all (unless > its > > > a > > > > > resistant > > > > > strain). If > > > > > > the spots are still few, I would go with > the > > > heat > > > > > treatment and > > > > > add no > > > > > > more than 1 tbs of salt per 5 gallons -- > you > > > have > > > > > Tetras. Give it > > > > > 2 > > > > > > days if you can (if there's not a heavy > > > > > infestation) and see what > > > > > it > > > > > > looks like by then. If you find that > you're > > > up > > > > > against a more > > > > > virulent > > > > > > strain, you may need to move to a > medication, > > > but > > > > > do not under any > > > > > > circumstances use a malachite green (or > any > > > other > > > > > dye) based > > > > > > medication -- it will kill your scaleless > > > Loaches. > > > > > So keep the > > > > > > temperature up and keep an eye on things. > > > And, I > > > > > hope you meant a > > > > > > reading of 0 for your nitrItes. > > > > > Ray > > > > > > > > > > > \ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > > > -- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, > "aclaar877" > > > > > <aclaar877@y...> > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > Just added four discus to 155g planted > tank > > > on > > > > > Sunday, and three > > > > > have > > > > > > > developed some ich spots. A few > cardinals > > > and > > > > > both clown > > > > > loaches > > > > > > have > > > > > > > them as well. Temperature has never > been > > > below > > > > > 86--I thought > > > > > ich > > > > > > > wouldn't spread at those temps? I now > have > > > the > > > > > temp at about 88- > > > > > 89, > > > > > > > and the discus are getting even more > spots. > > > > > They are still > > > > > eating > > > > > > and > > > > > > > not yet scratching against things. > Should I > > > > > keep the > > > > > temperature > > > > > > high > > > > > > > and wait it out, or start the Quick-Cure > > > > > malachite green > > > > > medication? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Water quality is high, with 0 ammonia > and 0 > > > > > nitrates. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I'd like to hear what any other discus > > > owners > > > > > have done in this > > > > > > > situation. I don't want to medicate if > I > > > don't > > > > > have to, but > > > > > would > > > > > > > hate for the ich to rapidly spread and > kill > > > the > > > > > fish quicker > > > > > than I > > > > > > > can react. Thanks. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > > > > > To help you stay safe and secure online, we've > > > developed the all > > > new Yahoo! Security Centre. > > > http://uk.security.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > To help you stay safe and secure online, we've > developed the all > new Yahoo! Security Centre. > http://uk.security.yahoo.com > > > > ___________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14777	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: What have I done !?????????

A correction--proofing will beat spell checking any day! In the fifth paragraph of my earlier post, the sentence "A warming goes along with this recommendation.", should read "A warning goes along with this recommendation.". Sorry for any confusion this may have caused. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: Sunday, August 21, 2005 9:44 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: What have I done !????????? Unclenorm, If you read my post, I do not state that changing water parameters is impossible to do, but that once it is done, there is a constant battle to maintain the new parameters and there are dangers in changing the parameters. With most of the people on this list in the early stages of the hobby, this is not something they should be considering, but accepting the limitations of their water and the fish they can successfully keep is what they should be concerned with doing. The aquarium hobby has a high drop out rate of people in the early stages of learning how to keep fish. Many of the problems could be resolved by keeping fish that like the water conditions that are present in the local water. (Another problem is that many simply do not prepare themselves before diving into the hobby (pun intended). But that is another topic in and of itself.) Using RO water requires an RO unit, starting at $125+, along with replacement membranes to produce enough water to fill a 10 gallon tank a day. There is also a tremendous ratio of waste water to RO water, a 5:1 figure is often seen, meaning it takes 5 gallons of incoming tap water to produce 1 gallon of RO water. Unless you are on a private system (read your own well), you are paying a price for each gallon of water used. I am paying $30-40 dollars a month for the normal water usage here. For every 10 gallons of water I produce using an RO filter, I will be throwing away 40 gallons of water. True, some of this can be recycled in the garden, but after a while, if I were to use all the water that way, I'd be raising bog plants instead of my bearded iris and daylilies. (The cactus do not require much water at all.) Then, I need to reconstitute the water per the requirements of the fish. This requires the purchase of mixtures to add to the water, or the purchase and measurements of the various chemicals and compounds I would need (and I do have recipes for those stashed away somewhere). This is not something you would want to be doing if you are a newcomer to the hobby. The use of the examples of the water companies is so that people can verify easily what I am saying, and also answers those questions about rapid pH drops that some people have reported here. Since probably 90% of the people here are on some form of municipal water system, it is an apt example. There are a number of books and many articles available that discuss water chemistry relating to aquariums out there. Some are mere generalizations, but many go into depth on various aspects of water chemistry. I have mentioned one book here several times and still do recommend it, though it can be a bit hard to find. Most consider it to be the bible when it comes to water chemistry, though I'll not give it that sobriquet, it is a well written book that goes into all the basic aspects in great depth with, sometimes lengthy, references to other articles and published works. It is "Fish and Invertebrate Culture, Second Edition", by Stephen Spotte. A warming goes along with this recommendation. You need to have had at least a high school chemistry course to be able to understand the book, and even then it may not be easy. An accomplished aquarist may wish to start experimenting with changing water parameters to keep specific fish, however it is not something a novice should be experimenting with. It is difficult enough to learn the nitrogen cycle and to maintain it for many beginners, hence all the quick fixes to be found on the market, many of which are worthless or even dangerous to use (dangerous for the health of your fish). At best, the better products can shave a couple of weeks off the cycle or convert the nitrogenous products to harmless compounds that still allow the cycle to complete. I will continue to maintain that if you do not understand water chemistry, you should not attempt to change it. Period. No argument allowed. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Norman. S. Hampson. Sent: Sunday, August 21, 2005 2:15 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: What have I done !????????? Hi Steve, I'm very surprised at this alarmist post, there is nothing at all wrong with changing the water parameters to suit the fish, there are many ways of doing it totally non dangerous!!, it is done all the time by thousands of hobbyists and breeders alike, your statement that people should only buy fish to suit there tap water is rather ridiculous to say the least. If there is anything dangerous it is the use of tap water! especialy in a marine tank, I'm sure you must know what RO/DI is ?. I would suggest that you need to read up on water chemistry as it applies to this hobby, totally different to water company prioritys. regards, unclenorm. --- Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > Chris, > > Of your three things, 2 and 3 are not needed. > > Your second item about changing the water chemistry > is downright dangerous. > One should be maintain fish with the water chemistry > that is available, not > trying to change it to suit the fish. If a fish > requires hard water, your > water should be hard out of the tap. If a fish > requires soft acid water, > that should be your water out of the tap. The only > change that should be > made is to add a marine salt should you be keeping > brackish fish or marine > fish, which changes the water subtly. > > If you have a high pH and you want to keep rams, > well, you will should not > be messing with the pH and find a fish that will do > well in a high pH > environment. When you try to lower the pH of the > water, you are fighting > against the natural buffering capacity of the water. > If you are able to > break this buffering capacity, you will then be > faced with what is known as > a pH crash, in which the pH can get so low that you > will not be able to keep > fish in the water for any length of time. > > Raising the pH is less risky to do, but then you > will be fighting a constant > uphill battle as the water tries to maintain its > natural pH. > > Well, you might say, water companies raise the pH of > their water supply all > the time to prevent their pipes from becoming > corroded. You are right--they > do. However, draw a glass of that water and measure > the pH. Then let the > glass sit there for 24 hours and measure the pH > again. Whoa, wait a minute, > the pH has gone down! You got that right, it has. It > is seeking its own pH > level and it may drop dramatically during that 24 > hour period. The water > company only needs the high pH when the water is > flowing through their > pipes. This is possible to do. In fact, it is quite > easy to do, though not > entirely without expense, and perhaps causing some > other problems, such as > raising the toxicity of nitrogenous compounds in the > water. > > I can go on and on about this subject, as some > members of this list can > attest. There have been books written about it. Find > one. Read it. > > Your third point is also not necessary, so long as > you are providing your > fish the environment they need to stay healthy and > stress free. If you are > messing with the water in your step two, then the > fish probably need it to > help prolong their lives, though I can't say the > quality of their life is > made better by it. Actually, the products that claim > to help fish by > creating a better mucous coat on the fish actually > irritate the fish to > produce the mucous which protects the fish. So, > maybe you really don't need > that since the fish are probably already irritated > by your messing with the > water chemistry. > > This is not to say that there are instances where > such products can be > useful, even necessary to use, but using one on a > regular basis is probably > something you wish to avoid as much as possible. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Chris > Sent: Friday, August 19, 2005 10:17 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: What have I done > !????????? > > Typically three things go into new water before the > water goes in > the tank: > > 1) water purifier - find one which removes chlorine, > chloramines and > heavy metals > > 2) water conditioner (if your type of fish needs it) > - basically > salts that set the water hardness and pH (different > for different > kinds of fish - eg goldfish, tropicals, cichlids, > south american, > etc) > > 3) something to "ease the stress" on the fish. > > If anything is optional, the third one might be - > but the first two > are most important. In all cases, mix the water up > before putting it > in the tank, too. try and get the temperature > roughly the same as in > your tank, too - don't just use the cold water tap. > > Check the shelf-life of the product you used, too - > make sure it's > not out of date. > > Chris. >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14778	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: What have I done !?????????

Steve, this long speech does not excuse your original alarmist post which will turn a lot of newbys away from the hobby, If you cannot afford an RO/DI unit then buy the RO/DI water it is very cheep and much better than slowly poisoning your fish with the chemical soup that comes through most peoples taps, you got the RO rejection rate the wrong way round if you were right it would just prove my point!. I'm not saying that there is not some truth in some of your remarks, I'm objecting to the alarmist posts you are making and the damage they are doing to the hobby. By the way I'm very aware of water chemistry we have a commercial RO/DI water purification plant and sell potable drinking water, (and for fish tanks). I've said my piece and do not intend getting into an argument on this subject, so please if you wish to write in that vane make it very clear that it is your opinion and not fact. regards, unclenorm. --- Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > Unclenorm, > > If you read my post, I do not state that changing > water parameters is > impossible to do, but that once it is done, there is > a constant battle to > maintain the new parameters and there are dangers in > changing the > parameters. With most of the people on this list in > the early stages of the > hobby, this is not something they should be > considering, but accepting the > limitations of their water and the fish they can > successfully keep is what > they should be concerned with doing. > > The aquarium hobby has a high drop out rate of > people in the early stages of > learning how to keep fish. Many of the problems > could be resolved by keeping > fish that like the water conditions that are present > in the local water. > (Another problem is that many simply do not prepare > themselves before diving > into the hobby (pun intended). But that is another > topic in and of itself.) > > Using RO water requires an RO unit, starting at > $125+, along with > replacement membranes to produce enough water to > fill a 10 gallon tank a > day. There is also a tremendous ratio of waste water > to RO water, a 5:1 > figure is often seen, meaning it takes 5 gallons of > incoming tap water to > produce 1 gallon of RO water. Unless you are on a > private system (read your > own well), you are paying a price for each gallon of > water used. I am paying > $30-40 dollars a month for the normal water usage > here. For every 10 gallons > of water I produce using an RO filter, I will be > throwing away 40 gallons of > water. True, some of this can be recycled in the > garden, but after a while, > if I were to use all the water that way, I'd be > raising bog plants instead > of my bearded iris and daylilies. (The cactus do not > require much water at > all.) Then, I need to reconstitute the water per the > requirements of the > fish. This requires the purchase of mixtures to add > to the water, or the > purchase and measurements of the various chemicals > and compounds I would > need (and I do have recipes for those stashed away > somewhere). This is not > something you would want to be doing if you are a > newcomer to the hobby. > > The use of the examples of the water companies is so > that people can verify > easily what I am saying, and also answers those > questions about rapid pH > drops that some people have reported here. Since > probably 90% of the people > here are on some form of municipal water system, it > is an apt example. > > There are a number of books and many articles > available that discuss water > chemistry relating to aquariums out there. Some are > mere generalizations, > but many go into depth on various aspects of water > chemistry. I have > mentioned one book here several times and still do > recommend it, though it > can be a bit hard to find. Most consider it to be > the bible when it comes to > water chemistry, though I'll not give it that > sobriquet, it is a well > written book that goes into all the basic aspects in > great depth with, > sometimes lengthy, references to other articles and > published works. It is > "Fish and Invertebrate Culture, Second Edition", by > Stephen Spotte. A > warming goes along with this recommendation. You > need to have had at least a > high school chemistry course to be able to > understand the book, and even > then it may not be easy. > > An accomplished aquarist may wish to start > experimenting with changing water > parameters to keep specific fish, however it is not > something a novice > should be experimenting with. It is difficult enough > to learn the nitrogen > cycle and to maintain it for many beginners, hence > all the quick fixes to be > found on the market, many of which are worthless or > even dangerous to use > (dangerous for the health of your fish). At best, > the better products can > shave a couple of weeks off the cycle or convert the > nitrogenous products to > harmless compounds that still allow the cycle to > complete. > > I will continue to maintain that if you do not > understand water chemistry, > you should not attempt to change it. Period. No > argument allowed. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Norman. S. Hampson. > Sent: Sunday, August 21, 2005 2:15 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: What have I done > !????????? > > Hi Steve, > I'm very surprised at this alarmist post, > there is nothing at all wrong with changing the > water > parameters to suit the fish, there are many ways of > doing it totally non dangerous!!, it is done all the > time by thousands of hobbyists and breeders alike, > your statement that people should only buy fish to > suit there tap water is rather ridiculous to say the > least. If there is anything dangerous it is the use > of > tap water! especialy in a marine tank, I'm sure you > must know what RO/DI is ?. I would suggest that you > need to read up on water chemistry as it applies to > this hobby, totally different to water company > prioritys. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > > > Chris, > > > > Of your three things, 2 and 3 are not needed. > > > > Your second item about changing the water > chemistry > > is downright dangerous. > > One should be maintain fish with the water > chemistry > > that is available, not > > trying to change it to suit the fish. If a fish > > requires hard water, your > > water should be hard out of the tap. If a fish > > requires soft acid water, > > that should be your water out of the tap. The only > > change that should be > > made is to add a marine salt should you be keeping > > brackish fish or marine > > fish, which changes the water subtly. > > > > If you have a high pH and you want to keep rams, > > well, you will should not > > be messing with the pH and find a fish that will > do > > well in a high pH > > environment. When you try to lower the pH of the > > water, you are fighting > > against the natural buffering capacity of the > water. > > If you are able to > > break this buffering capacity, you will then be > > faced with what is known as > > a pH crash, in which the pH can get so low that > you > > will not be able to keep > > fish in the water for any length of time. > > > > Raising the pH is less risky to do, but then you > > will be fighting a constant > > uphill battle as the water tries to maintain its > > natural pH. > > > > Well, you might say, water companies raise the pH > of > > their water supply all > > the time to prevent their pipes from becoming > > corroded. You are right--they > > do. However, draw a glass of that water and > measure > > the pH. Then let the > > glass sit there for 24 hours and measure the pH > > again. Whoa, wait a minute, > > the pH has gone down! You got that right, it has. > It > > is seeking its own pH > > level and it may drop dramatically during that 24 > > hour period. The water > > company only needs the high pH when the water is > > flowing through their > > pipes. This is possible to do. In fact, it is > quite > > easy to do, though not > > entirely without expense, and perhaps causing some > > other problems, such as > > raising the toxicity of nitrogenous compounds in > the > > water. > > > > I can go on and on about this subject, as some > > members of this list can > > attest. There have been books written about it. > Find > > one. Read it. > > > > Your third point is also not necessary, so long as > > you are providing your > > fish the environment they need to stay healthy and > > stress free. If you are > > messing with the water in your step two, then the > > fish probably need it to > > help prolong their lives, though I can't say the > > quality of their life is > > made better by it. Actually, the products that > claim > > to help fish by > > creating a better mucous coat on the fish actually > > irritate the fish to > > produce the mucous which protects the fish. So, > > maybe you really don't need > > that since the fish are probably already irritated > > by your messing with the > > water chemistry. > > > > This is not to say that there are instances where > > such products can be > > useful, even necessary to use, but using one on a > > regular basis is probably > > something you wish to avoid as much as possible. > > > > \\Steve// > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Chris > > Sent: Friday, August 19, 2005 10:17 AM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: What have I done > > !????????? > > > > Typically three things go into new water before > the > > water goes in > > the tank: > > > > 1) water purifier - find one which removes > chlorine, > > chloramines and > > heavy metals > > > > 2) water conditioner (if your type of fish needs > it) > > - basically > > salts that set the water hardness and pH > (different > > for different > > kinds of fish - eg goldfish, tropicals, cichlids, > > south american, > > etc) > > > > 3) something to "ease the stress" on the fish. > > > > If anything is optional, the third one might be - > > but the first two > > are most important. In all cases, mix the water up > > before putting it > > in the tank, too. try and get the temperature > > roughly the same as in > > your tank, too - don't just use the cold water > tap. > > > > Check the shelf-life of the product you used, too > - > > make sure it's > > not out of date. > > > > Chris. > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. http://uk.security.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14779	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: What have I done !?????????

Unclenorm, Nothing I have said was said in an alarmist way. It is simple fact. I can give references if you prefer, or you can look it up on your own. RO/DI water is not for sale in this area at any grocery store, any fish store, or any place I have been. I know that in some areas of the country it is readily available, but not everywhere, and I do live in a metropolitan area now. Coming clean in stating that ". . . we have a commercial RO/DI water purification plant . . ." does put quite a different spin on your posts concerning water than was obvious prior to this. I speak as a hobbyist and a person concerned not only about the fish and their well being, but as one who is aware of costs associated with the hobby, and they can become substantial indeed, depending on one's involvement. The ratio I gave (5:1) is one that has been mentioned frequently in discussions on RO. It does vary depending on the quality of the water prior to processing, but one will never reach a 1:1 ratio. Replacement of membranes and filters is a recurring cost also. Again, since many who read and participate on this list are novices, they need to learn the basics prior to getting into the more esoteric parts of the hobby, such as changing water chemistry. Many just want to be able to keep some pretty fish, and that can be accomplished no matter what kind of water is available, since there are fish available for all types of water. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Norman. S. Hampson. Sent: Sunday, August 21, 2005 11:21 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: What have I done !????????? Steve, this long speech does not excuse your original alarmist post which will turn a lot of newbys away from the hobby, If you cannot afford an RO/DI unit then buy the RO/DI water it is very cheep and much better than slowly poisoning your fish with the chemical soup that comes through most peoples taps, you got the RO rejection rate the wrong way round if you were right it would just prove my point!. I'm not saying that there is not some truth in some of your remarks, I'm objecting to the alarmist posts you are making and the damage they are doing to the hobby. By the way I'm very aware of water chemistry we have a commercial RO/DI water purification plant and sell potable drinking water, (and for fish tanks). I've said my piece and do not intend getting into an argument on this subject, so please if you wish to write in that vane make it very clear that it is your opinion and not fact. regards, unclenorm. --- Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > Unclenorm, > > If you read my post, I do not state that changing > water parameters is > impossible to do, but that once it is done, there is > a constant battle to > maintain the new parameters and there are dangers in > changing the > parameters. With most of the people on this list in > the early stages of the > hobby, this is not something they should be > considering, but accepting the > limitations of their water and the fish they can > successfully keep is what > they should be concerned with doing. > > The aquarium hobby has a high drop out rate of > people in the early stages of > learning how to keep fish. Many of the problems > could be resolved by keeping > fish that like the water conditions that are present > in the local water. > (Another problem is that many simply do not prepare > themselves before diving > into the hobby (pun intended). But that is another > topic in and of itself.) > > Using RO water requires an RO unit, starting at > $125+, along with > replacement membranes to produce enough water to > fill a 10 gallon tank a > day. There is also a tremendous ratio of waste water > to RO water, a 5:1 > figure is often seen, meaning it takes 5 gallons of > incoming tap water to > produce 1 gallon of RO water. Unless you are on a > private system (read your > own well), you are paying a price for each gallon of > water used. I am paying > $30-40 dollars a month for the normal water usage > here. For every 10 gallons > of water I produce using an RO filter, I will be > throwing away 40 gallons of > water. True, some of this can be recycled in the > garden, but after a while, > if I were to use all the water that way, I'd be > raising bog plants instead > of my bearded iris and daylilies. (The cactus do not > require much water at > all.) Then, I need to reconstitute the water per the > requirements of the > fish. This requires the purchase of mixtures to add > to the water, or the > purchase and measurements of the various chemicals > and compounds I would > need (and I do have recipes for those stashed away > somewhere). This is not > something you would want to be doing if you are a > newcomer to the hobby. > > The use of the examples of the water companies is so > that people can verify > easily what I am saying, and also answers those > questions about rapid pH > drops that some people have reported here. Since > probably 90% of the people > here are on some form of municipal water system, it > is an apt example. > > There are a number of books and many articles > available that discuss water > chemistry relating to aquariums out there. Some are > mere generalizations, > but many go into depth on various aspects of water > chemistry. I have > mentioned one book here several times and still do > recommend it, though it > can be a bit hard to find. Most consider it to be > the bible when it comes to > water chemistry, though I'll not give it that > sobriquet, it is a well > written book that goes into all the basic aspects in > great depth with, > sometimes lengthy, references to other articles and > published works. It is > "Fish and Invertebrate Culture, Second Edition", by > Stephen Spotte. A > warming goes along with this recommendation. You > need to have had at least a > high school chemistry course to be able to > understand the book, and even > then it may not be easy. > > An accomplished aquarist may wish to start > experimenting with changing water > parameters to keep specific fish, however it is not > something a novice > should be experimenting with. It is difficult enough > to learn the nitrogen > cycle and to maintain it for many beginners, hence > all the quick fixes to be > found on the market, many of which are worthless or > even dangerous to use > (dangerous for the health of your fish). At best, > the better products can > shave a couple of weeks off the cycle or convert the > nitrogenous products to > harmless compounds that still allow the cycle to > complete. > > I will continue to maintain that if you do not > understand water chemistry, > you should not attempt to change it. Period. No > argument allowed. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Norman. S. Hampson. > Sent: Sunday, August 21, 2005 2:15 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: What have I done > !????????? > > Hi Steve, > I'm very surprised at this alarmist post, > there is nothing at all wrong with changing the > water > parameters to suit the fish, there are many ways of > doing it totally non dangerous!!, it is done all the > time by thousands of hobbyists and breeders alike, > your statement that people should only buy fish to > suit there tap water is rather ridiculous to say the > least. If there is anything dangerous it is the use > of > tap water! especialy in a marine tank, I'm sure you > must know what RO/DI is ?. I would suggest that you > need to read up on water chemistry as it applies to > this hobby, totally different to water company > prioritys. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > > > Chris, > > > > Of your three things, 2 and 3 are not needed. > > > > Your second item about changing the water > chemistry > > is downright dangerous. > > One should be maintain fish with the water > chemistry > > that is available, not > > trying to change it to suit the fish. If a fish > > requires hard water, your > > water should be hard out of the tap. If a fish > > requires soft acid water, > > that should be your water out of the tap. The only > > change that should be > > made is to add a marine salt should you be keeping > > brackish fish or marine > > fish, which changes the water subtly. > > > > If you have a high pH and you want to keep rams, > > well, you will should not > > be messing with the pH and find a fish that will > do > > well in a high pH > > environment. When you try to lower the pH of the > > water, you are fighting > > against the natural buffering capacity of the > water. > > If you are able to > > break this buffering capacity, you will then be > > faced with what is known as > > a pH crash, in which the pH can get so low that > you > > will not be able to keep > > fish in the water for any length of time. > > > > Raising the pH is less risky to do, but then you > > will be fighting a constant > > uphill battle as the water tries to maintain its > > natural pH. > > > > Well, you might say, water companies raise the pH > of > > their water supply all > > the time to prevent their pipes from becoming > > corroded. You are right--they > > do. However, draw a glass of that water and > measure > > the pH. Then let the > > glass sit there for 24 hours and measure the pH > > again. Whoa, wait a minute, > > the pH has gone down! You got that right, it has. > It > > is seeking its own pH > > level and it may drop dramatically during that 24 > > hour period. The water > > company only needs the high pH when the water is > > flowing through their > > pipes. This is possible to do. In fact, it is > quite > > easy to do, though not > > entirely without expense, and perhaps causing some > > other problems, such as > > raising the toxicity of nitrogenous compounds in > the > > water. > > > > I can go on and on about this subject, as some > > members of this list can > > attest. There have been books written about it. > Find > > one. Read it. > > > > Your third point is also not necessary, so long as > > you are providing your > > fish the environment they need to stay healthy and > > stress free. If you are > > messing with the water in your step two, then the > > fish probably need it to > > help prolong their lives, though I can't say the > > quality of their life is > > made better by it. Actually, the products that > claim > > to help fish by > > creating a better mucous coat on the fish actually > > irritate the fish to > > produce the mucous which protects the fish. So, > > maybe you really don't need > > that since the fish are probably already irritated > > by your messing with the > > water chemistry. > > > > This is not to say that there are instances where > > such products can be > > useful, even necessary to use, but using one on a > > regular basis is probably > > something you wish to avoid as much as possible. > > > > \\Steve// > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Chris > > Sent: Friday, August 19, 2005 10:17 AM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: What have I done > > !????????? > > > > Typically three things go into new water before > the > > water goes in > > the tank: > > > > 1) water purifier - find one which removes > chlorine, > > chloramines and > > heavy metals > > > > 2) water conditioner (if your type of fish needs > it) > > - basically > > salts that set the water hardness and pH > (different > > for different > > kinds of fish - eg goldfish, tropicals, cichlids, > > south american, > > etc) > > > > 3) something to "ease the stress" on the fish. > > > > If anything is optional, the third one might be - > > but the first two > > are most important. In all cases, mix the water up > > before putting it > > in the tank, too. try and get the temperature > > roughly the same as in > > your tank, too - don't just use the cold water > tap. > > > > Check the shelf-life of the product you used, too > - > > make sure it's > > not out of date. > > > > Chris. > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14780	From: bristolia	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Questions About Fauna of Lake Titicaca

First, I am looking for any information, especially published articles, about Hippocampus titicacaensis, which was reported as having been found in Lake Titicaca, Bolivia by Posnansky (1943). Any citations, where the occurence of this or any other spieces of Hippocampus in Lake Titicaca is discussed, that a person can provide me, would be greatly appreciated. Finally, I am trying to obtain the specific bibliographic information for two articles, which discuss the fishes og Lake Titicaca, Bolivia. I need the year of publication for volume 24 of "Aqua Geographia" and page numbers on which an article titled "Pre-Columbian" appears within it. I also need for the May 2004 issue of "Tropical Fish Hobbyist", the page numbers on which an article, "Monster Killies! Introducing the Orestias of Lake Titicaca", is found; the issue number of the May 2004 issue; and the author of this article. I would be quite grateful if anyone could provide the bliographic data, which I am missing above, for either or both of these citations. Reference Cited Posnansky, Arthur, 1943, Tihuanacu: the Cradle of American Man. J. J. Augustin Publisher, New York. Best Regards, Paul Heinrich Baton Rouge, LA 70803

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14781	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: changing water parameters

Won';t many fish also adapt to different water conditions that aren't too radically different from what they need? I have Violet gobies that are thriving in freshwater. They are brackish to fresh fish. I add the tsp/5 gals of aquarium salts to my tank and maintain the level when I change water. The only other additive that I use is Melafix, which I add when I do a large water change or when I add new fish. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of thesydmonster Sent: Sunday, August 21, 2005 9:18 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: changing water parameters I was told when I started this hobby a whopping 6 months ago to get fish that would be comfortable in the water that I have from my tap. My pH is a little on the high side at 7.6 to 7.8 and I realize not all fish do well at that pH so I have avoided any fish that would need me to change the water parameters. I realize this could be done (peat, crushed coral, etc) and have read several articles on it but I am new and just want to enjoy healthy fish without doing a lot of changes that, if I messed up, would kill all my fish. Maybe when I am more comfortable and understand it all more completely, I would consider lowering or raising my pH/adjusting GH or KH, etc and getting different fish but I am very happy right now. I am told that as long as I keep things the same, the fish will do fine and so far, so good! Rebecca Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14782	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: Discus, ich, and high temps/ to AC

Norm, Don't you think I already know that there is always fish present in the tank waiting for the opportunity to infect az weakened fish? I did not just start in this hobby yesterday. However, once Ich has already been seen to manifest one fish, it is EXTREMELY possible (I would say probable) that now instead of this protozoan merely existing in normal numbers, through infecting one fish it has now had the chance to multiply profusely putting the remainder of the fish population at risk. All's it takes is for one newly latent encysted trophont having recently fallen off a fresh host to release its new generation of dinospores, to promptly seek out other fish in overwhelming numbers. Keep in mind, each trophont will release between 500 and 2200 new dinospores. I hope you don't feel its impossible for additional previously healthy fish to now get infected with Ich spores. I maintain that it is in the best interest of all piscine aquarium inhabitants to be treated against any possible infestation. Incidentally, how did you get on the off-beat thread of marine fish when the main topic of discussion dealt with AC's Discus? My posts on this topic deal exclusively with fresh water Ichyophthirius multifiliis, and I do not care to include in this discussion Cryptocaryon as it is not germane to this matter. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > Ray, > It is claimed by many of the experts that ich is > always present in a tank just waiting for an under par > fish to attach, so I believe that that fish should be > removed to quarantine before the dormant rich can > rejuvenate and infest the other fish in the tank. I am > inclined to believe this dormancy theory as I've seen > outbreaks in long established tanks both fresh and > salt water were there have been no changes of any kind > kind in a long time, except one under par fish through > a territorial squabble or some other reason, the quick > removal of the effected fish has brought the tank back > to normal. Tell me how would you treat a large salt > water reef tank 325gall that is normally running at > 32/33C. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > Hi Norm, While you may believe that all fish with > > problems should be > > treated in quarantine, my belief is that most (but > > not all) problems > > should be treated in quarantine. One of my main > > exceptions to this > > is when a fish shows symptoms of Ich. As I see it, > > by the time this > > is seen on just one fish, Ich has multiplied or is > > about to multiply > > in the water column many times over, putting any > > other fish in that > > tank at risk of contracting it. In this situation, > > I believe it is > > best to treat the entire tank to prevent the Ich > > from the probability > > (or even possibility) of spreading to the other > > inhabitants as can so > > very easily occur -- its very cheap insurance. In > > my estimation, it > > is nothing short of negligence not to treat the main > > tank in hopes > > that it won't spread, as once the second round of > > new free-swimming > > cysts release their populations (being many times > > over the original) > > the odds of any other fish getting this is greatly > > increased. To not > > act responsibly is like burying your head in the > > sand. Ray > > \ > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. > > Hampson." > > <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > > Hi Ray, > > > I've said many times fish with problems > > should > > > be treated in quarantein, Any container big enough > > > will do. There are dozens more such sites to be > > found > > > on the net. > > > regards, > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > > > > > Hi Norman, Just went up to these 4 sites you > > > > mentioned, out of > > > > curiousity. Looks like there's some good > > > > information there that may > > > > not have been known to our newcomers. One thing > > I > > > > did notice, there > > > > doesn't seem to be anything there that would > > inform > > > > AC of how to > > > > proceed with his treatment of Ich as the last > > two > > > > sites recommend > > > > treatment by medication (only), which AC prefers > > not > > > > to do. The third > > > > site even refers to Quick-Cure and Rid-Ich (both > > I > > > > believe containing > > > > malachite green) which should not be used with > > Clown > > > > Loaches, but > > > > something AC fortunately already realizes. The > > > > first site recommends > > > > raising the temperature up to 25 o C (77 o F) > > which > > > > may help Koi, but > > > > would be useless in treating tropicals. With > > the > > > > second site, I got > > > > the message "Can't Find Web Site". Don't know > > if > > > > that site still > > > > exists or maybe its just my server. Just > > thought > > > > I'd pass this along > > > > in case you haven't actually read these sites. > > Ray > > > > > > > > \ > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. > > > > Hampson." > > > > <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > > > > Hi AC, > > > > > Here are some links about Ich (Ick), you > > > > will > > > > > find all the information you need to overcome > > your > > > > > problem, :- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.fishdoc.co.uk/disease/whitespot.htm > > > > > > > > > > http://fishorbust.net/ich.html > > > > > > > > > > http://www.nunnie.com/ick.html > > > > > > > > > > http://badmanstropicalfish.com/meds/ick.html > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > unclenorm > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- aclaar877 <aclaar877@y...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Ray, thanks. > > > > > > > > > > > > I do have 0 nitrites, as well as 0 nitrates. > > > > > > Most > > > > > > plants are doing > > > > > > great, though maybe some nitrates will help > > the > > > > red > > > > > > ammania > > > > > > gracillis I have. I'll keep the heat up, > > but > > > > > > probably won't do salt > > > > > > because of the plants. Do you know if the > > white > > > > > > spots are the > > > > > > parasites themselves, or reactions to the > > > > parasite? > > > > > > If there is a > > > > > > delay between the parasite attaching itself > > and > > > > the > > > > > > appearance of a > > > > > > spot, I may be ahead of where I thought I > > was as > > > > far > > > > > > as the ich > > > > > > cycle is concerned. > > > > > > > > > > > > AC > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray > > Wetzel" > > > > > > > > > > <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > > > > > To Whom it May Concern (no signature): > > > > > > Generally, Ich find it > > > > > > > difficult to reproduce above 86 o. > > > > Occassionally, > > > > > > you might run > > > > > > across > > > > > > > a particularly virulent and resistant > > strain > > > > which > > > > > > may be able to > > > > > > > endure temperatures up to 90 o. Their > > getting > > > > > > more spots may just > > > > > > be a > > > > > > > delayed reaction and once these cysts drop > > off > > > > > > they should not be > > > > > > able > > > > > > > to multiply very freely, if at all (unless > > its > > > > a > > > > > > resistant > > > > > > strain). If > > > > > > > the spots are still few, I would go with > > the > > > > heat > > > > > > treatment and > > > > > > add no > > > > > > > more than 1 tbs of salt per 5 gallons -- > > you > > > > have > > > > > > Tetras. Give it > > > > > > 2 > > > > > > > days if you can (if there's not a heavy > > > > > > infestation) and see what > > > > > > it > > > > > > > looks like by then. If you find that > > you're > > > > up > > > > > > against a more > > > > > > virulent > > > > > > > strain, you may need to move to a > > medication, > > > > but > > > > > > do not under any > > > > > > > circumstances use a malachite green (or > > any > > > > other > > > > > > dye) based > > > > > > > medication -- it will kill your scaleless > > > > Loaches. > > > > > > So keep the > > > > > > > temperature up and keep an eye on things. > > > > And, I > > > > > > hope you meant a > > > > > > > reading of 0 for your nitrItes. > > > > > > Ray > > > > > > > > > > > > > \ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > > > > -- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, > > "aclaar877" > > > > > > <aclaar877@y...> > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > Just added four discus to 155g planted > > tank > > > > on > > > > > > Sunday, and three > > > > > > have > > > > > > > > developed some ich spots. A few > > cardinals > > > > and > > > > > > both clown > > > > > > loaches > > > > > > > have > > > > > > > > them as well. Temperature has never > > been > > > > below > > > > > > 86--I thought > > > > > > ich > > > > > > > > wouldn't spread at those temps? I now > > have > > > > the > > > > > > temp at about 88- > > > > > > 89, > > > > > > > > and the discus are getting even more > > spots. > > > > > > They are still > > > > > > eating > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > not yet scratching against things. > > Should I > > > > > > keep the > > > > > > temperature > > > > > > > high > > > > > > > > and wait it out, or start the Quick-Cure > > > > > > malachite green > > > > > > medication? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Water quality is high, with 0 ammonia > > and 0 > > > > > > nitrates. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I'd like to hear what any other discus > > > > owners > > > > > > have done in this > > > > > > > > situation. I don't want to medicate if > > I > > > > don't > > > > > > have to, but > > > > > > would > > > > > > > > hate for the ich to rapidly spread and > > kill > > > > the > > > > > > fish quicker > > > > > > than I > > > > > > > > can react. Thanks. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > > > > > > > To help you stay safe and secure online, we've > > > > developed the all > > > > new Yahoo! Security Centre. > > > > http://uk.security.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > > > To help you stay safe and secure online, we've > > developed the all > > new Yahoo! Security Centre. > > http://uk.security.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14783	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: How many angelfishes in a tank?

I have two tanks, one a 30 gallon tank which has at this moment five Angelfishes and my 55 gallon tank that has yet to be filled with my Angelfish and the new Angelfishes that will be coming soon. How many females to one male should I have in my tank? Two females per male or one female to one male? I got no bubble nests or whatever they do to make a nest yet, but I have found that my male has started to swim with one of my females and not letting any of the other females get near her. So I am figuring that he has decided she is his mate. But I would like to know how many Angelfishes I can have in my 55 gallon tank? I think I can have about twenty to my tank. But it will get crowded if they have fry. Beth http://fa.f-realm.com/ Fanfiction Axis. http://e.webring.com/hub?ring=siriusblack Sirius Black webring. http://e.webring.com/hub?ring=remuslupin Remus Lupin webring http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sailorsenshiocs/ for all original and series characters of Sailor Moon. http://www.livejournal.com/userinfo.bml?user=tropical_fishes Tropical fish tank livejournal community. ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14784	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: Quarantine

I keep mine empty till needed as either a Q-tank or H-tank (hospital). I have two extra 10G rated HOB's on the back my other tanks so when I need to set up the Q or H tank, I can just move one of them to the tank and the filter media is fully cycled and ready for the minor bio-load of the tank. I also have extra decorations and plastic plants that I can move to the Q or H tank which also have the good bacteria on them. I also keep extra filter pads in my main HOB's and canister filter in case I ever need even more cycled filter media for another filter or a friend. Now, if I had an outbreak in one of my display tanks, I would have to decide whether to treat the tank or move the fish and break down the tank. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2005 22:26:22 -0000 From: "thesydmonster" <TheSydMonster@...> Subject: Quarantine Do you keep a QT tank set up all the time? How do you keep the bacteria going? Do you QT everything including plants and inverts such as snails? Rebecca [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14785	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: How many angelfishes in a tank?

Angelfish are a beautiful peace loving cichlid but can be very nasty and aggressive towards others, when it comes breeding or spawning time. Well if you do get a mated pair in your 55 gallon tank, out of 20 angelfish plan on loosing a few. Angelfish are cichlids, and once Cichlids spawn they become overly protective. Your mated pair of Angelfish will try and stake as much of the tank as possible. Running anyone or anything out of there territory. You might be best in leaving your mated pair in the 30 and the rest of the Angelfish in the 55. But once you get another Pair in the 55 plan on moving them to another tank. I am no Angelfish breeder or even an angelfish keeper, but I would sugest no more then 4 or 5 Angelfish to a 55 gallon tank with lots of other fish. Angelfish lay there eggs on a Vertical surface usually the side of a piece of slate or piece of glass, etc. Your Angelfish might eat there first couple of batches of eggs. There is a Lot of info on Angelfish on the internet and I'd suggest doing more research about them before stocking your 55 gallon tank. Touched by Angels a great sight with Lots and lots of info on Angelfish. Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 8/21/2005 2:09:04 PM US Eastern Standard Time, spencer_creek_studios@... writes: I have two tanks, one a 30 gallon tank which has at this moment five Angelfishes and my 55 gallon tank that has yet to be filled with my Angelfish and the new Angelfishes that will be coming soon. How many females to one male should I have in my tank? Two females per male or one female to one male? I got no bubble nests or whatever they do to make a nest yet, but I have found that my male has started to swim with one of my females and not letting any of the other females get near her. So I am figuring that he has decided she is his mate. But I would like to know how many Angelfishes I can have in my 55 gallon tank? I think I can have about twenty to my tank. But it will get crowded if they have fry. Beth Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14786	From: jim	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > I don't, but I know someone who does have a tank in one of the two bathrooms > in their home. > > Anybody have an aquarium in their bathroom yet? > > Linda ---i had a 1 gal hex in the john,,, a little disconcerting,,, everytime you use it , the guppies want food,,,, JIM

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14787	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: angels and discus

This is like a 20 or 29 gallon tank. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of jim Sent: Sunday, August 21, 2005 5:08 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: angels and discus --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > I don't, but I know someone who does have a tank in one of the two bathrooms > in their home. > > Anybody have an aquarium in their bathroom yet? > > Linda ---i had a 1 gal hex in the john,,, a little disconcerting,,, everytime you use it , the guppies want food,,,, JIM

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14788	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: Newbie w/question(s). TIA

Erin, Are your gold gouramis doing this "dance" in unison or separately? This is probably a behavior issue, and may not be anything to worry about, unless they are facing off to each other and possibly sparring for dominance. As for the feeding, you can feed as often as you like, so long s the fish eat all the food placed in the tank. I'll normally feed once or twice a day, unless I'm feeding fry, then they get much more food. In the wild, which was alluded to in another post, fish can be said to be "opportunistic" feeders. When food is present they eat. When it is not present, they do not eat. You may wish to skip a day or two every so often in your feeding regimen, to more realistically mimic the natural state. Be sure to feed them a variety of foods to help ensure they get the nutrients they need. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Erin Cunningham Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2005 10:29 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Newbie w/question(s). TIA Hiya! Newbie here, please be gentle! Hee!Hee! A few questions... I have a couple of Gold Gouramis that are 'twitching', according to my 9yr old. They swim around the tank (55gal).. go to their favorite corner in the back and then stay facing in one direction, but go forward and back.. Is this normal??? After awhile, they take off around the tank and the cycle starts again! I have a couple of Blue's, but they don't do that. Also, how many times DO you feed fish?? I've read anywhere from once to three times. I fed them 3 times yesterday and now have 3 dead fish to show for this!!! TIA for your help!! Erin Who doesn't want to lose anymore fish if she can help it!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14789	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: changing water parameters

Many fish can survive in water that is not particularly to their liking. The key here is survive. They survive but do not thrive. Now, the fish you are speaking of, violet gobies, are horses of a different color. There are a number of species like them, either classified mainly in the freshwater world or the marine world. They can live in varying water conditions. Violet gobies may survive in fresh water, and they may survive in salt water. However to get them to thrive, they need water with a lower concentration of salt than the ocean, but more than that of fresh water. In fact, many fishes of this type do better if you vary the salinity of the tank either by adding no salt when you do a water change, or adding extra salt when you do a water change. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Roberts Sent: Sunday, August 21, 2005 12:28 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: changing water parameters Won';t many fish also adapt to different water conditions that aren't too radically different from what they need? I have Violet gobies that are thriving in freshwater. They are brackish to fresh fish. I add the tsp/5 gals of aquarium salts to my tank and maintain the level when I change water. The only other additive that I use is Melafix, which I add when I do a large water change or when I add new fish. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of thesydmonster Sent: Sunday, August 21, 2005 9:18 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: changing water parameters I was told when I started this hobby a whopping 6 months ago to get fish that would be comfortable in the water that I have from my tap. My pH is a little on the high side at 7.6 to 7.8 and I realize not all fish do well at that pH so I have avoided any fish that would need me to change the water parameters. I realize this could be done (peat, crushed coral, etc) and have read several articles on it but I am new and just want to enjoy healthy fish without doing a lot of changes that, if I messed up, would kill all my fish. Maybe when I am more comfortable and understand it all more completely, I would consider lowering or raising my pH/adjusting GH or KH, etc and getting different fish but I am very happy right now. I am told that as long as I keep things the same, the fish will do fine and so far, so good! Rebecca

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14790	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: Questions About Fauna of Lake Titicaca

I'm not able to get there today, but http://www.fishbase.org generally has references to fish in its database, so you can check there. Only found on reference to the seahorse from a Google search, and that is a caption for a picture that appeared on the back cover of a journal called Aqua, Vol. 5 Issue 4, dated July 2002. The genus made me think seahorse, but the location threw me off. The caption also explains that there was a clay seahorse dating back more than 2000 years unearthed in the Lake Titicaca area, which means that the seahorse was there more than a few years <g>. I've not been a regular reader of TFH for years, and I do not see the issue you refer to in my stack, so I cannot help you there. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of bristolia Sent: Sunday, August 21, 2005 11:47 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Questions About Fauna of Lake Titicaca First, I am looking for any information, especially published articles, about Hippocampus titicacaensis, which was reported as having been found in Lake Titicaca, Bolivia by Posnansky (1943). Any citations, where the occurence of this or any other spieces of Hippocampus in Lake Titicaca is discussed, that a person can provide me, would be greatly appreciated. Finally, I am trying to obtain the specific bibliographic information for two articles, which discuss the fishes og Lake Titicaca, Bolivia. I need the year of publication for volume 24 of "Aqua Geographia" and page numbers on which an article titled "Pre-Columbian" appears within it. I also need for the May 2004 issue of "Tropical Fish Hobbyist", the page numbers on which an article, "Monster Killies! Introducing the Orestias of Lake Titicaca", is found; the issue number of the May 2004 issue; and the author of this article. I would be quite grateful if anyone could provide the bliographic data, which I am missing above, for either or both of these citations. Reference Cited Posnansky, Arthur, 1943, Tihuanacu: the Cradle of American Man. J. J. Augustin Publisher, New York. Best Regards, Paul Heinrich Baton Rouge, LA 70803 Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14791	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: Discus, ich, and high temps/ to AC - Correction

Correction/clarification: This should have read: Don't you think I already know that there is always Ich present in the tank waiting for the opportunity to infect a weakened fish? Could have sworn that's what I wrote in the first place, but discovered such wasn't the case. Too bad these original posts aren't correctable as they are on other forums. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > Norm, Don't you think I already know that there is always fish > present in the tank waiting for the opportunity to infect az weakened > fish? I did not just start in this hobby yesterday. However, once > Ich has already been seen to manifest one fish, it is EXTREMELY > possible (I would say probable) that now instead of this protozoan > merely existing in normal numbers, through infecting one fish it has > now had the chance to multiply profusely putting the remainder of the > fish population at risk. All's it takes is for one newly latent > encysted trophont having recently fallen off a fresh host to release > its new generation of dinospores, to promptly seek out other fish in > overwhelming numbers. Keep in mind, each trophont will release > between 500 and 2200 new dinospores. I hope you don't feel its > impossible for additional previously healthy fish to now get infected > with Ich spores. I maintain that it is in the best interest of all > piscine aquarium inhabitants to be treated against any possible > infestation. Incidentally, how did you get on the off-beat thread of > marine fish when the main topic of discussion dealt with AC's > Discus? My posts on this topic deal exclusively with fresh water > Ichyophthirius multifiliis, and I do not care to include in this > discussion Cryptocaryon as it is not germane to this matter. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. Hampson." > <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > Ray, > > It is claimed by many of the experts that ich is > > always present in a tank just waiting for an under par > > fish to attach, so I believe that that fish should be > > removed to quarantine before the dormant rich can > > rejuvenate and infest the other fish in the tank. I am > > inclined to believe this dormancy theory as I've seen > > outbreaks in long established tanks both fresh and > > salt water were there have been no changes of any kind > > kind in a long time, except one under par fish through > > a territorial squabble or some other reason, the quick > > removal of the effected fish has brought the tank back > > to normal. Tell me how would you treat a large salt > > water reef tank 325gall that is normally running at > > 32/33C. > > regards, > > unclenorm. > > > > > > --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > > > Hi Norm, While you may believe that all fish with > > > problems should be > > > treated in quarantine, my belief is that most (but > > > not all) problems > > > should be treated in quarantine. One of my main > > > exceptions to this > > > is when a fish shows symptoms of Ich. As I see it, > > > by the time this > > > is seen on just one fish, Ich has multiplied or is > > > about to multiply > > > in the water column many times over, putting any > > > other fish in that > > > tank at risk of contracting it. In this situation, > > > I believe it is > > > best to treat the entire tank to prevent the Ich > > > from the probability > > > (or even possibility) of spreading to the other > > > inhabitants as can so > > > very easily occur -- its very cheap insurance. In > > > my estimation, it > > > is nothing short of negligence not to treat the main > > > tank in hopes > > > that it won't spread, as once the second round of > > > new free-swimming > > > cysts release their populations (being many times > > > over the original) > > > the odds of any other fish getting this is greatly > > > increased. To not > > > act responsibly is like burying your head in the > > > sand. Ray > > > \ > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. > > > Hampson." > > > <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > > > Hi Ray, > > > > I've said many times fish with problems > > > should > > > > be treated in quarantein, Any container big enough > > > > will do. There are dozens more such sites to be > > > found > > > > on the net. > > > > regards, > > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Hi Norman, Just went up to these 4 sites you > > > > > mentioned, out of > > > > > curiousity. Looks like there's some good > > > > > information there that may > > > > > not have been known to our newcomers. One thing > > > I > > > > > did notice, there > > > > > doesn't seem to be anything there that would > > > inform > > > > > AC of how to > > > > > proceed with his treatment of Ich as the last > > > two > > > > > sites recommend > > > > > treatment by medication (only), which AC prefers > > > not > > > > > to do. The third > > > > > site even refers to Quick-Cure and Rid-Ich (both > > > I > > > > > believe containing > > > > > malachite green) which should not be used with > > > Clown > > > > > Loaches, but > > > > > something AC fortunately already realizes. The > > > > > first site recommends > > > > > raising the temperature up to 25 o C (77 o F) > > > which > > > > > may help Koi, but > > > > > would be useless in treating tropicals. With > > > the > > > > > second site, I got > > > > > the message "Can't Find Web Site". Don't know > > > if > > > > > that site still > > > > > exists or maybe its just my server. Just > > > thought > > > > > I'd pass this along > > > > > in case you haven't actually read these sites. > > > Ray > > > > > > > > > > \ > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. > > > > > Hampson." > > > > > <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > > > > > Hi AC, > > > > > > Here are some links about Ich (Ick), you > > > > > will > > > > > > find all the information you need to overcome > > > your > > > > > > problem, :- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.fishdoc.co.uk/disease/whitespot.htm > > > > > > > > > > > > http://fishorbust.net/ich.html > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.nunnie.com/ick.html > > > > > > > > > > > > http://badmanstropicalfish.com/meds/ick.html > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > unclenorm > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- aclaar877 <aclaar877@y...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ray, thanks. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I do have 0 nitrites, as well as 0 nitrates. > > > > > > > > Most > > > > > > > plants are doing > > > > > > > great, though maybe some nitrates will help > > > the > > > > > red > > > > > > > ammania > > > > > > > gracillis I have. I'll keep the heat up, > > > but > > > > > > > probably won't do salt > > > > > > > because of the plants. Do you know if the > > > white > > > > > > > spots are the > > > > > > > parasites themselves, or reactions to the > > > > > parasite? > > > > > > > If there is a > > > > > > > delay between the parasite attaching itself > > > and > > > > > the > > > > > > > appearance of a > > > > > > > spot, I may be ahead of where I thought I > > > was as > > > > > far > > > > > > > as the ich > > > > > > > cycle is concerned. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > AC > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray > > > Wetzel" > > > > > > > > > > > > <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > > > > > > To Whom it May Concern (no signature): > > > > > > > Generally, Ich find it > > > > > > > > difficult to reproduce above 86 o. > > > > > Occassionally, > > > > > > > you might run > > > > > > > across > > > > > > > > a particularly virulent and resistant > > > strain > > > > > which > > > > > > > may be able to > > > > > > > > endure temperatures up to 90 o. Their > > > getting > > > > > > > more spots may just > > > > > > > be a > > > > > > > > delayed reaction and once these cysts drop > > > off > > > > > > > they should not be > > > > > > > able > > > > > > > > to multiply very freely, if at all (unless > > > its > > > > > a > > > > > > > resistant > > > > > > > strain). If > > > > > > > > the spots are still few, I would go with > > > the > > > > > heat > > > > > > > treatment and > > > > > > > add no > > > > > > > > more than 1 tbs of salt per 5 gallons -- > > > you > > > > > have > > > > > > > Tetras. Give it > > > > > > > 2 > > > > > > > > days if you can (if there's not a heavy > > > > > > > infestation) and see what > > > > > > > it > > > > > > > > looks like by then. If you find that > > > you're > > > > > up > > > > > > > against a more > > > > > > > virulent > > > > > > > > strain, you may need to move to a > > > medication, > > > > > but > > > > > > > do not under any > > > > > > > > circumstances use a malachite green (or > > > any > > > > > other > > > > > > > dye) based > > > > > > > > medication -- it will kill your scaleless > > > > > Loaches. > > > > > > > So keep the > > > > > > > > temperature up and keep an eye on things. > > > > > And, I > > > > > > > hope you meant a > > > > > > > > reading of 0 for your nitrItes. > > > > > > > Ray > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > \ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > > > > > -- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, > > > "aclaar877" > > > > > > > <aclaar877@y...> > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > Just added four discus to 155g planted > > > tank > > > > > on > > > > > > > Sunday, and three > > > > > > > have > > > > > > > > > developed some ich spots. A few > > > cardinals > > > > > and > > > > > > > both clown > > > > > > > loaches > > > > > > > > have > > > > > > > > > them as well. Temperature has never > > > been > > > > > below > > > > > > > 86--I thought > > > > > > > ich > > > > > > > > > wouldn't spread at those temps? I now > > > have > > > > > the > > > > > > > temp at about 88- > > > > > > > 89, > > > > > > > > > and the discus are getting even more > > > spots. > > > > > > > They are still > > > > > > > eating > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > not yet scratching against things. > > > Should I > > > > > > > keep the > > > > > > > temperature > > > > > > > > high > > > > > > > > > and wait it out, or start the Quick-Cure > > > > > > > malachite green > > > > > > > medication? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Water quality is high, with 0 ammonia > > > and 0 > > > > > > > nitrates. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I'd like to hear what any other discus > > > > > owners > > > > > > > have done in this > > > > > > > > > situation. I don't want to medicate if > > > I > > > > > don't > > > > > > > have to, but > > > > > > > would > > > > > > > > > hate for the ich to rapidly spread and > > > kill > > > > > the > > > > > > > fish quicker > > > > > > > than I > > > > > > > > > can react. Thanks. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > > > > > > > > > To help you stay safe and secure online, we've > > > > > developed the all > > > > > new Yahoo! Security Centre. > > > > > http://uk.security.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > > > > > To help you stay safe and secure online, we've > > > developed the all > > > new Yahoo! Security Centre. > > > http://uk.security.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide > with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14792	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: What have I done !?????????

Steve, Referring to a simple process like adjusting the PH, as "downright dangerous" is an alarmist statement as I'm sure most people would agree. I'm not sure what the statement "coming clean" implies, but here's another, I have been in this hobby for more than fifty years both tropical marine reef and keeping and breading fresh water tropicals with a pretty good success rate, so I know what I'm talking about. Now can we leave it at that. regards, unclenorm. --- Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > Unclenorm, > > Nothing I have said was said in an alarmist way. It > is simple fact. I can > give references if you prefer, or you can look it up > on your own. > > RO/DI water is not for sale in this area at any > grocery store, any fish > store, or any place I have been. I know that in some > areas of the country it > is readily available, but not everywhere, and I do > live in a metropolitan > area now. > > Coming clean in stating that ". . . we have a > commercial RO/DI water > purification plant . . ." does put quite a different > spin on your posts > concerning water than was obvious prior to this. I > speak as a hobbyist and a > person concerned not only about the fish and their > well being, but as one > who is aware of costs associated with the hobby, and > they can become > substantial indeed, depending on one's involvement. > > The ratio I gave (5:1) is one that has been > mentioned frequently in > discussions on RO. It does vary depending on the > quality of the water prior > to processing, but one will never reach a 1:1 ratio. > Replacement of > membranes and filters is a recurring cost also. > > Again, since many who read and participate on this > list are novices, they > need to learn the basics prior to getting into the > more esoteric parts of > the hobby, such as changing water chemistry. Many > just want to be able to > keep some pretty fish, and that can be accomplished > no matter what kind of > water is available, since there are fish available > for all types of water. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Norman. S. Hampson. > Sent: Sunday, August 21, 2005 11:21 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: What have I done > !????????? > > Steve, this long speech does not excuse your > original > alarmist post which will turn a lot of newbys away > from the hobby, If you cannot afford an RO/DI unit > then buy the RO/DI water it is very cheep and much > better than slowly poisoning your fish with the > chemical soup that comes through most peoples taps, > you got the RO rejection rate the wrong way round if > you were right it would just prove my point!. I'm > not > saying that there is not some truth in some of your > remarks, I'm objecting to the alarmist posts you are > making and the damage they are doing to the hobby. > By > the way I'm very aware of water chemistry we have a > commercial RO/DI water purification plant and sell > potable drinking water, (and for fish tanks). I've > said my piece and do not intend getting into an > argument on this subject, so please if you wish to > write in that vane make it very clear that it is > your > opinion and not fact. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > > > Unclenorm, > > > > If you read my post, I do not state that changing > > water parameters is > > impossible to do, but that once it is done, there > is > > a constant battle to > > maintain the new parameters and there are dangers > in > > changing the > > parameters. With most of the people on this list > in > > the early stages of the > > hobby, this is not something they should be > > considering, but accepting the > > limitations of their water and the fish they can > > successfully keep is what > > they should be concerned with doing. > > > > The aquarium hobby has a high drop out rate of > > people in the early stages of > > learning how to keep fish. Many of the problems > > could be resolved by keeping > > fish that like the water conditions that are > present > > in the local water. > > (Another problem is that many simply do not > prepare > > themselves before diving > > into the hobby (pun intended). But that is another > > topic in and of itself.) > > > > Using RO water requires an RO unit, starting at > > $125+, along with > > replacement membranes to produce enough water to > > fill a 10 gallon tank a > > day. There is also a tremendous ratio of waste > water > > to RO water, a 5:1 > > figure is often seen, meaning it takes 5 gallons > of > > incoming tap water to > > produce 1 gallon of RO water. Unless you are on a > > private system (read your > > own well), you are paying a price for each gallon > of > > water used. I am paying > > $30-40 dollars a month for the normal water usage > > here. For every 10 gallons > > of water I produce using an RO filter, I will be > > throwing away 40 gallons of > > water. True, some of this can be recycled in the > > garden, but after a while, > > if I were to use all the water that way, I'd be > > raising bog plants instead > > of my bearded iris and daylilies. (The cactus do > not > > require much water at > > all.) Then, I need to reconstitute the water per > the > > requirements of the > > fish. This requires the purchase of mixtures to > add > > to the water, or the > > purchase and measurements of the various chemicals > > and compounds I would > > need (and I do have recipes for those stashed away > > somewhere). This is not > > something you would want to be doing if you are a > > newcomer to the hobby. > > > > The use of the examples of the water companies is > so > > that people can verify > > easily what I am saying, and also answers those > > questions about rapid pH > > drops that some people have reported here. Since > > probably 90% of the people > > here are on some form of municipal water system, > it > > is an apt example. > > > > There are a number of books and many articles > > available that discuss water > > chemistry relating to aquariums out there. Some > are > > mere generalizations, > > but many go into depth on various aspects of water > > chemistry. I have > > mentioned one book here several times and still do > > recommend it, though it > > can be a bit hard to find. Most consider it to be > > the bible when it comes to > > water chemistry, though I'll not give it that > > sobriquet, it is a well > > written book that goes into all the basic aspects > in > > great depth with, > > sometimes lengthy, references to other articles > and > > published works. It is > > "Fish and Invertebrate Culture, Second Edition", > by > > Stephen Spotte. A > > warming goes along with this recommendation. You > > need to have had at least a > > high school chemistry course to be able to > > understand the book, and even > > then it may not be easy. > > > > An accomplished aquarist may wish to start > > experimenting with changing water > > parameters to keep specific fish, however it is > not > > something a novice > > should be experimenting with. It is difficult > enough > > to learn the nitrogen > > cycle and to maintain it for many beginners, hence > > all the quick fixes to be > > found on the market, many of which are worthless > or > > even dangerous to use > > (dangerous for the health of your fish). At best, > > the better products can > > shave a couple of weeks off the cycle or convert > the > > nitrogenous products to > > harmless compounds that still allow the cycle to > > complete. > > > > I will continue to maintain that if you do not > > understand water chemistry, > > you should not attempt to change it. Period. No > > argument allowed. > > > > \\Steve// > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Norman. S. Hampson. > > Sent: Sunday, August 21, 2005 2:15 AM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: What have I done > > !????????? > > > > Hi Steve, > > I'm very surprised at this alarmist post, > > there is nothing at all wrong with changing the > > water > > parameters to suit the fish, there are many ways > of > > doing it totally non dangerous!!, it is done all > the > > time by thousands of hobbyists and breeders alike, > > your statement that people should only buy fish to > > suit there tap water is rather ridiculous to say > the > > least. If there is anything dangerous it is the > use > > of > > tap water! especialy in a marine tank, I'm sure > you > > must know what RO/DI is ?. I would suggest that > you > > need to read up on water chemistry as it applies > to > > this hobby, totally different to water company > > prioritys. > > regards, > > unclenorm. > > > > > > --- Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > > > > > Chris, > > > > > > Of your three things, 2 and 3 are not needed. > > > > > > Your second item about changing the water > > chemistry > > > is downright dangerous. > > > One should be maintain fish with the water > > chemistry > > > that is available, not > > > trying to change it to suit the fish. If a fish > > > requires hard water, your > > > water should be hard out of the tap. If a fish > > > requires soft acid water, > > > that should be your water out of the tap. The > only > > > change that should be > > > made is to add a marine salt should you be > keeping > > > brackish fish or marine > > > fish, which changes the water subtly. > > > > > > If you have a high pH and you want to keep rams, > > > well, you will should not > > > be messing with the pH and find a fish that will > > do > > > well in a high pH > > > environment. When you try to lower the pH of the > > > water, you are fighting > > > against the natural buffering capacity of the > > water. > > > If you are able to > > > break this buffering capacity, you will then be > > > faced with what is known as > > > a pH crash, in which the pH can get so low that > > you > > > will not be able to keep > > > fish in the water for any length of time. > > > > > > Raising the pH is less risky to do, but then you > > > will be fighting a constant > > > uphill battle as the water tries to maintain its > > > natural pH. > > > > > > Well, you might say, water companies raise the > pH > > of > > > their water supply all > > > the time to prevent their pipes from becoming > > > corroded. You are right--they > > > do. However, draw a glass of that water and > > measure > > > the pH. Then let the > > > glass sit there for 24 hours and measure the pH > > > again. Whoa, wait a minute, > > > the pH has gone down! You got that right, it > has. > > It > > > is seeking its own pH > > > level and it may drop dramatically during that > 24 > > > hour period. The water > > > company only needs the high pH when the water is > > > flowing through their > > > pipes. This is possible to do. In fact, it is > > quite > > > easy to do, though not > > > entirely without expense, and perhaps causing > some > > > other problems, such as > > > raising the toxicity of nitrogenous compounds in > > the > > > water. > > > > > > I can go on and on about this subject, as some > > > members of this list can > > > attest. There have been books written about it. > > Find > > > one. Read it. > > > > > > Your third point is also not necessary, so long > as > > > you are providing your > > > fish the environment they need to stay healthy > and > > > stress free. If you are > > > messing with the water in your step two, then > the > > > fish probably need it to > > > help prolong their lives, though I can't say the > > > quality of their life is > > > made better by it. Actually, the products that > > claim > > > to help fish by > > > creating a better mucous coat on the fish > actually > > > irritate the fish to > > > produce the mucous which protects the fish. So, > > > maybe you really don't need > > > that since the fish are probably already > irritated > > > by your messing with the > > > water chemistry. > > > > > > This is not to say that there are instances > where > > > such products can be > > > useful, even necessary to use, but using one on > a > > > regular basis is probably > > > something you wish to avoid as much as possible. > > > > > > > \\Steve// > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > Behalf Of Chris > > > Sent: Friday, August 19, 2005 10:17 AM > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: What have I done > > > !????????? > > > > > > Typically three things go into new water before > > the > > > water goes in > > > the tank: > > > > > > 1) water purifier - find one which removes > > chlorine, > > > chloramines and > > > heavy metals > > > > > > 2) water conditioner (if your type of fish needs > > it) > > > - basically > > > salts that set the water hardness and pH > > (different > > > for different > > > kinds of fish - eg goldfish, tropicals, > cichlids, > > > south american, > > > etc) > > > > > > 3) something to "ease the stress" on the fish. > > > > > > If anything is optional, the third one might be > - > > > but the first two > > > are most important. In all cases, mix the water > up > > > before putting it > > > in the tank, too. try and get the temperature > > > roughly the same as in > > > your tank, too - don't just use the cold water > > tap. > > > > > > Check the shelf-life of the product you used, > too > > - > > > make sure it's > > > not out of date. > > > > > > Chris. > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14793	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: Clown Loaches

I'd wait at least a week after the treatment has been declared a success. Then I'd do the normal 14 day quarantine on them to ensure they are healthy. I'd also talk to the manager/owner to ensure that I could return the fish should they still have problems. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of The Dragon Hunter Sent: Friday, August 19, 2005 12:26 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Clown Loaches Apparently a large supplier out here had some problems, as virtually every LFS around me that has Clown loaches recieved them infected with Ich. They are all treating them now - was wondering if it would be safe to actually purchase them after their treatments are done or if I should wait Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14794	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: Gambusia day

How did things work out for you in the gambusia hunt? \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Chris Sent: Friday, August 19, 2005 10:03 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Gambusia day Looks like tomorrow is the Gambusia day for me. Other suggestions submitted to me were rotanone (tomato dust) and bleach (which apparently rapidly reduces oxygen). Anyone have any experience with these? (neither sounds appealing to me. Alcohol is still the likely option). I'll let you know how we go. In a nutshell, the waterway begins as stormwater runoff, enters a pollution trap, goes into a sediment pond then splits into two distinct (not joined) wetlands. Both wetlands drain separately into saltwater mangroves. Gambusia can be found in one of the two wetlands, and no-where else. At the head of those wetlands is a small waterhole with hundreds of them. At present, due to drought conditions, the waterhole is self contained. If we get good rain, those hundreds of Gambusia would likely spread downstream straight into the wetlands (where there are already some). To try and further discourage the possibility of the Gambusia heading upstream into the sediment pond, we plan to clear the waterhole then monitor all parts of the system. Bedtime now here in Sydney, but I'll check for replies in the morning before I head off. Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14795	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: Discus, ich, and high temps/ to AC

Ray, I didn't think you were a newby, neither am I, I have probably been in the hobby longer than you have. You are missing the point of my post, OK perhaps rather than quoting one of my reef tanks I should have asked the question in relation to a 125gall discus display tank which also has clown loaches and also runs at 32/33C. I have never seen a healthy unstressed fish contact ich if the infected fish has been removed from the tank. One stressed fish will eventualy stress the other fish in the tank, (stress not infect) the infection comes after the stress as I'm sure you are aware. regards, unclenorm. --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote: > Norm, Don't you think I already know that there is > always fish > present in the tank waiting for the opportunity to > infect az weakened > fish? I did not just start in this hobby yesterday. > However, once > Ich has already been seen to manifest one fish, it > is EXTREMELY > possible (I would say probable) that now instead of > this protozoan > merely existing in normal numbers, through infecting > one fish it has > now had the chance to multiply profusely putting the > remainder of the > fish population at risk. All's it takes is for one > newly latent > encysted trophont having recently fallen off a fresh > host to release > its new generation of dinospores, to promptly seek > out other fish in > overwhelming numbers. Keep in mind, each trophont > will release > between 500 and 2200 new dinospores. I hope you > don't feel its > impossible for additional previously healthy fish to > now get infected > with Ich spores. I maintain that it is in the best > interest of all > piscine aquarium inhabitants to be treated against > any possible > infestation. Incidentally, how did you get on the > off-beat thread of > marine fish when the main topic of discussion dealt > with AC's > Discus? My posts on this topic deal exclusively > with fresh water > Ichyophthirius multifiliis, and I do not care to > include in this > discussion Cryptocaryon as it is not germane to this > matter. Ray > \ > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. > Hampson." > <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > Ray, > > It is claimed by many of the experts that ich > is > > always present in a tank just waiting for an under > par > > fish to attach, so I believe that that fish should > be > > removed to quarantine before the dormant rich can > > rejuvenate and infest the other fish in the tank. > I am > > inclined to believe this dormancy theory as I've > seen > > outbreaks in long established tanks both fresh and > > salt water were there have been no changes of any > kind > > kind in a long time, except one under par fish > through > > a territorial squabble or some other reason, the > quick > > removal of the effected fish has brought the tank > back > > to normal. Tell me how would you treat a large > salt > > water reef tank 325gall that is normally running > at > > 32/33C. > > regards, > > unclenorm. > > > > > > --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > > > Hi Norm, While you may believe that all fish > with > > > problems should be > > > treated in quarantine, my belief is that most > (but > > > not all) problems > > > should be treated in quarantine. One of my main > > > exceptions to this > > > is when a fish shows symptoms of Ich. As I see > it, > > > by the time this > > > is seen on just one fish, Ich has multiplied or > is > > > about to multiply > > > in the water column many times over, putting any > > > other fish in that > > > tank at risk of contracting it. In this > situation, > > > I believe it is > > > best to treat the entire tank to prevent the Ich > > > from the probability > > > (or even possibility) of spreading to the other > > > inhabitants as can so > > > very easily occur -- its very cheap insurance. > In > > > my estimation, it > > > is nothing short of negligence not to treat the > main > > > tank in hopes > > > that it won't spread, as once the second round > of > > > new free-swimming > > > cysts release their populations (being many > times > > > over the original) > > > the odds of any other fish getting this is > greatly > > > increased. To not > > > act responsibly is like burying your head in the > > > sand. Ray > > > \ > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. > > > Hampson." > > > <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > > > Hi Ray, > > > > I've said many times fish with problems > > > should > > > > be treated in quarantein, Any container big > enough > > > > will do. There are dozens more such sites to > be > > > found > > > > on the net. > > > > regards, > > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Hi Norman, Just went up to these 4 sites > you > > > > > mentioned, out of > > > > > curiousity. Looks like there's some good > > > > > information there that may > > > > > not have been known to our newcomers. One > thing > > > I > > > > > did notice, there > > > > > doesn't seem to be anything there that would > > > inform > > > > > AC of how to > > > > > proceed with his treatment of Ich as the > last > > > two > > > > > sites recommend > > > > > treatment by medication (only), which AC > prefers > > > not > > > > > to do. The third > > > > > site even refers to Quick-Cure and Rid-Ich > (both > > > I > > > > > believe containing > > > > > malachite green) which should not be used > with > > > Clown > > > > > Loaches, but > > > > > something AC fortunately already realizes. > The > > > > > first site recommends > > > > > raising the temperature up to 25 o C (77 o > F) > > > which > > > > > may help Koi, but > > > > > would be useless in treating tropicals. > With > > > the > > > > > second site, I got > > > > > the message "Can't Find Web Site". Don't > know > > > if > > > > > that site still > > > > > exists or maybe its just my server. Just > > > thought > > > > > I'd pass this along > > > > > in case you haven't actually read these > sites. > > > Ray > > > > > > > > > > \ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. > S. > > > > > Hampson." > > > > > <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > > > > > Hi AC, > > > > > > Here are some links about Ich (Ick), > you > > > > > will > > > > > > find all the information you need to > overcome > > > your > > > > > > problem, :- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.fishdoc.co.uk/disease/whitespot.htm > > > > > > > > > > > > http://fishorbust.net/ich.html > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.nunnie.com/ick.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://badmanstropicalfish.com/meds/ick.html > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > unclenorm > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- aclaar877 <aclaar877@y...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ray, thanks. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I do have 0 nitrites, as well as 0 > nitrates. > > > > > > > > Most > > > > > > > plants are doing > > > > > > > great, though maybe some nitrates will > help > > > the > > > > > red > > > > > > > ammania > > > > > > > gracillis I have. I'll keep the heat > up, > > > but > > > > > > > probably won't do salt > > > > > > > because of the plants. Do you know if > the > > > white > > > > > > > spots are the > > > > > > > parasites themselves, or reactions to > the > > > > > parasite? > > > > > > > If there is a > > > > > > > delay between the parasite attaching > itself > > > and > > > > > the > > > > > > > appearance of a > > > > > > > spot, I may be ahead of where I thought > I > > > was as > > > > > far > > > > > > > as the ich > > > > > > > cycle is concerned. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > AC > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray > > > Wetzel" > > > > > > > > > > > > <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > > > > > > To Whom it May Concern (no signature): > > > > > > > > Generally, Ich find it > > > > > > > > difficult to reproduce above 86 o. > > > > > Occassionally, > > > > > > > you might run > > > > > > > across > > > > > > > > a particularly virulent and resistant > > > strain > > > > > which > > > > > > > may be able to > > > > > > > > endure temperatures up to 90 o. Their > > > getting > > > > > > > more spots may just > > > > > > > be a > > > > > > > > delayed reaction and once these cysts > drop > > > off > > > > > > > they should not be > > > > > > > able > > > > > > > > to multiply very freely, if at all > (unless > > > its > > > > > a > > > > > > > resistant > > > > > > > strain). If > > > > > > > > the spots are still few, I would go > with > > > the > > > > > heat > > > > > > > treatment and > > > > > > > add no > > > > > > > > more than 1 tbs of salt per 5 gallons > -- > > > you > > > > > have > > > > > > > Tetras. Give it > > > > > > > 2 > > > > > > > > days if you can (if there's not a > heavy > > > > > > > infestation) and see what > > > > > > > it > > > > > > > > looks like by then. If you find that > > > you're > > > > > up > > > > > > > against a more > > > > > > > virulent > > > > > > > > strain, you may need to move to a > > > medication, > > > > > but > > > > > > > do not under any > > > > > > > > circumstances use a malachite green > (or > > > any > > > > > other > > > > > > > dye) based > > > > > > > > medication -- it will kill your > scaleless > > > > > Loaches. > > > > > > > So keep the > > > > > > > > temperature up and keep an eye on > things. > > > > > And, I > > > > > > > hope you meant a > > > > > > > > reading of 0 for your nitrItes. > > > > > > > Ray > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > \ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > > > > > -- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, > > > "aclaar877" > > > > > > > <aclaar877@y...> > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > Just added four discus to 155g > planted > > > tank > > > > > on > > > > > > > Sunday, and three > > > > > > > have > > > > > > > > > developed some ich spots. A few > > > cardinals > > > > > and > > > > > > > both clown > > > > > > > loaches > > > > > > > > have > > > > > > > > > them as well. Temperature has never > > > been > > > > > below > > > > > > > 86--I thought > > > > > > > ich > > > > > > > > > wouldn't spread at those temps? I > now > > > have > > > > > the > > > > > > > temp at about 88- > > > > > > > 89, > > > > > > > > > and the discus are getting even more > > > spots. > > > > > > > They are still > > > > > > > eating > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > not yet scratching against things. > > > Should I > > > > > > > keep the > > > > > > > temperature > > > > > > > > high > > > > > > > > > and wait it out, or start the > Quick-Cure > > > > > > > malachite green > > > > > > > medication? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Water quality is high, with 0 > ammonia > > > and 0 > > > > > > > nitrates. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I'd like to hear what any other > discus > > > > > owners > > > > > > > have done in this > > > > > > > > > situation. I don't want to medicate > if > > > I > > > > > don't > > > > > > > have to, but > > > > > > > would > > > > > > > > > hate for the ich to rapidly spread > and > > > kill > > > > > the > > > > > > > fish quicker > > > > > > > than I > > > > > > > > > can react. Thanks. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > > > > > > > > > To help you stay safe and secure online, > we've > > > > > developed the all > > > > > new Yahoo! Security Centre. > > > > > http://uk.security.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > > > > > To help you stay safe and secure online, we've > > > developed the all > > > new Yahoo! Security Centre. > > > http://uk.security.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC > calling worldwide > with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com > > > ___________________________________________________________ To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. http://uk.security.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14796	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: Discus, ich, and high temps/ to AC

Norm, The length of time one has been in the hobby does not necessarily correlate with how much they have learned over the years. In any case, I find I have probably been in the hobby longer than you, but that's neither here nor there. I think the whole difference here is that I HAVE SEEN apparently "healthy" fish contract Ich as a result of another fish having been stressed and getting it, even with the affected fish being removed. Such fish as scaleless Clown Loaches are particularly prone to getting Ich and that is just the species of concern here as that's what AC has in with his Discus. I'm well aware that usually only stressed fish are subject to getting Ich. However, in cases I've observed, It would appear that the sudden release of a multitude of new Ich spores from its now renewed cycle contributed directly to this end. Whether you have ever seen this occur or not has no bearing on the fact that it can occur. I don't post lightly, and would not have brought forth these facts had I not actually experienced such occurrences. Please now be advised that in such rare instances, that Ich can continue to infect such healthy but prone fish as we're talking about when its life cycle has been jump started, even with the removal of the first infected (and obviously stressed fish). Regards, Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > Ray, > I didn't think you were a newby, neither am I, I > have probably been in the hobby longer than you have. > You are missing the point of my post, OK perhaps > rather than quoting one of my reef tanks I should have > asked the question in relation to a 125gall discus > display tank which also has clown loaches and also > runs at 32/33C. I have never seen a healthy unstressed > fish contact ich if the infected fish has been removed > from the tank. One stressed fish will eventualy stress > the other fish in the tank, (stress not infect) the > infection comes after the stress as I'm sure you are > aware. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > Norm, Don't you think I already know that there is > > always fish > > present in the tank waiting for the opportunity to > > infect az weakened > > fish? I did not just start in this hobby yesterday. > > However, once > > Ich has already been seen to manifest one fish, it > > is EXTREMELY > > possible (I would say probable) that now instead of > > this protozoan > > merely existing in normal numbers, through infecting > > one fish it has > > now had the chance to multiply profusely putting the > > remainder of the > > fish population at risk. All's it takes is for one > > newly latent > > encysted trophont having recently fallen off a fresh > > host to release > > its new generation of dinospores, to promptly seek > > out other fish in > > overwhelming numbers. Keep in mind, each trophont > > will release > > between 500 and 2200 new dinospores. I hope you > > don't feel its > > impossible for additional previously healthy fish to > > now get infected > > with Ich spores. I maintain that it is in the best > > interest of all > > piscine aquarium inhabitants to be treated against > > any possible > > infestation. Incidentally, how did you get on the > > off-beat thread of > > marine fish when the main topic of discussion dealt > > with AC's > > Discus? My posts on this topic deal exclusively > > with fresh water > > Ichyophthirius multifiliis, and I do not care to > > include in this > > discussion Cryptocaryon as it is not germane to this > > matter. Ray > > \ > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. > > Hampson." > > <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > > Ray, > > > It is claimed by many of the experts that ich > > is > > > always present in a tank just waiting for an under > > par > > > fish to attach, so I believe that that fish should > > be > > > removed to quarantine before the dormant rich can > > > rejuvenate and infest the other fish in the tank. > > I am > > > inclined to believe this dormancy theory as I've > > seen > > > outbreaks in long established tanks both fresh and > > > salt water were there have been no changes of any > > kind > > > kind in a long time, except one under par fish > > through > > > a territorial squabble or some other reason, the > > quick > > > removal of the effected fish has brought the tank > > back > > > to normal. Tell me how would you treat a large > > salt > > > water reef tank 325gall that is normally running > > at > > > 32/33C. > > > regards, > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > > > > > Hi Norm, While you may believe that all fish > > with > > > > problems should be > > > > treated in quarantine, my belief is that most > > (but > > > > not all) problems > > > > should be treated in quarantine. One of my main > > > > exceptions to this > > > > is when a fish shows symptoms of Ich. As I see > > it, > > > > by the time this > > > > is seen on just one fish, Ich has multiplied or > > is > > > > about to multiply > > > > in the water column many times over, putting any > > > > other fish in that > > > > tank at risk of contracting it. In this > > situation, > > > > I believe it is > > > > best to treat the entire tank to prevent the Ich > > > > from the probability > > > > (or even possibility) of spreading to the other > > > > inhabitants as can so > > > > very easily occur -- its very cheap insurance. > > In > > > > my estimation, it > > > > is nothing short of negligence not to treat the > > main > > > > tank in hopes > > > > that it won't spread, as once the second round > > of > > > > new free-swimming > > > > cysts release their populations (being many > > times > > > > over the original) > > > > the odds of any other fish getting this is > > greatly > > > > increased. To not > > > > act responsibly is like burying your head in the > > > > sand. Ray > > > > \ > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. > > > > Hampson." > > > > <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > > > > Hi Ray, > > > > > I've said many times fish with problems > > > > should > > > > > be treated in quarantein, Any container big > > enough > > > > > will do. There are dozens more such sites to > > be > > > > found > > > > > on the net. > > > > > regards, > > > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Hi Norman, Just went up to these 4 sites > > you > > > > > > mentioned, out of > > > > > > curiousity. Looks like there's some good > > > > > > information there that may > > > > > > not have been known to our newcomers. One > > thing > > > > I > > > > > > did notice, there > > > > > > doesn't seem to be anything there that would > > > > inform > > > > > > AC of how to > > > > > > proceed with his treatment of Ich as the > > last > > > > two > > > > > > sites recommend > > > > > > treatment by medication (only), which AC > > prefers > > > > not > > > > > > to do. The third > > > > > > site even refers to Quick-Cure and Rid-Ich > > (both > > > > I > > > > > > believe containing > > > > > > malachite green) which should not be used > > with > > > > Clown > > > > > > Loaches, but > > > > > > something AC fortunately already realizes. > > The > > > > > > first site recommends > > > > > > raising the temperature up to 25 o C (77 o > > F) > > > > which > > > > > > may help Koi, but > > > > > > would be useless in treating tropicals. > > With > > > > the > > > > > > second site, I got > > > > > > the message "Can't Find Web Site". Don't > > know > > > > if > > > > > > that site still > > > > > > exists or maybe its just my server. Just > > > > thought > > > > > > I'd pass this along > > > > > > in case you haven't actually read these > > sites. > > > > Ray > > > > > > > > > > > > \ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. > > S. > > > > > > Hampson." > > > > > > <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > > > > > > Hi AC, > > > > > > > Here are some links about Ich (Ick), > > you > > > > > > will > > > > > > > find all the information you need to > > overcome > > > > your > > > > > > > problem, :- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.fishdoc.co.uk/disease/whitespot.htm > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://fishorbust.net/ich.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.nunnie.com/ick.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://badmanstropicalfish.com/meds/ick.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > unclenorm > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- aclaar877 <aclaar877@y...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ray, thanks. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I do have 0 nitrites, as well as 0 > > nitrates. > > > > > > > > > > Most > > > > > > > > plants are doing > > > > > > > > great, though maybe some nitrates will > > help > > > > the > > > > > > red > > > > > > > > ammania > > > > > > > > gracillis I have. I'll keep the heat > > up, > > > > but > > > > > > > > probably won't do salt > > > > > > > > because of the plants. Do you know if > > the > > > > white > > > > > > > > spots are the > > > > > > > > parasites themselves, or reactions to > > the > > > > > > parasite? > > > > > > > > If there is a > > > > > > > > delay between the parasite attaching > > itself > > > > and > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > appearance of a > > > > > > > > spot, I may be ahead of where I thought > > I > > > > was as > > > > > > far > > > > > > > > as the ich > > > > > > > > cycle is concerned. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > AC > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray > > > > Wetzel" > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > To Whom it May Concern (no signature): > > > > > > > > > > Generally, Ich find it > > > > > > > > > difficult to reproduce above 86 o. > > > > > > Occassionally, > > > > > > > > you might run > > > > > > > > across > > > > > > > > > a particularly virulent and resistant > > > > strain > > > > > > which > > > > > > > > may be able to > > > > > > > > > endure temperatures up to 90 o. Their > > > > getting > > > > > > > > more spots may just > > > > > > > > be a > > > > > > > > > delayed reaction and once these cysts > > drop > > > > off > > > > > > > > they should not be > > > > > > > > able > > > > > > > > > to multiply very freely, if at all > > (unless > > > > its > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > resistant > > > > > > > > strain). If > > > > > > > > > the spots are still few, I would go > > with > > > > the > > > > > > heat > > > > > > > > treatment and > > > > > > > > add no > > > > > > > > > more than 1 tbs of salt per 5 gallons > > -- > > > > you > > > > > > have > > > > > > > > Tetras. Give it > > > > > > > > 2 > > > > > > > > > days if you can (if there's not a > > heavy > > > > > > > > infestation) and see what > > > > > > > > it > > > > > > > > > looks like by then. If you find that > > > > you're > > > > > > up > > > > > > > > against a more > > > > > > > > virulent > > > > > > > > > strain, you may need to move to a > > > > medication, > > > > > > but > > > > > > > > do not under any > > > > > > > > > circumstances use a malachite green > > (or > > > > any > > > > > > other > > > > > > > > dye) based > > > > > > > > > medication -- it will kill your > > scaleless > > > > > > Loaches. > > > > > > > > So keep the > > > > > > > > > temperature up and keep an eye on > > things. > > > > > > And, I > > > > > > > > hope you meant a > > > > > > > > > reading of 0 for your nitrItes. > > > > > > > > Ray > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > \ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > > > > > > -- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, > > > > "aclaar877" > > > > > > > > <aclaar877@y...> > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Just added four discus to 155g > > planted > > > > tank > > > > > > on > > > > > > > > Sunday, and three > > > > > > > > have > > > > > > > > > > developed some ich spots. A few > > > > cardinals > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > both clown > > > > > > > > loaches > > > > > > > > > have > > > > > > > > > > them as well. Temperature has never > > > > been > > > > > > below > > > > > > > > 86--I thought > > > > > > > > ich > > > > > > > > > > wouldn't spread at those temps? I > > now > > > > have > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > temp at about 88- > > > > > > > > 89, > > > > > > > > > > and the discus are getting even more > > > > spots. > > > > > > > > They are still > > > > > > > > eating > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > not yet scratching against things. > > > > Should I > > > > > > > > keep the > > > > > > > > temperature > > > > > > > > > high > > > > > > > > > > and wait it out, or start the > > Quick-Cure > > > > > > > > malachite green > > > > > > > > medication? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Water quality is high, with 0 > > ammonia > > > > and 0 > > > > > > > > nitrates. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I'd like to hear what any other > > discus > > > > > > owners > > > > > > > > have done in this > > > > > > > > > > situation. I don't want to medicate > > if > > > > I > > > > > > don't > > > > > > > > have to, but > > > > > > > > would > > > > > > > > > > hate for the ich to rapidly spread > > and > > > > kill > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > fish quicker > > > > > > > > than I > > > > > > > > > > can react. Thanks. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > > > > > > > > > > > To help you stay safe and secure online, > > we've > > > > > > developed the all > > > > > > new Yahoo! Security Centre. > > > > > > http://uk.security.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > > > > > > > To help you stay safe and secure online, we've > > > > developed the all > > > > new Yahoo! Security Centre. > > > > http://uk.security.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > > > Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC > > calling worldwide > > with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. http://uk.security.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14797	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/21/2005
Subject: Re: Discus, ich, and high temps/ to AC

Ray, I think the time has come to agree to disagree, as all we are realy debating is whether to treat the display tank or treat in quarantein, as you have agreed ich will always remain in the tank, so going to the expense and hassle of treating a large tank is a bit pointless don't you think.(you didn't answer that question). I have no argument with your first sentence, although the second might not be so accurate. I got my first gold fish about 1939, won in the visiting fair ground. I helped my father build my first tropical fish tank in early 1944, it was about 50gall, angle iron frame, slate bottom and back, glass front and ends, sealed with plumbers glazing putty, one of my sons still has it today but I'm not sure what he uses it for nowadays, but as you say that's neither here nor there. regards, unclenorm. --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote: > Norm, The length of time one has been in the hobby > does not > necessarily correlate with how much they have > learned over the > years. In any case, I find I have probably been in > the hobby longer > than you, but that's neither here nor there. I > think the whole > difference here is that I HAVE SEEN apparently > "healthy" fish > contract Ich as a result of another fish having been > stressed and > getting it, even with the affected fish being > removed. Such fish as > scaleless Clown Loaches are particularly prone to > getting Ich and > that is just the species of concern here as that's > what AC has in > with his Discus. I'm well aware that usually only > stressed fish are > subject to getting Ich. However, in cases I've > observed, It would > appear that the sudden release of a multitude of new > Ich spores from > its now renewed cycle contributed directly to this > end. Whether you > have ever seen this occur or not has no bearing on > the fact that it > can occur. I don't post lightly, and would not have > brought forth > these facts had I not actually experienced such > occurrences. Please > now be advised that in such rare instances, that Ich > can continue to > infect such healthy but prone fish as we're talking > about when its > life cycle has been jump started, even with the > removal of the first > infected (and obviously stressed fish). Regards, > Ray > \ > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. > Hampson." > <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > Ray, > > I didn't think you were a newby, neither am I, > I > > have probably been in the hobby longer than you > have. > > You are missing the point of my post, OK > perhaps > > rather than quoting one of my reef tanks I should > have > > asked the question in relation to a 125gall discus > > display tank which also has clown loaches and also > > runs at 32/33C. I have never seen a healthy > unstressed > > fish contact ich if the infected fish has been > removed > > from the tank. One stressed fish will eventualy > stress > > the other fish in the tank, (stress not infect) > the > > infection comes after the stress as I'm sure you > are > > aware. > > regards, > > unclenorm. > > > > > > --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > > > Norm, Don't you think I already know that there > is > > > always fish > > > present in the tank waiting for the opportunity > to > > > infect az weakened > > > fish? I did not just start in this hobby > yesterday. > > > However, once > > > Ich has already been seen to manifest one fish, > it > > > is EXTREMELY > > > possible (I would say probable) that now instead > of > > > this protozoan > > > merely existing in normal numbers, through > infecting > > > one fish it has > > > now had the chance to multiply profusely putting > the > > > remainder of the > > > fish population at risk. All's it takes is for > one > > > newly latent > > > encysted trophont having recently fallen off a > fresh > > > host to release > > > its new generation of dinospores, to promptly > seek > > > out other fish in > > > overwhelming numbers. Keep in mind, each > trophont > > > will release > > > between 500 and 2200 new dinospores. I hope you > > > don't feel its > > > impossible for additional previously healthy > fish to > > > now get infected > > > with Ich spores. I maintain that it is in the > best > > > interest of all > > > piscine aquarium inhabitants to be treated > against > > > any possible > > > infestation. Incidentally, how did you get on > the > > > off-beat thread of > > > marine fish when the main topic of discussion > dealt > > > with AC's > > > Discus? My posts on this topic deal exclusively > > > with fresh water > > > Ichyophthirius multifiliis, and I do not care to > > > include in this > > > discussion Cryptocaryon as it is not germane to > this > > > matter. Ray > > > \ > m ___________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14798	From: Chris	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: What have I done !?????????

Hello Erin, you seem to have gotten a little forgotten in all the long threads about water chemistry. I'm not sure how long you've been keeping fish, but I do know there have been a few newcomers to the group in the past few days. I do hope any newcomer - to the group, or the hobby - is not put off by the recent long thread. I myself have been a member of this group only for a couple of weeks or so, and it seems to me everyone here is very well intentioned. On the topic of water chemistry - as with any other - there are bound to be differences of opinion, but some things, at least, everyone will agree on. It should be clear that as a fish-owner (any aquatic life, not just fish, really), you ought to feel responsible for giving your creatures the best possible living conditions - after all, they rely on you 100% for that. So at the least then, as a newcomer to the hobby, you should be prepared to measure certain water chemistry conditions in your tank(s). There are any number of aspects of water chemistry you can measure, and different fish will be tolerant to different degrees of fluctuations in water conditions. The measurements themselves are not very hard at all. Sometimes the most difficult thing is being consistent! For a fairly robust beginner's tank, you might measure water conditions once a week and change a portion of the tank water every 2 to 4 of weeks. The whole thread we just saw was about whether or not you should condition new water before you add it to the tank. One side of the argument was that for beginners this is an extra complication not to worry about. The other side is that if you want to be sure the water suits your fish, you would at least measure certain things about it - and adjusting it is no more difficult than taking the measurements. And now I, - guilty as charged - have digressed onto a general discussion for newcomers on fishkeeping. Back to you, Erin - how is your tank doing? Chris. PS - any newcomers to the hobby who would like more info on what things to measure in their tanks, please do start a new thread. I'm sure there'd be a few links in this group to general fishcare, too - the links section is HUGE!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14799	From: Chris	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: What have I done !?????????

I don't know about you, but every store that I've worked in maintains banks of tanks with similar water quality, grouping fish with similar needs into the same bank. No store I've worked at has ever thought of fishkeeping as just "throwing water and fish together" even though a huge array of water conditions is maintained throughout any shop. If my first posting gave the impression that fishkeeping was just a 1, 2, 3 - I'm sorry - never meant that. And I didn't think the one posting was supposed to be a complete guide to fish care for beginners. Quite simply, shops do stock fish which require all different water conditions. Beginners will buy the fish. Not all water supplies will suit all fish right out of the tap. For those that needed to know, their water can be adjusted to suit their fish. Simple as that. My second post adds that anyone wanting to own a fish should be responsible enough to ensure it's requirements are met - this will include monitoring, and adjusting if necessary, water conditions. Surely we all agree on that? Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14800	From: Chris	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: Gambusia day

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > How did things work out for you in the gambusia hunt? > Somewhat disappointing, actually. The waterhole we planned to clear was about 1.5m across, and about 40-50cm deep. There would have been several hundred, if not a thousand Gambusia in there. It rained overnight just before and on the morning of, the day we planned to clear the hole. As a result, the waterhole's surface area was about 8 times larger, and it was now about 1.5 m deep. We took out about a hundred Gambusia anyway - mostly males and only a couple of really large females. None have been destroyed as I've put them into a tank for now. We found Gambusia in the second wetlands also, but none in the sediment pond, which is upstream (and drains into both wetlands). The overflows from the sediment pond into the wetlands are both "one- way" in that the water falls vertically down a short distance. In many ways this was a reconnaissance mission as we are planning an invertebrate and fish survey. So on the positive side, we did not find Gambusia in the sediment pond (although our sampling is far from conclusive!) and we did find several insect larvae despite still being in winter. Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14801	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Nitrite/nitrate in tap water

Hey folks, our tap water (directly from the faucet) contains about 3 ppm of Nitrite and 20 ppm of Nitrate. I use tap water conditioner before adding water to my tanks. Is there a way to remove the nitrite/nitrate by letting the water stand for a day or so, or some other way? Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14802	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: my catfish ate my snails!!!

Hi Lenny, Well, we took the catfish out of the 55 and put him in a 29. The only other fish in there with him is a gar, and I don't think he'll mess with her, lol. But when he outgrows the tank I will give him to a lady with a pond. In the meantime....what should I be feeding him? I have 2 remaining black mystery snails that are getting pretty big, lol!!! I only just recently noticed the trapdoor things, how cool! So far nothing else in the tank has messed with them, although something bit a fin off the do-jo loach :( He seems to be doing ok though, poor guy. What's a pleco? Sarah Lenny Vasbinder <lnvtm1@...> wrote: Hi Sarah, What size tank do you have? If your "Channel Cat" is anything like the Channel Cat's we have down here in South Louisiana, they get GIGANTIC... and I imagine they would pretty much eat anything that gets in their way. The Louisiana record is 105 pounds but they regularly get caught in the 30-40 pound range. You better watch the rest of your fish in that tank. I have a 5" juvi Common Pleco that I recently adopted from a 10G tropical tank and he's in my 65G Goldfish tank and I make sure he gets enough food so he doesn't get hungry for my sleeping goldfish as it has been reported that they will go for the slime coat on healthy goldfish. They will also suck on a sick or dead fish since they are omnivores. I know most, if not all catfish are omnivores. What kind of snails do you have? I have a few golden mystery snails and the Pleco will "clean" their shells but I've never seen him actually try to eat one. Of course, the GM Snails close their trap door whenever anything gets close. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 21:01:01 -0000 From: "Sarah Fleming Davis" <keelis_mom@...> Subject: my catfish ate my snails!!! Have any of you ever seen a catfish eat a snail??? It was so weird! I had just turned out the light last night(I am finally realizing that the catfish aren't very active until the light's out) and my big albino channel cat came out and grabbed a snail and shook it right out of it's shell and ate it!!! Then this morning there was another empty shell :( I feel really bad for the snail but I'm also wondering if he did it because he wasn't getting enough food and was hungry? What do you think? Sarah [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14803	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: do you name your fish?

Andrea, Wow, how do you know which is which when there's 50?!?!?! Sarah Andrea <whitedragon1018@...> wrote: All my adult bettas are named (probably about 50 right now) especially the males (Seamus, Rocky, Fluffy, Rufus, Tyler, Carl,Blackie, Casper, Pink Floyd, Reminton Steele, etc) and my few special girls (Tilly, Ruby, Violet, Emily, Sassy and Kitty). Mostly it's their personality that determines their name or something really obvious like an unusual color. Andrea and the "herds" of fishies --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Sarah Fleming Davis <keelis_mom@y...> wrote: > Oh good, lol, I thought I was the only one ;) I also have Bullet, Honey, Beetle Bug, Dino, Dinah, and the Rainbow Sisters(3 glass cats)! :) > > Sarah > > > Robert <coffeex10@y...> wrote: > Yes I name my fish, Slippery Pete, Bob and Boris. I have a cat named Fang. > Robert > >> Does anyone else name their fish? > > Sarah > > > ] Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, AquaticLife Management. --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14804	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: do you name your fish?/measurements?

How do you get exact measurements of your fish?!?!? Sarah joequality1980 <crazy.joe.walcek@...> wrote: I painstakingly take 6 photos of each fish, one for each direction on the compass plus above and below. Then I assign he/she a name selected from the Tibetan Book of the Dead based upon the fish's personality exhibited during the picture process. Once the name is selected I write the name plus the exact measurements of the fish on each photo, and submit it to www.petfishnamesdatabase.com. I email the photos to all my friends and family, and lastly file them away in my own peronsal archive that is updated every Saturday night. The entire process usually take around five hours. > Subject: do you name your fish? --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14805	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: salt question/cory cats

Hi Rebecca :) Thanks for the info on the corys, i will have to research that because I would hate to shorten their lifespan. They are my 5 year old daughters and one of them she has had for over 2 years and will be devastated when they die :( Speaking of dying fish, my gobi dies a couple days ago while me and my daughter were camping so I'm not sure if we still need to keep it brackish. Oh wait, I think the gar's are brackish too *sigh*. Someday we will have a dozen tanks I bet, lol, this fish business is addicting!!! ;) Sarah thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@...> wrote: Funny you should say that... I have been looking into another tank (hard to imagine, I know) but am trying to wait until we move next fall when I am done with school. We really don't have room for the one I want right now in this house, darn it :) As for the corys, I just read about long term exposure to salt... shortening of life span, things like that. Not necessarily things that you'll notice immediately. Of course, I believe there is a lot of conflicting thoughts on this. Good luck on the bigger house and bigger tank issue :) Rebecca --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14806	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: favorite fish died unexpectedly

Well my black moor goldfish died yesterday. Rather, I returned after spending the night elsewhere and found her dead. I've had her for about three years and she's my favorite fish. I'm pretty bummed out about it. I don't know how it happened. I've been leaving a lamp on at night for the fish so she wouldn't hurt herself again during the night, but someone had unplugged it. I can't imaging that would kill her though. I feel really terrible and quilty about this. I'm just wondering if I'm the only person who would get so upset over a dead fish. I burried her in a houseplant and we got a bluegill to replace her. Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14807	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: do you name your fish?/measurements?

I have way to many fish to name, but the wife and kids have named the fish in one tank.The Oscars ae named Adrew and Vern( possibly vernetta ), The upside down catfish is Charlie, and we have a feeder fish that survived in the Oscar tank that is name Esmerelda. Most people guess at the length, this is a man dominated hobby. and of course most woman should know about MAN inches. if you want the exact measuremnt you'll have to pull it from the tank, lay it flat and use a measuring device. measure from furthest point on its head ( usually snout ) to the base of its tail. this would be the length of the fish( head to tail) if you count the tail in the length of the fish this would he head plus tail measurement (Head+Tail ) Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 8/22/2005 10:58:28 AM US Eastern Standard Time, keelis_mom@... writes: How do you get exact measurements of your fish?!?!? Sarah [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14808	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: favorite fish died unexpectedly

Emily, Three years is a long time . One can and does get attached to favorite fish. You are in no way the Only person who gets upset over dead fish. My Mother in law has actually cried for 2 days over a dead fish, a fish she really didn't like, but it was hers. You gave your Moor a decent burial and did the best thing you could replaced her as soon as possible. A BlueGill is a rather odd choice in my opinion to replace her with but each there own. I hope your new fish helps ease the pain you are feeling for the loss of your loved one. Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 8/22/2005 11:11:28 AM US Eastern Standard Time, bababanana@... writes: Well my black moor goldfish died yesterday. Rather, I returned after spending the night elsewhere and found her dead. I've had her for about three years and she's my favorite fish. I'm pretty bummed out about it. I don't know how it happened. I've been leaving a lamp on at night for the fish so she wouldn't hurt herself again during the night, but someone had unplugged it. I can't imaging that would kill her though. I feel really terrible and quilty about this. I'm just wondering if I'm the only person who would get so upset over a dead fish. I burried her in a houseplant and we got a bluegill to replace her. Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14809	From: Andrea	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: do you name your fish?

Believe it or not, they are all different looking to me :) . Now there are a bunch of my girls that are not named because they really do all look alike. I also have a bristle nose pleco in my 30 gallon. Her name is Megan but I usually just refer to her as the Molly Maid because that's kind of her job in there :) Andrea, and the many fishes --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Sarah Fleming Davis <keelis_mom@y...> wrote: > Andrea, > Wow, how do you know which is which when there's 50?!?!?! > > Sarah > > > Andrea <whitedragon1018@y...> wrote: > All my adult bettas are named (probably about 50 right now) > > > > Robert <coffeex10@y...> wrote: > > Yes I name my fish, Slippery Pete, Bob and Boris. I have a cat > named Fang. > > Robert > > > >> Does anyone else name their fish? > > > > Sarah > > > > > > ] > > > > > Please delete this line and everything below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter, > AquaticLife Management. > > > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > --------------------------------- > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14810	From: Andrea	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Sick Cherry Barb

My adult female cherry barb's head has just recently started turning red. First it was just one side, then it spread by the next day to both sides of her face and basically encompassed her whole head right back to and including her gill flaps. I have treated the whole tank with Melafix for a couple of days and also added some additional salt to the tank (I keep some salt in the water at all times. She appears somewhat better today with less redness. She is in a 10 gallon tank with some young silver mollies, another female cherry barb, a few young bettas (none agressive) and a couple of baby danios. No one else is ill and she is still swimming (although with a bit of a lean to one side)and eating. Water quality, temps, filtration etc are all fine. It is a very quiet tank with lots of java moss to play and sleep in and no agression whatsoever. Any ideas if this is bacterial or what ?? Thanks for any insight you can give Andrea

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14811	From: Erin Cunningham	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: What have I done????? - update from me!

Thank you, Chris! I was starting to think this site wasn't right for me... it was never my intention to cause an arguement about water chemistry... Since my DH came home and discovered his present (the tank), he's taken to it like (pardon the pun) a fish to water!!! I wasn't aware he knew much about fish...couldn't have been further from the truth! He had kept Koi in a pond back in the UK and had kept freshwater tropicals in his 150 gallon tank!!! He took out the piece of driftwood I had in there (will add it back after its been properly leached - it was screwing up the alkalinity and pH) he has been doing partial water changes (to get the ammonia out) but he's also been feeding them 4 or more times since Sat.!!! But because he feeds them a bit at a time, apparently its OK! Since he has taken over the tank, I'm happy to report, NO more fish have died... all levels (pH, ammonia, nitrite, etc) are safe! Not to mention, DH now has a hobby back!! He's already thinking of a pond in the back garden! Erin __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14812	From: Erin Cunningham	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: What have I done????? - update from me!

Thank you, Chris! I was starting to think this site wasn't right for me... it was never my intention to cause an arguement about water chemistry... Since my DH came home and discovered his present (the tank), he's taken to it like (pardon the pun) a fish to water!!! I wasn't aware he knew much about fish...couldn't have been further from the truth! He had kept Koi in a pond back in the UK and had kept freshwater tropicals in his 150 gallon tank!!! He took out the piece of driftwood I had in there (will add it back after its been properly leached - it was screwing up the alkalinity and pH) he has been doing partial water changes (to get the ammonia out) but he's also been feeding them 4 or more times since Sat.!!! But because he feeds them a bit at a time, apparently its OK! Since he has taken over the tank, I'm happy to report, NO more fish have died... all levels (pH, ammonia, nitrite, etc) are safe! Not to mention, DH now has a hobby back!! He's already thinking of a pond in the back garden! Erin --------------------------------- Yahoo! Mail for Mobile Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14813	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: favorite fish died unexpectedly

So sorry for your loss :( You certainly are not the only person to be upset over a deceased pet! I am glad she had a nice life with you and hope your new fish does, too. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Emily Tenczar <bababanana@y...> wrote: > Well my black moor goldfish died yesterday. Rather, I returned after spending the night elsewhere and found her dead. I've had her for about three years and she's my favorite fish. I'm pretty bummed out about it. I don't know how it happened. I've been leaving a lamp on at night for the fish so she wouldn't hurt herself again during the night, but someone had unplugged it. I can't imaging that would kill her though. I feel really terrible and quilty about this. I'm just wondering if I'm the only person who would get so upset over a dead fish. I burried her in a houseplant and we got a bluegill to replace her. > Emily > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14814	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: do you name your fish?

Some of my fish have names -- my albino BN is Jimmy, my betta is Maui, my red zebra danio is Yahoo-ee (he kept swimming into my filter), my zebra loaches are Spaz, Middle One, and Little One... hmm, what else? Oh, my rasbora espei are not named, they all look alike to me. The guppies aren't really named (Yellow Momma, Blue Momma, Cobra Dad, etc) and none of the guppy fry have names. My otos do not have names, nor do my cory cats. I should work on that since I can tell them apart -- they are all different sizes. As for measuring them, I just estimate and do not inclue finnage. Rebecca

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14815	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: What fish is...

the one on the main web page? That is a very vibrant fish, what a neat picture :) Rebecca

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14816	From: Jonathan Hartsoe	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: Digest Number 946

Well I can say like any other pet you can become attached to a fish. I have a couple of fish currently that I hope to have for a long time to come. My bumble bee catfish I've had for nearly 11 years, and my convict cichlid I've had for around 5 years now. Though both of these fish are both insane and have been the death of quite a few tank mates over the years. Thus the catfish lives by himself in his personal retirement home and my convict spends his days in the turtle tank as that was the only tank i have he can't kill the inhabitants. > Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 12:22:22 EDT > From: FortWayneFish@... >Subject: Re: favorite fish died unexpectedly > >Emily, >Three years is a long time . One can and does get attached to favorite fish. >You are in no way the Only person who gets upset over dead fish. My Mother in >law has actually cried for 2 days over a dead fish, a fish she really didn't >like, but it was hers. >You gave your Moor a decent burial and did the best thing you could replaced >her as soon as possible. A BlueGill is a rather odd choice in my opinion to >replace her with but each there own. > >I hope your new fish helps ease the pain you are feeling for the loss of your >loved one. > >Rob >NE Indiana >USA > > >In a message dated 8/22/2005 11:11:28 AM US Eastern Standard Time, >bababanana@... writes: >Well my black moor goldfish died yesterday. Rather, I returned after spending >the night elsewhere and found her dead. I've had her for about three years >and she's my favorite fish. I'm pretty bummed out about it. I don't know how it >happened. I've been leaving a lamp on at night for the fish so she wouldn't >hurt herself again during the night, but someone had unplugged it. I can't >imaging that would kill her though. I feel really terrible and quilty about this. >I'm just wondering if I'm the only person who would get so upset over a dead >fish. I burried her in a houseplant and we got a bluegill to replace her. >Emily > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14817	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: Discus, ich, and high temps/ to AC - Correction

oops heheheh...fire the typist and get a new one Ray heheheh Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Sunday, August 21, 2005 6:55 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Discus, ich, and high temps/ to AC - Correction Correction/clarification: This should have read: Don't you think I already know that there is always Ich present in the tank waiting for the opportunity to infect a weakened fish? Could have sworn that's what I wrote in the first place, but discovered such wasn't the case. Too bad these original posts aren't correctable as they are on other forums. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > Norm, Don't you think I already know that there is always fish > present in the tank waiting for the opportunity to infect az weakened > fish? I did not just start in this hobby yesterday. However, once > Ich has already been seen to manifest one fish, it is EXTREMELY > possible (I would say probable) that now instead of this protozoan > merely existing in normal numbers, through infecting one fish it has > now had the chance to multiply profusely putting the remainder of the > fish population at risk. All's it takes is for one newly latent > encysted trophont having recently fallen off a fresh host to release > its new generation of dinospores, to promptly seek out other fish in > overwhelming numbers. Keep in mind, each trophont will release > between 500 and 2200 new dinospores. I hope you don't feel its > impossible for additional previously healthy fish to now get infected > with Ich spores. I maintain that it is in the best interest of all > piscine aquarium inhabitants to be treated against any possible > infestation. Incidentally, how did you get on the off-beat thread of > marine fish when the main topic of discussion dealt with AC's > Discus? My posts on this topic deal exclusively with fresh water > Ichyophthirius multifiliis, and I do not care to include in this > discussion Cryptocaryon as it is not germane to this matter. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. Hampson." > <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > Ray, > > It is claimed by many of the experts that ich is > > always present in a tank just waiting for an under par > > fish to attach, so I believe that that fish should be > > removed to quarantine before the dormant rich can > > rejuvenate and infest the other fish in the tank. I am > > inclined to believe this dormancy theory as I've seen > > outbreaks in long established tanks both fresh and > > salt water were there have been no changes of any kind > > kind in a long time, except one under par fish through > > a territorial squabble or some other reason, the quick > > removal of the effected fish has brought the tank back > > to normal. Tell me how would you treat a large salt > > water reef tank 325gall that is normally running at > > 32/33C. > > regards, > > unclenorm. > > > > > > --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > > > Hi Norm, While you may believe that all fish with > > > problems should be > > > treated in quarantine, my belief is that most (but > > > not all) problems > > > should be treated in quarantine. One of my main > > > exceptions to this > > > is when a fish shows symptoms of Ich. As I see it, > > > by the time this > > > is seen on just one fish, Ich has multiplied or is > > > about to multiply > > > in the water column many times over, putting any > > > other fish in that > > > tank at risk of contracting it. In this situation, > > > I believe it is > > > best to treat the entire tank to prevent the Ich > > > from the probability > > > (or even possibility) of spreading to the other > > > inhabitants as can so > > > very easily occur -- its very cheap insurance. In > > > my estimation, it > > > is nothing short of negligence not to treat the main > > > tank in hopes > > > that it won't spread, as once the second round of > > > new free-swimming > > > cysts release their populations (being many times > > > over the original) > > > the odds of any other fish getting this is greatly > > > increased. To not > > > act responsibly is like burying your head in the > > > sand. Ray > > > \ > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. > > > Hampson." > > > <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > > > Hi Ray, > > > > I've said many times fish with problems > > > should > > > > be treated in quarantein, Any container big enough > > > > will do. There are dozens more such sites to be > > > found > > > > on the net. > > > > regards, > > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Hi Norman, Just went up to these 4 sites you > > > > > mentioned, out of > > > > > curiousity. Looks like there's some good > > > > > information there that may > > > > > not have been known to our newcomers. One thing > > > I > > > > > did notice, there > > > > > doesn't seem to be anything there that would > > > inform > > > > > AC of how to > > > > > proceed with his treatment of Ich as the last > > > two > > > > > sites recommend > > > > > treatment by medication (only), which AC prefers > > > not > > > > > to do. The third > > > > > site even refers to Quick-Cure and Rid-Ich (both > > > I > > > > > believe containing > > > > > malachite green) which should not be used with > > > Clown > > > > > Loaches, but > > > > > something AC fortunately already realizes. The > > > > > first site recommends > > > > > raising the temperature up to 25 o C (77 o F) > > > which > > > > > may help Koi, but > > > > > would be useless in treating tropicals. With > > > the > > > > > second site, I got > > > > > the message "Can't Find Web Site". Don't know > > > if > > > > > that site still > > > > > exists or maybe its just my server. Just > > > thought > > > > > I'd pass this along > > > > > in case you haven't actually read these sites. > > > Ray > > > > > > > > > > \ > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. > > > > > Hampson." > > > > > <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > > > > > Hi AC, > > > > > > Here are some links about Ich (Ick), you > > > > > will > > > > > > find all the information you need to overcome > > > your > > > > > > problem, :- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.fishdoc.co.uk/disease/whitespot.htm > > > > > > > > > > > > http://fishorbust.net/ich.html > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.nunnie.com/ick.html > > > > > > > > > > > > http://badmanstropicalfish.com/meds/ick.html > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > unclenorm > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- aclaar877 <aclaar877@y...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ray, thanks. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I do have 0 nitrites, as well as 0 nitrates. > > > > > > > > Most > > > > > > > plants are doing > > > > > > > great, though maybe some nitrates will help > > > the > > > > > red > > > > > > > ammania > > > > > > > gracillis I have. I'll keep the heat up, > > > but > > > > > > > probably won't do salt > > > > > > > because of the plants. Do you know if the > > > white > > > > > > > spots are the > > > > > > > parasites themselves, or reactions to the > > > > > parasite? > > > > > > > If there is a > > > > > > > delay between the parasite attaching itself > > > and > > > > > the > > > > > > > appearance of a > > > > > > > spot, I may be ahead of where I thought I > > > was as > > > > > far > > > > > > > as the ich > > > > > > > cycle is concerned. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > AC > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray > > > Wetzel" > > > > > > > > > > > > <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > > > > > > To Whom it May Concern (no signature): > > > > > > > Generally, Ich find it > > > > > > > > difficult to reproduce above 86 o. > > > > > Occassionally, > > > > > > > you might run > > > > > > > across > > > > > > > > a particularly virulent and resistant > > > strain > > > > > which > > > > > > > may be able to > > > > > > > > endure temperatures up to 90 o. Their > > > getting > > > > > > > more spots may just > > > > > > > be a > > > > > > > > delayed reaction and once these cysts drop > > > off > > > > > > > they should not be > > > > > > > able > > > > > > > > to multiply very freely, if at all (unless > > > its > > > > > a > > > > > > > resistant > > > > > > > strain). If > > > > > > > > the spots are still few, I would go with > > > the > > > > > heat > > > > > > > treatment and > > > > > > > add no > > > > > > > > more than 1 tbs of salt per 5 gallons -- > > > you > > > > > have > > > > > > > Tetras. Give it > > > > > > > 2 > > > > > > > > days if you can (if there's not a heavy > > > > > > > infestation) and see what > > > > > > > it > > > > > > > > looks like by then. If you find that > > > you're > > > > > up > > > > > > > against a more > > > > > > > virulent > > > > > > > > strain, you may need to move to a > > > medication, > > > > > but > > > > > > > do not under any > > > > > > > > circumstances use a malachite green (or > > > any > > > > > other > > > > > > > dye) based > > > > > > > > medication -- it will kill your scaleless > > > > > Loaches. > > > > > > > So keep the > > > > > > > > temperature up and keep an eye on things. > > > > > And, I > > > > > > > hope you meant a > > > > > > > > reading of 0 for your nitrItes. > > > > > > > Ray > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > \ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > > > > > -- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, > > > "aclaar877" > > > > > > > <aclaar877@y...> > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > Just added four discus to 155g planted > > > tank > > > > > on > > > > > > > Sunday, and three > > > > > > > have > > > > > > > > > developed some ich spots. A few > > > cardinals > > > > > and > > > > > > > both clown > > > > > > > loaches > > > > > > > > have > > > > > > > > > them as well. Temperature has never > > > been > > > > > below > > > > > > > 86--I thought > > > > > > > ich > > > > > > > > > wouldn't spread at those temps? I now > > > have > > > > > the > > > > > > > temp at about 88- > > > > > > > 89, > > > > > > > > > and the discus are getting even more > > > spots. > > > > > > > They are still > > > > > > > eating > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > not yet scratching against things. > > > Should I > > > > > > > keep the > > > > > > > temperature > > > > > > > > high > > > > > > > > > and wait it out, or start the Quick-Cure > > > > > > > malachite green > > > > > > > medication? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Water quality is high, with 0 ammonia > > > and 0 > > > > > > > nitrates. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I'd like to hear what any other discus > > > > > owners > > > > > > > have done in this > > > > > > > > > situation. I don't want to medicate if > > > I > > > > > don't > > > > > > > have to, but > > > > > > > would > > > > > > > > > hate for the ich to rapidly spread and > > > kill > > > > > the > > > > > > > fish quicker > > > > > > > than I > > > > > > > > > can react. Thanks. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > > > > > > > > > To help you stay safe and secure online, we've > > > > > developed the all > > > > > new Yahoo! Security Centre. > > > > > http://uk.security.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > > > > > To help you stay safe and secure online, we've > > > developed the all > > > new Yahoo! Security Centre. > > > http://uk.security.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide > with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14818	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: What fish is...

My 1st visit to the Aquaticlife Homepage, Just to see the picture LOL Well its a salt water fish, looks to be a wrasse or possibly eel. I'm not a saltie so I really have no idea. Look at those teeth, imagine putting your hand in there and getting a love nibble from him. rob Indiana In a message dated 8/22/2005 1:14:44 PM US Eastern Standard Time, TheSydMonster@... writes: the one on the main web page? That is a very vibrant fish, what a neat picture :) Rebecca [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14819	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: Discus, ich, and high temps/ to AC

Couldn't that, as Norm pointed out, be due to the "infected" fish stressing out the other fish, thus making them susceptible to an ich infection? I can see, with my fish, then when one or more fish are stressed for whatever reason, it soon spreads to the rest of the tank and everyone is stressed (to include me trying to figure out the source of the stress hehehe) Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Sunday, August 21, 2005 10:00 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Discus, ich, and high temps/ to AC Norm, The length of time one has been in the hobby does not necessarily correlate with how much they have learned over the years. In any case, I find I have probably been in the hobby longer than you, but that's neither here nor there. I think the whole difference here is that I HAVE SEEN apparently "healthy" fish contract Ich as a result of another fish having been stressed and getting it, even with the affected fish being removed. Such fish as scaleless Clown Loaches are particularly prone to getting Ich and that is just the species of concern here as that's what AC has in with his Discus. I'm well aware that usually only stressed fish are subject to getting Ich. However, in cases I've observed, It would appear that the sudden release of a multitude of new Ich spores from its now renewed cycle contributed directly to this end. Whether you have ever seen this occur or not has no bearing on the fact that it can occur. I don't post lightly, and would not have brought forth these facts had I not actually experienced such occurrences. Please now be advised that in such rare instances, that Ich can continue to infect such healthy but prone fish as we're talking about when its life cycle has been jump started, even with the removal of the first infected (and obviously stressed fish). Regards, Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > Ray, > I didn't think you were a newby, neither am I, I > have probably been in the hobby longer than you have. > You are missing the point of my post, OK perhaps > rather than quoting one of my reef tanks I should have > asked the question in relation to a 125gall discus > display tank which also has clown loaches and also > runs at 32/33C. I have never seen a healthy unstressed > fish contact ich if the infected fish has been removed > from the tank. One stressed fish will eventualy stress > the other fish in the tank, (stress not infect) the > infection comes after the stress as I'm sure you are > aware. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > Norm, Don't you think I already know that there is > > always fish > > present in the tank waiting for the opportunity to > > infect az weakened > > fish? I did not just start in this hobby yesterday. > > However, once > > Ich has already been seen to manifest one fish, it > > is EXTREMELY > > possible (I would say probable) that now instead of > > this protozoan > > merely existing in normal numbers, through infecting > > one fish it has > > now had the chance to multiply profusely putting the > > remainder of the > > fish population at risk. All's it takes is for one > > newly latent > > encysted trophont having recently fallen off a fresh > > host to release > > its new generation of dinospores, to promptly seek > > out other fish in > > overwhelming numbers. Keep in mind, each trophont > > will release > > between 500 and 2200 new dinospores. I hope you > > don't feel its > > impossible for additional previously healthy fish to > > now get infected > > with Ich spores. I maintain that it is in the best > > interest of all > > piscine aquarium inhabitants to be treated against > > any possible > > infestation. Incidentally, how did you get on the > > off-beat thread of > > marine fish when the main topic of discussion dealt > > with AC's > > Discus? My posts on this topic deal exclusively > > with fresh water > > Ichyophthirius multifiliis, and I do not care to > > include in this > > discussion Cryptocaryon as it is not germane to this > > matter. Ray > > \ > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. > > Hampson." > > <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > > Ray, > > > It is claimed by many of the experts that ich > > is > > > always present in a tank just waiting for an under > > par > > > fish to attach, so I believe that that fish should > > be > > > removed to quarantine before the dormant rich can > > > rejuvenate and infest the other fish in the tank. > > I am > > > inclined to believe this dormancy theory as I've > > seen > > > outbreaks in long established tanks both fresh and > > > salt water were there have been no changes of any > > kind > > > kind in a long time, except one under par fish > > through > > > a territorial squabble or some other reason, the > > quick > > > removal of the effected fish has brought the tank > > back > > > to normal. Tell me how would you treat a large > > salt > > > water reef tank 325gall that is normally running > > at > > > 32/33C. > > > regards, > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > > > > > Hi Norm, While you may believe that all fish > > with > > > > problems should be > > > > treated in quarantine, my belief is that most > > (but > > > > not all) problems > > > > should be treated in quarantine. One of my main > > > > exceptions to this > > > > is when a fish shows symptoms of Ich. As I see > > it, > > > > by the time this > > > > is seen on just one fish, Ich has multiplied or > > is > > > > about to multiply > > > > in the water column many times over, putting any > > > > other fish in that > > > > tank at risk of contracting it. In this > > situation, > > > > I believe it is > > > > best to treat the entire tank to prevent the Ich > > > > from the probability > > > > (or even possibility) of spreading to the other > > > > inhabitants as can so > > > > very easily occur -- its very cheap insurance. > > In > > > > my estimation, it > > > > is nothing short of negligence not to treat the > > main > > > > tank in hopes > > > > that it won't spread, as once the second round > > of > > > > new free-swimming > > > > cysts release their populations (being many > > times > > > > over the original) > > > > the odds of any other fish getting this is > > greatly > > > > increased. To not > > > > act responsibly is like burying your head in the > > > > sand. Ray > > > > \ > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. > > > > Hampson." > > > > <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > > > > Hi Ray, > > > > > I've said many times fish with problems > > > > should > > > > > be treated in quarantein, Any container big > > enough > > > > > will do. There are dozens more such sites to > > be > > > > found > > > > > on the net. > > > > > regards, > > > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Hi Norman, Just went up to these 4 sites > > you > > > > > > mentioned, out of > > > > > > curiousity. Looks like there's some good > > > > > > information there that may > > > > > > not have been known to our newcomers. One > > thing > > > > I > > > > > > did notice, there > > > > > > doesn't seem to be anything there that would > > > > inform > > > > > > AC of how to > > > > > > proceed with his treatment of Ich as the > > last > > > > two > > > > > > sites recommend > > > > > > treatment by medication (only), which AC > > prefers > > > > not > > > > > > to do. The third > > > > > > site even refers to Quick-Cure and Rid-Ich > > (both > > > > I > > > > > > believe containing > > > > > > malachite green) which should not be used > > with > > > > Clown > > > > > > Loaches, but > > > > > > something AC fortunately already realizes. > > The > > > > > > first site recommends > > > > > > raising the temperature up to 25 o C (77 o > > F) > > > > which > > > > > > may help Koi, but > > > > > > would be useless in treating tropicals. > > With > > > > the > > > > > > second site, I got > > > > > > the message "Can't Find Web Site". Don't > > know > > > > if > > > > > > that site still > > > > > > exists or maybe its just my server. Just > > > > thought > > > > > > I'd pass this along > > > > > > in case you haven't actually read these > > sites. > > > > Ray > > > > > > > > > > > > \ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. > > S. > > > > > > Hampson." > > > > > > <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > > > > > > Hi AC, > > > > > > > Here are some links about Ich (Ick), > > you > > > > > > will > > > > > > > find all the information you need to > > overcome > > > > your > > > > > > > problem, :- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.fishdoc.co.uk/disease/whitespot.htm > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://fishorbust.net/ich.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.nunnie.com/ick.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://badmanstropicalfish.com/meds/ick.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > unclenorm > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- aclaar877 <aclaar877@y...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ray, thanks. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I do have 0 nitrites, as well as 0 > > nitrates. > > > > > > > > > > Most > > > > > > > > plants are doing > > > > > > > > great, though maybe some nitrates will > > help > > > > the > > > > > > red > > > > > > > > ammania > > > > > > > > gracillis I have. I'll keep the heat > > up, > > > > but > > > > > > > > probably won't do salt > > > > > > > > because of the plants. Do you know if > > the > > > > white > > > > > > > > spots are the > > > > > > > > parasites themselves, or reactions to > > the > > > > > > parasite? > > > > > > > > If there is a > > > > > > > > delay between the parasite attaching > > itself > > > > and > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > appearance of a > > > > > > > > spot, I may be ahead of where I thought > > I > > > > was as > > > > > > far > > > > > > > > as the ich > > > > > > > > cycle is concerned. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > AC > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray > > > > Wetzel" > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > To Whom it May Concern (no signature): > > > > > > > > > > Generally, Ich find it > > > > > > > > > difficult to reproduce above 86 o. > > > > > > Occassionally, > > > > > > > > you might run > > > > > > > > across > > > > > > > > > a particularly virulent and resistant > > > > strain > > > > > > which > > > > > > > > may be able to > > > > > > > > > endure temperatures up to 90 o. Their > > > > getting > > > > > > > > more spots may just > > > > > > > > be a > > > > > > > > > delayed reaction and once these cysts > > drop > > > > off > > > > > > > > they should not be > > > > > > > > able > > > > > > > > > to multiply very freely, if at all > > (unless > > > > its > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > resistant > > > > > > > > strain). If > > > > > > > > > the spots are still few, I would go > > with > > > > the > > > > > > heat > > > > > > > > treatment and > > > > > > > > add no > > > > > > > > > more than 1 tbs of salt per 5 gallons > > -- > > > > you > > > > > > have > > > > > > > > Tetras. Give it > > > > > > > > 2 > > > > > > > > > days if you can (if there's not a > > heavy > > > > > > > > infestation) and see what > > > > > > > > it > > > > > > > > > looks like by then. If you find that > > > > you're > > > > > > up > > > > > > > > against a more > > > > > > > > virulent > > > > > > > > > strain, you may need to move to a > > > > medication, > > > > > > but > > > > > > > > do not under any > > > > > > > > > circumstances use a malachite green > > (or > > > > any > > > > > > other > > > > > > > > dye) based > > > > > > > > > medication -- it will kill your > > scaleless > > > > > > Loaches. > > > > > > > > So keep the > > > > > > > > > temperature up and keep an eye on > > things. > > > > > > And, I > > > > > > > > hope you meant a > > > > > > > > > reading of 0 for your nitrItes. > > > > > > > > Ray > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > \ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > > > > > > -- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, > > > > "aclaar877" > > > > > > > > <aclaar877@y...> > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Just added four discus to 155g > > planted > > > > tank > > > > > > on > > > > > > > > Sunday, and three > > > > > > > > have > > > > > > > > > > developed some ich spots. A few > > > > cardinals > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > both clown > > > > > > > > loaches > > > > > > > > > have > > > > > > > > > > them as well. Temperature has never > > > > been > > > > > > below > > > > > > > > 86--I thought > > > > > > > > ich > > > > > > > > > > wouldn't spread at those temps? I > > now > > > > have > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > temp at about 88- > > > > > > > > 89, > > > > > > > > > > and the discus are getting even more > > > > spots. > > > > > > > > They are still > > > > > > > > eating > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > not yet scratching against things. > > > > Should I > > > > > > > > keep the > > > > > > > > temperature > > > > > > > > > high > > > > > > > > > > and wait it out, or start the > > Quick-Cure > > > > > > > > malachite green > > > > > > > > medication? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Water quality is high, with 0 > > ammonia > > > > and 0 > > > > > > > > nitrates. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I'd like to hear what any other > > discus > > > > > > owners > > > > > > > > have done in this > > > > > > > > > > situation. I don't want to medicate > > if > > > > I > > > > > > don't > > > > > > > > have to, but > > > > > > > > would > > > > > > > > > > hate for the ich to rapidly spread > > and > > > > kill > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > fish quicker > > > > > > > > than I > > > > > > > > > > can react. Thanks. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > > > > > > > > > > > To help you stay safe and secure online, > > we've > > > > > > developed the all > > > > > > new Yahoo! Security Centre. > > > > > > http://uk.security.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > > > > > > > To help you stay safe and secure online, we've > > > > developed the all > > > > new Yahoo! Security Centre. > > > > http://uk.security.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > > > Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC > > calling worldwide > > with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. http://uk.security.yahoo.com Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14820	From: raleighaquariumsociety	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Raleigh Aquarium Society

Check out the raleighaquariumsociety Yahoo group if you live anywhere near NC. We'll have our giant workshop & fish auction in February.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14821	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: What have I done????? - update from me!

Well done, seems like the present worked out well for everyone :) And now *possibly* a pond, what fun!! Enjoy :) Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Erin Cunningham <erosaaen@y...> wrote: > Thank you, Chris! I was starting to think this site wasn't right for me... it was never my intention to cause an arguement about water chemistry... > Since my DH came home and discovered his present (the tank), he's taken to it like (pardon the pun) a fish to water!!! I wasn't aware he knew much about fish...couldn't have been further from the truth! He had kept Koi in a pond back in the UK and had kept freshwater tropicals in his 150 gallon tank!!! > He took out the piece of driftwood I had in there (will add it back after its been properly leached - it was screwing up the alkalinity and pH) he has been doing partial water changes (to get the ammonia out) but he's also been feeding them 4 or more times since Sat.!!! But because he feeds them a bit at a time, apparently its OK! Since he has taken over the tank, I'm happy to report, NO more fish have died... all levels (pH, ammonia, nitrite, etc) are safe! Not to mention, DH now has a hobby back!! He's already thinking of a pond in the back garden! > > Erin > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14822	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: favorite fish died unexpectedly

sorry to hear about that. I have had mysterious fish deaths in the past as well. At least you tried your best to make it life as happy as you could. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Emily Tenczar Sent: Monday, August 22, 2005 11:11 AM To: AquaticLife Subject: [AquaticLife] favorite fish died unexpectedly Well my black moor goldfish died yesterday. Rather, I returned after spending the night elsewhere and found her dead. I've had her for about three years and she's my favorite fish. I'm pretty bummed out about it. I don't know how it happened. I've been leaving a lamp on at night for the fish so she wouldn't hurt herself again during the night, but someone had unplugged it. I can't imaging that would kill her though. I feel really terrible and quilty about this. I'm just wondering if I'm the only person who would get so upset over a dead fish. I burried her in a houseplant and we got a bluegill to replace her. Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14823	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: my catfish ate my snails!!!

Hi again Sarah, A Pleco is the "common" name for a catfish from the Plecostomus species. They are sucker-mouth catfish that generally do a good job on sucking the algae off of everything in a tank. They are omnivores so they need protein also but unfortunately, many people just let them scavenge for food and never feed them properly. http://www.PlanetCatfish.com is a great site to learn all about the variety of catfish out there in the world. I know the Channel Catfish here in southern Louisiana eat just about anything. People who are fishing for them use worms, shrimp, crawfish, cuttings of other fish, etc., anything that will stay on a hook, but you could probably feed him any kind of sinking fish food since they are mostly bottom feeders and the fish food would be more balanced. You could use any of the above mentioned items as treats though. Be careful of the loach with your snails. I understand that snails are a staple food for loaches but hopefully your Mystery snails are too big for the loach but maybe the loach sneak attacks them before they can close their trap door. I wonder if the loach could be your snail eater and blamed it on the catfish? LOL Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 08:42:51 -0700 (PDT) From: Sarah Fleming Davis <keelis_mom@...> Subject: Message: 20 Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 08:42:51 -0700 (PDT) From: Sarah Fleming Davis <keelis_mom@...> Subject: Re: Re: my catfish ate my snails!!! Hi Lenny, Well, we took the catfish out of the 55 and put him in a 29. The only other fish in there with him is a gar, and I don't think he'll mess with her, lol. But when he outgrows the tank I will give him to a lady with a pond. In the meantime....what should I be feeding him? I have 2 remaining black mystery snails that are getting pretty big, lol!!! I only just recently noticed the trapdoor things, how cool! So far nothing else in the tank has messed with them, although something bit a fin off the do-jo loach :( He seems to be doing ok though, poor guy. What's a pleco? Sarah Lenny Vasbinder <lnvtm1@...> wrote: Hi Sarah, What size tank do you have? If your "Channel Cat" is anything like the Channel Cat's we have down here in South Louisiana, they get GIGANTIC... and I imagine they would pretty much eat anything that gets in their way. The Louisiana record is 105 pounds but they regularly get caught in the 30-40 pound range. You better watch the rest of your fish in that tank. I have a 5" juvi Common Pleco that I recently adopted from a 10G tropical tank and he's in my 65G Goldfish tank and I make sure he gets enough food so he doesn't get hungry for my sleeping goldfish as it has been reported that they will go for the slime coat on healthy goldfish. They will also suck on a sick or dead fish since they are omnivores. I know most, if not all catfish are omnivores. What kind of snails do you have? I have a few golden mystery snails and the Pleco will "clean" their shells but I've never seen him actually try to eat one. Of course, the GM Snails close their trap door whenever anything gets close. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2005 21:01:01 -0000 From: "Sarah Fleming Davis" <keelis_mom@...> Subject: my catfish ate my snails!!! Have any of you ever seen a catfish eat a snail??? It was so weird! I had just turned out the light last night(I am finally realizing that the catfish aren't very active until the light's out) and my big albino channel cat came out and grabbed a snail and shook it right out of it's shell and ate it!!! Then this morning there was another empty shell :( I feel really bad for the snail but I'm also wondering if he did it because he wasn't getting enough food and was hungry? What do you think? Sarah [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14824	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: What fish is...

it looks like a yashia goby - a sw fish. --- thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@...> wrote: > the one on the main web page? That is a very vibrant fish, what a > neat picture :) > > Rebecca > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14825	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: favorite fish died unexpectedly

Very sorry for your loss. And no, you're not the only one. Me and my folks are dreading losing Horace. He's already surpassed the longest longevity I've been able to find online for Blue Gouramis (he's now 5 1/2 years old and going.) --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Emily Tenczar <bababanana@y...> wrote: > Well my black moor goldfish died yesterday. Rather, I returned after spending the night elsewhere and found her dead. I've had her for about three years and she's my favorite fish. I'm pretty bummed out about it. I don't know how it happened. I've been leaving a lamp on at night for the fish so she wouldn't hurt herself again during the night, but someone had unplugged it. I can't imaging that would kill her though. I feel really terrible and quilty about this. I'm just wondering if I'm the only person who would get so upset over a dead fish. I burried her in a houseplant and we got a bluegill to replace her. > Emily > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14826	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: favorite fish died unexpectedly

And , to continue my thought on this, if this was when I first got into the hobby, I admit, I would have just shrugged, flushed, and go buy another fish, grumbing to myself along the lines of "now I know why they were cheap" Guess that comes with addiction to the hobby. I take pride in my blue gouramis and my two monster plecos. (I have many others, but this group of 5 are the remaining survivors of when I first got into keeping tropical fish from gold fish.) ----- Original Message ----- From: "The Dragon Hunter" <dragon.hunter@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Monday, August 22, 2005 1:24 PM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: favorite fish died unexpectedly > Very sorry for your loss. And no, you're not the only one. Me and my folks > are dreading losing Horace. He's already surpassed the longest longevity > I've been able to find online for Blue Gouramis (he's now 5 1/2 years old > and going.) > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Emily Tenczar <bababanana@y...> > wrote: > > Well my black moor goldfish died yesterday. Rather, I returned after > spending the night elsewhere and found her dead. I've had her for > about three years and she's my favorite fish. I'm pretty bummed out > about it. I don't know how it happened. I've been leaving a lamp on at > night for the fish so she wouldn't hurt herself again during the > night, but someone had unplugged it. I can't imaging that would kill > her though. I feel really terrible and quilty about this. I'm just > wondering if I'm the only person who would get so upset over a dead > fish. I burried her in a houseplant and we got a bluegill to replace > her. > > Emily > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14827	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists every Monday! Monday August 22, 2005 8:00 pm - 9:00 pm This event repeats every week. The next reminder for this event will be sent in 3 hours, 4 minutes. Event Location: http://chat.thatpetplace.com/chat/chat.aspx Notes: Return to this site every Thursday from 8pm to 10pm and Monday from 8pm to 9pm (Eastern Time) to chat LIVE with one of our on-staff Marine Biologists. Learn about your fish, how to treat common maladies, get recommendations on accessories, food and live animal compatibility, or ask a question that only an expert could answer. MarineBio Chat every Thursday 8pm to 10pm EST, only from That Fish Place, The Original Aquatic Superstore. Attention MarineBio chat participants! The chat server is unavailable until 8pm Eastern Time. If you experience problems while trying to log on to the chat session ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14828	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: What fish is...

Glad I got you to do something new, Rob! --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, FortWayneFish@a... wrote: > My 1st visit to the Aquaticlife Homepage, Just to see the picture LOL > > > Well its a salt water fish, looks to be a wrasse or possibly eel. I'm not a > saltie so I really have no idea. > Look at those teeth, imagine putting your hand in there and getting a love > nibble from him. > > rob > Indiana >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14829	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: What fish is...

Thanks! I just think it is such a fascinating looking fish :) --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@y...> wrote: > it looks like a yashia goby - a sw fish. > > --- thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > > the one on the main web page? That is a very vibrant fish, what a > > neat picture :) > > > > Rebecca > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14830	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: What fish is...

they're nice looking gobies. unfortunately they're not too commonly available in the hobby so they're usually priced a little high - around $60 usually. i'd love to have one but don't really want to spend that much on a fish. if you think the yashia is bright and interesting, check out the helfrich firefish: http://www.petsolutions.com/404.aspx?404;http://www.petsolutions.com:80/product.asp_Q_pn_E_124950L_A_Helfrichs+Firefish_E_ and take a look @ the price! -valeen --- thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@...> wrote: > Thanks! I just think it is such a fascinating looking fish :) > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Valeen Gonzalez > <valeendgonzalez@y...> wrote: > > it looks like a yashia goby - a sw fish. > > > > --- thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@c...> wrote: > > > > > the one on the main web page? That is a very vibrant fish, what a > > > neat picture :) > > > > > > Rebecca > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > > My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!! > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14831	From: camdogkingsfan	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Albino catfish babies

About two weeks ago I saw a couple of white looking bubbles that looked like eegs but i didn't know what they where. I went to clean out the tank yesterday and there was this very small fish swimming at the bottom of the tank and it was a baby albino catfish. I have never had baby fish before I was so excitied. I know i am a dork but I was so happy. cameron

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14832	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: What fish is...

In a message dated 8/22/2005 1:44:28 P.M. Central Standard Time, FortWayneFish@... writes: Well its a salt water fish, looks to be a wrasse or possibly eel. I'm not a saltie so I really have no idea. Look at those teeth, imagine putting your hand in there and getting a love nibble from him. Is it some kind of gobie? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14833	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: What fish is...

it's a yashia goby. --- Crazy4fids@... wrote: > > In a message dated 8/22/2005 1:44:28 P.M. Central Standard Time, > FortWayneFish@... writes: > > > Well its a salt water fish, looks to be a wrasse or possibly eel. I'm not a > > saltie so I really have no idea. > Look at those teeth, imagine putting your hand in there and getting a love > nibble from him. > > > > Is it some kind of gobie? > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14834	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: favorite fish died unexpectedly

Thanks for the kind words. I'm glad to know I am not alone. We have been thinking about getting some more native fish and a bluegill seemed like a good choice...I'm not ready for another black moor right now. She had a really unique personality. The one thing I'm worried about causing problems is doing water changes from the tap. The tap water has nitrite and low levels of nitrate (I just checked it the other day). Would setting the water out for a day get rid of chemicals? Emily FortWayneFish@... wrote: Emily, Three years is a long time . One can and does get attached to favorite fish. You are in no way the Only person who gets upset over dead fish. My Mother in law has actually cried for 2 days over a dead fish, a fish she really didn't like, but it was hers. You gave your Moor a decent burial and did the best thing you could replaced her as soon as possible. A BlueGill is a rather odd choice in my opinion to replace her with but each there own. I hope your new fish helps ease the pain you are feeling for the loss of your loved one. Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 8/22/2005 11:11:28 AM US Eastern Standard Time, bababanana@... writes: Well my black moor goldfish died yesterday. Rather, I returned after spending the night elsewhere and found her dead. I've had her for about three years and she's my favorite fish. I'm pretty bummed out about it. I don't know how it happened. I've been leaving a lamp on at night for the fish so she wouldn't hurt herself again during the night, but someone had unplugged it. I can't imaging that would kill her though. I feel really terrible and quilty about this. I'm just wondering if I'm the only person who would get so upset over a dead fish. I burried her in a houseplant and we got a bluegill to replace her. Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14835	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: favorite fish died unexpectedly

Yeah this is almost as bad when my dog died. At least she was old and it was planned. Goldfish are supposed to live a long time, aren't they?? Emily thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@...> wrote: So sorry for your loss :( You certainly are not the only person to be upset over a deceased pet! I am glad she had a nice life with you and hope your new fish does, too. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Emily Tenczar wrote: > Well my black moor goldfish died yesterday. Rather, I returned after spending the night elsewhere and found her dead. I've had her for about three years and she's my favorite fish. I'm pretty bummed out about it. I don't know how it happened. I've been leaving a lamp on at night for the fish so she wouldn't hurt herself again during the night, but someone had unplugged it. I can't imaging that would kill her though. I feel really terrible and quilty about this. I'm just wondering if I'm the only person who would get so upset over a dead fish. I burried her in a houseplant and we got a bluegill to replace her. > Emily > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14836	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: favorite fish died unexpectedly

I had just filled up the aquarium with brand new huge amazon swords for them. I spent almost a month cycling the 55 gal this spring to step them up from the 20 gal. What could have gone wrong when I spent so much time trying to do things right? Emily Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: sorry to hear about that. I have had mysterious fish deaths in the past as well. At least you tried your best to make it life as happy as you could. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Emily Tenczar Sent: Monday, August 22, 2005 11:11 AM To: AquaticLife Subject: [AquaticLife] favorite fish died unexpectedly Well my black moor goldfish died yesterday. Rather, I returned after spending the night elsewhere and found her dead. I've had her for about three years and she's my favorite fish. I'm pretty bummed out about it. I don't know how it happened. I've been leaving a lamp on at night for the fish so she wouldn't hurt herself again during the night, but someone had unplugged it. I can't imaging that would kill her though. I feel really terrible and quilty about this. I'm just wondering if I'm the only person who would get so upset over a dead fish. I burried her in a houseplant and we got a bluegill to replace her. Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14837	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: favorite fish died unexpectedly

Wow! That's cool that he's so old. Did you know I have a hissing cockroach that's 5 years old? Really old for a roach ;) Emily The Dragon Hunter <dragon.hunter@...> wrote: Very sorry for your loss. And no, you're not the only one. Me and my folks are dreading losing Horace. He's already surpassed the longest longevity I've been able to find online for Blue Gouramis (he's now 5 1/2 years old and going.) --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Emily Tenczar wrote: > Well my black moor goldfish died yesterday. Rather, I returned after spending the night elsewhere and found her dead. I've had her for about three years and she's my favorite fish. I'm pretty bummed out about it. I don't know how it happened. I've been leaving a lamp on at night for the fish so she wouldn't hurt herself again during the night, but someone had unplugged it. I can't imaging that would kill her though. I feel really terrible and quilty about this. I'm just wondering if I'm the only person who would get so upset over a dead fish. I burried her in a houseplant and we got a bluegill to replace her. > Emily > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14838	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: favorite fish died unexpectedly

That's just the thing, if you buy a fish that dies right away, then there is no time to get attached to it. But when you've known someone for three years, it's different. And fish are so interactive with humans that it's easy to get attached like you would any other vertebrate pet. Emily The Dragon Hunter <dragon.hunter@...> wrote: And , to continue my thought on this, if this was when I first got into the hobby, I admit, I would have just shrugged, flushed, and go buy another fish, grumbing to myself along the lines of "now I know why they were cheap" Guess that comes with addiction to the hobby. I take pride in my blue gouramis and my two monster plecos. (I have many others, but this group of 5 are the remaining survivors of when I first got into keeping tropical fish from gold fish.) ----- Original Message ----- From: "The Dragon Hunter" To: Sent: Monday, August 22, 2005 1:24 PM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: favorite fish died unexpectedly > Very sorry for your loss. And no, you're not the only one. Me and my folks > are dreading losing Horace. He's already surpassed the longest longevity > I've been able to find online for Blue Gouramis (he's now 5 1/2 years old > and going.) > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Emily Tenczar > wrote: > > Well my black moor goldfish died yesterday. Rather, I returned after > spending the night elsewhere and found her dead. I've had her for > about three years and she's my favorite fish. I'm pretty bummed out > about it. I don't know how it happened. I've been leaving a lamp on at > night for the fish so she wouldn't hurt herself again during the > night, but someone had unplugged it. I can't imaging that would kill > her though. I feel really terrible and quilty about this. I'm just > wondering if I'm the only person who would get so upset over a dead > fish. I burried her in a houseplant and we got a bluegill to replace > her. > > Emily > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14839	From: Aaron	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: Bathroom aquariums -> Aquariass - Aquarium toilet

I saw on TV this guy (I believe it was in NYC) that makes Toilet (Fish) Tanks - he has a small seperate part hidden in back for flushing. From TV Show - Shown on: I Want That! HIWT-102, Episode - A Mighty Flush...toilets with fish. here is the link - http://www.hgtv.com/hgtv/rm_plumbing_toilets/article/0,,HGTV_3777_368 5936,00.html {if the link does not work - I went to http://www.hgtv.com/ and Searched for "Toilet and fish and tank"} Elseware Inc. offers a unique toilet tank assembly that combines a reservoir for flushing and a working aquarium. Finally, enjoy the tranquility of an aquarium in the bathroom. More Information Fishy Toilet From Elseware Inc. Phone: 917-805-2588 E-mail: oliver@... Website: www.elsewareinc.com Aquariass - Aquarium toilet Add a little life to your bathroom with this live aquarium. The fully functioning tank fits American Standard bowls. Custom bowl installation is available. 3/8" acrylic tank 1.6 gpf. (federal standard) 22" x 14" x 9" deep Designer: Oliver Beckert hth, Aaron --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Lenny Vasbinder" <lnvtm1@g...> wrote: > Message: > Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 17:33:26 EDT > From: Crazy4fids@a... > Subject: Re: Re: angels and discus > > Anybody have an aquarium in their bathroom yet? > > Linda

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14840	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: my catfish ate my snails!!!

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Lenny Vasbinder" <lnvtm1@g...> wrote: > Hi again Sarah, > > A Pleco is the "common" name for a catfish from the Plecostomus species. They are sucker-mouth catfish that generally do a good job on sucking the algae off of everything in a tank. They are omnivores so they need protein also but unfortunately, many people just let them scavenge for food and never feed them properly. http://www.PlanetCatfish.com is a great site to learn all about the variety of catfish out there in the world. > Hey Lenny :) You know, I think my catfish does eat ghost shrimp, I'll pick some up for him the next time I'm out. What about brine shrimp? Can't you "grow" them? Oh, I know what the plecos are, lol! My husband won't have them because he says they deficate so much, it itsn't worth the stuff they clean!!! So now the only things cleaning the tank walls are the 2 snails, lol! And I know the catfish ate the snails because I watched him! And we didn't have the loach then but thanks for the heads-up, I will keep and eye on him. I don't know anything about loaches actually, I'll have to look some info up!!! Sarah I know the Channel Catfish here in southern Louisiana eat just about anything. People who are fishing for them use worms, shrimp, crawfish, cuttings of other fish, etc., anything that will stay on a hook, but you could probably feed him any kind of sinking fish food since they are mostly bottom feeders and the fish food would be more balanced. You could use any of the above mentioned items as treats though. > > Be careful of the loach with your snails. I understand that snails are a staple food for loaches but hopefully your Mystery snails are too big for the loach but maybe the loach sneak attacks them before they can close their trap door. I wonder if the loach could be your snail eater and blamed it on the catfish? LOL > > Lenny Vasbinder > http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com > 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 > LNVTM1@g... > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14841	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists every Monday! Monday August 22, 2005 8:00 pm - 9:00 pm This event repeats every week. Event Location: http://chat.thatpetplace.com/chat/chat.aspx Notes: Return to this site every Thursday from 8pm to 10pm and Monday from 8pm to 9pm (Eastern Time) to chat LIVE with one of our on-staff Marine Biologists. Learn about your fish, how to treat common maladies, get recommendations on accessories, food and live animal compatibility, or ask a question that only an expert could answer. MarineBio Chat every Thursday 8pm to 10pm EST, only from That Fish Place, The Original Aquatic Superstore. Attention MarineBio chat participants! The chat server is unavailable until 8pm Eastern Time. If you experience problems while trying to log on to the chat session ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14842	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: my catfish ate my snails!!!

Sarah, There a lot of different kinds of "plecos" available. Smaller and produce less waste. Check here http://www.planetcatfish.com/ Mike -----Original Message----- From: Sarah Fleming Davis <keelis_mom@...> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Mon, 22 Aug 2005 23:38:56 -0000 Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: my catfish ate my snails!!! Oh, I know what the plecos are, lol! My husband won't have them because he says they deficate so much, it itsn't worth the stuff they clean!!! So now the only things cleaning the tank walls are the 2 snails, lol! And I know the catfish ate the snails because I watched him! And we didn't have the loach then but thanks for the heads-up, I will keep and eye on him. I don't know anything about loaches actually, I'll have to look some info up!!! Sarah [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14843	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: favorite fish died unexpectedly

My girlfriend had nightmares when she lost her last fish because she had them for about 4 years and the heater broke and the water warmed up to fast. she had nioghtmares and couldnt get itnout of her head for about a week so NO your ok to feel bad and bummed about it, but realize.....SH-T happens.... they are all living creatures and whatsthe one disadvantage to life.... DEATH. Im sorry for your loss but dont dwell on it. Kris Emily Tenczar <bababanana@...> wrote: Well my black moor goldfish died yesterday. Rather, I returned after spending the night elsewhere and found her dead. I've had her for about three years and she's my favorite fish. I'm pretty bummed out about it. I don't know how it happened. I've been leaving a lamp on at night for the fish so she wouldn't hurt herself again during the night, but someone had unplugged it. I can't imaging that would kill her though. I feel really terrible and quilty about this. I'm just wondering if I'm the only person who would get so upset over a dead fish. I burried her in a houseplant and we got a bluegill to replace her. Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14844	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: What have I done !?????????

Chris, Over here, the Mom and Pop stores are falling by the wayside to the likes of corporate stores like PetsMart and Petco. In many instances they can sell what they do sell for less than the Mom and Pop stores pay for the same thing for resale. Those that still do exist are moving to some of the same methods of stocking that the big boys do. Tanks all tied into a central filtration system so that all water is the same, and disease has a chance to spread store wide if they are not using or maintaining a UV unit sufficient to handle the water volume. Since, for many, it is move the fish in and move them out, they do not see water parameters to meet the fishes' needs as being important at all, since most fish can survive in very different water than they will thrive in. Sure, they do lose fish. They always have. It is built into the price of the ones that survive. Most livestock prices are boosted 3-400% by the store, so a fish that costs them 30 cents can be yours for $1.00 or $1.25. Don't get me wrong, I do not begrudge them the mark-up, everyone needs to make a living and cover their costs if they are running a business. I just want people to realize that you can not keep fish the way a store keeps fish over the long term. You need to know your water, and then pick fish that will do well in your water without having to adjust it every week. Once you have the basics down, then you can start to get fancy, if you want. If you have water that is pH 6.3 with a DH of 3, and want to keep Rift Lake cichlids, by all means boost your pH and bring up your hardness so that these fish will do their best for you. Just walk into it with open eyes. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Chris Sent: Monday, August 22, 2005 7:41 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: What have I done !????????? I don't know about you, but every store that I've worked in maintains banks of tanks with similar water quality, grouping fish with similar needs into the same bank. No store I've worked at has ever thought of fishkeeping as just "throwing water and fish together" even though a huge array of water conditions is maintained throughout any shop. If my first posting gave the impression that fishkeeping was just a 1, 2, 3 - I'm sorry - never meant that. And I didn't think the one posting was supposed to be a complete guide to fish care for beginners. Quite simply, shops do stock fish which require all different water conditions. Beginners will buy the fish. Not all water supplies will suit all fish right out of the tap. For those that needed to know, their water can be adjusted to suit their fish. Simple as that. My second post adds that anyone wanting to own a fish should be responsible enough to ensure it's requirements are met - this will include monitoring, and adjusting if necessary, water conditions. Surely we all agree on that? Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14845	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: Gambusia day

Chris, As they say, "The best laid plans of mice and men . . .". \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Chris Sent: Monday, August 22, 2005 7:56 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Gambusia day --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > How did things work out for you in the gambusia hunt? > Somewhat disappointing, actually. The waterhole we planned to clear was about 1.5m across, and about 40-50cm deep. There would have been several hundred, if not a thousand Gambusia in there. It rained overnight just before and on the morning of, the day we planned to clear the hole. As a result, the waterhole's surface area was about 8 times larger, and it was now about 1.5 m deep. We took out about a hundred Gambusia anyway - mostly males and only a couple of really large females. None have been destroyed as I've put them into a tank for now. We found Gambusia in the second wetlands also, but none in the sediment pond, which is upstream (and drains into both wetlands). The overflows from the sediment pond into the wetlands are both "one- way" in that the water falls vertically down a short distance. In many ways this was a reconnaissance mission as we are planning an invertebrate and fish survey. So on the positive side, we did not find Gambusia in the sediment pond (although our sampling is far from conclusive!) and we did find several insect larvae despite still being in winter. Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14846	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrite/nitrate in tap water

Emily, Just letting water stand will not remove nitrite and/or nitrate from the water. You may wish to try Amquel Plus, which claims to neutralize the nitrites and nitrates. I've not used it, so I can not give you any first hand reports of its efficacy. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Emily Tenczar Sent: Monday, August 22, 2005 10:51 AM To: AquaticLife Subject: [AquaticLife] Nitrite/nitrate in tap water Hey folks, our tap water (directly from the faucet) contains about 3 ppm of Nitrite and 20 ppm of Nitrate. I use tap water conditioner before adding water to my tanks. Is there a way to remove the nitrite/nitrate by letting the water stand for a day or so, or some other way? Emily

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14847	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: Nitrite/nitrate in tap water

See, I was thinking the same thing. I have some stuff to remove nitrates. I will check it out. Emily --- Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > Emily, > > Just letting water stand will not remove nitrite > and/or nitrate from the > water. You may wish to try Amquel Plus, which claims > to neutralize the > nitrites and nitrates. I've not used it, so I can > not give you any first > hand reports of its efficacy. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Emily Tenczar > Sent: Monday, August 22, 2005 10:51 AM > To: AquaticLife > Subject: [AquaticLife] Nitrite/nitrate in tap water > > Hey folks, our tap water (directly from the faucet) > contains about 3 ppm of > Nitrite and 20 ppm of Nitrate. I use tap water > conditioner before adding > water to my tanks. Is there a way to remove the > nitrite/nitrate by letting > the water stand for a day or so, or some other way? > Emily > > > > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor > --------------------~--> > Get fast access to your favorite Yahoo! Groups. Make > Yahoo! your home page > http://us.click.yahoo.com/dpRU5A/wUILAA/yQLSAA/ANOolB/TM > --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when > replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the > TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14848	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: do you name your fish?/measurements?

Sarah, The only way to get an accurate measurement is to sedate them and pull them out of the water. Generally, this is not a real good idea. If you get one of those clear plastic rulers, you can hold it up on the tank side, and get a pretty good estimate of the size of the fish. As Rob mentioned, there are two different ways to measure a fish, TL (Total Length) and SL (Standard Length). TL is the measurement from the tip of the snout to the tip of the tail. SL is the measurement from the tip of the snout to the caudal peduncle. Now, you sez to yourself, what the heck is a caudal peduncle? That is where the tail is attached to the fish--you measure to the end of the fleshy part. You may also ask yourself why there would be two measurements. If you study the tails of fish, you can see there are a number of factors that make TL the less reliable measure of the length of a fish. Many fish have what are known as extensions on the tail. Look at the swordtail. The male has a extension from the lower part of the caudal fin, which, amazingly enough, is called a sword. The length of the sword can vary between specimens of the same species or variety of swordtail. Now, look at the female. She has no sword. Using TL, males could be considered to be the larger of the two sexes, which to the eye is not true, using SL shows that the female is definitely the larger of the two. The question may arise as to whether you should include the extensions or not also. You may chose not to, but Rob, well, he is a guy, and he sure wants to have the largest fish, so he will include the extension, and maybe even add on a couple of mm to it to ensure he has the largest fish. <g> There are other factors. How many times have you seen a fish with a chunk out of its caudal? Do you guess where the tail should actually end, or should you use SL to get a truer picture of the size of the fish? I'd chose the latter. When a fin has been chomped, or otherwise is missing a piece, the piece often grows back in, but it is not always the same size as it would have been if it had not gone missing in the first place. One final thing to consider, which makes this even more confusing is that often books will not say which measurement they are using, TL or SL. Some may even use a mixture--you have no way of knowing. Sometimes, upon careful reading of the parts of the book that do not contain pictures, you may find out which measurement is used. The best way to learn what size fish grow to is to work with them, view them as often as you can under as many conditions as you can, then take you best shot at coming up with a measurement of the largest fish of that species or variety. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Sarah Fleming Davis Sent: Monday, August 22, 2005 11:58 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife]do you name your fish?/measurements? How do you get exact measurements of your fish?!?!? Sarah joequality1980 <crazy.joe.walcek@...> wrote: I painstakingly take 6 photos of each fish, one for each direction on the compass plus above and below. Then I assign he/she a name selected from the Tibetan Book of the Dead based upon the fish's personality exhibited during the picture process. Once the name is selected I write the name plus the exact measurements of the fish on each photo, and submit it to www.petfishnamesdatabase.com. I email the photos to all my friends and family, and lastly file them away in my own peronsal archive that is updated every Saturday night. The entire process usually take around five hours. > Subject: do you name your fish?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14849	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: comets harrassing oranda? Help!

Yesterday I moved my bluescale oranda from his hospital tank (where he was recovering from a supposed fin and tail rot) and replaced him into his 55 gal in which reside 2 commets and a bullhead. Now a day later....his fins are back to looking terrible! My only guess is that the comets have something to do with it. I think I read somewhere that they like to nip fins. So if this is the case, what to do? What to do? Why would the fish live together well for a year (the time I've had the comets) and all of the sudden start harrassing this oranda? If I move the oranda to its own tank, will it get lonely? Do goldfish need the company of other goldfish? Thanks for your help Emily

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14850	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: do you name your fish?/measurements?

In a message dated 8/22/2005 11:17:25 PM Eastern Standard Time, steve@... writes: <<<You may chose not to, but Rob, well, he is a guy, and he sure wants to have the largest fish, so he will include the extension, and maybe even add on a couple of mm to it to ensure he has the largest fish. <g>>>> If he's really smart, he'll measure the fish while they're in a bowfront.... ;-) Vicky Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Call (301) 402-8625 or write: hgparker@... =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: FCR-Cancer-Support@yahoogroups.com Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@... 919-513-1467, Dr London @ calondon@... 530-754-5711 _AND_ Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14851	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: comets harrassing oranda? Help!

In a message dated 8/22/2005 11:18:51 PM Eastern Standard Time, bababanana@... writes: <<<So if this is the case, what to do? What to do? Why would the fish live together well for a year (the time I've had the comets) and all of the sudden start harrassing this oranda?>>> Common wisdom is to not mix types of goldfishes - torpedo shaped vs. egg shaped vs. special exceptions (telescopes, ranchus, lionheads, celestials) The comet may not harrass your oranda when he's healthy, but I swear sick fish are nipper magnets. I don't know if they miss other goldfish, but I can tell you mine have always seemed to appreciate each other's company. =) Your comets should eventually outgrow that 55, ime. (I've got 12 - 14" comets out in my garden pond) Also, how is the water quality in the 55? Vicky Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Call (301) 402-8625 or write: hgparker@... =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: FCR-Cancer-Support@yahoogroups.com Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@... 919-513-1467, Dr London @ calondon@... 530-754-5711 _AND_ Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14852	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: favorite fish died unexpectedly

it happens... Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Emily Tenczar Sent: Monday, August 22, 2005 6:11 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] favorite fish died unexpectedly I had just filled up the aquarium with brand new huge amazon swords for them. I spent almost a month cycling the 55 gal this spring to step them up from the 20 gal. What could have gone wrong when I spent so much time trying to do things right? Emily Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: sorry to hear about that. I have had mysterious fish deaths in the past as well. At least you tried your best to make it life as happy as you could. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Emily Tenczar Sent: Monday, August 22, 2005 11:11 AM To: AquaticLife Subject: [AquaticLife] favorite fish died unexpectedly Well my black moor goldfish died yesterday. Rather, I returned after spending the night elsewhere and found her dead. I've had her for about three years and she's my favorite fish. I'm pretty bummed out about it. I don't know how it happened. I've been leaving a lamp on at night for the fish so she wouldn't hurt herself again during the night, but someone had unplugged it. I can't imaging that would kill her though. I feel really terrible and quilty about this. I'm just wondering if I'm the only person who would get so upset over a dead fish. I burried her in a houseplant and we got a bluegill to replace her. Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14853	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/22/2005
Subject: Re: do you name your fish?/measurements?

LMAO !! Is it pick on Rob day .... take your best shot. :-) I have been thinking of putting one of those elongated mirrors ( fun houses ) on the sides of my tanks, that way i can take reflective shots of GIANT fish.. Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 8/22/2005 10:20:37 PM US Eastern Standard Time, seleya8@... writes: If he's really smart, he'll measure the fish while they're in a bowfront.... ;-) Vicky [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14854	From: Chris	Date: 8/23/2005
Subject: Re: What have I done????? - update from me!

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Erin Cunningham <erosaaen@y...> wrote: I wasn't aware he knew much about fish... hahaha - I find that very funny! :) sounds a little like myself - out of the hobby for a time, but now the addiction is slowly growing again - including the pond plans, although for local natives in my case.... Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14855	From: muskie4817	Date: 8/23/2005
Subject: At a loss

I am at a loss as to what can be the problem with my tank. I own a 40 gallon community tank that has been up and running now for 1 1/2 years. I had about 20 different fish in it for quite a long time and then they just started dying off. I kept checking the ph and water conditions and everything seemed fine. I ended up with 3 pristella tetras, 1 serpae tetra and 1 pleco. I have left this set alone for about 1-2 months. I went to our local fish store (Jacks) and took a water sample. They test the ph, ammonia and nitrates and said everything was good. Just as I had tested. I bought 3 giant danios and brougth them home and watched them swim all around. Two days later, I noticed them swimming near the top. Today, I have one floating upside down. I don't know what can be wrong. Any ideas?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14856	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/23/2005
Subject: Re: At a loss

what are the levels now? _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of muskie4817 Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2005 7:22 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] At a loss I am at a loss as to what can be the problem with my tank. I own a 40 gallon community tank that has been up and running now for 1 1/2 years. I had about 20 different fish in it for quite a long time and then they just started dying off. I kept checking the ph and water conditions and everything seemed fine. I ended up with 3 pristella tetras, 1 serpae tetra and 1 pleco. I have left this set alone for about 1-2 months. I went to our local fish store (Jacks) and took a water sample. They test the ph, ammonia and nitrates and said everything was good. Just as I had tested. I bought 3 giant danios and brougth them home and watched them swim all around. Two days later, I noticed them swimming near the top. Today, I have one floating upside down. I don't know what can be wrong. Any ideas? Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14857	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/23/2005
Subject: Re: Bathroom aquariums -> Aquariass - Aquarium toilet

Or, you could go here for a description and picture--yours for only $1100! http://www.gizmodo.com/archives/aquariass-moon-in-pisces-018951.php \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Aaron Sent: Monday, August 22, 2005 7:16 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Bathroom aquariums -> Aquariass - Aquarium toilet I saw on TV this guy (I believe it was in NYC) that makes Toilet (Fish) Tanks - he has a small seperate part hidden in back for flushing. From TV Show - Shown on: I Want That! HIWT-102, Episode - A Mighty Flush...toilets with fish. here is the link - http://www.hgtv.com/hgtv/rm_plumbing_toilets/article/0,,HGTV_3777_368 5936,00.html {if the link does not work - I went to http://www.hgtv.com/ and Searched for "Toilet and fish and tank"} Elseware Inc. offers a unique toilet tank assembly that combines a reservoir for flushing and a working aquarium. Finally, enjoy the tranquility of an aquarium in the bathroom. More Information Fishy Toilet From Elseware Inc. Phone: 917-805-2588 E-mail: oliver@... Website: www.elsewareinc.com Aquariass - Aquarium toilet Add a little life to your bathroom with this live aquarium. The fully functioning tank fits American Standard bowls. Custom bowl installation is available. 3/8" acrylic tank 1.6 gpf. (federal standard) 22" x 14" x 9" deep Designer: Oliver Beckert hth, Aaron --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Lenny Vasbinder" <lnvtm1@g...> wrote: > Message: > Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 17:33:26 EDT > From: Crazy4fids@a... > Subject: Re: Re: angels and discus > > Anybody have an aquarium in their bathroom yet? > > Linda

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14858	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 8/23/2005
Subject: Re: At a loss

Do you do water changes? Are they getting enough oxygen? _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of muskie4817 Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2005 7:22 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] At a loss I am at a loss as to what can be the problem with my tank. I own a 40 gallon community tank that has been up and running now for 1 1/2 years. I had about 20 different fish in it for quite a long time and then they just started dying off. I kept checking the ph and water conditions and everything seemed fine. I ended up with 3 pristella tetras, 1 serpae tetra and 1 pleco. I have left this set alone for about 1-2 months. I went to our local fish store (Jacks) and took a water sample. They test the ph, ammonia and nitrates and said everything was good. Just as I had tested. I bought 3 giant danios and brougth them home and watched them swim all around. Two days later, I noticed them swimming near the top. Today, I have one floating upside down. I don't know what can be wrong. Any ideas? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14859	From: Chris	Date: 8/23/2005
Subject: very little fish

World's smallest fish. I just found a paper describing the world's smallest vertebrate (a fish) found at the Great Barrier Reef, Queensland, Australia. It's a marine goby less than 1cm. Here is a photo of a single specimen in a jar which is being held (for size comparison): http://www.origo.hu/tudomany/fold/20040726avilag.html And here is a picture of the fish: http://www.trekkingthai.com/cgi- bin/webboard/generate.pl?board=nature&content=0030 Not a hugely pretty fish - I wonder what that would cost in the shop? Schindleria brevipinguis Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14860	From: Amalthea	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Interesting video

Don't try this at home, kids, but it's interesting to witness: http://neistat.com/pages/video_holding/goldfish_holding.htm Amalthea http://www.amaltheasattic.com Custom Dreadfalls, Creepy Toys, and Much, Much More... [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14861	From: muskie4817	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: At a loss

My current Ph level is at 7.0 and ammonia and nitrates are at 0. The water temperature shows it is at about 78-80. I change the water about once every 1 1/2 - 2 months. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Deenerz@a... wrote: > > Do you do water changes? > Are they getting enough oxygen? > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of muskie4817 > Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2005 7:22 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] At a loss > > > I am at a loss as to what can be the problem with my tank. I own a 40 > gallon community tank that has been up and running now for 1 1/2 > years. I had about 20 different fish in it for quite a long time and > then they just started dying off. I kept checking the ph and water > conditions and everything seemed fine. I ended up with 3 pristella > tetras, 1 serpae tetra and 1 pleco. I have left this set alone for > about 1-2 months. I went to our local fish store (Jacks) and took a > water sample. They test the ph, ammonia and nitrates and said > everything was good. Just as I had tested. I bought 3 giant danios > and brougth them home and watched them swim all around. Two days > later, I noticed them swimming near the top. Today, I have one > floating upside down. I don't know what can be wrong. Any ideas? > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14862	From: Nicolas J. Munro	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Bettas got babies!!! woppie!

YIPPIE!!! YIPPIE!!!! Finnally my Bettas are breeding!!!! Found a pile of eggs or at least i think they are, little white things about the size of a grain of sand but sphere shaped. And my male betta has a bubble nest around them and is busy keeping them floating.!!! Yippie!!! There were two females and one Male along with the rest of the community fish in my 4ft fish tank. Think all Bettas look great. but hard to tell at this stage will check better over the weekend. See pics in =Nick photo album!!! Thanks guys/gals for you suggestions and help! =Nick

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14863	From: T	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: Bettas got babies!!! woppie!

HEy Nick, That is great. I recently lost my Betta of 3 yrs, and this actually made me smile! Good luck with the little ones. - Ter > YIPPIE!!! YIPPIE!!!! > > > Finnally my Bettas are breeding!!!! > > Found a pile of eggs or at least i think they are, little white > things about the size of a grain of sand but sphere shaped. > > And my male betta has a bubble nest around them and is busy keeping > them floating.!!! Yippie!!! > > > > There were two females and one Male along with the rest of the > community fish in my 4ft fish tank. > > Think all Bettas look great. but hard to tell at this stage will > check better over the weekend. > > See pics in =Nick photo album!!! > > > Thanks guys/gals for you suggestions and help! > > =Nick

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14864	From: Nicolas J. Munro	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: Bettas got babies!!! woppie!

No probs Ter, actually the photo album is "Nick (nedarg@...)" and i'm in the process of adding the photos now. =Nick --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "T" <bigter4@y...> wrote: > HEy Nick, That is great. I recently lost my Betta of 3 yrs, and this > actually made me smile! Good luck with the little ones. - Ter > > > > YIPPIE!!! YIPPIE!!!! > > > > > > Finnally my Bettas are breeding!!!! > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14865	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: At a loss

Could be a bacteria bloom? We lost a bunch of fish to no aparrant problem, and it turned out to be a bacterial bloom. Is there a film on top of the water that doesn't appear to be oily, or when the room is dark at night do you ever see a 'curtain' of mist swirling in the tank when you shine a light into it? >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14866	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: At a loss

Hi Muskie, Do you mean nitrate or nitrite ? if you do mean nitrate is zero in a 1.5 year old tank unless it is very heavyly planted, that would indicate to me that your filtration is not functioning properly. the symptoms you describe are compatible with nitrite poisoning or possibly lack of oxygen, do you have adequate water movement at the surface to facilitate gas exchange ? regards, unclenorm. --- muskie4817 <muskie4817@...> wrote: > My current Ph level is at 7.0 and ammonia and > nitrates are at 0. The > water temperature shows it is at about 78-80. I > change the water > about once every 1 1/2 - 2 months. > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Deenerz@a... > wrote: > > > > Do you do water changes? > > Are they getting enough oxygen? > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of muskie4817 > > Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2005 7:22 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] At a loss > > > > > > I am at a loss as to what can be the problem with > my tank. I own a > 40 > > gallon community tank that has been up and running > now for 1 1/2 > > years. I had about 20 different fish in it for > quite a long time > and > > then they just started dying off. I kept checking > the ph and water > > conditions and everything seemed fine. I ended up > with 3 pristella > > tetras, 1 serpae tetra and 1 pleco. I have left > this set alone for > > about 1-2 months. I went to our local fish store > (Jacks) and took > a > > water sample. They test the ph, ammonia and > nitrates and said > > everything was good. Just as I had tested. I > bought 3 giant > danios > > and brougth them home and watched them swim all > around. Two days > > later, I noticed them swimming near the top. > Today, I have one > > floating upside down. I don't know what can be > wrong. Any ideas? > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14867	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: At a loss

Does your pH vary at all (you mentioned "current" pH level)? That can be bad for fish. Did you acclimate the new fish slowly? Also, I would suggest stepping up your water changes, especially when your have a full tank. Most people do weekly or every two weeks. Do you gravel vac when you do water changes? I could be mistaken but I think bad bacteria can build up in your substrate if it isn't cleaned well. As for the dying off on an established tank -- depending on the type of fish you had in there, even though they were living they may not have been *thriving* and could have been stunted, not optimal conditions, etc. Or some kind of cycle started again (you didn't mention nitrIte readings?). Sorry to not be of more help. I hope you figure it out :) Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "muskie4817" <muskie4817@y...> wrote: > My current Ph level is at 7.0 and ammonia and nitrates are at 0. The > water temperature shows it is at about 78-80. I change the water > about once every 1 1/2 - 2 months. > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Deenerz@a... wrote: > > > > Do you do water changes? > > Are they getting enough oxygen? > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of muskie4817 > > Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2005 7:22 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] At a loss > > > > > > I am at a loss as to what can be the problem with my tank. I own a > 40 > > gallon community tank that has been up and running now for 1 1/2 > > years. I had about 20 different fish in it for quite a long time > and > > then they just started dying off. I kept checking the ph and water > > conditions and everything seemed fine. I ended up with 3 pristella > > tetras, 1 serpae tetra and 1 pleco. I have left this set alone for > > about 1-2 months. I went to our local fish store (Jacks) and took > a > > water sample. They test the ph, ammonia and nitrates and said > > everything was good. Just as I had tested. I bought 3 giant > danios > > and brougth them home and watched them swim all around. Two days > > later, I noticed them swimming near the top. Today, I have one > > floating upside down. I don't know what can be wrong. Any ideas? > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14868	From: deborahgd14	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Update on Angie - Ray

Angie seems to have rallied a little. She is swimming, but then sinks to the bottom. She ate a tiny bit yesterday and I think she got some medicated food when she did that. Is this normal? I have kept her isolated since 8/11. Thanks. Deborah D

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14869	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: At a loss

I get a film on the surface on occasion...is that bacteria? Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of cynthia brennemann Sent: Wednesday, August 24, 2005 7:05 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: At a loss Could be a bacteria bloom? We lost a bunch of fish to no aparrant problem, and it turned out to be a bacterial bloom. Is there a film on top of the water that doesn't appear to be oily, or when the room is dark at night do you ever see a 'curtain' of mist swirling in the tank when you shine a light into it? > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14870	From: Rob	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Fish Farms -Orlando area

I am going to be going to Orlando near the end of September and was hoping to be able to stop at a fish farm or two either in the Orlando area or along one of the main roads back through Florida ( I-95 to Georgia) I was looking to see if anyone had any suggestions for places to try to go see. Thanks Rob

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14871	From: EDITHAN1@AOL.COM	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Fwd: help w/ dimensions

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14872	From: EDITHAN1@AOL.COM	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: help w/ dimensions

Lets try that again: I recently set up a new tank and the dimensions are 17" T x 24" W x 12" Deep I stocked it with 3 orang mbuna cichlids all 1" long and 1 pleco, 3" long; I took all the other fish out and placed them in my community tank of live bearers, altho I am thinking of putting my clown loach 1.5" long back in there with the cichlids. Come to find out the biggest ciclid must of had babies in his mouth, because I saw 2 very tiny fish swimming around the bottom. I created a "cave - like" landscape, with rock shelves and I have a couple clay pot bottoms stacked on each other for places to escape to. I've never kept cichlids before because I was too intimidated, but I bought a cichlid aquarium book and got up the courage to "just do it". I know this fish can reach good sizes, so I'm not adding anythig else, because 1 of them has already died. When I purchased them, the salesclerk told me I had a male and 2 females. In the book, it seems very difficult to sex the fish, so I trusted her. Well I guess it was one of the females that died. Any suggestions??? SPONSORED LINKS 21st century Aquarium Hobby Aquarium filters Aquarium lighting Reef aquarium YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "21st_century_fish" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: mailto:21st_century_fish-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14873	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: very little fish

that is a very odd looking fish. --- Chris <youcantryreachingme@...> wrote: > World's smallest fish. > > I just found a paper describing the world's smallest vertebrate (a > fish) found at the Great Barrier Reef, Queensland, Australia. > > It's a marine goby less than 1cm. > > Here is a photo of a single specimen in a jar which is being held (for > size comparison): http://www.origo.hu/tudomany/fold/20040726avilag.html > > And here is a picture of the fish: http://www.trekkingthai.com/cgi- > bin/webboard/generate.pl?board=nature&content=0030 > > Not a hugely pretty fish - I wonder what that would cost in the shop? > > Schindleria brevipinguis > > Chris. > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14874	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: Interesting video

that is one cruel video! -- Amalthea <amalthea23@...> wrote: > Don't try this at home, kids, but it's interesting to witness: > http://neistat.com/pages/video_holding/goldfish_holding.htm > Amalthea > http://www.amaltheasattic.com > Custom Dreadfalls, Creepy Toys, and Much, Much More... > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14875	From: Robert	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: Interesting video

Its interesting...but mostly its really effed up, inhumane. Robert ----- Original Message ----- From: Amalthea To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, August 24, 2005 5:58 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] Interesting video Don't try this at home, kids, but it's interesting to witness: http://neistat.com/pages/video_holding/goldfish_holding.htm Amalthea http://www.amaltheasattic.com Custom Dreadfalls, Creepy Toys, and Much, Much More... [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14876	From: muskie4817	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: At a loss

My mistake, I meant nitrite levels are 0. I have a Marineland Emperor 400 filter on the tank so it is powerful enough for this tank. The water seems to look as though it is moving enough on the surface. Is there something else I should be looking to get for the tank? As I stated, I am completely dumbfounded. I lost another of my new Giant Danio's today. I have had these 3 for only 5 days and two are already gone. The last one doesn't look too well. I can't figure out why the 4 tetras are doing ok. Could the temperature be too high (78-80)? --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > Hi Muskie, > Do you mean nitrate or nitrite ? if you do > mean nitrate is zero in a 1.5 year old tank unless it > is very heavyly planted, that would indicate to me > that your filtration is not functioning properly. the > symptoms you describe are compatible with nitrite > poisoning or possibly lack of oxygen, do you have > adequate water movement at the surface to facilitate > gas exchange ? > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- muskie4817 <muskie4817@y...> wrote: > > > My current Ph level is at 7.0 and ammonia and > > nitrates are at 0. The > > water temperature shows it is at about 78-80. I > > change the water > > about once every 1 1/2 - 2 months. > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Deenerz@a... > > wrote: > > > > > > Do you do water changes? > > > Are they getting enough oxygen? > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > Behalf Of muskie4817 > > > Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2005 7:22 PM > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: [AquaticLife] At a loss > > > > > > > > > I am at a loss as to what can be the problem with > > my tank. I own a > > 40 > > > gallon community tank that has been up and running > > now for 1 1/2 > > > years. I had about 20 different fish in it for > > quite a long time > > and > > > then they just started dying off. I kept checking > > the ph and water > > > conditions and everything seemed fine. I ended up > > with 3 pristella > > > tetras, 1 serpae tetra and 1 pleco. I have left > > this set alone for > > > about 1-2 months. I went to our local fish store > > (Jacks) and took > > a > > > water sample. They test the ph, ammonia and > > nitrates and said > > > everything was good. Just as I had tested. I > > bought 3 giant > > danios > > > and brougth them home and watched them swim all > > around. Two days > > > later, I noticed them swimming near the top. > > Today, I have one > > > floating upside down. I don't know what can be > > wrong. Any ideas? > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14877	From: John	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: Interesting video ( Very Cruel!!!!)

Now that's just stupid & cruel thing to do!!!! --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Amalthea <amalthea23@m...> wrote: > Don't try this at home, kids, but it's interesting to witness: > http://neistat.com/pages/video_holding/goldfish_holding.htm > Amalthea > http://www.amaltheasattic.com > Custom Dreadfalls, Creepy Toys, and Much, Much More... > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14878	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: help w/dimensions

That tank is only 21.9 US Gallons according to http://www.fishpondinfo.com/calc.htm Here is another page of common tank sizes, volumes and weights http://www.alysta.com/books/fishtank.htm If it's a Common Pleco, (the most "common" type), they grow to over 12" and up to 24" so that tank is not nearly big enough for the Pleco. You need more like a 70G to 100G. Cichlids get very territorial, especially when breeding or raising their fry and could kill anything that gets close.... like a nearly blind Pleco just hunting for something to eat in the dark. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 13:18:25 EDT From: EDITHAN1@... Subject: help w/ dimensions Lets try that again: I recently set up a new tank and the dimensions are 17" T x 24" W x 12" Deep I stocked it with 3 orang mbuna cichlids all 1" long and 1 pleco, 3" long; I took all the other fish out and placed them in my community tank of live bearers, altho I am thinking of putting my clown loach 1.5" long back in there with the cichlids. Come to find out the biggest ciclid must of had babies in his mouth, because I saw 2 very tiny fish swimming around the bottom. I created a "cave - like" landscape, with rock shelves and I have a couple clay pot bottoms stacked on each other for places to escape to. I've never kept cichlids before because I was too intimidated, but I bought a cichlid aquarium book and got up the courage to "just do it". I know this fish can reach good sizes, so I'm not adding anythig else, because 1 of them has already died. When I purchased them, the salesclerk told me I had a male and 2 females. In the book, it seems very difficult to sex the fish, so I trusted her. Well I guess it was one of the females that died. Any suggestions??? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14879	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: Interesting Video (Now - STUPID FRIGGING IDIOTIC WEBSITE RECOMM

Below is the email I sent to the IDIOTS on that site. Other than going there for the sole purpose of complaining to the website, I would not give that site the benefit of a "click" for advertising purposes. Their email address is below if you want to complain also. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 03:58:48 -0400 From: Amalthea <amalthea23@...> Subject: Interesting video Don't try this at home, kids, but it's interesting to witness: http://neistat.com/pages/video_holding/goldfish_holding.htm Amalthea http://www.amaltheasattic.com Custom Dreadfalls, Creepy Toys, and Much, Much More... ----- Original Message ----- From: Lenny Vasbinder To: info@... Sent: Wednesday, August 24, 2005 3:57 PM Subject: Goldfish Video I'm not a member of PETA or anything like that but your video http://neistat.com/pages/video_holding/goldfish_holding.htm is HORRIBLE. Do you know how many kids and teens are going to try that at home? I have blocked your site with my Internet Explorer settings so you will never get a "click" from me for advertising purposes, ever again. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14880	From: EDITHAN1@AOL.COM	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: Interesting video

I cant see the video [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14881	From: Justin M.	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: Interesting video

At 05:57 PM 24/08/2005 -0400, you wrote: >I cant see the video You're not missing anything...I couldn't bear to watch it. JM

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14882	From: EDITHAN1@AOL.COM	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: Interesting video

I watched the video, and I didn't get it. The video showed a perfectly healthy fish and they killed it, by making it breathe carbonation. I don't understand why someone would do this and then show it to others, it made me sick in my stomach. What gives? Is this entertaining? -- to whom?? One thing kept coming to my mind, we are all rewarded according to our works. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14883	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: help w/dimensions

I would have to disagree with the comment on the plecos in regards to the cichlids. Plecos are armored fish and can withstand the protective behavior of breeding cichlids. This is why they tend to have a feast of cichlid eggs when the cichlids breed. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Lenny Vasbinder Sent: Wednesday, August 24, 2005 3:51 PM To: AquaticLife Yahoo! Group Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: help w/dimensions That tank is only 21.9 US Gallons according to http://www.fishpondinfo.com/calc.htm Here is another page of common tank sizes, volumes and weights http://www.alysta.com/books/fishtank.htm If it's a Common Pleco, (the most "common" type), they grow to over 12" and up to 24" so that tank is not nearly big enough for the Pleco. You need more like a 70G to 100G. Cichlids get very territorial, especially when breeding or raising their fry and could kill anything that gets close.... like a nearly blind Pleco just hunting for something to eat in the dark. Lenny Vasbinder http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 LNVTM1@... Message: Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 13:18:25 EDT From: EDITHAN1@... Subject: help w/ dimensions Lets try that again: I recently set up a new tank and the dimensions are 17" T x 24" W x 12" Deep I stocked it with 3 orang mbuna cichlids all 1" long and 1 pleco, 3" long; I took all the other fish out and placed them in my community tank of live bearers, altho I am thinking of putting my clown loach 1.5" long back in there with the cichlids. Come to find out the biggest ciclid must of had babies in his mouth, because I saw 2 very tiny fish swimming around the bottom. I created a "cave - like" landscape, with rock shelves and I have a couple clay pot bottoms stacked on each other for places to escape to. I've never kept cichlids before because I was too intimidated, but I bought a cichlid aquarium book and got up the courage to "just do it". I know this fish can reach good sizes, so I'm not adding anythig else, because 1 of them has already died. When I purchased them, the salesclerk told me I had a male and 2 females. In the book, it seems very difficult to sex the fish, so I trusted her. Well I guess it was one of the females that died. Any suggestions??? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14884	From: Amalthea	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: Interesting video

It's not that they kill it that's interesting, it's that they bring it back to life with a battery. That's the "point" of the whole thing. If you don't watch to the end, you miss that. Amalthea On Aug 24, 2005, at 6:13 PM, EDITHAN1@... wrote: > I watched the video, and I didn't get it. > The video showed a perfectly healthy fish and they killed it, by > making it > breathe carbonation. > I don't understand why someone would do this and then show it to > others, it > made me sick in my stomach. > What gives? > Is this entertaining? -- to whom?? > > One thing kept coming to my mind, we are all rewarded according to > our works. > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><· > ´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14885	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: Interesting video

I agree. It was very hard to watch the goldfish get all flustered as the water level got lower and lower. Why didn't they just pick up the bowl and pour the water out? What was the point of this video? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14886	From: clarkmariposo25@aol.com	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: Fish Farms -Orlando area

Try to go to segrest farms.-if it is along the way. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14887	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: At a loss

Well Muskie, I'm a bit puzzled, the Emperor 400 is a good filter if it is functioning properly, what are your nitrate readings ?, do you use tap water, if so do you treat it in any way ?, I'm wondering about chlorine or chloromine, as it still sounds like poisoning of some sort, do the deed fish show any signs of disease or damage ?, you try dropping your temp. a couple of degrees but I don't think that's the problem. A more regular water change might help. regards, unclenorm. --- muskie4817 <muskie4817@...> wrote: > My mistake, I meant nitrite levels are 0. I have a > Marineland > Emperor 400 filter on the tank so it is powerful > enough for this > tank. The water seems to look as though it is > moving enough on the > surface. Is there something else I should be > looking to get for the > tank? As I stated, I am completely dumbfounded. I > lost another of > my new Giant Danio's today. I have had these 3 for > only 5 days and > two are already gone. The last one doesn't look too > well. I can't > figure out why the 4 tetras are doing ok. Could the > temperature be > too high (78-80)? > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. > Hampson." > <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > Hi Muskie, > > Do you mean nitrate or nitrite ? if you > do > > mean nitrate is zero in a 1.5 year old tank unless > it > > is very heavyly planted, that would indicate to me > > that your filtration is not functioning properly. > the > > symptoms you describe are compatible with nitrite > > poisoning or possibly lack of oxygen, do you have > > adequate water movement at the surface to > facilitate > > gas exchange ? > > regards, > > unclenorm. > > > > > > --- muskie4817 <muskie4817@y...> wrote: > > > > > My current Ph level is at 7.0 and ammonia and > > > nitrates are at 0. The > > > water temperature shows it is at about 78-80. I > > > change the water > > > about once every 1 1/2 - 2 months. > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Deenerz@a... > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > Do you do water changes? > > > > Are they getting enough oxygen? > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > > Behalf Of muskie4817 > > > > Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2005 7:22 PM > > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > > Subject: [AquaticLife] At a loss > > > > > > > > > > > > I am at a loss as to what can be the problem > with > > > my tank. I own a > > > 40 > > > > gallon community tank that has been up and > running > > > now for 1 1/2 > > > > years. I had about 20 different fish in it > for > > > quite a long time > > > and > > > > then they just started dying off. I kept > checking > > > the ph and water > > > > conditions and everything seemed fine. I > ended up > > > with 3 pristella > > > > tetras, 1 serpae tetra and 1 pleco. I have > left > > > this set alone for > > > > about 1-2 months. I went to our local fish > store > > > (Jacks) and took > > > a > > > > water sample. They test the ph, ammonia and > > > nitrates and said > > > > everything was good. Just as I had tested. I > > > bought 3 giant > > > danios > > > > and brougth them home and watched them swim > all > > > around. Two days > > > > later, I noticed them swimming near the top. > > > Today, I have one > > > > floating upside down. I don't know what can > be > > > wrong. Any ideas? > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Send instant messages to your online friends > http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com > > > > ___________________________________________________________ How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14888	From: Chris	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: African cichlids (was Re: help w/ dimensions)

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, EDITHAN1@A... wrote: > Lets try that again: > I recently set up a new tank and the dimensions are 17" T x 24" W x 12" Deep yay! someone who talks dimensions, not volume! over here in Sydney, every tank is measured by dimensions if you're just giving someone an idea of the tank size... Volume comes into play for water chemistry / treating disease. (Oh, and I haven't a clue how much a gallon is!) > I stocked it with 3 orang mbuna cichlids all 1" long and 1 pleco, 3" long; I'm not sure exactly which species of cichlid you bought, but by saying "mbuna" we can safely say African cichlids, most likely rift lake cichlids (ie Lakes Malawi and Tanganyika). These fish natively live in vastly different water conditions to the plec, which comes from the Amazon, but - plecs are very very commonly kept with African cichlids - they seem to be very tolerant of the higher pH, hardness and salt conditions. Regarding the size of the tank and fish, I agree (with another reply) that the tank is a little small for the plec, but I wouldn't panic about it just yet. He'll be fine in there and I doubt the tank size will bother him. Plecs can live to 70 years, so you've got a bit of time to upsize your tank (if you choose). The cichlids, on the other hand could grow to perhaps 5cm, or to more than 30cm - so depending on the species, the tank may get crowded - if you imagine a full grown plec and two large cichlids. But again - you've got a bit of time - wait and see. > I am thinking of putting my clown loach 1.5" long back in there > with the cichlids. I would suggest you keep the clown loach in the community tank. He's not going to be as tolerant of the cichlids' water requirements. If you're maintaining your water quality for African cichlids, the clown loach just will not survive in there. > Come to find out the biggest ciclid must of had babies in his mouth, because > I saw 2 very tiny fish swimming around the bottom. Many African cichlids are mouth brooders. The mature males of many species have what are called "egg spots" on their anal fin (at the bottom of the fish, nearest the tail). When a pair mates, the female lays eggs, often in a depression in the gravel, then quickly swims around to take the eggs into her mouth. The male, who is excited by the female's hormones in the water, will be releasing sperm onto the eggs. The female is tricked by the male's egg spots and tries to take them into her mouth also, thus she takes in the sperm which then fertilizes the eggs in her mouth. The reason for this behaviour is because in their natural habitat, fish density is very high. If you wanted to hatch eggs by laying them in a nest or on a surface like a rock, they would be eaten in no time. The safest place for them is in the mother's mouth. > I've never kept cichlids before because I was too intimidated, I find many people say "cichlids are for the experienced" and so I held off for a long time too. But to be honest, I think there is nothing particularly difficult about keeping any kind of fish - anyone can learn how to use test kits to keep water quality in check and how to identify and treat disease. The difference is in how tolerant of poor water quality that fish can be, and in the price of the fish. You don't want to buy a breeding trio of cichlids for $100 if you're not used to maintaining water quality, and you should think twice about buying even a $5 fish if they are very sensitive to poor water. Fortunately, African cichlids are one of the most hardy fish you can buy. They are very forgiving. But as a bonus, they are completely captivating and entertaining. And they are also very intelligent. Many will learn their owner's face and will be very clearly excited when you get home. When you go on holidays they'll mope because you aren't around. When you turn on the TV, a tank of 30 cichlids will all swim to the nearest corner up and down up and down, excited by the flickering picture. Turn off the TV and they'll all fly back to their rocks saying "hey, this is my territory, get back out of here". > but I bought a > cichlid aquarium book and got up the courage to "just do it". And go for it you should! You'll probably become addicted in no time! > When I purchased them, the salesclerk told me I had a male and 2 females. In > the book, it seems very difficult to sex the fish, so I trusted her. She may well have worked it out based on the fish' behaviour. Or check for egg spots. Cheers, Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14889	From: jerry young	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Filter Media

Hello Everybody! I'm a new member here(just joined less than 24 hours ago) but been in the hobby since 1980. I began with 3 guppies n 2 zebra danios in a large mayo jar, then quickly graduated to a 5 gallon tank. Next came a 15 gallon which I had with me for 15 years. A 50 gallon came after that as a graduation gift from my aunt. Currently I am maintainig a 75gallon planted tank filled with a wide assortment of South American tetras, dwarf ciclids, dwarf gouramis, cory cats, some loaches and cyprinids. I use a 30watt flourescent daylight tube to light my tank from 7am until 8pm. I use a sponge filter powered by an airpump in one corner of the tank and an overhead power filter in the opposit corner. I put some ceramic cubes, activated carbon and peat granules in the filter box. Which leads me to my question, since carbon will remove water colourization and residues from medication, will it render the peat granules innefective since the peat granules are suppose to give my tank water a tea colour effect aside from softening it.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14890	From: EDITHAN1@AOL.COM	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: African cichlids (was Re: help w/ dimensions)

Many thanks to all who responded! Does the male or the female keep the babies in their mouth? The bigger fish is the one with the spots on the anal fin and is also the one rather protective of the babies, chasing off the other fish. In the book, it indicated it was the female that kept the babies in the mouth, or just the eggs? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14891	From: Chris	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: African cichlids (was Re: help w/ dimensions)

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, EDITHAN1@A... wrote: > Does the male or the female keep the babies in their mouth? I believe the female - but someone might correct me and point out some species where the male protects the young. > The bigger fish is the one with the spots on the anal fin and is also the one > rather protective of the babies, chasing off the other fish. That sounds like a male. > In the book, it indicated it was the female that kept the babies in the > mouth, or just the eggs? Both eggs and young babies. Quite often the female will lose alot of weight, not wanting to risk her young. Once the fry grow larger they'll leave the mouth for short periods of time. She can eat and if danger comes near they'll go back inside. Eventually the young will just have to survive on their own. Your case is quite good because there are no other threatening fish in the tank. The parents should have no real cause to eat them.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14892	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: African cichlids (was Re: help w/ dimensions)

"X. spiloptera belongs to the group of biparental mouthbrooders. The holotype of this species was collected at Nkumbula Island near Mpulungu in Zambia, but its distribution seems to spread along other parts of Zambia and along the Congonese and Tanzanian shores. " Source http://www.cichlidae.com/article.php?id=21 Mike In a message dated 8/24/2005 9:49:39 PM Pacific Daylight Time, youcantryreachingme@... writes: I believe the female - but someone might correct me and point out some species where the male protects the young. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14893	From: Chris	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: African cichlids (was Re: help w/ dimensions)

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Deenerz@a... wrote: > "X. spiloptera belongs to the group of biparental mouthbrooders. ha! that didn't take long! :D I've just never kept cichlids where the male broods. Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14894	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: Interesting video

What I saw .........A gold fish having a heart attack and an electrical charge bring it back to life. . In the end when they fill the bowl full of water again the carbonation starts bubbling in the water, then they place a 9volt battery to the water. The electrical charge kick starts the goldfish back to life. i did not find this entertaining but Perhaps a small bit educational. Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 8/24/2005 5:14:57 PM US Eastern Standard Time, EDITHAN1@... writes: I watched the video, and I didn't get it. The video showed a perfectly healthy fish and they killed it, by making it breathe carbonation. I don't understand why someone would do this and then show it to others, it made me sick in my stomach. What gives? Is this entertaining? -- to whom?? One thing kept coming to my mind, we are all rewarded according to our works. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14895	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 8/24/2005
Subject: Re: African cichlids (was Re: help w/ dimensions)

Search engines :) I knew there were Biparental mouth brooders, just could not recall the name. Mike In a message dated 8/24/2005 10:00:18 PM Pacific Daylight Time, youcantryreachingme@... writes: --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Deenerz@a... wrote: > "X. spiloptera belongs to the group of biparental mouthbrooders. ha! that didn't take long! :D I've just never kept cichlids where the male broods. Chris. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14896	From: Evita	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: Interesting video

I also agree with you and everyone on the fact killing a perfectly healthy fish like that was cruel as well as a few other things I can't even say.....But a while ago there was a tone of mail on the topic of euthanasia. It seems to me that this healthy fish died faster in Mountain Dew than many of the other methods at the site I went to on how to kill a sick fish. I also wonder if the Pepsi company would like to know how their product is being used to promote a web site. If they didn't get permission I see a law suit in the making here. Maybe someone might like to give them a heads up at Pepsi. If they did give permission for their product to be used for such an ad I would say boycott Pepsi too! Just a thought. Evita EDITHAN1@... wrote: I watched the video, and I didn't get it. The video showed a perfectly healthy fish and they killed it, by making it breathe carbonation. I don't understand why someone would do this and then show it to others, it made me sick in my stomach. What gives? Is this entertaining? -- to whom?? One thing kept coming to my mind, we are all rewarded according to our works. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14897	From: KttmfC	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Fresh water purple algea??

Ive got this purple type growth on my plants in my fresh water planted aquarium and im not sure what it is..... can anyone shed some light on this subject? i think it looks cool on the driftwood but not as uch on the plants so i would like to know how to control it or at least what it is... oh btw its 100 galloin with 6 rainbow, 2 kribs, 1 ram, and adiscus, with 5 cory cats. also various tetras that dont touch my plants. Thanks everyone Kris

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14898	From: Chris	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: Fresh water purple algea??

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "KttmfC" <punk3r12@y...> wrote: > Ive got this purple type growth on my plants in my fresh water planted > aquarium and im not sure what it is..... can you post a photo online? Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14899	From: harry perry	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: Filter Media/Peat

I run "Whispers" on all my tanks and add peat right into the filter. Works great. Harry jerry young <jerry_jla@...> wrote: Hello Everybody! I'm a new member here(just joined less than 24 hours ago) but been in the hobby since 1980. I began with 3 guppies n 2 zebra danios in a large mayo jar, then quickly graduated to a 5 gallon tank. Next came a 15 gallon which I had with me for 15 years. A 50 gallon came after that as a graduation gift from my aunt. Currently I am maintainig a 75gallon planted tank filled with a wide assortment of South American tetras, dwarf ciclids, dwarf gouramis, cory cats, some loaches and cyprinids. I use a 30watt flourescent daylight tube to light my tank from 7am until 8pm. I use a sponge filter powered by an airpump in one corner of the tank and an overhead power filter in the opposit corner. I put some ceramic cubes, activated carbon and peat granules in the filter box. Which leads me to my question, since carbon will remove water colourization and residues from medication, will it render the peat granules innefective since the peat granules are suppose to give my tank water a tea colour effect aside from softening it. Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14900	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: Discus, ich, and high temps/ to AC

Good Morning Norman, I regret this delay in replying back to you; I wrote you a lengthy reply Monday (8/24) but my 'putor decided to zap it just as it was being posted, and I just haven't had the time to get back here. \ I don't feel the need to agree with any disagreement concerning this topic, as the point of the matter is not really rationally disputable. However I will agree that it is your prerogative to take a different position regarding of whether or not just quarantining the Ich infected fish is the best approach. The agreed fact that Ich always remains in the tank is really secondary to my point, which if you've understood my posts, I have not only answered you in my main set of facts brought forth in the matter, but has been the very essence of my position on them all along. For you to say I "didn't answer your question", it almost appears you are trying to avoid the point, as I can't see how you could otherwise miss it, spelling it out as I did in so many posts. \ While I too would rather refrain from going to the expense of treating a large tank, there are occasions when it happens to be necessary and becomes far from "pointless". With the infection of an obviously stressed (or weakened) fish, the ever present latent Ich spores have now become newly activated, as manifested in the affected fish. Any resultant trophents that may have dropped off said affected fish(es) will be releasing or may have already released a multitude of new dinospores, seriously putting the rest of the inhabitants at risk whether or not the infected fish(es) have been removed. Such fish as Clown Loaches (one of the species of concern in this thread) are especially at risk regardless of whether they've become stressed or not. Such scaleless fish are most prone to Ich attacks. There is no option in these situations as a responsible hobbyist, other than to medicate the large tank in the best interest of the inhabitants, rather than to wait for the otherwise imminent outbreak of this disease. \ I feel no further need to discuss this at any more length, nor will I indulge in any such charade. I would trust that you are not intending to be a "know-it-all", as could otherwise appear. As you must realize, such people are soon looked upon as boors. Yet, I cannot fathom your reasoning in this discussion to seemingly just want to push a point for the need to look right when there's only one proper course of action to follow in these sets of circumstances. \ I do remember those goldfish games at carnivals and fairs, and have won a couple of them myself. Looking back, that can be seen as being one method of introducing at least some of us to the hobby. While I'm not trying to age you (in making you any older), I note that you mentioned winning your first goldfish in 1939, which would now make you 66 if you were a newborn infant then. I presume you might have been maybe 4 or so (?) making you about 70 right now, in my guestimation; please correct me if I'm wrong. While we've agreed that is neither here nor there, you have got me there. \ I too remembeer building my first tank -- an odd-sized one of about 12 gallons. My father soldered the frame together with a metal resembling stainless steel but having a duller finish (don't remember what it was), and which didn't need painting. I used scrap 1/4" plate, including the bottom, which was inexpensive to get, and "cheated" using the black Pecora aquarium cement in a can. I later built three 40 gallon angle iron frame tanks. Surprising how much cement you need -- these tanks had to each use about 8 pounds of the stuff which wasn't cheap. I'm intrigued with the slate backwall of your 50 gallon tank. That really sounds neat. Much later on, you may recall, they marketed hang-on shale backgrounds (with numerous small pieces) to be fitted inside your tank for decoration -- looked pretty decent. Regards, Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > Ray, > I think the time has come to agree to disagree, as > all we are realy debating is whether to treat the > display tank or treat in quarantein, as you have > agreed ich will always remain in the tank, so going to > the expense and hassle of treating a large tank is a > bit pointless don't you think.(you didn't answer that > question). I have no argument with your first > sentence, although the second might not be so > accurate. I got my first gold fish about 1939, won in > the visiting fair ground. I helped my father build my > first tropical fish tank in early 1944, it was about > 50gall, angle iron frame, slate bottom and back, glass > front and ends, sealed with plumbers glazing putty, > one of my sons still has it today but I'm not sure > what he uses it for nowadays, but as you say that's > neither here nor there. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > Norm, The length of time one has been in the hobby > > does not > > necessarily correlate with how much they have > > learned over the > > years. In any case, I find I have probably been in > > the hobby longer > > than you, but that's neither here nor there. I > > think the whole > > difference here is that I HAVE SEEN apparently > > "healthy" fish > > contract Ich as a result of another fish having been > > stressed and > > getting it, even with the affected fish being > > removed. Such fish as > > scaleless Clown Loaches are particularly prone to > > getting Ich and > > that is just the species of concern here as that's > > what AC has in > > with his Discus. I'm well aware that usually only > > stressed fish are > > subject to getting Ich. However, in cases I've > > observed, It would > > appear that the sudden release of a multitude of new > > Ich spores from > > its now renewed cycle contributed directly to this > > end. Whether you > > have ever seen this occur or not has no bearing on > > the fact that it > > can occur. I don't post lightly, and would not have > > brought forth > > these facts had I not actually experienced such > > occurrences. Please > > now be advised that in such rare instances, that Ich > > can continue to > > infect such healthy but prone fish as we're talking > > about when its > > life cycle has been jump started, even with the > > removal of the first > > infected (and obviously stressed fish). Regards, > > Ray > > \

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14901	From: EDITHAN1@AOL.COM	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: Interesting video

I guess I should of watched the ending, but I was so sickened by watching it die, I had to shut it off. The older I get the more life seems so precious to me, I guess I just don't have the strong stomach I once had. My daughter kept saying, Mom its JUST a fish. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14902	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Mississippi Cory cat keepers?

A friend just relocated to MS for work, and is need of stock to replenish his tanks. Currently he would like to find a few other hobbyists in his area ( Meridian i think ) who are breeding cory cats, or wouldn't mind letting a few go. Anyone know of a Local Aquarium Society? I checked out a few places on the net and it gave the Meridian Aquarium Hobbyists Association but the websight and telephone # they gave is no longer valid either. He is currently on the look out for adolfoi,habrosus and Hastatus. He has had success in the past breeding these 3 species and wants to limit his dabbling in corycats to a few species at first. Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14903	From: EDITHAN1@AOL.COM	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: African cichlids (was Re: help w/ dimensions)

so do you think thats what I have because like I said, he keeps chasing the female fish away, and the one female already died. He pretty much inhabits the one side of the tank that has been made to imitate cave like dwelling and the 2 little babies I've seen are at the very bottom of all these "shelves", there is like a hollowed out "nest?" at the very bottom where they stay. But the big fish w/ the anal spotted fin, which I believe to be the male, kind of corrals them back in when the other fish is out to eat, He chases her back to her side of the tank, where the clay pot saucers are stacked. Do you think the male is the brooder? Is this rare, unusual, what kind of breeding can I expect in the future, altho I really don't want them to, because right now the tank is housing everyone comfortably, but those babies are going to grow and become as big as the parents I will have to find them a new home. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14904	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: Fresh water purple algea??

It's algae... Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of KttmfC Sent: Thursday, August 25, 2005 7:25 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Fresh water purple algea?? Ive got this purple type growth on my plants in my fresh water planted aquarium and im not sure what it is..... can anyone shed some light on this subject? i think it looks cool on the driftwood but not as uch on the plants so i would like to know how to control it or at least what it is... oh btw its 100 galloin with 6 rainbow, 2 kribs, 1 ram, and adiscus, with 5 cory cats. also various tetras that dont touch my plants. Thanks everyone Kris Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14905	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Eco complete

I am getting ready to set up a new tank. It will be a planted tank (fresh water). I am trying to figure out how many of the 20 lb bags of eco complete planted tank sub. I will need for a 55 gal. tank. I have not decide yet if I am going to do a top layer of sand or not yet, but it is a possibility for my corries Thanks MM & MP, '73 Tricia, KG6PNC A couple of great sites for fun http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14906	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: Eco complete

at least 4-5 of them. I was told to get 2 bags of the 20 lbs of the sand for my 20 gallon. I am planning on getting 2 50lbs bags of it when I change over to the eco-complete gravel from my standard aquarium gravel. The sand would prolly just end up as a substrate. The eco-complete is a multi-grade substrate, so adding sand would not help. Blessings, Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Tricia Wilkerson Sent: Thursday, August 25, 2005 2:24 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Eco complete I am getting ready to set up a new tank. It will be a planted tank (fresh water). I am trying to figure out how many of the 20 lb bags of eco complete planted tank sub. I will need for a 55 gal. tank. I have not decide yet if I am going to do a top layer of sand or not yet, but it is a possibility for my corries Thanks MM & MP, '73 Tricia, KG6PNC A couple of great sites for fun http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14907	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists every Thursday Thursday August 25, 2005 8:00 pm - 10:00 pm This event repeats every week. The next reminder for this event will be sent in 3 hours, 4 minutes. Event Location: http://chat.thatpetplace.com/chat/chat.aspx Notes: Return to this site every Thursday from 8pm to 10pm and Monday from 8pm to 9pm (Eastern Time) to chat LIVE with one of our on-staff Marine Biologists. Learn about your fish, how to treat common maladies, get recommendations on accessories, food and live animal compatibility, or ask a question that only an expert could answer. MarineBio Chat every Thursday 8pm to 10pm EST, only from That Fish Place, The Original Aquatic Superstore. Attention MarineBio chat participants! The chat server is unavailable until 8pm Eastern Time. If you experience problems while trying to log on to the chat session ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14908	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: California Betta Society (CBS), 8/27/2005, 2:00 pm

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife California Betta Society (CBS) Saturday August 27, 2005 2:00 pm - 3:00 pm This event repeats on the last Saturday of every month. Event Location: various - http://www.cbsbettas.org/ Notes: CBS Meetings are usually on the 4th Saturday of each month. Our meetings are open to the public--everyone is welcome. While we hope that people will join CBS as official members, it's certainly not required -- we're here simply to share our love of bettas and information for all other fans of these fish. CBS is located in the San Francisco Bay Area. The members of CBS come from all over the Bay Area and meeting locations tend to change from month to month to give people in different parts of the Bay Area a chance to attend. (CBS) is an International Betta Congress chapter ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14909	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: Eco complete

The sand is more for looks and for the corries to play in than to help as a substrate. Thanks for the info, now I have a starting place and can go from there. MM & MP, '73 Tricia, KG6PNC A couple of great sites for fun http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya ----- Original Message ----- From: Eric Roberts To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, August 25, 2005 1:49 PM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Eco complete at least 4-5 of them. I was told to get 2 bags of the 20 lbs of the sand for my 20 gallon. I am planning on getting 2 50lbs bags of it when I change over to the eco-complete gravel from my standard aquarium gravel. The sand would prolly just end up as a substrate. The eco-complete is a multi-grade substrate, so adding sand would not help. Blessings, Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Tricia Wilkerson Sent: Thursday, August 25, 2005 2:24 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Eco complete I am getting ready to set up a new tank. It will be a planted tank (fresh water). I am trying to figure out how many of the 20 lb bags of eco complete planted tank sub. I will need for a 55 gal. tank. I have not decide yet if I am going to do a top layer of sand or not yet, but it is a possibility for my corries Thanks MM & MP, '73 Tricia, KG6PNC A couple of great sites for fun http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14910	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: Interesting video

I can understand informaing Pepsico about the ad and use of their product but boycotting them? If I went on a killing spree running over people in my dodge station wagon it isn't Dodge or Chryslers fault. Mike -----Original Message----- From: Evita <evitabug@...> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 04:49:09 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Interesting video I also agree with you and everyone on the fact killing a perfectly healthy fish like that was cruel as well as a few other things I can't even say.....But a while ago there was a tone of mail on the topic of euthanasia. It seems to me that this healthy fish died faster in Mountain Dew than many of the other methods at the site I went to on how to kill a sick fish. I also wonder if the Pepsi company would like to know how their product is being used to promote a web site. If they didn't get permission I see a law suit in the making here. Maybe someone might like to give them a heads up at Pepsi. If they did give permission for their product to be used for such an ad I would say boycott Pepsi too! Just a thought. Evita [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14911	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: Eco complete

If you contact Carib Sea, they will send you a sample of it. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Tricia Wilkerson Sent: Thursday, August 25, 2005 5:37 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Eco complete The sand is more for looks and for the corries to play in than to help as a substrate. Thanks for the info, now I have a starting place and can go from there. MM & MP, '73 Tricia, KG6PNC A couple of great sites for fun http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya ----- Original Message ----- From: Eric Roberts To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, August 25, 2005 1:49 PM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Eco complete at least 4-5 of them. I was told to get 2 bags of the 20 lbs of the sand for my 20 gallon. I am planning on getting 2 50lbs bags of it when I change over to the eco-complete gravel from my standard aquarium gravel. The sand would prolly just end up as a substrate. The eco-complete is a multi-grade substrate, so adding sand would not help. Blessings, Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Tricia Wilkerson Sent: Thursday, August 25, 2005 2:24 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Eco complete I am getting ready to set up a new tank. It will be a planted tank (fresh water). I am trying to figure out how many of the 20 lb bags of eco complete planted tank sub. I will need for a 55 gal. tank. I have not decide yet if I am going to do a top layer of sand or not yet, but it is a possibility for my corries Thanks MM & MP, '73 Tricia, KG6PNC A couple of great sites for fun http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14912	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists every Thursday Thursday August 25, 2005 8:00 pm - 10:00 pm This event repeats every week. Event Location: http://chat.thatpetplace.com/chat/chat.aspx Notes: Return to this site every Thursday from 8pm to 10pm and Monday from 8pm to 9pm (Eastern Time) to chat LIVE with one of our on-staff Marine Biologists. Learn about your fish, how to treat common maladies, get recommendations on accessories, food and live animal compatibility, or ask a question that only an expert could answer. MarineBio Chat every Thursday 8pm to 10pm EST, only from That Fish Place, The Original Aquatic Superstore. Attention MarineBio chat participants! The chat server is unavailable until 8pm Eastern Time. If you experience problems while trying to log on to the chat session ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14913	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: They love the net 0_o

My baby bettas are warped. The ones that have not yet found homes developed a gill diseas, which I have been treating with salt water baths, among other things. The silly fish will not get out of the net. I stick the net in the water, and every baby betta in the tank, sick or not, swims right into it! They do not avoide it..it's like puppies going for a ride in the car! When I try to scoop up just the diseased fish it's a laurel and hardy routine! Will it hurt the healthy fish to go along for the ride? They're driving me crazy!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14914	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: Mississippi Cory cat keepers?

Rob, Check the back section of aquarium fish magazine, they have a club/society section. Mike -----Original Message----- From: FortWayneFish@... To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 12:53:20 EDT Subject: [AquaticLife] Mississippi Cory cat keepers? A friend just relocated to MS for work, and is need of stock to replenish his tanks. Currently he would like to find a few other hobbyists in his area ( Meridian i think ) who are breeding cory cats, or wouldn't mind letting a few go. Anyone know of a Local Aquarium Society? I checked out a few places on the net and it gave the Meridian Aquarium Hobbyists Association but the websight and telephone # they gave is no longer valid either. He is currently on the look out for adolfoi,habrosus and Hastatus. He has had success in the past breeding these 3 species and wants to limit his dabbling in corycats to a few species at first. Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14915	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: Eco complete

Oh... cool thanks I will do that. MM & MP, '73 Tricia, KG6PNC A couple of great sites for fun http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya ----- Original Message ----- From: Eric Roberts To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, August 25, 2005 3:48 PM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Eco complete If you contact Carib Sea, they will send you a sample of it. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Tricia Wilkerson Sent: Thursday, August 25, 2005 5:37 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Eco complete The sand is more for looks and for the corries to play in than to help as a substrate. Thanks for the info, now I have a starting place and can go from there. MM & MP, '73 Tricia, KG6PNC A couple of great sites for fun http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya ----- Original Message ----- From: Eric Roberts To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, August 25, 2005 1:49 PM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Eco complete at least 4-5 of them. I was told to get 2 bags of the 20 lbs of the sand for my 20 gallon. I am planning on getting 2 50lbs bags of it when I change over to the eco-complete gravel from my standard aquarium gravel. The sand would prolly just end up as a substrate. The eco-complete is a multi-grade substrate, so adding sand would not help. Blessings, Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Tricia Wilkerson Sent: Thursday, August 25, 2005 2:24 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Eco complete I am getting ready to set up a new tank. It will be a planted tank (fresh water). I am trying to figure out how many of the 20 lb bags of eco complete planted tank sub. I will need for a 55 gal. tank. I have not decide yet if I am going to do a top layer of sand or not yet, but it is a possibility for my corries Thanks MM & MP, '73 Tricia, KG6PNC A couple of great sites for fun http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14916	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: Discus, ich, and high temps/ to AC

Good morning to you Ray, I've had your 'putor' problem on a number of occasions but only when using yahoo so I'm pretty sure the problem is at yahoo's end. To get back to the subject on which this will be my last post, you are still missing the point of my posts, maybe I haven't been precise enough. I'm simply saying remove all the fish from the tank, to a temporary home for treatment of what ever kind you wish to do, in 3 or 4 days all the Tomites will be dead or become dormant, much quicker if you raise the temperature to around 82F, no need to treat the tank and the fish can safely be returned if they are clear of cysts. My understanding is that the word Tomites is used for fresh water and Dinospores refers to salt water. The "know-it-all" remark was completely uncalled for and would have started a slanging match if I had the temperament of your departed friend. As for your detective work ! you got close but are a couple of years short. Finally I've never disagreed with your posts on this subject, just tried to point out an easier and more economical way to go. regards, unclenorm. --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote: > Good Morning Norman, I regret this delay in > replying back to you; I > wrote you a lengthy reply Monday (8/24) but my > 'putor decided to zap > it just as it was being posted, and I just haven't > had the time to > get back here. > > \ > > I don't feel the need to agree with any disagreement > concerning this > topic, as the point of the matter is not really > rationally > disputable. However I will agree that it is your > prerogative to take > a different position regarding of whether or not > just quarantining > the Ich infected fish is the best approach. The > agreed fact that Ich > always remains in the tank is really secondary to my > point, which if > you've understood my posts, I have not only answered > you in my main > set of facts brought forth in the matter, but has > been the very > essence of my position on them all along. For you > to say I "didn't > answer your question", it almost appears you are > trying to avoid the > point, as I can't see how you could otherwise miss > it, spelling it > out as I did in so many posts. > > \ > > While I too would rather refrain from going to the > expense of > treating a large tank, there are occasions when it > happens to be > necessary and becomes far from "pointless". With > the infection of an > obviously stressed (or weakened) fish, the ever > present latent Ich > spores have now become newly activated, as > manifested in the affected > fish. Any resultant trophents that may have dropped > off said > affected fish(es) will be releasing or may have > already released a > multitude of new dinospores, seriously putting the > rest of the > inhabitants at risk whether or not the infected > fish(es) have been > removed. Such fish as Clown Loaches (one of the > species of concern > in this thread) are especially at risk regardless of > whether they've > become stressed or not. Such scaleless fish are > most prone to Ich > attacks. There is no option in these situations as > a responsible > hobbyist, other than to medicate the large tank in > the best interest > of the inhabitants, rather than to wait for the > otherwise imminent > outbreak of this disease. > > \ > > I feel no further need to discuss this at any more > length, nor will I > indulge in any such charade. I would trust that you > are not > intending to be a "know-it-all", as could otherwise > appear. As you > must realize, such people are soon looked upon as > boors. Yet, I > cannot fathom your reasoning in this discussion to > seemingly just > want to push a point for the need to look right when > there's only one > proper course of action to follow in these sets of > circumstances. > \ > > I do remember those goldfish games at carnivals and > fairs, and have > won a couple of them myself. Looking back, that can > be seen as being > one method of introducing at least some of us to the > hobby. While > I'm not trying to age you (in making you any older), > I note that you > mentioned winning your first goldfish in 1939, which > would now make > you 66 if you were a newborn infant then. I presume > you might have > been maybe 4 or so (?) making you about 70 right > now, in my > guestimation; please correct me if I'm wrong. While > we've agreed > that is neither here nor there, you have got me > there. > \ > > I too remembeer building my first tank -- an > odd-sized one of about > 12 gallons. My father soldered the frame together > with a metal > resembling stainless steel but having a duller > finish (don't remember > what it was), and which didn't need painting. I > used scrap 1/4" > plate, including the bottom, which was inexpensive > to get, > and "cheated" using the black Pecora aquarium cement > in a can. I > later built three 40 gallon angle iron frame tanks. > Surprising how > much cement you need -- these tanks had to each use > about 8 pounds of > the stuff which wasn't cheap. I'm intrigued with > the slate backwall > of your 50 gallon tank. That really sounds neat. > Much later on, you > may recall, they marketed hang-on shale backgrounds > (with numerous > small pieces) to be fitted inside your tank for > decoration -- looked > pretty decent. Regards, Ray > > \ > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. > Hampson." > <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > Ray, > > I think the time has come to agree to > disagree, as > > all we are realy debating is whether to treat the > > display tank or treat in quarantein, as you have > > agreed ich will always remain in the tank, so > going to > > the expense and hassle of treating a large tank is > a > > bit pointless don't you think.(you didn't answer > that > > question). I have no argument with your first > > sentence, although the second might not be so > > accurate. I got my first gold fish about 1939, won > in > > the visiting fair ground. I helped my father build > my > > first tropical fish tank in early 1944, it was > about > > 50gall, angle iron frame, slate bottom and back, > glass > > front and ends, sealed with plumbers glazing > putty, > > one of my sons still has it today but I'm not sure > > what he uses it for nowadays, but as you say > that's > > neither here nor there. > > regards, > > unclenorm. > > > > > > --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > > > Norm, The length of time one has been in the > hobby > > > does not > > > necessarily correlate with how much they have > > > learned over the > > > years. In any case, I find I have probably been > in > > > the hobby longer > > > than you, but that's neither here nor there. I > > > think the whole > > > difference here is that I HAVE SEEN apparently > > > "healthy" fish > > > contract Ich as a result of another fish having > been > > > stressed and > > > getting it, even with the affected fish being > > > removed. Such fish as > > > scaleless Clown Loaches are particularly prone > to > > > getting Ich and > > > that is just the species of concern here as > that's > > > what AC has in > > > with his Discus. I'm well aware that usually > only > > > stressed fish are > > > subject to getting Ich. However, in cases I've > > > observed, It would > > > appear that the sudden release of a multitude of > new > > > Ich spores from > > > its now renewed cycle contributed directly to > this > > > end. Whether you > > > have ever seen this occur or not has no bearing > on > > > the fact that it > > > can occur. I don't post lightly, and would not > have > > > brought forth > > > these facts had I not actually experienced such > > > occurrences. Please > > > now be advised that in such rare instances, that > Ich > > > can continue to > > > infect such healthy but prone fish as we're > talking > > > about when its > > > life cycle has been jump started, even with the > > > removal of the first > > > infected (and obviously stressed fish). > Regards, > > > Ray > > > \ > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14917	From: Evita	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: Interesting video

When a company sells it's product by means you don't agree with advertizementwise yes you can boycott. If you feel the need to. That is freedom. I wonder first was this the case. Or was it used without their permission. In that case Pepsi might like to know about it. That's what I meant. Now if someone used the Dodge truck as an ad they would have to get permission to show the Dodge logo. And yes they might like to know how it was being used first. Not to get off the fish topic...just to answer the question. Evita Deenerz@... wrote: I can understand informaing Pepsico about the ad and use of their product but boycotting them? If I went on a killing spree running over people in my dodge station wagon it isn't Dodge or Chryslers fault. Mike -----Original Message----- From: Evita <evitabug@...> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 04:49:09 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Interesting video I also agree with you and everyone on the fact killing a perfectly healthy fish like that was cruel as well as a few other things I can't even say.....But a while ago there was a tone of mail on the topic of euthanasia. It seems to me that this healthy fish died faster in Mountain Dew than many of the other methods at the site I went to on how to kill a sick fish. I also wonder if the Pepsi company would like to know how their product is being used to promote a web site. If they didn't get permission I see a law suit in the making here. Maybe someone might like to give them a heads up at Pepsi. If they did give permission for their product to be used for such an ad I would say boycott Pepsi too! Just a thought. Evita [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14918	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: Fish Farms -Orlando area

I believe that you are going to be out of luck. I think most of the fish farms in that part of Florida are around Tampa, a bit out of your way. There is nothing on the East side, so far as I know, until you get down around Miami. It has been about 10 years since I've been down that way, so things may have changed. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Rob Sent: Wednesday, August 24, 2005 1:09 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Fish Farms -Orlando area I am going to be going to Orlando near the end of September and was hoping to be able to stop at a fish farm or two either in the Orlando area or along one of the main roads back through Florida ( I-95 to Georgia) I was looking to see if anyone had any suggestions for places to try to go see. Thanks Rob

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14919	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: Filter Media

Remove the carbon. Use of activated carbon as a general palliative is not recommended, and, in your case, it is removing, not only the tannins from the peat, which causes the coloration, but the other good chemicals it will place in the water. If you feel the need to use peat, you will need to learn to like the color of the water--the fish don't care. Activated carbon is good, in its place. It will remove many chemicals from the water that you have no other way to remove other than with a water change. However, it also has a down side. It is not picky about what it is removing, so it removes the good along with the bad. Experiments have also shown that once its capacity for adsorption is used, it will begin to release the chemicals, sometimes in a different form than was in the aquarium. There is no timeline that one can use to determine when this happens. One cannot say use 20 grams of AC for 30 days and then change it. The capacity of the carbon depends on the carbon itself, and each batch you purchase is liable to be different. Also, if your water contains a lot of compounds that will be adsorbed by the carbon, the capacity is used faster than if you have a light load. Only use carbon when you have a specific reason to do so, say to remove a medication from the water. If you need to lighten the discoloration the peat causes, you will need to do more frequent water changes to keep the concentration of tannins down. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of jerry young Sent: Wednesday, August 24, 2005 11:52 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Filter Media Hello Everybody! I'm a new member here(just joined less than 24 hours ago) but been in the hobby since 1980. I began with 3 guppies n 2 zebra danios in a large mayo jar, then quickly graduated to a 5 gallon tank. Next came a 15 gallon which I had with me for 15 years. A 50 gallon came after that as a graduation gift from my aunt. Currently I am maintainig a 75gallon planted tank filled with a wide assortment of South American tetras, dwarf ciclids, dwarf gouramis, cory cats, some loaches and cyprinids. I use a 30watt flourescent daylight tube to light my tank from 7am until 8pm. I use a sponge filter powered by an airpump in one corner of the tank and an overhead power filter in the opposit corner. I put some ceramic cubes, activated carbon and peat granules in the filter box. Which leads me to my question, since carbon will remove water colourization and residues from medication, will it render the peat granules innefective since the peat granules are suppose to give my tank water a tea colour effect aside from softening it.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14920	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: Fish Farms -Orlando area

There is a plant farm near Ft. Lauderdale. Florida Aquatic Nurseries. I am not sure whether they are open to the public or not. We passed it when we were vacationing down there last year. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14921	From: Salmarcus@aol.com	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Phosphates

No matter what I do, or how hard I try I cannot get rid of my phosphate problem. What should I do?? Please help. Desperate [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14922	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: Fish Farms -Orlando area

Even those are prolly out to sea after Katrina gets done with them...enjoy the storms! Eric...a survivor of Andrew while in Louisiana _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: Thursday, August 25, 2005 8:45 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Fish Farms -Orlando area I believe that you are going to be out of luck. I think most of the fish farms in that part of Florida are around Tampa, a bit out of your way. There is nothing on the East side, so far as I know, until you get down around Miami. It has been about 10 years since I've been down that way, so things may have changed. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Rob Sent: Wednesday, August 24, 2005 1:09 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Fish Farms -Orlando area I am going to be going to Orlando near the end of September and was hoping to be able to stop at a fish farm or two either in the Orlando area or along one of the main roads back through Florida ( I-95 to Georgia) I was looking to see if anyone had any suggestions for places to try to go see. Thanks Rob Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14923	From: Chris	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: African cichlids (was Re: help w/ dimensions)

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, EDITHAN1@A... wrote: > so do you think thats what I have It's a fair bet that's a male African cichlid. Can you phone the store where you bought the fish and ask them what they were? If they give you a scientific name, ask them to spell it. > Do you think the male is the brooder? Yes - in the sense that he's protecting the young, but not in the sense of taking the young into his mouth (unless you've seen that). > Is this rare, unusual, I would say this kind of protection is normal. I think males being the "mouth brooder" is less common. The thing to watch out for (with all cichlids, not just African) is that often the parents will be protective for a time, and then eat the young. They may do this for several spawns before they "work it out" and then maintain their young until the young become fully independent. You can either remove the young to a new tank, or just let the fish sort themselves out - being prepared for the parents to possibly eat them. > what kind of > breeding can I expect in the future, If the remaining fish is, in fact, a female (and it does sounds like the shop sold you a trio), then they will quite likely spawn again. > altho I really don't want them to, If I was in your shoes, I'd just make sure your water quality is right, your fish are fed a variety of food, and just enjoy the tank. If the fish breed, they breed. > but those babies are going > to grow and become as big as the parents You might find they won't grow as large because the population density is higher in your tank now. That's happened to the young cichlids in my in-laws' (African cichlid) community tank. Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14924	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: African cichlids (was Re: help w/ dimensions)

Chris, Gallons= h x w x d/231. From there, you can calculate the liters <g>. To get a true amount, measure the water as it is added to the tank. Most measurements of tank dimensions are outside measurements, so you would need to subtract the thickness of the glass, then you need to allow for the substrate, and any décor, then you can get a gallon figure mathematically. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Chris Sent: Wednesday, August 24, 2005 11:06 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] African cichlids (was Re: help w/ dimensions) --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, EDITHAN1@A... wrote: > Lets try that again: > I recently set up a new tank and the dimensions are 17" T x 24" W x 12" Deep yay! someone who talks dimensions, not volume! over here in Sydney, every tank is measured by dimensions if you're just giving someone an idea of the tank size... Volume comes into play for water chemistry / treating disease. (Oh, and I haven't a clue how much a gallon is!) > I stocked it with 3 orang mbuna cichlids all 1" long and 1 pleco, 3" long; I'm not sure exactly which species of cichlid you bought, but by saying "mbuna" we can safely say African cichlids, most likely rift lake cichlids (ie Lakes Malawi and Tanganyika). These fish natively live in vastly different water conditions to the plec, which comes from the Amazon, but - plecs are very very commonly kept with African cichlids - they seem to be very tolerant of the higher pH, hardness and salt conditions. Regarding the size of the tank and fish, I agree (with another reply) that the tank is a little small for the plec, but I wouldn't panic about it just yet. He'll be fine in there and I doubt the tank size will bother him. Plecs can live to 70 years, so you've got a bit of time to upsize your tank (if you choose). The cichlids, on the other hand could grow to perhaps 5cm, or to more than 30cm - so depending on the species, the tank may get crowded - if you imagine a full grown plec and two large cichlids. But again - you've got a bit of time - wait and see. > I am thinking of putting my clown loach 1.5" long back in there > with the cichlids. I would suggest you keep the clown loach in the community tank. He's not going to be as tolerant of the cichlids' water requirements. If you're maintaining your water quality for African cichlids, the clown loach just will not survive in there. > Come to find out the biggest ciclid must of had babies in his mouth, because > I saw 2 very tiny fish swimming around the bottom. Many African cichlids are mouth brooders. The mature males of many species have what are called "egg spots" on their anal fin (at the bottom of the fish, nearest the tail). When a pair mates, the female lays eggs, often in a depression in the gravel, then quickly swims around to take the eggs into her mouth. The male, who is excited by the female's hormones in the water, will be releasing sperm onto the eggs. The female is tricked by the male's egg spots and tries to take them into her mouth also, thus she takes in the sperm which then fertilizes the eggs in her mouth. The reason for this behaviour is because in their natural habitat, fish density is very high. If you wanted to hatch eggs by laying them in a nest or on a surface like a rock, they would be eaten in no time. The safest place for them is in the mother's mouth. > I've never kept cichlids before because I was too intimidated, I find many people say "cichlids are for the experienced" and so I held off for a long time too. But to be honest, I think there is nothing particularly difficult about keeping any kind of fish - anyone can learn how to use test kits to keep water quality in check and how to identify and treat disease. The difference is in how tolerant of poor water quality that fish can be, and in the price of the fish. You don't want to buy a breeding trio of cichlids for $100 if you're not used to maintaining water quality, and you should think twice about buying even a $5 fish if they are very sensitive to poor water. Fortunately, African cichlids are one of the most hardy fish you can buy. They are very forgiving. But as a bonus, they are completely captivating and entertaining. And they are also very intelligent. Many will learn their owner's face and will be very clearly excited when you get home. When you go on holidays they'll mope because you aren't around. When you turn on the TV, a tank of 30 cichlids will all swim to the nearest corner up and down up and down, excited by the flickering picture. Turn off the TV and they'll all fly back to their rocks saying "hey, this is my territory, get back out of here". > but I bought a > cichlid aquarium book and got up the courage to "just do it". And go for it you should! You'll probably become addicted in no time! > When I purchased them, the salesclerk told me I had a male and 2 females. In > the book, it seems very difficult to sex the fish, so I trusted her. She may well have worked it out based on the fish' behaviour. Or check for egg spots. Cheers, Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14925	From: Chris	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: Filter Media

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > If you need to lighten the discoloration the peat causes, you will need to > do more frequent water changes to keep the concentration of tannins down. Of course, water changes are often the simplest and quickest way to remove (or rather, dilute) undesirable chemicals (eg ammonia, medicines) too. Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14926	From: Leslie	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Danios/septisemia

Sorry about the spelling of the disease but you get the idea. My giant danios are not getting any better. Their fins are bright red and now are infected with mouth fungus. I have qt'd them into a ten but they now will not eat at all. It's been 3 days. The fungus on one is completely gone but it's still going strong on the other. Jungle fungus tabs were used 3 days ago, a 25% water change along with another tab last night. The fins are getting brighter red each day. They were in the 75 which was treated with maracyn 2 for two days. I believe that tank is OK but then that is when the danios got the fungus. I've never had a fish with this nasty looking stuff on their lip. It looks like a patch of thick, white foam. GROSS. Anyway, they've been treated and are still VERY red. I can't find the furan II or what Ray had suggested. Anyone have a link? My lfs said he can't get it in. What do I do for these guys? Thanks, Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14927	From: Amalthea	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: Interesting video

I'm not sure if Andy Warhol asked for Campbell's permission before making his art, generally, artists don't have to ask permission since it's a freedom of speech issue, not an advertisement. If it was advertising anything, it would be the battery, not the soda. Amalthea http://www.amaltheasattic.com Your Alternative to the Alternative.... On Aug 25, 2005, at 9:24 PM, Evita wrote: > When a company sells it's product by means you don't agree with > advertizementwise yes you can boycott. If you feel the need to. > That is freedom. I wonder first was this the case. Or was it used > without their permission. In that case Pepsi might like to know > about it. That's what I meant. Now if someone used the Dodge truck > as an ad they would have to get permission to show the Dodge logo. > And yes they might like to know how it was being used first. Not to > get off the fish topic...just to answer the question. Evita > > Deenerz@... wrote: I can understand informaing Pepsico about > the ad and use of their product but boycotting them? > > If I went on a killing spree running over people in my dodge > station wagon it isn't Dodge or Chryslers fault. > > Mike > > -----Original Message----- > From: Evita <evitabug@...> > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 04:49:09 -0700 (PDT) > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Interesting video > > > I also agree with you and everyone on the fact killing a perfectly > healthy fish > like that was cruel as well as a few other things I can't even > say.....But a > while ago there was a tone of mail on the topic of euthanasia. It > seems to me > that this healthy fish died faster in Mountain Dew than many of the > other > methods at the site I went to on how to kill a sick fish. I also > wonder if the > Pepsi company would like to know how their product is being used to > promote a > web site. If they didn't get permission I see a law suit in the > making here. > Maybe someone might like to give them a heads up at Pepsi. If they > did give > permission for their product to be used for such an ad I would say > boycott Pepsi > too! Just a thought. Evita > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><· > ´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><· > ´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14928	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/25/2005
Subject: Re: Mississippi Cory cat keepers?

Mike, Thats a great idea, I would have thaught of it myself in a few days :-) The minds a terrible thing to abuse. Scattered brained here, trying to do 50 things at once and can't. rob Indiana In a message dated 8/25/2005 7:46:19 PM US Eastern Standard Time, Deenerz@... writes: Rob, Check the back section of aquarium fish magazine, they have a club/society section. Mike Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14929	From: richard thompson	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: Phosphates

cut feeding to every 3 days (same amount do not increase), do partial water changes with distilled or ro water. i do not know what type of fish you have, but if you feed flake switch to a marine flake which is much lower in charatenoids and phosphorus. Salmarcus@... wrote:No matter what I do, or how hard I try I cannot get rid of my phosphate problem. What should I do?? Please help. Desperate [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14930	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: Filter Media

Hi Steve, Jerry is using peat to soften his water, doing more frequent water changes will defeat the object of using the peat in the first place !!. regards, unclenorm. --- Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > Remove the carbon. Use of activated carbon as a > general palliative is not > recommended, and, in your case, it is removing, not > only the tannins from > the peat, which causes the coloration, but the other > good chemicals it will > place in the water. If you feel the need to use > peat, you will need to learn > to like the color of the water--the fish don't care. > > Activated carbon is good, in its place. It will > remove many chemicals from > the water that you have no other way to remove other > than with a water > change. However, it also has a down side. It is not > picky about what it is > removing, so it removes the good along with the bad. > Experiments have also > shown that once its capacity for adsorption is used, > it will begin to > release the chemicals, sometimes in a different form > than was in the > aquarium. There is no timeline that one can use to > determine when this > happens. One cannot say use 20 grams of AC for 30 > days and then change it. > The capacity of the carbon depends on the carbon > itself, and each batch you > purchase is liable to be different. Also, if your > water contains a lot of > compounds that will be adsorbed by the carbon, the > capacity is used faster > than if you have a light load. > > Only use carbon when you have a specific reason to > do so, say to remove a > medication from the water. > > If you need to lighten the discoloration the peat > causes, you will need to > do more frequent water changes to keep the > concentration of tannins down. > > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of jerry young > Sent: Wednesday, August 24, 2005 11:52 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Filter Media > > Hello Everybody! > I'm a new member here(just joined less than 24 hours > ago) but been in > the hobby since 1980. I began with 3 guppies n 2 > zebra danios in a > large mayo jar, then quickly graduated to a 5 gallon > tank. Next came > a 15 gallon which I had with me for 15 years. A 50 > gallon came after > that as a graduation gift from my aunt. Currently I > am maintainig a > 75gallon planted tank filled with a wide assortment > of South American > tetras, dwarf ciclids, dwarf gouramis, cory cats, > some loaches and > cyprinids. I use a 30watt flourescent daylight tube > to light my tank > from 7am until 8pm. > I use a sponge filter powered by an airpump in one > corner of the tank > and an overhead power filter in the opposit corner. > I put some ceramic > cubes, activated carbon and peat granules in the > filter box. Which > leads me to my question, since carbon will remove > water colourization > and residues from medication, will it render the > peat granules > innefective since the peat granules are suppose to > give my tank water > a tea colour effect aside from softening it. > > ___________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14931	From: Evita	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: Interesting video

That wasn't art, not the same thing. Or are you saving killing a fish on film is art? Killing a living thing and painting a picture....way different. Maybe they could try it with a cat next time. I still think Pepsi might not agree with you. Evita Amalthea <amalthea23@...> wrote:I'm not sure if Andy Warhol asked for Campbell's permission before making his art, generally, artists don't have to ask permission since it's a freedom of speech issue, not an advertisement. If it was advertising anything, it would be the battery, not the soda. Amalthea http://www.amaltheasattic.com Your Alternative to the Alternative.... On Aug 25, 2005, at 9:24 PM, Evita wrote: > When a company sells it's product by means you don't agree with > advertizementwise yes you can boycott. If you feel the need to. > That is freedom. I wonder first was this the case. Or was it used > without their permission. In that case Pepsi might like to know > about it. That's what I meant. Now if someone used the Dodge truck > as an ad they would have to get permission to show the Dodge logo. > And yes they might like to know how it was being used first. Not to > get off the fish topic...just to answer the question. Evita > > Deenerz@... wrote: I can understand informaing Pepsico about > the ad and use of their product but boycotting them? > > If I went on a killing spree running over people in my dodge > station wagon it isn't Dodge or Chryslers fault. > > Mike > > -----Original Message----- > From: Evita <evitabug@...> > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 04:49:09 -0700 (PDT) > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Interesting video > > > I also agree with you and everyone on the fact killing a perfectly > healthy fish > like that was cruel as well as a few other things I can't even > say.....But a > while ago there was a tone of mail on the topic of euthanasia. It > seems to me > that this healthy fish died faster in Mountain Dew than many of the > other > methods at the site I went to on how to kill a sick fish. I also > wonder if the > Pepsi company would like to know how their product is being used to > promote a > web site. If they didn't get permission I see a law suit in the > making here. > Maybe someone might like to give them a heads up at Pepsi. If they > did give > permission for their product to be used for such an ad I would say > boycott Pepsi > too! Just a thought. Evita > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><· > ´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><· > ´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14932	From: Andrea	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: They love the net 0_o

Mine are the same way even now as adults. They see a net and can't wait to jump in. It probably won't hurt the healthy ones to get treated as well since they are all living together anyway and I've never had any injuries due to netting. I usually just treat the whole tank unless there is just one specific fish with an injury. Then I put them in the hospital tank for treatment. Andrea --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "cynthia brennemann" <brennewoman@h...> wrote: > My baby bettas are warped. The ones that have not yet found homes > developed a gill diseas, which I have been treating with salt water > baths, among other things. The silly fish will not get out of the > net. I stick the net in the water, and every baby betta in the tank, > sick or not, swims right into it! They do not avoide it..it's like > puppies going for a ride in the car! When I try to scoop up just the > diseased fish it's a laurel and hardy routine! Will it hurt the > healthy fish to go along for the ride? They're driving me crazy!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14933	From: Lenny Vasbinder	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: interesting video - NOT!!!!!

Amalthea, I know you started this thread when you posted the link calling this piece of garbage an "Interesting Video"... are you now implying that it's art? Thank God for normal people who recognize this garbage video for what it is. But you are right! It probably is some piece of crap liberal's idea of art... maybe they should have put a fetus or a turd in with the goldfish too! They do seem to think of those kinds of things as art as well. In their reply to my complaint email, they do seem to imply that it is a "movie". Just further proof of just how bad the Hollywood leftists and commies are getting in the USA! I can't believe that bleeding heart liberals who want to kill babies are also OK with killing a Goldfish in the name of "art". Just judging from your signature (which I have also blocked your website) and the fact that you actually thought this was "interesting", I'll presume you consider this kind of crap "art". Wear some warm weather clothes when you die... you'll need them! Oh well... I didn't want to get too far off topic but I guess I did already! Here is their reply to my complaint email: ok, thanks for the feedback. sorry you didn¹t like the movie. best regards p.s.we don¹t have any adverts on our site, it¹s not a commercial site at all -- (They had their website address but I removed it to not further their "cause".) On 8/24/05 4:57 PM, "Lenny Vasbinder" <lnvtm1@...> wrote: > I'm not a member of PETA or anything like that but your video > http://?????????.com/pages/video_holding/goldfish_holding.htm is HORRIBLE. Do > you know how many kids and teens are going to try that at home? > > I have blocked your site with my Internet Explorer settings so you will never > get a "click" from me for advertising purposes, ever again. > > Lenny Vasbinder > http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com > 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 > LNVTM1@... Message: Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 01:19:13 -0400 From: Amalthea <amalthea23@...> Subject: Re: Interesting video I'm not sure if Andy Warhol asked for Campbell's permission before making his art, generally, artists don't have to ask permission since it's a freedom of speech issue, not an advertisement. If it was advertising anything, it would be the battery, not the soda. Amalthea http://www.GoingDirectlyToHell.com (website URL edited by Lenny Vasbinder) Your Alternative to the Alternative.... On Aug 25, 2005, at 9:24 PM, Evita wrote: > When a company sells it's product by means you don't agree with > advertizementwise yes you can boycott. If you feel the need to. > That is freedom. I wonder first was this the case. Or was it used > without their permission. In that case Pepsi might like to know > about it. That's what I meant. Now if someone used the Dodge truck > as an ad they would have to get permission to show the Dodge logo. > And yes they might like to know how it was being used first. Not to > get off the fish topic...just to answer the question. Evita > > Deenerz@... wrote: I can understand informaing Pepsico about > the ad and use of their product but boycotting them? > > If I went on a killing spree running over people in my dodge > station wagon it isn't Dodge or Chryslers fault. > > Mike > > -----Original Message----- > From: Evita <evitabug@...> > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 04:49:09 -0700 (PDT) > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Interesting video > > > I also agree with you and everyone on the fact killing a perfectly > healthy fish > like that was cruel as well as a few other things I can't even > say.....But a > while ago there was a tone of mail on the topic of euthanasia. It > seems to me > that this healthy fish died faster in Mountain Dew than many of the > other > methods at the site I went to on how to kill a sick fish. I also > wonder if the > Pepsi company would like to know how their product is being used to > promote a > web site. If they didn't get permission I see a law suit in the > making here. > Maybe someone might like to give them a heads up at Pepsi. If they > did give > permission for their product to be used for such an ad I would say > boycott Pepsi > too! Just a thought. Evita > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14934	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: Danios/septisemia

It would possibly seem that you are treating for fungus, with using Jungle Fungus Tabs, although not being familiar with this med I do not know the ingredients. The Septicemia is a bacterial infection as I believe I may have told you. This will not be cured by a fungus medication. Likewise, the "mouth fungus" is almost always (except occasionally in livebearers) the result a one of several strains of Columnaris bacteria and is called "fungus" only because it resembles one. If you can't find Furan II, get Jungle Fungus Eliminator which treats for bacterial infections as well, having the same ingredients (nitrofurazone, furazolidone, etc.). Mouth fungus needs to be acted on FAST as it is a rapidly moving infection. Progressive salt treatment may be used against septicemia, adding 1 tsp salt per gallon, once in the morning and again in the evening, for 3 days. After the end of treatment, it should also be reduced gradually with water changes. It can be used with Fungus Eliminator or Furan II -- The Jungle POND Fungus Eliminator contains salt along with the previously mentioned ingredients. Maracyn II (minocycline) is also effective against septicemia infections, and is also absorbed through the (fish's) skin, although I prefer a nitrofurazone medication for this application. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > Sorry about the spelling of the disease but you get the idea. > > My giant danios are not getting any better. Their fins are bright red > and now are infected with mouth fungus. I have qt'd them into a ten but > they now will not eat at all. It's been 3 days. The fungus on one is > completely gone but it's still going strong on the other. Jungle fungus > tabs were used 3 days ago, a 25% water change along with another tab > last night. The fins are getting brighter red each day. > They were in the 75 which was treated with maracyn 2 for two days. I > believe that tank is OK but then that is when the danios got the fungus. > I've never had a fish with this nasty looking stuff on their lip. It > looks like a patch of thick, white foam. GROSS. > > Anyway, they've been treated and are still VERY red. I can't find the > furan II or what Ray had suggested. Anyone have a link? My lfs said he > can't get it in. > > What do I do for these guys? > > Thanks, > Leslie > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14935	From: Patrick, the AmericanFishGuy	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: Interesting video

I'm back after an invitation to join. :) Well, it certainly was intersting. I'm not completely convinced that the fish was ever in any real danger (They cut away, so that could have been yellow-tinted water and not what it looks like). What really bothers me is that they seem to revive the fish with a 9v battery. I don't think those things have the amperage to re-start a fish's heart, do they? That's why I hope this was just an illusion and the fish was not hurt. But if it was really what it looked like, even though the fish survived, there is no telling what kind of damage the acids did to the gills and interior of the fish. Patrick N., AFG --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Amalthea <amalthea23@m...> wrote: > Don't try this at home, kids, but it's interesting to witness: > http://neistat.com/pages/video_holding/goldfish_holding.htm > Amalthea > http://www.amaltheasattic.com > Custom Dreadfalls, Creepy Toys, and Much, Much More...

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14936	From: Patrick	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: Interesting video

That's a good point. If somebody makes something and calls it art, they can pretty much do anything they want and nobody can stop them. Copyrights don t apply to art or parody. Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps, the end of the beginning." -Winston Churchill -------Original Message------- I'm not sure if Andy Warhol asked for Campbell's permission before making his art, generally, artists don't have to ask permission since it's a freedom of speech issue, not an advertisement. If it was advertising anything, it would be the battery, not the soda. Amalthea http://www.amaltheasattic.com Your Alternative to the Alternative.... [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14937	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: interesting video - NOT!!!!!

it's better than being a piece of crap conservative who care for nothing but him self...I'll take being a piece of crap liberal. At least I know I care for more than just myself. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Lenny Vasbinder Sent: Friday, August 26, 2005 7:26 AM To: AquaticLife Yahoo! Group Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: interesting video - NOT!!!!! Amalthea, I know you started this thread when you posted the link calling this piece of garbage an "Interesting Video"... are you now implying that it's art? Thank God for normal people who recognize this garbage video for what it is. But you are right! It probably is some piece of crap liberal's idea of art... maybe they should have put a fetus or a turd in with the goldfish too! They do seem to think of those kinds of things as art as well. In their reply to my complaint email, they do seem to imply that it is a "movie". Just further proof of just how bad the Hollywood leftists and commies are getting in the USA! I can't believe that bleeding heart liberals who want to kill babies are also OK with killing a Goldfish in the name of "art". Just judging from your signature (which I have also blocked your website) and the fact that you actually thought this was "interesting", I'll presume you consider this kind of crap "art". Wear some warm weather clothes when you die... you'll need them! Oh well... I didn't want to get too far off topic but I guess I did already! Here is their reply to my complaint email: ok, thanks for the feedback. sorry you didn¹t like the movie. best regards p.s.we don¹t have any adverts on our site, it¹s not a commercial site at all -- (They had their website address but I removed it to not further their "cause".) On 8/24/05 4:57 PM, "Lenny Vasbinder" <lnvtm1@...> wrote: > I'm not a member of PETA or anything like that but your video > http://?????????.com/pages/video_holding/goldfish_holding.htm is HORRIBLE. Do > you know how many kids and teens are going to try that at home? > > I have blocked your site with my Internet Explorer settings so you will never > get a "click" from me for advertising purposes, ever again. > > Lenny Vasbinder > http://lennyvasbinder.blogspot.com > 504-621-1870 eFax - 413-318-0742 > LNVTM1@... Message: Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2005 01:19:13 -0400 From: Amalthea <amalthea23@...> Subject: Re: Interesting video I'm not sure if Andy Warhol asked for Campbell's permission before making his art, generally, artists don't have to ask permission since it's a freedom of speech issue, not an advertisement. If it was advertising anything, it would be the battery, not the soda. Amalthea http://www.GoingDirectlyToHell.com (website URL edited by Lenny Vasbinder) Your Alternative to the Alternative.... On Aug 25, 2005, at 9:24 PM, Evita wrote: > When a company sells it's product by means you don't agree with > advertizementwise yes you can boycott. If you feel the need to. > That is freedom. I wonder first was this the case. Or was it used > without their permission. In that case Pepsi might like to know > about it. That's what I meant. Now if someone used the Dodge truck > as an ad they would have to get permission to show the Dodge logo. > And yes they might like to know how it was being used first. Not to > get off the fish topic...just to answer the question. Evita > > Deenerz@... wrote: I can understand informaing Pepsico about > the ad and use of their product but boycotting them? > > If I went on a killing spree running over people in my dodge > station wagon it isn't Dodge or Chryslers fault. > > Mike > > -----Original Message----- > From: Evita <evitabug@...> > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 04:49:09 -0700 (PDT) > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Interesting video > > > I also agree with you and everyone on the fact killing a perfectly > healthy fish > like that was cruel as well as a few other things I can't even > say.....But a > while ago there was a tone of mail on the topic of euthanasia. It > seems to me > that this healthy fish died faster in Mountain Dew than many of the > other > methods at the site I went to on how to kill a sick fish. I also > wonder if the > Pepsi company would like to know how their product is being used to > promote a > web site. If they didn't get permission I see a law suit in the > making here. > Maybe someone might like to give them a heads up at Pepsi. If they > did give > permission for their product to be used for such an ad I would say > boycott Pepsi > too! Just a thought. Evita > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14938	From: harry perry	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Video thread/ A shot accross the bow.

This group is about keeping fish, not name calling. let's cool it before it escalates. Thanks. Harry __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14939	From: Amalthea	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: Interesting video

Again, for those who didn't see the whole thing. At the end of the video, the fish is alive. Technically, they suspended the fish's animation. If they could do it with a cat, that would be pretty amazing. It's been done with dogs already, though, so some of the *wow* factor would be gone. Amalthea http://www.amaltheasattic.com Custom Dreadfalls, Creepy Toys, and Much, Much More... On Aug 26, 2005, at 8:03 AM, Evita wrote: > That wasn't art, not the same thing. Or are you saving killing a > fish on film is art? Killing a living thing and painting a > picture....way different. Maybe they could try it with a cat next > time. I still think Pepsi might not agree with you. Evita > > Amalthea <amalthea23@...> wrote:I'm not sure if Andy Warhol > asked for Campbell's permission before > making his art, generally, artists don't have to ask permission since > it's a freedom of speech issue, not an advertisement. If it was > advertising anything, it would be the battery, not the soda. > Amalthea > > http://www.amaltheasattic.com > Your Alternative to the Alternative.... > > On Aug 25, 2005, at 9:24 PM, Evita wrote: > > > When a company sells it's product by means you don't agree with > > advertizementwise yes you can boycott. If you feel the need to. > > That is freedom. I wonder first was this the case. Or was it used > > without their permission. In that case Pepsi might like to know > > about it. That's what I meant. Now if someone used the Dodge truck > > as an ad they would have to get permission to show the Dodge logo. > > And yes they might like to know how it was being used first. Not to > > get off the fish topic...just to answer the question. Evita > > > > Deenerz@... wrote: I can understand informaing Pepsico about > > the ad and use of their product but boycotting them? > > > > If I went on a killing spree running over people in my dodge > > station wagon it isn't Dodge or Chryslers fault. > > > > Mike > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Evita <evitabug@...> > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Sent: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 04:49:09 -0700 (PDT) > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Interesting video > > > > > > I also agree with you and everyone on the fact killing a perfectly > > healthy fish > > like that was cruel as well as a few other things I can't even > > say.....But a > > while ago there was a tone of mail on the topic of euthanasia. It > > seems to me > > that this healthy fish died faster in Mountain Dew than many of the > > other > > methods at the site I went to on how to kill a sick fish. I also > > wonder if the > > Pepsi company would like to know how their product is being used to > > promote a > > web site. If they didn't get permission I see a law suit in the > > making here. > > Maybe someone might like to give them a heads up at Pepsi. If they > > did give > > permission for their product to be used for such an ad I would say > > boycott Pepsi > > too! Just a thought. Evita > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, > thanks. > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > ((((º> > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > > important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > > message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > > subject)" <- > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><· > > ´¯`·.¸¸. > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > > Service. > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, > thanks. > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > > ((((º> > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > > important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > > message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > > subject)" <- > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><· > > ´¯`·.¸¸. > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service. > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><· > ´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine biology Biology > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><· > ´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14940	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: OFF TOPIC-was interesting video - NOT!!!!!

lenny, while i agree with the general idea of your post, i don't agree with your usage of "piece of crap liberal's" phrase. i am a liberal, a democrat, however you wish to define a more left way of thinking, but i most wholeheartedly did not like the video!!!! thankfully here in the us we can all disagree, even call each other names like "piece of crap liberal" and not get thrown into jail for it. the us has its horrible aspects, but i'd say the good far outweight the bad ones! --- Lenny Vasbinder <lnvtm1@...> wrote: > Amalthea, > > I know you started this thread when you posted the link calling this piece of garbage an > "Interesting Video"... are you now implying that it's art? > > Thank God for normal people who recognize this garbage video for what it is. But you are right! > It probably is some piece of crap liberal's idea of art... maybe they should have put a fetus > or a turd in with the goldfish too! They do seem to think of those kinds of things as art as > well. > > In their reply to my complaint email, they do seem to imply that it is a "movie". Just further > proof of just how bad the Hollywood leftists and commies are getting in the USA! > > I can't believe that bleeding heart liberals who want to kill babies are also OK with killing a > Goldfish in the name of "art". > > Just judging from your signature (which I have also blocked your website) and the fact that you > actually thought this was "interesting", I'll presume you consider this kind of crap "art". > > Wear some warm weather clothes when you die... you'll need them! > > Oh well... I didn't want to get too far off topic but I guess I did already! > > Here is their reply to my complaint email: > > ok, thanks for the feedback. sorry you didn1t like the movie. > > best regards > > p.s.we don1t have any adverts on our site, it1s not a commercial site at all Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14941	From: aclaar877	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: Discus, ich, and high temps/ to AC

Guys, Thanks for the advice. The temp in the 155 discus tank has been 90- 91 for a week, and the discus have recovered. All are doing great-- up front all the time, ready for food. Clown loaches are mostly rid of ich, though I saw one scratching yesterday. I think they've turned the corner. I also had loaches in a planted 55g with much worse ich, and I also had that temp at 88-90 the past week. They were so bad I medicated with 1/2 doses of malachite green as well. Recovery took about the same time as the 155 discus tank. A couple guppies died, and all my glowlight tetras got burned or something-- they have cloudy grey midsections of a different color than their silvery scales. I think next time I'll just use heat. Since you've been in the hobby for such a long time, have you had success with either rotala wallichii or ammania gracillis red plants? I can't get them a strong red color, even with good co2, PC 65K lighting, and fluorite substrate. Reading whatever I can findonline, many have said that you need low nitrates to bring out the red. My nitrates read 0 on Aq. Pharmaceuticals test kit--I assume other plants are using it up as fast as it's produced, since I have a decent fish load and feed regularly. Would adding a small about of nitrate help them--maybe a reading of 5? Could it be other trace elements lacking, or the high temps? I've thought of getting Seachem Florish & adding small doses, just to make sure I don't have a limiting nutrient problem. I also have an RO unit, so I can soften the water further if need be. Readings now are gH of 6, kH of 2-3, pH of 6.4-6.6.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14942	From: paul helms	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: Interesting video

Hiya Pat! did you also notice that the complete name was not shown at any point during the video....it showed just enough for you to know what was being used without displaying the whole name. i have a feeling this was done to explain the lack of foam when poured and to give credibility to it still being soda. mountain dew dpes not overflow when poured rapidly. the maker of the video was quite smart to not show the full label, so he could not be sued. lol --- Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: > That's a good point. If somebody makes something > and calls it art, they can > pretty much do anything they want and nobody can > stop them. Copyrights don > t apply to art or parody. > > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14943	From: paul helms	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: interesting video - NOT!!!!!

lenny, you are way over the line here buddy. while i am a republican and middle of the road on political views, i also find the video to be interesting in that they brought the fish back with a 9 volt battery. i have heard the myth of it before and found it intersting to see it happen. the fish was obviously not completely dead, many people use soda water to euthenize (sp) fish as they slowly stop breathing, and it is not vioent. if you take the time to check out what people recommend as far as humanley killing fish, carbonated water is a common recommendation, and yes i realize they used soda, which in my opinion would have the same effect only a bit faster. everyone is entitled to a political view, and you happen to be very passionate in your views, but please be careful to not attack others so openly here. people have been banned for much less. personal attacks on peoples politics are really not necessary here, you can express your views in pm's or a bit more subtly so that no one gets angry and an all out war starts.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14944	From: Fonchy	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: interesting video - NOT!!!!!

I am new here and the only thing I have seen is a dispute between Reps and dems fighting about an ididotic video. I though this was an aquarium forum not a political forum, lets your bury the dead horse and continue on with our lives instead of keep beating the dead horse. who gives a crap who is a republican, democrat or independent. I signed up here about 4 hours ago and I have seen 10 to 15 emails about the movie, this is not why I joined the group, I did it to learn or to pass information on fish. My 0.02 cents. ----- Original Message ----- From: paul helms To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, August 26, 2005 3:05 PM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: interesting video - NOT!!!!! lenny, you are way over the line here buddy. while i am a republican and middle of the road on political views, i also find the video to be interesting in that they brought the fish back with a 9 volt battery. i have heard the myth of it before and found it intersting to see it happen. the fish was obviously not completely dead, many people use soda water to euthenize (sp) fish as they slowly stop breathing, and it is not vioent. if you take the time to check out what people recommend as far as humanley killing fish, carbonated water is a common recommendation, and yes i realize they used soda, which in my opinion would have the same effect only a bit faster. everyone is entitled to a political view, and you happen to be very passionate in your views, but please be careful to not attack others so openly here. people have been banned for much less. personal attacks on peoples politics are really not necessary here, you can express your views in pm's or a bit more subtly so that no one gets angry and an all out war starts. Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14945	From: rca2745@aol.com	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: OFF TOPIC-was interesting video - NOT!!!!!

In a message dated 8/26/2005 1:06:47 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, valeendgonzalez@... writes: lenny, while I agree with the general idea of your post, I don't agree with your usage of "piece of crap liberal's" phrase. I am a liberal, a democrat, however you wish to define a more left way of thinking, but I most wholeheartedly did not like the video!!!! thankfully here in the us we can all disagree, even call each other names like "piece of crap liberal" and not get thrown into jail for it. the us has its horrible aspects, but I'd say the good far outweight the bad ones! --- Lenny Vasbinder <lnvtm1@...> wrote: > Amalthea, > > I know you started this thread when you posted the link calling this piece of garbage an > "Interesting Video"... are you now implying that it's art? > > Thank God for normal people who recognize this garbage video for what it is. But you are right! > It probably is some piece of crap liberal's idea of art... maybe they should have put a fetus > or a turd in with the goldfish too! They do seem to think of those kinds of things as art as > well. > > In their reply to my complaint email, they do seem to imply that it is a "movie". Just further > proof of just how bad the Hollywood leftists and commies are getting in the USA! > > I can't believe that bleeding heart liberals who want to kill babies are also OK with killing a > Goldfish in the name of "art". > > Just judging from your signature (which I have also blocked your website) and the fact that you > actually thought this was "interesting", I'll presume you consider this kind of crap "art". > > Wear some warm weather clothes when you die... you'll need them! > > Oh well... I didn't want to get too far off topic but I guess I did already! > > Here is their reply to my complaint email: > > ok, thanks for the feedback. sorry you didn1t like the movie. > > best regards > > p.s.we don1t have any adverts on our site, it1s not a commercial site at all Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!! ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> Get fast access to your favorite Yahoo! Groups. Make Yahoo! your home page _Click Here!_ (http://us.click.yahoo.com/dpRU5A/wUILAA/yQLSAA/ANOolB/TM) --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links This person Valeen Robertson Gonzalez should be banned! WHere is the moderator? This type of assault and language is atrocious and should not be allowed on this group! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14946	From: rca2745@aol.com	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: OFF TOPIC-was interesting video - NOT!!!!!

In a message dated 8/26/2005 4:06:49 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, rca2745@... writes: In a message dated 8/26/2005 1:06:47 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, valeendgonzalez@... writes: lenny, while I agree with the general idea of your post, I don't agree with your usage of "piece of crap liberal's" phrase. I am a liberal, a democrat, however you wish to define a more left way of thinking, but I most wholeheartedly did not like the video!!!! thankfully here in the us we can all disagree, even call each other names like "piece of crap liberal" and not get thrown into jail for it. the us has its horrible aspects, but I'd say the good far outweight the bad ones! --- Lenny Vasbinder <lnvtm1@...> wrote: > Amalthea, > > I know you started this thread when you posted the link calling this piece of garbage an > "Interesting Video"... are you now implying that it's art? > > Thank God for normal people who recognize this garbage video for what it is. But you are right! > It probably is some piece of crap liberal's idea of art... maybe they should have put a fetus > or a turd in with the goldfish too! They do seem to think of those kinds of things as art as > well. > > In their reply to my complaint email, they do seem to imply that it is a "movie". Just further > proof of just how bad the Hollywood leftists and commies are getting in the USA! > > I can't believe that bleeding heart liberals who want to kill babies are also OK with killing a > Goldfish in the name of "art". > > Just judging from your signature (which I have also blocked your website) and the fact that you > actually thought this was "interesting", I'll presume you consider this kind of crap "art". > > Wear some warm weather clothes when you die... you'll need them! > > Oh well... I didn't want to get too far off topic but I guess I did already! > > Here is their reply to my complaint email: > > ok, thanks for the feedback. sorry you didn1t like the movie. > > best regards > > p.s.we don1t have any adverts on our site, it1s not a commercial site at all Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!! ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> Get fast access to your favorite Yahoo! Groups. Make Yahoo! your home page _Click Here!_ (http://us.click.yahoo.com/dpRU5A/wUILAA/yQLSAA/ANOolB/TM) --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links This person Valeen Robertson Gonzalez should be banned! WHere is the moderator? This type of assault and language is atrocious and should not be allowed on this group! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> Get fast access to your favorite Yahoo! Groups. Make Yahoo! your home page _Click Here!_ (http://us.click.yahoo.com/dpRU5A/wUILAA/yQLSAA/ANOolB/TM) --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links SORRY, I meant this person! Sorry Valeen [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14947	From: Patrick	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: video -> how about a fish suggestion?

WELCOME TO THE GROUP!!!!!!!! :) Well, it is just a temporary thing. There is usually about one major discussion here per week, then it changes. So lets talk about fish. I'm thinking about getting a new fish for my tank. It is the 29gal. with tetras danios, and cories. I'm thinking about a mid-sized mid-dweller (3-4 inch range) that is not a gourami or paradise fish. I'm not wanting to risk the aggressive Cichlids. What's left that is commonly available? I'm thinking ram. Are rams ok with glolight tetras? Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Thomas Jefferson once said, 'We should never judge a president by his age, only by his works.' And ever since he told me that, I stopped worrying." -Ronald Reagan -------Original Message------- I am new here and the only thing I have seen is a dispute between Reps and dems fighting about an ididotic video. I though this was an aquarium forum not a political forum, lets your bury the dead horse and continue on with our lives instead of keep beating the dead horse. who gives a crap who is a republican, democrat or independent. I signed up here about 4 hours ago and I have seen 10 to 15 emails about the movie, this is not why I joined the group, I did it to learn or to pass information on fish. My 0.02 cents. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14948	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: They love the net 0_o

thank you...the whole tank is being treated, but the ones with the reddened gills are getting extra strong salt water baths. Silly fish, the rest of the tank is cowering in the corner as soon as they see the net, but the bettas are going "Oh BOY! We get to go OUT!" LOL > Mine are the same way even now as adults. They see a net and can't > wait to jump in. It probably won't hurt the healthy ones to get > treated as well since they are all living together anyway and I've > never had any injuries due to netting. I usually just treat the > whole tank unless there is just one specific fish with an injury. > Then I put them in the hospital tank for treatment. > > Andrea !

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14949	From: Fonchy	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: video -> how about a fish suggestion?

I only have 1 fresh water tank with some feeder guppies because that is what my daughter wanted. I have 2 salt water tanks, mine is 125 AGA with 55 gal sump/fuge Reef with 4 percula clowns, yellow tang, 2 blue hippo tangs, 2 zebra gobies, 1 lawnmower blennie, 1 six line wrasse, 1 cleaner shrimp, 1 psudochromis, 1 pink/yellow (forgot the name) 1 green chromis and 1 yellow damsel, 185 lbs of rock, 14 different SPS, 12 different LPS. My other tank is my sons' tank, 29 Gal with 2 perculas, and assorted LPSs. ----- Original Message ----- From: Patrick To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, August 26, 2005 5:30 PM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] video -> how about a fish suggestion? WELCOME TO THE GROUP!!!!!!!! :) Well, it is just a temporary thing. There is usually about one major discussion here per week, then it changes. So lets talk about fish. I'm thinking about getting a new fish for my tank. It is the 29gal. with tetras danios, and cories. I'm thinking about a mid-sized mid-dweller (3-4 inch range) that is not a gourami or paradise fish. I'm not wanting to risk the aggressive Cichlids. What's left that is commonly available? I'm thinking ram. Are rams ok with glolight tetras? Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Thomas Jefferson once said, 'We should never judge a president by his age, only by his works.' And ever since he told me that, I stopped worrying." -Ronald Reagan -------Original Message------- I am new here and the only thing I have seen is a dispute between Reps and dems fighting about an ididotic video. I though this was an aquarium forum not a political forum, lets your bury the dead horse and continue on with our lives instead of keep beating the dead horse. who gives a crap who is a republican, democrat or independent. I signed up here about 4 hours ago and I have seen 10 to 15 emails about the movie, this is not why I joined the group, I did it to learn or to pass information on fish. My 0.02 cents. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14950	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: video -> how about a fish suggestion?

Honestly, I've never seen any Rams out my way, so have not really been curious about them. Rainbowfish are pretty good mid-levels. I have 3 australian and two bosmine (sp?) rainbows and they get along with everyone. They vary from a little over 1.5 inches (Neon Dwarf) to around 4 inches (the size of my Australians.) Haven't seen any larger Rainbows yet. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Patrick" <patrickmn@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Friday, August 26, 2005 2:30 PM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] video -> how about a fish suggestion? WELCOME TO THE GROUP!!!!!!!! :) Well, it is just a temporary thing. There is usually about one major discussion here per week, then it changes. So lets talk about fish. I'm thinking about getting a new fish for my tank. It is the 29gal. with tetras danios, and cories. I'm thinking about a mid-sized mid-dweller (3-4 inch range) that is not a gourami or paradise fish. I'm not wanting to risk the aggressive Cichlids. What's left that is commonly available? I'm thinking ram. Are rams ok with glolight tetras? Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Thomas Jefferson once said, 'We should never judge a president by his age, only by his works.' And ever since he told me that, I stopped worrying." -Ronald Reagan -------Original Message------- I am new here and the only thing I have seen is a dispute between Reps and dems fighting about an ididotic video. I though this was an aquarium forum not a political forum, lets your bury the dead horse and continue on with our lives instead of keep beating the dead horse. who gives a crap who is a republican, democrat or independent. I signed up here about 4 hours ago and I have seen 10 to 15 emails about the movie, this is not why I joined the group, I did it to learn or to pass information on fish. My 0.02 cents. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14951	From: EDITHAN1@AOL.COM	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: video -> how about a fish suggestion?

Welcome to the group! It looks like your daughter may have caught the "fever" for fish. This is a great group and very knowledgable, it sounds like you have a good grip on the hobby as well. I think you will be a great addtion to this group [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14952	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: DragonFish aka Violet Goby

Since I now know that these are peaceful fish and that I have to actually make sure other fish don't pick on it, have a quick question. Will one be ok with my 2 adult plecos and my Rainbow shark? I know my cories and neons will leave him alone, but am wondering if he would be ok with an occasional "landing" from my two plecos and if the Rainbow might harrass him. Will he leave my dwarf frogs alone? Thanks in advance! -Steve

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14953	From: Aaron M.	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: "Off Topic" Posts

To Whom it may Concern, This group has lost members due to the recent "Off Topic" Discussions. This is not the first, or the worst such case. Please, I do Not Believe in Censorship, I do have faith in Common Sense - to wit I trust that in the Future we may take such discussions Out of the Group and simply reply to the person to whom you wish to communicate with directly. We do not yet have enough Moderators to go to full moderation, nor do I hope to see that we must. There is a yahoo aquatic group that is dedicated to arguing and off topic type of posts, Paul, Nim, and a few others here know the name that escapes me at the moment. Perhaps, those here could continue their thoughts about the video there. Below is a reply as to why 1 felt the need to Unsubscribe. Hope that Helps, Aaron Billy ... wrote: I left because of all your political posts. This was supposed to be a group about various aquaria and the entire hobby. I dont need anymore of that political fighting going around. there is enough sentiment going around to last the rest of this decade. I got into this group to discuss the hobby of keeping fish and other aquaria related issues... not to read people bash each other back and forth about who's political party is right or wrong. Thats why I left, and I find it disappointing that people cant even chat about their hobby without throwing their selfish, off-topic opinions in. Dr. Billy Josay AquaticLife Moderator <AquaticLife-owner@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Hello, Sorry to see you go. If something happened that upset you or prompted you to leave, please feel free to write me and let me know. Hope all is well and that we will see you again sometime soon. Thanks for stopping by & take care, Aaron, got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FishTankPics/join stop by and see ~ membership is free! got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife stop by and see ~ membership is free! <º((((><¸..·´¯`·., . .·´¯`·.. <º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((>< ¸.·´¯`·.¸. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14954	From: Amalthea	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: interesting video - NOT!!!!!

Lenny, in fact, was banned this morning. He crossed a line and disrespected everyone in the group with his comments. Amalthea Bored? Never Fear! http://www.puppetterrorsshop.com/phpBB2/index.php On Aug 26, 2005, at 3:05 PM, paul helms wrote: > lenny, you are way over the line here buddy. while i > am a republican and middle of the road on political > views, i also find the video to be interesting in that > they brought the fish back with a 9 volt battery. i > have heard the myth of it before and found it > intersting to see it happen. the fish was obviously > not completely dead, many people use soda water to > euthenize (sp) fish as they slowly stop breathing, and > it is not vioent. if you take the time to check out > what people recommend as far as humanley killing fish, > carbonated water is a common recommendation, and yes i > realize they used soda, which in my opinion would have > the same effect only a bit faster. everyone is > entitled to a political view, and you happen to be > very passionate in your views, but please be careful > to not attack others so openly here. people have been > banned for much less. personal attacks on peoples > politics are really not necessary here, you can > express your views in pm's or a bit more subtly so > that no one gets angry and an all out war starts. > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><· > ´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine biology Biology > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14955	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Cloudy water in new tank/no fish.

I had finished setting up my 55 gallon tank on Thursday afternoon and used well water, started everything and now this afternoon the water is starting to cloud up. Should I add Aqua-Tech water safe into the water or do a wait and see attitude about the cloudiness in the tank? On Tuesday, I will be placing in my Angelfishes into the tank. Any advice? Beth http://fa.f-realm.com/ Fanfiction Axis. http://e.webring.com/hub?ring=siriusblack Sirius Black webring. http://e.webring.com/hub?ring=remuslupin Remus Lupin webring http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sailorsenshiocs/ for all original and series characters of Sailor Moon. http://www.livejournal.com/userinfo.bml?user=tropical_fishes Tropical fish tank livejournal community. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14956	From: Aaron	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?

Hi, Has anybody tried using Hydogen Peroxide as a cure for Algae? It was suggested to me to use 5ml of Hydrogen Peroxide per gallon per week. I have 3 tanks, the largest is 55 gallons. So for the big tank I should use 275ml or about 1/2 a bottle a week? Do I need to dilute it first or just pour right into the tank? I have thick Green Hair Algae and Black Bottle Brush Algae as well as Algae covering the glass. Thanks for any info, Aaron

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14957	From: Patrick	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: "Off Topic" Posts

Yes, I started it at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/aquariumdebates, and nothing is held back there. There is no off-topic. Let's move this there. Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Thomas Jefferson once said, 'We should never judge a president by his age, only by his works.' And ever since he told me that, I stopped worrying." -Ronald Reagan -------Original Message------- There is a yahoo aquatic group that is dedicated to arguing and off topic type of posts, Paul, Nim, and a few others here know the name that escapes me at the moment. Perhaps, those here could continue their thoughts about the video there. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14958	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?

I just leave it for my plecos and other algae chompers. Some of it actually looks good...it makes it look like a more natural setting. While this is an odd practice in the US, apparently European aquarists cultivate it. You can also add a few plants to soak up the nutrients in the water. Plants tend to feed out the algae. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Aaron Sent: Friday, August 26, 2005 6:41 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae? Hi, Has anybody tried using Hydogen Peroxide as a cure for Algae? It was suggested to me to use 5ml of Hydrogen Peroxide per gallon per week. I have 3 tanks, the largest is 55 gallons. So for the big tank I should use 275ml or about 1/2 a bottle a week? Do I need to dilute it first or just pour right into the tank? I have thick Green Hair Algae and Black Bottle Brush Algae as well as Algae covering the glass. Thanks for any info, Aaron Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14959	From: mike mather	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: Eco complete

Tricia, I have two 10 gal tanks,both with Eco in them and one with 1.5-2" of sand on top. Both also have the same lighting. The plants in the sand tank have grown and sent out runners a quarter as much as the tank with out sand. I have heard that sand does not allow enough oxygen to reach the roots, which i assumed meant plants rooting in sand. With roots in the Eco and sand on top, it still seems to hinder the growth of the plants. I would try the Takashi Amano method of dividing the two substrates into separate sections. The front 1/3 completely sand and the back 2/3's all Eco with the plants. You use plastic,wood or cardboard as a divider and then lift it out after you have laid the substrate down. Then you lay drift wood or rock down to cover the line between the two substrates,for aesthetics. I have seen pictures of these tanks of his in Tropical Fish Hobbyist Magazine and they look awesome! Just some things I've learned. Hope to have helped you some, Mike --- Tricia Wilkerson <trycya@...> wrote: > The sand is more for looks and for the corries to > play in than to help as a substrate. Thanks for the > info, now I have a starting place and can go from > there. > MM & MP, '73 > Tricia, KG6PNC > > A couple of great sites for fun > > http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya > > http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Eric Roberts > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Thursday, August 25, 2005 1:49 PM > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Eco complete > > > at least 4-5 of them. I was told to get 2 bags of > the 20 lbs of the sand > for my 20 gallon. I am planning on getting 2 > 50lbs bags of it when I change > over to the eco-complete gravel from my standard > aquarium gravel. The sand > would prolly just end up as a substrate. The > eco-complete is a multi-grade > substrate, so adding sand would not help. > > Blessings, > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Tricia Wilkerson > Sent: Thursday, August 25, 2005 2:24 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Eco complete > > > I am getting ready to set up a new tank. It will > be a planted tank (fresh > water). I am trying to figure out how many of the > 20 lb bags of eco > complete planted tank sub. I will need for a 55 > gal. tank. I have not > decide yet if I am going to do a top layer of sand > or not yet, but it is a > possibility for my corries > Thanks > MM & MP, '73 > Tricia, KG6PNC > > A couple of great sites for fun > > http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya > > http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it > when replying, thanks. > 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> > 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" > <- > <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , > .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on > the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an > email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it > when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the > TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > > > > SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an > email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14960	From: Aaron	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: algae chompers (wa - Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?)

What kinds of algae chompers do you have and/or recommend? --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > I just leave it for my plecos and other algae chompers. Some of it actually > looks good...it makes it look like a more natural setting. While this is an > odd practice in the US, apparently European aquarists cultivate it. You can > also add a few plants to soak up the nutrients in the water. Plants tend to > feed out the algae. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Aaron > Sent: Friday, August 26, 2005 6:41 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae? > > > Hi, > > Has anybody tried using Hydogen Peroxide as a cure for Algae?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14961	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: Eco complete

That's a cool idea as I really like the way the Tahitian moonlight sand looks. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of mike mather Sent: Friday, August 26, 2005 8:41 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Eco complete Tricia, I have two 10 gal tanks,both with Eco in them and one with 1.5-2" of sand on top. Both also have the same lighting. The plants in the sand tank have grown and sent out runners a quarter as much as the tank with out sand. I have heard that sand does not allow enough oxygen to reach the roots, which i assumed meant plants rooting in sand. With roots in the Eco and sand on top, it still seems to hinder the growth of the plants. I would try the Takashi Amano method of dividing the two substrates into separate sections. The front 1/3 completely sand and the back 2/3's all Eco with the plants. You use plastic,wood or cardboard as a divider and then lift it out after you have laid the substrate down. Then you lay drift wood or rock down to cover the line between the two substrates,for aesthetics. I have seen pictures of these tanks of his in Tropical Fish Hobbyist Magazine and they look awesome! Just some things I've learned. Hope to have helped you some, Mike --- Tricia Wilkerson <trycya@...> wrote: > The sand is more for looks and for the corries to > play in than to help as a substrate. Thanks for the > info, now I have a starting place and can go from > there. > MM & MP, '73 > Tricia, KG6PNC > > A couple of great sites for fun > > http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya > > http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Eric Roberts > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Thursday, August 25, 2005 1:49 PM > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Eco complete > > > at least 4-5 of them. I was told to get 2 bags of > the 20 lbs of the sand > for my 20 gallon. I am planning on getting 2 > 50lbs bags of it when I change > over to the eco-complete gravel from my standard > aquarium gravel. The sand > would prolly just end up as a substrate. The > eco-complete is a multi-grade > substrate, so adding sand would not help. > > Blessings, > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Tricia Wilkerson > Sent: Thursday, August 25, 2005 2:24 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Eco complete > > > I am getting ready to set up a new tank. It will > be a planted tank (fresh > water). I am trying to figure out how many of the > 20 lb bags of eco > complete planted tank sub. I will need for a 55 > gal. tank. I have not > decide yet if I am going to do a top layer of sand > or not yet, but it is a > possibility for my corries > Thanks > MM & MP, '73 > Tricia, KG6PNC > > A couple of great sites for fun > > http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya > > http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it > when replying, thanks. > 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> > 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" > <- > <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , > .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on > the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an > email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it > when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the > TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > > > > SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an > email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14962	From: Donna Ransome	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: Interesting video

Welcome back! -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of paul helms Sent: Friday, August 26, 2005 2:57 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Interesting video Hiya Pat! did you also notice that the complete name was not shown at any point during the video....it showed just enough for you to know what was being used without displaying the whole name. i have a feeling this was done to explain the lack of foam when poured and to give credibility to it still being soda. mountain dew dpes not overflow when poured rapidly. the maker of the video was quite smart to not show the full label, so he could not be sued. lol --- Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: > That's a good point. If somebody makes something > and calls it art, they can > pretty much do anything they want and nobody can > stop them. Copyrights don > t apply to art or parody. > > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy. Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14963	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: algae chompers (wa - Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?)

Depending on he size of your tanks, there are the common plecos for big tanks and the smaller bristle nose and bulldog plecos...as well as other dwarf pleco species..for smaller tanks. I also have octinoclus (sp?) cats. Siamese algae eaters also go to work on algae. Make sure they are the Siamese..not the more aggressive Chinese algae eaters that are more commonly found in pet stores. Snails also chow on algae. I have tiny ramshorns in most of my tanks. In the 55 gal I have an apple snail (these are great if you are concerned with getting overpopulated with snails as they require a mate to breed...so get one). In my 30 gal, I got some snails in with the plants. These have almost clear shells with black specking. They reproduce and depending on your feelings for snails...could be good or bad. I think they are neat. I am not sure what species they are , but they look cool and my loaches should keep the population down. In any case, they love the algae as well hehehe. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Aaron Sent: Friday, August 26, 2005 8:44 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] algae chompers (wa - Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?) What kinds of algae chompers do you have and/or recommend? --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > I just leave it for my plecos and other algae chompers. Some of it actually > looks good...it makes it look like a more natural setting. While this is an > odd practice in the US, apparently European aquarists cultivate it. You can > also add a few plants to soak up the nutrients in the water. Plants tend to > feed out the algae. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Aaron > Sent: Friday, August 26, 2005 6:41 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae? > > > Hi, > > Has anybody tried using Hydogen Peroxide as a cure for Algae? Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14964	From: Fonchy	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: Cloudy water in new tank/no fish.

If you are not doing it right now run some carbon to get rid of the cloudiness and get some of the minerals out. ----- Original Message ----- From: Beth Brownell To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, August 26, 2005 6:59 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] Cloudy water in new tank/no fish. I had finished setting up my 55 gallon tank on Thursday afternoon and used well water, started everything and now this afternoon the water is starting to cloud up. Should I add Aqua-Tech water safe into the water or do a wait and see attitude about the cloudiness in the tank? On Tuesday, I will be placing in my Angelfishes into the tank. Any advice? Beth http://fa.f-realm.com/ Fanfiction Axis. http://e.webring.com/hub?ring=siriusblack Sirius Black webring. http://e.webring.com/hub?ring=remuslupin Remus Lupin webring http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sailorsenshiocs/ for all original and series characters of Sailor Moon. http://www.livejournal.com/userinfo.bml?user=tropical_fishes Tropical fish tank livejournal community. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14965	From: Fonchy	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: algae chompers (wa - Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?)

When I had my old 55 aga fresh water I added some plants and the algae went away. I had 1' 4" fat pleco, 1 Jack dempsey, 15 kuhli loaches, 1 blue guarami and 2 clown loaches. ----- Original Message ----- From: Eric Roberts To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, August 26, 2005 9:59 PM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] algae chompers (wa - Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?) Depending on he size of your tanks, there are the common plecos for big tanks and the smaller bristle nose and bulldog plecos...as well as other dwarf pleco species..for smaller tanks. I also have octinoclus (sp?) cats. Siamese algae eaters also go to work on algae. Make sure they are the Siamese..not the more aggressive Chinese algae eaters that are more commonly found in pet stores. Snails also chow on algae. I have tiny ramshorns in most of my tanks. In the 55 gal I have an apple snail (these are great if you are concerned with getting overpopulated with snails as they require a mate to breed...so get one). In my 30 gal, I got some snails in with the plants. These have almost clear shells with black specking. They reproduce and depending on your feelings for snails...could be good or bad. I think they are neat. I am not sure what species they are , but they look cool and my loaches should keep the population down. In any case, they love the algae as well hehehe. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Aaron Sent: Friday, August 26, 2005 8:44 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] algae chompers (wa - Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?) What kinds of algae chompers do you have and/or recommend? --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > I just leave it for my plecos and other algae chompers. Some of it actually > looks good...it makes it look like a more natural setting. While this is an > odd practice in the US, apparently European aquarists cultivate it. You can > also add a few plants to soak up the nutrients in the water. Plants tend to > feed out the algae. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Aaron > Sent: Friday, August 26, 2005 6:41 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae? > > > Hi, > > Has anybody tried using Hydogen Peroxide as a cure for Algae? Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14966	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: Filter Media

Unclenorm, Please read my posts in their entirety so that you do understand what I am saying. To wit: "If you feel the need to use peat, you will need to learn to like the color of the water--the fish don't care. . . . If you need to lighten the discoloration the peat causes, you will need to do more frequent water changes to keep the concentration of tannins down." Those sentences, taken with other statements in the post do make it pretty clear that removing the tannins will reduce the efficacy of the peat. Now, depending on the peat used, one batch can darken the water considerably more than another batch. In this case, one may feel the need to do more frequent water changes in order to view the aquarium better. Only water tests will indicate if the one batch of peat is changing the water more than another batch of peat. Sometimes the answer will be yes, this peat is releasing tannins and other compounds in greater abundance, which may indicate a more frequent water change is necessary, and maybe not, which means that this batch of peat has a darker tannin than that of the previous peat. While it may be a pipe dream, one may presume that water testing is an ongoing task in the maintenance of a tank. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Norman. S. Hampson. Sent: Friday, August 26, 2005 7:46 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Filter Media Hi Steve, Jerry is using peat to soften his water, doing more frequent water changes will defeat the object of using the peat in the first place !!. regards, unclenorm. --- Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > Remove the carbon. Use of activated carbon as a > general palliative is not > recommended, and, in your case, it is removing, not > only the tannins from > the peat, which causes the coloration, but the other > good chemicals it will > place in the water. If you feel the need to use > peat, you will need to learn > to like the color of the water--the fish don't care. > > Activated carbon is good, in its place. It will > remove many chemicals from > the water that you have no other way to remove other > than with a water > change. However, it also has a down side. It is not > picky about what it is > removing, so it removes the good along with the bad. > Experiments have also > shown that once its capacity for adsorption is used, > it will begin to > release the chemicals, sometimes in a different form > than was in the > aquarium. There is no timeline that one can use to > determine when this > happens. One cannot say use 20 grams of AC for 30 > days and then change it. > The capacity of the carbon depends on the carbon > itself, and each batch you > purchase is liable to be different. Also, if your > water contains a lot of > compounds that will be adsorbed by the carbon, the > capacity is used faster > than if you have a light load. > > Only use carbon when you have a specific reason to > do so, say to remove a > medication from the water. > > If you need to lighten the discoloration the peat > causes, you will need to > do more frequent water changes to keep the > concentration of tannins down. > > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of jerry young > Sent: Wednesday, August 24, 2005 11:52 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Filter Media > > Hello Everybody! > I'm a new member here(just joined less than 24 hours > ago) but been in > the hobby since 1980. I began with 3 guppies n 2 > zebra danios in a > large mayo jar, then quickly graduated to a 5 gallon > tank. Next came > a 15 gallon which I had with me for 15 years. A 50 > gallon came after > that as a graduation gift from my aunt. Currently I > am maintainig a > 75gallon planted tank filled with a wide assortment > of South American > tetras, dwarf ciclids, dwarf gouramis, cory cats, > some loaches and > cyprinids. I use a 30watt flourescent daylight tube > to light my tank > from 7am until 8pm. > I use a sponge filter powered by an airpump in one > corner of the tank > and an overhead power filter in the opposit corner. > I put some ceramic > cubes, activated carbon and peat granules in the > filter box. Which > leads me to my question, since carbon will remove > water colourization > and residues from medication, will it render the > peat granules > innefective since the peat granules are suppose to > give my tank water > a tea colour effect aside from softening it. >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14967	From: Fonchy	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: video -> how about a fish suggestion?

I have been doing reefs for 7 years on and off, but in the last 3 years I have been maintaining mainly salt, not into fresh anymore but I did fresh water for 20 years. The way I did it was to take care of the problem from the root and stop the guessing, just figure out what is causing the problem . [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14968	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: Phosphates

Have you tested your tap water for phosphate? If your tap water is high, then you will need to modify your water to remove the phosphates from it. If it is not high or not measurable, then you need to look at what is happening in your tank. Food may be the source, look to see what your food contains. Simply switching to another brand lower in phosphates may help. Feeding less will also help. However, for food to raise the phosphates significantly, you would need to be feeding a large quantity of it, so the source is somewhere else. Just keep looking until it is found, and do your best to eliminate it, and that should resolve your problem. FWIW, you give very little to go on. How high is your phosphate reading? Is your reagent still good, or has it passed the expiration date. If there is no expiration date, you can safely assume it has. Get yourself another kit with an expiration date and re-test. What is in your tank, fish and décor. Perhaps one of the rocks contains phosphate that is leaching into your tank. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Salmarcus@... Sent: Thursday, August 25, 2005 10:49 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Phosphates No matter what I do, or how hard I try I cannot get rid of my phosphate problem. What should I do?? Please help. Desperate [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14969	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?

Yesterday I picked up three siamese algae eaters and a quarter sized rams horn snail. All four of these guys have been quite busy in the past 24 hours. I can see a noticeable difference in the amount of green hair algae and black bristle algae in my 150 gallon tank. If you go to buy siamese algae eaters, make sure you take some kind of identification with you. I put three picture of the look a likes on a paper and printed it off to take with me. The store I go to had all three kinds (siamese algae eaters, flying fox and false siamese algae eaters) in two different tanks together. All being sold as siamese algae eaters or flying fox. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14970	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: DragonFish aka Violet Goby

hi Steve, First of the Violet goby or Dragon fish is a salt water to brackish water fish, it can be acclimatized to fresh water but that is not giving it a good life, it normally feeds by sifting through the substrate filter feeding, but will eat small fish, it is normally peaceful but if harassed by other fish will inflict serious damage with its very sharp teeth, it requires long narrow hiding places like pieces of plastic pipe. the main consideration apart from salt to brackish water is the fact that they grow up to 2 feet long. regards, unclenorm. --- The Dragon Hunter <dragon.hunter@...> wrote: > Since I now know that these are peaceful fish and > that I have to actually > make sure other fish don't pick on it, have a quick > question. > > Will one be ok with my 2 adult plecos and my Rainbow > shark? I know my > cories and neons will leave him alone, but am > wondering if he would be ok > with an occasional "landing" from my two plecos and > if the Rainbow might > harrass him. Will he leave my dwarf frogs alone? > > Thanks in advance! > > -Steve > > ___________________________________________________________ To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. http://uk.security.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14971	From: Jerry Young	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?

How can you tell the difference between a Chinese algae eater and a Siamese algae eater? Crazy4fids@... wrote:Yesterday I picked up three siamese algae eaters and a quarter sized rams horn snail. All four of these guys have been quite busy in the past 24 hours. I can see a noticeable difference in the amount of green hair algae and black bristle algae in my 150 gallon tank. If you go to buy siamese algae eaters, make sure you take some kind of identification with you. I put three picture of the look a likes on a paper and printed it off to take with me. The store I go to had all three kinds (siamese algae eaters, flying fox and false siamese algae eaters) in two different tanks together. All being sold as siamese algae eaters or flying fox. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14972	From: Tom Ray	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Vaillant (or Samurai) Chocolate Gourami {S. vaillanti} In San Loren

I'm not sure if this is on topic, but I thought I'd pass it along for other Anabantoid keepers on the list. Today, I ran across S. Vaillanti at Great Bay Aquaria on Hesperian Blvd. I bought several, but he has more and says he can get more. Mine appear to be liking their new home. Hope this helps, --TommyBoy

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14973	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/26/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?

Hi Aaron, I've never heard of hydrogen Peroxide being used to kill plants (algae), but I do know that it is used in Hydroponics to enhance root growth so it would seem that it would encourage algae growth not kill it. I also know that it will bring down the PH value of your water, If your PH was 7.0 a 10% concentration of H2O2 would bring your PH down to 5.3. You should also consider the fact that H2O2-hydrogen peroxide is a dangerous substance, it is a fire hazard, corrosive, and explosive depending on the concentration, it has been said to be 'as harmless as toothpaste or as dangerous as rocket fuel' two of its uses!!. regards, unclenorm. --- Aaron <anonymous122899@...> wrote: > Hi, > > Has anybody tried using Hydogen Peroxide as a cure > for Algae? > > It was suggested to me to use 5ml of Hydrogen > Peroxide per gallon per > week. > > I have 3 tanks, the largest is 55 gallons. So for > the big tank I > should use 275ml or about 1/2 a bottle a week? > > Do I need to dilute it first or just pour right into > the tank? > > I have thick Green Hair Algae and Black Bottle Brush > Algae as well as > Algae covering the glass. > > Thanks for any info, > Aaron > > > > ___________________________________________________________ To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. http://uk.security.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14974	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: Re: Filter Media

Steve, I always do, on this occasion it would seem you did not understand the post you replied to. It was stated that the primary use of peat was to lower the PH the colour question was secondary. You recommended more frequent water changes which would have defeated the purpose of using peat in the first place. Please do not try arguing your way out of this slip on your part. regards, unclenorm. --- Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > Unclenorm, > > Please read my posts in their entirety so that you > do understand what I am > saying. To wit: "If you feel the need to use peat, > you will need to learn to > like the color of the water--the fish don't care. . > . . If you need to > lighten the discoloration the peat causes, you will > need to do more frequent > water changes to keep the concentration of tannins > down." > > Those sentences, taken with other statements in the > post do make it pretty > clear that removing the tannins will reduce the > efficacy of the peat. > > Now, depending on the peat used, one batch can > darken the water considerably > more than another batch. In this case, one may feel > the need to do more > frequent water changes in order to view the aquarium > better. Only water > tests will indicate if the one batch of peat is > changing the water more than > another batch of peat. Sometimes the answer will be > yes, this peat is > releasing tannins and other compounds in greater > abundance, which may > indicate a more frequent water change is necessary, > and maybe not, which > means that this batch of peat has a darker tannin > than that of the previous > peat. > > While it may be a pipe dream, one may presume that > water testing is an > ongoing task in the maintenance of a tank. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Norman. S. Hampson. > Sent: Friday, August 26, 2005 7:46 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Filter Media > > Hi Steve, > Jerry is using peat to soften his water, > doing more frequent water changes will defeat the > object of using the peat in the first place !!. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > > > Remove the carbon. Use of activated carbon as a > > general palliative is not > > recommended, and, in your case, it is removing, > not > > only the tannins from > > the peat, which causes the coloration, but the > other > > good chemicals it will > > place in the water. If you feel the need to use > > peat, you will need to learn > > to like the color of the water--the fish don't > care. > > > > Activated carbon is good, in its place. It will > > remove many chemicals from > > the water that you have no other way to remove > other > > than with a water > > change. However, it also has a down side. It is > not > > picky about what it is > > removing, so it removes the good along with the > bad. > > Experiments have also > > shown that once its capacity for adsorption is > used, > > it will begin to > > release the chemicals, sometimes in a different > form > > than was in the > > aquarium. There is no timeline that one can use to > > determine when this > > happens. One cannot say use 20 grams of AC for 30 > > days and then change it. > > The capacity of the carbon depends on the carbon > > itself, and each batch you > > purchase is liable to be different. Also, if your > > water contains a lot of > > compounds that will be adsorbed by the carbon, the > > capacity is used faster > > than if you have a light load. > > > > Only use carbon when you have a specific reason to > > do so, say to remove a > > medication from the water. > > > > If you need to lighten the discoloration the peat > > causes, you will need to > > do more frequent water changes to keep the > > concentration of tannins down. > > > > > > \\Steve// > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of jerry young > > Sent: Wednesday, August 24, 2005 11:52 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Filter Media > > > > Hello Everybody! > > I'm a new member here(just joined less than 24 > hours > > ago) but been in > > the hobby since 1980. I began with 3 guppies n 2 > > zebra danios in a > > large mayo jar, then quickly graduated to a 5 > gallon > > tank. Next came > > a 15 gallon which I had with me for 15 years. A 50 > > gallon came after > > that as a graduation gift from my aunt. Currently > I > > am maintainig a > > 75gallon planted tank filled with a wide > assortment > > of South American > > tetras, dwarf ciclids, dwarf gouramis, cory cats, > > some loaches and > > cyprinids. I use a 30watt flourescent daylight > tube > > to light my tank > > from 7am until 8pm. > > I use a sponge filter powered by an airpump in one > > corner of the tank > > and an overhead power filter in the opposit > corner. > > I put some ceramic > > cubes, activated carbon and peat granules in the > > filter box. Which > > leads me to my question, since carbon will remove > > water colourization > > and residues from medication, will it render the > > peat granules > > innefective since the peat granules are suppose to > > give my tank water > > a tea colour effect aside from softening it. > > > > ___________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14975	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?

Hi Jerry, Try these links there are dozens more via google. http://www.fishpondinfo.com/sae.htm http://www.aquatic-gardeners.org/cyprinid.html regards, unclenorm. --- Jerry Young <jerry_jla@...> wrote: > How can you tell the difference between a Chinese > algae eater and a Siamese algae eater? > > Crazy4fids@... wrote:Yesterday I picked up three > siamese algae eaters and a quarter sized rams > horn snail. All four of these guys have been quite > busy in the past 24 hours. > I can see a noticeable difference in the amount of > green hair algae and > black bristle algae in my 150 gallon tank. > > If you go to buy siamese algae eaters, make sure you > take some kind of > identification with you. I put three picture of the > look a likes on a paper and > printed it off to take with me. The store I go to > had all three kinds > (siamese algae eaters, flying fox and false siamese > algae eaters) in two different > tanks together. All being sold as siamese algae > eaters or flying fox. > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when > replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the > TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine biology Biology > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email > to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > --------------------------------- > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ___________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14976	From: paul helms	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: Re: Interesting video

thanks donna --- Donna Ransome <djransome@...> wrote: > Welcome back! > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of paul helms > Sent: Friday, August 26, 2005 2:57 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Interesting video > > Hiya Pat! > did you also notice that the complete name was not > shown at any point during the video....it showed > just > enough for you to know what was being used without > displaying the whole name. i have a feeling this was > done to explain the lack of foam when poured and to > give credibility to it still being soda. mountain > dew > dpes not overflow when poured rapidly. the maker of > the video was quite smart to not show the full > label, > so he could not be sued. lol > > --- Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: > > > That's a good point. If somebody makes something > > and calls it art, they can > > pretty much do anything they want and nobody can > > stop them. Copyrights don > > t apply to art or parody. > > > > > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy. > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when > replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14977	From: paul helms	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: Re: Cloudy water in new tank/no fish.

advice would be to wait a month before adding angel fish. let the tank fully cycle which takes 4-6 week, not 4 days. --- Beth Brownell <spencer_creek_studios@...> wrote: > I had finished setting up my 55 gallon tank on > Thursday afternoon and used well water, started > everything and now this afternoon the water is > starting to cloud up. > > Should I add Aqua-Tech water safe into the water or > do > a wait and see attitude about the cloudiness in the > tank? > > On Tuesday, I will be placing in my Angelfishes into > the tank. > > Any advice? > Beth > > http://fa.f-realm.com/ Fanfiction Axis. > http://e.webring.com/hub?ring=siriusblack Sirius > Black webring. > http://e.webring.com/hub?ring=remuslupin Remus Lupin > webring > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sailorsenshiocs/ for > all original and series characters of Sailor Moon. > http://www.livejournal.com/userinfo.bml?user=tropical_fishes > Tropical fish tank livejournal community. > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14978	From: harry perry	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: To Paul

I would also like to welcome you back. I feel your knowledge can be a valuable asset for this group. Harry --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14979	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: Re: Cloudy water in new tank/no fish.

A white or grey cloudiness indicates a bacterial bloom, a greenish color indicates an algal bloom. You do not say which. Generally, in both cases, you just need to wait this thing out. In general, anything you attempt to do usually makes the situation worse. You do not mention cycling the tank. You seem to be just letting it sit prior to adding angelfish next week. Not a good process IMHO. I am a proponent of fishless cycling. Add enough ammonia to the tank to reach 5 ppm, Continue to do this each day until there is no measurable ammonia the next day, and the nitrites are also not measurable. Once this has been done, minimum of 4 weeks, usually, but may take longer, then you may add the fish and stop the ammonia additions. Be sure to use ammonia that does not have detergent added to it or scents added. Need to be plain ammonia. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Beth Brownell Sent: Friday, August 26, 2005 7:00 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Cloudy water in new tank/no fish. I had finished setting up my 55 gallon tank on Thursday afternoon and used well water, started everything and now this afternoon the water is starting to cloud up. Should I add Aqua-Tech water safe into the water or do a wait and see attitude about the cloudiness in the tank? On Tuesday, I will be placing in my Angelfishes into the tank. Any advice? Beth http://fa.f-realm.com/ Fanfiction Axis. http://e.webring.com/hub?ring=siriusblack Sirius Black webring. http://e.webring.com/hub?ring=remuslupin Remus Lupin webring http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sailorsenshiocs/ for all original and series characters of Sailor Moon. http://www.livejournal.com/userinfo.bml?user=tropical_fishes Tropical fish tank livejournal community.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14980	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: Re: DragonFish aka Violet Goby

I have 2 of them in freshwater with a teaspoon of aquarium salt for every 5 gallons and they are quite happy. The myth about them eating small fish is...well..a myth. They look like they would be aggressive predators because they have a huge mouth that could swallow a tetra or Danios whole. In fact they are filter feeders for the bulk of their diet by opening their mouths to suck in food material in the water as well as cleaning it off the gravel. I have never experienced any even remotely aggressive behavior from them and comments on other sites about these fish say the same. One was talking about how he has his dragonfish in with his guppies and when they breed, the dragonfish doesn't even mess with the fry and they are swimming all around him (he even has pics of this). What works great for hiding places are the gerbil tubes. Mine also like the caves that are originally designed for reptile enclosures or alongside the piece of driftwood where I have the rocks holding it down. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Norman. S. Hampson. Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2005 12:02 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] DragonFish aka Violet Goby hi Steve, First of the Violet goby or Dragon fish is a salt water to brackish water fish, it can be acclimatized to fresh water but that is not giving it a good life, it normally feeds by sifting through the substrate filter feeding, but will eat small fish, it is normally peaceful but if harassed by other fish will inflict serious damage with its very sharp teeth, it requires long narrow hiding places like pieces of plastic pipe. the main consideration apart from salt to brackish water is the fact that they grow up to 2 feet long. regards, unclenorm. --- The Dragon Hunter <dragon.hunter@...> wrote: > Since I now know that these are peaceful fish and > that I have to actually > make sure other fish don't pick on it, have a quick > question. > > Will one be ok with my 2 adult plecos and my Rainbow > shark? I know my > cories and neons will leave him alone, but am > wondering if he would be ok > with an occasional "landing" from my two plecos and > if the Rainbow might > harrass him. Will he leave my dwarf frogs alone? > > Thanks in advance! > > -Steve > > ___________________________________________________________ To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. http://uk.security.yahoo.com Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14981	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?

Siamese Algae Eater http://www.aquahobby.com/gallery/gsae.html http://www.thekrib.com/Fish/Algae-Eaters/ Chinese Algae Eater http://www.petresources.net/fish/cyprinid/gyr_aym.html http://animal-world.com/encyclo/fresh/cyprinids/chinesealgae.php Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Jerry Young Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2005 1:29 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae? How can you tell the difference between a Chinese algae eater and a Siamese algae eater? Crazy4fids@... wrote:Yesterday I picked up three siamese algae eaters and a quarter sized rams horn snail. All four of these guys have been quite busy in the past 24 hours. I can see a noticeable difference in the amount of green hair algae and black bristle algae in my 150 gallon tank. If you go to buy siamese algae eaters, make sure you take some kind of identification with you. I put three picture of the look a likes on a paper and printed it off to take with me. The store I go to had all three kinds (siamese algae eaters, flying fox and false siamese algae eaters) in two different tanks together. All being sold as siamese algae eaters or flying fox. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14982	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?

A lot of stores also sell Chinese algae eaters under similar names. the CAE are very aggressive and will kill and eat smaller fish. I have heard many stories...especially from newbies about how they were sold these fish without being warned about their behavior. It is very important to have the right fish. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Friday, August 26, 2005 11:00 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae? Yesterday I picked up three siamese algae eaters and a quarter sized rams horn snail. All four of these guys have been quite busy in the past 24 hours. I can see a noticeable difference in the amount of green hair algae and black bristle algae in my 150 gallon tank. If you go to buy siamese algae eaters, make sure you take some kind of identification with you. I put three picture of the look a likes on a paper and printed it off to take with me. The store I go to had all three kinds (siamese algae eaters, flying fox and false siamese algae eaters) in two different tanks together. All being sold as siamese algae eaters or flying fox. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14983	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?

Aaron, Hydrogen peroxide dosage should be 5ml of 3.5% wv solution of H2O2 per gallon of water. This will oxidize any algae (including BGA) but sadly does not differentiate between plants and algae. If you have live plants, then it is best to do a 80% water change after 24 hrs of treating. If you don’t have live plants, then don’t really bother as it will only oxygenate the water. I have found that even triple of this dosage is not harmful to bacteria or fish but it is best kept to the dose mentioned above. Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Aaron Sent: 27 August 2005 00:41 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae? Hi, Has anybody tried using Hydogen Peroxide as a cure for Algae? It was suggested to me to use 5ml of Hydrogen Peroxide per gallon per week. I have 3 tanks, the largest is 55 gallons. So for the big tank I should use 275ml or about 1/2 a bottle a week? Do I need to dilute it first or just pour right into the tank? I have thick Green Hair Algae and Black Bottle Brush Algae as well as Algae covering the glass. Thanks for any info, Aaron Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14984	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?

Norm, Hydrogen peroxide is a very common algaecide that is harmless to fish and bacteria upto a certain dose. I have mentioned the recommended dose in my other post. Adding hydrogen peroxide will also not lower any PH as it is basically adding Nascent oxygen in the water (It is an oxidizing agent and not a reducing agent like Acids). It may however increase the PH (very slightly) and effect the functioning of PH buffers. The way H2O2 works for terrestrial plants is very much different then the way it works for aquatic plants as for terrestrial plants, it creates a oxygen rich environment in the substrate that helps the plant roots grow. For algae, because of the simple structure of the Algae, it tends to act as an organic chemical oxidizer rather then something that is providing oxygen. It does have a similar effect on plants but not as strong as it does on Algae and so only delicate plants suffer when treated with peroxide but plants like Anubias and swords etc. can withstand it. But yes, It is a dangerous substance. Not a fire hazard as it has nothing that can burn it can however be considered something equivalent to a Fire as in the case of Rocket Fuel where it provides oxygen to allow the fuel to burn. Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Norman. S. Hampson. Sent: 27 August 2005 07:32 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae? Hi Aaron, I've never heard of hydrogen Peroxide being used to kill plants (algae), but I do know that it is used in Hydroponics to enhance root growth so it would seem that it would encourage algae growth not kill it. I also know that it will bring down the PH value of your water, If your PH was 7.0 a 10% concentration of H2O2 would bring your PH down to 5.3. You should also consider the fact that H2O2-hydrogen peroxide is a dangerous substance, it is a fire hazard, corrosive, and explosive depending on the concentration, it has been said to be 'as harmless as toothpaste or as dangerous as rocket fuel' two of its uses!!. regards, unclenorm. --- Aaron <anonymous122899@...> wrote: > Hi, > > Has anybody tried using Hydogen Peroxide as a cure > for Algae? > > It was suggested to me to use 5ml of Hydrogen > Peroxide per gallon per > week. > > I have 3 tanks, the largest is 55 gallons. So for > the big tank I > should use 275ml or about 1/2 a bottle a week? > > Do I need to dilute it first or just pour right into > the tank? > > I have thick Green Hair Algae and Black Bottle Brush > Algae as well as > Algae covering the glass. > > Thanks for any info, > Aaron > > > > ___________________________________________________________ To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. http://uk.security.yahoo.com Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14985	From: bucks_boogie@webtv.net	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: Re: Blue and Gold Rams

Welcome aboard new members! As a registered Dem/Rep/Lib, I feel that the ram makes a great addition to an aquarium although they don't often swim along the middle but mine swim to the left and the right. (Just kidding about the politics) Rams are awesome, but are a lot more delicate to introduction than most fish. Slowly add your tank water to the bag until it's full over the course of an hour or more. pH change and nitrates in your system might be too much to handle if added quickly. Find out if your lfs uses salt in their tanks. Osmotic shock can be rough on these little guys too. They do spend most of their time near the bottom third of the tank, not so much as the middle or top. They usually do fine in the higher pH that most Americans have, but they won't spawn unless the tank is more acidic, much like the tanks that have been discussed using peat. If you've got the room, go for it. e ad some more come into the store and didn't have a chance to bring any home that day. I was off the next and by the time I came to work the following day, all 50 were sold. I was very disappointed, but we have a great breeder and look forward to his next delivery. "Damaged and I like it. It made me what I am!"

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14986	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: Re: Blue and Gold Ramsand new additions

I started with 6 gold rams and 6 german blue...... within about 2 months all had died accept one golden but he is a TROOPER, hje waent through a move with flying colors and now resides with 2 discus 6 rainbowfish(different types) 2 Kribs(M/F) red eye tetras,neons, and assorted bottom dwellers. I am thining abou getting a fewe more rams because i love them and this is a 100 gallon planted tank. Anyone have any suggestions for nice background plants or interesting fish to add?? thanks Kris bucks_boogie@... wrote: Welcome aboard new members! As a registered Dem/Rep/Lib, I feel that the ram makes a great addition to an aquarium although they don't often swim along the middle but mine swim to the left and the right. (Just kidding about the politics) Rams are awesome, but are a lot more delicate to introduction than most fish. Slowly add your tank water to the bag until it's full over the course of an hour or more. pH change and nitrates in your system might be too much to handle if added quickly. Find out if your lfs uses salt in their tanks. Osmotic shock can be rough on these little guys too. They do spend most of their time near the bottom third of the tank, not so much as the middle or top. They usually do fine in the higher pH that most Americans have, but they won't spawn unless the tank is more acidic, much like the tanks that have been discussed using peat. If you've got the room, go for it. e ad some more come into the store and didn't have a chance to bring any home that day. I was off the next and by the time I came to work the following day, all 50 were sold. I was very disappointed, but we have a great breeder and look forward to his next delivery. "Damaged and I like it. It made me what I am!" Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14987	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: Re: Vaillant (or Samurai) Chocolate Gourami {S. vaillanti} In San L

We had some here but everyone i have talked to says they die very fast and dont adjust well.... have you had bettter experience?? thanks Tom Ray <t_a_ray_cissp@...> wrote:I'm not sure if this is on topic, but I thought I'd pass it along for other Anabantoid keepers on the list. Today, I ran across S. Vaillanti at Great Bay Aquaria on Hesperian Blvd. I bought several, but he has more and says he can get more. Mine appear to be liking their new home. Hope this helps, --TommyBoy Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14988	From: paul helms	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?

gonna have to disagree here..... hydrogen peroxie is not flamable, but can be used as a catalyst in a flamable substance by adding oxygen to it...by itelsf compleetely harmless. algae is not the same plant a s a rooted plant unless you are talking macro algae. green algae or blue green for that matter will be killed by peroxide as its structure is much different. i have spoken to the head of marine biology at uc santa cruz about this subject before. because i had a dispute with someone about nutrient uptake by a rooted macroalgae and a run of the mill green algae. --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> wrote: > Hi Aaron, > I've never heard of hydrogen Peroxide being > used to kill plants (algae), but I do know that it > is > used in Hydroponics to enhance root growth so it > would > seem that it would encourage algae growth not kill > it. > I also know that it will bring down the PH value of > your water, If your PH was 7.0 a 10% concentration > of > H2O2 would bring your PH down to 5.3. You should > also > consider the fact that H2O2-hydrogen peroxide is a > dangerous substance, it is a fire hazard, corrosive, > and explosive depending on the concentration, it has > been said to be 'as harmless as toothpaste or as > dangerous as rocket fuel' two of its uses!!. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- Aaron <anonymous122899@...> wrote: > > > Hi, > > > > Has anybody tried using Hydogen Peroxide as a cure > > for Algae? > > > > It was suggested to me to use 5ml of Hydrogen > > Peroxide per gallon per > > week. > > > > I have 3 tanks, the largest is 55 gallons. So for > > the big tank I > > should use 275ml or about 1/2 a bottle a week? > > > > Do I need to dilute it first or just pour right > into > > the tank? > > > > I have thick Green Hair Algae and Black Bottle > Brush > > Algae as well as > > Algae covering the glass. > > > > Thanks for any info, > > Aaron > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > To help you stay safe and secure online, we've > developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. > http://uk.security.yahoo.com > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14989	From: paul helms	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: Re: To Paul

thanks --- harry perry <harryfisherman@...> wrote: > I would also like to welcome you back. I feel your > knowledge can be a valuable asset for this group. > > Harry > > > --------------------------------- > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14990	From: Tom Ray	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?

Here's what is listed in Dieter Untergasser's classic handbook on Fish Diseases: - Therapeutic Method C29 (3% Hydrogen Peroxide): to rapidly increase the Oxygen in aquarium water. Add 25ml of 3% H2O2 to 100L. Never repeat or overdose. If fish do not breathe easier within several minutes, a lack of oxygen is not the cause of their strained breathing (perhaps it is gill parasites). - Therapeutic Method D3 (30% Hydrogen Peroxide): to disinfect an empty aquarium, landsacping articles and utencils. One would not expect anti-algae therapies in this handbook on diseases. However, I thought it might be helpful to read 2 well- known uses H2O2 does have in tending to tanks and their inhabitants under our stewardship. Finally, as an alternative, I have read repeatedly over the years of people using SeaChem Excel (with polycycloglutaracetal) to treat their tanks for algae. Perhaps someone that's tried it can comment/share their experiences (success or failures, dosing regimin, periodicity, etc.). Hope this helps, --TommyBoy --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > Hi Aaron, > I've never heard of hydrogen Peroxide being > used to kill plants (algae), but I do know that it is > used in Hydroponics to enhance root growth so it would > seem that it would encourage algae growth not kill it. > I also know that it will bring down the PH value of > your water, If your PH was 7.0 a 10% concentration of > H2O2 would bring your PH down to 5.3. You should also > consider the fact that H2O2-hydrogen peroxide is a > dangerous substance, it is a fire hazard, corrosive, > and explosive depending on the concentration, it has > been said to be 'as harmless as toothpaste or as > dangerous as rocket fuel' two of its uses!!. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- Aaron <anonymous122899@y...> wrote: > > > Hi, > > > > Has anybody tried using Hydogen Peroxide as a cure > > for Algae? > > > > It was suggested to me to use 5ml of Hydrogen > > Peroxide per gallon per > > week. > > > > I have 3 tanks, the largest is 55 gallons. So for > > the big tank I > > should use 275ml or about 1/2 a bottle a week? > > > > Do I need to dilute it first or just pour right into > > the tank? > > > > I have thick Green Hair Algae and Black Bottle Brush > > Algae as well as > > Algae covering the glass. > > > > Thanks for any info, > > Aaron > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. http://uk.security.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14991	From: Andrea	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: Re: They love the net 0_o

I actually have a couple of males (Floyd and Seamus) that dearly love to come to work with me. They don't stress, lose their color, hide or anything. It's like being netted, plopped into a plastic bag and riding to work on a bus is just a regular thing for a betta to do :) Both are very active and seem interested in all the activity around my desk. People thought it was kind of strange at first to see the fish on my desk but now they ask about them when they aren't there. Andrea -- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "cynthia brennemann" <brennewoman@h...> wrote: >the bettas are going "Oh BOY! We get to go OUT!" LOL > > > Mine are the same way even now as adults. They see a net and can't > > wait to jump in.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14992	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: Pacific Coast Cichlid Association (PCCA), 9/10/2005, 6:45 pm

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife Pacific Coast Cichlid Association (PCCA) Saturday September 10, 2005 6:45 pm - 9:45 pm This event repeats on the second Saturday of every month. The next reminder for this event will be sent in 11 days, 4 minutes. Event Location: Round Table Pizza, 4302 Moorpark Avenue in San Jose, California Notes: The PCCA meets every second Saturday of the month. Meetings are held a the Round Table Pizza parlor located at 4302 Moorpark Avenue in San Jose, California http://www.cichlidworld.com/ ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14993	From: Aaron	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?

Thanks Everybody, I did as Nim said and it has made a great improvement. Aaron --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@y...> wrote: > Aaron, > > Hydrogen peroxide dosage should be 5ml of 3.5% wv solution of H2O2 per > gallon of water. > > This will oxidize any algae (including BGA) but sadly does not differentiate > between plants and algae. If you have live plants, then it is best to do a > 80% water change after 24 hrs of treating. If you don't have live plants, > then don't really bother as it will only oxygenate the water. > > I have found that even triple of this dosage is not harmful to bacteria or > fish but it is best kept to the dose mentioned above. > > Nim > _____ > > Behalf Of Aaron > Sent: 27 August 2005 00:41 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae? > > > > Hi, > > Has anybody tried using Hydogen Peroxide as a cure for Algae? > > It was suggested to me to use 5ml of Hydrogen Peroxide per gallon per > week... > > Thanks for any info, > Aaron

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14994	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?

Nim, All the information I quoted came from professional sites not from hobby sources, if you google Hydrogen Peroxide you will find it all, as for what it does to PH take a look at :- http://www.h2o2.com/intro/faq.html#15 regards, unclenorm. --- Nimish Mathur <nimmat4@...> wrote: > Norm, > > > > Hydrogen peroxide is a very common algaecide that is > harmless to fish and > bacteria upto a certain dose. I have mentioned the > recommended dose in my > other post. > > Adding hydrogen peroxide will also not lower any PH > as it is basically > adding Nascent oxygen in the water (It is an > oxidizing agent and not a > reducing agent like Acids). It may however increase > the PH (very slightly) > and effect the functioning of PH buffers. > > > > The way H2O2 works for terrestrial plants is very > much different then the > way it works for aquatic plants as for terrestrial > plants, it creates a > oxygen rich environment in the substrate that helps > the plant roots grow. > For algae, because of the simple structure of the > Algae, it tends to act as > an organic chemical oxidizer rather then something > that is providing oxygen. > It does have a similar effect on plants but not as > strong as it does on > Algae and so only delicate plants suffer when > treated with peroxide but > plants like Anubias and swords etc. can withstand > it. > > > > But yes, It is a dangerous substance. Not a fire > hazard as it has nothing > that can burn it can however be considered > something equivalent to a Fire > as in the case of Rocket Fuel where it provides > oxygen to allow the fuel to > burn. > > > > > > Nim > > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Norman. S. Hampson. > Sent: 27 August 2005 07:32 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Hydogen Peroxide cure for > Algae? > > > > Hi Aaron, > I've never heard of hydrogen Peroxide being > used to kill plants (algae), but I do know that it > is > used in Hydroponics to enhance root growth so it > would > seem that it would encourage algae growth not kill > it. > I also know that it will bring down the PH value of > your water, If your PH was 7.0 a 10% concentration > of > H2O2 would bring your PH down to 5.3. You should > also > consider the fact that H2O2-hydrogen peroxide is a > dangerous substance, it is a fire hazard, corrosive, > and explosive depending on the concentration, it has > been said to be 'as harmless as toothpaste or as > dangerous as rocket fuel' two of its uses!!. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- Aaron <anonymous122899@...> wrote: > > > Hi, > > > > Has anybody tried using Hydogen Peroxide as a cure > > for Algae? > > > > It was suggested to me to use 5ml of Hydrogen > > Peroxide per gallon per > > week. > > > > I have 3 tanks, the largest is 55 gallons. So for > > the big tank I > > should use 275ml or about 1/2 a bottle a week? > > > > Do I need to dilute it first or just pour right > into > > the tank? > > > > I have thick Green Hair Algae and Black Bottle > Brush > > Algae as well as > > Algae covering the glass. > > > > Thanks for any info, > > Aaron > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > To help you stay safe and secure online, we've > developed the all new Yahoo! > Security Centre. http://uk.security.yahoo.com > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when > replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the > web. > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of > Service. > > > > _____ > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ___________________________________________________________ How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14995	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?

Paul, See my reply to Nim, the fire hazard bit came from your US chemical health and safety site. regards, unclenorm. --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > gonna have to disagree here..... hydrogen peroxie is > not flamable, but can be used as a catalyst in a > flamable substance by adding oxygen to it...by > itelsf > compleetely harmless. algae is not the same plant a > s > a rooted plant unless you are talking macro algae. > green algae or blue green for that matter will be > killed by peroxide as its structure is much > different. > i have spoken to the head of marine biology at uc > santa cruz about this subject before. because i had > a > dispute with someone about nutrient uptake by a > rooted > macroalgae and a run of the mill green algae. > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> > wrote: > > > Hi Aaron, > > I've never heard of hydrogen Peroxide > being > > used to kill plants (algae), but I do know that it > > is > > used in Hydroponics to enhance root growth so it > > would > > seem that it would encourage algae growth not kill > > it. > > I also know that it will bring down the PH value > of > > your water, If your PH was 7.0 a 10% concentration > > of > > H2O2 would bring your PH down to 5.3. You should > > also > > consider the fact that H2O2-hydrogen peroxide is a > > dangerous substance, it is a fire hazard, > corrosive, > > and explosive depending on the concentration, it > has > > been said to be 'as harmless as toothpaste or as > > dangerous as rocket fuel' two of its uses!!. > > regards, > > unclenorm. > > > > > > --- Aaron <anonymous122899@...> wrote: > > > > > Hi, > > > > > > Has anybody tried using Hydogen Peroxide as a > cure > > > for Algae? > > > > > > It was suggested to me to use 5ml of Hydrogen > > > Peroxide per gallon per > > > week. > > > > > > I have 3 tanks, the largest is 55 gallons. So > for > > > the big tank I > > > should use 275ml or about 1/2 a bottle a week? > > > > > > Do I need to dilute it first or just pour right > > into > > > the tank? > > > > > > I have thick Green Hair Algae and Black Bottle > > Brush > > > Algae as well as > > > Algae covering the glass. > > > > > > Thanks for any info, > > > Aaron > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > > To help you stay safe and secure online, we've > > developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. > > http://uk.security.yahoo.com > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14996	From: Tom Ray	Date: 8/27/2005
Subject: Re: Vaillant (or Samurai) Chocolate Gourami {S. vaillanti} In San L

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, kristopher helsing <punk3r12@y...> wrote: > We had some here but everyone i have talked to says they die very fast and dont adjust well.... have you had bettter experience?? thanks I (so far, knock on wood), have not had any problems with Chocolate Gouramis, and as of today all the Vaillant Chocolates are still quite healthily content swimming throughout their tank. My secret? I'm told I am "A/R." But seriously, I try to provide well- planted (sometimes with a floating cover), nicely wooded/landmarked tanks but also with plenty of open spaces and with overfiltered soft (R/O) water. I also try to balance their tankmates (by eating habits and agression/personality). That's about it. --TommyBoy

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14997	From: paul helms	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?

market available h202 is not at the concentration in which you are referring to --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> wrote: > Paul, > See my reply to Nim, the fire hazard bit came > from your US chemical health and safety site. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > gonna have to disagree here..... hydrogen peroxie > is > > not flamable, but can be used as a catalyst in a > > flamable substance by adding oxygen to it...by > > itelsf > > compleetely harmless. algae is not the same plant > a > > s > > a rooted plant unless you are talking macro algae. > > > green algae or blue green for that matter will be > > killed by peroxide as its structure is much > > different. > > i have spoken to the head of marine biology at uc > > santa cruz about this subject before. because i > had > > a > > dispute with someone about nutrient uptake by a > > rooted > > macroalgae and a run of the mill green algae. > > > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> > > wrote: > > > > > Hi Aaron, > > > I've never heard of hydrogen Peroxide > > being > > > used to kill plants (algae), but I do know that > it > > > is > > > used in Hydroponics to enhance root growth so it > > > would > > > seem that it would encourage algae growth not > kill > > > it. > > > I also know that it will bring down the PH value > > of > > > your water, If your PH was 7.0 a 10% > concentration > > > of > > > H2O2 would bring your PH down to 5.3. You should > > > also > > > consider the fact that H2O2-hydrogen peroxide is > a > > > dangerous substance, it is a fire hazard, > > corrosive, > > > and explosive depending on the concentration, it > > has > > > been said to be 'as harmless as toothpaste or as > > > dangerous as rocket fuel' two of its uses!!. > > > regards, > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > --- Aaron <anonymous122899@...> wrote: > > > > > > > Hi, > > > > > > > > Has anybody tried using Hydogen Peroxide as a > > cure > > > > for Algae? > > > > > > > > It was suggested to me to use 5ml of Hydrogen > > > > Peroxide per gallon per > > > > week. > > > > > > > > I have 3 tanks, the largest is 55 gallons. So > > for > > > > the big tank I > > > > should use 275ml or about 1/2 a bottle a week? > > > > > > > > Do I need to dilute it first or just pour > right > > > into > > > > the tank? > > > > > > > > I have thick Green Hair Algae and Black Bottle > > > Brush > > > > Algae as well as > > > > Algae covering the glass. > > > > > > > > Thanks for any info, > > > > Aaron > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > > > > To help you stay safe and secure online, we've > > > developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. > > > http://uk.security.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home > page > > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC > calling worldwide with voicemail > http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14998	From: paul helms	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?

again we are talking about 3% and you are talking 10% --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> wrote: > Nim, > All the information I quoted came from > professional sites not from hobby sources, if you > google Hydrogen Peroxide you will find it all, as > for > what it does to PH take a look at :- > > http://www.h2o2.com/intro/faq.html#15 > > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- Nimish Mathur <nimmat4@...> wrote: > > > Norm, > > > > > > > > Hydrogen peroxide is a very common algaecide that > is > > harmless to fish and > > bacteria upto a certain dose. I have mentioned the > > recommended dose in my > > other post. > > > > Adding hydrogen peroxide will also not lower any > PH > > as it is basically > > adding Nascent oxygen in the water (It is an > > oxidizing agent and not a > > reducing agent like Acids). It may however > increase > > the PH (very slightly) > > and effect the functioning of PH buffers. > > > > > > > > The way H2O2 works for terrestrial plants is very > > much different then the > > way it works for aquatic plants as for terrestrial > > plants, it creates a > > oxygen rich environment in the substrate that > helps > > the plant roots grow. > > For algae, because of the simple structure of the > > Algae, it tends to act as > > an organic chemical oxidizer rather then something > > that is providing oxygen. > > It does have a similar effect on plants but not as > > strong as it does on > > Algae and so only delicate plants suffer when > > treated with peroxide but > > plants like Anubias and swords etc. can withstand > > it. > > > > > > > > But yes, It is a dangerous substance. Not a fire > > hazard as it has nothing > > that can burn it can however be considered > > something equivalent to a Fire > > as in the case of Rocket Fuel where it provides > > oxygen to allow the fuel to > > burn. > > > > > > > > > > > > Nim > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Norman. S. Hampson. > > Sent: 27 August 2005 07:32 > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Hydogen Peroxide cure > for > > Algae? > > > > > > > > Hi Aaron, > > I've never heard of hydrogen Peroxide > being > > used to kill plants (algae), but I do know that it > > is > > used in Hydroponics to enhance root growth so it > > would > > seem that it would encourage algae growth not kill > > it. > > I also know that it will bring down the PH value > of > > your water, If your PH was 7.0 a 10% concentration > > of > > H2O2 would bring your PH down to 5.3. You should > > also > > consider the fact that H2O2-hydrogen peroxide is a > > dangerous substance, it is a fire hazard, > corrosive, > > and explosive depending on the concentration, it > has > > been said to be 'as harmless as toothpaste or as > > dangerous as rocket fuel' two of its uses!!. > > regards, > > unclenorm. > > > > > > --- Aaron <anonymous122899@...> wrote: > > > > > Hi, > > > > > > Has anybody tried using Hydogen Peroxide as a > cure > > > for Algae? > > > > > > It was suggested to me to use 5ml of Hydrogen > > > Peroxide per gallon per > > > week. > > > > > > I have 3 tanks, the largest is 55 gallons. So > for > > > the big tank I > > > should use 275ml or about 1/2 a bottle a week? > > > > > > Do I need to dilute it first or just pour right > > into > > > the tank? > > > > > > I have thick Green Hair Algae and Black Bottle > > Brush > > > Algae as well as > > > Algae covering the glass. > > > > > > Thanks for any info, > > > Aaron > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > > To help you stay safe and secure online, we've > > developed the all new Yahoo! > > Security Centre. http://uk.security.yahoo.com > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it > when > > replying, thanks. > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > > that is NOT important to > > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > > message MODIFY the SUBJECT > > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" > <- > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > > matter. > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on > the > > web. > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email > to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > > Yahoo! > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of > > Service. > > > > > > > > _____ > === message truncated === __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 14999	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?

Er. What it says there is that the creation process of H2O2 also makes Acid. Also, H2O2 is kept at a lower PH as it is more stable in lower PH. H2O2 itself does not alter PH. I was probably wrong in assuming that it could increase the PH. Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Norman. S. Hampson. Sent: 28 August 2005 04:51 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae? Nim, All the information I quoted came from professional sites not from hobby sources, if you google Hydrogen Peroxide you will find it all, as for what it does to PH take a look at :- http://www.h2o2.com/intro/faq.html#15 regards, unclenorm. --- Nimish Mathur <nimmat4@...> wrote: > Norm, > > > > Hydrogen peroxide is a very common algaecide that is > harmless to fish and > bacteria upto a certain dose. I have mentioned the > recommended dose in my > other post. > > Adding hydrogen peroxide will also not lower any PH > as it is basically > adding Nascent oxygen in the water (It is an > oxidizing agent and not a > reducing agent like Acids). It may however increase > the PH (very slightly) > and effect the functioning of PH buffers. > > > > The way H2O2 works for terrestrial plants is very > much different then the > way it works for aquatic plants as for terrestrial > plants, it creates a > oxygen rich environment in the substrate that helps > the plant roots grow. > For algae, because of the simple structure of the > Algae, it tends to act as > an organic chemical oxidizer rather then something > that is providing oxygen. > It does have a similar effect on plants but not as > strong as it does on > Algae and so only delicate plants suffer when > treated with peroxide but > plants like Anubias and swords etc. can withstand > it. > > > > But yes, It is a dangerous substance. Not a fire > hazard as it has nothing > that can burn it can however be considered > something equivalent to a Fire > as in the case of Rocket Fuel where it provides > oxygen to allow the fuel to > burn. > > > > > > Nim > > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Norman. S. Hampson. > Sent: 27 August 2005 07:32 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Hydogen Peroxide cure for > Algae? > > > > Hi Aaron, > I've never heard of hydrogen Peroxide being > used to kill plants (algae), but I do know that it > is > used in Hydroponics to enhance root growth so it > would > seem that it would encourage algae growth not kill > it. > I also know that it will bring down the PH value of > your water, If your PH was 7.0 a 10% concentration > of > H2O2 would bring your PH down to 5.3. You should > also > consider the fact that H2O2-hydrogen peroxide is a > dangerous substance, it is a fire hazard, corrosive, > and explosive depending on the concentration, it has > been said to be 'as harmless as toothpaste or as > dangerous as rocket fuel' two of its uses!!. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- Aaron <anonymous122899@...> wrote: > > > Hi, > > > > Has anybody tried using Hydogen Peroxide as a cure > > for Algae? > > > > It was suggested to me to use 5ml of Hydrogen > > Peroxide per gallon per > > week. > > > > I have 3 tanks, the largest is 55 gallons. So for > > the big tank I > > should use 275ml or about 1/2 a bottle a week? > > > > Do I need to dilute it first or just pour right > into > > the tank? > > > > I have thick Green Hair Algae and Black Bottle > Brush > > Algae as well as > > Algae covering the glass. > > > > Thanks for any info, > > Aaron > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > To help you stay safe and secure online, we've > developed the all new Yahoo! > Security Centre. http://uk.security.yahoo.com > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when > replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the > web. > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of > Service. > > > > _____ > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ___________________________________________________________ How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15000	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?

http://www.inchem.org/documents/icsc/icsc/eics0164.htm It is not combustible but can help ignite a lot of things as it creates a reaction very similar to the effect of fire. But yes, as mentioned, it should be kept away from heat and metals. Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Norman. S. Hampson. Sent: 28 August 2005 05:07 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae? Paul, See my reply to Nim, the fire hazard bit came from your US chemical health and safety site. regards, unclenorm. --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > gonna have to disagree here..... hydrogen peroxie is > not flamable, but can be used as a catalyst in a > flamable substance by adding oxygen to it...by > itelsf > compleetely harmless. algae is not the same plant a > s > a rooted plant unless you are talking macro algae. > green algae or blue green for that matter will be > killed by peroxide as its structure is much > different. > i have spoken to the head of marine biology at uc > santa cruz about this subject before. because i had > a > dispute with someone about nutrient uptake by a > rooted > macroalgae and a run of the mill green algae. > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> > wrote: > > > Hi Aaron, > > I've never heard of hydrogen Peroxide > being > > used to kill plants (algae), but I do know that it > > is > > used in Hydroponics to enhance root growth so it > > would > > seem that it would encourage algae growth not kill > > it. > > I also know that it will bring down the PH value > of > > your water, If your PH was 7.0 a 10% concentration > > of > > H2O2 would bring your PH down to 5.3. You should > > also > > consider the fact that H2O2-hydrogen peroxide is a > > dangerous substance, it is a fire hazard, > corrosive, > > and explosive depending on the concentration, it > has > > been said to be 'as harmless as toothpaste or as > > dangerous as rocket fuel' two of its uses!!. > > regards, > > unclenorm. > > > > > > --- Aaron <anonymous122899@...> wrote: > > > > > Hi, > > > > > > Has anybody tried using Hydogen Peroxide as a > cure > > > for Algae? > > > > > > It was suggested to me to use 5ml of Hydrogen > > > Peroxide per gallon per > > > week. > > > > > > I have 3 tanks, the largest is 55 gallons. So > for > > > the big tank I > > > should use 275ml or about 1/2 a bottle a week? > > > > > > Do I need to dilute it first or just pour right > > into > > > the tank? > > > > > > I have thick Green Hair Algae and Black Bottle > > Brush > > > Algae as well as > > > Algae covering the glass. > > > > > > Thanks for any info, > > > Aaron > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > > To help you stay safe and secure online, we've > > developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. > > http://uk.security.yahoo.com > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15001	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Discus, ich, and high temps/ to AC

AC, Glad we could be of help; better yet to see that your Discus have recovered. With your Clown Loaches now turning the corner it looks like its just a matter of time before they're back to health also. Simple heat (with adaquate aeration) will generally do the trick, provided those species involved can take it. Yeah, that malachite green, even at half strength, can be nasty stuff when used on fish that are not especially tolerant to it. It can have its uses though. \ Don't know who you're directing the plant questions to, but I'll try to give you some input here. For plants such as you mentioned, they do require both larger amounts of light (up to a point) than normal and CO2, as you are already aware. I find 4.5 watts per gallon (average -- depending upon water depth) to be fine for these plants and use full-spectrum lighting. There can to too much lighting also, and even though you are not "burning" the plants, there may not be enough nutrients available to keep up with the demand the increased lighting is putting on the growth. These plants like it somewhat warm, but do best at not much more than 81 o F or 82 o F max. While your flourite substrate sounds good, other reports I've heard (have not tried this myself) say best results are had in soil. While low nitrates are definitely needed for these plants to bring out the best color, I believe you'd have better results if you try to increase it slightly to around 2.0. You may be lacking in trace elements such as magnesium and boron, and while many plant growers indicate soft water for these plants, they will still do well up to 8 gH. I would keep your gH at 6 where you have it now, as these plants require a fair amount of calcium, unless you feel there is enough present (from general growth indications); in which case you could soften it further. I'm sure your Discus would prefer that. Your pH is fine. Also consider adding chelated iron. Jobes spikes are also beneficial. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "aclaar877" <aclaar877@y...> wrote: > Guys, > > Thanks for the advice. The temp in the 155 discus tank has been 90- > 91 for a week, and the discus have recovered. All are doing great-- > up front all the time, ready for food. Clown loaches are mostly rid > of ich, though I saw one scratching yesterday. I think they've > turned the corner. I also had loaches in a planted 55g with much > worse ich, and I also had that temp at 88-90 the past week. They > were so bad I medicated with 1/2 doses of malachite green as well. > Recovery took about the same time as the 155 discus tank. A couple > guppies died, and all my glowlight tetras got burned or something-- > they have cloudy grey midsections of a different color than their > silvery scales. I think next time I'll just use heat. > > Since you've been in the hobby for such a long time, have you had > success with either rotala wallichii or ammania gracillis red > plants? I can't get them a strong red color, even with good co2, PC > 65K lighting, and fluorite substrate. Reading whatever I can > findonline, many have said that you need low nitrates to bring out > the red. My nitrates read 0 on Aq. Pharmaceuticals test kit--I > assume other plants are using it up as fast as it's produced, since > I have a decent fish load and feed regularly. Would adding a small > about of nitrate help them--maybe a reading of 5? Could it be other > trace elements lacking, or the high temps? I've thought of getting > Seachem Florish & adding small doses, just to make sure I don't have > a limiting nutrient problem. I also have an RO unit, so I can > soften the water further if need be. Readings now are gH of 6, kH > of 2-3, pH of 6.4-6.6.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15002	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Reading

It has been oft stated here by some of us that reading is important. I am a bit curious to find what people here are reading offline. I don't care about web-sites or other internet resources, just the old fashioned published material on paper. You needn't have read the whole publication, but have read more than the cover and table of contents and/or index <g>. Just reply to this message with what you have read in the past week. I'll start: "Aquarium Fish Magazine", August 2005 issue (finished) "Copeia", 2005, Vol. 1, in progress 2 Club newsletters (different clubs) Baensch _Aquarium Atlas, Vol. 2_ (as reference) _Fish And Invertebrate Culture, Second Edition_, Stephen Spotte (as reference) \\Steve// "There is still no cure for the common birthday" -- John Glenn

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15003	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Magazine Articles

My previous post, "Reading", is actually an off-shoot of my thinking while I was reading the August issue of AFM ("Aquarium Fish Magazine"). This issue, as usual with AFM, had a good mix of articles, both marine and freshwater. As befits the nature of the magazine, none of these articles goes into real depth, but really serves up their topics as a starting point--enough for the novice or intermediate fishkeeper, but with a lot more depth that could be explored. For instance, on page 58 an article appears on filters for your aquarium. It gives you the basics for each type of filtration, and what the different types of filters do, but really doesn't give much depth to the topic. However, for one who really doesn't know much about the different types of filters, it is a good starting point for further thought and research. How many of you freshwater people read the marine articles? You really should. A good article also in the August issue of AFM is titled "Help Your Marine Fish Thrive". Most of the points brought up in this article also apply to freshwater fish, and can easily be applied to your fish. A very good article that applies across the board of fishkeeping. In fact, one should at least skim those articles that do not appear to have any relevance to them for the tips that may be found to be applicable to your fish or aquarium. There is a lot of information that originated with the marine branch of the hobby that has been successfully applied to the freshwater branch. Not everything marine is suitable for freshwater, however. Take for example the protein skimmers mentioned in the filtration article. As good as the concept is, they really do not work in freshwater (though I am sure that someone would point out that I was remiss for not mentioning that there is some use found in ponds that have a very high organic load) because of the differences in water and organic composition of the water between fresh and marine environments. Everyone can find some time during the day to read. Outside the fish related publications I listed in my other post, I have also read the daily paper, 2 consumer related magazines, and a couple of computer related magazines, as well as trying to keep up with over 200 e-mails per day (outside of work, though many are work related), visiting various links given in the work related e-mails so that I can try to keep somewhat up on what is happening in my areas of expertise, and doing tech support for a small ISP after my day job is done. I also manage to fit in the mundane tasks of day-to-day living. \\Steve// "There is still no cure for the common birthday" -- John Glenn

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15004	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Two filters for a 55 gallon tank?

I am curious if that would be feasibly a good idea or not. I know it might help with the water movements and maybe help with picking up debris from all the fishes. But would it be a good idea to do that or just leave it to one filter meant for a 60 gallon tank? Thanks, Beth

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15005	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: How much light should an Angelfish tank get?

I have a fish book by Dr. Axelrod's mini-atlas of freshwater aquarium fishes and it states that the Angelfishes should have partial light. Does that mean on a 55 gallon tank which has two lamps that one is turned off and the other stays on till nightfall when that lamp is turned off or should it be rotated to fit the movement of the sun during the day? Thanks for any imput or correction to what I read. Beth

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15006	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Two filters for a 55 gallon tank?

One can never have too much filtration (unless the water movement is such that it prevents the inhabitants from swimming normally). Better yet if you have two types of filters, like one hang on (w/bio- wheel or not) and one canister, but two hang-ons are better than one. An additional advantage here is that you can remove one filter for cleaning without worrying about any temporary loss of beneficial bacteria (even though you shouldn't clean the filter with tap water). Sometimes, however, there reaches a point when the filter medium gets so saturated with debris that it does need to be replaced, and having one still running during those times is ideal. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Beth Brownell" <spencer_creek_studios@y...> wrote: > I am curious if that would be feasibly a good idea or not. > I know it might help with the water movements and maybe help > with picking up debris from all the fishes. > But would it be a good idea to do that or just leave it to > one filter meant for a 60 gallon tank? > > Thanks, > Beth

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15007	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?

Paul, you have only been back five minutes and you are trying to start an argument already. At no time did I say hydrogen peroxide was flammable, it is readily available up to 70% concentration, the 10% quote was just to show that it does lower PH, as I have already said all the information I quoted came from professional sites not hobby sources. Before you jump in with both feet again please read the posts in there entirety and understand the written word. regards, unclenorm. --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > again we are talking about 3% and you are talking > 10% > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> > wrote: > > > Nim, > > All the information I quoted came from > > professional sites not from hobby sources, if you > > google Hydrogen Peroxide you will find it all, as > > for > > what it does to PH take a look at :- > > > > http://www.h2o2.com/intro/faq.html#15 > > > > regards, > > unclenorm. > > > > > > --- Nimish Mathur <nimmat4@...> wrote: > > > > > Norm, > > > > > > > > > > > > Hydrogen peroxide is a very common algaecide > that > > is > > > harmless to fish and > > > bacteria upto a certain dose. I have mentioned > the > > > recommended dose in my > > > other post. > > > > > > Adding hydrogen peroxide will also not lower any > > PH > > > as it is basically > > > adding Nascent oxygen in the water (It is an > > > oxidizing agent and not a > > > reducing agent like Acids). It may however > > increase > > > the PH (very slightly) > > > and effect the functioning of PH buffers. > > > > > > > > > > > > The way H2O2 works for terrestrial plants is > very > > > much different then the > > > way it works for aquatic plants as for > terrestrial > > > plants, it creates a > > > oxygen rich environment in the substrate that > > helps > > > the plant roots grow. > > > For algae, because of the simple structure of > the > > > Algae, it tends to act as > > > an organic chemical oxidizer rather then > something > > > that is providing oxygen. > > > It does have a similar effect on plants but not > as > > > strong as it does on > > > Algae and so only delicate plants suffer when > > > treated with peroxide but > > > plants like Anubias and swords etc. can > withstand > > > it. > > > > > > > > > > > > But yes, It is a dangerous substance. Not a fire > > > hazard as it has nothing > > > that can burn it can however be considered > > > something equivalent to a Fire > > > as in the case of Rocket Fuel where it provides > > > oxygen to allow the fuel to > > > burn. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nim > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > Behalf Of Norman. S. Hampson. > > > Sent: 27 August 2005 07:32 > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Hydogen Peroxide cure > > for > > > Algae? > > > > > > > > > > > > Hi Aaron, > > > I've never heard of hydrogen Peroxide > > being > > > used to kill plants (algae), but I do know that > it > > > is > > > used in Hydroponics to enhance root growth so it > > > would > > > seem that it would encourage algae growth not > kill > > > it. > > > I also know that it will bring down the PH value > > of > > > your water, If your PH was 7.0 a 10% > concentration > > > of > > > H2O2 would bring your PH down to 5.3. You should > > > also > > > consider the fact that H2O2-hydrogen peroxide is > a > > > dangerous substance, it is a fire hazard, > > corrosive, > > > and explosive depending on the concentration, it > > has > > > been said to be 'as harmless as toothpaste or as > > > dangerous as rocket fuel' two of its uses!!. > > > regards, > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > --- Aaron <anonymous122899@...> wrote: > > > > > > > Hi, > > > > > > > > Has anybody tried using Hydogen Peroxide as a > > cure > > > > for Algae? > > > > > > > > It was suggested to me to use 5ml of Hydrogen > > > > Peroxide per gallon per > > > > week. > > > > > > > > I have 3 tanks, the largest is 55 gallons. So > > for > > > > the big tank I > > > > should use 275ml or about 1/2 a bottle a week? > > > > > > > > Do I need to dilute it first or just pour > right > > > into > > > > the tank? > > > > > > > > I have thick Green Hair Algae and Black Bottle > > > Brush > > > > Algae as well as > > > > Algae covering the glass. > > > > > > > > Thanks for any info, > > > > Aaron > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > > > > To help you stay safe and secure online, we've > > > developed the all new Yahoo! > > > Security Centre. http://uk.security.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it > > when > > > replying, thanks. > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all > TEXT > > > that is NOT important to > > > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the > original > > > message MODIFY the SUBJECT > > > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" > > <- > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > > > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > > > matter. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on > > the > > > web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email > > to: > > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > > > Yahoo! > > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of > > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > === message truncated === > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15008	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: How much light should an Angelfish tank get?

I believe Dr. Axelrod meant that Angelfish (as well as a number of other Cichlids) feel most comfortable in subdued (partial) lighting, not overly intense. Rotating the lamps is not necessary, but is not entirely a bad idea either. This all depends on a number of factors, not the least of which is how comfortable your Angelfish appear now (w/two lamps), if that is your concern. If they are swimming openly and not seeking refuge, its doubtful that they feel stressed in having too intense lighting. The plant growth also needs some consideration here, if you dramatically cut down on lighting; some may not like it. You could always add some floating plants to shade some light if needed (to be thinned out as need be). Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Beth Brownell" <spencer_creek_studios@y...> wrote: > I have a fish book by Dr. Axelrod's mini-atlas of freshwater aquarium > fishes and it states that the Angelfishes should have partial light. > > Does that mean on a 55 gallon tank which has two lamps that one is > turned off and the other stays on till nightfall when that lamp is > turned off or should it be rotated to fit the movement of the sun > during the day? > > Thanks for any imput or correction to what I read. > Beth

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15009	From: Patrick	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?

"You should also consider the fact that H2O2-hydrogen peroxide is a dangerous substance, it is a fire hazard, corrosive,and explosive depending on the concentration, it has been said to be 'as harmless as toothpaste or as dangerous as rocket fuel' two of its uses!!." That statement could be taken to mean flameable or that it is able to make conditions appropriate for a flame. Paul was clearly only trying to clarify the issues. Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Thomas Jefferson once said, 'We should never judge a president by his age, only by his works.' And ever since he told me that, I stopped worrying." -Ronald Reagan -------Original Message------- Paul, you have only been back five minutes and you are trying to start an argument already. At no time did I say hydrogen peroxide was flammable, it is readily available up to 70% concentration, the 10% quote was just to show that it does lower PH, as I have already said all the information I quoted came from professional sites not hobby sources. Before you jump in with both feet again please read the posts in there entirety and understand the written word. regards, unclenorm. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15010	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Reading

Fishy Related~ Aquarium Fish Magazine, November 2005 issue (finished) Freshwater and Marine Aquarium Sept 2000 issue ( reread article) Corydoras Catfish by Derek Lambourne (re-read for refrence) Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 8/28/2005 7:54:08 AM US Eastern Standard Time, steve@... writes: It has been oft stated here by some of us that reading is important. I am a bit curious to find what people here are reading offline. I don't care about web-sites or other internet resources, just the old fashioned published material on paper. You needn't have read the whole publication, but have read more than the cover and table of contents and/or index <g>. Just reply to this message with what you have read in the past week. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15011	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Two filters for a 55 gallon tank?

Beth, I think Ray said it all. Two filters are always betetr then one in my opinion. If one fails, the other is there. If one needs cleaned, the other still has good bacteria, if one needs to be Put on another tank ( temp ) the other is there. I might add since you mentioned a 55 gallon Angelfish tank in another post, that Angelfish, Discuss and a few other fish sometimes have problems if there is to much water suction from the filters. I agree though that Too much filteration is bettr then too little. I have two 300gph filters on (3) out of 4 55 gallon tanks. The one tank That is not over filtered has a Puffer fish in it that don't like water current so it is being filtered by (2) Whisper 30's which are rated for 30 gallons each, so I guess its still over filtered, but the current is a lot slower :-) Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 8/28/2005 9:18:37 AM US Eastern Standard Time, sevenspringss@... writes: I am curious if that would be feasibly a good idea or not. > I know it might help with the water movements and maybe help > with picking up debris from all the fishes. > But would it be a good idea to do that or just leave it to > one filter meant for a 60 gallon tank? > > Thanks, > Beth [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15012	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Two filters for a 55 gallon tank?

I am running 2 emperor 400's in my 55 gallon and the fish seem to be fine. It would depend on your fish too. If you have fish that require still water, there may be too much water flow. I just did a water change and a vacuum and there was noticeably less gunk in the gravel since I have put the 2 filters on the tank. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Beth Brownell Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2005 8:27 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Two filters for a 55 gallon tank? I am curious if that would be feasibly a good idea or not. I know it might help with the water movements and maybe help with picking up debris from all the fishes. But would it be a good idea to do that or just leave it to one filter meant for a 60 gallon tank? Thanks, Beth Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15013	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Floating THERMOMETERS

I have the LCD thermometers on the outside of most of my tanks, but the kids like pulling them off and after a few times they get inaccurate. SO have those floating Thermometers in my tanks, and I have found them to be very accurate but lately i have a problem. They seem to have got stuck at one temperature. I noticed this the other day in my 75 gallon tank. The LCD temp read 72* which puzzled me because it usually reads 76*, so i stuck my hand in and found the floating Thermometer. It said 80* F The water was cold to the touch, so i grabbed another Thermometer ( NIB ) and stuck it in the water, It immediately went to 73*F. I then rinsed the Old Floaty with rubbing alcohol, and dryed it, placed it in my hospital tank( no heater temps lower 70's ) which is currently empty. The thermometer still reads 80*f . So I am asking has anyone else ran into this problem? The old thermometer does not have any water in it, or any cracks I can see. The murcury and beads are still there... Is this a fluke? or common? All my floaties are about 5 years old now, should I be looking to replace them Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15014	From: Fonchy	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Two filters for a 55 gallon tank?

When i had my fresh water tanks I used to use 2 filters, one was a fluval 404 with carbon and the other ons was a fluval 104 with ammo chips, it was a plated tank and I never had any problems, I kept angels, gouramis, 1 jack dempsey, kuhli loaches and clown loaches. ----- Original Message ----- From: Eric Roberts To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2005 12:02 PM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Two filters for a 55 gallon tank? I am running 2 emperor 400's in my 55 gallon and the fish seem to be fine. It would depend on your fish too. If you have fish that require still water, there may be too much water flow. I just did a water change and a vacuum and there was noticeably less gunk in the gravel since I have put the 2 filters on the tank. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Beth Brownell Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2005 8:27 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Two filters for a 55 gallon tank? I am curious if that would be feasibly a good idea or not. I know it might help with the water movements and maybe help with picking up debris from all the fishes. But would it be a good idea to do that or just leave it to one filter meant for a 60 gallon tank? Thanks, Beth Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15015	From: Fonchy	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Floating THERMOMETERS

To get it unstuck just try a little heat so th mercury will raise then just let it sit an look at it again it should go down again. It happen to me once and that solved the problem, it still works after 9 years. i have 7 and they are about that old. ----- Original Message ----- From: FortWayneFish@... To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2005 12:03 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] Floating THERMOMETERS I have the LCD thermometers on the outside of most of my tanks, but the kids like pulling them off and after a few times they get inaccurate. SO have those floating Thermometers in my tanks, and I have found them to be very accurate but lately i have a problem. They seem to have got stuck at one temperature. I noticed this the other day in my 75 gallon tank. The LCD temp read 72* which puzzled me because it usually reads 76*, so i stuck my hand in and found the floating Thermometer. It said 80* F The water was cold to the touch, so i grabbed another Thermometer ( NIB ) and stuck it in the water, It immediately went to 73*F. I then rinsed the Old Floaty with rubbing alcohol, and dryed it, placed it in my hospital tank( no heater temps lower 70's ) which is currently empty. The thermometer still reads 80*f . So I am asking has anyone else ran into this problem? The old thermometer does not have any water in it, or any cracks I can see. The murcury and beads are still there... Is this a fluke? or common? All my floaties are about 5 years old now, should I be looking to replace them Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15016	From: Fonchy	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Two filters for a 55 gallon tank?

not plated but planted ----- Original Message ----- From: Fonchy To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2005 12:34 PM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Two filters for a 55 gallon tank? When i had my fresh water tanks I used to use 2 filters, one was a fluval 404 with carbon and the other ons was a fluval 104 with ammo chips, it was a plated tank and I never had any problems, I kept angels, gouramis, 1 jack dempsey, kuhli loaches and clown loaches. ----- Original Message ----- From: Eric Roberts To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2005 12:02 PM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Two filters for a 55 gallon tank? I am running 2 emperor 400's in my 55 gallon and the fish seem to be fine. It would depend on your fish too. If you have fish that require still water, there may be too much water flow. I just did a water change and a vacuum and there was noticeably less gunk in the gravel since I have put the 2 filters on the tank. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Beth Brownell Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2005 8:27 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Two filters for a 55 gallon tank? I am curious if that would be feasibly a good idea or not. I know it might help with the water movements and maybe help with picking up debris from all the fishes. But would it be a good idea to do that or just leave it to one filter meant for a 60 gallon tank? Thanks, Beth Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15017	From: Fonchy	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: any one with saltwater tanks

Is anyone here with a saltwater tank??? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15018	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Floating THERMOMETERS

I'll try that :-) I would hate to have to replace the 30 or so Thermometers i have in use. In a message dated 8/28/2005 11:38:23 AM US Eastern Standard Time, fonchy@... writes: To get it unstuck just try a little heat so th mercury will raise then just let it sit an look at it again it should go down again. It happen to me once and that solved the problem, it still works after 9 years. i have 7 and they are about that old. Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15019	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: How much light should an Angelfish tank get?

That's what I figured as my guys seem to like it when I have the lights off part of the day. But in my 55 gal tank, with two lights, I figure one will be on during the morning hours and both turned on when afternoon comes for an hour longer before the other one will be turned on till night fall. I think that is a good rotation of light. Thanks! Beth

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15020	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Two filters for a 55 gallon tank?

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, FortWayneFish@a... wrote: > Beth, > > I think Ray said it all. Two filters are always betetr then one in my opinion. If one fails, the other is there. If one needs cleaned, the other still has good bacteria, if one needs to be Put on another tank ( temp ) the other is there. > I might add since you mentioned a 55 gallon Angelfish tank in another post, that Angelfish, Discuss and a few other fish sometimes have problems if there is to much water suction from the filters. > Rob > NE Indiana > USA My Angelfishes don't even mind the current from the one I have in the tank at the moment. The plants are swaying nice and slow with the current that is flowing over them. There isn't much movement of water even with two in the tank itself. I did a floating feeder tablet with it to test how strong it was and the tablet just barely dunked fully under the water before drifting off to a calm section of the tank only to be move by the slow current about five minutes later. Is that too strong or just right for Angelfishes? They don't seem to be bothered by it at all. I just want to be sure that it is okay for them. I don't want them stressed and they ain't hiding about the tank either. Thanks! Beth

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15021	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Two filters for a 55 gallon tank?

It sounds about right to me. As long as the fish are not having to swim against the current all the time. I am sure you have a few dead spots or places in the tank where the current isn't that strong. Hope you the best with your fish. :-) Now all you need is a breeding cone or piece of slate positioned vertically for the fish to spawn on when they decide they want to... Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 8/28/2005 11:54:24 AM US Eastern Standard Time, spencer_creek_studios@... writes: Is that too strong or just right for Angelfishes? They don't seem to be bothered by it at all. I just want to be sure that it is okay for them. I don't want them stressed and they ain't hiding about the tank either. Thanks! Beth [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15022	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: How much light should an Angelfish tank get?

I would think it depends on how heavily planted the tank is. In a bare tank, the lighting is only for your viewing pleasure, not for any specific need the fish may have. In that case, ambient room light is enough. When you do need lighting is for most plants. The plants require a certain amount of light (actually in certain wave lengths) and if they do not get it, with all other factors being correct, they will not do well. If you take a look at the environment that angelfish are found in, the light is filtered by the forest canopy and any plants that may be growing in their territory. They will seldom, if ever, be subjected to full sunlight. It is a bit difficult to simulate the canopy, so a heavy planting of your tank should suffice, along with some floating plants such as water sprite, azolla, and/or duckweed. (There are others as well.) Since you do indicate they do not like the bright light, your current scheme is probably the best, until you create more cover for the fish. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Beth Brownell Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2005 9:34 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] How much light should an Angelfish tank get? I have a fish book by Dr. Axelrod's mini-atlas of freshwater aquarium fishes and it states that the Angelfishes should have partial light. Does that mean on a 55 gallon tank which has two lamps that one is turned off and the other stays on till nightfall when that lamp is turned off or should it be rotated to fit the movement of the sun during the day? Thanks for any imput or correction to what I read. Beth

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15023	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?

Hi Patrick, Your statement 'could be taken to mean' is in fact true, look up what your US health and safety authority says about it under hazardous chemicals. There is no clarification nessesary, there was nothing ambiguous in my post all I said is readily verified on line by the use of google, It would seem that Paul is looking for an argument again. regards, unclenorm. --- Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: > "You should also consider the fact that > H2O2-hydrogen peroxide is a > dangerous substance, it is a fire hazard, > corrosive,and explosive depending > on the concentration, it has been said to be 'as > harmless as toothpaste or > as dangerous as rocket fuel' two of its uses!!." > > That statement could be taken to mean flameable > or that it is able to > make conditions appropriate for a flame. Paul was > clearly only trying to > clarify the issues. > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy. > > "Thomas Jefferson once said, 'We should never judge > a president > by his age, only by his works.' And ever since he > told me that, > I stopped worrying." -Ronald Reagan > > > -------Original Message------- > Paul, > you have only been back five minutes and you are > trying to start an argument already. At no time did > I > say hydrogen peroxide was flammable, it is readily > available up to 70% concentration, the 10% quote was > just to show that it does lower PH, as I have > already > said all the information I quoted came from > professional sites not hobby sources. Before you > jump > in with both feet again please read the posts in > there > entirety and understand the written word. > regards, > unclenorm. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ___________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15024	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: any one with saltwater tanks

Hi Fonchy, Yes a few ?? regards, unclenorm. --- Fonchy <fonchy@...> wrote: > Is anyone here with a saltwater tank??? > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ___________________________________________________________ How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15025	From: muskie4817	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Ebo-Jager Heater

I have a Ebo-Jager heater model TS150 for 150 watts and was curious how to reset it. I bought it about 16 months ago and the temperature in my water and the heater settings are different. Does the little blue knob on the top do something?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15026	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Ebo-Jager Heater

Oh wow.. An Ebo- question If your Ebo has a push button on the dial knob( blue ), it needs to be popped up to unlock the dial setting.the blue knob on top should have a temperature setting. The knob will turn either clockwise or counter clockwise. set the temperature of the heater to the desired temperature of the tank. NO heater is 100% accurate, but Ebo's are generally closer then the rest. A 2-3 degree diffrence is not unheard of. If the temperature settings are worn off like one of my heaters then you will have to experiemnt with the temp, once you find 78* or what ever temp you are looking for mark the dial to represent that temperature. Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 8/28/2005 8:07:47 PM US Eastern Standard Time, muskie4817@... writes: I have a Ebo-Jager heater model TS150 for 150 watts and was curious how to reset it. I bought it about 16 months ago and the temperature in my water and the heater settings are different. Does the little blue knob on the top do something? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15027	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: The San Diego Tropical Fish Society , 9/11/2005, 7:00 pm

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife The San Diego Tropical Fish Society Sunday September 11, 2005 7:00 pm - 8:00 pm This event repeats on the second Sunday of every month. The next reminder for this event will be sent in 11 days, 4 minutes. Event Location: room 101, Casa Del Prado, Balboa Park at 7:00 PM Street: SAN DIEGO TROPICAL FISH SOCIETY, PO Box 4156, North Park Station City, State, Zip: San Diego, CA 92164 Phone: 619-281-FISH Notes: http://www.geocities.com/sandiegofishfan/ You are cordially invited to attend our next meeting in room 101, Casa Del Prado, Balboa Park at 7:00 PM on the second Sunday of the month. Visitors are always welcome! 619-281-FISH ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15028	From: Chris	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: video -> how about a fish suggestion?

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "The Dragon Hunter" <dragon.hunter@d...> wrote: > Honestly, I've never seen any Rams out my way, so have not really been > curious about them. I'm a bit behind on my reading, so apologies if someone has already answered this. Rams will tend to swim at the bottom of the tank (except at feeding time). Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15029	From: paul helms	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?

not looking for an argument at all --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> wrote: > Hi Patrick, > Your statement 'could be taken to mean' is > in fact true, look up what your US health and safety > authority says about it under hazardous chemicals. > There is no clarification nessesary, there was > nothing > ambiguous in my post all I said is readily verified > on > line by the use of google, It would seem that Paul > is > looking for an argument again. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: > > > "You should also consider the fact that > > H2O2-hydrogen peroxide is a > > dangerous substance, it is a fire hazard, > > corrosive,and explosive depending > > on the concentration, it has been said to be 'as > > harmless as toothpaste or > > as dangerous as rocket fuel' two of its uses!!." > > > > That statement could be taken to mean > flameable > > or that it is able to > > make conditions appropriate for a flame. Paul was > > clearly only trying to > > clarify the issues. > > > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy. > > > > "Thomas Jefferson once said, 'We should never > judge > > a president > > by his age, only by his works.' And ever since he > > told me that, > > I stopped worrying." -Ronald Reagan > > > > > > -------Original Message------- > > Paul, > > you have only been back five minutes and you are > > trying to start an argument already. At no time > did > > I > > say hydrogen peroxide was flammable, it is readily > > available up to 70% concentration, the 10% quote > was > > just to show that it does lower PH, as I have > > already > > said all the information I quoted came from > > professional sites not hobby sources. Before you > > jump > > in with both feet again please read the posts in > > there > > entirety and understand the written word. > > regards, > > unclenorm. > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC > calling worldwide with voicemail > http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com > __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - You care about security. So do we. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15030	From: paul helms	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?

i am not looking for an argument with anyone, only clarifying that the "dangerous" substance being talked about is not the same thing being advised. i know you like to argue things to the point of beating a dead horse, i am not looking for that at all. --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> wrote: > Hi Patrick, > Your statement 'could be taken to mean' is > in fact true, look up what your US health and safety > authority says about it under hazardous chemicals. > There is no clarification nessesary, there was > nothing > ambiguous in my post all I said is readily verified > on > line by the use of google, It would seem that Paul > is > looking for an argument again. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: > > > "You should also consider the fact that > > H2O2-hydrogen peroxide is a > > dangerous substance, it is a fire hazard, > > corrosive,and explosive depending > > on the concentration, it has been said to be 'as > > harmless as toothpaste or > > as dangerous as rocket fuel' two of its uses!!." > > > > That statement could be taken to mean > flameable > > or that it is able to > > make conditions appropriate for a flame. Paul was > > clearly only trying to > > clarify the issues. > > > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy. > > > > "Thomas Jefferson once said, 'We should never > judge > > a president > > by his age, only by his works.' And ever since he > > told me that, > > I stopped worrying." -Ronald Reagan > > > > > > -------Original Message------- > > Paul, > > you have only been back five minutes and you are > > trying to start an argument already. At no time > did > > I > > say hydrogen peroxide was flammable, it is readily > > available up to 70% concentration, the 10% quote > was > > just to show that it does lower PH, as I have > > already > > said all the information I quoted came from > > professional sites not hobby sources. Before you > > jump > > in with both feet again please read the posts in > > there > > entirety and understand the written word. > > regards, > > unclenorm. > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC > calling worldwide with voicemail > http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15031	From: paul helms	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: any one with saltwater tanks

i am currently running a 140 gallon saltwater tank witha 30 gallon sump and a 40 gallon refugium. --- Fonchy <fonchy@...> wrote: > Is anyone here with a saltwater tank??? > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15032	From: paul helms	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?

in my five minutes back i have already read several posts written by you to others telling them to reread what you wrote. i am not trying to start anything with anyone. i do not know why you take every comment i make as an attempt to fight with you. i have no interest in debating anything with you, jjust adding my 2 cents. when giving this advise is it not adviseable to perhaps write in a more clear manner so that other educated people like ray and myself can get your point? --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> wrote: > Paul, > you have only been back five minutes and you are > trying to start an argument already. At no time did > I > say hydrogen peroxide was flammable, it is readily > available up to 70% concentration, the 10% quote was > just to show that it does lower PH, as I have > already > said all the information I quoted came from > professional sites not hobby sources. Before you > jump > in with both feet again please read the posts in > there > entirety and understand the written word. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > again we are talking about 3% and you are talking > > 10% > > > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> > > wrote: > > > > > Nim, > > > All the information I quoted came from > > > professional sites not from hobby sources, if > you > > > google Hydrogen Peroxide you will find it all, > as > > > for > > > what it does to PH take a look at :- > > > > > > http://www.h2o2.com/intro/faq.html#15 > > > > > > regards, > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > --- Nimish Mathur <nimmat4@...> wrote: > > > > > > > Norm, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hydrogen peroxide is a very common algaecide > > that > > > is > > > > harmless to fish and > > > > bacteria upto a certain dose. I have mentioned > > the > > > > recommended dose in my > > > > other post. > > > > > > > > Adding hydrogen peroxide will also not lower > any > > > PH > > > > as it is basically > > > > adding Nascent oxygen in the water (It is an > > > > oxidizing agent and not a > > > > reducing agent like Acids). It may however > > > increase > > > > the PH (very slightly) > > > > and effect the functioning of PH buffers. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The way H2O2 works for terrestrial plants is > > very > > > > much different then the > > > > way it works for aquatic plants as for > > terrestrial > > > > plants, it creates a > > > > oxygen rich environment in the substrate that > > > helps > > > > the plant roots grow. > > > > For algae, because of the simple structure of > > the > > > > Algae, it tends to act as > > > > an organic chemical oxidizer rather then > > something > > > > that is providing oxygen. > > > > It does have a similar effect on plants but > not > > as > > > > strong as it does on > > > > Algae and so only delicate plants suffer when > > > > treated with peroxide but > > > > plants like Anubias and swords etc. can > > withstand > > > > it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But yes, It is a dangerous substance. Not a > fire > > > > hazard as it has nothing > > > > that can burn it can however be considered > > > > something equivalent to a Fire > > > > as in the case of Rocket Fuel where it > provides > > > > oxygen to allow the fuel to > > > > burn. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nim > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > > Behalf Of Norman. S. Hampson. > > > > Sent: 27 August 2005 07:32 > > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Hydogen Peroxide > cure > > > for > > > > Algae? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hi Aaron, > > > > I've never heard of hydrogen Peroxide > > > being > > > > used to kill plants (algae), but I do know > that > > it > > > > is > > > > used in Hydroponics to enhance root growth so > it > > > > would > > > > seem that it would encourage algae growth not > > kill > > > > it. > > > > I also know that it will bring down the PH > value > > > of > > > > your water, If your PH was 7.0 a 10% > > concentration > > > > of > > > > H2O2 would bring your PH down to 5.3. You > should > > > > also > > > > consider the fact that H2O2-hydrogen peroxide > is > > a > > > > dangerous substance, it is a fire hazard, > > > corrosive, > > > > and explosive depending on the concentration, > it > > > has > > > > been said to be 'as harmless as toothpaste or > as > > > > dangerous as rocket fuel' two of its uses!!. > > > > regards, > > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Aaron <anonymous122899@...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Hi, > > > > > > > > > > Has anybody tried using Hydogen Peroxide as > a > > > cure > > > > > for Algae? > > > > > > > > > > It was suggested to me to use 5ml of > Hydrogen > > > > > Peroxide per gallon per > > > > > week. > > > > > > > > > > I have 3 tanks, the largest is 55 gallons. > So > > > for > > > > > the big tank I > > > > > should use 275ml or about 1/2 a bottle a > week? > > > > > > > > > > Do I need to dilute it first or just pour > > right > > > > into > > > > > the tank? > > > > > > > > > > I have thick Green Hair Algae and Black > Bottle > > > > Brush > > > > > Algae as well as > > > > > Algae covering the glass. > > > > > > > > > > Thanks for any info, > > > > > Aaron > > > > > > > > > > > === message truncated === __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15033	From: Chris	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: algae chompers (wa - Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?)

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: I also have octinoclus (sp?) cats. Otocinclus or Ottocinclus. There was a discussion here about a month back about these fish. I'd seen them a while ago in a local store and thought they looked good, but didn't know anything about them. I didn't buy any, then when I found out their reputation as algae eaters (through this group) I wanted to get a few. The store no longer had them, but another store did. Within 30 minutes there were trails through the algae everywhere (I bought four). For a 3cm fish, they do a mean job on algae. I would say they are as effective as plecostomus, relative to their size. Highly recommended! (But note, experience in the past dictates that some species of fish will eat some species of algae. In the absence of competition, often a different species of algae will grow, which your fish does not eat - so you're just delaying the inevitable algae- takeover... but that's just my experience, and i've never had all three species of fish to tackle the problem: ottos, plecs and bristlenose) Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15034	From: Chris	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: algae chompers (wa - Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?)

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Fonchy" <fonchy@w...> wrote: > When I had my old 55 aga fresh water I added some plants and the algae went away. I've heard it said before that one way to get rid of algae is to densely plant your tank - the logic being to outcompete the algae. Whoever came up with that idea hasn't seen my tank! :) Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15035	From: Chris	Date: 8/28/2005
Subject: Re: Blue and Gold Ramsand new additions

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, kristopher helsing <punk3r12@y...> wrote: > I started with 6 gold rams and 6 german blue...... within about 2 months all had died accept one I agree - Rams can be very sensitive and easy to lose. Another tip for introducing them to the tank - turn off the tank light, and if you can, introduce them at the end of the day so they have all night to settle. > Anyone have any suggestions for nice background plants Amazon swords are always a winner for south-american fish. > or interesting fish to add?? If I could find them here in Sydney, I like the festive cichlid - kind of looks like an angel fish with the fins chopped off (not to sound mean). Never kept them though. Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15036	From: Chris	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: Reading

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > I am a > bit curious to find what people here are reading offline. We recently bought our 2 year old a fantastic book by Dorling Kindersly (DK) called "Animal". It's a single volume animal encyclopaedia with a nice section on fish. I have never found a single book with so many interesting fish facts that I didn't have any awareness of whatsoever. One that just blew me away was the Candiru of the Amazon - so much so that I suggested it as an article for a local radio station's "Science" segment. They found it sufficiently out of the ordinary to invite me in to record an interview on it... From the miniature end of the catfish scale we'll round out the story with a piece on catfish noodling. Candiru: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Candiru Noodling: http://www.johnsjottings.com/archives/2003/04/23/catfish_noodling.html Apart from that, much of my reading has been online - with respect (as you would know) to fish euthanasia, Gambusia eradication and species surveys in Australia's freshwater habitats. Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15037	From: Chris	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: Magazine Articles

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > Everyone can find some time during the day to read. Outside the fish related > publications I listed in my other post, I have also read the daily paper, 2 > consumer related magazines, and a couple of computer related magazines, as > well as trying to keep up with over 200 e-mails per day (outside of work, > though many are work related), visiting various links given in the work > related e-mails so that I can try to keep somewhat up on what is happening > in my areas of expertise, and doing tech support for a small ISP after my > day job is done. I also manage to fit in the mundane tasks of day- to-day > living. > > \\Steve// Ha!! I wasn't going to mention the book I'm reading outside of the fishworld, but it sounds like you could use it: two books in one volume: "Margin" and "the Overload Syndrome". :D Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15038	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: Two filters for a 55 gallon tank?

Beth I usually go for a power filter or canister with an air driven sponge filter. That way if I am gone for a while and have a power failure, like TODAY for example, the sponge filters will start right back up when the power comes back on. I had 2 power filters and one canister that did not start up again today but all the sponge filters were bubbling away. Mike In a message dated 8/28/2005 6:28:36 AM Pacific Daylight Time, spencer_creek_studios@... writes: I am curious if that would be feasibly a good idea or not. I know it might help with the water movements and maybe help with picking up debris from all the fishes. But would it be a good idea to do that or just leave it to one filter meant for a 60 gallon tank? Thanks, Beth [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15039	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: Two filters for a 55 gallon tank?

Rob, When I have a filter with strong suction and fry in the tank or delicate fish I use one of those generic round foam sponges that are commonly used on pond pumps. I put a bottle cap from a water bottle or two liter in one end and just pop the open end on the filter intake, sometimes it needs a rubber band to hold it secure. So far it has worked great for me. Mike In a message dated 8/28/2005 8:53:23 AM Pacific Daylight Time, FortWayneFish@... writes: I might add since you mentioned a 55 gallon Angelfish tank in another post, that Angelfish, Discuss and a few other fish sometimes have problems if there is to much water suction from the filters. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15040	From: paul helms	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: Reading

imperial san francisco --- Chris <youcantryreachingme@...> wrote: > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" > <steve@l...> wrote: > > I am a > > bit curious to find what people here are reading > offline. > > We recently bought our 2 year old a fantastic book > by Dorling > Kindersly (DK) called "Animal". It's a single volume > animal > encyclopaedia with a nice section on fish. I have > never found a > single book with so many interesting fish facts that > I didn't have > any awareness of whatsoever. > > One that just blew me away was the Candiru of the > Amazon - so much so > that I suggested it as an article for a local radio > station's "Science" segment. They found it > sufficiently out of the > ordinary to invite me in to record an interview on > it... From the > miniature end of the catfish scale we'll round out > the story with a > piece on catfish noodling. > > Candiru: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Candiru > Noodling: > http://www.johnsjottings.com/archives/2003/04/23/catfish_noodling.html > > Apart from that, much of my reading has been online > - with respect > (as you would know) to fish euthanasia, Gambusia > eradication and > species surveys in Australia's freshwater habitats. > > Chris. > > > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15041	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?

OK Paul, Check the posts again you will see that my post was before any recommendations on dilution put by any member of this group, the substance is the same - Hydrogen peroxide whatever the dilution. My original answer was based on information found on line, 'it is used by hydroponic growers of many types of plants to encourage growth in an aquatic environment', so if it does kill algae as is being claimed then I am guilty of an assumption as you are with regard to 'fire hazard'. But I have to wonder if the claim is true why is it not widely used ? when algae is such a common problem in the hobby!. regards, unclenorm. --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > i am not looking for an argument with anyone, only > clarifying that the "dangerous" substance being > talked > about is not the same thing being advised. i know > you > like to argue things to the point of beating a dead > horse, i am not looking for that at all. > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> > wrote: > > > Hi Patrick, > > Your statement 'could be taken to mean' > is > > in fact true, look up what your US health and > safety > > authority says about it under hazardous chemicals. > > There is no clarification nessesary, there was > > nothing > > ambiguous in my post all I said is readily > verified > > on > > line by the use of google, It would seem that Paul > > is > > looking for an argument again. > > regards, > > unclenorm. > > > > > > --- Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: > > > > > "You should also consider the fact that > > > H2O2-hydrogen peroxide is a > > > dangerous substance, it is a fire hazard, > > > corrosive,and explosive depending > > > on the concentration, it has been said to be 'as > > > harmless as toothpaste or > > > as dangerous as rocket fuel' two of its uses!!." > > > > > > > That statement could be taken to mean > > flameable > > > or that it is able to > > > make conditions appropriate for a flame. Paul > was > > > clearly only trying to > > > clarify the issues. > > > > > > Patrick, an American Fish Guy. > > > > > > "Thomas Jefferson once said, 'We should never > > judge > > > a president > > > by his age, only by his works.' And ever since > he > > > told me that, > > > I stopped worrying." -Ronald Reagan > > > > > > > > > -------Original Message------- > > > Paul, > > > you have only been back five minutes and you are > > > trying to start an argument already. At no time > > did > > > I > > > say hydrogen peroxide was flammable, it is > readily > > > available up to 70% concentration, the 10% quote > > was > > > just to show that it does lower PH, as I have > > > already > > > said all the information I quoted came from > > > professional sites not hobby sources. Before you > > > jump > > > in with both feet again please read the posts in > > > there > > > entirety and understand the written word. > > > regards, > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > > Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC > > calling worldwide with voicemail > > http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs > > ___________________________________________________________ To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. http://uk.security.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15042	From: wizzbaf	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Filter Question (Cross Post)

I have a very basic, simple question about filter usage. Used on the same size/shape tank, would two filters rated for 30 gallon tanks be more effective, less effective or as effective as one filter rated for 60 gallon tanks? Thank you in advance for anyone's thoughts on the subject.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15043	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?

Paul, This is another invitation to an argument, I write in plain English if you can't understand it that your problem not mine, so please stop trying to antagonize me. regards, unclenorm --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > in my five minutes back i have already read several > posts written by you to others telling them to > reread > what you wrote. i am not trying to start anything > with anyone. i do not know why you take every > comment > i make as an attempt to fight with you. i have no > interest in debating anything with you, jjust adding > my 2 cents. when giving this advise is it not > adviseable to perhaps write in a more clear manner > so > that other educated people like ray and myself can > get > your point? > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> > wrote: > > > Paul, > > you have only been back five minutes and you are > > trying to start an argument already. At no time > did > > I > > say hydrogen peroxide was flammable, it is readily > > available up to 70% concentration, the 10% quote > was > > just to show that it does lower PH, as I have > > already > > said all the information I quoted came from > > professional sites not hobby sources. Before you > > jump > > in with both feet again please read the posts in > > there > > entirety and understand the written word. > > regards, > > unclenorm. > > > > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > > > again we are talking about 3% and you are > talking > > > 10% > > > > > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." > <normnam2000@...> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > Nim, > > > > All the information I quoted came from > > > > professional sites not from hobby sources, if > > you > > > > google Hydrogen Peroxide you will find it all, > > as > > > > for > > > > what it does to PH take a look at :- > > > > > > > > > http://www.h2o2.com/intro/faq.html#15 > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Nimish Mathur <nimmat4@...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Norm, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hydrogen peroxide is a very common algaecide > > > that > > > > is > > > > > harmless to fish and > > > > > bacteria upto a certain dose. I have > mentioned > > > the > > > > > recommended dose in my > > > > > other post. > > > > > > > > > > Adding hydrogen peroxide will also not lower > > any > > > > PH > > > > > as it is basically > > > > > adding Nascent oxygen in the water (It is an > > > > > oxidizing agent and not a > > > > > reducing agent like Acids). It may however > > > > increase > > > > > the PH (very slightly) > > > > > and effect the functioning of PH buffers. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The way H2O2 works for terrestrial plants is > > > very > > > > > much different then the > > > > > way it works for aquatic plants as for > > > terrestrial > > > > > plants, it creates a > > > > > oxygen rich environment in the substrate > that > > > > helps > > > > > the plant roots grow. > > > > > For algae, because of the simple structure > of > > > the > > > > > Algae, it tends to act as > > > > > an organic chemical oxidizer rather then > > > something > > > > > that is providing oxygen. > > > > > It does have a similar effect on plants but > > not > > > as > > > > > strong as it does on > > > > > Algae and so only delicate plants suffer > when > > > > > treated with peroxide but > > > > > plants like Anubias and swords etc. can > > > withstand > > > > > it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But yes, It is a dangerous substance. Not a > > fire > > > > > hazard as it has nothing > > > > > that can burn it can however be considered > > > > > something equivalent to a Fire > > > > > as in the case of Rocket Fuel where it > > provides > > > > > oxygen to allow the fuel to > > > > > burn. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nim > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > > > > Behalf Of Norman. S. Hampson. > > > > > Sent: 27 August 2005 07:32 > > > > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > > > > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Hydogen Peroxide > > cure > > > > for > > > > > Algae? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hi Aaron, > > > > > I've never heard of hydrogen > Peroxide > > > > being > > > > > used to kill plants (algae), but I do know > > that > > > it > > > > > is > > > > > used in Hydroponics to enhance root growth > so > > it > > > > > would > > > > > seem that it would encourage algae growth > not > > > kill > > > > > it. > > > > > I also know that it will bring down the PH > > value > > > > of > > > > > your water, If your PH was 7.0 a 10% > > > concentration > > > > > of > > > > > H2O2 would bring your PH down to 5.3. You > > should > > > > > also > > > > > consider the fact that H2O2-hydrogen > peroxide > > is > > > a > > > > > dangerous substance, it is a fire hazard, > > > > corrosive, > > > > > and explosive depending on the > concentration, > > it > > > > has > > > > > been said to be 'as harmless as toothpaste > or > > as > > > > > dangerous as rocket fuel' two of its uses!!. > > > > > regards, > > > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Aaron <anonymous122899@...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Hi, > > > > > > > > > > > > Has anybody tried using Hydogen Peroxide > as > > a > > > > cure > > > > > > for Algae? > > > > > > > > > > > > It was suggested to me to use 5ml of > > Hydrogen > > > > > > Peroxide per gallon per > > > > > > week. > > > > > > > > > > > > I have 3 tanks, the largest is 55 gallons. > > So > > > > for > > > > > > the big tank I > > > > > > should use 275ml or about 1/2 a bottle a > > week? > > > > > > > > > > > > Do I need to dilute it first or just pour > > > right > > > > > into > > > > > > the tank? > > > > > > > > > > > > I have thick Green Hair Algae and Black > > Bottle > > > > > Brush > > > > > > Algae as well as > > > > > > Algae covering the glass. > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks for any info, > > > > > > Aaron > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > === message truncated === > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > ___________________________________________________________ To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. http://uk.security.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15044	From: Chris	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: Filter Question (Cross Post)

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "wizzbaf" <wizzbaf@c...> wrote: > I have a very basic, simple question about filter usage. Used on the > same size/shape tank, would two filters rated for 30 gallon tanks be > more effective, less effective or as effective as one filter rated for > 60 gallon tanks? I can give you an *opinion* on this, but someone will quickly put me in my place! :) I should *think* two 30gal filters would do the job of a 60gal filter. I presume you are talking about an external power filter? (ie remove water from tank, run through filter media, replace water in tank). The only thing I can possibly think of that might be an issue is for a very deep tank (top to bottom) - smaller filters might struggle to lift the water out of the bottom of the tank; however most regular tanks are not more than 2' high. If you are talking about some other kind of filtration, let us know. Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15045	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: Filter Question (Cross Post)

I'll give my 2 cents on the subject :-) For a regular 60 gallon tank (48 3/8 x 12 7/8 x 23 7/8) I would say two filters rated at 30 gallons OR MORE would probally be best. Using only one filter you will have a dead end on the tank. All the junk and poo will collect on that end. You will have to end up using a powerhead or something to move water current in that area. If you use two filters you can change/clean one filter while leaving the other running assuring filteration isn't interupted. Two smaller filters gives you an added advantage of using one on another tank for filteration. Remove one still have one ( TEMPORARILY ). Smalelr filters usually have cheapoer replacement parts,Pads, sponges, etc Get two the same and buy in bulk. save more $ in long run. I myself wouldn't use (2) filters rated at 30 gallons on a 60 gallon tank. I would probally use (2) filters rated at 40 or more gallons. But I like to over filter my stuff. The filteration ( GPH ) is measured on New filters, with no junk build up. A 150 gph filter will loose a few gallons per hour turn over after a few days of bacteria and junk collection. Ok thats my 2 cents worth. <hand extended> waiting for change Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 8/29/2005 8:26:08 AM US Eastern Standard Time, wizzbaf@... writes: I have a very basic, simple question about filter usage. Used on the same size/shape tank, would two filters rated for 30 gallon tanks be more effective, less effective or as effective as one filter rated for 60 gallon tanks? Thank you in advance for anyone's thoughts on the subject. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15046	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: algae chompers (wa - Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?)

The tank that has the Otto also has an albino dwarf bristlenose. One of the other issues with Ottos is that they are very sensitive to water chemistry. A seemingly healthy Otto can die without warning. I have had that happen already. One day he was happily chomping away on algae...then next he was dead. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Chris Sent: Monday, August 29, 2005 12:38 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] algae chompers (wa - Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?) --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: I also have octinoclus (sp?) cats. Otocinclus or Ottocinclus. There was a discussion here about a month back about these fish. I'd seen them a while ago in a local store and thought they looked good, but didn't know anything about them. I didn't buy any, then when I found out their reputation as algae eaters (through this group) I wanted to get a few. The store no longer had them, but another store did. Within 30 minutes there were trails through the algae everywhere (I bought four). For a 3cm fish, they do a mean job on algae. I would say they are as effective as plecostomus, relative to their size. Highly recommended! (But note, experience in the past dictates that some species of fish will eat some species of algae. In the absence of competition, often a different species of algae will grow, which your fish does not eat - so you're just delaying the inevitable algae- takeover... but that's just my experience, and i've never had all three species of fish to tackle the problem: ottos, plecs and bristlenose) Chris. Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15047	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?

All, This topic is now closed. If there are any further posts relating to the topic or the flames it has created, The posts will be deleted and posters put on moderated status. Nim [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15048	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: eggs in my tank

I have eggs in my tank. I do not know who the responsible party is. I discovered them on Saturday morning. There were seven, now there are five left. They are transparent/whitish and a little larger than the size of a pin head. The angelfish have been picking at them but they do not guard them. I have not seen any of my angelfish or keyhole cichlids exhibiting any mating behavior. The eggs are on the back side of a java fern leaf. I did add a fifty cent piece sized rams horn snail to the tank on Thursday. Could they be from this guy? I really don't think that the fern leaf would support the weight of this large snail. I didn't figure they would last this long. I assumed that the fish would eat them. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15049	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: any one with saltwater tanks

i have 4 and i believe paul has some, too. --- Fonchy <fonchy@...> wrote: > Is anyone here with a saltwater tank??? > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15050	From: Justin M.	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: tank dividers for betta splendens

I currently have a male betta, in need of a home after proving to be a poor neighbour for my cory cats. After being unable to find a tank in the < 5 gal. range that could accomodate both a heater and a filter, I went with a 10 gallon kit. The new tank is currently cycling and should be ready in another couple of weeks. I'd like to install a divider on the 10 and keep two bettas. I've been unable to find a tinted/non-see through divider that will keep my fish from constantly eyeballing each other. Does anyone on the list know if such a product exists? Failing that, I'll probably just use fake plants to block off the divider, but I'd rather not go that route if I can find something better. Any ideas? JM

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15051	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: eggs in my tank

Linda, They sound more like Angel eggs as they would be the ones laying on a vertical leaf. Besides, if it was some other fish, the eggs would have gone by now and even if it may not look like that the Angels are protecting them, they still are. Pecking at the eggs is a very normal behavior to clean the eggs and get rid of the unfertilized ones. What colour are they? Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: 29 August 2005 19:39 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] eggs in my tank I have eggs in my tank. I do not know who the responsible party is. I discovered them on Saturday morning. There were seven, now there are five left. They are transparent/whitish and a little larger than the size of a pin head. The angelfish have been picking at them but they do not guard them. I have not seen any of my angelfish or keyhole cichlids exhibiting any mating behavior. The eggs are on the back side of a java fern leaf. I did add a fifty cent piece sized rams horn snail to the tank on Thursday. Could they be from this guy? I really don't think that the fern leaf would support the weight of this large snail. I didn't figure they would last this long. I assumed that the fish would eat them. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15052	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: tank dividers for betta splendens

I saw some dividers at Petco. I am not sure if they are opaque or not. You could also make your own out of glass or plastic. IF you want to get creative, you could make a fake rock divider out of foam covered in Epoxy. I have seen some nice examples of this being used as a back to hide filters and all the cords hanging down the back. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Justin M. Sent: Monday, August 29, 2005 3:15 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] tank dividers for betta splendens I currently have a male betta, in need of a home after proving to be a poor neighbour for my cory cats. After being unable to find a tank in the < 5 gal. range that could accomodate both a heater and a filter, I went with a 10 gallon kit. The new tank is currently cycling and should be ready in another couple of weeks. I'd like to install a divider on the 10 and keep two bettas. I've been unable to find a tinted/non-see through divider that will keep my fish from constantly eyeballing each other. Does anyone on the list know if such a product exists? Failing that, I'll probably just use fake plants to block off the divider, but I'd rather not go that route if I can find something better. Any ideas? JM Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15053	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: tank dividers for betta splendens

JM, Plexi-glass (lucite) plastic sheet 1/16" or 1/8" comes in most opaque colors. A divider can easily be made out of this; just contact your nearest supplier and he'll cut it to size. You will probably have to pay for the full square foot rather than the just approx, 9 3/4" x 12" you'll need, but that's no big deal. You may want to drill a number of rows of 1/16" holes through it to allow for water circulation throughout both sides of the tank. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Justin M." <warbyrd@t...> wrote: > I currently have a male betta, in need of a home after proving to be a > poor neighbour for my cory cats. After being unable to find a tank in the < > 5 gal. range that could accomodate both a heater and a filter, I went with > a 10 gallon kit. The new tank is currently cycling and should be ready in > another couple of weeks. I'd like to install a divider on the 10 and keep > two bettas. I've been unable to find a tinted/non-see through divider that > will keep my fish from constantly eyeballing each other. Does anyone on the > list know if such a product exists? Failing that, I'll probably just use > fake plants to block off the divider, but I'd rather not go that route if I > can find something better. Any ideas? > > > JM

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15054	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists every Monday! Monday August 29, 2005 8:00 pm - 9:00 pm This event repeats every week. The next reminder for this event will be sent in 3 hours, 2 minutes. Event Location: http://chat.thatpetplace.com/chat/chat.aspx Notes: Return to this site every Thursday from 8pm to 10pm and Monday from 8pm to 9pm (Eastern Time) to chat LIVE with one of our on-staff Marine Biologists. Learn about your fish, how to treat common maladies, get recommendations on accessories, food and live animal compatibility, or ask a question that only an expert could answer. MarineBio Chat every Thursday 8pm to 10pm EST, only from That Fish Place, The Original Aquatic Superstore. Attention MarineBio chat participants! The chat server is unavailable until 8pm Eastern Time. If you experience problems while trying to log on to the chat session ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15055	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: eggs in my tank

More eggs! There are some more eggs that I have found. None of the fish seem to be cleaning, guarding, fanning or eating any of the eggs. Here is a picture of them. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15056	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: link to eggs

_Yahoo! Photos - View Photo_ (http://photos.groups.yahoo.com/group/aquaticlife/vwp?.dir=/Linda's&.dnm=eggs.jpg&.src=gr) _http://photos.groups.yahoo.com/group/aquaticlife/vwp?.dir=/Linda%27s&.dnm=egg s.jpg&.src=gr_ (http://photos.groups.yahoo.com/group/aquaticlife/vwp?.dir=/Linda's&.dnm=eggs.jpg&.src=gr) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15057	From: Leslie	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Plastic Plants w/ red spots

These plants are getting red spots on them, and they are all plastic. Water params are perfect and I just shook each plant out for debris with the last pwc. I am worried about this red spotting though. It's flat and not algae looking, rubs off very easily. Would a simple cleaning work or should I be treating for something that is causing this? Also, my blood parrot is paling. He acts normal, but around the evening, he pales. His color during the day is bright with the exception of two recent white spots near his right fin. ? Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15058	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists every Monday! Monday August 29, 2005 8:00 pm - 9:00 pm This event repeats every week. Event Location: http://chat.thatpetplace.com/chat/chat.aspx Notes: Return to this site every Thursday from 8pm to 10pm and Monday from 8pm to 9pm (Eastern Time) to chat LIVE with one of our on-staff Marine Biologists. Learn about your fish, how to treat common maladies, get recommendations on accessories, food and live animal compatibility, or ask a question that only an expert could answer. MarineBio Chat every Thursday 8pm to 10pm EST, only from That Fish Place, The Original Aquatic Superstore. Attention MarineBio chat participants! The chat server is unavailable until 8pm Eastern Time. If you experience problems while trying to log on to the chat session ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15059	From: Chris	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: algae chompers (wa - Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?)

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > The tank that has the Otto also has an albino dwarf bristlenose. One of the > other issues with Ottos is that they are very sensitive to water chemistry. > A seemingly healthy Otto can die without warning. I have had that happen > already. One day he was happily chomping away on algae...then next he was > dead. Thanks for the warning. Actually, for the first time ever I had a bristlenose do that... I haven't replaced him, choosing the ottos instead.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15060	From: Chris	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: eggs in my tank

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@y...> wrote: > Linda, > > They sound more like Angel eggs aww.. I'm going to get all clucky. Angels are one of my most favourite fish, and watching them brood is just awesome! :) you've made me want to go out and set up an angel tank again! (mind you, it's been a long time since i've seen decent quality angels in sydney!! and they are now so expensive!) Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15061	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: eggs in my tank

Chris, How much do you have to pay for angelfish over there? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15062	From: Chris	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: Plastic Plants w/ red spots

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > These plants are getting red spots on them, and they are all plastic. It's hard to tell, but they may still be algae. I would just wash/rub it all off (outside the tank) and keep an eye on it (esp in light of all other parameters being ok, and also because if the white spots indicate disease, you may be wanting to treat the tank for that first). Does the tank get any direct sunlight? > Also, my blood parrot is paling. He acts normal, but around the > evening, he pales. Does he slow down at this time also? By "evening" do you mean 6pm or 10pm? Many cichlids will pale when they sleep - so it's possible he's just settling for the night. > His color during the day is bright And is his behaviour also bright? is he not lethargic / active / inquisitive, etc? > with the > exception of two recent white spots near his right fin. ? Are you able to post a photo? The white spots *may* (but not necessarily) be the onset of whitespot (ie the disease), but at the same time, many cichlids can develop small (but larger than whitespot) whitish growths on their fins - often the pectorals (the side fins) which are harmless but will just stay there for the rest of his life. Keep an eye on whether any more spots develop - either on him or any other fish in the tank. If you can post a photo (yeah, I know - of a moving pectoral fin, right!), that'd be great! Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15063	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: aponogeton crispus

I have an aponogeton crispus that is not doing very well. The literature I have read says that it should do ok in low to moderate light. I purchased this plant as a plant with approx. 10 leaves on it. The substrate is fine to med. pea gravel (home depot pea gravel mixed with fine red flint gravel) amended with laterite. I do 20% water changes every week and add flourish excel. The lights are on for 10 hours /day. pH is 7.5-7.8 and the temp is 76 degrees. The leaves on the plant are turning a reddish brown and are disintegrating. It has been in my tank for over two months now and has only produce one small green leaf. I did move it to an area in the tank where it would receive more light and it had an extensive root system. Any suggestions? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15064	From: Chris	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: eggs in my tank

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > Chris, > How much do you have to pay for angelfish over there? (maybe it's just me, but...) I was used to seeing small angels for about AU$4.50 and medium size to about $9 but now even small angels sell for about $18, and as I said, there are not many about and they aren't that great quality (lots of bent fins!) Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15065	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: eggs in my tank

Is there any demand for them over there? Maybe you should acquire some and breed them?$$$??? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15066	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: algae chompers (wa - Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?)

When I got my Ottos, I bought 2. The other one is doing just fine. I don;t know what caused the other to die at all. He was actually in the tank that remains the cleanest...thanks to the ghost shrimp and the plants. I can accidentally put too much food in there and by the next day there is not a lick of it left on the sand. The shrimp eat it all up and everything is sparking clean. I wish I could put them in my other tanks to help clean, but they get eaten before they can clean hehehe... Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Chris Sent: Monday, August 29, 2005 7:26 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] algae chompers (wa - Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?) --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > The tank that has the Otto also has an albino dwarf bristlenose. One of the > other issues with Ottos is that they are very sensitive to water chemistry. > A seemingly healthy Otto can die without warning. I have had that happen > already. One day he was happily chomping away on algae...then next he was > dead. Thanks for the warning. Actually, for the first time ever I had a bristlenose do that... I haven't replaced him, choosing the ottos instead. Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15067	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: link to eggs

you have a really beautiful tank mine use to look a lot like that then i got cana snails and they ate up all my plant life so until i can put them in their own tank i can only use plastic plants.. grr.. shannon os - View Photo_ (http://photos.groups.yahoo.com/group/aquaticlife/vwp?.dir=/Linda's&.dnm=eggs. jpg&.src=gr) _http://photos.groups.yahoo.com/group/aquaticlife/vwp?.dir=/Linda%27s&.dnm=egg s.jpg&.src=gr_ (http://photos.groups.yahoo.com/group/aquaticlife/vwp [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15068	From: Chris	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: freshwater shrimp as cleaners - was: algae chompers

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > The shrimp eat it all up and everything is > sparking clean. I wish I could put them in my other tanks to help clean, > but they get eaten before they can clean hehehe... Haha... recently a colleague brought some Caradina spp shrimp over for me. I didn't have a tank ready, but quickly put a small one together, however I tried to put the two largest shrimp into my community tank. However, in the tank I have 6 specimens of a locally collected goby. It's common name is the Flat-backed Goby (Mugilogobius platynotus). These guys are only about 1 - 1.5" long, but they have a huge mouth and made short work of the shrimp! The gobies are nothing special to look at, but I've put a photo in my gallery if you're interested. And actually, since then the two dominant males have coloured up some - they have quite nice colours on their dorsal fins, and lose the speckled look. (The four smaller fish retain the speckled pattern in the photo). Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15069	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: tank dividers for betta splendens

Just go to maybe a craft store or a glass place, and you should be able to find some plastic that is thick enough to be stable, maybe 1/4 inch, and you can make your own divider(s) from it You can even find some plastic rails so you can make it removable if you like. If you are going to have a filter on both sides of the tank--you are OK with a solid piece. If not you'll need to drill some holes for water flow between the two sides of the tank. You are probably better off with two filters, small sponge filters. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Justin M. Sent: Monday, August 29, 2005 4:15 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] tank dividers for betta splendens I currently have a male betta, in need of a home after proving to be a poor neighbour for my cory cats. After being unable to find a tank in the < 5 gal. range that could accomodate both a heater and a filter, I went with a 10 gallon kit. The new tank is currently cycling and should be ready in another couple of weeks. I'd like to install a divider on the 10 and keep two bettas. I've been unable to find a tinted/non-see through divider that will keep my fish from constantly eyeballing each other. Does anyone on the list know if such a product exists? Failing that, I'll probably just use fake plants to block off the divider, but I'd rather not go that route if I can find something better. Any ideas? JM

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15070	From: Chris	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: mixed fish

One very large page containing a huge mixture of common and uncommon fish: http://www.sozo.sk/akva/miniatlas.php Fish to note: 1) we recently had a discussion about Chinese Algae Eaters (and I now believe in Australia these are more commonly termed "Sucking Catfish"), Flying Foxes, etc. This page has "Crossocheilus siamensis", which I think might be the Flying Fox, and "Gyrinocheilus aymonieri" which I would call a Sucking Catfish, but I think most here would call the Chinese Algae Eater. 2) There is a photo of snail eggs under "Pomacea bridgesi" 3) There are various angels and discus. 4) Near the bottom are several fish of the genus "Xenotaca" - I believe at least some species in this genus have only females (their eggs are fertilised by males of other species) - I guess the "Xeno" part of the name might have to do with that. 5) There is a Gambusia here (Gambusia krumholsii) which looks nothing like the pest here in Australia (Gambusia holbrooki). The page also shows several African cichlids, some Australian rainbows, and examples of two common freshwater shrimp genuses: Macrobrachium and Caridina.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15071	From: Dom	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: aponogeton crispus

Mostly the aquatic plant do need low PH such as PH6-6.8 in our aquarium. Beside the lighting, you need to inject the CO2 to the plant. I found the PH you mentioned is too high for Aponogeton. Once CO2 injected, the PH will drop below 7. I do have tons of Aponogeton species. Beside growing well with babies. They do flowering. Cheers, Dominic --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > I have an aponogeton crispus that is not doing very well. The literature I > have read says that it should do ok in low to moderate light. > > I purchased this plant as a plant with approx. 10 leaves on it. The > substrate is fine to med. pea gravel (home depot pea gravel mixed with fine red > flint gravel) amended with laterite. I do 20% water changes every week and add > flourish excel. The lights are on for 10 hours /day. pH is 7.5- 7.8 and the > temp is 76 degrees. > > The leaves on the plant are turning a reddish brown and are disintegrating. > It has been in my tank for over two months now and has only produce one > small green leaf. I did move it to an area in the tank where it would receive > more light and it had an extensive root system. > > Any suggestions? > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15072	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: eggs in my tank

That's what I was thinking... Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Monday, August 29, 2005 8:36 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: eggs in my tank Is there any demand for them over there? Maybe you should acquire some and breed them?$$$??? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15073	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: Plastic Plants w/ red spots

It probably is an algae. Since it is on plastic plants, why not bleach them the next time you clean. Be sue to rinse well before returning them to the tank. This may help. Also, when is the last time you changed your aquarium light? If you are fastidious about it, change the bulb (s) every six months, else, at least once a year. Not only red algae, but any algae needs nutrients to grow. You may have too much in the way of nitrates or organics in your tank water. Increase the amount of your water changes to try to reduce the load in the tank. For instance, if you do a 10% water change weekly, make it 15-20% weekly. If you are not doing at least 10% weekly, start doing it now. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Leslie Sent: Monday, August 29, 2005 6:36 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com; naturalaquariumenthusiast@yahoogroups.com; uniquaria@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Plastic Plants w/ red spots These plants are getting red spots on them, and they are all plastic. Water params are perfect and I just shook each plant out for debris with the last pwc. I am worried about this red spotting though. It's flat and not algae looking, rubs off very easily. Would a simple cleaning work or should I be treating for something that is causing this? Also, my blood parrot is paling. He acts normal, but around the evening, he pales. His color during the day is bright with the exception of two recent white spots near his right fin. ? Leslie

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15074	From: Fonchy	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: macro for trade

I have some macro algae for salt waater tanks, anyone for a trade, some of my macro has to go. Armando [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15075	From: paul helms	Date: 8/29/2005
Subject: Re: macro for trade

what do you have and what are you looking for? --- Fonchy <fonchy@...> wrote: > I have some macro algae for salt waater tanks, > anyone for a trade, some of my macro has to go. > > Armando > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15076	From: Fonchy	Date: 8/30/2005
Subject: Re: macro for trade

I have grape caulpera that is full of pods and feather dusters, kenya tree, small fuzzy mushroom and frag of birds nest. What do you have. Armando ----- Original Message ----- From: paul helms To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, August 30, 2005 1:34 AM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] macro for trade what do you have and what are you looking for? --- Fonchy <fonchy@...> wrote: > I have some macro algae for salt waater tanks, > anyone for a trade, some of my macro has to go. > > Armando > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15077	From: DB1RDMAN@WMCONNECT.COM	Date: 8/30/2005
Subject: Digest Number 960 - TANK DIVIDER

From: "Justin M." <warbyrd@...> Subject: tank dividers for betta splendens Go to: thatfishplace.com Go to: Fish Search for: divider You'll find all sizes. The ones I used to buy were a light green color. Looks like the new ones are white. If you have a large lfs in your area, you should have no trouble finding a divider. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15078	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 8/30/2005
Subject: Re: Eco complete

Hmmm... this sounds more along the thought that I am having of using sand and natural colored gravel with the eco complete just to give a bit more interest.... I am thinking that maybe a border of sand and/or the gravel about 1 inch in width and the eco complete in the center ... it would be almost like using the sand/gravel (beginning to lean more towards the gravel) as a picture frame...hmmmm, uh-oh there goes "Hubby" rolling his eyes at me. Thanks for the thought. MM & MP, '73 Tricia, KG6PNC A couple of great sites for fun http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya ----- Original Message ----- From: mike mather To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, August 26, 2005 6:40 PM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Eco complete Tricia, I have two 10 gal tanks,both with Eco in them and one with 1.5-2" of sand on top. Both also have the same lighting. The plants in the sand tank have grown and sent out runners a quarter as much as the tank with out sand. I have heard that sand does not allow enough oxygen to reach the roots, which i assumed meant plants rooting in sand. With roots in the Eco and sand on top, it still seems to hinder the growth of the plants. I would try the Takashi Amano method of dividing the two substrates into separate sections. The front 1/3 completely sand and the back 2/3's all Eco with the plants. You use plastic,wood or cardboard as a divider and then lift it out after you have laid the substrate down. Then you lay drift wood or rock down to cover the line between the two substrates,for aesthetics. I have seen pictures of these tanks of his in Tropical Fish Hobbyist Magazine and they look awesome! Just some things I've learned. Hope to have helped you some, Mike --- Tricia Wilkerson <trycya@...> wrote: > The sand is more for looks and for the corries to > play in than to help as a substrate. Thanks for the > info, now I have a starting place and can go from > there. > MM & MP, '73 > Tricia, KG6PNC > > A couple of great sites for fun > > http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya > > http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Eric Roberts > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Thursday, August 25, 2005 1:49 PM > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Eco complete > > > at least 4-5 of them. I was told to get 2 bags of > the 20 lbs of the sand > for my 20 gallon. I am planning on getting 2 > 50lbs bags of it when I change > over to the eco-complete gravel from my standard > aquarium gravel. The sand > would prolly just end up as a substrate. The > eco-complete is a multi-grade > substrate, so adding sand would not help. > > Blessings, > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Tricia Wilkerson > Sent: Thursday, August 25, 2005 2:24 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Eco complete > > > I am getting ready to set up a new tank. It will > be a planted tank (fresh > water). I am trying to figure out how many of the > 20 lb bags of eco > complete planted tank sub. I will need for a 55 > gal. tank. I have not > decide yet if I am going to do a top layer of sand > or not yet, but it is a > possibility for my corries > Thanks > MM & MP, '73 > Tricia, KG6PNC > > A couple of great sites for fun > > http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya > > http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it > when replying, thanks. > 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> > 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" > <- > <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , > .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on > the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an > email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it > when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the > TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > > > > SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an > email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15079	From: Justin M.	Date: 8/30/2005
Subject: Re: Digest Number 960 - TANK DIVIDER

At 12:40 PM 30/08/2005 -0400, you wrote: >From: "Justin M." <warbyrd@...> >Subject: tank dividers for betta splendens > >Go to: thatfishplace.com > >Go to: Fish > >Search for: divider > >You'll find all sizes. The ones I used to buy were a light green color. >Looks like the new ones are white. If you have a large lfs in your area, you >should have no trouble finding a divider. Thanks Birdman, and thanks as well to everyone else who responded. Thatfishplace seems to just have the basic Penn-Plax or Lee's clear dividers, which is all I've been able to find in my local stores. JM

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15080	From: paul helms	Date: 8/30/2005
Subject: Re: macro for trade

mostly mushrooms and polyps --- Fonchy <fonchy@...> wrote: > I have grape caulpera that is full of pods and > feather dusters, kenya tree, small fuzzy mushroom > and frag of birds nest. What do you have. > > Armando > ----- Original Message ----- > From: paul helms > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Tuesday, August 30, 2005 1:34 AM > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] macro for trade > > > what do you have and what are you looking for? > > > --- Fonchy <fonchy@...> wrote: > > > I have some macro algae for salt waater tanks, > > anyone for a trade, some of my macro has to go. > > > > Armando > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home > page > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it > when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the > TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an > email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15081	From: mike mather	Date: 8/30/2005
Subject: Re: Eco complete

Now that sounds like a pretty unique idea! I thank that would look cool. Mike --- Tricia Wilkerson <trycya@...> wrote: > Hmmm... this sounds more along the thought that I am > having of using sand and natural colored gravel with > the eco complete just to give a bit more > interest.... I am thinking that maybe a border of > sand and/or the gravel about 1 inch in width and the > eco complete in the center ... it would be almost > like using the sand/gravel (beginning to lean more > towards the gravel) as a picture frame...hmmmm, > uh-oh there goes "Hubby" rolling his eyes at me. > Thanks for the thought. > MM & MP, '73 > Tricia, KG6PNC > > A couple of great sites for fun > > http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya > > http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: mike mather > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Friday, August 26, 2005 6:40 PM > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Eco complete > > > Tricia, I have two 10 gal tanks,both with Eco in > them > and one with 1.5-2" of sand on top. Both also have > the > same lighting. The plants in the sand tank have > grown > and sent out runners a quarter as much as the tank > with out sand. I have heard that sand does not > allow > enough oxygen to reach the roots, which i assumed > meant plants rooting in sand. With roots in the > Eco > and sand on top, it still seems to hinder the > growth > of the plants. > > > I would try the Takashi Amano method of dividing > the > two substrates into separate sections. The front > 1/3 > completely sand and the back 2/3's all Eco with > the > plants. You use plastic,wood or cardboard as a > divider > and then lift it out after you have laid the > substrate > down. Then you lay drift wood or rock down to > cover > the line between the two substrates,for > aesthetics. I > have seen pictures of these tanks of his in > Tropical > Fish Hobbyist Magazine and they look awesome! > Just > some things I've learned. Hope to have helped you > some, Mike > --- Tricia Wilkerson <trycya@...> wrote: > > > The sand is more for looks and for the corries > to > > play in than to help as a substrate. Thanks for > the > > info, now I have a starting place and can go > from > > there. > > MM & MP, '73 > > Tricia, KG6PNC > > > > A couple of great sites for fun > > > > > http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya > > > > http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Eric Roberts > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Sent: Thursday, August 25, 2005 1:49 PM > > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Eco complete > > > > > > at least 4-5 of them. I was told to get 2 > bags of > > the 20 lbs of the sand > > for my 20 gallon. I am planning on getting 2 > > 50lbs bags of it when I change > > over to the eco-complete gravel from my > standard > > aquarium gravel. The sand > > would prolly just end up as a substrate. The > > eco-complete is a multi-grade > > substrate, so adding sand would not help. > > > > Blessings, > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Tricia Wilkerson > > Sent: Thursday, August 25, 2005 2:24 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Eco complete > > > > > > I am getting ready to set up a new tank. It > will > > be a planted tank (fresh > > water). I am trying to figure out how many of > the > > 20 lb bags of eco > > complete planted tank sub. I will need for a > 55 > > gal. tank. I have not > > decide yet if I am going to do a top layer of > sand > > or not yet, but it is a > > possibility for my corries > > Thanks > > MM & MP, '73 > > Tricia, KG6PNC > > > > A couple of great sites for fun > > > > > http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya > > > > http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below > it > > when replying, thanks. > > 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> > > 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all > TEXT > > that is NOT important to > > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the > original > > message MODIFY the SUBJECT > > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" > > <- > > <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , > > .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > > matter. > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " > on > > the web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an > > email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to > the > > Yahoo! Terms of Service > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > === message truncated === ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15082	From: thesydmonster	Date: 8/30/2005
Subject: algae chompers (wa - Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?)

I have been told that otos tend to die off within the first month in a new tank due to starvation. Even though they are eating your algae, it may be too little too late. You should ask your LFS how long they have been there (hopefully at least 2 weeks), what they are eating, etc. They also do better in well established tanks. If the tank you put him in was super clean, there may not have been enough food for him. They do not eat all types of algae. I also supplement my algae eaters (I have otos, snails, and an albino bristlenose) with fresh vegetables and spirulina flakes and algae wafers. They are great workers, though, I love them! Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > When I got my Ottos, I bought 2. The other one is doing just fine. I don;t > know what caused the other to die at all. He was actually in the tank that > remains the cleanest...thanks to the ghost shrimp and the plants. I can > accidentally put too much food in there and by the next day there is not a > lick of it left on the sand. The shrimp eat it all up and everything is > sparking clean. I wish I could put them in my other tanks to help clean, > but they get eaten before they can clean hehehe... > > Eric > > > _____ >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15083	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 8/30/2005
Subject: Re: aponogeton crispus

Linda, You probably need more light. Everything I saw in a quick search refers to moderate to high light for this plant. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Monday, August 29, 2005 9:33 PM To: uniaquaria@yahoogroups.com; AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com; mnaquarium@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] aponogeton crispus I have an aponogeton crispus that is not doing very well. The literature I have read says that it should do ok in low to moderate light. I purchased this plant as a plant with approx. 10 leaves on it. The substrate is fine to med. pea gravel (home depot pea gravel mixed with fine red flint gravel) amended with laterite. I do 20% water changes every week and add flourish excel. The lights are on for 10 hours /day. pH is 7.5-7.8 and the temp is 76 degrees. The leaves on the plant are turning a reddish brown and are disintegrating. It has been in my tank for over two months now and has only produce one small green leaf. I did move it to an area in the tank where it would receive more light and it had an extensive root system. Any suggestions? Linda

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15084	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/30/2005
Subject: San Francisco Aquarium Society (SFAS), 9/2/2005, 7:15 pm

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife San Francisco Aquarium Society (SFAS) Friday September 2, 2005 7:15 pm - 9:15 pm This event repeats on the first Friday of every month. Event Location: first Friday of each month at first Friday of each month at San Francisco State University Notes: http://www.sfaquarium.org/about.html Meetings are free and open to everyone. If you've enjoyed them, we urge you to become a member. You'll become a welcome part of our community, and your dues help defray the costs of speakers and other special things that show up at every meeting. We meet the first Friday of each month at The San Francisco State University. (We used to meet the first Friday of each month at The Academy of Sciences in San Francisco's Golden Gate Park.) Founded in 1923, the San Francisco Aquarium Society is regarded as one of the nation's esteemed aquarium hobbyi ADVERTISEMENT ZIP code where you park at night. Do you currently have auto insurance? Yes No Have you had a U.S driver's license for more than 3 years? Yes No Has any driver in your household had 2 or more accidents or moving violations in the last 3 years? Yes No Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15085	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 8/30/2005
Subject: Re: San Francisco Aquarium Society (SFAS), 9/2/2005, 7:15 pm

This particular meeting is the Annual Mega Auction... -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: 31 Aug 2005 02:10:26 -0000 Subject: [AquaticLife] San Francisco Aquarium Society (SFAS), 9/2/2005, 7:15 pm Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. My Groups | AquaticLife Main Page Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife San Francisco Aquarium Society (SFAS) Friday September 2, 2005 7:15 pm - 9:15 pm This event repeats on the first Friday of every month. Event Location: first Friday of each month at first Friday of each month at San Francisco State University Notes: http://www.sfaquarium.org/about.html Meetings are free and open to everyone. If you've enjoyed them, we urge you to become a member. You'll become a welcome part of our community, and your dues help defray the costs of speakers and other special things that show up at every meeting. We meet the first Friday of each month at The San Francisco State University. (We used to meet the first Friday of each month at The Academy of Sciences in San Francisco's Golden Gate Park.) Founded in 1923, the San Francisco Aquarium Society is regarded as one of the nation's esteemed aquarium hobbyi ADVERTISEMENT ZIP code where you park at night. Do you currently have auto insurance? Yes No Have you had a U.S driver's license for more than 3 years? Yes No Has any driver in your household had 2 or more accidents or moving violations in the last 3 years? Yes No Copyright © 2005 Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15086	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/30/2005
Subject: The Jersey Shore Aquarium Society (JSAS), 9/12/2005, 8:00 pm

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife The Jersey Shore Aquarium Society (JSAS) Monday September 12, 2005 8:00 pm - 9:00 pm This event repeats on the second Monday of every month. The next reminder for this event will be sent in 11 days, 4 minutes. Event Location: Knights of Columbus Hall on Rt. 537 (70 East Main Street) in Freehold, New Jersey Notes: http://www.jerseyshoreas.org/information.htm The Jersey Shore Aquarium Society meets at 8:00pm on the second Monday of every month (except August) at the Knights of Columbus Hall on Rt. 537 (70 East Main Street) in Freehold, New Jersey. Each meeting typically features an interesting slide, movie or video presentation of tropical fish, and aquarist related topics. Our presenters are often professionals in their respective fields or experienced hobbyists. ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15087	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/30/2005
Subject: Re: algae chompers (wa - Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?)

I bought five otos and only one of mine died. The other four are fat and happy. The three siamese algae eaters I bought last Thursday are doing an awesome job cleaning the black bristle algae in the tank as well as some of the green hair algae. I do see the oto's eating the zucinni and cucumbers that I add to the tank. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15088	From: Leslie	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: BP ate the shark

I woke up to find my rainbow shark sticking out of my blood parrots mouth. The head was very much gone by the time I got there. Was my blood parrot absolutely starved? They have been together for long enough that I thought we were in the clear. Am I underfeeding or is this simply the nature of the beast? I did feed and they ate very quickly. =( Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15089	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: EGGS IN MY TANK

I figured out who has been laying eggs in my tank. It is the large ramshorn snail. So far there are three clutches of eggs in the past four days. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15090	From: Leslie	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Danios back into tank?

One more question today: My danios are still very red on the fins, all fins. They are acting fine, eating, etc... The mouth fungus or whatever that bacteria strain was is no longer present on either danio. Is it safe to put them back into the main tank? I worry about the redness but it isn't going away. Could it just be stress? Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15091	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Re: Danios back into tank?

I usually keep fish in Qt at least 2 weeks after the last symptoms dissapear but that might be a little anal on my part. Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 8/31/2005 10:13:39 AM US Eastern Standard Time, amjmail@... writes: One more question today: My danios are still very red on the fins, all fins. They are acting fine, eating, etc... The mouth fungus or whatever that bacteria strain was is no longer present on either danio. Is it safe to put them back into the main tank? I worry about the redness but it isn't going away. Could it just be stress? Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15092	From: T	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Re: EGGS IN MY TANK

Hey Linda, Funny that you said this...My Ramshorn did the same thing. I have a 2 tanks, the smller one just had a Betta who passed not too long ago. The Ramshorn was in there and he/she just laid 2 bundles of Eggs as well. I am waiting/watching for them to hatch. I heard it can take close to 40 days. It has been about 3 weeks so far. ZGood Luck - Terry-- - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > I figured out who has been laying eggs in my tank. It is the large ramshorn > snail. So far there are three clutches of eggs in the past four days. > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15093	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Re: EGGS IN MY TANK

The egg clutches should look like mucus then...or a big glob of snot hope thats not to graphic. Eggs individually layed shouldn't be snails. Or my ramshorns and pond snails are doing it wrong :-) Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 8/31/2005 9:44:44 AM US Eastern Standard Time, Crazy4fids@... writes: I figured out who has been laying eggs in my tank. It is the large ramshorn snail. So far there are three clutches of eggs in the past four days. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15094	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Re: EGGS IN MY TANK

i think i had both sterile and non sterile eggs and some would hatch and some wouldnt i finally got tired of them and the mess they make as i am relaly picky about the appearace of my aquarium... and when one of my snails died i think the main producer of eggs i have got way less and i am not complianing.. i coudl enver get any of them to grow as i have a zebra botia that i love but i was hoping he woudlnt find every single darn baby snail but he does cept the ones in the filter lol shannon I figured out who has been laying eggs in my tank. It is the large ramshorn snail. So far there are three clutches of eggs in the past four days. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15095	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Re: EGGS IN MY TANK

my snail lady told me 10 days i belive maybe that is for a different breed.. cuase i know i had some clutches there for like months.. and nothing happened.. shannon Hey Linda, Funny that you said this...My Ramshorn did the same thing. I have a 2 tanks, the smller one just had a Betta who passed not too long ago. The Ramshorn was in there and he/she just laid 2 bundles of Eggs as well. I am waiting/watching for them to hatch. I heard it can take close to 40 days. It has been about 3 weeks so far. ZGood Luck - Terry-- [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15096	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Re: EGGS IN MY TANK

Nope. They are individual eggs in a gooey mucus. I saw he/she lay a bunch of them yesterday. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15097	From: Chris	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Re: BP ate the shark

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > I woke up to find my rainbow shark sticking out of my blood parrots > mouth. The head was very much gone by the time I got there. > Was my blood parrot absolutely starved? Is it possible that the shark died first and then the blood parrot came along for a nibble? I've seen your pics of the blood parrots, and they're very large - certainly when breeding they might aggressively ward off other fish. How large was the shark? I suppose you can't rule out the possibility that the blood parrot was wanting a live feed. Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15098	From: Leslie	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Re: BP ate the shark

Chris, I don't think the shark died prior to his beheading. He's been perfectly healthy and the water params are perfect, disease free, etc... The shark was about 4 inches long, so quite a bit was still sticking out of the mouth when I saw him. (NOT a great "good morning" as I usually get from this fish.) One of my BPs died so I don't know about the mating thing. Although when I went to get water in the tube for testing, he kept coming at me and he normally doesn't do that. At least he usually realizes this isn't food and quits, he didn't quit this time. The other fish are all acting freaked out too. The small black skirt is in hiding and so is my huge firemouth. I think this blood parrot is on some sort of frenzy and it has me a bit worried. He had overturned ALL the caves in the tank to get to the shark! I think that's pretty wild. I have a small catfish that can fit into his mouth if he tried hard enough. The large catfish is in a corner hovering at an awkward angle with the small one hovering just over him. Then my blood parrot is cruising around like he owns the place and no one else is allowed to show their existence. This sucks. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Chris Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2005 6:14 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: BP ate the shark --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > I woke up to find my rainbow shark sticking out of my blood parrots > mouth. The head was very much gone by the time I got there. > Was my blood parrot absolutely starved? Is it possible that the shark died first and then the blood parrot came along for a nibble? I've seen your pics of the blood parrots, and they're very large - certainly when breeding they might aggressively ward off other fish. How large was the shark? I suppose you can't rule out the possibility that the blood parrot was wanting a live feed. Chris. Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15099	From: Chris	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Re: Danios back into tank?

No, I agree. Especially with the fact they have red fins. This can be an indication of bacterial disease. At any rate, keeping them separate for longer can do no harm. By putting them in your tank you run the risk of (re-)infecting your other fish, and quite possibly losing some if they are not as robust as the danios. Chris. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, FortWayneFish@a... wrote: > I usually keep fish in Qt at least 2 weeks after the last symptoms dissapear > but that might be a little anal on my part.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15100	From: Chris	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Re: BP ate the shark

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > Chris, > > I think this blood parrot is on > some sort of frenzy This does sound bad. How long ago did the other parrot die? S/he could be lamenting the loss. The aggressive behaviour still does sound hormonal to me though - perhaps s/he feels like breeding, and in the absence of his/her mate s/he's going crazy. Ordinarily catfish should get left alone as they are typically spiny, but given the size difference and level of aggression, that might not count for much here. The fact that even the firemouth doesn't feel safe is a worry. I don't suppose you have a temporary tank you can transfer either the parrot, or the other fish to? At least the two fish which are hovering in the corner? It sounds like they are under alot of stress. I'd also suggest double checking the water conditions - pH, ammonia - although you've already done that. If it is something in the water (including hormones), perhaps a 40-50% water change is in order? (depending also on how much/how recently you changed the water). I'd probably turn the tank lights off also until s/he calms down. Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15101	From: Aaron M.	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Re: Hydogen Peroxide cure for Algae?

Thanks Nim. Aaron btw - I did as you said and it worked, thanks again Nimish Mathur <nimmat4@...> wrote: All, This topic is now closed. If there are any further posts relating to the topic or the flames it has created, The posts will be deleted and posters put on moderated status. Nim [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife stop by and see ~ membership is free! <º((((><¸..·´¯`·., . .·´¯`·.. <º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((>< ¸.·´¯`·.¸. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15102	From: Aaron M.	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Re: link to eggs

Hi Linda, The links did not work for me, however - I did post an edited (for size) version of the picture onto the groups home page. I hope it is ok with you, if not please let me know. Thanks, Aaron Crazy4fids@... wrote: _Yahoo! Photos - View Photo_ (http://photos.groups.yahoo.com/group/aquaticlife/vwp?.dir=/Linda's&.dnm=eggs.jpg&.src=gr) _http://photos.groups.yahoo.com/group/aquaticlife/vwp?.dir=/Linda%27s&.dnm=egg s.jpg&.src=gr_ (http://photos.groups.yahoo.com/group/aquaticlife/vwp?.dir=/Linda's&.dnm=eggs.jpg&.src=gr) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Fish ponds --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife stop by and see ~ membership is free! <º((((><¸..·´¯`·., . .·´¯`·.. <º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((>< ¸.·´¯`·.¸. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15103	From: Aaron M.	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Candiru of the Amazon (was - [AquaticLife] Reading)

Hi, I do not really read much outside of the group and related websites, I do Watch ALOT of TV now that I have the'Dish" system w/ the DVR. 1 great program I recorded recently was the 'Amazon Abyss", it was a lot of underwater exploration (ichythology?) and showed all kinds of Aquatic Life including the vicious Candiru CatFish as well as a previously undiscovered catfish that lives in mud and looks like a small red worm. There is anther catfish that is very fierce scavenger that looks like a shark. Aaron --------------------------- Chris wrote: We recently bought our 2 year old a fantastic book by Dorling Kindersly (DK) called "Animal". It's a single volume animal encyclopaedia with a nice section on fish. I have never found a single book with so many interesting fish facts that I didn't have any awareness of whatsoever. One that just blew me away was the Candiru of the Amazon - so much so that I suggested it as an article for a local radio station's "Science" segment. They found it sufficiently out of the ordinary to invite me in to record an interview on it... From the miniature end of the catfish scale we'll round out the story with a piece on catfish noodling. Candiru: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Candiru Chris. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > I am a > bit curious to find what people here are reading offline. got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife stop by and see ~ membership is free! <º((((><¸..·´¯`·., . .·´¯`·.. <º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((>< ¸.·´¯`·.¸. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15104	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Silicon Valley Aquarium Society (SVAS) Monthly Meeting, 9/3/2005, 6

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife Silicon Valley Aquarium Society (SVAS) Monthly Meeting Saturday September 3, 2005 6:30 pm - 9:30 pm This event repeats on the first Saturday of every month. Event Location: Round Table Pizza, 4302 Moorpark Ave., San Jose CA Street: 4302 Moorpark Ave. City, State, Zip: San Jose CA 95129-2030 Notes: Silicon Valley Aquarium Society (SVAS) Monthly Meeting http://www.svas.info/ http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SiliconValleyAquariumSociety/ 6:30 pm - 9:30 pm This event repeats on the first Saturday of every month. Event Location: Round Table Pizza, 4302 Moorpark Ave., San Jose ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15105	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Re: Candiru of the Amazon (was - [AquaticLife] Reading)

Hey Aaron. I caught that show the other day. As far as the candiru being vicious, to me it is terrifying! I mean a spiked fish swimming up your urethra!!! Let the nightmares begin. Mike -----Original Message----- From: Aaron M. <anonymous122899@...> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 18:17:59 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Candiru of the Amazon (was - [AquaticLife] Reading) Hi, I do not really read much outside of the group and related websites, I do Watch ALOT of TV now that I have the'Dish" system w/ the DVR. 1 great program I recorded recently was the 'Amazon Abyss", it was a lot of underwater exploration (ichythology?) and showed all kinds of Aquatic Life including the vicious Candiru CatFish as well as a previously undiscovered catfish that lives in mud and looks like a small red worm. There is anther catfish that is very fierce scavenger that looks like a shark. Aaron [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15106	From: Chris	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Re: Candiru of the Amazon (was - [AquaticLife] Reading)

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Deenerz@a... wrote: > Hey Aaron. > I caught that show the other day. As far as the candiru being vicious, to me it is terrifying! > I mean a spiked fish swimming up your urethra!!! > > Let the nightmares begin. First - if you can give me any more info on that show, that'd be great! [disturbing discussion warning - the following *may* disturb some] Aparently to the Western world, that particular behaviour of the Candiru was more or less a myth since it learned about the fish in the early 1900s. However, in 1997 a 23 year old male was operated on by Dr Anoad Samar of the Casos Clínicos, Brazil. X-rays confirmed the presence of a fish which had swum up the man's urethra. When the fish could go no further it did a 90 degree turn and ate through tissue until it entered the scrotal sac. The man was in agony, and could not urinate, for three days before seeking medical help. He insists he was standing in theigh-deep water, urinating into the river and that the fish swam up the urine stream. The only reason the fish was able to be removed without cutting open the man's penis is because the fish had died. As a result, the fish's barbs - which until then had kept it from being pulled out - became lax. The fish was submitted to an Amazonian research institute. All this info can be found at the wikipedia entry http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Candiru - and in the articles which have links there. Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15107	From: wendie	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Re: Candiru of the Amazon (was - [AquaticLife] Reading)

I can remember reading about that years and years ago... I mean a good 50 years ago. Wendie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Chris Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2005 8:56 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Candiru of the Amazon (was - [AquaticLife] Reading) --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Deenerz@a... wrote: > Hey Aaron. > I caught that show the other day. As far as the candiru being vicious, to me it is terrifying! > I mean a spiked fish swimming up your urethra!!! > > Let the nightmares begin. First - if you can give me any more info on that show, that'd be great! [disturbing discussion warning - the following *may* disturb some] Aparently to the Western world, that particular behaviour of the Candiru was more or less a myth since it learned about the fish in the early 1900s. However, in 1997 a 23 year old male was operated on by Dr Anoad Samar of the Casos Clínicos, Brazil. X-rays confirmed the presence of a fish which had swum up the man's urethra. When the fish could go no further it did a 90 degree turn and ate through tissue until it entered the scrotal sac. The man was in agony, and could not urinate, for three days before seeking medical help. He insists he was standing in theigh-deep water, urinating into the river and that the fish swam up the urine stream. The only reason the fish was able to be removed without cutting open the man's penis is because the fish had died. As a result, the fish's barbs - which until then had kept it from being pulled out - became lax. The fish was submitted to an Amazonian research institute. All this info can be found at the wikipedia entry http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Candiru - and in the articles which have links there. Chris. Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15108	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Re: Candiru of the Amazon (was - [AquaticLife] Reading)

In a message dated 8/31/2005 9:57:00 PM Eastern Standard Time, youcantryreachingme@... writes: <<<However, in 1997 a 23 year old male was operated on by Dr Anoad Samar of the Casos Clínicos, Brazil. X-rays confirmed the presence of a fish which had swum up the man's urethra. When the fish could go no further it did a 90 degree turn and ate through tissue until it entered the scrotal sac.>>> If you don't mind my saying..... holy crap! =O Vicky, who's happy to pee behind a tree..... ;-) Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Call (301) 402-8625 or write: hgparker@... =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: FCR-Cancer-Support@yahoogroups.com Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@... 919-513-1467, Dr London @ calondon@... 530-754-5711 _AND_ Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15109	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Re: Candiru of the Amazon (was - [AquaticLife] Reading)

I think I have seen segments on this fish on animal planet. Animals of nightmares or something like that. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15110	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Re: Candiru of the Amazon (was - [AquaticLife] Reading)

In a message dated 8/31/2005 8:18:20 P.M. Central Standard Time, anonymous122899@... writes: 1 great program I recorded recently was the 'Amazon Abyss", it was a lot of underwater exploration (ichythology?) and showed all kinds of Aquatic Life including the vicious Candiru CatFish as well as a previously undiscovered catfish that lives in mud and looks like a small red worm. There is anther catfish that is very fierce scavenger that looks like a shark We have cable TV and I wish I could see more stuff on amazon aquatics. You frequently see programs on the ocean, but hardly see anything on african rift lakes or amazon basin water life. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15111	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Re: Candiru of the Amazon (was - [AquaticLife] Reading)

Linda, There is a movie "jewel of the rift" about rift lake fish/animals. I think it is a National Geographic video. I have not seen it but am looking for it. From what from what I have heard they do not identify the fish so much as show them and describe their behavior. Although not Amazon basin fish there is an excellent DVD about Crater lake cichlids, I believe it is Crater lake cichlids of Nicaragua. I cannot recall the author's name, he was a speaker at the ACA convention in Fort Worth Texas this year. I believe there is a South American DVD/video but I cannot recall the name. Mike There is also The Cichlids of Lake Malawi. CD-ROM by Ad Konings, http://www.cichlidpress.com/ -----Original Message----- From: Crazy4fids@... To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 22:08:33 EDT Subject: Re: Candiru of the Amazon (was - [AquaticLife] Reading) We have cable TV and I wish I could see more stuff on amazon aquatics. You frequently see programs on the ocean, but hardly see anything on african rift lakes or amazon basin water life. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15112	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Re: Candiru of the Amazon (was - [AquaticLife] Reading)

Thanks Mike! I will check into these. Maybe I can find them online somewerhere. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15113	From: Chris	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Re: Candiru of the Amazon (was - [AquaticLife] Reading)

Amazon Abyss: http://www.bbc.co.uk/sn/tvradio/programmes/amazon/creatures.shtml

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15114	From: Aaron M.	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: "Amazon Abyss" (was - Re: Candiru of the Amazon)

If I recall correctly, It was filmed 6/11/04 according to the digital timestamp on the handheld cameras. I cannot remember when it aired here or what channel, but it was this month and probably TLC or its parent Discovery ---------- First - if you can give me any more info on that show, that'd be great! got Fish? ~ do you Yahoo? ~ I've got a group for you! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife stop by and see ~ membership is free! <º((((><¸..·´¯`·., . .·´¯`·.. <º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((>< ¸.·´¯`·.¸. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15115	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 8/31/2005
Subject: Re: BP ate the shark

Sounds like you might have a female BP who has laid eggs. The shark invaded the territory and possibly ate some or all of them...If you stick your hand in the water and she pecks at you, flares or attempt to bite at you I would guess she has eggs someplace.. The behavior of cichlids is fascinating isn't it. Or again she/he might just be having one of those moods where everyone should watch out Can we say PMS :-) rob In a message dated 8/31/2005 6:31:07 PM US Eastern Standard Time, amjmail@... writes: Chris, I don't think the shark died prior to his beheading. He's been Perfectly healthy and the water prams are perfect, disease free, etc. The shark was about 4 inches long, so quite a bit was still sticking out Of the mouth when I saw him. (NOT a great "good morning" as I usually Get from this fish.) One of my BPs died so I don't know about the mating thing. Although when I went to get water in the tube for testing, he kept coming at me and he normally doesn't do that. At least he usually realizes this isn't food and quits, he didn't quit this time. The other fish are all acting freaked out too. The small black skirt is in hiding and so is my huge firemouth. I think this blood parrot is on some sort of frenzy and it has me a bit worried. He had overturned ALL the caves in the tank to get to the shark! I think that's pretty wild. I have a small catfish that can fit into his mouth if he tried hard enough. The large catfish is in a corner hovering at an awkward angle with the small one hovering just over him. Then my blood parrot is cruising around like he owns the place and no one else is allowed to show their existence. This sucks. Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15116	From: Chris	Date: 9/1/2005
Subject: Re: BP ate the shark

ouch

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15117	From: Leslie	Date: 9/1/2005
Subject: Re: BP ate the shark

That would make sense. While I haven't seen any eggs, s/he has started a major digging spree. S/he didn't used to dig this much and now it is constant. It really is amazing how you can see such a difference in their tempermant and behavior. This fish is so lovey and sweet usually. Lol I did have the PMS thought cross my mind. This house is full of hormones already, just what we need is a hormonal fish. Everyone looks alive and well this morning. The little cat is sure hiding (I rebuilt 2 out of 3 caves.) I think I will move my small catfish to the 6 gallon wich is about to house some nice small community fish. Nobody should be eating eachother in this one. (At least I hope not, it's on the buffet in the dining room. Not good dinner talk if the fish are eating eachother.) Leslie Have kids stuff? Check out Zainy Zebra Consignment! Based in Cabot, AR www.ZainyZebra.com Live in or near Cabot? Join the Cabot Garage Sale! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/CabotgarageSale/ Live in Little Rock? Little Rock Garage Sale!http://groups.yahoo.com/group/LRgarageSale/ -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of FortWayneFish@... Sent: Thursday, September 01, 2005 12:25 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: BP ate the shark Sounds like you might have a female BP who has laid eggs. The shark invaded the territory and possibly ate some or all of them...If you stick your hand in the water and she pecks at you, flares or attempt to bite at you I would guess she has eggs someplace.. The behavior of cichlids is fascinating isn't it. Or again she/he might just be having one of those moods where everyone should watch out Can we say PMS :-) rob In a message dated 8/31/2005 6:31:07 PM US Eastern Standard Time, amjmail@... writes: Chris, I don't think the shark died prior to his beheading. He's been Perfectly healthy and the water prams are perfect, disease free, etc. The shark was about 4 inches long, so quite a bit was still sticking out Of the mouth when I saw him. (NOT a great "good morning" as I usually Get from this fish.) One of my BPs died so I don't know about the mating thing. Although when I went to get water in the tube for testing, he kept coming at me and he normally doesn't do that. At least he usually realizes this isn't food and quits, he didn't quit this time. The other fish are all acting freaked out too. The small black skirt is in hiding and so is my huge firemouth. I think this blood parrot is on some sort of frenzy and it has me a bit worried. He had overturned ALL the caves in the tank to get to the shark! I think that's pretty wild. I have a small catfish that can fit into his mouth if he tried hard enough. The large catfish is in a corner hovering at an awkward angle with the small one hovering just over him. Then my blood parrot is cruising around like he owns the place and no one else is allowed to show their existence. This sucks. Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15118	From: Leslie	Date: 9/1/2005
Subject: Re: BP ate the shark

Ouch? I didn't see what you were responding to. Did I say something rude or was that a literal ouch? =) Leslie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Chris Sent: Thursday, September 01, 2005 2:28 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: BP ate the shark ouch

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15119	From: kb1dva	Date: 9/1/2005
Subject: fish behaving badly

Either one of my Oscars or my Pacu took a bite out of the pikes mouth! And there's a flap of it hanging is there anything I can do to help him, or is it best left alone. Also my smallest blood parrot seems to be shy about going after food I think she's betting bullied, how do I fix that Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15120	From: Fonchy	Date: 9/1/2005
Subject: Blue hippo with cloudy eye

I woke up this morning and I saw a big piece of my green cap broken and then I saw the left eye of my blue hippo tang all cloudy, i got 2 conclussions: 1. he hit the coral, broke it and scratch his eye or, 2. he has some kind of discease. Should I take him out or leave him there, he is not acting abnormal. Armando [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15121	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 9/1/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists every Thursday Thursday September 1, 2005 8:00 pm - 10:00 pm This event repeats every week. The next reminder for this event will be sent in 3 hours, 3 minutes. Event Location: http://chat.thatpetplace.com/chat/chat.aspx Notes: Return to this site every Thursday from 8pm to 10pm and Monday from 8pm to 9pm (Eastern Time) to chat LIVE with one of our on-staff Marine Biologists. Learn about your fish, how to treat common maladies, get recommendations on accessories, food and live animal compatibility, or ask a question that only an expert could answer. MarineBio Chat every Thursday 8pm to 10pm EST, only from That Fish Place, The Original Aquatic Superstore. Attention MarineBio chat participants! The chat server is unavailable until 8pm Eastern Time. If you experience problems while trying to log on to the chat session ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15122	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 9/1/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists every Thursday Thursday September 1, 2005 8:00 pm - 10:00 pm This event repeats every week. Event Location: http://chat.thatpetplace.com/chat/chat.aspx Notes: Return to this site every Thursday from 8pm to 10pm and Monday from 8pm to 9pm (Eastern Time) to chat LIVE with one of our on-staff Marine Biologists. Learn about your fish, how to treat common maladies, get recommendations on accessories, food and live animal compatibility, or ask a question that only an expert could answer. MarineBio Chat every Thursday 8pm to 10pm EST, only from That Fish Place, The Original Aquatic Superstore. Attention MarineBio chat participants! The chat server is unavailable until 8pm Eastern Time. If you experience problems while trying to log on to the chat session ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15123	From: Leslie	Date: 9/1/2005
Subject: Expecting a bacterial bloom

A friend brought some fish to trade today. She took one chichlid, the lone inhabitor of the tank, and gave me 5 small fish which are now in the same tank the 1 fish was in. So I'm thinking I can expect a bacterial bloom. Is this about right? And if this does happen, is there anything I should do before or during? I don't have anywhere else to put the fish. I tried to stick a larger (2.5") into the 75 but the blood parrot made an instant b-line for the poor guy. I know if I place any others, all smaller than 2.5", he'll munch them. So again, anything I should/can do about the future bloom? Might it not even happen? Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15124	From: Chris	Date: 9/1/2005
Subject: Re: BP ate the shark

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > Ouch? I didn't see what you were responding to. The PMS comment! :)

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15125	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 9/1/2005
Subject: Re: Expecting a bacterial bloom

depending on size but 5 small fish might actually make less watse then the one larger fish. as long as your filteration is established, the good bacteria will reproduce quite quickly and if you do incur an algae bloom it should go away within a day or so. You can do a partial waterchange to remove any nitrates, or ammonia and then wait and see. Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 9/1/2005 7:22:28 PM US Eastern Standard Time, amjmail@... writes: A friend brought some fish to trade today. She took one chichlid, the lone inhabitor of the tank, and gave me 5 small fish which are now in the same tank the 1 fish was in. So I'm thinking I can expect a bacterial bloom. Is this about right? And if this does happen, is there anything I should do before or during? I don't have anywhere else to put the fish. I tried to stick a larger (2.5") into the 75 but the blood parrot made an instant b-line for the poor guy. I know if I place any others, all smaller than 2.5", he'll munch them. So again, anything I should/can do about the future bloom? Might it not even happen? Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15126	From: Leslie	Date: 9/2/2005
Subject: Cherry barbs & female betta

I put a female betta in with the new tank members which include two small cherry barbs. They will not leave the betta alone for a second. Is this a bad combination? Should I remove her? I thought they were calm community fish. Wrong? (and she is curling up once in a while as well.odd.) Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15127	From: rojeriko	Date: 9/2/2005
Subject: medicated food??

Hi, Has anyone tried a medicated food? I saw it at the PetsMart. I think it's made by Jungle Labs. I wonder if it's any better than soaking the food in garlic juice Thanks, Murat

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15128	From: Amalthea	Date: 9/2/2005
Subject: Re: medicated food??

After a particularly violent breeding season, I recently had an outbreak of body rot in my koi and used both the anti bacterial and then anti parasite foods (I got them at drs. foster smith) and all of the koi (even the ones with severe rot) completely healed. This was after I'd tried melafix, salt, and topical treatments that just weren't cutting it. I'd definitely recommend that stuff, even just to keep in the house in case of an emergency. Amalthea http://www.amaltheasattic.com Your Alternative to the Alternative.... On Sep 2, 2005, at 12:26 PM, rojeriko wrote: > Hi, > Has anyone tried a medicated food? I saw it at the PetsMart. I think > it's made by Jungle Labs. I wonder if it's any better than soaking the > food in garlic juice > Thanks, > Murat > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><· > ´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15129	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 9/2/2005
Subject: Re: medicated food??

Only Medicated food i have use is PEPSO by Jungle Labs My way of thinking is if the fish is in QT( quarantine) I don't medicate i just sit and watch until i see a problem then I address the problem. Most of the time My fish go through a Fast 2-3 week Isolation before finding new homes in a diffrent tank, But if I see a problem they are QT for at least 2-3 weeks after the problem dissapears. Every once in awhile I get fish with intestinal parasites. Usually Cory catfish, or livebearers .. I feed them Pepso by Jungle Labs while in Quarantine It does help. You feed the fish 3 days the medicated food, and then return the fish to a normal diet.I use the pepso food as a weekly additive to there diets just incase. Once the fish move out of the Quarantine tanks, i don't feed the pepso foods anymore. If a fish is showing signs of being sick in one of the Main tanks they are netted and QT'd ASAP. This way I can address the problem right away. Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 9/2/2005 11:29:13 AM US Eastern Standard Time, rojeriko@... writes: Hi, Has anyone tried a medicated food? I saw it at the PetsMart. I think it's made by Jungle Labs. I wonder if it's any better than soaking the food in garlic juice Thanks, Murat [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15130	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 9/2/2005
Subject: Re: Cherry barbs & female betta

Remove Betta or she will be harassed to death. Most fish will pick on bettas. Including Mollies, platys, guppies not saying you can't put a female with them but usually you have to watch them closely Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 9/2/2005 9:30:03 AM US Eastern Standard Time, amjmail@... writes: I put a female betta in with the new tank members which include two small cherry barbs. They will not leave the betta alone for a second. Is this a bad combination? Should I remove her? I thought they were calm community fish. Wrong? (and she is curling up once in a while as well.odd.) Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15131	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 9/2/2005
Subject: Re: video -> how about a fish suggestion?

Say, you never did say (or I never got it). What did you wind up getting or have you yet? -Steve ----- Original Message ----- From: "Patrick" <patrickmn@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Friday, August 26, 2005 2:30 PM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] video -> how about a fish suggestion? WELCOME TO THE GROUP!!!!!!!! :) Well, it is just a temporary thing. There is usually about one major discussion here per week, then it changes. So lets talk about fish. I'm thinking about getting a new fish for my tank. It is the 29gal. with tetras danios, and cories. I'm thinking about a mid-sized mid-dweller (3-4 inch range) that is not a gourami or paradise fish. I'm not wanting to risk the aggressive Cichlids. What's left that is commonly available? I'm thinking ram. Are rams ok with glolight tetras? Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Thomas Jefferson once said, 'We should never judge a president by his age, only by his works.' And ever since he told me that, I stopped worrying." -Ronald Reagan -------Original Message------- I am new here and the only thing I have seen is a dispute between Reps and dems fighting about an ididotic video. I though this was an aquarium forum not a political forum, lets your bury the dead horse and continue on with our lives instead of keep beating the dead horse. who gives a crap who is a republican, democrat or independent. I signed up here about 4 hours ago and I have seen 10 to 15 emails about the movie, this is not why I joined the group, I did it to learn or to pass information on fish. My 0.02 cents. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15132	From: Patrick	Date: 9/2/2005
Subject: Re: video -> how about a fish suggestion?

Well, with gas prices like they are, and the nearest fish store now over an hour drive from here at 65 mph, I doubt I will be getting a new fish for a while. :( Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Thomas Jefferson once said, 'We should never judge a president by his age, only by his works.' And ever since he told me that, I stopped worrying." -Ronald Reagan -------Original Message------- Say, you never did say (or I never got it). What did you wind up getting or have you yet? -Steve [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15133	From: Aaron	Date: 9/2/2005
Subject: Fish Tank Backsplash

OK, so now we know I like watching TV more than reading a book, I saw this interesting show called "Kitchen Trends" on HGTV, they had a 'Fish Tank Backsplash' built into the kitchen cabinets. Interesting idea? more info below: ----------------------------------------- Kitchen Trends : Episode HKTRD-101 http://www.hgtv.com/hgtv/dc_design_kitchen/article/0,1793,HGTV_3375_3 877140,00.html Fish Tank Backsplash This innovative backsplash is a fish tank that covers the entire back wall. It works like a regular tank and the only requirement is space behind the cabinets in order to feed the fish.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15134	From: Aaron	Date: 9/2/2005
Subject: Red-Tail Shark ate the Apple Snail

Kind of Sad I had bought this snail when it was barely the size of a marble on 11/19/2003. It cost $7.00, but the LFS guy said it would get big and help eat the Algae. I watched it every day as it quickly grew to about the size of a golf ball. It was very interesting to watch, it would go to about ½ inch from the surface and then this snorkel tube would appear and the snail's entire body would make a pumping action. My brother had said that while he was watching it, it devoured several plants in a couple minutes. I did not really pay attention, nor did I believe him until I witnessed it for myself. This Golden- Yellow snail was consuming my planted tank indiscriminately. I was in shock. I had spent more than I could recall stocking dozens of different kinds of plants, now this monster was rapidly depleting my beautifully designed underwater paradise. At the same time I was also very much amazed, I mean this snail was eating plants several times its size in about a minute, then moving on to another. When it got to the floating Hornwort it ate at least a foot of it before sucking up the duckweed like a vacuum. Here I was partially relived as the duckweed had become a nuisance and I had been unsuccessful in getting rid of it. If only I could get this snail to eat just that and not all the others. The worst part of this baffling buffet was the snail would start eating the tops of some plants and seem to get bored or change its mind after a few bites and go searching for a different type to taste. Then, its appetite for destruction became cause for concern. I did not know what to do, I did not even know what kind of snail this was, but I did know it was growing fast, very fast, as it was now almost the size of a tennis ball. This was not going to be something I could keep, so I went online to research it and its description matched that of the Apple Snail on the web site http://www.applesnail.net/ Apparently so named because the snail grows to the size of an Apple. After a few hours of this I put the Snail into a goldfish bowl with as much duckweed I could get out and some hornwort. A few minutes later the snail had crawled out of the bowl and landed on the carpet. I called my best friend Steve and asked if he could keep it for me. A year and a half or so later the shell lies empty on the bottom of his tank. An apparent victim of the newest inhabitant, a Red Tailed Shark that has been suspected of being the cause of several other fish mysteriously disappearing. Kind of Sad, I can still see the growth rings, each a different shade, depending I suppose on the diet and lighting. Seems weird to see it there empty for the first time.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15135	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 9/2/2005
Subject: Re: video -> how about a fish suggestion?

easier to find someone online willing to ship fish priority mail. I sent fish a month ago or so to Georgia for $5.60, sent fish to Wisconsin for $4.25. as long as the shipper is willing to send priority mail rather then Express buying fish via online is a viable option especially enlight of current gas prices. Of course the Post Office will have to start RAISE prices soon, to offset the fuel prices, so watch out ............ Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 9/2/2005 2:21:16 PM US Eastern Standard Time, patrickmn@... writes: Well, with gas prices like they are, and the nearest fish store now over an hour drive from here at 65 mph, I doubt I will be getting a new fish for a while. :( [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15136	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 9/2/2005
Subject: Re: Red-Tail Shark ate the Apple Snail

aw, sorry you lost your apple! --- Aaron <anonymous122899@...> wrote: > Kind of Sad > > I had bought this snail when it was barely the size of a marble on > 11/19/2003. It cost $7.00, but the LFS guy said it would get big and > help eat the Algae. I watched it every day as it quickly grew to > about the size of a golf ball. It was very interesting to watch, it > would go to about ½ inch from the surface and then this snorkel > tube > would appear and the snail's entire body would make a pumping > action. > > > My brother had said that while he was watching it, it devoured > several plants in a couple minutes. I did not really pay attention, > nor did I believe him until I witnessed it for myself. This Golden- > Yellow snail was consuming my planted tank indiscriminately. I was > in shock. I had spent more than I could recall stocking dozens of > different kinds of plants, now this monster was rapidly depleting my > beautifully designed underwater paradise. At the same time I was > also very much amazed, I mean this snail was eating plants several > times its size in about a minute, then moving on to another. When it > got to the floating Hornwort it ate at least a foot of it before > sucking up the duckweed like a vacuum. Here I was partially relived > as the duckweed had become a nuisance and I had been unsuccessful in > getting rid of it. If only I could get this snail to eat just that > and not all the others. The worst part of this baffling buffet was > the snail would start eating the tops of some plants and seem to get > bored or change its mind after a few bites and go searching for a > different type to taste. > > Then, its appetite for destruction became cause for concern. I did > not know what to do, I did not even know what kind of snail this > was, but I did know it was growing fast, very fast, as it was now > almost the size of a tennis ball. This was not going to be something > I could keep, so I went online to research it and its description > matched that of the Apple Snail on the web site > http://www.applesnail.net/ > Apparently so named because the snail grows to the size of an Apple. > > After a few hours of this I put the Snail into a goldfish bowl with > as much duckweed I could get out and some hornwort. A few minutes > later the snail had crawled out of the bowl and landed on the > carpet. I called my best friend Steve and asked if he could keep it > for me. A year and a half or so later the shell lies empty on the > bottom of his tank. An apparent victim of the newest inhabitant, a > Red Tailed Shark that has been suspected of being the cause of > several other fish mysteriously disappearing. > Kind of Sad, I can still see the growth rings, each a different > shade, depending I suppose on the diet and lighting. Seems weird to > see it there empty for the first time. > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15137	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 9/2/2005
Subject: pond plants

Will water sprite grow in an unheated goldfish pond? We have one at work and I thought if it grew well, I could cultivate a bunch of it at work so I would have lots of it for the winter. How about water lettuce? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15138	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 9/2/2005
Subject: Re: video -> how about a fish suggestion?

In a message dated 9/2/2005 2:21:16 P.M. Central Standard Time, patrickmn@... writes: Well, with gas prices like they are, and the nearest fish store now over an hour drive from here at 65 mph, I doubt I will be getting a new fish for a while. :( I feel your pain. I'm in the same boat. I cant' justify making that long of a trip to go to my favorite fish store. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15139	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 9/2/2005
Subject: Re: video -> how about a fish suggestion?

In a message dated 9/2/2005 3:51:31 P.M. Central Standard Time, FortWayneFish@... writes: Of course the Post Office will have to start RAISE prices soon, to offset the fuel prices, so watch out ............ I am waiting for the school district to start charging for bus service back and forth to school! Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15140	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 9/2/2005
Subject: Re: pond plants

In a message dated 9/2/2005 10:10:29 PM Eastern Standard Time, Crazy4fids@... writes: <<<Will water sprite grow in an unheated goldfish pond? We have one at work and I thought if it grew well, I could cultivate a bunch of it at work so I would have lots of it for the winter. How about water lettuce?>>> Both should be fine, I have water lettuce in my pond and also some unheated tanks right now and water sprite just needs to think of water to grow.... ;-) Vicky Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Call (301) 402-8625 or write: hgparker@... =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: FCR-Cancer-Support@yahoogroups.com Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@... 919-513-1467, Dr London @ calondon@... 530-754-5711 _AND_ Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15141	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 9/2/2005
Subject: Re: video -> how about a fish suggestion?

Well if we buy fish and get them shipped before shipping prices go up we can still save a little bit. Mike -----Original Message----- From: Crazy4fids@... To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 22:21:12 EDT Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] video -> how about a fish suggestion? In a message dated 9/2/2005 3:51:31 P.M. Central Standard Time, FortWayneFish@... writes: Of course the Post Office will have to start RAISE prices soon, to offset the fuel prices, so watch out ............ I am waiting for the school district to start charging for bus service back and forth to school! Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15142	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 9/2/2005
Subject: Re: pond plants

I had a bunch of water lettuce in my tanks...that is until the plecos and the apple snail chowed down on the roots. They killed off most of them. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Crazy4fids@... Sent: Friday, September 02, 2005 9:10 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com; mnaquarium@yahoogroups.com; uniaquaria@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] pond plants Will water sprite grow in an unheated goldfish pond? We have one at work and I thought if it grew well, I could cultivate a bunch of it at work so I would have lots of it for the winter. How about water lettuce? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15143	From: clarkmariposo25@aol.com	Date: 9/2/2005
Subject: Re: Fish Tank Backsplash

Cool! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15144	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 9/3/2005
Subject: looking to buy fish/products on line?

I frequently browse aquabid just to see what is for sale. A lot of people are doing benefit auctions, claiming that all winning sales go to benefit the victims of hurricane Katrina. I do not know how legit these auctions are or if the money will even make to the victims. I would hope so. Anyway's there are some good thing for sale. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15145	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 9/3/2005
Subject: OT: Katrina--Looking For and Safe Lists

MSNBC has provided the following page for those who have relatives and friends in the areas most severely affected by Katrina. Take a look at the Safe list first to see if the person you are looking for has found this page and posted. If they are not there, you can post a message for those for whom you are trying to contact. Keep in mind that these lists are not inclusive and your loved ones may well be safe but not have any access. The lists are at: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/apps/connect/search.aspx?n=A&i=2/ To post, use the form at:: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9159961/ \\Steve//

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15146	From: Chris	Date: 9/3/2005
Subject: Re: fish behaving badly

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "kb1dva" <vze3pd7a@v...> wrote: > Either one of my Oscars or my Pacu took a bite out of the pikes mouth! And > there's a flap of it hanging is there anything I can do to help him, or is > it best left alone. I would say it depends on how serious the injury is. In general, you would probably leave the fish alone - but keep a close eye out for disease setting in - such as fungus at the injury site, or any other disease in general. Also - it depends on whether the fish are still harrassing each other. If so, you may need to separate them. If the pike looks confident and untroubled by the other fish, then it's probably ok to leave them all alone. If you want to post a photo, that'd be good. Also my smallest blood parrot seems to be shy about > going after food I think she's betting bullied, how do I fix that Leslie might be the person to ask, as she has blood parrots. If you have a reasonably long tank, try feeding at one end, then after a few seconds, feed at the other end also. If you always feed at the same end, the fish get used to that, and any fish being bullied out will likely be down the other end. If you have a current going through the water, say because of water coming back into the tank from a filter, try dropping the food in the current - that should circulate it right through the tank. Try and feed a variety of foods. If you're only feeding flake food, then hold the flake underwater and rub it between your fingers so it breaks up and spreads throughout the water - not just across the surface. Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15147	From: Chris	Date: 9/3/2005
Subject: Re: Cherry barbs & female betta

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, FortWayneFish@a... wrote: > Remove Betta or she will be harassed to death. Barbs are also generally faster moving fish - certainly faster than bettas, so even if they are not directly harrassing the betta, they will generally get all the food and push her out of the way - which is itself stressful for the betta. Looks like a trial separation is in order. Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15148	From: Chris	Date: 9/3/2005
Subject: Re: video -> how about a fish suggestion?

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "The Dragon Hunter" <dragon.hunter@d...> wrote: > Say, you never did say (or I never got it). What did you wind up getting or > have you yet? > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Patrick" <patrickmn@c...> > I'm > thinking about getting a new fish for my tank. It is the 29gal. with tetras > danios, and cories. I'm thinking about a mid-sized mid-dweller (3-4 inch > range) that is not a gourami or paradise fish. I'm not wanting to risk the > aggressive Cichlids. What's left that is commonly available? I'm thinking > ram. Are rams ok with glolight tetras? I think before I answered that rams are bottom dwellers - which they are - but to answer your question, yes, they are ok with glolight tetras. I noticed you saying "not a paradise fish". Have you kept these? When I was a kid working in a fish shop, I didn't know their reputation for being aggressive and sold one to a customer. He came back an hour later - every other fish in that bag was dead. Not saying you can't keep them, but I suspect a paradise fish would make short work of the tetras. As you said, "not a paradise fish"! Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15149	From: Chris	Date: 9/3/2005
Subject: Re: Red-Tail Shark ate the Apple Snail

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Aaron" <anonymous122899@y...> wrote: > Kind of Sad > awww - that's very sad. I'd never heard of apple snails, but a completely fascinating story! I'm reading about the snails on your link now. I suspect they won't be available here in Australia though - if they got loose, sounds like nothing'd stop them! Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15150	From: Chris	Date: 9/3/2005
Subject: Re: Red-Tail Shark ate the Apple Snail

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Chris" <youcantryreachingme@y...> wrote: > I'd never heard of apple snails, actually, the site says they're also called "mystery" snails - and just about every shop sells those (although I've never kept one). But I don't know if they're a species that grows to the same size. Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15151	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 9/3/2005
Subject: Re: Red-Tail Shark ate the Apple Snail

apple and mystery shells make great homes for small cichlids. Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 9/3/2005 10:29:37 AM US Eastern Standard Time, youcantryreachingme@... writes: awww - that's very sad. I'd never heard of apple snails, but a completely fascinating story! I'm reading about the snails on your link now. I suspect they won't be available here in Australia though - if they got loose, sounds like nothing'd stop them! Chris. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15152	From: Chris	Date: 9/3/2005
Subject: Re: eggs in my tank

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > I have eggs in my tank. Linda - how are the angels doing with their eggs?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15153	From: Chris	Date: 9/3/2005
Subject: silver sharks

Hey all, I've just completed my tank with a trio of silver sharks. I would have preferred tinfoil barbs, but they're about $40 each. I was lucky to pick these three up at the size they were, for $8 each. This tank's a real mixed bag: Firstly, there is a single, branched, piece of driftwood which is surrounded by java plants. That's the extent of variety in the planting, but there's so much there that you're always looking in between the leaves for some other fish. On the fish front: 8 rosy barbs (I bought a dozen for $3 as feeder fish!) 4 lined barbs (these, and the rosy barbs are my fast mid-swimmers) 3 silver sharks, which I hope will grow much larger than all the barbs - these will be my feature fish a number of neon and cardinal tetras. the number is always shrinking courtesy of the gobies. The lower swimming fish are completely fascinating in and of themselves - even if a little mixed: 6 flat-backed gobies (I collected these locally, and they continually eat the neons. At first I thought I was losing neons to disease - and some did survive and grow large, but my latest batch of neons kept disappearing one by one and those remaining have nipped fins.) 4 ottocinclus (excellent algae eaters! looking a little underfed now - will need to get some food just for them, and try and get them eating it without the gobies hogging it all) 2 kuhli loaches - just so something very different and interesting appears once in a while to keep your interest. 1 flying fox - shaped like a silver shark, coloured like the lined barbs (with only 1 line). something different. bought thanks to the discussion of algae eaters here online. One of the great things about the lower-dwellers is they like sitting on leaves or on the driftwood - so even though they like to be "on the bottom", really they are scattered throughout the tank - even at the top if that means sitting on top of something. I must say, when I hand feed the fish, or clean the tank, the gobies bite me like there's no tomorrow - I nearly flicked one right out of the tank because of the reflex action of pulling my arm out of the water. These little guys have attitude - and big mouths. I hope to post photos soon. Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15154	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 9/3/2005
Subject: Re: Red-Tail Shark ate the Apple Snail

They tried to farm apple snails as a alternative to the snails used by the French as escargot. They let them loose on the rice fields in SE Asia...which almost destroyed the rice industry there. They are hungry little fellow, but are really cool. One of the nice things about apple snails is that they are sexual reproducers. Most other snails reproduce asexually if they have to, which means they can still get out of control. If you get one apple snail, you will only have one apple snail. I have one in my 55gal tank. I think he is pretty cool. He's about 4 inches across now. Many of my plants are gone now...but the plecos also share some of that blame. I saw some up at the Shedd Aquarium that were the size of a large softball. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Chris Sent: Saturday, September 03, 2005 10:27 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Red-Tail Shark ate the Apple Snail --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Aaron" <anonymous122899@y...> wrote: > Kind of Sad > awww - that's very sad. I'd never heard of apple snails, but a completely fascinating story! I'm reading about the snails on your link now. I suspect they won't be available here in Australia though - if they got loose, sounds like nothing'd stop them! Chris. Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15155	From: kb1dva	Date: 9/3/2005
Subject: thanks

I wanted to thank one and all for the help I got for my injured pike - someone took a bite out of his mouth and my shy blood parrot that doesn't seem to get enough to eat. I'm so glad I joined this group, you're such a help! Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15156	From: roughbuckincwgrl	Date: 9/3/2005
Subject: New with a question?

Hi I just joined this group and I was wondering if anyone in here had pictus catfish in their tanks? I cant find much info on these guys and was wondering about others experiences with them.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15157	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 9/3/2005
Subject: Re: New with a question?

www.planetcatfish.com will give you general info. A group like this is a great place to find out information on new fish. if you goto google.com and put in Pictus cat and search you'll find a lot of information, you'll just have to read a little. I'm sure others will reply in time :-) Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 9/3/2005 5:28:10 PM US Eastern Standard Time, roughbuckincwgrl@... writes: Hi I just joined this group and I was wondering if anyone in here had pictus catfish in their tanks? I cant find much info on these guys and was wondering about others experiences with them. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15158	From: thesydmonster	Date: 9/3/2005
Subject: Hydra

I believe I have hydra in my tank. I posted pictures in my photo album, named them "what is this?" 10 gallon tank with 1 male betta, 4 corydoras habrosus, 4 rasbora espei, 2 otos, some MTS and 2 nerite snails. There are also 8 cory eggs on the glass that were just put there today (the first time since I have had them). I am afraid that, should the eggs hatch, the hydra will eat the fry :( What should I do that won't harm my fish or snails or plants? Or I can put my fish in a bucket during treatment and move the nerites to another tank but I don't think I can get all my MTS out. Thank you, Rebecca

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15159	From: Patrick	Date: 9/3/2005
Subject: Re: video -> how about a fish suggestion?

I've had two in this tank. The first lived and grew for a couple of years and then died about 2 months ago. The second made it a little more than a month and then it died after something bit a chunk out of it (or it had some kind of disease that ate it away). After that I'm looking for a new fish to take their place. Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Thomas Jefferson once said, 'We should never judge a president by his age, only by his works.' And ever since he told me that, I stopped worrying." -Ronald Reagan -------Original Message------- I think before I answered that rams are bottom dwellers - which they are - but to answer your question, yes, they are ok with glolight tetras. I noticed you saying "not a paradise fish". Have you kept these? When I was a kid working in a fish shop, I didn't know their reputation for being aggressive and sold one to a customer. He came back an hour later - every other fish in that bag was dead. Not saying you can't keep them, but I suspect a paradise fish would make short work of the tetras. As you said, "not a paradise fish"! Chris. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15160	From: Aaron	Date: 9/3/2005
Subject: Re: Red-Tail Shark ate the Apple Snail

They are actually Illegal in the county where I reside, supposedly they are a threat to the rice crops? I live in the San Francisco Bay Area, I've never seen a rice crop in my travels here. Maybe the snails already ate them all. Aaron ----------------- > awww - that's very sad. I'd never heard of apple snails, but a > completely fascinating story! I'm reading about the snails on your > link now. I suspect they won't be available here in Australia though - > if they got loose, sounds like nothing'd stop them! > > Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15161	From: Aaron	Date: 9/3/2005
Subject: Re: Red-Tail Shark ate the Apple Snail

Yeah, apparently just like the name Apple refers to there Adult size, Mystery refers to how they got the name Mystery Snail. --------------- > actually, the site says they're also called "mystery" snails - and > just about every shop sells those (although I've never kept one). But > I don't know if they're a species that grows to the same size. > > Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15162	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 9/3/2005
Subject: Re: eggs in my tank

I finally figured out that the eggs belong to my large rams horn snail. Actually, I was going to tell everyone today that one of my keyhole cichlids has adopted a clutch of the eggs. He/she is guarding the eggs and cleaning them. Is this normal? Anybody ever heard of a cichlid adopting eggs? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15165	From: dawnmvo	Date: 9/3/2005
Subject: Algae Eater

Hello What would be a good algae eater for a 10 gallon tank? thanks Dawn

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15166	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: Algae Eater

Look into Otocinclus fish, peaceful. http://www.otocinclus.com Providing you are not putting them with something viscious In a message dated 9/3/2005 11:33:14 PM Pacific Daylight Time, cloversnamewastaken@... writes: Hello What would be a good algae eater for a 10 gallon tank? thanks Dawn [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15167	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: Hydra

Rebecca, Check out this link for help: http://www.thekrib.com/Fish/hydra.html \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of thesydmonster Sent: Saturday, September 03, 2005 7:22 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Hydra I believe I have hydra in my tank. I posted pictures in my photo album, named them "what is this?" 10 gallon tank with 1 male betta, 4 corydoras habrosus, 4 rasbora espei, 2 otos, some MTS and 2 nerite snails. There are also 8 cory eggs on the glass that were just put there today (the first time since I have had them). I am afraid that, should the eggs hatch, the hydra will eat the fry :( What should I do that won't harm my fish or snails or plants? Or I can put my fish in a bucket during treatment and move the nerites to another tank but I don't think I can get all my MTS out. Thank you, Rebecca Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15168	From: Fonchy	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Is this group for fresh water tanks???

Is this group mainly fresh water tanks????? ----- Original Message ----- From: Fonchy To: CCReefs ; NCFRAG ; rare-group@yahoogroups.com ; AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com ; ralieghaquariumsociety@... Sent: Thursday, September 01, 2005 12:42 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] Blue hippo with cloudy eye I woke up this morning and I saw a big piece of my green cap broken and then I saw the left eye of my blue hippo tang all cloudy, i got 2 conclussions: 1. he hit the coral, broke it and scratch his eye or, 2. he has some kind of discease. Should I take him out or leave him there, he is not acting abnormal. Armando [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15169	From: Justin M.	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: Is this group for fresh water tanks???

At 09:30 AM 04/09/2005 -0400, you wrote: >Is this group mainly fresh water tanks????? It's not exclusively a freshwater group, but I think those with marine tanks are a minority... JM

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15170	From: Fonchy	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: Is this group for fresh water tanks???

Well it has been a good group but im going to have to move on to another group. Thanks for everything guys. ----- Original Message ----- From: Justin M. To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, September 04, 2005 10:02 AM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Is this group for fresh water tanks??? At 09:30 AM 04/09/2005 -0400, you wrote: >Is this group mainly fresh water tanks????? It's not exclusively a freshwater group, but I think those with marine tanks are a minority... JM Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15171	From: Justin M.	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: Is this group for fresh water tanks???

At 10:07 AM 04/09/2005 -0400, you wrote: >Well it has been a good group but im going to have to move on to another >group. Thanks for everything guys. Sorry we couldn't be of more help....good luck. JM

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15172	From: wendie	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Safe Ick Medicine

Does anyone know of a safe Ick medicine for kuhli loaches. I bought a couple online and they've got ick. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15173	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: Algae Eater

one of the dwarf plecos (make sure it a dwarf...and not a common pleco which get big) would be good or a couple of octiniculus(sp?) cats. Siamese algae eaters are good too...but I would check on their adult size first...I am not sure how big they get offhand. I have a bulldog pleco and a dwarf albino bristlenose pleco. Both of these species max out at 4-6 inches. The octo cats get onl;y about 2 inches long...they are cute little guys. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of dawnmvo Sent: Sunday, September 04, 2005 1:32 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Algae Eater Hello What would be a good algae eater for a 10 gallon tank? thanks Dawn Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15174	From: thesydmonster	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: Algae Eater

Dwarf plecos are nice but I think they would be too large for a 10 gallon, not to mention the waste they produce for such a small tank. Otos are really the best, especially because you can get a couple for a 10 gallon tank. But that's just my opinion :) Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > one of the dwarf plecos (make sure it a dwarf...and not a common pleco which > get big) would be good or a couple of octiniculus(sp?) cats. Siamese algae > eaters are good too...but I would check on their adult size first...I am not > sure how big they get offhand. I have a bulldog pleco and a dwarf albino > bristlenose pleco. Both of these species max out at 4-6 inches. The octo > cats get onl;y about 2 inches long...they are cute little guys. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of dawnmvo > Sent: Sunday, September 04, 2005 1:32 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Algae Eater > > > Hello > > What would be a good algae eater for a 10 gallon tank? > > thanks > Dawn > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15175	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: Algae Eater

a 4-6 in fish too big? Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of thesydmonster Sent: Sunday, September 04, 2005 9:53 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Algae Eater Dwarf plecos are nice but I think they would be too large for a 10 gallon, not to mention the waste they produce for such a small tank. Otos are really the best, especially because you can get a couple for a 10 gallon tank. But that's just my opinion :) Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > one of the dwarf plecos (make sure it a dwarf...and not a common pleco which > get big) would be good or a couple of octiniculus(sp?) cats. Siamese algae > eaters are good too...but I would check on their adult size first...I am not > sure how big they get offhand. I have a bulldog pleco and a dwarf albino > bristlenose pleco. Both of these species max out at 4-6 inches. The octo > cats get onl;y about 2 inches long...they are cute little guys. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of dawnmvo > Sent: Sunday, September 04, 2005 1:32 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Algae Eater > > > Hello > > What would be a good algae eater for a 10 gallon tank? > > thanks > Dawn > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15176	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: Algae Eater

In a message dated 9/4/2005 10:53:30 AM Eastern Standard Time, TheSydMonster@... writes: <<<Dwarf plecos are nice but I think they would be too large for a 10 gallon, not to mention the waste they produce for such a small tank. Otos are really the best, especially because you can get a couple for a 10 gallon tank. But that's just my opinion :)>>> Some of the dwarfs, such as Rubberlipped/Rubbernosed/Bulldog Pl*cos are fine for a 10. I have one in the kids' "mini" tank with dwarf platies, endlers, african dwarf frog (a refugee from another tank) and bridgesiis and he's probably only 3". He's fine with the mass of anacharis, hair grass, java fern and water lettuce that's in there. (all easy, low maintenance plants) He is a pretty cool pl*c, originally a bit shy and retiring but has gradually become quite a center piece, even in broad daylight, and is pretty feisty when he wrestles the frog for shrimp pellets. A pl*c that size would be fine in a 10. =) Vicky =) Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Call (301) 402-8625 or write: hgparker@... =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: FCR-Cancer-Support@yahoogroups.com Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@... 919-513-1467, Dr London @ calondon@... 530-754-5711 _AND_ Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15177	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: Algae Eater

I have a bulldog pleco...they are really cool with distinctive markings. I have had him for about a month and he hasn't grown much at all...he's about 2 inches long. My dwarf albino bristlenose is in a 20 gallon with some Danios, feeder guppies, and ghost shrimp. The only filtration is the eclipse 2 hood and the only cleaning I have to do is to change the water. The substrate is picked clean by the ghost shrimp and the pleco. Just out of curiosity, why do you put the asterisk in pleco? I have seen that in a few places. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of seleya8@... Sent: Sunday, September 04, 2005 10:24 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: Algae Eater In a message dated 9/4/2005 10:53:30 AM Eastern Standard Time, TheSydMonster@... writes: <<<Dwarf plecos are nice but I think they would be too large for a 10 gallon, not to mention the waste they produce for such a small tank. Otos are really the best, especially because you can get a couple for a 10 gallon tank. But that's just my opinion :)>>> Some of the dwarfs, such as Rubberlipped/Rubbernosed/Bulldog Pl*cos are fine for a 10. I have one in the kids' "mini" tank with dwarf platies, endlers, african dwarf frog (a refugee from another tank) and bridgesiis and he's probably only 3". He's fine with the mass of anacharis, hair grass, java fern and water lettuce that's in there. (all easy, low maintenance plants) He is a pretty cool pl*c, originally a bit shy and retiring but has gradually become quite a center piece, even in broad daylight, and is pretty feisty when he wrestles the frog for shrimp pellets. A pl*c that size would be fine in a 10. =) Vicky =) Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Call (301) 402-8625 or write: hgparker@... =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: FCR-Cancer-Support@yahoogroups.com Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@... 919-513-1467, Dr London @ calondon@... 530-754-5711 _AND_ Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15178	From: Patrick	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: Safe Ick Medicine

Turn the heat to 86°F for several days. You can also add a small amount of salt. Maybe 1 tsp/gallon. Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Thomas Jefferson once said, 'We should never judge a president by his age, only by his works.' And ever since he told me that, I stopped worrying." -Ronald Reagan -------Original Message------- Does anyone know of a safe Ick medicine for kuhli loaches. I bought a couple online and they've got ick. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15179	From: paul helms	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: New with a question?

i have had several ove rthe years --- roughbuckincwgrl <roughbuckincwgrl@...> wrote: > Hi I just joined this group and I was wondering if > anyone in here had > pictus catfish in their tanks? I cant find much > info on these guys > and was wondering about others experiences with > them. > > > > > ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15180	From: paul helms	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: Blue hippo with cloudy eye

sounds like cloud eye...tansg often get it when wtaer parametrs start to go down in quality. same with the corals. whe the water gets a bit on the bad side thy can pop their caps off. test thoroughly --- Fonchy <fonchy@...> wrote: > I woke up this morning and I saw a big piece of my > green cap broken and then I saw the left eye of my > blue hippo tang all cloudy, i got 2 conclussions: > 1. he hit the coral, broke it and scratch his eye > or, > 2. he has some kind of discease. > > Should I take him out or leave him there, he is not > acting abnormal. > > Armando > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15181	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: New with a question?

Ask specific questions and you will get specific answers... its much easier to ask about things you want to know than assume we will know exactly 3hat you need... just a tip kris --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > i have had several ove rthe years > > --- roughbuckincwgrl <roughbuckincwgrl@...> > wrote: > > > Hi I just joined this group and I was wondering if > > anyone in here had > > pictus catfish in their tanks? I cant find much > > info on these guys > > and was wondering about others experiences with > > them. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________ > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15182	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: No fish + not much light on = smelly water?

I have rotated my lights on my tank and when I turned off my light on my east side of my tank I started to get the hint of a smell coming from the tank itself. I opened the lid and took a wiff of the air around it and found a smell coming from the water itself. It doesn't smell like fish pee but when I smelled my tank which had my fish in it, it had the same smell. Is something wrong with my empty 55 gallon tank or is it just fine? Thanks, Beth http://fa.f-realm.com/ Fanfiction Axis. http://e.webring.com/hub?ring=siriusblack Sirius Black webring. http://e.webring.com/hub?ring=remuslupin Remus Lupin webring http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sailorsenshiocs/ for all original and series characters of Sailor Moon. http://www.livejournal.com/userinfo.bml?user=tropical_fishes Tropical fish tank livejournal community. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15183	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: swordtail fry

I had a swordtail have fry about a month or so ago. Approx. 24 fry are growing up in a 10 gallon tank. The female is about ready to pop again. She currently is living in my 150 community tank. I have not yet up graded my light system and I don't think that there is enough cover for the new baby fry to survive in the community tank. I am wondering if it would be safe to put her back in to the 10 gallon tank with the older fry until she has her new babies. Or maybe I should just wait and let nature take its course. The fry would be a tasty treat for my angelfish in the community tank. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15184	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: swordtail fry

get a baby fish foloater... its a floating home for the mommy fish while the fry are born ansd they fall through the cracks into the tank then you can put her back in the community tank. Crazy4fids@... wrote:I had a swordtail have fry about a month or so ago. Approx. 24 fry are growing up in a 10 gallon tank. The female is about ready to pop again. She currently is living in my 150 community tank. I have not yet up graded my light system and I don't think that there is enough cover for the new baby fry to survive in the community tank. I am wondering if it would be safe to put her back in to the 10 gallon tank with the older fry until she has her new babies. Or maybe I should just wait and let nature take its course. The fry would be a tasty treat for my angelfish in the community tank. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15185	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: swordtail fry

In a message dated 9/4/2005 6:54:24 PM Eastern Standard Time, Crazy4fids@... writes: <<<I am wondering if it would be safe to put her back in to the 10 gallon tank with the older fry until she has her new babies. Or maybe I should just wait and let nature take its course. The fry would be a tasty treat for my angelfish in the community tank.>>> I admit I take the nature approach myself, but provide loads of hidey places for the smart/lucky fry. Lots of plants, even extra stuff you wouldn't normally keep long term -- anacharis, hornwort, frill -- cheap, relatively disposable plants. With that said, by the time any of my fry are about a month or so old, the risk of their being around an adult is pretty minimal. In my tanks, that's about the age when they truly emerge full-time. Vicky Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Call (301) 402-8625 or write: hgparker@... =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: FCR-Cancer-Support@yahoogroups.com Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@... 919-513-1467, Dr London @ calondon@... 530-754-5711 _AND_ Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15186	From: roughbuckincwgrl	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Pictus Catfish's Weird Behavior

Sorry my last post was so general. I bought two pictus cats about 4 years ago with out knowing anything about them. They were about 1 1/2 inches long at the time. Now they are 5-6 inches and very active. Everytime I add new fish to the tank they kill and eat them. Last week they killed two large mollys. Is there some thing I can do to stop this, they guy at the petsore said to rearrange the tank, does that sound right? Also one of them is longer and fatter than the other and lately its stomach has swollen and is lumpy. the cat became more aggresive and I thought that it might be spawning, but as I have researched everything says that pictus DO NOT breed in captivity so what could this behavior be? Thanx, ~Mandy~

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15187	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: Pictus Catfish's Weird Behavior

In a message dated 9/4/2005 7:48:09 PM Eastern Standard Time, roughbuckincwgrl@... writes: <<< Everytime I add new fish to the tank they kill and eat them. Last week they killed two large mollys. Is there some thing I can do to stop this, they guy at the petsore said to rearrange the tank, does that sound right?>>> That's not wierd behavior, it's pictus behavior -- they're predators and eating machines. If you want other fish in with them, you'll have to find much larger tankmates who can look out for themselves. Mollies won't stand a chance with pictus catfish that large -- once they realise they can eat them, too, they're gone. Vicky Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Call (301) 402-8625 or write: hgparker@... =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: FCR-Cancer-Support@yahoogroups.com Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@... 919-513-1467, Dr London @ calondon@... 530-754-5711 _AND_ Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15188	From: wendie	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: Safe Ick Medicine

Thanks for all the help. It looked like ick this morning but when I came home he was covered in fungus. So much for ordering from them again. Wendie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Patrick Sent: Sunday, September 04, 2005 2:09 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Safe Ick Medicine Turn the heat to 86°F for several days. You can also add a small amount of salt. Maybe 1 tsp/gallon. Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Thomas Jefferson once said, 'We should never judge a president by his age, only by his works.' And ever since he told me that, I stopped worrying." -Ronald Reagan -------Original Message------- Does anyone know of a safe Ick medicine for kuhli loaches. I bought a couple online and they've got ick. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15189	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: Is this group for fresh water tanks???

Hi Armando, This is a mixed group, if you want to stick to marine reef tanks I would suggest you try 'Saltwater Fish and Reef Aquariums' there are others. Also if you want advice you should include details of your tank such as - tank size in gallons, do you have a sump/refugium, type of filtration, number and type of fish and corals etc., water parameters :- type of water used i.e. is it tap water, RO/DI water, well water or what, salinity (specific gravity), PH, Temp., Ammonia, Nitrite, Nitrate, Phosphate, Calcium, Alkalinity, how long the tank has been set up, what type of lighting and how many watts per gallon, how much Live Rock do you have in lbs, what is your substrate ?. If you give all this information with your question or plea for help you should get a pretty quick answer, if you don't there will be a delay while people ask for this information and you reply, or you will get a wild guess answer at best. regards, unclenorm. --- Fonchy <fonchy@...> wrote: > Is this group mainly fresh water tanks????? > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Fonchy > To: CCReefs ; NCFRAG ; rare-group@yahoogroups.com > ; AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com ; > ralieghaquariumsociety@... > Sent: Thursday, September 01, 2005 12:42 PM > Subject: [AquaticLife] Blue hippo with cloudy eye > > > I woke up this morning and I saw a big piece of my > green cap broken and then I saw the left eye of my > blue hippo tang all cloudy, i got 2 conclussions: > 1. he hit the coral, broke it and scratch his eye > or, > 2. he has some kind of discease. > > Should I take him out or leave him there, he is > not acting abnormal. > > Armando > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it > when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the > TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > > > > SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an > email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ___________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15190	From: Thomas Schlemmermeyer	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Guppies (Poecilia reticulata)

Hi, I would like to get into contact (by e-mail or through suitable websites) with professional or well skilled amateur guppy breeders (Poecilia reticulata). I am particularly eager to see in the internet information about the Mendelian factors responsible for coloring, and suggestions for interesting breeding experiments which might be realized for didactic reason, and practical hints how to conduct breeding experiments avoiding that the females get fertilized by the wrong males etc. So far my request to this list, keep care and of good cheer! Thomas Schlemmermeyer - Mato Grosso do Sul State - Brazil.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15191	From: Chris	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: plecs

Can someone please give me a rundown on what "plec" means in the states? Here in Sydney, if you say "plec", you pretty much mean <i>Hypostomus plecostomus</i> and nothing else. I've seen someone refer to their albino bristlenose plec - which we'd call a bristlenose catfish. There is another large catfish which we'd call a <i>Gibbiceps</i> (not sure of the spelling). I've also seen people talk of "dwarf" plecs and such. Given Australia's import restrictions, I suspect "plec" may also refer to other fish I've never seen. Can someone give me a bit of a summary of what's what? Much appreciated! Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15192	From: Chris	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: swordtail fry

If you're stuck for time and/or cash, you could try improvising your own by taking a washed (no detergent) ice-cream container. Poke holes in the bottom, float it in your fry tank and put the pregnant female in there. Clip the container to the glass using pegs so it doesn't go under and release the adult into the tank. Weight some plant material in the bottom of the container for the fry to hide in. Try and use plants with very fine leaves as opposed to large flat leaves - so the fry have plenty of little spaces to hide in. (If you make the holes large enough for the fry to get out of the container, it may mean your existing fry can also get in...) Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15193	From: Chris	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: Pictus Catfish's Weird Behavior

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "roughbuckincwgrl" <roughbuckincwgrl@y...> wrote: > but as I have researched everything > says that pictus DO NOT breed in captivity so what could this behavior > be? Maybe that should read "have not been documented to breed in captivity"? Always a first time for everything! (I'm no pictus expert, mind you!) Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15194	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: plecs

plec or pleco refers to the different armored suckermouth catfish species (I guess that is the best way to describe them *grin*). The bristlenose, for example, is referred to as a cat or pleco depending on who you ask. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Chris Sent: Sunday, September 04, 2005 8:37 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] plecs Can someone please give me a rundown on what "plec" means in the states? Here in Sydney, if you say "plec", you pretty much mean <i>Hypostomus plecostomus</i> and nothing else. I've seen someone refer to their albino bristlenose plec - which we'd call a bristlenose catfish. There is another large catfish which we'd call a <i>Gibbiceps</i> (not sure of the spelling). I've also seen people talk of "dwarf" plecs and such. Given Australia's import restrictions, I suspect "plec" may also refer to other fish I've never seen. Can someone give me a bit of a summary of what's what? Much appreciated! Chris. Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15195	From: Chris	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: plecs

That much I follow - I guess I was wondering more if someone could pin scientific names to common names, and in particular what is meant by a dwarf plec. Is this a dwarf version of Hypostomus plecostomous or a different species? --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > plec or pleco refers to the different armored suckermouth catfish species (I > guess that is the best way to describe them *grin*). The bristlenose, for > example, is referred to as a cat or pleco depending on who you ask.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15196	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: plecs

Chris, Plec, or pleco, is generally applied to most any member of the Loricarid family in the states. Of course, this will vary depending on the group. Those who are more advanced will generally be a bit more specific, but, if you go into the LFS, you'll pretty much see them all referred to as plecos. Such is the downfall of using common names. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Chris Sent: Sunday, September 04, 2005 9:37 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] plecs Can someone please give me a rundown on what "plec" means in the states? Here in Sydney, if you say "plec", you pretty much mean <i>Hypostomus plecostomus</i> and nothing else. I've seen someone refer to their albino bristlenose plec - which we'd call a bristlenose catfish. There is another large catfish which we'd call a <i>Gibbiceps</i> (not sure of the spelling). I've also seen people talk of "dwarf" plecs and such. Given Australia's import restrictions, I suspect "plec" may also refer to other fish I've never seen. Can someone give me a bit of a summary of what's what? Much appreciated! Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15197	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: swordtail fry

Linda, If you had swordtail fry about a month or so ago, maybe they are large enough to put in the 150 by now. If so, that will free up the 10 for the female sword. Those fry,if you feel they're large enough, will not yet be savy to the fact they may be eyed up as a meal, so it would be best to transfer them to the 150 at lights out if you so decide. The 10 gallon for the female swordtail should have at least a fair number of plants as otherwise she'll start eating them. Ideally, pregnant female swordtails should not be moved if its too close to her delivery date, as the stress can cause premature births. Likewise. putting her in a breeding trap can cause enough stress for her to drop them premature also (they seldom survive). Breeding traps are not really meant for larger livebearers such as Swordtails or Mollies (for this very reason). With one of the options you were thinking, (putting her in the 10 gallon with the older fry), you have to ask yourself (1) if the older fry are still small enough for her to eat and/or (2) are the older fry large enough to eat the new born fry. Your propably in the best position to judge that, as I'm not really sure exactly how large your month old fry are. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > I had a swordtail have fry about a month or so ago. Approx. 24 fry are > growing up in a 10 gallon tank. The female is about ready to pop again. She > currently is living in my 150 community tank. I have not yet up graded my light > system and I don't think that there is enough cover for the new baby fry to > survive in the community tank. > > I am wondering if it would be safe to put her back in to the 10 gallon tank > with the older fry until she has her new babies. Or maybe I should just wait > and let nature take its course. The fry would be a tasty treat for my > angelfish in the community tank. > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15198	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: plecs

In a message dated 9/4/2005 9:42:13 PM Eastern Standard Time, youcantryreachingme@... writes: <<<Can someone please give me a rundown on what "plec" means in the states? Here in Sydney, if you say "plec", you pretty much mean Hypostomus plecostomus and nothing else.>>> Sorry, bad habit. <<<I've seen someone refer to their albino bristlenose plec - which we'd call a bristlenose catfish.>>> Typically Ancistrus varieties <<<There is another large catfish which we'd call a Gibbiceps (not sure of the spelling).>>> Sailfin Pleco - Pterygoplichthys gibbiceps <<<I've also seen people talk of "dwarf" plecs and such. Given Australia's import restrictions, I suspect "plec" may also refer to other fish I've never seen.>>> Rubberlipped plecs - Chaetostoma milesi Clown Pleco - Panaque maccus There are other types of fish referred to as "dwarf plecs" also. Vicky =) Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Call (301) 402-8625 or write: hgparker@... =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: FCR-Cancer-Support@yahoogroups.com Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@... 919-513-1467, Dr London @ calondon@... 530-754-5711 _AND_ Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15199	From: Chris	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: Algae Eater

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > Just out of curiosity, why do you put the asterisk in pleco? I have seen > that in a few places. I wasn't looking for this answer, but I found it here: http://www.planetcatfish.com/faq/index.php?qid=51&frommostpopular=yes

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15200	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: plecs

they didn't have a specific species...just the genus...Ancistrus (note...a note from the next link explains that they do not know what species the albino came form...) http://www.planetcatfish.com/shanesworld/s_r_270.php The first pic looks like what I have. Here's some more pics of the dwarf albino bristlenose pleco...(they call it a catfish here) http://www.planetcatfish.com/catelog/loricari/ancistru/5_f.php It's probably proper to call it, and any other member of lorcidae (sp?) a catfish, unless it is h. plecostimous, but in the common vernacular it applies to most of them. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Chris Sent: Sunday, September 04, 2005 9:23 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: plecs That much I follow - I guess I was wondering more if someone could pin scientific names to common names, and in particular what is meant by a dwarf plec. Is this a dwarf version of Hypostomus plecostomous or a different species? --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > plec or pleco refers to the different armored suckermouth catfish species (I > guess that is the best way to describe them *grin*). The bristlenose, for > example, is referred to as a cat or pleco depending on who you ask. Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15201	From: Chris	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: plecs

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, seleya8@a... wrote: Great! Thanks for this... will keep me occupied for a bit! Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15202	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: Algae Eater

thx hehehe Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Chris Sent: Sunday, September 04, 2005 9:58 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Algae Eater --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > Just out of curiosity, why do you put the asterisk in pleco? I have seen > that in a few places. I wasn't looking for this answer, but I found it here: http://www.planetcatfish.com/faq/index.php?qid=51 <http://www.planetcatfish.com/faq/index.php?qid=51&frommostpopular=yes> &frommostpopular=yes Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15203	From: dawnmvo	Date: 9/4/2005
Subject: Re: Algae Eater

Hey That is HILARIOUS!!!! Thanx everyone for all the answers to my question. Dawn "Chris" <youcantryreachingme@y...> wrote: > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > > Just out of curiosity, why do you put the asterisk in pleco? I have > seen > > that in a few places. > > I wasn't looking for this answer, but I found it here: > http://www.planetcatfish.com/faq/index.php?qid=51&frommostpopular=yes

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15204	From: muskie4817	Date: 9/5/2005
Subject: Any experience buying fish over the internet

Has anyone (I am sure some of you have) bought fish over the internet and if so is it worth looking into and who? I am leery about buying something alive that has to be mailed. Should I be? Thanks.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15205	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 9/5/2005
Subject: Re: Any experience buying fish over the internet

Mixed experiences on my End here. I have nothing but great success in buying fish via internet. My problem in buying fish via internet is that you can not see them before they are shipped and you really do not know what you are getting. I bought some 1" fish off Aquabid awhile back, I was very pleased with the purchase as he even sent extras. My biggest problem was I was expecting 1" fish and got 3/4" fish. The tank divider I had made had to big of screen and they where allowed to enter the WRONG side of the tank. Needless to say Good thing there where extras sent. My only word of advice is Read discriptions carefull, try to buy within a 150 mile radius of home ( usually can get them priority mailed cheaper) and don't buy any live fish of Ebay... Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 9/5/2005 10:57:20 AM US Eastern Standard Time, muskie4817@... writes: Has anyone (I am sure some of you have) bought fish over the internet and if so is it worth looking into and who? I am leery about buying something alive that has to be mailed. Should I be? Thanks. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15206	From: paul helms	Date: 9/5/2005
Subject: Re: Pictus Catfish's Weird Behavior

it does sound like they are gettig ready to breed. the source is incorrect in saying that tthey do not spawn in captivity, it is just very rare. iknow 2 people whp have had them spawn, but the mjority of the eggs did not hatch.. they ended up with only 4-5 babies in the tank. to stop the aggressive eating start supplementing them with sinkig carnivore pellet, some brands are called shrimp pellets, but i think hagen has a little heasvier one specifically called sinking carnivore. if they have a good food source at the bottom of the tank, they should not go stalking larger fish like moolies. neon will never be safe. paul --- roughbuckincwgrl <roughbuckincwgrl@...> wrote: > Sorry my last post was so general. I bought two > pictus cats about > 4 years ago with out knowing anything about them. > They were about 1 > 1/2 inches long at the time. Now they are 5-6 > inches and very active. > > Everytime I add new fish to the tank they kill and > eat them. Last > week they killed two large mollys. Is there some > thing I can do to > stop this, they guy at the petsore said to rearrange > the tank, does > that sound right? > > Also one of them is longer and fatter than the > other and lately its > stomach has swollen and is lumpy. the cat became > more aggresive and I > thought that it might be spawning, but as I have > researched everything > says that pictus DO NOT breed in captivity so what > could this behavior > be? > Thanx, > ~Mandy~ > > > > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15207	From: paul helms	Date: 9/5/2005
Subject: Re: No fish + not much light on = smelly water?

are you using any carbon....its main use is to remove odor --- Beth Brownell <spencer_creek_studios@...> wrote: > I have rotated my lights on my tank and when I > turned > off my light on my east side of my tank I started to > get the hint of a smell coming from the tank itself. > > I opened the lid and took a wiff of the air around > it > and found a smell coming from the water itself. It > doesn't smell like fish pee but when I smelled my > tank > which had my fish in it, it had the same smell. > > Is something wrong with my empty 55 gallon tank or > is > it just fine? > > Thanks, > Beth > > http://fa.f-realm.com/ Fanfiction Axis. > http://e.webring.com/hub?ring=siriusblack Sirius > Black webring. > http://e.webring.com/hub?ring=remuslupin Remus Lupin > webring > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sailorsenshiocs/ for > all original and series characters of Sailor Moon. > http://www.livejournal.com/userinfo.bml?user=tropical_fishes > Tropical fish tank livejournal community. > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > ______________________________________________________ Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. http://store.yahoo.com/redcross-donate3/

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15208	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 9/5/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists every Monday! Monday September 5, 2005 8:00 pm - 9:00 pm This event repeats every week. The next reminder for this event will be sent in 3 hours, 4 minutes. Event Location: http://chat.thatpetplace.com/chat/chat.aspx Notes: Return to this site every Thursday from 8pm to 10pm and Monday from 8pm to 9pm (Eastern Time) to chat LIVE with one of our on-staff Marine Biologists. Learn about your fish, how to treat common maladies, get recommendations on accessories, food and live animal compatibility, or ask a question that only an expert could answer. MarineBio Chat every Thursday 8pm to 10pm EST, only from That Fish Place, The Original Aquatic Superstore. Attention MarineBio chat participants! The chat server is unavailable until 8pm Eastern Time. If you experience problems while trying to log on to the chat session ADVERTISEMENT ZIP code where you park at night. Do you currently have auto insurance? Yes No Have you had a U.S driver's license for more than 3 years? Yes No Has any driver in your household had 2 or more accidents or moving violations in the last 3 years? Yes No Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15209	From: DB1RDMAN@WMCONNECT.COM	Date: 9/5/2005
Subject: Digest Number 969 - BUYING FISH ON THE `NET

In a message dated 9/5/2005 3:36:44 PM Eastern Daylight Time, AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com writes: > From: "muskie4817" <muskie4817@...> > Subject: Any experience buying fish over the internet > > Has anyone (I am sure some of you have) bought fish over the internet > and if so is it worth looking into and who? I am leery about buying > something alive that has to be mailed. Should I be? Thanks. > Go to: aquabid.com Before you buy, you can check on comments made by people who bought fish from the particular seller, and get their comments as to service, etc., to see if they were satisfied. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15210	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 9/5/2005
Subject: Re: No fish + not much light on = smelly water?

My filters has carbon in it. This just started up a couple of days ago. I have both filters running at the same time in my 55 gallon tank. Beth -- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms <wtfmorlok@y...> wrote: > are you using any carbon....its main use is to remove odor > > -- Beth Brownell <spencer_creek_studios@y...> wrote: > > > I have rotated my lights on my tank and when I turned > off my light on my east side of my tank I started to get > the hint of a smell coming from the tank itself. > > > > I opened the lid and took a wiff of the air around > it and found a smell coming from the water itself. It > doesn't smell like fish pee but when I smelled my > tank which had my fish in it, it had the same smell. > > > > Is something wrong with my empty 55 gallon tank or > is it just fine? > > > > Thanks, > > Beth

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15211	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 9/5/2005
Subject: Re: Algae Eater

try an otocinclus catfish. they're small & good algae eaters. dawnmvo <cloversnamewastaken@...> wrote:Hello What would be a good algae eater for a 10 gallon tank? thanks Dawn Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15212	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 9/5/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists every Monday! Monday September 5, 2005 8:00 pm - 9:00 pm This event repeats every week. Event Location: http://chat.thatpetplace.com/chat/chat.aspx Notes: Return to this site every Thursday from 8pm to 10pm and Monday from 8pm to 9pm (Eastern Time) to chat LIVE with one of our on-staff Marine Biologists. Learn about your fish, how to treat common maladies, get recommendations on accessories, food and live animal compatibility, or ask a question that only an expert could answer. MarineBio Chat every Thursday 8pm to 10pm EST, only from That Fish Place, The Original Aquatic Superstore. Attention MarineBio chat participants! The chat server is unavailable until 8pm Eastern Time. If you experience problems while trying to log on to the chat session ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15213	From: Jasmine	Date: 9/5/2005
Subject: Live plants?

Can anyone recommend any live plants that can be placed in my 10 gallon with guppies, mollies, and platies? I want them to be able to nibble on it as I read this is a good variety for their diet. Is there a kind that anyone has had good experience with? Also, if I got a snail, would he eat them? We have a problem with land snails in our outside garden so I wasn't sure :)

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15214	From: Justin M.	Date: 9/5/2005
Subject: Re: Live plants?

At 08:58 PM 05/09/2005 +0000, you wrote: >Can anyone recommend any live plants that can be placed in my 10 >gallon with guppies, mollies, and platies? I want them to be able to >nibble on it as I read this is a good variety for their diet. Is there >a kind that anyone has had good experience with? Also, if I got a >snail, would he eat them? We have a problem with land snails in our >outside garden so I wasn't sure :) You can reasonably expect any aquatic snail to eat up any live plants you have. Even a small one can do a lot of damage. My experience with plants (at least having success with them) is minimal, but Anacharis are attractive, and I have seen my corys nibble on them. JM

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15215	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 9/5/2005
Subject: Re: Live plants?

najas Grass, anachris, hornwort, all good floating plants that can be weighed down with success. Snails are snails and they will eat vegetation. If you get pond snails in your home aquarium it will be almost impossible to egt rid of them btw. Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 9/5/2005 8:04:22 PM US Eastern Standard Time, warbyrd@... writes: You can reasonably expect any aquatic snail to eat up any live plants you have. Even a small one can do a lot of damage. My experience with plants (at least having success with them) is minimal, but Anacharis are attractive, and I have seen my corys nibble on them. JM [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15216	From: discusfishies	Date: 9/5/2005
Subject: Re: Any experience buying fish over the internet

I have bought discus through EBAY and have been very pleased I was lucky to buy from sellers who knew what they were doing as far as shipping goes,kinda expensive but worth it Laurie

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15217	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 9/5/2005
Subject: Re: Any experience buying fish over the internet

Laurie next time try AquaBid.com A lot more variations and people to buy from. Ebay has been talking for some time now of banning ANY live animals ( including fish ) from being sold. But who knows if that will ever take effect? Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 9/5/2005 9:34:01 PM US Eastern Standard Time, discusfishies@... writes: I have bought discus through EBAY and have been very pleased I was lucky to buy from sellers who knew what they were doing as far as shipping goes,kinda expensive but worth it Laurie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15218	From: discusfishies	Date: 9/5/2005
Subject: Re: Any experience buying fish over the internet

always looking for something new ,,,thanks The fish stores in this state really stink when it comes to variety seems like they always carry the same fish,maybee is the same LOL Laurie --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, FortWayneFish@a... wrote: > Laurie next time try AquaBid.com A lot more variations and people to buy > from. > Ebay has been talking for some time now of banning ANY live animals ( > including fish ) from being sold. But who knows if that will ever take effect? > > > Rob > NE Indiana > USA > > In a message dated 9/5/2005 9:34:01 PM US Eastern Standard Time, > discusfishies@y... writes: > I have bought discus through EBAY and have been very pleased > I was lucky to buy from sellers who knew what they were doing as far > as shipping goes,kinda expensive but worth it > Laurie > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15219	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 9/5/2005
Subject: Re: Live plants?

ive got the wendti plants, bronze and green.... they grow well with decent lighting but anachiris should be good... p.s. sorry for the horrible spelling, FortWayneFish@... wrote:najas Grass, anachris, hornwort, all good floating plants that can be weighed down with success. Snails are snails and they will eat vegetation. If you get pond snails in your home aquarium it will be almost impossible to egt rid of them btw. Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 9/5/2005 8:04:22 PM US Eastern Standard Time, warbyrd@... writes: You can reasonably expect any aquatic snail to eat up any live plants you have. Even a small one can do a lot of damage. My experience with plants (at least having success with them) is minimal, but Anacharis are attractive, and I have seen my corys nibble on them. JM [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15220	From: Chris	Date: 9/6/2005
Subject: new photos

There are a few more photos under "youcantryreachingme" - several of the flat-backed gobies collected locally, and one each of a lined barb and rosy barbs. Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15221	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 9/6/2005
Subject: Re: Any experience buying fish over the internet

I live in WI and purchased some very nice angelfish from a man in Indiana. They were shipped two day DHL and arrived in great shape. The fish left his house at 6:30 on a Monday morning and arrived at my house at 9:30 Wednesday morning. He even sent me an extra angelfish that has turned out to be my favorite fish. Shipping only cost me $18. The fish are growing faster than the ones that I purchased from a local fish store. Last week I purchased some corkscrew val from Aquabid. They are suppose to get shipped out today. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15222	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 9/6/2005
Subject: Re: Any experience buying fish over the internet

When I started my search for black lace angelfish, I couldn't find any in my area. Someone suggested aquabid.com. I found someone who had some blacks for sale and I emailed him. Turns out that he had black lace angels for sale also. The part that sucks is you don't get to see what you are buying before you get it. Most sellers are pretty good about sending you what you want. I specified black lace angelfish with standard tails and red eyes. I wanted them to be very dark, almost black. That is exactly what I got. You can also email a seller to see if they have anything else that you may need and most are willing to add to the auction buy for little to no extra money. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15223	From: J G	Date: 9/6/2005
Subject: mixed community

I've got a question about food... When I got my angel fish & a couple others - they also sold me a jar of tropical fish flakes. I also have a couple jars of Betta pellets for my bettas. As of Monday morning, I had 3 tanks, 2 with a single male betta each, and my bigger tank with an angel, pelco & otocat. I stopped up to walmart in the afternoon (just went to check out the DVDs see if there was any labor day sales) & ended up checking out the fish. I ended up picking up two female bettas to add to the community tank. The angel was a little nippy at first, but they seem to be doing well now that they've been together for about 24hrs... I'm still checking in on them frequently & have a backup place for the bettas just in case the calm is broken... My question is... what should I feed them? I've been putting a little of both foods into the tank & I noticed the angel trying to eat the pellets & the bettas trying to eat the flakes. Should I keep putting both kinds in, one or the other or ..... And if your interrested... Picon (or Pices - Battle Star Galatica variation - yeah I'm a scifi geek) is kinda pink-ish silver with light to dark purple fins, while Blue boy (yeah even though she's a she... code talk "Blue boy, this is blue leader" - got that from some TV show or somethin) is obviously blue (a nice dark blue) with blue/purple fins... Looks kinda of crown tail-ish - the fin comes to an end, and then there's little extensions like points on a crown... __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15224	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 9/6/2005
Subject: Re: mixed community

Welp, I have bettas in my community tanks. They eat the flake food and bloodworms like everyone else. You may find once they get comfortable with their new settings, that your female bettas will be nocturnal. They tend to find a place to "sleep" during the day, commnig out occasionally. but if you have nightlights, you'll find them as active as tiger barbs at night after the lights have gone out. Mine love to play in the bubbles from the air wand when the lights are out. ----- Original Message ----- From: "J G" <sir_grubs47@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, September 06, 2005 10:03 AM Subject: [AquaticLife] mixed community > I've got a question about food... When I got my angel > fish & a couple others - they also sold me a jar of > tropical fish flakes. I also have a couple jars of > Betta pellets for my bettas. As of Monday morning, I > had 3 tanks, 2 with a single male betta each, and my > bigger tank with an angel, pelco & otocat. > > I stopped up to walmart in the afternoon (just went to > check out the DVDs see if there was any labor day > sales) & ended up checking out the fish. I ended up > picking up two female bettas to add to the community > tank. The angel was a little nippy at first, but they > seem to be doing well now that they've been together > for about 24hrs... I'm still checking in on them > frequently & have a backup place for the bettas just > in case the calm is broken... > > My question is... what should I feed them? I've been > putting a little of both foods into the tank & I > noticed the angel trying to eat the pellets & the > bettas trying to eat the flakes. Should I keep > putting both kinds in, one or the other or ..... > > And if your interrested... Picon (or Pices - Battle > Star Galatica variation - yeah I'm a scifi geek) is > kinda pink-ish silver with light to dark purple fins, > while Blue boy (yeah even though she's a she... code > talk "Blue boy, this is blue leader" - got that from > some TV show or somethin) is obviously blue (a nice > dark blue) with blue/purple fins... Looks kinda of > crown tail-ish - the fin comes to an end, and then > there's little extensions like points on a crown... > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15225	From: thesydmonster	Date: 9/6/2005
Subject: Re: mixed community

My betta gets what everyone else gets... flake, pellets, freeze dried bloodworms, frozen foods, he even nibbles on the shrimp pellets, algae wafers and fresh veggies. Good luck with yours, they sound lovely :) Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "The Dragon Hunter" <dragon.hunter@d...> wrote: > Welp, I have bettas in my community tanks. They eat the flake food and > bloodworms like everyone else. You may find once they get comfortable with > their new settings, that your female bettas will be nocturnal. They tend to > find a place to "sleep" during the day, commnig out occasionally. but if you > have nightlights, you'll find them as active as tiger barbs at night after > the lights have gone out. Mine love to play in the bubbles from the air > wand when the lights are out. > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "J G" <sir_grubs47@y...> > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Tuesday, September 06, 2005 10:03 AM > Subject: [AquaticLife] mixed community > > > > I've got a question about food... When I got my angel > > fish & a couple others - they also sold me a jar of > > tropical fish flakes. I also have a couple jars of > > Betta pellets for my bettas. As of Monday morning, I > > had 3 tanks, 2 with a single male betta each, and my > > bigger tank with an angel, pelco & otocat. > > > > I stopped up to walmart in the afternoon (just went to > > check out the DVDs see if there was any labor day > > sales) & ended up checking out the fish. I ended up > > picking up two female bettas to add to the community > > tank. The angel was a little nippy at first, but they > > seem to be doing well now that they've been together > > for about 24hrs... I'm still checking in on them > > frequently & have a backup place for the bettas just > > in case the calm is broken... > > > > My question is... what should I feed them? I've been > > putting a little of both foods into the tank & I > > noticed the angel trying to eat the pellets & the > > bettas trying to eat the flakes. Should I keep > > putting both kinds in, one or the other or ..... > > > > And if your interrested... Picon (or Pices - Battle > > Star Galatica variation - yeah I'm a scifi geek) is > > kinda pink-ish silver with light to dark purple fins, > > while Blue boy (yeah even though she's a she... code > > talk "Blue boy, this is blue leader" - got that from > > some TV show or somethin) is obviously blue (a nice > > dark blue) with blue/purple fins... Looks kinda of > > crown tail-ish - the fin comes to an end, and then > > there's little extensions like points on a crown... > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15226	From: thesydmonster	Date: 9/6/2005
Subject: Re: Live plants?

In my guppy tank I have floating water sprite (which they seem to really like playing under), dwarf saggitaria (which they nibble on and eat the algae off of), various crypts, cabomba, java ferns, java moss, and anubias coffefolia. Those are all in my 37 gallon tank but I have very similar plants in my 10 gallon except no cabomba and I do have anacharis. In my 10 gallon tank I have malaysian trumpet snails and they don't seem to eat the growing plants, only the dead leaves. I also have nerite snails and I love them, great workers and they don't eat the plants at all. From what I have read, they don't breed in fresh water so it's easy to control the number you have. I have read the red ramshorn snails are nice, too, and don't eat the plants much. Have fun :) Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, kristopher helsing <punk3r12@y...> wrote: > ive got the wendti plants, bronze and green.... they grow well with decent lighting but anachiris should be good... p.s. sorry for the horrible spelling, > > FortWayneFish@a... wrote:najas Grass, anachris, hornwort, all good floating plants that can be weighed > down with success. > Snails are snails and they will eat vegetation. If you get pond snails in > your home aquarium it will be almost impossible to egt rid of them btw. > > Rob > NE Indiana > USA > > > In a message dated 9/5/2005 8:04:22 PM US Eastern Standard Time, > warbyrd@t... writes: > You can reasonably expect any aquatic snail to eat up any live > plants you have. Even a small one can do a lot of damage. My experience > with plants (at least having success with them) is minimal, but Anacharis > are attractive, and I have seen my corys nibble on them. > > JM > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine biology Biology > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15227	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 9/6/2005
Subject: light advice for deep planted tanks

I found a website that does a lot of work with planted tanks. I thought you all would like to see the reply I got when asked about lighting for my 150 gallon 30" tall tank. Linda > I did read everything on your website and learned a few > things. I did not see any recommendations for tall > planted tanks. > > Any advice would be great. A tall tank isn't really that hard to light. If a light setup has good reflectors, most of the light gets into the water and depth is not a concern. Six extra inches of water will not reduce the light intensity to any degree, not matter what you have heard or read otherwise. As a matter of fact, light will reflect of the walls of a taller tank and actually produce more light towards the bottom than in a shorter tank! The only problem is that taller plants might shade shorter plants, so the plant layout needs some careful consideration. For lights with excellent reflectors, I would strongly suggest looking into Aquarium Hobbyist Supply (http://ahsupply.com/index.html). They offer a "96watt Bright Kit" that come in two configurations - one 96w bulb with a reflector or 2 96w bulbs in a wider reflector. They are designed to retrofit into existing hoods or into custom hoods. These are compact fluorescent (CF) tubes and are only 34.5" long, making it an easy fit over your four foot tank. Don't worry about the 6" at each end not "covered by light" - the light spreads very well. I would suggest 3 bulbs, either 3 singles or a double and a single. Two watts per gallon is plenty of light. If you needed more brightness, you can always add a fourth tube. The single bulb reflectors are 4" wide and the double reflectors are 7" wide. You could easily go with 3 or 4 singles (not much price difference). You can also use a series of 55w Bright Kits. The 55w reflector is 18" long so you can fit a pair lengthwise in a 48" hood and space them so the light is more even side to side if that concerns you. You could use 6 of these to give you 2.2 watts per gallon (three rows of pairs). I think I would go with three 96 watt tubes. We use 4 55w kits on our 100g tanks (48" long, 18" wide, 22" deep). We have had them for four years and I think they are an excellent product. Contact Kim Bryant directly at AH Supply (1-585-473-8680) for his recommendations and to discuss how you would mount the lights. He is great to talk to, very knowledgeable and dedicated to aquarium lighting. And, of course, mention my name :-). [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15228	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 9/6/2005
Subject: Re: light advice for deep planted tanks

Hi Linda, Who ever told you that the depth of the tank does not matter as far as lighting is concerned is completely wrong. Without getting to complicated for every meter light penetrates water it loses 60% of it's intensity at the surface, so for your 30" deep tank the light intensity at the bottom will be approximately 45% less than at the surface. regards, unclenorm. --- Crazy4fids@... wrote: > I found a website that does a lot of work with > planted tanks. I thought you > all would like to see the reply I got when asked > about lighting for my 150 > gallon 30" tall tank. > Linda > > > I did read everything on your website and learned > a few > > things. I did not see any recommendations for > tall > > planted tanks. > > > > Any advice would be great. > > A tall tank isn't really that hard to light. If a > light setup has good > reflectors, most of the light gets into the water > and depth is not a concern. Six > extra inches of water will not reduce the light > intensity to any degree, not > matter what you have heard or read otherwise. As a > matter of fact, light > will reflect of the walls of a taller tank and > actually produce more light > towards the bottom than in a shorter tank! The only > problem is that taller plants > might shade shorter plants, so the plant layout > needs some careful > consideration. > > For lights with excellent reflectors, I would > strongly suggest looking into > Aquarium Hobbyist Supply > (http://ahsupply.com/index.html). > They offer a "96watt Bright Kit" that come in two > configurations - one 96w > bulb with a reflector or 2 96w bulbs in a wider > reflector. They are designed > to retrofit into existing hoods or into custom > hoods. These are compact > fluorescent (CF) tubes and are only 34.5" long, > making it an easy fit over your > four foot tank. Don't worry about the 6" at each > end not "covered by light" - > the light spreads very well. I would suggest 3 > bulbs, either 3 singles or a > double and a single. Two watts per gallon is plenty > of light. If you needed > more brightness, you can always add a fourth tube. > The single bulb reflectors > are 4" wide and the double reflectors are 7" wide. > You could easily go with 3 > or 4 singles (not much price difference). > > You can also use a series of 55w Bright Kits. The > 55w reflector is 18" long > so you can fit a pair lengthwise in a 48" hood and > space them so the light is > more even side to side if that concerns you. You > could use 6 of these to > give you 2.2 watts per gallon (three rows of pairs). > > > I think I would go with three 96 watt tubes. > > We use 4 55w kits on our 100g tanks (48" long, 18" > wide, 22" deep). We have > had them for four years and I think they are an > excellent product. > > Contact Kim Bryant directly at AH Supply > (1-585-473-8680) for his > recommendations and to discuss how you would mount > the lights. He is great to talk to, > very knowledgeable and dedicated to aquarium > lighting. And, of course, > mention my name :-). > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ___________________________________________________________ To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. http://uk.security.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15229	From: Jasmine	Date: 9/6/2005
Subject: Algae overload...

I have suddenly got a ton of bright green algae in my fry tank...It seems like no matter what I do to get it out it comes back thicker and greener the next day....what can I do? Is this safe for them?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15230	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 9/6/2005
Subject: Re: Algae overload...

what type of fry? some may eat the algea Jasmine <icecreamprincess86@...> wrote:I have suddenly got a ton of bright green algae in my fry tank...It seems like no matter what I do to get it out it comes back thicker and greener the next day....what can I do? Is this safe for them? Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15231	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 9/6/2005
Subject: Re: Live plants?

Rams horns are the DEVIL in planted tanks... they devoured my entire 15 gallon tank in like 3 days.... not COOLL! thesydmonster <TheSydMonster@...> wrote: In my guppy tank I have floating water sprite (which they seem to really like playing under), dwarf saggitaria (which they nibble on and eat the algae off of), various crypts, cabomba, java ferns, java moss, and anubias coffefolia. Those are all in my 37 gallon tank but I have very similar plants in my 10 gallon except no cabomba and I do have anacharis. In my 10 gallon tank I have malaysian trumpet snails and they don't seem to eat the growing plants, only the dead leaves. I also have nerite snails and I love them, great workers and they don't eat the plants at all. From what I have read, they don't breed in fresh water so it's easy to control the number you have. I have read the red ramshorn snails are nice, too, and don't eat the plants much. Have fun :) Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, kristopher helsing <punk3r12@y...> wrote: > ive got the wendti plants, bronze and green.... they grow well with decent lighting but anachiris should be good... p.s. sorry for the horrible spelling, > > FortWayneFish@a... wrote:najas Grass, anachris, hornwort, all good floating plants that can be weighed > down with success. > Snails are snails and they will eat vegetation. If you get pond snails in > your home aquarium it will be almost impossible to egt rid of them btw. > > Rob > NE Indiana > USA > > > In a message dated 9/5/2005 8:04:22 PM US Eastern Standard Time, > warbyrd@t... writes: > You can reasonably expect any aquatic snail to eat up any live > plants you have. Even a small one can do a lot of damage. My experience > with plants (at least having success with them) is minimal, but Anacharis > are attractive, and I have seen my corys nibble on them. > > JM > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine biology Biology > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15232	From: KttmfC	Date: 9/6/2005
Subject: Knifefish Tankmates....

i HAD an arowana and ut was 2 times the size of my 6 inch clown knife.... but the clownknife has felt it necessary to eat the arowana, now doesnan yone have any ideas for tankmates?? since i thought the arowana would have been good. btw it was a silver. thnks Kris

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15233	From: KttmfC	Date: 9/6/2005
Subject: Kribensis fry

My Kribs had babies.... now what do i do with them and how do i move them?? i dont want them to get eaten by the tankmates but i dont want them todie in a move too... anyone ever done this move with krib babies?? thanks. btw they are in a tank(100G) home to 3 discus, 2 Krib, 1 Gold ram, 4 neon tetras, 9 Red eye tetras, 5 corycats, 4 border botias, 1 dwarf gourami,6 Rainbow(2bosmani 2australian 2 neon) 1Siamensis , and one plec.Well planted and ill post pix later tonight. Thanks for any help possible!! Kris

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15234	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 9/7/2005
Subject: Re: Knifefish Tankmates....

You mean a 6” clown knife ate a 12” arowana? I have kept 6” clown knifes with fish like fully grown rainbows, red tailed shark, key hole cichlids, angels etc this was in a community tank with no small fish and the clown went fine until I got a tank dedicated for him as he would have outgrown that tank and fish. I really cannot believe that the clown killed the arowana unless the arowana died and the clown was just scavenging it. Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of KttmfC Sent: 07 September 2005 04:15 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Knifefish Tankmates.... i HAD an arowana and ut was 2 times the size of my 6 inch clown knife.... but the clownknife has felt it necessary to eat the arowana, now doesnan yone have any ideas for tankmates?? since i thought the arowana would have been good. btw it was a silver. thnks Kris Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15235	From: jules27au	Date: 9/7/2005
Subject: Fish Filters

Hi There, In a gold fish tank, that has an internal filter, do you need an airstone as well?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15236	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 9/7/2005
Subject: Re: light advice for deep planted tanks

Well, that's what I thought! Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15237	From: Justin M.	Date: 9/7/2005
Subject: Re: Fish Filters

At 08:59 AM 07/09/2005 +0000, you wrote: >Hi There, > >In a gold fish tank, that has an internal filter, do you need an >airstone as well? It mainly depends on the size of the tank, and the size and number of fish. My 33 gallon tank has four small fancy goldfish, a Penguin 200 filter and an 18" bubble bar. That seems to be enough. Does your internal filter create much surface disruption? If it doesn't, I'd definitely look at some extra aeration. If you're not sure, you can always just observe your fish...if they're "gasping" at the surface for oxygen, you know there's not enough. Hope this helps. JM

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15238	From: mike mather	Date: 9/7/2005
Subject: Re: light advice for deep planted tanks

Linda, Tank depth does matter if you plan on growing plants,well. I have a 30g tall(24")and a custom made all-glass hood with a Coralife compact flourescent fixture, housing 2x65watt bulbs for a total of 130w. This is a little over 4watts of light per gallon,which is excellent for growing just about anything you can think of. You need at least 2-2.5 watts per gallon for your tank and more if you want to grow the short, carpeting ground cover plants. I got my lights from http://www.hellolights.com/ and have been very happy with the price and service. Good luck! Mike. --- Crazy4fids@... wrote: > I found a website that does a lot of work with > planted tanks. I thought you > all would like to see the reply I got when asked > about lighting for my 150 > gallon 30" tall tank. > Linda > > > I did read everything on your website and learned > a few > > things. I did not see any recommendations for > tall > > planted tanks. > > > > Any advice would be great. > > A tall tank isn't really that hard to light. If a > light setup has good > reflectors, most of the light gets into the water > and depth is not a concern. Six > extra inches of water will not reduce the light > intensity to any degree, not > matter what you have heard or read otherwise. As a > matter of fact, light > will reflect of the walls of a taller tank and > actually produce more light > towards the bottom than in a shorter tank! The only > problem is that taller plants > might shade shorter plants, so the plant layout > needs some careful > consideration. > > For lights with excellent reflectors, I would > strongly suggest looking into > Aquarium Hobbyist Supply > (http://ahsupply.com/index.html). > They offer a "96watt Bright Kit" that come in two > configurations - one 96w > bulb with a reflector or 2 96w bulbs in a wider > reflector. They are designed > to retrofit into existing hoods or into custom > hoods. These are compact > fluorescent (CF) tubes and are only 34.5" long, > making it an easy fit over your > four foot tank. Don't worry about the 6" at each > end not "covered by light" - > the light spreads very well. I would suggest 3 > bulbs, either 3 singles or a > double and a single. Two watts per gallon is plenty > of light. If you needed > more brightness, you can always add a fourth tube. > The single bulb reflectors > are 4" wide and the double reflectors are 7" wide. > You could easily go with 3 > or 4 singles (not much price difference). > > You can also use a series of 55w Bright Kits. The > 55w reflector is 18" long > so you can fit a pair lengthwise in a 48" hood and > space them so the light is > more even side to side if that concerns you. You > could use 6 of these to > give you 2.2 watts per gallon (three rows of pairs). > > > I think I would go with three 96 watt tubes. > > We use 4 55w kits on our 100g tanks (48" long, 18" > wide, 22" deep). We have > had them for four years and I think they are an > excellent product. > > Contact Kim Bryant directly at AH Supply > (1-585-473-8680) for his > recommendations and to discuss how you would mount > the lights. He is great to talk to, > very knowledgeable and dedicated to aquarium > lighting. And, of course, > mention my name :-). > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ______________________________________________________ Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. http://store.yahoo.com/redcross-donate3/

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15239	From: Chris	Date: 9/7/2005
Subject: Re: Fish Filters

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Justin M." <warbyrd@t...> wrote: > At 08:59 AM 07/09/2005 +0000, you wrote: > >Hi There, > > > >In a gold fish tank, that has an internal filter, do you need an > >airstone as well? I presume the internal filter is electric, and is not run by the supply of air from an external pump. If it is air-driven, that that will be enough oxygen. Otherwise - as per the earlier response (below) > > It mainly depends on the size of the tank, and the size and number > of fish. My 33 gallon tank has four small fancy goldfish, a Penguin 200 > filter and an 18" bubble bar. That seems to be enough. Does your internal > filter create much surface disruption? If it doesn't, I'd definitely look > at some extra aeration. Another possibility to consider is planting some live plants - these will produce oxygen and consume nitrates - (which come from the breakdown of fish wastes and decomposing foods, etc). I was also reading recently that too much oxygen will raise the pH. In all liklihood you won't experience a severe case of this from just one extra airstone - just keep an eye on the pH every week or so and if it keeps drifting up (after you put in an airstone), maybe take the airstone out again. (other things will affect pH too of course!) Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15240	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 9/7/2005
Subject: Pacific Coast Cichlid Association (PCCA), 9/10/2005, 6:45 pm

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife Pacific Coast Cichlid Association (PCCA) Saturday September 10, 2005 6:45 pm - 9:45 pm This event repeats on the second Saturday of every month. Event Location: Round Table Pizza, 4302 Moorpark Avenue in San Jose, California Notes: The PCCA meets every second Saturday of the month. Meetings are held a the Round Table Pizza parlor located at 4302 Moorpark Avenue in San Jose, California http://www.cichlidworld.com/ ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15241	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 9/7/2005
Subject: A miracle of timing.

Today, my 30 gallon tank decided to spring a major leak. And I don't mean a nice slow leak. This leak was bad. I had to move my 14 fish to my 55 gallon tank within 15 minutes before the tank got emptied. Thank god I had my 55 gallon tank up and ready to have fish in it or I would be crying over the dead fish that I spent about nine months having in my tank. Now, I'm going to get a new tank in the morning and get it set up for more fish. Thankfully, my 55 gallon tank was ready to have fish in it. Beth

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15242	From: camdogkingsfan	Date: 9/7/2005
Subject: banjo catfish

These are one of the strangest fish I have ever seen. I had one of these a while back and it died. At least I think it did. I got another one on Monday and I went looking for him today and it looked died again. I picked him up took him out of the water. Nothing. No breathing, no movement, not a pep. Then all of a sudden I saw his mouth open. Still no movement. Very strange. Oh well i like odd fish anyways. Here are two link I found on him. Not much out there on the net on him. http://www.exotictropicals.com/encyclo/fresh/catfish/banjocat.php http://www.brooklands.co.nz/tropical/banjo_cat.htm Cameron

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15243	From: Chris	Date: 9/7/2005
Subject: Re: A miracle of timing.

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Beth Brownell" <spencer_creek_studios@y...> wrote: > This leak was bad. I hope your carpet / flooring / house is ok! And lucky too your fish got an up-sized new home, not a down-size! Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15244	From: Chris	Date: 9/7/2005
Subject: Re: banjo catfish

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "camdogkingsfan" <camdog@s...> wrote: > These are one of the strangest fish I have ever seen. Hi Cameron - very interesting critter. Check out the Fishbase entry: http://www.fishbase.org/Summary/speciesSummary.php? ID=12152&genusname=Bunocephalus&speciesname=coracoideus

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15245	From: Andrea	Date: 9/8/2005
Subject: Re: mixed community

My bettas, both males and females live with cherry barbs, silver mollies and long finned zebra danios at the moment. None are fussy eaters - they eat HBH fry bites, betta bites, flake food, daphnia, bloodworms- whatever falls in the tank (including unfortunate flies, on occasion) :) Everybody sleeps together in the java moss and plays in the bubbles from the air stone. It really is a true community tank. Andrea and many, many bettas :) --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "The Dragon Hunter" <dragon.hunter@d...> wrote: > Welp, I have bettas in my community tanks. They eat the flake food and > bloodworms like everyone else. You may find once they get comfortable with > their new settings, that your female bettas will be nocturnal. They tend to > find a place to "sleep" during the day, commnig out occasionally. but if you > have nightlights, you'll find them as active as tiger barbs at night after > the lights have gone out. Mine love to play in the bubbles from the air > wand when the lights are out. > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "J G" <sir_grubs47@y...> > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Tuesday, September 06, 2005 10:03 AM > Subject: [AquaticLife] mixed community > > > > I've got a question about food... When I got my angel > > fish & a couple others - they also sold me a jar of > > tropical fish flakes. I also have a couple jars of > > Betta pellets for my bettas. As of Monday morning, I > > had 3 tanks, 2 with a single male betta each, and my > > bigger tank with an angel, pelco & otocat. > > > > I stopped up to walmart in the afternoon (just went to > > check out the DVDs see if there was any labor day > > sales) & ended up checking out the fish. I ended up > > picking up two female bettas to add to the community > > tank. The angel was a little nippy at first, but they > > seem to be doing well now that they've been together > > for about 24hrs... I'm still checking in on them > > frequently & have a backup place for the bettas just > > in case the calm is broken... > > > > My question is... what should I feed them? I've been > > putting a little of both foods into the tank & I > > noticed the angel trying to eat the pellets & the > > bettas trying to eat the flakes. Should I keep > > putting both kinds in, one or the other or ..... > > > > And if your interrested... Picon (or Pices - Battle > > Star Galatica variation - yeah I'm a scifi geek) is > > kinda pink-ish silver with light to dark purple fins, > > while Blue boy (yeah even though she's a she... code > > talk "Blue boy, this is blue leader" - got that from > > some TV show or somethin) is obviously blue (a nice > > dark blue) with blue/purple fins... Looks kinda of > > crown tail-ish - the fin comes to an end, and then > > there's little extensions like points on a crown... > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15246	From: Patrick	Date: 9/8/2005
Subject: Re: Live plants?

At this time I will note that there are multiple species of snails going by the name "rams horn". Many of these snails are innocent little bottom feeders. Some don't get bigger than a pencil eraser, while others get larger than that. Not all of them eat plants. Now back to the discussion already in progress. Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "Thomas Jefferson once said, 'We should never judge a president by his age, only by his works.' And ever since he told me that, I stopped worrying." -Ronald Reagan -------Original Message------- Rams horns are the DEVIL in planted tanks... they devoured my entire 15 gallon tank in like 3 days.... not COOLL! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15247	From: Leslie	Date: 9/8/2005
Subject: Red Giant Danions, still

My danios are still red. Their fins are red and so are their bodies. I have treated but after two weeks there is no change. They are eating regularly, they weren't eating at all before. They have turned red in the past due to stress. Could this be it? I'm a bit frustrated. I have put a new fish into this tank and she has not shown any symptoms of redness or being ill as the others seemed to do before. They are both now acting normally but still extremely RED. Help. ? There are pics under the Blood Parrot album in AquaticLife. Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15248	From: Justin M.	Date: 9/8/2005
Subject: Re: Red Giant Danions, still

At 02:39 PM 08/09/2005 -0500, you wrote: >My danios are still red. Their fins are red and so are their bodies. I >have treated but after two weeks there is no change. They are eating >regularly, they weren't eating at all before. They have turned red in >the past due to stress. Could this be it? I'm a bit frustrated. I >have put a new fish into this tank and she has not shown any symptoms of >redness or being ill as the others seemed to do before. They are both >now acting normally but still extremely RED. In some cases, it takes a very long time for the internal damage to heal in these cases. My pearlscale goldfish had a bout of septicemia four months ago, and his gill plates are still red. If your fish are behaving normally at this point, I'd probably just give them time to get over this naturally. JM

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15249	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 9/8/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists every Thursday Thursday September 8, 2005 8:00 pm - 10:00 pm This event repeats every week. The next reminder for this event will be sent in 3 hours, 2 minutes. Event Location: http://chat.thatpetplace.com/chat/chat.aspx Notes: Return to this site every Thursday from 8pm to 10pm and Monday from 8pm to 9pm (Eastern Time) to chat LIVE with one of our on-staff Marine Biologists. Learn about your fish, how to treat common maladies, get recommendations on accessories, food and live animal compatibility, or ask a question that only an expert could answer. MarineBio Chat every Thursday 8pm to 10pm EST, only from That Fish Place, The Original Aquatic Superstore. Attention MarineBio chat participants! The chat server is unavailable until 8pm Eastern Time. If you experience problems while trying to log on to the chat session ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15250	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 9/8/2005
Subject: Re: A miracle of timing.

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Chris" <youcantryreachingme@y...> wrote: > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Beth Brownell" > <spencer_creek_studios@y...> wrote: > > This leak was bad. > > I hope your carpet / flooring / house is ok! And lucky too your > fish got an up-sized new home, not a down-size! > > Chris. Thankfully, we had no damage to the floor or to the carpet. The fishes are enjoying their new home and they are all alive. Beth

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15251	From: Patrick	Date: 9/8/2005
Subject: Re: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologis

What is this message and what is its purpose? Do we need to get it every day? Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "To be prepared for war is one of the most effective means of preserving peace." -George Washington [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15252	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 9/8/2005
Subject: Re: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologis

I agree Patrick, except sometimes it is several times a day. Mike -----Original Message----- From: Patrick <patrickmn@...> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thu, 8 Sep 2005 17:08:35 -0500 (Central Standard Time) Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists every Thursday, 9/8/2005, 8:00 pm What is this message and what is its purpose? Do we need to get it every day? Patrick, an American Fish Guy. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15253	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 9/8/2005
Subject: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists e

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists every Thursday Thursday September 8, 2005 8:00 pm - 10:00 pm This event repeats every week. Event Location: http://chat.thatpetplace.com/chat/chat.aspx Notes: Return to this site every Thursday from 8pm to 10pm and Monday from 8pm to 9pm (Eastern Time) to chat LIVE with one of our on-staff Marine Biologists. Learn about your fish, how to treat common maladies, get recommendations on accessories, food and live animal compatibility, or ask a question that only an expert could answer. MarineBio Chat every Thursday 8pm to 10pm EST, only from That Fish Place, The Original Aquatic Superstore. Attention MarineBio chat participants! The chat server is unavailable until 8pm Eastern Time. If you experience problems while trying to log on to the chat session ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15254	From: Patrick	Date: 9/8/2005
Subject: Re: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologis

There it is again. :) Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "To be prepared for war is one of the most effective means of preserving peace." -George Washington [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15255	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 9/8/2005
Subject: Re: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biol...

In a message dated 9/8/2005 9:08:10 PM Eastern Standard Time, patrickmn@... writes: <<<There it is again. :) >>> Man, those biologists must be desperate for someone to talk to.... ;-) "~It's not easy being marine....?~" (apologies to kermit) Vicky, who's just glad it wasn't just her =) Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Call (301) 402-8625 or write: hgparker@... =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: FCR-Cancer-Support@yahoogroups.com Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@... 919-513-1467, Dr London @ calondon@... 530-754-5711 _AND_ Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15256	From: Leslie	Date: 9/8/2005
Subject: BAD spots on fish

The blood parrot has a white spot, near the face, that is actually going into his skin, not protruding. The firemouth has a spot on the side of his face. A light spot in the middle of the circle with a darker area around it. He also has spotting on the front of his face, a grouping of it. WHAT is this? I just read about a disease that turns the skin a milky color and this is also happening in the blood parrot. I can't remember what the disease was but I will look again after I post this. Sinking holes in one fish and another with awful spotting. Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15257	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 9/8/2005
Subject: The San Diego Tropical Fish Society , 9/11/2005, 7:00 pm

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife The San Diego Tropical Fish Society Sunday September 11, 2005 7:00 pm - 8:00 pm This event repeats on the second Sunday of every month. Event Location: room 101, Casa Del Prado, Balboa Park at 7:00 PM Street: SAN DIEGO TROPICAL FISH SOCIETY, PO Box 4156, North Park Station City, State, Zip: San Diego, CA 92164 Phone: 619-281-FISH Notes: http://www.geocities.com/sandiegofishfan/ You are cordially invited to attend our next meeting in room 101, Casa Del Prado, Balboa Park at 7:00 PM on the second Sunday of the month. Visitors are always welcome! 619-281-FISH ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15258	From: T	Date: 9/9/2005
Subject: NEED HELP

Hello all, little problem with one of my two Cory Catfish. One of them has gotten into a scuffle with someone else or something and has lost an eye. These 2 catdish have been with me since my starter tank years ago. I am so bummmed by this. I nedicated the tank with Meallfix... but is these anything else I can do? also another question of this topic..what do I feed a Ramshorn snail? thx - Terry

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15259	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 9/9/2005
Subject: Re: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologis

Apparently, it seems to be something that someone (tropicalfishman) as adding into the groups calendar. The calendar appointment is set to send a reminder to the entire group.. obvious to the way it functions. I am not really aware if this is something that has been permitted by the group owner but is something that can be stopped??? Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Patrick Sent: 09 September 2005 02:08 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists every Thursday, 9/8/2005, 8:00 pm There it is again. :) Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "To be prepared for war is one of the most effective means of preserving peace." -George Washington [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15260	From: Leslie	Date: 9/9/2005
Subject: Permanent Pop-Eye

My betta still has pop-eye. It looks so awful and painful. I have treated with every med that claims to work, kept water conditions optimal, etc... His fins were starting to shrivel at the edges and the medicated pepso food cleared that up. (Then it could have been something else, but that's when I noticed a change in the fins.) Should I put him down and out of his misery or is their maybe something I haven't tried? I've used pepso food, melafix, jungle tabs (forget which but claimed to cure pop-eye), maracyn 2. Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15261	From: Chris	Date: 9/9/2005
Subject: Re: NEED HELP

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "T" <bigter4@y...> wrote: > One of them > has lost > an eye. > is these anything else I can do? I'm sure we'd love to help - but I suspect not many of us have had that experience. Are there any vets in the group? My suspicion is that the fish will take care of itself - you tend to see that in nature - animals recovering from severe injuries and getting by. I would just keep checking for any signs of disease developing... also another question of this > topic..what do I feed a Ramshorn snail? thx - Terry not sure on snails... will leave this to someone else. Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15262	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 9/9/2005
Subject: Re: NEED HELP

I have a Danios that lost an eye somehow about 6 months ago and he is doing fine. If it is still an open would, Melafix should prevent an infection, but keep an eye (pun intended) on it. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of T Sent: Friday, September 09, 2005 6:46 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] NEED HELP Hello all, little problem with one of my two Cory Catfish. One of them has gotten into a scuffle with someone else or something and has lost an eye. These 2 catdish have been with me since my starter tank years ago. I am so bummmed by this. I nedicated the tank with Meallfix... but is these anything else I can do? also another question of this topic..what do I feed a Ramshorn snail? thx - Terry Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15263	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 9/9/2005
Subject: Re: MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologis

the mod or owner should be able to go in and delete announcements in the calendar. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nimish Mathur Sent: Friday, September 09, 2005 7:38 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists every Thursday, 9/8/2005, 8:00 pm Apparently, it seems to be something that someone (tropicalfishman) as adding into the groups calendar. The calendar appointment is set to send a reminder to the entire group.. obvious to the way it functions. I am not really aware if this is something that has been permitted by the group owner but is something that can be stopped??? Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Patrick Sent: 09 September 2005 02:08 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] MarineBio chat is back! Talk live to one of our Marine Biologists every Thursday, 9/8/2005, 8:00 pm There it is again. :) Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "To be prepared for war is one of the most effective means of preserving peace." -George Washington [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15264	From: T	Date: 9/9/2005
Subject: Re: NEED HELP

Thx to all that responded. I put in the Melafix and will keep an "eye" on him. He and is buddy arte two of my favs. thx - Ter < > I have a Danios that lost an eye somehow about 6 months ago and he is doing > fine. If it is still an open would, Melafix should prevent an infection, but > keep an eye (pun intended) on it. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of T > Sent: Friday, September 09, 2005 6:46 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] NEED HELP > > > Hello all, little problem with one of my two Cory Catfish. One of them > has gotten into a scuffle with someone else or something and has lost > an eye. These 2 catdish have been with me since my starter tank years > ago. I am so bummmed by this. I nedicated the tank with Meallfix... but > is these anything else I can do? also another question of this > topic..what do I feed a Ramshorn snail? thx - Terry > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio > logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= > 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15265	From: Leslie	Date: 9/9/2005
Subject: Cichlid shop in Dallas

There was once a cichlid store in Dallas mentioned on here...does anybody know the name of it or the link to their site? Thanks, Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15266	From: Leslie	Date: 9/9/2005
Subject: Metals in tank

Can you put pewter figures in a tank? Would it cause problems? lol I feel like a total idiot for asking this. I'm just hoping to hear that it will be OK. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15267	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 9/9/2005
Subject: Re: Metals in tank

Pewter is a lead alloy. I would not recommend putting any metallic object in your tank as the metals will leach into the water. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Leslie Sent: Friday, September 09, 2005 3:05 PM To: uniquaria@yahoogroups.com; AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com; naturalaquariumenthusiast@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Metals in tank Can you put pewter figures in a tank? Would it cause problems? lol I feel like a total idiot for asking this. I'm just hoping to hear that it will be OK. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15268	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 9/9/2005
Subject: Re: NEED HELP

The Cory should recover fine and do well with one eye. When I discovered one of my mine had lost an eye it had already healed up and that was without any medication. I do not know the purpose of Melafix but I would use something with Aloe or some other kind of bio coat. Just try and seperate all of them from whatever did the damage to his eye. Mike -----Original Message----- From: Chris <youcantryreachingme@...> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Fri, 09 Sep 2005 13:59:54 -0000 Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: NEED HELP --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "T" <bigter4@y...> wrote: > One of them > has lost > an eye. > is these anything else I can do? I'm sure we'd love to help - but I suspect not many of us have had that experience. Are there any vets in the group? My suspicion is that the fish will take care of itself - you tend to see that in nature - animals recovering from severe injuries and getting by. I would just keep checking for any signs of disease developing... also another question of this > topic..what do I feed a Ramshorn snail? thx - Terry not sure on snails... will leave this to someone else. Chris. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15269	From: Jasmine	Date: 9/9/2005
Subject: cichlid help!

I have just been given a 'baby' cichlid...I was at the pet shop to pick up some livebearer fry which I like to raise, and the woman said she had a baby cichlid that they didn't have the time or resources to keep alive at the store and asked me to take him. I just read that they don't look like adult fish with color until they are like 2 months old...so is he actually a baby? he's a very bright orange with lighter colored spots, he's just gorgeous but I don't know what to do with him!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15270	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 9/9/2005
Subject: Re: cichlid help!

Any pictures by any chance? Did the shop mention what kind of cichlid? Mike -----Original Message----- From: Jasmine <icecreamprincess86@...> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Fri, 09 Sep 2005 20:10:02 -0000 Subject: [AquaticLife] cichlid help! I have just been given a 'baby' cichlid...I was at the pet shop to pick up some livebearer fry which I like to raise, and the woman said she had a baby cichlid that they didn't have the time or resources to keep alive at the store and asked me to take him. I just read that they don't look like adult fish with color until they are like 2 months old...so is he actually a baby? he's a very bright orange with lighter colored spots, he's just gorgeous but I don't know what to do with him! Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15271	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 9/9/2005
Subject: Re: cichlid help!

post pix and we can help! Jasmine <icecreamprincess86@...> wrote: I have just been given a 'baby' cichlid...I was at the pet shop to pick up some livebearer fry which I like to raise, and the woman said she had a baby cichlid that they didn't have the time or resources to keep alive at the store and asked me to take him. I just read that they don't look like adult fish with color until they are like 2 months old...so is he actually a baby? he's a very bright orange with lighter colored spots, he's just gorgeous but I don't know what to do with him! Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15272	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 9/9/2005
Subject: Re: NEED HELP

Melafix is melalueca oil and aloe. Malaleuca oil has antibiotic properties, but won;t trash your bio-filter. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Deenerz@... Sent: Friday, September 09, 2005 6:23 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: NEED HELP The Cory should recover fine and do well with one eye. When I discovered one of my mine had lost an eye it had already healed up and that was without any medication. I do not know the purpose of Melafix but I would use something with Aloe or some other kind of bio coat. Just try and seperate all of them from whatever did the damage to his eye. Mike -----Original Message----- From: Chris <youcantryreachingme@...> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Fri, 09 Sep 2005 13:59:54 -0000 Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: NEED HELP --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "T" <bigter4@y...> wrote: > One of them > has lost > an eye. > is these anything else I can do? I'm sure we'd love to help - but I suspect not many of us have had that experience. Are there any vets in the group? My suspicion is that the fish will take care of itself - you tend to see that in nature - animals recovering from severe injuries and getting by. I would just keep checking for any signs of disease developing... also another question of this > topic..what do I feed a Ramshorn snail? thx - Terry not sure on snails... will leave this to someone else. Chris. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15273	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 9/9/2005
Subject: Re: cichlid help!

What an opportunity to learn about cichlids :-D Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Jasmine Sent: Friday, September 09, 2005 3:10 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] cichlid help! I have just been given a 'baby' cichlid...I was at the pet shop to pick up some livebearer fry which I like to raise, and the woman said she had a baby cichlid that they didn't have the time or resources to keep alive at the store and asked me to take him. I just read that they don't look like adult fish with color until they are like 2 months old...so is he actually a baby? he's a very bright orange with lighter colored spots, he's just gorgeous but I don't know what to do with him! Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15274	From: Deirdre Marr	Date: 9/10/2005
Subject: UV Sterilizer Advice?

I would like to put UV Sterilizers on my 60 gal freshwater and 50 saltwater tank. Can you offer advice as to recommended brands (that are affordable), methods of installation, etc.? Thank you! Deirdre Marr Dallas, TX

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15275	From: paul helms	Date: 9/10/2005
Subject: Re: UV Sterilizer Advice?

18w turbo twist by coralife --- Deirdre Marr <dastx@...> wrote: > I would like to put UV Sterilizers on my 60 gal > freshwater and 50 saltwater tank. Can you > offer advice as to recommended brands (that are > affordable), methods of installation, etc.? > > Thank you! > > Deirdre Marr > Dallas, TX > > > > ______________________________________________________ Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. http://store.yahoo.com/redcross-donate3/

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15276	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 9/11/2005
Subject: Re: Knifefish Tankmates....

well i watched the clown snap the arowana in half so it happened, thanks for the ideas on other fish ill give them a try Nimish Mathur <nimmat4@...> wrote:You mean a 6” clown knife ate a 12” arowana? I have kept 6” clown knifes with fish like fully grown rainbows, red tailed shark, key hole cichlids, angels etc this was in a community tank with no small fish and the clown went fine until I got a tank dedicated for him as he would have outgrown that tank and fish. I really cannot believe that the clown killed the arowana unless the arowana died and the clown was just scavenging it. Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of KttmfC Sent: 07 September 2005 04:15 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Knifefish Tankmates.... i HAD an arowana and ut was 2 times the size of my 6 inch clown knife.... but the clownknife has felt it necessary to eat the arowana, now doesnan yone have any ideas for tankmates?? since i thought the arowana would have been good. btw it was a silver. thnks Kris Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15277	From: Jasmine	Date: 9/11/2005
Subject: Re: cichlid help!

I was trying to get a picture but they weren't coming out very well...the shop said he showed up in a shipment and they didn't know what kind he was. its hard to get a good picture, when you shine light on him you can't see his colors as well, he's almost see-through so I haven't been able to get a good picture. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Deenerz@a... wrote: > Any pictures by any chance? > Did the shop mention what kind of cichlid? > Mike > > -----Original Message----- > From: Jasmine <icecreamprincess86@y...> > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Fri, 09 Sep 2005 20:10:02 -0000 > Subject: [AquaticLife] cichlid help! > > > I have just been given a 'baby' cichlid...I was at the pet shop to > pick up some livebearer fry which I like to raise, and the woman said > she had a baby cichlid that they didn't have the time or resources to > keep alive at the store and asked me to take him. I just read that > they don't look like adult fish with color until they are like 2 > months old...so is he actually a baby? he's a very bright orange with > lighter colored spots, he's just gorgeous but I don't know what to do > with him! > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the > reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> > i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15278	From: Jasmine	Date: 9/11/2005
Subject: Re: cichlid help!

I was thinking that same thing...the most life changing opportunities usually come unexpectedly, and I love embracing them...the very first site I went to about cichlids said they were so unique and fun to watch and I am very intrigued. At first I was a little nervous...all of a sudden I have this fish that may be a few inches long and needs another whole tank to itself, and my experience has only been in goldfish, guppies, mollies, and platies. I am really looking forward to this experience now. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > What an opportunity to learn about cichlids :-D > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Jasmine > Sent: Friday, September 09, 2005 3:10 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] cichlid help! > > > I have just been given a 'baby' cichlid...I was at the pet shop to > pick up some livebearer fry which I like to raise, and the woman said > she had a baby cichlid that they didn't have the time or resources to > keep alive at the store and asked me to take him. I just read that > they don't look like adult fish with color until they are like 2 > months old...so is he actually a baby? he's a very bright orange with > lighter colored spots, he's just gorgeous but I don't know what to do > with him! > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15279	From: Jerry	Date: 9/11/2005
Subject: My Green Tank

I have a 38 G. plastic tank that I purchased from a local shop. I have had algie problems from day 1. I have purchased chemicles, and everything that was available. I have boiled everything, bought bottled water. Taken out all of the plastic plants etc.. still I get green water in 2 days after a complete change and even boiling the rocks. it is just green water. nothing that gets caught in the filters or that you can see floating. Please help. I have a 30 g. glass tank next to it and it never gets green. They do not sit near a window. PLEASE HELP...Do I sell and buy glass?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15280	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 9/11/2005
Subject: Re: My Green Tank

Algae, whether it be in the form of the stuff that grows on a surface or the green water that you are experiencing, requires a few things to live and grow. It needs light, and it needs a food source. The green water is a bit easier to cure, though it may not seem that to you right now. Green water is a relatively common occurrence in a new tank, and it will seem the more you do to get rid of it, the more it grows. The last statement is true to a certain extent. A new tank is going through a lot of processes that gives the algae the environment it need to grow. So, rule number one is be patient. Right now your tank is trying to create a cycle. You do not say what you have in the tank right now, so it is difficult to judge what kind of load you have in the tank. The nitrogen cycle takes about 6 weeks to establish itself in your tank (see rule number one). It is important that you track the progress of the establishment of the cycle. This means that you should be measuring the levels of ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate as the cycle progresses. You will note that the ammonia level will rise, then stabilize, then start dropping. AS the ammonia level is dropping, you will note a rise in the level of nitrite. Like the ammonia, the nitrite will rise, level off, then start dropping. At the time the nitrite starts dropping, you will note a rise in nitrate. If you have animals in your tank during this period, it can be hard on them. There are a number of products sold that claim to remove ammonia from your tank, and you may be tempted to use them. Don't. This will inhibit the establishment of your cycle. There are a few products that claim to Change the ammonia to a non-toxic form. There is only one I know for sure that works, and that is Kordon's Amquel. However, when you use Amquel, you cannot use a test kit that uses Nesslar reagents, as they will give you false readings. You need to use a test kit using the Salicylate reagents to measure your ammonia levels. (Please note that I do know the person who invented Amquel.) While the tank is cycling, there are two schools of thought regarding water changes. One is don't do it, the other is do water changes. I will normally do water changes on a weekly basis during the cycle, if I have fish in the tank. This does not prolong the cycle and is beneficial to the animals in the tank. I'll do no more than a 10% water change during this period, though. After the cycle has completed, water changes will serve to remove excess nitrates in the water as well as other organic compounds that will be found in the water that are produced by the fish and not removed by normal filtration. There are products that are supposed to reduce the time the tank takes to cycle. I cannot vouch for any of them as the ones I have tried have not worked. However, some here have reported some success with a product called Biospira. Perhaps they can jump in here to report on their experiences with this product, or you can search the archives for their reports. So, rule number two is don't try to short circuit the cycle. Once your cycle has been completed, you should notice that the green water is gone, or is dissipating. If it is not, then you are going to need to determine why not. If this tank is getting more light than the other tank(s) you have, reduce the light. There may not be enough competition of the available food sources in that tank, namely nitrate. Add more plants or remove the source of the food, which may be a dead critter, excess food in the tank, etc. Check your nitrate level in the tank. If it is more than about 20-40 ppm, do more water changes to bring it down. Check the level of nitrate in your tap water. If it is high, your tank level will also be high. Should this be the case, water changes will not help much to reduce your algae and may actually encourage it. Live plants are definitely the best way to go to help provide an algae free tank. The problem with using live plants is that they take some time to become established and out compete the algae for food. Once they do, however, the change can be dramatic. Algal spores are always present. They just need the right conditions to grow. Remove one of those conditions, and you are on your way to resolving your problem. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Jerry Sent: Sunday, September 11, 2005 1:25 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] My Green Tank I have a 38 G. plastic tank that I purchased from a local shop. I have had algie problems from day 1. I have purchased chemicles, and everything that was available. I have boiled everything, bought bottled water. Taken out all of the plastic plants etc.. still I get green water in 2 days after a complete change and even boiling the rocks. it is just green water. nothing that gets caught in the filters or that you can see floating. Please help. I have a 30 g. glass tank next to it and it never gets green. They do not sit near a window. PLEASE HELP...Do I sell and buy glass? Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15281	From: pam phetteplace	Date: 9/11/2005
Subject: Surprise.....Bristlenose plecos

Hi all I was doing a "deep" clean on my 55 g and removed a piece of african (?) wood and luckily placed it in a plastic tray and then I saw the little guys, probably about 1/4 inch long, I put the wood and the little plecos back in the tank. My questions are can they survive in a community tank at this age, or do I need to try and move them out? What can I offer for food.? I gave them some microworms and peas. They are under the wood so I dont see what they are doing. This tank contains platies(3), angels (2), cory cats (5), tiger loach (1), and a variety of tetras. Any advice is appreciated. --------------------------------- Yahoo! for Good Watch the Hurricane Katrina Shelter From The Storm concert [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15282	From: pam phetteplace	Date: 9/11/2005
Subject: Surprise.....Bristlenose plecos

Hi all I was doing a "deep" clean on my 55 g and removed a piece of african (?) wood and luckily placed it in a plastic tray and then I saw the little guys, probably about 1/4 inch long, I put the wood and the little plecos back in the tank. My questions are can they survive in a community tank at this age, or do I need to try and move them out? What can I offer for food.? I gave them some microworms and peas. They are under the wood so I dont see what they are doing. This tank contains platies(3), angels (2), cory cats (5), tiger loach (1), and a variety of tetras. Any advice is appreciated. --------------------------------- Yahoo! for Good Watch the Hurricane Katrina Shelter From The Storm concert [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15283	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 9/11/2005
Subject: Re: Surprise.....Bristlenose plecos

Your BN will be able to eat anything at 1/4" problem is they are still small enough to be picked off, by larger tetras and the loach. You can keep them in the tank or remove them its up to you. Once your Pair of BN have a few more spanws they should start laying eggs every 4-6 weeks and the hatch rate will get betetr and better. I currently have approx 200 BN fry ranging from 1/2"- 2" out of 3 spawns :-) Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15284	From: pamphetteplace	Date: 9/11/2005
Subject: Re: Surprise.....Bristlenose plecos

Thanks Rob.....very kewl re: your 200 BNs. Do you have a tank dedicated to just them? Do you think more of mine would live if I put them in a grow out tank with betta fry. I really want some of them to make it.-- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, FortWayneFish@a... wrote: > Your BN will be able to eat anything at 1/4" problem is they are still small > enough to be picked off, by larger tetras and the loach. You can keep them in > the tank or remove them its up to you. > Once your Pair of BN have a few more spanws they should start laying eggs > every 4-6 weeks and the hatch rate will get betetr and better. I currently have > approx 200 BN fry ranging from 1/2"- 2" out of 3 spawns :-) > > > > > > Rob > NE Indiana > USA > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15285	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 9/11/2005
Subject: Re: Surprise.....Bristlenose plecos

I think if you place the driftwwod and BN fry into seperate tank you will have a better chance of keeping most of them alive. The Baby BN won't bother the Bettas so there is no problem there. At this size they should be able to eat almost anything. I give my Fry tank ( less then 3/4" ) weekly suppliments of cucumber or squash. I feed a staple diet of Moistened crushed flake They tend to grow better in warmer water over ( 75*F) and with regular weekly waterchanges. I have BN coming out my...well Bn in almost all my tanks. I have given approx 100 to local Hobbyists, donated 50 or so to Local Aquarium Society Auctions, and traded another 30 or so into LFS for store credits. It takes about 8-9 months before the beard/bristles start to grow so there is a LONG wait for them to get sexable, unless you know how to tell diffrence by looking at the underside. ( I don't ) Best of luck Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 9/11/2005 12:24:25 PM US Eastern Standard Time, pamphetteplace@... writes: Thanks Rob.....very kewl re: your 200 BNs. Do you have a tank dedicated to just them? Do you think more of mine would live if I put them in a grow out tank with betta fry. I really want some of [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15286	From: Chris	Date: 9/11/2005
Subject: Re: cichlid help!

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Jasmine" <icecreamprincess86@y...> wrote: > I was thinking that same thing...the most life changing opportunities > usually come unexpectedly, and I love embracing them...the very first > site I went to about cichlids said they were so unique and fun to > watch and I am very intrigued. cichlids = never a dull moment. people don't want to hear it, for whatever reason, but truth is that cichlids can be as smart as cats or dogs. They certainly learn who their owner(s) are and exhibit behaviour that most would call "being happy" when they see their owner. Some will only accept food from their owner and if the owner goes on holiday they mope about for days, not eating, until their owner gets back. I had a 5' community tank of cichlids once with a rock landscape. Each fish had it's territory; the whole thing was delicately balanced. If one fish strayed out of line, it'd quickly be put back in place. Now turn on the TV. All of a sudden, 20 or 30 cichlids are madly swimming up and down in the corner of the tank watching the flickering light of the TV and vying for the best viewing spot. (I think I've posted this here before!). Turn off the TV and bam! everybody back to defending their territories! Certainly I'd go so far as to say many cichlids will let their owners pat them. Like I said. Many people don't want to hear that about a fish, but don't be fooled - these are complex creatures! There are other families of fish besides cichlids that exhibit the same levels of intelligence and complex behaviour and communication, but by far the cichlids would have to be the most popular in the aquarium industry. Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15287	From: Leslie	Date: 9/11/2005
Subject: spotting, diseased face

My firemouth has spots on his face. At first there was one, dark middle with a lighter edge. Then there were a cluster of light spots all with darker edges. They are still there and are spreading, now over 3 days. I am treating with maracide but as I am seeing more spots, I don't know that it is helping. I can not find anything on the net that shows what this might be. Please help. Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15288	From: Chris	Date: 9/11/2005
Subject: Re: My Green Tank

Great answer Steve. Good luck Jerry. Don't be put off and think this whole process is too complex to bother with. It all simply boils down to doing a few tests (simple enough), and, as Steve said, being patient while the tank settles. One more thing to watch is the pH. Whilst setting up a new tank, you want to be checking this pretty much daily until it stabalises and doesn't drift up or down. Excess wastes can help drop the pH too low. Excess oxygen (eg millions of plants would produce lots of oxygen and so would an airstone) can raise the pH (and this makes the ammonia/nitrites more toxic). Certainly keep shell products out of the water (they raise pH and hardness) unless you are specifically keeping fish that like these conditions (such as an african-cichlid only tank). Once all the levels settle down and stay consistent for a few days, start slowly building up the fish stock. The reason for "slow" (a few fish per week, for example) is that each introduction of fish will increase the ammonia levels (via fish wastes, uneaten foods). Your bacterial filtration will have to break this down to nitrites, then nitrates. The ammonia and nitrites are toxic to fish, so if you put all 30 fish (or whatever) in there at once, all of a sudden you have another spike in toxic chemicals and you will lose fish. Nutshell: do things slowly, introduce fish sparingly. Keep an eye on ammonia and nitrites in particular, then also pH. When the tank is stable, see if you still have an algal problem. Remove as much algae as you can with each water change. (eg if algae is growing on the tank sides, scrape that down before the water change). Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15289	From: Chris	Date: 9/11/2005
Subject: Re: spotting, diseased face

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > My firemouth has spots on his face. > Please help. Can you get some photos? Can you tell if the spots are on the surface of the skin (eg raised bumps) or under the skin? Also - what are the current water conditions? pH in particular, but also ammonia if you have a kit. If I recall correctly, the parrot went ballistic recently, didn't it? This might have placed the firemouth under extra stress, and possibly damaged the firemouth's slime coat if he was attacked (making him prone to infection and/or parasites). Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15290	From: Leslie	Date: 9/11/2005
Subject: Re: spotting, diseased face

I don't think I can get photos. Every time he tries to come out the blood parrot chases him into the back. I think the blood parrot has hole in the head. !!! No, I know he does. Could it possibly be that the firemouth has the start of this? It doesn't look like the place on the BP at all. I hate this for my fish. About 3 weeks ago the tank went into a cess pool when the filter went out the one responsible for tending to it didn't do it. I think I am still seeing the results from those conditions and I need to know how to tend to them. All parameters are perfect but yet diseases are popping up everywhere. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Chris Sent: Sunday, September 11, 2005 9:27 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: spotting, diseased face --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > My firemouth has spots on his face. > Please help. Can you get some photos? Can you tell if the spots are on the surface of the skin (eg raised bumps) or under the skin? Also - what are the current water conditions? pH in particular, but also ammonia if you have a kit. If I recall correctly, the parrot went ballistic recently, didn't it? This might have placed the firemouth under extra stress, and possibly damaged the firemouth's slime coat if he was attacked (making him prone to infection and/or parasites). Chris. Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15291	From: Chris	Date: 9/11/2005
Subject: Re: spotting, diseased face

I would expect that firemouths can get hole-in-the-head - but I think someone else better post more info on the topic... or else hit the websearch (which i will do now)... Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15292	From: Chris	Date: 9/11/2005
Subject: Re: spotting, diseased face

This post identifies hole-in-the-head as having a new name: head and lateral line erosion (HLLE). It also says that HHLE is different to hexamita but that the two often occur together. http://animal-world.com/encyclo/fresh/information/Diseases.htm#HLLE Here are two more info links: http://www.aquariumfish.net/information/hole_in_the_head.htm http://www.thetropicaltank.co.uk/hdhith.htm The possible treatments cover a variety of things, primarily including frequent water changes, improving filtration, moving from undergravel filtration to a "bio-wheel" (or similar, i expect), using less activated carbon, improving nutrition and paying attention to specific vitamins. In other words - quite simply it seems over time that an aquarium just can't provide the freshness of the natural environment. It makes me wonder how commonly HLLE is seen in the wild, and whether sick fish in the wild would die sooner than in an aquarium. In other words, is this disease often occurring naturally, leading to a "cleansing" of the population of fish? Not that that helps you - but maybe the above links will help you decide if it's the onset of hole-in-the-head. Given your BP has it, and the causative agents are probably infectious (indeed, probably present in every tank and every fish anyway) - I'd say hole-in-the- head is a real possibility. Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15293	From: T	Date: 9/12/2005
Subject: "One" eyed CAtfish update

Thx to all that gave me hope and suggestions on what to do with my Catfish who lost an eye. He seems to be fine... I was able to cut off any onfection with the Melafix, and he has been eating and acting normal. It seems as if he will be ok, been about 5 days now. Thank You all for your help. On a side note.....I dont post all the time, but I read the posts everyday, It is just a great feeling to know I can come here for questions/advice. When I noticed this guy had lost an eye...My fist thought was.,." Iwonder what the board will say?" thx - Terry

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15294	From: Leslie	Date: 9/12/2005
Subject: Vitamin enriched food

I am needing to buy some fish food that is seriously stocked with vitamins, an effort to get rid of HITH in my blood parrot. I have found a few but am not sure of the quality and was wondering if anyone had some suggestions on one that you have had experience with. Thanks, Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15295	From: rojeriko	Date: 9/12/2005
Subject: Re: Vitamin enriched food

Hi, I've just started using the Kent vitamin supplement. It's called something like Kent Zoe Freshwater . You just soak any food in this vitamin mix before feeding the fish. I don't know if it's any good for HITH or not. There are also medicated fish food from Jungle Labs. They might be worthwhile to check Cheers, Murat --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > I am needing to buy some fish food that is seriously stocked with > vitamins, an effort to get rid of HITH in my blood parrot. I have found > a few but am not sure of the quality and was wondering if anyone had > some suggestions on one that you have had experience with. > > Thanks, > Leslie > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15296	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 9/12/2005
Subject: Re: Vitamin enriched food

Try Metronidazole for HITH, in the form of Aquarium Pharmaceuticals Hex- Out, Jungle Labs Hole-N-Head Guard or Seachem Metronidazole. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > I am needing to buy some fish food that is seriously stocked with > vitamins, an effort to get rid of HITH in my blood parrot. I have found > a few but am not sure of the quality and was wondering if anyone had > some suggestions on one that you have had experience with. > > Thanks, > Leslie > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15297	From: Jasmine	Date: 9/12/2005
Subject: Cichlid...I may have figured it out

After looking around, I think Ernie is a red zebra cichlid. The ones I see in the store look very similar to him, and the pictures I see on the internet as well. He's very small though, I don't know how old. He got moved into his tank and he absolutely loves it. His baby cup is in there with him and he likes to hide in there. I know they're supposed to like rocks and not plants but I had a plant in there just to see and he seems to enjoy rubbing himself against it. I have also cultured some algae which he seems to like. If anyone has any other suggestions or has had experience with this type, please let me know.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15298	From: Jasmine	Date: 9/12/2005
Subject: Re: cichlid help!

thats really cool, thanks! I've noticed he's very different from any other fish I've had. he has a little plastic cup in his tank (I read they like hiding places) and whenever there is a loud noise or he gets scared, he flashes right into the cup and waits for the danger to be gone. I'm really excited to see what else he'll do. :) --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Chris" <youcantryreachingme@y...> wrote: > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Jasmine" > <icecreamprincess86@y...> wrote: > > I was thinking that same thing...the most life changing > opportunities > > usually come unexpectedly, and I love embracing them...the very > first > > site I went to about cichlids said they were so unique and fun to > > watch and I am very intrigued. > > cichlids = never a dull moment. > > people don't want to hear it, for whatever reason, but truth is that > cichlids can be as smart as cats or dogs. They certainly learn who > their owner(s) are and exhibit behaviour that most would call "being > happy" when they see their owner. Some will only accept food from > their owner and if the owner goes on holiday they mope about for > days, not eating, until their owner gets back. > > I had a 5' community tank of cichlids once with a rock landscape. > Each fish had it's territory; the whole thing was delicately > balanced. If one fish strayed out of line, it'd quickly be put back > in place. > > Now turn on the TV. All of a sudden, 20 or 30 cichlids are madly > swimming up and down in the corner of the tank watching the > flickering light of the TV and vying for the best viewing spot. (I > think I've posted this here before!). Turn off the TV and bam! > everybody back to defending their territories! > > Certainly I'd go so far as to say many cichlids will let their owners > pat them. Like I said. Many people don't want to hear that about a > fish, but don't be fooled - these are complex creatures! > > There are other families of fish besides cichlids that exhibit the > same levels of intelligence and complex behaviour and communication, > but by far the cichlids would have to be the most popular in the > aquarium industry. > > Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15299	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 9/12/2005
Subject: Re: Cichlid...I may have figured it out

Er. Jasmin? What all do you have in the tank with this baby cichlid? Sorry to disappoint you a bit but the Red Zebra belongs to one of most aggressive group of cichlids (Mbunas). If you have the likes of guppies and mollies with it, then they may be in danger of their life in the next few months to come. Also, they don’t care much about the size of the fish they attack as a 2” mbuna can easily give a 6” oscar cichlid (also aggressive) a run for life. Red zebras are however one of the less aggressive of this group so you may be lucky. Also, the way they are grown also has a lot to contribute to their aggression so if he is grown with guppy babies, there might be a small possibility that she may not develop the instincts she would when grown with other cichlids. I mention “She” because a “he” will most definitely develop aggressive instincts. Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Jasmine Sent: 12 September 2005 17:36 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Cichlid...I may have figured it out After looking around, I think Ernie is a red zebra cichlid. The ones I see in the store look very similar to him, and the pictures I see on the internet as well. He's very small though, I don't know how old. He got moved into his tank and he absolutely loves it. His baby cup is in there with him and he likes to hide in there. I know they're supposed to like rocks and not plants but I had a plant in there just to see and he seems to enjoy rubbing himself against it. I have also cultured some algae which he seems to like. If anyone has any other suggestions or has had experience with this type, please let me know. Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15300	From: Karen	Date: 9/12/2005
Subject: Katrina: Help with Bettas rescued from N.O.

We went into N.O. today and rescued 2 Bettas and two cats. the cats I know how to take care of. I have cichlids so I'm fish savvy but have never had Bettas. I have two small tanks I can put them in. I need to know the water parameters and temp to try to moderate them. I'll test the water they came in and see what it is but not sure what it was suppose to be. Any help is greatly appreciated. Karen

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15301	From: T	Date: 9/12/2005
Subject: Re: Katrina: Help with Bettas rescued from N.O.

Hey Karen, Great Job... try this for the bettas -- http://www.fishforums.net/index.php? s=4b43cfd95897a1cde1b5681da4f47fbc&showforum=56 - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Karen" <oilfield_brat@y...> wrote: > We went into N.O. today and rescued 2 Bettas and two cats. the cats I > know how to take care of. I have cichlids so I'm fish savvy but have > never had Bettas. I have two small tanks I can put them in. I need to > know the water parameters and temp to try to moderate them. I'll test > the water they came in and see what it is but not sure what it was > suppose to be. Any help is greatly appreciated. > > Karen

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15302	From: Justin M.	Date: 9/12/2005
Subject: Re: Katrina: Help with Bettas rescued from N.O.

At 07:12 PM 12/09/2005 +0000, you wrote: >We went into N.O. today and rescued 2 Bettas and two cats. the cats I >know how to take care of. I have cichlids so I'm fish savvy but have >never had Bettas. I have two small tanks I can put them in. I need to >know the water parameters and temp to try to moderate them. I'll test >the water they came in and see what it is but not sure what it was >suppose to be. Any help is greatly appreciated. > >Karen Bettas are pretty easy to care for. They are not particularly fussy about pH, and is long as the tank is cycled and heated (in the 76-80 f neighbourhood) they'll be fine. JM

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15303	From: Ben Noreau	Date: 9/12/2005
Subject: Katrina rescue

There was a post regarding fish resuce being done for fish displaced by the hurricane. I would like to express interest in assisting with this effort. If there is anything that I can do please post. (I would be willing to take fish too). Ben __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15304	From: snailcrazymom	Date: 9/12/2005
Subject: Why do my fish tanks smell?

Please can someone tell me why my fish tanks are smelling? I haven't noticed it before the last two weeks or so. I have 2 ten gallon tanks, they are on a stand one on top of the other and they are kept in my master bedroom. If I am gone for the day, I come home and walk in the bedroom to a nasty musty/moldy smell. I haven't had this problem before and Love my tanks in my master suite. What can I do? Why are they smelling? My water is fine I do all the yadda yadda yadda maintenance on them that I need too each week...water levels are fine...just tested and all permitters are fine and each filter had a new charcoal insert (I use whispers) if they continue to this I am going to have to take the tanks down and do away with them as my husband is not too thrilled about the smell and I cant say that I am either. Please help what can I do...why are they smelling is there something I can add or do to stop it...this is the first I've had this trouble.... Thanks Rhonda

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15305	From: Karen	Date: 9/12/2005
Subject: Re: Katrina: Help with Bettas rescued from N.O.

Will they eat flake food or New Life Spectrum pellets? They seem to be ok in the tanks. One is dark blue and the other is white. Very pretty fish. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Justin M." <warbyrd@t...> wrote: > At 07:12 PM 12/09/2005 +0000, you wrote: > >We went into N.O. today and rescued 2 Bettas and two cats. the cats I > >know how to take care of. I have cichlids so I'm fish savvy but have > >never had Bettas. I have two small tanks I can put them in. I need to > >know the water parameters and temp to try to moderate them. I'll test > >the water they came in and see what it is but not sure what it was > >suppose to be. Any help is greatly appreciated. > > > >Karen > > Bettas are pretty easy to care for. They are not particularly > fussy about pH, and is long as the tank is cycled and heated (in the 76-80 > f neighbourhood) they'll be fine. > > JM

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15306	From: Andreas	Date: 9/12/2005
Subject: Re: Why do my fish tanks smell?

the tanks have increased the humidity in your bedroom which in turn has cause mold (fungus) to grow somewhere in the bedroom. I fight with molds and fungus constantly in my house. It has killed a bunch of my terrestrial plants. In the aquarium it usually 1st appears as a white film on the water surface, when you touch the surface the white stuff appears to "break" appart. I got a fancy air filter (the sharper image one) and it has made the problem somewhat better. Also lowering the temperature in your bedrrom (by cranking the AC) helps reduce the spread. If I am right I would suggest you act now before it start invading you as well. Andreas On 9/12/05, snailcrazymom <yarncrazymom@...> wrote: > > Please can someone tell me why my fish tanks are smelling? I haven't > noticed it before the last two weeks or so. I have 2 ten gallon > tanks, they are on a stand one on top of the other and they are kept > in my master bedroom. If I am gone for the day, I come home and walk > in the bedroom to a nasty musty/moldy smell. I haven't had this > problem before and Love my tanks in my master suite. What can I do? > Why are they smelling? My water is fine I do all the yadda yadda > yadda maintenance on them that I need too each week...water levels > are fine...just tested and all permitters are fine and each filter had > a new charcoal insert (I use whispers) if they continue to this I am > going to have to take the tanks down and do away with them as my > husband is not too thrilled about the smell and I cant say that I am > either. Please help what can I do...why are they smelling is there > something I can add or do to stop it...this is the first I've had this > trouble.... > > Thanks > Rhonda > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > 毀畔�虜.><((((�gt;.毀畔�虜.毀畔��gt;<((((�gt; �毀畔�� , .毀畔�.><((((�gt; > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <�(((><.毀畔�虜.毀畔��lt;�(((><�毀畔�� , .毀畔�.<�(((><毀畔�虜. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > ------------------------------ > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > - Visit your group "AquaticLife<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife>" > on the web. > - To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com<AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > - Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>. > > > ------------------------------ > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15307	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 9/12/2005
Subject: Re: Surprise.....Bristlenose plecos

Hey Rob...you should sell those little guys on Aquabid.com! Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15308	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 9/12/2005
Subject: Re: Katrina: Help with Bettas rescued from N.O.

well i have never heard you had to keep bettas between 76-80 I think most ppl don't have them in heated tanks.. mine stay in a pretty dark cold room and thrive.. they are all between 3 and 5 years old the temps change from high 50's in the winter to 80's in the summer.. and they adapt well... Shannon At 07:12 PM 12/09/2005 +0000, you wrote: >We went into N.O. today and rescued 2 Bettas and two cats. the cats I >know how to take care of. I have cichlids so I'm fish savvy but have >never had Bettas. I have two small tanks I can put them in. I need to >know the water parameters and temp to try to moderate them. I'll test >the water they came in and see what it is but not sure what it was >suppose to be. Any help is greatly appreciated. > >Karen Bettas are pretty easy to care for. They are not particularly fussy about pH, and is long as the tank is cycled and heated (in the 76-80 f neighbourhood) they'll be fine. JM [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15309	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 9/12/2005
Subject: Re: Why do my fish tanks smell?

I have noticed when i overfill my tanks and the water splashes up on the plastic parts on top and creates a moldish film that my tanks start to smell but i just take a clothe and clean it all off and things seem fine... so you by chance have a lot of film and stuff on the back of the tank where it is open from your cords and stuff... Shannon Please can someone tell me why my fish tanks are smelling? I haven't noticed it before the last two weeks or so. I have 2 ten gallon tanks, they are on a stand one on top of the other and they are kept in my master bedroom. If I am gone for the day, I come home and walk in the bedroom to a nasty musty/moldy smell. I haven't had this problem before and Love my tanks in my master suite. What can I do? Why are they smelling? My water is fine I do all the yadda yadda yadda maintenance on them that I need too each week...water levels are fine...just tested and all permitters are fine and each filter had a new charcoal insert (I use whispers) if they continue to this I am going to have to take the tanks down and do away with them as my husband is not too thrilled about the smell and I cant say that I am either. Please help what can I do...why are they smelling is there something I can add or do to stop it...this is the first I've had this trouble.... Thanks [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15310	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 9/12/2005
Subject: Re: Katrina: Help with Bettas rescued from N.O.

yes mine eat those and i alst have them eating bloodworms too... but what you have will be fine.. Shannon Will they eat flake food or New Life Spectrum pellets? They seem to be ok in the tanks. One is dark blue and the other is white. Very pretty fish. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15311	From: Snow	Date: 9/13/2005
Subject: Re: Katrina: Help with Bettas rescued from N.O.

ive kept bettas in a variety of different unheated bowls and tanks and thought it was ok too but when i got my 5 gallon and keep it at 75 degrees what a difference. if you think they are thriving and active now, you should see the difference when the water is heated. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, agentscullyeyore@a... wrote: > > well i have never heard you had to keep bettas between 76-80 I think most > ppl don't have them in heated tanks.. mine stay in a pretty dark cold room and > thrive.. they are all between 3 and 5 years old the temps change from high > 50's in the winter to 80's in the summer.. and they adapt well... Shannon > > At 07:12 PM 12/09/2005 +0000, you wrote: > >We went into N.O. today and rescued 2 Bettas and two cats. the cats I > >know how to take care of. I have cichlids so I'm fish savvy but have > >never had Bettas. I have two small tanks I can put them in. I need to > >know the water parameters and temp to try to moderate them. I'll test > >the water they came in and see what it is but not sure what it was > >suppose to be. Any help is greatly appreciated. > > > >Karen > > Bettas are pretty easy to care for. They are not particularly > fussy about pH, and is long as the tank is cycled and heated (in the 76-80 > f neighbourhood) they'll be fine. > > JM > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15312	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 9/13/2005
Subject: Re: Katrina: Help with Bettas rescued from N.O.

Bettas are pretty tough when it comes to water temps, though they cannot take it too cold. I've seen them in bowls with no heater whatsoever and doing fine. Mine seem to like it high 70's-low 80's best.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15313	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 9/13/2005
Subject: Re: Why do my fish tanks smell?

Add some zeolite to the filter, perhaps? Do you have any live plants in the water? What kind of fish?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15314	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 9/13/2005
Subject: Re: Katrina: Help with Bettas rescued from N.O.

They'll eat flake food, but mine like a varied diet of flake, pellet, bloodworm, brine shrimp, and plankton

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15315	From: snailcrazymom	Date: 9/13/2005
Subject: Re: Why do my fish tanks smell?

> Add some zeolite to the filter, perhaps? Do you have any live plants > in the water? What kind of fish? I do not have any type of white film or molds growing anywhere...I have a few fancy gup's and 2 apple snails in one and one large cana and a few babies in the other...nothing live in these tanks due to the snailies... The only thing different Ive done lately is use the tetra Balance stuff??? I dunno but its driving me crazy Im ready to tear the things apart, scrub them and start again.. Rho

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15316	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 9/13/2005
Subject: Re: Katrina: Help with Bettas rescued from N.O.

1 of my bettas will eat anything. the other 2 will only eat hikari gold baby betta pellets and mysis. you should try feeding them the flakes & pellets and if they don't like them try getting betta pellets. --- Karen <oilfield_brat@...> wrote: > Will they eat flake food or New Life Spectrum pellets? They seem to > be ok in the tanks. One is dark blue and the other is white. Very > pretty fish. > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Justin M." <warbyrd@t...> wrote: > > At 07:12 PM 12/09/2005 +0000, you wrote: > > >We went into N.O. today and rescued 2 Bettas and two cats. the > cats I > > >know how to take care of. I have cichlids so I'm fish savvy but > have > > >never had Bettas. I have two small tanks I can put them in. I > need to > > >know the water parameters and temp to try to moderate them. I'll > test > > >the water they came in and see what it is but not sure what it was > > >suppose to be. Any help is greatly appreciated. > > > > > >Karen > > > > Bettas are pretty easy to care for. They are not > particularly > > fussy about pH, and is long as the tank is cycled and heated (in > the 76-80 > > f neighbourhood) they'll be fine. > > > > JM > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15317	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 9/13/2005
Subject: Re: Katrina: Help with Bettas rescued from N.O.

yeah bettas seem to be pretty hardy. i've had mine in temps ranging from as low as 68 to as high as 82, depending upon the temp in the room (i don't have a/c). i have fans on all my tanks but i only 2 of my betta tanks have heaters. the other 2 bettas don't seem to need heaters. i don't keep the temp too high as they show stress lines more with higher temps as opposed to lower temps. --- agentscullyeyore@... wrote: > > well i have never heard you had to keep bettas between 76-80 I think most > ppl don't have them in heated tanks.. mine stay in a pretty dark cold room and > thrive.. they are all between 3 and 5 years old the temps change from high > 50's in the winter to 80's in the summer.. and they adapt well... Shannon > > At 07:12 PM 12/09/2005 +0000, you wrote: > >We went into N.O. today and rescued 2 Bettas and two cats. the cats I > >know how to take care of. I have cichlids so I'm fish savvy but have > >never had Bettas. I have two small tanks I can put them in. I need to > >know the water parameters and temp to try to moderate them. I'll test > >the water they came in and see what it is but not sure what it was > >suppose to be. Any help is greatly appreciated. > > > >Karen > > Bettas are pretty easy to care for. They are not particularly > fussy about pH, and is long as the tank is cycled and heated (in the 76-80 > f neighbourhood) they'll be fine. > > JM > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15318	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 9/13/2005
Subject: Re: Katrina: Help with Bettas rescued from N.O.

im sure this will spark a nasty discussions things always turn that way on this group but we had this same discussion not to long ago and most were in agreement of keeping them more close to the native habitat.. Shannon: ive kept bettas in a variety of different unheated bowls and tanks and thought it was ok too but when i got my 5 gallon and keep it at 75 degrees what a difference. if you think they are thriving and active now, you should see the difference when the water is heated. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15319	From: Patrick	Date: 9/13/2005
Subject: Re: Katrina: Help with Bettas rescued from N.O.

I will say two things: first is that I have kept bettas at room temp (73°) and at 76+°, and the ones in warmer water lasted a whole lot longer. Second I have read about an experiment that found that bettas live longest and are most active at 80°. Most, if not 99%, of betta profiles say 75-85°, most are 80°. If I was only keeping bettas, I'd keep them at 80°. I once tried to find the average temperature of Thailand. In Phuket, it is 79-85°. Water probably stays around 80° year round. Patrick, an American Fish Guy. "To be prepared for war is one of the most effective means of preserving peace." -George Washington -------Original Message------- im sure this will spark a nasty discussions things always turn that way on this group but we had this same discussion not to long ago and most were in agreement of keeping them more close to the native habitat.. Shannon [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15320	From: llrdhsktr	Date: 9/14/2005
Subject: Converting established cold water tank to tropical

I have an established 25 gallon cold water tank(goldfish). It is 5 or 6 years running now. It has a Fluval 204 canister filter and Eclipse biowheel system doing the filtering. If I wanted to change over to tropical fish, does anything special need to be done other than heating the water to the higher temperature? Of course I would be removing the goldfish elsewhere to new digs... Lester

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15321	From: Chris	Date: 9/14/2005
Subject: Re: Converting established cold water tank to tropical

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "llrdhsktr" <llrdhsktr@y...> wrote: > If I wanted to change over to > tropical fish, does anything special need to be done To my mind, add the heater and build your new fish stock slowly. If you already have plants, you might want to research whether they will handle the warmer water. If you don't, then consider buying some. That said, I'm not speaking from experience - has someone else been through the process? Specifically, I suspect the greatest potential problem is the biological filtration breaking down because of the temperature increase. This would be bad because the dead bacteria would a) no longer break down wastes (obviously), but b) contribute to the wastes as well. If no-one else writes in with first hand experience, consider heating your tank, running it for a few days (without fish) and monitoring the ammonia in your water. Again, add fish slowly and watch that the ammonia doesn't build up. Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15322	From: joequality1980	Date: 9/14/2005
Subject: African frogs--not for smaller/comunity tanks

I acquired 2 African frogs for free several weeks ago from someone who couldnt take care of them. I thought they were the common dwarf kind, but ended up being the size of apples. No problem since I have enough space in my community tank. Anyway, they were shy at first, but eventually were able to go to surface and eat the regular fish food with all the other tropical fish. Cool, I thought, until one of them had the balls to nab one of my swordtails. I was getting ready for work when I heard a splash and casually looked at the tank: in a flash one of the frogs had a swordtail tail sticking out of his mouth. After a brief chase, I grabbed the frog was eventually able to persuade him to release the fish. The sword had been critically damaged and died that night. I also noticed one of the sword juveniles (about 7 months old) was missing. I was already late for work, so I decided to administer "aquarium justice" and put both frogs in my cichlid tank. Maybe I'm just naive, but I was surprised to see that the frog had the audacity to eat a fully-grown swordtail (a little over 2" ); why didnt they go after the smaller black neons or otos? At any rate, some advice is to be careful about keeping the regular sized African frogs with fish less than 3"

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15323	From: Sue Boswell	Date: 9/14/2005
Subject: Re: Converting established cold water tank to tropical

The bacteria will be fine, I would get the heater calibrated in a bucket before adding it to the tank. Take out the goldies, vac the gravel & do a water change - add the heater, bring the temp up with warm water & you are ready to go. Some plants may not like warmer temps but in the summer a coldwater tank indoors is probably at tropical temperature anyway. Sue ----- Original Message ----- From: "llrdhsktr" <llrdhsktr@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wednesday, September 14, 2005 3:05 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] Converting established cold water tank to tropical I have an established 25 gallon cold water tank(goldfish). It is 5 or 6 years running now. It has a Fluval 204 canister filter and Eclipse biowheel system doing the filtering. If I wanted to change over to tropical fish, does anything special need to be done other than heating the water to the higher temperature? Of course I would be removing the goldfish elsewhere to new digs... Lester

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15324	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 9/14/2005
Subject: Re: African frogs--not for smaller/comunity tanks

In a message dated 9/14/2005 2:38:13 PM Eastern Standard Time, crazy.joe.walcek@... writes: <<<I acquired 2 African frogs for free several weeks ago from someone who couldnt take care of them. I thought they were the common dwarf kind, but ended up being the size of apples.>>> It sounds like you got african CLAWED frogs. I've never seen dwarfs that large and, while dwarfs will grab anything they can latch on to (they don't see very well), it's the clawed ones you have to watch out for. Vicky Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Call (301) 402-8625 or write: hgparker@... =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: FCR-Cancer-Support@yahoogroups.com Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@... 919-513-1467, Dr London @ calondon@... 530-754-5711 _AND_ Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15325	From: llrdhsktr	Date: 9/14/2005
Subject: Re: Converting established cold water tank to tropical

I have no live plants in the tank, just rocks and fake wood. Also forgot to mention that there is also a UV sterilizer to prevent green water. Algae grows on the glass and everything rather quickly in the summer. I used to keep chinese algae eaters to keep the algae under control, but they kept harassing the goldfish so they got the boot. I'm down to just two fish, a feeder comet and a shubunkin and they are pigs when it comes to eating. When I started the tank years ago I had as many as a dozen small goldfish but lost the others over time. Thanks for the advice! Lester --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Sue Boswell" <feathers@s...> wrote: > The bacteria will be fine, I would get the heater calibrated in a bucket > before adding it to the tank. Take out the goldies, vac the gravel & do a > water change - add the heater, bring the temp up with warm water & you are > ready to go. > > Some plants may not like warmer temps but in the summer a coldwater tank > indoors is probably at tropical temperature anyway. > > Sue > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "llrdhsktr" <llrdhsktr@y...> > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Wednesday, September 14, 2005 3:05 PM > Subject: [AquaticLife] Converting established cold water tank to tropical > > > I have an established 25 gallon cold water tank(goldfish). It is 5 or > 6 years running now. It has a Fluval 204 canister filter and Eclipse > biowheel system doing the filtering. If I wanted to change over to > tropical fish, does anything special need to be done other than > heating the water to the higher temperature? Of course I would be > removing the goldfish elsewhere to new digs... Lester

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15326	From: joequality1980	Date: 9/14/2005
Subject: Re: African frogs--not for smaller/comunity tanks

thanks, Vicky. I looked them up and thats exactly what I have (had). > It sounds like you got african CLAWED frogs. I've never seen dwarfs that > large and, while dwarfs will grab anything they can latch on to (they don't see > very well), it's the clawed ones you have to watch out for. >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15327	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 9/14/2005
Subject: Re: African frogs--not for smaller/comunity tanks

sounds as if you have african clawed frogs which will eat anything they can fit in their mouths! --- joequality1980 <crazy.joe.walcek@...> wrote: > I acquired 2 African frogs for free several weeks ago from someone > who couldnt take care of them. I thought they were the common dwarf > kind, but ended up being the size of apples. No problem since I have > enough space in my community tank. Anyway, they were shy at first, > but eventually were able to go to surface and eat the regular fish > food with all the other tropical fish. Cool, I thought, until one of > them had the balls to nab one of my swordtails. > I was getting ready for work when I heard a splash and casually > looked at the tank: in a flash one of the frogs had a swordtail tail > sticking out of his mouth. After a brief chase, I grabbed the frog > was eventually able to persuade him to release the fish. The sword > had been critically damaged and died that night. I also noticed one > of the sword juveniles (about 7 months old) was missing. I was > already late for work, so I decided to administer "aquarium justice" > and put both frogs in my cichlid tank. > Maybe I'm just naive, but I was surprised to see that the frog had > the audacity to eat a fully-grown swordtail (a little over 2" ); why > didnt they go after the smaller black neons or otos? > At any rate, some advice is to be careful about keeping the regular > sized African frogs with fish less than 3" > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez My reef addiction is growing stronger every day!!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15328	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 9/14/2005
Subject: Re: Converting established cold water tank to tropical

I'd break it down completely, clean and sterilize it, then cycle it. Goldfish have different pathogens than "tropicals", so this would be the prudent course of action. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of llrdhsktr Sent: Wednesday, September 14, 2005 10:05 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Converting established cold water tank to tropical I have an established 25 gallon cold water tank(goldfish). It is 5 or 6 years running now. It has a Fluval 204 canister filter and Eclipse biowheel system doing the filtering. If I wanted to change over to tropical fish, does anything special need to be done other than heating the water to the higher temperature? Of course I would be removing the goldfish elsewhere to new digs... Lester Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15329	From: Patrick	Date: 9/14/2005
Subject: Re: Converting established cold water tank to tropical

Sounds a little extreme. Especially since the uv sterilizer will take out a lot of what is floating in the water. I'd expect that there would be a minisucle chance of cross contamination. Patrick ----- Original Message ----- From: Steve Szabo To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, September 14, 2005 9:04 PM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Converting established cold water tank to tropical I'd break it down completely, clean and sterilize it, then cycle it. Goldfish have different pathogens than "tropicals", so this would be the prudent course of action. \\Steve// [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15330	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 9/14/2005
Subject: Re: Converting established cold water tank to tropical

I did see that later. Unfortunately, on this list, the threads are incessantly broken and difficult to follow. With the UV in place. Presuming that tit was kept up, you would be right. If the bulb was not regularly cleaned and replaces, however, I would stand by my original post. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Patrick Sent: Wednesday, September 14, 2005 10:21 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Converting established cold water tank to tropical Sounds a little extreme. Especially since the uv sterilizer will take out a lot of what is floating in the water. I'd expect that there would be a minisucle chance of cross contamination. Patrick ----- Original Message ----- From: Steve Szabo To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, September 14, 2005 9:04 PM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Converting established cold water tank to tropical I'd break it down completely, clean and sterilize it, then cycle it. Goldfish have different pathogens than "tropicals", so this would be the prudent course of action. \\Steve//

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15331	From: joequality1980	Date: 9/15/2005
Subject: Re: African frogs--not for smaller/comunity tanks

yes, and they have been dealt with accordingly --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@y...> wrote: > sounds as if you have african clawed frogs which will eat anything they can fit in their mouths! >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15332	From: Jasmine	Date: 9/15/2005
Subject: Re: Cichlid...I may have figured it out

Oh no he's in his own tank, I read that much about cichlids. :) I don't want to take the chance of him eating my small fish as he gets older. He's in his very own tank with a cup he likes to hide in and a plant he loves to rub his body through. He prefers flakes to pellets so far and loves the algae I cultured. Thanks for your information. Jasmine --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@y...> wrote: > Er. Jasmin? What all do you have in the tank with this baby cichlid? Sorry > to disappoint you a bit but the Red Zebra belongs to one of most aggressive > group of cichlids (Mbunas). If you have the likes of guppies and mollies > with it, then they may be in danger of their life in the next few months to > come. Also, they don't care much about the size of the fish they attack as a > 2" mbuna can easily give a 6" oscar cichlid (also aggressive) a run for > life. > > Red zebras are however one of the less aggressive of this group so you may > be lucky. Also, the way they are grown also has a lot to contribute to their > aggression so if he is grown with guppy babies, there might be a small > possibility that she may not develop the instincts she would when grown with > other cichlids. I mention "She" because a "he" will most definitely develop > aggressive instincts. > > > > Nim > > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Jasmine > Sent: 12 September 2005 17:36 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Cichlid...I may have figured it out > > > > After looking around, I think Ernie is a red zebra cichlid. The ones I > see in the store look very similar to him, and the pictures I see on > the internet as well. He's very small though, I don't know how old. He > got moved into his tank and he absolutely loves it. His baby cup is in > there with him and he likes to hide in there. I know they're supposed > to like rocks and not plants but I had a plant in there just to see > and he seems to enjoy rubbing himself against it. I have also cultured > some algae which he seems to like. If anyone has any other suggestions > or has had experience with this type, please let me know. > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > _____ > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15333	From: ahorseofcourse66	Date: 9/15/2005
Subject: HELP with clown knife!!!

Hi, Bought our first clown knife about 6 days ago, he wont eat. We have tried ghost shrimp, feeder fish, dry shrimp, blood worms and flake food. He wont eat any of it. He seems to be swimming around fine but just wont eat. We even have put him in his own tank with his live food so there is no competion. Anyone have any ideas? Please?!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15334	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 9/15/2005
Subject: Re: HELP with clown knife!!!

Mine will go for about 8 days sometimes without eating...... i have feeders i breed in my garage that i let swim weith him until he gets hungry, but i was told this lagging in feeding is a normal thing. When he eats an arowana like mine did...... then worry! KRis ahorseofcourse66 <ahorseofcourse66@...> wrote: Hi, Bought our first clown knife about 6 days ago, he wont eat. We have tried ghost shrimp, feeder fish, dry shrimp, blood worms and flake food. He wont eat any of it. He seems to be swimming around fine but just wont eat. We even have put him in his own tank with his live food so there is no competion. Anyone have any ideas? Please?! Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15335	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 9/16/2005
Subject: Re: Cichlid...I may have figured it out

Jasmin, These cichlids also need essentially a vegetarian diet. You get special food for Rift lake cichlids that has less of fat as if they are fed a lot of fatty diet, they can develop a typical syndrome called the “Malawi Bloat” If he is in a tank of his own, it must be wonderful to watch him ;) Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Jasmine Sent: 15 September 2005 23:59 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Cichlid...I may have figured it out Oh no he's in his own tank, I read that much about cichlids. :) I don't want to take the chance of him eating my small fish as he gets older. He's in his very own tank with a cup he likes to hide in and a plant he loves to rub his body through. He prefers flakes to pellets so far and loves the algae I cultured. Thanks for your information. Jasmine --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Nimish Mathur" <nimmat4@y...> wrote: > Er. Jasmin? What all do you have in the tank with this baby cichlid? Sorry > to disappoint you a bit but the Red Zebra belongs to one of most aggressive > group of cichlids (Mbunas). If you have the likes of guppies and mollies > with it, then they may be in danger of their life in the next few months to > come. Also, they don't care much about the size of the fish they attack as a > 2" mbuna can easily give a 6" oscar cichlid (also aggressive) a run for > life. > > Red zebras are however one of the less aggressive of this group so you may > be lucky. Also, the way they are grown also has a lot to contribute to their > aggression so if he is grown with guppy babies, there might be a small > possibility that she may not develop the instincts she would when grown with > other cichlids. I mention "She" because a "he" will most definitely develop > aggressive instincts. > > > > Nim > > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Jasmine > Sent: 12 September 2005 17:36 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Cichlid...I may have figured it out > > > > After looking around, I think Ernie is a red zebra cichlid. The ones I > see in the store look very similar to him, and the pictures I see on > the internet as well. He's very small though, I don't know how old. He > got moved into his tank and he absolutely loves it. His baby cup is in > there with him and he likes to hide in there. I know they're supposed > to like rocks and not plants but I had a plant in there just to see > and he seems to enjoy rubbing himself against it. I have also cultured > some algae which he seems to like. If anyone has any other suggestions > or has had experience with this type, please let me know. > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > _____ > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Bio logy&c=2&s=33&.sig=AfBN-ra7JJtop11O-jTujQ> biology Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Biology&c= 2&s=33&.sig=vyS1FzI4oDuT11H8KSAMpA> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15336	From: T	Date: 9/16/2005
Subject: Really Stupid Question

Ok... this might take the cake for the dumb question of the year. My Airstone needs to be replaced. As I was cleaning the tank I took notice to this. As I went to remove the tube to change the Airstone it broke apart.( many tiny green pieces floating thru the water)This cant do any damage to the fish can it? I would assume whatever the airstone is made of is fishfriendly right??? thx - Ter

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15337	From: Justin M.	Date: 9/16/2005
Subject: Re: Really Stupid Question

At 11:39 AM 16/09/2005 +0000, you wrote: >Ok... this might take the cake for the dumb question of the year. My >Airstone needs to be replaced. As I was cleaning the tank I took notice >to this. As I went to remove the tube to change the Airstone it broke >apart.( many tiny green pieces floating thru the water)This cant do any >damage to the fish can it? I would assume whatever the airstone is made >of is fishfriendly right??? thx - Ter This should be fine. The airstone bits won't harm your fish, and you'll eventually get it all out with vacuuming during your water changes. Don't worry! JM

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15338	From: harry perry	Date: 9/16/2005
Subject: Re: Really Stupid Question/??????

How can caring about your fish be stupid???? CO2 in the water will destroy a regular airstone. Try using a porcelain air stone. They seem to last forever. Harry "Justin M." <warbyrd@...> wrote: At 11:39 AM 16/09/2005 +0000, you wrote: >Ok... this might take the cake for the dumb question of the year. My >Airstone needs to be replaced. As I was cleaning the tank I took notice >to this. As I went to remove the tube to change the Airstone it broke >apart.( many tiny green pieces floating thru the water)This cant do any >damage to the fish can it? I would assume whatever the airstone is made >of is fishfriendly right??? thx - Ter This should be fine. The airstone bits won't harm your fish, and you'll eventually get it all out with vacuuming during your water changes. Don't worry! JM Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! for Good Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15339	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 9/16/2005
Subject: Re: Really Stupid Question/??????

Hi Harry, This is a very odd statement you have made, all water contains CO2 especialy fish tanks, fish take oxygen from the water and replace it with carbon dioxide (CO2), many people with planted tanks actualy inject CO2 through air stones. CO2 will not destroy an air stone if it is a normal regular product!. regards, unclenorm. --- harry perry <harryfisherman@...> wrote: > How can caring about your fish be stupid???? CO2 in > the water will destroy a regular airstone. Try using > a porcelain air stone. They seem to last forever. > > Harry > > "Justin M." <warbyrd@...> wrote: > At 11:39 AM 16/09/2005 +0000, you wrote: > >Ok... this might take the cake for the dumb > question of the year. My > >Airstone needs to be replaced. As I was cleaning > the tank I took notice > >to this. As I went to remove the tube to change the > Airstone it broke > >apart.( many tiny green pieces floating thru the > water)This cant do any > >damage to the fish can it? I would assume whatever > the airstone is made > >of is fishfriendly right??? thx - Ter > > > This should be fine. The airstone bits > won't harm your fish, and > you'll eventually get it all out with vacuuming > during your water changes. > Don't worry! > > JM > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when > replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the > TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine biology Biology > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email > to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! for Good > Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina > relief effort. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ___________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15340	From: Patrick	Date: 9/16/2005
Subject: Re: Really Stupid Question/??????

Let's see. All tanks have CO2. All air stones (the stone type) eventually become brittle and break apart in about 6 months. The question is, is it the CO2, or some other factor that is also in all tanks, that makes this happen. :) Patrick N. ----- Original Message ----- From: Norman. S. Hampson. To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, September 16, 2005 9:23 PM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Really Stupid Question/?????? Hi Harry, This is a very odd statement you have made, all water contains CO2 especialy fish tanks, fish take oxygen from the water and replace it with carbon dioxide (CO2), many people with planted tanks actualy inject CO2 through air stones. CO2 will not destroy an air stone if it is a normal regular product!. regards, unclenorm. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15341	From: harry perry	Date: 9/16/2005
Subject: Re: Really Stupid Question/??????

Hi Norm, The statement didn't seem odd to me since it was based on actual experience with my CO2 system. The concentrated CO2 disolved my "regular" stone in three months. Your right, all 51 of my planted tanks have CO2 in them Seems like its been that way for the past 45 years that I've been keeping fish. Harry "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> wrote: Hi Harry, This is a very odd statement you have made, all water contains CO2 especialy fish tanks, fish take oxygen from the water and replace it with carbon dioxide (CO2), many people with planted tanks actualy inject CO2 through air stones. CO2 will not destroy an air stone if it is a normal regular product!. regards, unclenorm. --- harry perry <harryfisherman@...> wrote: > How can caring about your fish be stupid???? CO2 in > the water will destroy a regular airstone. Try using > a porcelain air stone. They seem to last forever. > > Harry > > "Justin M." <warbyrd@...> wrote: > At 11:39 AM 16/09/2005 +0000, you wrote: > >Ok... this might take the cake for the dumb > question of the year. My > >Airstone needs to be replaced. As I was cleaning > the tank I took notice > >to this. As I went to remove the tube to change the > Airstone it broke > >apart.( many tiny green pieces floating thru the > water)This cant do any > >damage to the fish can it? I would assume whatever > the airstone is made > >of is fishfriendly right??? thx - Ter > > > This should be fine. The airstone bits > won't harm your fish, and > you'll eventually get it all out with vacuuming > during your water changes. > Don't worry! > > JM > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when > replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the > TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine biology Biology > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email > to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! for Good > Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina > relief effort. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ___________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15342	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 9/16/2005
Subject: Air Stones to Harry & Paul

Well gentlemen, I have 6 concrete tanks outside, one 400gal, 5 x 120gal all heavyly stocked the large one holds Koi carp, the rest various fish, Guppies, Mollys, Swords, angels, all breeding (I sell them to finance my marine tanks), anyway they all run on normal air stones, 20 in total, on average they last about 3 to 4 years before they start to disintegrate, I do get the odd one that only lasts about a year. The only situation in my experience that effects an air stone is high ammonia readings, certainly not CO2. All I can say is that there must be a lot of poor quality air stones for sale over there. regards, unclenorm. --- harry perry <harryfisherman@...> wrote: > Hi Norm, > > The statement didn't seem odd to me since it was > based on actual experience with my CO2 system. The > concentrated CO2 disolved my "regular" stone in > three months. Your right, all 51 of my planted tanks > have CO2 in them Seems like its been that way for > the past 45 years that I've been keeping fish. > > Harry > > "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> wrote: > Hi Harry, > This is a very odd statement you have made, > all water contains CO2 especialy fish tanks, fish > take > oxygen from the water and replace it with carbon > dioxide (CO2), many people with planted tanks > actualy > inject CO2 through air stones. CO2 will not destroy > an > air stone if it is a normal regular product!. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- harry perry <harryfisherman@...> wrote: > > > How can caring about your fish be stupid???? CO2 > in > > the water will destroy a regular airstone. Try > using > > a porcelain air stone. They seem to last forever. > > > > Harry > > > > "Justin M." <warbyrd@...> wrote: > > At 11:39 AM 16/09/2005 +0000, you wrote: > > >Ok... this might take the cake for the dumb > > question of the year. My > > >Airstone needs to be replaced. As I was cleaning > > the tank I took notice > > >to this. As I went to remove the tube to change > the > > Airstone it broke > > >apart.( many tiny green pieces floating thru the > > water)This cant do any > > >damage to the fish can it? I would assume > whatever > > the airstone is made > > >of is fishfriendly right??? thx - Ter > > > > > > This should be fine. The airstone bits > > won't harm your fish, and > > you'll eventually get it all out with vacuuming > > during your water changes. > > Don't worry! > > > > JM > > > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it > when > > replying, thanks. > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > > that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING > the > > TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" > <- > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > > matter. > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > Marine biology Biology > > > > --------------------------------- > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email > > to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > > Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > Yahoo! for Good > > Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina > > relief effort. > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC > calling worldwide with voicemail > http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when > replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the > TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > > > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email > to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ___________________________________________________________ How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15343	From: Patrick	Date: 9/16/2005
Subject: Re: Air Stones to Harry & Paul

That or the air stones where you are made with magic dust glued into them. :) I think it is mostly because most of the air stones that are easy to get here are really cheap (2 for a dollar), and are constructed to match. Patrick N. ----- Original Message ----- Well gentlemen, I have 6 concrete tanks outside, one 400gal, 5 x 120gal all heavyly stocked the large one holds Koi carp, the rest various fish, Guppies, Mollys, Swords, angels, all breeding (I sell them to finance my marine tanks), anyway they all run on normal air stones, 20 in total, on average they last about 3 to 4 years before they start to disintegrate, I do get the odd one that only lasts about a year. The only situation in my experience that effects an air stone is high ammonia readings, certainly not CO2. All I can say is that there must be a lot of poor quality air stones for sale over there. regards, unclenorm. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15344	From: Patrick	Date: 9/16/2005
Subject: Re: Air Stones to Norman

By the way, this is Patrick, not Paul. He's the other guy with a "P" name. :) Patrick N. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15345	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 9/16/2005
Subject: Re: Air Stones to Norman

Sorry Patrick, My mistake. regards, unclenorm. --- Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: > By the way, this is Patrick, not Paul. He's the > other guy with a "P" name. :) > > Patrick N. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ___________________________________________________________ How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15346	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 9/17/2005
Subject: Re: Really Stupid Question

Ter, No, not a stupid question. The fish should be OK. This does, however, highlight something that is seldom thought about, and that is replacement of airstones. Airstones, like so many other things, have a finite life. Generally, you should notice this by a decrease of airflow through the airstone, but it can happen so gradually that you are not aware of the occurrence until the flow has almost stopped. In the case of the airstone type you were using (and maybe still are), it seems that the structural integrity of the stone weakens over time, eventually leading to the collapse of the stone that you have witnessed. While I have seen methods outlined for cleaning airstones, they are o inexpensive that you are better off replacing the stones on a regular basis. It would be up to you to determine the replacement cycle in your tanks as conditions vary, as does the useful life of the airstone. All airstones are not created equal. For instance, you may have noticed that the green airstone would allow you to rub some of the surface granules off when handling it. You'll not see this from the material used to make the bubble wands and other airstones. If you can recall when you started using this particular airstone, subtract a couple of months for your replacement cycle. I just happened to be looking at a Drs. Foster and Smith catalog, and the most expensive airstones were approximately $1.50. The so-called disposable stones were 20 cents per, in quantity. I say so-called, because, in reality all airstones are disposable. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of T Sent: Friday, September 16, 2005 7:39 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Really Stupid Question Ok... this might take the cake for the dumb question of the year. My Airstone needs to be replaced. As I was cleaning the tank I took notice to this. As I went to remove the tube to change the Airstone it broke apart.( many tiny green pieces floating thru the water)This cant do any damage to the fish can it? I would assume whatever the airstone is made of is fishfriendly right??? thx - Ter Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15347	From: ranchugirl	Date: 9/17/2005
Subject: your local goldfish clubs

Hi everybody, I am working currently on an article for the November/December issue of the Goldfish Society Report, and its gonna be a very excessive list of available goldfish clubs in the US, as well as throughout the world. I have been collecting websites and contact infos for over a year now, and so far the list is about 170 entries long. And that is were I need as much help as I can get - to make it even more complete, it would be great if anybody who has a goldfish club / koi club with goldfish included, or even an aquarium society in your neighboorhood, would let me know and email me the details to RAJ- Pecher@.... It can be all over the world, so far I have found clubs as far away as Europe, Malaysia, Australia... The club doesn't have to have a website, there are dozens and dozens out there with just a contact phone # or email address - it doesn't matter to me. Any help is so greatly appreciated, so if anybody knows of any club, that would be wonderful! Thanks again, guys! Andrea a.ka. Ranchugirl

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15348	From: paul helms	Date: 9/17/2005
Subject: Re: Air Stones to Harry & Paul

why is this to me? --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> wrote: > Well gentlemen, > I have 6 concrete tanks outside, one > 400gal, 5 x 120gal all heavyly stocked the large one > holds Koi carp, the rest various fish, Guppies, > Mollys, Swords, angels, all breeding (I sell them to > finance my marine tanks), anyway they all run on > normal air stones, 20 in total, on average they last > about 3 to 4 years before they start to > disintegrate, > I do get the odd one that only lasts about a year. > The > only situation in my experience that effects an air > stone is high ammonia readings, certainly not CO2. > All > I can say is that there must be a lot of poor > quality > air stones for sale over there. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- harry perry <harryfisherman@...> wrote: > > > Hi Norm, > > > > The statement didn't seem odd to me since it was > > based on actual experience with my CO2 system. The > > concentrated CO2 disolved my "regular" stone in > > three months. Your right, all 51 of my planted > tanks > > have CO2 in them Seems like its been that way for > > the past 45 years that I've been keeping fish. > > > > Harry > > > > "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> > wrote: > > Hi Harry, > > This is a very odd statement you have > made, > > all water contains CO2 especialy fish tanks, fish > > take > > oxygen from the water and replace it with carbon > > dioxide (CO2), many people with planted tanks > > actualy > > inject CO2 through air stones. CO2 will not > destroy > > an > > air stone if it is a normal regular product!. > > regards, > > unclenorm. > > > > > > --- harry perry <harryfisherman@...> wrote: > > > > > How can caring about your fish be stupid???? CO2 > > in > > > the water will destroy a regular airstone. Try > > using > > > a porcelain air stone. They seem to last > forever. > > > > > > Harry > > > > > > "Justin M." <warbyrd@...> wrote: > > > At 11:39 AM 16/09/2005 +0000, you wrote: > > > >Ok... this might take the cake for the dumb > > > question of the year. My > > > >Airstone needs to be replaced. As I was > cleaning > > > the tank I took notice > > > >to this. As I went to remove the tube to change > > the > > > Airstone it broke > > > >apart.( many tiny green pieces floating thru > the > > > water)This cant do any > > > >damage to the fish can it? I would assume > > whatever > > > the airstone is made > > > >of is fishfriendly right??? thx - Ter > > > > > > > > > This should be fine. The airstone bits > > > won't harm your fish, and > > > you'll eventually get it all out with vacuuming > > > during your water changes. > > > Don't worry! > > > > > > JM > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it > > when > > > replying, thanks. > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all > TEXT > > > that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING > > the > > > TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > > > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" > > <- > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > > > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > > > matter. > > > > > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > > Marine biology Biology > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an > email > > > to: > > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > > > Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > > Yahoo! for Good > > > Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina > > > relief effort. > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > > Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC > > calling worldwide with voicemail > > http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it > when > > replying, thanks. > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > > that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING > the > > TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" > <- > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > > matter. > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email > > to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > > Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > > protection around > > http://mail.yahoo.com > === message truncated === __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15349	From: paul helms	Date: 9/17/2005
Subject: Re: Really Stupid Question

nope won't hurt anyting. the blue ones lasta bit longer than the green inmy experience, and do not clog as easy either, but neither is harmful. --- T <bigter4@...> wrote: > Ok... this might take the cake for the dumb question > of the year. My > Airstone needs to be replaced. As I was cleaning the > tank I took notice > to this. As I went to remove the tube to change the > Airstone it broke > apart.( many tiny green pieces floating thru the > water)This cant do any > damage to the fish can it? I would assume whatever > the airstone is made > of is fishfriendly right??? thx - Ter > > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15350	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 9/17/2005
Subject: Re: Air Stones to Harry & Paul

Sorry Paul, 'Paul' should have read Patrick, my error. regards, unclenorm. --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > why is this to me? > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> > wrote: > > > Well gentlemen, > > I have 6 concrete tanks outside, > one > > 400gal, 5 x 120gal all heavyly stocked the large > one > > holds Koi carp, the rest various fish, Guppies, > > Mollys, Swords, angels, all breeding (I sell them > to > > finance my marine tanks), anyway they all run on > > normal air stones, 20 in total, on average they > last > > about 3 to 4 years before they start to > > disintegrate, > > I do get the odd one that only lasts about a year. > > The > > only situation in my experience that effects an > air > > stone is high ammonia readings, certainly not CO2. > > All > > I can say is that there must be a lot of poor > > quality > > air stones for sale over there. > > regards, > > unclenorm. > > > > > > --- harry perry <harryfisherman@...> wrote: > > > > > Hi Norm, > > > > > > The statement didn't seem odd to me since it was > > > based on actual experience with my CO2 system. > The > > > concentrated CO2 disolved my "regular" stone in > > > three months. Your right, all 51 of my planted > > tanks > > > have CO2 in them Seems like its been that way > for > > > the past 45 years that I've been keeping fish. > > > > > > Harry > > > > > > "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> > > wrote: > > > Hi Harry, > > > This is a very odd statement you have > > made, > > > all water contains CO2 especialy fish tanks, > fish > > > take > > > oxygen from the water and replace it with carbon > > > dioxide (CO2), many people with planted tanks > > > actualy > > > inject CO2 through air stones. CO2 will not > > destroy > > > an > > > air stone if it is a normal regular product!. > > > regards, > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > --- harry perry <harryfisherman@...> > wrote: > > > > > > > How can caring about your fish be stupid???? > CO2 > > > in > > > > the water will destroy a regular airstone. Try > > > using > > > > a porcelain air stone. They seem to last > > forever. > > > > > > > > Harry > > > > > > > > "Justin M." <warbyrd@...> wrote: > > > > At 11:39 AM 16/09/2005 +0000, you wrote: > > > > >Ok... this might take the cake for the dumb > > > > question of the year. My > > > > >Airstone needs to be replaced. As I was > > cleaning > > > > the tank I took notice > > > > >to this. As I went to remove the tube to > change > > > the > > > > Airstone it broke > > > > >apart.( many tiny green pieces floating thru > > the > > > > water)This cant do any > > > > >damage to the fish can it? I would assume > > > whatever > > > > the airstone is made > > > > >of is fishfriendly right??? thx - Ter > > > > > > > > > > > > This should be fine. The airstone > bits > > > > won't harm your fish, and > > > > you'll eventually get it all out with > vacuuming > > > > during your water changes. > > > > Don't worry! > > > > > > > > JM > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below > it > > > when > > > > replying, thanks. > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all > > TEXT > > > > that is NOT important to the reply & if > CHANGING > > > the > > > > TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT > > > > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" > > > <- > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > > > > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > > > > matter. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > > > Marine biology Biology > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > > > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > > > > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an > > email > > > > to: > > > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to > the > > > > Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > > > Yahoo! for Good > > > > Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina > > > > relief effort. > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > > > > Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC > > > calling worldwide with voicemail > > > http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it > > when > > > replying, thanks. > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all > TEXT > > > that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING > > the > > > TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > > > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" > > <- > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > > > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > > > matter. > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an > email > > > to: > > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > > > Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > > Do You Yahoo!? > > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > > > protection around > > > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > === message truncated === > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > ___________________________________________________________ How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15351	From: Leslie	Date: 9/17/2005
Subject: Blood Parrot is VERY Pale, SICK!

I've been having a problem with ph the past few days, used a buffer and it seems to be working well. It was at 7.8 and now a steady 7 for two days. I tested because two of the fish were extremely pale and lathargic. Ph was fixed and color came back quickly. Next night, pale again. PH was high, lowered, all was fine. Tonight the Blood Parrot is white with pink spots. He's normally VERY colorful. The firemouth is the same, white on the underside...normally bright red. Ph is still at 7 and everything tests great. Please give me some clue as to what's wrong or where to look. Hole in the head has caught the blood parrot but is closing up well. I've treated with salt, changed the diet to higher vitamins and increased the temp to 82 for 3 days. This also cleared up the spots on the firemouth, whatever they were. Completely gone. Today I fed medicated (for bacteria) food and a new vitamin enriched pellet food. The tank is in the living room and was completely dark when I came in. Of course I threw on the lights and I know I startled some seriously sleeping fish. It took them all a minute or two to get moving from their sleep. Could this have something to do with the discoloration? He has paled before, recently started, in the evenings but NEVER this white. Pleeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeease help. ~Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15352	From: paul helms	Date: 9/18/2005
Subject: Re: Air Stones to Harry & Paul

ok --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> wrote: > Sorry Paul, > 'Paul' should have read Patrick, my > error. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > > why is this to me? > > > > --- "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> > > wrote: > > > > > Well gentlemen, > > > I have 6 concrete tanks outside, > > one > > > 400gal, 5 x 120gal all heavyly stocked the large > > one > > > holds Koi carp, the rest various fish, Guppies, > > > Mollys, Swords, angels, all breeding (I sell > them > > to > > > finance my marine tanks), anyway they all run on > > > normal air stones, 20 in total, on average they > > last > > > about 3 to 4 years before they start to > > > disintegrate, > > > I do get the odd one that only lasts about a > year. > > > The > > > only situation in my experience that effects an > > air > > > stone is high ammonia readings, certainly not > CO2. > > > All > > > I can say is that there must be a lot of poor > > > quality > > > air stones for sale over there. > > > regards, > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > --- harry perry <harryfisherman@...> > wrote: > > > > > > > Hi Norm, > > > > > > > > The statement didn't seem odd to me since it > was > > > > based on actual experience with my CO2 system. > > The > > > > concentrated CO2 disolved my "regular" stone > in > > > > three months. Your right, all 51 of my planted > > > tanks > > > > have CO2 in them Seems like its been that way > > for > > > > the past 45 years that I've been keeping fish. > > > > > > > > Harry > > > > > > > > "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> > > > wrote: > > > > Hi Harry, > > > > This is a very odd statement you have > > > made, > > > > all water contains CO2 especialy fish tanks, > > fish > > > > take > > > > oxygen from the water and replace it with > carbon > > > > dioxide (CO2), many people with planted tanks > > > > actualy > > > > inject CO2 through air stones. CO2 will not > > > destroy > > > > an > > > > air stone if it is a normal regular product!. > > > > regards, > > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > > > > --- harry perry <harryfisherman@...> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > How can caring about your fish be stupid???? > > CO2 > > > > in > > > > > the water will destroy a regular airstone. > Try > > > > using > > > > > a porcelain air stone. They seem to last > > > forever. > > > > > > > > > > Harry > > > > > > > > > > "Justin M." <warbyrd@...> wrote: > > > > > At 11:39 AM 16/09/2005 +0000, you wrote: > > > > > >Ok... this might take the cake for the dumb > > > > > question of the year. My > > > > > >Airstone needs to be replaced. As I was > > > cleaning > > > > > the tank I took notice > > > > > >to this. As I went to remove the tube to > > change > > > > the > > > > > Airstone it broke > > > > > >apart.( many tiny green pieces floating > thru > > > the > > > > > water)This cant do any > > > > > >damage to the fish can it? I would assume > > > > whatever > > > > > the airstone is made > > > > > >of is fishfriendly right??? thx - Ter > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This should be fine. The airstone > > bits > > > > > won't harm your fish, and > > > > > you'll eventually get it all out with > > vacuuming > > > > > during your water changes. > > > > > Don't worry! > > > > > > > > > > JM > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below > > it > > > > when > > > > > replying, thanks. > > > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > > > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all > > > TEXT > > > > > that is NOT important to the reply & if > > CHANGING > > > > the > > > > > TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > > SUBJECT > > > > > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > > subject)" > > > > <- > > > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. > , > > > > > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in > this > > > > > matter. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > > > > Marine biology Biology > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the > web. > > > > > > > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an > > > email > > > > > to: > > > > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > > > > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to > > the > > > > > Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > Yahoo! for Good > > > > > Click here to donate to the Hurricane > Katrina > > > > > relief effort. > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > > > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > > > === message truncated === __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15353	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 9/18/2005
Subject: Re: Blood Parrot is VERY Pale, SICK!

Leslie, You should really not be messing around with your water chemistry. What is your normal pH (note, it is always lowercase p, uppercase H, even when starting a sentence with it) in the tank? What is the pH out of your tap? What is it after the water has sat for a day? If your pH out of the tap is closer to 7.0, then you should start looking for what may be raising it. It may be something that was added to the tank in the area of decoration. It is usually something with a calcium content, such as coral or oyster sell, perhaps a rock of unknown composition. If the tap pH is closer to the 7.8 you are reading in the tank, you could be walking a dangerous path in lowering it. All water has what is generally known as a natural buffer which helps to maintain the pH. When you attempt to lower the pH, you are trying to overcome this buffer. The amount to which you are successful determines the pH at the end of the process. If you are too successful, in other words, if you manage to break the buffer, your pH can crash to an unacceptable low pH. This will happen very quickly and without warning. Your parrots (an abomination I'd never advise some one to purchase, but rather avoid, as with the "painted" or dyed fish) are probably a fish that would do best in a water with lower pH, since all the fish mentioned as possible contributors to this hybrid come from waters with a pH lower than 7.0. However, many fish are fairly adaptable with regard to pH, and will do well in water that is not in their natural pH range. Some fish, though, will need to have pH in their natural range when you attempt to breed them. Since most people who keep aquariums find that breeding is more a bonus than a goal, pH is not all that important to the general health of a fish, so long as other water parameters are kept in line. Ammonia is known to be more toxic to fish as the pH of the water goes up. I do not know, off hand, if the other nitrogenous products are the same, but I would certainly treat them as they were. I believe I have seen posts from you here regarding your parrots and HTH disease. While I am not up on the current literature on this condition, what I do recall is that nitrogenous wastes are a contributing factor to this disease, so paying attention to your ammonia, nitrite and nitrate levels would be more important in controlling this problem than pH. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Leslie Sent: Saturday, September 17, 2005 11:04 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com; naturalaquariumenthusiast@yahoogroups.com; uniquaria@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Blood Parrot is VERY Pale, SICK! I've been having a problem with ph the past few days, used a buffer and it seems to be working well. It was at 7.8 and now a steady 7 for two days. I tested because two of the fish were extremely pale and lathargic. Ph was fixed and color came back quickly. Next night, pale again. PH was high, lowered, all was fine. Tonight the Blood Parrot is white with pink spots. He's normally VERY colorful. The firemouth is the same, white on the underside...normally bright red. Ph is still at 7 and everything tests great. Please give me some clue as to what's wrong or where to look. Hole in the head has caught the blood parrot but is closing up well. I've treated with salt, changed the diet to higher vitamins and increased the temp to 82 for 3 days. This also cleared up the spots on the firemouth, whatever they were. Completely gone. Today I fed medicated (for bacteria) food and a new vitamin enriched pellet food. The tank is in the living room and was completely dark when I came in. Of course I threw on the lights and I know I startled some seriously sleeping fish. It took them all a minute or two to get moving from their sleep. Could this have something to do with the discoloration? He has paled before, recently started, in the evenings but NEVER this white. Pleeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeease help. ~Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15354	From: kb1dva	Date: 9/18/2005
Subject: Help- dead pike and questions

The pike that got a piece of this mouth bitten off has died I found him floating upside down with no further signs of injury. Could that have been the cause of his death, and if not what should I do. I am now down 2 large fish in the tank can I add others and can they be young fish (small) I had an Oscar jump out of the tank. I do need some help here, and hope somebody will be so kind as to respond this time. Thanks in advance Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15355	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 9/18/2005
Subject: Re: Help- dead pike and questions

Give me details and i might be able to help... tank size, type of fish in the tank, water parameters....ph temp and such..... oh how long has the tank been up and running.... these answered will give us all a heads up on the actual situation so we can help Kris kb1dva <vze3pd7a@...> wrote: The pike that got a piece of this mouth bitten off has died I found him floating upside down with no further signs of injury. Could that have been the cause of his death, and if not what should I do. I am now down 2 large fish in the tank can I add others and can they be young fish (small) I had an Oscar jump out of the tank. I do need some help here, and hope somebody will be so kind as to respond this time. Thanks in advance Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! for Good Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15356	From: Thomas Schlemmermeyer	Date: 9/18/2005
Subject: Livebearer question

Hello, friends, Does anyone of you have practical tank (aquarium) experience with the following livebeaerers: Phallocerus caudimaculatus Phallotorynus victoriae ? are there pictures on the web showing these fish species in aquarium, possibly displaying courtship behavior, feeding behavior or anything interesting of that kind? thanks for your hints, Thomas Schlemmermeyer - Brazil best wishes to all you Aquarium enthusiasts, perhaps besides birdwatching one of the most meaningful ways to teach natural history to teenagers and other interested citizens!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15357	From: kb1dva	Date: 9/19/2005
Subject: Re: Help- dead pike and questions

It’s a 90 gallon tank – I have rescue fish and the previous owner did nothing more that add straight tap water. I have 2 Oscars, each about 8 inches, a Pacu that’s about 10 inches and 3 blood parrots – and the pike. The tank has been set up since May? when they went into this bigger tank. I had 3 Oscars but one jumped out of the tank and I didn’t catch him in time. Yes I know I should have a cover (lights) it’s just a can’t afford it right now. The pike was in a fight and someone bit his mouth, but he was acting ok and eating. One of the blood parrots doesn’t get enough to eat, it seems like she afraid of the bigger fish, how can I make sure she eats. Emily _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of kristopher helsing Sent: Sunday, September 18, 2005 6:21 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Help- dead pike and questions Give me details and i might be able to help... tank size, type of fish in the tank, water parameters....ph temp and such..... oh how long has the tank been up and running.... these answered will give us all a heads up on the actual situation so we can help Kris kb1dva <vze3pd7a@...> wrote: The pike that got a piece of this mouth bitten off has died I found him floating upside down with no further signs of injury. Could that have been the cause of his death, and if not what should I do. I am now down 2 large fish in the tank can I add others and can they be young fish (small) I had an Oscar jump out of the tank. I do need some help here, and hope somebody will be so kind as to respond this time. Thanks in advance Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! for Good Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Mar ine+fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=sWozU8RAgM2g66Yb_7h_nQ> biology Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine +fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=JB6FNOraRx3JIvMA1E4-Lw> fish Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine+fis h&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=R-HUKyhqLGfm-ZAFT2vuTQ> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15358	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 9/19/2005
Subject: Re: Help- dead pike and questions

In a message dated 9/19/2005 8:00:49 AM Eastern Standard Time, vze3pd7a@... writes: <<<It’s a 90 gallon tank – I have rescue fish and the previous owner did nothing more that add straight tap water. I have 2 Oscars, each about 8 inches, a Pacu that’s about 10 inches and 3 blood parrots – and the pike. The tank has been set up since May? when they went into this bigger tank. I had 3 Oscars but one jumped out of the tank and I didn’t catch him in time. Yes I know I should have a cover (lights) it’s just a can’t afford it right now. The pike was in a fight and someone bit his mouth, but he was acting ok and eating. One of the blood parrots doesn’t get enough to eat, it seems like she afraid of the bigger fish, how can I make sure she eats.>>> I'm a little confused, you said you were down to 2 large fish but you are listing 2 oscars, a pacu and 3 parrots.... (that's 3 _really_ big fish and 3 large fish in aquarium terms) IMO, you're still very overstocked in this tank and adding even a guppy would be a bad idea (especially for the guppy) ;-) If you cannot afford a cover, you may want to buy some "eggcrate" at Lowes or Home Depot. That's the plastic stuff you use for lighting covers like in drop ceilings. It's cheap and will cover your tank somewhat -- probably too light to hold in a determined fish, but a barrier from accidents nonetheless. Vicky Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Call (301) 402-8625 or write: hgparker@... =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: FCR-Cancer-Support@yahoogroups.com Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@... 919-513-1467, Dr London @ calondon@... 530-754-5711 _AND_ Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15359	From: kb1dva	Date: 9/19/2005
Subject: Re: Help- dead pike and questions

I guess what I meant to say is I'm down 2 big ones the Oscar that jumped and the pike. Do you have an idea why this happened. Or is it just one of those things. The egg crate sounds like a great idea thanks!. I just feel badly about the pike E _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of seleya8@... Sent: Monday, September 19, 2005 8:28 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Help- dead pike and questions In a message dated 9/19/2005 8:00:49 AM Eastern Standard Time, vze3pd7a@... writes: <<<It's a 90 gallon tank - I have rescue fish and the previous owner did nothing more that add straight tap water. I have 2 Oscars, each about 8 inches, a Pacu that's about 10 inches and 3 blood parrots - and the pike. The tank has been set up since May? when they went into this bigger tank. I had 3 Oscars but one jumped out of the tank and I didn't catch him in time. Yes I know I should have a cover (lights) it's just a can't afford it right now. The pike was in a fight and someone bit his mouth, but he was acting ok and eating. One of the blood parrots doesn't get enough to eat, it seems like she afraid of the bigger fish, how can I make sure she eats.>>> I'm a little confused, you said you were down to 2 large fish but you are listing 2 oscars, a pacu and 3 parrots.... (that's 3 _really_ big fish and 3 large fish in aquarium terms) IMO, you're still very overstocked in this tank and adding even a guppy would be a bad idea (especially for the guppy) ;-) If you cannot afford a cover, you may want to buy some "eggcrate" at Lowes or Home Depot. That's the plastic stuff you use for lighting covers like in drop ceilings. It's cheap and will cover your tank somewhat -- probably too light to hold in a determined fish, but a barrier from accidents nonetheless. Vicky Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Call (301) 402-8625 or write: hgparker@... =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: FCR-Cancer-Support@yahoogroups.com Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@... 919-513-1467, Dr London @ calondon@... 530-754-5711 _AND_ Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. `..><((((>.`..`.><((((> .`.. , .`..><((((> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <((((><.`..`.<((((><.`.. , .`..<((((><`.. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Mar ine+fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=sWozU8RAgM2g66Yb_7h_nQ> biology Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine +fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=JB6FNOraRx3JIvMA1E4-Lw> fish Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine+fis h&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=R-HUKyhqLGfm-ZAFT2vuTQ> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15360	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 9/19/2005
Subject: Re: Help- dead pike and questions

In a message dated 9/19/2005 8:45:45 AM Eastern Standard Time, vze3pd7a@... writes: <<<I guess what I meant to say is I'm down 2 big ones the Oscar that jumped and the pike. Do you have an idea why this happened. Or is it just one of those things.>>> I think some of the more experienced aquarists on this list could tell you better than me. From my limited experience: As far as your leaping oscar, fish can jump from a tank for any variety of reasons: water quality (hard to keep perfect with all those notoriously messy fish), boisterousness (big fish, big jump), being chased/territoriality issues (ya gotta go somewhere!) And as for the pike, none of those fish in that tank are slouches -- any of them could have done the damage. It could just as easily have occurred in a much larger tank but a 90 doesn't give one much room to get out of the way and overcrowding can also lead to added stress levels and added aggression. I'm sorry for your losses, it's always hard losing something you're caring for, especially when you went to the effort to rescue them. I know money is an issue but if you could split the fish up a bit it would be better for all of them. Craigslist often has cheap setups and there's always the option of making or buying something like a large stock tank (150 gallon Rubbermaid stock tanks go for $125 new around here -- pond liner and some creative know-how can be even cheaper) I overwinter some of my pond fish inside and it's very cool to have a small "pond" in the house -- the fish sure enjoy it! Just a thought. =) All my hopes, Vicky Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Call (301) 402-8625 or write: hgparker@... =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: FCR-Cancer-Support@yahoogroups.com Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@... 919-513-1467, Dr London @ calondon@... 530-754-5711 _AND_ Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15361	From: T	Date: 9/19/2005
Subject: AIRSTONE

Thanks to everyone that answered me on this topic. Looks like I have stared an interesting debate. Just to clear up sopme questions... It was a Grenn airstone.. A cheap variety, I forget the name. It lasted about 6 months. All the levels ( including ammoina) are perfect. I have no idea what caused it to just fall apart. I have since replaced with a new "bubble wall" air stone. This adds a nice effect to the Tank and and serves the purpose. Anyone else used these?? thx agian for all the help. I have since cleaned out the "green piece" that were all about ther tank with no harm to any fish. - Ter

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15362	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 9/19/2005
Subject: Re: Help- dead pike and questions

Emily, If there are Oscars in the tank the blood parrot probably does not even get a chance to see the food let alone eat it. Oscars are pigs (love em) and can easily gulp down food that the parrots may only be able to nibble at. Although I do not own blood parrots I own Severums which I think are one of the donors of genetic material for these hybrids and their mouthes are much smaller and they are more docile than oscars. My personal opinion is they might be a mismatch for sharing a tank. I had small Oscars and small Jack Dempseys at one point and the despite size and mouth size being similar the Dempseys could not compete with the Oscars. My 2 cents. Mike -----Original Message----- From: kb1dva <vze3pd7a@...> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 07:59:54 -0400 Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Help- dead pike and questions It's a 90 gallon tank - I have rescue fish and the previous owner did nothing more that add straight tap water. I have 2 Oscars, each about 8 inches, a Pacu that's about 10 inches and 3 blood parrots - and the pike. The tank has been set up since May? when they went into this bigger tank. I had 3 Oscars but one jumped out of the tank and I didn't catch him in time. Yes I know I should have a cover (lights) it's just a can't afford it right now. The pike was in a fight and someone bit his mouth, but he was acting ok and eating. One of the blood parrots doesn't get enough to eat, it seems like she afraid of the bigger fish, how can I make sure she eats. Emily _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of kristopher helsing Sent: Sunday, September 18, 2005 6:21 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Help- dead pike and questions Give me details and i might be able to help... tank size, type of fish in the tank, water parameters....ph temp and such..... oh how long has the tank been up and running.... these answered will give us all a heads up on the actual situation so we can help Kris kb1dva <vze3pd7a@...> wrote: The pike that got a piece of this mouth bitten off has died I found him floating upside down with no further signs of injury. Could that have been the cause of his death, and if not what should I do. I am now down 2 large fish in the tank can I add others and can they be young fish (small) I had an Oscar jump out of the tank. I do need some help here, and hope somebody will be so kind as to respond this time. Thanks in advance Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! for Good Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Mar ine+fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=sWozU8RAgM2g66Yb_7h_nQ> biology Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine +fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=JB6FNOraRx3JIvMA1E4-Lw> fish Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine+fis h&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=R-HUKyhqLGfm-ZAFT2vuTQ> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15363	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 9/19/2005
Subject: Re: AIRSTONE

I do not have any recent experience with the bubble wands, but when I tried them years ago, when they were new to the market, I had to clean them nearly every week to keep the air flow up. Much may have changed in the intervening years with this type of air dispenser, so they may no longer suffer this problem. Cleaning them required just rubbing the wand with my fingers to clean the whatever off them, plus a bleach dip every so often. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of T Sent: Monday, September 19, 2005 10:11 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] AIRSTONE Thanks to everyone that answered me on this topic. Looks like I have stared an interesting debate. Just to clear up sopme questions... It was a Grenn airstone.. A cheap variety, I forget the name. It lasted about 6 months. All the levels ( including ammoina) are perfect. I have no idea what caused it to just fall apart. I have since replaced with a new "bubble wall" air stone. This adds a nice effect to the Tank and and serves the purpose. Anyone else used these?? thx agian for all the help. I have since cleaned out the "green piece" that were all about ther tank with no harm to any fish. - Ter Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15364	From: hadesidhe	Date: 9/19/2005
Subject: Help! New Tank and Fish are Stressed

Recently bought a 29 gallon tank and set it all up with a filter, thermometer, air pump, etc. Filled it with tap water which is a 7.4 pH, slightly hard. Put in a package of Start Right and waited 3 days. Recently I bought the first planned addition to my tank, 6 black neon tetras. Right before I put them in, I put in a nice dose of Stress Coat. After acclimating my 6 neons, I put them in. After 20 minutes they are still hanging out at the bottom of my tank not moving... just bouncing up and down. I threw some flakes in, but too much since I didn't want too much ammonia entering the system. Is there anything else I can do to help keep my fish alive? I probably should have waited a week until the helpful bacteria had grown more but these black neons are supposed to be pretty hardy fish. They're still alive but I want to make sure they're going to live. Thanks!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15365	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 9/19/2005
Subject: help for fish with kinked spine--fish looks like a zig zag

A couple of my danios have been chronically ill for a couple of months. Before they got sick, I moved the guppies and danios from a 10 to a 20 gal tank (which had been established with goldfish, who I also moved to a larger tank). I also adopted 5 mollies, who all died within several weeks. I've treated the tank several times with several different antibiotics for fin and tail rot but no matter what the fish won't get better. I started to wonder if they were nipping fins, and just today I was reading about fish TB and wondering if that is what's ailing the danios. The really bad ones are kinky (zig-zag, one in particular is the worst) and very thin, and the tails are stubs. The 7 danios share the 20 gal with a handful of guppies, some snails and all live plants. From what I know, guppies and danios aren't especially bad when it comes to fin biting. A few of the guppies have some tears in the fins, but nothing major. I did notice an increase in nitrites a couple days ago, but I had just done a partial water change and stired up some debris in the gravel, so that could have something to do with it. I'm wondering if this is something serious like fish tb, or just fin biting (which doesn't explain the kink), or what, and if so, what the heck am I supposed to do? I feel so bad! Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15366	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 9/19/2005
Subject: Re: help for fish with kinked spine--fish looks like a zig zag

The kinks are going to be due to lack of vitamin C in the diet.... if i were you id look into addatives with vitamin C and check out aricles online aboutg fisj vitamin C. Normaly thats the culprit and the best way to avoid scoliosis in fish. Also if the guppies are fancy then the males will fight with one another like betas for dominance which includes the tail biting. Kris --- Emily Tenczar <bababanana@...> wrote: > A couple of my danios have been chronically ill for > a couple of months. Before they got sick, I moved > the guppies and danios from a 10 to a 20 gal tank > (which had been established with goldfish, who I > also moved to a larger tank). I also adopted 5 > mollies, who all died within several weeks. > > I've treated the tank several times with several > different antibiotics for fin and tail rot but no > matter what the fish won't get better. I started to > wonder if they were nipping fins, and just today I > was reading about fish TB and wondering if that is > what's ailing the danios. The really bad ones are > kinky (zig-zag, one in particular is the worst) and > very thin, and the tails are stubs. The 7 danios > share the 20 gal with a handful of guppies, some > snails and all live plants. From what I know, > guppies and danios aren't especially bad when it > comes to fin biting. A few of the guppies have some > tears in the fins, but nothing major. > > I did notice an increase in nitrites a couple days > ago, but I had just done a partial water change and > stired up some debris in the gravel, so that could > have something to do with it. > > I'm wondering if this is something serious like fish > tb, or just fin biting (which doesn't explain the > kink), or what, and if so, what the heck am I > supposed to do? I feel so bad! > Emily > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15367	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 9/20/2005
Subject: Re: help for fish with kinked spine--fish looks like a zig zag

Hi Emily, It sounds to me like ammonia/nitrite poisoning due to inadequate filtration, what type of filtration are you using ?, what water source are you using ?. regards, unclenorm. --- Emily Tenczar <bababanana@...> wrote: > A couple of my danios have been chronically ill for > a couple of months. Before they got sick, I moved > the guppies and danios from a 10 to a 20 gal tank > (which had been established with goldfish, who I > also moved to a larger tank). I also adopted 5 > mollies, who all died within several weeks. > > I've treated the tank several times with several > different antibiotics for fin and tail rot but no > matter what the fish won't get better. I started to > wonder if they were nipping fins, and just today I > was reading about fish TB and wondering if that is > what's ailing the danios. The really bad ones are > kinky (zig-zag, one in particular is the worst) and > very thin, and the tails are stubs. The 7 danios > share the 20 gal with a handful of guppies, some > snails and all live plants. From what I know, > guppies and danios aren't especially bad when it > comes to fin biting. A few of the guppies have some > tears in the fins, but nothing major. > > I did notice an increase in nitrites a couple days > ago, but I had just done a partial water change and > stired up some debris in the gravel, so that could > have something to do with it. > > I'm wondering if this is something serious like fish > tb, or just fin biting (which doesn't explain the > kink), or what, and if so, what the heck am I > supposed to do? I feel so bad! > Emily > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ___________________________________________________________ How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15368	From: Chris	Date: 9/20/2005
Subject: Re: Help! New Tank and Fish are Stressed

In my opinion, 6 black neons will have an almost negligible effect on the ammonia levels of the tank (produced in part by fish wastes). Any uneaten food will contribute to ammonia also, but still, after only a day or so, I don't think ammonia or the biological filtration will be your problem. The first-first thing, is that 20 minutes is not very long.... but on to the first thing... The first thing you can do is switch off the light. Second, give them somewhere to hide - preferably a few aquatic plants. Third, check your pH again - it may have drifted up even further, which the tetras won't like too much. I believe that each point on the pH scale (1-14) is 10 times more concentrated than the point before. That is, a pH of 7.0 is what you should be aiming for. If your pH drifts to 8.0, then the pH is actually 10x higher than at 7. So pH 7.4, whilst you *can* keep those tetras there, you really want to see 7.0 - even though that doesn't seem like much difference. BIG IMPORTANT POINT - don't alter your pH by too much at a time!! do it slowly!! this means perhaps a quater of a teaspoon of chemical (pH up or down as required) per day. pH can fluctuate very rapidly, and can tend to drift in one direction (continually up or down). You can buffer this drifting effect by monitoring and probably increasing carbonate hardness, but I'll let you research that, because it takes a few days to get a desired carbonate hardness level, and for the problem at hand (unhappy fish), you're probably best just bringing the pH straight back into line. Check your pH daily for the next week or two (and if you decide to increase carbonate hardness, then until you finish doing that). Fourth, check your thermometer is working - if you have a second one, throw it in. Feel the water by hand to see if it's obviously hot or cold (although if you're not experienced, this might be a bit ineffective). Fifth - don't add any more fish until your pH is stable, the neons are happy and it's been about a week or so. Then build up the fish stocks slowly (a few fish at a time over several days or weeks). All the best! Chris. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "hadesidhe" <hadesidhe@y...> wrote: > Recently bought a 29 gallon tank and set it all up with a filter, > thermometer, air pump, etc. Filled it with tap water which is a 7.4 > pH, slightly hard. Put in a package of Start Right and waited 3 days. > > Recently I bought the first planned addition to my tank, 6 black neon > tetras. Right before I put them in, I put in a nice dose of Stress > Coat. After acclimating my 6 neons, I put them in. After 20 minutes > they are still hanging out at the bottom of my tank not moving... just > bouncing up and down. I threw some flakes in, but too much since I > didn't want too much ammonia entering the system. > > Is there anything else I can do to help keep my fish alive? I > probably should have waited a week until the helpful bacteria had > grown more but these black neons are supposed to be pretty hardy fish. > They're still alive but I want to make sure they're going to live. > > Thanks!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15369	From: Chris	Date: 9/20/2005
Subject: Re: Help- dead pike and questions

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "kb1dva" <vze3pd7a@v...> wrote: > The egg crate sounds like a great idea thanks!. Heck - even use cling wrap! anything! :)

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15370	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 9/20/2005
Subject: Re: Help! New Tank and Fish are Stressed

Chris, The pH scale is set up so that an increase (or decrease) in one UNIT (not point) -- example pH 7.0 to pH 8.0 (or pH 7.0 to pH 6.0) represents a 10 X (ten-fold) change. However, as this scale is logarithmic, a change in pH of 2 UNITS (pH 6.0 to pH 8.0) is a 100 X (one hundred times) change in the value. \ As far as adding pH adjusting chemicals ("pH UP" or pH "DOWN"), you cannot arbitrarily say to add "perhaps a quarter of a teaspoon of chemical per day", even if you know the quantity of water you're dealing with in this case (29 gallons). All water is different, depending upon its source, and can vary immensely in buffering capacity. It may take just a few drops of one of these chemical products in that quantity of water to adjust it a point (not unit here) or two at a time, i.e., pH 7.4 to pH 7.2. Even so, using these chemicals can cause the pH to bounce, again depending upon its buffering capacity, and is not the best approach unless you really know your own water -- softer water having less buffering capacity will have much less of a tendancy to bounce. Otherwise its usually best to first remove most of the carbonates. Then too, pH Down is a much stronger chemical solution than pH up, by several X's, and the same amount of this product will move the pH of a given quantity of water several times that (initially) as compared to the same quantity of pH Up (unless/until it possibly bounces). Never the less, its never good to subject your aquarium water (and inhabitants) to pH bouncing, especially at this time when the fish seem to possibly be already stressed by it. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Chris" <youcantryreachingme@y...> wrote: > > Third, check your pH again - it may have drifted up even further, > which the tetras won't like too much. I believe that each point on > the pH scale (1-14) is 10 times more concentrated than the point > before. > > That is, a pH of 7.0 is what you should be aiming for. If your pH > drifts to 8.0, then the pH is actually 10x higher than at 7. So pH > 7.4, whilst you *can* keep those tetras there, you really want to > see 7.0 - even though that doesn't seem like much difference. > > BIG IMPORTANT POINT - don't alter your pH by too much at a time!! do > it slowly!! this means perhaps a quater of a teaspoon of chemical > (pH up or down as required) per day. > > pH can fluctuate very rapidly, and can tend to drift in one > direction (continually up or down). You can buffer this drifting > effect by monitoring and probably increasing carbonate hardness, but > I'll let you research that, because it takes a few days to get a > desired carbonate hardness level, and for the problem at hand > (unhappy fish), you're probably best just bringing the pH straight > back into line. > > All the best! > > Chris. >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15371	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 9/20/2005
Subject: Re: help for fish with kinked spine--fish looks like a zig zag

I have an undergravel filter as well as a filter than hangs on the side of the tank. I can't remember off the top of my head the specks on that one. I have an ammonia indicator on the side of the tank and it's been consistantly at zero. I'm using water from the tap, which I recently started treating with Amquel Plus to remove nitrites from the tap water. Emily "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> wrote: Hi Emily, It sounds to me like ammonia/nitrite poisoning due to inadequate filtration, what type of filtration are you using ?, what water source are you using ?. regards, unclenorm. --- Emily Tenczar wrote: > A couple of my danios have been chronically ill for > a couple of months. Before they got sick, I moved > the guppies and danios from a 10 to a 20 gal tank > (which had been established with goldfish, who I > also moved to a larger tank). I also adopted 5 > mollies, who all died within several weeks. > > I've treated the tank several times with several > different antibiotics for fin and tail rot but no > matter what the fish won't get better. I started to > wonder if they were nipping fins, and just today I > was reading about fish TB and wondering if that is > what's ailing the danios. The really bad ones are > kinky (zig-zag, one in particular is the worst) and > very thin, and the tails are stubs. The 7 danios > share the 20 gal with a handful of guppies, some > snails and all live plants. From what I know, > guppies and danios aren't especially bad when it > comes to fin biting. A few of the guppies have some > tears in the fins, but nothing major. > > I did notice an increase in nitrites a couple days > ago, but I had just done a partial water change and > stired up some debris in the gravel, so that could > have something to do with it. > > I'm wondering if this is something serious like fish > tb, or just fin biting (which doesn't explain the > kink), or what, and if so, what the heck am I > supposed to do? I feel so bad! > Emily > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ___________________________________________________________ How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15372	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 9/20/2005
Subject: Re: help for fish with kinked spine--fish looks like a zig zag

Thanks, I'll look into a supplement for them. The guppies are the small pond variety, not the fancies. Emily kristopher helsing <punk3r12@...> wrote: The kinks are going to be due to lack of vitamin C in the diet.... if i were you id look into addatives with vitamin C and check out aricles online aboutg fisj vitamin C. Normaly thats the culprit and the best way to avoid scoliosis in fish. Also if the guppies are fancy then the males will fight with one another like betas for dominance which includes the tail biting. Kris --- Emily Tenczar wrote: > A couple of my danios have been chronically ill for > a couple of months. Before they got sick, I moved > the guppies and danios from a 10 to a 20 gal tank > (which had been established with goldfish, who I > also moved to a larger tank). I also adopted 5 > mollies, who all died within several weeks. > > I've treated the tank several times with several > different antibiotics for fin and tail rot but no > matter what the fish won't get better. I started to > wonder if they were nipping fins, and just today I > was reading about fish TB and wondering if that is > what's ailing the danios. The really bad ones are > kinky (zig-zag, one in particular is the worst) and > very thin, and the tails are stubs. The 7 danios > share the 20 gal with a handful of guppies, some > snails and all live plants. From what I know, > guppies and danios aren't especially bad when it > comes to fin biting. A few of the guppies have some > tears in the fins, but nothing major. > > I did notice an increase in nitrites a couple days > ago, but I had just done a partial water change and > stired up some debris in the gravel, so that could > have something to do with it. > > I'm wondering if this is something serious like fish > tb, or just fin biting (which doesn't explain the > kink), or what, and if so, what the heck am I > supposed to do? I feel so bad! > Emily > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 http://mail.yahoo.com Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15373	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 9/20/2005
Subject: vitamin C/ help for fish with kinked spine--fish looks like a zig

Is there any in particular that you'd suggest? Would you add the vitamins in liquid or food form? what should I do with the fish that's already kinked? Will his tail recover after getting the vitamins? Emily kristopher helsing <punk3r12@...> wrote: The kinks are going to be due to lack of vitamin C in the diet.... if i were you id look into addatives with vitamin C and check out aricles online aboutg fisj vitamin C. Normaly thats the culprit and the best way to avoid scoliosis in fish. Also if the guppies are fancy then the males will fight with one another like betas for dominance which includes the tail biting. Kris --- Emily Tenczar wrote: > A couple of my danios have been chronically ill for > a couple of months. Before they got sick, I moved > the guppies and danios from a 10 to a 20 gal tank > (which had been established with goldfish, who I > also moved to a larger tank). I also adopted 5 > mollies, who all died within several weeks. > > I've treated the tank several times with several > different antibiotics for fin and tail rot but no > matter what the fish won't get better. I started to > wonder if they were nipping fins, and just today I > was reading about fish TB and wondering if that is > what's ailing the danios. The really bad ones are > kinky (zig-zag, one in particular is the worst) and > very thin, and the tails are stubs. The 7 danios > share the 20 gal with a handful of guppies, some > snails and all live plants. From what I know, > guppies and danios aren't especially bad when it > comes to fin biting. A few of the guppies have some > tears in the fins, but nothing major. > > I did notice an increase in nitrites a couple days > ago, but I had just done a partial water change and > stired up some debris in the gravel, so that could > have something to do with it. > > I'm wondering if this is something serious like fish > tb, or just fin biting (which doesn't explain the > kink), or what, and if so, what the heck am I > supposed to do? I feel so bad! > Emily > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 http://mail.yahoo.com Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15374	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 9/20/2005
Subject: Re: Help- dead pike and questions

You can also get really cheap thin acrylic sheets at most hardware stores. Different sizes or have it cut. I bought a cheap thin piece that I use as a cover on a tank. -----Original Message----- From: Chris <youcantryreachingme@...> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tue, 20 Sep 2005 13:30:05 -0000 Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Help- dead pike and questions --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "kb1dva" <vze3pd7a@v...> wrote: > The egg crate sounds like a great idea thanks!. Heck - even use cling wrap! anything! :) Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15375	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 9/20/2005
Subject: Re: help for fish with kinked spine--fish looks like a zig zag

Hi Emily, Well in my opinion I think your problem is the use of tap water and Amquel plus, the manufacturer makes claims for Amquel that are in my opinion contradictory, they also admit that Amquel will render a lot of medications useless!. In a large number of areas these days tap water is a chemical soup, arguably fit for human consumption but not in my opinion fit for fish to live in!, I recommend using RO/DI water. You could run activated carbon in your hang on filter for a week or so to try and clean up your water, it should remove the medications that could be stressing your fish. regards, unclenorm. --- Emily Tenczar <bababanana@...> wrote: > I have an undergravel filter as well as a filter > than hangs on the side of the tank. I can't remember > off the top of my head the specks on that one. I > have an ammonia indicator on the side of the tank > and it's been consistantly at zero. I'm using water > from the tap, which I recently started treating with > Amquel Plus to remove nitrites from the tap water. > > Emily > > "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> wrote: > Hi Emily, > It sounds to me like ammonia/nitrite > poisoning due to inadequate filtration, what type of > filtration are you using ?, what water source are > you > using ?. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- Emily Tenczar wrote: > > > A couple of my danios have been chronically ill > for > > a couple of months. Before they got sick, I moved > > the guppies and danios from a 10 to a 20 gal tank > > (which had been established with goldfish, who I > > also moved to a larger tank). I also adopted 5 > > mollies, who all died within several weeks. > > > > I've treated the tank several times with several > > different antibiotics for fin and tail rot but no > > matter what the fish won't get better. I started > to > > wonder if they were nipping fins, and just today I > > was reading about fish TB and wondering if that is > > what's ailing the danios. The really bad ones are > > kinky (zig-zag, one in particular is the worst) > and > > very thin, and the tails are stubs. The 7 danios > > share the 20 gal with a handful of guppies, some > > snails and all live plants. From what I know, > > guppies and danios aren't especially bad when it > > comes to fin biting. A few of the guppies have > some > > tears in the fins, but nothing major. > > > > I did notice an increase in nitrites a couple days > > ago, but I had just done a partial water change > and > > stired up some debris in the gravel, so that could > > have something to do with it. > > > > I'm wondering if this is something serious like > fish > > tb, or just fin biting (which doesn't explain the > > kink), or what, and if so, what the heck am I > > supposed to do? I feel so bad! > > Emily > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > How much free photo storage do you get? Store your > holiday > snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos > http://uk.photos.yahoo.com > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when > replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the > TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ___________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15376	From: Chris	Date: 9/20/2005
Subject: Re: Help! New Tank and Fish are Stressed

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > Chris, The pH scale is set up so that an increase (or decrease) in > one UNIT (not point) -- example pH 7.0 to pH 8.0 (or pH 7.0 to pH > 6.0) represents a 10 X (ten-fold) change. However, as this scale is > logarithmic, a change in pH of 2 UNITS (pH 6.0 to pH 8.0) is a 100 X > (one hundred times) change in the value. Yes, by "point", I meant "unit" - I can understand the confusion because pH is usually reported with a decimal point. Sorry about that. That 6.0 to 8.0 is an increase of x100 follows logically, as from 6.0 to 7.0 it is x10. From 7.0 to 8.0 it is x10, so logically from 6.0 to 8.0 is x10 x10 = x100. (in other words, agreed!) > \ > As far as adding pH adjusting chemicals ("pH UP" or pH "DOWN"), you > cannot arbitrarily say to add "perhaps a quarter of a teaspoon of > chemical per day", even if you know the quantity of water you're > dealing with in this case (29 gallons). All water is different, > depending upon its source, and can vary immensely in buffering > capacity. It may take just a few drops of one of these chemical > products in that quantity of water to adjust it a point (not unit > here) or two at a time, i.e., pH 7.4 to pH 7.2. Even so, using these > chemicals can cause the pH to bounce, again depending upon its > buffering capacity, and is not the best approach unless you really > know your own water -- softer water having less buffering capacity > will have much less of a tendancy to bounce. Otherwise its usually > best to first remove most of the carbonates. Then too, pH Down is a > much stronger chemical solution than pH up, by several X's, and the > same amount of this product will move the pH of a given quantity of > water several times that (initially) as compared to the same quantity > of pH Up (unless/until it possibly bounces). Never the less, its > never good to subject your aquarium water (and inhabitants) to pH > bouncing, especially at this time when the fish seem to possibly be > already stressed by it. Ray Again, agreed. My intent was to keep things simple in the explanation department and point out that 1/4 a teaspoon/day should be a maximum adjustment for a 29gal tank even with poor buffering capacity. As I pointed out, the big picture will be to address the stability of the pH, but in the "here and now" my advice was to adjust the pH (after checking and if required) so as to ease the stress on the fish. I hear that you're saying that might not be the best idea (in that last sentence) and I don't necessarily disagree; in my experience however, if the pH is way out of whack, usually bringing it drastically closer to the required range seems to ease the fish's stress (yes, even at the expense of how drastic the change is)... but as I said, I'm not going to argue with anyone who suggests the opposite, which is "don't be drastic". However, I still think the most siginificant thing was that the question was posted only 20 minutes after the fish were introduced. Chances are, nothing needed to be done! (but still check on the pH! :) ) Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15377	From: Crazy4fids@aol.com	Date: 9/20/2005
Subject: cure for ick-fill in the blanks

I believe that I read somewhere that I could cure ick by raising the tank temperature for ? degrees, and sustaining this temp for ? days. What are the figures that I am looking for? I only see one silver hatchet with symptoms of ick, but it looks like I have another fish with dropsy. Two weeks ago it was a siamese algae eater. This week it is a cory. What would be the course of treatment for these fish. I figured I would put the cory into the hospital tank and treat with one med. and leave the hatchet fish in the large community and treat with heat. Any other advice? What is the best med to use for dropsy? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15378	From: ii_ming	Date: 9/21/2005
Subject: sick balloon molly

Re : Sick Balloon mollies 2 weeks ago, my balloon molly gave birth. Until now she has no more balloon in your tummy. Few days ago, her body was getting so flat with hunk like back and her back was bend. She refused to eat for 2 days. She looks so sick. I have another molly which was dead 3 weeks later after giving birth. Her body was as flat as the existing sick one. What's worng with them? I have only 6 mollies in 10 gl tank. Re : Wired Angelfish My new set up 55 gl tank. Cycle should not be completed. All the test had done. Everything goes perfect except amonia a little bit high. Regular 5% water change every week. Recently, one of my angel fish started to swim strange. It tends to lean its body to right side. Not up right. Sometime, it only stare the food without eating. But it shows aggressive when it saw the food. Why? Is it sick? Ming

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15379	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 9/21/2005
Subject: Re: help for fish with kinked spine--fish looks like a zig zag

I only used the amquel a couple of times, which was well after the medication. I know someone mentioned a tap water filter a while back, what do you know about how to do this so I don't have to purchase bottled water all the time? Emily "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> wrote: Hi Emily, Well in my opinion I think your problem is the use of tap water and Amquel plus, the manufacturer makes claims for Amquel that are in my opinion contradictory, they also admit that Amquel will render a lot of medications useless!. In a large number of areas these days tap water is a chemical soup, arguably fit for human consumption but not in my opinion fit for fish to live in!, I recommend using RO/DI water. You could run activated carbon in your hang on filter for a week or so to try and clean up your water, it should remove the medications that could be stressing your fish. regards, unclenorm. --- Emily Tenczar wrote: > I have an undergravel filter as well as a filter > than hangs on the side of the tank. I can't remember > off the top of my head the specks on that one. I > have an ammonia indicator on the side of the tank > and it's been consistantly at zero. I'm using water > from the tap, which I recently started treating with > Amquel Plus to remove nitrites from the tap water. > > Emily > > "Norman. S. Hampson." wrote: > Hi Emily, > It sounds to me like ammonia/nitrite > poisoning due to inadequate filtration, what type of > filtration are you using ?, what water source are > you > using ?. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- Emily Tenczar wrote: > > > A couple of my danios have been chronically ill > for > > a couple of months. Before they got sick, I moved > > the guppies and danios from a 10 to a 20 gal tank > > (which had been established with goldfish, who I > > also moved to a larger tank). I also adopted 5 > > mollies, who all died within several weeks. > > > > I've treated the tank several times with several > > different antibiotics for fin and tail rot but no > > matter what the fish won't get better. I started > to > > wonder if they were nipping fins, and just today I > > was reading about fish TB and wondering if that is > > what's ailing the danios. The really bad ones are > > kinky (zig-zag, one in particular is the worst) > and > > very thin, and the tails are stubs. The 7 danios > > share the 20 gal with a handful of guppies, some > > snails and all live plants. From what I know, > > guppies and danios aren't especially bad when it > > comes to fin biting. A few of the guppies have > some > > tears in the fins, but nothing major. > > > > I did notice an increase in nitrites a couple days > > ago, but I had just done a partial water change > and > > stired up some debris in the gravel, so that could > > have something to do with it. > > > > I'm wondering if this is something serious like > fish > > tb, or just fin biting (which doesn't explain the > > kink), or what, and if so, what the heck am I > > supposed to do? I feel so bad! > > Emily > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > How much free photo storage do you get? Store your > holiday > snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos > http://uk.photos.yahoo.com > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when > replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the > TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ___________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15380	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 9/21/2005
Subject: Re: cure for ick-fill in the blanks

Linda, For Ich, raise the tank temperature to at least 86 o and hold it there for 3 days after you no longer see any signs of Ich on your fish. This time period will vary according to when in the cycle of the Ich you started treatment, how intense the infection is on your fish and of course the exact temperature the tank is kept at. Could take a week (or less) or up to ten days. The addition of salt helps; not knowing if you have more salt-intolerant cory's (than the one mentioned) or live plants, use no more than 1 tbs of salt per 5 gallons. Yes, treating the infected cory in the hospital tank for Dropsey while you treat the silver hatchet for Ich would be the best route to go. Treating Dropsey is not often successful, but you can try a med like Binox (Jungle Labs) which sometimes effects a cure. Generally, Dropsey is a result of poor water conditions. Check your water for excess ammonia and/or nitrites, keep up with water changes and vacuum the gravel to keep the aquarium water in as best condition as you can. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Crazy4fids@a... wrote: > I believe that I read somewhere that I could cure ick by raising the tank > temperature for ? degrees, and sustaining this temp for ? days. > > What are the figures that I am looking for? > > I only see one silver hatchet with symptoms of ick, but it looks like I have > another fish with dropsy. Two weeks ago it was a siamese algae eater. This > week it is a cory. What would be the course of treatment for these fish. > > I figured I would put the cory into the hospital tank and treat with one > med. and leave the hatchet fish in the large community and treat with heat. > > Any other advice? What is the best med to use for dropsy? > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15381	From: stuff4paws	Date: 9/21/2005
Subject: What is wrong with my bubble eye?

ok, Monday morning my fish was doing fine and than about an hour later I saw that all of the scales on it's back had fallen off. I immediatly did a water change and added some aquafiz fungus fizzie things. Then I began feeding medicated food. So far my fish is doing fine, eating and swiming just like nothing was wrong. The thing that bothers me though is that about three quarters of it's scales appear to have fallen of and where the scales used to be the appear little red streaks. Anybody know what it is? Stefani P.s. maybe it would help if I posted a pic, but I don't know how

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15382	From: stuff4paws	Date: 9/21/2005
Subject: Re: What is wrong with my bubble eye?

Ok, I figured out how to put a pic in...it is in the photos and the title is bubble-eye sick. It is near the end. It is not very clear but you can kind of see what I'm talking about. Stefani --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "stuff4paws" <stuff4paws@y...> wrote: > ok, > Monday morning my fish was doing fine and than about an hour later I > saw that all of the scales on it's back had fallen off. I immediatly > did a water change and added some aquafiz fungus fizzie things. Then > I > began feeding medicated food. So far my fish is doing fine, eating > and > swiming just like nothing was wrong. The thing that bothers me though > is that about three quarters of it's scales appear to have fallen of > and where the scales used to be the appear little red streaks. > Anybody > know what it is? > Stefani > > P.s. maybe it would help if I posted a pic, but I don't know how

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15383	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 9/21/2005
Subject: Re: help for fish with kinked spine--fish looks like a zig zag

Hi again Emily, Your best bet is to buy an RO/DI filter of E-Bay, there are a number of sellers, there is one used by a lot of reef keepers and the one one I would recommend most it is - Aqua-Safe Systems , they are excellent and have very good instructions and after sales service and can supply every thing you need to install the unit, they are easy to install. I would suggest the 100GPD six stage unit, I think it is around $70.00 US. All RO units work best at high pressure, up to 80PSI they can also supply a suitable booster pump, at high pressure you get much more pure water and less waste water. regards, unclenorm. --- Emily Tenczar <bababanana@...> wrote: > I only used the amquel a couple of times, which was > well after the medication. I know someone mentioned > a tap water filter a while back, what do you know > about how to do this so I don't have to purchase > bottled water all the time? > Emily > > "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> wrote: > Hi Emily, > Well in my opinion I think your problem is > the use of tap water and Amquel plus, the > manufacturer > makes claims for Amquel that are in my opinion > contradictory, they also admit that Amquel will > render > a lot of medications useless!. In a large number of > areas these days tap water is a chemical soup, > arguably fit for human consumption but not in my > opinion fit for fish to live in!, I recommend using > RO/DI water. You could run activated carbon in your > hang on filter for a week or so to try and clean up > your water, it should remove the medications that > could be stressing your fish. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- Emily Tenczar wrote: > > > I have an undergravel filter as well as a filter > > than hangs on the side of the tank. I can't > remember > > off the top of my head the specks on that one. I > > have an ammonia indicator on the side of the tank > > and it's been consistantly at zero. I'm using > water > > from the tap, which I recently started treating > with > > Amquel Plus to remove nitrites from the tap water. > > > > Emily > > > > "Norman. S. Hampson." wrote: > > Hi Emily, > > It sounds to me like ammonia/nitrite > > poisoning due to inadequate filtration, what type > of > > filtration are you using ?, what water source are > > you > > using ?. > > regards, > > unclenorm. > > > > > > --- Emily Tenczar wrote: > > > > > A couple of my danios have been chronically ill > > for > > > a couple of months. Before they got sick, I > moved > > > the guppies and danios from a 10 to a 20 gal > tank > > > (which had been established with goldfish, who I > > > also moved to a larger tank). I also adopted 5 > > > mollies, who all died within several weeks. > > > > > > I've treated the tank several times with several > > > different antibiotics for fin and tail rot but > no > > > matter what the fish won't get better. I started > > to > > > wonder if they were nipping fins, and just today > I > > > was reading about fish TB and wondering if that > is > > > what's ailing the danios. The really bad ones > are > > > kinky (zig-zag, one in particular is the worst) > > and > > > very thin, and the tails are stubs. The 7 danios > > > share the 20 gal with a handful of guppies, some > > > snails and all live plants. From what I know, > > > guppies and danios aren't especially bad when it > > > comes to fin biting. A few of the guppies have > > some > > > tears in the fins, but nothing major. > > > > > > I did notice an increase in nitrites a couple > days > > > ago, but I had just done a partial water change > > and > > > stired up some debris in the gravel, so that > could > > > have something to do with it. > > > > > > I'm wondering if this is something serious like > > fish > > > tb, or just fin biting (which doesn't explain > the > > > kink), or what, and if so, what the heck am I > > > supposed to do? I feel so bad! > > > Emily > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > > How much free photo storage do you get? Store your > > holiday > > snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos > > http://uk.photos.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it > when > > replying, thanks. > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > > that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING > the > > TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" > <- > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > > matter. > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC > calling worldwide with voicemail > http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when > replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the > TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ___________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15384	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 9/21/2005
Subject: Re: help for fish with kinked spine--fish looks like a zig zag

So....how big are these things??? Emily "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> wrote: Hi again Emily, Your best bet is to buy an RO/DI filter of E-Bay, there are a number of sellers, there is one used by a lot of reef keepers and the one one I would recommend most it is - Aqua-Safe Systems , they are excellent and have very good instructions and after sales service and can supply every thing you need to install the unit, they are easy to install. I would suggest the 100GPD six stage unit, I think it is around $70.00 US. All RO units work best at high pressure, up to 80PSI they can also supply a suitable booster pump, at high pressure you get much more pure water and less waste water. regards, unclenorm. --- Emily Tenczar wrote: > I only used the amquel a couple of times, which was > well after the medication. I know someone mentioned > a tap water filter a while back, what do you know > about how to do this so I don't have to purchase > bottled water all the time? > Emily > > "Norman. S. Hampson." wrote: > Hi Emily, > Well in my opinion I think your problem is > the use of tap water and Amquel plus, the > manufacturer > makes claims for Amquel that are in my opinion > contradictory, they also admit that Amquel will > render > a lot of medications useless!. In a large number of > areas these days tap water is a chemical soup, > arguably fit for human consumption but not in my > opinion fit for fish to live in!, I recommend using > RO/DI water. You could run activated carbon in your > hang on filter for a week or so to try and clean up > your water, it should remove the medications that > could be stressing your fish. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- Emily Tenczar wrote: > > > I have an undergravel filter as well as a filter > > than hangs on the side of the tank. I can't > remember > > off the top of my head the specks on that one. I > > have an ammonia indicator on the side of the tank > > and it's been consistantly at zero. I'm using > water > > from the tap, which I recently started treating > with > > Amquel Plus to remove nitrites from the tap water. > > > > Emily > > > > "Norman. S. Hampson." wrote: > > Hi Emily, > > It sounds to me like ammonia/nitrite > > poisoning due to inadequate filtration, what type > of > > filtration are you using ?, what water source are > > you > > using ?. > > regards, > > unclenorm. > > > > > > --- Emily Tenczar wrote: > > > > > A couple of my danios have been chronically ill > > for > > > a couple of months. Before they got sick, I > moved > > > the guppies and danios from a 10 to a 20 gal > tank > > > (which had been established with goldfish, who I > > > also moved to a larger tank). I also adopted 5 > > > mollies, who all died within several weeks. > > > > > > I've treated the tank several times with several > > > different antibiotics for fin and tail rot but > no > > > matter what the fish won't get better. I started > > to > > > wonder if they were nipping fins, and just today > I > > > was reading about fish TB and wondering if that > is > > > what's ailing the danios. The really bad ones > are > > > kinky (zig-zag, one in particular is the worst) > > and > > > very thin, and the tails are stubs. The 7 danios > > > share the 20 gal with a handful of guppies, some > > > snails and all live plants. From what I know, > > > guppies and danios aren't especially bad when it > > > comes to fin biting. A few of the guppies have > > some > > > tears in the fins, but nothing major. > > > > > > I did notice an increase in nitrites a couple > days > > > ago, but I had just done a partial water change > > and > > > stired up some debris in the gravel, so that > could > > > have something to do with it. > > > > > > I'm wondering if this is something serious like > > fish > > > tb, or just fin biting (which doesn't explain > the > > > kink), or what, and if so, what the heck am I > > > supposed to do? I feel so bad! > > > Emily > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > > How much free photo storage do you get? Store your > > holiday > > snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos > > http://uk.photos.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it > when > > replying, thanks. > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > > that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING > the > > TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" > <- > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > > matter. > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC > calling worldwide with voicemail > http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when > replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the > TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ___________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15385	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 9/21/2005
Subject: Re: help for fish with kinked spine--fish looks like a zig zag

So....how big are these things??? Do they hook up directly to the tap, or can I just run it when I need it? Emily "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> wrote: Hi again Emily, Your best bet is to buy an RO/DI filter of E-Bay, there are a number of sellers, there is one used by a lot of reef keepers and the one one I would recommend most it is - Aqua-Safe Systems , they are excellent and have very good instructions and after sales service and can supply every thing you need to install the unit, they are easy to install. I would suggest the 100GPD six stage unit, I think it is around $70.00 US. All RO units work best at high pressure, up to 80PSI they can also supply a suitable booster pump, at high pressure you get much more pure water and less waste water. regards, unclenorm. --- Emily Tenczar wrote: > I only used the amquel a couple of times, which was > well after the medication. I know someone mentioned > a tap water filter a while back, what do you know > about how to do this so I don't have to purchase > bottled water all the time? > Emily > > "Norman. S. Hampson." wrote: > Hi Emily, > Well in my opinion I think your problem is > the use of tap water and Amquel plus, the > manufacturer > makes claims for Amquel that are in my opinion > contradictory, they also admit that Amquel will > render > a lot of medications useless!. In a large number of > areas these days tap water is a chemical soup, > arguably fit for human consumption but not in my > opinion fit for fish to live in!, I recommend using > RO/DI water. You could run activated carbon in your > hang on filter for a week or so to try and clean up > your water, it should remove the medications that > could be stressing your fish. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- Emily Tenczar wrote: > > > I have an undergravel filter as well as a filter > > than hangs on the side of the tank. I can't > remember > > off the top of my head the specks on that one. I > > have an ammonia indicator on the side of the tank > > and it's been consistantly at zero. I'm using > water > > from the tap, which I recently started treating > with > > Amquel Plus to remove nitrites from the tap water. > > > > Emily > > > > "Norman. S. Hampson." wrote: > > Hi Emily, > > It sounds to me like ammonia/nitrite > > poisoning due to inadequate filtration, what type > of > > filtration are you using ?, what water source are > > you > > using ?. > > regards, > > unclenorm. > > > > > > --- Emily Tenczar wrote: > > > > > A couple of my danios have been chronically ill > > for > > > a couple of months. Before they got sick, I > moved > > > the guppies and danios from a 10 to a 20 gal > tank > > > (which had been established with goldfish, who I > > > also moved to a larger tank). I also adopted 5 > > > mollies, who all died within several weeks. > > > > > > I've treated the tank several times with several > > > different antibiotics for fin and tail rot but > no > > > matter what the fish won't get better. I started > > to > > > wonder if they were nipping fins, and just today > I > > > was reading about fish TB and wondering if that > is > > > what's ailing the danios. The really bad ones > are > > > kinky (zig-zag, one in particular is the worst) > > and > > > very thin, and the tails are stubs. The 7 danios > > > share the 20 gal with a handful of guppies, some > > > snails and all live plants. From what I know, > > > guppies and danios aren't especially bad when it > > > comes to fin biting. A few of the guppies have > > some > > > tears in the fins, but nothing major. > > > > > > I did notice an increase in nitrites a couple > days > > > ago, but I had just done a partial water change > > and > > > stired up some debris in the gravel, so that > could > > > have something to do with it. > > > > > > I'm wondering if this is something serious like > > fish > > > tb, or just fin biting (which doesn't explain > the > > > kink), or what, and if so, what the heck am I > > > supposed to do? I feel so bad! > > > Emily > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > > How much free photo storage do you get? Store your > > holiday > > snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos > > http://uk.photos.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it > when > > replying, thanks. > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > > that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING > the > > TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" > <- > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > > matter. > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC > calling worldwide with voicemail > http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when > replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the > TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ___________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15386	From: snailcrazymom	Date: 9/21/2005
Subject: Worms

Hey all...I was just doing my weekly cleaning of my tanks...I was going to wash out the filters and I saw these small black worms in the white of the filter media...so I threw them in the trash and put new filters in....can anyone tell me what these worms are..they are gross..I freaked out and Im ready to break down my tanks now...Ive been having water issues...could this be the cause..or the effect?? Any help would be appreciated Rho

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15387	From: Leslie	Date: 9/21/2005
Subject: Re: What is wrong with my bubble eye?

Little red streaks lead me to think septicemia. It's bacterial and I just had a run with it in my danios. I have no idea as to the scales falling off. I fed bacterial food and treated with maracyn 2 with a bit of PimaFix. That along with perfect water conditions, they improved. I did quarantine them as some people think it might be contagious. It took about 2 weeks for them to fully recover. If in fact that's what it is, it's treatable if caught quickly. Do a fish disease search for losing scales. That's new to me but I know someone here has some great info for you. Also look at a search on septicemia. That will help you determine if this is in fact the case. Good luck, Leslie

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15388	From: stuff4paws	Date: 9/21/2005
Subject: Re: What is wrong with my bubble eye?

Thanks for the help. My little fish seems to be worse, in that his scales just keep falling off. Am doing the searches to see what I come up with. Stefani --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > Little red streaks lead me to think septicemia. It's bacterial and I > just had a run with it in my danios. I have no idea as to the scales > falling off. I fed bacterial food and treated with maracyn 2 with a bit > of PimaFix. That along with perfect water conditions, they improved. I > did quarantine them as some people think it might be contagious. It > took about 2 weeks for them to fully recover. > If in fact that's what it is, it's treatable if caught quickly. Do a > fish disease search for losing scales. That's new to me but I know > someone here has some great info for you. Also look at a search on > septicemia. That will help you determine if this is in fact the case. > > Good luck, > Leslie

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15389	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 9/21/2005
Subject: Re: help for fish with kinked spine--fish looks like a zig zag

Hi Emily, They aren't very big, a common place to install them is under the kitchen sink, but they can be installed anywhere that has a water supply. regards, unclenorm. --- Emily Tenczar <bababanana@...> wrote: > So....how big are these things??? > Emily > > "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> wrote: > Hi again Emily, > Your best bet is to buy an RO/DI filter > of E-Bay, there are a number of sellers, there is > one > used by a lot of reef keepers and the one one I > would > recommend most it is - Aqua-Safe Systems , they are > excellent and have very good instructions and after > sales service and can supply every thing you need to > install the unit, they are easy to install. I would > suggest the 100GPD six stage unit, I think it is > around $70.00 US. All RO units work best at high > pressure, up to 80PSI they can also supply a > suitable > booster pump, at high pressure you get much more > pure > water and less waste water. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- Emily Tenczar wrote: > > > I only used the amquel a couple of times, which > was > > well after the medication. I know someone > mentioned > > a tap water filter a while back, what do you know > > about how to do this so I don't have to purchase > > bottled water all the time? > > Emily > > > > "Norman. S. Hampson." wrote: > > Hi Emily, > > Well in my opinion I think your problem is > > the use of tap water and Amquel plus, the > > manufacturer > > makes claims for Amquel that are in my opinion > > contradictory, they also admit that Amquel will > > render > > a lot of medications useless!. In a large number > of > > areas these days tap water is a chemical soup, > > arguably fit for human consumption but not in my > > opinion fit for fish to live in!, I recommend > using > > RO/DI water. You could run activated carbon in > your > > hang on filter for a week or so to try and clean > up > > your water, it should remove the medications that > > could be stressing your fish. > > regards, > > unclenorm. > > > > > > --- Emily Tenczar wrote: > > > > > I have an undergravel filter as well as a filter > > > than hangs on the side of the tank. I can't > > remember > > > off the top of my head the specks on that one. I > > > have an ammonia indicator on the side of the > tank > > > and it's been consistantly at zero. I'm using > > water > > > from the tap, which I recently started treating > > with > > > Amquel Plus to remove nitrites from the tap > water. > > > > > > Emily > > > > > > "Norman. S. Hampson." wrote: > > > Hi Emily, > > > It sounds to me like ammonia/nitrite > > > poisoning due to inadequate filtration, what > type > > of > > > filtration are you using ?, what water source > are > > > you > > > using ?. > > > regards, > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > --- Emily Tenczar wrote: > > > > > > > A couple of my danios have been chronically > ill > > > for > > > > a couple of months. Before they got sick, I > > moved > > > > the guppies and danios from a 10 to a 20 gal > > tank > > > > (which had been established with goldfish, who > I > > > > also moved to a larger tank). I also adopted 5 > > > > mollies, who all died within several weeks. > > > > > > > > I've treated the tank several times with > several > > > > different antibiotics for fin and tail rot but > > no > > > > matter what the fish won't get better. I > started > > > to > > > > wonder if they were nipping fins, and just > today > > I > > > > was reading about fish TB and wondering if > that > > is > > > > what's ailing the danios. The really bad ones > > are > > > > kinky (zig-zag, one in particular is the > worst) > > > and > > > > very thin, and the tails are stubs. The 7 > danios > > > > share the 20 gal with a handful of guppies, > some > > > > snails and all live plants. From what I know, > > > > guppies and danios aren't especially bad when > it > > > > comes to fin biting. A few of the guppies have > > > some > > > > tears in the fins, but nothing major. > > > > > > > > I did notice an increase in nitrites a couple > > days > > > > ago, but I had just done a partial water > change > > > and > > > > stired up some debris in the gravel, so that > > could > > > > have something to do with it. > > > > > > > > I'm wondering if this is something serious > like > > > fish > > > > tb, or just fin biting (which doesn't explain > > the > > > > kink), or what, and if so, what the heck am I > > > > supposed to do? I feel so bad! > > > > Emily > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > > > > How much free photo storage do you get? Store > your > > > holiday > > > snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos > > > http://uk.photos.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it > > when > > > replying, thanks. > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all > TEXT > > > that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING > > the > > > TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > > > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" > > <- > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > > > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > > > matter. > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > > Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC > > calling worldwide with voicemail > > http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it > when > > replying, thanks. > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > > that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING > the > > TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" > <- > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > > matter. > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC > calling worldwide with voicemail > http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when > replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the > TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ___________________________________________________________ How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15390	From: Leslie	Date: 9/22/2005
Subject: HITH?

I have posted pictures of my firemouth under "HITH" in the albums. This just appeared this morning. He has had small gatherings of spotted holes around his face but they cleared up and have been completely gone now for about 5 days. I am thinking HITH with this because of it's location. Also, the hole is in fact into the skin, but the outer edges are puffed up and a bit swollen. The blood parrot also a hole-ish area but not on top of the head, it's more near the bottom of his face. The two have been fighting a LOT the last two days but I doubt that the BP could have done this. Still possible? I'm trying to get better pictures but not much luck with that. What should I treat this with? Water conditions are perfect and a small water change is due today. Thanks, Leslie

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15391	From: Barbara	Date: 9/22/2005
Subject: Re: HITH?

That is NOT HITH, this looks more like he scaped his head on a rock, as you said, they have been fighting, which means chasing and running and trying to hide and get away. HITH is an arosion to a patch looking area, not like what yours have. YOU dont' say how big the tank is. A small water change?? what do you concider small? 10%, 20%?? IF you want to heal these, I suggest MelaFix to combat any fungus/bacteria that may develope..Keeping your tank cleaner wil prevent a lot of bacteria infections on any scrapes they may get. Parrots are mean as they are a mixture of Severum and Red Devil or Midas. Your firemouth is a bluff fish as he puffs up to ward off any attacts, the parrot does not bluff, he wil attact back..Small opening come and go on fish alot. NO worries until you see them get big and combine into more. The swelling is from him ramming his head not from HITH.. More on HITH with pics..Hope this helps U see this is not what yours has.. Barb Okla.. http://www.worldcichlids.com/diseases/Adamhith.html --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > I have posted pictures of my firemouth under "HITH" in the albums. > This just appeared this morning. He has had small gatherings of > spotted holes around his face but they cleared up and have been > completely gone now for about 5 days. I am thinking HITH with this > because of it's location. Also, the hole is in fact into the skin, > but the outer edges are puffed up and a bit swollen. > > The blood parrot also a hole-ish area but not on top of the head, > it's more near the bottom of his face. > > The two have been fighting a LOT the last two days but I doubt that > the BP could have done this. Still possible? > > I'm trying to get better pictures but not much luck with that. > > What should I treat this with? Water conditions are perfect and a > small water change is due today. > > Thanks, > Leslie

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15392	From: Barbara	Date: 9/22/2005
Subject: Re: Worms

These worms live in the substrate and are brought in by plants/snails. I am insure if you have never had a LIVE plant in your tank and no snails how they did get into the tank. Your filter wil remove them but more are in the gravel. A good vacuuming on every water change wil help keep them under control. Breaking down the tank wil cause it to crash and you wil have to cycle it all over again, possibley losing your fish. NOT GOOD! They should NOT be harmful to the fish, more cleaning of the gravel is the best way to go. And you may want to do a parasite clear by Jungle to see if it has any effect. Can't hurt your fish and just may take them out..Clean the filter later to see. Barb --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "snailcrazymom" <yarncrazymom@y...> wrote: > Hey all...I was just doing my weekly cleaning of my tanks...I was > going to wash out the filters and I saw these small black worms in the > white of the filter media...so I threw them in the trash and put new > filters in....can anyone tell me what these worms are..they are > gross..I freaked out and Im ready to break down my tanks now...Ive > been having water issues...could this be the cause..or the effect?? > Any help would be appreciated > Rho

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15393	From: Leslie	Date: 9/22/2005
Subject: Re: HITH?

Thanks Barb. That helps. I've put him in another tank (a 10g from his usual 75g.) and will treat him there. He should also get a good rest as I'm sure he's beat. Once he goes into the larger tank, I will have put in new hideouts of river rock formations. Hopefully that will help. Leslie PS I consider a small change about 15%. Water is good but I like to clean out the gunk in the gravel once a week.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15394	From: Leslie	Date: 9/22/2005
Subject: HITH in the BP?

Now that I know the firemouth doesn't have it, can someone please tell me what this is on the BP? (Picture under HITH album.) It's white and indented into the skin. No puffiness around the edges at all. You can also see how he is turning white on his fins. =( Normal? Thanks, Leslie

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15395	From: Barbara	Date: 9/22/2005
Subject: Re: HITH?

Glad the information helped you and REALLY glad it's not HITH.. Did you know that a 15% water change on a 75 gal tank is only 18 1/2 gal?? I do 25 gal+ change on my 75 gal. I do figure that with the deco and gravel you displace a good 5 gal if not more . so you figure it at 70 gal x.15= 10 1/2 gal of a water change. NOW I dont' think a 15% is enough on a 75 (70) gal tank. I always tell ppl to do 25-30% for a healthy tank, but it does depend on how many you have in the tank. How do you vacuum the gravel and only take out 10 gal of water?? I can't do it. I only have 1" or less of gravel in my 75 as it takes to long to clean it if it is any deeper. As this tank is high due to a homemade double stand it drains fast so I have to watch it..( I take my waste water out the window!) works great and I don't flood the floor!! --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > Thanks Barb. That helps. I've put him in another tank (a 10g from his > usual 75g.) and will treat him there. He should also get a good rest as > I'm sure he's beat. > Once he goes into the larger tank, I will have put in new hideouts of > river rock formations. Hopefully that will help. > > Leslie > > PS > I consider a small change about 15%. Water is good but I like to clean > out the gunk in the gravel once a week.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15396	From: Barbara	Date: 9/22/2005
Subject: Re: HITH in the BP?

Normal. Most of the species that are crossed with the severum, are those RD/Midas who do morph to a white as they get older. My male midas is mostly white now. This parrot seems to be taking after the that line of his parentage. He may morph a few times, and if you are lucky, he may go all white, rather rare for a parrot.. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > Now that I know the firemouth doesn't have it, can someone please tell > me what this is on the BP? (Picture under HITH album.) > It's white and indented into the skin. No puffiness around the edges > at all. You can also see how he is turning white on his fins. =( > Normal? > > Thanks, > Leslie

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15397	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 9/23/2005
Subject: Water Changes and Cleaning Substrate - WAS: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: H

Barbara, How do you do a 10-15% water change and clean the substrate at the same time? That is easy, you only do a section of substrate with each water change. There is no real need, unless you have really messy fish, to clean the full substrate with each water change, unless you are one of those proponents of putting off water changes as much as possible. In a tank with no plantings or real aqua decor, one inch is probably sufficient, as it would be without under gravel filtration. However, in most installations, more than one inch would be required, whether it be for support of rockwork and/or driftwood, as a rooting medium for live plants, or to serve as a biofilter. So far as water displacement goes, you are absolutely correct, though I may not agree with your figures. First of all, that 75 gallon probably does not hold 75 gallons of water, even with noting in the tank but water. If you do the math using outside measurements, it may add up to 75 gallons, or more, but not always. Using your 75 gallons as an example, I checked a couple of web sites for measurements, and came up with the following: 75 Gal. Tall 48 x 18 x 21 = 78.545454545454545454545454545455 gal. 75 Gal. Long 72 x 18 x 13 = 72.935064935064935064935064935065 gal. 75 48x18x20 = 74.805194805194805194805194805195 gal. One exceeds the capacity, while two fall short. Now, if we take the inside measurements, unfortunately not given, the capacity would be even less. And that would be with the water to the brim. Subtract that inch or so that we leave free at the top, and we are looking at even less water. I don't know of a good way measure the capacity of a tank with substrate, etc. in it, mathematically, though I do know those who have made the attempt. The best way to get the capacity is to measure the amount of water added to fill that tank from empty (which no one every really does), so the actual amount of water is merely a guesstimate. The idea behind doing a water change is not so much the actual amount, but that it is done on a regular basis so that the disagreeable stuff is removed and water without it is added. The way to do a proper water change is to add fresh water (not necessarily "freshwater") to the tank to make up for evaporation since the last water change, and then change the amount of water you prefer to change to keep your aquatic environment in good condition. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Barbara Sent: Thursday, September 22, 2005 8:33 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: HITH? Glad the information helped you and REALLY glad it's not HITH.. Did you know that a 15% water change on a 75 gal tank is only 18 1/2 gal?? I do 25 gal+ change on my 75 gal. I do figure that with the deco and gravel you displace a good 5 gal if not more . so you figure it at 70 gal x.15= 10 1/2 gal of a water change. NOW I dont' think a 15% is enough on a 75 (70) gal tank. I always tell ppl to do 25-30% for a healthy tank, but it does depend on how many you have in the tank. How do you vacuum the gravel and only take out 10 gal of water?? I can't do it. I only have 1" or less of gravel in my 75 as it takes to long to clean it if it is any deeper. As this tank is high due to a homemade double stand it drains fast so I have to watch it..( I take my waste water out the window!) works great and I don't flood the floor!! --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie" <amjmail@c...> wrote: > Thanks Barb. That helps. I've put him in another tank (a 10g from his > usual 75g.) and will treat him there. He should also get a good rest as > I'm sure he's beat. > Once he goes into the larger tank, I will have put in new hideouts of > river rock formations. Hopefully that will help. > > Leslie > > PS > I consider a small change about 15%. Water is good but I like to clean > out the gunk in the gravel once a week. Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15398	From: KttmfC	Date: 9/23/2005
Subject: Why are my fish dying?? HELP!!!

Ive got a 55 gallon tank with a bioload(predeath) of about 15 penguin tetras, 10 baby neons, 8 rummy nose and 4 panda corydoras. stats, GH 15 KH 6 pH 7.2 no amonia and low nitrites..... Fe is very low too Does anyone know why all my fish keep dying or can anyone help possibly??? Anything would help me im bummed i have great luck with my other 10 tnaks but this one just keeps having problems. I lost 5 discus in it about 2 months ago then i cycled it and started with these again about a month ago.PLEASE HELP! im down to 3 neons 2 penguin and 3 rummynose and 3 corydoras. Kris

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15399	From: Chris	Date: 9/23/2005
Subject: Re: Why are my fish dying?? HELP!!!

stats all look fine, and clearly you'd know what you were doing with 10 tanks... my first thought would be for some sort of poisoning as a result of contamination. again - these suggestions will sound silly given you already manage 10 tanks well, but here goes.... have any cleaning agents (soaps/detergents) been used in that tank (or the gravel) at any stage? Has the gravel been washed in (or the water changed with) a bucket which has had soaps/detergents? Have any flysprays or other aerosols been used near the tank or near any air pump used in that tank? Are there any signs of disease on the fish? Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15400	From: harry perry	Date: 9/23/2005
Subject: Re: Why are my fish dying?? HELP!!!/To Kris

Tell us some more about this tank. Plants, filter, substrate, water changes, filter etc. Nitrites not at 0 would indicate a problem. Harry KttmfC <punk3r12@...> wrote: Ive got a 55 gallon tank with a bioload(predeath) of about 15 penguin tetras, 10 baby neons, 8 rummy nose and 4 panda corydoras. stats, GH 15 KH 6 pH 7.2 no amonia and low nitrites..... Fe is very low too Does anyone know why all my fish keep dying or can anyone help possibly??? Anything would help me im bummed i have great luck with my other 10 tnaks but this one just keeps having problems. I lost 5 discus in it about 2 months ago then i cycled it and started with these again about a month ago.PLEASE HELP! im down to 3 neons 2 penguin and 3 rummynose and 3 corydoras. Kris Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! for Good Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15401	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 9/23/2005
Subject: Re: Water Changes and Cleaning Substrate - WAS: RE: [AquaticLife] R

Hi Steve, I use an excellent calculator for finding actual tank water volumes with various types and depth of substrate, weight of set-up and much more, it is called 'Fish Tank' and can be used on line or downloaded for free from the following link :- http://boonedocks.net/fishtank regards, unclenorm --- Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > Barbara, > > How do you do a 10-15% water change and clean the > substrate at the same > time? That is easy, you only do a section of > substrate with each water > change. There is no real need, unless you have > really messy fish, to clean > the full substrate with each water change, unless > you are one of those > proponents of putting off water changes as much as > possible. > > In a tank with no plantings or real aqua decor, one > inch is probably > sufficient, as it would be without under gravel > filtration. However, in most > installations, more than one inch would be required, > whether it be for > support of rockwork and/or driftwood, as a rooting > medium for live plants, > or to serve as a biofilter. > > So far as water displacement goes, you are > absolutely correct, though I may > not agree with your figures. First of all, that 75 > gallon probably does not > hold 75 gallons of water, even with noting in the > tank but water. If you do > the math using outside measurements, it may add up > to 75 gallons, or more, > but not always. Using your 75 gallons as an example, > I checked a couple of > web sites for measurements, and came up with the > following: > > 75 Gal. Tall 48 x 18 x 21 = > 78.545454545454545454545454545455 gal. > 75 Gal. Long 72 x 18 x 13 = > 72.935064935064935064935064935065 gal. > 75 48x18x20 = 74.805194805194805194805194805195 > gal. > > One exceeds the capacity, while two fall short. Now, > if we take the inside > measurements, unfortunately not given, the capacity > would be even less. And > that would be with the water to the brim. Subtract > that inch or so that we > leave free at the top, and we are looking at even > less water. > > I don't know of a good way measure the capacity of a > tank with substrate, > etc. in it, mathematically, though I do know those > who have made the > attempt. The best way to get the capacity is to > measure the amount of water > added to fill that tank from empty (which no one > every really does), so the > actual amount of water is merely a guesstimate. > > The idea behind doing a water change is not so much > the actual amount, but > that it is done on a regular basis so that the > disagreeable stuff is removed > and water without it is added. > > The way to do a proper water change is to add fresh > water (not necessarily > "freshwater") to the tank to make up for evaporation > since the last water > change, and then change the amount of water you > prefer to change to keep > your aquatic environment in good condition. > > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Barbara > Sent: Thursday, September 22, 2005 8:33 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: HITH? > > ___________________________________________________________ To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. http://uk.security.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15402	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 9/23/2005
Subject: Re: Why are my fish dying?? HELP!!!

Hi Kris, Two things strike me your bioload was to high, and it would appear that your filtration has a problem or is inadequate, ammonia and nitrite should be zero at all times, your fish could be dyeing from nitrite poisoning, the Fe reading is not important unless you have a planted tank. regards, unclenorm. --- KttmfC <punk3r12@...> wrote: > Ive got a 55 gallon tank with a bioload(predeath) of > about 15 penguin > tetras, 10 baby neons, 8 rummy nose and 4 panda > corydoras. > > stats, > GH 15 > KH 6 > pH 7.2 > no amonia and low nitrites..... > Fe is very low too > > Does anyone know why all my fish keep dying or can > anyone help > possibly??? Anything would help me im bummed i have > great luck with my > other 10 tnaks but this one just keeps having > problems. I lost 5 > discus in it about 2 months ago then i cycled it and > started with > these again about a month ago.PLEASE HELP! im down > to 3 neons 2 > penguin and 3 rummynose and 3 corydoras. > > Kris > > > ___________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15403	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 9/24/2005
Subject: new betta

Well, no real problems right now, except for a case of popeye that is responding well to treatment in my flame gourami. We had a slight problem with bacterial bloom, and gill flukes in my baby bettas, but it seems to have responded to the treatment(water change, adding zeolite to the filters, salt baths for afflicted fish, medication) and there doesn't seem to be any problem now. We are starting up the third tank again, now, in preparation of breeding again. Although the baby bettas that got sick are still stunted and small, the rest of them are nearly of breeding size, if not of breeding age already. We didn't want to breed them with each other, so we called our local fish store, and he told us he'd call when he had something good. Well two days ago he called, and had a beautifully colored dark blue crowntail male betta for us. He's georgeous, and flares at EVERYTHING. We've put him in the tank with several females, and he seems to prefer a light bodied red female, who has a beautiful pink blush all over her light coloration, and a blue irridescence on her red fins and tail, so I think we'll try to breed those two first. We still have a georgeous male from our first breeding, light bodied, with a peacock mix of colors on his tail. I'm thinking of keeping him and getting another female for him.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15404	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 9/24/2005
Subject: Re: Water Changes and Cleaning Substrate - WAS: RE: [AquaticLife] R

Unclenorm, I downloaded the code for the calculator to determine how the programmer accounts for the substrate when determining the volume of water. I finally found the section in which the calculations are made. For the density it appears that he uses newtons/m^3 A newton is a measurement of force. It is not a measurement of density. Nor is it a measurement of weight. However, he comes up with a figure for each of the different types of substrate he lists, which is pretty nebulous in and of itself--using small, medium, large, sand and coral. The last two may have more credibility here, but, still, there is sand and there is sand. The same goes for coral. He also assigns a porosity for each material, ranging from 35% to 43.8%. The apparent meaning of this is that so much percent of the substrate is actually water. Doing a few web searches via Google, I was not able to come up with much in the way of firm information, but did find this link, http://herkules.oulu.fi/isbn9514269640/html/x618.html where it is mentioned that varying porosity of various corals, to wit: "The Porites porosity volume is 49 2% and their mean pore diameter is 250 µm (range 150–400 µm) while Acropora porosity volume is 12 4% with a mean pore diameter of 500 µm (range 200–800 µm)." So, I do find the programmers 43.8% a bit on the optimistic side, though I am aware that this porosity figure should include the spaces between the grains of coral. I did not look at how he uses temperature in his calculations, but I am aware that the density of water does change with temperature, but I'd not think it would make much difference in the amount of water that a 75 gallon tank can hold, to follow the size tank this discussion started with. The other work is fairly straight forward. I would just question running to the computer to calculate the gallonage when I could just do it with a hand held calculator (a pretty ubiquitous item), a cell phone (some do have a calculator as one of the options) or even roughly calculating it mentally. The formula is pretty straight forward, h*l*w/231=gallons. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Norman. S. Hampson. Sent: Saturday, September 24, 2005 12:09 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Water Changes and Cleaning Substrate - WAS: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: HITH? Hi Steve, I use an excellent calculator for finding actual tank water volumes with various types and depth of substrate, weight of set-up and much more, it is called 'Fish Tank' and can be used on line or downloaded for free from the following link :- http://boonedocks.net/fishtank regards, unclenorm --- Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > Barbara, > > How do you do a 10-15% water change and clean the > substrate at the same > time? That is easy, you only do a section of > substrate with each water > change. There is no real need, unless you have > really messy fish, to clean > the full substrate with each water change, unless > you are one of those > proponents of putting off water changes as much as > possible. > > In a tank with no plantings or real aqua decor, one > inch is probably > sufficient, as it would be without under gravel > filtration. However, in most > installations, more than one inch would be required, > whether it be for > support of rockwork and/or driftwood, as a rooting > medium for live plants, > or to serve as a biofilter. > > So far as water displacement goes, you are > absolutely correct, though I may > not agree with your figures. First of all, that 75 > gallon probably does not > hold 75 gallons of water, even with noting in the > tank but water. If you do > the math using outside measurements, it may add up > to 75 gallons, or more, > but not always. Using your 75 gallons as an example, > I checked a couple of > web sites for measurements, and came up with the > following: > > 75 Gal. Tall 48 x 18 x 21 = > 78.545454545454545454545454545455 gal. > 75 Gal. Long 72 x 18 x 13 = > 72.935064935064935064935064935065 gal. > 75 48x18x20 = 74.805194805194805194805194805195 > gal. > > One exceeds the capacity, while two fall short. Now, > if we take the inside > measurements, unfortunately not given, the capacity > would be even less. And > that would be with the water to the brim. Subtract > that inch or so that we > leave free at the top, and we are looking at even > less water. > > I don't know of a good way measure the capacity of a > tank with substrate, > etc. in it, mathematically, though I do know those > who have made the > attempt. The best way to get the capacity is to > measure the amount of water > added to fill that tank from empty (which no one > every really does), so the > actual amount of water is merely a guesstimate. > > The idea behind doing a water change is not so much > the actual amount, but > that it is done on a regular basis so that the > disagreeable stuff is removed > and water without it is added. > > The way to do a proper water change is to add fresh > water (not necessarily > "freshwater") to the tank to make up for evaporation > since the last water > change, and then change the amount of water you > prefer to change to keep > your aquatic environment in good condition. > > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Barbara > Sent: Thursday, September 22, 2005 8:33 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: HITH? > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15405	From: Amanda	Date: 9/24/2005
Subject: What type of fish are these?

These fish were caught in the Pamlico Sound in Hatteras N.C. They look like Gobies to me, from what I can find online. One of them seems to be getting ready to lay eggs(?). The photos are under Mandy's Pics. They are in a brackish tank with my green spotted puffer. They are constantly feeding on the bottom, and sifting the sand out through their gills. I have had them for about a month now, and have just been calling them bottom feeders. They peck at sinking shrimp pellets, and of course on bloodworms, and brine shrimp that sink to the bottom. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks, Mandy They are the last 3 photos in my album!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15406	From: Amanda	Date: 9/24/2005
Subject: Re: What type of fish are these?

By the way, they do not always have the brown/black coloring. Sometimes they are all silver. Seems like they change color with mood. Mandy --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Amanda" <acharris23@y...> wrote: > These fish were caught in the Pamlico Sound in Hatteras N.C. They look > like Gobies to me, from what I can find online. One of them seems to be > getting ready to lay eggs(?). The photos are under Mandy's Pics. They > are in a brackish tank with my green spotted puffer. They are > constantly feeding on the bottom, and sifting the sand out through > their gills. I have had them for about a month now, and have just been > calling them bottom feeders. They peck at sinking shrimp pellets, and > of course on bloodworms, and brine shrimp that sink to the bottom. Any > help would be greatly appreciated. > > Thanks, > > Mandy > > > They are the last 3 photos in my album!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15407	From: Patrick	Date: 9/24/2005
Subject: Re: Why are my fish dying?? HELP!!!

Well, you are a little over an inch per gallon, but not by much. BUT, since it is a newly set-up tank, it would explain the high nitrites. It would mean you are just coming out of the cycle with too many fish. Once the nitrite goes down, the deaths should level off and then stop. In about a month, you should be able to start replacing those fish, two per week. Patrick ----- Original Message ----- Ive got a 55 gallon tank with a bioload(predeath) of about 15 penguin tetras, 10 baby neons, 8 rummy nose and 4 panda corydoras. stats, GH 15 KH 6 pH 7.2 no amonia and low nitrites..... Fe is very low too Does anyone know why all my fish keep dying or can anyone help possibly??? Anything would help me im bummed i have great luck with my other 10 tnaks but this one just keeps having problems. I lost 5 discus in it about 2 months ago then i cycled it and started with these again about a month ago.PLEASE HELP! im down to 3 neons 2 penguin and 3 rummynose and 3 corydoras. Kris

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15408	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 9/24/2005
Subject: Re: Why are my fish dying?? HELP!!!

I also forgot to mention the filtration is in the back of the tank... its got bioballs and a heater and all that stuff, the temp is at 79 degrees. Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote:Well, you are a little over an inch per gallon, but not by much. BUT, since it is a newly set-up tank, it would explain the high nitrites. It would mean you are just coming out of the cycle with too many fish. Once the nitrite goes down, the deaths should level off and then stop. In about a month, you should be able to start replacing those fish, two per week. Patrick ----- Original Message ----- Ive got a 55 gallon tank with a bioload(predeath) of about 15 penguin tetras, 10 baby neons, 8 rummy nose and 4 panda corydoras. stats, GH 15 KH 6 pH 7.2 no amonia and low nitrites..... Fe is very low too Does anyone know why all my fish keep dying or can anyone help possibly??? Anything would help me im bummed i have great luck with my other 10 tnaks but this one just keeps having problems. I lost 5 discus in it about 2 months ago then i cycled it and started with these again about a month ago.PLEASE HELP! im down to 3 neons 2 penguin and 3 rummynose and 3 corydoras. Kris Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15409	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 9/24/2005
Subject: Re: Water Changes and Cleaning Substrate - WAS: RE: [AquaticLife] R

Hi Steve, The calculator is for the normal hobbist giving very close amounts, not for budding Einstine's. What do you want for free !!. If you want to dispute its accuracy contact the writer not me. regards, unclenorm. --- Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > Unclenorm, > > I downloaded the code for the calculator to > determine how the programmer > accounts for the substrate when determining the > volume of water. I finally > found the section in which the calculations are > made. For the density it > appears that he uses newtons/m^3 A newton is a > measurement of force. It is > not a measurement of density. Nor is it a > measurement of weight. However, he > comes up with a figure for each of the different > types of substrate he > lists, which is pretty nebulous in and of > itself--using small, medium, > large, sand and coral. The last two may have more > credibility here, but, > still, there is sand and there is sand. The same > goes for coral. > > He also assigns a porosity for each material, > ranging from 35% to 43.8%. The > apparent meaning of this is that so much percent of > the substrate is > actually water. Doing a few web searches via Google, > I was not able to come > up with much in the way of firm information, but did > find this link, > http://herkules.oulu.fi/isbn9514269640/html/x618.html > where it is mentioned > that varying porosity of various corals, to wit: > "The Porites porosity > volume is 49 2% and their mean pore diameter is 250 > µm (range 150–400 µm) > while Acropora porosity volume is 12 4% with a mean > pore diameter of 500 µm > (range 200–800 µm)." So, I do find the programmers > 43.8% a bit on the > optimistic side, though I am aware that this > porosity figure should include > the spaces between the grains of coral. > > I did not look at how he uses temperature in his > calculations, but I am > aware that the density of water does change with > temperature, but I'd not > think it would make much difference in the amount of > water that a 75 gallon > tank can hold, to follow the size tank this > discussion started with. > > The other work is fairly straight forward. I would > just question running to > the computer to calculate the gallonage when I could > just do it with a hand > held calculator (a pretty ubiquitous item), a cell > phone (some do have a > calculator as one of the options) or even roughly > calculating it mentally. > The formula is pretty straight forward, > h*l*w/231=gallons. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Norman. S. Hampson. > Sent: Saturday, September 24, 2005 12:09 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: Water Changes and Cleaning Substrate - > WAS: RE: [AquaticLife] > Re: HITH? > > Hi Steve, > I use an excellent calculator for finding > actual tank water volumes with various types and > depth > of substrate, weight of set-up and much more, it is > called 'Fish Tank' and can be used on line or > downloaded for free from the following link :- > > http://boonedocks.net/fishtank > > regards, > unclenorm > > > --- Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > > > Barbara, > > > > How do you do a 10-15% water change and clean the > > substrate at the same > > time? That is easy, you only do a section of > > substrate with each water > > change. There is no real need, unless you have > > really messy fish, to clean > > the full substrate with each water change, unless > > you are one of those > > proponents of putting off water changes as much as > > possible. > > > > In a tank with no plantings or real aqua decor, > one > > inch is probably > > sufficient, as it would be without under gravel > > filtration. However, in most > > installations, more than one inch would be > required, > > whether it be for > > support of rockwork and/or driftwood, as a rooting > > medium for live plants, > > or to serve as a biofilter. > > > > So far as water displacement goes, you are > > absolutely correct, though I may > > not agree with your figures. First of all, that 75 > > gallon probably does not > > hold 75 gallons of water, even with noting in the > > tank but water. If you do > > the math using outside measurements, it may add up > > to 75 gallons, or more, > > but not always. Using your 75 gallons as an > example, > > I checked a couple of > > web sites for measurements, and came up with the > > following: > > > > 75 Gal. Tall 48 x 18 x 21 = > > 78.545454545454545454545454545455 gal. > > 75 Gal. Long 72 x 18 x 13 = > > 72.935064935064935064935064935065 gal. > > 75 48x18x20 = 74.805194805194805194805194805195 > > gal. > > > > One exceeds the capacity, while two fall short. > Now, > > if we take the inside > > measurements, unfortunately not given, the > capacity > > would be even less. And > > that would be with the water to the brim. Subtract > > that inch or so that we > > leave free at the top, and we are looking at even > > less water. > > > > I don't know of a good way measure the capacity of > a > > tank with substrate, > > etc. in it, mathematically, though I do know those > > who have made the > > attempt. The best way to get the capacity is to > > measure the amount of water > > added to fill that tank from empty (which no one > > every really does), so the > > actual amount of water is merely a guesstimate. > > > > The idea behind doing a water change is not so > much > > the actual amount, but > > that it is done on a regular basis so that the > > disagreeable stuff is removed > > and water without it is added. > > > > The way to do a proper water change is to add > fresh > > water (not necessarily > > "freshwater") to the tank to make up for > evaporation > > since the last water > > change, and then change the amount of water you > > prefer to change to keep > > your aquatic environment in good condition. > > > > > > \\Steve// > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Barbara > > Sent: Thursday, September 22, 2005 8:33 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: HITH? > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. http://uk.security.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15410	From: Patrick	Date: 9/24/2005
Subject: Re: Water Changes and Cleaning Substrate - WAS: RE: [AquaticLife] R

"A newton is a measurement of force. It is not a measurement of density. Nor is it a measurement of weight." Newtons are a measure of force. Weight is in reality the force pulling down on a mass. Weight can be measured in Newtons. Patrick

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15411	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 9/24/2005
Subject: Re: Water Changes and Cleaning Substrate - WAS: RE: [AquaticLife] R

Patrick, OK, you got me on the weight. A newton is "the unit of force required to accelerate a mass of one kilogram one meter per second per second, equal to 100,000 dynes.", but it can be converted to a weight with 1 Newton = 0.2248089 pound. However, I do not see anywhere a conversion of newtons to density, which is an entirely different measurement. A pound of feathers requires much more volume to fill than a pound of lead, yet they are both, still, a pound. You can store a lot more lead in a given space than feathers, weight-wise. Pretty much, what I am saying is that I don't trust this fellow's calculations concerning substrate and the amount of water it displaces. The density of coral varies from species to species by quite a lot, should you be using coral as a substrate. I would suspect that the density of other substrates does vary depending on the exact material that is used as well. Take this along with the variations in tank capacity as shown in my original post in this thread, and the only really accurate measurement of the amount of water the tank will hold is to measure the water a you fill the tank for the first time. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Patrick Sent: Saturday, September 24, 2005 9:16 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Water Changes and Cleaning Substrate - WAS: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: HITH? "A newton is a measurement of force. It is not a measurement of density. Nor is it a measurement of weight." Newtons are a measure of force. Weight is in reality the force pulling down on a mass. Weight can be measured in Newtons. Patrick

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15412	From: mike	Date: 9/25/2005
Subject: what is the best size tank to buy a 30 or 40gal

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15413	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 9/25/2005
Subject: Re: what is the best size tank to buy a 30 or 40gal

Presuming your question is the subject, the general wisdom is to buy the largest tank you can afford that will fit into the space you have available. The reasoning behind this is that the more water you have, the more stable the tank insofar as water quality is concerned. Go for the 40. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of mike Sent: Sunday, September 25, 2005 7:51 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] what is the best size tank to buy a 30 or 40gal

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15414	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 9/25/2005
Subject: Quarantine

I just finished reading an article this week in the _Buntbarsche Bulletin_ Number 228 (the publication of the American Cichlid Association) about flagellates in cichlids written by two veterinarians. At the end of the article there is a recommendation to quarantine fish for up to two months before mixing them with the general population. This is a longer period than is generally recommended, we often recommend 2-3 weeks, and I wonder that if there is a benefit to this. If we are dealing with pet shop fish, I certainly think that 3 weeks is sufficient to notice any problems with the fish. However, if I am bringing in wild stock, I'd probably opt for the longer period of at least a month, not only to allow anything to show up, but to get the fish used to life in confined quarters. In the article, it is not clear whether they are talking about wild or domesticated fish. Does anyone care to opine about this topic? \\Steve// "There is still no cure for the common birthday" -- John Glenn

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15415	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 9/25/2005
Subject: Re: Quarantine

Tank raised and Wild fish are diffrent and should be treated diffrent in my opinion. Tank raised fish should be quaratined ( QT) for a minimum of 4-5 weeks. Longer if any problems arise while in Quarantine. Wild fish should be Qt'd and watched very closely for the first 4 weeks. If no problems arise then I take another 3-4 weeks of quarantine before i introduce to an established tank. I may be ANAL about QT's but I have ( like most) had a few bad incidents when I try and introduce fish straight into the tank. rob NE Indiana usa In a message dated 9/25/2005 11:10:41 AM US Eastern Standard Time, steve@... writes: If we are dealing with pet shop fish, I certainly think that 3 weeks is sufficient to notice any problems with the fish. However, if I am bringing in wild stock, I'd probably opt for the longer period of at least a month, not only to allow anything to show up, but to get the fish used to life in confined quarters. In the article, it is not clear whether they are talking about wild or domesticated fish. Does anyone care to opine about this topic? \\Steve// Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15416	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 9/25/2005
Subject: Re: Quarantine

Hi Steve, I presume this "recommended" 2 - 3 week quarantine period would probably be an average time period for isolating fairly disease- free Florida fish farm fish which are relatively free of disease and/or parasites. As for "pet shop" fish, there's no way of knowing if these fish are domestically raised (from Florida farms), hobbyist/tank raised, Far Eastern farm raised or wild as the lfs owner could pick up fish at his local wholesalers from any of these sources. As with Rob, I generally quarantine for at least 4 - 5 weeks if I think the fish are farm raised; and at least 6 - 7 weeks if I know or suspect the fish are wild caught. Often, with wild fish, just the stress of being in captivity will result in those fish eventually showing signs of a latent parasite which may take that long to manifest itself. I recently bought a mated pair of wild Pterophyllum leopoldi. The store owner had them in his shop for about 3 weeks. After 4 or 5 weeks in my tank, the female showed signs of the Hexamita-like gut protozoan Cryptobia lubilans, as per the "Flagellates -- Cichlids" article in BB #228 (June '05) you just finished reading. Being a pair, they were naturally housed in their own tank anyway, but I could have had real problems if I had put these fish in with a tank full of adult sized P. scalare after only 3 weeks. \ I'm even somewhat leary of fish being raised in the Far East, as I feel they tend have the possibility of harbouring disease moreso than domestically raised fish. After reading such early books as "Diseases of Fishes" (C. Van Duijn jnr - 1956) or even more modern books on diseases such as "Aquariology - the Science of Fish Health Management" (Dr. John B. Gratzek) or the more involved "The Manual of Fish Health" (Dr. Chris Andrews et al), the many obsure diseases that our fishy friends can come down with are enough to scare one into quarantining new fish for 6 months (lol). While most of these diseases are quite rare and hardly ever seen, the possibility still remains that our fish can carry them, as they do exist. \ A last note for those needing to treat diseases with antibiotics -- Many antibiotics are most effective in relatively soft water in a pH of 6.9, down, as these drugs will bind up with calcium or magnesium rendering then relatively ineffective. This is not to say you should change you hardness/pH, but those certain medications will need higher doses than normal to do any good. Regards, Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > I just finished reading an article this week in the _Buntbarsche Bulletin_ > Number 228 (the publication of the American Cichlid Association) about > flagellates in cichlids written by two veterinarians. At the end of the > article there is a recommendation to quarantine fish for up to two months > before mixing them with the general population. This is a longer period than > is generally recommended, we often recommend 2-3 weeks, and I wonder that if > there is a benefit to this. > > If we are dealing with pet shop fish, I certainly think that 3 weeks is > sufficient to notice any problems with the fish. However, if I am bringing > in wild stock, I'd probably opt for the longer period of at least a month, > not only to allow anything to show up, but to get the fish used to life in > confined quarters. > > In the article, it is not clear whether they are talking about wild or > domesticated fish. > > Does anyone care to opine about this topic? > > \\Steve// > "There is still no cure for the common birthday" > -- John Glenn

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15417	From: Patrick	Date: 9/25/2005
Subject: Re: Quarantine

Nearly a month or more for quarantining? That isn't quarantining, that is just plain making excuses for more display tanks! :) Patrick

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15418	From: Chris	Date: 9/25/2005
Subject: new to group / photo trouble

I just found this group today, so I'd like to start by saying hi to everyone. I've had my tank set up for about 2 months now and I'm pretty happy with it right now. Although I keep losing fish now and then... it's definitely a learning process, and I'm looking forward to any advice that comes my way. I uploaded a couple of photos to the Chris M folder. One's a shot of the tank itself, and the other is of the fish. After uploading, I got an error message saying the storage limit's been exceeded. I tried to go back in & delete my photos but it won't let me in. Sorry if I screwed it up. Administrators, please feel free to delete my photos if they are causing the problem. Today I made a list of all my fish. I have 6 platys that I got yesterday (3 red and 3 gold), 4 green barbs, 2 small goldfish, 2 red gourami, 1 chinese algae eater, 1 tetra, and 3 albino bottom feeders (I don't remember what they're called). Anyways, hi and I hope everyone's having a great evening. Chris

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15419	From: Aaron	Date: 9/26/2005
Subject: Re: photo trouble

Hi Chris, Welcome to the group. There is more space now to upload your photos. The first 2 pics you mentioned were very large and needed to be editied for size. You can do this yourself or use the "Delete Full Size Only" feature in the Yahoo Photo Album. Hope that helps, Aaron --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Chris" <psychedup74@g...> wrote: ... I uploaded a couple of photos to the Chris M folder. One's a shot of the tank itself, and the other is of the fish. After uploading, I got an error message saying the storage limit's been exceeded. I tried to go back in & delete my photos but it won't let me in. Sorry if I screwed it up. Administrators, please feel free to delete my photos if they are causing the problem. ... Chris

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15420	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 9/27/2005
Subject: Needle-Nosed Gar with hurt nose?

My gar has what looks like messed up spots on her nose. They showed up a couple days ago but didn't look to bad and I figured they would heal. Well now it looks like she's having trouble eating! :( We put in a bunch of goupies for her yesterday and she would catch them, and then let go! She sure seems hungary though and keeps going after them and then letting go. Any ideas? Sarah

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15421	From: Teresa	Date: 9/27/2005
Subject: Long post but PLEASE help!

Ok so I'm pretty new to this whole aquarium thing...Growing up I remember always having a 55 gallon freshwater aquarium in the house that my dad took care of. Now I'm in college and my boyfriend bought me a little 10 gallon for my dorm room and I haven't had very much luck with it so far. The tank has been set up for about 7 weeks now and my progress fluctuates a lot. I let it cycle for about 2 weeks before I added some guppies. I added 9 right away (I know I know...bad idea) and 6 died within a week. I waited another 2 weeks then added 4 more. A week later I had lost 5 more. I hear guppies are supposed to be pretty hard to kill but apparently I'm really good at it... Just last week I added 2 more guppies and one cory cat...1 guppy died. Now the weird thing is that with these last 3 fish I added, within two days all 5 of my ghost shrimp died. Now I've had these ghost shrimp from the very beginning and I thought nothing would kill them but all of a sudden every single one croaked. The most recent guppy death appeared to be from a mixture of ich and scale protrusion. I was away for the weekend and when I came back he was BAD. 2 of the 3 guppies I have left seem to have a mild (so far) case of ich. Today I did about an 80% water change syphoning from the bottom and added aged water that was treated with bio-safe tap water detoxifier, bio-coat internal and external stress defense, and dual action stress zyme. I then added a tablespoon of aquarium salt for tropical fish and 5ml of rid-ich+. I also raised the temperature to 84 degrees. Is there anything else I can be doing? I read that I'm supposed to do a 50% water change daily and add 5 ml of rid-ich+ for about 16 days. Do I add the aquarium salt every day too? What about the stress zyme and water detoxifier? Thanks for reading my long post. Pllleeeaaase help!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15422	From: Justin M.	Date: 9/27/2005
Subject: Re: Long post but PLEASE help!

At 07:26 PM 27/09/2005 +0000, you wrote: >Ok so I'm pretty new to this whole aquarium thing...Growing up I >remember always having a 55 gallon freshwater aquarium in the house >that my dad took care of. Now I'm in college and my boyfriend bought >me a little 10 gallon for my dorm room and I haven't had very much >luck with it so far. > > >Is there anything else I can be doing? I read that I'm supposed to >do a 50% water change daily and add 5 ml of rid-ich+ for about 16 >days. Do I add the aquarium salt every day too? What about the >stress zyme and water detoxifier? The biggest thing that's gone wrong here is that the nitrogen cycle has not been established. You can't just let a tank sit and establish the bacteria colonies that way...they need some source of ammonia (this is the bacteria's food), which will not exist in a tank with nothing living in it. A good article to learn about this process can be found here: http://badmanstropicalfish.com/articles/article14.html You'll want to purchase test kits for Ammonia, Nitrite, and Nitrate. The best kind are the liquid reagent tests; they are not the cheapest ones, but they work very well. The cycle will take 4-6 weeks to establish, and during that time, you'll want to do frequent water changes to minimize the impact of toxic ammonia and nitrite on your fish. I hope this makes sense...we're all here if you have any questions. Good luck! JM

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15423	From: Andreas	Date: 9/27/2005
Subject: Re: Needle-Nosed Gar with hurt nose?

Can you be more specific about what the spots look like? Andreas On 9/27/05, Sarah Fleming Davis <keelis_mom@...> wrote: > > My gar has what looks like messed up spots on her nose. They showed up > a couple days ago but didn't look to bad and I figured they would > heal. Well now it looks like she's having trouble eating! :( We put > in a bunch of goupies for her yesterday and she would catch them, and > then let go! She sure seems hungary though and keeps going after them > and then letting go. Any ideas? > > Sarah > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > 毀畔�虜.><((((�gt;.毀畔�虜.毀畔��gt;<((((�gt; �毀畔�� , .毀畔�.><((((�gt; > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <�(((><.毀畔�虜.毀畔��lt;�(((><�毀畔�� , .毀畔�.<�(((><毀畔�虜. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine biology<http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine+fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=sWozU8RAgM2g66Yb_7h_nQ> Marine > fish<http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine+fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=JB6FNOraRx3JIvMA1E4-Lw> > Biology<http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine+fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=R-HUKyhqLGfm-ZAFT2vuTQ> > ------------------------------ > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > - Visit your group "AquaticLife<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife>" > on the web. > - To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com<AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > - Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>. > > > ------------------------------ > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15424	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 9/27/2005
Subject: I got a new fish!

We bought a freshwater moray eel yesterday and it is so cool!!! Actually, it's a snowflake one and he sure is neat looking! :) Does anybody else have one of these? Anything I should know about them? We got some frozen bloodworms because that's what he was eating but I've read a litttle online and sounds like he'll eat ghost shrimp, which several other of our fish like :) Sarah

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15425	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 9/27/2005
Subject: Re: I got a new fish!

Hi Sarah, I really like the look of those eels but never bought one. Only thing I can add is to make sure the top of your tank is well covered and secured. Most eels are escape artists. Mike -----Original Message----- From: Sarah Fleming Davis <keelis_mom@...> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tue, 27 Sep 2005 16:36:44 -0000 Subject: [AquaticLife] I got a new fish! We bought a freshwater moray eel yesterday and it is so cool!!! Actually, it's a snowflake one and he sure is neat looking! :) Does anybody else have one of these? Anything I should know about them? We got some frozen bloodworms because that's what he was eating but I've read a litttle online and sounds like he'll eat ghost shrimp, which several other of our fish like :) Sarah Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15426	From: Thomas Schlemmermeyer	Date: 9/27/2005
Subject: The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, wilderness tank ent

Hello, I have been just discussing with a friend of mine who is a bird enthusiast. She loves bird watching very much, but each time she goes to catch birds in nets (sometimes it is necessary for her science) her consciousness gets rather heavy, as she does not feel entitled to take the freedom away of whatever animal. This brings me to the point of discussing the ethical aspects of our own hobby: the aquarium. My dream would be to work out a sort of poster presentation which lists up possible dark sides of our seemingly so innocent hobby - innocent just at first sight. Afterwards solutions or avoidances of these dark sides might be suggested. Let me just list up some points: -Many seawater fish species, particularly those that are found in coral reefs, are caught with dubious methods, including poison. -pretty many of those coral fish die during transport, or (if they survive) won´t get the opportunity to live and to reproduce in a habitat which is suitable to their natural niche. -Many fish species for instance from the Amazone region only survive in their artificial Northern Hemisphere Tank habitats due to regular refreshing caughts in wilderness. These excursions are often not in compliance with local laws and may affect local ecosystems. -even fish species that are routinely bred in tanks are vertebrates, hence phylogenetically alike to us (humans), and therefore these fish deserve some protection of their natural animal rights. But is it fair for instance to breed fancy guppies in small 30 liter- tanks? Moreover, is it fair to select fish populations only for fancy effects? Are fancy guppies really lucky? Aren´t they deprived of their natural rights, due to artificial selection? Shouldn´t artificial selection be forbidden in that context? (OK, I am not against breeding bigger porks, more milk giving cows or anything like this, as in this case artificial selection merely serves to satisfy our protein needs; but I think it is highly questionable to breed for instance glimmering Danio rerio, or fancy guppies, as in that case the purpose of man is neither the observation of nature (in due awe) nor the struggle for his own survival, but what is on stake is falsifying nature for mere pleasure purposes?) I would like to sum up more of these ethically critical aspects, and I would like to know about guideline drafts for free and ecologically well sustained aquarium maintainance of fish. Where do we find a reasonable compromise between an unlimited claim on fish for merely ornamental purposes and a more reasonable handling of aquarium fish as interesting study objects which should only enhance our awe of nature, and nothing more? best wishes, I am waiting for good suggestions, Thomas

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15427	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 9/27/2005
Subject: Re: The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, wilderness tank

Simple, fish do not have rights. -----Original Message----- From: Thomas Schlemmermeyer <evolthomas@...> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wed, 28 Sep 2005 00:19:27 -0000 Subject: [AquaticLife] The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, wilderness tank enthusiast -even fish species that are routinely bred in tanks are vertebrates, hence phylogenetically alike to us (humans), and therefore these fish deserve some protection of their natural animal rights. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15428	From: Patrick	Date: 9/27/2005
Subject: Re: The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, wilderness tank

This topic would be better at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/aquaticdebates I simply will not participate in this debate on this group. :) Patrick, who will probably get yelled at for NOT making everybody mad with his thoughts...

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15429	From: Patrick	Date: 9/27/2005
Subject: Re: The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, wilderness tank

correction, the debate group is at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/aquariumdebates/ Patrick

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15430	From: Sue Boswell	Date: 9/27/2005
Subject: Re: I got a new fish!

The snowflake eel isn't a freshwater species - it may survive in fresh for a time while small but need taking up to high end brackish or Marine. G tile is the brackish moray but it too won't survive long in freshwater. They will eat any meaty/fishy foods or small fish. cockles & lancefish are fairly standard foods for them. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sarah Fleming Davis" <keelis_mom@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, September 27, 2005 5:36 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] I got a new fish! We bought a freshwater moray eel yesterday and it is so cool!!! Actually, it's a snowflake one and he sure is neat looking! :) Does anybody else have one of these? Anything I should know about them? We got some frozen bloodworms because that's what he was eating but I've read a litttle online and sounds like he'll eat ghost shrimp, which several other of our fish like :) Sarah Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15431	From: Patrick, the AmericanFishGuy	Date: 9/28/2005
Subject: Re: how about a fish suggestion?

I think I've decided to get a couple of angelfish. I moved the tetras to my 10 gallon tank, so I won't have to worry about them getting eaten. Angels are easier to find than the rams, and I can get them locally. Now I just have to save up the money to buy them. Patrick, AFG --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "The Dragon Hunter" <dragon.hunter@d...> wrote: > Say, you never did say (or I never got it). What did you wind up getting or > have you yet? > > -Steve

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15432	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 9/28/2005
Subject: Re: The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, wilderness tank

Rights and responsibilities go hand in hand. Until fish can take responsibility, they have no rights. Now, this does not mean that we cannot be good stewards, but let's be realistic. Whatever cruelty you see inflicted on animals by humans, I garauntee Mother nature also does, only more ruthlessly. The people who are avid hobbiests are usually the ones who take the best care of their fish, and are concerned with where they come from, if only because stressed fish seldom show well, or live long. It is the dabblers who tend to perpetuate cruelty by lack of information. Just research where your fish come from, and choose your sources accordingly.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15433	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 9/28/2005
Subject: Deeper and deeper

We're being dragged deeper and deeper into this whole betta breeding thing! AUGH! I noticed what I thought was one of our female bettas behaving like a male, trying to interest a female, and started studying them closely. Looks like one of the veil-tails that produced this lot of babies was a short tailed betta, rather than a veil-tail. Hmmm. His coloring is a georgeous deep bloodred on the fins, and a rosy blush over his white body, a good conformation on the body, from what my amateur eyes can tell. He has a sister whose body isn't quite as pretty, a few tiny spatters of red, and not as nice a shape, but otherwise the same coloring. So...what is the general concensus on breeding spawn-mates to each other? Is it a bad idea? I love the coloring and thought it would be worth a try if the results won't be too inbred.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15434	From: wendie	Date: 9/28/2005
Subject: Re: Deeper and deeper

I noticed that. Out of a CT x VT breeding I had several different tail types ranging from a nice crown tail, a veil tail, a round tail, a spade tail, several veil tails with spikes like a crown tail, a veil tail with double rays at the end...not a nice look, double tail, and several round tails with ridges - like the beginnings of a crown tail. Quite an assortment. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of cynthia brennemann Sent: Wednesday, September 28, 2005 7:27 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Deeper and deeper We're being dragged deeper and deeper into this whole betta breeding thing! AUGH! I noticed what I thought was one of our female bettas behaving like a male, trying to interest a female, and started studying them closely. Looks like one of the veil-tails that produced this lot of babies was a short tailed betta, rather than a veil-tail. Hmmm. His coloring is a georgeous deep bloodred on the fins, and a rosy blush over his white body, a good conformation on the body, from what my amateur eyes can tell. He has a sister whose body isn't quite as pretty, a few tiny spatters of red, and not as nice a shape, but otherwise the same coloring. So...what is the general concensus on breeding spawn-mates to each other? Is it a bad idea? I love the coloring and thought it would be worth a try if the results won't be too inbred. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15435	From: mike mather	Date: 9/28/2005
Subject: Re: The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, wilderness tank

Thomas, you better join PETA! You obviously are looking at this from a Humanism perspective. I'd be curious to know your stance on abortion and gay rights? Mike --- Thomas Schlemmermeyer <evolthomas@...> wrote: > > Hello, > > I have been just discussing with a friend of mine > who is a bird > enthusiast. She loves bird watching very much, but > each time she goes > to catch birds in nets (sometimes it is necessary > for her science) > her consciousness gets rather heavy, as she does not > feel entitled to > take the freedom away of whatever animal. > > This brings me to the point of discussing the > ethical aspects of our > own hobby: the aquarium. > > My dream would be to work out a sort of poster > presentation which > lists up possible dark sides of our seemingly so > innocent hobby - > innocent just at first sight. Afterwards solutions > or avoidances of > these dark sides might be suggested. > > Let me just list up some points: > > -Many seawater fish species, particularly those that > are found in > coral reefs, are caught with dubious methods, > including poison. > > -pretty many of those coral fish die during > transport, or (if they > survive) won´t get the opportunity to live and to > reproduce in a > habitat which is suitable to their natural niche. > > -Many fish species for instance from the Amazone > region only survive > in their artificial Northern Hemisphere Tank > habitats due to regular > refreshing caughts in wilderness. These excursions > are often not in > compliance with local laws and may affect local > ecosystems. > > -even fish species that are routinely bred in tanks > are vertebrates, > hence phylogenetically alike to us (humans), and > therefore these fish > deserve some protection of their natural animal > rights. > > But is it fair for instance to breed fancy guppies > in small 30 liter- > tanks? Moreover, is it fair to select fish > populations only for fancy > effects? Are fancy guppies really lucky? Aren´t they > deprived of > their natural rights, due to artificial selection? > Shouldn´t > artificial selection be forbidden in that context? > > (OK, I am not against breeding bigger porks, more > milk giving cows or > anything like this, as in this case artificial > selection merely > serves to satisfy our protein needs; but I think it > is highly > questionable to breed for instance glimmering Danio > rerio, or fancy > guppies, as in that case the purpose of man is > neither the > observation of nature (in due awe) nor the struggle > for his own > survival, but what is on stake is falsifying nature > for mere pleasure > purposes?) > > I would like to sum up more of these ethically > critical aspects, and > I would like to know about guideline drafts for free > and ecologically > well sustained aquarium maintainance of fish. > > Where do we find a reasonable compromise between an > unlimited claim > on fish for merely ornamental purposes and a more > reasonable handling > of aquarium fish as interesting study objects which > should only > enhance our awe of nature, and nothing more? > > best wishes, I am waiting for good suggestions, > Thomas > > > > > __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15436	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 9/28/2005
Subject: Re: The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, wilderness tank

why would one ever want to join PETA? _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of mike mather Sent: Wednesday, September 28, 2005 8:14 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, wilderness tank enthusiast Thomas, you better join PETA! You obviously are looking at this from a Humanism perspective. I'd be curious to know your stance on abortion and gay rights? Mike --- Thomas Schlemmermeyer <evolthomas@...> wrote: > > Hello, > > I have been just discussing with a friend of mine > who is a bird > enthusiast. She loves bird watching very much, but > each time she goes > to catch birds in nets (sometimes it is necessary > for her science) > her consciousness gets rather heavy, as she does not > feel entitled to > take the freedom away of whatever animal. > > This brings me to the point of discussing the > ethical aspects of our > own hobby: the aquarium. > > My dream would be to work out a sort of poster > presentation which > lists up possible dark sides of our seemingly so > innocent hobby - > innocent just at first sight. Afterwards solutions > or avoidances of > these dark sides might be suggested. > > Let me just list up some points: > > -Many seawater fish species, particularly those that > are found in > coral reefs, are caught with dubious methods, > including poison. > > -pretty many of those coral fish die during > transport, or (if they > survive) won´t get the opportunity to live and to > reproduce in a > habitat which is suitable to their natural niche. > > -Many fish species for instance from the Amazone > region only survive > in their artificial Northern Hemisphere Tank > habitats due to regular > refreshing caughts in wilderness. These excursions > are often not in > compliance with local laws and may affect local > ecosystems. > > -even fish species that are routinely bred in tanks > are vertebrates, > hence phylogenetically alike to us (humans), and > therefore these fish > deserve some protection of their natural animal > rights. > > But is it fair for instance to breed fancy guppies > in small 30 liter- > tanks? Moreover, is it fair to select fish > populations only for fancy > effects? Are fancy guppies really lucky? Aren´t they > deprived of > their natural rights, due to artificial selection? > Shouldn´t > artificial selection be forbidden in that context? > > (OK, I am not against breeding bigger porks, more > milk giving cows or > anything like this, as in this case artificial > selection merely > serves to satisfy our protein needs; but I think it > is highly > questionable to breed for instance glimmering Danio > rerio, or fancy > guppies, as in that case the purpose of man is > neither the > observation of nature (in due awe) nor the struggle > for his own > survival, but what is on stake is falsifying nature > for mere pleasure > purposes?) > > I would like to sum up more of these ethically > critical aspects, and > I would like to know about guideline drafts for free > and ecologically > well sustained aquarium maintainance of fish. > > Where do we find a reasonable compromise between an > unlimited claim > on fish for merely ornamental purposes and a more > reasonable handling > of aquarium fish as interesting study objects which > should only > enhance our awe of nature, and nothing more? > > best wishes, I am waiting for good suggestions, > Thomas > > > > > __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 http://mail.yahoo.com Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Mar ine+fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=sWozU8RAgM2g66Yb_7h_nQ> biology Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine +fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=JB6FNOraRx3JIvMA1E4-Lw> fish Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine+fis h&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=R-HUKyhqLGfm-ZAFT2vuTQ> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15437	From: Patrick	Date: 9/28/2005
Subject: Re: The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, wilderness tank

This is why we moved this to the debates group. :) But I don't think anyone with a working brain would join that organization. Patrick ----- Original Message ----- why would one ever want to join PETA?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15438	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 9/28/2005
Subject: Re: The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, wilderness tank

what debates group? _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Patrick Sent: Wednesday, September 28, 2005 10:17 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, wilderness tank enthusiast This is why we moved this to the debates group. :) But I don't think anyone with a working brain would join that organization. Patrick ----- Original Message ----- why would one ever want to join PETA? Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Mar ine+fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=sWozU8RAgM2g66Yb_7h_nQ> biology Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine +fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=JB6FNOraRx3JIvMA1E4-Lw> fish Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine+fis h&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=R-HUKyhqLGfm-ZAFT2vuTQ> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15439	From: Patrick	Date: 9/28/2005
Subject: Re: The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, wilderness tank

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/aquariumdebates Patrick ----- Original Message ----- what debates group?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15440	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 9/28/2005
Subject: Re: The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, wilderness tank

thanks! _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Patrick Sent: Wednesday, September 28, 2005 10:26 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, wilderness tank enthusiast http://groups.yahoo.com/group/aquariumdebates Patrick ----- Original Message ----- what debates group? Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Mar ine+fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=sWozU8RAgM2g66Yb_7h_nQ> biology Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine +fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=JB6FNOraRx3JIvMA1E4-Lw> fish Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine+fis h&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=R-HUKyhqLGfm-ZAFT2vuTQ> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15441	From: Ted Angelo	Date: 9/29/2005
Subject: geophagus surinamensis

can anyone tell me how big this fish would be before it breeds and how to induce it to breed? thanks!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15442	From: Ted Angelo	Date: 9/29/2005
Subject: geop

can anyone tell me how big this fish would be before it breeds and how to induce it to breed? thanks!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15443	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 9/29/2005
Subject: Re: geophagus surinamensis

http://www.fishbase.org/Summary/SpeciesSummary.php?id=4781 www.wetpetz.com/surinamensis.htm Just a couple sites rergarding the fish.... have fun Try typing it in at google or yahoo.... Kris Ted Angelo <mustard_5@...> wrote: can anyone tell me how big this fish would be before it breeds and how to induce it to breed? thanks! Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! for Good Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15444	From: Sue Boswell	Date: 9/29/2005
Subject: Re: geophagus surinamensis

They can breed from about 3" & IME stopping them breeding is the difficult bit. They do like a choice of spawning sites & consistent light cycles. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ted Angelo" <mustard_5@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Thursday, September 29, 2005 11:10 AM Subject: [AquaticLife] geophagus surinamensis can anyone tell me how big this fish would be before it breeds and how to induce it to breed? thanks!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15445	From: Chris	Date: 9/29/2005
Subject: help finding a hood?

I have a 20 gallon hex tank that I got from a friend, but it doesn't have a hood or a light. I've been looking all over and they seem to be very hard to find. I was in Petco today and they do have a light fixture that would fit, but no glass hood for it to sit on. My tank is 14" from side to side, or 16" from corner to corner. Anybody know where I could find a glass top for it without spending a fortune? Thanks, Chris

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15446	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 9/29/2005
Subject: disappearing fish

I keep having female guppies disappear. The tank has guppies, platys, mollies, corries, and golden mystery (apple) snails. I have the holes covered so they could not jump out, even so I have still checked the floor looking for them. I am just wondering if maybe they have died and the snails maybe took care of the body? MM & MP, '73 Tricia, KG6PNC A couple of great sites for fun http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15447	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 9/29/2005
Subject: Re: help finding a hood?

Check Marineland and All-Glass Aquariums. I think both make glass tops. Marine land may have a Eclipse hood for Hex tanks. Other than that, you could also make one yourself. I built a hood got my 55 gallon tank for about $50 in materials. The main reason I made it is that I am putting in some custom lighting when I could afford it. I designed after a custom hood I saw in a store, with some modifications. The one in the store was $110. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Chris Sent: Thursday, September 29, 2005 2:00 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] help finding a hood? I have a 20 gallon hex tank that I got from a friend, but it doesn't have a hood or a light. I've been looking all over and they seem to be very hard to find. I was in Petco today and they do have a light fixture that would fit, but no glass hood for it to sit on. My tank is 14" from side to side, or 16" from corner to corner. Anybody know where I could find a glass top for it without spending a fortune? Thanks, Chris Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Mar ine+fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=sWozU8RAgM2g66Yb_7h_nQ> biology Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine +fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=JB6FNOraRx3JIvMA1E4-Lw> fish Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine+fis h&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=R-HUKyhqLGfm-ZAFT2vuTQ> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15448	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 9/29/2005
Subject: Re: disappearing fish

That sounds like a good cause to me. The other fish are not aggressive enough to have munched on them alive. Not sure about the eating habits of the platy's or mollies, but the corycats are bottom feeders, so if there was a dead fish, they would eat them as well as would the snail. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Tricia Wilkerson Sent: Thursday, September 29, 2005 2:51 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] disappearing fish I keep having female guppies disappear. The tank has guppies, platys, mollies, corries, and golden mystery (apple) snails. I have the holes covered so they could not jump out, even so I have still checked the floor looking for them. I am just wondering if maybe they have died and the snails maybe took care of the body? MM & MP, '73 Tricia, KG6PNC A couple of great sites for fun http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> Get fast access to your favorite Yahoo! Groups. Make Yahoo! your home page http://us.click.yahoo.com/dpRU5A/wUILAA/yQLSAA/ANOolB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15449	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 9/29/2005
Subject: Re: disappearing fish

If you have a lot of males and few females, the males can harrass the females to death, and yes, the snails make short work of fish bodies.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15450	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 9/29/2005
Subject: Re: help finding a hood?

Chris, your local home depot or lowes should have acrylic which would work, and would be easy to cut to fit with a jigsaw, or circular saw...whatever. You can get them in several thicknesses and cut exactly to fit > Anybody know where I could find a glass top for it without spending a > fortune? > > Thanks, > Chris

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15451	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 9/29/2005
Subject: Re: help finding a hood?

acrylic is expensive for the thickness needed for a tank lid.... just remember that when looking. cynthia brennemann <brennewoman@...> wrote:Chris, your local home depot or lowes should have acrylic which would work, and would be easy to cut to fit with a jigsaw, or circular saw...whatever. You can get them in several thicknesses and cut exactly to fit > Anybody know where I could find a glass top for it without spending a > fortune? > > Thanks, > Chris Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! for Good Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15452	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 9/29/2005
Subject: Re: help finding a hood?

It can be, but some stores have scrap acrylic peices at a very reasonable rate you can go through. You wouldn't need a single peice, two would be fine so you could hinge it. > acrylic is expensive for the thickness needed for a tank lid.... just remember that when looking. >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15453	From: mike mather	Date: 9/29/2005
Subject: Re: The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, wilderness tank

Eric, Any normal, right minded person wouldn't! Thomas is not one of those people, which makes him a perfect candidate as a lifetime PETA member. Mike --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > why would one ever want to join PETA? > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of mike mather > Sent: Wednesday, September 28, 2005 8:14 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] The ecological, > libertarian, civil desobedient, > wilderness tank enthusiast > > > Thomas, you better join PETA! You obviously are > looking at this from a Humanism perspective. I'd be > curious to know your stance on abortion and gay > rights? > Mike > > __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15454	From: Chris	Date: 9/29/2005
Subject: Re: The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, wilderness tank

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "cynthia brennemann" <brennewoman@h...> wrote: > let's be realistic. Whatever cruelty you > see inflicted on animals by humans, I garauntee Mother nature also > does, only more ruthlessly. did someone say ... "more humanely"? ;) Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15455	From: Chris	Date: 9/29/2005
Subject: Re: I got a new fish!

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Sue Boswell" <feathers@s...> wrote: > The snowflake eel isn't a freshwater species Great! someone bringing this back on-topic! I can't believe the discussion went so long without raising this point... when I read the initial post I thought "wow! a freshwater morey!! I've never heard of that!!" (and "where can I get one?").... but alas, too good to be true... Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15456	From: Chris	Date: 9/29/2005
Subject: Re: geophagus surinamensis

ahhh... this really is an unsung jewel of the Amazon. A close comrade would be the G. braziliensis (sp?) also - but for some reason the surinamensis gets me every time :D I've never kept one but always wanted to; as per the other reply, 3" sounds about right and I'd say they can grow to about 8" - 10".

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15457	From: paul helms	Date: 9/29/2005
Subject: Re: I got a new fish!

there are freshwater morays, just not the snowflake --- Chris <youcantryreachingme@...> wrote: > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Sue Boswell" > <feathers@s...> > wrote: > > The snowflake eel isn't a freshwater species > > Great! someone bringing this back on-topic! I can't > believe the > discussion went so long without raising this > point... when I read the > initial post I thought "wow! a freshwater morey!! > I've never heard of > that!!" (and "where can I get one?").... > > but alas, too good to be true... > > Chris. > > > > __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15458	From: Christopher Mansfield	Date: 9/30/2005
Subject: Re: help finding a hood?

On 9/29/05, cynthia brennemann <brennewoman@...> wrote: > > Chris, your local home depot or lowes should have acrylic which would > work, and would be easy to cut to fit with a jigsaw, or circular > saw...whatever. You can get them in several thicknesses and cut > exactly to fit > > Thanks for the awesome tip! I went to Home Depot tonight, not having a clue where to find acrylic... but I did find it. they had it in various sizes and thicknesses. I picked out a nice thick piece that was probably twice the size I needed, and it was only $5. It feels pretty strong so I'm not worried about it being able to support the light fixture. Right next to the acrylic, they had little exacto knives for sale for cutting it. I brought it home and found it is very easy to work with. It took a bit to get the hang of it... I found a spare shelf that came off of my entertainment center... put the shelf along the line I wanted to cut and then sat on the shelf to hold it in place :) You just have to score through the acrylic a few times and then it breaks off with a nice clean edge. Probably took about 1/2 hour altogether. Now I have a top that looks as good as anything I'd expect to find at a store. I cut a separate piece and attached it with duct tape to make a little lid that can open for feeding, etc. And then I took a barrel from an old pen and taped it on the edge for a handle :) I put a picture of it under Photos, in the Chris M folder in case you'd like to see it. Not being much of an artist or handyman, I'm pretty proud of myself. Chris [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15459	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 9/30/2005
Subject: Re: help finding a hood?

Looks good, Chris! And you can place a light fixture on or over it whenever you can get it :)

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15460	From: Christopher Mansfield	Date: 9/30/2005
Subject: Re: help finding a hood?

I picked up the light fixture this morning. It turns out the thickness of the acrylic isn't really an issue. The light is long enough that it rests on top of the tank, not on the cover. It is so bright & colorful in there now. I don't know how I ever lived without it before! The fish seem to like it too, they seem more active now. On 9/30/05, cynthia brennemann <brennewoman@...> wrote: > > Looks good, Chris! And you can place a light fixture on or over it > whenever you can get it :) > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15461	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 9/30/2005
Subject: Re: help finding a hood?

The only problem with the thickness involves the heat of the fixture.... after a while the acrylic begins to bend and sag where the light is concentrated.... am i the ONLY person with this experience?? Christopher Mansfield <psychedup74@...> wrote:I picked up the light fixture this morning. It turns out the thickness of the acrylic isn't really an issue. The light is long enough that it rests on top of the tank, not on the cover. It is so bright & colorful in there now. I don't know how I ever lived without it before! The fish seem to like it too, they seem more active now. On 9/30/05, cynthia brennemann <brennewoman@...> wrote: > > Looks good, Chris! And you can place a light fixture on or over it > whenever you can get it :) > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! for Good Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15462	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 9/30/2005
Subject: Re: help finding a hood?

Nope, happens to me too. You can try elevating the light or cut out a section of the acrylic where the light shines through. Mike -----Original Message----- From: kristopher helsing <punk3r12@...> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Fri, 30 Sep 2005 13:44:50 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: help finding a hood? The only problem with the thickness involves the heat of the fixture.... after a while the acrylic begins to bend and sag where the light is concentrated.... am i the ONLY person with this experience?? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15463	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 9/30/2005
Subject: Re: help finding a hood?

I haven't noticed this, but then, I use flourescents, which aren't very hot. > The only problem with the thickness involves the heat of the fixture.... after a while the acrylic begins to bend and sag where the light is concentrated.... am i the ONLY person with this experience?? >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15464	From: discusfishies	Date: 9/30/2005
Subject: Bear,DE fish tanks 4 sale

complete set up filters,heater,gravel,air pump 45 gallon $150 6 yrs old and 37 gallon $200 2 yrs old must pick up Laurie

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15465	From: Christopher Mansfield	Date: 9/30/2005
Subject: Re: help finding a hood?

Hmm I'll just keep an eye on it. My light is fluorescent, too, so hopefully it won't be too hot. But if it does sag, I can always spend another $5 to make another cover. Maybe try a thicker acrylic if that happens. On 9/30/05, cynthia brennemann <brennewoman@...> wrote: > I haven't noticed this, but then, I use flourescents, which aren't very > hot. > > > The only problem with the thickness involves the heat of the > fixture.... after a while the acrylic begins to bend and sag where the > light is concentrated.... am i the ONLY person with this experience??

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15466	From: Chalyn Thomas	Date: 9/30/2005
Subject: New Member

Hello, My name is Chalyn and at the moment I have two ciclids, three plecos, a betta and three corey cats (the ciclids and two plecos are in one tank and the betta, pleco and corey cats are in a seperate tank). I will tell you up front my favorite brand of anythign having to do with fish is Marineland. I have had the best success with this brand. I am also wanting to become either a veteranarian or a biologest who studies various animals. Chalyn --------------------------------- Yahoo! for Good Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15467	From: Deirdre Marr	Date: 9/30/2005
Subject: What To Feed Rope Fish?

Hello List, I need help with getting my Rope Fish (Erpetoichthys calabaricus) to eat. I have read about them on the internet and everything says this species is a hearty eater and readily comes out to feed. I have yet to see mine eat after several weeks and I am very worried about him. I have tried BeefHeart, Frozen Mysis shrimp, shimp pellets and silversides. Suggestions please!? Thanks! Deirdre Marr Dallas, TX PS He is kept in a 60 gal. community tank, heavily planted, plenty of hiding places, regular water changes, etc.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15468	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 9/30/2005
Subject: Re: I got a new fish!

Huh? Why can't my snowflake be a freshwater? I am so confused about this eel, lol! This is what I get for buying a fish at Petco where they don't anything about wha they are selling!!! I ahve read everything I can online and I still don't understand. Is it a freshwater fish or a brackish fish or a fresh-to-brackish-to-slatwater?!?!? FYI, he's doing good so far, we keep our tank brackish for the gars. He's not eating though, but that's probably because the girl at Petco said he eats bloodworms so that's what I bought but everything online says crustacians of some sort. So today I got him some shrip from the grocery store. I plan to put them in just before I turn off the light. Hope he eats them!!! Sarah paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: there are freshwater morays, just not the snowflake --- Chris <youcantryreachingme@...> wrote: > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Sue Boswell" > <feathers@s...> > wrote: > > The snowflake eel isn't a freshwater species > > Great! someone bringing this back on-topic! I can't > believe the > discussion went so long without raising this > point... when I read the > initial post I thought "wow! a freshwater morey!! > I've never heard of > that!!" (and "where can I get one?").... > > but alas, too good to be true... > > Chris. > > > > __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 http://mail.yahoo.com Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! for Good Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15469	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 9/30/2005
Subject: Re: What To Feed Rope Fish?

Tried any live foods? Can they eat small feeder guppies? I avoid live feeders to try and prevent illness but if it isn't eating? In a message dated 9/30/2005 9:45:18 PM Pacific Daylight Time, dastx@... writes: Hello List, I need help with getting my Rope Fish (Erpetoichthys calabaricus) to eat. I have read about them on the internet and everything says this species is a hearty eater and readily comes out to feed. I have yet to see mine eat after several weeks and I am very worried about him. I have tried BeefHeart, Frozen Mysis shrimp, shimp pellets and silversides. Suggestions please!? Thanks! Deirdre Marr Dallas, TX [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15470	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 9/30/2005
Subject: Re: What To Feed Rope Fish?

I would use something living...get some small feeder guppies or something like that. The movement usually entices them to eat. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Deirdre Marr Sent: Friday, September 30, 2005 11:45 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] What To Feed Rope Fish? Hello List, I need help with getting my Rope Fish (Erpetoichthys calabaricus) to eat. I have read about them on the internet and everything says this species is a hearty eater and readily comes out to feed. I have yet to see mine eat after several weeks and I am very worried about him. I have tried BeefHeart, Frozen Mysis shrimp, shimp pellets and silversides. Suggestions please!? Thanks! Deirdre Marr Dallas, TX PS He is kept in a 60 gal. community tank, heavily planted, plenty of hiding places, regular water changes, etc. Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Mar ine+fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=sWozU8RAgM2g66Yb_7h_nQ> biology Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine +fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=JB6FNOraRx3JIvMA1E4-Lw> fish Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine+fis h&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=R-HUKyhqLGfm-ZAFT2vuTQ> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15471	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 9/30/2005
Subject: Re: I got a new fish!

Hi Sarah, The Snowflake eel is a Moray eel, and is a salt water fish, having said that it is possible to keep them in your "freshwater" aquarium provided that the water is slightly brackish. They run up rivers to spawn, so they spend some time in freshwater and are often caught in rivers that run into the sea, this might be why so many people call them a freshwater fish!, as for eating they eat mainly meaty foods alive or dead, they are naturally a nocturnal fish so it could be eating while you are sleeping, also they are known to go lengthy periods without eating. the main thing about them is they are "Hudinies" they will escape from any tank that is not completely covered and can live out of water for 3 or 4 hours and travel long distances, also they can grow quite large up to about 3 feet (80cm). regards, unclenorm. --- Sarah Fleming Davis <keelis_mom@...> wrote: > Huh? Why can't my snowflake be a freshwater? I am > so confused about this eel, lol! This is what I get > for buying a fish at Petco where they don't anything > about wha they are selling!!! > I ahve read everything I can online and I still > don't understand. Is it a freshwater fish or a > brackish fish or a > fresh-to-brackish-to-slatwater?!?!? > FYI, he's doing good so far, we keep our tank > brackish for the gars. He's not eating though, but > that's probably because the girl at Petco said he > eats bloodworms so that's what I bought but > everything online says crustacians of some sort. So > today I got him some shrip from the grocery store. > I plan to put them in just before I turn off the > light. Hope he eats them!!! > > Sarah > > > paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > there are freshwater morays, just not the snowflake > > > --- Chris <youcantryreachingme@...> wrote: > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Sue Boswell" > > <feathers@s...> > > wrote: > > > The snowflake eel isn't a freshwater species > > > > Great! someone bringing this back on-topic! I > can't > > believe the > > discussion went so long without raising this > > point... when I read the > > initial post I thought "wow! a freshwater morey!! > > I've never heard of > > that!!" (and "where can I get one?").... > > > > but alas, too good to be true... > > > > Chris. > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when > replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the > TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine biology Marine fish Biology > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email > to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! for Good > Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina > relief effort. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > ___________________________________________________________ To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. http://uk.security.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15472	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 9/30/2005
Subject: Re: What To Feed Rope Fish?

i suggest ghost shrimp nand feeder guppies and when the light goes out i bet from day to day you notice less and less feeders... just a guess ut thats what i had to do with my bichirs... have fun~!!! Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: I would use something living...get some small feeder guppies or something like that. The movement usually entices them to eat. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Deirdre Marr Sent: Friday, September 30, 2005 11:45 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] What To Feed Rope Fish? Hello List, I need help with getting my Rope Fish (Erpetoichthys calabaricus) to eat. I have read about them on the internet and everything says this species is a hearty eater and readily comes out to feed. I have yet to see mine eat after several weeks and I am very worried about him. I have tried BeefHeart, Frozen Mysis shrimp, shimp pellets and silversides. Suggestions please!? Thanks! Deirdre Marr Dallas, TX PS He is kept in a 60 gal. community tank, heavily planted, plenty of hiding places, regular water changes, etc. Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Mar ine+fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=sWozU8RAgM2g66Yb_7h_nQ> biology Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine +fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=JB6FNOraRx3JIvMA1E4-Lw> fish Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine+fis h&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=R-HUKyhqLGfm-ZAFT2vuTQ> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! for Good Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15473	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 9/30/2005
Subject: Re: help finding a hood?

You could also raise the light a little bit to allow for some air flow and put in a fan to keep the acrylic cool. PC fans work great. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Deenerz@... Sent: Friday, September 30, 2005 5:17 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: help finding a hood? Nope, happens to me too. You can try elevating the light or cut out a section of the acrylic where the light shines through. Mike -----Original Message----- From: kristopher helsing <punk3r12@...> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Fri, 30 Sep 2005 13:44:50 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: help finding a hood? The only problem with the thickness involves the heat of the fixture.... after a while the acrylic begins to bend and sag where the light is concentrated.... am i the ONLY person with this experience?? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Mar ine+fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=sWozU8RAgM2g66Yb_7h_nQ> biology Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine +fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=JB6FNOraRx3JIvMA1E4-Lw> fish Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine+fis h&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=R-HUKyhqLGfm-ZAFT2vuTQ> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15474	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 9/30/2005
Subject: Re: What To Feed Rope Fish?

yeah...predatory fish love ghosties...they go fast in my tanks too. I got some feeder guppies and they are reproducing, so if I do it right, they may provide a self sustaining live food supply :-D Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of kristopher helsing Sent: Saturday, October 01, 2005 1:13 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] What To Feed Rope Fish? i suggest ghost shrimp nand feeder guppies and when the light goes out i bet from day to day you notice less and less feeders... just a guess ut thats what i had to do with my bichirs... have fun~!!! Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: I would use something living...get some small feeder guppies or something like that. The movement usually entices them to eat. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Deirdre Marr Sent: Friday, September 30, 2005 11:45 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] What To Feed Rope Fish? Hello List, I need help with getting my Rope Fish (Erpetoichthys calabaricus) to eat. I have read about them on the internet and everything says this species is a hearty eater and readily comes out to feed. I have yet to see mine eat after several weeks and I am very worried about him. I have tried BeefHeart, Frozen Mysis shrimp, shimp pellets and silversides. Suggestions please!? Thanks! Deirdre Marr Dallas, TX PS He is kept in a 60 gal. community tank, heavily planted, plenty of hiding places, regular water changes, etc. Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Mar > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Mar ine+fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=sWozU8RAgM2g66Yb_7h_nQ> biology Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine > &k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine +fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=JB6FNOraRx3JIvMA1E4-Lw> fish Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine+fis > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine+fis h&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=R-HUKyhqLGfm-ZAFT2vuTQ> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! for Good Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Mar ine+fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=sWozU8RAgM2g66Yb_7h_nQ> biology Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine +fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=JB6FNOraRx3JIvMA1E4-Lw> fish Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine+fis h&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=R-HUKyhqLGfm-ZAFT2vuTQ> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15475	From: Ann	Date: 10/1/2005
Subject: Re: What To Feed Rope Fish?

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Deirdre Marr" <dastx@s...> wrote: > Hello List, > > I need help with getting my Rope Fish (Erpetoichthys calabaricus) to eat. Try frozen bloodworms (thawed of course) just before lights out.Ropefish like many bichirs can be shy and take a few days to settle in.One other thing I advise you to know ropefish are escape artists any opening must be covered or it crawlout of the tank-Anne

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15476	From: paul helms	Date: 10/1/2005
Subject: Re: I got a new fish!

the snowflake is a salt water fish through and through. it can be extremely slowly acclimated to freshwater, but its longevity will be lessened. bloodworms are ridiculous for a moray. they do not have asmall mouth like a tiretrack or fire eel, and prefer larger foods. most ppl use silversides which can be bought frozen and thawed as needed. babies are very small and adults are about 3 inches (silversides). krill, feeder goldfish, and the like can also be used. eels are nearly blind, but can see movement. live foods will e difficult for them to catch. feedng prongs are a great idea. be very careful, the moray has rows over serated teeth in the roof of its mouth, and should it bite you, you would have to put your finger father down the throat to egt of the teeth, much like a chinese finger trap. --- Sarah Fleming Davis <keelis_mom@...> wrote: > Huh? Why can't my snowflake be a freshwater? I am > so confused about this eel, lol! This is what I get > for buying a fish at Petco where they don't anything > about wha they are selling!!! > I ahve read everything I can online and I still > don't understand. Is it a freshwater fish or a > brackish fish or a > fresh-to-brackish-to-slatwater?!?!? > FYI, he's doing good so far, we keep our tank > brackish for the gars. He's not eating though, but > that's probably because the girl at Petco said he > eats bloodworms so that's what I bought but > everything online says crustacians of some sort. So > today I got him some shrip from the grocery store. > I plan to put them in just before I turn off the > light. Hope he eats them!!! > > Sarah > > > paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > there are freshwater morays, just not the snowflake > > > --- Chris <youcantryreachingme@...> wrote: > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Sue Boswell" > > <feathers@s...> > > wrote: > > > The snowflake eel isn't a freshwater species > > > > Great! someone bringing this back on-topic! I > can't > > believe the > > discussion went so long without raising this > > point... when I read the > > initial post I thought "wow! a freshwater morey!! > > I've never heard of > > that!!" (and "where can I get one?").... > > > > but alas, too good to be true... > > > > Chris. > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when > replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the > TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine biology Marine fish Biology > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email > to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! for Good > Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina > relief effort. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15477	From: paul helms	Date: 10/1/2005
Subject: Re: help finding a hood?

or just have a glass lid made at a glass shop. it is very cheap. about 25 bucks for a 55 gallon --- Deenerz@... wrote: > Nope, happens to me too. You can try elevating the > light or cut out a section of the acrylic where the > light shines through. > > Mike > > -----Original Message----- > From: kristopher helsing <punk3r12@...> > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Fri, 30 Sep 2005 13:44:50 -0700 (PDT) > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: help finding a hood? > > > The only problem with the thickness involves the > heat of the fixture.... after a > while the acrylic begins to bend and sag where the > light is concentrated.... am > i the ONLY person with this experience?? > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15478	From: hadesidhe	Date: 10/1/2005
Subject: Questions about Ich

First off, can it be transferred to humans? I've read some documentation about aeration causing bacteria or parasite transfer to some humans via their fish tank. Second, is there any danger using the salt method and the medication method AT THE SAME TIME? Last, how long before Ich starts to kill my fish? I've no idea how it got in my tank. Damn petsmart...

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15479	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 10/1/2005
Subject: Re: Deeper and deeper

Inbreeding is quite common among fish, especially when trying to establish a line that carries a particular trait. Once you have established the trait you are looking for, then you would bring in other fish to shore up any weak points. For example, you are looking at a color pattern. Once you establish a color pattern that seems to breed true, you notice that the tail could use more robustness, so you bring in fish that have the tail structure you want and integrate them into your breeding program to strengthen the tail. This may disrupt your color pattern, so you would then dispose of those fish that do not match the color requirement, as well as those that do not show improvement in the tail region. This takes a lot of generations of fish, and a lot of fish, with many more sold off, given away, made into cichlid food, or what ever. And, even then, you may finally end up with the fish you want, but only 25% of the fish you spawn from a line might equal the traits you are breeding for. It can be quite a challenge, but if you succeed, you'll have a feeling like no other, and that is what makes it worthwhile. That and the knowledge that somewhere down the road, someone will be giving a betta talk, and show a slide of your fish and mention that it was developed by Cynthia Brennemann. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of cynthia brennemann Sent: Wednesday, September 28, 2005 8:27 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Deeper and deeper We're being dragged deeper and deeper into this whole betta breeding thing! AUGH! I noticed what I thought was one of our female bettas behaving like a male, trying to interest a female, and started studying them closely. Looks like one of the veil-tails that produced this lot of babies was a short tailed betta, rather than a veil-tail. Hmmm. His coloring is a georgeous deep bloodred on the fins, and a rosy blush over his white body, a good conformation on the body, from what my amateur eyes can tell. He has a sister whose body isn't quite as pretty, a few tiny spatters of red, and not as nice a shape, but otherwise the same coloring. So...what is the general concensus on breeding spawn-mates to each other? Is it a bad idea? I love the coloring and thought it would be worth a try if the results won't be too inbred. Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15480	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 10/1/2005
Subject: Re: Questions about Ich

I haven't heard of that, but mold forming in your tanks can adversely effect you if you are an asthmatic or have some other lung disease. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of hadesidhe Sent: Saturday, October 01, 2005 5:49 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Questions about Ich First off, can it be transferred to humans? I've read some documentation about aeration causing bacteria or parasite transfer to some humans via their fish tank. Second, is there any danger using the salt method and the medication method AT THE SAME TIME? Last, how long before Ich starts to kill my fish? I've no idea how it got in my tank. Damn petsmart... Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Mar ine+fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=sWozU8RAgM2g66Yb_7h_nQ> biology Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine +fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=JB6FNOraRx3JIvMA1E4-Lw> fish Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine+fis h&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=R-HUKyhqLGfm-ZAFT2vuTQ> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15481	From: Patrick	Date: 10/1/2005
Subject: Re: Questions about Ich

Ich is not a danger to fish or humans. What? Not a danger to fish? Did I just say that? What a stupid comment. I stand by it, but it is hard to believe...Next thing you know, I'll say something like it is present in all tanks at most times, or that meds are the worst thing you can do to them. Seriously, ich isn't that dangerous to fish. The danger is that you start medicating and salting and completely ignore the problem. Ich is a non-lethal symptom to a deadly problem. The fish is stressed by something. It could be a move to a new tank, being chased by a mean fish, or high ammonia or nitrite levels. Figure out which one or ones of those the problem is. Not much can be done for a recent move. A mean fish will need to be removed. High ammonia/nitrite levels need a water change. Whatever the problems is, turn the heat up to 86°F for a few days. Temps above 86° will kill the parasites, but if you don't fix what caused the fish to be susceptible to ich will kill the fish anyway. Patrick http://groups.yahoo.com/group/aquariumdebates ----- Original Message ----- First off, can it be transferred to humans? I've read some documentation about aeration causing bacteria or parasite transfer to some humans via their fish tank. Second, is there any danger using the salt method and the medication method AT THE SAME TIME? Last, how long before Ich starts to kill my fish? I've no idea how it got in my tank. Damn petsmart...

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15482	From: KttmfC	Date: 10/1/2005
Subject: Shovelnose catfish

Ok has anyone had experience with these fish? i know here is a tiger or lima but are there other kinds as well? im having ahard time figuring out what type min is because its only about 6 inches right now but it has traits from both types ive seen in pix, lamost same body lines as a lima but some blotching and up and down marks which look like almosrt a tiger pattern. Can anyone help... thanks!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15483	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 10/2/2005
Subject: Re: Deeper and deeper

Thank you Steve...that's a relief. I was having visions of buck- toothed fish in overalls. LOL

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15484	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 10/2/2005
Subject: Re: Shovelnose catfish

The only thing I know about them is that they get huge...they have one at the Shedd Aquarium in Chicago in their Amazon exhibit that was about 3 ft long. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of KttmfC Sent: Sunday, October 02, 2005 12:37 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Shovelnose catfish Ok has anyone had experience with these fish? i know here is a tiger or lima but are there other kinds as well? im having ahard time figuring out what type min is because its only about 6 inches right now but it has traits from both types ive seen in pix, lamost same body lines as a lima but some blotching and up and down marks which look like almosrt a tiger pattern. Can anyone help... thanks! Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15485	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 10/2/2005
Subject: gone for a month

All, I will be gone for a month as I am visiting South Africa :-) Nim [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15486	From: cynjul	Date: 10/2/2005
Subject: WAHH, I killed my pregnant Molly

I had a very pregnant Molly who was just hanging at the bottom of my 50 gallon tank. I went to the store, was recommended this contraption where the mother is on the top, and the babies should go to the bottom. Well, I moved her and she died within five minutes. I feel horrible, lost all the babies and the mommy. I was only trying to save the babies, we've had many, but most get eaten by others Cynthia

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15487	From: cynjul	Date: 10/2/2005
Subject: there was an actual question

So, I have a few other Mollies, and they will have babies. I bought and set up a 1 gallon tank (for the babies, I find the nets really small). How do I go about protecting them without killing the mother? I feel horrible as it is and don't want to go through this again Cynthia (the murderer) :(

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15488	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 10/2/2005
Subject: Re: gone for a month

enjoy! _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Nimish Mathur Sent: Sunday, October 02, 2005 3:46 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] gone for a month All, I will be gone for a month as I am visiting South Africa :-) Nim [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Mar ine+fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=sWozU8RAgM2g66Yb_7h_nQ> biology Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine +fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=JB6FNOraRx3JIvMA1E4-Lw> fish Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine+fis h&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=R-HUKyhqLGfm-ZAFT2vuTQ> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15489	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 10/2/2005
Subject: Re: there was an actual question

Moving a pregnant female can cause problems due to the stress. I find I do better to just provide plenty of hiding places -- plants, especially. If I think I need more hiding places, I grab a few cheap bunches of anacharis, water sprite or other frilly or full plants and pop them in. I don't breed in any sort of organized way, just allow my fish including my mollies to do what comes naturally. The more hiding places you provide, the more the strongest, smartest and luckiest survive. =) Vicky Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Call (301) 402-8625 or write: hgparker@... =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: FCR-Cancer-Support@yahoogroups.com Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@... 919-513-1467, Dr London @ calondon@... 530-754-5711 _AND_ Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15490	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 10/2/2005
Subject: Re: Questions about Ich

Ich is not transferred to humans. There is a certain bacterial based disease which is, but I have forgotten what it is called and caused by off the top of my head. Best cure for ich is the raising of the temperature of your water to the upper 80's and the addition of a small amount of salt. The main ingredient of most ich medications is salt, so save your money for something worthwhile. Ich should not kill your fish. If it does, it is because your fish was already in a weakened state prior to the development of ich. While I'll not go so far as Patrick does in saying it is not harmful, it should not cause death. Your last statement, "I've no idea how it got in my tank. Damn petsmart..." is rather telling. I take it to mean you got some new fish and added them straight to your tank without a quarantine period other than the trip home from the store. One should always quarantine new fish for a minimum of three weeks to ensure that they do not have a disease they will be introducing to your tank. I am willing to bet that it was the new fish that first showed signs of ich, with others succumbing to it later. Ich will always show up on the weakest fish first, those with a compromised immune system. The most common way to compromise the immune system is through stress, and those new fish have had more than their share of it. Ich seems to be present in almost every tank, yet it does not get out of hand with healthy fish. Healthy fish are produced with good management practices, proper maintenance of your tank to keep the nitrogen cycle going, proper temperature maintenance, proper stocking of the tank--not overstocking or mixing of incompatible fish, water changes, and so on. Now that the parasite has become visible, do the right thing in curing it, then make a resolution to follow proper techniques to prevent it from happening again. \\Steve// \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of hadesidhe Sent: Saturday, October 01, 2005 6:49 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Questions about Ich First off, can it be transferred to humans? I've read some documentation about aeration causing bacteria or parasite transfer to some humans via their fish tank. Second, is there any danger using the salt method and the medication method AT THE SAME TIME? Last, how long before Ich starts to kill my fish? I've no idea how it got in my tank. Damn petsmart...

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15491	From: cynjul	Date: 10/2/2005
Subject: Okay okay, some are moving

So, some of the babies are moving, not well, but moving. They are tiny, have tails and a small bulge where I assume the belly should be. Is there any chance they will live? Is there anything I can do to save them???????? I HOPE SO Cynthia

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15492	From: Fred and Cynthia	Date: 10/3/2005
Subject: Vicky - response

Thanks! Well, some of the babies are alive, but I have no idea if they will live. I hope so. I usually let nature do it's thing and save any I can, but this time I wanted to save them all because of the color of the mother. Sigh, dumb dumb. As for those plants, I may look them up online - the fish store here isn't that great........ Cynthia http://babyitems.myphotoalbum.com/view_photo.php?set_albumName=album01&id=bag ----- Original Message ----- From: seleya8@... To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, October 02, 2005 9:17 PM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] there was an actual question Moving a pregnant female can cause problems due to the stress. I find I do better to just provide plenty of hiding places -- plants, especially. If I think I need more hiding places, I grab a few cheap bunches of anacharis, water sprite or other frilly or full plants and pop them in. I don't breed in any sort of organized way, just allow my fish including my mollies to do what comes naturally. The more hiding places you provide, the more the strongest, smartest and luckiest survive. =) Vicky Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Call (301) 402-8625 or write: hgparker@... =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: FCR-Cancer-Support@yahoogroups.com Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@... 919-513-1467, Dr London @ calondon@... 530-754-5711 _AND_ Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15493	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 10/3/2005
Subject: Re: Vicky - response

In a message dated 10/3/2005 9:23:39 AM Eastern Standard Time, fcouellet@... writes: <<<Thanks! Well, some of the babies are alive, but I have no idea if they will live. I hope so. I usually let nature do it's thing and save any I can, but this time I wanted to save them all because of the color of the mother. Sigh, dumb dumb. As for those plants, I may look them up online - the fish store here isn't that great........>>> What other fish are in your tank and how big is it? Any chance you could set up a small tank to net some babies into after they're born to grow out? I find, once they reach that critical 'big enough to not fit in mum's mouth' size, they usually reach maturity. Too many survivors and you're tank shopping -- which isn't a bad thing! ;-) I get anacharis bundles at the chain stores if necessary. They usually charge 1.89 - 1.99 a bundle of six stalks. PetSmart/Co both tend to get those in. They also all seem to carry hornwort (which can be disastrously messy if your tank won't support it), frill, wisteria and a couple other full plants. (many of which aren't truly aquatic or suitable for most aquariums imo) I'm not advocating going there, just pointing out that they are an option. Any half decent lfs should have something to try. When I've had specific things I wanted to accomplish short term and didn't care which plants I got since they're not so much part of an aquascaping plan and more a matter of expediency (temporarily break up sight lines, protect fry...), I've gone into my lfs and told them what I need and let them choose my plants without too many problems. I still haven't identified my "sight line" plants (not that I've tried much) -- I asked for something cheap to break up sight lines in a tall tank and got what looks like java fern on steroids. The fish guys, who usually are incredibly tough to stump, didn't know what they were either -- a customer had unloaded a ton of it on them when he got overrun. They gave me a *huge* bundle of these plants for less than $5. I still have them camping out in a different tank now that they have served their purpose. Good luck with your fry! Vicky Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Call (301) 402-8625 or write: hgparker@... =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: FCR-Cancer-Support@yahoogroups.com Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@... 919-513-1467, Dr London @ calondon@... 530-754-5711 _AND_ Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15494	From: fcouellet@sympatico.ca	Date: 10/3/2005
Subject: Re: Vicky - response

> Right now the babies are in a plastic thingy, in a 50 gallon tank. I have a one gallon set up and will move them once I figure out how many are actually alive. This morning when I got up, there were double the amount that are moving around. I still feel awful for killing the mommy..... I plan on making a large net thingy, and will move the mommy into it earlier next time Cynthia > From: seleya8@... > Date: 2005/10/03 Mon AM 11:12:12 EST > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Vicky - response > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15495	From: andrew davis	Date: 10/3/2005
Subject: Cabomba aquarium requirments

Well, the two Cabomba's (Caroliniana and the aquatica) tried outside seem to have got going on a warm sunny waterlily pond quite well. With winter approaching, I'd be curious to hear what sort of tips may be useful about growing them indoors, as I'm a bit limited on aquarium keeping (waterlilies are the usual foible) At best I can muster two strip lights just over them, the objective being to Winter indoors a few sprigs out of curiosity, along with some of the multitude of guppies raised in the ponds outdoors Regards, andy adavisus(at)aol.com http://www.members.aol.com/abdavisnc/swglist.html -------------------------------oo-------------------------------

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15496	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 10/3/2005
Subject: Clamped fins

One of my giant danios has been clamping his fins more and more so lately. At first it was just when he was being chased, now it is almost constant accompanied by awkward swimming. His movements are not smooth but jerky and his spine seems to be bent. These are the danios that had redness, possibly septicemia, and are now back in the main tank. Their fins are still reddened but behavior has been normal for some time. Then of course the fin clamping. What is this and should I quarantine the fish? Thanks, leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15497	From: Fred and Cynthia	Date: 10/3/2005
Subject: Re: Clamped fins

Sounds like it........any awkward movement means trouble in my experience.......... Cynthia http://babyitems.myphotoalbum.com/view_photo.php?set_albumName=album01&id=bag ----- Original Message ----- From: Leslie & Dane Moore To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com ; naturalaquariumenthusiast@yahoogroups.com ; uniquaria@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, October 03, 2005 7:27 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] Clamped fins One of my giant danios has been clamping his fins more and more so lately. At first it was just when he was being chased, now it is almost constant accompanied by awkward swimming. His movements are not smooth but jerky and his spine seems to be bent. These are the danios that had redness, possibly septicemia, and are now back in the main tank. Their fins are still reddened but behavior has been normal for some time. Then of course the fin clamping. What is this and should I quarantine the fish? Thanks, leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15498	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 10/3/2005
Subject: Re: Cabomba aquarium requirments

Most people only have experience with cabomba indoors, so you should have no problem growing it. Two light strips will probably be more than sufficient, but you may wish to add some plant fertilizer in with it. Be sure to follow the directions for the fertilizer. Others who have more recent experience can tell you more about using the various kinds. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of andrew davis Sent: Monday, October 03, 2005 5:00 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Cabomba aquarium requirments Well, the two Cabomba's (Caroliniana and the aquatica) tried outside seem to have got going on a warm sunny waterlily pond quite well. With winter approaching, I'd be curious to hear what sort of tips may be useful about growing them indoors, as I'm a bit limited on aquarium keeping (waterlilies are the usual foible) At best I can muster two strip lights just over them, the objective being to Winter indoors a few sprigs out of curiosity, along with some of the multitude of guppies raised in the ponds outdoors Regards, andy adavisus(at)aol.com http://www.members.aol.com/abdavisnc/swglist.html -------------------------------oo-------------------------------

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15499	From: KttmfC	Date: 10/3/2005
Subject: Live rock and cichlids

Im trying to recycle my live rock from the saltwater tank and use it in my freshwater maybe tanganika setup..... any advice?? Ive got the water at a stable unreadable sg with the hydrometer.... is this low enough for tanganika cichlids?? thanks..... Kris

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15500	From: bucks_boogie@webtv.net	Date: 10/4/2005
Subject: Re: Breeder contraptions, GGGGGrrrrrrrrrrrr

All those breeder nets and plastic craptations should be put in the recycle heap. They are so stressful, most of the fish die. Add plants, whether real or fake. Give them someplace for the babies to hide, or add them to a new tank with a used filter (you know what I mean, established with bacteria) with a sponge over the intake or a sponge filter that's been left to run in an established tank. Those freakin' nets and plastic crapomatics just keep the Moms' and babies right next to the lights, stressing the life right out of them. I mean, think about it, buy a new Penguin Mini for $25, an AquaClear sponge with a slit cut into it to cover the intake for $.99, and a 10 gallon new tank for $10, everybody has a spare heater or if not, pick one up for $20 bucks . No light or hood and raise 100 babies to 3/4 of an inch. Sell them to the petstore and get your money back. Then you have nothing but profit or more babies to raise. When you're not worrying about babies, you can keep the filter running without a cartridge on your main tank to keep the bacteria alive. JMHO, but a cheap way to raise babies, I'll be doing the same for my neolamprolongus brevis as soon as they start breeding. Good luck and have lots of fry to share, Rob. "I'm damaged, and I like it. It made me what I am!"

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15501	From: T	Date: 10/4/2005
Subject: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning

I have been on this board for awhile and always forget to ask this question. When it comes to Gravel cleaning.. so many sources say differet thing.. I have a 15 gl tank pretty well stocked... some may say over stocked, but the level are fine and I have never had any serious issues. I do the tpical 25% water change weekly and clean the gravel about once a month... never cleaning the whole thing at oncce. One half one time & the other half the other. Is this correct? also Filter changes... I change the filter as needed about 1 a month.. and rinse it out with the water from the "water change" in between. Is this too often? thx - Terry

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15502	From: Sue Boswell	Date: 10/4/2005
Subject: Re: Breeder contraptions, GGGGGrrrrrrrrrrrr

I agree that breeder traps should be banned but the nets have a use - as a seperator in the event of incompatibility for 12/24 hours until a fish can be rehoused. A 10g is too small to rear a large batch optimally - 20g+ is much better for most species. For N brevis you don't need spare tanks as they are colony breeders & look after their fry. Sue ----- Original Message ----- From: <bucks_boogie@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, October 04, 2005 12:29 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Breeder contraptions, GGGGGrrrrrrrrrrrr All those breeder nets and plastic craptations should be put in the recycle heap. They are so stressful, most of the fish die. Add plants, whether real or fake. Give them someplace for the babies to hide, or add them to a new tank with a used filter (you know what I mean, established with bacteria) with a sponge over the intake or a sponge filter that's been left to run in an established tank. Those freakin' nets and plastic crapomatics just keep the Moms' and babies right next to the lights, stressing the life right out of them. I mean, think about it, buy a new Penguin Mini for $25, an AquaClear sponge with a slit cut into it to cover the intake for $.99, and a 10 gallon new tank for $10, everybody has a spare heater or if not, pick one up for $20 bucks . No light or hood and raise 100 babies to 3/4 of an inch. Sell them to the petstore and get your money back. Then you have nothing but profit or more babies to raise. When you're not worrying about babies, you can keep the filter running without a cartridge on your main tank to keep the bacteria alive. JMHO, but a cheap way to raise babies, I'll be doing the same for my neolamprolongus brevis as soon as they start breeding. Good luck and have lots of fry to share, Rob. "I'm damaged, and I like it. It made me what I am!"

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15503	From: Sue Boswell	Date: 10/4/2005
Subject: Re: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning

I would gravel vac at each water change & not change the filter ( unless using carbon - I keep carbon for removing meds) until it gets beyond rinsing out. I find filter foam lasts about a year. Sue ----- Original Message ----- From: "T" <bigter4@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, October 04, 2005 1:53 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning I have been on this board for awhile and always forget to ask this question. When it comes to Gravel cleaning.. so many sources say differet thing.. I have a 15 gl tank pretty well stocked... some may say over stocked, but the level are fine and I have never had any serious issues. I do the tpical 25% water change weekly and clean the gravel about once a month... never cleaning the whole thing at oncce. One half one time & the other half the other. Is this correct? also Filter changes... I change the filter as needed about 1 a month.. and rinse it out with the water from the "water change" in between. Is this too often? thx - Terry Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15504	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 10/4/2005
Subject: Re: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning

Terry, All what you said works. Just that it holds a tiny bit of risk factor that while cleaning the gravel, the bacteria might die or when changing the filter then tank may have to recycle all over again.. but again, this may not happen ever. Ideally, you should only change the filter media when the existing media has almost died and cannot be reused. 2 reasons: 1: The Bacteria remain intact in the filter giving the tank stability, 2: It saves you money and it is your choice. As with cleaning gravel, if you have been cleaning gravel all along, then I will say that stick to what ever you are doing. What usually happens is, people don’t clean their gravel for months and this makes the gravel a breeding ground for bacteria etc. and suddenly disturbing this, will cause a disturbance in the overall ecosystem. Your gravel has probably not settled but has enough bacteria to keep a cycle alive. Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of T Sent: 04 October 2005 13:54 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning I have been on this board for awhile and always forget to ask this question. When it comes to Gravel cleaning.. so many sources say differet thing.. I have a 15 gl tank pretty well stocked... some may say over stocked, but the level are fine and I have never had any serious issues. I do the tpical 25% water change weekly and clean the gravel about once a month... never cleaning the whole thing at oncce. One half one time & the other half the other. Is this correct? also Filter changes... I change the filter as needed about 1 a month.. and rinse it out with the water from the "water change" in between. Is this too often? thx - Terry Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15505	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 10/4/2005
Subject: Re: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning

well i have a heavily stocked 20 gallon and do about a 40% water change cleaning all the gravel each time i used to do this water change about once a week now since my system seems so stable as it went 2 months this summer without being touched i have backed off to about every nearly 2 weeks... this being only cause i am so busy and i monitor it very well... since what your doing seems to work for you i would keep it up.. everyone does things different finding what works for them... Shannon I have been on this board for awhile and always forget to ask this question. When it comes to Gravel cleaning.. so many sources say differet thing.. I have a 15 gl tank pretty well stocked... some may say over stocked, but the level are fine and I have never had any serious issues. I do the tpical 25% water change weekly and clean the gravel about once a month... never cleaning the whole thing at oncce. One half one time & the other half the other. Is this correct? also Filter changes... I change the filter as needed about 1 a month.. and rinse it out with the water from the "water change" in between. Is this too often? thx - Terry [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15506	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 10/4/2005
Subject: Re: Breeder contraptions, GGGGGrrrrrrrrrrrr

IMO they are not all that bad as they are made to sound like. Yes, they do stress the fish a bit but I think a female guppy is much better off in a breeder then surrounded by 4 males in a community tank who are trying to mate with her at the same time as she is going to deliver. I use breeding traps for various fish including Malawi mouth brooding cichlids (yes the same guppy floating breeding trap). The carrying female goes in the trap a few days before she is about to finally release them and when I see the babies in the morning, I move the mom away. What is wrong with breeding traps is that many people tend to keep a impregnated female livebearer in the trap from the day they think its pregnant. Its all about calculations and if you can calculate an approximate drop time, move her in the trap a couple of days before that and once she has laid, move her back to the main tank. Its like a Hospital ward. N _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Sue Boswell Sent: 04 October 2005 14:01 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: Breeder contraptions, GGGGGrrrrrrrrrrrr I agree that breeder traps should be banned but the nets have a use - as a seperator in the event of incompatibility for 12/24 hours until a fish can be rehoused. A 10g is too small to rear a large batch optimally - 20g+ is much better for most species. For N brevis you don't need spare tanks as they are colony breeders & look after their fry. Sue ----- Original Message ----- From: <bucks_boogie@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, October 04, 2005 12:29 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Breeder contraptions, GGGGGrrrrrrrrrrrr All those breeder nets and plastic craptations should be put in the recycle heap. They are so stressful, most of the fish die. Add plants, whether real or fake. Give them someplace for the babies to hide, or add them to a new tank with a used filter (you know what I mean, established with bacteria) with a sponge over the intake or a sponge filter that's been left to run in an established tank. Those freakin' nets and plastic crapomatics just keep the Moms' and babies right next to the lights, stressing the life right out of them. I mean, think about it, buy a new Penguin Mini for $25, an AquaClear sponge with a slit cut into it to cover the intake for $.99, and a 10 gallon new tank for $10, everybody has a spare heater or if not, pick one up for $20 bucks . No light or hood and raise 100 babies to 3/4 of an inch. Sell them to the petstore and get your money back. Then you have nothing but profit or more babies to raise. When you're not worrying about babies, you can keep the filter running without a cartridge on your main tank to keep the bacteria alive. JMHO, but a cheap way to raise babies, I'll be doing the same for my neolamprolongus brevis as soon as they start breeding. Good luck and have lots of fry to share, Rob. "I'm damaged, and I like it. It made me what I am!" Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15507	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 10/4/2005
Subject: Re: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning

that is so right.. i used to wash out my filter and rarely change it as it is expensive and honestly i just forget.. but the past few times i have replaced it i have got the foggy bacterial bloom for a day or so and then the tank seems to bounce back so i have tried to do less major stuff with the filter and just stick to cleaning how i have always done... Shannon Terry, All what you said works. Just that it holds a tiny bit of risk factor that while cleaning the gravel, the bacteria might die or when changing the filter then tank may have to recycle all over again.. but again, this may not happen ever. Ideally, you should only change the filter media when the existing media has almost died and cannot be reused. 2 reasons: 1: The Bacteria remain intact in the filter giving the tank stability, 2: It saves you money and it is your choice. As with cleaning gravel, if you have been cleaning gravel all along, then I will say that stick to what ever you are doing. What usually happens is, people don’t clean their gravel for months and this makes the gravel a breeding ground for bacteria etc. and suddenly disturbing this, will cause a disturbance in the overall ecosystem. Your gravel has probably not settled but has enough bacteria to keep a cycle alive. Nim [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15508	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 10/4/2005
Subject: Re: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning

I switch hit with tank cleaning. I will do a 20-40%water change, vacuuming the gravel. Then the next week, i change out the filter. I never do them at the same time since we had that mass die off after I did give the tank a thorough clean and water change. :P

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15509	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 10/4/2005
Subject: Re: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning

I usually clean all of my tanks every 2 weeks, vacuuming all of the gravel and doing a 25% water change each time. I usually clean the filters with tab water (using the sprayer to get the gunk off of it, then dipping the filter in the tank a few times to rinse out the chlorinated water before putting it back in the filter unit. This prevents getting chlorinated water on the bio-wheel and damaging the bio-filter. In my opinion, cleaning only half could potentially cause problems because you have fish poop and uneaten food in the gravel for long periods of time. I would do the whole thing. I never heard of only doing 1/2 of it. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of T Sent: Tuesday, October 04, 2005 7:54 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning I have been on this board for awhile and always forget to ask this question. When it comes to Gravel cleaning.. so many sources say differet thing.. I have a 15 gl tank pretty well stocked... some may say over stocked, but the level are fine and I have never had any serious issues. I do the tpical 25% water change weekly and clean the gravel about once a month... never cleaning the whole thing at oncce. One half one time & the other half the other. Is this correct? also Filter changes... I change the filter as needed about 1 a month.. and rinse it out with the water from the "water change" in between. Is this too often? thx - Terry Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15510	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 10/4/2005
Subject: Bettas and PopEye

Are bettas prone to pop-eye? My male betta got it and although he is healed, his eyes are still bulging out. Now my female has one eye out. She is with several other tank mates so I know it isn't water conditions. Also, from what I have read, just one eye usually means an injury of some sort.? But both bettas? Thanks Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15511	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 10/4/2005
Subject: Re: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning

I usually rinse my filters a day or so afterwards since the act of cleaning and adding water kicks up gunk. I wait to let it get sucked up by the filter. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of cynthia brennemann Sent: Tuesday, October 04, 2005 11:55 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning I switch hit with tank cleaning. I will do a 20-40%water change, vacuuming the gravel. Then the next week, i change out the filter. I never do them at the same time since we had that mass die off after I did give the tank a thorough clean and water change. :P Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Mar ine+fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=sWozU8RAgM2g66Yb_7h_nQ> biology Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine +fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=JB6FNOraRx3JIvMA1E4-Lw> fish Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine+fis h&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=R-HUKyhqLGfm-ZAFT2vuTQ> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15512	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 10/4/2005
Subject: Re: I got a new fish!

Thanks for the info Unclenorm :) The tank is brackish and we have a couple other escape artist so it's good and sealed up! :) He's still not eating though, as far as we can tell. I bought some raw shrimp and he doesn't seem to like it so I'll try some live ghost shrimp. Sarah "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> wrote: Hi Sarah, The Snowflake eel is a Moray eel, and is a salt water fish, having said that it is possible to keep them in your "freshwater" aquarium provided that the water is slightly brackish. They run up rivers to spawn, so they spend some time in freshwater and are often caught in rivers that run into the sea, this might be why so many people call them a freshwater fish!, as for eating they eat mainly meaty foods alive or dead, they are naturally a nocturnal fish so it could be eating while you are sleeping, also they are known to go lengthy periods without eating. the main thing about them is they are "Hudinies" they will escape from any tank that is not completely covered and can live out of water for 3 or 4 hours and travel long distances, also they can grow quite large up to about 3 feet (80cm). regards, unclenorm. --------------------------------- Yahoo! for Good Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15513	From: Sarah Fleming Davis	Date: 10/4/2005
Subject: Re: I got a new fish!/feeding prong?

What's a feeding prong? Could I use something like a wooden skewer? Sarah paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: feedng prongs are a great idea. --------------------------------- Yahoo! for Good Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15514	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 10/4/2005
Subject: Re: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning

Terry, For the gravel, I'd clean 1/4 to 1/2 of the bed with each water change. You do not say whether you have live plants or not, but, if you do, be careful not to disturb the root systems too much. If you ever see any horseface loaches, _Acantopsis choirorhynchos_, you might want to get one or two of them. They will grow to about 11" in the wild, but I've not seen them over 5" in an aquarium. You'll almost never see them, though, unless you have good eyes as all you'll see is the top of their head and their eyes sticking out of the gravel. They will do a good job of keeping the gravel getting compacted, especially around plants. You may wish to graduate to a larger tank with them around, however. As for your filter, it is difficult to say what the best method is because you do not tell us anything about it, though it sounds as though it is the type to use foam blocks. If this is the case, a quick rinse and squeeze in the water you have just siphoned out is good. If you have another type of media, please enlighten for the best method. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of T Sent: Tuesday, October 04, 2005 8:54 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning I have been on this board for awhile and always forget to ask this question. When it comes to Gravel cleaning.. so many sources say differet thing.. I have a 15 gl tank pretty well stocked... some may say over stocked, but the level are fine and I have never had any serious issues. I do the tpical 25% water change weekly and clean the gravel about once a month... never cleaning the whole thing at oncce. One half one time & the other half the other. Is this correct? also Filter changes... I change the filter as needed about 1 a month.. and rinse it out with the water from the "water change" in between. Is this too often? thx - Terry

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15515	From: Evita	Date: 10/4/2005
Subject: Re: Breeder contraptions, GGGGGrrrrrrrrrrrr

Great idea, I actually have a 20 gal up that I have been using for my babies. Evita bucks_boogie@... wrote:All those breeder nets and plastic craptations should be put in the recycle heap. They are so stressful, most of the fish die. Add plants, whether real or fake. Give them someplace for the babies to hide, or add them to a new tank with a used filter (you know what I mean, established with bacteria) with a sponge over the intake or a sponge filter that's been left to run in an established tank. Those freakin' nets and plastic crapomatics just keep the Moms' and babies right next to the lights, stressing the life right out of them. I mean, think about it, buy a new Penguin Mini for $25, an AquaClear sponge with a slit cut into it to cover the intake for $.99, and a 10 gallon new tank for $10, everybody has a spare heater or if not, pick one up for $20 bucks . No light or hood and raise 100 babies to 3/4 of an inch. Sell them to the petstore and get your money back. Then you have nothing but profit or more babies to raise. When you're not worrying about babies, you can keep the filter running without a cartridge on your main tank to keep the bacteria alive. JMHO, but a cheap way to raise babies, I'll be doing the same for my neolamprolongus brevis as soon as they start breeding. Good luck and have lots of fry to share, Rob. "I'm damaged, and I like it. It made me what I am!" Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! for Good Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15516	From: SuNnY	Date: 10/4/2005
Subject: Re: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning

If you have been doing this for long w/o any problem then its not at all a problem. Especially the Gravel cleaning part, 1/3 or 1/2 at a time is a good practise. Filter cleaning i do every 3 months once and dont have any problem what so ever. ...SuNnY ! T <bigter4@...> wrote: I have been on this board for awhile and always forget to ask this question. When it comes to Gravel cleaning.. so many sources say differet thing.. I have a 15 gl tank pretty well stocked... some may say over stocked, but the level are fine and I have never had any serious issues. I do the tpical 25% water change weekly and clean the gravel about once a month... never cleaning the whole thing at oncce. One half one time & the other half the other. Is this correct? also Filter changes... I change the filter as needed about 1 a month.. and rinse it out with the water from the "water change" in between. Is this too often? thx - Terry Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! for Good Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15517	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 10/5/2005
Subject: Re: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning

yep i tend to forget major details and your right i do that as well usually try about 3 or more days later the two times when i had a huge foggy mess with my water is when i did it like within the day of doing the water change... Shannon I usually rinse my filters a day or so afterwards since the act of cleaning and adding water kicks up gunk. I wait to let it get sucked up by the filter. Eric [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15518	From: paul helms	Date: 10/5/2005
Subject: Re: Live rock and cichlids

advice, dont do that. live rock is worth anywhere from 3-9 dollars a pound, and bowl rock (for freshwater) is under 2 bucks a pound. the live rock is live because it has millions of critters deep inside it that clean in the night time. these will die in fesh water and realeas massive amounts of ammonia. --- KttmfC <punk3r12@...> wrote: > Im trying to recycle my live rock from the saltwater > tank and use it > in my freshwater maybe tanganika setup..... any > advice?? Ive got the > water at a stable unreadable sg with the > hydrometer.... is this low > enough for tanganika cichlids?? thanks..... > > Kris > > > __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15519	From: paul helms	Date: 10/5/2005
Subject: Re: The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, wilderness tank

because some people like to eat tasty animals. --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > why would one ever want to join PETA? > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of mike mather > Sent: Wednesday, September 28, 2005 8:14 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] The ecological, > libertarian, civil desobedient, > wilderness tank enthusiast > > > Thomas, you better join PETA! You obviously are > looking at this from a Humanism perspective. I'd be > curious to know your stance on abortion and gay > rights? > Mike > > --- Thomas Schlemmermeyer <evolthomas@...> > wrote: > > > > > Hello, > > > > I have been just discussing with a friend of mine > > who is a bird > > enthusiast. She loves bird watching very much, but > > each time she goes > > to catch birds in nets (sometimes it is necessary > > for her science) > > her consciousness gets rather heavy, as she does > not > > feel entitled to > > take the freedom away of whatever animal. > > > > This brings me to the point of discussing the > > ethical aspects of our > > own hobby: the aquarium. > > > > My dream would be to work out a sort of poster > > presentation which > > lists up possible dark sides of our seemingly so > > innocent hobby - > > innocent just at first sight. Afterwards solutions > > or avoidances of > > these dark sides might be suggested. > > > > Let me just list up some points: > > > > -Many seawater fish species, particularly those > that > > are found in > > coral reefs, are caught with dubious methods, > > including poison. > > > > -pretty many of those coral fish die during > > transport, or (if they > > survive) won´t get the opportunity to live and to > > reproduce in a > > habitat which is suitable to their natural niche. > > > > -Many fish species for instance from the Amazone > > region only survive > > in their artificial Northern Hemisphere Tank > > habitats due to regular > > refreshing caughts in wilderness. These excursions > > are often not in > > compliance with local laws and may affect local > > ecosystems. > > > > -even fish species that are routinely bred in > tanks > > are vertebrates, > > hence phylogenetically alike to us (humans), and > > therefore these fish > > deserve some protection of their natural animal > > rights. > > > > But is it fair for instance to breed fancy guppies > > in small 30 liter- > > tanks? Moreover, is it fair to select fish > > populations only for fancy > > effects? Are fancy guppies really lucky? Aren´t > they > > deprived of > > their natural rights, due to artificial selection? > > Shouldn´t > > artificial selection be forbidden in that context? > > > > > (OK, I am not against breeding bigger porks, more > > milk giving cows or > > anything like this, as in this case artificial > > selection merely > > serves to satisfy our protein needs; but I think > it > > is highly > > questionable to breed for instance glimmering > Danio > > rerio, or fancy > > guppies, as in that case the purpose of man is > > neither the > > observation of nature (in due awe) nor the > struggle > > for his own > > survival, but what is on stake is falsifying > nature > > for mere pleasure > > purposes?) > > > > I would like to sum up more of these ethically > > critical aspects, and > > I would like to know about guideline drafts for > free > > and ecologically > > well sustained aquarium maintainance of fish. > > > > Where do we find a reasonable compromise between > an > > unlimited claim > > on fish for merely ornamental purposes and a more > > reasonable handling > > of aquarium fish as interesting study objects > which > > should only > > enhance our awe of nature, and nothing more? > > > > best wishes, I am waiting for good suggestions, > > Thomas > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when > replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Mar > ine+fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=sWozU8RAgM2g66Yb_7h_nQ> > biology > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine > +fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=JB6FNOraRx3JIvMA1E4-Lw> > fish Biology > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine+fis > h&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=R-HUKyhqLGfm-ZAFT2vuTQ> > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the > web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > === message truncated === ______________________________________________________ Yahoo! for Good Donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. http://store.yahoo.com/redcross-donate3/

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15520	From: paul helms	Date: 10/5/2005
Subject: Re: The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, wilderness tank

why are you here? this is a group of ppl who want to have fish, and either wish to advise or ask questions based on others experiences. --- Thomas Schlemmermeyer <evolthomas@...> wrote: > > Hello, > > I have been just discussing with a friend of mine > who is a bird > enthusiast. She loves bird watching very much, but > each time she goes > to catch birds in nets (sometimes it is necessary > for her science) > her consciousness gets rather heavy, as she does not > feel entitled to > take the freedom away of whatever animal. > > This brings me to the point of discussing the > ethical aspects of our > own hobby: the aquarium. > > My dream would be to work out a sort of poster > presentation which > lists up possible dark sides of our seemingly so > innocent hobby - > innocent just at first sight. Afterwards solutions > or avoidances of > these dark sides might be suggested. > > Let me just list up some points: > > -Many seawater fish species, particularly those that > are found in > coral reefs, are caught with dubious methods, > including poison. > > -pretty many of those coral fish die during > transport, or (if they > survive) won´t get the opportunity to live and to > reproduce in a > habitat which is suitable to their natural niche. > > -Many fish species for instance from the Amazone > region only survive > in their artificial Northern Hemisphere Tank > habitats due to regular > refreshing caughts in wilderness. These excursions > are often not in > compliance with local laws and may affect local > ecosystems. > > -even fish species that are routinely bred in tanks > are vertebrates, > hence phylogenetically alike to us (humans), and > therefore these fish > deserve some protection of their natural animal > rights. > > But is it fair for instance to breed fancy guppies > in small 30 liter- > tanks? Moreover, is it fair to select fish > populations only for fancy > effects? Are fancy guppies really lucky? Aren´t they > deprived of > their natural rights, due to artificial selection? > Shouldn´t > artificial selection be forbidden in that context? > > (OK, I am not against breeding bigger porks, more > milk giving cows or > anything like this, as in this case artificial > selection merely > serves to satisfy our protein needs; but I think it > is highly > questionable to breed for instance glimmering Danio > rerio, or fancy > guppies, as in that case the purpose of man is > neither the > observation of nature (in due awe) nor the struggle > for his own > survival, but what is on stake is falsifying nature > for mere pleasure > purposes?) > > I would like to sum up more of these ethically > critical aspects, and > I would like to know about guideline drafts for free > and ecologically > well sustained aquarium maintainance of fish. > > Where do we find a reasonable compromise between an > unlimited claim > on fish for merely ornamental purposes and a more > reasonable handling > of aquarium fish as interesting study objects which > should only > enhance our awe of nature, and nothing more? > > best wishes, I am waiting for good suggestions, > Thomas > > > > > __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15521	From: Fred and Cynthia	Date: 10/5/2005
Subject: Re: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning

I do a 50% change every week, but my tank is full of live plants. I guess it depends - I also do the gravel every week, and it shows that it's needed, always has junk coming out. If I wait too long, the fish get ill, and I get wayyyyyy too much algae all over. Cynthia http://babyitems.myphotoalbum.com/view_photo.php?set_albumName=album01&id=bag ----- Original Message ----- From: Eric Roberts To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, October 04, 2005 2:14 PM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning I usually clean all of my tanks every 2 weeks, vacuuming all of the gravel and doing a 25% water change each time. I usually clean the filters with tab water (using the sprayer to get the gunk off of it, then dipping the filter in the tank a few times to rinse out the chlorinated water before putting it back in the filter unit. This prevents getting chlorinated water on the bio-wheel and damaging the bio-filter. In my opinion, cleaning only half could potentially cause problems because you have fish poop and uneaten food in the gravel for long periods of time. I would do the whole thing. I never heard of only doing 1/2 of it. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of T Sent: Tuesday, October 04, 2005 7:54 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning I have been on this board for awhile and always forget to ask this question. When it comes to Gravel cleaning.. so many sources say differet thing.. I have a 15 gl tank pretty well stocked... some may say over stocked, but the level are fine and I have never had any serious issues. I do the tpical 25% water change weekly and clean the gravel about once a month... never cleaning the whole thing at oncce. One half one time & the other half the other. Is this correct? also Filter changes... I change the filter as needed about 1 a month.. and rinse it out with the water from the "water change" in between. Is this too often? thx - Terry Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15522	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 10/5/2005
Subject: Re: The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, wilderness tank

I could not find the original Post. Anyways, there is a difference between catching birds and catching fish. Birds cannot live in confinement but fish almost always have to live in confinement. They are limited to certain bodies of water some of which can be reduced to the size of a large aquarium in the dry season and many species probably don’t have even a drop of water in their lifecycle. You missed one of the very important points though: A Lot of species have actually become extinct in the wild and it is the Aquarium hobby that is keeping them alive. Examples?: Red Tailed Black shark, Rainbow Shark, A lot of Lake Victoria cichlids. I think there is a species of a Rainbow Fish as well. These are just a few well known ones. Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of paul helms Sent: 05 October 2005 12:10 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, wilderness tank enthusiast why are you here? this is a group of ppl who want to have fish, and either wish to advise or ask questions based on others experiences. --- Thomas Schlemmermeyer <evolthomas@...> wrote: > > Hello, > > I have been just discussing with a friend of mine > who is a bird > enthusiast. She loves bird watching very much, but > each time she goes > to catch birds in nets (sometimes it is necessary > for her science) > her consciousness gets rather heavy, as she does not > feel entitled to > take the freedom away of whatever animal. > > This brings me to the point of discussing the > ethical aspects of our > own hobby: the aquarium. > > My dream would be to work out a sort of poster > presentation which > lists up possible dark sides of our seemingly so > innocent hobby - > innocent just at first sight. Afterwards solutions > or avoidances of > these dark sides might be suggested. > > Let me just list up some points: > > -Many seawater fish species, particularly those that > are found in > coral reefs, are caught with dubious methods, > including poison. > > -pretty many of those coral fish die during > transport, or (if they > survive) won´t get the opportunity to live and to > reproduce in a > habitat which is suitable to their natural niche. > > -Many fish species for instance from the Amazone > region only survive > in their artificial Northern Hemisphere Tank > habitats due to regular > refreshing caughts in wilderness. These excursions > are often not in > compliance with local laws and may affect local > ecosystems. > > -even fish species that are routinely bred in tanks > are vertebrates, > hence phylogenetically alike to us (humans), and > therefore these fish > deserve some protection of their natural animal > rights. > > But is it fair for instance to breed fancy guppies > in small 30 liter- > tanks? Moreover, is it fair to select fish > populations only for fancy > effects? Are fancy guppies really lucky? Aren´t they > deprived of > their natural rights, due to artificial selection? > Shouldn´t > artificial selection be forbidden in that context? > > (OK, I am not against breeding bigger porks, more > milk giving cows or > anything like this, as in this case artificial > selection merely > serves to satisfy our protein needs; but I think it > is highly > questionable to breed for instance glimmering Danio > rerio, or fancy > guppies, as in that case the purpose of man is > neither the > observation of nature (in due awe) nor the struggle > for his own > survival, but what is on stake is falsifying nature > for mere pleasure > purposes?) > > I would like to sum up more of these ethically > critical aspects, and > I would like to know about guideline drafts for free > and ecologically > well sustained aquarium maintainance of fish. > > Where do we find a reasonable compromise between an > unlimited claim > on fish for merely ornamental purposes and a more > reasonable handling > of aquarium fish as interesting study objects which > should only > enhance our awe of nature, and nothing more? > > best wishes, I am waiting for good suggestions, > Thomas > > > > > __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 http://mail.yahoo.com Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Mar ine+fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=sWozU8RAgM2g66Yb_7h_nQ> biology Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine +fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=JB6FNOraRx3JIvMA1E4-Lw> fish Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine+fis h&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=R-HUKyhqLGfm-ZAFT2vuTQ> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15523	From: dkforgey	Date: 10/5/2005
Subject: Phosphate levels

Hi...I've been a member of this group for a while, but never posted. I have 4 aquariums (all freshwater) and a 600 gallon pond. My question pertaiins to all of these: How important are phosphate levels? If they are high, and mine are, what does that do to the fish and plants? The levels are much higher in my pond because we used well water to fill it up. I've been using a phosphate lowering product in the pond because those levels are reading very high. My fish and plants seem fine, but I just want to make sure. Do I need to try to lower the phosphate level or do I need to worry about it at all? Thanks! Donna Forgey

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15524	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 10/5/2005
Subject: Re: The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, wilderness tank

hehehe...I saw a tee-shirt that said PETA on one side and on the the other People Eating Tasty Animals. I thought it was great hehehe Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of paul helms Sent: Wednesday, October 05, 2005 6:05 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, wilderness tank enthusiast because some people like to eat tasty animals. --- Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: > why would one ever want to join PETA? > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of mike mather > Sent: Wednesday, September 28, 2005 8:14 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] The ecological, > libertarian, civil desobedient, > wilderness tank enthusiast > > > Thomas, you better join PETA! You obviously are > looking at this from a Humanism perspective. I'd be > curious to know your stance on abortion and gay > rights? > Mike > > --- Thomas Schlemmermeyer <evolthomas@...> > wrote: > > > > > Hello, > > > > I have been just discussing with a friend of mine > > who is a bird > > enthusiast. She loves bird watching very much, but > > each time she goes > > to catch birds in nets (sometimes it is necessary > > for her science) > > her consciousness gets rather heavy, as she does > not > > feel entitled to > > take the freedom away of whatever animal. > > > > This brings me to the point of discussing the > > ethical aspects of our > > own hobby: the aquarium. > > > > My dream would be to work out a sort of poster > > presentation which > > lists up possible dark sides of our seemingly so > > innocent hobby - > > innocent just at first sight. Afterwards solutions > > or avoidances of > > these dark sides might be suggested. > > > > Let me just list up some points: > > > > -Many seawater fish species, particularly those > that > > are found in > > coral reefs, are caught with dubious methods, > > including poison. > > > > -pretty many of those coral fish die during > > transport, or (if they > > survive) won´t get the opportunity to live and to > > reproduce in a > > habitat which is suitable to their natural niche. > > > > -Many fish species for instance from the Amazone > > region only survive > > in their artificial Northern Hemisphere Tank > > habitats due to regular > > refreshing caughts in wilderness. These excursions > > are often not in > > compliance with local laws and may affect local > > ecosystems. > > > > -even fish species that are routinely bred in > tanks > > are vertebrates, > > hence phylogenetically alike to us (humans), and > > therefore these fish > > deserve some protection of their natural animal > > rights. > > > > But is it fair for instance to breed fancy guppies > > in small 30 liter- > > tanks? Moreover, is it fair to select fish > > populations only for fancy > > effects? Are fancy guppies really lucky? Aren´t > they > > deprived of > > their natural rights, due to artificial selection? > > Shouldn´t > > artificial selection be forbidden in that context? > > > > > (OK, I am not against breeding bigger porks, more > > milk giving cows or > > anything like this, as in this case artificial > > selection merely > > serves to satisfy our protein needs; but I think > it > > is highly > > questionable to breed for instance glimmering > Danio > > rerio, or fancy > > guppies, as in that case the purpose of man is > > neither the > > observation of nature (in due awe) nor the > struggle > > for his own > > survival, but what is on stake is falsifying > nature > > for mere pleasure > > purposes?) > > > > I would like to sum up more of these ethically > > critical aspects, and > > I would like to know about guideline drafts for > free > > and ecologically > > well sustained aquarium maintainance of fish. > > > > Where do we find a reasonable compromise between > an > > unlimited claim > > on fish for merely ornamental purposes and a more > > reasonable handling > > of aquarium fish as interesting study objects > which > > should only > > enhance our awe of nature, and nothing more? > > > > best wishes, I am waiting for good suggestions, > > Thomas > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when > replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Mar > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Mar > ine+fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=sWozU8RAgM2g66Yb_7h_nQ> > biology > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine > &k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine > +fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=JB6FNOraRx3JIvMA1E4-Lw> > fish Biology > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine+fis > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine+fis > h&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=R-HUKyhqLGfm-ZAFT2vuTQ> > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the > web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > === message truncated === ______________________________________________________ Yahoo! for Good Donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. http://store.yahoo.com/redcross-donate3/ Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15525	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 10/5/2005
Subject: Betta w/ Pop Eye has puss spot. ?

The betta with the pop eye now has a puss looking spot under her eye. It is on her face and just under the eye. Parasite? Puss? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15526	From: Justin M.	Date: 10/5/2005
Subject: Re: The ecological, libertarian, civil disobedient, wilderness tank

At 12:57 PM 05/10/2005 +0100, you wrote: >A Lot of species have actually become extinct in the wild and it is the >Aquarium hobby that is keeping them alive. Examples?: Red Tailed Black >shark, Rainbow Shark, A lot of Lake Victoria cichlids. I think there is a >species of a Rainbow Fish as well. These are just a few well known ones. You can add the humble White Cloud Mountain Minnow to that list. JM

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15527	From: deborahgd14	Date: 10/5/2005
Subject: Ick

I have a goldfish that has ick really bad. I am confused on what to do. Give him ick medicine or change the water every day and put salt in it. Anyone's suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Thanks. Deborah D

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15528	From: KttmfC	Date: 10/5/2005
Subject: Rift parameters

Ive got the parameters for my rift setup and i need to raise the kH...... Anyone know how to do it?? heres the deal.... pH 8.2 GH 16 kH 6 Any suggestions??? Kris

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15529	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 10/5/2005
Subject: Re: Phosphate levels

Donna, I am not aware of any work pointing to phosphates as injurious to fish. This does not mean it isn't so, just that I've not seen it implicated in any problems. Now, phosphates are good for plants, up to a point. Plants can utilize the phosphates in their growth cycle. Algae also uses phosphates. If the level is too high for your other plants, algae would be glad to make use of it to grow. This means not only green water, but any of a number of kinds of algae that can be found in an aquarium. If you are not having algal problems now, in your pond or in your aquarium, I'd not worry too much about the level. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of dkforgey Sent: Wednesday, October 05, 2005 7:23 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Phosphate levels Hi...I've been a member of this group for a while, but never posted. I have 4 aquariums (all freshwater) and a 600 gallon pond. My question pertaiins to all of these: How important are phosphate levels? If they are high, and mine are, what does that do to the fish and plants? The levels are much higher in my pond because we used well water to fill it up. I've been using a phosphate lowering product in the pond because those levels are reading very high. My fish and plants seem fine, but I just want to make sure. Do I need to try to lower the phosphate level or do I need to worry about it at all? Thanks! Donna Forgey

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15530	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 10/5/2005
Subject: Re: Live rock and cichlids PAUL!!

Ive been soaking the rock in buckets and emptying and refilling them since june. The most recent time was about 3 weeks and i did a full water check which the parameters were kh of 6 gh of 16 and ph of 8.2, no amonia, no iron, what else should i test for??? Kris paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: advice, dont do that. live rock is worth anywhere from 3-9 dollars a pound, and bowl rock (for freshwater) is under 2 bucks a pound. the live rock is live because it has millions of critters deep inside it that clean in the night time. these will die in fesh water and realeas massive amounts of ammonia. --- KttmfC <punk3r12@...> wrote: > Im trying to recycle my live rock from the saltwater > tank and use it > in my freshwater maybe tanganika setup..... any > advice?? Ive got the > water at a stable unreadable sg with the > hydrometer.... is this low > enough for tanganika cichlids?? thanks..... > > Kris > > > __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 http://mail.yahoo.com Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! for Good Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15531	From: Fred and Cynthia	Date: 10/5/2005
Subject: Re: Ick

Ick medication as well as turning up the heat slowly with adding salt always makes the issue go away for me...........not sure with goldfish, mine are all tropical Cynthia http://babyitems.myphotoalbum.com/view_photo.php?set_albumName=album01&id=bag ----- Original Message ----- From: deborahgd14 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, October 05, 2005 8:51 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] Ick I have a goldfish that has ick really bad. I am confused on what to do. Give him ick medicine or change the water every day and put salt in it. Anyone's suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Thanks. Deborah D Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15532	From: deborahgd14	Date: 10/6/2005
Subject: Re: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning

I do 50 to 75 per cent water changes once a week and that works for me. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, agentscullyeyore@a... wrote: > > well i have a heavily stocked 20 gallon and do about a 40% water change > cleaning all the gravel each time i used to do this water change about once a > week now since my system seems so stable as it went 2 months this summer > without being touched i have backed off to about every nearly 2 weeks... this being > only cause i am so busy and i monitor it very well... since what your doing > seems to work for you i would keep it up.. everyone does things different > finding what works for them... Shannon > > I have been on this board for awhile and always forget to ask this > question. When it comes to Gravel cleaning.. so many sources say > differet thing.. I have a 15 gl tank pretty well stocked... some may > say over stocked, but the level are fine and I have never had any > serious issues. I do the tpical 25% water change weekly and clean the > gravel about once a month... never cleaning the whole thing at oncce. > One half one time & the other half the other. Is this correct? also > Filter changes... I change the filter as needed about 1 a month.. and > rinse it out with the water from the "water change" in between. Is this > too often? thx - Terry > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15533	From: Thomas Schlemmermeyer	Date: 10/6/2005
Subject: Re: The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, wilderness tank

Oh, this is very interesting. These species that only survive in Aquarium, how many of them are there? Are there studies being made about their genetic variation and whether it is sufficient to make them survive on the long run? Are reintroductions into the wild also planned? I reiterate I am an Aquarium enthusiast. But I understand that scientific experiments with vertebrate organisms require special ethical considerations. So, I think Aquarium enthusiast shall make such considerations as well, as Aquarium fish are vertebrate organisms as well! > > You missed one of the very important points though: > > A Lot of species have actually become extinct in the wild and it is the > Aquarium hobby that is keeping them alive. Examples?: Red Tailed Black > shark, Rainbow Shark, A lot of Lake Victoria cichlids. I think there is a > species of a Rainbow Fish as well. These are just a few well known ones. > > Nim > > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of paul helms > Sent: 05 October 2005 12:10 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, > wilderness tank enthusiast > > > > > why are you here? > this is a group of ppl who want to have fish, and > either wish to advise or ask questions based on others > experiences. > --- Thomas Schlemmermeyer <evolthomas@y...> wrote: > > > > > Hello, > > > > I have been just discussing with a friend of mine > > who is a bird > > enthusiast. She loves bird watching very much, but > > each time she goes > > to catch birds in nets (sometimes it is necessary > > for her science) > > her consciousness gets rather heavy, as she does not > > feel entitled to > > take the freedom away of whatever animal. > > > > This brings me to the point of discussing the > > ethical aspects of our > > own hobby: the aquarium. > > > > My dream would be to work out a sort of poster > > presentation which > > lists up possible dark sides of our seemingly so > > innocent hobby - > > innocent just at first sight. Afterwards solutions > > or avoidances of > > these dark sides might be suggested. > > > > Let me just list up some points: > > > > -Many seawater fish species, particularly those that > > are found in > > coral reefs, are caught with dubious methods, > > including poison. > > > > -pretty many of those coral fish die during > > transport, or (if they > > survive) won´t get the opportunity to live and to > > reproduce in a > > habitat which is suitable to their natural niche. > > > > -Many fish species for instance from the Amazone > > region only survive > > in their artificial Northern Hemisphere Tank > > habitats due to regular > > refreshing caughts in wilderness. These excursions > > are often not in > > compliance with local laws and may affect local > > ecosystems. > > > > -even fish species that are routinely bred in tanks > > are vertebrates, > > hence phylogenetically alike to us (humans), and > > therefore these fish > > deserve some protection of their natural animal > > rights. > > > > But is it fair for instance to breed fancy guppies > > in small 30 liter- > > tanks? Moreover, is it fair to select fish > > populations only for fancy > > effects? Are fancy guppies really lucky? Aren´t they > > deprived of > > their natural rights, due to artificial selection? > > Shouldn´t > > artificial selection be forbidden in that context? > > > > (OK, I am not against breeding bigger porks, more > > milk giving cows or > > anything like this, as in this case artificial > > selection merely > > serves to satisfy our protein needs; but I think it > > is highly > > questionable to breed for instance glimmering Danio > > rerio, or fancy > > guppies, as in that case the purpose of man is > > neither the > > observation of nature (in due awe) nor the struggle > > for his own > > survival, but what is on stake is falsifying nature > > for mere pleasure > > purposes?) > > > > I would like to sum up more of these ethically > > critical aspects, and > > I would like to know about guideline drafts for free > > and ecologically > > well sustained aquarium maintainance of fish. > > > > Where do we find a reasonable compromise between an > > unlimited claim > > on fish for merely ornamental purposes and a more > > reasonable handling > > of aquarium fish as interesting study objects which > > should only > > enhance our awe of nature, and nothing more? > > > > best wishes, I am waiting for good suggestions, > > Thomas > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Mar > ine+fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=sWozU8RAgM2g66Yb_7h_nQ> biology > > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine > +fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=JB6FNOraRx3JIvMA1E4-Lw> fish > > Biology > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine+fis > h&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=R-HUKyhqLGfm-ZAFT2vuTQ> > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. > > > > _____ > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15534	From: Barbara	Date: 10/6/2005
Subject: Re: Ick

ICH can be treated the same way as you do cichlids to tropicals. ONE thing to remember is that some meds stain the silicon in the tank. I have a 55 gal that been stained a blue color. Some meds do not want you to turn the heat up. With goldfish, I recommend that ICH med. Salt is good to use but if your golds are not used to it, it can cause problems in high doses. SO YOU need to do this gradually if you do the salt. Half the dose then 3 days later the rest. ICh only stays on for a certain amount of time. IF you keep salt in the water, this wil help keep them at bay and also improves other problems they may have. HERE is a great site on Goldfish and cures. I do have a small pond and have fancy goldfish that come in for the winter..Hope this helps you, Barb : http://www.goldfishinfo.com/identify.htm --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "deborahgd14" <deborahgd14@y...> wrote: > I have a goldfish that has ick really bad. I am confused on what to > do. Give him ick medicine or change the water every day and put salt > in it. Anyone's suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Thanks. > Deborah D

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15535	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 10/6/2005
Subject: Popeyed Bettas Parasitic Puss Spot

So the post I sent out a day or so ago went without answer so I'm trying again. Never seeing a parasite, I don't know what they look like exactly. My betta has a popped eye and underneath is a protruding white stringy something that look like puss oozing out of a wound. The base of this that is on her skin is red and bloody. That could be two thing to me. 1. It's the wound in which is infected hence the "puss." or 2. It's the wound caused by the sucking parasite. I removed her to get a closer look and when I did the white stuff fell off into the conainer I placed her in and there is now a bloody spot on her -the white thing. I treated the tank with pimafix since it's a wound either way. I also treated with acriflaven in the case of a parasite. I did that last night and the thing was 2x's as long this morning. Very bad. I treated the tank w/ tetracycline 4 days ago, continuing still, then acriflavin yesterday, pimafix today. Help please? Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15536	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 10/6/2005
Subject: Re: Popeyed Bettas Parasitic Puss Spot

Are you doing salt water baths? That is what helped my afflicted bettas more than anything. And either bettas ARE prone to popeye, OR you got your betta the same place the local petsmart got theirs LOL. EVery betta we got there got popeye sooner or later. We watch closely, and at the first sign of any swelling we start with saltwater baths, and feeding them food for internal parasites.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15537	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 10/6/2005
Subject: Re: Popeyed Bettas Parasitic Puss Spot

Regarding food for parasites, I do have that but it's so large that she can't eat it. I try crushing it and that helps a little but she still doesn't get much at all. We didn't get her at PetSmart, worse though...Wal Mart. I have not tried salt baths. I will try that if this other does not work. Does that help the eye go down? My male betta still has pop-eye but has been treated thoroughly. Poor thing. Leslie Have kids stuff? Check out Zainy Zebra Consignment! Based in Cabot, AR www.ZainyZebra.com Live in or near Cabot? Join the Cabot Garage Sale! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/CabotgarageSale/ Live in Little Rock? Little Rock Garage Sale!http://groups.yahoo.com/group/LRgarageSale/ -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of cynthia brennemann Sent: Thursday, October 06, 2005 1:06 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Popeyed Bettas Parasitic Puss Spot Are you doing salt water baths? That is what helped my afflicted bettas more than anything. And either bettas ARE prone to popeye, OR you got your betta the same place the local petsmart got theirs LOL. EVery betta we got there got popeye sooner or later. We watch closely, and at the first sign of any swelling we start with saltwater baths, and feeding them food for internal parasites. Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15538	From: A J Myers	Date: 10/6/2005
Subject: Koi keeling over

My koi are listless and two are keeling over to the side. My pH is a little high right now (8.0) and I have dosed my 90+ gallon outdoor pond twice to lower it but it is still hanging up there. I removed any recent rock additions and am hoping for the best. Any suggestions?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15539	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 10/6/2005
Subject: Goldfish

Asking on behalf of a friend who has a 75 gallon goldfish tank. He had just two comets in it, both around 7 inches long and about an inch or so thick. He came home yesterday and found one of his comets upside down and from what he described, the belly above the anus appears to have ruptured. There were no signs of a fight. Neutral PH and no measurable Nitrates/Nitrites. Water Temp. was 70 Degrees at the time. Unfortunately, I have no idea what could have happened as I keep FW tropicals only and have never had anything like this happen in any of my tanks. He said other than the fish's ruptured belly, there were no other signs of injury and the other fish is behaving normally. Any ideas as to what might have happened? -Steve

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15540	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 10/6/2005
Subject: Re: Popeyed Bettas Parasitic Puss Spot

There is a gel food for bacterial infections and another one for parasites that I have been using. You have to pretty much isolate the fish, in a small area, and deprive them of food for a day or so before they'll eat it, but eventually they eat it. The popeye eventually went down for us, but I couldn't hardly stand to look at it for some time. :( >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15541	From: Barbara	Date: 10/6/2005
Subject: Re: Popeyed Bettas Parasitic Puss Spot

WAY to many meds to be giving your betta. YOU need to stay with one only! They do take time to work. On the white stuff coming off, that could be a parasite, but hard to tell as I dont' know of any that are white in form. I am sending you to a betta forum. it is a Yahoo one.. imagine that...Try these as bettas is all they do, I had some but they died. I can keep cichlids all day but not the bettas..Hope these help you..Barb..http://groups.yahoo.com/group/CaliforniaBettas/ This is the only one I found that is active, but maybe they can help you..IF I find another one I wil post it to you.. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie & Dane Moore" <5moores@c...> wrote: > So the post I sent out a day or so ago went without answer so I'm trying > again. Never seeing a parasite, I don't know what they look like > exactly. My betta has a popped eye and underneath is a protruding white > stringy something that look like puss oozing out of a wound. The base > of this that is on her skin is red and bloody. That could be two thing > to me. 1. It's the wound in which is infected hence the "puss." or 2. > It's the wound caused by the sucking parasite. > > I removed her to get a closer look and when I did the white stuff fell > off into the conainer I placed her in and there is now a bloody spot on > her -the white thing. I treated the tank with pimafix since it's a > wound either way. I also treated with acriflaven in the case of a > parasite. I did that last night and the thing was 2x's as long this > morning. Very bad. > > I treated the tank w/ tetracycline 4 days ago, continuing still, then > acriflavin yesterday, pimafix today. > > Help please? > > Leslie > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15542	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 10/6/2005
Subject: Re: Goldfish

Fish can't burp...is his filter sucking air in with the water? Has he changed the diet of the fish lately? Could be gas bubble disease?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15543	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 10/6/2005
Subject: Re: Popeyed Bettas Parasitic Puss Spot

I am really worried about this fish. Now the entire front of her face is red. Blood red and nasty looking. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of cynthia brennemann Sent: Thursday, October 06, 2005 4:43 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Popeyed Bettas Parasitic Puss Spot There is a gel food for bacterial infections and another one for parasites that I have been using. You have to pretty much isolate the fish, in a small area, and deprive them of food for a day or so before they'll eat it, but eventually they eat it. The popeye eventually went down for us, but I couldn't hardly stand to look at it for some time. :( >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15544	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 10/6/2005
Subject: Re: Popeyed Bettas Parasitic Puss Spot

can you post a pic leslie? Leslie & Dane Moore <5moores@...> wrote:I am really worried about this fish. Now the entire front of her face is red. Blood red and nasty looking. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of cynthia brennemann Sent: Thursday, October 06, 2005 4:43 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Popeyed Bettas Parasitic Puss Spot There is a gel food for bacterial infections and another one for parasites that I have been using. You have to pretty much isolate the fish, in a small area, and deprive them of food for a day or so before they'll eat it, but eventually they eat it. The popeye eventually went down for us, but I couldn't hardly stand to look at it for some time. :( > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- Valeen Robertson Gonzalez valeendgonzalez@... [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15545	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 10/6/2005
Subject: Re: Ick

Deborah, Do you just have the one goldfish, or do you have a number of them with just the one affected? If it is just one of a number, move the affected fish to a separate tank, you know, the one you have put aside for just such a situation <g>. In any case, add salt, one tablespoon per 5 gallons of water. Bring the temperature up to the low 80's, and aerate heavily. Goldfish need a lot of oxygen in the water, and the higher the temperature the less oxygen the water can hold. Heavy aeration will help you overcome this somewhat. Maintain this treatment regimen until the ick is no longer visible on the fish plus one week. Then you can start reducing the temperature and removing the salt via your regular water changes. Keep the fish separate for at least another two weeks, if a single, to ensure the parasite's cycle has been broken, and it is not making a comeback. I don't have a link handy, but I am sure that you can find information about the life cycle of ick on the net somewhere. Basically, the salt like granules you see on the fish are cysts. They contain the parasite. When this portion of the life cycle is done, the cyst will fall away from the fish, the parasite will breed and the young will become free swimming, looking for the host. This free swimming stage is where they are most vulnerable. During this stage, they will find a fish and attach themselves and make new cysts as they feed and develop. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of deborahgd14 Sent: Wednesday, October 05, 2005 8:52 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Ick I have a goldfish that has ick really bad. I am confused on what to do. Give him ick medicine or change the water every day and put salt in it. Anyone's suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Thanks. Deborah D

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15546	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 10/6/2005
Subject: Re: Rift parameters

Get some crushed oyster shell or coral, and place it in your filter, or where you will have water flow through it. Once you have it where you want it, you may be able to get away with just mixing it in your substrate. There is also a product, generically known as kalkawasser (I think I have the spelling right). It is a calcium concentrate, and you can use it when doing water changes. It was originally developed for marine tanks, but works in freshwater as well. I don't like messing with water parameters like this, but raising KH is probably a better move than trying to lower it. Your fish will probably do Ok in your water as it is, also, but they will be more likely to breed with water parameters close to their home waters.. Also check for the water parameters from the location the fish are from. The three big lakes have different chemistries, and most of the water coming into the lake is closer to South American waters than lake waters. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of KttmfC Sent: Wednesday, October 05, 2005 9:35 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Rift parameters Ive got the parameters for my rift setup and i need to raise the kH...... Anyone know how to do it?? heres the deal.... pH 8.2 GH 16 kH 6 Any suggestions??? Kris

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15547	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 10/6/2005
Subject: Re: Rift parameters

Would that also be good for snails (obviously in smaller quantities)? I am looking for something to help them with their shells. I have an apple snail in one tank and a mystery snail in another. I am planning on getting a couple more apple snails for my other tanks (one each...don't want a ton of them heheh). I am also looking for a potassium supplement. I have a bunch of feeder guppies that are too big to eat and they have growths on them. I was researching it and everything I could find showed that they were due to a potassium deficiency. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: Thursday, October 06, 2005 10:02 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Rift parameters Get some crushed oyster shell or coral, and place it in your filter, or where you will have water flow through it. Once you have it where you want it, you may be able to get away with just mixing it in your substrate. There is also a product, generically known as kalkawasser (I think I have the spelling right). It is a calcium concentrate, and you can use it when doing water changes. It was originally developed for marine tanks, but works in freshwater as well. I don't like messing with water parameters like this, but raising KH is probably a better move than trying to lower it. Your fish will probably do Ok in your water as it is, also, but they will be more likely to breed with water parameters close to their home waters.. Also check for the water parameters from the location the fish are from. The three big lakes have different chemistries, and most of the water coming into the lake is closer to South American waters than lake waters. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of KttmfC Sent: Wednesday, October 05, 2005 9:35 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Rift parameters Ive got the parameters for my rift setup and i need to raise the kH...... Anyone know how to do it?? heres the deal.... pH 8.2 GH 16 kH 6 Any suggestions??? Kris Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15548	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 10/6/2005
Subject: Re: Popeyed Bettas Parasitic Puss Spot

I have tried to get one but they are all so fuzzy even I can't see it. That's another why I moved her today...hoping to get her more still and on a white background. I will try again but it won't be too soon. =( Poor fish. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez Sent: Thursday, October 06, 2005 8:19 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Popeyed Bettas Parasitic Puss Spot can you post a pic leslie? L

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15549	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 10/7/2005
Subject: Questions to ask a potential seller of fish?

What questions should I ask of someone who is selling their fish? I know one of them is is how do you ship and when do you ship your fish? Anymore questions I should ask? Thanks, Beth, who doesn't want to buy a Wal Mart fish.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15550	From: harry perry	Date: 10/7/2005
Subject: Re: Questions to ask a potential seller of fish?/ To Beth.

I would ask: How long have you been shipping fish(experience). Have the fish been quarintined and treated for anything?, in the caes of importers. What are you currently feeding the fish.? Some fish will only eat live food. Water parameters? ph, etc. Is their a guarantee?. Harry P.S.Found an excellant source for fish. Will contact you off list. Beth Brownell <spencer_creek_studios@...> wrote: What questions should I ask of someone who is selling their fish? I know one of them is is how do you ship and when do you ship your fish? Anymore questions I should ask? Thanks, Beth, who doesn't want to buy a Wal Mart fish. Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! for Good Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15551	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 10/7/2005
Subject: Re: Rift parameters

Snails will utilize the available calcium to build their shell structure. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Roberts Sent: Thursday, October 06, 2005 11:34 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Rift parameters Would that also be good for snails (obviously in smaller quantities)? I am looking for something to help them with their shells. I have an apple snail in one tank and a mystery snail in another. I am planning on getting a couple more apple snails for my other tanks (one each...don't want a ton of them heheh). I am also looking for a potassium supplement. I have a bunch of feeder guppies that are too big to eat and they have growths on them. I was researching it and everything I could find showed that they were due to a potassium deficiency. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: Thursday, October 06, 2005 10:02 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Rift parameters Get some crushed oyster shell or coral, and place it in your filter, or where you will have water flow through it. Once you have it where you want it, you may be able to get away with just mixing it in your substrate. There is also a product, generically known as kalkawasser (I think I have the spelling right). It is a calcium concentrate, and you can use it when doing water changes. It was originally developed for marine tanks, but works in freshwater as well. I don't like messing with water parameters like this, but raising KH is probably a better move than trying to lower it. Your fish will probably do Ok in your water as it is, also, but they will be more likely to breed with water parameters close to their home waters.. Also check for the water parameters from the location the fish are from. The three big lakes have different chemistries, and most of the water coming into the lake is closer to South American waters than lake waters. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of KttmfC Sent: Wednesday, October 05, 2005 9:35 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Rift parameters Ive got the parameters for my rift setup and i need to raise the kH...... Anyone know how to do it?? heres the deal.... pH 8.2 GH 16 kH 6 Any suggestions??? Kris Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15552	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 10/7/2005
Subject: this is so cool does anyone have one

_http://www.fluque.net/_ (http://www.fluque.net/) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15553	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 10/7/2005
Subject: Re: this is so cool does anyone have one

Yes, As a child in the early 70's I used to see a square version at the local Woolworths store. I thought it was pretty cool. More recently I have seen them on ebay for a lot less than $80.00! I think if you are handy enough with acrylic you could make one for a lot less or ask a acrylic store like Tap Plastics to make you one. Two U shaped pieces of acrylic with a flat front and rear piece and some acrylic cement and you could have the same thing. Stores that work with acrylic like making signs for desks, or sign holders for tables at restaraunts have the equipment to heat and bend acrylic. You could aslo buy a few feet of acrylic tubing (more expensive) Have a store make two 45 degree cuts, use the acrylic cement and make a Wide U shape. Or with a lot more cutting and use of acrylic cement use flat pieces to make a box tube U. I have always wanted one of these, might try and make one sometime. Be pretty cool to link a couple tanks like that. Mike In a message dated 10/7/2005 9:17:41 PM Pacific Daylight Time, agentscullyeyore@... writes: _http://www.fluque.net/_ (http://www.fluque.net/) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15554	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 10/7/2005
Subject: Re: this is so cool does anyone have one

so call me stupid but in the picture that i see it looks like there is water in there and they talk about how the fish swim from side to side how can that be... Shannon Yes, As a child in the early 70's I used to see a square version at the local Woolworths store. I thought it was pretty cool. More recently I have seen them on ebay for a lot less than $80.00! I think if you are handy enough with acrylic you could make one for a lot less or ask a acrylic store like Tap Plastics to make you one. Two U shaped pieces of acrylic with a flat front and rear piece and some acrylic cement and you could have the same thing. Stores that work with acrylic like making signs for desks, or sign holders for tables at restaraunts have the equipment to heat and bend acrylic. You could aslo buy a few feet of acrylic tubing (more expensive) Have a store make two 45 degree cuts, use the acrylic cement and make a Wide U shape. Or with a lot more cutting and use of acrylic cement use flat pieces to make a box tube U. I have always wanted one of these, might try and make one sometime. Be pretty cool to link a couple tanks like that. Mike [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15555	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 10/7/2005
Subject: Re: this is so cool does anyone have one

Shannon, I lack the proper words to explain it but... You know how you have a straw in your soda cup and you plug the straw with your finger and pull it up above the level of the soda? Soda stays in the straw. Now if the straw were a flexible tube and you bent it over and placed it in another soda of the same level as the soda in the first cup the soda would remain in the straw (providing the straw is below the surface on both ends). If you lowered the level in one tank they would eventual equalize and be the same level. Siphon action. Providing no air gets in the tube it should stay just like that and allow the fish to swim from tank to tank. Mike In a message dated 10/7/2005 11:26:42 PM Pacific Daylight Time, agentscullyeyore@... writes: so call me stupid but in the picture that i see it looks like there is water in there and they talk about how the fish swim from side to side how can that be... Shannon [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15556	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 10/7/2005
Subject: Re: this is so cool does anyone have one

so then what your saying is basically the same water would be in the area on the top... i was also thinking you wouldn't be able to have a hood on either so what if the fish jump out maybe i am thinking to much but i have to have mine covered cause the fish always jump when i feed them.. Shannon Shannon, I lack the proper words to explain it but... You know how you have a straw in your soda cup and you plug the straw with your finger and pull it up above the level of the soda? Soda stays in the straw. Now if the straw were a flexible tube and you bent it over and placed it in another soda of the same level as the soda in the first cup the soda would remain in the straw (providing the straw is below the surface on both ends). If you lowered the level in one tank they would eventual equalize and be the same level. Siphon action. Providing no air gets in the tube it should stay just like that and allow the fish to swim from tank to tank. Mike [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15557	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 10/8/2005
Subject: Re: this is so cool does anyone have one

Ya, a hood would not work out so well. I suppose the water might not circulate through the tube very well, but if you do a water change in one tank it will siphon the older water through the tube. I suppose you could use a power head with a hose running from one tank to the other to make a current go through the tube in the opposite direction. Mike In a message dated 10/7/2005 11:51:56 PM Pacific Daylight Time, agentscullyeyore@... writes: so then what your saying is basically the same water would be in the area on the top... i was also thinking you wouldn't be able to have a hood on either so what if the fish jump out maybe i am thinking to much but i have to have mine covered cause the fish always jump when i feed them.. Shannon [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15558	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 10/8/2005
Subject: Re: this is so cool does anyone have one

that sounds like a good plan... i wonder how long it would take the fish to figure out they could do this... Shannon Ya, a hood would not work out so well. I suppose the water might not circulate through the tube very well, but if you do a water change in one tank it will siphon the older water through the tube. I suppose you could use a power head with a hose running from one tank to the other to make a current go through the tube in the opposite direction. Mike [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15559	From: Evita	Date: 10/8/2005
Subject: Re: this is so cool does anyone have one

All I got was can not display page. I couldn't see anything. Evita agentscullyeyore@... wrote:_http://www.fluque.net/_ (http://www.fluque.net/) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Music Unlimited - Access over 1 million songs. Try it free. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15560	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 10/8/2005
Subject: Re: this is so cool does anyone have one

http://www.fluque.net try this link without the _ behind it :-) In a message dated 10/8/2005 3:57:58 AM US Eastern Standard Time, evitabug@... writes: http://www.fluque.net Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15561	From: paul helms	Date: 10/8/2005
Subject: Re: Live rock and cichlids PAUL!!

nitrite nitrate --- kristopher helsing <punk3r12@...> wrote: > Ive been soaking the rock in buckets and emptying > and refilling them since june. The most recent time > was about 3 weeks and i did a full water check which > the parameters were kh of 6 gh of 16 and ph of > 8.2, no amonia, no iron, what else should i test > for??? > > Kris > > paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > advice, dont do that. live rock is worth anywhere > from 3-9 dollars a pound, and bowl rock (for > freshwater) is under 2 bucks a pound. the live rock > is live because it has millions of critters deep > inside it that clean in the night time. these will > die in fesh water and realeas massive amounts of > ammonia. > > --- KttmfC <punk3r12@...> wrote: > > > Im trying to recycle my live rock from the > saltwater > > tank and use it > > in my freshwater maybe tanganika setup..... any > > advice?? Ive got the > > water at a stable unreadable sg with the > > hydrometer.... is this low > > enough for tanganika cichlids?? thanks..... > > > > Kris > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when > replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the > TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > > > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email > to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! for Good > Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina > relief effort. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Yahoo! Music Unlimited Access over 1 million songs. Try it free. http://music.yahoo.com/unlimited/

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15562	From: paul helms	Date: 10/8/2005
Subject: Re: I got a new fish!/feeding prong?

too sharp --- Sarah Fleming Davis <keelis_mom@...> wrote: > What's a feeding prong? Could I use something like > a wooden skewer? > > Sarah > > > paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > feedng prongs are a great idea. > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! for Good > Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina > relief effort. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15563	From: Donna Ransome	Date: 10/8/2005
Subject: Used Tank Advice

What are some questions to ask when buying a used aquarium set-up (tank, filter, hood, etc.)? One is to ask if the tank was never used for reptiles. What else? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15564	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 10/8/2005
Subject: Endangered Species Program, USF&W

This covers all animals and plants, including fishes and aquatics. I know that some of you will find this site more than interesting, even though it only covers the United States. There is a section, also, on invasive species. Endangered Species Program, U.S. Fish & Wildlife Service [pdf] http://www.fws.gov/endangered/ Created as a result of the Endangered Species Preservation Act of 1966, the Endangered Species Program is responsible for promulgating information about the various international agreements that protect species, maintain the listing program of threatened and endangered species, and also disseminate publications and fact sheets. As one might expect, a primary feature of the site is the actual list of threatened and endangered species. Visitors can generate and print out this list, and also peruse a list of general statistics, along with looking at species list by classification, such as clams, snails, and lichens. The site's homepage also contains direct links to recent publications, such as Working Together: Tools for Helping Imperiled Wildlife on Private Lands. Visitors can also look at management plans adopted by the U.S. Fish & Wildlife Service and learn about the various invasive species which are also of concern to the agency. Finally, visitors can also peruse the online archive of the Endangered Species Bulletin all the way back to 1995. >From The Scout Report, Copyright Internet Scout Project 1994-2005. http://scout.wisc.edu/ \\Steve// "There is still no cure for the common birthday" -- John Glenn

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15565	From: Amalthea X	Date: 10/8/2005
Subject: Re: this is so cool does anyone have one

I've seen similar systems in a lot of restaurants, but don't own one. Amalthea http://www.amaltheasattic.com Custom Dreadfalls, Creepy Toys, and Much, Much More... On Oct 8, 2005, at 12:17 AM, agentscullyeyore@... wrote: > _http://www.fluque.net/_ (http://www.fluque.net/) > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><· > ´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15566	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 10/8/2005
Subject: Re: Used Tank Advice

Probably the most important is to see the tank filled with water--then you can determine if there are any leaks. If you cannot see it with water, knock down the price or leave it alone and find another one. If the tank leaks, by the time you locate the leak and repair it, your time and effort would have made it worthwhile to buy a new tank with some sort of warranty on it. Rather than asking if the tank was used for reptiles directly, ask what the tank was used for, or "what kind of fish did you keep?"--then you are more likely to get an answer that is closer to the truth. Maybe it was fish, maybe it was guinea pigs, maybe reptiles. If the tank is spotless, you may wish to enquire as to what was used to clean it. Anything other than water, salt, bleach, alone or in combination, and it may be wise to avoid the tank. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Donna Ransome Sent: Saturday, October 08, 2005 7:20 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Used Tank Advice What are some questions to ask when buying a used aquarium set-up (tank, filter, hood, etc.)? One is to ask if the tank was never used for reptiles. What else?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15567	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 10/8/2005
Subject: Re: this is so cool does anyone have one

maybe you put a g instead of a q i did that at first lol if not .. i have no clue..maybe try again later its worth the viewing.. Shannon All I got was can not display page. I couldn't see anything. Evita agentscullyeyore@... wrote:_http://www.fluque.net/_ (http://www.fluque.net/) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15568	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 10/8/2005
Subject: Re: Live rock and cichlids PAUL!!

right now cant remember which is which, but the one i need is low and the one i dont is non existant.... --- paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > nitrite nitrate > > --- kristopher helsing <punk3r12@...> wrote: > > > Ive been soaking the rock in buckets and emptying > > and refilling them since june. The most recent > time > > was about 3 weeks and i did a full water check > which > > the parameters were kh of 6 gh of 16 and ph of > > 8.2, no amonia, no iron, what else should i test > > for??? > > > > Kris > > > > paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > advice, dont do that. live rock is worth anywhere > > from 3-9 dollars a pound, and bowl rock (for > > freshwater) is under 2 bucks a pound. the live > rock > > is live because it has millions of critters deep > > inside it that clean in the night time. these > will > > die in fesh water and realeas massive amounts of > > ammonia. > > > > --- KttmfC <punk3r12@...> wrote: > > > > > Im trying to recycle my live rock from the > > saltwater > > > tank and use it > > > in my freshwater maybe tanganika setup..... any > > > advice?? Ive got the > > > water at a stable unreadable sg with the > > > hydrometer.... is this low > > > enough for tanganika cichlids?? thanks..... > > > > > > Kris > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > > Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 > > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it > when > > replying, thanks. > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > > that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING > the > > TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" > <- > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > > matter. > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email > > to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > > Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > Yahoo! for Good > > Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina > > relief effort. > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > Yahoo! Music Unlimited > Access over 1 million songs. Try it free. > http://music.yahoo.com/unlimited/ > __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15569	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 10/8/2005
Subject: Re: The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, wilderness tank

I've been following the posts on this topic posted to this list. Until now, I've not had the time to post a reply to the original message. My other half says I work too much <g>. It is unfortunate that someone decided that his list was a better place for it, but such is life. Let me answer some of the points brought up: "-Many seawater fish species, particularly those that are found in coral reefs, are caught with dubious methods, including poison." Actually, the places where this occurs have been well documented, and those who are into the hobby know about them and generally avoid fish from those areas. I would suspect that he fish that do make it into the system from those areas are sold to those who really do not know about this, are not well versed in keeping such fish, and don't really care to be. The people who import such fish into the country are only there for the money to be made, as are those who sell them. Can this practice be stopped. It is not likely. The fish that are caught using these methods have a lower price on them than those that are not. It would be up to the countries in which such practices are used to stop the trade, and they will not or cannot do so. Pretty much a lost cause, though attention should still be drawn to the problem. "-pretty many of those coral fish die during transport, or (if they survive) won't get the opportunity to live and to reproduce in a habitat which is suitable to their natural niche." Many fish die in transport, or from the stress caused during transport to reach their artificial homes. Doesn't matter if they are marine or freshwater species, wild caught or tank or pond raised. Shipping methods have improved over the years, and still do continue to improve. Fish caught be the means alluded to in the first statement are more likely to die during shipment, whether the means be chemical or explosive. If they do make it to the aquarium, they will die soon due to the damage done to their bodies and metabolism by the means used to catch them. The problem with reproduction in many of the marine fish is that there are stages they go through in their life cycles that cannot be reproduced in an aquarium, thus far, that match their needs. While many species of freshwater fish have been bred, and spend their whole lifetimes in captivity, relatively few marines have been induced to reproduce. However, if we go back to the beginning of the freshwater hobby, very few fish were bred in captivity. Now, even after over 100 years, many of the available species are bred in captivity and in such quantities that only specialists look for wild individuals. The marine side of the hobby is most likely following the same learning curve. As time goes by, more and more marine fish will be bred in captivity, until the percentage of such species rivals the freshwater hobby. "-Many fish species for instance from the Amazone region only survive in their artificial Northern Hemisphere Tank habitats due to regular refreshing caughts in wilderness. These excursions are often not in compliance with local laws and may affect local ecosystems." Collection of wild specimens is a big business in Amazonia and other areas. While there are probably the illegal collections happening that you describe, they are very much in the minority. Those who are caught are treat much more harshly in those countries than they would be here. The trade in animals other than fish seems to be much larger, and many of the other animals are much more endangered than the fishes. "-even fish species that are routinely bred in tanks are vertebrates, hence phylogenetically alike to us (humans), and therefore these fish deserve some protection of their natural animal rights." Anthropomorphizing is not a way to win arguments among thinking people, though it seems to work wonders with the uncleansed masses. Fish in captivity often live longer lives than can be expected in the wild. They do not face all the environmental challenges their wild brethren do. They are not likely to be prey for larger fish or other fish eating animals. They do not need to put up with varying temperatures, they do not need to constantly hunt for food that is conveniently provided to them at least once a day. Your argument is a non-starter. "But is it fair for instance to breed fancy guppies in small 30 liter-tanks? Moreover, is it fair to select fish populations only for fancy effects? Are fancy guppies really lucky? Aren't they deprived of their natural rights, due to artificial selection? Shouldn´t artificial selection be forbidden in that context?" You'll need to get over this natural rights thing first. Rational beings are one thing, animals are another. The selection process happens all the time in the wild. Those selections that work, live to pass along those genes. Those that don't do not get the chance to pass along those genes. The real world ensures that. These fish no longer live in the real world. You get enough money together, you no longer need to live in the real world. "(OK, I am not against breeding bigger porks, more milk giving cows or anything like this, as in this case artificial selection merely serves to satisfy our protein needs; but I think it is highly questionable to breed for instance glimmering Danio rerio, or fancy guppies, as in that case the purpose of man is neither the observation of nature (in due awe) nor the struggle for his own survival, but what is on stake is falsifying nature for mere pleasure purposes?)" OK, you like Rembrandt, she likes Picasso. What is the argument. People want something pretty to look at. It may be the world as Rembrandt see it, or it may be the world as Picasso sees it. Maybe it is the world as Escher sees it. Can you get wild type versions of all those fish. Sure can. Do you want the wild type? Maybe. You want to rant and rave over something? Try blueberry tetras, or painted glassfish, or parrot cichlids. As far as I am concerned, you have got a good argument there. You have no real argument over the fancy varieties of fish, though. Personally, I'll take the wild types, but I'll not begrudge one their choice of the fancies. "I would like to sum up more of these ethically critical aspects, and I would like to know about guideline drafts for free and ecologically well sustained aquarium maintenance of fish. "Where do we find a reasonable compromise between an unlimited claim on fish for merely ornamental purposes and a more reasonable handling of aquarium fish as interesting study objects which should only enhance our awe of nature, and nothing more?" I don't have the time right now to look up the information, but there are several groups out there that have done just that. Some are conservation groups, others are hobbyist groups, and even industry groups have proposed solutions out of their sense of self preservation. While searching for these groups, be very cautious of what you find, and look behind the curtain. The same people who will not allow the oil industry to build more refineries are, in many cases, the same people who want the government to do something to lower the current oil prices they pay at the pump or delivered to their home. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Thomas Schlemmermeyer Sent: Tuesday, September 27, 2005 8:19 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] The ecological, libertarian, civil desobedient, wilderness tank enthusiast ---------------------<snip>----------------------------------

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15570	From: wendie	Date: 10/8/2005
Subject: Re: this is so cool does anyone have one

Use http://www.fluque.net -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of agentscullyeyore@... Sent: Saturday, October 08, 2005 1:05 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] this is so cool does anyone have one maybe you put a g instead of a q i did that at first lol if not .. i have no clue..maybe try again later its worth the viewing.. Shannon All I got was can not display page. I couldn't see anything. Evita agentscullyeyore@... wrote:_http://www.fluque.net/_ (http://www.fluque.net/) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15571	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 10/8/2005
Subject: Re: this is so cool does anyone have one

just www.fluque.net the others add a /) to the url. --- wendie <wendieo@...> wrote: > Use http://www.fluque.net > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On > Behalf Of agentscullyeyore@... > Sent: Saturday, October 08, 2005 1:05 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] this is so cool does > anyone have one > > > > maybe you put a g instead of a q i did that at > first lol if not .. i have > no > clue..maybe try again later its worth the > viewing.. Shannon > > All I got was can not display page. I couldn't > see anything. Evita > > agentscullyeyore@... > wrote:_http://www.fluque.net/_ > (http://www.fluque.net/) > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15572	From: sevenspringss@wmconnect.com	Date: 10/9/2005
Subject: Re: this is so cool does anyone have one

Hi Shannon, They used to make one-piece glass goldfish bowls years ago with a hollow loop on top from one side to the other that would hold water -- same idea -- don't know if fish ever used the loop though. By the way, I also got the "the page cannot be found" message when clicking on the link, just like Evita, but the site can be opened by then clicking on "www.flugue.net" in the 2nd paragraph of that Message that says "* open the www.fugue.net home page, . . . ". I never actually knew anyone who had one though, but they were popular for a while. Regards, Ray [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15573	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 10/9/2005
Subject: Water cloudy white.

I added a pleco to the tank on the seventh and the water had started to go cloudy white on me that morning. I am planning on doing a water change to see if that will help, everything seems to be fine in the 30 gallon tank beyond the cloudiness of the water. Is this a bacterial bloom or something else? Thanks, Beth Brownell __________________________________ Yahoo! Music Unlimited Access over 1 million songs. Try it free. http://music.yahoo.com/unlimited/

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15574	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 10/9/2005
Subject: Re: Water cloudy white.

You tank may not have been fully cycled or something disrupted it. While plecos do add considerable bioload...it shouldn't have caused a bloom in itself. I would leave it alone and let things balance out. The bacterial or algal blooms won;t harm your fish. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Beth Brownell Sent: Sunday, October 09, 2005 5:52 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Water cloudy white. I added a pleco to the tank on the seventh and the water had started to go cloudy white on me that morning. I am planning on doing a water change to see if that will help, everything seems to be fine in the 30 gallon tank beyond the cloudiness of the water. Is this a bacterial bloom or something else? Thanks, Beth Brownell __________________________________ Yahoo! Music Unlimited Access over 1 million songs. Try it free. http://music.yahoo.com/unlimited/ Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15575	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 10/9/2005
Subject: Re: Water cloudy white.

Hi Eric. I recently had the exact thing happen. Added a 6 inch pleco to an established tank and a couple days later cloudy white water. Been doing water changes off and on for a week and a half. Just now the water is starting to clear up a bit. Mike In a message dated 10/9/2005 4:06:47 PM Pacific Daylight Time, woad@... writes: You tank may not have been fully cycled or something disrupted it. While plecos do add considerable bioload...it shouldn't have caused a bloom in itself. I would leave it alone and let things balance out. The bacterial or algal blooms won;t harm your fish. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Beth Brownell Sent: Sunday, October 09, 2005 5:52 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Water cloudy white. I added a pleco to the tank on the seventh and the water had started to go cloudy white on me that morning. I am planning on doing a water change to see if that will help, everything seems to be fine in the 30 gallon tank beyond the cloudiness of the water. Is this a bacterial bloom or something else? Thanks, Beth Brownell [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15576	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 10/9/2005
Subject: Re: Water cloudy white.

Beth, If this is a regular water change, go ahead and do it. However, if you are changing the water merely because of this bacterial bloom--stop. Let it be. This is just something you need to ride out. So long as your water parameters are in line--0 ammonia, 0 nitrites, less than 100 nitrate, you'll just need to ride this out. If the water does not check out, write back, giving us that information, plus more about your tank--size, number and kinds of fish and their sizes, pH water temp, filtration, and whatever you can think of, and we'll start trying to sort this out for you. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Beth Brownell Sent: Sunday, October 09, 2005 6:52 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Water cloudy white. I added a pleco to the tank on the seventh and the water had started to go cloudy white on me that morning. I am planning on doing a water change to see if that will help, everything seems to be fine in the 30 gallon tank beyond the cloudiness of the water. Is this a bacterial bloom or something else? Thanks, Beth Brownell __________________________________ Yahoo! Music Unlimited Access over 1 million songs. Try it free. http://music.yahoo.com/unlimited/ Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15577	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 10/9/2005
Subject: Re: this is so cool does anyone have one

Ray, Someone is making them or has made them not too long ago in acrylic. I tried to get one on ebay but got outbid on it. Mike In a message dated 10/9/2005 9:25:56 AM Pacific Daylight Time, sevenspringss@... writes: Hi Shannon, They used to make one-piece glass goldfish bowls years ago with a hollow loop on top from one side to the other that would hold water -- same idea -- don't know if fish ever used the loop though. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15578	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 10/9/2005
Subject: Re: Water cloudy white.

I can see a full grown, or at least large one, doing it and they do poop allot. Most of the ones you get in the store are smaller plecos. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Deenerz@... Sent: Sunday, October 09, 2005 6:27 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Water cloudy white. Hi Eric. I recently had the exact thing happen. Added a 6 inch pleco to an established tank and a couple days later cloudy white water. Been doing water changes off and on for a week and a half. Just now the water is starting to clear up a bit. Mike In a message dated 10/9/2005 4:06:47 PM Pacific Daylight Time, woad@... writes: You tank may not have been fully cycled or something disrupted it. While plecos do add considerable bioload...it shouldn't have caused a bloom in itself. I would leave it alone and let things balance out. The bacterial or algal blooms won;t harm your fish. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Beth Brownell Sent: Sunday, October 09, 2005 5:52 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Water cloudy white. I added a pleco to the tank on the seventh and the water had started to go cloudy white on me that morning. I am planning on doing a water change to see if that will help, everything seems to be fine in the 30 gallon tank beyond the cloudiness of the water. Is this a bacterial bloom or something else? Thanks, Beth Brownell [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15579	From: Thomas Schlemmermeyer	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: William Thorton Innes

I would like to get some infos on a typical aquarium personality: William Thorton Innes For the announced essay, I started to write, I would appreciate it very much, if you ´d comment on Innes´s most famous writings, notably the magazine "The aquarium" (1914), "Goldfish varieties and Tropical Fishes" (1917), "Exotic Aquarium Fishes" (when was that published?). It would be particularly nice if you´d upload excerpts or partial scans of these opera to the files section. I would like to know what aspects of Innes´s work are still relevant, and what aspects may sound rather bizarre from a modern standpoint. I would also like to know how the 24 degrees Celsius ideology (I forgot the original Fahrenheit value) came up, and how it came about that tank enthusiasts started to mount mixed aquarium communities with fishes from widely distanced geographical regions (ideologically speaking this seems to be a remake of the American melting pot society?) best wishes, Thomas

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15580	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: Re: Water cloudy white.

1. It's an angelfish tank with one pleco. 2. Temp is about 82 to 84 degrees. trying to get it lower or is this a good temp for it. The heater is set at 76 degrees. 3. Everything is in normal range. Beth Brownell --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > > Beth, > > If this is a regular water change, go ahead and do it. However, if you are changing the water merely because of this bacterial bloom-- stop. Let it be. This is just something you need to ride out. So long as your water parameters are in line--0 ammonia, 0 nitrites, less than 100 nitrate, you'll just need to ride this out. If the water does not check out, write back, giving us that information, plus more about your tank-- size, number and kinds of fish and their sizes, pH water temp, filtration, and whatever you can think of, and we'll start trying to sort this out for you. > > \\Steve// > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Beth Brownell > Sent: Sunday, October 09, 2005 6:52 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Water cloudy white. > > I added a pleco to the tank on the seventh and the water had > started to go cloudy white on me that morning. > > I am planning on doing a water change to see if that will help, > everything seems to be fine in the 30 gallon tank beyond the > cloudiness of the water. > > Is this a bacterial bloom or something else? > > Thanks, > Beth Brownell

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15581	From: supamii	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: Re: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning

That seems like a lot of water change... I personally do about a 25% every two or so weeks since I have a planted tank (the water is expected to be more clean). Plus I don't want to throw out all the healthy bacteria in the aquarium (the ones that break down ammonia and nitrites). Spam. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "deborahgd14" <deborahgd14@y...> wrote: > > I do 50 to 75 per cent water changes once a week and that works for > me. > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, agentscullyeyore@a... wrote: > > > > well i have a heavily stocked 20 gallon and do about a 40% water > change > > cleaning all the gravel each time i used to do this water change > about once a > > week now since my system seems so stable as it went 2 months this > summer > > without being touched i have backed off to about every nearly 2 > weeks... this being > > only cause i am so busy and i monitor it very well... since what > your doing > > seems to work for you i would keep it up.. everyone does things > different > > finding what works for them... Shannon > > > > I have been on this board for awhile and always forget to ask > this > > question. When it comes to Gravel cleaning.. so many sources say > > differet thing.. I have a 15 gl tank pretty well stocked... some > may > > say over stocked, but the level are fine and I have never had > any > > serious issues. I do the tpical 25% water change weekly and clean > the > > gravel about once a month... never cleaning the whole thing at > oncce. > > One half one time & the other half the other. Is this correct? > also > > Filter changes... I change the filter as needed about 1 a month.. > and > > rinse it out with the water from the "water change" in between. > Is this > > too often? thx - Terry > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15582	From: supamii	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: how big does it really get?

I've seen various information about the popular Angel Fish and was wondering if it really got to be 7 inches long?? I'm assuming this a measurement based on Angels in the wild? Does anyone have or have seen a HUUUUGE angel fish?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15583	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: Re: how big does it really get?

I have seen some larger ones at the Shedd Aquarium. We have a pair that are about 5 or 6 inches long from tip of tail to snout. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of supamii Sent: Monday, October 10, 2005 1:00 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] how big does it really get? I've seen various information about the popular Angel Fish and was wondering if it really got to be 7 inches long?? I'm assuming this a measurement based on Angels in the wild? Does anyone have or have seen a HUUUUGE angel fish? Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Mar ine+fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=sWozU8RAgM2g66Yb_7h_nQ> biology Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine +fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=JB6FNOraRx3JIvMA1E4-Lw> fish Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine+fis h&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=R-HUKyhqLGfm-ZAFT2vuTQ> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15584	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: Re: William Thorton Innes

You may want to check out the Aquarium Hobby History Society list on Yahoo! Groups. Some of the people there actually knew and worked with Innes. _Exotic Aquarium Fishes_ continued to be published after Innes's death with another one or two editions. Probably the most popular edition is the 19th Edition, Revised. It is a good book, even today, though somewhat dated due t changes in scientific names of the fish and plants named in the book. I believe that the first edition was published in 1935. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Thomas Schlemmermeyer Sent: Monday, October 10, 2005 10:06 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] William Thorton Innes I would like to get some infos on a typical aquarium personality: William Thorton Innes For the announced essay, I started to write, I would appreciate it very much, if you ´d comment on Innes´s most famous writings, notably the magazine "The aquarium" (1914), "Goldfish varieties and Tropical Fishes" (1917), "Exotic Aquarium Fishes" (when was that published?). It would be particularly nice if you´d upload excerpts or partial scans of these opera to the files section. I would like to know what aspects of Innes´s work are still relevant, and what aspects may sound rather bizarre from a modern standpoint. I would also like to know how the 24 degrees Celsius ideology (I forgot the original Fahrenheit value) came up, and how it came about that tank enthusiasts started to mount mixed aquarium communities with fishes from widely distanced geographical regions (ideologically speaking this seems to be a remake of the American melting pot society?) best wishes, Thomas Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15585	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: Re: Water cloudy white.

Beth, 1. How many angels, and how large are they? What size is the tank? How large is the pleco? 2. Don't rely on the heater setting, rely on the thermometer. Do bring down the temperature, probably 76-78^o F would be fine for your angels. 3. What do you consider to be normal? That really does not tell us anything. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Beth Brownell Sent: Monday, October 10, 2005 12:06 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Water cloudy white. 1. It's an angelfish tank with one pleco. 2. Temp is about 82 to 84 degrees. trying to get it lower or is this a good temp for it. The heater is set at 76 degrees. 3. Everything is in normal range. Beth Brownell --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > > Beth, > > If this is a regular water change, go ahead and do it. However, if you are changing the water merely because of this bacterial bloom-- stop. Let it be. This is just something you need to ride out. So long as your water parameters are in line--0 ammonia, 0 nitrites, less than 100 nitrate, you'll just need to ride this out. If the water does not check out, write back, giving us that information, plus more about your tank-- size, number and kinds of fish and their sizes, pH water temp, filtration, and whatever you can think of, and we'll start trying to sort this out for you. > > \\Steve// > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Beth Brownell > Sent: Sunday, October 09, 2005 6:52 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Water cloudy white. > > I added a pleco to the tank on the seventh and the water had > started to go cloudy white on me that morning. > > I am planning on doing a water change to see if that will help, > everything seems to be fine in the 30 gallon tank beyond the > cloudiness of the water. > > Is this a bacterial bloom or something else? > > Thanks, > Beth Brownell

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15586	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: Re: how big does it really get?

I have, but not for a long time. I've seen them at about 8" SL with a tip of the dorsal to the tip of the anal of about 12 inches. Since the angelfish plague back in the 80"s, though, I've not seen them as large--no where near as large. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of supamii Sent: Monday, October 10, 2005 2:00 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] how big does it really get? I've seen various information about the popular Angel Fish and was wondering if it really got to be 7 inches long?? I'm assuming this a measurement based on Angels in the wild? Does anyone have or have seen a HUUUUGE angel fish? Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15587	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: Re: William Thorton Innes

Thomas, Dr. William T. Innes' "The Aquarium" magazine did not start until May 1932 (not 1914). His book "Exotic Aquarium Fishes" was indicated to be imminently released since January 1935 and was promised to be available for April 1935, however, it was not advertised (in "The Aquarium" magazine) as being available until June (July '35 issue) of that year. There have been 19 subsequent editions published by Innes (The Aquarium Publishing Company), the last one put out in 1964. Several revised 19th editions had since been put out by Aquariums Incorporated (Metaframe Corp./"The Aquarium") and I believe also by TFH/Herbert Axelrod, both with different editors than the originals. "Goldfish Varieties and Tropical Fishes" (1st edition -- 1917) also had numerous subsequent editions as did Innes' similar book "Goldfish Varieties and Water Gardens" and his 64 page booklet "The Modern Aquarium". He also came out with a book entitled "Aquarium Highlights" around 1950 which was a compilation of best articles from "The Aquarium" magazine going back to and including material from the first issue, on. His "Exotic Aquarium Fishes" was known as the "bible" of the aquarium hobby and with exception of a relatively few name changes, is in one way much like Shakespear's works, having universality of appeal and is still very much relevant to the hobby today having most of the basics needed for aquarium maintenance plus a wealth of information on most of the still popular aquarium fishes we are familiar with including color plates of most. Having read all of Innes' works in my library, I can't say there is anything that sounds bizarre which he wrote, even by today's standards; everything he wrote about aquariums and fish were factually down to earth and is as pertinent today as it will be 50 years from now. While he wrote many articles and of course all the "Editor's Letters" in "The Aquarium" magazine issues, there were many contributors to the magazine as well. Most of these other authors were nothing but the best world famous aquarists of the times and wrote just as reliably and with much knowledge. So again, while of course not being able to remember everything I read which was written in all the many volumns of that magazine since 1932, I can't remember anything in the magazine as a whole which I can say was/is bizzare. There are of course many fish (in many Families) available today which were not covered by Innes, but only because they were more recently discovered, which would included many of the Rift Lake Cichlids and some newer Tetras and Killies, etc., still being discovered today. Lots of luck on your essay -- great topic -- wish you well with it. Best Regards, Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Thomas Schlemmermeyer" <evolthomas@y...> wrote: > > > I would like to get some infos on a typical aquarium personality: > William Thorton Innes > > For the announced essay, I started to write, I would appreciate it > very much, if you ´d comment on Innes´s most famous writings, notably > the magazine "The aquarium" (1914), "Goldfish varieties and Tropical > Fishes" (1917), "Exotic Aquarium Fishes" (when was that published?). > > It would be particularly nice if you´d upload excerpts or partial > scans of these opera to the files section. > > I would like to know what aspects of Innes´s work are still relevant, > and what aspects may sound rather bizarre from a modern standpoint. > > I would also like to know how the 24 degrees Celsius ideology (I > forgot the original Fahrenheit value) came up, and how it came about > that tank enthusiasts started to mount mixed aquarium communities > with fishes from widely distanced geographical regions (ideologically > speaking this seems to be a remake of the American melting pot > society?) > > best wishes, Thomas >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15589	From: Jeremy Carter	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: unsubscribe

unsubscribe --------------------------------- Yahoo! Music Unlimited - Access over 1 million songs. Try it free. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15590	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: Re: unsubscribe

Jeremy, You can't do that by posting to the group. Send it instead to AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com K? Leslie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Jeremy Carter Sent: Monday, October 10, 2005 3:43 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife]unsubscribe unsubscribe

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15591	From: supamii	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: Re: how big does it really get?

The motive behind my inquiry is due to the fact that I currently have a lovely angel that is at a modest 2.5 inches housed in a puny 15 gal. tank/aquarium. I have heard about how fishes grow accordingly to the size of their environment, but even so, if it doubled in size I fear it would terrorize the smaller fishes. What are your ideas about my situation? Are your 5-6 inch angels in a larger tank? Say, 30+ gallons (120L)? --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > > I have seen some larger ones at the Shedd Aquarium. We have a pair that are > about 5 or 6 inches long from tip of tail to snout. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of supamii > Sent: Monday, October 10, 2005 1:00 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] how big does it really get? > > > I've seen various information about the popular Angel Fish and was > wondering if it really got to be 7 inches long?? I'm assuming this a > measurement based on Angels in the wild? Does anyone have or have > seen a HUUUUGE angel fish? > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Mar > ine+fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=sWozU8RAgM2g66Yb_7h_nQ> biology > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine > +fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=JB6FNOraRx3JIvMA1E4-Lw> fish Biology > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine+fis > h&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=R-HUKyhqLGfm-ZAFT2vuTQ> > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15592	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: Re: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning

Spam, Might be that you are not changing enough water as frequently as you should, planted tank or not. While plants do definitely help in keeping the water parameters more towards the fishes' liking, you can't just rely on them as "expecting the water to be more clean". It is generally recommended to change on the average of 33% every week. This of course depends on a lot of variables such as your fish load, your filtration, etc. While the water column does support a fair colony of beneficial bacteria, most of these critters are found growing on the interior surfaces of your aquarium (glass, gravel, etc.) and are especially much more numerous in oxygen enriched environments such as your filter, with water constantly flowing past them or on the bio-wheels where the thin film of water is directly exposed to the atmosphere. There is little need to be reluctant to throw out whatever good bacteria is present in the water itself. That will grow back in short time. I generally change out larger amounts of water with healthy results noted in my fish. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "supamii" <supamii@y...> wrote: > > That seems like a lot of water change... I personally do about a 25% > every two or so weeks since I have a planted tank (the water is > expected to be more clean). Plus I don't want to throw out all the > healthy bacteria in the aquarium (the ones that break down ammonia and > nitrites). > > Spam. > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "deborahgd14" <deborahgd14@y...> > wrote: > > > > I do 50 to 75 per cent water changes once a week and that works for > > me. > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, agentscullyeyore@a... wrote: > > > > > > well i have a heavily stocked 20 gallon and do about a 40% water > > change > > > cleaning all the gravel each time i used to do this water change > > about once a > > > week now since my system seems so stable as it went 2 months this > > summer > > > without being touched i have backed off to about every nearly 2 > > weeks... this being > > > only cause i am so busy and i monitor it very well... since what > > your doing > > > seems to work for you i would keep it up.. everyone does things > > different > > > finding what works for them... Shannon > > > > > > I have been on this board for awhile and always forget to ask > > this > > > question. When it comes to Gravel cleaning.. so many sources say > > > differet thing.. I have a 15 gl tank pretty well stocked... some > > may > > > say over stocked, but the level are fine and I have never had > > any > > > serious issues. I do the tpical 25% water change weekly and clean > > the > > > gravel about once a month... never cleaning the whole thing at > > oncce. > > > One half one time & the other half the other. Is this correct? > > also > > > Filter changes... I change the filter as needed about 1 a month.. > > and > > > rinse it out with the water from the "water change" in between. > > Is this > > > too often? thx - Terry > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15593	From: supamii	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: Re: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning

Thanks for the clarification Ray. I am also in the process of switching tanks and am reluctant to immediately transfer the gravel to the newer tank since I had the INFAMOUS bearded/hair algae. (My algae wasn't green like most of the material I've read but I definately has to be the same algae.) I dipped my plants in a >5% bleach solution and sterilized my driftwood (via boiling for an hour) as well as other misc stuff. I've left those items in the new tank with the filter running. I'm very much paranoid about introducing the bearded algae SPORES to my new tank. Do I need to be worried? If so how can I transfer my gravel to the new tank safely? --Since I've also heard that using gravel from an already established tank is a great way to speed up the cycling process. Thanks anyone who can help! Spam. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > Spam, Might be that you are not changing enough water as frequently > as you should, planted tank or not. While plants do definitely help > in keeping the water parameters more towards the fishes' liking, you > can't just rely on them as "expecting the water to be more clean". > It is generally recommended to change on the average of 33% every > week. This of course depends on a lot of variables such as your fish > load, your filtration, etc. While the water column does support a > fair colony of beneficial bacteria, most of these critters are found > growing on the interior surfaces of your aquarium (glass, gravel, > etc.) and are especially much more numerous in oxygen enriched > environments such as your filter, with water constantly flowing past > them or on the bio-wheels where the thin film of water is directly > exposed to the atmosphere. There is little need to be reluctant to > throw out whatever good bacteria is present in the water itself. > That will grow back in short time. I generally change out larger > amounts of water with healthy results noted in my fish. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "supamii" <supamii@y...> wrote: > > > > That seems like a lot of water change... I personally do about a 25% > > every two or so weeks since I have a planted tank (the water is > > expected to be more clean). Plus I don't want to throw out all the > > healthy bacteria in the aquarium (the ones that break down ammonia > and > > nitrites). > > > > Spam. > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "deborahgd14" <deborahgd14@y...> > > wrote: > > > > > > I do 50 to 75 per cent water changes once a week and that works > for > > > me. > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, agentscullyeyore@a... wrote: > > > > > > > > well i have a heavily stocked 20 gallon and do about a 40% > water > > > change > > > > cleaning all the gravel each time i used to do this water > change > > > about once a > > > > week now since my system seems so stable as it went 2 months > this > > > summer > > > > without being touched i have backed off to about every nearly 2 > > > weeks... this being > > > > only cause i am so busy and i monitor it very well... since > what > > > your doing > > > > seems to work for you i would keep it up.. everyone does things > > > different > > > > finding what works for them... Shannon > > > > > > > > I have been on this board for awhile and always forget to ask > > > this > > > > question. When it comes to Gravel cleaning.. so many sources > say > > > > differet thing.. I have a 15 gl tank pretty well stocked... > some > > > may > > > > say over stocked, but the level are fine and I have never had > > > any > > > > serious issues. I do the tpical 25% water change weekly and > clean > > > the > > > > gravel about once a month... never cleaning the whole thing at > > > oncce. > > > > One half one time & the other half the other. Is this > correct? > > > also > > > > Filter changes... I change the filter as needed about 1 a > month.. > > > and > > > > rinse it out with the water from the "water change" in > between. > > > Is this > > > > too often? thx - Terry > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15594	From: supamii	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: Re: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning

Thanks for the clarification Ray. I am also in the process of switching tanks and am reluctant to immediately transfer the gravel to the newer tank since I had the INFAMOUS bearded/hair algae. (My algae wasn't green like most of the material I've read but I definately has to be the same algae.) I dipped my plants in a >5% bleach solution and sterilized my driftwood (via boiling for an hour) as well as other misc stuff. I've left those items in the new tank with the filter running. I'm very much paranoid about introducing the bearded algae SPORES to my new tank. Do I need to be worried? If so how can I transfer my gravel to the new tank safely? --Since I've also heard that using gravel from an already established tank is a great way to speed up the cycling process. Thanks anyone who can help! Spam. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > Spam, Might be that you are not changing enough water as frequently > as you should, planted tank or not. While plants do definitely help > in keeping the water parameters more towards the fishes' liking, you > can't just rely on them as "expecting the water to be more clean". > It is generally recommended to change on the average of 33% every > week. This of course depends on a lot of variables such as your fish > load, your filtration, etc. While the water column does support a > fair colony of beneficial bacteria, most of these critters are found > growing on the interior surfaces of your aquarium (glass, gravel, > etc.) and are especially much more numerous in oxygen enriched > environments such as your filter, with water constantly flowing past > them or on the bio-wheels where the thin film of water is directly > exposed to the atmosphere. There is little need to be reluctant to > throw out whatever good bacteria is present in the water itself. > That will grow back in short time. I generally change out larger > amounts of water with healthy results noted in my fish. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "supamii" <supamii@y...> wrote: > > > > That seems like a lot of water change... I personally do about a 25% > > every two or so weeks since I have a planted tank (the water is > > expected to be more clean). Plus I don't want to throw out all the > > healthy bacteria in the aquarium (the ones that break down ammonia > and > > nitrites). > > > > Spam. > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "deborahgd14" <deborahgd14@y...> > > wrote: > > > > > > I do 50 to 75 per cent water changes once a week and that works > for > > > me. > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, agentscullyeyore@a... wrote: > > > > > > > > well i have a heavily stocked 20 gallon and do about a 40% > water > > > change > > > > cleaning all the gravel each time i used to do this water > change > > > about once a > > > > week now since my system seems so stable as it went 2 months > this > > > summer > > > > without being touched i have backed off to about every nearly 2 > > > weeks... this being > > > > only cause i am so busy and i monitor it very well... since > what > > > your doing > > > > seems to work for you i would keep it up.. everyone does things > > > different > > > > finding what works for them... Shannon > > > > > > > > I have been on this board for awhile and always forget to ask > > > this > > > > question. When it comes to Gravel cleaning.. so many sources > say > > > > differet thing.. I have a 15 gl tank pretty well stocked... > some > > > may > > > > say over stocked, but the level are fine and I have never had > > > any > > > > serious issues. I do the tpical 25% water change weekly and > clean > > > the > > > > gravel about once a month... never cleaning the whole thing at > > > oncce. > > > > One half one time & the other half the other. Is this > correct? > > > also > > > > Filter changes... I change the filter as needed about 1 a > month.. > > > and > > > > rinse it out with the water from the "water change" in > between. > > > Is this > > > > too often? thx - Terry > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15595	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: Re: Water cloudy white.

1. In my 30 gallon tank there is ten angels, about the size of a quarter. The pleco is two inches long. I might remove two or three of the angels to my 55 gallon tank when they get bigger. 2. Would ice work to cool the temp down? as the thermometer states 82f right now. 3. Will have to retest it since I didn't mark down the results. But it was a pale color. 4. My 55 gallon tank about a week after I filled it with water, it went cloudy white and a week later it was clear. My mother who watches my 30 gallon tank is worried about the angels that the cloudy water is not good for them. But I explained to her that it is a good thing. Beth --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > Beth, > > 1. How many angels, and how large are they? What size is the tank? > How large is the pleco? > > 2. Don't rely on the heater setting, rely on the thermometer. Do > bring down the temperature, probably 76-78^o F would be fine for > your angels. > > 3. What do you consider to be normal? That really does not tell us > anything. > > \\Steve// > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Beth Brownell > Sent: Monday, October 10, 2005 12:06 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Water cloudy white. > > 1. It's an angelfish tank with one pleco. > 2. Temp is about 82 to 84 degrees. trying to get it lower or is > this a good temp for it. The heater is set at 76 degrees. > 3. Everything is in normal range. > > Beth Brownell > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > > > > Beth, > > > > If this is a regular water change, go ahead and do it. However, if > you are changing the water merely because of this bacterial bloom-- > stop. Let it be. > This is just something you need to ride out. So long as your water > parameters are in line--0 ammonia, 0 nitrites, less than 100 nitrate, > you'll just need to ride this out. If the water does not check out, > write back, giving us that information, plus more about your tank-- > size, number and kinds of fish and their sizes, pH water temp, > filtration, and whatever you can think of, and we'll start trying to > sort this out for you. > > > > \\Steve//

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15596	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: Re: how big does it really get?

From what I am told, that is not correct. They will grow to full size in a 10 gallon tank or a 100 gallon tank. A larger tank would be better for them as they can swim around unhindered. My angels were originally in a 55 gallon tank, but are now in a 30 gallon tank. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of supamii Sent: Monday, October 10, 2005 4:18 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: how big does it really get? The motive behind my inquiry is due to the fact that I currently have a lovely angel that is at a modest 2.5 inches housed in a puny 15 gal. tank/aquarium. I have heard about how fishes grow accordingly to the size of their environment, but even so, if it doubled in size I fear it would terrorize the smaller fishes. What are your ideas about my situation? Are your 5-6 inch angels in a larger tank? Say, 30+ gallons (120L)? --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > > I have seen some larger ones at the Shedd Aquarium. We have a pair that are > about 5 or 6 inches long from tip of tail to snout. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of supamii > Sent: Monday, October 10, 2005 1:00 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] how big does it really get? > > > I've seen various information about the popular Angel Fish and was > wondering if it really got to be 7 inches long?? I'm assuming this a > measurement based on Angels in the wild? Does anyone have or have > seen a HUUUUGE angel fish? > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Mar > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Mar > ine+fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=sWozU8RAgM2g66Yb_7h_nQ> biology > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine > &k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine > +fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=JB6FNOraRx3JIvMA1E4-Lw> fish Biology > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine+fis > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine+fis > h&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=R-HUKyhqLGfm-ZAFT2vuTQ> > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Mar ine+fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=sWozU8RAgM2g66Yb_7h_nQ> biology Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine +fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=JB6FNOraRx3JIvMA1E4-Lw> fish Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine+fis h&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=R-HUKyhqLGfm-ZAFT2vuTQ> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15597	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: Re: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning

get fish that eat it and you won;t have a problem. I actually encourage algae while having fish that eat it to balance it out so it doesn't get out of control. I do the same with snails. If you want to help speed the cycle, get some biozyme or biospira. Biospira is frozen (but not dead) bacteria that will jump start the cycling. Biozyme is a dried version Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of supamii Sent: Monday, October 10, 2005 4:53 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning Thanks for the clarification Ray. I am also in the process of switching tanks and am reluctant to immediately transfer the gravel to the newer tank since I had the INFAMOUS bearded/hair algae. (My algae wasn't green like most of the material I've read but I definately has to be the same algae.) I dipped my plants in a >5% bleach solution and sterilized my driftwood (via boiling for an hour) as well as other misc stuff. I've left those items in the new tank with the filter running. I'm very much paranoid about introducing the bearded algae SPORES to my new tank. Do I need to be worried? If so how can I transfer my gravel to the new tank safely? --Since I've also heard that using gravel from an already established tank is a great way to speed up the cycling process. Thanks anyone who can help! Spam. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > Spam, Might be that you are not changing enough water as frequently > as you should, planted tank or not. While plants do definitely help > in keeping the water parameters more towards the fishes' liking, you > can't just rely on them as "expecting the water to be more clean". > It is generally recommended to change on the average of 33% every > week. This of course depends on a lot of variables such as your fish > load, your filtration, etc. While the water column does support a > fair colony of beneficial bacteria, most of these critters are found > growing on the interior surfaces of your aquarium (glass, gravel, > etc.) and are especially much more numerous in oxygen enriched > environments such as your filter, with water constantly flowing past > them or on the bio-wheels where the thin film of water is directly > exposed to the atmosphere. There is little need to be reluctant to > throw out whatever good bacteria is present in the water itself. > That will grow back in short time. I generally change out larger > amounts of water with healthy results noted in my fish. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "supamii" <supamii@y...> wrote: > > > > That seems like a lot of water change... I personally do about a 25% > > every two or so weeks since I have a planted tank (the water is > > expected to be more clean). Plus I don't want to throw out all the > > healthy bacteria in the aquarium (the ones that break down ammonia > and > > nitrites). > > > > Spam. > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "deborahgd14" <deborahgd14@y...> > > wrote: > > > > > > I do 50 to 75 per cent water changes once a week and that works > for > > > me. > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, agentscullyeyore@a... wrote: > > > > > > > > well i have a heavily stocked 20 gallon and do about a 40% > water > > > change > > > > cleaning all the gravel each time i used to do this water > change > > > about once a > > > > week now since my system seems so stable as it went 2 months > this > > > summer > > > > without being touched i have backed off to about every nearly 2 > > > weeks... this being > > > > only cause i am so busy and i monitor it very well... since > what > > > your doing > > > > seems to work for you i would keep it up.. everyone does things > > > different > > > > finding what works for them... Shannon > > > > > > > > I have been on this board for awhile and always forget to ask > > > this > > > > question. When it comes to Gravel cleaning.. so many sources > say > > > > differet thing.. I have a 15 gl tank pretty well stocked... > some > > > may > > > > say over stocked, but the level are fine and I have never had > > > any > > > > serious issues. I do the tpical 25% water change weekly and > clean > > > the > > > > gravel about once a month... never cleaning the whole thing at > > > oncce. > > > > One half one time & the other half the other. Is this > correct? > > > also > > > > Filter changes... I change the filter as needed about 1 a > month.. > > > and > > > > rinse it out with the water from the "water change" in > between. > > > Is this > > > > too often? thx - Terry > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Mar ine+fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=sWozU8RAgM2g66Yb_7h_nQ> biology Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine +fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=JB6FNOraRx3JIvMA1E4-Lw> fish Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine+fis h&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=R-HUKyhqLGfm-ZAFT2vuTQ> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15598	From: supamii	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: Re: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning

I'm quite alright with any kind of algae that my small pleco eats... which is practically anything except for the bearded/hair algae. I think I've read about the rare saimese algae eater being effective with that type of algae. Have you had success in purchasing a fish that eats bearded/hair algae? --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > > get fish that eat it and you won;t have a problem. I actually encourage > algae while having fish that eat it to balance it out so it doesn't get out > of control. I do the same with snails. If you want to help speed the > cycle, get some biozyme or biospira. Biospira is frozen (but not dead) > bacteria that will jump start the cycling. Biozyme is a dried version > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of supamii > Sent: Monday, October 10, 2005 4:53 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning > > > Thanks for the clarification Ray. > > I am also in the process of switching tanks and am reluctant to > immediately transfer the gravel to the newer tank since I had the > INFAMOUS bearded/hair algae. (My algae wasn't green like most of the > material I've read but I definately has to be the same algae.) I > dipped my plants in a >5% bleach solution and sterilized my driftwood > (via boiling for an hour) as well as other misc stuff. I've left > those items in the new tank with the filter running. > > I'm very much paranoid about introducing the bearded algae SPORES to > my new tank. Do I need to be worried? If so how can I transfer my > gravel to the new tank safely? --Since I've also heard that using > gravel from an already established tank is a great way to speed up the > cycling process. Thanks anyone who can help! > > Spam. > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> > wrote: > > > > Spam, Might be that you are not changing enough water as frequently > > as you should, planted tank or not. While plants do definitely help > > in keeping the water parameters more towards the fishes' liking, you > > can't just rely on them as "expecting the water to be more clean". > > It is generally recommended to change on the average of 33% every > > week. This of course depends on a lot of variables such as your fish > > load, your filtration, etc. While the water column does support a > > fair colony of beneficial bacteria, most of these critters are found > > growing on the interior surfaces of your aquarium (glass, gravel, > > etc.) and are especially much more numerous in oxygen enriched > > environments such as your filter, with water constantly flowing past > > them or on the bio-wheels where the thin film of water is directly > > exposed to the atmosphere. There is little need to be reluctant to > > throw out whatever good bacteria is present in the water itself. > > That will grow back in short time. I generally change out larger > > amounts of water with healthy results noted in my fish. Ray > > \ > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "supamii" <supamii@y...> wrote: > > > > > > That seems like a lot of water change... I personally do about a 25% > > > every two or so weeks since I have a planted tank (the water is > > > expected to be more clean). Plus I don't want to throw out all the > > > healthy bacteria in the aquarium (the ones that break down ammonia > > and > > > nitrites). > > > > > > Spam. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "deborahgd14" <deborahgd14@y...> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > I do 50 to 75 per cent water changes once a week and that works > > for > > > > me. > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, agentscullyeyore@a... wrote: > > > > > > > > > > well i have a heavily stocked 20 gallon and do about a 40% > > water > > > > change > > > > > cleaning all the gravel each time i used to do this water > > change > > > > about once a > > > > > week now since my system seems so stable as it went 2 months > > this > > > > summer > > > > > without being touched i have backed off to about every nearly 2 > > > > weeks... this being > > > > > only cause i am so busy and i monitor it very well... since > > what > > > > your doing > > > > > seems to work for you i would keep it up.. everyone does things > > > > different > > > > > finding what works for them... Shannon > > > > > > > > > > I have been on this board for awhile and always forget to ask > > > > this > > > > > question. When it comes to Gravel cleaning.. so many sources > > say > > > > > differet thing.. I have a 15 gl tank pretty well stocked... > > some > > > > may > > > > > say over stocked, but the level are fine and I have never had > > > > any > > > > > serious issues. I do the tpical 25% water change weekly and > > clean > > > > the > > > > > gravel about once a month... never cleaning the whole thing at > > > > oncce. > > > > > One half one time & the other half the other. Is this > > correct? > > > > also > > > > > Filter changes... I change the filter as needed about 1 a > > month.. > > > > and > > > > > rinse it out with the water from the "water change" in > > between. > > > > Is this > > > > > too often? thx - Terry > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Mar > ine+fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=sWozU8RAgM2g66Yb_7h_nQ> biology > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine > +fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=JB6FNOraRx3JIvMA1E4-Lw> fish Biology > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine+fis > h&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=R-HUKyhqLGfm-ZAFT2vuTQ> > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15599	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: Re: how big does it really get?

The notion that a fish will grow to the size of its environment is pretty much a fallacy, though there is some truth behind it. Fish will release a hormone that will stunt the growth of others, as well as themselves. This is one of the reasons one should do regular water changes--to remove the hormones and other excretions from your fish from the environment they are in. Size also requires a proper diet. Without the protein, etc. they need to grow, they will not grow, or to grow poorly. A 30 would be a good size to get your angels on the road to growth. For them to get good fin development, be sure you have a deep tank. They need the depth for good dorsal and anal fin development, so look for a 30 tall to give that height, not the normal 30 gallon tank. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of supamii Sent: Monday, October 10, 2005 5:18 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: how big does it really get? The motive behind my inquiry is due to the fact that I currently have a lovely angel that is at a modest 2.5 inches housed in a puny 15 gal. tank/aquarium. I have heard about how fishes grow accordingly to the size of their environment, but even so, if it doubled in size I fear it would terrorize the smaller fishes. What are your ideas about my situation? Are your 5-6 inch angels in a larger tank? Say, 30+ gallons (120L)? --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > > I have seen some larger ones at the Shedd Aquarium. We have a pair that are > about 5 or 6 inches long from tip of tail to snout. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of supamii > Sent: Monday, October 10, 2005 1:00 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] how big does it really get? > > > I've seen various information about the popular Angel Fish and was > wondering if it really got to be 7 inches long?? I'm assuming this a > measurement based on Angels in the wild? Does anyone have or have > seen a HUUUUGE angel fish? >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15600	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: Re: Water cloudy white.

Beth, 1. You are probably OK with that load, but you are probably feeding heavily to get some growth on those angels. The addition of the pleco may have been enough to upset the balance you had reached, especially if it is eating well also. 2. I probably should have asked you what your ambient (room) temperature was. Around here, it can vary quite radically, with hot days and cool nights and with this set of foster dogs running around, the back door is wide open quite a bit helping the fluctuation. Normally, I try to keep it at about 72^o F. If the room temperature is high, your tank water temperature will at least match it. It does take some time, however for the water to change temperature, either up or down. It may take a day or more for the tank to drop a degree if the ambient temperature is close to the temperature of the water. It may fall faster if there is a greater difference, with the room being cooler. While you are turning down the heater, so it slowly, and allow your temperature to stabilize before dropping it down again. 4. Water becoming cloudy in a new tank is quite common. For it to happen in an established tank is not so common, but not unknown, especially if changes have been made. This cloudiness will pass also. We just need to be a bit more careful now that there are fish in the tank to ensure we do not make any drastic changes which may either prolong the cloudiness or harm the current tank residents. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Beth Brownell Sent: Monday, October 10, 2005 7:45 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Water cloudy white. 1. In my 30 gallon tank there is ten angels, about the size of a quarter. The pleco is two inches long. I might remove two or three of the angels to my 55 gallon tank when they get bigger. 2. Would ice work to cool the temp down? as the thermometer states 82f right now. 3. Will have to retest it since I didn't mark down the results. But it was a pale color. 4. My 55 gallon tank about a week after I filled it with water, it went cloudy white and a week later it was clear. My mother who watches my 30 gallon tank is worried about the angels that the cloudy water is not good for them. But I explained to her that it is a good thing. Beth --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > Beth, > > 1. How many angels, and how large are they? What size is the tank? > How large is the pleco? > > 2. Don't rely on the heater setting, rely on the thermometer. Do > bring down the temperature, probably 76-78^o F would be fine for > your angels. > > 3. What do you consider to be normal? That really does not tell us > anything. > > \\Steve// > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Beth Brownell > Sent: Monday, October 10, 2005 12:06 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Water cloudy white. > > 1. It's an angelfish tank with one pleco. > 2. Temp is about 82 to 84 degrees. trying to get it lower or is > this a good temp for it. The heater is set at 76 degrees. > 3. Everything is in normal range. > > Beth Brownell > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > > > > Beth, > > > > If this is a regular water change, go ahead and do it. However, if > you are changing the water merely because of this bacterial bloom-- > stop. Let it be. > This is just something you need to ride out. So long as your water > parameters are in line--0 ammonia, 0 nitrites, less than 100 nitrate, > you'll just need to ride this out. If the water does not check out, > write back, giving us that information, plus more about your tank-- > size, number and kinds of fish and their sizes, pH water temp, > filtration, and whatever you can think of, and we'll start trying to > sort this out for you. > > > > \\Steve//

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15601	From: Cydne McCown	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: Re: how big does it really get?

Eric; from my 30 plus years in the hobby, I have heard that you are partially right about the size of the tank. It does have a contributing factor up to a certain size. What I have been told by both other aquarists and a couple of articles in tropical fish mags, another big factor in growth has to do with how MANY angelfish are housed in the tank. The explanation being that there is some sort of growth inhibitor enzyme in Angelfishes' urine and so the more of that enzyme in the water ratio-wise decides how big your angels get. Also I was told that even though fish continue to grow thoughout their lives, the growth slows down quite a bit after hitting adult age. This means that if you have several young angelfish in a smallish tank, and dont make your weekly 10% to 30% water changes, you are going to have stunted fish. Also, there is one more factor in this. Those of you who do keep more than one angelfish might notice that you will have one Angel that is larger than the others. Seems that the larger angel has more enzyme in his/her urine than the others and has advantage over them by keeping them smaller without affecting his growth! Interesting aint it? Cydne Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: From what I am told, that is not correct. They will grow to full size in a 10 gallon tank or a 100 gallon tank. A larger tank would be better for them as they can swim around unhindered. My angels were originally in a 55 gallon tank, but are now in a 30 gallon tank. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of supamii Sent: Monday, October 10, 2005 4:18 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: how big does it really get? The motive behind my inquiry is due to the fact that I currently have a lovely angel that is at a modest 2.5 inches housed in a puny 15 gal. tank/aquarium. I have heard about how fishes grow accordingly to the size of their environment, but even so, if it doubled in size I fear it would terrorize the smaller fishes. What are your ideas about my situation? Are your 5-6 inch angels in a larger tank? Say, 30+ gallons (120L)? --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > > I have seen some larger ones at the Shedd Aquarium. We have a pair that are > about 5 or 6 inches long from tip of tail to snout. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of supamii > Sent: Monday, October 10, 2005 1:00 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] how big does it really get? > > > I've seen various information about the popular Angel Fish and was > wondering if it really got to be 7 inches long?? I'm assuming this a > measurement based on Angels in the wild? Does anyone have or have > seen a HUUUUGE angel fish? > > > > > > > --------------------------------- Yahoo! Music Unlimited - Access over 1 million songs. Try it free. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15602	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: Re: how big does it really get?

it is pretty cool stuff...I try and research the hell out of things before I buy a fish, but even with that I find they still have a thing or 2 to teach me hehehe Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Cydne McCown Sent: Monday, October 10, 2005 9:42 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: how big does it really get? Eric; from my 30 plus years in the hobby, I have heard that you are partially right about the size of the tank. It does have a contributing factor up to a certain size. What I have been told by both other aquarists and a couple of articles in tropical fish mags, another big factor in growth has to do with how MANY angelfish are housed in the tank. The explanation being that there is some sort of growth inhibitor enzyme in Angelfishes' urine and so the more of that enzyme in the water ratio-wise decides how big your angels get. Also I was told that even though fish continue to grow thoughout their lives, the growth slows down quite a bit after hitting adult age. This means that if you have several young angelfish in a smallish tank, and dont make your weekly 10% to 30% water changes, you are going to have stunted fish. Also, there is one more factor in this. Those of you who do keep more than one angelfish might notice that you will have one Angel that is larger than the others. Seems that the larger angel has more enzyme in his/her urine than the others and has advantage over them by keeping them smaller without affecting his growth! Interesting aint it? Cydne Eric Roberts <woad@...> wrote: >From what I am told, that is not correct. They will grow to full size in a 10 gallon tank or a 100 gallon tank. A larger tank would be better for them as they can swim around unhindered. My angels were originally in a 55 gallon tank, but are now in a 30 gallon tank. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of supamii Sent: Monday, October 10, 2005 4:18 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: how big does it really get? The motive behind my inquiry is due to the fact that I currently have a lovely angel that is at a modest 2.5 inches housed in a puny 15 gal. tank/aquarium. I have heard about how fishes grow accordingly to the size of their environment, but even so, if it doubled in size I fear it would terrorize the smaller fishes. What are your ideas about my situation? Are your 5-6 inch angels in a larger tank? Say, 30+ gallons (120L)? --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > > I have seen some larger ones at the Shedd Aquarium. We have a pair that are > about 5 or 6 inches long from tip of tail to snout. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of supamii > Sent: Monday, October 10, 2005 1:00 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] how big does it really get? > > > I've seen various information about the popular Angel Fish and was > wondering if it really got to be 7 inches long?? I'm assuming this a > measurement based on Angels in the wild? Does anyone have or have > seen a HUUUUGE angel fish? > > > > > > > --------------------------------- Yahoo! Music Unlimited - Access over 1 million songs. Try it free. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Mar ine+fish&c=2&s=37&.sig=ifFK7dXwnimgasbXc9Qw3w> biology Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine +fish&c=2&s=37&.sig=7uvV14BE0FL5qQP83-gHGA> fish _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15603	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: Re: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning

My guppies have been chowing down on what I have. What you would want is not the Chinese algae eater, but the Siamese Algae eater. The Chinese one doesn't eat that much algae and they are very aggressive Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of supamii Sent: Monday, October 10, 2005 8:46 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning I'm quite alright with any kind of algae that my small pleco eats... which is practically anything except for the bearded/hair algae. I think I've read about the rare saimese algae eater being effective with that type of algae. Have you had success in purchasing a fish that eats bearded/hair algae? --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > > get fish that eat it and you won;t have a problem. I actually encourage > algae while having fish that eat it to balance it out so it doesn't get out > of control. I do the same with snails. If you want to help speed the > cycle, get some biozyme or biospira. Biospira is frozen (but not dead) > bacteria that will jump start the cycling. Biozyme is a dried version > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of supamii > Sent: Monday, October 10, 2005 4:53 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning > > > Thanks for the clarification Ray. > > I am also in the process of switching tanks and am reluctant to > immediately transfer the gravel to the newer tank since I had the > INFAMOUS bearded/hair algae. (My algae wasn't green like most of the > material I've read but I definately has to be the same algae.) I > dipped my plants in a >5% bleach solution and sterilized my driftwood > (via boiling for an hour) as well as other misc stuff. I've left > those items in the new tank with the filter running. > > I'm very much paranoid about introducing the bearded algae SPORES to > my new tank. Do I need to be worried? If so how can I transfer my > gravel to the new tank safely? --Since I've also heard that using > gravel from an already established tank is a great way to speed up the > cycling process. Thanks anyone who can help! > > Spam. > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> > wrote: > > > > Spam, Might be that you are not changing enough water as frequently > > as you should, planted tank or not. While plants do definitely help > > in keeping the water parameters more towards the fishes' liking, you > > can't just rely on them as "expecting the water to be more clean". > > It is generally recommended to change on the average of 33% every > > week. This of course depends on a lot of variables such as your fish > > load, your filtration, etc. While the water column does support a > > fair colony of beneficial bacteria, most of these critters are found > > growing on the interior surfaces of your aquarium (glass, gravel, > > etc.) and are especially much more numerous in oxygen enriched > > environments such as your filter, with water constantly flowing past > > them or on the bio-wheels where the thin film of water is directly > > exposed to the atmosphere. There is little need to be reluctant to > > throw out whatever good bacteria is present in the water itself. > > That will grow back in short time. I generally change out larger > > amounts of water with healthy results noted in my fish. Ray > > \ > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "supamii" <supamii@y...> wrote: > > > > > > That seems like a lot of water change... I personally do about a 25% > > > every two or so weeks since I have a planted tank (the water is > > > expected to be more clean). Plus I don't want to throw out all the > > > healthy bacteria in the aquarium (the ones that break down ammonia > > and > > > nitrites). > > > > > > Spam. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "deborahgd14" <deborahgd14@y...> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > I do 50 to 75 per cent water changes once a week and that works > > for > > > > me. > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, agentscullyeyore@a... wrote: > > > > > > > > > > well i have a heavily stocked 20 gallon and do about a 40% > > water > > > > change > > > > > cleaning all the gravel each time i used to do this water > > change > > > > about once a > > > > > week now since my system seems so stable as it went 2 months > > this > > > > summer > > > > > without being touched i have backed off to about every nearly 2 > > > > weeks... this being > > > > > only cause i am so busy and i monitor it very well... since > > what > > > > your doing > > > > > seems to work for you i would keep it up.. everyone does things > > > > different > > > > > finding what works for them... Shannon > > > > > > > > > > I have been on this board for awhile and always forget to ask > > > > this > > > > > question. When it comes to Gravel cleaning.. so many sources > > say > > > > > differet thing.. I have a 15 gl tank pretty well stocked... > > some > > > > may > > > > > say over stocked, but the level are fine and I have never had > > > > any > > > > > serious issues. I do the tpical 25% water change weekly and > > clean > > > > the > > > > > gravel about once a month... never cleaning the whole thing at > > > > oncce. > > > > > One half one time & the other half the other. Is this > > correct? > > > > also > > > > > Filter changes... I change the filter as needed about 1 a > > month.. > > > > and > > > > > rinse it out with the water from the "water change" in > > between. > > > > Is this > > > > > too often? thx - Terry > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Mar > &k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Mar > ine+fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=sWozU8RAgM2g66Yb_7h_nQ> biology > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine > &k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine > +fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=JB6FNOraRx3JIvMA1E4-Lw> fish Biology > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine+fis > &k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine+fis > h&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=R-HUKyhqLGfm-ZAFT2vuTQ> > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15604	From: supamii	Date: 10/10/2005
Subject: repost: red algae/ bearded/ hair algae help!

> I am also in the process of switching tanks and am reluctant to > immediately transfer the gravel to the newer tank since I had the > INFAMOUS bearded/hair algae. (My algae wasn't green like most of the > material I've read but I definately has to be the same algae.) I > dipped my plants in a >5% bleach solution and sterilized my driftwood > (via boiling for an hour) as well as other misc stuff. I've left > those items in the new tank with the filter running. > > I'm very much paranoid about introducing the bearded algae SPORES to > my new tank. Do I need to be worried? If so how can I transfer my > gravel to the new tank safely? --Since I've also heard that using > gravel from an already established tank is a great way to speed up the > cycling process. Thanks anyone who can help! > > Spam.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15605	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 10/11/2005
Subject: Re: Basic Qestion on Tank Cleaning

Spam, In one aspect, you're wise not to want to physically transfer any possible algae spores from your old tank to your new tank as your hair algae may well have hitch-hiked in to your old tank on your original plants, however much like fungal spores (and terrestrial contaminants -- mold and mildew) it is well documented that algae spores are airborne and may have started this way. I see no reason why you shouldn't use some gravel (very top layer only, unless you have an undergravel filter) or filter material from your old tank to jump start your new tank, as with proper aquarium maintenance you should have no problem with any type of algae growth. If you're still reluctant to start your new cycle this way, there are products on the market to help start your cycle as has been pointed out, or you could add a little clear ammonia as food to establish this bacteria, or just some fish food. "Seeding" your new tank with gravel from an established tank is an excellent way to get the cycle started, as you've heard, but will not necessarily substantially "speed up" the cycling process to any large degree; you will still have to wait until both types of bacterial colonies (nitrobacters and nitrosomas) get established to the point of being able to keep your ammonia and nitrite in balanced check. As for algae, it has already been pointed out that several fish species will consume most varieties. If you keep a properly maintained aquarium, it should not gain a foothold in the first place. Keep in mind that algae, like other plant matter, thrives on nutrients and light. Do not add excess quantities of nutrients (fish food, etc.), do not add an excess amount of fish to the point that you need to add more food (and have more fish waste), keep the bottom free of organic waste, establish live plants to use the nutrients (which will starve off any algae) and regulate your lighting as needed. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "supamii" <supamii@y...> wrote: > > Thanks for the clarification Ray. > > I am also in the process of switching tanks and am reluctant to > immediately transfer the gravel to the newer tank since I had the > INFAMOUS bearded/hair algae. (My algae wasn't green like most of the > material I've read but I definately has to be the same algae.) I > dipped my plants in a >5% bleach solution and sterilized my driftwood > (via boiling for an hour) as well as other misc stuff. I've left > those items in the new tank with the filter running. > > I'm very much paranoid about introducing the bearded algae SPORES to > my new tank. Do I need to be worried? If so how can I transfer my > gravel to the new tank safely? --Since I've also heard that using > gravel from an already established tank is a great way to speed up the > cycling process. Thanks anyone who can help! > > Spam. > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> > wrote: > > > > Spam, Might be that you are not changing enough water as frequently > > as you should, planted tank or not. While plants do definitely help > > in keeping the water parameters more towards the fishes' liking, you > > can't just rely on them as "expecting the water to be more clean". > > It is generally recommended to change on the average of 33% every > > week. This of course depends on a lot of variables such as your fish > > load, your filtration, etc. While the water column does support a > > fair colony of beneficial bacteria, most of these critters are found > > growing on the interior surfaces of your aquarium (glass, gravel, > > etc.) and are especially much more numerous in oxygen enriched > > environments such as your filter, with water constantly flowing past > > them or on the bio-wheels where the thin film of water is directly > > exposed to the atmosphere. There is little need to be reluctant to > > throw out whatever good bacteria is present in the water itself. > > That will grow back in short time. I generally change out larger > > amounts of water with healthy results noted in my fish. Ray > > \ > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "supamii" <supamii@y...> wrote: > > > > > > That seems like a lot of water change... I personally do about a 25% > > > every two or so weeks since I have a planted tank (the water is > > > expected to be more clean). Plus I don't want to throw out all the > > > healthy bacteria in the aquarium (the ones that break down ammonia > > and > > > nitrites). > > > > > > Spam. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "deborahgd14" <deborahgd14@y...> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > I do 50 to 75 per cent water changes once a week and that works > > for > > > > me. > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, agentscullyeyore@a... wrote: > > > > > > > > > > well i have a heavily stocked 20 gallon and do about a 40% > > water > > > > change > > > > > cleaning all the gravel each time i used to do this water > > change > > > > about once a > > > > > week now since my system seems so stable as it went 2 months > > this > > > > summer > > > > > without being touched i have backed off to about every nearly 2 > > > > weeks... this being > > > > > only cause i am so busy and i monitor it very well... since > > what > > > > your doing > > > > > seems to work for you i would keep it up.. everyone does things > > > > different > > > > > finding what works for them... Shannon > > > > > > > > > > I have been on this board for awhile and always forget to ask > > > > this > > > > > question. When it comes to Gravel cleaning.. so many sources > > say > > > > > differet thing.. I have a 15 gl tank pretty well stocked... > > some > > > > may > > > > > say over stocked, but the level are fine and I have never had > > > > any > > > > > serious issues. I do the tpical 25% water change weekly and > > clean > > > > the > > > > > gravel about once a month... never cleaning the whole thing at > > > > oncce. > > > > > One half one time & the other half the other. Is this > > correct? > > > > also > > > > > Filter changes... I change the filter as needed about 1 a > > month.. > > > > and > > > > > rinse it out with the water from the "water change" in > > between. > > > > Is this > > > > > too often? thx - Terry > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15607	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 10/11/2005
Subject: Re: WAHH, I killed my pregnant Molly

Awwww I'm so sorry :( Try a breeder net instead. You put the mom in there when she starts looking pregnant and although it doesn't separate her from the babies, you can remove her right after they are born. Maybe she was so far along that the handling stressed her :( Emily cynjul <fcouellet@...> wrote: I had a very pregnant Molly who was just hanging at the bottom of my 50 gallon tank. I went to the store, was recommended this contraption where the mother is on the top, and the babies should go to the bottom. Well, I moved her and she died within five minutes. I feel horrible, lost all the babies and the mommy. I was only trying to save the babies, we've had many, but most get eaten by others Cynthia Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15608	From: Esther Souverein	Date: 10/12/2005
Subject: Re: WAHH, I killed my pregnant Molly

When my swordtail looks almost ready to deliver, I put her in a small separate tank. I build a sort of box, out of a thin sheet of plastic with tiny holes in it (the plastic is normally used for children to embroider upon). The top of the box is open and the box is just a bit higher than the water surface in the tank. In the box I put some fake plants. When mom delivers, the fry instinctively seek cover in the fake plants. So they race to the box and through the small holes. After this they're safe from mom, and mom still swims around freely. Don't put any plants in the tank apart from those in the box; you want the fry to go for the box instead of anywhere else. Perhaps this will not save all the fry, but most of them seem to make it to safety, and I feel it's friendlier on mom than most other methods. Esther -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- Van: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] Namens Emily Tenczar Verzonden: dinsdag 11 oktober 2005 17:32 Aan: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Onderwerp: Re: [AquaticLife] WAHH, I killed my pregnant Molly Awwww I'm so sorry :( Try a breeder net instead. You put the mom in there when she starts looking pregnant and although it doesn't separate her from the babies, you can remove her right after they are born. Maybe she was so far along that the handling stressed her :( Emily cynjul <fcouellet@...> wrote: I had a very pregnant Molly who was just hanging at the bottom of my 50 gallon tank. I went to the store, was recommended this contraption where the mother is on the top, and the babies should go to the bottom. Well, I moved her and she died within five minutes. I feel horrible, lost all the babies and the mommy. I was only trying to save the babies, we've had many, but most get eaten by others Cynthia

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15609	From: aclaar877	Date: 10/12/2005
Subject: Re: repost: red algae/ bearded/ hair algae help!

Soon after starting my planted discus tank, I had beard algae on some rocks and many of the large-leafed plants. If you can find Siamese Algae Eaters, I strongly recommend them. Two of them cleared up a well-planted 155g tank in about a week to ten days. I believe they will eat any type of algae other than cyanobacteria (slime). Andy --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "supamii" <supamii@y...> wrote: > > > I am also in the process of switching tanks and am reluctant to > > immediately transfer the gravel to the newer tank since I had the > > INFAMOUS bearded/hair algae. (My algae wasn't green like most of the > > material I've read but I definately has to be the same algae.) I > > dipped my plants in a >5% bleach solution and sterilized my driftwood > > (via boiling for an hour) as well as other misc stuff. I've left > > those items in the new tank with the filter running. > > > > I'm very much paranoid about introducing the bearded algae SPORES to > > my new tank. Do I need to be worried? If so how can I transfer my > > gravel to the new tank safely? --Since I've also heard that using > > gravel from an already established tank is a great way to speed up the > > cycling process. Thanks anyone who can help! > > > > Spam. >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15610	From: aclaar877	Date: 10/12/2005
Subject: Discus Growth Rate

Two months ago I purchased four discus, about 3-4" in size. They are doing great in a 155g planted tank with about 50 tetras (mix of cardinals, black phantom, and bleeding hearts). They eat everything most of the time--frozen bloodworms, discus bits, flakes, frozen mosquito larvae. I haven't seen much of a change in size, but it's only been two months. How long does it take discus to grow from 4" to 8"? Is it on the order of years or months? Andy

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15611	From: Cydne McCown	Date: 10/12/2005
Subject: Re: Discus Growth Rate

Try this website that I found........ I perused it about a week ago because I am considering getting discus for my next tank. http://www.discuspro.com/index.htm Cydne aclaar877 <aclaar877@...> wrote: Two months ago I purchased four discus, about 3-4" in size. They are doing great in a 155g planted tank with about 50 tetras (mix of cardinals, black phantom, and bleeding hearts). They eat everything most of the time--frozen bloodworms, discus bits, flakes, frozen mosquito larvae. I haven't seen much of a change in size, but it's only been two months. How long does it take discus to grow from 4" to 8"? Is it on the order of years or months? Andy --------------------------------- Yahoo! Music Unlimited - Access over 1 million songs. Try it free. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15612	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 10/12/2005
Subject: Re: Discus Growth Rate

Andy, Unless your fish have been stunted, you should have seen some growth in them in 2 months. Often, as we see our fish every day, we don't notice the growth in them -- that may be the explanation in your case. If there truly has been little (or none) growth in them, then it may well be that they've been stunted. Hard to say if this happened before or after you got them. A 4" Discus should be approx. 7 or so months old; a 10 month old Discus can often get to 6" in that time frame. This of course all depends on many variables (food, water, tank size, etc.). On average, Discus take about 18 months to mature and start breeding at which time they're usually at least 7" to 8" (or more). While you seem to be feeding them a good variety, you don't say how often you feed. Best growth will be seen when feeding at least 3 times a day -- and up to 5 times (if you have the time). You do not say how often or how much water you change. Again, best growth will be see with large, frequent water changes -- 50% water changes every 2 or 3 days is not too much, especially with 50 Tetras in the tank. All fish give off growth inhibiting Theromones which need to be gotten rid of through water changing (not to mention keeping your water parameters to their best liking). Too, while a 155g is a nice size tank for the Discus, you might want to consider cutting back slightly on the number of Tetras -- Bleeding Hearts can get bigger than most of the group. Also, with having Tetras in the tank, I'm wondering what temperature you're keeping them at since the Family does best in the mid to upper 70's (not much more) and your Discus should be around 84 o for growing fish. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "aclaar877" <aclaar877@y...> wrote: > > Two months ago I purchased four discus, about 3-4" in size. They are > doing great in a 155g planted tank with about 50 tetras (mix of > cardinals, black phantom, and bleeding hearts). They eat everything > most of the time--frozen bloodworms, discus bits, flakes, frozen > mosquito larvae. I haven't seen much of a change in size, but it's > only been two months. How long does it take discus to grow from 4" to > 8"? Is it on the order of years or months? > > > Andy >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15613	From: discusfishies	Date: 10/12/2005
Subject: Re: Discus Growth Rate

Discus are very slow growers, and I agree with previous post.. feed several times daily . Also live food is best try live bloodworms mine love them, they also sell a cone shape feeder because discus are not aggressive eaters it keeps thier food at the top for a longer period of time.Keep thier water as clean as possible. After 1 yr a discus might be between 5-7 inches thier growth rate slows down.good luck. Laurie

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15614	From: discusfishies	Date: 10/12/2005
Subject: Fish tank maintenance business

I am looking into starting my own business to maintain fish tanks for people, I am actually working on a contract for a lease system for the entire set up, anyone have any info that might be helpful for me.If you use a service like this do you pay alot? I am not offering this service for salt tanks. Laurie

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15615	From: aclaar877	Date: 10/12/2005
Subject: Re: Discus Growth Rate

Thanks. I keep the temp at 85, and do 20% water changes twice a week. I only have eight bleeding hearts--the rest are cardinals and small black phantoms. Feeding is twice a day on weekdays; weekends and other days I'm home I feed about four times. I'm seeing some small growth in a turquoise and pigeon blood, but little to none in a nice blue cobalt. At first, I was worried about keeping stable water parameters, so I didn't want to disrupt things too much by doing larger water changes. I was doing (what I thought) was a tightrope act for planted discus, balancing RO/tap water, baking soda to regulate KH & pH stability, CO2, temp, airstone timing at night, not to mention some algae troubles in a new planted tank. That has all evened out now, and I see that my fish are hardier than I thought. I'll start doing larger changes, and feed some in the morning, even though the lights don't come on until 10. The fish are awake, it's just dark in there... In the two months I've had them, they had a case of ich and recovered, plus I've gone away for four days three different times, which wasn't the best for feeding or water changes. I would have loved to get some nice, big mosquito larvae for them, but I'm in downtown St. Louis and had no luck culturing any. I did get a lump of blackworms once, and they loved them. I doubt these fish will become the 10" "dinner plates" we dream about--I got them from a store that had 3-4 in ten-gallon tanks, and I know they didn't change their water everyday. They weren't there long, but it probably stunted them somewhat. It's my first set--I wasn't going to pay $70 apiece when I could get these for $25, not knowing if I could keep them alive. Andy --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > Andy, Unless your fish have been stunted, you should have seen some > growth in them in 2 months. Often, as we see our fish every day, we > don't notice the growth in them -- that may be the explanation in your > case. If there truly has been little (or none) growth in them, then it > may well be that they've been stunted. Hard to say if this happened > before or after you got them. A 4" Discus should be approx. 7 or so > months old; a 10 month old Discus can often get to 6" in that time > frame. This of course all depends on many variables (food, water, tank > size, etc.). On average, Discus take about 18 months to mature and > start breeding at which time they're usually at least 7" to 8" (or > more). While you seem to be feeding them a good variety, you don't say > how often you feed. Best growth will be seen when feeding at least 3 > times a day -- and up to 5 times (if you have the time). You do not > say how often or how much water you change. Again, best growth will be > see with large, frequent water changes -- 50% water changes every 2 or > 3 days is not too much, especially with 50 Tetras in the tank. All > fish give off growth inhibiting Theromones which need to be gotten rid > of through water changing (not to mention keeping your water parameters > to their best liking). Too, while a 155g is a nice size tank for the > Discus, you might want to consider cutting back slightly on the number > of Tetras -- Bleeding Hearts can get bigger than most of the group. > Also, with having Tetras in the tank, I'm wondering what temperature > you're keeping them at since the Family does best in the mid to upper > 70's (not much more) and your Discus should be around 84 o for growing > fish. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "aclaar877" <aclaar877@y...> wrote: > > > > Two months ago I purchased four discus, about 3-4" in size. They are > > doing great in a 155g planted tank with about 50 tetras (mix of > > cardinals, black phantom, and bleeding hearts). They eat everything > > most of the time--frozen bloodworms, discus bits, flakes, frozen > > mosquito larvae. I haven't seen much of a change in size, but it's > > only been two months. How long does it take discus to grow from 4" > to > > 8"? Is it on the order of years or months? > > > > > > Andy > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15616	From: aclaar877	Date: 10/12/2005
Subject: Re: Cabomba aquarium requirments

I consistently have to throw strands of this away. I have some in a large aquarium with compact fluorescent lights, and some in a smaller tank with regular fluorescents (twin fixture with one ColorMax and one plant bulb). I've also kept some in a bucket in the dark for a week, and it was still green. You may want to add some CO2, which is easy to do. Plenty of info is on the web, probably even elsewhere in this group. I can elaborate on it, if you want, on how to set up a simple system with yeast, sugar, and baking soda. Another thing with my cabomba is that it is prone to getting slimy blue-green algae on it. Probably due to lots of fertilization in my tank plus lack of water movement. It's shape lends it to creating pockets of stagnant water, especially when it spreads across the surface. So I recommend putting a cheap filter on your tank, or a powerhead to keep the water moving around. Andy --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > > Most people only have experience with cabomba indoors, so you should have no > problem growing it. Two light strips will probably be more than sufficient, > but you may wish to add some plant fertilizer in with it. Be sure to follow > the directions for the fertilizer. Others who have more recent experience > can tell you more about using the various kinds. > > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of andrew davis > Sent: Monday, October 03, 2005 5:00 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Cabomba aquarium requirments > > > > Well, the two Cabomba's (Caroliniana and the aquatica) tried outside > seem to have got going on a warm sunny waterlily pond quite well. > > With winter approaching, I'd be curious to hear what sort of tips may > be useful about growing them indoors, as I'm a bit limited on aquarium > keeping (waterlilies are the usual foible) > > At best I can muster two strip lights just over them, the objective > being to Winter indoors a few sprigs out of curiosity, along with some > of the multitude of guppies raised in the ponds outdoors > > Regards, andy > adavisus(at)aol.com > http://www.members.aol.com/abdavisnc/swglist.html > -------------------------------oo------------------------------- >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15617	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 10/12/2005
Subject: Re: Discus Growth Rate

i had the same problem with mine and the exact same ones grew..... until earlier this week when my blood decidded it wanted to get sick on me, im not siure what it was but it couldnt swim straight and when it died it had just started developing a faint white fuzz on its fins. aclaar877 <aclaar877@...> wrote: Thanks. I keep the temp at 85, and do 20% water changes twice a week. I only have eight bleeding hearts--the rest are cardinals and small black phantoms. Feeding is twice a day on weekdays; weekends and other days I'm home I feed about four times. I'm seeing some small growth in a turquoise and pigeon blood, but little to none in a nice blue cobalt. At first, I was worried about keeping stable water parameters, so I didn't want to disrupt things too much by doing larger water changes. I was doing (what I thought) was a tightrope act for planted discus, balancing RO/tap water, baking soda to regulate KH & pH stability, CO2, temp, airstone timing at night, not to mention some algae troubles in a new planted tank. That has all evened out now, and I see that my fish are hardier than I thought. I'll start doing larger changes, and feed some in the morning, even though the lights don't come on until 10. The fish are awake, it's just dark in there... In the two months I've had them, they had a case of ich and recovered, plus I've gone away for four days three different times, which wasn't the best for feeding or water changes. I would have loved to get some nice, big mosquito larvae for them, but I'm in downtown St. Louis and had no luck culturing any. I did get a lump of blackworms once, and they loved them. I doubt these fish will become the 10" "dinner plates" we dream about--I got them from a store that had 3-4 in ten-gallon tanks, and I know they didn't change their water everyday. They weren't there long, but it probably stunted them somewhat. It's my first set--I wasn't going to pay $70 apiece when I could get these for $25, not knowing if I could keep them alive. Andy --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > Andy, Unless your fish have been stunted, you should have seen some > growth in them in 2 months. Often, as we see our fish every day, we > don't notice the growth in them -- that may be the explanation in your > case. If there truly has been little (or none) growth in them, then it > may well be that they've been stunted. Hard to say if this happened > before or after you got them. A 4" Discus should be approx. 7 or so > months old; a 10 month old Discus can often get to 6" in that time > frame. This of course all depends on many variables (food, water, tank > size, etc.). On average, Discus take about 18 months to mature and > start breeding at which time they're usually at least 7" to 8" (or > more). While you seem to be feeding them a good variety, you don't say > how often you feed. Best growth will be seen when feeding at least 3 > times a day -- and up to 5 times (if you have the time). You do not > say how often or how much water you change. Again, best growth will be > see with large, frequent water changes -- 50% water changes every 2 or > 3 days is not too much, especially with 50 Tetras in the tank. All > fish give off growth inhibiting Theromones which need to be gotten rid > of through water changing (not to mention keeping your water parameters > to their best liking). Too, while a 155g is a nice size tank for the > Discus, you might want to consider cutting back slightly on the number > of Tetras -- Bleeding Hearts can get bigger than most of the group. > Also, with having Tetras in the tank, I'm wondering what temperature > you're keeping them at since the Family does best in the mid to upper > 70's (not much more) and your Discus should be around 84 o for growing > fish. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "aclaar877" <aclaar877@y...> wrote: > > > > Two months ago I purchased four discus, about 3-4" in size. They are > > doing great in a 155g planted tank with about 50 tetras (mix of > > cardinals, black phantom, and bleeding hearts). They eat everything > > most of the time--frozen bloodworms, discus bits, flakes, frozen > > mosquito larvae. I haven't seen much of a change in size, but it's > > only been two months. How long does it take discus to grow from 4" > to > > 8"? Is it on the order of years or months? > > > > > > Andy > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Music Unlimited - Access over 1 million songs. Try it free. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15618	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 10/12/2005
Subject: Re: Discus Growth Rate

Oops, Just realized (as I was changing out some of my own water), the growth inhibiting secretion fish give out is spelled Pheromones (not Theromones as spelled previously). Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > Andy, Unless your fish have been stunted, you should have seen some > growth in them in 2 months. Often, as we see our fish every day, we > don't notice the growth in them -- that may be the explanation in your > case. If there truly has been little (or none) growth in them, then it > may well be that they've been stunted. Hard to say if this happened > before or after you got them. A 4" Discus should be approx. 7 or so > months old; a 10 month old Discus can often get to 6" in that time > frame. This of course all depends on many variables (food, water, tank > size, etc.). On average, Discus take about 18 months to mature and > start breeding at which time they're usually at least 7" to 8" (or > more). While you seem to be feeding them a good variety, you don't say > how often you feed. Best growth will be seen when feeding at least 3 > times a day -- and up to 5 times (if you have the time). You do not > say how often or how much water you change. Again, best growth will be > see with large, frequent water changes -- 50% water changes every 2 or > 3 days is not too much, especially with 50 Tetras in the tank. All > fish give off growth inhibiting Theromones which need to be gotten rid > of through water changing (not to mention keeping your water parameters > to their best liking). Too, while a 155g is a nice size tank for the > Discus, you might want to consider cutting back slightly on the number > of Tetras -- Bleeding Hearts can get bigger than most of the group. > Also, with having Tetras in the tank, I'm wondering what temperature > you're keeping them at since the Family does best in the mid to upper > 70's (not much more) and your Discus should be around 84 o for growing > fish. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "aclaar877" <aclaar877@y...> wrote: > > > > Two months ago I purchased four discus, about 3-4" in size. They are > > doing great in a 155g planted tank with about 50 tetras (mix of > > cardinals, black phantom, and bleeding hearts). They eat everything > > most of the time--frozen bloodworms, discus bits, flakes, frozen > > mosquito larvae. I haven't seen much of a change in size, but it's > > only been two months. How long does it take discus to grow from 4" > to > > 8"? Is it on the order of years or months? > > > > > > Andy > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15619	From: djransome@optonline.net	Date: 10/12/2005
Subject: Re: Siamese Algae Eaters and African Cichlids

Anyone keep the Siamese Algae Eaters with Malawi Mbunas? Wondering how the SAE would tolerate the mbuna water chemistry, and whether they would be attacked by the mbunas. ----- Original Message ----- From: aclaar877 <aclaar877@...> Date: Wednesday, October 12, 2005 12:03 pm Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: repost: red algae/ bearded/ hair algae help! > Soon after starting my planted discus tank, I had beard algae on > some rocks and many of the large-leafed plants. If you can find > Siamese Algae Eaters, I strongly recommend them. Two of them > cleared up a well-planted 155g tank in about a week to ten days. > I > believe they will eat any type of algae other than cyanobacteria > (slime). > > > Andy > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "supamii" <supamii@y...> wrote: > > > > > I am also in the process of switching tanks and am reluctant to > > > immediately transfer the gravel to the newer tank since I had the > > > INFAMOUS bearded/hair algae. (My algae wasn't green like most > of > the > > > material I've read but I definately has to be the same algae.) I > > > dipped my plants in a >5% bleach solution and sterilized my > driftwood > > > (via boiling for an hour) as well as other misc stuff. I've left > > > those items in the new tank with the filter running. > > > > > > I'm very much paranoid about introducing the bearded algae > SPORES to > > > my new tank. Do I need to be worried? If so how can I transfer my > > > gravel to the new tank safely? --Since I've also heard that using > > > gravel from an already established tank is a great way to > speed > up the > > > cycling process. Thanks anyone who can help! > > > > > > Spam. > > > > > > > > > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -------------------- > ~--> > Get fast access to your favorite Yahoo! Groups. Make Yahoo! your > home page > http://us.click.yahoo.com/dpRU5A/wUILAA/yQLSAA/ANOolB/TM > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > -~-> > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ���`�.��.><((((�>.���`�.��.���`�.�><((((�> �.���`�.�. , > .���`�..><((((�>PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the > original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was > re: old subject)" <- > <�((((><.���`�.��.���`�.�<�((((><�.���`�.�. , > .���`�..<�((((><���`�.��.We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in > this matter. > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15620	From: dragon6435@aol.com	Date: 10/12/2005
Subject: Re: Discus Growth Rate

Hey Andy! I'm in downtown St. Louis too...small world. I didn't really want to mess with discus but a friend had several pairs and one pair was not thriving in the mix so I agreed to foster them. I now have 10 discus combined with some rummynose and neons. They actually do better for me than some of the so called "easy" fish. I feed mine mysis, bloodworms, beefheart and Omega One Colorflakes and veggie flakes. The tank is heavily planted with various swords and I have driftwood for hidey holes and decor. They seem quite happy in the tank with it set up this way. As for growth, the ones I've noticed growing the fastest are my red turquoise. No idea if some varieties do grow faster, but these definitely appear to have a foot up on their peers. Whereabouts downtown are you?? Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15621	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 10/12/2005
Subject: Re: Siamese Algae Eaters and African Cichlids

Are you really sure you would want to do this? While SAE's will eat many types of algae, they will at the same time consume the same type of green carpet algae that many Mbunas like to graze on, leaving them little if any of this type of plant material growing on the rocks, etc. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, djransome@o... wrote: > > Anyone keep the Siamese Algae Eaters with Malawi Mbunas? Wondering how the SAE would tolerate the mbuna water chemistry, and whether they would be attacked by the mbunas. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: aclaar877 <aclaar877@y...> > Date: Wednesday, October 12, 2005 12:03 pm > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: repost: red algae/ bearded/ hair algae help! > > > Soon after starting my planted discus tank, I had beard algae on > > some rocks and many of the large-leafed plants. If you can find > > Siamese Algae Eaters, I strongly recommend them. Two of them > > cleared up a well-planted 155g tank in about a week to ten days. > > I > > believe they will eat any type of algae other than cyanobacteria > > (slime). > > > > > > Andy > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "supamii" <supamii@y...> wrote: > > > > > > > I am also in the process of switching tanks and am reluctant to > > > > immediately transfer the gravel to the newer tank since I had the > > > > INFAMOUS bearded/hair algae. (My algae wasn't green like most > > of > > the > > > > material I've read but I definately has to be the same algae.) I > > > > dipped my plants in a >5% bleach solution and sterilized my > > driftwood > > > > (via boiling for an hour) as well as other misc stuff. I've left > > > > those items in the new tank with the filter running. > > > > > > > > I'm very much paranoid about introducing the bearded algae > > SPORES to > > > > my new tank. Do I need to be worried? If so how can I transfer my > > > > gravel to the new tank safely? --Since I've also heard that using > > > > gravel from an already established tank is a great way to > > speed > > up the > > > > cycling process. Thanks anyone who can help! > > > > > > > > Spam. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ------------------- - > > ~--> > > Get fast access to your favorite Yahoo! Groups. Make Yahoo! your > > home page > > http://us.click.yahoo.com/dpRU5A/wUILAA/yQLSAA/ANOolB/TM > > ------------------------------------------------------------------ - > > -~-> > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > > ���`�.��.>< ((((�>.���`�.��.���`�.�><((((�> �.���`�.�. , > > .���`�..><((((�>PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > > that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the > > original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was > > re: old subject)" <- > > <�((((><.���`�.��.���`�.�<� ((((><�.���`�.�. , > > .���`�..<�((((><���`�.��.We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in > > this matter. > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15622	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 10/12/2005
Subject: help with snails in cold water

First of all I love snails and I encourage them to breed in my aquariuams. I have a colony of what I think are trumpet snails. They breed really well in my 2 gal betta tanks, but I've been having problems getting them to thrive in my cold water tanks (goldfish and others). Do these snails die or refuse to reproduce when they are too cold? Should I remove all the trumpet snails in my cold tanks and put them in a warmer tank? I have an invertebrate tank (no fish allowed!) that contains snails, scuds and leaches right now. Would these inverts be happier with a heater in their tank? What kinds of snails would be best suited for cold water tanks? Something that can reproduce in cold water and likes to eat algae but goes easy on the plants would be wonderful. I've got a nice supply of algae going in the tank right now and I'd like snails to keep it in check. Emily

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15623	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 10/12/2005
Subject: Re: help with snails in cold water

how cold is cold because my 74 degree tank has no problem with trumpets breeging like crazy even with 3 border botias i put in there to keep them in check... --- Emily Tenczar <bababanana@...> wrote: > First of all I love snails and I encourage them to > breed in my aquariuams. I have a colony of what I > think are trumpet snails. They breed really well in > my > 2 gal betta tanks, but I've been having problems > getting them to thrive in my cold water tanks > (goldfish and others). > > Do these snails die or refuse to reproduce when they > are too cold? > > Should I remove all the trumpet snails in my cold > tanks and put them in a warmer tank? I have an > invertebrate tank (no fish allowed!) that contains > snails, scuds and leaches right now. Would these > inverts be happier with a heater in their tank? > > What kinds of snails would be best suited for cold > water tanks? Something that can reproduce in cold > water and likes to eat algae but goes easy on the > plants would be wonderful. I've got a nice supply of > algae going in the tank right now and I'd like > snails > to keep it in check. > > Emily > __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15624	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 10/12/2005
Subject: Re: Discus Growth Rate

You sure those are Pheromones Ray...Pheromones are sexual attractant hormones... Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Wednesday, October 12, 2005 5:55 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Discus Growth Rate Oops, Just realized (as I was changing out some of my own water), the growth inhibiting secretion fish give out is spelled Pheromones (not Theromones as spelled previously). Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > Andy, Unless your fish have been stunted, you should have seen some > growth in them in 2 months. Often, as we see our fish every day, we > don't notice the growth in them -- that may be the explanation in your > case. If there truly has been little (or none) growth in them, then it > may well be that they've been stunted. Hard to say if this happened > before or after you got them. A 4" Discus should be approx. 7 or so > months old; a 10 month old Discus can often get to 6" in that time > frame. This of course all depends on many variables (food, water, tank > size, etc.). On average, Discus take about 18 months to mature and > start breeding at which time they're usually at least 7" to 8" (or > more). While you seem to be feeding them a good variety, you don't say > how often you feed. Best growth will be seen when feeding at least 3 > times a day -- and up to 5 times (if you have the time). You do not > say how often or how much water you change. Again, best growth will be > see with large, frequent water changes -- 50% water changes every 2 or > 3 days is not too much, especially with 50 Tetras in the tank. All > fish give off growth inhibiting Theromones which need to be gotten rid > of through water changing (not to mention keeping your water parameters > to their best liking). Too, while a 155g is a nice size tank for the > Discus, you might want to consider cutting back slightly on the number > of Tetras -- Bleeding Hearts can get bigger than most of the group. > Also, with having Tetras in the tank, I'm wondering what temperature > you're keeping them at since the Family does best in the mid to upper > 70's (not much more) and your Discus should be around 84 o for growing > fish. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "aclaar877" <aclaar877@y...> wrote: > > > > Two months ago I purchased four discus, about 3-4" in size. They are > > doing great in a 155g planted tank with about 50 tetras (mix of > > cardinals, black phantom, and bleeding hearts). They eat everything > > most of the time--frozen bloodworms, discus bits, flakes, frozen > > mosquito larvae. I haven't seen much of a change in size, but it's > > only been two months. How long does it take discus to grow from 4" > to > > 8"? Is it on the order of years or months? > > > > > > Andy > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Mar ine+fish&c=2&s=37&.sig=ifFK7dXwnimgasbXc9Qw3w> biology Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine +fish&c=2&s=37&.sig=7uvV14BE0FL5qQP83-gHGA> fish _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15625	From: nicolasqueen	Date: 10/12/2005
Subject: Hi, New to Group

Hello all, My name is Nick, and I just joined. I am still very new to the hobby, and currently I have no fish. The last time I kept them, I had very bad beginner's luck. I am hoping to start once again, and this time do it right, and as such i am hoping to gain insights from you guys. So hi all, and hope to get to know everyone well! Nick

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15626	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 10/13/2005
Subject: Re: Discus Growth Rate

Hi Ray, I'm curious about your reference to Pheromones being given of by fish as a growth inhibitor to other fish, I've never heard this before, do you have any links to articles on this subject. I can relate an experiment that I was involved in a long time ago, performed by one of the river authorities in the UK (they are the regulatory body's for all things fish related in the UK), it entailed putting a number of trout fingerling's, I think it was 25 from memory into a glass cylinder with oxygenated water containing various forms of food pumped through on a continuous basis, this went on till the trout grew to a size were they could no longer move and the water flow became restricted, at this point they were released from the glass container and compared with there brothers and sisters in a rearing pond with plenty of space and the same water food mix flowing through it, the only perceivable difference was the restricted fish were much paler and had eregular flat patches due to pressure but after a few weeks in the same rearing pond it was not possible to tell the difference between the to groups. this was an extreme experiment related to inhibited growth (stunting) due to lack of space. As far as pheromones go I do now that If a fish is injured by a predator or in a fight and sustains a cut or tear to its skin it will release pheromones through the injury which are believed to be an alarm system to warn other fish in the vicinity, but this is still not fully understood. To my knowledge stunting is caused by lack of a correct diet or genetic inbreeding. regards, unclenorm. --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote: > Oops, Just realized (as I was changing out some of > my own water), the > growth inhibiting secretion fish give out is spelled > Pheromones (not > Theromones as spelled previously). Ray > > \ > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" > <sevenspringss@w...> > wrote: > > > > Andy, Unless your fish have been stunted, you > should have seen > some > > growth in them in 2 months. Often, as we see our > fish every day, > we > > don't notice the growth in them -- that may be the > explanation in > your > > case. If there truly has been little (or none) > growth in them, > then it > > may well be that they've been stunted. Hard to > say if this > happened > > before or after you got them. A 4" Discus should > be approx. 7 or > so > > months old; a 10 month old Discus can often get to > 6" in that time > > frame. This of course all depends on many > variables (food, water, > tank > > size, etc.). On average, Discus take about 18 > months to mature and > > start breeding at which time they're usually at > least 7" to 8" (or > > more). While you seem to be feeding them a good > variety, you don't > say > > how often you feed. Best growth will be seen when > feeding at least > 3 > > times a day -- and up to 5 times (if you have the > time). You do > not > > say how often or how much water you change. > Again, best growth > will be > > see with large, frequent water changes -- 50% > water changes every 2 > or > > 3 days is not too much, especially with 50 Tetras > in the tank. All > > fish give off growth inhibiting Theromones which > need to be gotten > rid > > of through water changing (not to mention keeping > your water > parameters > > to their best liking). Too, while a 155g is a > nice size tank for > the > > Discus, you might want to consider cutting back > slightly on the > number > > of Tetras -- Bleeding Hearts can get bigger than > most of the > group. > > Also, with having Tetras in the tank, I'm > wondering what > temperature > > you're keeping them at since the Family does best > in the mid to > upper > > 70's (not much more) and your Discus should be > around 84 o for > growing > > fish. > Ray > > > > \ > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "aclaar877" > <aclaar877@y...> > wrote: > > > > > > Two months ago I purchased four discus, about > 3-4" in size. They > are > > > doing great in a 155g planted tank with about 50 > tetras (mix of > > > cardinals, black phantom, and bleeding hearts). > They eat > everything > > > most of the time--frozen bloodworms, discus > bits, flakes, frozen > > > mosquito larvae. I haven't seen much of a > change in size, but > it's > > > only been two months. How long does it take > discus to grow from > 4" > > to > > > 8"? Is it on the order of years or months? > > > > > > > > > Andy > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15627	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 10/13/2005
Subject: Re: help with snails in cold water

I have seen Trumpet snails survive in 40*F water. I would believe though that the colder the water got the slower the snails would be, to conserve energy. And they probally wouldn't breed, for the same reason. If you give them a deep sand bed they'd probally burrow deep and stay deep while looking for food as it would be warmer. They might go into a dormant stage ( hybranate? ) I am unsure myself, as i am not a snail lover.. Just a botia Keeper. ~~~~~~~~~~~ trumpets breeging like crazy even with 3 border botias i put in there to keep them in check... Trumpet snails are Really hard, slender shelled snails and not eaten by many snail eating fish. Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 10/12/2005 10:44:13 PM US Eastern Standard Time, punk3r12@... writes: Do these snails die or refuse to reproduce when they > are too cold? > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15628	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 10/13/2005
Subject: Re: Discus Growth Rate

Eric, Yes, I'm sure these are Pheromones! I appreciate your enthusiasm in this Group, but I would suggest you learn more about what you are questioning before blindly challenging something it appears you have little knowledge about. While there of course are certain pheromones (amino acid chemical compounds) associated with sexual attraction which may be better known than most others, there are many other pheromones (hormones -- the terms may be used interchangeably) found in animals. In fish, there are pheromones associated with anti predator cues, social cues, reproductive cues as well as appetite-inducing cues. Associated with the growth- inhibiting hormone in fish is also a closely linked immune- suppressing pheromone. In small groups of fish, this hormone acts as a stimulate to the group to increase their immune system. In larger groups of fish, this hormone is increased, resulting in an increase in the immune system of all fish within the group. However, in yet larger groups of fish where overcrowding has occurred, this hormone acts as an immune suppressant. This will allow weaker fish to become ill and die off, stabilizing the population. These pheromones not only have an influence on fish reproduction, but also help control shoaling, feeding and migration. In humans, while genetics play the major role in our growth, there are certain pheromones/hormones (among others) secreted by the pituitary gland, namely Somatotropin, which also help regulate how tall we grow. This has little to do with "sexual attraction", as you suggest. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > > You sure those are Pheromones Ray...Pheromones are sexual attractant > hormones... > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Wednesday, October 12, 2005 5:55 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Discus Growth Rate > > > Oops, Just realized (as I was changing out some of my own water), the > growth inhibiting secretion fish give out is spelled Pheromones (not > Theromones as spelled previously). Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> > wrote: > > > > Andy, Unless your fish have been stunted, you should have seen > some > > growth in them in 2 months. Often, as we see our fish every day, > we > > don't notice the growth in them -- that may be the explanation in > your > > case. If there truly has been little (or none) growth in them, > then it > > may well be that they've been stunted. Hard to say if this > happened > > before or after you got them. A 4" Discus should be approx. 7 or > so > > months old; a 10 month old Discus can often get to 6" in that time > > frame. This of course all depends on many variables (food, water, > tank > > size, etc.). On average, Discus take about 18 months to mature and > > start breeding at which time they're usually at least 7" to 8" (or > > more). While you seem to be feeding them a good variety, you don't > say > > how often you feed. Best growth will be seen when feeding at least > 3 > > times a day -- and up to 5 times (if you have the time). You do > not > > say how often or how much water you change. Again, best growth > will be > > see with large, frequent water changes -- 50% water changes every 2 > or > > 3 days is not too much, especially with 50 Tetras in the tank. All > > fish give off growth inhibiting Theromones which need to be gotten > rid > > of through water changing (not to mention keeping your water > parameters > > to their best liking). Too, while a 155g is a nice size tank for > the > > Discus, you might want to consider cutting back slightly on the > number > > of Tetras -- Bleeding Hearts can get bigger than most of the > group. > > Also, with having Tetras in the tank, I'm wondering what > temperature > > you're keeping them at since the Family does best in the mid to > upper > > 70's (not much more) and your Discus should be around 84 o for > growing > > fish. > Ray > > > \ > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "aclaar877" <aclaar877@y...> > wrote: > > > > > > Two months ago I purchased four discus, about 3-4" in size. They > are > > > doing great in a 155g planted tank with about 50 tetras (mix of > > > cardinals, black phantom, and bleeding hearts). They eat > everything > > > most of the time--frozen bloodworms, discus bits, flakes, frozen > > > mosquito larvae. I haven't seen much of a change in size, but > it's > > > only been two months. How long does it take discus to grow from > 4" > > to > > > 8"? Is it on the order of years or months? > > > > > > > > > Andy > > > > > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Mar > ine+fish&c=2&s=37&.sig=ifFK7dXwnimgasbXc9Qw3w> biology Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine > +fish&c=2&s=37&.sig=7uvV14BE0FL5qQP83-gHGA> fish > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15629	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 10/13/2005
Subject: Re: Discus Growth Rate

Hi Unclenorm, No, I do not have any links to articles on this subject. I did not just learn of this on the Internet -- this is an established fact. If interested in more information on the subject, you would probably have as much success in searching the 'Net as I would as I'm sure there are many Sites relating to it. The experiment you relate is most interesting. I do especially note that you say that oxygenated water was continually pumped through the cylinder. Unless this was a closed (recirculating) system, it would appear the continually fresh water flowing through the cylinder would constantly remove any growth-inhibiting hormones releases by the fish, not allowing a build up of them. I would think that with food also being pumped through the cylinder at this same time, it could not be a recirculating system as any food getting past the fish would of course foul the water in short time no matter how efficient any filtration system might be, and knowing the high oxygen demands of trout. Confining the fish in itself will have no bearing on their growth as long as these pheromones do not have a chance to build up. This is just another reason why we should frequently change water, especially when wanting to grow out fish we may have bred. I cannot comment on injured fish giving off pheromones, but it does seem feasible, however there is more to stunting than poor diet and inbreeding. Regards, Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > Hi Ray, > I'm curious about your reference to Pheromones > being given of by fish as a growth inhibitor to other > fish, I've never heard this before, do you have any > links to articles on this subject. I can relate an > experiment that I was involved in a long time ago, > performed by one of the river authorities in the UK > (they are the regulatory body's for all things fish > related in the UK), it entailed putting a number of > trout fingerling's, I think it was 25 from memory into > a glass cylinder with oxygenated water containing > various forms of food pumped through on a continuous > basis, this went on till the trout grew to a size were > they could no longer move and the water flow became > restricted, at this point they were released from the > glass container and compared with there brothers and > sisters in a rearing pond with plenty of space and the > same water food mix flowing through it, the only > perceivable difference was the restricted fish were > much paler and had eregular flat patches due to > pressure but after a few weeks in the same rearing > pond it was not possible to tell the difference > between the to groups. this was an extreme experiment > related to inhibited growth (stunting) due to lack of > space. > As far as pheromones go I do now that If a fish > is injured by a predator or in a fight and sustains a > cut or tear to its skin it will release pheromones > through the injury which are believed to be an alarm > system to warn other fish in the vicinity, but this is > still not fully understood. > To my knowledge stunting is caused by lack of a > correct diet or genetic inbreeding. > regards, > unclenorm. > > --- Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > > Oops, Just realized (as I was changing out some of > > my own water), the > > growth inhibiting secretion fish give out is spelled > > Pheromones (not > > Theromones as spelled previously). Ray > > > > \ > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" > > <sevenspringss@w...> > > wrote: > > > > > > Andy, Unless your fish have been stunted, you > > should have seen > > some > > > growth in them in 2 months. Often, as we see our > > fish every day, > > we > > > don't notice the growth in them -- that may be the > > explanation in > > your > > > case. If there truly has been little (or none) > > growth in them, > > then it > > > may well be that they've been stunted. Hard to > > say if this > > happened > > > before or after you got them. A 4" Discus should > > be approx. 7 or > > so > > > months old; a 10 month old Discus can often get to > > 6" in that time > > > frame. This of course all depends on many > > variables (food, water, > > tank > > > size, etc.). On average, Discus take about 18 > > months to mature and > > > start breeding at which time they're usually at > > least 7" to 8" (or > > > more). While you seem to be feeding them a good > > variety, you don't > > say > > > how often you feed. Best growth will be seen when > > feeding at least > > 3 > > > times a day -- and up to 5 times (if you have the > > time). You do > > not > > > say how often or how much water you change. > > Again, best growth > > will be > > > see with large, frequent water changes -- 50% > > water changes every 2 > > or > > > 3 days is not too much, especially with 50 Tetras > > in the tank. All > > > fish give off growth inhibiting Theromones which > > need to be gotten > > rid > > > of through water changing (not to mention keeping > > your water > > parameters > > > to their best liking). Too, while a 155g is a > > nice size tank for > > the > > > Discus, you might want to consider cutting back > > slightly on the > > number > > > of Tetras -- Bleeding Hearts can get bigger than > > most of the > > group. > > > Also, with having Tetras in the tank, I'm > > wondering what > > temperature > > > you're keeping them at since the Family does best > > in the mid to > > upper > > > 70's (not much more) and your Discus should be > > around 84 o for > > growing > > > fish. > > Ray > > > > > > > \ > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "aclaar877" > > <aclaar877@y...> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > Two months ago I purchased four discus, about > > 3-4" in size. They > > are > > > > doing great in a 155g planted tank with about 50 > > tetras (mix of > > > > cardinals, black phantom, and bleeding hearts). > > They eat > > everything > > > > most of the time--frozen bloodworms, discus > > bits, flakes, frozen > > > > mosquito larvae. I haven't seen much of a > > change in size, but > > it's > > > > only been two months. How long does it take > > discus to grow from > > 4" > > > to > > > > 8"? Is it on the order of years or months? > > > > > > > > > > > > Andy > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15630	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 10/13/2005
Subject: Re: help with snails in cold water

I think it's in in the 70's last time I checked. I'll leave them in and give a try; what other snails might be good? Emily kristopher helsing <punk3r12@...> wrote: how cold is cold because my 74 degree tank has no problem with trumpets breeging like crazy even with 3 border botias i put in there to keep them in check... --- Emily Tenczar <bababanana@...> wrote: > First of all I love snails and I encourage them to > breed in my aquariuams. I have a colony of what I > think are trumpet snails. They breed really well in > my > 2 gal betta tanks, but I've been having problems > getting them to thrive in my cold water tanks > (goldfish and others). > > Do these snails die or refuse to reproduce when they > are too cold? > > Should I remove all the trumpet snails in my cold > tanks and put them in a warmer tank? I have an > invertebrate tank (no fish allowed!) that contains > snails, scuds and leaches right now. Would these > inverts be happier with a heater in their tank? > > What kinds of snails would be best suited for cold > water tanks? Something that can reproduce in cold > water and likes to eat algae but goes easy on the > plants would be wonderful. I've got a nice supply of > algae going in the tank right now and I'd like > snails > to keep it in check. > > Emily > __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 http://mail.yahoo.com Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15631	From: aclaar877	Date: 10/13/2005
Subject: Re: Discus Growth Rate

Linda, I'm in the Printers building on Locust and 16th. You? Andy --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, dragon6435@a... wrote: > > Hey Andy! I'm in downtown St. Louis too...small world. > > I didn't really want to mess with discus but a friend had several pairs and > one pair was not thriving in the mix so I agreed to foster them. I now have 10 > discus combined with some rummynose and neons. They actually do better for > me than some of the so called "easy" fish. I feed mine mysis, bloodworms, > beefheart and Omega One Colorflakes and veggie flakes. The tank is heavily > planted with various swords and I have driftwood for hidey holes and decor. They > seem quite happy in the tank with it set up this way. As for growth, the ones > I've noticed growing the fastest are my red turquoise. No idea if some > varieties do grow faster, but these definitely appear to have a foot up on their > peers. > > Whereabouts downtown are you?? > > Linda > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15632	From: Cydne McCown	Date: 10/13/2005
Subject: Re: Hi, New to Group

Hi Nick! I hope you don't mind some pointers on starting up a tank! I tell all beginners to start with the biggest tank you can afford to get. Many people start off with a 10 gallon tank and that is a size that is really difficult to be sucessful in if you don't have much aqarium experience. You also need to decide what kind of tank you are going to keep. Planning will definately help you stay in the right direction. By kind of tank, I mean do you want a Community tank, where you have top dwellers, middle dwellers and bottom dwellers? If that is what you want, then you need to decide whether you want to go with a "Natural" tank or a "Theme" tank. Natural tanks are those that have only things that occur naturally in a nature setting, rocks, gravel, live or plastic plants, driftwood, etc. For an example of a Specialty tank or a Theme tank, I will tell you about a friend that had a strange sense of humor with his tanks. Had a 20 gallon tank with black gravel and put black paper on the back of his aquarium, and put blind cavefish and albino corydoras. It was not what I would call a pretty tank, but it was very effective. Oh you also have to decide how you want to filtrate your tank. So it is all a matter of educating yourself. I learned a whole lot about the hobby just by hanging out with aquarium enthusiasts at my local aquarium society where I lived. We would have shows each month, it was alot of fun! You should see if there is one in your area! I specialize in South American natural tanks. I am thinking about branching out into African cichlids and Asian fishes, but I live in an apartment, kind of hard to set up more than one large tank and a hospital tank, you know? Cydne nicolasqueen <nicolasqueen@...> wrote: Hello all, My name is Nick, and I just joined. I am still very new to the hobby, and currently I have no fish. The last time I kept them, I had very bad beginner's luck. I am hoping to start once again, and this time do it right, and as such i am hoping to gain insights from you guys. So hi all, and hope to get to know everyone well! Nick --------------------------------- Yahoo! Music Unlimited - Access over 1 million songs. Try it free. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15633	From: dragon6435@aol.com	Date: 10/13/2005
Subject: Re: Discus Growth Rate

In a message dated 10/13/05 11:30:31 AM Central Daylight Time, aclaar877@... writes: > Linda, > > I'm in the Printers building on Locust and 16th. You? > > > Andy > Ah, one of the loft developments! I'm at Mansion House, down by the Arch. Do you attend the MASI events? They have marvelous auctions several times a year. There is another coming up next month. I picked up some nice Mickey Mouse Platies at the last one, and some plants. Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15634	From: pamphetteplace	Date: 10/13/2005
Subject: Info on shipping bettas requested

Hiyas I have been researching how to best ship bettas. I was wondering if anyone has had experience doing this. Someone had commented on another site that the USPS express service had been getting somewhat poor as of late. I am looking at shipping supplies on the majestic betta site. any input is much appreciated TIA

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15635	From: pamphetteplace	Date: 10/13/2005
Subject: Info on shipping bettas requested

Hiyas I have been researching how to best ship bettas. I was wondering if anyone has had experience doing this. Someone had commented on another site that the USPS express service had been getting somewhat poor as of late. I am looking at shipping supplies on the majestic betta site. any input is much appreciated TIA

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15636	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 10/13/2005
Subject: Re: Hi, New to Group

welcome nick! you will get some good advice here no doubt. -valeen --- nicolasqueen <nicolasqueen@...> wrote: > Hello all, > > My name is Nick, and I just joined. I am still very new to the hobby, > and currently I have no fish. The last time I kept them, I had very > bad beginner's luck. I am hoping to start once again, and this time do > it right, and as such i am hoping to gain insights from you guys. > > So hi all, and hope to get to know everyone well! > > Nick > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez valeendgonzalez@...

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15637	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 10/13/2005
Subject: Re: Discus Growth Rate

That is why I was asking...no need to be an ass. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Thursday, October 13, 2005 7:56 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Discus Growth Rate Eric, Yes, I'm sure these are Pheromones! I appreciate your enthusiasm in this Group, but I would suggest you learn more about what you are questioning before blindly challenging something it appears you have little knowledge about. While there of course are certain pheromones (amino acid chemical compounds) associated with sexual attraction which may be better known than most others, there are many other pheromones (hormones -- the terms may be used interchangeably) found in animals. In fish, there are pheromones associated with anti predator cues, social cues, reproductive cues as well as appetite-inducing cues. Associated with the growth- inhibiting hormone in fish is also a closely linked immune- suppressing pheromone. In small groups of fish, this hormone acts as a stimulate to the group to increase their immune system. In larger groups of fish, this hormone is increased, resulting in an increase in the immune system of all fish within the group. However, in yet larger groups of fish where overcrowding has occurred, this hormone acts as an immune suppressant. This will allow weaker fish to become ill and die off, stabilizing the population. These pheromones not only have an influence on fish reproduction, but also help control shoaling, feeding and migration. In humans, while genetics play the major role in our growth, there are certain pheromones/hormones (among others) secreted by the pituitary gland, namely Somatotropin, which also help regulate how tall we grow. This has little to do with "sexual attraction", as you suggest. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > > You sure those are Pheromones Ray...Pheromones are sexual attractant > hormones... > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Wednesday, October 12, 2005 5:55 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Discus Growth Rate > > > Oops, Just realized (as I was changing out some of my own water), the > growth inhibiting secretion fish give out is spelled Pheromones (not > Theromones as spelled previously). Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> > wrote: > > > > Andy, Unless your fish have been stunted, you should have seen > some > > growth in them in 2 months. Often, as we see our fish every day, > we > > don't notice the growth in them -- that may be the explanation in > your > > case. If there truly has been little (or none) growth in them, > then it > > may well be that they've been stunted. Hard to say if this > happened > > before or after you got them. A 4" Discus should be approx. 7 or > so > > months old; a 10 month old Discus can often get to 6" in that time > > frame. This of course all depends on many variables (food, water, > tank > > size, etc.). On average, Discus take about 18 months to mature and > > start breeding at which time they're usually at least 7" to 8" (or > > more). While you seem to be feeding them a good variety, you don't > say > > how often you feed. Best growth will be seen when feeding at least > 3 > > times a day -- and up to 5 times (if you have the time). You do > not > > say how often or how much water you change. Again, best growth > will be > > see with large, frequent water changes -- 50% water changes every 2 > or > > 3 days is not too much, especially with 50 Tetras in the tank. All > > fish give off growth inhibiting Theromones which need to be gotten > rid > > of through water changing (not to mention keeping your water > parameters > > to their best liking). Too, while a 155g is a nice size tank for > the > > Discus, you might want to consider cutting back slightly on the > number > > of Tetras -- Bleeding Hearts can get bigger than most of the > group. > > Also, with having Tetras in the tank, I'm wondering what > temperature > > you're keeping them at since the Family does best in the mid to > upper > > 70's (not much more) and your Discus should be around 84 o for > growing > > fish. > Ray > > > \ > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "aclaar877" <aclaar877@y...> > wrote: > > > > > > Two months ago I purchased four discus, about 3-4" in size. They > are > > > doing great in a 155g planted tank with about 50 tetras (mix of > > > cardinals, black phantom, and bleeding hearts). They eat > everything > > > most of the time--frozen bloodworms, discus bits, flakes, frozen > > > mosquito larvae. I haven't seen much of a change in size, but > it's > > > only been two months. How long does it take discus to grow from > 4" > > to > > > 8"? Is it on the order of years or months? > > > > > > > > > Andy > > > > > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Mar > ine+fish&c=2&s=37&.sig=ifFK7dXwnimgasbXc9Qw3w> biology Marine > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? t=ms&k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine > +fish&c=2&s=37&.sig=7uvV14BE0FL5qQP83-gHGA> fish > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15638	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 10/14/2005
Subject: Re: Discus Growth Rate

If, as you say, you were merely asking a question, why was it that you came on seemingly as if you knew what Pheromones were in stating that "Pheromones are sexually attractant hormones", saying this as is you were sure that's all they are. Your question certainly had the appearance of asking me to rethink my referral to these hormones for use in any other function, almost as if you thought I was wrong. As it appeared you did not fully understand what Pheromones are, I went on to explain exactly what was involved with them. There's no need to resort to calling me names on this Forum, even if I would like to call you a first class jerk, which I will not do. Before resorting to name calling, you might consider that there may have been some sort of miscommunication, which I'm tending to believe. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > > That is why I was asking...no need to be an ass. > > Eric > > > _____ > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > Sent: Thursday, October 13, 2005 7:56 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Discus Growth Rate > > > Eric, Yes, I'm sure these are Pheromones! I appreciate your > enthusiasm in this Group, but I would suggest you learn more about > what you are questioning before blindly challenging something it > appears you have little knowledge about. While there of course are > certain pheromones (amino acid chemical compounds) associated with > sexual attraction which may be better known than most others, there > are many other pheromones (hormones -- the terms may be used > interchangeably) found in animals. In fish, there are pheromones > associated with anti predator cues, social cues, reproductive cues as > well as appetite-inducing cues. Associated with the growth- > inhibiting hormone in fish is also a closely linked immune- > suppressing pheromone. In small groups of fish, this hormone acts as > a stimulate to the group to increase their immune system. In larger > groups of fish, this hormone is increased, resulting in an increase > in the immune system of all fish within the group. However, in yet > larger groups of fish where overcrowding has occurred, this hormone > acts as an immune suppressant. This will allow weaker fish to become > ill and die off, stabilizing the population. These pheromones not > only have an influence on fish reproduction, but also help control > shoaling, feeding and migration. In humans, while genetics play the > major role in our growth, there are certain pheromones/hormones > (among others) secreted by the pituitary gland, namely Somatotropin, > which also help regulate how tall we grow. This has little to do > with "sexual attraction", as you suggest. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Eric Roberts" <woad@w...> wrote: > > > > You sure those are Pheromones Ray...Pheromones are sexual attractant > > hormones... > > > > Eric > > > > > > _____ > > > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > > Behalf Of Ray Wetzel > > Sent: Wednesday, October 12, 2005 5:55 PM > > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Discus Growth Rate > > > > > > Oops, Just realized (as I was changing out some of my own water), > the > > growth inhibiting secretion fish give out is spelled Pheromones > (not > > Theromones as spelled previously). > Ray > > > \ > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" > <sevenspringss@w...> > > wrote: > > > > > > Andy, Unless your fish have been stunted, you should have seen > > some > > > growth in them in 2 months. Often, as we see our fish every day, > > we > > > don't notice the growth in them -- that may be the explanation in > > your > > > case. If there truly has been little (or none) growth in them, > > then it > > > may well be that they've been stunted. Hard to say if this > > happened > > > before or after you got them. A 4" Discus should be approx. 7 or > > so > > > months old; a 10 month old Discus can often get to 6" in that > time > > > frame. This of course all depends on many variables (food, > water, > > tank > > > size, etc.). On average, Discus take about 18 months to mature > and > > > start breeding at which time they're usually at least 7" to 8" > (or > > > more). While you seem to be feeding them a good variety, you > don't > > say > > > how often you feed. Best growth will be seen when feeding at > least > > 3 > > > times a day -- and up to 5 times (if you have the time). You do > > not > > > say how often or how much water you change. Again, best growth > > will be > > > see with large, frequent water changes -- 50% water changes every > 2 > > or > > > 3 days is not too much, especially with 50 Tetras in the tank. > All > > > fish give off growth inhibiting Theromones which need to be > gotten > > rid > > > of through water changing (not to mention keeping your water > > parameters > > > to their best liking). Too, while a 155g is a nice size tank for > > the > > > Discus, you might want to consider cutting back slightly on the > > number > > > of Tetras -- Bleeding Hearts can get bigger than most of the > > group. > > > Also, with having Tetras in the tank, I'm wondering what > > temperature > > > you're keeping them at since the Family does best in the mid to > > upper > > > 70's (not much more) and your Discus should be around 84 o for > > growing > > > fish. > > Ray > > > > > > \ > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "aclaar877" <aclaar877@y...> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > Two months ago I purchased four discus, about 3-4" in size. > They > > are > > > > doing great in a 155g planted tank with about 50 tetras (mix of > > > > cardinals, black phantom, and bleeding hearts). They eat > > everything > > > > most of the time--frozen bloodworms, discus bits, flakes, > frozen > > > > mosquito larvae. I haven't seen much of a change in size, but > > it's > > > > only been two months. How long does it take discus to grow > from > > 4" > > > to > > > > 8"? Is it on the order of years or months? > > > > > > > > > > > > Andy > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, > thanks. > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to > > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY > the SUBJECT > > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > Marine > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? > t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Mar > > ine+fish&c=2&s=37&.sig=ifFK7dXwnimgasbXc9Qw3w> biology Marine > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads? > t=ms&k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine > > +fish&c=2&s=37&.sig=7uvV14BE0FL5qQP83-gHGA> fish > > > > _____ > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? > subject=Unsubscribe> > > > > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service > > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > _____ > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > * Visit your group "AquaticLife > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. > > > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com? subject=Unsubscribe> > > > * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . > > > _____ > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15639	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 10/14/2005
Subject: question about leaches in pond

my moms bf has a pond outside and just discovered leaches about a inch in size in the filter and he says they are on the bottom of the pond as well.. he doesn't want to kill the plants or goldfish that are or have been living in the pond for 3 years now anyone know how to get rid of the leaches or why they got there.. thanks Shannon [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15641	From: Aaron	Date: 10/14/2005
Subject: TROPICAL FISH HOBBYIST MAGAZINE - SPECIAL HOLIDAY RATE!

Happy Holidays! In celebration of the upcoming holiday season, Tropical Fish Hobbyist Magazine, The Leading Aquarium Magazine For Over Half a Century, invites you, a valued member of this forum, to subscribe to TFH and to give a gift at our very special seasonal rates! 2006 promises to be yet again, another historical year for TFH, so subscribe/renew today and when you do, give the gift of aquatic knowledge as well! This limited time gift subscription offer, now valid for both new and renewal subscriptions, will allow you to become a part of history and join the thousands and thousands of aquarium hobbyists and experts around the world who already read TFH magazine and books. Subscribe/Renew your subscription for only $19.95 for one year and receivEOne FREE freshwater or saltwater book+ One FREE collector's edition bookmarkGive a holiday gift when you subscribe or renew for $19.951st gift ONLY $15.00 + free bookmark (new subscribers only)*Gift card included*2nd gift only $1.00 + free bookmark (new subscribers only) *Gift card included* Top 10 Reasons to Subscribe/Renew Now! 1) Up to 70 pages MORE than other aquarium publications 2) The BEST & latest discoveries, product innovations, and inventions 3) Tips, secrets, and trustworthy advice from respected experts 4) MORE world-class photography 5) The MOST up-to-the-minute information to achieve real success with fish and aquariums 6) Time-saving techniques and easy maintenance information for BETTER aquariums 7) MORE profit-making tips for breeders and other pros 8) The BEST tips, secrets, and trustworthy advice from respected experts 9) MORE thrilling articles on exploration, conservation, and captive breeding 10) Join thousands and thousands of responsible aquarium owners who read the BIGGER and BETTER TFH Magazine. Please note that all holiday subscriptions will begin with the January 2006 issue!RECEIVE YOUR FREE FABULOUS FISH CALENDAR WITH THE DECEMBER ISSUE! Call our holiday hotline today to place your order: 1-888-859-9034 or email: jdondero@... or cbaran@... **Please note that Canada & Mexico must add $11.00 U.S.D. per subscription and Foreign (outside of lace w:st="on">U.S.lace>) must add $20.00 U.S.D. per subscription** [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15642	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 10/14/2005
Subject: Need to sell a whisper water filter and plastic plants.

The whispter water filter is for up to a 60 gallon tank and I have several cartidges for it. I also have several large plastic plants for sale too. I have them all boxed up and they have never been used. I need to sell them and I will sell them for $70 + $20 shipping. I take money orders and I will ship within 48 hours after reciept of payment. The filter and the plants are brand new never been used. Thanks, Beth http://fa.f-realm.com/ Fanfiction Axis. http://e.webring.com/hub?ring=siriusblack Sirius Black webring. http://e.webring.com/hub?ring=remuslupin Remus Lupin webring http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sailorsenshiocs/ for all original and series characters of Sailor Moon. __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15643	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 10/14/2005
Subject: My Angelfish just laid eggs!

On the intake valve of the water filter. I think it's the male who is rubbing against them now to fertilize them. What do I do to protect the eggs from the other fishes in the tank? I don't even have another tank to put them in beyond the 30 gallon with the young Angelfishes in. I'm not even sure if they will hatch and grow to full size. I guess they love the tank if they are breeding. Help! Beth

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15644	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 10/14/2005
Subject: Re: My Angelfish just laid eggs!

It's the tubing that they laid their eggs on not the intake valve itself. But what do I do? Beth --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Beth Brownell" <spencer_creek_studios@y...> wrote: > > On the intake valve of the water filter. > I think it's the male who is rubbing against them now to > fertilize them. > What do I do to protect the eggs from the other fishes in the > tank? I don't even have another tank to put them in beyond the 30 > gallon with the young Angelfishes in. > I'm not even sure if they will hatch and grow to full size. > I guess they love the tank if they are breeding. > > Help! > > Beth

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15645	From: pamphetteplace	Date: 10/14/2005
Subject: Re: My Angelfish just laid eggs!

Hi Beth About the only thing you could do to protect them would be to somehow remove the intake and put it in another tank to hatch out. Frequently that is done to obtain a successful angel fish spawn as the parents often eat the eggs. The other tank would need to be exact replication of the original tank re: water and temp etc. Do not allow air to contact the eggs if you decide to move them. Then you would want to use an antifungal as angel eggs are famous for being killed by fungus. It is normally the male that passes over the eggs fertilizing them after they are laid. My angels lay eggs at least once per week and they always end up eating the eggs even when they are the only fish in the tank. Good luck --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Beth Brownell" <spencer_creek_studios@y...> wrote: > > On the intake valve of the water filter. > I think it's the male who is rubbing against them now to fertilize them. > What do I do to protect the eggs from the other fishes in the tank? I > don't even have another tank to put them in beyond the 30 gallon with > the young Angelfishes in. > I'm not even sure if they will hatch and grow to full size. > I guess they love the tank if they are breeding. > > Help! > > Beth >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15646	From: pamphetteplace	Date: 10/14/2005
Subject: Re: Hi, New to Group

-Hi Nick Welcome to the group, glad to see you didnt let one negative experience keep you from fishkeepin'. We have all had a few of them. Pam >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15647	From: Cydne McCown	Date: 10/14/2005
Subject: Re: My Angelfish just laid eggs!

Hey Beth! Let me add my comments to this. My Angels started breeding and the male was actually "fanning" the eggs. That means he was making sure the eggs got oxygen-rich water, and he also would go over them with his mouth to make sure the unfertilized eggs or eggs that were starting to turn white were removed promptly. My suggestion to you for this first breeding is to wait and see what your Angel parents do. My pair did quite well through the egg laying and the squiggle stage, (when the eggs hatch out at about three days after being layed and they are still attached to the yolk of the eggs), but when they became free swimmers, the male went nuts trying to keep them all together. That is when I started losing the babies, one at a time. The male would go get the stragglers from the main group, pick them up in his mouth, and swim back to the main group, but instead of spitting out the baby, he would swallow instead. Hey, no one ever claimed Angels were very bright! So what I did was to put a piece of natural slate (not part of a chalkboard please) in their tank, and once they got use to that being there, they readily used it to spawn on. Then you have the choice of transfering the Angels to another tank, (which could mean that they forget they ever spawned or even knew each other, hey no one ever said Angels were bright), and put that anti-fungus stuff in there, I forget what it is called, but it turns the water bright blue, and put airstones under the slate for agitation. Or you could choose to move the slate to another tank and do the blue stuff and the airstones that way. Best way to situate the slate is to prop it with the eggs facing down and the airstones underneath it. It would look like an H I suppose or an upsidedown U, put it about 6" or so above the airstones and supported on either end. Sometimes, just letting the parents go through a few spawnings will allow them to stumble onto what works for them, but it is true that most tame Angel parents just are not bright enough to do it. Cydne Hi Beth About the only thing you could do to protect them would be to somehow remove the intake and put it in another tank to hatch out. Frequently that is done to obtain a successful angel fish spawn as the parents often eat the eggs. The other tank would need to be exact replication of the original tank re: water and temp etc. Do not allow air to contact the eggs if you decide to move them. Then you would want to use an antifungal as angel eggs are famous for being killed by fungus. It is normally the male that passes over the eggs fertilizing them after they are laid. My angels lay eggs at least once per week and they always end up eating the eggs even when they are the only fish in the tank. Good luck --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Beth Brownell" <spencer_creek_studios@y...> wrote: > > On the intake valve of the water filter. > I think it's the male who is rubbing against them now to fertilize them. > What do I do to protect the eggs from the other fishes in the tank? I > don't even have another tank to put them in beyond the 30 gallon with > the young Angelfishes in. > I'm not even sure if they will hatch and grow to full size. > I guess they love the tank if they are breeding. > > Help! > > Beth > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Music Unlimited - Access over 1 million songs. Try it free. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15648	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 10/14/2005
Subject: Brooklyn Aquarium Society Presents: 19th ANNUAL GIANT TROPICAL FISH

Reminder from the Calendar of AquaticLife Brooklyn Aquarium Society Presents: 19th ANNUAL GIANT TROPICAL FISH AUCTION Friday October 14, 2005 7:30 pm - 8:30 pm This event does not repeat. Event Location: St. Brendan's Church East 12 Street & Avenue O in Brooklyn Street: E.12th St. & Ave. O, City, State, Zip: Bklyn NY Phone: (718) 837-4455 Notes: http://www.brooklynaquariumsociety.com/main.htm Brooklyn Aquarium Society Presents: 19th ANNUAL GIANTTROPICAL FISH AUCTION Featuring: Freshwater & Marine Fish, Corals, Plants & Dry goods. Free Parking � Free Refreshments Free Product Samples ADVERTISEMENT Copyright ©  2005  Yahoo! Inc. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy - Terms of Service

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15649	From: SuNnY	Date: 10/14/2005
Subject: Re: My Angelfish just laid eggs!

Hey Beth ! I have bred angels in the past, but to have a successful batch you have to go thru a lot of work, but mind you its fun. For this you will need a few Grow out tanks, with sponge filters, heaters, lots of water changes, Brine shrimp hatchery etc. So if you are ready for all this then only go ahead otherwise let nature take its own course....SuNnY ! If you are keen to invest time and money then let me know and i shall fwd you the details of Breeding angels.......SuNnY !! --------------------------------- Yahoo! Music Unlimited - Access over 1 million songs. Try it free. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15650	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 10/14/2005
Subject: Bad news. re: My Angelfish just laid eggs!

Two hours after I turned out the lights on my tank, I checked the eggs to find no eggs on the pipe at all. My wonderful future Angels gone! :( I cannot believe that they ate the babies. I figure that they didn't fertilized like they thought and ate them to get rid of them. :( I guess the next time I see my Angelfishs laying eggs, to put a floating plant near them and keep an eye on them a bit better. Beth

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15651	From: Cydne McCown	Date: 10/14/2005
Subject: Re: Bad news. re: My Angelfish just laid eggs!

Yes, Beth, that is another thing I forgot to mention, if the light is on when the eggs are laid, dont turn off the lights until you can remove the eggs or the Angels. Visa Versa, if the light is out when the eggs are laid. Bottom line, dont make any changes until you have secured the eggs if you are going to try and raise them yourself. Cydne Beth Brownell <spencer_creek_studios@...> wrote: Two hours after I turned out the lights on my tank, I checked the eggs to find no eggs on the pipe at all. My wonderful future Angels gone! :( I cannot believe that they ate the babies. I figure that they didn't fertilized like they thought and ate them to get rid of them. :( I guess the next time I see my Angelfishs laying eggs, to put a floating plant near them and keep an eye on them a bit better. Beth Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Music Unlimited - Access over 1 million songs. Try it free. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15652	From: Cydne	Date: 10/14/2005
Subject: Now my Angels are laying eggs!

Well! Love must be in the "air" or water???? My Angelfish must have gotten jealous, now they are laying eggs! First time for this pair. How about that? Cydne

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15653	From: Donna Ransome	Date: 10/15/2005
Subject: North Jersey Aquarium Society Fall Show

I see on their website there is a fish show and auction November 4-6 at the Meadowlands. Has anyone been to this event before? Would you recommend it? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15654	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 10/15/2005
Subject: Re: North Jersey Aquarium Society Fall Show

Hi Donna, As a member of the Board of Directors of the North Jersey Aquarium Society which is putting on this show and auction, I can heartily recommend this annual event as something that is always looked forward to by hobbyists in the Tri-State (NJ, NY and CT) area and is well attended, being one of the most popular events in the Northeast. The best day for viewing the show is on Saturday, Nov. 5th (preferably afternoon) as show break-down happens starting early Sunday morning. However, the hugh fish auction starts on Sunday at 12:00PM, with viewing starting at 11:00PM. The admission to the show and auction is free, however there is a $2 fee to obtain a bidder card if you want to bid on the fish. There are generally up to 400 to 500 bags of fish which go for prices in the wholesale range, on average, so you're bound to find something. Often, the auction will last until 7:00PM or so, with thesd last bags of fish going for $1 as most people have left by that time. Dry goods, such as filters, food and heaters, etc., are also included in the auction as well. Friday (Nov. 4th) is set-up day from 6:00PM tp 10:00PM so relatively little is available for viewing as many entries are still coming in the following morning, but your welcome to come in and look around. If you need directions, the club website address is < NJAS.net >. Would be glad to send you a show flyer if needed, if you'd like to send me your snail mail address. Hope to see you there. Regards, Ray \ -- - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Donna Ransome <djransome@o...> wrote: > > I see on their website there is a fish show and auction November 4-6 at the > Meadowlands. > > > > Has anyone been to this event before? Would you recommend it? > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15655	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 10/15/2005
Subject: Re: Bad news. re: My Angelfish just laid eggs!

you could also have 2 females...my angels do the same. We thought we had a pair, but the eggs never fertilized. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Beth Brownell Sent: Friday, October 14, 2005 11:10 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Bad news. re: My Angelfish just laid eggs! Two hours after I turned out the lights on my tank, I checked the eggs to find no eggs on the pipe at all. My wonderful future Angels gone! :( I cannot believe that they ate the babies. I figure that they didn't fertilized like they thought and ate them to get rid of them. :( I guess the next time I see my Angelfishs laying eggs, to put a floating plant near them and keep an eye on them a bit better. Beth Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15656	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 10/15/2005
Subject: NCORE

For those of you interested in reefs, here is an interesting site. Fishadmin people, feel free to pass this along to your members. National Center for Caribbean Coral Reef Research [pdf] http://www.ncoremiami.org/ A number of research centers are concerned with the state of the world's coral reefs, and the National Center for Caribbean Coral Reef Research (NCORE) is one such center of scholarly excellence. Located at the University of Miami, NCORE is primarily concerned with the analysis and predication of coral reef resilience. On their site, visitors can learn about some of their primary research initiatives, such as their work on the Florida reef tract and on tracking the effects of climate change on the reef communities. The general public will also find their digital map series quite useful as well. In this section, users can examine a number of complex digital maps and images that provide information about the state of coral cover around Puerto Rico, South Florida, and the Bahamas. >From The Scout Report, Copyright Internet Scout Project 1994-2005. http://scout.wisc.edu/

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15657	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 10/15/2005
Subject: What to do?

Well, this past Spring I inherited a pl*co from a friend who had to take the fish ("two boring grey fish" who colored out to be black skirts and "Mr. Big", a foot long pl*c) when she bought a second-hand 55. Since I'm the one responsible for corrupting her in the first place (and happen to really like pl*cs!), I agreed to take him and he has resided in my garden pond all summer with a couple koi and an assortment of comets, happily munching on zucchini, algae, algae wafers and whatever else I came up with to toss in. Now, with Fall fast approaching, I'm a bit torn about what to do with him. Yeah, I knew this day would come but, now that it has, some of my previous plans have changed so I'm sorting out the best option with what I have. The only tanks I currently have set up that can accomodate his needs (fit him somewhat without aquascaping armaggedon) are 2 46 bowfronts with some fancy goldfish. I also have a 55 I can use (not currently set up), but am trying to sell my 75 (mom hates the stand and I have to yield on this one -- anyone want it? LOL) I also have a 125 gallon fiberglass dog kennel which looks like a big institutional green vat (32" X 32" X 28", I believe), which I'm using to move some of the pond fish into for the winter. My choices: 1. sell him at one of the upcoming local aquarium society auctions. In this day of planted tanks, do people actually want big pl*cs? 2. put him in the 125 with enough driftwood to keep him from trying to rasp fiberglass (which may be hard and smooth enough to resist most of his efforts -- it's very hard and 1/4" thick) 3. pop him into a 46 bow for the winter and increase water changes (do at least 33% changes each week now) 4. set up the 55 for him but the bows have better turning room He has grown this summer -- haven't measured him, but considering he came from a home with nonexistant waterchanges, etc., he's most likely a "Petco special" "common pl*c" (quite attractive really, brown with lots of darker brown spots like small giraffe markings all over) I have no idea how much larger he may get -- at least he's pretty laidback. Any thoughts? And no drawn butter jokes! Thanks! Vicky Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Contact mosherd@... or (301-451-9390) =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: FCR-Cancer-Support@yahoogroups.com Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@... 919-513-1467, Dr London @ calondon@... 530-754-5711 _AND_ Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15658	From: Donna Ransome	Date: 10/15/2005
Subject: Re: North Jersey Aquarium Society Fall Show

Thanks for the tip on coming Saturday afternoon, I'm planning to attend. Sounds great! -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ray Wetzel Sent: Saturday, October 15, 2005 9:42 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: North Jersey Aquarium Society Fall Show Hi Donna, As a member of the Board of Directors of the North Jersey Aquarium Society which is putting on this show and auction, I can heartily recommend this annual event as something that is always looked forward to by hobbyists in the Tri-State (NJ, NY and CT) area and is well attended, being one of the most popular events in the Northeast. The best day for viewing the show is on Saturday, Nov. 5th (preferably afternoon) as show break-down happens starting early Sunday morning. However, the hugh fish auction starts on Sunday at 12:00PM, with viewing starting at 11:00PM. The admission to the show and auction is free, however there is a $2 fee to obtain a bidder card if you want to bid on the fish. There are generally up to 400 to 500 bags of fish which go for prices in the wholesale range, on average, so you're bound to find something. Often, the auction will last until 7:00PM or so, with thesd last bags of fish going for $1 as most people have left by that time. Dry goods, such as filters, food and heaters, etc., are also included in the auction as well. Friday (Nov. 4th) is set-up day from 6:00PM tp 10:00PM so relatively little is available for viewing as many entries are still coming in the following morning, but your welcome to come in and look around. If you need directions, the club website address is < NJAS.net >. Would be glad to send you a show flyer if needed, if you'd like to send me your snail mail address. Hope to see you there. Regards, Ray \ -- - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Donna Ransome <djransome@o...> wrote: > > I see on their website there is a fish show and auction November 4-6 at the > Meadowlands. > > > > Has anyone been to this event before? Would you recommend it? > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15659	From: Donna Ransome	Date: 10/15/2005
Subject: Planning a African Rift Tank

Last year, my son was working at WalMart during the summer and became interested in the Oscars there. I thought I might give him a tank for Christmas. I joined Aquatic Life. Lucky for him, I realized before Christmas that Mom was the one with the interest in an aquarium! I've been lurking and researching for a year. Had small aquariums as a kid, but never heard of "the cycle". Today, I bought a 38 gallon tank, light hood and cabinet. I have well water and it tested pH 7.4 at the fish store. These are the fish (one male, two females) I am considering. I realize the pH will have to be higher.: * 3 Pseudotropheus demasoni * 3 Labidochromis caeruleus * 3 Synodontis petricola I'm going to take my time choosing filters, heater, rocks, substrate, etc. I'm sure I will be asking for lots of opinions. There are lots of mixed opinions on stocking levels. Some sources say the above fish should not be kept in anything smaller than a 50 gallon tank, and other sources suggest the African mbunas do well in an overstocked 30 gallon tank with twice the recommended filtration. Opinions from this group? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15660	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 10/15/2005
Subject: Re: Planning a African Rift Tank

mbuna do well in overstocked situations because it divides the fishs attention between multiple targets minimizing the amount of deaths. The extra filtration is probably a good idea. dont over filter though because the mbunas like to eat the algea on rocks.. this is all my opinion from experience. Kris --- Donna Ransome <djransome@...> wrote: > Last year, my son was working at WalMart during the > summer and became > interested in the Oscars there. I thought I might > give him a tank for > Christmas. I joined Aquatic Life. Lucky for him, I > realized before > Christmas that Mom was the one with the interest in > an aquarium! > > > > I've been lurking and researching for a year. Had > small aquariums as a kid, > but never heard of "the cycle". Today, I bought a > 38 gallon tank, light > hood and cabinet. > > > > I have well water and it tested pH 7.4 at the fish > store. These are the > fish (one male, two females) I am considering. I > realize the pH will have > to be higher.: > > * 3 Pseudotropheus demasoni > * 3 Labidochromis caeruleus > * 3 Synodontis petricola > > > > I'm going to take my time choosing filters, heater, > rocks, substrate, etc. > I'm sure I will be asking for lots of opinions. > > > > There are lots of mixed opinions on stocking levels. > Some sources say the > above fish should not be kept in anything smaller > than a 50 gallon tank, and > other sources suggest the African mbunas do well in > an overstocked 30 gallon > tank with twice the recommended filtration. > > > > Opinions from this group? > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Yahoo! Music Unlimited Access over 1 million songs. Try it free. http://music.yahoo.com/unlimited/

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15661	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 10/16/2005
Subject: Re: Planning a African Rift Tank

Hi Donna, True enough, "the cycle" was not heard of back when we were kids, presumeably as little was known about it back then (yet somehow, "strangely enough", all our fish survived). Very little, if anything, was even written about it as it was apparently a topic which was unknown, at least in the hobby circle. It has been suggested that the fish were stronger back then, but one thing's for sure -- no one ever waited 6 weeks after setting up their aquarium before stocking it and fatalities because of this were unknown! Is "the cycle" over-rated or just a precaution?; (no comment here), but as we now know -- it is an established fact. \ Moving on to your Rift Lake fish concerns -- while I understand your preference and wants to maintain several Mbuna species in one aquarium (which can of course be done, especially with the less aggressive ones), best results are usually obtained with housing just one species to a tank. In my experience, a minimum aquarium length of 36" seems to work out the best for trouble free co-habitation of a group of most small to medium sized Mbunas (3" - 5"), preferably (but not necessarily) 18" wide, whether it be a 30 Breeder, a 40 Breeder or a 50 gallon. As you may well know by now, lots of rockwork, caves and/or clay flowerpots (on their sides) is a prerequisite. A minimum of at least 7 (or more, depending upon size) specimens should be attempted to be housed together with an approximate ratio of 2 (or 3) males and 5 or 6 (or more) females, for best longevity of all fish involved as being the safest situation from aggression induced mortalities. \ Your 36" long by 12" wide 38 gallon should be fine for a group (of at least 7) Labidochromis caeruleus (only), as (1) they are a somewhat smaller species and (2) they are less aggressive. Three Synodontis petricola with them would work out great. Keep in mind, Mbuna do not really require height so much for peaceful co-habitation as they do length of the aquarium, with width being the secondary consideration. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Donna Ransome <djransome@o...> wrote: > > Last year, my son was working at WalMart during the summer and became > interested in the Oscars there. I thought I might give him a tank for > Christmas. I joined Aquatic Life. Lucky for him, I realized before > Christmas that Mom was the one with the interest in an aquarium! > > > > I've been lurking and researching for a year. Had small aquariums as a kid, > but never heard of "the cycle". Today, I bought a 38 gallon tank, light > hood and cabinet. > > > > I have well water and it tested pH 7.4 at the fish store. These are the > fish (one male, two females) I am considering. I realize the pH will have > to be higher.: > > * 3 Pseudotropheus demasoni > * 3 Labidochromis caeruleus > * 3 Synodontis petricola > > > > I'm going to take my time choosing filters, heater, rocks, substrate, etc. > I'm sure I will be asking for lots of opinions. > > > > There are lots of mixed opinions on stocking levels. Some sources say the > above fish should not be kept in anything smaller than a 50 gallon tank, and > other sources suggest the African mbunas do well in an overstocked 30 gallon > tank with twice the recommended filtration. > > > > Opinions from this group? > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15662	From: andrew davis	Date: 10/16/2005
Subject: Re: question about leaches in pond

Leeches on a pond are usually benign, unless you are a snail, which is the 'usual' prey of leeches. Just as snails can get to a pond on the feathers of a bird, so can leeches. Leeches are a lot tougher and resilient than most other critters on a pond, any attempt to suppress them is likely to have some collateral damage Unless you are real sure they pose some problem they might best be left alone to go about their quiet and discrete duel with the aquatic snails Regards, andy http://www.members.aol.com/abdavisnc/swglist.html ----------------------oo------------------------- --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, agentscullyeyore@a... wrote: > > my moms bf has a pond outside and just discovered leaches about a inch in > size in the filter and he says they are on the bottom of the pond as well.. he > doesn't want to kill the plants or goldfish that are or have been living in > the pond for 3 years now anyone know how to get rid of the leaches or why they > got there.. thanks Shannon > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15663	From: SuNnY	Date: 10/16/2005
Subject: Re: Bad news. re: My Angelfish just laid eggs!

HI Beth, Dont be disapointed. Initially the parent'(s) will eat the eggs off if its a community tank. Once they reach the maturity stage they will lay eggs every 8 - 10 days. If you are really eager and keen to breed angels, then as i had mentioned in my earlier mail to you, get all the stuff and be ready. You can anytime induce spawing by making a 30 - 40% water change. But while filling the tank let the tempr of the water be little colder than the one in the tank. This will get them ready for the JOB *wink* ......hope this helps..SuNnY ! --------------------------------- Yahoo! Music Unlimited - Access over 1 million songs. Try it free. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15664	From: SuNnY	Date: 10/16/2005
Subject: Re: Bad news. re: My Angelfish just laid eggs!

HI Beth, Also when you have the eggs / wrigglers its always better to have a 0w bulb somewhere near the tank to be switched on in the night. This will help the Parent angel to fan the eggs / or keep the fry from falling off or to keep them together. ......hope this helps..SuNnY ! --------------------------------- Yahoo! Music Unlimited - Access over 1 million songs. Try it free. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15665	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 10/17/2005
Subject: too many gold mystery snails

I have way too many snails, I have already given more than 1/2 of them away... (at one point they were more than an inch thick in the bottom of my 29 gal plus the ones crawling up the tank walls) none of the stores around here will buy from anyone other than their suppliers. So now I am trying to figure out how to find new homes for the ones that I still have. I am thinking of using eBay or something like that any thoughts? MM & MP, '73 Tricia, KG6PNC A couple of great sites for fun http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15666	From: wendie	Date: 10/17/2005
Subject: Re: too many gold mystery snails

Well try putting some up on Ebay Aquabid forums Wendie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Tricia Wilkerson Sent: Monday, October 17, 2005 10:11 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] too many gold mystery snails I have way too many snails, I have already given more than 1/2 of them away... (at one point they were more than an inch thick in the bottom of my 29 gal plus the ones crawling up the tank walls) none of the stores around here will buy from anyone other than their suppliers. So now I am trying to figure out how to find new homes for the ones that I still have. I am thinking of using eBay or something like that any thoughts? MM & MP, '73 Tricia, KG6PNC A couple of great sites for fun http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15667	From: bigter4	Date: 10/18/2005
Subject: Re: too many gold mystery snails

Hi Tricia, wow! I cant believe that you have that many. So how did the number get so high? Well if we can figure out a way to ship them, I would love to take a few. Let me know.-Terry In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Tricia Wilkerson" <trycya@g...> wrote: > > I have way too many snails, I have already given more than 1/2 of them away... (at one point they were more than an inch thick in the bottom of my 29 gal plus the ones crawling up the tank walls) none of the stores around here will buy from anyone other than their suppliers. So now I am trying to figure out how to find new homes for the ones that I still have. I am thinking of using eBay or something like that any thoughts? > > MM & MP, '73 > Tricia, KG6PNC > > A couple of great sites for fun > > http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya > > http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15668	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 10/18/2005
Subject: Re: too many gold mystery snails

The number got so high early.... within 1 week of adding them to my tank I had 2 clutches... (started out with 3 snails) by the end of the 2nd month there had been 10-15 clutches. I guess they liked the tank conditions really well.... unfortunately I noticed this morning that one of my corries (the smallest) was missing... only to find 2 snails working on what was left of it. When I fed the fish last night everyone looked fine so now I am wondering if the snails attacked him while resting, esp. since right now the tank is over run by the snails. If I can figure out a safe way to ship I would love to find them new homes. I have a 55 gal tank that I am planning to start around spring that is going to be a planted tank and no snails will be allowed in it. Later I will also be turning the 29 gal into a planted nursery. Well that is about it for now ... I think *VBG* MM & MP, '73 Tricia, KG6PNC A couple of great sites for fun http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya ----- Original Message ----- From: bigter4 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, October 18, 2005 4:30 AM Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: too many gold mystery snails Hi Tricia, wow! I cant believe that you have that many. So how did the number get so high? Well if we can figure out a way to ship them, I would love to take a few. Let me know.-Terry In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Tricia Wilkerson" <trycya@g...> wrote: > > I have way too many snails, I have already given more than 1/2 of them away... (at one point they were more than an inch thick in the bottom of my 29 gal plus the ones crawling up the tank walls) none of the stores around here will buy from anyone other than their suppliers. So now I am trying to figure out how to find new homes for the ones that I still have. I am thinking of using eBay or something like that any thoughts? > > MM & MP, '73 > Tricia, KG6PNC > > A couple of great sites for fun > > http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya > > http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15669	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 10/18/2005
Subject: Re: too many gold mystery snails

I am going to have to look into how to ship them safely. I am sure there is a way.... maybe ship them in containers similar to the containers the angelfish are in at stores. MM & MP, '73 Tricia, KG6PNC A couple of great sites for fun http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya ----- Original Message ----- From: wendie To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, October 17, 2005 8:15 PM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] too many gold mystery snails Well try putting some up on Ebay Aquabid forums Wendie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Tricia Wilkerson Sent: Monday, October 17, 2005 10:11 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] too many gold mystery snails I have way too many snails, I have already given more than 1/2 of them away... (at one point they were more than an inch thick in the bottom of my 29 gal plus the ones crawling up the tank walls) none of the stores around here will buy from anyone other than their suppliers. So now I am trying to figure out how to find new homes for the ones that I still have. I am thinking of using eBay or something like that any thoughts? MM & MP, '73 Tricia, KG6PNC A couple of great sites for fun http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15670	From: Gianluca Polgar	Date: 10/18/2005
Subject: new website on mudskippers

Dear all, I'm happy to announce the birth of a new website on mudskippers (Gobiidae: Oxudercinae). It can be found at the address: <http://www.themudskipper.org/>http://www.themudskipper.org/ I'd like very much to receive comments, suggestions, corrections, etc. Even the smallest correction (e.g. typo mistakes, or grammatical errors) would be precious, but observations on more complex issues are also warmly welcome :-)!! I will try to go on developing it with corrections and new information. I really hope that it will prove useful. Best wishes Gianluca

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15671	From: Chris	Date: 10/18/2005
Subject: Re: new website on mudskippers

Sensational photos! and at a glance, excellent layout. I plan to have a good read when I have a bit more time (but I'm not really qualified to comment on the accuracy of the information). I would add a photo to the table of contents, and change the photo of yourself; the bamboo stick in the foreground is not very flattering! :) By the way - if you're not already a member of the "gobygroup" yahoo group, please consider joining and posting your link there. Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15672	From: Chris	Date: 10/18/2005
Subject: Re: new website on mudskippers

PS - I'd write the full text "Mailing Lists" instead of "M-L" in both the link to that page and in that page title. Maybe it's just me, but I couldn't guess it and had to find the subheading at the bottom of the page. Cheers, great site! Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15673	From: supamii	Date: 10/18/2005
Subject: plants dying hydrogen peroxide? help!

Anyone know the effect of hydrogen peroxide (3%) on laterite? I recently attempted to "sterilize" my gravel (mixed with laterite) and am currently using it in my planted tank and a number of plants definately seem to be doing very poorly. A new potted plant just turned to MUSH after just 2 days (I didn't have time to plant it). I did let the solution evaporate and for safe measure used a hair dryer to ensure it was thoroughly dried. This is a 15 gal with a CO2 injector but with lots of disturbance on the surface of the water due to my power filter made for a 30 gal (worried about CO2 depletion!). I supplement my water with some iron and potassium weekly. I recently bought a 15-17 lb bag of seachem flourite but have not yet added due to my busy schedule. Any chem/bio gurus out there with any comments or hypothesis would be very appreciated. Public conjectures welcome as well!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15674	From: Cydne McCown	Date: 10/18/2005
Subject: Re: plants dying hydrogen peroxide? help!

The only comment I wish to make on this subject is; this is the main reason I do everything naturally, no testing of water, no adding of chemicals, no supplements of any kind. Works for me. I have heavily planted tanks, natural only to the region the fish and plants are from. I only have one tank right now, my favorite tank, which is a simple amazon tank, Angelfish and planted heavily with swords. Cydne supamii <supamii@...> wrote: Anyone know the effect of hydrogen peroxide (3%) on laterite? I recently attempted to "sterilize" my gravel (mixed with laterite) and am currently using it in my planted tank and a number of plants definately seem to be doing very poorly. A new potted plant just turned to MUSH after just 2 days (I didn't have time to plant it). I did let the solution evaporate and for safe measure used a hair dryer to ensure it was thoroughly dried. This is a 15 gal with a CO2 injector but with lots of disturbance on the surface of the water due to my power filter made for a 30 gal (worried about CO2 depletion!). I supplement my water with some iron and potassium weekly. I recently bought a 15-17 lb bag of seachem flourite but have not yet added due to my busy schedule. Any chem/bio gurus out there with any comments or hypothesis would be very appreciated. Public conjectures welcome as well! Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Music Unlimited - Access over 1 million songs. Try it free. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15675	From: supamii	Date: 10/18/2005
Subject: Re: plants dying hydrogen peroxide? help!

Fishkeeping in general is quite un-natural if one thinks about it. Thats why we have filters and heaters and other such contraptions, cause they can't possiblly survive "naturally" in a glass tank. For me- the more I learned about fish and plant needs, the more I became compelled to supplement my water and treat it. After all, I'm only looking out for the little guys. However: The issue remains: can anyone give me information about hydrogen peroxide and my substrate (gravel + laterite)? --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Cydne McCown <cydthekid50@y...> wrote: > > The only comment I wish to make on this subject is; this is the main reason I do everything naturally, no testing of water, no adding of chemicals, no supplements of any kind. Works for me. I have heavily planted tanks, natural only to the region the fish and plants are from. I only have one tank right now, my favorite tank, which is a simple amazon tank, Angelfish and planted heavily with swords. > Cydne > > supamii <supamii@y...> wrote: > Anyone know the effect of hydrogen peroxide (3%) on laterite? I > recently attempted to "sterilize" my gravel (mixed with laterite) and > am currently using it in my planted tank and a number of plants > definately seem to be doing very poorly. A new potted plant just > turned to MUSH after just 2 days (I didn't have time to plant it). > > I did let the solution evaporate and for safe measure used a hair > dryer to ensure it was thoroughly dried. > > This is a 15 gal with a CO2 injector but with lots of disturbance on > the surface of the water due to my power filter made for a 30 gal > (worried about CO2 depletion!). I supplement my water with some iron > and potassium weekly. I recently bought a 15-17 lb bag of seachem > flourite but have not yet added due to my busy schedule. > > Any chem/bio gurus out there with any comments or hypothesis would be > very appreciated. Public conjectures welcome as well! >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15676	From: antoniq64	Date: 10/19/2005
Subject: cabomba help!

I'm trying to grow Cabomba and Anacharis in my aquarium but they keep dying off. What could be wrong? I only have catfish, Gouramis and barbs in the tank. Nothing is eating them.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15677	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 10/19/2005
Subject: Re: plants dying hydrogen peroxide? help!

Tolerances for hydrogen peroxide differ widely. Some of the most susceptible are the floaters who have stem rootlets, like hornwort and cabomba. Microsorium pteropus, all Cryptocorines, Rotala rotundifolia, and the Anubias should resist the hydrogen peroxide quite handily. Others will turn to mush, but then revive later, like Ricia fluitans, Echinodorus ozelot, Nymphaea lotus and Hygrophila corymbosa. Laterite and gravel are a good start to a substrate, but without any organic material, like peat moss, coir, or other in with it, the bacteria that normally support life in the substrate are easily killed by such applications as well.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15678	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 10/19/2005
Subject: Re: cabomba help!

They are extremely sensitive to a lot of chemicals added to the water. Flourish excell melted an entire tank of these in a local nursery, and bleach and hydrogen peroxide dips to rid them of algae will also cause them to croak. > I'm trying to grow Cabomba and Anacharis in my aquarium but they keep > dying off. What could be wrong? I only have catfish, Gouramis and > barbs in the tank. Nothing is eating them. >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15679	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 10/19/2005
Subject: Re: plants dying hydrogen peroxide? help!

Hi, I think if you read the original post the tank water was allowed to evaporate till the tank was dry and then refilled, if I'm right then the hydrogen peroxide is still in there, hydrogen peroxide is bleach and will kill everything, the fact that it was a low strength just means it will take a lot longer!! regards, unclenorm. --- cynthia brennemann <brennewoman@...> wrote: > Tolerances for hydrogen peroxide differ widely. > Some of the most > susceptible are the floaters who have stem rootlets, > like hornwort and > cabomba. Microsorium pteropus, all Cryptocorines, > Rotala rotundifolia, > and the Anubias should resist the hydrogen peroxide > quite handily. > Others will turn to mush, but then revive later, > like Ricia fluitans, > Echinodorus ozelot, Nymphaea lotus and Hygrophila > corymbosa. > > Laterite and gravel are a good start to a substrate, > but without any > organic material, like peat moss, coir, or other in > with it, the > bacteria that normally support life in the substrate > are easily killed > by such applications as well. > > > > ___________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15680	From: fish8951	Date: 10/19/2005
Subject: Question for cory breeders

Hey all, I'm having problems with my cories. I have several pairs breeding in my fish room but I'm having a few problems with the fry. I'd appreciate any help with the following questions. 1) After the fry hatch how long before I can start to feed them? They don't appear to have yolk sacks to absord the first few days like my cichlids do. They were scooting all over the tank the same day after hatching. 2) What is the best first food? I tried live bbs but it seems to be a little large for them & they appeared to starve to death the first 2 batches of fry. I've heard that I should use 18 hour old live bbs or a fine powered flake food ground up in a coffee bean grinder? Thanks again! Dave SC

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15681	From: supamii	Date: 10/19/2005
Subject: Re: plants dying hydrogen peroxide? help!

Please note that I did not add the hydrogen peroxide solution directly into my tank. I treated only the gravel and laterite in a seperate container. How is the hydrogen peroxide still in the tank if I tried to evaporate the solution? Yes it is used as a bleach in higher concentrations, but it has unique properties which made it particularly appealing to me to use to sterilize. It is my understanding that a number of factors contribute to the decomposition of H2O2 into H20 and 02. The array of factors include heat, increased PH levels, increasing contamination (especially transition metals such as copper, manganese or iron) and ultraviolet exposure. So... I should have at least decomposed a great deal of the H2O2 in the evaporation process. I also add plant supplements which are in a chelated form (Fe). With my lights on at an average of 10 hours per day, there would be a fair amount of UV hitting at least the surface of the substrate. On a side note, even chlorine in tap water, if let to sit long enough, will evaporate (chlorine or whatever form its in is often the active ingredient in household bleach ie clorox). Anyway, if anyone can address the ACTUAL ISSUE at hand and clarify things for me, it would be much appreciated. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > Hi, > I think if you read the original post the tank > water was allowed to evaporate till the tank was dry > and then refilled, if I'm right then the hydrogen > peroxide is still in there, hydrogen peroxide is > bleach and will kill everything, the fact that it was > a low strength just means it will take a lot longer!! > regards, > unclenorm. > > --- cynthia brennemann <brennewoman@h...> > wrote: > > > Tolerances for hydrogen peroxide differ widely. > > Some of the most > > susceptible are the floaters who have stem rootlets, > > like hornwort and > > cabomba. Microsorium pteropus, all Cryptocorines, > > Rotala rotundifolia, > > and the Anubias should resist the hydrogen peroxide > > quite handily. > > Others will turn to mush, but then revive later, > > like Ricia fluitans, > > Echinodorus ozelot, Nymphaea lotus and Hygrophila > > corymbosa. > > > > Laterite and gravel are a good start to a substrate, > > but without any > > organic material, like peat moss, coir, or other in > > with it, the > > bacteria that normally support life in the substrate > > are easily killed > > by such applications as well. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15682	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 10/19/2005
Subject: Re: plants dying hydrogen peroxide? help!

Well, hydrogen peroxide isn't as toxic as chlorine bleach, but it does kill indescriminately. Black hair algae is particularly susceptible to hydrogen peroxide, and will die off with use, but it can also kill fish, snails, and, as you've noticed, several plants. It also kills off the bacteria in the soil that would normally be able to make nutrients available to the plants, that the plants are inefficient at gathering themselves. I think a couple of water changes and time are about all that can be done, either that or get the hydrogen peroxide resistant plants and use them exclusively. > > Hi, > I think if you read the original post the tank > water was allowed to evaporate till the tank was dry > and then refilled, if I'm right then the hydrogen > peroxide is still in there, hydrogen peroxide is > bleach and will kill everything, the fact that it was > a low strength just means it will take a lot longer!! > regards, > unclenorm. > > --- cynthia brennemann <brennewoman@h...> > wrote: > > > Tolerances for hydrogen peroxide differ widely. > > Some of the most > > susceptible are the floaters who have stem rootlets, > > like hornwort and > > cabomba. Microsorium pteropus, all Cryptocorines, > > Rotala rotundifolia, > > and the Anubias should resist the hydrogen peroxide > > quite handily. > > Others will turn to mush, but then revive later, > > like Ricia fluitans, > > Echinodorus ozelot, Nymphaea lotus and Hygrophila > > corymbosa. > > > > Laterite and gravel are a good start to a substrate, > > but without any > > organic material, like peat moss, coir, or other in > > with it, the > > bacteria that normally support life in the substrate > > are easily killed > > by such applications as well. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15683	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 10/19/2005
Subject: Re: plants dying hydrogen peroxide? help!

I was trying to address the issue. Plants that are sensitive to hydrogen peroxide will react badly even wtih very low doses. Yes, you treated the laterite and gravel, but there is no organic buffer there to help it recover and so it retains some of the hydrogen peroxide. Yes chlorine bleach evaporates handily, but not all bleaching agents evaporate like that. You'll have to actually rinse the water out, do some water changes, and get a healthy bacterial cycle going to bring the levels down to where your plants can tolerate it. > Please note that I did not add the hydrogen peroxide solution directly > into my tank. I treated only the gravel and laterite in a seperate > container. > > How is the hydrogen peroxide still in the tank if I tried to evaporate > the solution? Yes it is used as a bleach in higher concentrations, > but it has unique properties which made it particularly appealing to > me to use to sterilize. > > It is my understanding that a number of factors contribute to the > decomposition of H2O2 into H20 and 02. The array of factors include > heat, increased PH levels, increasing contamination (especially > transition metals such as copper, manganese or iron) and ultraviolet > exposure. > > So... I should have at least decomposed a great deal of the H2O2 in > the evaporation process. I also add plant supplements which are in a > chelated form (Fe). With my lights on at an average of 10 hours per > day, there would be a fair amount of UV hitting at least the surface > of the substrate. > > On a side note, even chlorine in tap water, if let to sit long enough, > will evaporate (chlorine or whatever form its in is often the active > ingredient in household bleach ie clorox). > > Anyway, if anyone can address the ACTUAL ISSUE at hand and clarify > things for me, it would be much appreciated.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15684	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 10/19/2005
Subject: Re: plants dying hydrogen peroxide? help!

Hi again, OK noted, but you did not make that clear in your original post, no matter the situation is still the same, when you allow a solution to evaporate only pure water evaporates all chemicals stay in the media as solids (usualy as salts in crystalline form), when you again add water the chemicals go back into solution. You cannot compare chlorine, chlorine dissipates as a gas hence the smell. Instead of allowing the water to evaporate you should have rinsed the substrate with large amounts of water to wash out the bleach. Do you test your water regularly ?, adding to much chelated Fe (iron)or potassium can also be harmful to your plants, if you are using lights which give of sufficient UV light to penetrate to the substrate that could also be detrimental to your plants,(there is more than one form of UV light). I would suggest that you get your tank water tested, do you use tap water ? do you do water changes ?. You make no mention of how many fish and what type you have. regards, unclenorm. --- supamii <supamii@...> wrote: > Please note that I did not add the hydrogen peroxide > solution directly > into my tank. I treated only the gravel and > laterite in a seperate > container. > > How is the hydrogen peroxide still in the tank if I > tried to evaporate > the solution? Yes it is used as a bleach in higher > concentrations, > but it has unique properties which made it > particularly appealing to > me to use to sterilize. > > It is my understanding that a number of factors > contribute to the > decomposition of H2O2 into H20 and 02. The array of > factors include > heat, increased PH levels, increasing contamination > (especially > transition metals such as copper, manganese or iron) > and ultraviolet > exposure. > > So... I should have at least decomposed a great deal > of the H2O2 in > the evaporation process. I also add plant > supplements which are in a > chelated form (Fe). With my lights on at an average > of 10 hours per > day, there would be a fair amount of UV hitting at > least the surface > of the substrate. > > On a side note, even chlorine in tap water, if let > to sit long enough, > will evaporate (chlorine or whatever form its in is > often the active > ingredient in household bleach ie clorox). > > Anyway, if anyone can address the ACTUAL ISSUE at > hand and clarify > things for me, it would be much appreciated. > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. http://uk.security.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15685	From: Cydne McCown	Date: 10/19/2005
Subject: Re: cabomba help!

You don't say what kind of catfish. I researched Cabomba and Anacharis, and they have different requirements, Cambomba needs High Light and Anacharis needs Moderate Light. They are both native to South America, and Cambomba can also be found in North America. Your fish, Gouramis and barbs are asian fish. I found this great website that talks about aquarium plants (yes, they sell them too). http://www.freshwateraquariumplants.com/ They have some great plants, and they also describe what is in their Asian plant biotape (I think a biotape must mean their group of Asian plants) and what is in their Amazon biotape. I have always found that if you keep to the same region for plants and fishes, you have a better chance of having both plant and fish thriving in your tank. That way you don't have to fight PH levels and all of that stuff. Also, most barbs love a heavily planted tank, so if you use plants that occur in their natural habitat, you would most like have a better chance at seeing the barbs' natural behaviors in their full life cycle, ie breeding and etc. You don't say how you filtrate your tank, if you use undergravel filters, that can be hard on plants. Most plants appreciate at least 10 and up to 14 hours of light per 24 hour period. Of course, I am just touching on the obvious and basic points. Cydne antoniq64 <Niqbiz@...> wrote: I'm trying to grow Cabomba and Anacharis in my aquarium but they keep dying off. What could be wrong? I only have catfish, Gouramis and barbs in the tank. Nothing is eating them. --------------------------------- Yahoo! Music Unlimited - Access over 1 million songs. Try it free. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15686	From: supamii	Date: 10/19/2005
Subject: Re: plants dying hydrogen peroxide? help!

First off, thanks for all the input guys. This little experimentation has been quite frustrating and I hope I didn't come off as being dismissive with my last comment/reply. Lets start: - My tank is freshly cycled and the ammonia levels are down to zero. I treated my tap water with chlorine remover for the initial fill-up. I am giving it some time for nitrite bacteria to kick in (2-3 days and I'll do a 30% water change with distilled/RO water, which ever will save a few bucks). - Currently I only have a couple of zebra danios and a dwarf pleco. - My PH is at a pretty high- 7.6-8.0 range, dispite the CO2 injection. In my last setup, I was able to bring it down to about 7.0. - I supplement my water with some chelated iron and potassium on a weekly basis (5-10 ml). - I have about 2.6 watts of lighting per gal (a 50/50 coral life flourescent with actinic and regular daylight). A few other concerns include: Since a great deal of laterite did come into contact with H2O2, would it be a flaw to assume that the iron-enriched laterite also helped to decompose it? I've read that H2O2 oxidizes iron, but I have yet to learn what that makes of iron except for an additional electron. Also, my gravel was from an established tank, which means that the H2O2 came ino contact with bacteria- but to what degree, I have no clue. When testing my water, what should I look for? Ahhhh! --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > Hi again, > OK noted, but you did not make that clear in > your original post, no matter the situation is still > the same, when you allow a solution to evaporate only > pure water evaporates all chemicals stay in the media > as solids (usualy as salts in crystalline form), when > you again add water the chemicals go back into > solution. You cannot compare chlorine, chlorine > dissipates as a gas hence the smell. Instead of > allowing the water to evaporate you should have rinsed > the substrate with large amounts of water to wash out > the bleach. Do you test your water regularly ?, adding > to much chelated Fe (iron)or potassium can also be > harmful to your plants, if you are using lights which > give of sufficient UV light to penetrate to the > substrate that could also be detrimental to your > plants,(there is more than one form of UV light). I > would suggest that you get your tank water tested, do > you use tap water ? do you do water changes ?. You > make no mention of how many fish and what type you > have. > regards, > unclenorm. > > > --- supamii <supamii@y...> wrote: > > > Please note that I did not add the hydrogen peroxide > > solution directly > > into my tank. I treated only the gravel and > > laterite in a seperate > > container. > > > > How is the hydrogen peroxide still in the tank if I > > tried to evaporate > > the solution? Yes it is used as a bleach in higher > > concentrations, > > but it has unique properties which made it > > particularly appealing to > > me to use to sterilize. > > > > It is my understanding that a number of factors > > contribute to the > > decomposition of H2O2 into H20 and 02. The array of > > factors include > > heat, increased PH levels, increasing contamination > > (especially > > transition metals such as copper, manganese or iron) > > and ultraviolet > > exposure. > > > > So... I should have at least decomposed a great deal > > of the H2O2 in > > the evaporation process. I also add plant > > supplements which are in a > > chelated form (Fe). With my lights on at an average > > of 10 hours per > > day, there would be a fair amount of UV hitting at > > least the surface > > of the substrate. > > > > On a side note, even chlorine in tap water, if let > > to sit long enough, > > will evaporate (chlorine or whatever form its in is > > often the active > > ingredient in household bleach ie clorox). > > > > Anyway, if anyone can address the ACTUAL ISSUE at > > hand and clarify > > things for me, it would be much appreciated. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. http://uk.security.yahoo.com >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15687	From: Cydne McCown	Date: 10/19/2005
Subject: Re: Question for cory breeders

Hey Dave! I had a couple of successful batches of corys (albino). I kept them in a 10 gallon tank with no gravel on the bottom, and water sprites floating on top with only about half full tank, because they don't do well in deep water the first few weeks. I didn't have to start feeding them very much at first, I fed them some suspended egg yolk at first, but I think they were really eating the tiny algae off the sides of my tank, just guessing. When they were large enough (as I recall about the third week) I started feeding them live baby brine shrimp, very sparingly and also the baby fish fry flakes. I also kept two air stones going, and only did the first water change when I started feeding them the baby brine shrimp, about 30 to 50 percent water change every week. But I was really careful with the water changes, to actually take a little air tubing and making sure I was not anywhere near the fry, also, I started filtering the water I took up with a baby fish net, and when that didn't work because the netting still was not close enough, I made a net out of some support pantyhose I had and a coat hanger. That way, I was not throwing out any fry with the old water! Good luck! Cydne fish8951 <fish8951@...> wrote: Hey all, I'm having problems with my cories. I have several pairs breeding in my fish room but I'm having a few problems with the fry. I'd appreciate any help with the following questions. 1) After the fry hatch how long before I can start to feed them? They don't appear to have yolk sacks to absord the first few days like my cichlids do. They were scooting all over the tank the same day after hatching. 2) What is the best first food? I tried live bbs but it seems to be a little large for them & they appeared to starve to death the first 2 batches of fry. I've heard that I should use 18 hour old live bbs or a fine powered flake food ground up in a coffee bean grinder? Thanks again! Dave SC --------------------------------- Yahoo! Music Unlimited - Access over 1 million songs. Try it free. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15688	From: antoniq64	Date: 10/20/2005
Subject: Save Cabomba and Anacharis

I have aa bunch of Cabomba and Anacharis that are dying. The Anacharis is dissolving completely, but a lot of it is still left. The Cabomba leaves are coming off. The only chemical I've added to the water is stuff to treat tap water. Will fertilizer save the plants? I want live plants in my aquarium but I can't figure out why so many of the plants I put in practically dissolve they do so bad. 5 kinds of plants and only 1 kind is left that's not dying but it's not growing either. And one of the kinds did so bad it started to turn black a few hours after I put it in my tank. Does anybody know what's poisoning my plants so bad?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15689	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 10/20/2005
Subject: Re: Save Cabomba and Anacharis

For starters, you might look towards your tap water treating chemical that you say is the only additive you've added. There are more than one chlorine and chloramine removers on the market; some of the newer ones are not especially kind to fish if even slightly overdosed. With that in mind, I might tend to think that those products are even less kind to plants. Also, Cabomba requires more light than many other plants, with a good balance of trace plant nutrients (nitrogen - in the form of nitrate, potassium/potash and phosphorus/phosphate) present. Additionally, other elements (calcium, iron, etc.) are benefitial. Normally, the accumulation of some fish waste will act as "fertilizer" for the plants. Without any type(s) of plant food, Cabomba does poorly and often drops its leaves. A lack of nutrients may also be the problem of your poor performance of the Anacharis and other plants. You do not say how long your tank has been set up. One thing I would be suspect of is the fact that one of your plants turned black after being in your water for only a few hours. This should tell you volumns in that there well may be something in your water (perhaps the type of chloramine remover -- Amquel II has been said to harmful on occasion if not used right) that is detrimental to the plants. You might want to try carbon filtration to remove this or any other chemical which may be harmful to your plants, after which you'll discard it. Ray \ -- - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "antoniq64" <Niqbiz@c...> wrote: > > I have aa bunch of Cabomba and Anacharis that are dying. The Anacharis > is dissolving completely, but a lot of it is still left. The Cabomba > leaves are coming off. The only chemical I've added to the water is > stuff to treat tap water. > Will fertilizer save the plants? I want live plants in my aquarium > but I can't figure out why so many of the plants I put in practically > dissolve they do so bad. 5 kinds of plants and only 1 kind is left > that's not dying but it's not growing either. And one of the kinds did > so bad it started to turn black a few hours after I put it in my tank. > Does anybody know what's poisoning my plants so bad? >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15690	From: bigter4	Date: 10/20/2005
Subject: Re: too many gold mystery snails

Hello Tricia, Well we will have to see hopw to ship them, I will look into how some interent sites ship them cause that might be the best way. I think it would be so cool to ahre the snails with the Board. I will pay for the shipping of course. well figure it out- Ter -- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Tricia Wilkerson" <trycya@g...> wrote: > > I am going to have to look into how to ship them safely. I am sure there is a way.... maybe ship them in containers similar to the containers the angelfish are in at stores. > > MM & MP, '73 > Tricia, KG6PNC > > A couple of great sites for fun > > http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya > > http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: wendie > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Monday, October 17, 2005 8:15 PM > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] too many gold mystery snails > > > Well try putting some up on > Ebay > Aquabid > forums > > Wendie > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On > Behalf Of Tricia Wilkerson > Sent: Monday, October 17, 2005 10:11 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] too many gold mystery snails > > > I have way too many snails, I have already given more than 1/2 of them > away... (at one point they were more than an inch thick in the bottom of my > 29 gal plus the ones crawling up the tank walls) none of the stores around > here will buy from anyone other than their suppliers. So now I am trying to > figure out how to find new homes for the ones that I still have. I am > thinking of using eBay or something like that any thoughts? > > MM & MP, '73 > Tricia, KG6PNC > > A couple of great sites for fun > > http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya > > http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<: ((((><74/`7.88. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------ ---------- > -- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service. > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------ ---------- > -- > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- ---------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- ---------- > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15691	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 10/20/2005
Subject: Re: plants dying hydrogen peroxide? help!

Hi again, First of your tank cannot be cycled in such a short time, I would suspect that your cycle has barely started, do you know for sure that your tap water only has chlorine, most water authoritys use chloromine these days which needs neutralizing, it won't evaporate like chlorine, using tap water is not a very good idea. Adding chemicals on a regular basis, you should test your tank water to establish if the additives are neccesary before adding them. Your lights are more suited to a salt-water tank than freshwater. Please read the following links to get a better understanding of the nitrogen cycle :- http://faq.thekrib.com/begin_cycling.html http;//user.aol.com/andrerich/aquarium/page2.htm http://www.thetropicaltank.co.uk/cycling2.htm http://www.aquahobby.com/articles/e_ciclo.php regards, unclenorm. --- supamii <supamii@...> wrote: > First off, thanks for all the input guys. This > little experimentation > has been quite frustrating and I hope I didn't come > off as being > dismissive with my last comment/reply. > > Lets start: > - My tank is freshly cycled and the ammonia levels > are down to zero. > I treated my tap water with chlorine remover for the > initial fill-up. > I am giving it some time for nitrite bacteria to > kick in (2-3 days > and I'll do a 30% water change with distilled/RO > water, which ever > will save a few bucks). > - Currently I only have a couple of zebra danios and > a dwarf pleco. > - My PH is at a pretty high- 7.6-8.0 range, dispite > the CO2 injection. > In my last setup, I was able to bring it down to > about 7.0. > - I supplement my water with some chelated iron and > potassium on a > weekly basis (5-10 ml). > - I have about 2.6 watts of lighting per gal (a > 50/50 coral life > flourescent with actinic and regular daylight). > > A few other concerns include: > Since a great deal of laterite did come into contact > with H2O2, would > it be a flaw to assume that the iron-enriched > laterite also helped to > decompose it? I've read that H2O2 oxidizes iron, > but I have yet to > learn what that makes of iron except for an > additional electron. > Also, my gravel was from an established tank, which > means that the > H2O2 came ino contact with bacteria- but to what > degree, I have no clue. > > When testing my water, what should I look for? > > Ahhhh! > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. > Hampson." > <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > > > Hi again, > > OK noted, but you did not make that clear > in > > your original post, no matter the situation is > still > > the same, when you allow a solution to evaporate > only > > pure water evaporates all chemicals stay in the > media > > as solids (usualy as salts in crystalline form), > when > > you again add water the chemicals go back into > > solution. You cannot compare chlorine, chlorine > > dissipates as a gas hence the smell. Instead of > > allowing the water to evaporate you should have > rinsed > > the substrate with large amounts of water to wash > out > > the bleach. Do you test your water regularly ?, > adding > > to much chelated Fe (iron)or potassium can also be > > harmful to your plants, if you are using lights > which > > give of sufficient UV light to penetrate to the > > substrate that could also be detrimental to your > > plants,(there is more than one form of UV light). > I > > would suggest that you get your tank water tested, > do > > you use tap water ? do you do water changes ?. You > > make no mention of how many fish and what type you > > have. > > regards, > > unclenorm. > > > > > > --- supamii <supamii@y...> wrote: > > > > > Please note that I did not add the hydrogen > peroxide > > > solution directly > > > into my tank. I treated only the gravel and > > > laterite in a seperate > > > container. > > > > > > How is the hydrogen peroxide still in the tank > if I > > > tried to evaporate > > > the solution? Yes it is used as a bleach in > higher > > > concentrations, > > > but it has unique properties which made it > > > particularly appealing to > > > me to use to sterilize. > > > > > > It is my understanding that a number of factors > > > contribute to the > > > decomposition of H2O2 into H20 and 02. The > array of > > > factors include > > > heat, increased PH levels, increasing > contamination > > > (especially > > > transition metals such as copper, manganese or > iron) > > > and ultraviolet > > > exposure. > > > > > > So... I should have at least decomposed a great > deal > > > of the H2O2 in > > > the evaporation process. I also add plant > > > supplements which are in a > > > chelated form (Fe). With my lights on at an > average > > > of 10 hours per > > > day, there would be a fair amount of UV hitting > at > > > least the surface > > > of the substrate. > > > > > > On a side note, even chlorine in tap water, if > let > > > to sit long enough, > > > will evaporate (chlorine or whatever form its in > is > > > often the active > > > ingredient in household bleach ie clorox). > > > > > > Anyway, if anyone can address the ACTUAL ISSUE > at > > > hand and clarify > > > things for me, it would be much appreciated. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > To help you stay safe and secure online, we've > developed the all new > Yahoo! Security Centre. http://uk.security.yahoo.com > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15692	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 10/20/2005
Subject: Re: question about leaches in pond

No kidding, I have a small invert tank that only contains snails, scuds and leeches right now. Interesting. But the snails seem to be doing fine... Emily andrew davis <adavisus@...> wrote: Leeches on a pond are usually benign, unless you are a snail, which is the 'usual' prey of leeches. Just as snails can get to a pond on the feathers of a bird, so can leeches. Leeches are a lot tougher and resilient than most other critters on a pond, any attempt to suppress them is likely to have some collateral damage Unless you are real sure they pose some problem they might best be left alone to go about their quiet and discrete duel with the aquatic snails Regards, andy http://www.members.aol.com/abdavisnc/swglist.html ----------------------oo------------------------- --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, agentscullyeyore@a... wrote: > > my moms bf has a pond outside and just discovered leaches about a inch in > size in the filter and he says they are on the bottom of the pond as well.. he > doesn't want to kill the plants or goldfish that are or have been living in > the pond for 3 years now anyone know how to get rid of the leaches or why they > got there.. thanks Shannon > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15693	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 10/20/2005
Subject: Re: question about leaches in pond

so then you all are saying not to do anything about the leeches and just let them be... what are they feeding on if not the goldfish in the pond.. Shannon No kidding, I have a small invert tank that only contains snails, scuds and leeches right now. Interesting. But the snails seem to be doing fine... Emily andrew davis <adavisus@...> wrote: Leeches on a pond are usually benign, unless you are a snail, which is the 'usual' prey of leeches. Just as snails can get to a pond on the feathers of a bird, so can leeches. Leeches are a lot tougher and resilient than most other critters on a pond, any attempt to suppress them is likely to have some collateral damage Unless you are real sure they pose some problem they might best be left alone to go about their quiet and discrete duel with the aquatic snails Regards, andy [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15694	From: Gianluca Polgar	Date: 10/20/2005
Subject: Re: new website on mudskippers

Hi Chris, thank you really very much for your feedback. I've followed your suggestions, and I'll try to find another picture of myself... cheers and thanks again! Gianluca

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15695	From: Kwang Pak	Date: 10/20/2005
Subject: Re: too many gold mystery snails

Hi Tracy, I will take a few off your hands if you are willing to ship them . I'll pay for shipping... I'm in the Toronto area. Thanks. Alex

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15696	From: supamii	Date: 10/20/2005
Subject: Re: plants dying hydrogen peroxide? help!

I had my tank sit around for a while (few weeks). Ammonia levels went from high to low which is enough of an indication for me since ammonia levels remain at 0. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > Hi again, > First of your tank cannot be cycled in such a > short time, I would suspect that your cycle has barely > started, do you know for sure that your tap water only > has chlorine, most water authoritys use chloromine > these days which needs neutralizing, it won't > evaporate like chlorine, using tap water is not a very > good idea. > Adding chemicals on a regular basis, you should test > your tank water to establish if the additives are > neccesary before adding them. Your lights are more > suited to a salt-water tank than freshwater. > Please read the following links to get a better > understanding of the nitrogen cycle :- > > http://faq.thekrib.com/begin_cycling.html > > http;//user.aol.com/andrerich/aquarium/page2.htm > > http://www.thetropicaltank.co.uk/cycling2.htm > > http://www.aquahobby.com/articles/e_ciclo.php > > regards, > unclenorm. > > > > --- supamii <supamii@y...> wrote: > > > First off, thanks for all the input guys. This > > little experimentation > > has been quite frustrating and I hope I didn't come > > off as being > > dismissive with my last comment/reply. > > > > Lets start: > > - My tank is freshly cycled and the ammonia levels > > are down to zero. > > I treated my tap water with chlorine remover for the > > initial fill-up. > > I am giving it some time for nitrite bacteria to > > kick in (2-3 days > > and I'll do a 30% water change with distilled/RO > > water, which ever > > will save a few bucks). > > - Currently I only have a couple of zebra danios and > > a dwarf pleco. > > - My PH is at a pretty high- 7.6-8.0 range, dispite > > the CO2 injection. > > In my last setup, I was able to bring it down to > > about 7.0. > > - I supplement my water with some chelated iron and > > potassium on a > > weekly basis (5-10 ml). > > - I have about 2.6 watts of lighting per gal (a > > 50/50 coral life > > flourescent with actinic and regular daylight). > > > > A few other concerns include: > > Since a great deal of laterite did come into contact > > with H2O2, would > > it be a flaw to assume that the iron-enriched > > laterite also helped to > > decompose it? I've read that H2O2 oxidizes iron, > > but I have yet to > > learn what that makes of iron except for an > > additional electron. > > Also, my gravel was from an established tank, which > > means that the > > H2O2 came ino contact with bacteria- but to what > > degree, I have no clue. > > > > When testing my water, what should I look for? > > > > Ahhhh! > > > > > > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. > > Hampson." > > <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > > > > > Hi again, > > > OK noted, but you did not make that clear > > in > > > your original post, no matter the situation is > > still > > > the same, when you allow a solution to evaporate > > only > > > pure water evaporates all chemicals stay in the > > media > > > as solids (usualy as salts in crystalline form), > > when > > > you again add water the chemicals go back into > > > solution. You cannot compare chlorine, chlorine > > > dissipates as a gas hence the smell. Instead of > > > allowing the water to evaporate you should have > > rinsed > > > the substrate with large amounts of water to wash > > out > > > the bleach. Do you test your water regularly ?, > > adding > > > to much chelated Fe (iron)or potassium can also be > > > harmful to your plants, if you are using lights > > which > > > give of sufficient UV light to penetrate to the > > > substrate that could also be detrimental to your > > > plants,(there is more than one form of UV light). > > I > > > would suggest that you get your tank water tested, > > do > > > you use tap water ? do you do water changes ?. You > > > make no mention of how many fish and what type you > > > have. > > > regards, > > > unclenorm. > > > > > > > > > --- supamii <supamii@y...> wrote: > > > > > > > Please note that I did not add the hydrogen > > peroxide > > > > solution directly > > > > into my tank. I treated only the gravel and > > > > laterite in a seperate > > > > container. > > > > > > > > How is the hydrogen peroxide still in the tank > > if I > > > > tried to evaporate > > > > the solution? Yes it is used as a bleach in > > higher > > > > concentrations, > > > > but it has unique properties which made it > > > > particularly appealing to > > > > me to use to sterilize. > > > > > > > > It is my understanding that a number of factors > > > > contribute to the > > > > decomposition of H2O2 into H20 and 02. The > > array of > > > > factors include > > > > heat, increased PH levels, increasing > > contamination > > > > (especially > > > > transition metals such as copper, manganese or > > iron) > > > > and ultraviolet > > > > exposure. > > > > > > > > So... I should have at least decomposed a great > > deal > > > > of the H2O2 in > > > > the evaporation process. I also add plant > > > > supplements which are in a > > > > chelated form (Fe). With my lights on at an > > average > > > > of 10 hours per > > > > day, there would be a fair amount of UV hitting > > at > > > > least the surface > > > > of the substrate. > > > > > > > > On a side note, even chlorine in tap water, if > > let > > > > to sit long enough, > > > > will evaporate (chlorine or whatever form its in > > is > > > > often the active > > > > ingredient in household bleach ie clorox). > > > > > > > > Anyway, if anyone can address the ACTUAL ISSUE > > at > > > > hand and clarify > > > > things for me, it would be much appreciated. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15697	From: dreammaker2623	Date: 10/20/2005
Subject: Re: plants dying hydrogen peroxide? help!

Was the plant that turned to mush a true aquatic plant. There are several plnts that are sold for the aquariums that are really not aquatic but rather cn survive underwater for some time. There are other plants like cryptocorns that do not like to be moved.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15698	From: Chris	Date: 10/20/2005
Subject: Re: new website on mudskippers

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Gianluca Polgar <polgar@a...> wrote: > I'll try to find another picture of myself... I know how hard that can be!! I just tried finding a current photo for my CV recently! Looks like you were having alot of fun on that boat though! (I know I would have been! :) ) Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15699	From: supamii	Date: 10/20/2005
Subject: Re: plants dying hydrogen peroxide? help!

Yeah I purchased a small potted cryptocoryne wendtii, which is known to be a quite hardy plant. I have another brown crypt that seems to be doing fine though. It certainly came as a shock to me to see a brand new plant crap out on so quickly! --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "dreammaker2623" <dreammaker2623@y...> wrote: > > Was the plant that turned to mush a true aquatic plant. There are > several plnts that are sold for the aquariums that are really not > aquatic but rather cn survive underwater for some time. There are > other plants like cryptocorns that do not like to be moved. >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15700	From: Sandy Kay	Date: 10/21/2005
Subject: gourmie (spelling?)

I am not sure if the spelling is right. I have a new gourmie. He is the largest fish in the tank but the newest. He has been timid but getting better. Everyone is healthy and eating. But he seems so picky about the food and I don't see him actually eating it. He has even spit it back out. Is there a special food he would like? He seems very healthy otherwise. Thank you in advance, Sandy [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15701	From: Fred and Cynthia	Date: 10/21/2005
Subject: Re: gourmie (spelling?)

Mine eats the same food as the rest of the tropical fish - and I've seen him as well as other spit the food out but eat smaller pieces Cynthia http://babyitems.myphotoalbum.com/view_photo.php?set_albumName=album01&id=bag ----- Original Message ----- From: Sandy Kay To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, October 21, 2005 2:55 AM Subject: [AquaticLife] gourmie (spelling?) I am not sure if the spelling is right. I have a new gourmie. He is the largest fish in the tank but the newest. He has been timid but getting better. Everyone is healthy and eating. But he seems so picky about the food and I don't see him actually eating it. He has even spit it back out. Is there a special food he would like? He seems very healthy otherwise. Thank you in advance, Sandy [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15702	From: Eric Roberts	Date: 10/21/2005
Subject: Re: plants dying hydrogen peroxide? help!

Most municipal water providers have either a website with he content of the water or on your city's website will have an entry. Otherwise, you can call them and they will tell you. The water that supplies the bulk of the Chicago area, for instance, does not contain chloramines. I had a nice chat with one of the Chemists at the water department and she told me that they don't add anything at their level, since the water is from Lake Michigan and supplied by the Greater Chicagoland water reclamation district...where the only additive is chlorine. If you are just interested, do a web search on the city of Naperville, IL and go to their water departments site, you can look at the water quality tests they have done for the past 3 years...showing the contents of the water we consume here. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Norman. S. Hampson. Sent: Thursday, October 20, 2005 8:28 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: plants dying hydrogen peroxide? help! Hi again, First of your tank cannot be cycled in such a short time, I would suspect that your cycle has barely started, do you know for sure that your tap water only has chlorine, most water authoritys use chloromine these days which needs neutralizing, it won't evaporate like chlorine, using tap water is not a very good idea. Adding chemicals on a regular basis, you should test your tank water to establish if the additives are neccesary before adding them. Your lights are more suited to a salt-water tank than freshwater. Please read the following links to get a better understanding of the nitrogen cycle :- http://faq.thekrib.com/begin_cycling.html http;//user.aol.com/andrerich/aquarium/page2.htm http://www.thetropicaltank.co.uk/cycling2.htm http://www.aquahobby.com/articles/e_ciclo.php regards, unclenorm. --- supamii <supamii@...> wrote: > First off, thanks for all the input guys. This > little experimentation > has been quite frustrating and I hope I didn't come > off as being > dismissive with my last comment/reply. > > Lets start: > - My tank is freshly cycled and the ammonia levels > are down to zero. > I treated my tap water with chlorine remover for the > initial fill-up. > I am giving it some time for nitrite bacteria to > kick in (2-3 days > and I'll do a 30% water change with distilled/RO > water, which ever > will save a few bucks). > - Currently I only have a couple of zebra danios and > a dwarf pleco. > - My PH is at a pretty high- 7.6-8.0 range, dispite > the CO2 injection. > In my last setup, I was able to bring it down to > about 7.0. > - I supplement my water with some chelated iron and > potassium on a > weekly basis (5-10 ml). > - I have about 2.6 watts of lighting per gal (a > 50/50 coral life > flourescent with actinic and regular daylight). > > A few other concerns include: > Since a great deal of laterite did come into contact > with H2O2, would > it be a flaw to assume that the iron-enriched > laterite also helped to > decompose it? I've read that H2O2 oxidizes iron, > but I have yet to > learn what that makes of iron except for an > additional electron. > Also, my gravel was from an established tank, which > means that the > H2O2 came ino contact with bacteria- but to what > degree, I have no clue. > > When testing my water, what should I look for? > > Ahhhh! > > > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Norman. S. > Hampson." > <normnam2000@y...> wrote: > > > > Hi again, > > OK noted, but you did not make that clear > in > > your original post, no matter the situation is > still > > the same, when you allow a solution to evaporate > only > > pure water evaporates all chemicals stay in the > media > > as solids (usualy as salts in crystalline form), > when > > you again add water the chemicals go back into > > solution. You cannot compare chlorine, chlorine > > dissipates as a gas hence the smell. Instead of > > allowing the water to evaporate you should have > rinsed > > the substrate with large amounts of water to wash > out > > the bleach. Do you test your water regularly ?, > adding > > to much chelated Fe (iron)or potassium can also be > > harmful to your plants, if you are using lights > which > > give of sufficient UV light to penetrate to the > > substrate that could also be detrimental to your > > plants,(there is more than one form of UV light). > I > > would suggest that you get your tank water tested, > do > > you use tap water ? do you do water changes ?. You > > make no mention of how many fish and what type you > > have. > > regards, > > unclenorm. > > > > > > --- supamii <supamii@y...> wrote: > > > > > Please note that I did not add the hydrogen > peroxide > > > solution directly > > > into my tank. I treated only the gravel and > > > laterite in a seperate > > > container. > > > > > > How is the hydrogen peroxide still in the tank > if I > > > tried to evaporate > > > the solution? Yes it is used as a bleach in > higher > > > concentrations, > > > but it has unique properties which made it > > > particularly appealing to > > > me to use to sterilize. > > > > > > It is my understanding that a number of factors > > > contribute to the > > > decomposition of H2O2 into H20 and 02. The > array of > > > factors include > > > heat, increased PH levels, increasing > contamination > > > (especially > > > transition metals such as copper, manganese or > iron) > > > and ultraviolet > > > exposure. > > > > > > So... I should have at least decomposed a great > deal > > > of the H2O2 in > > > the evaporation process. I also add plant > > > supplements which are in a > > > chelated form (Fe). With my lights on at an > average > > > of 10 hours per > > > day, there would be a fair amount of UV hitting > at > > > least the surface > > > of the substrate. > > > > > > On a side note, even chlorine in tap water, if > let > > > to sit long enough, > > > will evaporate (chlorine or whatever form its in > is > > > often the active > > > ingredient in household bleach ie clorox). > > > > > > Anyway, if anyone can address the ACTUAL ISSUE > at > > > hand and clarify > > > things for me, it would be much appreciated. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > To help you stay safe and secure online, we've > developed the all new > Yahoo! Security Centre. http://uk.security.yahoo.com > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos http://uk.photos.yahoo.com Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Mar ine+fish&c=2&s=37&.sig=ifFK7dXwnimgasbXc9Qw3w> biology Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine +fish&c=2&s=37&.sig=7uvV14BE0FL5qQP83-gHGA> fish _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15703	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 10/21/2005
Subject: Re: gourmie (spelling?)

All of my Gouramis eat the same thing everyone else does. Flake food and freeze dried blood worms. He'll settle down once he gets used to things there. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sandy Kay" <knightwriter101@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Thursday, October 20, 2005 11:55 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] gourmie (spelling?) I am not sure if the spelling is right. I have a new gourmie. He is the largest fish in the tank but the newest. He has been timid but getting better. Everyone is healthy and eating. But he seems so picky about the food and I don't see him actually eating it. He has even spit it back out. Is there a special food he would like? He seems very healthy otherwise. Thank you in advance, Sandy [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15704	From: Bruce Hansen	Date: 10/21/2005
Subject: Re: Question for cory breeders

Dave I used to feed mine on a diluted slurry of egg yolk infusion and microworms. Fine powdered foods such as a mix of APR and spirulina should be OK too - just remember to wet it to aid sinking, and snails for the excess. I never used water deeper than 8-9". Good Luck. Cheers Bruce (Hansen) ANGFA (Qld) Inc - http://www.angfaqld.org.au/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Cydne McCown" <cydthekid50@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Thursday, October 20, 2005 4:29 PM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Question for cory breeders Hey Dave! I had a couple of successful batches of corys (albino). I kept them in a 10 gallon tank with no gravel on the bottom, and water sprites floating on top with only about half full tank, because they don't do well in deep water the first few weeks. I didn't have to start feeding them very much at first, I fed them some suspended egg yolk at first, but I think they were really eating the tiny algae off the sides of my tank, just guessing. When they were large enough (as I recall about the third week) I started feeding them live baby brine shrimp, very sparingly and also the baby fish fry flakes. I also kept two air stones going, and only did the first water change when I started feeding them the baby brine shrimp, about 30 to 50 percent water change every week. But I was really careful with the water changes, to actually take a little air tubing and making sure I was not anywhere near the fry, also, I started filtering the water I took up with a baby fish net, and when that didn't work because the netting still was not close enough, I made a net out of some support pantyhose I had and a coat hanger. That way, I was not throwing out any fry with the old water! Good luck! Cydne fish8951 <fish8951@...> wrote: Hey all, I'm having problems with my cories. I have several pairs breeding in my fish room but I'm having a few problems with the fry. I'd appreciate any help with the following questions. 1) After the fry hatch how long before I can start to feed them? They don't appear to have yolk sacks to absord the first few days like my cichlids do. They were scooting all over the tank the same day after hatching. 2) What is the best first food? I tried live bbs but it seems to be a little large for them & they appeared to starve to death the first 2 batches of fry. I've heard that I should use 18 hour old live bbs or a fine powered flake food ground up in a coffee bean grinder? Thanks again! Dave SC --------------------------------- Yahoo! Music Unlimited - Access over 1 million songs. Try it free. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15705	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 10/21/2005
Subject: Re: plants dying hydrogen peroxide? help!

The cryptocoryne MIGHT (I stress MIGHT) come back on you. Every time I plant one when it's in its active growth stage it turns to mush, but then comes back from the roots. I suggest when buying cryptocorynes, that you purchase them when small or dormant. > Yeah I purchased a small potted cryptocoryne wendtii, which is known > to be a quite hardy plant. I have another brown crypt that seems to > be doing fine though. It certainly came as a shock to me to see a > brand new plant crap out on so quickly!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15706	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 10/21/2005
Subject: Re: gourmie (spelling?)

i have a flame gourami who was the same way when i first got it. i was worried it would die because it was so timid and wouldn't eat the flakes i was feeding. now (i'd say at least 3 mos later) it's much more active and eats the flakes i feed the tank. it also likes mysis, which i feed occasionally. just give it time. if you have to use a turkey baster to shoot food in front of its face. try some frozen foods or dry feeds soaked in garlic to try to entice it to eat if you have them available. hope this helps. -valeen --- Sandy Kay <knightwriter101@...> wrote: > I am not sure if the spelling is right. I have a new gourmie. He is the largest fish in the tank > but the newest. He has been timid but getting better. Everyone is healthy and eating. But he > seems so picky about the food and I don't see him actually eating it. He has even spit it back > out. Is there a special food he would like? He seems very healthy otherwise. Thank you in > advance, Sandy > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez valeendgonzalez@...

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15707	From: Rei - Raymond Tremor	Date: 10/21/2005
Subject: Help! My plant's leaves are turning into skeleton

Hi! I have one question and I hope someone can answer me. I have both Anubias Barteri and Anubias Nana in my 15 gallon aquarium. Lately the leaves are turning to skeleton like a snail ate it, but I don't see any snails. The leaves also turns yellow on some parts. I have golden algae eater, cories, and paradise fishes. I use Flourish from Seachem, the pet store close to us suggested for me to use an iron based fertilizer and gave me Flourish Iron. And then another person in the pet store told me not to use to much Iron since it will prevent the plant from taking in nutrients. He calls it Iron poisoning. He also told me that the plant might need Potasium and I asked him where I could find one and he said he doesn't know. Any help would be appreciated. I don't have a substrate. It was fine before then all of a sudden the big leaves was turning into skeleton and then was turning yellow and would fall off and the filter would suck it. I have the light on like 8 to 16 hrs a day. Is there supposed to be a hardness or softness of the water that the plant needs? And what do I need to correct the water hardness/softness if it is off? Thanks, Rei - Raymond Tremor

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15708	From: Cydne McCown	Date: 10/21/2005
Subject: Re: Help! My plant's leaves are turning into skeleton

FamilyAraceaePart of the worldAfricaHeight20-40 cmWidth15-30 cmLight requirementslow-averageTemperature20-30oCHardness tolerancesoft-averagepH toleranceacid-neutralEasinesseasy FamilyAraceaePart of the worldAfricaHeight7-15 cmWidth8-15 cmLight requirementslow-averageTemperature20-30oCHardness tolerancesoft-averagepH toleranceacid-neutralEasinesseasy Here is what I found for you. Cydne Rei - Raymond Tremor <rei_tremor@...> wrote: Hi! I have one question and I hope someone can answer me. I have both Anubias Barteri and Anubias Nana in my 15 gallon aquarium. Lately the leaves are turning to skeleton like a snail ate it, but I don't see any snails. The leaves also turns yellow on some parts. I have golden algae eater, cories, and paradise fishes. I use Flourish from Seachem, the pet store close to us suggested for me to use an iron based fertilizer and gave me Flourish Iron. And then another person in the pet store told me not to use to much Iron since it will prevent the plant from taking in nutrients. He calls it Iron poisoning. He also told me that the plant might need Potasium and I asked him where I could find one and he said he doesn't know. Any help would be appreciated. I don't have a substrate. It was fine before then all of a sudden the big leaves was turning into skeleton and then was turning yellow and would fall off and the filter would suck it. I have the light on like 8 to 16 hrs a day. Is there supposed to be a hardness or softness of the water that the plant needs? And what do I need to correct the water hardness/softness if it is off? Thanks, Rei - Raymond Tremor --------------------------------- Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15709	From: Cydne	Date: 10/21/2005
Subject: Question........

My "new" 29 gallon tank is really getting a bad case of algae. When I bought the tank, it came with a florescent light fixture and glass top, which is what I prefer. I put the tank in a corner until I was able to buy the other components and ready to set it up. When I went to set it up, I realized the pet shop I had bought the tank and light fixture had not included a bulb, so I went back to the shop with the fixture to get a bulb. The guy at the shop tried four times to find an aquarium bulb to fit the fixture, then he tried a bulb for a reptile fixture, it fit. The shop owner was there, and assured me this fixture would be fine for an aquarium also. So I bought the reptile bulb and took it home. I think that's the problem, it has the reptile light fixture instead of an aquarium light fixture. What do you guys think? Cydne

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15710	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 10/21/2005
Subject: Re: Question........

yeah but i dont see why your aving a problem finding a bulb to fit it... the reptile bulbs should be the same size as aquarium because ive use plenty of mine interchangable.... Kris Cydne <cydthekid50@...> wrote: My "new" 29 gallon tank is really getting a bad case of algae. When I bought the tank, it came with a florescent light fixture and glass top, which is what I prefer. I put the tank in a corner until I was able to buy the other components and ready to set it up. When I went to set it up, I realized the pet shop I had bought the tank and light fixture had not included a bulb, so I went back to the shop with the fixture to get a bulb. The guy at the shop tried four times to find an aquarium bulb to fit the fixture, then he tried a bulb for a reptile fixture, it fit. The shop owner was there, and assured me this fixture would be fine for an aquarium also. So I bought the reptile bulb and took it home. I think that's the problem, it has the reptile light fixture instead of an aquarium light fixture. What do you guys think? Cydne Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15711	From: Cydne McCown	Date: 10/21/2005
Subject: Re: Question........

well, they did "fit", but they did not "light", the aquarium bulbs just flashed and flashed and never lit completely. Cydne kristopher helsing <punk3r12@...> wrote: yeah but i dont see why your aving a problem finding a bulb to fit it... the reptile bulbs should be the same size as aquarium because ive use plenty of mine interchangable.... Kris Cydne <cydthekid50@...> wrote: My "new" 29 gallon tank is really getting a bad case of algae. When I bought the tank, it came with a florescent light fixture and glass top, which is what I prefer. I put the tank in a corner until I was able to buy the other components and ready to set it up. When I went to set it up, I realized the pet shop I had bought the tank and light fixture had not included a bulb, so I went back to the shop with the fixture to get a bulb. The guy at the shop tried four times to find an aquarium bulb to fit the fixture, then he tried a bulb for a reptile fixture, it fit. The shop owner was there, and assured me this fixture would be fine for an aquarium also. So I bought the reptile bulb and took it home. I think that's the problem, it has the reptile light fixture instead of an aquarium light fixture. What do you guys think? Cydne --------------------------------- Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15712	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 10/21/2005
Subject: Re: Question........

i had the same problem... the fixture isnt very sturdy... once you get the bulb fixed in the right spot... might be frustrating but trust me iut will work... then youll be ok.... if you dont like the idea you should look into some PCs online... for the amount your going to spend on rep bulbs you can get decent pcs online...... i love the pc light on fish. Cydne McCown <cydthekid50@...> wrote: well, they did "fit", but they did not "light", the aquarium bulbs just flashed and flashed and never lit completely. Cydne kristopher helsing <punk3r12@...> wrote: yeah but i dont see why your aving a problem finding a bulb to fit it... the reptile bulbs should be the same size as aquarium because ive use plenty of mine interchangable.... Kris Cydne <cydthekid50@...> wrote: My "new" 29 gallon tank is really getting a bad case of algae. When I bought the tank, it came with a florescent light fixture and glass top, which is what I prefer. I put the tank in a corner until I was able to buy the other components and ready to set it up. When I went to set it up, I realized the pet shop I had bought the tank and light fixture had not included a bulb, so I went back to the shop with the fixture to get a bulb. The guy at the shop tried four times to find an aquarium bulb to fit the fixture, then he tried a bulb for a reptile fixture, it fit. The shop owner was there, and assured me this fixture would be fine for an aquarium also. So I bought the reptile bulb and took it home. I think that's the problem, it has the reptile light fixture instead of an aquarium light fixture. What do you guys think? Cydne --------------------------------- Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15713	From: KttmfC	Date: 10/22/2005
Subject: Tag alongs

I got some gup's today for the first time( everything else has been done here figured id breed some for beauty) and got a couple tagalongs. Im going to post them in a folder like Kris's Fish. Please give em a look over and tell me what you think they might be. I think one type is goby, dont know the other.. thanks! Kris

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15714	From: Chris	Date: 10/22/2005
Subject: Re: Tag alongs

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "KttmfC" <punk3r12@y...> wrote: > Correct me if I'm wrong, but the photo labelled "hard to" looks like a different kind of fish to the other photos. If so, it looks like something which has a million names: White Cloud Mountain Minnow, Mountain Cloud, Mountain Cloud, or any other variation. Those can be kept reasonably well in cold-water tanks, and they'll do fine in tropical tanks too. As for the others, I'm not sure. Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15715	From: Chris	Date: 10/22/2005
Subject: Re: gourmie (spelling?)

It could also be a problem if the other tank inhabitants are eating the food more quickly than the gourami can eat it.. Is the tank full of really fast-swimming fish like barbs and danios? Otherwise, it's been a few days - how's the gourami going? Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15716	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 10/22/2005
Subject: Re: Tag alongs

its not a white cloud..... ill try for a better pic but its got black stripes that go from nose to tail... with the red in the tail but totally different fin build... ill try another pic thanks Chris <youcantryreachingme@...> wrote: --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "KttmfC" <punk3r12@y...> wrote: > Correct me if I'm wrong, but the photo labelled "hard to" looks like a different kind of fish to the other photos. If so, it looks like something which has a million names: White Cloud Mountain Minnow, Mountain Cloud, Mountain Cloud, or any other variation. Those can be kept reasonably well in cold-water tanks, and they'll do fine in tropical tanks too. As for the others, I'm not sure. Chris. Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15717	From: ahorseofcourse66	Date: 10/22/2005
Subject: What is in my tank??

HI, A few days ago I spotted something different in my tank. Its about 1/8in. long about as big around as a hair dark to black in color has two darker spots I think are eyes and clings to the side of the tank like an algae eater. I have balloon mollies, zebra danios and a clown plecostomus are the only fish in the tank. Does anyone know what my new little friend might be??? I have had the same fish in this tank for several months with the only addition of a new molly now and then. Thanks

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15718	From: Beth Brownell	Date: 10/23/2005
Subject: My loss is your gain sale.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7720763788 I have put up on eBay my Whisper power filter with extra cartridges and several plastic plants. My loss is your gain. Please have a look and bid if you want the items. Thank you, Beth Brownell

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15719	From: fuzzybpebble	Date: 10/23/2005
Subject: Re: What is in my tank??

It may be a baby plecostomus. It sounds like it is related to the algae eater family and I would think that maybe your pleco was pregnant. Just an idea. Bethany --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "ahorseofcourse66" <ahorseofcourse66@y...> wrote: > > HI, A few days ago I spotted something different in my tank. Its > about 1/8in. long about as big around as a hair dark to black in color > has two darker spots I think are eyes and clings to the side of the > tank like an algae eater. > I have balloon mollies, zebra danios and a clown plecostomus are the > only fish in the tank. Does anyone know what my new little friend > might be??? > I have had the same fish in this tank for several months with the only > addition of a new molly now and then. > Thanks >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15720	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 10/23/2005
Subject: Re: What is in my tank??

Sounds like a new hatched snail to me...but I could be wrong

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15721	From: Donna Ransome	Date: 10/23/2005
Subject: Re: 29 gallon mbuna tank

Nim, did you ever add the demasoni's? How do they get along with the labidochromis caeruleus? Any new pics? I am starting a tank. I like Ray's suggestion of maximizing success with a single species (labidochromis caeruleus) plus synodontis petricola. Some day after I have more experience, I'd like to keep the little blue guys, whether in their own tank or make an attempt at a mix like you have. _____ From: Nimish Mathur [mailto:nimmat4@...] Sent: Saturday, February 26, 2005 12:55 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] 29 gallon mbuna tank Hi Donna, This is still in progress and I will get some good pics soon. It presently house about 6 labidochromis caeruleus, 3 synodontis niggriventris, 5 labido hongi, 6 pseudotropheus elongates mpanga, It initially had 3 melanochromis maingano, 6 melanochromis auratus. Had to give away the melanochromis as they were too aggressive for the others. I am getting some pseudotropheus demasonni and pseudo easthrae red in replacement. Oh, it also has a large RTB shark and a freaked out platy that chases the labidochromis :-s and cannot be kept in a community tank and also a golden nugget pleco and a Siamese algae eater. No one is bothering the SAE so I keep him to control a bit of black brush algae. The caving in the tank is good enough to hide almost all the fish and hence has been working very well. I specifically chose ocean rocks with a lot of holes and stacked them accordingly. This tank is a Juwel reckord 96, with the Juwel filter removed and HOT filter and eheim 2217 canister on this. HOT is not visible as it is on a side and intake covered by vallis. Nim _____ From: Donna Ransome [mailto:djransome@...] Sent: 26 February 2005 15:54 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] 29 gallon mbuna tank Nim, do you have a picture of the 29 gallon mbuna tank? I'd love to set one up some day (not this year). Are live plants out of the question with these cichlids? I know you need lots of rocks and caves/hiding places. _____ From: Nimish Mathur [mailto:nimmat4@...] Sent: Friday, February 25, 2005 8:21 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: New 29 gallon tank - fish ideas The rule can be relaxed depending on your maintenance, filter system, live plants and type of fish. 9 barbs, 2 gouramis and a pleco is not over stocked in a 29 gallon tank as long as you do weekly 20% water changes and have a good filter. However, if you were to reduce your water changes to once in 3 weeks and don't have a powerful filter, the tank could be considered a bit over stocked. I have about 28 mbunas (Malawi cichlids, 2"-3") in a 29 gallon tank with a canister filter and an internal power filter coupled with weekly 50% water changes and except for the crowd in there (cannot help it), water parameters do not tell me that I am overstocked. Nim [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15722	From: Donna Ransome	Date: 10/23/2005
Subject: Mbuna Tank Decor: Background

I have been researching options by looking at award-winning Malawi tanks on the internet. For an authentic Lake Malawi habitat, no plants, sand substrate and lots of rocks seem to be the rules. Has anyone used a Back to Nature background? I like the looks, it is lighter than real rock and it hides all the equipment (placed behind the background). I asked about this at a LFS today, they stopped building "inside the tank" backgrounds due to problems with dirt and fish getting behind. Back to Nature (the LFS had never heard of Back to Nature) gets around these by (a) silicone around the edges so fish can't get behind, and (b) the filter pulls in water through an intake in the background, so water behind is filtered as well. Opinions from this group? Other recommendations on background treatment for the mbunas? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15723	From: Tom Ray	Date: 10/24/2005
Subject: Re: Tag alongs

From the looks of it (if I am looking in the correct folder and at the correct pic), it may be a blue fin killifish/topminnow (Lucania goodei). Its a native fish to the Continental USA. Hope this helps... --TommyBoy --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "KttmfC" <punk3r12@y...> wrote: > > I got some gup's today for the first time( everything else has been > done here figured id breed some for beauty) and got a couple > tagalongs. Im going to post them in a folder like Kris's Fish. Please > give em a look over and tell me what you think they might be. I think > one type is goby, dont know the other.. thanks! > > Kris >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15724	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 10/24/2005
Subject: Re: Tag alongs

Thanks Tommyboy Thats it..... i got it free cuz they couldnt sell it. Have any idea what the goby looking guys are?? i dont want to feed them incorrectly.. Tom Ray <t_a_ray_cissp@...> wrote:From the looks of it (if I am looking in the correct folder and at the correct pic), it may be a blue fin killifish/topminnow (Lucania goodei). Its a native fish to the Continental USA. Hope this helps... --TommyBoy --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "KttmfC" <punk3r12@y...> wrote: > > I got some gup's today for the first time( everything else has been > done here figured id breed some for beauty) and got a couple > tagalongs. Im going to post them in a folder like Kris's Fish. Please > give em a look over and tell me what you think they might be. I think > one type is goby, dont know the other.. thanks! > > Kris > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15725	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 10/24/2005
Subject: Re: Tag alongs

I think these(the ones we havent named) are darter fish of some type.... would anyone please douuble check and see if they agree?? thanks Kris kristopher helsing <punk3r12@...> wrote: Thanks Tommyboy Thats it..... i got it free cuz they couldnt sell it. Have any idea what the goby looking guys are?? i dont want to feed them incorrectly.. Tom Ray <t_a_ray_cissp@...> wrote:From the looks of it (if I am looking in the correct folder and at the correct pic), it may be a blue fin killifish/topminnow (Lucania goodei). Its a native fish to the Continental USA. Hope this helps... --TommyBoy --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "KttmfC" <punk3r12@y...> wrote: > > I got some gup's today for the first time( everything else has been > done here figured id breed some for beauty) and got a couple > tagalongs. Im going to post them in a folder like Kris's Fish. Please > give em a look over and tell me what you think they might be. I think > one type is goby, dont know the other.. thanks! > > Kris > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15726	From: Chris	Date: 10/24/2005
Subject: shortest lived vertebrate - coral reef pygmy goby

Just did some reading of older articles on the ABC science website and found this article on the shortest lived vertebrate known; a coral reef pygmy goby with a maximum life expectancy of 59 days: http://www.abc.net.au/science/news/enviro/EnviroRepublish_1352637.htm Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15727	From: supamii	Date: 10/24/2005
Subject: bolivian ram AND angelfish??

Right now I have an angelfish which is at a small-medium size of 2.5 inches. So far with a small school of tetras and corydoras, he's been super peaceful. I've been looking at pictures online and I think that the bolivian ram is quite a pretty pretty cichlid. With that said, I want to buy one! Does anyone have experience with the bolivian ram? Fin nipping? While my tank is not at all a large one, its well planted and provides cover for even the angel fish to hide in! So I'd like to hear if any of you guys have mixed 2 of these cichlids together. bring it on!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15728	From: SuNnY	Date: 10/24/2005
Subject: Re: bolivian ram AND angelfish??

Yes i have. Bolivian rams are the most peaceful chichlids... you wont have any problem whatsoever. But the water conditions should be ideal for them to survive for long.....SuNnY ! supamii <supamii@...> wrote: Right now I have an angelfish which is at a small-medium size of 2.5 inches. So far with a small school of tetras and corydoras, he's been super peaceful. I've been looking at pictures online and I think that the bolivian ram is quite a pretty pretty cichlid. With that said, I want to buy one! Does anyone have experience with the bolivian ram? Fin nipping? While my tank is not at all a large one, its well planted and provides cover for even the angel fish to hide in! So I'd like to hear if any of you guys have mixed 2 of these cichlids together. bring it on! Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15729	From: supamii	Date: 10/24/2005
Subject: Re: bolivian ram AND angelfish??

how big is your tank and what are your water conditions? PH + hardness? thanks! --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, SuNnY <sunnyvks@y...> wrote: > > Yes i have. > > Bolivian rams are the most peaceful chichlids... you wont have any problem whatsoever. > > But the water conditions should be ideal for them to survive for long.....SuNnY ! > > supamii <supamii@y...> wrote: > Right now I have an angelfish which is at a small-medium size of 2.5 > inches. So far with a small school of tetras and corydoras, he's been > super peaceful. I've been looking at pictures online and I think that > the bolivian ram is quite a pretty pretty cichlid. With that said, I > want to buy one! > > Does anyone have experience with the bolivian ram? Fin nipping? > > While my tank is not at all a large one, its well planted and provides > cover for even the angel fish to hide in! > > So I'd like to hear if any of you guys have mixed 2 of these cichlids > together. > > bring it on!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15730	From: Chris	Date: 10/24/2005
Subject: Re: bolivian ram AND angelfish??

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "supamii" <supamii@y...> wrote: > So I'd like to hear if any of you guys have mixed 2 of these cichlids Yes - the Rams are very peaceful, even shy; they also seem to be more sensitive to water quality. If you had a dozen angels and one pair of rams, I'd suggest the Rams wouldn't appreciate the voracity of the angels. A single angelfish shouldn't be too bad. If you plan on more angels, then make sure not to overstock the tank; that is, leave enough space for the rams to get some peace. Hiding places wouldn't be sufficient for the rams because if a pair of angels decided to breed, they would likely drive away the rams so persistently that the rams would be confined to the hiding space; and rams being a little more sensitive to stress, wouldn't fair well. That said, you've only mentioned one angelfish, so everything should be good. My personal preference for these fish are tall narrow-leaved plants, especially sword plants (and similar). Because of the compressed body shape of the fish, these guys love to swim through leaves like this. A piece of driftwood will also help with conditioning (in this case softening / adding tanins to) the water.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15731	From: supamii	Date: 10/24/2005
Subject: Re: bolivian ram AND angelfish??

wow thanks, sounds like great news for me. yeah, i'm considering the bolivian ram since i expect to return the lovely angelfish sometime in the near future when he begins to outgrow the tank. i have plenty of swords! but i think my driftwood has little effect on the PH level now since after they were supposedly cured and left in another tank for a while, i additionally boiled/sterilized them. I'm relying mostly on my CO2 to keep my PH level at a moderate 7.0- 7.5 ph. i have also heard that these are not as sensitive to water quality as blue rams, else i'd have gotten those already! have you ever tried the 7.0 neutralizer products from seachem? --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Chris" <youcantryreachingme@y...> wrote: > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "supamii" <supamii@y...> wrote: > > So I'd like to hear if any of you guys have mixed 2 of these > cichlids > > Yes - the Rams are very peaceful, even shy; they also seem to be more > sensitive to water quality. > > If you had a dozen angels and one pair of rams, I'd suggest the Rams > wouldn't appreciate the voracity of the angels. A single angelfish > shouldn't be too bad. If you plan on more angels, then make sure not > to overstock the tank; that is, leave enough space for the rams to > get some peace. > > Hiding places wouldn't be sufficient for the rams because if a pair > of angels decided to breed, they would likely drive away the rams so > persistently that the rams would be confined to the hiding space; and > rams being a little more sensitive to stress, wouldn't fair well. > > That said, you've only mentioned one angelfish, so everything should > be good. > > My personal preference for these fish are tall narrow-leaved plants, > especially sword plants (and similar). Because of the compressed body > shape of the fish, these guys love to swim through leaves like this. > A piece of driftwood will also help with conditioning (in this case > softening / adding tanins to) the water. >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15732	From: SuNnY	Date: 10/25/2005
Subject: Re: bolivian ram AND angelfish??

I have a 55gal moderately planted tank. I dont bother much about the water conditions. I have set the temp to 28"C religiously make a 30% water change every week. Well i had the rams and agels in a 20Gal tank and in fact they laid eggs also, but unfortunately the male ate them off and after that they never did the job. ........SuNnY ! supamii <supamii@...> wrote: how big is your tank and what are your water conditions? PH + hardness? thanks! --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, SuNnY <sunnyvks@y...> wrote: > > Yes i have. > > Bolivian rams are the most peaceful chichlids... you wont have any problem whatsoever. > > But the water conditions should be ideal for them to survive for long.....SuNnY ! > > supamii <supamii@y...> wrote: > Right now I have an angelfish which is at a small-medium size of 2.5 > inches. So far with a small school of tetras and corydoras, he's been > super peaceful. I've been looking at pictures online and I think that > the bolivian ram is quite a pretty pretty cichlid. With that said, I > want to buy one! > > Does anyone have experience with the bolivian ram? Fin nipping? > > While my tank is not at all a large one, its well planted and provides > cover for even the angel fish to hide in! > > So I'd like to hear if any of you guys have mixed 2 of these cichlids > together. > > bring it on! Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15733	From: Sue Boswell	Date: 10/25/2005
Subject: Re: bolivian ram AND angelfish??

If one angelfish could outgrow the tank it is probably too small for the rams. What is the Kh & Gh? If these are high you may as well forget lowering the pH. ----- Original Message ----- From: "supamii" <supamii@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, October 25, 2005 7:22 AM Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: bolivian ram AND angelfish?? wow thanks, sounds like great news for me. yeah, i'm considering the bolivian ram since i expect to return the lovely angelfish sometime in the near future when he begins to outgrow the tank. i have plenty of swords! but i think my driftwood has little effect on the PH level now since after they were supposedly cured and left in another tank for a while, i additionally boiled/sterilized them. I'm relying mostly on my CO2 to keep my PH level at a moderate 7.0- 7.5 ph. i have also heard that these are not as sensitive to water quality as blue rams, else i'd have gotten those already! have you ever tried the 7.0 neutralizer products from seachem?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15734	From: Robert Hickey	Date: 10/25/2005
Subject: Re: bolivian ram AND angelfish??

Hiya I have kept 3 Bolivan rams With a breeding pair of angels ( holy terrors that they are) and they are indeed the most peacefull chichlids towards other fish I have come accross, they basically ignore everyone else and do there thing, However when you get a pair they Can be aggressive towards others namley other Rams. and I have seen almost pitched battles between the Rams and angels ( no harm done just chasing )when breeding, all in all A lovely fish and highly recommended and will be no hassle to you other fish at all. Irish Rob Regards Robert Hickey Robert Hickey | Networks Engineer Citywest Business Park | BT | Tel: +353 (0)1 4328749 | Mob: +353 (0)86 8061840 | E: robert.hickey@... | www.btireland.ie ----- Original Message ----- From: SuNnY To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, October 25, 2005 6:10 AM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] bolivian ram AND angelfish?? Yes i have. Bolivian rams are the most peaceful chichlids... you wont have any problem whatsoever. But the water conditions should be ideal for them to survive for long.....SuNnY ! supamii <supamii@...> wrote: Right now I have an angelfish which is at a small-medium size of 2.5 inches. So far with a small school of tetras and corydoras, he's been super peaceful. I've been looking at pictures online and I think that the bolivian ram is quite a pretty pretty cichlid. With that said, I want to buy one! Does anyone have experience with the bolivian ram? Fin nipping? While my tank is not at all a large one, its well planted and provides cover for even the angel fish to hide in! So I'd like to hear if any of you guys have mixed 2 of these cichlids together. bring it on! Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15735	From: Ben Noreau	Date: 10/25/2005
Subject: betta problem

hello, My son, who is in third grade brought my attention a problem that his class is having with their pet betta. His thought was that since we raise tropical fish I would know what the problem was and make it better. The problem is this, the betta which the teacher says she was told was male (I wasnt able to tell, I didnt see a male part but that doesnt mean that it wasnt. I am positive that it is a betta that much I am sure of) has "suddenly" (Im not sure of the timeframe) has gotten fat. I am really concerned because when I saw it, the first thing I thought that it looks like a balloon mollie. The water tested within normal limits, its not over fed, its in a 5 gal acrylic tank. The only other thing that is worth noting is that there was some "funny" white stuff on the bottom of the tank. It looked like white seaweed. The teacher noted that that appeared around the time that she noted the problem with the betta. I have heard people talk about "bubble nests" and that is what I thought that the white stuff might be. I have never seen one. So that is why I question if they are bubble nests and the fish is pregnant. If the fish isnt pregnant that there is some other more serious problem that needs to be addressed. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Ben --------------------------------- Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15736	From: cynthia brennemann	Date: 10/25/2005
Subject: Re: betta problem

Well, the white stuff is definately NOT bubble nest. Bubble nests float on top of the surface, and are made of bubbles. The most common reason for fish to suddenly become fat is dropsy. Take a look at the fish and see if the scales are protruding a bit from the body. And while they're at it, have them do a partial water change and get rid of the white stuff on the bottom. Adding a tablespoon of seasalt or aquarium salt to the water wouldn't hurt anything.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15737	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 10/25/2005
Subject: Re: betta problem

Funny white stuff at the bottom of the tank? May be a fungus, perhaps from decaying food. If the fish is looking like a balloon mollie, it is probably near EOL, as it has gone to far without any diagnosis and treatment. Even a female betta would not look like a balloon mollie if she was full of eggs. A bubble nest is just that, a nest of bubbles, that float. Definitely something wrong here. Overfeeding is just one possibility, and the water quality is probably suspect as well. You really don't give us enough to go on to even diagnose, never mind suggest a possible cure. However, first thing I'd do is to clean up that tank with a water change removing all that stuff on the bottom of the tank. If it is not a fungus, then it could be something some student added to the tank "accidentally" or to "improve" the tank. It may be too late to save the betta, but you could teach a bit about water quality and its importance. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ben Noreau Sent: Tuesday, October 25, 2005 8:53 AM To: aquaticlife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] betta problem hello, My son, who is in third grade brought my attention a problem that his class is having with their pet betta. His thought was that since we raise tropical fish I would know what the problem was and make it better. The problem is this, the betta which the teacher says she was told was male (I wasnt able to tell, I didnt see a male part but that doesnt mean that it wasnt. I am positive that it is a betta that much I am sure of) has "suddenly" (Im not sure of the timeframe) has gotten fat. I am really concerned because when I saw it, the first thing I thought that it looks like a balloon mollie. The water tested within normal limits, its not over fed, its in a 5 gal acrylic tank. The only other thing that is worth noting is that there was some "funny" white stuff on the bottom of the tank. It looked like white seaweed. The teacher noted that that appeared around the time that she noted the problem with the betta. I have heard people talk about "bubble nests" and that is what I thought that the white stuff might be. I have never seen one. So that is why I question if they are bubble nests and the fish is pregnant. If the fish isnt pregnant that there is some other more serious problem that needs to be addressed. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Ben --------------------------------- Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15738	From: mommy2acdhsurvivor	Date: 10/25/2005
Subject: Re: Question........

I had a tank light that would flicker and not stay all the way on. It turned out to be a simple as you have to hold the button in for like 3 seconds than let go. Than it will work fine. > > Cydne <cydthekid50@y...> wrote: > My "new" 29 gallon tank is really getting a bad case of algae. When I > bought the tank, it came with a florescent light fixture and glass > top, which is what I prefer. I put the tank in a corner until I was > able to buy the other components and ready to set it up. > > When I went to set it up, I realized the pet shop I had bought the > tank and light fixture had not included a bulb, so I went back to the > shop with the fixture to get a bulb. The guy at the shop tried four > times to find an aquarium bulb to fit the fixture, then he tried a > bulb for a reptile fixture, it fit. The shop owner was there, and > assured me this fixture would be fine for an aquarium also. So I > bought the reptile bulb and took it home. > > I think that's the problem, it has the reptile light fixture instead > of an aquarium light fixture. > > What do you guys think? > > Cydne

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15739	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 10/26/2005
Subject: Nemotodes coming out of guppy anus - treatment?

If it isn't one thing it's something else. My 20 gal tropical tank has been having problems for months, and tonight it occured to me that the guppies are infected with some disgusting nematodes...Camallanus I think, or something similar. Although the danios don't seem to be affected, they are all in the same tank so of course it's possible. I wonder if this has anything to do with the kinked spine and constant fin rot in danios? Anyway, I've been giving them the Jungle anti-parasite food for 2 weeks (3 days on, 4 days off); will this work and how long will it take to clear up? I read about fenbendazole and levamisole, and also read that the fish sometimes die anyway after the treatments because they have dead nemetodes rotting in the gut. If I could get some opinions about the best way to tackle this problem, that would be great! Thanks Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15740	From: Daniel Brown	Date: 10/27/2005
Subject: Questions: just got a mature tank

First off some background info, I've had the tank about 11 days now. Its a 75 litre tank with 10 Neon Tetras, 4 Black Widows, 2 Leopard Danios and a Golden Loach. I got the tank from a friend who had had it for over a year but no longer wanted it, so far its been running alright although I've had to replace the heater as it did not seem to be holding a constant temperature and replace the filter media as the filter's clogged indicator (is a Fluval Plus 2) was up and add the Golden Loach to try and get the algae back under control. I think I will need to replace the other piece of filter foam in my filter soon too, how long should I leave it between adding the new replacement foam and removing and replacing the other clogged piece of filter foam to allow for bacterial colonisation of the filter media. What temperature should I be aiming to keep my tank at? My heater is currently set to maintain 25 C (77 F), the book I have says 24 C (75F). My other query is about heater placement, I've currently got my new 100w heater located horizontally in the middle of the rear wall of the thank about 2-3 inches from the gravel. I did this to try and get the heater as low as possible to that its thermostat gets a more accurate reading of the actual water temperature as locating the heater in a vertical orientation would place the sensor above the heat source and would surely give a less accurate reading? Is my reasoning correct? I live in Scotland so I'm using a 100w heater as it can get cool in our living room at night and so far the heater seems to be doing a great job keeping the tank at the set temperature. Although I've noticed that the neon tetras in particular seem to lose some of there colouration overnight, I can't decide if this is to do with the lights being off or the temperature dropping to 24 C (75F) can anyone tell me? My last question is about feeding I have bought some tropical fish food (flakes) it says feed 2-3 times a day and the amount is 1-2 flakes per fish. Does this sound like the correct amount? I can't decide if its too much or not , should the fish react to the food in the water when its added? I get a burst of activity for about 30 seconds when I add food in the morning and then they seem to ignore it but by the time I come back in the evening to feed them the old flakes are gone (I've had a good look and they would seem to have been eaten)... So far things seem to be going alright although I've had two Neon Tetras die since I got the tank (the original count was 12 tetras) but I think things might have settled down now. What signs should I look for when looking for distressed or ill fish? One of my Leopard Danios seems much more fat (for lack of a better term) than the other is this normal? Sorry for the huge post! Cheers, Daniel ______________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email ______________________________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15741	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 10/27/2005
Subject: Re: Nemotodes coming out of guppy anus - treatment?

Emily, While Jungle anti-parasite is good, sometimes it's just not enough. Additionally, you might want to consider feeding Piperazine sulfate - 17% (by Agrilabs) or Pipfuge - 34% (by Butler) mixed into a homemade paste food, if you can locate these meds. You would feed them the equivilent of 1% of their body weight of either of these two meds for 3 days. \ Am glad to see you are at least familiar with Fenbendazole and Levimisole. While their are mortalities (especially with heavily infected fish), these treatments often result in cures in otherwise doomed fish. Panacur (fenbendazole) is to be used as a bath , using 7.6 mg of the drug to the gallon once a week for 3 weeks. Levamisole is really the drug of choice in treating nematodes, but as it is not readily soluable in water you'll need to use it as Levimisole HCL (hydrochloride), called Levisol (7.5% concentration) or Tramisol. This is used as a one-time bath using 38 mg to the gallon (5 ppm) for 24 hours after which you should do at least a 90% water change (preferably 100%). Needless to say, a good water change should be done before adding the drug, and any carbon should be removed from the filter(s); it should first be disolved in a small quantity of very warm (but not hot) water. Levisol is most effective in water with a pH of 7 or lower. While its usually not advised to mess with your pH, for best results you may need to gradually lower your pH in this case (if it is alkaline) before administering treatment, and then watch your pH when making the large water change afterwards. After treatment, you can then gradually return your pH to normal range for ease of maintenance (weekly water changes, etc.). You may need to repeat the treatment after 1 month if you see any further signs of illness, but usually one treatment will do it. A trade name for this drug is Levaside (TM); you may be able to get these meds from your vet and certainly at most farm outlets. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Emily Tenczar <bababanana@y...> wrote: > > If it isn't one thing it's something else. My 20 gal tropical tank has been having problems for months, and tonight it occured to me that the guppies are infected with some disgusting nematodes...Camallanus I think, or something similar. Although the danios don't seem to be affected, they are all in the same tank so of course it's possible. I wonder if this has anything to do with the kinked spine and constant fin rot in danios? > > Anyway, I've been giving them the Jungle anti-parasite food for 2 weeks (3 days on, 4 days off); will this work and how long will it take to clear up? I read about fenbendazole and levamisole, and also read that the fish sometimes die anyway after the treatments because they have dead nemetodes rotting in the gut. > > If I could get some opinions about the best way to tackle this problem, that would be great! > Thanks > Emily > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15742	From: Andreas	Date: 10/27/2005
Subject: Re: Questions: just got a mature tank

I don't think you should replace the sponge media unless its hopelessly clogged, much smarter it so take some of the water from the aqarium, put it in a bucker and then wash out the sponges in that bucket, this way youi get rid of the grunge, buit the bacteria stay alive. andreas On 10/27/05, Daniel Brown <daniel.brown@...> wrote: > > First off some background info, I've had the tank about 11 days now. > Its a 75 litre tank with 10 Neon Tetras, 4 Black Widows, 2 Leopard > Danios and a Golden Loach. I got the tank from a friend who had had it > for over a year but no longer wanted it, so far its been running alright > although I've had to replace the heater as it did not seem to be holding > a constant temperature and replace the filter media as the filter's > clogged indicator (is a Fluval Plus 2) was up and add the Golden Loach > to try and get the algae back under control. I think I will need to > replace the other piece of filter foam in my filter soon too, how long > should I leave it between adding the new replacement foam and removing > and replacing the other clogged piece of filter foam to allow for > bacterial colonisation of the filter media. > > What temperature should I be aiming to keep my tank at? My heater is > currently set to maintain 25 C (77 F), the book I have says 24 C (75F). > My other query is about heater placement, I've currently got my new 100w > heater located horizontally in the middle of the rear wall of the thank > about 2-3 inches from the gravel. I did this to try and get the heater > as low as possible to that its thermostat gets a more accurate reading > of the actual water temperature as locating the heater in a vertical > orientation would place the sensor above the heat source and would > surely give a less accurate reading? Is my reasoning correct? I live > in Scotland so I'm using a 100w heater as it can get cool in our living > room at night and so far the heater seems to be doing a great job > keeping the tank at the set temperature. Although I've noticed that the > neon tetras in particular seem to lose some of there colouration > overnight, I can't decide if this is to do with the lights being off or > the temperature dropping to 24 C (75F) can anyone tell me? > > My last question is about feeding I have bought some tropical fish food > (flakes) it says feed 2-3 times a day and the amount is 1-2 flakes per > fish. Does this sound like the correct amount? I can't decide if its > too much or not , should the fish react to the food in the water when > its added? I get a burst of activity for about 30 seconds when I add > food in the morning and then they seem to ignore it but by the time I > come back in the evening to feed them the old flakes are gone (I've had > a good look and they would seem to have been eaten)... > > So far things seem to be going alright although I've had two Neon Tetras > die since I got the tank (the original count was 12 tetras) but I think > things might have settled down now. What signs should I look for when > looking for distressed or ill fish? One of my Leopard Danios seems much > more fat (for lack of a better term) than the other is this normal? > > Sorry for the huge post! > > Cheers, > > Daniel > > ______________________________________________________________________ > This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. > For more information please visit http://www.messagelabs.com/email > ______________________________________________________________________ > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > 毀畔�虜.><((((�gt;.毀畔�虜.毀畔��gt;<((((�gt; �毀畔�� , .毀畔�.><((((�gt; > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <�(((><.毀畔�虜.毀畔��lt;�(((><�毀畔�� , .毀畔�.<�(((><毀畔�虜. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine biology<http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine+fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=sWozU8RAgM2g66Yb_7h_nQ> Marine > fish<http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine+fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=JB6FNOraRx3JIvMA1E4-Lw> > Biology<http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine+fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=R-HUKyhqLGfm-ZAFT2vuTQ> > ------------------------------ > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > - Visit your group "AquaticLife<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife>" > on the web. > - To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com<AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > - Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>. > > > ------------------------------ > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15743	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 10/27/2005
Subject: Re: Nemotodes coming out of guppy anus - treatment?

Thanks for the speedy reply. I have a few questions about the drugs: When you say use as a bath, you mean add it directly to the tank (after dissolving in water like you said), right? It's a 20 gal tank, so would I add the equivalent for 20 gallons, or less? I'm not sure how many gallons are water and what's rock and other stuff (does that make sense?) I read that levamisole is safe for snails...is this true? Can I get this at a pet store, like petsmart? Thanks! Emily Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote: Emily, While Jungle anti-parasite is good, sometimes it's just not enough. Additionally, you might want to consider feeding Piperazine sulfate - 17% (by Agrilabs) or Pipfuge - 34% (by Butler) mixed into a homemade paste food, if you can locate these meds. You would feed them the equivilent of 1% of their body weight of either of these two meds for 3 days. \ Am glad to see you are at least familiar with Fenbendazole and Levimisole. While their are mortalities (especially with heavily infected fish), these treatments often result in cures in otherwise doomed fish. Panacur (fenbendazole) is to be used as a bath , using 7.6 mg of the drug to the gallon once a week for 3 weeks. Levamisole is really the drug of choice in treating nematodes, but as it is not readily soluable in water you'll need to use it as Levimisole HCL (hydrochloride), called Levisol (7.5% concentration) or Tramisol. This is used as a one-time bath using 38 mg to the gallon (5 ppm) for 24 hours after which you should do at least a 90% water change (preferably 100%). Needless to say, a good water change should be done before adding the drug, and any carbon should be removed from the filter(s); it should first be disolved in a small quantity of very warm (but not hot) water. Levisol is most effective in water with a pH of 7 or lower. While its usually not advised to mess with your pH, for best results you may need to gradually lower your pH in this case (if it is alkaline) before administering treatment, and then watch your pH when making the large water change afterwards. After treatment, you can then gradually return your pH to normal range for ease of maintenance (weekly water changes, etc.). You may need to repeat the treatment after 1 month if you see any further signs of illness, but usually one treatment will do it. A trade name for this drug is Levaside (TM); you may be able to get these meds from your vet and certainly at most farm outlets. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Emily Tenczar <bababanana@y...> wrote: > > If it isn't one thing it's something else. My 20 gal tropical tank has been having problems for months, and tonight it occured to me that the guppies are infected with some disgusting nematodes...Camallanus I think, or something similar. Although the danios don't seem to be affected, they are all in the same tank so of course it's possible. I wonder if this has anything to do with the kinked spine and constant fin rot in danios? > > Anyway, I've been giving them the Jungle anti-parasite food for 2 weeks (3 days on, 4 days off); will this work and how long will it take to clear up? I read about fenbendazole and levamisole, and also read that the fish sometimes die anyway after the treatments because they have dead nemetodes rotting in the gut. > > If I could get some opinions about the best way to tackle this problem, that would be great! > Thanks > Emily > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15744	From: Ray Wetzel	Date: 10/27/2005
Subject: Re: Nemotodes coming out of guppy anus - treatment?

Yes, the medication is to be added to the aquarium water. And yes again; you would add the equivalent for 2o gallons of water (minus what the gravel and rocks take up -- 1 to 2 gallons?). Doesn't have to be exact although of course you don't want to drastically overdose. Can't say whether or not levamisole is safe for snails -- don't know. You might be able to get the med at one of the better pet stores, but I doubt very much if Petsmart would handle it. If there's no LFS near you that has it, try calling your nearest (or any) Agway and have it mailed in, if you can't get it from a vet. Agway generally handles all sorts of livestock needs and this stuff is needed to deworm farm animals. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Emily Tenczar <bababanana@y...> wrote: > > Thanks for the speedy reply. I have a few questions about the drugs: > When you say use as a bath, you mean add it directly to the tank (after dissolving in water like you said), right? > > It's a 20 gal tank, so would I add the equivalent for 20 gallons, or less? I'm not sure how many gallons are water and what's rock and other stuff (does that make sense?) > > I read that levamisole is safe for snails...is this true? > > Can I get this at a pet store, like petsmart? > > Thanks! > Emily > > Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > Emily, While Jungle anti-parasite is good, sometimes it's just not > enough. Additionally, you might want to consider feeding Piperazine > sulfate - 17% (by Agrilabs) or Pipfuge - 34% (by Butler) mixed into a > homemade paste food, if you can locate these meds. You would feed > them the equivilent of 1% of their body weight of either of these two > meds for 3 days. > \ > Am glad to see you are at least familiar with Fenbendazole and > Levimisole. While their are mortalities (especially with heavily > infected fish), these treatments often result in cures in otherwise > doomed fish. Panacur (fenbendazole) is to be used as a bath , using > 7.6 mg of the drug to the gallon once a week for 3 weeks. Levamisole > is really the drug of choice in treating nematodes, but as it is not > readily soluable in water you'll need to use it as Levimisole HCL > (hydrochloride), called Levisol (7.5% concentration) or Tramisol. > This is used as a one-time bath using 38 mg to the gallon (5 ppm) for > 24 hours after which you should do at least a 90% water change > (preferably 100%). Needless to say, a good water change should be > done before adding the drug, and any carbon should be removed from > the filter(s); it should first be disolved in a small quantity of > very warm (but not hot) water. Levisol is most effective in water > with a pH of 7 or lower. While its usually not advised to mess with > your pH, for best results you may need to gradually lower your pH in > this case (if it is alkaline) before administering treatment, and > then watch your pH when making the large water change afterwards. > After treatment, you can then gradually return your pH to normal > range for ease of maintenance (weekly water changes, etc.). You may > need to repeat the treatment after 1 month if you see any further > signs of illness, but usually one treatment will do it. A trade name > for this drug is Levaside (TM); you may be able to get these meds > from your vet and certainly at most farm outlets. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Emily Tenczar <bababanana@y...> > wrote: > > > > If it isn't one thing it's something else. My 20 gal tropical tank > has been having problems for months, and tonight it occured to me > that the guppies are infected with some disgusting > nematodes...Camallanus I think, or something similar. Although the > danios don't seem to be affected, they are all in the same tank so of > course it's possible. I wonder if this has anything to do with the > kinked spine and constant fin rot in danios? > > > > Anyway, I've been giving them the Jungle anti-parasite food for 2 > weeks (3 days on, 4 days off); will this work and how long will it > take to clear up? I read about fenbendazole and levamisole, and also > read that the fish sometimes die anyway after the treatments because > they have dead nemetodes rotting in the gut. > > > > If I could get some opinions about the best way to tackle this > problem, that would be great! > > Thanks > > Emily > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine biology Marine fish Biology > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15745	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 10/27/2005
Subject: Re: betta problem

bubble nests are big "nests" of bubbles that float on the top of the tank. they look exactly like a bunch of bubbles stuck together into a group. so the stuff on the bottom of the betta tank wouldn't be a bubble nest. -valeen --- Ben Noreau <ben_noreau@...> wrote: > hello, > > My son, who is in third grade brought my > attention a problem that his class is having with > their pet betta. His thought was that since we > raise tropical fish I would know what the problem > was and make it better. > > The problem is this, the betta which the > teacher says she was told was male (I wasnt able to > tell, I didnt see a male part but that doesnt mean > that it wasnt. I am positive that it is a betta > that much I am sure of) has "suddenly" (Im not sure > of the timeframe) has gotten fat. I am really > concerned because when I saw it, the first thing I > thought that it looks like a balloon mollie. The > water tested within normal limits, its not over fed, > its in a 5 gal acrylic tank. The only other thing > that is worth noting is that there was some "funny" > white stuff on the bottom of the tank. It looked > like white seaweed. The teacher noted that that > appeared around the time that she noted the problem > with the betta. > > I have heard people talk about "bubble nests" > and that is what I thought that the white stuff > might be. I have never seen one. So that is why I > question if they are bubble nests and the fish is > pregnant. If the fish isnt pregnant that there is > some other more serious problem that needs to be > addressed. Any help would be greatly appreciated. > > > > > > > > Ben > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in > one click. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez valeendgonzalez@...

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15746	From: Andreas	Date: 10/28/2005
Subject: anchor worms heeelp

Hello all My SA leaf fish have caught anchor worms, presumably from their feeder fish. I have been treating with Clout for about 4 days now with no visible improvement. I have heard suggested I take the fish out and pick the anchor worms off with tweezers. is this safe? any other ideas for meds or methods. Andreas [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15747	From: linsparks22	Date: 10/28/2005
Subject: Pleco

Hello, My name is Linda and I am new to the group. Thank you for letting me join. I was wondering if someone might be able to help me. My husband bought 2 plecos about 2 weeks ago and about 2 days ago we noticed these brown patches on the top of both of there heads. They are small and black. My husband thought they were changing colors or something. I noticed tonight they are not eating, very active, and now I saw red streaks on the tip of one of there tails. I was wondering if anyone might know what it is. Is it cureable? Do we need to throw them out of the tank? We have other fish in the tank with them. Moors, Fantail Goldfish, Corydoras, Chinese algae eater. Will this harm the other fish? Please respond A.S.A.P if anyone can. Thank you, Linda

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15748	From: shaenalee_02	Date: 10/28/2005
Subject: Betta?

I have moved my betta to my 55 gallon tank with my other fish I have, 1huge black moor, 1huge weather leuch, 8 glow lights 7 neons, two plackos, 4 cory doras, 2huge dollar fish and 6 black fan tailed tetras, ok here is the question, he was living in a very small tank before I got him and I am wondering if this move will stress him out to much? he has been fine for the last 2 days but I have never had a betta before and don't want to do something wrong, maybe a silly question but had to ask. All my fish have excepted him as far as I can tell, he did try to stand off with my black moor but Brusie as I call him is a easy going fish and just swam right on by.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15749	From: Cydne McCown	Date: 10/28/2005
Subject: Re: Betta?

I have not had any trouble with putting male or female bettas in my community tanks, just so it's just the one betta. Cydne shaenalee_02 <shaenalee_02@...> wrote: I have moved my betta to my 55 gallon tank with my other fish I have, 1huge black moor, 1huge weather leuch, 8 glow lights 7 neons, two plackos, 4 cory doras, 2huge dollar fish and 6 black fan tailed tetras, ok here is the question, he was living in a very small tank before I got him and I am wondering if this move will stress him out to much? he has been fine for the last 2 days but I have never had a betta before and don't want to do something wrong, maybe a silly question but had to ask. All my fish have excepted him as far as I can tell, he did try to stand off with my black moor but Brusie as I call him is a easy going fish and just swam right on by. Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15750	From: Cydne McCown	Date: 10/28/2005
Subject: Re: Pleco

Well, how big is your tank and how big are your Plecos? Also, I have to tell you, I have never been able to keep two Plecos in the same tank, they fight something fierce, I don't know if anyone else in this group has had that trouble, but I have. Cydne linsparks22 <linsparks@...> wrote: Hello, My name is Linda and I am new to the group. Thank you for letting me join. I was wondering if someone might be able to help me. My husband bought 2 plecos about 2 weeks ago and about 2 days ago we noticed these brown patches on the top of both of there heads. They are small and black. My husband thought they were changing colors or something. I noticed tonight they are not eating, very active, and now I saw red streaks on the tip of one of there tails. I was wondering if anyone might know what it is. Is it cureable? Do we need to throw them out of the tank? We have other fish in the tank with them. Moors, Fantail Goldfish, Corydoras, Chinese algae eater. Will this harm the other fish? Please respond A.S.A.P if anyone can. Thank you, Linda Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine fish --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15751	From: Linda Sparks	Date: 10/28/2005
Subject: Fw: Re: [AquaticLife] Pleco

They were between 2 1/2 to 3 inches long. The smallest one died the night I asked the question about them. The other one is hanging on. The tank is a 55 gallon. I have had 2 maybe 3 at a time in this tank. We purchased the 2 plecos at a Wal-mart store at the same time, out of the same tank. They just got the shipment in right before we purchased them. The containers they came in were still in the floor. I suppose they were shipped like that. But at the time we purchased there were no visable disease on them. Linda -------Original Message------- From: Cydne McCown Date: 10/29/05 00:13:06 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Pleco Well, how big is your tank and how big are your Plecos? Also, I have to tell you, I have never been able to keep two Plecos in the same tank, they fight something fierce, I don't know if anyone else in this group has had that trouble, but I have. Cydne linsparks22 <linsparks@...> wrote: Hello, My name is Linda and I am new to the group. Thank you for letting me join. I was wondering if someone might be able to help me. My husband bought 2 plecos about 2 weeks ago and about 2 days ago we noticed these brown patches on the top of both of there heads. They are small and black. My husband thought they were changing colors or something. I noticed tonight they are not eating, very active, and now I saw red streaks on the tip of one of there tails. I was wondering if anyone might know what it is. Is it cureable? Do we need to throw them out of the tank? We have other fish in the tank with them. Moors, Fantail Goldfish, Corydoras, Chinese algae eater. Will this harm the other fish? Please respond A.S.A.P if anyone can. Thank you, Linda Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine fish --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine fish YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15752	From: Cydne McCown	Date: 10/28/2005
Subject: Re: Fw: Re: [AquaticLife] Pleco

I am sorry you had to wait so long for an answer, and not a great answer at that! I try not to buy fish from Wal-Mart, I have not had any luck at all with any fish I bought there. Do you have a "hospital tank" you could put the Pleco in? Just in case he is sick and you don't want to risk infecting the other fish? Or it could be he needs to be by himself for awhile for you to keep an eye on him........? Still sounds like the two Plecos were fighting, but I could be wrong about that. Cydne Linda Sparks <linsparks@...> wrote: They were between 2 1/2 to 3 inches long. The smallest one died the night I asked the question about them. The other one is hanging on. The tank is a 55 gallon. I have had 2 maybe 3 at a time in this tank. We purchased the 2 plecos at a Wal-mart store at the same time, out of the same tank. They just got the shipment in right before we purchased them. The containers they came in were still in the floor. I suppose they were shipped like that. But at the time we purchased there were no visable disease on them. Linda -------Original Message------- From: Cydne McCown Date: 10/29/05 00:13:06 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Pleco Well, how big is your tank and how big are your Plecos? Also, I have to tell you, I have never been able to keep two Plecos in the same tank, they fight something fierce, I don't know if anyone else in this group has had that trouble, but I have. Cydne linsparks22 <linsparks@...> wrote: Hello, My name is Linda and I am new to the group. Thank you for letting me join. I was wondering if someone might be able to help me. My husband bought 2 plecos about 2 weeks ago and about 2 days ago we noticed these brown patches on the top of both of there heads. They are small and black. My husband thought they were changing colors or something. I noticed tonight they are not eating, very active, and now I saw red streaks on the tip of one of there tails. I was wondering if anyone might know what it is. Is it cureable? Do we need to throw them out of the tank? We have other fish in the tank with them. Moors, Fantail Goldfish, Corydoras, Chinese algae eater. Will this harm the other fish? Please respond A.S.A.P if anyone can. Thank you, Linda Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine fish --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine fish YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine fish --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15753	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 10/28/2005
Subject: Re: Fw: Re: [AquaticLife] Pleco

Common Plecos usually don't get aggressive until they get larger, in my experience anyway. Mike In a message dated 10/28/2005 11:27:29 PM Pacific Daylight Time, cydthekid50@... writes: I am sorry you had to wait so long for an answer, and not a great answer at that! I try not to buy fish from Wal-Mart, I have not had any luck at all with any fish I bought there. Do you have a "hospital tank" you could put the Pleco in? Just in case he is sick and you don't want to risk infecting the other fish? Or it could be he needs to be by himself for awhile for you to keep an eye on him........? Still sounds like the two Plecos were fighting, but I could be wrong about that. Cydne Linda Sparks <linsparks@...> wrote: They were between 2 1/2 to 3 inches long. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15754	From: harry perry	Date: 10/29/2005
Subject: Re: Pleco/To Linda

Sounds like your combining cold water fish with tropical fish. Water temp. should be 78 for the corys, algae eater and the pleco. Much too warm for the Moors and fantail. If you stress their imune system this way many dieases will show up. I would put the plecos in a quarentine tank. Heated quarentine tank. Their are literally hundreds of dieases that can effect fish. The best strategy is to keep the fish as healthy as possible and test your water and do a 20% water change once a week. These fish need to be separated. Harry linsparks22 <linsparks@...> wrote: Hello, My name is Linda and I am new to the group. Thank you for letting me join. I was wondering if someone might be able to help me. My husband bought 2 plecos about 2 weeks ago and about 2 days ago we noticed these brown patches on the top of both of there heads. They are small and black. My husband thought they were changing colors or something. I noticed tonight they are not eating, very active, and now I saw red streaks on the tip of one of there tails. I was wondering if anyone might know what it is. Is it cureable? Do we need to throw them out of the tank? We have other fish in the tank with them. Moors, Fantail Goldfish, Corydoras, Chinese algae eater. Will this harm the other fish? Please respond A.S.A.P if anyone can. Thank you, Linda Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine fish --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15755	From: harry perry	Date: 10/29/2005
Subject: Re: Pleco/To Linda

Sounds like your combining cold water fish with tropical fish. Water temp. should be 78 for the corys, algae eater and the pleco. Much too warm for the Moors and fantail. If you stress their imune system this way many dieases will show up. I would put the plecos in a quarentine tank. Heated quarentine tank. Their are literally hundreds of dieases that can effect fish. The best strategy is to keep the fish as healthy as possible and test your water and do a 20% water change once a week. These fish need to be separated. Harry linsparks22 <linsparks@...> wrote: Hello, My name is Linda and I am new to the group. Thank you for letting me join. I was wondering if someone might be able to help me. My husband bought 2 plecos about 2 weeks ago and about 2 days ago we noticed these brown patches on the top of both of there heads. They are small and black. My husband thought they were changing colors or something. I noticed tonight they are not eating, very active, and now I saw red streaks on the tip of one of there tails. I was wondering if anyone might know what it is. Is it cureable? Do we need to throw them out of the tank? We have other fish in the tank with them. Moors, Fantail Goldfish, Corydoras, Chinese algae eater. Will this harm the other fish? Please respond A.S.A.P if anyone can. Thank you, Linda Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine fish --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15756	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 10/29/2005
Subject: Re: anchor worms heeelp

Are you sure that what you are seeing is anchor worm? I've only heard anchor worm discussed as a parasite in pond fish, usually a cyprinid such as goldfish and koi. That does not rule out that it may be found on other fish as well. Treatment is generally with Dimilin. This substance is pretty potent, so make sure you can get it in a dilution that is suitable for aquarium use. Normal dosage is 1 g per 1000 water. You can also do as you suggest, and use tweezers to actually remove the parasite from the fish. Doing this will make the fish more susceptible to bacterial infection, so it may be wise to pan a course of treatment with a general bactericide as a prophylactic. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Andreas Sent: Friday, October 28, 2005 2:13 PM To: UniQuaria@yahoogroups.com; AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com; freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] anchor worms heeelp Hello all My SA leaf fish have caught anchor worms, presumably from their feeder fish. I have been treating with Clout for about 4 days now with no visible improvement. I have heard suggested I take the fish out and pick the anchor worms off with tweezers. is this safe? any other ideas for meds or methods. Andreas [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15757	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 10/29/2005
Subject: Re: Pleco

Linda, First, plecos and goldfish should not be mixed. Goldfish are a temperate water fish while many plecos are warm water fish (not all, but many). Goldfish have their own requirements that are not suitable for other fish. But, let's put that aside for the moment. You really do not give us much to go on here to try to determine what the problem was. However, I think we can safely rule out the conspecific infighting since they both exhibited the relative same symptoms. One thing that should be done, and many people don't, is to quarantine any new fish you purchase (or are given) for a minimum of three weeks. This will give time for most, if not all, diseases and/or parasite infections to show themselves. Should any symptoms show, they can then be treated, while the fish is still in isolation, for the period that is called for, while, at the same time, not subjecting your existing population to the problem and the treatment. Once the treatment has been completed, the quarantine period is started once again. You did state that you have other fish in the tank, citing two varieties of goldfish, as well as the cories and a CAE. First, your 55 is good to house two adult goldfish, so, if you have more, it is certainly past time to either move to a larger tank or reduce the population. The temperature of the tank should be no more than room temperature, assuming 72^o F, and less is preferable. In most cases, this rules out the keeping of tropicals with goldfish. Goldfish have a high oxygen requirement, and the higher the water temperature, the less oxygen it will hold. Goldfish are known as messy or dirty fish. They release large amounts of ammonia and solid waste into the aquarium. This means that your water quality may be suspect. At minimum, when reporting a problem in a forum such as this, or getting advice from others, you should present your latest measurements of pH, ammonia, nitrites, and nitrate along with the temperature. Other information that is useful include the size of the tank, and the number, size and species of the other fish in the tank. I'm willing to bet that you have a reading of ammonia and nitrite of more than 0.0, which is what they should be, particularly with the goldfish. With this information, we can also provide you tips to improve your tank so that all your fish are more likely to stay healthy. The chinese algae eater (CAE) is a definite no-no in any tank, even though they are readily available in the trade. First, even as young fish, they do not eat much algae, if any, and second, as they grow larger, they will harass and harm your other fish as they eat the protective mucous off the other fish, possibly taking some scales along with the mucous. I'd remove the CAE as soon as possible, if not sooner. Finally, you mention you have a cory or cories. I would suspect that they are not doing as well as you might suspect. Take a good long look at them, especially the barbels of the cories. I'd suspect you'll note that they are not in good condition, one of the signs of poor water quality. They should be removed to another tank. At some point, hopefully soon, you are going to need to make some decisions. Are you truly interested in goldfish? If so, you need to be prepared to give them the space they need, and to add new tanks as you collect more fish. Do you want to delve into the world of tropicals? That 55 would make for a nice sized community tank, and you will be able to keep a number of species and/or varieties in the tank as well as getting into keeping live plants (which your goldfish will likely render near impossible) and develop a really nice looking tank. If you do not already know about the nitrogen cycle, you'll need to learn about it as it is one of the more important processes in keeping fish. You'll need to know how to measure the primary substances (ammonia, nitrites, nitrates) involved in the cycle so you can track the cycle as you go along in the hobby. Doing so will help you ensure that your fish remain disease and parasite free, and live out their expected lifespan, which for goldfish is in excess of 20 years. Forums, such as this one, are good places to learn about keeping fish. Incorrect statements will be challenged, and corrected as is necessary. Web sites are OK, but there is no limiting factor to separate the wheat from the chaff, though as you progress, you'll be able to discern the good sites form the not so good sites. Finally, there are a number of excellent books and magazines out there to read that will help you learn about the keeping of fish. Until you decide which direction you wish to pursue, I'll refrain from making recommendations so that you can be directed to publications more in line with your interests. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Linda Sparks Sent: Saturday, October 29, 2005 1:06 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Fw: Re: [AquaticLife] Pleco They were between 2 1/2 to 3 inches long. The smallest one died the night I asked the question about them. The other one is hanging on. The tank is a 55 gallon. I have had 2 maybe 3 at a time in this tank. We purchased the 2 plecos at a Wal-mart store at the same time, out of the same tank. They just got the shipment in right before we purchased them. The containers they came in were still in the floor. I suppose they were shipped like that. But at the time we purchased there were no visable disease on them. Linda -------Original Message------- From: Cydne McCown Date: 10/29/05 00:13:06 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Pleco Well, how big is your tank and how big are your Plecos? Also, I have to tell you, I have never been able to keep two Plecos in the same tank, they fight something fierce, I don't know if anyone else in this group has had that trouble, but I have. Cydne linsparks22 <linsparks@...> wrote: Hello, My name is Linda and I am new to the group. Thank you for letting me join. I was wondering if someone might be able to help me. My husband bought 2 plecos about 2 weeks ago and about 2 days ago we noticed these brown patches on the top of both of there heads. They are small and black. My husband thought they were changing colors or something. I noticed tonight they are not eating, very active, and now I saw red streaks on the tip of one of there tails. I was wondering if anyone might know what it is. Is it cureable? Do we need to throw them out of the tank? We have other fish in the tank with them. Moors, Fantail Goldfish, Corydoras, Chinese algae eater. Will this harm the other fish? Please respond A.S.A.P if anyone can. Thank you, Linda

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15758	From: Justin M.	Date: 10/29/2005
Subject: Re: Betta?

At 09:12 PM 28/10/2005 -0700, you wrote: >shaenalee_02 <shaenalee_02@...> wrote: >I have moved my betta to my 55 gallon tank with my other fish I have, >1huge black moor, 1huge weather leuch, 8 glow lights 7 neons, two >plackos, 4 cory doras, 2huge dollar fish and 6 black fan tailed >tetras, This is actually a pretty nasty mix, but not for the reason you're asking about. Your moor and your weatherloach will prefer much cooler water than your other fish, the betta especially. Those two really deserve their own separate tank. This would also relieve some pressure on your tank, which is somewhat overstocked. As for betta compatibility, they can be good community fish, but it depends on the individual. I kept one of my bettas in a 10g with four cory cats, and this worked well for several weeks until the betta took a liking to the sinking wafers I was feeding the corys. He became very defensive of the food (even though he also received his own food) and the corys began showing some wear and tear because of this. That was the end of that arrangement. So I would just suggest to watch closely. Your betta may also end up being the victim, rather than the aggressor. Tetras are not known as aggressive fish, but they can be fin-nippers, and your betta's long fins will be an easy target if they choose to do this. Hope this helps! JM

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15759	From: Andreas	Date: 10/29/2005
Subject: Re: anchor worms heeelp

I am faily certain that they got the worms from some feeder goldfish I put in there. I had a friend/ fish expert have a look to. the split tail sticking out of the fish was pretty much unmistakeable. I did notice that most anchor worm meds where designed for ponds. my tank is 90 gallon so it might still work out. right now it looks like the worms are gone from all but one fish, who I found nearly dying this morning. i took him out and did some emergency surgery. i doubt he will survive, but hope springs eternal. the other leaf fish seem fine, and the pike characins seem totally unaffected. andreas [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15760	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 10/29/2005
Subject: Re: anchor worms heeelp

I know its hard but another reason to quarantine Even Feeder fish... We use a 20 gallon bucket with Pond sponge filter,Usually we can Qt the feeder fish for 2-3 weeks before graduating them into a Glass tank,.We keep them in the glass tank for a couple days before we use them as feeders.We have been lucky so far.... Its really hard though when the wife thinks her Oscars and Fahaka puffer need extra fish and scoop them straight from the Bucket. She'll learn one of these days...... When her 3 year old Oscars or 10" Fahaka end up with something... Best of luck with the Leaf fish, Hope you have eradicated all the Anchor worms Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 10/29/2005 8:53:33 A.M. US Eastern Standard Time, andreas1120@... writes: I am faily certain that they got the worms from some feeder goldfish I put in there. I had a friend/ fish expert have a look to. the split tail sticking out of the fish was pretty much unmistakeable. I did notice that most anchor worm meds where designed for ponds. my tank is 90 gallon so it might still work out. right now it looks like the worms are gone from all but one fish, who I found nearly dying this morning. i took him out and did some emergency surgery. i doubt he will survive, but hope springs eternal. the other leaf fish seem fine, and the pike characins seem totally unaffected. andreas [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15761	From: Cydne McCown	Date: 10/29/2005
Subject: Re: anchor worms heeelp

You know, a good way to assure quality feeder fish is (and this takes some time) to keep your own tank of them, I kept a very easy feeder tank to maintain full of feeder guppies in a 10 gallon tank, undergravel filter and a large amount of water sprite growing in it for the babies to hide in. Granted, I was feeding my breeder Angels living in another tank, and they don't require feeders very much bigger than guppy fry that's just a few weeks old, but I had control over the quality of what those guppies were fed and knew they were disease and parasite free. Any other members breed their own live food? I knew an 80 year old lady who was trying to show me how to breed and keep vinegar worms for fish fry, and also showed me how to keep brine shrimp available, but it is alot of work and time involved. She also knew how to breed blood worms, but I will tell you this....... many of my prize-winning fish were kept at top condition with frozen foods. Cydne FortWayneFish@... wrote: I know its hard but another reason to quarantine Even Feeder fish... We use a 20 gallon bucket with Pond sponge filter,Usually we can Qt the feeder fish for 2-3 weeks before graduating them into a Glass tank,.We keep them in the glass tank for a couple days before we use them as feeders.We have been lucky so far.... Its really hard though when the wife thinks her Oscars and Fahaka puffer need extra fish and scoop them straight from the Bucket. She'll learn one of these days...... When her 3 year old Oscars or 10" Fahaka end up with something... Best of luck with the Leaf fish, Hope you have eradicated all the Anchor worms Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 10/29/2005 8:53:33 A.M. US Eastern Standard Time, andreas1120@... writes: I am faily certain that they got the worms from some feeder goldfish I put in there. I had a friend/ fish expert have a look to. the split tail sticking out of the fish was pretty much unmistakeable. I did notice that most anchor worm meds where designed for ponds. my tank is 90 gallon so it might still work out. right now it looks like the worms are gone from all but one fish, who I found nearly dying this morning. i took him out and did some emergency surgery. i doubt he will survive, but hope springs eternal. the other leaf fish seem fine, and the pike characins seem totally unaffected. andreas [ --------------------------------- Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15762	From: mommy2acdhsurvivor	Date: 10/29/2005
Subject: Re: anchor worms heeelp

Tried but now just have a tank full of feeder guppy's. LOL I bought a bunch and had them in a 30 gallon quarentine tank. But the batch the lady scooped up where so pretty. They have neat tails. She said some guys house caught on fire and he brought in his feeder guppies. To me they look mixed with regular fancy guppys. Now I have a ton. They keep having baby's and not eating them! I don't have the heart to feed them. Any other members breed their own live food?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15763	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 10/29/2005
Subject: questiona bout frogs in tanks

ok i have 7 of the african dwarf frogs myself my friends wants some but in wondering if they can survive in a non filtered tank with bettas.. or do they need to be in a heated and filtered tank.. does anyone know.. thanks shannon [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15764	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 10/29/2005
Subject: Re: questiona bout frogs in tanks

they can make it but with extra water changes... and you need a lid or they WILL jump out... Kris agentscullyeyore@... wrote: ok i have 7 of the african dwarf frogs myself my friends wants some but in wondering if they can survive in a non filtered tank with bettas.. or do they need to be in a heated and filtered tank.. does anyone know.. thanks shannon [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine fish --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15765	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 10/29/2005
Subject: Re: live foods

well I have microworms for my corycat fish, confused beetles for my livebearing fish. I also have the" Rosey Reds" that have bred for me a time or two in the quarantine tanks. I don't feed goldfish.. The guppies are way to small for any of my bigger fish.. I have tried guppies but it takes so long for them to drop, and there just isn't enough babies. I cull my cichlids Heavily and use them as feeders also. Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 10/29/2005 3:54:51 P.M. US Eastern Standard Time, CK147@... writes: Any other members breed their own live food? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15766	From: Linda Sparks	Date: 10/29/2005
Subject: Fw: Re: [AquaticLife] anchor worms heeelp

I have never heard of anchor worms. Where do they come from? Can any kind of freshwater fish get them? By the way I would like to say Hello Indiana! That's my HomeState. I now live in Kentucky. I was born in Wells County, Bluffton, Indiana. Linda -------Original Message------- From: FortWayneFish@... Date: 10/29/05 11:29:04 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] anchor worms heeelp I know its hard but another reason to quarantine Even Feeder fish... We use a 20 gallon bucket with Pond sponge filter,Usually we can Qt the feeder fish for 2-3 weeks before graduating them into a Glass tank,.We keep them in the glass tank for a couple days before we use them as feeders.We have been lucky so far.... Its really hard though when the wife thinks her Oscars and Fahaka puffer need extra fish and scoop them straight from the Bucket. She'll learn one of these days...... When her 3 year old Oscars or 10" Fahaka end up with something... Best of luck with the Leaf fish, Hope you have eradicated all the Anchor worms Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 10/29/2005 8:53:33 A.M. US Eastern Standard Time, andreas1120@... writes: I am faily certain that they got the worms from some feeder goldfish I put in there. I had a friend/ fish expert have a look to. the split tail sticking out of the fish was pretty much unmistakeable. I did notice that most anchor worm meds where designed for ponds. my tank is 90 gallon so it might still work out. right now it looks like the worms are gone from all but one fish, who I found nearly dying this morning. i took him out and did some emergency surgery. i doubt he will survive, but hope springs eternal. the other leaf fish seem fine, and the pike characins seem totally unaffected. andreas [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine fish YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15767	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 10/29/2005
Subject: Re: questiona bout frogs in tanks

so the cooler temps they are ok with and the bettas will leave them alone.. thanks for your help.. shannon they can make it but with extra water changes... and you need a lid or they WILL jump out... Kris agentscullyeyore@... wrote: ok i have 7 of the african dwarf frogs myself my friends wants some but in wondering if they can survive in a non filtered tank with bettas.. or do they need to be in a heated and filtered tank.. does anyone know.. thanks shannon [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15768	From: Nimish	Date: 10/30/2005
Subject: Re: Nemotodes coming out of guppy anus - treatment?

I Would agree with the Livacide/Livasimon way. I have myself been infected with camallanus worms in all my tanks and Livasimol works like a charm in eradicating the worms completely. I might have a PDF document that I followed for the treatment. The key thing is that after treating the tank with livasimol, you will need to recycle the tank and change the gravel and filter media as their eggs can remain suspended without hosts for days and the livasimol treatment is pretty strong on fish so should not exceed more then 36 hrs followed by a 100% water change and change of gravel and filter media. Nim --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ray Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > Yes, the medication is to be added to the aquarium water. And yes > again; you would add the equivalent for 2o gallons of water (minus > what the gravel and rocks take up -- 1 to 2 gallons?). Doesn't have > to be exact although of course you don't want to drastically > overdose. Can't say whether or not levamisole is safe for snails -- > don't know. You might be able to get the med at one of the better > pet stores, but I doubt very much if Petsmart would handle it. If > there's no LFS near you that has it, try calling your nearest (or > any) Agway and have it mailed in, if you can't get it from a vet. > Agway generally handles all sorts of livestock needs and this stuff > is needed to deworm farm animals. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Emily Tenczar <bababanana@y...> > wrote: > > > > Thanks for the speedy reply. I have a few questions about the drugs: > > When you say use as a bath, you mean add it directly to the tank > (after dissolving in water like you said), right? > > > > It's a 20 gal tank, so would I add the equivalent for 20 gallons, > or less? I'm not sure how many gallons are water and what's rock and > other stuff (does that make sense?) > > > > I read that levamisole is safe for snails...is this true? > > > > Can I get this at a pet store, like petsmart? > > > > Thanks! > > Emily > > > > Ray Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > Emily, While Jungle anti-parasite is good, sometimes it's just not > > enough. Additionally, you might want to consider feeding > Piperazine > > sulfate - 17% (by Agrilabs) or Pipfuge - 34% (by Butler) mixed into > a > > homemade paste food, if you can locate these meds. You would feed > > them the equivilent of 1% of their body weight of either of these > two > > meds for 3 > days. > > > \ > > Am glad to see you are at least familiar with Fenbendazole and > > Levimisole. While their are mortalities (especially with heavily > > infected fish), these treatments often result in cures in otherwise > > doomed fish. Panacur (fenbendazole) is to be used as a bath , > using > > 7.6 mg of the drug to the gallon once a week for 3 weeks. > Levamisole > > is really the drug of choice in treating nematodes, but as it is > not > > readily soluable in water you'll need to use it as Levimisole HCL > > (hydrochloride), called Levisol (7.5% concentration) or Tramisol. > > This is used as a one-time bath using 38 mg to the gallon (5 ppm) > for > > 24 hours after which you should do at least a 90% water change > > (preferably 100%). Needless to say, a good water change should be > > done before adding the drug, and any carbon should be removed from > > the filter(s); it should first be disolved in a small quantity of > > very warm (but not hot) water. Levisol is most effective in water > > with a pH of 7 or lower. While its usually not advised to mess > with > > your pH, for best results you may need to gradually lower your pH > in > > this case (if it is alkaline) before administering treatment, and > > then watch your pH when making the large water change afterwards. > > After treatment, you can then gradually return your pH to normal > > range for ease of maintenance (weekly water changes, etc.). You > may > > need to repeat the treatment after 1 month if you see any further > > signs of illness, but usually one treatment will do it. A trade > name > > for this drug is Levaside (TM); you may be able to get these meds > > from your vet and certainly at most farm outlets. Ray > > > \ > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Emily Tenczar <bababanana@y...> > > wrote: > > > > > > If it isn't one thing it's something else. My 20 gal tropical > tank > > has been having problems for months, and tonight it occured to me > > that the guppies are infected with some disgusting > > nematodes...Camallanus I think, or something similar. Although the > > danios don't seem to be affected, they are all in the same tank so > of > > course it's possible. I wonder if this has anything to do with the > > kinked spine and constant fin rot in danios? > > > > > > Anyway, I've been giving them the Jungle anti-parasite food for 2 > > weeks (3 days on, 4 days off); will this work and how long will it > > take to clear up? I read about fenbendazole and levamisole, and > also > > read that the fish sometimes die anyway after the treatments > because > > they have dead nemetodes rotting in the gut. > > > > > > If I could get some opinions about the best way to tackle this > > problem, that would be great! > > > Thanks > > > Emily > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, > thanks. > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > Marine biology Marine fish Biology > > > > --------------------------------- > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service. > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15769	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 10/30/2005
Subject: praziquantel?/ Nemotodes coming out of guppy anus - treatment?

I haven't been able to get any Levimisole yet (totally forgot to ask when I was at the vet), but I found some stuff at the pet store today that contains praziquantel. One of the products is called "UItra Cure PX" gel tek by Aquarium Products inc. and has AI: praziquantel 0.0057%, Flubenol 0.03% and Metronidazole 0.3%. I guess it's some kind of gel food?? It is labeled for nematodes. The other product is "PraziPro" by Hikari and contains AI of oxybispropanol and <5% praziquantel. It is used as a bath treatment. Have any of you used either of these? I picked some up anyway and can return it if I don't use it. Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15770	From: sevenspringss	Date: 10/30/2005
Subject: Re: praziquantel?/ Nemotodes coming out of guppy anus - treatment?

Haven't had any experience with either of those two products, but it sounds like they may be worth a try if you can't locate the Levisimole. With the gel food, it may turn out to be a good trick if you can get them to eat it, although lets hope they do. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Emily Tenczar <bababanana@y...> wrote: > > I haven't been able to get any Levimisole yet (totally forgot to ask when I was at the vet), but I found some stuff at the pet store today that contains praziquantel. > > One of the products is called "UItra Cure PX" gel tek by Aquarium Products inc. and has AI: praziquantel 0.0057%, Flubenol 0.03% and Metronidazole 0.3%. I guess it's some kind of gel food?? It is labeled for nematodes. > > The other product is "PraziPro" by Hikari and contains AI of oxybispropanol and <5% praziquantel. It is used as a bath treatment. > > Have any of you used either of these? I picked some up anyway and can return it if I don't use it. > Emily > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15771	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 10/30/2005
Subject: Re: praziquantel?/ Nemotodes coming out of guppy anus - treatment?

Emily, I have no idea about these things. Livasimol should be easy to get through a vet. It is mostly used as a de-wormer in cattle and any vet that deals with cattle should be able to help you. I have 1 Liter of this stuff but it may have expired by now. besides, I am in the UK. Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Emily Tenczar Sent: 31 October 2005 04:38 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] praziquantel?/ Nemotodes coming out of guppy anus - treatment? I haven't been able to get any Levimisole yet (totally forgot to ask when I was at the vet), but I found some stuff at the pet store today that contains praziquantel. One of the products is called "UItra Cure PX" gel tek by Aquarium Products inc. and has AI: praziquantel 0.0057%, Flubenol 0.03% and Metronidazole 0.3%. I guess it's some kind of gel food?? It is labeled for nematodes. The other product is "PraziPro" by Hikari and contains AI of oxybispropanol and <5% praziquantel. It is used as a bath treatment. Have any of you used either of these? I picked some up anyway and can return it if I don't use it. Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15772	From: Rev. Eric Roberts	Date: 10/31/2005
Subject: Re: Pleco

We had 2 plecos in a 55 gallon. They never really fought, but they would push each otyher around. When I got my 30 gallon, I put the smaller of the 2 in there and he is now flourishing. HE also had patches of lighter colored skin and occasionally I would see some redness on the edges of hos fins, but no other symptoms. He is otherwise healthy and is in a tank with other fiosh who are very healthy (2 gold marbles angels, some danios, a couple of clown loaches, and some feeder guppies as well as a small bulldog pleco) _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Cydne McCown Sent: Friday, October 28, 2005 11:11 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Pleco Well, how big is your tank and how big are your Plecos? Also, I have to tell you, I have never been able to keep two Plecos in the same tank, they fight something fierce, I don't know if anyone else in this group has had that trouble, but I have. Cydne linsparks22 <linsparks@...> wrote: Hello, My name is Linda and I am new to the group. Thank you for letting me join. I was wondering if someone might be able to help me. My husband bought 2 plecos about 2 weeks ago and about 2 days ago we noticed these brown patches on the top of both of there heads. They are small and black. My husband thought they were changing colors or something. I noticed tonight they are not eating, very active, and now I saw red streaks on the tip of one of there tails. I was wondering if anyone might know what it is. Is it cureable? Do we need to throw them out of the tank? We have other fish in the tank with them. Moors, Fantail Goldfish, Corydoras, Chinese algae eater. Will this harm the other fish? Please respond A.S.A.P if anyone can. Thank you, Linda Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine fish --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+fish&c=1&s=17&.si g=bxftFRZrGk2BgcINUOMEgQ> fish _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15773	From: shaenalee_02	Date: 11/1/2005
Subject: How many fish?

Hi ok I have been told three different veiws on this so someone plz let me know for sure, I was told you can have 1 fish per gallon is that accurate? Of course the bigger the fish would change that, I have about 30 fish in a 55 gallon tank and only four of them are on the bigger size the others are neons corydorras ect....Whats the rule?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15774	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 11/1/2005
Subject: Re: How many fish?

I have 13 fish in a 75 gal. It's semi-crowded to me. I can not imagine putting in 75 fish! Lol I'd say that's inaccurate. =) Good luck. L Have kids stuff? Check out Zainy Zebra Consignment! Based in Cabot, AR www.ZainyZebra.com Live in or near Cabot? Join the Cabot Garage Sale! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/CabotgarageSale/ Live in Little Rock? Little Rock Garage Sale!http://groups.yahoo.com/group/LRgarageSale/ -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of shaenalee_02 Sent: Tuesday, November 01, 2005 10:34 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] How many fish? Hi ok I have been told three different veiws on this so someone plz let me know for sure, I was told you can have 1 fish per gallon is that accurate? Of course the bigger the fish would change that, I have about 30 fish in a 55 gallon tank and only four of them are on the bigger size the others are neons corydorras ect....Whats the rule? Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15775	From: Justin M.	Date: 11/1/2005
Subject: Re: How many fish?

At 04:34 PM 01/11/2005 +0000, you wrote: >Hi ok I have been told three different veiws on this so someone plz >let me know for sure, I was told you can have 1 fish per gallon is >that accurate? Of course the bigger the fish would change that, I have >about 30 fish in a 55 gallon tank and only four of them are on the >bigger size the others are neons corydorras ect....Whats the rule? The wording of the rule you mentioned, I believe is supposed to be one inch of fish per gallon. This is somewhat valid, but varies greatly depending on the size of the fish involved. Ten neon tetras would probably be fine in a ten gallon tank, but obviously you can't keep a six-inch Oscar in a six gallon tank! :) I've heard the suggestion (and tend to agree with it) that the 1" per gallon rule should only apply to fish who's adult length does not exceed three inches, and obviously can't apply to large waste producers such as plecos or goldfish. An assortment of 30 tetras and corys would probably be okay in your 55, but what are the larger fish? One good way to tell would be to keep an eye on your nitrates. If you're having to change out more than 30% of your volume in a week in order to keep your nitrates below 20ppm, I'd say you're overstocked. Hope this helps! JM

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15776	From: Fred and Cynthia	Date: 11/1/2005
Subject: Re: How many fish?

One inch per gallon Cynthia http://babyitems.myphotoalbum.com/view_photo.php?set_albumName=album01&id=bag ----- Original Message ----- From: "shaenalee_02" <shaenalee_02@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, November 01, 2005 11:34 AM Subject: [AquaticLife] How many fish? Hi ok I have been told three different veiws on this so someone plz let me know for sure, I was told you can have 1 fish per gallon is that accurate? Of course the bigger the fish would change that, I have about 30 fish in a 55 gallon tank and only four of them are on the bigger size the others are neons corydorras ect....Whats the rule? Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15777	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 11/1/2005
Subject: Re: How many fish?

I was told that it's 1" of Adult Fish per Gallon (not by a certain large chain store who happily had me triple stock my 20-gallon tank when I first got into the hobby) But have since learned thanks to the lists here once you get the hang of things, (types of fish, where they swim, how big/deep the tank is, water monitering, Plants, etc), you can start to fudge that a little. Anime and Aquaria...who has the money for drugs?! ----- Original Message ----- From: "shaenalee_02" <shaenalee_02@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, November 01, 2005 8:34 AM Subject: [AquaticLife] How many fish? Hi ok I have been told three different veiws on this so someone plz let me know for sure, I was told you can have 1 fish per gallon is that accurate? Of course the bigger the fish would change that, I have about 30 fish in a 55 gallon tank and only four of them are on the bigger size the others are neons corydorras ect....Whats the rule? Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15778	From: harry perry	Date: 11/1/2005
Subject: Re: How many fish/1" per gal???.

In my experience the 1" per gal. is just a guideline. There is no set rule. You could have an all catfish tank and follow the 1" per gal. rule and have fish dieing all the time. 10 - 1" corys will produce much more waste than 10-1" cardnial tetras. Tanks are as different as the folks who set them up. Some things are known for sure. Live plants will help you balance the tank. A weekly 20% water change is needed. Don't feed the fish according to the instructions on the container. This is overfeeding and will lead to algae problems and a "fouled" tank. Fish can go for 2 weeks without food. Once a day or even every other day is fine.Over the years I have found nature will correct my mistakes. Overcrowding leads to a stressed immune system and then all kinds of dieases will show up. Ich is usually first.The guidline of 1" per gal. is for an adult fish. It is amazing to me what folks put into their tanks. The pleco you see everywhere reaches 14". The oscars at my local Walmart reach 13". Unless you can spend thousands of dollars on huge tanks to house a few fish I strongly suggest you research what this "adult fish" is really like. Fish keeping is common sense. I have never used an air stone in my tanks. Air stones don't add oxygen to the water. They create a surface agitation, this agitation intermixes the water and the air. I accomplish the same thing with my filters. I always overfilter because I know sooner or later I will overpopulate or put off water changes. A summary: 1 - research the fish. 2 - don't overfeed. 3 - do weekly water changes of at least 20%. 4 - use live plants if at all possible. 5 - overfilter your tank. In reality it won't be overfiltration. 6 - nature will help you adjust your overpopulation problem. 7 - have fun The Dragon Hunter <dragon.hunter@...> wrote: I was told that it's 1" of Adult Fish per Gallon (not by a certain large chain store who happily had me triple stock my 20-gallon tank when I first got into the hobby) But have since learned thanks to the lists here once you get the hang of things, (types of fish, where they swim, how big/deep the tank is, water monitering, Plants, etc), you can start to fudge that a little. Anime and Aquaria...who has the money for drugs?! ----- Original Message ----- From: "shaenalee_02" <shaenalee_02@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, November 01, 2005 8:34 AM Subject: [AquaticLife] How many fish? Hi ok I have been told three different veiws on this so someone plz let me know for sure, I was told you can have 1 fish per gallon is that accurate? Of course the bigger the fish would change that, I have about 30 fish in a 55 gallon tank and only four of them are on the bigger size the others are neons corydorras ect....Whats the rule? Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine fish --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15779	From: supamii	Date: 11/1/2005
Subject: Re: How many fish?

It feels like most everybody here simply regurgitates what they have read online. The popular 1 inch per gallon rule does keep you safe from overstocking I admit. Influenced by aquahobby.com, I have found that the 1 inch per gallon rule is indeed a myth. I am currently maintaining a 15 gallon tank which would probably have close to 17-18 inches of fish. Overstocked? Maybe, and maybe not. What makes most sense to me when figuring out how much fish to stock in a tank depends on more factors satisfying social/personality needs. You have to make sure your fishes are compatable and not aggressive, otherwise you must give the aggressive fish and others, enough space to get away from the commotion. 1 inch of neons is quite different from 1 inch of angels as far as waste goes anyway. I also have my tank stocked according to how and where my fish spend most of their time. For example, my pristella tetras are often found swimming around at the mid-section of my tank while my corydora catfishes spend all of their time scouring for food on the substrate. Thus, in a 10 gallon tank I would be comfortable with 8 tetras and 3-4 corydoras (here, tetras are 1 inch and cories are 2 inches; so 14-16 inches of fish!). In conclusion, there is no real rule to how many fish you can keep in your tank. If you have a lot of fish, just remember to change your water more often than if you had a very small amount of fish. g'luck. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "shaenalee_02" <shaenalee_02@y...> wrote: > > Hi ok I have been told three different veiws on this so someone plz > let me know for sure, I was told you can have 1 fish per gallon is > that accurate? Of course the bigger the fish would change that, I have > about 30 fish in a 55 gallon tank and only four of them are on the > bigger size the others are neons corydorras ect....Whats the rule? >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15780	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 11/1/2005
Subject: Re: How many fish?

There is no rule that will hold for all fish in all aquaria. Several years ago, maybe 10, Steve Meyer, writing in AFM presented a formula for goldfish that took into account the SL, girth and weight of the fish, along with a few other things to determine the MINIMUM amount of water needed for that fish. On the other hand, there is a famous experiment that raised a number of, I think, trout in a plastic tubing. The picture all remember after seeing it is that of a number of fish gills to tail in the pipe looking a lot like sardines in a can. The fact is that normally we all keep more fish in a tank than we should, when comparing the amount of water per fish in an aquarium and compare it with the amount of water per fish in the wild. Given that the number of fish you may keep in a tank depends upon a number of factors, you need to be the judge. Keep an eye on your water quality (pH, ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, oxygen). When one of these starts to get out of line, you have crossed the line (and now have an excellent excuse to start a new tank <g>). If you wish to have a busy tank, get fish that are busy fish, like zebra danios, smaller characins (your neons), etc. If you would like a quiet peaceful tank, look to slower, stately even, fish like angels or many of the anabantoids. Don't forget that you will want fish that inhabit all the levels in the tank--the top dwellers, the mid-water fish, and the bottom fish (not necessarily catfish). Try to find a nice balance of fish, and you probably will not overload the tank, just by the aesthetics, but do keep an eye on the adult size of the fish--that cute, engaging little oscar the high school kid said won't get very big will grow to around 12" or more. In this case, it may help to think of another common name for this fish--peacock bass--does that give you a clue? If you are not sure of a fish--take a look at the literature, and check here--to find out more about the fish (I find that sometimes the fish were not paying attention in school, and did not read that particular assignment). Right now, without a fuller description of your fish, I'd say that you are at or over the limit for the size of tank that you have. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of shaenalee_02 Sent: Tuesday, November 01, 2005 11:34 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] How many fish? Hi ok I have been told three different veiws on this so someone plz let me know for sure, I was told you can have 1 fish per gallon is that accurate? Of course the bigger the fish would change that, I have about 30 fish in a 55 gallon tank and only four of them are on the bigger size the others are neons corydorras ect....Whats the rule?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15781	From: harry perry	Date: 11/1/2005
Subject: Re: How many fish/To Steve

As a moderator I can say I appreciate the help you have given this group. As a fisherman I can tell you you don't know what your talking about. The peacock bass and the oscar are two entirely different fish. There not built the same they don't even look similar. Where did you get this information?. Harry Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: There is no rule that will hold for all fish in all aquaria. Several years ago, maybe 10, Steve Meyer, writing in AFM presented a formula for goldfish that took into account the SL, girth and weight of the fish, along with a few other things to determine the MINIMUM amount of water needed for that fish. On the other hand, there is a famous experiment that raised a number of, I think, trout in a plastic tubing. The picture all remember after seeing it is that of a number of fish gills to tail in the pipe looking a lot like sardines in a can. The fact is that normally we all keep more fish in a tank than we should, when comparing the amount of water per fish in an aquarium and compare it with the amount of water per fish in the wild. Given that the number of fish you may keep in a tank depends upon a number of factors, you need to be the judge. Keep an eye on your water quality (pH, ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, oxygen). When one of these starts to get out of line, you have crossed the line (and now have an excellent excuse to start a new tank <g>). If you wish to have a busy tank, get fish that are busy fish, like zebra danios, smaller characins (your neons), etc. If you would like a quiet peaceful tank, look to slower, stately even, fish like angels or many of the anabantoids. Don't forget that you will want fish that inhabit all the levels in the tank--the top dwellers, the mid-water fish, and the bottom fish (not necessarily catfish). Try to find a nice balance of fish, and you probably will not overload the tank, just by the aesthetics, but do keep an eye on the adult size of the fish--that cute, engaging little oscar the high school kid said won't get very big will grow to around 12" or more. In this case, it may help to think of another common name for this fish--peacock bass--does that give you a clue? If you are not sure of a fish--take a look at the literature, and check here--to find out more about the fish (I find that sometimes the fish were not paying attention in school, and did not read that particular assignment). Right now, without a fuller description of your fish, I'd say that you are at or over the limit for the size of tank that you have. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of shaenalee_02 Sent: Tuesday, November 01, 2005 11:34 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] How many fish? Hi ok I have been told three different veiws on this so someone plz let me know for sure, I was told you can have 1 fish per gallon is that accurate? Of course the bigger the fish would change that, I have about 30 fish in a 55 gallon tank and only four of them are on the bigger size the others are neons corydorras ect....Whats the rule? Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine fish --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15782	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 11/1/2005
Subject: Re: How many fish/To Steve

I do stand corrected. I thought I had seen that name referencing the good ol' _Astronotus ocellatus_, but I seem to be mistaken, after doing a few quick look-ups in some commonly referenced books. I guess the old synapses don't quite work the way they used to <g>. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of harry perry Sent: Tuesday, November 01, 2005 6:50 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] How many fish/To Steve As a moderator I can say I appreciate the help you have given this group. As a fisherman I can tell you you don't know what your talking about. The peacock bass and the oscar are two entirely different fish. There not built the same they don't even look similar. Where did you get this information?. Harry Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: There is no rule that will hold for all fish in all aquaria. Several years ago, maybe 10, Steve Meyer, writing in AFM presented a formula for goldfish that took into account the SL, girth and weight of the fish, along with a few other things to determine the MINIMUM amount of water needed for that fish. On the other hand, there is a famous experiment that raised a number of, I think, trout in a plastic tubing. The picture all remember after seeing it is that of a number of fish gills to tail in the pipe looking a lot like sardines in a can. The fact is that normally we all keep more fish in a tank than we should, when comparing the amount of water per fish in an aquarium and compare it with the amount of water per fish in the wild. Given that the number of fish you may keep in a tank depends upon a number of factors, you need to be the judge. Keep an eye on your water quality (pH, ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, oxygen). When one of these starts to get out of line, you have crossed the line (and now have an excellent excuse to start a new tank <g>). If you wish to have a busy tank, get fish that are busy fish, like zebra danios, smaller characins (your neons), etc. If you would like a quiet peaceful tank, look to slower, stately even, fish like angels or many of the anabantoids. Don't forget that you will want fish that inhabit all the levels in the tank--the top dwellers, the mid-water fish, and the bottom fish (not necessarily catfish). Try to find a nice balance of fish, and you probably will not overload the tank, just by the aesthetics, but do keep an eye on the adult size of the fish--that cute, engaging little oscar the high school kid said won't get very big will grow to around 12" or more. In this case, it may help to think of another common name for this fish--peacock bass--does that give you a clue? If you are not sure of a fish--take a look at the literature, and check here--to find out more about the fish (I find that sometimes the fish were not paying attention in school, and did not read that particular assignment). Right now, without a fuller description of your fish, I'd say that you are at or over the limit for the size of tank that you have. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of shaenalee_02 Sent: Tuesday, November 01, 2005 11:34 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] How many fish? Hi ok I have been told three different veiws on this so someone plz let me know for sure, I was told you can have 1 fish per gallon is that accurate? Of course the bigger the fish would change that, I have about 30 fish in a 55 gallon tank and only four of them are on the bigger size the others are neons corydorras ect....Whats the rule? Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine fish --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15783	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 11/1/2005
Subject: Re: How many fish?

what are all trhe types?? --- shaenalee_02 <shaenalee_02@...> wrote: > Hi ok I have been told three different veiws on this > so someone plz > let me know for sure, I was told you can have 1 fish > per gallon is > that accurate? Of course the bigger the fish would > change that, I have > about 30 fish in a 55 gallon tank and only four of > them are on the > bigger size the others are neons corydorras > ect....Whats the rule? > > > > __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15784	From: shaenalee_02	Date: 11/1/2005
Subject: Thank you

Hi thank you all for the info on How many fish? I appreciate it all very much, I do have two plako's in my 55 gallon but soon will be moving one to a 160 gallon, thanks again for all your help.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15785	From: dreammaker2623	Date: 11/1/2005
Subject: Re: How many fish?

The rule of thumb that I like to go by is the number of inches long that a fish is (not including the tail) time the number of inches tall the fish is (not including the fins) is the number of gallons that the fish needs. Just imagine ten one inch oscars in a ten gallon cycled tank, Now imagine one ten inch oscar in a ten gallon tank, somuch for one inch of fish per gallon of water.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15786	From: supamii	Date: 11/1/2005
Subject: Re: How many fish?

actually a few posts prior to your post have argued against simply measuring the size of a fish- its simply not accurate and most importantly it doesnt make sense. perhaps you should read them? --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "dreammaker2623" <dreammaker2623@y...> wrote: > > The rule of thumb that I like to go by is the number of inches long > that a fish is (not including the tail) time the number of inches tall > the fish is (not including the fins) is the number of gallons that the > fish needs. Just imagine ten one inch oscars in a ten gallon cycled > tank, Now imagine one ten inch oscar in a ten gallon tank, somuch for > one inch of fish per gallon of water. >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15787	From: paul helms	Date: 11/2/2005
Subject: Re: How many fish/To Steve

hey harry, not to start an argument, because i have not seen the whole thread but there is a color pattern of oscar called the peacock.....it is striped and spotted --- harry perry <harryfisherman@...> wrote: > As a moderator I can say I appreciate the help you > have given this group. As a fisherman I can tell you > you don't know what your talking about. The peacock > bass and the oscar are two entirely different fish. > There not built the same they don't even look > similar. Where did you get this information?. > > Harry > > Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > There is no rule that will hold for all fish in all > aquaria. Several years > ago, maybe 10, Steve Meyer, writing in AFM presented > a formula for goldfish > that took into account the SL, girth and weight of > the fish, along with a > few other things to determine the MINIMUM amount of > water needed for that > fish. On the other hand, there is a famous > experiment that raised a number > of, I think, trout in a plastic tubing. The picture > all remember after > seeing it is that of a number of fish gills to tail > in the pipe looking a > lot like sardines in a can. > > The fact is that normally we all keep more fish in a > tank than we should, > when comparing the amount of water per fish in an > aquarium and compare it > with the amount of water per fish in the wild. > > Given that the number of fish you may keep in a tank > depends upon a number > of factors, you need to be the judge. Keep an eye on > your water quality (pH, > ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, oxygen). When one of > these starts to get out of > line, you have crossed the line (and now have an > excellent excuse to start a > new tank <g>). > > If you wish to have a busy tank, get fish that are > busy fish, like zebra > danios, smaller characins (your neons), etc. If you > would like a quiet > peaceful tank, look to slower, stately even, fish > like angels or many of the > anabantoids. Don't forget that you will want fish > that inhabit all the > levels in the tank--the top dwellers, the mid-water > fish, and the bottom > fish (not necessarily catfish). Try to find a nice > balance of fish, and you > probably will not overload the tank, just by the > aesthetics, but do keep an > eye on the adult size of the fish--that cute, > engaging little oscar the high > school kid said won't get very big will grow to > around 12" or more. In this > case, it may help to think of another common name > for this fish--peacock > bass--does that give you a clue? > > If you are not sure of a fish--take a look at the > literature, and check > here--to find out more about the fish (I find that > sometimes the fish were > not paying attention in school, and did not read > that particular > assignment). > > Right now, without a fuller description of your > fish, I'd say that you are > at or over the limit for the size of tank that you > have. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of shaenalee_02 > Sent: Tuesday, November 01, 2005 11:34 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] How many fish? > > Hi ok I have been told three different veiws on this > so someone plz > let me know for sure, I was told you can have 1 fish > per gallon is > that accurate? Of course the bigger the fish would > change that, I have > about 30 fish in a 55 gallon tank and only four of > them are on the > bigger size the others are neons corydorras > ect....Whats the rule? > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when > replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the > TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine fish > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email > to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in > one click. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15788	From: paul helms	Date: 11/2/2005
Subject: Re: Fw: Re: [AquaticLife] anchor worms heeelp

they are a cold water fish parasite. usually affecting goldfish and gourami.nothing kills them. copper does not work but it is supposed to lol. --- Linda Sparks <linsparks@...> wrote: > I have never heard of anchor worms. Where do they > come from? Can any kind of freshwater fish get > them? > By the way I would like to say Hello Indiana! > That's my > HomeState. I now live in Kentucky. I was born in > Wells County, Bluffton, Indiana. > Linda > > -------Original Message------- > > From: FortWayneFish@... > Date: 10/29/05 11:29:04 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] anchor worms heeelp > > > > I know its hard but another reason to quarantine > Even Feeder fish... We > use > a 20 gallon bucket with Pond sponge filter,Usually > we can Qt the feeder > fish > for 2-3 weeks before graduating them into a Glass > tank,.We keep them in > the > glass tank for a couple days before we use them as > feeders.We have been > lucky so far.... > > Its really hard though when the wife thinks her > Oscars and Fahaka puffer > need extra fish and scoop them straight from the > Bucket. > She'll learn one of these days...... When her 3 year > old Oscars or 10" > Fahaka end up with something... > > Best of luck with the Leaf fish, Hope you have > eradicated all the Anchor > worms > > > Rob > NE Indiana > USA > > > In a message dated 10/29/2005 8:53:33 A.M. US > Eastern Standard Time, > andreas1120@... writes: > > I am faily certain that they got the worms from > some feeder goldfish I put > in there. I had a friend/ fish expert have a look > to. the split tail > sticking out of the fish was pretty much > unmistakeable. > I did notice that most anchor worm meds where > designed for ponds. my tank > is 90 gallon so it might still work out. right now > it looks like the worms > are gone from all but one fish, who I found nearly > dying this morning. i > took him out and did some emergency surgery. i > doubt he will survive, but > hope springs eternal. the other leaf fish seem > fine, and the pike characins > seem totally unaffected. > andreas > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when > replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > > > > SPONSORED LINKS Marine fish > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! > Terms of Service. > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - Make it your home page! http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15789	From: paul helms	Date: 11/2/2005
Subject: Re: questiona bout frogs in tanks

they will be fine, but they will exit anything withouta lid --- agentscullyeyore@... wrote: > ok i have 7 of the african dwarf frogs myself my > friends wants some but in > wondering if they can survive in a non filtered tank > with bettas.. or do they > need to be in a heated and filtered tank.. does > anyone know.. thanks shannon > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - Make it your home page! http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15790	From: paul helms	Date: 11/2/2005
Subject: Re: anchor worms heeelp

turn up the heat they cant handle it --- Andreas <andreas1120@...> wrote: > I am faily certain that they got the worms from some > feeder goldfish I put > in there. I had a friend/ fish expert have a look > to. the split tail > sticking out of the fish was pretty much > unmistakeable. > I did notice that most anchor worm meds where > designed for ponds. my tank > is 90 gallon so it might still work out. right now > it looks like the worms > are gone from all but one fish, who I found nearly > dying this morning. i > took him out and did some emergency surgery. i doubt > he will survive, but > hope springs eternal. the other leaf fish seem fine, > and the pike characins > seem totally unaffected. > andreas > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - Make it your home page! http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15791	From: paul helms	Date: 11/2/2005
Subject: Re: anchor worms heeelp

while the anchor worms are somewhat hard on the outside make sure you do not squeeze when pulling out, if any part of themis left in the fish they will regenrate. --- Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: > Are you sure that what you are seeing is anchor > worm? I've only heard anchor > worm discussed as a parasite in pond fish, usually a > cyprinid such as > goldfish and koi. That does not rule out that it may > be found on other fish > as well. Treatment is generally with Dimilin. This > substance is pretty > potent, so make sure you can get it in a dilution > that is suitable for > aquarium use. Normal dosage is 1 g per 1000 water. > > You can also do as you suggest, and use tweezers to > actually remove the > parasite from the fish. Doing this will make the > fish more susceptible to > bacterial infection, so it may be wise to pan a > course of treatment with a > general bactericide as a prophylactic. > > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Andreas > Sent: Friday, October 28, 2005 2:13 PM > To: UniQuaria@yahoogroups.com; > AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com; > freshwateraquariums@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] anchor worms heeelp > > Hello all > My SA leaf fish have caught anchor worms, > presumably from their feeder > fish. I have been treating with Clout for about 4 > days now with no visible > improvement. I have heard suggested I take the fish > out and pick the anchor > worms off with tweezers. is this safe? any other > ideas for meds or methods. > Andreas > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when > replying, thanks. > 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> > 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , > .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > __________________________________ Yahoo! FareChase: Search multiple travel sites in one click. http://farechase.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15792	From: Rev. Eric Roberts	Date: 11/2/2005
Subject: Re: How many fish?

I have 15 plus a few feeder guppies in my 55, about 10 in my 30 (most are feeder guppies, a bulldog pleco, and danios the only larger fish are the 2 angels, and a common pleco) and about 15 in my 20 gallon (6 danios, a bunch of feeder guppies, and a dwarf bristlenose pleco). Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Leslie & Dane Moore Sent: Tuesday, November 01, 2005 11:11 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] How many fish? I have 13 fish in a 75 gal. It's semi-crowded to me. I can not imagine putting in 75 fish! Lol I'd say that's inaccurate. =) Good luck. L Have kids stuff? Check out Zainy Zebra Consignment! Based in Cabot, AR www.ZainyZebra.com Live in or near Cabot? Join the Cabot Garage Sale! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/CabotgarageSale/ Live in Little Rock? Little Rock Garage Sale!http://groups.yahoo.com/group/LRgarageSale/ -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of shaenalee_02 Sent: Tuesday, November 01, 2005 10:34 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] How many fish? Hi ok I have been told three different veiws on this so someone plz let me know for sure, I was told you can have 1 fish per gallon is that accurate? Of course the bigger the fish would change that, I have about 30 fish in a 55 gallon tank and only four of them are on the bigger size the others are neons corydorras ect....Whats the rule? Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+fish&c=1&s=17&.si g=bxftFRZrGk2BgcINUOMEgQ> fish _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15793	From: Patrick	Date: 11/2/2005
Subject: Re: How many fish/1" per gal???.

My opinion of how many fish is...I don't know. It is impossible to tell how many hypothetical fish will go in a hypothetical tank. You have to judge for yourself. If it looks crowded, it probably is. If it looks too sparse, that won't hurt anything, but it probably is. It's up to you. Want a longer answer? :) There was once a 3-inch per gallon rule, but that was a little extreme. There are some who say 10 gallons per inch, but that is a little extreme. In theory, a 10 gallon tank could hold 10 neon tetras with no trouble. A 5 gallon tank could hold 5 neon tetras. Below 5 gallons and the best you could do is 1 betta or maybe some white clouds. A 20 gallon should be ok with 30 neon tetras. A 50 gallon tank should be ok with 100 neon tetras. A 100 gallon tank should be ok with 300 neon tetras. This is not just because of the amount of water, but the length of the tank. Bigger tanks have more surface area. Some big tanks have less surface area than slightly smaller ones, so this might not be completely accurate. I've heard of exact calculations based on all kinds of factors, and I think they are just people trying to feel good about their know-it-all-ness. The question really is how stable the tank is. I think a tank should be 10 inches long for each inch of the maximum length of the fish in the tank with the longest possible length in captivity. A neon tetra is 1 inch long, so a 10 inch tank would be ok. A common pleco would need about a 180 inch tank. A goldfish would need a 240 inch tank. That is just to make sure the fish can get up to their maximum speed for 10 times their body length. But none of that covers how many fish for a tank. Patrick

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15794	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 11/2/2005
Subject: Thought just came to me

How would yall recommend moving a full grown pleco. I've been told to just pick them up, but not an option when they do not want to be picked up. Nets would get tangled on their "spikes?" as I found out the last time I moved them and don't want to hurt them if I have to do it again. Thanks in advance! -Steve

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15795	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 11/2/2005
Subject: Re: Thought just came to me

I'll give 4 suggestions :-) (1)I've used a clean hand towel on the bottom of the tank , then had someone chase the plec over top of it and then gently lifted him out. (2)I've also used a favorite decoration wait until they are in side, then lift decoration and fish out. When it comes to larger fish its hard. If he's Really (3)big hook and line..... (4)Maybe just net him out and then carefully remove the net from him once he's out of water, release him back by hand.( make sure your hands are wet before handling any fish ). Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 11/2/2005 12:30:20 P.M. US Eastern Standard Time, dragon.hunter@... writes: How would yall recommend moving a full grown pleco. I've been told to just pick them up, but not an option when they do not want to be picked up. Nets would get tangled on their "spikes?" as I found out the last time I moved them and don't want to hurt them if I have to do it again. Thanks in advance! -Steve Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15796	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 11/2/2005
Subject: Female Betta FAT w/ eggs

She looks like she is about to blow up. Do I need to put her in with a male or will this take care of itself? She is hu---ge. Help please. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15797	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 11/2/2005
Subject: Re: Thought just came to me

many thanks. will file this one in my printed folder. (the computer will not eat this one, the gouramis might, the the computer won't!) -Steve ----- Original Message ----- From: <FortWayneFish@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wednesday, November 02, 2005 9:36 AM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Thought just came to me I'll give 4 suggestions :-) (1)I've used a clean hand towel on the bottom of the tank , then had someone chase the plec over top of it and then gently lifted him out. (2)I've also used a favorite decoration wait until they are in side, then lift decoration and fish out. When it comes to larger fish its hard. If he's Really (3)big hook and line..... (4)Maybe just net him out and then carefully remove the net from him once he's out of water, release him back by hand.( make sure your hands are wet before handling any fish ). Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 11/2/2005 12:30:20 P.M. US Eastern Standard Time, dragon.hunter@... writes: How would yall recommend moving a full grown pleco. I've been told to just pick them up, but not an option when they do not want to be picked up. Nets would get tangled on their "spikes?" as I found out the last time I moved them and don't want to hurt them if I have to do it again. Thanks in advance! -Steve Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15798	From: agentscullyeyore@aol.com	Date: 11/2/2005
Subject: Re: questiona bout frogs in tanks

oh wow that is great i guess might give her some then i shold prolly have the transition between room temp water and tank water be longer than shorter huh????? shannon they will be fine, but they will exit anything withouta lid --- agentscullyeyore@... wrote: > ok i have 7 of the african dwarf frogs myself my > friends wants some but in > wondering if they can survive in a non filtered tank > with bettas.. or do they > need to be in a heated and filtered tank.. does > anyone know.. thanks shannon > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15799	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 11/2/2005
Subject: Re: Thought just came to me

how big is the tank?? maybe i missed that... if its big enough use a bucket and gently coax him in there... thats what ive done several times... The Dragon Hunter <dragon.hunter@...> wrote:many thanks. will file this one in my printed folder. (the computer will not eat this one, the gouramis might, the the computer won't!) -Steve ----- Original Message ----- From: <FortWayneFish@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wednesday, November 02, 2005 9:36 AM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Thought just came to me I'll give 4 suggestions :-) (1)I've used a clean hand towel on the bottom of the tank , then had someone chase the plec over top of it and then gently lifted him out. (2)I've also used a favorite decoration wait until they are in side, then lift decoration and fish out. When it comes to larger fish its hard. If he's Really (3)big hook and line..... (4)Maybe just net him out and then carefully remove the net from him once he's out of water, release him back by hand.( make sure your hands are wet before handling any fish ). Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 11/2/2005 12:30:20 P.M. US Eastern Standard Time, dragon.hunter@... writes: How would yall recommend moving a full grown pleco. I've been told to just pick them up, but not an option when they do not want to be picked up. Nets would get tangled on their "spikes?" as I found out the last time I moved them and don't want to hurt them if I have to do it again. Thanks in advance! -Steve Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine fish --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15800	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 11/2/2005
Subject: Re: Thought just came to me

A full grown common Pleco? Not by hand if it were me. Mine were all sharp scaled, LONG spined and they thrash a lot. I think someone else mentioned getting them into a container and then picking it up. I used a net recently to move three of them and as where it did work I had to carefully removed the net from spines and sharp scales. Mike -----Original Message----- From: The Dragon Hunter <dragon.hunter@...> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wed, 2 Nov 2005 09:27:29 -0800 Subject: [AquaticLife] Thought just came to me How would yall recommend moving a full grown pleco. I've been told to just pick them up, but not an option when they do not want to be picked up. Nets would get tangled on their "spikes?" as I found out the last time I moved them and don't want to hurt them if I have to do it again. Thanks in advance! -Steve [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15801	From: Andrea	Date: 11/2/2005
Subject: Re: Female Betta FAT w/ eggs

I wouldn't put her in with a male unless you are ready to raise and look after a spawn of babies! I have all kinds of females that look like that (swimming balloons :) ) Sometimes they just stay that way with no harm done and others will actually drop their eggs (little white eggs on the tank bottom). Again - no harm done. Raising bettas is an awful lot of work for what you get out of it. Crazy me is in the process of starting another spawn right now :) Andrea & way too many bettas --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie & Dane Moore" <5moores@c...> wrote: > > She looks like she is about to blow up.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15802	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 11/2/2005
Subject: Re: Thought just came to me

In a message dated 11/2/2005 6:34:41 PM Eastern Standard Time, Deenerz@... writes: <<<A full grown common Pleco?>>> I've used a bucket, Cool Whip container and large net. It's easiest if you drain the water down some so they can't swim over the bucket and get them into a corner. A favorite ornament works too as someone else suggested. Good luck! Vicky Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Contact mosherd@... or (301-451-9390) =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: FCR-Cancer-Support@yahoogroups.com Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@... 919-513-1467, Dr London @ calondon@... 530-754-5711 _AND_ Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15803	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 11/2/2005
Subject: Re: Thought just came to me

What about making a 3 sided box out of plastic canvas or something of that nature to catch them in and then use the net to just herd them into the box? MM & MP, '73 Tricia, KG6PNC A couple of great sites for fun http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya ----- Original Message ----- From: The Dragon Hunter To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, November 02, 2005 9:27 AM Subject: [AquaticLife] Thought just came to me How would yall recommend moving a full grown pleco. I've been told to just pick them up, but not an option when they do not want to be picked up. Nets would get tangled on their "spikes?" as I found out the last time I moved them and don't want to hurt them if I have to do it again. Thanks in advance! -Steve Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15804	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 11/3/2005
Subject: Brown growth on filters

My filters have a brown/reddish film growing on each part that water runs over. My last filter didn't get this. The stuff is also mildly on the walls and the heater. Algae? Harmful? Water conditions are all great. PWC done about every 10-15 days of 25-40%. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15805	From: Rev. Eric Roberts	Date: 11/3/2005
Subject: Re: Thought just came to me

I use one of the larger nets and haven’t had a problem. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of The Dragon Hunter Sent: Wednesday, November 02, 2005 11:27 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Thought just came to me How would yall recommend moving a full grown pleco. I've been told to just pick them up, but not an option when they do not want to be picked up. Nets would get tangled on their "spikes?" as I found out the last time I moved them and don't want to hurt them if I have to do it again. Thanks in advance! -Steve Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15806	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 11/4/2005
Subject: Re: Brown growth on filters

Algae, most likely. You should be able to wipe it off the external surfaces with little or no problem. For the filter tube(s) and hose(s), you can use a flexible long handled bottle brush or the like. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Leslie & Dane Moore Sent: Thursday, November 03, 2005 10:17 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com; uniquaria@yahoogroups.com; naturalaquariumenthusiast@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Brown growth on filters My filters have a brown/reddish film growing on each part that water runs over. My last filter didn't get this. The stuff is also mildly on the walls and the heater. Algae? Harmful? Water conditions are all great. PWC done about every 10-15 days of 25-40%.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15807	From: paul helms	Date: 11/5/2005
Subject: Re: Brown growth on filters

if it is slat water that sounds like cyano bacteria --- Leslie & Dane Moore <5moores@...> wrote: > My filters have a brown/reddish film growing on each > part that water > runs over. My last filter didn't get this. The > stuff is also mildly on > the walls and the heater. Algae? Harmful? > > Water conditions are all great. PWC done about > every 10-15 days of > 25-40%. > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15808	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 11/5/2005
Subject: Re: Brown growth on filters

It's fresh water. I forget to specify that. ;) -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of paul helms Sent: Saturday, November 05, 2005 3:37 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Brown growth on filters if it is slat water that sounds like cyano bacteria --- Leslie & Dane Moore <5moores@...> wrote: > My filters have a brown/reddish film growing on each > part that water > runs over. My last filter didn't get this. The > stuff is also mildly on > the walls and the heater. Algae? Harmful? > > Water conditions are all great. PWC done about > every 10-15 days of > 25-40%. > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 http://mail.yahoo.com Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15809	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 11/6/2005
Subject: New poll for AquaticLife

Enter your vote today! A new poll has been created for the AquaticLife group: How many aquariums do you have running? o One o 2 o 3 o 4 o 5 o 6 to 10 o 11 to 15 o 16 to 20 o 21 to 25 o More than 26 To vote, please visit the following web page: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/surveys?id=1825763 Note: Please do not reply to this message. Poll votes are not collected via email. To vote, you must go to the Yahoo! Groups web site listed above. Thanks!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15810	From: aclaar877	Date: 11/7/2005
Subject: Free Aquarium Plants -- St. Louis

I have several aquarium plants to give away after thinning out my tanks over the weekend. If you're in the St. Louis area, feel free to contact me for some free plants. Here's what I have: Italian Vals (grow as tall as your tank) Narrow Leaf Ludwigia Ammania Gracillis (nice red plant) Cabomba Hygrophilia (tropic sunset) Aponogeton (huge, 36" tall, many many leaves) Egeria Najas Rotala Indica In a week or two I'll have some baby Red Ozelot Swords. The plant just sent out a runner. I'm located downtown, phone 314-420-6603. Andy

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15811	From: Justin M.	Date: 11/7/2005
Subject: corydoras spawning!

Much to my surprise, my bronze corydoras have begun spawning today! I only have two, so I guess it's just luck that there's a pair of them. The female (well now I know she's a female) had quite a swollen belly for a few days, and the male had been chasing her around for a while. I didn't put two and two together until I saw her holding clutches of eggs between her ventral fins this morning. She's laid eggs on the walls of the tank, and on the underside of a fake plant leaf. I can't tell if the male has fertilized them. My fiance and I will have to decide how to proceed; assuming the eggs get fertilized and actually hatch (and I know that could be a big if), we may elect to try and raise them to adulthood. Or we may just let nature take it's course within the tank. So I have a few questions for the list. Have any listers successfully bred cory cats? The eggs are currently in a 10 gallon tank with the parents, two Three Line corys, and three Dwarf Otos. Will any of these eat the eggs? Is there a way to tell if the eggs have been fertilized, besides waiting to see if they hatch? Will there be any health concerns for the female after this? I hope these don't seem too silly; this has taken me very much by surprise, and I admit to being pretty excited! I'm gonna be a grandpa! *grin* JM

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15812	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 11/7/2005
Subject: Received 2 Kissing Gouramis

I received these from a lady that is moving out of her home and doesn't want to take the fish along. Her tank was filthy! The water was so brown that I could barely tell there were fish in it. She had several misc. filters hanging on the sides, no lid, no light, no heater. ("I'm supposed to have a heater?") Anyway, the gouramis are wonderful and have already eaten all that brown algae off of the rocks. Yay! From what I have read, it seems that they will work well with the blood parrots and the rest of the crew. They are larger than what size you purchase at the store so my other fish should leave them alone as far ast trying them out for a food source. What luck! =) AND I got a fat, albino catfishy looking guy as well. He is small and almost rounded in the belly. Has small whisker things around the nose and just hangs out at the bottom. He's in my 10 gal. What is he? Just thought I'd share. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15813	From: Justin M.	Date: 11/7/2005
Subject: Re: Received 2 Kissing Gouramis

At 03:51 PM 07/11/2005 -0600, you wrote: >AND I got a fat, albino catfishy looking guy as well. He is small and >almost rounded in the belly. Has small whisker things around the nose >and just hangs out at the bottom. He's in my 10 gal. What is he? Probably an albino corydoras. Fairly common in the hobby, undemanding and easy to keep. They are the albino variety of the bronze corydoras. Here's a link: http://www.thetropicaltank.co.uk/Fishindx/cory-aen.htm The second photo is the albino cory. Hope this helps! JM

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15814	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 11/7/2005
Subject: Re: Received 2 Kissing Gouramis

oooh you're so lucky, i'd love to have a kissing gourami but none of my fw tanks are large enough. the albino could it be an albino cory cat? http://www.liveaquaria.com/product/prod_Display.cfm?pCatId=953 -valeen --- Leslie & Dane Moore <5moores@...> wrote: > I received these from a lady that is moving out of > her home and doesn't > want to take the fish along. Her tank was filthy! > The water was so > brown that I could barely tell there were fish in > it. She had several > misc. filters hanging on the sides, no lid, no > light, no heater. ("I'm > supposed to have a heater?") > Anyway, the gouramis are wonderful and have already > eaten all that brown > algae off of the rocks. Yay! From what I have > read, it seems that they > will work well with the blood parrots and the rest > of the crew. They > are larger than what size you purchase at the store > so my other fish > should leave them alone as far ast trying them out > for a food source. > What luck! =) > > AND I got a fat, albino catfishy looking guy as > well. He is small and > almost rounded in the belly. Has small whisker > things around the nose > and just hangs out at the bottom. He's in my 10 > gal. What is he? > > Just thought I'd share. > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez valeendgonzalez@...

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15815	From: EDITHAN1@AOL.COM	Date: 11/7/2005
Subject: Re: Free Aquarium Plants -- St. Louis

Yes, I would love to get some of these. I am in Pacific, but work in Fenton. I will call tomorrow. Thanks edith my cell: 314-496-0379 -----Original Message----- From: aclaar877 <aclaar877@...> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Mon, 07 Nov 2005 15:48:47 -0000 Subject: [AquaticLife] Free Aquarium Plants -- St. Louis I have several aquarium plants to give away after thinning out my tanks over the weekend. If you're in the St. Louis area, feel free to contact me for some free plants. Here's what I have: Italian Vals (grow as tall as your tank) Narrow Leaf Ludwigia Ammania Gracillis (nice red plant) Cabomba Hygrophilia (tropic sunset) Aponogeton (huge, 36" tall, many many leaves) Egeria Najas Rotala Indica In a week or two I'll have some baby Red Ozelot Swords. The plant just sent out a runner. I'm located downtown, phone 314-420-6603. Andy Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15816	From: paul helms	Date: 11/7/2005
Subject: Re: corydoras spawning!

the female will hang to protect the eggs, but he ottos will eat them as they are cleaning. if you can do it easily remove any shrimp or algae eaters as they will eatthem.. i have bred albinos, greens and peppered --- "Justin M." <warbyrd@...> wrote: > Much to my surprise, my bronze corydoras have > begun spawning today! I > only have two, so I guess it's just luck that > there's a pair of them. The > female (well now I know she's a female) had quite a > swollen belly for a few > days, and the male had been chasing her around for a > while. I didn't put > two and two together until I saw her holding > clutches of eggs between her > ventral fins this morning. She's laid eggs on the > walls of the tank, and on > the underside of a fake plant leaf. I can't tell if > the male has fertilized > them. My fiance and I will have to decide how to > proceed; assuming the eggs > get fertilized and actually hatch (and I know that > could be a big if), we > may elect to try and raise them to adulthood. Or we > may just let nature > take it's course within the tank. So I have a few > questions for the list. > > Have any listers successfully bred cory cats? > > The eggs are currently in a 10 gallon tank with the > parents, two Three > Line corys, and three Dwarf Otos. Will any of these > eat the eggs? > > Is there a way to tell if the eggs have been > fertilized, besides waiting > to see if they hatch? > > Will there be any health concerns for the female > after this? > > I hope these don't seem too silly; this has taken > me very much by > surprise, and I admit to being pretty excited! I'm > gonna be a grandpa! *grin* > > JM > > > __________________________________ Yahoo! FareChase: Search multiple travel sites in one click. http://farechase.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15817	From: paul helms	Date: 11/7/2005
Subject: Re: anchor worms heeelp

that is your only option..nothing i have tried has killed the anchor worms. occasionally we get fantails that are infected. when this happens we restart the tank with new gravel and new water and do a cycle. they ones in the fish are the mail worms...the females are in the gravel --- Andreas <andreas1120@...> wrote: > Hello all > My SA leaf fish have caught anchor worms, > presumably from their feeder > fish. I have been treating with Clout for about 4 > days now with no visible > improvement. I have heard suggested I take the fish > out and pick the anchor > worms off with tweezers. is this safe? any other > ideas for meds or methods. > Andreas > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15818	From: Andreas	Date: 11/7/2005
Subject: Re: anchor worms heeelp

well the worms seem to be gone now, there are pike characins in the tank and they seem fine. maybe they are less suscpetible. andreas On 11/7/05, paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: > > that is your only option..nothing i have tried has > killed the anchor worms. occasionally we get fantails > that are infected. when this happens we restart the > tank with new gravel and new water and do a cycle. > they ones in the fish are the mail worms...the females > are in the gravel > > > --- Andreas <andreas1120@...> wrote: > > > Hello all > > My SA leaf fish have caught anchor worms, > > presumably from their feeder > > fish. I have been treating with Clout for about 4 > > days now with no visible > > improvement. I have heard suggested I take the fish > > out and pick the anchor > > worms off with tweezers. is this safe? any other > > ideas for meds or methods. > > Andreas > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > 毀畔�虜.><((((�gt;.毀畔�虜.毀畔��gt;<((((�gt; �毀畔�� , .毀畔�.><((((�gt; > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <�(((><.毀畔�虜.毀畔��lt;�(((><�毀畔�� , .毀畔�.<�(((><毀畔�虜. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > ------------------------------ > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > - Visit your group "AquaticLife<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife>" > on the web. > - To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com<AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > - Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>. > > > ------------------------------ > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15819	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 11/7/2005
Subject: Re: corydoras spawning!

JM remove the fake plant with eggs on it . Take your finger and roll the eggs off the plant leaf into a small bowl with tank water in it.( butter dish, specimen cup) anything that will float and will hold your eggs. Float this container in your aquarium, if possible do small partial waterchanges on the conatainer every day in 3 -5 days take a look inside your container. Look close as the babies are small.. if the container is see through Hold it up and look at it from underneath. Everything in your tank will eat the eggs including Mom and Pop.. so it would be best to remove a few of them. microworms, BBS, finely fine ground flakes can be fed after 2 days of hatching as there eggs sacks will have probally been used up by then. I've spawned a couple cory cats( 5 species ) the trick is to get them to live once you get the eggs... Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 11/7/2005 10:09:16 PM US Eastern Standard Time, My fiance and I will have to decide how to > proceed; assuming the eggs > get fertilized and actually hatch (and I know that > could be a big if), we > may elect to try and raise them to adulthood. Or we > may just let nature > take it's course within the tank. So I have a few > questions for the list. > > Have any listers successfully bred cory cats? > > The eggs are currently in a 10 gallon tank with the > parents, two Three > Line corys, and three Dwarf Otos. Will any of these > eat the eggs? > > Is there a way to tell if the eggs have been > fertilized, besides waiting > to see if they hatch? > > Will there be any health concerns for the female > after this? > > I hope these don't seem too silly; this has taken > me very much by > surprise, and I admit to being pretty excited! I'm > gonna be a grandpa! *grin* > > JM > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15820	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 11/8/2005
Subject: Re: Received 2 Kissing Gouramis

That's what it is, albino cory cat. =) This article says they like to be in groups. Should I get him/her a playmate? (the lady I got him from said it's called an algae eater.) I had no idea that these kg's needed so much room. They are around 4" right now. She had them in a 35 but like I said, you couldn't see them. She also had several gold fish that a friend of hers was taking along with the tank. She offered me the tank, no thanks! Lol Well I'm excited. I'm pretty amazed at what a good match they are for my tank. Thanks for the help on the cory cat. Should I let him be or add another? He's in a 10gal with a firemouth, baby blood parrot (temporary resident of course), 2 cherry barbs (hate them), and a small whitish fish that you can see through. ~Leslie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez Sent: Monday, November 07, 2005 4:01 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Received 2 Kissing Gouramis oooh you're so lucky, i'd love to have a kissing gourami but none of my fw tanks are large enough. the albino could it be an albino cory cat? http://www.liveaquaria.com/product/prod_Display.cfm?pCatId=953 -valeen --- Leslie & Dane Moore <5moores@...> wrote: > I received these from a lady that is moving out of > her home and doesn't > want to take the fish along. Her tank was filthy! > The water was so > brown that I could barely tell there were fish in > it. She had several > misc. filters hanging on the sides, no lid, no > light, no heater. ("I'm > supposed to have a heater?") > Anyway, the gouramis are wonderful and have already > eaten all that brown > algae off of the rocks. Yay! From what I have > read, it seems that they > will work well with the blood parrots and the rest > of the crew. They > are larger than what size you purchase at the store > so my other fish > should leave them alone as far ast trying them out > for a food source. > What luck! =) > > AND I got a fat, albino catfishy looking guy as > well. He is small and > almost rounded in the belly. Has small whisker > things around the nose > and just hangs out at the bottom. He's in my 10 > gal. What is he? > > Just thought I'd share. > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez valeendgonzalez@... Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15821	From: Justin M.	Date: 11/8/2005
Subject: new albino cory (was: RE: [AquaticLife] Received 2 Kissing Gouramis)

At 07:45 AM 08/11/2005 -0600, you wrote: >That's what it is, albino cory cat. =) This article says they like to >be in groups. Should I get him/her a playmate? (the lady I got him >from said it's called an algae eater.) Cory cats are shoaling fish, and you'll really see their behaviour and personality come through if you have a group of them. But it also sounds like your tank is full, I don't think you have room for more fish in there. He'll be okay on his own. And cory cats are not really algae eaters, they don't have the sucker mouth that plecos or otocinclus have. They prefer a more carnivorous diet anyways. Mine love frozen meaty foods, and also like sinking wafers. Good luck! JM

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15822	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 11/8/2005
Subject: where to buy Levimisole HCL online?

I was wondering if any of you have bought this product online? I've found a number of websites that sell it, but there are a number of different products and formulations. I've read that it's easiest to use in injectible form but so far I've only found it available in large expensive quantities. Just wondering if any of you have a favorite online store that you use. I'm in MN USA by the way Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15823	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 11/8/2005
Subject: multivitamin freshwater supplement?

I'm looking for a vitamin supplement that contains vitamin C that I can add once or twice a week to a freshwater aquarium. I know there are several products out there; is there a certain product or brand that you'd recommend? Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15824	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 11/8/2005
Subject: Re: Received 2 Kissing Gouramis

yeah i would definitely get more than 1 cory. i think groups of 3 are good if i remember correctly. kissing gouramis are really cool fish. let us know how it's going with them and the cory. -valeen --- Leslie & Dane Moore <5moores@...> wrote: > That's what it is, albino cory cat. =) This article > says they like to > be in groups. Should I get him/her a playmate? > (the lady I got him > from said it's called an algae eater.) > > I had no idea that these kg's needed so much room. > They are around 4" > right now. She had them in a 35 but like I said, > you couldn't see them. > She also had several gold fish that a friend of hers > was taking along > with the tank. She offered me the tank, no thanks! > Lol > > Well I'm excited. I'm pretty amazed at what a good > match they are for > my tank. > Thanks for the help on the cory cat. Should I let > him be or add > another? He's in a 10gal with a firemouth, baby > blood parrot (temporary > resident of course), 2 cherry barbs (hate them), and > a small whitish > fish that you can see through. > > ~Leslie > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Valeen Gonzalez > Sent: Monday, November 07, 2005 4:01 PM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Received 2 Kissing > Gouramis > > > oooh you're so lucky, i'd love to have a kissing > gourami but none of my fw tanks are large enough. > > the albino could it be an albino cory cat? > http://www.liveaquaria.com/product/prod_Display.cfm?pCatId=953 > > -valeen > > --- Leslie & Dane Moore <5moores@...> > wrote: > > > I received these from a lady that is moving out of > > her home and doesn't > > want to take the fish along. Her tank was filthy! > > The water was so > > brown that I could barely tell there were fish in > > it. She had several > > misc. filters hanging on the sides, no lid, no > > light, no heater. ("I'm > > supposed to have a heater?") > > Anyway, the gouramis are wonderful and have > already > > eaten all that brown > > algae off of the rocks. Yay! From what I have > > read, it seems that they > > will work well with the blood parrots and the rest > > of the crew. They > > are larger than what size you purchase at the > store > > so my other fish > > should leave them alone as far ast trying them out > > for a food source. > > What luck! =) > > > > AND I got a fat, albino catfishy looking guy as > > well. He is small and > > almost rounded in the belly. Has small whisker > > things around the nose > > and just hangs out at the bottom. He's in my 10 > > gal. What is he? > > > > Just thought I'd share. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > valeendgonzalez@... > > > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when > replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important > to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez valeendgonzalez@...

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15825	From: supamii	Date: 11/8/2005
Subject: Re: multivitamin freshwater supplement?

http://www.petsolutions.com/Garlic+Guard-I-10101760-I-.aspx Despite being slightly more costly in price for their freshwater products, I've only heard good things about seachem products. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Emily Tenczar <bababanana@y...> wrote: > > I'm looking for a vitamin supplement that contains vitamin C that I can add once or twice a week to a freshwater aquarium. I know there are several products out there; is there a certain product or brand that you'd recommend? > Emily > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15826	From: paul helms	Date: 11/10/2005
Subject: Re: Pleco

your answer is more than likely the chinese algae eater....they have voracious appetite and do become aggressive towards other fish at small sizes and towards all fish at larger sizes. he is probably biting the crap out of the plecos. --- linsparks22 <linsparks@...> wrote: > Hello, > My name is Linda and I am new to the group. > Thank you for letting me join. I was wondering > if someone might be able to help me. My husband > bought 2 plecos about 2 weeks ago and about 2 days > ago we noticed these brown patches on the top of > both of there heads. They are small and black. > My husband thought they were changing colors or > something. I noticed tonight they are not eating, > very active, and now I saw red streaks on the tip > of one of there tails. I was wondering if anyone > might know what it is. Is it cureable? Do we need > to throw them out of the tank? We have other fish > in the tank with them. Moors, Fantail Goldfish, > Corydoras, Chinese algae eater. Will this harm the > other fish? Please respond A.S.A.P if anyone can. > > Thank you, > Linda > > > > > > > __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15827	From: Fred and Cynthia	Date: 11/11/2005
Subject: molly who is pregnant

She looks like she is ready to blow. I don't want to make the same mistake last time, but want to save the babies. What can I do? I have a mesh thingy that hangs off the side. Can I put her in there now until she has the babies or will that kill her? Cynthia http://babyitems.myphotoalbum.com/view_photo.php?set_albumName=album01&id=bag [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15828	From: Raymond Wetzel	Date: 11/11/2005
Subject: Re: molly who is pregnant

Cynthia, The combined stress of both netting her and her being confined in the small space of the breeding trap (mesh thingy) could very well cause her to deliver the fry prematurely. Those things are useless, except maybe for guppies. There is the chance she will also be killed, but not usually, although the fry won't make it. Better off putting a separater in the tank (and throw in some plants). Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Fred and Cynthia" <fcouellet@s...> wrote: > > She looks like she is ready to blow. I don't want to make the same mistake last time, but want to save the babies. What can I do? I have a mesh thingy that hangs off the side. Can I put her in there now until she has the babies or will that kill her? > > Cynthia > > http://babyitems.myphotoalbum.com/view_photo.php? set_albumName=album01&id=bag > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15829	From: Fred and Cynthia	Date: 11/11/2005
Subject: Re: molly who is pregnant

That's what I thought. The only tank I can put her in is a one gallon and I think it's too small. I'll start looking to buy a bigger tank. Thanks! Cynthia http://babyitems.myphotoalbum.com/view_photo.php?set_albumName=album01&id=bag ----- Original Message ----- From: "Raymond Wetzel" <sevenspringss@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Friday, November 11, 2005 3:13 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: molly who is pregnant Cynthia, The combined stress of both netting her and her being confined in the small space of the breeding trap (mesh thingy) could very well cause her to deliver the fry prematurely. Those things are useless, except maybe for guppies. There is the chance she will also be killed, but not usually, although the fry won't make it. Better off putting a separater in the tank (and throw in some plants). Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Fred and Cynthia" <fcouellet@s...> wrote: > > She looks like she is ready to blow. I don't want to make the same mistake last time, but want to save the babies. What can I do? I have a mesh thingy that hangs off the side. Can I put her in there now until she has the babies or will that kill her? > > Cynthia > > http://babyitems.myphotoalbum.com/view_photo.php? set_albumName=album01&id=bag > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15830	From: wendie	Date: 11/11/2005
Subject: Re: molly who is pregnant

Use plenty of floating plants. Mollies generally don't eat their young... just the others in the tank will. Wendie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Fred and Cynthia Sent: Friday, November 11, 2005 3:32 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: molly who is pregnant That's what I thought. The only tank I can put her in is a one gallon and I think it's too small. I'll start looking to buy a bigger tank. Thanks! Cynthia http://babyitems.myphotoalbum.com/view_photo.php?set_albumName=album01&id= bag ----- Original Message ----- From: "Raymond Wetzel" <sevenspringss@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Friday, November 11, 2005 3:13 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: molly who is pregnant Cynthia, The combined stress of both netting her and her being confined in the small space of the breeding trap (mesh thingy) could very well cause her to deliver the fry prematurely. Those things are useless, except maybe for guppies. There is the chance she will also be killed, but not usually, although the fry won't make it. Better off putting a separater in the tank (and throw in some plants). Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Fred and Cynthia" <fcouellet@s...> wrote: > > She looks like she is ready to blow. I don't want to make the same mistake last time, but want to save the babies. What can I do? I have a mesh thingy that hangs off the side. Can I put her in there now until she has the babies or will that kill her? > > Cynthia > > http://babyitems.myphotoalbum.com/view_photo.php? set_albumName=album01&id=bag > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15831	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 11/11/2005
Subject: Vitamin fish food

Someone had posted a request for information regarding fish food with vitamins. I just wanted to boast on Boyds Vitadiet. My fish look so great and they just love the stuff. The only bad thing is that it claims to be slow sinking yet it goes to the bottom pretty quickly. I spend a few minutes "hand feeding" the stuff. It's worth it! The catfish get a LOT of it sense it sinks so quickly. VERY healthy catfish. =) I bought it online with Foster and Smith. Hope this helps whoever was looking. Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15832	From: Andreas	Date: 11/11/2005
Subject: need to identify snails

Hello all. I have some snails in my fish tank. Their shells are long and almost conical, I think they look like trumpet snails. They hide under the gravel most of the time, and probably come out at night. and when there is fresh food to be had. can you help me ID them? Andreas [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15833	From: Pat Jellison	Date: 11/11/2005
Subject: Requiem for a frog

Sigh -- one of my ancient dwarf African clawed frogs died this week -- kidney failure or some such malady I think. He was fourteen. I get attached when a critter stays with me that long! Now I have only one of my original three H. curtipes left. She's also fourteen. My second wave of frogs (H. boettgeri I think) are almost eleven years old and are in a different tank (and still laying eggs on occasion). Fortunately the old female seems to be going strong still. It made me take stock, though, and realize that I have tanks and tanks of geriatric critters. I lost my twelve-year-old hermit crab last summer. Still have elderly newts, senior fish, and my one lonely ancient frog. I guess this is going to happen more frequently from now on. Does anyone have experience in mixing old frogs and young ones? I'm thinking of replenishing the fleet, but not sure if it would stress Ms. OldFrog too much at this point in her life. Sigh. Pat J

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15834	From: wendie	Date: 11/11/2005
Subject: Re: need to identify snails

Sounds like Malaysian Trumpet Snails which will multiple like crazy. I started with a few and am now trying to figure out how to get rid of some of them. I hate the idea of killing them but might pick up a loach to do the work. Wendie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Andreas Sent: Friday, November 11, 2005 7:04 PM To: UniQuaria@yahoogroups.com; AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] need to identify snails Hello all. I have some snails in my fish tank. Their shells are long and almost conical, I think they look like trumpet snails. They hide under the gravel most of the time, and probably come out at night. and when there is fresh food to be had. can you help me ID them? Andreas [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15835	From: harry perry	Date: 11/11/2005
Subject: Re: Requiem for a frog/To Pat

I read your post, not as a requiem but as a testimonial to the care you give your critters. Fourteen years is fantastic. Harry Pat Jellison <pjjellison1@...> wrote: Sigh -- one of my ancient dwarf African clawed frogs died this week -- kidney failure or some such malady I think. He was fourteen. I get attached when a critter stays with me that long! Now I have only one of my original three H. curtipes left. She's also fourteen. My second wave of frogs (H. boettgeri I think) are almost eleven years old and are in a different tank (and still laying eggs on occasion). Fortunately the old female seems to be going strong still. It made me take stock, though, and realize that I have tanks and tanks of geriatric critters. I lost my twelve-year-old hermit crab last summer. Still have elderly newts, senior fish, and my one lonely ancient frog. I guess this is going to happen more frequently from now on. Does anyone have experience in mixing old frogs and young ones? I'm thinking of replenishing the fleet, but not sure if it would stress Ms. OldFrog too much at this point in her life. Sigh. Pat J Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15836	From: Joe	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: Re: How many fish?

One inch per gallon is crazy, NEVER use that myth. it depends on the kind of fish you want, and your filtration and how much you want to change your water. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Fred and Cynthia" <fcouellet@s...> wrote: > > One inch per gallon > > Cynthia >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15837	From: abs_334	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: Hi

I was wondering are their any fish that you don't want i Would have them in my aquarium

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15838	From: seaurchin119	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: Hi--I'm a new member!

Hello, hope all you guys are doing good. I am a college student studying Psych/Bio and I love fish. I have two fish tanks of my own-- a 3 gal freshwater and a 12 gal saltwater. It may not sound like much, but living in a dorm does not help the cause. Let me tell you a little bit about why I am here. I absolutely love the hobby--I have been running my tanks for a little over a year now and love to learn about fish keeping and the aquarium hobby through online articles, magazines, and other fish entusiests. Besides learning about aquaia, I am also here to observe the interactions of an online community for a required class at the university I am attending. Don't mind me, I am only here to observe--and maybe ask some of you questions about your feelings of the community and such--as long as you don't mind. Thank you so much and I hope to learn a lot from all of you. Kelly

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15839	From: tigertydrake	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: Fish Health

I Have chilclid fish in a aquarium that has been set up for 6 months. I have 5 fish, 2 rainbows male and female, 1 oscar, 1 blue dolphin and 1 forest jewel. They are all ggood friends and don't fight. The water is clear and smeels fine. i have a 3 foot tank that is longer and higher than most normal fish tanks. It holds about 130 litres at the moment because of rocks etc: I have a 1500 litre Aqua Pro external filter which has been set up for 1 month. I have river sand/ small grain rock, in my tank alongside river stones and a piece of wood from fish shops. My fish have always died in the past so i upgraded to the filter noted above. Latley my fish look unwell. i test for P.H and ammonia and they are fine. i change the water on the weekend every week( 20-30 Litres changed Approx)I add chlorine neutraliser and other chemicals aswell. i don't have a light but might buy one. I have two plants (thin vale) and an air pump that is on on 50% of the day. what do you recommand that i should do to prevent any deaths? i know people whom have fish that live for 5 years but mine only last months. Can you help with suggestions? I've heard of nitrate and nitrite how can i stop it? How can i get my rainbow pair to breed? My fish rub themselves against objects and shake what is it, i heard that they are parasites, how do i get ride of them?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15840	From: Fred and Cynthia	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: Re: need to identify snails

Yeah, I have a problem killing them as well. I had an infestation from some plants I bought. So, I bought a clown loach who loves to have them for a snack. Also, the two tanks that have the issue, well I have a blue lobster in one who loves to eat them and a fresh water puffer in the other. They are controlled pretty well now. The clown loach is in a community tank but the puffer is alone and the lobster has three fish with him. Cynthia http://babyitems.myphotoalbum.com/view_photo.php?set_albumName=album01&id=bag ----- Original Message ----- From: "wendie" <wendieo@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Friday, November 11, 2005 8:17 PM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] need to identify snails Sounds like Malaysian Trumpet Snails which will multiple like crazy. I started with a few and am now trying to figure out how to get rid of some of them. I hate the idea of killing them but might pick up a loach to do the work. Wendie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Andreas Sent: Friday, November 11, 2005 7:04 PM To: UniQuaria@yahoogroups.com; AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] need to identify snails Hello all. I have some snails in my fish tank. Their shells are long and almost conical, I think they look like trumpet snails. They hide under the gravel most of the time, and probably come out at night. and when there is fresh food to be had. can you help me ID them? Andreas [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15841	From: wendie	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: Re: need to identify snails

Would the loach eat the trumpet snails or just the regular rams? Wendie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Fred and Cynthia Sent: Saturday, November 12, 2005 7:58 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] need to identify snails Yeah, I have a problem killing them as well. I had an infestation from some plants I bought. So, I bought a clown loach who loves to have them for a snack. Also, the two tanks that have the issue, well I have a blue lobster in one who loves to eat them and a fresh water puffer in the other. They are controlled pretty well now. The clown loach is in a community tank but the puffer is alone and the lobster has three fish with him. Cynthia http://babyitems.myphotoalbum.com/view_photo.php?set_albumName=album01&id= bag ----- Original Message ----- From: "wendie" <wendieo@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Friday, November 11, 2005 8:17 PM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] need to identify snails Sounds like Malaysian Trumpet Snails which will multiple like crazy. I started with a few and am now trying to figure out how to get rid of some of them. I hate the idea of killing them but might pick up a loach to do the work. Wendie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Andreas Sent: Friday, November 11, 2005 7:04 PM To: UniQuaria@yahoogroups.com; AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] need to identify snails Hello all. I have some snails in my fish tank. Their shells are long and almost conical, I think they look like trumpet snails. They hide under the gravel most of the time, and probably come out at night. and when there is fresh food to be had. can you help me ID them? Andreas [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. -------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- -- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. -------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- -- [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15842	From: Fred and Cynthia	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: Re: need to identify snails

my loach eats any snail. He LOVES them. LOL Cynthia http://babyitems.myphotoalbum.com/view_photo.php?set_albumName=album01&id=bag ----- Original Message ----- From: "wendie" <wendieo@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Saturday, November 12, 2005 9:33 AM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] need to identify snails Would the loach eat the trumpet snails or just the regular rams? Wendie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Fred and Cynthia Sent: Saturday, November 12, 2005 7:58 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] need to identify snails Yeah, I have a problem killing them as well. I had an infestation from some plants I bought. So, I bought a clown loach who loves to have them for a snack. Also, the two tanks that have the issue, well I have a blue lobster in one who loves to eat them and a fresh water puffer in the other. They are controlled pretty well now. The clown loach is in a community tank but the puffer is alone and the lobster has three fish with him. Cynthia http://babyitems.myphotoalbum.com/view_photo.php?set_albumName=album01&id= bag ----- Original Message ----- From: "wendie" <wendieo@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Friday, November 11, 2005 8:17 PM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] need to identify snails Sounds like Malaysian Trumpet Snails which will multiple like crazy. I started with a few and am now trying to figure out how to get rid of some of them. I hate the idea of killing them but might pick up a loach to do the work. Wendie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Andreas Sent: Friday, November 11, 2005 7:04 PM To: UniQuaria@yahoogroups.com; AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] need to identify snails Hello all. I have some snails in my fish tank. Their shells are long and almost conical, I think they look like trumpet snails. They hide under the gravel most of the time, and probably come out at night. and when there is fresh food to be had. can you help me ID them? Andreas [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. -------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- -- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. -------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- -- [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15843	From: Justin M.	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: Re: Fish Health

At 06:18 AM 12/11/2005 +0000, you wrote: >I Have chilclid fish in a aquarium that has been set up for 6 months. >I have 5 fish, 2 rainbows male and female, 1 oscar, 1 blue dolphin and >1 forest jewel. They are all ggood friends and don't fight. The water >is clear and smeels fine. i have a 3 foot tank that is longer and >higher than most normal fish tanks. It holds about 130 litres at the >moment because of rocks etc: Sounds like your tank is around 55 gallons. Your oscar will eventually outgrow this tank, even if he was kept in it by himself. >I have a 1500 litre Aqua Pro external >filter which has been set up for 1 month. I have river sand/ small >grain rock, in my tank alongside river stones and a piece of wood from >fish shops. My fish have always died in the past so i upgraded to the >filter noted above. Latley my fish look unwell. i test for P.H and >ammonia and they are fine. Remember that only a 0 ammonia reading is "fine". >i change the water on the weekend every >week( 20-30 Litres changed Approx)I add chlorine neutraliser and other >chemicals aswell. What other chemicals? >i don't have a light but might buy one. I have two plants (thin vale) >and an air pump that is on on 50% of the day. what do you recommand >that i should do to prevent any deaths? i know people whom have fish >that live for 5 years but mine only last months. Can you help with >suggestions? >I've heard of nitrate and nitrite how can i stop it? You need to learn about the nitrogen cycle. Fish waste (or any decaying organic material, including uneaten food or even dead fish) breaks down into ammonia. This is toxic to fish. You need to grow bacteria cultures in your tank which will break down the ammonia into nitrite (also toxic) and then into nitrate (not as toxic). The nitrates are then removed via your weekly water changes. Here's a link: http://faq.thekrib.com/begin-cycling.html It would have been best for you to establish this cycle before adding fish to your tank, but since the fish are already there, you'll need to work on it right away. This is almost definitely why your fish have not lived long in the past, and why their health is poor now. Here's what I recommend: purchase test kits for ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate. Your ammonia and/or nitrite are probably high (anything above zero is bad for your fish) so you'll need to correct this with water changes. Do changes of no more than 30%, as often as twice a day until you get those numbers as low as possible. You'll read in the link above how your numbers for ammonia and nitrite will peak, and then drop down to zero. The process may take as long as six weeks. Sorry if this seems like a lot of hassle, but it is absolutely vital for the health of your fish. >How can i get my rainbow pair to breed? >My fish rub themselves against objects and shake what is it, i heard >that they are parasites, how do i get ride of them? The bad water conditions in your tank are weakening your fish, and making them succeptible to all kinds of nasties. The rubbing against objects could well mean parasites, or it could be just general irritation and discomfort. Unless you're able to identify a specific ailment in your fish, I would not medicate at this time. Hope this helps! JM

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15844	From: Fred and Cynthia	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: Re: molly who is pregnant

Okay, I have another tank set up. How do I move her without stressing her out? I put the tank right beside the 50 gallon to make it easier Cynthia http://babyitems.myphotoalbum.com/view_photo.php?set_albumName=album01&id=bag ----- Original Message ----- From: "Raymond Wetzel" <sevenspringss@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Friday, November 11, 2005 3:13 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: molly who is pregnant Cynthia, The combined stress of both netting her and her being confined in the small space of the breeding trap (mesh thingy) could very well cause her to deliver the fry prematurely. Those things are useless, except maybe for guppies. There is the chance she will also be killed, but not usually, although the fry won't make it. Better off putting a separater in the tank (and throw in some plants). Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Fred and Cynthia" <fcouellet@s...> wrote: > > She looks like she is ready to blow. I don't want to make the same mistake last time, but want to save the babies. What can I do? I have a mesh thingy that hangs off the side. Can I put her in there now until she has the babies or will that kill her? > > Cynthia > > http://babyitems.myphotoalbum.com/view_photo.php? set_albumName=album01&id=bag > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15845	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: Re: Fish Health

ok my fish never look healthy if i leave the light off... they color up significantly once light gets turned back on.... the breeding your going to get into pH and thats a whole new ball game, but you must use buffers or peat moss in your filter to soften the water. The rubbing might be parasites but if you get pics of the fish doing the rubbing, it may help. I havent had this experience so i cannot help too much. Hope all turns out well Kris tigertydrake <lordsion@...> wroteI Have chilclid fish in a aquarium that has been set up for 6 months. I have 5 fish, 2 rainbows male and female, 1 oscar, 1 blue dolphin and 1 forest jewel. They are all ggood friends and don't fight. The water is clear and smeels fine. i have a 3 foot tank that is longer and higher than most normal fish tanks. It holds about 130 litres at the moment because of rocks etc: I have a 1500 litre Aqua Pro external filter which has been set up for 1 month. I have river sand/ small grain rock, in my tank alongside river stones and a piece of wood from fish shops. My fish have always died in the past so i upgraded to the filter noted above. Latley my fish look unwell. i test for P.H and ammonia and they are fine. i change the water on the weekend every week( 20-30 Litres changed Approx)I add chlorine neutraliser and other chemicals aswell. i don't have a light but might buy one. I have two plants (thin vale) and an air pump that is on on 50% of the day. what do you recommand that i should do to prevent any deaths? i know people whom have fish that live for 5 years but mine only last months. Can you help with suggestions? I've heard of nitrate and nitrite how can i stop it? How can i get my rainbow pair to breed? My fish rub themselves against objects and shake what is it, i heard that they are parasites, how do i get ride of them? Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15846	From: Raymond Wetzel	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: Re: molly who is pregnant

Cynthia, There are several ways of doing this. (1) If you have (or can get from your LFS) a medium sized plastic fish bag, get a wire coat hanger and bend it to the approximate size of the bag opening, and leave the hanger part for a handle. Stretch the bag opening over this frame to keep the bag open. Next, use your net to slowly guide the molly into the bag while positioning the bag so she can't miss going into it. Once in the bag, you just transfer her to the new tank. (2) If no bag is available, use as large a pitcher as you can find, guiding her into it with the net. Don't chase her with the bag or the pitcher. (3) If there's room, you can submerge the new tank in the 50 towards one corner. Guide her into that corner with a net. Once she's in that corner, you slowly lift the tank so she'll go into it -- then lift the tank out, spilling half of the water out of it as you lift it (by tilting it -- so it won't be to heavy to lift out all the way). If its a 2 1/2 gallon, it shouldn't be too heavy to lift even if nearly full. Add plants and cover the tank. Sometimes it helps if you have two people; makes it easier. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Fred and Cynthia" <fcouellet@s...> wrote: > > Okay, I have another tank set up. How do I move her without stressing her > out? I put the tank right beside the 50 gallon to make it easier > > Cynthia > > http://babyitems.myphotoalbum.com/view_photo.php? set_albumName=album01&id=bag > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Raymond Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Friday, November 11, 2005 3:13 PM > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: molly who is pregnant > > > Cynthia, The combined stress of both netting her and her being > confined in the small space of the breeding trap (mesh thingy) could > very well cause her to deliver the fry prematurely. Those things are > useless, except maybe for guppies. There is the chance she will also > be killed, but not usually, although the fry won't make it. Better > off putting a separater in the tank (and throw in some plants). Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Fred and Cynthia" > <fcouellet@s...> wrote: > > > > She looks like she is ready to blow. I don't want to make the same > mistake last time, but want to save the babies. What can I do? I > have a mesh thingy that hangs off the side. Can I put her in there > now until she has the babies or will that kill her? > > > > Cynthia > > > > http://babyitems.myphotoalbum.com/view_photo.php? > set_albumName=album01&id=bag > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > Yahoo! Groups Links >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15847	From: Fred and Cynthia	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: Ray

Thanks so much! It worked. Too forever mind you. I didn't use the 2 gallon because it was already set up with plants and all. Used the bag idea. She's eating now and looks ok. Now I just wait for the babies! Cynthia http://babyitems.myphotoalbum.com/view_photo.php?set_albumName=album01&id=bag ----- Original Message ----- From: "Raymond Wetzel" <sevenspringss@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Saturday, November 12, 2005 2:06 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: molly who is pregnant Cynthia, There are several ways of doing this. (1) If you have (or can get from your LFS) a medium sized plastic fish bag, get a wire coat hanger and bend it to the approximate size of the bag opening, and leave the hanger part for a handle. Stretch the bag opening over this frame to keep the bag open. Next, use your net to slowly guide the molly into the bag while positioning the bag so she can't miss going into it. Once in the bag, you just transfer her to the new tank. (2) If no bag is available, use as large a pitcher as you can find, guiding her into it with the net. Don't chase her with the bag or the pitcher. (3) If there's room, you can submerge the new tank in the 50 towards one corner. Guide her into that corner with a net. Once she's in that corner, you slowly lift the tank so she'll go into it -- then lift the tank out, spilling half of the water out of it as you lift it (by tilting it -- so it won't be to heavy to lift out all the way). If its a 2 1/2 gallon, it shouldn't be too heavy to lift even if nearly full. Add plants and cover the tank. Sometimes it helps if you have two people; makes it easier. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Fred and Cynthia" <fcouellet@s...> wrote: > > Okay, I have another tank set up. How do I move her without stressing her > out? I put the tank right beside the 50 gallon to make it easier > > Cynthia > > http://babyitems.myphotoalbum.com/view_photo.php? set_albumName=album01&id=bag > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Raymond Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Friday, November 11, 2005 3:13 PM > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: molly who is pregnant > > > Cynthia, The combined stress of both netting her and her being > confined in the small space of the breeding trap (mesh thingy) could > very well cause her to deliver the fry prematurely. Those things are > useless, except maybe for guppies. There is the chance she will also > be killed, but not usually, although the fry won't make it. Better > off putting a separater in the tank (and throw in some plants). Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Fred and Cynthia" > <fcouellet@s...> wrote: > > > > She looks like she is ready to blow. I don't want to make the same > mistake last time, but want to save the babies. What can I do? I > have a mesh thingy that hangs off the side. Can I put her in there > now until she has the babies or will that kill her? > > > > Cynthia > > > > http://babyitems.myphotoalbum.com/view_photo.php? > set_albumName=album01&id=bag > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > Yahoo! Groups Links > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15848	From: sevenspringss@wmconnect.com	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: Re: Ray

Cynthia, Glad to see that she cooperated and went into the bag for you. Lots less stress this way. Keep us posted on her progress with the expected babies. Ray [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15849	From: KttmfC	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: need help please

Ive got a discus in my 100 gallon planted aquarium ive had him since hew was very small and now all the sudden i see strange spots developing on him.. can anyone help me ID the problem, im going to do water chem tests right now but any prelim answers would help... there are pix in our groups photos in the folder Kris's Fish. Thanks Much Kris

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15850	From: Fred and Cynthia	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: Re: need help please

White spots? Ick maybe. Need more info. I use Quick fix for ick, works great!! Cynthia http://babyitems.myphotoalbum.com/view_photo.php?set_albumName=album01&id=bag ----- Original Message ----- From: "KttmfC" <punk3r12@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Saturday, November 12, 2005 6:39 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] need help please Ive got a discus in my 100 gallon planted aquarium ive had him since hew was very small and now all the sudden i see strange spots developing on him.. can anyone help me ID the problem, im going to do water chem tests right now but any prelim answers would help... there are pix in our groups photos in the folder Kris's Fish. Thanks Much Kris Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15851	From: Ty Drake	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: Re: need help please

It may be white spot, also known as Itch. you probably already know this but the are white pinhead dots that appear on a fishes body. They can be fatal if not treated. You can buy medication at any good fish or pet store. If not white spot they can be para-sites that can also be removed with medication. They enter the tank when new fish or plants, rocks, ornaments or sometimes by contact with the water. Every fish owner i know have had them, even me, and as a result of holding off the medication i had some fatalities. On 11/13/05, KttmfC <punk3r12@...> wrote: > > Ive got a discus in my 100 gallon planted aquarium ive had him since > hew was very small and now all the sudden i see strange spots > developing on him.. can anyone help me ID the problem, im going to do > water chem tests right now but any prelim answers would help... there > are pix in our groups photos in the folder Kris's Fish. Thanks Much > > Kris > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > 毀畔�虜.><((((�gt;.毀畔�虜.毀畔��gt;<((((�gt; �毀畔�� , .毀畔�.><((((�gt; > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <�(((><.毀畔�虜.毀畔��lt;�(((><�毀畔�� , .毀畔�.<�(((><毀畔�虜. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > ------------------------------ > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > - Visit your group "AquaticLife<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife>" > on the web. > - To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com<AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > - Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>. > > > ------------------------------ > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15852	From: Ty Drake	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: Re: Fish Health

Thank you Justin to your e-mail about the tanks condition Other chemicals i use are blue mineral crystals, that recommend that they should be added after water changes. I have white spot remedy in case i need it. i did have a chemical named "bio-booster" that i have just run out of and the chlorine tap water neutraliser also called "water conditioner". When the Oscar gets bigger i will sell it to a pet shop in town that offers to buy. The Oscar is about 4 inches long at the moment and i think it will at least double. The link about the nitrogen cycle helped. On 11/13/05, Justin M. <warbyrd@...> wrote: > > At 06:18 AM 12/11/2005 +0000, you wrote: > >I Have chilclid fish in a aquarium that has been set up for 6 months. > >I have 5 fish, 2 rainbows male and female, 1 oscar, 1 blue dolphin and > >1 forest jewel. They are all ggood friends and don't fight. The water > >is clear and smeels fine. i have a 3 foot tank that is longer and > >higher than most normal fish tanks. It holds about 130 litres at the > >moment because of rocks etc: > > Sounds like your tank is around 55 gallons. Your oscar will > eventually outgrow this tank, even if he was kept in it by himself. > > > >I have a 1500 litre Aqua Pro external > >filter which has been set up for 1 month. I have river sand/ small > >grain rock, in my tank alongside river stones and a piece of wood from > >fish shops. My fish have always died in the past so i upgraded to the > >filter noted above. Latley my fish look unwell. i test for P.H and > >ammonia and they are fine. > > Remember that only a 0 ammonia reading is "fine". > > > >i change the water on the weekend every > >week( 20-30 Litres changed Approx)I add chlorine neutraliser and other > >chemicals aswell. > > What other chemicals? > > > >i don't have a light but might buy one. I have two plants (thin vale) > >and an air pump that is on on 50% of the day. what do you recommand > >that i should do to prevent any deaths? i know people whom have fish > >that live for 5 years but mine only last months. Can you help with > >suggestions? > >I've heard of nitrate and nitrite how can i stop it? > > You need to learn about the nitrogen cycle. Fish waste (or any > decaying organic material, including uneaten food or even dead fish) > breaks > down into ammonia. This is toxic to fish. You need to grow bacteria > cultures in your tank which will break down the ammonia into nitrite (also > > toxic) and then into nitrate (not as toxic). The nitrates are then removed > > via your weekly water changes. Here's a link: > > http://faq.thekrib.com/begin-cycling.html > > It would have been best for you to establish this cycle before > adding fish to your tank, but since the fish are already there, you'll > need > to work on it right away. This is almost definitely why your fish have not > > lived long in the past, and why their health is poor now. Here's what I > recommend: purchase test kits for ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate. Your > ammonia and/or nitrite are probably high (anything above zero is bad for > your fish) so you'll need to correct this with water changes. Do changes > of > no more than 30%, as often as twice a day until you get those numbers as > low as possible. You'll read in the link above how your numbers for > ammonia > and nitrite will peak, and then drop down to zero. The process may take as > > long as six weeks. Sorry if this seems like a lot of hassle, but it is > absolutely vital for the health of your fish. > > >How can i get my rainbow pair to breed? > >My fish rub themselves against objects and shake what is it, i heard > >that they are parasites, how do i get ride of them? > > > The bad water conditions in your tank are weakening your fish, and > making them succeptible to all kinds of nasties. The rubbing against > objects could well mean parasites, or it could be just general irritation > and discomfort. Unless you're able to identify a specific ailment in your > fish, I would not medicate at this time. Hope this helps! > > > JM > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > 毀畔�虜.><((((�gt;.毀畔�虜.毀畔��gt;<((((�gt; �毀畔�� , .毀畔�.><((((�gt; > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <�(((><.毀畔�虜.毀畔��lt;�(((><�毀畔�� , .毀畔�.<�(((><毀畔�虜. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > ------------------------------ > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > - Visit your group "AquaticLife<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife>" > on the web. > - To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com<AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > - Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>. > > > ------------------------------ > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15853	From: Ty Drake	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: Re: Fish Health

Thanks for your interest. the fish just flip on their sides and gently swim to the gravel floor and rub or shake near it then swim away. I think i may have a solution. someone recommended a medication and ways to fix bad water quality. Thanks anyway Bye On 11/13/05, kristopher helsing <punk3r12@...> wrote: > > ok my fish never look healthy if i leave the light off... they color up > significantly once light gets turned back on.... the breeding your going to > get into pH and thats a whole new ball game, but you must use buffers or > peat moss in your filter to soften the water. The rubbing might be parasites > but if you get pics of the fish doing the rubbing, it may help. I havent had > this experience so i cannot help too much. Hope all turns out well > > Kris > > tigertydrake <lordsion@...> wroteI Have chilclid fish in a aquarium > that has been set up for 6 months. > I have 5 fish, 2 rainbows male and female, 1 oscar, 1 blue dolphin and > 1 forest jewel. They are all ggood friends and don't fight. The water > is clear and smeels fine. i have a 3 foot tank that is longer and > higher than most normal fish tanks. It holds about 130 litres at the > moment because of rocks etc: I have a 1500 litre Aqua Pro external > filter which has been set up for 1 month. I have river sand/ small > grain rock, in my tank alongside river stones and a piece of wood from > fish shops. My fish have always died in the past so i upgraded to the > filter noted above. Latley my fish look unwell. i test for P.H and > ammonia and they are fine. i change the water on the weekend every > week( 20-30 Litres changed Approx)I add chlorine neutraliser and other > chemicals aswell. > i don't have a light but might buy one. I have two plants (thin vale) > and an air pump that is on on 50% of the day. what do you recommand > that i should do to prevent any deaths? i know people whom have fish > that live for 5 years but mine only last months. Can you help with > suggestions? > I've heard of nitrate and nitrite how can i stop it? > How can i get my rainbow pair to breed? > My fish rub themselves against objects and shake what is it, i heard > that they are parasites, how do i get ride of them? > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > Marine biology Marine fish Biology > > > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine biology<http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine+fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=sWozU8RAgM2g66Yb_7h_nQ> Marine > fish<http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine+fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=JB6FNOraRx3JIvMA1E4-Lw> > Biology<http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine+fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=R-HUKyhqLGfm-ZAFT2vuTQ> > ------------------------------ > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > - Visit your group "AquaticLife<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife>" > on the web. > - To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com<AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > - Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>. > > > ------------------------------ > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15854	From: Ty Drake	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: Re: need help please

Kris, After seeing your photos it still may be white spot. But if you are refering to the large circular marks ,if not part of the fish, it looks like it may be some kind of fungil infection. Either way, they both can be treated by chemicals, ask your pet supplier. On 11/13/05, KttmfC <punk3r12@...> wrote: > > Ive got a discus in my 100 gallon planted aquarium ive had him since > hew was very small and now all the sudden i see strange spots > developing on him.. can anyone help me ID the problem, im going to do > water chem tests right now but any prelim answers would help... there > are pix in our groups photos in the folder Kris's Fish. Thanks Much > > Kris > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > 毀畔�虜.><((((�gt;.毀畔�虜.毀畔��gt;<((((�gt; �毀畔�� , .毀畔�.><((((�gt; > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <�(((><.毀畔�虜.毀畔��lt;�(((><�毀畔�� , .毀畔�.<�(((><毀畔�虜. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > ------------------------------ > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > - Visit your group "AquaticLife<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife>" > on the web. > - To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com<AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> > - Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>. > > > ------------------------------ > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15855	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: Re: Hi--I'm a new member!

When I was in school, I kept a couple of 5.5 gallon tanks in the dorm. During breaks, I'd just take them over to a friend's place to care for them while I went back home. Both were freshwater. Back in the dark ages when I went to school, a marine tank could not even be though of due to the expense and the rarity of shops that would even be carrying marine supplies and critters. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of seaurchin119 Sent: Thursday, November 10, 2005 12:57 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Hi--I'm a new member! Hello, hope all you guys are doing good. I am a college student studying Psych/Bio and I love fish. I have two fish tanks of my own-- a 3 gal freshwater and a 12 gal saltwater. It may not sound like much, but living in a dorm does not help the cause. Let me tell you a little bit about why I am here. I absolutely love the hobby--I have been running my tanks for a little over a year now and love to learn about fish keeping and the aquarium hobby through online articles, magazines, and other fish entusiests. Besides learning about aquaia, I am also here to observe the interactions of an online community for a required class at the university I am attending. Don't mind me, I am only here to observe--and maybe ask some of you questions about your feelings of the community and such--as long as you don't mind. Thank you so much and I hope to learn a lot from all of you. Kelly Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15856	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: Re: Fish Health

At this juncture, I'd look for Amquel to help you through the cycle of your tank, it will also neutralize your chlorine. I'd also ensure I have good test kits including those for pH, ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate. Those that use powdered reagents are the best, in my opinion. If you do use Amquel, you will need to ensure that your ammonia test kit does not use a Nesslar reagent, as it will not give you the proper readings. I'd remove the oscar now, rather than waiting for it to grow more. It will actually triple in size from the 4" it is now, and it will be of no help should your rainbows breed. Actually, most rainbows come from a water that has a higher pH than oscars like, and you will probably not be very successful with the breeding unless the fish are in good condition, and have water parameters they like. I'm not familiar with the common names "blue dolphin" and "forest jewel", so I cannot comment on them, nor can I further comment on the rainbows without knowing what they are either. As for the flashing you have happening, the cause could be one of a number of number of things, and if you are not seeing any parasites on the fish, I'd not medicate. In the absence of parasites, the most likely cause is your water conditions, which no medication can cure, so it would be up to you to get the water quality stabilized. You have already checked out a link mentioned to you earlier about the nitrogen cycle. The ammonia level will rise (and you oscar can be a primary source for a lot of ammonia), and then start dropping as the nitrites rise. When the nitrites start falling, you are well on your way to establishing the cycle. Water changes will help keep the nitrates in check, which is the end product of the cycle in most aquariums. The use of the aforementioned Amquel will change the ammonia to a non-toxic form so far as the fish are concerned while not hindering the cycle. Your filter and air pump (if you feel the need for an air pump) should be run 24/7. The nitrogen cycle is probably the most important thing for the beginning aquarist to understand, and probably the most neglected. There is no magic to it, only time. There are some tricks to speed it along in its process, but no magic bullet that will preclude you from going through the initial cycle which will take 6-8 weeks. Get going, and if you have further questions, feel free to ask them here. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of tigertydrake Sent: Saturday, November 12, 2005 1:19 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Fish Health I Have chilclid fish in a aquarium that has been set up for 6 months. I have 5 fish, 2 rainbows male and female, 1 oscar, 1 blue dolphin and 1 forest jewel. They are all ggood friends and don't fight. The water is clear and smeels fine. i have a 3 foot tank that is longer and higher than most normal fish tanks. It holds about 130 litres at the moment because of rocks etc: I have a 1500 litre Aqua Pro external filter which has been set up for 1 month. I have river sand/ small grain rock, in my tank alongside river stones and a piece of wood from fish shops. My fish have always died in the past so i upgraded to the filter noted above. Latley my fish look unwell. i test for P.H and ammonia and they are fine. i change the water on the weekend every week( 20-30 Litres changed Approx)I add chlorine neutraliser and other chemicals aswell. i don't have a light but might buy one. I have two plants (thin vale) and an air pump that is on on 50% of the day. what do you recommand that i should do to prevent any deaths? i know people whom have fish that live for 5 years but mine only last months. Can you help with suggestions? I've heard of nitrate and nitrite how can i stop it? How can i get my rainbow pair to breed? My fish rub themselves against objects and shake what is it, i heard that they are parasites, how do i get ride of them?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15857	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: Re: need help please

Hi Kris, It's not possible to be 100% sure from just a photo, but it look very much like ammonia/nitrite burns to me, have you recently cleaned your filtration system ? or replaced your filtration ?, I would say that your biological filtration is not functioning for some reason. regards, unclenorm. --- KttmfC <punk3r12@...> wrote: > Ive got a discus in my 100 gallon planted aquarium > ive had him since > hew was very small and now all the sudden i see > strange spots > developing on him.. can anyone help me ID the > problem, im going to do > water chem tests right now but any prelim answers > would help... there > are pix in our groups photos in the folder Kris's > Fish. Thanks Much > > Kris > > > > ___________________________________________________________ To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. http://uk.security.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15858	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 11/12/2005
Subject: Re: need help please

I just did a water change... i dont know if that would have done it but i did the change and the parameters seem fine...i WILL have to retest amonia tomorrow just to be safe. Thanks Kris "Norman. S. Hampson." <normnam2000@...> wrote: Hi Kris, It's not possible to be 100% sure from just a photo, but it look very much like ammonia/nitrite burns to me, have you recently cleaned your filtration system ? or replaced your filtration ?, I would say that your biological filtration is not functioning for some reason. regards, unclenorm. --- KttmfC <punk3r12@...> wrote: > Ive got a discus in my 100 gallon planted aquarium > ive had him since > hew was very small and now all the sudden i see > strange spots > developing on him.. can anyone help me ID the > problem, im going to do > water chem tests right now but any prelim answers > would help... there > are pix in our groups photos in the folder Kris's > Fish. Thanks Much > > Kris > > > > ___________________________________________________________ To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. http://uk.security.yahoo.com Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15859	From: Fred and Cynthia	Date: 11/13/2005
Subject: Ray

How would I know if she aborted her babies? Today she does not look as big as she was, not squareness anymore. I still see black spots (she is sliver with an orange tail). I also don't see any eggs on the bottom. I will see if I can try to take a picture for you Cynthia http://babyitems.myphotoalbum.com/view_photo.php?set_albumName=album01&id=bag ----- Original Message ----- From: "Raymond Wetzel" <sevenspringss@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Friday, November 11, 2005 3:13 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: molly who is pregnant Cynthia, The combined stress of both netting her and her being confined in the small space of the breeding trap (mesh thingy) could very well cause her to deliver the fry prematurely. Those things are useless, except maybe for guppies. There is the chance she will also be killed, but not usually, although the fry won't make it. Better off putting a separater in the tank (and throw in some plants). Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Fred and Cynthia" <fcouellet@s...> wrote: > > She looks like she is ready to blow. I don't want to make the same mistake last time, but want to save the babies. What can I do? I have a mesh thingy that hangs off the side. Can I put her in there now until she has the babies or will that kill her? > > Cynthia > > http://babyitems.myphotoalbum.com/view_photo.php? set_albumName=album01&id=bag > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15860	From: Raymond Wetzel	Date: 11/13/2005
Subject: Re: Ray/Mollie who is pregnant

If she aborted, you would not see eggs on the bottom as by this time the fry would have hatch internally but would not be fully developed (if they were premature); she could have eaten them though. If this was a normal birthing where the fry were delivered fully developed, you should have found at least a few fry hiding in the plants, especially if you used fine leafed plants like Cabomba or Myriophyllum (Foxtail), or floating water sprite with lots of roots. While Mollies don't usually eat their fry (they're primarily vegetarians/herbivors), they can still be opportunistic at times and seek them out for a meal. From your description it does sound as if she had them, but if you still see black spots it would seem as if she is still gravid. Try giving her more time and see what happens before putting her back in the 50. By the way, you don't want to have a light on her tank when you think she's due -- why make it easier for her to find the fry. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Fred and Cynthia" <fcouellet@s...> wrote: > > How would I know if she aborted her babies? Today she does not look as big > as she was, not squareness anymore. I still see black spots (she is sliver > with an orange tail). I also don't see any eggs on the bottom. I will see > if I can try to take a picture for you > > Cynthia > > http://babyitems.myphotoalbum.com/view_photo.php? set_albumName=album01&id=bag > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Raymond Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Friday, November 11, 2005 3:13 PM > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: molly who is pregnant > > > Cynthia, The combined stress of both netting her and her being > confined in the small space of the breeding trap (mesh thingy) could > very well cause her to deliver the fry prematurely. Those things are > useless, except maybe for guppies. There is the chance she will also > be killed, but not usually, although the fry won't make it. Better > off putting a separater in the tank (and throw in some plants). Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Fred and Cynthia" > <fcouellet@s...> wrote: > > > > She looks like she is ready to blow. I don't want to make the same > mistake last time, but want to save the babies. What can I do? I > have a mesh thingy that hangs off the side. Can I put her in there > now until she has the babies or will that kill her? > > > > Cynthia > > > > http://babyitems.myphotoalbum.com/view_photo.php? > set_albumName=album01&id=bag > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > Yahoo! Groups Links >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15861	From: Luke	Date: 11/14/2005
Subject: Guppies

How do i know if my guppies are pregnant?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15862	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 11/14/2005
Subject: Re: Guppies

they will get really big and you'll see a dark spot near the anus. However, it's hard to tell sometimes because they can look like that if they are well fed, too. Emily Luke <pukas65@...> wrote: How do i know if my guppies are pregnant? Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15863	From: Fred and Cynthia	Date: 11/14/2005
Subject: Ray, photos

I still see black, but she is NOT as large as she was when we put her in....unless the tank being plastic makes her look different. There are no babies anywhere though. Not sure what to do! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15864	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 11/14/2005
Subject: Re: Guppies

If youve got males in with females.... its pregnant... its a guppy, those are the on;y fish i knwo that will breed in ANY condition! Luke <pukas65@...> wrote: How do i know if my guppies are pregnant? Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15865	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 11/14/2005
Subject: Re: Guppies

In a message dated 11/14/2005 7:53:08 PM Eastern Standard Time, punk3r12@... writes: <<<If youve got males in with females.... its pregnant... its a guppy, those are the on;y fish i knwo that will breed in ANY condition!>>> Then you've never seen convicts in action! ;-) Vicky Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Contact mosherd@... or (301-451-9390) =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: FCR-Cancer-Support@yahoogroups.com Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@... 919-513-1467, Dr London @ calondon@... 530-754-5711 _AND_ Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15866	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 11/14/2005
Subject: Re: Guppies

how easy are the convicts??? i need feeders for the clown knife and tiger shovelnose i have... seleya8@... wrote: In a message dated 11/14/2005 7:53:08 PM Eastern Standard Time, punk3r12@... writes: <<<If youve got males in with females.... its pregnant... its a guppy, those are the on;y fish i knwo that will breed in ANY condition!>>> Then you've never seen convicts in action! ;-) Vicky Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Contact mosherd@... or (301-451-9390) =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: FCR-Cancer-Support@yahoogroups.com Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@... 919-513-1467, Dr London @ calondon@... 530-754-5711 _AND_ Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15867	From: KttmfC	Date: 11/14/2005
Subject: anyone in san diego??

anyone in san diego?? Ive got tanks and filters for sale... also some fish if anyone is interested... ive got 16 tanks working down to about 5... all fresh.. Kris

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15868	From: KttmfC	Date: 11/14/2005
Subject: sweet

so my pix on the front page... thats kinds sweet,,,

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15869	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 11/14/2005
Subject: Re: Guppies

You need a male convict and a female convict. Then, just add water. Pretty much that easy. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of kristopher helsing Sent: Monday, November 14, 2005 11:05 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Guppies how easy are the convicts??? i need feeders for the clown knife and tiger shovelnose i have... seleya8@... wrote: In a message dated 11/14/2005 7:53:08 PM Eastern Standard Time, punk3r12@... writes: <<<If youve got males in with females.... its pregnant... its a guppy, those are the on;y fish i knwo that will breed in ANY condition!>>> Then you've never seen convicts in action! ;-) Vicky Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Contact mosherd@... or (301-451-9390) =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: FCR-Cancer-Support@yahoogroups.com Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@... 919-513-1467, Dr London @ calondon@... 530-754-5711 _AND_ Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15870	From: sevenspringss@wmconnect.com	Date: 11/14/2005
Subject: Re: Ray, photos

Cynthia, Sounds as if she may have had the fry (and apparently has eaten them). As you say you still see black, that may or may not be a gravid spot (she may be carrying fry), and you could wait it out a few days, but usually they deliver them all at once. Noticed you changed the subject title to include "photos", but I can't find anything there. If you've added photos of her to the site, what heading is it under? Ray [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15871	From: Fred and Cynthia	Date: 11/15/2005
Subject: Re: Ray, photos

They would have been in the email, I attached them. Let me know if you don't see them and I'll send again Cynthia http://babyitems.myphotoalbum.com/view_photo.php?set_albumName=album01&id=bag ----- Original Message ----- From: <sevenspringss@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Monday, November 14, 2005 11:39 PM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Ray, photos Cynthia, Sounds as if she may have had the fry (and apparently has eaten them). As you say you still see black, that may or may not be a gravid spot (she may be carrying fry), and you could wait it out a few days, but usually they deliver them all at once. Noticed you changed the subject title to include "photos", but I can't find anything there. If you've added photos of her to the site, what heading is it under? Ray [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15872	From: sevenspringss@wmconnect.com	Date: 11/15/2005
Subject: Re: Ray, photos

Nope, not a trace -- no photos with last email. Ray [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15873	From: Phil	Date: 11/15/2005
Subject: 4th generation convicts!!

Hey mates! I've had fish for about 15 yrs now. I've had preetty much all of the smaller community fish(guppies, platies, tetras, danios, barbs). I got into cichlids about 7 yrs ago. My 1st cichlids were 3 black convicts (2 F & 1M). About 3 months later, the M paired with the bigger F & they had a brood, well then a few days later he paired with the other F & had another brood. Well when the young got bigger I sorted through them & kept a few. Then I bought some at the lfs to breed with my babies. Each generation I repeat the routine. Now I have 4th generation convicts. I had their great grandpa & great grandma. They are 3 months old now & I have already bought 2 Pink convicts to breed with them. I plan on trying to keep the line going as long as I can. I LOVE CONVICTS!!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15874	From: Tiger	Date: 11/16/2005
Subject: Oscar

My oscar looks unwell. He has a transparent fin and his skin seems to be degrading. Please look at the photo album of Tiger's tank. The pitcures are a bit unclear but you can get the main problem by looking at the makings and damged fins. My fish don't fight with each other. Does anyone have any suggestions on what it is and how to fix it?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15875	From: paul helms	Date: 11/17/2005
Subject: Re: need to identify snails

trumpets are too hard for them to eat unless they are tiny babies --- wendie <wendieo@...> wrote: > Would the loach eat the trumpet snails or just the > regular rams? > Wendie > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On > Behalf Of Fred and Cynthia > Sent: Saturday, November 12, 2005 7:58 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] need to identify snails > > > Yeah, I have a problem killing them as well. I > had an infestation from > some > plants I bought. So, I bought a clown loach who > loves to have them for a > snack. Also, the two tanks that have the issue, > well I have a blue > lobster > in one who loves to eat them and a fresh water > puffer in the other. They > are controlled pretty well now. The clown loach > is in a community tank > but > the puffer is alone and the lobster has three fish > with him. > > Cynthia > > > http://babyitems.myphotoalbum.com/view_photo.php?set_albumName=album01&id= > bag > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "wendie" <wendieo@...> > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Friday, November 11, 2005 8:17 PM > Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] need to identify snails > > > Sounds like Malaysian Trumpet Snails which will > multiple like crazy. I > started with a few > and am now trying to figure out how to get rid of > some of them. I hate > the > idea of killing > them but might pick up a loach to do the work. > Wendie > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On > Behalf Of Andreas > Sent: Friday, November 11, 2005 7:04 PM > To: UniQuaria@yahoogroups.com; > AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] need to identify snails > > > Hello all. > I have some snails in my fish tank. Their shells > are long and almost > conical, I think they look like trumpet snails. > They hide under the > gravel > most of the time, and probably come out at > night. and when there is > fresh > food to be had. > can you help me ID them? > Andreas > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it > when replying, thanks. > 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> > 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all > TEXT that is NOT important > to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the > SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" > <- > <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , > .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- > -- > -- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the > web. > > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an > email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to > the Yahoo! Terms of > Service. > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- > -- > -- > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it > when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the > SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" > <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it > when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > -- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an > email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of > Service. > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > -- > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15876	From: paul helms	Date: 11/17/2005
Subject: Re: need to identify snails

WHY would you get rid of tru,pet snails? theyare the most beneficial animal you can get ina n aquarium! they keep your gravel bed aerated so that there are no spots creating toxins, eat algae and scavenge food, and do not eat healthy plants. i have literally hundreds in my 30 gallon tank. --- wendie <wendieo@...> wrote: > Sounds like Malaysian Trumpet Snails which will > multiple like crazy. I > started with a few > and am now trying to figure out how to get rid of > some of them. I hate the > idea of killing > them but might pick up a loach to do the work. > Wendie > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On > Behalf Of Andreas > Sent: Friday, November 11, 2005 7:04 PM > To: UniQuaria@yahoogroups.com; > AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] need to identify snails > > > Hello all. > I have some snails in my fish tank. Their shells > are long and almost > conical, I think they look like trumpet snails. > They hide under the gravel > most of the time, and probably come out at night. > and when there is fresh > food to be had. > can you help me ID them? > Andreas > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it > when replying, thanks. > 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> > 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , > .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > -- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an > email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of > Service. > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > -- > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Yahoo! FareChase: Search multiple travel sites in one click. http://farechase.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15877	From: paul helms	Date: 11/17/2005
Subject: Re: need to identify snails

they are! and do not kill em --- Andreas <andreas1120@...> wrote: > Hello all. > I have some snails in my fish tank. Their shells > are long and almost > conical, I think they look like trumpet snails. They > hide under the gravel > most of the time, and probably come out at night. > and when there is fresh > food to be had. > can you help me ID them? > Andreas > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15878	From: Rev. Eric Roberts	Date: 11/17/2005
Subject: Re: need to identify snails

My tanks are the same...plus they keep my loaches happy ;-) Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of paul helms Sent: Thursday, November 17, 2005 2:51 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] need to identify snails WHY would you get rid of tru,pet snails? theyare the most beneficial animal you can get ina n aquarium! they keep your gravel bed aerated so that there are no spots creating toxins, eat algae and scavenge food, and do not eat healthy plants. i have literally hundreds in my 30 gallon tank. --- wendie <wendieo@...> wrote: > Sounds like Malaysian Trumpet Snails which will > multiple like crazy. I > started with a few > and am now trying to figure out how to get rid of > some of them. I hate the > idea of killing > them but might pick up a loach to do the work. > Wendie > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On > Behalf Of Andreas > Sent: Friday, November 11, 2005 7:04 PM > To: UniQuaria@yahoogroups.com; > AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] need to identify snails > > > Hello all. > I have some snails in my fish tank. Their shells > are long and almost > conical, I think they look like trumpet snails. > They hide under the gravel > most of the time, and probably come out at night. > and when there is fresh > food to be had. > can you help me ID them? > Andreas > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it > when replying, thanks. > 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> > 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , > .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > -- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an > email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of > Service. > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > -- > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Yahoo! FareChase: Search multiple travel sites in one click. http://farechase.yahoo.com Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Mar ine+fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=sWozU8RAgM2g66Yb_7h_nQ> biology Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine +fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=JB6FNOraRx3JIvMA1E4-Lw> fish Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine+fis h&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=R-HUKyhqLGfm-ZAFT2vuTQ> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15879	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 11/17/2005
Subject: got tramisol from foy's pigeon, just double checking dosage...

So for 20 gal, (minus about 1 gal for rocks=19 gal) I would add 38*19=722 mg of solution, right? Is there a tsp dose for this amount (I got the soluble powder kind)? Or should I just weigh out on a scale? Thanks! Emily Levamisole > is really the drug of choice in treating nematodes, but as it is not > readily soluable in water you'll need to use it as Levimisole HCL > (hydrochloride), called Levisol (7.5% concentration) or Tramisol. > This is used as a one-time bath using 38 mg to the gallon (5 ppm) for > 24 hours after which you should do at least a 90% water change [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15880	From: Raymond Wetzel	Date: 11/17/2005
Subject: Re: got tramisol from foy's pigeon, just double checking dosage...

Emily, If you're fairly sure about the amount of rocks and gravel (so as not to overdose the med), then yes you are right. Mg is a measurement of weight and tsp is a measurement of volume. As everything has a different weight, the volume (tsp) of one substance will never be the same weight as the same volume of the next substance. So, you're better off weighing it out on a scale. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Emily Tenczar <bababanana@y...> wrote: > > So for 20 gal, (minus about 1 gal for rocks=19 gal) I would add 38*19=722 mg of solution, right? Is there a tsp dose for this amount (I got the soluble powder kind)? Or should I just weigh out on a scale? > > Thanks! > Emily > > Levamisole > > is really the drug of choice in treating nematodes, but as it is > not > > readily soluable in water you'll need to use it as Levimisole HCL > > (hydrochloride), called Levisol (7.5% concentration) or Tramisol. > > This is used as a one-time bath using 38 mg to the gallon (5 ppm) > for > > 24 hours after which you should do at least a 90% water change > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15881	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 11/17/2005
Subject: Re: got tramisol from foy's pigeon, just double checking dosage...

that's what i was thinking, since i don't know the density of the product. though I'm not positive on the amt of rocks. should I calculate for 18 gal? What would be the lowest I can go to minimize risk of overdose, and still have an effective dose? Emily Raymond Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote: Emily, If you're fairly sure about the amount of rocks and gravel (so as not to overdose the med), then yes you are right. Mg is a measurement of weight and tsp is a measurement of volume. As everything has a different weight, the volume (tsp) of one substance will never be the same weight as the same volume of the next substance. So, you're better off weighing it out on a scale. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Emily Tenczar <bababanana@y...> wrote: > > So for 20 gal, (minus about 1 gal for rocks=19 gal) I would add 38*19=722 mg of solution, right? Is there a tsp dose for this amount (I got the soluble powder kind)? Or should I just weigh out on a scale? > > Thanks! > Emily > > Levamisole > > is really the drug of choice in treating nematodes, but as it is > not > > readily soluable in water you'll need to use it as Levimisole HCL > > (hydrochloride), called Levisol (7.5% concentration) or Tramisol. > > This is used as a one-time bath using 38 mg to the gallon (5 ppm) > for > > 24 hours after which you should do at least a 90% water change > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15882	From: aclaar877	Date: 11/17/2005
Subject: Azoo Red Plant Fertilizer

Has anyone on this group tried the Azoo fertilizer specifically geared toward red plants? Is it effective? I'm close to giving up on ammania gracillis and rotala varieties altogether. They grow fine, but aren't red. Right now I'm increasing water changes while maintaining PO4 and iron, in an effort to drive nitrates down, and see if that affects the red color. I have the plants directly under 6700K CFs, so I doubt there is insufficient light. Andy

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15883	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 11/17/2005
Subject: Re: Azoo Red Plant Fertilizer

Andy, I am by no means a plant person but even though you are running 6700K are there enought watts per gallon? How deep is the tank? How close are the plants in relation to the top of the water and the light to the water? Mike -----Original Message----- From: aclaar877 <aclaar877@...> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thu, 17 Nov 2005 22:12:34 -0000 Subject: [AquaticLife] Azoo Red Plant Fertilizer Has anyone on this group tried the Azoo fertilizer specifically geared toward red plants? Is it effective? I'm close to giving up on ammania gracillis and rotala varieties altogether. They grow fine, but aren't red. Right now I'm increasing water changes while maintaining PO4 and iron, in an effort to drive nitrates down, and see if that affects the red color. I have the plants directly under 6700K CFs, so I doubt there is insufficient light. Andy Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15884	From: Raymond Wetzel	Date: 11/17/2005
Subject: Re: got tramisol from foy's pigeon, just double checking dosage...

Emily, I know what you're asking, as of course you want to try to calculate for as near to the quantity of watet (only) that you have. But if you think about it, there's no way I can tell you as I have no idea the amount of rocks and gravel you have, especially from here, unless possibly I could guestimate from looking at a photo and even then it would be difficult to get an idea of the depth of gravel from a photo. I might guess that with your question, part of what you're asking is how much below the unknown quantity of water can you calculate for and still have the dosage be effective; i.e., if you knew for sure that you definitely had 19 gallons, would the dosage for 18 gallons be effective for the fish if used for a known 19 gallons of water. \ One thing to need to keep in mind -- with nothing in the tank, it would only be a full 20 gallons if the water actually reached the very top of the rim of the tank. Most people keep the water level 1/2" to 1" below the very top of the tank. Sources of information on the medication vary, indicating both that there's no problem if accidentally overdosing with also saying you need to be somewhat careful of overdosing. Play the middle of the road as you are already thinking but allow for a drop in water level especially if its substantial (1 gallon in a 20 gallon long tank equals somewhere between 1 3/16" and 1 1/4" in depth). My guess is you have the water level down at least 1/2" as no one has the water at tippy-top. Going by that I think you'd be both safe and giving an effective dosage at 18 gallons of water figured. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Emily Tenczar <bababanana@y...> wrote: > > that's what i was thinking, since i don't know the density of the product. though I'm not positive on the amt of rocks. should I calculate for 18 gal? What would be the lowest I can go to minimize risk of overdose, and still have an effective dose? > Emily > > Raymond Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > Emily, If you're fairly sure about the amount of rocks and gravel > (so as not to overdose the med), then yes you are right. Mg is a > measurement of weight and tsp is a measurement of volume. As > everything has a different weight, the volume (tsp) of one substance > will never be the same weight as the same volume of the next > substance. So, you're better off weighing it out on a scale. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Emily Tenczar <bababanana@y...> > wrote: > > > > So for 20 gal, (minus about 1 gal for rocks=19 gal) I would add > 38*19=722 mg of solution, right? Is there a tsp dose for this amount > (I got the soluble powder kind)? Or should I just weigh out on a > scale? > > > > Thanks! > > Emily > > > > Levamisole > > > is really the drug of choice in treating nematodes, but as it is > > not > > > readily soluable in water you'll need to use it as Levimisole HCL > > > (hydrochloride), called Levisol (7.5% concentration) or > Tramisol. > > > This is used as a one-time bath using 38 mg to the gallon (5 ppm) > > for > > > 24 hours after which you should do at least a 90% water change > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15885	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 11/18/2005
Subject: Re: got tramisol from foy's pigeon, just double checking dosage...

thanks, I know you can't tell me exactly (obviously), I was just thinking of a safe estimate. I could drain all the water and measure it, but that would not be the best thing for those little sensitive fish. Emily Raymond Wetzel <sevenspringss@...> wrote: Emily, I know what you're asking, as of course you want to try to calculate for as near to the quantity of watet (only) that you have. But if you think about it, there's no way I can tell you as I have no idea the amount of rocks and gravel you have, especially from here, unless possibly I could guestimate from looking at a photo and even then it would be difficult to get an idea of the depth of gravel from a photo. I might guess that with your question, part of what you're asking is how much below the unknown quantity of water can you calculate for and still have the dosage be effective; i.e., if you knew for sure that you definitely had 19 gallons, would the dosage for 18 gallons be effective for the fish if used for a known 19 gallons of water. \ One thing to need to keep in mind -- with nothing in the tank, it would only be a full 20 gallons if the water actually reached the very top of the rim of the tank. Most people keep the water level 1/2" to 1" below the very top of the tank. Sources of information on the medication vary, indicating both that there's no problem if accidentally overdosing with also saying you need to be somewhat careful of overdosing. Play the middle of the road as you are already thinking but allow for a drop in water level especially if its substantial (1 gallon in a 20 gallon long tank equals somewhere between 1 3/16" and 1 1/4" in depth). My guess is you have the water level down at least 1/2" as no one has the water at tippy-top. Going by that I think you'd be both safe and giving an effective dosage at 18 gallons of water figured. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Emily Tenczar <bababanana@y...> wrote: > > that's what i was thinking, since i don't know the density of the product. though I'm not positive on the amt of rocks. should I calculate for 18 gal? What would be the lowest I can go to minimize risk of overdose, and still have an effective dose? > Emily > > Raymond Wetzel <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > Emily, If you're fairly sure about the amount of rocks and gravel > (so as not to overdose the med), then yes you are right. Mg is a > measurement of weight and tsp is a measurement of volume. As > everything has a different weight, the volume (tsp) of one substance > will never be the same weight as the same volume of the next > substance. So, you're better off weighing it out on a scale. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Emily Tenczar <bababanana@y...> > wrote: > > > > So for 20 gal, (minus about 1 gal for rocks=19 gal) I would add > 38*19=722 mg of solution, right? Is there a tsp dose for this amount > (I got the soluble powder kind)? Or should I just weigh out on a > scale? > > > > Thanks! > > Emily > > > > Levamisole > > > is really the drug of choice in treating nematodes, but as it is > > not > > > readily soluable in water you'll need to use it as Levimisole HCL > > > (hydrochloride), called Levisol (7.5% concentration) or > Tramisol. > > > This is used as a one-time bath using 38 mg to the gallon (5 ppm) > > for > > > 24 hours after which you should do at least a 90% water change > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15886	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 11/18/2005
Subject: having problems getting snails to control algae

I'm having an algae invasion in my 55 gal. cold water goldfish/native tank. I added a couple of apple snails and some ramshorns, and 2 of the ramshorns have died already :( The tank is around 70 degrees F (roomtemp/unheated) and I'm wondering, do snails need to be acclimated like fish do? In the past I've just dropped them in the tanks and they'll do fine, but I'm wondering if this could have lead to their demise or is it just because they are from a petstore? The snails I added to my other cold water tank are doing okay. I'm definitely not looking to kill the algae; I just want to keep it in check, and I already have 6 fish (goldfish, bullheads and bluegills) in the tank so I don't want anymore fish, unless it's something that will stay relatively small and doesn't mind cold water. Algae eating shrimp won't survive in this tank. I've also added some trumpet snails, which don't seem to be doing well either. I don't know what's going on, because all the levels are ideal. The alkalinity is a bit low (40-60ppm, i think?) but the hardness is 150 or so and pH is close to neutral. I just don't understand why I'm having trouble with snails lately. Is there a different kind of snail I should try, or what? Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15887	From: Justin M.	Date: 11/18/2005
Subject: electronic pH meters

We're getting real sick of using liquid reagent tests for our three tanks...have any listers had any experience with electronic pH meters? Are they worth the high price? JM

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15888	From: dreammaker2623	Date: 11/19/2005
Subject: Re: having problems getting snails to control algae

Have you added any meds lately? If so them that might be the problem. I would do a water change of about 10 gallons of dechlorinated water of about the same temp, and add carbon to the filter to get rid of any meds that are in the water. How about salt, smails do not do well in water that has salt in it. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Emily Tenczar <bababanana@y...> wrote: > > I'm having an algae invasion in my 55 gal. cold water goldfish/native tank. I added a couple of apple snails and some ramshorns, and 2 of the ramshorns have died already :( The tank is around 70 degrees F (roomtemp/unheated) and I'm wondering, do snails need to be acclimated like fish do? In the past I've just dropped them in the tanks and they'll do fine, but I'm wondering if this could have lead to their demise or is it just because they are from a petstore? The snails I added to my other cold water tank are doing okay. > > I'm definitely not looking to kill the algae; I just want to keep it in check, and I already have 6 fish (goldfish, bullheads and bluegills) in the tank so I don't want anymore fish, unless it's something that will stay relatively small and doesn't mind cold water. Algae eating shrimp won't survive in this tank. I've also added some trumpet snails, which don't seem to be doing well either. > > I don't know what's going on, because all the levels are ideal. The alkalinity is a bit low (40-60ppm, i think?) but the hardness is 150 or so and pH is close to neutral. I just don't understand why I'm having trouble with snails lately. Is there a different kind of snail I should try, or what? > > Emily

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15889	From: paul helms	Date: 11/19/2005
Subject: Re: electronic pH meters

no they rae not...they need to be calibrated quite often --- "Justin M." <warbyrd@...> wrote: > We're getting real sick of using liquid reagent > tests for our three > tanks...have any listers had any experience with > electronic pH meters? Are > they worth the high price? > > JM > > > __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15890	From: Tim Fairchild	Date: 11/19/2005
Subject: Re: electronic pH meters

On Saturday 19 Nov 2005 17:49, Justin M. wrote: > We're getting real sick of using liquid reagent tests for our three > tanks...have any listers had any experience with electronic pH meters? Are > they worth the high price? Not really. In any case, IMO, if you keep the kH about right, the pH will look after itself (esp with water changes, etc)... I rarely check pH... I have to mix and match water a bit since we have a choice of rainwater and well water (at about 280kH)... -- --------------------------------------------------------- Tim Fairchild Atchafalaya Border Collies. Kuttabul, Queensland, Australia. --------------------------------------------------------- Email mailto:tim@... Homepage http://www.bcs4me.com Photos http://www.pbase.com/amosf Blog http://bcs4me.com/blog ---------------------------------------------------------

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15891	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 11/19/2005
Subject: Re: having problems getting snails to control algae

no meds or salt for months. Emily dreammaker2623 <dreammaker2623@...> wrote: Have you added any meds lately? If so them that might be the problem. I would do a water change of about 10 gallons of dechlorinated water of about the same temp, and add carbon to the filter to get rid of any meds that are in the water. How about salt, smails do not do well in water that has salt in it. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Emily Tenczar <bababanana@y...> wrote: > > I'm having an algae invasion in my 55 gal. cold water goldfish/native tank. I added a couple of apple snails and some ramshorns, and 2 of the ramshorns have died already :( The tank is around 70 degrees F (roomtemp/unheated) and I'm wondering, do snails need to be acclimated like fish do? In the past I've just dropped them in the tanks and they'll do fine, but I'm wondering if this could have lead to their demise or is it just because they are from a petstore? The snails I added to my other cold water tank are doing okay. > > I'm definitely not looking to kill the algae; I just want to keep it in check, and I already have 6 fish (goldfish, bullheads and bluegills) in the tank so I don't want anymore fish, unless it's something that will stay relatively small and doesn't mind cold water. Algae eating shrimp won't survive in this tank. I've also added some trumpet snails, which don't seem to be doing well either. > > I don't know what's going on, because all the levels are ideal. The alkalinity is a bit low (40-60ppm, i think?) but the hardness is 150 or so and pH is close to neutral. I just don't understand why I'm having trouble with snails lately. Is there a different kind of snail I should try, or what? > > Emily Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15892	From: thesydmonster	Date: 11/19/2005
Subject: Re: need to identify snails

I had wondered about this... I have zebra loaches (botia striata) that are supposed to be great snail eaters but when I dropped baby MTS into their tank, they never ate them! Now I have snails in my loach tank, which just cracks me up. I just got some red ramshorn snails for a different tank, will loaches eat those babies? Thanks, Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms <wtfmorlok@y...> wrote: > > trumpets are too hard for them to eat unless they are > tiny babies > > > --- wendie <wendieo@o...> wrote: > > > Would the loach eat the trumpet snails or just the > > regular rams? > > Wendie

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15893	From: Rev. Eric Roberts	Date: 11/20/2005
Subject: Re: need to identify snails

Get some clowns. Mine attacked and killed a mystery snail...I guess they will eat anything. I had a problem with snail in one of my tanks, so I got 2 clowns for it. Within a month, all that was left was a bunch of snail shells. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of thesydmonster Sent: Saturday, November 19, 2005 10:41 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: need to identify snails I had wondered about this... I have zebra loaches (botia striata) that are supposed to be great snail eaters but when I dropped baby MTS into their tank, they never ate them! Now I have snails in my loach tank, which just cracks me up. I just got some red ramshorn snails for a different tank, will loaches eat those babies? Thanks, Rebecca --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, paul helms <wtfmorlok@y...> wrote: > > trumpets are too hard for them to eat unless they are > tiny babies > > > --- wendie <wendieo@o...> wrote: > > > Would the loach eat the trumpet snails or just the > > regular rams? > > Wendie Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15894	From: scooobycat2000	Date: 11/20/2005
Subject: question

Hi, I have a 30 gallon freshwater tank. When i test my water it tests very hard and alkaline. I have used a water softner pillow and done water changes. What else can i do? THanks

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15895	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 11/20/2005
Subject: Tszzzzzt! Electric fish may jam rivals' signals: Science News Onlin

For those of you with an interest in electric fishes, you may find this article interesting. http://www.sciencenews.org/articles/20051119/fob4.asp \\Steve// "The nice thing about standards is that there are so many of them to choose from." Andrew S. Tanenbaum, IT teacher, Vrije University, Netherlands

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15896	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 11/20/2005
Subject: Re: question

Keep fish that prefer hard and alkaline water like some of the rift lake cichlids. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of scooobycat2000 Sent: Sunday, November 20, 2005 11:12 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] question Hi, I have a 30 gallon freshwater tank. When i test my water it tests very hard and alkaline. I have used a water softner pillow and done water changes. What else can i do? THanks Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15897	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 11/20/2005
Subject: Re: question

the water changes wojnt help a bit.... get r/o water from the store, and if youwant it softer than use peat moss in your filtration.... also some driftwood might help. Kris scooobycat2000 <scooobycat2000@...> wrote: Hi, I have a 30 gallon freshwater tank. When i test my water it tests very hard and alkaline. I have used a water softner pillow and done water changes. What else can i do? THanks Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15898	From: Rev. Eric Roberts	Date: 11/20/2005
Subject: Re: Tszzzzzt! Electric fish may jam rivals' signals: Science News O

That was very interesting...did you listen to the audio conversion of the electric courtship signals? That was too cool. Thanks! Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Steve Szabo Sent: Sunday, November 20, 2005 1:42 PM To: Aquatic Life; Fish and Aquaria List Subject: [AquaticLife] Tszzzzzt! Electric fish may jam rivals' signals: Science News Online, Nov. 19, 2005 For those of you with an interest in electric fishes, you may find this article interesting. http://www.sciencenews.org/articles/20051119/fob4.asp \\Steve// "The nice thing about standards is that there are so many of them to choose from." Andrew S. Tanenbaum, IT teacher, Vrije University, Netherlands Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Mar ine+fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=sWozU8RAgM2g66Yb_7h_nQ> biology Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine +fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=JB6FNOraRx3JIvMA1E4-Lw> fish Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine+fis h&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=R-HUKyhqLGfm-ZAFT2vuTQ> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15899	From: Iksnip@aol.com	Date: 11/20/2005
Subject: Bioscape

Hi Guys, Got a question. I am trying to build a south american tank that can house each fish, amphibians, and (with research) the correct lizards. In looking at other tanks in a LFS, I had a couple of questions. In a 75 gallon tank, I am going to lay out 2-3 inches of white sand substrate. I am going to house the bottom with rocks and naturally submerged plants for the fish. Now, I really want to create room for the fish and would like to fill the tank up say, 2/3 with water. To create surface space for the amphibs and lizards obviously one can use logs and other plant life with little branches and perhaps lilly pads. If I want to create enough surface space however, how do I do it? does anyone have any ideas? I would REALLY appreciate any experiences, success and failures, people have with this. thanks Ken PS what are some south american frogs people house their tanks with? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15900	From: Chris	Date: 11/20/2005
Subject: Re: Bioscape

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Iksnip@a... wrote: I am trying to build a south american tank that can house each fish, amphibians, and (with research) the correct lizards. This tank sounds great! :) Just to let you know, I don't speak from experience, but I was recently at the Sydney Aquarium and they have a lot of displays that match this description, including the fish and lizards, but even including ducks(!), turtles and in one of the displays, platypuses. In general, the above-water surfaces tended to be at the sides and at the back of the tank - this maximises the view into the underwater environment. You mentioned little branches - but perhaps larger pieces of wood shaped more or less like an upside down tree stump would be good too - in this way, the bit that's underwater is just the "trunk" - using up very little underwater space, but the part above water would be where the wood branches out (the "roots" if you prefer). This was done just at the water surface, particularly in the platypus tank. The shape of the wood was excellent for lizards to bask on (they did have water dragons in with the platypuses - they're awesome to watch swimming!) - and you can get plenty of climbing space if the branches extend up into the open air part of the tank. For the amphibians - something that more resembles a "beach" might be appropriate, and again, just thinking out loud, but you might acheive this by siliconing a piece of glass into the tank. If you wanted the beach at the back, then the glass would go along the full length of the back panel and it's ends would be glued to the side panels. It would come up at an angle from the back wall. You could then fill that compartment with gravel. The idea of the angle is that you can maximise above-water surface area without needing to use up much of the space in the water. The angle of the glass would be important - too horizontal and it might not take the weight of the gravel. Anyway - it's an idea. Oh - and needless to say - don't house the poisonous frogs! :) Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15901	From: Kara	Date: 11/20/2005
Subject: Re: Bioscape

I don't know anything but the idea sounds really cool. Please post pictures when you complete the tank:) Iksnip@... wrote: Hi Guys, Got a question. I am trying to build a south american tank that can house each fish, amphibians, and (with research) the correct lizards. In looking at other tanks in a LFS, I had a couple of questions. In a 75 gallon tank, I am going to lay out 2-3 inches of white sand substrate. I am going to house the bottom with rocks and naturally submerged plants for the fish. Now, I really want to create room for the fish and would like to fill the tank up say, 2/3 with water. To create surface space for the amphibs and lizards obviously one can use logs and other plant life with little branches and perhaps lilly pads. If I want to create enough surface space however, how do I do it? does anyone have any ideas? I would REALLY appreciate any experiences, success and failures, people have with this. thanks Ken PS what are some south american frogs people house their tanks with? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15902	From: harry perry	Date: 11/20/2005
Subject: Re: Bioscape/Paludarium

Your idea is called a paludarium. Some ideas at http://freshaquarium.about.com/cs/paludriums/l/blpaludarium.htm Harry Kara <scooobycat2000@...> wrote: I don't know anything but the idea sounds really cool. Please post pictures when you complete the tank:) Iksnip@... wrote: Hi Guys, Got a question. I am trying to build a south american tank that can house each fish, amphibians, and (with research) the correct lizards. In looking at other tanks in a LFS, I had a couple of questions. In a 75 gallon tank, I am going to lay out 2-3 inches of white sand substrate. I am going to house the bottom with rocks and naturally submerged plants for the fish. Now, I really want to create room for the fish and would like to fill the tank up say, 2/3 with water. To create surface space for the amphibs and lizards obviously one can use logs and other plant life with little branches and perhaps lilly pads. If I want to create enough surface space however, how do I do it? does anyone have any ideas? I would REALLY appreciate any experiences, success and failures, people have with this. thanks Ken PS what are some south american frogs people house their tanks with? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15903	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 11/20/2005
Subject: Re: Bioscape/Paludarium

I was thinking it was called a terrarium or something like that. There are a couple websights about people building these. Terrariums/ paludriums or whatever you call them. Harry's link will give you a couple great places to start looking. Great Link Harry !!! I was going to link him to http://www.terraquarium.com/ they are trying to sell the tank and setup as a business. But I am sure he could pick up a few ideas from there sight. www.blackjungle.com also has a lot of info that might be useful. and if those sights are not enough http://www.vivariumtopsites.com/ has a listing of relevant sights. Hope your setup proves to be all you want and wish you the best of luck Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 11/20/2005 10:39:10 PM US Eastern Standard Time, harryfisherman@... writes: Your idea is called a paludarium. Some ideas at http://freshaquarium.about.com/cs/paludriums/l/blpaludarium.htm Harry [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15904	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 11/21/2005
Subject: Male cichlids transform as dominant rivals removed

http://www.scienceinafrica.co.za/2005/november/cichlids.htm I believe I may have already mentioned this study here, but , this is another take on it. \\Steve//

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15905	From: John	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: Bio-Wheel Filter opinions

Does anyone have any experience with Marineland/Penguin Bio-Wheel filters? I am about to replace my Whisper (leak) on my 25 gallon tank and am considering a Bio-Wheel 200. Are there better choices that you might recommend? Thanks for any help.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15906	From: yellow71camaro	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: help!!! stingray problems

i came home from work tonight and went to feed my ray and he starts do strange stuff like he is haven siezers or something and in the death curel did a water check and everything is at 0 so i did a 40% water change its been like 5hrs and nothing is improving . can anyone help me ? he is a 12" motoro

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15907	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: Re: Bio-Wheel Filter opinions

In a message dated 11/26/2005 10:38:17 PM Eastern Standard Time, jayemsr@... writes: <<<Does anyone have any experience with Marineland/Penguin Bio-Wheel filters? I am about to replace my Whisper (leak) on my 25 gallon tank and am considering a Bio-Wheel 200. Are there better choices that you might recommend? Thanks for any help.>>> I have a couple of them and find they are the most trouble and noisiest filters I own. They clog easily so the water flow is impeded, they're a hassle to clean and they have an incessant splashing sound. As far as HOB filters, IMO you can't beat the Aquaclears. They're workhorses and last for a very long time. I've read they recently redesigned them to deal with the noise issue but don't intend to buy any more of them. Vicky Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Contact mosherd@... or (301-451-9390) =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: FCR-Cancer-Support@yahoogroups.com Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@... 919-513-1467, Dr London @ london.20@... 614-292-9554 _AND_ Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15908	From: Kara	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: Re: Bio-Wheel Filter opinions

I have a penguin 150 with a bio wheel for my 29 gallon tank. It seems to do a good job. I do go thru alot of filters and have to clean out the filter box part often. Algae builds up in the tube and box and then it doesn't pull enought water thru to turn the biowheel. The algae build up may because i have my tank too close to a window. Good luck John <jayemsr@...> wrote: Does anyone have any experience with Marineland/Penguin Bio-Wheel filters? I am about to replace my Whisper (leak) on my 25 gallon tank and am considering a Bio-Wheel 200. Are there better choices that you might recommend? Thanks for any help. Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Music Unlimited - Access over 1 million songs. Try it free. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15909	From: Kara	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: Re: Bio-Wheel Filter opinions

I Recently (about 6 months ago) bought mine and it is very quiet. I have a couple of them and find they are the most trouble and noisiest filters I own. They clog easily so the water flow is impeded, they're a hassle to clean and they have an incessant splashing sound. As far as HOB filters, IMO you can't beat the Aquaclears. They're workhorses and last for a very long time. I've read they recently redesigned them to deal with the noise issue but don't intend to buy any more of them. Vicky Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Contact mosherd@... or (301-451-9390) =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: FCR-Cancer-Support@yahoogroups.com Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@... 919-513-1467, Dr London @ london.20@... 614-292-9554 _AND_ Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Music Unlimited - Access over 1 million songs. Try it free. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15910	From: Patrick	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: Re: Bio-Wheel Filter opinions

I wouldn't have anything but marineland. I have two of them, and one whisper that sits in a box. The marinelands I have are not biowheels, and I have never really seen the point in biowheels, but they certainly can't do anything but help with biofiltration. The important thing to remember when your filter gets clogged is that you can wash the cartridges with a water hose and use them for months or years without replacing them. The wheels themselves should not be cleaned, only the parts that turn should be cleaned to prevent jams. When you clean the cartridges, the wheel will make up for the bacteria loss. :) Patrick

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15911	From: Laura	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: New tank set up

Hi! I am new to the group. My brother just gave me a 30 gallon tank (his old one...his new job has him travel too much and he wasnt able to take care of his fishies)....my kids and I are soooooo excited.... Anyway....we have put the water, rocks and pretty stuff in.....put the cholorine drops in.....letting the tank rest and filter through etc.....dont plan on getting any fish until next weekend provided this tank is stable and ready.... Any advice on what to monitor and do this week to help establish this tank....needless to say I will be cramming the internet looking for information..... Thanks, Laura

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15912	From: Patrick	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: Re: New tank set up

Nothing will happen until there is an ammonia source. Until then, it is just an empty tank of water. http://americanfishguy.tripod.com/setup.html http://americanfishguy.tripod.com/nitrogencycle.html Patrick http://groups.yahoo.com/group/aquariumdebates ----- Original Message ----- Hi! I am new to the group. My brother just gave me a 30 gallon tank (his old one...his new job has him travel too much and he wasnt able to take care of his fishies)....my kids and I are soooooo excited.... Anyway....we have put the water, rocks and pretty stuff in.....put the cholorine drops in.....letting the tank rest and filter through etc.....dont plan on getting any fish until next weekend provided this tank is stable and ready.... Any advice on what to monitor and do this week to help establish this tank....needless to say I will be cramming the internet looking for information..... Thanks, Laura

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15913	From: wendie	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: Re: Bio-Wheel Filter opinions

Noise is high. I find that the bio wheel stops turning on one. Just doesn't turn smoothly while the other two are fairly good. Tosses out a lot of water and causes a lot of turbulence in the tank. Does do a good job. It sounds like you're in a rain storm at times. Wendie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of John Sent: Wednesday, November 23, 2005 10:01 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Bio-Wheel Filter opinions Does anyone have any experience with Marineland/Penguin Bio-Wheel filters? I am about to replace my Whisper (leak) on my 25 gallon tank and am considering a Bio-Wheel 200. Are there better choices that you might recommend? Thanks for any help. Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15914	From: Laura	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: Re: New tank set up

Thank you for the links. I have read them but, I have to admit I am a little confused though. Are you saying I cant really "ready" my tank unless I have a fish in it? Should I just get a couple of fish and put them in there? ALso, as a tank goes through this nitrogen cycle....how do I help them stay alive as all this ph changing is going on??? Thanks for your advice, Laura If you give up when it's winter, you will miss the promise of your spring, the beauty of your summer, and the fulfillment of your fall. -------Original Message------- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Date: 11/26/05 23:22:26 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] New tank set up Nothing will happen until there is an ammonia source. Until then, it is just an empty tank of water. http://americanfishguy.tripod.com/setup.html http://americanfishguy.tripod.com/nitrogencycle.html Patrick http://groups.yahoo.com/group/aquariumdebates ----- Original Message ----- Hi! I am new to the group. My brother just gave me a 30 gallon tank (his old one...his new job has him travel too much and he wasnt able to take care of his fishies)....my kids and I are soooooo excited.... Anyway....we have put the water, rocks and pretty stuff in.....put the cholorine drops in.....letting the tank rest and filter through etc.....dont plan on getting any fish until next weekend provided this tank is stable and ready.... Any advice on what to monitor and do this week to help establish this tank....needless to say I will be cramming the internet looking for information..... Thanks, Laura Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15915	From: Laura	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: New to the group...

My brother just gave me his 30 gallon tank with all the "fixing"....the kids and I are very excited.. However... We have a lot to learn.... We have it set up and the pump is going...we did put the declorinating drops and some salt (fresh water tank but my brother suggested using the salt).... How long should we let the tank set up before we get fish??? I am reading a little on the nitrogen cycle but I am a bit confused by it...I am not sure if I have to wait until the cycle is finished before getting fish or if the cycle will not even start before getting a fish?? Thanks for your help, Laura

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15916	From: Laura	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: Re: New to the group...

Oopps...sorry....I thought this was to another "group" that I joined....I got the fish tank today and it is set up so I am researching all of my options as best I can..... Laura If you give up when it's winter, you will miss the promise of your spring, the beauty of your summer, and the fulfillment of your fall. -------Original Message------- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Date: 11/26/05 23:50:16 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] New to the group... My brother just gave me his 30 gallon tank with all the "fixing"....the kids and I are very excited.. However... We have a lot to learn.... We have it set up and the pump is going...we did put the declorinating drops and some salt (fresh water tank but my brother suggested using the salt).... How long should we let the tank set up before we get fish??? I am reading a little on the nitrogen cycle but I am a bit confused by it...I am not sure if I have to wait until the cycle is finished before getting fish or if the cycle will not even start before getting a fish?? Thanks for your help, Laura Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15917	From: Patrick	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: Re: New to the group...

I hate it when that happens. It is especially bad when you think you are sending a private message to an individual, and then an embarrassing moment happens when a whole group gets to read it. :) I'm a member of nearly 20 groups. Look for Uniquaria. You might also check out the Freshwater Aquariums group. Patrick ----- Original Message ----- Oopps...sorry....I thought this was to another "group" that I joined....I got the fish tank today and it is set up so I am researching all of my options as best I can..... Laura

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15918	From: Patrick	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: Re: New tank set up

There is a process called fishless cycling, but for new fish keepers, it usually is no better than the regular process. Fish always have a way of not making it in a new tank with a new keeper. My philosophy is, it takes a few deaths to learn how to keep them alive. Confusion is normal, especially when you realize that there is no real science behind fish tanks. There is science in some of the processes, but most of it is random. It gets easier. pH shouldn't change too much after the first day, and only then because the water has to settle all the dissolved stuff in it. Good luck! Patrick ----- Original Message ----- Thank you for the links. I have read them but, I have to admit I am a little confused though. Are you saying I cant really "ready" my tank unless I have a fish in it? Should I just get a couple of fish and put them in there? ALso, as a tank goes through this nitrogen cycle....how do I help them stay alive as all this ph changing is going on??? Thanks for your advice, Laura

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15919	From: Laura	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: Re: New tank set up

So are you saying it would be best for us to just go ahead and get a couple of fish and try this out.....rather than having it sent in our living room all ready to go and teasing us/????? Sure sounds more fun then waiting until next weekend but I want to do what is right....what all needs to be in balance before I buy the first fish? Laura There is a process called fishless cycling, but for new fish keepers, it usually is no better than the regular process. Fish always have a way of not making it in a new tank with a new keeper. My philosophy is, it takes a few deaths to learn how to keep them alive. Confusion is normal, especially when you realize that there is no real science behind fish tanks. There is science in some of the processes, but most of it is random. It gets easier. pH shouldn't change too much after the first day, and only then because the water has to settle all the dissolved stuff in it. Good luck! Patrick [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15920	From: Laura	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: Re: New to the group...

Would love the links to both of those...you can email them to me at llmdolphin@... if you would like to.... Thanks, Laura

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15921	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: Re: New tank set up

Laura Basically you are correct in what you read. The tank can not start cycling without an ammonia source ( fish poop ), or other ammonia source. What kind of fish do you plan on keeping? Maybe your 1st choice of fish will be hardy enough to withstand the changes ( cycle ) your tank will go through the next couple months. The key is to go slow, add 1 fish wait a week, add another fish, wait a week add another etc etc until your tank is stocked . this will allow your tank to gradually build up an ammonia source and the good bacterias will grow to consume them. You will need a test Kit to test ammonia, Nitrates, Ph, GH, Your 30 gallon tank is a Great sized tank for most kinds of fish, but still small for others. I'd take your Tap water into the Fish store and have them check it. If you have High PH you will want to stay with a fish that likes a higher PH. Or vice versa. what kind of filter does your tank have? btw this will help us in the future help you wih your tank. Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 11/27/2005 12:46:34 AM US Eastern Standard Time, llmdolphin@... writes: Thank you for the links. I have read them but, I have to admit I am a little confused though. Are you saying I cant really "ready" my tank unless I have a fish in it? Should I just get a couple of fish and put them in there? ALso, as a tank goes through this nitrogen cycle....how do I help them stay alive as all this ph changing is going on??? Thanks for your advice, Laura [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15922	From: Laura	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: Re: New tank set up

My filter is an AquaTech 20-40 and it sits on the back of the tank and kinda waterfalls into the tank..... I have all the testing kits (my brother gave them to me) here already....he suggested waiting a few days before getting fish so that everything could settle in the tank and a good reading could be taken (ph, ammonia, hardness/softness of water, etc etc)......its still a little cloudy but we only just put the water and all the ornaments together about 4 hours ago.... its been a long time since he "set up a tank" though so maybe he is mistaken in telling me that.... He told me to start out with a tetra tank, a snail and an algae eater (only because I really like them and want one), and possibly a tiger barb depending on what the pet store suggested....he has had luck with them living together but says its not always promoted by the fish stores.... Are these "hearty" fish to start a new tank with?? What is GH? ALso, do I need to buy bacteria or will they just appear naturally? I think he has a bottle of some kind of bacteria but not sure how old it is.... Thanks Laura Laura Basically you are correct in what you read. The tank can not start cycling without an ammonia source ( fish poop ), or other ammonia source. What kind of fish do you plan on keeping? Maybe your 1st choice of fish will be hardy enough to withstand the changes ( cycle ) your tank will go through the next couple months. The key is to go slow, add 1 fish wait a week, add another fish, wait a week add another etc etc until your tank is stocked . this will allow your tank to gradually build up an ammonia source and the good bacterias will grow to consume them. You will need a test Kit to test ammonia, Nitrates, Ph, GH, Your 30 gallon tank is a Great sized tank for most kinds of fish, but still small for others. I'd take your Tap water into the Fish store and have them check it. If you have High PH you will want to stay with a fish that likes a higher PH. Or vice versa. what kind of filter does your tank have? btw this will help us in the future help you wih your tank. Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15923	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: Re: Bio-Wheel Filter opinions

i have an ac and it works pretty well. haven't had to replace but have had to clean it to get it working at 100% again, as with all filters. seleya8@... wrote: In a message dated 11/26/2005 10:38:17 PM Eastern Standard Time, jayemsr@... writes: <<<Does anyone have any experience with Marineland/Penguin Bio-Wheel filters? I am about to replace my Whisper (leak) on my 25 gallon tank and am considering a Bio-Wheel 200. Are there better choices that you might recommend? Thanks for any help.>>> I have a couple of them and find they are the most trouble and noisiest filters I own. They clog easily so the water flow is impeded, they're a hassle to clean and they have an incessant splashing sound. As far as HOB filters, IMO you can't beat the Aquaclears. They're workhorses and last for a very long time. I've read they recently redesigned them to deal with the noise issue but don't intend to buy any more of them. Vicky Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Contact mosherd@... or (301-451-9390) =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: FCR-Cancer-Support@yahoogroups.com Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@... 919-513-1467, Dr London @ london.20@... 614-292-9554 _AND_ Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- Valeen Robertson Gonzalez valeendgonzalez@... [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15924	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: Re: New tank set up

Some Tetras are great starter fish, some are NOT. Neon Tetras are beautiful fish but not very hardy. while Black Skirt Tetras, Buenos Aires Tetras and a few others are not that pretty but are very hardy. Algae eaters can be very good fish to keep in a tank but You should wait for awhile to let things settle down and to let the algae start growing in the tank before adding the algae eater. Snails I will not comment on ... I will just say I own a Fahaka Puffer who likes snails the bigger the better.. gh refers to general hardness usually around here you'll have moderetly hard water and High Ph .. The bacteria ....Read the back of the container most only have a 6 month shelf life. Rob NE Indiana USA www.midwestcichlid.com In a message dated 11/27/2005 1:42:27 AM US Eastern Standard Time, llmdolphin@... writes: He told me to start out with a tetra tank, a snail and an algae eater (only because I really like them and want one), and possibly a tiger barb depending on what the pet store suggested....he has had luck with them living together but says its not always promoted by the fish stores.... Are these "hearty" fish to start a new tank with?? What is GH? ALso, do I need to buy bacteria or will they just appear naturally? I think he has a bottle of some kind of bacteria but not sure how old it is.... Thanks Laura [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15925	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: Re: New tank set up

i have some lemon tetras (bigger than neon tetras) that are very hardy. i also have some cherry barbs that are also very hardy. in a 30 you could definitely have a school of lemons. i believe cherry barbs are not schoolers so having them singly is probably a good idea. FortWayneFish@... wrote: Some Tetras are great starter fish, some are NOT. Neon Tetras are beautiful fish but not very hardy. while Black Skirt Tetras, Buenos Aires Tetras and a few others are not that pretty but are very hardy. Algae eaters can be very good fish to keep in a tank but You should wait for awhile to let things settle down and to let the algae start growing in the tank before adding the algae eater. Snails I will not comment on ... I will just say I own a Fahaka Puffer who likes snails the bigger the better.. gh refers to general hardness usually around here you'll have moderetly hard water and High Ph .. The bacteria ....Read the back of the container most only have a 6 month shelf life. Rob NE Indiana USA www.midwestcichlid.com In a message dated 11/27/2005 1:42:27 AM US Eastern Standard Time, llmdolphin@... writes: He told me to start out with a tetra tank, a snail and an algae eater (only because I really like them and want one), and possibly a tiger barb depending on what the pet store suggested....he has had luck with them living together but says its not always promoted by the fish stores.... Are these "hearty" fish to start a new tank with?? What is GH? ALso, do I need to buy bacteria or will they just appear naturally? I think he has a bottle of some kind of bacteria but not sure how old it is.... Thanks Laura [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- Valeen Robertson Gonzalez valeendgonzalez@... [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15926	From: Rev. Eric Roberts	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: Re: Bio-Wheel Filter opinions

I have 2 emperor 440's on my 55 gallon and one on my 30 gallon...even when "clogged up" it keeps the tank clean. I also like the emperors because I can separate the filter media from the charcoal or other chemical filtration media. I can just use some of the filer material and then put any chemical filtration material in he provided containers. I have been a bit lax on cleaning as I have been working a lot (yeah!!!) and my water is still crystal clear and my fish are happy campers. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Kara Sent: Saturday, 26 November 2005 22:16 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Bio-Wheel Filter opinions I have a penguin 150 with a bio wheel for my 29 gallon tank. It seems to do a good job. I do go thru alot of filters and have to clean out the filter box part often. Algae builds up in the tube and box and then it doesn't pull enought water thru to turn the biowheel. The algae build up may because i have my tank too close to a window. Good luck John <jayemsr@...> wrote: Does anyone have any experience with Marineland/Penguin Bio-Wheel filters? I am about to replace my Whisper (leak) on my 25 gallon tank and am considering a Bio-Wheel 200. Are there better choices that you might recommend? Thanks for any help. Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Music Unlimited - Access over 1 million songs. Try it free. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15927	From: Rev. Eric Roberts	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: Re: Bio-Wheel Filter opinions

That is one of the things I like about the marine land filters with biowheels. When I rinse out my filters, I dip them in the tank water to rinse out any of the chlorinated water so I don't cause any harm, to the bacteria on he biowheel. My only complaint on a marineland product...I have been having an overflow problem with my Eclipse hood lately. If I don;t clean the filter every couple of weeks, the prevents enough water flow to cause water to leak outside the tank. Most of the time I catch it before it becomes a huge mess, but I can see this happening at a time when I am away from home for an extended period of time and coming back to a huge mess and dead fish,I have thought about shaving down the inside wall of the filter housing so that t would spill over into the tank instead of down the outside of the tank. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Patrick Sent: Saturday, 26 November 2005 22:38 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Bio-Wheel Filter opinions I wouldn't have anything but marineland. I have two of them, and one whisper that sits in a box. The marinelands I have are not biowheels, and I have never really seen the point in biowheels, but they certainly can't do anything but help with biofiltration. The important thing to remember when your filter gets clogged is that you can wash the cartridges with a water hose and use them for months or years without replacing them. The wheels themselves should not be cleaned, only the parts that turn should be cleaned to prevent jams. When you clean the cartridges, the wheel will make up for the bacteria loss. :) Patrick Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15928	From: Rev. Eric Roberts	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: Re: Bio-Wheel Filter opinions

That is a problem solved in the emperor series. The flow that spins the biowheel is a separate flow tube off of the pump so that if there is a problem with eh filters being clogged or anything like that, it doesn't effect the biowheel. I have 3 of the largest ones they have running (emperor 440's) and the only noise I have is the lite sound of running water...which is actually quite relaxing. As long as you keep the water level above the bottom of the outflow, the sound of running water is not too loud. The turbulence also is not as bad as some would say for plants. I have plants in all of my tanks and they are thriving. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of wendie Sent: Saturday, 26 November 2005 23:30 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Bio-Wheel Filter opinions Noise is high. I find that the bio wheel stops turning on one. Just doesn't turn smoothly while the other two are fairly good. Tosses out a lot of water and causes a lot of turbulence in the tank. Does do a good job. It sounds like you're in a rain storm at times. Wendie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of John Sent: Wednesday, November 23, 2005 10:01 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Bio-Wheel Filter opinions Does anyone have any experience with Marineland/Penguin Bio-Wheel filters? I am about to replace my Whisper (leak) on my 25 gallon tank and am considering a Bio-Wheel 200. Are there better choices that you might recommend? Thanks for any help. Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15929	From: Rev. Eric Roberts	Date: 11/26/2005
Subject: Re: New tank set up

Get some hardy fish...or at least cheap ones to cycle the tank. I had no probs with my pleco and cories when we first setup our tanks. There are others that I am sure others will recommend. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Laura Sent: Sunday, 27 November 2005 00:22 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] New tank set up So are you saying it would be best for us to just go ahead and get a couple of fish and try this out.....rather than having it sent in our living room all ready to go and teasing us/????? Sure sounds more fun then waiting until next weekend but I want to do what is right....what all needs to be in balance before I buy the first fish? Laura There is a process called fishless cycling, but for new fish keepers, it usually is no better than the regular process. Fish always have a way of not making it in a new tank with a new keeper. My philosophy is, it takes a few deaths to learn how to keep them alive. Confusion is normal, especially when you realize that there is no real science behind fish tanks. There is science in some of the processes, but most of it is random. It gets easier. pH shouldn't change too much after the first day, and only then because the water has to settle all the dissolved stuff in it. Good luck! Patrick [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15930	From: Raymond Wetzel	Date: 11/27/2005
Subject: Re: New tank set up

Hi Laura, Welcome to the wonderful hobby of tropical fish keeping and wish you much success. Any questions -- just ask here and any of us will be glad to help. Have been following this topic, hoping for some more-definitive answers to be forthcoming, which I haven't seen yet. I noticed that at least in two of your posts, that you intend putting fish in the tank by next weekend. If you still feel so inclined, I would suggest you consider them as being expendable as although (hopefully) they may make it, the odds are good that they may not survive the cycling period. I noticed you are aware of the bacteria stuff in a bottle, but as Rob said,the shelf life if limited. I would suggest using this product, even if you need to get a fresh supply. I do realize that its very tempting to get started with having some fish in there. However, and not to confuse you, I would suggest doing a fishless cycle. With the introduction of the bacteria, you can add a small amount of clear (not sudsy) ammonia to the tank and maybe some (a little) fish food as food for the bacteria to get established. Be advised that the cycling process can take at least 4 and up to 6 weeks (generally) to fully cycle. Your ammonia will first spike at around 10 days followed by your nitrate spiking after an additional approximate 10 days. After which it will gradually taper off to a more normal reading in the next ensuing weeks. Only then is it really safe to start slowly adding fish when there's little danger of them dying from nitrate poisoning. Waiting this period of time is entirely up to you but expect some deaths (and hopefully not), if you add them much sooner. Regards, Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Laura" <llmdolphin@g...> wrote: > > So are you saying it would be best for us to just go ahead and get a couple > of fish and try this out.....rather than having it sent in our living room > all ready to go and teasing us/????? Sure sounds more fun then waiting > until next weekend but I want to do what is right....what all needs to be in > balance before I buy the first fish? > Laura > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15931	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 11/27/2005
Subject: Re: New to the group...

Laura, Your first fish purchase should probably be a good book. While the Internet can be a good source, there is also a lot of junk out there. You may fall for some of the junk because it says what you want to hear. With mail lists, such as this one, there is give and take, and when someone puts forth an idea that is not supported empirically, there should ensue a discussion to sort things out. While books may have errors in their text, and some are oft repeated errors, they are not the type of errors that could cause you to lose a tank full of fish. Probably the best general book for novices as well as the more advanced aquarist is the Baensch _Aquarium Atlas_, Volume 1. It has a good, concise section on setting up and maintaining a tank, a section on keeping live plants, and, of course, information on plants and the fish. Perhaps the most important item for a novice to grasp is the nitrogen cycle. Fish produce nitrogenous wastes. These wastes are toxic to the fish when they reach a certain level. The cycle that is referred to in so many places reduces the initial wastes to a much less toxic substance, which can be controlled by live plants and regular water changes. This is also known as biological filtration. The cycle can simply shown as: ammonia (from the fish and other critters) --> nitrites --> nitrates The ammonia is converted to nitrites by bacteria, which need to be cultivated into colonies large enough to handle the ammonia load in the tank. The bacteria are already present in your tank, but not in sufficient quantities. Once this first set of bacteria has done its magic, another set of bacteria takes over to convert the nitrites into nitrates. Nitrates can also be reduced by bacteria, however, in practical terms, this is not possible in an aquarium situation so we do water changes and use live plants to keep nitrates at an acceptable level. It takes 4-8 weeks to establish a viable cycle, no matter what method you choose. There are products that claim to "instantly" cycle your tank, but that is marketing hype. There are, according to people on this list, products that will help reduce the amount of time to cycle your tank, but I have no personal experience with them. There are two methods to cycling a tank. You can use fish, or you can use the "fishless" method. When you use fish, you are guaranteed to lose some fish while the cycle is starting and going through its steps. "Hardy" fish are recommended for this, and it is no problem if you have an extended interest in keeping those fish. However, if those fish are not interesting to you, there will be a question of what to do with those fish once the cycle has been established. The fishless cycle involves adding enough ammonia to the tank to bring the ammonia level to 5 ppm. Each day you will need to test and add ammonia to the water to maintain that 5 ppm level. The bacteria that utilize the ammonia as a food, will convert it to nitrite. This will happen slowly at first, but with a good food supply, the bacteria will grow and multiply. As the nitrite level rises, another bacteria will take over and reduce that to nitrate, again like the first, growing and multiplying as the food source increases, and the nitrate level will begin to rise. When your testing shows the entire amount of ammonia is utilized every day, and the nitrite levels also falls to 0 ppm, you are ready to stop supplying the ammonia yourself and start adding fish to supply the ammonia. It is important that the ammonia you select is ammonia with out any detergent or scents added. Using fish, the process is the same. Ammonia will increase, then decrease as the nitrite spikes, and the nitrite will eventually fall until it also reaches 0 ppm. However, this does put a lot of stress on the fish you use, and is why you may have a high mortality rate. You will also find that it is recommended that you add only a few fish at a time. The reason behind this is that new fish add to the ammonia load, and you do need time for the bacteria to catch up to the additional load in the tank. While the tank is cycling, it will give you plenty of time to read about the fish and make decisions as to which fish you wish to keep in the tank. This is where the Baensch volume comes in particularly handy. Lots of fish are pictured and written about. You should already know what pH your water is and the hardness, so you can pick fish that prefer your conditions. The hard part will be in limiting yourself to a number of fish that will be able to co-exist in your water with each other, without choosing a number that will not survive within the confines of 30 gallons of water (actually a bit less). \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Laura Sent: Sunday, November 27, 2005 12:50 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] New to the group... My brother just gave me his 30 gallon tank with all the "fixing"....the kids and I are very excited.. However... We have a lot to learn.... We have it set up and the pump is going...we did put the declorinating drops and some salt (fresh water tank but my brother suggested using the salt).... How long should we let the tank set up before we get fish??? I am reading a little on the nitrogen cycle but I am a bit confused by it...I am not sure if I have to wait until the cycle is finished before getting fish or if the cycle will not even start before getting a fish?? Thanks for your help, Laura Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15932	From: Laura	Date: 11/27/2005
Subject: Re: New tank set up

Ok....today the water is all cleared up....yeah!!! We tested using some of the strips my brother gave me. There is a strip that measures nitrates, nitrites, total hardness, total alkalinity and ph... . My results are nitrates (40ppm) ...how is this possible....because I am using his old stuff??? nitrites (0ppm) GH (75ppm) KH (@60ppm) ph (6.8)....this was hard to tell really...could be 7.8...the variation in color on the key was very hard to determine Ok....now what??? Do I have a nitrate reading because I am using my brothers old rocks, ornaments, plants, tank, filter, etc???? THe GH and KH scale dont indicate to me where the numbers should be...what is "normal"... Laura My filter is an AquaTech 20-40 and it sits on the back of the tank and kinda waterfalls into the tank..... I have all the testing kits (my brother gave them to me) here already....he suggested waiting a few days before getting fish so that everything could settle in the tank and a good reading could be taken (ph, ammonia, hardness/softness of water, etc etc)......its still a little cloudy but we only just put the water and all the ornaments together about 4 hours ago.... its been a long time since he "set up a tank" though so maybe he is mistaken in telling me that.... He told me to start out with a tetra tank, a snail and an algae eater (only because I really like them and want one), and possibly a tiger barb depending on what the pet store suggested....he has had luck with them living together but says its not always promoted by the fish stores.... Are these "hearty" fish to start a new tank with?? What is GH? ALso, do I need to buy bacteria or will they just appear naturally? I think he has a bottle of some kind of bacteria but not sure how old it is.... Thanks Laura Laura Basically you are correct in what you read. The tank can not start cycling without an ammonia source ( fish poop ), or other ammonia source. What kind of fish do you plan on keeping? Maybe your 1st choice of fish will be hardy enough to withstand the changes ( cycle ) your tank will go through the next couple months. The key is to go slow, add 1 fish wait a week, add another fish, wait a week add another etc etc until your tank is stocked . this will allow your tank to gradually build up an ammonia source and the good bacterias will grow to consume them. You will need a test Kit to test ammonia, Nitrates, Ph, GH, Your 30 gallon tank is a Great sized tank for most kinds of fish, but still small for others. I'd take your Tap water into the Fish store and have them check it. If you have High PH you will want to stay with a fish that likes a higher PH. Or vice versa. what kind of filter does your tank have? btw this will help us in the future help you wih your tank. Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15933	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 11/27/2005
Subject: Re: New tank set up

Just because it is clear doesn't mean it is ready. Buy some BiOSpira and cycle it that way. It's costly but WORTH it and no poor fish will die. You can add fish within only 24 hours of adding the biospira, so no long waiting. It's by far the best way to go In My Opinion. I have never had a fish die during tank set up either, so that is not a must. Then again I refuse to put a fish through the cycle process as well. BioSpira by Marine Land. Good luck and good for you for asking questions. =) Leslie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Laura Sent: Sunday, November 27, 2005 9:08 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] New tank set up Ok....today the water is all cleared up....yeah!!! We tested using some of the strips my brother gave me. There is a strip that measures nitrates, nitrites, total hardness, total alkalinity and ph... . My results are nitrates (40ppm) ...how is this possible....because I am using his old stuff??? nitrites (0ppm) GH (75ppm) KH (@60ppm) ph (6.8)....this was hard to tell really...could be 7.8...the variation in color on the key was very hard to determine Ok....now what??? Do I have a nitrate reading because I am using my brothers old rocks, ornaments, plants, tank, filter, etc???? THe GH and KH scale dont indicate to me where the numbers should be...what is "normal"... Laura My filter is an AquaTech 20-40 and it sits on the back of the tank and kinda waterfalls into the tank..... I have all the testing kits (my brother gave them to me) here already....he suggested waiting a few days before getting fish so that everything could settle in the tank and a good reading could be taken (ph, ammonia, hardness/softness of water, etc etc)......its still a little cloudy but we only just put the water and all the ornaments together about 4 hours ago.... its been a long time since he "set up a tank" though so maybe he is mistaken in telling me that.... He told me to start out with a tetra tank, a snail and an algae eater (only because I really like them and want one), and possibly a tiger barb depending on what the pet store suggested....he has had luck with them living together but says its not always promoted by the fish stores.... Are these "hearty" fish to start a new tank with?? What is GH? ALso, do I need to buy bacteria or will they just appear naturally? I think he has a bottle of some kind of bacteria but not sure how old it is.... Thanks Laura Laura Basically you are correct in what you read. The tank can not start cycling without an ammonia source ( fish poop ), or other ammonia source. What kind of fish do you plan on keeping? Maybe your 1st choice of fish will be hardy enough to withstand the changes ( cycle ) your tank will go through the next couple months. The key is to go slow, add 1 fish wait a week, add another fish, wait a week add another etc etc until your tank is stocked . this will allow your tank to gradually build up an ammonia source and the good bacterias will grow to consume them. You will need a test Kit to test ammonia, Nitrates, Ph, GH, Your 30 gallon tank is a Great sized tank for most kinds of fish, but still small for others. I'd take your Tap water into the Fish store and have them check it. If you have High PH you will want to stay with a fish that likes a higher PH. Or vice versa. what kind of filter does your tank have? btw this will help us in the future help you wih your tank. Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15934	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 11/27/2005
Subject: Re: New tank set up

Laura, Not only should you measure the tank water, you should get a baseline reading of water from your tap. The nitrates could be coming from your tap water. That, and all the other readings can change during the year, particularly if your water system in a municipal one, and they draw water from different sources. In theory, your tap water should show no more than 10 ppm of nitrates if it is a municipal system, but in practice, many do not reach this level, set by the EPA. 40 ppm of nitrate is not out of line for an aquarium, but, if yours is that high to start, you may wish to avoid the fish that are particularly susceptible to nitrate \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Laura Sent: Sunday, November 27, 2005 10:08 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] New tank set up Ok....today the water is all cleared up....yeah!!! We tested using some of the strips my brother gave me. There is a strip that measures nitrates, nitrites, total hardness, total alkalinity and ph... . My results are nitrates (40ppm) ...how is this possible....because I am using his old stuff??? nitrites (0ppm) GH (75ppm) KH (@60ppm) ph (6.8)....this was hard to tell really...could be 7.8...the variation in color on the key was very hard to determine Ok....now what??? Do I have a nitrate reading because I am using my brothers old rocks, ornaments, plants, tank, filter, etc???? THe GH and KH scale dont indicate to me where the numbers should be...what is "normal"... Laura My filter is an AquaTech 20-40 and it sits on the back of the tank and kinda waterfalls into the tank..... I have all the testing kits (my brother gave them to me) here already....he suggested waiting a few days before getting fish so that everything could settle in the tank and a good reading could be taken (ph, ammonia, hardness/softness of water, etc etc)......its still a little cloudy but we only just put the water and all the ornaments together about 4 hours ago.... its been a long time since he "set up a tank" though so maybe he is mistaken in telling me that.... He told me to start out with a tetra tank, a snail and an algae eater (only because I really like them and want one), and possibly a tiger barb depending on what the pet store suggested....he has had luck with them living together but says its not always promoted by the fish stores.... Are these "hearty" fish to start a new tank with?? What is GH? ALso, do I need to buy bacteria or will they just appear naturally? I think he has a bottle of some kind of bacteria but not sure how old it is.... Thanks Laura Laura Basically you are correct in what you read. The tank can not start cycling without an ammonia source ( fish poop ), or other ammonia source. What kind of fish do you plan on keeping? Maybe your 1st choice of fish will be hardy enough to withstand the changes ( cycle ) your tank will go through the next couple months. The key is to go slow, add 1 fish wait a week, add another fish, wait a week add another etc etc until your tank is stocked . this will allow your tank to gradually build up an ammonia source and the good bacterias will grow to consume them. You will need a test Kit to test ammonia, Nitrates, Ph, GH, Your 30 gallon tank is a Great sized tank for most kinds of fish, but still small for others. I'd take your Tap water into the Fish store and have them check it. If you have High PH you will want to stay with a fish that likes a higher PH. Or vice versa. what kind of filter does your tank have? btw this will help us in the future help you wih your tank. Rob NE Indiana USA

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15935	From: wendie	Date: 11/27/2005
Subject: Re: New tank set up

I totally agree with BioSpira. I keep it on hand just in case I do something stupid with the tanks. I've cycled 5 or 6 tanks with it so far and they are all running like clocks - almost a year later on some. Wendie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Leslie & Dane Moore Sent: Sunday, November 27, 2005 10:30 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] New tank set up Just because it is clear doesn't mean it is ready. Buy some BiOSpira and cycle it that way. It's costly but WORTH it and no poor fish will die. You can add fish within only 24 hours of adding the biospira, so no long waiting. It's by far the best way to go In My Opinion. I have never had a fish die during tank set up either, so that is not a must. Then again I refuse to put a fish through the cycle process as well. BioSpira by Marine Land. Good luck and good for you for asking questions. =) Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15936	From: Laura	Date: 11/27/2005
Subject: Re: New tank set up

What is the cure for nitrates that are too high? From what I am reading it appears that you just do a 20-25% water change. If my tap water is already high then how is this going to ever help? Is this when the only thing you can do is use bacteria? If so, then every time I do my regular water changes then my nitrates are going to be too high until new bacteria colonies are established and my fish will be "sick", right? Or am I not understanding this whole cycle biz correctly? Did a check on my tap water.....it appears that my tap water is about 20ppm for nitrates....soo...does this mean that the extra ppms are coming from the "used" supplies even though we rinsed them thouroughly (or so we thought) and that tank has not been used for a few months? All other readings were exactly the same as my tank is now...... Laura Laura, Not only should you measure the tank water, you should get a baseline reading of water from your tap. The nitrates could be coming from your tap water. That, and all the other readings can change during the year, particularly if your water system in a municipal one, and they draw water from different sources. In theory, your tap water should show no more than 10 ppm of nitrates if it is a municipal system, but in practice, many do not reach this level, set by the EPA. 40 ppm of nitrate is not out of line for an aquarium, but, if yours is that high to start, you may wish to avoid the fish that are particularly susceptible to nitrate \\Steve// [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15937	From: Patrick	Date: 11/27/2005
Subject: Re: New tank set up

40ppm for nitrates is hardly "high", or even dangerous to most FW aquarium fish. You can bring them down with a tank full of live plants, like java fern attached to driftwood, Amazon swords planted in the gravel, and some hornwort or duckweed floating at the top. Patrick http://groups.yahoo.com/group/aquariumdebates ----- Original Message ----- What is the cure for nitrates that are too high? From what I am reading it appears that you just do a 20-25% water change. If my tap water is already high then how is this going to ever help? Is this when the only thing you can do is use bacteria? If so, then every time I do my regular water changes then my nitrates are going to be too high until new bacteria colonies are established and my fish will be "sick", right? Or am I not understanding this whole cycle biz correctly? Did a check on my tap water.....it appears that my tap water is about 20ppm for nitrates....soo...does this mean that the extra ppms are coming from the "used" supplies even though we rinsed them thouroughly (or so we thought) and that tank has not been used for a few months? All other readings were exactly the same as my tank is now...... Laura

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15938	From: Larry Nave	Date: 11/27/2005
Subject: BioWheel

I have had whisper,aquclear units and have found the emperor280(fits my unit) the best. It is really quiet....it takes a while to learn the adjustments as my unit out of the box was noisy...now it is silent after tweeking the adjustments...I still do water changes and clean the filters. My water is crystal clear....the fish look like they are floating in air. I think the construction of the emperor is more solid than the rest. If you go to Marinelandswebsite they explain in detail the pros for the biowheel and they seem plausible and positive to keep your tank healthy. All filters take a certain amount of maintence to properly run effeciently and the Emperor is no exception...but it seems to take less time. Larry Carmichael/Sacramento

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15939	From: Patrick	Date: 11/27/2005
Subject: Re: New to the group...

Note about books: While I always suggest getting books when you are new to fishkeeping, I would hardly say they are any more accurate than websites. Most books are written by PhDs or long-time aquarists who haven't been new to fishkeeping in 30 or 40 years and don't remember what it is like to be new to fishkeeping and have no idea what these books are talking about. Websites offer wide experiences based on a short time in the world of aquariums. They might not all repeat the same old story that the fish books do, but they are rarely junk. I would not suggest a new fish keeper only read books and distrust websites. I would say read the websites first to get a good understanding of the common terms and issues, and then read some of the books you can find in your local library. Subscribe to a magazine like Aquarium Fish (AFM), which will have a Q & A section where fish keepers write in with common questions and they explain their answers. just my opinion Patrick

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15940	From: Laura	Date: 11/27/2005
Subject: Re: New tank set up

Yes, I know it falls into the "normal" range but I have no fish yet and am thinking that once I get fish and it cycles , etc then that number will be higher? Or am I just totally off on the cycle stuff... Sorry for so many questions and thanks to all of you so willing to try and help me understand how to set up my new tank... Laura 40ppm for nitrates is hardly "high", or even dangerous to most FW aquarium fish. You can bring them down with a tank full of live plants, like java fern attached to driftwood, Amazon swords planted in the gravel, and some hornwort or duckweed floating at the top. Patrick http://groups.yahoo.com/group/aquariumdebates ----- Original Message ----- What is the cure for nitrates that are too high? From what I am reading it appears that you just do a 20-25% water change. If my tap water is already high then how is this going to ever help? Is this when the only thing you can do is use bacteria? If so, then every time I do my regular water changes then my nitrates are going to be too high until new bacteria colonies are established and my fish will be "sick", right? Or am I not understanding this whole cycle biz correctly? Did a check on my tap water.....it appears that my tap water is about 20ppm for nitrates....soo...does this mean that the extra ppms are coming from the "used" supplies even though we rinsed them thouroughly (or so we thought) and that tank has not been used for a few months? All other readings were exactly the same as my tank is now...... Laura [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15941	From: Patrick	Date: 11/27/2005
Subject: Re: New tank set up

Well, it could go higher, but plants would remove a lot of it for you and keep it in the safe range (under 80). Patrick http://groups.yahoo.com/group/aquariumdebates ----- Original Message ----- Yes, I know it falls into the "normal" range but I have no fish yet and am thinking that once I get fish and it cycles , etc then that number will be higher? Or am I just totally off on the cycle stuff... Sorry for so many questions and thanks to all of you so willing to try and help me understand how to set up my new tank... Laura

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15942	From: Raymond Wetzel	Date: 11/27/2005
Subject: Re: New tank set up

Laura, Once your aquarium becomes cycled, you can (should) do weekly water changes (up to about 33% -- depending upon your fish load). This should keep your nitrate values around 20ppm (maybe a little higher), or just above what your tap water reads if both other parameters (ammonia and nitrites) are well within acceptable limits. To start changing water out now will only serve to slow down and increase the length of time for the cycle to get established as you'll be pulling out ammonia right off, effectively starving off the nitrifying bacteria. While you do indicate rocks and things you got from your brother being used now, you do not say anything about gravel. If you are using gravel that has been previously used, your higher readings are possibly coming from that (maybe some leftover food, etc. in the gravel), but should only be temporary. While there are bacteria that act on nitrates, this process is way too slow to be of any value to the fish hobbyist. You're main concern are the ammonia converting bacteria (nitrosomas) and the nitrite converting bacteria (nitrobacters) as these two chemicals are the most harmful compared to the relatively much less harmful nitrates. Your reading of 40ppm is still considered comfortable for most species (even though 20ppm would be much better). Many hobbyists wish they could keep their nitrates as low as 40ppm! Do not be concerned too much about your nitrates -- your fish will not get sick at 40ppm. Being the end product of the ammonia cycle, this (nitrates) can now be used by the plants as one of the three major plant foods (nitrate, phosphorus and potassium). This is why you'll want to use live plants instead of plastic -- the live plants will use up much of the excess nitrates. Best wishes, Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Laura" <llmdolphin@g...> wrote: > > > What is the cure for nitrates that are too high? From what I am reading it > appears that you just do a 20-25% water change. If my tap water is already > high then how is this going to ever help? Is this when the only thing you > can do is use bacteria? If so, then every time I do my regular water > changes then my nitrates are going to be too high until new bacteria > colonies are established and my fish will be "sick", right? Or am I not > understanding this whole cycle biz correctly? > > Did a check on my tap water.....it appears that my tap water is about 20ppm > for nitrates....soo...does this mean that the extra ppms are coming from the > "used" supplies even though we rinsed them thouroughly (or so we thought) > and that tank has not been used for a few months? All other readings were > exactly the same as my tank is now...... > Laura > > > Laura, > > Not only should you measure the tank water, you should get a baseline > reading of water from your tap. The nitrates could be coming from your tap > water. That, and all the other readings can change during the year, > particularly if your water system in a municipal one, and they draw water > from different sources. > > In theory, your tap water should show no more than 10 ppm of nitrates if it > is a municipal system, but in practice, many do not reach this level, set by > the EPA. 40 ppm of nitrate is not out of line for an aquarium, but, if yours > is that high to start, you may wish to avoid the fish that are particularly > susceptible to nitrate > > > \\Steve// > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15943	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 11/27/2005
Subject: Re: New tank set up

Laura, Using live plants is one way of reducing nitrates in your tank. It is tough to say where these nitrates are coming from with the information at hand. A 50% water change will give you a reduction in the nitrates your currently have, down to about 30 ppm. Then it will be a wait and see if the nitrate rises again. I could very well come from your water as well--even though they are measured at 20 ppm right now, they may have been higher when you first filled the tank. Your tank is not a "sick" tank. However, I'd start watching the nitrates as the cycle begins and progresses to see what happens. They may well stabilize at a lower level than you are seeing now (with regular water changes), or they can go higher. Once it is determined how your tank will go, you can get a better idea of what to do. It may well be avoiding fish who are sensitive to nitrates and other nitrogenous products and you'll be fine. Fishkeeping is a mixture of art and science. You need to develop the science knowledge as well as learn the art and you will be successful. It has been said that the only difference between an expert and a novice is in the price of the fish they kill. A bit on the morbid side, but there is a lot of truth to it. Get that Baensh book I mentioned earlier and study the first two parts of it until you have a good knowledge of what is happening in that tank. Then you can go on to look at all the pictures <g>. Those first chapters will give you a good, sound base to work from. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Laura Sent: Sunday, November 27, 2005 11:13 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] New tank set up What is the cure for nitrates that are too high? From what I am reading it appears that you just do a 20-25% water change. If my tap water is already high then how is this going to ever help? Is this when the only thing you can do is use bacteria? If so, then every time I do my regular water changes then my nitrates are going to be too high until new bacteria colonies are established and my fish will be "sick", right? Or am I not understanding this whole cycle biz correctly? Did a check on my tap water.....it appears that my tap water is about 20ppm for nitrates....soo...does this mean that the extra ppms are coming from the "used" supplies even though we rinsed them thouroughly (or so we thought) and that tank has not been used for a few months? All other readings were exactly the same as my tank is now...... Laura Laura, Not only should you measure the tank water, you should get a baseline reading of water from your tap. The nitrates could be coming from your tap water. That, and all the other readings can change during the year, particularly if your water system in a municipal one, and they draw water from different sources. In theory, your tap water should show no more than 10 ppm of nitrates if it is a municipal system, but in practice, many do not reach this level, set by the EPA. 40 ppm of nitrate is not out of line for an aquarium, but, if yours is that high to start, you may wish to avoid the fish that are particularly susceptible to nitrate \\Steve//

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15944	From: Rev. Eric Roberts	Date: 11/27/2005
Subject: Re: BioWheel

I used to have probs with my penguin with the flow of the water slowing down enough to keep the biowheel from turning. One of the improvements the emperor has over the penguin is it has a spray bar powered by a separate channel from the pump to power the wheels. Another design improvement over the Penguins...you can also shut down the flow to the filters to almost a complete stand still and not effect the flow to the biowheels. This is a great idea and you can reduce the intake of water during feeding times so you are not wasting food. They are more solidly constructed than their penguin cousins. I am probably going to end up replacing my eclipse hood with one of the emperors. I am more than pleased with their performance on my other tanks. Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Larry Nave Sent: Sunday, 27 November 2005 10:46 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] BioWheel I have had whisper,aquclear units and have found the emperor280(fits my unit) the best. It is really quiet....it takes a while to learn the adjustments as my unit out of the box was noisy...now it is silent after tweeking the adjustments...I still do water changes and clean the filters. My water is crystal clear....the fish look like they are floating in air. I think the construction of the emperor is more solid than the rest. If you go to Marinelandswebsite they explain in detail the pros for the biowheel and they seem plausible and positive to keep your tank healthy. All filters take a certain amount of maintence to properly run effeciently and the Emperor is no exception...but it seems to take less time. Larry Carmichael/Sacramento Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Mar ine+fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=sWozU8RAgM2g66Yb_7h_nQ> biology Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine +fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=JB6FNOraRx3JIvMA1E4-Lw> fish Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine+fis h&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=R-HUKyhqLGfm-ZAFT2vuTQ> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15945	From: Cydne McCown	Date: 11/27/2005
Subject: Re: New tank set up

Laura, alot of these great people here are very technically inclined, and I have to tell you that the science part of fishkeeping does not have to be very daunting. I have been in the hobby consistently for about 30 years now. There are things that work for me when I start a tank. You mentioned the possibility of keeping a barb or two. I have always wanted to keep cherry barbs ever since I read an article about them. Reading fish articles is fun and expands your knowledge base so that when you have the opportunity to get new fish, you know what they require. Cherry barbs are from Asia. They require a heavily planted tank so that they will be able to establish their own territory and not terrorize other fish (if you are setting up a community tank). The plus of keeping a heavily planted tank is that the plants will thrive on the nitrates in your tank as well as providing a comfortable habitat for your barb(s). Also, I have not lost a fish yet setting up my tank, letting it run for about three to 6 days, then adding my fish one at a time, every three to 6 days. But that is just a rule of thumb. I have been in the habit of starting my tanks off with three corydora catfish. They are hardy armored cats that are very playful. They also will help start the "cycle" in your tank. It's just a suggestion, but you do need to know that I had a terrible experience with an algae eater (chinese variety, the person who gave it to me said). They said all of their fish except this Chinese Algae Eater fish had died and asked me if I wanted to add it to my community tank. I said okay, and added it to my tank. Well, it took me three fish bodies to realize that darned fish was systemically killing off my community! It got flushed down the toilet soon after! It is probably busy killing fishes in the Mississippi River now! The point is, research your fish before adding them to your tank. Build your community up from one fish, I always start with my favorites, Corys-Angels-Tetras. These are all South American Fishes. The plants they thrive with are Amazon Swords (many many varieties out there now), Java Ferns, and Sprites (the plants that float) and also corys LOVE duckweed, if you can get that in your area. I have to mention that I do not use measuring devices. I do not use chemicals except for the water treatment that promotes slimecoat and rids the water of clorine. I guess I am a dinosaur, but if you do your water changes every one to two weeks at 10% up to 50% with AGED water (water you have put in containers to sit for at least 24 hours) (I use rinsed out gallon milk jugs-NEVER USE SOAP on anything to do with the fish), you should not have any trouble with your tank cycling and keeping beautiful fish. Use a reputable fish store in your area for your fish. I have always had good luck no matter where I have lived, (Memphis, Omaha, Seattle) I have found a non-chain fish store for buying fish. Make sure that they always quarantine their new fishes. Make a habit of coming to the store on a weekly basis, but not on the same day or same time, just to see how their tanks look. They should be very clean, and the fish very healthy and active (except for catfishes that always just either sit there or hide which is very normal for them). Also, mention to the people in that fishstore that you are just starting your very first tank. They will take the time to show you how much to feed the fish if you ask them to. Overfeeding is the number one killer of tropical fishes. This should get you started on the right track. If it were me, I'd go out right now and get that barb fish you are thinking about getting from your local non-chain fish store! Have FUN! That is what it's about you know! Cydne Laura <llmdolphin@...> wrote: Yes, I know it falls into the "normal" range but I have no fish yet and am thinking that once I get fish and it cycles , etc then that number will be higher? Or am I just totally off on the cycle stuff... Sorry for so many questions and thanks to all of you so willing to try and help me understand how to set up my new tank... Laura 40ppm for nitrates is hardly "high", or even dangerous to most FW aquarium fish. You can bring them down with a tank full of live plants, like java fern attached to driftwood, Amazon swords planted in the gravel, and some hornwort or duckweed floating at the top. Patrick http://groups.yahoo.com/group/aquariumdebates ----- Original Message ----- What is the cure for nitrates that are too high? From what I am reading it appears that you just do a 20-25% water change. If my tap water is already high then how is this going to ever help? Is this when the only thing you can do is use bacteria? If so, then every time I do my regular water changes then my nitrates are going to be too high until new bacteria colonies are established and my fish will be "sick", right? Or am I not understanding this whole cycle biz correctly? Did a check on my tap water.....it appears that my tap water is about 20ppm for nitrates....soo...does this mean that the extra ppms are coming from the "used" supplies even though we rinsed them thouroughly (or so we thought) and that tank has not been used for a few months? All other readings were exactly the same as my tank is now...... Laura [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Music Unlimited - Access over 1 million songs. Try it free. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15946	From: minnesotagal866	Date: 11/27/2005
Subject: Re: New tank set up

Laurie, What you have to realize is that within the hobby there are two distinct camps for starting a tank, the fishy vs. fishless cycle. Both cycling methods have their pros and cons. I personally fishy cycle, and I have never lost a fish during the cycle. Personally, I would not fishless cycle but that's me. You should do what feels right to you after reading up on both methods. I would lightly stock with hardy fish (3-4) with several plants-- floating anachris for example if you don't want plants in your aquarium after it's fully cycled, or red melon swords, crypts, java fern, and java moss attached to some driftwood if you want plants-- these are hardy plants that don't need a lot of light to surive. Then I would buy a simple test kit (I use strips, they work fine), and check the water every day. If and when the amnonia levels go above .25 or if you notice the fish gasping for air or breathing funny (it's very noticable), change 5-10 gallons of water. I would change 5-10 gallons at least twice a week, you may have to do more. I would wait 2 weeks, making sure you are not overfeeding (basically you feed a small pinch to 3-4 fish once a day), and clean the gravel with a siphon once a week. Do not change the filter, just rinse it out in the old tank water when you are doing a water change once a week if there's a lot of gunk in it--and there shouldn't be if you are not overfeeding the fish and creating too much waste. Then add fish once a week, one or two at a time, starting with the hardiest and ending with the most delicate. You can research which is which online or thru a book or magazine. I would save cories, otos, angels until last. You have a 29 gallon so you can keep a decent number of fish, about 15 or so depending on what you choose. For example: start with 3-4 zebra danios, pristella tetras, white cloud mountain minnows or whatever main school you want, I have used tiger barbs also after 2 weeks add 2 more of cycling fish week 3 add a dwarf gourami week 4 add a group of 2 cories week 5 add 2-3 cories week 6 add 4 otos In my experience, if you have enough plants (think 8 or so) you can add more fish in the beginning and be fully stocked in 2-3 weeks. But you have to be on top of water changes and the general maintenance that plants require (dead leaves clogging the filter, trimming back plants, etc.). In the end, you have to decide what to do. It's a great hobby and it's easy to get hooked! Jackie

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15947	From: Kara	Date: 11/27/2005
Subject: Re: New to the group...

hi, i have just recently joined this group but i have had aquariums off and on for years. This group seems to have alot of good advice. The best advice is to be patient, add fish slowly! I think it is the hardest part of an aquarium is waiting, i am always impatient to add fish:) As for books, the dummies series is easy to understand. Your local pet store is also a great resource. Generally a local pet store will have more knowledgable employees but the petsmart by me has been helpful too. Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: Note about books: While I always suggest getting books when you are new to fishkeeping, I would hardly say they are any more accurate than websites. Most books are written by PhDs or long-time aquarists who haven't been new to fishkeeping in 30 or 40 years and don't remember what it is like to be new to fishkeeping and have no idea what these books are talking about. Websites offer wide experiences based on a short time in the world of aquariums. They might not all repeat the same old story that the fish books do, but they are rarely junk. I would not suggest a new fish keeper only read books and distrust websites. I would say read the websites first to get a good understanding of the common terms and issues, and then read some of the books you can find in your local library. Subscribe to a magazine like Aquarium Fish (AFM), which will have a Q & A section where fish keepers write in with common questions and they explain their answers. just my opinion Patrick Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Music Unlimited - Access over 1 million songs. Try it free. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15948	From: scooobycat2000	Date: 11/27/2005
Subject: saltwater

Hi This group has great suggestions. I would love some for a saltwater tank. I am going to set up my first saltwater tank. I have a book that i have been reading and advice from others. I would love any hints tips or ideas on setting up a saltwater tank. Right now i am going to start with a fish only tank. Thanks:)

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15949	From: Iksnip@aol.com	Date: 11/28/2005
Subject: Some Questions :)

Hi Guys, Okay, have a few questions if people have the time. Working with a standard size rectangular 75 gallon tank, I am attempting to build my paludrium. Thus far I filled the tank 2/3 with water and using 1/3 of the upper space for the land mass. Currently, I have 2 large floating pieces of wood up there (its quite ugly so far :) ). Is this acceptable or is there not enough vertical room for the creatures I intend to place in there, toads for now. Anyway, I am having a filter problem. I have an Emporer 400 filter which I havent used in a few months. Now that I turned it on it makes a grinding sound, what is up with that? I'm getting a lot of condensation on the upper part (out of water) on the glass of the tank which is clouding or rather leaving spots on the glass making it difficult to see, how can I fix this? I have this white coloration on the filter and heater...what is that? Btw, I am a pitiful aquascaper I have decided! :( thanks Ken [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15950	From: Iksnip@aol.com	Date: 11/28/2005
Subject: one last question

Regarding filters, in this case the filter barely comes down into the water...the end piece does ofcourse but I was wondering if a different kind of filter would be more advantagous thanks Ken [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15951	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 11/28/2005
Subject: Re: one last question

google it, look up building paladarium. There are many methods of filtering underwater which i find much more clean and less splashing on the glass. however you will ALWAYS have some water on the glass and you should be ready for constant cleaning none the less. Do you plan on keeping any fish?? Iksnip@... wrote: Regarding filters, in this case the filter barely comes down into the water...the end piece does ofcourse but I was wondering if a different kind of filter would be more advantagous thanks Ken [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! DSL Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15952	From: A J Myers	Date: 11/28/2005
Subject: Dojo loach stays buried

My Dojo has stayed buried for the past week, he usually comes out to eat at feeding time in the morning and at night, but he has been a no show for a week. I persuaded him to come out of hiding just to make sure he wasn't dead, he popped up for a few seconds and buried himself again. He looked healthy enough, water tests good, 76 degrees. Any thoughts? *A J*

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15953	From: Rev. Eric Roberts	Date: 11/28/2005
Subject: Re: Dojo loach stays buried

Yep...I actually discovered a few I thought were long gone when I was braking down my tank to move! They like to bury themselves...much like their cousins the eel (kuhli)loaches...found one of them too hehehe Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of A J Myers Sent: Monday, 28 November 2005 10:18 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Dojo loach stays buried My Dojo has stayed buried for the past week, he usually comes out to eat at feeding time in the morning and at night, but he has been a no show for a week. I persuaded him to come out of hiding just to make sure he wasn't dead, he popped up for a few seconds and buried himself again. He looked healthy enough, water tests good, 76 degrees. Any thoughts? *A J* Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15954	From: seaurchin119	Date: 11/28/2005
Subject: Hello again--Please help me out

Hello, hope all is well. I have really enjoyed all the information about fish tank setups, water chemsitry, and the various discussions about fish and related topics. As I stated before, I am not only here to learn about fish keeping, but to explore the relations of the commuity established within this forum for a class project/final. I would really appreciate it if some of you could answer a few questions concerning the Aqautic Life community and why this forum is so unique. You can either email me or post on the forum if you are willing to answer some questions for my final paper. Thanks so much for all your aquatic fish keeping information--you guys are great. Kelly

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15955	From: bigter4	Date: 11/29/2005
Subject: Re: Hello again--Please help me out

I will help Kelly. - Terry - In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "seaurchin119" <seaurchin119@y...> wrote: > > Hello, hope all is well. I have really enjoyed all the information > about fish tank setups, water chemsitry, and the various discussions > about fish and related topics. As I stated before, I am not only here > to learn about fish keeping, but to explore the relations of the > commuity established within this forum for a class project/final. I > would really appreciate it if some of you could answer a few questions > concerning the Aqautic Life community and why this forum is so > unique. You can either email me or post on the forum if you are > willing to answer some questions for my final paper. Thanks so much > for all your aquatic fish keeping information--you guys are great. > > Kelly >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15956	From: Laura	Date: 11/29/2005
Subject: Identity crisis....lol

I just bought three fish of the same species....however...in all of the excitement of setting up a new tank and talking "fish education" with the owner, I neglected to ask what kind of fish it was. Since I am doing the cycling "with fish" (and all is well three days into it), the pet store worker chose this species as being very hardy and successful with all of their new aquarium customers... Anyway....I was asking so many questions but forgot to ask an important one regarding what kind of fishies I just bought lol....please help....I have an album under my name (llmdolphin) at the group site... Thanks, Laura

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15957	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 11/29/2005
Subject: Re: Identity crisis....lol

buenos aires or von rio tetras.... i have realy bad luck with the latter but the first i have a school ive had for years, They will rip apart live plants and love seaweed as a treat, also they love celery stalks! look them up online to determine if its one of them. good luck! Kris Laura <llmdolphin@...> wrote: I just bought three fish of the same species....however...in all of the excitement of setting up a new tank and talking "fish education" with the owner, I neglected to ask what kind of fish it was. Since I am doing the cycling "with fish" (and all is well three days into it), the pet store worker chose this species as being very hardy and successful with all of their new aquarium customers... Anyway....I was asking so many questions but forgot to ask an important one regarding what kind of fishies I just bought lol....please help....I have an album under my name (llmdolphin) at the group site... Thanks, Laura Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Music Unlimited - Access over 1 million songs. Try it free. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15958	From: Thomas Schlemmermeyer	Date: 11/30/2005
Subject: Re: Identity crisis....lol

Of course, such photos might be a great help, but they can be misleading too. But I think I would not agree with Kristopher´s hint. The Red one from the River (Der Rote von Rio, or in Portuguese: O vermelho do rio), Hyphessobrycon flammeus, looks like the ones on this picture: http://animal-world.com/encyclo/fresh/characins/vonrio.php or on this picture ( a slightly different species) http://animal-world.com/encyclo/fresh/characins/serpae.php I think they are native to Mato Grosso do Sul State Brazil, from where I send my best Aquatic Life greetings, Thomas --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, kristopher helsing <punk3r12@y...> wrote: > > buenos aires or von rio tetras.... i have realy bad luck with the latter but the first i have a school ive had for years, They will rip apart live plants and love seaweed as a treat, also they love celery stalks! look them up online to determine if its one of them. good luck! > > Kris > > Laura <llmdolphin@g...> wrote: > I just bought three fish of the same species....however...in all of > the excitement of setting up a new tank and talking "fish education" > with the owner, I neglected to ask what kind of fish it was. Since I > am doing the cycling "with fish" (and all is well three days into it), > the pet store worker chose this species as being very hardy and > successful with all of their new aquarium customers... > > Anyway....I was asking so many questions but forgot to ask an > important one regarding what kind of fishies I just bought > lol....please help....I have an album under my name (llmdolphin) at > the group site... > > Thanks, > Laura > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine biology Marine fish Biology > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Music Unlimited - Access over 1 million songs. Try it free. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15959	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 11/30/2005
Subject: Pictus Catfish ?'s

I have two pictus cats in a 75. They don't get along but don't hurt each other either. But the smaller/younger of the two has recently been stuck in a corner and elevated as though standing upright on his tail. When he does move about it's only for a few inches until the two do this odd shuffle, no attacking, then he returns to his upright position in his corner. I have a 10 gal w/ only a 3 small fish (a cherry barb, some sort of tetra that is clearish white, and another tiny clear white thing) and a cory cat. I am thinking of moving my smaller pictus into this tank. Is that advisable? I only ask as I have read that they will sometimes eat smaller fish and I do NOT want that. BUT I have not seen anything resembling that behavior either. Opinions? Thanks, Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15960	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 11/30/2005
Subject: Re: Pictus Catfish ?'s

i wouldn't, when i was a complete newbie i put a pictus in my tank and it ate all my glowlight & cardinal tetras. yikes! i found out after the fact that pictus will eat anything they can get in their mouths. --- Leslie & Dane Moore <5moores@...> wrote: > I have two pictus cats in a 75. They don't get > along but don't hurt > each other either. But the smaller/younger of the > two has recently been > stuck in a corner and elevated as though standing > upright on his tail. > When he does move about it's only for a few inches > until the two do this > odd shuffle, no attacking, then he returns to his > upright position in > his corner. > I have a 10 gal w/ only a 3 small fish (a cherry > barb, some sort of > tetra that is clearish white, and another tiny clear > white thing) and a > cory cat. I am thinking of moving my smaller pictus > into this tank. Is > that advisable? I only ask as I have read that they > will sometimes eat > smaller fish and I do NOT want that. BUT I have not > seen anything > resembling that behavior either. > > Opinions? > > Thanks, > Leslie > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez valeendgonzalez@...

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15961	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 11/30/2005
Subject: Re: Identity crisis....lol

i would even ask for another pic but id say look up tetras and youll find what it is through your searching... even if i am wrong. Kris Thomas Schlemmermeyer <evolthomas@...> wrote: Of course, such photos might be a great help, but they can be misleading too. But I think I would not agree with Kristopher´s hint. The Red one from the River (Der Rote von Rio, or in Portuguese: O vermelho do rio), Hyphessobrycon flammeus, looks like the ones on this picture: http://animal-world.com/encyclo/fresh/characins/vonrio.php or on this picture ( a slightly different species) http://animal-world.com/encyclo/fresh/characins/serpae.php I think they are native to Mato Grosso do Sul State Brazil, from where I send my best Aquatic Life greetings, Thomas --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, kristopher helsing <punk3r12@y...> wrote: > > buenos aires or von rio tetras.... i have realy bad luck with the latter but the first i have a school ive had for years, They will rip apart live plants and love seaweed as a treat, also they love celery stalks! look them up online to determine if its one of them. good luck! > > Kris > > Laura <llmdolphin@g...> wrote: > I just bought three fish of the same species....however...in all of > the excitement of setting up a new tank and talking "fish education" > with the owner, I neglected to ask what kind of fish it was. Since I > am doing the cycling "with fish" (and all is well three days into it), > the pet store worker chose this species as being very hardy and > successful with all of their new aquarium customers... > > Anyway....I was asking so many questions but forgot to ask an > important one regarding what kind of fishies I just bought > lol....please help....I have an album under my name (llmdolphin) at > the group site... > > Thanks, > Laura > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine biology Marine fish Biology > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Music Unlimited - Access over 1 million songs. Try it free. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Music Unlimited - Access over 1 million songs. Try it free. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15962	From: Thomas Schlemmermeyer	Date: 11/30/2005
Subject: Re: Identity crisis....lol

I just browsed around a little bit. It seems that the original Rios (Hyphessobrycon flammeus) are really from Rio de Janeiro State. But there are lots of Hyphessobrycon species, from Amazonia, Mato Grosso, or Paraguay. And all these species look similar. Anyway, I guess they are tetras, I hope they are healthy, interesting and will have a long life in your tank, best aquatic life wishes, Thomas --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, kristopher helsing <punk3r12@y...> wrote: > > i would even ask for another pic but id say look up tetras and youll find what it is through your searching... even if i am wrong. > Kris > > Thomas Schlemmermeyer <evolthomas@y...> wrote: > > Of course, such photos might be a great help, but they can be > misleading too. > > But I think I would not agree with Kristopher´s hint. The Red one > from the River (Der Rote von Rio, or in Portuguese: O vermelho do > rio), Hyphessobrycon flammeus, looks like the ones on this picture: > > http://animal-world.com/encyclo/fresh/characins/vonrio.php > > or on this picture ( a slightly different species) > > http://animal-world.com/encyclo/fresh/characins/serpae.php > > I think they are native to Mato Grosso do Sul State Brazil, from > where I send my best Aquatic Life greetings, > > Thomas > > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, kristopher helsing > <punk3r12@y...> wrote: > > > > buenos aires or von rio tetras.... i have realy bad luck with the > latter but the first i have a school ive had for years, They will rip > apart live plants and love seaweed as a treat, also they love celery > stalks! look them up online to determine if its one of them. good > luck! > > > > Kris > > > > Laura <llmdolphin@g...> wrote: > > I just bought three fish of the same species....however...in all > of > > the excitement of setting up a new tank and talking "fish > education" > > with the owner, I neglected to ask what kind of fish it was. Since > I > > am doing the cycling "with fish" (and all is well three days into > it), > > the pet store worker chose this species as being very hardy and > > successful with all of their new aquarium customers... > > > > Anyway....I was asking so many questions but forgot to ask an > > important one regarding what kind of fishies I just bought > > lol....please help....I have an album under my name (llmdolphin) at > > the group site... > > > > Thanks, > > Laura > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, > thanks. > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< > ((((º> > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT > important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old > subject)" <- > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º > ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > Marine biology Marine fish Biology > > > > --------------------------------- > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of > Service. > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > Yahoo! Music Unlimited - Access over 1 million songs. Try it free. > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine biology Marine fish Biology > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Music Unlimited - Access over 1 million songs. Try it free. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15963	From: Thomas Schlemmermeyer	Date: 11/30/2005
Subject: Re: Pictus Catfish ?'s

In so far I looked it up in the net, a 10 gal tank is very small for this species. But if you think that in your 75 Gal tank, this second one is suffering a lot....? Those tiny little fish really could be eaten by the cat pictus. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Valeen Gonzalez <valeendgonzalez@y...> wrote: > > i wouldn't, when i was a complete newbie i put a > pictus in my tank and it ate all my glowlight & > cardinal tetras. yikes! i found out after the fact > that pictus will eat anything they can get in their > mouths. > > --- Leslie & Dane Moore <5moores@c...> wrote: > > > I have two pictus cats in a 75. They don't get > > along but don't hurt > > each other either. But the smaller/younger of the > > two has recently been > > stuck in a corner and elevated as though standing > > upright on his tail. > > When he does move about it's only for a few inches > > until the two do this > > odd shuffle, no attacking, then he returns to his > > upright position in > > his corner. > > I have a 10 gal w/ only a 3 small fish (a cherry > > barb, some sort of > > tetra that is clearish white, and another tiny clear > > white thing) and a > > cory cat. I am thinking of moving my smaller pictus > > into this tank. Is > > that advisable? I only ask as I have read that they > > will sometimes eat > > smaller fish and I do NOT want that. BUT I have not > > seen anything > > resembling that behavior either. > > > > Opinions? > > > > Thanks, > > Leslie > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez > valeendgonzalez@y... >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15964	From: John	Date: 11/30/2005
Subject: Would be a Clown Loach good choice?

Do you think that a Clown would do well in my tank? I'm looking for something to help control trumpet snails and add some interest to my 25 gal. FW tank. I am concerned that a Clown might eat my plants. I have some aponogetons that I'd like to keep in tact if possible Other tank denizens include a Red Tail Shark, an Ancistrus, a couple of Giant Danios, two Serpeae Tetras, and two Rams. So what do you all think about adding a CL or two? For that matter, considering the size they may get (although I've never seen any really huge ones), I will certainly take other suggestions. The main requirements are that they eat some of the trumpet snails (way too many) and don't destroy the plants or the other fish. BTW, I've had trouble with an aggressive yoyo loach before this. Thanks for any help. John

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15965	From: Justin M.	Date: 11/30/2005
Subject: Re: Would be a Clown Loach good choice?

At 09:59 PM 30/11/2005 +0000, you wrote: >Do you think that a Clown would do well in my tank? I've never kept clown loaches but I did some reading about them when I was considering adding some to my tank. The ones in stores usually are fairly young...they can get extremely large, and I've seen individuals in store tanks at the 4-5" range. They will eat snails, but if I recall, they are a rather timid, shoaling species, and do much better in groups rather than on their own. They will not eat aquatic plants, and are not aggressive towards other fish. IMO, a single clown loach would not be a good fit for your tank. You could do it, but I don't think it would be a good situation for the loach. Should you decide to add one anyways, much of what I read indicated that transport and acclimation is very hard on these fish. They are very vulnerable to ich, especially when they are young. Get the biggest (thus, oldest) individual(s) you can find, as they seem to be a lot more durable. Hope this helps! JM

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15966	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 11/30/2005
Subject: Re: Would be a Clown Loach good choice?

John, Clown Loaches can be regarded as Gods when it comes to consuming snails. They will go fine with the fish you have but eventually a 25 gallon will be too small for these fish that can live for over 15 years and grow to 1ft. There are other loach options like the YoYo Loach or the tiger/striped loach that remain considerably smaller then clowns but do an equally good job against snails. Keep in mind that one or 2 loach may not be able to eradicate your snail population completely as the snails may reproduce faster then the loaches can consume. Ideally go for 4-5 of these but also consider returning the excess once your snails have been eradicated or brought under control. Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of John Sent: 30 November 2005 22:00 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Would be a Clown Loach good choice? Do you think that a Clown would do well in my tank? I'm looking for something to help control trumpet snails and add some interest to my 25 gal. FW tank. I am concerned that a Clown might eat my plants. I have some aponogetons that I'd like to keep in tact if possible Other tank denizens include a Red Tail Shark, an Ancistrus, a couple of Giant Danios, two Serpeae Tetras, and two Rams. So what do you all think about adding a CL or two? For that matter, considering the size they may get (although I've never seen any really huge ones), I will certainly take other suggestions. The main requirements are that they eat some of the trumpet snails (way too many) and don't destroy the plants or the other fish. BTW, I've had trouble with an aggressive yoyo loach before this. Thanks for any help. John Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Mar ine+fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=sWozU8RAgM2g66Yb_7h_nQ> biology Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine +fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=JB6FNOraRx3JIvMA1E4-Lw> fish Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine+fis h&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=R-HUKyhqLGfm-ZAFT2vuTQ> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15967	From: Fred and Cynthia	Date: 11/30/2005
Subject: Re: Would be a Clown Loach good choice?

I have one, a few years now. Never touches my plants but eats the snails! He will eat them all you know, you will end up with none..... Cynthia http://babyitems.myphotoalbum.com/view_photo.php?set_albumName=album01&id=bag ----- Original Message ----- From: "John" <jayemsr@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wednesday, November 30, 2005 4:59 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] Would be a Clown Loach good choice? Do you think that a Clown would do well in my tank? I'm looking for something to help control trumpet snails and add some interest to my 25 gal. FW tank. I am concerned that a Clown might eat my plants. I have some aponogetons that I'd like to keep in tact if possible Other tank denizens include a Red Tail Shark, an Ancistrus, a couple of Giant Danios, two Serpeae Tetras, and two Rams. So what do you all think about adding a CL or two? For that matter, considering the size they may get (although I've never seen any really huge ones), I will certainly take other suggestions. The main requirements are that they eat some of the trumpet snails (way too many) and don't destroy the plants or the other fish. BTW, I've had trouble with an aggressive yoyo loach before this. Thanks for any help. John Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15968	From: Willow Sumner	Date: 11/30/2005
Subject: what are Rams (was - Re: [AquaticLife] Would be a Clown Loach good

Hi, I am new to this group, and to the fish world, even tho have had fish off and on, I like gold fish plain and easy.. what are rams? And what are Serpeae Tetras?? And Giant Danios????? Best, Ssara

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15969	From: John	Date: 11/30/2005
Subject: what are Rams (was - Re: [AquaticLife] Would be a Clown Loach good

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Willow Sumner <theangelofhomelesspets@y...> wrote: > > Hi, > I am new to this group, and to the fish world, even tho have had fish off and on, I like gold fish plain and easy.. > what are rams? > And what are Serpeae Tetras?? > And Giant Danios????? > > Best, > Ssara Follow the links for some poictures. Rams are South American Dwarf Cichlids (Mikrogeophagus ramarezi). http://www.timstropicals.com/Inventory/Dwarf/RamInfo.asp Serpaes are small Tetras as the name implies Hyphessobrycon eques). http://www.aquahobby.com/gallery/gserpae.html Giant Danios are large fast swimming members of the danio family (Danio malabaricus). http://www.aquahobby.com/gallery/gdanio3.html

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15970	From: Patrick	Date: 11/30/2005
Subject: fish identification

I was at what is now the lfs, which is the pestmart 60 miles from here, and I saw some fish, but the name was unusual and I don't remember it. It was in the semi-aggressive section of the tanks. I think it was a scientific name, and the genus started with an "s" (I don't think it was synodontis, but it might have been). It was not an upside down or armored catfish. It was long and slim. It had black and white vertical bars from head to fin. Can anybody tell me what that fish was so I can research it? Patrick http://groups.yahoo.com/group/aquariumdebates PS: I'm sending this to 6 fish groups, so don't be surprised if you get multiple copies in your e-mail inbox. :) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15971	From: Raymond Wetzel	Date: 11/30/2005
Subject: Re: Identity crisis....lol

Laura, Lacking anything more close up, It appears as if these are Buenos Aires Tetras (Hemigrammus caudovittatus), especially if the fish have a small fleshy fin (adipose fin) just ahead of the tail on top of the body. This detail cannot be seen in the photos of this fish, although still might be there (can't tell from here) and probably is. Watch this fish with your other fish as it has the reputation of being a fin nipper, although with three they may keep each other occupied. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Laura" <llmdolphin@g...> wrote: > > I just bought three fish of the same species....however...in all of > the excitement of setting up a new tank and talking "fish education" > with the owner, I neglected to ask what kind of fish it was. Since I > am doing the cycling "with fish" (and all is well three days into it), > the pet store worker chose this species as being very hardy and > successful with all of their new aquarium customers... > > Anyway....I was asking so many questions but forgot to ask an > important one regarding what kind of fishies I just bought > lol....please help....I have an album under my name (llmdolphin) at > the group site... > > Thanks, > Laura >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15972	From: Raymond Wetzel	Date: 11/30/2005
Subject: Re: fish identification

Patrick, At first glance, it sounds as if you're trying to say it may be a species of catfish (???), but from your description, the first thing that comes to mind is Leporinus fasciatus or L. affinis, more possibly so if your fish swims with a slight head-down posture. These fish are known jumpers, but not necessarily known to be aggressive. Your fish might also be Distichodus lusoso, a slightly deeper bodied fish but still somewhat slender (until it gets more mature -- in can get up to 16" or so). This fish is known to be aggressive. A similar, but deeper bodied fish is D. sexfasciatus. All fish suggested above are broadly related to the Characoids. If in fact the fish is more catfish-like in appearance, it could well be the Bumble Bee Catfish (Leiocassis siamensis), although this fish is quite peaceful. Or, if not a catfish, it could be the Bumble Bee Goby (Brachygogius zanthozonus) which doesn't get much more than a couple of inches, but is known as a fin nipper. A photo here would certainly help, as there are any number of fish this could describe. Regards, Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Patrick" <patrickmn@c...> wrote: > > I was at what is now the lfs, which is the pestmart 60 miles from here, and I saw some fish, but the name was unusual and I don't remember it. It was in the semi-aggressive section of the tanks. I think it was a scientific name, and the genus started with an "s" (I don't think it was synodontis, but it might have been). It was not an upside down or armored catfish. It was long and slim. It had black and white vertical bars from head to fin. Can anybody tell me what that fish was so I can research it? > > Patrick > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/aquariumdebates > > PS: I'm sending this to 6 fish groups, so don't be surprised if you get multiple copies in your e-mail inbox. :) > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15973	From: Patrick	Date: 12/1/2005
Subject: Re: fish identification

They were definatly from the Leporinus genus. I think I remember the word fasciatus, and that fish gets way too big for my 29 gallon tank! Thanks. Patrick http://groups.yahoo.com/group/aquariumdebates ----- Original Message ----- Patrick, At first glance, it sounds as if you're trying to say it may be a species of catfish (???), but from your description, the first thing that comes to mind is Leporinus fasciatus or L. affinis, more possibly so if your fish swims with a slight head-down posture. These fish are known jumpers, but not necessarily known to be aggressive. Your fish might also be Distichodus lusoso, a slightly deeper bodied fish but still somewhat slender (until it gets more mature -- in can get up to 16" or so). This fish is known to be aggressive. A similar, but deeper bodied fish is D. sexfasciatus. All fish suggested above are broadly related to the Characoids. If in fact the fish is more catfish-like in appearance, it could well be the Bumble Bee Catfish (Leiocassis siamensis), although this fish is quite peaceful. Or, if not a catfish, it could be the Bumble Bee Goby (Brachygogius zanthozonus) which doesn't get much more than a couple of inches, but is known as a fin nipper. A photo here would certainly help, as there are any number of fish this could describe. Regards, Ray

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15974	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 12/1/2005
Subject: Female beta needs her guy!

I put my fat, fat female beta in the community tank (10 gal.) Then I put in the male beta. Reason being is that she is FAT with what I am assuming is a belly full of eggs. She's only getting fatter and her belly is turning white. Well I acclimated them to each other in separate but close quarters then today stuck them together in a 10 gal. She is following him everywhere. They float at the top together then she hangs onto his fin while he swims across the tank. It's like someone tagging onto a dolphins fin while it swims across the ocean. ? Strange! While he sits in the corner she floats around him literally touching him like she is begging for him to take of things. He is NOT interested. Should I run and get another male? She is hanging around him constantly and he is hiding a corner. Isn't it supposed to be the other way around? Confused. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15975	From: wendie	Date: 12/1/2005
Subject: Re: Female beta needs her guy!

LOL looks like it! I put a lovely cambodian in with my CT... they became very good friends. I finally gave up and put in a dark female... that worked. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Leslie & Dane Moore Sent: Thursday, December 01, 2005 4:23 PM To: uniquaria@yahoogroups.com; AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Female beta needs her guy! I put my fat, fat female beta in the community tank (10 gal.) Then I put in the male beta. Reason being is that she is FAT with what I am assuming is a belly full of eggs. She's only getting fatter and her belly is turning white. Well I acclimated them to each other in separate but close quarters then today stuck them together in a 10 gal. She is following him everywhere. They float at the top together then she hangs onto his fin while he swims across the tank. It's like someone tagging onto a dolphins fin while it swims across the ocean. ? Strange! While he sits in the corner she floats around him literally touching him like she is begging for him to take of things. He is NOT interested. Should I run and get another male? She is hanging around him constantly and he is hiding a corner. Isn't it supposed to be the other way around? Confused. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15976	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/2/2005
Subject: Re: what are Rams (was - Re: [AquaticLife] Would be a Clown Loach g

The goldfish you have kept are temperate water fish. That is they do best when kept in water at room temperature and below. All goldfish are of the same species, though there is a good number of variations in color, finnage, and body shape. They can also winter over out doors if they have enough depth to the water to avoid freezing to the bottom. The three fish you mention, and most of the fish we talk about on this list are tropical fish. That is they will do well in water that is room temperature and above--some of the fish require much higher temperatures than room temperature, approaching the mid 80's F. There are many species available, and in those species, there are some that have variations, mainly in color and finnage. The rams you mention are members of the cichlid family. They do well in warmer water that is soft and acid. There are several species of rams available, and there are variations among some of the individual species. You need to pay close attention to water quality with rams, as they are rather sensitive to nitrogenous wastes and changes in pH. They are relatively small fish and are noted for their coloring and finnage. Serpae tetras belong to the Characin family. Again, one of these in good condition is a very nice looking fish with a reddish cast to the body and a darker red edging on the lower portion of the body and into the anal fin, which then goes to black with a white edging on the outside of the fin. The caudal fin has the same coloring, and the dorsal fin is black with the white edging toward the rear of the fin. They are relatively deep bodied fish. They do not have the same sensitivities to pH, temperature, and hardness that the rams do. The giant danio comes from yet another family of fish, the Cyprinids--the same family of fish that the goldfish belongs to. There are actually two species referred to as giant danio, and they look very similar to each other, _Devario malabaricus_ and _Devario aequipinnatus_, with the former probably being the most widely distributed. These fish have a stream-lined body, and require a lot of room for swimming. These fish are also relatively tolerant of water conditions. (They did used to be known as _Danio_, as another poster named them, but they have been separated from that genus and put into the _Devario_ genus.) There are many fish available. You'll need to read, and read some more. The Internet can be a good resource, but you might want a good book or two as well (the Baench _Aquarium Atlas_ Volume 1, is my favorite recommendation), and maybe some magazines (don't know if you are in the US or not, so I hesitate for a recommendation). Here is a good place to ask questions. There may also be a local aquarium society or club near you, which is worth joining to get in on the local scene, and have live bodies with answers at hand. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Willow Sumner Sent: Wednesday, November 30, 2005 7:05 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: what are Rams (was - Re: [AquaticLife] Would be a Clown Loach good choice?) Hi, I am new to this group, and to the fish world, even tho have had fish off and on, I like gold fish plain and easy.. what are rams? And what are Serpeae Tetras?? And Giant Danios????? Best, Ssara

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15977	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 12/2/2005
Subject: Yikes! Betta swims funny! White tetra is getting eaten!

Just took my poor male betta out of the 10 gal. Any hopes of him helping out my poor prego female have been shot. Problem now is that he is swimming very awkwardly as though he can't get down to the bottom of the tank. His back is literally arched like a U. WHAT is that from? His fins also look bad but I can not tell if that is from getting picked on or from disease. Also, I have a white skirt tetra in the 10 gal. I did have her in a trop. 75 with blood parrots and one of them apparently tried to get her in his mouth so her nose is torn and wounded. I moved her into the 10 gal and am treating with Melafix. BUT every day I observe her she looks worse, like someone else is eating at her wound. Please tell me who the likely culprit could be so I can help her. Occupants: 1 cherry barb, 1 cory cat, 1 white something or other (pic in blood parrot file under fish id.), and the female betta. I have never seen anyone remotely hostile to anyone in this tank. Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15978	From: Justin M.	Date: 12/2/2005
Subject: Re: ! White tetra is getting eaten!

At 10:41 PM 02/12/2005 -0600, you wrote: >Also, I have a white skirt tetra in the 10 gal. I did have her in a >trop. 75 with blood parrots and one of them apparently tried to get her >in his mouth so her nose is torn and wounded. I moved her into the 10 >gal and am treating with Melafix. BUT every day I observe her she looks >worse, like someone else is eating at her wound. You might want to consider that the wound has become infected, and this is what's causing it to look worse every day. If the fish was continually being picked on, I think you'd see injuries all over, not just to one specific area. A stronger anti-bacterial med would be in order if this is the case. IMO, Melafix is like the Polysporin of the aquarium world...it helps the healing of wounds, but it won't cure a sick fish. Hope this helps! JM

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15979	From: harry perry	Date: 12/2/2005
Subject: Melafix

Will Melafix kill blue-green algae? Thanks Harry --------------------------------- Yahoo! Personals Single? There's someone we'd like you to meet. Lots of someones, actually. Try Yahoo! Personals [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15980	From: Justin M.	Date: 12/2/2005
Subject: Re: Melafix

At 10:58 PM 02/12/2005 -0800, you wrote: >Will Melafix kill blue-green algae? The active ingredient in Melafix is tea tree oil. I don't think it actually kills anything. JM

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15981	From: harry perry	Date: 12/2/2005
Subject: Amazing. Another kind of fish.

This is the leafy sea dragon. The same family as seahorses and pipefish ????? Harry This attachment has been scanned for virus. --------------------------------- Yahoo! Shopping Find Great Deals on Gifts at Yahoo! Shopping [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15982	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 12/2/2005
Subject: Re: Melafix

no harry perry <harryfisherman@...> wrote: Will Melafix kill blue-green algae? Thanks Harry --------------------------------- Yahoo! Personals Single? There's someone we'd like you to meet. Lots of someones, actually. Try Yahoo! Personals [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Personals Skip the bars and set-ups and start using Yahoo! Personals for free [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15983	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 12/2/2005
Subject: Re: Melafix

no harry perry <harryfisherman@...> wrote: Will Melafix kill blue-green algae? Thanks Harry --------------------------------- Yahoo! Personals Single? There's someone we'd like you to meet. Lots of someones, actually. Try Yahoo! Personals [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Personals Let fate take it's course directly to your email. See who's waiting for you Yahoo! Personals --------------------------------- Yahoo! Shopping Find Great Deals on Gifts at Yahoo! Shopping [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15984	From: Raymond Wetzel	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: Re: Yikes! Betta swims funny! White tetra is getting eaten!

Sounds like the male Betta may have swim bladder problems. Might be that this was coming on and would explain his lack of enthusiasm for breeding. Usually not easily or successfully treatable. What's the temperature of the water? Hard to say what the problem is without a current pic of the white-skirt Tetra. With damage in the mouth and nose area as you described, I would go with treating for mouth fungus (actually bacterial), as its a fast moving infection and no time should be wasted in treating it. Not sure if that's the problem though, but wounds such as you described should be treated with a bacticide anyway, rather than just Melafix, and time is of the essence if it is mouth fungus; use Furan II. I don't read of any other fish you describe in the 10 gallon that would inflict such wounds. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie & Dane Moore" <5moores@c...> wrote: > > Just took my poor male betta out of the 10 gal. Any hopes of him > helping out my poor prego female have been shot. > > Problem now is that he is swimming very awkwardly as though he can't get > down to the bottom of the tank. His back is literally arched like a U. > WHAT is that from? His fins also look bad but I can not tell if that is > from getting picked on or from disease. > > Also, I have a white skirt tetra in the 10 gal. I did have her in a > trop. 75 with blood parrots and one of them apparently tried to get her > in his mouth so her nose is torn and wounded. I moved her into the 10 > gal and am treating with Melafix. BUT every day I observe her she looks > worse, like someone else is eating at her wound. Please tell me who the > likely culprit could be so I can help her. Occupants: 1 cherry barb, 1 > cory cat, 1 white something or other (pic in blood parrot file under > fish id.), and the female betta. I have never seen anyone remotely > hostile to anyone in this tank. > > Leslie > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15985	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: Re: Yikes! Betta swims funny! White tetra is getting eaten!

I do have Furan II in caplets. Ordered them from Fosters and Smith months ago as a "just in case." Although her injuries were caused by a bite from another fish, I should still treat the wound with the Furan as a bacterial problem then? The bettas temp gradually fluctuates from 73-79 F. It depends on if the light is on. He is acting a little better today but I have no idea as to what to do for him. Thank you so much, Leslie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Raymond Wetzel Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2005 10:58 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Yikes! Betta swims funny! White tetra is getting eaten! Sounds like the male Betta may have swim bladder problems. Might be that this was coming on and would explain his lack of enthusiasm for breeding. Usually not easily or successfully treatable. What's the temperature of the water? Hard to say what the problem is without a current pic of the white-skirt Tetra. With damage in the mouth and nose area as you described, I would go with treating for mouth fungus (actually bacterial), as its a fast moving infection and no time should be wasted in treating it. Not sure if that's the problem though, but wounds such as you described should be treated with a bacticide anyway, rather than just Melafix, and time is of the essence if it is mouth fungus; use Furan II. I don't read of any other fish you describe in the 10 gallon that would inflict such wounds. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie & Dane Moore" <5moores@c...> wrote: > > Just took my poor male betta out of the 10 gal. Any hopes of him > helping out my poor prego female have been shot. > > Problem now is that he is swimming very awkwardly as though he can't get > down to the bottom of the tank. His back is literally arched like a U. > WHAT is that from? His fins also look bad but I can not tell if that is > from getting picked on or from disease. > > Also, I have a white skirt tetra in the 10 gal. I did have her in a > trop. 75 with blood parrots and one of them apparently tried to get her > in his mouth so her nose is torn and wounded. I moved her into the 10 > gal and am treating with Melafix. BUT every day I observe her she looks > worse, like someone else is eating at her wound. Please tell me who the > likely culprit could be so I can help her. Occupants: 1 cherry barb, 1 > cory cat, 1 white something or other (pic in blood parrot file under > fish id.), and the female betta. I have never seen anyone remotely > hostile to anyone in this tank. > > Leslie > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15986	From: Thomas Schlemmermeyer	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?

Hello, We are working with Phalloceros sp., a Southamerican Livebearer Species (Poecilidae). The temperature in our tank always goes up to about 31 degrees Celsius during the heat of the day, as now we are in summertime here in Brazil. It seems that above 26 degrees Celsius or so, our Phalloceros sp. are dying (which makes sense, as in their natural habitat temperature does not go beyond 24 degrees Celsius or so). What can we do to cool down the water, put in some ice cubes? best wishes from Mato Grosso do Sul State, Thomas

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15987	From: Cydne McCown	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: Re: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?

Hello Thomas; I had that same problem during my summers when I lived in Memphis and did not use my air conditioner. What I did was two things: To aid in the temps, I would drop some large ice cubes in and monitor the temps. But the reason my fish were distressed had more to do with the lack of oxygen in warmer waters, so I also let the level of water drop about two or more inches in the tank, to allow my waterfall filter to agitate the water more, thus producing more oxygen, also, I added a large airstone too. That seemed to help alot. I also increased my water changes to three times a week during those particularly hot days. Hope this helps youl Cydne Thomas Schlemmermeyer <evolthomas@...> wrote: Hello, We are working with Phalloceros sp., a Southamerican Livebearer Species (Poecilidae). The temperature in our tank always goes up to about 31 degrees Celsius during the heat of the day, as now we are in summertime here in Brazil. It seems that above 26 degrees Celsius or so, our Phalloceros sp. are dying (which makes sense, as in their natural habitat temperature does not go beyond 24 degrees Celsius or so). What can we do to cool down the water, put in some ice cubes? best wishes from Mato Grosso do Sul State, Thomas Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Personals Single? There's someone we'd like you to meet. Lots of someones, actually. Try Yahoo! Personals [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15988	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: Re: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?

there are two methods that i know... one is freeze water in a jug(size depending on how big the aquarium is) and drop it in the tank during the day though id say t would work easier if you had a sump. the other method is a cooling system. they sell them at hghprices but they work well. Ive used the jug method. ive never needed the chiller. Ive had great luck. Good luck in your fishkeeping. Thomas Schlemmermeyer <evolthomas@...> wrote: Hello, We are working with Phalloceros sp., a Southamerican Livebearer Species (Poecilidae). The temperature in our tank always goes up to about 31 degrees Celsius during the heat of the day, as now we are in summertime here in Brazil. It seems that above 26 degrees Celsius or so, our Phalloceros sp. are dying (which makes sense, as in their natural habitat temperature does not go beyond 24 degrees Celsius or so). What can we do to cool down the water, put in some ice cubes? best wishes from Mato Grosso do Sul State, Thomas Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! DSL Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15989	From: Bruce Hansen	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: Re: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?

Hello Thomas One method I used to cool an outside tank was to use a powerhead to pump water from the aquarium to a styro box suspended 2' above the water then drizzled out the perforations I had drilled in the base and down folded plastic shadecloth back into the aquarium. This acts as a biological filter but also as it drizzles down some evaporates and cools (by removing the latent heat of evaporation) , it cools quicker if there is a breeze blowing.You can get up to 5 degress C lowering by this. Here in Australia outback pioneers used this " Coolgardie Safe" principle to help preserve food , cool drinking water and so on. Cheers Bruce (Hansen) ANGFA (Qld) Inc - http://www.angfaqld.org.au/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Thomas Schlemmermeyer" <evolthomas@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Sunday, December 04, 2005 4:29 AM Subject: [AquaticLife] some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium? Hello, We are working with Phalloceros sp., a Southamerican Livebearer Species (Poecilidae). The temperature in our tank always goes up to about 31 degrees Celsius during the heat of the day, as now we are in summertime here in Brazil. It seems that above 26 degrees Celsius or so, our Phalloceros sp. are dying (which makes sense, as in their natural habitat temperature does not go beyond 24 degrees Celsius or so). What can we do to cool down the water, put in some ice cubes? best wishes from Mato Grosso do Sul State, Thomas Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15990	From: Patrick	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: Re: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?

In the US, we can get air conditioners for about 100 USD. I think that is significantly cheaper than using a typical chiller, but would require cooling the entire room. If the room is not insulated well, it might not work well. If the room is insulated well, that would be the best option, in my opinion. Patrick http://groups.yahoo.com/group/aquariumdebates ----- Original Message ----- We are working with Phalloceros sp., a Southamerican Livebearer Species (Poecilidae). The temperature in our tank always goes up to about 31 degrees Celsius during the heat of the day, as now we are in summertime here in Brazil. It seems that above 26 degrees Celsius or so, our Phalloceros sp. are dying (which makes sense, as in their natural habitat temperature does not go beyond 24 degrees Celsius or so). What can we do to cool down the water, put in some ice cubes? best wishes from Mato Grosso do Sul State, Thomas

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15991	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: Re: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?

In a message dated 12/3/2005 11:45:20 AM Pacific Standard Time, punk3r12@... writes: there are two methods that i know... one is freeze water in a jug(size depending on how big the aquarium is) and drop it in the tank during the day I did this during the hottest days of the summer and it worked great. I had a whole bunch of frozen gatorade bottles different sizes in the refridgerator. The different sizes worked great as you could use smaller bottles in smaller tanks and larger bottles in the larger tanks. Mike [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15992	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: Re: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?

also to add the air conditioner will cost way more eventully because of the power bill. Thanks Kris Deenerz@... wrote: In a message dated 12/3/2005 11:45:20 AM Pacific Standard Time, punk3r12@... writes: there are two methods that i know... one is freeze water in a jug(size depending on how big the aquarium is) and drop it in the tank during the day I did this during the hottest days of the summer and it worked great. I had a whole bunch of frozen gatorade bottles different sizes in the refridgerator. The different sizes worked great as you could use smaller bottles in smaller tanks and larger bottles in the larger tanks. Mike [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Personals Let fate take it's course directly to your email. See who's waiting for you Yahoo! Personals --------------------------------- Yahoo! Personals Single? There's someone we'd like you to meet. Lots of someones, actually. Yahoo! Personals [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15993	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: Fish ID on group home page

Can someone please tell me what the two white fish are? One is a white skirt tetra I think and I have no idea what the other is. Thank you for putting that on the homepage, it makes it easy for everyone to see and served as a reminder to myself. =) Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15994	From: Donna Ransome	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: Ordering Online: Minimum Order

I haven't liked the looks of the yellow labs in my LFS. I have visited 8 LFS, not counting the chains. How do people deal with ordering from breeders who have minimum orders? I'd like to add two-three fish per week, but that would be an $8-$12 order.far short of a $50 minimum. Plus as the breeder pointed out, the shipping on each pair of fish would kill me! All the fish for my entire tank will cost barely over $50! I did not ask the LFS what breeders they use.maybe they do or will order from the breeder I have in mind? Do clubs ever group together to put several individuals for an order to meet the minimum? Then how are the fish received and distributed? There would have to be one "ship to" address and all would have to be available to pick up their fish promptly upon delivery. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15995	From: Patrick	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: Re: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?

What, 5 dollars a month? Boy, that will make you go broke! :) Patrick ----- Original Message ----- also to add the air conditioner will cost way more eventully because of the power bill. Thanks Kris

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15996	From: Patrick	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: Re: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?

I couldn't let this go. If you are freezing jugs of water, you are using power in your freezer. Now hold your seats here: Freezing water in your freezer causes your freezer compressor to run more, which costs you more money! What, you didn't know that? Now you do. Every time you open the door to get out the ice, that costs you money. Every time you put a jug of water in there, the compressor has to run to pull the heat out of that water to make it freeze. If your fish are not doing well because they are getting too hot, you are spending money on them, too. If the ice causes wild changes in temperature, it could stress the fish to the point that they get sick and die, and you lose money. Nobody complains about their aquarium heaters costing too much money in winter, when they have to run a lot. Imagine how much a 100 watt heater costs you! Now, if you have an a/c, you can keep the room at a stable temperature. It doesn't have to be 70°, it can just cool the room to 78 or 80, which will mean the a/c will hardly run. Patrick

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15997	From: harry perry	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: Re: Ordering Online: Minimum Order/An option

Find another source go to: www.groups.yahoo.com/group/anubiasdesign/ no minimums. Donna Ransome <djransome@...> wrote: I haven't liked the looks of the yellow labs in my LFS. I have visited 8 LFS, not counting the chains. How do people deal with ordering from breeders who have minimum orders? I'd like to add two-three fish per week, but that would be an $8-$12 order.far short of a $50 minimum. Plus as the breeder pointed out, the shipping on each pair of fish would kill me! All the fish for my entire tank will cost barely over $50! I did not ask the LFS what breeders they use.maybe they do or will order from the breeder I have in mind? Do clubs ever group together to put several individuals for an order to meet the minimum? Then how are the fish received and distributed? There would have to be one "ship to" address and all would have to be available to pick up their fish promptly upon delivery. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Personals Skip the bars and set-ups and start using Yahoo! Personals for free [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15998	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: Re: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?

what i was saying jackass is that a room air conditioner costs a lot of money to run to constantly keep a room at a certain temp. Also its my own thoughts that most people have a fridge in their home as it is. Therefore the cost would be less to just use that instead of a room air conditioner. The dfference between 5 bucks a month extra on the fridge, and the difference of 20 bucks extra or more trying to get room to the temp youd like in fact will add up!! think about it. before you go off on a rant do the researce.. unless you live somewhere that has its own generator. Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: I couldn't let this go. If you are freezing jugs of water, you are using power in your freezer. Now hold your seats here: Freezing water in your freezer causes your freezer compressor to run more, which costs you more money! What, you didn't know that? Now you do. Every time you open the door to get out the ice, that costs you money. Every time you put a jug of water in there, the compressor has to run to pull the heat out of that water to make it freeze. If your fish are not doing well because they are getting too hot, you are spending money on them, too. If the ice causes wild changes in temperature, it could stress the fish to the point that they get sick and die, and you lose money. Nobody complains about their aquarium heaters costing too much money in winter, when they have to run a lot. Imagine how much a 100 watt heater costs you! Now, if you have an a/c, you can keep the room at a stable temperature. It doesn't have to be 70°, it can just cool the room to 78 or 80, which will mean the a/c will hardly run. Patrick Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! DSL Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less --------------------------------- Yahoo! Shopping Find Great Deals on Gifts at Yahoo! Shopping [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 15999	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: Re: Ordering Online: Minimum Order/An option

Group orders are a great way for individuals to Order from a supplier who has a mininum order amount and or who only ship via airport to airport. Airport to Airport isn't that expensive if you divide a LARGE amount of fish into the shipping fee. Sometimes cheaper then express or overnight delivery. Jeff Rapps is one supplier who pops to mind. The are groups of people who get together to place an order from Jeff all the time. Usually one person picks up the order and holds the fish for a few days until a meeting date. Of course this could mean the person picking up might need a Lot of tank Space pending species ordered. Sometimes you can find breeders online who will ship for a modest amount,in warmer weather a lot of the breeders/ suppliers will ship priority mail. Of course if you live in cichlid country ( iowa, minnesota,indiana,OH, PA , IL to name a few ) you might be able to find a LOCAL ( 50 miles or less ) person raising Yellow labs, and you could check out there operation and fish prior to buying. Rob NE Indiana USA www.groups.yahoo.com/group/anubiasdesign might be a great yahoo group to join if you are seriously looking for a fish you can't find. I haven't seen Mark - post any Yellow Labs in awhile but that doesn't mean He doesn't have them or hasn't posted them... ~~SNIPPET ~~~ Do clubs ever group together to put several individuals for an order to meet the minimum? Then how are the fish received and distributed? There would have to be one "ship to" address and all would have to be available to pick up their fish promptly upon delivery. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16000	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: Re: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?

In a message dated 12/3/2005 11:35:10 PM Eastern Standard Time, punk3r12@... writes: <<<what i was saying jackass is that a room air conditioner costs a lot of money to run to constantly keep a room at a certain temp. Also its my own thoughts that most people have a fridge in their home as it is. Therefore the cost would be less to just use that instead of a room air conditioner. The dfference between 5 bucks a month extra on the fridge, and the difference of 20 bucks extra or more trying to get room to the temp youd like in fact will add up!! think about it. before you go off on a rant do the researce.. unless you live somewhere that has its own generator.>>> Geez.... Slow down. He had a very valid point. If you don't want to go that route, don't. =b Of course, with the cold snap we're getting up here, seeing the header got my attention. LOL My room is like Christmas with all the heaters blinking on and off..... =) Vicky Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Contact mosherd@... or (301-451-9390) =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: FCR-Cancer-Support@yahoogroups.com Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@... 919-513-1467, Dr London @ london.20@... 614-292-9554 _AND_ Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16001	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: Re: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?

i appologize to anyone else in the grooup for my tyrade. It just urks me to think along certain lines of people that insuly my original thought. If it were brought to my attentuion that somthing may be more financially stable then i could accept it but it sounded like an attack on my practices. I know what im doing... sometimes i do understand though that we can all use advice. Take it easy everyone and im sorry once again for my tyrade. seleya8@... wrote: In a message dated 12/3/2005 11:35:10 PM Eastern Standard Time, punk3r12@... writes: <<<what i was saying jackass is that a room air conditioner costs a lot of money to run to constantly keep a room at a certain temp. Also its my own thoughts that most people have a fridge in their home as it is. Therefore the cost would be less to just use that instead of a room air conditioner. The dfference between 5 bucks a month extra on the fridge, and the difference of 20 bucks extra or more trying to get room to the temp youd like in fact will add up!! think about it. before you go off on a rant do the researce.. unless you live somewhere that has its own generator.>>> Geez.... Slow down. He had a very valid point. If you don't want to go that route, don't. =b Of course, with the cold snap we're getting up here, seeing the header got my attention. LOL My room is like Christmas with all the heaters blinking on and off..... =) Vicky Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Contact mosherd@... or (301-451-9390) =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: FCR-Cancer-Support@yahoogroups.com Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@... 919-513-1467, Dr London @ london.20@... 614-292-9554 _AND_ Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! DSL Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16002	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?

Patrick likes stating Facts that he can back up . I think his manner of typing sometimes needs some net ettiquette but he is usually right. If he would back up his statements instead of typing one sentence comments there would probally be less arguments on the boards he belongs too. :) Before this goes to far and another argument drags on and on and on. A room air conditioner might be the best option in the long run. The cost could be spread out over many years of service.The room doesn't need to be 60* F but any temp lower then what it is outside will help lower the inside temperature. The fish keeper would be happier the fish happier and the electrical consumption isn't that much compared to a lot of the electrical devices. The refrigerator/ freezer uses more electricity then your furnace or air condition on average. But if you do not have the $$ to go out and buy an air conditioner especially in Peru. Your best bet might be to leave the lid open on your tank, run a small fan across the top of the water. this will cause the water to evaporate more but will also cool the temp of the top half of the tank by 2 or 3 degrees. More aeration will help in supplying more oxygen to your fish, warmer water less oxygen content in the water. The fish will be able to tolerate higher temps if oxygen is available in the tank. Turn off all non essential electrical appliances in the room and on the fish tank. No lights the fish don't need it, if you have plants run the lights for 8 hr. at night after the temps outside have started to cool down. I do not like the idea of Ice in my tanks. the water around the ice bottles is colder and doesn't really do much on the GRAND scale of things in the tank. I'd rather do a small 10% water change with water that is 5 degrees colder then tank temperature. Depending on your fish you might be able to get away with 10 degrees cooler. The water change in my opinion would do more to cool the tank then adding ice that will melt and only cool a small area of the tank for a few hrs. Placing Bagged ice in a cooler and running your airline through the ice has been suggested to help supply colder air to the tank, which in turn is suppose to lower the temp in the tank. I don't know about this because by the time the air reaches the tank it probally has already warmed back up because of the small amount of heat being put off by the airpump in the beginning. I seen a home made Chiller where they used an Old Chest freezer, They ran some Pvc Pipes through the chest and filled it full of water and let it freeze( freezer ) . then water was pumped through the pipes back into the tank. The owner claimed to have achieved a 15 degree temp drop in his tank. To me it sounds like alot of work, the water would have to be pumped pretty slow in my opinion to achieve a decrease in temperature, but in time ( weeks ) of constant use i could see where the temps could be lowered. My soap box opinion Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 12/3/2005 10:16:54 PM US Eastern Standard Time, patrickmn@... writes: also to add the air conditioner will cost way more eventually because of the Power bill. Thanks Kris [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16003	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: Re: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?

How about this move the refrigerator closer to the tank, run the airline into the freezer, coil it up in a bowl of water let freeze, Freezer door should seal with airline going inside without pinching the airline shut. as its freezing start pumping air through the line into the tank.. would it make a diffrence?? don't know my tanks are 30 plus feet from my refrig.. by the time the air got back to my tanks it would be warmed back up... I am sure there are people who have tried it, anyone dare collaberate on the subject.. some of the best inventions have come out of neccessity, no money and a person willing to experiment Rob NE Indiana USA BTW Patrick gets it all the time He is used to it :) In a message dated 12/3/2005 11:51:51 PM US Eastern Standard Time, punk3r12@... writes: i appologize to anyone else in the grooup for my tyrade. It just urks me to think along certain lines of people that insuly my original thought. If it were brought to my attentuion that somthing may be more financially stable then i could accept it but it sounded like an attack on my practices. I know what im doing... sometimes i do understand though that we can all use advice. Take it easy everyone and im sorry once again for my tyrade. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16004	From: Patrick	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: Re: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?

Well, I thought you were attacking my suggestion by simply stating that it would be too expensive. I was simply stating that the alternatives were also going to be expensive, and that people attack room temperature control thinking it is expensive, when they have no problem running a heater that uses a nearly constant drain of hundreds of watts, depending on tank size. I don't believe an a/c will cost 20 dollars to lower a room temperature by just a few degrees, but I might be wrong. But again, I was simply comparing that to the alternative using the examples of buying ice and making your own in a freezer. It was not an attack on anyone, it was just my built up lack of understanding of how people can so quickly say one thing is too expensive while happily spending a fortune on something no more reasonable. You attacked my suggestion, remember? So I defended my suggestion against your attack. Now you insult me. Nice. Patrick ----- Original Message ----- what i was saying jackass is that a room air conditioner costs a lot of money to run to constantly keep a room at a certain temp. Also its my own thoughts that most people have a fridge in their home as it is. Therefore the cost would be less to just use that instead of a room air conditioner. The dfference between 5 bucks a month extra on the fridge, and the difference of 20 bucks extra or more trying to get room to the temp youd like in fact will add up!! think about it. before you go off on a rant do the researce.. unless you live somewhere that has its own generator.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16005	From: Patrick	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: A/C vs. Aquarium heaters

Just to throw this out, a 6000 btu a/c (about $100) uses around 600 watts, which is probably overkill. A 29 gallon tank should have a 100 watt heater and probably a 20 watt light (or more). A 55 or 60 gallon would have a 200 watt heater and at least 40-80 watts of light. A few tanks, and you easily go above 600 watts. In winter, people see a heater as nothing more than a standard aquarium supply. In summer, people think the idea of an airconditioner, which will probably not run as often as the heater had to in winter, is too expensive. All I was trying to say is that if you have a heater for the winter, there is little reason to completely reject the idea of a room a/c for the summer. That is all I was saying. Now everybody has some statistics to make their own decisions. :) Patrick

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16006	From: Patrick	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: Re: A/C vs. Aquarium heaters

Really, just my opinion. No offense meant to anybody. I like you people, I don't want to make you mad. Just giving my opinion with a little sarcasm for my own humor. Hay, don't throw that algae chip at me! Really, Kris, didn't mean to offend you. :) Patrick

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16007	From: Laura	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: Re: A/C vs. Aquarium heaters

Since I have a very dry and sarcastic sense of humor I found the whole statement quite funny and not at all offensive.....lol Laura If you give up when it's winter, you will miss the promise of your spring, the beauty of your summer, and the fulfillment of your fall. -------Original Message------- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Date: 12/04/05 00:46:34 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] A/C vs. Aquarium heaters Really, just my opinion. No offense meant to anybody. I like you people, I don't want to make you mad. Just giving my opinion with a little sarcasm for my own humor. Hay, don't throw that algae chip at me! Really, Kris, didn't mean to offend you. :) Patrick Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16008	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 12/3/2005
Subject: Re: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?

i don't know about where everyone else lives but where i live, room a/c's are minimum $1,000. not in my budget! i use pc fans to cool all my tanks. FortWayneFish@... wrote: Patrick likes stating Facts that he can back up . I think his manner of typing sometimes needs some net ettiquette but he is usually right. If he would back up his statements instead of typing one sentence comments there would probally be less arguments on the boards he belongs too. :) Before this goes to far and another argument drags on and on and on. A room air conditioner might be the best option in the long run. The cost could be spread out over many years of service.The room doesn't need to be 60* F but any temp lower then what it is outside will help lower the inside temperature. The fish keeper would be happier the fish happier and the electrical consumption isn't that much compared to a lot of the electrical devices. The refrigerator/ freezer uses more electricity then your furnace or air condition on average. But if you do not have the $$ to go out and buy an air conditioner especially in Peru. Your best bet might be to leave the lid open on your tank, run a small fan across the top of the water. this will cause the water to evaporate more but will also cool the temp of the top half of the tank by 2 or 3 degrees. More aeration will help in supplying more oxygen to your fish, warmer water less oxygen content in the water. The fish will be able to tolerate higher temps if oxygen is available in the tank. Turn off all non essential electrical appliances in the room and on the fish tank. No lights the fish don't need it, if you have plants run the lights for 8 hr. at night after the temps outside have started to cool down. I do not like the idea of Ice in my tanks. the water around the ice bottles is colder and doesn't really do much on the GRAND scale of things in the tank. I'd rather do a small 10% water change with water that is 5 degrees colder then tank temperature. Depending on your fish you might be able to get away with 10 degrees cooler. The water change in my opinion would do more to cool the tank then adding ice that will melt and only cool a small area of the tank for a few hrs. Placing Bagged ice in a cooler and running your airline through the ice has been suggested to help supply colder air to the tank, which in turn is suppose to lower the temp in the tank. I don't know about this because by the time the air reaches the tank it probally has already warmed back up because of the small amount of heat being put off by the airpump in the beginning. I seen a home made Chiller where they used an Old Chest freezer, They ran some Pvc Pipes through the chest and filled it full of water and let it freeze( freezer ) . then water was pumped through the pipes back into the tank. The owner claimed to have achieved a 15 degree temp drop in his tank. To me it sounds like alot of work, the water would have to be pumped pretty slow in my opinion to achieve a decrease in temperature, but in time ( weeks ) of constant use i could see where the temps could be lowered. My soap box opinion Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 12/3/2005 10:16:54 PM US Eastern Standard Time, patrickmn@... writes: also to add the air conditioner will cost way more eventually because of the Power bill. Thanks Kris [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- Valeen Robertson Gonzalez valeendgonzalez@... [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16009	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/4/2005
Subject: Re: Amazing. Another kind of fish.

Your attachment did not come through--as per the list rules. You'll need to post photos to the file section here or elsewhere, with a link if elsewhere, for others to see. To answer your question, yes, it is a member of the same family. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of harry perry Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2005 2:26 AM To: anubiasdesign@yahoogroups.com; AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com; ultimate_seahorse@yahoogroups.com; UniQuaria@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Amazing. Another kind of fish. This is the leafy sea dragon. The same family as seahorses and pipefish ????? Harry

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16010	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/4/2005
Subject: Re: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?

Thomas, I don't know what your situation is in Brazil, but, here in the US, one can purchase a small refrigerator, know as a dorm refrigerator, for 100 USD or less. Also needed would be a smallish pump: a lot of plastic, or similar, tubing; Some silicone or similar sealant (it doesn't matter what you use for a sealant, as long as it does not affect the tubing, since it does not touch the water); and a drill of sufficient size to drill holes for the tubing. You'll set up the refrigerator in a convenient place near the tank. Drill two holes for the tubing to pass through. Coil the tubing in the fridge and feed both ends, one through each hole and to your tank. Seal the tubing in the holes and add the pump into the circuit. Turn on the fridge, and start the water flow. You'll need to do some experimentation to get the temperature set correctly, so it is not too cold, yet not too warm, to keep the water at a desired lower temperature than the room. The fridge can also be used for keeping live foods, other aquarium related products or foods cool, as well as your favorite cold beverage handy. You could also use a chiller unit, but these are usually far more expensive to purchase and run and only serve the purpose of chilling the water. The air conditioner was another idea, but I suspect if you had the means or need for an air conditioner, you'd already have one, and this would have been a non-question. Some one had mentioned the oxygen level in the tank. As water warms, it capacity for carrying oxygen decreases with temperature. The following table shows the relationship of dissolved oxygen (mg/L) to temperature and salinity: Oxygen Saturation Based on Temperature and Salinity Temp (deg C) Salinity (ppt) 0ppt 9 ppt 18.1ppt 27.1ppt 36.1ppt 45.2ppt 0 14.62ppm 13.73 12.89 12.10 11.36 10.66 10 11.29 10.66 10.06 9.49 8.96 8.45 20 9.09 8.62 8.17 7.75 7.35 6.96 25 8.26 7.85 7.46 7.08 6.72 6.39 30 7.56 7.19 6.85 6.51 6.20 5.90 40 6.41 6.12 5.84 5.58 5.32 5.08 Hopefully the formatting holds enough to be readable. I've included the salinity since this fish can also live in brackish water and you do not specify whether you are keeping them in fresh or brackish water. While the decrease between 25^o C and 30^o C does not appear to be much, it can mean the difference between life and death. There are ways to supersaturate the water, but it is not long lasting and can lead to other effects that are not wanted, but as a temporary measure, you may want to try that to see if the fish are really affected by a lack of oxygen, or if it is really the temperature that causes the ill effects leading to death. (Maybe that would be an experiment after you have built your stock back up.) The argument of energy costs came up earlier in this thread. This is more or less a red herring. The end result is that if you are not willing to foot the bill, you need to be doing something else. I wish you success with your fish. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Thomas Schlemmermeyer Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2005 1:29 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium? Hello, We are working with Phalloceros sp., a Southamerican Livebearer Species (Poecilidae). The temperature in our tank always goes up to about 31 degrees Celsius during the heat of the day, as now we are in summertime here in Brazil. It seems that above 26 degrees Celsius or so, our Phalloceros sp. are dying (which makes sense, as in their natural habitat temperature does not go beyond 24 degrees Celsius or so). What can we do to cool down the water, put in some ice cubes? best wishes from Mato Grosso do Sul State, Thomas

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16011	From: Raymond Wetzel	Date: 12/4/2005
Subject: Re: Yikes! Betta swims funny! White tetra is getting eaten!

Leslie, Swim bladder problems can come from dirty or old water, or a sudden drop in temperature -- not always, but sometimes. The Furan II that you need to use anyway may help him as I believe this med is at least semi-absorbable through the skin, although not as good as kanamycin in this respect for treating internal infections. Another cause could be that he's somewhat bloated in which case added some epsom salts (2 tsp per 10 gallons) often clears that up. Since your temperature fluctuates, do I gather that you don't have a heater (as it sounds like)? If so, that may be your problem. I think he would do better maintained at a more even (and higher -- 77 o) temperature rather than letting it go down to 73 o. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie & Dane Moore" <5moores@c...> wrote: > > I do have Furan II in caplets. Ordered them from Fosters and Smith > months ago as a "just in case." Although her injuries were caused by a > bite from another fish, I should still treat the wound with the Furan as > a bacterial problem then? > > The bettas temp gradually fluctuates from 73-79 F. It depends on if the > light is on. He is acting a little better today but I have no idea as > to what to do for him. > > Thank you so much, > Leslie > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] > On Behalf Of Raymond Wetzel > Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2005 10:58 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Yikes! Betta swims funny! White tetra is > getting eaten! > > > Sounds like the male Betta may have swim bladder problems. Might be > that this was coming on and would explain his lack of enthusiasm for > breeding. Usually not easily or successfully treatable. What's the > temperature of the water? Hard to say what the problem is without a > current pic of the white-skirt Tetra. With damage in the mouth and > nose area as you described, I would go with treating for mouth fungus > (actually bacterial), as its a fast moving infection and no time > should be wasted in treating it. Not sure if that's the problem > though, but wounds such as you described should be treated with a > bacticide anyway, rather than just Melafix, and time is of the > essence if it is mouth fungus; use Furan II. I don't read of any > other fish you describe in the 10 gallon that would inflict such > wounds. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie & Dane Moore" > <5moores@c...> wrote: > > > > Just took my poor male betta out of the 10 gal. Any hopes of him > > helping out my poor prego female have been shot. > > > > Problem now is that he is swimming very awkwardly as though he > can't get > > down to the bottom of the tank. His back is literally arched like > a U. > > WHAT is that from? His fins also look bad but I can not tell if > that is > > from getting picked on or from disease. > > > > Also, I have a white skirt tetra in the 10 gal. I did have her in > a > > trop. 75 with blood parrots and one of them apparently tried to get > her > > in his mouth so her nose is torn and wounded. I moved her into the > 10 > > gal and am treating with Melafix. BUT every day I observe her she > looks > > worse, like someone else is eating at her wound. Please tell me > who the > > likely culprit could be so I can help her. Occupants: 1 cherry > barb, 1 > > cory cat, 1 white something or other (pic in blood parrot file under > > fish id.), and the female betta. I have never seen anyone remotely > > hostile to anyone in this tank. > > > > Leslie > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important > to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the > SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > Yahoo! Groups Links >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16012	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 12/4/2005
Subject: Re: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?

i appologize.... like i said i felt attacked. now your idea will work for a few degrees.. however in an area that the temp is warm and the AC is owned... would you just use it for tanks? or would you take advantage of its cooling capabilities. I for one would probably end up hanging out in the room cooling off quite often so it would probably be more expensive in my home. now the fridge idea with the air running through the freezer works but is a lot of work. I have used this method.... but it was too much work in my opinion and any freezer you feel is ok to sacrafice.... probably drains energy too. Thats why here in CA they will give you discounts to trade in fridge every 3 years because they lose efficiancy and electricity is expensive here. and thats MY soapbox rant! haha once again sorry for the attack. just difference of opinion. Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: Well, I thought you were attacking my suggestion by simply stating that it would be too expensive. I was simply stating that the alternatives were also going to be expensive, and that people attack room temperature control thinking it is expensive, when they have no problem running a heater that uses a nearly constant drain of hundreds of watts, depending on tank size. I don't believe an a/c will cost 20 dollars to lower a room temperature by just a few degrees, but I might be wrong. But again, I was simply comparing that to the alternative using the examples of buying ice and making your own in a freezer. It was not an attack on anyone, it was just my built up lack of understanding of how people can so quickly say one thing is too expensive while happily spending a fortune on something no more reasonable. You attacked my suggestion, remember? So I defended my suggestion against your attack. Now you insult me. Nice. Patrick ----- Original Message ----- what i was saying jackass is that a room air conditioner costs a lot of money to run to constantly keep a room at a certain temp. Also its my own thoughts that most people have a fridge in their home as it is. Therefore the cost would be less to just use that instead of a room air conditioner. The dfference between 5 bucks a month extra on the fridge, and the difference of 20 bucks extra or more trying to get room to the temp youd like in fact will add up!! think about it. before you go off on a rant do the researce.. unless you live somewhere that has its own generator. Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Personals Skip the bars and set-ups and start using Yahoo! Personals for free --------------------------------- Yahoo! Personals Single? There's someone we'd like you to meet. Lots of someones, actually. Yahoo! Personals [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16013	From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com	Date: 12/4/2005
Subject: New file uploaded to AquaticLife

Hello, This email message is a notification to let you know that a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the AquaticLife group. File : /leafyseadragon2.jpg Uploaded by : harryfisherman <harryfisherman@...> Description : A leafy sea dragon. Anyone keeping these? You can access this file at the URL: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife/files/leafyseadragon2.jpg To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit: http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files Regards, harryfisherman <harryfisherman@...>

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16014	From: bunnycareshi	Date: 12/4/2005
Subject: Need book referral on mixing freshwater fish

Aloha As you can well imagine, I'm getting quite differing opinions from various pet stores on which freshwater fish are ok to mix. Right now my aquarium is pretty simple: 30 gal freshwater w/1 Clown Loach, 2 Marbled Angels - all 3 are 3-4" - and 1 catfish, which I *think* is a Pictus, which is a fat 5". I'm going to sell the 2 Angels, get a "buddy" Clown for the other, and not sure what I'm doing w/the catfish. What I really want to do is get smaller fish, so I can have more fish and more variety. Specific questions are: 1) Since my Clown is about 3", do I have to get a Clown exactly the same size or can it be 2"? 2) Can you recommend a current book that will tell me what small fish I can mix with what will be my 2 Clowns, and if you've got any general suggestions for fish to start acquiring, that would be great. I like colorful, active fish. Mahalo, Cinde - Hawaii __________________________________________ Yahoo! DSL – Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less. dsl.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16015	From: Cydne McCown	Date: 12/4/2005
Subject: Re: Need book referral on mixing freshwater fish

Aloha Cinde! I found this book on Barnes and Noble. I have used the Compass Guide Series in the past with good success. I am thinking about purchasing this book. What does the other members of the group recommend? I will tell you that with personal experience, pictus cats have pretty nice sized mouths, and will eat anything they can get in their mouth! So I am thinking small fish and pictus cats don't really mix well. I know that clown loaches are schooling fish, which means that usually you have better luck with three rather than two, five rather than four, just something that one of my aquarium buddies advised to me when I was relatively new to the hobby, and it has worked well for me. Cydne Tropical Freshwater Aquarium Fish from A to Z (Compass Guide Series) Ulrich Schliewen, Dave (Editor) Format: Paperback Pub. Date: May 2005 bunnycareshi <bunnycareshi@...> wrote: Aloha As you can well imagine, I'm getting quite differing opinions from various pet stores on which freshwater fish are ok to mix. Right now my aquarium is pretty simple: 30 gal freshwater w/1 Clown Loach, 2 Marbled Angels - all 3 are 3-4" - and 1 catfish, which I *think* is a Pictus, which is a fat 5". I'm going to sell the 2 Angels, get a "buddy" Clown for the other, and not sure what I'm doing w/the catfish. What I really want to do is get smaller fish, so I can have more fish and more variety. Specific questions are: 1) Since my Clown is about 3", do I have to get a Clown exactly the same size or can it be 2"? 2) Can you recommend a current book that will tell me what small fish I can mix with what will be my 2 Clowns, and if you've got any general suggestions for fish to start acquiring, that would be great. I like colorful, active fish. Mahalo, Cinde - Hawaii __________________________________________ Yahoo! DSL – Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less. dsl.yahoo.com Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Personals Single? There's someone we'd like you to meet. Lots of someones, actually. Yahoo! Personals --------------------------------- Yahoo! Personals Let fate take it's course directly to your email. See who's waiting for you Yahoo! Personals [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16016	From: Cydne McCown	Date: 12/4/2005
Subject: Re: Need book referral on mixing freshwater fish

Cinde, here is a book that specifically gives compatibility..... An Essential Guide to Choosing Your Tropical Freshwater Fish (Tankmaster Series) Graham Quick, Gina Sandford Format: Hardcover - Reprint Pub. Date: March 2000Cydne bunnycareshi <bunnycareshi@...> wrote: Aloha As you can well imagine, I'm getting quite differing opinions from various pet stores on which freshwater fish are ok to mix. Right now my aquarium is pretty simple: 30 gal freshwater w/1 Clown Loach, 2 Marbled Angels - all 3 are 3-4" - and 1 catfish, which I *think* is a Pictus, which is a fat 5". I'm going to sell the 2 Angels, get a "buddy" Clown for the other, and not sure what I'm doing w/the catfish. What I really want to do is get smaller fish, so I can have more fish and more variety. Specific questions are: 1) Since my Clown is about 3", do I have to get a Clown exactly the same size or can it be 2"? 2) Can you recommend a current book that will tell me what small fish I can mix with what will be my 2 Clowns, and if you've got any general suggestions for fish to start acquiring, that would be great. I like colorful, active fish. Mahalo, Cinde - Hawaii __________________________________________ Yahoo! DSL – Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less. dsl.yahoo.com Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Personals Single? There's someone we'd like you to meet. Lots of someones, actually. Try Yahoo! Personals --------------------------------- Yahoo! Personals Let fate take it's course directly to your email. See who's waiting for you Yahoo! Personals [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16017	From: bunnycareshi	Date: 12/4/2005
Subject: Re: Need book referral on mixing freshwater fish

Aloha Thank you Cydne for these referrals. I still have the question about size on Clowns. We don't have the selection here as on the mainland and so far the biggest I've found is 2". Is that one ok w/my 3", and if I get more, how much does size matter? Also, I'm curious as to the reason for odd numbers of Clowns, i.e. 3,5 etc. I'm a bird person, finches right now, and we always go for pairs, so this is new to me. Cinde, Hawaii --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Cydne McCown <cydthekid50@y...> wrote: > > Aloha Cinde! > I found this book on Barnes and Noble. I have used the Compass Guide Series in the past with good success. I am thinking about purchasing this book. What does the other members of the group recommend? > I will tell you that with personal experience, pictus cats have pretty nice sized mouths, and will eat anything they can get in their mouth! So I am thinking small fish and pictus cats don't really mix well. I know that clown loaches are schooling fish, which means that usually you have better luck with three rather than two, five rather than four, just something that one of my aquarium buddies advised to me when I was relatively new to the hobby, and it has worked well for me. > > Cydne > > Tropical Freshwater Aquarium Fish from A to Z (Compass Guide Series) > Ulrich Schliewen, Dave (Editor) > > Format: Paperback > Pub. Date: May 2005 > > > > bunnycareshi <bunnycareshi@y...> wrote: > Aloha > > As you can well imagine, I'm getting quite differing > opinions from various pet stores on which freshwater > fish are ok to mix. > > Right now my aquarium is pretty simple: 30 gal > freshwater > w/1 Clown Loach, 2 Marbled Angels - all 3 are 3-4" - > and 1 catfish, which I *think* is a Pictus, which is a > fat 5". I'm going to sell the 2 Angels, get a "buddy" > Clown for the other, and not sure what I'm doing w/the > catfish. > > What I really want to do is get smaller fish, so I can > have more fish and more variety. Specific questions > are: > > 1) Since my Clown is about 3", do I have to get a > Clown exactly the same size or can it be 2"? > > 2) Can you recommend a current book that will tell me > what small fish I can mix with what will be my 2 > Clowns, and if you've got any general suggestions for > fish to start acquiring, that would be great. I like > colorful, active fish. > > Mahalo, > Cinde - Hawaii > > > > __________________________________________ > Yahoo! DSL – Something to write home about. > Just $16.99/mo. or less. > dsl.yahoo.com > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine biology Marine fish Biology > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Personals > Single? There's someone we'd like you to meet. > Lots of someones, actually. Yahoo! Personals > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Personals > Let fate take it's course directly to your email. > See who's waiting for you Yahoo! Personals > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16018	From: bunnycareshi	Date: 12/4/2005
Subject: Re: Need book referral on mixing freshwater fish

Aloha Thank you Cydne for these referrals. I still have the question about size on Clowns. We don't have the selection here as on the mainland and so far the biggest I've found is 2". Is that one ok w/my 3", and if I get more, how much does size matter? Also, I'm curious as to the reason for odd numbers of Clowns, i.e. 3,5 etc. I'm a bird person, finches right now, and we always go for pairs, so this is new to me. Cinde, Hawaii --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Cydne McCown <cydthekid50@y...> wrote: > > Aloha Cinde! > I found this book on Barnes and Noble. I have used the Compass Guide Series in the past with good success. I am thinking about purchasing this book. What does the other members of the group recommend? > I will tell you that with personal experience, pictus cats have pretty nice sized mouths, and will eat anything they can get in their mouth! So I am thinking small fish and pictus cats don't really mix well. I know that clown loaches are schooling fish, which means that usually you have better luck with three rather than two, five rather than four, just something that one of my aquarium buddies advised to me when I was relatively new to the hobby, and it has worked well for me. > > Cydne > > Tropical Freshwater Aquarium Fish from A to Z (Compass Guide Series) > Ulrich Schliewen, Dave (Editor) > > Format: Paperback > Pub. Date: May 2005 > > > > bunnycareshi <bunnycareshi@y...> wrote: > Aloha > > As you can well imagine, I'm getting quite differing > opinions from various pet stores on which freshwater > fish are ok to mix. > > Right now my aquarium is pretty simple: 30 gal > freshwater > w/1 Clown Loach, 2 Marbled Angels - all 3 are 3-4" - > and 1 catfish, which I *think* is a Pictus, which is a > fat 5". I'm going to sell the 2 Angels, get a "buddy" > Clown for the other, and not sure what I'm doing w/the > catfish. > > What I really want to do is get smaller fish, so I can > have more fish and more variety. Specific questions > are: > > 1) Since my Clown is about 3", do I have to get a > Clown exactly the same size or can it be 2"? > > 2) Can you recommend a current book that will tell me > what small fish I can mix with what will be my 2 > Clowns, and if you've got any general suggestions for > fish to start acquiring, that would be great. I like > colorful, active fish. > > Mahalo, > Cinde - Hawaii > > > > __________________________________________ > Yahoo! DSL – Something to write home about. > Just $16.99/mo. or less. > dsl.yahoo.com > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine biology Marine fish Biology > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Personals > Single? There's someone we'd like you to meet. > Lots of someones, actually. Yahoo! Personals > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Personals > Let fate take it's course directly to your email. > See who's waiting for you Yahoo! Personals > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16019	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 12/4/2005
Subject: Re: Need book referral on mixing freshwater fish

The size of the clowns will not matter. 2" will be fine with bigger clowns. The younger and smaller the clown the more acceptable to stress related ick though. So please Quarantine them for a few weeks or more before adding them to the main tank. Clown fish like to school, so more then 2 is recommended. I have no idea why people say to get an odd number of them but its been suggested on a few boards before. We have a couple 5.5- 6" clowns in one of our tanks and they are about 4 years old. We added some smaller clown loaches about a year ago and the two bunches get a long fine.. Just provide them with enough food so the bigger fish don't out compete the smaller fish. Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 12/4/2005 4:57:59 PM US Eastern Standard Time, bunnycareshi@... writes: Aloha Thank you Cydne for these referrals. I still have the question about size on Clowns. We don't have the selection here as on the mainland and so far the biggest I've found is 2". Is that one ok w/my 3", and if I get more, how much does size matter? Also, I'm curious as to the reason for odd numbers of Clowns, i.e. 3,5 etc. I'm a bird person, finches right now, and we always go for pairs, so this is new to me. Cinde, Hawaii [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16020	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 12/4/2005
Subject: Re: Need book referral on mixing freshwater fish

Cinde, You can put 2 clown loaches of variable sizes together as long as the bigger one is not an aggressive bully and the smaller one is not too small to be considered food (which is very unlikely as a 10” clown is a rarity in aquaria). The numbers for keeping clowns are not odd. The minimum you should have is 3 and you can of course have 4. The reason for minimum 3 is that they like to have company of their own species and lonely specimen will not come out during the day. This does not mean that a lonely specimen will die, but you may not see it for months. Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of bunnycareshi Sent: 04 December 2005 21:52 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Need book referral on mixing freshwater fish Aloha Thank you Cydne for these referrals. I still have the question about size on Clowns. We don't have the selection here as on the mainland and so far the biggest I've found is 2". Is that one ok w/my 3", and if I get more, how much does size matter? Also, I'm curious as to the reason for odd numbers of Clowns, i.e. 3,5 etc. I'm a bird person, finches right now, and we always go for pairs, so this is new to me. Cinde, Hawaii --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Cydne McCown <cydthekid50@y...> wrote: > > Aloha Cinde! > I found this book on Barnes and Noble. I have used the Compass Guide Series in the past with good success. I am thinking about purchasing this book. What does the other members of the group recommend? > I will tell you that with personal experience, pictus cats have pretty nice sized mouths, and will eat anything they can get in their mouth! So I am thinking small fish and pictus cats don't really mix well. I know that clown loaches are schooling fish, which means that usually you have better luck with three rather than two, five rather than four, just something that one of my aquarium buddies advised to me when I was relatively new to the hobby, and it has worked well for me. > > Cydne > > Tropical Freshwater Aquarium Fish from A to Z (Compass Guide Series) > Ulrich Schliewen, Dave (Editor) > > Format: Paperback > Pub. Date: May 2005 > > > > bunnycareshi <bunnycareshi@y...> wrote: > Aloha > > As you can well imagine, I'm getting quite differing > opinions from various pet stores on which freshwater > fish are ok to mix. > > Right now my aquarium is pretty simple: 30 gal > freshwater > w/1 Clown Loach, 2 Marbled Angels - all 3 are 3-4" - > and 1 catfish, which I *think* is a Pictus, which is a > fat 5". I'm going to sell the 2 Angels, get a "buddy" > Clown for the other, and not sure what I'm doing w/the > catfish. > > What I really want to do is get smaller fish, so I can > have more fish and more variety. Specific questions > are: > > 1) Since my Clown is about 3", do I have to get a > Clown exactly the same size or can it be 2"? > > 2) Can you recommend a current book that will tell me > what small fish I can mix with what will be my 2 > Clowns, and if you've got any general suggestions for > fish to start acquiring, that would be great. I like > colorful, active fish. > > Mahalo, > Cinde - Hawaii > > > > __________________________________________ > Yahoo! DSL – Something to write home about. > Just $16.99/mo. or less. > dsl.yahoo.com > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine biology Marine fish Biology > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Personals > Single? There's someone we'd like you to meet. > Lots of someones, actually. Yahoo! Personals > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Personals > Let fate take it's course directly to your email. > See who's waiting for you Yahoo! Personals > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Mar ine+fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=sWozU8RAgM2g66Yb_7h_nQ> biology Marine <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Marine+fish&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine +fish&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=JB6FNOraRx3JIvMA1E4-Lw> fish Biology <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Biology&w1=Marine+biology&w2=Marine+fis h&w3=Biology&c=3&s=50&.sig=R-HUKyhqLGfm-ZAFT2vuTQ> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16021	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/4/2005
Subject: Re: Need book referral on mixing freshwater fish

Cynde, Hmmm, this is really a pretty tough question. Selling or moving the angels will make it easier, but, if that is a pictus for sure, then you have a problem. They will eat any fish they can get their mouths around, which pretty much rules out any fish they can eat, which would be most small fish. If you remove the pictus, then the field becomes wide open. As was already mentioned, you should have more than one clown loach, and an odd number always seems to do better than an even number. Also, keep in mind that they will grow up to 12" in the aquarium (larger in the wild) though 8" is more common, so you are going to be looking at a much larger tank down the road. Fortunately, it does take them several years to reach that size, so you do have some time. If you take care of them, you will have them for 20+ years. If you would like to keep with a clown scheme, you can try to locate: clown panaque _Panaque maccus_; clown rasbora; clown squeaker _Synodontis decorus_ (this fish can get quite large also); and clown barb. The barbs are a schooling fish that should have an odd number of fish in the school, 5 is good. And the rasbora is also a schooling fish--any number will do. There are a few other nice rasboras available, particularly the harlequin rasbora, which is what most people think of when you mention a rasbora. The natural color dwarf gourami is nice, as is the honey gourami. All these fish come from Southeast Asia or India, which would make for a nice geographic mix. There are a large number of tetras that will fill the bill also. There are also a number of smaller barbs, and don't forget the livebearers, though the really interesting ones will be hard to get (check out Aquabid if you see one you are interested in keeping). You'll really need to make the decisions yourself, and something like the Baensch book will help with this. I've not mentioned other loaches, cichlids, etc., that will also fit your smaller fish designation. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of bunnycareshi Sent: Sunday, December 04, 2005 2:12 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Need book referral on mixing freshwater fish Aloha As you can well imagine, I'm getting quite differing opinions from various pet stores on which freshwater fish are ok to mix. Right now my aquarium is pretty simple: 30 gal freshwater w/1 Clown Loach, 2 Marbled Angels - all 3 are 3-4" - and 1 catfish, which I *think* is a Pictus, which is a fat 5". I'm going to sell the 2 Angels, get a "buddy" Clown for the other, and not sure what I'm doing w/the catfish. What I really want to do is get smaller fish, so I can have more fish and more variety. Specific questions are: 1) Since my Clown is about 3", do I have to get a Clown exactly the same size or can it be 2"? 2) Can you recommend a current book that will tell me what small fish I can mix with what will be my 2 Clowns, and if you've got any general suggestions for fish to start acquiring, that would be great. I like colorful, active fish. Mahalo, Cinde - Hawaii

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16022	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/4/2005
Subject: Re: Need book referral on mixing freshwater fish

Cynde, I also mentioned this in my reply to you, and don't really know why, but some fish seem to do better when kept in odd numbered groups. Then you have things like livebearers that are better off kept in trios, 1 male and two females, and this is so the male does not worry the female to death. There are also the harem breeders in the cichlid family where one male and several females are placed together. This is the way they are found in the wild and is probably an evolutionary thing to ensure the continuation of the species. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of bunnycareshi Sent: Sunday, December 04, 2005 4:53 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Need book referral on mixing freshwater fish Aloha Thank you Cydne for these referrals. I still have the question about size on Clowns. We don't have the selection here as on the mainland and so far the biggest I've found is 2". Is that one ok w/my 3", and if I get more, how much does size matter? Also, I'm curious as to the reason for odd numbers of Clowns, i.e. 3,5 etc. I'm a bird person, finches right now, and we always go for pairs, so this is new to me. Cinde, Hawaii --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Cydne McCown <cydthekid50@y...> wrote: > > Aloha Cinde! > I found this book on Barnes and Noble. I have used the Compass Guide Series in the past with good success. I am thinking about purchasing this book. What does the other members of the group recommend? > I will tell you that with personal experience, pictus cats have pretty nice sized mouths, and will eat anything they can get in their mouth! So I am thinking small fish and pictus cats don't really mix well. I know that clown loaches are schooling fish, which means that usually you have better luck with three rather than two, five rather than four, just something that one of my aquarium buddies advised to me when I was relatively new to the hobby, and it has worked well for me. > > Cydne > > Tropical Freshwater Aquarium Fish from A to Z (Compass Guide Series) > Ulrich Schliewen, Dave (Editor) > > Format: Paperback > Pub. Date: May 2005 > > > > bunnycareshi <bunnycareshi@y...> wrote: > Aloha > > As you can well imagine, I'm getting quite differing > opinions from various pet stores on which freshwater > fish are ok to mix. > > Right now my aquarium is pretty simple: 30 gal > freshwater > w/1 Clown Loach, 2 Marbled Angels - all 3 are 3-4" - > and 1 catfish, which I *think* is a Pictus, which is a > fat 5". I'm going to sell the 2 Angels, get a "buddy" > Clown for the other, and not sure what I'm doing w/the > catfish. > > What I really want to do is get smaller fish, so I can > have more fish and more variety. Specific questions > are: > > 1) Since my Clown is about 3", do I have to get a > Clown exactly the same size or can it be 2"? > > 2) Can you recommend a current book that will tell me > what small fish I can mix with what will be my 2 > Clowns, and if you've got any general suggestions for > fish to start acquiring, that would be great. I like > colorful, active fish. > > Mahalo, > Cinde - Hawaii > > > > __________________________________________ > Yahoo! DSL – Something to write home about. > Just $16.99/mo. or less. > dsl.yahoo.com > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine biology Marine fish Biology > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Personals > Single? There's someone we'd like you to meet. > Lots of someones, actually. Yahoo! Personals > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Personals > Let fate take it's course directly to your email. > See who's waiting for you Yahoo! Personals > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16023	From: Patrick	Date: 12/4/2005
Subject: Re: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?

Lowes has them for $100 for a cheap one, and $130 for the next cheapest. These are for small rooms (200 ft sq). $1000 would nearly buy an air conditioner for a house. :) Patrick ----- Original Message ----- i don't know about where everyone else lives but where i live, room a/c's are minimum $1,000. not in my budget! i use pc fans to cool all my tanks.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16024	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/4/2005
Subject: Re: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?

I don't know about a straight air conditioner, but my heat pump and blower unit cost me 6000 USD a couple of years ago. I'd suspect that a central air unit would only be 1000 USD or so less than that, though I am sure someone here could give a better ballpark on that from their experience. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Patrick Sent: Sunday, December 04, 2005 6:37 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium? Lowes has them for $100 for a cheap one, and $130 for the next cheapest. These are for small rooms (200 ft sq). $1000 would nearly buy an air conditioner for a house. :) Patrick ----- Original Message ----- i don't know about where everyone else lives but where i live, room a/c's are minimum $1,000. not in my budget! i use pc fans to cool all my tanks.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16025	From: Cydne McCown	Date: 12/4/2005
Subject: Re: Need book referral on mixing freshwater fish

I don't quite understand the "science" of it myself. I was just told by a pet store owner who was also a member of my aquarium club at the time that when you have more than one of the same species, they do better as odds rather than as evens. I have be true to this idea, but certainly it could be just a myth among oldster types in the hobby. I know that when the species is aggressive, odd numbers seem to work better to control aggressive behaviors. But I believe that clown loaches (which I believe are from the botia group?) are not agressive. If that holds true, then a smaller clown should not be in danger of being picked upon by the other clown. I am so sure about the pictus cat though. Cydne bunnycareshi <bunnycareshi@...> wrote: Aloha Thank you Cydne for these referrals. I still have the question about size on Clowns. We don't have the selection here as on the mainland and so far the biggest I've found is 2". Is that one ok w/my 3", and if I get more, how much does size matter? Also, I'm curious as to the reason for odd numbers of Clowns, i.e. 3,5 etc. I'm a bird person, finches right now, and we always go for pairs, so this is new to me. Cinde, Hawaii --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Cydne McCown <cydthekid50@y...> wrote: > > Aloha Cinde! > I found this book on Barnes and Noble. I have used the Compass Guide Series in the past with good success. I am thinking about purchasing this book. What does the other members of the group recommend? > I will tell you that with personal experience, pictus cats have pretty nice sized mouths, and will eat anything they can get in their mouth! So I am thinking small fish and pictus cats don't really mix well. I know that clown loaches are schooling fish, which means that usually you have better luck with three rather than two, five rather than four, just something that one of my aquarium buddies advised to me when I was relatively new to the hobby, and it has worked well for me. > > Cydne > > Tropical Freshwater Aquarium Fish from A to Z (Compass Guide Series) > Ulrich Schliewen, Dave (Editor) > > Format: Paperback > Pub. Date: May 2005 > > > > bunnycareshi <bunnycareshi@y...> wrote: > Aloha > > As you can well imagine, I'm getting quite differing > opinions from various pet stores on which freshwater > fish are ok to mix. > > Right now my aquarium is pretty simple: 30 gal > freshwater > w/1 Clown Loach, 2 Marbled Angels - all 3 are 3-4" - > and 1 catfish, which I *think* is a Pictus, which is a > fat 5". I'm going to sell the 2 Angels, get a "buddy" > Clown for the other, and not sure what I'm doing w/the > catfish. > > What I really want to do is get smaller fish, so I can > have more fish and more variety. Specific questions > are: > > 1) Since my Clown is about 3", do I have to get a > Clown exactly the same size or can it be 2"? > > 2) Can you recommend a current book that will tell me > what small fish I can mix with what will be my 2 > Clowns, and if you've got any general suggestions for > fish to start acquiring, that would be great. I like > colorful, active fish. > > Mahalo, > Cinde - Hawaii > > > > __________________________________________ > Yahoo! DSL – Something to write home about. > Just $16.99/mo. or less. > dsl.yahoo.com > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Marine biology Marine fish Biology > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Personals > Single? There's someone we'd like you to meet. > Lots of someones, actually. Yahoo! Personals > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Personals > Let fate take it's course directly to your email. > See who's waiting for you Yahoo! Personals > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Personals Let fate take it's course directly to your email. See who's waiting for you Yahoo! Personals [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16026	From: harry perry	Date: 12/4/2005
Subject: Re: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?/ think abo

The post was originally from Brazil?? . A "poor country" compared to the U.S.A. We're suggesting central air, dorm refrigerators etc.etc.etc. Just build another house for your fish. No problem. Is there any wonder why the rest of the world considers Americans to be rich, arrogant assholes?. Harry Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: I don't know about a straight air conditioner, but my heat pump and blower unit cost me 6000 USD a couple of years ago. I'd suspect that a central air unit would only be 1000 USD or so less than that, though I am sure someone here could give a better ballpark on that from their experience. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Patrick Sent: Sunday, December 04, 2005 6:37 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium? Lowes has them for $100 for a cheap one, and $130 for the next cheapest. These are for small rooms (200 ft sq). $1000 would nearly buy an air conditioner for a house. :) Patrick ----- Original Message ----- i don't know about where everyone else lives but where i live, room a/c's are minimum $1,000. not in my budget! i use pc fans to cool all my tanks. Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Personals Skip the bars and set-ups and start using Yahoo! Personals for free --------------------------------- Yahoo! Personals Single? There's someone we'd like you to meet. Lots of someones, actually. Yahoo! Personals [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16027	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/4/2005
Subject: Re: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?/ think abo

Harry, Yes, that is correct, the original poster is in Brazil. However, I doubt that nay who have replied thus far have lived in Brazil. I know I haven't ever been there. We can only reply based on our own experiences. Since we do not know this fellow, nor do we know his financial status, we can only relate to ours. He has gotten a number of suggestions. He can probably adapt at least one of those suggestions to his circumstances. That's the best we can do. I was the one who recommended the dorm fridge. It worked quite well for a friend of mine, and was a lot cheaper than air conditioning, though not cost free or easily absorbed by other normal uses of equipment on hand. My post, to which you tagged on your reply was merely questioning the cost of a unit to air condition a whole house. I'd suspect that if he was going to air condition his house, should he be the owner, he'd probably have done it by now, though he may have plans to do it in the future, when money is available. But that is just pure conjecture. I'd suspect that if his daytime temperature is in the 30^o C+ range now, when he experiences winter the temperatures are probably in the low 20^o C range, and he is rather used to the higher temperatures. I'm a northern boy, where a summertime temperature of 90^0 F+ is rather rare, and we have always suffered through it. Most of the hottest days are in the upper 70's, low 80's, much more bearable. Now that I am living in Virginia, where 90^o days are much more common, and the humidity is higher, I find the air conditioner to be an indispensable part of life. If I was born and raised here, I'd probably have a different outlook, and find the normal winter temperature of my original home unbearable. Now, if our Brazilian friend want to keep the fish he is keeping, he must do something about chilling the water. He has a number of suggestions, so it is his call. If none of the ideas put forth already is adaptable to his situation, then he simply cannot keep those fish. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of harry perry Sent: Sunday, December 04, 2005 11:29 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?/ think about it. The post was originally from Brazil?? . A "poor country" compared to the U.S.A. We're suggesting central air, dorm refrigerators etc.etc.etc. Just build another house for your fish. No problem. Is there any wonder why the rest of the world considers Americans to be rich, arrogant assholes?. Harry Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: I don't know about a straight air conditioner, but my heat pump and blower unit cost me 6000 USD a couple of years ago. I'd suspect that a central air unit would only be 1000 USD or so less than that, though I am sure someone here could give a better ballpark on that from their experience. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Patrick Sent: Sunday, December 04, 2005 6:37 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium? Lowes has them for $100 for a cheap one, and $130 for the next cheapest. These are for small rooms (200 ft sq). $1000 would nearly buy an air conditioner for a house. :) Patrick ----- Original Message ----- i don't know about where everyone else lives but where i live, room a/c's are minimum $1,000. not in my budget! i use pc fans to cool all my tanks.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16028	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 12/4/2005
Subject: Re: Need book referral on mixing freshwater fish

clowns do well in MANY communiys... i would reccommend thouth GET RID OF THE PICTUS. If your goal is to keep smaller fish then rid yourself of the pictus for it will eat al it can. Kris

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16029	From: hank voss	Date: 12/4/2005
Subject: Re: Need book referral on mixing freshwater fish

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "bunnycareshi" <bunnycareshi@y...> wrote: > > > > I'm curious as to the reason for odd numbers of Clowns, i.e. > 3,5 etc. > Cinde: Hi. just got back from Fla. and arrived to 2 in. of snow (should have stayed) Just started to go through the treads. There is no reason for it to be an odd number, just more than 2. the reason for this is if you get only 2 and 1 happens to be a male (usually more agressive) it spreads out the amount of agression to several fish. Plus most fish prefer to be in a group of their own kind.(not male bettas of course) Hank

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16030	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 12/5/2005
Subject: Re: some like it cool - how to cool slightly a aquarium?

no lowes near me, unfortunately. even if there were though, their prices would be as high as everyone else's here, to keep with the price gouging of nearly every single thing someone could possibly buy in the bay area. --- Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: > Lowes has them for $100 for a cheap one, and $130 > for the next cheapest. > These are for small rooms (200 ft sq). $1000 would > nearly buy an air > conditioner for a house. :) > > Patrick > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > i don't know about where everyone else lives but > where i live, room a/c's > are minimum $1,000. not in my budget! i use pc fans > to cool all my tanks. > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez valeendgonzalez@...

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16031	From: Tom Ray	Date: 12/5/2005
Subject: Freshwater Local Clubs and Fish Stores (LFS) for Louisville,KY & Bl

I am heading back to Louisville, Kentucky and Southern Indiana (up to Bloomington) to visit family for Christmas. I've not found much on Freshwater (FW) LFS and clubs for either city. So I hope this newsgroup can help. Thank you. I'd like to give/set up for my nieces and nephews small fish tanks with some interesting, fun and simple fish. I keep FW nano-tanks and pico-tanks myself, so I can set them up and establish them. However, I am not clear as to the availability of tank items and fish. For example: Should I bring small filters, heaters, plants, lighting, etc. with me, ...should I order them on the internet and have them delivered? and/or ...what will be available there? I like to support the LFS, breeders, and club(s) whenever possible. Similarly: What FW fish are right and available for this region? Here in California in the Bay Area, the temperature is pretty constant and cool in the Winter, but not too cold. So nano-tanks can get by with a small Hydor brand flat panel heater or 2. And, many fish can live in nano-tanks: guppies, or dario, or whiteclouds, or "micro-rasboras" (merahs or bridgettes) or even a pair of A. australes or a male B. splendid. This also leads me to my next question for everyone... Is there a Freswater Club that you know of in each of these towns? When and where does it meet? Does it have a Yahoo or MSN group? I'd like to show my nieces and nephews that they can get involved with and get support from other hobbists. So they can become enthuiasts like I have. Again, any help you can provide is greatly appreciated. Regards & Happy Holidays, --Tom

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16032	From: Tom Ray	Date: 12/5/2005
Subject: Hobby Magazines for Holiday Gifts.

I've been asked to identfy a few. Any recommendations (favorable or not)? Thanks again, --Tom(myBoy)

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16033	From: Aaron R. Martin	Date: 12/5/2005
Subject: Re: Freshwater Local Clubs and Fish Stores (LFS) for Louisville,KY

Hi Tom, There is a LFS and a Clubs folder in the groups Links section, I checked, but theres no listing in there yet, so if you do find some could you please add to it, it would be much appreciated. Thanks, Aaron --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Tom Ray" <t_a_ray_cissp@y...> wrote: > > I am heading back to Louisville, Kentucky and Southern Indiana (up to > Bloomington) to visit family for Christmas. I've not found much on > Freshwater (FW) LFS and clubs for either city. So I hope this > newsgroup can help. Thank you. ... I like to support the LFS, breeders, and club(s) whenever possible. ... > (message truncated) > Again, any help you can provide is greatly appreciated. > > Regards & Happy Holidays, > --Tom >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16035	From: Aaron R. Martin	Date: 12/5/2005
Subject: Re: Freshwater Local Clubs and Fish Stores (LFS) for Louisville,KY

Hi Tom, I was curious as how to find the LFS some place I'd never been. On the" Yahoo!" main page, click on "Local", then enter "Fish Store" in the first field and "Louisville, Kentucky" in the second and then search. It came up with several right away and you can filter the results by distance as well. The best part is after you visit the LFS you can submit your own review on the same Yahoo! Local page to let others know if you liked the place. I'm from the Bay Area also, so I'm gonna get started reviewing the LFS I've been to, and hopefully others will review the LFS they've visited so we'll all know ahead of time if its worth the drive. Thanks, Aaron --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Tom Ray" <t_a_ray_cissp@y...> wrote: > > I am heading back to Louisville, Kentucky and Southern Indiana (up to > Bloomington) to visit family for Christmas. I've not found much on > Freshwater (FW) LFS and clubs for either city. So I hope this > newsgroup can help. Thank you. ... I like to support the LFS, breeders, and club(s) whenever possible. ... > (message truncated) > Again, any help you can provide is greatly appreciated. > > Regards & Happy Holidays, > --Tom

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16036	From: Aaron R. Martin	Date: 12/5/2005
Subject: Re: Freshwater Local Clubs and Fish Stores (LFS) for Louisville,KY

Hi Tom, This is the best part of Yahoo! Local ~ "Business Owners: Add your business to Yahoo! Local for free!" Another usefull tool is the Yahoo! 360 - when you review any business from LFS to restraunts, hotels, etc... the reviews show up on your 360 page with your profile. I just started mine, it seems promising. Here are some of the initial search results: Pets Galore, (502) 452-1521, 2509 Grinstead Dr, Louisville, KY "Tim, the owner, is very knowledgable with pretty much everything. Whether he has it or not. He..."  Sandy's Pet Shop, (502) 636-2743, 1421 Hess Ln, Louisville, KY, www.sandyspetshop.com Pet's Palace, (502) 452-6912, 2817 Del Rio Pl, Louisville, KY Auburndale Pet Center, (502) 367-2893, 5460 New Cut Rd, Louisville, KY www.auburndalepets.com Rate it Something Fishy Incorporated, (502) 297-9891, 3618d Klondike Ln, Louisville, KY 7.71 mi Map | Directions | Send to Phone | Save See all: Pet Supplies - All Animal Services - Fish Feeder's Supply Company, (812) 944-6592, 229 E Lewis And Clark Pkwy, Clarksville, IN www.feederssupply.com Results Page: 1  2  3  4  5  6  7  8   Next Business Owners: Add your business to Yahoo! Local for free! Are you in any local Bay Area clubs? Thanks, Aaron --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Tom Ray" <t_a_ray_cissp@y...> wrote: > > I am heading back to Louisville, Kentucky and Southern Indiana (up to > Bloomington) to visit family for Christmas. I've not found much on > Freshwater (FW) LFS and clubs for either city. So I hope this > newsgroup can help. Thank you. ... I like to support the LFS, breeders, and club(s) whenever possible. ... > (message truncated) > Again, any help you can provide is greatly appreciated. > > Regards & Happy Holidays, > --Tom

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16037	From: wendie	Date: 12/5/2005
Subject: Better Than Brine Shrimp Food

Has anyone tried using the new "better than brine shrimp" food that swims by releasing air bubbles? It's up on AquaBid. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16038	From: Cydne McCown	Date: 12/5/2005
Subject: Re: Hobby Magazines for Holiday Gifts.

I like TFH (Tropical Fish Hobbyist) Cydne Tom Ray <t_a_ray_cissp@...> wrote: I've been asked to identfy a few. Any recommendations (favorable or not)? Thanks again, --Tom(myBoy) Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Saltwater aquarium Marine biologist Reef tank --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! DSL Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16039	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 12/5/2005
Subject: FISH ID PLEASE

Picture under blood parrot album labled "fish id". The smallest white fish, what is it? And do they school if I buy more than one? I'm looking to add to a 10 gal. and since I already have one of these I will get a couple more if they like to be in groups. I am also adding two cory cats to go with the lonely one. Thank you, Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16040	From: Justin M.	Date: 12/5/2005
Subject: Re: FISH ID PLEASE

At 09:00 PM 05/12/2005 -0600, you wrote: >Picture under blood parrot album labled "fish id". The smallest white >fish, what is it? And do they school if I buy more than one? >I'm looking to add to a 10 gal. and since I already have one of these I >will get a couple more if they like to be in groups. I am also adding >two cory cats to go with the lonely one. Looks like a white skirt tetra to me. These fish have the unfortunate fate of frequently being dyed bright colours. Nice to see one that hasn't been used this way. If this is in fact what it is, they will school, like most tetras. JM

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16041	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 12/5/2005
Subject: Re: FISH ID PLEASE

I know the larger of the two is a white skirt, but so is the small one? I was way off if that's the case. =) Leslie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Justin M. Sent: Monday, December 05, 2005 9:43 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] FISH ID PLEASE At 09:00 PM 05/12/2005 -0600, you wrote: >Picture under blood parrot album labled "fish id". The smallest white >fish, what is it? And do they school if I buy more than one? I'm >looking to add to a 10 gal. and since I already have one of these I >will get a couple more if they like to be in groups. I am also adding >two cory cats to go with the lonely one. Looks like a white skirt tetra to me. These fish have the unfortunate fate of frequently being dyed bright colours. Nice to see one that hasn't been used this way. If this is in fact what it is, they will school, like most tetras. JM Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16042	From: Raymond Wetzel	Date: 12/5/2005
Subject: Re: FISH ID PLEASE

Checked out this photo several days ago at your request. Hard to tell about the small one as it is not clear nor quite in focus. Very possibly a type of Tetra, but can't see it well enough to make a positive I.D. Could also be a Barb. I believe I see what possibly appears to be elongated dorsal and anal fins; if so it could be a type of threadfin Rainbow. A better (larger and clearer) picture would be of immense help. Any one of these 3 Families should school. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie & Dane Moore" <5moores@c...> wrote: > > Picture under blood parrot album labled "fish id". The smallest white > fish, what is it? And do they school if I buy more than one? > I'm looking to add to a 10 gal. and since I already have one of these I > will get a couple more if they like to be in groups. I am also adding > two cory cats to go with the lonely one. > Thank you, > Leslie > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16043	From: princezzuno	Date: 12/5/2005
Subject: Re: Fish Id

I looked at the picture, and as best I can see it is either a albino rummy nose or head n tail, definetly a tetra. The is a colored skirt and a rosy barb also in the picture. Either way they are all are schooling fish.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16044	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 12/5/2005
Subject: Re: Freshwater Local Clubs for louisville/bloomington

Tom - A few quickies and then a Private email to you Louisville, Kentucky - ~~>*Louisville Tropical Fish Fanciers websight http://www.ltff.net/ contact email John Campbell (jkcjohn@...) Yahoo Group: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/LTFF ~~>* Louisville Marine Aquarium Society websight http://www.lmas.org/ Discussion Forum open to public on websight Bloomington, Indiana Closest Club I know of is in Indianapolis about an hour North .. Circle City Aquarium Club- Indianapolis websight http://circlecityaqclub.org/ Discussion Forum: viewable to public only Yahoo Group : http://groups.yahoo.com/group/circlecityaquariumclub i think the yahoo groups would probally get you all the required info you need for either location. I have asked about LFS in Bloomington on the CCAC forum so if you join you can view archive for replies.... rob Ft Wayne, Indiana Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16045	From: KttmfC	Date: 12/6/2005
Subject: Re: FISH ID PLEASE

in my opinion its a lemon tetra... other possibilities but look it up online and check. just type into google or yahoo, tetra pictures and youll get it. Kris

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16046	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 12/6/2005
Subject: Re: Hobby Magazines for Holiday Gifts.

for a new fish keeper I'd choose Aquarium Fish for a long term hobbyist I'd choose tropical fish Hobbyist or Freshwater and Marine Aquarium Magazine In a message dated 12/5/2005 10:04:27 PM US Eastern Standard Time, cydthekid50@... writes: I like TFH (Tropical Fish Hobbyist) Cydne Tom Ray <t_a_ray_cissp@...> wrote: I've been asked to identfy a few. Any recommendations (favorable or not)? Thanks again, --Tom(myBoy) Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16047	From: Justin M.	Date: 12/6/2005
Subject: Re: FISH ID PLEASE

At 09:56 PM 05/12/2005 -0600, you wrote: >I know the larger of the two is a white skirt, but so is the small one? >I was way off if that's the case. =) Doh! Maybe I should have read your post a little more carefully before trying to be Mister Smart Guy ;) My mistake! JM

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16048	From: Raymond Wetzel	Date: 12/6/2005
Subject: Re: Fish Id

Now that is exactly what I thought, that it resembled a Rummy Nose Tetra above anything else I mentioned, but did not want to say for sure going by the quality of the photo. I think you've got it, unless a better pic forthcoming proves otherwise. As I'm not into Tetras much at the moment, I'm not sure if an albino Rummy Nose has been developed, unless perhaps its something new. Can't even find a reference to them on the Net (Google), but the general shape looks close. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "princezzuno" <princezzuno@y...> wrote: > > I looked at the picture, and as best I can see it is either a albino > rummy nose or head n tail, definetly a tetra. The is a colored skirt > and a rosy barb also in the picture. Either way they are all are > schooling fish. >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16049	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 12/6/2005
Subject: Re: FISH ID PLEASE

In a message dated 12/5/2005 10:40:51 PM Eastern Standard Time, 5moores@... writes: <<<Picture under blood parrot album labled "fish id". The smallest white fish, what is it? And do they school if I buy more than one? I'm looking to add to a 10 gal. and since I already have one of these I will get a couple more if they like to be in groups. I am also adding two cory cats to go with the lonely one.>>> The picture isn't clear enough for a positive id, but I believe it is a pristella tetra. Do the dorsal and anal fin have a black spot halfway up? Are both fins quite narrow for their length? Here's a picture: http://animal-world.com/encyclo/fresh/characins/pristella.php If it is a pristella, they're nice, peaceful fish that should do well in a 10 gallon. They're also easy to find as most lfs and even the large chains should have them regularly. All my hopes, Vicky Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Contact mosherd@... or (301-451-9390) =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: FCR-Cancer-Support@yahoogroups.com Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@... 919-513-1467, Dr London @ london.20@... 614-292-9554 _AND_ Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16050	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 12/6/2005
Subject: Fish ID, New Pics

There are two more pictures of the white fish under the blood parrot album. They still are not the BEST quality, my camera I guess. Thank you for all the help. I do plan on getting 2 more once I find out what it is. Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16051	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 12/6/2005
Subject: Re: FISH ID PLEASE

It does look a lot like the one I have. The black is not as prominent but he does have the red tail fin. A black spot half way up and the fins are both very thin for their length. Hmmmm. ID maybe? =) Leslie -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of seleya8@... Sent: Tuesday, December 06, 2005 7:24 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] FISH ID PLEASE

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16052	From: Raymond Wetzel	Date: 12/6/2005
Subject: Re: Fish ID, New Pics

Leslie, Okay, that appears to be an albino Pristella tetra. It is a schooling fish (peaceful) and wouldn't bite anything more than the food that was being offered to it. Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie & Dane Moore" <5moores@c...> wrote: > > There are two more pictures of the white fish under the blood parrot > album. They still are not the BEST quality, my camera I guess. > > Thank you for all the help. I do plan on getting 2 more once I find out > what it is. > > Leslie > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16053	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 12/6/2005
Subject: Re: FISH ID PLEASE

In a message dated 12/6/2005 9:12:29 AM Eastern Standard Time, 5moores@... writes: <<<It does look a lot like the one I have. The black is not as prominent but he does have the red tail fin. A black spot half way up and the fins are both very thin for their length. Hmmmm. ID maybe? =)>>> Yes, in the new photos I can clearly see the yellow, black, white on the dorsal (the anal should match). They kinda twitch those fins much like scissortails but not quite as obviously as they school. They are very nice, peaceful fish; active but not too busy middle swimmers. Great fish for a 10. What do I win? ;-) Vicky Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Contact mosherd@... or (301-451-9390) =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: FCR-Cancer-Support@yahoogroups.com Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@... 919-513-1467, Dr London @ london.20@... 614-292-9554 _AND_ Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16054	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/6/2005
Subject: Re: Hobby Magazines for Holiday Gifts.

Tom, For which country? For what level aquarist? Any specific interest (cichlids, livebearers, bettas, etc.)? \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Tom Ray Sent: Monday, December 05, 2005 6:51 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Hobby Magazines for Holiday Gifts. I've been asked to identfy a few. Any recommendations (favorable or not)? Thanks again, --Tom(myBoy) Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16055	From: princezzuno	Date: 12/6/2005
Subject: Re: Fish ID, New Pics

I will concur. It does look to be a Pristella. A better picture would definetly help. Just like the others in the picture it is a schooling and will be peaceful. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Raymond Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > Leslie, Okay, that appears to be an albino Pristella tetra. It is a > schooling fish (peaceful) and wouldn't bite anything more than the food > that was being offered to it. Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie & Dane Moore" > <5moores@c...> wrote: > > > > There are two more pictures of the white fish under the blood parrot > > album. They still are not the BEST quality, my camera I guess. > > > > Thank you for all the help. I do plan on getting 2 more once I find > out > > what it is. > > > > Leslie > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16056	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 12/6/2005
Subject: snail popl control

I am wondering are there other freshwater fish that can knock out a snail population... it seems I don't have much luck with loaches. MM & MP, '73 Tricia, KG6PNC A couple of great sites for fun http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16057	From: Ambisense	Date: 12/7/2005
Subject: Ich help!

Hi everyone, I have a problem that I hope someone can help me with. I bought a 70 gal and set it up...i waited till it cycled, watched the water params very carefully and then placed the fishes (fancy gold fishes) in. Shortly after that, I bought new aqua plants and I guess they carried ich - my bad for not salting the plants a bit before putting it in the tank - but now the tank has exploded in ich. I have tried the salt treatment for 10 days (yes I did it according to procedure, got it up to 0.3% salinity, raised it to that salnity over a course of 48 hours, raised the temp to 25 degrees celcius, did daily vacuuming, etc etc) and it's just getting worst and worst. in fact, my lion head has so much ich on her that I even see some under her gills (one of her gills is transparent) so then I stopped the the salt treatment and went to the store and was highly recommended Super Ich Cure capsule. The instructions said that one capsule should be used per 5 gal and I used the correct dose, pre dissolved it into a cup filled with the tank water and then I put the medication in the tank. Turned the whole tank blue but I was told this is normal and not to panic. Has anyone used Super Ich Cure Capsule? AM I to follow the instructions on the box? It says to give a dose, wait 48 hours, give another dose, wait another 48 hours and then do a 25% water change. However, I ran across this site: http://www.netpets.com/fish/reference/freshref/ich.html and it says "...Disregard the instructions on the bottle!!!!! Use the DOSE written on the bottle, but treat like this: Treat every 3 to 4 days for 4 treatments, changing 50% of the water before every treatment. Do NOT treat once or twice, like the directions will tell you! You need to treat over 12 to 16 days in order to get all the little guys when they are vulnerable. (See life cycle diagram for explanation)..." "...(Excuse the digression here, but this is my chance to vent my frustration at the aquarium trade -- I think they purposefully give poor medicating information so that the consumer will treat only partially, and knock down the parasite burden only enough to temporarily cure the fish! Because not all the organisms are dead, they will bounce back in a few weeks or months, and the poor consumer has to run out and but more of the ich medication! What a scam!!)..." I called the pet store and inquired about this and they just weren't any help. They didnt even KNOW what ich was. Any input on this matter would be greatly appreciated!! -Amy

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16058	From: Ambisense	Date: 12/7/2005
Subject: Photos of Ich

I just wanted to share some photos of my fishes that are infected with ich. This is chewy and her whole body is dotted like her tail here, it just didn't show up on camera: http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v320/Sueen/chewytail2.jpg http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v320/Sueen/chewytail.jpg and here's my moor, he does have some specs of ich..not as bad as chewy and his tail has an odd film of white - doesn't come off to the touch. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v320/Sueen/moortail.jpg -Amy

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16059	From: paul helms	Date: 12/7/2005
Subject: Re: Ich help!

how long did you let it cycle? and how many fish did you add at once? a full cycle is 4-6 weeks, not a few days or a couple weeks. around 3 weeks you have ammonia and or nitrate spikes --- Ambisense <sueentran@...> wrote: > Hi everyone, I have a problem that I hope someone > can help me with. > > I bought a 70 gal and set it up...i waited till it > cycled, watched > the water params very carefully and then placed the > fishes (fancy > gold fishes) in. Shortly after that, I bought new > aqua plants and I > guess they carried ich - my bad for not salting the > plants a bit > before putting it in the tank - but now the tank has > exploded in > ich. > > I have tried the salt treatment for 10 days (yes I > did it according > to procedure, got it up to 0.3% salinity, raised it > to that salnity > over a course of 48 hours, raised the temp to 25 > degrees celcius, > did daily vacuuming, etc etc) and it's just getting > worst and worst. > in fact, my lion head has so much ich on her that I > even see some > under her gills (one of her gills is transparent) so > then I stopped > the the salt treatment and went to the store and was > highly > recommended Super Ich Cure capsule. The instructions > said that one > capsule should be used per 5 gal and I used the > correct dose, pre > dissolved it into a cup filled with the tank water > and then I put > the medication in the tank. Turned the whole tank > blue but I was > told this is normal and not to panic. Has anyone > used Super Ich Cure > Capsule? AM I to follow the instructions on the box? > It says to give > a dose, wait 48 hours, give another dose, wait > another 48 hours and > then do a 25% water change. However, I ran across > this site: > > > http://www.netpets.com/fish/reference/freshref/ich.html > > and it says "...Disregard the instructions on the > bottle!!!!! Use > the DOSE written on the bottle, but treat like this: > Treat every 3 > to 4 days for 4 treatments, changing 50% of the > water before every > treatment. Do NOT treat once or twice, like the > directions will tell > you! You need to treat over 12 to 16 days in order > to get all the > little guys when they are vulnerable. (See life > cycle diagram for > explanation)..." > > "...(Excuse the digression here, but this is my > chance to vent my > frustration at the aquarium trade -- I think they > purposefully give > poor medicating information so that the consumer > will treat only > partially, and knock down the parasite burden only > enough to > temporarily cure the fish! Because not all the > organisms are dead, > they will bounce back in a few weeks or months, and > the poor > consumer has to run out and but more of the ich > medication! What a > scam!!)..." > > I called the pet store and inquired about this and > they just weren't > any help. They didnt even KNOW what ich was. > > Any input on this matter would be greatly > appreciated!! > > -Amy > > > > > > __________________________________________ Yahoo! DSL – Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less. dsl.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16060	From: Fred and Cynthia	Date: 12/7/2005
Subject: Re: Ich help!

The only thing that ever worked for me was Melafix.........adding salt helps too. Frequent water changes. Can't remember how many now because I haven't had the issue for a few years. Sorry! Cynthia http://babyitems.myphotoalbum.com/view_photo.php?set_albumName=album01&id=bag ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ambisense" <sueentran@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, December 06, 2005 9:51 PM Subject: [AquaticLife] Ich help! Hi everyone, I have a problem that I hope someone can help me with. I bought a 70 gal and set it up...i waited till it cycled, watched the water params very carefully and then placed the fishes (fancy gold fishes) in. Shortly after that, I bought new aqua plants and I guess they carried ich - my bad for not salting the plants a bit before putting it in the tank - but now the tank has exploded in ich. I have tried the salt treatment for 10 days (yes I did it according to procedure, got it up to 0.3% salinity, raised it to that salnity over a course of 48 hours, raised the temp to 25 degrees celcius, did daily vacuuming, etc etc) and it's just getting worst and worst. in fact, my lion head has so much ich on her that I even see some under her gills (one of her gills is transparent) so then I stopped the the salt treatment and went to the store and was highly recommended Super Ich Cure capsule. The instructions said that one capsule should be used per 5 gal and I used the correct dose, pre dissolved it into a cup filled with the tank water and then I put the medication in the tank. Turned the whole tank blue but I was told this is normal and not to panic. Has anyone used Super Ich Cure Capsule? AM I to follow the instructions on the box? It says to give a dose, wait 48 hours, give another dose, wait another 48 hours and then do a 25% water change. However, I ran across this site: http://www.netpets.com/fish/reference/freshref/ich.html and it says "...Disregard the instructions on the bottle!!!!! Use the DOSE written on the bottle, but treat like this: Treat every 3 to 4 days for 4 treatments, changing 50% of the water before every treatment. Do NOT treat once or twice, like the directions will tell you! You need to treat over 12 to 16 days in order to get all the little guys when they are vulnerable. (See life cycle diagram for explanation)..." "...(Excuse the digression here, but this is my chance to vent my frustration at the aquarium trade -- I think they purposefully give poor medicating information so that the consumer will treat only partially, and knock down the parasite burden only enough to temporarily cure the fish! Because not all the organisms are dead, they will bounce back in a few weeks or months, and the poor consumer has to run out and but more of the ich medication! What a scam!!)..." I called the pet store and inquired about this and they just weren't any help. They didnt even KNOW what ich was. Any input on this matter would be greatly appreciated!! -Amy Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16061	From: Aaron R. Martin	Date: 12/7/2005
Subject: Re: snail popl control

Clown Loaches have always done the job in my tanks, but I've heard of others like fw puffers and maybe some of the larger variety of fish like sharks. My friend added a young red-tailed shark to his tank that only had, as in past tense, 1 large apple snail - the new fish made a quick meal out of a snail several times its size. The snail was a pet, not a pest and the outcome was unintended. I would get the fish used to the taste of the snails by crushing some at feeding time, once the fish get the idea that those things are a tasty treat they might take care of the snails for you. Some goldfish and gouramis have been know to eat snails also. What kind of Snails and Fish and how many in what size tank? --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Tricia" wrote: > > I am wondering are there other freshwater fish that can knock out a snail population... it seems I don't have much luck with loaches. > > MM & MP, '73 > Tricia, KG6PNC

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16062	From: hank voss	Date: 12/7/2005
Subject: Re: Ich help!

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ambisense" <sueentran@y...> wrote: > > Hi everyone, I have a problem that I hope someone can help me with. > > Amy: Hi: I assume you have a filter running, did you remove the c arbon from it ? As it will remove any med. you put in the tank. Good luck Hank

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16063	From: jigme7777	Date: 12/7/2005
Subject: inquiry

i have got two new red tailed albino sharks but it won't come out of hiding i have made a cave oput of stones. it is very shy i think if it does not eat it 'll die what to do please tell me its been 4 days since it has eating any thing

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16064	From: Tom Ray	Date: 12/7/2005
Subject: Re: Freshwater Local Clubs and Fish Stores (LFS) for Louisville,KY

Aaron: Thanks for the tip (see below). That was a great idea. As I'd said... I'd gone to PlantedTank Forum (they have a place for posting 'em). I'd also gone to FIS who has a directory of clubs and another of LFS, but had not found much. Rob: Thank you also for the contacts and suggestions. I've sent off my emails to 'em. Let's hope they come through. Thank you both and Happy Holidays, --Tom(myBoy) --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Aaron R. Martin" <anonymous122899@y...> wrote: > > Hi Tom, > > I was curious as how to find the LFS some place I'd never been. On the" Yahoo!" main page, click on "Local", then enter "Fish Store" in the first field and "Louisville, Kentucky" ...

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16065	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 12/7/2005
Subject: Re: inquiry

remove all hiding places... so you can see if it is eating. when satisfied it is eating put hiding places back in... Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 12/7/2005 11:58:43 AM US Eastern Standard Time, jigme777@... writes: i have got two new red tailed albino sharks but it won't come out of hiding i have made a cave oput of stones. it is very shy i think if it does not eat it 'll die what to do please tell me its been 4 days since it has eating any thing [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16066	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 12/7/2005
Subject: Re: snail popl control

what other fish do you have in your tank? --- Tricia Wilkerson <trycya@...> wrote: > I am wondering are there other freshwater fish that > can knock out a snail population... it seems I don't > have much luck with loaches. > > MM & MP, '73 > Tricia, KG6PNC > > A couple of great sites for fun > > http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya > > http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez valeendgonzalez@...

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16067	From: Raymond Wetzel	Date: 12/7/2005
Subject: Re: inquiry

Excuse me for saying so, but that sounds a little confusing. You're saying that you have TWO (2) red tailed albino Sharks, but IT(?) won't come out of hiding to feed. Are you saying neither one of the two Sharks will come out? Are they each in separate hiding places? Is it just the newest one of the two Sharks which is in hiding? Do you have TWO Sharks? If its the last case scenario, you should never have two Red tail Sharks (albino or not) in the same aquarium. They will fight every time. Could be the newest Shark is hiding from the resident Shark. Are they both the same size (figuring you have two)? If not, if the newest one is smaller, that may be your answer. If they are both the same size and were introduced to the tank at the same time, one may be ill. How is the other one doing? Have you ever seen them fighting, as they inevitably will do? Or did the one in hiding just go directly into the cave when you got him. How long have you had it/them? Ray \ --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "jigme7777" <jigme777@g...> wrote: > > i have got two new red tailed albino sharks but it won't come out of > hiding i have made a cave oput of stones. it is very shy i think if it > does not eat it 'll die what to do please tell me its been 4 days > since it has eating any thing >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16068	From: Ambisense	Date: 12/7/2005
Subject: Re: Ich help!

Hi Paul, I let it cycle for three weeks but ontop of that at least 80% of the cycled water came from my old cycled tank! i made sure to keep the water in the old tank clean and transfered the water, gravel, plants, filters, etc. But even then I let the new tank cycle for three weeks. -Amy paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: how long did you let it cycle? and how many fish did you add at once? a full cycle is 4-6 weeks, not a few days or a couple weeks. around 3 weeks you have ammonia and or nitrate spikes --------------------------------- Yahoo! Personals Skip the bars and set-ups and start using Yahoo! Personals for free [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16069	From: Ambisense	Date: 12/7/2005
Subject: Re: inquiry

Aside Raymond's point..I'm wondering how new your fishes are if you have one of them...new fishes can take a while to eat - they have to settle down first. My goldies usually dont eat for 1-2 days and my betta went for almost a week before he ate. -Amy --------------------------------- Yahoo! DSL Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16070	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 12/7/2005
Subject: Re: snail popl control

What kind of Snails and Fish and how many in what size tank? I have a 29 and a 55 gal. tank right now the 29 has only snails in it and the 55 has mollies, platys, guppies, and corries. Not sure how many live bearers. The snails are golden mystery and the brown pest snails that unfortunately came with the plants that I had hope to get started. Originally started with 3 of the mystery snails... there has been 3 times that they were so thick in the 29 gal. that they would be 1-2 in. thick on the bottom as well as several on the walls and furniture. We had a family member that wanted a bunch so we took him somewhere in the neighborhood 0f (3 trip) 500-700 each trip. I am at the point that I no longer want to have any snails... I have decided instead to go with corries, bristle noses, and ottos. I have tried using clown loaches a couple of diff. times but they kept dying on me so I just figured they were to sensitive for me to deal with. MM & MP, '73 Tricia, KG6PNC A couple of great sites for fun http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16071	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 12/7/2005
Subject: Re: snail popl control

well since you have other fish the freshwater puffers are out, unless you don't mind them possibly, most likely, eating the other fish. this may sound drastic, but can you rehome your fish for awhile and completely clean out your tank? --- Tricia Wilkerson <trycya@...> wrote: > What kind of Snails and Fish and how many in what > size tank? > > I have a 29 and a 55 gal. tank right now the 29 > has only snails in it and the 55 has mollies, > platys, guppies, and corries. Not sure how many > live bearers. > The snails are golden mystery and the brown pest > snails that unfortunately came with the plants that > I had hope to get started. Originally started with > 3 of the mystery snails... there has been 3 times > that they were so thick in the 29 gal. that they > would be 1-2 in. thick on the bottom as well as > several on the walls and furniture. We had a family > member that wanted a bunch so we took him somewhere > in the neighborhood 0f (3 trip) 500-700 each trip. > I am at the point that I no longer want to have any > snails... I have decided instead to go with corries, > bristle noses, and ottos. > > I have tried using clown loaches a couple of diff. > times but they kept dying on me so I just figured > they were to sensitive for me to deal with. > MM & MP, '73 > Tricia, KG6PNC > > A couple of great sites for fun > > http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya > > http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez valeendgonzalez@...

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16072	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/7/2005
Subject: Re: Ich help!

Amy, I'm not sure that you understand what a cycle is from messages posted throughout the day today. Using your old water will not help with the cycle whether it is getting it started or in lessening the time it takes to complete. The cycle, as we refer to it in a hobby sense is the conversion of ammonia to nitrite to nitrate. Just to get the cycle started, you need a source of ammonia, whether it be from a bottle or a fish. The ammonia will increase for a period, then it will start to decrease while the second step, nitrite, increases. This will reach a peak, and nitrates will start to increase. Nitrate is removed by water changes and plants. When the cycle "completes" (it never really completes, just continues on), your ammonia and nitrites should read 0 ppm. I would suspect that this is not the case in your 70 gallon. It takes 4-8 weeks for a tank to cycle. The addition of plants to your tank is not the source of ich. It was more coincidence than anything else that the ich raised its ugly head in your tank when you added the plants. Ich is present in all tanks. It only shows when conditions are ripe for it. In this case, you had a new tank, and even though you let it sit for three weeks, the tank had not been cycled. Then you went and added some fish. Not only did you add fish to your tank, but you added fish that are known to be among the worst for the amount of ammonia they produce. You do not mention the size nor the number of fish you added. This immediately placed a load of ammonia in the tank that it probably was not ready to handle. This, in turn, stressed the fish, which led to the appearance of ich in the tank. You did do the right thing in adding salt to the tank and raising the temperature. The temperature should be increased to about 29-30^o C for ich. This shortens their lifecycle, and presents more tomosites to the salt in your water faster. This is the only time they are vulnerable to this type of treatment. I'm not sure, off the top of my head what the 0.3% salinity works out to, but you should have added 3 tsps. Salt for each gallon of water. This treatment takes, usually 7-10 days to work and show a distinct lessening of the ich parasite, if not what appears to be a complete cure. This treatment can be rough on your goldfish, however, so I would keep a close eye on them, and try to supersaturate the water with oxygen for them. I am not familiar with the medication you mention. However, if there is a list of ingredients on the container, you are likely to find the main ingredient is salt. They may add other drugs as well, but they serve as more a prophylactic role than anything that can help with ich. However, should you go the packaged medication route, follow the directions religiously. If you have any carbon or any other product in your filter that is supposed to clean water (other than the media that serves for your mechanical filtration) remove it from the filter so that any of the prophylactics are not removed prematurely from the water. If you will be adding any more animals to your tank after this episode is over, be sure to quarantine them for at least 4 weeks. Should they show any signs of disease or parasites, treat them accordingly, and when the seem to be cured start the quarantine period over again. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ambisense Sent: Tuesday, December 06, 2005 9:51 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Ich help! Hi everyone, I have a problem that I hope someone can help me with. I bought a 70 gal and set it up...i waited till it cycled, watched the water params very carefully and then placed the fishes (fancy gold fishes) in. Shortly after that, I bought new aqua plants and I guess they carried ich - my bad for not salting the plants a bit before putting it in the tank - but now the tank has exploded in ich. I have tried the salt treatment for 10 days (yes I did it according to procedure, got it up to 0.3% salinity, raised it to that salnity over a course of 48 hours, raised the temp to 25 degrees celcius, did daily vacuuming, etc etc) and it's just getting worst and worst. in fact, my lion head has so much ich on her that I even see some under her gills (one of her gills is transparent) so then I stopped the the salt treatment and went to the store and was highly recommended Super Ich Cure capsule. The instructions said that one capsule should be used per 5 gal and I used the correct dose, pre dissolved it into a cup filled with the tank water and then I put the medication in the tank. Turned the whole tank blue but I was told this is normal and not to panic. Has anyone used Super Ich Cure Capsule? AM I to follow the instructions on the box? It says to give a dose, wait 48 hours, give another dose, wait another 48 hours and then do a 25% water change. However, I ran across this site: http://www.netpets.com/fish/reference/freshref/ich.html and it says "...Disregard the instructions on the bottle!!!!! Use the DOSE written on the bottle, but treat like this: Treat every 3 to 4 days for 4 treatments, changing 50% of the water before every treatment. Do NOT treat once or twice, like the directions will tell you! You need to treat over 12 to 16 days in order to get all the little guys when they are vulnerable. (See life cycle diagram for explanation)..." "...(Excuse the digression here, but this is my chance to vent my frustration at the aquarium trade -- I think they purposefully give poor medicating information so that the consumer will treat only partially, and knock down the parasite burden only enough to temporarily cure the fish! Because not all the organisms are dead, they will bounce back in a few weeks or months, and the poor consumer has to run out and but more of the ich medication! What a scam!!)..." I called the pet store and inquired about this and they just weren't any help. They didnt even KNOW what ich was. Any input on this matter would be greatly appreciated!! -Amy

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16073	From: jigme7777	Date: 12/8/2005
Subject: Re: inquiry

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Raymond Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > Excuse me for saying so, but that sounds a little confusing. You're > saying that you have TWO (2) red tailed albino Sharks, but IT(?) won't > come out of hiding to feed. Are you saying neither one of the two > Sharks will come out? Are they each in separate hiding places? Is it > just the newest one of the two Sharks which is in hiding? Do you have > TWO Sharks? If its the last case scenario, you should never have two > Red tail Sharks (albino or not) in the same aquarium. They will fight > every time. Could be the newest Shark is hiding from the resident > Shark. Are they both the same size (figuring you have two)? If not, > if the newest one is smaller, that may be your answer. If they are > both the same size and were introduced to the tank at the same time, > one may be ill. How is the other one doing? Have you ever seen them > fighting, as they inevitably will do? Or did the one in hiding just go > directly into the cave when you got him. How long have you had > it/them? Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "jigme7777" <jigme777@g...> wrote: > > > > i have got two new red tailed albino sharks but it won't come out of > > hiding i have made a cave oput of stones. it is very shy i think if it > > does not eat it 'll die what to do please tell me its been 4 days > > since it has eating any thing no i bought them both at the same time. i bought them about 1 week earlier but they dont eat anything and when they see people they go and hide in the caves

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16074	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 12/8/2005
Subject: Re: inquiry

Jig, You cannot have 2 red tailed sharks in the same tank unless it is a very big tank (4ft+). Red tailed sharks are very aggressive towards each other and one will always dominate the other to the level of starving it to death. I myself had a lot of difficulty in keeping 2 red tailed sharks in a 5ft tank and took almost a year of training to get them to start living with each other. Even then, one rules the left half of the tank and the other rules the right half. They still flare at each other when they come within close proximity (I mean 1feet distance). So if you have 2 of these in a 3ft tank, one will almost always hide away and eventually become too weak to even escape the aggressor. Your best bet would be to return one of these back to the fish store and keep only one. Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of jigme7777 Sent: 08 December 2005 14:55 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: inquiry --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Raymond Wetzel" <sevenspringss@w...> wrote: > > Excuse me for saying so, but that sounds a little confusing. You're > saying that you have TWO (2) red tailed albino Sharks, but IT(?) won't > come out of hiding to feed. Are you saying neither one of the two > Sharks will come out? Are they each in separate hiding places? Is it > just the newest one of the two Sharks which is in hiding? Do you have > TWO Sharks? If its the last case scenario, you should never have two > Red tail Sharks (albino or not) in the same aquarium. They will fight > every time. Could be the newest Shark is hiding from the resident > Shark. Are they both the same size (figuring you have two)? If not, > if the newest one is smaller, that may be your answer. If they are > both the same size and were introduced to the tank at the same time, > one may be ill. How is the other one doing? Have you ever seen them > fighting, as they inevitably will do? Or did the one in hiding just go > directly into the cave when you got him. How long have you had > it/them? Ray > \ > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "jigme7777" <jigme777@g...> wrote: > > > > i have got two new red tailed albino sharks but it won't come out of > > hiding i have made a cave oput of stones. it is very shy i think if it > > does not eat it 'll die what to do please tell me its been 4 days > > since it has eating any thing no i bought them both at the same time. i bought them about 1 week earlier but they dont eat anything and when they see people they go and hide in the caves Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16075	From: hank voss	Date: 12/8/2005
Subject: Re: inquiry

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "jigme7777" <jigme777@g...> wrote: > > > > no i bought them both at the same time. i bought them about 1 > week earlier but they dont eat anything and when they see people they > go and hide in the caves > Jig: You say they so both of them are hiding right. That is not uncommon for them to do that. It takes some fish longer to get used to a tank(depends on their tankmates). The first one out of hiding will probably be the boss ,then you may have to seperate them. Dont worry too much about not eating because if they are in good shape to begin with they can go a long time without food. Regards Hank

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16076	From: Rob And Joyce	Date: 12/8/2005
Subject: Sebea anenome question

I've got a sebea anenome (white green tip) for about 6 weeks now. This 29 gallon tank houses a clarkii clown, maroon clown, yellow gobie, clown gobie, scooter blennie, kole tang, kupang damsel and a cherub angel and a host of live rock, corals polyps, snails, crabs and shrimps. The maroon clown has bonded with a bubbletip and hopefully leaves the clarkii alone until it can get moved to my daughters tank at christmas. The problem is, the sebea seems healthy, but doesn't attach. I scooped him out of the tank at my store when it was traveling across some crushed coral, so as to not damage it. I pinpoint feed both anenomes with a variety of frozen food, but the clarkii knocks alot of it away. SG is kept at 1.024, pH 8.2-8.4 over the course of the day and night. Lot's of filtration and water movement, low phosphates and nitrates due to resins and Poly Filter pads (these are great filter additions I'd recommend to anyone, they remove sooo much bad stuff). I use RO water and do 10-15% water changes weekly. Any tips anyone? It seems healthy but just won't attach to anything, it's base just seems bunched up and the clarkii tends to knock it around the tank because of it sometimes. Lighting incluses 2 compacts, one is a 50/50(11am-9pm) and the other is actinic(10am-10pm). I use a host of buffers and additives and monitor levels appropriatly. Other than the aneome, the tank seems fine (knocking on wood). Thanks everyone, Rob.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16077	From: chestercanoy	Date: 12/8/2005
Subject: puffers

ive been seeing freshwater puffers in petshops lately and im planning to buy some. they're new to me... what do they eat?

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16078	From: Fred and Cynthia	Date: 12/8/2005
Subject: Re: puffers

Snails are the main thing, it helps control the teeth..... And mine eats A LOT. Bloodworms are second. I've tried other things like brine shrimp but mine won't eat it Cynthia http://babyitems.myphotoalbum.com/view_photo.php?set_albumName=album01&id=bag ----- Original Message ----- From: "chestercanoy" <chestercanoy@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Thursday, December 08, 2005 11:44 AM Subject: [AquaticLife] puffers ive been seeing freshwater puffers in petshops lately and im planning to buy some. they're new to me... what do they eat? Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16079	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 12/8/2005
Subject: Re: Sebea anenome question

Hi Rob, Your anemone is drifting around because it is trying to find a suitable place to attach but cannot, possible due to one or a combination of the following, water quality, poor water flow, insufficient light. your tank is grossly overcrowded, your fish alone need a tank twice that size and a Tang (Surgeon fish) needs a tank around 100galls they are very active fast swimmers and need a lot of room. Why do you use "a host of buffers and additives"?, it sounds as if your anemone does not like the lack of light and the chemical 'pea soup' you have put it in. I would suggest that your first priority is a far bigger tank. regards, unclenorm. --- Rob And Joyce <bucks_boogie@...> wrote: > I've got a sebea anenome (white green tip) for about > 6 weeks now. This 29 gallon tank houses a clarkii > clown, maroon clown, yellow gobie, clown gobie, > scooter blennie, kole tang, kupang damsel and a > cherub angel and a host of live rock, corals polyps, > snails, crabs and shrimps. The maroon clown has > bonded with a bubbletip and hopefully leaves the > clarkii alone until it can get moved to my daughters > tank at christmas. The problem is, the sebea seems > healthy, but doesn't attach. I scooped him out of > the tank at my store when it was traveling across > some crushed coral, so as to not damage it. I > pinpoint feed both anenomes with a variety of frozen > food, but the clarkii knocks alot of it away. SG is > kept at 1.024, pH 8.2-8.4 over the course of the day > and night. Lot's of filtration and water movement, > low phosphates and nitrates due to resins and Poly > Filter pads (these are great filter additions I'd > recommend to anyone, they remove sooo much bad > stuff). I use RO water and do 10-15% water changes > weekly. Any tips anyone? It seems healthy but just > won't attach to anything, it's base just seems > bunched up and the clarkii tends to knock it around > the tank because of it sometimes. Lighting incluses > 2 compacts, one is a 50/50(11am-9pm) and the other > is actinic(10am-10pm). I use a host of buffers and > additives and monitor levels appropriatly. Other > than the aneome, the tank seems fine (knocking on > wood). > Thanks everyone, Rob. > > > > ___________________________________________________________ To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. http://uk.security.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16080	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 12/8/2005
Subject: Re: puffers

They are carnivores Snails, live foods, frozen foods if your lucky No freeze dried foods Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 12/8/2005 7:53:02 PM US Eastern Standard Time, fcouellet@... writes: Snails are the main thing, it helps control the teeth..... And mine eats A LOT. Bloodworms are second. I've tried other things like brine shrimp but mine won't eat it Cynthia [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16081	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 12/8/2005
Subject: Re: puffers

Also, make sure they're truly freshwater -- some places keep brackish puffers in fresh. Do your research. They are also _tough_ on most possible tankmates. Species tanks are advisable with them tho a few fish can cohabitate. No inverts, whatsoever, and few fish can survive their incessant pecking. Vicky Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Contact mosherd@... or (301-451-9390) =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: FCR-Cancer-Support@yahoogroups.com Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@... 919-513-1467, Dr London @ london.20@... 614-292-9554 _AND_ Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16082	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 12/8/2005
Subject: Re: snail popl control

Hmmm... ok I am thinking that the red-tailed shark may be my best choice. I am just wondering if my corries and live bearers would be safe? Does anyone have a good resource site on red-tailed sharks... I have seen them @ the pet store, but do not know much about them... things like should I just get 1 for each tank? Has anyone else used this fish for snail pop control? My hubby keeps looking at this particular fish everytime we go to the pet store so I guess I just might get some... LOL Thanks for any advice or resources in advance. MM & MP, '73 Tricia, KG6PNC A couple of great sites for fun http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya ----- Original Message ----- From: Valeen Gonzalez To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, December 07, 2005 4:09 PM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: snail popl control well since you have other fish the freshwater puffers are out, unless you don't mind them possibly, most likely, eating the other fish. this may sound drastic, but can you rehome your fish for awhile and completely clean out your tank? --- Tricia Wilkerson <trycya@...> wrote: > What kind of Snails and Fish and how many in what > size tank? > > I have a 29 and a 55 gal. tank right now the 29 > has only snails in it and the 55 has mollies, > platys, guppies, and corries. Not sure how many > live bearers. > The snails are golden mystery and the brown pest > snails that unfortunately came with the plants that > I had hope to get started. Originally started with > 3 of the mystery snails... there has been 3 times > that they were so thick in the 29 gal. that they > would be 1-2 in. thick on the bottom as well as > several on the walls and furniture. We had a family > member that wanted a bunch so we took him somewhere > in the neighborhood 0f (3 trip) 500-700 each trip. > I am at the point that I no longer want to have any > snails... I have decided instead to go with corries, > bristle noses, and ottos. > > I have tried using clown loaches a couple of diff. > times but they kept dying on me so I just figured > they were to sensitive for me to deal with. > MM & MP, '73 > Tricia, KG6PNC > > A couple of great sites for fun > > http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya > > http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez valeendgonzalez@... Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biologist Biology Bucharest romania San francisco bay area United kingdom South africa ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16083	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 12/9/2005
Subject: Re: snail popl control

Don't have any resources off hand, but my folks have a red-tail in their tank and he pretty much ignores everyone, and she has 3 albino corys, 3 gouramis, 5 white skirt tetras, and 2 dwarf frogs, and two clown loaches. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tricia Wilkerson" <trycya@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Thursday, December 08, 2005 8:36 PM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: snail popl control Hmmm... ok I am thinking that the red-tailed shark may be my best choice. I am just wondering if my corries and live bearers would be safe? Does anyone have a good resource site on red-tailed sharks... I have seen them @ the pet store, but do not know much about them... things like should I just get 1 for each tank? Has anyone else used this fish for snail pop control? My hubby keeps looking at this particular fish everytime we go to the pet store so I guess I just might get some... LOL Thanks for any advice or resources in advance. MM & MP, '73 Tricia, KG6PNC A couple of great sites for fun http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya ----- Original Message ----- From: Valeen Gonzalez To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, December 07, 2005 4:09 PM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: snail popl control well since you have other fish the freshwater puffers are out, unless you don't mind them possibly, most likely, eating the other fish. this may sound drastic, but can you rehome your fish for awhile and completely clean out your tank? --- Tricia Wilkerson <trycya@...> wrote: > What kind of Snails and Fish and how many in what > size tank? > > I have a 29 and a 55 gal. tank right now the 29 > has only snails in it and the 55 has mollies, > platys, guppies, and corries. Not sure how many > live bearers. > The snails are golden mystery and the brown pest > snails that unfortunately came with the plants that > I had hope to get started. Originally started with > 3 of the mystery snails... there has been 3 times > that they were so thick in the 29 gal. that they > would be 1-2 in. thick on the bottom as well as > several on the walls and furniture. We had a family > member that wanted a bunch so we took him somewhere > in the neighborhood 0f (3 trip) 500-700 each trip. > I am at the point that I no longer want to have any > snails... I have decided instead to go with corries, > bristle noses, and ottos. > > I have tried using clown loaches a couple of diff. > times but they kept dying on me so I just figured > they were to sensitive for me to deal with. > MM & MP, '73 > Tricia, KG6PNC > > A couple of great sites for fun > > http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya > > http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez valeendgonzalez@... Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biologist Biology Bucharest romania San francisco bay area United kingdom South africa ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16084	From: Valeen Gonzalez	Date: 12/9/2005
Subject: Re: puffers

most, if not all, puffers should be kept in species only tanks because they tend to be aggressive and have sharp teeth they use to eat things like snails, crabs, etc. i wouldn't put them in a community tank with things like tetras, angels, etc. if i were you, unless you don't mind those fish getting possibly eaten when the puffer feels like it. --- chestercanoy <chestercanoy@...> wrote: > ive been seeing freshwater puffers in petshops > lately and im planning > to buy some. they're new to me... what do they eat? > > > > > > Valeen Robertson Gonzalez valeendgonzalez@...

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16085	From: Amber	Date: 12/9/2005
Subject: Saltwater chat!

Hey anyone who has a saltwater tank...I need help...add me to your messenger list please please lol

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16086	From: Jerry Young	Date: 12/9/2005
Subject: Re: Need book referral on mixing freshwater fish

The COMPLETE AQUARIUM by Peter W. Scott from DK Publications. They have information about almost everything from compatibility of fish to choice of plants and substrate and equipments. Check it out, http://www.aquahobby.com/books/e_scott1.php bunnycareshi <bunnycareshi@...> wrote: Aloha As you can well imagine, I'm getting quite differing opinions from various pet stores on which freshwater fish are ok to mix. Right now my aquarium is pretty simple: 30 gal freshwater w/1 Clown Loach, 2 Marbled Angels - all 3 are 3-4" - and 1 catfish, which I *think* is a Pictus, which is a fat 5". I'm going to sell the 2 Angels, get a "buddy" Clown for the other, and not sure what I'm doing w/the catfish. What I really want to do is get smaller fish, so I can have more fish and more variety. Specific questions are: 1) Since my Clown is about 3", do I have to get a Clown exactly the same size or can it be 2"? 2) Can you recommend a current book that will tell me what small fish I can mix with what will be my 2 Clowns, and if you've got any general suggestions for fish to start acquiring, that would be great. I like colorful, active fish. Mahalo, Cinde - Hawaii __________________________________________ Yahoo! DSL – Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less. dsl.yahoo.com Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biology Marine fish Biology --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Shopping Find Great Deals on Holiday Gifts at Yahoo! Shopping [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16087	From: Laura	Date: 12/10/2005
Subject: Columbian Tetras in trouble

I have a new tank that is just now two weeks old. I purchased, at the advice of the pet store, three columbian tetras to cycle the tank (29 gallons) and was told to do nothing to the tank for two weeks. The first week and a half was great. Those fish have played and played and played. However, for about 3-4 days they are staying at the bottom and two of them have scales missing and messed up fins. I can barely get them to come up to feed. The other fish is perfectly fine but I am thinking the little guy may have turned against his tank mates??? I have seen him chase during those first few days but I thought they were playing. The only thing that also concerns me about him is that he is also staying at the bottom and not swimming around. All three of them are staying hidden. The only other trigger that I can see is that one night the pump fell off of the back of the aquarium and pulled the two air stones out. I have an over the bak filter which moves the water around already and the bubble walls were really just because I like the way they look, etc. To my knowledge they are not required for the fish since water is being moved around by the filter. I have not fixed those back yet so they are not currently running. I have checked all of my nitrates and ph and nothing has changed to an area of caution or stress through this whole two weeks......the highest the nitrates have gotten is 40ppm.....ph and temp still the same.... We were supposed to go on today to take the water in to the store to be tested and to buy new fish if all was well..... Sooo....do my fish have some sort of disease or are they traumatized by the pump falling out and the air stones being ripped out?? Thank you, Laura [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16088	From: Justin M.	Date: 12/10/2005
Subject: Re: Columbian Tetras in trouble

At 08:20 AM 10/12/2005 -0600, you wrote: > >I have a new tank that is just now two weeks old. I purchased, at the advice >of the pet store, three columbian tetras to cycle the tank (29 gallons) and >was told to do nothing to the tank for two weeks. You received some bad advice, in my opinion. Cycling a tank with fish in it is almost always harmful to the fish, as you're seeing now. I doubt their behaviour has been triggered by the accident with your pump; these fish are being poisoned by the water. Nitrates at 40 ppm is a ways too high, it needs to be under 20 or it's bad for the fish. But the real killer at work here is ammonia. You mentioned taking your water into the store to be tested, but I don't think I'd trust the results they give you, if they suggested "doing nothing for two weeks". I'd recommend purshasing test kits for ammonia and nitrite (you mentioned you had test results for nitrate and pH, so I assume you already have test kits for these). The only safe amount for ammonia and nitrite is 0 ppm, so you'll need to do frequent water changes to get these as low as possible. You've probably got a month or so to go before the cycle is complete. Start with water changes every day or second day to get the ammonia down, feed as little as you can get away with, and take it from there. Good luck! JM

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16089	From: Laura	Date: 12/10/2005
Subject: Re: Columbian Tetras in trouble

I forgot to say that my nitrites are at zero...........the strip doesnt actually test for ammonia but does the nitrites and nitrates.....its a jungle 5n1 test strip for nitrate, nitrite,total hardness (gh), total alkalinity (kh) and then ph. Do I need to medicate them or simply do the water changes? Will their fins grow back? Do you think the one fish is being aggressive and should be taken back to the store?? Thanks for your help, Laura Merry CHRISTmas and may this CHRISTIAN holiday bring you great joy, happiness, love and peace. -------Original Message------- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Date: 12/10/05 08:40:23 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Columbian Tetras in trouble At 08:20 AM 10/12/2005 -0600, you wrote: > >I have a new tank that is just now two weeks old. I purchased, at the advice >of the pet store, three columbian tetras to cycle the tank (29 gallons) and >was told to do nothing to the tank for two weeks. You received some bad advice, in my opinion. Cycling a tank with fish in it is almost always harmful to the fish, as you're seeing now. I doubt their behaviour has been triggered by the accident with your pump; these fish are being poisoned by the water. Nitrates at 40 ppm is a ways too high, it needs to be under 20 or it's bad for the fish. But the real killer at work here is ammonia. You mentioned taking your water into the store to be tested, but I don't think I'd trust the results they give you, if they suggested "doing nothing for two weeks". I'd recommend purshasing test kits for ammonia and nitrite (you mentioned you had test results for nitrate and pH, so I assume you already have test kits for these). The only safe amount for ammonia and nitrite is 0 ppm, so you'll need to do frequent water changes to get these as low as possible. You've probably got a month or so to go before the cycle is complete. Start with water changes every day or second day to get the ammonia down, feed as little as you can get away with, and take it from there. Good luck! JM Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16090	From: Justin M.	Date: 12/10/2005
Subject: Re: Columbian Tetras in trouble

At 08:44 AM 10/12/2005 -0600, you wrote: >I forgot to say that my nitrites are at zero...........the strip doesnt >actually test for ammonia but does the nitrites and nitrates.....its a >jungle 5n1 test strip for nitrate, nitrite,total hardness (gh), total >alkalinity (kh) and then ph. > >Do I need to medicate them or simply do the water changes? Will their fins >grow back? Do you think the one fish is being aggressive and should be >taken back to the store?? You didn't mention the fin damage in your original email. I don't know much about the species you're keeping...if one is bullying the others, you may have to take it back to the store. If the fin-fraying is due to aggression, it should heal on it's own...though the current water conditions could hamper this. If it's a disease, like fin rot, you'll have to medicate...you'll have to decide which of these is the cause. Nitrite is the second stage in the nitrogen cycle...and you probably won't see any of it for a while yet. If you don't know already, a basic rundown of the nitrogen cycle is as follows... Decaying organic material, whether it's fish waste, uneaten food, or even a dead fish, breaks down into ammonia as it decays. A bacterial culture (one that needs to grow to a certain size to be effective) converts the toxic ammonia into nitrite, which unfortunately is just as toxic. Then a second form of bacteria, which also needs to grow in your tank, converts nitrIte into nitrAte, which is still somewhat toxic, but generally harmless at concentrations under 20 ppm. So basically at this point, you're waiting for those bacterial cultures to grow. There isn't really a way to speed the process along, all you can do is perform frequent water changes (no more than 50% at a time) to protect your fish. If you decide to pick up an ammonia test kit, I recommend a liquid reagent kit. Aquarium Pharmaceuticals makes a good one, but there are several others that work. I've never used a dip strip-type kit, such as the one you have, but I've ready many complaints about their accuracy. Anyways, I hope this helps...keep us posted on how your tank is doing! JM

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16091	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/10/2005
Subject: Re: Columbian Tetras in trouble

Not to be argumentative, but, nitrates at 40 ppm is perfectly acceptable in a freshwater tank. In fact, you can go much higher without ill effects to the critters in your tank. What is important here is the level of ammonia, likely to be high, and nitrites, likely to be rising at this juncture in time. In a cycled tank, both these reading should be 0 ppm. Nitrates are the end product of the aquarium cycle. While one would ideally like to keep them low, any measurement under 100 ppm is acceptable. Use of live plants and regular water changes should keep nitrates relatively low. The EPA has a regulation stating that nitrates in drinking water should be 10 ppm or less from municipal water systems, there are many who have not yet reached that level of nitrates. If you are not on a municipal water system, then you are at the mercy of your water supply for nitrates. One should also always measure their tap water to determine the parameters of the water that is being delivered. The same tests you perform on your tank water should be performed on your tap water, namely pH, ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate. The use of chloramines, which bind chlorine with ammonia may make the measurement of ammonia difficult, but treatment of the water to remove the chloramines will generally free the ammonia for testing. Be sure your test kit for ammonia is compatible with your water treatment, though, as some require different reagents to get an accurate measurement. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Justin M. Sent: Saturday, December 10, 2005 9:31 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Columbian Tetras in trouble At 08:20 AM 10/12/2005 -0600, you wrote: > >I have a new tank that is just now two weeks old. I purchased, at the advice >of the pet store, three columbian tetras to cycle the tank (29 gallons) and >was told to do nothing to the tank for two weeks. You received some bad advice, in my opinion. Cycling a tank with fish in it is almost always harmful to the fish, as you're seeing now. I doubt their behaviour has been triggered by the accident with your pump; these fish are being poisoned by the water. Nitrates at 40 ppm is a ways too high, it needs to be under 20 or it's bad for the fish. But the real killer at work here is ammonia. You mentioned taking your water into the store to be tested, but I don't think I'd trust the results they give you, if they suggested "doing nothing for two weeks". I'd recommend purshasing test kits for ammonia and nitrite (you mentioned you had test results for nitrate and pH, so I assume you already have test kits for these). The only safe amount for ammonia and nitrite is 0 ppm, so you'll need to do frequent water changes to get these as low as possible. You've probably got a month or so to go before the cycle is complete. Start with water changes every day or second day to get the ammonia down, feed as little as you can get away with, and take it from there. Good luck! JM

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16092	From: Laura	Date: 12/10/2005
Subject: Re: Columbian Tetras in trouble

Thank you for your advice. I dont know if the problem is cured but I did as you suggested (inferred) and I did a water change of about 30%. Wow...my water was dirty and I didnt even realize it. I think I will have to do that each day for a couple of days. Also, when cleaning the tank I discovered that my heater had been bumped down to about 72. I have one of those sticky" temperature readers on the front of the tank but because I had been told not to add water or change it the level was below that "sticky" temp reader I didnt realize that the temperature was wrong. I guess when the pump fell, taking the air stones with it, it must have also bumped the temperature control therefore lowering the temperature. So, it appears that I may have had several factors causing problems. The good news is that as of right now my fish are swimming around again which they have not done in three days. The water is cloudy due to all the moving around and adding of water etc but I see hope where I thought I was going to lose all of my fish. I was pretty desperate and am glad you answered quickly. Hopefully, I didnt clean it too late and the temperature changes will help. Thanks, Laura Merry CHRISTmas and may this CHRISTIAN holiday bring you great joy, happiness, love and peace. -------Original Message------- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Date: 12/10/05 08:40:23 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Columbian Tetras in trouble At 08:20 AM 10/12/2005 -0600, you wrote: > >I have a new tank that is just now two weeks old. I purchased, at the advice >of the pet store, three columbian tetras to cycle the tank (29 gallons) and >was told to do nothing to the tank for two weeks. You received some bad advice, in my opinion. Cycling a tank with fish in it is almost always harmful to the fish, as you're seeing now. I doubt their behaviour has been triggered by the accident with your pump; these fish are being poisoned by the water. Nitrates at 40 ppm is a ways too high, it needs to be under 20 or it's bad for the fish. But the real killer at work here is ammonia. You mentioned taking your water into the store to be tested, but I don't think I'd trust the results they give you, if they suggested "doing nothing for two weeks". I'd recommend purshasing test kits for ammonia and nitrite (you mentioned you had test results for nitrate and pH, so I assume you already have test kits for these). The only safe amount for ammonia and nitrite is 0 ppm, so you'll need to do frequent water changes to get these as low as possible. You've probably got a month or so to go before the cycle is complete. Start with water changes every day or second day to get the ammonia down, feed as little as you can get away with, and take it from there. Good luck! JM Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16093	From: Laura	Date: 12/10/2005
Subject: Re: Columbian Tetras in trouble

On my stick color comparison chart it does include 40 in the "safe" zone but its the highest of the safe zone. So, I wasnt totally concerned about that as much as I thought some sort of disease had set in. I guess it is possible that each company that makes these "sticks" and "testers" could have their own set of "safe" parameters marked on their bottle though. Laura Merry CHRISTmas and may this CHRISTIAN holiday bring you great joy, happiness, love and peace. -------Original Message------- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Date: 12/10/05 09:23:39 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Columbian Tetras in trouble Not to be argumentative, but, nitrates at 40 ppm is perfectly acceptable in a freshwater tank. In fact, you can go much higher without ill effects to the critters in your tank. What is important here is the level of ammonia, likely to be high, and nitrites, likely to be rising at this juncture in time. In a cycled tank, both these reading should be 0 ppm. Nitrates are the end product of the aquarium cycle. While one would ideally like to keep them low, any measurement under 100 ppm is acceptable. Use of live plants and regular water changes should keep nitrates relatively low. The EPA has a regulation stating that nitrates in drinking water should be 10 ppm or less from municipal water systems, there are many who have not yet reached that level of nitrates. If you are not on a municipal water system, then you are at the mercy of your water supply for nitrates. One should also always measure their tap water to determine the parameters of the water that is being delivered. The same tests you perform on your tank water should be performed on your tap water, namely pH, ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate. The use of chloramines, which bind chlorine with ammonia may make the measurement of ammonia difficult, but treatment of the water to remove the chloramines will generally free the ammonia for testing. Be sure your test kit for ammonia is compatible with your water treatment, though, as some require different reagents to get an accurate measurement. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Justin M. Sent: Saturday, December 10, 2005 9:31 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Columbian Tetras in trouble At 08:20 AM 10/12/2005 -0600, you wrote: > >I have a new tank that is just now two weeks old. I purchased, at the advice >of the pet store, three columbian tetras to cycle the tank (29 gallons) and >was told to do nothing to the tank for two weeks. You received some bad advice, in my opinion. Cycling a tank with fish in it is almost always harmful to the fish, as you're seeing now. I doubt their behaviour has been triggered by the accident with your pump; these fish are being poisoned by the water. Nitrates at 40 ppm is a ways too high, it needs to be under 20 or it's bad for the fish. But the real killer at work here is ammonia. You mentioned taking your water into the store to be tested, but I don't think I'd trust the results they give you, if they suggested "doing nothing for two weeks". I'd recommend purshasing test kits for ammonia and nitrite (you mentioned you had test results for nitrate and pH, so I assume you already have test kits for these). The only safe amount for ammonia and nitrite is 0 ppm, so you'll need to do frequent water changes to get these as low as possible. You've probably got a month or so to go before the cycle is complete. Start with water changes every day or second day to get the ammonia down, feed as little as you can get away with, and take it from there. Good luck! JM Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Marine biologist Biology Bucharest romania San francisco bay area United kingdom South africa YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16094	From: hank voss	Date: 12/10/2005
Subject: Re: Columbian Tetras in trouble

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Laura" <llmdolphin@g...> wrote: > > > The first week and a half > was great. Those fish have played and played and played. However, > Laura: Col. tets are great at getting ich(looks like fish are covered with salt)I would look for this.Usually when they lay on bottom or at the surface their sick espec. since they were ok for 2 wks. Torn fins= male tend to be aggressive to ea. other. Good luck Hank

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16095	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/10/2005
Subject: Re: Columbian Tetras in trouble

Laura, WARNING TO THE UNSUSPECTING--HISTORY LESSON AHEAD! There was a time when nitrates were not even considered to be a problem. As different fish came into the hobby, some were found to be sensitive to high levels of nitrate. Nitrate became a concern then, but the exact levels were somewhat in doubt. Water changes came to be the preferred method to lower nitrates, as most water had very low levels of nitrate, if any at all. Since then it has also been discovered that live plants are large consumers of nitrates, and are also recommended to be used, when possible. (There are fish that never saw a plant they did not like to eat. There are also fish that never saw a plant they could not up-root or otherwise disturb.) When marine fishkeeping came on the scene, it was found that many sea critters could not take any but the lowest amount of nitrate in the water. 0 ppm was the ideal. The search began to limit nitrates in the water column. Things like sump tanks and plenums were developed to remove the nitrates from the water. It was found that an anaerobic bacteria thrived on nitrates. They were the ones who discovered the benefits of plants in removing nitrates and grew many species of algae to remove the algae in their sump tanks (or, now, the refugarium as they are called, as they have become a part of the display tank and often contain critters as well as plants). If you go back into the archives, I believe it was in July of this year, you will find a long discussion of nitrates, with a lot of good information. I believe it was this search for 0 ppm of nitrates by the marine arm of the hobby that has spilled over into the freshwater portion of the hobby. After all, for manufacturers, the marine portion of the hobby is not very large, relatively speaking, and if they can sell some of the marine technology to freshwater, they can expand their base to make a profit. Nothing wrong with this, the freshwater people have often benefited from discoveries on the marine end of things. Also, it is not a bad idea to strive for low nitrates. However, one must be aware that, in FW, nitrates are just not as important as they are to marine folk and their critters. END OF HISTORY LESSON. The level of nitrates found in your tank can be an indicator of the health of the tank. If the nitrates keep increasing without reaching a level and staying within a small range around that level, you have a problem. If your nitrates stabilize around the 40 ppm you mention, you are not in bad shape. From other messages you have posted, it looks like you have neglected to do your regular water changes (and yes, no matter what anyone says, you do need to do regular water changes). Regular water changes should consist of change out at least 10% of the water volume and replace it with water from your water source. Not only does this help you maintain some control over your nitrate levels, but it will remove other chemicals from the water that are seldom mentioned here or in the commonly available literature. The question becomes more of when you should start to worry about the level of nitrates in your water. Some of this depends on the type of fish you are keeping, but in real life, you should start worrying when your nitrate level reaches 100-150 ppm. Higher than this, you are probably looking at some long term health problems with your fish. It may be some time before your fish show signs of problems due to nitrate. If you are keeping fish that are sensitive to nitrates, the level is lower. If your nitrates reach higher levels, then, the question is what to do to resolve the problem. First, a water change is in order to lower the level immediately (unless your water is extraordinarily high in nitrates). More regular water changes may be all you need. However, if you are still experiencing high nitrates, you will need to look deeper for the problem. You will need to find the source of the nitrates, and this can, sometimes take some doing. However, if you remember that nitrates are an end product of the nitrogen cycle, you will first start looking for a source of ammonia. It could be as simple as over crowding your tank, or an overlooked deceased member of your community. Once this is resolved, your nitrate level will start to come down, and you will reach the level that is more normal for your tank. Now, onto the frayed fins you mentioned. This may be a result of high ammonia levels in your tank. That fish may be more sensitive to nitrogenous wastes than others in the tank. Once a fish starts to decline in health, it is normal for other fish to "pick" on it. Survival of the fittest and all, you know. There is no place for the fish to go to get away from this harassment, and as a result, unless you intervene, and the fish will either waste away and die or recover and no longer be picked on. I noticed that you use the test trips, which are fine, in their own right. I'll use them for quick tests, and have also used them when I have been out collecting native fish. They are quick and easy to use, and, if properly stored, will give fairly accurate readings. To give credence to this, many scientists use the test strips to make preliminary measurements, though they can always fall back onto much more accurate, and, of course, much more expensive. I prefer to use the powdered reagents to do my testing. Whenever you buy reagents or test strips, look for an expiration date (not all test strips will show a date), and make sure that the date is far enough into the future that you will be able to use that batch of reagents before the expiration date (or, at least, most of them). Beyond the expiration, the test results cannot be guaranteed to be accurate. The reagents that are sold in tablet form can present difficulties in dissolving properly, and the liquid reagents have a shorter self life and are much more sensitive to light exposure, which can degrade them prior to their expiration. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Laura Sent: Saturday, December 10, 2005 11:16 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Columbian Tetras in trouble On my stick color comparison chart it does include 40 in the "safe" zone but its the highest of the safe zone. So, I wasnt totally concerned about that as much as I thought some sort of disease had set in. I guess it is possible that each company that makes these "sticks" and "testers" could have their own set of "safe" parameters marked on their bottle though. Laura Merry CHRISTmas and may this CHRISTIAN holiday bring you great joy, happiness, love and peace. -------Original Message------- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Date: 12/10/05 09:23:39 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Columbian Tetras in trouble Not to be argumentative, but, nitrates at 40 ppm is perfectly acceptable in a freshwater tank. In fact, you can go much higher without ill effects to the critters in your tank. What is important here is the level of ammonia, likely to be high, and nitrites, likely to be rising at this juncture in time. In a cycled tank, both these reading should be 0 ppm. Nitrates are the end product of the aquarium cycle. While one would ideally like to keep them low, any measurement under 100 ppm is acceptable. Use of live plants and regular water changes should keep nitrates relatively low. The EPA has a regulation stating that nitrates in drinking water should be 10 ppm or less from municipal water systems, there are many who have not yet reached that level of nitrates. If you are not on a municipal water system, then you are at the mercy of your water supply for nitrates. One should also always measure their tap water to determine the parameters of the water that is being delivered. The same tests you perform on your tank water should be performed on your tap water, namely pH, ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate. The use of chloramines, which bind chlorine with ammonia may make the measurement of ammonia difficult, but treatment of the water to remove the chloramines will generally free the ammonia for testing. Be sure your test kit for ammonia is compatible with your water treatment, though, as some require different reagents to get an accurate measurement. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Justin M. Sent: Saturday, December 10, 2005 9:31 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Columbian Tetras in trouble At 08:20 AM 10/12/2005 -0600, you wrote: > >I have a new tank that is just now two weeks old. I purchased, at the advice >of the pet store, three columbian tetras to cycle the tank (29 gallons) and >was told to do nothing to the tank for two weeks. You received some bad advice, in my opinion. Cycling a tank with fish in it is almost always harmful to the fish, as you're seeing now. I doubt their behaviour has been triggered by the accident with your pump; these fish are being poisoned by the water. Nitrates at 40 ppm is a ways too high, it needs to be under 20 or it's bad for the fish. But the real killer at work here is ammonia. You mentioned taking your water into the store to be tested, but I don't think I'd trust the results they give you, if they suggested "doing nothing for two weeks". I'd recommend purshasing test kits for ammonia and nitrite (you mentioned you had test results for nitrate and pH, so I assume you already have test kits for these). The only safe amount for ammonia and nitrite is 0 ppm, so you'll need to do frequent water changes to get these as low as possible. You've probably got a month or so to go before the cycle is complete. Start with water changes every day or second day to get the ammonia down, feed as little as you can get away with, and take it from there. Good luck! JM

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16096	From: Chris	Date: 12/10/2005
Subject: Re: Bioscape

I just found a fantastic tank description whilst looking for information on mudskippers. The homepage is: http://members.ozemail.com.au/~thebobo/mud.htm And the tank description is at: http://members.ozemail.com.au/~thebobo/tank.htm Chris. And click the link in the centre to --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, Iksnip@a... wrote: > > > > Hi Guys, > > Got a question. I am trying to build a south american tank that can house each fish, amphibians, and (with research) the correct lizards. In looking at other tanks in a LFS, I had a couple of questions. In a 75 gallon tank, I am going to lay out 2-3 inches of white sand substrate. I am going to house the bottom with rocks and naturally submerged plants for the fish. Now, I really want to create room for the fish and would like to fill the tank up say, 2/3 with water. To create surface space for the amphibs and lizards obviously one can use logs and other plant life with little branches and perhaps lilly pads. If I want to create enough surface space however, how do I do it? does anyone have any ideas? I would REALLY appreciate any experiences, success and failures, people have with this. > > thanks > > Ken > > PS what are some south american frogs people house their tanks with? > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16097	From: Chris	Date: 12/10/2005
Subject: buying mudskippers in sydney

I'm about to do the legwork myself, but if anyone can point me in the direction of where to buy mudskippers in Sydney, Australia, I'd be most appreciative. Thanks. Chris.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16098	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 12/10/2005
Subject: Re: Columbian Tetras in trouble

Have you tested for ammonia and nitrites? I'm guessing from your post that you have not performed any water changes. Do one immediately (at least half the water) with a gravel vacuum and be sure to use dechlorinator on the new water. Don't add any new fish for the time being until your water is safe. Vicky Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Contact mosherd@... or (301-451-9390) =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: FCR-Cancer-Support@yahoogroups.com Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@... 919-513-1467, Dr London @ london.20@... 614-292-9554 _AND_ Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16099	From: Raymond Wetzel	Date: 12/10/2005
Subject: Re: Columbian Tetras in trouble

Laura, It appears as if you've received some excellent information from two very knowledgeable sources on this Forum, Steve and Hank. Would just like to add that with your tank being set up for this short period of time, you probably wouldn't see much of a reading yet in your nitrites, as you have mentioned. In the cycling process, your ammonia is going to spike first after some ten or so days (your strips aren't testing for that). After this time, and not before approximately another 10 days, you nitrite will spike -- it apparently hasn't reached that point yet. I would suggest testing for ammonia; many hobbyists prefer the drops over the strips as being more accurate, but I won't get into that, its just a suggestion. While you mention that your pH has not changed to an area of caution, you do not say what your pH reading is. If your ammonia reading is high, which at this stage of the cycle it would be expected to be, I would suggest your doing a partial (1/3) change, even though changing out water at this point in time is going to lengthen your cycling time (you will at least ease the stress on your fish). After this water change, I suggest your adding salt to the tank especially if your pH reading is in the alkaline zone. The salt will nilify the effects of the condition called "brown blood" which is caused by the poisonous effects of ammonia in alkaline water. This condition will manifest itself with the fish becoming lethargic, as they now appear to be. Additionally, high ammonia can (will) burn the fishes' gills. Best Regards, Ray > > I forgot to say that my nitrites are at zero...........the strip doesnt > actually test for ammonia but does the nitrites and nitrates.....its a > jungle 5n1 test strip for nitrate, nitrite,total hardness (gh), total > alkalinity (kh) and then ph. > > Do I need to medicate them or simply do the water changes? Will their fins > grow back? Do you think the one fish is being aggressive and should be > taken back to the store?? > > Thanks for your help, > Laura > > > > Merry CHRISTmas and may this CHRISTIAN holiday bring you great joy, > happiness, love and peace. > > > > > -------Original Message------- > > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Date: 12/10/05 08:40:23 > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Columbian Tetras in trouble > > At 08:20 AM 10/12/2005 -0600, you wrote: > > > >I have a new tank that is just now two weeks old. I purchased, at the > advice > >of the pet store, three columbian tetras to cycle the tank (29 gallons) and > >was told to do nothing to the tank for two weeks. > > > You received some bad advice, in my opinion. Cycling a tank with > fish in it is almost always harmful to the fish, as you're seeing now. I > doubt their behaviour has been triggered by the accident with your pump; > these fish are being poisoned by the water. Nitrates at 40 ppm is a ways > too high, it needs to be under 20 or it's bad for the fish. But the real > killer at work here is ammonia. You mentioned taking your water into the > store to be tested, but I don't think I'd trust the results they give you, > if they suggested "doing nothing for two weeks". I'd recommend purshasing > test kits for ammonia and nitrite (you mentioned you had test results for > nitrate and pH, so I assume you already have test kits for these). The only > safe amount for ammonia and nitrite is 0 ppm, so you'll need to do frequent > water changes to get these as low as possible. You've probably got a month > or so to go before the cycle is complete. Start with water changes every > day or second day to get the ammonia down, feed as little as you can get > away with, and take it from there. Good luck! > > JM > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..>< ((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º ((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. > > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16100	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/11/2005
Subject: Triops

I was doing some shopping on the web, looking for presents for my nieces and nephews, and ran across an interesting kit offered by the Smithsonian store called Prehistoric Sea Monsters (http://www.smithsonianstore.com/catalog/product.jsp?productId=12241&categor yId=3212&parentCategoryId=3212 or http://tinyurl.com/88xys, since the first link will definitely wrap). It appears that these are like a freshwater version of brine shrimp, but larger, with a lifespan of 20-40 days and growing to 1-1.5" in length. They seem fairly easy to raise, requiring only plant matter and detritus for food (unlike brine shrimp, which can be difficult to raise) and there may be some cannibalism as well. It is not clear, from what I found on the web, whether the eggs require a dry period for hatching or not. Most are found in temporary ponds, but then some are found in more stable waters. From the quick reads I have done, it seems that these may make a nice food for fish, particularly bottom dwellers, but in my quick reads I have not seen anyone mentioning using them as a live food, but several mentions were made about keeping them with fish, mostly smaller fish and not seeing them being eaten by those fish. Of course, the adult triops would be a mouthful for any but larger fish, so once they reach a certain size, they can probably be kept with most fish that are on the smaller end of the size scale. Does anyone have any experience with these critters? \\Steve// "There is still no cure for the common birthday" -- John Glenn

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16101	From: hank voss	Date: 12/11/2005
Subject: Re: Triops

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > > I was doing some shopping on the web, looking for presents for my nieces and > nephews, and ran across an interesting kit offered by the Smithsonian > Steve: I remember quite a few yrs back somrone sug. them for poss. food but I think they were too big for most fish and hard shelled.I think they were only good when in their larvae stage.And if not mistaken they they did have to be dried out to hatch and too raise enough of them would be a hard job. Regards Hank

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16102	From: Tricia Wilkerson	Date: 12/11/2005
Subject: upside down catfish question?

I have read some reports that they are snail eaters.... is this true? MM & MP, '73 Tricia, KG6PNC A couple of great sites for fun http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=trycya http://www.gopetslive.com/inviter/?Trycya [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16103	From: jerry young	Date: 12/11/2005
Subject: companion for my newts

Hello all! I have a 10 gallon tank with a pair of fire-bellied newts. Can any one suggest a suitable companion for them? I prefer amphibians like frogs but have no idea what kind will be compatible. Thanks!

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16104	From: red eye	Date: 12/12/2005
Subject: Re: companion for my newts

The only compatble frog I know of would have to be a full one :-) red-eye...who has been down this road jerry young <jerry_jla@...> wrote: Hello all! I have a 10 gallon tank with a pair of fire-bellied newts. Can any one suggest a suitable companion for them? I prefer amphibians like frogs but have no idea what kind will be compatible. Thanks! Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16105	From: Robert Hickey	Date: 12/12/2005
Subject: Re: mbuna new tank Setup

Hi all I have a been given a gift of a juwel 180. Currently I have a 260 litres (Uk messures) Discus Tank, with south american chiclids Im thinking of Moving My discus to a new Set up in the new Juwel 180, and converting my 260 litres to a mbuna tank Electric yellows and peacocks etc, I have Read lots about african Chichlids so I know About Aggression feeding And rocks and ph etc, Etc, The problem I am have is the Discus tank I have is an Aquatlantide 260 litres and if anyone knows these tanks there square and kinda tall, but still has a large bottom surface Area and I was planning on building the rocks tall and grouped ( there Will be a fair Amount of them so) along the entire back and left side and some middle to forground rock formations to Allow lots of hidding spaces, Am I nuts doing this, ??? if I think About it and do it Right Could I pull it off??? Any advice to give , greatly received Cheers Irish Rob Regards Robert Hickey Robert Hickey | Networks Engineer Citywest Business Park | BT | Tel: +353 (0)1 4328749 | Mob: +353 (0)86 8061840 | E: robert.hickey@... | www.btireland.ie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16106	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 12/12/2005
Subject: Re: mbuna new tank Setup

Irish Rob, Make sure when stacking those rocks they couldn't be knocked over by the fish. Mbuna are notoriuos diggers and any rocks sitting on a substrate are ideal canidates for the fish to dig under. Some people prefer to put some eggcrate ( ) on the bottom of there tank before adding anything to help distribute the weight of the rocks but also to help absorb some of the shock of a falling rock. When the fish do start digging they are stopped or hampered when they hit the egg crate. You can also get some epoxy to more or less glue your rocks together I'd error on the side of caution if it was me. There are a lot of great mbuna landscpaes people have done kind of like what you are refering to it is possible... :-) Rob NE Indiana USA In a message dated 12/12/2005 11:37:10 AM US Eastern Standard Time, robert.hickey@... writes: Hi all I have a been given a gift of a juwel 180. Currently I have a 260 litres (Uk messures) Discus Tank, with south american chiclids Im thinking of Moving My discus to a new Set up in the new Juwel 180, and converting my 260 litres to a mbuna tank Electric yellows and peacocks etc, I have Read lots about african Chichlids so I know About Aggression feeding And rocks and ph etc, Etc, The problem I am have is the Discus tank I have is an Aquatlantide 260 litres and if anyone knows these tanks there square and kinda tall, but still has a large bottom surface Area and I was planning on building the rocks tall and grouped ( there Will be a fair Amount of them so) along the entire back and left side and some middle to forground rock formations to Allow lots of hidding spaces, Am I nuts doing this, ??? if I think About it and do it Right Could I pull it off??? Any advice to give , greatly received Cheers Irish Rob [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16107	From: Robert Hickey	Date: 12/12/2005
Subject: Re: mbuna new tank Setup

Thanks Rob Yeh heard of the eggcrate thingy , by that you Mean normal egg cartons??????? Dont really want to clue them together that would be a last choice, Im just trying to figure out if my Square tank would be ok, for this As all I have read say a long tank as it spreads the aggression,, Also the stand this tank is on , is the stand that came with the tank, wood, Will it take all that rock ??? Thanks again rob Rob

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16108	From: Tom Ray	Date: 12/12/2005
Subject: Re: Freshwater Local Clubs and Fish Stores (LFS) for Louisville,KY

As a follow-up, I want to let everyone know of one more Website that was sent to me for looking up LFS in the USA, rating them, and looking up the reviews and ratings of LFS: http://www.fishstorereview.com/ Hope this helps others, --TommyBoy --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Tom Ray" <t_a_ray_cissp@y...> wrote: > > Aaron: > > Thanks for the tip (see below). That was a great idea. As I'd said... > I'd gone to PlantedTank Forum (they have a place for posting 'em). > I'd also gone to FIS who has a directory of clubs and another of LFS, > but had not found much. > > Rob: Thank you also for the contacts and suggestions. I've sent off > my emails to 'em. Let's hope they come through. > > Thank you both and Happy Holidays, > --Tom(myBoy) > > --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Aaron R. Martin" > <anonymous122899@y...> wrote: > > > > Hi Tom, > > > > I was curious as how to find the LFS some place I'd never been. On > the" Yahoo!" main page, click on "Local", then enter "Fish Store" in > the first field and "Louisville, Kentucky" ... >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16109	From: amvass2002	Date: 12/12/2005
Subject: Re: Triops

Over at Yahoo groups for "Freshwater Shrimp", one of many knowledgeable individuals discuss, among other things, triops. Stuart Halliday created a website devoted to them, appropriately named, http://mytriops.com/ Very interesting stuff. Great picture on the home page.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16110	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/12/2005
Subject: Re: mbuna new tank Setup

Rob, Eggcrate is a plastic construction that you may find if you look up at fluorescent lighting ceiling fixtures. Generally of white plastic, it is a molded piece with square or rectangular openings. Think of a tic-tac-toe grid, make it three dimensional, ad put a bunch of them together. You should be able to find some at a lighting store--particularly if they do industrial and/or office lighting, or perhaps at a hardware type store that carries lighting. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Robert Hickey Sent: Monday, December 12, 2005 12:42 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] mbuna new tank Setup Thanks Rob Yeh heard of the eggcrate thingy , by that you Mean normal egg cartons??????? Dont really want to clue them together that would be a last choice, Im just trying to figure out if my Square tank would be ok, for this As all I have read say a long tank as it spreads the aggression,, Also the stand this tank is on , is the stand that came with the tank, wood, Will it take all that rock ??? Thanks again rob Rob

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16111	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/12/2005
Subject: Re: Triops

I've bookmarked the page to look at later, when time allows. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of amvass2002 Sent: Monday, December 12, 2005 4:08 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Triops Over at Yahoo groups for "Freshwater Shrimp", one of many knowledgeable individuals discuss, among other things, triops. Stuart Halliday created a website devoted to them, appropriately named, http://mytriops.com/ Very interesting stuff. Great picture on the home page.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16112	From: FortWayneFish@aol.com	Date: 12/12/2005
Subject: Re: mbuna new tank Setup

White Styrene Egg Crate Louvers if pic doesn't come through pic can be viewed at http://www.edee.com/images/eggcratelg.jpg Plastic eggcrate louvers are available in two thickness, our standard 3/8" thick nominal and 1/2" thick nominal. They both are available in styrene and acrylic and our 3/8" louver is also available in black styrene. The standard size is 2' x 4', but the can be cut to smaller sizes. Plastic Eggcrate Louvers play an important role in the lighting, ceiling, elevator cab, display, HVAC and packaging industries. Available in various cell sizes and panel sizes, Eggcrate Louvers can be manufactured or fabricated to special sizes, including oversized dimensions. Numerous finishes are available, such as white, black and chrome (silver). we can get a 2' x 4 ' sheet at home improvement stores for about $15 USd Some people also use styrofoam. They place a layer down on the bottom of there tank then place rocks and substrate inside. Myself I don't like the idea of strofoam in my tanks but a lot of people and a few I know in England swear by the use of it in Mbuna setups. Hope this makes more sense to you Rob :-) Rob NE Indiana USA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16113	From: Robert Hickey	Date: 12/13/2005
Subject: Re: mbuna new tank Setup

Thanks Steve now I get yeh Its just called foam padding in wee Ireland So,, haha Know where i Can get loads of it for free So, Question,, in Cleaning the Eggcrate, wouldnt it be a storage factory For bateria??? How good/ bad Would it be,,? Rob Regards Robert Hickey Robert Hickey | Networks Engineer Citywest Business Park | BT | Tel: +353 (0)1 4328749 | Mob: +353 (0)86 8061840 | E: robert.hickey@... | www.btireland.ie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16114	From: Robert Hickey	Date: 12/13/2005
Subject: Re: mbuna new tank Setup

Jezz Thanks Rob your a Star,, :o) that helps Alot, I actually thought it was plastic foam at first you know the ones your get with an electric component when its Shipped to you,, Hmmm styroform.. might be the easiest And Cheapist option for Me to go For as I have had a Look At some local DIY places And there charging 30 Euro per 2x4 , Rip off Ireland.. :o) Thats Cool. Thanks again Rob and thanks all. Will post a pic when it done,, Rob Regards Robert Hickey Robert Hickey | Networks Engineer Citywest Business Park | BT | Tel: +353 (0)1 4328749 | Mob: +353 (0)86 8061840 | E: robert.hickey@... | www.btireland.ie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16115	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/13/2005
Subject: Re: mbuna new tank Setup

Rob, No, I don't think so. It is not foam, though there is a foam known as eggcrate also. This is a hard plastic--the other Rob--the one from Indiana--found a picture, I guess, for you. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Robert Hickey Sent: Tuesday, December 13, 2005 5:36 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] mbuna new tank Setup Thanks Steve now I get yeh Its just called foam padding in wee Ireland So,, haha Know where i Can get loads of it for free So, Question,, in Cleaning the Eggcrate, wouldnt it be a storage factory For bateria??? How good/ bad Would it be,,? Rob Regards Robert Hickey Robert Hickey | Networks Engineer Citywest Business Park | BT | Tel: +353 (0)1 4328749 | Mob: +353 (0)86 8061840 | E: robert.hickey@... | www.btireland.ie

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16116	From: Justin M.	Date: 12/13/2005
Subject: plant ID

I'm at a loss to identify a plant I saw in my LFS. Unfortunately, the staff in the store were little help (surprise surprise). It's a rooted plant that grows from a stalk, and has pointed, two-tone light green leaves that resemble corn leaves. If I had a camera this would be much easier, but unfortunately I don't. Does anyone have any idea what this plant could be? JM

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16117	From: thedakotawinds	Date: 12/13/2005
Subject: Gold Angel Fish

Hi all, I have nine gold angel fish and would like to get rid of 5 of them. If anyone would like to trade for something I would like, perhaps we can strike up a deal. I am quite interested in Endlers and Heterandria Formosa (least Killi Fish). I live in South Dakota.. Thanks all, Ivan Aqua-Hobbyist@...

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16118	From: Nimish Mathur	Date: 12/13/2005
Subject: Re: plant ID

By the sound of it, seems like a dracaena species or the wheat plant. They both are not true aquatic plants and will eventually rot away and die when placed under water. Nim _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Justin M. Sent: 14 December 2005 03:23 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] plant ID I'm at a loss to identify a plant I saw in my LFS. Unfortunately, the staff in the store were little help (surprise surprise). It's a rooted plant that grows from a stalk, and has pointed, two-tone light green leaves that resemble corn leaves. If I had a camera this would be much easier, but unfortunately I don't. Does anyone have any idea what this plant could be? JM Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. 74/`7.88.><((((:>.74/`7.88.74/`7.8><((((:> 8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..><((((:> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <:((((><.74/`7.88.74/`7.8<:((((><8.74/`7.8. , .74/`7..<:((((><74/`7.88. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16119	From: Justin M.	Date: 12/14/2005
Subject: Re: plant ID

At 07:32 AM 14/12/2005 +0000, you wrote: >By the sound of it, seems like a dracaena species or the wheat plant. They >both are not true aquatic plants and will eventually rot away and die when >placed under water. Good call! It appears to be dracaena sanderiana. Can apparently survive months under water, but as you said, it's not a true aquatic plant. Pity, they're quite attractive. Thanks for your help! JM

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16120	From: bucks_boogie@webtv.net	Date: 12/14/2005
Subject: Re: Sebea anenome

Thanks for the reply uncleneorm, but you've made some assumptions. This tank is not meant as a display tank. I have many clients who've got tanks I care for. They don't want the fish when they are small to go in their display tanks due to the size of their fish. All of the fish in this tank are juveniles and this is a grow out for them, one of several. Since it's in my house, I like to keep it nice, thus the inverts, scooter blennie and kupang, which are the only permanent residents. Besides, my clients do like to see where they're going to be housed to grow out in. It's not a quarantine either, but just someplace to get a bigger, the quarantines are in the basement. This "pea soup" they live in is a proper blend of Seachem Reef Builder, Reef Buffer- Kent Coral Vite, Calcium A&B, Iodine, Iron, Magnesium, Strontium and Molybdenum. These are vital components of a healthy invertebrate and must be replenished and the buffers are meant to prevent pH bounce among other things. These are added at recommended dosages and times. As I've never personally cared for a sebea before, I thought I'd throw the question out there without having to explain nearly every detail of the tank, I should have known better. It's easier to assume and answer, rather than ask a question oneself and then answer, I guess. BTW, none of these fish exceed 2.25 inches and ironically, despite living in pea soup, all the inverts aren't dead ;-). (They actually need to be culled ever so often) The sebea has since settled in now that the clarkii is in its new home and seems to be surviving after all with just 110 watts of light. Filtration in this tank include, Supreme Skilter 500, BioScenic sponge filter, Magnum 350 with Poly Filters and BioMax ceramic chunks, 22 lbs of live rock(probably closer to 35 now that it has spend onto the 10-15 pounds of base rock) and water movement by a PowerSweep and a Penguin 550. The tank has been running for around 5 years. When the east coast lost power a couple of years ago, my marine tanks never even had a slight ammonia spike, running the BioScenic filters off of battery operated airpumps. Anyhow, I digress.... Think this tank's ready for a 13" snowflake eel???? "I'm damaged, and I like it. It made me what I am!"

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16121	From: Norman. S. Hampson.	Date: 12/14/2005
Subject: Re: Sebea anenome

Hi Rob, I made no assumptions, I just commented on the facts as you stated them and stand by what I said, I would add that if you are using a good quality sea salt and doing 10%-15% water changes per week then your "proper blend" is totally unnecessary and possibly detrimental, also your filtration system is more akin to fresh water than marine. regards, unclenorm. bucks_boogie@... wrote: Thanks for the reply uncleneorm, but you've made some assumptions. This tank is not meant as a display tank. I have many clients who've got tanks I care for. They don't want the fish when they are small to go in their display tanks due to the size of their fish. All of the fish in this tank are juveniles and this is a grow out for them, one of several. Since it's in my house, I like to keep it nice, thus the inverts, scooter blennie and kupang, which are the only permanent residents. Besides, my clients do like to see where they're going to be housed to grow out in. It's not a quarantine either, but just someplace to get a bigger, the quarantines are in the basement. This "pea soup" they live in is a proper blend of Seachem Reef Builder, Reef Buffer- Kent Coral Vite, Calcium A&B, Iodine, Iron, Magnesium, Strontium and Molybdenum. These are vital components of a healthy invertebrate and must be replenished and the buffers are meant to prevent pH bounce among other things. These are added at recommended dosages and times. As I've never personally cared for a sebea before, I thought I'd throw the question out there without having to explain nearly every detail of the tank, I should have known better. It's easier to assume and answer, rather than ask a question oneself and then answer, I guess. BTW, none of these fish exceed 2.25 inches and ironically, despite living in pea soup, all the inverts aren't dead ;-). (They actually need to be culled ever so often) The sebea has since settled in now that the clarkii is in its new home and seems to be surviving after all with just 110 watts of light. Filtration in this tank include, Supreme Skilter 500, BioScenic sponge filter, Magnum 350 with Poly Filters and BioMax ceramic chunks, 22 lbs of live rock(probably closer to 35 now that it has spend onto the 10-15 pounds of base rock) and water movement by a PowerSweep and a Penguin 550. The tank has been running for around 5 years. When the east coast lost power a couple of years ago, my marine tanks never even had a slight ammonia spike, running the BioScenic filters off of battery operated airpumps. Anyhow, I digress.... Think this tank's ready for a 13" snowflake eel???? "I'm damaged, and I like it. It made me what I am!" Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos. Get Yahoo! Photos [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16122	From: KttmfC	Date: 12/16/2005
Subject: Blue green algea help

Hey hey everyone! i need a lil help ridding my 100 gallon tank of blue greeen algea, im using co2, 290 watts of light, heavily planted , and residing are discus, rainbows and tetras, bottom are corys botias and a few kribs..... any help would be appreciated. Temp is 80 degrees and the ph is between 6.5 and 7, I try to keep it down. OK for now, ANYONE HAVE HELPFUL HINTS! Kris

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16123	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 12/17/2005
Subject: Re: Blue green algea help

In a message dated 12/17/2005 12:44:45 AM Eastern Standard Time, punk3r12@... writes: <<<Hey hey everyone! i need a lil help ridding my 100 gallon tank of blue greeen algea, im using co2, 290 watts of light, heavily planted , and residing are discus, rainbows and tetras, bottom are corys botias and a few kribs..... any help would be appreciated. Temp is 80 degrees and the ph is between 6.5 and 7, I try to keep it down. OK for now, ANYONE HAVE HELPFUL HINTS!>>> If, by any chance, you're feeding TetraColor, stop. Yes, it does help immensely! ;-) Vicky Have a healthy older Flatcoat? Share the wealth! ASK ME how to help Dr Ostrander help *more* people have healthy older dogs! Contact mosherd@... or (301-451-9390) =) Suspect a tumor? ='( *PLEASE* contact: FCR-Cancer-Support@yahoogroups.com Dr Breen @ CVM_K9Genomics@... 919-513-1467, Dr London @ london.20@... 614-292-9554 _AND_ Dr Ostrander!!! They NEED your specimens! Need to update your AHT info? Please do! Write cathryn.mellersh@... ~~PERMISSION TO CROSS POST IS GRANTED~~ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16124	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 12/17/2005
Subject: Betta breeding questions

I have this female still fat with eggs. I have another male that I have in the same tank, 10 gal., but divided off in a third of it. He made a bubble nest yesterday so I added the female. She found a way out so I had to remake the divider which messed up the nest. This morning there is no other nest. Should I not add her until he makes another one? What if he doesn't? I have NO clue as to what I am doing here so any help is greatly appreciated. Thank you. Leslie [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16125	From: hank voss	Date: 12/17/2005
Subject: Re: Betta breeding questions

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Leslie & Dane Moore" <5moores@c...> wrote: > > I have this female still fat with eggs. > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > Leslie: Myself i prefer to use a smaller tank like a 51/2.If a 10 is all you have then drop the water level by half this makes it poss.for the male to pick up more eggs before the female can get to them.Every once in a while you"ll get a female that will also place eggs in the nest but they are rare. If the divider your using is srore bought type(plastic opaque with holes) the male can not see the fem. to encourage him to rebuild the nest. Why not float the fem. in a glass jar,this will also protect the fem. from the male till he rebuilds the nest.This usually within a couple of days.Keep the tank covered high humidity helps the nest last longer.Temp. 75-80F. When and if they spawn you will have to look at bottom of the nest to see the eggs they will look like little pin heads among the bubbles take the fem. out she will be hiding by then.When the eggs hatch tend to fall out of the nest the male will go after them(he"s not eating the eggs just putting them back in the nest.Fry are quite small and ned very mall food so if you only get afew or none dont get dismayed try again "practice makes perfect" Any half way decent aquar. book will give you more info. P.S. Some males will spawn a female with only a few bubbles along the side of the glass. Good luck Hank

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16126	From: supamii	Date: 12/18/2005
Subject: SAE not eating hair algae

I recently purchased an SAE and much to my dissapointment it has not been eating the hair algae. I'm more than certain that this is not a false SAE since its black stripe extends all the way to it's fin and furthermore it's fins are not dark. Does anyone else have this similar problem? I want to keep my algae problem under control but I already have my small tank over-stocked so buying another SAE is something I don't want to do. It only seems to be nibbling bits of the brown fuzzy algae while the hair algae is quickly growing and expanding out of control.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16127	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/18/2005
Subject: 'TWAS THE NIGHT BEFORE CHRISTMAS

'Twas the Night Before Christmas Linda & Roy Miller Berkshire Museum Aquarium Club 12/76 'Twas the night before Christmas, and Santa was humming, The fish were excited, one even was humming; The fry were all snuggled in their watery beds . . . While visions of brine shrimp swam in their heads; The Cabomba was trimmed and sparkled just right; Of course the Neons you know, provided the light; The colorful ornaments--green, red and gold Green Swordtails, red platies, and goldfish we're told; A big Silver Angel graced the top of the tree, It was the prettiest "Fishmas" tree even could be. And then on the tank top there arose such a clatter . . . The fish swam 'round to see what was the matter. Someone was coming, they could tell by the sound-- Then down the filter tube came Santa with a bound! The stump of a snorkel held tight in his teeth, And the bubbles encircled his head like a wreath. In his furry red wet suit he swam to the tree, And opened his pack for the fishes to see; A new hollowed log for the fry to play tag, Was the very first gift he pulled from his bag; Cans of flake food were next, brine shrimp and squid, And a bubbling treasure chest, with the fluttering lid; New colored gravel, a large piece of slate, It was obvious now the angels would mate. Santa hadn't forgotten them . . . He'd filled every wish, He'd remember each item they put on his list. Then laying a finger aside his air hose . . . And giving a nod, up the tube he arose; But they heard him exclaim as he hopped in his sled . . . Maybe next year I'll bring them a 55 gallon instead! Merry Christmas! \\Steve// "It is much easier to suggest solutions when you don't know too much about the problem." - Malcolm Forbes

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16128	From: fuzzybpebble	Date: 12/18/2005
Subject: Re: SAE not eating hair algae

I have also had this problem. You can get a pair of Snails for Warm Fresh water and they will go to town. They are really fun to watch and will do clean up duty in your tank, as in they will also eat any excess food that is around. They will dine on the algae and you may see some interesting sites while they do this. You can get then at your LFS or I got mine at Walmart in the fish section. They are doing great and my tank is clean. I have 5 white clouds, 2 Otos and 2 snails and have no problem with algae. See if this helps. Bethany --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "supamii" <supamii@y...> wrote: > > I recently purchased an SAE and much to my dissapointment it has not > been eating the hair algae. I'm more than certain that this is not a > false SAE since its black stripe extends all the way to it's fin and > furthermore it's fins are not dark. > > Does anyone else have this similar problem? > > I want to keep my algae problem under control but I already have my > small tank over-stocked so buying another SAE is something I don't > want to do. It only seems to be nibbling bits of the brown fuzzy > algae while the hair algae is quickly growing and expanding out of > control. >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16129	From: bucks_boogie@webtv.net	Date: 12/18/2005
Subject: Re: sebea

As I gladly remove myself from this list, I'd like to add that you "old school" marine hobbiest can keep to yourselfs and swin in the glorious sumps with those useless pretty bioballs wrapped around your brains for all of eternity..... "I'm damaged, and I like it. It made me what I am!"

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16130	From: harry perry	Date: 12/18/2005
Subject: Re: SAE not eating hair algae/Algae control.

Adding algae eating fish helps the problem but you will never eliminate the problem unless you eliminate the source of the algae in the first place. Algae can only exist if it has food. It is a one celled plant. You eliminate the algae food by; not feeding your fish more than once a day or skip a day. Regular water changes, adding plants like hornwort and java moss. To eliminate algae you eliminate the excess nutrients in the tank. Excess nutrients are; Light - put your lights on a timer for 12 hours a day. Fish food - do not ever feed your fish according to the instructions on the container. Your fish can go for 2 weeks without food. Fish waste - Do a 20% water change once a week. Dead plants, dead fish etc. - Think of these as fertilizer for the algae. Live Plants - use live plants to outcompete the algae for the excess nutrients in your tank. Hornwort and Java Moss are nutrient sponges. Help your plants grow with Flourish Excel or co2. The goal is to eliminate any food for the algae. My tanks are all algae free. It's a matter of balance. Harry supamii <supamii@...> wrote: I recently purchased an SAE and much to my dissapointment it has not been eating the hair algae. I'm more than certain that this is not a false SAE since its black stripe extends all the way to it's fin and furthermore it's fins are not dark. Does anyone else have this similar problem? I want to keep my algae problem under control but I already have my small tank over-stocked so buying another SAE is something I don't want to do. It only seems to be nibbling bits of the brown fuzzy algae while the hair algae is quickly growing and expanding out of control. Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Biology Bucharest romania San francisco bay area United kingdom South africa --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16131	From: Patrick	Date: 12/18/2005
Subject: Re: sebea

I can't stand those guys. Everybody knows bioballs and sumps are nitrate factories! :) Patrick ----- Original Message ----- As I gladly remove myself from this list, I'd like to add that you "old school" marine hobbiest can keep to yourselfs and swin in the glorious sumps with those useless pretty bioballs wrapped around your brains for all of eternity..... "I'm damaged, and I like it. It made me what I am!"

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16132	From: supamii	Date: 12/18/2005
Subject: Re: SAE not eating hair algae/Algae control.

Thanks Harry, but to be blunt and perhaps slightly rude I wasn't asking for a lecture on algae control. I feed my fishes every other day, I have a timer for my lights, I have live plants where a good portion died when I deprived them of liquid fertilizer (I also suspect they died since I didn't replant them as they were stem plants), and lastly I have a CO2 system. Currently I do water changes bi-weekly but I may try to be a bit less lazy and change it weekly as you do. I am still waiting for a reply about whether anyone has had a similar experience with SAE's not eating hair algae. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, harry perry <harryfisherman@y...> wrote: > > Adding algae eating fish helps the problem but you will never eliminate the problem unless you eliminate the source of the algae in the first place. > > Algae can only exist if it has food. It is a one celled plant. You eliminate the algae food by; not feeding your fish more than once a day or skip a day. Regular water changes, adding plants like hornwort and java moss. > > To eliminate algae you eliminate the excess nutrients in the tank. Excess nutrients are; > > Light - put your lights on a timer for 12 hours a day. > > Fish food - do not ever feed your fish according to the instructions on the container. Your fish can go for 2 weeks without food. > > Fish waste - Do a 20% water change once a week. > > Dead plants, dead fish etc. - Think of these as fertilizer for the algae. > > Live Plants - use live plants to outcompete the algae for the excess nutrients in your tank. Hornwort and Java Moss are nutrient sponges. Help your plants grow with Flourish Excel or co2. > > The goal is to eliminate any food for the algae. My tanks are all algae free. It's a matter of balance. > > Harry > > > supamii <supamii@y...> wrote: > I recently purchased an SAE and much to my dissapointment it has not > been eating the hair algae. I'm more than certain that this is not a > false SAE since its black stripe extends all the way to it's fin and > furthermore it's fins are not dark. > > Does anyone else have this similar problem? > > I want to keep my algae problem under control but I already have my > small tank over-stocked so buying another SAE is something I don't > want to do. It only seems to be nibbling bits of the brown fuzzy > algae while the hair algae is quickly growing and expanding out of > control. > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16133	From: harry perry	Date: 12/18/2005
Subject: Re: SAE not eating hair algae/Algae control./supamii

My post wasn't a sermon, it was the benefit of my years of experience in dealing with algae and algae eaters. Why you would react with rudeness to someone you is trying to help is beyond me. If your sae is a true sae and not a flying fox or cae. It just found something it likes to eat better .Now here's a sermon. Your tank is overstocked, your plants have died off because you don't know how to take care of plants it has nothing to do with replanting or fertilizer, it's probably the wrong plants for the amount of light. You obviously have a lot to learn about fish keeping and getting along with people. Your next problem will be ich. I hope the person who tries to help you isn't rewarded with rudeness. Harry supamii <supamii@...> wrote: Thanks Harry, but to be blunt and perhaps slightly rude I wasn't asking for a lecture on algae control. I feed my fishes every other day, I have a timer for my lights, I have live plants where a good portion died when I deprived them of liquid fertilizer (I also suspect they died since I didn't replant them as they were stem plants), and lastly I have a CO2 system. Currently I do water changes bi-weekly but I may try to be a bit less lazy and change it weekly as you do. I am still waiting for a reply about whether anyone has had a similar experience with SAE's not eating hair algae. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, harry perry <harryfisherman@y...> wrote: > > Adding algae eating fish helps the problem but you will never eliminate the problem unless you eliminate the source of the algae in the first place. > > Algae can only exist if it has food. It is a one celled plant. You eliminate the algae food by; not feeding your fish more than once a day or skip a day. Regular water changes, adding plants like hornwort and java moss. > > To eliminate algae you eliminate the excess nutrients in the tank. Excess nutrients are; > > Light - put your lights on a timer for 12 hours a day. > > Fish food - do not ever feed your fish according to the instructions on the container. Your fish can go for 2 weeks without food. > > Fish waste - Do a 20% water change once a week. > > Dead plants, dead fish etc. - Think of these as fertilizer for the algae. > > Live Plants - use live plants to outcompete the algae for the excess nutrients in your tank. Hornwort and Java Moss are nutrient sponges. Help your plants grow with Flourish Excel or co2. > > The goal is to eliminate any food for the algae. My tanks are all algae free. It's a matter of balance. > > Harry > > > supamii <supamii@y...> wrote: > I recently purchased an SAE and much to my dissapointment it has not > been eating the hair algae. I'm more than certain that this is not a > false SAE since its black stripe extends all the way to it's fin and > furthermore it's fins are not dark. > > Does anyone else have this similar problem? > > I want to keep my algae problem under control but I already have my > small tank over-stocked so buying another SAE is something I don't > want to do. It only seems to be nibbling bits of the brown fuzzy > algae while the hair algae is quickly growing and expanding out of > control. > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Biology Bucharest romania San francisco bay area United kingdom South africa --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16134	From: Jerry Young	Date: 12/18/2005
Subject: Re: SAE not eating hair algae/Algae control./supamii

I find your post very helpful Harry, even if I wasn't the one who asked the question about algae. Thanks for sharing it. harry perry <harryfisherman@...> wrote: My post wasn't a sermon, it was the benefit of my years of experience in dealing with algae and algae eaters. Why you would react with rudeness to someone you is trying to help is beyond me. If your sae is a true sae and not a flying fox or cae. It just found something it likes to eat better .Now here's a sermon. Your tank is overstocked, your plants have died off because you don't know how to take care of plants it has nothing to do with replanting or fertilizer, it's probably the wrong plants for the amount of light. You obviously have a lot to learn about fish keeping and getting along with people. Your next problem will be ich. I hope the person who tries to help you isn't rewarded with rudeness. Harry supamii <supamii@...> wrote: Thanks Harry, but to be blunt and perhaps slightly rude I wasn't asking for a lecture on algae control. I feed my fishes every other day, I have a timer for my lights, I have live plants where a good portion died when I deprived them of liquid fertilizer (I also suspect they died since I didn't replant them as they were stem plants), and lastly I have a CO2 system. Currently I do water changes bi-weekly but I may try to be a bit less lazy and change it weekly as you do. I am still waiting for a reply about whether anyone has had a similar experience with SAE's not eating hair algae. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, harry perry <harryfisherman@y...> wrote: > > Adding algae eating fish helps the problem but you will never eliminate the problem unless you eliminate the source of the algae in the first place. > > Algae can only exist if it has food. It is a one celled plant. You eliminate the algae food by; not feeding your fish more than once a day or skip a day. Regular water changes, adding plants like hornwort and java moss. > > To eliminate algae you eliminate the excess nutrients in the tank. Excess nutrients are; > > Light - put your lights on a timer for 12 hours a day. > > Fish food - do not ever feed your fish according to the instructions on the container. Your fish can go for 2 weeks without food. > > Fish waste - Do a 20% water change once a week. > > Dead plants, dead fish etc. - Think of these as fertilizer for the algae. > > Live Plants - use live plants to outcompete the algae for the excess nutrients in your tank. Hornwort and Java Moss are nutrient sponges. Help your plants grow with Flourish Excel or co2. > > The goal is to eliminate any food for the algae. My tanks are all algae free. It's a matter of balance. > > Harry > > > supamii <supamii@y...> wrote: > I recently purchased an SAE and much to my dissapointment it has not > been eating the hair algae. I'm more than certain that this is not a > false SAE since its black stripe extends all the way to it's fin and > furthermore it's fins are not dark. > > Does anyone else have this similar problem? > > I want to keep my algae problem under control but I already have my > small tank over-stocked so buying another SAE is something I don't > want to do. It only seems to be nibbling bits of the brown fuzzy > algae while the hair algae is quickly growing and expanding out of > control. > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Biology Bucharest romania San francisco bay area United kingdom South africa --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Biology Bucharest romania San francisco bay area United kingdom South africa --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16135	From: harry perry	Date: 12/18/2005
Subject: Re: SAE not eating hair algae/Algae control./supamii/Jerry

Thanks Jerry. Harry Jerry Young <jerry_jla@...> wrote: I find your post very helpful Harry, even if I wasn't the one who asked the question about algae. Thanks for sharing it. harry perry <harryfisherman@...> wrote: My post wasn't a sermon, it was the benefit of my years of experience in dealing with algae and algae eaters. Why you would react with rudeness to someone you is trying to help is beyond me. If your sae is a true sae and not a flying fox or cae. It just found something it likes to eat better .Now here's a sermon. Your tank is overstocked, your plants have died off because you don't know how to take care of plants it has nothing to do with replanting or fertilizer, it's probably the wrong plants for the amount of light. You obviously have a lot to learn about fish keeping and getting along with people. Your next problem will be ich. I hope the person who tries to help you isn't rewarded with rudeness. Harry supamii <supamii@...> wrote: Thanks Harry, but to be blunt and perhaps slightly rude I wasn't asking for a lecture on algae control. I feed my fishes every other day, I have a timer for my lights, I have live plants where a good portion died when I deprived them of liquid fertilizer (I also suspect they died since I didn't replant them as they were stem plants), and lastly I have a CO2 system. Currently I do water changes bi-weekly but I may try to be a bit less lazy and change it weekly as you do. I am still waiting for a reply about whether anyone has had a similar experience with SAE's not eating hair algae. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, harry perry <harryfisherman@y...> wrote: > > Adding algae eating fish helps the problem but you will never eliminate the problem unless you eliminate the source of the algae in the first place. > > Algae can only exist if it has food. It is a one celled plant. You eliminate the algae food by; not feeding your fish more than once a day or skip a day. Regular water changes, adding plants like hornwort and java moss. > > To eliminate algae you eliminate the excess nutrients in the tank. Excess nutrients are; > > Light - put your lights on a timer for 12 hours a day. > > Fish food - do not ever feed your fish according to the instructions on the container. Your fish can go for 2 weeks without food. > > Fish waste - Do a 20% water change once a week. > > Dead plants, dead fish etc. - Think of these as fertilizer for the algae. > > Live Plants - use live plants to outcompete the algae for the excess nutrients in your tank. Hornwort and Java Moss are nutrient sponges. Help your plants grow with Flourish Excel or co2. > > The goal is to eliminate any food for the algae. My tanks are all algae free. It's a matter of balance. > > Harry > > > supamii <supamii@y...> wrote: > I recently purchased an SAE and much to my dissapointment it has not > been eating the hair algae. I'm more than certain that this is not a > false SAE since its black stripe extends all the way to it's fin and > furthermore it's fins are not dark. > > Does anyone else have this similar problem? > > I want to keep my algae problem under control but I already have my > small tank over-stocked so buying another SAE is something I don't > want to do. It only seems to be nibbling bits of the brown fuzzy > algae while the hair algae is quickly growing and expanding out of > control. > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Biology Bucharest romania San francisco bay area United kingdom South africa --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Biology Bucharest romania San francisco bay area United kingdom South africa --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Biology Bucharest romania San francisco bay area United kingdom South africa --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16136	From: Jerry Young	Date: 12/18/2005
Subject: Re: SAE not eating hair algae/Algae control./supamii/Jerry

Keep cool. harry perry <harryfisherman@...> wrote: Thanks Jerry. Harry Jerry Young <jerry_jla@...> wrote: I find your post very helpful Harry, even if I wasn't the one who asked the question about algae. Thanks for sharing it. harry perry <harryfisherman@...> wrote: My post wasn't a sermon, it was the benefit of my years of experience in dealing with algae and algae eaters. Why you would react with rudeness to someone you is trying to help is beyond me. If your sae is a true sae and not a flying fox or cae. It just found something it likes to eat better .Now here's a sermon. Your tank is overstocked, your plants have died off because you don't know how to take care of plants it has nothing to do with replanting or fertilizer, it's probably the wrong plants for the amount of light. You obviously have a lot to learn about fish keeping and getting along with people. Your next problem will be ich. I hope the person who tries to help you isn't rewarded with rudeness. Harry supamii <supamii@...> wrote: Thanks Harry, but to be blunt and perhaps slightly rude I wasn't asking for a lecture on algae control. I feed my fishes every other day, I have a timer for my lights, I have live plants where a good portion died when I deprived them of liquid fertilizer (I also suspect they died since I didn't replant them as they were stem plants), and lastly I have a CO2 system. Currently I do water changes bi-weekly but I may try to be a bit less lazy and change it weekly as you do. I am still waiting for a reply about whether anyone has had a similar experience with SAE's not eating hair algae. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, harry perry <harryfisherman@y...> wrote: > > Adding algae eating fish helps the problem but you will never eliminate the problem unless you eliminate the source of the algae in the first place. > > Algae can only exist if it has food. It is a one celled plant. You eliminate the algae food by; not feeding your fish more than once a day or skip a day. Regular water changes, adding plants like hornwort and java moss. > > To eliminate algae you eliminate the excess nutrients in the tank. Excess nutrients are; > > Light - put your lights on a timer for 12 hours a day. > > Fish food - do not ever feed your fish according to the instructions on the container. Your fish can go for 2 weeks without food. > > Fish waste - Do a 20% water change once a week. > > Dead plants, dead fish etc. - Think of these as fertilizer for the algae. > > Live Plants - use live plants to outcompete the algae for the excess nutrients in your tank. Hornwort and Java Moss are nutrient sponges. Help your plants grow with Flourish Excel or co2. > > The goal is to eliminate any food for the algae. My tanks are all algae free. It's a matter of balance. > > Harry > > > supamii <supamii@y...> wrote: > I recently purchased an SAE and much to my dissapointment it has not > been eating the hair algae. I'm more than certain that this is not a > false SAE since its black stripe extends all the way to it's fin and > furthermore it's fins are not dark. > > Does anyone else have this similar problem? > > I want to keep my algae problem under control but I already have my > small tank over-stocked so buying another SAE is something I don't > want to do. It only seems to be nibbling bits of the brown fuzzy > algae while the hair algae is quickly growing and expanding out of > control. > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Biology Bucharest romania San francisco bay area United kingdom South africa --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Biology Bucharest romania San francisco bay area United kingdom South africa --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Biology Bucharest romania San francisco bay area United kingdom South africa --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Biology Bucharest romania San francisco bay area United kingdom South africa --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! 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Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16137	From: kristopher helsing	Date: 12/18/2005
Subject: Re: 'TWAS THE NIGHT BEFORE CHRISTMAS

that was definately cute... ill pass it around to my friends Kris Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: 'Twas the Night Before Christmas Linda & Roy Miller Berkshire Museum Aquarium Club 12/76 'Twas the night before Christmas, and Santa was humming, The fish were excited, one even was humming; The fry were all snuggled in their watery beds . . . While visions of brine shrimp swam in their heads; The Cabomba was trimmed and sparkled just right; Of course the Neons you know, provided the light; The colorful ornaments--green, red and gold Green Swordtails, red platies, and goldfish we're told; A big Silver Angel graced the top of the tree, It was the prettiest "Fishmas" tree even could be. And then on the tank top there arose such a clatter . . . The fish swam 'round to see what was the matter. Someone was coming, they could tell by the sound-- Then down the filter tube came Santa with a bound! The stump of a snorkel held tight in his teeth, And the bubbles encircled his head like a wreath. In his furry red wet suit he swam to the tree, And opened his pack for the fishes to see; A new hollowed log for the fry to play tag, Was the very first gift he pulled from his bag; Cans of flake food were next, brine shrimp and squid, And a bubbling treasure chest, with the fluttering lid; New colored gravel, a large piece of slate, It was obvious now the angels would mate. Santa hadn't forgotten them . . . He'd filled every wish, He'd remember each item they put on his list. Then laying a finger aside his air hose . . . And giving a nod, up the tube he arose; But they heard him exclaim as he hopped in his sled . . . Maybe next year I'll bring them a 55 gallon instead! Merry Christmas! \\Steve// "It is much easier to suggest solutions when you don't know too much about the problem." - Malcolm Forbes Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Biology Bucharest romania San francisco bay area United kingdom South africa --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16138	From: princezzuno	Date: 12/19/2005
Subject: Looking for Livebearers

Hello. I am in Washington state and I am looking for livebearers. The selection in LPS is fairly small. Common mollies, platies, guppies. I have all these and a single dwarf top minnow (heterandria formosa). She is the last of a bunch of babies. I had one female, now I just have her daughter. I am currently looking for dwarf top minnows and widows. If anyone has any ideas, let me know. Thank you for taking the time to read this.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16139	From: hank voss	Date: 12/19/2005
Subject: Re: SAE not eating hair algae/Algae control.

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "supamii" <supamii@y...> wrote: > > Thanks Harry, but to be blunt and perhaps slightly rude I wasn't > asking for a lecture on algae control. > > > I am still waiting for a reply about whether anyone has had a similar > experience with SAE's not eating hair algae. > > >******** ********* ********** *********** Hi all: Ive been the hobby over 60 yrs and have not found anything that eats hair algae regular algae yes but not hair algae.If there is such an animal i would sure like to know what it is. Regards Hank > > > > To eliminate algae you eliminate the excess nutrients in the tank. > Excess nutrients are; > > > > Light - put your lights on a timer for 12 hours a day. > > > > Fish food - do not ever feed your fish according to the > instructions on the container. Your fish can go for 2 weeks without food. > > > > Fish waste - Do a 20% water change once a week. > > > > Dead plants, dead fish etc. - Think of these as fertilizer for the > algae. > > > > Live Plants - use live plants to outcompete the algae for the > excess nutrients in your tank. Hornwort and Java Moss are nutrient > sponges. Help your plants grow with Flourish Excel or co2. > > > > The goal is to eliminate any food for the algae. My tanks are all > algae free. It's a matter of balance. > > > > Harry > > > > > > supamii <supamii@y...> wrote: > > I recently purchased an SAE and much to my dissapointment it has not > > been eating the hair algae. I'm more than certain that this is not a > > false SAE since its black stripe extends all the way to it's fin and > > furthermore it's fins are not dark. > > > > Does anyone else have this similar problem? > > > > I want to keep my algae problem under control but I already have my > > small tank over-stocked so buying another SAE is something I don't > > want to do. It only seems to be nibbling bits of the brown fuzzy > > algae while the hair algae is quickly growing and expanding out of > > control. > > > > > > > > > > >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16140	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 12/19/2005
Subject: Re: SAE not eating hair algae/Algae control.

In a message dated 12/19/2005 8:41:27 AM Eastern Standard Time, aatetras@... writes: Ive been the hobby over 60 yrs and have not found anything that eats hair algae regular algae yes but not hair algae.If there is such an animal i would sure like to know what it is. I've always been told Jordanellas eat hair algae. I have a pair, but no hair algae to test them on, so I'm not sure how true it is. Vicky [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16141	From: hank voss	Date: 12/19/2005
Subject: Re: SAE not eating hair algae/Algae control.

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, seleya8@a... wrote: > > > > > > > > I've always been told Jordanellas eat hair algae. I have a pair, but no hair > algae to test them on, so I'm not sure how true it is. > > > Vicky: Ive kept Jord.s also they will nibble on reg. algae but do not eat hair algae.Red Ram snails do a good job on gre en and brown algae but ignore the other. Regards Hank > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16142	From: hank voss	Date: 12/19/2005
Subject: Re: SAE not eating hair algae/Algae control.

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, seleya8@a... wrote: > > > > > In a message dated 12/19/2005 8:41:27 AM Eastern Standard Time, > aatetras@y... writes: > > Ive been the hobby over 60 yrs and have not found anything > that eats hair algae regular algae yes but not hair algae.If there > is such an animal i would sure like to know what it is. > > > > I've always been told Jordanellas eat hair algae. I have a pair, but no hair > algae to test them on, so I'm not sure how true it is. > > Vicky > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16143	From: hank voss	Date: 12/19/2005
Subject: Re: SAE not eating hair algae/Algae control.

--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, seleya8@a... wrote: > > > > > In a message dated 12/19/2005 8:41:27 AM Eastern Standard Time, > aatetras@y... writes: > > > > > > I've always been told Jordanellas eat hair algae. I have a pair, but no hair > algae to test them on, so I'm not sure how true it is. > > Vicky > Vicky: PS Count your lucky stars you dont have hair algae cause its impossible to get rid of it without tearing down the tank. Its usually introduced by a minute piece on a plant. Regards Hank > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16144	From: mike mather	Date: 12/19/2005
Subject: Re: SAE not eating hair algae/Algae control.

I have had Flag Fish(Jordanella Floridae) and they really do eat hair algae! They will slack off if you feed them too well. Don't feed them for a couple of days and the will "go to town", so to speak. Mike hank voss <aatetras@...> wrote: --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, seleya8@a... wrote: > > > > > In a message dated 12/19/2005 8:41:27 AM Eastern Standard Time, > aatetras@y... writes: > > Ive been the hobby over 60 yrs and have not found anything > that eats hair algae regular algae yes but not hair algae.If there > is such an animal i would sure like to know what it is. > > > > I've always been told Jordanellas eat hair algae. I have a pair, but no hair > algae to test them on, so I'm not sure how true it is. > > Vicky > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16145	From: Ivan White (Aqua-Hobbyist)	Date: 12/19/2005
Subject: Re: SAE not eating hair algae/Algae control.

Hi all, On the Florida Flagfish, if anyone is interested, here is a place where you can buy them http://www.aquaculturestore.com/ Take care all, Ivan Aqua-Hobbyist@... ----- Original Message ----- From: mike mather To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, December 19, 2005 7:19 PM Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Re: SAE not eating hair algae/Algae control. I have had Flag Fish(Jordanella Floridae) and they really do eat hair algae! They will slack off if you feed them too well. Don't feed them for a couple of days and the will "go to town", so to speak. Mike hank voss <aatetras@...> wrote: --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, seleya8@a... wrote: > > > > > In a message dated 12/19/2005 8:41:27 AM Eastern Standard Time, > aatetras@y... writes: > > Ive been the hobby over 60 yrs and have not found anything > that eats hair algae regular algae yes but not hair algae.If there > is such an animal i would sure like to know what it is. > > > > I've always been told Jordanellas eat hair algae. I have a pair, but no hair > algae to test them on, so I'm not sure how true it is. > > Vicky > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.371 / Virus Database: 267.14.1/207 - Release Date: 12/19/2005 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16146	From: seleya8@aol.com	Date: 12/19/2005
Subject: Re: SAE not eating hair algae/Algae control.

In a message dated 12/19/2005 9:57:16 AM Eastern Standard Time, aatetras@... writes: PS Count your lucky stars you dont have hair algae cause its impossible to get rid of it without tearing down the tank. Its usually introduced by a minute piece on a plant. ROTFL! Yup, I'm happy to not have had to test them yet, especially with my bad habit of swapping plants around my tanks and with friends! 0=) As an aside for those who haven't tried them, the flag fish are really nice fish. Subtly pretty and pretty hardy. My pair are somewhat shy but also don't tolerate being pushed around. Just today I finally removed (and sold at the fish club auction) some pretty cool Macrobrachium sp. which lived in their tank since our club's annual auction a few months ago. (lesson #1: look for yourself -- they weren't wood shrimp!) When I dropped in blood worms, the shrimp would dash out and wave his long hairy pincers protectively while his smaller pairs of forelegs shoveled worms into his mouth like crazy -- the flag fish totally ignored him and ate worms right out from under him. I wasn't surprised to see the angels and Bolivian rams not be bothered by him, but the Jordanellas were smaller than him! This particular tank is being sorted out in the next week or so, with the Jordanellas going one way and the majority of the remainder going into a proper biotope. Vicky =) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16147	From: paul helms	Date: 12/21/2005
Subject: Re: companion for my newts

afican dwarf frog --- red eye <red-eye@...> wrote: > The only compatble frog I know of would have to be a > full one :-) > red-eye...who has been down this road > > jerry young <jerry_jla@...> wrote: > Hello all! I have a 10 gallon tank with a pair of > fire-bellied newts. > Can any one suggest a suitable companion for them? I > prefer amphibians > like frogs but have no idea what kind will be > compatible. Thanks! > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when > replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the > TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16148	From: Jerry Young	Date: 12/21/2005
Subject: Re: companion for my newts

Thanks! they're cute little guys. i'll just have to look for them here in the Philippines. paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: afican dwarf frog --- red eye <red-eye@...> wrote: > The only compatble frog I know of would have to be a > full one :-) > red-eye...who has been down this road > > jerry young <jerry_jla@...> wrote: > Hello all! I have a 10 gallon tank with a pair of > fire-bellied newts. > Can any one suggest a suitable companion for them? I > prefer amphibians > like frogs but have no idea what kind will be > compatible. Thanks! > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when > replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the > TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Biology Bucharest romania San francisco bay area United kingdom South africa --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16149	From: paul helms	Date: 12/22/2005
Subject: Re: companion for my newts

hey jerry, tell ya what, you find me a fish wholesaler there and i will send you frogs lol --- Jerry Young <jerry_jla@...> wrote: > Thanks! they're cute little guys. i'll just have to > look for them here in the Philippines. > > paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: afican > dwarf frog > > --- red eye <red-eye@...> wrote: > > > The only compatble frog I know of would have to be > a > > full one :-) > > red-eye...who has been down this road > > > > jerry young <jerry_jla@...> wrote: > > Hello all! I have a 10 gallon tank with a pair > of > > fire-bellied newts. > > Can any one suggest a suitable companion for them? > I > > prefer amphibians > > like frogs but have no idea what kind will be > > compatible. Thanks! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it > when > > replying, thanks. > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > > that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING > the > > TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" > <- > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > > matter. > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when > replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the > TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Biology Bucharest romania San francisco > bay area United kingdom South africa > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email > to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________________ Yahoo! DSL – Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less. dsl.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16150	From: dragon6435@aol.com	Date: 12/23/2005
Subject: Nippy not so little fishy

Well, I got quite a surprise tonight. In the midst of doing routine tank maintenance on my 58 gallon tank which house among a few others, a slightly over a year old green severum. I guess my mistake was not feeding them first cause big fella tried to take a chunk out of my arm. I've ended up with a fairly interesting bruise on my inner forearm that looks like a wayward hickey. I'm going to keep my eye on the brute the next time I venture in. Dang, that hurt! Happy holidays, all. I've been given a $50 gift certificate to a fine local aquarium store so the holiday is sweet already. <G> Linda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16151	From: Sai Narendra Vangamudi	Date: 12/24/2005
Subject: Substrate !!!

Hi , I'm into beginning my chiclid tank project.Can i use beach sand as a substrate ? is there any harm by using it ?? Please help me regards, Naren

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16152	From: Kevin	Date: 12/24/2005
Subject: Re: SAE not eating hair algae/Algae control.

My experience has been that Jordanella floridae love the taste of filamentous green algae. I've actually brought them plants covered in the stuff as a treat. Kevin --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, seleya8@a... wrote: > > In a message dated 12/19/2005 8:41:27 AM Eastern Standard Time, > aatetras@y... writes: > > Ive been the hobby over 60 yrs and have not found anything > that eats hair algae regular algae yes but not hair algae.If there > is such an animal i would sure like to know what it is. > > I've always been told Jordanellas eat hair algae. I have a pair, but no hair > algae to test them on, so I'm not sure how true it is. > > Vicky

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16153	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 12/24/2005
Subject: Re: Substrate !!!

Naren, What kind of Cichlid project do you have in mind? Do you want to use sand right off of a salt water beach or a freshwater sand bar or beach? Either way you need to rinse them really good check for live or dead animals etc. I am not sure where you are located. Some people use play sand intended for a childs sand box. I used some in one tank and it is a fine grain sand and packed a little too tight for me and was hard to clean, but there are many different kinds of sand. I know a guy that buys sand from a welding supply company that sells sand for sand blasting media. He told me he finds it in two sizes, a smaller grain and a larger grain. He prefers the larger of the two as it does not compact as easy and is easier for cichlids to sift it or dig as part of their nesting behavior. What kind of cichlids do you plan on keeping? Do want them as a show tank or as breeders or? If you just want to breed them you may not even need a substrate at all. Mike In a message dated 12/24/2005 1:36:42 AM Pacific Standard Time, snvangamudi@... writes: Hi , I'm into beginning my chiclid tank project.Can i use beach sand as a substrate ? is there any harm by using it ?? Please help me regards, Naren [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16154	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/24/2005
Subject: Re: Substrate !!!

You can use beach sand, however, it has a tendency to compact and make itself rock-like unless you stir it quit frequently. It is not a good substrate for growing plants, since it does pack so well when wet. It will also so the tendency to become anaerobic, even if you stir it up, since food and waste will eventually become trapped in it. Then, when it does get stirred, noxious gases will be released, which could be harmful to your sense of smell. If you want t fine substrate, look at number 1 gravel or number 2, which is the size I prefer for my tanks. Else you would wish to only have enough sand to cover the bottom of the tank, but that may not be enough for the fish in a glass bottomed tank. -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Sai Narendra Vangamudi Sent: Friday, December 23, 2005 11:26 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Substrate !!! Hi , I'm into beginning my chiclid tank project.Can i use beach sand as a substrate ? is there any harm by using it ?? Please help me regards, Naren

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16155	From: Patrick	Date: 12/24/2005
Subject: Re: Substrate !!!

Question for you: A person who has been keeping SW and FW tanks for a while says that the same principles of anaerobic bacteria removing nitrates in SW apply in FW, and the best thing to do is have compacted sand and never stir it so those bacteria can go on without releasing too many dangerous gasses at once. The idea seems reasonable to me since it has been done in SW for a while now, and it should be the same gasses in both types of water. But everything I've read says it is bad to try this. Will FW keepers be using a "dead zone" sand area in 20 years just like SW keepers are doing now? Patrick ----- Original Message ----- It will also so the tendency to become anaerobic, even if you stir it up, since food and waste will eventually become trapped in it. Then, when it does get stirred, noxious gases will be released, which could be harmful to your sense of smell.

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16156	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/24/2005
Subject: Re: Substrate !!!

Patrick, Most likely it will depend upon how it is done. A layer of sand covered by another substrate is probably the way to go. The author of the original post stated that they were going to be keeping cichlids. While there are a number that are not diggers, one cannot rule out that aspect of their behavior, hence the recommendation for regular stirring of the substrate to prevent the accumulation of wastes and the anaerobic bacteria that will feed o them. Merry Christmas to all. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Patrick Sent: Saturday, December 24, 2005 10:24 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Substrate !!! Question for you: A person who has been keeping SW and FW tanks for a while says that the same principles of anaerobic bacteria removing nitrates in SW apply in FW, and the best thing to do is have compacted sand and never stir it so those bacteria can go on without releasing too many dangerous gasses at once. The idea seems reasonable to me since it has been done in SW for a while now, and it should be the same gasses in both types of water. But everything I've read says it is bad to try this. Will FW keepers be using a "dead zone" sand area in 20 years just like SW keepers are doing now? Patrick ----- Original Message ----- It will also so the tendency to become anaerobic, even if you stir it up, since food and waste will eventually become trapped in it. Then, when it does get stirred, noxious gases will be released, which could be harmful to your sense of smell. Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16157	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/24/2005
Subject: A Holiday Wish to Those on the Lists

An electronic greeting card from us to you: http://www.jacquielawson.com/viewcard.asp?code=XT34319040 \\Steve// "It is much easier to suggest solutions when you don't know too much about the problem." - Malcolm Forbes

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16158	From: Sai Narendra	Date: 12/25/2005
Subject: Re: Substrate !!!

Mike, I'm planning to put up an show tank,with a few beautiful chichlids in it. This is first chichlid tank,sorry to mention,,i'm from India.My hometown is VIzac, a major port trust and with a big coast line.Here , the quality of substrate we get in shops is poor and it comprises nothin but marble or granite chips.we do'nt even get imported substrates like Peat based laterite,,,,so for me the next best option is beach sand. Please mike help me out ,, whether to use beach sand or not, which kind of fishes are suitable ???? All i want is to have a beautiful chichlid tank with a rocky background. Thanks Bye Naren Deenerz@... wrote: Naren, What kind of Cichlid project do you have in mind? Do you want to use sand right off of a salt water beach or a freshwater sand bar or beach? Either way you need to rinse them really good check for live or dead animals etc. I am not sure where you are located. Some people use play sand intended for a childs sand box. I used some in one tank and it is a fine grain sand and packed a little too tight for me and was hard to clean, but there are many different kinds of sand. I know a guy that buys sand from a welding supply company that sells sand for sand blasting media. He told me he finds it in two sizes, a smaller grain and a larger grain. He prefers the larger of the two as it does not compact as easy and is easier for cichlids to sift it or dig as part of their nesting behavior. What kind of cichlids do you plan on keeping? Do want them as a show tank or as breeders or? If you just want to breed them you may not even need a substrate at all. Mike In a message dated 12/24/2005 1:36:42 AM Pacific Standard Time, snvangamudi@... writes: Hi , I'm into beginning my chiclid tank project.Can i use beach sand as a substrate ? is there any harm by using it ?? Please help me regards, Naren [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ���`�.��.><((((�>.���`�.��.���`�.�><((((�> �.���`�.�. , .���`�..><((((�> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <�((((><.���`�.��.���`�.�<�((((><�.���`�.�. , .���`�..<�((((><���`�.��. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Biology Bucharest romania San francisco bay area United kingdom South africa --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! for Good - Make a difference this year. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16159	From: jazz	Date: 12/25/2005
Subject: happy happy

HAPPY CHRISTMAS AND A HAPPY NEW YEAR FROM THE JAZZ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16160	From: Patrick	Date: 12/25/2005
Subject: Re: happy happy

Merry Christmas to all, and to all a good night. :) Patrick

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16161	From: Raymond Wetzel	Date: 12/25/2005
Subject: Re: Seasons Greetings!

To You and Yours, Best Wishes for a Happy Chanukah, a Merry Christmas and a Very Happy and Prosperous New Year! :) Regards, Ray :D [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16162	From: Ivan White (Aqua-Hobbyist)	Date: 12/25/2005
Subject: Re: Substrate !!!

Hi I am not sure I would use totally sand in my aquarium and the reason is is that sand gets very crusty as a only subtrate and is difficult to work with. You might better use small gravel in my estimation as it is easier to work with and I think performs better as a subtrate. However some do mix sand and small gravel together and that seems to work alright, but sand alone in my experience has not been good. Just my opinions of course, Ivan Aqua-Hobbyist@... ----- Original Message ----- From: Sai Narendra Vangamudi To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, December 23, 2005 10:25 AM Subject: [AquaticLife] Substrate !!! Hi , I'm into beginning my chiclid tank project.Can i use beach sand as a substrate ? is there any harm by using it ?? Please help me regards, Naren Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.371 / Virus Database: 267.14.7/214 - Release Date: 12/23/2005 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16163	From: Kurt Johnston	Date: 12/25/2005
Subject: Happy Holidays

I want to wish everyone in this group a Very Merry Christmas and Happy Holiday Season. I have enjoyed all the great things that everyone has to offer in this group. I hope to see some of you during the year at all the different events that we have coming this area. Kurt Johnston Program V.P. Aquarium Club of Lancaster County [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16164	From: Jerry Young	Date: 12/26/2005
Subject: Re: companion for my newts

Its a deal! What kind of fish are you looking for? paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: hey jerry, tell ya what, you find me a fish wholesaler there and i will send you frogs lol --- Jerry Young <jerry_jla@...> wrote: > Thanks! they're cute little guys. i'll just have to > look for them here in the Philippines. > > paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: afican > dwarf frog > > --- red eye <red-eye@...> wrote: > > > The only compatble frog I know of would have to be > a > > full one :-) > > red-eye...who has been down this road > > > > jerry young <jerry_jla@...> wrote: > > Hello all! I have a 10 gallon tank with a pair > of > > fire-bellied newts. > > Can any one suggest a suitable companion for them? > I > > prefer amphibians > > like frogs but have no idea what kind will be > > compatible. Thanks! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it > when > > replying, thanks. > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > > that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING > the > > TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" > <- > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > > matter. > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when > replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the > TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Biology Bucharest romania San francisco > bay area United kingdom South africa > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email > to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________________ Yahoo! DSL – Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less. dsl.yahoo.com Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. SPONSORED LINKS Biology Bucharest romania San francisco bay area United kingdom South africa --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! DSL Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16165	From: paul helms	Date: 12/27/2005
Subject: Re: companion for my newts

i am actually looking for a wholesale distributor for oth marine and fresh water --- Jerry Young <jerry_jla@...> wrote: > Its a deal! What kind of fish are you looking for? > > paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: hey jerry, > tell ya what, you find me a fish wholesaler > there and i will send you frogs lol > > > --- Jerry Young <jerry_jla@...> wrote: > > > Thanks! they're cute little guys. i'll just have > to > > look for them here in the Philippines. > > > > paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: afican > > dwarf frog > > > > --- red eye <red-eye@...> wrote: > > > > > The only compatble frog I know of would have to > be > > a > > > full one :-) > > > red-eye...who has been down this road > > > > > > jerry young <jerry_jla@...> wrote: > > > Hello all! I have a 10 gallon tank with a pair > > of > > > fire-bellied newts. > > > Can any one suggest a suitable companion for > them? > > I > > > prefer amphibians > > > like frogs but have no idea what kind will be > > > compatible. Thanks! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it > > when > > > replying, thanks. > > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all > TEXT > > > that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING > > the > > > TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > > > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" > > <- > > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > > > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > > > matter. > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > > removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > > protection around > > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it > when > > replying, thanks. > > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > > that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING > the > > TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" > <- > > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > > matter. > > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > > Biology Bucharest romania San > francisco > > bay area United kingdom South africa > > > > --------------------------------- > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email > > to: > > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > > Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > > protection around > > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > removed] > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________ > Yahoo! DSL – Something to write home about. > Just $16.99/mo. or less. > dsl.yahoo.com > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when > replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the > TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Biology Bucharest romania San francisco > bay area United kingdom South africa > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email > to: > AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! DSL Something to write home about. Just > $16.99/mo. or less > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________ Yahoo! for Good - Make a difference this year. http://brand.yahoo.com/cybergivingweek2005/

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16166	From: paul helms	Date: 12/27/2005
Subject: Re: Substrate !!!

the cichlids will continuopusly stir the sand and mound it into piles. and your description of saltwater si not entirely correct. while gases to build in some areas most saltwater keepers also keep sand sifitnig species susch as cucumbers, gobies, stars, snails, and cucumbers which are constantly burrowing beneath the sand to keep it from becoming anaerobic. in addition snails crabs cucmbers stars, sea urchins, and many fishes eat the waste produced by other fish and over feeding, causing there to be less ammonia in the system to begin with. also protein skimmers are used to filter out unbroken down organic waste in fine particles form eth water before they go through the nitrogen cycle, resulting in les need for bacteria. a saltwater reef is kept healthy by small to microscopic organisms other than bacteria. this is not to say that bacteria is not needed or used, but rather that it is a redundant backup. --- Patrick <patrickmn@...> wrote: > Question for you: A person who has been keeping SW > and FW tanks for a while > says that the same principles of anaerobic bacteria > removing nitrates in SW > apply in FW, and the best thing to do is have > compacted sand and never stir > it so those bacteria can go on without releasing too > many dangerous gasses > at once. The idea seems reasonable to me since it > has been done in SW for a > while now, and it should be the same gasses in both > types of water. But > everything I've read says it is bad to try this. > Will FW keepers be using a > "dead zone" sand area in 20 years just like SW > keepers are doing now? > > Patrick > ----- Original Message ----- > It will also so the tendency to become anaerobic, > even if you stir it up, > since food and waste will eventually become trapped > in it. Then, when it > does get stirred, noxious gases will be released, > which could be harmful to > your sense of smell. > > __________________________________ Yahoo! for Good - Make a difference this year. http://brand.yahoo.com/cybergivingweek2005/

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16167	From: paul helms	Date: 12/27/2005
Subject: Re: Saltwater chat!

i can help message me --- Amber <amber_da_bomb@...> wrote: > Hey anyone who has a saltwater tank...I need > help...add me to your > messenger list please please lol > > > > > > __________________________________ Yahoo! for Good - Make a difference this year. http://brand.yahoo.com/cybergivingweek2005/

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16168	From: paul helms	Date: 12/27/2005
Subject: Re: Sebea anenome question

1. too many fish for the tank. 2. too many species of clowns in the tank. 3. too many chemicals going in teh tank 4. i did not see a protein skimmer, and what are you considering acceptable nitrates? 5. the anemone will not attach as long as it is being harassed. 6. what si the wattage on your lights? if it is under 120 watts you do not have suffiecient light. 7. most added elements cant be tested for, and you may be poisoning your tank. too much of a good thing is bad! the only thing you should be adding is maybe calcium. --- Rob And Joyce <bucks_boogie@...> wrote: > I've got a sebea anenome (white green tip) for about > 6 weeks now. This 29 gallon tank houses a clarkii > clown, maroon clown, yellow gobie, clown gobie, > scooter blennie, kole tang, kupang damsel and a > cherub angel and a host of live rock, corals polyps, > snails, crabs and shrimps. The maroon clown has > bonded with a bubbletip and hopefully leaves the > clarkii alone until it can get moved to my daughters > tank at christmas. The problem is, the sebea seems > healthy, but doesn't attach. I scooped him out of > the tank at my store when it was traveling across > some crushed coral, so as to not damage it. I > pinpoint feed both anenomes with a variety of frozen > food, but the clarkii knocks alot of it away. SG is > kept at 1.024, pH 8.2-8.4 over the course of the day > and night. Lot's of filtration and water movement, > low phosphates and nitrates due to resins and Poly > Filter pads (these are great filter additions I'd > recommend to anyone, they remove sooo much bad > stuff). I use RO water and do 10-15% water changes > weekly. Any tips anyone? It seems healthy but just > won't attach to anything, it's base just seems > bunched up and the clarkii tends to knock it around > the tank because of it sometimes. Lighting incluses > 2 compacts, one is a 50/50(11am-9pm) and the other > is actinic(10am-10pm). I use a host of buffers and > additives and monitor levels appropriatly. Other > than the aneome, the tank seems fine (knocking on > wood). > Thanks everyone, Rob. > > > > __________________________________ Yahoo! for Good - Make a difference this year. http://brand.yahoo.com/cybergivingweek2005/

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16169	From: paul helms	Date: 12/27/2005
Subject: Re: puffers

anythign meaty that they want to...including other fish and other puffers --- chestercanoy <chestercanoy@...> wrote: > ive been seeing freshwater puffers in petshops > lately and im planning > to buy some. they're new to me... what do they eat? > > > > > > __________________________________________ Yahoo! DSL – Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less. dsl.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16170	From: paul helms	Date: 12/27/2005
Subject: Re: Ich help!

as long as you did not clean any of the gravel or replace any of the filter pads you shoudl be fine. the water itself is of little consequence. teh bacteria colonize the filter pads after 30 days and the substrate after 30 days. fi you washed either you started at day 1 --- Ambisense <sueentran@...> wrote: > Hi Paul, > > I let it cycle for three weeks but ontop of that > at least 80% of the cycled water came from my old > cycled tank! i made sure to keep the water in the > old tank clean and transfered the water, gravel, > plants, filters, etc. But even then I let the new > tank cycle for three weeks. > > -Amy > > paul helms <wtfmorlok@...> wrote: how > long did you let it cycle? and how many fish did > you add at once? a full cycle is 4-6 weeks, not a > few > days or a couple weeks. around 3 weeks you have > ammonia and or nitrate spikes > > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Personals > Skip the bars and set-ups and start using Yahoo! > Personals for free > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________________ Yahoo! DSL – Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less. dsl.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16171	From: paul helms	Date: 12/27/2005
Subject: Re: inquiry

the red tails are generally a night feeder until they have become accustomed to eating on your schedule. check to make sure they are alive by lifting the hiding places. i know many ppl have posted not to have 2, but i have never had a problem with them in any number --- jigme7777 <jigme777@...> wrote: > i have got two new red tailed albino sharks but it > won't come out of > hiding i have made a cave oput of stones. it is very > shy i think if it > does not eat it 'll die what to do please tell me > its been 4 days > since it has eating any thing > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ Yahoo! for Good - Make a difference this year. http://brand.yahoo.com/cybergivingweek2005/

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16172	From: paul helms	Date: 12/27/2005
Subject: Re: Ich help!

melafix is an antibacterial, ich is a parasite. melafix does nothign for ich. --- Fred and Cynthia <fcouellet@...> wrote: > The only thing that ever worked for me was > Melafix.........adding salt helps > too. Frequent water changes. Can't remember how > many now because I haven't > had the issue for a few years. Sorry! > > Cynthia > > http://babyitems.myphotoalbum.com/view_photo.php?set_albumName=album01&id=bag > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Ambisense" <sueentran@...> > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Tuesday, December 06, 2005 9:51 PM > Subject: [AquaticLife] Ich help! > > > Hi everyone, I have a problem that I hope someone > can help me with. > > I bought a 70 gal and set it up...i waited till it > cycled, watched > the water params very carefully and then placed the > fishes (fancy > gold fishes) in. Shortly after that, I bought new > aqua plants and I > guess they carried ich - my bad for not salting the > plants a bit > before putting it in the tank - but now the tank has > exploded in > ich. > > I have tried the salt treatment for 10 days (yes I > did it according > to procedure, got it up to 0.3% salinity, raised it > to that salnity > over a course of 48 hours, raised the temp to 25 > degrees celcius, > did daily vacuuming, etc etc) and it's just getting > worst and worst. > in fact, my lion head has so much ich on her that I > even see some > under her gills (one of her gills is transparent) so > then I stopped > the the salt treatment and went to the store and was > highly > recommended Super Ich Cure capsule. The instructions > said that one > capsule should be used per 5 gal and I used the > correct dose, pre > dissolved it into a cup filled with the tank water > and then I put > the medication in the tank. Turned the whole tank > blue but I was > told this is normal and not to panic. Has anyone > used Super Ich Cure > Capsule? AM I to follow the instructions on the box? > It says to give > a dose, wait 48 hours, give another dose, wait > another 48 hours and > then do a 25% water change. However, I ran across > this site: > > > http://www.netpets.com/fish/reference/freshref/ich.html > > and it says "...Disregard the instructions on the > bottle!!!!! Use > the DOSE written on the bottle, but treat like this: > Treat every 3 > to 4 days for 4 treatments, changing 50% of the > water before every > treatment. Do NOT treat once or twice, like the > directions will tell > you! You need to treat over 12 to 16 days in order > to get all the > little guys when they are vulnerable. (See life > cycle diagram for > explanation)..." > > "...(Excuse the digression here, but this is my > chance to vent my > frustration at the aquarium trade -- I think they > purposefully give > poor medicating information so that the consumer > will treat only > partially, and knock down the parasite burden only > enough to > temporarily cure the fish! Because not all the > organisms are dead, > they will bounce back in a few weeks or months, and > the poor > consumer has to run out and but more of the ich > medication! What a > scam!!)..." > > I called the pet store and inquired about this and > they just weren't > any help. They didnt even KNOW what ich was. > > Any input on this matter would be greatly > appreciated!! > > -Amy > > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when > replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > __________________________________________ Yahoo! DSL – Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less. dsl.yahoo.com

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16173	From: Rev. Eric Roberts	Date: 12/27/2005
Subject: Re: Ich help!

melafix also helps the slime coat, so that would prolly help the fish heal quicker... Eric _____ From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of paul helms Sent: Tuesday, 27 December 2005 10:50 To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [AquaticLife] Ich help! melafix is an antibacterial, ich is a parasite. melafix does nothign for ich. --- Fred and Cynthia <fcouellet@...> wrote: > The only thing that ever worked for me was > Melafix.........adding salt helps > too. Frequent water changes. Can't remember how > many now because I haven't > had the issue for a few years. Sorry! > > Cynthia > > http://babyitems.myphotoalbum.com/view_photo.php?set_albumName=album01 <http://babyitems.myphotoalbum.com/view_photo.php?set_albumName=album01&id=b ag> &id=bag > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Ambisense" <sueentran@...> > To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Tuesday, December 06, 2005 9:51 PM > Subject: [AquaticLife] Ich help! > > > Hi everyone, I have a problem that I hope someone > can help me with. > > I bought a 70 gal and set it up...i waited till it > cycled, watched > the water params very carefully and then placed the > fishes (fancy > gold fishes) in. Shortly after that, I bought new > aqua plants and I > guess they carried ich - my bad for not salting the > plants a bit > before putting it in the tank - but now the tank has > exploded in > ich. > > I have tried the salt treatment for 10 days (yes I > did it according > to procedure, got it up to 0.3% salinity, raised it > to that salnity > over a course of 48 hours, raised the temp to 25 > degrees celcius, > did daily vacuuming, etc etc) and it's just getting > worst and worst. > in fact, my lion head has so much ich on her that I > even see some > under her gills (one of her gills is transparent) so > then I stopped > the the salt treatment and went to the store and was > highly > recommended Super Ich Cure capsule. The instructions > said that one > capsule should be used per 5 gal and I used the > correct dose, pre > dissolved it into a cup filled with the tank water > and then I put > the medication in the tank. Turned the whole tank > blue but I was > told this is normal and not to panic. Has anyone > used Super Ich Cure > Capsule? AM I to follow the instructions on the box? > It says to give > a dose, wait 48 hours, give another dose, wait > another 48 hours and > then do a 25% water change. However, I ran across > this site: > > > http://www.netpets.com/fish/reference/freshref/ich.html > > and it says "...Disregard the instructions on the > bottle!!!!! Use > the DOSE written on the bottle, but treat like this: > Treat every 3 > to 4 days for 4 treatments, changing 50% of the > water before every > treatment. Do NOT treat once or twice, like the > directions will tell > you! You need to treat over 12 to 16 days in order > to get all the > little guys when they are vulnerable. (See life > cycle diagram for > explanation)..." > > "...(Excuse the digression here, but this is my > chance to vent my > frustration at the aquarium trade -- I think they > purposefully give > poor medicating information so that the consumer > will treat only > partially, and knock down the parasite burden only > enough to > temporarily cure the fish! Because not all the > organisms are dead, > they will bounce back in a few weeks or months, and > the poor > consumer has to run out and but more of the ich > medication! What a > scam!!)..." > > I called the pet store and inquired about this and > they just weren't > any help. They didnt even KNOW what ich was. > > Any input on this matter would be greatly > appreciated!! > > -Amy > > > > > > > > > Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when > replying, thanks. > ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> > ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> > PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT > that is NOT important to > the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original > message MODIFY the SUBJECT > LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- > <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , > .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. > We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this > matter. > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > __________________________________________ Yahoo! DSL – Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less. dsl.yahoo.com Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "AquaticLife <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AquaticLife> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <mailto:AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> . _____ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16174	From: Emily Tenczar	Date: 12/28/2005
Subject: triops anyone??

I have a triops kit that I am looking to get started. The instructions say not to place any foreign objects in the tank. Does this include gravel? IE, no gravel, nothing? Is it okay to use more than one liter but less than 2 liters of water? Why won't they grow if they have more water? Emily [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16175	From: Patrick	Date: 12/28/2005
Subject: Re: triops anyone??

They are brine shrimp, and come in a packet with the proper water mixture to survive. If you add more water, there will be less of the mixture, and they will not be able to hatch out and live as long. If you have gravel in the tank, the shrimp may get below the gravel and you won't be able to see them. Patrick ----- Original Message ----- I have a triops kit that I am looking to get started. The instructions say not to place any foreign objects in the tank. Does this include gravel? IE, no gravel, nothing? Is it okay to use more than one liter but less than 2 liters of water? Why won't they grow if they have more water? Emily

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16176	From: amvass2002	Date: 12/28/2005
Subject: Re: triops anyone??

Over at the Freshwaters Shrimps Yahoo group, Stuart Halliday is an expert in keeping Triops. You can check out his helpful page: http://mytriops.com/ Good luck. --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Patrick" <patrickmn@c...> wrote: > > They are brine shrimp, and come in a packet with the proper water mixture to > survive. If you add more water, there will be less of the mixture, and they > will not be able to hatch out and live as long. If you have gravel in the > tank, the shrimp may get below the gravel and you won't be able to see them. > > Patrick > ----- Original Message ----- > > I have a triops kit that I am looking to get started. The instructions say > not to place any foreign objects in the tank. Does this include gravel? IE, > no gravel, nothing? > Is it okay to use more than one liter but less than 2 liters of water? Why > won't they grow if they have more water? > Emily >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16177	From: scooobycat2000	Date: 12/28/2005
Subject: filter

Hi Can anyone give me any recommendations on the best filters for a saltwater tank. Thanks Kara

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16178	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/28/2005
Subject: Re: triops anyone??

Google triops and you will find a lot of useful information. I see someone is recommending a Yahoo! Group also. I read a passing reference to Triops spp. And did the search, which led to a post here a month or so ago. There seems to be a lot of info out there. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Emily Tenczar Sent: Wednesday, December 28, 2005 12:26 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com; ATS_enthusiast Subject: [AquaticLife] triops anyone?? I have a triops kit that I am looking to get started. The instructions say not to place any foreign objects in the tank. Does this include gravel? IE, no gravel, nothing? Is it okay to use more than one liter but less than 2 liters of water? Why won't they grow if they have more water? Emily

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16179	From: Deenerz@aol.com	Date: 12/28/2005
Subject: Re: filter

Hi Kara, What size and dimensions are the tank you want to use? What do you want to keep in the tank? -----Original Message----- From: scooobycat2000 <scooobycat2000@...> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 02:57:37 -0000 Subject: [AquaticLife] filter Hi Can anyone give me any recommendations on the best filters for a saltwater tank. Thanks Kara Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16180	From: Kara	Date: 12/29/2005
Subject: Re: filter

it's a 50 gallon aquarium, i think i will be starting with a fish only instead of a mini reef but i would like to eventually move to the reef. Deenerz@... wrote: Hi Kara, What size and dimensions are the tank you want to use? What do you want to keep in the tank? -----Original Message----- From: scooobycat2000 <scooobycat2000@...> To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 02:57:37 -0000 Subject: [AquaticLife] filter Hi Can anyone give me any recommendations on the best filters for a saltwater tank. Thanks Kara Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Photos Ring in the New Year with Photo Calendars. Add photos, events, holidays, whatever. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16181	From: sunnycitrine	Date: 12/29/2005
Subject: Help! I have a fin-nipper!

Hello to all! This is my first "group", so I'm a bit new at this, and I could use a little advice from my fellow fish-keepers. I have a 42- gal community freshwater, one of whose residents has recently become a bit of a fin-nipper. What are my options? Add more fish of its kind? Move it to another tank? And what about the fish with the freshly-frazzled fins? Will they repair themselves over time? Any advice is GREATLY appreciated. Thank in advance and I look forward to getting to know you! ~ Sunny

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16182	From: Kevin	Date: 12/29/2005
Subject: Re: triops anyone??

Triops are tadpole shrimp, not brine shrimp, and neither is really a shrimp! Kevin --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Patrick" <patrickmn@c...> wrote: > > They are brine shrimp, and come in a packet with the proper water mixture to > survive. If you add more water, there will be less of the mixture, and they > will not be able to hatch out and live as long. If you have gravel in the > tank, the shrimp may get below the gravel and you won't be able to see them. > > Patrick > ----- Original Message ----- > > I have a triops kit that I am looking to get started. The instructions say > not to place any foreign objects in the tank. Does this include gravel? IE, > no gravel, nothing? > Is it okay to use more than one liter but less than 2 liters of water? Why > won't they grow if they have more water? > Emily >

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16183	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/29/2005
Subject: Re: Help! I have a fin-nipper!

Sunny, What kind of fish is causing the problem? What are the other inhabitants of the tank? How many fish do you have in there now? It would be easy to say, sure get some more of the fin nipper's kind, but that could also be the worst thing to do. If it is a species known for nipping, then you have x times the problem you had to start with the new additions. If it is a fish that would tend to stop nipping if it were in a school, then adding the extra fish might be OK, except, all of a sudden you have more fish than your tank can handle, and you will start to have health problems with all your fish, simply because the bioload is too high. It is not flippant of me or anyone else here to ask these questions before giving you an answer. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of sunnycitrine Sent: Tuesday, December 27, 2005 10:52 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Help! I have a fin-nipper! Hello to all! This is my first "group", so I'm a bit new at this, and I could use a little advice from my fellow fish-keepers. I have a 42- gal community freshwater, one of whose residents has recently become a bit of a fin-nipper. What are my options? Add more fish of its kind? Move it to another tank? And what about the fish with the freshly-frazzled fins? Will they repair themselves over time? Any advice is GREATLY appreciated. Thank in advance and I look forward to getting to know you! ~ Sunny ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> Get fast access to your favorite Yahoo! Groups. Make Yahoo! your home page http://us.click.yahoo.com/dpRU5A/wUILAA/yQLSAA/ANOolB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16184	From: sunnycitrine	Date: 12/29/2005
Subject: Re: Help! I have a fin-nipper!

Steve, The fin-nipper in question is a long-fin rosy barb, which never had aggressive tendencies until its mate died not long ago. The other inhabitants of the tank include 4 small lemon tetras, and 2 beautiful congo tetras (the fin-nippees). I realize the rosy barb is semi-aggressive and probably doesn't belong in the tank to begin with, but like I said, the problem wasn't even a problem until just recently. Perhaps I just answered my own question. Thanks for the reply, ~ Sunny --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > > Sunny, > > What kind of fish is causing the problem? What are the other inhabitants of the tank? How many fish do you have in there now? > > It would be easy to say, sure get some more of the fin nipper's kind, but that could also be the worst thing to do. If it is a species known for nipping, then you have x times the problem you had to start with the new additions. If it is a fish that would tend to stop nipping if it were in a school, then adding the extra fish might be OK, except, all of a sudden you have more fish than your tank can handle, and you will start to have health problems with all your fish, simply because the bioload is too high. > > It is not flippant of me or anyone else here to ask these questions before giving you an answer. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of sunnycitrine > Sent: Tuesday, December 27, 2005 10:52 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Help! I have a fin-nipper! > > Hello to all! This is my first "group", so I'm a bit new at this, and I could use a little advice from my fellow fish-keepers. I have a 42- gal community freshwater, one of whose residents has recently become a bit of a fin-nipper. What are my options? Add more fish of its kind? Move it to another tank? And what about the fish with the freshly-frazzled fins? Will they repair themselves over time? Any advice is GREATLY appreciated. > > Thank in advance and I look forward to getting to know you! > > ~ Sunny

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16185	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/29/2005
Subject: Re: Help! I have a fin-nipper!

Sunny, I don't have much experience directly with barbs, but they are a schooling fish and they are problematic fin nippers. Another rosy barb may resolve the issue, but barbs do better when kept in larger groups, and with an odd number of members. The smallest group would be 5 that should end the fin nipping. If any fin nipping goes on, it will most likely be amongst members of the group, and not innocent bystanders. Now the question would become whether you wish to have that many rosy barbs <g>. If the answer is no, then you can do one of several things. You can place a divider in the tank to separate the barb from the other fish. You can give the fish to someone else who has rosy barbs. You could auction it off at your local club. You could find out if your LFS will take the fish in trade. You can live with the nipping until the fish passes on. You could give the fish his own tank, and maybe some companionship with other rosy barbs. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of sunnycitrine Sent: Thursday, December 29, 2005 6:13 PM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AquaticLife] Re: Help! I have a fin-nipper! Steve, The fin-nipper in question is a long-fin rosy barb, which never had aggressive tendencies until its mate died not long ago. The other inhabitants of the tank include 4 small lemon tetras, and 2 beautiful congo tetras (the fin-nippees). I realize the rosy barb is semi-aggressive and probably doesn't belong in the tank to begin with, but like I said, the problem wasn't even a problem until just recently. Perhaps I just answered my own question. Thanks for the reply, ~ Sunny --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Szabo" <steve@l...> wrote: > > Sunny, > > What kind of fish is causing the problem? What are the other inhabitants of the tank? How many fish do you have in there now? > > It would be easy to say, sure get some more of the fin nipper's kind, but that could also be the worst thing to do. If it is a species known for nipping, then you have x times the problem you had to start with the new additions. If it is a fish that would tend to stop nipping if it were in a school, then adding the extra fish might be OK, except, all of a sudden you have more fish than your tank can handle, and you will start to have health problems with all your fish, simply because the bioload is too high. > > It is not flippant of me or anyone else here to ask these questions before giving you an answer. > > \\Steve// > > -----Original Message----- > From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of sunnycitrine > Sent: Tuesday, December 27, 2005 10:52 AM > To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [AquaticLife] Help! I have a fin-nipper! > > Hello to all! This is my first "group", so I'm a bit new at this, and I could use a little advice from my fellow fish-keepers. I have a 42- gal community freshwater, one of whose residents has recently become a bit of a fin-nipper. What are my options? Add more fish of its kind? Move it to another tank? And what about the fish with the freshly-frazzled fins? Will they repair themselves over time? Any advice is GREATLY appreciated. > > Thank in advance and I look forward to getting to know you! > > ~ Sunny

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16186	From: Leslie & Dane Moore	Date: 12/29/2005
Subject: Re: Help! I have a fin-nipper!

Lol It is situations such as this that I thank God I have several friends in the hobby. We trade fish all the time when we have problems. We all have at least two tanks as well so we can usually find a good home for all. Also, our LFS is wonderful about taking anything we can't solve. I have a rosy barb. He came to me in a pair. He was AWFUL to the other barb but once the small weak one passed on, he left everyone alone, until the betta anyway. I hate him because I know how mean he is, but he's fine and doesn't nip anyone else. Now I had a male betta in there for a whopping 30 minutes as the stupid barb was eating his fins. He also ate at some white skirt tetras, this was while the other barb was still around. I think they are just mean. Pass him off to someone else is my opinion. Sorry to be so long winded. I just don't like them and if you are trying for a small community tank I don't think they are a good choice. Good luck to you! =) Leslie

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16187	From: Amy	Date: 12/30/2005
Subject: Re: Help! I have a fin-nipper!

What about the frayed fins of my other fish.... will they heal/repair themselves in time? I'm thinking my best bet in this situation is to remove the problematic fish and restore peace and happiness in my once tranquil aquarium. Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: Sunny, I don't have much experience directly with barbs, but they are a schooling fish and they are problematic fin nippers. Another rosy barb may resolve the issue, but barbs do better when kept in larger groups, and with an odd number of members. The smallest group would be 5 that should end the fin nipping. If any fin nipping goes on, it will most likely be amongst members of the group, and not innocent bystanders. Now the question would become whether you wish to have that many rosy barbs <g>. If the answer is no, then you can do one of several things. You can place a divider in the tank to separate the barb from the other fish. You can give the fish to someone else who has rosy barbs. You could auction it off at your local club. You could find out if your LFS will take the fish in trade. You can live with the nipping until the fish passes on. You could give the fish his own tank, and maybe some companionship with other rosy barbs. \\Steve// --------------------------------- Yahoo! for Good - Make a difference this year. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16188	From: Steve Szabo	Date: 12/30/2005
Subject: Re: Help! I have a fin-nipper!

Amy, Yes, the fins should heal. However, one will always be able to tell that they have had a problem with the fins, since the healing will leave tell tale signs that the fins have been injured. More than likely, though, a cursory glance or the eyes of the uninitiated will not pick this up, unless the injury had been severe. \\Steve// -----Original Message----- From: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Amy Sent: Friday, December 30, 2005 10:12 AM To: AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Help! I have a fin-nipper! What about the frayed fins of my other fish.... will they heal/repair themselves in time? I'm thinking my best bet in this situation is to remove the problematic fish and restore peace and happiness in my once tranquil aquarium. Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: Sunny, I don't have much experience directly with barbs, but they are a schooling fish and they are problematic fin nippers. Another rosy barb may resolve the issue, but barbs do better when kept in larger groups, and with an odd number of members. The smallest group would be 5 that should end the fin nipping. If any fin nipping goes on, it will most likely be amongst members of the group, and not innocent bystanders. Now the question would become whether you wish to have that many rosy barbs <g>. If the answer is no, then you can do one of several things. You can place a divider in the tank to separate the barb from the other fish. You can give the fish to someone else who has rosy barbs. You could auction it off at your local club. You could find out if your LFS will take the fish in trade. You can live with the nipping until the fish passes on. You could give the fish his own tank, and maybe some companionship with other rosy barbs. \\Steve//

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16189	From: The Dragon Hunter	Date: 12/30/2005
Subject: Re: Help! I have a fin-nipper!

You can remove the carbon from your filter and use Mela-fix. I usually use it when I get a beta. Have yet to get a beta that didn't have frayed fins. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Amy" <sunnycitrine@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Friday, December 30, 2005 7:12 AM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Help! I have a fin-nipper! What about the frayed fins of my other fish.... will they heal/repair themselves in time? I'm thinking my best bet in this situation is to remove the problematic fish and restore peace and happiness in my once tranquil aquarium. Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: Sunny, I don't have much experience directly with barbs, but they are a schooling fish and they are problematic fin nippers. Another rosy barb may resolve the issue, but barbs do better when kept in larger groups, and with an odd number of members. The smallest group would be 5 that should end the fin nipping. If any fin nipping goes on, it will most likely be amongst members of the group, and not innocent bystanders. Now the question would become whether you wish to have that many rosy barbs <g>. If the answer is no, then you can do one of several things. You can place a divider in the tank to separate the barb from the other fish. You can give the fish to someone else who has rosy barbs. You could auction it off at your local club. You could find out if your LFS will take the fish in trade. You can live with the nipping until the fish passes on. You could give the fish his own tank, and maybe some companionship with other rosy barbs. \\Steve// --------------------------------- Yahoo! for Good - Make a difference this year. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16190	From: Kurt Johnston	Date: 12/31/2005
Subject: ALA Chairman invades PA

I hope that subject got everybody's attention. I just wanted let everyone in this group know that those of us in Lancaster, PA are fortunate enough to have Rit Forcier, Chairman of the ALA (American Livebearers Assoc.), coming to our Club to speak on Tuesday January 17th. I also have heard that Tom Crane, ALA SMP Chairman, may be coming with him! This is a real coup for us! I hope that anyone who is in the area will consider joining us that evening for a great program on livebearers. If you have never seen Rit's program, it is well worth the time and travel. If you would like more details and directions please contact me either via email or my phone. Hope to see you there! Kurt Johnston kaj41354@... Program V.P. Aquarium Club of Lancaster County 717-965-7763

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16191	From: Amy	Date: 12/31/2005
Subject: Re: Help! I have a fin-nipper!

Thanks for all the suggestions, guys. I really appreciate it. Happy New Year to all! ~ Amy The Dragon Hunter <dragon.hunter@...> wrote: You can remove the carbon from your filter and use Mela-fix. I usually use it when I get a beta. Have yet to get a beta that didn't have frayed fins. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Amy" <sunnycitrine@...> To: <AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Friday, December 30, 2005 7:12 AM Subject: RE: [AquaticLife] Re: Help! I have a fin-nipper! What about the frayed fins of my other fish.... will they heal/repair themselves in time? I'm thinking my best bet in this situation is to remove the problematic fish and restore peace and happiness in my once tranquil aquarium. Steve Szabo <steve@...> wrote: Sunny, I don't have much experience directly with barbs, but they are a schooling fish and they are problematic fin nippers. Another rosy barb may resolve the issue, but barbs do better when kept in larger groups, and with an odd number of members. The smallest group would be 5 that should end the fin nipping. If any fin nipping goes on, it will most likely be amongst members of the group, and not innocent bystanders. Now the question would become whether you wish to have that many rosy barbs <g>. If the answer is no, then you can do one of several things. You can place a divider in the tank to separate the barb from the other fish. You can give the fish to someone else who has rosy barbs. You could auction it off at your local club. You could find out if your LFS will take the fish in trade. You can live with the nipping until the fish passes on. You could give the fish his own tank, and maybe some companionship with other rosy barbs. \\Steve// --------------------------------- Yahoo! for Good - Make a difference this year. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. Yahoo! Groups Links Please DELETE this line and EVERYTHING below it when replying, thanks. ·´¯`·.¸¸.><((((º>.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸><((((º> ¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..><((((º> PLEASE, when you REPLY to a post, DELETE all TEXT that is NOT important to the reply & if CHANGING the TOPIC of the original message MODIFY the SUBJECT LINE -> i.e. "new subject (was re: old subject)" <- <º((((><.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸<º((((><¸.·´¯`·.¸. , .·´¯`·..<º((((><·´¯`·.¸¸. We Thank You in Advance for Your HELP in this matter. --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "AquaticLife" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: AquaticLife-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! Photos Ring in the New Year with Photo Calendars. Add photos, events, holidays, whatever. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16192	From: harry perry	Date: 12/31/2005
Subject: An important message to all.

Hi and happy new year, Like many folks, in all the fish groups, I love to help people with their concerns and to share the benefits of my experience. These groups are a valuable resource. You can learn in minutes what it took some of us years to learn. Help us help you. When you post a concern please add all the info you can about your tank. Some folks need help in a hurry to save fish but without knowing anything about your tanks . I like many others would hesitate to help in fear that we would make the situation worse by not knowing anything about your set-up. Tanks are as individual as the people who own them. Anything goes and often does. I hope you all have a healthy and prosperous new year and remember there is no such thing as too many tanks. Harry --------------------------------- Yahoo! for Good - Make a difference this year. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Group: AquaticLife	Message: 16193	From: Salmarcus@aol.com	Date: 12/31/2005
Subject: Happy New Year

From me to all of you: Happy New Year [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]